Last updated2020-07-10T16:09:11



45915 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 8, #1 of 1444 🔗


Easy to use forum. Feel free to use it to continue discussions and organise content. Thanks

45916 HawkAnalyst, 3, #3 of 1444 🔗

68% Have Antibodies in This Clinic. Can Neighborhood Beat a Next Wave? – The New York Times


45917 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 6, #4 of 1444 🔗

Meanwhile, American DJ Dan Bongino reacts to mandatory mask wearing in Martin County, Florida by saying: “You can take your mask mandate and shove it right up your ass.”

Is that after or before the mask-wearing sex?

Or, perhaps, during?

46261 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 2, #5 of 1444 🔗

But,but Matthew McConaughey says ‘wear the dam mask’ Idiot

45918 John P, replying to John P, 4, #6 of 1444 🔗

A little news from the Mayor of Leicester:


45929 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to John P, 6, #7 of 1444 🔗
46193 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tenchy, 14, #8 of 1444 🔗

Matt Hancock has to be reined in asap..basically he is able to act as a dictator, with no checks on his power, which is shocking.

46536 ▶▶▶▶ Chas, replying to Carrie, 3, #9 of 1444 🔗

… and he is incompetent and doesn’t have a clue what he is doing. He has also wasted £10 billion on a track and trace system that doesn’t work. We can’t afford to have him around much longer.

45932 ▶▶ Julian, replying to John P, 4, #10 of 1444 🔗

Strong stuff
Good for him

46217 ▶▶ HawkAnalyst, replying to John P, 1, #11 of 1444 🔗
45919 HawkAnalyst, 1, #12 of 1444 🔗

Pull up your pants & finish school’: Would CNN’s Don Lemon cancel himself over shockingly unwoke 2013 tips to black community? https://www.rt.com/usa/494206-lemon-black-advice-canceled/

45921 HawkAnalyst, #13 of 1444 🔗

‘Virtue signaling at its finest’: Fury after US team replaces player names with black police brutality victims (VIDEO) https://www.rt.com/sport/494292-mls-black-lives-matter/

45924 Tenchy, 11, #14 of 1444 🔗

Decolonising the curriculum in Haringey

What, in the name of sanity, is a “curriculum diet”? And there are no “students” in schools; they are “pupils”. Idiot headmaster!

46173 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nel, 1, #16 of 1444 🔗

Great that it’s regularly updated. Thanks for the link.

48122 ▶▶ gmseed, replying to Nel, #17 of 1444 🔗

Thanks for the recommendation. I noticed a spike in traffic to the freely available book after you made a reference to the book – and thanks. Hope you got at least 1 thing from it!

45934 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 9, #18 of 1444 🔗

Amol Rajan enjoying himself leading the BBC’s “Rethink”. Rajan told us in terms that we now had to address inequality because of Covid-19 because the poor were getting such a raw deal.

But now the news comes in from New York that the poorer communities have more immunity than richer areas.

Hmmm…not sure that was in the script.


I’m not sure why the BBC assumes we agree that Covid-19 “should” to use their word “change” after Covid-19. Of course it will have “changed” whether the BBC campaigns for change or not! That is the nature of life…things change. I think we can assume that the BBC actually mean we “should change” the way we do things by adopting more Far Left policies.

I wonder why the BBC’s “Media Editor” (failed editor of a national newspaper that he ran into the ground) is addressing issues of “inequality and intergenerational fairness” – surely that’s Mark Easton’s patch. Of course I can’t see Easton delivering an Eastenders-style “get off my manor” type of reproof. But it does speak volumes about Rajan’s cosmic-scale vanity. The fool positively drips with self-regard.

46403 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to OKUK, 2, #19 of 1444 🔗

And what on earth is a BBC Editor doing “addressing issues” of anything?? Since when did the BBC charter extend to “addressing issues”?

47305 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to OKUK, #20 of 1444 🔗

Rajan is the worst kind of media shill. Watch his principles shift and change with the wind.

45935 Biker, replying to Biker, 38, #21 of 1444 🔗

Hugo says “ We are all each other, all intertwined, all responsible for attuning our own behaviour for the greater good.” No were not Hugo. You mean nothing to me and i don’t give two shits what happens to you in your life. Why is it i am to care for the whole world just because you say?

45938 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to Biker, 23, #22 of 1444 🔗

Is Hugo offering to share his trust fund with the rest of the world? Or is he just posing?

45939 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to OKUK, 6, #23 of 1444 🔗

Hugo’s problem is he doesn’t know how to share that’s why he insists he does and to prove it would be willing to have his suff taken from him and shared out amongst us. Well i say would be willing, he’s not willing, it’s the last thing he is. These virtue signalling balloons don’t know we can see thru them like we’re wearing Joe Bazooka’s x ray specs

45949 ▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Biker, 8, #24 of 1444 🔗

The Blessed Hugo is a typically right on, subtly superior metropolitan affluent pillock.

No doubt he will be showing that actions speak louder than words and donning a sustainably sourced carbon neutral biohazard suit.

Of course intertwining in a biohazard suit could be challenging

Covid is the worst affliction to befall humanity since records began so we must all take his sermonising to heart and regulate ourselves accordingly.


45955 ▶▶▶▶▶ PD, replying to wendyk, 8, #25 of 1444 🔗

“typically right on, subtly superior metropolitan affluent pillock.“

Love it! 🤣 😂

45967 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to PD, 13, #26 of 1444 🔗

Thank you! These wealthy wazzocks seem to be completely unaware of the fury which they generate in lesser beings like me-I’m growing angrier with each day that passes.

And..’the template for every crisis’ : what a tendentious twat! (I had to check on the meaning for the long word).

46056 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to wendyk, 17, #27 of 1444 🔗

Woke up shaking with rage today…. literally shaking. I’m going to end up being imprisoned for other reasons if anyone gives me shit over not putting a maxi pad on my face.

45961 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Biker, 24, #28 of 1444 🔗

Once again, the rights of the collective trump the rights of the individual. That is the first assumption which allows all these idiotic restrictions to be imposed. He’s an odious, virtue-signalling tosser.

45973 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Poppy, 15, #29 of 1444 🔗

They only trump your rights if you let them. I’m afraid i won’t let them. Hugo seems like the kind of dude that hates himself because he’s as soft as shite and all the ladies he fancies wouldn’t look at a weedie little fucker like him. He dreams of a strong conservative woman who can cook, raise kids and fuck all night long but these goddesses don’t look to wimps like him, all he’s left with is the drug addled lefty dirty looking unwashed social justice warriors who consider ordering a coffee an achievement.

46042 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Biker, 2, #30 of 1444 🔗

Irrelevant, but interesting – why is it that when a man gets het up about anything at all, his thoughts turn to sex? Why does the testosterone get distracted and confused about its objective?

46061 ▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Bruno, #31 of 1444 🔗

His thoughts don’t turn to sex but as a woman what have you to offer a man apart for doing what he wants and you must want to do this. If you don’t you can live any way you like it’s a free world but you’re no use to me. You’re also no use to yourself and will lead a miserable life with no meaning. It’s evolution.

46067 ▶▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Bruno, 3, #32 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think that’s a male thing, I think it’s a rage thing. It depends on where you emotions are clustered together. Rage and sex are definitely next door neighbours in my world.

46109 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bruno, #33 of 1444 🔗

Some do, some don’t. Sounds like another conspiracy theory …

46232 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to JohnB, #34 of 1444 🔗

Ha ha, touché!
NB, hitchhiking, takes me back, but they all have their own cars nowadays, even the 21 year olds, or so it seems.

46293 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Bruno, 1, #35 of 1444 🔗

I’m the same….. and I’m not a man ;P

46326 ▶▶▶▶▶ Judith Day, replying to Bruno, #36 of 1444 🔗

Probably because in our country a man is not allowed to go and beat his ‘enemy’ to death, so the testosterone turns to the next ‘best thing’?

47097 ▶▶▶▶▶ petgor, replying to Bruno, #37 of 1444 🔗

Sorry Sylvie, but it’s the way that we males are programmed. Not our fault, just blame nature.

47221 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Poppy, #38 of 1444 🔗

A year ago the new Premier of Quebec, François Legault, said collective rights were more important than individual rights. When I read that sentence I knew immediately what kind of politics he stood for: top down authoritarianism. With a friendly face.

45998 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Biker, 2, #39 of 1444 🔗

What a maroon!

Maybe he should put his money where his mouth is and start with “attuning” his own behaviour “for the greater good”

46008 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #40 of 1444 🔗

Perhaps he could dematerialise himself while he’s about it and reappear in a more suitably saintly dimension-where the sun doesn’t shine: and take Sturgeon with him!!

46025 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to wendyk, 1, #41 of 1444 🔗

Exactly. He can do us a great service by just going away.

45936 Nel, replying to Nel, 5, #42 of 1444 🔗

UK Column have a very good news analysis from 8th July – all of it

Interesting at about the 46 min mark that there’s an ‘article’ in the Daily Express by the UK Government ‘This is what you get asked on a 45minute NHS Test and Trace phone call’ Complete propaganda, propagated by Reading University who seem to be the mouthpiece for the government.

45996 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Nel, 1, #44 of 1444 🔗

Keele is apparently at it too – according to a friend with links in academia, they’re vying with Reading to get a bigger slice of the Covid gravy train:


45941 Nessimmersion, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #45 of 1444 🔗

Could Toby or one of the admins add a link to the below on the home page.
Very useful series of bullet points on Covid – very useful when debunking hysteria.

45982 ▶▶ steve, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #46 of 1444 🔗

I found that site was posting back end feb/. Early March. It was very useful back then showing what virus was fairly benign. It’s rarely updated now but worth looking at

46304 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nessimmersion, #47 of 1444 🔗

Oh thanks for flagging this. I only checked the other day, so the update must be very new.

46408 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #48 of 1444 🔗

Yes me too, damn more reading . . . but sense

46463 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #49 of 1444 🔗

They’re only updating once a month now. Unfortunately they’ve now (from May) stopped updating in all the many other languages that they had on there – it was very useful to be able to send people links in languages such as Romanian, for example. Previous entries are still there in all the languages, but the more recent ones are only in English.

45942 Nessimmersion, replying to Nessimmersion, 19, #50 of 1444 🔗

Post Covid reactions to the BBC.
The hysterical woke propaganda being regurgitated by the BBC including the phenomenally condescending reporters fake interviewed by the presenter are further evidence that we need to stop the license fee funding right now.
The BBC must be moved to a voluntary funding model or subscription model to save the intellectual, moral and physical health of the populace.

45944 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to Nessimmersion, 9, #51 of 1444 🔗

Hmmm…I’m not sure about that entirely. We see in the USA that in many ways the media is more leftist and determinedly biased than even the BBC – simply censoring their President for instance.

The BBC cannot be allowed to become the British CNN.

So I favour reform really…major cutbacks in the budget, ending of racially divisive broadcasting, major changes to how senior staff are appointed, a strict ratio limit on big earners and statutory obligations to reflect the full range of opinion in the UK. At the same time you need to abolish Ofcom and tackle egregious social media censorship.

45945 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to OKUK, 9, #52 of 1444 🔗

I should have made clear, I do favour abolition of the TV licence fee.

46076 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to OKUK, 4, #53 of 1444 🔗

I think it’s inaccurate to call any media left or right….. it’s establishment, and the establishment blows neo-conservative and neo-liberal. Things like BLM are not suddenly left wing reporting tactics, it’s merely of use to the establishment.

46105 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to TyLean, 7, #54 of 1444 🔗

As it stands the media are the bellows of totalitarism.

46986 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to TyLean, 2, #55 of 1444 🔗

I respectfully disagree. Too many in the media are little more than left-wing activists pretending, not very well,to be journalists. They will outright lie when it suits them. At the moment, the majority are in lockstep in promoting Trump Derangement Syndrome, BLM, and left-wing ideology. There is little dissent. In the U.S., 95% of the media is pro-Democrat, anti-Trump. In the UK, it’s little different, but is closer to 100% anti-Trump. If you could find any article, or any reporter or commentator in the UK that’s sympathetic to Trump, I’d be very surprised.

47353 ▶▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Lms23, #56 of 1444 🔗

You make a good argument. I was thinking more over my lifetime than since Trump/Brexit to present. Recent years, yes, you are correct.

46425 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to OKUK, 2, #57 of 1444 🔗

I agree with that. The major complaint is “why should I be forced to pay for it?”. But that’s not really the problem. We pay for all sorts of things in general taxation that we don’t want to. The REAL problem is that the BBC is the dominant broadcaster and can do what the heck it pleases. It can bring politicians down, so they are forced to appease it. It is way too powerful.
I would: 1) Strip it of ownership of the channels, and put that into a separate organisation b) Make it subscription, but also make it buy channel time at market rates c) ban any cross-subsidy e.g. a free news channel paid out of subscriptions (like Sky does) d) put out Reuters and Associated Press reports on an unedited, unpresented channel, as a public service.

47118 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to OKUK, #58 of 1444 🔗

The BBC ‘leftist????’. Errrr…. that’s as much a fiction as their Covid and Corbyn coverage!

The BBC is, and always has been biased towards the establishment. Not necessarily a big deal when it was recognised and under control, but there has been a quantitative change over recent years towards clear propagandizing, as we see in the almost total lack of critical coverage of the government use of Covid.

45990 ▶▶ matt, replying to Nessimmersion, 13, #59 of 1444 🔗

BBC Breakfast is in full-on alarmist censorious mode this morning. ‘Airborne virus’ being presented as unquestioned fact instead of theory (as far as I can tell, it’s barely even a theory – it’s a slight possibility that hasn’t been completely ruled out yet and so _obviously_ face masks are vital.

We can all travel to other countries from today, apparently and swimming pools and gyms are going to open soon, but woe betide anyone who is so reckless and stupid as to take advantage of this, according to the beeb.

46110 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to matt, 11, #60 of 1444 🔗

Air bornne virus. It is so clear this is the story to push to get a population mask wearing. Minchie physcologist and the nudge unit asking for pressure to get mask wearing compliance. Air borne is the way they will try.

I see the finger print of conspiracy running through this explicitly.

46311 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, #61 of 1444 🔗

Michie’s surname is pronounced Mickey!

46412 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Basics, 2, #62 of 1444 🔗

Yes if you didn’t think it was a conspiracy before you will now. Sme drivelling idiot with her hands clasped in prayer claiming that it was too soon to open gyms and we must all wear masks

meanwhile in the Real World


plus another post I haven’t read yet, and the ever reliable


46424 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Basics, #63 of 1444 🔗

Absolutely, that is a solid finger print.

46163 ▶▶▶ John Mirra, replying to matt, 2, #64 of 1444 🔗

I gave up watching all TV news a year or 2 before this all happened so I can’t comment on what they said specifically but: I was under the impression that COVID-19 is “airborne” in the sense that any virus can be “airborne”, it can sit in the air around those who have been coughing, breathing, sneezing etc. in poorly ventilated areas. And that is why conventional wisdom says to wear a mask in clinical settings when dealing with infected patients. Outside is a different story as there’s this thing called wind, UV light and lots of other factors that render most viruses inert or unable to infect.

To call a virus airborne in pre-covid-19 times meant that it could survive for an extended period of time outside and was able travel on the wind and infect individuals in this way. To be fair any virus that stays mostly suspended in air can be taken by the wind but outside survival and reinfection is the main point of an airborne infection model.

Of course the scientific studies that I have been forced to read for my sanity around this (many shared here and elsewhere) seem to suggest that masks are more than likely ineffective even in clinical settings for many viruses as they cannot eliminate the chance of a certain amount of the virus getting passed the mask and it many cases the amount needed for viable infection is so insanely low that it renders the mask useless.

(This was the last summary of mask studies I read: https://www.rcreader.com/commentary/masks-dont-work-covid-a-review-of-science-relevant-to-covide-19-social-policy )

46347 ▶▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to John Mirra, 1, #65 of 1444 🔗

There is also this summation of RCT ( the scientific gold standard there were so keen on for HCQ bu deem to have lost their enthusiasm for when it doesn’t suport them in either case)


46494 ▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to Nessimmersion, 1, #66 of 1444 🔗

This seems like a good solution for the BBC


45943 RyanM, 14, #67 of 1444 🔗

Surely, Toby, you have some connections at National Review. It is all hyperventilating, which is all the rage here in the US.

Could you please write an article about Sweden? They have published several “Sweden’s experiment was a failure!” articles, and could use a voice of reason.

How ’bout it?

45946 Tony Rattray, replying to Tony Rattray, 27, #68 of 1444 🔗



Good to hear many challenging the mandatory mask wearing in shops in scotland based upon this random response in my local area. Like them, I will be avoiding shops like the plague! until it is dropped.

So wee krankie will not be able to ignore the on-going deserted shops in her deluded ivory tower public health clique.

46004 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tony Rattray, 17, #69 of 1444 🔗

Recognised many of the shops that were mentioned in the article and while I sympathise with their plight, its right that people vote with their wallet and feet and boycott because of the compulsory muzzling.

The Scottish Retail Consortium said there were “very challenging trading conditions” at the moment – but hoped the new rules would “reaffirm it is safe to come back to the high street and support Scottish shops”.

“We need customers to come out and shop because every purchase helps to support stores and protect Scottish retail jobs,” said its head of policy, Ewan MacDonald-Russell.

BIB – No it won’t you nincompoop – if anything it will drive more people away and it will simply accelerate the demise of many shops.

46082 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Bart Simpson, 14, #70 of 1444 🔗

I thought this too. How is wearing masks gonna encourage anyone to go shopping? You’ll go to the supermarket but that’s it. Even, if like me you don’t wear the mask, who can be bothered with the stress of it?

46120 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Biker, 6, #71 of 1444 🔗

Exactly. That’s even before you have to tackle their insane antisocial distancing measures in the shops which will make doing the tasks to storm Takeshi’s Castle much more appealing.

46526 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Biker, #72 of 1444 🔗

You have to go into a shop to buy your masks. Simples.

46541 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to chris c, #73 of 1444 🔗

You can use a scarf – even a georgette one!

46103 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bart Simpson, 13, #74 of 1444 🔗

A simple harmless action people can take is deliberately walking up to shops then politely explaining they won’t enter if mask required and walk away.

If enough customers did that the whole thing would need to be rethought. Just a few people doing that will send a strong message to business.

Anyone can do it and its most effective by those who are out shopping anyway.

46122 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Basics, 5, #75 of 1444 🔗

That’s a good idea as well – let them know and they will have to feed it back to management which will go into some way of explaining their dire footfall and sales figures.

46171 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 16, #76 of 1444 🔗

I think we need to bombard shops by all means possible (email social media, in person) with the clear message that we are NOT staying away through fear of the virus, but due to the stupid RULES.. so if they want our business – drop the rules…

46183 ▶▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Carrie, 24, #77 of 1444 🔗

That is a good point.
A local independent shoe shop was entirely empty on Saturday morning. Doors open but devoid of customers and it is usually very busy.
I stepped in and saw both staff members with masks on so I said, “Sorry. Not for me…” and turned away to leave.
The chap called after me, “Can I help..?”
I turned back and said, “I don’t shop at shops where I’m made to feel like an infectious danger. I’m a customer with money but you clearly see me as a danger so, no, you cannot help me today.”
And I left.
I have done this several times. I want the businesses to know that it is their conduct that is preventing me from parting with my money, not fear of some spurious infection.

46199 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Little Red Hen, 17, #78 of 1444 🔗

Good for you. That is the only way to save our dignity, our sanity, and, just maybe, their businesses.

46213 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Little Red Hen, 10, #79 of 1444 🔗

Great – worth going into shops even where you don’t really want anything, just to put that message across..

46263 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Carrie, 8, #80 of 1444 🔗

We did need shoes – teenager with ever-growing feet in tow – but principals must be adhered to even with some personal cost.

We will find shoes somewhere or get some hand-me-downs to last the summer but I will not bend to fit the ‘new narrative’. That way, inevitable compliance lies.

46315 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Little Red Hen, 3, #81 of 1444 🔗

Amazon have a huge selection of shoes, all brands – many with free returns. My local high st doesn’t tend to stock my favourite, ie most comfy brand.
If you don’t like to support Amazon, Rubbersole are good and also easy for returns.

46329 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Little Red Hen, 4, #82 of 1444 🔗

Good idea and well done!!! That’s one way of making them know you’re boycotting them.

46333 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Judith Day, replying to Little Red Hen, 7, #83 of 1444 🔗

I did exactly the same yesterday when I was asked by a masked member of staff in River Island to use a hand sanitiser as I walked through the door. I simply said ‘No, I’m not doing that’ and went out again.

46414 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Little Red Hen, 3, #84 of 1444 🔗


46437 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Little Red Hen, 3, #85 of 1444 🔗

Which is great and I applaud it, but I heard in England the local authorities are making spot checks on places like hairdressers and if you don’t play by the rules they shut you down straight away. Great fodder for the new Nazis.

46049 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to Tony Rattray, 30, #86 of 1444 🔗

Start work in a shop in an hour. Not challenging anyone’s behaviour, and not wearing a mask. Will let you all know how it goes later on.

46118 ▶▶ GrowYourOwn, replying to Tony Rattray, 15, #87 of 1444 🔗

Went to the supermarket this morning. The first member of staff I saw wasn’t wearing a mask so I had a chat with him. The staff have been told not to challenge any non-mask wearers so I did my shopping in peace. I only saw one other person not wearing a mask but I think they had only popped in for a paper. Everyone else, mostly older people, had gagged themselves.

46334 ▶▶▶ Judith Day, replying to GrowYourOwn, 4, #88 of 1444 🔗

Very, very few people shopping in my area wear masks.

46344 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Tony Rattray, 1, #89 of 1444 🔗

Topical image of how Sturgeon & the Natzis see the populace:

46417 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Nessimmersion, 7, #90 of 1444 🔗

She’s going for a covid-free Scotland. A Sturgeon-free Scotland would be much better

46422 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nessimmersion, 1, #91 of 1444 🔗

“Anastacia“ Anastacia, holy Anastasia,

You who were borne by Yemenja, our mother,

Give us the strength to struggle each day

So we may never become slaves,

So that, like you, we may be rebellious creatures

May it be so. Amen”

46432 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Tony Rattray, 2, #92 of 1444 🔗

I know it’s the BBC but there might have been one interview with someone who was vehemently opposed to wearing the damn things.

46504 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Bella, 2, #93 of 1444 🔗

dont be silly – this is the BBC. people with views that are not the same as the BBC approved line are ignored …

46510 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to Tony Rattray, 1, #94 of 1444 🔗

Like everyone here, I am not wearing a face mask, although judging by the comments on the local FB page, I will be in a minority. We’ll see, but intending to do most shopping on-line.

What I wanted to ask is, has anyone found the Scottish legislation that says wearing a face mask in Scotland is in law. I’ve been searching the Scottish legislation site, but so far, I can’t find any mention of face masks, apart from being used on public transport. Would welcome some help in the search, if anyone is interested – even if it is to find it & point me in the right direction.

47392 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Ruth Sharpe, #96 of 1444 🔗

There is advice from Gillian far above in this thread. Basically the law if it is there would not have been put into the holyrood library until late thursday night and not appear until friday morning online.
Perhaps your searching was in the right place but too soon. I am passing on what others have suggested.

46533 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to Tony Rattray, 3, #97 of 1444 🔗

So an update;

In the workshop no one used a mask all day, we were serving folk out the door as we have been doing all lockdown. To give context, it is a very small workshop and we can barely fit in all the staff right now, good stands and tools are limited, so not having the ‘public’ in that area actually works. Also workshops are dangerous, things do occasionally go flying or explode..

The sales floor was a different story, all the staff wore masks but most took them on and off all day. They used them when serving customers but not when there were none around.

On the customer side, it seems that there were a significant minority not wearing masks which, once I noticed, gave me so much glee. No staff member challenged them and continued to serve them as normal, regardless of the staff member’s views. Again, very positive I think

As a customer I went to Greggs, an independent coffee shop and a corner shop / newsagents. Greggs was as it has been since opening a week ago, perspex screens and staff in masks but otherwise just walk in, get food and walk out as normal. In the coffee shop had a good chat about what was happening, seems they are going to have to get perspex screens up, amongst other things. Seen how many companies have popped up overnight offering custom screens at a pretty penny?! In the corner shop they didn’t mention my lack of mask at all, one of the two other customers also wore no mask, again wasn’t challenged.

Overall not the complete and utter cluster fuck that I though today would be.

45947 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 17, #98 of 1444 🔗


This has done it for me: Scotland is now ruled by a cult. Clap for the Great Leader’s birthday!!

Never! Never!

45976 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to wendyk, 13, #99 of 1444 🔗

I bet without her make up she looks more like 60. Bitchy comment, I know, but I can’t stand the silly cow.

45979 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Gillian, 8, #100 of 1444 🔗

Neither can I. She ‘s awful!

45986 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Gillian, 11, #101 of 1444 🔗

it’s the amount of hairspray she uses. I don’t trust a woman who’s hair don’t move in the wind

46184 ▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Biker, 5, #102 of 1444 🔗

Like Barbara Bush.
Described as having hair that moved as a single unit.

45999 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Gillian, 5, #103 of 1444 🔗

And those horrible spiky shoes: spiky is as spiky does.

46000 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Gillian, 6, #104 of 1444 🔗

She’s awful and I wouldn’t go near her even with a 10 foot barge pole.

46052 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Bart Simpson, 6, #105 of 1444 🔗

Yes – that is one social distance I would be very happy to maintain!

46116 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to IanE, 3, #106 of 1444 🔗

Amen and complete with the 10 foot barge pole! 🙂

46051 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Gillian, 5, #107 of 1444 🔗

Actually, if one were to take off her make-up, she would probably be revealed as a little green alien form Alpha Centauri – she cannot possibly be human!

46009 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to wendyk, 2, #108 of 1444 🔗

I saw that Arlene Foster (Northern Ireland) on the telly yesterday and thought what a down-to-earth, sensible, straight-talking woman she seems to be. I know that NI politics is a minefield and no doubt she is as tough as any of them, but she struck me as sensible and pragmatic.

46022 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Gillian, 6, #109 of 1444 🔗

Absolutely agree! I watched a rather good drama about the 2007 Agreement recently, which led to reading about Mrs Foster and her stalwart no nonsense approach to current affairs.

She has a strong uncompromising demeanour, is married to a policeman, has 3 children, trained and worked as a solicitor and then joined the DUP , eventually becoming leader.

My feeling is that the Troubles and the ensuing hardships have strengthened the character of many in Northern Ireland and that Mrs Foster would have little time for the likes of Sturgeon.

46053 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to wendyk, #110 of 1444 🔗

A wrestling match would be fun to watch!

46062 ▶▶▶▶ Gillian, replying to wendyk, 6, #111 of 1444 🔗

Absolutely. She’s the same age as oor Nickla (born two days apart) but she presents as a mature, fully-rounded and adult personality as opposed to the shrill, control-freakery, over-grown student apparition presented by Nickla. I read somewhere that Arlene Foster suffered a personal tragedy during the Troubles, or at least witnessed an atrocity of some sort. Nobody would want these sort of things to happen but I am sure that they must have contributed to her growth into the woman she is today.

46090 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Gillian, #112 of 1444 🔗

Yes she did,while on a school bus I believe

46317 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to wendyk, 2, #113 of 1444 🔗

Heil Nicola!

46337 ▶▶ Jodie S, replying to wendyk, 3, #114 of 1444 🔗

Every time the Sturgeon gets a mention my bf (of Scots-Irish descent) lampoons that godawful wee film featuring all the grateful kiddies from last month: ‘Thank you, Nicola, for keeping us safe….’

46361 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Jodie S, 2, #115 of 1444 🔗

Yes that piece of agitprop was worthy of Goebbels.

46351 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to wendyk, 4, #116 of 1444 🔗

I’m told her nickname used to be seaweed at school/college, as even the tide wouldn’t take her out.

46363 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #117 of 1444 🔗

Seaweed is hard to get rid of as well!

45948 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 5, #118 of 1444 🔗


This is worth reading; woke coding is now on the Silicon Valley to-do list.

I noticed a couple of years ago that Disqus appeared to be using some kind of woke algorithms to monitor comments.

Users of twitter etc, beware.

46431 ▶▶ chris c, replying to wendyk, 2, #119 of 1444 🔗

Remember when AOL first came to the UK? You couldn’t open an account if you lived in Scunthorpe, Peniston or Cockermouth. I often wondered why they didn’t take that concept further

45951 CarrieAH, replying to CarrieAH, 19, #120 of 1444 🔗

Wow look at all the anti muzzle wearing comments below this Mail article. Excellent responses!


45956 ▶▶ annie, replying to CarrieAH, 18, #121 of 1444 🔗

Seems pretty well unanimous. And a massive rejection of the new abnormal, too.
There is hope!
As for the photo of someone swimming in the sea while wearing a mask ………..

45971 ▶▶ Sally, replying to CarrieAH, 7, #122 of 1444 🔗

Thanks for that. Gives me some hope!

46003 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to CarrieAH, 7, #123 of 1444 🔗

That’s good if the public are fighting back. There is hope,

46047 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #124 of 1444 🔗

Yes – when it happens at the GroanAid, we will know the government has had it!

46079 ▶▶ Basics, replying to CarrieAH, 2, #125 of 1444 🔗

How does the dissent in comments stand? I got myself banned withoht a swear word in sight in a single first and last ever post on a social media site. Is it possible to infer tgere are moderators who are allowing such common sense to be seen. How does that work?

45952 Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 45, #126 of 1444 🔗

I’m surprised to see that you haven’t spent a little time dissecting the quite frankly terrifying authoritarianism playing out in Oz, Toby.

Not content with deploying hundreds of police officers to enforce the locking down of some 3000 tower block residents, confining them to nothing but their four walls for 5 full days (all because of a measly 23 cases, I should add), the government has now shut down Melbourne for 6 weeks due to a “surge in new infections.”

Let’s note here that Australia has been testing its citizens like crazy, and this would obviously increase the number of positive cases. There has been however a small fightback against this policy, I quote from the DT:

“More than 10,000 people have refused to be tested for coronavirus as the Australian health authorities warned that conspiracy theories are hampering efforts to contain a steep spike in cases around the city of Melbourne.”

One wonders if this new lockdown is a show of force to punish these dissenters into taking their tests?

There are actually only 23 people in hospital with Covid-19 in the whole state of Victoria, a population of some 6.3 million people. Australia has suffered a tiny fraction of UK coronavirus deaths with 104, and yet that is deemed a serious enough public health crisis to ban an entire city of some 5 million people from leaving their homes over the next few weeks.

The police have set up checkpoints around Melbourne to form a “ring of steel” around the quarantine area, and are able to issue crippling fines to anybody who dares shop for something that isn’t deemed essential.

The bugs and an aversion to long flights were a couple of reasons I wasn’t keen on ever visiting Australia, now I can add a reckless, totalitarian and despotic government to that list.

45954 ▶▶ james, replying to Scotty87, 10, #127 of 1444 🔗

Australia has always been authoritarian to the extreme. Riding a push bike without a helmet, $300 fine! They are a nanny state. I will be watching with intrigue how this plays out with the banning of incoming tourists and ramping tensions with China.

46172 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to james, 1, #128 of 1444 🔗

Wow, never knew that..

45957 ▶▶ james, replying to Scotty87, 4, #129 of 1444 🔗
45983 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to james, 16, #130 of 1444 🔗

We used to be. We’ve had a Conservative government for 10 years, or so we thought, and it’s these fake Conservatives that have slowly but surely chipped away at our freedom of speech and our civil liberties, now the Coronavirus is a godsend to them to impose even more rules upon us.

46538 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Bella Donna, 4, #131 of 1444 🔗

Boris needs to STFU.

I thought the only good thing about him was that he wasn’t Corbyn but I was wrong

46280 ▶▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to james, 1, #132 of 1444 🔗

Wow, that is some absolutely cracking work done by the NSW police force!

First they solve the case of: “The Kebab Eating Jogger” and then they cracked the one:”Where did all the Zingers go?”

Do they drive around the state in a green van with a talking dog, I wonder?

45960 ▶▶ Mark B, replying to Scotty87, 28, #133 of 1444 🔗

What’s encouraging is if you look at the comments on Sky News Australia YouTube people are really waking up to what is going on. “A pandemic so deadly they have to test thousands of people to find it”

45978 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Scotty87, 25, #134 of 1444 🔗

No one can tell me there isn’t a global plan going on here. The virus is just excuse to impose authoritarianism on us. Resist Resist Resist!

46038 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Bella Donna, 5, #135 of 1444 🔗

It gets harder and harder to resist this interpretation. One-world totalitarian government, here we come.

46767 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to IanE, 1, #136 of 1444 🔗

That’s what they want Ian, not what we want.

47251 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to IanE, #137 of 1444 🔗

Winston Churchilll said it best: Never!

45953 Gillian, replying to Gillian, 5, #138 of 1444 🔗

Face mask coverings in shops in Scotland

Link to the relevant Statutory Instrument made yesterday


45958 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Gillian, 19, #139 of 1444 🔗

I shall offer my habitual bare faced custom to a small shop today. As a regular customer, I’m hoping that they’ll fulfil my weekly order, but we shall see.

Several more small businesses have closed in recent weeks and this will not help recovery in this rapidly declining small town.

Only one bank remains, along with only 2 free cash points.

Ghost Town looms.

45977 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Gillian, 22, #140 of 1444 🔗

what a ludicrous document by absolute wankers whom think they can regulate the cleaning of your fucking teeth. They’ve went insane. They seem to think it’s popular but outside of the wankers on Twitter and Facebook Sturgeon has over played her hand and i predict this type of fascism will be the end of her.

46002 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Biker, 13, #141 of 1444 🔗

Most of the wankers on Twatter and Arsebook are probably 77th Brigade anyway.

46071 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 6, #142 of 1444 🔗

The UK Column gave out personal number and email for a 77th Brigade colonel. If you want to give them a bell. Dialing code and all. Be polite of course when discussing why they are using proacative shell accounts to control and colour covid discussions.

I would post the number/address here but I am unsure if I break a law by doing so while not wearing a mask.

46167 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 2, #143 of 1444 🔗

There are definitely stooges on Twitter who target anybody with even a slight appearance of having a dissenting view.

46031 ▶▶▶ Guirme, replying to Biker, 1, #144 of 1444 🔗

Oops, must have missed the teeth cleaning rules!

46055 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Guirme, 3, #145 of 1444 🔗

the virus can live in the dry sockets that most of the Irn Bru drinking brave hearts have for teeth for years.

46034 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Biker, 4, #146 of 1444 🔗

I so hope you are right. I half expect them to introduce a straight-arm salute and seig-heil as official greeting!

46040 ▶▶ Guirme, replying to Gillian, 6, #147 of 1444 🔗

The exclusion of cafes is interesting as I can think of several combined cafes and retail food premises. These would be good places for sceptics to frequent to start chipping away at this ludicrous requirement.

Also how about withdrawing some money from your nearest bank’s cash machine then going inside to deposit it back into your account as banks seem to be exempt.

46440 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Gillian, 3, #148 of 1444 🔗

… it is a reasonable excuse for a person not to wear a face covering, where that person is undertaking food handling tasks, in order to avoid risk to the hygiene or safety of food.

Well that makes logical sense – not!

46559 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to Gillian, 1, #149 of 1444 🔗

Thanks for finding that – I’ve been looking for the exact legislation & even today couldn’t find it. I was thinking Wee Jimmie hadn’t even bothered to put it through & was taking us more for fools than normal!

46602 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to Gillian, #150 of 1444 🔗

I highly recommend having a wee dig through the legislation site, bit of a convoluted mind melt but can be very useful.

For example, after reading it last night, if you are a shop worker ‘Paragraph (1) does not apply to the wearing of a face covering by … an employee, where a distance of at least two metres is maintained between the … employee and members of the public’, where Paragraph (1) says ‘… no person may use a shop without wearing a face covering.’

A helpful escape clause for use with management, colleagues, busybodies and the poileas.

46784 ▶▶ Adam, replying to Gillian, #151 of 1444 🔗

There may be a partial loophole. From page 5, paragraph 6 of the ‘Explanatory Note’ towards the end of the Scottish Statutory Instruments linked to immediately above:

“Regulation 2(11)(c) of these Regulations amends regulation 8(5A) of the principal regulations, to provide that it is a reasonable excuse for a person not to wear a face covering, where that person is undertaking food handling tasks, in order to avoid risk to the hygiene or safety of food.”

So, if you’re in a shop buying food – and perhaps particularly if you’re undertaking the food handling task of purchasing it for and delivering it to a neighbour – you have a reasonable excuse not to wear a face covering.

Why should food handlers be exempt? The only reason I can think of at the moment is that wearing face coverings might make it more difficult for handlers to detect that the food is off, or is not quite ripe or, well, you’ve got to be able to smell the stuff.

Would this fly? I’m not a lawyer so I can’t say. But I’ll try to contact one over the weekend and get back to you. At my nearby Sainsbury’s Local, the assistant manager assured me yesterday that his staff would make no attempt to enforce face covering. At 21:45 this evening, at least three non-face-covered customers were allowed to pass through the checkouts as normal. Following two episodes of diligent, face-covering-free shopping yesterday, I now have food (and drink) supplies for around two weeks (guests included). If I need to top up – milk probably – I’ll very likely be a non-face-covered late-evening shopper (I know, not much of a protest, but it’s about as much as I can manage at the moment).

47260 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Adam, #152 of 1444 🔗

Bureaucrts love making up new rules and regulations. It’s what they do best. Could not live without it. Their sole reason for living. Poor sods.

45959 Gillian, replying to Gillian, 5, #153 of 1444 🔗
45964 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Gillian, 3, #154 of 1444 🔗

Brilliant, absolutely nailed it, I’ll be sharing this everywhere

45969 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Gillian, 15, #155 of 1444 🔗

Exactly … what did happen to those serious spikes in infections after all the protests?! It’s over. Let’s get back to proper normal. Now.

46564 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to Gillian, #156 of 1444 🔗

Yup, good find.

45962 Hoppy Uniatz, 4, #157 of 1444 🔗

Here’s another blogger who has been consistently sceptical (his “I Want Coronavirus” piece from March is well worth reading, too):


45963 Biker, replying to Biker, 46, #158 of 1444 🔗

Just back from the co-op after buying four rolls. All the staff wearing plastic visors and they have a sign up saying please wear the mandatory masks while in their shop. I didn’t, no one said a word. Don’t wear the mask and if the fuzz challenge you lie to them about how you’re medically exempt. There is no official way of proving you are exempt so there is no official way of proving you’re not.

45966 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Biker, 28, #159 of 1444 🔗

Me too, I’m doing my usual shop this morning without a mask!!!

45968 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Biker, 19, #160 of 1444 🔗

Well done Biker. Keep up the good work.

45972 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Biker, 12, #161 of 1444 🔗

“Insanity is contagious.”

“Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t after you.”

Catch 22 -says it all. Joseph Heller nailed it.

Milo Minderbender might as well take charge of this lunacy.

46585 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to Biker, #162 of 1444 🔗

Not seen the police out and about for mask stuff, see what tomorrow brings, Saturday shopping anyone? Saw one van race through town, usually see a lot more.

45965 Nigel Sherratt, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 5, #163 of 1444 🔗

Dan Bongino isn’t a DJ at all. He is a political commentator with a very popular US show online. Ex NYPD and Secret Service (presidential bodyguard). Worth a look for insights into conservative USA. https://bongino.com/

45970 ▶▶ Scotty87, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #164 of 1444 🔗

Quite right. I’ve listened to his podcast on and off since Trump’s election, he can certainly take the fight to the bed-wetting left!

45974 Peter Thompson, replying to Peter Thompson, 18, #165 of 1444 🔗

Second wave Wendys are getting very excited now as the media caravan will now leave Texas and head off to Melbourne. Of course Australia and New Zealand have played the impossible game of elimination much to the BBC and Guardians approval , although it was the latter that the media praised as NZ has a socialist government led by saintly Jacinta.

There actually has been no first wave in the antipodes just a few cases arriving in the southern summer from Italy in March. Melboure has lots of dry tinder, high density tower blocks, diverse population. multigenerational families and now it is mid winter. They have also ramped up testing to 30,000 a day ( NZ max is only testing 2,000 a day and that is mainly on the quarantined inflow ) .Corona will come to Auckland soon despite the best efforts of Jacinta and the BBC.

The worst aspects now in Melbourne are , the hard lockdown now imposed for 2 months and the media s scare tactics. Imagine the UK media in March 2020 but 10 x worse. Here is a link if you can stomach it.


45992 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Peter Thompson, 8, #166 of 1444 🔗

Not one mention of deaths or hospitalisations!? 1000 cases in population of close to 6.5mil in Victoria = 0.15% and you get headlines and articles like that?

45994 ▶▶▶ Gillian, replying to Sarigan, 8, #167 of 1444 🔗

Just wait for the fake footage from “overrun” hospitals In Melbourne.

46012 ▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Gillian, 7, #168 of 1444 🔗

I have family in Melbourne. I will ask them to attempt some investigative journalism.

46318 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 2, #169 of 1444 🔗

Not great news. The reply when I asked if people will protest or resist:

“No, everyone is petrified by it. Social engineering at its best.”

46005 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Sarigan, 6, #170 of 1444 🔗

And, of course, a positive result from a dodgy test is not a ‘case’.

46144 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to Peter Thompson, 7, #171 of 1444 🔗

What was just as scary, and perhaps more “telling” was reading through the comments section: not a single dissenting opinion! Almost everyone screaming that MASKS SHOULD BE MANDATORY and praising Scotland. No one questioning the appallingly distorted statistics. No one querying the disappropriate response. (Almost) No one bothering to justify their comments with facts or numbers.

I lived in Australia for 4 years; and this is absolutely classic behavior by the populace. It was a nannying state 20 years ago and it’s only gotten orders of magnitude worse, in my opinion and from discussions with family and friends who still live there. I use to go to the park in Sydney, and a large sign would greet me, divided up into 16 smaller signs, each one telling me what I cannot do. Australians love to be told how to think, what not to do, what to say and how to behave – preferably explicitly laid out without ambiguity. Their government popularised slogan-based-governing well before ours did! “Click, clack, front and back.” “Slip, slap, slop.”, etc … Sigh, I feel for those in Melbourne – a (once) great city.

Sorry, had to get that off my chest.
Cheers all and have a good day – the sun is shining and I’ve found a no-fuss local!

46365 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to HaylingDave, 1, #172 of 1444 🔗

Not all those comments are forced to be genuine.

46465 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #173 of 1444 🔗

That’s why it’s important to contribute and redess the balance.

46481 ▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #174 of 1444 🔗


45975 Charles, replying to Charles, 42, #175 of 1444 🔗


There will be other businesses that might fit, but supermarkets are the most obvious control during this absurd experiment. They are to be found all over the country and their operations have changed very, very little since February.

Since supermarket staff are, therefore, an excellent representation of the working age population, might it not make sense to examine the apparent effect of Covid-19 on these people? They have come into continual contact with each other, customers, suppliers and their own families. I have not yet seen a supermarket employee wearing gloves or a mask, or observe any kind of distance dance.

During a conversation with the extremely sanguine manager of a branch of Sainsbury’s today (conducted at a gap of about 50cm), I was told that not a single one of their 350-strong staff had been ill. This sort of anecdotal evidence is corroborated by plenty of other posts over the past few weeks.

Businesses that are feverishly setting themselves up for a fall by ‘doubling-down’ on the incoherent guidance could do worse than taking a leaf from the supermarket playbook.

Dare I suggest the Government might use the supermarkets as a very strong case study, with which to restore public confidence?

(Sorry if you already saw this – it went on last night, just before ‘changeover’.)

46007 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Charles, 30, #176 of 1444 🔗

One of the checkout assistants at my local Sainsbury’s has said the same thing – no-one in the branch has been off sick since this insanity began and barely anyone has been using any PPE either. This is considering that their oldest member of staff is in his 60s and the youngest is around 18.

When people go on and on about infections I always put forward the supermarket question – why is it supermarket workers have not been dropping like flies since this madness began.

46018 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Bart Simpson, 12, #177 of 1444 🔗

Me too, I also wonder how prisons have faired, a colleague’s husband is a prison warden and he has been working (as well as doing some building work on the side) and he is fine. I believe prisoners have been locked in their cell for longer and have staggered their association and eating but I don’t think the prison population has been decimated, then again prisoners make more money for the government.

46028 ▶▶▶▶ davews, replying to stefarm, 8, #178 of 1444 🔗

Our local Tesco had a couple of staff test positive last week. Sadly someone leaked it on Facebook and the comments which followed are confirmation of why I don’t go near that platform. Suspect it was back office staff as it seems the danger to the general public is very small. So it does happen.

46036 ▶▶▶▶▶ Charles, replying to davews, 8, #179 of 1444 🔗

As you say, it must happen. The question is, for those that have – for the most part – continued with life/business as usual, what has the incidence rate been? No need for models on this one, just hard facts.

46048 ▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to davews, 5, #180 of 1444 🔗

i’d bet the people, who claimed they have the virus that work at tescos were lying and just wanted a couple of weeks off on full pay.

46065 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Biker, 7, #181 of 1444 🔗

Overflowing bins across the city? Reason: corona self isolating bin people. Council are understaffed. Of course its a fucking holiday. The supermarkets have been seemless – essential workers incentivised by respect to keep working. Council staff, life is a jolly for them, demoralised by managment makibg jib satisfactiin impossible. Audit the cronona council it will reveal a lot about management.

46074 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Basics, 10, #182 of 1444 🔗

All civil servants (me being one, don’t judge me) are on a jolly up. Wow, how exciting, let’s have a zoom meeting and chat on Skype, super fun and no fares to pay as we are sitting working at home.

No thanks, I for one have been desperate to get back to the office if only for some face to face social interaction and normality.

46467 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to stefarm, 3, #183 of 1444 🔗

My son found that working from home means twice the work without the leavening of social interaction.

46501 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #184 of 1444 🔗


46029 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to stefarm, 3, #185 of 1444 🔗

Yeah, I’ve not heard of any prisoners and wardens dropping like flies either. Good point.

46310 ▶▶▶▶▶ El coronel no tiene quien le escriba, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #186 of 1444 🔗

Actually low ranking prison staff were on that list of ‘occupations statistically more likely to die of Covid’ published a few weeks back, along with taxi drivers and chefs.

46468 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to El coronel no tiene quien le escriba, 1, #187 of 1444 🔗

Shift work, low pay, high stress …..

46448 ▶▶ chris c, replying to Charles, 5, #188 of 1444 🔗

And in fact they are now going to introduce (mandatory?) testing for supermarket staff among others presumably hoping to find those pesky symptomless infections

We had one here but no knowing if she caught it in the supermarket or even if it actually was covid. No-one in any other shops or farm shops, one has been quite relaxed throughout. Lots of reports of nil cases all over the country. This should be good news but who wants good news?

46500 ▶▶ ianric, replying to Charles, 3, #189 of 1444 🔗

I would assume supermarkets are getting more customers than usual as supermarkets are able to sell items unavailable in other shops unable to open eg clothes. The justification for lockdown was that if businesses were open this would result in people catching the coronavirus. If this justification is valid, how is that staff at supermarkets have not been catching coronavirus. Have any cases come forward of customers who claimed to have caught coronavirus in a supermarket?

It would be interesting to know what the takings of supermarkets have been when other businesses couldn’t open. Have supermarkets been complete winners in this situation. How much have supermarkets have lost not being able to operate their cafes. There is an Asda not from me which as several caravan parks nearby. This branch must have lost a lot of custom as tourist can’t use the caravans.

46556 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to ianric, 1, #190 of 1444 🔗

There are still periodic shortages in our Co-Op. I went in just after five but there was a queue the length of which I hadn’t seen since April. I went back later and no queue ouside but only two till girls on so there was an internal queue. Fewer shortages today and some of the purchasing limits have been removed, but only two cartons of milk.

I suspect takings would be up, but would have been even higher if they had more stock. Yes lots of stuff like sucepans which are uninfectious unlike the ones in the ironmongers, obviously.,

I suspect most “cases” have been caught in hospitals and care homes. Places where the public congregates, not so much.

46599 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to chris c, 4, #191 of 1444 🔗

Forgot to add, the Co-Op is back to staying open until 10 pm, it was previously closing at six. The town shops were forced to close at 12 or 1, now they are magnanimously permitted to stay open untril 2 pm. The Thoroughfare (pedestrianised high street) is now signed to walk on the left. Originally the public toiulets were closed but those in the Co-Op stayed open. Then the town ones were reopened but those in the Co-Op were closed and still are.

Since this is a killer virus despite hardly anyone here catching it, I completely fail to see the logic of making twice as many people go shopping in half the time

46619 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to Charles, #192 of 1444 🔗

Yup, this is an excellent point to make!

46705 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Charles, #193 of 1444 🔗

It’s quite interesting, if you think about it, that supermarket staff (who are low paid), meet huge numbers of people very day, and yet few if any of them have caught the virus, much less ended up in intensive care with it, and yet Boris, who is very well-off (also a number of other politicians) who relatively speaking meets few people (and most of them also rich), managed somehow to catch it…

45980 mhcp, replying to mhcp, 7, #194 of 1444 🔗

In the Great Financial Crisis, Howie Hubler lost $8 billion due to his selling of CDS instruments against one’s he owned. Basically he was short the bond market but then needed to keep his sales numbers up so did the idiotic thing of selling insurance on “less risky” bonds thinking he could beat the market. This is in the book “The Big Short”

Matt Hancock has surpassed that recklessness with easy abandon. And it seems with out any recourse. Just think what £10B could do for innovation and entrepreneurs in this country.

45989 ▶▶ steve, replying to mhcp, 9, #195 of 1444 🔗

£15billion on ppe!!!! How is that possible. Most operations cancelled.
ICU half full. I tried to look up the number of personal working there but the £per person doesn’t make sense!

46083 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to steve, 8, #196 of 1444 🔗

£15billion on ppe!!!! How is that possible.

It’s not. Not without corruption or plastic gloves at £10,000 a pair.

46476 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to steve, 1, #197 of 1444 🔗

One of the comments:

PPE has cost about £54000 per case. To put that in context, one could have instead made health staff disposable and simply replaced them by training up new ones as they fell for less money.

46010 ▶▶ Basics, replying to mhcp, 17, #198 of 1444 🔗

Look into hancocks eyes. What is in there? Who keeps ticking along with a record like his.

Hopefully people have the sense to consider Major Tom the verteran walker fundraiser – his millions raised for the NHS are but a piddle in the wind. A pointless effort in context of losses and waste on the scale hancock has conjured.

Why would anyone support charitable fundraising efforts for the NHS when there are sewer monsters leeching out billions upon billions of pounds. The real charitable efforts should now be angeled at removing, getting rid of the offensive wasteful ruinous scum.

Recall Mr Mathew Hancock lurching out in front of the nation at an early lockup Downing St Press Conference to annouce he had just wiped out £12.5 Billion of NHS debt. This was hancocks first move in this scam, his big announcement to dazzle the nation. Decades of human loss and suffering because funds could not be found for treatments, equipement and care because of debts wiped out just like that. To suit the political moment.

The scale of these sums is inhuman. Such enormous amounts could easily hide frauds. Just as a matter of due diligence a police team to take on the task of investigating – whats a £30 million spend on such a team now, Major Tom knocked out his pan and raised that in a week or two anyway.

46133 ▶▶▶ Bobblybob, replying to Basics, 5, #199 of 1444 🔗

It’s all going into the same big pockets of the same shady big bastards

Quarter of a billion quid ppe supply contract to a ‘wealth’ company, who have nothing to do with ppe, with no tender. They’re not even bothering with the brown envelopes any more.

46359 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bobblybob, #200 of 1444 🔗

Can you imagine the hide of these people. Thanks bobajob bobblybob.

46197 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 6, #201 of 1444 🔗

I always thought Major Tom was a generous, well-meaning, blithering idiot.

46295 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Basics, 3, #202 of 1444 🔗

I said that the other day somewhere when Handjob came on TV.

“There’s nothing behind his eyes”.

46360 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Farinances, 1, #203 of 1444 🔗

It’s gone whatever was there.

46455 ▶▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Basics, 1, #204 of 1444 🔗

Some one said Herr Flick of the Gestapo. Milo Minderbinder comes close also

46715 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to chris c, #205 of 1444 🔗

He looks like Lieutenant Gruber but behaves more like Herr Flick of the Gestapo.

46470 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 1, #206 of 1444 🔗

Wonder what Major Tom thinks about the billions wasted on Track and Trace.. and the money being wasted on other useless NHS Covid initiatives..

46015 ▶▶ James007, replying to mhcp, 12, #207 of 1444 🔗

I just can’t understand how Track and Trace could have cost £10B. And it isn’t even finished! Apple probably spends around £15B on R&D in a year, and that’s a company with over 100k employees, and a series of very successful products.
Where has the £10B actually gone?

46601 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to James007, 2, #208 of 1444 🔗


45981 TJN, replying to TJN, 36, #209 of 1444 🔗

A sad day for Scotland. I write from about as far away from Sturgeon land as it’s possible to get in the UK. But I want to say that my thoughts are with all of you in that blighted land, on what is a black day in the history of a wonderful country.

Yes, what’s been foisted on you is odious. But it’s also an opportunity. It’s an opportunity to undermine a nasty, authoritarian and rotten culture. Whatever the merits or demerits of independence, Scotland deserves far better than Sturgeon and her ilk.

Were it me, I would refuse to wear a muzzle and if questioned simply refuse to answer or just lie. And every time someone does that it’s another kick against a loathsome ethos, that will surely fall before long.

My guess is that for Scotland this day is the lockdown nadir, and that things get better from here on, as the likes of Sturgeon realise they no longer command the respect of the population they claim to serve.

I look forward to reading your stories of noncompliance on here, and this evening (bit early in the day now) will be raising a wee dram to you all.

45985 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to TJN, 13, #210 of 1444 🔗

Thanks TJN, that is a wonderful and supportive post which has raised my spirits.

Gillian (from Soviet Scotland)

45987 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to TJN, 6, #211 of 1444 🔗

We will stay strong 💪 💪

45988 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to TJN, 8, #212 of 1444 🔗

All Dictators go the same way in the end

46019 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Cecil B, 6, #213 of 1444 🔗

Yes – usually after several million innocents though.

45993 ▶▶ Biker, replying to TJN, 17, #214 of 1444 🔗

Scotland has become like all the rest of the western countries, exactly the same and the next place. No matter where you go you see the same shit. The public are moronic. I don’t blame them for this because the state education system is designed to educate you to such a level as you don’t know how to think for yourself. Sure some rise above that but not many. I went to Dollar Academy, a private school where you were expected to know things once you had been shown them, you were expected to want to provide for yourself and you were taught the importance of self respect. State educated people in the main are taught that you’ll never amount to nothing and should just shut up and do what your betters tell you. There isn’t a way out of this and i’m at a loss as to how we can ever get back to individuals. These people seem to enjoy group think and we’re all in this together type bullshit. They’ve never walked a step in their own shoes.

45997 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Biker, 13, #215 of 1444 🔗

Sad to think how far the reputation of Scottish education, once so high, has fallen.

46035 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 4, #216 of 1444 🔗

And so quickly.

46099 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Biker, 5, #217 of 1444 🔗

They’ve never walked a step in their own shoes.” ….. Perfect. I have never heard it put better than that.

45995 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to TJN, 6, #218 of 1444 🔗

Thank youTJN. Recent conversations show that She Who Must Be Obeyed is not enjoying the soaring popularity which the MSM reports.

Let’s hope that voting with our feet does the trick, although I hope this latest piece of dumbthink will be revoked before too many more small businesses go under.

46011 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to wendyk, 12, #219 of 1444 🔗

Presumably, given that shopping will be such an unpleasant experience, it hopefully won’t be long until the shops realise what is happening to their businesses.

As I say, for essential shopping such as food, I would simply refuse to answer any questions or just lie – the only truth any of us owe then likes of Sturgeon, Hancock, Johnson et al. is to let them know what we think of them.

Just been listening to some non-entity minor government minister on the Today Programme (around 08:15) going on about how we should all be wearing muzzles. And of course, the BBC interviewer was asking leading questions – clearly the BBC has decided that we should all be wearing muzzles. My blood is up now!

46016 ▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to TJN, 5, #220 of 1444 🔗

Will the news presenter or other celeb luvvies wear them on tv? Of course not. Not only would we not be able to hear them but they will have some sort of exemption.

46017 ▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to TJN, 5, #221 of 1444 🔗

You’re quite right, and I shall be invoking the damage in my right eye-suitably invisible, but real.

I won’t be expecting to be carted off to the nearest optician for a scan:they’re all closed still!

Let us hope for an outbreak of impossible-to-verify- mask exemptions .

46044 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to TJN, 9, #222 of 1444 🔗

I’m hoping to find a shop ttat bars my entry. A food shop. I want to stand in the door way and have them creatively work out how to get a loaf of bread to me and me to pay for it without my entering. There are certain hamanities even the most steroid pumped security cannot disregard. Then again…

This is fantasy of course since people will get on despite the holyrood babblings.

46026 ▶▶ Basics, replying to TJN, 3, #223 of 1444 🔗

Happy Scottish masks in shops dat to you to TJN. As you say another ruling another opportunity to declare opposition.

46098 ▶▶ annie, replying to TJN, 4, #224 of 1444 🔗

I hate whisky but I’m with you in spirit(s).
Now’s the day and now’s the hour!

46113 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to annie, 11, #225 of 1444 🔗

Ah, but you have to try the real stuff – straight from the cask (typically 55-60% ABV), not filtered, not coloured.You can’t generally get it in shops – I get most of mine from the Scotch Malt Whisky Society.

I offer it to friends who say they hate whisky, and I’ve never known any of them say it isn’t wonderful.

It’s impossible to drink this stuff, and think where it comes from, and not understand that Sturgeon and her ilk are not Scotland, but an aberration – a disease that has foisted itself on a magnificent country.

Sorry for any Sturgeon supporters out here. I really don’t like her.

The country and landscape that invented single malt whisky will not long endure having to wear face nappies.

46195 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to TJN, 11, #226 of 1444 🔗

Whether or not I ever take to whiskey, I know that Scotland is a great country with some of the most magnificent scenery in the world. It’ll outlast the Poison Dwarfess.
As for Sturgeon, she’s reminding me more and more of Ceausescu, the sadistic megalomaniac Romanian dictator.
They shot him.

46210 ▶▶▶▶▶ Evelyn, replying to annie, 8, #227 of 1444 🔗

Sturgeon is detestable. You all probably saw the photo of the banner someone put up in Charlotte Square in Edinburgh (quickly taken down) of Sturgeon as Hitler.

46487 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Evelyn, 2, #228 of 1444 🔗

Quickly taken down – but the photo was published in a load of newspapers!

45984 Cecil B, 4, #229 of 1444 🔗

A bunch of fraudsters and conmen

45991 Nigel Sherratt, 4, #230 of 1444 🔗

The ‘Ice Cold in Alex’ scene of grabbing Captain van der Poel’s dog tags at the last moment to save him from being shot as a spy seems relevant to ‘Test and Trace’ lists too.

46001 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 19, #231 of 1444 🔗

So, we are meant to social-distance.

Why the hell then, in the name of all that is sane, have Essex Highways put an effing 20 m.p.h. speed limit sign (which no-one is taking any notice of), on the pavement preventing the social-distancing that they want us all to partake in? The sign is taking up half of the pavement.

When the hell are people going to grow a pair and rise up against this crap … when?

46006 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to kh1485, 7, #232 of 1444 🔗

I have a feeling that some enterprising person will write their own three.part.slogan on the COVID and speed limit signs … 😉

46014 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to kh1485, 4, #233 of 1444 🔗

As in f…k right off?

46020 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to wendyk, 3, #234 of 1444 🔗

I couldn’t possibly say 😉

46013 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kh1485, 3, #235 of 1444 🔗

Shows that this lot don’t really use there brains do they?

46095 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #236 of 1444 🔗

What brains?

46352 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, 1, #237 of 1444 🔗

Nope they don’t have any and their IQ is that of parsley.

46451 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #238 of 1444 🔗

Come on Bart, that’s a bit unfair on parsley … (a very versatile herb!)

46740 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kh1485, 1, #239 of 1444 🔗


46021 annie, replying to annie, 30, #240 of 1444 🔗

The NHS killing machine is going full revs:

…In particular, experts highlighted a “growing crisis” in access to diagnostic procedures, with 571,459 patients waiting more than six weeks in May for one of 15 standard tests – such as MRI or ultrasound – compared to just 43,230 in the same month last year.
Such tests are crucial for detecting cancers and other serious diseases at an early stage.


Clap that, you bloody zombies..

46043 ▶▶ Biker, replying to annie, 17, #241 of 1444 🔗

It seems like the virus is the excuse to let millions die from cancer.

46154 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Biker, 4, #242 of 1444 🔗

And this is just the UK. Worldwide numbers will be far greater.

46176 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Sarigan, 8, #244 of 1444 🔗

‘Moreover, if you take the line that we’re better safe than sorry, why were there no calls to make the wearing of masks mandatory in the winter of 2017/8 when there 50,000 excess deaths- thought to be caused by the predominant strain of flu?
The fact that there were no calls then for masks to be worn by the politicians now calling for us all to wear them is quite revealing. Because surely if you think face coverings do make a difference with reducing infections, you’d want them used every time there is a bad bug doing the rounds?
In fact, given the figures, you could argue that there was a much stronger case for wearing face masks in early 2018 than there is in the summer of 2020. Yet no one made the case for the two years ago.Clearly there‘s more to this than meets the eye. You don’t have to be Hercule Poirot to suspect there’s a hidden agenda at play.’


46024 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 15, #245 of 1444 🔗

Another reason to boycott museums, art galleries and heritage sites:

It seems that their insistence on pre booking is not only with regards to adhering to anti-social distancing but also to aid in the NHS test and trace system:

Tried the National Gallery and this was on the website: Use of the National Gallery’s website and your account is subject to our terms of use Details of how we will communicate with you and use your data, for example in respect of the NHS Test and Trace scheme, are detailed in our privacy policy .

It was harder to find the information on the RAF museum.

The cynic in me wonders if they are using the museum sector knowing that the people who tend to go to these places are the “I’m all right Jack” mentality and are not wholly concerned with the increasing erosion of our civil rights.

46177 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bart Simpson, 8, #246 of 1444 🔗

I think that pretty much *all* measures now are underhand ways of harvesting people’s personal details, now that Simon Dolan has started challenging decisions in the courts, and that they have seen that people are not willing going to download any tracing app..

46203 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Carrie, 4, #247 of 1444 🔗

Me too. TT&T at all costs. Even though nobody fucking cares.

46330 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Carrie, 1, #248 of 1444 🔗

Still have to check if there’s a tick box for you to opt out because it clearly says in the guidelines that if people decline to take part in TT&T then you have no right to hold their data.

46581 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, #249 of 1444 🔗

BUT are they obliged to take it?
Because that’s a different ballgame.

46698 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #250 of 1444 🔗

That’s a good question. I think really the safest way is to boycott and refuse to visit until this madness is over.

46663 ▶▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to Carrie, #251 of 1444 🔗

Not just your details, but your DNA from the swabs.

46027 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 33, #252 of 1444 🔗

So my bf and I were meant to go to NY at the end of August. I booked the holiday way back in the dark, cold days of early January, before anyone had even heard of Covid. One of the flights got cancelled in June which entitled me to a refund, and to be fair BA were very good and returned all the money to me within 48 hours, which I was surprised at because I was expecting a real protracted wrangle to get my money back. Can’t complain about the customer service but of course I am bitterly disappointed because going abroad is a real luxury for someone like me and I’ve never been to the USA before so I was really looking forward to it.

Therefore, we turned our attention to where else we could go this summer, trying to salvage some sort of fun. We normally go to Scotland every year anyway and we absolutely love the place, Edinburgh is one of my favourite cities in the world but this year, I’m really not feeling it at all. I really don’t want to be forced to wear a muzzle on my face whenever I go into a shop (and going into physical shops is something I regard as important because I hate online shopping and I don’t want to see the high street die). Sturgeon has also been complicit in anti-English sentiment, what with an increase in cases being attributed to ‘English contractors’ and reports of SNP activists turning people away at the border. These may well be little things but it is very off-putting, and it’s also off-putting to know that a lot of establishments may well still be closed and there will just not be as much to do.

It seems a waste to spend money on accommodation and fuel/train tickets (the latter of which are extortionately expensive right now, something I am furious about given that I can’t drive and rely quite heavily on trains) when the ‘holiday’ experience may well be a washout. It honestly seems a better idea right now just to pack it in and spend that money on a new games console or something, but that feels like we’re being complicit in obeying our overlords and being forced to stay inside, never go out or have any fun.

It’s a dilemma and I truly think that these bastards are determined to suck all humanity and enjoyment out of any activity they possibly can. Maybe I’m overreacting but the thought of going out and about, being forced to cover my face, makes me really rather scared and upset. I am very worried that mask wearing will become mandatory in as many places as possible and reading about what is happening in Catalonia, Spain, where masks are mandatory in all public areas, is frightening. I do a lot of strenuous outdoor exercise in public like running and road biking – can you imagine panting into a filthy, sweaty mask, not being able to breathe properly at a time when your body is expelling CO2 and needs as much oxygen as possible? I can’t think of anything worse. I don’t want to go on a day out to the shops with my bf and turn to him and see his beautiful smile and his laugh, my favourite feature of his, covered up by some dirty piece of fabric. Have all our interactions conducted from behind the mask. He’s a portrait photographer and I imagine that mandatory mask wearing would make his job a lot harder and less fulfilling.

Modern Western society does not have a precedent for mandatory face covering at any point in recent history – so why now?

46033 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Poppy, 20, #253 of 1444 🔗

just come anyway, Sturgeon and her goons aren’t the majority and anyway fuck ’em. Don’t bother with the masks either. Most people aren’t buying it and all over the place people are just out and about doing what they want. The mask wearing bullshit will be the undoing of Sturgeon. Go up the east coast, stay away from the shit hole that is Glasgow.

46037 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Biker, 4, #254 of 1444 🔗

I’m looking forward to your updates today Biker! Good one earlier about your visit to the Co-op.

46072 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to TJN, 11, #255 of 1444 🔗

I can’t say i’m enjoy my need to ignore these people but in my five decades i’ve only needed to enjoy life and do all the things i’ve done but now it seems they’re going to force me to stand up for a real issue. Not like the bullshit protests over the years where people have protested this that and the next thing. Today it stands the government has taken our lives and decreed what exactly we can do right up to the point of who you visit,sleep with how you buy goods and services and all the rest of it. It’s the society the Germans would have imposed on us had they won the war, oh wait, sorry, they did win the war didn’t they, they just changed the name and called it the EU.

46057 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Biker, 9, #256 of 1444 🔗

Someone posted late yesterday there is a genuine idea -facebook page is set up apparently- for a clap for Sturgeon in a weeks time. Not joking. Since this is ‘International Scotland is a dictstorship day’ I repost my reply to the Sturgeon clap here:

A good time to mention the pulled advert which saw pramary school aged children talking to camera to say thank you to nicola sturgeon.

It was an STV advert which ran in the first weeks of the lockdown. The children could not possibly have know what they were saying (it was scripted) or how they were being used. Its was an effort to manipulate public perception in favour of the dear leader.

Accustations of child abuse were levelled and the advert was pulled with an investigation promised.

Yes it was creepy to see children on their beds, in their bedrooms and elsewhere thanking nicola for keeping them safe.

One of the papers from the time.

Other less tabloid comment is available.

It makes me sick to even think this happened nevermind having unwittingly witnessed the advert.

46075 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Basics, 4, #257 of 1444 🔗

If anyone deserves the clap it’s sturgeon. Do Lesbians catch the clap?

46070 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Poppy, 2, #258 of 1444 🔗

There’s always hitch-hiking, Poppy. Great fun (if the weather’s kind. 🙂 ).

46191 ▶▶ annie, replying to Poppy, 3, #259 of 1444 🔗

You’re young. NY will still be there after the bollox is over, go then and have a fantastic time!

46659 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Poppy, #260 of 1444 🔗

Because they are trying to break your spirit Polly. There is no other explanation.

46030 TJN, replying to TJN, 25, #261 of 1444 🔗

Toby writes in today’s post about how the dismissal of the Dolan and Waters legal challenges is ‘depressing’.

But this was never, ever going to be easy. Our society has been eaten out by a self-serving rotten culture, and it is going to take a very long time to put right – perhaps a generation.

Surely it’s incumbent on all of us to recognise this, and to be prepared to be in it for the long haul.

So please Toby, the Dolan and Waters review dismissals are not ‘depressing’: they merely lay bare the scale of what we are up against. They are no reason to be depressed, but a call on all of us to dig deep, and patiently and stoically to set about changing things – while ready and prepared for many setbacks along the way.

Lockdown is a symptom of what has gone wrong in our societies, not the core wrong in itself.

47271 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to TJN, #262 of 1444 🔗

C. S. Lewis’s prophecy has come true.
The fearmongering of the past twenty plus years by the dogooders of Public Health England, the World Health Organization, the visible and invisible Quangos, plus charlatans like Michael Bloomberg and company, combined with the public’s cowardice, passivity and inability to stand up to their relentless onslaught, has paved the way to the situtation we live in now. I hope that the level of incompetence and inefficiency that these groups have shown the world for the past four months will finally reveal the undeniable truth that their pretentions of superiority and know-it-all-ism were without foundation; hubris on a global scale, funded with taxpayer monies. If any organizations deserve to be defunded the global health network should be first on the list.
Richard Riewer

46032 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 6, #263 of 1444 🔗

Hi, this is from the NHS England website that shows that there have only been 1366 deaths in hospital since April of people with no known pre-existing condition:

‘COVID-19 all announced deaths
The total announced file is updated daily and contains information on the deaths of patients who have died in hospitals in England and either tested positive for COVID-19 or where no positive test result was received for COVID-19, but COVID-19 was mentioned on their death certificate. All deaths are recorded against the date of death rather than the day the deaths were announced. This file contains breakdowns by region, age group and NHS trust for those who tested positive for COVID-19. This file also contains a breakdown by region for those where no positive result was received, but COVID-19 was mentioned on their death certificate.’

‘where no positive test result was received for COVID-19, but COVID-19 was mentioned on their death certificate.’ – how does this make any sense? You haven’t tested positive but it’s still mentioned on the death cert. I know this has come up before but is there a reasonable (i.e. one that doesn’t think the figures are fudged or a precedent in stat recording, for example) explanation for this?

46050 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Moomin, 10, #264 of 1444 🔗

It was decreed that the cause of death should be registered as coronavirus even if there was no proof. Don’t be fooled into thinking this was anything other than a deliberate attack on our civil liberties by our own government!

46059 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to Bella Donna, 2, #265 of 1444 🔗

It’s so very bizarre isn’t it?!

46063 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Moomin, 15, #266 of 1444 🔗

The government have now to find a balancing act between keeping us on ‘edge’ but allowing enough leash to enable the economy to recover. Our leash to be pulled back every now and again to show us who is really in charge.

46091 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Bella Donna, 4, #267 of 1444 🔗

Spot on, BD. Succinct and so true.

46608 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to Sam Vimes, #268 of 1444 🔗

Who guards the guards? TP

46096 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #269 of 1444 🔗

Yes. Now watch that happen and how they do it. Sticking spanners in works where we can.

46139 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Moomin, #270 of 1444 🔗

It’s a bit more complicated than BD recognises. Doctors must record both the immediate cause and the contributing factors to a death, both for the family (could help them in future about hereditary conditions) and for public health purposes, see the rules:

If the doctor diagnosed that the patient had Covid symptoms, they would have to include it on the death cert (because a notifiable disease), along with the other causes, even if at the time they hadn’t got a positive test result.
(PS, do hope your posts mean you’re feeling a bit less down now?)

46164 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Bruno, 1, #271 of 1444 🔗

I believe however (based on Dr Lee on Spectator) that things were changed in March so it no longer had to be a doctor filling out death certificates in care homes, nor be a doctor who saw the patient at all.


46196 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Mark II, #272 of 1444 🔗

Not according to that link: ‘ There is no
provision in the emergency period to delegate this statutory duty to any non-medical practitioner.
‘Where the certifying doctor has not seen the deceased before death they should
delete the words last seen alive by me on.
If the deceased has been seen before death by a doctor but not the certifying doctor,
as well as signing the MCCD they should include the name of that doctor on the
MCCD. In hospital, there may be several doctors in a team caring for the patient. It is ultimately the responsibility of the consultant in charge of the patient’s care to ensure that the death is properly certified. Any subsequent enquiries, such as for the results of post-mortem or ante-mortem investigations, will be addressed to the consultant.
‘In general practice, more than one GP may have been involved in the patient’s care and so be able to certify the death. In the emergency period, the same provisions to enable any doctor to certify the death prevail in general practice.
‘If no doctor has attended the deceased within 28 days of death (including video/visual consultation) or the deceased was not seen after death by a doctor, the MCCD can still be completed. However, the registrar will be obliged to refer the death to the coroner before it can be registered. In these circumstances, the coroner may instruct the registrar to accept the certifying doctor’s MCCD for registration.’
Is there some other reference in the article?

46064 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Moomin, 2, #273 of 1444 🔗

Replace “covid” with “the devil” and see how ludicrous is sounds

46087 ▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to mhcp, 3, #274 of 1444 🔗

That is really good!
I’m going to start doing that in everyday conversations.

Or replace “covid” with “in-grown toenails” or “bunions”.
It’s more likely…

46097 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to mhcp, 5, #275 of 1444 🔗

Indeed! Or, from a visual point of view, replace the name of the disease with ‘BULLSHIT’ and it becomes its own warning 😉

46170 ▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Sam Vimes, 7, #276 of 1444 🔗

I have an elderly friend who keeps referring unintentionally to the lockdown as ‘breakdown’.

46039 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 18, #277 of 1444 🔗

Me again. Do you think this is a fair comment to make? I’ve been thinking, if no mention whatsoever had been made of Covid19 (i.e. if we’d been blissfully unaware of its existence), would we have been any more aware of a new ‘deadly’ virus spreading through the country than at other times? In other words, would it have impacted/affected our daily lives, e.g. knowing of many people going to hospital or would we have heard about excess deaths, etc.? I personally don’t think that we would have any more than in a bad flu season. However, is it possible to express this in a kind and compassionate way to lockdown zealots or even to those who’ve been affected by Covid?

46045 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Moomin, 17, #278 of 1444 🔗

Yes I agree, I haven’t been ill and I don’t know of anyone who has so if no fuss had been made of this virus, my life would have continued as normal.

46081 ▶▶ matt, replying to Moomin, 9, #279 of 1444 🔗

If nothing else, the medical establishment would have noticed something going on. While the total excess deaths are no worse than a bad flu season, they’ve occurred after the usual ‘flu season and they’ve happened over a shorter period of time than the equivalent number of flu season deaths would have done. It would have been impossible to miss a sudden increase in deaths of the elderly and the ill occurring in March and April. Most of us – except those with elderly or vulnerable relatives who ended up dead – would have noticed nothing, except that a few of us would have felt a bit rubbish with an annoying cough unusually late in the year.

46102 ▶▶▶ Rick, replying to matt, 10, #280 of 1444 🔗

Also suspect that if we take out those caused by lockdown policy, reduced healthcare, forced isolation of old and vulnerable and the panic driven madness which we know makes conditions worse, then the all cause mortality over the period would have been reduced and less noticeable even by the medics.

46134 ▶▶▶ Guirme, replying to matt, 11, #281 of 1444 🔗

But wasn’t the sudden increase in deaths of the elderly because the sick elderly were herded together in care homes by Government decree? If Covid hadn’t been mentioned and they hadn’t been chucked out of hospitals then surely the death toll would have been much lower?

46141 ▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Guirme, 5, #282 of 1444 🔗


The high death count among the elderly / compromised is because they were shepherded out of the hospitals and into the community.

46150 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Guirme, 2, #283 of 1444 🔗

To an extent, yes, but many of the unwell elderly were shipped out of hospital into care homes, and they would probably have died in hospital anyway.

I think it’s a reasonable counterfactual to say “if we had made a better effort to protect the elderly and vulnerable, including not seeding the virus into care homes from hospital, there would have been fewer deaths”, but I’m less sure that we can say with any confidence that there would have been fewer deaths of the elderly if we had not sent patients home from hospital but had made no other efforts to protect the vulnerable at all – and presumably that’s what we would have done in a scenario where we weren’t aware that the virus existed.

46278 ▶▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to matt, 5, #284 of 1444 🔗

‘To an extent, yes, but many of the unwell elderly were shipped out of hospital into care homes, and they would probably have died in hospital anyway.’

Possibly. But the elderly / compromised / unwell die every hour of every day in hospitals. It happens. We are all both aware and oblivious to this. We take it as read.

What is exceptional to this is the deliberate evacuation of very frail and vulnerable people out of the geriatric wards and into care homes – most of which were unprepared. We know that moving the elderly (especially those with degenerative conditions) really does hasten their end as it is distressing and bewildering.

Nonetheless, this was done to them in their thousands. This is an absolute travesty and a huge betrayal of them and their families.

It goes well beyond the ‘they would probably have died anyway’ argument.

46650 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Little Red Hen, #285 of 1444 🔗

I’m not condoning the actions taken. My point is, we can fairly confidently say “in a world where the elderly weren’t evacuated from hospital into care homes, fewer people might have died”, but we have no frame of reference for saying “in a world where nobody knew that coronavirus was happening, fewer old people would have died.”

46085 ▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Moomin, 23, #286 of 1444 🔗

Were you / are you aware of the daily death toll in the UK before this new C19 death obsession?

Did you previously note & mourn the 1,700 – 1,800 daily deaths that occur each day, every day, across the UK, due to that thing us humans are inescapably partnered with – mortality?

Did you keep a tally of the thousands of flu deaths that the Beast from the East brought in its wake a few years back?

Or any other high-ish flu season…?

Most definitely not.

Always remember this – it keep the bollocks in perspective.

46108 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Little Red Hen, 12, #287 of 1444 🔗

Exactly. And did they mourn the elderly who are over-medicated and then contract sepsis in hospital?

Probably not …

46121 ▶▶▶ smileymiley, replying to Little Red Hen, 15, #288 of 1444 🔗

I’ve said this all along. We never have had a daily count of influenza deaths!
It’s a totally politically motivated crisis.

46145 ▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to smileymiley, 6, #289 of 1444 🔗

We don’t count / note ANY deaths.

We read of tragedies / murders / disasters with shock & awe, but we don’t walk around with our faces drawn and heads bowed for the multitudes that slough off their mortal coils each & every day. That would be truly morbid.

And we don’t note the daily birth rate either. That would be exhausting as we scrutinised the landscape and wondered where we were going to squeeze all those new humans in….
and then we remember the deaths and relax…

46123 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Little Red Hen, 12, #290 of 1444 🔗

Funny enough, of flu stats – no. But, because it’s an area of interest of mine, I do have a lot of population and health related stats (including historic pandemics) committed to memory. (What can I say, I’m morbid… I live in the middle of a cemetery).

So when the Tesco Value Plague came along, I was quite stoic in the face of increasingly hysterical friends telling them, “these numbers are shit, stop teasing me like this is a real plague.” And every few days, I’d get messages, “oh my god! X dead today in Italy!” (Or whatever). I would look at the numbers again and say, “tell me when it’s 100x that, then I’m interested.” This cycle repeated for weeks.

This virus has yet to impress me.

46146 ▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to TyLean, 5, #291 of 1444 🔗

There’s always one…! 😁
I bet you were a Goth.

This virus has yet to impress me too – but it has impressed UPON me, thanks to this inept / mendacious Govt. (take your pick) for which I am truly irate.

46094 ▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to Moomin, 16, #292 of 1444 🔗

Absolutely. The flu a couple of years ago was very bad and this can hardly be worse. Bearing in mind especially that the official figures for this thing are not that high and are in any case inflated (as we know).

Excess deaths are misleading, surely, because they include deaths caused by the lockdown?

How to say this nicely to people? I think the fear has been embedded in them and so it’s hard to shift. If they were Brexiteers you might try asking why they were immune to Project Fear but not to Project Fear II? But I don’t think they’re thinking with the thinking part of their brains. They’re thinking with some more primitive part.

So how did those of us who were afraid become less afraid? In my case several things.
One, I saw that that the government was lying about the official death total and so I stopped reading anything they said.
Two, the case of the Chinese woman who was infectious while asymptomatic was the sole reason for thinking that that was a thing. Then I read that a scientific study had shown that her case wasn’t like that at all. So asymptomatic infection is not a thing after all.
Three, I looked at the worldometer site and saw that the shape of the graphs for deaths is the same in the UK, Sweden and elsewhere. So the lockdown made no difference.

But if people trust the MSM they’re not going to listen, in my opinion. I hope I’m wrong about that.

46753 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mike Smith, 2, #293 of 1444 🔗

I think of them as being addicted to the MSM, rather than trusting it, Mike.

46127 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Moomin, 5, #294 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think anyone would have cared. However I think this “crisis” has exposed something deeper and as I’ve said before I think it’s related to the stain of the last recession. We haven’t properly gotten over that. A lot of people either went fully back into debt (delusion) or spent the last 10 years being semi-careful about their money, choosing carefully what risks to take.

Maybe you stayed in that job that you didn’t like that while longer. Maybe you didn’t sell your house or kept your car a bit more. Brexit maybe helped bring a bit more reality into the picture.

But the sense I get is that we were all waiting for a disaster to happen. And maybe the reason that the government acted like they did is because without it, finally, we’d all see how absolutely useless they have been for all this time.

46147 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to mhcp, 5, #295 of 1444 🔗

Yes, I’ve been thinking for ages that we were going to have this national nervous breakdown sooner or later anyway, and that covid has merely been a vehicle for it, not the root cause.

I’ll get around to posting on it some day. I think that the last recession has probably had some destabilising effect, as maybe did the Brexit debate, but that the main problems run much deeper in our society.

46148 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Moomin, 3, #296 of 1444 🔗

Perfectly fair Kevin. One thing that reinforces it for me is that despite the 560k official deaths worldwide there is no outrage that that many have died.

The lack of anger is palpable. If people truly cared there would be much more feeling and conviction in what they say. But it’s just not there. People may attempt an “ooh it’s terrible” or “so sad” much the same way they would if they heard a neighbour died but that’s about as intense as it gets. There are the odd few who may be directly affected or paid stooges feigning anger but on the whole the response is pretty muted.

So even with the heightened awareness it seems that people are as indifferent to the numbers as me.

46041 Bella Donna, 19, #297 of 1444 🔗

It says something when Romania appears more democratic than the UK.

Coronavirus patients in Romanian hospitals discharge themselves
Hundreds of Romanian coronavirus patients have discharged themselves from hospital after a court ruled against mandatory hospitalisation.

Parliament moved on Thursday to pass a new law to enforce isolation amid a surge in infections.

The law allows those quarantined to challenge the decision in court.

Parliament’s move follows a court ruling that came into force last week.

The court decided that hospitalising and quarantining people without or with just mild Covid-19 symptoms violated fundamental rights and so could not be imposed by a government decree alone.

46046 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #298 of 1444 🔗

Oh dear.

Add this to the “Guidance for potentially infected persons”. It’s not good.

46058 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Sam Vimes, 8, #299 of 1444 🔗

As more testing is going on the more ‘cases’ are being found, it’s only natural, however the test cannot distinguish between those currently infected and those who have had it. I wouldn’t have one even if it was free.

46060 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Bella Donna, 9, #300 of 1444 🔗

Me neither. But the sheep will. They’ll line up for it. This is fake local lockdown in the making.

46069 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #301 of 1444 🔗

This will continue until a vaccine is discovered.

46077 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Sam Vimes, 10, #302 of 1444 🔗

The plebs are desperate for a test and a positive result just so they can post it on FB and twatter, they’re too stupid see the bigger picture and resulting fall out of being locked indoors.

46084 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to stefarm, 6, #303 of 1444 🔗

“Many people never even realise they’re ill at all, meaning they go on with their normal lives while infected with the deadly virus.”

Yes, we are!!

46101 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to Sam Vimes, 8, #304 of 1444 🔗

Life is the deadliest virus of all. It has a 100% fatality rate.

46131 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Sam Vimes, 9, #305 of 1444 🔗

If they don’t realise they’re ill, it probably means they’re NOT ill, doesn’t it? And how can you not realise you’re infected with a “deadly” virus? Shouldn’t you be dying or dead? Bit of a clue there.

46142 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to A. Contrarian, 7, #306 of 1444 🔗

That’s it. I’m reporting you to the common sense police. We can’t have that kind of talk…

46106 ▶▶▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to stefarm, 2, #307 of 1444 🔗

As I said somewhere the other day, some people seem to think this is all about being an extra in someone’s else’s film.

46111 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Hoppity, 1, #308 of 1444 🔗

A farce or horror film???

46066 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #309 of 1444 🔗

Hmmm, are we ‘potentially infected’ with measles if we had it as kids ?

46073 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to JohnB, 3, #310 of 1444 🔗

LOL yes I know its ridiculous but many people are gullible.

46078 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to JohnB, 3, #311 of 1444 🔗

We are in the ‘Transmission control period’. The virus is “everywhere”. So, we are all potentially infectious and therefore could be detained.

46054 Tyneside Tigress, 5, #312 of 1444 🔗

Interesting, and pithy article:


Doug Casey is a well-known Libertarian commentator and investor

46068 Melangell, replying to Melangell, 9, #313 of 1444 🔗

Just watched this interesting video from the USA that shows vividly the dangers of masks in terms of the toxic carbon dioxide build-up for the wearer. https://youtu.be/bQo79HRUksk

46674 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Melangell, #314 of 1444 🔗

It’s a very good one! The kid is great.

46080 Sim18, replying to Sim18, 7, #315 of 1444 🔗

Toby, the Heather MacDonald “I cited their paper so they retracted it” is more fun than you suggest.

The report authors told RetractionWatch.com (pretty much does what it says on the tin):
“We were careless when describing the inferences that could be made from our data. This led to the misuse of our article to support the position that the probability of being shot by police did not differ between Black and White Americans ( MacDonald, 2019 ). To be clear, our work does not speak to this issue and should not be used to support such statements. We accordingly issued a correction to rectify this statement (Johnson & Cesario, 2020).”

The first paragraph of their peer reviewed paper states:
“There is widespread concern about racial disparities in fatal officer-involved shootings and that these disparities reflect discrimination by White officers. Existing databases of fatal shootings lack information about officers, and past analytic approaches have made it difficult to assess the contributions of factors like crime. We create a comprehensive database of officers involved in fatal shootings during 2015 and predict victim race from civilian, officer, and county characteristics. We find no evidence of anti-Black or anti-Hispanic disparities across shootings, and White officers are not more likely to shoot minority civilians than non-White officers. Instead, race-specific crime strongly predicts civilian race. This suggests that increasing diversity among officers by itself is unlikely to reduce racial disparity in police shootings.”

46117 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Sim18, 10, #316 of 1444 🔗

We’re starting to see the death of science, going back to pre-Copernicus times. It will be interesting to see where it ends, though I won’t be around to see it.

These loonies seem to have forgotten that observing things as they actually are, and not how we’d like them to be or how we thought they were, is what got us what we have today – stuff, and comfort.

I’d like them to be given their own countries, and we can each see how the other gets on. Let’s start by saying that if you’re an advocate of political correctness, you must choose your brain surgeon and airline pilot on the basis of their professed beliefs, and if you are not an advocate of PC then you are allowed to choose based on how good they.

46088 JBW, replying to JBW, 5, #317 of 1444 🔗

Can Toby or anyone else direct me to a rational website which is focussed on the ongoing Covid situation in the USA? It is proving to be very difficult to find reliable regular data which properly separates the hysteria surrounding ‘cases’, and the hard facts of deaths and hospital intakes.

46100 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to JBW, 2, #318 of 1444 🔗
46126 ▶▶▶ JBW, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #319 of 1444 🔗

Thanks Sam, and while he has written some good stuff about Covid hysteria, I am very worried about his anti-vaxxing standpoint. I hate to refer friends to sources which could then link into areas which, at best, are highly contentious and ruin the argument I’m making.

46130 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to JBW, 9, #320 of 1444 🔗

I propose that you take 1 hour of your life and truly listen to the anti-vaxxers. Just one hour to hear what they have to say from their own mouths. You don’t have to agree with them, but I would be surprised if you didn’t at least respect their position after that one hour. One has to ask themselves the very difficult question… why are we so scared to even hear what they have to say?

46153 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to TyLean, 6, #321 of 1444 🔗

At the risk of attracting the wrath of the vax sceptics, and as one of the older generation who all had wild virus measles, mumps, whooping cough, chicken pox, scarlet fever before we went to secondary school, I’d recommend vaccination of children against them. If nothing else, less heart stoppingly worrying and disruptive for parents, means they aren’t off work for weeks looking after you! And against polio, for which there was no vaccine in my childhood and was rightly feared – even though it’s no longer endemic anywhere except Afghanistan, Pakistan, bits of Africa etc.
Flu vaccination, not so much. And the history of vaccination in the US is a different story. Another country, as foreign as India.

46155 ▶▶▶▶▶ JBW, replying to TyLean, 1, #322 of 1444 🔗

I appreciate your comment, and your right to make it, but you seem to be heading very close to the ‘educate yourself’ diktat that seems to be so prevalent these days, without actually knowing anything about the person to whom you are directing this order. My children were due for their vaccinations exactly at the time of Wakefield’s proven fraudulent claims – so you can rest assured I and my wife spent many many hours reading, investigating and discussing with qualified people, the relative merits of his position. I have absolutely no fear of discussing vaccination issues with anyone, but I don’t think this site is the right forum for that.

46223 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JBW, 3, #323 of 1444 🔗

Wakefield’s claims have of course been validated by the CDC whistleblower Thompson, JBW. You’ll know that if you’ve been keeping yourself educated. 🙂

46266 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to JBW, 4, #324 of 1444 🔗

I have absolutely no fear of discussing vaccination issues with anyone, but I don’t think this site is the right forum for that.

All the Covid lockdowns are underpinned by the vaccination agenda and therefore it is the ‘right forum’ to discuss it. In addition most of us frequenting this amazing website also support freedom of speech. If certain topics become off limits it is not freedom of speech.

46486 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Victoria, 4, #325 of 1444 🔗

IMO there’s a world of difference between vaccinating against genuinely nasty diseases, such as when I was young – polio. diptheria and smallpox – and vaccinating against everything under the sun incuding relatively trivial diseases and of course covid where the costs of side effects may well outweigh the protection from the disease

46686 ▶▶▶▶▶ Michel, replying to TyLean, 3, #326 of 1444 🔗

Thank you TyLean, I seem to remember having read in an earlier post that you’re far from antivaxxing yourself so as a “vaccin sceptic” I appreciate this. I think it should be a constitutional right of everyone to decide for him or herself (and respectively their children) to take a vaccin or not. It should never be imposed.

46119 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to JBW, 2, #327 of 1444 🔗

If you’re on Twitter this is a good US focused account to follow:


This is also good but not so US centric:


You can then find others to follow from there.

46152 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to JBW, 2, #328 of 1444 🔗

This channel is sensible, she gives the data sources so you can look up figures, no hysteria – https://www.youtube.com/user/drpamsnewschannel/videos

46159 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Darryl, 1, #329 of 1444 🔗

But you have to remember, she’s American. Where every health issue is tied up with money. So she’s against the sort of unnecessary over medication they go in for. Plus she seems to be flogging some sort of healthy eating course.

46157 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to JBW, #330 of 1444 🔗

Horowitz: The CDC Confirms Remarkably Low Coronavirus Death Rate. Where is the Media?


Instagram Threatens to Delete Greenmedinfo’s Account for Posting THESE Covid-19 Related Posts

46089 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #331 of 1444 🔗

Oh, it gets better.

Which ethnic group have been told they are more susceptible to the virus?
So, wouldn’t they be more likely to agree to a test?
Where can we find lots of these people?
I know, lets do ‘random’ testingin Bradford, Oldham, Brent and Newham!


46092 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #332 of 1444 🔗

If they are only told to optimise their vitamin D levels instead of the recent PHE report that concluded that more BAME people died from Covid due to inherent racism. WHAT??

46128 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Sam Vimes, 8, #333 of 1444 🔗

Why would people STILL go for a test after what happened to Leicester?

46168 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to A. Contrarian, 5, #334 of 1444 🔗

People won’t get a choice soon: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-potentially-infectious-people
They can just say they ‘think’ you’re infected and detain you till you agree to be tested – even children..

46272 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Carrie, 4, #335 of 1444 🔗

Since we’re all supposed to have it asymptomatically, all the time, I guess that means they can detain any one of us at any time, forever more…

46093 Cecil B, 7, #336 of 1444 🔗

The house arrest bill currently stands at 300bn.

It would take a 50p in the pound rise in income tax to raise that sum in 12months; raising basic income tax to 70p in the pound

The bills have only just started coming in, likely to be double or treble that figure in my estimation.

Get your money out of British banks, and out of the country

46104 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 15, #337 of 1444 🔗

We just received a load of drivel from our Business ‘Improvement’ District. I’m so relieved that the government’s trashing of the economy has given these idiots the chance to “get to know each other better” during this “tricky situation” The full-length missive waffles on about how our local MP would be happy to hear from businesses and about their experiences. Actually, BID chairwoman, I don’t think she would want to hear from this one:

In a funny way, it has given everyone in the BID team and BID members a chance to get to know each other better. I am amazed every day by the innovative and clever ways in which each of you have adapted. You have all taken the challenge and modified your wonderful businesses to deal with this tricky situation. It has also been refreshing to see the support for our local businesses from people who live here.  Royston Vasey is a beautiful town with so much to offer and hopefully the momentum built up from our local support will continue.

There won’t be much “momentum” if they persist with closing off roads and making it as difficult as possible, not only to get into the town but to do any actual shopping once you get here.

46107 ▶▶ IanE, replying to kh1485, 7, #338 of 1444 🔗

Pass the sick-bag please.

46112 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to IanE, 14, #339 of 1444 🔗

I know. Sadly, the woman who writes this drivel runs her office upstairs from my shop. I have to endure her inanity on a daily basis. It takes every bit of self-restraint I have (stocks now dwindling), not to give it to her with both barrels.

46143 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 4, #340 of 1444 🔗

Banana skin …stairs … loosen carpet …

46151 ▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to kh1485, 1, #341 of 1444 🔗

Super glue works wonders in the cause of obstructing access by BID person.

46190 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to kh1485, 3, #342 of 1444 🔗

Do it! It’s about time!

46115 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to kh1485, 15, #343 of 1444 🔗

I would just point out that “in a funny way” this is throwing thousands of people out of work, destroying businesses, killing people who may otherwise have survived if they’d managed to get cancer treatment on time, “Tricky situation”? Sheesh.

46132 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to CarrieAH, 5, #344 of 1444 🔗

Thanks CarrieAH, I may point this out to her the next time she wafts past with her rainbow bag and breezy “Hi guys, how’s it going?”

46135 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to CarrieAH, 7, #345 of 1444 🔗

Quite – it’s the “we’re all in this together” that really sticks in my gullet.

46137 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to IanE, 7, #346 of 1444 🔗

Let’s put it this way, her business isn’t really affected by this …

46161 ▶▶ Paul, replying to kh1485, 8, #347 of 1444 🔗

She really is in a different dimension to us,she is absolutely loving it,I bet she prays at bedtime ‘please god,don’t let the virus and lockdowns stop’ !
It’s exactly the same inane drivel our district council is putting out all the time,saying how hard they are working to keep us ‘safe’ and how much they are doing to support business,you would think that from their ivory tower in the middle of town they might have noticed that our town centre is on it’s last legs now.

46179 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Paul, 6, #348 of 1444 🔗

I know, I mean where would all us trashed businesses be without these hard-working council people?

She even, the other night, posted a video to tell us idiots (the ones who have got off our arses and managed – god knows how – without any *help* to run businesses for nearly 17 years) about the Chancellor’s announcement!

46340 ▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to kh1485, 1, #349 of 1444 🔗

Royston Vasey is the fictional town in The League of Gentlemen.

Are you sure she’s not mocking the lockdown?

46447 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Mike Smith, 3, #350 of 1444 🔗

Sorry, the ‘Royston Vasey’ bit was my addition. Should have put it in brackets. My cack-handed way of taking the mick!

Re. your second point, no she’s really into the lockdown and the chance to go round sorting everyone/thing out …

46692 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to kh1485, 4, #351 of 1444 🔗

Today, I wrote (again) to my councillor. I finished my letter thus:

It occurred to me that, as town centre shops close in increasing numbers, not least because they can’t afford to pay you rent, the council might be better occupied by drawing up plans to turn the empty retail premises into accommodation for the homeless. Because if the government doesn’t stop playing its ridiculous antisocial distancing games and if councils don’t stop aiding and abetting them, but instead let people get on with creating and contributing to a thriving economy, there’s going to be unprecedented number of homeless – including families – looking for food and shelter this winter.

46960 ▶▶▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to kh1485, #352 of 1444 🔗

No, my entire case rested on the Royston Vasey reference!

46114 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 7, #353 of 1444 🔗

Farrakhan Accuses Fauci And Bill Gates Of Plotting To ‘Depopulate The Earth’ With Coronavirus Vaccine
“Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan trended on Twitter on Saturday after he accused Dr. Anthony Fauci and Bill Gates of trying to “depopulate the Earth” through the development of vaccines aimed at ending the coronavirus pandemic.

Speaking at Nation of Islam headquarters in Chicago, Farrakhan urged African leaders and his followers to avoid accepting vaccines and medications developed by Western scientists.

Farrakhan proposed convening a team of virologists and epidemiologists to inspect whatever vaccines are developed to deal with the coronavirus.”


46124 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Victoria, 4, #354 of 1444 🔗

There is a vast Muslim skepticism forgotten in our discourse. Great post – reminds me of all those other world views this game is an affront to.

46136 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Victoria, 4, #355 of 1444 🔗

It is such a sad judgement on the way our world is going that such scepticism of new vaccines is essential now.

46125 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 5, #357 of 1444 🔗

The London Marxist Theatre Company reacts to the Govt. rescue package:


46129 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Sarigan, 8, #358 of 1444 🔗

Priceless. I really hope Andrew Lawrence gets loads of gigs if and when this crap ever ends.

Watched an interview with him the other day where he talked of how he and his fellow non-pc comedians, struggle to get work. Seems like a really nice bloke …

46165 ▶▶▶ James007, replying to kh1485, 3, #359 of 1444 🔗

Yes me too.
I think the dream for a lot of comedians is to get on TV, especially the BBC. Name recognition goes up and so do earnings from gigs. So they don’t want to annoy commissioning editors, or get caught saying anything that may be out of bounds. Perhaps a lot more comedians would be more daring and original if this wasn’t the case. It’s not about right or left, but about genuine diversity.
I think some of this frustration is evident in the Johnny Smugface character!

46189 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to James007, 3, #360 of 1444 🔗

I miss Peter Piss-Pot of Twat Valley Police. Perhaps he’s on leave!

46231 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 2, #361 of 1444 🔗

Shielding …

46233 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to JohnB, 2, #362 of 1444 🔗

Thanks JohnB, you’ve given me my two laugh out loud moments today, and boy, do I need those right now 🙂

46353 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 1, #363 of 1444 🔗

My pleasure Kim. You likewise give support, encouragement, and hope to lots of us on here.

46316 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to James007, 4, #364 of 1444 🔗

no it is about right or left , more where BBC seem to place people on their political spectrum. I got so fed up of BBC comedy shows on both tv and radio that i gave up on most of them. the final straw was when Nish Kumar, who must be the most unfunny comedian out there took over the news quiz. at that point it gave up being funny and having jokes and just became a place for snidy liberal comments and for Jo Brand (the cauliflower without a sense of humour).. The numbers of comedians that are not following the party line can be counted on one hand.

47126 ▶▶▶▶ peter, replying to James007, #365 of 1444 🔗

This explains Frankie boyle’s transformatoin into such a hideous c*nt.

46226 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to kh1485, 5, #366 of 1444 🔗

Maybe we can crowdfund a private gig for us all here?

46138 Margaret, 19, #367 of 1444 🔗

Following on from yesterday’s sortie to the hairdresser’s, OH and I went out for a meal to a pub/restaurant which we were frequenting every week before lockdown. Apart from arrows on the floor, a few less tables in the restaurant and the fact that none of the tables were set, everything seemed perfectly normal- no masks, no being asked for details (although the owners know us anyway). It was really great to see familiar faces there again and have a catch up. One or two had gone AWOL, still petrified by the propaganda. I pointed out to their friends who were present that they had been in their usual place at the bar every night before lockdown when “infections” must have been sky high. Why choose to be frightened now?
Had a chat with our lovely window cleaner too this morning. He tells me that he, his family and a lot of his customers are sceptics too so I pointed him in the direction of this site. He reported several instances of customers whose family members had died and were registered as Covid deaths when it was clear that they had died from something else.

46149 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 31, #368 of 1444 🔗

Success! My initial ‘unplugged’ visit to my local shop: proprietor-wife of the couple who own it-‘you’ll need a mask Wendy’; to which I replied ‘I’m exempt’. ‘You’ll need to keep explaining yourself then’.’ No, my badge is on the way, but I shall if need arises’.

I’m thinking of adding ‘fully house trained ‘ to the badge.

Weekly order fulfilled; pleasant conversation; next week’s order taken; smiles all round.They obviously value customer loyalty over pettifogging rules.

Woman waiting outside fully masked with sun glasses as well; impossible to read her expression, although she smiled-I think!- when I apologised for keeping her waiting.

It truly is disconcerting to be unable to read another person’s expression.

Plenty of deliveries being made to local shops; masks about 50/50.

I actually enjoyed doing the defiant bit, having been somewhat apprehensive to start with.

Hopefully this polite resistance will spread.

46160 ▶▶ TJN, replying to wendyk, 3, #369 of 1444 🔗

Good to hear your story. It doesn’t appear that much attempt will be made to enforce this crime.

46162 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to TJN, 9, #370 of 1444 🔗

I do hope not, TJN, and I meant to add: while the owner of the shop was serving me, having done the mask questions and answers bit, I noticed that her own mask was pulled down around her chin, and that she adjusted it several times.

This just shows what an absolute nonsense all this is: mask devotees seem to touch their faces far more than we, the bare faced rebels, do.

46175 ▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to wendyk, 11, #371 of 1444 🔗

The Bare Faced Rebels!
You’ve just formed & named a new club….!
And I’m a fully participatory member.

46181 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Little Red Hen, 2, #372 of 1444 🔗


46188 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Little Red Hen, 4, #373 of 1444 🔗

Me too! Anybidy like to make some badges? I’m a customer.

46283 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Little Red Hen, 3, #374 of 1444 🔗

Rebel Without a Mask.

46374 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, 7, #375 of 1444 🔗

Aargh, predictive text, Rebel Without a Gauze!

46166 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to TJN, 5, #376 of 1444 🔗

if shops want business they won’t enforce it..

46174 ▶▶ Guirme, replying to wendyk, 14, #377 of 1444 🔗

I have just been out for a walk along our High Street. It was unusually quiet despite the weather being fine. I would like to think that this is because of the mask wearing edict but it is probably too soon to be sure. I went into only one shop, the newsagents, and bought a paper; no adverse comments that I wasn’t wearing a mask.

Interestingly over the last few days in shops and elsewhere the most common comment is “why now?”, so I intend to keep reinforcing the innate scepticism of much of the population by asking that question ad nauseam.

46201 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Guirme, 7, #378 of 1444 🔗

The times they are a changin’; we must keep on with the defiance.

46281 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to wendyk, 8, #379 of 1444 🔗

I’ve already posted my experience today, I strolled in and happily done my shopping mask free, some people done an actual double take but I think more in realisation that somebody has the guts to do what they are too frightened to do. Usual bedwetters walking around scared shitless.

No staff or security guards stopped me or questioned me.

Slightly concerning to see nearly all shop staff barring till operators masked, see how that lasts as a warmish weekend is forecast in Edinburgh.

💪 💪 💪

46156 Surreal, replying to Surreal, 4, #380 of 1444 🔗

I desperately need a driving license, so that I can realise some of my projects, which coincidentally would also help restart the economy. I started driving lessons just before the lockdown. Then there was obviously a long break. I was delighted to find out that – finally – the lessons are allowed to restart from 4 July. But my driving instructor says that he won’t restart the lessons until… at least until mid-September, because it’s too unsafe – even with masks, sanitiser, etc.
I am frustrated because I can’t get on with my life. I also find it appauling that even if the instructor has a client asking him to provide the service, he wouldn’t do it. I suppose the reason he can afford to do this is the government scheme that pays self-employed 80 percent of their income if their business is affected by coronavirus. But his business is not affected by coronavirus anymore – he has a client begging him to resume his business! Why should he still get government money for just refusing to go back to business?! I suppose the reason is that he prefers to get 80 percent of his income for doing absolutely nothing to doing work and earning money for it.
So I am now paying not for my driving lessons, but for his holiday – out of my taxes. Is it even legal for businesses to do this? Surely, the definition of ‘business affected by covid’ shouldn’t include entrepreneurs just refusing to work.

46700 ▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Surreal, #381 of 1444 🔗

My partner is a driving instructor and she started back this week and found all clients very chilled and even had 2 new ones. Your instructor is a pathetic sponging bedwetter so get rid of them and tell them why. They need to hear that clients have no time for leeching spongers who are too scared to get out of bed in the morning. He/she sounds like a candidate for James Delingpole’s ‘bedwetter of the week’.

46745 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Surreal, #382 of 1444 🔗

Can a friend, neighbour, or family member not provide instruction ?

46158 smileymiley, 4, #383 of 1444 🔗

Good piece on how we live with Corona viruses & that this one has been with us for a long, long time.

46178 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 2, #384 of 1444 🔗


An important aspect of the absurd frenzy to mandate the wearing of masks, flying in the face of science, law and common sense as it so obviously does, is that this is a ritual. We have witnessed the emergence of a cult of obedience to the state, and as is the case with all cults there are repetitive mantras (“We’re all in this together” etc.), ceremonies (hand washing) and costume/uniform (masks) by which the individual’s identity is broken down and reassembled. For those that have been converted, their extreme hostility to outsiders is a perfectly understandable (albeit repulsive) consequence.

In the context of the above viewpoint, and that further impositions to harvest our obedience are coming down the pike (testing, contact tracing and vaccination), it is becoming increasingly clear that we are in a war for our future. As is the case with all wars, sacrifices will need to be made and casualties will be sustained. All the contributors to this wonderful forum should take a moment to consider how they can prepare themselves for this eventuality. This is not going to stop.

46744 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, #385 of 1444 🔗

Agreed Richard. It is very serious.

Ironically, humour, ridicule, and scorn are some of our most effective weapons at present.

46187 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to smileymiley, 4, #388 of 1444 🔗

Why isn’t Keir Starmer challenging some of these legalities? It is an open goal for him instead of pissing about kneeling down and virtue signalling by having the correct PPE on in various settings !

46236 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to Tom Blackburn, 12, #389 of 1444 🔗

Unfortunately, he’s a paid up lockdown zealot and is blinded by that. I actually wrote something to this effect to him months ago as part of a letter:

“Whilst I appreciate that you might not agree with my position, namely that a ‘total’ lockdown is counterproductive, believing that some measures need to be implemented to protect the vulnerable, for example, these are still genuine questions from a concerned citizen that I feel ought to be raised.

I’m not writing this to ‘score points’ over one party, I am not a member of any political party so I have no ‘ulterior motive’, I’m simply writing because it seems that we are sleepwalking into a socioeconomic disaster and only a minority of people is speaking up about it. There seems to have been unthinking, blanket acceptance that the lockdown is the ‘right thing to do’, yet the objective evidence seems to say otherwise.

Many people say that Covid19 is the biggest threat that this country has faced for decades, yet according to the science that doesn’t appear to be the case, it would appear that there have been similar outbreaks in the recent past that have not received such attention. The biggest threat that this country has faced for decades is the government’s panic and irrational response that threatens the life and livelihoods of thousands of people.

The government’s policy appears to be short-sighted at best and we could be witnessing the unfolding of one of this country’s greatest ever (avoidable) tragedies.

As the leader of the Opposition can I respectfully ask you to consider the whole picture when contemplating your questions and to swim against the tide of public opinion and to look at this situation objectively and based on the evidence against the efficacy of a lockdown that is freely available in the public domain.

On 7 th May 2020 I see that you have been quoted as saying that, ‘The health and safety of the nation needs to come first’. I agree and I simply want what is best for the health of this nation in the short, medium and long term since with every passing day of lockdown this health is being jeopardised.”

And then this in a follow up:

“I am surprised, saddened and disheartened that Sir Starmer, as a qualified lawyer, has failed to objectively look at the evidence that is available to him that shows that a lockdown is ineffective and has failed to see and have the courage to take the opportunity to do the right thing and to stand up for the truth.

When the history books are written over this whole fiasco no doubt some will comment on the massive lost opportunity that this has been for the Labour party, supposedly the party of the people, to totally undermine this shambolic government.

These are dark days for British politics, with a government that has no idea what it’s doing and an opposition that poses no opposition whatsoever.”

It’s very sad that there is effectively no opposition.

46242 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Moomin, 4, #390 of 1444 🔗

Like it, Kevin.

Whatever side of the fence you are on, he’s been a massive let down for sceptics. I’m starting to feel a bit disheartened; like Peter Hitchens, I fancy watching the whole shit show from a slightly more detached viewpoint.

46252 ▶▶▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #391 of 1444 🔗

Hi Tom, I’m very disheartened too. Has Hitchens said he’ll be more detached? Following what he’s said has been one of the things that has kept me sane.

46277 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Moomin, 2, #392 of 1444 🔗

I think he said something along the lines of ‘enjoying champagne’ while in between crisis and calamity.

Back on topic, is there a single MP we can get behind? Lord even?

46332 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #393 of 1444 🔗

I’ve not paid much attention to the Lords but am not aware of any MP who has said anything of significance – any criticism is just at the edges.

46321 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Moomin, 2, #394 of 1444 🔗

Really well done Kevin.

47253 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Tom Blackburn, #395 of 1444 🔗

He’s pushing Boris to make masks compulsory. Opposition, what opposition?

46192 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to smileymiley, 5, #396 of 1444 🔗

So all the hospital staff being forced to wear masks all day can actually refuse because it is not law..

46207 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Carrie, 1, #397 of 1444 🔗

However, I seem to recall reading that it is now a condition of working.

46238 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to smileymiley, 1, #398 of 1444 🔗

My, my – does he provide evidence of what he’s found? The source, for example?

46459 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Moomin, #399 of 1444 🔗

See Peter Hitchens’ Twitter for source!

46185 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 15, #400 of 1444 🔗

Holidays will be such fun:

Gloria Guevara, WTTC president and chief executive, said: “The safety and hygiene of travellers and those who work in travel and tourism is of paramount importance, which is why we now strongly recommend masks being mandatory.

“Wear to care promotes the protection of face mask users and visibly shows they care about the welfare and safety of their fellow travellers, which will help save lives (1) and encourage the return of safe travels.

“The wearing of masks should not be politicised (2) . Wearing a mask needs to become part of everyday life to ensure everyone enjoys travelling in safety until a vaccine for Covid-19 is found. We implore the private sector and global governments to encourage their use so wearing a mask becomes the new normal.” (3)

They are using #weartocare!! Eurgh!!

Why is there this unfailing belief that a vaccine will work and we need to wait for it? Really depressing day today.

1) No they won’t
2) Yes it should, it is a breach of our liberties
3) It will never be normal for me

46200 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Sarigan, 15, #401 of 1444 🔗

#daretobare; it’s much healthier!

From The Bare Faced Rebels

46205 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to wendyk, 5, #402 of 1444 🔗

#NaughtyNaturists !

46224 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to wendyk, 5, #403 of 1444 🔗

Love it! Can I also suggest:


46235 ▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Sarigan, 5, #404 of 1444 🔗

Be healthy, not stealthy
Set the pace, show your face
Being obedient means being expedient
Show your defiance, not your compliance

46457 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Sarigan, 2, #405 of 1444 🔗

I like facefarce!

46214 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Sarigan, 7, #406 of 1444 🔗

Guevara is a very unfortunate name for such a person.

46546 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Farinances, #407 of 1444 🔗

Are we sure there’s no relation?

46248 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Sarigan, 13, #408 of 1444 🔗

The wearing of masks should not be politicised (2) .

Where do they learn this stuff? Translated, this means “I have decided this is what you must do, and you are not allowed to disagree with me, or question my decision, because I know best”.


46301 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Julian, 4, #409 of 1444 🔗

Despite the fact that the wearing of masks in itself is inherently symbolic AKA – political

46324 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Farinances, 1, #410 of 1444 🔗


In her world, an edict from her is apolitical, because she made it. Any opposition to that edict is political (by which she means that it’s not based on logic, but dogma).

I get the impression that the world people like her inhabit is full of people who spend all their time agreeing with eachother, and if they ever met someone with a keen intellect who didn’t agree with them they would get trounced in an argument, or just become abusive.

46545 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Farinances, 2, #411 of 1444 🔗

I have to be very careful in what I say nowadays, when talking to colleagues in the states. The mask has been politicised – America is currently divided between anti-trump (we must all keep everyone safe, love lockdown, people who don’t wear a mask are beneath contempt) and pro-trump (Merca, hell yeah! no lockdown, no mask ever).

None of this bears any kind of relationship to usefulness or otherwise of masks.

It’s added another layer for me to subtly avoiding giving any opinion about anything, to make sure I can keep my job. BLM is also on the list.

46724 ▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to matt, #412 of 1444 🔗

Thats the reality of being a wage slave matt. I am a self employed entrepreneur so no one can cancel me so they can all go and f____ themselves. I advise all youngsters not to go to uni and not to get a job. Learn a marketable skill on a vocational course and then set up on your own. Otherwise your views will be permanently muzzled.

47236 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Julian, #413 of 1444 🔗

In that case they’d better not make in mandatory, the act of making anything mandatory is guaranteed to politicise it.

46249 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to Sarigan, 11, #414 of 1444 🔗

Pretty much a word for word retelling of the press release sent out by Royal Society on Tuesday where that chap was imploring we wear them all the time and they become ‘new normal’ and must be so ‘until there is a vaccine’ – almost like these people are in it together… I smell that same rat I smelt on Tuesday.

46338 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Sarigan, 3, #415 of 1444 🔗

Gloria Guevara, WTTC president and chief executive, said: “The safety and hygiene of travellers and those who work in travel and tourism is of paramount importance, which is why we now strongly recommend masks being mandatory.

“Wear to care promotes the protection of face mask users and visibly shows they care about the welfare and safety of their fellow travellers, which will help save lives (1) and encourage the return of safe travels.

“The wearing of masks should not be politicised (2) . Wearing a mask needs to become part of everyday life to ensure everyone enjoys travelling in safety until a vaccine for Covid-19 is found. We implore the private sector and global governments to encourage their use so wearing a mask becomes the new normal.” (3)

Is it me or this is more like a suicide note for the travel industry??


It should be #notweartolive

46350 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #416 of 1444 🔗


46186 Winston Smith, replying to Winston Smith, 9, #417 of 1444 🔗

Afternoon, just, from sunny Oceania.

Suffering from a mild hangover today, my local (a small independent craft beer pub) opened last night. The owner did all of the state recommended things, screens, one-way entrance and exit etc. Handshakes, hugs and even kisses were all very much in evidence and minimal distancing and not a mask in site 🙂 It was almost normal!

This morning, my GP phoned me, a follow-up call as she is worried about me. An interesting conversation ensued. Most of the time, I would make a statement, she would trot out the party line, I would then reinforce my intial statement and then she would say she agreed with me.

Even more interesting is that she persistently directed me to a Covid Age Risk Calculator – https://alama.org.uk/covid-19-medical-risk-assessment/

That link is also found on the BMA’s website – https://www.bma.org.uk/advice-and-support/covid-19/your-health/covid-19-risk-assessment

I was suspicious, but I took a look.

I ended with a roughly 0.3% risk of dying if I contracted ‘the virus’……..

I’ve been thinking about this all morning. I knew this risk all along, why was she so emphatic about me looking at it? Does she want me to share it? It reinforces the truth that we’ve known along but contradicted by the state propoganda.

Any thoughts?

46198 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Winston Smith, 6, #418 of 1444 🔗

I think she’s been brain washed Winston and would like you to sign up to the mindlessness.

Remember how popular mindfulness was in certain quarters just a short time ago?

It’s been replaced by mindlessness.

46202 ▶▶ Jonathan Smith, replying to Winston Smith, 1, #419 of 1444 🔗

I think she’s not really paid a fat lot of attention to what it actually says.

46211 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Jonathan Smith, 1, #420 of 1444 🔗

No, I think she knows exactly what it says, I think there are a lot of clinicians are desperate to get the truth out there but are threatened, nulled, gagged etc. I know what the top-down leadership is like, been there. Tow the line, leave or get sacked.

She said that there moves to use this tool as a more nuanced solution as opposed to the sledgehammer approach.

46204 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Winston Smith, 2, #421 of 1444 🔗

Ministry of Truth, next for you!

46208 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Winston Smith, #422 of 1444 🔗

Don’t think most people are invited to do this, is it some sort of risk assessment because you work in health care?

46221 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Bruno, 3, #423 of 1444 🔗

No, it clearly states that it’s a tool for doctors assessing people for return to work. It’s not meant for public use.

Using and reading it, it clearly states my wife, who has been advised by the state to ‘shield’, should return to work.

The whole conversation and the tool, on reflection, was/is fascinating.

46222 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Winston Smith, 4, #424 of 1444 🔗

It would be great if someone could make a user friendly version where you input age, simple lifestyle answers etc and it kicks out a risk percentage. I think it would shut a lot of people up.

I recommend one for flying to clients who are nervous:


You put in route, airline and aircraft type and it then demonstrates how miniscule the chances of the plane crashing is. Maybe we have some programmers present?

46225 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Sarigan, 2, #425 of 1444 🔗

Brilliant idea.

46194 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 4, #426 of 1444 🔗

This is a very confusing article in the DT. If you look at the graphs while cases are increasing the death rates are all in significant decline. So have we moved on from preventing deaths to now preventing anyone getting sick? That won’t work if life is ever going to get back for normal. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/resurgence-covid-19-around-world-tells-us-risk-second-wave/

46227 ▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, 8, #427 of 1444 🔗

A lot depends on how a “case” is defined. If you’re talking about someone being ill enough to require hospital treatment, you would expect death numbers to start to rise again after a week or two. If by “case” people mean a positive test of someone who is either asymptomatic or has mild symptoms, then that is only really significant if it leads to an accelerated spread which then causes severe symptoms in some. If you do more and more testing, you may find more cases than you did before, but if after a few weeks you don’t have more people being hospitalised and dying then I’m not sure how useful the information is, and why you’d base the continued wrecking of human life and the economy on it. Unless you wanted for various reasons to prolong the “pandemic” indefinitely.

46262 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Julian, 2, #428 of 1444 🔗

Who would want to prolong the pandemic indefinitely? That is surely not UK Government policy?

46269 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, 7, #429 of 1444 🔗

They are showing strong signs of wanting to prolong the illusion of a pandemic indefinitely, because it gives them more or less unfettered power.

I think some of them want a way out, some don’t. I did think that on balance they wanted a way out, but after Leicester I changed my view.

46290 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Julian, 3, #430 of 1444 🔗

They want things just as they are, until mass unemployment and the economic crash hit, and their skulduggery is seen for what it was.

46454 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Julian, 2, #431 of 1444 🔗

They want to prolong it till they have a vaccine – Boris has been meeting Gates, as has Hancock..
Boris has also given shedloads of (our) money to GAVI..

47257 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Carrie, #432 of 1444 🔗

Yes they are still following the original plan. They haven’t taken note that reailty is quite different from Ferguson’s paranoid fantasy. We don’ need no steenking evidence

46206 James007, replying to James007, 8, #433 of 1444 🔗

Is there anyone with IT project experience that understands how the “Trace and Trace” app costs £10bn plus? It’s been on my mind all morning. The largest IT project I’ve worked on was £7m, and for that we had about a dozen contractors and had BAs, PM, PMO etc.. for me it seemed pretty big at the time. From what I gather, this is the total cost of contracts awarded to 11 different firms, plus NHSX. Perhaps the cost will be in fact lower, if elements of the project are descoped and the government will seek to exit some of these contracts?

I think the decentralised system design uses bluetooth, which in the open air may be ok, but it is hard to get accurate distance estimation from in different environments like trains and buses. Is this the favoured approach now? Also I understand they have realised that it only works on Android, and are now bringing in Apple.
If it finally works, it obviously won’t track the 20% of the population who do not have an Android or Apple OS phone. They will need all users who do have those phones to use it for it to be worthwhile. (I’ve seen 70% as the required overall usage rate).

46209 ▶▶ IanE, replying to James007, 8, #434 of 1444 🔗

I wonder how many new millionaires are benefiting from Handjob’s imbecility?!

46259 ▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to IanE, 2, #435 of 1444 🔗

More new billionaires rather than millionaires!!!!!

46212 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to James007, 17, #436 of 1444 🔗

I was in IT project management (now retired). The sum mentioned is astronomic – almost unbelievable. If it’s correct I can only put it down to a total lack of accountability and appalling management, coupled with no budgetary control whatsoever. In other words, just like every other IT project in the public sector, especially those in the NHS.

46219 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tenchy, 9, #437 of 1444 🔗

Can we do a FOI request for the breakdown of the costs? Would be interesting to see how much money went to Hancock’s mates..

46229 ▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Carrie, 2, #438 of 1444 🔗

How to make an FOI request You must make a Freedom of Information (FOI) request in writing. You can do it by:

  • letter
  • email
  • social media
  • online form – check the organisation’s website or the government department’s page to see if they have an online form
  • fax

If you cannot make your request in writing because of a disability, contact the public authority. They should help you to make the request another way – for example over the phone.

46230 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 2, #439 of 1444 🔗
46234 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, #440 of 1444 🔗

You can submit one here https://contactus.dhsc.gov.uk/

Does anyone have experience of submitting before or is perhaps better at wording one than I would be? AG perhaps?

46307 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bobblybob, replying to Sarigan, 1, #441 of 1444 🔗

Submit it via What Do They Know and it will be public:

46215 ▶▶ TJN, replying to James007, 4, #442 of 1444 🔗

£10 billion doesn’t sound plausible.

In 2018-19 UK defence was £38 billion, with £15.9 billion on equipment and support.

If they tried their best, they couldn’t spend that sort of money – two-thirds the defence equipment budget – on T&T in a few weeks.

That’s not to say they haven’t wasted a colossal sum of money on this though.

46228 ▶▶▶ James007, replying to TJN, #443 of 1444 🔗

I’ve not been able to find the original source for the figure, but it is across the tabloids. It must be an error.

46241 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to James007, 1, #444 of 1444 🔗

Thank you for reverting to this, it has been niggling me too, ever since you first brought it up. I think it must be wrong. For comparison, the total HMRC spend for ‘the UKs biggest IT contract’, over 13 years, is about £13Bn:
That is, unless GCHQ’s hidden budget is astronomical and the figure quoted is an estimated slice of it…

46256 ▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Bruno, 3, #445 of 1444 🔗

HMRC IT is shite as I know from experience of working for them…

46279 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to stefarm, 1, #446 of 1444 🔗

Although seems to have delivered the furlough payments OK? Their Chief got in promptly yesterday to rubbish Sunak’s handouts as a waste of money!

46251 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to James007, #447 of 1444 🔗

It may not be £10Bn, but it isn’t £10M either, according to the NY Times. They said just the ‘warm flesh’ end of the track and trace scheme contract alone was awarded to Serco for £108M:
On top of which will be the costs of all the IT to find the contacts, process the results, etc.

46273 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, #448 of 1444 🔗

Incidentally, for those with time on their hands, some of the BTL comments are priceless. Maybe where Mark bunked off to.

46571 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to TJN, #449 of 1444 🔗

I don’t buy it. Even given an expectation that we maintain high staffing levels forever, it’s just not plausible.

46218 ▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to James007, 2, #450 of 1444 🔗

You have to be a VERY, VERY dedicated public servant to spend that much money uselessly. DfID trained, at least.

46237 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to James007, 2, #451 of 1444 🔗

It seems to me like they contracted several different parties to do the project, paid them all to develop an app, then picked the ‘best’ one to roll out as the official version. 😂 😂

I’m laughing but that honestly wouldn’t surprise me!

46239 ▶▶ Ozzie, replying to James007, #452 of 1444 🔗

I was wondering this as well. It seems to be a huge amount – the project must also have a long timescale. I have noticed that spend on large scale government contracts increases over time, especially when management consultants get involved (used to work in this industry). £10bn? Lots of snouts in troughs?

46240 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to James007, 6, #453 of 1444 🔗

I’m a programmer and I can’t understand how most projects cost what they cost, but in this particular instance there must be an error in the number being reported, because a few weeks ago it was £12m, but has suddenly jumped to £10bn. It is not plausible that even a government as incompetent as ours could spend £10bn on an IT project in the space of 4 months, you could potentially get there with a project spanning a couple of years by opting to go with a behemoth provider, rather than an efficient provider.

Whilst happy to stick it to them for the endless catastrophe that the last few months have been, it’s important we only leap on things that are definitely correct, I suspect £12bn will be proven totally inaccurate – but if not ‘wow!’

46284 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark II, #454 of 1444 🔗

It’s usually the enormous programmer salaries … 🙂

46245 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to James007, 1, #455 of 1444 🔗

Where are you getting the figure of £10bn from? It cost £12mn

46319 ▶▶▶ James007, replying to JohnB, 1, #456 of 1444 🔗

“Where are you getting the figure of £10bn from? It cost £12mn”

From Toby’s article today and the various tabloid reports.

46258 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to James007, 8, #457 of 1444 🔗

Having worked on Electronic Patients Records which was scrapped at a cost of £11bn all those years ago I will have a stab.

There are 25,000 employees for TTT. If they are all on minumum wage (which they won;t be), that is £322 for each employee a week, so for 25K employees that’s £8mn a week, or £420mn a year. If they’re gonna wait for a vaccine which will take 5-10 years, then thats £2.1bn-£4.2bn just on wages.

Then you’ve got costs for premises and desk equipment, phobebills, IT Systems & Licenses (massive cost!!!!), mileage, ppe and mobile phones for the tracers, and whatever they are doing with the TT App. This which will easily account for the rest of the money.

TTT will probably be a minimum of 5 years as this will probably be the earliest a (supposedly) safe vaccine could be pushed out, so I can easily see £10bn being used up.

46271 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to daveyp, 4, #458 of 1444 🔗

I predict this one will be quietly ditched a.s.a.p. before the next Budget: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2020/07/10/track-trace-app-uk-google-apple-when-download/
It’s a pointless nightmare, now the true nature of the disease is known, the death rates are down to nearly none, and we know what ought to be done when it starts again in November. Which is when conditions in Britain most closely approximate to the interior of a slaughterhouse, sorry, meat processing plant, i.e. when it’s cold and damp and people are close together at work or on transport.

46450 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bruno, 1, #459 of 1444 🔗

They will drop it when they have acquired everyone’s personal details by other more underhand means, eg scanning Q code to go into a pub, etc..

46446 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to daveyp, #460 of 1444 🔗

I read an interview with a tracer in the UK and they were on £27 an hour!

46499 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Carrie, 1, #461 of 1444 🔗

Just found it Tracers are paid £9.42 an hour, and the Caseworkers because the are skilled get £17-£27 an hour.

They were/are being recruited through recruitment agencies who’ll also earn a fair whack from it.

46452 ▶▶ guy153, replying to James007, 2, #462 of 1444 🔗

It seems that all they’re doing now anyway after axing their own car crash of an app is putting NHS logos on the code Apple and Google have already done. I would expect this to cost no more than a few thousand quid.

£10bn is astronomical. Literally. You could do a Mars mission for less than that.

46216 HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, 3, #463 of 1444 🔗
46220 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to HawkAnalyst, #464 of 1444 🔗

Are they going to be the test area for the vaccine? High BAME population and all that… Need to prove it is necessary..

46257 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Carrie, 3, #465 of 1444 🔗

Very possible – they have a history of experimenting with vaccines in African countries.

Protesters in South Africa burn masks in opposition to coronavirus vaccine experimentation
“Africans are finally waking up to the deception of the experimental vaccination campaigns that continue to be thrust upon them in the name of advancing “public health.

But protesters say that those who are agreeing to participate in such trials do not know the risks involved, and often naively believe that these drug-pushing outsiders are only trying to help them.

“The people chosen as volunteers for the vaccination, they look as if they’re from poor backgrounds, not qualified enough to understand,” says Phapano Phasha, one of the organizers of the protest. “We believe they are manipulating the vulnerable,” he says of Gavi, Gates, and other vaccine pushers.

French researcher Jean-Paul Mira basically admitted to this earlier in the year when he stated that Africa is a perfect place to test experimental vaccines for the Wuhan coronavirus (COVID-19) because “there are no masks, no treatments, no resuscitation.””


46445 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, 4, #466 of 1444 🔗

Gates has been turfed out of a number of countries due to dodgy vaccines; if I remember rightly one time it was his polio vaccines in India which caused an *increase* in the incidence of polio.. Also some of his vaccines in Africa have only been given to women of childbearing age, and it was discovered afterwards that they contained agents to sterilise the women… shocking..

BAME women tend to have large families, and we know Gates is into population reduction – could explain Leicester as a testing ground..

46244 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #467 of 1444 🔗

Things like this could point to why the TTT system cost £10B:

Key Cummings and Gove ally given COVID-19 contract without open tender

The government justified the absence of a competitive tendering process, which would have enabled other companies to bid, under emergency regulations that allow services to be urgently commissioned in response to the COVID-19 crisis.

46253 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #468 of 1444 🔗


46270 ▶▶ Invunche, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #469 of 1444 🔗


Swamp emptying saviour Dom looking out for his mates just like the rest of them?

Surely not!!

46282 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Nobody2020, #470 of 1444 🔗

Lol so it’s the exact opposite of what I said 😂

Just pay the money to the highest bidder boys!! (Because we’re all connected personally to winning company…..)

46443 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #471 of 1444 🔗

I saw a list somewhere (annoyed I can’t remember where) a while back, with all the contracts the government have awarded to firms under the emergency regulations. Many were decidedly iffy, eg. where the company had not previously manufactured the PPE items the government was ordering, had previously had very low turnover (so would never have won if others had been able to bid)… Owner likely a mate of someone in government…

46246 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 42, #473 of 1444 🔗

Back from running the Scottish gauntlet aka food shopping.

What a thoroughly depressing shopping experience…..but not for me as I wasn’t wearing a mask…..yay……

Sad to see all of the staff stacking shelves fully masked. 4 people including me not masked and even more despicable seeing children muzzled. Was served by a lovely lady who agreed it is all bollocks. The friendly lady who works on the fag counter not happy and asked if I picked up a mask on my way in. Gladly told her no and if I did I would use it to my blow nose with. Much hilarity all round.

Stay strong people and fuck them all.

46247 ▶▶ TJN, replying to stefarm, 10, #474 of 1444 🔗

Good one. The children business is, as you say, dreadful; but maybe that’s what people do when they are brainwashed.

46255 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to TJN, 9, #475 of 1444 🔗

Exactly what the lady on the till said. Sod em. I walked around with my head held high breathing clean air.

46285 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to TJN, 15, #476 of 1444 🔗

My 4-year-old said to me the other day, “masks are good.” I explained to him they absolutely are not and people are being silly, but it’s very difficult to explain to a child who doesn’t yet have abstract reasoning.

46396 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to TyLean, 5, #477 of 1444 🔗

Doing my best to make sure my 4-year-old doesn’t even see people in masks.

46439 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to TyLean, 3, #478 of 1444 🔗

Presumably he/she has been fed that line at nursery/school?

46529 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Carrie, 3, #479 of 1444 🔗

Our nursery is pretty laid back, and luckily so is the school for September – otherwise ours won’t be going.

46250 ▶▶ IanE, replying to stefarm, 1, #480 of 1444 🔗

Yep – rusty poker time!

46274 ▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 28, #481 of 1444 🔗

Glad to hear you and others are getting a smile out there. It is throughly depressing and we must fight back.

Myself I took to the city centre then outwards towards a main suburb centre. All chain shops in city centre have covid security who check each contaminated biohazard on the way in. Apple actually checking shoppers have masks on with three security including an electronic temperature xapper on the street outside the enterance. I wanted to ask what they do with a temerature above or below whatever range the ministry of Apple deem safe, but didn’t. Come winter, well…!

H&M had a stall with nonmasked ‘greeter’, “Do you have a mask?”. “No.”. “Do you have a health condition?” “That’s not your place to ask”, I replied. I pointed out the irony of them not wearing a mask telling me I needed one. Then a sermon about how to shop safely, sounded like pingu to me. I would have been able to go onwards to the rails of clutter but since I’d rather pluck my eyeballs out than shop I turned and left.

Press pack further down the street getting the story. Unmasked photographers with their long lenses ready to get that ‘crowds of shoppers’ shot. There were not crowds. Masked journalist talking to masked retail representative both happily slagging off poundland. All shops were not busy a small number of queues of one or two people. Each doorway uninviting with covid obstacles and door keeper.

About 60% in masks more than yesterday but with an added hateful feeling not present before today. Oppressive, would not suggest a pleasant place to holiday as it was before.

Onwards to the suburban supermarkets. Lidl shop one. Straight in no gate keeper. Nothing at all different from yesterday other than all staff at till had masks on. Cheery and not oppressive. I can buy bread at least.

Aldi. This is where it got ugly. Security man inside porch. Agressively standing in way of each would be customer. His chin in a hammock his scalp tattooed like his face. “You have the option to buy a mask, he pointed inside or you can run the risk of a fine – the police are doing spot checks”. I asked him serveal times if he wanted me in his shop. He repeated his sentence about police. Quite a large queue formed behind me. None were shaming me but they did all have masks, so many beady eyes! I asked him a last time if he wanted my custom. Again he deliberately did not answer and so I turned and left. He shouted after me that he wasn’t stopping me from going in to shop.

Next up Lidl shop two. Straight in. No man with a tattooed tear on his cheek or anything. Able to shop as before but one or two nervous reactions from others. Not unkind, just a sense of avoidance similar perhaps to what it must feel like to be a criminal. Masks at checkouts. But a properly warm chat and thanks from the person serving me.

All in all, the chain city centre fasbion/phone shops are going to keep at this I suggest. The food shops are going to dwindle in their enforcement to comply, it’s not their responsibility as the aldi doorman had said. He, himself employed just for the role out of this indanity I presume.

I experienced no social shaming. Lying about a medical condition would seem to be the easiest way to not wear a mask.

Unpleasant that we’re are all going through this, these days will stay with me for life, once the memory fades the dislike for the political class and all it thinks itself to be will remain.

I believe, as others have remarked, it’s important for others to see people without a mask. Mask wearing on a large scale will rapidly distance people from each other when out and about. Imagine a world without smiles. Frightening.

46286 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Basics, 14, #482 of 1444 🔗

Earth to Sturgeon ; be careful what you wish for. Turning us into an SNPolice state will not end well.

46342 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 8, #483 of 1444 🔗

Cunningly took a stroll to parts no often visited to shop. I did my research in my local shops and know there are some very friendly anti-all-this folk about. We will do okay. But we may need to follow Bulgaria’s example! Well done to them, and Albania!

46390 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Basics, 3, #484 of 1444 🔗

Excellent post. I admire you!

46398 ▶▶▶ BJJ, replying to Basics, 12, #485 of 1444 🔗

I´m in Reykjavik now. Now masks to be seen, anywhere. No social distancing anywhere. No corpses in the streets.

46406 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to BJJ, #486 of 1444 🔗

.. what about under the glaciers, good a place as any to hide a corpse or two…

46436 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to BJJ, 4, #487 of 1444 🔗

I do wonder how the UK government are going to keep up the ‘masks are necessary’ line when so many other countries are not mandating them – and yet as you say, no piles of corpses in the streets..

46456 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Carrie, 3, #488 of 1444 🔗

No, just piles of scuzzy masks …

46434 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, #489 of 1444 🔗

Was this in Scotland?

46441 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Carrie, #490 of 1444 🔗


46517 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 3, #491 of 1444 🔗

A world without faces.
A world where individuals have been deleted.
I think I’d rather go to prison.

46299 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to stefarm, 4, #492 of 1444 🔗

I just came back from Lidl. 99% compliance as far as I could tell. Most people did take the masks off as soon as they got outside though.

I couldn’t help thinking that it’s highly likely that none of the people I saw were infectious with the virus.

46302 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Nobody2020, 2, #493 of 1444 🔗

Yeah, I saw people walking out with a bag in 1 hand and mask in the other, very pleased with themselves

46314 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nobody2020, 8, #494 of 1444 🔗

I can see this becoming law across Britain and also creeping out to not just inside but anytime outside too. I’m not meaning to sound hyperbolic, I do see that is the direction they are moving us.

46357 ▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Basics, 7, #495 of 1444 🔗

This is what I tried to point out yesterday: in the ‘new normal’ mask wearing could be employed as a form of social/ political barter and control creep.

Wear the masks, show you’re responsible and selflessly concerned for the welfare of others, and worried about the next pandemic, and we’ll lift restrictions more quickly and dish out a few rewards for the obedient masses.

Those who refuse to comply will be targeted and undermined by widespread announcements and slogans in the MSM and social media.

Mass compliance will be added to the list of virtuous posturing , thus ensuring yet another successful nudging strategy .

I fully share you fears Basics.

46358 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to wendyk, 13, #496 of 1444 🔗

Just been out to the Coop in Marston (suburb of Oxford) – haven’t been up there for a couple of weeks. Lots of people out and about (compared with previously), very few wearing masks anywhere (including inside the Coop – either staff or customers). Most I saw were a few people on a bus wearing masks. I am not convinced that if the advice/law changes people are going to comply (in England). I think the pro-maskers are being ignored. Today was closest to pre-lockdown that I have seen.

46371 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Ozzie, #497 of 1444 🔗

Encouraging, especially as Oxford proper is a woke strong hold I believe.

46369 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 8, #498 of 1444 🔗

They need the measure to carry us through the disater of the economy and onwards to the vaccine. We cannot be normal normal by the time the dvonomic fudging unravels. If we are in facecoverings at least we can touch the reason why 4 million jobless. Without a measure such as the mask this virus will long be forgotten.
The crazy seat belt messaving and air borne virus rot is the propaganda to get us in masks. For the reasons above.
In my opinion.

46354 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to stefarm, 2, #499 of 1444 🔗

Sturgeon’s preference:



46260 John B, replying to John B, 18, #500 of 1444 🔗

“… new Prime Minister Jean Castex said in an interview on RTL television.
“But we’re not going to impose a lockdown like the one we did last March, because we’ve learned… that the economic and human consequences from a total lockdown are disastrous,” he said.


Economic and social disaster caused by shutting down the economy came as a surprise!

46264 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to John B, 16, #501 of 1444 🔗

I suppose he’s at least moving the French Gov narrative in the right direction and not continuing to lie and doubling down like our mob of gangsters.

46265 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #502 of 1444 🔗

Does anyone have the link to that article that comprehensively explains why the covid tests are a load of unreliable nonsense? I was sure I’d archived it but I can’t find it anywhere!

46268 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to stefarm, 2, #504 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think so but this will do the trick. Thanks very much.

46276 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #505 of 1444 🔗

There was a great one comparing the RNA sequences detected by different “brands” of test to looking for a tiger – some look for stripes, some for claws, some for a tail, and some for two or even all three. So for some of the tests, anything with a tail is counted as a tiger, even if it’s a monkey or a parrot. With other tests, they would only be positive for “tiger” (i.e. covid) if they have claws and a tail, or stripes and a tail, etc etc. Of course only something with stripes, claws AND a tail is likely to be a tiger, and even then not necessarily. Can’t find it now unfortunately.

46275 TyLean, replying to TyLean, #506 of 1444 🔗

Can someone please help me? This document is giving me a migraine. I’m trying to find where it specifically says that people who have medical conditions are exempt, but I’m not seeing it. Thank you!


46291 ▶▶ TyLean, replying to TyLean, 1, #507 of 1444 🔗

Basically, this is the section with the exemptions:
(2) Paragraph (1) does not apply to the wearing of a face covering— (a) by a child who is under the age of 5, (b) by a constable acting in the course of their duty, (c) by an emergency responder (other than a constable) acting in their capacity as an emergency responder, (d) by a person responsible for a shop, or an employee of that person, where— (i) there is a partition between the person or employee and members of the public, or (ii) a distance of at least two metres is maintained between the person or employee and members of the public.

And then there is this explanatory section:
Regulation 8(4) of the principal regulations provides that it is a defence to a charge of committing an offence under paragraph (1), (2) or (3) of that regulation if the person had a reasonable excuse. Regulation 2(11)(c) of these Regulations amends regulation 8(5A) of the principal regulations, to provide that it is a reasonable excuse for a person not to wear a face covering, where that person is undertaking food handling tasks, in order to avoid risk to the hygiene or safety of food.

But it doesn’t specifically say MEDICAL exemption. It says, “reasonable excuse,” but doesn’t go on to clarify what might constitute a “reasonable excuse.”

46292 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to TyLean, 4, #508 of 1444 🔗

Once again – Why are police and emergency responders exempt?!? WHY?!

Maybe communication? But….. surely doctors etc. need to communicate too!

46296 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Farinances, 4, #509 of 1444 🔗

You know what came to mind when I read that…. mouth to mouth resuscitation, lol!

46298 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to TyLean, 2, #510 of 1444 🔗

you may have a point though

Surely they’re advising them to just…. not do CPR because of the dreaded lurgy?

46300 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Farinances, 4, #511 of 1444 🔗

Yup…. public health! Let the person die, you might catch a cough!!

46306 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mario, replying to TyLean, 5, #512 of 1444 🔗

That would fit the logic of these times, though.

46489 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ken Turner, replying to Farinances, 2, #513 of 1444 🔗

True – Resuscitation council updated guidance for lay responders to do compression only CPR and cover the month and nose by some form of cloth to reduce risk of CPR coursing an aerosol and increasing the risk of infection – most ambulance trusts have either stood down their community responders or placed strict limits on what they can be sent to. If an ambulance arrives, and resuscitation is needed then the crew will use full PPE including an disposable over suit, shoes and FPE3 facemask – speaking to a friend this still takes around 2 minutes to get into so not very friendly to someone who needs help (It’s all aound “AGP’s” – aerosol generating procedures that need full PPE )

46322 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Farinances, 3, #514 of 1444 🔗

Well, obviously because they come into close contact with more people, so errr… hang on, no, err…

46375 ▶▶▶▶ Guirme, replying to Farinances, 6, #515 of 1444 🔗

Surely it doesn’t matter if the police are exempt. If wearing a mask is a health measure then the police as an employer would be remiss if they did not follow this health measure and would be able to be sued by any employee who caught Covid. Therefore the police must insist that their employees, particularly when sitting beside each other in a car, are masked. Alternatively they would have to argue that there is no protective health benefit in wearing a mask.

46294 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to TyLean, 5, #516 of 1444 🔗

Also, “defence to a charge of committing an offence” reads to me as though I can be charged and later have to prove my medical exemption to the court…. which I can do easily enough, but why should I have this (theoretical) bureaucratic nightmare just because I’m disabled?

46343 ▶▶▶▶ The Spingler, replying to TyLean, 1, #517 of 1444 🔗

It would never get as far as court as once you showed your medical exemption if you had already been charged (probably wouldn’t even get that far) those charges would be dropped. Of course it should never even get to that point and if it did I would certainly look at using the anti-discrimination legislation to get compensation/justice/apologies etc

46386 ▶▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to TyLean, 2, #518 of 1444 🔗

TyLean – see the TfL webpage here:


which also gives the exemption card to printout or download. (It looks like this can be used by anyone who wants to).

Definition of a good reason is:

You also do not need to wear a face covering if you have a good reason not to; such as:

  • If you have a physical or mental illness or impairment, or a disability that means you cannot put on, wear or remove a face covering
  • If putting on, wearing or removing a face covering would cause you severe distress
  • If you are travelling with, or providing assistance to, someone who relies on lip reading to communicate
  • If you are travelling to avoid injury or escape the risk of harm, and you do not have a face covering with you
  • If you need to remove it during your journey to avoid harm or injury or the risk of harm or injury to yourself or others
  • If you need to eat, drink, or take medication you can remove your face covering
  • If you are asked to remove your face covering by a police officer or other official, for example to check your railcard
46320 ▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to TyLean, #519 of 1444 🔗

Do you not also need the text of the original Act? Is this thing comprehensible on its own?

46810 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Mike Smith, #520 of 1444 🔗

The mask bit is entirely new, and a lot of the references to previous legislation seem to be altering the original Covid Act, but yes…. ideally to decode the entire document. I’m very surprised that medical exemptions aren’t specifically cited though. I don’t expect I will be given a problem, but I want to be confident in my knowledge of the law before I’m a cocky bitch to anyone who dares to tell me to put a muzzle on me or my son. If it’s just me, I might have a capacity to be pleasant, but I get hyper protective of my son…. I don’t know if that’s a thing generally among parents of disabled children, but I go into tiger bitch mode, lol.

46880 ▶▶▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to TyLean, #521 of 1444 🔗

I still think you need the original Act to be sure what’s going on. If you can find that (I can’t, I tried) then look for anything medical and see if those paras transfer to the face masks legislation.

6B.—(1) Except to the extent that a defence would be available under regulation 8(4), no person may use a shop without wearing a face covering.

What is regulation 8(4)? Might help, might be useless.

46954 ▶▶▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to TyLean, 1, #522 of 1444 🔗

Alternatively? comment image

47058 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to TyLean, 1, #523 of 1444 🔗

Matt Hancock can change the law at will now, as he feels like it, with no checks in Parliament – it is outrageous..

46287 Dinger, replying to Dinger, 3, #524 of 1444 🔗

Great website link put on last night’s comments http://www.laworfiction.com/2020/06/masks-are-not-compulsory-yet/

46288 ▶▶ Dinger, replying to Dinger, 1, #525 of 1444 🔗

Sorry – that’s for TyLean!

46289 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Dinger, #526 of 1444 🔗

Thank you!

46372 ▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to Dinger, #527 of 1444 🔗

However very worrying that Wales might be going there soon from this BBC article – “ He said: “If you are able to run a business taking all reasonable measures to sustain a 2m distance that is what the law in Wales will require you to do.
“But we recognise that there will be some context and some business for whom that simply isn’t practically possible and in those circumstances what the law in Wales will require is that those businesses will have to take a series of other mitigating measures.”

Sounds an awful lot like the enforcement of 2m by law in workplaces in wales(as detailed on that law or fiction above) will now be replaced by masks by law or even lots of different measures, of course because if not 2m then more measures =safety, obviously.
Coronavirus: Welsh pubs and cafes to reopen indoors on 3 August https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-53363807

46427 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Youth_Unheard, 3, #528 of 1444 🔗

A positive thing is that the UsForThem campaign has had success with ensuring that Welsh and Scottish schoolchildren will go back in September without social distancing – however this does not apply to children in England… UsforThem are still fighting on this one..

46297 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 15, #529 of 1444 🔗

Haha, this guy is funny:

Only herd sanity can inoculate us against this madness

Once this level of mass common sense is achieved in a population, any stupid idea like ‘Speech is violence’, or ‘Defund the police’, or ‘Listen to Sadiq Khan’ will only be able to get so far without running into a sane, normal person and immediately dying out.

46303 ▶▶ Mario, replying to Nobody2020, 5, #530 of 1444 🔗

There is something to it, but I wonder why it is taking so long to actually work that way.

Yesterday I took a look at Titania McGraths twitter, and found it no longer funny. Because reality has become so much more crazy in the last three years that it is hard for her to keep her absurdist edge.

And lots of people I trusted and knew well are now woke. It’s making me wonder if this isn’t a kind of zombie apocalypse we are witnessing, with “wokeosis” being the mind eating bug.

46305 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Mario, #531 of 1444 🔗

I stopped finding Titania funny the day Eddie Izzard came out as ‘trans’

46309 ▶▶▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to Farinances, 1, #532 of 1444 🔗

Ah yes, Che Guevara’s aunt.

46368 ▶▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to Mario, 1, #533 of 1444 🔗

I wouldn’t worry quite so much, Twitter is still a cesspit of far left ideologies being shouted about by a vocal minority, even if they get 100k likes that is still a very small minority of the general population of even this country, and remembers Twitters is global. Normal people still aren’t difficult to find in real life.

46308 Farinances, replying to Farinances, 22, #534 of 1444 🔗


“A mask stops a virus like your underwear stops your farts”

46313 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Farinances, 10, #535 of 1444 🔗

But if everyone wears pants then we can collectively reduce the fartal load each individual breathes in.


46328 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Farinances, 6, #536 of 1444 🔗

Isn’t it also a fact that if you can smell a fart through a mask, it means that a virus can pass through?

46335 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to daveyp, 4, #537 of 1444 🔗

I don’t have the virus, but my farts are deadly, even at two metres.

46355 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to daveyp, 5, #538 of 1444 🔗

And the dreaded Covid has apparently been found in sewage and effluent so, farting could soon be on the list of proscribed activities.

However, pause for thought: how would the noxious effusions be halted in their deadly tracks?

Bungs? Dietary changes? Beans now verboten? Light match and retreat?

Seriously, farting is a necessary function of human plumbing so even Wee Krankie would have trouble banning it.


Beat this!

46367 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Farinances, 7, #539 of 1444 🔗

To be fair, sitting on a bench was pretty dangerous a few weeks back so maybe you CAN get infected through your arse

46312 Basics, replying to Basics, 3, #540 of 1444 🔗

Apologies if posted already.

UK Column today covers many aspects of lockdown including the Public Health legislation and what powers they have given themselves to enforce compliance, Simon Dolan has raised considerable concern about that.

UKC also covers an interesting phenonmenon that where populations have gone out on street to protest the lockdown, and been victorious in aboloshing it, the UK Gov says travel is not safe. Sweden also is seen by UK Gov as an unsafe destination.

Much more besides.

UK Column today:

46325 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Basics, #541 of 1444 🔗

I’d bet it has been posted already as there was nearly 2,000 comments yesterday!!!!

46339 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to daveyp, 1, #542 of 1444 🔗

It was only broadcast at 1pm today.

46415 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 8, #543 of 1444 🔗

Re Sweden: practically no one is wearing masks here and yet people are not still dropping like flies!

46323 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 17, #544 of 1444 🔗

Wow, from Boris’ virtual address to this years’ school leavers:

Your final months of school have coincided with the greatest crisis our country has faced since the Second World War. Thanks to your sacrifice, we have saved hundreds of thousands of lives.

Words fail me!

46331 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Cheezilla, 12, #545 of 1444 🔗

What is the nazi quote… a giant lie can be swallowed by the people if you just keep repeating it. Ovbiously with more craftsmanship around the words, but that’s the point. Repeat the lie to make it stick. They are past the point of return long ago.

46345 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Basics, 15, #546 of 1444 🔗

The expression was coined by Adolf Hitler , when he dictated his 1925 book Mein Kampf , about the use of a lie so “colossal” that no one would believe that someone “could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously

Repeat a lie often enough and it becomes the truth ”, is a law of propaganda often attributed to the Nazi Joseph Goebbels .

46364 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lockdown Truth, #547 of 1444 🔗

Thanks L Truth! It’s better the way you say it. But, boris is doing that… repeating

46376 ▶▶▶ assoc, replying to Basics, 4, #548 of 1444 🔗

So much of what has happened appears to have come straight out of Animal Farm, an anti-Soviet parody, that it seems only fair that the Nazis get a look in!

46381 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to assoc, 1, #549 of 1444 🔗

Are you too young to remember pick n mix shops? Am I too old to know they still have ’em?
Yeah, we are seeing a good deal of the old cart horse behind these face coverings.

46803 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to assoc, 1, #550 of 1444 🔗

I’ve been muttering, “Long Live Napoleon” since this bollocks started.

46341 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Cheezilla, 22, #551 of 1444 🔗

Totally speechless. I loathe him. Not only is that statement a barefaced lie, but those lives which were ‘saved’ were the lives which had been artificially extended into old age and those who had already had a good innings on this earth. Never has so much been sacrificed by so many for so few.

46356 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Poppy, 10, #552 of 1444 🔗

Despicable. What a preening w……

And the “few” didn’t actually ask for this. Some might want it, but not all. My mother in law is 80+ and is furious about this whole business, worries about her grandchildren.

46493 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Julian, 7, #553 of 1444 🔗

My mother’s comment on the GOSH news last week: “if they’re doing this to save us oldies, then frankly I’d rather they lined us up against a wall and shot us than that put children through this.” (She’s 69 and still working)

46400 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Poppy, 14, #554 of 1444 🔗

Yes, I loathe him too, and I voted for the bastard.

46411 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to TJN, 7, #555 of 1444 🔗

Same here!

46741 ▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to TJN, #556 of 1444 🔗

Me too but only because I was presented with a 3 headed monster called liblabcon and I thought he was the least awful of the 3. Maybe I was wrong.

46401 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Poppy, 13, #557 of 1444 🔗

isnt it amazing how one man can, in the space of 6 months , go from being a breath of fresh air to being a total fart

46370 ▶▶ Jodie S, replying to Cheezilla, 8, #558 of 1444 🔗

Is he on drugs?
Does he really believe this?

(Probably not.)

46682 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Jodie S, 1, #559 of 1444 🔗

It.s The Agenda.

Ferguson was chosen to provide a massively over the top estimation of deaths so Boris could claim to have “saved” half a million lives.

If they’d gone with other estimates of 40 000 – 60 000 deaths he wouldn’t have “saved” anyone

46377 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Cheezilla, 11, #560 of 1444 🔗

I think he’s taking the Churchillian posture too seriously, in that he’s convinced himself that Covid mania is ‘the greatest crisis’ etc. and that he represents a latter day Churchill here to lead us to safety.

Fantastical thinking, delusions of grandeur or simple political spin; who can tell?

46387 ▶▶▶ Poppy, replying to wendyk, 19, #561 of 1444 🔗

He is a total narcissist but unfortunately he doesn’t have any leadership qualities to speak of so he just comes across as delusional and incompetent.

46461 ▶▶▶▶ Brian D, replying to Poppy, 2, #562 of 1444 🔗

Apologies as I made half of this post a few comments up the page but didn’t finish editing it…

How he can claim that lockdown has saved any lives and still sleep at night is beyond me. Back in May (?) in his address to the nation he stated:

“it is a fact that by adopting those measures we prevented this country from being engulfed by what could have been a catastrophe…”

Whatever science he is being fed it isn’t based on any evidence that they’re willing to share with us oddly enough.

This is despite his post hospital speech when he said this:

“I want to serve notice now that these decisions will be taken with the maximum possible transparency. And I want to share all our working, our thinking, my thinking, with you, the British people.”….yet it took Simon Dolan’s court battle for them to release the Sage minutes and they still haven’t had a proper debate in parliament. Hmmmm….

Incidentally if it ‘could’ have been a catastrophe then how is it a ‘fact’ that the measures prevented this?

47171 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Poppy, #563 of 1444 🔗

Gordon Brown spent his life looking forward to being Prime Minister, but when he finally got the job he couldn’t do it.

Boris is Gordon Brown lite.

46429 ▶▶ Brian D, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #564 of 1444 🔗

How he can claim that lockdown has saved any lives and still sleep at night is beyond me. Back in May (?) in his address to the nation he stated ‘it is a fact that by adopting those measures we prevented this country from being engulfed by what could have been a catastrophe…’ Whatever science he is being fed it isn’t based on any evidence that they’re willing to share with us oddly enough.

Incidentally if it ‘could’ have been a catastrophe then how is it a ‘fact’ that the measures prevented this?

47232 ▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Cheezilla, #565 of 1444 🔗

Let me correct that, Boris: “ Thanks to your sacrifice, we have told hundreds of thousands of lies.”

46327 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #566 of 1444 🔗

Did we miss this one yesterday?

Exclusive: Coronavirus could fuel a superbugs timebomb Former chief medical officer urges hospitals to avoid over-using antibiotics to stop patients from catching secondary infections

Another reason to keep the hospitals empty!

To help solve the problem, an alliance of more than 20 leading pharmaceutical companies has launched the AMR Action Fund, with an initial investment of nearly $1 billion. The goal is to bring two to four new antibiotics to market in the next decade.
“This multilateral effort is a potential game-changer,” Dame Sally said.

Who’d have guessed?!

46336 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #567 of 1444 🔗

In Northern Ireland they are stopping A&E being a drop in service. You will soon only be allowed into A&E if you arrive by ambulance. See UK Column today for more. Sorry I’m not a UKC employee, honestly! They just do good topical coverage.

47175 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Basics, #568 of 1444 🔗

“Hello, I’d like to break my leg. Will next tuesday be okay?”

“Can you make it wednesday?”

47231 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Basics, #569 of 1444 🔗

So now the timewasting A and E cases (colds, minor cuts, minor burns…) will call an ambulance rather than get there themselves, what a brilliant way to make the waiting times for those who need A and E treatment even longer.

46346 smileymiley, replying to smileymiley, 4, #570 of 1444 🔗

Just had this ,

The truth about care homes
By Fraser Nelson

Across Europe, countries – some of which handled the Covid-19 crisis very differently to others – are asking a similar question: how did we fail so badly in protecting our eldery in care homes? In my Daily Telegraph column today, I critique the standard explanation: that older patients were discharged from hospitals in a panic, seeding the virus into care homes. In the past few weeks, I’ve been talking to those involved and found a different story. The order to clear hospitals was given on 17 March and 25,000 patients were discharged to care homes between then and 23 April. Is that proof of a panicked exodus? On the contrary: it’s business as usual for the NHS who sent 35,000 to care homes in the same period last year. Yes, some 30,000 beds were cleared and lay empty throughout the crisis, but that was achieved by stopping the inflow. Had this seeded the virus into homes, we would have seen an infection boom in care homes. Instead, it was a slow burn with the full horror taking some time to become apparent. The number one problem was our failure to realise early on just how many people are barely affected by Covid-19, spreading the virus asymptomatically.

Internal NHS studies show no link between discharges and infections. But there is huge variation in care home outcome, some having no Covid-19 infections and some being rife. Research suggests that the big difference, throughout Europe, lies in how the homes were staffed. In France, a home near Lyon put its staff and residents into complete isolation for seven weeks, taking no one from outside. In contrast, an Isle of Skye care home found that 30 of its 36 residents ended up with the virus, six of whom died. It turned out to be shipping in workers, including one from Kent. The Vivaldi study of care homes shows residents stood a 56 per cent greater chance of catching the virus if they were looked after by agency workers, who were more than twice as likely to carry Covid-19 if they worked in multiple homes. The upshot: if there is a second wave, the first step should be to quarantine those working in care homes, putting them up in hotels if need be. Yes, it’s expensive – but we haveyet again seen the cost of doing this on the cheap

46362 ▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to smileymiley, 1, #571 of 1444 🔗

Expensive?? We wouldn’t even bat an eyelid at the cost of that compared to the damage done by not doing that!!!

46485 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Youth_Unheard, #572 of 1444 🔗

Maybe – but have you seen all the whinging comments around complaining about the cost of care homes? Of course, if the government (i.e. future tax-payers) took the strain, it might be the way forward, BUT care homes are not the NHS, so I rather doubt that the government would help.

46348 Bart Simpson, 18, #573 of 1444 🔗

Greetings Fellow Sceptics!

So Mr Bart and I used the underground for the first time since our self imposed boycott, it was mostly to test my exemption card and badge and also to treat ourselves since we are supposed to be on “annual leave”

I topped up my card in the shop inside the station and have a lovely chat with the owner who himself is a lockdown sceptic and thinks that all this muzzling is bollocks and that this lockdown and antisocial distancing is costing the country dear.

Then we made our way to the platform where the number of unmuzzled slightly outnumbered the muzzled. There was a member of staff there but he was ignoring the passengers and seemed to be more concerned with checking the signalling lights.

We went for a walk in Hampstead Heath with nice coffee and lunch – no muzzles, everyone had a lovely time.

Then it was off to the supermarket and on the way there we walked past a hairdressers where we saw the staff wearing visors while the customers were muzzled. Had to feel sorry for one woman who kept touching her face and holding the muzzle away from her nose which made me think that she was struggling to breathe and trying hard not to pass out. If that was me I would have walked out but as Mr Bart pointed out either customers were sheep or desperate to have their hair done.

Inside the supermarket, people were ignoring the one way system and antisocial distancing circles. Ditto the staff.

46349 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 18, #574 of 1444 🔗

13,000 Dutch medical professionals criticise lockdown measures .

They’re obviously all lumpen ignoramuses.

46366 ▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #575 of 1444 🔗


46472 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #576 of 1444 🔗

The problems is they are all in the pockets of the EU, Big Pharma, and other orgs. They are all biased now, and any independent scientist will never get their voice heard, or will be called cranks. So the only option they have is to join the crowd or not earn a living.

46373 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 14, #577 of 1444 🔗

Johnson hints stricter rules on face coverings may come

The PM hints there may be stricter regulations coming to encourage people to wear face coverings in public.

He said:

“We need to be stricter in insisting that people wear face coverings in confined places, transport and shops where they are meeting people they don’t normally meet.”

Johnson said expert opinion on face coverings had shifted over the course of the pandemic and that he was
“very keen to follow that”.

Maybe he’s waiting to see how the Sheeple in the UK testing zone take to it.

46378 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Tenchy, 9, #578 of 1444 🔗

They’ve put their ducks in a row on this. Watched it happen. Those who were thinking its just that bampot sturgeon, well, it is coming your way.

Look to Bulgaria and Albania for inspiration.

46379 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Tenchy, #579 of 1444 🔗
46380 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, #580 of 1444 🔗

Apologies, wasn’t meant as a reply!

46391 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Tenchy, 34, #581 of 1444 🔗

I really feel like I am going totally bonkers. We indeed know more about the virus now than we did in March but that knowledge points to the fact that it is LESS dangerous than feared, not more! So we should be lessening the measures, not bringing in more restrictive crap. It is astonishing and frightening how far our governments are taking this charade, how much destruction they are willing to wreak on this country to sustain the colossal mistake they made on 23rd March 2020.

46672 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Poppy, 4, #582 of 1444 🔗

This all has nothing to do with the virus. They did not make a colossal mistake they proceeded according to a plan that is clearly global in nature even though some of the actors may be unwitting or have a proverbial gun to their head. As hard is it may be to accept we are not in the middle of a deadly virus pandemic we are in the middle of a coup and we now live in a totalitarian state and there are much greater horrors on their way. If we cannot accept this reality then there really is no hope.

46802 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Poppy, 2, #583 of 1444 🔗

No one is this stupid…. no one. That only leaves intentional.

46394 ▶▶ Snarly, replying to Tenchy, 11, #584 of 1444 🔗

The Daily Mail has actually come up with a poll claiming that 61% of the public are in favour of compulsory masks with only 26% against, very depressing but at least most of the comments are from people who are anti-muzzles.

46418 ▶▶▶ Laura, replying to Snarly, 8, #585 of 1444 🔗

Those in favor of compulsory masks won’t leave their houses anyways for fear of the “virus” and “droplets hanging in the air.” So their opinion doesn’t count.

46435 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Laura, 7, #586 of 1444 🔗

Exactly. It will make the scared people even more scared (it’s so dangerous out there, we need to wear masks – better not go out), and the not scared so pissed off that they won’t bother to go to the shops either, other than for essentials. Therefore it won’t benefit anyone.

46676 ▶▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #587 of 1444 🔗

There is no intention to benefit anyone.

46464 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Snarly, 9, #588 of 1444 🔗

Interesting. So I wonder why the 61% aren’t wearing them now – because at the moment I’d say only about 5% are.

46469 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Tenchy, 8, #589 of 1444 🔗

Good point! Again it was probably one of those loaded survey questions. Would you rather wear a mask to the shops, or would you rather not wear a mask and kill ten grannies?

46675 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Snarly, #590 of 1444 🔗

That is odd because when I go out I only see 1-2% wearing them.

46677 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Snarly, #591 of 1444 🔗

Whoever pays for the poll gets the result they want.

46413 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Tenchy, 20, #592 of 1444 🔗

If they make muzzles compulsory, I simply won’t go where they are required. And if Rishi Sunak wants me out shopping or eating in restaurants, they will have to remove the antisocial distancing, muzzles and queuing. Simple.

46420 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to CarrieAH, 18, #593 of 1444 🔗

Crucial that it is “expert opinion” and not “scientific fact” ie, it’s just being made up on the hoof. Bloody bunch of twats the lot of them, to be honest, tories, labour, gov scientists, lib dems, the journos spreading this shite – they should all be ashamed.

Just requires them to stop and think – what cost will bringing them in now have (on society, on economy, on environment even – which we’re supposed to believe now that they all actually give a shit about!), and what tiny tiny fucking benefit could possibly be gained even if it turns out they did reduce transmission of this already almost non-existent non-lethal virus… GAHHHHHH

46460 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Mark II, 3, #594 of 1444 🔗

A… s… h… a… m… e… d… is not how you spell s… h… o… t…

46430 ▶▶▶ Morris_Day, replying to CarrieAH, 17, #595 of 1444 🔗

Utterly depressed. It seems inevitable now that masks are going to become compulsory. There’s no ending to the insanity.

Eradication of a flu-like virus that is going to be with us forever is still their end goal. Where do we go next? Who takes part in these bloody polls?!

46458 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Morris_Day, 4, #596 of 1444 🔗

The workforces of PPE manufactories probably.
“Yeah, make ’em compulsory. Yeah, I need some overtime so make ’em change the mask every fifteen minutes…”

46679 ▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Morris_Day, 3, #597 of 1444 🔗

Their end goal is total domination of humanity not the eradication of a virus.

46419 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Tenchy, 8, #598 of 1444 🔗

It was obvious this was going to happen from the moment they mandated them on public transport,

46421 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to A. Contrarian, 4, #599 of 1444 🔗

Also, I don’t care about “expert opinion”, just real scientific evidence.

46423 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to A. Contrarian, 9, #600 of 1444 🔗

Yep. Just as it was obvious the ‘3 weeks of lockdown’ was going to be extended and impossible to logically exit from without them admitting what a gigantic mistake it was.

46438 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Tenchy, 2, #601 of 1444 🔗

Check this out: https://masks4all.org/founders This lot have been around since the beginning. It sounds like your friendly neighbourhood craft club but the ‘founders’ are an interesting lot, a mixture of scientists (?) and entrepreneurs. Here are two of them:

In August 2014, Howard founded Enlitic to use machine learning to make medical diagnostics and clinical decision support tools faster, more accurate, and more accessible. Enlitic uses Deep Learning algorithms to diagnose illness and disease.[11] Howard believes that today, machine learning algorithms are actually as good as or better than humans at many things that we think of as being uniquely human capabilities.[12]

and https://www.petrludwig.com/ He’s into neuroscience and check-out his client list!

They seem to have a disproportionate amount of influence on the mask narrative. BTW, we’ve heard a theory that the obsession with getting everyone’s face covered is to test out facial recognition software which can recognise you just from the eye line. ‘Sounds possible.

It certainly has no basis in preventing the spread of a virus which is no longer a threat. Silly old Boris, what a twit he is, eh!

46685 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #602 of 1444 🔗

If their intention was to merely test some facial recognition software there are much easier ways then to wage months of psychological warfare and campaigns of terror against the entire population of multiple nations.

47100 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Saved To Death, #603 of 1444 🔗

That was not really what I said but the mask-wearing psyop seems to be part of a bigger picture. Obviously ‘they’ wouldn’t be doing all this ‘merely’ to test out software which is only one string to their bow but it’s plausible that it’s a useful sideline. I can’t remember where I read this now but look up ‘masks, facial recognition software’ and you will find many links.

47718 ▶▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #604 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think there is much link between the push for masks and their monitoring capabilities. There is software which can identify people without seeing any of the face. I think the push for masks is about exerting control and gaining compliance.

46694 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #605 of 1444 🔗

According to the latest swprs update, the founder of masks4all is a ‘young leader’ from Davos – says it all really…

47101 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Carrie, #606 of 1444 🔗

Doesn’t it just! They seem like a dodgy crew altogether.

46382 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 7, #607 of 1444 🔗

Night out on the town-don’t bother. Double decker buses only take 19 people so you can’t be sure that you can get on one into town or on one coming back, First Bus have an app that shows how spare places there are but unless you live next to the bus stop you don’t know if the bus is going to fill up at stops before yours while you walk there. And why?
“It is not possible for the bus providers to currently increase their vehicle capacity at the moment.
As current government guidance states social distancing must remain at 2m, and where not possible it must be 1m+ with precautions (including masks and hand washing), bus providers will continue to maintain journeys at their current capacity.
Individuals are still not able to sit in the aisle seats as they will be unable to maintain any social distance from passengers passing them in the aisle.
Government advice also still recommends commuters drive, where possible, instead of taking public transport. Although this may cause traffic delays as numbers increase, this active dissuation is essential to limit the number of people using public transport and allow those who do not have alternative transport to make the same journey as safely as possible.”
How exactly does passing someone in the aisle seat cause a problem? Madness or what ?
No wonder city centre pubs and restaurants are empty. Is it the same on trains?

46392 ▶▶ Basics, replying to arfurmo, 8, #608 of 1444 🔗

And there in lies one of the great dilema of the behavioural nudgists. They want you scare shittless of virus at the same time as using public transport, to save greta or whatever. The two don’t mix. The result is broken economy and increase in people praying for a vaccine to release them. Little thinking until the next and the next.

Public transport and virus do not mix well for the nudgistas, what are they going to do?

46428 ▶▶ smileymiley, replying to arfurmo, 2, #609 of 1444 🔗

Especially as for the T&T it states that you have to be in close contact, <1m, for more than 15 minutes.

46383 MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 8, #610 of 1444 🔗

Our shopping trip to Buxton by bus: After 3 weeks of avoiding PT and their mandatory muzzles, we’ve decided to reclaim a bit of the Old Normal, courtesy of exemption cards. On 3 buses, nobody else was without a muzzle. Four of us on the first bus, about 8 on the second and 6, on and off, on the third. Nobody gave us any grief and the bus drivers weren’t bothered. Everyone wearing a muzzle was fiddling with it, taking it on and off to drink, talk etc. They clearly wear the same one several times and it’s apparent it’s an obedience rather than a fear thing in most cases.

Two youngsters trying to talk kept saying ‘Eh?’ to each other. An old chap dozed off and when my OH opened a window he jerked awake. We may have saved him from hypoxia! A neighbour who we haven’t seen for 4 months got on the bus home. Her husband is a university lecturer and he has urged her to wear one of those masks that you buy in supermarkets. She is very bright, obviously has her doubts and we did a bit of a job on her. She nearly broke her neck getting off the bus and blamed the muzzle which was preventing her seeing where she was putting her feet. Brilliant!

To our surprise, a lot of the shops have re-opened. For how long is another question as most seemed empty. Nobody was imposing chemical crap on us. A favourite cafe was nearly normal although the 2 workers suddenly and inexplicably muzzled up after about 5 minutes. It was table service and my OH asked to see the waitress’ face. She took a step back but complied so we thanked her profusely.

We were also able to shop together for the first time in nearly 4 months instead of having to be alone at different ends of town. Not many masks, most on very old, frail types or young ‘virtue signallers’, as I remarked loudly to my OH as we passed to 20-something idiots. Overall it was not brilliant but an improvement on last time we went there.

One puzzle: The Old Sun above on High St is a Marstons’ pub but has a list of anti-social distancing rules on the door including saying that they want contact details. We couldn’t check this because it was closed. Has anyone been there or to any other Marstons pubs than the one in Toby’s post and seen this list of rules and can you say whether or not they are being enforced?

46384 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 14, #611 of 1444 🔗

I’m furious! I‘ve just been accused of being vexatious by the Department of Transport after I sent a FOI request asking for their risk assessment on the wearing of masks on public transport! It appears that they had a whole load of these requests so regarded them all in the same way, vexatious. I pointed out to them that as I am due to fly abroad in the next two weeks and make a 500 mile round trip by rail in August, I want to make an informed decision regarding masks. I also pointed out to them that Dr Jenny Harries said to the PM in an interview with him in March that masks were of little use and could easily become contaminated and that Matt Hancock was on record saying similar things.
The DoT did send me a lot of links on mask wearing, including how to make my own, but not the risk assessment that I had requested.

46385 ▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to Margaret, 14, #612 of 1444 🔗

I suppose if the risk was real they would just give you a standard, sensible reply. The fact that they react like that shows that they know that the situation is absurd.

46393 ▶▶ Ozzie, replying to Margaret, 3, #613 of 1444 🔗

You could just go with printing the exemption card and stating that you had a reasonable excuse not to wear one

See the TfL webpage here:


which also gives the exemption card to printout or download . (It looks like this can be used by anyone who wants to).

Definition of a good reason is:
You also do not need to wear a face covering if you have a good reason not to; such as:

  • If you have a physical or mental illness or impairment, or a disability that means you cannot put on, wear or remove a face covering
  • If putting on, wearing or removing a face covering would cause you severe distress
  • If you are travelling with, or providing assistance to, someone who relies on lip reading to communicate
  • If you are travelling to avoid injury or escape the risk of harm, and you do not have a face covering with you
  • If you need to remove it during your journey to avoid harm or injury or the risk of harm or injury to yourself or others
  • If you need to eat, drink, or take medication you can remove your face covering
  • If you are asked to remove your face covering by a police officer or other official, for example to check your railcard
46397 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Ozzie, #614 of 1444 🔗

Thanks but does this apply to airports and flying though?

46399 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Margaret, 4, #615 of 1444 🔗

Appeal it or ask for a review. Then ICO. Youve done the lengthy part already.
It is clearly a readonable ask. Vexatious is their term be proud they have used it, you are rattling a cage to get vexatious when clearly it is an honestly held concern.

46404 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Margaret, 2, #616 of 1444 🔗

Hi Margaret, post a link to the letter you sent and we can all make copies and send the same FoI to the DoT. That should really start to p*ss them off!!

46407 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Margaret, #617 of 1444 🔗

Simon Dolan might be interested to hear about this; good for his appeal..

46433 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Margaret, 2, #618 of 1444 🔗

The Department of Transport is the most useless,unhelpful government department there is and they have a lot of competition for that accolade !.

46388 Hopeful, replying to Hopeful, 18, #619 of 1444 🔗

Watch out people. Government has issued guidance to Public Health Officers. These folks can enter our homes and take us away for merely suspecting we have covid19. This includes children. Simon Dolan tweeted about this frightening power to be wielded at any time it seems by yes, you got it right , Prefect Hancock. This at a time when hospitalisations and deaths from/with covid19 are on the decline to nothing.

46389 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Hopeful, 6, #620 of 1444 🔗

It looks really frightening. UK Column goes through it in detail.

46405 ▶▶▶ Hopeful, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 9, #621 of 1444 🔗

I first learned of this provision end of May beginning of June from the guy who does the Go Vote stuff. So concerned I wrote to my MP who is also a Minister. The reply was bland so I’ve written to him again today re-stressing my concern. I give what I can financially to Simon Dolan’s campaign. Keep spreading the word. Got to get people to wake up to this stuff, critical mass and all.

46402 ▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to Hopeful, 1, #622 of 1444 🔗

So we are now on a slippery slope to being like New Zealand?

46409 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Hopeful, 8, #623 of 1444 🔗

I’ve said it a million (500,000?) times before, but here it is again:


46478 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #624 of 1444 🔗

You are not alone!

46483 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #625 of 1444 🔗

I’m actually quite surprised no one has ‘lost it’ and taken a shot at him – surely can’t be long until someone does…

46453 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Hopeful, 2, #626 of 1444 🔗

As I said earlier, add that to this:

And you have instant local lock down with fabricated ‘cases’ and dissenters detained for ‘assessment’.

Look at where they are doing the testing…

46475 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Hopeful, 1, #627 of 1444 🔗

Dawn raids no doubt, and perhaps with the stasi armed police in attendance!

46479 ▶▶ Liam, replying to Hopeful, 4, #628 of 1444 🔗

Anyone “public health officer”(ugh!) who tries to enter my home won’t be dying of Covid.

47280 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Hopeful, #629 of 1444 🔗

WHO first bought it up months ago – video available online.

46395 David Elden, 3, #630 of 1444 🔗

Both the disease and the control measures have had serious consequences for population health and equity. We believe that a balanced response is required as we continue to deal with COVID-19.
At last some (urgently needed) scepticism from Canada:

Dave in Ottawa.

46410 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 32, #631 of 1444 🔗

There is a lovely little café in my town which I used to love visiting – they do delicious cakes.

They are still closed and a new notice has appeared on their door – the manager has chosen to keep the place closed because s/he does not think that the business can operate in a ‘Covid-secure way’ according to the government guidelines.

It made me immensely sad and it is a perfect example of how over-regulation from the government can totally stifle business. I wonder how many other places are in the same predicament and will risk getting into massive debt/going under as a result.

My resolve is really starting to waver now. I try and go into town every day and mingle as much as possible – seeing so many cars on the road and lots of people out and about helps me cling onto some normality – but now there are rumblings of mandatory mask wearing and I am very worried it will be forced on us as a ‘way of life’. It is so obvious that the danger has passed and we have to learn to live with this, rather than being over-sensitive and locking down at the emergence of 3 ‘cases’ because EXPONENTIAL GROWTH!!!!!!!!!!!!! Only it’s not as simple as mere exponential growth, because how many of those exponential cases will end up in hospital, in ICU, and dead? Enough dead to totally poleaxe entire societies? Life cannot go on if we lock down all the bloody time.

46416 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Poppy, 7, #632 of 1444 🔗

I think the same is happening in my town centre,apart from a few barbers,hairdressers and one charity shop no other places have opened since June 15th,a few of them will clearly never re-open.

46466 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Paul, 10, #633 of 1444 🔗

I’m wondering whether a lot of businesses will simply go underground… If you can have 30 people in your house, then cut hair from home!

46754 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Paul, #634 of 1444 🔗

A visit to a worcestershire town today revealed very few businesses open and one just doing take aways.He said it was not possible to open under the regulations and that there were too many stasi types around who would report him and get the business closed again. Poor bastard also had had his premises wrecked by the flooding of the river Teme early in the year. Plenty of local council bedwetting signs eg ‘narrow pavements…THINK SOCIAL DISTANCING!…my arse.

47268 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to They dont like it up 'em, #635 of 1444 🔗

One of our veg shops didn’t reopen – but for a good reason. She’s been working full time doing deliveries for the old folks – not just fruit and veg, she will buy them stuff from the butcher’s and supermarket too. A good niche to market into.

46426 ▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to Poppy, 22, #636 of 1444 🔗

Hi Poppy,
My wife has just come back from the regular Tesco trip to say that they have scrapped the one-way system, and queuing to wait for a checkout desk.
Hardly any masks and people were shopping “just like they used to do.”
The dam will break faster than you imagine – stay strong!

46473 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to BTLnewbie, 6, #637 of 1444 🔗

I hope so, but, with Boris now talking about the need for masks indoors???

46480 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to BTLnewbie, 6, #638 of 1444 🔗

I hope you’re right, I feel the same as Poppy, really struggling with it all.

46444 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Poppy, 10, #639 of 1444 🔗

I think this will be the last lockdown ever. Come October, when furlough ends, people will start to wake up to what the government has done.

46521 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Nick Rose, 12, #640 of 1444 🔗

I’d like to think so Nick but my faith in human nature is rock bottom. Thank god there are a few havens of sanity left, this being one of them.

46683 ▶▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Bella Donna, #641 of 1444 🔗

I wish.

46537 ▶▶▶ Nic, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #642 of 1444 🔗

Agree businesses me included have to make a stand.lets face it boris ,cockup witty and the rest have plenty of money they wont be affected in any way

46552 ▶▶ A Reader, replying to Poppy, 6, #643 of 1444 🔗

It’s is any use I had my first work lunch since March in a restaurant in Sloane Square (only with a colleague). Hardly saw any masks, the waiter weren’t wearing them, everything was very relaxed (and normal). I even saw some people enjoying themselves!

46442 Biker, replying to Biker, 13, #644 of 1444 🔗

Sad news from Asda. My mrs been on since 7 this morning says 99.9% of people were obeying Sturgeons face mask bollocks. I give up, i really do.

46449 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Biker, 7, #645 of 1444 🔗

I wonder how many people are just staying at home rather than muzzle up?

46471 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Biker, 5, #646 of 1444 🔗

Ridiculous! The only way to stop it is to boycott it.

46462 Cambridge N, replying to Cambridge N, 14, #647 of 1444 🔗

John Travolta thought he’d caught it.

But it was only a Saturday night fever.

He’s stayin’ alive.

I’ll get me coat.

46482 ▶▶ Ian, replying to Cambridge N, #648 of 1444 🔗


46477 Ian, replying to Ian, 30, #649 of 1444 🔗

Isn’t it depressing? I have never believed the conspiracy angle, I think overreaction, cover our arses now line. But the more this goes on, the more concerned I am. What possible reason could there be to mandate masks? The virus has gone, vamooshed, just as we knew it would. Yet rather than celebrate this shameful shower continue to tighten the psychological screws – loosening up yet maintaining the charade of distancing. When the f… is it going to end? This is 4 months now. When are MPs, mainstream press, let alone people up and down the country, going to shout ‘enough’! There is, very clearly, some dangerous psychological game being played that is making people very ill and setting depression for life. Why? And for any Tory MP reading this. Find your cojones. Call it out. This is debilitating.

46484 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ian, 2, #650 of 1444 🔗
46488 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Ian, 7, #651 of 1444 🔗

Yes – as I have said elsewhere, it is getting very hard to believe that it is just a giant hancock-up!

46516 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Ian, 7, #652 of 1444 🔗

Believe it – it isn’t a conspiracy theory, this is a trial run for the real thing. Unless we say NO WAY!

46534 ▶▶ Nic, replying to Ian, 1, #653 of 1444 🔗

On the continent it is even worse

46490 James H, replying to James H, 2, #654 of 1444 🔗

I think I might cut a very large horizontal slit in a mask and see if that suffices in the event I am compelled to wear one. As I view the whole Covid thing as madness, a gambit worthy of a loon might bring people to their senses . . . (Admittedly, not as good as Mr Peter Hitchens’ WW II gas mask, but still!)

46699 ▶▶ chris c, replying to James H, 1, #655 of 1444 🔗

When I was young we still had the gas mask hanging up in the shed. Now I wish I’d kept it.

46513 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #657 of 1444 🔗

No one is stopping the sheep from wearing one, however I’m not.

46492 Hammer Onats, replying to Hammer Onats, 25, #658 of 1444 🔗

I was talking to a couple of neighbours tonight. Both work in catering and have been enjoying the holiday, courtesy of the taxpayer. However, it’s a different story now as both have been given notice of redundancy. I’m afraid it will take many, many more people to suffer this fate before the country rises up against these ludicrous “rules”.

46495 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Hammer Onats, 10, #659 of 1444 🔗

I am sorry for them and people like them. That’s the awakening to come. The Gov know it too. How will the behavioural scientists capture the minds of people who have gone through the same? Worthwhile keeping an eye on what messaging is put out to their situation. A £10 voucher looks pretty ridiculous.

46498 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Hammer Onats, 14, #660 of 1444 🔗

My neighbour and I were saying the same thing this morning, sheeple will get a rude awakening when furlough ends and they haven’t got a job. A 6 month holiday won’t seem so worth it.

46512 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to stefarm, 2, #661 of 1444 🔗

Just in time for Christmas too.

46514 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #662 of 1444 🔗

Thought that is cancelled

46524 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to stefarm, #663 of 1444 🔗

It might as well be.

46530 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nic, replying to Bella Donna, #664 of 1444 🔗

For many it will be

46583 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Nic, #665 of 1444 🔗

Santa will be cancelled for some dumb reason other other.

46588 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #666 of 1444 🔗

It will be due to Elf and Safety…..

46620 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Sarigan, 3, #667 of 1444 🔗

Will we see Nativity scenes with masked characters????

46651 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Carrie, #668 of 1444 🔗

It’ll probably rain, dear.

46793 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #669 of 1444 🔗

Cos he’ll refuse to wear a mask.

God, that would terrify the kids at the grotto. The “normal” is scary enough!

46618 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bella Donna, 4, #670 of 1444 🔗

Mason Mills wrote on Twitter at the beginning of April that mask advice would change, and even joked then that they would be popular Christmas presents… This plan has been long thought out…

46527 ▶▶▶ Nic, replying to stefarm, 5, #671 of 1444 🔗

Yes we are well in to summer now the catastrophe the government has u leashed on this country will soon be there for all to see

I think bt x mass even the most extreme sheepie will be questioning what the hell has happend

46511 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Hammer Onats, 1, #672 of 1444 🔗

Consequences, there’s no such thing as a free lunch.

46520 ▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Hammer Onats, 16, #673 of 1444 🔗

Being made redundant is just awful. Happened to me as a result of the financial crash (as it’s always referred to). Happened to my late father (who survived Dunkirk, D-Day, and Arnhem) twice in later life. I had other things going on at the time (most notably a traumatic bereavement) and never recovered — between them, the DWP and A4E made sure of that, with knobs on. When I was on the dole, I vowed that, once I’d found a new way of earning my living, I would stand outside the Job Centre with a view to offering help to those who weren’t equipped to weave in and out of the bollards, and stand up to the bullying. I’m ashamed to say that, in the (eventual) event of being offered a job (as a cleaner in a public school – not quite what I had in mind when I went to university in the1970s), – I still haven’t got round to that, because I’m competely done in, physically, and emotionally. Sooo, I really pity all those poor duggers who are already on the heap, or shortly to find themselves on the heap. They’re planning to make made 25% of the workforce redundant where my son works — some of them are recent graduates, on graduate schemes. I could cry for all of them, except I haven’t a lake to draw from.

I went into Oxford today for the first time since lockdown. Even though I had psyched myself up for it, I found it shocking. A shop selling tea had someone at the door taking people’s temperatures before they were directed to use the sanitiser, etc.. The sign outside the shop said, ‘Welcome back!’ Some welcome! Madness… I had my hair cut for the first time in 5 months. I felt really sorry for the hairdresser. I also felt sorry for myself, as I was expected/required to wear a mask. It’s the first time I’ve done it, so desperate was I to have my tresses trained. They say there’s a first time for everything…

I can’t believe just how foolish this government has turned out to be. Perhaps they should all relocate to China? I’ve heard losing face isn’t the done thing over there.

Apologies for any and all typos.

46630 ▶▶▶ ianric, replying to Hoppity, 7, #674 of 1444 🔗

The Daily Mirror was complaining about job losses and we must protect jobs. It beggars belief that the mainstream media have slavishly supported the lockdown and then complain about the consequences of lockdown such as job losses.

46732 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to ianric, 2, #675 of 1444 🔗

They’re not exactly in good shape are they with 500 jobs being cut?

They are now reaping what they’ve sown.

46733 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Hammer Onats, 2, #676 of 1444 🔗

Very sorry for your neighbours and its going to get worse unfortunately. A few of us here have been predicting that there will be rioting, a few weeks’ ago I was convinced it will be in October. Now I’m not so sure, it could be even earlier now as more jobs go and businesses fold.

46496 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #677 of 1444 🔗

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47224 ▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Cheezilla, #678 of 1444 🔗

Our actions are NOT what is controlling the spread, or not, of this virus. The course of it has been so similar in countries which have taken very different actions (or none) that human intervention is clearly not what is driving its patterns. All the lockdown zealot sheep are too mentally contorted to be willing to accept that some things are simply beyond human control, that sacrificing liberties and luxuries cannot help, and that the only thing to do is get on with normal life accepting that maybe, just maybe, oneself is going to be one of the very few who drops dead from covid.

46497 Mike Smith, 7, #679 of 1444 🔗

They’ll have celebs dancing on TV adverts next, singing a ditty:

“Now we know that Covid’s gone
It’s time to put your facemasks on!”

[Note: “your facemasks”, not “our facemasks”]

46502 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #680 of 1444 🔗

Here we go…..

Face masks compulsory in England…

On June 20th it was already on the cards .

46503 ▶▶ annie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 7, #681 of 1444 🔗

‘being considered’

46506 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to annie, 8, #682 of 1444 🔗

that’s code for “it’s going to happen”

46509 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #683 of 1444 🔗

It’s the “science”

46539 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 15, #684 of 1444 🔗

Then I stop shopping. Click and Collect for food, online for rest. End of.
That is, assuming that Quackaduck follows suit, as the Welsh zombies will no doubt demand.
Although NOBODY in my town was muzzled today. Nobody .

46549 ▶▶▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to annie, 4, #685 of 1444 🔗

They’re probably counting on us not shopping, as in starving ourselves to death.

46555 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to annie, 8, #686 of 1444 🔗

My Tesco has removed the one way system today…

46787 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #687 of 1444 🔗


46702 ▶▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to annie, 8, #688 of 1444 🔗

What about filling up at the petrol station / shop with 70 quids worth of diesel (as I have just done) and then being told to mask up to enter the shop to pay…

Simple response: ‘No. Do you want my money or not?’

They wanted my money 😁

46592 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #689 of 1444 🔗

No it isn’t.

I’m not saying it won’t – God forbid.

Maybe the government/BBC are testing the waters to see what the public reaction to it is.

If they do I will get my brother in law (a butcher) to deliver my groceries.

47053 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, #690 of 1444 🔗

I’m reminded once again of Mason Mills’ post from 3rd April when he wrote that mask advice would change, and joked (grrr) that masks would be a popular Christmas present. This has been planned for a long time…

47054 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, #691 of 1444 🔗

I’m reminded once again of Mason Mills’ Twitter post from 3rd April when he wrote that mask advice would change, and joked (grrr) that masks would be a popular Christmas present. This has been planned for a long time…

46507 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Lockdown Truth, 25, #692 of 1444 🔗

Boris needs to be psychologically assessed. He’s unfit to be PM.

46515 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Bella Donna, 22, #693 of 1444 🔗

If this was just arse covering you’d think they would just ease out of it. But doubling down like this is unbelievable.

46522 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Lockdown Truth, 7, #694 of 1444 🔗

Farr’s. Fucking. Law.

46604 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #695 of 1444 🔗

Thank you for that, interesting, looked it up as hadn’t heard of it:

46703 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Bruno, #696 of 1444 🔗

Yes obviously it happened. The MSM just haven’t noticed yet.

46550 ▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Bella Donna, #697 of 1444 🔗

Agree wholeheartedly.

46518 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 16, #698 of 1444 🔗

It’s NOT spreading…..
Look at the data…..
It’s disappearing!!!!

46790 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown Truth, #699 of 1444 🔗

If it slowed down much more, it would be in reverse.

46519 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 13, #700 of 1444 🔗

Can we please start a legal challenge to this?
There is tons of evidence that it’s not necessary.
Is there a solicitor in the group who can give initial advice please?

46560 ▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Lockdown Truth, #701 of 1444 🔗

I imagine Toby Young would know a man (or several men) who can.

46562 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Hoppity, 1, #702 of 1444 🔗

I’m asking him

46525 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Lockdown Truth, 11, #703 of 1444 🔗

It’ll happen. Just seen photos on social media of Johnson wearing a mask today, which I think is as clear evidence as anything that he is trying to set an ‘example’ and doesn’t want to be branded a hypocrite when he finally does make them mandatory.

46528 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Poppy, 10, #704 of 1444 🔗

He can get stuffed!

46578 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Bella Donna, 3, #705 of 1444 🔗

My sentiments exactly.

46568 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Poppy, 9, #706 of 1444 🔗

Same game plan as sturgeon in tartan mask shoot. Never worn one in her life. The then photo. Then the annluncement.

My bet is this time next week folks. But every new clamp down is another opportunity to rebel. Do not be victims. Act and conquer the feeling of helplessness.

46612 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 2, #707 of 1444 🔗

Yep, the game plan is so transparent… watch what happens in Scotland and start your stopwatch..just watch out for the first move in England that is the same as Nippy’s first move, and you know what’s on the cards for England..

46532 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #708 of 1444 🔗

Wow, the comments are actually quite anti-mask – very surprising for the BBC!

46535 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to A. Contrarian, #709 of 1444 🔗

No they aren’t mate…

46543 ▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #710 of 1444 🔗

Mixed bag. Lots of downvotes on the pro comments too.

46554 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Sarigan, #711 of 1444 🔗

Prob changing by the minute, but can’t look at it again.

46573 ▶▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Sarigan, #712 of 1444 🔗

Yes, I should have said mixed, it’s just I was surprised to see anything anti-mask on there at all.

46566 ▶▶▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #713 of 1444 🔗

Yes, they are. Top-rated comments are basically saying it’s unworkable.

46577 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Mike Smith, 5, #714 of 1444 🔗

Its unworkable here. But its happend. Simply factor in social shaming and there’s your compliance. I will say there is a much much more courageous spirit in England than the prevailing strangeness in Scotland. I think you can get some real traction on a counter to this.

46540 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Lockdown Truth, 7, #715 of 1444 🔗

You refuse to wear a mask; you are seen as reckless; therefore, you are ‘potentially infectious’, and can be detained by force. And the circle is complete.

Look forward to meeting some of you in police cells or ‘assessment’ centres.

46594 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #716 of 1444 🔗

I have yet to be told to wear one …

46558 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #717 of 1444 🔗

Ugh! You lot haven’t thought of the very worst bit – this is going to make the crankie look like a miracle worker to her cult. Please get out there and do something!

46561 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Basics, #718 of 1444 🔗

Anyone know a solicitor?

46595 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lockdown Truth, 4, #719 of 1444 🔗

Simon Dolan will.

Might I urge a thought to the torture aspect of this. It is clear peoples reactions are those of people who are under a lot of stress. I think there is a strong case for torture. See amazing polly is this torture for the fastest explanation of the case to be made.

46693 ▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Lockdown Truth, 7, #720 of 1444 🔗

I just can’t see how a type of dress code such as this – a face bag / covering / veil – can be made compulsory.

Surely you just simply say, ‘I am a free human being, free to choose how I dress. I choose to dress like this…’ and show your uncovered face.

It is bizarre to be either bewildered or frightened by this piece of emotional, hysterical blackmail. For that is what it is…

46785 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #721 of 1444 🔗

The prime minister said:
“I think it’s very important that people should try to lead their lives more normally.”

46505 Nobody2020, 3, #722 of 1444 🔗

Look at Peru in this table. Hard and early lockdown:

153,000 Missing Deaths: Tracking the True Toll of the Coronavirus Outbreak

146% above normal excess deaths.

46508 Marcus, replying to Marcus, 20, #723 of 1444 🔗

This facemask idea is the latest fresh hell…Boris could be in line for Toby’s next bed-wetting award tomorrow. Once again for me it’s outrageous and disgusting which if implemented as a minimum we need to vote with our feet (and not shop physically). Nothing feels like enough though.

46523 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Marcus, #724 of 1444 🔗

Bedwetting? You think?

46531 ▶▶ Old Bill, replying to Marcus, 6, #725 of 1444 🔗

Anybody know where I can buy masks with:


Inscribed on the front?

I would be quite happy to wear one of those.

46613 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Old Bill, 1, #726 of 1444 🔗

They have an interesting range here:

46774 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to TJN, #727 of 1444 🔗

Actually there’s something appropriate about wearing a mandatory face nappy with Fuck Off emblazoned on it. Kind of emphasises the obscenity of the whole thing.

comment image ?version=0

I’d want to make some ventilation holes under the nose though!!

46924 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #728 of 1444 🔗

The poshest ‘N95’ ones usually have a valve because otherwise the thing comes off your face when you breathe out hard. So ‘the fog and filthy air’ of the miasma of the coronanists is concentrated in a stream directed right at the people they congratulate themselves they are ‘protecting’.

46796 ▶▶▶ DomW, replying to Old Bill, #730 of 1444 🔗

My personal favourite. I bought one to wear out should it ever become mandatory, but then discovered that putting it on causes me severe distress so am unable to do so…


46551 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Marcus, 13, #731 of 1444 🔗

Just popped up on The BBC News website… “Mandatory face masks in England’s shops considered”

Well that seems to be it then, we will be joining our comrades north of the border by being forced to wear muzzles.

I despair, how did we arrived at this hell?

46553 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Dave #KBF, #732 of 1444 🔗

It’s being discussed a bit lower down…

46593 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Dave #KBF, 28, #733 of 1444 🔗

I have not and will not wear a mask anywhere. Especially in my shop.

In the near eight weeks we have been back at work, not one customer has suggested that we should be wearing masks. I gave the Saturday staff the option of wearing them (I didn’t want them to, but I thought it only fair to leave the decision to them) and they all decided against it.

46598 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to kh1485, 9, #734 of 1444 🔗

Absolutely right. It’s their decision.
Up tick!

46606 ▶▶▶▶ ikaraki, replying to kh1485, 10, #735 of 1444 🔗

Yes yes yes! Glad to hear more business owners choosing their own path. Seems my work is taking a more lax approach than I expected, so you have company.

46632 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to ikaraki, 2, #736 of 1444 🔗

That’s good to hear. We are in a minority of one in our town. Every other business has gone full-on with implementing the guidelines. I walked past a shoe shop today that has a little certificate in the window confirming their COVID safety!

46565 ▶▶ Peter Thompson, replying to Marcus, 17, #737 of 1444 🔗

Where is the scientific evidence ? who is actually pushing this ? what is for sure is mission creep will occur with masks and if it is made mandatory in shops then the next push will be for all public gatherings , restaurants, cafes etc. If people think it will be imposed for a month they are wrong it will be for a year or more and will be a regular winter duty.

Personally myself I wont enter a shop for anything 100 % essential whilst this imposition is maintained . Sorry retail this is going to kill you.

46582 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Peter Thompson, #738 of 1444 🔗

See a gov physcologist called Minchie she was in the guardian a few days ago speaking about puttibg pressure onto number 10 inorder to get mask compliance enforced.

46647 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Basics, 3, #739 of 1444 🔗

Professor Michie, I think. Nasty Unevolved piece of work.

46797 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnB, #740 of 1444 🔗

Thanks for correction. I just go by evil spectres.. names and titles mean little.

46589 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Peter Thompson, #741 of 1444 🔗

“if it is made mandatory in shops then the next push will be for all public gatherings , restaurants, cafes etc”

Indoor public gatherings? You can’t mandate mask wearing in pubs and restaurants.

46591 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to John P, 8, #742 of 1444 🔗

Bbc showing propaganda pictures of people at tables with food and masked up. Don’t be so ready to underestimate the insanity they are pushing.

46614 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to John P, 3, #743 of 1444 🔗

Want to bet?

46736 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to John P, #744 of 1444 🔗

In some countries they make you wear one to walk to your table, or if you need to use the toilet,

46738 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to John P, #745 of 1444 🔗

Is this how the government are intending to fend off the latest legal challenge regarding churches being closed? By mandating masks and then opening places of worship just before the court date? Muslims might not mind – their women have to cover their faces – but other religions do not cover faces.. And how can you sing wearing a mask?

46776 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, #746 of 1444 🔗

With determination!

46778 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #747 of 1444 🔗

Actually, if it’s only a “face covering” that’s reuired, you could easily sing in one of these – and they don’t obstruct airflow:

comment image

47051 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, #748 of 1444 🔗

Good idea!

46631 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to Marcus, 10, #749 of 1444 🔗

Serbian and Bulgarian tactics may need to be deployed.

46542 Hoppity, 32, #750 of 1444 🔗

It’s so easy to bleat on about all this lockdown nonsense amongst oursleves, online. As someone who lives alone (and who’s been ‘furloughed’ – I wonder what Thomas Hardy would have made of that word?), I find this place (Lockdown Sceptics) and others helpful. But when I look around and see what’s happening and how the majority of people where I live are behaving in public… I wonder what we might realistically be able to do to change any of it.

I was out in town today and thought, “Oh, maybe I’ll go in there and have a look at such-and-such.” Well, I was intercepted by a young bloke standing outside the entrance to the shop in question, who told me I had to stand “there”, pointing. There was nobody “there”. I just happened to be standing on the OUT part of the entrance. Meanwhile, nobody was trying to get out! No customers in sight, anywhere! So I just put my hands up, turned, and walked away. If that’s how Boris, Rishi and Co think ‘the economy’ is going to get back into gear, they are seriously mistaken.

46544 Hoppity, replying to Hoppity, 2, #751 of 1444 🔗

PS sorry for typos. I have my reasons (poor eyesight, srthritic fingers – attractive!).

46548 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Hoppity, 2, #752 of 1444 🔗

Don’t worry Hoppity, you haven’t done anything I haven’t done! I’ll keep making you look good by comparison to me!

46576 ▶▶ John P, replying to Hoppity, 3, #753 of 1444 🔗

You can edit your posts if it worries you.

Hover over the bottom right of your comment and a cog appears with the word “edit” underneath.

You may have to press the cog to get the word “edit” to appear.

PS: I edit my comments all the time. Perhaps more often than not.

46657 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to John P, 1, #754 of 1444 🔗

I never knew there was an edit button!

PS Just tried it no sign of the cog you mentioned.

Oops I take that back. Thanks found it!

46662 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella Donna, #755 of 1444 🔗

It’s there, but I think there’s a time limit on editing. Once it’s been posted a while you maybe cannot edit.

When you hover over it a message comes up saying “manage comment”.

46547 Nic, replying to Nic, 19, #756 of 1444 🔗

Iv got to ask how on earth can we afford even local lockdowns.
We are broke and even boris was pleading for people to try to get back to work and a more normal life. Today.
He wouldent lock us down again, would he?
There again that twat Hancock would luv to lock us all down again he despises us the plebs ,and we despise him.

46617 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to Nic, 7, #757 of 1444 🔗

Hancock is now a dead man walking.

46624 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Rowan, 9, #758 of 1444 🔗

Indeed. I wrote below that it is a miracle that no one has yet ‘lost it’ and shot him – but it may be only a matter of time. Mind you, you could say the same about Bill Gates..

46656 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Carrie, 2, #759 of 1444 🔗

It’s just as well we don’t carry guns.

46641 ▶▶▶ Chas, replying to Rowan, 3, #760 of 1444 🔗

I wish.

46557 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #761 of 1444 🔗

Don’t recall this being posted but hopefully it will lighten the mood a little.

I though we needed a caption competition.

46567 ▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #762 of 1444 🔗

Mum, look! There’s a digger over there!

46572 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Dave #KBF, 11, #763 of 1444 🔗

“Just a little deeper Mr Johnson, then you can lie down and try it out for size and yes, so can your friend Matthew over there”.

46584 ▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Dave #KBF, 8, #764 of 1444 🔗

“Never mind how deep it is. Just keep digging, sonny.”

46639 ▶▶ Chas, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #765 of 1444 🔗

Must I use my staff to whack a mole?

46707 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #766 of 1444 🔗

Is this the ditch you said I could be dead in?

46563 Nic, replying to Nic, 40, #767 of 1444 🔗

I’m sure boris and his inner circle are starting to panick about the damage they have done to the economy.
Jobs being shed at an alarming rate every day.
Meanwhile Sweden’have been proved right virus has all but gone in their country notice the MSM has gone very quiet on sweden .
Well done sweden you stuck to your guns and most of all maintained your freedoms and economy.

46570 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Nic, 6, #768 of 1444 🔗

What a relief to know that there’ll shortly be up to 30,000 jobs at ONS to make up for it, taking the 2021 census:
People are going to love doing those forms…

46596 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, #769 of 1444 🔗

And just to make it easier, they’re going to ask you to do it electronically – for the first time ever… Think they may be having a major brainstorming session on what to ask, as we speak. Currently includes:
Employment status last week
Reasons for not working
Looking for work
Availability to work
Waiting to start a job already accepted
Ever worked
Employer’s organisation name
Job title
Job description
Employer’s main activity
Supervisory status
Number of hours worked
Method of travel to work
Type of workplace
Workplace address

46640 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bruno, 2, #770 of 1444 🔗

Our dog eats ours.

46681 ▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to JohnB, 1, #771 of 1444 🔗

Mine too – don’t see the point of filling them out, the information has never been used i.e. the ageing population and what they will need.

46580 ▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Nic, 21, #772 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think they have a clue about the extent of the damage they’ve done. They’re like the senior managers where I work, i.e. in their own orbit, completely out of touch, and completely happy to be there.

46766 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Hoppity, 3, #773 of 1444 🔗

Yes. Ten quid off some junk food and no stamp duty on the cardboard box that’s going to be your accommodation this time next year. Brilliant!

47283 ▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Hoppity, #774 of 1444 🔗

I was once told by the factory manager that

“Your customers are ordering the wrong parts!”

No you dolt, they’re ordering the right parts, you just don’t want to make them. There’s a lot of it about.

46587 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Nic, 23, #775 of 1444 🔗

Sweden is unsafe to travel to on UK gov list. Just so you know. Not that I agree. Just saying how our Gov is. Spiteful, dishonest, toxic…

46597 ▶▶▶ Nic, replying to Basics, 15, #776 of 1444 🔗

Of course they are punishing sweden because they know sweden got it right,

46607 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nic, 19, #777 of 1444 🔗

Same with Albania and Bulgaria. Both countries where mass protests stopped the lockdown. No c19. UK gov say unsafe to travel to. They don’t tell you that on BBC or C4.

Thank god for Sweden.

46629 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 14, #778 of 1444 🔗

And yet the only people in masks here are a few elderly, frail looking, and a number of people of Asian ethnicity.. No piles of bodies in the streets or hospitals, I assure you!
Went out for a walk earlier this evening, and there were lots of people socialising in their gardens in groups – no social distancing either!!!

46616 ▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to Nic, 12, #779 of 1444 🔗

I see that the UK Government thinks it’s ‘unsafe’ (sic.) to exempt Swedes from quarantine. This bolsters the lies about Sweden being bandied around by the vile BBC and fellow travellers.

46627 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cambridge N, 3, #780 of 1444 🔗

I’m in Sweden, but all my relatives are in the UK. I really want to visit, but do not want to come while this madness is going on.. Besides which, I cannot afford to pay for accommodation to self-isolate for 2 weeks before being able to meet anyone..

46635 ▶▶▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to Carrie, 1, #781 of 1444 🔗

We badly want to visit our släktingar in Småland, so I know how you must feel.

46622 ▶▶ Jonathan Castro, replying to Nic, #782 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think they have a clue

46569 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 30, #783 of 1444 🔗

I wonder how much loot Boris has got put aside. While the vast majority of the public seem quite enthusiastic about mask wearing – to the extent of choosing or customising their mask to express their individuality – Boris’s source of income used to be his humour and wit, writing about liberty and the rights of freeborn Englishmen, for right-of-centre publications.

Hopefully he won’t be PM for too long, and when he’s gone, his frankly embarrassing demeanour these past few months should ensure that his core audience will never pay to read anything written by him again. Could be expensive for him.

46615 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to Barney McGrew, 26, #784 of 1444 🔗

Boris looks totally out of his depth, he is PM in name only. He could have put a stop to all this bloody nonsense and I hope he chokes on the Bill Gates shilling.

46633 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Rowan, 17, #785 of 1444 🔗

Have to say I am disappointed that people like Steve Baker are remaining silent over this – he gave a very good speech when the coronavirus act went through Parliament so I had thought he could be relied on to stand up for our rights – but no, it would seem not..

46644 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Carrie, 7, #786 of 1444 🔗

He’s probably been whipped into line.

You don’t get selected by the main parties to run for a seat in parliament if you display too many signs of having an independent mind.

46661 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Carrie, 5, #787 of 1444 🔗

YES! Where is Steve Baker? He was never shy to speak his mind before. Despite being a Lefty and a Remainer, I always admired him and was keen to listen to his point of view.

46770 ▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to TyLean, #788 of 1444 🔗

He is a gutless toe rag like all the other MPs….I am old enough to remember when there were decent ones in all parties…and I am a Righty and a Brexiteer lol.

46638 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #789 of 1444 🔗

How poor is that Mr Blair again ?

46764 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, #790 of 1444 🔗

Exactly – but he’s good at what he does.
I guess Boris will make a killing as an after dinner blusterer. Worked for the Hamiltons!

46773 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #791 of 1444 🔗

Not sure he would – who would turn up to listen to him, no one could afford to pay for those types of swanky dinners, and I actually think he’d be in danger of being lynched!

46574 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 14, #792 of 1444 🔗

Englishmen* MUST stand against this. MEN OF SHERWOOD!!!

*and ladies.

46590 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Sam Vimes, 7, #793 of 1444 🔗

I think there’s a grand chance it can be stood up to. Pitch forks have long been sharpened jp and down the land.

46600 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Basics, 6, #794 of 1444 🔗

Mine will have Fuck That carved on the shaft. I love the English language.

46605 ▶▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Sam Vimes, #795 of 1444 🔗

That’s a bit rude.

46628 ▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Hoppity, 3, #796 of 1444 🔗

Yes – must try harder!

46575 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #797 of 1444 🔗

Not that I watch any of them but I wonder how TV soap operas would have covered the current situation?

I believe they stopped filming them because if they had shown the madness we are going through, in the various soap operas, surely a few viewers would have though whoa what are they doing.

46609 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #798 of 1444 🔗

Imagine soaps with everyone in masks – no one would understand a word – the diction is bad at the best of times!

46761 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 1, #799 of 1444 🔗

Subtitles would be essential – which might improve a lot of people’s reading ability!

46731 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #800 of 1444 🔗

I’m sure there will be a nudgy socially-distanced soap coming to our screens soon…

46586 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 4, #801 of 1444 🔗

Sorry to post BBC but this guy is a bit of a hero:


Neverspoons App – must have been dreamt up over a few pints!

46603 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Sarigan, 15, #802 of 1444 🔗

Playing devils advocate, the Spoons near me is actually leading the charge against many of these daft guidelines. Lots of the independents are so shit scared of losing their licenses, they have been demanding details at the door, sitting people down etc. It is the Spoons which has been the most relaxed – stressing at the door that handgel and details being left are strictly voluntary. When this info is relayed back to the other pubs, they have then relaxed their nonsense.

46634 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #803 of 1444 🔗

Had a lovely Spoons lunch today. Apart from having a very short wait outside it was more or less normal inside. Not a mask in sight anywhere, lots of perspex at the bar and a couple of discrete separating partitions but otherwise you wouldn’t have known something was going on. Track and trace forms in a box next to the menu but not even pointed out. I confess though to have filled it out, had to ask the waitress for a pen. If Spoons can do it (cheap as well) others can do.

46648 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to davews, 10, #804 of 1444 🔗

Why did you go the extra mile to fill out the form?

46914 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Victoria, 2, #805 of 1444 🔗

Had a decent breakfast on 4th at Leading Light here. On the front of the form I wrote (with the pencil provided) that ‘they’ (NHS Trace and Track) had my email and phone from the app transaction. On the back I thanked the staff for opening and left a note for NHS T&T should anyone ever look at the form again.
‘This ritual will not cover up HMG’s responsibility for the catastrophe you have caused by panicking and being ignorant of science. Clearing hospitals and seeding infection into nursing homes. 100 days incarceration of the young, fit and well. Preventing treatment of serious illnesses. Preventing solace for the dying. Denying education with the poorest worst damaged. Crashing the economy because you could not admit your catastrophic error.’

46757 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tom Blackburn, #806 of 1444 🔗

Good for Spoons! If the businesses had the sense to confer and work together to fulfil the guidelines as minimally as possible, they’d be able to find workable solutions much more quickly.

46917 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Cheezilla, #807 of 1444 🔗

My experience was improved by the well designed screens and wider spaced tables. Sat in the window effectively in my own little booth like pubs of old.

46611 Cambridge N, replying to Cambridge N, 19, #808 of 1444 🔗

Theodore Dalrymple on political correctness. Some resonance with our current situation, I think, especially his observation about obvious lies.

“Political correctness is communist propaganda writ small. In my study of communist societies, I came to the conclusion that the purpose of communist propaganda was not to persuade or convince, not to inform, but to humiliate; and therefore, the less it corresponded to reality the better. When people are forced to remain silent when they are being told the most obvious lies, or even worse when they are forced to repeat the lies themselves, they lose once and for all their sense of probity. To assent to obvious lies is in some small way to become evil oneself. One’s standing to resist anything is thus eroded, and even destroyed. A society of emasculated liars is easy to control. I think if you examine political correctness, it has the same effect and is intended to.”
― Theodore Dalrymple

46626 ▶▶ Chas, replying to Cambridge N, 10, #809 of 1444 🔗

Political Correctness is giving up your own opinions to please @rseholes.

46621 John P, replying to John P, 23, #810 of 1444 🔗

On the day that the state broadcaster starts pushing the concept of muzzle wearing on the public, this from Prof Karol Sikora:

“48 reported fatalities today, in comparison to recent Fridays that is a very low number – 137 186 173 204 358. 512 new cases.”

Always a voice of calm and reason. He manages to sit on the fence without causing offence.

Meanwhile Captain Fuckwitt in number ten is seen in a shop muzzled. The only mandated muzzle wearing I want is for him and his wretched cabal.

46625 ▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to John P, 20, #811 of 1444 🔗

Saw a bedwetter masked father muzzling a tiny tot in the street yesterday. Upsetting and dystopian.

46637 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Cambridge N, 16, #812 of 1444 🔗

Child abuse.

46665 ▶▶▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to John P, 4, #813 of 1444 🔗

What has the NSPCC got to say, if anything?

46666 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Cambridge N, 2, #814 of 1444 🔗

Good question !

46670 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Cambridge N, 4, #815 of 1444 🔗

Nothing. They are only concerned with censoring the Internet and tracking all users.

46691 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cambridge N, 4, #816 of 1444 🔗

Virtually NO children have died from the virus in the UK, and only ONE child under 9 in Sweden…in spite of schools being open and no masks..

46712 ▶▶▶ Andy C, replying to Cambridge N, #817 of 1444 🔗

Yesterday, I drove past a lady at a bus stop who was muzzling a little girl who couldn’t have been more than 3 or 4 years old. It was awful to see.

46643 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to John P, 22, #818 of 1444 🔗

As seen on Twitter just now: ‘ How did we get from “we must flatten the curve” to “our way of life must change forever”?’

46649 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Carrie, 10, #819 of 1444 🔗

Because it was never just to flatten the curve this was always their plan.

46654 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bella Donna, 7, #820 of 1444 🔗

Agree. It was the entry point to a much grander plan – all routes lead to an Extinction Rebellion-style overthrow of Western capitalism.

46669 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to John P, 6, #821 of 1444 🔗

Why does he need a mask? He’s already had Wuhan flu, so he won’t get it again, and he’ll almost certainly be immune, so he’s not going to pass it on to others.

46671 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Tenchy, 5, #822 of 1444 🔗

He’s modelling behaviour for the sheep among us to copy.

46726 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to John P, 3, #823 of 1444 🔗

Yep, Monkey See Monkey Do.

46623 Chas, replying to Chas, 38, #824 of 1444 🔗

One thing that is apparent to me is that we need a change of government, None of the parties currently in Westminster is suitable. We need a brand new political party. It needs to consolidate the various different libertarian factions that we have. I had hoped Simon Dolan’s Keep Britain Free, Toby Young’s Free Speech Union or even Nigel Farage’s Reform Party would morph into a political unit that could replace the current incompetent politicians we have. Am I dreaming the impossible dream?

46636 ▶▶ John P, replying to Chas, 2, #825 of 1444 🔗

Possibly, but it’s an attractive idea.

I just watched Peter Hitchens talking to William Clouston, who I had never heard of, but who is apparently leader of the SDP. Link here:


I thought it was an interesting and thoughtful political discussion. (PS: I am not advocating for the SDP!)

46742 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to John P, #826 of 1444 🔗

Yes some good points made, especially about tribal voting and feudalism.
It’s a pity Hitchens has such a bad habit of drowning out his interviewer when they’re trying to make a point. I’ve noticed it before.

46642 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Chas, 21, #827 of 1444 🔗

Agree! Just saw this on Twitter, ‘ The British generally abide by the law and respect the rules. Unfortunately we have a government that is spectacularly out of its depth, and badly advised. It is increasingly difficult to take them seriously and believe we live in a rational country.’

46743 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 3, #828 of 1444 🔗

Unfortunately we have a Cabinet that has no respect for the law and doesn’t abide by normal social rules.

46645 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Chas, 14, #829 of 1444 🔗

Agree. We desperately need a new political party that will fight for our rights and liberties.

46749 ▶▶▶ Belinda, replying to Victoria, #830 of 1444 🔗

How about the Unlocked Party, to remind peeps never ever to fall for such nonsense ever again?

46653 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Chas, 14, #831 of 1444 🔗

Our government is following The Science (faint sound of choir). Ok, get your etymological dictionaries out – you know you’ve got them in your anorak pocket.

The word “Science” means “Knowledge”. Not modelling, predictions, guesses or “what we think”, but what we bloody well KNOW. From experiment, from test, from repeated checking.

None of these are what the gov is following.

46704 ▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #832 of 1444 🔗

Modelling is basically just gambling, there’s no difference between the models Ferguson uses to me having a system that I use to predict horse race winners.

46771 ▶▶▶▶ Peter Thompson, replying to daveyp, 3, #833 of 1444 🔗

Modelling is as relaible as Mystic Meg . As for cloth masks/ face nappies there is no scientific evidence that wearing them makes any difference.

46655 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Chas, 1, #834 of 1444 🔗

Clearly, something like this needs to happen.

46667 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Chas, 6, #835 of 1444 🔗

part of the problem – not the only problem is there is no opposition. Nothing rigorous has come from any party in a form of a check and balance about any c19 policy. Our sytem of government has failed. A coup has been suggested by wise people, the Parliament is not working for us the people.

Look at the oversight of the c19 monopoly money spending – what oversight?

46668 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Chas, 18, #836 of 1444 🔗

Something will happen. Either a new party or a mutiny within the Tory party. I hear too many people out and about saying they will never vote for this lot again. It will be filtering back to CCHQ. Boris is a disaster, Hancock has been getting a bit too big for his rather small and arrogant boots, Williamson is brain-dead, and the rest of them are missing in action. October is my month for mutiny.

46690 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 13, #837 of 1444 🔗

We need it before that! Before mask-wearing gets embedded into the population and starts to be regarded as ‘normal’..

46720 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Carrie, 3, #838 of 1444 🔗

On the other hand, if compulsory mask wearing sounds the death knell for Rishi’s star turn of ‘eat out to help out’, it might bring the whole house down?

46706 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 8, #839 of 1444 🔗

More jobs are being shed faster than you can say Covid 19 and I won’t be surprised if many people are getting restless. We might not even need to wait until October for people to riot, give it a couple of weeks we might see one.

46710 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #840 of 1444 🔗

–especially when they are expected to adhere to stupid rules, and made to feel like lepers very time they leave their homes, and with the constant threat of a sudden new lockdown at any moment ..

46747 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Carrie, 4, #841 of 1444 🔗

Exactly. My boycott still stands precisely because I do not consent to be treated like a leper and be on sufferance by tinpot Hitlers and Stalins.

46709 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #842 of 1444 🔗

More jobs are being shed faster than you can say Covid 19 and I won’t be surprised if many people are getting restless. We might not even need to wait until October for people to riot, give it a couple of weeks we might see one.

The weather has also been erratic and several consecutive days of bad weather will spell more disaster for shops, restaurants, pubs and visitor attractions. Once there’s several days of little to no trading, more staff will be laid off.

46680 ▶▶ Alice, replying to Chas, 10, #843 of 1444 🔗

I have the same dream! And I hope it’s not impossible – there are many of us!
Another name to add to the ones you mentioned in your post:
David Kurten
Jul 8
The Wuhan virus pandemic in London is over. There is no need to wear a face nappy! I would ignore this latest Covid-1984 advice, which is the exact opposite of the previous advice.

46701 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Chas, #844 of 1444 🔗

Will never happen, too many sheep always vote Tory or Labour as they are too scared to break the cycle.

46748 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to daveyp, 1, #845 of 1444 🔗

A lot of Labour voters broke the cycle last December. They’ll be so disillusioned with both the main parties they’ll be ripe for the picking – or they’ll give up their right to vote.
The latter will be a crying shame because, after serfdom, rotten boroughs, the Enclosures Act etc, brave people died to get the ordinary man (and eventually all women) a vote in this country and as such, it should be a precious thing.

46721 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Chas, 3, #846 of 1444 🔗

Farage is hardly competent.

46746 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Bella, 1, #847 of 1444 🔗

Farage is controlled opposition.Any time he has the opportunity to make a difference he backs away.

46646 DJC, #848 of 1444 🔗

The evil Irish Times again. It is hard to read this without thinking that there is some deep and disturbing agenda behind all this. Commentary detached from reality. Journalism as crass propaganda. It has become so unhinged that one is forced to reconsider many of one’s assumptions about the nature of governments and the class that serve them.


46652 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 4, #849 of 1444 🔗

July update available. Read the section “On the effectiveness of masks” then ask WHY ARE THEY BEING PUSHED NOW???


46664 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to T. Prince, 1, #850 of 1444 🔗

Interesting – especially the bit about masks4all having been started by a ‘young leader’ from Davos..

46716 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to T. Prince, #851 of 1444 🔗

Unfortunately, the WHO has just done yet another convenient about turn and declared masks effective against virus transmission. Fait accompli!

46722 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #852 of 1444 🔗

Yeah, but they’re not and who the hell in their right mind would take notice of the WHO?

46863 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Bella, 2, #853 of 1444 🔗

Who the hell in government is in its right mind?

47309 ▶▶▶▶ chris c, replying to Bella, #854 of 1444 🔗

People who won’t get fooled again?

46658 duncanpt, 2, #855 of 1444 🔗

Hugo Rifkind:
You’d think that Hugo would be intelligent enough and well educated enough to know hte difference between tax avoidance (ok, legal and in some views everyone’s duty) and tax evasion (bad, illegal and criminal, indulged in by, yes, nasty people).

Implicit in the quote from his article is that he doesn’t. How sad.

46673 thedarkhorse, replying to thedarkhorse, 27, #856 of 1444 🔗

It is deeply disturbing that a government is pushing its population to become performing seals. The virus has abated, there is no need for every one to have face-rags….and yet they are pushing it, I agree, why?? why are they doing it? Imagine the country’s people all going about their lives with just half a face on show. How easy is it to recognise people/ even your friends? Constant obliteration of the facial features begins to erode communication between individuals. It is abnormal. The end result is a country full of zombies, living cocooned lives, scared of others, abrupt mannerisms to avoid holding conversation….we are being treated like fools. If government mandates this mask crap, it needs opposing with all the strength we can muster. My fear is we will be betrayed bythe bed-wetters. I’m making plans now…if this does go through….to get all my food online and bulk-buy each time, enough to last for some weeks.
It’s utter madness. There are people out there who want the whole world masked up. We are heading for disaster.

46678 ▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to thedarkhorse, 7, #857 of 1444 🔗

Even worse than ‘Utter madness’, but the English language hasn’t got the vocabulary!

46775 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cambridge N, 1, #858 of 1444 🔗

I’d say it does, but that the words required are considered a bit sweary …

46788 ▶▶▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to JohnB, #859 of 1444 🔗

A thesaurus suggests ‘consummate stupidity’.

46684 ▶▶ John P, replying to thedarkhorse, 27, #860 of 1444 🔗

“There are people out there who want the whole world masked up.”

There are, but it’s not entirely the fault of the public. We have been relentlessly pummelled by virus fear-porn propaganda.

There was (is?) a psyop in progress to keep people afraid – government had the attitude that they had to scare people in order to get them to comply with lockdown restrictions.

A lot of people fell for it.

I’ve noted a few prominent commenters saying that this “project fear” is the most successful propaganda push any government has ever undertaken.

I really do think that MPs should be prosecuted and jailed for this.

46697 ▶▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to John P, 2, #861 of 1444 🔗

For sure, they have successfully scared the majority of the population shitless, if we believe the opinion polls. ‘PsyOp’ may turn out to be a very appropriate epithet.

46735 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to John P, 12, #862 of 1444 🔗

They should be prosecuted and jailed. But it is also the public’s fault for taking everything laid down for them as ‘truth’ and being too idle to do some independent research

46862 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Bella, 3, #863 of 1444 🔗

They are exactly like the animals in Animal Farm. Our ruling pigs are using ‘second wave/spike’, which the zombies always trot out mechanically, as the equivalent of ‘If you don’t do XYZ, Jones will come back.’ The one thing the animals were sure of was that they didn’t want Jones back.
Animal Farm used to be a GCSE set book. I bet it will be banned from now on, as it is in all countries with tyrannical governments.

46890 ▶▶▶ John Smith, replying to John P, #864 of 1444 🔗

Not just m.ps .

Anyone involved in this crime must face the consequences of their actions.

46687 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to thedarkhorse, 2, #865 of 1444 🔗

I’m still waiting for Boris to reveal himself wearing a top hat and cape…

Aah aah fooled ya…

46695 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to stefarm, #866 of 1444 🔗

I wish..

46734 ▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to stefarm, 1, #867 of 1444 🔗

Top hat, cape and a half-face mask.

And singing.


In Paris….

46689 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 7, #868 of 1444 🔗

A Novel Approach to treating COVID-19 Using Nutritional and Oxidative Therapies

Dr David Brownstein and partners treated 107 COVID-19 patients . “Our results were excellent: one hospitalization, no deaths, and full recovery (minus two patients still suffering from somewhat minor lingering symptoms). It was the most stressful time I have encountered in nearly 30 years of practicing medicine. It was also the most thrilling time. Before coronavirus made it to Michigan, I told my staff that we were ready for this. I stated, “For over 25 years, we have been practicing medicine for this situation. We have a particularly good track record of treating influenza-like illnesses using natural therapies. The first 25 years we were practicing for this very illness.  I believe our protocol for treating viral infections will work in patients who become ill with coronavirus.”

When COVID-19 made its ugly appearance in Michigan, we got to work. Our protocol of using vitamins A, C, D, and iodine along with intravenous and intramuscular injections of hydrogen peroxide, vitamin C, and ozone helped support the immune systems of our patients and they recovered.

When I received the FTC letter telling me to pull my videos and information about COVID-19 I was shocked. Tens of thousands of people were dying across our country and I thought I was providing an alternative treatment protocol that could help many. The FTC warning letter stated, “ “It is unlawful under the FTC Act, 15 U.S.C Sec. 41 et seq. to advertise that a product or service can prevent, treat, or cure human disease unless you possess competent and reliable scientific evidence, including, when appropriate, well-controlled human clinical studies, substantiating that the claims are true at the time they are made. For COVID-19, no such study is currently known to exist for the products or services identified above.”

Now we all have a study. For the last 2 months when I should have been blogging and talking with you, I was working on our study. I am happy to report the study has been peer-reviewed and published! Here is the link to the study and the accompanying editorial:

  1. https://cf5e727d-d02d-4d71-89ff-9fe2d3ad957f.filesusr.com/ugd/adf864_cc5004cfa84a46d3b1a0338d4308c42c.pdf
  2. https://cf5e727d-d02d-4d71-89ff-9fe2d3ad957f.filesusr.com/ugd/adf864_70a18d9a200f48d8ac5ebe2a703340a3.pdf

Here is the link to the journal home page (you must click the ‘Clinical and Translational Research’ box to reach the article): https://www.publichealthpolicyjournal.com/

46861 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Victoria, 1, #869 of 1444 🔗

I read this yesterday as I am using the Iodine Protocol he recommends and have been since last year. Really good to see the study published.

47166 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Victoria, #870 of 1444 🔗

Update – Censored :

Dr Brownstein “I had to remove Plan B (The Study) from my website. We are currently under legal counsel. As always, I will keep you posted.”

46696 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 10, #871 of 1444 🔗

Great article – a must read on real facts about face masks
Healthy People Should Not Wear Face Masks

As for the scientific support for the use of face masks, a recent careful examination of the literature, in which 17 of the best studies were analyzed, concluded that, “None of the studies established a conclusive relationship between mask/respirator use and protection against influenza infection.”[ R ] Keep in mind, no studies have been done to demonstrate that either a cloth mask or the N95 mask has any effect on transmission of the COVID-19 virus. Any recommendations, therefore, have to be based on studies of influenza virus transmission. The fact is, there is no conclusive evidence of their efficiency in controlling flu virus transmission. – Russell Blaylock, MD

  • The Pandemic of Bad Science and Public Health Misinformation on Community Wearing of Masks
  • Quarantining Healthy People – A Failed Experiment
  • Face masks decrease oxygen, increase carbon dioxide, and alter breathing in ways that increase susceptibility and severity of CoVID-19
  • SARS CoV-2 becomes more dangerous when blood oxygen levels decline
  • Masks are unnecessary when asymptomatic spreading of SARS CoV-2 is “very rare”

https://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/healthy-people-should-not-wear-face-masks ?

46729 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Victoria, 1, #872 of 1444 🔗

Thanks for this – excellent summary of all the scientific papers and literature available on one site!

46756 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, 6, #873 of 1444 🔗

Feeling thankful that as yet Sweden is not planning on masks..

Just looked at the stats issued over here today – there has been a drop of 124 (since Tuesday) in the number of people in hospital with Covid-19, and the numbers in intensive care have now dipped under 100 – to 99, which is a drop of 26 since Tuesday. A grand total of 2 (!!!) people have been admitted to intensive care in the last few days.

Eleven of Sweden’s 21 regions now have fewer than 10 people in hospital with Covid-19. Looking at the rate of discharges from hospital, I’d estimate that within 2-3 weeks these 11 regions will probably not have anyone in hospital with the virus at all!

46708 Adam, replying to Adam, 19, #874 of 1444 🔗

Managed to resist the temptation to comment on the BBC news website throughout this whole covid cluster f**k, as it gets me agitated arguing with brain donors, but I am afraid I relented tonight and commented on what I think of the government considering making face nappies mandatory in shops. I am so bloody angry about it.

I have ordered a plague doctor’s mask, which is what I shall be wearing if I am forced to wear a mask in my local Sainsbury’s. This arsehole government!!!

46730 ▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to Adam, 13, #875 of 1444 🔗

Just don’t wear one! Don’t even own one. Have absolutely nothing to do with them.

How can someone force you? Get you in a headlock and wrestle one round your bonce?

It is all ridiculous.

Just smile, say politely and firmly, ‘No thank you. I don’t wear a mask or any other unnecessary apparel. I do like to wear a nice pair of lacy knickers though…’
They don’t insist after that…

46752 ▶▶▶ Adam, replying to Little Red Hen, 4, #876 of 1444 🔗

Rest assured, I won’t be wearing one needlessly. I simply won’t support businesses that enforce it. But how can we not if we need to buy food and the supermarkets absolutely insist and don’t let you in without. Guess there’s online shopping, but that’s still supporting them.

46760 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Adam, 2, #877 of 1444 🔗

You could always try growing your own veg if your garden’s big enough.

Not an option for myself with a “postage stamp” garden, but some could do it.

When I was growing up my dad used to grow some and I am told my great grandad used to grow his own veg as well.

If you’re lucky you might get an allotment, but I think they have long waiting lists.

46845 ▶▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to John P, #878 of 1444 🔗

You can grow veg indoors also its more popular then you might think. Some people grow entirely under artificial light some use light through a window supplemented with artificial light.

46891 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Saved To Death, #879 of 1444 🔗

Indeed. They usually get Vietnamese 12 year olds to tend it though.

47028 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bruno, #880 of 1444 🔗

Economic recovery, a healthier population, and a different perspective on the current bollox. All good.

Maybe we should use 12 year old British kids, mind.

47093 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Bruno, #881 of 1444 🔗

I think you are referring to ‘the herb’ as its called, indeed you can grow herbs of all varieties too you can grow stuff that you cannot grow in a garden in this country.

Anyway I don’t think its ‘usual’ even with ‘the herb’ to get Vietnamese 12 year olds to tend it, I imagine that’s more the exceptional case. Indeed if you are married to a tory party MP you can get a license and employ minimum wage adults to grow it and become the world biggest exporter. For us mere plebs its obviously safer to stick to any other fruit, vegetable or herb.

46858 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Adam, #882 of 1444 🔗

Use click and collect. Book a slot, order and pay online, collect from outside store, all usually over within a couple of minutes.

46887 ▶▶▶▶ John Smith, replying to Adam, 2, #883 of 1444 🔗

Supermarkets are not insisting anyone does anything.

No one who works there has the power to compel anyone to do anything.

They are utterly powerless.

46755 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Little Red Hen, 1, #884 of 1444 🔗

“I do like to wear a nice pair of lacy knickers though…”

(lol) … hmm, yeah, but I’m not really into the cross-dressing thing – even in private.

Seriously though, I imagine they might bar entry to the shop if you refuse. I am currently thinking of how to minimise my visits to shops.

46758 ▶▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to John P, 5, #885 of 1444 🔗

I wouldn’t dare to presume!

They might bar entry… but they would be fools to.
I have posted this up earlier, but how would a petrol station/shop bar entry if you were unmasked when you already have their product in your tank…?

46762 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Little Red Hen, 1, #886 of 1444 🔗

lol, well okay, but I don’t usually buy groceries at a petrol station.

Might be an idea though!

46763 ▶▶▶▶▶ Adam, replying to Little Red Hen, 1, #887 of 1444 🔗

I thought about that earlier while at the petrol station after just reading about it. Guess that would be a good way round it

46759 ▶▶▶▶ Adam, replying to John P, 2, #888 of 1444 🔗

Hence why I am considering taking the absolute p**s on those occasions when I simply have to go in the shop, to e.g. buy food.

46765 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Adam, 2, #889 of 1444 🔗

I’ve got a “#nolockdown” tee shirt which I might wear if the shop is unavoidable.

46769 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to John P, 1, #890 of 1444 🔗


46768 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Adam, 4, #891 of 1444 🔗

I’m just thinking – it doesn’t specify *which part* of your face the mask has to cover – so why not just make a mockery of it and wear some kind of crazy Halloween-type mask in situations where it’s unavoidable? Most of those leave you free to breathe through both nose and mouth…

46777 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Adam, replying to Carrie, #892 of 1444 🔗

I intend to Carrie, hence why I ordered a plague doctor’s mask tonight haha. Quite like John Pretty’s tee-shirt idea too — good way of letting the sheeples know what I think of their new normal.

46781 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Adam, 1, #893 of 1444 🔗

Simon Dolan’s Twitter has a thread with lots of good t-shirt slogans – I posted a few yesterday..

46794 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Adam, 1, #894 of 1444 🔗

I went hunting for it again on Amazon to give people here a link, but I couldn’t find it. Then I had a brainwave and went back to my original purchase. It’s still there. Link:


46799 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Adam, replying to John P, #895 of 1444 🔗

Nice one, cheers. Think I shall be getting one of them!!

46860 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Carrie, #896 of 1444 🔗

Carrie that reminds me of the days when helmets first became compulsory when riding motorbikes. The law in Greece didn’t say where you had to wear the helmet, so everyone drove round with the helmet hanging from their arm 😂

47047 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to CarrieAH, #897 of 1444 🔗

On eBay you can get latex masks of Boris – maybe we should wear those!

46859 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to John P, 1, #898 of 1444 🔗

They bar entry, you find another shop which doesn’t.

46823 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Little Red Hen, #899 of 1444 🔗

That would be even more effective if you were a 6ft hairy bloke!

46857 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Little Red Hen, #900 of 1444 🔗

That’s the only solution.The mortality among plague doctors was high.

46711 GetaGrip, replying to GetaGrip, 26, #901 of 1444 🔗

Scotland calling.
Compulsory masks in shops here – you’ll be aware of this from the wider discussion.
One more observation if you’ll indulge me:

It Is Fu**ing Horrible.

Not just because masks are unpleasant to wear, restrictive to breathing, itchy etc etc.

Before everyone masks up, you don’t realise how much non-verbal interaction goes on subliminally in an environment full of strangers mingling, until it can’t.
The most important bit is called The Smile. It’s a vital part of how we negotiate personal space and avoid conflict.
Lose that in a crowded interactive space and the whole experience becomes edgy and passive-aggressive.

The evidence for masks reducing transmission of a small airborne virus is not robust, but in my experience compulsory use in a Western European population has the potential to be socially destabilizing. (OK – that was my Inner Scientist talking. I reckon the mask thing is basically politically motivated SNP bollocks but coming soon to another UK Nation near you).

46719 ▶▶ Hammer Onats, replying to GetaGrip, 14, #902 of 1444 🔗

The First Gauleiter will destroy retail in Scotland with her muzzle policy. Folk will wear one to go to the supermarket because they need food. For other purchases there’s the good old Internet. Amazon can deliver most stuff the next day, as can Argos. What’s the point of going to a shop if you are treated as a leper?

46728 ▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Hammer Onats, 7, #903 of 1444 🔗

The Spiteful Nannying Party are doing it to try to kill off any economic recovery.
Then they can blame the eeeevil tories for the damage caused by themselves.

46841 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Nessimmersion, 4, #904 of 1444 🔗

And that’s what this pantomime is really all about. Just like it’s a presidential election year in the USA

47212 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Hammer Onats, #905 of 1444 🔗

The point of high street shops is to ensure that some form of competition against online firms exists, that way online firms don’t get a monopoly and they have to keep providing good prices and good ranges of choices. If the high street dissapears it won’t be long before online shops seriously exploit the consumers as well as the workforce. Also, we need somewhere to spend proper cash, not just numbers on a bank’s computer, so it stays in circulation.

46727 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to GetaGrip, 7, #906 of 1444 🔗

I was in a supermarket awhile ago and Mr Bart was tempted by two herb plants that were reduced to clear. A muzzled woman tried to chat with us, bless her, she was trying to be friendly but we could only understand something like 30% of what she was saying.

We were reduced to being like the nodding dog in the Churchill insurance adverts just to get rid of her.

46856 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #907 of 1444 🔗

As my hearing isn’t great and I have to partially lip read, I feel very cut off if anyone is wearing a muzzle.

46895 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to CarrieAH, 3, #908 of 1444 🔗

I don’t have any hearing difficulties but even I had trouble understanding people who are muzzled. Majority of us rely on lip reading as a form of effective communication.

46786 ▶▶ Basics, replying to GetaGrip, 8, #909 of 1444 🔗

Getagrip. Absolutelylutely!
I’ve been banging on about the power of a smile til I’m loopy. Place is like a room of borgs without them. Eye contact is all over the place without facial expression.

Now tell me these physcopathic physcologists do not know the effect of hiding smiles.

46885 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to GetaGrip, 7, #910 of 1444 🔗

Was in Tesco (Glasgow) yesterday and a staff member informed me this policy is not being enforced.

At least half of my fellow shoppers were unmasked.

46976 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to John Smith, 3, #911 of 1444 🔗

Cheers John. Really good to hear reports like this. Of benefit to us all.

46713 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #912 of 1444 🔗

Did you spot this?


Boris Johnson has said the Government will be “very insistent” on the use of face coverings in shops and other public spaces, but appeared to rule out making them mandatory.

…. Friday, Mayor of London Sadiq Khan renewed his call to Boris Johnson to adopt the WHO’s recommendations and require the wearing of masks in shops.

Khan said:
“Businesses across the capital need to encourage customers back or they will not survive, and the widespread use of face coverings are a visible signal that Londoners are willing to take the steps needed to keep each other safe.”

Virus-free London??!!

46714 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 8, #913 of 1444 🔗

Khan was interviewed criticising Boris for not wearing a mask, but Khan himself was not wearing one – hypocrite!

46717 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #914 of 1444 🔗

A “visible signal” says it all really.

46723 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #915 of 1444 🔗

BBC News really pushing Project Fear and giving fake scientific reasons for wearing a mask.
This needs to be challenged – produce a proper RCT verifying masks stopping virions or else.
Note there are plenty of RCT confirming masks do absolutely nothing.

46791 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nessimmersion, #916 of 1444 🔗


46725 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #917 of 1444 🔗

Just seen him proudly wearing his mask.Then followed by the usual BBC propaganda.A few talking heads and members of the public all saying its a good idea.Expect the wearing of masks in public places to be mandatory soon.

46855 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #918 of 1444 🔗

They can insist as much as they like, up to and including trying to force one on me while I scream, bite and kick.
Boris must be possessed by an evil demon. All trace of his original personality (such as it was) has gone.

46883 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #919 of 1444 🔗

Has Khan not been arrested yet?

46718 Northern Chubs, replying to Northern Chubs, 25, #920 of 1444 🔗

Alas, I went to a Marstons pub and I have given it a 6/10 Dystopian pub rating. I read on here weeks ago that the CEO was a bit of sceptic, but I do recognise that he said he’d leave it up to the staff to use PPE as they felt comfortable.

However, we arrived in North Derbyshire to one of my favourite pubs (I can name and shame if that’s allowed/useful) and both the front and side door were open during this cold, rainy weather. We went in and were positioned next to the open door but said we’d rather not sit there. So we were put next to the log burning fire, which wasn’t burning any logs, and sat under an extractor fan on full blast.

The pub was 1/4 capacity so there was no atmosphere. No music to compensate for the extractor fan. We sat in the cold in our coats and ordered a main meal and a drink and left after an hour. I was up for a starter and bottle of wine before we got there, but that wasn’t going to happen. To be fair, the booze and food was exceptional as it always is.

There were signs up and stickers on the floor. We were asked for our name and number (despite already giving it to book the table). Hand sanitiser abundant. I didn’t partake in any of that nonsense. But the biggest issue was the staff were wearing…………… visors. Why? It was absurd. Thus 6/10 Dystopian pub rating.

Due to our early departure, we went to an independent pub on the way home that I give a 2/10 Dystopian pub rating. Hand sanitiser and name register only (again I didn’t partake).

So Mr Marstons. Sort it out. I won’t be going back to the ——— until that nonsense it sorted out. But then, I suppose I won’t be going to any pubs if they make wearing masks in public mandatory. I just won’t do it. They can f*ck off.

46800 ▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to Northern Chubs, 5, #921 of 1444 🔗

An iconic picture of Princess Diana shows her wearing a visor. Someone has coined the term ‘dianafication’ to describe a sentimental and virtue-signalling prediliction in the UK,

46830 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Cambridge N, 2, #922 of 1444 🔗
47044 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Northern Chubs, 1, #923 of 1444 🔗

On Simon Dolan’s Twitter he has posted that Marston’s boss has backed down on his previous promises – likely has been ‘bought’..

46737 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 16, #924 of 1444 🔗

Good question just seen on Twitter:

comment image
Replying to @AlexBerenson
If the droplets from asymptomatic people were carrying such significant virus load why is the PCR test so invasive then? Just spitting on it should be enough to trace the virus.

46739 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #925 of 1444 🔗

Good point!

46750 ▶▶ Ian, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #926 of 1444 🔗

Bloody hell! What a great point

46772 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Nobody2020, 2, #927 of 1444 🔗

Just breathing on it should be enough according to some…

46819 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to A. Contrarian, #928 of 1444 🔗

You’d have to have an immune system that was about f*cked.

46941 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #929 of 1444 🔗

From a website I read. Admittedly he does do some conspiracy theory stuff that is proved wrong later but quite often he’s been on the money:

The Coronavirus test is not credible and likely to be for clandestine brain access. They are claiming the virus wrecks the nervous systems of a large percentage of people, leaving lasting neurological problems and brain damage. But I’d like to ask – is it really a virus doing that, or are the tests doing that? Folks, the coronavirus tests themselves, in many cases, (there are probably different types) but in many cases they are obviously what is causing the brain damage. Easily explained: Many of the tests, (all of them that use the incredibly long “swab”) take their samples from the cribriform plate, which is a millimeter thick bone at the top of the nasal cavity that is perforated with many holes that go directly into the brain cavity. These holes are what your olefactory nerves pass through, and there are many (the bone is similar to a coarse screen)
If you wanted to sabotage someone by planting a clandestine brain virus, nano tech, or plant a chip in someone, this would be the place to do it because perhaps a doctor could get a chip out but individuals certainly never could without perforating that very thin bone (that is not really even bone, it is about half nerves) and anyone attempting to do an extraction from there would likely end up killing themselves. Any chemicals, viruses, nanotech or whatever else they wanted to put there will have immediate access to the brain and you can forget about getting that out, once it’s in, it is in. It would be literally right on the brain when placed, and go right in. People complain about the tests being excruciatingly painful with the pain lasting for days. For what reason would the tests need to touch the most brain accessible part of the human body? Are the ones that do really tests at all? DNA tests are done with a simple mouth swab, and it’s ridiculous to think any virus test – when you supposedly can spread it by coughing, – would not be the same. Something is screwy with these tests. They have GOT TO be fake, (or at least the ones that literally swab the brain are) No wonder why they hurt for days and GEE, getting your olefactory nerves nailed by whatever is on that swab is probably what is causing people to permanently lose their sense of smell.
COMMON SENSE. I bet you did not know how nasty that test really is. Avoid the test at all costs. My first post ever on this topic mocked the entire concept of a coronavirus being massively lethal. The obviously unnecessarily invasive “tests” strongly indicate this is TOTALLY fake and they are not tests at all. That’s why we end up getting Kiwi fruit testing positive and people who signed up and left before testing ending up positive, THERE IS NO CORONAVIRUS TEST IF THAT IS HAPPENING, no, they are doing something entirely other than testing and the close proximity to the brain really opens up a reason for questioning what those tests really are.

46751 Bugle, #930 of 1444 🔗

Why is Boris playing games over face masks? Why would he want them now, just as the virus is receding and just as he wants us all out and about? Either it’s posturing to show how concerned HMG is about our health, or it’s to keep the perception of threat going by giving us yet another reinforcement behaviour. Or he’s trying to create pressure to make sure we all accept the vaccine because we’re so grateful to take the mask off.

I’m not planning to wear one, by the way, and will shop where measures are loosely enforced.

46780 A. Contrarian, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #931 of 1444 🔗


On the Swiss site, a possible explanation for the very high New York antibody testing results that were discussed on this site yesterday, suggesting that herd immunity is only achieved with more than 60% of the population being infected:

In July, an antibody prevalence of allegedly up to 70% was reported in some New York City districts. However, this is not a population-based figure, but rather antibodies in people who had visited an urgent care center.

So probably not a sample representative of the population at all, and definitely not random.

46783 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to A. Contrarian, #932 of 1444 🔗

Elsewhere on that update it says 20% is high enough..

46789 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 2, #933 of 1444 🔗

From our brothers & sisters in the US of A …


46846 ▶▶ RyanM, replying to JohnB, 6, #934 of 1444 🔗

I went into my local gun shop today. There was a sign on the door that said “masks are required. However, there is an exemption for those with medical conditions. Hippa prevents us from asking about medical conditions. Therefore, if we see anyone without a mask, we will assume a medical condition and we will not ask questions.” (Not a direct quote, I should have taken a picture)

Lots of customers. No masks on customers or staff.

I bought a Sig p365 as my new carry gun.

46854 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to RyanM, 4, #935 of 1444 🔗

If that spirit spreads, the end of the bollox is approaching.
Help it in. Patronise only that sort of shop.

46792 Basics, 3, #936 of 1444 🔗

Ruply youtube channel is showing the Serbian anti lockdown protests live right now.

Been going all evening. Quite physical. But calm now.

46795 John P, replying to John P, #937 of 1444 🔗

For anyone who would like a “#nolockdown” tee shirt, here is a link:


46818 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to John P, #938 of 1444 🔗

Why are they always so expensive?

47209 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Cheezilla, #939 of 1444 🔗

Go to a custom printing shop, order a T shirt with your own graphics/text on it. Typically on the order of £10, so usually a bit cheaper than commercial low volume* designs. And you can pick a better slogan than simply #nolockdown”, for example parody the “3 part slogan” “green and yellow dashed border” propaganda with anti-lockdown elements to it.

*high volume T shirt designs, the kinds of things sold with graphics than simply “look cool” rather than specific graphics for specific messages ara a different matter, produced in such volume they can get down to £3 and still make a big prfit margin.

46798 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 6, #940 of 1444 🔗

They’re all pillocks . I despair…!!!

46844 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #941 of 1444 🔗

No they are worse then that they are tyrants.

46868 ▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Saved To Death, #942 of 1444 🔗

They’re both!

46801 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #943 of 1444 🔗

The Torygraph has a different take on the Boris mask position. They suggest it IS happening…

46804 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #944 of 1444 🔗

2 quid?! And I bet that was a photo of him whipping it off!

in confined spaces where they are meeting people they don’t normally meet

But those are exactly the situations where one instinctively keeps a distance!

46905 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #945 of 1444 🔗

Two quid! Withnail’s response to Danny The Dealer comes to mind.

46915 ▶▶▶ Cbird, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #946 of 1444 🔗

Apart from anything else…. So only people we don’t normally meet are infectious? Or we are only infectious to people we don’t normally meet?

What a fucking moron

46811 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown Truth, 7, #947 of 1444 🔗

Some good comments though!

Has anyone considered using one of those paper bags with a transparent window set in it.
Face it, If we’re going to be forced to look like an utter prat of ourselves, let’s make a proper job of it.

46814 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 11, #948 of 1444 🔗

I am a qualified medical practitoner with many years of experience. There is no reliable scientific evidence ,ZERO that supports the wearing of face cloths as a health measure to prevent transmission of flu or coronaviruses. The push to wear face cloths comes from a propaganda outfit and their message is echoed by the BBC and Guardian.
At work in the surgery  I wear one as I fear being denounced. Opposite me a patient is obliged to wear one because of the CCG policy. On average they are lifitng the face cloth, repositioning it , lowering it about twice a minute. I wish they would take them off. At least they wouldn’t be touching their face all the time.

46867 ▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #949 of 1444 🔗

THe Ned Kelly look.

46906 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Cheezilla, #950 of 1444 🔗

Y fronts is my plan.

46950 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #951 of 1444 🔗

i’m going to repurpose a string vest as a mask – or the other night i thought a crisp packet might be good, but then maybe just a paper envelope with writing on of “muzzled” or “baaaaaaa” (sheep) or “fuck boris” or some apt phrase.

I’m not one to draw attention to myself but this mask thing is really the last straw for me and i will not wear a conventional one. I wear snoody things round my neck a lot and best case i’ll pull it over my mouth for 2 seconds for the gestapo uniform parade.

What is this country coming to – i want to get out!

46972 ▶▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Sue, #952 of 1444 🔗

String vest idea: good one!

47032 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, #953 of 1444 🔗

Most of the comments are anti-mask, pleasingly – people have seen what’s really going on, it would seem!

46805 sam, replying to sam, 47, #954 of 1444 🔗

This was sent to me written by an anonymous doctor in Surrey:

I am a consultant at a major , regional hospital in Surrey. By major you can take that to indicate that we have an A&E department. I had agreed to give an interview to an anti lockdown activist in which I would have revealed my identity. I have since changed my mind and only feel able to give an
anonymous statement. I have changed my mind simply because that all staff , no matter what grade, at all hospitals have been warned that if they give any media interviews at all or make any statements to either the Main Stream Press or smaller, independent press /social media we may, immediately be suspended without pay. I have a family, dependents and I simply cant do it to them. I therefore can not reveal my identity at this time but wish to state as follows:

In my opinion, and that of many of my colleagues, there has been no Covid Pandemic, certainly not in the Surrey region and I have heard from other colleagues this picture is the same throughout the country. Our hospital would normally expect to see around 350,000 out patients a year. Around 95,000 patients are admitted to hospital in a normal year and we would expect to see around a similar figure, perhaps 100,000 patients pass through our A&E department. In the months from March to June (inclusive) we would normally
expect to see 100,000 out patients, around 30,000 patients admitted to hospital and perhaps 30,000 pass through A&E. This year (and these figures are almost impossible to get hold of) we are over 95% down on all those numbers. In effect, the hospital has been pretty much empty for that entire period.

At the start, staff that questioned this were told that we were being used as ‘redundant’ capacity, kept back for the ‘deluge’ we were told would come. It never did come, and when staff began to question this, comments like, ‘for the greater good’ and to ‘protect the NHS’ came down from above. Now its just along the lines of, ‘Shut up or you don’t get paid’. The few Covid cases that we have had , get repeatedly tested, and every single test counted as a new case. Meaning the figures reported back to ONS / PHE (Office for National Statistics & Public Health England) were almost exponentially inflated. It could be that Covid cases reported by hospitals are between 5 to 10x higher than the real number of cases. There has been no pandemic and this goes a long way to explain why figures for the UK are so much higher than anywhere else in Europe.

The trust has been running empty ambulances during lockdown and is still doing it now. By this I mean ambulances are driving around, with their emergency alert systems active

(sirens & / or lights) with no job to go to. This I believe has been to give the impression to the public that there is more demand for ambulances than there actually is. Staff only wear face coverings/ masks & social distance when public facing, as soon as they are out of public view, the masks come off and social distancing is not observed. Indeed jokes are made about the measures, and I have heard staff express amazement that despite warnings on packets and at point of sales, telling people masks are totally ineffective and dangerous , the public still buy them, because a politician has told them too.
We have cancelled the vast majority of operations and of these ALL elective surgery has been cancelled. That’s surgery that has been pre planned / waiting list. Non elective Surgery, this tends to be emergency surgery or that which is deemed urgent has been severely curtailed. The outcome of this is simple. People are at best being denied basic medical care and at worst, being left to die, in some cases, in much distress and pain.

46813 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to sam, 5, #955 of 1444 🔗


46815 ▶▶ TyLean, replying to sam, 5, #956 of 1444 🔗

Oh my fucking god.

46816 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to sam, 4, #957 of 1444 🔗

Thank you for writing this, People need to know!

46848 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to sam, 6, #958 of 1444 🔗

Thank you for this. What a dreadful reflection on our supposed democratic freedoms that you have had to write anonymously.

Would you send it again anonymously, to Simon Dolan to help his campaign?

46853 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to sam, 8, #959 of 1444 🔗

Thank you for posting this! It confirms what many of us knew inside ourselves intuitively.

46866 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to sam, 5, #960 of 1444 🔗

Can anyone explain then if all this is true why it’s happening? Why would we be exaggerating this when clearly if it’s gone we can return to work and play and celebrate the fact. I am still looking for this key explanation as until it comes the general public brainwashed/scared by MSM will keep following government advice.

46878 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, 11, #961 of 1444 🔗

It’s the coalition from hell – organisations with agendas, power hungry politicians, lazy, risk-averse citizens

46911 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to hotrod, 5, #962 of 1444 🔗

Key question worth asking is who benefits? You can be sure if there is a reasom for this it will be to do with a group who are benefitting.

To consider if a conspiracy is present then it is worthwhile examining what Icke calls Problem, Reaction, Solution.

The problem is caused to get the reaction required to bring in a preplanned solution.

Cause a Problem.
Get a reaction.
Provide the solution.

47034 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 2, #963 of 1444 🔗

Who benefits? Bill Gates and his cronies, likely with kickbacks from him to all politicians and organisations who have helped him promote the agenda..

47131 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, 1, #964 of 1444 🔗

And as Icke points out, the populace itself cries out for the “solution” – ie the draconian totalitarian measures they wouldn’t have tolerated before the crisis!

46949 ▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to hotrod, 2, #965 of 1444 🔗

Well, I did hear mention in passing on one news bulletin yesterday of the government’s wanting to overhaul/shake up the NHS or something. Maybe what’s been going on is designed to prime us for sudden, fundamental changes to healthcare provision in this neck of the woods? And some of those changes are already in place? E.g. ‘Hunt the GP’.

46975 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Hoppity, 2, #966 of 1444 🔗

See NHS Reset. Its a thing.
Also A&E becoming appointment only – I kid you not. NI NHS already plan to bring in during August.

46881 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to sam, 9, #967 of 1444 🔗

I am truly sorry for your predicament. However , you and your colleagues must find the courage to speak openly if we are to have any chance going forward.

They cannot sack you all.

46913 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to John Smith, 7, #968 of 1444 🔗

Completely agree John Smith. I wrote a long rant about this but think it might be OTT. The NHS workers need to get their priorites in order – they at present are not treating the human race with respect or dignity. I understand each has a lot to lose, but by god they need to get themselves organised. They know better than most the killing and other harms this has caused and will cause for decades.

Trying not to rant. Everything the NHS workers have comes from us and, where there is debt, from our children and children’s children. Now is the time to show gratitude to the nation.

Find ways. The generations before you were lions, what are you?

46990 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to John Smith, 2, #969 of 1444 🔗

I agree. Was it Edmund Burke who said something along the lines of “for evil to prevail, good men do nothing …”

It takes courage to stand up for what is right but there is power and safety in collective action surely.

47017 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to John Smith, #970 of 1444 🔗

(I’m pretty sure Sam posted the anonymous doctor’s letter, rather than the doctor him/herself).

46900 ▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to sam, 12, #971 of 1444 🔗

Is your source (presumably you know him/her) 100% reliable?

I only ask, because such a deep conspiracy by NHS managers to defraud the public by denial of a public service, is so extraordinary.

If so, this HAS to be spread more widely.
1. Those who have written to our MP already can cut and paste and ask for comment on what clearly demands a Parliamentary question.

2. Many of us know (directly or indirectly) frontline doctors and nurses – we should ask them if the situation described here is reflected where they work.

3. I hope Toby quotes from this post extensively in his next piece so it gets a wider airing.

46962 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to BTLnewbie, 2, #972 of 1444 🔗

I agree…. there is the potential that this could be an emotional manipulation tactic. (And if so, it worked), so we have to be able to verify this somehow. That said…. given videos I have already seen of nurses speaking out, of Dr. Scott Jensen (Minnesota senator and family GP) being investigated for spreading “misinformation about Coronavirus”…. it rings true.

Either way it’s scandalous that this can be taken onboard instantly by all us skeptics, because it means we have either been well and truly worn down…. or….. we’ve seen so much at this point that this becomes the next logical conclusion.

It’s like War of the Worlds. I keep wanting someone to say, “oh no, this is all a big show; wasn’t it great?!”

46963 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to TyLean, #973 of 1444 🔗
46970 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to TyLean, #974 of 1444 🔗
47019 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to TyLean, #975 of 1444 🔗

There was Dr Q on here a week or so ago too.

46903 ▶▶ mjr, replying to sam, 13, #976 of 1444 🔗

That is scandalous. I want to assume that it is genuine as it confirms what we already believe here. However as it is anonymous that cannot be guaranteed and so we must be careful.
Having said that, if it is genuine, i want to see it on the front page of a newspaper tomorrow. To that end, it must be possible for a sympathetic journalist (we know there are some sceptics out there in MSM land) to conduct a formal interview with the author of the letter (and so ensure that his credentials and veracity are confirmed)
Sam, can you contact Toby Young directly to initiate this

46909 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to sam, 7, #977 of 1444 🔗

Sometimes it is better to tell the truth and take the consequences. It can be liberating What sort of country do you want for your children? If there is to be no truth, liberty, or justice, then we might as well kill ourselves, there is no future

Sack a Consultant for telling the truth?………….. The people would riot in the streets

46957 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Cecil B, 1, #978 of 1444 🔗

Would they?

47022 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cecil B, 1, #979 of 1444 🔗

Agreed, except for the killing ourselves bit.

Imho, it’s always good – morally, tactically, and motivationally – to take some of the bad guys with us.

46912 ▶▶ Cbird, replying to sam, 2, #980 of 1444 🔗

Thank you so much for your bravery. This really needs to reach a wider audience. Can anyone here suggest how it could be publicised?

46919 ▶▶ ambwozere, replying to sam, 2, #981 of 1444 🔗

I’ve actually seen this going around Facebook which is actually rather good as statements like these tend not to go seen on this platform. Here’s hoping people take note of all of this!

46921 ▶▶ DressageRider, replying to sam, 3, #982 of 1444 🔗

Bloody Hell, this is a scandal of epic proportions. Like others I feel sick at the implications of this. Thank you for posting. How on earth can we get this into the mainstream?

47024 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to DressageRider, #983 of 1444 🔗

This sentiment has been echoing for at least 4 months, DR.

46964 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to sam, 3, #984 of 1444 🔗

Thank you for writing this. I had 2 strokes in January. I am only 52 with no health conditions so it’s counted as a ‘young stroke’. I had a follow up MRI Brain scan ( lasting over an hour) in the National neurological hospital at end of March. This revealed an anomaly that puts me at high risk of a brain bleed (another stroke) and a further surgical investigation is recommended. But I’ve been left in limbo since then as the hospital is not carrying out any investigative procedures. If I suffer a brain bleed the likelihood is brain damage or worse death. It’s not just cancer deaths.

46981 ▶▶ Howie59, replying to sam, 1, #985 of 1444 🔗

If this indeed true then I am aghast. The anonymous MD in Private Eye should blow the whistle in a respectable publication. If people are dying and a doctor says nothing because of their career then they are breaking their hippocratic oath.

47033 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to sam, #986 of 1444 🔗

Sam, Simon Dolan is urgently looking to make contact with this doctor for his case, so if you can link them up it would be great!

46806 sam, replying to sam, 18, #987 of 1444 🔗


Regarding death certification. All staff that are responsible for this have been encouraged where possible to put Covid-19 complications as reason for death, even though the patient may have been asymptomatic and also not even tested for covid. I feel this simply amounts to fraudulently completed death certificates and has been responsible to grossly inflating the number of Covid deaths. The fact is that regardless of what you actually die of in hospital, it is likely that Covid-19 will feature on your death certificate. I have included with my statement the detailed published guidance from Government on Death Certification which shows how Covid-19, as a factor is encouraged to at least feature on a death certificate. Remember Covid-19 itself can not kill. What kills is complications from the virus, typically pneumonia like symptoms. These complications are in reality incredibly rare but have featured and a large amount of death certificates issued in recent months. As long as Covid-19 appears on a death certificate, that death is counted as Covid-19 in the figures released by the ONS and PHE. I genuinely believe that many death certificates, especially amongst the older 65+ demographic have been fraudulently completed so as to be counted as Covid-19 deaths when in reality Covid-19 complications did not cause the death.

There have been Thursday nights when I stood, alone in my office and cried as I heard people cheering and clapping outside. It sickens me to see all the ‘Thank You NHS’ signs up everywhere and the stolen rainbow that for me now says one word and word only ; Fear.

There are many good people in the NHS and whilst I do not plead forgiveness for myself, I do plead for them. Most are on low pay, they joined for the right reasons and I did and have been bullied and threatened that if they don’t ‘stay on message’ they don’t eat. I know that if a way could be found to assure staff within the NHS of safety against reprisals, there would be a tsunami of whistleblowers which I have no doubt would help end this complete and brutal insanity. I am finding it increasingly hard to live with what I have been involved in and I am sorry this has happened. To end, I would simply say this. Politicians haven’t changed, the country has just made a fatal mistake and started trusting them without question.

46828 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to sam, 1, #988 of 1444 🔗

Regarding death certification, this has been discussed here today already. Be aware that there is very clear guidance laid down which doctors have to follow, here it is:
They must put on the certificate both the immediate cause of death and the contributory causes, which in an elderly patient with several co morbidities may be a long list. This is for the benefit of the family, who may be especially concerned about hereditary health conditions, and for public health tracking. In addition, Covid 19 is a notifiable disease, so where doctors have diagnosed it, whether or not it is the only or immediate cause of death, it must go on the certificate. It is hard to know in what circumstances the writer would include it as a cause of death if the patient had been asymptomatic; conceivably though a swab might have been taken from an asymptomatic patient at some stage, which then came back positive, even though the immediate cause of death was not CV 19. It would still have to be put on the certificate, along with the other identifiable conditions. As a consultant the author will have long experience of all this, including their own ultimate responsibility for what goes on a death certificate, even if completed by a member of their team; it seems they are suggesting something fraudulent about the completion of certificates, when what is perhaps more likely is the uncritical or deliberate ‘sexing up’ of the figures by politicians.

46832 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bruno, #989 of 1444 🔗

Has there been a change in Death Certing through the Covid emergency bill. I believe there were alterations to the normal procedure in Scotland at least. As I don’t know for certain I don’t want to give examples of what I believe to be altered.

46833 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Basics, 2, #990 of 1444 🔗

Yes and the link above gives you the up to date version.

46836 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bruno, #992 of 1444 🔗

This document appears to be the equivalent in Scotland. I am unable to read PDFs so may be identical.


46839 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Basics, #993 of 1444 🔗

No, these 2 links are on slightly different procedural topics, not how to actually fill in the certs.

46840 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bruno, #994 of 1444 🔗

Ok. Thank you for saying.

46877 ▶▶▶▶ steve, replying to Basics, 3, #995 of 1444 🔗

Sorry reply meant for you 😉
Two articles from ages ago describing the scandal that these utter fckwits in government are doing. Rage level now at defcon 5


And this


46898 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to steve, 5, #996 of 1444 🔗

Thanks Steve. As mentioned already. Other true stats will reveal their ‘slight of hand’. Flu death average falling during covid and care home death average is likely to drop in the coming months against the average. Both will indicate thr shoveling of bodies into the covid stats. In nonemergency times the idea of no autopsy and declaring causes based on a presented symptom would be seen as unsafe. One of the first things they *needed* was to declare the state of emergency. That was politically essential.

47039 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, #997 of 1444 🔗

Yes – see Ronan Maher on is Twitter account, also his article on Hector Drummond’s website where he explains it all!

46875 ▶▶▶ steve, replying to Bruno, #998 of 1444 🔗

Two articles from ages ago describing the scandal that these utter fckwits in government are doing. Rage level now at deacon 5


And this


46874 ▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to sam, 4, #999 of 1444 🔗

As soon as covid 19 was made a notifiable disease (05 March), death registrations ‘involving’ covid 19 went through the roof. This is what has been going on:


The only numbers that can be taken seriously are those of all cause mortality, and those have been below the five year average for the last two weeks, for the same period…..

Somebody knows what they are doing because covid 19 was removed from the list of high consequence infectious diseases on 19th March.

Pretty much everything since then has been politics…..

And for that there must be accountability…..a public inquiry…….changes to the law of the land…….

Any sign so far? That would be a big fat zero…….

46902 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tim Bidie, 5, #1000 of 1444 🔗

Ukcolumn have shown that around the world from the date that lockdown was brought in excess death rates above the average increased. From the very day an upward trend. They also show that before the date of lockdown covid was in the population but there was no increase.

Placing the date of lockdown on excess deaths charts shows a repeat pattern that lockdown caused the upward trend. Country after country.

46923 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tim Bidie, #1001 of 1444 🔗

It may be tempting to conclude that politicians engineered a falsely overstated number of covid 19 deaths toward some nefarious grab for power, but a moment’s reflection will make you realise this is nonsense. The fact is that a good proportion of people have been infected, a large proportion of those asymptomatically, with most of the rest having recovered without permanent damage. And among the cohort of frail elderly people who died, many will have been infected and died of it plus their other existing conditions, just as any form of pneumonia has finished off the elderly since the beginning of time. But it will be important to know, from the death cert statistics, that loads of people have had it, if that’s true. Hold that thought. It is important in getting places like Leicester out of a pointless lockdown.
As for the power grab, given both Trump and Johnson already had thumping majorities and huge public approval ratings before this started, what would ever have been the advantage in fraudulently engineering this sort of lockdown situation? They were obviously caught off guard, as have been their political opponents.

46983 ▶▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Bruno, 2, #1002 of 1444 🔗

You start from a false premise.

I have never believed that it was a grab for power. That would be to impute far too much ability to the protagonists.

In fact, the state, every state, as we have seen, is hopelessly incompetent, so everything state run is incompetent.

Where the central state has delegated certain powers, in Germany and Sweden, outcomes for individuals, in the round, have been markedly better than elsewhere.

As Dr John Lee, a retired NHS consultant pathologist makes clear in my link above, death registrations have been so unregulated since covid 19 was made a notifiable disease in this country that they are useless for the purpose of any lessons learned. The ONS here regularly quotes roughly 90% of deaths ‘involving’ covid 19 to have been directly caused by covid 19. In Italy, when they re-evaluated their covid 19 mortality figures, deaths from covid 19 reduced to 12% of the original figure. Britain will never be able to conduct such a re-evaluation.

We are, globally, paying the price for overmighty statism, a bloated, bureaucratic, public sector, run, as all public sectors are, by time servers promoted to their own level of incompetence.

The British government panicked, given cover by absurd models/modellers and pressurised by, amongst others, Macron, but, really, the eu.


Since then, all state actions have been geared towards the covering of backsides, as the scale of the incompetence and consequent damage to lives and livelihoods becomes ever more apparent.

In this cover up, the British state has been aided by, particularly, broadcast media with their own agendas centred on the massive public affairs market that is the U.S.A. particularly in this election year.

Only after 03 November, will the truth get out there………

How long after will largely depend on the result of that election.

It is because the stakes are so very high, so many fat stipends at stake, that the scale of dissimulation is so enormous.

47103 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tim Bidie, #1003 of 1444 🔗

I can’t believe that the current long drawn-out refusal to let us get back to normal is merely arse-covering.

Even if you’re right and they blundered their way into this, the opportunity has been created to finish Thatcher’s dream of demolishing the local authorities and they have seized it with both hands.

Watch as the NHS goes exactly the same way as British Rail.

47243 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1004 of 1444 🔗

Local government has been one of the most valuable features of our national life..’

‘The character of local government has changed vastly in the last four years. Local authorities have been denuded of many powers, some of which have been transferred to nominated boards under the control of Ministers. This conflicts directly with the Conservative principle that power should be as widely diffused and as directly responsible to the electorate as possible.’


As for the railways:

‘…. the UK government has taken charge of the passenger rail network. All commercial franchisees have been suspended for at least six months from today……the infrastructure manager Network Rail is a government agency….’


And the NHS is receiving another £6.6bn to cope with a common cold.

So, yes, precisely the same way as British Rail…..a self licking lollipop.

46946 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Tim Bidie, 4, #1005 of 1444 🔗

From what I understand about the HCID, that was because HCIDs have to be treated in very specialist isolation units of which there are very few in the U.K. downgrading meant that cases could be treated in standard hospitals.

46807 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 2, #1006 of 1444 🔗

Mixed messaging is the antithesis of good leadership.All we are getting from this government is mixed messaging. Appalling!

47011 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to OKUK, 2, #1007 of 1444 🔗

Yep. But it’s deliberate.

46808 Basics, 3, #1008 of 1444 🔗

Hong Kong (pop 7.5 million)

7 covid19 deaths total (4 in June)

46809 OKUK, 2, #1009 of 1444 🔗

If we now have a Maskist government I don’t want it.Time to decide Boris!

46817 Adam, replying to Adam, 47, #1010 of 1444 🔗

Precisely zero chance of sleeping tonight, as I am so bloody angry because of the mask wearing stuff. Row with my mother about it, who is really sucking this all up. Doesn’t feel her liberty is being taken away because ‘they are doing their best to keep us safe’. FFS!!!! We were never in very much danger — just how safe does she want to be?

This whole shitshow has really pulled me down tonight. I am bloody furious that our lives are being changed irrevocably without consent, people are sucking it all up, and there is not a damn thing we can do about it.

46821 ▶▶ TyLean, replying to Adam, 6, #1011 of 1444 🔗

I’m not on my third night not being able to sleep.

46822 ▶▶ TyLean, replying to Adam, 28, #1012 of 1444 🔗

We’ve just had a death in the family, and we’re being told not to come, because of the virus. 91 year old woman on her own for the first time in 71 years, and we’re not supposed to fucking go to her?!?!

Edit: We’re going anyway – fuck what anyone has to say about it. We’re leaving tomorrow (12 hour drive, best to start off fresh), but it’s more the idea that anyone would suggest we shouldn’t be there because of this virus that no one has.

46824 ▶▶▶ Adam, replying to TyLean, 13, #1013 of 1444 🔗

Sorry to hear that TyLean. It’s morally fucking reprehensible — separating people from their relatives.

We have my 96 year old grandmother in a home, and not been able to see her. Was more like a mother to me when I was a kid. Care home locked down, and had resigned myself to never seeing her again. Though just read tonight they may be allowed visitors soon. Also had my father in hospital twice because of heart attacks — not allowed to visit him either, though turns out he is ok now, but may well not have been. It’s all fucked up.

46829 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Adam, 6, #1014 of 1444 🔗

Thanks Adam! Hopefully you get to see your grandmother and father soon…. when all this kicked off in Italy, that was the thing that broke me down into tears. People scared in hospital and dying alone. I am so glad my mother died two years ago surrounded by most of her family and before all of this…. that’s a bit sick really, isn’t it? Being glad my mother is two years in the grave? Only to spare her this nightmare.

46831 ▶▶▶▶▶ Adam, replying to TyLean, 7, #1015 of 1444 🔗

Thanks!! No, I don’t think that’s sick at all given these appalling and damned right evil circumstances.

46852 ▶▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to TyLean, 11, #1016 of 1444 🔗

Same here TyLean. My mother died 2 years ago and I’m so thankful she isn’t still here! Her anxiety would be through the roof – she would never have coped with me being unable to see her for months. I was there every day. It’s inhumane and totally abhorrent.

46872 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to TyLean, 13, #1017 of 1444 🔗

‘People scared in hospital and dying alone’

Yes, that makes me feel physically fucking sick. What the fuck sort of a society have we become?

And our MPs, without exception, do and say fuck all about it.

Well done for going to see your relative. And as Sylvie says, take care on journey, as you are clearly v tired and upset.

I would go to jail before I abandoned a vulnerable relative.

I see from an earlier post that you have a 4-year-old. I do too, and a 2-year-old, and Mrs TJN and I are determined that we will bring them through this by setting an example of what it is to be human. One of the most basic tenets of being a decent human being is that you don’t abandon people in distress. I’m genuinely scared about what sort of a society we have brought our children in to. I can only trust that these dreadful days will pass, and when they do it will mean a lot to look back and know that we behaved as human beings, not drone-like ghosts and zombies.

To risk breaching Godwin’s Law, we know now how many of our fellow citizens would have behaved had they lived in the totalitarian societies of the past.

I’m so angry I’m struggling to express myself in this post, but hopefully you get the gist. I’d better stop writing.

47197 ▶▶▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to TyLean, #1018 of 1444 🔗

“that’s a bit sick really, isn’t it? Being glad my mother is two years in the grave?” Don’t be ashamed, I’ve lost elderly relatives at similar dates, they got to slip away happily and painlessly seeing their children looking forward to inheriting a bright future. I’m really glad they didn’t have to live through seeing their liberties so utterly crushed and their childern’s and grandchildren’s futures wrecked, some of them fought in World War 2 to defend us from totalitarianism, and served on standby in the cold war ready to let loose civilisation ending munitions if the soviets tried anything. They’d be disgusted by how the state has been abusing the elderly in recent months to supposedly “protect” them. Have your life end happily is far more important than prolonging it so it can end in fear and loneliness later.

46825 ▶▶▶ Adam, replying to TyLean, 4, #1019 of 1444 🔗

Just read your edit. Good for you!

46826 ▶▶▶ assoc, replying to TyLean, 2, #1020 of 1444 🔗

go for it!

46835 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to TyLean, 6, #1021 of 1444 🔗

Take care driving if you aren’t sleeping well, there’s no shame in pulling over and having a 30 minute nap! Don’t try and plug on, it’s not worth it.

46837 ▶▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Bruno, 3, #1022 of 1444 🔗

Thank you! On the bright side, at least you can stop for a coffee and a toilet break in Scotland again!

46838 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to TyLean, 3, #1023 of 1444 🔗

True! It’s still an awfully long journey though, hope you have someone to share it, and can do a couple of hours each in turns!

47201 ▶▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Bruno, #1024 of 1444 🔗

Looking at the stats, for most people driving 50 miles or so carries much more risk than covid. Take a break when you need to, it doesn’t hurt to arrive a little later than intended.

46901 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to TyLean, 7, #1025 of 1444 🔗

Do it. resist, refuse, say no, we will put up with this no longer

47073 ▶▶▶ stevie119, replying to TyLean, 5, #1026 of 1444 🔗

A friend of mines dad is 97. He was a tank commander in the war. He is now getting a bit frail etc. His live in carer wouldn t let him visit. I told him to tell her to fuck off and visit him anyway. He plucked up courage and did so. He wanted to hug his old dad but couldn t due to “virus”. Again, tell her to fuck off and give him a hug. What s the worst that could happen? He s 97!!!! And frail. Dementia is not helping. He won`t live forever for fucks sake!

46847 ▶▶ FrankiiB, replying to Adam, 16, #1027 of 1444 🔗

I’m also livid and not sleeping. It’s a terrible policy and I don’t think even Boris believes in it. It’s a flawed excuse to shut the WHO idolisers up and get the economy going. If enforced, it will have the opposite effect since it could further hit numbers of shoppers etc.
And the WHO fanatics will continue anyway.

46865 ▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to FrankiiB, 13, #1028 of 1444 🔗

Yep, it will have the opposite effect. I probably thought about going into 15 different shops on my little excursion yesterday, but ended up going into only 3 or 4 of them. Put off by challenges (stand here/there, do this/that) from sentries posted at the entrances. I still can’t believe how badly everything has been, and still is, being handled. If it weren’t for music, some nice weather, and being able to potter around at home, I’d have gone completely round the bend by now. The whole thing is surreal.

46899 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Adam, 7, #1029 of 1444 🔗

Proof that you are sane, don’t let the bastards grind you down

46820 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #1030 of 1444 🔗

Amazon delivery today. For the first time in weeks, the courier knocked on the door, checked my name and handed me the parcel. He was wearing a mask but it only covered his mouth, not his nose.

46851 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #1031 of 1444 🔗

That happened to me too! Handed me my parcels, no mask or gloves, cheerful smile – I felt like offering him a cuppa!

47194 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to CarrieAH, #1032 of 1444 🔗

I think delivery workers came to realise, early on, how minor this pandemic really is when compared to the ocean of media fearmongering surrounding it. The only time I saw one masked was in the first two weeks after Boris abandoned his wisest action ever (for a man I despise I can say that when announcing the herd imunity strategy to the nation he was properly statesman-like) to pursue lockdown delusion. Since a few weeks after the lockdown got, unnecessarily, declared the delivery drivers I’ve seen have all stopped wearing masks, probably from seeing so many households and so many possibly infected people they realised that the virus was much rarer than the media pretended and also much milder.

46879 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1033 of 1444 🔗

I’ve been doing that for weeks sans mask.

46927 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1034 of 1444 🔗

I had a Majestic wine delivery (cheers!). No mask, parcel handed to me and I even had to sign on the electronic gizmo – which was also handed directly to me and received back, bare-handed!

46827 TyLean, replying to TyLean, 7, #1035 of 1444 🔗

I have binder in my filing cabinet. It’s full of letters of correspondence with MPs, MEPs, State and US senators and representatives and government committees…. over a decade of responses to voicing my opinion to my elected officials (whether I voted for them or not).

For the first time ever, I am afraid to write to them. I am afraid of repercussions. I am not a fearful person!

46842 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to TyLean, 4, #1036 of 1444 🔗

I know what you mean.

46876 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to TyLean, 1, #1037 of 1444 🔗

Just the simple and democratic action of writing to your m.p is enough to earn you a file with one of myriad of intelligence services active in this country.

Bet you never knew that eh … ?

46939 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to John Smith, #1038 of 1444 🔗

No. And before now, I would not have believed that.

46849 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 5, #1039 of 1444 🔗
46864 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to wendyk, 1, #1040 of 1444 🔗

should be voice of sanity

46869 Ethelred the Unready, 11, #1041 of 1444 🔗

This muzzle nonsense seems an eleventh hour attempt to remove our individuality. Amusingly (to Ethelred at least), it brings to mind an early Human League lyric from a track called Blind Youth.
”Dehumanisation is such a big word, it’s been around since Richard the Third”
well, Phil Oakey was a seer, because this attempt at dehumanising us, certainly is a proper Richard the Third! (Cockernee rhyming slang applies)

46870 Hoppity, 5, #1042 of 1444 🔗

Who’d be a bus driver? “France: Bus driver dies after ‘attack over face masks’ in Bayonne” (BBC report).

46871 Julian, replying to Julian, 14, #1043 of 1444 🔗

In the best case scenario, the masks in shops thing is intended to get more people going to them, to get the economy going again – people are still fearful. In the worst case it’s another sign that the UK govt. has fully signed up to be part of the global pandemic industry, forever, and it’s a power grab.

Logically, you’d also impose them in cinemas, theatres, museums and galleries, gyms, and possibly even eating and drinking venues. We shall see. There’s at least once ice rink I know that is planning to make masks compulsory while ON the ice – impede your breathing while doing exercise.

I also wonder about offices. There’s not much incentive currently for the government to encourage people in offices to stop working from home, but longer term empty offices will wreck the commercial property sector, wreck city centre economies that rely on daytime footfall of office workers, and the train operators and TFL who will lose huge amounts of money. So in time we may see mandatory masks in offices.

46896 ▶▶ ambwozere, replying to Julian, 20, #1044 of 1444 🔗

I’d happily go back to my office to work but if they make masks mandatory I will refuse to go back. Add in the one way system around the College campus and there is no reason to want to return.

All these so called methods to keep me safe make me feel extremely anxious. It feels like discrimination now, just because I have a different viewpoint and how all these measures make me feel. It’s wrong fundamentally.

46928 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to ambwozere, 2, #1045 of 1444 🔗

It is discrimination for disabled people who can’t do the extra walking.

46953 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to ambwozere, 3, #1046 of 1444 🔗

Ditto, I’ve made my views on masks very clear to boss and colleagues, if he tries to make it compulsory I’ll refuse to wear and refuse to go in if he attempts to insist. Luckily, in IT, I could just find another job if need be pretty quick, others won’t have such luck in other industries and will be forced to suck it up and join the herd.

46961 ▶▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to Mark II, 1, #1047 of 1444 🔗

What will you do if you leave your job and all the new potential employers insist you wear a face mask?

46873 TJN, replying to TJN, 12, #1048 of 1444 🔗

Merchandise suggestion: a Boris Johnson voodoo doll.

46889 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to TJN, 2, #1049 of 1444 🔗

Loo roll with a black mask print.

Offensive but this whole saga is offensive.

47080 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to TJN, #1050 of 1444 🔗

I think a Bill Gates one would have a more far-reaching effect ….

46882 steve, replying to steve, 28, #1051 of 1444 🔗

The false positive rates for this horse shit CV test is between 2 and 29%.
From the British Medical Journal


Read that again! Up to 29%!!!!

Uk currently testing 100k tests per day and still increasing the daily Number of tests.

So between 2000 and 29000 false “positive test” gleefully reported by the media “infections rising”

I cannot begins to describe how much I hate the government now. The opposition party are also a disgrace for not even questioning it and continuing this charade

46965 ▶▶ guy153, replying to steve, 6, #1052 of 1444 🔗

That figure of between 2 and 29% the false negative rate. What matters now that prevalence is low is the false positive rate.

According to that document 95% is a lower-end estimate for specificity (in other words 5% false positives) which sounds realistic if a bit pessimistic.

The latest ONS survey tested 25662 people and found 8 positives. But with a false positive rate of 5% we would expect 1283 false positives, totally swamping those 8.

They give a 95CI from 0.01% to 0.06%. In other words they’re saying with 95% certainty that they reckon the true rate of positives is between 0.01% and 0.06%.

Besides the test accuracy, there is another source of uncertainty which is the sample size. A proper result would combine both of these usually using something called a “delta method”. This is how Ioannidis combined test kit uncertainty with sample size uncertainty in his Santa Clara antibody study.

It looks to me like the ONS are assuming close to 100% test accuracy and their result is mainly based on the second source of uncertainty, which is sample size. If I apply the sample size formula, assuming 100% test accuracy, I get a 95CI of between 0.0091% and 0.0532%. Not exactly their result but very close. So they are assuming close to 100% test kit accuracy.

Basically the only valid conclusion we can draw from the latest ONS test is that zero or close to zero people in the UK currently have Covid.

47023 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to guy153, 1, #1053 of 1444 🔗

..and yet the law now says that you can be detained (including kids) if you are suspected of having it and refuse to be tested..

46971 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to steve, 3, #1054 of 1444 🔗

I may be missing something but doesn’t the article say the false negative rate is between 2% and 29% rather than the false positive? Don’t get me wrong (I am still a sceptic) but we need to get our arguments right! I could be wrong but that was my reading of it.

46997 ▶▶ jrsm, replying to steve, 2, #1055 of 1444 🔗

I think one of the things that makes these false positive / false negative rates suspect is the circular definition of Covid-19. A negative test result appears to be defined as a false negative if repeated PCR testing turns up at least one positive result. Since you can supposedly have covid without having any symptoms whatsoever, I have no idea how they prove that a case is a false positive.

47146 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to jrsm, #1056 of 1444 🔗

You don’t ever need to identity an actual individual as a false positive. You just need to know the probability that she might be. This is no different to many other medical tests or any situation where there is only one test.

To estimate the specificity of your test you do need some known true negatives to calibrate it on. You can start by trying it on pineapples, papayas etc but really you need samples from people who you know don’t have the virus. This isn’t necessarily all that easy to come by however.

46884 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 14, #1057 of 1444 🔗

No doubt discussed below (so, apologies) but the Fraser Nelson article in yesterday’s Telegraph merely underlined the astonishing lack of comprehension amongst the most intelligent in the land as to what has been going on:

‘25,000 elderly patients were sent back to care homes between March and April – but this number was, if anything, smaller than the same period last year’

Daily Telegraph 10 July 2020

Has Mr Nelson not read the hopeless instruction to hospitals instructing them to clear beds:

‘To do this we need to organise the safe and rapid discharge of those people who no longer need to be in a hospital bed. The new default will be discharge home today.’


To compare that to the orderly hospital discharges of the previous year is, at best, unexpected from one of the country’s finest journalists.

He then goes on to say:

‘So what about the NHS then seeding the virus into care homes? If so we’d see a sudden boom in infections, but this didn’t happen.’

Has Mr Nelson not seen the leaked document from Public Health England showing how hopeless the covid 19 tests were in March?


The real lesson from his article is that covid 19 is a common cold coronavirus just as lethal in care homes and hospitals via nosocomial infection as a multitude of other common cold viruses but a globally lethal pandemic it clearly is not……but he won’t say so.

And my guess is that he and most others in his profession will not say that until after 03 November……..

46907 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Tim Bidie, 9, #1058 of 1444 🔗

And my guess is that he and most others in his profession will not say that until after 03 November……..

I wish I could believe this was just about the US Presidential election. I think the UK government is liking the almost limitless power, and will do almost anything to keep this going.

46987 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Julian, 3, #1059 of 1444 🔗

The COVID plot is deeper and infinitely more serious than the US kabuki presidential election. If Trump falls by the wayside because of COVID that will be just a bit of a bonus for them, but nothing more.

46918 ▶▶ Invunche, replying to Tim Bidie, 7, #1060 of 1444 🔗

Telegraph was only going to criticise a Conservative government for so long.

Clearly the “crisis” is just about over and accountability has begun.

Time to spin up the excuses. So far we have PHE, Care Homes, Civil Service.

Anyone but Boris and Cronies. They were just doing their best, bless em.

46994 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Invunche, 3, #1061 of 1444 🔗

This fake “crisis” is far from over. The real danger lies with the genocidal vaccine now being rushed to us by the great depopulator Bill Gates and shedloads of suborned politicians.

47030 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Rowan, 1, #1062 of 1444 🔗

Did you know Christine Lagarde is also part of the depopulation mob? Saw an interesting quote from her yesterday..’ Old people live too long and this is a risk for the global economy. We must do something, urgently.’

47262 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Carrie, #1063 of 1444 🔗

One could argue Christine is quite old, she clearly uses up more than of her fair share of sun rays. Perhaps she should lead the way.

47006 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Invunche, #1064 of 1444 🔗

Mainstream media near the top of the list.

46937 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Tim Bidie, 2, #1065 of 1444 🔗

Thank you Tim. A really informative post.

47025 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tim Bidie, 1, #1066 of 1444 🔗


46886 mhcp, replying to mhcp, 13, #1067 of 1444 🔗

Apparently in Eureka, California, a protester held up a sign with a picture of a famous black slave from Brazil (called Anastacia) wearing a mask/muzzle. The slogan was “Muzzles are for dogs and slaves. I am a free human being”

Of course fact checkers and Snopes pounced on this, along with others saying it was racist and has been used in far right things before.

Not the point.

Being forced to wear a muzzle is clearly akin to it being used on slaves in the past. So I’m wondering if in this great year of Woke, the simple reason you aren’t wearing a mask is Black Lives Matter, don’t you know.

It’s triggering and a reminder of the cruelties of slavery and oppression (and insert whatever wokeness terms in there)

Solidarity comrades!

47005 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to mhcp, 1, #1068 of 1444 🔗

We could maybe augment this by referring to the things as ‘slave masks’ ?

47074 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, 1, #1069 of 1444 🔗

Slaves have to work. Many of the sheeple are being paid not to!

So I think sheep muzzles is better – though face nappies sums it up!

47329 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to mhcp, #1070 of 1444 🔗

We’ve got a picture of kneeling Guantanamo Bay prisoners wearing those blue masks (over what look like full hoods) in our window with the slogan ‘as worn in Guantanamo since 2002’. (Sensory deprivation, distancing and stress position = known torture techniques.)

Stay strong; resist as much as you are able. I echo what others have said, we are not alone.

46888 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 14, #1071 of 1444 🔗

Some time ago, on another site, I predicted that the policing of societies would increase in years to come; it seems that I was right.

This is not a boast, nothing to boast about, but it’s happening so rapidly with an apparent widespread compliance.

Desperation and disgust are fighting for first place now.

Let’s hope that Simon Dolan’s appeal will succeed ,for all our sakes.

46973 ▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 2, #1072 of 1444 🔗

There are populations of hope in other parts of the world. Where people have rejected this. I want no part of what I see around me.

46892 Biker, replying to Biker, 40, #1073 of 1444 🔗

Maybe we should give up and just wear the mask. I’m sick of the stress. I’m about to go to the co-op for rolls and i don’t have a mask to wear even if i wanted to but it’s starting to get to me. Only kidding fuck the lot of them.

46933 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to Biker, 10, #1074 of 1444 🔗

God, you had me worried there.

46940 ▶▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to Gillian, 10, #1075 of 1444 🔗

Bloody hell ! Me too I thought if Biker has been turned we’re all lost! thankfully sanity returned at the end of his post

46893 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 7, #1076 of 1444 🔗

comment image

Remember Max Headroom?

The New Normal; we’re being turned into droids or a borg collective.

46897 ▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to wendyk, 3, #1077 of 1444 🔗

Isn’t that Lady Kir Stammer, the forensic quiffmeister?

46894 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 9, #1078 of 1444 🔗

The only story is the mass killing of people in care homes.

All the other stories pumped out by the spin doctors are hares run to divert the gullible public’s attention from what really happened.

Yesterday it was meal deals, so far we’ve had, second wave, track and trace, endless covid porn, facemasks, etc etc

For some reason Mr Nelson is towing the party line, any suggestions as to why?

46932 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to Cecil B, #1079 of 1444 🔗

He’s been bought by Bill Gates.

46934 ▶▶▶ Gillian, replying to Gillian, #1080 of 1444 🔗

Sorry, my reply was facetious. Just read comment below that right wing commentators have now turned to protect Boris. Sounds probable. Has Toby changed sides?

46904 Nic, replying to Nic, 30, #1081 of 1444 🔗

The Daily mail and express papers should be punished for the amount of scare stories they pump out daily
Today the Express says therr could be a xmas lockdown as cases will surge in winter.
Of course I know its BS but many people believe this rubbish and their opinions will drive government policy
I’m 59 and I cant see any way out of this feel.my life quality wise is over.
They could drive this on for years fear fear fear its political now im afraid

47014 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Nic, 2, #1082 of 1444 🔗

It was always political

46908 Biker, replying to Biker, 39, #1083 of 1444 🔗

Back from the shop and i was the only person not wearing a mask. Phew it feels like i’m the only man on the planet. Everyone looks so pathetic, you can see it in their eyes. They know it’s bullshit but yet they do it. This type of mass hypnosis shows you how normal Germans went from regular people to mass murdering lunatics. Once you’re joined the cult you’ll do anything for it. Later i’m going to the supermarket and it’ll be horrific when i’m the only person in their without a mask. All eyes are on you. The fact i’m not wearing a mask and i’m rather good looking will trigger hatred in the mask wearers, of me and of themselves, and in that moment the government has them.
Without joking i am concerned about my safety because i never thought everyone would be wearing them. And i mean everyone is wearing them. Holy fucking shit.

46916 ▶▶ Albie, replying to Biker, 10, #1084 of 1444 🔗

I’m hoping that in a few months time that CCTV will have been rendered useless by face masks and that conviction rates will have dropped to such a level through not being able to identify criminals beyond doubt that the police will be calling on the Government to scrap the wearing of them. Staff safety will be massively compromised but I’m sure if someone dies of a gunshot or knife wound that covid will still end up on the death certificate somehow.

46922 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Albie, 6, #1085 of 1444 🔗

“a few months time”? Heck, the lunacy surely can’t go on for months more?

46926 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to IanE, 7, #1086 of 1444 🔗

Settle in Ian. Think it’s wise to hope for the best and plan for the worst.

46943 ▶▶▶ Mark B, replying to Albie, 1, #1087 of 1444 🔗

They are working on it. A Chinese company said they have reached 95% accuracy for people wearing face masks.

46993 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark B, 1, #1088 of 1444 🔗

Mask, baseball cap pulled down low and funny walk – preferably with a pronounced twitch should do it.

46998 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, #1089 of 1444 🔗

Mirror shades are cool too. 🙂

47068 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, #1090 of 1444 🔗

I hate trying to talk to someone wearing those!

Just proves the masking thing is to make us all inscrutible. It also objectifies us. Powerful psy-op!

47001 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1091 of 1444 🔗

My creepy neighbour has been doing that for weeks.

46947 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to Albie, 2, #1092 of 1444 🔗

Or that will be the excuse why we all have to become “scannable.”

46938 ▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to Biker, 4, #1093 of 1444 🔗

I’m not. I’ve got a note from my Mum I wrote.

46956 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Biker, 2, #1094 of 1444 🔗

Biker -are you carrying a scrap of paper printed out from an official website saying “I’m exempt”, a similar image on your phone or if challenged do you just say “I’m exempt”? I’ve got a couple of days holiday in Edinburgh coming up and want to know the etiquette. Assuming of course that Wee Jimmy doesn’t shut the border or insists on quarantining virus ridden people like me.

46984 ▶▶▶ Guirme, replying to arfurmo, 2, #1095 of 1444 🔗

We have booked a break in England to escape the madness – we’ll give you a wave at the border!

47038 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to arfurmo, 5, #1096 of 1444 🔗

No i’ve nothing to prove it. You don’t need it. Just say medical reasons and you’re good to go. I hate lying about why i’m not wearing it but i can do without the fine or the hassle. This compromise sickness me to my core though.

46959 ▶▶ Guirme, replying to Biker, 11, #1097 of 1444 🔗

We’re boycotting the shops. If hardly anyone spends money, particularly in non food shops, any hope of an economic recovery is dead in the water. Even a relatively small number boycotting the shops will be the difference between profitability and business failure. I know from talking to others who are not militantly sceptical that the drudgery of a masked mall is seen as something to be avoided. Simple then – BOYCOTT THE SHOPS!

46969 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Guirme, 6, #1098 of 1444 🔗

I think this is reasonable. Seeing the sandwich boards pulled into shop entrances to block access shows they don’t want your custom anyway. It is only a certain demograph that I witness near the nonfood chain shops. Essentially the same demograph as the folk in Logan’s Run – not the Michael York band of rebels, the others.

47059 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Guirme, 4, #1099 of 1444 🔗

Don’t worry i’m not going shopping any time soon.

46985 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Biker, 5, #1100 of 1444 🔗

I’m really, really shocked, I didn’t think that there would be such compliance in Scotland – so much for Braveheart!

46999 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Moomin, 1, #1101 of 1444 🔗

Maybe a lot of the people with spirit are recovering from hangovers, or having a Saturday morning lie-in ?

47041 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Moomin, 6, #1102 of 1444 🔗

I’m shocked too. I can only hope it doesn’t last but i’m afraid the mass hypnosis has worked. Makes me proud to know that they can’t do it to me.

46991 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Biker, 6, #1103 of 1444 🔗

The more people see brave souls like you getting away with not wearing them, the more they’ll be prepared to drop their own. Sticking your head above the parapet takes a lot of guts Biker. Consider yourself a hero!

This is being brought in just when people were starting to relax and voluntary mask-wearing was becoming a rare sight – where I live at any rate. Granted, I don’t get out much but behaviour in Aldi last night was perfectly normal, only the perspex screen at the till was different from old normal.

My Amazon package was delivered into my hand – rather than being abandoned at the door – by a young man half-heartedly wearing a mask over his mouth but not over his nose.

We feel disempowered – because we are – but we are also in effect the enlightened ones and we need to set the example for others to follow. At least then we’re not giving up.

47050 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #1104 of 1444 🔗

My Granddad was a hero, he was in the navy for the whole war. He had medals and everything. If not wearing a mask makes one a hero then it’s a crazy world we live in.

47070 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Biker, 2, #1105 of 1444 🔗

It certainly is – but peer pressure is a powerful thing.

47081 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Biker, 2, #1106 of 1444 🔗

My experience yesterday, I was 1 of 4 shoppers not wearing a mask and I felt smug and normal. People looking at me thinking ‘he’s not wearing a mask, is he safe, am I safe. I don’t want to wear a mask but I’ve been told to’.

I was wondering what the true tipping point will be, crimes increased, masked rapists, muggers, robbers not being able to easily identified, a mass shooting in America??? There has to be a moment in time where people kick back and kick off.

P.s. pleasant warm day in Edinburgh today, lots of outdoor drinking to be done, let’s hope for widespread social mixing with no distancing and masked plebs passing out from the heat.

46910 Biker, replying to Biker, 23, #1107 of 1444 🔗

all i can hear in the ether is put the mask on, put the mask on, put the mask on. The siren call will get louder and louder until it drowns out all other thoughts and you’re consumed, drowned in the Morphic Resonance, unable to move from your chair. Then you’ll put the mask on and, like a hit of a straight vodka, you’ll shiver and then relax, then you become of them. All your worries will be over and you’ll forget how you once were. At this point this new Morphic Resonance will be your new life and the worst thing is you’ll not even remember the previous life.
In the words of Bill Shankly Some people think freedom is a matter of life and death. I don’t like that attitude. I can assure them it is much more serious than that.

46931 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Biker, 12, #1108 of 1444 🔗

I’d like to say it’s the thin end of the wedge but in reality it’s the middle of the wedge. Not happy with saving the NHS, daily deaths coming down, the R rate and pillar 2 etc etc, now they want us all walking around looking like prize plums !

46920 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #1109 of 1444 🔗

Does anyone know how to contact Toby here?

46929 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #1110 of 1444 🔗
46930 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1111 of 1444 🔗


46925 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, #1112 of 1444 🔗

I’ve tried 4 different browsers and not one of them shows the add picture icon at the bottom of the comments box.

Anyone out there in sceptic land have a clue what I’m doing wrong?

In the meantime a link (if i’ve done it right) to the picture I wanted to add:


46945 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Awkward Git, #1113 of 1444 🔗

Have you registered on the site? I have found that if not signed in sometimes I cannot add pics

46948 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1114 of 1444 🔗

Yep, done that.

It worked a few weeks ago as I posted a picture, now the little icon is gone and won’t come back.

No idea what I’ve done, my idea of computer programming is hit it with a fire axe. It will either work or you needed a new one anyway.

46955 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1115 of 1444 🔗

We’ve been saying this over the last few days. It’s because people are using the comments here like a Forum, this is a WordPress blogging site, it is not built to bea Forum. If people want to have a good experience start posting on https://lockdownsceptics.com which is a proper forum that we can start to build.and develop a community. There is once again over 1,000 comments on here making it very slow.

46936 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1117 of 1444 🔗

One way traffic in the comments section here !

46979 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1118 of 1444 🔗

Is there any other sensible way?

46942 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, #1119 of 1444 🔗

Got it working somehow, no idea how.

46944 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, #1120 of 1444 🔗

No it wasn’t, just a link but it works.

46951 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 9, #1121 of 1444 🔗

Rebooted the computer twice, icon appeared again so here is the picture:

46982 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Awkward Git, 4, #1122 of 1444 🔗

The slave and punishment masks leave the nose free to breathe. The corona masks are worse!

47021 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1123 of 1444 🔗

Please could you, or someone who has Twitter, post this on Quentin Letts thread where he has stated that he is anti-mask? The comments there are pretty much exclusively pro-mask – comments such as ‘it’s good you are going to stay home if you won’t wear a mask, so you won’t infect us’.
In fact it would be good if anyone who has Twitter could post some ‘anti’-mask facts on that thread!

46952 Scotty87, 28, #1124 of 1444 🔗

It seems the BBC are happy to allow those opposed to the wearing of masks to be described as “gammons” on their comment section, but I’m not allowed to respond by calling muzzle fanatics “sheep.”

I know this because they politely informed me that my comment broke house rules. No agenda to see here, folks…

46958 Peter Thompson, 5, #1125 of 1444 🔗

Most UK readers are aware that Australia is now experiencing the hysteria that we witnessed in March but magnified because of so many months of media 24/7 coronaporn.For all the nonsense appearing in the media occasionly there appears a sceptical article . This is from the Sydney Morning Herald .

” Setting aside how long COVID hangs in the air, the evidence for how well masks actually work to stop the spread of infection is more contested than you might think.
In part, that’s because there is no high quality direct evidence that shows asking the general public to wear masks prevents COVID-19, as the World Health Organisation says (the organisation, nevertheless, recommends masks).
One way to prove masks prevent the spread of COVID-19 is to run a randomised controlled trial. We don’t have one for COVID-19 yet.”


46966 James Leary #KBF, 18, #1126 of 1444 🔗

Like they used to say in the Soviet Union, “they pretend to pay us, and we pretend to work”.

Well, if they pretend that masks are a good thing, I’ll pretend I have a good medical reason not to wear one. Everybody happy. The pretend world goes on until sanity is restored, but I’m not holding my breath, to continue the theme.

46967 Nobody2020, 3, #1127 of 1444 🔗

The argument for masks:

Hardly anybody needs them
But we don’t know the few who need them
So everybody needs them

46968 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 7, #1128 of 1444 🔗

We once again have too many comments on here yet again making this site pretty much unusable and with loads of repetition. We’ve had two members setup forums https://lockdownsceptics.com and https://lockdowntruth.org that are made for the vast amounts of comments and the size of the comments that are on here. Also, these forums would help us to build as a community and to organise ourselves to start taking group action against the lockdown rather than as individuals.

46974 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 1, #1129 of 1444 🔗

The comments section here currently contain just under 60,000 words. So, the equivalent of 6 final year university dissertations!

47160 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to JohnB, #1130 of 1444 🔗

The uni’s all went cowardly and “Total Inability To Support Usual Pedagogy” this year. So plenty of those dissertations have been shortened, or requirements for them dropped, especially as unis knew they couldn’t expect proper student focus when the students saw their futures being ravaged by brutal lockdowns (some students recognised that the lockdown was the real problem, I can speak from personal experience of working with such people, but far too many students fell hook line and sinker for the clapping and zealotry). So I guess these comments are adding up to rather more than just 6 dissertations.

46978 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, 2, #1131 of 1444 🔗

You’re right but how to bring it about?

If, when we introduce a subject, we could post it in the comments section here, while including a link to its new thread on the forum where the discussion can follow.

It will have to be done slickly because the reason Toby’s comments section here gets so full is due to the spontaneity of the dialogue and it would be counterproductive to ruin that.

Anyone like to set us off with a workable procedure?

46989 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1132 of 1444 🔗

That sounds a good idea, Create a comment, put the subject, then a link to the thread on the forum. It would stop the chaos that is happening every time a blog appears on here.

46995 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 5, #1133 of 1444 🔗

Agreed. Maybe one forum rather than two though ?

This site is great for social updates, and for news from Toby and specifically-related comments.

But the forums can act as more of a database of information – scientific papers, other websites, expert articles, political shenanigans, etc. Plus a wide range of sub-categories connected to the lockdown – masks, the legal side, TTT, etc.

47016 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, #1134 of 1444 🔗

I’ve tried to start one, see above. It’s easy with Windows but people joining by phone will possibly struggle.

47015 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to JohnB, #1135 of 1444 🔗

Agree – since Toby stopped posting very day (fully understand the pressure on how btw), the comments quickly move to subjects other than the topics he has posted about. Unfortunately it does not seem possible for him to post a ‘blank’ new thread each day..

47018 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 1, #1136 of 1444 🔗

But easy to start one on the forum …..
It just needs to become a new habit.

46977 Ryan, #1137 of 1444 🔗

Right people.
Calm down.
This is all drivel and we all know its drivel.
The best option in not to get angry but ignore it.
I live in London and travel on the Tube and buses unmasked.
I have been stopped a few times on the Tube (never buses) and simply present this (I’ve printed out loads of them):

The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Wearing of Face Coverings on Public Transport) (England) Regulations 2020 – Reasonable excuse
4. For the purposes of regulation 3(1), the circumstances in which a person (“P”) has a reasonable excuse include those where—
(a)P cannot put on, wear or remove a face covering—
(I)because of any physical or mental illness or impairment, or disability (within the meaning of section 6 of the Equality Act 2010), or
(ii)without severe distress;
British Heart Foundation
Should I wear a mask to protect myself from coronavirus?
‘No. Wearing a mask if you have a heart condition is not recommended as it could / may make breathing more difficult.’

Once that is displayed I have never had an issue. You are under no obligation whatsoever to prove any of this.
It’s even better when on the tube the conversation goes like this after being questioned:
Me: Are you a married man constable?
Constable: Yes
Me: Are you embarrassed to tell your wife what you do for a living? Well you should be. Harassing people going about their business and threatening them with little bits of paper because they are not wearing a face nappy. You are an embarrassment. You should be ashamed of yourself. Is this why you became a police officer?
Constable: Just doing my job
Me: Go away and leave me alone.

The look in people’s eyes (I was going to say faces but they were muzzled and I couldn’t see) when they hear this interaction is amazing. Given this was the Piccadilly line with foreigners going to Heathrow, seeing a policeman being spoken to in this way was a shock to them.
I’m going to Loch Lomond on holiday in 2 weeks and have these prepared for North of the Border:

The Health Protection (Coronavirus) (Restrictions) (Scotland) Regulations 2020
PART 5 Interpretation and expiry
(b) any person under 70 who has an underlying health condition, including but not limited to, the conditions listed in schedule 2

SCHEDULE 2 Underlying Medical Conditions
2.  Chronic heart disease, such as heart failure.
8.  A weakened immune system as the result of conditions such as HIV and AIDS, or medicines such as steroid tablets or chemotherapy.

Don’t get mad.
Ignore them.

46980 Bart Simpson, 5, #1138 of 1444 🔗

Laurence Fox calling out Sadiq Khan on his hypocrisy:


Comments highly entertaining.

46988 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 16, #1139 of 1444 🔗

Notes from today’s bare faced test trip: not challenged anywhere.

Friendly greetings at Post Office, Pound Land, Greggs-(delighted to see that the young man who served me is a trainee; at least one company is offering some kind of future to young people), and greengrocer.

The latter is independent and doing well, thankfully. Proprietor wearing patterned material mask but invited me in; we exchanged the usual pleasantries and I left clutching my bag of spuds.

Maskerons by and large looked anxious and distracted and unwilling to make eye contact.

At least 3 more shops have closed down: estate agents’ signs proliferating.

How those in charge can fool themselves that this equates to any kind of recovery is beyond me: empty premises; masked cowed folk scurrying about and unwilling to greet ,let alone meet.

To repeat :Earth to the Dear leader-be careful what you wish for and no, I will not be clapping , offering slavish thanks, bowing,scraping, knee bending or pot banging tomorrow.

47013 ▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 2, #1140 of 1444 🔗

Not to split hairs… thanks for the update very good to read… is a mask needed in greggs? Its a food shop.. honestly I don’t know how to follow the rules.

47020 ▶▶▶ Gillian, replying to Basics, 2, #1141 of 1444 🔗

I dont think food shops are exempt from the mask requirement. Its any retail premises but excluding cafes, restaurants, bars.

47026 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Gillian, 1, #1142 of 1444 🔗

Thats what i mean I suppose Greggs is bordeline. Good news if coverings are to be used in there, loads were not yesterday. Even better they were relaxed and as normal.

47029 ▶▶▶▶▶ Gillian, replying to Basics, 6, #1143 of 1444 🔗

I should have added that banks, building societies, credit unions, other retail finance places and foreign exchange bureaux are exempt. Is this a tacit admission that masking makes clear, unambiguous communication difficult, such communication essential where money transactions are going on? It would be interesting to know the rationale behind the bank exemption.

47035 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Gillian, 7, #1144 of 1444 🔗

… the words i have about this farce! Covid 19 the evil plague abides by the rules to let people bank in peace before ravaging them as they stride outside again.

It is a tacit agreement that bank tellers are more likely to be harmed in a stick up than carry the virus off ‘to kill a granny’.

‘Kill a granny’ was used by the suits to condemn the street parties and beach goers. Have fun and kill a granny. Can you make this stuff up!

47052 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Gillian, 1, #1145 of 1444 🔗

Call me old fashioned – bank robbers ? 🙂

47066 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Gillian, 5, #1146 of 1444 🔗

The banks probably objected on security grounds and they no doubt have more clout that the hospitality and retail sectors – who do seem to have embraced the “guidelines” wholeheartedly.

47071 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Gillian, 3, #1147 of 1444 🔗

If this is*really* for HEALTH reasons then no one should be exempt – what are they saying otherwise? That this who work in banks etc are all super-immune to the virus, or that their lives are dispensable?

47042 ▶▶▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Basics, #1148 of 1444 🔗

Good news? Why so?

47048 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to arfurmo, 6, #1149 of 1444 🔗

Because people were ignoring the diktat as they used greggs. In and out, banter, smiling, normal. Not a hint of rebelling. Just normal.

47079 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Basics, 3, #1150 of 1444 🔗

Ah for one dreadful moment I thought you meant it was good that face nappies were mandated in Greggs. Paid for bacon sandwich with £2 coin yesterday. Woman had to sanatise her hands before picking up the virus ridden coin and couldn’t place the 10p change in my paw.

47139 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to arfurmo, #1151 of 1444 🔗

Bloody hell! I wouldn’t be able to keep my eyes from rolling at that. Local independants might be better, but greggs near me seem to be doing a fast trade.

47060 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Basics, 2, #1152 of 1444 🔗

No Basics; the staff are behind large perspex screen and are happy to serve. Very good atmosphere in Greggs.
Must be a decent company to work for.

47135 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 2, #1153 of 1444 🔗

Yes, noticing that Wendy, where the staff are cheery things are relaxed.

Just scored somr groceries from a co op. More faces than masks.

And of course the local independent shops are thoroughly dependable. A nice conversation starter is – where does it all end?

One strangers comment reply was “when there’s an antidote.” Sad face and sorrow, they knew the implications and would be able to follow all thoughts on this thread. Skeptics are out there in droves.

Wendyk. Unintentionally I feel like i sounded critical towards your post. Certainly did not intend go be. I am thankful to read yours and everyones comments here. It helps to process this slow motion disaster.

47156 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Basics, 1, #1154 of 1444 🔗

No offence taken Basics and pleased that you found the Coop to be reasonably normal.

47027 ▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 4, #1155 of 1444 🔗

Thanks also wendyk for an inspration that has come from your post. I realise it’s important for me to get out everyday to visit a shop or two. So that it does not become an overburdening effort. I’ll find good people in good shops as you have found. Thank you.

47284 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to wendyk, #1156 of 1444 🔗

‘Maskerons’ 😂

I for one am relishing the thought of my first visit to the bank wearing my balaclava.

47320 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to wendyk, 1, #1157 of 1444 🔗

Looks like you had a good day and it seems like shops in your area are being pragmatic but its sad that more stores have closed which leads to more people out of work.

46992 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 2, #1158 of 1444 🔗


Master and Servant Depeche Mode

Right for our times

47008 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to wendyk, 1, #1159 of 1444 🔗

I don’t want to play!

47010 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1160 of 1444 🔗

Neither do I! Good song though

46996 Bella, replying to Bella, 17, #1161 of 1444 🔗

I saw a post on my Facebook timeline yesterday from a friend, who should know better, about the moral superiority of wearing masks. I was apoplectic and she got it back with both barrels and I felt a bit guilty because she is such a lovely, kind person and my vitriol was fuelled by weeks of this nonsense. It was more sickening than usual because the person who write the article referred to a memorial in Covent Garden  marking the deaths of workers in the Blitz (or some such) and that they died for our liberty and for doing the right thing like wearing masks. (Yes, I know, ridiculous argument.)  Once I calmed down about the tyranny of it all I went back to my friend and said I’d wear a mask if these virtue signallers would commit to eschewing travel on buses, cars or planes (premature deaths from air pollution 40,000 p.a. road accidents 2,000 p.a.) and refuse to buy food brought in by these methods or by ship. If 98.95% of people have to wear a mask because 0.05% of people are infected then we should ban all travel by car as about 2,000 are killed every year on the roads (let alone maimed.) So about the same odds as wearing masks being useful and proportionate – it’s a justified preventative measure after all.

47045 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Bella, 9, #1162 of 1444 🔗

I had a similar exchange with a friend last week, though in person. Usually we exchange several e-mails, conversations per week: I haven’t heard back from her … She seemed aghast at my lockdown-scepticism, as though I was advocating the most evil reckless course of action. Sad …

47065 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to kh1485, 1, #1163 of 1444 🔗

I posted the swprs link on a Facebook group and someone told me they were unreliable – using wikipedia as their source for the unreliability!!!!

47063 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bella, 1, #1164 of 1444 🔗

Great reply – did your friend respond?

47099 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Carrie, 3, #1165 of 1444 🔗

Yes, she said she had no idea I was so vitriolic about masks. She works in the healing professions too. So I sent her that image comparing corona masks to slave masks and prisoner masks but, crucially, she didn’t respond to my statistic about car travel which seems to be a very fair comparison to me.

47358 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bella, #1166 of 1444 🔗

Could have been worse – you could have been ‘unfriended’!

47000 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1167 of 1444 🔗

This is an attempt to move some discussion away from Toby’s blog site and onto the forum, so things are easier to find on both sites.

I spotted this in yesterday’s Grad:

https://www.theguardian.com/society/202 … ct-control
Exclusive: health secretary said to be frustrated by his lack of authority over NHS England boss Simon Stevens

Some of the plans are to undo some of Lansleys demented changes but some are more insidious.

….. There is ministerial frustration at the role some health agencies have played during the pandemic, notably Public Health England (PHE), and a desire to make permanent some recent changes in NHS working, such as different NHS bodies working closely together, and the huge increase in patients seeing their GP or hospital specialist by video or telephone .

Here’s the link to the forum, comments invited, if only for practice :

47037 ▶▶ Cbird, replying to Cheezilla, #1168 of 1444 🔗

Thanks Cheezilla, good idea. I have joined LDT but am finding the response time is extremely slow. Anyone else find this or is it just my technology?

47043 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cbird, #1169 of 1444 🔗

Oh boy. We have TWO forums. I forgot. This could get complicated!

I just got straight into LDT no problem. Like their layout, I found the black hard work on the LS forum.

47049 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1170 of 1444 🔗

You can change the colours. 🙂

47056 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, #1171 of 1444 🔗

Thanks I tried. I’ll have another go.

47069 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, #1172 of 1444 🔗

Click on your profile name, gets you to Settings.

47107 ▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to Cbird, #1173 of 1444 🔗

Yes – I found this a couple of days ago – tried to post on an LDT forum (after registering) – the moving dots showed for 5+ minutes. I clicked away from the page and went back but it had lost my comment.

47057 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, #1174 of 1444 🔗

OOPS. Forgot we had two forums. Just posted the same here on Lockdown Truth.


See which you prefer to use!

47002 Gillian, replying to Gillian, 9, #1175 of 1444 🔗

I think we in Scotland are all, if we’re honest, at least slightly worried about going into shops maskless, not so much regarding the reaction of staff (the staff in the big shops are all chilled about it and have been instructed not to challenge maskless customers), more regarding being taken to task by other masked customers and ugly scenes developing as we stand our ground. But, thinking about it, the type of person who meekly accepts a daft (to put it mildly!) diktat from Sturgeon is likely to be lacking some degree of bottle and I doubt will be up for challenging a fellow shopper beyond maybe the odd acerbic comment uttered just within earshot. I would recommend not rising to any provocation, pretend that you haven’t heard the comment and move on. If the provocation persists, a firm retort in a slightly raised voice should be enough to discourage the cowed from persisting. Any thoughts on this?

47003 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Gillian, 11, #1176 of 1444 🔗

Surely just calmly tell them you’re exempt on medical grounds (it’s to preserve your sanity). No confrontation there.

47012 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1177 of 1444 🔗

This what I shall be doing; it succeeded yesterday, but I think that in time, a badge or lanyard will have to be shown to protect those of us who are baring the face.

47007 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Gillian, 17, #1178 of 1444 🔗

There’s no need to get into any algercation whatsoever. The moment you loose your temper or use loudness to force a point of view you lose.

Set an example of reason. Nothing more. Prepare to turn away and move on before a challenge so that you will freely do so if red mist descends.

Your conduct matters more that the words you speak.

My toughts.

47009 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Gillian, 7, #1179 of 1444 🔗

Also beaware you are overthinking because you care. Keep your eyes peeled many small shops ha ven’t even heard the news yet – you cannot blame them with so much gloom.

47046 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Basics, 2, #1180 of 1444 🔗

Punch ’em in the throat !

Oh, sorry, forgot where I was … 🙂

47225 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnB, #1181 of 1444 🔗

Haha.. it that your method… I prefer to twist their neck ’til it crunches!

47061 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Gillian, 9, #1182 of 1444 🔗

If the person calling you out is masked, just pretend not to be able to understand them through their mask!

47085 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to Carrie, 12, #1183 of 1444 🔗

I am thinking of getting some little cards printed with ‘I’m sorry.I can’t tell what you are saying,you’ve got a nappy over your mouth’ on them and handing them to anyone muzzled who talks to me.

47087 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Carrie, #1184 of 1444 🔗

Maybe they’ll start calling you in if you are wearing a muzzle. They’ll need the business.

47216 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1185 of 1444 🔗

True. The nappy rule, if enforced (which I doubt it will be) won’t just kill the high street, it’ll bury it ten feet deep.

47226 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to annie, #1186 of 1444 🔗

This is a good point. Will the rule be lifted from high street groups raising the alarm in weeks to come? It’s a possible hope.

47104 ▶▶▶ Panda, replying to Carrie, 1, #1187 of 1444 🔗

Now that is a genius idea. I’m going to try that out!

47356 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Panda, #1188 of 1444 🔗

Someone suggested the other day on here that you say something in response, but something that is not an actual answer to their comment, eg give the current time, or directions to some local landmark!!!

47278 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Carrie, 3, #1189 of 1444 🔗

I’ve actually already done this the other day. I was in a factory for work and one of the (few) masked morons in management came up to me, presumably to ask me to wear a mask. Or maybe to just ask me something else. I have no idea. I just kept saying “I have no idea what you’re saying” to him over and over again until he went away. He can either take his muzzle off and address me like a fellow human being, or he can fuck off.

47067 ▶▶ Mike Smith, replying to Gillian, 2, #1190 of 1444 🔗

Just tell them you’re following WHO guidelines. See above. I would have posted it as a reply to you had I read your’s first!

47088 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Gillian, 2, #1191 of 1444 🔗

Obviously you can’t hear anyone if they have a mask on

47215 ▶▶ annie, replying to Gillian, 1, #1192 of 1444 🔗

Courage will be needed, but it will be no worse than being hazed in primary school. Better, in fact, because nasty little primary-school bullies would not hesitate to thump you, but the zombies will.

47004 Bruno, replying to Bruno, 1, #1193 of 1444 🔗

Have been wondering about the role of air conditioning in spreading the virus, since reading this paper in April: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.16.20067728v1.full.pdf
It suggests that people sitting in a Chinese restaurant got it from others they’d never met before, because they were all sitting at adjacent tables in a particular part of the restaurant. The A/C was not bringing in much, if any, air from outside. Is A/C in the UK different, e.g.is it only to bring in and circulate external air?
I’m not saying it should, it would be a good thing in my opinion if lots of young healthy people became infected and recovered. Just wondering if the old and frail should stay away from some kinds of venues?

47031 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Bruno, #1194 of 1444 🔗

Ultra violet screens in A/C is that the future?

47036 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bruno, 1, #1195 of 1444 🔗

The elderly who are that frail usually can’t get to such venues anyway. As for the diabetics and the CHD people, they have the choice. Life is a risk for these people whatever they do. Eating out is always a risk for lots of reasons, including the journeys to and fro but we do it anyway.

47078 ▶▶ Peter Thompson, replying to Bruno, 3, #1196 of 1444 🔗

The Chinese restaurant is always used by the pro mask fanatics , however as this article shows the evidence is not there to support aerosol transmission


47119 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Bruno, 1, #1197 of 1444 🔗

As has been said on here and elsewhere many times, you can catch the flu and cold from yourself if you stress yourself or compromise your immune system in anyway. But if you hold to the model that is “spreads” then it may seem like people have caught it from someone else.

47147 ▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Bruno, #1198 of 1444 🔗

Air con is BAD. Why do we, in the UK, catch colds and other viruses mostly in winter? It is because air con gives hot stuffy rooms of recycled air, perfect for germs of all kinds to spread. Unlike countires which often get very hot in summer we don’t tend to have air con which works fr cooling, so in sumemr the air con goes off, the windows are opened and very little viral transmission occurs.We should ban air con and require all communal (offices, schools, shopping centres…) buildings to have large openable windows and simple short and direct air vents to the outside. Tolerate the thermal cold and say “f off” to the viral cold.

47040 Mike Smith, replying to Mike Smith, 12, #1199 of 1444 🔗

WHO recommends the following groups use medical masks.

  • Health workers
  • Anyone with symptoms suggestive of COVID-19, including people with mild symptoms
  • People caring for suspect or confirmed cases of COVID-19 outside of health facilities

Medical masks are also recommended for these at-risk people, when they are in areas of widespread transmission and they cannot guarantee a distance of at least 1 metre from others:

  • People aged 60 or over
  • People of any age with underlying health conditions

But Paragraph Two doesn’t apply because there is currently no widespread transmission. It’s Paragraph One that counts, and that doesn’t apply to most of us. So no need to wear a mask.

So surely a reasonable defence against accusations of recklessness etc would be to say that one is follwing the World Health Organisation guidelines and to take it up with them? Not a legal defence, I dare say, but might be helpful if confronted by some angry person in a shop.

The WHO also says that non-medical masks (fabric masks) are “ not sufficient to provide an adequate level of protection.” So that would be a reason not to be wearing one of those.

47055 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mike Smith, 11, #1200 of 1444 🔗

Until early last month, the World Health Organisation recommendation was against the wearing of face masks for the general population. The WHO reversed its recommendation on the basis of no new evidence.

47086 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Steve Hayes, 13, #1201 of 1444 🔗

The WHO reversed its recommendations as required by their benefactors

47222 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Victoria, 2, #1202 of 1444 🔗

The WHO are a shower. Starting with Tedros of such public health methods as – changing the name of Cholera means the empedemic goes away.

47102 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Mike Smith, 4, #1203 of 1444 🔗

They’ve decided to rewrite all the rules to be compatible with the utterly stupid way the world reacted in shutting whole countries down.

There’s no way they can simply say it’s ok now and just forget what’s happened.

47062 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 62, #1204 of 1444 🔗

I am not saying everyone who subscribes to The Telegraph is a Tory voter, but I am pretty sure Boris and CCHQ will be somewhat concerned about the comments to the attached. If they are not, they are even more incompetent that I thought they were:


Now more than 1500 comments. The most popular is:
Why on earth should the rest of us have to put up with wearing face nappies and compromise our own health, just because some folk haven’t done their own research and are therefore too scared to come out from behind the sofa? .. If the government persist with yet another stupid guideline like this one, I shall simply not go anywhere they are required to be used. I don’t need to go to shops or use public transport.

Second and third most popular, very similar.

Fourth most popular:
I voted for your lot. If you tell me to wear a muzzle I will do everything in my power to destroy your party. I will, and I bet thousands of others will too. Think hard you bumbling fool. If thinking is within your capabilities.

Fifth most popular:
There was a time, several months ago when this might have made some sense. Not any more. Several months ago I had high hopes for Boris and this government. Not any more.

47072 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 9, #1205 of 1444 🔗

One can only hope – but as they apparently sent letters to all party members asking for which taxes to increase (note, no suggestion of any tax CUTS), then it is clear what they are planning next..

47076 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Carrie, 10, #1206 of 1444 🔗

Husband is a member (has already made his opinion on various matters predating the current fiasco known to local MP, head of council and CCHQ). Have not seen anything – yet – soliciting views on tax. It is almost inevitable there will be some form of attack on assets because that will be what ‘the mob’ demands!

47083 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1207 of 1444 🔗

I guess we need to know what Dominic Cummings thinks about it. Anyone know of any pronouncement he may have made on the subject? I’m betting he’s not in favour of muzzles.

47090 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Tenchy, 1, #1208 of 1444 🔗

What makes you think he wouldn’t be in favour?

47091 ▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Julian, 1, #1209 of 1444 🔗

He seems, rightly, to have an underlying contempt for the whole lockup hysteria. Witness his total disregard for the dumb rules when he went to Barnard Castle. Maybe I’m wrong – just a feeling about the guy.

47122 ▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1210 of 1444 🔗

I don’t think so – he was clearly behind much of the Lockdown. He may be contemptuous of most of Westminster, but thinks even less of us plebs! [And the feeling is mutual.]

47178 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ petgor, replying to IanE, 4, #1211 of 1444 🔗

I still don’t understand why so much reliance was placed on the prouncements of that lockdown hypocrite, prof. Ferguson, who seems to have been wrong on just about every single one.

47144 ▶▶▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Tenchy, #1212 of 1444 🔗

Total decent disregard and a sensible view that all should have defied the lockdown, or merely the usual belief of the lockdown zealot “these rules are vitally important and everyone should obey them, except me”?

47165 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1213 of 1444 🔗

Well my understanding is that he has the PMs ear, and it’s well known that he was in some of the SAGE meetings
It seems implausible that he is not broadly in favour of current policy
The fact that he disregarded the rules is irrelevant- elites always disregard rules they make up for the plebs
Cummings is as culpable as the rest of them, if for no other reason than he hasn’t resigned

47189 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, #1214 of 1444 🔗

After the preposterous ‘Barnard Castle Defence’, from the man who many have held to be instrumental in engineering lockdown, so enamoured was he of Ferguson and his (less than) scientific and accurate modelling, I would not be prepared to risk it!

47084 ▶▶ Cbird, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1215 of 1444 🔗


47105 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1216 of 1444 🔗

I commented on that on the DT!

Not sure what the DT are up to though as loads of the “likes” have disappeared.

47117 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to CarrieAH, #1217 of 1444 🔗

I didn’t comment on that one. I have a suspicion that one or more CCHQ bods ‘police’ the site and downtick?

47120 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1218 of 1444 🔗

Ah, but they will just point out all the sycophantic fan-girl posts by that Caroline Bates creature – I often wonder if it is really a Miss/Missus and, instead think it might be a Master!

47121 ▶▶ Howie59, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 18, #1219 of 1444 🔗

I have a subscription. I posted this:
I am beginning to think that the population has been covertly drugged. Why in God’s name are face masks even being debated?

Self-made muzzles or the non-medical types available to the likes of you and me do not stop viruses. What they definitely do is reduce your oxygen intake and conversely increase your CO2 intake. You do not have to be a scientist or a doctor to understand this and prolonged use will most certainly have a detrimental effect on your health, making you MORE susceptible to contracting a virus.

The world has officially gone mad. Just read the comments section on any BBC coronavirus article since the breakdown began to gain a perspective of what the general population thinks. It is depressing beyond words. Previously normal, intelligent people have been turned into zombies, unable to think rationally anymore through fear of what they believe is a plague. I despair for our future, I really do.

47143 ▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1220 of 1444 🔗

That fifth most popular comment is very acurate. If we’d worn masks in early March, when the virus was rising to a peak on about the 18th, it may have reduced penetration of the virus in to the population. Although maybe it would have been a bad thing as doing so would have meant we didn’t get so close to herd immunity, that is if herd immunity has happened at far lower (20% ish rather than 60%) penetration than predicted then it might be the reason that the virus hasn’t spiked much in recent protest, shopping, pub and beach crowds. Hard to judge either way, all depends on the truth of whether herd immunity does arrive “early” with this virus, of which there still isn’t proper proof for or against. However, whether masks work well or not, and whether, on the hindsight of evidence we don’t yet have about herd immunity levels, we’d have wanted to slow the virus back then or not, they could have helped fight off something far more destructive than the virus, the lockdowns. Wearing them back then might have kept the bedwetters calm enough for them not to have demanded a hugely destructive lockdown. As it is now, lets put the proponents of lockdown on trial, have them jailed for human rights abuses, then (in the unlikely event that) if in autumn or winter there is a second wave we’ll declare a mandatory masking period but no other barbaric draconian governmental intrusions on daily life.

47064 Mike Smith, 18, #1221 of 1444 🔗

If fabric masks don’t do much, then I suppose if one is accosted by a mask-wearer and asked why one isn’t wearing a mask, one could reply, “Well, why aren’t you?” Unless they’re wearing a surgical mask, you can say it doesn’t count.

47075 Mike Smith, replying to Mike Smith, 24, #1222 of 1444 🔗

Kit Malthouse, the crime minister, has said there is a “common sense element” to wearing face masks.

Oh really? You mean when robbing a bank, for example?

We didn’t need the crime minister to tell us that!

47077 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mike Smith, 9, #1223 of 1444 🔗

You raise a very interesting point. Should we dismantle all the CCTV and general surveillance as it is surely rendered useless if part of a criminal trial?

47082 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1224 of 1444 🔗

I’d be happy with it all being dismantled.

47089 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 2, #1225 of 1444 🔗

Ditto, with the exception of unmanned train stations perhaps

47098 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Mike Smith, 5, #1226 of 1444 🔗

“common sense element” could be read as the evidence is weak.

Bit like when there was a hullaballoo about tax evasion schemes. They’re not illegal but morally wrong, similar line of thinking.

47108 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Mike Smith, 14, #1227 of 1444 🔗

Ton Hanks..”I have no respect for people that don’t wear masks”

Matthew Mcconaughey..”Wear the dam mask”

Me…”F*ck right off”

47110 ▶▶▶ TyLean, replying to T. Prince, 2, #1228 of 1444 🔗

Makes me embarrassed to be an actress.

47112 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to TyLean, 3, #1229 of 1444 🔗

Don’t be TyLean. By virtue of you being here, I don’t expect you to be given over to such sanctimonious BS!

47125 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to T. Prince, 5, #1230 of 1444 🔗

How many flu seasons has Mr Hanks worn a mask for i wonder. Or it it only people that die from COVID that he thinks need saving.

47168 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nobody2020, 2, #1231 of 1444 🔗

Exactly Nobody. Flu masks forever more at this rate.

Did oh wise Hanks deliberately not wear a flu mask? Or is he just jumping on a band wagon he knows is good for his own self serving skin?

47208 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Nobody2020, 5, #1232 of 1444 🔗

Some twonk on another site said I shouldn’t be selfish and should wear a mask as it could ‘save someones life’ (!!!) I asked if he kept his car in the garage in case he killed someone driving to Tesco.His answer? He was OK with that as he “wore a seat belt”.I don’t know how that would help if he hit Granny at a bus stop, but my head’s still hurting trying to work out the logic of that one.

47299 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to T. Prince, 1, #1233 of 1444 🔗

There’s no logic required to parrot something seen on social media.

47354 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to T. Prince, 1, #1234 of 1444 🔗

On the subject of Tom Hanks, there are some interesting films doing the rounds about him, that he has ‘disappeared’ and that all his recent interviews were pre-recorded a while back – despite supposedly having been recorded at different times, he is in the same room and wearing the same clothes in all of them. He has a film coming out and yet has not posted himself on any of his social media since mid-May..

47092 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 14, #1235 of 1444 🔗

I know this has already been mentioned, but surely used muzzles constitute bio-hazard waste. Special precautions are needed to dispose of it. Has this been addressed by the MSM?

47137 ▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Tenchy, #1236 of 1444 🔗

Except they don’t. Most people aren’t infected, so most masks are only “contaminated” which whatever was in the air they breathed in, none of which is any worse than what anyone without a mask would have breathed. In a healthcare setting masks need to be treated as hazardous waste, but in daily life they aren’t any worse than any other normal waste. Which means people need to stop chucking them away, reuse them as many times as possible. lets not have a resource crisis from disposing of too many masks. Lets not have every bit of outdoor space strewen with cast off bits of face covering, I’ve seen so many dumped on grass and in hedgerows, it is disgusting. The littering is often worse than the virus.

47328 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tenchy, 1, #1237 of 1444 🔗

Unfortunately concern for the environment has gone out of the window. I’m fed up with the amount of muzzles and gloves that I see during my walks and litter picking.

47094 petgor, replying to petgor, 12, #1238 of 1444 🔗

On the subject of Masks. Those who refuse to wear masks are neither idiots or irresponsible. Think about it for a moment, and here I am offering a layman’s opinion.

Those wearing masks will be destined for the entire period that they wear them, to breathe in and expel carbon dioxide. To wear them therefore, at times of heavy breathing whether engaging on sex or riding a bike or indeed both separately or at the same time, will, I would suggest, run the risk of damaging their health. And, as Veronica says, understanding a mask wearers speech, is difficult.

47136 ▶▶▶ Suitejb, replying to Victoria, 2, #1240 of 1444 🔗

Really interesting article and makes perfect sense. You really don’t want to be breathing in what you’ve just breathed out in addition to all the other stuff attaching itself to your damp and increasingly grubby mask!

47114 ▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to petgor, 7, #1241 of 1444 🔗

And when do those wearing masks stop?
If they see fit to wear one today – with the sun shining & the temperature up – as they are in my street, this very minute, will they stop wearing them when Autumn approaches? Or Winter?
If you wear a mask today, I guarantee you will be wearing one in perpetuity.

47124 ▶▶▶ Laura, replying to Little Red Hen, #1242 of 1444 🔗

This is what terrifies me the most. Mask wearing will be with us for years to come – because we must “protect against the flu,” and not everyone will get the “vaccine,” and so on. Anyone who doesn’t understand how the Germans followed Hitler en masse surely does today.

47213 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Little Red Hen, 4, #1243 of 1444 🔗

And if you DON’T, I guarantee you will NOT be wearing one, now or ever.

47249 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Little Red Hen, 1, #1244 of 1444 🔗

Flu masks… wby not? That follows on in their logic. Then further on in their logic. Covid masks not needed, vaccine instead. So Flu vaccines then?

I say flu because full is responsible for vast numbers of deaths every year.

This is shifting perceptions of risk, death and life. Will we soon see a day when people suffer shock from realising that death is inevitable for most of us at least.

47095 stefarm, 20, #1245 of 1444 🔗

Round of golf this morning, was chatting to the marshall, I asked when the stupid plastic contraption in the hole will be removed, rakes and ball cleaners back in operation.

Not until next season, didn’t I know that the virus stays on surfaces for 48 to 72 hours, can’t run the risk of touching stuff on the course.

Didn’t have the heart or energy to argue that the virus is no more and cannot be caught from surfaces or that collectively we have been playing golf for decades and routinely shook hands, shared bottles, cups, wee’d behind trees and then shook hands!!! shared food picked up rakes that have been shat on and wee’d on by all manner of wildlife and got changed in sometimes filthy changing rooms.

Apparently we are just following rules. No wonder there is no light at the end of the tunnel.

47111 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 12, #1246 of 1444 🔗

I’ve just ordered my ”face covering exempt” card (I’ll turn it into a badge with a safety pin and some tape.
Obviously I don’t know what my disability is because its hidden…


47113 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Major Panic, 9, #1247 of 1444 🔗

Your disability? ‘Acute Scepti-cytis’

47116 ▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to T. Prince, 8, #1248 of 1444 🔗

I have a severe case of Bare Faced Cheek.
It affects all of my face and sometimes my Sunday face (but only in confined spaces) and there is a cream for it, but it’s quite expensive and smells divine…

47115 CarrieAH, replying to CarrieAH, 7, #1249 of 1444 🔗

Here’s a few masks – I particularly like the “Make Orwell Fiction Again” one.


47127 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to CarrieAH, 8, #1250 of 1444 🔗

Got some really *lovely* flowery ones here in the Naughty-Step cafe!

I really like how people are coordinating their masks with their Boden & Crew Clothing shirts, it’s really lovely!

47177 ▶▶▶ Little Red Hen, replying to kh1485, 6, #1251 of 1444 🔗

I find the floral face masks – ie. those a la Cath Kidston – the most dismal. Ms Kidston’s business has gone under, thanks to the lock-up. That’s another 900 out of jobs.
I wonder if these newly unemployed can find a mask with an attractive all-over P45 print…?

47319 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to kh1485, 3, #1252 of 1444 🔗

Hi, just been to another ‘naughty step cafe’, run by our Middle Eastern friend. On a 10+ mile round cycle trip we saw very few masks, Boden, Kidson or otherwise. Apart from 2 puddled middle-aged women in a car, the others were a young woman out in the country (FB must have told her to), a nervous looking middle-aged woman and an obvious drama queen, male, 40+, who kept taking it off to eat his chips and puff on his vape. God that virus is clever, isn’t it?

It was the most normal day we’ve had since this horror started. Lots of happy groups, families, people sitting in and outside pubs no obvious antisocial distancing. Even the biggest Nelly we know, a retired academic who believes everything, managed to sit right next to someone else inside the cafe without a muzzle on. A lot of shops and cafes are still closed or only doing take-away but at least the stupid barriers have gone from the main road outside our friend’s cafe. Oh and I made a fuss of a very old lady’s cat on the way there and she invited me inside her new house to look round. I’m a stranger to her so how about that! (And no, she wasn’t remotely senile.)

If Johnson follows Krankie down the mandatory mask route, people will obey of course but I think a lot will push back as much as they can get away with. Unless you’re brain-dead, a little voice inside must tell you that this is nothing to do with any virus.

47132 ▶▶ wendy, replying to CarrieAH, 2, #1253 of 1444 🔗

I have gone mad …. do you think one with a picture of oral sex might cause offence?

47228 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to wendy, #1254 of 1444 🔗

Go for it! 😂

47123 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 13, #1255 of 1444 🔗

11th July 1984:

Gosh, it’s been a while since my last entry! I’ve been sooo busy re-writing the truth about face masks, like when Jenny Harries, Chris Whitty, Matt Hancock, Boris Johnson et al said that their effectiveness was weak or practically non-existent, it’s taken ages. I’ve only just recovered from re-writing the times when Johnson and Whitty said that the virus was ‘mild’, it took some doing changing it to ‘vicious threat’. Anyway, that seemed to work and I reckon that with the work the state media is doing promoting face masks, and with all the virtue signallers out there, the Ministry will have no problem making them mandatory. I personally think that they should make them all red, like the party colours.

47130 ▶▶ wendy, replying to Moomin, 3, #1256 of 1444 🔗

Oh so so funny. So glad I found this site other wise I might have gone mad x x

47133 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Moomin, 11, #1257 of 1444 🔗

If we are going to be forced to wear masks I am going for plain white background with 1984 in thick black bold letters.

47134 ▶▶▶ Swedish__flag, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1258 of 1444 🔗

I have a nice one with a Swedish flag on it, a reminder of who’s example (well done Anders Tegnell!) we should have followed from the start.

47163 ▶▶▶ Anthony, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1259 of 1444 🔗

Me too

47151 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Moomin, 2, #1260 of 1444 🔗

Great Kevin! Spot on!

47184 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to Basics, 1, #1261 of 1444 🔗


47128 wendy, replying to wendy, 3, #1262 of 1444 🔗

I keep going over the implications of the ONS care home study showing 80% of residents who tested positive had no symptoms. It’s mainly because my Dad lives in a care home and I try to think of when they will allow some sort of visiting.

Are the implications of these asymptomatic residents that they encountered the virus and have shaken it off with some part of their immunity system response and so the test shows virus particles but these are not infectious people? And if this is so does it imply that perhaps many people on the U.K. deaths list from/with coronavirus may well have been asymptomatic, ie had no effects of the virus meaning it was not the virus that caused their death and the positive test simply picked up virus particles?

I wonder if we can find someone to speak on this? Who I don’t know – a virologist?

Finding asymptomatic elderly people seems very significant to me. Any one any thoughts on this?

47150 ▶▶ Mark B, replying to wendy, 3, #1263 of 1444 🔗

I found it very significant too. The RT-PCR test is not designed to identify the complete virus, rather just a small part of it. So if your immune system has neutralised it the PCR test could still trigger positive because it has matched a virus fragment. The immune system response that is gaining more interest is the T cell response. Antibodies will directly detect the virus and kill it but people seem to recover with little or no antibodies detected. The T cells are part of your immune system that patrol and monitor what your cells are doing. If they know about coronavirus and find your cells have been hijacked and are producing coronavirus antigens they will cause the cell to self destruct. The good news is because Covid is similar to other types of coronavirus we have encountered it appears a lot of us are able to produce an immune system response.

47162 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Mark B, 3, #1264 of 1444 🔗

Thanks Mark, I don’t understand why government aren’t talking about this and making something of it? If the vulnerable elderly can fight it off with T cells it seems to me to be so significant to the understanding of the virus and to calling a halt to the destruction of, well everything really.

It’s exactly what the likes of Michael Levett and Suneta Gupta have been saying but even more significant because it’s elderly people too, but who can speak up for this that will be listened to?

47206 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to wendy, 4, #1265 of 1444 🔗

I can’t see any recent evidence that the government really want a way out of this
Everything they are doing points to a desire to keep the myth going forever
They are unlikely to admit they were wrong
I would advise the young to leave the country

47240 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Julian, 3, #1266 of 1444 🔗

It’s very depressing. Wouldn’t an opposition want to make a challenge? A doctor and a nurse friend today have both told of empty hospitals and staff with nothing to do. I suppose I can only hold on to that there must be a tipping point. Very sadly my poor Dad along with lots of other isolated care home residents may have died by the time a tipping point comes. And that makes me feel very angry.

47347 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to wendy, #1267 of 1444 🔗

The so-called Opposition are worse!
Twat alert:

47322 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Mark B, 1, #1268 of 1444 🔗

What you’re describing is “killer T cells” also known as CD8+. But the Singapore, California and Carolinska studies all also found CD4+ memory T cells. These T cells are part of the humoral immune system and are essentially a memory of how to make particular antibodies again. It’s B cells that actually make antibodies but the CD4+ T cells are part of the system that activates them.

If you had cross-immunity from a similar coronavirus it would probably result in both killer T and antibodies (but probably not the exact antibodies that the antibody tests look for). You would probably then also make a few of the antibodies the test is looking for but would have only a mild illness.

47138 assoc, 7, #1269 of 1444 🔗

Given that we are supposed to work from home and do our travelling by bicycle or private car, why are we spending £100 billion on HS2. Surely cycle tracks would be better!

47140 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 4, #1270 of 1444 🔗

Pandemonium within a pandemic
“Naturally-acquired immunity
During our evolution as a species, two things have been central to us overcoming pandemics. The first is the ability of surviving populations to develop natural immunity to the pathogen in question, the other is the declining virulence of the pathogen itself. With covid, 6 months on, there’s still very little agreement about what’s really going on. This, in part, is because the kind of investment that’s been made in vaccines hasn’t been matched in trying to understand natural immunity – let along what we could do to improve it.”


47152 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Victoria, #1271 of 1444 🔗


47141 Basics, replying to Basics, 4, #1272 of 1444 🔗

A good conversation starter for bringing up the subject with strangers is: where does it all end?
You can quickle engage people with or without coverngs.

Even a visor and mask combination took the bait, though she had to grab at her mask to pull it down to get her reply heard.

47153 ▶▶ petgor, replying to Basics, 3, #1273 of 1444 🔗

Being a pro or anti Covid-19 believer isn’t much different from being a Brexiteer amongst the noisy Remainers. I am learning to suss out those who share my view that their has been a total over reaction to this panicdemic.

47192 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to petgor, 2, #1274 of 1444 🔗

Its good to chat to those who don’t share you view too. Kindly with all is a good way then you have more to think on.

Never try to convince anyone of anything and you can’t go wrong.

47161 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Basics, 1, #1275 of 1444 🔗

Where does it end? I suspect for most people it might be “With the vaccine”, but Sarah Gilbert of the Oxford vaccine team tells us it would only be likely to “take the edge off” symptoms, rather than giving complete protection. So it won’t end there. I think we’re stuck here forever.

47191 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #1276 of 1444 🔗

That’s it.. you see how effective it is. Immediately you can use but and begin to suggest some alternative thoughts.

But the vaccine won’t be safe because any other vaccine take 6-10 years to test and you cannot fast forward time.

But you cannot wear a facemask for the next 18 months can you? Then onto why masks will now be normal for the flu etc.

I agree. Stuck forever with masks vaccines and lock downs. Until the spell of illogic is lifted. See awkward gits update breaking down the groups of mask wearers. Its really not such an unthinkable task to tackle those groups with reason. 18-30 yr olds excepted!

47142 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 5, #1277 of 1444 🔗

Times of crisis are ripe for the watering down of human rights. When the pandemic hit, the Government introduced overbearing legislation – the Coronavirus Act – which gives the state extraordinary powers to restrict our civil liberties. We must demand our rights are safeguarded, starting with the repeal of the Coronavirus Act.

The Coronavirus Act introduced sweeping powers that were the greatest limitation on liberty in a generation.

Under the Coronavirus Act 2020:

  • Police forces have been granted broad and unworkable powers to detain anyone who could be infectious – every charge made under the Coronavirus Act has been found by the Criminal Prosecution Service have been created to forcibly test, question and isolate people indefinitely – with criminal sanctions if they don’t comply
  • Safeguards for disabled people, people with mental health issues and those who rely on social care have been stripped away just when people were most at risk
  • Dangerous restrictions on the right to protest have been created
  • Borders can be closed and some elections suspended

The Coronavirus Act has failed to uphold people’s rights while leaving the most marginalised worst affected.

These emergency measures are still in force and Parliament can choose to renew them indefinitely.

The Act is up for review in a couple of months, so now is the time to tell the Government to end the lockdown on our liberties and repeal the Coronavirus Act.

Sign the petition today.

47154 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to Victoria, #1278 of 1444 🔗


47159 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Victoria, 1, #1279 of 1444 🔗

Part 2 Section 90 allows for any power to be altered or extended by ministerial fiat. No need for parliamentary approval.

47349 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Steve Hayes, #1280 of 1444 🔗

Which is outrageous!

47210 ▶▶ annie, replying to Victoria, #1281 of 1444 🔗


47335 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Victoria, #1282 of 1444 🔗


47348 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, #1283 of 1444 🔗


47145 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 7, #1284 of 1444 🔗

No evidence anyone has died from the coronavirus
“Dr Stoian Alexov, President of the Bulgarian Pathology Association stated in an interview with Dr Stoycho Katsarov, chair of the Centre of protection of citizens’ rights, that, “ No one has died from the coronavirus. People are dying with coronavirus, not from ”. It’s the comorbidities such as cardiovascular disease that are killing people. He was clear that a pandemic should never have been declared and that in his opinion, covid-19 is nowhere near as dangerous as it’s been made out to be.

He also said that autopsies of covid patients have not identified a specific antibody that can be used to identify the presence of the coronavirus. Criticising the WHO’s handling of the situation, Dr Alexov said it has manipulated and misrepresented information and is “ creating worldwide chaos, with no real facts ”.”


47149 ▶▶ petgor, replying to Victoria, 6, #1285 of 1444 🔗

Spot on. No post mortems; only one medical practitioner needs to certify instead of as previously, two; the deceased need not have been examined and worst of all, death from the virus need only be certified as “presumed” or “suspected”.

If and when the government holds an inquiry and provides what I suspect will be a high fantasy number, they will be safe in whatever they figure they provide, as the evidence has either been buried or cremated.

47164 ▶▶ Jonathan Smith, replying to Victoria, 3, #1286 of 1444 🔗

What have antibodies got to do with autopsies? Who is testing for antibodies post mortem? Post mortem tests are antigen tests – nasal and throat swabs – just like you do with the living.

An antibody body test would not tell you if there was current infection.

The problem with post mortem testing is when it’s used to avoid an autopsy examination if a positive result occurs.

47148 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 14, #1287 of 1444 🔗

A very dispiriting experience: a visit to our local Tesco. I would say that possibly a third of the people in there were wearing masks and doing the Covid swerve around each other. I was surprised at how much I found myself despising them.

Rather than getting back to normal, I think it’s getting much worse.

47170 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #1288 of 1444 🔗

In Blackpool yesterday and Stoke today – only about 2% of people asked up which was encouraging so it’s a bit hit and miss.

47343 ▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Awkward Git, #1289 of 1444 🔗

North Essex, in town 5%?

47195 ▶▶ Laura, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #1290 of 1444 🔗

It’s absolutely getting worse. This fear and division will be with us forever

47196 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #1291 of 1444 🔗

Like Awkward Git, where I live (a Tory shire), the ones in masks are few and far between. With the exception of Scotland, is this a London/metropolitan-type phenomenon?

47211 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1292 of 1444 🔗

I would concur with that. we have heard out in the shires, or sticks, of Scotland there will be much less intense than the University city of Edinburgh. Glasgow seems more real world too.

47245 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Basics, #1293 of 1444 🔗
I have a strong family and business connection to Scotland. One side of my family is a mix of French and Irish Catholic, the other is Scots (Glasgow) Protestant and Irish Catholic. I have a niece in Scotland, and have been a regular business visitor to both Edinburgh and Glasgow since late 1980s. More recently, Stirling has been part of my travels. Never quite get away with Edinburgh - feels a bit like Oxford, which I also know quite well (metropolitan luvvie). Love Glasgow. Sorry Biker, I know you will be along to reprimand me!
47261 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1294 of 1444 🔗

Sorry about format of the post – something has happened and I cannot change it – any thoughts welcome!

47267 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1295 of 1444 🔗

Something has indeed happened!

47277 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1296 of 1444 🔗

“is this a London/metropolitan-type phenomenon?”

No, it’s a self righteous, sanctimonious, cry baby phenomenon

47341 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to T. Prince, 2, #1297 of 1444 🔗

It’s a psy-op!
And they’re doubling up on the 2nd wave nonsense at the moment too – we all have to get slim and fit ready for the 2nd wave this winter.

47351 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, #1298 of 1444 🔗

Yes, BG has already said on camera that people *will* take it seriously the ‘next time’..

47310 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1299 of 1444 🔗

I think that I must live in the same part of the country as Awkward Git from some of the things he has been posting. From the beginning, I’ve thought that most of the “rules” have only been developed with London and the large metropolitan areas in mind-those places with underground lines or with large commuter belts where buses and trams are standing room only.
In my city, we don’t have any of those things. The shops around here were never crammed to capacity even before lockdown and on weekdays you could stay at least five metres away from anyone in the main stores, let alone two metres, so very, very few people here wear masks. The tsunami of cases expected by the local hospitals never materialised nor was there any noticeable increase in the number of death notices in the local paper. There are no queues to get in any of the supermarkets now and yet it looks like we are going to get the “London treatment” and be forced to wear muzzles against our will.

47382 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Margaret, #1300 of 1444 🔗

Intersting to hear about the local paper evidence (lack of). One of the old people I shop for is a self confessed obituary junkie! She keeps an eye as she seems to know many people. She has discussed notices she’s seen here but not mentioned any increase. Never occured to me until reading your comment Margaret. Absolutely, there ought to have been a rise, especially since the disgusting funeral limitations.

47407 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #1301 of 1444 🔗

Noticed some of that today in the Lakes. I despise and pity them.

47155 Liam, replying to Liam, 25, #1302 of 1444 🔗

I quite genuinely feel that I am losing my sanity in all this. I’m quite a robust person generally but feel an appalling sense of rising distress.

47181 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Liam, 14, #1303 of 1444 🔗

Think of yourself as part of the underground resistance fighting to overthrow a totalitarian regime gain freedom for the people and you won’t be far wrong.

47397 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Awkward Git, #1304 of 1444 🔗

That’s exactly what it is.

47183 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Liam, 12, #1305 of 1444 🔗

If it helps, you’re not on your own. I feel exactly the same.

47234 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Moomin, 14, #1306 of 1444 🔗

Same here too. I feel a lot more scared, powerless and dispirited now than I did in the early days of the lockdown.
I have lots of hobbies (not least gardening) to keep my mind occupied, but it’s hard to keep a positive frame of mind when society’s response to the virus has so completely diverged from the reality (it feels like it’s been going that way over the last month at at least – but the last week or so, with the Leicester lockdown and threat of compulsory masks, is the worst). It seems like the Government have dug themselves into a post-truth, post-rational hole and are taking everyone else with them.

47241 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Drawde927, 2, #1307 of 1444 🔗

Keep up the gardening, and this time of year it’s great to do the full monty (don) and just sit and enjoy your work. Take time out to just enjoy how remarkable nature is.

47186 ▶▶ Dave Tee, replying to Liam, 6, #1308 of 1444 🔗

Me too, Liam. You feel terrified, overwhelmed, and powerless. Please know that you’re not alone.

47214 ▶▶▶ Ian, replying to Dave Tee, 3, #1309 of 1444 🔗

Me too Liam. It is a horrible, sinking, debilitating feeling that sucks the fun and enjoyment out of life.

47193 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Liam, 8, #1310 of 1444 🔗

Chin up Liam. We are all here for each other. I am not distressed for myself per se, but for my sons (18 and 20), whose lives have, and will have been, needlessly turned upside down because of the catastrophic failings of my generation of elites. Keep focused on judgment day, because it will be here before the protagonists reckon!

47205 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1311 of 1444 🔗

That’s true. Once the tipping point comes, CERRRRRASH!

47235 ▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1312 of 1444 🔗

Thanks TT.

47204 ▶▶ annie, replying to Liam, 5, #1313 of 1444 🔗

I know how you feel, but be strong. And don’t spend foo much time dwelling on it, even on this site.Go and so something nice and normal. And think how that evil mob hate normal: every normal thing you do is a poke in their eyes.

47218 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Liam, 8, #1314 of 1444 🔗

Remember what Ghandi said – you may be a minority of one but the truth is still the truth.

Truth Passes Through Three Stages: First, It Is Ridiculed. Second, It Is Violently Opposed. Third, It Is Accepted As Self-Evident

47402 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Awkward Git, #1315 of 1444 🔗

I’ve always taken the view that if I’m with the mainstream, I’ve got something wrong.

47252 ▶▶ DressageRider, replying to Liam, #1316 of 1444 🔗

Me too.

47336 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Liam, 2, #1317 of 1444 🔗

I’ve been feeling the same way too – I swing between optimism and pessimism. You are not alone, this site has been a life saver.

47366 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to Bart Simpson, 3, #1318 of 1444 🔗

It’s really getting to me today.The past three days had been the most pleasantly normal for me in months, a meal out with almost complete normality,a visit to the shops with no distancing being done with everyone behaving normally,no enforcement of any stupid rules in any of the shops,I didn’t see any muzzlers in the hour or so I was there and just a calm relaxed atmosphere overall.
But today with the obvious approach of compulsory muzzles in England I am constantly swinging between anger and anxiety,every time I see a small glimmer of hope a new demon appears over the hill,more evil than the last one.Muzzles next,what then,eye shields ?,gloves ?,an orange jumpsuit with a number on ?.

47377 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Paul, 2, #1319 of 1444 🔗

I agree – it seem to be two steps forward 10 steps back. Makes you wonder when it will ever end.

Mr Bart and I were talking about the possibility of people having had enough and taking matters into their own hands. He agrees with me that we don’t have to wait until October especially as more job losses are reported and more businesses go bust.

Hang in there.

47406 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bart Simpson, #1320 of 1444 🔗

We don’t. But Serbia, Bulgaria and Albania have already taken to the streets and got lockdowns ended there. It’s a ticking bomb, and if nothing shifts public opinion, the economic implosion certainly will. As I love to say to lockdown supporters: tick-tock.

47371 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Liam, 2, #1321 of 1444 🔗

You are far from alone Liam. I often lie awake at night, anxiety levels rocketing, depression as a big cloud over me, shaking. I’m not in the least bit frightened of a virus, but I’m scared to death as to what has become of this country inside a few short months. I want to move away – but where to? I can’t see the remotest bit of sanity anywhere on this earth right now.

47398 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Liam, #1322 of 1444 🔗

You’re not alone, you’re NOT alone!!

47157 Dave Tee, replying to Dave Tee, 16, #1323 of 1444 🔗

I have the greatest respect for the good people running petitions and making legal challenges but I suspect that boots on the ground will be a far more effective protest. If masks become mandatory for shopping then PLEASE stop patronising the supermarkets, in person and online. They are big enough to take the hit without making wholesale redundancies – but they will soon start kicking off if their profits fall. Buy from local shops and in particular open markets where masks will presumably not be required.

I have set aside a stash of stuff for emergencies and I will be living off that for as long as possible if this latest bollocks gets introduced.

47334 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave Tee, 2, #1324 of 1444 🔗

And pay with CASH as much as possible!

47342 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Dave Tee, 2, #1325 of 1444 🔗

And don’t forget to boycott museums, art galleries, heritage sites and visitor attractions – your pre-booked tickets will mean that you will be entered into the NHS T&T unless you withhold your consent while booking.

47158 Suitejb, replying to Suitejb, 5, #1326 of 1444 🔗

I find myself in a tricky situation regarding these damn masks! I have offered to take a good friend to hospital for chemo treatment and whilst I (reluctantly) accept wearing a mask in hospital it turns out I have to wear one in the car as well. That’s an hour each way.
For many years I ran a community car scheme where volunteers provided transport in their own cars to take elderly people, or those with disabilities, to medical appointments. By definition most of the clients were vulnerable either because of age or illness but no driver, or passenger, ever wore a mask. A driver might spend hours with a patient, either in the hospital or the car and the idea that he/she might be a risk to that person’s health was only considered if the driver was obviously unwell. Common sense then prevailed and the driver didn’t work until better.
Any virus or bug could seriously affect someone with other conditions but it’s a bit like out of sight, out of mind – if we’re not reminded about something we don’t think about it and therefore don’t worry about it. Sadly we’re not being allowed to forget about COVID.
I will wear a mask on this occasion, although not one of those horrible blue things, as a few of us are taking turns with transport so it won’t be too often. And it will be coming off at every opportunity.
Hopefully I’ll be able to drive in it!

47169 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Suitejb, 5, #1327 of 1444 🔗

Most medical staff I’ve encountered the last few days have the mask down below their noses anyway and some it’s on for show so just wear it as far down your face as you can get away with and have done with it.

47176 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Suitejb, 2, #1328 of 1444 🔗

consider a bandana or scarf as a decoy

47248 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Suitejb, 4, #1330 of 1444 🔗

AFAIK, you should not be operating machinery while wearing a mask that does not have an exhale valve.
The exhale valve allows all your breath out to leave the mask.
Other types of mask are prone to lowering your oxygen intake and giving elevated CO2 levels, none of which are ideal.
That Glasgow bin lorry driver had some sort of condition that caused him to pass out and now they are encouraging drivers to wear garments likely to do the same

Of course if you have a mask with an exhale valve, that is the ideal one to wear withe maskerbating Karens.
Absolutely f******* pointless, it’s a dust mask ( with bullshit written in blackmarker across it of course)

47308 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #1331 of 1444 🔗

As far as I know the govt consider it perfectly acceptable to wear one with an exhale valve, which presumably will not protect other people since any coughs or sneezes will come straight out of the valve? So anyone wearing such a mask is definitely not doing it “because I care”…

47416 ▶▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to A. Contrarian, #1332 of 1444 🔗

Yes, exactly, if it has an exhale valve then all your exhalation has just been concentrated straight aahead.h
However as you are not rebreathing stale air you are safer to drive or operate other machinery.
There used to be a saying “you couldn’t make it up” but I fear we have gone beyond that.

It would be an interesting court case if someone had an accident and proferred the excuse that they momentarily passed out due to low SpO2 caused by wearing a mask!

47167 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 25, #1333 of 1444 🔗

After being out and about for the past couple of days I’ll make the following couple of comments rather than do a full “report”:

  • if the government think a max £10 voucher off food 3 nights a week will get things moving they are even more stupid and incompetent that even I though
  • shops and pubs that are more insistent on following guidelines are nearly empty, premises that just let you get on with it and just pay lips service are doing ,to better trade
  • mask wearing is way down from last week – brilliant sign
  • the badge I got from two-six is great for kicking off conversations. A GP and a hospital nurse both said “so you’ve researched what’s going on? OK, we don’t need to tell you anything then” and promptly forgot social distancing, masks, hand washing, sanitising communal pens and clipboards and both admitted they have had nothing to do for the past 4 months
  • councils are doing a great job of destroying the high street even more than they were previously – they have had market holders paying full int when closed because “they had the £10000 rebate on rates”
  • very few including pharmacy staff know a positive test does not mean anything more than some viral genetic material has been detected in your body, you do not have the virus affecting you
  • those 18-30 are the most likely to be scared silly
  • it feels great to refuse to to give details to track and trace as it is only voluntary and you prepare to show them where it says this on the website and the looks on the young people’s faces when you question the statement “it’s to keep us all safe” is worth it.
  • lots of discarded masks – cleaning staff do not realise that it could be classified as contaminated clinical waste and is therefore a biohazard and just pick them up sometimes by ungloved hands and put them into normal waste bins. Had fun with a shopping centre management yesterday when I explained this to one of the ladies cleaning (I was bored outside a clothes shop waiting for the wife to finish trying on new outfits in the dressing rooms) and she went straight off and asked management for medical biohazard waste bags, gloves, the pick-up stick grab thing and so on and they came down to see who put ideas into her head. HA HA fucking HA to them.

Mask wearers fit into the following categories:

  1. the truly vulnerable
  2. the scared stiff young 18-30 who don’t know any better as their social media bubble tells them they will all die horribly
  3. those who are wearing it due to social pressure (soft brained docile useful idiots) and it is a fashion accessory – matches outfit colours, nice design and picture etc
  4. the sanctimonious wankers who are doing it to make a point. Normally 40-60, probably were one of the first to buy a prius to save the planet and not for the big discount thou get for buying one, buy organic or fair-trade if/when they can afford it and generally all round twats. These are the most annoying of all.
47172 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1334 of 1444 🔗

Which badge did you get? Sounds a useful thing to have!

47179 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to CarrieAH, 6, #1335 of 1444 🔗

It’s one that says “Covid 1984 Not Brainwashed”.

Not seen two six on here for a few days but his e-mail is two-six@twang.co.uk

Sent a few to my buddy in the north east, he had success with it in the pub last night meeting other sceptics who thought they were the only ones questioning things.

47180 ▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1336 of 1444 🔗

That sounds a good one!

47203 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1337 of 1444 🔗

Buy his badges, he’s a great guy.
Great guy, could you do a nappy-exempt badge?

47272 ▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to annie, 1, #1338 of 1444 🔗

Annie, I donated a fiver for two. We’ll wear them on the basis that we have acute sceptic-cytis….


47182 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to CarrieAH, 3, #1339 of 1444 🔗

Time well spent speaking to the cleaner – the ripples of that one conversation will go far, the joy of being right is sometimes beautiful!

A certain contrast from the Scotlands capital that is now mask wearing central. Early days for the mandatory masks in shops. The tendency still prevails to become relaxed as you describe England.

47188 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Basics, 6, #1340 of 1444 🔗

My years as a senior boss keeping crews safe is paying off.

Plus annoying upper management arseholes is always a bonus.

47207 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Awkward Git, 5, #1341 of 1444 🔗

I want an Awkward Git badge!

47274 ▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Awkward Git, #1342 of 1444 🔗

“keeping crews safe”?

47293 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to T. Prince, 1, #1343 of 1444 🔗

Yep, anything upto 250 depending on what we were working on and the project and the buck stopped with me.

47229 ▶▶▶▶ Hoppity, replying to Basics, #1344 of 1444 🔗

Some workplaces are like ripple tanks, and ultimately the ripples go nowhere. And being right is not so much a joy as a burden in places like that. (It’s being so cheery wot keeps me going.)

47238 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Hoppity, 1, #1345 of 1444 🔗

Haha! Very good. But I knows I’m right. Tell a person an interesting ponderence that is relevant to them, and it will be discussed later in that unbeatable word of mouth way.

Do you know what happened to day at work luv? This mad hairy Awkward git came up to me and said bio hazard… and he’s right! You’re still alive though luv! Shall I put the kettle on?

47242 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1346 of 1444 🔗

Out for a walk earlier with my OH to nearby woods. Pub across the road busy which was encouraging. Mix of ages enjoying a drink, everyone dressed up for a proper drink up. Approaching the pub a bus stopped outside, an elderly fit and healthy looking gentleman got off the bus to go in the pub, obviously having a pint with his mates – good on him however when he got off the bus he took his mask off folded it up and put it in his pocket, mentioned to my OH that it was now contaminated and should be replaced otherwise completely pointless, I don’t think he would or anybody else would blow their nose and put their handkerchief over their nose and mouth so why do it with a dirty mask.

Was going to stop on the way home for a drink but no empty tables, pub is encouraging card payments.

Nice to see families and dog walkers in the woods, on our way out saw a woman (no 4. above) wearing a designer mask in the middle of the woods in fresh air!!!! WTF…..she walked past head down, no eye contact or greeting. Both OH and I commented how miserable and brow beaten she looked.

Few other mask wearers seen driving cars.

Stay strong people.

At the very least, if plebs want to wear a mask proper information should be given.

Medical masks must be properly fitted and sealed around the mouth and nose. Masks must not be touched. Every touch has the potential to contaminate the mask and the hands, thus increasing the spread of disease.

Medical masks are single use devices designed to be worn for a relatively short period of time. Once the mask becomes saturated with moisture from breath, which, if properly fit, takes about an hour, they should be replaced.

If people understood this maybe the craze would be phased out, who wants to buy a huge stash of masks or walk about with a stash to be regularly changed, why wear one in a completely non sterile environment (bus, car, shop, pub, restaurant……)

47254 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1347 of 1444 🔗

If you want to really work the system , starter in restaurant a, main course in restaurant b, dessert in restaurant c plus soft drinks .

47352 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, #1348 of 1444 🔗

Interested to know more about the conversation with the GP and nurse..

47173 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1349 of 1444 🔗

From blog I read, sometimes he’s wrong and says so once he’s fully investigated something, this he keeps repeating:

The Coronavirus test is not credible and likely to be for clandestine brain access. They are claiming the virus wrecks the nervous systems of a large percentage of people, leaving lasting neurological problems and brain damage. But I’d like to ask – is it really a virus doing that, or are the tests doing that? Folks, the coronavirus tests themselves, in many cases, (there are probably different types) but in many cases they are obviously what is causing the brain damage. Easily explained: Many of the tests, (all of them that use the incredibly long “swab”) take their samples from the cribriform plate, which is a millimeter thick bone at the top of the nasal cavity that is perforated with many holes that go directly into the brain cavity. These holes are what your olefactory nerves pass through, and there are many (the bone is similar to a coarse screen)
If you wanted to sabotage someone by planting a clandestine brain virus, nano tech, or plant a chip in someone, this would be the place to do it because perhaps a doctor could get a chip out but individuals certainly never could without perforating that very thin bone (that is not really even bone, it is about half nerves) and anyone attempting to do an extraction from there would likely end up killing themselves. Any chemicals, viruses, nanotech or whatever else they wanted to put there will have immediate access to the brain and you can forget about getting that out, once it’s in, it is in. It would be literally right on the brain when placed, and go right in. People complain about the tests being excruciatingly painful with the pain lasting for days. For what reason would the tests need to touch the most brain accessible part of the human body? Are the ones that do really tests at all? DNA tests are done with a simple mouth swab, and it’s ridiculous to think any virus test – when you supposedly can spread it by coughing, – would not be the same. Something is screwy with these tests. They have GOT TO be fake, (or at least the ones that literally swab the brain are) No wonder why they hurt for days and GEE, getting your olefactory nerves nailed by whatever is on that swab is probably what is causing people to permanently lose their sense of smell.
COMMON SENSE. I bet you did not know how nasty that test really is. Avoid the test at all costs. My first post ever on this topic mocked the entire concept of a coronavirus being massively lethal. The obviously unnecessarily invasive “tests” strongly indicate this is TOTALLY fake and they are not tests at all. That’s why we end up getting Kiwi fruit testing positive and people who signed up and left before testing ending up positive, THERE IS NO CORONAVIRUS TEST IF THAT IS HAPPENING, no, they are doing something entirely other than testing and the close proximity to the brain really opens up a reason for questioning what those tests really are.

47187 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #1350 of 1444 🔗

They are claiming the virus wrecks the nervous systems of a large percentage of people, leaving lasting neurological problems and brain damage.

It has to do with poor health prior to getting Covid, nutrient deficiencies especially vitamin D, magnesium, Zinc, vitamin C, poor diet, dehydration, not enough sleep, not enough movement/exercise and taking many prescribed pharmaceutical drugs with many side effects that only treat the symptoms and not the underlying cause.

47220 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Victoria, 4, #1351 of 1444 🔗

Yes plus iodine. We are all iodine deficient nowadays, and iodine is the building block for pretty much every organ in your body. I started taking iodine some time ago now in addition to everything you mention above, and since then I haven’t even had a cold, never mind influenza or Covid.

47230 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to CarrieAH, 3, #1352 of 1444 🔗

Agree. I take 6.25mg Iodine per day with Selenium. Dr Brownstein’s Iodine book is world-class and a must have.

47233 ▶▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Victoria, 3, #1353 of 1444 🔗

Absolutely. A great book.

47264 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1354 of 1444 🔗

Yikes AG. That’s quite a hypothesis!

However, it was noted only yesterday that if we can get an infection merely from walking past someone – hence justifying mask-wearing, why does the test have to shove the swab so far into the nasal cavity?

We should be asking this question at every single opportunity on the BTL comments of the MSM.

Has anyone here had a test? Can you confirm about the lasting discomfort etc?

47295 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1355 of 1444 🔗

It’s a numbers game. In theory you might be able to detect the virus in some air someone had breathed out but the smaller a sample you have the more you have to crank up the test cycles increasing the chance of false positives. The better the sample you can get the more confidence you can have in the result.

It is the same with getting infected in that you probably do also need a decent dose. But the goal is to minimise infections and maximise testing accuracy so it makes sense to treat the two scenarios differently.

I haven’t had a test and don’t plan on it. It’s not so much the nanobots being implanted in my brain I’m worried about but the test doesn’t sound particularly enjoyable and it’s important to do one’s civic duty and avoid creating any surges, spikes, upticks or outbreaks.

47174 petgor, replying to petgor, 14, #1356 of 1444 🔗

I fear that once this problem is sorted the media, who know that the weak minded will fall for it every time, will have a fine old time looking for and finding other viruses. I am convinced that this is just the beginning.

47198 ▶▶ Hoppity, replying to petgor, 2, #1357 of 1444 🔗

I hope you’re wrong, but… I seem to remember seeing mention somewhere the other day of cases of the bubonic plague (in China?) and also swine flu somewhere or other.

47202 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Hoppity, 6, #1358 of 1444 🔗

Now that it is evident how easy it is to fool people and seize power, it’s probable it will become addictive

47244 ▶▶ Digital Nomad, replying to petgor, 3, #1359 of 1444 🔗

Far from it. I have the distinct feeling more and more are joining the club titled “Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.”

47185 Ian, replying to Ian, 17, #1360 of 1444 🔗

What I don’t understand is, if masks and face coverings work, why does everyone have to wear them? Surely if I am a vector of disease, a germ ridden danger, the fact that those who wish to wear a mask believing it protects then then must be safe from my germs. If they aren’t, why bother?

47219 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Ian, 8, #1361 of 1444 🔗

Ah apparently the virus is terribly clever and only goes one way through a mask. Apparently I have to wear a face nappy to protect you and vice versa. My own nappy doesn’t protect me. Go figure.

47296 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to CarrieAH, 3, #1362 of 1444 🔗

It sounds mad but clearly I have just solved the universe! One way mssks? Just wear two back to back.

Don’t know if this works for doubling up winter scarves but surely a boffin can model-up something nasty to prove.

47223 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Ian, 3, #1363 of 1444 🔗

They do it for our safety more than theirs apparently

47239 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Tom Blackburn, 3, #1364 of 1444 🔗

How very Christian of them, putting me before themselves, however I don’t believe them!

47290 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Ian, 1, #1365 of 1444 🔗

It’s one of these “if it helps even just a tiny bit it’s worth it” situations.

There could be 1 person in the whole world who is infected and they would still argue that there’s some evidence to say masks help.

So if 7 Billion people all wear masks collectively they might save half a life so it would be worth it.

47190 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 21, #1366 of 1444 🔗

Was in Blackpool yesterday, quite a few Scottish families down enjoying themselves at the seaside in the sun and wind while away and escaped from Gulag Sturgeonland.

While having a cup of coffee in the sun a family sat on the next bench and we got chatting (I am half Scottish, from Edinburgh, just don’t sound it as lived away for most of my life) and I asked them did they get Sturgeon’s permission to leave?

They replied no but she may stop them at the border on the way in and imprison them for a few weeks until decontaminated unless they slip across at night.

Not one of them had a good word to say about her, about how Scotland is handling things and how much more “civillised” being in England was and how the English were a lot more open, friendly and to paraphrase them – being perfidious albion and ignoring diktat instead of being afce down arse up as in Scotland.

They said Robert the Bruce would be ashamed for what passes for Scots nowadays.

47199 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Awkward Git, 5, #1367 of 1444 🔗

There’s some poor bugger (sorry cannot recall actual name but its all avatars and handles anyway!) on this thread booked in for a few days hol up here… oh how my heart sinks for them! A change is as good as a break and all that!

47200 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1368 of 1444 🔗

The boys on Culloden did not fight for any of this.

47217 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Basics, 7, #1369 of 1444 🔗

My ancestors fought at Culloden, and I’m darned sure it wasn’t so that people had to wear face nappies and antisocial distance and all the rest of the gubbins.

47227 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 23, #1370 of 1444 🔗

Answer to the anonymous doctor from earlier:

I was in a situation a few years ago when it came to a choice of stand my ground and lose my career or kowtow, do as told and risk maybe killing hundreds of people if it all went wrong – thing deepwater horizon or Piper Alpha consequences.

My wife said “do whatever you feel is right with you”, I’ll back you. I never backed down, faced threats of court cases and tens of millions of personal damages and so on – won without going to court after 2 years as company and sub-contractor did not have a leg to stand on and all because I had a piece of paper signed by a 3rd party inspector that said “equipment not fit for purpose” and I refused to use it.

Speaking to people doing these are jobs see they told me that they didn’t think they had the balls or guts to do what I did and stand up for what I believed in and my answer – “you should not be doing this job then with all those lives depending on you to do the right think then”.

But that’s just me, an awkward git.

47237 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Awkward Git, 11, #1371 of 1444 🔗

As my beloved father used to say, ‘you have to be able to face yourself in the mirror every day’. I can, and so can you. Doctors need to muster the courage to do that – they are starting from a position of respect and trust in wider society. I tried very hard to change things in my career, and I was forced out long before I had achieved what I could and should have done. Sometimes you just have to do what is right, and it really is black or white.

47246 Biker, 15, #1372 of 1444 🔗

Went to the shops, lots of people wearing masks, i didn’t. I’m very concerned that Sturgeon has said mask wearing should be the same as wearing a seatbelt in a car. These people, and brain-dead Sturgeon thinks my life should be made a total misery in a mask forever. Fuck her. Maybe they don’t understand humanity but i can see the type of person who joined the IRA or UVF and the like taking up arms against the vile fuckers that are trying to make us wear masks and starting armed rebellions. The whole thing is to turn the world into a prison. I wish i was a drinker because i could do with one

47247 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 13, #1373 of 1444 🔗

Buying bacon and a joint of 30 day aged beef rib in for tomorrow (joys of knowing a real butcher) with yorkie puds in the local council run market got chatting to the butchers who saw my sceptics badge.

The market is now a depressing place with most stall empty – decamping to another nearby market with a different council where rents are 75% lower – and pointed them in the direction of the unbeliever sceptics world of underground revolution.

Not plastic screens, no masks, no gloves, no social distancing, no tracks and trace, takes cash and hates the councils as they have made them pay full rent even when shut “because they have and the business rates rebate of upto £10000 so have an income” in the words of the council.

Councils are the enemy so went through with them guidelines are not enforceable (I have this in writing form the council, offers them a copy of the e-mail) and went through how to stuff the council if the council say everything is under the Health and Safety at Work Act 1974 by telling them where to find the scientific evidence for a risk assessment that makes the council/government one meaningless.

47250 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1374 of 1444 🔗

Doing good work there AG!

47255 Biker, replying to Biker, 20, #1375 of 1444 🔗

Lol, England to make masks compulsory. Who feels sick that they voted for that fat disgusting prick Boris thinking he was British and he’d get us out the EU and we’d be free. He’s just another deep state paid up member of the secret cabal. We’ll never be free of them. I know who’s behind this, you know in your bones who’s behind this and the fact if i were to say who’s behind this i’d be arrested, shows i’m right. This now ladies and gents is a war for our lives. There is no doubt whatsoever that are coming for us. The people behind this have hated Britain for a long time and this is their revenge

47300 ▶▶ Christopher, replying to Biker, 11, #1376 of 1444 🔗

Mate , you hit the nail on the head . I had to hold my nose when i went and voted for the fake conservative and rothschild plant Johnson , i voted solely for the reason that he wasn’t the power mad insane commie commissar Corbyn who would gladly destroy what was left of old Albion at an unprecedented rate . Johnson had one job to perform adequately and one job only , the one he promised us and that was to get us out of the EU.
Not in my worst nightmares did i envisage the dystopian hell he and his globalist scum underlings have unleashed on the people of Britain.
Not much of a choice we were presented with was it ?

47317 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Christopher, 6, #1377 of 1444 🔗

It’s the end of the good ship Albion and i never thought for a second the people would be just fucking dandy with it. I despise these fuckers so much i can hardly breathe. What passes for a man in this country now is pathetic. They’re all sitting their on their fat arse’s playing xbox with their fat children and their fat wive’s while they hang around facebook lying to their fat fucking friends, eating fucking pizza and drinking coffee. The British people have become useless. The greatest nation in the history of the world is now a lazy, ignorant dumb fucking bunch of soft boned cunts.
I fully expect to be a causality in this coming war because i will not do what they say ever.

47337 ▶▶▶▶ Christopher, replying to Biker, 4, #1378 of 1444 🔗

I can’t argue with any of that although i would say that i was also once asleep to the war being conducted against the people of this island and the western world in general. I get utterly frustrated talking to my friends and family , even now after having this hoax thrust upon us and the stripping of our freedom they still refuse to accept there is any truth to what i have say regarding the real truth to the world we now face having forced upon us all.
It’s utterly demoralising to think the descendants of the people that built the greatest civilisation the world has ever seen reduced to this.

47256 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 3, #1379 of 1444 🔗

A publican that is struggling with takings and frightened of the authorities, further restricts his capacity because friends were hugging and others cheering the football. An unconnected fight outside means everyone is tarred with the same brush – as ‘wild animals’.

Manchester Evening News: Popular pub shuts to general public after ‘wild animal’ drinkers turn reopening into ‘a bit of a nightmare’.

47258 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1380 of 1444 🔗

I can no longer bring myself to read the MEN. Recently counted 11 covid related horror stories in one online edition, all devoid of any factual information….

47259 Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 22, #1381 of 1444 🔗

Is there a more ridiculous sight than Boris Johnson gallivanting around wearing a mask?

He’s probably the most high profile person in the world to have contracted and defeated the disease. As far as I am aware, there is barely any evidence to suggest you can contract Covid twice or facilitate its spread once you have developed the particular antibodies.

Anybody with half a brain can see that this is no more than a cynical publicity stunt, a shameless piece of Covid virtue-signalling by the shepherd to please his flock of sheep.

Still, the blinkered masses will lap it up as they usher us towards a new era of isolation, suspicion and tyranny. The Muzzealots should be careful what they wish for.

47265 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Scotty87, 1, #1382 of 1444 🔗

This is a dam good read (lots of useful links) and there is a section relating to the effectiveness of masks…..book mark it as it is updated monthly


47269 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Scotty87, 9, #1383 of 1444 🔗

“Is there a more ridiculous sight than Boris Johnson gallivanting around wearing a mask?”

Yes, the ridiculous sight of Boris Johnson gallivanting around pretending to be leading us out of this fiasco.

47275 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Scotty87, 7, #1384 of 1444 🔗

Just about sums you up that does, Grant.

Zero balls

47281 ▶▶▶ GrantM, replying to Tom Blackburn, -20, #1385 of 1444 🔗

No, just a logical and rational thinker who isint selfish like everyone here

47288 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to GrantM, #1386 of 1444 🔗

That made me chuckle….

47298 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to GrantM, 1, #1387 of 1444 🔗

I’ve got you marked down as a shit house

47307 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to GrantM, 2, #1388 of 1444 🔗

you’re a absolute wanker through so there is that

47433 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to GrantM, #1389 of 1444 🔗

You ever ridden in a car? That’s fuckin’ selfish, number of deaths they cause.

47282 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1390 of 1444 🔗

Zero brains

47286 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Scotty87, 5, #1391 of 1444 🔗

The mask is pointless though grantm. Indeed breathing your own co2 and expelled bacteria increases your risk to health issues. And then there is the lower oxygen levels. Oh and the touching and pulling at it. So I am wrong, its not pointless it is an unsafe thing to do. Critical think much.

47291 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Basics, 2, #1392 of 1444 🔗

No point trying to reason with GruntM……just comes here to insult (must make him feel better) never offers anything logical or intelligent.

47292 ▶▶ Christopher, replying to Scotty87, 1, #1393 of 1444 🔗

The 77 Brigade’s finest has returned to spout the usual establishment horseshit.
Bore Off ..

47294 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Christopher, #1394 of 1444 🔗

Didn’t you mean ‘thickest” ?

47303 ▶▶▶▶ Christopher, replying to T. Prince, 1, #1395 of 1444 🔗

Yes sorry , i should have said thickest or mind controlled drone .

47301 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Scotty87, 2, #1396 of 1444 🔗

Oh Grant, I’ve missed you
*blows kiss*

47306 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Scotty87, 1, #1397 of 1444 🔗

fuck you tedious cunt

47311 ▶▶ Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 7, #1398 of 1444 🔗

“Maybe, just maybe we wont need to sooner than later”

You must have been living under a rock since March, mate. Remember when the lockdown was supposed to “just flatten the curve?” The curve flattened, then the conversation moved onto concerns about a “second spike.”

Then, thousands of Black Lives Matter protesters gathered all around across the country, cramming into public squares cheek by jowl. No spike ever occurred.

Now we’re being told that we’re in a “new normal” until a vaccine is found – so basically the government can boss us around and shut society down whenever they want due to the Orwellian powers they handed themselves contained within the Coronavirus Act.

So please forgive me, Grant, for being sceptical about any regulations these clueless despots foist onto us. You can wear that mask with pride for all I care – at least I’ll be able to easily identify you as part of the mindless flock should our paths ever cross!

47312 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Scotty87, 6, #1399 of 1444 🔗

I think that if they’re going to introduce this, we need people of our persuasion to always be on the look-out for Tory MPs and ministers breaching the mask rule. If they’re going to make our lives a misery, we should make damn sure that it is for them, too. Every restaurant they go to, pub, shop, golf club bar, they should be photographed whenever they fail to humiliate themselves with a face nappy, and the photos should be posted to social media. Even those natural bed wetters the Guardian would be only too pleased to print such images of Tories, I should think.

47314 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #1400 of 1444 🔗

An excellent action to do.

47324 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #1401 of 1444 🔗

No, every time we see one of them not wearing a mask we should congratulate them for their efforts to free us from the fleas that have infested out country

47321 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Scotty87, 4, #1402 of 1444 🔗

He never had the virus. I don’t believe that for a second.

47362 ▶▶▶ Christopher, replying to Biker, #1403 of 1444 🔗

Him , Tom Hanks and Edris Elba all utter bollocks.

47263 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 5, #1404 of 1444 🔗

This excellent article from The Spectator is a “must read”. It’s from April this year, but it comprehensively debunks the idea of face masks being useful. In fact, the article suggests they may make contagion worse. I’m waiting for the MSM to put the points raised in this article to those politicians who may force these muzzles upon us.


Here’s the Wikipedia bio of the author:


He also wrote an article mentioned above by Toby.

47429 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Tenchy, -1, #1405 of 1444 🔗

John Lee is excellent, but that’s not the point. Nor is reasoning as much as Tracy’s email to Zahawi above is well put and valid. Because the whole rationale of putting people in face masks is disingenuous.They want us subjugated, lockdown was testing the waters as to how submissive we would be. Now they can go the full Monty. Unless there is an uprising this is it for the foreseeable future. It was always about social control.

47266 Hester, replying to Hester, 29, #1406 of 1444 🔗

Please find a copy of an email I have just sent to my MP I feel so strongly about this issue,
Dear Mr Zahawi,

I have read with great fear and trepidation and I hope it is just another media hysteria, that the Conservative government led by Boris Johnson is about to make the wearing of face coverings mandatory in all shops.
I sincerely hope this is not the case as I look upon this as another breach of basic Human Rights by the Conservatives (which incidentally I am now ashamed to say I voted for) under the auspices of protecting us from the Covid 19 virus. This Virus even by the Governments own statistics has virtually disappeared, when it was at its height again under your own statistics it killed those in the 80 -90 + age bracket with a prevalence of other illnesses, the majority having dementia or Alzheimer’s. The incidence of death in the healthy under 60s has been just under 300, and in the under 50s the numbers do not even register on the Governments graphs. For 4 months we have been in Lockdown, and masks were not compulsory, now we are supposed to be returning to normality, and very grim it is if you care to visit the dystopian world of Retail that has been created even without compulsory face masks, no one wants to shop for pleasure in that!.

But I digress, my question to you and the Prime minister and it is a very important one. If masks are to be mandatory in order to visit a shop, and taking into account it is impossible to get food delivered, is the choice you are giving myself and the British people that of either covering their faces at the Governments command if they want to buy food, or if they choose the basic human right to not be forced to cover their faces, they are denied the opportunity to buy food and presumably starve at the  States behest?

I very much look forward to an answer to this basic question. Am I to be denied the right to shop for food to feed myself and my family if I do not succumb to the demands of a Conservative Government to cover my face.

I look forward to your response


47279 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Hester, 8, #1407 of 1444 🔗

Nicely put.

47285 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Hester, 8, #1408 of 1444 🔗

A very good letter.

47361 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Hester, #1409 of 1444 🔗


47390 ▶▶ Ian, replying to Hester, #1410 of 1444 🔗

I wrote to him 3 times about my lad missing school. He has responded twice, with the standard Conservative Central Office response.

47270 Youth_Unheard, 9, #1411 of 1444 🔗

For all these measures to be in place from mask wearing to screens to distancing, all comes from the biased view that even the spread of COVID presents a “serious and imminent danger”. None of it is evidence based and if people realise this and conduct them accordingly with the evidence at hand, as my favourite line in this article says “as everyone knows, threats and bullies often go away when you stand up to them”. Highly recommend businesses reading this to understand THEY have the power to change the tide. We can do this.


47276 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 20, #1412 of 1444 🔗

Re the Maskist takeover of our government:

1. Until now mask wearing has been a voluntary matter. No one knows what terrible social and psychological damage will be caused by mass compulsory wearing of masks, especially to children.

2. The science behind this is dubious – but even where mask wearing is claimed to be beneficial there is always a caveat added eg “as long as masks are used properly”. This means people must put on fresh masks frequently and not fiddle with the masks. Of course these caveats are hardly ever met in real life.

3. Clearly there must also be dangers associated with wearing close fitting filthy rags around the mouth and nose. I doubt these have been properly assessed.

4. The negative impact on economic activity will be immense.

I was once a strong Boris supporter. Now I am a strong Johnson Sceptic.

47297 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to OKUK, 13, #1413 of 1444 🔗

The man is a dangerous idiot

47304 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Tom Blackburn, 14, #1414 of 1444 🔗

he’s a fat bastard

47313 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Biker, 6, #1415 of 1444 🔗

Yes, yes, and yes to all 3 comments – with the one exception that I always wondered how far one could trust the man. Now we know, alas!

47315 ▶▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to IanE, 12, #1416 of 1444 🔗

During the election, I remember being a bit peeved at Andrew Neil for doing his anti-Boris monologue when BJ refused to be interviewed. I now realise that Neil was right, and I was completely wrong.

47365 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #1417 of 1444 🔗

Andrew Neil – Brillo – has a very low opinion of our current crop of politicians, whatever their party colour.

47338 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to OKUK, 4, #1418 of 1444 🔗

I was always a Bristol– eh? Boris lol- sceptic but am really disappointed that I’ve been proved right (I was hoping we’d get a good brexit out of him at least – maybe we still will but it will all be down to David Frost not him and will be monstrously overshadowed by covid-1984 shitshow)

47289 Awkward Git, 2, #1419 of 1444 🔗

On April 07th 2020 WHO started talking about removing “sick” people from their families:


There is a longer video around, will try and find.

Hanjobs et al just following orders.

47316 Bugle, replying to Bugle, 4, #1420 of 1444 🔗

If you are interested in how the government brainwashed the public into corona compliance, take a look at Simon Dolan’s twitter feed. Simon has retweeted a post by @TonyGreyMan, including government documents. HMG also bought the cooperation of the press in terrifying the public by placing lots of advertising during an otherwise slack time. Can somebody also draw Toby Young’s attention to this? Thanks.

47318 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Bugle, #1421 of 1444 🔗

Link please

47323 ▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Victoria, #1422 of 1444 🔗

Sorry, not very tech literate. I just searched Simon Dolan’s latest tweets.

47331 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Bugle, 1, #1423 of 1444 🔗

The bribes to the press have been known since the beginning of this.

47332 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #1424 of 1444 🔗

I have studied the use of psychological techniques during this crisis but the buying of the press is news to me – that’s to say suspected not proven.

47340 ▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Carrie, #1426 of 1444 🔗

Thanks, Carrie.

47345 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bugle, 2, #1427 of 1444 🔗

You’re welcome 🙂 . In the chart, the boxes re legislation are interesting – almost the only ones that are mentioned as possibly negative.

I note on Simon’s Twitter someone has said that the two SAGE members whose names were withheld could be Bill and Melinda Gates – in the light of developments, this is not totally unlikely!

47346 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Carrie, #1428 of 1444 🔗

Not reassuring. I think the aim is to create a ‘leper’ class, the only way out being vaccination.

47325 Basics, 4, #1429 of 1444 🔗

From Simon Dolan just as I looking into Bugle comment below.

Simon Dolan #KBF
Almost 28bn items of PPE have been ordered from UK-based manufacturers

That’s over 28,000 pieces for every person who works in the NHS.

Does that sound right to you….?

There is no end to this.

47326 annie, replying to annie, 9, #1430 of 1444 🔗

I’m thinking it’s time some of us met up.
We need real personal support, if only to banish that hideous feeling of being alone in a world that’s gone screaming mad.
Alas, it isn’t possible, at present, to get a group together in Gulag Wales, but it might be in England? Or even Fascist Scotland?
Obviously it would mean a great deal of organising. And trust. But is it possible? What do folks think?

47327 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to annie, 2, #1431 of 1444 🔗

It’s more than possible to get a group together in Gulag Wales. Have you never watched the Great Escape. Or Chicken Run?

47330 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to annie, 2, #1432 of 1444 🔗

Love the idea. We (OH and I) are in the High Peak but would travel!

47404 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #1433 of 1444 🔗

I’m near Holme Moss.

47350 ▶▶ TyLean, replying to annie, #1434 of 1444 🔗

Yes, yes, yes. Will travel. Yes.

47355 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to annie, #1435 of 1444 🔗

Very possible here. Anywhere from Stirling to Devon is an easy day’s drive for me.

47359 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Nick Rose, #1436 of 1444 🔗

And if bivvying out, anywhere mainland UK

47357 ▶▶ TyLean, replying to annie, #1437 of 1444 🔗

If I may be so bold as to put myself forward for organising details….. for one, because we’re travelling at present. For two, because I have a lot of experience managing “on the road,” and for three, because I am highly “googleable” and you can all vet me by searching TyLean and know that I am who I say I am. I’ll create a separate post at the top.

47344 Julian, replying to Julian, 6, #1438 of 1444 🔗

Dear GrantM I would normally say that taking advice from strangers on the Internet isn’t a good idea, but I really think it’s probably not that healthy for you to post abuse here and receive it back. Most people on here like a good argument and would be happy to engage in a debate on these issues, but you don’t seem to want to engage, you just rant and swear. I don’t think your ranting and swearing is upsetting anyone except probably you. Perhaps you could write a few paragraphs setting out your views on lockdown, masks, and the “pandemic”.

47573 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Julian, #1439 of 1444 🔗

I think it’s best to collectively just ignore GrantM. We should all agree not to respond to any of his posts. I note on the latest LS of the 11th, he’s getting more vile…..

48313 ▶▶ matt, replying to Julian, #1440 of 1444 🔗

Has he been back? Honestly can’t keep track of the comments anymore, and just looked but can’t find him.

47363 TyLean, 3, #1441 of 1444 🔗

Hello All,

Firstly, thank you so much for all the kind words last night. It’s been very encouraging having you here. (And another thank you to Toby for creating this space for us).

Meeting in person has been proposed, and I am volunteering myself to do some organising… we’re on the road at the moment and could do several locations, but also, because my identity online is very easy to check out, and I think – rightfully so – people may have hesitation about sharing identifiable info. If you google TyLean…. you will find me. (I may have dropped in the search engines having lost interest in the social media game).

Please email tylean .com if you want to meet in real time – let me know the geographical area you’re happy to travel and rough dates/times you can meet.

Edit: Also you can email if you are happy to host and/or have suggestions for a good venue.

47374 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, #1442 of 1444 🔗

Vernon Coleman on the dangers of hand sanitisers:


47464 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Bart Simpson, #1443 of 1444 🔗

“More and more people are waking up and I firmly believe that together, we WILL win this fight.”
Thank you Dr. Vernon Coleman

48307 matt, #1444 of 1444 🔗

Just sent this to the editor of the spectator. More in hope than expectation, but I thought… why not?


In her otherwise excellent article, Kate Andrews refers to Covid turning “our world upside down.”

Not so. Our world has indeed been turned upside down, not by the virus itself but by the overreaction of many western governments, our own included. It may have been understandable at the end of March that any government would be panicked by public pressure and international example – not to mention the catastrophist modelling of certain academic bodies – into imposing quarantine on an entire population, but the continued obsession with the virus is irrational.

The science has become clearer over time and shows with high probability that we are not facing a virus that is epoch-defining in its lethality or transmissibility and yet our government persists in pretending otherwise and is ably assisted by continuing terror stories produced by the majority of media outlets, most notably the BBC and the Guardian. The economy can never return to normality while a proportion of the public are too scared to leave their houses and the rest would rather steer clear of the dystopian unpleasantness we are forced to endure in shops, cafes, pubs and restaurants. The encouragement to wear “face coverings” cannot help to give confidence, as it creates a sense of abnormality for all.

I fear that a “v-shaped” economic recovery is now beyond reach. Nonetheless, if Messrs Johnson and Sunak genuinely hope for a recovery of any kind, now is the time to begin admitting to the public that we have little to fear and that we can return to normal as long as we take care of those among us who are old or sick or both.

Yours faithfully,


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