2020-07-24

Sourcehttps://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/07/24/latest-news-83/
Published2020-07-24T08:34:49
Last updated2020-07-24T16:20:44
Scraped2020-12-20T20:18:04
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61824 Geraint, replying to Geraint, 105, #1 of 1523 🔗

We are now living in a ‘Medico-Fascist’ state. The public health mafia and academic medics – epidemiologists with their assumption-riddled models, virologists with their umpteen different theories regarding transmission, virulence and mortality etc – seem to be driving the agenda that the politicians are lapping up and arming the police to implement their sinister control policies. This is being supported by the compliant state broadcaster (BBC) and most of the rest of the media. Most of the public are cowed, some are aggressively supporting this hysteria and loss of freedoms. We must resist this with every fibre: NO LOCKDOWN, NO MASKS, NO CONTROL, NO SELL-OUT. Freedom is expensive to get and easy to lose, or have it wrested from you….

62048 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Geraint, 19, #2 of 1523 🔗

That’s a pretty good summary.

The only modification I would make is to note that there are out there some good scientists who haven’t abandoned the proper basis of rational enquiry or medical ethics – people such as Professors Heneghan and Gupta. The problem is that they are given far less airtime than the graduates of the Mengele O.B.N school.

It’s interesting how many of the latter school, who do boast knighthoods and other trappings of favour are all over the airwaves like a rash when it comes to donning jackboots on the basis of a lethal combination of poor science and crap politics.

62256 ▶▶ PWL, replying to Geraint, #3 of 1523 🔗

It’s like I say, “the Nazis used junk science to legitimise a philosophy for enabling a technocracy”:
http://www.frombehindenemylines.org.uk/2020/05/surveying-the-triangulation-of-uk-governments-covid-19-tyranny-nazism-and-the-collective-of-equals/

62261 ▶▶▶ PWL, replying to PWL, #4 of 1523 🔗

And elsewhere “the NHS can reasonably be compared to the Nazi SS, because… ‘it is in the lead in the cult by which Britain is tyrannised'”:
http://www.frombehindenemylines.org.uk/2020/05/track-and-trace-and-the-difference-between-covid-19-and-from-with-coronavirus/

62328 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to PWL, #5 of 1523 🔗

While NHS is lauded as ‘our guys on the frontline’ (who have the same statistical ‘covid’ profile as the general population), the CVS is in full swing.

62746 ▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to PWL, #6 of 1523 🔗

SS ? S eventy S eventh (Brigade) Wasting your time (and money) on Facebook and everywhere else.

63875 ▶▶▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to PWL, #7 of 1523 🔗

That would be the NHS who seem to have sat on my wife’s brain scan for a suspected tumour for the last 10 weeks.

62403 ▶▶ SD67, replying to Geraint, #8 of 1523 🔗

It’s the health equivalent of the Military Industrial Complex

62734 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Geraint, 8, #9 of 1523 🔗

south coast today, no masks anywhere, cafe full , no masks, people walking no masks. its almost like the old normal.

62737 ▶▶▶ Digital Nomad, replying to Dan Clarke, 8, #10 of 1523 🔗

Given the ‘Small Businesses That Have Re-Opened’ section on the website has now been rendered obsolete by events, it should be amended to ‘Small Businesses That Have Rejected the mask mandate’ subito , Toby!

61833 Simon Dutton, replying to Simon Dutton, 6, #11 of 1523 🔗
62334 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Simon Dutton, #12 of 1523 🔗

He knows his stuff.
“The lie becomes the truth.”
Indeed!

61836 Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 153, #13 of 1523 🔗

2 hours into my shift in the family convenience store. Unmasked customers are outnumbering the muzzled nearly 2 to 1, with a few even happy to tell me that they think this whole charade is a load of old bollocks.

Going well isn’t it, Mr Hancock!

61842 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to Scotty87, 58, #14 of 1523 🔗

This is our only hope, that the public finally just start to ignore the government.

61844 ▶▶ Andy C, replying to Scotty87, 38, #15 of 1523 🔗

Good stuff. The only way to defeat measures like this is to turn them into the farce they deserve to be. I’ll be visiting my local shop later today, and I can’t imagine for one second that masks will be any more prevalent than they were yesterday.

61871 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Scotty87, 20, #16 of 1523 🔗

Go Scotty! Saw that wazzock on Simon Dolan saying you won’t have any customers cos you are killing them all. You are my kind of murderer 🙂

61898 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Scotty87, 9, #17 of 1523 🔗

YAY!!!!

61914 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Scotty87, 19, #18 of 1523 🔗

Fingers crossed that this will continue and grow. Hopefully the gov and MSM don’t organise a couple of high profile “incidents” to scare the masses into obeying.

61932 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 10, #19 of 1523 🔗

…although they will most probably try!

62009 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 7, #20 of 1523 🔗

Boris has been out full of bullshit and propaganda already: “tough times ahead” etc etc.

62821 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cheezilla, #21 of 1523 🔗
62137 ▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Carrie, 13, #22 of 1523 🔗

Well yes, look what happened when pubs first opened – so called positive cases made 3 pubs have to close. Not heard any more having to close. I am only going in ones that don’t collect names and if I am caught out have 2 ready none names. These really are depressing times.

61998 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Lockdown Truth, 16, #23 of 1523 🔗

You can almost guarantee if compliance isnt as high as they want, they’ll manufacture some ‘spikes’ and really ramp up the creepy authoritarian adverts for masks

‘Wear a mask or you’ll kill your gran’

In fact, that IT Crowd scene about copyright privacy springs to mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALZZx1xmAzg

62258 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Mark II, 8, #24 of 1523 🔗

Although it’s more like you’ll kill someone else’s gran so that’s why strangers will shame/attack you.

It’s nice the way they have made it “your mask protects me, my mask protects you” so it means if I don’t wear a mask i don’t want to protect you or your gran.

62264 ▶▶▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Lockdown Truth, 12, #25 of 1523 🔗

I was told this by my GP friend last night. That literally I didn’t have any empathy for others. What can you say?!

62339 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Country Mumkin, 23, #26 of 1523 🔗

Looking at how many GPs are (not) treating their paients at the moment, that’s rather hypocritical!

63087 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Cheezilla, #27 of 1523 🔗

That about sums them up. Overpaid bags of wind.

62396 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #28 of 1523 🔗

idiot?

62515 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Country Mumkin, 17, #29 of 1523 🔗

That’ll be one of the GPs that ran for the hills when this all started and now refuse to let their patients see them one to one then? Wow, that’s empathetic. What this whole thing has taught me is that a lot of (if not most) GPs are idiots. (I make exceptions for the couple/few who post here.)

63089 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Bella, #30 of 1523 🔗

Yes a few honourable exceptions.

62712 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #31 of 1523 🔗

Has your GP friend lost many patients to cv19?

63086 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Country Mumkin, #32 of 1523 🔗

Like most GPs he’s an overpaid know nothing.

62508 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Lockdown Truth, 4, #33 of 1523 🔗

Not interested in their gran. Tell her she doesn’t need to come anywhere near me.

62561 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Lockdown Truth, 5, #34 of 1523 🔗

Indeed, to which I would say, please feel free to take your mask off too, just dont cough or sneeze in my face, or come and lick me, and we’ll be all good. I promise not to go and assault your gran, now kindly fuck off and leave me alone haha

62587 ▶▶▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to Lockdown Truth, 4, #35 of 1523 🔗

Thing is, I’ve been killing people already all my life by this reasoning, so why stop now!

61999 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Scotty87, 4, #36 of 1523 🔗

HURRAY!!!

62131 ▶▶ wendy, replying to Scotty87, 3, #37 of 1523 🔗

Fantastic

62132 ▶▶ annie, replying to Scotty87, 7, #38 of 1523 🔗

Cheers.
Death to Handjob.

62213 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Scotty87, 3, #39 of 1523 🔗

First bit of good news I’ve had for some time…..

62246 ▶▶ Jonathan Smith, replying to Scotty87, 19, #40 of 1523 🔗

Just been to the local Co-op. It was muzzle central sadly. The majority of people were muzzled on the street too. Staff in the chemist were dressed in a way more appropriate for an operating theatre. Ridiculous.

62391 ▶▶▶ InfiniteDissent, replying to Jonathan Smith, 1, #41 of 1523 🔗

Same in Waitrose this morning. Almost 100% mask wearing as far as I could see. I think it depends on the demographic — well-off middle-class people are more likely to do what they’re told (presumably due to the acute embarrassment they would suffer from being told off in public).

62839 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Jonathan Smith, #42 of 1523 🔗

Watch the 1968 film, Candy, and you will see James Coburn perform a very delicate brain surgery operation. Not to be missed.

62845 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Jonathan Smith, 4, #43 of 1523 🔗

Same in my local Coop today. As I walked in a man on his way out chirped up “you’ve to wear a mask, mate” in an aggressive tone, so I just growled “no, I don’t” to him and carried on. But I can see how fights will break out over this.

Each and every one, and all the consequences of them, to be laid personally at the feet of each and every member of the government.

62394 ▶▶ watashi, replying to Scotty87, 3, #45 of 1523 🔗

I`m so happy to read this 🙂

62775 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Scotty87, 2, #46 of 1523 🔗

Well done Scotty!!!!

61879 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to Geraint, 5, #48 of 1523 🔗

How could such selfless and wonderful people take advantage like that! It must be fake news (not).

62045 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Geraint, 4, #49 of 1523 🔗

Bloris just visited Tollgate Medical Centre in Beckton, London. Here are the press photos. The NHS staff make Bloris look slim!

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62056 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Cheezilla, 16, #50 of 1523 🔗

What a knob!

62927 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cheezilla, #51 of 1523 🔗

Is this Boris Not Goodenov’s lesson for the day? Out with the fist bump, in with the elbow bump. The New Normal.

63012 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #52 of 1523 🔗

PM Johnson. What a maroon!

63020 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #53 of 1523 🔗

Why is elbow bumping OK when we are encouraged to cough into our elbows? Fauci fond of standing with his arms crossed too I notice transferring infection from sputum laden elbow to hands. Best not to even attempt to look for logic if madness is to be avoided.

62280 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Geraint, 3, #54 of 1523 🔗

No wonder so many NHS staff are so fat.

62655 ▶▶▶ alison, replying to Lms23, 5, #55 of 1523 🔗

I know I shouldn’t even try to engage with the claptrap on it’s own terms but honestly, can’t Boris at least keep track of the stupid guidance? He’s less than 2m, less than 1m away from the woman in these pictures. He’s touching her for pete’s sake. I thought we were all supposed to remember that masks don’t ameliorate from need for all the social distancing hoo-ha? If he’s going to impose irrational rules, he could at least make the effort to recall what they are.

63134 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to alison, #56 of 1523 🔗

Magic Mask Trumps All.

61839 Caro7777, 7, #57 of 1523 🔗

I’m not that comforted by the official twitter statements by Sainsbury’s. The lockdown induced panic has spawned a wave of bossy jobsworths who are relishing their little bit of power at this time. I’m afraid I will have to give way because i don’t like being harangued by a 20 year old in a panic.

61840 BecJT, replying to BecJT, 31, #58 of 1523 🔗

The government have rewritten section 6.1 overnight, yesterday it said there was very little evidence for masks and the effects would be very small, now it’s gone. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/working-safely-during-coronavirus-covid-19/offices-and-contact-centres#offices-6-1

61859 ▶▶ Lili, replying to BecJT, 25, #59 of 1523 🔗

Down the 1984 memory hole.

61864 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Lili, 20, #60 of 1523 🔗

They will have to be busy at the ministry of truth because there are still a lot of videos circulating of our leaders and great scientific minds,saying that wearing a mask is next to useless.

62752 ▶▶▶▶ Gracie Knoll, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 4, #61 of 1523 🔗

Manufacturers are even putting disclaimers on boxes of masks confirming that they’re effing useless:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ec9KBE7WkAIH7Yt?format=png&name=small

You could find a packet of masks displaying this caveat, show it to a store employee or a terrified mask zealot, and ask them WHY we might be being told by our Dictatorship to wear something that the manufacturer knows, and the Dictatorship knows, and the pseudoscientists “advising” the Dictatorship know, are nothing more than a placebo at best.

Then wait for the cognitive dissonance to kick in.

61886 ▶▶▶ Andy Riley, replying to Lili, 6, #62 of 1523 🔗

Except that we now have WayBackMachine the internet archive
https://archive.org/web/web.php

61921 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Andy Riley, 1, #63 of 1523 🔗

You can request to be opted out of that though…

61920 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to BecJT, 3, #64 of 1523 🔗

Is there a copy of the previous guidance available?

62002 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #65 of 1523 🔗

Yeah, does someone have a copy of the original?

62100 ▶▶▶▶ microdave, replying to Moomin, 22, #66 of 1523 🔗

Fortunately, I saved the complete web page yesterday – here’s the relevant part (with my bolding):

6.1 Face coverings There are some circumstances when wearing a face covering may be marginally beneficial as a precautionary measure. The evidence suggests that wearing a face covering does not protect you, but it may protect others if you are infected but have not developed symptoms . However, workers and visitors who want to wear a face covering should be allowed to do so.
A face covering can be very simple and may be worn in enclosed spaces where social distancing isn’t possible. It just needs to cover your mouth and nose. It is not the same as a face mask, such as the surgical masks or respirators used by health and care workers. Similarly, face coverings are not the same as the PPE used to manage risks like dust and spray in an industrial context. Supplies of PPE, including face masks, must continue to be reserved for those who need them to protect against risks in their workplace, such as health and care workers, and those in industrial settings like those exposed to dust hazards.
It is important to know that the evidence of the benefit of using a face covering to protect others is weak and the effect is likely to be small , therefore face coverings are not a replacement for the other ways of managing risk, including minimising time spent in contact, using fixed teams and partnering for close-up work, and increasing hand and surface washing. These other measures remain the best ways of managing risk in the workplace and government would therefore not expect to see employers relying on face coverings as risk management for the purpose of their health and safety assessments.

And what it shows today:

6.1 Face coverings There is growing evidence that wearing a face covering in an enclosed space helps protect individuals and those around them from COVID-19 .
A face covering can be very simple and may be worn in enclosed spaces where social distancing isn’t possible. It just needs to cover your mouth and nose. It is not the same as a face mask, such as the surgical masks or respirators used by health and care workers. Similarly, face coverings are not the same as the PPE used to manage risks like dust and spray in an industrial context. Supplies of PPE, including face masks, must continue to be reserved for those who need them to protect against risks in their workplace, such as health and care workers, and those in industrial settings like those exposed to dust hazards.
Face coverings are not a replacement for the other ways of managing risk, including minimising time spent in contact, using fixed teams and partnering for close-up work, and increasing hand and surface washing. These other measures remain the best ways of managing risk in the workplace and government would therefore not expect to see employers relying on face coverings as risk management for the purpose of their health and safety assessments.

If Toby wants the complete page I’ll be happy to forward it on.

62254 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to microdave, 5, #67 of 1523 🔗

Well done!

62407 ▶▶▶▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to microdave, 3, #68 of 1523 🔗

Classic stuff here! Brilliant.

62530 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to microdave, 2, #69 of 1523 🔗

Copy and pasted for my files.

62742 ▶▶▶▶▶ ikaraki, replying to microdave, 1, #70 of 1523 🔗

Excellent work!

62755 ▶▶▶▶▶ Gracie Knoll, replying to microdave, 1, #71 of 1523 🔗

And the disclaimers now printed on the boxes!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ec9KBE7WkAIH7Yt?format=png&name=small

62817 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Steve, replying to Gracie Knoll, 2, #72 of 1523 🔗

The ones my wife bought from Aldi just in case (now personalised with various anti mask slogans), clearly state on the front ‘not to be used as PPE or for medical purposes’. What is the point in this?

62823 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Gracie Knoll, replying to Steve, 1, #73 of 1523 🔗

Mask wearing is simply a tool to soften us up for the COMPULSORY Final Solution® Eugenics Vaccine from God-Emperor Bill Gates.

63092 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Gracie Knoll, #74 of 1523 🔗

Exactly. We are in very deep trouble.

63091 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Steve, #75 of 1523 🔗

It is to make us compliant and demand to be injected with Gates’s depopulating witches brew. And of course to make people look as stupid as most are. Present company excepted, of course.

62934 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Gracie Knoll, #76 of 1523 🔗

Send a copy to Boris.

63138 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to richard riewer, #77 of 1523 🔗

To the person who spells out long words for him.

63136 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Gracie Knoll, 1, #78 of 1523 🔗

They always were!
Meanwhile, our town is awash with hand filth. All ‘anti- bacterial’. Mostly made in China.
Does the bottle/flask/ vat/barrel say that this muck is useless against viruses?
No. Lying by silence.
And the residue goes straight into the sea.

61935 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to BecJT, 2, #79 of 1523 🔗

Funny that….not!

62337 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to BecJT, 8, #80 of 1523 🔗

Are you kidding me? And I thought I was a last-minute cowboy …

Government’s July 24th checklist:

  • BBC story coercion … check
  • public shame campaign … check
  • NHS photo opportunities … check
  • Remove contradictory government literature …. che- … oh fuck!

It’s here, by the way, the original:

https://web.archive.org/web/20200721090202/https://www.gov.uk/guidance/working-safely-during-coronavirus-covid-19/offices-and-contact-centres

62341 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to HaylingDave, 1, #81 of 1523 🔗

Make a copy before it disappears!

62936 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to HaylingDave, #82 of 1523 🔗

Here today, gone tomorrow. Are they trying to muddle our brains or is it their brains that are muddled?

61845 BecJT, replying to BecJT, 47, #83 of 1523 🔗

From a scientist friend this morning as a rebuttal to the mask zealots: T here is clear evidence that obesity is a massive risk factor for Covid. Let’s apply the same logic. Let’s imagine the government introduced a law to mandate a maximum calorie intake per day of 1500 calories. Being over weight is a known risk factor for ending up in hospital if you catch CV. So a policy that enforced weight loss would mean putting less pressure on health services. By losing weight an individual could help others by making sure they weren’t blocking an intensive care bed that someone else needed to stay alive. A very clear evidence based policy could be made to predict how many lives this law might save – and after all even if it doesn’t save lives it might so surely we should just do it anyway just in case. It’s just an easy thing to do and it’s temporary. We could all then shame fat people in public safe in the knowledge it was for the greater good, and in doing so we were demonstrating we care about others. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(20)30208-X/fulltext

61852 ▶▶ IanE, replying to BecJT, 5, #84 of 1523 🔗

Tee Hee – “Look at Boris”, the muzzealots must surely see him as a mass-murderer (and that is ignoring the large-scale corporate manslaughter of which his government is guilty.

63097 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to IanE, #85 of 1523 🔗

Yes, Boris and his team of useless eaters have allowed thousands to die, by suspending medical services for the non-Covid sick. They need to be charged at a minimum with criminal negligence.

61853 ▶▶ mjr, replying to BecJT, 4, #86 of 1523 🔗

And of course, if you are wearing a mask and cannot remove it. you cannot eat . the equivalent of a gastric band . simples

62605 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to mjr, 2, #87 of 1523 🔗

Much cheaper than the surgical gastric bands that Boris was proposing to offer for the obese at the expense of the taxpayer….

61880 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to BecJT, 4, #88 of 1523 🔗

The campaign for this starts today – https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53522492

62072 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Polemon2, 11, #89 of 1523 🔗

This is actually worrying because it will depend who advises the government, which foods are affected.

The current epidemic of obesity and diabetes has been caused by decades of government propaganda to eat less real food like butter, eggs and meat and to eat a lot more seed oils and grains – all made palatable by artificial sweeteners and GM HFCS.

This has been encouraged by supermarkets, whose shelves are mainly full of what I consider to be non-food. Lots of low nutrition in pretty boxes that keeps for weeks on their shelves.

62083 ▶▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Cheezilla, 11, #90 of 1523 🔗

The elephant in the room ( pun intended ), is exercise. A good balanced diet, fresh air and exercise should have been the public health message from the start.

62156 ▶▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to PoshPanic, #91 of 1523 🔗

+ vitamin D and zinc to fortify the immune system.

62355 ▶▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to PoshPanic, #92 of 1523 🔗

I have a set of old encylopedias that show this WAS known and practiced as standard health care and advice until the Antibiotic struck back.

62144 ▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #93 of 1523 🔗

I agree, and have often made this point online. Fatties and smokers and those who eat an unhealthy diet as pushed by the MSM (which includes, actually, a lot of “heart-healthy” foods such as refined seed oils) are affecting my health and the cost of my health care, because they degrade the insurance pool, or whatever that is called.

The obesity issue is, along with nursing home deaths, the obvious elephant in the room in the USA death count (and general poor health profile of the US population and esp. of minorities).

62176 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jane, #94 of 1523 🔗

I’m affecting your health by smoking, as it ‘degrades the insurance pool’ ?! But you’re not sure what it is called.

Rarely does one get the chance to witness such a well presented argument, Jane. 🙂

62162 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #95 of 1523 🔗

Seeds, grains, legumes, and nuts are good. And are recommended in the Bible. 🙂

The stuff you mention is also good, Cheese, along with fish, roots, and fruit. And of course chocolate ! Hence the balanced diet recommendation.

62406 ▶▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to JohnB, #96 of 1523 🔗

The US Military Industrial Complex set the plan for Food Control post ww2. (Seeds of Destruction by F. William Engdahl has relevance for the capture and control of Food production, processing and distribution – which is part of the bio-tec 4th reich that promotes itself through ‘our Boris’ as a Bright New Future. (See Boris’s inaugural scripted speech at the UN)

The agribusiness model or ‘green revolution’ used Big Oil and Big Money to drive out smaller farmers. And so aggressive PR was used to undermine the old normal under mask of science – so as to promote seed oils as a health alternative to butter or lard. Quite apart from the methods of mass farming using toxic biocides – whose consequence is hidden for the most part by ‘infectious diseases’ or idiopathic new disease conditions, the balance of omega 3 and omega 6 fatty acids is reversed so as to undermine rather than serve health, and the oils themselves are much more unstable with regard to oxidising – for the most part and this also adds to an oxidative load that uses up our antioxidants. On top of which there are chemical processes for non cold-pressed oils that add further toxic opportunity to what passes as food – but was not available in Bible times. But they knew about poisoning by stealth and guile.

Deceit is where the forms of something is masked in and passed off as true. Once the trojan is ‘taken in’ the insider job is effected to break down defences from within.

Those who sleepwalk in surface appearances are essentially phished by manipulative intent – and in a sense are asking for it by shutting down their own discernment in blind trust to worldy authorities.

So we have ourselves an Educational Crash Course in true discernment or the scrabble to align an identity under a systemic adulteration of the data and especially of its interpretation. In any case we have a Global Crash by Design, of an enormity that we haven’t had in living memory – that the controllers believe or desperately intend – to manage so as to rest a much contracted and systematically controlled ‘economy’ over an effectively erased consciousness of groupthink compliance and collective conformity.
Are the controllers actually in control or able to command the situation?
Or are they lured by false promise and goaded by fear of loss of the little they have – because control agenda demands sacrifice of self to orders from above or else!
False premises and false profits deliver unto war on truth of exposure – and if sickness and limitation mitigates the total loss – it becomes the necessary lie.

63371 ▶▶▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to JohnB, #97 of 1523 🔗

red wine also

62352 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Cheezilla, #98 of 1523 🔗

You are closer to the truth. The popular view that fat or obese people are lazy and eat too many calories is a convenient cover story for systemic targeting of the unwary – and the poor in particular with junk foods and other exposures that breakdown the capacity to digest properly (antibiotic effects of such as glyphosate et al, and lack actual nutrition as a result of what is in it, what is done to it and how it is grown. And so there is a case to understand obesity as malnutrition and a compromised immune system. So indeed lack of real foods for those who for whatever reasons most readily conform to agri-corps food management Inc. This is set to radically shift to bio-tech genetically grown factory phoods – along with driving not just people but farmers from the land.

The Medical Mafia is NOT new. Iatrogenic disease is probably topping the charts – but officially it comes in third for UK and US.
We have an Economy driven by debt and coercion that feeds on war and sickness – but until it came home – no one was too bothered.

61902 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to BecJT, 4, #99 of 1523 🔗

The logical conclusion to this is a sort of mask that is not removable, for fatties, like a prison ankle tag, with a special flap that only opens for a short time every day to allow the specified amount of calories to be ingested, then closes again.

62057 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to BecJT, 2, #100 of 1523 🔗

If they use the Fergoid model, it would prove they could save trillions of lives!

A&E checking your BMI before allowing you a bed.

Food stores refusing entry to people whose waist to height ratio was too high ….

62066 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to BecJT, 5, #101 of 1523 🔗

I think applying the same logic as facemasks would mean everyone else should wear hazmat suites to protect vulnerable overweight people.

Of course, the logical consequence of all this is that everyone should wear hazmat suites & be tightly controlled forever, since you never know what bugs might be lurking around – even a common cold could kill someone vulnerable!

62145 ▶▶ annie, replying to BecJT, 2, #102 of 1523 🔗

And supermarkets should refuse to sell them fattening foods.

62349 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to annie, 3, #103 of 1523 🔗

Supermarkets would never adopt that policy. With the possible exception of Aldi and its emphasis on fresh produce, supermarket shelves are three-quarters full of fattening food.

62959 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to annie, 3, #104 of 1523 🔗

Here we go. You are all losing the plot. You are complaining about the government imposing laws and restrictions on your lives then you rant and rave about people eating fatty foods, smoking, drinking too much beer, eating too many sweets, being obese, etc. You are acting just like the Government. Live let live or shut the fuck up!

62159 ▶▶ wendy, replying to BecJT, 6, #105 of 1523 🔗

This is my pet subject. We can perhaps say the obese persons life style choices are the greatest threat to the nhs that there is and by implication to the health of everyone else in terms of resource use and income tax and availability of services. It’s an extremely emotive subject but it’s a good way to try challenge and get people to look at the absurdity of what has and is currently going on.

62361 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to wendy, 6, #106 of 1523 🔗

I don’t think it’s simply about their lifestyle choices.
We’ve been propagandised for decades with lies such as cholesterol causes heart disease, that eggs are unhealthy and that seed oils and grains are a healthy alternative.
It’s been a very successful psy-op which has caused much ill health and suffering. The MSM has played the same part as with the current covid lie, though the covid one has been easier to see because of the compressed timescale.

62866 ▶▶ NickR, replying to BecJT, 1, #108 of 1523 🔗

I fail to see why if we’re all happy to give up basic freedoms to do things that are a total waste of time, such as mask wearing, we shouldn’t also be compelled to do sensible things like exercise for 2 hours a day, take vitamin c, d & zinc & eat fresh fruit& vegetables.

62942 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to BecJT, 2, #109 of 1523 🔗

Public Health England would love it if you jumped on their anti-sugar, anti-obesity, anti anti anti bandwagon. With them, one step leads to another. That’s why we’re in this mess right now. Defund and disband all ot them and we will see a much more pleasant society to live in for most us.

61846 Steve, replying to Steve, 1, #110 of 1523 🔗

If you look at the actual legislation on face coverings, and in particular the exemption list https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/791/schedule/made you will probably be surprised for just how much is exempt. Take item 17 for example…

62092 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Steve, #111 of 1523 🔗

What would the rationale for item 19 (casinos) be?

62151 ▶▶ Jane, replying to Steve, 3, #112 of 1523 🔗

This is really quite weird.
Seems like all of the addictions and luxuries are privileged, whereas essentials such as food stores are not. . .

62194 ▶▶ Fed up, replying to Steve, 2, #113 of 1523 🔗

If you also look at what section it is made under you will see that by reason of urgency it was not laid before both Houses. Urgency as considered by Secretary of State. Is in the introduction

62384 ▶▶▶ InfiniteDissent, replying to Fed up, #114 of 1523 🔗

It was so “urgent” that they waited two whole weeks to implement it after the announcement, but they couldn’t find time to debate it in parliament during those two weeks because of its “urgency”.

61850 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 36, #115 of 1523 🔗

The fantastic news about Nick Buckley is a ray of sunshine on an otherwise very grim day. Well done to the FSU and Toby. I strongly recommend everyone to join the FSU because this situation is going to get worse before it gets better, not least for those of us publicly espousing Covid-sceptical views.

61961 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #116 of 1523 🔗

Well done to Tony & Team

62175 ▶▶ wendy, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 9, #117 of 1523 🔗

Yes, I second that as I am losing friends and family all the time. If I want to see these people I have to keep my mouth shut which is unpleasant. Another issue is anyone admitted to hospital with a virus is painted as Covid when in fact there are many other viruses which cause illness and death. It’s as if no one knew this before and has conveniently forgotten it now.

62452 ▶▶▶ Binra, replying to wendy, #118 of 1523 🔗

I agree with your message in principle but add that a lack of true nutrition, toxic ingestions and exposures, persistent strain of conflicted psychic-emotional imbalance and Iatrogenesis all play a larger role in disease than the trillion dollar virology-cum bio-genetics lobby would want you to know.
The use of fear to sharpen the mind can also be used to shape the charge to specified research goals.
Such that vast sums are diverted to research climate – but through the Anthropomorphic narrative assertion. Not to study climatology as a whole.
Likewise the findings of biology far exceed the applications allowed into a virologically controlled narrative.

If you stress or shock or toxify cell cultures – they produce viral reactions.
The thing about investing in false premises, that initially seem to profit us, is that when it becomes apparent we were wrong, we rarely openly admit the error, but seek to conceal it in the extension of the false premise, adjusted to mask the true disclosure. This generates a coercive and opaque or schizophrenic and pathological mindset of fragmentation that becomes ever more lost in its own spin.
It is not just the Captains of Industry who and Leaders of State who generate this but all who are invested in the narrative identity that has been asserted and defended as righteous – set over an against feared or hated outcomes.

The ‘authorities’ have the stick by which to induce compliance, but no one will listen to what they are unwilling and unready to hear – and so they will hear whatever serves their sense of self and need in the situation as they see it.

Giving freedom to another is of course accepting them as they are instead of needing them to be what we want or think they should be. If others feel accepted, then there will be openings of willingness to share life – and this is best guided by the Life – and not by fitting to an agenda.
Of course this is all breaking down our sense of self and world, and therefore we need to find and hold our centre if we are to be open to the opportunities for sharing in true witness that ARE available.

62545 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to wendy, 3, #119 of 1523 🔗

Friend of mine has had gastric symptoms that have been worrying her for three months. GP (over phone of course) said it might be Covid (!!!!????) and prescribed antibiotics (for a friggin’ virus!!!!)????) No question of getting a referral.

61854 David Mc, replying to David Mc, 24, #120 of 1523 🔗

Toby, the silence of the human rights lobby is not at all surprising to anybody who has been closely following the career of human rights law over the past few decades, as I have. (It’s my day job.) Human rights long ago transformed from being the legal means by which the individual is protected from the state, into the legal justification for its “positive” action. To your average modern human rights advocate, human rights are achieved BY the state, which is supposed to “protect, respect and fulfil” them. To such people there is therefore no controversy in lockdowns whatsoever: they help us to fulfil our right to health and ultimately our right to life, from which all other rights stem. Case closed.

61868 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to David Mc, 2, #121 of 1523 🔗

I’ve written to Liberty three times, not a sausage!

61875 ▶▶▶ Rachel, replying to BecJT, #122 of 1523 🔗

Have you seen this https://liberty.e-activist.com/page/63681/petition/1?ea.tracking.id=Website . Just not at all well subscribed. Perhaps it says something about their supporters? But anyway, it’s there.

61906 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to BecJT, 1, #123 of 1523 🔗

Liberty SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!

61947 ▶▶▶ Jubs, replying to BecJT, 4, #124 of 1523 🔗

I’ve written to them too and received zero response. The silence from all these organisations is deafening and utterly bizarre.

62375 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Jubs, 1, #125 of 1523 🔗

They’re probably too busy sitting furloughed in their gardens to be answering emails.

61870 ▶▶ Rachel, replying to David Mc, 3, #126 of 1523 🔗

Toby, I found this petition from Liberty https://liberty.e-activist.com/page/63681/petition/1?ea.tracking.id=Website , which is bang on the money, ie repeal the bloody act. I don’t know why it hasn’t been picked up more by social media (they have 65K followers), or maybe I do. Anyway, my point was that at least one reasonably high profile human rights org (even if I don’t agree with everything they’re about) has started up precisely the sort of petition that is needed. Maybe lockdown sceptics can help get the word out more? Thanks Rachel.

61878 ▶▶ IanE, replying to David Mc, 2, #127 of 1523 🔗

Yes – I think Toby was just pointing this out!

61937 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to David Mc, 8, #128 of 1523 🔗

I just looked at the 38Degrees website – all the front page and all the promoted campaigns = the usual virtue signalling BS. Not one campaign about lockdown, masks, shutting down of NHS services, etc. FAIL

63003 ▶▶▶ John Devine, replying to Lockdown Truth, #129 of 1523 🔗

I unsubscribed from 38 Degrees earlier this week when they sent an email asking me to support a petition on mandatory mask wearing in every situation…

62152 ▶▶ annie, replying to David Mc, 3, #130 of 1523 🔗

But the European Court of Human Rights is loaded with cases of individuals against governments.
Of course, it has to be the right sort of individual and the right sort of government.

62966 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to annie, #131 of 1523 🔗

International Court of Justice. Yoohoo? Crickets.

62791 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to David Mc, #132 of 1523 🔗

Yes, that’s remarkable. Stalin as the agent of liberty for the oppressed proletariat.

61855 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 6, #133 of 1523 🔗

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-07-23/virus-can-jump-26-feet-at-cold-meat-plants-filled-with-stale-air?sref=ZMFHsM5Z
I only have the news report and not the original article. This is interesting as the investigators (according to another news agency summaries) also discarded cramped living conditions as a case of the outbreak, which was previously suspected. It seemed to be one person behind the whole outbreak. This is not surprising for anyone that a respiratory virus also can spread in the air for long distances even though it might not be the primary way of transmission. This virus behaves like all respiratory virus and you cannot use Laws against this virus or masks as it will always outsmart you. Even Michael Ryan, the discredited WHO lead, also admitted yesterday that we have to learn to live with this virus.

61938 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to swedenborg, 1, #134 of 1523 🔗

You couldn’t make it up!
Only they did…

62206 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 1, #135 of 1523 🔗

https://twitter.com/FrankfurtZack/status/1286570696399888384
This is getting more interesting. This plant was closed for a long time investment in brand new ventilation.Then opened to all recommendations done from experts. And just today the above“Twenty persons working in the plant has just been tested positive  for Covid-19 in the plant again”

62383 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to swedenborg, #136 of 1523 🔗

Dodgy batch of tests?

62380 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to swedenborg, 1, #137 of 1523 🔗

A virus can jump 50x further than a flea!
Who’d have thought it?

Remind me, how any legs does a virus have?

62970 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cheezilla, #138 of 1523 🔗

How do viruses compare with Mexican Jumping Beans?

61858 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 11, #139 of 1523 🔗
61877 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 12, #140 of 1523 🔗

He was a bullshitter at Eton, and remains so today

61883 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Cecil B, 6, #141 of 1523 🔗

He is becoming a pretty desperate bullshiter these days!

62025 ▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #142 of 1523 🔗

Always has been, always will be. He’s a farce and should never have been let anywhere near power. Same can be said for anyone who would be in line to replace him, unfortunately.

62300 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 10, #143 of 1523 🔗

So all those people who are cautious about being given a completely new, relatively untested vaccine are now considered the same as flat-earthers, “climate change deniers,” etc.
Or in other words, when they don’t have a good argument backed up by facts, they call you names instead.

61860 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 13, #144 of 1523 🔗

Lucky old England. In the Marxist utopia that is Wales the foul mouthed health secretary has ordered the permanent closure of all hospital A and E departments.(not I’m not making it up, google it).

It was found that during the non flu hysteria many empty wards achieved a zero mortality rate. In an effort to save more lives they will remain closed

On the upside local tax payers will receive a rebate proportionate to the cost savings (that bit I did make up)

61867 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Cecil B, 3, #145 of 1523 🔗

What the!?

61887 ▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Cecil B, #146 of 1523 🔗

Can’t find anything? There is discussion about adopting the Scandinavian system of non life threatening cases phoning ahead and getting a time to attend as opposed to sitting in A&E waiting rooms for 8 hours.

61952 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to The Spingler, 4, #148 of 1523 🔗

Where in Scandinavia is that? Not the case in Sweden… Here we have smaller ‘närakuten’ centres (not within the hospital), where they deal with minor injuries and illnesses (eg UTIs); you can only book under certain circumstances, but they have long opening times (closed at night though). They deal with urgent, but not immediately life-threatening cases.
It is sort of first come, first served, although some triaging goes on. They send you to A & E if they deem it necessary. It works well 🙂

62050 ▶▶▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to Carrie, 5, #149 of 1523 🔗

The more I hear about Sweden the more I like it!

62410 ▶▶▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Keen Cook, #150 of 1523 🔗

me too! seems like a good place to move to.

62982 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Keen Cook, #151 of 1523 🔗

Everybody move to Sweden! Bye Boris! Matt! Dominic! Cressida! Sadiq! Nicola! Enjoy ghost town London.

61942 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cecil B, 2, #152 of 1523 🔗

That surely can’t be true….
I did read an article on somewhere else, where you were going to have to book A & E appointments (hello, like you can ‘plan’ to break a limb or have a heart attack!), but closing A & E altogether????

61951 ▶▶ Jubs, replying to Cecil B, #153 of 1523 🔗

Not true of the Royal Glamorgan hospital: https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/local-news/health-board-confirms-royal-glamorgan-18507185 . I suspect they’re all trying to go over to the “phone triage first” system that’s currently on trial in Cardiff.

62230 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Jubs, #154 of 1523 🔗

Yet, you are on the list

61862 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 19, #155 of 1523 🔗

Supermarket pushing back?

Some days ago I posted on here my experience at Booths supermarket in Ilkley—Yorkshire, when I had a discussion with the store manager concerning the up coming masks guidance. This discussion was quite positive and the manager was pleasant and understanding. Lord knows it’s difficult for all of us, not least businesss, trying to make sense of this destructive governments’s policies as they roll out from day to day.

This morning I received an E-mail from Booths which indicates to me that they are trying to navigate the swamp of government ineptitude. This is it:

http://boothsnews.co.uk/interface/external_view_email.php?AJ91222662938228049553735zzzzz64e84c5cbaf82fe508a85fd9f91d9d66976b9342fa20de7f869c8c76565e80b886

So Booths are giving away sunflower lanyards that you can wear around your neck instead of a mask. Whilst it may not appeal to those of us who refuse to wear masks because it infringes our basic human rights it at least gives an avenue to those who have genuine health concerns and indeed those who would rather wear a lanyard than a mask. if push comes to shove I know which I would prefer. So I’m going to say to Booths a cautious—well done!
.

61881 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Harry hopkins, 4, #156 of 1523 🔗

But why should you wear a “mask substitute” ?

61888 ▶▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to arfurmo, 15, #157 of 1523 🔗

I totally agree and I won’t be wearing one myself. However, perhaps Booths are aware of the problem of ‘peer pressure’ and the totally disgraceful situation that might arise if and when people are verbally abused for not wearing a mask when their medical condition dictates that it would be harmful to them. And also, don’t forget, that whilst very many people think the whole mask business is a farce it’s not all of them who are like you and me and are determined to stick to our guns.

61889 ▶▶▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Harry hopkins, 8, #158 of 1523 🔗

A definite well done to Booths. I had a holiday job with them eons ago, making pizzas. Happy days 🙂

62103 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Harry hopkins, 1, #159 of 1523 🔗

A Booths senior executive was on BBC Breakfast this morning. He said all the stores would “greet” customers on arrival and inform them that they needed to wear a mask.

61890 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to arfurmo, 4, #160 of 1523 🔗

you are right – but what an excellent response from a responsible retailer…

62008 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Harry hopkins, 1, #161 of 1523 🔗

Good for them to be fair. I’m going to Ilkley this afternoon as it happens!

62371 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Harry hopkins, 7, #162 of 1523 🔗

That’s actually quite clever. Replace one pointless imposition with another pointless imposition that’s far less…… impositiony.

62395 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Harry hopkins, 5, #163 of 1523 🔗

Good for Booths, my favourite supermarket!
Ironically, Ilkley is my nearest one but not near enough for regular shopping.

If masks are supposed to instil confidence in scared shoppers, the lanyards will definitely increase confidence in those who can’t or don’t want to wear a mask.

It’s actually more of a symbol of power that it might at first look.

63014 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Harry hopkins, #164 of 1523 🔗

Don’t encourage them it might become permanent.

61863 BecJT, replying to BecJT, 55, #165 of 1523 🔗

The Indy lose the internet today. “ As a woman, I find wearing a face mask liberating – I’m no longer judged on my appearance”
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/women-face-masks-coronavirus-appearance-shopping-a9634506.html
These people’s minds are so open their brains have fallen out. It also confirms this is now about faith and honour, not science. Why not just mandate the niqab? Same difference.

61891 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to BecJT, 10, #166 of 1523 🔗

What kind of people even think of writing such articles? some of the stuff the mainstream media are producing every day is just absolutely crazy.

61893 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Darryl, 6, #167 of 1523 🔗

erm…. idiots?

61916 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Major Panic, 5, #168 of 1523 🔗

Useful IDIOTS

62399 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Major Panic, 3, #169 of 1523 🔗

The idiots are writing for even bigger idiots. It’s all a plot to make their readers’ brains dissolve completely.

Fortunately for us, we’re not their target audience of vain airheads.

61960 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Darryl, 5, #170 of 1523 🔗

People who have lost their other stream of income?

61904 ▶▶ Edna, replying to BecJT, 15, #171 of 1523 🔗

“These people’s minds are so open their brains have fallen out”
Great comment! Sad article though.

61965 ▶▶ Lili, replying to BecJT, 7, #172 of 1523 🔗

It’s the Sharia Independent – I’d expect nothing less.

62160 ▶▶ annie, replying to BecJT, 4, #173 of 1523 🔗

The bad, the bad and the ugly.
And, of course, the ugly woman wants all women to be equally ugly. If you haven’t read this

http://www.tnellen.com/cybereng/harrison.html

read it now.
.

62372 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to BecJT, 4, #174 of 1523 🔗

Get thee to Saudi Arabia!
🙄 🙄 🙄 🙄

63270 ▶▶▶ BecJT, replying to Farinances, 1, #175 of 1523 🔗

Telegraph running a ‘mask hair’ article, and I think it was Marie Claire, how to accentuate your eyes. Meanwhile all I’m thinking, “FFS we are celebrating people COVERING THEIR FACES!!”

62664 ▶▶ alison, replying to BecJT, 5, #176 of 1523 🔗

In a very crowded market, this is the stupidest thing I have seen in a week.

62690 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to BecJT, 2, #177 of 1523 🔗

That is the same reasoning that some Muslim women use to explain wearing the niqab & / or burka. It is also common in Japan – many women wear masks to hide they are not wearing make up. I despair – again!

62816 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to BecJT, 1, #178 of 1523 🔗

That’s crazy, its the same argument they were trotting out years ago after Jack Straw made his comments about the niqab being a barrier to communication.

62987 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to BecJT, 2, #179 of 1523 🔗

The government of Quebec wanted to ban Muslim women from wearing the hijab at their place of work eight years ago. The hysteria about it went on for months. They were also going to ban people wearing sunglasses from using public transport buses. Now they want us all to wear masks. Make up your mind, eh?

63271 ▶▶▶ BecJT, replying to richard riewer, 1, #180 of 1523 🔗

I’m secretly praying for a crime wave.

64109 ▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to BecJT, #181 of 1523 🔗

There’s gonna be one when furlough runs out.

61869 Hubes, replying to Hubes, 51, #182 of 1523 🔗

Friday shopping trip complete.

Tesco Express and Lidl. No mask, no questions, no problems, as expected. Just walked straight into both and shopped as normal.

Sad thing was everybody else in both shops had a face nappy on and the Lidl staff were wearing them too. I asked the girl on the checkout if they had been made to wear them and she said yes. I told her she should challenge that as I believe it’s against the law. She said it was horrible with it on.

I feel really sorry for the staff of these places. Especially ones who are shy and scared to speak up against this nonsense.

62058 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Hubes, 2, #183 of 1523 🔗

Roughly which part of the world are you in?

62668 ▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to Lockdown Truth, #184 of 1523 🔗

I’m in the West Midlands

61874 PoshPanic, replying to PoshPanic, 8, #185 of 1523 🔗

Just reposting on this update, in case there’s any takers..

Does anybody know of any studies that have been done re sepsis deaths, during this period? I’ve searched, but can’t seem to find any mention and don’t recall seeing any articles mentioning it. It was one of the big killers in hospitals particularly, with some failings in some hospitals. But the ONS figures don’t cover it and all searches just show previous FOI requests.
I’m just curious as to why there has been little discussion of it, in comparison to bat flu?
A couple of articles from Jan..
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51138859
https://news.sky.com/story/sepsis-is-bigger-killer-than-three-types-of-cancer-combined-study-11910168

61955 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to PoshPanic, 5, #186 of 1523 🔗

Good question. Covid and Sepsis both share cytokine storm as the thing that could kill you.

Sepsis can easily be treated by using the Marik Protocol (hydrocortisone, intravenous Vitamin C and intravenous thiamin/vitamin B1) but it is not used by the NHS – Covid patients will also benefit from this. If my child/family member died or was maimed by Sepsis and the health services failed to treat them with this protocol I would be extremely upset. This protocol is cheap and could save many lives.

Hydrocortisone, Vitamin C, and Thiamine for the Treatment of Severe Sepsis and Septic Shock
https://journal.chestnet.org/article/S0012-3692(16)62564-3/fulltext

http://nwcriticalcare.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/The-Marik-Protocol-final-2017.pdf

62077 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Victoria, 1, #187 of 1523 🔗

Thanks, that’s interesting about the treatment. I’m curious if somehow, sepsis is lying hidden in the figures somewhere. The fact that symptoms can be similar, at least deserves a closer look.

62405 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Victoria, #188 of 1523 🔗

I had wondered how many people have died at home from sepsis because they couldn’t get treatment for appendicitis or abscesses. Didn’t know about the cytokine storm though. Big question!

62674 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #189 of 1523 🔗

Soon after this farrago started they changed the procedure for confirming and registering deaths, in my view the only thing the death statistics now tell you with any certainty is that someone has died! Many deaths have multiple causes listed, when my Mum died there were 3 listed causes, these days it seems that Covid is being tacked on as one of the multiple causes. I understand that when they investigated one reported Covid death it turned out to actually be a fatal motorbike accident! If you consider the way deaths are being recorded and the way dodgy pillar 2 tests keeping throwing up positives, Covid is becoming the Hotel California of virus infections, ‘you can end the infection any time you like, but you can never leave the lock-down’.

62033 ▶▶ RickH, replying to PoshPanic, 4, #190 of 1523 🔗

No sepsis – but a while back I was having a telephone (obviously) discussion with my allocated colorectal nurse, who said that the main effect of the panic and shutdown was actually a decrease in infections like norovirus – because people were washing their hands conscientiously.

62079 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to RickH, 4, #191 of 1523 🔗

Could some of the below average numbers since June, be because there are fewer hospital spread infections generally?

61876 Youth_Unheard, replying to Youth_Unheard, 22, #192 of 1523 🔗

Can you believe this? They have put in that the mask restrictions don’t need to be reviewed for 6 MONTHS! Of course this is in theory if the majority comply, but if they do then there is just no way out!
*EDIT*Someone did point it out on yesterday’s comments about the time period but it is somewhere buried deep in the thousand comments, very good going keeping the conversation alive and kicking!
http://laworfiction.com/2020/07/face-covering-for-6-to-12-months-from-24th-july/

Also interesting on the consequences of people inadvertently breaking the law by shaming people :

“Businesses and their staff are best advised not to challenge those who refuse to wear a face covering. Otherwise, at some point in the day there is likely to be a time when someone with a disability is challenged. Depending on how the situation develops, and this could be within minutes or seconds, a situation may arise when the business, and the person conducting the challenge, may find they have committed:

an offence for which they are liable on summary conviction to pay a fine of up to £5,000 – section 112 (Aiding contraventions) of the Equality Act 2010; and/or
an act of disability discrimination and be ordered to pay to any individual who suffers injury to feelings compensation between £900 and £9,000 – section 119 (Remedies) of the Equality Act 2010”

61901 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Youth_Unheard, 6, #193 of 1523 🔗

You’d BETTER believe it! Anything is possible with this shower, anything.

61984 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to Youth_Unheard, 7, #194 of 1523 🔗

Yep it’s in place for a year, reviewed after six months. They also removed over night the bit about lack of evidence and small to no effect.

62165 ▶▶ annie, replying to Youth_Unheard, 3, #195 of 1523 🔗

Note that last paragraph.
Print it out, carry it with you. Stick it on windows of zombie shops.

61884 swedenborg, 11, #196 of 1523 🔗

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.24.20078717v1.full.pdf
“Full lockdown policies in Western Europe countries have no evident impacts on the COVID-19 epidemic”This article published 24th April by a single author but not in a prestigious paper but on research gate was never in the public space.This is a quote “Comparison of pre and post lockdown observations reveals a counter-intuitive slowdown in the decay of the epidemic after lockdown. Estimates of daily and total deaths numbers using pre-lockdown trends suggest that no lives were saved by this strategy, in comparison with pre-lockdown, less restrictive, social distancing policies.”The article is complicated mathematics. Michael Levitt was surprised yesterday to see this for him  unknown article. It seems that both scientists independently using mathematics came to the same conclusion (my amateurish take of it)

61885 profund chap, replying to profund chap, 3, #197 of 1523 🔗

Why vaccinate children?

More risk of being struck by lightening and study in saxony tells is they are a break I the chain.

Bedwetters no doubt will be lining their kids up.

61892 MDH, replying to MDH, 43, #199 of 1523 🔗

A quick update following my mini-meltdown yesterday. Last night me and the OH met with a friend for a pizza at our local. Little if any difference, aside from a few fewer tables. The takeaway trade was hugely busy, and the staff were as agreeably bonkers as ever (masked, but up and down like the Italian economy) and the food excellent.

Fact is, we could go back to normal normal now. But instead, the government are trapped by their own hype and outright lies. So the charade must continue no matter what the cost.

I’ve shelled out 11/- for a Sunflower card. Given that it’s now admitted that the mask is nothing more than a talisman, then I shall rely on my own talisman to protect me from aggressive mask enforcers and brandish it at arm’s length like a crucifix before a vampire. “Away! Away vile zealot!!” “Agent of the Death Minister!!” Could make quite a scene.

I’m tempted to enter the supermarket clutching a bunch of sweet violets. If challenged I shall say: “Sir/Madam, ’tis but a fragrant NOSEGAY to ward off the POX!”

61894 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to MDH, 10, #200 of 1523 🔗

I often have found myself whistling Ring-a-Ring-a-Roses as I walk about shops.

61899 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Two-Six, 4, #201 of 1523 🔗

Well, it would appear Lord Percy is running the country.

62170 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #202 of 1523 🔗

Compared to those who are running the country, Percy was an intellectual giant. And Baldric an Einstein.

62409 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 1, #203 of 1523 🔗

But there was a genuine plague when that was first sung.

61895 ▶▶ MDH, replying to MDH, 16, #204 of 1523 🔗

Oh, and because I stupidly gave my email address to the “Conservative” party a year or so again, I’ve had a begging letter from Boris this morning asking me to make a donation. I may chance a visit to Conservative HQ when I next feel the urge to void. But that’s the only deposit they’ll be getting from me.

62172 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to MDH, 4, #205 of 1523 🔗

My dog will deposit something for you.

61897 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to MDH, 5, #206 of 1523 🔗

11 bob. Love it.

63013 ▶▶ John Devine, replying to MDH, #207 of 1523 🔗

Brilliant post, actually laughed out loud…er..but what exactly is a Sunflower Card..?

61896 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 39, #208 of 1523 🔗

Hearing the propaganda blitz on radio and TV this morning about how everyone is wearing masks and happy about it, the DJs taking the mickey and bad mouthing people who contact them as an anti-mask and so on you would think that all these first-hand reports from people on here were all lies.

MSM – total wank merchants and now 100% propaganda related.

61910 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #209 of 1523 🔗

M asturbation and S ubmission M erchants

61922 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Awkward Git, 8, #210 of 1523 🔗

They’re lying. They will also be bombarding the airwaves today, pretending to be ordinary members of the public to promote the muzzling.

61928 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Awkward Git, 12, #211 of 1523 🔗

The propaganda campaign really is breathtaking in its scale. I don’t think the vast majority of the population even realise they are being brainwashed. When I look at any news site I just have endless NHS and government adverts and then the occasional company saying thank you to the NHS.

61941 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Darryl, 7, #212 of 1523 🔗

Anti-Brainwashing badge anyone?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154016480170

62028 ▶▶▶▶ DomW, replying to Two-Six, 4, #213 of 1523 🔗

Thanks for doing this. I’ve ordered mine already, along with a few spares 🙂

62417 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 2, #214 of 1523 🔗

Wearing mine at the moment. 🙂

62365 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Darryl, 5, #215 of 1523 🔗

Except there’s a lot of people who have been pretty much abandoned by the NHS, or by dental practices, GPS, etc, who will be feeling less than charitable towards any of them, which will include the government and their advisors. And if they’ve not been directly affected, they will probably know someone who has, e.g. my sister, who cannot get her root canal treatment completed, and has a tooth infection and pain.
Her husband needed a blood test, was told by the GP practice they couldn’t do anything until October. They then contacted him 3 times to collect a blood request form, but when he got there, wouldn’t give it to him without photo ID. New rules, they said.
I likened it to being in Soviet Russia (see the excellent series, Chernobyl, to see what Imean.)

63888 ▶▶▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Lms23, #216 of 1523 🔗

The NHS has become a cowardly, craven organisation that has rowed back on it’s responsibility to patients. We’re in a mind bogglingly stupid situation of protecting the NHS because it needs to be protected so it can look after us by not looking after us. I sometimes wonder if I died in March and am in a hell which looks a bit like normal life but with mass psychosis.

62685 ▶▶▶ alison, replying to Darryl, #217 of 1523 🔗

Speaking of corporate propaganda, saw a ridiculous poster outside branch of Barclay’s today saying NHS staff welcome to skip the queue as, if they required to attend a branch during this time of “national emergency” it must be an essential visit for them and really important that they be allowed to do it quickly. Just incredibly embarrassing.

62828 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to alison, #218 of 1523 🔗

I hate that priority over the NHS shit, it’s sickening. I watched a fat woman with a bad lockdown suntan jump the queue at Waitrose a while ago now and wave a ID card at the guard. They had been watching her in the car park and they thought she had been up to something, they checked her card very carefully before letting her go in. I just couldn’t believe the cheek of her, there were about 20 people in the queue, I just could not do that.

61900 kbeanie, replying to kbeanie, 18, #219 of 1523 🔗

Signatures have surpassed the 12k mark 👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/331430

61931 ▶▶ nowhereman, replying to kbeanie, 2, #220 of 1523 🔗

Signed!

61933 ▶▶ RickH, replying to kbeanie, 4, #221 of 1523 🔗

I don’t want to pee on the pansies … but this is far too small a number for this stage.

But, I’l keep fingers crossed..

61963 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to RickH, 2, #222 of 1523 🔗

It’s the minimum number required for a government response – think we need 10 x that for there to be a debate in Parliament on it…

62039 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Carrie, 2, #223 of 1523 🔗

Mind you a proper debate = opposing parties thrashing out their views to try to change opinions or reach a consensus.

There are no opposing views in parliament. So, it’ll be a quick chat where people will agree it’s necessary and maybe decide to make exemptions more formal or something.

62032 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to RickH, 4, #224 of 1523 🔗

It’s gone up 3,000 in the last 12 hours – while most were asleep. Even at that rate it will reach 100,000 in two more weeks…

62134 ▶▶ John Mirra, replying to kbeanie, 4, #225 of 1523 🔗

Signed. It’s over 13K now

If you look at the data for this petition you can see where people are signing it from. It warms my heart that over 30 people from my constituency have signed it.

Seems like the South East, North West and London are the places most signatures are coming from.

62178 ▶▶▶ kbeanie, replying to John Mirra, 1, #226 of 1523 🔗

South East signer here 👍🏻

62731 ▶▶▶▶ DressageRider, replying to kbeanie, #227 of 1523 🔗

Now over 14,000 and Eastbourne a hotspot – so proud of East Sussex efforts!

62425 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to John Mirra, 1, #228 of 1523 🔗

32 in mine!

62992 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to kbeanie, #229 of 1523 🔗

You need 88k more to really pack a punch.

61903 Ryan, replying to Ryan, 29, #230 of 1523 🔗

REMEMBER – SELF EXEMPT

Just fired this off:
enquiries@metfed.org.uk
Feel free to send one as well

I wish to register a complaint again John Apter.

It is reported in today’s Guardian that he said:

‘I would urge retail outlets to play their part in making the rules crystal clear: if you are not wearing a face covering then you are not coming in.’

( https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2020/jul/24/uk-coronavirus-live-face-masks-compulsory-england-shops-covid-19-latest-news-updates )

This does not take into consideration the exemptions to the law which will allow people like me to enter shops without a mask.

I object to the ignorance of the statement as well as the tone in which it is delivered. He is also clearly inciting Stores to break Discrimination and Equality law.

In my opinion Mr Apter should be disciplined for his ignorant comments and release a full apology.

Yours sincerely,
Non Muzzler

61915 ▶▶ Edna, replying to Ryan, 2, #231 of 1523 🔗

Excellent email.

61905 Cbird, replying to Cbird, 16, #232 of 1523 🔗

from Pets at Home today:

“We’re here for all the things you need to care for your VIP. We’ve also made it safe and easy to shop in our stores, and visit our grooming salons or vet practices.

In response to local guidance from tomorrow, 24th July, a face covering must now be worn when visiting us.”

No mention of exemptions. Have emailed the COO (peterdirect@petsathome.co.uk) telling him I will no longer be shopping there

61943 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cbird, 1, #233 of 1523 🔗

There are many great online pet type shops. This one delivers pet food and many other accessories, great service. http://www.viovet.co.uk

61948 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cbird, 4, #234 of 1523 🔗

I just email peter and I don’t even have a pet. Just for shits and giggles.

61907 Albie, replying to Albie, 71, #235 of 1523 🔗

I’ve just been to Card Factory. I had a couple of cards in my hand still browsing when a female middle-aged maskless assistant asked me to put a mask on. I just put the cards back and left without a word. I hope when Card Factory inevitably announce redundancies she thinks back to moments like that, playing a part in her own misfortune. I’m not explaining to anyone I am medically exempt, you either leave me to shop without a mask or I leave.

61912 ▶▶ Hubes, replying to Albie, 22, #236 of 1523 🔗

Spot on

61913 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Albie, 28, #237 of 1523 🔗

Do these people not see the bigger picture of being unemployed by the end of the year.

61927 ▶▶▶ Albie, replying to stefarm, 22, #238 of 1523 🔗

Clearly not. Shame on any CEOs who have told staff to implement this, too. I felt a mixture of emotions when I was leaving. The overriding feeling is one of absurdity of a maskless person telling another maskless person to put on a mask. Also, the cards my disease ridden hands touched could be touched by other shoppers later. They’ll have a mask on though so that will save them surely! This is just beyond ridiculous.

61936 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Albie, 12, #239 of 1523 🔗

Let’s see, would I rather cards (or food!) touched by you, or by someone who has been fiddling with a snot soaked face rag all day? Answers on a used mask, please…

61959 ▶▶▶▶ Albie, replying to Albie, 28, #240 of 1523 🔗

I still don’t think Cressida Dick got anywhere near enough criticism for her appalling comments condoning shoppers being shamed into mask wearing. The head of the Met actively encouraging citizens to abuse each other is a disgrace. Does she not know that verbal abuse often leads to violence or is she thick?

61964 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Albie, 14, #241 of 1523 🔗

Not thick just EVIL

61966 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Albie, 9, #242 of 1523 🔗

She didn’t mention an ethnic minority or religion, so she’s in the clear.

62017 ▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Albie, 10, #243 of 1523 🔗

Police policy. On BBC breakfast tv at 6.16ish Chief constable of Devon and Cornwall – Shaun Sawyer .. “you are in someones premises, they have invited you in. and if you “abuse” that invitation the role of police is no different …. we would ask you to respect the individual but if we are called we are going to ask you through them to leave and if you dont there is a chance that you will get arrested. Just look at yourself in the mirror and ask “why am i being like this” treat them with respect, buy the product and leave with a smile on your face and if you cant do that you have not been listening to what has been happening over the last 6 months. ”

Of course, how can anyone see you have a smile on your face if you are wearing a nappy. But otherwise i am lost for words

62026 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to mjr, 4, #244 of 1523 🔗

So basically if the staff (or I’m guessing any nasty fellow shopper) calls the police, then they will arrest you if you do not leave the shop, ignoring any exemption you might have. You are only ‘safe’ if no one actually calls the police…

62047 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Carrie, 8, #245 of 1523 🔗

Just realised, no mention made of “the police will fine you” he has gone straight to arrest.. for what? not for not wearing a mask .. so for refusing to leave… so is this for breach of the peace?
I would like someone to give a legal guidance on this .

62084 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to mjr, 10, #246 of 1523 🔗

According to Francis Hoar, not wearing a mask is a civil offence not a criminal one, so if you are arrested, then it is deemed ‘kidnap’.. He has a good thread on his Twitter account regarding it.

62121 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Carrie, 4, #247 of 1523 🔗

It would be the refusal to leave when requested that gets you arrested.

62441 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, 1, #248 of 1523 🔗

Unless you’d gone to deliberately provoke trouble, there would be no reason to stay if asked to leave.

62116 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Carrie, 1, #249 of 1523 🔗

Sky .. fall … head …

62435 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 4, #250 of 1523 🔗

Given the reach of social media, you’d think shops would have more sense than to alienate a peaceful customer.

62374 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to mjr, 8, #251 of 1523 🔗

” not been listening to what has been happening over the last 6 months. ”

We have. And for a number of years before that. That’s why we’re engaging in civil disobedience. They can’t provide reasonable evidence, but name calling and public shaming instead, which is why we believe it’s B.S.

63048 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Albie, #252 of 1523 🔗

The former mayor of New York City, Michael Bloomberg-close friend to Bill Gates-urged New Yorkers to shame and ridicule smokers to their faces. What’s the diff? None.

63410 ▶▶▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to Albie, #253 of 1523 🔗

the latter

62688 ▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to stefarm, 2, #254 of 1523 🔗

Nope. They won’t realise what is going on until they are called into a meeting and told they are losing their jobs and even then some of them won’t put 2 and 2 together.

62846 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to stefarm, 2, #255 of 1523 🔗

Unfortunately they don’t. Like I’ve always said they have been too cowardly to stand up to all this antisocial distancing nonsense and have forgotten that their customers deserve to be treated as human beings worth of respect and not as lepers.

61919 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Albie, 12, #256 of 1523 🔗

All they have seen/heard is “Masks compulsory”. They haven’t looked at exemptions or *anything*. Christ, they were making it up before the ‘law’ was published.

62023 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #257 of 1523 🔗

Yes. In this day and age of training, what training have these door people been given on the new regs that came out less than 24 hours ago. There should be a lead in period while businesses adapt with a very light touch etc.

But no, they (the bad ones) just rush it in full blast like the collaborators they are.

62849 ▶▶▶▶ Steve, replying to Lockdown Truth, #258 of 1523 🔗

They will have had no training. We’ve just had an in store email thing about it which I suspect most people will have just skipped past when looking for their payslips/shifts etc. Maybe there was a briefing this morning for the instore staff, but I’d be surprised.

61967 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Albie, 4, #259 of 1523 🔗

Note that the assistant was not wearing a mask herself – hypocrite!

62126 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Albie, 1, #260 of 1523 🔗

That doesn’t surprise me,Card Factory in my experience is rude staff and even worse customers.

62442 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Paul, 1, #261 of 1523 🔗

Never been, now I know not to bother. Thanks.

62368 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Albie, 3, #262 of 1523 🔗

Should have handed them to her and then walked out.

61908 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 3, #263 of 1523 🔗

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/epidemiology-and-infection/article/time-course-of-the-immune-response-to-experimental-coronavirus-infection-of-man/6C633E4EFDAEB2B4C0E3986
This is a 11 year old article about experimental infection of volunteers with Corona virus 229E one of our common cold virus. Must have some relevance for Covid-19?Quote about antibodies “Although concentrations were still slightly raised 1 year later, this did not always prevent reinfection when volunteers were then challenged with the homologous virus. However, the period of virus shedding was shorter than before and none developed a cold. All of the uninfected group were infected on re-challenge although they also appeared to show some resistance to disease and in the extent of infection. These results are discussed with reference to natural infections with coronavirus and with other infections, such as rhinovirus infections.

61929 ▶▶ RickH, replying to swedenborg, 2, #264 of 1523 🔗

and none developed a cold”

That’s the killer line when you read the word ‘cases’ (of the presence of a virus).

62592 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, 3, #265 of 1523 🔗

Yes this was very interesting. It was referenced by the Tom Chivers article in Unherd the other day. Your link didn’t seem to work for me but I think this is the same paper: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2271881/ .

There was all this fuss in the news about how Covid-19 antibodies were present in low levels and fell quickly in mild cases. But why should this be unexpected? We just never went around measuring antibodies in people who weren’t that ill before. Except in that one study which seems to confirm that there’s nothing particularly unusual about Covid.

The same thing with the asymptomatic cases. This very likely happens often with other viruses too. It’s just we don’t usually go around doing mass testing of people who have nothing wrong with them.

61918 Darryl, replying to Darryl, 20, #266 of 1523 🔗

Trying to see where this all ends the Times has a leading opinion piece today saying how low paid workers are going to be replaced by technology. There seems to be a real effort being made in the background by the establishment to make sure the old normal doesn’t return and that there is a new normal as spoken about from day one.

It looks suspiciously like a large amount of the population is being written off in the name of ‘progress’.

61930 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Darryl, 17, #267 of 1523 🔗

This is what The Corona Project is all about, a social catalyst for massive global change. The re-purposing of the global economy to make it sustainable. The global lockdown was the primary objective, all the rest is propaganda.

61945 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Two-Six, 2, #268 of 1523 🔗

It does look like it is a dishonest way to get things implemented that voters wouldn’t agree to normally. I was watching a video on Technocracy earlier and it certainly raises my suspicions. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKdsL57SUZo

61954 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Darryl, 7, #269 of 1523 🔗

It’s a real thing. No need to be suspicious, its obvious.

62036 ▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Two-Six, 3, #270 of 1523 🔗

Add in what amounts to the world’s biggest single transfer of funds after the 2019 bankers meeting in Jackson Hole when Blackrock said a reset was going to happen.

US Treasury and Federal reserve have been merged and the running of it given over to Blackrock who promptly took billions.

https://www.sgtreport.com/2020/04/blackrock-megacorporation-just-took-over-the-us-treasury-and-federal-reserve/

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-05-21/how-larry-fink-s-blackrock-is-helping-the-fed-with-bond-buying

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BLEDFYb4lD8

Where is all the money going prior to the “great reset”?

62376 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Awkward Git, #271 of 1523 🔗

Jeff Bezos??

62756 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to Two-Six, 2, #272 of 1523 🔗

Just google “World Economic Forum The Global Reset”

61991 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Two-Six, 6, #273 of 1523 🔗

The climate change doom mongering didn’t work but this sure did.The whole world cowering under their bed sheets over a flu

62011 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 5, #274 of 1523 🔗

“Climate change” is still there. That will be a long term “new normal” as zero carbon is foisted on us just like Covid. The fact that very few people are fighting back on Covid will embolden the zero carbon agenda.

62112 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #275 of 1523 🔗

My point is neither are real.they are just an excuse for the state to take total control of our lives

62003 ▶▶▶ Paul M, replying to Two-Six, 6, #276 of 1523 🔗

It is clear on the World Economic Forum website what the agenda is and that covid is just the catalyst. Covid is not the worlds biggest problem they state, it is the fact that we are too affluent.

62005 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Paul M, #277 of 1523 🔗

yep

62021 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Paul M, 5, #278 of 1523 🔗

It’s on the WHO website as well – find it hard that people still say it is just conspiracy theory…

61971 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Darryl, 2, #279 of 1523 🔗

Exactly – seen more than one article saying the vaccine will be sterilising as well, although that won’t show up for 7 years apparently. Population reduction…

61975 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Carrie, 1, #280 of 1523 🔗

That’s sustainable!

62115 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Carrie, 1, #281 of 1523 🔗

Just read that Bill Gates has said it will take 2 doses of the new corona vaccine to work.sorry don’t know how to post links but it’s in the HuffPost

62125 ▶▶▶▶ anon, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 5, #282 of 1523 🔗

to work

to work

these people are pure evil. I would like to restrain doktor bill gates and fill him with his dodgy vaccines and nano chips until he gets the blue screen of death.

62760 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to anon, #283 of 1523 🔗

And his awful “wife.”

62995 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to anon, #284 of 1523 🔗

I used to get the blue screen of death all the time. I blocked MS automatic updates and now have fewer problems than before.

62444 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Darryl, #285 of 1523 🔗

Surely most low paid jobs can’t be done by technology?
I know my local Sainsbury’s have replaced most of the checkout staff with robots but a real person cleans the toilets and empties the bins.

61923 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 8, #286 of 1523 🔗

I thought the Dictator was going to Scotland? He flew over Scotland to Orkney, where he caught crabs (not for the first time I suspect)

There were many people in Glasgow waiting to kiss him, never mind, next time

61926 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Cecil B, 5, #287 of 1523 🔗

Would that be the world-famous Glasgow kiss?

61962 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to IanE, 2, #288 of 1523 🔗

I’m a non violent refusnik, but I can’t speak for ‘Jimmy’

61925 RickH, 4, #289 of 1523 🔗

On the issue of ‘Covid’ admissions to hospital – I keep an eye on the CEBM updates – and they have shown a reduction to insignificant levels. There is clearly no evidence of ‘spikes’, waves’ or any other mythical beasts.

Of course, we have no guarantee of the future – but when have we ever? – and when did we ever implement massively invasive measures based on a near zero probablitity of an event? e might as well be digging Anderson shelters in the back garden – and anyone who wants to ‘stay safe’ in this perverted sense should sell their car and stop crossing *any* roads. For anyone wearing a mask – just let me know when you’ve done these things, so that I can do my own poll on the numbers of safety conscious good fairies.

But, behind any figures mentioning ‘Covid’ as a distinct ‘disease’ (and particularly deaths), there is one startling, amazing scientific fact we have to recognize that :

WE DON’T F.ING KNOW!

.. because the whole thing is so totally screwed – like a Saudi Arabian thief counting on his fingers..

61939 Bella Donna, replying to Bella Donna, #290 of 1523 🔗

Watch this video and share. The vaccines for Covid change your DNA!

61978 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bella Donna, #291 of 1523 🔗

Which video?

61983 ▶▶ anon, replying to Bella Donna, #292 of 1523 🔗

is it the american lady? v articulate and knowledgeable if so

extremely chilling if true

61940 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #293 of 1523 🔗
61981 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 4, #294 of 1523 🔗

Hence why mask law valid for a year…

61944 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #295 of 1523 🔗

We are nuts apparently

Sky News: ‘They are nuts’: Boris Johnson hits out at vaccine opponents.
https://news.sky.com/story/they-are-nuts-boris-johnson-hits-out-at-vaccine-opponents-12035200

61946 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #296 of 1523 🔗

Two words : ‘Johnson’ and ‘Sun’ and you have the definititive illustration of what ‘nuts’ means.

61958 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Tom Blackburn, 9, #297 of 1523 🔗

It really is disgusting that a Prime Minister would completely write off anyone with vaccine concerns. I am starting to think the man is so nuts himself and might even use the army to force vaccinations on anyone who holds out.

62000 ▶▶▶ anon, replying to Darryl, 3, #298 of 1523 🔗

eugenics

at this point one of the agendas can’t really be hidden imo

62392 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Darryl, 3, #299 of 1523 🔗

It’s the same attempt at shaming people as calling them “climate change deniers,” or “racist” which means they don’t have real evidence or a good argument.
If this is what he’s resorting to, F*** him.

62481 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Darryl, 1, #300 of 1523 🔗

The amended 1984 Health Act allows them to do just that.

62081 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tom Blackburn, 7, #301 of 1523 🔗

From Guido:
‘Man who has ‘flu jab in October 2019 and is hospitalised in an ICU in April 2020 with COVID-19 tells people to have a ‘flu jab which does not protect against COVID-19 and a vaccine that has not yet been developed, and, if it ever is, will not have been properly tested, particularly among vulnerable groups, before being marketed.
And he calls others ‘nuts’.’

62706 ▶▶ alison, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #302 of 1523 🔗

So ignorant. We’re not his herd of cattle, we’re human beings and one would have thought persuasion rather than stupid insults is the way forward.

Whole range of reasons people might object. I’m all in favour of safe, reasonably necessary and ethical vaccines. But there isn’t even a vaccine so how can he expect anyone, before a vaccine is even developed, to be signing up to take it before anyone can judge that it’s safe? Personally, I conscientiously object to taking vaccines developed from foetal cell lines, maybe that’s a niche concern in UK but it’s not nuts, and not particularly anyone else’s business if I refuse vaccines for that reason. I’m also young and lucky to be healthy so why would I want an unnecessary vaccine against a disease that poses no risk? I don’t take a flu vaccine so why this?

63937 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Tom Blackburn, #303 of 1523 🔗

I’m not an anti-vaxxer, but I wouldn’t go near a vaccine that has been developed and tested in an unusually short timescale.

61949 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 6, #304 of 1523 🔗

MANDATORY VACCINATIONS… for flu?

To protect the NHS this winter because the Covids are still around.

“We want everybody to get a flu jab in the run-up to this winter and that’s why we’re rolling out the biggest-ever programme of flu immunisation,” he said. (Boris Johnson)

“And we’re aiming first of all for schoolchildren up to year 7, for pregnant women, for people over 65, for people who are shielded, but then we will be extending it to people who are 50 to 65.

“Now the reason for doing this is to protect the NHS in the winter months because obviously we have still got COVID, we have still got the threat of a second spike on COVID, and it’s vital therefore to keep that pressure off the NHS by everybody getting a flu jab and I really hope everybody will.”

https://news.sky.com/story/they-are-nuts-boris-johnson-hits-out-at-vaccine-opponents-12035200

61956 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to Lockdown Truth, 4, #305 of 1523 🔗

I saw something from the ONS the other day, think it was Hugh Osmond, about how many people who ‘died’ of Covid also had the flu, reckoned it’d mean they’d have to knock about 20k off the death total.

61972 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Lockdown Truth, 11, #306 of 1523 🔗

Either members of the establishment have lost their minds or they are evil. They are promoting everything as the ‘greater good’ which is interesting as the politicians and elite rarely do much to improve the lives of the masses. Now there are endless funds for pet projects such as vaccinations and sustainable development.

61982 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Lockdown Truth, 7, #307 of 1523 🔗

I have no problem generally with ‘flu jabs. And I have experienced bad ‘flu – and you wouldn’t wish it on anyone. I have had one most years since I’ve been a member of the Old Farts Club, and have not had any problems.

But they aren’t a magic bullet – and have extremely variable efficacy.

The key issue, if we’re talking ‘nuts’, however , is the is the idea of a *safe* Corona vaccine being shown as ‘safe’ and being produced in the near future. That is a truly stupid idea aimed at morons, given the time that proper RCTs take to monitor both short and long term effects.

If it was possible, why do you think that previous vaccines have taken so long to develop, given the interest that the pharmacological industry has in getting them to the market as soon as possible to bring in the return?

In fact – this looks suspiciously like a commercial push to get rid of proper public health safeguards.

Unfortunately – it’s on the back of a virus that refuses to be particularly dangerous as things have turned out – so we’ve got the construction of the narrative of myth and absurdity to do the job for the virus.

61986 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #308 of 1523 🔗

Pregnant women should stay very far away from any vaccine as some of the ingredients such as mercury, timerosal etc can damage the foetus. The health establishment will tell pregnant women that they can’t eat soft boiled eggs or fermented cheeses but it is ok to take a risk with a vaccine.

Flu Vaccination During Early Pregnancy Linked to Nearly Eightfold Risk of Miscarriage

  • In recent years, pregnant women have been told to get an increasing number of vaccinations, even though there’s a shocking lack of studies to confirm the safety for mother and child
  • In 2009, reports of miscarriage following receipt of the pandemic H1N1 swine flu vaccine (pH1N1) started emerging. Now, a study has found that women who had received a pH1N1-containing flu vaccine two years in a row were more likely to suffer miscarriage within the following 28 days
  • Most miscarriages occurred during the first trimester, but several also took place in the second trimester. Median fetal term at the time of miscarriage was seven weeks
  • In all, pregnant women receiving concurrent pH1N1-containing flu vaccines had a nearly eightfold higher risk of miscarriage

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2017/09/26/flu-vaccination-miscarriage-risk.aspx

Flu Shot Fails to Protect Seniors and May Increase Miscarriages

  • U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data have repeatedly demonstrated that the flu vaccine does not work for seniors. The 2018/2019 flu vaccines against influenza A and B viruses had an adjusted effectiveness rating of just 12% for those over age 50
  • Studies have also demonstrated that influenza vaccination has little or no impact on mortality among the elderly
  • The flu vaccine is routinely recommended for all pregnant women during any trimester, yet some scientific evidence suggests it could place their pregnancy at risk. Research funded by the CDC found an association between flu vaccination during pregnancy and an eightfold risk of miscarriage
  • Injury following influenza vaccination is now the most compensated claim in the federal Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). Between January 1, 2006, and December 31, 2017, a total of 3,575 injury claims for flu vaccine were filed

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2019/09/26/flu-shot-ineffective.aspx

61987 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #309 of 1523 🔗

Getting their ducks in a row for the main event.

62015 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to DRW, 2, #310 of 1523 🔗

Yep, the one BG has told us on camera that people ‘will take seriously next time’…

61995 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 6, #311 of 1523 🔗

There have been studies of children who have had the flu jab, showing that it makes them MORE susceptible to coronaviruses – clearly the plan is to pretend there has been some mutation and children *can* now get CV19.

Pregnant women – are they trying to induce miscarriages? Kill 2 people at once?

Over 65s – just another population cull…lots of studies showing the flu vaccine makes people more susceptible to other viruses – including one study done on American servicemen, who would likely have been fit people to start with!

61997 ▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #312 of 1523 🔗

And they can [expletive deleted] right off!

62013 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 5, #314 of 1523 🔗

Additionally I feel a lawyer needs to look closely at the coronavirus legislation as regards what constitutes medical treatment of a person considered ‘at risk’, in conjunction with the current laws for children’s rights regarding consent to their medical treatment.

We know that schoolchildren have been allowed within the law, to socially transition to the opposite sex at school, and considered mature enough (under ‘Gillick competence’) to consent to puberty suppressants, often against the wishes of their parents.

Now imagine children back in school in September, being ‘fed’ a diet of corona-fear plus pro-mask and vaccine propaganda. I can foresee a situation where children get vaccinated in schools, against their parents’ wishes or consent (possibly without the parents being informed prior to the event), and the parents simply being told afterwards, that their child requested it, agreed to it and is considered mature enough to have made that decision… By that time it will be too late for the parents to do anything about it…

63945 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Lockdown Truth, #315 of 1523 🔗

But meanwhile we have to fight to get any treatment or doctor examinations at GP surgeries.

61953 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 14, #316 of 1523 🔗

You are wearing a mask, “to help others”.
You keep fiddling with the sweaty, snotty thing on your face.
You are working in food service.

The Food Safety Act 1990 (as amended) provides the framework for all food legislation in the England, Wales and Scotland.

The main responsibilities for all food businesses under the Act are to ensure that:

  • businesses do not include anything in food, remove anything from food or treat food in any way which means it would be damaging to the health of people eating it

Just a thought, Mr. Wancock.

61970 ▶▶ Guirme, replying to Sam Vimes, 7, #317 of 1523 🔗

According to our local butcher, in Scotland, food preparation business are exempt from mask wearing; there’s not even any screens in the shop. Shopping like it used to be.

61968 RickH, #318 of 1523 🔗

A fascinating update of their ‘Florence Nightingale’ chart of comparative mortality on the CEBM website :

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/covid-19-florence-nightingales-daigrams-for-deaths/

It clearly shows the April upsurge, and the following spike in Care Home deaths, but also the preceding *lower* level of mortality and – more importantly – the *current* lower level of mortality in comparison with previous years.

61969 GLT, replying to GLT, 25, #319 of 1523 🔗

I picked up a framed picture yesterday..the shop assistant picked up her used mask lying on the counter, put her hands all over it whilst putting it on and then proceeded to handle my picture. She was definitely not reducing my risk of being infected by her! Fortunately that risk doesn’t concern me.

It reminds me of the nuclear holocaust cartoon, ‘When the wind blows’ where the hapless couple attempt to build a homemade nuclear fallout shelter following government instructions. There’s something very sad about witnessing this level of gullibility and lack of critical thinking in such a large section of our population.

61973 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to GLT, 4, #320 of 1523 🔗

Remember in “The Young Ones” where Neil painted himself white, “To deflect the blast”. It’s pretty similar.

62019 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Two-Six, 6, #321 of 1523 🔗

Or Private Baldrick who engraved his name on a bullet

https://youtu.be/ACnqI1l4I9s

62150 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cecil B, 2, #322 of 1523 🔗

This is a very useful reminder, DB. I shall use this one. Most people know and love Baldrick, and will remember the ‘bullet with his name on’ episode.

How many will put 2 and 2 together is a different matter. 🙂

61993 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to GLT, #323 of 1523 🔗

Yes… it’s that same level of stupidity and ignorance

62016 ▶▶ RickH, replying to GLT, 2, #324 of 1523 🔗

An interesting parallel. Nostalgia can be misleading – but at that time, there was a profound scepticism about the scary official compliance narrative about the cold war.

62037 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to RickH, 1, #325 of 1523 🔗

Nostalgia isn’t what it used to be

62179 ▶▶ annie, replying to GLT, 1, #326 of 1523 🔗

Eustace and Hilda.
They died.

61974 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 7, #327 of 1523 🔗

Just been told by someone in the know that the fifth wave will arrive in January 2025 and kill 20 million in the U.K (Keep it to yourself and start investing in body bag futures)

61976 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cecil B, 1, #328 of 1523 🔗

???

61994 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Carrie, 1, #329 of 1523 🔗

Covid 25, keep up, 19 is sooooo yesterday

62040 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Cecil B, 3, #330 of 1523 🔗

Fake news -there is another wave at least at every six months -so I think you meant the 11 th wave.

61977 Edna, replying to Edna, 31, #331 of 1523 🔗

So, husband braved Waitrose this morning; it was a mixed experience. As he said, it couldn’t be called pleasant but it wasn’t awful.
There wasn’t a queue so he walked straight in, the chap on the door just asking him if he wanted a trolley. Shop was quite busy, probably twice as busy as in recent weeks, he reckons. The staff were fine, most without masks. But he says that every single customer had one on. A few gave him dirty looks; one saw him, looked at him then turned around and walked the other way. And one middle-aged chap said loudly “Sir, you need a mask”. Husband ignored him and walked on. Chap followed him and said “Excuse me sir, you need a mask”. Husband turned round and quietly said “I’m exempt” and the chap begged his pardon and said sorry. The only other unfriendly person was the staff member who had to verify his age. She didn’t say anything but glared at him whilst doing the age thing.

Husband had thought about arguing with chap who accosted him but thought it might be better to say he was exempt because then the chap might think twice before accosting someone else.

Husband also said it gave him a strange feeling of lawlessness – the ‘broken window’ syndrome. He deliberately then went the wrong way down the one way system in the car park and undertook a couple of cars on the motorway! He reckons he’ll be doing a bank job next!!! [I am joking about the bank job of course, he is usually the most law-abiding citizen there is, as am I].

61990 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Edna, 16, #332 of 1523 🔗

Would have preferred ‘husband turned round and quietly said “Why don’t you fuck off and mind your own business”

Never mind, baby steps, he’ll get there

62012 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Cecil B, 8, #333 of 1523 🔗

It’s tempting – but best to keep the upper hand, I reckon.

I think the ‘I’m exempt’ reply is the best. But, if further challenged, I might just calmly point out the uselessness. Stage three might be the embarrassment technique of displaying the evidence of already compromised health … mine would give any squeamish self-righteous twat the psychological equivalence of a smack in the teeth.

62105 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to RickH, 6, #334 of 1523 🔗

“Pardon ?”, with ear cupping, is a sort of half-way house compromise. 🙂

62164 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to JohnB, 4, #335 of 1523 🔗

Haha, yes – implies you are deaf and are relying on lipreading – bit tricky if everyone is masked!

62114 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to RickH, 10, #336 of 1523 🔗

I don’t think we should be explaining anything to a member of the public. They have no right to ask (as I told someone yesterday who asked why OH and I don’t wear masks). I got an apology but, since I know her, did tell her we were exempt. I would bandy words with a stranger, I would just invite them to keep their distance if they have a problem.

Actually, I don’t think we need to give staff explanations either but it might make life easier to have a badge/lanyard/card.

62400 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 4, #337 of 1523 🔗

The public have been co-opted by Matt Hancock and the police. The government wants the public to do the shaming and confronting.

62759 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Lms23, #338 of 1523 🔗

I know, it’s despicable and potentially very dangerous.

62513 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 4, #339 of 1523 🔗

Legally no-one is allowed to ask.

62763 ▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #340 of 1523 🔗

I should have said ‘wouldn’t bandy words’ (!) sorry.

62511 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to RickH, 2, #341 of 1523 🔗

Or do a good impression of having a meltdown because his mental state was already fragile and he’d just experienced the last straw …..

62231 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Cecil B, 6, #342 of 1523 🔗

i think my retort is going to be “f off you mask nazi”!!! 🙂
I’m normally such a polite lady but i think this whole shabang has pushed me to my limit of civilised debate with idiots

62517 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sue, 3, #343 of 1523 🔗

Oh I think shaming them back is more appropriate, as demonstrated by the response to Edna’s husband’s non-provocative reply.

62004 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Edna, 3, #344 of 1523 🔗

Well done!

I used to buy all our wine from Waitrose but is now buying online from a lovely company, great service and quick delivery. No need to wait for some staff member (not sure where they always hide) to verify my age.

62520 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Victoria, 3, #345 of 1523 🔗

With my shock of grey, lockdown-untrimmed medusa locks, being thus challenged would be a treat.

62101 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to Edna, 6, #346 of 1523 🔗

What a dickhead (the busybody not your husband!). Hopefully, if enough of us fail to comply and are seen to not comply by people who are wavering, a bit of momentum will build up for non-compliance. It’s always difficult when you are the odd one out.

62238 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Edna, 9, #347 of 1523 🔗

how about a counter offensive strategy … when you see a masked idiot fiddle with their mask ask them please not to touch the goods as they have infected their hands with virus, strep germs, bacteria, snot and saliva etc. That’ll upset them.

62244 ▶▶▶ Edna, replying to Sue, 3, #348 of 1523 🔗

That’s a very good idea!

61979 Ben Shirley, replying to Ben Shirley, 28, #349 of 1523 🔗

Just went out to test the water today, not the I actually had any shopping I needed to do. Justified my visit to Lidl by picking up a couple of bottles of beer. Had no trouble in there but felt like a pariah since everyone else, including all the checkout staff, were muzzled.

Then I went to Oxfam, which I usually like visiting because its the only shop for miles around which has a good line in antiquarian books. I was told by some woman on the door that I had to have a mask. I said I’m exempted under government guidelines as wearing a mask is likely to cause me distress. She said, “Sorry, it’s company policy.” So all the poor ickle African kids can go and starve.

If I’d had half a brain I’d have printed the relevant sections of the Equality Act 2010 to shove under her nose. I might try that next week.

Being maskless revived a feeling I haven’t felt since I was 18 and I bought my first Teddy Boy suit. The first couple of times I wore it, I was extremely self-conscious of standing out and felt a bit hot under the collar. But it wasn’t long before I got used to the idea, was confident in the knowledge that I looked very smart and could walk around with my head held high, my non-conformity being a badge of honour. This mask situation will, I think, be the same.

61985 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Ben Shirley, 3, #350 of 1523 🔗

Go Oxfam! (not)

62022 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Lockdown Truth, 9, #351 of 1523 🔗

Can someone in your circle set up Oxfam with a cast-iron genuine exempt, film the refusal, and then take it to court?

61988 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Ben Shirley, 8, #352 of 1523 🔗

OXFAM SUCK!!!!!
For many many many reasons. I haven’t bought anything from them or given to them for a long long time.

62899 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Two-Six, 1, #353 of 1523 🔗

I’ve boycotted them since the fiasco in Haiti and the bullying. Not to mention I’ve found them always holier than thou.

61996 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Ben Shirley, 7, #354 of 1523 🔗

Since when did the charity juggernaut ever care about doing good, apart from to the bank balances of those who run them!

By the way, see a lot of Showaddywaddy on 70s music channel – wow did those boys look good. They are forever in the hearts of a certain generation in the North East after their star turn at High Pit Social Club (too young to go, unfortunately).

62018 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ben Shirley, 10, #355 of 1523 🔗

They are acting illegally under disability discrimination law..

62007 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #356 of 1523 🔗

They are pushing everyone to get flu jabs this winter and are targeting kids!

From TheTorygraph live:

Speaking to Sky News, [Bloris] said: “We want everybody to get a flu jab in the run-up to this winter and that’s why we’re rolling out the biggest-ever programme of flu immunisation.

“And we’re aiming first of all for schoolchildren up to year 7, for pregnant women, for people over 65, for people who are shielded, but then we will be extending it to people who are 50 to 65.”

He added the programme is being rolled out due to the threat of second spike of Covid-19.
“It’s vital therefore to keep that pressure off the NHS by everybody getting a flu jab and I really hope everybody will,” he said.

On the other hand:

Doctors have warned they will struggle to deliver the extra flu jabs under the Government’s new vaccination programme.
Dr Dylan Watkins, a GP in Totnes,….. said:
“(This is) at a time when we’re going to struggle to administer the vaccines effectively because of coronavirus limitations …..
He added it was a “huge guess” how many vaccines would be needed and who would take them up, adding that 2,000 extra vaccines “sat in the fridge gone off” would cost £15,000.

Time for some serious foot-dragging of our own!

62014 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #357 of 1523 🔗

Great, there will be millions of people wandering round shedding “Government Flu” germs everywhere after they have had the jab which will be much more dangerous than COVIDS ever could be.

62029 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Two-Six, 5, #358 of 1523 🔗

Yes you are so right. Virus shedding after vaccinations infect other people.

62031 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #359 of 1523 🔗

Ha ha – the government have tied themselves up in knots. Dr Dylan Watkins, a GP in Totnes,….. said: “(This is) at a time when we’re going to struggle to administer the vaccines effectively because of coronavirus limitations …..

62090 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lili, 6, #360 of 1523 🔗

I seem to remember reading that the government plan to train other groups of people to administer the vaccines – If I were a parent, I would not be letting my children out of my sight for the foreseeable future…

62042 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 11, #362 of 1523 🔗

Just saw this comment on Guido and thought it was funny..

‘Man who has ‘flu jab in October 2019 and is hospitalised in an ICU in April 2020 with COVID-19 tells people to have a ‘flu jab which does not protect against COVID-19 and a vaccine that has not yet been developed, and, if it ever is, will not have been properly tested, particularly among vulnerable groups, before being marketed.
And he calls others ‘nuts’.’ !!!!

62049 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Cheezilla, 9, #363 of 1523 🔗

I honestly haven’t eliminated from my mind the possibility that old people come off much worse from Covid because they all previously had the flu jab. Someone pointed out that Bozo made a big song and dance about having it too.

It turns out that this isn’t some tinfoil hat-type fear. ‘Enhancement’ happens naturally too, just depending what order you get diseases in (check out Dengue Fever, for example).

The people who promote vaccination are of the same level of intellect and critical thinking ability as, say, Neil Ferguson. It doesn’t inspire confidence!

62060 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Barney McGrew, 8, #364 of 1523 🔗

I would REALLY like to see some data that compares who had this years flu jab and then died of COVIDS.
THAT would be very interesting to see.

62064 ▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Two-Six, 4, #365 of 1523 🔗

And previous years’, too.

62067 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Two-Six, 9, #366 of 1523 🔗

Yes, me too. As a 67-year-old asthmatic, I was talked into having a flu jab in 2018. I can’t prove a link but I had the worst health year I’ve ever had in 2019, culminating in a bad bout of bronchitis which still hasn’t cleared up.

The GP did his damndest to get me to have a flu jab in January, a real hard-sell. This year, they will have to find me first, even if they do know where I live. . . .

62107 ▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 3, #367 of 1523 🔗

In the mean time top up your vitamin D levels (will also assist with breathing health) . Consider taking at least 10,000IU of Vitamin D3 per day. Take with Vitamin K2 if you take such a high dose as this will assist the body to move the calcium into the cells. Read this for more information
https://media.mercola.com/assets/pdf/ebook/vitamin-d-in-the-prevention-of-covid-19.pdf

62754 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Victoria, #368 of 1523 🔗

Thank you. I’ll check that out. I’ve just stocked up with 4,000IU tablets, maybe I need to up the ante!

62076 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Two-Six, 6, #369 of 1523 🔗

We also cannot know what they will put in this year’s flu jab – they could put something nasty in it, because the flu jab will be comparatively easier (because it’s been around longer) to get people to accept than the rushed Covid-19-specific one..

62649 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, #370 of 1523 🔗

I suspect that’s the plan.

62108 ▶▶▶▶ anon, replying to Two-Six, 3, #371 of 1523 🔗

I saw commentary stating this is what happened in Italy early on in this wicked tale

62489 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #372 of 1523 🔗

I think it’s very unlikely that the flu jab makes Covid-19 worse. The Dengue business is something called “antibody dependent enhancement” which is where having slightly the wrong antibodies sticking to virus particles actually makes it easier for them to enter cells. It’s rare but also since flu viruses are not physically much like coronaviruses it’s unlikely that antibodies from a flu vaccine would enhance Covid.

You see headlines about flu jabs making Covid worse but the only evidence I’ve seen behind them is speculative and relates to viral interference. This is an effect whereby actually having flu may make you a bit protected from getting Covid at the same time. Since Covid and flu are similar mortality it’s probably not worth getting flu for the minimal protection against Covid it gives you.

Enhancement of Covid from Covid vaccines is a genuine concern however. I don’t think the mechanism is antibody dependent enhancement but is more related to immune system imbalance. Other coronavirus vaccine candidates (for SARS1 and MERS) have had a bit of a history of this problem.

62053 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #373 of 1523 🔗

I’v never had flu (that I am aware of) so I will donate my free jab to someone who does not have a ‘fit for purpose’ imune system

62651 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Major Panic, 2, #374 of 1523 🔗

If you get real flu, you definitely know about it!

63000 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cheezilla, #375 of 1523 🔗

Boris the Spider … creepy crawly, creepy crawly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvFuUaCe8eY

62010 Edgar Friendly, 3, #376 of 1523 🔗

RE: that twït from Sainsbury’s:

Finally, a Karen who makes some sense!

62020 Brian, replying to Brian, 5, #377 of 1523 🔗

No masks in shops in Wales (yet) maybe people will be popping over to wales to shop. There is no toll on the bridge now just avoid public transport. We could do with the trade.
Alas you have to eat outside. In wales it is often cold and very wet. It is what keeps the green green grass of home. Love to see you. If people come to my door wearing a mask I ask them why the mask. They are suitable surprised by the question normally replying the virus. I point to my small badge I wear. They lean in close to read it. I help by reading it out ‘,I ain’t afraid of no ghost’. If it comes to wales I will get me an exemption card.
There is no official exemption letters or cards being issued. But plenty of unofficial exemption cards are being issued by MInd and others so much confusion abounds
https://hiddendisabilitiesstore.com/hidden-disabilities-face-covering.html
£0.55

62062 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Brian, #378 of 1523 🔗

Next stop, Wales. Next Thursday actually, for a week.

62191 ▶▶ annie, replying to Brian, 5, #379 of 1523 🔗

Problems in Pendine:
The main car park is closed for building work.
Nowhere else to park.
Pub turns car park into table space: nobody can park, no customers.
Café keeps car park: nowhere to eat, no customers.
Café puts tables on half of car park: not enough customers to cover costs.

62245 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Brian, #380 of 1523 🔗

yes that’s an option i may do as i live in bristol – so a little weekly jaunt over the bridge to chepstow or somewhere for shopping may actually be nice break. i fear though that it will be a matter of couple of weeks before the taffies bring in the mask fetish in shops, as they’ve enforced on transport.

62282 ▶▶▶ court, replying to Sue, #381 of 1523 🔗

Popped over the border from North Bristol to Chepstow to visit Boots, Tesco & M&S today as a tester. Surprised to see so many masked up, esp in Tesco. Great to know I wont be challenged there though. Loads of lovely independent shops in the high street. Even though 99% of my shopping comes online it’s great to have the option of going somewhere and not being challenged.

Looks like the FM believes in Civil Liberties still (at least this week!)

62799 ▶▶ Catherine, replying to Brian, #382 of 1523 🔗

I’m popping over tomorrow, we are on the border so it’s a no brainer!

62027 Northern Chubs, 21, #383 of 1523 🔗

I just went to my local Tesco Express shop. I didn’t need to but I wanted to see what would happen if I wasn’t a complicit masked goon.

I parked my car in the car park and strolled up to the doors. I noticed some new Orwell signage but disregarded it immediately. I instantly broke the rules by going the “wrong” way until I encountered the croissant stand. I noticed the staff were masked up to the eyeballs whereas yesterday they weren’t. So it’s an interesting feature of the virus where in the UK it has mutated to become more dangerous at 12:00am this morning.

Anyway, 5 or 6 customers were wearing a mask. The only person that wasn’t was a b loke. I looked at him for a bit of camaraderie, but he wasn’t bothered. Never mind.

No one said anything to me and I don’t feel like I got any stares. So I advise other people to go into shops unmuzzled. Do it! It’ll be ok.

62030 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 8, #384 of 1523 🔗

Clearly, John Apter, in charge of upholding the law, is unaware of the 2010 Equalities Act!

Shops should refuse entry to anyone not wearing a face mask, the chairman of the Police Federation of England and Wales has said.
From today the wearing of face masks is compulsory in shops and other indoor establishments in England.
John Apter said officers will be available to help stores “only as a last resort” as they “simply do not have the resources” to enforce the rule.
“It is our members who are expected to police what is a new way of living and I would urge retail outlets to play their part in making the rules crystal clear; if you are not wearing a face covering then you are not coming in,” he said.

Unfortunately, his callous words will provoke severe anxiety in many vulnerable people.

I hope shop management are more clued-up and sensible!

62041 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Cheezilla, 12, #385 of 1523 🔗

The Police came out with this sort of crap when shutdown first started. Remember them wanting tougher lock down? They want it absolute, so that it’s easy for them. They went bonkers with over-reach, can’t go in your own garden etc., even though the law said you could.

62193 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #386 of 1523 🔗

That came back and bit them.

62034 saab93viggen, replying to saab93viggen, 28, #387 of 1523 🔗

First-time poster, and thanks to all of you for keeping me sane. Just back from my local Tesco (Dorset). The girl on the door asked (nicely) if I wanted to wear a mask and was very happy to accept my claim for an exemption before I was even half-way through asking. I didn’t have to elaborate and would have used the ‘severe distress’ one if needed, even though it’s intellectual distress. Every other customer was wearing a mask but no-one said anything to me. Grocery shopping will have to be a solitary thing for the time being, sadly, because I wouldn’t want my family to be exposed to any kind of unpleasantness.

Thanks again for everything, as I say.

62096 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to saab93viggen, 7, #388 of 1523 🔗

I suffer from low blood oxygen level when suffocated

64152 ▶▶ eca, replying to saab93viggen, #389 of 1523 🔗

‘Intellectual distress,’ perfect! Encapsulates what so many of us are feeling.

62658 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IMoz, #391 of 1523 🔗

Here’s a video of her saying it:
Harries on masks: https://twitter.com/i/status/1279360417903542273

62038 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 11, #392 of 1523 🔗

09.15 breakfast at the cafe on the White Van Man trading estate, busiest I’ve seen it thus far, every table occupied and some outside, not a mask in sight; steady stream of takeaway customers at the counter, none had masks and nobody asked them to.

62075 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to karenovirus, 6, #393 of 1523 🔗

We’ve just had 2 young lads in our house to mend our bathroom extractor fan. No masks, no question of masks, no problem! I am penning an email to Oxfam – outrageous!

62043 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 12, #394 of 1523 🔗

just back from southern spain….
Two days after I arrived face nappies were made mandatory everywhere outside including walking in the countryside or on the beach. If you are in a bar or restaurant you must don your nappy when you go to the toilet – fine for non compliance 100euro and 600euro for the bar owner.
The saddest thing I saw was a nappied up elderly chap in town leaning on his stick, clearly having breathing problems in the 30C heat.
The mislead/brainwashed Spanish were 95% nappied up outside in town 2 days before it was mandatory, fear or an ignorant duty to the vulnerable maybe?
The beaches are swarming with official hitler youth/gestapo ensuring that; ”you must comply” i was told. (presumably in an effort to reduce spanish youth unemployment)
I like to ratch along the beach/rocks with the occasional dip in the sea and portion of sardines – and its not practical with a nappy on. I’m back over in august and my frends will have got me a bike (no nappy required) by then and i can head off to less busy coast with less official busy bodies ruining the tourist industry.
The stasi were out in force making a fortune out of nappy crime.

If you can I suggest you avoid Spain as they sleep walk back to facism through ignorance and blind compliance. If you do go then make sure you get a QR code 48 hrs before flight – I went through malaga airport like a dose of salts…

C19 posative cases are apparently on the rise again in spain (more testing maybe?) so compulsory nappies at all time is clearly a raging success!

62044 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Major Panic, 12, #395 of 1523 🔗

More likely increase in cases due to wearing masks and thereby compromising one’s immune system!

62052 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Carrie, 6, #396 of 1523 🔗

….and an increase in testing with the wonderful tests that are NOT reliable

62078 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Carrie, 5, #397 of 1523 🔗

That, and the cough is naturally making its way through the healthy population leaving imunity in its wake – it is not being detered by mandatory face nappies everywhere. When they introduced the new law they did say that there had been no increase in hospitalisations – but they just want people to be aware that the cough hasnt gone away – idiots!

62086 ▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 2, #398 of 1523 🔗

”something must be done”, however stupid

62270 ▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Major Panic, 2, #399 of 1523 🔗

Boris, in a nutshell – as us nuts would say!

62292 ▶▶ court, replying to Major Panic, #400 of 1523 🔗

I cancelled our trip to visit family in the Costa Blanca next week when I heard it was heading this way. I’ve had run ins with overzealous supermarket staff and the Guardia Civil in the past and knew exactly how it will be policed.

62725 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to Major Panic, 1, #401 of 1523 🔗

Unfortunately, this is what I think they will do here. England’s mask-wearing legislation is stricter than Scotland’s, so Wee Jimmy clearly will need to go further than Boris. Worse still, the majority in Scotland just seem to gave gone along with the mask wearing, although first fine today in Jedburgh for non-compliance. I suspect she is calculating now how much further she can go. Very, very depressing.

62046 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 17, #402 of 1523 🔗

Maybe Boris can explain why, if vaccines are so safe, these schemes are in place:

https://www.gov.uk/vaccine-damage-payment

https://www.hrsa.gov/vaccine-compensation/index.html

https://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/committee/topics/pharmacovigilance/Dec_2018_VICPs/en/

and what happened last time a mass vaccination of the population took place with a rushed vaccine and to estimate the payouts this time around:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I0hIC6GqMc&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

62054 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Awkward Git, 10, #403 of 1523 🔗

There’s a far more recent cock-up from 2009, but why publicise that: https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/brain-damaged-uk-victims-swine-flu-vaccine-get-60-million-compensation-1438572

62071 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, #404 of 1523 🔗

Exactly!

62091 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Awkward Git, 4, #405 of 1523 🔗

Thanks AG this is potent stuff.

The Swine Flu Fraud of ’76 is a must watch. link again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I0hIC6GqMc&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

So funny (basically tragic) to see the guy in change of this mass vaccination program squirm and deny that he knew that the vaccination had severe side effects such as neurotoxicity that resulted in paralysis, the public were never told of side effects and the propaganda relentless and played on emotions, same tactic as now but supported by digital age.

62055 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 20, #406 of 1523 🔗

Posted on yesterday’s page from the airport early this morning. Had a snack in Pret. Lots of people glad to remove masks but put their dirty snot rags down on the table. Two other women came in without masks but wearing lanyards. No problems getting on the plane- no questions or dirty looks from anyone, except perhaps envious ones. Met another lovely lady on our flight wearing sunflower lanyard. She had obviously researched things thoroughly and was ready with her translation into Spanish.
We thought the police might say something at passport control-not a dicky bird. We had to scan Covid immigration forms and my husband was asked by the lady to put on a mask. He told her in his best Spanish that he was exempt-no problem. Through the temperature recorder-no problem. Decided against the bus so took a taxi-driver wearing a mask but didn’t mind us riding without one. Chatted about how bad things were for everyone, everywhere and this crazy world that we live in.
In hotel now. Just off to test the waters in the street. Wish us luck.

62059 ▶▶ ambwozere, replying to Margaret, 3, #407 of 1523 🔗

Good luck and enjoy yourselves too.

62080 ▶▶ Edna, replying to Margaret, 1, #408 of 1523 🔗

Good luck, hope you have a good holiday.

62111 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Margaret, #409 of 1523 🔗

question for when you get back from the street – have you had a 100euro fine yet?

62311 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Major Panic, 7, #410 of 1523 🔗

No. We ambled out of the hotel to find a nice spot for lunch. Delightful Spanish lady brought us the leather bound menu (horror of horrors!)and we passed a pleasant hour or so in the sunshine. Then a walk along to visit our friends at their apartment. Stopped to chat to a pleasant chap who had opened a lovely French Patisserie so we promised to pay him a visit in the next few days. He took no notice of the fact that we were unmuzzled as he was just so keen to show us his gorgeous cakes and chocolates in the desperate hope of getting a sale. Back to the hotel then, spotting only a couple of unmuzzled folk.
We laughed at how ridiculous it was for people to be masked up in 30 degree heat especially as there was hardly anyone to be seen in this usually bustling resort. Social distancing could take place here at 30 metres not 1 metre. Lots of places had closed down for good, which is sad to see.

62370 ▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Margaret, 1, #411 of 1523 🔗

wow – I was in a different spain…
lots of spanish holiday makers, beach busyish but deffinately not packed

keep us updated and have a great time

62419 ▶▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Major Panic, 1, #412 of 1523 🔗

Thanks. Just been for a swim in the large outdoor pool-me and two others. Loads of empty sun beds placed in pairs inside a rectangle marked by black tape. You won’t get killed in the rush for a sun bed here. OH has the terrace all to himself. Not been to the beach yet so will let you know.

62061 Achilles heel, replying to Achilles heel, 4, #413 of 1523 🔗

the government website helpfully now gives links to exemption cards for the “causes severe distress”
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own

62070 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Achilles heel, 15, #414 of 1523 🔗

The masks are just a distraction, designed to make people fed up and ‘want’ the vaccine…

62088 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Carrie, 4, #415 of 1523 🔗

Indeed, so much has been invested into it, politically and financially. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if it’s just a placebo to put the zombies at rest.

62095 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to DRW, 2, #416 of 1523 🔗

I’ve got a mad theory that, since they say the vaccine will do little more than minimise symptoms, it’s just HCQ (out of patent and cheap) + some nasties they’ve developed so they can claim it’s a new product and coin it in.

62153 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 2, #417 of 1523 🔗

More likely (in my opinion) is that they ‘spike’ the flu vaccine – which will likely have a higher uptake than any rushed CV19 vaccine – with some nasties instead, or as well a,s anything they might add to the CV 19 one (eg sterility agents, like BG has added to some of his previous vaccines).

Remember that they are planning to initially target kids up to age 11 with the flu vaccine, and I have read elsewhere that any sterilising side effects of a CV19 vaccine will take 7 years to show up… I think that adds to the likelihood of them secretly adding something to this flu vaccine as well, so that one way or another, they will ‘get’ everyone…

62240 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, #418 of 1523 🔗

I’d been thinking on the same lines – Bloris openly said they want us ALL to have the flu vaccine this winter.

62255 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Carrie, 3, #419 of 1523 🔗

Yes, I made this point earlier – I normally have the flu jab (due to mild immuno-suppressants for arthritis), but certainly won’t this year. Who, nowadays, would trust ‘our’ government not to spike it with some untested and rushed anti-covid stuff!?

62427 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to IanE, 1, #420 of 1523 🔗

I’ve not had a flu jab for decades.
Haven’t had flu in decades.

62745 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Carrie, #421 of 1523 🔗

I was only half-serious and what you say makes sense but it was the bit about ‘minimising symptoms’ that got me thinking. . . p.s. I will not be having a flu jab again, not after 2018 (‘posted about this before).

62130 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Carrie, 2, #422 of 1523 🔗

I wish I could believe you were right and that masks would then become optional – as long as the vaccine isn’t compulsory. Call me selfish, but if others want to get vaccinated then let them go ahead (though I worry about the kids).

62198 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Carrie, 3, #423 of 1523 🔗

Dead right. That’s the real reason. Anything to get out of the nappies.

62202 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to annie, 2, #424 of 1523 🔗

..which may also why the Police are not likely to get over-involved…

62422 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Carrie, 1, #425 of 1523 🔗

Especially when hes talking about beating this virus by next summer…..

62242 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Achilles heel, 1, #426 of 1523 🔗

I like the one that says “Please remove your face covering so I can understand you better.”
Sums it up really!

62065 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 14, #427 of 1523 🔗

Are we winning the debate?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8555759/Confusion-anger-day-one-new-face-mask-law.html

Pleased to see North Tyneside is doing its bit!

62120 ▶▶ sarnskeptic, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #428 of 1523 🔗

Why do all their characters say the same thing? Almost like they made most of them up?

62129 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #429 of 1523 🔗

YAY!
FIGHT BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

62138 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #430 of 1523 🔗

Is John Apter auditioning for a job in the Parliamentary Cabinet?

John Apter, chairman of the Police Federation of England and Wales, said: ‘I would urge retail outlets to play their part in making the rules crystal clear – if you are not wearing a face covering then you are not coming in. Officers will be there to help stores if needed – but only as a last resort, as we simply do not have the resources.’
Speaking about those who might have exemptions, Mr Apter added: ‘If you’re out shopping today and you see somebody not wearing a face covering it may be because they have a hidden disability. Don’t jump to conclusions, don’t have a go at them.

Massive contradiction without even taking a breath!

62068 TJN, replying to TJN, 39, #431 of 1523 🔗

So here we are at last: English Muzzle Day. The date 24 July 2020 will surely go down as one of the most shameful in English history. England, the country that gave the world Shakespeare, football, the Sex Pistols, the English language, countless political philosophers and countless inventions, and laid the groundwork of so much that is good and noble in the world today: reduced to an abject exhibition of pre-Enlightenment superstition and centralist subservience probably never previously exampled in its long history, redolent of some miserable East European state in the dark days of Communism.

I wouldn’t normally go into the nearest city (down here in Deepest Devon) on a Friday morning, but felt I had to make the effort today. M&S, Tesco, Hotel Chocolat, covered shopping arcade: no questions, nothing, zilch, zero. Had a long chat with the staff in Hotel Chocolat; no mention or even hint at muzzles. Almost no other shoppers without muzzles. Don’t know if I had any dirty looks, because (except for elderly, frail or visibly disabled people) I don’t make any eye contact with muzzle wearers. When I was in the bank (Lloyds) I was asked in hushed tones whether I wanted one of their muzzles, so I just said exempt, to which the reply was, in very hushed and almost apologetic tone, that’s fine. So just pretty well as Biker has reported from Bonny Scotland.

It’s clear that the shops just don’t want to know. There are security guys at many of the entrances, but you can see they are almost embarrassed to be there, the more so when you walk by unmuzzled.

Another notable thing: no visible plod presence. I was surprised at that. I thought they’d at least be out and about today, of all days – they are usually around. But no sign of them. It’s almost as if they’ve made a definite decision not to get involved. Time will tell on that one I suppose.

The muzzle wearers nearly all take the filthy rags on and off between shops. Of course, that’s completely against the government guidance, which states that hands must be sanitised or washed with soap and water for 20 seconds each time the disgusting garment is touched. With no plod around, I was unable to make any complaints about this flagrant breach of the guidelines.

Mrs TJN is going out later (unmuzzled of course), as she doesn’t want to miss out on the fun.

Today’s the first anniversary of our Lord Protector’s ascendance to power. I wonder what we will be looking back on come 24 July 2021. Right now, today, I’m ashamed to be English.

62143 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to TJN, 5, #432 of 1523 🔗

Good for the local coppers. They know it’s not their problem and also must realise there’s a massive potential for riots down the road when the job losses are felt. The less hostility towards them now, the easier things will be.

Their Fuhrers need to be reminded about policing by consent!

62173 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Cheezilla, 8, #433 of 1523 🔗

Thing is, down here the D&C Police were among the most eager forces in the country to inflict the lockdown: roadblocks, masses of patrols, stopping people when they were out, lots of social media threats.

So I’m surprised by their recent statement that, essentially, they won’t be enforcing the nappies.

Maybe they felt they were taken for a ride by the government back in March-April, and aren’t going to be bitten again.

62234 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to TJN, 7, #434 of 1523 🔗

It sounds like in the early days they believed there was a deadly virus waiting to strike anyone out in the open.

After the BLM riots and the myriad blatant contradictions from the government, coupled with the stats, many of them must realise we’ve all been had and that they’ll be on the frontline when the bulk of the population finally twigs.

62272 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #435 of 1523 🔗

Yes, and now we know that the virus spreads indoors in crowded environments, and that vitamin D almost certainly protects against it. The wonders of science. But my grandmother could have told anyone that, and presumably all the grandmothers before her.

Our wonderful government, followed by the police thought differently of course.

One burning question I’ve had ever since the lockdown, and which I may post to CC Sawyer some day: what’s the difference between their telling us to stay inside during the covid outbreak and telling someone to stay inside a burning tower block?

62286 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to TJN, 1, #436 of 1523 🔗

Ouch!

62479 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #437 of 1523 🔗

Really, what’s the difference? I’m going to be writing to Sawyer with this some day.

It occurred to me back in March. But Mrs TJN said it might be in bad taste to draw such an analogy. I don’t know. Killing people with lockdown is in very bad taste.

62237 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to TJN, 1, #438 of 1523 🔗

See my comment elsewhere on this page from earlier today quoting your chief constable – Sawyer who was interviewed by BBC breakfast (on at 6.16) and was talking about arresting people .

62265 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to mjr, 4, #439 of 1523 🔗

Only just seen your Sawyer post. He’s full of shit. Your quote seems to be saying that if you are asked to leave a shop and refuse then you can be arrested. No news in that; nothing new. Obviously, if I’m asked to leave a premises then I will do so.

Same back during the Nazi bit of the lockdown. Media. statements like ‘we will be maintaining a visible presence’; we will be upholding the CV rules’. Intimidating to some perhaps, but actually meaningless.

The TJN family got stopped by an Armed Response Unit when out walking near their home. They didn’t have any time for him.

62804 ▶▶ Gracie Knoll, replying to TJN, #440 of 1523 🔗

My worry is that by 24 July 2021 we will look back on 24 July 2020 as a Golden Age.

62860 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Gracie Knoll, #441 of 1523 🔗

Economically I think we will probably look back on July 2020 as a golden age. Culturally, I hope we will have moved on a very long way, having learnt some very hard lessons.

Fundamentally, economic reality is going to do for this current lot.

62069 daveyp, replying to daveyp, 24, #442 of 1523 🔗

Boris calling anyone “Nuts” who doesn’t want to be vaccinated.

Anyone remember any of these statements that Michael Gove said when campaigning to Leave the EU with Boris:

“People in this country have had enough of experts.”

“I’m not asking the public to trust me. I’m asking them to trust themselves”

Well thanks for this advice, because I’m gonna trust myself and make my own mind up, rather than listening to these same experts that they told us we shouldn’t be trusting back in 2016.

62082 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to daveyp, 6, #443 of 1523 🔗

I trust myself, and I am nuts

62119 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Major Panic, 2, #444 of 1523 🔗

Freedom to be nuts!

63105 ▶▶▶ Hugh, replying to Major Panic, #445 of 1523 🔗

Don’t panic!

62306 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to daveyp, 11, #446 of 1523 🔗

Yes Boris. It’s nuts to let your body perform a natural function that has evolved over millennia, without the need for medical intervention. Absolutely nuts.

62073 RickH, replying to RickH, 28, #447 of 1523 🔗

Of course – this whole thing is a reminder of that saying :

“Just think how stupid are many of average intelligence. And then remember that 50% are even less intelligent”.

A minute’s pause reveals the absurdity : we have not worn masks up to this point.

In that time, the indicators (probably exaggerated anyway) of infection have consistently declined. No spikes, no waves – except unconvincing government manufactured ones.

The indicators for this generally mild infection are now at a level well below any definition of an epidemic, and suggest the presence (and only *presence*) of the virus in between 0.01% to 0.04% of the population.

… and yet people are wandering around in a worse state of anxiety than September 1939, FFS!

62110 ▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to RickH, 20, #448 of 1523 🔗

On my small (what you might describe as up market) estate the majority are what may be classed as having above average intelligence. Retired headmasters, teachers, solicitors and accountants to name but a few. Most are ‘Guardian’ readers and avid BBC watchers. I’m afraid to say that they are the worst of the lot in my experience and have embraced the Covid narrative as a junky craves his heroine.
Intelligence does not come into it. What determines your grasp on reality is whether or not you have been conditioned to believe that the ‘Guvment’ exists to look after its citizens first and foremost.
I also believe that humans fall into two categories. Those who can be hypnotised (evidenced by the ridiculous antics stage performers can get their willing participants to engage in) and those who are hypnotise proof who cannot be controlled in this way. Nothing to do with intelligence.

62135 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Harry hopkins, 5, #449 of 1523 🔗

There’s no link between intelligence and capacity for independent though, perhaps even a reverse correlation.

62149 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to TJN, 1, #450 of 1523 🔗

‘Intelligence’ (forget the narrow operational test definitions) includes the concept of independent and rational thought. And, no, there’s not a reverse correlation between the two. That’s a contradiction.

62161 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to RickH, 6, #451 of 1523 🔗

I known some very intelligent people – scientific and maths-based degrees, lots of qualifications – and have often been gobsmacked about how little they can think for themselves.

I suppose there’s a type of intelligence which enables someone to learn ‘process’ very well, and another that enables someone to work things out.

For a lot of people it seems that their ‘intelligence’ – that is a capacity to take on and retain information (and thus pass exams) – merely enables them to swallow stuff like the covid scam more thoroughly.

62201 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to TJN, 6, #452 of 1523 🔗

Yep – I was at uni (doing languages) with a girl who went on to get a First in Maths (back in the days when not everyone got Firsts!!), and she has totally bought into the panic – she was also a good seamstress, so she is now making and selling fabric masks. Sigh!

62735 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ alison, replying to Carrie, 1, #453 of 1523 🔗

I agree, so many really intelligent people fully committed to the official narrative. I think it’s more about the difference between those who mainly judge by following the herd, and those who think independently and are willing to be seen as curmudgeons, which is really about character not intelligence as such. Also, difference between having a basic commitment to reality in thinking, or having a commitment to something else, whether it be ideology or the zeitgeist or whatever else.

62141 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Harry hopkins, 13, #454 of 1523 🔗

This is what happens when you cut people of from family,friends work colleagues and the wider community and then beam fear programming into their minds 24/7.
Very similar to cult programming

62220 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 6, #455 of 1523 🔗

That’s why “The Science” the goverment has been following is from the nudge unit and not from the medically qualified.

62180 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Harry hopkins, 11, #456 of 1523 🔗

Absolutely, our experience to a T. We know hardly anyone with higher qualifications who has not been brainwashed. Worse, some of them were screaming for lockdown in early March and we now despair that some of them will ever get better. Certainly you cannot challenge them; they just get angry and defensive. Some less educated, people we know have just been feared into obedience.

We (OH and I) have doubted the meaning of ‘intelligence’ for years. What is an intelligent person? I think you may be onto something about the hypnotism; does a long time in the education system mean some are more susceptible? I really don’t know but at the moment the only rational conversations we’re having is with shopkeepers, workmen, some neighbours and a rag-bag of acquaintances, some with higher education backgrounds, some not.

As for us, we attribute our scepticism to being arsey bastards. We are now totally inured to being out-of-step with most people’s views on most issues so this is only an extreme form for us. Our geo-political understanding has finally come home and it has found the British woefully but expectedly wanting. I won’t go through our history of dissidence – ‘don’t want to lose the few friends we’ve got! – but suffice to say our causes were generally ‘left’ although never Labour (nu or otherwise) and absolutely not ‘woke’!

Now left/right are bankrupt terms, it’s them v us and no mistake. My OH has just suggested that another thing we’ve somehow retained is a sense of humour. This is something that seems to have disappeared fast in the general population, and it has been happening for years. Thank god it’s still flourishing on this site, something to cherish.

FInally, we do not follow MSM or social media and we make a point of talking to real-life people as much as possible, even if it isn’t always a good experience. I am sure this is a big factor in our retaining some sanity although weirdly, one of my husband’s brothers, a graduate and a dead-ringer for a bedwetter, is being very robust and he’s on Arsebook all the time!

63076 ▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #457 of 1523 🔗

Agree. What does OH stand for?

63159 ▶▶▶▶▶ Catherine123, replying to Jane, #458 of 1523 🔗

Other half.

62297 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Harry hopkins, 2, #459 of 1523 🔗

That’s funny.
I’ve had about five people try to hypnotise me over the years.
They all failed.

62318 ▶▶▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to Farinances, 2, #460 of 1523 🔗

The only time I allowed someone to attempt it on me they failed miserably also. They confessed that I wasn’t hypnotisable (is there such a word?—there is now!

62085 MDH, replying to MDH, 2, #461 of 1523 🔗

God bless Lord Lloyd-Webber, but who on earth is going to pay out for socially distanced, masked, theatre?
https://www.whatsonstage.com/london-theatre/news/photos-beverley-knight-palladium-social-distance_52050.html

62094 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to MDH, #462 of 1523 🔗

Has the rule changed since yesterday?

It will not be compulsory for customers to wear masks or similar coverings in hairdressers, gyms, dine-in restaurants and pubs or cinemas, concert halls or theatres.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/23/face-masks-mandatory-shops-takeaways-stations-england-friday

62128 ▶▶▶ MDH, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #463 of 1523 🔗

I think M’Lord L-M staged this event ahead of the latest diktat. I mean, God bless him, as far as I know he’s the only high-profile arts figure to actually try to deal with the problem. The rest of them (mainly in the Arts Council Maintained sector) are just sitting on their arses discussing how they can turn the latest Guardian editorial into a piece of socially distanced “performance” to be relayed on Zoom.

62174 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Cheezilla, #464 of 1523 🔗

That’s if they have “measures in place to protect staff and the public from COVID-19.”

62212 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sam Vimes, #465 of 1523 🔗

Yes but surely that’s spacing people out so the theatre is only a quarter full?
(And does that mean the tickets cost four times as much as normal?!)

62229 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rick, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #466 of 1523 🔗

Probably. Yet they can do a sensible risk assessment within the law and fill the place. I am losing sympathy for those that do little to resist the madness.

62257 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #467 of 1523 🔗

You can bet it will be about ‘measures’ more than sense, Cheez.

62224 ▶▶▶ Rick, replying to Cheezilla, #468 of 1523 🔗

Law and guidance. Those you mention do not need to enforce mask or much else. So do because they do not know, some because they are stupid.

62106 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to MDH, 1, #469 of 1523 🔗

“I wanna here you say yeah!”
“mmmmh”

62133 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to MDH, #470 of 1523 🔗

Yer sod that for a game of entertainment. Muppets. I am sure one of our most esteemed theatres is going to go bust if it hasn’t done already. I talked to the manager and she told me this a while ago now.

62147 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to MDH, 3, #471 of 1523 🔗

Bizarrely, you do not have to wear a mask in theatres and cinemas, even though you’d likely be in there far longer than in any shop…

62177 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Carrie, 6, #472 of 1523 🔗

And if you spend an hour in a cafe with friends, plus people serving you – no mask. But run in, grab butty, pay, say “keep the change” and run out… You need a mask.
I thought it was all about contact?

62295 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Carrie, 1, #473 of 1523 🔗

And you’re sat pretty close to a complete stranger. And you could – GASP! – reach over and TOUCH THEM!!

62087 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 12, #474 of 1523 🔗

Some good news!

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/jul/24/sainsburys-asda-face-mask-laws-england-police-coronavirus-risk

Sainsbury’s, Asda and the Co-op are among the stores saying they do not plan to police the new rule ….

Jo Whitfield, who runs the Co-op’s 2,600 grocery stores, said its staff – who already received abuse from shoppers on a daily basis – would not challenge people who refused to toe the line.

“We’ll have in-store signage on the new rules around face coverings but we are clear that shop workers should not enforce the new legislation,” Whitfield said.
“On a daily basis they face abuse, threatening behaviour and even physical assault. Our own figures show that during the Covid-19 crisis such instances have risen and enforcing the wearing of face masks could be another flashpoint.”

62098 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #475 of 1523 🔗

More on abuse in Co-ops:

The Co-op is introducing body cameras for workers after in-store crime soared by 140% in the past year. It said the numbers of violent incidents hit record levels with 1,350 attacks experienced by workers in its shops in the first six months of 2020.
The company said it had not asked staff to challenge shoppers who were not wearing face covering. “We are aware that there are reasons why some customers are exempt, and it is the responsibility of all non-exempt customers to ensure they are in adherence with the new legal requirements,” the Co-op said.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/23/face-masks-mandatory-shops-takeaways-stations-england-friday

I think some Sceptics have said the Co-op has been draconian about distancing. So it is their inebriated or extra-bolshy locals, or have they provoked trouble for themselves?

Businesses are concerned about potential threats to staff if they try to enforce the rules too strictly. Many retailers have already reported aggressive behaviour from some customers when trying to maintain social distancing measures.

Richard Walker , the boss of the frozen food chain Iceland, tweeted: “If mandatory face masks in shops will make our customers & colleagues safer then they are welcome – but we won’t put our staff at risk by asking them to police this.

62123 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #476 of 1523 🔗

Our local Coop still has red barriers in the middle of the narrow alley way (also ugly yellow painted dots next to the wall) but no longer enforces access at the door. They might want to remove these ugly and demeaning barriers and scuba the yellow paint to provide a calm shopping experience.

62127 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Victoria, 3, #477 of 1523 🔗

A Coop in the high peak wasted god knows how much money on traffic lights to limit the numbers of people in the store a few weeks ago. They have now gone, along with the stupid barriers.

62207 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #478 of 1523 🔗

Clearly some local managers have more brains than others.

62139 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #479 of 1523 🔗

So in the Co-op, you might now find random staff shoving a body camera in your face? It’s bad enough in Morrisons at the moment, that some security goons walk around filming you at close quarters. There’s no need for this invasive approach. I’m thinking of getting my own and shoving it in their faces! Essentially what a body camera says is “you are not trusted”. My tactic is to either treat body-camera-wearing scum as though they don’t exist, or give them a menacing look and glare at the camera.

62184 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Tenchy, 3, #480 of 1523 🔗

Perhaps say “ooh can I look at that, isn’t it good?”, while casually wiping your boot polish coated finger over the lens…

62089 Ossettian, #481 of 1523 🔗

Just back from Asda in Corby.

I was the only customer not gimped-up.

Nobody said anything; got a few double-takes.

Nice lady on the till seemed please to have a normal chat. Told me it was quiet.

62093 AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #482 of 1523 🔗

I have to admit that this mask nonsense has pushed me back to the some of darkest days of this whole stupid debacle. And then Kim Jong Boris’ statement this morning about ‘anti-vaxxers are nuts’ really was the icing on the cake.

I’d not paid any attention to the vaccine debate before all this. I’ve now done a fair bit of research. The arguments against vaccines are far more nuanced and rational than the blob would have us believe. Like so many of these no go PC topics, once you take a look under the hood you find some very reasonable and sensible people just asking questions.

The two individuals in the vaccine debate that I’ve found most interesting, with some very compelling arguments, are Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and J.B. Handley.

I suspect that many on here will have been on a similar journey with vaccines.

In case you’re still on the fence, here’s some stuff that I found very helpful:

Robert F. Kennedy’s site https://childrenshealthdefense.org/

Debate/conversation between Kennedy and Alan Dershovitz yesterday on whether vaccines mandates are constitutionally valid in the US – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfnJi7yLKgE

J.B. Handley’s book ‘How to end the autism epidemic’ https://www.amazon.co.uk/How-End-Autism-Epidemic-Revealing/dp/1603588248

J.B. Handley’s blog ‘Did vaccines really save the world?’ https://jbhandleyblog.com/home/2020/6/19/vaccinessavetheworld

Interview with JB Handley
Pt 1 https://tinyurl.com/yaodluwu
Pt 2 https://tinyurl.com/y7n5n39q

Conversation between Kennedy and Handley https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHeP7nJA9MY

As Mike Pompeo very wisely said yesterday (in relation to the CCP) –

‘Distrust and verify’

That could be a very good LS moto!

Hang in the there fellow Lockdown Sceptics.

62097 Ben Shirley, replying to Ben Shirley, 23, #483 of 1523 🔗

I have just got round to writing to my MP, at long last. If anyone else wishes to so but hasn’t found time yet, you’re welcome to use my letter as a template:

Dear So-and-So,

I am writing to express my displeasure at the government’s recent ruling to make face masks a legal requirement in all shops in England, plus many other businesses besides. This is the most aggressive and remorseless assault on human rights inflicted by the British government on its citizens in modern history.

Like many other people, I understood the implementation of a lockdown at the end of March to be the in-road for a totalitarian state, and like all good people I abhor totalitarianism, but nevertheless I went along with the rules largely due to fear. It was not fear of catching or spreading the virus that kept me under house-arrest, but the fear of being punished by the government and socially ostracised by members of the public who have swallowed the government’s shameless parade of lies, inconsistencies and fallacies hook, line and sinker. It was that and the fact that there wasn’t anywhere I could go even if I wanted to. Now, enough is enough and I will play the game no more. The government says I must not show my face in shops. For the sake of all that is true and good and beautiful about life, I must defy the government.

I think it’s customary at this stage in proceedings for the unconverted recipient of the anti-lockdown gospel to interject with the insistence that the government policy has been strictly science-led and that absolute freedom does not include the ‘freedom to infect people’, and of course they’d be talking nonsense.

For one thing, ‘the science’ is far from conclusive and has frequently been terribly flawed. The lockdown itself was implemented partly on the insistence of Professor Neil Ferguson and his lurid fantasy that 500,000 people in the UK would die of Covid without it, an eventuality which has been proven entirely false by our friends in Sweden. Both Ferguson himself and his model have since been roundly discredited but heaven knows why it took so long when Ferguson has a proven track record of exaggerating the effects of pandemics beyond all proportion, as shown by his earlier forecasts for SARS and swine flu. What’s more, he evidently didn’t believe his own forecasts or else he wouldn’t have risked infecting his lover and her family when he broke his own rules to meet her. It is shameful that the government has persisted in justifying its tyranny with his claim of 500,000 deaths long after it was discredited and it is wholly dishonest to portray its interpretation of science as definitive when the man responsible for it operates with expertise of a mediaeval quack doctor and the accuracy of Mystic Meg.

Furthermore, ‘the science’ in April claimed that face masks do more harm than good. Now, apparently, they are vital. After years upon years of epidemiological research, I do not believe that science will suddenly change its mind about face masks at the drop of a hat unless it is instructed to do so for the furtherance of a government agenda. Even now, ‘the science’ is still highly contested, with many credible scientists opposing the use of masks and high-profile epidemiologists like Dr. Sunetra Gupta suggesting that we have already achieved herd immunity. If any further evidence were needed, let me quote from the Welsh Government’s advice on face coverings, thus: “At the present time, the widespread use of masks by healthy people in the community is not supported by high quality scientific evidence.”

Secondly, the nature of infection is a two-way street. It is as much about the ‘freedom to become infected’ as it as about the ‘freedom to infect’. The citizens of this country are, by and large, responsible adults. We do not live in a state of perpetual childhood in which we can never be trusted to act rationally and of our own accord. We are all aware of the virus but most among us understand that the risk of catching it on any given day is infinitesimally small, let alone the risk of being hospitalised and dying from it. Therefore, when two rational adults transmit the virus between themselves, they do so by mutual consent. We all know we might have it and we all know that any other person could be a potential carrier, and we are happy to engage despite the risk of infection because we know it is minute. Anyone who believes in the possibility and desirability of eternal life, if only they could avoid risk completely, is welcome to lock themselves down in their own homes. Then the rest of us could get on with earning a living and socialising healthily, since we cannot alleviate their problems merely by adding to our own.

Contd. in Pt II.

62109 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Ben Shirley, 5, #484 of 1523 🔗

Good work. Every letter of dissent helps.

62122 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Ben Shirley, 11, #485 of 1523 🔗

Call me psychic but I got a vision of the reply you will get:
“Thank you for contacting me, you comments have been noted. We value your input, May I offer my thanks to you for your continued support for the Government in these extraordinary times”.

62185 ▶▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to Two-Six, 2, #486 of 1523 🔗

What on earth gives you that idea? Anyone would think we had reason to be cynical…

62099 Ben Shirley, 27, #487 of 1523 🔗

Template Letter Pt. II

As of today, I will be breaking the law every time I go shopping because I will not endorse totalitarianism and will not refuse myself the most fundamental human right to acknowledge my own humanity, which is expressed through my face, and to act independently as a free man, and whatever the shower of ministers and jumped-up journalists have to say on the matter, that does not make me a criminal, nor even selfish.

I am appealing for you to give great consideration to the totalitarian policy concerning masks, and its other lockdown bedfellows, and to stand up in Parliament and voice your objection to it, for the sake of your constituents and for everyone else in the country. Let us be governed by wisdom rather than excitement and let those in power for whom power is an end in itself make way for new leaders governed by principles of fairness and rationality.

Yours sincerely,
So-and-So

62102 Darryl, 17, #488 of 1523 🔗

I read a article on OffGuardian today, and the opening paragraph sums things up well, article drifts a bit after that –

“Walk the streets in the United States and many countries these days and you will see streaming crowds of people possessed by demons, masked and anonymous, whose eyes look like vacuums, staring into space or out of empty sockets like the dead, afraid of their own ghosts. Fear and obedience oozes from them. Death walks the streets with people on leashes in lockstep.
That they have been the victims of a long-planned propaganda campaign to use an invisible virus to frighten them into submission and shut down the world’s economy for the global elites is beyond their ken. This is so even when the facts are there to prove otherwise.”

62104 Lockdown Truth, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #489 of 1523 🔗

Why will school children in the future remember today’s date ?

comment image /v1/fill/w_740,h_493,al_c,q_90,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/f90459_04939aed9ce742e1928dcec38af7d9ef~mv2.webp

62190 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #490 of 1523 🔗

Another thread on that link asks if it will be gloves next, and points out how new regulations have been being brought in – Media posts pic as if from ‘normal life’ (before, it was people with masks) and the next minute – masks brought in.

Seems like the media are now promoting gloves… Remind me, how long is the MPs summer recess??? Although as we are being governed via SIs, I guess Matt Hancock can just sign a new one at whim.. There was no Parliamentary scrutiny re compulsory masking..

62204 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 3, #491 of 1523 🔗

Gloves give me the heebie jeebies. They really are disgustingly insanitary! They are supposed to be worn for a certain task and disposed of immediately thereafter.

So who and what are they supposed to protect and from what?

Glove-wearing as a medical precaution outside surgery became commonplace during the AIDS scare. Do the glove-wearers think we’re going to be bleeding all over them?

62233 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #492 of 1523 🔗

I’ve noticed a few older people in Sweden wearing gloves in the supermarkets, but only in that type of shop. Seems a bit silly, as most supermarkets provide hand sanitiser at the entrance (but there is no one standing near it and absolutely no enforcement).

62296 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Carrie, 2, #493 of 1523 🔗

Gloves…ffs If you wear then for more than a few minutes your hands get really sweaty and I would imagine are a really good breeding ground for bacteria. Take then of and woo, your hands are going to be a real health hazard.

62445 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Two-Six, 2, #494 of 1523 🔗

get boxing gloves .. to use when some herbert challenges you for not wearing a mask

62329 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #495 of 1523 🔗

Plastic gloves makes me anxious

62232 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #496 of 1523 🔗

Heavens, he looks as unhealthy as he deserves to be.

62117 Kelly deacons, replying to Kelly deacons, 24, #497 of 1523 🔗

Round 1….Morrisons

Lady on door told me to mask up,said I was exempt.She asked for proof,told her I wasnt required to provide it,she said well maybe not today,I told her never.She said OH right.

Next stage of my strategy…..I pulled out an empty cellophane bag that they sell the blue masks in,said to lady,you know that blue mask you’re wearing?it says on the bag not for PPE,Oh she said.

Shop was unusually quiet,I was only one unmasked,no one said anything to me,check out girl lovely.

Do love the way shops have been flogging these masks,knowing they are not for PPE.

62136 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Kelly deacons, 6, #498 of 1523 🔗

Mental.

63054 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Kelly deacons, #499 of 1523 🔗

Well played.

62124 Clive Price, #500 of 1523 🔗

This is the message and clarification I got from Aldi:
 Dear Clive, ​
I’m sorry that the previous response did not meet your expectation.
I can advise that the store will be challenging customers not wearing these and unless there is a medical reason for not wearing one then entry would be refused.
We would not physically restrain you but indeed the police would be called.
I hope this answers your questions.
Yours sincerely
Gary Morton
Customer Service Advisor

62140 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 16, #501 of 1523 🔗

https://twitter.com/tlowdon/status/1286465340281516032/photo/2
Los Angeles County mandated masks on the 14th May. Look at this chart that the epidemic 8 weeks later is three times higher cases than when the masks started. If the masks cannot stop an accelerating outbreak how can they be effective at all in the UK with a minuscule of cases?

62157 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to swedenborg, 4, #502 of 1523 🔗

Unfortunately reality is just not as reliable as theoretical modelling mumbo jumbo

62142 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 24, #503 of 1523 🔗

Back from my usual Friday shopping trip.

No mask and no questions asked. Wonderful, strolled straight in. Depressing to see all of the beady eyes of the mask wearers staring at me. Barring a couple of children I was the only one unmasked.

To quote my beloved football team – No one likes us, we don’t care!!!

Had a great conversation with the unmasked lady on the till. I walked straight up to her, I’m now ignoring the stupid trolley pit lane.

Usual pleasantries – nice day out etc. Have I got a day off, no I’m working at home.

She was upset at how lonely it must be working at home, agreed and that I can’t wait to return to work.

Shifted the conversation up a gear.

Lady (L) ‘do you think people will ever go back to the office’

Me – ‘not sure, could be part of the big plan to close offices so banks can claw back assets etc’

L – ‘umm, never though of it like that’

Me – ‘as you can see I don’t wear a mask as I’m a non-believer’

L – Knowing smile – ‘hmm, yes I can see that’

Me – ‘as a matter of interest how many of your colleagues have been off sick?’

L – ‘ummm, now you come to mention it…..none. A couple of people off with long term illness and were shielding and a coupe off as their partners tested positive but they were back within a couple of days with no symptoms’

Me – ‘umm – funny that’

L – ‘Yeah seeing as we’ve all been working full time’

Me – ‘exactly, if it was that bad you would all be dead and the shop would be closed’

L – ‘ha, yes, you’re right, never thought of it like that. We should of been wearing masks when it was dangerous at the beginning of it’

Me – ‘technically, I suppose so, but it’s not real’

L – blank stare lightbulb flickering – ‘one thing I have noticed is how people touch their face wearing a mask, most people before used to use the hand sanisitser, they don’t now and then spread germs all over their mask and face, urgghhh, disgusting’

Me – ‘mmmm – yeah. My mum taught me to wash my hands to avoid spreading germs and catch my sneeze in a tissue and throw it away. Mum’s are always right, stood me in good stead’

L – ‘yeah, mine too now I think about it’

Me – ‘people need to stop believing the propaganda on tv and in the newspapers’

L – ‘you’re right, anyway there is your change, have a good weekend’

Me – ‘thanks, you too. Don’t forget to wash your hands’

L – ‘I won’t’

What do we take from this conversation – people don’t fucking think for themselves!!

Nice lady though.

62148 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to stefarm, 8, #504 of 1523 🔗

Well you certainly caused her to start thinking. Let’s hope she asks others the same questions.

Well done!

62154 ▶▶ RickH, replying to stefarm, 5, #505 of 1523 🔗

I think you’re absolutely right in attempting to treat people as if they might be capable of rational thought.

62210 ▶▶ Lili, replying to stefarm, 6, #506 of 1523 🔗

What a brilliant example of the sort of light-hearted, friendly but punchy conversation we all need to have with people. This is exactly how we will wake people up and get them to start thinking for themselves. Fantastic.

62216 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lili, 3, #507 of 1523 🔗

Yes, – and fairly easy to ask how many of said shop assistant’s colleagues have had the virus. We know the answer is likely to be ‘few’ or ‘none’ and it is natural to then point out that with the number of people they meet and products they touch, then if it was that dangerous then you’d have expected more cases… Definitely a way to get them thinking (and hopefully others in the queue, if they are not too ‘socially-distanced’ away!)

62248 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to stefarm, 6, #508 of 1523 🔗

The hand sanitiser is another can of worms—nobody ever reads the label—most say along the lines of “work for 2 minutes!” simply because the formulation is so weak that to meet the BSI standard they need to say that :)) Reminds me of that mouthwash that “fights germs” getting recalled because there was a risk it was contaminated with… bacteria!

62288 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to stefarm, 10, #509 of 1523 🔗

That’s the way to do it. I also like talking to a sceptic friend very loudly on the phone whilst walking around the shop. Everyone earwigs. You get tutted and sneered at, but also smiled at knowingly and stared at questioningly. It gets ppl thinking.

62310 ▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 1, #510 of 1523 🔗

Good account thanks. Still doesn’t beat “…don’t start me!”

62314 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Basics, 4, #511 of 1523 🔗

Ha, the 2 conversations I had yesterday and today have put a spring in my step.

P.s. postman delivered a package to me today, no mask and he is looking very fit and sprightly, almost running up and down the street.

62146 Lydia, replying to Lydia, 17, #512 of 1523 🔗

Visited my local shopping centre this morning and I was the only one unmasked. No one questioned me although the guy clicking everyone in and out of the indoor market stared at me but didn’t say anything. I did speak to him on the way and told him I was exempt and he said I thought you were. During the two minute conversation he must have touched his mask ten times.
I came home and felt so guilty and selfish for not doing my part to help others. I have never felt like this before and I do not want to go shopping ever again!

62186 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Lydia, 16, #513 of 1523 🔗

Why do you feel guilty and selfish? You should feel proud that you’ve stood up for common decency and un-selfish in that you’ve done your little it to help others overcome their own stupidity.

62197 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to TJN, 7, #514 of 1523 🔗

Yes, you are not the guilty and selfish one.

62192 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lydia, 13, #515 of 1523 🔗

You did your bit. Shows shopping unmasked can be done painlessly.
Someone else who was in the shop might follow your lead next time.

62205 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Lydia, 13, #516 of 1523 🔗

You ARE doing your bit to help others, Lydia. You are helping to break the spell this evil government has woven and helping people get back to a real normal and not this Handmaid’s Tale, Gilead ‘new normal’. What we are doing is nothing compared to what the young boys and men in the two world wars went through for our freedoms. We stand on their shoulders and must not let THEM down.

62211 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Lili, 8, #517 of 1523 🔗

As Biker put it earlier, going into a shop unmasked is not quite comparable to storing the Normandy beaches …

Yes, not nice for normally unobtrusive and law-abiding people, but well within our capacities.

62208 ▶▶ wendy, replying to Lydia, 10, #518 of 1523 🔗

What a terrible way to have been made to feel for just going shopping. It makes me so angry that we are being forced to feel we are murdering other vulnerable people.

62222 ▶▶▶ Lydia, replying to wendy, 11, #519 of 1523 🔗

That’s how I felt Wendy and it wasn’t very nice experience. There were no other people unmasked and I felt like I was the bad one. If there was a mix of people in masks and unmasked then it possibly would have felt different. Before today I always went shopping with my mum and kids but there is no way I would take my children shopping again as I do not want them to see everyone in masks.

62251 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Lydia, 15, #520 of 1523 🔗

I’m the same – not letting my toddlers see hordes of masked zombies.

Just remember, they want you to feel like ‘the bad one’. You are not; it’s about silent coercion. You’re the one standing up for deeply held principle. That’s not bad.

62326 ▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to TJN, 1, #521 of 1523 🔗

agree

62155 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #522 of 1523 🔗

Can anyone suggest examples of where government ‘science’ and expert advice have turned out to be wrong in the past? I can think of WMD. And the dash for diesel was a great example, but was slightly under the radar for most people – and then the catastrophe was neutralised by VW taking on the role of scapegoat.

Any others?

62158 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #523 of 1523 🔗

The most recent example: the lockdown…

And I don’t think Ferguson was ever right on any of the previous “projections” of major epidemics… His vCJD scare-mongering was a spectacular fail, for example

62166 ▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to IMoz, 1, #524 of 1523 🔗

Yes, but I’m hoping to be able to point to undeniable examples in the past in order to argue that government experts are not infallible.

62182 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #525 of 1523 🔗

Why wouldn’t this qualify: https://www.oie.int/doc/ged/D3278.PDF ?

62187 ▶▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to IMoz, #526 of 1523 🔗

It would! Many thanks (I think I replied to your earlier comment before it was edited).

62200 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Barney McGrew, #527 of 1523 🔗

I edited about the vCJD, I think, but just google that, you’ll fall off your chair when you compare how many he predicted would die from it, and how many actually have!

62223 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to IMoz, 1, #528 of 1523 🔗

Isn’t it only about a couple of hundred worldwide? Compared to his prediction of thousands, if not more?

62236 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Carrie, 4, #529 of 1523 🔗

I think his prediction was something like 50–50k when below 180 have actually died. Although “technically,” he wasn’t “wrong;” but then again, it’s the equivalent of me saying “I predict that between 2 and 10’000’000 will die in the UK from COVID-19,” and I don’t need his “model” to make that “prediction” 😉

62196 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #530 of 1523 🔗

Most of “fallibility” is not about fallibility but about skewing and mis-representing data. I wrote a scathing attack on the Royal Society’s “masks are good” paper and sent it to the President of the RS and someone who was more involved in the paper, all I got was thanks for the comments and criticism; some of the studies they were presenting had p-value (the probablity of falsely rejecting the null hypothesis (that a measure makes no difference)) over 0.5, or approach 1 in one case, when the “accepted” value for p-value “validation” of the alternative hypothesis (that the measure makes a difference) is below 0.05…

62209 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #531 of 1523 🔗

If you want to be controversial, and slightly off-topic, the advice to ‘stay put’ in a tower block that is on fire – Grenfell?

62168 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #532 of 1523 🔗

There’s a few in here
Scared to Death: From BSE to Global Warming: Why Scares are Costing Us the Earthhttps://tinyurl.com/yyt769k8

62181 ▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 2, #533 of 1523 🔗

Thanks. Now I come to think about it, perhaps a better line of attack is to ask my opponent if they can name any examples of where expert advice to government has been shown to be good!

62171 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #534 of 1523 🔗

Measles scare in the early 1990s.
The Foot & Mouth scandal – which I’m thinking was “sponsored” by the seed industry – massive and extremely powerful part of Big Ag.

62189 ▶▶ Edna, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #535 of 1523 🔗

Whatever happend to the hole in the ozone layer?
And, the Millennium bug, of course. Though I can’t complain about that one as I got quite a lot of work from it!!

62199 ▶▶ wendy, replying to Barney McGrew, 6, #536 of 1523 🔗

Maybe it’s been said below but what about thalidomide? I am always grateful that my mother refused the prescription given to her. It has always stayed with me all my life of what I might have suffered and it has made me very cautious of medications and over speedily developed vaccines

62214 ▶▶ ChrisW, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #537 of 1523 🔗

How about the advice to reduce fat in your diet and eat more carbohydrates?

62215 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to ChrisW, -3, #538 of 1523 🔗

Actually, that is not bad advice!

62219 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to IanE, #539 of 1523 🔗

It is if taken as a cure-all in all situations.

62226 ▶▶▶▶ ChrisW, replying to IanE, 3, #540 of 1523 🔗

I think we now know that eating fat doesn’t make you fat, but too many carbs will – plus the extra risk of developing diabetes.

Disclaimer – I’m not a dietician!

62278 ▶▶▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to ChrisW, 3, #541 of 1523 🔗

Good fat won’t make you fat such as that from meats, real cheese, yoghurts, eggs, etc. It’s the transfat and those in processed food that are the dangerous ones as the body can’t break them down and they hang around building up in the body.

62680 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to daveyp, #542 of 1523 🔗

Yes and those are the ones the government told us to eat instead of the good fats.

62678 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to ChrisW, #543 of 1523 🔗

Do the opposite of what NHS dieticians tell you!

62675 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IanE, #544 of 1523 🔗

That’s appalling advice. It has caused an epidemic of diabetes!

62218 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Barney McGrew, 5, #545 of 1523 🔗

The problem isn’t the ‘expert’ or ‘science’. It’s the distortion of both concepts to a political purpose. (Note – that ‘political’ impulse can originate also in the scientific community – as we have seen in some epidemiologists, virologists and public health specialists wildly overstating conclusions that are essentially based on guesswork in order to enhance their status and role. The Ferguson/ICL work is the classic, of course.)

In the current situation, the main issue has been to filter experts and knowledge through a propaganda net that distorts the actual evidence through selective and distorted reporting.

62268 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #546 of 1523 🔗

Swine Flu 2009. The numbers were way out for the UK in particular

62389 ▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Barney McGrew, #547 of 1523 🔗

AIDS we were told it would wipe out millions and effect everyone. In fact it mainly affected passive gay men and injecting drug users. That did not stop the BBC creating Mark Fowler the East Enders character who caught it from shagging a woman! Maybe the BBC were not much better then!

63119 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Barney McGrew, #548 of 1523 🔗

Fouci, the American Ferguson, predicting 30 years ago that AIDS could be transmitted by casual social contact, share a bottle of wine and you’re all gonna die.

62163 Phil Beckley, replying to Phil Beckley, 10, #549 of 1523 🔗

I had a disappointing response from my MP, James Daly in Bury North, to my emails to him against compulsory masks. He ignored all the arguments I presented against mask wearing. He wrote: “While I understand that the science in this area has evolved during the outbreak, the body of scientific evidence that has built up, shows that the risk of transmission is made lower by wearing a face covering.” I have asked him to provide details. The evidence from the CDC in the US, in May (that the evidence from 14 randomised control trials did not support a substantial effect from mask wearing on transmission of the influenza virus) and the figures from New Mexico and California showing much higher rates of infection after the introduction of compulsory masks, would be very hard to gainsay; but I thought it only fair to see the evidence for compulsory masks.

62225 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Phil Beckley, 2, #550 of 1523 🔗

Why are you wasting your time writing to a twat?

62267 ▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to Cecil B, #551 of 1523 🔗

Talking of twats, do we know if Boris Johnson visited Twatt whilst in Orkney yesterday?

62283 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to daveyp, #552 of 1523 🔗

Did they cover over the place name sign to avoid and awkward photo ops?

62309 ▶▶▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to Two-Six, #553 of 1523 🔗

They probably did, but it wouldn’t make any difference as you’ve just got to look at him and it’s the first word that enters your head.

62917 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Phil Beckley, #554 of 1523 🔗

Yet again another template reply.

Jesus wept.

62167 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 10, #555 of 1523 🔗

https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/reconstruction-of-a-mass-hysteria-the-swine-flu-panic-of-2009-a-682613.htmlThis is about the swine flu pandemic 2009.I think a must read for lockdown sceptics. Sounds familiar? Quote “Sometimes some of us think that WHO stands for World Hysteria Organization,” says Richard Schabas, the former chief medical officer for Canada’s Ontario Province.

62203 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to swedenborg, #557 of 1523 🔗

Very, very interesting.

62289 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to swedenborg, 2, #558 of 1523 🔗

Had this, horrible flu. Also it affected kids seemingly worse than adults. The difference then was how the media worked. Smart phones and news via social media weren’t a thing.

62183 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to swedenborg, 1, #559 of 1523 🔗

Synchronistically I’d just written this comment in response to a different but related topic.

The Foot & Mouth scandal – which I’m thinking was “sponsored” by the seed industry – massive and extremely powerful part of Big Ag.

62644 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #560 of 1523 🔗

Just read through this article. It gives a disturbing insight into how and why the world reacted to Covid-19 the way it did.Swine flu turned out to be so much less lethal – a fraction of the deaths of ordinary seasonal flu – that the fear and panic couldn’t be sustained. It’s no surprise then that with a disease that genuinely kills thousands – even if it’s still much less deadly than predicted, and not actually much worse than a bad flu year – has resulted in society and the media going totally nuts.

The article is understandably focused on the German media and government response. Was there a similar response here in the UK – I have no memory of it, though I do remember SARS in 2003 and bird flu in 2005.

Even more disturbing is reading how eager the pharmaceutical industry was for the outbreak to be classed as a “pandemic” so they could start mass-producing the vaccine.

“Sometimes you get the feeling that there is a whole industry almost waiting for a pandemic to occur,” says flu expert Tom Jefferson , from an international health nonprofit called the Cochrane Collaboration. “And all it took was one of these influenza viruses to mutate to start the machine grinding.”

62188 RickH, replying to RickH, 5, #561 of 1523 🔗

Interesting summary re. research on mask wearing on the CEBM website :

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/masking-lack-of-evidence-with-politics/

It’s written in the usual measured manner of the Group, but, stepping back, the evidence clearly blows out of the water any rationale for wearing masks in the current situation – *if* you stick to the basic, long-established principles of risk/established benefit analysis.

The recent Norwegian study makes a key point :

Norway’s Institute for Public Health reported that if masks did work then any difference in infection rates would be small when infection rates are low: assuming 20% asymptomatics and a risk reduction of 40% for wearing masks, 200 000 people would need to wear one to prevent one new infection per week.”

62195 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to RickH, #562 of 1523 🔗

That reminds me, any news on the Danish Mask study? I believe the results were expected around now…

62327 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to RickH, #563 of 1523 🔗

Great info from them, yet again!

62217 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, #564 of 1523 🔗

https://twitter.com/AlexBerenson/status/1286517178309779457/photo/2
Dr Anthony Fauci, US corona virus czar smiles while attending opening of baseball. Btw the one now recommending all to wear masks.

62227 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to swedenborg, 3, #565 of 1523 🔗

…with his mask under his chin – says it all!

62221 T. Prince, 1, #566 of 1523 🔗

Good piece by Tom Woods in the US and he’s giving away free ebook!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RDffMCAujg

Your Facebook Friends Are Wrong About the Lockdown !

Free ebook available from:

wrongaboutlockdown.com

62228 Michael C, #567 of 1523 🔗

A pleasant morning near Wandsworth Common. Plenty of people about both on the Common and on the street, almost nobody wearing a mask. Got my paper from a nearby independent grocer/shop, six people in there, three with masks on, three without. I wore my mask but looped below my mouth and nose. No one seemed to care, certainly not the shop assistant. Passed by the local Sainsburys which usually has a queue of about half a dozen outside, no queue and I thought I spotted two shoppers coming out, one without a mask on and another with their mask pulled down.

62239 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #568 of 1523 🔗

Yesterday it was reported that a number of coaches at St Mirren football club tested positive for coronavirus at a private centre. After retesting with NHS they are now negative. Make of that what you will.

Six St Mirren coaches get coronavirus all-clear after retests Paisley club sent staff for NHS checks after they tested positive for Covid-19 at a private centre.

https://news.stv.tv/sport/st-mirren-coaches-get-coronavirus-all-clear-after-retests?top

62249 ▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #569 of 1523 🔗

you couldn’t make it up….

62279 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #570 of 1523 🔗

We all know how unreliable these tests are.

It is a good thing that they retested and it was negative otherwise they would have locked the place down

62243 PWL, replying to PWL, 6, #571 of 1523 🔗

Face coverings in shops: it’s all about store policy and its reward or punishment – so don’t make excuses to be allowed in
http://www.frombehindenemylines.org.uk/2020/07/face-coverings-in-shops-its-all-about-store-policy-and-its-reward-or-punishment-so-dont-make-excuses-to-be-allowed-in/

62262 ▶▶ Humanity First, replying to PWL, 1, #572 of 1523 🔗

Thanks; interesting analysis- although since the article was written it is obviously now law (and not just store policy) to wear face coverings in shops. But the deliberate creation of a national mood and expectation around mask wearing is quite valid.

This is another thought-provoking article on the same site:

http://www.frombehindenemylines.org.uk/2020/07/exiting-babylon-the-only-way-to-escape-being-prey-for-uk-government-in-perpetuity/

62266 ▶▶▶ PWL, replying to Humanity First, 1, #573 of 1523 🔗

Yes, there is legislation, but the scheme would work with or without it given that essentially it is a matter of shops adopting a policy or not.

62287 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Humanity First, 2, #574 of 1523 🔗

I think the key point is that the law doesn’t compel shopkeepers to enforce the face coverings – only the individual customer is liable. Ergo, it is still essentially a policy decision for the store whether they care to make a big deal about it or not – at no risk to them (unless they fear losing the custom of the muzzled).

62284 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to PWL, 2, #575 of 1523 🔗

Great links thanks.

As for the shop that is essentially implementing a policy that you do not agree with, the normal way for any self-respecting person to react would be take their custom elsewhere – and this is indeed what must be done.

62247 Keen Cook, replying to Keen Cook, 26, #576 of 1523 🔗

Just off the phone from a dear friend – 78 widowed years ago tough resilient (we’ve been having supper on Sunday nights throughout these last 6 months) but pacemaker heart fragile and she gets anxious. Bad varicose veins on legs she’s managed for years but problemsworsened in early May. Took photo for her here on iPad and sent to Dr GP in village as he wasn’t doing face to face and of course no appointments. He prescribed cream online. Legs worsened. She got desperate and after many phone calls and irritating discussions eventually had to decide to pay £150 to see a consultant in August at local Spire hospital as only way for a medical person to see it. Leg got worse. She called into minor injuries hospital near Beverley yesterday to see someone. After many phone calls and speaking through voice entrance allowed in. Hospital empty. Tumbleweed blowing in corridors. Turns out it is now an ulcerated leg, the cream was the wrong one, and she can’t get a wound clinic appointment until next Wednesday. She is incandescent. Wants me to write to MP on her behalf (I will) and has asked where are all the consultants, what are they doing, why are we paying them and why are we giving them more????? Can anyone in charge let me know – oh wait ….

62285 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Keen Cook, 8, #577 of 1523 🔗

Try looking down the golf course. One of the great faikures of our country has been the cowardliness of consultants and other highly paid health professionals to stand tall. They are a group of degenerates. I know their are exceptions proving the rule.

None of them willing to stand with the people for the right cause. Afraid they may lose their double garage lifestyles while others are losing their lives.

62305 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Keen Cook, 7, #578 of 1523 🔗

Gets on my tits that BBC shows a programme called ‘dear NHS superstars’ famous faces honour the incredible people of the NHS.

How about we change it to ‘dear NHS why did you deliberately kill my mum, dad, gran, uncle, daughter…’

62373 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to stefarm, 1, #579 of 1523 🔗

god why did you watch that drivel – propaganda of the highest order…. well to be fair a lot of health workers did exceptional jobs on the covid wards etc. Not sure what the other 75% were doing

62449 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Sue, 1, #580 of 1523 🔗

I didn’t watch it 😏

62323 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Keen Cook, 7, #581 of 1523 🔗

Film the wound and someone to talk on film and send to Simon Dolan – they are looking for evidence like this.

62381 ▶▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to Victoria, 1, #582 of 1523 🔗

OK. Yes. .

62695 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, #583 of 1523 🔗

Great idea!

62369 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Keen Cook, #584 of 1523 🔗

friday + sun’s out = consultants playing golf

62250 Guirme, 9, #585 of 1523 🔗

My daughter has suggested that it makes perfect sense for Wales to ban the reading of newspapers; after all there is the very real danger that they may spread the truth (some of themat least)!

62252 Lockdown Truth, 12, #586 of 1523 🔗

The day I’ve joked about before has actually arrived…!

comment image /v1/fill/w_740,h_538,al_c,q_90,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/f90459_cc83af0667e84191b28036e3e71cacc6~mv2.webp

62259 wendy, replying to wendy, 3, #588 of 1523 🔗

Latest ONS infection survey is out. I keep an eye on it every week. They continue to report new infections as the decline as levelled off since May. So it’s not falling but it’s not statistically significantly rising either.

62273 ▶▶ sarnskeptic, replying to wendy, #589 of 1523 🔗

I’m more or less convinced at this point that those figures are largely false positives: as far as I can tell they’re getting fewer than 10 infections per 25000 people and then extrapolating (!) it to 55 million people.

62274 ▶▶ Basics, replying to wendy, 1, #590 of 1523 🔗

Infections or cases? Genuine question not wanting to be pedantic or even sound like I am by saying so! Is ‘infections’ now the term?

62276 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Basics, 1, #591 of 1523 🔗

Almost certainly false positives anyway – esp since it seems to be flat-lining!

62294 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to IanE, 2, #592 of 1523 🔗

Yes the percentage of tests graph a few days ago showed that. I’m interested in the terms.
Case is so in control.
Infection is so toxic.

The propaganda isn’t based on much else that emotional flavours in words. It would be interesting to see how closely framed words are operating in other languages.

62303 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Basics, 3, #593 of 1523 🔗

Infection does sound toxic, but it’s more technically correct. You can be infected with the virus without being a medical case requiring treatment

62344 ▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to IanE, 6, #594 of 1523 🔗

ONS estimate currently at any given point in time England has around 27,000 people who have tested positive for the virus that causes the illness Covid-19. There seems to be very few admissions to hospitals currently so these people must mostly be recovering.

Wouldn’t it be good if this could be reported by MSM as to do so would totally undermine the fear. But my conversations with frightened people lead me to believe they have been so taken in by the fear and misinformation they can’t take on board that there is little to fear. It’s all very very sad, disappointing and generally anger making

62440 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to wendy, 1, #595 of 1523 🔗

27,000 is almost certainly a gross over-estimation too. It was ~30,000 about a month ago if I recall, and given it’s been in decline (R < 1) the entire time, it should be a lot less than that now. I do remember reading something about them changing the way they calculate community infections but I can’t recall what it was that changed/why.

Either way, as the good Dr Carl H wrote about in speccie (unsurprisingly _not_ covered on the BBC, Guardian and co) loads of these are false anyway, beggars belief.

62333 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Basics, 1, #596 of 1523 🔗

Well infections and cases are being used to mean the same thing. An infection could have no symptoms. Usually a case was when a person was unwell enough to be admitted to hospital for treatment. With other viral illnesses we have always said infections. Cases seems to cause more panic and fear.

62340 ▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to wendy, #597 of 1523 🔗

Likewise ‘coronavirus’ and ‘COVID19’.

62350 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to bluemoon, #598 of 1523 🔗

Yes it’s got all muddled up hasn’t it. There is the particular coronavirus that causes the illness COVID-19 but people are not always unwell as we all know there are many asymptomatic infections even in the frail elderly living in care homes which the ONS Vivaldi study has demonstrated. How to get these studies to be reported on in MSM I don’t know.

62353 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to wendy, #599 of 1523 🔗

As we keep saying: doesn’t fit the narrative…….

62367 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to wendy, 1, #600 of 1523 🔗

they keep changing the goal posts, narrative, what they’re testing and definitions etc on purpose to keep people confused. Also lack of consistency on what measuring/announcing means more difficult to compare over time and keeps the fear factor maintained.

62404 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to wendy, #601 of 1523 🔗

The corona virus or covid-19 usage has been mixed. In such situations I find it’s always noteworthy to see if there is an official language used when speaking to children, often this is less threatening than official language used towards adults. Where there is a divide like that it is clear there is an effort to cause an effect.

For now I feel that the corona causes covid message is lost organically.

In the early days of lockup I was on a forum explaining this point about corona virus causing an illness covid-19. People did not understand. I used the HIV causes AIDS analogy but wished I hadn’t!

62387 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to wendy, #602 of 1523 🔗

Thanks Wendy. I see things entirely differently I’d be pleased to be a case but not hsve an infection. But I do understand the logic as you say for a case to be made a registering within a process needs to have occured.
Thanks for discussing – it a bit trivial perhaps. But these emotive terms are where they, them, are fighting.

Completely agree about the recoveries. We don’t need to discuss the why’s of keeping the recoveries out of view.

62715 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, 1, #603 of 1523 🔗

If they just honestly called them positive test results, there wouldn’t be this confusion.

62260 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #604 of 1523 🔗

Surely, this is a big day for Royston Vasey’s greatest living cafe proprietor; are you there KH1485?

62275 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #605 of 1523 🔗

Probably rushed off his feet at the moment!

62263 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 14, #606 of 1523 🔗

If there is a surge of infection in the winter (which is perfectly feasible) will the people exempt from mask wearing be blamed for being superspreaders?

That’s how science seems to be working these days.

62298 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Nobody2020, 10, #607 of 1523 🔗

Of course they will. That’s when Cressida Dick and the rest of the Brownshirts will roll out the Kristallnacht ‘bash a dissenter’ scheme.

62269 Mike Smith, replying to Mike Smith, 3, #608 of 1523 🔗

Johnny Smugface on top form. Terrific. Especially on how kind and decent liberals like him are:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9u2_zf5FxJs

62719 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mike Smith, #609 of 1523 🔗

… zero tolerance – it’s about empathy, kindness ….

62271 Basics, replying to Basics, 4, #610 of 1523 🔗

Forgive me if this has been mentioned before, I’ve been unable to keep up with threads over tge past days.

Do you remember the funny little story about Russia trying to hack out UK covud vaccine secrets?

Well, well, in the USA, its been tge same story, at the same time, for tge same reasons, only they use a different word in the states. Russia has been replaced with the word China.

Use a search term like ‘china stealing usa covid vaccine’ to find msm articles.

Once again no sense of peril comes from these stories – it’s as though the boys club has become psychotic. The boy who cries wolf would be mandatory reading for all spooks if I had my way.

62290 ▶▶ daveyp, replying to Basics, 5, #611 of 1523 🔗

The Russians have leaked the the stolen documents on the Dark Web. The ingredients for the vaccine are listed as: Sodium Chloride and Dihydrogen monoxide.

62308 ▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to daveyp, 2, #612 of 1523 🔗

remember that time when Penn and Teller got dumbarse hippies to sign a petition to ban dihydrogen monoxide? :-))))

62415 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to IMoz, #613 of 1523 🔗

found it, surprisingly applicable to “get onboard” covid panic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yi3erdgVVTw

62382 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to daveyp, #614 of 1523 🔗

daveyp, your comment of yesterday ?

62437 ▶▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to JohnB, #615 of 1523 🔗

What comment, I don’t think I posted yesterday

62454 ▶▶▶▶▶ daveyp, replying to daveyp, #616 of 1523 🔗

Just found it, it’s looks like i must’ve pasted a password into the comment box lol!

63538 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to daveyp, #617 of 1523 🔗

Ta. Was getting worried for a while …

62722 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to daveyp, #618 of 1523 🔗

Pity that isn’t all the “vaccine” will contain!

62321 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Basics, 2, #619 of 1523 🔗

Yes, the same agenda. Re the Russian interference / spy thing – the fact that Russia is behind this is nonsense, it is just an excuse to legislate for mass censorship.

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/richieallen/episodes/2020-07-22T11_18_32-07_00

62411 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Victoria, 1, #620 of 1523 🔗

Its not even trying to be creative or different or hidden. I wonder if in Russian and Chijna they are saying UK and USA are trying to steal our vaccines? Then I remember our spooks are school boys in long trousers out of touch with a decent purposeful world view.

How many bad decisions have to be made before an organisation like the integrity initiative is born?!

62277 zacaway, replying to zacaway, 20, #621 of 1523 🔗

Just been for a lunchtime stroll around the park – loads of people out enjoying the sun, not particularly bothered by distancing – and very few face nappies. (South East London).

Approached a small cafe – with my fully exposed face! – and the owner warmly beckoned me in where I bought an ice cream to take away. Ludicrous that this is now an offence. A couple of others did the same. #BritainFightsBack

Vote with you wallet – support businesses that ignore the nonesense and walk away if they only want bedwetters’ custom. That’s how to fight it.

62293 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to zacaway, 1, #622 of 1523 🔗

What park? Se London my old manor

62312 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to stefarm, 1, #623 of 1523 🔗

Manor House Gardens, Lewisham

62320 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to zacaway, 1, #624 of 1523 🔗

Know it well (Lee) glad to see the people in SE12 and SE13 are fighting the good fight

62532 ▶▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to stefarm, 3, #625 of 1523 🔗

Yup – I think the locals are already getting uppity with road closures along Manor Lane and surrounding area causing chaos – rushed through by the council under emergency covid powers. They’ve been wanted to do it for ages, but sticking a covid sign next to road closed means they can bypass the usual process. Obviously.

62647 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to zacaway, #626 of 1523 🔗

I used to live in Lee, nothing has changed.

62281 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 12, #627 of 1523 🔗

General Eisenhower, who became president of the USA in the 1950’s, said on leaving office that his biggest fear was that the ‘military industrial complex’—built up by the ‘arsenal of democracy’ so necessary to win the second world war—would in itself go on to become a threat to world peace. And boy has this proven to be the case. The Military industrial complex is a huge multi billion dollar empire that in order to satisfy its insatiable thirst for profits has to go in search of enemies whether they exist or not and whether they are real or not.
I’ve been well aware of this for many years now but I must admit that until recently I hadn’t stopped to think that the Pharmaceutical industry was based on the same anti human self perpetuating business model. The ‘Pharmaceutical industrial complex’ is just as prevalent and just as evil (and I don’t use that word lightly) as ever is the military organisation.

On the one hand we have weapons of death and destruction being developed and manufactured in order to ‘preserve world peace and to spread democracy and freedom throughout the world’. Whilst in so doing bringing about the death and destruction of millions. And now we have measures in place to protect us from a deadly virus whilst a ‘vaccine’ is concocted to protect us all. Why am I suspicious of this ? Why do I think that if the likes of Bill Gates, with his untold millions and who professes to have only the welfare of humanity at heart, might just, if he thought about it seriously, decide that supplying the two thirds of the world’s population who lack clean drinking water with just that might be a positive way of improving and indeed saving the lives of millions? Am I now too cynical? Or is the road to profit non existent with something as simple as water supplies when compared to developing a vaccine for a flu like virus which creates the road to untold and ongoing profits.
There used to be a word for the richest when they did good works it was PHILANTHROPY and those who practised it were PHILANTHOPISTS . History can number many examples of these people from Andrew Carnegie through to the Quaker chocolate makers of York. Now it seems Philanthropy no longer exists and it has been usurped by PHILANTHROCAPITALISM and it is this new and despicable money making activity that drives the likes of Bill gates.
Why am I talking about this when the current concern is face masks? Because, as you dear people reading this are only too aware, it is the abandonment of our very humanity and individualism behind a mask that convinces those who would exploit us all for profit that we are ripe for the picking. They can do with us whatever they choose. We mustn’t let this happen—-DON’T WEAR A MASK!—-time to say enough is enough!

62661 ▶▶ Edgar Friendly, replying to Harry hopkins, 2, #628 of 1523 🔗

Philanthropy by the rich nowadays is as much, or solely, for the tax break that it affords as it is for any good that would result. Why pay the government millions when you can instead dump that money on your friend’s wife’s charity and have a nice building named after you? Not saying this hasn’t always been the case, but at least in the days of Carnegie, or the Peabody and Guinness dynasts they had some thought of the ‘everafter’ to which their souls may be consigned.

62743 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Harry hopkins, #629 of 1523 🔗

Very well put HH!

63001 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Harry hopkins, #630 of 1523 🔗

Good stuff from Ike but I think Churchill’s ‘.. then the whole world, including the United States, including all that we have known and cared for, will sink into the abyss of a new Dark Age made more sinister, and perhaps more protracted, by the lights of perverted science.’ is more powerful and horribly resonant just now.

62291 Justineheaton, replying to Justineheaton, #631 of 1523 🔗

Notice The Telegraph doesn’t mention ‘if wearing a mask causes sever distress’ as an exemption. Don’t know if that’s a mistake or deliberate. Wouldn’t surprise me if it’s the latter.

63894 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Justineheaton, #632 of 1523 🔗

Does it matter? The exemption mentions distress and doesn’t say you have to provide any evidence.

62299 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 3, #633 of 1523 🔗

Mandatory gloves next? From the House of Lords today “Health minister Lord Bethell, concluding a debate on coronavirus regulations, replied: “To date, gloves are not in the guidance but they remain an area that we’re looking at.”

62313 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to arfurmo, #634 of 1523 🔗

Uggh. What is the end objective? I CAN NOT be to manage a non lethal virus

62342 ▶▶ Sue, replying to arfurmo, 3, #635 of 1523 🔗

the madness continues – gloves unless in clinical setting and replaced with every patient are utterly useless – everyone will wear same gloves for weeks and the gunk on them would be unbelieveable. what happened to ‘washing your hands’ mantra which is probably much better

62358 ▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to Sue, 6, #636 of 1523 🔗

Precisely!

Rub a little buter on your hands (fat) – wash your hands with warm to hot water and the butter takes some remving. Now wash hands with water and soap. The butter is removed effectively. It’s the same for the lipid layers of viruses. One of the BEST ways to minimise transmission is to wash hands with soap and water!

DavidC

62689 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to arfurmo, #637 of 1523 🔗

https://www.lockdowntruth.org/post/now-it-s-gloves-as-well Looks like pre-conditioning for gloves may already have started…

62930 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to arfurmo, #638 of 1523 🔗

And there will be more and more litter that will harm our environment – the scale of disposable muzzles and gloves already in our woods and seas is already appalling.

62301 PWL, replying to PWL, 2, #639 of 1523 🔗

The Covid-19 science problem series: how Covid-19 is an issue of health terrain potentially damaged by prescription drugs, and only a few thousand have ever dies of it.

http://www.frombehindenemylines.org.uk/2020/05/the-covid-19-science-problem-part-one-for-the-sake-of-propaganda-there-is-no-unified-understanding-of-the-disease/

62319 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to PWL, 2, #640 of 1523 🔗

Yes, polypharmacy (many people on large numbers of pharmaceutical drugs, many contraindications, often side effects result in new prescriptions) is a major factor in contributing to co-morbidities.

62360 ▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to Victoria, 4, #641 of 1523 🔗

My understanding is that SARS-Cov2 has, to date, fulfilled NONE of Koch’s 4 postulates! I’m happy to be corrected though. Does the viruse even exist if it hasn’t been isolated as a unique organism?

DavidC

62480 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to DavidC, 2, #642 of 1523 🔗

I think there is a crowd-sourced legal action demanding “The Government” prove that SARS-CoV2 exists going on right now.

62692 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Two-Six, #643 of 1523 🔗

Talking of legal action, any word on how Jolyon Maugham’s case re the handing out of PPE contracts to friends of the government is going?

62302 PWL, 2, #644 of 1523 🔗

SARS-COV-2 doesn’t exist, but don’t take anyone else’s word for ithttp://www.frombehindenemylines.org.uk/2020/06/sars-cov-2-doesnt-exist-but-dont-take-anyone-elses-word-for-it/

62304 DressageRider, replying to DressageRider, 5, #645 of 1523 🔗

Anyone else spotted this? Test and Trace is unlawful, now why I am not surprised?
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/nhs-test-and-trace-unlawful-data

62315 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to DressageRider, 8, #646 of 1523 🔗

Sad to say it, but the passage of the coronavirus act effectively ended the rule of law in this country, so this is basically meaningless.

62316 ▶▶ DavidC, replying to DressageRider, 2, #647 of 1523 🔗

Even if it was legal, there is no obligation to provide the information.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/maintaining-records-of-staff-customers-and-visitors-to-support-nhs-test-and-trace

If someone does not wish to share their details, or provides incorrect information

Although this is voluntary, please encourage customers and visitors to share their details in order to support NHS Test and Trace and advise them that this information will only be used where necessary to help stop the spread of COVID-19.

If a customer or visitor informs you that they do not want their details shared for the purposes of NHS Test and Trace, they can choose to opt out, and if they do so you should not share their information used for booking purposes with NHS Test and Trace.

The accuracy of the information provided will be the responsibility of the individual who provides it. You do not have to verify an individual’s identity for NHS Test and Trace purposes.

DavidC

62322 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to DressageRider, 6, #648 of 1523 🔗

What’s most surprising is that there is so much wrong with the whole T&T concept and existing data protection legislation ( none of which has been repealed). All these cafes/pubs that have been collecting personal data have no idea what obligations and potential liabilities they’re assuming. Unbelievable that few are picking up on this. However there’s so much that’s unbelievable, it’s impossible to keep up with all the inconsistencies between CoVid regulations being imposed ad hoc and existing legislation. That’s the problem when laws are introduced with no regulatory impact analysis/ cost /benefit analysis, no debate or accountability. Nothing. And not a peep from politicians or media. I despair

62345 ▶▶ Sue, replying to DressageRider, 5, #649 of 1523 🔗

They should be fined by the ICO for data breach of GDPR regs. I cannot believe, (or maybe i can with this shitstorm of government), that they bring in a process/app to capture individuals’ personal data and don’t carry out a data protection assessment. They probably did and just ignored it

62317 Nobody2020, 9, #650 of 1523 🔗

There was a time when a coronavirus case was when people were ill enough to be admitted to hospital. The fatality rate then was unsurprisingly high.

Now they have changed a case to anybody who tests positive but still act as though they’re the same as the previous definition of a case. The assumption being that a case will lead to the same level of death as before and actions taken on that basis.

62324 BTLnewbie, replying to BTLnewbie, 7, #651 of 1523 🔗

You may recall I wrote last night to Dave Lewis, CEO of Tesco (that ‘Dave’ has a very ‘I’m your best mate’ feel to it).

I thought I’d share the exchange this afternoon, purely for the record. If you are writing to other CEO’s, ask them to share takings details not footfall. My experience of retailers tells me that they have daily takings figures for every shop in their chain. They will already have them for Scotland.

[It may be that I am wrong – don’t tell Mrs BTL that I admitted the possibility – and that footfall and takings are unaffected by masking – but I doubt it.]

From Tesco:
Thank you for your email addressed to Dave Lewis, our Chief Executive, I have been asked to respond on his behalf.

From Friday 24 July, in line with new government guidelines, customers will need to wear a face covering when visiting our stores in England. This guidance has already been introduced in Scotland.

I understand your concerns however we cannot overturn the Governments decision nor do we have the resources to monitor the footfall through each of our stores.

Thank you for your feedback and I am sorry that I could not be of further help.
Kind regards,
xxx
Customer Service Specialist”

0 – 0 – 0 – 0

From me:
“Thank you for responding so swiftly.

If you don’t track footfall, you will at least track store takings daily. That should also be an indicator. A switch from in-store to online shopping will, of course, fail to achieve the Government’s stated objective of getting people out and about again.

I hope to be able to meet your excellent store staff again once the edict has been revoked.

With best wishes,”

62335 ▶▶ Sue, replying to BTLnewbie, #652 of 1523 🔗

footfall measurement can be done automatically by sensors at the door – i don’t know if tesco have these – at mine they have shoulder high things which could be sensors or more likely security alarm things which are always going off

62377 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Sue, 1, #653 of 1523 🔗

Pretty sure all big shops monitor footfall – it’s a standard metric when reporting to the City.

62464 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Sophie123, #654 of 1523 🔗

Yes, it’s a useful early indicator. Ultimately, the important metric (for the bottom line) is cash per square foot, as it takes into account ‘bogof’ and other discounts. Online deliveries complicate all the metrics, however – they make less money on deliveries – so we should be aiming to smoke them out that way if they get arsey on masks.

62968 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #655 of 1523 🔗

Why do they make less money on deliveries? There are logistics and transport costs, but I would have thought that wage and real estate costs were lower. Genuine question.

62686 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to BTLnewbie, 1, #656 of 1523 🔗

Surely takings would include online shopping, so would not be able to tell if people have been deterred by the mask rule? They may be just ordering from the store online instead.

62749 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to BTLnewbie, 1, #657 of 1523 🔗

Surely the number of till transactions are easy to count, rather than foofall?

62325 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 5, #658 of 1523 🔗

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/jul/23/andrew-johnson-explains-pulled-out-of-golf-british-masters

The event at Close House, which marks the resumption of the European Tour, is being played in a strict and biosecure format where no one is allowed beyond the course or hotel. “I’m struggling to get my head around it all,” Johnston said. “One minute I’m coming out of lockdown, going out for dinner, and then the next I’m back in lockdown in a hotel room

Know how he feels

62433 ▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 1, #659 of 1523 🔗

Strict and biosecure format. Puke off.

62330 Telpin, 2, #660 of 1523 🔗

Except of course this won’t work for the simple reason that before, when the LD started, they weren’t even recording people who were symptomatic ( let alone those who were asymptomatic). Only those who were admitted to hospital and tested positive were recorded as ‘cases’. The whole basis of recording has changed so you’re quite right to point out the fundamental difference yet BBC in particular hasn’t highlighted this at all and I’m afraid people are too stupid to notice. I’ve now complained to the BBC on 2 separate occasions how they’re entirely misrepresenting the actual risk and of lazy journalism. Got stock anodyne replies that they take pains to represent ‘all views’. Not my point. It’s not about balance here it’s about inaccurate reporting you muppets. Btw, Hitchens is on Any Questions On R4 at 8pm tonight

62331 Farinances, replying to Farinances, 20, #661 of 1523 🔗

Ok I’ve just been into a shop (in Leeds- so I wasn’t at all confident they’d let me in). I had an encounter and I’m still laughing.

When asked to wear a mask, I panicked a bit and just blurted out, “No, sorry, I have phobophobia” (fear of fear). I expected to be told to piss off.

The guy nodded his head solemnly and said, “OK that’s fine you’re an exemption then” and waved me forward. 😂 😂 😂 He didn’t notice me burst out laughing round the corner.

Maybe we can use this in future.

Autophobia – fear of isolation
Cacophobia – fear of ugliness
Carcinophobia – fear of cancer
Halitophobia – fear of bad breath…….

And of course the immortal claustrophobia, but that’s prob not exotic enough for instant admittance 😂

62338 ▶▶ anon, replying to Farinances, 3, #662 of 1523 🔗

ha! I’m going to try that line

62347 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Farinances, 4, #663 of 1523 🔗

I definately have Halitophobia

62354 ▶▶▶ Guirme, replying to Major Panic, 2, #664 of 1523 🔗

Wouldn’t that be a reason to want to wear a mask ( or want everyone else to wear them)?

62359 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Guirme, #665 of 1523 🔗

What if it’s your own breath you’re scared of?

62363 ▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Guirme, #666 of 1523 🔗

bad breath, like cv19, does not respect masks

62351 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Farinances, 4, #667 of 1523 🔗

i’ve got gamophobia – fear of commitment and marriage! 🙂
(aka too independent, stubborn, opinionated, uncompromising difficult old mare!!! i blame boarding school!! ha 🙂

62366 ▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to Farinances, 7, #668 of 1523 🔗

I’m wearing a bandana in shops because of the very high risk of ‘barbaphagicitis’, where depriving a beard of oxygen by wearing a tight mask causes it *literally* to eat itself! A very real risk, I’m suprised the authorities have ignored the science on this. I also suffer from ‘barbaphagicitisphobia’.

62413 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Cambridge N, 3, #669 of 1523 🔗

I am honestly mortified that mask insanity may cause a good proportion of the nation’s menfolk to renounce their beardly splendour. The only positive thing about today’s hipster fashions is the facial hair.

62809 ▶▶▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to Farinances, 1, #670 of 1523 🔗

I have been mistaken for a Mohammedan by a Mohammedan because of my resplendent beard on several occasions. This can only be a plus, obviously.

62961 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Farinances, 1, #671 of 1523 🔗

On the other hand, lockdown has meant that many of us shave far less often than we used to.

62401 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Farinances, 4, #672 of 1523 🔗

Thanatophobia is usually a good one to go for

62978 ▶▶▶ Cambridge N, replying to IMoz, #673 of 1523 🔗
62402 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Farinances, 4, #674 of 1523 🔗

Claustrophobia is usually though of as a fear of confined spaces, and that is not incorrect but it is also a fear of suffocation, so 100% relevant to not wearing a soggy rag over your face.

62418 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Farinances, 1, #675 of 1523 🔗

Another to consider:

Linonophobia refers to the fear of string. As with all phobias, the fear stems from a negative association with the item.

62423 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Farinances, 7, #676 of 1523 🔗

Allodoxaphobia
An extremely rare phobia, allodoxaphobia is used to define the fear of opinions. The phobia is believed to be associated with previous encounters wherein the person affected has not been able to properly express their opinion, or has had their opinion rejected. It is visible in social situations when the affected person refuses to involve themselves in discussions and can also reflect a fear of confrontation.

And one that the masses clearly all suffer from:

OptophobiaOptophobia is the fear of opening one’s eyes. Yes, there are people scared of opening their eyes.

63116 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Sarigan, #677 of 1523 🔗

Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice

62472 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Farinances, 7, #678 of 1523 🔗

PHOBOPHOBIA!
lol, that’s the funnies thing I have seen all week!

62682 ▶▶ Edgar Friendly, replying to Farinances, 1, #679 of 1523 🔗

You could say you have Aneleutherophobia – the fear of loss of freedom (i made that one up).

63069 ▶▶ Graham, replying to Farinances, 1, #680 of 1523 🔗

I might say that I have narcissistic personality disorder. That’s what the Daily Mail calls us mask refuseat so we should adopt the badge with pride.

62332 CarrieAH, replying to CarrieAH, 21, #681 of 1523 🔗

I’ll bet the British media aren’t telling you this, but out here on my Greek island, not one – zero – British arrival has tested positive for Covid since direct flights started 9 days ago. They’ve tested thousands on arrival but not one is a carrier. It’s gone from the general U.K. population. Come on out if you want to be treated like a human being, instead of a diseased robot. We would love to see you. Tavernas, bars, accommodation, beaches, all open. Sunbeds set apart on the beaches – which is nice – and if you go into a supermarket you are asked to wear a mask. I’m doing that because I’m in somebody else’s country and out of respect must abide by the rules here. But it’s a laidback atmosphere, nobody growling at you or watching you, and you are made to feel very welcome. Nobody is creeping around dismally, frightened of their own shadow, and nobody is really very upset about it at all. Come on over, the water is lovely!

62336 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to CarrieAH, 1, #682 of 1523 🔗

Which island?

My islands are Spetse and Lesbos 😊 My heavens.
My Spetsian family have invited me over. I want to go but I don’t want to be tested 😟

62356 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Farinances, 5, #683 of 1523 🔗

Go! They don’t test everyone, just about half of all arrivals. You fill in a Passenger Locator Form before you fly, get a QR code sent to you, and you present this to the border control people on arrival. This code decides whether or not you are tested. But the test is easy, just taken as a swab from the back of the throat – didn’t hurt at all and was over in seconds. You are then allowed into Greece. I was really worried about it before I came over, but it was all fine. It is safe, relaxed, sunny, and welcoming over here. Normal.

62408 ▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to CarrieAH, 2, #684 of 1523 🔗

Omg I’m going. Prob in Sept now thpugh, my acceptable temperature window has passed lol

62457 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Farinances, 1, #685 of 1523 🔗

The sea will be even warmer then, hopefully they will drop the insane rules and me and Mrs 2-6 might join you.
Hopefully we can stay there and never come back.

62438 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to CarrieAH, 2, #686 of 1523 🔗

i don’t think i want some greek sticking anything in the back of my throat thanks very much. The fact you go along with it means they will keep doing it. Every one of us must refuse to do any of what they are saying and if you comply then i’m afraid you’re as big a threat to humanity as they are.

62343 ▶▶ Basics, replying to CarrieAH, 8, #687 of 1523 🔗

Ooh! Interesting testing of UK population outside the control of NHS, UK Army, UK Gov. Great report! Keep us informed about that first positive… they may even send one out to you especially!

62364 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Basics, #688 of 1523 🔗

I believe somebody mentioned a positive test result on another island recently – just one – but I’ll have to check on that. There have been positive results from Balkan country citizens at the Greek land border, but not here on the islands.

62466 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, 2, #689 of 1523 🔗

Yes I see your point, its not in Greece’s interests to boost the figures is it. This could be interesting indeed.

62357 ▶▶ Sue, replying to CarrieAH, 1, #690 of 1523 🔗

i love greece – was supposed to be flying to Preveza for Lefkas end August until sleazyjet cancelled my flight…. i think in august i’ll book something again for sept.
yassas!

62362 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Sue, #691 of 1523 🔗

Do! The airlines are still juggling flights, they aren’t running anything like the normal amount, and you may have to be a little fluid with your dates – but it’s worth it when you get here.

62677 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to CarrieAH, #692 of 1523 🔗

I’d love to know if Greece is sharing the results of these tests (plus peoples’ DNA) with the UK authorities…

62346 kbeanie, replying to kbeanie, 21, #693 of 1523 🔗

I made a thing. Please feel free to share. It’s on my Twitter feed too @kbeanie93 if anyone wants to retweet it 👍🏻

62455 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to kbeanie, 2, #694 of 1523 🔗

NICE ONE!

62937 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kbeanie, #695 of 1523 🔗

Great stuff!!!

62378 tallandbald, #696 of 1523 🔗

Wife has just come back from Tesco. Was the only one there without a mask. (She is made of sterner stuff than me so she offered to test the water – she likes the attention)

Much chuntering and nudging all the way round and one old guy said to his wife “if she isn’t wearing one, I’m not wearing mine” and promptly took it off.

Woman at the checkout had a little conversation and during the discourse asked “why aren’t you wearing one then?”

Wife replied ” No-one is forcing me to wear a mask”

Checkout woman “Oh, so that’s why you aren’t wearing one?”

Wife ” Yes – well I am also exempt” (she isn’t)

Checkout woman “Well can i ask what is wrong with you”

Wife ” You certainly cannot!!”

Checkout woman “Oh, sorry. I was only asking as i hate wearing mine and i was wondering if my high blood pressure would make me exempt”

Wife “Just take it off. You don’t need to wear it”

Checkout woman “You know what – i just might.”

My wife left and had to stare down a group of teenage girls who loudly questioned between themselves why she was bare faced.
She said as long as you hold your head high, act confidant and ignore the chuntering you will not be challenged and you may just change someone else’s perspective.

62379 Hammer Onats, replying to Hammer Onats, 12, #697 of 1523 🔗

A bit of a panic in First Gauleiter Sturgeon’s territory when it was reported that 7 coaches at a football club had tested positive for Covid. On retesting, however, six of the seven turned out to be false positives. I wonder how many more of these are boosting the daily drumroll of doom?

62393 ▶▶ Chris Hume, replying to Hammer Onats, 1, #698 of 1523 🔗

Wow! That is staggering. I heard about the positive tests (plural) but nothing about this. Is it being reported? Or have they quietly binned it as is normal?

62430 ▶▶▶ Hammer Onats, replying to Chris Hume, #699 of 1523 🔗

The initial tests were supposedly done by a private company then retested by the NHS. But given that many of these football clubs will be employing the same private company to do their tests who knows how many false positives and negatives are being reported. The story was covered in the “newspaper” known as The Scotsman but needless to say none of their cretinous journalists had the wit to investigate further.

62434 ▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Hammer Onats, 4, #700 of 1523 🔗

I just read this. Staggering. All the pillar 2 tests are done by private companies – and the reason for the lockdown in Leicester. Only 1 out of 7 correct? The implications are huge but is any news source going to run with it? Of course not.

62476 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to The Spingler, #701 of 1523 🔗

And I wonder who has links to these companies or had a hand in awarding the contracts for a nice fat fee………

62553 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to The Spingler, 2, #702 of 1523 🔗

Private Eye reported on the massive conflict of interests a few weeks back, GSK and Astrazaneca (I think it was) operating 2 of the test processing facilities on a nice tasty government contract, also happen to be in line to benefit massively from a vaccine being lapped up around the world. Now why on earth would they, therefore, want to ensure testing continues and continues to find positives.

62385 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 25, #703 of 1523 🔗

There certainly are some absolute arseholes in government:

Speaking during a House of Lords debate on the regulations already in effect to further ease lockdown, Lord Blencathra welcomed offences and penalties listed for people breaking lockdown rules.

But he referred to the illegal demonstrations and raves seen over the last few months, as well as garment factories continuing to operate in lockdown and said: “But I ask will these ever be enforced?”

He added: “When we see people getting away with it and there’s no enforcement then more and more people will break other laws as well, and that will destroy society.”

Destroy society FFS! They have been doing that since 18th March, and there’s no end in sight!

62524 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 4, #704 of 1523 🔗

I Googled the good Lord, aka David Maclean. Well, well, to my very surprise this (on Wiki):

Maclean was reported in The Daily Telegraph as having spent more than £20,000 improving his farmhouse under the Additional Costs Allowance (ACA) scheme before selling it for £750,000. He claimed the money by designating the property as his “second home” with the Commons authorities, yet Maclean did not pay capital gains tax on the sale because the taxman accepted it was his main home. Maclean was one of 98 MPs who voted to keep their expense details secret; and
Four years later he was found to have breached the Code of Conduct of the Lords in his dealings with the government of the Cayman Islands.

62386 EssieSW, #705 of 1523 🔗

Went to the corner shop at lunchtime, without a mask, trying to be confident but slightly weary of what one of the usually friendly gentlemen who man the till might say. Noticed a police car parked up a little way down the road which gave me slight pause but I continued into the shop.
Said a quick hello and started to grab the items I needed, though the shopkeeper did not look at my face as I entered (very small shop and you are out of view as soon as you go down the first aisle).
As I was browsing the biscuit selection I heard the shop door open and another customer enter and heard “I am sorry sir, I cannot serve you unless you are wearing a mask”. My heart skipped as I tried to remember how I would explain my exemption (asthmatic) once he saw my unmasked face when the customer and shop keeper burst out laughing and started talking about the cricket.
I paid for my items and exchanged the usual pleasantries and off I went.

Glad to know I will be able to get my essentials around the corner without question or funny looks – just need to brave the bigger stores next!

62388 Chris Hume, replying to Chris Hume, 28, #706 of 1523 🔗

Went into my local Offie on Wednesday. The owner who is a brilliant guy and well known in the community wasnt there, but there a was pleasant young woman serving. Guy in front of me made a comment about needing to wear a mask from Friday ‘but I’m always forgetting it’. l am always interested in these sorts of conversations so I listened carefully. She said tentatively ‘ it does seem a bit daft that they are bringing it in now when it’s almost disappeared’ Guy in response said ‘yeah at the height of summer as well’. I thought ‘good, both sound nicely sceptical. When I got to the counter I said ‘ I’m sure Sukhi (the owner) won’t make people wear them will he?’ She said’ oh no, we wont be turning anyone away’ and I smiled and said how great it was. We had a small chat about how ridiculous the situation is. I really hope that this is the moment of truth and the non-mask wearers by seeing each other out and about will take courage from that and the large group of compliant people who think it is all a bit silly will be encouraged by us ‘full faces’ to rid themselves of these ridiculous garments.

62863 ▶▶ matt, replying to Chris Hume, #707 of 1523 🔗

Haven’t really been shopping today, but I wandered in to our local corner shop on the way back from the pub to buy… something. Can’t even remember what. I was unmasked, the owner was unmasked. Wasn’t even mentioned. Just like a normal day.

62390 Roadrash, #708 of 1523 🔗

Just back from Aldi with my wife. I intended to go in unmasked but bottled it last minute and just sat in the car while she did the shopping. I know, pathetic.

Everyone I watched went in masked though most people coming out seemed to be taking them off or dropping them to their chin. My wife reported that everyone she saw in the shop had one on ( as did she), though some were fiddling with them a lot. I thought there might be a mini rebellion but either people like me are avoiding the shops because they are too much of a sh*thouse or most are just complying. If the latter then that’s really depressing. I will try to pluck up the courage and go in unmasked. Sorry to let folks down but just couldn’t face any confrontation however slight.

I really hope legal firms start “ambulance chasing” this I.e “ have you been denied entry into a shop or been discriminated against because your disability prevents you from wearing a mask? If so call us on xxxxxx”. Must be some firms out there who are up for this.

62397 SD67, #709 of 1523 🔗

Dear Toby

Have you considered submitting a FOI request in respect of the key members of SAGE?

Patrick Vallance for example was head of R&D at GSK for over a decade. GSK have a very generous share ownership scheme for Senior Management, I’d be surprised if Vallance did not have a direct financial interest one of the firms which is leading the drive for a vaccine.

62398 MDH, replying to MDH, 39, #710 of 1523 🔗

‘I want to see a massive effort now by the country to psychologically stop thinking of coronavirus as something that makes it impossible to do things.’

Just when I thought I couldn’t hold our Prime Minister in any further contempt…

Mr Johnson, your actions have resulted in unnecessary deaths and millions of ruined lives, and you want the people of this country to make a “massive effort”.

The only massive effort I’d like to see at this point is to remove you and all your cohorts from the offices which by your continued presence you bring into disrepute.

62416 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to MDH, 23, #711 of 1523 🔗

What a traitor. Everything he and his criminal gang has done has made it impossible to do anything without thinking about the virus. Without question the worst PM in the history of this country (and he’s had some very stiff competition recently). Guilty at best of criminal negligence, at worst of genocide.

62420 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Richard O, 3, #712 of 1523 🔗

Would a walk do any good? A ghandi style walk to parliament. I can imagine quite a crowd gathering on the way. But the mps are on a well earned rest now while tge country plays out their fantasy.

62941 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Basics, 1, #713 of 1523 🔗

Maybe we should revive the Jarrow March of 1936 which will be appropriate as we are headed towards rates of unemployment and bankruptcies that makes the 1930s figures pale in comparison.

62448 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Richard O, 11, #714 of 1523 🔗

He’s so clearly mentally unwell, and has been since returning from his stint in hospital. He needs to be removed before he inflicts any further damage – CCHQ are you listening!

62431 ▶▶ Biker, replying to MDH, 12, #715 of 1523 🔗

He says shit like that to wind us up. He’s saying one thing while knowing another is true and it winds up any thinking person. Off course the mask wearing fools don’t know if they’re coming or going at the best of times so they don’t notice. Like saying wear a mask, it won’t protect you but it will protect others makes zero sense but repeaters have squared that in their minds and it make perfect sense to them.

62462 ▶▶ Hammer Onats, replying to MDH, 10, #716 of 1523 🔗

Well, you obese cretin here’s what to do. Tell the country that you and your tame advisers have royally screwed up and you are abolishing all the Coronavirus regulations with immediate effect. And for good measure you are also abolishing the left-wing imbeciles in charge of Wales and Scotland.

62467 ▶▶ Julian, replying to MDH, 12, #717 of 1523 🔗

‘I want to see a massive effort now by the country to psychologically stop thinking of coronavirus as something that makes it impossible to do things.’”
Yes, make everyone wear masks, that’ll help with that.

62498 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Julian, 5, #718 of 1523 🔗

The irony is that, taken literally, what he says is exactly what people should be doing… so why exactly are the government and media doing their best to promote exactly the opposite way of thinking? It’s certainly going to take a “massive effort” to overcome that.
It feels like mandatory masks, more than anything else, seem intended to perpetuate the fear and abnormality, and stop people’s behaviour gradually relaxing back to an “old normal” situation.

62527 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Drawde927, 2, #719 of 1523 🔗

That’s the idea.

62477 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to MDH, 5, #720 of 1523 🔗

“I want to see a massive effort now by the country to psychologically stop thinking of coronavirus as something that makes it impossible to do things.”

Are you sure Mr. Johnson said this? I can’t credit he did say it. Though, he is surely living in a little bubble in which no one is wearing a mask – and he sure won’t be popping in to a shop to meet people that are.

62497 ▶▶▶ MDH, replying to Ned of the Hills, 3, #721 of 1523 🔗

It’s from the Speccie website which in turn has taken it from the Bolshevik Broadcasting Corporation, so who knows? But the idea that Johnson now has any credibility whatsoever is laughable. He’s beneath contempt. He just sounds like every other stuffed-shirt.

62522 ▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to MDH, 1, #722 of 1523 🔗

I was just going to edit my comment to say that I’d seen the words quoted in an email I’d just received from the Spectator. Sorry for doubting – but then the quote is a bit unbeleivable.

Johnson himself offers the best justification for not wearing a masks. Wearing a mask prevents us forgetting the virus which is making it impossible for us “to do things”.

Ee, what a noodle eh?

62820 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to MDH, 1, #723 of 1523 🔗

And wearing masks are the ideal thing to stop people psychologically thinking about the virus!

62414 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 8, #725 of 1523 🔗

Could it get any worse? Yes!!

From The Telegraph:

Requiring the public to wear gloves to combat Covid-19 is being considered by the Government.

Speaking in the House of Lords, Conservative Baroness McIntosh of Pickering asked: “Has the Government formed a view on the use of gloves?

“Obviously we’re all following the guidance of washing our hands but surely the correct use of gloves outdoors and indoors could prevent the passing on of the virus?”

Health minister Lord Bethell, concluding a debate on coronavirus regulations, replied: “To date, gloves are not in the guidance but they remain an area that we’re looking at.”

The exchanges came on the day people in England were required to start wearing face coverings in shops, shopping centres, banks, takeaways, post offices, sandwich shops and supermarkets or risk a £100 fine.

62426 ▶▶ Fiat, replying to Tenchy, 7, #726 of 1523 🔗

That’s so so depressing

62428 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Tenchy, 10, #727 of 1523 🔗

They might aswell just get it done with and issue everyone their Cyanide pill now.

62436 ▶▶ Hammer Onats, replying to Tenchy, 6, #728 of 1523 🔗

I think that is likely to be a load of clickbait shite, so to speak. Getting people to make ineffective masks is one thing, gloves are completely different. And as far as Im aware none of the scientific advisers think gloves is a good idea.

62447 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Hammer Onats, #729 of 1523 🔗

I think you’re probably right. Apart from anything else, how would gloves work if you also have to apply hand poison? Hopefully it’s bollocks, but in today’s mad world, anything is possible.

62451 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Tenchy, -1, #730 of 1523 🔗

Holy Fuck-a-Moley

62546 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tenchy, 2, #731 of 1523 🔗

Correct use of gloves says it all. They’re more likely to spread infection than incorrectly used masks!

62671 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tenchy, #732 of 1523 🔗

Funnily enough I wrote about this around lunchtime, followed a link to another site and saw a picture of supposedly ‘normal life’ with 2 people wearing gloves. And under it someone had written that from what happened with masks (ie random media pictures of people with masks as subtle pre-conditioning) we can surmise that gloves are the next plan… And so it would appear!

Here’s the link: https://www.lockdowntruth.org/post/now-it-s-gloves-as-well

62819 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Tenchy, 2, #733 of 1523 🔗

I’m so worried about catching anything that I’ve started wearing a condom 24/7 now to reduce my risk of catching HIV or a STD.

62998 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to JohnB, #734 of 1523 🔗

Yes condoms are utterly necessary when watching porn lol…in fact why not use two,

62421 Biker, replying to Biker, 16, #735 of 1523 🔗

Fuck the government and fuck anyone wearing a mask

62429 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Biker, 11, #736 of 1523 🔗

The mask wearers will be first in line to take the vaccine, so will not require any assistance from us in this regard.

62424 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #737 of 1523 🔗

Found this while mooching today:

https://www.3ccorp.net/2020/03/15/rockefeller-plan-details-government-takeover-through-pandemic-martial-law/

It’s from 2010 and it contains the 54 pages of a Rockefeller Report entitled “ Scenarios for the Future of Technology and International Development” and has stated aim of a stated goal of creating “a world of tighter top-down government control and more authoritarian leadership, with limited innovation and growing citizen pushback.”

62443 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #738 of 1523 🔗

I posted that here a few weeks ago. A very good bed time read that one. It’s THE BLUEPRINT for this current shit-show. It REALLY IS. Also the “Hack-Attack” scenario is very close to what we have now, private corporations or criminal elements through hacking and incredible internet influence becoming MORE POWERFUL THAN STATES and national governments. The thing is now the global state (or criminals?) IS/ARE more powerful than states and national governments. So the global powers seized the day didn’t they, before it was too late for them.

62525 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Two-Six, 1, #739 of 1523 🔗

And we’re still labelled mad and conspiracy theory nutters.

62463 ▶▶ PaulK, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #740 of 1523 🔗

If you fancy a bit of light reading log into the World Economic Forum and dive into a never ending rabbit hole covering every aspect of life. Agenda 21, 50 years in the making: https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/post2015/transformingourworld

62902 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to PaulK, #741 of 1523 🔗

I have read all about it. Its hard to see what they really want to do, it is all written in some very neo-corporate English. It all looks quite nice, on the surface but its when you interpret what their aim mean then its gets scary fast.

62432 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, #742 of 1523 🔗

Don’t know if this has already been raised but can anyone debunk the BBC’s debunking https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/53108405 please?

62453 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to arfurmo, 3, #743 of 1523 🔗

I notice they didn’t include “Masks don’t stop virus transmission” – FACT.

62439 AngloWelshDragon, 17, #744 of 1523 🔗

Happy to report a pleasant and mask-free shop in Sainsbury’s wearing both my “mask exempt” Lanyard and the sunflower one given to me last week by Sainsbury’s customer services. No problem getting in and no hostility from the sheeple. They are also broadcasting messages telling customers to be considerate of staff and customers who are unable to wear masks. Saw one other non mask wearer – a man in his late 20s who looked as fit as a flea and was buying a birthday card and a bottle of gin (but who knows with hidden disabilities?) I’ve never been so glad of my occasionally-annoying-but-generally liveable-with heart issue!

62446 wendy, replying to wendy, 5, #745 of 1523 🔗

I’ve read a few posts over the past weeks from people saying they don’t know anyone who has had the virus. I do and I likely had it too. And of course we know Toby has had a positive antibody test.

All this was back in March. A family of 3 I know in London, wife, child and husband all had the likely symptoms of fever and long lasting cough. The husband was quite worryingly unwell. There were no tests available at that time but the husband has been confirmed as having had the illness when he enrolled for plasma donation.

Another friends brother returned from skiing in Austria in March and was unwell with the familiar symptoms of cough, temperature.

I am a former NHS employee so have lots of friends and family as well as my partner currently working in the NHS. In March hospitals were reporting lots of sickness. 2 doctors we know were very unwell, one hospitalised and had a positive test. Other doctor friends had some kind of mild illness around the same time. Another member of staff died after admission to hospital and a positive test.

I had the strangest of physical symptoms. It began as very mild sore throat, headache and shivering. After 4 days it seemed to lift but I was very emotional, crying at the drop of a hat. To be fair there was something to cry about – my Dad living in a care home and the growing knowledge that he would be shut in there for???? On the 6th day I felt like I was going to get a head cold. On the 7th day I was shivering, shaking, felt dizzy, had diarrhoea and a tight and burning feeling in my chest. I never did get any head cold symptoms which is very unusual for me. This continued for 3 days and I felt generally unwell but kept trying do things, but not going out anywhere as I suspected I should isolate. On the 10th night my chest felt like hot liquid had been poured in and as if it was being squeezed from front and back by strong hands. I had a nose bleed then too. I did feel worried at this point and talked myself down and slept as if drugged. Next morning all physical symptoms had gone but I felt as if I had been hit by a bus. The fatigue and cough continued for 8 weeks.

I had been rundown with other illnesses, dad in hospital and a small operation on my ear for a suspect cancer so perhaps I was more unwell because of that. I am all better now, if not back to full fitness with my running. I don’t have any fears of the virus and am a volunteer marshall at the local test centre. I am here on this site and have been commenting for a while so am a sceptic, but more of the terrible measures than the existence of a new coronavirus.

Not sure what anyone else makes of all this? I am not even sure why I’ve decided to tell all this. Is it of any use to us at this point?

62450 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to wendy, 1, #746 of 1523 🔗

Two members of my family have had it (married couple). Both were quite ill, but didn’t need hospital treatment. One of them picked it up from a work colleague who had recently been in hospital for an unrelated condition.

62456 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Tenchy, 1, #747 of 1523 🔗

Ah yes, that has reminded me of another friend. He was very unwell in January after coming back from visiting his partner in Spain. Unrelated to his own illness, his brothers in-laws both had it after one was admitted to hospital for a bladder infection. Both, in their 60s, recovered. They had positive tests.

And a further friend who is a senior manager at another hospital with staff off with positive tests.

One common denominator here is the NHS and as Toby has said, illnesses spreading from hospital.

62475 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to wendy, -8, #748 of 1523 🔗

oh look more tales of people you know with the virus, fuck off

62495 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Biker, #749 of 1523 🔗

But Toby had a positive antibody test

62536 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to wendy, 4, #750 of 1523 🔗

Its impossible to test for antibodies specific to a strain of corona virus that hasn’t been isolated. It literally can’t be done. Most people however will have antibodies to the wider corona family (common cold etc). And the test itself throws up many false positives because of its design. So having a positive antibody test in these circumstances doesnt mean someone has had/got this ‘covid19’ virus

62645 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to birdwatcher, #751 of 1523 🔗

The virus has had its genome sequenced countless times. Antibody tests have been designed and validated and have a pretty good and fairly well-known accuracy of at least 90%.

Covid-19 ranges from asymptomatic through a mild cold to a very nasty viral pneumonia which may take months to recover from fully although it is very rarely fatal in anyone who is not elderly.

62514 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Biker, 6, #752 of 1523 🔗

Lots of people post on here to get things off their chest, who are going through a hard time on this. Nowt wrong with that.

62461 ▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to wendy, 4, #753 of 1523 🔗

People get ill all the time, simply getting ill with a virus-like set of symptoms doesnt mean someones got/had the thing being called covid19. It remains true that this alleged new virus hasn’t been isolated in a lab and the tests being used to detect it are both non specific and specifically not designed as diagnostic tools. There is no proof at all of this supposed new viruses existence, or of its ‘novelty’ in regards any aspect of it. But of course there are many circulating viruses, including ‘normal’ corona viruses, that people are still coming down with. Whether it actually exists or not though, the evidence of the danger, even with all the manipulated figures and outright lies, is clearly not anywhere near enough to warrant any of the measures that have been and are continuing to be taken against it.

62492 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to birdwatcher, 4, #754 of 1523 🔗

And yes I totally agree, the measures are terrible and unnecessary and of course people get sick with many many viruses. I didn’t intend to make a problem or imply anything and am so sorry if I have done

62474 ▶▶ Biker, replying to wendy, -9, #755 of 1523 🔗

People who volunteer as a marshal at a test centre sicken me. I highly doubt every word you posted and now believe you to be one of them paid people posting garbage to fuck us up.

62478 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Biker, 2, #756 of 1523 🔗

Hi Biker, from my experience they are not doing it to chat to lots of people, the test centre I drive past daily rarely has any customers.

62485 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Dave #KBF, #757 of 1523 🔗

no one is being tested, well nearly no one like you say. This “wendy” is a shill trying to normalise this idea that there is a killer virus and we need tested. Everyone you meet no mater where you go says the same thing ” i don’t know anyone with the virus do you” I heard it from the AA man last night, i heard it from a woman in a cafe in Arbroath this afternoon, i’ve never been to Arbroath. I’m pissed off to the max with the whole thing

62488 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Biker, 5, #758 of 1523 🔗

Oh no, I didn’t say it was killer, oh dear. And your right only 10 people a day are being tested. Please don’t turn against me. Please.

62490 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to wendy, #759 of 1523 🔗

i’ll tell you what, my best mate of thirty five years died today, he’s real you’re not

62493 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Biker, 2, #760 of 1523 🔗

That is very sad and I am sorry.

62521 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to wendy, 3, #761 of 1523 🔗

Don’t worry I am interested to read what you type Wendy.
Condolences about your mate Biker. I know how it feels too well, I don’t have enough fingers to count the number of close friends I have lost.

62523 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, #762 of 1523 🔗

or toes

62708 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Two-Six, #763 of 1523 🔗

Thanks for the support. I realised I miss timed what I wrote today. I didn’t intend to cause difficulties or imply a deadly virus. Of course I am going to know people as I am close to the nhs works and live in a big city.

62854 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to wendy, 1, #764 of 1523 🔗

We win’t.
Tempers are a bit frayed right now, and it’s understandable, but PLEASE let’s not turn on our friends and comrade.

62528 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Biker, 1, #765 of 1523 🔗

Saw three tests taking place about half an hour ago when I walked past the hospital. To be fair, it’s the first time I’ve ever seen anyone there. Looks horrible – they stick this swab so far down your throat it almost comes out of your arse. Of course, I could be a Nazi shill… so don’t trust a word I say.

Our neighbour got tested positive and had to take a 14 week holiday from her NHS job, but I don’t think she had ANY adverse symptoms. Waste of time if you ask me. My mother in law got tested – negative (but I think she secretly wanted it to be positive).

62486 ▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #766 of 1523 🔗

Yes and that is the same as my one. But it gives me an added insight I can bring here.

62482 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Biker, 6, #767 of 1523 🔗

Oh don’t be daft Biker. Why did I volunteer at the test centre? Well to have something to do since most of my life has been shut down by the government. And in a way it has given me good insights to bring here. None of the staff there have any fears of the virus. I have posted before about it being less than clean, no distancing.

62483 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to wendy, -10, #768 of 1523 🔗

maybe you didn’t hear me fuck off you traitor to humanity. I know you’re lying

62484 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Biker, 6, #769 of 1523 🔗

That’s a bit sad for me. This site has been helping me cope with my dad in a care home. I am at a loss to think what you think I am doing. I am bringing insights from the NHS. I think we all welcomed Leicester Doctor. Please don’t turn me away as I don’t know where I would go for support.

62487 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to wendy, -4, #770 of 1523 🔗

You appeal to feelings just confirms to me what i’m saying is bang on the money. You’re claiming that a fucking forum on a website debated to pissed of people wanting their freedom back is helping you cope with an ill parent, sure i believe you

62501 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Biker, -1, #771 of 1523 🔗

48 members of my family are currently in a coma, that trumps both of you

62518 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, -1, #772 of 1523 🔗

and you don’t hear me banging on about it

62519 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to wendy, 2, #773 of 1523 🔗

Wendy, no one’s turning you away.

62531 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to wendy, 2, #774 of 1523 🔗

I should add that I could tell very similar stories to what you’ve posted here, and have on another site. And I’m real.

The TJN family had classic CV symptoms just after Christmas – lots of people have told similar stories on forums such as this. In themselves these stories mean little, but they all add up to something.

62544 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to TJN, 3, #775 of 1523 🔗

I know a number of people who got very sick with *something* in January. And I could probably say the same for most years of my long life. People get sick every year. This is called life not a ‘novel corona virus’. And there are no ‘classic CV symptoms’. The ever changing list of ‘symptoms’ is vague enough to cover many normal seasonal bugs and a variety of other ailments

62586 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to birdwatcher, 4, #776 of 1523 🔗

When I say classic CV symptoms I mean fever, rasping cough for days, feeling shit for 2-3 weeks, and loss of taste and smell, like I’ve never had before.

Back then we hadn’t heard of CV, but we were struck at how whatever it was we had was so odd – not a cold, but not really a flu either. It was miserable, but nothing you’d go to the doctor about – the sort of virally thing you might get every few years or so.

Loads of people around us had the same thing at the same time. But if it was CV – and I’m not saying it was – it matters because it was here weeks earlier than has been assumed, and it means we were far closer to herd immunity than had been assumed. Hence the reason for the lockdown fell to dust.

62629 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to TJN, 2, #777 of 1523 🔗

Yes, Nothing you’d go to the dr about, a ‘bad/weird’ bug of the sort that comes round every few years, thats what people assumed they were coming down with in Dec, Jan and feb, before the OMG Killer Plague madness was started in the media. There was definitely something going round making some people really sick but if it hadn’t been for the media hysteria afterwards we’d all have just shrugged that off as we’ve always done before.

62643 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to TJN, #778 of 1523 🔗

I’m pretty sure my family had it just after Christmas. No one was very ill.

62848 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #779 of 1523 🔗

Cheezilla and Chooselife,

The TJN family aren’t in any vulnerable category, so as per the norm whatever it was we had we shook it off. Whatever virus it was though, I can imagine that if you were in weak health it might get a hold on you and not let go.

That’s what the flu sometimes does – takes the weak.

For me, the real tragedy, the real scandal in all this is that we’ve protected people who don’t need protecting and not protected those who did. Worse, we are supposed to feel morally good about that.

62883 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Biker, 4, #780 of 1523 🔗

Biker, stop being a twat.

62502 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to wendy, 1, #781 of 1523 🔗

I think I had it a bit in late March/Early April, I had a mild “burning” upper chest cough and felt a bit shivery (temperature) for about two days, the cought stayed for about two weeks, very very very mild but something was going on.
Actually my old Aunty 84 came back from an Xmas break up in Scotland and all her friends and also my Aunty had a ROTTEN does of cold, hacking cough, feeling ill. It went in about a week, she is fine again. So are all her aged friends.

I have internet mates all over Europe and in January a lot of them had bad colds too. They are all fine.

Then it was just called a cold so I suppose that’s why they are alive today.

62516 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Two-Six, 2, #782 of 1523 🔗

I have got myself in a bit of a hole here with biker without intending to. For which I am sorry. I am here because all the measures taken are not in proportion to the threat from the virus. As we know most people are fine and recover. Very sorry to mess things up here. Perhaps I should withdraw and not make things worse today.

62541 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to wendy, 2, #783 of 1523 🔗

Lots of people on here have got in a hole with Biker. His ire is great when aimed at the perpetrators of this madness, but far less so when directed at individuals.

Nothing messed up here today. It’s actually been one of the best days in the history of this forum.

62699 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to TJN, 1, #784 of 1523 🔗

Many thanks TNJ. I didn’t mean to upset anyone. I miss timed my post.

62836 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to wendy, #785 of 1523 🔗

I am quite sure that you didn’t mean to upset anyone – I can’t imagine what you wrote that would, and I can’t see that you mis-timed your post. My guess is that just about everyone who reads here can see that.

62535 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to wendy, #786 of 1523 🔗

Wendy, you worked for the NHS. The only other person I can vouch for who was very ill with covid symptoms started working in admin for the NHS in Janary. She wasn’t hospitalised, just had the equivalent of a bad flu.

She is in her 50s, obese and had to have an armful of shots before she could start her job.

Did you have a flu jab last winter?

62698 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #787 of 1523 🔗

I think that was what I was trying to get at when I posted today, that this was spread out from hospitals. I would say the physical symptoms were not the worse illness I have had so am sorry if they sounded that way. I timed writing about this wrong. I am 62 but a runner. I had an illness at Christmas, dad in hospital and a minor op so was very rundown in March.

I don’t have any health issues and I don’t have a flu vaccine. I am not sure I would want to have it. Gosh I am sorry I got things so wrong today. I posted about what happened in March without thinking of today’s context. I too want my life back and think the measure are terrible.

62538 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to wendy, 1, #788 of 1523 🔗

Can you clarify something for me, you describe all these symptoms you had, and you say you had shivering, shaking, dizziness, diarrhoea, and tight and burning feeling in your chest, and you’re former NHS employee.

Well, the “tight and burning feeling in the chest” alone is a reason to call 999 and get a troponin test done, especially if you get fatigued and “dizzy” after the event…

Shivering and shaking as well as “dizziness” make it sound like you had quite a pyrexic experience, or sepsis, again, reasons anough to seek medical attention or at least call 111, or did you self-medicate with antipyretics?

You also say you had fatigue and cough for eight weeks… The NHS guideline is to seek medical attention if cough persists for longer than three weeks, yet you haven’t mentioned anything of the sort.

62691 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to IMoz, 1, #789 of 1523 🔗

Hi there, well I was not a doctor when I was employed. I did have all the symptoms I described but I didn’t think they were too bad. No I didn’t ring anyone or self medicate. You must have more experience than me, I suppose I thought I was okay. And as I thought when the physical symptoms stopped I was on the mend. Cough was just dry and chest was tight and tiredness felt like getting over an illness.

I am just back from a run and I have had time to consider what I have done here. I felt safe to describe what happened to me but I can see it was very very poor timing. I don’t think there is a deadly virus. Every time I hear this I feel very angry. Sorry for getting this wrong today.

62747 ▶▶▶▶ DressageRider, replying to wendy, #790 of 1523 🔗

Wendy, I dont read that you mistimed things badly. I am always interested to hear what you and others say about what is affecting you or what is on your mind right now. This is playing with all our heads, no need to apologise.

62758 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendy, replying to DressageRider, #791 of 1523 🔗

Ah thank you. It is messing with our heads and isolating us from others too

63096 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to DressageRider, #792 of 1523 🔗

wendy i think people’s experiences are interesting and valuable to hear. Today i think emotions may be running a little higher than normal, don’t take it personally and don’t feel bad, don’t leave the site, and tomorrow is another day.

62653 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to wendy, #793 of 1523 🔗

March… It’s nearly August now. It’s gone!

62687 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to Lockdown Truth, #794 of 1523 🔗

Yes I agree. I timed my post wrong today. I didn’t intend to cause trouble. I am just back from a run and see what I did but I really didn’t intend to make big of the virus. I am sorry. I think I just felt safe to describe what had happened to me. Not the right time to bring this up when we are all fighting for our lives back. Sorry.

62794 ▶▶ annie, replying to wendy, #795 of 1523 🔗

It is of use. Thank you. I derive:

  1. the bug is not pleasant, but
  2. it is survivable, and
  3. the counter-measures are worse – as we always suspected.
62949 ▶▶▶ wendy, replying to annie, 1, #796 of 1523 🔗

Many thanks Annie. I shouldn’t have written it today of all days, I didn’t intend to cause any problems

62458 Basics, 7, #797 of 1523 🔗

Not quite “Bof! This is how you do it!” But an interesting article never the less. Not a smear to Skeptics, or is it? For those with social media you may like to guage reaction.

Fife salon owner will not make face masks mandatory for clients, claiming coronavirus is a ‘hoax’

Exclusive: A salon owner in Fife has told customers and staff they do not need to wear face masks as he believes he has proof coronavirus does not exist

https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/fife-salon-owner-not-make-18657185

62460 Lili, replying to Lili, 17, #798 of 1523 🔗

I’m off for a short city break in Berkshire next weekend. I’d normally spend ages in Blackwell’s bookshop in Oxford and the Wallingford bookshop (Wallingford) and would always come out with a pile of books. I won’t be doing that now. I’d also be in and out of all the little vintage shops and would usually get something – also now not going to happen. Instead we will be doing lots of walking – free – and only buying take away food from outside street stalls. We will also have a couple of sit in meals in pubs or restaurants. We will come back home around £200 – 300 better off than normal. The discretionary spending tap is well and truly off.

62494 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Lili, 1, #799 of 1523 🔗

Give me an email if you would like to meet up, we live in the region. two-six@twang.co.uk
We have Free Badges! (and cake)

62509 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Lili, #800 of 1523 🔗

Lili, I am often in the area and will assess next week for you including the Lamb Arcade. If you want to email me offlands@protonmail.com we can discuss offline. I can also recommend some ‘normal’ establishments in the area.

62534 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Sarigan, #801 of 1523 🔗

me2

62542 ▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Two-Six, #802 of 1523 🔗

Happy to meet for a drink at any time

62465 Julian, replying to Julian, 7, #803 of 1523 🔗

The BBC remembers Sweden exists:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53498133

Did Sweden’s coronavirus strategy succeed or fail?
In the first part of the article, which is more fact-based, they more or less admit that it succeeded, without being conclusive

The last part of the article, which is more touchy-feely, starts to waffle about Sweden having become a pariah internationally, and that public support for the approach has weakened at home.

So while surprising they bothered to report it at all, and that they didn’t completely distort the truth, it’s standard stuff for 2020 – facts, data, science, reason don’t count much, it’s how people feel about things that’s really important.

I do so want to see all these twits go away and start a new country where they are all nice to eachother and feelings are more important than achieving anything, and see how long it takes for them to come begging when their country fails miserably.

62540 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to Julian, 2, #804 of 1523 🔗

They will always spend ages trying to find people to give both sides for illusion of balance. If they stopped 100 people and only 1 was not supportive, they’ve still give equal billing to the 1 person vs 1 who was supportive. BBCs idea of balance…

62571 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Mark II, 1, #805 of 1523 🔗

Not at all. The Beb hasn’t shown any balance on the two related key issues of Corbyn and ‘antisemitism’ or the Covid parallel fiction. Both have been subjected to a fact-free rehearsal of a predetermined propaganda narrative.

62713 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to RickH, #806 of 1523 🔗

Not much balance on bbc in an item on face masksEveryone of the talking heads said it’s just a piece of cloth wear it.very strange watching people talk through one.

62558 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to Julian, 4, #807 of 1523 🔗

I love the way they say that latest figures suggest that Sweden is getting better at “containing” the virus. No, they don’t show that at all. They show that Sweden is getting herd immunity. They have to stick to the bs line that the only viable strategy is “containing” the virus. I’m completely sick to the stomach with the relentless propaganda that the BBC keeps churning out. I really should try not looking at that site…

62662 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Chicot, 5, #808 of 1523 🔗

I’m in Sweden – numbers in hospital are continuing to drop steadily. The only region that has admitted more than 2 new patients with CV19 since Tuesday is Stockholm, and 8 (of 21) regions have 5 or fewer patients in hospital with the virus. Two thirds of regions have fewer than 10 patients in hospital with it now..

Most Swedes think the care home situation was a mess and unacceptable, but I’m not hearing or seeing criticism of the overall strategy. If Swedes were unhappy, and still worried now, you’d think they’d be choosing to wear face masks – but they’re not!

62468 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 3, #809 of 1523 🔗

Just been to a little shop attached to a play park. I felt very stared at for not wearing a mask. I wonder if people will become more or less judgy…??

62491 ▶▶ A13, replying to Country Mumkin, 27, #810 of 1523 🔗

I went to my local GP for a blood test and I got some thumbs up from two elderly patients for not wearing one. Everyone was masked up at first, but I noticed that people started pulling their masks down once they saw me without one. Then I popped to two smaller grocery stores and the same thing happened – couple of people pulled their masks down after seeing me without one. It made me happy.

62506 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to A13, 3, #811 of 1523 🔗

YAY FIGHT BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

62512 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to A13, 4, #812 of 1523 🔗

I’ve noticed this behaviour. If people think you’re giving them permission not to wear their own mask, by not wearing one yourself, they’ll take their mask off.

I spent 5 hours catching up with some dear friends who’ve spent the last 6 years in the States (they had to escape via Canada!). Walked round Erddig Park, near Wrexham. Plenty of people enjoying the sun – not a mask to be seen. Social distancing was only observed by one couple who stopped and squeezed as far away from us as possible on a narrow path – I’ve not seen that behaviour for a few weeks round here, so it made them seem like nutters. Walked past Morrisons twice, there and back, again plenty of people shopping – only counted a solitary mask! But it’s not compulsory here.

62790 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mr Dee, #813 of 1523 🔗

Had to laugh at the approach to my local beach today. People meekly queuing six feet apart for the loo; hordes of beach-bound holidaymakers squeezing in between the queuers.

62787 ▶▶ annie, replying to Country Mumkin, #814 of 1523 🔗

Lettem stare. Fuck ’em.

62469 Paul, 18, #815 of 1523 🔗

We had a carpet fitted today,to my relief the fitter was unmasked and normal.He did say though that he was supposed to get PPE’d up and that the company requires him to sanitise his fitting tools between customers !,bloody hell !,he’s putting carpets in not doing open heart surgery !,so Covid in carpets now,we’d better use coverings over our shoes then.He asked if I would sign a form saying he had undertaken all of the ‘CV19 safety precautions’ even though he hadn’t,I said no problem.He said it keeps the company off his back.

62471 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 5, #816 of 1523 🔗

Back in Clownland…

“Boris Johnson says there are ‘tough times ahead’, but Britain will be ‘well on the way past’ coronavirus ‘by the middle of next year’.

“The government has bought a manufacturing facility in Essex so that it can be converted to produce a Covid-19 vaccine. The total cost to the taxpayer after the conversion will be £100 million”.

62496 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to T. Prince, 7, #817 of 1523 🔗

Only this time last week, BoJo was saying we should be back to almost normal by Christmas .

Do not recall him mentioning which year.

62500 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #818 of 1523 🔗

He has no clue what he’s spouting anymore.

62507 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to DRW, 6, #819 of 1523 🔗

Because someone else is pulling Pinocchio’s strings

62657 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #820 of 1523 🔗

Just like the lockdown was only supposed to be 3 weeks!

63008 ▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Carrie, #821 of 1523 🔗

Squashing the sombreero…..what an utter arse that man is. I just cant bear to look at him.

62499 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to T. Prince, 8, #822 of 1523 🔗

The total cost to the taxpayer will be a lifetime of serious illness and total enslavement.

62503 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Richard O, 3, #823 of 1523 🔗

And yet, we’ll still see the masked morons queuing up willingly with their sleeves rolled up in anticipation …..

62510 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to T. Prince, 4, #824 of 1523 🔗

They deserve whatever horrific fate awaits them. We just have to be smart enough to stay out of harm’s way until it becomes obvious what is going on. “Tough times ahead” is correct though. Johnson yesterday told the army to prepare for a nightmare winter. They are the only agency that will be able to keep him and his government in power, i.e. martial law.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8550967/Boris-tells-army-prepare-quadruple-winter-whammy.html

62539 ▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Richard O, 2, #825 of 1523 🔗

Just when I thought things couldn’t get any more depressing

62547 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to T. Prince, #826 of 1523 🔗

And the “four-pronged disaster which threatens to cripple Britain” does not include the economic meltdown!

62550 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Richard O, #827 of 1523 🔗

Beggars belief

62548 ▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Richard O, 1, #828 of 1523 🔗

So, they’ve managed to shoehorn in Brexit and flooding to keep the frightened masses hiding under their beds. A lot of the comments were reassuring in that most could smell the BS….

62559 ▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Richard O, 3, #829 of 1523 🔗

“They deserve whatever horrific fate awaits them.”

No, FFS. Even if they were daft enough to vote Tory or read the Daily Bile when the bleedin’ was already obvious.

A civilized response doesn’t have to mirror the evil of Boris and Co.

62581 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to RickH, #830 of 1523 🔗

Fair point, my levels of empathy have been drained to nothing over the last four months. All credit to you for still being able to view it from another angle.

62710 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Richard O, #831 of 1523 🔗

Don’t assume the army will put up with any bulshit. There must be a few senior officers with Jonathan Sumption’s POV

62583 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Richard O, #832 of 1523 🔗

Several lifetimes. Three? four?generations.

62473 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #833 of 1523 🔗

So, using bits of AG’s post, I emailed this to my MP.

Boris is urging us all to have a flu jab this winter. He’s also assuming that we will all be vaccinated against CV-29 in the near future.
I am very concerned about the safety of a rushed and relatively untested vaccine.
The severe neurological problems caused by Pandemrix are a good example of what happened last time a mass vaccination of the population took place with a rushed vaccine. It cost millions of pounds in compensation, as well as ruining previously healthy lives.
If vaccines are safe, please can you explain why these schemes are in place:
https://www.gov.uk/vaccine-damage-payment
https://www.hrsa.gov/vaccine-compensation/index.html
https://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/committee/topics/pharmacovigilance/Dec_2018_VICPs/en/

What can you tell me about the government’s estimate regarding the cost of the inevitable compensatory payouts for the covid vaccine?

Yours faithfully XXX

I’ve never corresponded with him before as I know he’s a lazy git, so I didn’t expect much in response.
Imagine my surprise, when he wrote back less than half an hour later. Not a boilerplate response either:

Thank you of your email and raising this subject.

It will be down to you to make a choice for yourself whether to vaccinate or not. Vaccines have saved billions of lives around the world but there are occasional side effects which is why these schemes are in place. I am not a member of the Government so I do not have access to any estimates for compensation for any damage caused by a vaccine that does not yet exist.

Kind regards, YYY

Methinks he’ll be hearing from me a lot in future. I’ll make him earn his £90k per annum.

Notice he implies the vaccine will not be compulsory – though it isn’t clear which one he means.

62504 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #834 of 1523 🔗

It may not be but we won’t be able to live a ‘normal’ life without it (like renewing your passport)…….

62654 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to T. Prince, #835 of 1523 🔗

Exactly!

62505 Gtec, replying to Gtec, 22, #836 of 1523 🔗

Not sure how Toby does it, but he is supposed to be on holiday, and yet he still manages to put this together, so many thanks – just wish I had half the drive, but in my defence I’m a lot older!

If it wasn’t for this and other places where you can comment and rail against this madness, I think I would go insane.

My wife is from Russia, and lived two-thirds of her life in the ‘utopia’ of the USSR; she does not have fun memories or nostalgia for then, but she is much more able to tolerate all this as she is well used to living under a lying dictatorship, with shortages and lack of basic supplies, such as we experienced at the beginning of all this.

Needless to say, we were well prepared without really trying, and certainly without any panic, as such circumstances weren’t new to my wife; I was the beneficiary of quite a lot of ‘comfort’ baking too, which was nice for me, but not for the waistline! She is also a mean hairdresser.

The thing is, she never expected to be living under such a Soviet-style government again, and the lack of freedom to travel is hard for her to take, but she is able to rise above it all much better than I am, or many others too I suspect.

I am very fortunate.

62739 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Gtec, 1, #837 of 1523 🔗

I grew up in Soviet Union and remember it well. I have lived in Britain for over 20 years and really liked democracy and law.

When all the restrictions started I said to my English husband “I cannot believe it is happening here”. It reminds me so much of Soviet Union. Especially the disappearance of freedom of speech and propaganda. Propaganda gets worse every week. Unbelievable.

I told my teenage daughter who supports masks “I have lived in a totalitarian state and don’t want to live in one again”. I find it difficult to tolerate this nonsense from the government, maybe because I experienced it.

62797 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Gtec, -1, #838 of 1523 🔗

Ever heard of ghost writers?

62529 40 Dollar Shoes, #839 of 1523 🔗

Does anyone understand the current death statistics as reported? Today we have 123 deaths in the UK of which only 16 were in hospital. Where are the others occurring? In care homes? If so why aren’t these elderly people being treated in hospital? Or are they people who once had COVID and have died of other causes later perhaps at home?

62533 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, -2, #840 of 1523 🔗

The things I most hate

Matt Handjob

The Dictator

The BBC

People who wear face nappies

People who wear exemption lanyards, whatever the fuck they are. Sounds like something Timothy Lumsden would wave about

People who make public service announcements in Supermarkets about being nice to the staff. If they can’t hack it fuck off and get another job

Not in any particular order of preference

62537 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, -9, #841 of 1523 🔗

Oh and people who write to their MP’s. To a man and woman MP’s are c**ts, why would you seek their views on anything?

62569 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, -6, #842 of 1523 🔗

Oh and people who bang on about their coronavirus symptoms back in January but didn’t go to the doctor. Funny you only mention it now, please fuck off, you only had a cold

62582 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Cecil B, 5, #843 of 1523 🔗

I certainly don’t write to my MP to seek her views, as she doesn’t really have any. I write to her so she knows that there is at least one person in her constituency who doesn’t go along with this stuff. If everyone did that, everywhere, they might take notice. Obviously one email isn’t going to change anything, but it’s a start.

62589 ▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Julian, -5, #844 of 1523 🔗

Do you really think they give a shit about what you think. They are there to line their own pockets, your letter will be filed under B for bin, or N for nutter

62614 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Cecil B, 3, #845 of 1523 🔗

They don’t care what I think but they care about getting re-elected

If enough people who voted for them last time seem like they are going to desert them, they will start to worry

62551 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Cecil B, 12, #846 of 1523 🔗

I wear an exemption lanyard because I’m entitled to wear one and frankly I don’t need the hostility. Sorry for not being brave enough for you.

62556 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to AngloWelshDragon, -7, #847 of 1523 🔗

FFS. I rest my case

62570 ▶▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to AngloWelshDragon, -1, #848 of 1523 🔗

The lanyards are basically the same as face coverings, both are utterly useless at protecting against viruses and both mark you out as compliant with the bs narrative. Lanyards also mark you out as having some kind of health or disability condition, which is supposed to be nobodys business but yours. This kind of marking of different groups has happened in the past with terrible end consequences. So it might feel like the best option for you personally to avoid ‘hostility’ right now but it does make you a part of the wider problem and threaten your personal and our collective future.

62577 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to birdwatcher, 3, #849 of 1523 🔗

Also under this Nazi regime you will be singled out as less than perfect and a candidate for elimination. (Yes it all did happened in the 1930s, wasn’t just a dream.)

62895 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Bella, #850 of 1523 🔗

Interestingly, the Nazis organised ghetto police formed of Jewish people who enforced the Nazi controls on their own kind. Sounds familiar.

62579 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to birdwatcher, 6, #851 of 1523 🔗

Tell that to Toby as he has been telling you where you can get them. Not everyone is confrontational and not everyone lives in an anonymous city where they can maybe get away with bring a stand out rebel. I live in a right it community and as a councillor am quite well known locally so I wear an exemption lanyard. I’m pretty fit actually but I do have a condition that makes me more prone to hypoxia then most so you could say I’m gaming the system as the chances of me actually being made ill by a mask are probably as minute as me catching or transmitting covid! If your bf asks at Sainsbury’s customer service they will give him a lanyard. Every exposed mouth undermines the rationale for masks whether it’s through exemption or rebellion!

62584 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to AngloWelshDragon, -17, #852 of 1523 🔗

Your getting more boring by the second, fuck off

62585 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Cecil B, 3, #853 of 1523 🔗

Proper charmer aren’t you? Sanctimonious cunt.

62590 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to AngloWelshDragon, -4, #854 of 1523 🔗

Language Timothy

62631 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Cecil B, 25, #855 of 1523 🔗

Oh ffs, can’t we keep it civil here? The thing I’ve liked about this forum is that we can disagree without it being personal. Being a contributor who would have been considered ‘of the left’ before lockdown I have had very civil and enlightening exchanges with people of opposing political views without it degenerating into Twitter standards. I estimate only about 20% on here have, or did have, left-ish leanings (but concede i could be way out) but we’ve been given a fair hearing. And what I have learnt being here – having dumped my partisanship – is that most of us want the same things – common decency, consideration for others and freedom from interference in our lives. Hence my recent political divorce but, hell, can’t we keep it civil?

62641 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Evelyn, replying to Bella, 5, #856 of 1523 🔗

I agree with you Bella. These exchanges today have put me off looking at future comments. I’ll look at Toby’s stuff but will no longer look on here.

62665 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Evelyn, 5, #857 of 1523 🔗

Obviously your choice but I think the comments on here are often worth looking at, and maybe you could consider just ignoring the threads that you don’t find interesting or constructive.

62784 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Evelyn, replying to Julian, #858 of 1523 🔗

Wise words Julian, thank you.

62736 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Evelyn, 4, #859 of 1523 🔗

I think people are feeling particularly wound-up today. It’s not usually like this.

62786 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Evelyn, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #860 of 1523 🔗

I know Miriam, we can all get wound-up, including me. I’m feeling better after being for a good walk with my dogs…..thank God for dogs.

62887 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #861 of 1523 🔗

Yer, today has been a RED LETTER DAY. Lets all calm down a bit.

62894 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Bella, 2, #862 of 1523 🔗

The thing I’ve liked about this forum is that we can disagree without it being personal.’

Unless we can do that this forum is finished. And who gains by that? If forums like this are finished, then the lockdown fascists will be nine tenths of the way to winning.

Left/right is redundant now. No one has, or ever did, have a monopoly on wisdom. I say this as someone who voted for Johnson in December. I loathe him now.

63016 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to TJN, #863 of 1523 🔗

Ditto I detest the man.

63015 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Bella, #864 of 1523 🔗

Everyone is entitled to be here of any political persuasion. We are united by the greatest issue of the moment. Other issues pale into insignificance by comparison. Each person must decide how to cope with the rules….I refuse to comply with any of them but respect that others may not feel they are able to do that. It does NOT mean they support the tyranny.

62591 ▶▶▶▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #865 of 1523 🔗

Not everybody understands the damage they’re doing by using exemption lanyards instead of simply not covering their faces. I’m sure plenty of people feel theyre ‘gaming the system’ this way but thats not reality. Nobody *has* to wear a face covering or explain why they’re not, currently thats part of the guidance. But what happens from here really depends on how people react to whats happening now and sadly the exemption lanyards are helping to push us toan even worse future

62595 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to birdwatcher, 1, #866 of 1523 🔗

It’s a tricky one that right enough. I am pretty sure i won’t wear a lanyard.

62604 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to birdwatcher, 9, #867 of 1523 🔗

I don’t disagree. I feel very unhappy to be in this invidious position but with hyperthyroidism and a history of associated high cardiac output heart issues I don’t need the stress of any of the available options of wearing a mask, not wearing a mask or wearing a lanyard. We can’t all be Spartacus and I do wonder how many people on here are talking a good war but actually wearing a mask. Anyone of us could come on here and bullshit about their heroic one man protest but we’d never know if it was true.

62740 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kelly deacons, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #868 of 1523 🔗

Brilliant, now we have mask wearers and non mask wearers at odds……and now non mask wearers against other non mask wearers!……someone somewhere must be loving all this.

62617 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to birdwatcher, 7, #869 of 1523 🔗

You are forgetting that not everyone is as unintimidated as you to the potential reaction. I carry a lanyard for use in a crunch but I have never actually had to wear it and it will be a last resort, followed by threats under disability legislation. However if it is a choice between people wearing a lanyard or wearing a muzzle, then a lanyard is clearly preferable – not least for their own health. People will see others “get away with it”, and fear-of-missing-out will possibly lead them to go home and find out where to get lanyards themselves. They might even stumble upon some facts on their journey.

62563 ▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to Cecil B, 4, #870 of 1523 🔗

You’ve left out the Guardian Newspaper surely the most evil newsheet on the planet. The print and on line instrument of the deep state and secret services and financed by both.

63021 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Harry hopkins, #871 of 1523 🔗

A tax dodging trust too.

62543 RickH, 6, #872 of 1523 🔗

An ‘interesting’ experience this afternoon.

I have always found my GP Practise excellent, and responsive : normally, if necessary, I could queue at 8 a.m. and get an appointment that day.

Recently, however, we have had a letter abolishing everything but a telephone triage system, operating only in the morning. All related, of course to the usual bollocks about this diappeared virus.

This afternoon I rang to get a prescription (probably needing an appointment, even tho’ that shouldn’t be strictly necessary given my medical history – but OK – for a developing urinary tract infection.

Usual telephone Covid bollocks before getting through.

But here’s the kicker – the receptionist (obviously only pleasantly doing her job) fended me off and told me to go to the Walk-In Centre in the City!

I’ve had a creeping suspicion about what is being done to the health sevices under this regime under the cover of the imagined virus. Here was confirmation.

62549 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 17, #873 of 1523 🔗

Great piece in The Spetator today by Christopher Snowdon about Bumbling Boris’ new nanny state food decrees.

This paragraph stood out:

There is also a strange comfort in being able to abandon hope in Boris Johnson so soon into his premiership. It saves time in the long run. To be honest, his libertarianism was already in doubt when he put us all under house arrest for three months but, to be fair, that was under exceptional circumstances. However, if a Conservative government with an 80 seat majority, a liberal leader and an anti-establishment chief advisor is going to impose the kind of purse-lipped, micro-managing, finger-wagging, lemon-sucking, nanny-knows-best, censorious, anti-business, killjoy policies that even Gordon Brown never seriously entertained, then we have to conclude that nothing short of revolution is going to put the paternalistic political class out of its stride. It doesn’t matter who you vote for, Public Health England always gets in.’

62616 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #874 of 1523 🔗

The ‘food decrees’ worry me. Is this the precursor to limiting food supplies or am I becoming too paranoid?

62711 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to T. Prince, 2, #875 of 1523 🔗

These days you have to wonder – all bets are off…

62552 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #876 of 1523 🔗

From the Torygraph live:

Police must enforce Covid-19 laws or risk helping to “destroy society”, peers have heard.
Conservative Lord Blencathra suggested more people will break different laws if they see others “getting away with it” during lockdown.

Very perceptive!
Is Martial law where the silly stuff is leading?

62555 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #877 of 1523 🔗

Just shows what an ill thought out law it is.

62566 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #878 of 1523 🔗

Just goes to show how useless the House of Lords (and all that sail in her) is.

62560 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Cheezilla, #879 of 1523 🔗

As I posted down-thread, the good Lord has form – look on his Wiki page!

62574 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #880 of 1523 🔗

Missed your post so far. The site is so busy today …..
Blencathra is clearly a Nazi but his anticipation of anarchy is pretty astute.

62785 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #881 of 1523 🔗

Hasn’t occurred to them that people who normally never break laws will break this one, because it’s an intolerably bad law..

63117 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Cheezilla, #882 of 1523 🔗

People breaking stupid laws STRENGTHENS society, idiot.
Then again I can imagine this guy paid his Poll Tax like a good little boy, mostly because he’s so loaded that he didn’t give a fuck.

62554 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 16, #883 of 1523 🔗

My bf has a skin condition which can make his face quite blotchy because it is very itchy for him so he scratches his face a lot. Wearing a mask today has irritated his skin even more and I explained that he would likely be exempt under the regulations. I would like to point out that he is just as sceptical as I am about all this bollocks – masks, lockdown, social distancing, the lot (I am very lucky to have a likeminded parter in that respect) – but he is also the least confrontational person on the planet, just wants a quiet life more than anything. He is a very sanguine person and doesn’t get angry/passionate in the same way as I do. That’s probably why we are so well suited, because we complement one another. Anyway, I explained the exemption to him but given his very non-confrontational nature, as well as his tendency to be just too damned kind for his own good, he just sighed and said ‘No it’s fine, it’s not that bad, as long as it keeps people happy.’ I’d like to add that my bf wasn’t ‘virtue signalling’ when he said this; he was very resigned about the whole thing, his mask is very uncomfortable for him and he hates wearing it but he really does genuinely just want to avoid questions and aggro at shop entrances as well as death glares/confrontations with judgemental Karens who are too selfish to realise people are exempt.

But my bf’s attitude gives me hope in a way. I wonder if there are others like him who despise the whole thing and are even exempt under the regs but comply anyway because they want a quiet life and assume it’s only temporary. We’ll have to see – I’m still convinced that the whole pile of shit will come tumbling down during winter once the days get cold and dark, more people lose their jobs and the delayed illnesses from missed consultations and the like finally catch up with everyone. The scepticism is definitely stronger than we think; it’s just bubbling under the surface.

62565 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Poppy, 3, #884 of 1523 🔗

He could legitimately wear an exempt badge and lanyard and avoid all hassle. Stress will probbaly aggravate his condition.

I don’t have sensitive skin but when I had to wear a disposable mask at the hospital for about 20 minutes, my cheeks and chin felt very hot all the way home and I was surprised to find my face wasn’t red. Clearly the mask had irritated my skin, even in that short time.

62596 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #885 of 1523 🔗

According to a patronising tit below wearing a lanyard makes you as bad as a mask wearer. I really didn’t expect to get hostility from people on LDS. Sad.

62598 ▶▶▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #886 of 1523 🔗

If youre referring to me I was trying to be polite not patronising, in case you genuinely hadnt realised the wider implications of your personal choice. Thats not hostility its info sharing.

62650 ▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to birdwatcher, 1, #887 of 1523 🔗

No not you. D Barton. Apologies for the confusion! I Should have been more clear.

62568 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Poppy, 6, #888 of 1523 🔗

I think there are a lot of people who know or suspect this is all nonsense, and think it is only temporary, and are just either thinking they are being helpful, or going along with it for a quiet life. Assuming this goes on for ages, and gets extended to more and more settings, you’d hope that these kind of people will get more and more annoyed by it and start to rebel and wonder what it’s all for. What worries me is what happens if they don’t – it’s a test really. Are we really just a nation of sheep? We will find out. I absolutely refuse to believe that mask enthusiasts are in anything like a majority – borne out by the fact that even after the government announcement, shops were largely full of people with no masks on.

62572 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Poppy, 6, #889 of 1523 🔗

I completely understand. Not everyone is confrontational and not everyone lives in an anonymous city where they can maybe get away with bring a stand out rebel. I live in a right it community and as a councillor am quite well known locally so I wear an exemption lanyard. I’m pretty fit actually but I do have a condition that makes me more prone to hypoxia then most so you could say I’m gaming the system as the chances of me actually being made ill by a mask are probably as minute as me catching or transmitting covid! If your bf asks at Sainsbury’s customer service they will give him a lanyard. Every exposed mouth undermines the rationale for masks whether it’s through exemption or rebellion!

62602 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Poppy, 2, #890 of 1523 🔗

I was talking to a nice young lady in Marks yesterday, I asked if she was going to mask up today, I guess so she said, looking sad, I said she didn’t have to wear one if she had any issues at all with it and she didn’t have to prove anything to anybody and if she got the sack its wrongful dismissal. She just said she didn’t mind wearing one. Ah well, I tried.
Sad.

62981 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Poppy, #891 of 1523 🔗

My husband is like your boyfriend – techincally he’s exempt as he suffers from really bad headaches and was nearly a victim of a crime a few years’ ago but he insists on muzzling up on public transport to avoid hassle then proceeds to constantly touch his face and fiddle with it to get some oxygen. His attitude is the same as well, he doesn’t like it but is afraid of the harassment and bullying especially from the police.

I used to think that we could see rioting in October but I’m thinking it could start kicking off come August when more shops close and more people are made redundant. I could be wrong as to when this all starts but definitely we will see a push back when the shit hits the fan.

62557 Cheezilla, 1, #892 of 1523 🔗

Presumably it’s still in patent?

Osteoporosis drug could be repurposed to fight Covid-19 An osteoporosis drug reduces coronavirus infection by 85 per cent in human cells, say scientists, opening the door to a quick new treatment for the condition.
The widely used drug apilimod is one of 13 new medications that has been found to fight coronavirus when scientists screened nearly 12,000 medications to see if any could battle Covid-19.

From the DT live.

62562 Bella, replying to Bella, 9, #893 of 1523 🔗

My IT guy came the other day to pick up my PC for a health check in a full fuck-off bomber pilot face mask, complete with detached filter. I told him to take it off. He brought PC back today and I told him he wasn’t allowed to wear his mask which he didn’t. Not only that, but this bloke (who has probably been scaring the fuck out of other people with his mask – and he’s a nice bloke ) proceeds to show me photos on his iPhone of the patio he built during Lockdown (when he got a government grant of £5k) and he’s standing about a foot away as we scroll through his photos. So tell me, full on fuck-off face-mask one day and less than a foot distancing the next, does that compute? And he’s in IT.

62567 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Bella, #894 of 1523 🔗

They’re the worst!

62575 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, 5, #895 of 1523 🔗

My Cousin is like that. Mental, he just freeking LOVES it. (Ex RAF) Even now he wears a ful N95 respirator when he goes to see his old mum, (Autny)…just mental. I just cannot talk to him. Like just not talk to him, I haven’t since the lockdown. It’s really not going to go well.

62564 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #896 of 1523 🔗

Friday thought.

We are where we are.
Where do you want to be and how do we go about getting there?

Sounds a bit managerial for a friday I admit, sometime I surprise myself!

What i’m thinking is there’s a large amount that needs turning around and/or repealing. What steps might get us heading in a better direction?

Obvious thoughts from myself are to keep up talking and dissenting at every opportunity. The idea of a People’s Public Inquiry is a good one too. What other steps need to be taken?

62573 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Basics, 4, #897 of 1523 🔗

I was thinking with input from here and some professional touches some excellent leaflets could be designed and printed and distributed to every household in the UK, with some pithy facts. We just need someone to put up some money. It could be part crowdfunded but would still need a few million.

62603 ▶▶ Malcolm Ramsay, replying to Basics, #898 of 1523 🔗

“What steps might get us heading in a better direction?”

If anybody was willing to mount a legal challenge based on the argument that the current system has forfeited its legitimacy, I think there’s a good chance the courts would order a constitutional overhaul  – there are a few obvious changes which could transform the current system and would be very hard to argue against.

62576 IMoz, replying to IMoz, 1, #899 of 1523 🔗

Here’s one of the chief proponents of face masks Stateside: https://twitter.com/AlexBerenson/status/1286517178309779457 Oops!

62578 ▶▶ Julian, replying to IMoz, 2, #900 of 1523 🔗

Yes, do as I say. These tossers always have trouble following the stupid rules they make up for others.

62624 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to IMoz, 1, #901 of 1523 🔗

If Trump needed an excuse he has a bigly one there!

62697 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to IMoz, #902 of 1523 🔗

As with Ferguson and Cummings it just shows what a sham it all is.

62580 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #903 of 1523 🔗

More on bumbling Boris today. As some of you know on here I am fond of watching TV/Youtube clips with the sound off first. Most of us use all senses at once, so they are often in competition. If any of you know anyone who is blind, the other senses often (over) compensate – my friend’s son is blind but is impressively perceptive on sound/mood etc. Just watched a clip of Boris, who I am convinced in mentally unwell since his stint in hospital. Watch him walk (today’s visit to the hospital where he described anti-vaxxers as nuts – on Sky). He is not walking straight, and quite noticeably. Suggests a neurological condition?

62601 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #904 of 1523 🔗

Hospital Sam Kylie (sp?) Interview. Boris was looking down at the floor a good deal as he spoke, looking for ideas before reconnecting his eyes to Sam. Injections of arm flaps with knee bounces seem to me to be his method for staying alive. He would die of boredom without keeping himself on an edge by doing a weird movement then speaking words inspired by his flap. Hard to word what I mean.

His eyes are as dead as a sharks, sorry sharks.

Then thumb pressed to index finger forward faux fist gesture shows his speech training is still engaged.

A sense of doing things to get through it rather than statesman drive and spirit. Whatever ‘it’ is, not firing on a full deck perhaps.

62607 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, 8, #905 of 1523 🔗

Boris isn’t in control of anything, he is doing what is told to do. We can all see he is is almost DESTROYED by the damage he is responsible for. A totally crushed man.

62615 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Two-Six, 5, #906 of 1523 🔗

Fundamental problem was to rely on Cummings to interpret ‘the science’ on his behalf, and Cummings (and others) were too easily impressed by ‘the scientist’ with the model.

62666 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #907 of 1523 🔗

I feel there a more connected relationship between the scientists and the string pullers.
A down at the lodge kind of feel, except not down at the lodge, somewhere else.

62679 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Basics, #908 of 1523 🔗

Anticipate subpoenas in the US served on The Lancet at some stage over the paper that had to be withdrawn on HCQ. A Trojan horse that could be used to uncover some interesting links to Chinese datasets/WHO etc. I know of one man who might be motivated to do that – bigly!

62627 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Two-Six, #909 of 1523 🔗

That’s what I’ve thought all along.

62635 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 2, #910 of 1523 🔗

He could do a David Cameron and go “OOPS look at the mess I’ve created. I’m clearly not qualified to sort it out. Bye!”

62703 ▶▶▶▶ anon, replying to Two-Six, 1, #911 of 1523 🔗

this

they got to him big time. that’s why he’s so broken

even though he’s a nasty eton tory I don’t believe he would subject us to this much torture

and no way did he gave corona. they got to him.

62709 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Two-Six, #912 of 1523 🔗

You have to wonder if he was ‘got at’ while in hospital..

62609 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Basics, 1, #913 of 1523 🔗

Yes, that’s the one – Sam Coates.

62618 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #914 of 1523 🔗

I wondered if it’s because he’s not used to walking with his hands behind his back?
It seems to be a new affectation – does he think it makes him look like Churchill?
Churchill didn’t blather. Someone ought to tell Boris it’s more reminiscent of Prince Philip.

62659 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Cheezilla, #915 of 1523 🔗

He stands with his hands behind his back when being interviewed (to stop him flailing them about), but he wasn’t when he was walking.

62766 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Cheezilla, #916 of 1523 🔗

Hand behind his back like some jumped up primary school milk monitor.

63114 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #917 of 1523 🔗

My Dad is deaf and swears blind (punnnnnnnn) that his sense of smell is amazing to compensate. I think he’s full of crap personally but….. hey maybe he isn’t.
(I mean he wasn’t born deaf but went deaf pretty young so…..)

62588 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 21, #918 of 1523 🔗

This is the way to wear your face mask:
comment image ?imwidth=1160

62593 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Cheezilla, #919 of 1523 🔗

How’s it attached at the back?

62597 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #920 of 1523 🔗

Yesterday we were discussing converting thongs into facemasks.
Presumably he’s converted a facemask into a thong.

62630 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Lockdown Truth, #921 of 1523 🔗

Don’t overthink it LT!

62700 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Lockdown Truth, #922 of 1523 🔗

I assume he’s put one ear loop around each leg?

62764 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Lockdown Truth, #923 of 1523 🔗

Pinch between the cheeks?

62634 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cheezilla, 10, #924 of 1523 🔗

Ha ha. Brilliant this man ‘struts along busy Oxford Street’ today, ‘making a mockery of the new rules’. He absolutely gets my vote for making a stand against wearing face masks

62642 ▶▶ Edgar Friendly, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #925 of 1523 🔗

Don’t think i’d want to be around when he sneezes into that mask…

63113 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Cheezilla, #926 of 1523 🔗

I WANT THIS GUY’S PHONE NUMBER

62594 DRW, replying to DRW, 7, #927 of 1523 🔗

Saw this on Reddit: Biderman’s Chart of Coercion
https://www.reddit.com/r/LockdownSkepticism/comments/hwgqcg/bidermans_chart_of_coercion

Originally described “stress maniplulation techniques” such as torture and domestic violence but you can certianly add our current experience to the list.

62613 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to DRW, 1, #928 of 1523 🔗

Showing complete control over
victims face

62676 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to DRW, #929 of 1523 🔗

Check out Amazing Polly http://amazingpolly.net/index.php (a fellow Canadian!). She does a whole video on how what is being done to us meets the criteria of non-touch (psychological) torture according to the Geneva Convention. She draws on Biderman’s Chart of Coercion as well. Her follow up video to this one is also very good.

62599 TheBluePill, replying to TheBluePill, 19, #930 of 1523 🔗

Pleased to report that at a local independent supermarket, with a large Sikh community, muzzle compliance was maybe 60%. That was skewed by the elderly having total compliance, but the young and middle aged at much lower levels. Well done Sikh community. This stupid law will be effectively dead in a few days. It may also help people to see the disconnect between propaganda pieces on the BBC with their corrupt pollsters, and what they see with their own eyes.

62610 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to TheBluePill, -1, #931 of 1523 🔗

“That was skewed by the elderly having total compliance” I suppose that is good because they are at higher risk

62612 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to T. Prince, 10, #932 of 1523 🔗

The elderly would be better off with normal oxygen levels and not having to expose their airways with stale air and a build up of bacteria and other pathogens on the mask

62625 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Victoria, 3, #933 of 1523 🔗

Sorry, I was being ironic. I keep telling people that the evidence is that muzzles aren’t good for them because of the reasons you state. Those that insist on wearing masks tend to stare back, expressionless. Maybe it’s the low O2 levels….

62648 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to TheBluePill, 3, #934 of 1523 🔗

I hope it will be dead in a few days, not as optimistic as you though based on compliance in Scotland.

62663 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Moomin, 1, #935 of 1523 🔗

Theres a different mindset on sturgeonsland. The leaders wish is our delight. By general comparison Englands towns and cities have more dicerse character. That being said I have no news of how the Highland ands and Islands are doing. Cannot think many see a poimt up there. Is there a rural/urban split in maskage?

62600 The Mask Exempt Covid Marshall, #936 of 1523 🔗

For any of you living in the East Riding of Yorkshire and Hull area, you might want to know that Sewell’s, who have a number of shops attached to petrol stations locally, will not be enforcing the muzzle edict. By way of a return email, they state that many people are unable to wear a face covering within their stores for a number of reasons and that I will be more than welcome in them without one. Nicely done!

62606 Adam, replying to Adam, 6, #937 of 1523 🔗

100% compliance at my local Sainsbury’s I am afraid to say, bar one. Very very saddening. 🙁

62619 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Adam, 2, #938 of 1523 🔗

Hopefully the novelty will wear off. Keep setting the example.

62623 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Adam, 6, #939 of 1523 🔗

Just think about it this way: the more people do it, and the more often they do it, the sooner we get all signs and symptoms that sensible people know about from contact dermatitis to bacterial and fungal infections and aspiration pneumonia…

62646 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Adam, 4, #940 of 1523 🔗

Tragic. I think Scotland was the same though. People are sheeple.

62608 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 11, #941 of 1523 🔗

Headline in DM:

“Small Business owners say they can’t afford to keep giving NHS staff discounts – as one reveals she was asked to send free booze to a team of 53 ambulance service workers”


62620 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Victoria, 5, #942 of 1523 🔗

We need more headlines like that!

62621 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to Victoria, 3, #943 of 1523 🔗
62707 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Victoria, 5, #944 of 1523 🔗

Nobody’s got a gun to their heads forcing them to offer discounts.

Idiots.

62727 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Victoria, #945 of 1523 🔗

I reckon that wasn’t a serious request.

62733 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Victoria, 1, #946 of 1523 🔗

Discounts for doing their jobs (allegedly) . But that is taking the P

62611 Drummerman, #947 of 1523 🔗

Had a day trip to London today. Travelled from the end of the Central Line to London Bridge Station (so changed onto the Jubilee Line, en route). Walked to Borough Market. Shopped and ate and drank there for 3 hours. Travelled home again. Didn’t wear a mask at any time. Numerous TFL staff saw me and said nothing. A group of 3 cops stood next to me on one platform and said nothing. No one at Borough Market said anything. No passenger on Tube said anything. Just going to keep doing it.

62622 Victoria, 6, #948 of 1523 🔗

Maybe give McDonald’s a miss

Bit of a sensational headline in the DM

McDonald’s kicks out diners for not wearing masks as brawls break out in supermarkets over customers not covering up – but Asda, Sainsbury’s and Co-op REFUSE to enforce new rules introduced today

62626 Humanity First, replying to Humanity First, 10, #949 of 1523 🔗

“If COVID 19 vaccines become compulsory then the legal precedent will be set to force you to have every other vaccine the pharmaceutical corporations dream up in the future. You will have no autonomy over your own body , which will be owned by the State, and you will “officially” be a slave.

If it is not permitted to openly discuss the scientific evidence, both for and against vaccines, then medical tyranny is assured and any eye rolling by anti-rationalists merely demonstrates that they are not only incapable of understanding science they have no appreciation of history either.”

https://off-guardian.org/2020/07/23/we-must-inoculate-ourselves-against-the-crazy-anti-rationalists/

(Apologies if already posted)

62632 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Humanity First, 2, #950 of 1523 🔗

We don’t have autonomy over our bodies anyway since the government decided it could harvest our organs unless we specially opt out.

62637 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 5, #951 of 1523 🔗

At least we can opt out. And by that time, what does it matter if you’re dead?

62640 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Bella, 3, #952 of 1523 🔗

I think it’s the principal that bothers me. If you don’t own your body what do you own? The 1832 anatomy led to the bodies of the poor being requisitioned for dissection resulting in much anguish for their families. These things shouldn’t be done by the state to anyone.

62789 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Bella, 1, #953 of 1523 🔗

And if the hospital has a VIP who needs one of your organs, where is the incentive to take full care of you? Who would fully trust PHE, the NHS or (especially) our government?

62864 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to IanE, #954 of 1523 🔗

..and collecting people’s DNA via coronavirus tests makes it all the easier to find a ‘perfect match’ for said VIP who is in need of a transplant..

62633 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 12, #955 of 1523 🔗

https://www.bt.dk/samfund/mail-afsloerer-soeren-brostroem-fraraadede-at-lukke-skoler-kort-foer-pressemoede
Denmark’s PM stated that she was advised to close schools and other lockdown measures from the Public Health Body. Now a leaked e mail shows that 7 hours before the PM declared all these measurements in a press conference, she was advised by the Public Health Body not to do school closures or any other strong measure at this time. She disregarded this advice but obviously used the Public Health Body as backing these measurements.Interesting. It always surprised me that Denmark, which has such a relaxed attitude to life and health risks, should suddenly be so draconian compared to Sweden, a country which Danes always associate with a nanny state.

62702 ▶▶ Humanity First, replying to swedenborg, 4, #956 of 1523 🔗

Very interesting. Again seems to imply some pressure from above which put Denmark on the same track (or in the same herd) as the majority of the world’s governments in their response to the virus.

If we are to assume that Governments were not really acting independently and were actually just following a lockdown script they were given regardless of what effect the virus was having on their own populations, the question then arises how and why was Sweden “allowed” to deviate from this script?

Would something about the Swedes’ prior behaviour and openness to “new technologies” be an indication?

https://www.npr.org/2018/10/22/658808705/thousands-of-swedes-are-inserting-microchips-under-their-skin?t=1595612276523

62738 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Humanity First, 4, #957 of 1523 🔗

The Swedish Law does not allow Emergency Powers to isolate people in peace time.You can only use the Public Health Law to quarantaine buildings with suspect disease etc but not geographic areas let alone the whole country.Although very much a nanny state still giving freedom for the Public Health Bodies to proceed without much interference.Perhaps the politicians were burned after the Swine flu pandemic and the mass vaccination of a very enthusiastic population with Pandremix vaccine and the sveral hundered children and teenagers with narcolpesy as a side effect.

62844 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to swedenborg, 1, #958 of 1523 🔗

Narcolepsy, eh?
Did somebody give Boris the first dose?

62893 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to swedenborg, #959 of 1523 🔗

Quite possibly. Sweden had half of all the reported Pandemrix-related narcolepsy cases in Europe, likely as a result of 60% of the population choosing to accept the offer of vaccination.
I wonder what the likely take-up of a rushed CV19 vaccine might be here? Especially if the one offered to Swedes is the Astra Zeneca one? Astra Zeneca being part-Swedish owned might increase the trust factor?

62810 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Humanity First, -1, #960 of 1523 🔗

Yes that’s why Sweden “got off lightly” I think. Many people in Sweden have chips in their hand/wrists, I believe you can use them on the metro in Stockholm by swiping it and buy drinks food in a lot of bars. Not seen any evidence of this myself, just what I have read. It might have been a fad. Swedenborg? Got any low-down on this?

62857 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Two-Six, 1, #961 of 1523 🔗

‘Many people in Sweden have chips in their hands/wrists’ – well, I’ve lived here for almost 11 years, in Sweden’s 4th largest city, and I know no one with a chip! Nor have I ever seen it being promoted..

That said, there are a lot of shops here in Uppsala that even before corona were going ‘card-only’ as regards payment, and there are quite a lot of apps about for various services, like bus tickets, where the app is linked to your bank account. ‘Swish’, a means of sending money to people via a mobile app linked to your bank account, is very popular. Having Bank ID on your mobile is pretty much essential too. But nonetheless, Sweden did introduce new banknotes and coins only a couple of years ago, so cash is not yet dead here…

62872 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Carrie, #962 of 1523 🔗

Ok, yes I found it hard to believe that lots of people in Sweden have chips in them. I guess it must be that you guys have a government that isn’t totally evil and insane.

62669 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, #964 of 1523 🔗

“The evidence reviewed in this briefing spells out the risks
normally associated with maltreatment”.

62638 Che Strazio, 6, #965 of 1523 🔗

I’ve lost the comment where omeone asked for a response to the BBC Facts/myths about masks. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/53108405

1) Surgeons
Surgeons work in strictly regulated environments where the the air is highly filtered and replenished at the rate of ideally 25 air changes per hour (1000’s of litres per hour) and its humidity is kept below 70% (see link below section 4)
https://www.rcophth.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Theatre-facilities-equipment.pdf

2) Oxygen
a)There are number of papers (pre-Covid) agreeing that wearing a face mask does not significantly reduce oxygen in the blood because the body compensates by raising the heart rate to mantain correct blood oxygen levels.
(here is one such paper: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7087880/ )

This may, however, lead to possible dangerous effects such Raised Blood Pressure and Stress on the heart muscle.

The BBC might want to consider heart conditions to its exemption list.
It could also look at the The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (No. 2) (England) Regulations 2020 Schedule 1
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/684/contents/made

b) There has not been sufficient research (or even an impact model as required by law) to assess danger of wearing face coverings. Neoprene masks will be very different to cotton ones. I have a feeling it would be easier to breathe through a low thread count cotton fabric than through tee-shirting fabric.

62652 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 8, #966 of 1523 🔗

Are there shops refusing to serve people because they are not wearing a mask?

If so politicians such as Mr. Johnson should be asked if they support shops doing so.

If they do they support of shops doing this they must be asked if they support people being starved in to submission? Starved in to supporting a policy that is massively detrimental. Starved going against their conscious

They should be challenged on this.

62842 ▶▶ annie, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #967 of 1523 🔗

Contravenes disability discrimination law. Could incur hefty fines.

62953 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Ned of the Hills, #968 of 1523 🔗

Following on from my correspondence with B&M finally had a response from them today (to the question of what they would do if i appeared there maskless)
The health and safety of our customers and colleagues is paramount to B&M.
The wearing of face coverings became mandatory in shops as of Friday 24th July.
However there are exceptions to these rules, as per the Government guidelines.
Our store colleagues are not in a position to question a person as to why they are not wearing a face covering. The liability for wearing a face covering lies with the individual.
I will pass your concerns to the relevant team, “

So that looks like they will take no action

62656 RyanM, replying to RyanM, 6, #969 of 1523 🔗

Kids over 11?! Consider yourselves lucky. In my state, it is kids over 2 who have to wear masks. I’ve never attempted to put a stupid mask on my kids, and when I give them bandannas, they pull them down below their chins. Good for them.

62778 ▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to RyanM, 6, #970 of 1523 🔗

As far as I’m concerned suppressing a child’s ability to build their immune system is tantamount to abuse where are the child welfare groups in all this ,if myself or my wife missed a doctor or dentist appointment for any of our Foster children in the 25 years we fostered there would of been hell to pay and fresh air, contact with peer groups and physical activity were absolute priority for the children’s welfare and mental well being yet that now seems not important ,someone in power should be advocating for children’s health

62802 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to tonyspurs, 2, #971 of 1523 🔗

They don’t care obviously.

62660 Snarly, replying to Snarly, 1, #972 of 1523 🔗

I was under impression that plod didn’t have the resources to police non-mask wearers!
https://twitter.com/Rother_Police/status/1286666522233049095?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1286666522233049095%7Ctwgr%5E&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-16528829181409404942.ampproject.net%2F2007102309001%2Fframe.html
They are certainly right about helping me to spend less every day!!

62796 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Snarly, 1, #973 of 1523 🔗

Does anyone seriously believe the police won’t be out in force on this one? They’ll be all over it like a rash, despite that Dick woman’s comments.

62889 ▶▶▶ Adam, replying to Tenchy, #974 of 1523 🔗

Easy nick, innit. Can chase people not wearing masks instead of nicking crims.

63042 ▶▶▶▶ Shep, replying to Adam, #975 of 1523 🔗

goalpost moving creates new class of crims, get £100 each time;- really easy goal, cheating . Not fair play, especially on the police. This is not really what we pay them for and I doubt they really want to be doing this.. Problems for no medically evidentially backed reason. Everyone must by now realise we are all being gaslighted. I am not hyping it up when I say its a life or death one.

62667 Adam, replying to Adam, 14, #976 of 1523 🔗

More half-truths from that shaggy-haired blond C**T!! Actually, not even half-truths, blatant damned lies. Claiming they didn’t know about asymptomatic transmission earlier on in the pandemic. Errrrrr, yes they fucking did: I believe Sunetra Gupta was saying this very thing back in February/March, but they chose to ignore her rigorous statistical analysis and go with Ferguson’s crytal ball method instead. The complete and utter tools!!!!

62670 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Adam, 5, #977 of 1523 🔗

Is there actually any clinical study that confirms “asymptomatic” transmission, given that the only way to interpret “asymptomatic” is “immune”? Otherwise think about it: your body is replicating the virus, the virus escapes cells causing cell death en masse and your body is none the wiser?

62696 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to IMoz, 5, #978 of 1523 🔗

I’m not convinced by asymptomatic transmission either. Is there any other respiratory viral illness you can pass on without symptoms? Maybe with very close contact, but surely not just in passing in a shop.

62701 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to IMoz, 4, #979 of 1523 🔗

Dr Maria Van Kerkhove at the WHO said a couple of months ago that there was no evidence of transmission from asymptomatics, but was then forced to retract:

https://www.mdedge.com/cardiology/article/223631/coronavirus-updates/who-clarifies-comments-asymptomatic-transmission-sars

Wonder why?

62716 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #980 of 1523 🔗

She retracted it based upon computer models, too.

I’ll say again (as a software developer myself) computer models are engineering, not science.

62718 ▶▶▶▶ Malcolm Ramsay, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #981 of 1523 🔗

I don’t think she retracted it, she just clarified that what she’d said only applied to truly asymptomatic people (i.e. people who were infected but would never have any symptoms), but not to pre-symptomatic people.

62726 ▶▶▶ Adam, replying to IMoz, 1, #982 of 1523 🔗

I do not know, but Gupta made the case that it may well have been spreading silently (i.e. asymptomatically) before cases were being observed. At least her model did actually fit the observed data, unlike professor Pantsdown’s!!!

Just realized I should clear something up — I am certainly not making the case for masks based on asymptomatic transmission — quite the opposite. I am saying that asymptomatic transmission is a good thing, as it means people are building up/already have immunity, and it is disingenuous of that shithouse Johnson to say they did not know about it.

62744 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Adam, 6, #983 of 1523 🔗

Ok, let’s get slightly more technical. It’s possible that someone with such mild symptoms might be dismissive of those symptoms (who thinks that they might be infective if they sneeze a few times and that’s it?) while being infectious but to be truly asymptomatic you have to have the virus actually suppress body’s response which is what Van Kerkhove of WHO was trying to say but the media stupidity caused WHO to retract what she was trying to explain.

The problem is this: for most overtly symptomatic infections it is no worse than mild ‘flu; but having gone down the “fatal disease” path both the State and the media have no choice but to keep doubling down (recall how long it took them to admit, for example, that Saddam had no WMDs).

62750 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Adam, 5, #984 of 1523 🔗

On the spreading asymptomatically front. My elder son arrived back from university in mid-March and started to complain about loss of smell and taste (long before it was one of the three signs). He was otherwise ok. Two of his friends flew back to their home countries at the same time, and were tested on arrival – both positive, but no symptoms at all. If I did catch it from my son in March, I was definitely asymptomatic. If I passed it to anybody I associated with in March then they were all asymptomatic too.

62795 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to IMoz, 3, #985 of 1523 🔗

Asymptomatic transmission is the key pillar of this whole Corona Project. It is stating that healthy people are contaegeous and a threat to other people. It justifies EVERYTHING.

If this narrative was shown to be impossible or even extremely unlikely, that a person who is 100% healthy and has no symptoms of COVID19 but can still transmit SARS2-Cov then it would be a major step forward in putting the brakes on this run-away train.

62841 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Two-Six, 1, #986 of 1523 🔗

… as well as “touch” transmission 😉

62865 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to IMoz, 1, #987 of 1523 🔗

Yes that another one and of course arsehole transmission,

62868 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, #988 of 1523 🔗

Sorry, aerosol

62672 anon, replying to anon, 29, #989 of 1523 🔗

trip to the co-op just now (deduced some time ago that co-op must be running the Karen apprenticeship scheme)

first time out today – needed some ale after sitting at home working all week at my desk like I’m in groundhog day (I wasn’t sure if it was actually Friday earlier)

had printed some of those flipping lanyard things – did a pretty good job with some stuff I had lying around to make my own cards. felt good to be creative. my printer’s fucked though so the colours weren’t solid however end result was very passable

anyway I waited for about 3 seconds in the car thinking how-ma-gonna-play-this

then bam fuck this I don’t need to think about how am I going to get fleeced again by the co-op. just go in like a good consumer and stand your ground on the bullshit!

leave car and approach co-op confidently. lots of masks. chap leaving promptly removes mask (in disgust I felt not sure)

queue forming as I near entrance. wtf out of the zillions of co-ops near me this is the only one sans queues. ffs! turns out it’s an old masked dude santising his basket. they should leave frail old folks out of their damned psyops (annoyed me)

mild queue forming (normal distancing I might add) and the blonde lady in front of me turns around. no mask yippee!

checkout drone hollers ‘wait there’ and blondey turns around again. muzzled. fuck! you bitch! I’m clearly the only unmuzzled and I thought you were on board! dammit!

two muzzles leave and I enter undertaking blondey. muzzle muzzle muzzle. avoiding eye contact I pick up my ale and a few other items and head for the short queue at the til. everyone is muzzled apart from the young street urchin in front – he’s fingering his new muzzle and a frozen pizza courtesy of co-op.

approach til

“you’re not wearing a mask”

“I don’t want to”

“why not?”

“they’re dehumanising”

“I know what you mean but..”

“they don’t work. viruses are too small”

“better wait for the vaccine eh”

“well you can”

“OK bye then”

“see ya”

chap behind all the while telling his muzzled other half how we must “all wear ’em else it won’t work”.

so yeah just don’t comply and stand up for what you believe in.

left feeling liberated and simultaneosly depressed (at my fellow man I suppose). we’ve been heavily brainwashed in the uk though so I can forgive them I guess)

62693 ▶▶ Basics, replying to anon, 10, #990 of 1523 🔗

Thanks for that! Seriously get a copy of that and send it back to your old self in january. The entire thing your write is you experiencing a full break down of society. All that stress and panic and alertness to buy a couple of beers on a Friday. I don’t want any part of a society as unpeaceful as this. And we are to be like this for two or more years perhaps.

Great post anon – striking.

62741 ▶▶ Paul, replying to anon, 2, #991 of 1523 🔗

I like that,good for you,love the conversation at the till.What has it come to when a normal thing like buying some Friday beers,something a few months ago we would almost have done on autopilot,leaves you sat in your car beforehand thinking like you are about to go in with a sawn-off shotgun !,also I hate those people that stand behind you in queues obviously talking about you but without the balls to say it to your face.
I’m about to nip to the shop maskless soon,I’m 50/50 on which way it will go,hopefully my custom will mean more them than brainless compliance,it’s the other customers that worry me,I’ve promised my wife I will try not to strangle anyone that sticks their nose in !,

63047 ▶▶▶ Shep, replying to Paul, #992 of 1523 🔗

With a mask on and sunglasses and hat, the sawn off might be not such a bad idea;- get someone else to sit in the car outside {with the engine running}, worrying about what people might think! – cheers))

63049 ▶▶▶▶ Shep, replying to Shep, #993 of 1523 🔗

sorry Paul, that was meant as reply to anon,)

62933 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to anon, #994 of 1523 🔗

Thanks for sharing that!!!!!!

62673 Dave #KBF, 1, #995 of 1523 🔗

Just listened to Piers Corbyn on Mark Devlins Good Vibrations Podcast.

I know the name Corbyn will put some off, have a listen, make your own mind up. Some interesting comparisons to historical events.

It is on YT here https://youtu.be/u-nNAbiIy0w It has not hit iTunes yet.

62681 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 9, #996 of 1523 🔗

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.14.095414v2Important new study from Univ College London.
“we demonstrate the presence of pre-existing humoral immunity in uninfected and unexposed humans to the new coronavirus. SARS-CoV-2 S-reactive antibodies were readily detectable by a sensitive flow cytometry based method in SARS-CoV-2-uninfected individuals and were particularly prevalent in children and adolescents.”“A possible modification of COVID-19 severity by prior HCoV infection might account for the age distribution of COVID-19 susceptibility, where higher HCoV infection rates in children than in adults, correlates with relative protection from COVID-19, and might also shape seasonal and geographical patterns of transmission.”

62694 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to swedenborg, 5, #998 of 1523 🔗

Interesting, thanks. President Trump said at his press conference on Wednesday that there is a study coming out in the US as early as next week that shows children ‘don’t get the disease and don’t transmit it’, if I heard correctly.

62714 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, 3, #999 of 1523 🔗

Wow, the smoking gun! Note this: “Notably, SARS-CoV-2-uninfected donor sera exhibited specific neutralising activity against SARS-CoV-2 and SARS-CoV-2 S pseudotypes, according to levels of SARS-CoV-2 S-binding IgG and with efficiencies comparable to those of COVID-19 patient sera”

This isn’t the indirect evidence we had from T-cells, this is actually neutralizing antibodies to SARS2 in people who never had Covid-19.

62768 ▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to guy153, #1000 of 1523 🔗

There was something similar in The Cell back in May, I think, where they estimated that 40–60% have immune cross-reactivity against SARS-CoV-2.

62783 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to IMoz, 1, #1001 of 1523 🔗

Yes, two studies one in Cell by Grifoni et. al. and the other one in Singapore by Le Bert et al. who found similar things (although I don’t think Le Bert found anything cross-reactive with the spike protein, although Grifoni did).

They found the T-cells (both kinds– the kind that help make antibodies, aka CD4+, and the kind that kill infected cells directly, aka CD8+). Although strong evidence, there was no proof how effective those memory cells (and the antibody responses they would elicit) would be against an actual SARS2 infection. It was likely they would help, but we don’t know how much, and there was even a theoretical chance they could make things worse.

These guys have shown they are in fact as effective as the antibodies you get from an actual SARS2 infection, and also why children hardly ever get Covid-19.

62770 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, 7, #1002 of 1523 🔗

An interesting comment from the conclusion: “Public health measures intended to prevent the spread of SARS-CoV-2 will also prevent the spread of and, consequently, maintenance of herd immunity to HCoVs, particularly in children. It is, therefore, imperative that any effect, positive or negative, of pre-existing HCoV-elicited immunity on the natural course of SARS-CoV-2 infection is fully delineated.”

In other words, keep children in school bouncing viruses off each other and they will stay immune to SARS2. Lock everyone down and suppress all viruses and who knows what will happen when they come back?

62780 ▶▶▶ Edna, replying to guy153, 3, #1003 of 1523 🔗

Thank you so much Guy for deciphering all the scientific/technical terms, it’s really helpful; ithout you I’d probably understand 1 word in 4!

62788 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Edna, 3, #1004 of 1523 🔗

I’ll second that, and also thank Swedenborg.

62704 Edgar Friendly, replying to Edgar Friendly, 29, #1005 of 1523 🔗

I went in shops today without a mask and just said “I can’t wear one” and nobody tried to stop me. I am exempt anyway as an asthmatic. But i did feel like i was getting stares and people seemed to keep away as if i was some kind of leper. ‘What changed overnight to make me more of a risk than i was yesterday? You’re all wearing fucking masks anyway you twats!’ i want to shout. What a world.

62717 ▶▶ Kelly deacons, replying to Edgar Friendly, 14, #1006 of 1523 🔗

I am so angry now,I am just waiting for one dirty look and I will shame them as disgusting bullies….have had enough now.

62724 ▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to Kelly deacons, #1007 of 1523 🔗

I was at a few shops without a mask today but didn’t notice any strange looks.
Hopefully you will not either.

62748 ▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to Kelly deacons, 6, #1008 of 1523 🔗

Yeah same here. One dirty look, tut or comment is all it’s going to take.

62944 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Kelly deacons, 1, #1009 of 1523 🔗

Don’t sham them as bullies. Shame them as idiots.

62720 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Edgar Friendly, 13, #1010 of 1523 🔗

Please can people continue to share this petition to repeal the face-masks law? https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/331430

Numbers were moving up nicely earlier, but it has now only gone up by 2000 in the last 7 hours…

62762 ▶▶▶ JYC, replying to Carrie, 3, #1011 of 1523 🔗

Signed.

62813 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to JYC, 1, #1012 of 1523 🔗

Thanks – great! Don’t know if it is you guys on LS, but it’s now gone up almost another 2000 in the last hour since I posted here 🙂

62721 JulieR, #1013 of 1523 🔗

A report from my local High street in South London as a shopper without a mask:

Last week I went to the shops in my High street around 10% were wearing masks.
Today everybody in shops were wearing masks, no other face covering. Even children of 5-6 years old. It is very depressing.

I first went to Waterstones: nobody at the door, nobody asked me about a mask.

TK Maxx: a person at the door “Do you have a mask?”, “No” “Would you like to wear a mask?”, “No”, then he said “Ok” and I walked in and bought some clothes. All staff were wearing masks, last week none were wearing masks.

H&M: A person at the door “Do you have a mask?” “No”, “You have to leave the shop then”, “OK, I will not shop here again”. The shop was empty.

M&S: a person at the door “Do you own a mask?”, “No”, “Would you like to wear a mask? “No”, “OK” and I walked in. No staff were wearing masks. Nobody said anything and it was not empty like H&M.

Primark: A young man at the door “You need to wear a mask”, “I don’t have one”, he started shouting “You need to wear a mask”, “I cannot”, “Why?”, “I don’t have to tell you”, he is still shouting “Why are you so rude, you need to leave the shop”. So I left.

Morrison: just walked straight in, nobody said anything at all.

I will check next week again. It is sad and unbelievable how conforming people are.

62723 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1014 of 1523 🔗

The Independent: Boris Johnson admits UK could have handled coronavirus outbreak better in early months.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-lockdown-coronavirus-england-quarantine-uk-covid-a9636891.html

62729 ▶▶ Bugle, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #1015 of 1523 🔗

He should have said that around the end of April.

62730 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tom Blackburn, 12, #1016 of 1523 🔗

Oh look, maybe he should of lockdown sooner, nor did he need to at all…..and remember, anyone not getting the vaccine this winter is ‘nuts’. Don’t trust you Boris…..

62728 DRW, 4, #1017 of 1523 🔗
62732 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 7, #1018 of 1523 🔗

Remember the Spanish antibody study saying the immunity was still low in Spain? That was based upon N antibodies. That study was used by many scaremongers to say that we have not reached herd immunity. The study below recently published says other antibodies must be measured to get a more reliable discussion about immunity.
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.07.16.20155663v2.full.pdf
“We believe that our study has significant and urgent public health and translational impact. Firstly, our findings demonstrate that the half-life of the SARS-CoV-2 nucleoprotein antibody is only 52 days. This has immediate and important implications for large-scale seroprevalence surveys, government policy and mathematical modelling predictions which rely on serological tests that target this antibody. Secondly, the slower decay of the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein antibody identified in this study makes assays to the spike protein a more reliable target for serological assays in the longer term. We demonstrate a strong positive linear correlation between spike/RBD antibody and ACE-2 receptor binding in vitro. Our findings are therefore likely to reflect the time to loss of a functional antibody response in SARS-CoV-2.”

62837 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, #1019 of 1523 🔗

I didn’t know they were looking for N! I guess they chose it because you apparently get high levels of it (I think this is also why it decays quicker– the body’s clever tricks for conserving IgG become saturated). But you would also expect it to result in false positives as lots of coronaviruses have it. Unless they picked some particular bit of it they reckoned was unique to SARS2.

It’s also encouraging to find that the half-life of the spike antibodies is quite a bit longer, as these are the ones that are doing the most work. Running out of antibodies is not the end of the world– you will likely only suffer a mild reinfection as the your memory B and T cells will recreate the antibodies and also the cell-mediated response you had before– but you want people to keep the antibodies around at least until the main epidemic is over. The duration of IgG antibodies seems very well adapted by evolution to get you through the main part of an epidemic (the duration of which is mainly determined by incubation and infectious periods, not by population size, and is therefore fairly constant).

62751 Matthew Beresford, replying to Matthew Beresford, 7, #1020 of 1523 🔗

Surely someone is producing masks with ‘under sufferance’ ‘utterly pointless mask’ or some such printed on it?

62761 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Matthew Beresford, 5, #1021 of 1523 🔗

There’s plenty of masks in packaging that expressly state either “DOES NOT PROTECT FROM COVID-19” or “NOT TO BE USED AS PPE” 😉

62771 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to IMoz, 3, #1022 of 1523 🔗

Are there any made to look like chocolate fire guards?

62776 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IMoz, 3, #1023 of 1523 🔗

Needs to be printed on the mask itself!

62830 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Cheezilla, #1024 of 1523 🔗

Why, it’s not their job to protect the stupid from stupidity; they were warned. Same as with a lot of hand sanitisers—who actually reads the label on the sanitiser that says you need to sanitise for at least two mintes?

62765 ▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to Matthew Beresford, 11, #1025 of 1523 🔗

My favourite is “this mask is as useless as the government”

62777 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Youth_Unheard, 4, #1026 of 1523 🔗

“… but not nearly as dangerous”

62767 ianric, 10, #1027 of 1523 🔗

Just read that there were a thousand applicants for one job in a restaurant. Hope the lockdown zealots are proud.

62769 Cheezilla, 2, #1028 of 1523 🔗

Attention all Mirfield, Dewsbury and Leeds dwellers.
More covid traffic idiocy proposed:

https://kirkleestogether.co.uk/2020/07/23/consultation-starts-on-improvements-to-key-west-yorkshire-route-between-mirfield-dewsbury-and-leeds/

Q: What are disabled drivers supposed to do?
A: Crawl along in a traffic jam caused by the priority bus routes, like the people trying desperately to get out of Halifax.

62772 Klein, replying to Klein, 14, #1029 of 1523 🔗

Update from N. Ireland

No mandatory masks in shops, I’d say I see maybe 1 in 20 wearing a mask in the shops I was in today.
Had a pint and lunch in a pub, was essentially normal except for some hand sanatizer, and we had to ask for vinegar.
They are hanging the threat of mandatory masks over us, possibly by Aug 20th, but there has been about 1 or 2 deaths in the last couple of weeks. It makes no sense to impose it.
Anyway, come to Belfast if you want relative normality.

62952 ▶▶ matt, replying to Klein, #1030 of 1523 🔗

Don’t start. My wife’s from Tyrone and tries to find any excuse to make me go to Northern Ireland

62773 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 16, #1031 of 1523 🔗

I’ve just called my local Waitrose. I wanted to check if they would be arsey at the door. They have assured me they won’t and may ask if I can wear a mask; to which I will reply I am exempt. And that’s that. No more questions.

I hope everyone can regularly go until shoos maskless so we can denormalise mask wearing. I don’t like to say I’m exempt but I feel being maskless is the most important priority, for other shoppers to get used to.

Also hoping this will just fade… feels shit today, but hopefully it will just fizzle.

62814 ▶▶ kbeanie, replying to Country Mumkin, 7, #1032 of 1523 🔗

I imagine the novelty might wear off, especially when people realise that no one will enforce it. They’ll think HANG ON, they don’t have to wear them, so why am I?!

Think the Cummings scenario but with masks 👍🏻

62843 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to kbeanie, 6, #1033 of 1523 🔗

I’m not wearing a mask because I want to test my eyesight?
Could work

63176 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kbeanie, #1034 of 1523 🔗

Its like antisocial distancing, no-one really cares about that now and I think you’re right about muzzle wearing especially the police won’t really be enforcing this. They got burned by trying to enforce antisocial distancing plus with BLM their credibility is shot and they know this.

62774 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 10, #1035 of 1523 🔗

Well I suppose it’s slightly better than the nominated visitor idea:

We will purchase Wellbeing Pods for our care homes that will help reunite residents with family and friends kept apart during lockdown.
The proposal highlights the mental health impact of the coronavirus lockdown and how residents have been impacted by not seeing loved ones in person.
How will the pods help residents? The pods will allow residents to meet family and friends in a socially distanced face-to-face way without the risk of spreading the infection.
Two pods will cost £50,000

However, it’s only two pods for a population of about 500,000 in a district that’s working hard to outlaw car use!

Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right, here I am …..

62779 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #1036 of 1523 🔗

All this money being spent, to keep people apart, when the simplest and most natural way is to just MEET. God almighty it’s just so painful.

62808 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, #1037 of 1523 🔗

Presumably said pods will need fumigating between visitors too?

62858 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cheezilla, #1038 of 1523 🔗

flippin WELL BEING PODS!!!

63053 ▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to Cheezilla, #1039 of 1523 🔗

Another steely dan fan

62781 Simon, replying to Simon, 3, #1040 of 1523 🔗

This is a decent piece pulling apart mask usefulness.On Talk Radio which give airtime to this kind of thing which is decent. Growing numbers of listeners too, so the word will get out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHA-a4moDKE

62800 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Simon, 1, #1041 of 1523 🔗

It’s actually worse than bad science: in one of the case-control studies the Royal Society relied on in their push for masks, the “researchers” actually let it slip that the subjects were using oseltamivir phosphate (aka TamiFlu) and made no comparision between unadjusted Odds Ratio for masks vs OR for masks adjusted for TamiFlu (interestingly, their paper also had far better Odds Ratio if you had the right kind of “footwear” whatever that meant), that’s abysmal science!

62782 WhyNow, replying to WhyNow, 1, #1042 of 1523 🔗

I am very frustrated by comments suggesting that “the government” (Boris, Hancock etc) are engaged in a conspiracy with the public health professionals to coerce the public into obedience.
This is fundamentally to misunderstand the nature of the problem. A government has to get elected. A government is simply a very few (remarkably few) people representing the interests of the public to those services that are supposed to work for them. On the other side are hundreds of thousands of people who allegedly work for the public but who often see it as the other way round.
The real problem is that our government is massively overpowered by on the one hand the BBC, and the other the public services. I see this lockdown as the overwhelming force of the public health professionals, together with the BBC, simply sweeping government aside. The government meanwhile has taken the only choice available and go with the flow. This is only what successful ministers do normally. The successful ones (like Hammond) quickly learn to do what their department tells them. This is the real problem: the public’s lack of control of the public sector.

62792 ▶▶ IanE, replying to WhyNow, 10, #1043 of 1523 🔗

Hmm, does anyone (ANYONE) believe Maggie would have kowtowed to the BBC?!!!

62807 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to IanE, #1044 of 1523 🔗

Maggie would not get elected today.
She was only elected after decades of governments failing to deal with Trades Unions.
The electoral lesson from Blair, Cameron, May, Johnson is that you need to be media friendly, and you need broadly to go along with the public sector consensus on how to run public services.
Johnson is a curve ball for the BBC because he is amiable but not pliable.

62824 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to WhyNow, 6, #1045 of 1523 🔗

She got elected after the power cuts, strikes, 3-day working week, mountains of uncollected rubbish in the streets etc that were the result of Labour governments.. The way things are going, all that could happen again, but this time under the Tories!

62831 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 11, #1046 of 1523 🔗

It’s hard to know exactly what the PM and the BBC think of eachother. I am not sure I care much.

He’s not up to the job. Not that it looks like there are many alternatives who would have been better, not just here but globally. But that doesn’t excuse anything he has done.

62920 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to WhyNow, 2, #1047 of 1523 🔗

Yes but the media decide who will be voted in – Murdoch put Blair in power. Thatcher would have waltzed past Corbyn in any election.

The beeb trumpeted Boris’ stupid slogans at every available opportunity.
All it every reported of Corbyn was the anti-semitic stuff that was conveniently ramped up in the last couple of weeks before the election.

62957 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1048 of 1523 🔗

I thought the media did not want Johnson to be elected, because they want us to stay in the EU…

62914 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IanE, 1, #1049 of 1523 🔗

She set about systematically disempowering it after it took the piss out of Dennis’ drinking habits.

62806 ▶▶ Mark, replying to WhyNow, 19, #1050 of 1523 🔗

I see this lockdown as the overwhelming force of the public health professionals, together with the BBC, simply sweeping government aside. The government meanwhile has taken the only choice available and go with the flow .”

Except that that’s utter bollocks, isn’t it? Johnson hasn’t even tried to resist. In fact he and the rest of his cabinet of clowns have been prime movers in most of this. They haven’t been “forced” or “pushed” into anything. They might have been “frightened” into doing some stuff, but that’s just a consequence of their own stupidity and lack of moral fibre.

Please do try to explain exactly what disaster would have befallen “the government” if they hadn’t entirely gratuitously introduced this evil,nonsense of compulsory mask wearing?

They are absolutely as personally and collectively responsible for this shit-show as anybody else in the nation.

They are scum. And so are the “Opposition”. Never forget. Never forgive.

62811 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Mark, 1, #1051 of 1523 🔗

Emotive, but not analytical. Why is the government going along with lockdown? The answer is obvious. The electoral cost, in terms of BBC and public sector opposition, is too high.

62825 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 3, #1052 of 1523 🔗

What about leadership?

If they think it’s all nonsense, they should resign if they haven’t got the stomach for it.

62850 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Julian, 9, #1053 of 1523 🔗

Also how do you explain face masks? I could concede there was a majority in favour of some kind of lockdown at the start, but if the majority of people really believed they were murdering pensioners by shipping barefaced, how come they have all been doing so up until now? Even after the government announcement, the majority continued to shop barefaced as long as they could. How has the government’s hand been forced there?

62855 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Julian, 6, #1054 of 1523 🔗

Facemasks for all now or else we take your pocket money away. This was the threat to all world governments in the coalition.

62838 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to WhyNow, 7, #1055 of 1523 🔗

This isn’t an issue that requires deep analysis. It’s right there on the surface. If you are going to try to pretend that something is true that is as profoundly opposed to evident reality as what you are trying to claim here, you are going to need to come up with an awful lot more than you have so far.

Your argument is ridiculous on its face. The government is newly elected, with,a thumping majority. It has nearly five years to go before it has to face the electorate again. It’s literally stupid to claim it acted out of supposed fear of electoral consequences.

The only way to make that case is to claim to believe what some say is the “Cummings idiocy”: that somehow if the government hadn’t locked down etc it would have suffered such a disaster that its electoral credibility would have been irretrievably destroyed, so that nothing it did over the next four years could have recovered its standing. And that is, as the name suggests, simple idiocy.

To believe it could apply to the gratuitously vicious decision to impose masks by law now is doubly idiotic, to a degree that would bring the honesty or sanity of the person making that case into question.

63070 ▶▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Mark, -1, #1056 of 1523 🔗

Venom, but no logic.

63093 ▶▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Mark, 1, #1057 of 1523 🔗

Of course it has acted for fear of electoral consequences! The biggest risk to a Conservative government in the next thirty years is that they let people die. The BBC knows this. Labour knows this. Sturgeon knows this. And yet somehow the lockdown sceptics don’t know it.

63250 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to WhyNow, #1058 of 1523 🔗

Your position requires us to believe that people will still remember in four years’ time what happened this summer, and that nothing that happens in the intervening time could change their view of the government. That’s basically pure speculation and fantasy on your part. They say (with good reason) that “a week is a long time in politics”. Four years is an eternity

Your position is apparently the “Cummings idiocy”, and so it might well be that the government were panicked into the disastrous course of action they have followed (and continued to follow) because they were persuaded into believing such nonsense by insiders such as Cummings, but just because they allowed themselves to be deluded doesn’t make it any more plausible.

And even if we accept it for the panic lockdown decision itself, we’d have to stretch ourselves yet further into delusion to think it explains the absurd later decisions such as quarantine periods and compulsory mask wearing.

Your position is inherently illogical. Basically it uses a claim of supposedly all powerful media and medical professionals to justify obeying those forces, thereby making them all powerful.

It’s just a silly way to try to rationalise this government’s cowardice, panic and failure to live up to its leadership responsibilities.

Consider this: if your premise were true, it would have been the absolute basic duty of the Johnson government to have taken a firm, open and honest stand against the forces you describe in March this year, regardless of the potential personal costs. The first thing they should be doing, now, would be to take steps, using their secure majority, to aggressively dismantle the BBC. They aren’t and they won’t, because they see the BBC not as you would have it, as something forcing them into action they hate, but rather as a general political rival that has proved to be very useful in the coronapanic. That’s because the opposite of what you claim is true – on the coronapanic the government are not whipped, reluctant servants of a media/health professional tyranny. Rather they are fearful cowards.who largely believe what those forces say.

62885 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to WhyNow, 9, #1059 of 1523 🔗

And the destruction of the economy and fracturing of civil society is not an electoral cost.The fact is that Johnston and the govt. took this country into lockdown despite the scientific evidence.There is no one else to blame.They are elected to serve this country and have betrayed it utterly.

63080 ▶▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1060 of 1523 🔗

Do you seriously think that this is what the majority in the country think??
There are more people arguing that the government betrayed the country by not locking down earlier.

63094 ▶▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1061 of 1523 🔗

That Chief Medical Officer is such a patsy. He just says whatever Cummings tells him. Yes?

62815 ▶▶ RickH, replying to WhyNow, 4, #1062 of 1523 🔗

Oh FFS. What a classic of naively bathing in the confirmation bias of nonsense at the expense of the real world.

Poor Boris and Cummings – victims to the last! I laughed ’till the tears ran down my leg!

63085 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to RickH, #1063 of 1523 🔗

Would you like to explain what you think Johnson and Cummings motivation could be in going against what you say is the self evident will of the majority of the population?

62822 ▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 9, #1064 of 1523 🔗

Of course governments are not all-powerful and have to some extent to work with the civil service and other parts of the public sector, and with the media.

But it seems to me that your theory is blown out of the water by Brexit. The “establishment” were/are overhwelmingly pro-Remain, yet we have a government that, at least for now, is still on track to complete our departure from the EU.

I think the government is more worried about public opinion right now than they are about the Establishment. I think it’s pretty obvious that we are where we are with covid because the government felt pressured to do something, in the eyes of a frightened public.

As Mark points out, there’s little evidence of any desire on the part of the government to come out of this – in fact quite the opposite – they have seized every opportunity to do the opposite. If not, why did they engineer Leicester?

And finally, regardless of the above, they sought power and when the big questions were asked, they came up short. Their crimes are so huge that, if they seriously felt they could not lead the country in the right direction because of the BBC or the public sector, at the least they should have said what they really thought and resigned.

The PM and others should never be allowed near public office again, and should probably be at the least exiled for life, if not face criminal charges.

62891 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Julian, 1, #1065 of 1523 🔗

Criminal charges at the very least.I think the Blair government took the death penalty for treason off the statue books.shame

62928 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Julian, 4, #1066 of 1523 🔗

I think the government is just deliberately prolonging lockdown by any devious means they can. Their policies are deliberately slippery and nonsensical. The constant propaganda stops scared people from questioning.

This is destabilising society ready for phase 2.

62954 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1067 of 1523 🔗

Phase 2 – compulsory vaccine in order to be allowed to work, plus vaccine passport if you want to travel????

63073 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Julian, #1068 of 1523 🔗

And replaced with? You have to engage brain before emoting.

63233 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 1, #1069 of 1523 🔗

In the short term, the best one can hope for is some kind of recognition that the virus has been mis-handled, a clearing out of the most culpable, replaced by others who are a little more realistic and sensible. I doubt even that will happen.

In the longer term, stop voting Conservative and vote for a party, as UKIP did, that forces the Tories to better represet conservative views. That probably won’t happen either.

Just because there are not obvious alternatives doesn’t mean that the PM and others are not culpable. I suppose it’s possible they believe the nonsense they come out with, in which case they are merely incompetent, but I struggle to believe that. They know it’s nonsense and they do it anyway. That’s immoral.

63090 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Julian, 1, #1070 of 1523 🔗

A large part of the electorate are pensioners and not adversely affected by lockdown. A large part are on minimum wage and not affected financially. A large part are in public service and not affected financially.
You are mistaking your own opinion for self-evident truth. The fact is that, for a majority of people, lockdown is very comfortable indeed. No commuting. No childcare costs. £25k pa guaranteed, without having to work. £60-100k guaranteed, without working, if you are a senior person in public service.
The question we need to answer is: how can it be that so many people are – at least in the short term – immune from the economic impact of their actions?

63234 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, #1071 of 1523 🔗

In the short term, they seem to be. In the long term, I can’t see how they can be immune. Sadly people seem to believe in magic money trees

62877 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to WhyNow, 11, #1072 of 1523 🔗

I’m sorry but a government just elected with a 80 seat majority can do exactly as it pleases.
To say it is beholden to the media is absolute rubbish.The entire media has become the governments mouthpiece.
The government is currently the biggest spender on advertising in the media.The governments actions are indefensible and the blame rests there.nowhere else.

62897 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 8, #1073 of 1523 🔗

The governments actions are indefensible and the blame rests there.nowhere else .”

Well, in fairness to WhyNow, there’s plenty of blame to apply to others, including both the other targets he mentioned – the BBC and public health professionals. Those organisations and individuals have behaved disgracefully and manipulatively. They are absolutely blameworthy for the mess our elites have made of this, that they have meaningfully contributed to. But they are not solely to blame, and they have no leadership responsibility – that rests, as you suggest, squarely and immovably with the government. There’s no realistic world in which the Johnson government is not directly responsible for the mess it has made, and its actions are indeed indefensible.

62913 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Mark, 2, #1074 of 1523 🔗

I agree that they are all culpable but the buck stops with the government and they will deservedly get the blame the consequences become apparent.

62929 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 1, #1075 of 1523 🔗

Yes, I agree with you on that. I was just being a little pedantic there.

63081 ▶▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1076 of 1523 🔗

Exactly what the BBC wants. The buck stops with a Conservative government. So we get a Labour government. And that would handle the hysteria better?? I am really waiting to hear in what way Starmer would have handled it better. Lockdown earlier and more often? Just what the sceptics wanted.

63074 ▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Mark, #1077 of 1523 🔗

Great. So we elect Starmer and he is supposed to be the fearless leader that will face down the tyranny of the BBC and the public services? Someone has their map upside down.

63060 ▶▶ Nel, replying to WhyNow, 1, #1078 of 1523 🔗

Quite right

63078 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to WhyNow, #1079 of 1523 🔗

I am amazed that people don’t see the way the game is played.
How can you be a lockdown sceptic if you think that the majority of public opinion is on your side? You can’t be a sceptic about something you think everyone agrees with, FFS.
Everyone thinks the government should do what they want. The trick is to get the general public to want what you want. That’s pretty tough when you have the BBC and the entire public service, not to say the twitter mob, ready to defenestrate anyone who so much as suggests this virus is less serious than ebola.

63099 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to WhyNow, #1080 of 1523 🔗

It seems that a number of sceptics don’t really appreciate the depth of the problem we face.
The problem is not that some academics and health professionals think we should lock down. It is that the public guardians in the BBC and in public health have such power that they can coerce a government into locking down. And the Treasury into funding it.
Seriously. Does anyone think that Johnson, Cummings, Hancock are going with lockdown because of their personal assessment of the medical risk? How cute! They are doing it because it seems to be electoral suicide to do anything else.

62793 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 12, #1081 of 1523 🔗

Peter Hitchens on Any Questions now and nailing it!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

And yes, I feel very dirty listening to the BBC aka The Ministry of Truth

62826 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 6, #1082 of 1523 🔗

Five minutes in, and the beeboid is desperate to get Hitchens to admit he “breaks the law”. But Hitchens is not answering it directly. Very sensible.

62834 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Barney McGrew, 12, #1083 of 1523 🔗

He said earlier on in this “crisis” that he was following the rules because he believes in the rule of law, but recently he has become evasive. I’d rather he stayed evasive and keep his platform on a national newspaper.

Sumption said he changed his mind and started breaking the rules when he concluded that the government had gone beyond the pale.

62851 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Julian, 4, #1084 of 1523 🔗

His best defence is to say yes I did break the law because the law is insane. So what? Better that then beat about the bush, they will stick it on him somehow and then its game over for him, at least in that interview. The BBC are VILE. Which is an anagram of EVIL.

62835 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #1085 of 1523 🔗

The beeb have not done their research – plenty of photos on his Twitter feed, of Hitchens wearing an ancient gas mask on public transport…

62911 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #1086 of 1523 🔗

He’s too bright for the beeb!

63035 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #1087 of 1523 🔗

Had to stop listening once James Stupidly started to waffle about seatbelts and crash helmets. And who is the Chinese woman – I’m not a scientist but …..

Load of bollox. Wouldn’t be so bad if you could at least speed up the playback like on youtube and get it over with quickly.

I hope Peter Hitchens was able inject some sense in there later but I just couldn’t stomach any more.

62798 Dave Tee, replying to Dave Tee, 3, #1088 of 1523 🔗

“A date that will live in infamy” – that was Pearl Harbor, wasn’t it. And now, the Japs have shown us how to deal with a viral outbreak. Funny old world, innit?

62840 ▶▶ Gracie Knoll, replying to Dave Tee, 4, #1089 of 1523 🔗

The Govt and the MSM are now the totalitarian Axis Powers. The British people now stand alone, as they did in 1939, against the forces of Evil.

62878 ▶▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to Gracie Knoll, 6, #1090 of 1523 🔗

The Government IS the virus and the Media ARE the spreaders.

62801 matt, 19, #1091 of 1523 🔗

You know, it occurred to me yesterday – I have heard many stories in the last few months of people dying and being misclassified as a Covid death and heard several people say that they have had elderly relatives die in the last few months, some for reasons you’d attribute to lockdown. Some of this may be because I hang out here.

I haven’t heard a single “my granny died of Covid” story except on BBC.

Just an observation.

62803 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 6, #1092 of 1523 🔗

The government wants you to wear a mask if you want to and not wear one if you don’t want to. This, it believes, is leadership. You know differently.

Government exemption certificate download for mobile phones (second document):

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own

Mobile phone exemption certificate download:

file:///C:/Users/tim/Downloads/Exemption_from_face_covering_badge_for_mobile_phone.pdf

P.S. Uniformed security staff wore masks outside and then, taking a break inside store, removed them……..

62805 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tim Bidie, 4, #1093 of 1523 🔗

Is it wise to let the government know who and how many people are downloading exemptions? We know how they love collecting data…

63167 ▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Carrie, #1094 of 1523 🔗

In my view, that would be far beyond their level of competence.

62832 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to kbeanie, 10, #1096 of 1523 🔗

So far Dominic Raab has been seen mask-less in a food bank (ok, it’s not exactly a shop, as no money changes hands, but still…). How many more mask-less MPs can we catch on camera?

62909 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 9, #1097 of 1523 🔗

Don’t encourage the shaming into wearing masks. Boris’ current disgraceful posing is bad enough.

If they’re left to not wear them, they’ll set an example that helps our cause!

62946 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #1098 of 1523 🔗

I wasn’t meaning shaming them into wearing masks – I was thinking that if MPs are not wearing them, then that proves to the public that there is no medical need for anyone to wear one..

63023 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, #1099 of 1523 🔗

Fair enough but the press will seize any opportunity for shaming, rather than allowing the anomaly to speak for itself.

62818 Mark, replying to Mark, 63, #1100 of 1523 🔗

McDonald’s kicks out diners for not wearing masks as brawls break out in supermarkets over customers not covering up – but Asda, Sainsbury’s and Co-op REFUSE to enforce new rules introduced today
Meanwhile, customers reported seeing fights break out in supermarkets, with masked shoppers confronting those not wearing a covering.
One person wrote: ’10:05am I entered Sainsbury’s, 10:08am there’s a fight in the second isle because someone hasn’t got a mask on and the lady with her kid was panicking and shouting at the anti masker ….. end result?
‘Lady picks up a tub of double cream and throws it in their face.’

All your fault, Johnson, Hancock, Gove, Sunak, and the rest of the morons in the Cabinet, and Cummings no doubt.

You did this, and you are responsible for it and for all the rest of the chaos and misery to come. And you did it basically gratuitously. Nobody “made” you do it. There’s no significant benefit to doing it that could come close to matching the costs. You just imposed a law because you could and because you are too stupid or uncaring to understand the costs of doing so to ordinary people.

You aren’t meaningfully conservative, or liberal, or even British, in any traditional sense. What you have done goes profoundly and fundamentally against all those things.

You are evil, illiberal, cowardly scum.

Never forget. Never forgive.

62827 ▶▶ Chris John, replying to Mark, 4, #1101 of 1523 🔗

The Cabinet will be in dire need of a damn good head wobble

62833 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Chris John, 11, #1102 of 1523 🔗

A guillotine could supply one.

62847 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to annie, -5, #1103 of 1523 🔗

Happy to wear a mask if needed.

62852 ▶▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Basics, 1, #1104 of 1523 🔗
62867 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to IMoz, 7, #1105 of 1523 🔗

You see imot when a guillotine was used it was custom for the executioner to wear a. Drum roll. Mask. So my making my comment to Annies comment I made a black humoured joke.

I dare say there’d be quite a queue to wear the mask should a guillotine be swung into action.

62898 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Basics, 4, #1106 of 1523 🔗

Too french.hung drawn and quartered English style

62906 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #1107 of 1523 🔗

Lock them all up in an empty Nightigale hospital with no food and leave them to it.
Bets on who eats whom first and who’s the last survivor should be interesting.

62951 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, #1108 of 1523 🔗

Ugh! Who’d eat any of that lot?

62997 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to annie, 2, #1109 of 1523 🔗

They’d be locked IN Annie, not our problem.

62950 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 2, #1110 of 1523 🔗

The French had another version of that. It involved four bits of string and four horses and it was definitely not nice, but very, very final.

62958 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ smileymiley, replying to annie, 1, #1111 of 1523 🔗

Genghis Khan & his ilk liked that version too.

62908 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to IMoz, 1, #1112 of 1523 🔗

… the subtitles are also in spanish. Which is less than helpful.

62919 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to RyanM, 2, #1113 of 1523 🔗

Its a good video. You only need to wait for the results. Grim to gruesome in those petri-dishes.

It does help to know the masks have had varioys amounts of use from light to a good shift.

62967 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to RyanM, #1114 of 1523 🔗

youtube has autotranslate functionality, works for most part 😉

62876 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Basics, 9, #1115 of 1523 🔗

Geez three myopic humourless down votes.

I spell it out for you if its too much.

Annie: A guillotine could supply one.
Basics: Happy to wear a mask if needed

Perhaps its been a long day for you.

62888 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Basics, 3, #1116 of 1523 🔗

ok, actually funny, but sometime you do have to spell things out for daft folk like me ;p

62900 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to IMoz, 3, #1117 of 1523 🔗

There’s a bloody great gang of you! Was going to say it must be my joke… but now you say funny I am left confused! I will never funny again – keep us all safe.

Damn skim thumbs downers!

62955 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, #1118 of 1523 🔗

Cool it, friend. We are all a bit uptight just now.

62901 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IMoz, 3, #1119 of 1523 🔗

Sometimes you have to spell it out because the witty comment gets separated by other comments and the joke is lost.

I’ve just had to edit this comment twice because that happened – not that this aims to be witty.

62910 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Basics, 4, #1120 of 1523 🔗

Basic people need to read the thread then they would understand.

I can supply a blunt rusty blade if needed.

63180 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, #1121 of 1523 🔗

Defenestration above Windsor or Edinburgh Castle would be a good idea.

62829 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Mark, 3, #1122 of 1523 🔗

Wonder if anyone got that confrontation (with the throwing of double cream) on film?!

62875 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 2, #1123 of 1523 🔗

I was wondering if she removed the top and the foil.
It all sounds very Daily Vile!

62905 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1124 of 1523 🔗

I wonder if the shop made her pay for it!

62879 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Carrie, 1, #1125 of 1523 🔗

Yes all a little too viral and outlandish for my believing.

62861 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 5, #1126 of 1523 🔗

Well said Mark. They all have blood on their hands on a genocidal scale, and that includes the enablers – the rest of the Cabinet and the ‘doctors’ on, and close to SAGE.

62869 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 10, #1127 of 1523 🔗

The really frustrating thing is that the obvious route of voting for their political rivals doesn’t achieve anything much, because their rivals are all as bad or in most cases worse than they are on this.

We need new parties, stat.

62912 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Mark, 5, #1128 of 1523 🔗

You are completely right Mark. The prospect for a vibrant democracy doesn’t look too good – new parties required plural. How in heck can that be achieved! Different ideologies forming at the same time to overtake the existing. Would be fascinating to see.

62938 ▶▶▶▶▶ Steve, replying to Basics, 2, #1129 of 1523 🔗

Our political system is set up to make it difficult for new parties to appear or gain any seats. So long as we have first past the post and the deposit system it isn’t going to happen.

62947 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Steve, 1, #1130 of 1523 🔗

Yes. The status quo is long set to protrct itself.

62923 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 3, #1131 of 1523 🔗

Agree. The way things are shaping up, however, it is entirely plausible that elections will be cancelled forthwith. Lockdowns, masks are an infringement of civil liberties, as well as being completely pointless. Mandatory CV vaccine, if ‘we’ refuse to engage with the Flu jab this autumn – all bets are off!

62940 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #1132 of 1523 🔗

As I wrote earlier, the plan to mass-vaccinate everyone with the ‘flu’ vaccine this autumn makes me very suspicious that this year’s version will be ‘spiked’ with some nasties – they must realise that persuading a majority of the population to accept a rushed CV-19 vaccine will be difficult, so they need a plan B.. Don’t fall for it!

62972 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Carrie, 4, #1133 of 1523 🔗

No, I won’t be. I don’t think they will spike it, but they are certainly being disingenuous. I am not anti-vaxx, but in the case of a vaccine that will likely be rolled out before it is given regulatory approval, and has not been tested over an extended timeframe, absolutely no chance!

62943 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1134 of 1523 🔗

So. Elections called off. Crowd calls a coup. Crowd goes onto street. Army joins crowd because no one can defend Boris the tosser. Boris gone.

Elections called off. Crowd dislike. Crowd lives with Boris the tosser as king. Queen says wharrabout me! Army ousts king boris. Boris gone.

Elections called off. Then what?

I can’t see their is disipline within the armed forces for privates and nco’s to be on our streets against the people. That’s what the colour revolution does isn’t it?

A quiet coup does seem to be happening. I’m clueless as to the possible outcomes.

62963 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Basics, 2, #1135 of 1523 🔗

Boris has apparently put the army on standby for the autumn I think I read somewhere yesterday. Ominous!

62965 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1136 of 1523 🔗

For what eventuality? Riots when the furlough scheme ends and there is mass unemployment? No deal Brexit?

62974 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Carrie, 1, #1137 of 1523 🔗

I can certainly see riots from pending economic collapse. Not sure how to read the Brexit debate at the moment – it could go either way.

62979 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1138 of 1523 🔗

I agree with seeing riots coming. Could a british PM call off elections with riots then a fresh memory, it would be incendiary.

62977 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1139 of 1523 🔗

I heard there was an Army camp set up in Dumfries just at tge start of lockaway. I never buy that. But! There absolutely have been RAF exercises throughout being explained away in the local press as training. Very unusual to see low hercules? Over the city.

I don’t see theres enough separation in tge personel to blindly follow the orders that would be required.

Yellow vest in France were reporting riot police were speaking other languages while policing in france. The distance of separation is important in such circumstances.

63017 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1140 of 1523 🔗

At the start of the lockdown, they were saying they’d got 20,000 troops on standby.
Recently they were saying they were laying off 20,000 troops. Coincidental magic numbers – or magic troops that never existed in the first place?

62853 coalencanth12, replying to coalencanth12, 9, #1141 of 1523 🔗

Observation locally in the Thames Valley – as I suspected the ‘ethnic*’ coffee shops and takeouts aren’t enforcing this, although I believe the Polish shops are.

Enjoying reading everyone’s comments, I’ve been a bit quiet lately as I’m trying to get my team back to work under ‘level 3 conditions’…

** I hope this doesn’t offend anyone!!

62890 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to coalencanth12, 11, #1142 of 1523 🔗

I’ve heard anecdotally here in Glasgow that in Asian mini markets, takeaways etc the face mask rules are bring largely ignored, with full approval of the owners/management. If things become unpleasant at the big supermarkets, it’s good to know that you can always get a friendly welcome, without mask, at your local Asian food shop.

62925 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Gillian, 6, #1143 of 1523 🔗

Same in Edinburgh Gillian as remarked earlier. Not just Food shops but other places too. A very nice attitude to diktat without sound basis. I would agree too that these shops deserve support away from shops with the oppressive atmosphere.

63029 ▶▶ Julian, replying to coalencanth12, 7, #1144 of 1523 🔗

Was in a Turkish restaurant the other night, group of youngish Turkish men celebrating a birthday, lots of hugs and handshakes, talking loudly close to one another, sure the virus doesn’t bother them one bit.

62856 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 25, #1145 of 1523 🔗

I hereby pledge I will never vote Tory again.

62871 ▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to Barney McGrew, 19, #1146 of 1523 🔗

And I will never vote Tory OR Labour again!

62873 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Harry hopkins, 7, #1147 of 1523 🔗

That’s more like it, I think.

62896 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, 15, #1148 of 1523 🔗

Raving Loony Party would be a more sensible choice next time round.

62903 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Cheezilla, 11, #1149 of 1523 🔗

Compared to the current government, the monster Ravin Loony party look positively sane!

62935 ▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Harry hopkins, 7, #1150 of 1523 🔗

I currently have 6 options in Germany.
None is acceptable to me anymore.
For good.

62945 ▶▶ annie, replying to Barney McGrew, 6, #1151 of 1523 🔗

What the heck CAN we vote for?
The Party for Real People maybe?

63025 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to annie, 3, #1152 of 1523 🔗

SDP seem sound-ish, if you’re socially conservative and into nation states. They are a bit more socialist economically. I’ve not looked recently but they didn’t have much to say on lockdown. Maybe worth a look, although Rod Liddle is involved who I used to think had some sense until he came out with his nonsense about “not every country in the world can have go this wrong”.

62983 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Barney McGrew, 6, #1153 of 1523 🔗

I never did, never would, and never will.

But where the f.’s *any* opposition – one half of the democratic equation?

I’ve heard of and seen creepy compliance – but this is beyond belief.

63075 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to RickH, 3, #1154 of 1523 🔗

Yes I’ve never been keen on tories, for reasons even their supporters now must be seeing – that by and large tory mps are a bunch of self serving useless twats.

However, I am totally homeless now, politically, lib dems and Labour a waste of space, I actually can’t work out the point in either of them anymore. and that’s our lot. I don’t count anything farage is involved in as an actual party, given he’ll fuck off the moment someone waves a cheque in his vague direction (and he’s a cunt) .

62859 GetaGrip, replying to GetaGrip, 27, #1155 of 1523 🔗

Scotland calling. Chin up folks!

Today being a bit more surreal than usual.
It started with being shouted at for going into a Londis, which only allows 2 people in at a time. I was the 3rd. Big shop, couldn’t even see the other humans. Go figure.

At work I had some occupational medical examinations booked. Being compliant with the PH Scotland guidance, I’m in a mask, gloves and a plastic bin-bag. The client gets gloves and a mask. The first one’s gloves kept splitting when he held a (single-use disposable straight to landfill) pen, so we abandoned that.
The next one was a bit of a mumbler, so the mask had to go, in case I missed some safety-critical point in his medical history and passed him fit to kill a family of four in his Very Large Vehicle.
Next one, we had to take a blood test.
It’s a ‘splash-risk’ procedure, so on goes my face-visor. That kept slipping down because I was wearing a bin bag and sweating like Sturgeon during an enquiry on Covid nursing-home deaths.
So, despite having a reputation for getting blood out of a stone, I was reduced to being a can’t-see sh*t kack-hand. 3 attempts to hit the vein. Poor sod.
The next one left with a Fit certificate with a wrong date typo on it, due to my sweaty gloved fingers malfunctiong. He popped back later to collect a corrected version in a chatty encounter, in which both of us wore nothing except our normal clothes and faces.
What a bloody pantomime…
On the way home I called at Tesco, (after popping back to the car for the forgotten mask of course) – have to conform because my Tesco still has a Gauleiter on the door.

For the second time today I got shouted at. This time for being ‘too close!’ to a fat woman at the till. My pointing out that her BMI in excess of 40 conferring a Covid-risk age of 10 additional years to her chronological age was game-set-and-match to my being within a few feet of her, was not, umm, well received.

Welcome to the UK July 2020. The ‘U’ stands for ‘Unhinged’
Home now to take the edge off with a large glass of Cab Sav, thank God.

62874 ▶▶ RickH, replying to GetaGrip, 6, #1156 of 1523 🔗

A brilliant comedic piss-take.

62862 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #1157 of 1523 🔗

Sorry if this has already been flagged up.
Do watch today’s UK Column broadcast. The first bit about masks had me laughing out loud several times.

https://www.ukcolumn.org/ukcolumn-news/uk-column-news-24th-july-2020

62922 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1158 of 1523 🔗

That was pretty funny actually Mike and Patrick were really cracking up, never seen that before really.

62990 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 2, #1159 of 1523 🔗

Friday’s Column is always full of dry humour but today’s was a cracker.

62964 ▶▶ Howie59, replying to Cheezilla, 8, #1160 of 1523 🔗

A good episode today. Patrick is always good value.

I was a bit puzzled when they referenced Sherelle Jacobs column and commented that it was the first bit of resistance from her to the MSM narrative. Sherelle has pushed a pretty consistent line against this nonsense for months now in her Thursday morning column, often to her own detriment as I have gradually seen her column pushed down the pecking order these last few weeks.

62986 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Howie59, 7, #1161 of 1523 🔗

Yes, and some pretty unpleasant comments underneath her articles from the attack dogs. She never pulls her punches and is extremely perceptive.

63177 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1162 of 1523 🔗

About the most perceptive piece I’ve read during all of this fiasco was by Ms Jacobs way back on 26 March, at the start of the lockdown.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/03/26/lockdown-wests-berlin-wall-moment-elite-managerialism-collapses/

The last five paragraphs struck me then, and even more so now. It’s as if this is a culture fight to the death.

Mrs TJN is aware that I’m in awe of the lovely Ms Jacobs, but doesn’t seem too worried or jealous. (I’m also in awe of Lionel Shriver, but would be too petrified to meet or cross her.)

Yes, Ms Jacobs is astonishingly perceptive. Her writing is a bit hyperbolic at times, but I read that as a sign of literary ambition. She’s the Telegraph’s asset, not the other way around.

62870 RickH, 14, #1163 of 1523 🔗

Sampling report :

Had to drive down to the Drop-In Centre for an antibiotic, as the GP surgery now guarded by a fence of non-service (watch out for ‘reshaping’ of health services near you)

I did wear a mask to go in – I’m deliberately not making a fuss in health locations. But I did remark to the Nurse/Guardian at the entrance that the virus had, essentially disappeared.

Which provoked a haughty “I can assure you that it hasn’t” – despite all evidence to the contrary – showing how particular situations + an infusion of propaganda doesn’t equal insight or wider grasp, even in the professions involved.

The up-side was that outside – on pavements and outside pubs, there was no sign of a growth in mask wearing prompted by the shop idiocy. There is a well of scepticism to be tapped into – I hope, when people clock the sheer barmy idiocy of the inconsistent regulations

62880 Lockdown Truth, 22, #1164 of 1523 🔗

Mandatory face masks is a bit like this
comment image /v1/fill/w_740,h_689,al_c,q_90,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/f90459_bdae92e72f88455fbbfb798fbe198492~mv2.webp

62881 Steve, replying to Steve, 27, #1165 of 1523 🔗

So some good news and some bad. Went to the local co-op and the local small Asda, didn’t wear a mask, staff clearly weren’t bothered at all. No one challenged me or even looked at me funny. All as normal, except they were wearing masks. Bad news though, I was the only non-conformist in either store at around 4-5pm.

Slightly more optimistic though my wife has just returned from the same Asda to say that the rebels were out in force at 8.30pm, with hardly any mask wearing in evidence.

62884 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Steve, 4, #1166 of 1523 🔗

Promising… What part of the country are you in?

62892 ▶▶▶ Steve, replying to Lockdown Truth, 5, #1167 of 1523 🔗

Lancashire

62907 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Steve, 3, #1168 of 1523 🔗

Thanks

62932 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Steve, 5, #1169 of 1523 🔗

Give them some ecky-thump!

62886 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Steve, 9, #1170 of 1523 🔗

That is good news critical mass sorely needed in shops.

62904 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Steve, 11, #1171 of 1523 🔗

Virus goes to bed at 8pm. Didn’t you get the memo? It’s the science!

62926 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Steve, 6, #1172 of 1523 🔗

The virus goes to bed when Celebrity Master Chef starts on BBC1

62882 Edward, replying to Edward, 26, #1173 of 1523 🔗

Good and bad day for me today. Decided to escape Freaky Friday with a day trip to Matlock Bath. It wasn’t all eating and drinking, but Tucker’s Fish & Chips were good, socially distanced queue but no masks. Likewise the Midland Hotel for a pint, voluntary hand sanitiser and track & trace but nobody bothering much, lots of tables to sit outside in the sun, quite busy but no problem finding a table. Mad Hatter tea rooms OK, staff masked but friendly, most tables pre-booked but one was available, a book to write name & phone number for T&T. All three places happy to accept cash. Observations on people going into general shops: they put on their masks, and as soon as they come out they either lower it to their chin, dangle it from fingers, or shove it in their pocket. Exactly the behaviour which was said 4 months ago to be why general mask wearing by the public is useless or harmful. A lot of the “hobby business” shops (antiques etc) closed, maybe they only open on Saturday & Sunday or may never reopen.
Email from Nottingham Contemporary gallery “welcoming me back” on 4 August. My reply: “You may well be looking forward to welcoming me back on 4 August, but I have to tell you now that I will not be visiting as long as I am required to inhibit my breathing and potentially damage my health by covering my face.” This is despite museums & galleries NOT being in the list of places where face coverings are mandated. Tate galleries also seem to be moving in that direction; since I have a membership with them my message to them will be longer and stronger.

62931 ▶▶ annie, replying to Edward, 5, #1174 of 1523 🔗

Afraid you’ll infect the paintings, are they?

62915 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 11, #1175 of 1523 🔗

Bottled going to the supermarkets today but am pleased to say Booze Buster was chocka with not a mask in sight

62918 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Tom Blackburn, 12, #1176 of 1523 🔗

I was nervous but just went for it. Waved lanyard and not one bit of agro. Felt so good and spoke to two who asked where I got it, complete sceptics and really refreshing conversations

62921 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Sarigan, 6, #1177 of 1523 🔗

It feels good. I knew most of the people around here wouldn’t tolerate it

63006 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Sarigan, 7, #1178 of 1523 🔗

Some on here unfortunately will tell you that wearing a lanyard makes you part of the problem. Apparently the only authentic resistance is brazening it out. I don’t want to wear a mask and I am entitled to claim an exemption. I don’t need the stress of my occasional trip to Sainsbury’s ending in being abused on social media. If that makes me some sort of collaborator in the eyes of some hardline sceptics, so be it. This is a tight knit community and I have to live in it!

63030 ▶▶▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 15, #1179 of 1523 🔗

Personally, I feel it is of the upmost importance that we do not wear the mask. For those who choose to wear a lanyard, fine and for those who choose to simply say that they are not going to wear a mask, also fine. I just think being mask/muzzle free is key here; either path one chooses.

63051 ▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1180 of 1523 🔗

Is tight knit a euphemism for intolerant and conformist?

63043 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Sarigan, 8, #1181 of 1523 🔗

“I was nervous”.. what were you going to do? Rob the place or buy a loaf and some milk?

I’ve been there- we all have – the walk across a car park with nerves and tunnel vision as you – go into a shop – ffs and all the other **&€£%/$# rest!

This “I was made to feel nervous” is, for me, up there just under the the policies of manslaughter and abuse enabling. This needless humiliation, the oppression that stops us living peacefully. That mental assault that changes our routines and keeps us away from shops we would freely otherwise go to

Biker has it right of course to not care and carry on. Yes.

But people feeling nervous for the crime of going into a shop is one of the forgivables amongst all this.

62916 Sam Vimes, 2, #1182 of 1523 🔗

It’s feeling good, innit?

62924 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 14, #1183 of 1523 🔗

Going to the shops tomorrow and mentally rehearsing my response to any abusive comments to my maskless countenance. Not that I expect them mind you but it’s always best to be prepared. I want to let any rude aggressor know exactly how I feel in a pithy, direct way but with courtesy and good manners. So it will be something along these lines:

‘My parents brought me up to be considerate, kind, thoughtful to others and never to use bad language—–which is just as well otherwise I would tell you to piss off!’ (may substitute the F word depending on how far my dander is up).

62960 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Harry hopkins, 7, #1184 of 1523 🔗

You are assaulting me. I give you warning that if you do not remove your hand, I will defend myself physically, Thank You (always worth being polite).

62985 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #1185 of 1523 🔗

They are encouraged to social distance but are not allowed to touch you anyway. Only the police can do that.

62996 ▶▶ matt, replying to Harry hopkins, 6, #1186 of 1523 🔗

“If you think wearing a mask makes a difference, I have a bridge I’d like to sell you.”

63083 ▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to Harry hopkins, 9, #1187 of 1523 🔗

“Thank you for reminding me of the requirement for wearing a mask but I was already aware of it. The matter has been quite widely publicised lately. The fact that, at this time, I am still not wearing a mask should tell you one of two things, viz .: I have a legitimate medical condition which exempts me from it, or I just have no inclination to subject myself to tyrannical bullshit whether administered by the government or your own good person. Obviously, in my case, it is the former.”

62976 ▶▶ RickH, replying to kbeanie, #1189 of 1523 🔗

Excellent reference.

62980 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to kbeanie, #1190 of 1523 🔗

Good article, thanks!

62948 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 8, #1191 of 1523 🔗

Neil Oliver’s excellent analysis about how humans have evolved to communicate using their entire face and body and how muzzling presents a problem:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk0u0XFki5g

62969 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Bart Simpson, 10, #1192 of 1523 🔗

100% agree. With your comment without seeing the link. It is essential in society to see facial expression. The physcologists who need to be sectioned for not speaking out all know this is true. It wont take long before levels of empathy drop off and people start to look more and more inward.

62989 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Basics, 5, #1193 of 1523 🔗

Exactly. This brings us back to all those years ago when Jack Straw said that the niqab was a barrier to communication and he was right, funny how we’re now returning to this debate but this time with muzzles.

63031 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #1194 of 1523 🔗

We know its wrong. You can point to all of history and say – look ma’ no masks!

Within the niqab debate was the idea of safety. A concealed identity is more likely to cause crime was said. Now I think its been broadly accepted that the religioys asspects have be assimilated. Because people of any faith tend largely to have respect for others. In general terms this is good even though I have my own misgivings. I do respect other cultures – and expect a reciprocal respect towards me.

But now we are suddenly in a place where some shops are only allowing concealed identities into their businesses. Should I feel sorry for them if they suffer shoplifting? On balance I find the support for the mask such a fundamental breach of decency I somehow have little sympathy for businesses who seem for all the world like turkeys voting for Christmas.

I don’t mean to say they should expect crime and good for the criminals. Somehow my empathy for hard working masked up busniesses is deminished.

We have a culture to protect here.

63052 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, 10, #1195 of 1523 🔗

Burqas, niqabs etc are all designed to turn the wearers into almost invisible unindividualised objects. They are a symbol of women as men’s property.

Hence, face coverings are one of the driving forces behind my passionate refusal to signify that I am under government control.

63063 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1196 of 1523 🔗

Yes its a good point and those are part of my misgivings, yet it’s is a cultural phenomenon that people are entitled to just as I am entitled not to partake of any such thing. The sexism inherent is a battle for the culture to resolve.

I wanted to make a distinction between cultural and crime. You’ve rightly added the dehumanising principle which is a reason for my own outrage at these laws.

63132 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1197 of 1523 🔗

Makes me wonder what strict Muslim males think about it, Centuries if obliterating their women’s faces and suddenly, it’s their own.

63101 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Basics, #1198 of 1523 🔗

That’s a good point and its funny how banks and post offices are included in the list where they have been exempt for decades now because of security reasons.

Ite funny how that’s gone out of the window now.

63133 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Bart Simpson, #1199 of 1523 🔗

Wait till they get robbed.

63183 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, 2, #1200 of 1523 🔗

I came across a comment somewhere along those lines – a spate of robberies will force businesses and banks to lobby the government for a U turn.

62956 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 11, #1201 of 1523 🔗

Day 2 of back to work:

More dead today than yesterday (less visitors and people going into the shop), had visitors coming in with muzzles but always relieved when we told them that its not necessary when visiting gallery. One old couple were really, really relieved especially as they looked worse for wear.

Gift shop asking if customers had muzzles, one family refused to go in before staff member had a chance to tell them that they could go in if they’re medically exempt.

62962 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Bart Simpson, 12, #1202 of 1523 🔗

The gift shop really highlights the sheer irrationality of it: you can sit in a pub or a restaurant and talk and expel this “terrible” thing, but when you got into a shop for at most 5–10 minutes, not wearing a mask is a grave offence!

62971 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to IMoz, 7, #1203 of 1523 🔗

How naive! You’re looking for logic and sense 🙂

62973 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to RickH, 7, #1204 of 1523 🔗

I knew I was going wrong somewhere! :p

62988 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to IMoz, 13, #1205 of 1523 🔗

It is agree and I think that’s why people are staying away from the shops because its insane and makes shopping even more unpleasant than it is.

63004 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Bart Simpson, 3, #1206 of 1523 🔗

I’ve been to Sainsbury’s and Waitrose today; both had far fewer shoppers than yesterday at the same time, maybe it’s Friday, or opportunistic shoppers went away…

63107 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to IMoz, 6, #1207 of 1523 🔗

Do not look for any sense from government edicts on Covid-19. They should be ignored at all times.

62975 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #1208 of 1523 🔗

This is what is needed, a bit of friendly advice, hopefully this family will tell others you can got to xyz, if you are medically exempt 😉

Good on your gift shop people for offering this advice.

62984 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #1209 of 1523 🔗

I’m in the visitor services side – the gallery so we’re not covered in the guidance but the gift shop is so people muzzle up.

The staff in the gift shop have been told not to challenge people who are not wearing a muzzle but the vast majority comply and its not like we’re swamped with people.

63108 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Bart Simpson, #1210 of 1523 🔗

Hmmmm.

62991 RDawg, replying to RDawg, 31, #1211 of 1523 🔗

Remember a time when you could go to a busy pub/bar and chat to random people? When you could watch live music? Dance like an idiot? Rub shoulders with sweaty strangers and have random conversations with new people, without a care in the world? How are we supposed to make new friends now?

63002 ▶▶ Paul, replying to RDawg, 8, #1212 of 1523 🔗

I remember that RDawg,it seems so long ago,when was it ?,oh yes,February.Oh for time travel to be possible.

63010 ▶▶ Julian, replying to RDawg, 10, #1213 of 1523 🔗

The people driving this probably wouldn’t understand what you’re on about

Their loss

63104 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to RDawg, #1214 of 1523 🔗

All of that will never happen again, sad but true.

63364 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to RDawg, #1215 of 1523 🔗

Remember a time when you could go to a busy pub/bar and chat to random people? Rub shoulders with sweaty strangers and have random conversations with new people, without a care in the world?

Err, yeah, yesterday. But I don’t remember that much due to the beers. Hope to repeat today. 🙂

You trying hard enough, Dawg ? 🙂

62993 Mark, replying to Mark, 45, #1216 of 1523 🔗

We have clear evidence that the main reason this new coronavirus wasn’t any more significant in its effects than past cold/flu bugs is that we have immune systems that were primed by previous similar infections to deal with it. Wearing masks and other distancing measures makes us collectively less able to deal effectively with future new viruses and bugs.

It turns out that “common sense” would have been a much better guide to behaviour than all the scaremongering nonsense put about by the selected “experts” driving the panic response, who failed to properly take account of this crucial factor and consequently led us into a catastrophic overreaction.

But the Prime Minister and members of the government have no excuse for having allowed themselves to be herded into this monstrous calamity. A mere modicum of common sense and of moral courage would have allowed them to stand against it. And many of their policies have been gratuitously additionally harmful, such as the latest evil nonsense of compulsory mask wearing by law.

“Social distancing” and mask wearing attacks the very thing – regular exposure to endemic viruses – that has protected us from this new disease, and that will protect us from future new diseases. The government’s actions are not just economically, socially and culturally harmful, they are directly counterproductive in terms of dealing with diseases.

Never forget. Never forgive.

63018 ▶▶ Edna, replying to Mark, 3, #1217 of 1523 🔗

Hear hear.

63066 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Mark, 4, #1218 of 1523 🔗

Exactly how I feel. It’s herd mentality instead of of herd immunity

63185 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Mark, 1, #1219 of 1523 🔗

Well said. This is junk science and is doing more harm than good. Its now easy to believe why there are conspiracy theories going about that antisocial distancing and mask wearing are being mandated to weaken the immune system so come winter they can dress up an ordinary flu season as the “second wave”

63357 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark, 1, #1220 of 1523 🔗

Agree re not forgiving or forgetting, Mark. But ‘herded’ ?

It is not about a virus.
It is a planned global reset.
Effected by a cleverly executed psy-op.

I do think to defeat/resist/overturn this bollocks we need to start from an accurate viewpoint.

62994 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 6, #1221 of 1523 🔗

Birmingham Live: ‘Taking the p***’ – Disabled teen subjected to tirade of abuse on train for not wearing face mask.
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/uk-news/taking-p-disabled-teen-subjected-18660405

62999 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Tom Blackburn, 25, #1222 of 1523 🔗

A lot of people in this country have become absolute bastards,shame on them all,I hope the evil woman that abused the teenager gets her just desserts one day.
Take note Johnson and all you spineless,useless wasters that make up parliament,this is what you have done to us and the nation,you deserve everything bad I hope is coming to you all.

63046 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #1223 of 1523 🔗

That must have felt like a very long train journey. Poor kid!

63178 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1224 of 1523 🔗

and i can see more of that happenings as ignorant self righteous virtue signalling gobshites (to use a word from this woman”s own locality ) decide to take action about perceived breaches. Hope she gets her comeuppance
I wonder if this will feature on BBC? A BAME disabled person being abused for not correctly wearing a mask. What a dilemma it is for the BBC wokeness department

63005 Nessimmersion, replying to Nessimmersion, 16, #1225 of 1523 🔗

BBC 10 o clock news just featured a succession of randomly selected interviewees all preaching the govt line, could have been N Korea for all the independence of thought.
Kuennsberg doing her remainer, wouldn’t lockdown have been better in January for at least a year act.
Then finally that condescending smug git Sopel telling us how Trump has got everything wrong and has reversed himself on everything he said.

The Daily North Korea is getting visibly worse and more biased by the day.

63036 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Nessimmersion, 8, #1226 of 1523 🔗

Sopel is so anti-Trump it’s laughable. I honestly don’t know how he gets away with it, even at the BBC.

63056 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tenchy, 4, #1227 of 1523 🔗

True. Completely true. And he looks as mean as a dog as he speaks his zero charm speeches into the homes of the nation. A very unpleasant little man indeed.

63351 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Basics, #1228 of 1523 🔗

Do people who continue to let tv into their living rooms deserve all they get ? Discuss …

63103 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Tenchy, 2, #1229 of 1523 🔗

I know why.

63174 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #1230 of 1523 🔗

i think you should have put “randomly” in quotes. Without them readers might actually think the interviewees were selected at random. Most of us know that there is nothing random about the people that BBC show answering questions. We dont know how many interviews were discontinued and deleted if the “correct” comment was not forthcoming.

63007 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #1231 of 1523 🔗

Sky news are running a small report about Mask compliance on its first day in England. Essentially compliance hangs in the balance – the report says no active policing will happen. A small independent shop saying they will keep people out of their shop who don’t wear a mask, adding they will lose business but it is right to do.

One classic vox pop has a masked shopper say “i think it’s a shame in Britain…[nervous stutter]… that people dont like being dictated too”. Made me wonder if her words were her own, easy to dub if you cannot see mouth.

Brings back memories of BBC Panorama’s Saving Syria’s Children. The programme had a British doctor (daughter of a diplomat) say something in the middle of an emergency response to a chemical attack. She was wearing a mask. It was later proved a word was changed in post production to turn it into a Napalm attack.

https://youtu.be/2wtt4LbWl84 for a very interesting exposé.

63011 ▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 22, #1232 of 1523 🔗

‘It’s a shame that people don’t like being dictated to.’

There speaks the very quintessence of sheepleness.

63026 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to annie, 16, #1233 of 1523 🔗

It’s very odd that we’ve fought all these wars and wasted billions of pounds over the last 40 years against dictators like Amin, Gadafi, Hussein, Assad, etc because they dictate to their populations, but we ourselves should be being dictated too by our leaders and should follow everything they say.

People are stupid!

63032 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to JohnB, 11, #1234 of 1523 🔗

I listened to some of Mike Pompeo’s speech the other day, when he was over here. He was talking about China, and the infringements of civil liberties, punishments of minorities etc. For a while, you could have believed it was UK 2020 he was referring to.

63131 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1235 of 1523 🔗

Aargh, no, surely China can’t be as bad as that.

63041 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to annie, 8, #1236 of 1523 🔗

It’s a shame that people don’t like being dictated to.
That is a scarily nonsensical statement!

63349 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to annie, #1237 of 1523 🔗

Yep. I see it as a very unpleasant twisted sexuality.

(Dr John. Ho ho.).

63040 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to richard riewer, 1, #1239 of 1523 🔗

I suspect it’s a bit early for that!

63153 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to richard riewer, 6, #1240 of 1523 🔗

The wife and I now constantly remark about how different life used to be when we see old clips like that.

I was watching the Stones in 2013 at Hyde Park the other day, and it shows just how much life has changed in a very short time. The obvious things is that the crowd are all in close proximity to each other without a care in the world. But some of the video backdrops they show might be construed as celebrating the differences between the sexes, heaven forbid. People of all skin colours are mixing together as though race doesn’t matter – shocking. But most of all, the band is a bunch of blokes and they don’t feel the need to apologise for that.

63158 ▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #1241 of 1523 🔗

Is that the concert during which Mick Jagger made the joke about Boris in a treehouse? He also quoted sonnet 18:

“And summer’s lease hath all too short a date”

I may watch that with a glass of something this evening, what we have lost but will have again.

63019 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 27, #1243 of 1523 🔗

An observation, and an associated request.

As a mother of two right-leaning sons, I can attest to much verbal abuse at school from many girls and female teachers, including one who actually called my elder son a misogynist in a class where he was the only boy. The conditioning of girls starts early in schools – it tends not to work as well on the boys. It was very apparent during the Brexit debate, Climate Change debate – note the number of women involved with the Extinction Rebellion protests last year, and their Joan of Arc, St Greta. The psych-ops seeks to control the girls/women assuming they will then work on their men. They have worked on women with ‘designer masks’ from the likes of Mrs Cameron. Hell, we even have a woman in one of the papers today calling mask wearing ‘liberating’.

I know not all of the men on here have wives/partners who share our scepticism. It really is going to need you out and about without masks to deter the mask nazis. Women, young and old, are significantly less likely to challenge men who are not wearing a mask than another woman. Older women will be especially unpleasant to teenagers, boys and girls alike. We need your help!

63137 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 8, #1244 of 1523 🔗

My observation yesterday is that more women than men wore masks and more Working Bloke men were not wearing.

63327 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to karenovirus, 1, #1245 of 1523 🔗

Yes I think there is a gender and class element to this. A lot of working class men think its bollocks…they dont worry about being ostracised at the dinner parties and women sadly seem to accept authoritarianism more readily. Lots of wonderful women on here though thank goodness!! I am middle class but think its all bollocks too which makes me very much an outcast among my peers but stuff them.

63202 ▶▶ matt, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1246 of 1523 🔗

Interesting. My wife is sceptical, but in a passive sort of way and possibly partly because she’s had more sceptic propaganda from me than she’s heard otherwise from MSM. She conceded immediately to the mask thing though. Doesn’t much like them, but doesn’t even think twice about wearing them.

63333 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to matt, #1247 of 1523 🔗

My partner was a lockdown supporter at first and we had many rows about it. She accused me ,as usual ,of being a contrarian ,a member of the awkward squad etc. She seems very willing to believe the BBC etc and just does not seem to see propaganda even when its very much in your face. She also believed all the nonsense about Johnson selling the NHS to trump (I wish lol) and that Nissan would leave the UK if we had Brexit (they actually closed the Barcelona plant not the Sunderland one lol). She does not go with the herd on some issues though so there is some hope but her family are very ‘go with the flow’ so its a constant battle. Christmas is always very entertaining haha. Thankfully she is much more sceptical than she was about lockdown but again accepted the mask thing without question. Happy days!

63362 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1248 of 1523 🔗

It’s female socialisation too though – women are stuck in compassion against their own interests, as if you look at the social and economic harms (partic around school closures) it hits women and kids harder. It’s very frustrating, but it seems the most affluent women, who are the least affected who seem to think lockdown is all fairy cakes and fuzzy felt and zoom yoga. And yet we’ve also had a quadrupling of domestic violence, child abuse, and a doubling of domestic violence murders. It’s maddening that most women can’t see lockdown is a disaster, because they are so well trained to be ‘kind’.

63022 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 8, #1249 of 1523 🔗

Is this the plan, divide the country and the people.

What is our role, are we a new class or a new tribe to be marginalised, to be attacked to be forgotten.

How do we fight, how do we win.

63024 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to stefarm, 14, #1250 of 1523 🔗

They are deliberately setting citizens against each other. Pure evil.

63027 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #1251 of 1523 🔗

Is it deliberate, do they think we deserve it?

63028 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to stefarm, 6, #1252 of 1523 🔗

If we are so busy fighting each other we will leave them alone!

63135 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1253 of 1523 🔗

Not working so far, I had 5 maskless retail encounters on Maskup Friday, had no problems.

63037 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to stefarm, 3, #1254 of 1523 🔗

They don’t think anything – they just don’t care.

63033 ▶▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1255 of 1523 🔗

This is happening on a massive scale. It is pure, absolute evil.

63034 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 17, #1256 of 1523 🔗

It’s very depressing that Sainsbury’s feels it has to run an announcement on a loop saying “please be kind to our staff and customers. Not everyone is able to wear a face covering”. I think the aggression is not because they think non mask wearers will actually spread anything but it is a repudiation of their religious beliefs. When a mask wearer sees an unmasked face they feel jealous and their own certainty starts to crumble.

63102 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 4, #1257 of 1523 🔗

Southwestern Trains had the same announcement and posters. Its depressing that it has come to this.

63128 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Bart Simpson, 9, #1258 of 1523 🔗

Better thsn an announcement that free faces will be lynched, which is what Matt the Death snd Fetida Dickhead would prefer.

63188 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, 1, #1259 of 1523 🔗

Matt the Death and Fetida Dickhead should be careful what they wish for as they say, what goes around comes around….

63050 ▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 4, #1260 of 1523 🔗

Humanity. Warm Compassion. Patience. Understanding. Communicating. And by being plainly right.

Fear is not a very bright way to fight – where do you have to go for more control but more fear.

Meek is a good way to win. If you look into the orginal meaning of the word. There’s a good deal of strength in our position.

63126 ▶▶ annie, replying to stefarm, 3, #1261 of 1523 🔗

We are a minority. All other minorities have rights.
It is illegal to attack or harass minorities.

63336 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to annie, #1262 of 1523 🔗

Some minorities are more equal than others though.Try being a non left liberal in a school!

63038 Mr Dee, replying to Mr Dee, 14, #1263 of 1523 🔗

Observation today – Aldis in Wrexham. Much busier than it’s been for weeks. I wonder if it’s due to an influx of English from across the border seeking a maskless shopping experience? All welcome of course! The more the merrier.

63039 ▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Mr Dee, 4, #1264 of 1523 🔗

Welcome to Wales one and all!

63044 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Kath Andrews, 3, #1265 of 1523 🔗

Aye, come and breathe and make the merry cash tills ring!
Shop at Mogg’s!

63061 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Kath Andrews, 5, #1266 of 1523 🔗

Just don’t run for the bus or er, read a paper on the train

63125 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mark II, 4, #1267 of 1523 🔗

And above all, do not SING.
It isn’t as though anybody in Wales thought singing was important, after all.

63216 ▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to annie, -1, #1268 of 1523 🔗

My experience hearing Welsh choirs tends to support that!

63341 ▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to annie, #1269 of 1523 🔗

Is that why they banned singing swing low?

63339 ▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Mark II, #1270 of 1523 🔗

No point in running for the bus now as there is no pole at the back to grab hold of! The health and safety brigade got rid of that.

63160 ▶▶ court, replying to Mr Dee, #1271 of 1523 🔗

Down south I nipped over the bridge to Chepstow yesterday to get some supplies and to scope it out. I was surprised to see so many mask wearers compared to England on the Thursday. That’s not comparing apples with apples though.
It was great to grab a items from a few different shops without fear of a nappy nazi having a pop.

I really hope the Welsh first minister keeps up his views on civil liberties.

63045 Gracie Knoll, 6, #1272 of 1523 🔗

PLEASE share this superb Bill Gates video. Summarises the reality behind this psyop while being very funny! (Remember folks, we may be the last repository of humour left in joyless Britain!)

https://youtu.be/ZQcvuftqXFY

63055 nfw, replying to nfw, 10, #1273 of 1523 🔗

So those who deal with the public more often that not, eg The Plod, don’t have to wear masks because …? How very Nazi or KGB of them.

63062 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to nfw, 5, #1274 of 1523 🔗

I live close to a police station, I have not seen anyone at the station wear any form of face covering, at any time since March 2020.

Also I have noticed the emergency ambulance crews who wait for their next call in local supermarket car parks, do not wear face coverings whilst waiting, or when they go into the supermarkets to use facilities.

63129 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #1275 of 1523 🔗

.most policemen sport those trim little beards which would make a mask useless anyway.

63067 ▶▶ Basics, replying to nfw, 5, #1276 of 1523 🔗

These very same people would be hellish spreaders if the ptemise of deadly plague was actual. Track and trace a policemans daily interactions. Wouldn’t take too long to stall a patch. Then multiply for each policeman/woman. It’s better we ignore it. Because if we don’t we might realise something is up.

63348 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Basics, #1277 of 1523 🔗

Especially for the vice squad with their ‘discounts’ for overlooking non compliance with the law!

63057 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1278 of 1523 🔗
63064 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Cheezilla, #1279 of 1523 🔗

Just what we are suffering a load of pooh.

63058 Ivor VeeTwelve, 1, #1280 of 1523 🔗

I’ve been lurking for weeks. First post.

Went into town today. Did some shopping in M&S. I was wearing a bandana pulled up over my mouth. It fell down all the time but nobody seemed bothered. They had nobody checking muzzles or anything like that.

It does seem a bit strange though looking around seeing everyone in their masks. Quite surreal. Like somethings gone wrong with the matrix. I’m waiting for Neo to materialize.

63059 A13, replying to A13, 4, #1281 of 1523 🔗

Can someone please tell me that this is only a joke?
“Gloves may be the next step after masks in the battle against coronavirus.
People in England must wear masks in shops and banks, but a Lords debate raises the question of whether gloves are useful against Covid-19”
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/24/gloves-may-next-step-masks-battle-against-covid-19-infection/

63065 ▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to A13, 13, #1282 of 1523 🔗

Wearing gloves can F£$k off! I read that piece in the Torygiraffe, I genuinely believe it’s more nonsense scaremongering. In my job, my colleagues and I do genuinely need to wear disposable gloves, but only ever to carry out the task in hand, as soon as that is done, throw em away and wash hands. Even after ten minutes – hands are unbearably sweaty – it’s horrible. To wear them for any longer – unimaginable. It’s always confused me – the glove wearing phenomenon throughout this rubbish, how on earth does it help in any way at all, with anything? Utter Bollocks!

63068 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Kath Andrews, 7, #1283 of 1523 🔗

Try those gloves with nails. Even the slightest nail has the fingers going through. Plus who’s got money for gloves? It’s not happening. The story might be a plant to allow behaviour studies. Sound crazy? Well think about what the story actually is about!

63098 ▶▶▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Basics, 14, #1284 of 1523 🔗

Standing back from this, I do genuinely believe that all of this is a test (in those weird early days) – for me, the first fortnight or so, when fear seemed to be prevalent, I couldn’t get the feeling out of my head that this is some kind of stress test. Even in the very beginning, queuing outside my local Tesco metro, I felt like a lab rat. I think we are being pushed and tested and the results, our behaviours are being constantly monitored. I – okay maybe very naively – believe we have the power here – just don’t do it. If your circumstances / situation require a lanyard or other exemption fine…..but just do not comply, just ignore it all.

63106 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Kath Andrews, 4, #1285 of 1523 🔗

I can almost see the PHDs Doctorates and all else rifling through every facet of these times. The effect of the studies alone separated from the causations will change any normal normal we get back to. These is a learning dream which academia will feed off for decades and more.

It’s not organic, you coukd feel it in those early days. In your bones this wasn’t what the sell was. On all fronts – the streets were not up for the Eyam plague. The desperate sell of the media indicated they needed us to believe and had no need for us to understand. The political theatre, well!

Only then did a few serious people’s comments get out and soon the ordinaries person’s experiential knowledge was invariably explained by deep thinking gems of the world with open minds to critically reason to a stronger truth.

How will those PHDs and reseach fellows turn away from learning the ovbious lessons sceptics have being alert to from those first few weeks?

63110 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Basics, 5, #1286 of 1523 🔗

I feel that this – and I am being a bit brave here – but here I go, the HOAX – will be discussed and discussed and discussed (well unless the only woke degree you can do in the future is ‘Golf Studies’ [was a real course in Loughborugh University back in the early 2000s – couldn’t make it up]. This has been coming a long time – Agenda 21 seems pretty pathetic in its infancy – Cardiff is comical – ridiculous and comical yellow (albeit permanent) markings on the ground – the bullshit 2 metre (anti) social distancing – one way markings. Everyone cheerfully ignoring it for now and, sadly, I say for now….

63127 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Kath Andrews, #1287 of 1523 🔗

Notice how the “I wear a mask to save You” crowd cheerfully ignore Pedestrian one way signs whenever they are inconvenienced ?

63201 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Kath Andrews, #1288 of 1523 🔗

Scot public transport are moving to one metre. At tge same time as 40% of passengers on some routes are not wearing masks. The answer? Scot rail do a publucity stunt by putting a giant mask on a train.

All factual, anyone can smiply search, the giant mask is a clinical style. I mention that because we have been deliberatedly told not to wear clinical masks.

So! The future studies of tgese days will be a sifting of lunacy yet it will be on message and revealing the simply revealed truths will need to be unlearned.

With researchs looking out the truth of the matter how can that happen?

63095 ▶▶ Adam, replying to A13, 1, #1289 of 1523 🔗

Nothing would surprise me anymore.

63115 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to A13, 2, #1290 of 1523 🔗

I wish I could tell you yes. Facemasks is a joke. Here we are.

63124 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to A13, #1291 of 1523 🔗

Sudden outbreaks of dermatitis among Sceptics?

63071 DJ Dod, replying to DJ Dod, 14, #1292 of 1523 🔗

Infamy, infamy… Just read an article on the backlog of around 50,000 cancer patients waiting for surgery in Germany. An oncologist comments that: ‘We are seeing more advanced tumors than before the pandemic’. And for those who are a bit slower on the uptake he adds: ‘Because of Corona the tumors have had more time to grow’.
He concludes that ‘…it’s certainly possible that in Germany more people will die indirectly as a result of the Corona measures (i.e. ‘lockdown’) than from the virus itself’.

Read it and weep (if you want to practice your German):

https://www.focus.de/gesundheit/ratgeber/50-000-krebs-ops-verschoben-mediziner-warnt-vor-fatalen-konsequenzen_id_12241754.html

63243 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to DJ Dod, #1293 of 1523 🔗

Thank you.
Sofar I only saw stories about the expected 35000 excess cancer deaths in the UK in the German media.
They are so full of themselves with regard to their handling of the pandemic, that such uncomfortable stories could have an impact.

63072 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 8, #1294 of 1523 🔗

Just saw this on Dick Delingpole’s twitter:
https://twitter.com/i/status/1286349473413771265

I salute this gentleman.

63330 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Barney McGrew, #1295 of 1523 🔗

John Waters, apparently. Very good indeed ..

63077 James Leary #KBF, replying to James Leary #KBF, 6, #1296 of 1523 🔗

FFS

There’s loads of this ‘balanced’ report. My guess is they’re after a licence fee reprieve.

“The BBC’s anti-disinformation team has been investigating false and misleading claims about the health risks of face masks and coverings being shared on social media.
Claim: Masks deprive your body of oxygen
Verdict: False claim“

63088 ▶▶ Basics, replying to James Leary #KBF, 2, #1297 of 1523 🔗

How did the achieve their desired result?

63143 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to James Leary #KBF, 6, #1298 of 1523 🔗

Sounds like they’re setting up a load of straw men. I think I’ve noticed that before: set up nine straw men and knock them down, leaving just one they can’t. They can then argue “90% of all arguments against wearing masks are shown to be false. Therefore, masks are good.” Whereas in fact, you just need one, solitary, argument against masks in order to justify not wearing them.

63169 ▶▶ Bugle, replying to James Leary #KBF, #1299 of 1523 🔗

BBC’s very own Snopes.

63079 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 21, #1300 of 1523 🔗

Spoke at length on Friday to a work colleague about the current situation, where we started in March and where we are now at the end of July.

For an extended period of time we had a sensible adult conversation about cv19, the numbers, what the ordinary numbers would look like, why masks have been introduced now etc. etc.

After all that she said I know someone who is making masks if you want some cheap.

Cheesus wept. People have been brain washed.

63140 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Dave #KBF, 8, #1301 of 1523 🔗

Sounds like a good business to be in since they don’t have any regulations to meet!

63082 Adam, replying to Adam, 31, #1302 of 1523 🔗

Just got in from the alehouse about an hour ago. Couple of masked morons came in, ordered their drinks, then took them outside. (My local does not seem to be abiding by the silliness, in spite of my expectation that they would.) Anyway, later on in the evening, the barmaid went outside to collect glasses, and came back with disguarded masks that these pair had been breathing into for fuck knows how long and put them on the bar along with the glasses. I thought the masked morons constantly fiddling with their masks in shops was disgusting enough, but that truly was vile. To my mind, it just reinforces my opinion that people have not obeyed these measures to ‘save others’, but to save their own sorry arses! Otherwise, these people would have considerately observed proper infection controls and disposed of their masks properly in the first place, instead of leaving their filthy rags to infect someone else. Arsewipes!!!

63123 ▶▶ annie, replying to Adam, 13, #1303 of 1523 🔗

NOBODY does it for anybody else’s sake. But the pretence of doing so allows them to abuse the free-faced with what I would call a clear conscience, if I thought zombies had a conscience.

63420 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to annie, #1304 of 1523 🔗

Whether its to save themselves from the virus or to virtue signal (in the case of the young) its still ultimately for themselves. Bullshitters.

63141 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Adam, 7, #1305 of 1523 🔗

A very telling observation. Yes, the discarded mask is a truly disgusting thing.

63142 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Adam, 4, #1306 of 1523 🔗

I hope the barmaid was wearing gloves when she picked them up.

63084 Basics, replying to Basics, 4, #1307 of 1523 🔗

Sky news
Yougov poll.
Will you have a covid19 (yes covid not corona) vaccine should one become available?
15% no ever
15% maybe not sure
70% yes certainly
Sky quoted ‘scientists’ say 70% of tge population will need a vaccine in order for it to work. Strange since they don’t yet have a vaccine to know how it will work. Sky ended by saying a lot of “convincing” will need to be done.

63112 ▶▶ Mark B, replying to Basics, 6, #1308 of 1523 🔗

So if they need 70% of the population to be vaccinated and 70% of people say they will take the vaccine we are ok then?

63193 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Mark B, 2, #1309 of 1523 🔗

That was the gist of the report… but despite the number reflecting 30% would be fine with no vaccine they made it clear a large campaign is coming to convert the 30%. To me this sounded as though the stated 70% of people are not in the bank. Perhaps tgey fear some of the 70% may convert the other way when they realise tge vaccine will not be correctly (reasonably) tested.

63207 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Mark B, 5, #1310 of 1523 🔗

It’s just a poll!

And how many were virtue-signallers giving the ‘easy’ answer? And how carefully selected were the people giving answers? And how neutral was the question asked?

63291 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Mark B, 1, #1311 of 1523 🔗

They always have a play off words with these ‘required’ percentages that will need to be vaccinated to be ‘effective’.

Either the vaccine works (protect the vaccinated person) or it doesn’t protect the person. The people without vaccinations depend on their immune systems to fight the virus should they get infected.

63241 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Basics, 5, #1312 of 1523 🔗

In March and early April, I would have been among the 70% and considered (autism) anti-vaxxers ‘nuts’.
After the handling of the issues by governments, ‘science’, media&co and the defamation, ignorance and censoring of any criticism rather than engaging with it constructively, and after having learned more about the risks of those particular vaccines, I am now completely opposed to mandatory vaccinations and firmly in the: ‘Definetley not now, maybe in 10 years’ camp.

63297 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Jay Berger, #1313 of 1523 🔗

In March I would have wrapped a t’shirt over my face if they’d told me it would save me from the Covid

63322 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jay Berger, 1, #1314 of 1523 🔗

Maybe the whistleblower from the CDC who confirmed MMR does seem to increase autism rates will tip you all the way over to the darkside, Jay ? 🙂

His name was Thompson, I think. Might be getting hard to find on the web now, of course.

63264 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, 4, #1315 of 1523 🔗

Well let these fools have the vaccine and then hopefully we will still have the ability to sit back and watch as they become infertile, develop wierd cancers, neurological problems, birth defects and need to be admitted to ICU when they catch a common cold. See how keen they are then on the vaccine.

63100 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #1316 of 1523 🔗

First person fined in Scotland for refusing to wear a face covering – in a Jedburgh shop
The first person has been fined for not wearing a face covering in Scotland.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/first-person-fined-scotland-refusing-wear-face-covering-jedburgh-shop-2923211

I’m unable to read beyond the sub. The fine is £60 but keep in mind tgat Children as young as 6 (six) are required by law so that equates to a lot of pocket money.

63122 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basics, 5, #1317 of 1523 🔗

I don’t think under 18s can be fined, the Police found that out the hard way at the start of lockdown.

63187 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to karenovirus, #1318 of 1523 🔗

I think you are morally right. But technically I have no reason to think we are not all subject to the fine. Certainly no message has reached me.

63240 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basics, #1319 of 1523 🔗

Didn’t they have to unfine teenagers who fell foul of lockdown regs ?

63259 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to karenovirus, #1320 of 1523 🔗

No idea

63299 ▶▶▶▶▶ DressageRider, replying to karenovirus, #1321 of 1523 🔗

Yes, that’s what I remember too.

63285 ▶▶ Edna, replying to Basics, 2, #1322 of 1523 🔗

In England, the Face Covering law says you have to be over 18:

Fixed penalty notices

7.—(1) An authorised person may issue a fixed penalty notice to anyone that the authorisedperson reasonably believes—

(a)

has committed an offence under these Regulations, and

(b)

is aged 18 or over.

63289 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Edna, 1, #1323 of 1523 🔗

Thanks Edna !

63109 Sue Lundie, #1324 of 1523 🔗

And now it’s gloves on the list. Has Boris got a death wish for the Tories, because I am rapidly running out of tolerance and charity?

63111 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 14, #1325 of 1523 🔗

For those who don’t wish to muzzle their mouths on government order but don’t wish to provoke confrontation may I suggest the mask under the chin gambit. Worked for me today and may encourage others not to mask their faces.

63284 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to OKUK, 3, #1326 of 1523 🔗

Mmm not sure I understand what you are saying. If you say you are exempt there should not be any confrontation. We either stand up for our ‘rights’ or follow instructions.

63288 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Victoria, 2, #1327 of 1523 🔗

OKUK suggestion might work for those who know it’s bollocks but lack the confidence to say so.

63118 Nick Rose, replying to Nick Rose, 19, #1328 of 1523 🔗

Was in Keswick today (Friday), for my last Lakes walk before the August hordes descend. After my very enjoyable walk, I wandered through Keswick and looked into whatever shops I could see into from outside.

Very depressing, fellow sceptics, very depressing. *Everybody* was wearing a mask that I saw. Very few on the streets did not have a mask, though the majority of wearers did not have them pulled up when outside.

But in general the density of people outside was far higher than inside any of the shops I looked into, so perhaps people are staying outside.

On the bright side, one family group was clearly contemptuous of the mask policy, had a bit of a natter with them as we were headed the same direction. Gave me some hope there was still some resistance.

I’m in Chester today, with A4 notepad and pencil, noting what the city centre shopping scene is like with the mask policy in place. If anyone is around (I expect to be there late morning to early afternoon), I’ll be the maskless one. Hopefully I’ll be hard to find with so little information, but I suspect not.

63144 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #1329 of 1523 🔗

Keswick is where I reside, normally. But I’ve been in the Auld Sod for the past five months but it is likely I’ll be back next week. How will I ever buy my comestibles? You paint a bleak picture for me.

63150 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #1330 of 1523 🔗

Sorry Ned, but it was what I saw. Now how many of those people were locals and how many visitors, obviously I have no idea. And because I wasn’t shopping, also have no idea how zealous shop staff are over the masks.

But it does mean I won’t be spending money or time in Keswick from now on. In, do walk, go home.

63154 ▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1331 of 1523 🔗

I did learn while I’ve been away that a self appointed “response” group put signs up on every road into the town saying “Keswick is Closed” – very friendly I thought! I suppose they must be gone now?

63155 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #1332 of 1523 🔗

I’ve been to Keswick three times in the past two months and haven’t noticed them, so may have been when the travel restrictions were first eased. I seem to remember the Mayor of Keswick complaining about all the cars parked, obviously belonging to outsiders, blah, blah.

63164 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1333 of 1523 🔗

I was told last week that the ‘Closed’ signs were only up for 24 hours.

I was also told that there’s a disconnect between aged Keswickians who don’t live off the tourist dollar, and resent the influx, and the younger working population who make their living from tourism.

The Royal Oak and Morrels, at least, were civilised and like old times.

63181 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to BTLnewbie, #1334 of 1523 🔗

The Royal Oak are still doing breakfasts, which was good to see!

63198 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to BTLnewbie, 2, #1335 of 1523 🔗

Keswick’s local paper “The Keswick Reminder” has a website which is where I gleaned my information about the “Keswick is Closed” sign. It was removed under cover of night by some one apparently at one point and then put back up again. The town council discussed its ‘legitimacy’ which caused some demurring – but also some approval.

63254 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #1336 of 1523 🔗

Writing the above has prompted me to look at the Reminder website. It carries a photo of the recently revamped doctor’s surgery I attend. Three member of staff occupy the waiting room’s new seats – suitably distanced – but none wearing masks!

Similarly the staff who work at the Derwentwater independent hostel which has recently re-opened are featured – none wearing a mask (and none too socially distanced it must be said!)

And both articles mention Covid!

It suggests to me there is a disposition to live normally where it hasn’t been prohibited.

63553 ▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Ned of the Hills, #1337 of 1523 🔗

People should remember that and starve them of all tourism.

63267 ▶▶ helenf, replying to Nick Rose, 8, #1338 of 1523 🔗

I was in Chester on Tuesday. Down by the river, you could be forgiven for thinking it was just a typical day in the summer holidays, busy with families enjoying themselves. But the shopping centre was a different story. It was like a ghost town. Shops were dead. Some literally, having closed down since I was last there. I don’t bother going in ones requiring you to sanitise your hands first, just shot the sanitizer police a dirty look and hoped that was self-explanatory. Can’t imagine mandatory masks are going to improve the situation. Shopping has become such a joyless experience. It will be a very long time before I go out browsing around the shops again. What a pointless, totally avoidable shame. It’s criminal what the government have done.

63269 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to helenf, 2, #1339 of 1523 🔗

yep

63557 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to helenf, #1340 of 1523 🔗

It is but some very PC businesses seem to welcome it even if it means they close down…you really cannot help some people. Entrepreneurship is becoming woke and therefore broke. I wonder what Hayek and Friedman would have made of it?

63120 CarrieAH, replying to CarrieAH, 20, #1341 of 1523 🔗

What is strange in all this – looking at it from abroad now as I am, and not feeling so caught up in it or dragged down by it – is that the government have chosen to put up “facemask exempt” notices on their website, ready for anyone to download and print off. Now this really is a farce! If nothing else, it proves that their facemask regulation is very little to do with health and absolutely more of a psyop in getting people back out from behind their sofas or giving them something else to think about. Are they becoming desperate? Boris seems to keep begging people to ignore the virus and carry on with life now, get back to work, yet to me the best way to ignore the virus and carry on, would be to remove all signs of the Covid measures completely. Floor markings, face masks, screens etc. Until those go away, people won’t forget. It will still be in the forefront of their minds and they will still be fretting over it. What you fix your mind on, increases.

From talking to people over here in Greece, we are all beginning to think that the reason behind this is the Great Reset financially worldwide. So much money is being pumped into the systems from the ground up (Rishi Sunak found billions from somewhere, and the EU is doing likewise) whilst the populations are looking the other way and talking about face masks. The virus exists, but it is nowhere near as bad as it is made out to be. We know that on here. It is a vast overreaction worldwide for a reason. Somebody on here posted the Financial Reset theory a while back and it does make sense.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/903454/Exemption_from_face_covering_card_to_print.pdf

63121 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to CarrieAH, 9, #1342 of 1523 🔗

Just to get us worrying about who is or isn’t wearing a mask and whether that person really is exempt, to distract us with inanity from what might really be going on just while they are off on holiday and so not in the spotlight.

63163 ▶▶ Bugle, replying to CarrieAH, 7, #1343 of 1523 🔗

At the beginning of the lockdown I took a delivery from a courier. The driver assured me, in a strong Eastern European accent, that he was really an economist. He said, “The banks need a crisis…” (As you can tell, I only listen to the most reliable sources).

63203 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bugle, 6, #1344 of 1523 🔗

More reliable than the pink and orange winged men the government listens to while smoking unusual substances but not inhaling.

63307 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bugle, 3, #1345 of 1523 🔗

Probably true. Many East Europeans in the UK are graduates or post grads.

63257 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to CarrieAH, 3, #1346 of 1523 🔗

I said a few times The Corona Project is a global reset. This is the main driver for it. Deflating the bubble, targeted QE, re-financing the banks by allowing them to scoop up hard assets and destroying national GDP.

63130 Nick Rose, replying to Nick Rose, 19, #1347 of 1523 🔗

One thing I did notice yesterday was that most folk wore the disposable blue (useless) masks. Are they all disposing of these masks after use correctly? Breach of the Health and Safety Law if not. This utter stupidity is causing millions of potential biohazard risks to council refuse collectors, landfill workers and, of course, other healthy people.

63139 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Nick Rose, 15, #1348 of 1523 🔗

At the supermarket yesterday the owner of the car next to me had clearly dropped his or her blue mask out of the door when they drove away. Disgusting.

63148 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stefarm, 9, #1349 of 1523 🔗

Biohazard. I’m taking car registrations or any distinguishing marks from people who do that where I can see today. All to be reported. Just another way of fighting back. Might start filming it too.

63161 ▶▶▶▶ John Smith, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #1350 of 1523 🔗

That’s right, you become a grass too.

That’ll help 🙄

63204 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to John Smith, 6, #1351 of 1523 🔗

Under ordinary circumstances I’d agree with you John, and AngloWelsh above. But fuck them, they’re the enemy.

63225 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1352 of 1523 🔗

Indeed. Perhaps we should give them no quarter as they have given us none.

63175 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1353 of 1523 🔗

Isn’t that just the same mindset that has had people throughout lockdown photographing their neighbours going out for a second run or having a relative round at their house?

63156 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to stefarm, #1354 of 1523 🔗

Did anybody shame theys driver ?

63147 ▶▶ Hammer Onats, replying to Nick Rose, 15, #1355 of 1523 🔗

From what I’ve seen, these “one use” masks are stuffed in a pocket and used over and over again. It won’t be long until there are reports of people breaking out with poxy spots all over their chins due to the filth on them.

63149 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Hammer Onats, 2, #1356 of 1523 🔗

At least it will mark them out as wearers:o))

63172 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Hammer Onats, 3, #1357 of 1523 🔗

Fingers crossed, tho don’t be surprised if ‘chin spots’ pops up as another symptom of covid and thus it’s lucky all these spotty chinned people had masks on.

63152 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Nick Rose, 21, #1358 of 1523 🔗

“I wear mine to protect others”
*chucks discarded germ rag into path of oncoming grandma*

63168 ▶▶▶ JimByJovi, replying to Farinances, #1359 of 1523 🔗

Exactly! It’s cognitive dissonance all round – all hail the NHS (but you can’t use it), and protect the environment (by hoying masks on the floor, the return of single use plastic, and the death of public transport).

63179 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Nick Rose, 9, #1360 of 1523 🔗

My husband is an HGV driver taking domestic waste to incinerators working for a waste management company. He’s worked throughout and they have been issued no additional PPE over and above their normal boots, hi vis and heavy duty gloves. They handle waste from a city with a large BAME community that is currently a Covid hotspot. Despite this not one person has contracted covid. While not denying masks are a potential hazard I would also suggest the virus is a) not particularly contagious (especially) outside confined spaces b) not strongly present in the community.

63200 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 5, #1361 of 1523 🔗

Oh I quite agree with you. If we accept that there was a virus (not everybody does, and they may well be correct), it is gone now, except perhaps from some hospitals and care homes. But I will still be pointing to the masked, that their used facemasks ARE bio-hazardous waste and must be disposed of accordingly.

More to make them think, rather than us :o))

63217 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #1362 of 1523 🔗

Good point, well made. The fact is they believe the masks are catching the virus so why are they strewing them about in public?!

63220 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1363 of 1523 🔗

Exactly. :o))

63247 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #1364 of 1523 🔗

It’s the same kind of people who eat a McDonalds and then throw the bag and their cup out the car window, or who have a pic-nik and leave all their food wrappers in the park or on the beach and leave.. Utter Charlies!

63321 ▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1365 of 1523 🔗

Well if there is still a virus lurking around, it’s certainly not in the bodies of those people who come on holiday to the Greek islands. We are testing visitors from the U.K. on their arrival at island airports, and out of 5000 people tested, not one showed positive for Covid. Zero. I think since those statistics were released, there may have been one case in Corfu but I’m not sure. So the theory that the virus is now just in care homes and certain BAME hotspots makes sense. So why are the general population still having to social distance, wear stupid masks, stay off work, remain on furlough etc etc?

63194 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #1366 of 1523 🔗

I know people who have admitted that they don’t wash their cloth masks – they wear then in public transport then shove them in their bags or pockets when they don’t need them. If anything cloth muzzles are far worse because its not only the bacteria that has accumulated in them but also the bobbles and fibres that they end up breathing in.

63209 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bart Simpson, #1367 of 1523 🔗

Disgusting isn’t it?

63249 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1368 of 1523 🔗

If you wanted to think of a better way of ensuring you are breathing a constant mix of incubated bacteria and pathogens, you would be hard pressed to do so. There is no better way to do this than wearing a facemask.

63212 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Bart Simpson, #1369 of 1523 🔗
63222 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #1370 of 1523 🔗

I think this suggests most wearers no perfectly well the masks are pointless. If they actually thought they were themselves a vector of infection they would not behave so casually. What many don’t realise is that while most masks won’t have trapped Covid they may well have trapped in them streptococcus, E. coli and other nasty germs.

63145 Ewan Duffy, replying to Ewan Duffy, 25, #1371 of 1523 🔗

The Irish Independent (paywall so no link) reports that a pub worker in Dublin is suing her employer after falling down stairs at work as the visor her employer told her to wear made it difficult to see.

63195 ▶▶ annie, replying to Ewan Duffy, 9, #1372 of 1523 🔗

Hope she gets huge compensation.

63146 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 15, #1373 of 1523 🔗

We are living through the decline and fall of Britain. All empires fall in the end. The fall cannot be paused or halted. This is my last post

63162 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to Cecil B, 5, #1374 of 1523 🔗

You lot are always leaving dramatic declarations of imminent retirement from this board only to reappear a couple of days later.

More comebacks than Frank Sinatra.

63165 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to John Smith, 5, #1375 of 1523 🔗

fuck off mate no one likes you

63563 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to John Smith, #1376 of 1523 🔗

Or Tina Turner

63171 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1377 of 1523 🔗

Ta ra.

63190 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Cecil B, #1378 of 1523 🔗

Have they put you in the slammer?

63151 Steeve, 10, #1379 of 1523 🔗

An unmasked man tried to stop a mugger yesterday but unfortunately the suspect ran into a nearby supermarket. Customer services phoned the police but the suspect could not be identified on shop camera footage. The police and shop staff thanked the man for his efforts. The man decided to do some shopping “Don’t forget your mask!!!! you are breaking the law”

63166 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 17, #1381 of 1523 🔗

I see people comparing mask wearing to wearing a seat belt.

This could be a more valid comparison if seatbelts were only compulsory at certain speeds or driving in certain areas.

63170 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to Nobody2020, 11, #1382 of 1523 🔗

And if the evidence they stopped you flying through the windscreen in event of a crash was weak or non existent

63192 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mark II, 2, #1383 of 1523 🔗

And uf you had to wear thrm in cities but not tiwns, A roads but not B roads.

63196 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Mark II, 6, #1384 of 1523 🔗

Seatbelts must be to stop you flying into other people after exiting via the windscreen. My seatbelt protects you, your seatbelt protects me.

63227 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #1385 of 1523 🔗

The most dangerous thing for a car driver is the unbelted passenger behind.

Oh joy, the waitresses in my usual cafe have abandoned their muzzled today.

63231 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to karenovirus, 2, #1386 of 1523 🔗

Is that an England day two event or a Scotland day 14 or whatever?

How long did the waitresses stick it out for?

Good to get an idea of how long patience lasts.

63236 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, 1, #1387 of 1523 🔗

This is a CRUCIAL factor.

63279 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Two-Six, #1388 of 1523 🔗

Second day of takeaway customers ignoring mask edict was probably the final straw.

63245 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basics, #1389 of 1523 🔗

England from when cafes reopened July 4th.

63182 ▶▶ JimByJovi, replying to Nobody2020, #1390 of 1523 🔗

Or if seatbelts were not made and tested to strict criteria, and you could just make your own…

63189 ▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #1391 of 1523 🔗

It’s a perfectly valid comparison. The idea, which has become institutionalised, that you’re a criminal if you don’t wear a seatbelt or a motorcycle helmet is in itself a basic assault on freedom. The safety benefits may be proven, but if we want to be unsafe, bearing in mind be pose a risk to no one but ourselves, that is our prerogative and not for the government to interfere with.

See J. S Mill: “The only purpose for which power can rightfully be exercised over any member of a civilised community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others.”

63319 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Ben Shirley, 1, #1392 of 1523 🔗

a basic assault on freedom”

Nonsense. It’s a balanced measure where the harm is far less than the benefit in a public realm. It isn’t a constraint except for restless spoiled children. ‘Freedom’ never was unconstrained in any society deserving of the name.

This current situation is far different, even if the fake arguments might mimic the rationality of the use of seat belts. Democracy has always required a balancing of demands between the individual and the crowd – that’s it’s very essence of a concept where the unconstrained dominance of either results in totalitarianism.

63342 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 1, #1393 of 1523 🔗

It’s a balanced measure where the harm is far less than the benefit in a public realm. It isn’t a constraint except for restless spoiled children. ‘Freedom’ never was unconstrained in any society deserving of the name .”

Now you are revealing your own inner totalitarian.

How is it “balanced”? What benefit do you give to an individual to counteract the cost of restricting his basic liberty (and worse, establishing structures and principles that will be used to further restrict his freedom)?

Reduction to a personal risk that they have already chosen to run for the precise benefit you are now taking away? Inherently absurd.

Some supposed trivial reduction in collectivised healthcare costs? Of course, it was never explained when such collectivisation was brought in that it would mean the end of any liberty to choose what personal risks to run.

What arrogance! To airily assume the right to dictate to others what their liberties are worth!

63219 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #1394 of 1523 🔗

There’s no honest comparison with wearing a seatbelt, because the two justifications (rationalisations, actually) are apples and oranges.

The mask law is rationalised based upon the pretence that wearing a mask “saves [other people’s] lives”. There is, of course, no evidence for this, but it is what people tend o believe based mostly upon the propaganda to which they are regularly exposed. Thus, it’s more similar, ethically, to drink driving laws, except with no evidence base to support it.

The seatbelt law is simple safety/health tyranny – it’s based upon using the law to force people to protect their own lives against a risk they would otherwise choose to run for themselves. The dishonest or deluded use an additional, spurious rationalisation that claims that because we have collectivised healthcare people supposedly shouldn’t be allowed to run such risks any more (because “everyone” pays for the healthcare costs”), but that is transparently dishonest because it is not applied remotely consistently, only where the person arguing for legal coercion wants to see such coercion applied. The people who use that argument, such as commenter “Boney Knee” here, are just dishonest on the issue, unless they are simply too stupid to understand their own argument..

So the comparison with seatbelt laws is not true, in ethical terms. It is used either in ignorance, or with intentional dishonesty. The motivation for using it dishonestly seems to be twofold: first, because a lot of unsophisticated people have fallen for the lie previously mentioned that seatbelt laws are a morally legitimate public protection measure, and secondly because it makes the wearing of masks seem to be an inevitability that only dinosaurs and the awkward squad are resisting and they of course are doomed to lose in the end.

63226 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Mark, 3, #1395 of 1523 🔗

You could argue that the best way to save other people’s lives when driving would be not to drive at all. That should be especially applied to my father in law! 🤣

63228 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #1396 of 1523 🔗

Of course. Life necessarily involves risks, and the issue can never be how to eliminate all risks, but only how to manage risks by balancing effectiveness versus hazard.

A society like ours, that becomes over-fearful (cultural cowardice, basically) becomes ineffectual.

63235 ▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Mark, 7, #1397 of 1523 🔗

Indeed. I’m a horsewoman and my husband rides a motorbike (I’m
Learning) and the inability of other riders to judge risk has dumbfounded me. I do endurance which involves cross country riding over Long distances often at speed. All events remain cancelled because riders have told our governing body they are afraid of covid 19. We ride 700kg of unpredictable horseflesh at high speed over uneven ground in an activity known to result in deaths and serious injury yet we are worried about a virus that has caused virtually no deaths in our demographic (fit, largely female, under 60, white).

63242 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #1398 of 1523 🔗

Mental. I have noticed that gliding, hang-gliding, paragliding,wing-walking, scuba diving, mountain climbing, bicycle racing, motorbike racing, and base jumping activities have been seriously curtailed for fear of spreading the Rona too.

63569 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Two-Six, #1399 of 1523 🔗

When you participate in sky diving the most important thing is that you socially distance yourself from other skydivers….even though you are 10,000 feet in the air!

63277 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ DressageRider, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1400 of 1523 🔗

I think it is about fear of the unknown. We think we are better able to judge risk doing things that we regularly do, and put to the back of our minds how dangerous equestrian sports can be. After all, we probably all know of someone killed or badly injured jumping and being kicked and bitten can also cause serious injury, but because we love horses that doesn’t stop us from wanting to ride or to handle them because the majority of our horsey encounters are very very positive. However fear of unknown viruses is far less easy for people to deal with. It is a cognitive dissonance, but I can understand how it occurs given the human brain.

63282 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ DressageRider, replying to DressageRider, #1401 of 1523 🔗

What I am trying to say is that it is pointless expecting people to be logical when fear is a driving factor. It is pointless expecting the majority to be logical in any circumstances. Our brains are not wired for it.

63309 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1402 of 1523 🔗

Absolutely agree AngloWelshDragon. I keep horses, and it is far more dangerous handling and riding half a ton of living breathing horse that quite rightly has a mind of its’ own. I believe it is considered by insurance companies to be a high risk activity. So like you I am well used to weighing up risk versus living! I used to event in my younger days but decided that at my age, my bones break far too easily now, so I stick to more gentle types of riding and handling. But I would never give up my horses “just in case” I may have an accident. That’s not living, that’s just existing. The virus pales into insignificance compared to other things I willingly do in my life.

63340 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1403 of 1523 🔗

You are absolutely right that the assessment of risk is essential in any situation.

My son and myself were talking about the teaching of mathematics the other day, and were totally agreed that key areas like estimation and the nature of probability (I don’t mean in a highly technical sense) are neglected for mickey-mouse computational exercises.

To ‘follow the science” in essence means to assess the evidence in terms of probabilities and risk. Rational enquiry.

We see this lack of risk awareness critically in this situation, where people are conned into thinking (a) that a disappearing mild infection is a major threat and (b) that wearing a mask has a significant probability, in this situation, of having any significant real-world effect.

But then we come to other aspects of this situation, where a psychological war has been actively waged to use fear as a means of distorting rational assessment (assuming it exists) for political ends.The victims have been deliberately targeted by studied distortion aimed at amplifying their lack of knowledge.

63347 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to RickH, 1, #1404 of 1523 🔗

There is no way for people to learn how to assess risk if they never expose themselves to risk. It’s a slippery slope and we’re already halfway down.

63568 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1405 of 1523 🔗

I am a maths tutor and I find that people are incapable of quantifying risks. Indeed their understanding of the idea of mathematical probability is non existent. It all helps to explain why they are easy prey to the fear mongers.

63238 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1406 of 1523 🔗

This objective has been partially met with a high degree of compliance. The roads are still relatively quiet. No more commuters, no more schools runs, much less traffic in towns. Just wait until they ban internal combustion engines.
Only people with huge amounts of cash will be able to drive and service the lease on the vehicles battery.

63310 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Nobody2020, #1407 of 1523 🔗

John Adams has great data about the impact of wearing seat belts on road deaths. Declining curves plateau once they are introduced. So wearing selt belts does not appear to cause futher decline in deaths. in fact in some cases it appears to keep deaths at a certain level.

The reason is due to our perception of risk and the way we adjust behaviour to suit. The mask thing is pertinent. The more you touch it the less effective (if effective at all) it becomes. Very quickly you have a bug rag on your face. A face nappy.

But try telling someone that it’s better to take it off once this happens and most won’t, because they associate the risk with not wearing it.

Local effects versus systematic effects. The same goes for theorists and modelling.

63173 Mike Smith, replying to Mike Smith, 13, #1408 of 1523 🔗

Helen Whately, the Care Minister, said that the Government will be “encouraging” people to wear a mask but they were “not expecting the police to be called every time someone isn’t wearing a face mask, that would be inappropriate”.

Why inappropriate? I thought that non-mask wearers were effectively killing people? Why wouldn’t you phone the phone for that? If the police won’t say that this law is unenforceable, then they should be expected to enforce it. And if that means the public making hundreds of thousands of 999 calls every day, swamping the system, then so be it.

63184 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Mike Smith, 18, #1409 of 1523 🔗

I think the government is trying to be all things to all people. “Wear a mask or be fined! But if you don’t want to don’t. But then again it might save lives. But maybe not. It’s important that healthy people cover up. But the most vulnerable – who we locked up for 12 weeks – are exempt”. It’s a total unscientific, focus group driven, dogs breakfast.

63191 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 7, #1410 of 1523 🔗

My dog wouldn’t go near it.

63215 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to annie, 3, #1411 of 1523 🔗

Nor my 4!

63223 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 8, #1412 of 1523 🔗

That had not occurred to me, the very same ‘vulnerable’ people who self isolated for three months are the most likely to claim exemption from masks, if they dare.

63229 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to karenovirus, 6, #1413 of 1523 🔗

The irony hasn’t escaped me. I don’t consider myself vulnerable and I’m pretty fit but I do have hyperthyroidism and that makes my heart beat very fast and I have a very high demand for oxygen when my meds are out of kilter or if I get stressed. As my last two blood tests and consultant appointments were cancelled due to covid that is starting to happen again and I’m starting to get a bit of hand tremor. On the down side heading into thyrotoxicosis territory again but on the upside legit reason not mask up.

63246 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 5, #1414 of 1523 🔗

If anybody dares to ‘shame’ you, show ’em the disability discrimination bit that imposes fines of up to £9000 for harassment.

63331 ▶▶▶▶ watashi, replying to karenovirus, 3, #1415 of 1523 🔗

If they dare indeed. I met my local propaganda delivery man yesterday, he is elderly and had told me a while ago that he has respiratory issues. I asked him why he was wearing a mask (he had it on his chin), he said the shop where he collects the papers wouldn t let him in without one. I explained that he can claim exemption with his condition. He looked very pleased. I wonder if people don t know that they can be exempt?

63186 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #1416 of 1523 🔗

Somebody posted this on Twitter. I’ve only had a quick skim through it but seems to suggest little risk of passing it on after 6 days. Some other interesting stuff in there too:

Duration of Isolation and Precautions for Adults with COVID-19
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/duration-isolation.html

A large contact tracing study demonstrated that high-risk household and hospital contacts did not develop infection if their exposure to a case patient started 6 days or more after the case patient’s illness onset (Cheng et al., 2020).

63210 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #1417 of 1523 🔗

Interesting read. I also looked at their advice on masks and read through their supporting articles. Lots of ‘potentially could’, ‘perhaps reduce’ etc. They have clearly cherry picked the most supportive pieces as there are many that do not support mask wearing such as this one:

https://journals.viamedica.pl/cardiology_journal/article/view/CJ.a2020.0054/50906

Cloth masks are an absolute health hazard.

63262 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1418 of 1523 🔗

Saw a waitress yesterday, adjust her mask at the mouth area with her free hand. She then used that hand to pass the plate. Not blaming the poor girl, she was just doing her job.

63197 Andy Riley, replying to Andy Riley, 20, #1419 of 1523 🔗

Tescos Ealing yesterday. Masked queue supervisor fiddles with own mask then hands out masks to customers without mask before letting them in. Thus creating transmission route which did not exist before. This will be happening all over the country.

63199 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Andy Riley, 11, #1420 of 1523 🔗

Stop, you’re thinking logically, that’s not allowed in 2020!

63205 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Andy Riley, 12, #1421 of 1523 🔗

It won’t make much difference right now as there’s not a lot of virus to transmit. If there’s a resurgence in winter it may become an issue though. By then the improper use of masks will become second nature.

63218 ▶▶▶ Andy Riley, replying to Nobody2020, 11, #1422 of 1523 🔗

Agreed – I posted this on one of my local web forums earlier

Question for the mask enthusiasts.

When can we stop wearing them? Given that both the rates of new cases and deaths have tailed off in recent weeks, there is no current reason to wear them. The danger is that if there is an increase in the Autumn, there may be “mask fatigue” by then.

I am in favour of targeted interventions such as distancing, hygiene and possibly mask use where and when justified, but right now, given that mask use, even if beneficial has only marginal effect it seems we are using a tool that should be saved for a more urgent time.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/

63230 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Andy Riley, 13, #1423 of 1523 🔗

Compulsory mask wearing has little to do with anything apart from being an integral part of the psy-op. Total mind fuckery.

63302 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #1424 of 1523 🔗

It’s clear that a rise of infection in the autumn winter will be the engineered story.

This is obvious from the ‘Second Wave’ being touted as a certainty rather than one possible outcome. We also, of course have another unsupported idea that Lock-Ups and masks make a difference. Not to mention the need to flog vaccines.

“Follow the Science”? Of course not. Follow the pre-determined propaganda narrative.

Watch out for a pretty ordinary ‘flu epidemic being touted again as Armageddon.

The Black Shorts have played with their toys and like the look of them : more for Christmas?

63232 ▶▶ davews, replying to Andy Riley, 8, #1425 of 1523 🔗

Well tried to be compliant. Put mask on outside Tesco in view of girl at door, strap promptly broke, showed her the broken strap and went in. 100% masks with customers but 50% staff maskless. Joined queue at checkout and joked to (masked) woman in front about the useless masks and she kindly let me go in front of her. Don’t expect that trick to work next time. Not an enjoyable shop.

63272 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to davews, 4, #1426 of 1523 🔗

Why did you try to be compliant?

63273 ▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to davews, 2, #1427 of 1523 🔗

‘tried to be compliant’? what on earth for? Just relax.

63258 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Andy Riley, 2, #1428 of 1523 🔗

Hold up didn’t Tescos say they wouldn’t be enforcing this?

63281 ▶▶▶ Andy Riley, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #1429 of 1523 🔗

I said “ letting them in” perhaps implying he might not have let them in. Badly worded – they may well have been not enforcing, just handing out masks. I’ll pop along this morning to see how they react to an exemption claim.

63323 ▶▶ watashi, replying to Andy Riley, #1430 of 1523 🔗

well, apart from the fact that there is no virus to start with so nothing really to transmit.

63206 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 16, #1431 of 1523 🔗

Breakfast in Spanish hotel. Buffet is behind glass screens and served to you by waiters-aptly named because whatever you queue for involves a long wait! All Spanish are well masked up. No problem with saying we are exempt.

Virus does not attack the fresh orange juice machine, nor the coffee or toast machines. You are completely safe by the cereal dispensers and the jams, spreads etc but it is extremely dangerous by the fruit, hot breakfasts and breads. There is a one way system around a large central island which gives you your morning exercise as it’s always a long walk back to your table!

I would say the hotel is only a quarter full and with these measures in place is unlikely to get any fuller this summer.

63221 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Margaret, 4, #1432 of 1523 🔗

If they don’t get substantially fuller – and pretty quickly at that – it is hard to see how they can keep going!

63244 ▶▶ annie, replying to Margaret, #1433 of 1523 🔗

Are you enjoying Jail España?

63312 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to annie, #1434 of 1523 🔗

It’s fine for us thanks Annie (as long as we don’t get one that is) We lived here for a long time and have friends here so are used to the ways of the Spanish-but it does take so much of the joy out of being on holiday.

63345 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Margaret, 2, #1435 of 1523 🔗

Whilst the incompetent cretins running the UK shit show are bad enough the Spanish are in a competition to see how much self destructive stupidity they can get away with…

Costa del Sol are proudly the first to mandate face nappies for exercising like running along the beach, some areas that includes cycling along the boardwalk.

Currently no genuine evidence that the cough spreads out in the open air (30C and plenty of strong UV ‘del sol’) or that masks do anything other than make people look stupid while not being able to breath properly.

Their ‘cases’ are rising in line with increased testing but their daily death rate is stubbornly flat-lined down near fuck all – what could that mean????

Sounds like you are further north…

63401 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Margaret, #1436 of 1523 🔗

that sounds hideous – “please sir may i have some more bangers?!” or “hey Miguel mate fling us another chipola por favore” 🙂
Not exactly the relaxing holiday experience IMHO but try and enjoy it! 🙂

63208 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 31, #1437 of 1523 🔗

To quote my husband. He has just coined a term for our present situation called ‘The Chain of Bollocks’. It begins with a Government that doesn’t know what it is doing but trying to avoid the blame. A bunch of Marxists on the Left looking to overthrow democracy. The media looking to sensationalise every statistic (death). Public sector that doesn’t want to go to work. The rest of us totally disenfranchised. Did he miss anything, he asks?

63211 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 19, #1438 of 1523 🔗

The civil servants refusing to return to work need to be careful. I’ve noticed the country is still ticking over, the streets are still cleaned, waste is being taken away. Do we actually need these people who are staying off work? We do need every penny we can lay our hands on now.

63213 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1439 of 1523 🔗

County Hall car park is on a main road into town, everyone can see it remains empty weeks after the rest of us went back to work.

63224 ▶▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Nick Rose, 10, #1440 of 1523 🔗

Those not wanting to return to work need to watch their step; there are huge numbers of applicants now for average jobs, from unemployed, desperate highly qualified people; don’t wanna work? we can easily replace you.

63253 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #1441 of 1523 🔗

If 50% of public sector workers disappeared now life could be a lot better.

63290 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #1442 of 1523 🔗

I’m fascinated by the emergence of this sort of bollocks as an diversion for a mess entirely owned by a bunch of dim right-wing nutters feeding the demands of big private finance!

63300 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 1, #1443 of 1523 🔗

You seem to live in a fantasy world where the people driving this – the BBC, big media, social media zealots and senior medical “experts” are all somehow krypto-fascist enablers, when in objective reality these groups are all more or less openly admitted as heavily left-leaning supporters of (in the UK) the Labour and LibDem parties.

Where are these “far right” people and where is a single party with a single objectively “far right” political policy?

I’d like to know, so that I can have someone to vote for again.

63577 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Mark, #1444 of 1523 🔗

Very good point….with a few notable exceptions such as Paul Embery the main opposition has come from the Right including the creator of this sight and key figures such as Peter Hitchens and James Delingpole. I have not seen any left wing equivalents of this site which is why the left who oppose lockdown have had to come on here even though they are probably not keen on its ancestry.

63407 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to RickH, #1445 of 1523 🔗

That being the banking sector that is about to be replenishing ‘bucket 3’ of post Financial Crisis bad debt provisions when the inevitable credit event happens in the commercial property sector? Agree there are some dubious big business-related interests behind this fiasco, plus a Big Pharma industry that has totally captured the regulators, but last time I looked, most of the money supporting the virus bandwagon aligns to left-leaning interests. In the UK, who and where are the ‘right wing nutters’?

63716 ▶▶▶ gina, replying to Nick Rose, #1446 of 1523 🔗

My husband is a civil servant – HMRC inspector – he’s worked all through – as has the whole of his department. They’ve mostly worked from home where their hours are logged into the system. Many of them, like him, do over their contracted hours.

63214 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1447 of 1523 🔗

The self-appointed, censorious, authoritarian block Kapos on every street and in every village naming and shaming on social media.

63255 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1448 of 1523 🔗

Plenty of detail to add, but I think he’s covered the basics pretty well.

63256 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1449 of 1523 🔗

You missed Climate Activists who see the grounding of the airlines and the collapse of capitalism as good – you know, ‘there were pigeons in the fountain on the high street, nature is healing herself’. Curtain twitching stasi informers feeling emboldened, and having a lovely time, comfortable at last that someone is indulging their dependent personality disorder. Scientists just making stuff up now to protect their reputations and their funding, and pharmaceutical corporate interests, who in the midst of this chaos, who have spotted a whopping opportunity for profiteering, and an NHS who at last gets to take revenge for funding cuts by doing sweet fanny adams for four months, and taking a bow.

63301 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to BecJT, 1, #1450 of 1523 🔗

And demanding care packages/money off/ free food

63578 ▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Chris John, #1451 of 1523 🔗

Yes lots of that where I live even though they are on full pay for doing very little in many cases.

63263 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 8, #1452 of 1523 🔗

He missed the toxic proliferation of social media which makes politicians feel public opinion all the more acutely, favours and amplifies hysteria and emotion over rationality and facts, as well as its (ab)use as an incredibly powerful propaganda tool to spread fear. Can you imagine how Stalin and Hitler would have used social media had it existed in their time? Perhaps we are getting a taste now.

63278 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tyneside Tigress, -3, #1453 of 1523 🔗

A bunch of Marxists on the Left looking to overthrow democracy.”

I’m more worried about a bunch of proto-fascists on the Tory free-market right who *have* overthrown democratic principles. Inventing straw men from political obsessions won’t alter that.

63386 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to RickH, 1, #1454 of 1523 🔗

The only Tory free marketeers still alive are in a tiny minority in The Lords – Peter Lilley being a notable one. If you think Boris and his Cabinet of all star intellects such as Williamson and Sharma are free marketeers and right wing, I fear you are mistaken.

63583 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to RickH, #1455 of 1523 🔗

You are deluded….in so far as the Tories have gone along with this its because they are now part of the left and the cultural revolution. Any free market person would not want to see private capitalism destroyed and the NHS turned into a state religion. They would leave that to the likes of you.

63237 Oaks79, replying to Oaks79, 23, #1456 of 1523 🔗

How long do you think this is going to go on for ? I’m seriously thinking of looking for work in Sweden and to move out there, I’ve literally had enough of the covid fear that is in this country. I’m arguing with family who are normally well balanced people but are now “Covid Karen’s” and acting in ways I’ve never seen before. I want to live a life but not like this..

63239 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Oaks79, 1, #1457 of 1523 🔗

I have a nephew who moved there about seven years ago. He found it hard to get work, although admittedly he was moving in a narrow field…music teaching and performance. Sweden doesn’t always recognise British qualifications. However, if you can get through that aspect, then it seems to be a nice place; obviously very uncrowded; but everywhere is cashless, lots of things very liberal, and so on. Analyse carefully before jumping.

63587 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to thedarkhorse, #1458 of 1523 🔗

The Old Sweden has also been changed by a very large muslim intake and parts of the big cities are seen as no go zones for women after dark. The liberal nature of the Swedes has made it difficult for them to deal with this new manace.

63251 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Oaks79, 7, #1459 of 1523 🔗

Sorry to put a dampner on things but as far as I can see this madness is everywhere. Us Sceptics need to stick together and fight back.

63268 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #1460 of 1523 🔗

Agree. The grass is not always greener on the other side.

63317 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Victoria, 3, #1461 of 1523 🔗

I agree. Running away will not solve the problem. Mass non-violent resistance will.

63314 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Oaks79, 5, #1462 of 1523 🔗

I’ve recently purchased an “I Love Sweden’ T-shirt to wear in public as often as I can. Raises a few eyebrows. I can’t believe “I Love Sweden” is now a political statement!

63315 ▶▶ watashi, replying to Oaks79, #1463 of 1523 🔗

please can I come with you?

63387 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Oaks79, 1, #1464 of 1523 🔗

i think sweden is a very “liberal” society and probably very nice but they have a stack of their own issues too. They have taken in a lot of refugees which are creating issues in the cities and there have been increase in rapes, and bombings in recent years etc – none of this ever gets into the msm as it doesn’t fit their agenda – google it.
there seem to be a few swedes on this forum who can probably give you a balanced view. But i would think a little wooden hut couple hundred miles away in the forest would be absolutely ideal right now…

63248 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 11, #1465 of 1523 🔗

Off topic but just listened to Chopper’s Politics Podcast from the Telegraph. He interviewed an utterly cretinous Tory MP for Stoke on the obesity “crisis”. Not only did she suggest we all need to be eating a “plant based” diet, the corollary of what she said had me screaming at the radio. Her argument followed to its logical conclusion would be that everyone should be banned from buying or preparing their own food. We should all get a “nutritious” meal prepared and delivered to our door by the state (she didn’t actually say that but it was the logical conclusion of what she did say). And she claimed her approach wasn’t nanny statist and that Boris should get 10/10 for his first year. Un-f-ing believable!

63252 ▶▶ Mark, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 7, #1466 of 1523 🔗

And we are supposed to believe these people are meaningfully “conservative”!?

(Let alone “far right” as some deluded types seem to believe!)

63266 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Mark, 1, #1467 of 1523 🔗

“Conservative” – perhaps not in any meaningful sense

“Far Right” definitely – like the fascists. The fact that Stalinism was just as repulsive doesn’t alter the fact; this lot come from the other extreme.

63276 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 3, #1468 of 1523 🔗

I think you confuse “authoritarian” with far right. You can be either left or right and be authoritarian. The distinction between left and right is fundamentally one of radicalism versus conservatism, not as it tends to be viewed by those whose views were formed by the socialism/Thatcher decades in this country, merely big government versus big business. In reality, big business can be either left or right, as can be clearly seen from the actions of many big businesses and super-rich individuals recently. .

63594 ▶▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to RickH, #1469 of 1523 🔗

You really are a joke…I am sure you would find Novara media more to your liking. And Ash Sarkar is very easy on the eye too.

63593 ▶▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to Mark, #1470 of 1523 🔗

I wonder who you are referring to there lol.

63261 ▶▶ mjr, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #1471 of 1523 🔗

the mushroom approach .. kept in the dark and fed on sh*t

63265 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 7, #1472 of 1523 🔗

So ridiculous. We absolutely cannot trust any nutrition advice by the Government. They still use the outdated food pyramid. At the bottom of the pyramid they recommend that we stuff ourselves with a lot of carbohydrates. They even recommend low fat diets that have been debunked. We need good quality fats in our diet and good quality proteins (the building blocks of our bodies).

We are all different and our bodies react differently to different foods – it is not as simple as calories in and out. Some people are very sensitive to carbohydrates and gain weight weight quickly.

63280 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 5, #1473 of 1523 🔗

I have a feeling ration cards won’t be too long before they are mentioned, can only buy food with “approved” cards and so on.

Part of the new green agenda being pushed.

63311 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1474 of 1523 🔗

And you can only have a ration card if you have your immunity pass.

63292 ▶▶ Humanity First, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1475 of 1523 🔗

One of the objectives of the “Sustainability” agenda being pushed/planned by the UN/WEF and their supporter/controllers is to abolish meat consumption altogether (dairy/cattle farms are ‘not sustainable’ because they take up too much land and resources).

They will sing the praises of a ‘plant-based’ diet but in reality it is food created in a lab – much more ‘efficient’ than farms. So the end result will be to sever the connection between people and the consumption of natural foods.

Watch out for more and more articles appearing in MSM praising ‘plant-based’ diets, bemoaning the consumption and production of meat and linking it to the proliferation of viruses, etc

Here’s one in today’s Telegraph:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/food-and-drink/features/do-need-stop-eating-meat/

63303 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Humanity First, #1476 of 1523 🔗

Some good reading here, for anyone interested. A bit more balanced than headlines.

https://sustainablefoodtrust.org/articles/?category=food-systems-2

63334 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Humanity First, #1477 of 1523 🔗

Bill Gates headlines an all-star list of investors pumping $75 million into meatless burgers

https://qz.com/1044498/bill-gates-impossible-foods-investment-increases-in-meatless-burger-funding-round/

63346 ▶▶▶▶ Edna, replying to Victoria, #1478 of 1523 🔗

How revolting.

63403 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Victoria, #1479 of 1523 🔗

I suspect that elite will continue t eat the best beef and lamb and fish available. It will be the rest of us who get the synthetic equivalent of an airline meal delivered daily by the block kapo.

63399 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Humanity First, #1480 of 1523 🔗

Like I always say- it’s plant-based because it’s made in a plant and plant is another word for factory. Funny how the people who 15 years ago were bleating on about additives and GM crops are the same ones advocating we eat an increasingly synthetic diet.

63294 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1481 of 1523 🔗

It’s not off topic. It’s another case of politicians and media channels, regurgitating the opinions of a few. Most of the real evidence for healthy eating, that can also feed the whole planet, points to non selective diets.

63306 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #1482 of 1523 🔗

I’d love to see her suggest her food plan to my wife’s face – she’s passionate about home-cooking healthy meals every day – I fear that MP will not come out well from the confrontation (my wife’s a fiery red-headed ginger ninja).

Did she also suggest what we could do with the elderly population – what she would undoubtedly term the ‘useless eaters’? Soylent Green anyone?

I don’t think this is off-topic at all. It’s all part of the same lunatic mentality that got us into this mess in the first place.

63591 ▶▶ They dont like it up 'em, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1483 of 1523 🔗

Yes thats the reality of the collapse of the ‘red wall’ They have still got Labour MPs standing on Tory colours. Many of the new Tory MPs would not know a conservative principle from a communist one.

63260 Steeve, replying to Steeve, 16, #1484 of 1523 🔗

Nervous – Needed to pick up a Hoover from Argos this morning. Deep breathing exercises before I left. Walked around a little because I was early, surprised everyone wearing a mask going into local Tesco – local butchers looked hopeful! Anyway down to Sainsburys – 8am and not busy – walked straight in and asked two members of staff(wearing masks) what time Argos(inside store) opened “8am” “Thank You” – Walked down to Argos Section – all good so far, lady came to serve me – not wearing a mask Hurray! Nice chat about hoovers etc – Smiled at each other walked out with my Shark Hoover. Mission accomplished! Co op later for my parents.

63337 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Steeve, #1485 of 1523 🔗

I’m bracing myself for the Co-Op, too.

63274 Awkward Git, 6, #1486 of 1523 🔗

Found this picture online, thought you all might like it.

63275 James Leary #KBF, replying to James Leary #KBF, 32, #1487 of 1523 🔗

They say you never appreciate what you had until it’s gone. I really, really miss my freedom. My freedom to go where I want on a whim. My freedom to browse book shops with no specific aim. My freedom to smile at a passing stranger who, for no known reason smiled at me. My freedom josh with staff in restaurants and pubs. Freedom to play with words in that British way we do during daily interactions – that Americans find very difficult to understand – even without a mask. It’s the oil that allows the wheels of daily life to turn without grinding quite so much. The politicians have thrown sand in the wheels, and it hurts. I will have my revenge, preferably in this world, not the next.

63287 ▶▶ Mark, replying to James Leary #KBF, 16, #1488 of 1523 🔗

The only mechanism for political revenge that I can see will be to support new and non-mainstream parties,at every opportunity, even if you don’t necessarily like all their policies or views, to take away legitimacy from the mainstream politicians who have betrayed us and failed in their most basic responsibilities.

Most importantly – don’t let them “move on” and persuade us that we have to accept what they have done because new things become more urgent and important. That’s why my mantra is: Never forget. Never forgive.

What they most want is for us to forget about all this and vote for them again, because they are saying something we want to hear or (more likely) because it’s “necessary” to prevent some other group getting into power, a few years down the line.

63295 ▶▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to Mark, 11, #1489 of 1523 🔗

Yes Mark. But don’t you find it strange that there are NO political voices being raised at this cataclysmic change to our centuries-old freedoms? None? Civil Wars have started for less – and faster.

63313 ▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to James Leary #KBF, 5, #1490 of 1523 🔗

No ‘political’ voices perhaps, but alternative sites like this are flourishing. I know there’s not much to feel bright about at present, but look at what Toby Young has achieved here: a mixture of objective reporting, accessible commentary, citizen journalism by contributors plus a forum for criticism and commiseration. This is the future.

63335 ▶▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Bugle, 3, #1491 of 1523 🔗

Until ‘the authorities’ decree that free exchange of information is ‘dangerous’ and force social media companies and ISPs to block such material.

63316 ▶▶▶▶ Humanity First, replying to James Leary #KBF, 5, #1492 of 1523 🔗

Yes it was definitely strange in the beginning…now it is quite chilling as there does not appear anyone in Parliament who is willing to question the government on its actions or hold it to account.

Where have the independent, brave politicians not afraid to speak their minds gone? They were always relatively few in number but they did exist and made their voices heard. What has happened?

63338 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Humanity First, 4, #1493 of 1523 🔗

As Simon Heffer has pointed out, Boris has a talent for avoiding scrutiny. The refusal to interviewed by Andrew Neil, the attempted prorogation of parliament, avoiding Sir Graham Brady, the institution of a socially distanced and virtual parliament, virtual press conferences which deflect awkward questions: these things are of a piece.

According to the Spectator, the Red Wall recent intake of MPs is causing problems for Boris over Huawei. We just need to encourage them to cause him problems over Covid policy.

But of course, the magician has just rushed through some of the most illiberal measures in history and slipped from the stage.

63389 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Bugle, 2, #1494 of 1523 🔗

Good luck with that! Red Wall constituents absolutely love masks and lockdown. I live in a working class strongly pro Brexit constituency and I honestly think if Boris told us to smear our faces with cow pat, wear a traffic cone on our heads and sing “Dancing Queen” to ward of covid 99.9% of people here would do it with enthusiasm. Don’t make the mistake of thinking people vote for Brexit because they are libertarians; I have learnt most people just wanted the wearer of the jackboot pressing on their neck to be worn by a Brit.

63318 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to James Leary #KBF, 7, #1495 of 1523 🔗

We live in a heavily conformist society that has been