Last updated2020-07-25T12:02:48



63343 Ethelred the Unready, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 30, #1 of 1129 🔗

A catalogue of errors on every front. An abject lesson in how to spend political capital very quickly. Pandemic over reaction, total inability to control rubber boat arrivals, allowing a trial to be concluded where questions of jury interference remain, and now the final indignity, heading towards a ‘level playing field’ fake Brexit…He is only getting away with it for lack of a credible genuinely centre-right alternative…so far….nature hates a vacuum…

63350 ▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 19, #2 of 1129 🔗

Nearly forgot, plus wanton throwing around of tax payers hard earned cash and vote destroying‘ tax reviews’. The funny thing is that when they lose their majority at the next election, they won’t understand why, it will be the voters fault…simple lesson in life, never bite the hand that feeds…when did the Tories morph into New Labour?

63355 ▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 30, #3 of 1129 🔗

Mandatory gloves coming next apparently, it’s almost as though a group of liberals somewhere in a darkened room are amusing themselves by seeing what they can get away with next…

63358 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 9, #4 of 1129 🔗

Well – it’s surely much harder to claim ‘exemption’ from gloves, so this is even deeper stasi tactics!

63416 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to IanE, 3, #5 of 1129 🔗

I suppose we could paint/dye our hands a light turquoise blue …

63434 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to IanE, 4, #6 of 1129 🔗


63528 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 4, #7 of 1129 🔗


63547 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to karenovirus, #8 of 1129 🔗

Sorry Karen, didn’t notice your reply before replying myself. My bad…

64270 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ nfw, replying to karenovirus, 1, #9 of 1129 🔗

Love the name, an Irish Karen.

63451 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to IanE, 2, #10 of 1129 🔗

wear boxing gloves and look as though mean to use them!! 🙂
i used to go to bootcamp and in the boxing exercises had a mean right hook and upper cut!! ha 🙂

63549 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Sue, #11 of 1129 🔗

I look like I’m going to use them even without gloves.

64095 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Sue, #12 of 1129 🔗

Didn’t the wearing of boxing gloves used to be a ‘cure’ for onanism?

64428 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to Ethelred the Unready, #13 of 1129 🔗

That was Corn Flakes, I believe.

63546 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to IanE, 1, #14 of 1129 🔗

Contact dermatitis.

63772 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Nick Rose, #15 of 1129 🔗



63879 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to IanE, 1, #16 of 1129 🔗

Those blue gloves are super allergenic and can be quite systemically toxic, they have a lot of NASTY chemicals in them.

64002 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to IanE, #17 of 1129 🔗

Do like Michael Jackson did, only wear one.

63381 ▶▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 49, #18 of 1129 🔗

Great comment in the Sun “ The healthy sheep will comply as they always do. They would wear a dog turd on their heads if Dr. Hilary told them it would prevent a sniffle.”

63395 ▶▶▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 21, #19 of 1129 🔗

Not what I hear. The next edict is to persuade people that walking backwards helps prevent inhalation of the virus.

63424 ▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 12, #20 of 1129 🔗

Presumably to prepare us for the mandatory insertion of the gloved finger up the netherhole while shopping Why not? It will probably “save lives” just as much as masking does.

63427 ▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 8, #21 of 1129 🔗

wear the kenny everett gloves – that would be funny!
What happened to comedy/comedians – they’re so dull these days i can’t watch

63430 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Sue, 1, #22 of 1129 🔗

What happened to comedy/comedians – they’re so dull these days i can’t watch
“How I Got Cancelled” – Andrew Lawrence

63998 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Snake Oil Pussy, replying to Mark, #23 of 1129 🔗

They got cancelled. Except for the ones you can only watch through censored electronic media.

63487 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Sue, 2, #24 of 1129 🔗

They went woke, sadly

63489 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Sue, 1, #25 of 1129 🔗
63603 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Sue, #26 of 1129 🔗
63731 ▶▶▶▶▶ Fed up, replying to Sue, #27 of 1129 🔗

Ryan Long US comedian is doing some good stuff. His ‘snitches for riches’ piece reflects the mask shaming we are seeing.

64365 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Sue, #28 of 1129 🔗

There is no fun or humour allowed we might as well be living in East Germany

63496 ▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 5, #29 of 1129 🔗

Have they got a job lot of “work experience” kids working for the civil service? Maybe they have just left university or are temping. That’s the only explanation that I can think of because whoever is making up these rules clearly has no common sense nor experience of life. They are living in a fantasy world.

63532 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Margaret, 2, #30 of 1129 🔗

They have just discovered Monty Python and are trying to outdo the Ministry of Silly Walks sketch.

63552 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Margaret, 2, #31 of 1129 🔗

Totally unreal. I can’t work out whether most folk deserve pity or contempt for keeping up with the BS.

63605 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Nick Rose, #32 of 1129 🔗

Contempt for some, pity for the others.

63639 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Margaret, 5, #33 of 1129 🔗

Sigh. Most civil servants work at a computer terminals and have now discovered, like the rest of the world, that it’s perfectly possible to do this at home. Now Boris wants to herd them all back in to stuffy offices to breathe on each other all day long – while business has realised that it can save a bomb by stopping renting office space! The forthcoming debt crisis for property magnates may be what’s driving Boris, rather than anything else. The City of London will not return to normal and that will be worrying him.

63748 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Margaret, 3, #34 of 1129 🔗

Probably the kids of these new nomenklatura who never had to shop because they have minions doing it for them, never take public transport as they’re always being chauffeured, never have to fly commercial because they fly via private jet. In other words they never have to come across the likes of us riff-raff so they have no idea how we live!

63504 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 11, #35 of 1129 🔗

Especially when all this is being led by lobby groups, not scientists or politicians. Might be gloves next, it will definitely be masks everywhere outdoors….


If these people want to change society on our behalf then they should enter politics and get elected instead of sculking in the shadows

63555 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to T. Prince, 3, #36 of 1129 🔗

Exactly. Weird, oddball cult.

63588 ▶▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 1, #37 of 1129 🔗

Sensory processing issues? I hope we are all going to wear fingerless gloves!

63692 ▶▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #38 of 1129 🔗

Well you can’t use a smartphone with nitrile gloves on.

64125 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cruella, replying to CarrieAH, 8, #39 of 1129 🔗

Gloves in healthcare are worn to protect the person wearing them from body fluids/chemicals. Handwashing is done to protect the vulnerable from invisible pathogens. Wearing gloves prohibits and discourages hand washing and increases risk. I will not be gloving up or masking up ever. Until such time as this changes, I stay out.

63735 ▶▶▶▶ Digital Nomad, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 2, #40 of 1129 🔗

“The most terrifying words in the English language are: I’m from the government and I’m here to help.” – Ronald Reagan

64313 ▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 2, #41 of 1129 🔗

Well, I have a lovely pair of white crocheted gloves used for a wedding. Lots of holes in them due to being crochet. I’ll use those 😡

64345 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ethelred the Unready, #42 of 1129 🔗

Are we allowed to wear Freddy Krueger gloves?

63380 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 10, #43 of 1129 🔗

I love it when people blithely talk about ‘the next election’ …

63406 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to JohnB, 8, #44 of 1129 🔗

I agree.I can’t see how they will ever let us vote again.And I believe they have not intention of ever paying the money back that they have wasted.

63508 ▶▶▶▶▶ Paul M, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 7, #45 of 1129 🔗

Agree too. We’ll never be allowed to vote again.
But there has to be some way to get rid of bojo (and his complicit chums) and have a leader who will give us our freedoms back.
MPs don’t seem to give a stuff.

63556 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Paul M, 7, #46 of 1129 🔗

There is. But you need a lot more people behind it than we have now. Too early yet.
Edit: And it won’t be looking for someone to “give” us our freedoms back. We’ll have to take them back.

63511 ▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 6, #47 of 1129 🔗

My view entirely. If Blair/Brown et al get their way, we’ll have world government by next year. The US is the tipping point in November

63562 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 1, #48 of 1129 🔗

Next year is Council elections in England, and Scottish and Welsh elections for the respective devolved governments. I suspect those will go ahead – put extremists in. That’ll shake the government.

If in Scotland, hold your nose if you must and give the SNP a clean sweep. Boris will hate that.

In Wales, same with Plaid.

63673 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Nick Rose, 8, #49 of 1129 🔗

I’m never voting Plaid after this – they wanted a more extreme Lockdown than we got with Drakeford. That said, I’m never voting Labour or Tory again. Lib Dems – no. Green – no. I’ll vote for whoever says they would have followed the Swedish model, if anybody is brave enough to put that on their manifesto.

63750 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Mr Dee, 7, #50 of 1129 🔗

I think I’d rather vote for the Monster Raving Looney Party or None of the Above.

63835 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Mr Dee, #51 of 1129 🔗

If all I get in my area to pick from is the usual Tory, Labour, Lib Dem, Green… rubbish options I’ll be spoiling the ballot with a ballad on how we should have copied Sweden.

63860 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 4, #52 of 1129 🔗

We will be allowed to vote.
But it won’t make any difference. All the parties are as bad as each other. The Tories have co-opted the worst possible policies from each of the other main parties.

63411 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 5, #53 of 1129 🔗

Under David Cameron

63478 ▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 4, #54 of 1129 🔗

…when did the Tories morph into New Labour?

Hitchens book ‘The Cameron Delusion’ sheds light on this.


63545 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 7, #55 of 1129 🔗

It already has. Blair was Major Mark 2, Brown was Major Mark 3, Cameron #4, May #5, so we are up to Major Mark 6 for Fatso.

63548 ▶▶▶▶ HawkAnalyst, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #56 of 1129 🔗


Tony Blair: We will need to learn to live with coronavirus

“The reality is that we’re going to be living with Covid-19 – we’re not really going to be able to eliminate it,”

63592 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to HawkAnalyst, 9, #57 of 1129 🔗

In fairness I’d agree with that comment. Which is why we need herd immunity. The only way to achieve that is to catch the damned thing. If it really exists, of course.

63790 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #58 of 1129 🔗

Scientists e.g. Prof. Sunetra Gupta think we may have already got herd immunity. Certainly, by any reckoning, the epidemic is over so the mask mandate is a psyop to test obedience. So far, we’re doing well . . . .

63611 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to HawkAnalyst, 5, #59 of 1129 🔗

It doesn’t need to be eliminated. You do. Buzz off Tony!

63839 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to richard riewer, #60 of 1129 🔗

That bastard wanted ID cards for everyone in the UK, he’s loving this panicdemic as a chance to push his tyrannical ambitions.

63676 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to HawkAnalyst, 5, #61 of 1129 🔗

Gahhh why are none of them stopping to think, ‘hang on… Do we actually _need_ to eliminate this?’… Them and the general public, how has the consensus become accepted that we can’t go back to normal til its gone, when it’s provable not that fucking bad anyway

63722 ▶▶▶▶▶ Chicot, replying to HawkAnalyst, 5, #62 of 1129 🔗

What we are doing is definitely not living with it. It’s the collective equivalent of hiding under the bed.

63980 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to HawkAnalyst, 3, #63 of 1129 🔗

We live with fucking colds too, big deal

64259 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to HawkAnalyst, 3, #64 of 1129 🔗

His idea of ‘living with the virus’ is biometric ID cards tied to vaccination and health records. He bloody LOVES this shit. It’s his life’s work realised.

64102 ▶▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #65 of 1129 🔗

Isn’t it tragic when you stand in the voting booth and have to hold your nose and vote for the least worst? I have been doing exactly that since Thatcher, the last PM I voted for with positivity

64239 ▶▶▶▶▶ Hugh, replying to Ethelred the Unready, #66 of 1129 🔗

Ha! you’ll have to wear your mask and gloves and goodness knows what else to vote at the next election

64739 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Ethelred the Unready, #67 of 1129 🔗

Other way round – New Labour was a Tory virus (a real one). Meanwhile it’s nutters of the right, not ‘liberals’ who are responsible for this shambles, although many seem to be in denial of the bleedin’ obvious.

63850 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 4, #68 of 1129 🔗

HS2 go-ahead
Huawei go-ahead until current situation forced a u-turn (maybe)

I thought Boris might be a bit flakes, except on Brexit, but he’s exceeded my low expectations.
Talk about finding a deep hole and keep digging. He’ll be all the way to China at this rate.

63352 annie, 25, #69 of 1129 🔗

Not just face mask filth in the sea, but hand poison filth too. Countryfile ( now a nest of zombie zealotry) ran a piece last year on possible polluting effects of antibacterial gel – and that’s long before the zombies started swilling it.

63353 GLT, replying to GLT, 41, #70 of 1129 🔗

Travelling today, I am not wearing a mask. Autistic son extremely angry and agitated that I am not obeying the rules. Neuro-typical children also made to feel anxious by non-conformance. A great deal of discussion of morality and law required.

63751 ▶▶ Catherine Young, replying to GLT, 1, #71 of 1129 🔗

My 22 year old daughter told me yesterday that I am a “horrible person” for using my exemption card upon entering a shop. (I have no disability but am a libertarian and lockdown sceptic.) She could offer no evidence for needing a mask but simply believes the UK gov propoganda. I’m saddened and really concerned that such an intelligent individual as she hasn’t researched the counter evidence and is so ready to condemn me.

65672 ▶▶▶ Proudtobeapeasant, replying to Catherine Young, #72 of 1129 🔗

I regularly post things about the lockdown on Facebook, including one about refusing to wear a mask, accompanied by a link to an article from here. One son agrees with my stance (and went on the anti-mask protest in London) the other, who has lived abroad for several years, completely disagrees, either on Facebook or via more private means. He always quickly counters my posts, usually with some comment that the article is not reliable, with other articles opposing what I’m saying (and I often think his articles are far less reliable than mine) and worries that I am thinking wrongly. He’s an engineer with a 1st class degree. I try to discuss it all calmly but it’s difficult. My husband also disagrees with me. It’s upsetting when your family gets divided, but this will happen.

63844 ▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to GLT, #73 of 1129 🔗

Would think, from knowing several people with similar conditions, that someone autistic would be more streesed by the PRESENCE not absence of masks. From what I’ve seen lockdown scepticism is pretty common among those with autism, the high functioning ones see through all the bullshit and recognise that the viral risk is neglible (and always has been), the low functioning consider this whole lockdown charade a disastrous disruption to routine without any cause they can understand (and truth be told there is no proper reasoning behind the panic we’ve seen).

63354 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 26, #74 of 1129 🔗

Nice to see the VIRUS and the SPREADER sitting together.

63522 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Harry hopkins, 4, #75 of 1129 🔗

And those ar*e-licking Tory blue shoes…

63356 DJ Dod, replying to DJ Dod, 17, #76 of 1129 🔗

Boris is being disingenuous about his mistakes, and I think he knows it. I live in hope that the truth will eventually out, but it looks like the Government is giving itself plenty of time to create an alternate reality – masks until the middle of next year? Really?

63367 ▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to DJ Dod, 7, #77 of 1129 🔗

“Disingenuous”. What a very genteel word that is.

63517 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to DJ Dod, 3, #78 of 1129 🔗

And people will accept the forced vaccination program if it means dispensing with masks and other restrictions. As Boris says, we’d be nuts to refuse the jab this winter

63602 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to T. Prince, 6, #79 of 1129 🔗

I think he’s referring to the flu jab. But erm, wasn’t that believed to be a partial cause of bad symptoms reckoned to maybe perhaps be the virus?

63615 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Nick Rose, 8, #80 of 1129 🔗

That is what Dolores Cahill suggested on a podcast not too long ago. Some vaccines precipitated adverse reactions that led to contracting Covid-19, especially in Northern Italy. Those vaccinations were given way before the outbreak after Christmas 2019.

65694 ▶▶▶▶▶ Proudtobeapeasant, replying to richard riewer, #81 of 1129 🔗

And see here -Dr John Campbell explains “Flu Vaccination and Covid 19 risk” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utMREADbtAc

65682 ▶▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to Nick Rose, #82 of 1129 🔗

Some time ago (I am doing this from memory, so cannot provide a link) the US army found that multiple flu vaccines on an individual could cause vaccine interference and result in a person suffering more sever reactions to viruses where otherwise a mild or asymptomatic response would have been expected.There is a good video on ‘Perspectives on the pandemic’, Judy Mikovits and Robert Kennedy Jr, 3 in total. Good insight into viruses, retroviruses and dementia,negative effects of masks, her work in HIV, her findings regarding the negative effects of some vaccines grown on mice brain cells etc. Basically a huge range of stuff and very interesting.

63599 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DJ Dod, #83 of 1129 🔗

Lying out of his arse you mean? C’mon, some of us only went to a bog (sub-)standard comprehensive.

63866 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to DJ Dod, 1, #84 of 1129 🔗

If people wear them for long enough, they become habit, then psychologically necessary.

64135 ▶▶▶ Cruella, replying to Lms23, 2, #85 of 1129 🔗

You’re right, that is what worries me. I have to wear them at work all the time. It now feels like something is wrong without one, you find yourself covering your mouth. It’s so bloody bad.

63359 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, -1, #86 of 1129 🔗

New normal mentioned at the 2019 Economic Policy Symposium in Jackson Hole.


From the speech by Chair Powell:

“Era III, 2010 and After: Monetary Policy and the Emerging New Normal
The third era began in 2010 as the recovery from the Great Recession was taking hold. My focus in discussing this era will be on a “new normal” that is becoming apparent in the wake of the crisis. “

63366 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 4, #87 of 1129 🔗

From Mark Carney’s speech:

IV. Medium term: reshuffling the deck by reforming the existing system
In the new world order, a reliance on keeping one’s house in order is no longer sufficient. The neighbourhood too must change.
There can be innocent bystanders but there should be no disinterested observers. We are all responsible for fixing the fault lines in the system.

There are a few more comments in his complete speech that are very similar:


Very, very worrying.

63360 Ethelred the Unready, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 4, #88 of 1129 🔗

I know this is off topic, but this is so depressing, I needed a laugh.

what these fine upholders of law and order need…. 😁

63361 ▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 1, #89 of 1129 🔗


63363 ▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 9, #90 of 1129 🔗

Supports for Copper’s knees..

63369 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 3, #91 of 1129 🔗


63684 ▶▶▶▶ Catherine123, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 2, #92 of 1129 🔗

Brilliant Ethelred!

63755 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Ethelred the Unready, #93 of 1129 🔗

🤣 🤣

63476 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to Ethelred the Unready, #94 of 1129 🔗

“I used to be a police officer, but then i took a woke arrow to the knee.”

63616 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Ethelred the Unready, 1, #95 of 1129 🔗

Was that a Billy Graham rally?

63368 Simon, replying to Simon, 17, #96 of 1129 🔗

Looking at the disposing of hazardous waste, i.e masks, they can only be dropped or discarded by mask wearers.

Certainly isn’t our fault :>)

63373 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Simon, 3, #97 of 1129 🔗

Silly boy, it is, obviously, Trump’s fault!

63526 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to HawkAnalyst, 7, #99 of 1129 🔗

That is the most disgustingly unhygienic measure they could possibly come up with!
Let’s hope the Lords go back to sleep and it gets forgotte about!
Maybe summer recess isn’t such a bad idea.

63527 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to HawkAnalyst, 5, #100 of 1129 🔗

They have gone completely bonkers.
Like the Belgians today.
Or, it’s all part of a really cunning plan.

63579 ▶▶▶ HawkAnalyst, replying to Jay Berger, 2, #101 of 1129 🔗
63376 HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, 5, #102 of 1129 🔗
63899 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to HawkAnalyst, 4, #103 of 1129 🔗

So if the government wanted people to be more confident about going out shopping, mandating masks is the worst choice possible.

63377 Awkward Git, 37, #104 of 1129 🔗

Got bored so sent this e-mail to some national newspapers, the BBC, Sky, ITV etc yesterday.

So far not one – no surprise there. I feel like letting rip at my MP one last time.

“On the 21st July 2020 the Chief Medical Officer of England, Dr Chris Whitty, appeared before a Parliamentary select committee for health and social care.

Under questioning he stated the following on record:

“If you look at the R, and the behaviours, quite a lot of the change that led to the R going below one occurred well before, or to some extent before, the 23rd, when the full lockdown started.”

This, in effect, means that “the virus” infection rate was dropping drastically BEFORE the incarceration of the population started and that the existing precautions – wash hands properly, coughing etiquette, stay at home if you feel ill – were effectively controlling the spread of “the virus”.

It also means that the peak of the infections occurred PRIOR to the population incarceration commenced and as the average time from catching “the virus” to death has been widely stated as 23 days with the peak numbers of deaths occurring approximately 10-14 days from commencement of the incarceration it means that the imprisonment of the population and destruction of the economy has had NO effect whatsoever.

My question especially in light of the above quote is:

Why is this not reported in the MSM?”

63378 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 26, #105 of 1129 🔗

Great video
12 Reasons not to Mandate Masks

“It is no longer about health or science but it became political. The establishment wants to convince us to wear masks because personally wearing a mask psychologically cements in the person this idea that we live in a world where there are dangerous viral pathogens and that the only way you can be protected is to accept that the state is going to control your life and is going to give you vaccines . It is fear based. It is a frenzy, its like a call to war. It is irrational.”

— Prof Denis Rancourt PhD —

63529 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Victoria, 6, #106 of 1129 🔗

And I also think that wearing masks and SD are really omly implemented to squash face to face conversations, particularly in groups, to prevent any dissent from coming up and spreading untraceable and uncontrollable.

64014 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Jay Berger, 3, #107 of 1129 🔗

I really agree with you. I’m not on board with the whole Agenda Whateveritis stuff, but I am on board with the fact that people are trying to make lots of money, in perpetuity, from ‘obligatory’ annual strain-based vaccination for every common ailment (flu, cold, eventually vomiting bugs etc.) A jab for everything you could possibly catch. No more illness. Ever. (In theory, because nature always finds a way).

Anything natural that butts up against this idea must be suppressed until it can be implemented. That includes people talking about what a scam Covid is.

63379 HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, 2, #108 of 1129 🔗

Will Boris’s war on obesity succeed?


Also on the podcast: when is normality going to return, and are anti-vaxxers ‘nuts’?

63414 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to HawkAnalyst, 2, #109 of 1129 🔗

SV40 – no.

63425 ▶▶ Cbird, replying to HawkAnalyst, 3, #110 of 1129 🔗

Truly depressing. They should be ashamed

63428 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to HawkAnalyst, 15, #111 of 1129 🔗

I posted yesterday

We absolutely cannot trust any nutrition advice by the Government. They still use the outdated food pyramid. At the bottom of the pyramid they recommend that we stuff ourselves with a lot of carbohydrates. They even recommend low fat diets that have been debunked. We need good quality fats in our diet and good quality proteins (the building blocks of our bodies).

We are all different and our bodies react differently to different foods – it is not as simple as calories in and out. Some people are very sensitive to carbohydrates and gain weight weight quickly.

The Government’s war on obesity is therefore a red herring

63550 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Victoria, 3, #112 of 1129 🔗

Or yet more opportunism from the seed companies, the frankenmeat manufacturers and the makers of artificial sweeteners.

63581 ▶▶▶ Dave Tee, replying to Victoria, 6, #113 of 1129 🔗

The Govt has no intention of conducting a war on obesity. Obesity, and the diabetes it invariably leads to, are good for the economy. Cheap junk-starch makes megabucks for PepsiNabiscoKelloggCorp, then when we get sick the medical and pharmaceutical industries step in – generating employment for doctors and nurses, and a lot of profit for Glazo & co. Obesity is good for the politicans too, because sick, dependant people are in no position to challenge them or hold them to account.

If you’re waiting for the authorities to make you healthy then you’ll be waiting a long time. I’ve been low-carb for a decade now. I’m 62, no illness, no tablets, and I wiegh ten stone zero. You’ve got to do it for yourself – fatso Johnson ain’t gonna help.

63623 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Dave Tee, 5, #114 of 1129 🔗

That’s it. I eat plenty of fresh green vegetables, meat, fish or eggs, with the occasional week when I eat only soft fruit. I avoid (but have not completely cut out) complex carbs such as bread, potatoes, and pasta, and any chocolate I eat is min 70% cocoa. I avoid processed sugar like the plague.

PS Gents, I recommend broccoli for good prostate health.

63647 ▶▶▶▶▶ Dave Tee, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #115 of 1129 🔗

You’ve got it, Nick. Stay with it mate.

63679 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #116 of 1129 🔗

Why the fruit weeks? Fructose fest!

63802 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Dave Tee, 3, #117 of 1129 🔗

The OH (other half) and I are low carb too. I can thoroughly recommend it. Intermittent fasting is also good. We both have health issues (cancer, asthma) but despite that we’re actually in very good nick at 67 and 71, pretty slim and we are keeping as fit as we possibly can so we can stay out of the hands of big pharma and the ‘health professionals’.

In my opinion you’ve got the politics right too. There’s big money to be made from keeping everyone fat and ill. We’re now in the interesting situation that , as people become increasingly poor, they will only be able to afford junk food. Tax that and we’re looking at mass starvation. Our perception is that people really have got fatter during the Lock-up (apart from the manic cyclists!)

So, it’s really just another psyop. Make it seem as if they really care about our health and well-being as they take away everything that makes life worth living and destroy communication between us.

63985 ▶▶▶▶▶ Dave Tee, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 3, #118 of 1129 🔗

Thanks for your comment, Miriam and good health to you and your OH with your low carb regime. Your politics is spot-on, too! There’s a correlation between lower incomes and obesity, for the reason you have explained. So the lockdown is going inevitably to lead to more obesity – yet another negative result of the current nonsense.

63619 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Victoria, 4, #119 of 1129 🔗

They love to come up with one size fits all directives. A waste of time and a waste of taxpayer monies.

63681 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to richard riewer, 1, #120 of 1129 🔗

Those directives are a goldmine for those businesses who profit from them.

63438 ▶▶ mjr, replying to HawkAnalyst, 14, #121 of 1129 🔗

the government have been doing wonders for obesity so far this year . All those kids not at school and not participating in sports and P.E ( for those schools that still do it) and sitting at home eating junk food .. Same goes for many of the parents.
Unfortunately a proportion of the population are feckless and stupid and will eat junk food. Many say they cannot afford decent food…. but what they are saying is they cannot be bothered to spend time cooking a meal and sitting at a table to eat it. And they think that removing adverts for junk food before the watershed will stop this? If that was the case then i would eat my horse (with vegetables – healthy and nutritious)

63625 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to mjr, 1, #122 of 1129 🔗

Doesn’t sound too healthy for your horse though…

63382 drrobin, #123 of 1129 🔗

Good read as ever, Toby.

Unperturbed by Toby’s store debacle, would anyone else like to see more great pieces of great art available as T-shirts & Tote-bags – a great addition to attire for any sane non-mask wearers?

I do so wish more artists and their publishers could be persuaded to marketing such merchandise to spread sane messages a little wider.

These are my 2 favourites – has anyone else others to recommend?

Bob (Telegraph):

Luca D’Urbino (Economist):

63383 HawkAnalyst, 1, #124 of 1129 🔗

London Underground closer to capacity at weekends as people look to ‘break monotony’ of staying home


63385 Mark, replying to Mark, 59, #125 of 1129 🔗

I find I can no longer watch or listen to Johnson. The anger that boils up is simply too uncomfortable. Like Blair or Cameron after their wars of choice, he has become worse than dead to me. At least in the case of Blair he was nominally a leader of the political “other side”, for me. The betrayal by supposed “conservative” leaders has been by far the more damaging, because it means there is nowhere left to turn, politically.

So Boris is (sort of) admitting that he should have imposed a lockdown earlier, even though he shouldn’t, and claiming the reason he didn’t is because he hadn’t realised back then that scientists studying the disease wrongly assumed asymptomatic transmission was a key driver of the pandemic, even though every man and his dog thought that back in March. However, he has now embraced this assumption – just when we have good reason to doubt it – and is now fully prepared for the next wave, i.e. the Government will repeat the same mistake it made in March and indiscriminately lock up the sick as well as the healthy this winter .

A pretty good assessment of the personal qualities of the man.

Never forget. Never forgive.

63398 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Mark, 12, #126 of 1129 🔗

Absolutely with you on that, Mark. He is indeed one of the growing list of PMs through my life that I would like to cancel!

63483 ▶▶▶ Jane, replying to IanE, #127 of 1129 🔗

Same goes here for the USA presidents.
Can’t bear to watch or listen to ANY of them.
Since 1980, Reagan election.
Nixon was a Cicero compared to what followed.

63492 ▶▶▶ Ethelred the Unready, replying to IanE, 10, #128 of 1129 🔗

I had such high hopes of him, now dashed on the rocks of uselessness…

63440 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Mark, 25, #129 of 1129 🔗

likewise mark – i can’t listen to the bloke – he just spouts soundbites in that irritating bumbling eerr errr hhmmm hmmm and patronising manner – it’s highly irritating and raises my blood pressure too much.
He has a very over inflated ego, self-belief and arrogance and is so characteristic of the public school elites who look down on the little people. Reminds me of the generals in the WW1 who were so out of their depth and experience and ignorantly sent thousands to their deaths with no shame.

I kind of went along with his election bumblings with the positive spin etc … but this shitshow i cannot listen to him or any government minister with their diabolic spin on it – they must think we’re flippin idiots!

63551 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sue, 6, #130 of 1129 🔗

Unfortunately, with respect to a huge chunk of the population, they are right!

63466 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 8, #131 of 1129 🔗

It is his version of the Weapons of Mass Destruction … Programmes subtle (but not so subtle) nudge. He needs to be at The Hague for what he has done to his fellow citizens.

64211 ▶▶▶ ChrisDinBristol, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #132 of 1129 🔗

I hear that Nuremberg has an empty diary . . .

63622 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Mark, 4, #133 of 1129 🔗

He’s more muddled than Winnie the Pooh.

63626 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to richard riewer, 4, #134 of 1129 🔗

How dare you.I happen to think Winnie the Pooh would make an excellent Prime Minister. Especially given the competition.

63660 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #135 of 1129 🔗

I agree. Pooh would say ‘bother’ and go searching for a pot of hunny. Boris would probably say ‘bother’ and pass a law banning hunny.

Last year I bought hundreds of Pooh/Piglet/Tigger/Eeyore stickers on Amazon, stuffed them in my Winnie the Pooh tote bag and gave them away to children walking down the street with their mothers, on buses, nursery schools, etc. I put them on bus shelter adverts, lamp posts, here there and everywhere. I was a self-appointed Pooh propagandist. Whenever I crossed the street at an intersecition I made sure that Pooh’s face was facing the vehicles waiting for the light to change. Several times last year a child would get on the bus I was riding, see my bag and exclaim ‘it’s Pooh Bear! This year I would have been thrown off the bus and taken into custody for endangering the lives of the chiiiiillllldren.

63863 ▶▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to richard riewer, #136 of 1129 🔗

Hope you sent some to China, encourage the locals to rise up against their dictators. The evil piece of work running that totalitarian state is said to look like to Pooh (and get very angry when the comparison is presented), not odd that Boris should be the same as Jinping in this respect, as well as all the ways he’s signed away our rights.

63767 ▶▶ xplod, replying to Mark, #137 of 1129 🔗

Is this the real Boris? Or do we have a “doppelganger” put in place by the Deep State when the real Boris was “ill” with coronavirus. Asking for a friend!

63388 HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, 1, #138 of 1129 🔗

Luton’s mayor broke lockdown rules as town’s coronavirus infections surged


63409 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to HawkAnalyst, 3, #139 of 1129 🔗

On the one hand, good for him exercising his own judgement on the other hand another example of a “do as I say but not as I do politician”.

63534 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to HawkAnalyst, 2, #140 of 1129 🔗

He’s a very naughty boy! Yawn.
Is this news, or a load of scandalmongering that’s past its sell-by date?
They’re scraping the bottom of the barrel – or is Luton next in the firing line for a local lockdown?

64304 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #141 of 1129 🔗

They could save time and trouble by just locking down the mayor.
Note: Luton, like Leicester, is very very Effnick.

63390 HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, 4, #142 of 1129 🔗

Hopes for ‘game-changer’ coronavirus antibody test sinking fast | News | The Times


63397 ▶▶ IanE, replying to HawkAnalyst, 4, #143 of 1129 🔗

Now there’s a surprise!

63536 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to HawkAnalyst, #144 of 1129 🔗

It doens’t matter any more because they’re going to put “it” into the flu jab.

63391 HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, 3, #145 of 1129 🔗

Coronavirus testing may end travel quarantine | News | The Times


63392 ▶▶ IanE, replying to HawkAnalyst, 1, #146 of 1129 🔗

wrong place

63544 ▶▶ HawkAnalyst, replying to HawkAnalyst, #148 of 1129 🔗

Enough moaning about masks. The wartime generation would think we were babies

63582 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to HawkAnalyst, 13, #149 of 1129 🔗

The wartime generation here think this is stupid and “a lot of nonsense” they also think they should carry on as normal looking after themselves and being careful. Which is exactly what they do.

63630 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to HawkAnalyst, 7, #150 of 1129 🔗

Brave, brave Sweden. Such a shame Anders Tegnell isn’t our Chief Scientist.

63396 Paul, replying to Paul, 25, #151 of 1129 🔗

I posted this on yesterdays page before I realised today’s was out,sorry if you’ve already seen it !

I was surprised to be asked why I didn’t have a mask on when I went in my local takeaway last night,they have always been sceptical of all the CV crap and I told them that I would never wear a mask when we were talking a couple of weeks ago.The conversation went,
‘sorry,you need a mask ‘.
‘no,I am exempt’
oh,okay,exempt,didn’t know about exemptions,why are you exempt ? ‘,
‘I don’t have to give you a reason or proof of a reason’
Okay,that’s fine with us,no problem
To be fair to them they weren’t pushy and I have known them quite a while so,afterwards,even though I didn’t need to,I did explain my genuine health reason for not wearing a mask as well as my conscientious objection to being forcibly muzzled and I did show them the exemption card I had in my pocket.
They were very interested as they didn’t know much about exemptions and how to react to someone who claims exemption,in fact it turns out one of the chaps wives has a severe disability and has been struggling badly with wearing a mask so he was pleased he could now tell her she didn’t need to wear one.
I was pleased that the first time I have been confronted about being maskless went well and I was able to have a decent sensible conversation with people about it.
It seems the owners of the takeaway are worried because the local council have implied that they are liable if any customer does not wear a mask,I told them this is not true,it is the person without the mask who could get a fine,they have no obligation to enforce the law.

63530 ▶▶ Hopeful, replying to Paul, 13, #152 of 1129 🔗

Had a telephone conversation with my hairdresser yesterday about her policy of mandatory masks for clients. Salon decided to adopt face nappies because to paraphrase, if we have to wear visors to protect you, it’s only right that you wear a mask to protect us. Undaunted I continued. I am exempt I said. Oh in that case just prove it and you can come in. How do I prove it I asked. The reply was get a letter from your doctor or something. The rest of the conversation is irrelevant to the main points. These being the ignorance displayed by the salon re the efficacy of masks, and the arrogance to think they have a right to demand proof. So much for being a valued customer!

63540 ▶▶▶ Emma, replying to Hopeful, 7, #153 of 1129 🔗

I was told by my local Toni and Guy place (a couple of weeks ago) that it was company policy that customers must wear masks. I said I didn’t want to, but they insisted. After four months of my 19 year old son cutting my hair, I needed a haircut badly so I complied. But I later contacted the head office and was told this:
Thank you for your email.

I can confirm you will not be refused service if you choose not to wear the mask provided however, we do encourage our clients to wear the face masks we provide, this is to ensure the Health and Safety of our clients and staff members.

If you have any other queries please do not hesitate to contact us.

Kind Regards

TONI&GUY Client Care

Since masks are not required in hairdressers under the new regs I look forward to going back for my next appointment and enlightening the manager there.

63580 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Emma, 2, #154 of 1129 🔗

Visors are a hoot. I saw a hairdresser cutting the fringe of a customer. Customer in chair. Hairdresser standing behind and reaching over the top of the customer to cut/fiddle with fringe – normal and typical. Every breath the hairdresser exhaled was funnelled onto the head and shoulders of the customer.

Goof old customer was happily unaware ‘safe’ behind their mask.

64097 ▶▶▶▶▶ Steve, replying to Basics, 1, #155 of 1129 🔗

Which was probably also funneling the customers breath back towards the hairdresser…

63554 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Paul, #156 of 1129 🔗

Wow, the government have told the truth about this, no doubt to cover their posteriors, but the council are downright liars!

63633 ▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Paul, 3, #157 of 1129 🔗

Had to fill car up today. Had no mask (obviously!). 2 other people maskless out of 5 went into pay without a mask, plus me of course. No questions asked, no interest shown. Man behind perspex screen was sporting a mask. 2 blokes stacking shelves – one with who mask at all and the other with his round his neck!

64306 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to HelzBelz, #158 of 1129 🔗

Use pay at pump. Pump doesn’t give an oil fart what you are wearing.

63402 Awkward Git, 6, #159 of 1129 🔗

Found this article that quotes a 2018 article on the link between mask wearing and blood clots:


63404 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 2, #160 of 1129 🔗

A depressing article if ever there was one:


Pretty much one-sided, as you would expect from The Guardian (glad to see everyone in Stratford had got the “memo”).

63412 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Tenchy, 6, #161 of 1129 🔗

Propaganda and psychological warfare increasing daily in leaps and bounds.

63405 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #162 of 1129 🔗

Are that LDS emails still going out? I haven’t had one for days.

63423 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #163 of 1129 🔗


63558 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #164 of 1129 🔗


63408 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 23, #165 of 1129 🔗

Went to local supermarkets yesterday – Waitrose, Tesco, Aldi. Not a word spoken, no problems at all. A couple of ‘Please wear a face covering’ posters. Gel/mask lady at Tesco, but optional. Queue at Aldi, fairly busy, Waitrose/Tesco quieter than normal. A few people without masks in Waitrose and Tesco; none in Aldi – was a very brief visit though.

I overheard (was possibly meant to) one woman in Waitrose asking ‘But I thought everyone had to wear a mask ?’. Response was good, not if they are exempt, we’re not allowed to ask them.

Pubs in the evening – asked to leave one, more later – 2nd pub great, paid cash at bar , then Harveys, outside, handshakes, ciggies, much hilarity. 🙂

Haircut this morning, barber wore visor, didn’t do full beard trim just the edges, otherwise fine.

Noticeably more mask-wearing in public. It is hard to think of suitable treatment for those who put them on children. 🙁

63419 ▶▶ Clive, replying to JohnB, #166 of 1129 🔗

Quite agree re children. There are some f**king idiots out there.

63436 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to JohnB, 2, #167 of 1129 🔗

Roughly what part of the country are you in?

63491 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #168 of 1129 🔗

Sussex, near Lewes.

63415 Awkward Git, 2, #169 of 1129 🔗
63417 Newmill Mark, #170 of 1129 🔗

When, eventually, the hysteria dies down and the people wake up and survey the wreckage I think Boris will be seen as a tragic figure, as well as a clown.  Despite his obvious and plentiful flaws he had an unlikely but clear opportunity to act like his beloved Churchill – he could have followed his first, correct, instinct to “be like Sweden” and emerge as a hero who took a decision that was unpopular with the masses (remember appeasement was the clear will of the country at the time) but completely vindicated by events.  But as we know that requires character, strength of will and any number of other qualities that the despicable charlatan lacks.

63418 Awkward Git, 3, #171 of 1129 🔗

Can’t remember if this website has been posted on here before so I’ll put it on anyway just in case:


63422 Clive, #172 of 1129 🔗

Opening words from the BBC website a couple of days ago evening:

“There is now almost no excuse for not wearing a face mask while out shopping in England – covering your face is as essential as remembering your cash or bank card.”

not the government – the BBC. But is there a difference?

“excuse” is very telling: it puts us in the role of misbehaving children who can be punished;

“reason” would be a better word, but that would put us in the role of thinking adults capable of presenting sensible arguments. Not desirable.

Government proposes – BBC disposes. This is the most shockingly open expression of the BBC’s totalitarian instincts I’ve yet seen.

63426 Mark, replying to Mark, 6, #173 of 1129 🔗

The Four Quadrants of Conformism

That’s an interesting essay, which for me represents a(n apparent) leftist beginning to have to come to terms with the consequences of the more or less complete triumph of the left and its transformation into the ruling elite and the ruling dogma, over the past few centuries (gaining speed throughout so that most of the visible movement has been in the past few decades).

Just as conservatives struggle to work out how to address a situation in which society has been changed so radically that there is nothing left to conserve, so radicals struggle when the nominal radicals are in fact the entrenched elites suppressing dissent from their dogmas.

This doesn’t mean that, as many like to claim, left and right are no longer relevant. These terms represent profoundly significant and fundamental aspects of human nature, and of beliefs about some of the basic aspects of reality. but it certainly complicates their application in practice.

63446 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Mark, #174 of 1129 🔗

That’s excellent. Many thanks.

63447 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to Mark, 1, #175 of 1129 🔗

We have lived through a PC revolution in our times. It has similarities with some other revolutions in mass consciousness e.g. the switch from Georgian creativity and openness to stifling Victorian prudery, the Maoist cultural revolution (so hating of the past) and the Protestant Reformation (far
More and destructive than most people realise).

63604 ▶▶▶ Felice, replying to OKUK, #176 of 1129 🔗

And to that collection of revolutions I would add the islamic revolution since 1979, when fundamentalist islam started to throw its weight around. The middle east is unrecognisable now compared with 30 years ago.

63572 ▶▶ Jane, replying to Mark, 2, #177 of 1129 🔗

Bari Weiss of the NYT, apparently admired by Toby Young, is an aggressive conformist type:

“[4] There has been progress in one area: the punishments for talking about banned ideas are less severe than in the past. There’s little danger of being killed, at least in richer countries. ***The aggressively conventional-minded are mostly satisfied with getting people fired***.’

Weiss has gotten a lot of people fired. Her own “self-firing” is some kind of stunt—a lateral career move of some kind, to get into a position at a difference “influence silo” than the NYT.

BTW, there seem to be very few USA-ians here at LS. This is surprising.

63644 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Mark, #178 of 1129 🔗

Don’t forget a “conservative” in Russia is a dyed-in-the-wool unapologetic Stalinist.

63650 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Nick Rose, #179 of 1129 🔗

Not necessarily. There are plenty of conservatives who are also authoritarian and in Russia they often do hark back to Stalinist times, but more commonly a conservative in Russia is a Christian.

63429 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 3, #180 of 1129 🔗

For “quiet” rebels may I recommend the wearing of the mask under the chin while out shopping. It’s still an annoying infringement of one’s civil liberties but at least you know you are directly contravening the government’s commandment and you are also annoying a lot of self-righteous Maskies. Also if like me you can claim any sort of exemption that will further stir the pot if you do get challenged. .

63432 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to OKUK, 1, #181 of 1129 🔗

Also you are not endangering your own health apart from possibly developing a chin rash!

63437 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to OKUK, 15, #182 of 1129 🔗

This was my reply to your same comment yesterday:

Mmm not sure I understand what you are saying. If you say you are exempt there should not be any confrontation. We either stand up for our ‘rights’ or follow instructions.

If you have a mask around your neck, you indicate that you are willing to wear a mask or have been wearing a mask so in affect you are complying.

Things have changed. We all have to stand up and fight for our rights and liberties.

63445 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Victoria, 6, #183 of 1129 🔗

I agree. Also if you wear mask round neck, more likely to get virtue signallers passive aggressively telling you it how to wear it.

63455 ▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Country Mumkin, #184 of 1129 🔗

Hasn’t happened to me yet.

63873 ▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Country Mumkin, #185 of 1129 🔗

Might be good to get the virtue signalers speaking to you, then you get an opportunity to speak back, and while you might still have one round your neck you’ll be the one who can talk at full volume without being muzzled.

63454 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Victoria, #186 of 1129 🔗

I don’t agree. You are undermining conformism.

63576 ▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to OKUK, 3, #187 of 1129 🔗

I agree.
And there are a LOT of people adopting this strategy here.
Call it maybe “passive aggressive noncormity.”
The mask-around-neck look has almost become a fashion statement. Esp. among men. I expect it to have some influence on “actual” fashion in the near future. In the winter, when people are wearing warmer clothes, I bet there will be a neckwear look based on the noncompliant mask “scarf” or “necklace.”

The more people see that others, too, are just going through the motions, the more (I hope) the whole charade will start to be tacitly recognized for what it is and will fall of its own weight.

63648 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Jane, 4, #188 of 1129 🔗

This doesn’t make sense, though surely? The law is only about wearing it inside shops, so the obvious conclusion when you see someone with it around their neck outside is precisely that they are conforming and are wearing the mask ready to pull it up when they enter a shop?

The only time it would represent dissent is if you were to leave it pulled down when inside a shop, in which case why wear it at all?

64285 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to Mark, #189 of 1129 🔗

In my town, on my island, in my county, USA, one is directed to wear a mask all the time. So any form of noncompliance undermines the narrative of maskwear. The governor of Mass—sorry, that’s Massachusetts—has also introduced NEW quarantine directions for people who visit from states that have high postiive “cases.” Since this is a tourist area with many one-week-or-less stays, the whole thing makes little sense and probably cannot be enforced. But does give greater scope for scolders of various sorts.

63597 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to OKUK, #190 of 1129 🔗

Setting a great example here on correct mask-wearing and 1m social distancing.

comment image ?width=700&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=348adb3eae8bbd48374f669998eb053e

63736 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, #191 of 1129 🔗

Sorry, suspect paywall.

63612 ▶▶ Felice, replying to OKUK, 5, #192 of 1129 🔗

I’m a quiet rebel too (actually a coward because I think that our town has a high proportion of mask zealots if the past few weeks are anything to go by )

My face mask is made from a patterned net curtain with lots of holes, and is more like a very short ‘niqab’ that does not reach to my chin and allows loads of air to circulate. Also the elastic straps are a bit long so it keeps slipping down below my nose….

I’m seriously wondering about going down the exemption route though. I suffer from claustrophobia and after about 5 mins in a more normal mask I was starting to get really anxious as it got all hot and damp around my nose and mouth.

63431 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 6, #193 of 1129 🔗

Reading the article about the disabled girls who were harangued by a mask-wearing moron on a train, I strongly suspect that people here hoping to use “exemption” from wearing masks will be disappointed in the long run. From the article:

‘We welcome the Government’s introduction of ‘exemption cards’, but more must be done to raise public awareness of who is exempt from wearing face coverings, so the public are on board and disabled people feel supported.’

I predict that anyone who waves a card bought off the internet may, in fact, be subject to more self-righteous abuse from the mask-wearing public than if they didn’t have a card at all. Not only will the mask zealot be feeling virtuous about the mask, they’ll be feeling virtuous about their ‘awareness’ and tolerance of genuine disabled people. When they see you with your laser-printed card, they’re not going to like it.

The saddest thing from the article is that the girl subjected to the abuse says:

Not enough people are taking this pandemic seriously but this behaviour is never acceptable.

63433 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Barney McGrew, 17, #194 of 1129 🔗

That’s my concern about claiming exemptions – it inherently concedes the legitimacy of the rules themselves, even if that is not our intention.

But not everyone is in a position to openly confront authority, or the mob.

63457 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Mark, 3, #195 of 1129 🔗

What if Rosa Parks had a badge to say she had a bad leg! Joke

63655 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #196 of 1129 🔗

Rosa Parks had more courage than few others ever manage. Else what she started would have happened before. Someone to admire.

64385 ▶▶▶▶▶ Catherine123, replying to Nick Rose, #197 of 1129 🔗

I’ve thought about her a bit recently and absolutely someone to admire.

63462 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 13, #198 of 1129 🔗

Mark, the nasty woman on the train would almost certainly not have challenged a man. Middle-aged women in particular will be very nasty to other women, younger women, and teenagers/children, boys and girls alike.

As I posted yesterday. A plea to all men – please lead the way in thwarting the mask nazis.

A plea to all women – search your soul, support your sisters who were given Primodos or who had vaginal mesh implants, and shun the vaccine bandwagon by boycotting this winter’s Flu jab if you are not on the pre-existing list.

63480 ▶▶▶▶ Paul, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #199 of 1129 🔗

I agree,seven out of the eight times in the past months someone has had a go at my wife about distancing in shops it has been a middle aged woman.No-one has ever said a word when I have been with her.

63585 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to Paul, 2, #200 of 1129 🔗

These are the “Karens.”
My definition of this term is women who see themselves as proxies for authority, self-appointed as being given a right—a duty—to enforce rules promulgated by authorities of various kinds on strangers, including other adults.
Thus, in the lingo of seventies, “authoritarian personality” enforcers.

63742 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Jane, 1, #201 of 1129 🔗

It also comes from centuries of having no voice.

64093 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to bluemoon, 1, #202 of 1129 🔗

I don’t think any of them are centuries old. Just middle aged, at most, and never personally experienced any society other than a universal suffrage one.

64277 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to bluemoon, 1, #203 of 1129 🔗

Nah it comes from however long they’ve been alive with a self-esteem problem that they project onto other women who don’t have one.

63484 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 17, #204 of 1129 🔗

A fair point, and we all need to do as much as we feel able, to confront and to undermine this disgusting situation, and to help and support others who try to do so.

The concern, though is that there is a much higher risk of actual violence when men are involved in such confrontations.

My first experience under the latest regime was going into my local Co-op yesterday. Previously almost nobody wore masks there. Yesterday, I was one of only two not wearing whilst I was in there. I know the management will not enforce the requirement, so there is no need to hide behind any exemption tag.

As I walked in (briskly because I don’t enjoy shopping and had no intention of wasting any more time at it than absolutely necessary) I was challenged by a man on his way out who chirped up “you’ve to wear a mask, mate” in an aggressive tone, so I just growled “no, I don’t” to him as I swept past. If I had stopped to argue with him it could easily have developed into a physical confrontation, and now is not the time for such in my judgement. Wait until the initial rush of compliance has died down and people start to become more jaded about the whole thing.

For the moment, just the sight of people not wearing these badges of submission is what is most important.

63493 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 4, #205 of 1129 🔗

I agree with that. Yes, man-on-man challenge is more likely to escalate to physical abuse than woman-on-woman. My mother has challenged men in the past for very bad language in public places, and a woman once for hitting her child in public, but that was in 1970s Newcastle, and times were different. I once challenged a youth ‘of colour’ on the Tube many years ago in a similar manner, and a very large lady ‘of colour’ grabbed me and intimated to be careful. She was genuinely concerned, I took the cue, and we smiled at each other. You have to read the situation.

63498 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #206 of 1129 🔗

Hmm, the feminazis will use masculinity as a badge of shame – and be doubly attacking!

63509 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #207 of 1129 🔗

True.one of these women had a go at my 17 yo daughter yesterday,she was laughing at her friend over something then was admonished with the words your wouldn’t be laughing if you were in ICU’
What sort of world are we now living in?

63637 ▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #208 of 1129 🔗

Get your daughter to answer along the lines of “I didn’t know xxxxx had the monopoly on being arseholes”.

XXX being whatever your daughter wants – as she is 17 I’d say she says “young women”.

63608 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #209 of 1129 🔗

Well said TT.

64276 ▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #210 of 1129 🔗

Yup. Karens frigging LoVe me!!

63444 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Barney McGrew, 10, #211 of 1129 🔗

Just print the government one then. I have a legit reason but I’d have done it anyway. GPs who aren’t able to conduct routine screenings or see patients certainly won’t have the capacity to issue exemption letters so I think it will remain self certified. And tbh I think the government is deliberately offering people a way out because they know this is not about “stopping the spread” but about getting the most scared out of their houses.

63561 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 6, #212 of 1129 🔗

I certainly agree with that last part. The broad wording of the exemptions and the fact that self-certification is the only process says to me that the government know it’s a nonsense and are trying to avoid it causing confrontation.

63564 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 16, #213 of 1129 🔗

If they want to get the terrified out from their houses, the thing to do is lift ALL restrictions and let us get on with our lives. When the overly timid see we’re not dying in the streets, they’ll come out.

63614 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #214 of 1129 🔗

I don’t think they want people to come out. I think they want to maintain the illusion that there’s a terrifying virus out there.
Sometimes, the Cabinet members’ blatant mendacity makes me wonder if they’re disappointed by how gullible the public has been and getting rather bored with the whole thing.

64307 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, #215 of 1129 🔗

‘Hey! chaps, I’m bored, shall we have another laugh and force the zombies to hop around supermarkets on one leg?’
‘Too obvious, Ken, we want something really, really funny.’
‘Face masks on babies?’
‘Good one!’

64197 ▶▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #216 of 1129 🔗

I’ve got the hidden disabilities badge attached to the bright Sainsbury’s green & sunflower lanyard. Visited to 2 Boots stores for friend, small village one immediately asked I just held up badge and said I’m exempt. Bigger branch wasn’t bothered. No hassle.

63607 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #217 of 1129 🔗

The other point is that it was a female teenager who was being bullied. If the victim had been a six foot shaven-haired muscly male with tattoos, not a word would have been spoken.

63771 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #218 of 1129 🔗

My friend and I had a slightly similar encounter in a church in the City of London where we were forced to sanitise our hands and leave our details for the NHS T&T. We refused so walked out.

I can guarantee you if we were two 6 foot tall blokes built like Arnold S or two black men or even two black women, we would never have been forced to do any of the above.

64278 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #219 of 1129 🔗

You guys deifnitely have a point. It reminds me of the Tv Licence goons and the fact that the people who are prosecuted for not paying are invaribly women. Because women are easy targets who are easily bullied into letting them in their houses and don’t argue with them.

64330 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Farinances, #220 of 1129 🔗

Yep. We just sent a letter of complaint to the Bishop of London for this appalling behaviour.

63435 Crazy Hoarse, #221 of 1129 🔗

Just went to my local Morrisons (North-West England). Besides me, the only others not masked there were 2 teenage boys, 1 man with his masked wife, 1 middle aged woman, a few had their masks round their chins. No dirty looks, no comments. Will be shopping there again.

Keep up the good work Toby. You’re doing this country a great favour

63439 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 12, #222 of 1129 🔗

SCIENCE FRAUD: Florida Gov. calls for investigation into why people are testing “positive” for coronavirus tests they never received
“According to reports, Gov. DeSantis has asked the state’s Department of Health to look into the situation further. He announced that it makes no sense whatsoever that people who were never even evaluated by a practitioner are now receiving anomalous positive test results that are being used by some to push for more lockdowns and mask-wearing.

Now it appears as though people who were never even tested are being told, possibly at random, that they have the coronavirus, which further skews the official statistics and makes it seem as though “spikes” of infection are occurring when they are actually not.”


63442 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Victoria, 7, #223 of 1129 🔗

Because this is a political scam and Johnson must know it is, so he’s doubly bad in my eyes! He’s a fake!

63463 ▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Bella Donna, #224 of 1129 🔗

Why are they in it?
Why are people like Trump and Johnson U-turning and acting against all their prior beliefs?
Why has Toennies skimped on retesting his infected workers for free to whitewash himself after a talk with PM Laschet?

It doesn’t make any sense.

63486 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Jay Berger, 7, #225 of 1129 🔗

I have seen no evidence either the PM or Trump have much in the way of beliefs, other than in their own greatness

63617 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bella Donna, 2, #226 of 1129 🔗

I suspect Bloris didn’t know what he was getting himself into until he was up to the neck. Maybe that’s why he looks so haggard nowadays.

Why doesn’t he get out or come clean? I’m sure the real powers that be have a powerful hold over him.

63450 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Victoria, 10, #227 of 1129 🔗

The good news is – if you prefer Trump to ‘sleepy Joe’ Biden, as I do – De Santis is a Trump ally. Florida is the swing state in this election. Texas looks as though it is well past the worst of the virus, and in any event, the oil industry has had its second bailout, and California is Democrat heaven. A scandal in Florida to make the virus appear worse than it is, must be a few extra points on the Republican ticket? The best chance of the corona madness ending is if Trump gets a second term, in my view.

63666 ▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #228 of 1129 🔗


64279 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #229 of 1129 🔗

I agree on all counts. Trump is hands down better than Biden (who is just basically being primed to be Hillary Clinton’s sock puppet). You can tell what Trump really thinks because that’s the first thing that comes out of his mouth (i.e. Covid is just flu, masks are bullshit, HCQ works) – 50% of the time he’s right (he was with Covid). After that he’ll flipflop as it suits him politically – but his FIRST statement (before the media advisors get to him ;p) is always what he really thinks. This to me is way better (and way more predictable – despite what everyone says about him being a wildcard) than some lying bloody Democrat who talks the game and means absolutely nothing they say.

63441 Nigel Sherratt, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 7, #230 of 1129 🔗

Well done ‘Mask Man’ for not stepping on the cracks and so avoiding the bears.

64308 ▶▶ annie, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #231 of 1129 🔗

I am a bear.
This is not fair.
A bear has to eat.
Masks are a cheat.

63443 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 11, #232 of 1129 🔗

Early start for me this morning, bus passed me 07:30, chap on the top deck on his own wearing a black mask and huge headphones.

1st thing I thought was guantanamo bay inmate. Sad days.

Overheard a conversation at the golf club, chap literally salivating at the thought of a vaccine. Sad days

63728 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to stefarm, 4, #233 of 1129 🔗

I hear a lot of that, along the lines of “Can’t wait for the vaccine so this can all be over”. This is exactly the objective – make life so miserable that people will be desperate for the vaccine.

64248 ▶▶▶ Hugh, replying to Chicot, #234 of 1129 🔗

nuts to big pharma

63448 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 7, #235 of 1129 🔗

Is this government rowing back? Realising they’ve unleashed something very nasty, getting people to turn on each other and they have got to do something about it?

If I understand the matter correctly you go on a government website – this one:-

( https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own )

download perfunctory looking exception “notice” which you can print off paste on a card and wear round your neck – or just download on your mobile!. No doctor’s certificate required. One certify’s oneself!

Isn’t “extreme anxiety” a ground for exemption? And isn’t anxiety being inflicted on anyone who doesn’t want to wear a mask?

Ah! – but it has to be “extreme” – how does one prove that? Profuse sweating?

63473 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Ned of the Hills, #236 of 1129 🔗

Absolute Charlies

63490 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Two-Six, 4, #237 of 1129 🔗

There’s too much charlieism around for me to buy into it. What evidence do we see of a cock-up? None. Plenty of apparent results of cock-ups but never evudence or explanation. One of our great problems is thinking these people in charge have similar morals as us and so we judge them according to our own morals. It’s a simple explanation that suits our belief system. But at some point, without evidence of mistakes, it will be realised we give them a free pass every time. What’s more, they know we do.

Not a jab at you 2-6. A general comment brought about by your word. Thanks for your great comments.

63525 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, #238 of 1129 🔗

I was being polite, like in the war. It’s code for C*&^s

63559 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Two-Six, #239 of 1129 🔗

Charlies. Gotcha! Twosixer Oscar and out.

63590 ▶▶▶▶ Jane, replying to Basics, #240 of 1129 🔗

What does “Charlies” mean?

63683 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Jane, 1, #241 of 1129 🔗

According to 2 6 it means cunts. But i took it to mean chumps.

63693 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, 1, #242 of 1129 🔗

That’s always been my take on it.

63501 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #243 of 1129 🔗

How would one DISprove that one’s anxiety is extreme?!

63514 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to IanE, 4, #244 of 1129 🔗

It’s absurd but I don’t imagine the government care much as they are relying on propaganda and peer pressure to do the bulk of the work

The exemptions are there to deflect criticism from people who would otherwise support this but are hot opposing disability discrimination-these days a real taboo. I’m sure it’s all been carefully calculated

63539 ▶▶ birdwatcher, replying to Ned of the Hills, 7, #245 of 1129 🔗

Its absolutely not a rolling back. Its simply them exerting more control and bringing ‘rebels’ into line. Requiring people to carry an official exemption card is as bad as requiring face coverings. How do people not see this??

63621 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to birdwatcher, 1, #246 of 1129 🔗

At least the card carriers aren’t literally de-facing themselves!

63829 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #247 of 1129 🔗

It’s a tricky one, this, isn’t it? I’ve read several comments on this and other sites, plus a couple of articles that make the point that having an exemption card/badge/lanyard is playing the Government’s game as much as wearing a mask. I have to agree with this but then, it’s a wearing prospect to go into battle every time you need to shop for the foreseeable future. Shopping online is also playing the government’s game.

I don’t have any good answers. Our M.O. at the moment is to walk in, maskless, and then, if challenged, say we’re exempt. We’ve got a card in our pocket just in case but it shouldn’t really be needed, by law. We’ve had no grief from members of the public and we’ve seen a few other people without masks but we haven’t been in many shops yet.

I actually think the Government card is a collector’s item, assuming we survive this hell. One one side it says ‘I’m a leper, keep your distance’ and on the other, ‘be kind’. Woke, whiny and totalitarian all in one go. Superb job, SPI-B!

p.s. My husband thinks an exemption card could be a way of marking out us as untermenschen. Since we’re also old, we’re doomed either way!

63923 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #248 of 1129 🔗

We’ve got a card in our pocket just in case but it shouldn’t really be needed, by law.

I think that’s the right approach. Nothing really wrong with having the card in case it’s useful to defuse a situation, but the key is not to display it publicly all the time, or use it automatically as you go in.

The important thing is for people to just see other people not wearing masks, and without having any obvious “authorisation” not to do so.

63449 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 10, #249 of 1129 🔗

600,000 people sign petition calling for Bill Gates to be investigated for crimes against humanity
The petition is hosted on the White House’s We the People website, which is a public relations platform that allows citizens to express themselves. The site enables people to create a petition calling on the White House to take some action on a particular issue. According to the White House, any petition that receives 100,000 signatures in 30 days will be seen by the appropriate policy experts and will receive an official response from the White House within 60 days.

The petition’s description says that many questions remain unanswered about the Gates and the global push for vaccines and biometric tracking.

The petition’s author, who is identified only by the initials C.S., points out that Gates has publicly stated in the past that he would like to reduce population growth by 10 to 15 percent through vaccination. Along with the World Health Organization (WHO) and UNICEF, Gates has been accused of purposely sterilizing children in Kenya via an antigen in a tetanus vaccine.

The petition goes on to state that Congress and other governing bodies are “derelict in duty until a thorough and public inquiry is complete.”

[Gates have been connected] to many different vaccines and other medical experiments that have damaged the health of African women and children. For example, their foundation funded the phase 3 trial of an experimental vaccine for malaria in 2010 that left 1,000 African infants with serious side effects like seizures and paralysis; 151 of the infants died.


63643 ▶▶ Jane, replying to Victoria, #250 of 1129 🔗
63688 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Jane, #251 of 1129 🔗

The best Statement ever!

64281 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Jane, #252 of 1129 🔗

He should have continued to #10 Downing Street and given PM Boris the Full Monty. Maybe that’s where he was headed?

63452 AN other lockdown sceptic, 3, #253 of 1129 🔗

Behind the masks – 12 Reasons to NOT mandate masks

63453 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 1, #254 of 1129 🔗
63459 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Harry hopkins, #255 of 1129 🔗

Because what could possibly go wrong with people inhaling hypochlorous acid? Oh look: https://www.atsjournals.org/doi/full/10.1513/pats.201001-009SM

63897 ▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to IMoz, #256 of 1129 🔗

Not to mention entering the eyes. And what if some of that (probably conductive) liquid makes it in to the guts of a phone, criminal damage by the tunnel operator to people’s property too.

63465 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Harry hopkins, 1, #257 of 1129 🔗

Interesting chart on the page, a chart with a line indicating target level cases per day – 1k, the chart clearly shows cases have been below it barring a couple of small spikes since June

63469 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Harry hopkins, #258 of 1129 🔗

… and it seems they got the science part wrong, this is for H7N1 influenza subtype: “In [indirect spray] form, the 200 ppm solution inactivated AIV within 10 min of contact , while 50 and 100 ppm could not inactivate it .” https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4363024/

63456 EllGee, replying to EllGee, 21, #259 of 1129 🔗

Couldn’t do the shops yesterday so this morning was the first venture out. Hello face, nice to see you, said the man behind the counter. I mimed kisses in an (anti) socially distanced manner. We agreed it was a right load of bo***ocks. He said he was worried that he’d had some people come in who genuinely seemed to believe from midnight on Friday they could catch it again.

63833 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to EllGee, 1, #260 of 1129 🔗

OMG, keep remembering what George Carlin said about stupidity.

63458 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, #261 of 1129 🔗

As my friend in Melbourne said a few weeks ago, the military operating in Victoria on anti-covid track and trace operations:


Coming to the UK soon as the next stage of track and trace?

63472 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Awkward Git, 4, #262 of 1129 🔗

that’s very scary … if T&T can’t contact the person over 2 hour period they will send the army to their house. Seems rather reminiscent of a little man with a moustache and inferiority complex some years ago!!

63460 Simon, replying to Simon, 13, #263 of 1129 🔗

Maybe if all this stop the virus at all costs nonsense is going to Boris’ head, and he thinks he is succeeding, maybe someone can suggest to him that he could stop the tide coming in…

63471 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Simon, 5, #264 of 1129 🔗

To be fair to the grand old king, he was making a point about the stupidity of his advisors

63474 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to mhcp, 9, #265 of 1129 🔗

Our tragedy is that we have not just foolish advisers but a foolish leader as well…

63481 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 11, #266 of 1129 🔗

It goes beyond that. The end game is the vaccine, and someone/persons have enrolled us, the UK population, as the Phase III trial for the world. Call me old fashioned, or a conspiracy theorist, but when the SoS for Business is out promoting the vaccine, and the vaccine czar is a biotech financier, what else should we conclude? Follow the money!

63494 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #267 of 1129 🔗

TT. Saw the Boris walk you refered to yesterday. He is not well. As you said. Something is badly amiss. Reminiscent of killary’s neurological problems on stage in 2016.

Anyone not liking the expression killary might like to view https://youtu.be/6DXDU48RHLU to understand why I used tge name.

63499 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Basics, #268 of 1129 🔗

Ask Huma!

63520 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Basics, 1, #269 of 1129 🔗

Don’t mind at all.

63516 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #270 of 1129 🔗

i reckon end-game is vaccine and digital id which will track everything and limit where you can go/do. It’s happening now in china. I posted a video above from youtube – i find it very disturbing agenda even if not all achieved.

64252 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Hugh, replying to Sue, #271 of 1129 🔗

Strewth! I knew we were too close to China but really! Is there any political party not too close to the prc? I suppose their people are monitoring these sites, unfortunately – I await a knock – or worse

64452 ▶▶ Paul Mendelsohn, replying to Simon, #272 of 1129 🔗

You mean he’s a Cnut?

63461 Steeve, 15, #273 of 1129 🔗

Copy from earlier this morning as new comment page started – we need to encourage each other!

Nervous – Needed to pick up a Hoover from Argos this morning. Deep breathing exercises before I left. Walked around a little because I was early, surprised everyone wearing a mask going into local Tesco – local butchers looked hopeful! Anyway down to Sainsburys – 8am and not busy – walked straight in and asked two members of staff(wearing masks) what time Argos(inside store) opened “8am” “Thank You” – Walked down to Argos Section – all good so far, lady came to serve me – not wearing a mask Hurray! Nice chat about hoovers etc – Smiled at each other walked out with my Shark Hoover. Mission accomplished! Co op later for my parents.

63464 Jane, replying to Jane, 1, #274 of 1129 🔗

Daily Mail story about the incident on the Merseyside train includes this:

“He [some kind of official] said: ‘These experiences cause distress and anxiety, and lead many disabled people to feel they have to stay at home, where they become isolated.”

Hey, you don’t say! Isolation is BAD.
Hey, what about that Lockdown!
For everyone!

Now they are lying their pants off about the efficacy of mask wearing.
Is that to try to cure Lockdown Syndrome while avoiding the obviously needed CLIMBDOWN? Climbdown Avoidance explains Johnson’s twisting and turning as detailed by Toby, above.

Ryan Christian, at LastAmericanVagabond.com, has a guided tour through the current suppression of scientific papers on mask INefficacy in a recent Daily Roundup.

Unfortunately, Christian is a terrible online talent. He wanders, he is voluble to no purpose, he wanders off into very long digressions and detours while the screen jumps up and down of the document he is showing, which one cnnot read because his voice doesn’t ever cease its machine-gun action, is a terrible speaker and doesn’t use a script, which he definitly needs. If only he would channel Freddie Sayers or James Corbett! Or, Whitney Webb.

And Christian does have Whitney Webb, who has signed on to Last American Vagabond (Christian must have some cash to pay her). And he has compiled a great deal of evidence of the science-censorship crime under way in the USA and elsewhere.

63904 ▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Jane, #275 of 1129 🔗

I hope this whole mask farce is an attempt to back down from the crimes and errors of lockdown, but I fear it could just as easily be laying foundations for more (and more fanatically tyrannical) lockdowns to follow.

63467 Catherine, replying to Catherine, 10, #276 of 1129 🔗

Went just over the border to Monmouth for my shopping, very few masks! I will carry on unless they make them mandatory there too. The bonus was Green & Jenks ice cream 🍦

64253 ▶▶ Hugh, replying to Catherine, #277 of 1129 🔗

seriously, how long do you reckon for Wales? two weeks? less? my preferred holiday stopovers in Wales are still closed from what I’ve heard. I fear for that country

63479 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Mark, 3, #279 of 1129 🔗

great video – he tells it as it is.

63515 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Mark, 2, #280 of 1129 🔗


63707 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, #281 of 1129 🔗


63733 ▶▶ M Hopkirk, replying to Mark, #282 of 1129 🔗

Thanks Mark, he is absolutely right. Could do with many more people like him.

63477 mhcp, replying to mhcp, -3, #283 of 1129 🔗

I saw in ZeroHedge that the next big thing will be the full declassifying of UFO data. Some has already been admitted, recently. But more to come.

So the “Aliens” narrative will probably be with us October just before the US election.

63531 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to mhcp, #284 of 1129 🔗

I saw this also, weird timing.

64254 ▶▶▶ Hugh, replying to BecJT, #285 of 1129 🔗

nothing to do with the CIA obviously…

63634 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to mhcp, 1, #286 of 1129 🔗

Ronald Reagan in the speech at the end of his presidency (if I remember correctly) said, to paraphrase, an alien invasion was what was required to unite the human race.

No surprise it’s being raised now what with the US space force and the RAF now doing space defence – I was looking at their websites a few days ago.

63917 ▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Awkward Git, #287 of 1129 🔗

If there was an alien “invasion”* the human race as it stands has no chance. While we faff about making speeches and uniting for a brave mission the aliens would have just set a few hundred lumps of tungsten at >95% c (light speed) on course to hit Earth. We’d barely even have time to see it coming. If we ever get attacked by real aliens their technology to have crossed the interstellar voids will be so superior to ours that we’ll be like ants before a bulldozer, the intelligence and independent mindedness those aliens will need to have to develop such tech will be so stunning as to show up all humanity as moronic conformists. The only reason there would be an “alien attack” of a strength we could unitedly oppose is if some human was running a setup for poliical gains.

*invasion implies they’d want out planet, they wouldn’t, they’d just want to make us extinct before we could be a threat able to compete with them

63482 Basics, replying to Basics, 13, #288 of 1129 🔗

Masks. Faceless friends and family. Dehumanising. Politicians are sinister and evil. Why we fight. Has any man said as eloquently what many of us know and feel as John Waters from Ireland.

John Waters. https://youtu.be/rcQSnUCzjfc

3 minutes of extraordinary powerful comment

You and I are but a festering mass of bacteria to them.

Thank you John Waters for standing so tall. Inspirational.

63711 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, 1, #289 of 1129 🔗

Brilliant. Thanks.

63743 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Basics, 1, #290 of 1129 🔗


Politicians are sinister and evil.

They are destroying individuality

63485 Tyneside Tigress, 5, #291 of 1129 🔗

Many of you will be aware of Eye Spy MP, where people post pictures of MPs to Twitter, for example, when spotted travelling first class on public transport. Suggest we all do the same for MPs or anyone else famous spotted anywhere sans mask (as per the clip of Dr Fauci the other day)

63488 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 6, #292 of 1129 🔗

I shared this yesterday or day before about the golfer Andrew Johnston


He has had previously admitted to having anxiety issues, seems lockdown has clearly exacerbated them.

Brave of him to speak out, the fall out from this ludacris lockdown is immeasurable.

63495 ▶▶ Julian, replying to stefarm, 2, #293 of 1129 🔗

Good luck to him

Interesting that the golf authorities have engaged mental health consultants and this seems to be seen as normal

Logically therefore we all ought to have mental health consultants available to us….

64282 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Julian, 1, #294 of 1129 🔗

Petition the government. We want shrinks!

63497 RickH, replying to RickH, 7, #295 of 1129 🔗

Just looking at the web page for the anti-mask petition :


Particularly, the map, on the next page is a sad commentary on the idle compliance of the Great British Public.

Ah, Hitler, thou shouldst be living at this hour – England would be a walk-over!

63502 ▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 1, #296 of 1129 🔗

Rugby and Hastings apparently Resistance hotbeds.

16731 signatures atm.

63505 ▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Mark, 1, #297 of 1129 🔗

My wife was number 16731!

63535 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steeve, 1, #298 of 1129 🔗

Up to 16831 now – 100 in 30 minutes. Needs to step up to get to the 100,000 mark in a reasonable time!

63566 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Mark, 1, #299 of 1129 🔗

Only 24 minutes for the next 100 (you know you’re getting desperate when you have to look to the second order differential for encouragement…)

64255 ▶▶▶▶▶ Hugh, replying to Mark, #300 of 1129 🔗

just out of interest, was there a petition calling for this rule (compulsory masks) and how far did it get?

63512 ▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to Mark, #301 of 1129 🔗

Better send for Hancock to do a few tests and lock them down.

63519 ▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Bugle, #302 of 1129 🔗

He has a team driving there right now!

63537 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to RickH, 2, #303 of 1129 🔗

The petition hasn’t had much publicity – none that I’m aware of on Radio 4. But, that said, the numbers signing are disappointingly low – especially in Scotland. Note how no one has sign it in the Hebrides or in Orkney – is that because they don’t bother to wear them there?

64024 ▶▶▶ bluefreddy, replying to Ned of the Hills, #304 of 1129 🔗

The petition is about mandatory face coverings in English shops. Why would the Scots care?

64387 ▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to bluefreddy, #305 of 1129 🔗

Yes, I realised that subsequently. Though people in Scotland have signed it.

64283 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Ned of the Hills, #306 of 1129 🔗

Contact community radio stations and independent media outlets. Podcasts. Anything you can think of.

63929 ▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to RickH, #307 of 1129 🔗

Funnily enough there’s a 16K signature petition on the .gov website for a ban on face coverings in public places. Old enough to, I suspect, be referrring more to religious headgear. Still, we’re not against masks, just against mandatory rules, we support freedom of choice so I couldn’t really advocate for using that petition as a sly way to get the coronanist bed wetters banned from muzzling themselves.

63503 BecJT, replying to BecJT, 21, #308 of 1129 🔗

Right, now I’m really angry. Not only has the poet Brian Bilston utterly disappointed me by joining the mask zealots, and mocking dissent, but this has just tipped me over the edge.

Oxford Rape Crisis has written a handy post for rape survivors on how to cope with having a fucking rag pressed over their faces (note ‘cope’) https://www.osarcc.org.uk/coping-with-a-face-covering-as-a-survivor-of-sexual-violence/

Violence against women and children has gone off the charts under lockdown (it was fairly epidemic before all this) and services are really under pressure (not least from transactivists who think women subject to violence are not entitled to a female only spaces from from dudes who think they’re ladies, but I digress).

Also imagine if you are suffering from PTSD, which means you are in a state of ‘hyper arousal’ to any threat, if you are surrounded by mask wearers, you cannot read facial expressions which is how we largely unconsciously read ‘intent’ and whether someone is going to hurt us.

I could cry.

63931 ▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to BecJT, #309 of 1129 🔗

I don’t know the first thing about Brian Bilston or what he writes, but by your disappointment I gues you used to like him before he fell into coronazealotry. I’ve had similar things happen with authors I’ve approved of, they were so big on civil rights before and now their (personally run, not by some corporate middle man desperate not to offend) blogs are hiding any comment which suggests that Britain would have been better off following Sweden.

64215 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to BecJT, #310 of 1129 🔗

Right, now I’m really angry. Not only has the poet Brian Bilston utterly disappointed me by joining the mask zealots, and mocking dissent, …

Had never heard of the dude, so looked him up. Did nothing say (or shout) psy-op to you, Bec ?

64257 ▶▶ Hugh, replying to BecJT, #311 of 1129 🔗

could I possibly mock mask zealots? “don’t panic captain mainwaring, don’t paniiiiiiic! There’s a bug on the loose! Fix bayonets! They don’t like it up them, they do not like it up them!!!

63506 Sue, replying to Sue, 7, #312 of 1129 🔗

Oh boy this video is pretty scary about digital identity coming along next year with your medical records etc …

I think i’ll emigrate to a small island and live off-grid – seems the only way forward!

63523 ▶▶ anon, replying to Sue, 4, #313 of 1129 🔗

at this point I would like to do the same

63541 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Sue, 7, #314 of 1129 🔗

My two sons have taken it upon themselves to learn Swedish during the lockdown – that will be their third European language!

63560 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #315 of 1129 🔗

Sadly, from what you’ve said about their political leanings, I doubt they will find Sweden generally much to their liking other than on the coronapanic issue.

It’s a huge irony and a source of particular sadness to me that the only real resistance to this broadly leftist-inspired (Guardian/BBC/US Democrat etc) panic was from a famously left-leaning country.

Though there is resistance to the leftist consensus in Sweden and one can hope that a more patriotic and conservative time will come there.

63939 ▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Mark, #316 of 1129 🔗

Shows that our left aren’t the proper left any more. Our left have become nothing but small minded authoritarian turds. Leftism used to be about liberalism, live your life your way and let others do as they will. I fell disgusted every time a lockdown zealot claims to be “liberal”. Sweden’s biggest problem, to my undrstanding, is that good honest cash is close to extinction there and most payments have moved to sinister middleman-middleman transaction methods.

63507 Bugle, replying to Bugle, 20, #317 of 1129 🔗

Johnson is convinced about one thing only: he ought to be Prime Minister. “There will be plenty of opportunities to learn the lessons of what happened.” Except for those who are dead, of course, and those who will suffer premature deaths due to denial of treatment.

“What happened” sounds a bit like Nixon’s “Mistakes were made.” As if Boris was just a hapless bystander while all these things just “happened” around him, and not that he as PM made the politically driven decision to save the NHS at any cost, the mistake from which all the other mistakes flowed: care home deaths, the deaths of the undiagnosed and untreated, the crashing of the economy.

Then this gem: “What people want to focus on now…” Exactly what we might have heard from Blair or Cameron. There was a time when I really thought Boris would be different, a breath of fresh air. But no, the same calculating, callous, let’s move on BS we’ve had from every other government, which shows this is just another government.

63533 ▶▶ James007, replying to Bugle, 10, #318 of 1129 🔗

“What people want to focus on..” or “here is what I want to talk about”.

Johnson is a void. Where there should be ideas, leadership and courage, he only has frivolous lines and focus grouped slogans.
In another life he could be a Labour Prime Minister. He would follow any cause if it meant he could be popular.
I am afraid that any inquiry will be a stitch-up, designed to come to an answer within the bounds of acceptability. No lessons will be learned, except those the government decides it wants to learn.

63746 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to James007, 1, #319 of 1129 🔗

If the enquiry is a stitchup (inevitable), the obvious thing for the government to learn will be that they can get away with murder – literally.

64284 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to James007, #320 of 1129 🔗

Charlatan Boris.

63510 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 6, #321 of 1129 🔗

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.07.23.20160762v1Just published not peer-reviewed
“Our inferences result in herd immunity thresholds around 10-20%, considerably lower than the minimum coverage needed to interrupt transmission by random vaccination, which for R_0 higher than 2.5 is estimated above 60%. We emphasize that the classical formula, 1-1⁄R_0 , remains applicable to describe herd immunity thresholds for random vaccination, but not for immunity induced by infection which is naturally selective. These findings have profound consequences for the governance of the current pandemic given that some populations may be close to achieving herd immunity despite being under more or less strict social distancing measures.

63513 ▶▶ Bob, replying to swedenborg, #322 of 1129 🔗

Page not found?

63518 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bob, 2, #323 of 1129 🔗

Take the ‘Just’ off the URL

63521 ▶▶ Mark, replying to swedenborg, 5, #325 of 1129 🔗

We emphasize that the classical formula, 1-1⁄R_0 , remains applicable to describe herd immunity thresholds for random vaccination, but not for immunity induced by infection which is naturally selective.

A very important point that people should take on board…

63967 ▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to swedenborg, #326 of 1129 🔗

By the time one reaches the conclusion they aren’t anti-lockdown, they regrettably think that lockdowns may have prevented overwhelming hospitals (their original purpose, for which Sweden seems to show they can’t be necessary), but they do come out and say, in other words, that we shouldn’t be locked down any longer and should by this point stop with this stupid fear.

63524 alw, replying to alw, 3, #327 of 1129 🔗

One of my cousin’s who lives just outside Cape Town caught the virus because of enforced mask wearing. Was in ICU for 2 weeks and hospitalised for a further week. His wife fortunately did not contract the virus.

And this from a South African friend yesterday; “Yesterday they closed the schools again and yet they allowed a huge funeral for Zindzi Mandela where there was no social distancing and they also just announced another state funeral next week for Andrew Mlangeni, last of the Rivonia triallists. No doubt there will be no restrictions on that one either”.

63567 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to alw, 1, #328 of 1129 🔗

Apparently a guest house in the Cape receives R18.3 million per month since March as an isolation centre. Never had a person in it.

64184 ▶▶ Bella, replying to alw, #329 of 1129 🔗

Don’t want to be difficult here – and I will go to prison before I wear a mask – but how does he (or anyone) know they got the virus because of enforced mask wearing?

63543 Dave #KBF, 7, #331 of 1129 🔗

Retail Report.

B&M wife went for some paint. No mask no hassle either from shop staff or other shoppers, store was busy with possibly 80% of people wearing masks. No store staff wearing masks.

Couple overheard at the till, woman, “oh this is so uncomfortable” man “you only need to keep it on until you are outside”

Wife was not close enough to advise about medical exemptions, and could not see them outside the store when she had paid.

63565 Edward, replying to Edward, 23, #332 of 1129 🔗

Saturday food shopping without a mask: I had an exemption card, the blue & yellow one from the government website. I don’t disagree that this in effect means I’m accepting the policy as legitimate, but my immediate aim was to do my essential shopping without a mask and without hassle. Indoor market hall run by the city council, asked on entry “Would you like to wear a mask?”, “No, I have an exemption on medical grounds”, indicating lanyard though card was hidden behind jacket, carried on unhindered. On to indoor shopping centre, I used a less frequented entry and got in without being spoken to. With card visible, I bought fruit & veg from my favourite independent, then on to Sainsbury’s where I was waved in without hesitation. About half of staff masked, maybe to avoid hassle with masked customers saying “Why do I have to wear a mask but you don’t?” Anyway Sainsbury’s seem to be applying their already stated policy of not questioning non-wearers. So my personal aim was achieved.
Now the bad news, but I have to tell it as I saw. Almost 100% mask compliance by customers in the shopping centre. Shop staff don’t have to, but about 50% were, maybe to encourage customers or to avoid hassle. Moderately busy, apparently supporting the government’s notion that compulsory mask wearing will encourage hitherto timid people to come out. But it could also be down to curiosity to see how it works out, along with young women keen to show off the latest flowery fashion item. No police to be seen, not even the community sort. Out in the streets some people keep their masks on but more don’t. I was absolutely disgusted to see a masked (albeit loosely) toddler in a pushchair. With young kids there may be an element of wanting to be like mummy & daddy, but even the official line is that masks are definitely not recommended for children. This may be a good line to push: if they’re bad for children how can they be good for adults?
It looks like being a long hard struggle to get rid of this oppression. Don’t give up!

63570 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Edward, 11, #333 of 1129 🔗

It’s a sight to remember isn’t it. Really bad or really motivating depending on how you think. But it is a sight I won’t forget, everyone but you in a mask. No need for hitchcock thrillers anymore, I’ve lived the real thing.

63651 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Basics, 3, #334 of 1129 🔗

In a strange way I found it motivating. The exemption card is a bit like waving a cross to ward off a vampire, I don’t have to believe in it if they do. I’m not ready to try it without the card yet – maybe I will when I’m away from my usual area and don’t really care if I’m not allowed into the shops.

63754 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Edward, 1, #335 of 1129 🔗

Try just saying you’re exempt without brandishing the card. Legally, they’re not allowed to challenge you anyway.

63799 ▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #336 of 1129 🔗

That’s true, I just think the card is a useful hassle reducer. Another thought I may as well put in here, so much advertising features happy smiling people. I’m generally cynical about advertising but it does show that a smiling face is a basic ingredient of making people feel good, and suppressing it is anti-human. Advertising featuring mask wearers repels me.

63801 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Basics, 1, #337 of 1129 🔗

Invasion of the Bodysnatchers.

63610 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Edward, 8, #338 of 1129 🔗

Well i’m just going to stay home – I can’t bear to go out into the zombie apocalypse.
Thankfully i’ve never been much of a shopper, but have in recent weeks tried to go out and spend in local shops – I won’t bother now and do a flying weekly visit to supermarket.

63699 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Edward, 2, #339 of 1129 🔗

Only the Swedish thought about and still love their children.

63740 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jay Berger, 3, #340 of 1129 🔗

Mmmm. The Belorussian dictator said masking kids was child abuse.

63757 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to JohnB, #341 of 1129 🔗

It’s ok for dictators to be right on some things.

63766 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #342 of 1129 🔗

Ours get things wrong every time. 🙂

63571 Nick Rose, replying to Nick Rose, 8, #343 of 1129 🔗

Had a wander through Chester, Foregate and Eastgate Streets. Not entirely reassuring and not entirely depressing either.

I’d say compliance with the Diktat is roughly 100%, but I think a lot of that compliance is reluctant. Just something in the body language. I don’t know if the nudgers can get away with many, if any, further nudges.

Got a few looks on the street as I had no mask at all. Most on the street were putting on their mask as they walked into a shop, and took it off again when they left. Everybody I saw with a mask was fiddling with it.

Streets were emptier than on previous visits, so I’m guessing that other than essential shopping, most people just aren’t bothering.

Two PCSOs walking along outdoors, both wearing masks. As authority figures I just scowled at them, they avoided eye contact and wandered on.

Stopped from entering the Precinct by “security” due to no mask.

“Noticed that it’s quieter out?” I asked.

“Yeah,” replies one of them.

“Not wondering why?” I ask, before walking away.

For the moment, we’re still free to shop barefaced in Wales, but I do wonder for how much longer. After all, the Turtle’s Head caved in over masks on public transport, so another week or two and we’ll be in line with the rUK.

63640 ▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #344 of 1129 🔗

The Welsh Chief Scientific Officer Frank Atherton did say they wouldn’t introduce mandatory masks unless infections started increasing and that the first place they would probably come in would be tourist hotpots. But of course just because he said that a couple of weeks ago doesn’t mean it will be true next week or the week after. And what does ‘increase’ mean. There’s a small outbreak in a food plant at Ebbw Vale, and in my county most days we have zero new cases, so a day with one case would count as an increase.

Interestingly I was at the first services on the M4 as you come into Wales this morning. Lots more masks in evidence than previous visits – made me wonder if they were all English folk coming for their holidays and not realising they don’t have to wear masks here. I did catch a few mask wearers glancing at my naked face but there were plenty of us not wearing them. One guy joined the queue I was in (McDonalds – I admit a weakness for a sausage and egg McMuffin) about to put a mask on, saw that most people weren’t wearing them and put it back in his pocket. Result.

63709 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to The Spingler, 5, #345 of 1129 🔗

Just come back from shopping at Aldis in Llangollen. Much busier – most of shoppers there seem to be English tourists. Quick survey at tills – out of 23 people, 9 and a half were mask wearers (the half was a young lad with the mask hanging off one of his ears). Big increase from last week, where it was only about 10% masked.

As I entered, I passed 3 women worried about when to put their masks on (“Do we put them on now or do we do it when we step inside?”) I told them they didn’t have to wear masks in shops in Wales, “Welcome to the Land of the Free”. They actually cheered as they stuffed the disgusting things back into their pockets!

I tried the same thing with an old woman standing near the entrance. “You know you don’t need to wear a mask in here?” She gave me an evil stare and rasped at me “I can wear a mask if I want to!” Nasty piece of work. I left her to it.

Funny thing was, her husband was maskless. I tried to see the logic of it. If she was wearing hers out of virtue, in order to stop herself spreading the virus to others, why was she not worried that her husband was displaying such selfish behaviour? If she believed that the mask protected her from certain death, why did she not insist that her husband shield himself with a similar such magickal charm?

Anyway, I do think a lot of the mask wearing was due to outsiders not realising that they are free to breathe the pure Welsh air unimpeded by face-rags, and unaware that the evil Covids bounce off the border twixt England and Wales, thanks to the nightly rituals performed in the light of the moon around the Cardiff’s Gorsedd stone circle in Bute Park by Drakeford, Gething and his fellow druids.

63737 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #346 of 1129 🔗

I told them they didn’t have to wear masks in shops in Wales, “Welcome to the Land of the Free”. They actually cheered as they stuffed the disgusting things back into their pockets!

The cheering of course was highly illegal ! 🙂

I tried the same thing with an old woman standing near the entrance. “You know you don’t need to wear a mask in here?” She gave me an evil stare and rasped at me “I can wear a mask if I want to!”

“Probably best with that face”.

64408 ▶▶▶▶ Catherine123, replying to Mr Dee, #347 of 1129 🔗

Magical thinking seems to be the order of the day with masks. It goes something along the lines of ‘if I wear this germ ridden, hideous looking (or landfill filling/polluting/expensive disposable) mask then I won’t die’.

63827 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to The Spingler, #348 of 1129 🔗

I saw quite a few nappies here in Pembs yesterday. Today, nary a one.

63687 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #349 of 1129 🔗

Haha! Have you noticed he’s got a head like a turtle too! Google an image of him speaking, and google an image of a tortoise with its mouth open. Compare the two. Hours of hilarity.

63573 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 7, #350 of 1129 🔗

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/duration-isolation.htmlInside this document“ Although replication-competent virus was not isolated 3 weeks after symptom onset, recovered patients can continue to have SARS-CoV-2 RNA detected in their upper respiratory specimens for up to 12 weeks (Kore a CDC, 2020; Li et al., 2020; Xiao et al, 2020). Investigation of 285 “persistently positive” persons, which included 126 persons who had developed recurrent symptoms, found no secondary infections among 790 contacts attributable to contact with these case patients. Efforts to isolate replication-competent virus from 108 of these case patients were unsuccessful (Korea CDC, 2020).
So you could be PCR pos for up to 12 weeks although no active virus. Although you could have recurrent respiratory symptoms(another virus?) they did not transmit Covid-19 and no Sars-Cov 2 virus could be isolated.So PCR pos cases now could be 3 mth old and even if they have respiratory symptoms you can’t be sure it’s caused by Sars-Cov 2.Imagine the problems with interpretation of masstesting.

63584 Felice, replying to Felice, 8, #352 of 1129 🔗

The asymptomatic aspect really worries me now.
There’s an outbreak in Mathon, Herefordshire, amongst the Romanian fruit pickers that I have been keeping an eye on. Initially, when a very small number started to show symptoms, they started testing them, as they live cheek by jowl in caravans on the farm site.
At first, it was reported that about 50 of them were positive, with the vast majority being asymptomatic. To me, that was wonderful evidence that the virus is really nothing to worry about. But when I mentioned it to a friend, their response was along the lines that this was a very good reason not to lift the lockdown in case vulnerable people were infected.
It’s now being (quietly) reported that over 130 of them are testing positive. With the introduction of masks, I predict that this type of info will be used to increase the compulsory use of masks to even more areas of life and for way longer than the 1 year of the guidelines.
And people will happily go along with it.

63596 ▶▶ BecJT, replying to Felice, 3, #353 of 1129 🔗

I read something that the Greek authorities are testing Brits coming in to the country, and they’ve not had one positive case. The Greeks think our tests are duff. There was something on CEBM (and I think Carl Heneghan’s interview on UnHerd with Freddie Sayers) that false positive could be responsible for the entirety of our new cases.

63635 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to BecJT, 1, #354 of 1129 🔗

Well don’t the tests depend on putting the swab through an arbitrary number of cycles? Too few cycles and nothing shows but too many and we’d all test positive. Does anyone know how the cut-off point of around 37 cycles was decided upon?

63667 ▶▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to Margaret, 2, #355 of 1129 🔗

It’s not the swab, it’s the number of amplifications of the protein fragments by the PCR (which is a qualitative, not quantitative test) in order to get ‘something’ that be picked up. Even its inventor Katry Mullis said it was no good as a diagnostic tool.

63678 ▶▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to DavidC, 1, #356 of 1129 🔗

Yes, it was intended as a manufacturing process, I think-but who decided on the number of amplifications?

63697 ▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to BecJT, 2, #357 of 1129 🔗

CH, LUX, Austria, Germany etc.: the recent spike in the number of positive test results equal pretty much exactly the 1.4% false positive rate of the flawed PCR tests done.

63930 ▶▶▶▶ BecJT, replying to Jay Berger, #358 of 1129 🔗

Thanks, I’m not very good at maths or science, so I’m glad to hear it wasn’t just me being thick, and I understood correctly.

63598 ▶▶ John B, replying to Felice, 6, #359 of 1129 🔗

‘… vulnerable people…’

Vulnerable people are those with serious conditions normally found in the elderly. Such people are in care, on geriatric wards, bedridden in their own homes.

They are not out picking fruit! They are not among the general population.

How effective the Government propaganda has been that no matter the mountain of evidence to tte contrary, it does dispel from people’s minds, that the virus’s victims are not among the general population, but a distinct cohort, localised, immobile mostly, close to death.

Plus around 50% of positive tests are false.

63600 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Felice, 4, #360 of 1129 🔗

yup i think you’re right to be worried – i think this face fiasco will go on probably for over a year. It will be the excuse to protect vulnerable and outbreaks in confined places – and if these don’t happen or the “second wave” it will be because the masks were so wonderful so carry on wearing them. Most people are too stupid to see the underlying narrative.

63695 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Felice, 1, #361 of 1129 🔗

Over 1500 workers in a meat processing plant were infected (as per the flawed test) in Germany.
Nine died, few got sick, 5 needed ICU.
We now know that this happened at work and that they all had to wear masks at work…

63586 John B, replying to John B, 22, #362 of 1129 🔗

He doesn’t mention biggest fundamental error, ignoring the first principle of infection control, never mix infectious people with non-infectious people. Yet the NHS (clap) did just that. Covid patients were admitted into hospitals, not quarantined, so infection could spread via staff, equipments, other patients, surfaces, airborne. Then from those Petri dishes patients were decanted into care homes whose populations were most susceptible to the disease. 👍

Meanwhile the general population for most of which the virus was harmless were put under a quasi-quarantine regime which breaks second rule of infection control, quarantine must be 100%, and third rule don’t quarantine non-infectious people – it serves no purpose.

But… lessons will be learned. Not the lessons learned from over 200 years dealing with infections.

63606 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to John B, 2, #363 of 1129 🔗

Even back then, COVID-19 was to “virulent” that “Special environmental controls, such as negative pressure isolation rooms [ed: something that you have to use when you have dangerous airborne pathogens], are not necessary to prevent the transmission of COVID-19.” Page 3, NHS COVID-19 SOP, 1st Apr 2020 (nope, not April’s fool) — https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/wp-content/uploads/sites/52/2020/03/C0131-Design-note_COVID-19-ward-for-intubated-patients_1-April-MR2.pdf

63641 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to John B, 6, #364 of 1129 🔗

Not sure if this has been shared before.

Singapore had a horrid problem with PPE in their hospitals like everyone else when Covid hit and their health care workers were getting Covid just like everywhere else. Rather than screaming at people they took what they learned from SARS and instituted militant hand-washing before and after every contact with a person or thing.


63846 ▶▶ microdave, replying to John B, 1, #365 of 1129 🔗

Never mix infectious people with non-infectious people

Exactly the point made by Tom Jefferson in this recent “UnHerd” video:
It’s at 25:20 if you don’t want to watch all of it – although you REALLY should!

63589 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 12, #366 of 1129 🔗

Another Churchillian moment for Boris:
We shall fight them in the sweet shoppes, on the shelves of our grocers, both big and small, tea shops, in the homes of consenting adults watching a bit of telly, in our children’s lunch boxes … Take that, Winston!

Boris Johnson’s absurd nanny state crusade ‘ – Christoher Snowdon in the Spectator warns of a raft of new anti-obesity measures the Government is intending to introduce on Monday, including a ban on advertising sugary, salty and fatty food on television before 9pm.

That should get the economy up and running at full tilt in no time at all. Money that could be spent fixing the economy will be siphoned off to subsidize more Nanny State advertising, public relations and marketing campaigns. Boris had a childhood dream to one day become British Prime Minister and the result so far is ineffectual Super Nanny Boris.

63595 ▶▶ Sue, replying to richard riewer, 6, #367 of 1129 🔗

doesn’t their lunch voucher scheme offering cheaper lunch in restaurants come out in august which starts next week? utter shambles … go out and stuff your face cheaper but wait you’re all too fat and need to listen to nanny on what to eat – you couldn’t make it up!! 🙂

63631 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Sue, 7, #368 of 1129 🔗

Thought I’d post about the positive and negative things about holidaying abroad at the moment as Spain is desperate to get its tourist industry back.


Airport very quiet-plenty of seats available
Plane not completely rammed as it would normally be at this time of year. Five or six spare seats in our immediate vicinity.
Resort very quiet, plenty of empty sun beds around pool and on beach.
Traffic and parking no problem. Normally you would be driving round looking for a sixpence on which to park.
Restaurants desperate for your custom so service is better than usual.


Told that only one person is allowed to queue for the toilet on the plane-that rule soon went by the board.
Zombie Town. The few people that are here are well masked up but thankfully, we haven’t had any hassle so far. No one smiles at us though from behind those muzzles so it feels a bit threatening at times.
Trying to persuade friends who have travelled all over the world that the whole thing has been a massive overreaction and that we are all being manipulated psychologically. They are still too scared to get back on a plane and think that we are brave (or privately think that we are mad)for doing so. This is in spite of the fact that they and their family have lost virtually all their income because they rely on tourists coming here. I can’t see things getting any better for them.

Just as in the UK, if businesses want our custom and our money, things will have to change-and fast.

Think I’m posting this in the wrong place but don’t know how to move it!

63654 ▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Margaret, 15, #369 of 1129 🔗

I’m in the south of Spain. Total nightmare. Masks compulsory not just indoors but also on the street – except when doing sport. (Some) police acting like Gestapo officers.

I have personally witnessed the following:

  • a person walking briskly along seafront who was told by the police in a very authoritarian manner to either start running or put on a mask.
  • a policeman asking a person who had his mask covering his mouth but not his nose to pull it up to cover his nose.
  • police patrolling the seafront calling out every single person they see not wearing a mask properly. (Many walk with a mask under their chin, because it’s just too hot and unbearable.)
  • beach patrollers (not police) telling people walking ON THE BEACH to put on a mask. (The rule is you have to wear a mask even on the beach, except when you are sitting on your towel or in the water.)

It is a dystopian hell. Don’t come to Spain.

63665 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to stewart, 2, #370 of 1129 🔗

This makes me so sad. My husband and I were in Spain for a month and cut our time short in mid-March to get home just before they locked down the whole country. Spain is our go-to place and now I’m not sure I can ever go back. I won’t soon forget the extent to which each country flexed its’ authoritarian muscles as a result of Covid and would prefer to spend my travel dollars in more democratic countries. Too bad Iceland and Sweden aren’t my top choices to escape the Canadian winter! But since I won’t wear a mask on a plane I won’t be traveling anywhere for the foreseeable future anyway.

63672 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 7, #371 of 1129 🔗

In the first month of confinement, the Spanish police handed out half a million fines.

Everyone has either been fined or knows someone who has been fined. Very few know anyone who has died from the virus.

64266 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Gossamer, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #372 of 1129 🔗

Lisa, I can recommend Iceland in winter. It doesn’t get terribly cold, and even in December there are a good few hours of daylight. The scenery is stunning.

63690 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to stewart, 2, #373 of 1129 🔗

The fascist, denunciatiin and obedience genes never disappeared from people joining the police and from most of the people in Spain, Italy, Austria & Germany.
Neither the respective commie ones in Eastern European states.
The really new, sad, and strange developments in this respect are happening currently in the UK, France and the USA.

63822 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to stewart, #374 of 1129 🔗

Why the hell do they put up with it?

63838 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to annie, #375 of 1129 🔗

Historical… due to the old Napoleonic Laws – which are based on specifying what you can do. Hence European countries tend to be far more obedient and the police more authoritarian
In this country .. until recently, the legal position was that we can do what we want unless there is a specifically law to prevent it. i.e. we are told what we cannot do

64173 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to annie, #376 of 1129 🔗

They like it. It makes them feel safe.

63756 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Margaret, #377 of 1129 🔗

Which airport did you fly from please Margaret ?

63601 Edward, replying to Edward, 2, #378 of 1129 🔗

My second post of the day, then I have other things to do. Looking solely at the effects of a mask on the wearer’s health, without the broader psychological implications, I’ve been thinking (it happens occasionally). Discomfort is an indication to the body that something needs to change, but is not necessarily bad – strenuous exercise makes your muscles ache but they react by becoming stronger (no pain, no gain). Discomfort from wearing a mask may make you breathe faster or your heart pump blood harder to compensate for the reduction of oxygen intake, and may be a problem for those who already have high blood pressure. But I think these are probably small effects. Likewise I don’t think that re-breathing in a small proportion of carbon dioxide is much of a problem. But nobody’s breath is completely odourless; halitosis is merely the far end of a spectrum. So there must be organic compounds in exhaled air, whether arising from teeth, gums, tongue, throat, or within the digestive system. Accumulation of these compounds in a mask and/or re-breathing them in is probably more of a health hazard than the oxygen & carbon dioxide issues. Would any medically knowledgeable people like to comment on this?

63609 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to Edward, 8, #379 of 1129 🔗

You need to watch the YouTube video of the Spanish scientist which someone posted on here the other day. She tested various masks into which someone had sung. The results on the Petri dishes were disgusting.

First use a handkerchief to blow your nose, then spit onto it. Now wrap it around your face. Mmmmm bet that feels good doesn’t it?

63664 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Margaret, 1, #380 of 1129 🔗

Why breathe through a festering mass of bacteria?

Just a thought.

63668 ▶▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to Basics, #381 of 1129 🔗

I think that Margaret’s point!

63675 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to DavidC, #382 of 1129 🔗

I know it was. I was summarising into a simple memorable point. Well done Margaret.

63613 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 4, #383 of 1129 🔗

Sometimes you need to do studies just to confirm things one take mostly for grantedIn this study for Stockholm they looked at Covid-19 deaths in 274000 persons over 70 year of age.

Stockholm with 30% of all Covid-19 cases in Sweden and 41 % of all Covid-19 deaths.Similarities with immunity at 20% level as New York and London.The biggest population density in Sweden.1.5 million people.“Compared to living in only-old households, living with someone of working age is associated with elevated COVID-19 mortality (HR = 1.6; 95% CI = 1.3-2.0). Living in a care home is associated with a 4-fold (HR = 4.1; 95% CI = 3.5-4.9) risk of COVID-19 mortality compared to living in independent housing. Living in neighbourhoods with the highest population density was associated with higher COVID-19 mortality (HR = 1.6; 95% CI = 1.1-2.4) compared to living in the least densely populated neighbourhoods.”

Not very surprising but definite result. Living in care home 4 times risk, living with someone in working age 1.6 times risk, living in densely populated area 1.6 times risk.
Rather pessimistic for the future possible second wave as reducing risk by moving from care home does not seem plausible, considering the reasons that they are there in the first place. You might consider temporary moving out the working age person in the household but moving single household in a densely populated area to somewhere else temporary must be very difficult.

63677 ▶▶ RickH, replying to swedenborg, 4, #384 of 1129 🔗

Living in care home 4 times risk”

But causality shouldn’t be confused with this number :

(a) There is no way now of accurately diagnosing the *main* cause of death
(b) Care Homes contain some of the most vulnerable people in society – many of whom will die in a relatively short time span.
(c) The low mortality of 2018/19 created a *much* larger vulnerable population in 2019/20, who were susceptible to *any* infection a year later.

63618 HelzBelz, replying to HelzBelz, 10, #385 of 1129 🔗

Got my supermarket delivery yesterday. It all arrived in plastic bags!! Plastic Bags for chrissakes. They used to be very very bad and we couldn’t have them, but now they are OK because they will prevent the transmission of a virtually non existent virus between delivery driver and me. At the expense of our oceans. FFS!

63627 ▶▶ Mark, replying to HelzBelz, 12, #386 of 1129 🔗

It’s alright, the plastic bags can’t get into the oceans to pollute them any more – the outlets are choked up with discarded masks…..

63661 ▶▶ DavidC, replying to HelzBelz, 3, #387 of 1129 🔗

See my comment above about the potential weight of mask waste alone!


63680 ▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to DavidC, 3, #388 of 1129 🔗

A friend of mine has just calculated, that smart meters use up electricity worth around €1billion p.a. once installed in every household, the equivalent of a third of a nuclear power station’s annual output.
Like the masks: sick.

63752 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jay Berger, 2, #389 of 1129 🔗

Easily worth it for the enhanced surveillance and control capabilities. Oops, sorry, wrong forum …

63620 Drawde927, replying to Drawde927, 5, #390 of 1129 🔗

Another good article on AIER on the politics of lockdown (from a US perspective):

I get the feeling that when/if we see organised, large scale dissent against the current dystopian farce, it will start in the US. It feels like the UK is lost at the minute. All the mainstream media seem to be singing from the same hymn sheet – the left have been enthusiastically pushing fear, alarmism and conformism from the start (and have now applied their zealotry to mask-wearing), whilst the right now seem wary of doing too much to undermine the Conservative government responsible for the mess.

63642 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Drawde927, 3, #391 of 1129 🔗

Not many on the right believe that we have a Conservative government, of course!

63653 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to IanE, 10, #392 of 1129 🔗

We don’t. They are cast from the Liberal metropolitan elite – look at their parents, wives/partners. Many are not very pleasant people with many skeletons in their cupboards. Most have never worked in the real world outside of the media bubble.

63646 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Drawde927, 9, #393 of 1129 🔗

Let’s see what happens when furlough ends. A neighbour enjoyed his three month paid holiday but came back to find no work. He’s been re-furloughed and will be probably laid off next month. I expect millions will have similar experiences.

63656 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Drawde927, #394 of 1129 🔗

I have some hope in our football supporters.

64196 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Edward, #395 of 1129 🔗

Would be nice. The Premier League consortium is pretty sewn up though – ‘White Lives Matter’ gets you a lifetime ban. Players are still kneeling. Serious amounts of money.

63670 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Drawde927, 7, #396 of 1129 🔗

Do stop all this shite about ‘it wasn’t me, guv’ as an attempt to redefine the ‘right’.

I’m of what is commonly and broadly termed ‘the left’, but I don’t go around defending any of the compliant belly-crawling from others who also claim to be so. I’m willing to nail the current crimes on anyone who is complicit. Actually – I’m a Blairite of the ‘Eric’ variety.

The hard fact is that the right-of-centre have been in power since 1980 (I include the Blair/Brown period), and this present scam is to be owned by the right. It flows in a continuous thread from Thatcher’s obeisance to uncontrolled financial markets and global capitalism, through the financial crash (another ‘weren’t me, guv’ moment) to this present domination of society by the unconstrained deadly trio of Big Pharma, Big Data and Big Finance. All are products of unregulated capital – not some dastardly ‘Marxist’ plot.

So – the Tories got taken over by the psychopaths and total spivs. Just tell it as it is, but don’t pretend that the responsibility lies elsewhere than in that dysfunctional collective.

63698 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to RickH, 2, #397 of 1129 🔗

Do stop all this shite about ‘it wasn’t me, guv’ as an attempt to redefine the ‘right’.

I hope this wasn’t a direct reply to my post! If so you’ve misunderstood me. I wrote it from a perspective of not really sympathising with either side of the political/media divide.

I’m of what is commonly and broadly termed ‘the left’, but I don’t go around defending any of the compliant belly-crawling from others who also claim to be so.

The above would also more or less describe my political views. I didn’t have any sympathy for the current government and PM even before the coronamadness and lockdown, and have never voted Conservative.
I’m just sick – and have been since the beginning of the lockdown – with the general attitude of most of the left-leaning media, so much so that I’ve stopped reading them even to check out the headlines. I certainly wasn’t attempting to defend them!

63701 ▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to RickH, #398 of 1129 🔗

Sort of agree, except you omit the corporate adoption and promotion of socialism.

63702 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 1, #399 of 1129 🔗

Still at it, I see. So we’ve had the “centre right” in power for 40 years, and we now have a government run by the “far right”, according to you, but we still have collectivised state healthcare, we still have our children compulsorily indoctrinated in political correctness and massively funded bodies policing said political correctness along with laws to enforce it, we still have no halt to mass immigration, we still have a state-subsidised national broadcaster that overwhelmingly employs Labour and LibDem supporters and pushes their leftist ideas, we still have government support for divorce and for pushing homosexual behaviour.

I suppose your excuse is that these “right-wingers” are just too incompetent to actually do anything actually right-wing.

63774 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, 1, #400 of 1129 🔗

I suspect you’ll find we don’t have collectivised state health care for much longer.
It looks to me just like the way Thatcher & Co ran down British Rail so they could sell it off cheap to their buddies.

63868 ▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Cheezilla, #401 of 1129 🔗

Oh dear the railways were privately owned before the government stole them in the first place. Oh and we can dream that we get rid of the NHS. The less the government does the better. It’s so disheartening to find virtually no one seems understand what is going on.

64001 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Biker, #402 of 1129 🔗

The railways were bust and would have closed if not nationalised.

63916 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #403 of 1129 🔗

I’ve seen 11 elections since the socialist attempt to strangle the country in the mid-1970s. At every single one of them, to my certain knowledge, it was claimed the Tories planned to run down and sell off the NHS if they were elected. (I was too young to notice or recall now if that was true of Heath as well, but I suspect it was). They actually won 7 of those elections.

Yet here we are, with the state not only still accounting for an ever larger amount of spending in real terms, but with a PM who makes a cult of NHS-worship and a point of protecting the NHS even to the extent of plunging the nation into a catastrophic lockdown to avoid any possible risk of being accused of risking harm to it.

In fact since the aforementioned socialist disaster of the mid-1970s, there has never been a year in which state health spending declined significantly in real terms, and only two (one under the coalition and one under Thatcher) in which it was even static.

And yet it’s not even particularly radical to suggest that there are better ways to organise healthcare than state central control, which has proved so disastrously incompetent in this crisis that it has quite possibly caused as many or more deaths by its response to the new coronavirus than would have been inflicted by that disease with no centrally organised healthcare response.

63739 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to RickH, 2, #404 of 1129 🔗

The long march thru the institutions by the left have a MASSIVE part to play in this

63773 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to RickH, #405 of 1129 🔗

I agree. Started with Thatcher’s ruthless lot. Blair and co were pink tories.

Don’t forget Big Ag!

63794 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #406 of 1129 🔗

The Blair government was one of the most revolutionary governments we have ever had.Its a misconception that they were tories with a red rosette.So many of its members were ex communists of some persuasion who when in power,had the M15 files on themselves destroyed.

64010 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #407 of 1129 🔗

Would that be destroyed in the way that the Guardian had hard disks destroyed? As a former public servant, I doubt that the files were actually “destroyed”.

64201 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ewan Duffy, #408 of 1129 🔗

Sorry Ewan, just seen your post. 🙁

64199 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #409 of 1129 🔗

One strongly suspects they were ‘told’ their files had been destroyed.

63854 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to RickH, #410 of 1129 🔗

You must be living in a parallel universe if you think the financial markets are uncontrolled. We live under a communist system and have done for decades. Mrs Thatcher tried to free us but was removed in a coup.Big Pharma, Big Data and Big Finance are backed and protected by the state. Your analysis of the situation is typical of someone who understands didlly fucking squat about economics. It’s one of the dumbest posts i’ve read here.

63674 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Drawde927, 6, #411 of 1129 🔗

500.000 people expected/hoped for at a demo in Berlin on 1.8..
Fingers xd.

The resistance has to organize itself better and that, IMO, internationally coordinated.

Respected figureheads of the criticism and advocates of alternatives, like Tegnell, Ioannidis, Gupta, Sumption, Kreiss, Homburg, Raoult etc. must gain prominence everywhere.

63820 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Jay Berger, #412 of 1129 🔗

Good luck!

63624 Allen, replying to Allen, 27, #413 of 1129 🔗

Masks are just a political weapon disguised as a public health concern.

Below are some data points to make a flyer with and distribute:

– Randomized controlled trials of face masks have shown no detectable effect against transmission of viral infections;

– There has never been a single randomized control trial done that proves the efficacy of masks for the prevention of viral transmission;

– 2019 study of 2862 participants showed that both N95 respirators and surgical masks “resulted in no significant difference in the incidence of laboratory confirmed influenza”;

– 2016 meta-analysis randomized controlled trials and observational studies of N95 respirators and surgical masks used by healthcare workers did not show benefit against transmission of respiratory infections;

– Schlieren imaging showed that both surgical masks and cloth masks had farther brow jets (unfiltered upward airflow past eyebrows) than not wearing any mask at all, 182 mm and 203 mm respectively, vs none discernible with no mask. Backward unfiltered airflow was found to be strong with all masks compared to not masking;

– A study of 44 mask brands found mean 35.6% penetration. Most medical masks had over 20% penetration, while “general masks and handkerchiefs had no protective function in terms of the aerosol filtration efficiency.” The study found that “Medical masks, general masks, and handkerchiefs were found to provide little protection against respiratory aerosols”;

– N95 respirators are made with a 0.3 micron filter, Coronaviruses are approximately 0.125 microns in diameter;

– Cloth masks were found to have low efficiency for blocking particles of 0.3 microns and smaller. Aerosol penetration through the various cloth masks are between 74 and 90%;

– Healthcare workers wearing cloth masks were found to have 13 times the risk of influenza-like illness than those wearing medical masks;

– Surgical mask wearers had significantly increased dyspnea after a 6-minute walk than non-mask wearers;

– Research shows facemasks increases burden on pulmonary, circulatory and immune systems, due to oxygen reduction and air trapping reducing substantial carbon dioxide exchange;

– Healthcare workers were found to have a loss in volume of oxygen consumption by 13.8% compared to controls when wearing N95 respirators. 17.7% less carbon dioxide was exhaled As a result there is a shift to metabolic acidosis;

– Various respiratory pathogens are common on the outer surface of used medical masks, which could result in self-contamination;

– Surgical masks were found to be a repository of bacterial contamination. The source of the bacteria was determined to be the body surface of the surgeons. Without the protective garb of surgeons, laypeople have even more exposed body surface to serve as a source for bacteria to collect on their masks;

– The data show that masks serve more as instruments of obstruction of normal breathing, rather than as effective barriers to pathogens. Therefore, masks should not be used by the general public, either by adults or children.

63645 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Allen, 5, #414 of 1129 🔗

On top of that, people don’t know that there are two types of N95 masks: industrial and medical, and they filter in different directions 😉

63775 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IMoz, #415 of 1129 🔗

Industrial are for filtering dust.

63819 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, #416 of 1129 🔗

… and designed to ensure that everything else goes straight through in both directions.

63657 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Allen, 9, #417 of 1129 🔗

A good summary.

Masks are just a political weapon disguised as a public health concern.”

… as are lock-ups and mad exaggerations of anti-social distancing. You have to be a bear of little brain to believe the advertising!

63659 ▶▶ DavidC, replying to Allen, 1, #418 of 1129 🔗

Spot on Allen. Well done!


63669 ▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Allen, 2, #419 of 1129 🔗

Nice summary, but, as Lebon stated well over a hundred years ago:
You can’t reason with a fanatic, let alone one who is part of a crowd or a/that crowd.

64028 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Allen, #420 of 1129 🔗

Great stuff!!! Thanks for this!

63629 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #422 of 1129 🔗


63632 ▶▶ Felice, replying to Tom Blackburn, 3, #423 of 1129 🔗

Can you see the misery in that dog’s eyes?

63638 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Felice, 2, #424 of 1129 🔗

Not misery….. just embarrassment that the world now knows he works for the same outfit as Cressida Disk

63649 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to mjr, #425 of 1129 🔗

I thought it was Cressida dick

63777 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tom Blackburn, #426 of 1129 🔗

Content not found. That was quick!

63832 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Tom Blackburn, #427 of 1129 🔗

for those that missed it, it was a photo of a police alsatian wearing a mask .

63636 mjr, replying to mjr, 16, #428 of 1129 🔗

I have a friend who is a hospital porter. Young and fit (walks 15 miles a day on his job) He had a good moan when told he had to wear mask and said how uncomfortable it was.
Today he told me that he was working evening shift last night – masked up – and ended up having to go to A&E as he finished his shift as he had breathing issues and a ridiculously high blood pressure. Took 4 hours to get treated (no staff favouritism). He is working again tonight (so not allowed to be sick). Be interesting to see what happens.

63652 ▶▶ RickH, replying to mjr, 8, #429 of 1129 🔗

Interesting. When masks appeared as a sine qua non in hospital settings (well after the peak of any viral infection), I had a conversation with a stoical male nurse about the effect of wearing one all day. He said he frequently ended up with a headache by the time he got home, and yes, even without that, it was extremely uncomfortable.

You would be hard pushed to rationally defend more general and constant wearing of masks by normal health criteria.

63779 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to RickH, #430 of 1129 🔗

Worrying if lots of people are driving home suffering from face nappy headaches. Now there’s a health risk!

63710 ▶▶ ambwozere, replying to mjr, 2, #432 of 1129 🔗

That’s ridiculous that he can’t go off sick when he works in a hospital. The NHS is supposed to look after people.

63781 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to ambwozere, #433 of 1129 🔗

Hahahahaha – but not funny.

64008 ▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to ambwozere, #434 of 1129 🔗

The NHS today only looks after people with covid-19, if you have anything else you’e f***ed

63658 DavidC, replying to DavidC, 16, #435 of 1129 🔗

I posted the other day about if the UK, with a population of 67 million, has one in four people wearing ONE disposable mask a day (and disposing of it at the end of the day), at a weight of 3.5 grams, will produce 64 TONS of waste EACH DAY.

Given the bit in Toby’s piece above, I’ve done a recalculation.
World population around 7.7 billion.

Assume ONE IN ONE HUNDRED people wears one 3.5 gram disposable mask a day and throws it away at the end of the day.

That’s 269.5 tonnes or 273.9 UK tons of MASK waste PER DAY!

And that’s before any other waste such as sanitizer bottles, hand sanitizer wipes, nanaoparticle waste or any other waste is considered. That is frightening.


63663 ▶▶ stewart, replying to DavidC, 16, #436 of 1129 🔗

In a few months time, when the waste becomes news, some idiot will come out and say that mistakes might have been made and that lessons can be drawn, but of course, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

63825 ▶▶▶ microdave, replying to stewart, 1, #437 of 1129 🔗

In a few months time, when the waste becomes news

It was headline news on my local Beeb the other night! And that when the new requirement was barely off the starting blocks. There has also been a story about a Seagull with it’s legs bound together by the ear straps of a muzzle – it was only caught when too weak to evade the wildlife rescue people…

63671 ▶▶ Basics, replying to DavidC, 9, #438 of 1129 🔗

Someone needs to get that into the ear of holy greta. if she is serious about the planet she can’t stand by and watch surely…!

63893 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to DavidC, #439 of 1129 🔗

Good work, I might quote you on that.

I’ve unfortunately had a few floaters ( masks, a glove, wet wipes ) go past me in the sea, especially a few weeks back. Clear today thankfully

63662 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 39, #440 of 1129 🔗

The Jehova’s Witness response.

Over the years I’ve honed my response to the Witnesss to a polite: ‘No thank you, I’m not interested’.

Shopped at Waitrose earlier on. Masked lady vigorously wiping down trolleys pushed one at me and said: ‘ you need to wear a mask’.—Que Witness response— ‘No thank you, I’m not interested’ and in I went. This was the Otley branch and once inside I would estimate that 80% of shoppers were masked. But hey! 20% weren’t. No aggro from masked folk but I made a point of smiling at the unmasked and one or two responded in kind.

This reminded me of when I was a kid and my dad was the proud possessor of a Reliant Robin (think Del boy’s van in Only fools and horses). There weren’t many of them on the road (thank goodness) but those that were had a certain camaraderie that was expressed with a gentle wave as they passed each other on the highway. It was as if they belonged to a club of like minded souls and my dad would get very excited at the site of another Reliant as it came into view.

Now I’m not saying that I’m going to get excited when I see a person not wearing a mask in a shop but I do intend to smile at every shopper I see NOT wearing a face dressing. Not everyone will respond I’m sure but they must be like minded souls and the goal must surely be to increase the membership of this, at present, minority but very select club.

63691 ▶▶ Proudtobeapeasant, replying to Harry hopkins, #441 of 1129 🔗

This morning I went to Waitrose, Sainsbury’s and Home Bargains, all in Wantage. I was pleased that in the town there were not so many people wearing masks as I had seen earlier in the week. Maybe the Saturday shoppers were different, I thought. But guess what, I was the ONLY shopper in all three shops not wearing a mask. I did not get challenged by the staff on the way in, or even spoken to at all. They are clearly doing what they’ve said they’ll do and not challenging anyone. If there had been any others, like you I would have given them a matey smile, but there were none. I didn’t get any nasty looks but oh boy did I feel like I was the weird one. I just couldn’t believe how they were all so COMPLIANT. Young and old alike following like sheep. I have to say that shopping has become a horrible experience and I don’t know whether I want to do it again, but I probably will, because I like to do my food shopping in real shops.

63705 ▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Harry hopkins, 5, #442 of 1129 🔗

Beware though – amongst the bare faced, there will be some who are ‘genuinely’ exempt and believe very strongly that everyone else should be muzzled.

63786 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to HelzBelz, 1, #443 of 1129 🔗

Still, smiles are very infectious.

63682 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 4, #444 of 1129 🔗

Just receive this email from Waitrose


From Friday 24 July, we’re asking you to follow the new government legislation on face coverings while shopping in our stores.

All customers, apart from children under 11 and those who have reasonable cause, such as a health condition, disability, physical or mental impairment, should wear a face mask, scarf or other covering. Not all exemptions are visible, so please be understanding of other shoppers.

You will also see our Partners in both Waitrose and John Lewis stores will be wearing face coverings. These will be worn by all Partners who are not exempt when they are in areas where two metre social distancing cannot be achieved or where other measures, such as screens, are not present.

63704 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to Victoria, 9, #445 of 1129 🔗

So first we have the long list of exemptions to muzzle wearing: physical illnesses, mental illnesses, severe distress, need to be able to lip read, to avoid harm or injury, to eat and drink or take medicine etc..
Then we have an even longer list of places where masks are not required:cinemas, theatres, gyms, museums etc..
Then we have the government kindly providing exemption cards for us to print out in case we really can’t wear a mask.

After all of these get-out clauses, is there anyone left in the UK who actually IS required to wear a face mask? Is that the real intention behind all this-a bit like breaking lockdown was? The government can thus abdicate its responsibility and say, “It wasn’t us”

63706 ▶▶▶ ambwozere, replying to Margaret, 5, #446 of 1129 🔗

I do wonder if that’s the point deny all responsibility by the govt.

63789 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Margaret, #447 of 1129 🔗

I suspect so. They’ve been perfectly clear about this all along, It’s the MSM and the local council hitlers that give the opposite impression.

63816 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Margaret, #448 of 1129 🔗

New get-out clause: suffering from sanity.

63982 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Margaret, #449 of 1129 🔗

Just guidance really.

64208 ▶▶▶ Ken Turner, replying to Margaret, #450 of 1129 🔗

But.. in a museum apparently you don;t need a mask, unless there is an in-store shop – then you apparently need to wear a mask when you cross some mystical line to enter the shop, and can remove it when you repass the line – not sure what happens to you as you cross the line which means you need a mask 🙁

63708 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Victoria, 9, #451 of 1129 🔗

I like the part where they say the queues are reducing and no queues at many shops… D’uh, that’s because fewer people are going!

63724 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to Victoria, 3, #452 of 1129 🔗

Not all exemptions are visible says Waitrose. True but which ones ARE visible? Very few – most are not discernible to the eye …just another Fake Tale.

63862 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to OKUK, 1, #453 of 1129 🔗

No all examples of blatant FASCISM and a near A psychopathic view towards humanity is visable either eh JOHN LEWIS? John Lewis and Waitrose totally suck in so many ways. Actually their customer service right now is a total joke, almost totally non functional.

64033 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Victoria, 1, #454 of 1129 🔗

Got that email too.The bit about smaller queues made me laugh, don’t they know why that is?

Most odd.

63685 TJN, replying to TJN, 25, #455 of 1129 🔗

Just back from a sea swim. Foggy, drizzle, and a bit rough, so miserable really; but water was warm which always helps. Will be doing more sea swims now, as we learn today (gym reopening day) that most pools won’t be open for a long while yet. That will help with obesity, especially as the weightlessness of swimming is easy on overstrained joints. I wonder how long it will be before I spy my first muzzle in the sea or washed up on the beach.

Called in at Tesco on the way back. Didn’t need to but I wanted to buy a token item on Day 2 of Muzzleland. Quite busy, and I was the only un-muzzled adult. One woman avoided me as if I had bubonic plague sores or something. Then again, I was in my beach clothes (i.e. rags), 6-month uncut hair still wet and sticking out like Ken Dodd, and I probably smelled of piss (having peed in my wetsuit several times). I probably wasn’t giving us exempts a very good image.

Thing is though, I was actually enjoying being there, the only un-muzzled person. I wonder if any other sceptics have experienced the same? And a message for any sceptics who haven’t been shopping yet un-muzzled: go for it! You’ll be pleased you did.

63694 ▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to TJN, 3, #456 of 1129 🔗

And don’t forget that the very best ‘clubs’ and those most worthy of joining are those with limited numbers.

63713 ▶▶ Martin Spencer, replying to TJN, 7, #457 of 1129 🔗

“I wonder if any other sceptics have experienced the same? ”

Yep: I had huge fun in Asda yesterday

63763 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to TJN, 2, #458 of 1129 🔗

I had you down as a bona fide hero, TJN … till you mentioned the wetsuit … 🙂

63770 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to JohnB, 3, #459 of 1129 🔗

I admit, I am a wimp with cold water. But they do help with jellyfish and getting knocked about on rocks. And I’m nearly always on my own, so if I get back and my beach stuff is gone I don’t have to get home nearly naked.

It’s a scandal that most pools won’t be re-opening any time soon. And this is announced on the same day they announce their obesity drive. More long-term damage from the lockdown.

63857 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to TJN, #460 of 1129 🔗

What the freekin hell makes swimming pools so dangerous? This just goes back to superstition, some snooty old hypocondriac dame probably thought this one up, “on no the plebs are just TOO unclean to allow them to go to swimming pools”. The B*(^%$ds.

63993 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Two-Six, 1, #461 of 1129 🔗

Isn’t that what CHLORINE is for?!?

64087 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Two-Six, 1, #462 of 1129 🔗

It isn’t that they are dangerous. It’s that if they reopen under the current ‘guidelines’ they won’t cover their costs and will thus be losing money. This goes for many businesses. The economy is a basket case.

63803 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to JohnB, #463 of 1129 🔗

I should say, are you a swimmer too? Surely you don’t do loads of sea swimming with no wetsuit!

64231 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to TJN, #464 of 1129 🔗

Very occasionally TJN. Mid-Sept to mid-Oct, if the weather is hot.
But no wetsuit.

64314 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to JohnB, 1, #465 of 1129 🔗

There’s nothing quite like sea swimming to clear and freshen the mind.

63686 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 1, #466 of 1129 🔗

Has the Chinese economy suffered as bad as ours?

63712 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Victoria, 3, #467 of 1129 🔗

No, but if I was in their shoes I would be a bit concerned that I had $3-4 trillion in the US Treasury market given the way the wind is blowing.

63814 ▶▶ annie, replying to Victoria, #468 of 1129 🔗

Who makes face nappies, hand poison, plastic gloves….?

63689 CarrieAH, replying to CarrieAH, 77, #469 of 1129 🔗

“”What people really want to focus on now is what are we doing to prepare for the next phase.”” Boris Johnson

No, Boris, I and many others are not playing your game any more. I’ve taken my ball home. I couldn’t give a toss about your preparation for the next phase, because as far as we are concerned, there won’t be one. We are more interested in when you are going to bring this whole charade to an end.

63696 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to CarrieAH, 12, #470 of 1129 🔗


63703 ▶▶ ambwozere, replying to CarrieAH, 9, #471 of 1129 🔗

Totally agree or I think a lot of people will be willing to end it all for him.

63715 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to ambwozere, 6, #472 of 1129 🔗

The men in grey suits will be on the case in the autumn, IMO

63734 ▶▶▶▶ ambwozere, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #473 of 1129 🔗

I hope so or I’ll be doing it for them!

63812 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to ambwozere, 4, #474 of 1129 🔗

New Covviesymptom discovered: irresistible suicidal tendencies, developing about four months after the first infection. Affects fat, stupid politicians.

64156 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to ambwozere, #475 of 1129 🔗

How about reversing that and ending him for all?

63726 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to CarrieAH, 5, #476 of 1129 🔗

I demand an opt-out clause.

63815 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to CarrieAH, 4, #477 of 1129 🔗

There’s no way I’m going back into any form of lockdown.

63927 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to CarrieAH, 2, #478 of 1129 🔗

Hear, hear!!! So fed up with this now.

63700 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 43, #479 of 1129 🔗

I feel like I am living in some sort of parallel universe, in my world there was a bit of a virus a while back but the weekly death rate is now back to normal (below average in fact) and the hospital are doing OK and a long way from being overwhelmed and life can now get back to normal. But in the universe many people seem to be living in there still seems to be some need for panic and fear and people see doom and gloom around every corner, I do not understand their universe and really do not want to live there!
Someone today had tied a rather old grotty hanky around his mouth as a face mask, goodness knows what it had been used for? (wiping his hands after mucking out?) but it would certainly have been better for everyone’s hygiene if he had kept it in his pocket.

63744 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #480 of 1129 🔗

You win the prize for “comment of the day”. Nice one.

63811 ▶▶ microdave, replying to Steve Martindale, 6, #481 of 1129 🔗

I feel like I am living in some sort of parallel universe

I wish I bloody well was – one devoid of Messrs Johnson & Hancock for a start, and with no zombies wearing face nappies in sight. One where “The Science” can not be constantly evolving for Covid, yet is resolutely “settled” when dealing with Climate Change. One where politicians don’t constantly lie (not that we can even see them doing it now), and occasionally admit they’re wrong.There’s lots more on my list, but these starters would allow me a tiny weeny bit of hope for the future, something I don’t have right now…

63912 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to microdave, 3, #482 of 1129 🔗

I walked up the hill to the pub earlier and I realised after I walked past the masked zombies at the bus stop that I felt completely detached from them. Like they were occupying a different world. Maybe I’m going mad or maybe the world is.

64043 ▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to matt, 1, #483 of 1129 🔗

As I commented elsewhere – Invasion of the Bodysnatchers.

63714 Cheezilla, 6, #484 of 1129 🔗
63717 PWL, replying to PWL, 1, #485 of 1129 🔗

1/ It’s not a surprise that UK Government is blaming obesity for Covid-19. This is a gold mine for the pharma/NHS complex.

63720 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to PWL, 4, #486 of 1129 🔗

They’re using that study that’s come out, but the problem with that study is that it only considers unadjusted univeriate analyses, which is not the proper way to do such studies, but then again, all of science has been thrown down the drain with this mild-to-medium severity ‘flu.

63725 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to IMoz, 1, #487 of 1129 🔗

Haven’t a clue what this means, but upticked anyway. 🙂

63727 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to JohnB, 1, #488 of 1129 🔗

For example, an obese person can have hypertension, or diabetes, or some CVD, in a proper adjusted analysis, you’d jusxtapose rates for obese people with no health conditions and those for obese people with either all of those or each of those and compare rate ratios for all; if there is no significant difference for rate ratios, then obesity is a factor, if there is significant difference between rate ratios for obese-healthy and obese-chronically ill, then obesety is not a factor. What they appear to have done is just lumped all obese people (both healthy and with chronic health issues) and said: “et voila!”

63749 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to IMoz, #489 of 1129 🔗

Would have asked, IMoz, would have asked. 🙂 But ta anyway.

63769 ▶▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to IMoz, 1, #490 of 1129 🔗

Why have a study? You just have to look at them.

63870 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to PWL, 2, #491 of 1129 🔗

Has it occurred to.anyone that being fat makes people more likely to have a bad outcome with ANY disease?

So why does it suddenly.matter NOW?

63718 PWL, replying to PWL, 4, #492 of 1129 🔗

2/ However, it’s more likely that there is a correlation between obesity and Covid-19 because ARBs and ACEIs (the prescription drugs ladled out for obesity, high blood pressure, etc) appears to create more of the protein that SARS-COV binds to at the lung; this is leads to the infection and the pneumonia.


63732 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to PWL, #493 of 1129 🔗

Thanks I wondered from the beginning if the problem was caused by the drug treatment, not the condition!

These are the sort of questions journalists ought to be investigating!

63841 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to PWL, 2, #494 of 1129 🔗

Also the reduced lung volume in a fatty and probably much weaker breathing muscles and more pressure on the lungs in general due to excess body fat might well lead to complications if they did come down with SARS2-Cov.

64096 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, #495 of 1129 🔗

Good point. Obese people tend to be breathless to start with.

64421 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Two-Six, #496 of 1129 🔗

It probably due to lung function more than being fat. I have a gone to seed rugby player build (BMI 39) and just had to have full spirometry as part of a work medical. For a man of my age and ethnicity the pass mark was 70 (doctor explain did all really well), I scored between 97 and 134 on the tests so very good lung function. Lots of guys who are lower BMI and age than me were only just squeaking through.

64423 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, #497 of 1129 🔗

Forgot to say – just saying “it’s because you are obese” is an easy get out though. No more explanation needed and it’s easy to see.

63721 IMoz, replying to IMoz, 15, #499 of 1129 🔗

The best argument against masks:- “if something like that was helpful, life on Earth would have long evolved to have that”

63745 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to IMoz, 10, #500 of 1129 🔗

Doesn’t quite trump “They look stupid and they’re fucking dangerous”. For me, anyway. 🙂

63788 ▶▶ DavidC, replying to IMoz, #501 of 1129 🔗

Funnily enough, following a question earlier today from a friend of mine on F***book about something Covid-19 related I’d said exactly that!

Spot on!


63810 ▶▶ annie, replying to IMoz, 1, #502 of 1129 🔗

But Life somehow evolved Handjob…

63963 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to annie, #503 of 1129 🔗

There are always some throwbacks…

63955 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to IMoz, 1, #504 of 1129 🔗

It did.

It’s called the immune system.

63723 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 11, #505 of 1129 🔗

I think there is a connection between this Covid-19 baloney and the late last year Greta Thunberg global rallies. Children were given the day off, usually accompanied by their mothers. Five year olds were carrying signs that read ‘Save the Earth’. It was all government sanctioned/approved/promoted, with free transport. The entire City of Montreal was shut down, streets cordoned off, the police at their stations. The streets were teeming with thousands of people, elbow to elbow, all marching to the same drummer. Six months later, in March 2020, we had empty streets, children not going to school and not carrying signs, people wearing masks, swerving into the street to avoid getting too close to another human being … all marching to the same drummer. All government sanctioned/approved/promoted. Three months after that, Black Lives Matter took over the streets of Montreal with young people carrying signs, mostly designer dressed middle class black, white and tan college/university students, no children, walking elbow to elbow, unmasked, taking over the cordonned off streets, not swerving out of the way, all marching to the same drummer. A few weeks later the All Clear was given and pubs began to fill up. All government approved/sanctionned/promoted. That was shortlived, though and since yesterday, we are back to the imposition of masks, more swerving pedestrians, mask wearers in motorized vehicles … All government sanctionned/approved/promoted.

63730 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to richard riewer, 11, #506 of 1129 🔗

Cultural Marxism. The Marxists were ready and waiting for the Covid pandemic. Last year’s Climate protests (Extinction Rebellion) were the trial run. Yes, it is orchestrated through middle class women and their kids. Like you, we have a soppy Liberal Dear Leader – look at Boris’s father, sister and current girlfriend – they are easy targets for the Cultural Marxists behind the scenes.

63836 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to richard riewer, 4, #507 of 1129 🔗

I went to an Extinction rally in town last year, not to join it just to have a look. I was absolutely ENRAGED, shaking with rage. I could see clearly what was going on. It really did look like a Hitler youth rally, flags and all. There were about 80 school girls and a few boys and an even fewer ordinary people. I knew a lot of them, old local greenies.

They even were mostly in school uniforms. Their posters stayed for months on empty shop fronts. The councill would have gotten rid of any other political posters immediately. I was intensely aware of the DANGER it posed. I was the only person to see this. I said to my friend there that I thought this was DANGEROUS.

I was particularly aggreived at the way some lefty/green party people who are very well know in the local area had hitched their political wagons onto this march and were literally using schoolgirls to bolster their political bullshit. The same bullshit they have been spouting for years and nobody listened to them at all.

Moreover, the press was really behind them, saying stuff like the march was led by the head girl from one of our posh girl’s schools. This is how The Corona Project has been enabled. They are targeting the young systematically with intense propaganda. State sponsored “demonstrations” so transparent.

64247 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Two-Six, 1, #508 of 1129 🔗

Scottish parliament set up an enclosed camp ground for extintion rebellion crapistas on the lawn at parliament – they wanted them there. For a week of disruption – much publicised before hand. Did not last a week. Such poor turn outs no local engagement it was embarrasing to see 5 or 6 radicals sitting beside a pile of rubbish, an old chair some plastic and a bit of cardboard… a protest! Edinburgh completely ignored the establishment funded fake protestors extintion rebellion.
The school children were given council approval to stay off school one friday to protest. Better than school some did. Many others fucked off and had a long weekend.

Fake. Contrived. Bullshit. Enemies of the people.

63729 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #509 of 1129 🔗

Vernon Coleman – good overview so far.

63791 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #510 of 1129 🔗

Vernon Coleman is right on the money, getting more angry with each video, trying to tell people they need to wake up.

63795 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #511 of 1129 🔗

The bit about social credits sent shivers down my spine!

63738 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 17, #512 of 1129 🔗

Dr Malcolm Kendrick on form

Why the scaremongering about COVID?’


The reality is that COVID-19 has all but gone in the UK and Europe. The slow, but inexorable rise in deaths in the UK is being driven by the fact that anyone who has ever had a positive COVID-19 test, who dies, is recorded as dying of COVID.


63747 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 3, #513 of 1129 🔗

So true.

Don’t get these tests, they are unreliable, lots of false positives and should you die long after from another reason you will be a Covid statistic

64100 ▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Victoria, #514 of 1129 🔗

The tests are currently a perverse incentive. If you get one and test positive you risk incurring the wrath of a local lockdown upon your area, now with trumped up council busybodies able to enforce one without needing the say so of a brainless minister. One should refuse all testing until such point as the government scraps its ability to order lockdowns, and repeals all other authoritarian measures in the 2020 covid act. Once the govrnment are willing to work with virus containment measures which are compatible ith magna carta, human rights and civil liberties then, and only then, should we consider doing anything which would let them get the data they need to have a full picture of covid’s (now negligible) spread.

63758 ▶▶ Mark B, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 6, #515 of 1129 🔗

Yes, well worth reading. Here’s a highlight

A biomedical scientist in the UK sent me an e-mail two days ago, about the testing they had done.
‘In the week 9th – 16th July we carried out 2800 PCR tests (across three different platforms: mainly on the Hologic Panther, but some on the Cepheid GeneXpert and Biomerieux BioFire) and had only 4 positives. These 4 positives were all patients who had previously tested positive. We had NO new cases, and after checking back a few weeks, the only positives we have had have been from repeat swabs from these same 4 patients – they were almost acting like QC samples to ensure that our tests were actually working properly!
Two thousand eight hundred tests and none positive. This scientist contacted other laboratories, and they were seeing the same things. ‘I have contacted a couple of nearby NHS Pathology Labs and they reported the same findings as us: zero or near zero new cases for several weeks.’
What on earth is going on?

63761 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark B, #516 of 1129 🔗

Coup, coup …

[Bill Hicks, pigeons]

63792 ▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to JohnB, 3, #517 of 1129 🔗

How long before our leaders are wearing military uniforms?

63821 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Mark B, #518 of 1129 🔗

For gods sake why doesn’t this make ANY bastard news outlets. This is just POISON.

63959 ▶▶▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Two-Six, #519 of 1129 🔗

Malcolm Kendrick’s article originally appeared on rt.com.

63826 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Mark B, #520 of 1129 🔗

So how are they reporting hundreds of new cases every day? I’m sure some of them are repeat/double counted tests, but not that many surely?

63973 ▶▶▶▶ Mark B, replying to A. Contrarian, 3, #521 of 1129 🔗

Today they performed 157,229 tests and found 767 positives. That is 0.49% which could well be in the range of false positives.
They also list antibody tests and it’s not clear if a positive in this is counted as infected which would totally confuse matters.

63797 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, #522 of 1129 🔗

Kendrick rocks!

63741 Steeve, replying to Steeve, 8, #523 of 1129 🔗


First we need soldiers in the supermarkets, in the veg shop, butchers and chippy! Don’t hide behind the online shopping malarkey (unless you really have a good reason) We need -courage. Lets make 1 – 2 and 2- 4 and then 4-8 and then 8-16 and then 16-32 and then 32-64 and then 64-128. We need 100 soldiers of freedom in every town by next week. ONLY YOU CAN MAKE THAT HAPPEN!

63759 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Steeve, 7, #524 of 1129 🔗

Yep, agreed. One of the few (and most important) things we can do is maintain our normal routines / way of life.

63809 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to JohnB, 8, #525 of 1129 🔗

Spot on. Normal is poison to the Fascist devils. Feed ’em tons of it.

63881 ▶▶ Hubes, replying to Steeve, 4, #526 of 1129 🔗

Yep that has been my way throughout all of this, just carry on as normal. The more ridiculous the rule, the more important it is to completely ignore it. Like this face mask shit.

63753 jim j, replying to jim j, 12, #527 of 1129 🔗

Has anyone else observed the “expert” opinions that are making click bait are getting more and more ludicrous? It’s as though all the academic egos that haven’t been stroked yet realise they need to make more ridiculous and more ambit claims of disaster to get their names in the media. Dear old Fauci is not even immune from it. Wake up world, “science” is very far from infallible and impartial – they are pushing their own narrow like never before!! Anything for a grant, or it’s back to unemployment for them!

63818 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to jim j, 4, #528 of 1129 🔗

Unemployment? Freekin JAIL is what these bastards need.

63903 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to jim j, 2, #529 of 1129 🔗

These “scientists” are behaving more shamans and witch doctors. The scientific methods has gone out of the window.

64138 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bart Simpson, #530 of 1129 🔗

No need to disrespect shamans and witch doctors !

63760 stefarm, 13, #531 of 1129 🔗

The problem is because no one is now getting sick the so called experts can’t say there’s no point in wearing a mask because nature is in control and the virus will infect you with a mask or no mask.

The plebs now wearing masks are too thick to work this out.

63762 RDawg, replying to RDawg, 26, #532 of 1129 🔗

Sadly I broke up with gf today, after realising the long distance thing is making it unsustainable. It has been on the cards for a while. I didn’t think it would be possible to feel any lower in 2020, but today I managed to hit that new low.

I think what makes it harder is that all of my usual coping mechanisms have been ruined by govt interference. My gym is not the same. My favourite cafe is not the same. My favourite pub has no live music and dancing anymore.

A defining moment for me is the fact that my local cafe is no longer providing newspapers/magazines anymore to read. This is due to the local authority banning them because of the risk of cross-contamination between customers. All businesses serving food under the Richmond LA have been told that all staff must mask up.

I will have to turn to my faith now more than ever, and pray that I can be strong and life finds a way to return to some sort of normality. Today has been a real punch in the guts 🙁

63764 ▶▶ Edna, replying to RDawg, 4, #533 of 1129 🔗

So sorry to hear this RDawg.

63765 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to RDawg, 6, #534 of 1129 🔗

Very sorry to hear what you’re going through RDawg 🙁

63768 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to RDawg, 7, #535 of 1129 🔗

So sorry RDawg. We will all try to help you through this.

63776 ▶▶ TJN, replying to RDawg, 10, #536 of 1129 🔗

Sorry to hear this RDawg. Lots of people are feeling very dark now, so you aren’t alone.

My advice is to do lots of shopping unmasked. One, you’ll feel better straight away. Two, sooner or later they’ll be some gal doing the same and you’ll click immediately as having something in common. I reckon shops could become the new dating sites.

And remember, always look out for the crazy and absurd. Lockdown sceptics are winning the humour war by a country mile (not that we have much competition).

63780 ▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to TJN, 3, #537 of 1129 🔗

Shops have always been a good dating site – years ago, hovering over the chilled food in M&S… ah….

63782 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to RDawg, 2, #538 of 1129 🔗

Sorry to hear this RDawg.

63808 ▶▶ annie, replying to RDawg, 10, #539 of 1129 🔗

Pray. Be strong. Tribulation comes, then redemption.
I lit a candle for us all today in our brave Catholic church.Whatever your religion, or even if you have none, , you have faith in Good against Evil. We all hold to that.
Bless you all.

63824 ▶▶ Bella, replying to RDawg, 3, #540 of 1129 🔗

Sorry about the gf, keep strong. I don’t understand all the cross contamination bulshit. If that’s the case with publications surely it’s the same with seats, people do put their hands on seats. Maybe everyone should stand instead.

64092 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bella, #541 of 1129 🔗

Don’t give them ideas!

63840 ▶▶ RDawg, replying to RDawg, 4, #542 of 1129 🔗

Thank you all for your kind words and support guys. In a world of pain right now and very confused about everything. Nothing makes sense anymore.

63843 ▶▶ Simon, replying to RDawg, 5, #543 of 1129 🔗

RDawg, I’m sorry to hear that. It’s one of those other risks of life, I know it quite well.

I will quote the great Spencer Conway, who once said (and this goes for all of us on here) “no matter how bad things get, this momment will pass”.

He was lying in a ditch in Africa having been shot by an automatic weapon and waited two days to see if they’d come back to finish him off when he thought of that. Then he got up and walked many miles to find a hospital.

Go out with a smile on your face and others will smile back. You’re not on your own.

63856 ▶▶ James007, replying to RDawg, 4, #544 of 1129 🔗

Really sorry to hear this. Tough to deal with losing a relationship in normal times.
Completely understand about the coping mechanisms. Dont know if you’re the church type, but for me church was a coping mechanism, and loosing that community has been tough, as well as swimming, spontaneous day trips etc.. all stopped or sanitized.

I enjoy your posts and updates. Thanks for sharing

63858 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to RDawg, 12, #545 of 1129 🔗

This is exactly how I feel (without the breakup luckily) and I’m now resolved. The gvt. have until Christmas to row back on this insanity – or, at least quietly let it gracefully melt away – or I’m gone from these shores. Still compiling my list of where I’ll be going (getting longer by the day as more and more countries cancel the apocalypse). I refuse to live in a country where living normally is pathologised.

I haven’t spent all these years learning languages and travelling for nothing. It’s time I used my skills.

63911 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Farinances, 3, #546 of 1129 🔗

Do it. Wish I was a bit younger, but am a little too old to start over again.

63969 ▶▶▶ gina, replying to Farinances, 1, #547 of 1129 🔗

Any suggestions as to where might be good? Would be much appreciated. Not sure I can hang on until Christmas.

64035 ▶▶▶▶ RDawg, replying to gina, 1, #548 of 1129 🔗


64220 ▶▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to RDawg, #549 of 1129 🔗

Its on my list. Also France which I know quite well – as they have promised not to lock down again. Trying to think more widely though. Could be an opportunity for a marvellous adventure.
Saw your news. Tough time eh. Hope you can find things to do for yourself, the small things like a warm bath, a walk, a gaze at the sky, something nice to eat, that make you feel better in the moment. Small pleasures can make the days bearable. Wishing you well

64264 ▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to gina, #550 of 1129 🔗

Agh soz I never replied!

Current list:

  1. Most of Eastern Europe. They seem to be back to normal. – Bar Poland which went a bit batshit crazy with their quarantine enforcement selfies. I may be a bit biased because I’ve alway wanted to travel here – particularly Romania and Transylvania which are just stunning.
  2. Serbia & Croatia. Serbia rioted and got their way. Croatia seems to have never really succumbed to the nonsense and has really low (AKA non-fake) death rate. (I also have a few Croatian friends and can muddle along in the language)
  3. Greece. See Croatia. They did panic and go into lockdown but seemed to relent pretty quickly when they realised the nothingburger status of their ‘outbreak’. I am basically an adopted Greek and can speak Greek so…. this would be pretty easy for me.
  4. TANZANIA! – Seriously, I love Africa (never been!) so if I could get a decent job this could actually be an option. Dude banned face masks and tested a papaya and is my hero for life.
  5. Scandinavia – more specifically Sweden (of course), Norway, Finland and Iceland. The reason they are lower down on my list is that they’re pretty hard to survive in if you don’t have a really well paid job – high cost of living etc. They are just such sensible, sound people though by the sound of it. My Dad (extensive traveller for work, been everywhere) says the Fins and the Icelanders are “completely insane” but in a good way.
  6. Germany and Italy are also on the list but only because of personal convenience (friends and family, I can muddle along in German and speak Italian, contacts etc.) But I’m not so confident about them with regards post-Covid madness. At least there are stirrings of dissent in these countries though via protests and some governmental agitation (Italian MPs calling Covid a fraud, German government departments inititally strongly against lockdown – but were ignored). I’m pretty confident neither of these nations would nationally lock down again.
64265 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Farinances, #551 of 1129 🔗

Oooh. Also maybe 7. The Netherlands/Switzerland. I have heard positive stirrings for both countries (The Swiss were apparently VERY disparaging of lockdown and only had moderate measures like Sweden) but also negative ones (they appear to be very mask happy in both countries).

63778 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, #552 of 1129 🔗

What is still closed in England? Theatres, live music, comedy venues & night clubs is that everything?

63783 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Dave #KBF, #553 of 1129 🔗


63784 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, #554 of 1129 🔗

Sports stadia.

63787 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Dave #KBF, #555 of 1129 🔗

Some museums and heritage sites are still closed.

63793 ▶▶ DavidC, replying to Dave #KBF, 13, #556 of 1129 🔗

A lot of people’s minds!


63796 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to DavidC, #557 of 1129 🔗

Got to agree with that, sadly.

63834 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Dave #KBF, #558 of 1129 🔗


63853 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to DRW, #559 of 1129 🔗

Is parliament in summer recess yet? For all the good they are doing they may as well be.

64089 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #560 of 1129 🔗

Yes. Bunked off just before the mask edict came into force.

63785 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 18, #561 of 1129 🔗

My retail report:

Covent Garden – super dead, even Apple store so looks like people are waking up to how draconian they are and are voting with their feet and wallet. Had lovely lunch with takeways from Wahaca and Santa Nata – very positive experience from both

Mr Bart wanted to go to a garden centre so we headed off to one in North London, fairly close to where we used to live. Small sign outside about mandatory muzzling but we ignored it and inside no-one challenged us. Other customers constantly touching their faces and adjusting muzzles. Mr Bart overheard one woman complaining about being uncomfortable and having trouble breathing. Woman who rang up our purchase constantly fiddling with her muzzle and glasses.

Sainsbury’s – doorman asked if I had a muzzle, I said I was medically exempt and he smiled and gave me a thumbs up. Once inside I had no problems but staff looked rather unhappy and demoralised wearing the muzzles.

I won’t be surprised if the takings this weekend will be so bad to non existent and will hasten the demise of more shops.

63909 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Bart Simpson, 6, #562 of 1129 🔗

Wife just got back from Teesside Park near Middlesbrough. Just about everyone in M&S wearing a muzzle, and the retail park was packed out like any other Saturday before the hysteria started. I rate this as bad news.

64047 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tenchy, 3, #563 of 1129 🔗

Indeed. That said I wonder if this is because people who are still employed have just been paid.

63798 Michael, #564 of 1129 🔗

I believe we are on Stage 6 of the 10 Stages of Genocide. comment image ?cb=1444338307

63800 Ben Shirley, replying to Ben Shirley, 26, #565 of 1129 🔗

To follow up a post I made earlier in the week, in which I explained that many of my colleagues in Sainsbury’s had no intention of adhering to Sainsbury’s diktat that all shop-floor employees must wear masks, I have just come back from a shift this afternoon.

I walked into the shop without a mask, started work and at no point was I given any trouble by a manager. Two department managers weren’t wearing one and the store manager herself was wearing one, but as a chinstrap. I was the only shelf-stacker not masked, except for Colleague A from Tuesday who had gone to great pains to prove herself exempt on medical grounds.

Many other colleagues were making a mockery of the rule by wearing their masks as chinstraps, although sadly at least 50 per cent persisted in wearing their masks in the correct Orwellian fashion, even though they were constantly fiddling with them or taking them down to talk.

I think I’m extremely lucky to be working in a store where the management has taken such a laissez-faire , common-sense approach, but what disappoints me is that, with this in mind, half its employees are muzzling up of their own free will. It just goes to reinforce Aldous Huxley’s warning that “A really efficient totalitarian state would be one in which the all-powerful executive of political bosses and their army of managers control a population of slaves who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude.”

63806 ▶▶ annie, replying to Ben Shirley, 5, #566 of 1129 🔗

Cheering. Keep it up.
By God, they gave to coerce people like us. And it isn’t working. If the whole population were truly enslaved they wouldn’t need to bother obliterating faces.

63804 Ben Shirley, 12, #567 of 1129 🔗

A few observations of customers from an afternoon spent working on the shop floor.

The Saddest Irony Award goes to the masked woman carrying a bag emblazoned with the legend ‘Free Soul’.

The “Please Don’t Hurt Me, I’m a Good Boy, Honest!” Award went to the man who was having a conversation on his mobile ‘phone and tried desperately to tuck it inside his face mask.

The Best Piss-Take Award went to the young unmasked woman who just held her sleeve across her face if she thought someone might be looking at her.

63805 Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 19, #568 of 1129 🔗

Got back from the Czech Republic yesterday.

Did many normal things there that are strictly verboten in England such as eat a buffet breakfast everyday, visited a swimming pool (without any butterfly stroke restirctions) and even listened to some live music in a bar! The coronaphobes would have a heart attack if they found out!

63901 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 1, #569 of 1129 🔗

We’re thinking of Prague for October, but after what’s just happened regarding Spain – we’re thinking again. What a bunch of gits we have running this country.

63943 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Tenchy, 2, #570 of 1129 🔗

I don’t blame you. We went on a bit of a whim because we’re both airline staff so we get cheap fully flexible tickets as a perk. If I was paying full fare without flexible cancellation I’d certainly think twice.

63949 ▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, #571 of 1129 🔗

Did you have to wear a mask when you went up to the buffet to choose your breakfast though? On holiday in the north of France things were normal except for the masks, so I would put on my mask when I went up to the buffet then take it off and leave it on the table while I was eating my breakfast. Which wasn’t a very hygienic thing to do but nobody seemed to mind all the germs I might be leaving on the table.

63807 Bella, replying to Bella, 14, #572 of 1129 🔗

If Johnson still doesn’t know a thing about the virus – moron – maybe he should have listened to those that do, people like Knut Wittowski (this back in April).

WITTKOWSKI: Of course! I don’t know where these (huge) numbers are coming from—they’re totally unrealistic. There are no indications that this flu is fundamentally different from every other flu. We know what happened in China, we know what happened in South Korea, we know what happened, or is happening, in Europe. There are no indications that anything is different from a regular flu. Maybe it’s a bit worse than other flus—could be?
For a respiratory disease, the flu ends during springtime, that people spend more time outdoors because outdoors, the viruses cannot easily spread. That is a form of containment, spending more time outdoors.
INTERVIEWER: So, we’re now spending more time indoors. We’ve been told to go indoors. Isn’t that—doesn’t that help keep the virus going?
WITTKOWSKI: It keeps the virus healthy, yeah.
INTERVIEWER: So we should be told to go outdoors?
WITTKOWSKI: Yeah. Going outdoors is what stops every respiratory disease.

Full interview here: https://21stcenturywire.com/2020/04/15/herd-immunity-expert-explains-why-covid-19-lockdown-social-distancing-doesnt-actually-work/

63828 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Bella, 6, #573 of 1129 🔗

One of the many posters from back then

63831 ▶▶▶ James007, replying to PoshPanic, 7, #574 of 1129 🔗

This one was posted around the children’s play equipment near my mum’s house!
No wonder it’s hard getting the children back playing there!

63946 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to PoshPanic, 7, #575 of 1129 🔗

I may be pointing out the obvious to some but still worthwhile. The nhs image has been consciously colour shifted to cause a emotional response.

Compare it with the angelic photo of ferguson. Another deliberate choice of imaging.


The NHS briefed and approved an image that causes stress and anxiety. All throughly obvious I know. But no less shocking for that. I cannot express how ^&£_$@&(* this is.

Clearly the words are rotten too, we may see this image in history books of propaganda. The contrast between the NHS logo – a caring organisation, yet such brutal aggressive messaging causes the stress. The NHS public health officials are scum.

63986 ▶▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Basics, 1, #576 of 1129 🔗

Yep, perfectly set up, with a colour grade straight from a dystopian movie.

From memory, they actually used the words ” STAY INSIDE” at the start of lockdown, this was replaced widely with ” STAY HOME”. I wonder why?

64059 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to PoshPanic, 3, #577 of 1129 🔗

28 days later. Funny because it was boyle who directed olympic opener too.

In britain we use the word ‘at’ interesting ommision in both. Then corbett rocks up with his video https://youtu.be/EmWDUmFV6yY

And so we have a marketing campaign to instill fear and panic in our population. Folk are saying they aren’t going to vote for them again. We need to be locking these people up.

64084 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to PoshPanic, 1, #578 of 1129 🔗

People furloughed or not working in offices any more?

64133 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to PoshPanic, #579 of 1129 🔗

‘Home’ has a much deeper emotional resonance than ‘inside’ ?

64058 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, #580 of 1129 🔗

They really are, that’s pretty shocking. No wonder people are mental.

64082 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Basics, #581 of 1129 🔗

Red and yellow. Interesting!
Colours of the Chinese flag as pointed out on Friday’s UK Column.


64134 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, #582 of 1129 🔗

Red and black – Mars, nazis.

Yellow and black – wasps.

Both I think danger signals in nature.

63842 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Bella, 5, #583 of 1129 🔗

All the authorities achieved was to push the infection spread into people’s homes, where they could spread it more easily to each other. I remember hearing/reading about it at the time, but it never got any traction in the media or with politicians.

63852 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Lms23, 1, #584 of 1129 🔗

Wasn’t that one of the big amplifiers in Italy, with all its extended family households?

63990 ▶▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to DRW, 1, #585 of 1129 🔗

Not sure on that. I think care homes being abandoned in panic was one of the issues there. But most of the areas, that had out of proportion numbers, were areas with dense populations and poor air quality at the time…Madrid, Lombardy, New York, London etc

63849 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bella, 7, #586 of 1129 🔗

I was shouted at on another site for pointing this out. The old TB hospitals had south-facing gardens and verandahs, not to kill off the patients, but to help alleviate their symptoms. Sometimes think the government is trying to reinvent the wheel, just as it tried with the Foot and Mouth outbreak in 2001.

64077 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #587 of 1129 🔗

The Foot and Mouth scandal, that had millions of livestock needlessly destroyed, had a lesser known effect.

Prior to that, pigs were fed pigswill, ie leftover food from school dinners and restaurants. Very effective recycling and quite healthy for the pigs.

After F&M, DEFRA mandated that pigs must not be fed on swill. Like cows, they now eat commmercially-produced food that is not particularly suitable for their digestive systems. Pellets made from grain and soy – another win for Big Ag and the hugely powerful seed companies.

Of course, we eat the pork, which is less healthy for us because of the pigs’ unnatural diet.

I suspect that’s one reason Ferguson keeps being mandated to create his disastrous models. Cui bono?

63813 Bella, replying to Bella, 19, #588 of 1129 🔗

Discarding used masks indiscriminately is as disgusting as discarding used condoms the same way, these fucking zealots need to get a grip (anger increasing day by day)

63837 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Bella, 8, #589 of 1129 🔗

And I have to wonder how many of those carelessly discarding their PPE also believe in the climate change catastrophe nonsense?

63817 Michael, #590 of 1129 🔗

I believe we are on Stage 6 of the 10 Stages of Genocide:

1. Classification: people are divided into “us and them.”
2. Symbolization: people are forced to identify themselves.
3. Discrimination: people begin to face systematic discrimination.
4. Dehumanization: people equated with animals, vermin, or diseases
5. Organization: the government creates specific groups (police/military) to enforce the policies
6. Polarization: the government broadcasts propaganda to turn the populace against the group
7. Preparation: official action to remove/relocate people
8. Persecution: beginning of murders, theft of property, trial massacres
9. Extermination: wholesale elimination of the group. It is “extermination” and not murder people the people are not considered human.
10. Denial: the government denies that it has committed any crime.

Source: Stanton, Gregory (2012). 10 Stages of Genocide. Genocide Watch.

63823 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #591 of 1129 🔗

The impact of the mask edict on infection figures in Ireland so far.

These are the words the Irish Taoiseach, Michael Martin, used just over a week ago when he announced he was going to make the wearing of face masks mandatory in Ireland.

My government and I have received very sobering advice from the National Public Health Emergency Team. The concern about the rise in the number of cases over recent weeks is very real.

The R number, which we have all become familiar with, has now risen above ‘1’ in this country.

And the international situation, with almost a million and a half cases reported in just the last week, represents a growing worry.

Using the Irish government’s own website I’ve been able to put the following concrete figures on the Taoiseach’s statement.

The lowest number of “cases confirmed” in a single week since mid-March was towards the end of June – from the 22nd to the 28th June to be exact. In that week there were 67 cases. (In mid April there had been more than 4,000 cases a week.)

As Martin spoke on the 15th July the rise in cases which disturbed him must have occurred in the previous two and a half weeks. What was the size of this increase?

In the week after the 22nd to the 28th June (i.e. up to the 5th of July) there were 94 cases.

And in the week after, up to the 12th of July, there were 127 cases.

An increase certainly – but it was in no way similar to the thirty-three fold increase which occurred over a two week period back in March which led to a lockdown.

In the week Martin made his statement there were 142 cases.

In the week just gone, including today, there were 119 cases – i.e. less that second week of increase earlier this month that caused Mr. Martin and his government so much concern.

What should we make of these figures?

On the face of it it looks like over four million people masking up in the past week has prevented a few score infections occurring? Or has the ‘benefit’ been far greater than meets the eye?

Or could this decline in cases have happened anyway?

63847 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #592 of 1129 🔗

Funnily enough, I saw something on Yahoo yesterday claiming the so-called “R” number was “probably” above 1 in every region of England. Hmm.

63861 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Ned of the Hills, 6, #593 of 1129 🔗

Ireland, population 4.9 million (republic), currently has 10 people in hospital with the Wuhan Lab flu (five critical). There are 741 active cases, and I’m guessing a lot of these will be asymptomatic. Put another way, the virus has all but disappeared in Ireland. However, it seems the Irish Establishment is, like its British counterpart, stuffed full of wankers. As the pandemic retreats, they claim ever smaller numbers of deaths, cases, positive tests or whatever, are “troubling developments”. It does not bode well for a return to the “old normal”.

63880 ▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Tenchy, #594 of 1129 🔗

Hi Tenchy – do you have those type of stats for Spain?

63895 ▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Steeve, #595 of 1129 🔗

Hi Steeve, unfortunately not. I source the Irish data from Wikipedia:


But the equivalent article for Spain doesn’t have that detail and is not quite up-to-date:


However, you’ll note that each day there are just a handful of deaths in Spain, and the rate of increase in case numbers is below 1%. The article has no information on test numbers as far as I can see, but I bet testing has recently increased significantly.

BTW, face masks are compulsory at all times when outdoors in many parts of Spain. It doesn’t seem to be making a difference.

63920 ▶▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Tenchy, #596 of 1129 🔗

Thanks! I follow a Swedish site – mainly because I like the graphs + have always have been interested in their policy. On the international graph they do not include Spain.

63890 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Tenchy, 4, #597 of 1129 🔗

If populations can be kept witless with fear they won’t question so much the lockdown disaster. I think this might well prompt a keenness for mask wearing edicts, or at least a disposition to enact them.

64078 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #598 of 1129 🔗

Might well? It’s exactly what is happening.

63934 ▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Ned of the Hills, #599 of 1129 🔗

What is meant by a “confirmed case?” Is it based on the test or are people actually feeling unwell and turning up in hospital? In which case, what are there symptoms? And how are they treated?

64126 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ned of the Hills, 3, #600 of 1129 🔗

What should we make of these figures?

Your leader’s a cunt, like most of the others ?

63845 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 9, #601 of 1129 🔗

Breaking News:

U.K. residents returning from Spain will have to quarantine for 14 days from Monday!

63851 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 2, #602 of 1129 🔗

I note a few contributors are there now, if you cannot quarantine coming back, I would get out now.

63855 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 7, #603 of 1129 🔗

Actually, if not back by midnight tonight!!!! FFS this is insane

64007 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Sarigan, 3, #604 of 1129 🔗

No, just ignore the quarantine

64025 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Sarigan, 1, #605 of 1129 🔗

Travel via another country if you can, i.e France

63859 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Sarigan, 9, #606 of 1129 🔗

Seems that they’re determined to destroy the airline and travel industries. Might as well hand over the keys to my house now!

63864 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 11, #607 of 1129 🔗

Me too, 18 years of running a successful small travel company. Destroyed

63869 ▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Sarigan, -29, #608 of 1129 🔗

But if holiday makers bring the virus back to the UK what on earth else is there to do? Spain are seeing increase in cases, do you want that here? This is a repeat of half term ski trips which started it all last time.

63882 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to hotrod, 9, #609 of 1129 🔗

Test them? Ask to stay home for few days and see if there are any symptoms? Not worry that 4500 news cases may be due to increased testing and is only 0.009% of the population of Spain.

63885 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Sarigan, 2, #610 of 1129 🔗

Thank you. Great answer. The government are clearly panicking as see this now as purely a vote winner.

63905 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Sarigan, 2, #611 of 1129 🔗

And not only due to increased testing, but false positives doubtless in there, if not the mass psychosis referred to above (or below, depending on your options).

64074 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Sarigan, 8, #612 of 1129 🔗

Can’t be true anyway, Spain has been nappied up for months, stops transmission don’t it?

63883 ▶▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to hotrod, -12, #613 of 1129 🔗

Rather than adding thumbs down how about answering my point.

63886 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to hotrod, 13, #614 of 1129 🔗

We can’t keep locking down in perpetuity, hotrod. Think about it.

63896 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Tom Blackburn, -19, #615 of 1129 🔗

Isn’t this move to stop more lockdowns being necessary? IF infections rise from returning holiday makers then Lockdown may need to return. Hence this step to help avoid. What else could be done if there is a new risk?

63908 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to hotrod, 30, #616 of 1129 🔗

Lockdown was NEVER needed and has achieved nothing except to terrify many citizens and destroy a very significant portion of our economy (and of course set in chain hundreds of thousands of avoidable deaths). Do you not yet realise that this is simply a flu-level virus which almost noone would have noticed without the government-sponsored project-fear?

63918 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to IanE, -9, #617 of 1129 🔗

Ok if what you say is all true why on earth are the government sponsoring this? What are they doing all this for exactly?

63941 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to hotrod, 9, #618 of 1129 🔗

International peer pressure. Starting in China, then spreading to Italy, and from there to most of the rest of the world. If those clowns hadn’t embarked on their draconian lockdowns the rest of the world wouldn’t have done so either.

63956 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Tenchy, 1, #619 of 1129 🔗

Yes but China never had a total national lockdown.

64118 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Tenchy, #620 of 1129 🔗

Lets hope the next pandemic starts somewhere libertarian, then in copying the local strategies used to combat it the world can become a more free place. Would be funny to see China forced to adopt fair elections and a ban on censorship as tools against a disease.

63977 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to hotrod, 4, #621 of 1129 🔗

Try a bit of independent research, Hotrod. The answers are waiting for you.

63997 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to hotrod, #622 of 1129 🔗

See my post up near the top with the new comments on here about the journalist predicting the futhur. That is why they are doing this.

63953 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to hotrod, 9, #623 of 1129 🔗

A risk from what? A virus so deadly that you need to be tested to be told that you have it?

64205 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to hotrod, #624 of 1129 🔗

People could just be asked to do a test not quarantine.

63892 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to hotrod, 1, #625 of 1129 🔗

I didn’t thumbs down you as respect your opinion and thought I answered you perfectly well. I guess the only other answer is to shut down the world completely until the virus is eradicated or we have a vaccine – is that better?

63900 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Sarigan, -8, #626 of 1129 🔗

Sorry I know you didn’t and I thanked you for your reply but in between someone else did give the thumbs down.

63902 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to hotrod, 2, #627 of 1129 🔗

Living for likes eh?

63987 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Two-Six, 7, #628 of 1129 🔗

Hotrod needs an endorphin hit. Posting pro-lockdown and government supportive messages on here probably isn’t the right strategy.

64039 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Cicatriz, 1, #629 of 1129 🔗

Strategy. An interesting word. . . . .

63942 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to hotrod, 2, #630 of 1129 🔗

There is a quote that is (incorrectly) attributed to Ronald Reagan viz:

“Don’t just do something, stand there”. It is appropriate for the moment in time.

64179 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ewan Duffy, #631 of 1129 🔗

Groucho Marx ?

63910 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to hotrod, 16, #632 of 1129 🔗

Given the low IFR of this virus, I believe the correct course of action would be to do nothing. Continuously opening and closing things in response to positive test numbers is tail chasing in the extreme.

63915 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to hotrod, 25, #633 of 1129 🔗

The tests are totally crap. They give more false positives than accurate results. Especially the PCR test. They cannot be relied upon. The virus is endemic in the UK, in the wild, most people have immunity to it, most people will not even notice they have it, the vast majority will have only very mild symptoms, only a tiny tiny few will have any problem if they have it and even fewer of them will need any kind of medical support to help them get over it. one or two might die if they are already very ill and old.


Everything you have heard about this virus is a lie.

63921 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Two-Six, 1, #634 of 1129 🔗

Short, sweet & to the point.

64060 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #635 of 1129 🔗

It’s too worldwide for that. The keyword, as already noted is “Lockstep”.

My son spotted back in April that all the countries were using exactly the same vocabulary. This has been co-ordinated across western economies.

64071 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #636 of 1129 🔗

Yes to a script. its easy to see. Same with WMD’s there are loads of videos on youtube showing all world “leaders” saying the same words in relation to Iraq and WMD’s. I saw another video recently that showed the same thing, hundreds of TV stations repeating the same scripted news items using the same intonation. Crazy.

63935 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Two-Six, 1, #637 of 1129 🔗

Why the lie. Who is gaining from this in HMG?

63957 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to hotrod, 10, #638 of 1129 🔗

That’s a matter of debate.

My own opinion is that they panicked back in March, and policy since then has been driven by the overriding priority of avoiding getting the blame for that while (as a secondary objective) trying to limit the damage to the nation. So they absolutely cannot admit that this was a virus not noticeably more dangerous than past cold/flu epidemics (as the figures demonstrate incontrovertibly) and that the damage inflicted by lockdown was unnecessary, but they need to get people back shopping and working.

Hence all the ludicrous dancing around pretending there’s a dangerous disease still lurking out there.

(I also suspect that one or two key individuals in government (Cummings at least) are literally irrationally afraid of this disease or diseases in general and have been driving policy in irrational directions throughout, but that’s more speculative.)

64006 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to hotrod, 1, #639 of 1129 🔗

The new corporate global communitarian governance structure that is king of the world now.

Check this out hotrod:

Everybody should watch this.
The Corona Project is a global corporate coup d’e’tat

64127 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 2, #640 of 1129 🔗

You only need to look at this list to know it stinks to high heaven:

…. hosted by The Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security in partnership with the World Economic Forum and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation ….

64017 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Two-Six, 1, #641 of 1129 🔗


Great post. So True

64110 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Two-Six, 6, #642 of 1129 🔗

Indeed, I have worked with PCR testing in another area and whilst they are an extremely useful and powerful technology, they need to be used in conjunction with a full professional assessment of the symptom. They should not be taken as ‘Gospel Truth’ in their own right. The residual RNA scraps from a cured case can trigger a +ve result. So, as it is. the Pillar 2 testing farrago is becoming a Hotel California, ‘you can get cured any time you like but you can can never leave (lock-down).

63940 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to hotrod, #643 of 1129 🔗

“what on earth else is there to do”

Hide under your bed, making sure you seal up all windows and doors beforehand.

63954 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark B, replying to hotrod, 8, #644 of 1129 🔗

The fact that the virus has pretty much disappeared in the U.K. with no spikes when lockdown ended suggests we already have herd immunity. So I doubt travelling to Spain will make much difference.

64003 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Mark B, 4, #645 of 1129 🔗

The virus was with us for months before lockdown. It was only when lockdown was imposed that deaths increased above the five year average. It’s a pattern that repeats in many other countries too. As though lockdown has a direct connection to increased deaths.

Currently UK in under the five year average as we were just prior to lockdown.

64051 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to hotrod, 2, #646 of 1129 🔗

There’s no virus to bring back!

64105 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to hotrod, #647 of 1129 🔗

Is it? What’s the increase in hospitalisations in Spain? Or is it just increased testing means you find more people testing positive?

And did the half term ski trips “start it all last time”? If that is true, we would have seen the beginning of the spike of cases before the end of February, peaking in mid-March. February half term too early to be the start of that.

64114 ▶▶▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to hotrod, #648 of 1129 🔗

We don’t mind an increase, just as long as we take the Swedish way of handling it. Keep clam, carry on, never lock down. Although I would doubt an increase is likely, the virus is wiping itself out, if a few cases get imported then the virus within the Uk will still keep trending towards extinction.

64137 ▶▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to hotrod, 8, #649 of 1129 🔗

It doesn’t make any difference. We’ve already had the epidemic here in the UK. It’s been and gone. There are a few thousand or maybe tens of thousands of cases in the country and will be forever (probably going up a bit each winter and down again in the summer). The virus is endemic in the UK.

There’s no way that our late and half-arsed lockdown followed by ludicrous and widely-ignored “social distancing” and laughable track and tracing effort is what’s keeping the virus at practically undetectable levels. Such measures are certainly able to lower R0 a bit but are a million miles from what you would need to actually suppress or eradicate a respiratory virus.

According to an ONS statistic mentioned here the other day, there are now 3x as many deaths from other viruses as from Covid-19. In their recent Covid-19 Infection Survey, around 20x as many people reported cold or flu-like symptoms as tested positive for Covid-19. If the distancing, masks, etc. are so effective how are people catching these other viruses?

Those other viruses probably are at lower levels than they would be normally– the measures probably are reducing transmission– but if a large percentage of the population were still susceptible to Covid-19 we would be seeing a real second wave. I don’t mean phony outbreaks like in Leicester. I mean hospitalizations and deaths.

Look at Romania on worldometers: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/romania/ . Don’t just look at cases. Scroll down and look at deaths. That’s what it looks like if you had a real lockdown and then relaxed it. Romania isn’t the only place, I’m sure you can find others. I don’t know what their restrictions are but it’s very likely they are still stricter than anything the UK ever imposed.

The UK has very similar seroprevalence levels to Sweden, who also have almost no cases. Seroprevalence is lower than initial estimates of what was required for herd immunity, but we now have actual evidence of cross-immunity from other coronaviruses. Several people have done the math to estimate the effect on herd immunity threshold of pre-existing immunity, and links have been posted here. This, combined with what we know about how rapidly antibody levels drop in mild cases (this is nothing unusual, nothing special about Covid, and does not people are not still immune), means that the measured levels are entirely consistent with the UK having reached herd immunity.

So has Sweden, so has New York, and so have many other places, probably including all of Spain and Italy, although there is a chance the virus has a little way to go still in Catalonia and the south of Italy, we shall see.

Nobody in the UK has anything to fear from this virus and it’s one of the safest places to be right now. There is no reason for the UK to restrict migration from any country on Earth because of Covid-19 or quarantine anybody. It might be worth Iceland or New Zealand doing that, but not the UK.

Covid-19 can be a nasty disease even in younger people, although it is very rarely fatal. All the same I can certainly understand if people want to avoid catching it. In which case the best advice if you are in the UK is just to stay put for a while because your chances of catching it here (if you haven’t already had it) are minimal.

64140 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to hotrod, 2, #650 of 1129 🔗

Just ignore it cos its a normal illness, you hysterical fucking boob.

64202 ▶▶▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to hotrod, #651 of 1129 🔗

It is a small increase in cases in some part of Spain, most of them could be asymptomatic.
It is unlikely people returning to the UK will be infected.
And also the government could have offered free tests at airport if they are so concerned.

63928 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Sarigan, 5, #652 of 1129 🔗

Terrible. It seems as though we’re just yet more acceptable collateral damage to this government, and we’re far from the only ones. Most haven’t even realised it yet.

64013 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 3, #653 of 1129 🔗

It feels like each day there is a fresh drama as though events are scripted in sequence like pages of a book.

64075 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 2, #654 of 1129 🔗

Yes, the Mammoth Book of Lies.

63867 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Sarigan, 15, #655 of 1129 🔗

i think someone in government has loads of cards each with a ridiculous action written on it .. and every so often they shuffle them and pull one out … and suddenly its the new rule

63919 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to mjr, 2, #656 of 1129 🔗

Or something like this:


63968 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #657 of 1129 🔗


64005 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #658 of 1129 🔗

great! A must watch

64032 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Sarigan, 5, #659 of 1129 🔗

Never thought I’d see the day when the next world war could be fought with withdrawal of tourism as a weapon 😂

64048 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Farinances, 1, #660 of 1129 🔗

Economically it’s a very powerful weapon.

64094 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Sarigan, 2, #661 of 1129 🔗

If it’s anything like the “quarantine” you were supposed to have earlier in the year, lots of companies just told their staff to come in.

64128 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Sarigan, 3, #662 of 1129 🔗

This is to prevent the realisation that things will be fine if they just go about their business. if they are quarantined and there’s no rise in cases you can say “look the quarantine worked”.

63848 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, #663 of 1129 🔗

Has this been posted before? It’s very good.

July 21. Amazing Polly: Your body is their weapon.

Very thought-provoking. (You can watch at double speed.)

64069 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #664 of 1129 🔗

It’s a follow on to her other video about how what governments are doing to us fits the definition of torture according to Amnesty International. Watch that one first! It starts off a bit slow, but OMG is it dead on. Sometimes I feel like I’m the one being hysterical in my reaction to all this since my life is good by all accounts, but when she systematically explains how this is psychological torture I realize I’m not overreacting.

64073 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 7, #665 of 1129 🔗

Lisa, have a look here. Another sceptic posted this on here a while ago. The brainwashing was systematic. Done BY THE BOOK..
Alexander Whorf (Posted on http://www.lockdownsceptics.org )

Uncanny parallels between what governments have done and Dr Singer’s research on religious cults. Those responsible should be held to account.

Tactics for Psychological Coercion (AKA “Brainwashing”) – Dr Margaret Singer (1921-2003)

Techniques to increase suggestibility and ‘soften up’ the individual via hypnotic or other suggestibility increasing techniques such as extended audio drills, excessive exact repetition of routine activities.

Establishment of control over the victim’s social environment, time, and sources of social support through creating social isolation; removing contact with family and friends, as well as persons who do not share group-approved attitudes.

Rejection of alternate information and separate opinions. Rules exist about permissible topics to discuss. Communication is highly controlled. An ‘in-group’ language is usually constructed.

Make the person re-evaluate the most central aspects of his or her experience of self and prior conduct in negative ways. Efforts are designed to destabilize and undermine reality awareness, world view, and defence mechanisms.

Create a sense of powerlessness by subjecting the victim to intense and frequently confusing, conflicting actions and situations which undermine the victim’s self-confidence and judgement.

Creating strong, aversive, emotional arousals in the subject by reactions such as intense humiliation, loss of privilege, social isolation, social status changes, intense guilt, anxiety, and manipulation.

Intimidate with group-sanctioned psychological threats. For example, it may be suggested that failure to adopt the approved behaviour will lead to severe punishment or the reappearance of a prior physical illness.

64085 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Two-Six, 3, #666 of 1129 🔗

Spot on! The constant “stay safe” type messaging that appears everywhere you turn, the isolation I’ve now imposed on myself because I can’t stand the dystopian vision I’m assaulted with every time I go out, the censoring of renowned doctors and scientists that don’t spout the party line, and me questioning why I can’t “just wear the damn mask.” It’s so frustrating that others don’t see this as any big deal, let alone a form of psychological torture! I look like the crazy one.

63865 Edna, replying to Edna, #667 of 1129 🔗

Has anyone else seen this? Is it true, do you know?

63872 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Edna, 3, #668 of 1129 🔗

Not surprised at all. Fits the government M.O exactly.

63874 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Edna, 1, #669 of 1129 🔗

It’s true. There’s no end to the madness and paranoia.

63887 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Edna, 4, #671 of 1129 🔗

I can see Coronavirus being used as an excuse to bully/threaten countries into towing the pandemic response line.

64086 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Nobody2020, 2, #672 of 1129 🔗

They’ve been trying it on with Sweden. Expecting them to follow us out from the EU, the bullying has been so bad.

63906 ▶▶ Edna, replying to Edna, 1, #673 of 1129 🔗

Thanks everyone. Hope anyone out there gets back safely.

63944 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Edna, 9, #674 of 1129 🔗

Clearly the outdoor muzzling in Spain hasn’t worked . Next step must be muzzling in houses together with gloves. No going out.People can survive for 30 days without food so no going out for any reason whatsoever. If that still doesn’t get the transmission down then death will be by starvation rather than Covid which is much better result.

64088 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to arfurmo, 3, #675 of 1129 🔗

That sounds so ludicrous I expect that’s exactly what they’ll do.

64193 ▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to arfurmo, 1, #676 of 1129 🔗

The Spanish government are crazy. I felt so sorry for children who were not allowed out for 3 month. Now they all have to wear masks when outside in the heat.
It is inhumane.

64027 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Edna, #677 of 1129 🔗

Wasn’t there a bit of a scuff up with some of the Spanish politicians and cover up expose a few weeks back?

63876 Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, 2, #678 of 1129 🔗
64041 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 3, #679 of 1129 🔗

LOCKSTEP is a key word at the moment.
Not as crazy as he sounds – and looks.

64050 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cheezilla, #680 of 1129 🔗

in lockstep, that’s the word

64431 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Two-Six, #681 of 1129 🔗

Justa sin that Rockefeller document from 2010 we both read.

63878 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 14, #682 of 1129 🔗

Interesting new angle:

Some local coronavirus outbreaks could be ‘mass hysteria’ , Joint Biosecurity Centre warns. Organisation co-ordinating UK’s virus response said it would be alert to possibility of ‘local episodes of mass psychogenic illness’


The Joint Biosecurity Centre (JBC), which has taken the lead on co-ordinating the response in place of the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage) , said …. local episodes of mass psychogenic illness” …. could cause “substantial anxiety, anger and loss of trust in the community” if “poorly handled”.

Mass psychogenic illness – which used to be referred to as mass hysteria – is when people in a community start feeling sick at the same time, even though there is no physical or environmental reason for them to be ill.

The warning was revealed in a note published by Sage at the end of June and written by officials from the JBC in May as the centre geared up to launch under the leadership of Dr Clare Gardiner, seconded from her role as the head of cyber resilience and strategy at the National Cyber Security Centre, part of GCHQ.

The note said: “In previous public health incidents, episodes of mass psychogenic illness or increased symptom reporting or requests for testing have occurred as a result of heightened population anxiety or media reporting.
“These will complicate the epidemiological picture but, if poorly handled, mass psychogenic illness can also provoke substantial anxiety, anger and loss of trust in a community.
“JBC should be alert to the possibility of local episodes of mass psychogenic illness and should quickly discuss suspicions with public health teams to help them resolve the situation quickly.”

63884 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Cheezilla, 22, #683 of 1129 🔗

I believe much of the world is already showing signs of mass psychosis.

63889 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Nobody2020, 10, #684 of 1129 🔗

Yes definately state induced MASS PSYCHOSIS on a MASSIVE scale. I would think that the mental issues people are having around COVID fear would actually fit the classical profile of Psychosis.

63924 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Cheezilla, 9, #685 of 1129 🔗

Nice of the scientists to point out what common sense already knew. The whole worldwide episode is one of mass hysteria.

Now … any word on stopping the mass psychogenic illness and reducing said anxieties?

63933 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tom Blackburn, #686 of 1129 🔗

Truth from the covid co-ordinators?
I suspect we should be worried about what’s planned for us next.

If you want to know about the JBC, have a look on UK Column.

63938 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tom Blackburn, 3, #687 of 1129 🔗

Tom, I do keep wondering that myself. Despite visiting LS (and other sites) on a daily basis and seeing the evidence keep mounting up against this charade, why the f*ck are we no closer to seeing an end to it?

63965 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #689 of 1129 🔗


63891 Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, 12, #690 of 1129 🔗

I got this letter from the assistant of the COE of Pets At Home:

Thank you for sending an e-mail to our CEO regarding the issues you’ve faced. He does have full access to this inbox, however as he’s so exceptionally busy he has requested for me to get in touch with you to ensure you’re not left waiting for a response.

I’m sorry to hear that you aren’t happy with having to wear a face mask in our stores & that due to this you will no longer be shopping with Pets at Home.

As of yesterday (24th July 2020) the government have made the decision to make masks mandatory when customers attend retail stores. Throughout this pandemic Pets at Home have followed our governments advice and guidance and for the safety of our colleagues and customers, we will be continuing to do so by requesting that our customers wear face coverings when visiting.

Shops, supermarkets and other premises where face coverings are required are encouraged to take reasonable steps to promote compliance with the law. We have created learning modules for our colleagues to help them with any challenging situations. We have briefed all our store teams that although this is our governments advice we of course do have strict social distancing measures in place already to protect everyone on our premises, therefore should a customer object to wearing a face covering we wouldn’t refuse entry, despite the government stating that retailers can refuse entry to any customer without a valid exemption.

All our store teams have of course been fully briefed in regards to any exemptions.

Once again I am truly sorry to hear that you will be no longer shopping with ourselves, I do hope that I have reassured you of our position. Take care & stay safe.

Kind regards,

Mike Gardiner
Customer Service Team Leader for Pets at Home


I think I am going to write back and say to him I don’t have any pets now cos I just killed my freekin dog.

63913 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Two-Six, 15, #691 of 1129 🔗

LOL !! “Take care and stay safe”. Oh fuck off you load of idiots!

64104 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to BecJT, #693 of 1129 🔗

This is very good. I have downloaded and encourage others to do too.

63947 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Two-Six, 5, #694 of 1129 🔗

Pets at Home was off my shopping list a few days after they reopened, the manager chasing me round the store did for my patronage.

When I bumped into her and her kids later in Sainsbury’s, she was remarkably silent & did not wish to make eye contact.

Since then we ordered dried food for the dogs online.

Sensible stores are saying something like, we cannot/will not enforce mask wearing, thus allowing customers to be adult and make a decision, will the police be waiting for me when I leave the store. Probably not so I will go unmasked, if they are waiting, I will talk to them and go on my way, most likely without a ticket.

Pets at Home seem to prefer to loose business, their choice.

64023 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #695 of 1129 🔗

Try Zooplus or Bitiba if you’re ordering dogfood online.

63971 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Two-Six, 10, #696 of 1129 🔗

Ask Mike, why you can travel to any Pets at Home store in Wales right now and enter without wearing a mask. Ask him why his Company is obviously not concerned for the health of his staff in Wales, and why it is not mandating mask-wearing in all the Pets at Home stores in Wales. Or is the policy nothing to do with health, and all about kowtowing to Govt policy?

Absolute nonsense. It’s either safe to shop maskless everywhere in the UK (my position!), or nowhere.

63979 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #697 of 1129 🔗

How about you ask him yourself. peterdirect@petsathome.co.uk

64232 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Two-Six, #698 of 1129 🔗

Cheers. I will!

64019 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #699 of 1129 🔗

If they have social distancing, masks are unnecessary for the staff anyway.

64057 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Two-Six, 6, #700 of 1129 🔗

Jesus wept. Another patronising email, seriously where do this lot get their templates from?

This is a textbook case in how to lose customers and alienate them for life.

64182 ▶▶ matt, replying to Two-Six, #701 of 1129 🔗

You’d think that the customer services team leader would have a working apostrophe key on his laptop.

63898 assoc, replying to assoc, 16, #702 of 1129 🔗

I don’t wish to denigrate all who go to Spain for their hols (I’ve been myself, several times) but a significant minority of them really are the lower orders and the idea that these people will obey self-isolation rules on their return is absurd.
There is no point passing laws if many people won’t obey them.
Incidentally I’ve been in half a dozen (smaller) shops yesterday and today, without a mask, and no-one has said a word. Many of my fellow shoppers are bare faced too!

63925 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to assoc, 5, #703 of 1129 🔗

We are telling the bare faced truth!

63936 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to assoc, 7, #704 of 1129 🔗

You don’t have to be “lower orders” to disobey pointless rules. Suggest using cash not cards though!

64090 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #705 of 1129 🔗

Exactly what I said to OH-draw out a wad of cash at the airport on our return. Leave little or no paper trail.

Just in the middle of a lovely meal when the news came through. My thoughts about this useless government are unprintable at the moment. We are the lucky ones, being retired, but some will not be so lucky. Will the government, who only three weeks ago, said it was safe to travel to Spain, be paying the wages of those who can’t work when they get home? I don’t think so.

The last lot of quarantine restrictions lasted a month before they were lifted. How long will the restrictions be in place this time? Any bets? It will kill the travel industry in Spain.

The main area where people seem to be testing positive is in Catalonia, about three hundred miles from here. They have closed the bars and nightclubs there as those testing positive are younger people. The latest graphs look like there has been a spike in positive tests but the numbers of serious cases and deaths has been flatlining for weeks. https://catalannews.com

Oh and Assoc, there is an awful lot of Spain outside of the Costas-Segovia,
Granada, Seville, Madrid, Barcelona-all with wonderful museums and architecture not to mention gastronomy. We don’t all sit on a beach on our holidays!

64106 ▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Margaret, 1, #706 of 1129 🔗

Sorry, the link above comes under the “most popular” section-Coronavirus in Catalonia.

64122 ▶▶▶ etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh, replying to Cheezilla, #707 of 1129 🔗

Always use cash, don’t let them eradicate it else we’ll be getting negative interest rates, social credit systems and re-education camps soon after. Cash is one of the few things which allows civilisation to function day to day in ways which government cannot interfere with on an event by event basis, if we lose it then government making un-persons of all dissenters will be terrifying easy.

64022 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to assoc, 9, #708 of 1129 🔗

So why aren’t you ‘obeying’ the mask law? Have you, like those that you imply won’t obey quarantine laws, just realised what a pile of crud this ‘pandemic’ is?

64171 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to assoc, 2, #709 of 1129 🔗

God almighty. What a patronising post and frankly hypocritical. I suppose the “lower orders” won’t obey quarantine because they are thick while you don’t obey the mask rules because of your high minded libertarian principles? You are a hairsbreadth away from calling them gammons,

Firstly, the working class has (whether I like it or not) stuck loyally with Bojo and exhibited an almost religious compliance with his rules. Secondly, if they do feel obliged to break the quarantine it will most likely be from fear of losing their jobs.

63907 Tangelo, replying to Tangelo, 40, #710 of 1129 🔗

Report from east London: I’ve just returned from my local Tesco’s with beer and prosecco. I went in without a mask; no one said anything. About half the staff and security were maskless and probably about 15 -20% of the customers too. They were mostly young and male, but there were a couple of 20 something females too. No noticeable increase in street masking I’m glad to see.

63926 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Tangelo, 6, #711 of 1129 🔗

I take that as good news!

63952 ▶▶▶ Tangelo, replying to Steeve, 4, #712 of 1129 🔗

Yes indeed Steeve, hopefully more will join us.

64056 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tangelo, 2, #713 of 1129 🔗

Glad to hear it!

64116 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Tangelo, 5, #714 of 1129 🔗

Sounds hopeful Colin,I wish it was so in my part of the East Midlands,seems to be about 99% compliance around here,I’ve never been so ashamed of the English public,a lot of people talk the talk but don’t walk the walk.

63932 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 16, #715 of 1129 🔗

I wonder how many people returning from holiday in Spain are going to lose their jobs due to being forced into 14 days of quarantine?

63950 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Dave #KBF, 17, #716 of 1129 🔗

People tweeting to Sky – lots saying they can’t quarantine as they will lose their jobs

63964 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 28, #717 of 1129 🔗

Hopefully this is the beginning of mass civil disobedience

64012 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Farinances, 3, #718 of 1129 🔗

Boris is going for broke – many/most will be people who live in the Red Wall seats.

64031 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Farinances, 7, #719 of 1129 🔗

I’d love that to be the case, but given the way people have complied so far, it seems unfortunately more likely to be the beginning of the end for mass international travel.

64042 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 13, #720 of 1129 🔗

I was talking to two of my brainwashed old mates the other night and i said that most of the world’s airline carriers have gone bust, and the reply I got was so what’s wrong with not being able to fly anywhere you want in the world?

I couldn’t believe my freekin ears.

64080 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Two-Six, 3, #721 of 1129 🔗

Indeed, the madness goes far and wide. I’ve no idea how to get through to people who don’t want to listen!

64144 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 1, #722 of 1129 🔗

My DH used to say “You can’t educate pork.”

64273 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Two-Six, 1, #723 of 1129 🔗

they obviously haven’t ventured very far to experience the wonderful diversity of different countries, creeds and cultures. But their choice!

64053 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 2, #724 of 1129 🔗

Airbus are working to a worst case scenario of four years before a return to normality for the airline industry.

64079 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #725 of 1129 🔗

IAG are doing the same. I worked for the ‘world’s favourite’ for quite a long time before moving on so still have many friends there.

The odd thing is that even though their company currently has a huge redundancy program in progress, many of them seem fully on board with the COVID hysteria, refusing even to question the damaging quarantine rules. The fully buy into the premise that it’s ‘the virus’ and not the response to it that is causing the damage.

64083 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 4, #726 of 1129 🔗

I think it’s one problem with large corporations/conglomerates is that they’re pretty much NGOs. So perhaps not surprising that they’ve bought into the narrative.

64131 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #727 of 1129 🔗

Yes that’s true. And with staff ‘engagement’ programs, the narrative tends to easily spread to employees, probably explaining the attitudes of many I know.

BA, Ryanair, Easyjet and others did make some noise about quarantines at a high level before, so it’ll be interesting to see how they respond to this Spain business.

64414 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 1, #728 of 1129 🔗

I dodged a bullet there. In February, I was interviewed for a job in Aer Lingus (also IAG) and didn’t get it.

64430 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Ewan Duffy, #729 of 1129 🔗

You certainly did! Especially if your skills aren’t specific to aviation. I moved on to another airline at around the same time, who haven’t announced any UK redundancies yet, so I’ve sort of dodged one for now. It’s starting to feel like it’s only a matter of time before it hits though…

64018 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #730 of 1129 🔗

They’ll ignore the rules and may become the excuse for some local lockdowns.

63948 Nessimmersion, replying to Nessimmersion, 18, #731 of 1129 🔗

Correlation is not causation, but sometimes it’s a big cluebat.
The countries that are most enthusiastic about forcing their people to wear masks are the ones seeing a slight increases in cases- Spain
The countries such as Sweden that do not force their citizens to wear them are not seeing that increase in cases.

63961 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #732 of 1129 🔗

You don’t need masks when you have local walk in test centres 😣

63951 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 68, #733 of 1129 🔗

“”What people really want to focus on now is what are we doing to prepare for the next phase.”” Boris Johnson


We’ve not heard anything about your plans for how we get back to the old normal and rebuilding the economy after you lot are trashing it. There’s nothing about deploying the NHS to do what they’re supposed to do – i.e. look after the sick and when I mean sick, I mean those with cancer, heart disease, waiting for surgeries, giving teeth their TLC. Not to mention what about helping those you have thrown under the bus for this – children, old people, those with disabilities and mental health issues?

Add in those who are losing their jobs and having to declare bankruptcy after their businesses have gone under because you lot have closed them down.

My own workplace isn’t immune – takings for voluntary redundancies is low so it looks like compulsory redundancies will be next which means that I can lose my job and will be another statistic swelling the ranks of the unemployed.

I sincerely hope that you, the rest of the cabinet and Sage aren’t sleeping properly and are having nightmares from those who have died because they missed those treatments that could have saved their lives and those who have committed suicide because they have lost all hope of getting out of this nightmare.

You have blood on your hands and one way or the other you will be called into account for what you have done.

63958 ▶▶ Tangelo, replying to Bart Simpson, 10, #734 of 1129 🔗

Sorry to hear that Bart, I hope you will be ok in the long-term. I would like to thank you for your eloquent posts that have given hope to me and many others.

63962 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tangelo, 5, #735 of 1129 🔗

Thanks Colin. Keeping my fingers crossed but its anyone’s guess now.

63960 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bart Simpson, 9, #736 of 1129 🔗

Agree completely Bart. He doesn’t have a plan, and he doesn’t care – he’ll be alright, as will the rest of them.

63966 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 14, #737 of 1129 🔗

That’s because they’re not really affected by all this and so yeah, they don’t care. When we’re all poor and reduced to living like pesants during the Middle Ages, this lot will still be swanning around like those aristocrats in pre-1789 France.

64016 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, 10, #738 of 1129 🔗

Ah but look what happened to them.

64066 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #739 of 1129 🔗

Exactly. They will get their comeuppance at some point.

63984 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Bart Simpson, 12, #740 of 1129 🔗

Very sad news Bart. But the damage is too big to be covered up. They’ve gotten lucky so far but the mass redundancies, NHS backlog deaths etc. will catch up with them eventually.

63994 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to DRW, 2, #741 of 1129 🔗

Yep. We nee an agree but thumbs down button.

64070 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to DRW, 3, #742 of 1129 🔗

That’s why we need more people to speak out. Only when the voices become louder that they can no longer be suppressed.

64015 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, 6, #743 of 1129 🔗

I suspect the “next phase” will make this one look like a picnic.

64061 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Cheezilla, 8, #744 of 1129 🔗

Indeed. Something could happen that will make the 2011 riots look like a picnic.

64045 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bart Simpson, 10, #745 of 1129 🔗

Fingers crossed for you Bart. We’ve got 1400 redundancies coming up. Hope the older guys will take their pensions!

As for the government and SAGE – well, the truth will out. It’s very difficult to bury it these days.

64064 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #746 of 1129 🔗

Thanks. I know of some in my team who are taking up voluntary redundancies, it will be sad to see them go but they’re thinking that they’re doing the honourable thing.

And hopefully more people will see what the government and Sage are really up and realise that they’ve been had.

64062 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #747 of 1129 🔗

Best of luck, Bart. Somehow it seems doubly unfair that the consequences of this nonsense should afflict those who saw through it from the start along with the enthusiastic dupes…

64065 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Mark, 1, #748 of 1129 🔗

Exactly. We will be all affected one way or the other and being vindicated will be of small comfort to the economic Armageddon that we will be facing.

63970 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, #749 of 1129 🔗

What’s the verdict then? – shops busier, quieter or the same as last week?

63974 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tom Blackburn, 9, #750 of 1129 🔗

My opinion is its even more dead than it was last week

63995 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #751 of 1129 🔗

I’d say the same. It’s hard to tell really. Hope you are both right.

64076 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #752 of 1129 🔗

I’m basing my verdict on my observations in Central London not my local area because the high street in my area is non-existent.

63976 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #753 of 1129 🔗

Quieter than last week.

64081 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Dave #KBF, #754 of 1129 🔗

Yep, quieter in Sussex too. All day rain might not have helped.

64091 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to JohnB, #755 of 1129 🔗

The boozers are definitely busier

64120 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Tom Blackburn, #756 of 1129 🔗

For me, shops have been around the same, but the streets outside have been much busier (and mask-wearers are still in the minority on the open-air streets). Could just be the weekend effect though.

63972 DRW, 4, #757 of 1129 🔗

Tucker Carlson: Coronavirus response is being driven by politics: https://youtu.be/uQS-Er4amRA

63975 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #758 of 1129 🔗

Totally off topic but Peter Green died in his sleep last night. Sad.


64000 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #759 of 1129 🔗

God. Of. Guitar. Fuck me, did he have the touch.

64055 ▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #760 of 1129 🔗

BB Kings favourite guitarist says something. RIP

64121 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #761 of 1129 🔗

Looks like he went his own way.

63978 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #762 of 1129 🔗

Daily Mail: Union barons put the brakes on PM’s bid to get government staff back at desks by end of next week.

63981 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 13, #763 of 1129 🔗

Could we have a scenario where the government are forced to come out and prove this virus isn’t as harmful as initially made out?

63988 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #764 of 1129 🔗

How can they do that when they are now insisting on 14 day quarantine? They can’t have it both ways.

63991 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to hotrod, 6, #765 of 1129 🔗

They are having it both ways now.

63992 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to hotrod, 7, #766 of 1129 🔗

That’s Tom’s point. The government has painted itself into a corner and has no good moves left.

64004 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #767 of 1129 🔗

Well they could fill the House of Commons, all the MPs sitting next to each other quite normally.
Oh wait …..

63983 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Tom Blackburn, 8, #768 of 1129 🔗

serves him right for fanning the unjustified panic and fear

63999 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to IMoz, 1, #769 of 1129 🔗

Doesn’t help those thousands of people waiting for passports and probates though.

64009 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #770 of 1129 🔗

might not, but, for most part, they bought into it too

64054 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Cheezilla, #771 of 1129 🔗

So now the union leaders are part of the “far right” plot that Rick H fantasizes about as the supposed driving force behind this coronapanic?

Are they plotting to sell off the NHS as well?

64112 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, 1, #772 of 1129 🔗

I’d say that’s obvious.

63996 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tom Blackburn, 43, #773 of 1129 🔗

During a visit to a GP surgery in east London yesterday Mr Johnson said: ‘I want to see a massive effort now by the country to psychologically to stop thinking of coronavirus as something that makes it impossible to do things and start really looking at tackling the problems of the British people.’

Well the mask mandate should really help with that. Idiot!!

64011 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Cheezilla, 10, #774 of 1129 🔗

You ARE the problem of the British people. (Him, not you, Cheez)

64098 ▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #775 of 1129 🔗

And I want to see you strung up by your short and curlies.

But we can’t always get what we want.

64113 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Farinances, 1, #776 of 1129 🔗

I presume you mean HIS pubes, not mine?

64236 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #777 of 1129 🔗

Of course. You and yours are safe 🙂

64162 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Farinances, #778 of 1129 🔗

We can dream of it, though.

64272 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #779 of 1129 🔗

boris really is a prize twat! couldn’t run a primary school never mind a country and government”

63989 Humanity First, replying to Humanity First, #780 of 1129 🔗

THIS IS JUST THE BEGINNING | “2025 is when the whole procedure finishes”

64155 ▶▶ Jonathan Castro, replying to Humanity First, 2, #781 of 1129 🔗

After the Tories lose the next election then.

64020 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #782 of 1129 🔗

Independent journalist Anna Brees, has put out a mobile number for people to send videos letter her know their feelings on the lockdown and the effect it has had on them.

The first one has just been published.

Annas YT channel:


The video explaining about the mobile number:


I will not post a link to the first video as the second one has just appeared.

Good to see what others feel in video rather than write word, far more powerful.

64108 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #783 of 1129 🔗

Woman from Burnley is definitely scared of the right things to fear.

64130 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Cheezilla, #784 of 1129 🔗

The second video has been removed, BA worker from Heathrow. He made a comment during the video that he had reason to think this madness would be over soon.

But he did not say why.

64142 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #785 of 1129 🔗

Hmmm. Censorship?

64021 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 36, #786 of 1129 🔗

What the fuck is a Prime Minister – of any stripe – doing looking like this?
comment image

64026 ▶▶ Farinances, replying to Sam Vimes, 25, #787 of 1129 🔗

Why the fuck has NOONE in the MSM gone “Eh? He’s already had it?!”

64036 ▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Farinances, 14, #788 of 1129 🔗

A conspiracy theorist might say “no he hasn’t, it’s been a ploy” :-))

64044 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to IMoz, 9, #789 of 1129 🔗

Hello, conspiracy theorist here. Did somebody call?

64040 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Farinances, 12, #790 of 1129 🔗

No, no, you can get it again, second wave, asymptomatic, R number, mask not mask all going to die, but not if you work in a cafe,bikkit, bikkit, BIKKIT!

64067 ▶▶▶ DJ Dod, replying to Farinances, 25, #791 of 1129 🔗

None of the measures currently being imposed make any sense from a public health perspective. Masks and quarantines are just a distraction from the epic disaster that this Government has inflicted on the country – they know they have destroyed the economy and caused the deaths of thousands of people in care homes, and thousands more who have been denied treatment by the NHS.

The question is who will be held responsible? I hope that I am wrong, but I suspect that any future public inquiry will spread the blame so thinly that ultimately no-one will be held to account. By keeping us in a ‘state of emergency’ until next year the Government hopes that we will be so relieved to regain a semblance of normality that we will forget to ask why normal life and civil liberties were suspended for a ‘flu virus.

History is being rewritten before our eyes, and it will be up to us to tell our children, and our children’s children, what really happened.

64099 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Farinances, 1, #792 of 1129 🔗

Ah but he’s protecting other people. Remember how it works?

64103 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #793 of 1129 🔗

God bless our PM, caring to the last. How lucky we are [sigh].

64111 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Farinances, 1, #794 of 1129 🔗

Because the Gov and MSM are telling us that even if you’ve had it you can catch it over and over again, there is no assumed immunity.

64115 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 8, #795 of 1129 🔗

I’ve also seen now that they are saying that even if you have had and are immune, it will mutate in the winter like flu so you will catch it again. But this then surely goes against the vaccine as this won’t be relevant in a years time when it’s rolled out!

64191 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to JohnB, 1, #796 of 1129 🔗

Well spotted.

64256 ▶▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to JohnB, 1, #797 of 1129 🔗

But then there’ll be another different strain vaccine. Like the flu vaccine.

That is definitely what they’re aiming for. Each year – new jab.

64238 ▶▶▶ helenf, replying to Farinances, 4, #798 of 1129 🔗

No one can be considered immune, as everyone will be expected to have the vaccine. Every year. For ever.

64258 ▶▶▶▶ Farinances, replying to helenf, #799 of 1129 🔗

Yes exactly.

64034 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #800 of 1129 🔗


64038 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #801 of 1129 🔗

Calls himself a leader.

64166 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #802 of 1129 🔗

He couldn’t lead a conga

64170 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #803 of 1129 🔗

You seen him walking lately Tom.. somethings up – he looks like he is leading a conga genuinely… weird problems going on.

64046 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Sam Vimes, 6, #804 of 1129 🔗

Would be improved by the addition of the full straitjacket in his case, imo.

64049 ▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Sam Vimes, 13, #805 of 1129 🔗

Wanker of the highest order

64068 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #806 of 1129 🔗

And wearing what looks like a Patek Philippe!

64072 ▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #807 of 1129 🔗

Who would have thought that

64101 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #808 of 1129 🔗

Anything for a stupid photo op.

64117 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #809 of 1129 🔗

Boris the Butcher?

64124 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #810 of 1129 🔗

Jeez….he looks like he’s struggling to breathe with that muzzle.

64149 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Bart Simpson, 3, #811 of 1129 🔗

Hmmm, wouldn’t you think someone who’d had a ‘could go either way’ experience with a respiratory complaint would be quite scared of face masks?

64203 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #812 of 1129 🔗

He looks comfortable in it. Probably part of his BDSM routine.

64136 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #813 of 1129 🔗

I wonder what is going through his mind. “Why did I ever stand for this ghdsi0oghod position, should have let Gove have it.”

64161 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #814 of 1129 🔗

Mind? What mind?

64176 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #815 of 1129 🔗

Well, it’s a new mask – but the same tie and suit I think.

64206 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #816 of 1129 🔗

Thinking about it a bit more – I hope never to see him looking any different!

64228 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #817 of 1129 🔗

Actually – it’s the first sensible reason for a mask that I’ve seen :

  1. Can’t hear the stupid twat’s gormless waflle
  2. I can’t see some of his stupid Bullingdon pig-face
64260 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #818 of 1129 🔗

He’s gorn mad!

64029 Paul Mendelsohn, #819 of 1129 🔗

Just came up with a great tactic to deal with people wearing masks outdoors. Go up to them with a big smile and say. “Hey John/Jane how are you?” Then apologise and say you thought they were someone else under the mask. Works a treat.

64037 Aremen, replying to Aremen, 20, #820 of 1129 🔗

I find humour helps in the darkest situation. Suggestion: how about we obey the law and wear our masks in supermarkets, but stage “collapses” with respiratory distress. Should clog up the flow of customers, give headaches to the managers, who can pass it up the line, and make a point to the watching mask enthusiasts. Then report back here. It might not need to be “staged”, just genuine distress made very visible. If enough of us do it our message would be heard, and reported. You could even do it as obvious slapstick, but the staff would have to react in the same way.

64198 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Aremen, 5, #821 of 1129 🔗

I suggested weeks ago that if you wear glasses (and if you don’t get a pair) and then knock items (preferably glassed) off the shelves and when they come a-running plead that you can’t see because glasses have steamed up. Equally, if you’re going to collapse, collapse while pulling a shelf down, preferably not on top of you.

64052 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 14, #822 of 1129 🔗

YOU JUST DON’T GET IT DO YOU? We’re all definitely going to die in the next couple of days. I’ve been saying this since March 23rd….

64129 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #823 of 1129 🔗

Let’s see. What’s left on my bucket list?

  1. Shag
  2. Beer

Think I’ve got time.

64147 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #824 of 1129 🔗

If I may…

  1. Shag
  2. Beer
  3. Goto 1
64183 ▶▶▶▶ Howie59, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #825 of 1129 🔗

Or the prof Ferguson computer model version…

while (shagging) {

64195 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Howie59, 6, #826 of 1129 🔗

I can’t drink 500,000 beers…

64180 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Sam Vimes, #827 of 1129 🔗

At least that would put us out of our misery.

64274 ▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #828 of 1129 🔗

Haha brilliant I’m gonna nick this

64063 Judith Day, replying to Judith Day, 28, #829 of 1129 🔗

Visiting my local town here in N.Wales, several shop assistants told me that they have had many coming in from ‘over the border’ because we do not have to wear masks in shops. Some spoke of the almost hostile reception they got in big supermarkets in England that are ‘enforcing’ mask wearing, and how pleasant they found the atmosphere in shops here.

64154 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Judith Day, 9, #830 of 1129 🔗

Found exactly the same here in Wrexham, yesterday. Massive influx in the local Aldis. And the same in Llangollen today. I chatted to three tourists who didn’t know the rules were different here and were overjoyed when I told them they didn’t have to wear masks (see my post earlier if you can find it). All refugees from across the border warmly welcome.

My wife and I are worried that Drakeford and his lackeys might lose what little spine they have and enforce mask wearing here (to avoid a mythical spike from tourists) or even close the border! You never know what goes on in their deranged minds.

We need real leaders in Wales, and elsewhere in Britain. Time for Arthur to rise from his slumber, methinks!

64363 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #831 of 1129 🔗

He is way, way overdue.

64107 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 41, #832 of 1129 🔗


For every other insanity they’ve visited upon us – lockup, quarantine, antisocial distancing, face nappies – they’ve been good enough to give us some warning (how bloody thoughtful of them!) Now, without any warning whatsoever, they’ve placed thousands of people currently in Spain into a dreadful predicament. And for those about to travel to Spain in the near future, and maybe anywhere else, the situation is not much better; ruined holidays, lost deposits and worse. If the scum in Whitehall really think there’s a problem with Spain – which there isn’t – the least they could have done would be to exempt people already there from quarantine on return. But no! This ultra-lunacy must come in IMMEDIATELY, for the whole of Spain. I just hope this is the final straw and people quickly start to see what’s going on here, and decide things have gone too far. Unfortunately, I’m not optimistic that they will.

64119 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tenchy, 14, #833 of 1129 🔗

I agree with you, but I doubt this final straw will be any more effective at waking up the gullible, collaborating, fear-filled masses than all the previous final straws were…..

64132 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 14, #834 of 1129 🔗

I think there might be 100k people coming home or not now getting their holiday. Not many of them will be keen to quarantine given the jobs they do (shop workers, transport/factory workers, if those commenting online are representative). People will be very angry and this will not be easily forgotten. It could tip the balance.

64188 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #835 of 1129 🔗

I hope you are right.

64123 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Tenchy, 5, #836 of 1129 🔗

But if you’d just like to pop over by dinghy…

64139 ▶▶ FiFiTrixabelle, replying to Tenchy, 19, #837 of 1129 🔗

Daughter in Barcelona currently, flying back on Thursday. This is ridiculous. Two weeks of quarantine?!! What are the practicalities of this? Arrives airport, has to travel by train and bus to get home, lives with us..does this mean we can’t go out for 14 days too or does she just live in her room with food parcels left at the door? Unless you are going to whisk them off in a decontaminated bus to a prison for 2 weeks, how do you fully ‘self isolate’?? S**t shouldn’t have written that, it will give someone ideas…

64160 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 5, #838 of 1129 🔗

Er … who’s going to be checking?

64169 ▶▶▶▶ FiFiTrixabelle, replying to annie, 1, #839 of 1129 🔗

Would love to know Annie! Are there to be any spot checks?
I suspect it may be more the twitchy neighbours who know she’s been in Spain that may be watching!!

64225 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 5, #840 of 1129 🔗

My friends were supposed to quarantine for a fortnight. Soon realised there were no checks. Ignored it after a few days in .

64246 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ alison, replying to Mr Dee, 6, #841 of 1129 🔗

My brother and his fiancée likewise were supposed to quarantine. They had to travel several hundred miles by tube and train across the country before arriving at quarantine destination, where there were 4 others living, none of whom joined the quarantine. No checks, and they also didn’t bother with observing it.

64194 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 9, #842 of 1129 🔗

Just fucking ignore it. They have no resources to police it.

64175 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Tenchy, 2, #843 of 1129 🔗

Why not offer free tests at airports like many countries do? That would have shown compassion and care.

64177 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to JulieR, 3, #844 of 1129 🔗

Your second sentence answered the question posed in the first.

64178 ▶▶▶ FiFiTrixabelle, replying to JulieR, #845 of 1129 🔗

Yes, I’m wondering that too Julie. Greece are managing to do this, why can’t we?

64189 ▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 4, #846 of 1129 🔗

Because our government is a feckless bunch of morons.

64292 ▶▶▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 3, #847 of 1129 🔗

The Greek system is working pretty well. I was tested on arrival earlier this week, asked nicely just to distance for 24 hours and then if I hadn’t heard anything from the authorities in that time, I could presume my test was negative and I was free to go out and mingle and live pretty much normally out here. Greece have had to change the rules at one of their land borders however and ask certain nationalities (Balkan, mainly) to arrive with proof of a negative test within the previous 72 hours, as so many people were testing positive there. However here on the islands it is different. Only one – just one – British person has tested positive on arrival out of thousands tested. Just show how low the infection rate actually is in Britain now.

64141 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 38, #848 of 1129 🔗

Just read the news that anyone returning from Spain will have to quarantine for 14 days. What a f***ing mess. A policy thrust upon the British public with absolutely no warning or notice whatsoever and all the disruption and misery that will entail. I’m sure it will create an enormous headache in lost deposits, cancelled holidays and plans, risks to losing one’s job if one doesn’t turn up for two weeks, etc.

Surely this is another chink in the enormous damn of stinking shit. Middle England can’t go without their annual holiday to Ibiza, Majorca, Minorca, Benidorm, Barcelona etc. – perhaps a crude sociological generalisation but you get the idea. All of these people will also have been mightily inconvenienced by whichever government bright spark had the idea of bringing in this ludicrous policy without notice. The point is that this will surely make quite a few people very angry. Spain also had one of the strictest lockdowns in the world and masks have been widespread for quite a while there now. Of course, us sceptics know that lockdowns and masks are totally useless and do far more damage than good, but to the ‘uninitiated’, surely the fact that Spain is now going through its ‘second wave’ is proof that lockdown and masks ‘don’t work’. I would have thought that a lockdown would actually create ‘second wave’ (or rather, suppress the first wave into discrete parts, therefore giving the impression of multiple waves) seeing as lockdowns don’t allow the disease to spread and allow the population to build herd immunity but we’re not thinking logically anymore, it’s the coronavirus pandemic of 2020!

It truly is a total shitshow. Imagine waiting 13 days to bring in a rule about face coverings, something that the population could have reasonably prepared for in a much shorter space of time, but bringing in a quarantine policy immediately which will upend so many people’s plans, finances, and lives. You’ve really got to ask yourself what the hell is going on now. It’s almost like they’re taking the piss. I’m still convinced that it’s not a big conspiracy, but rather it really is just a bunch of psychopaths who are absolutely terrified of being exposed as having totally destroyed the country over a flu-like virus. That’s why they’re still pushing all this BS and refusing to let us get on with our lives – I mean can you imagine the scale of the public anger if it all came crashing down and people realised they’d been had? I think there’s a dull awareness forming now but it’s too slow and I think for now that people would rather remain in ignorance because for them, the fact that their entire lives have been destroyed for no good reason is a fact which is just too much to bear. Better to bury one’s head in the sand.

64167 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Poppy, 2, #849 of 1129 🔗

I like to think it will come crashing down once the longer term chickens come home to roost.

64174 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Poppy, 5, #850 of 1129 🔗

They don’t even say that lots of people are ill. They just say that the number of infected people is up. They could be asymptomatic.

64237 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to JulieR, 2, #851 of 1129 🔗

Exactly. It’s all complete BS!

64218 ▶▶ Rick, replying to Poppy, 11, #852 of 1129 🔗

The more I talk to people the more I sense they are also beginning to realise they supported this and want to absolve themselves of any sense of complicity. So they wear the muzzle and follow the nonsense and will probably quarantine for 2 weeks and lose their business and some relatives will die of untreated cancer, yet on and on they march, unwilling to stand up and say they got this wrong just like the dimwits in charge.

64221 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Rick, 6, #853 of 1129 🔗

They’ll blame somebody not wearing a mask for cancer deaths because they prolonged the epidemic. Just like some old guy sat on a bench during lockdown was to blame for all the deaths to date.

64296 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Rick, 5, #854 of 1129 🔗

Like the old joke about the inexperienced officer who started his men marching towards a cliff edge and couldn’t remember the command to stop them. The sergeant called as he marched on, ‘For God’s sake, sir, say something, even if it’s only good-bye.’

64286 ▶▶ CarrieAH, replying to Poppy, 5, #855 of 1129 🔗

I think this is one situation where the government should have given notice of its’ intention to impose quarantine. At least a week, maybe more. Better still, if they really do still want to carry on with this charade, test arrivals at the airports exactly like they do here in Greece. It works. I don’t understand why the U.K. aren’t doing it. There are plenty of empty testing facilities around – just move staff to the airports. There aren’t yet that many people travelling (airport was virtually empty when I flew out of it earlier this week) so it’s not impossible to test arrivals. Or again, do as Greece do, which is check the PLF forms of people about to arrive in the country, issue a QR code the day before travel, and that code holds information as to whether or not you are tested on arrival. I was tested, it took all of 20 seconds behind a screen in the baggage reclaim hall, and was absolutely fine. Back of tongue/throat swab only. You are contacted within 24 hours if you test positive and you are asked to socially distance and not mix until then. There’s no drama, people know what to expect, and once the 24 hours have passed you are free to mingle and enjoy pretty much normal life out here in the Greek islands.

64143 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #856 of 1129 🔗

Agree with Toby that this is a great talk:

The Fact-Free Lockdown Hysteria ‘ – Great talk by Thomas E. Woods, Jr. for the Mises Institute

I liked the part about the jar of jelly beans, i.e. if you had a jar of 100 jelly beans and 3 of them were poisoned, would you reach in and take one? An attempt to explain the choice of getting infected by the virus or not.

I would adress the scenario slightly differently in that COVID19 is not represented by a jelly bean but rather a tiny amount of extra poison in one of the jelly beans. Thus becoming infected only raises the risk of you dying by a small amount relative to all the other ways you could die.

64212 ▶▶ GLT, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #857 of 1129 🔗

In fairness, he did mention that there are in reality many more jelly beans and he also said how about not jelly beans but everything one could hope or strive for…

But yes, great talk. Made me laugh out loud which I really needed!

64145 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 29, #858 of 1129 🔗

No masks in our very busy takeaway tonight so I didn’t even get my lanyard out of my bag. Also visited a hardware store in town and although I was the only person not wearing a mask I wasn’t challenged despite not wearing my lanyard.

Thing that’s upset me the most today is the number of children, some very young, in masks. They clearly didn’t want to be wearing them and were constantly fiddling with them or pulling them down. One child of about 8 pulled hers down before picking up and putting down several of Sainsbury’s freshly made pizzas. Hardly the height of good hygiene whether you are concerned about covid or not. Parents who make their kids wear these things are guilty of psychological abuse. I have no doubt their children will grow up with anxiety disorders, hypochondria or socially phobic. It’s disgusting.

64172 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 6, #859 of 1129 🔗

I agree, I saw lots of children over 5 years old wearing masks yesterday. It is awful.

64181 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to JulieR, 18, #860 of 1129 🔗

Child abuse for sure. What all these masked adults must look like to young ones too. Stuff of nightmares.

Sturgeon has it illegal for anyone over 5 years not to wear a mask in shops. 11yrs in England. It is absolutely unforgivable for anyone in any position that passed these laws. THIS is the stuff you resign ovrr if you have a soul.

64267 ▶▶▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to Basics, 5, #861 of 1129 🔗

I’d go to prison before putting my children in masks

64295 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to tonyspurs, #862 of 1129 🔗

Brave man.

64294 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 3, #863 of 1129 🔗

Sturgeon is presumably childless?

64348 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #864 of 1129 🔗

My sister has put muzzles on her daughters. They are aged 5 and 3.

I think its child abuse but have to hold my tongue for the sake of family harmony. That said if both girls grow up to develop any physical and psychological problems, I will stay out of it as its up to my sister and brother-in-law to sort out the mess that they have created.

64482 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #865 of 1129 🔗

There would have been no way anybody could have made me wear a mask when I was a kid. Never, I would have fought like a tiger and kept fighting.

64146 Hammer Onats, replying to Hammer Onats, 53, #866 of 1129 🔗

The country is fucked. Never, in human history, has so much damage been done to so many by so few.

64157 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Hammer Onats, 17, #867 of 1129 🔗

And if this empire should last a thousand years, men will still say “this was their finest fuckup”.

64192 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Hammer Onats, 2, #868 of 1129 🔗

“It’s only a temporary inconvenience”

64148 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 15, #869 of 1129 🔗

The British transport secretary Grant Shapps is reportedly on holiday in Spain , which, unless he returns to the UK in the next one and a half hours, might make him subject to the government’s newly imposed quarantine rules for all travellers returning from Spain.


However, it is unclear whether the new quarantine rules will apply to government ministers, as a government website states that people “undertaking essential policing or essential government work outside of the UK” will not necessarily have to self-isolate.


The [quarantine] decision was taken yesterday afternoon after ministers including Michael Gove, the Cabinet Office minister, Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary, and Grant Shapps, the Transport Secretary, met to discuss rising concerns about rates of infections in Spain.

So did Shapps “meet” while he was on holiday?
Evidently, there’s one rule for him and another for those who don’t get paid a relative fortune to sit around doing nothing.

64168 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #870 of 1129 🔗

If they cared about people they could have offered tests on arrival. Lots of countries do that.
But it proves again they don’t care about ordinary people.

64317 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to JulieR, 2, #871 of 1129 🔗

We had our temperatures taken by automatic cameras coming into Spain.

64210 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #872 of 1129 🔗

One rule for them, another for the plebs.

64150 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #873 of 1129 🔗

Listening to BBC Any Questions, Peter Hitchens guesting.

Worth a listen, someone has put the audio on TY here:


64158 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #874 of 1129 🔗

Thanks Dave

64151 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 16, #875 of 1129 🔗

Just noticed there a quite a few flights to destinations in Spain at 11:50pm tonight that will not have to self isolate for 14 days on return, yet those leaving 10 minutes later will be required to self isolate for 14 days on return.

If this was as serious as they make out they would be cancelling all flights to protect people. This is just a load of bullsh*t!

64165 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to JohnB, 10, #876 of 1129 🔗

If this was as serious as they make out they would be offering tests at airport arrivals. Then no quarantine would be required.
They claim they have capacity of hundred thousand tests per day.

64187 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to JulieR, 2, #877 of 1129 🔗

Yes. Government policy proves the falseness of government claims yet again.

64190 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to JohnB, 2, #878 of 1129 🔗

And if Spains numbers reduce over the next week they might lift the quarantine rule but presumably people already in quarantine would need to complete the 14 days.

64204 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nobody2020, 9, #879 of 1129 🔗

Nobody. What you have said. Coupled with practicalities of home bound travel pubkic transport and compensation for employees and employers make one hell of an unreasonable mess.

This is not, repeat not, what government is there for. The givernment is their to facillitate our lives.

You and I and the postmans dog knows that if a decision is taken like this prior planning kicks in and the announcement in made competently with clear instructions and infirmatiin about the most imoortant questions and concerns thrown up by such a decision.

They knew with was coming. Yet the deliberately leave the country in the dark. This is willfull bad givernance. Cold, deliberate, purposeful bad governance.

64153 Basics, replying to Basics, 12, #880 of 1129 🔗

Supermarket mask ‘pub-cricket’.

For those barefaced shoppers there’s sport to be had to bring a little competitive fun to the supermarket* zombie apocalypse.

Like old time pub cricket it is a game to be enjoyed on the move. Similar to a staring competition the name of the game is to ‘affect’ mask wearers by attitude or glance. Causing a mask to be touched scores 1 point, a ‘pull’ scores 4 and a removal scores 6.

Its a non contact sport where if played correctly the maskees are non the wiser. Much sneak and cunning tactic can be devised to get that involuntary arm in motion!

Best played in pairs but equally good to practice alone. Mirth and merriment for children of all ages!

*can be played wild on the street in larger numbers.

64222 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Basics, 3, #881 of 1129 🔗

Excellent game. I scored 18 today in one go.

64223 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Mr Dee, 2, #882 of 1129 🔗

An expert no less! Perhaps you can be club captain!

64230 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, #883 of 1129 🔗


64159 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 11, #884 of 1129 🔗

Grant Shapps is apparently in Spain on holiday. Imposed by his department – you couldn’t make it up!

64209 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #885 of 1129 🔗

Is he actually? What a joke. Isn’t he the same minister who said just a few months ago that he ‘wouldn’t go on a foreign holiday this year’ or words to that effect?

64241 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #886 of 1129 🔗

Anyone know why positive tests are up in Spain?

More testing?

Anyone got any links to decent stats on tests done?

64321 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Julian, 3, #887 of 1129 🔗

https://catalannews.com under “most popular” James. There are graphs which show how ridiculous is this whole quarantine thing.

64326 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Margaret, #888 of 1129 🔗

Thanks for that

Any idea where we could find figures for number of tests done?

Also the link suggests that the number of positives includes antibody tests – is that true? If so then the figure is surely meaningless and an overstatement as the two are not at all the same thing

64163 annie, replying to annie, #889 of 1129 🔗

There have been some problems with sceptic forums.
The KBF forum is running nicely, lots of discussion, no trolling as far as I can see.


64164 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to annie, 1, #890 of 1129 🔗

What problems?

64293 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Steeve, #891 of 1129 🔗

See Toby’s paragraph above under ‘Note to the good folks…’

64185 nfw, replying to nfw, 7, #892 of 1129 🔗

In an interview with Laura Kuenssberg for the BBC to mark his first anniversary of becoming Prime Minister, Boris Johnson admitted to having made mistakes in his initial response to the pandemic. Unfortunately, they were the wrong mistakes.

So you can have the “right” mistakes? He’s certainly deluded about his actions.

64240 ▶▶ Julian, replying to nfw, 6, #893 of 1129 🔗

I think Toby Young meant that the mistakes he admitted to were not really mistakes or were not very important, and that he didn’t recognise his most egregious mistakes

64251 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Julian, 8, #894 of 1129 🔗

Leaving the top button undone on your uniform when you haven’t cleaned your rifle in the hope the inspecting sergeant tears you off a strip for the button and misses the far more important rifle.

64186 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 1, #895 of 1129 🔗

More extreme wokery here (paywall):


Black and ethnic minority people are set to feature on British money for the first time, the Sunday Telegraph can reveal.

Chancellor Rishi Sunak is looking at proposals by a campaign group to put influential BAME figures from throughout history on a set of coins, a Treasury minister said.

There has never been a non-white person featured on British coins or notes, and the Banknotes of Colour campaign, led by former Conservative candidate Zehra Zaidi, has been fighting for representation.

Ms Zaidi, along with a group of historians and MPs, has written to the chancellor with some proposed historic figures, including the first Indian and Gurkha soldiers to receive the Victoria Cross, the Jamaican British nurse Mary Seacole, and the British Muslim woman, Noor Inayat Khan, one of only four women to receive the George Cross.

64217 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Tenchy, 1, #896 of 1129 🔗

Lenny Henry overlooked?

64219 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tenchy, 5, #897 of 1129 🔗

But remember, this is a government of the “far right”, we are supposed to believe, according to a few sceptics here.

The most woke reactionaries in history, presumably.

64235 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tenchy, 2, #898 of 1129 🔗

Who fives a f? Look on the bright side – it’d at least be a change from the usual suspects of the Order of the O.B.N

64243 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 2, #899 of 1129 🔗

“Who gives a f?”

Well here’s the thing. You might not give a f, but your actual serious right-wingers, your traditionalists, conservatives, reactionaries, those kinds – the kind you claim are running the government when you say it’s “far right”, they actually do give a f about that kind of thing. That’s kind of how you can tell that’s what they are, rather than just greedy, power hungry apolitical types, or greedy power hungry leftist types.

64245 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tenchy, 2, #900 of 1129 🔗

If it’s woke zealotry in all its evil insanity you are looking for, look no further:

Sheffield choir: Closure over diversity handled ‘appallingly’

64416 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Tenchy, #901 of 1129 🔗

why not .. we already had Beatrix Potter characters on coins.. Weve had Peter Rabbit .. Might as well have Brer Rabbit .
Anyway after the economy has been trashed coins will be useless.. We will be back to bartering

64200 Paul E, replying to Paul E, 38, #902 of 1129 🔗

This could be a turning point in human history, the government has rejected 200 and more years of rational thinking and science since the age of enlightenment and effectively embraced magic and superstition instead. No evidence at all in favour of wearing facemasks, their pet scientists complain about “too much reliance on evidence based studies” and instead insist masks have to be worn, though they have no more than a talisman to ward off the evil eye! Unfortunately the majority are being fooled by these fools. I was born an optimist but now I fear the cup is now no longer half full or empty, having been turned over

64207 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Paul E, 9, #903 of 1129 🔗

Just let me know when its time to go back to driving stakes through the hearts of the vampires.

64291 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 1, #904 of 1129 🔗

Just take up voodoo.
Come to think if it, masks are voodoo.

64396 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 3, #905 of 1129 🔗

Right now. If they’ve got MP, MSP or AM after their name, you’ve found a vampire.

64213 nfw, 11, #906 of 1129 🔗

This is the classic wrong think although the speaker is trying to make the correct point:

They made masks compulsory outside the home on May 1st, when they had 5,951 cases.
Now they’ve had 408,502 cases.

Once upon a time it was about cutting the death toll; now that has happened as we all develop immunity it’s about “cases”. Well, if you’re testing more and they show “positive”, whatever that really means, then you have more cases, it is inevitable as the Wuhan Virus Flu spreads because it cannot be contained no matter what the Henny Penny Karens think or say. The goal posts have not only been moved, we are now using different shaped footballs and goalposts. It’s about lying and keeping power and control.

64214 nfw, replying to nfw, #907 of 1129 🔗

Well theres’ the problem:

64224 ▶▶ nfw, replying to nfw, #908 of 1129 🔗

Whoops, finger probs. Tried to edit it from existence but the system says I can’t now after what, 5 minutes? Disquis is better that that and it’s pretty terrible.

64216 nfw, replying to nfw, 1, #909 of 1129 🔗

Well there’s the problem: In late January, Dr Anthony Fauci told CNN: “There’s no doubt after reading this paper that asymptomatic transmission is occurring.”

Stop reading the paper and transmission stops. I thought Fauci was the expert who told others what to do and didn’t need their work to be the wonderful expert he is?

64229 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to nfw, 4, #910 of 1129 🔗

I’ve read the same paper (actually a letter, not a study), and when he said that I couldn’t believe it: the “study” is based on words of… 1 patient, and the transcript of what she said isn’t entirely “asymptomatic”: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2001468

64268 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to IMoz, 3, #911 of 1129 🔗

No, from the Appendix she was pre symptomatic, with very mild symptoms when she was in contact with the others! she actually went into hospital and was still there when interviewed by phone!

64275 ▶▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Bruno, 4, #912 of 1129 🔗

C’mon, a patient who is adamant about “no symptoms whatsoever during the day.” Even you can’t answer so difinitevely whether you caughed or sneezed today let alone whether you had a tickle at the back of your throat, and travel lethargy easily masks illnes onset lethargy. And quite frankly, you have to be superhypocondriac to take acetaminophen and chlorpheniramine maleate blend when merely feeling “a little bit warm” (at the very least, a reasonable epidemiologist would explore how often and under what circumstances the patient takes the medicine to establish the baseline). The whole thing is just the poster child for “patients lie.” They heard what they wanted to hear and it didn’t occur to them to pause and actually think.

Incidentally, even if, as you say. she had “very mild symptoms,” she axiomatically can’t be asymptomatic. Q.E.D.

64226 Derek Toyne, replying to Derek Toyne, 31, #913 of 1129 🔗

I’ve come to the conclusion that the government isn’t interested in protecting the people but more interested in protecting themselves.
When people began going to protests,beaches and parks the government realised the people had stopped being frightened and needed something to keep the people frightened. So it wheeled out the claim 120000 would die without face masks,we all know face masks aren’t backed by science. Even the WHO originally didn’t back face masks but after lobbying by politicians changed that to recommending the use of face masks. But we all know the government blundered when it emptied the hospitals of covid patients putting them in care homes with the most vulnerable people. Personally I believe we won’t get a second wave but the government will take credit for making face masks mandatory hoping we all forget about the old people you’ve died.

64233 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Derek Toyne, 14, #914 of 1129 🔗

Of course they’re not interestded in protecting the public : they’ve caused far more damage, and stored up more long-term ill than this mild virus ever has done or will do.

The only equal in the contempt stakes is the members of the massed propaganda bands of the media that have colluded with them, rather than doing a proper job.

Just watched ‘The Post’ – a dramatization of the ‘Pentagon Papers’ and the Washington Post affair. The thing is … you can’t imagine *any* British paper of the present doing such a public service through investigative reporting. Journalism no longer happens.

64290 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to RickH, 13, #915 of 1129 🔗

The BBC used to do investigative journalism.
Seems incredible now!

64301 ▶▶▶ nottingham69, replying to RickH, 2, #916 of 1129 🔗

It is a mild virus for most but for the old and even late middle age with existing health issues it isn’t. Especially with our NHS recovery performance. You are only 60/40 coming out alive in our local trust, going in with CCP Virus. My view is Alexander’s reopening policies are a complete disaster but this is a serious virus to the elderly for sure.

64404 ▶▶▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to nottingham69, #917 of 1129 🔗

Hi Nottingham69,
I don’t fancy those odds! Have you got any data for that?
My neighbour works in a Nottingham ICU (not sure which one) and I had hoped he’d do better for me than 60/40!

64242 ▶▶ Jonathan Castro, replying to Derek Toyne, 11, #918 of 1129 🔗

The government will just relabel Flu as Covid-19

64249 ▶▶▶ IMoz, replying to Jonathan Castro, 7, #919 of 1129 🔗

They’ve already relabelled it from “COVID-19” to “coronavirus,” of course ‘flu (as well as, what, 1 in 6 (don’t quote me on that) common colds) is actually caused by a coronavirus…

64263 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to Derek Toyne, 5, #920 of 1129 🔗

It’s very difficult to see what this government is trying to do. They were bounced into lockdown by Macron threatening to shut down the Channel ports. Maybe they are just pretending to be free agents and are doing other people’s bidding.

64315 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to OKUK, 11, #921 of 1129 🔗

If they were “bounced” into it by that empty threat then that’s just another piece of evidence that they are unfit to govern. The leadership responsibility for this is 100% with the Johnson government and his Cabinet. No excuses about supposed external pressure.

64302 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Derek Toyne, #922 of 1129 🔗

Spot on!

64227 nfw, replying to nfw, 19, #923 of 1129 🔗

And of course the response to this nonsense: “Imagine how bad it would have been without the masks” is the response of believers in the new religion of face masks.”

…is “prove it”.

64250 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to nfw, 8, #924 of 1129 🔗

“Burn the witch! Burn the witch!” the likely response to your appeal to science.

64289 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 1, #925 of 1129 🔗

‘Well! we did do the nose.’

64234 Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, 35, #926 of 1129 🔗

The world feels a bit more normal.

I went into my two small local shops and ((Premier Stores) (OneStop-Tesco)) to do some test purchases bare-face. Milk, chocolate.

No problem what so ever. A very positive experience. Two other non masked dudes, and older scared guy, face nappy, happy friendly shop assistants, (one in face-nappy).

I said to the other bare-face, nice face!

Then went to my local pub, sweet as, no social distancing, just drunk people having fun.

Yer, don’t worry. It’s not quite as bad as you might think, I have some optimism that the mask thing is set up to fail.

Wear a mask-Don’t wear a mask, stay in, don’t stay in, go to work, don’t go to work…

Yer whatever Boris.

Next step, I am going to try all the other small food shops and see how the land lies. Graduating to a supermarket in due course.

64288 ▶▶ annie, replying to Two-Six, 4, #927 of 1129 🔗

You’re doing great!

64310 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to annie, 8, #928 of 1129 🔗

And PS, I am proudly wearing your badge. No negative comments ( let ’em try it!), but a boost for the confidence of unbelievers, who are not as rare as the MSM/government liars would have us believe.

64422 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to annie, 3, #929 of 1129 🔗

Yes it’s surprising, many people I talk to are various shade of sceptic. Or trainees, as I like to call them.

64426 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, #930 of 1129 🔗

Live music in pubs is back soon as well said the landlord, with social distancing in place…Of Course, lol.

64244 James Leary #KBF, replying to James Leary #KBF, 4, #931 of 1129 🔗

Is Spain the result of testing? Asymptomatic or symptomatic testing? Percentage of tests positive/negative? Hospitalisation numbers? Death numbers in same areas? BBC Online KNOWS it’s THE second wave.

Coronavirus: Spain drives fears of European ‘second wave’ https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53539015

Project Fear Mk? It will morph into a demand to rescind Brexit shortly. Remoaners may not have caused this, but they are running with it.

64287 ▶▶ annie, replying to James Leary #KBF, 16, #932 of 1129 🔗

All those hellish Spanish masks really worked, didn’t they?

64312 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to James Leary #KBF, 6, #933 of 1129 🔗

No James we aren’t. Brexit isn’t even a blip on my, or any other remainers I know, radar anymore given the crapfest we’re enduring now, with great thanks to yer brexit boy Johnson let’s not forget. That you lot still haven’t accepted you won is comical.

64316 ▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Mark II, 16, #934 of 1129 🔗

You’ve got to laugh though, haven’t you? After the referendum, it was claimed that Brexit was the equivalent of shooting ourselves in the foot, etc. because it was predicted it might lop a whopping 0.3% annual growth off the economy or some such. It was calculated that after twenty years, it would have cost the average family £4,800 – or something like that.

Many of the people who went into meltdown over that (or pretended to?) are now going hysterical over every little move to recover some of the 50%+ of the economy that has been suspended/destroyed post-Covid. I wonder if they ever reflect on the irony – probably not.

64335 ▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Barney McGrew, 9, #935 of 1129 🔗

I’m not one who cared that much for the economic arguments of brexit, I simply prefer to be part of it for the many benefits it brings, but a major reason for me was I don’t trust British politicians to do what’s good for us without the checks the EU ensured on us… And I think that’s being demonstrated now. Left to their own devices, our leaders are evil and incompetent on a scale I hadn’t even imagined and will destroy the country.

But yes, it has been extremely eye opening to see people who were on ‘my side’ during brexit debate basically abandon all pretence of being Liberal minded people and now just shitting themselves and desperate for never ending state dictatorship – there are a lot of hypocrites out there it seems, but I think that goes for both the original sides, as previously tough, ‘blitz spirit’ type brexiters have been reduced to quivering lumps cowering at home and behind their masks too. Shame on all those people, whatever side of the brexit debate they fell on.

64343 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mark II, 5, #936 of 1129 🔗

And we will be both dead of it and not.
Miaaaaaaow from Schrödinger’s cat.

64378 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to annie, 1, #937 of 1129 🔗

Haha true true

64366 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark II, 5, #938 of 1129 🔗

I agree with what you say about our leaders, but sadly see little evidence that many of the others in the EU and elsewhere are any better.

I voted leave and thought there was a good chance it would bring opportunities to the UK, but right now I really don’t care one way or the other about it. The only important thing is for us to somehow claw our way back from the mass hysteria.

64376 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Julian, 6, #939 of 1129 🔗

Agreed on that, as unsurprised as I am by the behaviour of our politicians I’m disappointed the EU has lacked a cohesive response across the group… With some countries doing well to avoid draconian laws and others being _almost_ as bad as us (worse for a month in a few places, but they’ve unwound things a lot quicker than us).

Basically, as I’ve said before, the feeling of being totally and utterly politically homeless now is certain, not one single side has come out of this strongly, for any of us on here I imagine.

64399 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark II, 2, #940 of 1129 🔗

Indeed, homeless.

They have unwound things more quickly in most of Europe, but masks are everywhere and some countries are re-imposing lockdowns

It will take a lot of pull us out of this hysteria – even co-ordinated admissions that it was a mistake from world governments and WHO may be seen as a conspiracy by those who are now convinced that covid is the global health catastrophe it was portrayed as

64318 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to James Leary #KBF, 13, #941 of 1129 🔗

It’s seasonal so a second wave is expected in Winter.

But it’s also not seasonal so a second wave can come at any time.

But if it doesn’t come it’s neither. Or it’s both.

Who knows. It’s not important. We can all just live like it’s coming or not coming or both.

64319 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to James Leary #KBF, 7, #942 of 1129 🔗

In my post below. https://catalannews.com under “ most popular” section. The graphs show deaths and serious cases have been flat-lining for months in Catalonia. The spike is in the number of positive test cases and is mainly in younger people so they have closed bars and nightclubs.

64325 ▶▶ Will, replying to James Leary #KBF, 6, #943 of 1129 🔗

Spain locked down too hard and too early for most of the country, the same as Australia, Israel, the southern and western US states, Kazakhstan etc etc. The spike in cases we are seeing isn’t a second wave of virus, it is a continuation of the first one that was interrupted. All these examples give a further lie to the suggestion the UK locked down too late. Face nappies also help to spread covid because people think they are invincible and continually touch their faces…

64372 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to Will, 3, #944 of 1129 🔗

Or there is no spike at all and what you are seeing is the effect of compromising immune systems. You then get any Coronavirus which has a high chance of testing positive in the PCR test.

No attempt is made to have control groups but then no attempt has been made to create a decent test either whose data and efficacy are shown to the public. PCR tests can be shown to be accurate to what they are producing, but that means little if the concept of the test itself is incorrect.

64390 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to James Leary #KBF, 2, #945 of 1129 🔗

There have been 36 (I think) deaths in Spain since 1st July. The spike upwards is clear on Worldometers, but have no idea of the hospitalisations. My guess is that it’s increased testing and is a bit early to see any deaths (if there are going to be any) from this spike in “cases”.


64427 ▶▶▶ helenf, replying to Nick Rose, #946 of 1129 🔗

Just noticed on Worldometer that the Spanish daily “cases” is the “sum of total cases detected by PRC and antibodies tests”. We already know PCR tests are unreliable. But Antibodies tests? I didn’t think that would be a very accurate way of detecting current cases!

64261 OKUK, 21, #947 of 1129 🔗

It’s terrible when you see a gifted performer reduced to singing karaoke on a cruise liner. Likewise it’s very sad seeing Boris Johnson so desperate as having to wear a mask and mime along to tracks provided by WHO.

64262 Eddie, 1, #948 of 1129 🔗

Just wanted to drop in my first post and say what an enjoyable bunch of sharp minded folks you are. Been enjoying these threads this past week. This site is a comforting discovery indeed!

Over on the west coast of Canada things are pretty tame here and more faces visible, at least where I live, than the masked ones. I actually do a little happy dance as I complete a circuit of my grocery store and observe that us visible faces win again. I want to high five everyone who sports the old normal look.

I believe it’s imperative to show understanding for everyone caught up in this s**tshow of bulls**t and try not to look down on ordinary folk…masked, plastic shielded, rubber gloved, whatever it may be…well, those three combined, if observed, make it okay to enjoy a brief moment of comedic joy.

Good luck my UK friends. Resist the continued wave of bulls**t….or are we in the second wave of bulls**t now?? Keep the great posts coming and best wishes to you all.

64269 nfw, replying to nfw, 16, #949 of 1129 🔗

Why isn’t Boris wearing a mask in that photo? He should be setting the ultimate example. Or is it he knows it’s all a con? Anyway we know Toby Young won’t be voting Conservative again. He said so in a London Calling podcast. Any hints as to which you might vote Toby?

64413 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to nfw, 4, #950 of 1129 🔗

Both of them should have been wearing masks, visors, safety helmets, goggles, gloves, aprons, shoe covers, and anti-covid butt-plugs.
Just to demonstrate clearly to the public what a total shower of CHARLIES they are.

64500 ▶▶▶ Old Bill, replying to Two-Six, 2, #951 of 1129 🔗

anti-covid butt-plugs

I bought a pack of those from ebay – a bit uncomfortable but they must work, I still haven’t caught the bat flu!

64271 Griblet, #952 of 1129 🔗

C ertification O f V accination ID

For all the tin foil hatters out there…

Me? I’m just a lawn mower, you can tell me by the way I walk.

64280 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 3, #953 of 1129 🔗

PM: “I didn’t have a clue about the virus back in March and I still don’t Laura.”
Not a clue? Here is a USA timeline from USA Today:

64403 ▶▶ Bugle, replying to richard riewer, 5, #954 of 1129 🔗

That admission alone ought to bring about his resignation.

64493 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to richard riewer, #955 of 1129 🔗

Johnsons idea of plausible deniability perhaps.

64297 annie, replying to annie, 22, #956 of 1129 🔗

The bold Sir Peter has another swipe at face nappies


and a crack at Fetida Dickhead as well, same article.

64300 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to annie, 18, #957 of 1129 🔗

Hitch is spot on again. Alexander it is from here on, no Johnson is no mate for sure with his authoritarian fear promoting policies. When I see old law fearing women made to feel uncomfortable, sweating like donkeys in a sauna on their shopping trip for no good reason, it is a step too far.

64309 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to nottingham69, 10, #958 of 1129 🔗

One small step for a zombie, one giant leap for Fascism.

64311 ▶▶ TJN, replying to annie, 9, #959 of 1129 🔗

Yes, but what he’s really spot on about is the economy.

Sitting merrily on a boat as we drift inexorably towards the Niagara Falls; an apt metaphor.

64334 ▶▶ Guirme, replying to annie, 3, #960 of 1129 🔗

Pity that comments aren’t allowed as they could be interesting. However good to see such a critical article in a major newspaper.

64341 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Guirme, 1, #961 of 1129 🔗

You can comment. Click on ‘comments’ right at the bottom if the article.

64351 ▶▶ IanE, replying to annie, 3, #962 of 1129 🔗

And, for those who find all the pop-ups and videos that keep appearing at the Mail online intensely irritating, it is also available at Hitchens’ blog spot :-


64368 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to annie, 4, #963 of 1129 🔗

The link to the Mail online article you supply includes a video of Mr, Johnson telling us how we all have to pull together. Listening to him you’d think mask wearing was a matter of free will rather than something being imposed on people. Presumably the video shows him speaking quite recently?

64298 annie, 26, #964 of 1129 🔗

Had to laugh just now. An ad. popped up on my Audible page:

Me: no need, I’m in one right now.

64299 Brett_McS, #965 of 1129 🔗

As Taiwan, SIngapore and Hong Kong showed, the key was to stop travel from China (ie ignore the WHO) at the first indication of a SARS-like virus spreading there. That should be the main lesson learnt.

64303 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 31, #966 of 1129 🔗

So, yesterday evening we spontaneously decided to get a Chinese take away, as you do in a free country. I got in my car to collect it, thinking normally, then as I was driving along I realised and remembered I think you’re supposed to wear a mask to get a take away. I contemplated how bizarre it was to even have that thought in my mind and just carried on as normal. Since I don’t own and never will own a mask I simply went in and collected the take away with no issues. Granted, it’s only a small, local affair, and no one else was in apart from the non-mask wearing staff, but I felt better for doing it and for knowing it can be done and it’s ok to do! Oh man, even writing that last sentence is insane isn’t it? Sadly most, if not all, of my close family and friends are complying. I haven’t yet spoken to a mask objector or defier in person!

64322 ▶▶ james, replying to Moomin, 22, #967 of 1129 🔗

Got my chippy tea without mask Friday night. Unfortunately out of around 7 people only 2 of us unmasked. Both of us seemed to be in some sort of construction industry (not known for it virtue signalling!) The card reader has disappeared from the chippy and back to cash only. Seems tax avoidance also wins over ‘card only safety’

64354 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to james, 17, #968 of 1129 🔗

If i were a shop i’d want cash only because if one of your customers paid for their goods by card and then they went on to test positive for the flu they’d shut down your shop. Cash only is the only way to remain open in our facist country now. Hopefully many many many shops catch on to this. I’ve noticed loads of shops saying cash only. I hope it catches on. This might go some way to stoping the fools who think laying by card is good. Never ever ever pay by card all your doing is asking for government approval of your buying.

64379 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to james, 5, #969 of 1129 🔗

Smaller stores in Scotland have been complaining about the additional costs of taking card payments which seriously affects their profitability. I imagine this will be an issue everywhere so it’s not necessarily all about tax avoidance.

64391 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Moomin, 8, #970 of 1129 🔗

Update, just got some milk and dog poo bags from my local coop, I went in unmasked and wandered around as I normally would, it wasn’t busy, only a couple of people in there but none of the mask and visor wearing staff said anything to me. How strangely bizarre it feels to ‘defiantly’ go into a coop unmasked! What had the U.K. come to?

64429 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Moomin, 2, #971 of 1129 🔗

It’s a gigantic chicken Co-op.

64305 Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 38, #972 of 1129 🔗

Well, I just went into a shop for the first time since the compulsory mask nonsense.

It was a small local petrol station, and unbelievably, the guy tried to lock me out and started making mask gestures through the glass door!! He still wouldn’t let me in when I claimed exemption on medical grounds, but offered to serve me at the window. I told him that under no circumstances would I be treated like a leper, along with some other choice words (which I’m not happy about as I wanted to keep my cool) and he opened the door and I got my 4 pints of milk.

Won’t be going back there again, but I went in and got my milk – unmasked!!

64329 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 8, #973 of 1129 🔗

They are still doing that at a local newsagent, never been back in two months.

64337 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to karenovirus, 11, #974 of 1129 🔗

It’s crazy. I mean, I have a borderline medical exemption which would probably put the police off if they ever happened to be there, but it really annoyed me that somebody with a serious condition could be treated in this way. There was no way I was leaving without going in and making a point.

64364 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 8, #975 of 1129 🔗

Feeling brave after my Saturday experience I split my Sunday am shop between 6 small stores. Most of the few other shoppers masked, not even a glance from any of the store staff, had my ‘mask exempt card’ in my pocket but did not need to produce it.

64369 ▶▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to karenovirus, 2, #976 of 1129 🔗

I like acts of bravery!

64392 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to karenovirus, 4, #977 of 1129 🔗

Excellent, glad to hear it. After my maskless experiences so far (tube, airport arrivals and now the shop) I’m feeling very good about sticking to my principles. That feeling far outweighs the disapproving looks from the masked ones.

64347 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 9, #978 of 1129 🔗

As I have previously opined Boris et al should be asked if they support people refusing to sell comestibles to someone not wearing a mask? If they do then by extention they support part of the population starving another part of the population in to submission.

64382 ▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #979 of 1129 🔗

Remember the Grand National winner – Comply or Die?

64386 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Ned of the Hills, 3, #980 of 1129 🔗

I suppose they pretty much are supporting that.

The odd thing is though that they’ve made the ‘rules’ very easy to get around for anyone who bothers to read them, especially at the large supermarkets who have big legal teams frightened of discrimination claims and hassle for staff.

I have no idea what the government’s game is, my wife is always telling me that I should stop trying to apply logic to their actions!

64388 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 3, #981 of 1129 🔗

They have made the rules easy to get around so they cannot be accused of being horrid to people with disabilities, medical issues etc, which is taboo these days. In practice, they are relying on propaganda and peer pressure to enforce compliance.

64397 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Julian, 5, #982 of 1129 🔗

Yes, very true. If claims of discrimination do arise, they can point to their government exemption cards and deny all responsibility. A bit like how they claim to never have closed schools. What a bunch of criminals.

64320 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 25, #983 of 1129 🔗

Saw some of a programme about Diana last night. We may sometimes imagine that the British public have lost their way relatively recently, but if you go all the way back to 1997, you will find that they were just as wet, sentimental and sheep-like then. The recent ‘clapping’ for the NHS was the same as the weird applause for Diana’s coffin on the day of the funeral.

64324 ▶▶ matt, replying to Barney McGrew, 13, #984 of 1129 🔗

I was only 21 at the time but, not just in retrospect but in the moment, that was the point when I realised this wasn’t the country that I thought it was.

64373 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to matt, 3, #985 of 1129 🔗

That was my feeling too. A strange week and hard to believe it is now almost a quarter of a century ago.

64393 ▶▶▶ James007, replying to matt, 5, #986 of 1129 🔗

I remember Blair’s speech “the people’s princess”. He was so well controlled, he could have been an actor. In those early days he was exceptional at spin and using popular sentiment.
When seeing Boris trying to use NHS worship to do a similar thing, I see a stark contrast in ability.

You’re right that the cultural changes have been a long time coming. For me it’s been happening without me noticing.

64328 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Barney McGrew, 5, #987 of 1129 🔗

Went to the pub, without telly, when the funeral was on.

64374 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to karenovirus, 2, #988 of 1129 🔗

I went for a long, all day walk. Bliss.

64332 ▶▶ Gillian, replying to Barney McGrew, 14, #989 of 1129 🔗

I could never understand the Diana worship. I appreciated her many talents but she always seemed to me very manipulative. Prince Harry has inherited his mother’s flaws.The widely accepted narrative of her death (“victim” of an intrusive press and “killed” by the chasing paparazzi) has always struck me as a manipulation of the truth. She chose to live a high-profile lifestyle after her split from Charles. Why was she dining at the Ritz in Paris with her playboy lover and then being driven through the Paris streets late at night with her lover? She could easily have been keeping a low profile in a cottage in the countryside somewhere if she craved the quiet life.

64361 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Gillian, 1, #990 of 1129 🔗

Likewise nothing against Diana just the wall to wall media coverage, just as now with the Corona.

64339 ▶▶ annie, replying to Barney McGrew, 7, #991 of 1129 🔗

But it didn’t last. Attempts by e.g. Althorpe House to cash in on the Di-hysteria proved to be lamentable failures.

64352 ▶▶ steve, replying to Barney McGrew, 5, #992 of 1129 🔗

Please let this blog be one of the few that are free of anything mentioning the royal family especially saint D

… And What Do You Do?: What The Royal Family Don’t Want You To Know https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1785904914

64551 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to steve, #993 of 1129 🔗

‘The Strange Death of David Kelly’ is an excellent book – maybe excluding the last chapter.

I’ve not read this one on the Royals, but as the blurb says, Norman is also a Privy Councillor !?

64377 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #994 of 1129 🔗

i remember waking up on the sunday morning to find that ITV BBC1 and BBC2 were all broadcasting rolling news about the death. Only C4 was doing normal programmes. I rang the BBC to complain. I could never understand the devotion to her and her beatification. And the national mourning and how people felt the need to go stand somewhere and emote. And from then on it became the norm which ended up in the clapping …

64401 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #995 of 1129 🔗

It was a very interesting experience. I cannot remember the exact order of things, but suspect Blair’s impromptu speech was on the Sunday or Monday – it was outside his constituency home and he had his ‘man of the people’ mug of tea in his hand. He had a visible tear in the eye – like any good actor he can turn on the waterworks on demand. People started putting flowers outside Buckingham Palace. I think it must have been mid-week when I went after work with my colleague on our way back from a client meeting. Flowers were four or five deep up The Mall. The biggest surprise was not the mass of flowers, but the number of men (in suits in many cases) stood looking at the flowers in tears. The closest example I can muster is the scene in the Evita film, with Antonio Banderas in the crowd as Madonna starts to sing from the balcony. That Tony Blair chap is some genius!

My view, perhaps conspiratorial, perhaps not. She was pregnant.

64406 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #996 of 1129 🔗

Diana was murdered by a little car overtaking her car in the tunnel and flashing a bright tactical strobe at Henri Paul, blinding him. It still didn’t finishes her of so they killed her in the ambulance. All the CCTV in Paris that night “went off”…OK sure it did.
Call me a conspiracy theorist if you like. Don’t care.

64471 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Two-Six, #997 of 1129 🔗

Ah yes — that naughty Duke of Edinburgh

64496 ▶▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Two-Six, #998 of 1129 🔗

Dodi was the intended victim, the motive to make his father suffer as much as possible. Diana was collateral damage.

Not sure I really believe the above but it makes sense as Mohamed Al Fayed has certainly made enemies

64446 ▶▶ court, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #999 of 1129 🔗

It’s funny you say that, I was only 20 at the time and still remember having heated discussions with my elders about how I thought she was just a media whore who lived and died by the sword.

She did get me a day off work though, which was nice.

64323 matt, replying to matt, 19, #1000 of 1129 🔗

I’ve been thinking about chaos theory.

You know the old chestnut about the butterfly flapping its wings in the Caribbean causing a storm in Japan? It works on the basis that the tiniest action has knock on effects and consequences and that there is a non-zero chance that one or more of those consequences might cause a chain of events that builds to a significant consequence.

The official response to this disease, as well as the group think response is based on exactly this thinking. There is a non-zero chance that I might be infected with the virus without knowing it. There is a non-zero chance that asymptomatic spread is a thing and so a non-zero chance that I might infect someone else, who might infect someone else and so on until someone’s granny catches the virus and dies. Taken across an entire population, you end up with an absolute certainty of death at the end of the chain. If we remain free to interact with each other, we are all collectively guilty of being granny killers.

As an aside – this is always true and always has been forever, even before there was such a thing as SARS-CoV-2. Society’s interactions ultimately lead to hundreds of thousands of deaths because every action has consequences, intended and unintended. He knew a thing or two, that Isaac Newton. Ferguson’s model was in effect an attempt to model chaos theory. It was suitably chaotic, to boot.

The human mind – and especially the gestalt social hive mind – is very uncomfortable with complexity and uncertainty. We prefer to think that we can exert control and achieve fixed outcomes.

So what’s the answer to the storms in Japan? Well, it’s obvious – you just have to lock up all the butterflies in Jamaica and stop them from flapping their wings.

64346 ▶▶ IanE, replying to matt, 4, #1001 of 1129 🔗

Yes, some climate scientists and many mathematicians have wondered about possible effects of the forests of windfarms and possible effects on global air circulation patterns and, hence, on our climate. Air movements are of course a very well-known class of non-linear dynamic systems – the sort which will under certain conditions develop chaotically , in the mathematical sense of chaos theory!

64353 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to matt, 3, #1002 of 1129 🔗

I’ve thought about that recently along with Nassim Taleb’s proposal that wearing masks is better than not due to the low probability but high impact risk. On paper it looks reasonable but just like with the butterfly effect, it’s all about the system conditions and assumptions.

In Taleb’s case he makes a Pascal’s Wager, simplifying probability. When scientists say there is no evidence that masks work to stop transmission his point is that this is lack of evidence rather than no evidence and hence there is a probability that masks do work. The problem is that this is selective reasoning. For a system there is also the case where something works locally one way then works completely different when in a system context (the Fallacy of Composition). Taking Taleb’s reasoning there is also a chance the mask make things much worse – they just redirect the risk. So the default case is we don’t know.

But it also brings in the concept of the butterfly. The effect of the wings can only occur in a fully coupled system, one were noise is not enough to prevent the escalating effect. And that just doesn’t happen (except in very special conditions) in Nature due to that pesky Least Energy Principle. Systems have a way of localising effects. You can have coupled behaviour locally but it doesn’t last. The more elements and degrees of freedom the more noise, the higher the entropy.

And this I think hits home to your point about the hive mind. The layers of abstraction between micro, meso and macro scales do not exist in the same way with social media. You either opt in or out and the threshold for mass coupling effects is much much lower.

64362 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to mhcp, 1, #1003 of 1129 🔗

Thank you for taking the trouble to write all this but it is all too deep for me. Though I think what you are saying is that mask wearing may well not have the effect the government hopes it will have.

64375 ▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Ned of the Hills, #1004 of 1129 🔗

Good morning Ned of the Hills

64367 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to mhcp, 2, #1005 of 1129 🔗

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Though I think it’s pretty obvious that the masks people are wearing are useless for the intended purpose.

64486 ▶▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to Nick Rose, #1006 of 1129 🔗

Yes I agree but Taleb’s problem is he restricts the possibilties of his model. Which ironically is what his whole Antifragile idea is about. Another point is that say masks are useful in a local setting? Does that apply to the system?

It doesn’t always follow because you don’t see or understand the whole system. Whose purpose as far as we can see is to minimise energy.

64400 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to mhcp, 2, #1007 of 1129 🔗

Disappointing if Taleb of all people is making such an elementary mistake as you describe.

As far as the UK is concerned there’s no evidence of any risk of spreading the infection (most likely the epidemic is done and we have passed the herd immunity threshold for the current conditions, and there’s virtually zero risk of catching the thing, multiplied by virtually zero risk of serious medical consequences, for the vast majority.

Maybe he’s counting death as effectively infinite loss, but if so he’s making a fundamental error right there, just as if he’s counting wearing a mask as effectively zero cost.

64370 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to matt, 1, #1008 of 1129 🔗

The butterfly effect has been happening since the universe began. Everything that’s happened in the past has led us to where we are in the present.

Most attempts to attribute cause and effect are little more than a mental exercise.

64327 FiFiTrixabelle, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 31, #1009 of 1129 🔗

Following a sleepless night as a result of the announcement re quarantine rules for those returning from Spain (my daughter flies back from Barcelona on Thursday, we have a planned Graduation Party for family and friends 8 days after), I’m now getting even more angry than I’ve been over the muzzle debacle.
1. Why no notice? If we can get 10 days notice on mask wearing, why not the same on this policy? Do we just enjoy watching the fall out for those currently on holiday, those now cancelling their holidays and the travel firms/airlines being thrown into turmoil, WITH NO NOTICE?
2. What are the current figures? I just see ‘an increase in cases’ being cited, can anyone shed any light?
3. WHY NOT INTRODUCE TESTING ON ARRIVAL? Are we so incompetent that this can’t be organised? Greece manage, why can’t we?
4. How will it be policed? Handy helpful tips on the BBC website which tells me about fines, not using public transport and only going out for food if no-one else can do so on your behalf. Are they for real?
5. Fully reliant on employers supporting this for those who can’t go back to work. I know lots of people are ‘working from home’ but that’s not the case for everyone. So another 2 weeks off will be required – either with no pay or subsidised by employer (my reading is SSP will not apply). And we are trying to get the economy moving????

It’s a sh*tshow. I’m truly giving up on there being any rational to anything. I know, this has been the case for ages but ever the optimist I kept thinking it can’t get any worse given ALL the data we now have. I’m wrong. We are being run by complete numpties.

64333 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 2, #1010 of 1129 🔗

1 Extreme Risk
2 No idea
3 Incubation period
4 No idea
5 No

64340 ▶▶ IanE, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 4, #1011 of 1129 🔗

All part of Carrie’s Boris’s green anti-travel agenda!

64457 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to IanE, 1, #1012 of 1129 🔗

I thought that when the original quarantine was brought in.It was too late to be of any use.The only consequence is to be the bankrupting of the mass travel firms and airlines.

64344 ▶▶ Bill Hickling, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 10, #1013 of 1129 🔗

My sympathies. My son works in travel so this will just torpedo any slight recovery they have been seeing. A bone-headed overreaction driven by their science committees without consideration for the wider effects.

64350 ▶▶ steve, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 12, #1014 of 1129 🔗

Answer to all. The government are total fckwits

64384 ▶▶ James007, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 4, #1015 of 1129 🔗

Absolutely right. They haven’t a clue what they are doing, and nothing seems to make sense. Testing on-arrival would be easy to arrange. Test stations around the country are turning round results in less than 24hrs.

64447 ▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to FiFiTrixabelle, 1, #1016 of 1129 🔗

Ignore the entire pronouncement as being the knee jerk reaction it is?

64331 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 18, #1017 of 1129 🔗

Faroe Islands has been free of Covid-19 for quite a long time.62 % of the population has been tested. Now suddenly 23 cases. The usual picture. A Russian trawler in one of the ports. First one crew hospitalised for corona, then 23 of 30 tested crew members PCR pos and still 47 more to test. All asymptomatic, I think. None of the crew members has left the ship except for the hospitalized case. Four visiting Faroe islanders on the ship is not considered to be at risk. Even a remotely rather isolated islands will be affected by Covid-19. Unfortunately also a visiting non-Faroe islander family on a SAS flight to Faroe Island has the same day also tested positive in one member. The Chief Medical Officer Faroe Island thinks it will be very difficult to contact trace all passengers. If tiny Faroe Islands have these difficulties to keep out Covid-19,think of New Zealand.You cannot stop this virus in the end.

64338 ▶▶ IanE, replying to swedenborg, 6, #1018 of 1129 🔗

Yep, New Zealotland will get its yet!

64342 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to swedenborg, 11, #1019 of 1129 🔗

NZ might have a problem

64336 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 8, #1020 of 1129 🔗

Does anyone see a link between attitudes to Covid and the ‘somewheres’ versus ‘anywheres’ divide? I was wondering if acceptance of living life through Zoom might be seen as a literal acceptance of being ‘anywhere’, not to mention masks making us all anonymous and seemingly the same, interchangeable.

64395 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Barney McGrew, #1021 of 1129 🔗

This might be of interest – someone on here a few days ago brought up the matter of Austrian School free market economics. On ZeroHedge from Mises Institute:


64417 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1022 of 1129 🔗

Diverting, certainly:
‘It should also be noted here that pure capitalism encourages the division of labor among people, nationally and internationally. This, in turn, entices people to seek peaceful cooperation rather than conflict: everyone realizes that it pays off to cooperate, that this is mutually beneficial to all parties involved. In other words: pure capitalism is a recipe for peace. In a world of pure capitalism, there would simply be no reason for large-scale violent conflicts, let alone state wars.’
So in other words, most of the 19th century was a huge mistake – hilarious!

64439 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Bruno, #1023 of 1129 🔗

“… pure capitalism encourages the division of labor among people, nationally and internationally. This, in turn, entices people to seek peaceful cooperation rather than conflict”

Zoom!!! – Pigs flying all over the sky in that LaLa Land :-))

64349 Biker, replying to Biker, 29, #1024 of 1129 🔗

another day in HMP that is Great Britain, ain’t it fucking great.

64371 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Biker, 2, #1025 of 1129 🔗

Good Morning Scotland!

64380 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Steeve, 5, #1026 of 1129 🔗

i read that in the voice of Robin Williams

64398 ▶▶ Howie59, replying to Biker, 12, #1027 of 1129 🔗

My sentiments exactly Biker. Yesterday was a day I’d like to forget. My marriage is currently being tested to the max. Forget the scorn from the proles, I can deal with them. Having a partner at odds with your own skepticism does not make for an enjoyable supermarket shopping experience.

64440 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Howie59, #1028 of 1129 🔗

The solution there is send her to the supermarket without you, after all she’ll be doing the cooking and cleaning anyway so there is no real need to go.

64441 ▶▶▶ court, replying to Howie59, 9, #1029 of 1129 🔗

My wife just wants a quiet life, which I can understand. But she still wont be shopping as a pastime for the foreseeable. She can do what she wants but there’s no way in hell either of my kids will be masked up ever.

64465 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to court, #1030 of 1129 🔗

Did somebody say Just Eat? 🎶

64477 ▶▶ Christopher, replying to Biker, 1, #1031 of 1129 🔗

Good Morning to all our Scottish Freedom Loving Brethren.
As we further slide deeper into dystopia I can confirm after visiting a few stores yesterday that HMP not so Great Britain is utterly awful.
The Horror The Horror .

64355 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 12, #1032 of 1129 🔗

Anyone out there think that this quarantine is another ”Leicester” mullarkey? The government are doing another “whack a mole” to show that they can do this on a grand scale as well as a small scale.

I can’t remember which government spokesperson said it, but it was implied last week that any shut down would have to be on a national scale rather than a regional one as they couldn’t guarantee where people would have travelled during their holiday.

Then this,
A Spanish foreign ministry spokeswoman said the country was safe with only localised, isolated and controlled outbreaks-a bit like the U.K. then?

64356 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Margaret, 4, #1033 of 1129 🔗

There are flights due in from Spain this morning, how are they the passengers to get home without infecting transport workers ?

64357 ▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to karenovirus, 2, #1034 of 1129 🔗

Wear a mask!

64359 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Steeve, 5, #1035 of 1129 🔗

Ooops, you missed off the /sarc !

64358 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Margaret, 5, #1036 of 1129 🔗

Looks very much like another Leicester to me, though they could have chosen a slightly less popular country. The quarantine applies to mainland + islands, but FCO only advising against travel to mainland, so anyone coming from the Islands will have to quarantine but won’t be able to claim on travel insurace

64360 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Margaret, 12, #1037 of 1129 🔗

Another silly act in this stupid pantomine of concealing the natural immunity. I reckon early next year it’ll be in an self-congratulatory, arse-pulled report saying we stopped a second wave, now forget about the big lies/errors.

64445 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to DRW, #1038 of 1129 🔗

The Thick Of It series 2, episode 2
‘Let’s ban sandcastles. . .’
Malcolm Tucker.

64562 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to DRW, #1039 of 1129 🔗

That is exactly what has been going on since the middle of April when it became clear that Ferguson’s modelling was cat litter.

64394 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Margaret, 11, #1040 of 1129 🔗

I think the Spanish foreign minister has just said Spain will impose quarantine on incoming British travellers unless the UK government removes the restrictions, so tit-for-tat!

64434 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Margaret, 1, #1042 of 1129 🔗

Its about the bedwetters seeing ‘the right thing done at the right time’ – also known as politics

64381 mjr, replying to mjr, 12, #1043 of 1129 🔗

local mini mart for sunday papers. I had told them last week i wouldnt be masked. The shop had a couple of posters on the door requesting masks – but i think someone had been going round the shops putting them up. They had said they wouldnt be bothered and they werent . Good natter about footy and a pleasant experience. No other shoppers there… although as i was leaving a lady came in and lifted her scarf.

64436 ▶▶ Biggles, replying to mjr, #1044 of 1129 🔗

I went to my local mini mart this morning for the Sunday paper but had a different response. I’m served by a guy who must be in his early 30s. He hasn’t worn a mask before but had one on today. Was greeted with ‘You’re supposed to be wearing a mask when you come into the shop’, to which I replied ‘Not when you have a medical exemption, you don’t’ (I have asthma). It will be interesting to see what happens next week. Any more hassle and I will be going elsewhere.

64383 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 4, #1045 of 1129 🔗

Relative risk for Covid-19 for different occupation,Sweden.No risk for teachers

64389 ▶▶ IanE, replying to swedenborg, 8, #1046 of 1129 🔗

Certainly no risk for teachers in the UK – at least until they get up off their comfy sofas!

64402 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to IanE, 4, #1047 of 1129 🔗

The importance of this findings from Sweden is very high, almost a proof that schools are safe. Sweden had no lockdown and 80% more cases per million than UK. All primary schools open, when this disease was spreading. This must be one of the biggest mistake in the UK response. We knew already in March that children were rarely affected in China and South Korea. Closing schools will always affect up to 20-25% of care and NHS staff, the type of occupation you really need in a pandemic, even more so because of the age profile of severe cases. Disastrous mistake.

64435 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to swedenborg, 1, #1048 of 1129 🔗

The only word I’d question is ‘mistake’ – ???

64407 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 15, #1049 of 1129 🔗

Just got this through the Daily fail’s censorbot not that it will do much good as the sheeple will go baaaaah and down vote along with the 77th but it made me feel good:

More psychological conditioning of the population going on. A few points to ponder: Why are “cases” in Spain increasing? They have worn masks in more places for longer than the UK and if masks worked they numbers should be dropping. Is it because more testing is being done? 2 – With the increase in testing the positive rate is pretty constant and wishing the percentage of false positives that happen. If a new outbreak was occurring the positive rate would increase dramatically. Why isn’t it? 3 – A positive test does not mean that you re suffering from any virus, they have just picked up some viral genetic material in the sample. It means nothing so why keep up the pretence it does? 4 – If there was a new outbreak hospital admissions and deaths would be rising dramatically but they are not. Why not? All over Europe deaths have been below 5 years averages for nearly 6 weeks now so a new outbreak is not happening.

64418 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Awkward Git, 5, #1050 of 1129 🔗

The WHO and most governments seem to be playing Animal Crossing, just collecting tokens for the sake of it. A bit like when you go to the amusement arcade and get those tickets every time you play. You end up with millions of tickets, but they don’t really amount to any value.

64420 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to PoshPanic, 1, #1051 of 1129 🔗

Just to add, I’m talking about case numbers

64433 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to PoshPanic, 3, #1052 of 1129 🔗

What you mean is “case” numbers (with quotation marks) – i.e. not infections or illness.

As you say, it’s a game called ‘Self-Fulfilling Prophecy’, and it’s one that the Mengele brigade are addicted to so that (as said above) and indication (not actual ‘presence’ of a vaguely similar RNA fragment from an exponential growth in testing can be called ‘a case’.

The confected nature of this plague scenario gets clearer by the day, at a time when a representative government really intent on the health of its population would be getting everything back to normal.

64449 ▶▶▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to RickH, #1053 of 1129 🔗

Addiction might be the key word. It’s this obsession with collecting and broadcasting this data that’s at the heart of the problem.

64549 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to PoshPanic, #1054 of 1129 🔗

We are engaged in a pointless exercise to cover up governments and the WHO getting this whole business completely wrong.

64729 ▶▶ wendy, replying to Awkward Git, #1055 of 1129 🔗

Just to add this is confirmed in England by my critical care dr friend – no new admissions to his hospital!!!

64409 AMZ, replying to AMZ, 8, #1056 of 1129 🔗

Anyone seen this:

Especially this bit:
“ PHO may direct, remove or request a constable to remove, an individual to a place suitable for screening and assessment.
The time such person is required to remain at the place for screening and assessment cannot exceed 48 hours.” Holy shit! The government has truly lost it.

64454 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to AMZ, #1057 of 1129 🔗

Yes I was aware of this after reading about it in the coronavirus act when it was published a week before lockdown back in March.

64410 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 13, #1058 of 1129 🔗

https://euro weekly news.com
Video posted 2 days ago. The Spanish foreign minister says that Spain is NOT facing a second wave. The outbreaks are small- a house, a salon etc.. They have done more testing so are finding more cases. The outbreaks are being contained.

64411 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Margaret, 4, #1059 of 1129 🔗

Proves my point – increased testing leads to increased ‘infection’ numbers BUT the CPR test is notoriously unreliable with many false positives

64412 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to Margaret, 1, #1060 of 1129 🔗

Sorry- fat fingers again!

64468 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Margaret, 1, #1061 of 1129 🔗

i was reading up on a local Andalucian english news blog last week. Andalucia which has gone the full masks indoors masks outdoors had had a couple of outbreaks in Malaga and in Granada. Small numbers, all contained

64481 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Margaret, 1, #1062 of 1129 🔗

Isn’t it interesting how outbreaks and waves have different definitions depending on who it favours most.

64415 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 15, #1063 of 1129 🔗

Spain have tested themselves out of the tourist £’s – idiots! Testing is the virus!

I was out delivering Chinese last night and had to fill up the car. I was hoping I would be turned away with no nappy on – but no such luck. The station is also a spar shop, there were a couple of people shopping and one person paying for stuff. Nobody, including the person serving, were nappied up.

A lady was walking towards the shop and lifted a John Wayne style necker over her nose – we weren’t sure if she wasn’t going to pull out a gun and rob the place. But when she realised no one else had bothered she dropped the nappy looking a little sheepish.

I think if people see others not wearing nappies they will have confidence to follow suit so keep up the good fight.

There are some that feel very pleased with themselves with their nappies on – well I prefer those types nappied up anyway.

64463 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Major Panic, 2, #1064 of 1129 🔗

Was in my local Spar yesterday (unmasked) and the shop assistants were following me around, watching me at the ends of the aisles. Not a word from them but it was quite comical being treated like an extremely dangerous shoplifter.

64466 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1065 of 1129 🔗

well if you haven’t got a nappy strapped on you are clearly suspicious, alien even…

64419 Sarigan, 1, #1066 of 1129 🔗

Work remotely in Barbados for a year? Sounds very appealing:


64424 James Leary #KBF, replying to James Leary #KBF, -1, #1067 of 1129 🔗

Is Spain the result of testing? Asymptomatic or symptomatic testing? Percentage of tests positive/negative? Hospitalisation numbers? Death numbers in same areas? BBC Online KNOWS it’s THE second wave.
Coronavirus: Spain drives fears of European ‘second wave’ https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53539015

Project Fear Mk? It will morph into a demand to rescind Brexit shortly. Remoaners may not have caused this, but they are running with it.

64437 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to James Leary #KBF, 5, #1068 of 1129 🔗

I think Brexit is cancelled, I also think the EU is cancelled. There won’t be much left of the EU to leave after this.

64451 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Two-Six, 2, #1069 of 1129 🔗

The wonderful free movement that the remainers so loved was the first casualty of this.At the first sign of trouble every country went their own way and left each other to it.A brilliant example of why the E U is unworkable.

64464 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 1, #1070 of 1129 🔗

And of course has been unworkable for ooh, what, over 60 years? And continues to be? Yeah, right…

64492 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 1, #1071 of 1129 🔗

Except of course for the escorted cross-channel crossings by small boats!

64489 ▶▶ IanE, replying to James Leary #KBF, #1072 of 1129 🔗

I note that the talks, which were due to end at the end of July (or was it June?) have now been extended up to the end of October – though it didn’t say which year where I read that!

Is Johnson going for a T.May – copyright version of ‘leaving’ the EUrinal?

64662 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to James Leary #KBF, #1073 of 1129 🔗

Posted the same thing twice, 10 hours apart… odd behaviour. Didn’t get your desired replies first time round?

64425 swedenborg, 2, #1074 of 1129 🔗

This graph from US shows detection rates of all respiratory viruses except Sasr-Cov2.The coronaviruses in the graph are our ordinary ones. Interesting to see how Sars-Cov2 presses down all other viruses. How can we be sure in the UK that we would have both a flu epidemic and Sars-Cov2 epidemic at the same time next winter? The caveat is that we do not know if there are much co-infection in Covid-19. Everybody would judge a pos PCR test as indication of disease and not doing further tests for other agents. This could be a problem as you can have dead virus fragments of Sars-Cov2 up to 12 weeks.

64432 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 6, #1075 of 1129 🔗

I still see a lot references to keep a distance of 2 meters. What happened to the 1 meter plus rule?

64438 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Victoria, 3, #1076 of 1129 🔗

Social-Distance swervery is very much on the up right now. However that might be because the terrified are finally coming out to play.

64455 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Two-Six, 5, #1077 of 1129 🔗

My wife sneezed in a shop the other day. Some of the customers were left hanging from the display units lol!

64456 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to PoshPanic, 3, #1078 of 1129 🔗

lol, yes sneezing in public is actually HILARIOUS.

64458 ▶▶▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Two-Six, #1079 of 1129 🔗

The girl behind the counter, all decked out in PPE, was in hysterics

64461 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to PoshPanic, 3, #1080 of 1129 🔗

I was cycling up to two potential swervers a while ago now and I sneezed, they were 20 feet away at least, it was one of those “out-the-blue” sneezes, the look of horror on their faces was just amazing. So funny.

64494 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Two-Six, #1081 of 1129 🔗

Sneezing? Ah, yes the thing that’s never been mentioned as a symptom. Corona Cognitive Filter again.

64467 ▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to PoshPanic, #1082 of 1129 🔗
  • Most days I find myself sneezing – it’s usually when out on the fell though when I’m on my todd.
64485 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to PoshPanic, #1083 of 1129 🔗

Next time hold out a hankie and threaten to not use it.

64487 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to PoshPanic, #1084 of 1129 🔗

Well, at least it wasn’t your wife who ended that way! (Humourous comment – for the moment anyway).

64442 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #1085 of 1129 🔗

Tony Blair was on Sophie Ridge on Sunday earlier stating that the evidence for masks is clear. Countries that have widespread mask usage have done well.

On that basis the evidence for lockdowns is clear. Countries that have longer and stricter lockdowns have higher mortality rates.

64450 ▶▶ Nic, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #1086 of 1129 🔗

Spain ? Strictest lockdown in europe infections back up but its death that counts 3 yesterday MAINTAIN THE FEAR

64453 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Nobody2020, 7, #1087 of 1129 🔗

Countries that have widespread mask usage have done well.

Yeah and you’ll find Iraq full of WMD

64460 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Nobody2020, #1088 of 1129 🔗

Does Blair ever go shopping d’y think? Has he been seen out and about wearing a mask?

64462 ▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to Nobody2020, 8, #1089 of 1129 🔗

And of course, if you didn’t already know, Iraq has enough ‘weapons of mass destruction’ to destroy the entire world. The only thing that keeps this mass murderer, Blair, in the news is his billionaire backers who are intent on evil.
Blair truly is, himself, a ‘weapon of mass destruction’ and the one good thing that his regular media appearances do is to remind those of us who recognise this fact is just how corrupt the MSM are.
His pronouncements do have their uses however. If you listen to him and then believe exactly the opposite to what he says then you won’t go far wrong.

64474 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Nobody2020, #1090 of 1129 🔗

I know the reason he got a Third in Law from Oxford – he was moonlighting in the Biochem labs

64478 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1091 of 1129 🔗

He blagged the Third after his viva voce.

64502 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #1092 of 1129 🔗

Tony Blair….. stating that the evidence for masks is clear .”

End of debate, that’s pretty irrefutable evidence that masks are useless.

64523 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #1093 of 1129 🔗

Was anyone on that even bothered to challenge that primary school level of reasoning? To point out to him that that is not ‘evidence’ of anything?

64443 Proudtobeapeasant, #1094 of 1129 🔗

Can anyone please tell me if there is a way to search comments on here, either to see if anyone has replied to one’s own comment or to see what a particular person has said? (Now I’ll have to wait here for a few minutes to see if someone replies!)

64444 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 13, #1095 of 1129 🔗

Oxford are close to a wonder vaccine that ‘takes the edge off symptoms’…

So the people they use as guinea pigs are healthy specimens with good immune systems and generally not or lightly effected by the nasty cough – so how can they know that the vaccine doesn’t make the ‘symptoms’ worse? Every individual is different.

The sooner any vaccine is brought out ,even if it is a placebo, the better – C19 fear is now a cult, so the reality war is lost – get the bedwetters jabbed and lets get back to normal

64448 ▶▶ Nic, replying to Major Panic, 8, #1096 of 1129 🔗

Agree use saline it will do the job ,cos we cant continue like this,

64473 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Major Panic, 6, #1097 of 1129 🔗

Suggest Phase III is not going as smoothly due to side effects in the older, less well cohort. Professor Gilbert is parading the narrative ‘I am working day and night to save the world, I am so tired I cannot eat and sleep’, to deflect. Coupled with the ‘I am such an ordinary girl, I was so brilliant at school, but I simply didn’t know the Oxford application process so I went to University of East Anglia’. I call Bullshit!

64535 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1098 of 1129 🔗

The University of East Anglia was where they altered figures to push the global warming bollocks.

64459 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 10, #1099 of 1129 🔗

My husband and I have decided that we will not vote in future for the monster raving loony party. Instead we will vote for The Monster Raving Loony Party.

64469 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Margaret, 8, #1100 of 1129 🔗

I am hoping an alternative political moment is going to emerge from the current mess.

The current crop of political parties have nothing to offer free thinking people.

64472 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1101 of 1129 🔗

Democracy is cancelled.

64476 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Two-Six, 2, #1102 of 1129 🔗

If it saves just one life it should be cancelled.

64484 ▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Nobody2020, #1103 of 1129 🔗

Not if it’s the PM’s political life!

64483 ▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Two-Six, 3, #1104 of 1129 🔗

Yes but, as (I think) Mark Twain said, if voting changed anything, they wouldn’t let us do it.

64480 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Margaret, 3, #1105 of 1129 🔗

Would that one could – but for many (most?), we just keep getting the standard offerings. Even at the last GE, when I contributed a decent amount to the Brexit Party, they just took the money and, shortly afterwards, stood down most of their candidates, including that for my area. If even the Brexit Party (and, probably any follow-on Reform Party) does that, you know that politics and treachery (after pocketing the cheques, of course) go hand-in-hand.

64501 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to IanE, 2, #1106 of 1129 🔗

In fairness, the Brexit Party was a single issue party and you could definitely make a case that focusing resources against particular Remain candidates was probably the best way to achieve their goal. Though of course the proof of that pudding will only be in the ultimate eating thereof, and we aren’t quite there yet.

What we need now is something very different – a wholesale replacement of our political elite, which has proved itself unfit for purpose with its coronapanic response. The problem is, much of our modern culture along with pretty much our entire cultural, social and other elites are clearly similarly unfit for purpose….

In the past I think such situations have generally been resolved by external conquest and wholesale destruction and rebuilding from the ground up.

64563 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to IanE, #1107 of 1129 🔗

I’d suggest this is primarily down to farage and his odious pals. Taking money from naive supporters and keeping it for themselves. Those who put themselves forward to be MPs were, as I understand it, for the most part at least, passionate locals who had every intention of standing and committing to whatever manifesto might have eventually come out – I believe they were even conned into paying for the privilege of standing and weren’t given their money back?

Farage is of course just a con man, like Boris, like Blair, like corbyn and others – theyre just all conning a different group of people.

64509 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Margaret, #1108 of 1129 🔗

People voted for it last year – and got what they voted for 🙂

64470 TheBluePill, replying to TheBluePill, 1, #1109 of 1129 🔗

Who would have thunk it, correlation (obviously not causation) between Coronovirus and literal bed wetting…


I wouldn’t bother reading beyond the headline though as it is pure fear porn drivel. 172 symptoms FFS.

64475 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to TheBluePill, 6, #1110 of 1129 🔗

Tiredness causing sleep for 7-8 hours every night
Shortness of breath after exercise
Hair loss
Old age
Hunger at various times of the day

The list is endless.

64479 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #1111 of 1129 🔗

Bloody hell, I’m off for a test…

64491 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Major Panic, 1, #1112 of 1129 🔗

Mate of mine had a blood test. They found it all round his body!!!

64545 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to TheBluePill, #1113 of 1129 🔗

Glad to see that bed wetting is one though

64488 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 4, #1114 of 1129 🔗

Understatement of the year (Dominic Raab):

Holidaymakers faced with this abrupt change in policy may find it “inconvenient” but the Government must be able to take “targeted measures” if and when the situation requires it…

Yes, just a little bit of inconvenience.

64490 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Tenchy, 2, #1115 of 1129 🔗

measured lawyer speak

64495 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tenchy, 6, #1116 of 1129 🔗

One would almost be tempted to believe that Raab has let slip the true purpose of these essentially arbitrary, sudden decrees, which is in fact merely to habituate people to obedience to such commandments. For the Greater Good, of course.

64533 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark, 1, #1117 of 1129 🔗

Yep, it’s not incompetence or craziness. It’s wicked (in the traditional sense).

64498 mjr, 1, #1118 of 1129 🔗
64499 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #1119 of 1129 🔗

Anybody else noticed the Corona Cognitive Filter effect?

Gov says “Wear masks, they have a small effect in protecting others “.

Parsed through the bedwetters’ CCF, this becomes:

“A mask will protect me for sure and we all have to wear them because the virus has got worse, starting on Friday”.

64508 ▶▶ IMoz, replying to Sam Vimes, #1120 of 1129 🔗
64540 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #1121 of 1129 🔗

It’s hopeless to try to construct a rational narrative from goverment political propagada. It’s oxy moronic.

True infection has dribbled away to practically nothing – even given that everything recorded as ‘Covid’ isn’t. That’s happened without any significant use of masks. So you don’t have to be Einstein to draw the most likely conclusion.

64503 Kelly deacons, replying to Kelly deacons, 7, #1122 of 1129 🔗

I despair.Our town today noticeably more deserted than usual.

Went to local conv shop.I told him last week I would not be wearing a mask,he was lovely as usual.There today,he served me,then told the one other customer in shop to put his mask on.I have never felt so uncomfortable.I want no *favours* from shop keepers.Will not go back.

Is this really how people want to live?they just want more lockdowns,more masks……My town will never ever be the same again.Feeling sick to my stomach right now.

64528 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Kelly deacons, 3, #1123 of 1129 🔗

Hang in there, Kelly. It’s early days and we’re in the vanguard of this fight out of the dystopian nightmare.

64507 Basics, replying to Basics, 1, #1124 of 1129 🔗

It’s okay folks tony lairb is speaking out tiday from his very own institute /foundation. Creepy voice more creepy than ever. Ex PMs should just shut up. But not globalist lairb. He tells the UK we need to create tge infrastructure to live along side corona forever. He now talks russia where he uses ‘should’ alot.

His interview was a giant nothing burger and yet his creepy half wispered urgency intoned creepfest interview probably gives some of tge ‘deep state’ plans away. Prepare to live with this for a long time unless we burn down the establishment.

64518 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Basics, #1125 of 1129 🔗

Blair = WMD
Johnson = VMD

Story-tellers, not statesmen.

Me – I’m a Blairite. ‘Eric’ by name. He’s the one who sussed the bullshit of the time.

64515 RickH, replying to RickH, 5, #1126 of 1129 🔗

Of course, the ludicrously termed ‘government’ is playing the Catch-22 game.

They are ensuring that their narrative cannot be disproved by preventing normal life (which would show up the developed mildness and lack of current spread of this virus). So:

  • If real illness continues to decrease, it will be attributed to the success of government measures – no matter how unsupported by proper evidence.
  • If ‘cases’ (stray bits of RNA possibly indicating viral presence) increase, it will be a ‘warning’ against slackening measures
  • If actual illness – diagnosed by hospital admissions increases, it will indicate a need to maintain and increase social destruction – no matter what the statistical analysis actually shows.

Draw your own conclusions about motives for this double bind – there’s a few to list.

64569 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to RickH, #1127 of 1129 🔗

You’re spot on with your analysis!

64582 BecJT, replying to BecJT, 2, #1128 of 1129 🔗

I watched The Post last night (again), about the WaPo and the Pentagon Papers / Vietnam War. It struck me that this is kinda the same, having got themselves into it, the Gov (or in the case of Vietnam, successive governments) didn’t know how to get out of it, and didn’t want to be the one to ‘lose the war’. The McNamara Report made it plain that they knew they couldn’t win, that they were lying to the American people, that they kept on sending boys to die knowing it was a disaster, but they kept on lying, talking about making progress, defeating communism etc etc. They even commissioned the McNamara Report for ‘posterity’ so that the war could be understood with the benefit of ‘hindsight’ – it was never intended to be leaked or read until it and they were long gone.

I know a Tory grandee, he keeps telling me re Lockdown ‘it’s just politics’ and all recrimination and analysis will have to be done in retrospect.

Like the war, I think until the press start asking some serious questions, and young people start getting angry about their future being robbed, we’re in this for the long haul. A bit like Weapons of Mass Destruction and the War on Terror, nobody was ready to look at that critically until it was over. And even now we rewrite history and entirely blame Tony Blair, when let’s be honest, apart from Cook and Short, everyone else was eagerly credulous, including the opposition and the press.

64736 ▶▶ RickH, replying to BecJT, #1129 of 1129 🔗

You’re analogy with ‘The Post’ struck me too – but particularly in the way that there were , then at least, elements of real journalism around that actually did investigation. Not now.

“… [like the] War on Terror, nobody was ready to look at that critically until it was over.”

Not actually true – that march in London was the biggest ever; a large section of the population was highly suspicious of the official narrative – very different from today’ compliant acceptance.

Similarly with the protests against the Vietnam war in the 60s in both the US and here – with the episode in ‘The Post’ being followed up by the toppling of Nixon over Watergate.

We have gone backwards.


182 users made 1,096 comments today.

217Mark1, 59, 6, 0, 4, 17, 1, 17, 0, 9, 10, 1, 1, 1, 3, 5, 12, 1, 1, 10, 4, 0, 6, 14, 3, 5, 2, 2, 11, 2, 1, 2, 6
200annie25, 263, 2, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 4, 1, 8, 10, 5, 1, 8, 2, 0, 1, 1, 5, 5, 0, 3, 0, 0, 1, 13, 1, 4, 8, 16, 5, 22, 10, 1, 2, 7
184Cheezilla4, 67, 3, 3, 1, 6, 2, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 3, 3, 2, 1, 1, 0, 1, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 4, 5, 2, 2, 1, 1, 0, 3, 14, 0, 1, 0, 1, 7, 1, 0, 10, 6, 6, 4, 1, 1, 43, 1, 0, 0, 1, 4, 15
177Bart Simpson3, 7, 0, 3, 0, 0, 1, 2, 2, 6, 0, 18, 3, 6, 68, 5, 14, 6, 3, 8, 3, 1, 9, 2, 4, 3
170Tyneside Tigress58, 13, 4, 10, 11, 0, 7, 10, 3, 6, 11, 7, 17, 3, 9, 2, 14, 11, 2, 0, 11, 0, 6
149Two-Six1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 2, 4, 0, 4, 0, 0, 2, 25, 2, 1, 7, 2, 0, 10, 12, 1, 13, 0, 0, 35, 3, 0, 4, 3, 5, 3, 3, 3, 3
134Nick Rose0, 0, 1, 2, 3, 7, 1, 7, 9, 6, 0, 5, 1, 4, 7, 0, 3, 16, 8, 0, 4, 0, 3, 7, 1, 0, 2, 2, 3, 2, 2, 4, 10, 2, 3, 2, 3, 2, 2
132Sam Vimes5, 5, 10, 36, 9, 12, 1, 3, 14, 3, 6, 5, 17, 0, 1, 5
132Basics13, 2, 4, 0, 1, 5, 13, 11, 1, 0, 9, 1, 7, 3, 4, 3, 1, 18, 1, 2, 9, 12, 2, 9, 1
126Lockdown_Lunacy19, 2, 9, 16, 5, 7, 3, 3, 1, 0, 38, 11, 4, 3, 5
115Victoria26, 15, 0, 15, 12, 10, 0, 1, 1, 4, 1, 12, 3, 1, 1, 3, 4, 6
111Ethelred the Unready30, 19, 30, 0, 2, 1, 5, 4, 1, 9, 10
105IanE9, 3, 12, 4, 1, 3, 1, 3, 2, 30, 3, 4, 4, 6, 5, 8, 1, 0, 0, 0, 3, 3
98Harry hopkins21, 26, 1, 39, 3, 8
98Farinances3, 3, 1, 0, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 12, 0, 0, 5, 2, 28, 2, 6, 2, 25, 1, 0
96Tenchy2, 3, 6, 1, 6, 0, 9, 1, 15, 41, 3, 4, 1, 4
89CarrieAH2, 2, 77, 3, 5
84Margaret5, 1, 1, 7, 8, 9, 4, 1, 2, 3, 7, 12, 13, 1, 10
81Nobody20204, 22, 1, 4, 6, 6, 2, 2, 13, 0, 5, 1, 1, 0, 6, 0, 2, 6
76IMoz0, 0, 2, 5, 9, 4, 1, 15, 1, 8, 2, 14, 4, 4, 7, 0
73Awkward Git37, 6, 2, 3-1, 4, 6, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 15
72Sue2, 8, 25, 4, 2, 3, 7, 8, 4, 6, 1, 2
64mjr114, 0, 2, 0, 16, 15, 0, 3, 0, 12, 1
64RickH0, 7, 4, 7, 9, 8, 3, 2, 14, 0, 1, 3, 0, 1, 0, 5, 0
64Dave #KBF73, 3, 2, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 5, 16, 2, 5, 0, 2, 3, 5, 8
59richard riewer0, 0, 0, 5, 8, 1, 4, 4, 5, 0, 1, 0, 0, 12, 5, 11, 3
58arfurmo49, 9
58Bella3, 0, 0, 0, 3, 14, 19, 3, 2, 5, 9
57Barney McGrew0, 6, 2, 16, 25, 8
57Tom Blackburn2, 13, 3, 9, 0, 2, 0, 5, 13, 6, 1, 1, 0, 2
55nfw111, 7, 0, 0, 1, 19, 16
54Tangelo40, 4, 10
53Hammer Onats53
51FiFiTrixabelle19, 1, 0, 31
51Biker0, 0, 17, 29, 5, 0
51swedenborg26, 4, 7, 2, 4, 18, 4, 4
49Steve Martindale43, 6
49TJN25, 3, 1, 0, 1, 10, 9
48OKUK2112, 1, 3, 1, 0, 0, 3, 1, 1, 5
46Poppy0, 38, 1, 7
45Mr Dee8, 5, 1, 4, 10, 0, 9, 5, 3, 0
44AngloWelshDragon3, 0, 10, 2, 29
42DJ Dod17, 25
42GLT41, 1
41matt6, 3, 0, 13, 19
41stefarm1311, 1, 6, 6, 2, 0, 2
41Steeve151, 0, 8, 0, 0, 6, 1, 2, 2, 0, 2, 2, 2
40DRW49, 0, 1, 12, 0, 2, 12
40Sarigan19, 2, 7, 11, 9, 1, 0
39Moomin0, 31, 8
38Paul E38
38Ben Shirley1226
38stewart15, 7, 16
38PoshPanic0, 6, 1, 1, 0, 11, 1, 5, 1, 0, 5, 0, 7
36karenovirus4, 4, 2, 8, 8, 5, 1, 4, 0
35Paul25, 5, 5
35Simon17, 13, 5
35Major Panic1, 15, 0, 13, 4, 2
35DavidC2, 0, 3, 1, 16, 0, 13
35Julian7, 4, 2, 1, 0, 6, 5, 2, 3, 5
33Jay Berger4, 5, 6, 0, 2, 2, 1, 2, 3, 6, 2
32T. Prince11, 6, 3, 3, 9
31Derek Toyne31
31RDawg26, 4, 1
31Edward23, 3, 1, 1, 2, 0, 1
30James00710, 4, 7, 5, 4
30Mark II5, 2, 6, 9, 1, 6, 0, 1, 0
30Ned of the Hills7, 2, 0, 1, 4, 1, 1, 4, 9, 1, 0, 0, 0
29HawkAnalyst13, 4, 2, 5, 2, 1, 4, 3, 4, 0
28Judith Day28
28John B6, 22
28BecJT0, 21, 3, 0, 2, 2
28JulieR0, 0, 1, 2, 5, 6, 4, 10
27Bugle0, 1, 0, 20, 0, 1, 5
26Lms234, 4, 1, 4, 5, 8
25JohnB1, 8, 16
24AN other lockdown sceptic34, 17
23Nigel Sherratt7, 8, 8
23Jonathan Palmer8, 5, 6, 1, 1, 2
20nottingham692, 18
20ambwozere2, 5, 9, 4
18HelzBelz3, 10, 5
18Jaguarpig5, 13, 0
17steve5, 12
17Mark B6, 3, 8
16Cicatriz7, 2, 7
16Felice0, 5, 8, 3
15Howie593, 12
14Nic6, 8
13Jonathan Castro2, 11
13Dave Tee6, 4, 3
13MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG4, 3, 4, 1, 1
12jim j12
12Ewan Duffy0, 0, 9, 2, 0, 1
11mhcp5, -3, 3, 3, 3, 0
10Bill Hickling10
10court1, 9
10Cruella8, 2
9Chicot5, 4
9Bruno5, 3, 0, 1
8microdave1, 0, 1, 6
8Jane0, 2, 3, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1
7Kelly deacons7
7Martin Spencer7
7Paul M7
7Simon Dutton7
7Bella Donna0, 7
7Country Mumkin1, 6
7Drawde9275, 2
7tonyspurs2, 5
7Lisa from Toronto2, 2, 3
7Lockdown Truth2, 3, 2
6Will6, 0, 0
5bluemoon1, 1, 3
5Edna4, 0, 1
5PWL01, 4
4helenf4, 0
3The Spingler3
3James Leary #KBF0, 4, -1
2Chris John2
2Digital Nomad2
2Old Bill2
2Catherine1232, 0, 0
2JohnB0, 1, 1
1Catherine Young1
1gina1, 0
1Keen Cook0, 1
0A. Contrarian0
0Crazy Hoarse0
0Fed up0
0Humanity First0
0Ken Turner0
0M Hopkirk0
0Newmill Mark0
0Snake Oil Pussy0
0Strange Days0
0Michael0, 0
0Paul Mendelsohn00
0Jane in France0, 0, 0
0Proudtobeapeasant00, 0, 0
0Hugh0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0
0etgttghetheth4th4ht4eh0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0
-69hotrod-29, 2, -12, -19, -9, -8, 1, 5