Last updated2020-08-21T10:51:58



97011 MaxPower, replying to MaxPower, 65, #1 of 1374 🔗

That Headteacher should not be overseeing our children’s’ education

97027 ▶▶ Gtec, replying to MaxPower, 12, #2 of 1374 🔗

He shouldn’t be in education; probably better suited to HR!

97042 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Gtec, 30, #3 of 1374 🔗

I think he’s more suited to being a sadistic prison warden.

97061 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bella Donna, 22, #4 of 1374 🔗

He needs to be one of the inmates

97143 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bobblybob, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 13, #5 of 1374 🔗

He’s a CEO of an academy, unlikely he has any teaching qualifications.

97255 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Bella Donna, 8, #6 of 1374 🔗

Just being in prison would do.

97335 ▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to annie, 8, #7 of 1374 🔗

The growth of kerrchingg! academies has correlated with the elevation of a lot of dodos with sharp suits and pointy shoes to headship.- now often entitled with pseudo-management terms such as ‘chief executive’.

There idea of education is that of a baked bean factory with trendy slogans on the wall.

97327 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Bella Donna, 4, #8 of 1374 🔗

He is a sadistic prison warden, disguised as an educator.

97102 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to MaxPower, 54, #9 of 1374 🔗

If you read the full article in the Mirror he sounds like he’s using the opportunity to score some political hits against Tories (deserved, to be fair) and couldn’t give a shit about the kids at his school.

His entire newsletter might as well be a Labour public broadcast, not once does he talk about the mental welfare of children, exemptions, possible negative effects of masking, the actual risk they face (or lack therefore, more to the point) – it’s just all about taking digs at gov and feeling smug about himself. Really shocking stuff, the guy should be removed from his post immediately, he is a danger to others.

97157 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to MaxPower, 39, #10 of 1374 🔗

I just read the full article. I’m now incandescent with rage. That headmaster is an absolute arsehole of the highest order – and he’s on a salary of £140k, one of the largest in the country.

97263 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Tenchy, 16, #11 of 1374 🔗

and he’s on a salary of £140k, one of the largest in the country.”

That’ll be why he’s a Labour supporter.

97340 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Lucan Grey, -6, #12 of 1374 🔗

No – the kerrrching! factor is an embedded Tory policy – quite forseeable in its results..

97377 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Lucan Grey, 4, #13 of 1374 🔗

Petty point scoring you Lord Lucan, will only have the government smiling. Did you ever hear of “divide and rule”. Well of course you did, but you decided to take no notice.

97270 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Tenchy, 5, #14 of 1374 🔗

Bet he doesn’t live in Bletchley, or anywhere else he might be within punching range of a dad.

97207 ▶▶ Sceptic-on-Sea, replying to MaxPower, 27, #15 of 1374 🔗


The man is insane.

Young kids are really good at calling out idiocy when they see it. Lots of children will refuse to muzzle up and as for the 2 metre rule… good luck with that one!

My little one went back to school in June. Social distancing and bubbling died that first day, the teachers soon gave up trying to police the impossible.

I’d love to be a fly on the wall in Mr Harrison’s school a few days in, I have a feeling things will not be going to plan.

97260 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to MaxPower, 6, #16 of 1374 🔗

Calls himself a ceo. Ffs.

There’s only 1 photo of the scrote on googleimages – very suspicious.

97474 ▶▶ PWL, replying to MaxPower, 2, #17 of 1374 🔗

But God forbid that parents do it, right?

97547 ▶▶ Riffman, replying to MaxPower, 5, #18 of 1374 🔗

I don’t use this word lightly.. he is a c..t!

98083 ▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Riffman, #19 of 1374 🔗

That’s a terrible insult to an ingenious, elegant and joyous thing.

97552 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to MaxPower, 9, #20 of 1374 🔗

The parents all individually need to go to the police and report him for assault on their children. Or harm with intent. Or causing actual bodily harm. I am sure there are several offences which relate. There is a very good and active parents organisation in Germany which is fighting attempts to introduce masks in schools.

97762 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to MaxPower, 4, #21 of 1374 🔗

It’s child abuse pure and simple. He should be in jail.

98402 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to MaxPower, 2, #22 of 1374 🔗

Too many red marxists infiltrated the establishments now

97031 Stephen, replying to Stephen, 61, #23 of 1374 🔗

Cath Noakes clearly needs to get out more.

The picture of a school operating like that is inhuman. What we are doing is very misguided and very sad.

97037 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Stephen, 37, #24 of 1374 🔗

Misguided and sad doesn’t cut it. Criminally insane is more fitting.

97235 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Bella Donna, 2, #25 of 1374 🔗

Yes, yes, yes

97380 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Bella Donna, 3, #26 of 1374 🔗

Psychopathic, might be better.

97227 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Stephen, 2, #27 of 1374 🔗

I was just reading her tweets and comments when it suddenly flashed up that they were protected. Has she just done this?

97035 Bella Donna, replying to Bella Donna, 29, #28 of 1374 🔗

Great cartoon!

DT readers are finally waking up to the Covid scam. Bojo is getting a right kicking, deservedly so. A couple of the comments blame NHS and PHE but overwhelmingly Bojo and Hancock are in the firing line

Has anyone discovered if Bojo has gone on holiday to Greece yet if he reads the DT he might not want to come back.

97192 ▶▶ Klein, replying to Bella Donna, 25, #29 of 1374 🔗

One comment with over 200 upvotes:

” Boris has blown it. The eminent people who said he was an untrustworthy vacuum were right, sadly. I voted for him as a lifelong Tory but never again, ”


97366 ▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Klein, 2, #30 of 1374 🔗

Me too, what twats .

97384 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Jaguarpig, 11, #31 of 1374 🔗

Johnson and Hancock are simply doing what Gates wants them to do. Compulsory genocidal vaccine is coming, if these “twats” think they can get away with it.

97480 ▶▶▶ PWL, replying to Klein, -6, #32 of 1374 🔗

Of course, the grossly stupid still think that theirs is an opinion worth sharing.

97338 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Bella Donna, 6, #33 of 1374 🔗

Quarantine him for an undetermined length of time upon his return.

97367 ▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to richard riewer, 7, #34 of 1374 🔗

On the end of a rope

98064 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Jaguarpig, 1, #35 of 1374 🔗

I think that all these pro lockdown folks should all be compelled to live in a Greta Thunberg/Extincition Rebellion/Public Health England/Green World for a year or two.

97767 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to richard riewer, 1, #36 of 1374 🔗

Preferably at the Tower of London. He can be another visitor attraction.

97052 watashi, replying to watashi, 5, #37 of 1374 🔗

Good morning all. Any happy stories to share? I could do with a dose of positivity today.

97063 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to watashi, 14, #38 of 1374 🔗

I’ve just taken my car into the garage. No indication of the covid cult. No tape, signs, perspex, masks, sanitiser. Had a lovely chat about my car and the fixing of with the owner. Lovely.

Oh, almost full maskage on the bus 😒

97092 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to stefarm, 11, #39 of 1374 🔗

Same yesterday in main dealership, neither office or workshop staff or customers in waiting room masked up.

97117 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to karenovirus, 12, #40 of 1374 🔗

I had a different experience.The sales staff were all unmasked but no tea or handshakes.One of the backroom staff came to get my driving licence and wouldn’t touch it.I had to place it on a piece of paper.When he returned it he held it on said paper and let it slide onto the desk.Surreal

97133 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #41 of 1374 🔗

Yeah, they had removed the coffee maker, apart from that pretty good.

97203 ▶▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to karenovirus, 10, #42 of 1374 🔗

We had our septic tank emptied yesterday, and a very pleasant chap. Had a great chat on our past expat experiences in the Middle East, needless to say in his line of work surrounded by bacteria, there was no social distancing or masks during our exchange.

97259 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Nsklent, 5, #43 of 1374 🔗

septic tank workers, they LOVE IT…lol

Most people these days look they ARE septic tank workers.

97332 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian S, replying to Nsklent, 5, #44 of 1374 🔗

And here you are today, in the sceptic tank!

98472 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Nsklent, #45 of 1374 🔗

🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣 Great story You’d think in his line of work he’d be in a full hazmet suit wouldn’t you?

97391 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to stefarm, 19, #46 of 1374 🔗

Masks wearers are a very real problem. These compliant people are giving the government enough confidence to do something yet more stupid. Making vaccination, with Gates’s hardly tested genocidal brew, compulsory is something HMG will try to do, if it thinks the public is just too dumb to resist being culled.

97064 ▶▶ Julian, replying to watashi, 25, #47 of 1374 🔗

Not many I’m afraid. Our plumber is a hardcore sceptic, though he does also believe people are being turned into lizards. Actually, thinking about the BS we see spouted, maybe he’s not that far wrong….

97088 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to watashi, 33, #48 of 1374 🔗

I saw 4 unmasked shoppers in Aldi last night. First time I have seen a bare face in there. I felt utterly joyful and grinned idiotically at them all!

97155 ▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to Charlie Blue, 14, #49 of 1374 🔗

We went to Morrison’s late on a Sat. night no one on door ,being later not a great many shoppers a few without masks staff , some masked others not, and hearing a Capt. Beefheart track being played! had a great chat with a bloke restocking the veg. about the Capt. Of course he pulled down his mask to chat!

97344 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to David Grimbleby, 4, #50 of 1374 🔗

My brothers and I saw The Yardbirds with Jimmy Page and Captain Beefheart’s Magic Band at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium (former home of the Oscars) in 1966. Safe as Milk. Zig Zag Wanderer. He turned to painting later in his life.

97425 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to richard riewer, 1, #51 of 1374 🔗

Jealous. Did you get to Monterey Pop, Richard ?

98075 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to JohnB, 1, #52 of 1374 🔗

No, but I saw Cream with my two brothers at the Whisky A Go Go on Sunset Boulevard, Hollywood, September4th, 1967:

97817 ▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to richard riewer, 1, #53 of 1374 🔗

Weird, I was listening to strictly personal the other day.

97897 ▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to David Grimbleby, 1, #54 of 1374 🔗

I saw the great Captain & his Magic Band in 1974, supported by Henry Cow.
…..for a minute I thought I was on the John Peel group on Facebook.

97305 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Charlie Blue, 8, #55 of 1374 🔗

My local Aldi had several unmuzzled shoppers on Wednesday evening. Usually it’s just me.

97307 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #56 of 1374 🔗

Grinning at people is the best antidote we’ve got.

97094 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to watashi, 36, #57 of 1374 🔗

The normal pub I mentioned a while ago that closed due to a non-local snitch complaining is back open as before due to local pressure. A big win.

97258 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Sarigan, 7, #58 of 1374 🔗

Drop the snitch down a well. A deep one.

97309 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to annie, 7, #59 of 1374 🔗

Annie, for a devout Christian there’s something very Old Testament about you ……

97575 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #60 of 1374 🔗

Those are the best kind of Christians…

97267 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Sarigan, 2, #61 of 1374 🔗


97103 ▶▶ Lorenzo Basso, replying to watashi, 35, #62 of 1374 🔗

On Tuesday I met up with an old colleague who greeted me with a handshake and hug, and I quickly realised he was sceptical about this whole business as well. Very heartening.

Last night I visited a local country pub. Everything was delightfully normal – not a sign of test and trace, perspex, tape, stickers or one-way systems. I thanked the landlord for providing such a haven of normality amongst all the madness. I will be going back.

97110 ▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Lorenzo Basso, #63 of 1374 🔗

Did it happen to be anywhere in warwickshire?

97314 ▶▶▶▶ Lorenzo Basso, replying to watashi, 8, #64 of 1374 🔗

Sadly it’s in Hertfordshire. We should set up a database of sensible pubs!

98489 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Lorenzo Basso, #65 of 1374 🔗

The danger with announcing where they are is some vindictive snitch will inform on them and they’ll be closed down.

98485 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Lorenzo Basso, #66 of 1374 🔗

I know of a pub where they don’t bother with these silly rules but it’s 70 miles away!!

97134 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to watashi, 10, #67 of 1374 🔗

Happy stories – I guess taking my step-daughter for her first haircut in 6 months is a happy story? Well she was very happy anyway. My step-son’s got into University, despite the fact he was cheated of finishing his College course back in March. Very happy! And his Uni doesn’t seem to be heavy on the social-distancing by the looks of their FAQs on their website – they’re doing all they can, it seems, to make the Uni experience as fun and exciting as possible in September, despite restrictions.

97149 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to watashi, 12, #68 of 1374 🔗

Got my tyres changed on Monday. The mechanics weren’t too bothered about masks and whatnot. The guy at the front desk was wearing one for appearance’s sake, as far as i can tell, but didn’t tell any customer that they needed masks or anything. Once you get past all the things they have to do, like put up signs about facemask, it was actually a pretty normal experience.
Now, if i only hadn’t ordered Goodyear tyres, that would have been great…

97176 ▶▶ EllGee, replying to watashi, 18, #69 of 1374 🔗

Went for breakfast in the local cafe. No masks and the only sign was “Remember we don’t have a card machine”. Saw the local shop had the no mask, we don’t ask, poster up. The builder at home, which was why a breakfast out day, punctuated the banging with his views on the total stupidity of everything that was happening. Nearly 1.00 pm, was out for three hours, and didn’t see one mask

97254 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to watashi, 4, #70 of 1374 🔗

I went to the pub last night my favourite local ever and it was…..fairly normal. Phew. There was a fair ground in the park. Nice to see and hear but it was a socially distanced faircround, book in advance, fenced off site, masked up security guard at the gate and “keep two seats apart, scream if you wanna go faster!” The riders weren’t wearing face masks and neither were the ride operators. Your £10 ticket bought unlimited rides. Phew….

97427 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Two-Six, 4, #71 of 1374 🔗

Screaming is allowed? Good heavens, where were the police?

97453 ▶▶ James Bertram, replying to watashi, 9, #72 of 1374 🔗

Went to hospital consultant a few days ago. This was a real test of my resolve, for I had waited a year for this appointment and didn’t want to blow it by not wearing one of those disgusting face-things. Fretted about it a week.
So, that morning, I decided to ring the hospital department to see how the land lied. I said ‘I don’t wear a mask’ (I didn’t say ‘I’m exempt’ – too yellow star for me).
Sweet girl at the other end – ‘No problem’ she said; ‘just speak with the person on the door then, if you want, you can wait outside and we’ll come and get you; but if you want to wait in the waiting area, no problem.’
So I just turned up; but there was a mask-Nazi on the door who was about to say I need a mask. ‘Don’t wear one’, I interrupted. ‘Girl on reception says to come in. I have an appointment with … – at… ‘ And am overheard – another door person (much to the Nazi’s disgust) says ‘Hello Mr Bertram, we are expecting you. I’ll show you to the waiting room.’ It was easy as that. No need to worry at all.
So my advice to all in a similar situation is to telephone the reception in advance, say you don’t wear a mask, and ask if they have any special arrangement for you to attend, such as turning up a bit early.
Good luck.

98498 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to James Bertram, #73 of 1374 🔗

That’s good to know. Thanks.

97774 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to watashi, 1, #74 of 1374 🔗

More unmuzzled fellow passengers in my carriage on the way back home from work. Its been slow and uneven but it seems to be steady.

97827 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to watashi, #75 of 1374 🔗

Sorry, I’m a bit late. Yesterday had a lovely afternoon with my neighbours, in a pub garden. The pub was totally cool and unfussy, no taking of details either. And our neighbours who were very scared of covid in the beginning, have now turned tail and see it for what it really is. We walked through the park and had coffee at the cafe – loads of people enjoying the sun, no naps. Then walking through town – loads of napless walking around. So all in all a good time.

97055 Drawde927, replying to Drawde927, 23, #76 of 1374 🔗

A few good reads on AIER (American Institute for Economic Research) recently:




AIER has been one of the best sources of reasoned, in-depth sceptical analysis of the current madness, especially from a political, economic and social angle. The first two, especially, are a good attempt at trying to figure out why so many governments have rushed to implement the same measures worldwide, and keeping them going against all the evidence.

They’re written from a US-focused perspective, but a lot of the points apply to the UK and the rest of the world!

98045 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to Drawde927, #77 of 1374 🔗

AIER has had a lot of good stfuf since the start.

97056 karenovirus, 4, #78 of 1374 🔗

Zero Covid Deaths In English Hospitals Yesterday

Local Live Online editor had better be awake or their copy will read
“None of the deaths occurred in XXXX county or XXXX county next door.” as per every day for 8 weeks.

97057 Mark, replying to Mark, 56, #79 of 1374 🔗

that was the riskiest thing I’ve done in a long while ” !!!?

Literally incredible. The fact that such a statement could come from a professor, and someone who is on the board of supposed “experts” advising the government on policy in response to the now passed epidemic, is both astonishing and a very good explanation for how we came to be in the mess we are in.

If the “professor” (as I think we must term someone making such a stupid statement on such an important issue) is in fact a safety obsessed neurotic, then I suppose it could theoretically be true that going for lunch in a restaurant could be “the riskiest thing she has done” for a while, but her biggest risks would be things like food poisoning, getting mugged or involved in a traffic accident on the way there or back, etc. Catching covid, let alone suffering serious consequences, would be well down the list, among other vanishingly small risks ordinarily routinely ignored, such as getting struck by lightning or having a tree branch fall on her head..

97065 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Mark, 35, #80 of 1374 🔗

Wankers, all of them!

97084 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to stefarm, 35, #81 of 1374 🔗

Cowardly wankers.

It’s not cowardly to feel fear. It is cowardly to let fear override your reason, which is what they have done.

97066 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark, 4, #82 of 1374 🔗

Do you think she believes what she is saying to be true?

97081 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Julian, 26, #83 of 1374 🔗

Seems unlikely to be something she wrote as propaganda. Possible in theory, but even less plausible I think than the idea she actually is that irrational, because I see educated, intelligent people all the time in my social circles who are that dominated by irrational fear.

The fact is that the fearmongering has been omnipresent and highly effective, and fear is, indeed, the mind killer. It is just as dangerous to reason and to rationality as we were always told. And once you have stopped reasoning, it doesn’t matter a whit how intelligent or educated you are.

97097 ▶▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Mark, 13, #84 of 1374 🔗

Have an uptick for the Bene Gesserit “fear is the mind killer” reference.

97152 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Liam, 18, #85 of 1374 🔗

True wisdom, as we have just had demonstrated very forcefully to the whole world, from the Bene Gesserit (ok, ok, from Frank Herbert).

Not the only person to have warned us against the very trap the entire wold just fell into. We can hardly claim we weren’t warned:

“Fear is an insidious and deadly thing. It can warp judgment, freeze reflexes, breed mistakes. Worse, it’s contagious.”
Jimmy Stewart (a wartime bomber pilot as well as an actor)

“Fear is a distorting mirror in which anything can appear as a caricature of itself, stretched to terrible proportions; once inflamed, the imagination pursues the craziest and most unlikely possibilities. What is most absurd suddenly seems the most probable.”
Stefan Zweig

“Of all the liars in the world, sometimes the worst are our own fears.”
Rudyard Kipling

“We are more often frightened than hurt; and we suffer more from imagination than from reality.”
— Seneca

“No power so effectually robs the mind of all its powers of acting and reasoning as fear.”
— Edmund Burke

97173 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Mark, 4, #86 of 1374 🔗

Great, thanks for these.

97217 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mr Bee, replying to Liam, 2, #87 of 1374 🔗

Fear – false evidence appearing real!

97215 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to Mark, 8, #88 of 1374 🔗

Stefan Zweig was a wonderful writer. Beware of Pity is one of my favourite novels.

Check out the reviews!


I’m reading a lot more fiction now and minimising the time I waste on the news, since most of it is insultingly transparent propaganda anyway. (Hello, BBC!) Entering the world of an absorbing novel is very good for the psyche; not escapism, but a refreshing retreat from Covidmania. Ditto listening to great music.

97371 ▶▶▶▶▶ DJC, replying to Liam, 2, #89 of 1374 🔗

I’ve thought as well that Covid has been like a global Gom Jabbar, revealing the humans from the animals.

97147 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark, 6, #90 of 1374 🔗

Well I find it easier to believe she wrote it as propaganda than think she is stupid enough to actually believe what she said.

97153 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Julian, 1, #91 of 1374 🔗

Motivation is always the hardest thing to be sure of, it could certainly be either. But which is worse for us, in its implications?

97162 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark, 3, #92 of 1374 🔗

Both are bad, but if she knows it’s BS then it’s much worse for us because that means she is pursuing an evil agenda and not just a victim of her own fears, which she could be possibly talked out of

97680 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Mark, #93 of 1374 🔗

Both are are likely bad for the rest of us.

97271 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Julian, 11, #94 of 1374 🔗

Intelligence seems to have nothing to do with Civid mania. The latter effortlessly overrides the former.
That’s why we constantly find ourselves howling ‘WHAT’S WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?’ They aren’t people any more. They have surrendered ‘their fair judgement, without which we are pictures, or mere beasts’.

97677 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Julian, 1, #95 of 1374 🔗

That is my view, either way though, she is a dangerous pos.

97617 ▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Mark, 6, #96 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I see many much more intelligent and better educated people than me (in STEM subjects!!) unable to assess the risk. It is not about logic, common sense or intelligence. I’m still thinking about what it is really about …. maybe fear of death, suggestibility, inability to think critically, desire to conform. Who knows but I see so many people who really should do better obsessing about bubbles, rules and God knows what else.

97670 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Mark, 2, #97 of 1374 🔗

You may be right, but no matter. She is either dangerous or dangerous and stupid. Either way we need rid of her.

97278 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Julian, 5, #98 of 1374 🔗

Good question…Yes. Or she is virtue signalling her compliance to the cult of covid

97323 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, 5, #99 of 1374 🔗

Her words stink of virtue signalling.

97661 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Julian, #100 of 1374 🔗

As a part of the official Covid psyop, she has to do, what she has to do. I wonder how she managed to eat her meal while wearing her mask.

98046 ▶▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to Julian, 1, #101 of 1374 🔗

Having worked with and to several similar personalities in similar positions, I have no doubt she is genuine, if a little condescending. I think she expects her readers to be even more scared than she is. The main problem is that like all SAGE members she has a significant personal investment in the current situation, just like a general who can neve understand why people want wars to end.
Note that she is utterly protected economically from the lockdown and has gained a strong sense of self-importance from her position. Would anyone be following her before 2020? Now she has an audience of the worried we’ll to nurture. Vanity can be a strong driver.

97073 ▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Mark, 20, #102 of 1374 🔗

Last year I turned 40. In the midst of my midlife crisis I decided to take up skateboarding.
Turns out I’ve been doing more risky things than that by going to pubs, restaurants and church. If I’d known that last year I would have maybe left the skateboard thing alone.

97078 ▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Ed Phillips, 1, #103 of 1374 🔗

How`s the skateboarding going? are you any good? have you
mastered any tricks?

97099 ▶▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to watashi, #104 of 1374 🔗

It’s going all right. No tricks yet. In February I could do an ollie. Then I lost the knack and can’t get it back.

97135 ▶▶▶▶▶ A Heretic, replying to Ed Phillips, 11, #105 of 1374 🔗

tomorrow’s headline: “Thanks to covid, Ed can no longer do an ollie”

97389 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to A Heretic, 3, #106 of 1374 🔗

Sounds like the caption of a Gary Larson cartoon 🙂

97086 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Ed Phillips, 13, #107 of 1374 🔗

Yes, real thrill-seekers go to restaurants where people don’t wear masks now, it seems.

97163 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Mark, 6, #108 of 1374 🔗


97129 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Ed Phillips, 1, #109 of 1374 🔗

Ha! Cool!

97224 ▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Ed Phillips, 2, #110 of 1374 🔗

Much respect. Inspirational stuff. I considered taking skateboarding up when I was 30 but decided that I was far too clumsy. Since then though, cycling and skiing has resulted in four trips to A&E and two surgeries! Maybe I should reconsider skateboarding now that I’m 50 ….

97363 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Ed Phillips, 4, #111 of 1374 🔗

There’s a skateboard park two streets from where I live, just under the Jacques Cartier Bridge. It was enclosed by a metal chain link fence from April to July. A basketball court just a five minute bicycle ride away from my apartment was also closed to the public. WTF!

97424 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to richard riewer, 3, #112 of 1374 🔗

The public that doesn’t own any wirecutters ?

97108 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, 7, #113 of 1374 🔗

When she gave evidence before the House of Commons Science and Technology Committee in May, she stated that the science for the two metre social distancing rule was the precautionary principle.

97131 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, 15, #114 of 1374 🔗

In other words, no science.

Though in fact, of course, we all know the truth behind the 2m rule imposition because an insider spilled the beans months ago:


“Prof Dingwall said he had been told by a senior public health specialist that “we knew it was one metre but we doubled it to two because we did not think the British population would understand what one metre was and we could not trust them to observe it so we doubled it to be on the safe side”.”

97144 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, 11, #115 of 1374 🔗

The one metre World Health Organisation recommendation was equally just made up.

97128 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Mark, 16, #116 of 1374 🔗

It’s all incremental but stuff like this brings people onside as it is clearly ludicrous. What worries me is the hardcore shitbags who hear this and double down on their fear. It all goes back to the SAGE m̶i̶n̶d̶ ̶c̶o̶n̶t̶r̶o̶l̶ behavioural science from March. In trying to illicit change in the “complacent”, they failed to consider the impact the “hard-hitting emotional messaging” would have on the non-complacent.

If nothing else, these scientists are very, very clumsy.

97137 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Mark, 15, #117 of 1374 🔗

Risk assessment.
We have a busy main road that narrows to go under a railway bridge, on one side there is no pavement, on the other is a narrow tunnel for Pedestrians.
Last year a woman was crushed to death trying to walk the non pavements side.
Council put up barriers and signs trying to stop people doing that, there are pedestrian crossings nearby either side of the bridge.
4 young women are huddled around the sign having evaded the barrier , waiting for a gap in traffic to dash through.

They are all wearing masks in the open.

They are not the only ones because they have come from nearby Aldi, Iceland or Matalan

97296 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to karenovirus, 4, #118 of 1374 🔗

crazy…really crazy

97284 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Mark, 7, #119 of 1374 🔗

It also says a lot for the life she has lived so far, it must have been as boring as watching paint dry. What a total muppet. Risks? It’s just amazing I am still here. So many close calls with the grim reaper I have lost count.

97339 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Mark, 1, #120 of 1374 🔗

I hope the twitter replies were strong.

97350 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Mark, #121 of 1374 🔗

A low threshold for risk.

97420 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Mark, 1, #122 of 1374 🔗

She wrote that for attention. That’s it.

97439 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Mark, 7, #123 of 1374 🔗

When AIDS first loomed on the horizon it took forever for the ‘safe sex’ message to get across. Nobody I knew was practising it then and condoms were not an ubiquitous thing in the eighties. If this woman had been around then she would probably have put a padlock on her vagina and campaigned for mandatory celibacy.

97449 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Mark, 11, #124 of 1374 🔗

This is the inevitable consequence of decades of the relentless advance of health and safety policies. We have become risk intolerant (as a society).

Most of us on here, for example, grew up riding in the back of our parent’s cars without seat belts and here we are. And yet, most children today not only don’t need to be told to buckle up, but will feel extremely uneasy if they’re not strapped in. And parents of course could get into some serious trouble for it.

It’s a different world and it’s going to get worse. I expect at this rate in a decade or two contracting any sort of cold or flu will be intolerable. We will be so thoroughly tracked, traced and vaccinated that people will be terrified at the prospect of contracting any sort of respiratory infection.

We (sceptics) are all fast becoming relics I fear.

97075 Hoppy Uniatz, replying to Hoppy Uniatz, 18, #125 of 1374 🔗

Apologies if anyone posted this yesterday – a splendid Spanish doctor explains to newsreaders why they are misrepresenting the covid narrative


97279 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Hoppy Uniatz, 2, #126 of 1374 🔗

yes – it was referenced by Toby yesterday and links also posted on here several times. Definitely worth a watch and worth repeating for those that missed it

97076 watashi, 6, #127 of 1374 🔗
97096 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 31, #128 of 1374 🔗

I watched a television advertisement earlier today. It contained images of people wearing masks. The voice-over asserted: This is not a mask. It is freedom. This is not a mask. It is solidarity. The closest the so called advertisement actually came to trying to sell me something was at the end when the word Vistaprint appeared.

97100 ▶▶ watashi, replying to Steve Hayes, 11, #129 of 1374 🔗

Best to avoid all tell-lie-vision I find. Thanks for the heads up
though, I have used vistaprint in the past.

97101 ▶▶ Liam, replying to Steve Hayes, 35, #130 of 1374 🔗

War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength. We have always been at war with Eastasia.

97126 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Liam, 4, #131 of 1374 🔗

I was just to type that quote…

97170 ▶▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Mr Dee, #132 of 1374 🔗

Great minds.

97262 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Liam, 2, #133 of 1374 🔗

But does 2 + 2 = 4
(just testing)

97105 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to Steve Hayes, 6, #134 of 1374 🔗

Complain to them – I have.

97139 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Steve Hayes, 5, #135 of 1374 🔗

Corporations act as parasites in any situation which they can turn to their advertising advantage. It always makes me laugh that advertisers are called creatives.

97146 ▶▶ Fiat, replying to Steve Hayes, 9, #136 of 1374 🔗

We use Vistaprint for our annual family calendars. No more.

97275 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Fiat, 4, #137 of 1374 🔗

Make sure you let them know why!

97277 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Fiat, 2, #138 of 1374 🔗

Nor me.

97167 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Steve Hayes, 9, #139 of 1374 🔗

Work Shall Make You Free

97243 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Steve Hayes, 13, #140 of 1374 🔗

I saw that yesterday too – I thought it was government propaganda until vistaprint was mentioned at the end. My husband is currently reading 1984. Big Brother calls this doublethink – where 2 contradictory ideas are conflated into one. How can anyone think that freedom is achieved by restriction??

97385 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to CGL, 15, #141 of 1374 🔗

There is government propaganda in Quebec. I saw four large posters yesterday showing 30 something males and females wearing masks and looking defiant. One said Conviction. Another Solidarity. Another Courage.
This was a brand new government produced propaganda poster, subsidized by us, the taxpayers. At the bottom of the poster was this government’s motto ‘Votre Gouvernement’ (Your Government). Our Premier was marketing director for Quebecair. Now he’s marketing East Germany 2.0.

97783 ▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to richard riewer, 1, #142 of 1374 🔗

Blimey, that’s sinister!

97406 ▶▶▶ nat, replying to CGL, 2, #143 of 1374 🔗


97256 ▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Steve Hayes, 5, #144 of 1374 🔗

Another company to add to the boycott list!

97274 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Alec in France, 10, #145 of 1374 🔗

Sent them this short e mail

“Recently saw your nonsense advert on the TV re: the wearing of masks. Won’t be buying any more products from you”…

97336 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Steve Hayes, 5, #146 of 1374 🔗

Wow – boycott Vistaprint!

97528 ▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Cheezilla, 7, #147 of 1374 🔗

I just went on their website to find an email address. Was shocked to see that they are selling back-to-school kid-friendly masks. Seems they are also supporters of child abuse.

97752 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Steve Hayes, 2, #148 of 1374 🔗


I am off to for a run. The anger after watching that should see me a personal best

97948 ▶▶▶ DomW, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #149 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for that. I now know what to watch out for so I can imediately hit the mute button.

I’ve added my Thumbs Down, currently running at nearly 1000 more than the Ups

It could do with a few more I think 😉

97104 Bill Hickling, replying to Bill Hickling, 27, #150 of 1374 🔗

Words just fail me with that idiotic tweet from Sage member Cath Noakes! Does she really feel in danger in a restaurant? No wonder government is making stupid decisions with people like her advising them.

97124 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Bill Hickling, 17, #151 of 1374 🔗

I can recommend a restaurant for her where she’ll feel totally safe. There’s only room for one – no dirty other people – and it’s got soft padded walls. Lovely! Best of all, she’ll get regular meals, three times a day, spooned into her mouth by Nursie.

97138 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Mr Dee, 9, #152 of 1374 🔗

Two metre spoon, of course.

97302 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #153 of 1374 🔗

made of plastic, slipped under the locked door. Seriously this woman should not be allowed to give any more advice on anything of any importance ever again.

97390 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Mr Dee, 2, #154 of 1374 🔗

With a two metre spoon?

97381 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Bill Hickling, 2, #155 of 1374 🔗

I don’t understand why she went in the first place if she thinks it’s sooooo dangerous.

97119 ▶▶ NappyFace, replying to Sam Vimes, 11, #157 of 1374 🔗

You mean to say, COVID19 is not the deadliest pathogen to strike Homo sapiens in all our history?

97136 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to NappyFace, 8, #158 of 1374 🔗

It’s awful. I mean, the treatment involves… have to steel myself… being sent home!

97720 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to NappyFace, #159 of 1374 🔗

It never was. That was hype. And it did the trick.

97228 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sam Vimes, 11, #160 of 1374 🔗

Interesting that the Flu/Pneumonia are half what they are normally. Wonder how many of those were diagnosed as Covid in the absence of a test but in the presence of symptoms.

97266 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Sarigan, 3, #161 of 1374 🔗

The other half (at least)

97359 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #162 of 1374 🔗

Some good comments too.

97113 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 22, #163 of 1374 🔗

Now that all the chickens are coming home to roost, don’t you all feel the teeniest bit smug on here? Having to bite my tongue, when speaking with friends who thought I was the one who had got this completely wrong, is going to give me a lisp!

97115 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Margaret, 19, #164 of 1374 🔗

There are still too many entrenched zealots for my liking. Idiots who will not budge.

97168 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #165 of 1374 🔗

Set fire to them 😇

97322 ▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to Tom Blackburn, #166 of 1374 🔗

Pot commitment, as AIER recently established.

97118 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Margaret, 14, #167 of 1374 🔗

No, not smug. Just very, very sad that we were right. It’s not a great feeling. Back in March I hoped I’d be wrong, and that by the end of summer we’d be out of lockdown.

The ONLY way we can beat this is with the power of saying NO.

Even if it means being locked away for 6 months for hugging a friend.

Before we win, we will have to be prepared to suffer.

97507 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Mr Dee, 6, #168 of 1374 🔗

Similarly, definitely not smug, more like despair in that we turned out to be right but nobody in charge is listening, instead they’re just doubling down repeatedly with less and less excuse for it. The fear + compliance propaganda has also created a significant minority of people (probably a small minority of the overall population but a much bigger one in terms of online/social media presence) who are fully signed up to the official narrative and angrily denounce anything that seems to challenge it (this situation is a lot worse in the US)

In the UK, at least, it feels like the only way out of this is for people – from MPs down to ordinary citizens – to stand up to it. Businesses and charities also.

Maybe there will be some progress once Parliament starts up again next month. It seems totally crazy that they are allowed to take a “summer holiday” in this situation, but it’s another excuse to delay the day of judgement by a few more weeks at least…

The longer this goes on the worse the inevitable backlash/fightback will eventually be. But this Government seem to now be irrevocably committed to their attempt to keep up the narrative until a vaccine, they could have apologised and backed down a couple of months maybe, but now they’re just digging themselves an ever-deeper hole.

97712 ▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Mr Dee, #169 of 1374 🔗

First they laugh at you, then they hate you, then they fight you, then you win.
-David Icke.

97120 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Margaret, 4, #170 of 1374 🔗

But then they will still be trumpeting a second wave and long covid. I agree that a bit more of this sort of info emerging is very heartening, though.

97179 ▶▶ DespairSquid, replying to Margaret, 18, #171 of 1374 🔗

What I’m most worried about is that facts don’t seem to matter any more.

There have been so many “no clothes” moments and yet the reaction just seems to be to tweak the narrative (deaths -> cases etc) and apply yet more nonsensical authoritarian controls.

They are so lost in their cult of groupthink! What on earth is it going to take to make these idiots see sense?

97324 ▶▶▶ Jay Berger, replying to DespairSquid, 2, #172 of 1374 🔗

Judging by the example of Germans, only a complete, humiliating and absolutely obvious catastrophe.
Followed by another 30 years during which the then still influential collaborators and
denialists slowly pass away.

97189 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Margaret, 1, #173 of 1374 🔗

But they will say that if it hadn’t been for lockdown etc etc

97272 ▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Margaret, 5, #174 of 1374 🔗

The Covid paranoiacs I know (2 couples) are actually doubling down – “self isolation before the second wave…”.
I guess we won’t be meeting up soon (if ever).

97535 ▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Alec in France, 3, #175 of 1374 🔗

Jeez. I wonder if I should prepare myself for this from my family. I already find their brainwashed, believing everything they are fed by mainstream media state incredibly tiring and depressing. Wake up already!

97308 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Margaret, 3, #176 of 1374 🔗

I haven’t felt this yet but I sense the façade is cracking…..

97392 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Margaret, 2, #177 of 1374 🔗

Take your new found smugness to Trafalgar Square on the 29th of August.

97114 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 49, #178 of 1374 🔗

Right, fuck it.

Anybody who walks about wearing a disgusting mask deserves every boil, pimple, black head, yellow head, cold sore, chest infection, sinus infection, throat infection, cold, flu, fungal infection and virus.

Fucking idiots, line them and put them out of their misery.

Normally being in town I would have a mooch about, have a pint, read the paper. Buy some records, books or anything else that takes my fancy. No more. The government have been sly bastards, everyone you can go out but you have to dress up like an arsehole. Ha ha, as fat slob Boris and his advisors laugh at us from behind their keyboards. Hope he gets the shits whilst he is in Greece. Fat slob.

As I posted yesterday bovine like creatures being fattened up for the slaughterhouse.

I can see it in their eyes, the fear. Save me, the eyes say it. Demoralised or self-virtuouse. Take your pick.

Fuck off.

97123 ▶▶ Old Bill, replying to stefarm, 16, #179 of 1374 🔗

Boris has actually been quite clever about this. Hitler identified his supposed ememies by making them wear a Star of David, but in today’s pc society that would be discriminatory, but making everybody wear a ‘mask of covid’ cannot be deemed to be so yet serves the same purpose and still allows you to target the dissenters.

97140 ▶▶▶ NappyFace, replying to Old Bill, 6, #180 of 1374 🔗

Round up the COVID19 unbelievers and put them in re-education camps.

It’s for our own good…

97178 ▶▶▶▶ Old Bill, replying to NappyFace, 12, #181 of 1374 🔗

That wont be long in coming.

The new nazis – kind to animals, the planet and minorities, but no change on civil rights.

97285 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Old Bill, 3, #182 of 1374 🔗

A bit like in the old days: the AA man didn’t salute to warn of a speed trap.

97182 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to stefarm, 3, #183 of 1374 🔗

I applaud your articulation 👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻

97201 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Winston Smith, 8, #184 of 1374 🔗

Thank you, I’m here all week and can do weddings and christenings.

Oh, hold on a minute nobody can anymore

97281 ▶▶ Alec in France, replying to stefarm, 5, #185 of 1374 🔗

Hope they all get terminal Maskne – the DT’s name for the burgeoning bacterial/fungal infection of the muzzled area. Eugh!

97298 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Alec in France, 15, #186 of 1374 🔗

I am waiting for someone’s shaving cut or spot to get infected with MRSA from their mask and develop necrotising fasciitis and have their entire face EATEN OFF. Only something that dramatic will cure people of their mask-love and end this misery.

and it will happen …with millions wearing them, law of big numbers says it will

97301 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Sophie123, 8, #187 of 1374 🔗

You’re just tying to cheer us up …

97316 ▶▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Sophie123, 3, #188 of 1374 🔗

Bring it on!

97348 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Sophie123, 15, #189 of 1374 🔗

I find myself wishing all kinds of horrible things on maskers. I used to be a nice person before all this shit! I feel the same about the vaccine — I’m actually hoping for catastrophic results from the trials. They’ll probably cover those up or minimize them since they are only using healthy guinea pigs at the moment, but if there is a widespread rollout I anticipate a lot of misery.

97428 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Sophie123, 2, #190 of 1374 🔗

Face nappy related necrotising fasciitis, oh yer, bring it on…That really is nasty.

97724 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Alec in France, #191 of 1374 🔗

A new type of acne.

97127 karenovirus, 9, #192 of 1374 🔗

Lots of holiday makers going homeward a day early.
Having spent 3 months locked indoors during the best spring/early summer in memory (during which I was out & about, key worker).
Now they find themselves unable to make plans for foreign travel due to johnsons continuing reckless lockdown so they come here for a bit of holiday and it’s Pissing down with rain in August.

You would have to have a heart of stone….

97130 Montag Smith, replying to Montag Smith, 15, #193 of 1374 🔗

Why would anyone have a Covid test after returning from holiday and pay 600 quid for the opportunity to get yourself quarantined?!

As for the headteacher and the SAGE member, those kind of people have no business being in any position of responsibility. It’s about time people like that learnt to understand relative risk and grew a backbone to replace the flaccid one they currently have.

97250 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Montag Smith, 4, #194 of 1374 🔗

I think the deal is the £600 gets you out of doing the quarantine. Effectively a bribe.

Of course it’s easiest just to say you will quarantine and then not do it. This is truer to the spirit of most of what the government is doing anyway.

97287 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to guy153, 3, #195 of 1374 🔗

Except for neighbourhood Karens – you’ll get snitched.

97300 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Alec in France, 1, #196 of 1374 🔗

Like a lot of things, this depends on where you live.

97505 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Alec in France, #197 of 1374 🔗

Why would you tell snitchers you were going on holiday? And more to the point where? Surely people on here don’t have snitchers as friends?

97631 ▶▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to guy153, #198 of 1374 🔗

Only if you test negative?

97957 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Montag Smith, #199 of 1374 🔗

You have about a 99.5% chance of testing negative.

97503 ▶▶ Bella, replying to Montag Smith, #200 of 1374 🔗

Hitler had no business being in any position of responsibility….but there you go.

97141 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 14, #201 of 1374 🔗

This is the editorial article July JAMA by Redfield Director CDC which is the primary document behind all mask wearing now in the western world. Adopted like sheep everywhere “Now, there is ample evidence that persons without symptoms spread infection and may be the critical driver needed to maintain epidemic momentum” “Others may think it is premature to promote community masking until research has been completed that measures the effectiveness of cloth face coverings to prevent exposure specifically to SARS-CoV-2. Laboratory studies will be difficult and costly because they require capacity to safely manage this biosafety level 3 pathogen. Any type of community-based randomized trial will be complex to deploy in the right setting (a community with active infection) at the right time (when infections are increasing) to produce actionable results quickly. In the absence of such data, it has been persuasively argued the precautionary principle be applied to promote community masking because there is little to lose and potentially much to be gained . In this regard, the report by Wang et al provides practical, timely, and compelling evidence that community-wide face covering is another means to help control the national COVID-19 crisis.”
“Like herd immunity with vaccines, the more individuals wear cloth face coverings in public places where they may be close together, the more the entire community is protected. Community-level protection afforded by use of cloth face coverings can reduce the number of new infections and facilitate cautious easing of more societally disruptive community interventions such as stay-at-home orders and business closings.
“In addition, another analysis published by Goldman Sachs Research suggests that expanding community masking by 15% could prevent the need to bring back stay-at-home orders that would otherwise cost an estimated 5% of gross domestic product, or a projected cost of $1 trillion.
“It is probably safe for individuals and safe for others to drive alone or to walk or jog alone on an uncrowded route without a face covering ” (Thanks)
The referenced Wang article is here jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2768533
The Wang article has only to do with HCW. It is not a RCT study.
 Not a single RCT has been published about C-19 and facemasks but 8-10 RCT with influenza without effect Redfield also refer to Missouri hair dressers paper almost embarrassing. Retrospective study and not even all exposed were tested for C-19. Redfield again using precautionary principle Redfield even having a reference to Goldman Sachs modelling. Laughable. Redfield referring to T Grenhalgh. British pride, one of the chief woke in the GP community And the whole thing based upon this? And our whole medical establishment swallowing this and throwing out evidence based medical practice? This is a sociological manifest not science Recommend to read in full as this is the fateful document used by all governments.

97174 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to swedenborg, 9, #202 of 1374 🔗

Two words that should set off alarm bells – no, for once, not Bill Gates – Goldman Sachs!

97183 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to swedenborg, 15, #203 of 1374 🔗

“there is little to lose and potentially much to be gained”

Seems to be the general approach of medical types advocating this, wilfully ignoring ALL the things to lose by doing this (won’t list, we know them all, the list is long) and claiming there is MUCH to be gained, when in fact their best attempts to list gains are that it _might help reduce_ transmission except, where there are no infected people it literally does nothing and just costs all the downsides. Twats.

Also they claim they help avoid the need for a return to lockdown… there was never a need, there will never be a need, to return to that for C-19 anyway, so fuck off with your mask lies you cunts.

97325 ▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Mark II, 2, #204 of 1374 🔗

And were they at the same time setting up mask production companies? Lots of dosh.

97370 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Mark II, 1, #205 of 1374 🔗

“there is little to lose and potentially much to be gained”

By the people – the politicians, the “scientists” – prescribing the measures.

Much to be lost by all the rest of us.

97211 ▶▶ Drawde927, replying to swedenborg, 14, #206 of 1374 🔗

“It is probably safe for individuals and safe for others to drive alone… without a face covering”

Don’t know whether to laugh or cry… that explains the masked drivers with nobody else in the car – they’re not taking any chances with the “probably”!

97214 ▶▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Drawde927, 10, #207 of 1374 🔗

It’s utter madness what some academics are saying. What effing planet do they live on?!

97297 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Drawde927, 6, #208 of 1374 🔗

Eagerly waiting for the first serious accident caused by a muzzled driver suffering from hypoxia and/or hypercapnia. The legal ramifications will be fascinating.

97352 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Alec in France, 5, #209 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I used to be a nice person but now I’m hoping for events like this to happen! Bring on the maskne, fungal infections, halitosis, dental rot, and people passing out in the car.

97369 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Alec in France, 3, #210 of 1374 🔗

Yes but I don’t want to be the one coming from the other direction!

97212 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to swedenborg, 9, #211 of 1374 🔗

The precautionary principle only works if you can be fairly sure there are no unintended consequences which could make the problem worse, otherwise it’s better to live with uncertainty. Surely those academics should know that.

97299 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to Montag Smith, 1, #212 of 1374 🔗

Does the precautionary principle ever work?

97349 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Alec in France, 3, #213 of 1374 🔗

Off the top of my head, it would make sense if you were trying to avoid a nuclear war.

97233 ▶▶ NickR, replying to swedenborg, 23, #214 of 1374 🔗

A friend of mine, an enthusiastic mask wearers & bedwetter of the 1st rank, has come down with a nasty viral respiratory infection. Now, I don’t know that it’s because of the mask wearing but I wouldn’t bet against it.
Am I being unfeeling if I admit to a fleeting sense of schadenfreude.

97253 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to NickR, 9, #215 of 1374 🔗

No you’re not! These brain dead twerps don’t deserve any sympathy. I’m saving mine for all the poor souls that are going to suffer from delayed treatments for other, more serious illnesses. Why is a ‘covid casualty’ any more important than any other casualty?

97264 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to NickR, 7, #216 of 1374 🔗

There are logical reasons that mask wearing might increase risk of infection.Handwashing is almost the only thing effective in reducing transmission.If constant fiddling with the face masks makes it possible contamination of fingers and perhaps not available hand washing.This is a serious concern(not just schadenfreude).The recent increase of cases in France and Spain AND mask wearing might be that possibility together with more accepting crowds etc than doing the same thing without mask.

97808 ▶▶▶▶ Jim D, replying to swedenborg, #217 of 1374 🔗

I saw a news report about train fares yesterday where two masked passengers were asked their opinion, both touched the middle of their masks within the few seconds they were on screen, everyday I see people holding the material of masks in their hands – possibly safe in the knowledge they’re part of the 99.98% of the population that aren’t infected. I’d love to see the scientific research showing unhygienic wearing and handling of face masks is beneficial!!

97932 ▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to swedenborg, #218 of 1374 🔗

Thanks Swedenborg – I’ve now read the Redfield, Wang and Greenhalgh articles and tried to understand them as best I can (as a complete layman).

My head is spinning but those studies alone (despite your comments) seem enough to convince the intelligent layman that masking is effective to prevent spread of the virus. Not what I wanted to see.

Are the papers as clearly refutable as you say? Or is belief in the efficacy, and on the other hand the damage, of masking just an article of faith, on our side as well as theirs?

If it’s a question of belief and not science, we move into religious territory, where one man’s angel is another man’s devil, and the rational man bows out.

98273 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to BTLnewbie, #219 of 1374 🔗

You have to careful comparing mask articles for Health Care Workers with masks for General population. They are two completely different ball games. Many of the pro mask articles cite those studies. The hospital setting is completely different .Change of masks, handwashing in between competent handling of masks. Masks for general population. No technical knowledge to put on safely. No change of masks. No handwashing after touching etc. These are two different worlds.

The studies referenced are all retrospective observational studies which always have the risk for bias, you easily find what you want to find. You are more likely to publish a positive study than negative. You need a prospective (look into future)study with two different groups exposed(RCT) one with masks one without, at the same time ie same stage of the pandemic. None has been published for C-19. But for a similar virus, influenza, several such RCTs have been done showing no effect of face masks for the general public.
I confess I haven’t read Trisha G(who is not a virologist, more a politician) article which I think uses the precautionary principle i.e. if it had an effect it would be good if everybody used it. I think this is very dangerous. I think mask wearing increases the risk for transmission. But another blog comment on that. Fully understand difficult position of a layman overwhelmed by so much information.

97142 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 16, #220 of 1374 🔗

Are we going to completely ignore the guy that snuck into an empty hospital, took photos, and got 3 months in jail for it? Are we also going to ignore how the Daily Mail was writing about hospitals filled to bursting under photos of empty hallways?

97160 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 2, #221 of 1374 🔗

I am liking the comments from Fritz thecat

97172 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 5, #222 of 1374 🔗

Didn’t know about it until your post, or didn’t remember it. That is pretty shocking. Any journalist take this up at the time or were they just happy to make it difficult for amateurs to compete with them?

Are we also going to ignore how the Daily Mail was writing about hospitals filled to bursting under photos of empty hallways ?”

Note the captions in the current story:

Corridors appeared eerily quiet as NHS staff packed into the wards to help sick patients, as Stevenson carried about his business despite strict Government orders to stay at home


With the hospital battling against the strain of increasing Covid-19 patients, Stevenson sauntered through will documenting his journey for social media

Be interesting to know what the true situation was in Stoke Mandeville on 30th March.

That story was dated 2nd April, though,so presumably the guy’s been out for a while. And how did he get arrested and convicted so quickly (even given he apparently admitted the offence) in the midst of a supposed crisis where courts were not operating normally?

97185 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 1, #223 of 1374 🔗

Here’s a full interview with the guy:

Liberty Bunker

97202 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Mark, #224 of 1374 🔗

Looks like the guy was just too nice and cooperative, a bit naive, so he got railroaded.

97625 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark, #225 of 1374 🔗

He was very naive. Sounds like he fell for all their tricks.

97219 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Mark, #226 of 1374 🔗

Great! I was going to ask someone for an update on him.

97223 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Mr Dee, 2, #227 of 1374 🔗

Seems pretty chirpy. All’s well that ends well, I suppose.

Though I bet if he’d insisted on a lawyer and refused to plead guilty, I bet he’d either have had the charges dropped or still be waiting for the process to get moving. Really there should be scope for an abuse of process or similar suit, because they clearly took advantage of him in a way that the courts had supposedly said they were going to stop doing..

97204 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 3, #228 of 1374 🔗

“The corridors were eerily quiet as staff packed into the wards…”. Hmm.

97306 ▶▶▶ Alec in France, replying to JohnB, 1, #229 of 1374 🔗

…to practice Tik Tok dance routines?

97145 James Lawrence, replying to James Lawrence, 4, #230 of 1374 🔗

EVERYONE please go over to @CathNoakes and take her up on this tweet:
“Very pleased we’ve been awarded @UKRI_News
funding to evaluate #covid risks on public transport. Looking forward to working with @Martin_Lopez_Ga
and colleagues at @imperialcollege
Newcastle, @PHE_uk
Manchester, dstl & DfT. More soon.”


97156 ▶▶ Sally, replying to James Lawrence, 2, #231 of 1374 🔗

And no doubt the more MASKS!

97318 ▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Sally, 1, #232 of 1374 🔗

Certainly looks like more modelling and we know how they make all that up.

97159 ▶▶ Mark, replying to James Lawrence, 2, #233 of 1374 🔗

Seems fear pays well…

97190 ▶▶▶ Mark II, replying to Mark, 5, #234 of 1374 🔗

Indeed, a friend of mine works at a University in Psysiology and has bagged himself a research grant (way back in April) for something Covid related. His girlfriend also bringing in some Covid funds though I couldn’t work out what she was actually doing from what he said – She’s another Phd who went into academia – big money, lots of holidays, hardly any work to do. If you’re in the ‘right’ sector within Academia at the moment it must be like you’ve won the lottery, non-stop funding for Covid related studys.

97208 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Mark II, 4, #235 of 1374 🔗

And of course all that mostly wasted largesse will come out of our pockets in the end.

97241 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Mark II, 6, #236 of 1374 🔗

for years global warming has been the gravy train . academics have been able to get grants from all over for doing research into any tosh as long as it was pro climate change. Which is why the BBC and the grauniad can forever come up with rubbish scare stories that start with “scientists say………”.
Now it is Covid.

97245 ▶▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to mjr, #237 of 1374 🔗

Oops didn’t see your comment!

97252 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to T. Prince, 4, #238 of 1374 🔗

probably contemporaneous! and if it’s worth saying it’s worth repeating!..
I am going to think about the effects of climate change on covid – something like “how hospital staff sweat more when wearing useless masks because of global warming” . I reckon that’s a 20 week study and a £500 per week grant

97292 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to mjr, 3, #239 of 1374 🔗

You’re not experienced enough at this – a year and a half, at £1000 a week. 🙂

97242 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Mark II, 2, #240 of 1374 🔗

Covid obviously the new climate change scam

97313 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to James Lawrence, 2, #241 of 1374 🔗

She makes it sound like a jolly with all her mates. Do these people ever grow up?

97151 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 11, #242 of 1374 🔗

Hospital Admissions Over-Counted

Who puts these incompetent muppets in charge of counting things? They can’t even define what they’re looking for.

97247 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 8, #243 of 1374 🔗

It wasn’t incompetence it was deliberate

97164 Will, replying to Will, 38, #244 of 1374 🔗

What has this country come to when my 91 year old step father, who uses an inhaler every morning to counter his COPD doesn’t realise that it is actually dangerous for him to wear a mask in church. A church, I would add, that can seat 200 and rarely sees a congregation of more than 20 yet forces everyone to wear face nappies and does not allow singing or, even more ludicrously, the playing of the organ. How in the name of all that is holy have we ended up here?

97965 ▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Will, 2, #245 of 1374 🔗

Saw a post online from someone recently, a friend in the US. They gist of it was: they keep you away from schools. they keep you away from the churches. they keep you away from community centres; why? because that’s where people go to vote!

98061 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Will, #246 of 1374 🔗

The droplets might fly into one ot the organ pipes and be shot into the air when the organist opens a stop?

97171 David Grimbleby, replying to David Grimbleby, 5, #247 of 1374 🔗

From a story by H. P. Lovecraft ‘The Last Test’. Dr. Clarendon is the stereotype mad scientist prepared to experiment on any living creature including his sister..
“yes it may be horrible but it’s glorious too. The pursuit of knowledge, I mean. Certainly, there’s no slovenly sentiment connected with it. Doesn’t nature kill constantly and remorselessly, and are any but fools horrified at the struggle? Killings are necessary. They are the glory of science. We learn something from them, and we can’t sacrifice learning to sentiment. Here the sentimentalists howled against vaccination! They fear it will kill the child. Well, what if it does? How else can we discover the laws of disease concerned?”

97216 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to David Grimbleby, 1, #248 of 1374 🔗

I’m convinced that Nyarlathotep is behind all this. He is, after all, a big fan of Masks.

97180 Sue, replying to Sue, 9, #249 of 1374 🔗

Hi – for anyone on Facebook there is a group “ Save Our Rights UK – A Real Democracy” with about 18k members which seems a good contact point on the lockdown and surrounding issues. It seems quite active – not with the analysis and erudition of this site obviously but may be interesting to some of you folks.
There are some local groups arranging meetups and nice picture of group in kent/surrey area who met up recently

i’ll try and post link here but if doesn’t work can search on the name above.

I think there is quite a lot of different groups now forming on various platforms bringing peopel in touch – people sick of the bullshit being fed to us…

97919 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Sue, 1, #250 of 1374 🔗

I’ve joined the group – looks OK but nowhere near as good as this LS comments section. I mainly use Facebook for my music, art & photography interests. As other FB users will have noticed, their advertising algorithms relentlessly promote companies selling masks, the more expensive the better. Comments below such posts (presumably filtered) say what a great product they are. But I did see something a bit different on FB today, an advert for the posh magazine Country Life with a headline something like How Covid Has Changed Everything. The comments below were about 90% sceptical or anti-lockdown, apart from a few idiots still parroting lines from about 4 months ago like “Don’t want to wear a mask? You won’t like a ventilator much”. I won’t insult our intelligence here by bothering to demolish that ludicrous statement.

97181 AnotherSceptic, replying to AnotherSceptic, 6, #251 of 1374 🔗

& this is what we are up against, an 80 year old has went to the local rag to complain about his local carvery
Stupid old tit.


97197 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Sam Vimes, 10, #253 of 1374 🔗

Who writes this shit. A room full of chimps sitting at typewriters would make more sense.

97400 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #254 of 1374 🔗

Hmmm. I wonder if that’s general Toby policy. Sounds like a sane venue.

97194 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to AnotherSceptic, 9, #255 of 1374 🔗

If it were that dangerous the old prick would be dead weeks ago.

97198 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to AnotherSceptic, 16, #256 of 1374 🔗

If only the old farts and bedwetters, including the yummy mummies intent on masking their little ones, would just stay behind their sofas, the rest of us could get on with our lives.

97231 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #257 of 1374 🔗

Is it any wonder some people are so frightened when you’ve got utter morons like this ‘advising’ governments?

comment image

97311 ▶▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to T. Prince, 3, #258 of 1374 🔗

Now Cath IS a bedwetter.

98041 ▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to T. Prince, #259 of 1374 🔗

Idiot, walking or driving to the restaurant was far more risky than the chance of ctaching covid while there. The fools really have got it in to their heads that covid is the only danger in this world, otherwise they’d recognise that almost everything else we do day to day is more dangerous and we never worry about it. And I bet she was all for obeying the lockdown lunacy, yet she doesn’t mention the risks she posed to herself through vitamin D deficiency though.

97213 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to AnotherSceptic, 20, #260 of 1374 🔗

A Toby Carvery customer has vowed to never go back during the pandemic as he felt they were “not taking regulations seriously”.

I’m sure he’ll be sorely missed…

97186 NappyFace, replying to NappyFace, 7, #261 of 1374 🔗

The Brexit Party was a single cause party – that succeeded in its aims (though personally I disagreed with them).

How about a similar single issue party against COVID19 measures?

97187 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to NappyFace, 1, #262 of 1374 🔗

Farage might be the man to lead it. Not sure where he stands on bat flu, though. I bet he’s a sceptic.

97193 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 10, #263 of 1374 🔗

I think (from one of his articles in the Telegraph a few months ago), unfortunately he was in favour of lockdown. On that, he follows a line of people who have disappointed on their lockdown stance – Melanie Philipps, Rod Liddle and Dominic Lawson, to name a few. Unless he has seen the light, we need to look elsewhere!

97199 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tenchy, 11, #264 of 1374 🔗

Farage is controlled opposition,any time he has an opportunity for real change he has backed away.He is used by the deep state to sweep up disaffected voters ,remember If he had stood his candidates in the election then we wouldn’t be in this mess

97205 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #265 of 1374 🔗

You can hardly plausibly claim brexit isn’t “real change”

“If he had stood his candidates in the election then we wouldn’t be in this mess

Not a chance of that being true.

97244 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Mark, 1, #266 of 1374 🔗

Really, he seemed disappointed when the Brexit vote happened,then immediately stepped down.He only appears when there is a chance of a movement that could affect real change and a government with a slim majority is a different animal than one with a 80 seat one.
Brexit is only the start.Instead of going to Washington via Brussels we just go direct now.

97742 ▶▶▶ Carlo, replying to Tenchy, #267 of 1374 🔗

He said lockdown was done wrongly he is a skeptic.

97191 ▶▶ Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to NappyFace, #268 of 1374 🔗

CONvid 19

97196 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 4, #269 of 1374 🔗

Is pre symptomatic spread a major contributor to COVID-19 transmission? There is a Chinese article suggesting this The authors above in this recently posted letter above don’t believe this
“Although a request for viral shedding data was denied by the Guangzhou Eighth People’s Hospital, we believe that there could be potential issues with the interpretation of the data. “The model also predicts that infectiousness starts at 1.56 days before symptom onset but peaks at 2.32 days before symptom onset, but, because this is not biologically possible, one would have to assume that 1.56 days is both the start and peak of infectiousness, which is also a biologically implausible scenario. “Although many factors are involved with transmission efficiency, it appears that asymptomatic/presymptomatic transmission measured by direct contact tracing studies is lower than that predicted by COVID-19 transmission models” This is a complicated paper but of importance as the paper they criticize is heavily involved in the asymptomatic spreading agenda(mask wearing agenda)

97484 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to swedenborg, #270 of 1374 🔗


I think it is that study Dr John Campbell refers to briefly here.

97209 Sane and furious, replying to Sane and furious, 17, #271 of 1374 🔗

Lockdown Sceptics has become a valued source of sane information and I thank you for your hard work in keeping up with the daily task of bringing it all together. Just one thing – your use of the term ‘bedwetter’ undermines the intelligent and appropriately exasperated tone of most of your editorial content. Images of anxious children and urine soaked sheets are distasteful, and the playground bullying tone strikes a wrong note. People are in the grip of fear and anxiety, conditioned by the scaremongering approach of government and media, much of it in the realms now of the delusional. This is a serious collective mental health as well as political issue, not a matter of personal weakness or stupidity, though people’s vulnerabilities are certainly bring manipulated.

97222 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Sane and furious, 8, #272 of 1374 🔗

Kind of, but whatever you call them, it’s going to have negative connotations. Their intelligence is less; their minds are weaker and more easily manipulated…

About the most positive thing I can call them is the ‘less enlightened’…

97393 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Barney McGrew, 8, #273 of 1374 🔗

No… my mother follows the official narrative to the letter. Her intelligence is not less, her mind is not weaker, though she certainly has been manipulated.

She is of a generation that trusts everything the ‘experts’ and ‘trusted’ sources like the BBC have fed her. Any why not? In a sane world, experts should be trusted – they have utterly betrayed their positions of responsibility.

97413 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Mr Dee, 5, #274 of 1374 🔗

“experts” really have ABUSED their positions of responsibility and abused all of us too for their own financial gain. It’s just sickening.

97530 ▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Mr Dee, 3, #275 of 1374 🔗

I’m trying to think of any experts I trust fully. I can’t say there are any, at the moment! ‘Expertise’ refers to a low level, shop-floor, learned-on-the-job, narrow-minded, ‘skill’. I think Nicholas Taleb talks about this: your taxi driver is an ‘expert’ but there should be no such thing as an expert economist because economics is not a ‘job’ that you ‘get the hang of’ through practise or reading text books. The mistakes happen when you give ‘experts’ the power to run the world. Their vision is too narrow.

97809 ▶▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #276 of 1374 🔗

Absolutely Barney McGrew, this reminds me of a wonderful book called “The Master and his Emissary” by Iain McGilchrist about right and left brained thinking. We’re in a world that is far too left brained, everything broken down into smaller and smaller disconnected parts but the real treasure is in seeing the overall picture, the whole. We’ve become a nation of narrow experts who all think they’ve got the whole picture.

98032 ▶▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #277 of 1374 🔗

Economists, funnily enough, have made sensible predictions throughout the covid panicdemic, often highlighting the harms of lockdown, and how even during an “emergency” greatest threat to society is the threat of panic to infrastructure, not of covid to health. Plenty of economic research groups have seen and published the truths which epidemiologists were blind to. We mustn’t condemn experts in general, many do know what they’re doing, we need to condemn safety-ists in experts clothing and those fools in Ferguson’s field who don’t realise that the model is as much the data as the map is the territory.

97543 ▶▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Mr Dee, 2, #278 of 1374 🔗

My parents are also in this camp. I call them brainwashed.

97549 ▶▶▶▶ Eddie, replying to Mr Dee, 2, #279 of 1374 🔗

I think back to a time long ago when I consulted an ‘expert’ in WW2 historical artifacts and his humility and brushing off of the expert label was telling. “I may have knowledge but I will never possibly know everything on this subject…I will still have much to learn even as I take my final breath in this life.”

I guess people rely on and trust experts because there’s not a chance in hell they can be bothered to look into things for themselves.

97251 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to Sane and furious, 10, #280 of 1374 🔗

Sorry, I disagree. A large part of the reason we are in this mess is because of the stupidity, gullibility and laziness of the general public. If they could only put in the time and effort to think a bit and seek out sources of information other than the mainstream media then maybe enough pressure could be put on the government to put an end to this insanity. Most people on here are exasperated at this situation and calling people “bedwetters” is pretty mild really in the circumstances.

97280 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Chicot, 8, #281 of 1374 🔗

Yep, I quite agree, most people lack critical thinking skills, coupled with the innate desire to conform.

It’s almost like it’s been thought through….. 🤔

97286 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Chicot, 4, #282 of 1374 🔗

I shall call them whatever I like.

97333 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Chicot, 6, #283 of 1374 🔗

unfortunately too many people only take their news from MSM (some people actually believe the BBC) or from twitter. They wont even consider that their is an alternative

97554 ▶▶▶▶ Eddie, replying to mjr, 2, #284 of 1374 🔗

Indeed. My step mother cautioned me on using the internet for information while she watches MSNBC daily and displays obvious signs of Trump Derangement Syndrome. The television is right, the internet is wrong.

97972 ▶▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to mjr, #285 of 1374 🔗

Too true. As a true crime buff, I’m often seeing comments indicating the principles underpinning the entire justice system of western civilization – namely, innocent until proven guilty in court, & the right to be judged by a jury of one’s peers – be completely thrown out, in favour of just asking some random on Twitter (i deally a leftist, because a leftist knows best) to sum up in a few characters, what any verdict & applicable sentence should be.

97739 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Chicot, 1, #286 of 1374 🔗

Bedwetter is too kind a word to describe the inexcusable level of conformity that these people display.

98141 ▶▶▶ Fed up, replying to Chicot, #287 of 1374 🔗

I think the term adds a flavour of the farcical nature of the Covid Secure mindset and acts as a counterpoint to the reality of Orwellian nightmare imposed on us. These pages have had me chuckling as well as being prepared to man the barricades.

97329 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Sane and furious, 4, #288 of 1374 🔗

After what we’ve been called, bedwetter is mild!

97408 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Tom Blackburn, 9, #289 of 1374 🔗

I find myself agreeing after being called a granny killer, QAnon Karen etc. the other day for merely engaging in a scientific debate on mask wearing. The ad hominem attacks on me were beyond the pale. While I don’t like the term bedwetter either, I must agree that those of us here have been called much worse. Should we go high when they go low? I’m past being nice; there is too much riding on this.

97544 ▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #290 of 1374 🔗


97341 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Sane and furious, 10, #291 of 1374 🔗

Doesn’t it partly depend on who we think reads this site?

Personally if I were trying to persuade someone over to my point of view, I wouldn’t start by calling them names, unless I thought that might shock them to their senses.

But if we’re assuming it’s mainly sceptics who read this site, it possibly doesn’t much matter what they are called.

The zealots and those with agendas are the enemy who will probably never agree with us, the fearful and apathetic who have just been brainwashed probably deserve a measure of disapproval, but also, without wishing to sound patronising, some measure of pity.

97347 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Julian, 4, #292 of 1374 🔗

I think we’re entitled to express our frustration.

97467 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to matt, 1, #293 of 1374 🔗

For sure, and I share that frustration and anger.

97399 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Julian, 5, #294 of 1374 🔗

I would love to be able to direct those who some of us have called ‘bedwetters’ to this site, but I am reluctant to because we have insulted them for their mistake in following the official narrative. How do we bring the misinformed round to the truth of the matter if we mock them?

Bear in mind that if we mock them, we are playing into the hands of those who seek to rule us by dividing us. We are doing their job for them. And that is the intention.

If mask wearers hurl abuse at us, attempt to shame us, treat us with contempt, we respond with compassion. We turn the other cheek. Otherwise we have already lost.

97563 ▶▶▶▶ Eddie, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #295 of 1374 🔗

I try to limit the name calling but totally understand why it happens. It’s the greatest challenge to not look down on folks who eat up the official narrative.

98037 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Julian, #296 of 1374 🔗

We need two sites, one were we can let out all our anti-lockdown fury, one to tempt in the undeicded neutrals. Undecided neutrals by the way aren’t bed-wetters, I reserve that phrase for those who have really fallen hook line and sinker for the coronapanic narrative. The actual bed-wetters can’t be brought round to our way of thinking, but they are much rarer than undecided people.

97387 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Sane and furious, 5, #297 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I agree. We’re all better than that.

We should direct our attacks against the purveyors of the fear (who have been using expert psychological propaganda to achieve their nefarious aim), not those who fall for the confidence trick.

97409 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sane and furious, 5, #298 of 1374 🔗

I prefer to call them the sheeple or the brainwashed. I think the connotations for the term bedwetters detract from our argument.

97472 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Cheezilla, #299 of 1374 🔗

Brainwashed is a slightly more neutral term, and more accurate. But again, if you want to persuade someone, would you start by telling them they have been brainwashed, or that they have been misinformed and perhaps they would like to hear some alternative information. It’s horses for courses, and each case is different. But generally people who feel threatened or insulted just get defensive and stop listening.

97928 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Sane and furious, #300 of 1374 🔗

I kind of agree, and I don’t use that term myself, maybe “scaredy-cats” if I need a short word. Likewise I refer to masks rather than the emotive muzzles. But above everything else I believe in freedom of speech, so any expressions that people want to use are fine by me.

97210 Mr Dee, replying to Mr Dee, 12, #301 of 1374 🔗

Just passed a throng of trade unionists (an indignation of trade unionists) flag-waving not far from the town centre. There about thirty of them – I was happy to see they were all huddled together and best of all, I noticed none of them muzzled. Obviously the Covid is Socialist and avoids those waving red flags.

97364 ▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to Mr Dee, 4, #302 of 1374 🔗

Glad to see even more evidence that being a sheeple vs. a sceptic has nothing to do with left vs. right.

97383 ▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, 4, #303 of 1374 🔗

However, left-wing woke mask-zealots would probably consider those trade unionists as far right because they are not masked up…

97402 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Mr Dee, 8, #304 of 1374 🔗

Yes, it’s quite amazing how small minded the zealots are. I was a New York Times, Washington Post liberal until all this went down. I should say I’m socially liberal and on the fiscal conservative side and have voted for both parties historically, but what I’ve discovered through all of this is that I am now a one issue voter and my issue is FREEDOM. There was never that much light between our 2 main political parties, and there still may not be, but my libertarian instincts from my teen and young adult years is back in force. It’s very disconcerting to be called a QAnon Karen for merely providing links to scientific research on the inefficacy of masks in preventing virus transmission. While I always hated the “woke” far-left progressives and think Trump is a malignant narcissist with dementia, I’m finding myself wondering who I’d vote for if I were American. But at 55 I pride myself in being able to remain objective and see this insanity for what it is, even if that means aligning myself with folks I’d never have imagined and with whom I don’t necessarily agree on everything. I think that’s what we all have in common here.

97482 ▶▶▶▶▶ Luckyluke1976, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 9, #305 of 1374 🔗

Great post! I am on the right side of politics, or shall I say, libertarian. There is nothing more important in life than FREEDOM. Talk to Eastern Europeans, Cambodians and Venezuelans and you will understand why. This is exactly what the globalists are trying to prevent, left and right coming together to defend what all human beings should cherish.
In regards of Trump, if you are a one issue voter, in spite of his shortcomings (narcissism, boastfulness, macho style etc) he believes in freedom.But let’s agree we first need to win this together, then we can friendly debate left vs right over a glass of beer!

97867 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #306 of 1374 🔗

You are the Canadian me.

Or I am the British you.

One or the other.

98030 ▶▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #307 of 1374 🔗

I’m a libertarian like you too, but left and right wingers really cannot understand how you can be anything but a left winger or right winger. They cannot get their heads around the idea of freedom being your top issue.

97218 NonCompliant, replying to NonCompliant, 13, #308 of 1374 🔗

Judging by the responses others on here have had from their MP’s it seems they don’t feel themselves accountable for any of the oncoming economic misery going to be visited upon us shortly.
I’ve not yet had a response from my two local MP’s but I expect it’ll be 100% condescending drivel similar to what others have had sent back to them here.

With this in mind i’m wondering if it’s time to appeal to our MP’s more base instincts, ie survival?

It’s been obvious for a long time now that this thing has pretty much blown over and yet our MP’s quietly sit on their hands and let the Govt do whatever it wants regards Covid-19. I think the way to go from hereon in is contact them with all the evidence in hand (NHS England) and state that come the next election we’ll be standing against them. Not only that, we’ll be showing our fellow consituents the evidence which they ignored which could have saved both their jobs and lives of friends and loved ones, ie Cancer patients and diagnosis, missed operations etc.

The data is going to be completely damning and it’s obvious the majority of the population has absolutely no idea as to the reality on the ground in our hospitals. I think once we start seeing a climb in unemployment, peoples willingness to listen is going to follow with it.

All we need to do is inform them we’re compiling all the data provided by NHS England, that we’re compiling a database of their glib and dismissive responses and we’ll be using both against them come the next Election (if we ever have another of course!).

All the arrogance and conceit in the world isn’t going to save them from their constituents if people can see for themselves that these moron’s just went along with it all, even though they were informed by their own constituents of the reality of the situation!

Worth a shot?

97248 ▶▶ Julian, replying to NonCompliant, 2, #309 of 1374 🔗

Everything is worth a shot though we would need more numbers to make it really stick

If there was a credible political party that looked like it would take votes away from the incumbents, it would be a lot easier. But that party does not yet exist, though sooner or later it will need to be founded if we want to have any chance of getting out of this. The only ready-made party is the Brexit Party, but they are no use re the lockdown

I’ve made clear to my MP on a number of occasions that I voted for her and am a natural supporter of her party, but that she had crossed a red line and I would not be voting for her again, but she doesn’t care because she has a huge majority and I expect very few others, so far, have written to her to say this

97282 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to NonCompliant, 2, #310 of 1374 🔗

Worth a shot?

Oh yes. Recommend 12-bore.

97312 ▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to NonCompliant, #311 of 1374 🔗

Just to be clear, I was meaning we should stand as independent candidates.

97974 ▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to NonCompliant, #312 of 1374 🔗

Or as suggested, someone could kinda merge the Brexit Party with a anti-Lockdown party. Bloc Party? I think that’s already taken! 🙂

98024 ▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Not Tiger Woods, #313 of 1374 🔗

I am a remainer, but right now I’d vote for f*cking Farage if he was standing against lockdown.

97643 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to NonCompliant, #314 of 1374 🔗

Do any politicians consider themselves to be accountable? It’s rare for one to resign because of a major cock-up that has a major affect on the country.

97979 ▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Montag Smith, #315 of 1374 🔗

I’m sure every MP has every intention of investigating the possibility of considering accountability….!

98027 ▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Not Tiger Woods, #316 of 1374 🔗

…In the fullness of time, as Sir Humphrey would insist.

97225 MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 19, #317 of 1374 🔗

Morrison’s yesterday:

Turn left, go through the newly-installed electronic gates and you’re in Zombie Hell. Silent, worried eyes over every muzzle as they see our bare faces, some of them seemed to be clocking our exempt badges. All staff not behind a screen masked up. We were looking for tahini and a couple of young staff were helping us. In the next aisle, AG heard the girl say to the lad, ‘Pull it down, I can’t hear what you’re saying!’  He did.

Turn right, though, and you walk bare-faced into the crowded cafe. Every table occupied, not a mask in sight. Any shopper wanting the loo has to walk past the tables. No need to wear a mask, right, because you’re in the cafe. If you go shopping before/after your snack you turn back into a zombie. You’d think you were in a movie or a horror story, wouldn’t you?

All the above is in full compliance with Govt guidelines. Is it any wonder people are being driven insane?

After shopping, we waited for the bus. A familiar (muzzled) figure came out and hailed us, muffledly, from behind her mask. She was a woman from church who we like a lot with her hands full and she let AG unhook the muzzle from one ear so we could chat.   We had a fascinating conversation with her. She has bought into every single drop of the propaganda, even avoiding her own little great-grandchildren because ‘she doesn’t want to infect them’. She is puzzled because some of her friends are now meeting up (risky). We said ‘that’s great!’ and she said, ‘Do you think so?’ and we told her why. She said that she wished she’d met us months ago. Well, you never know and she did invite us to visit her beautiful garden!

A bloke we know got on the bus with a black jock-strap just over his mouth, the only other passenger. We had a chat (not about the crap) and we kicked ourselves afterwards for not telling him to take it off. Next time! MW

97229 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 11, #318 of 1374 🔗

Because the virus is so tiny, it can make the fine distinction between the shop and the cafe. It’s actually smaller than a hamster! Isn’t science wonderful?

97230 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #319 of 1374 🔗

I stand in awe of it! MW

97237 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #320 of 1374 🔗

Mask on if standing, don’t forget.

97249 ▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #321 of 1374 🔗


98085 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Sam Vimes, #322 of 1374 🔗

It’s smarter than the average virus. Almost omnipresent and omniscient.

97823 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 3, #323 of 1374 🔗

The virus is clever – it travels only in one direction, can make the distinction between different public places, can tell the time and date and so knows when to strike.

Anything else I missed?

97982 ▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #324 of 1374 🔗

Oh there’s more Bart Simpson… distinguishes clearly on race (per David Lammy & BLM); is more likely to target people of 6′ or 6’2″ than someone 5’8- 5’10, so I guess that makes it tallophobic? (think that was Uni. of Manchester who came up with that “analysis”, though not totally sure). Yes you’re right it knows about different public gatherings – Dr Ranj said on This Morning that anti-racism protests were absolutely OK, but gathering to celebrate a sporting event or other occasion requires different rules..

98124 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Not Tiger Woods, #325 of 1374 🔗

Well said. The virus knew to avoid VE Day street parties and especially BLM protests!!!

98086 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #326 of 1374 🔗

It has GPS.

98126 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to richard riewer, #327 of 1374 🔗

😂 😂 😂

97226 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, #328 of 1374 🔗

North West News – we just won’t stop it! If you live in Oldham, Pendle or Blackburn, you will need to carefully ignore this:

97315 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #329 of 1374 🔗

we are

97326 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #330 of 1374 🔗

So the police choppers are going to busy again getting on with that really important police business of counting people in back gardens .
Looking forward to the next series of police camera action . “Sorry that this hazardous pursuit only included a car, The helicopter was busy breaking up a christening party”

97232 karenovirus, 6, #331 of 1374 🔗

Tostock Parish Council needs renaming:


97239 Jonathan Castro, replying to Jonathan Castro, 2, #332 of 1374 🔗

You can contact the school mentioned in this article to complain at: tpamk.co.uk/contact.html

97276 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jonathan Castro, 1, #333 of 1374 🔗

Done so. Awaiting knock on door from her maj’s finest.

97240 peter, replying to peter, #334 of 1374 🔗

The News Benders – from the BBC vaults, just amazing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pctbKP8avc

97257 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to peter, #335 of 1374 🔗

Is that Julian Barratt’s dad?

97283 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Mr Dee, #336 of 1374 🔗

No – Nigel Davenport.. someone did post a link to this a few weeks ago … But still worth a watch

97293 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to mjr, #337 of 1374 🔗

Yes, watching it now (I was only joking about JB – the actor looks very similar to him). And it has Donald Pleasance in it. Fantastic! Good find!

97320 ▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #338 of 1374 🔗

true .. But i think Davenport was a bit of a lad…. maybe he got about a bit!!!

97246 MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 6, #339 of 1374 🔗

Rick II posted a response to the bonkers restrictions our local community centre is imposing on users. He plays in an orchestra and he’s waiting for them to re-convene and his post ends, ‘ It was bad enough when Blair decided to bomb Baghdad. Now the government is carpet-bombing our own country.’

When Alan G and I protested against the Iraq war from 2003-6 (street corner vigil) one popular form of abuse/justification was ‘He’s killing his own people.’ No ironies, eh?

Anyway, AG and I also play(ed) in an orchestra and we entertain no hopes. It’s an older demographic than Rick’s and full of bedwetters. We cannot see what will ever make it safe for most of them. We will not be wearing masks to play our banjos (aka ‘cello and viola) or sit with zombies playing strings as, presumably, the wind sections will be outlawed.

Just suppose there was anything left to catch, there is no risk from wind players, at least in terms of a virus – as a recently-retired French horn player, I cannot answer for any risk to your musical sensibilities! 🙂 The Vienna Philharmonic demonstrated this back in May, for God’s sake:


The level of ignorance is stupendous and the fearmongering and psy-ops go on and on (just read Sam V’s post about Oldham etc.) MW

97459 ▶▶ Sylvie, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #340 of 1374 🔗

Miriam, sorry to hear of your Craft Club experience, and about your orchestra.

Re Craft Club, sounds like you’re the kind of person they will be very sorry to lose, anyone willing to give up their time to organise clubs is like gold dust. So fellow members might listen to you and be prepared to back you in resisting. You could just be surprised that some people who don’t want to be the first to speak up, are still unwilling to be pushed about and will miss the Club enough to want to get it going again.

Assuming you are in England, not Wales or Scotland, the first thing is to discover who is actually at the back of these restrictions. If the Club is renting the hall from a local authority and it is the Council saying these restrictions apply to all using the hall, then you need to approach the Clerk to the Council. You should request that the unnecessarily restrictive approach be put to the Council for a vote. As a courtesy, also write/speak to your local ward councillor, to put your case. Doesn’t really matter if that individual agrees or not, the point is they must help you to get it on the Council’s meeting agenda. You have the right to speak at the meeting, and present your case. You also need to marshal support, hopefully in written form, from others.
In other cases (Church hall? Community centre not run by council but by Board of Trustees, or charity limited by guarantee? Private premises??) you need to find out exactly who is mandating these restrictions and deal with them.
If the premises devolve the H&S risk assessment to each hirer, e.g. to the Club, then you’re just dealing with your own committee.Could be easier to get them to ease off, presented with facts and figures about risks, plus stressing that none of this stuff is law. And hammer the angle that no meetings, or meetings under these sterile conditions, is dangerous to mental health.

You don’t need any help from me on what to say, I’m sure. But you could start with:

Social Distancing

You could refer the responsible person to the laworfiction.com website for general reference. Then cite:
‘In Wales, the situation is more complicated because social distancing requirements, and need to ‘have regard to’ Welsh Government guidance, has been given the force of law.’

And say that the Club is not in Wales. None of this is law in England. It is merely ‘guidance’.

Guidance is generally unenforceable but, as a matter of legal obligation, employers and controllers of premises are required to undertake evidence-based health and safety risk assessments. If there is no evidence of a significant danger, no mitigation is required.’

Point out that the Club can have a risk assessment which says there is no evidence of significant danger (which there isn’t, given CV19 is currently causing the deaths of far fewer people per week than flu or pneumonia – we aren’t socially distancing for them. Say that you can supply more facts and figures about the absence of ‘significant danger’ if required.


I guess AG could give you some better words here about what to put in the risk assessment if you are just doing it for your own Club – or even advise on what a local Council could put in its wording, if they are the hall hirer??

Track and Trace – taking personal details etc

The Track and Trace material on the government website is specifically described as ‘ Guidance ‘. The Club has no legal requirement whatsoever to collect names, addresses etc. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/maintaining-records-of-staff-customers-and-visitors-to-support-nhs-test-and-trace

It would have to destroy the material collected after 21 days anyway:
‘To support NHS Test and Trace, you should hold records for 21 days. This reflects the incubation period for COVID-19 (which can be up to 14 days) and an additional 7 days to allow time for testing and tracing. After 21 days, this information should be securely disposed of or deleted.’

‘Although this is voluntary , please encourage customers and visitors to share their details in order to support NHS Test and Trace and advise them that this information will only be used where necessary to help stop the spread of COVID-19. If a customer or visitor informs you that they do not want their details shared for the purposes of NHS Test and Trace, they can choose to opt out, and if they do so you should not share their information used for booking purposes with NHS Test and Trace. The accuracy of the information provided will be the responsibility of the individual who provides it. You do not have to verify an individual’s identity for NHS Test and Trace purposes.’

But perhaps you have a sign-in book for a session, for fire safety rules?

And so on for the rest of the measures. Best of luck.

97559 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Sylvie, #341 of 1374 🔗

Hi Sylvie, I really appreciate you doing this and thank you. Unfortunately, the Community Centre is run by a committee with Trustees. The chair of Craft Club also runs the Committee and she is the Karen’s Karen (!) Along with the other centre leaders she will find regulations within regulations and will enforce them to the letter.

I don’t want to sound defeatist but I would be banging my head against a brick wall trying to oppose this. Apart from any other consideration I would bet money that I’m the only person who has a problem with it. It is very depressing but it’s where I am. People do not like those who stick their neck out in villages and it’s very frustrating (and scary!) I don’t want to be proved right but I fear very much that I am, in terms of what’s in store for us all. Being able to say ‘I warned you’ won’t be much comfort when the shit really starts to hit the fan.

Orchestra is in a different area but I suspect the brainwashed majority will carry the day just the same. MW

97567 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #342 of 1374 🔗

I’d start a new club somewhere else or just fight her with the law just for the hell of it.

If I can’t occupy self at the club I’ll find a new hobby – annoying the committee and when they back down the rest of the village wills and up and say they agreed with you all along.

97571 ▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Awkward Git, #343 of 1374 🔗

Thanks. It’s a village so I’ll not bother fighting it. I will just do my own thing (‘usually do!) Although I think you’re absolutely right. If this ever ends, everybody will have seen through it, all along. I think it was ever thus. MW

97638 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sylvie, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #344 of 1374 🔗

Understand, and sometimes life’s too short. But I’ve found unexpected support, you might be surprised the people who phone or message you if you did decide to take it on.Somebody else might also be itching to see Karen knocked off his/her perch!

97261 Seansaighdeoir, 2, #345 of 1374 🔗

Apologies for posting this link again but its such an excellent expose it needs as much publicity as possible imho. Thanks to the original poster for the link.


97265 Mibi, replying to Mibi, 10, #346 of 1374 🔗

So sad! Wouldn’t send my children to a school with masks mandatory!

97288 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Mibi, 5, #347 of 1374 🔗

Nor me. My daughter will not wear them anyway.

97268 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 16, #348 of 1374 🔗

Worrying trends also emerged in India as a new study suggested more than a quarter of Delhi’s 20 million people may have been infected without showing symptoms — backing up several similar studies.
The figures added urgency to the desperate bid to find a vaccine for the virus,….


97294 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Cheezilla, 9, #349 of 1374 🔗

So it’s worrying they have no symptoms. No, I don’t get it either.

98087 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #350 of 1374 🔗

Upside down logic.

97269 Gerry Mandarin, 10, #351 of 1374 🔗

Still showing 0 deaths in hospital on the 19th August.

97273 Julian, replying to Julian, 5, #352 of 1374 🔗

I do not recall if this has been posted or discussed:


Boris Johnson has been urged to commit to a “zero-Covid” approach across England by a group of MPs and peers.
In a letter to the Prime Minister, the All-Party Parliamentary Group on coronavirus called on the Government to maintain compulsory social distancing measures across the country until zero-Covid is achieved.

97290 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Julian, 5, #353 of 1374 🔗

So he can be dictator forever. When does Il Duce finish his hols?

98462 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Thinkaboutit, #354 of 1374 🔗

Il Duce came to a sticky end though along with his woman. Lampposts have many uses Bozo should bear that in mind.

97291 ▶▶ annie, replying to Julian, 13, #355 of 1374 🔗

Forever, then.
And we shall ignore them, forever.
God damn them to hell. Hell is for ever.

97295 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Julian, 13, #356 of 1374 🔗

Zero-covid? So never, then. Accordingly, if these morons get their way we’ll have antisocial distancing and face nappies permanently.

97601 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Tenchy, 4, #357 of 1374 🔗

It’s over when the Davos lot say it’s over. Johnson or indeed no international government is in charge of this shit show (or anything else). Just puppets giving the illusion of democracy

98444 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to T. Prince, #358 of 1374 🔗

That is so true.

97310 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Julian, 9, #359 of 1374 🔗

Should be advising zero-dementia, kills way more people see LS 2 hours ago

97417 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to karenovirus, 2, #360 of 1374 🔗

Some of them in the group have dementia, others are mentally ill!

97346 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Julian, 14, #361 of 1374 🔗

By all publicly available statistics the virus is gone, and has been gone for months. Yet the “authorities” tighten and extend the restrictions further and further.

James Corbett coined the phrase “Medical Martial Law” earlier this year. This is what we are facing folks.

97361 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Richard O, 1, #362 of 1374 🔗

I don’t think I’d agree it has gone and has been gone for months but I would say that infections are mainly among the young where it is unlikely to have much effect. (Except in Preston where it is taken home to kill Granny).

97379 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to arfurmo, 5, #363 of 1374 🔗

How many of these ongoing infections are asymptomatic i.e. the immune system is doing its job and doesn’t need any assistance?

The genius of the virus narrative is that it will never be beaten. And there are dozens of new strains every year to keep the show going.

98451 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Richard O, #364 of 1374 🔗

Of course it means our immune systems are doing their job, they’re integral to our survival. I think the sheep don’t even realise we even have one, and the fact is wearing masks inhibit the immune system from doing its job! You couldn’t make it up.

97411 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to arfurmo, 3, #365 of 1374 🔗

It has gone in terms of a public health emergency, if there ever was one.

97353 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Julian, 7, #366 of 1374 🔗

“Group chairwoman, Liberal Democrat MP Layla Moran”

Ugh. Her again. I saw an interview with her, pre-election I think, and I thought she was barking mad back then…

These MPS and peers who call for Zero-Covid – traitors all.

97628 ▶▶▶ daveh2, replying to Mr Dee, #367 of 1374 🔗

She’s my MP. She had not responded to the emails & letters I’ve sent her since lockdown started.

98453 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Mr Dee, #368 of 1374 🔗

Ugh indeed!

97357 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Julian, 4, #369 of 1374 🔗

Zero-flu as well, morons?

97365 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Mark, 2, #370 of 1374 🔗

Terrifyingly, I can imagine that happening as a further justification for maintaining restrictions indefinitely.

97401 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mark, 2, #371 of 1374 🔗

Zero death.

97414 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Julian, 2, #372 of 1374 🔗

Wow, some real intellects in that group:


Have any of them achieved anything in the ‘real world’!

97418 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Julian, 3, #373 of 1374 🔗

Sadly, it is very hard to argue against safe-ism. Wouldn’t be shocked if Boris Johnson indulges this way of thinking. Safe-ism is politically safe.

97463 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to stewart, 3, #374 of 1374 🔗

Safe-ism is politically safe as long as people believe what they are being kept safe from is worse than the cost of the safety in economic and lost liberty and enjoyment terms. Imagine we had a limitless budget and could make beautiful TV commercials or films about Sweden, showing unmasked people dancing, empty hospitals, granny-hugging, low unemployment etc. Sooner or later people would start to think “I want some of that”.

97509 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Julian, 3, #375 of 1374 🔗

Zero-COVID is the equivalent of closing your eyes and ears and wishing it had never happened.

97826 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Julian, 2, #376 of 1374 🔗

Zero covid? Then he should be calling for the extinction of the human race which can be achieved by mass suicide.

He and Wancock should volunteer to go first.

98089 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Julian, #377 of 1374 🔗

Who sits on this All-Party Parliamentary Group?

98460 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Julian, #378 of 1374 🔗

Zero Covid along with zero carbon. I was called a conspiracy theorist for daring to link the connection to the Climate zealots. Doesn’t seem too mad now does it?

97289 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 2, #379 of 1374 🔗

More Tegnell bashing in The Telegraph (paywall). Have a look at the comments, though (non-paywall):


97317 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Tenchy, 3, #380 of 1374 🔗

What a puddled broadsheet they are. One minute sceptical, the next lockdownistas

97334 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #381 of 1374 🔗

At least they are giving both sides of the argument unlike most of the MSM who never publish anything that is sceptical.

97356 ▶▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #382 of 1374 🔗

Like journalists have independent minds and not just one hive brain? Who’d have thought it!

97671 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, #383 of 1374 🔗

“journalists have independent minds”

That is highly debatable

97321 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Tenchy, 7, #384 of 1374 🔗

This Mark Brolin twat really has it in for Sweden, just looks at his articles:


Great comment ‘Did your wife run off with a Swede?’

97355 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Sarigan, 4, #385 of 1374 🔗

Indeed. I recall highlighting disgraceful Brolin articles about Sweden here back in April, I think.

He really has been a disgrace on that topic and if the Telegraph had any concern for truth and honesty in its staff they’d be suspending him and investigating his reporting.

97303 mjr, replying to mjr, 14, #386 of 1374 🔗

Dentist update.. This morning (on yesterday’s page) i mentioned my issue with my dentist. I phoned for a repeat prescription for a high flouride toothpaste that they had recommended last year. They said that under their new covid processes they wouldnt issue a prescription without seeing me and wouldnt see me as it was not an emergency.
I sent them an email about how illogical this was.
Anyway good news. They have just phoned me back and said yes they can issue a prescription. The receptionist was very apologetic and said that the rules were ever changing and so very confusing . She agreed that the whole thing was tosh anyway and i think was a sceptic.
One thing that did puzzle me was after confirming my details she then asked a load of covid questions . (living with anyone isolating, then asking if in the last two weeks had any covid symptoms – where she listed them one by one which took ages (as we know being alive is a covid symptom)) Clearly not relevant to the specific request of posting me a prescription so i wonder if this a data gathering exercise for NHS or others?

97445 ▶▶ Biker, replying to mjr, 2, #387 of 1374 🔗

Bro the last thing i’d do is clean my teeth with fluoride toothpaste, that shit is real bad for you.

97500 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Biker, #388 of 1374 🔗

generally yes – especially for the young which is why it is prescription.. However for an old fart with dodgy teeth it is worth it

97304 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 4, #389 of 1374 🔗

Just have to post agin as i have no idea how to mask a hamster, any suggestions?:

Looking into DELVE, which is part of the Royal Society:
This is their “facemarks study report”:
They are a data analytical group so no need for medical people, just data analysis.
Few gems from the “report/study” if you can call it that”

  • A series of controlled experiments in a hamster SARS-CoV2 transmission model
  • the majority of SARS-CoV2 infected individuals remain asymptomatic throughout infection. and “the index animal was “masked”’ WTF?
  • There are no human controlled trials on the efficacy of universal mask use in stemming SARS-CoV2 transmission.
  • However, the conclusions of this study are not supported by the presented evidence , as summarized by a number of scientists requesting a retraction by the authors.

Underwhelming to say the least was my first and second impression reading through it.
Like the 6 countries study on diets it’s cherry picked data with what does not meet your preconceived ideas being ejected and not included – ergo, not mention of the 15 or 16 reals studies done using humans in surgical settings that contradict their finding completely.

97343 ▶▶ matt, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #390 of 1374 🔗

Someone posted a link to this study and a precise of it a few days ago. Essentially they put a barrier between the hamster cages. Equivalent? Why no. No it isn’t.

97382 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to matt, 4, #391 of 1374 🔗

How does that work? Can’t see it myself.

If this is what “intelligent” people with a university education call science nowadays glad I left school at 16 and went to work instead as I found 4 A-levels (applied maths, physics, electronic engineering and pure maths) boring and couldn’t face 2 more years at college and 3 at Uni to “get educated”.

97396 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to matt, 4, #392 of 1374 🔗

I have never heard a hamster sneeze or cough.

97375 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Awkward Git, 16, #393 of 1374 🔗

The shit that’s passing for science these days is very scary. I discovered the other day that the authors of the only RCT of cloth vs. medical masks (cloth is useless, medical slightly better than useless) have now come out with an “opinion” piece calling for widespread masking — basically contradicting their own 2015 study in the BMJ, probably due to political pressure. I don’t know what’s worse, that they’d bow to political pressure or that they really now believe that their own research was crap.

97319 Polemon2, replying to Polemon2, 2, #394 of 1374 🔗

Wondering why BBC is suddenly interested in virus transmission whilst singing? Item on TV last night showing a test in progress (clearly in an environment with no relationship to the real world) showing singing breaths travel further than talking breaths.(Another proof of the bleedin’ obvious) Same issue turned up on World at One on radio. Might just be coincidence of course…….

97398 ▶▶ annie, replying to Polemon2, 7, #395 of 1374 🔗

Because yesterday a study was published with evidence that singing carried bugs no further than ordinary breathing. See yesterday’s comments.
BBC Lie machine in action.

97410 ▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to annie, 1, #396 of 1374 🔗

Can you repost that study, please? I’m lazy.

97438 ▶▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Ed Phillips, 6, #397 of 1374 🔗

I read the BBC Website article about it. They just can’t help themselves can they? Singing and talking at low levels has the same spray says study. But the last word goes to a scientist who says: “The risks should not be overly underestimated or played down because of this – we don’t want choir members getting infected and potentially dying from Covid-19 whilst doing what they love.”
What a load of scaredy cat nonsense.

97592 ▶▶▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Ed Phillips, 2, #398 of 1374 🔗

Some would say doing what you love is a perfect way to go.

97461 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to annie, #399 of 1374 🔗

I don’t think it was even part of the usual propaganda. It was just a study that had been done in response to the bullshit forced on groups meeting together.

97499 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Polemon2, 5, #400 of 1374 🔗

It will lead to mandatory mask wearing whenever you’re out of your house……then the promise that a vaccine is our route back to ‘normal’. It will be voluntary but you won’t be able to lice a ‘normal’ life without it. The script has been written….

97968 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to T. Prince, #401 of 1374 🔗

So tear up the script and throw it in their faces.

98011 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to T. Prince, #402 of 1374 🔗

I can’t really beleive that merely sticking a needle in everyone’s arm is the goal of a sinister global conspiracy. If there is a conspiracy beind this then they aren’t interested in getting a chance to give everyone a vaccine, any conspiracy behind this is a lot more interested in harnessing track-and-trace systems for extending the reach of tyranny.

98073 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to seventeen, #403 of 1374 🔗

First find out what ingredients might make up the vaccine.

97328 RickH, replying to RickH, 26, #404 of 1374 🔗

The tweet from Catherine Noakes about eating in a restaurant being ‘risky’ is – even at a time when one’s mouth involuntarily falls frequently open with disbelief – a corker.

How anyone with any claim to a scientific background (which I’ve always assumed includes a firm grasp of statistical concepts such as probability and risk) could perpetuate such patent nonsense whilst being a member of the group responsible for advice on the subject – is beyond any rational comprehension.

… although it would make sense if SAGE members were vetted to ensure high levels of incompetence and brown-nosing.

97330 ▶▶ Julian, replying to RickH, 12, #405 of 1374 🔗

I really don’t think she believes it’s true. It was said for effect, IMO. She’s wicked, not stupid.

97345 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 2, #406 of 1374 🔗

I guess that’s another interpretation – an even bigger indictment!

97405 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RickH, 2, #407 of 1374 🔗

I just can’t believe anyone is that stupid.

97471 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Julian, 1, #408 of 1374 🔗

Believe it!

97407 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to RickH, 4, #409 of 1374 🔗

Gulag for her when it’s all over

97337 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 4, #410 of 1374 🔗

WHY did this reader test his/her family on return to the UK? “Want a lockdown? Get a test”
see Windswept Testing Facilities (above)A reader has been in touch to tell me about his testing experience when he came back from his hols.

To my astonishment, after asking me why I wanted to test myself and family (I said because we’d been travelling), the operator said it was a waste of time but yes, even if we had no symptoms and were not essential workers we could have one.

It took about 20 minutes for the whole family to self-administer the tests in the car, and we drove off leaving them to the deserted car park. That’s the way the money goes.

97342 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Victoria, 13, #411 of 1374 🔗

one of my housemates just came back from 4 weeks abroad. He is supposed to be isolating for 14 days. Certainly he is not going to work as they wont have him, but otherwise he is not isolating and none of the rest of us are and no one is going near a testing station.
Anyway we both think we had covid in february

97360 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Victoria, 3, #412 of 1374 🔗

Perhaps they thought (rationally, if incorrectly) that a negative test would get them off the quarantine hook. Or perhaps the ongoing government message ‘get tested, save lives’ ( read/hear if you don’t get a test you are a killer) has a powerful subliminal influence even on some of us who are sceptically inclined.

97351 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 7, #413 of 1374 🔗

Dr Hilary Jones has become a bit of a wrong un, hasn’t he?

97586 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #414 of 1374 🔗

All tv doctors are nuts. Look at that Sarah Jarvis, nanny on steroids. We call her Scary Jarvis.

97354 matt, replying to matt, 8, #415 of 1374 🔗

Am currently sitting on a train on my way into London bridge. Unmuzzled chap in his 30s diagonally opposite me. All others wearing nappies.

97435 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to matt, 7, #416 of 1374 🔗

Strike up a chat with him. Show the others what they’re missing in social interaction.

97358 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #417 of 1374 🔗

Has there been any studies yet that link scepticism to productivity? I’d bet a pound to a penny that bedwetters are mostly made up of the retired, the furloughed and the work shy.

97374 ▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Tom Blackburn, 11, #418 of 1374 🔗

Don’t make generalisations while I’m around!
I’ve been retired for ahem a few years, still work part time but have been furloughed. It’s horrible not being able to work, I hate it.
So that’s all three of your assumptions blown out of the water.
I have been an angry sceptic for four months.

97725 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to bluemoon, 2, #419 of 1374 🔗

And the last thing we need is people trying to divide the little island community we have here. Spoken as a semi-retired, low-income, left-wing sceptic.

98007 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to bluemoon, 1, #420 of 1374 🔗

My situation is semi-similar, I’m younger, I like my job, I’ve been getting adequate pay throughout this panic crisis but I’m damn furious at not being able to work because of bed-wetting bosses.

97378 ▶▶ EssieSW, replying to Tom Blackburn, 7, #421 of 1374 🔗

Perhaps, however my OH was furloughed and is a complete sceptic so was desperate to go back to work (thankfully has been now since July), my teacher friend also desperate to go back to school and teach her year 11’s properly , and my retired grandfather broke lockdown many times to go on long bike rides etc and pretty much ignores all restrictions.
One of my more ‘bedwetting’ friends is currently working from home in her 3 bed house and large garden so lockdown has been more comfortable for her.

Maybe a study into scepticism and how comfortable you are physically (large house, outdoor space etc) and financially (still has a job and can work from home) could be an indicator.

97386 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tom Blackburn, 9, #422 of 1374 🔗

FFS – stop trying to use this shambles to make childish sectarian nonsense. It’s far too serious for party games

97432 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Tom Blackburn, 7, #423 of 1374 🔗

Furloughed against my will. Worked throughout the furlough, doing voluntary work for my company that would help it bring in a small income stream while the business was more or less shut down. I did not treat the furlough as a holiday, as I know that a price will have to paid at some point, and did my bit to help cushion the company I work for, to hopefully secure my continuing employment.

97457 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Tom Blackburn, 7, #424 of 1374 🔗

I’m still furloughed from my normal well paid job, getting less than 50% of my normal wage due to the cap in place. Since March, I’ve taken on a really soul destroying job working 5 nights a week to make up some of the difference. Wish I wasn’t furloughed, it’s had a really bad impact on my family life, but I’m one of the ‘lucky’ ones as at least I still have some income!

I think the only things that make someone more likely to be a sceptic are a more critically thinking mind and a pragmatic approach to life in general. Scepticism seems to transcend education levels, income levels etc. Some people can just sense BS and others can’t, or are slower to.

98090 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, #425 of 1374 🔗

Their BS meters need an overhaul and a tuneup.

97481 ▶▶ Sylvie, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #426 of 1374 🔗

Disagree. Those posting here sound like they are retired, furloughed and working, old, middle aged and young (from the ages cited yesterday alone), and range politically from anarchic to traditionalist. Some seem to have more than their fair share of health problems. Productivity in the usual sense is not a marker for scepticism.

97558 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, #427 of 1374 🔗

It never ceases to amaze me how many people can respond to a comment asking a question… without answering the question

97692 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Tom Blackburn, #428 of 1374 🔗

I would imagine that most people do not know whether there have been any studies into the matter so cannot answer your question. Instead, they are providing their own experiences in response to your theory.

If I had to guess I would say that there have almost certainly been no studies examining the link between productivity and scepticism. Question answered!

97583 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #429 of 1374 🔗

I’m retired and more cynical by the day. I want everyone back to their normal work and maskless in shops. Dont assume all oldies are bedwetters. Well not mentally, anyway.

97830 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tom Blackburn, #430 of 1374 🔗

Don’t forget financially well off as well.

97362 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 27, #431 of 1374 🔗

DM headline

Pregnant women and new mothers died needlessly in lockdown after being denied intensive care beds or mental health services, Oxford University report finds

Still clapping for the NHS?

97395 ▶▶ annie, replying to Victoria, 6, #432 of 1374 🔗

I heard that no post-natal care was provided. That’s not true, is it? Can’t be?

97412 ▶▶▶ alw, replying to annie, 12, #433 of 1374 🔗

My daughter in law had a baby just before lockdown. Baby jaundiced but sent home 48 hours after birth. Had treatment at home for first week, but since then virtually nothing. No support other than friends and family. Baby has had routine vaccinations. Thank goodness my son was able to work from home. Unsurprisingly she has felt very down at times because of limitations and that is saying something because she is a doctor!

97437 ▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to alw, 11, #434 of 1374 🔗

And no mums and baby groups which are so vital for the mental health of new mothers. Yet more collateral damage…

98091 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Will, 1, #435 of 1374 🔗

When we add up all the negatives we have to wonder what is their real game plan? They are too callous, indifferent and uncaring. It’s more than scandaous, it’s criminal!

97460 ▶▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to annie, 7, #436 of 1374 🔗

Anecdotally from a good friend who gave birth during lockdown…yes there are post-natal wards as many women will have had surgery of some kind. However they’re not allowed visitors so it’s a sad solitary few days struggling with a newborn. After that all after-care at home is done over the phone.

Obviously there were no pre-natal classes either. The saddest part for me was that new mothers had to wear masks if having c-sections so unable to kiss their new babies or even let them see their face 🙁

97465 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, 2, #437 of 1374 🔗

It’s too depressing for words.

97368 2 pence, replying to 2 pence, #439 of 1374 🔗

This guidance document provides basic principles for pro-vaccine spokespersons on how to behave and respond to vocal vaccine deniers in a public debate. Vocal vaccine deniers are individuals who do not accept recommended vaccines, are not open to a change of mind no matter the scientific evidence and are actively advocating against vaccination. The guidance in this document was developed based on psychological research on persuasion, on research in public health and communication and on WHO risk communication guidelines. The guidance is primarily intended for spokespersons of health authorities who want to prepare for a public event with a vocal vaccine denier.


97373 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to 2 pence, #440 of 1374 🔗


97415 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to 2 pence, 3, #441 of 1374 🔗

We know how they operate. They use key emotive prompt words and phrases like “safe”, “protect”, and “your child” while failing to communicate the warnings contained in the accompanying leaflets or explaining how a vaccine works.

97462 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to 2 pence, 6, #442 of 1374 🔗

LOL. Annnnd still I am unmoved. They can call me all the names they want it doesn’t stop me from thinking they are being gullible fools. They can mask up and vaccinate themselves I don’t care, but I won’t be joining them.

97900 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to 2 pence, 4, #443 of 1374 🔗

This is a really good practical document for sceptics to use, well done 2pence for finding it. We could all learn effective ways to argue the case against lockdown from it. Important, for example, to realise that you are not arguing to convince the vocal lockdownista, because you can’t. But the audience of the worried well will notice your reasonable demeanour. You can convey confidence, set high goals like getting all young people back into education/achieving natural immunity by mixing as much as possible/getting the economy in its feet again. Express moral conviction by talking about the collateral damage from cancer treatments lost, suicide etc., use rhetorical questions :”do we really want to give up our entire way of life and shut down our health service to deal with a disease less deadly than the flu?”
Prepare 3 key messages, keep them simple, repeat them. Be honest and transparent, and avoid humour – doesn’t work in a health context. Avoid repeating the pro lockdown arguments, as the brain remembers repeated messages more easily. Respond with correct info instead. Don’t question their motivation as it drags focus away from the facts and leaves room for their emotional narratives. Use inclusive terms, like”we as parents…as members of a community.. ” Underline scientific consensus, emphasise social benefits 1 like return to normal GP opening, theatre going etc. Lots of useful hints and tips for our daily communication with workmates, social circle, any sphere where you are known as a sensible person whose views are respected.

97372 ikaraki, replying to ikaraki, 3, #444 of 1374 🔗

So they decided to expend energy already, the fools. It was done, finished, my battle lost. Suddenly re-engaged, and I straight up ruin their day. Oh boys and girls, today I am smiling!

97388 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to ikaraki, 3, #445 of 1374 🔗

what happened?

97397 Winston Smith, replying to Winston Smith, 13, #446 of 1374 🔗

Literally just got back from our local Tesco’s, 95% muzzled shoppers, about 5 other normals.

I was hoping for some sort confrontation today as I’m totally pissed off with the whole clown show.

Waiting at the checkout, the geezer in front of me, packing his shopping away, had some sort cyberpunk-face face mask on, like his lower face was like fucking Johnny Mnemonic or something.

I had the overwhelming urge to punch him straight in his stupid face.

Instead, I……

a) looked away, embarrassed for him.
b) laughed out loud, pointing at him.
c) glared at him, provoking him to make eye contact with me.

97403 ▶▶ EssieSW, replying to Winston Smith, 2, #447 of 1374 🔗


97419 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Winston Smith, 1, #448 of 1374 🔗

c, b, a

97421 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Winston Smith, 11, #449 of 1374 🔗

Sheep and bedwetters don’t realise that forcing others to change their lives in order to make themselves feel safe is an incredibly aggressive act.

I assume it is just a question of time before people who don’t want to be told how to live their lives start pushing back. There is only so much aggression one can take without responding.

97430 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to stewart, 2, #450 of 1374 🔗

Passive aggression on stilts.

97454 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to stewart, 3, #451 of 1374 🔗

Yes – I would suggest that inciontinence pads would be more appropriate than face masks – and less obtrusive

97534 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to stewart, 3, #452 of 1374 🔗

I assume it is just a question of time before people who don’t want to be told how to live their lives start pushing back .”

Already started,as per this posted here yesterday:

Man who was haranguing rail staff for not wearing face masks at busy London station is knocked unconscious by pram-pushing passerby – who was also bare-faced

97614 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to stewart, 4, #453 of 1374 🔗

Rage Against the Machine goes through my head all the time. Sometimes I start singing it (at home alone, my singing is terrible).

“F*** you, I won’t do what you tell me.”

I am so overwhelmingly sick and tired of being told what to do. It’s not like anyone gave a rat’s ass about me or my life before.

97937 ▶▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to ConstantBees, #454 of 1374 🔗

Bullet in the head…!

98092 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to stewart, #455 of 1374 🔗

Start a new country for the sheep where they can graze at their leisure, wearing their masks.

97458 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Winston Smith, 5, #456 of 1374 🔗

That is why I now do click and collect shopping. Its quite brilliant really and I don’t have to mix with the sheep.

97550 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to Bella Donna, 2, #457 of 1374 🔗

Agreed and I find I shop much more efficiently which is, I imagine, why Tesco are offering all sorts for actually shopping in store where you end up spending an extra 10% on impulse buys. My reason for so doing, since face nappies came in, is I think they are disgustingly insanitary and more likely to spread the colds, sickness, diarrhoea etc that I don’t want my daughter, who is having chemotherapy, getting.

97502 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Winston Smith, 3, #458 of 1374 🔗

Few extra unmuzzled in Tesco today but what was astonishing was how many people now wear their muzzles wrong or half-hearted so that they are useless and more comfortable.

They are almost ready for the next step of going out and not wearing one.

97596 ▶▶ watashi, replying to Winston Smith, 1, #459 of 1374 🔗


97693 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to watashi, #460 of 1374 🔗

Sorry, too late 🤗

97616 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Winston Smith, #461 of 1374 🔗

1st prize goes to EssieSW 👍🏻

97422 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 5, #462 of 1374 🔗

I’m not a scientist or a doctor

Could someone please explain how the PCR test works. I don’t mean in general terms.

What exactly does the test do

I ask because whole towns/cities are being locked up on the basis of these tests; yet, it would appear that those testing ‘positive’ are not ill.

So if they test positive but are not ill, do they ‘have’ the virus? If they have the virus can they infect other people?

97429 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cecil B, 1, #463 of 1374 🔗

I’m not qualified to explain, though I’ve read a few explanations on the web.

To summarise, inventing it won Kary Mullis a Nobel prize. 🙂

97431 ▶▶ ted, replying to Cecil B, 8, #464 of 1374 🔗

The PCR is designed to detect the presence of sections of RNA that are believed to be unique to the SARS COV 2 virus. These bits on RNA have been found in several studies to be present in some cases even when the live virus is not found for the person, which requires a separate test, PCR is not a way to test for live viruses. And these live virus secondary tests are rarely done. Dead fragments of viral RNA can be present in nasal and throat tissues for weeks and even months after one’s immune system has dealt with an earlier infection, often with only mild or no symptoms of illness.

97434 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Cecil B, 5, #465 of 1374 🔗

PCRs test for a sample of the genetic material of the virus. So it would be a bit like looking for a page of a book by looking for a phrase that appears on that page.

People who test positive can not be ill for a number of reasons. Two that I’m aware of are:

  1. They have the virus, but not enough of it to make them sick, so their immune system is coping with it before they present symptoms.
  2. False positive. Because the test only tries to find a small matching part of the entire virus, this apparently leads to a number of false positives. How many seems to be a matter of great debate.

I’m not a virologist, but that’s what I’ve managed to discern from what I’ve read.

97441 ▶▶▶ DressageRider, replying to stewart, 1, #466 of 1374 🔗

False positives could be as high as 5%. However, there are more false negatives I believe.

97658 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to DressageRider, #467 of 1374 🔗

Yes usually about 30%.

97452 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to stewart, 2, #468 of 1374 🔗

I think it worth saying that the link between an RNA strand and a particular actual virus is highly suspect in the first place.

97665 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to RickH, #469 of 1374 🔗

Why’s that suspect? The virus has been fully sequenced about 50,000 times so we have a pretty good idea of what RNA to look for.

97522 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to stewart, 2, #470 of 1374 🔗

They also may still have non-infectious fragments from Covid if they had it at some point, so they can be quarantined for an illness they already had and recovered from.

97455 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Jack, 2, #472 of 1374 🔗

Thanks, astonishing, it was never intended for the purpose for which it’s being used

97468 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Cecil B, #473 of 1374 🔗

Yep that’s the gist of it.

97682 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Cecil B, 2, #474 of 1374 🔗

I haven’t looked at the second one but that off-guardian article is fake news. 77th Brigade pissing in the knowledge pool.

The test is about 70% sensitive and 95% specific or better for detecting an active infection with a viable virus. This makes it a pretty decent tool per se.

Testing asymptomatic people in the UK right now is essentially pointless because of Bayes Theorem not because it’s a bad test in itself.

98122 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to guy153, 2, #475 of 1374 🔗

I read a good book on this recently that explained it well.

The HIV PCR test is thought to be be about 99.8% accurate. You are not having unprotected sex with a high risk population or an IV drug user. Your HIV test comes back positive. What is the probability that you have HIV?

Actually about 50% because the prevalence of HIV in the non risky population is so low that it’s equivalent to the risk of a false positive.

I have probably misremembered the numbers but you get the point. If something is a rare event (like being infected with corona), you need a very very very accurate test to detect it with any degree of precision.

98169 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Sophie123, 1, #476 of 1374 🔗

Yes this is exactly the problem. Here is a corona example. Suppose the test is 70% sensitive and 99.5% specific, which are reasonable assumptions. So 30% of actual positives slip through the net and give you a negative test result, but 0.5% of actual negatives crop up as false positives.

At the height of the epidemic drive-thru testing in Bavaria was getting as high as 20% positive, or 50% or so in NYC. Some selection bias, but it’s likely that at the peak at least 20% of people are actually positive. But now the prevalence in the UK is somewhere around 0.05%.

If prevalence is 20% then with that 70%/99.5% test, a positive test means a 97.22% chance of having SARS2 and a negative test a 7.01% chance.

Now that it’s 0.05%, with the same test, positive means a 6.55% chance of having SARS2 and negative 0.02%.

So you would have more chance of having SARS2 if you tested negative at the end of March than if you were asymptomatic and tested positive now. But the PCR test is a good test. Just gotta know how and when to use it.

98254 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to guy153, 2, #477 of 1374 🔗

Thank you for the excellent explanation.In the height of the pandemic a clinical suspected case admitted to hospital was always tested twice in case the first test was negative as the risk of false negative was so high.
Still NZ requires two neg PCR tests to leave their concentration camps altough low negative percentage in their testing situation.

97748 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Cecil B, 2, #478 of 1374 🔗

Be careful. The test is not complete trash. It’s a good tool for working out what infection you’re treating for people who are showing symptoms and you need to be sure. It’s a very bad tool for surveying a population for the asymptomatic presence of a virus on a large scale.

97598 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Cecil B, #479 of 1374 🔗

Any samples must be replicated many times in a laboratory to be able to detect any Corona RNA. The likelyhood of cross contamination and false positives is therefor quite high, especially in cheaper lab settings or if the lab does a lot of tests.
Sadly the governments around the world have had a theory presented in March, and now do not want to loose face by admitting they got it wrong. The education and protests have to come from the people.

97687 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Silke David, 1, #480 of 1374 🔗

It’s not quite high in the grand scheme of things. Somewhere between 0.05% and 5%. But when the thing you’re looking for is extremely rare (which it now is in the UK) this matters.

97423 Bella, replying to Bella, 2, #481 of 1374 🔗

Don’t know if anyone’s asked this question as I’m coming to this update late and 300 plus comments is too much to scroll through but on the surface don’t those ‘stop press’ figures for increased hospital admissions in France seem a little alarming for those of us, like me, who think this virus is past its sell-by date? Anyone got an alternative take on that or are we looking at the dreaded second wave which I never really believed in? Given that France copped it earlier than we did at the beginning of the year are we going to see an increase here that will belie all us sceptics? Or are the figures being massaged? Bit concerned as I thought it was all over bar the shouting. Is this the excuse to muzzle us 24 hours a day?

97426 ▶▶ hat man, replying to Bella, 6, #482 of 1374 🔗

The answer may be in today’s Telegraph article: in England, non-Covid cases admitted to hospital were bundled into the Covid count. There are many ways to fake statistics if the French authorities want to. Now GB has brought in a quarantine, they have a lot less to lose.

97444 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to hat man, 6, #483 of 1374 🔗

They are doing the same in some US states – anyone admitted to hospital for any reason is tested, and they are included in the stats if positive, even if they are not ill with covid.

97618 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Julian, #484 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for all your answers. I was suspecting similar to what most of you have said.

97512 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to hat man, #485 of 1374 🔗

For every C-19 admission to hospitals and even ICUs you need to know whether they are admitted for C-19 disease. In the US, 25% of all admitted pregnant women have C-19.This just show they had C-19 previously and now admitted for pregnancy related causes but not true C-19 illness. In Spain, you could have RTA ending up in ICU but screened C-19 pos and stamped C-19 case ICU. Somebody needs to sift through the data now for true C-19 hospitalisations. It is not reliable.

97433 ▶▶ Will, replying to Bella, 7, #486 of 1374 🔗

I have always thought that countries like France and Spain that had very localised outbreaks in March but locked down the whole country would be susceptible to a wave of infections when lockdown was lifted. It wouldn’t be a second wave because they never had the first wave in many areas. Because the UK locked down later, after the virus had been allowed to spread further throughout the population, indeed it was already declining, in our much more densely populated country, I think we are much closer to herd immunity throughout the country. Herd immunity doesn’t mean cases will stop overnight but there won’t be enough people, without immunity, for the disease to spread exponentially.

97450 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Will, 2, #487 of 1374 🔗

That’s a good go at explaining it. Dr John Campbell touches on it here in what is a very uplifting presentation all over


97557 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Will, 2, #488 of 1374 🔗

Yes. The UK numbers are reported as “the worst in Europe”. But, the point is that they are not particularly bad. Once you take the lower excess deaths now (from e.g. dementia and cancer) you end up with nothing unusual. Other countries may catch up, but it is not in an absolute sense bad.
1650 people die every day on average. We don’t have news reports and emotive photos of the loved one. It’s normal.

97443 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to Bella, 6, #489 of 1374 🔗

Seems to be part of a push for masks. I’m not sure where you’ve seen hospital numbers for France but I couldn’t see any in the article. I can see they’ve had 3,000 test positive, but their numbers are jumping around like mad, I imagine heavily heavily influenced by rate of testing. I wonder if their deaths are moving…

Unless they quantify what hospitalisation means too, it may just mean people checking in and out again in a day, or it may mean needing actual treatment. It could mean, like it turns out it does here, they’re going in for reason X and test positive, so they whack them down as Covid.

It continues to be a source of frustration that, since mandating masks ‘cases’ have gone up, and instead of pausing and having a think about that, they’re just mandating masks in more and more places. Where in the world has there been ANY evidence that masks have definitively helped? No where, and yet they are set to become part of every aspect of life. They are even mandating people riding bikes wear them in Toulouse now, which is SURELY a recipe for disaster? Hot and sweaty people exercising – stick a mask on, it’s good for you.

97436 nat, replying to nat, 4, #490 of 1374 🔗

Has anyone looked at the ‘ Stop New Normal ‘ the new anti-lockdown website mentioned in the news round up today ? I just had a peek. They have an upcoming protest in London:

NO MORE LOCKDOWNS – Restore Jobs, Rights and Freedoms – NO to all Covid Vax programs No to Bill Gates Rule – Stop New Normal and New World Order.​Top Professional Doctors, Nurses and Campaigners Speaking OutWith Real truth about Covid-19 and the Plandemic

No New Normal ? It looks very much like the new normal to me, when you get a
respectable looking bunch of people coming together to protest the New World Order.

I wonder if the fact that Toby listed this is a sign that he is becomingi more conspiratorially minded? Or a hint to the conspiratorially minded among us here to migrate? Or just that Lockdown Sceptics is a broad church ? ( I am in a mischievous mood today.)

97442 ▶▶ Julian, replying to nat, 24, #491 of 1374 🔗

We should be a broad church though personally I think we’re better off sticking to a core message that the virus is demonstrably not as dangerous as first thought and that lockdown and continuing measures are disproportionate and harmful on many levels. I think that’s easier to sell.

I think the position on vaccines should be that they may be of limited use to some, in the same way that flu vaccines are, but there should be proper testing and no compulsion

The NWO stuff may or may not be true, but I think it is harder to sell to a mainstream audience. It’s a question of tactics.

97448 ▶▶▶ Achilles, replying to Julian, 12, #492 of 1374 🔗

I agree. The rhetoric of the conspiracy theorist just makes it easy for you to be disregarded by the people who we need to change the minds of if we are to achieve anything.

97456 ▶▶▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Achilles, 12, #493 of 1374 🔗

Also agree. I’m just not a believer in conspiracy theories. It’s imparting far too much intelligence to people who are in reality thick as mince. Incompetence always wins over conspiracy.

It’s already too easy for the coronamaniacs to dismiss any narrative that challenges the mainstream presentation of the pandemic without giving them extra ammo that we are all conspiracy theory enthusiasts.

97527 ▶▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to The Spingler, 3, #494 of 1374 🔗

I agree with you all about the core message. I agree the ones in charge are as thick as mince. But. are they really the ones in charge ? 😉

97627 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to The Spingler, 1, #495 of 1374 🔗

Intelligence that has locked up most of the world for five months and counting ?

Maybe you mean something else by ‘mince’ though ?

97451 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 8, #496 of 1374 🔗

I think we’re better off sticking to a core message”

I totally agree. Being diverted into other mere hobby-horses simply dilutes the message – and risks alienating many that you want to recruit.

I guess many of us know how difficult it is to get over that core simple, objective message against a barrage of brain-washing. Confusing it with contestable political views does no service at all, as it contaminates the factual with the disputable.

97716 ▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to RickH, 5, #497 of 1374 🔗

Personally I don’t think this is too bad a stance to take – below is from StandupX website – also contributing to the Trafalgar Square demo. Sounds pretty democratic to me – a ‘broad church.’ And as I’ve said before – I’m a bit tired of writing and reading comments and emailing MP’s…

We are a community of struggle against the New Normal.

We include many views and many minds of individuals and wide-ranging groups.

We March Separately and Strike Together.

We welcome all people questioning the mainstream narrative to come meet us, join in discussions, and participate in peaceful rallies.

98079 ▶▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to gina, 1, #498 of 1374 🔗

That sounds wonderful – people are really starting to question things.

97498 ▶▶▶ Eddie, replying to Julian, 1, #499 of 1374 🔗

Core message all the way!

97546 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Julian, 5, #500 of 1374 🔗

I agree. I don’t think disputing the interpretation is that difficult. In fact, I am getting a bit surprised that more doctors and health professionals are not raising their voices. It is quite obvious that the data about admissions and deaths do not add up to a pandemic. They add up to a case of medical hysteria.

98098 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to WhyNow, 1, #501 of 1374 🔗

They are afraid of losing their jobs, that’s why.

97607 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Julian, 8, #502 of 1374 🔗

One problem we have as lockdown sceptics is that ALL of us are conflated with the 5G crowd, anti-vaxxers, NWO-ers, lizard gang, etc. To actually use them as a means to persuade people to come over to our way of thinking will not work. Whatever you think of the theories/beliefs.

Another snag is that the left-wing press paint us as ultra-right wing hardline Brexiteers; and the right-wing press paint us as crypto-Communist ultra ultra Remainers, doing our very best to undo Brexit and bring down the government.

I have little doubt that we have people on the sceptic team who subscribe to a number of the views listed above, but I think all of us just want to see the end of the lockdown and a return to normality, with all its faults. The rest, as somebody else here put it, is flim-flam.

We can get on with disagreeing over who controls whom, whose needles we want, or don’t want, to get stuck with, and squabbling how we want to make normality better after we have seen the resumption of that normality, complete with civil liberties and rights restored.

97667 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #503 of 1374 🔗

Wise words.
First slay the dragon.

97999 ▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #504 of 1374 🔗

Might help to show up to such a protest with some signs like:”vaccines work, lockdowns don’t”, “5G is mere hype, lockdown is total tripe”, see if the crooks in the BBC who report on it would let those signs get in to the “frontpage” pictures of the event and probe that we aren’t all “crazies*”.

*not that the even the very most outlandish of “conspiracy theories” seem as mad as what the coronanists are willing to put up with in service of their fear

98080 ▶▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to seventeen, #505 of 1374 🔗

So true. I don’t understand why they believe the lunacy.

98101 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to seventeen, #506 of 1374 🔗

5G is part of the New World Order Master Plan. Ignore it at your peril.

98100 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Nick Rose, #507 of 1374 🔗

No needles. Thank you.

97688 ▶▶▶ Sylvie, replying to Julian, 4, #508 of 1374 🔗

I would like to see the immediate priority being an all- out assault on the social distancing measures, to demonstrate that schools can and must go back to normal at the beginning of September. Because that is where parents are likely to be digging in their heels understandably cautious. The measures are socially damaging, ineffectual, expensive, unnecessary, and impossible to police. Once the kids are back and Mum can go back to work, I think fear will be dispelled (as nothing will happen). As an adult I just ignore the masks thing, this to me is a far higher priority.

97993 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Julian, 3, #509 of 1374 🔗

Selling it to the mainstream audience really matters, as does keeping the conspiracy minded onside (we need every lockdown sceptic to stand together on this). I think it wisest not to discuss, and also not to deny, conspiracies, we can’t tell if they are or aren’t true. What we can see is the measurable effects of the lockdown disaster, regardless of cause. Those measuarble effects are undisputable to the mainstream and the conspiracy minded.

97494 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to nat, 4, #510 of 1374 🔗

I have followed the work of alternative researchers of many stripes for decades with great interest, and will continue to do so, but I am in complete agreement that for the purposes of the message that people need to hear right now we need to stick to facts in specifically targeted areas that can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. Speculation is all well and good but only serves to dilute and obfuscate. We cannot afford ourselves this luxury when engaging with others.

Yesterday evening I suggested that we should collaborate on a creating a handy summary of the key sceptic positions that could be distributed widely. It would be a small gesture but every little helps.

97518 ▶▶▶ nat, replying to Richard O, 4, #511 of 1374 🔗

Richard O I was thinking exactly the same thing about collaborating on key sceptic positions ! Mind you , writing sceptical comments in the Daily Mail gives a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn’t. My favourite comment at the moment is one from Alan Jones ( mentions Australia but adaptable for UK) :

Covid -19 doesn’t even make the top 50 causes of death in Australia.

That’s blown a few minds

97533 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to nat, 3, #512 of 1374 🔗

Exactly, when you see the polls conducted in the USA recently about people’s perception of the death figures the lack of knowledge of official state statistics, freely available on government websites, is absolutely staggering.

In addition to straightforward facts such as the above, we can also focus on more qualitative issues such as highlighting the inconsistencies of government regulations.

What alerted me to this idea was how well expressed and constructed so many of the comments here are. Using that as a basis, we must have a wide enough pool of skills in this group that can be utilised to create something useful (graphic design, legal, scientific, creative, narrative etc.).

97551 ▶▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Richard O, 1, #513 of 1374 🔗

You are right. We need a mix of skills to develop a robust alternative narrative.

97562 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 2, #514 of 1374 🔗

There are many people on here who write very well and are well informed

What we lack is the financial muscle to get the message to millions of people

Vote leave spent £6M in the Brexit campaign, and started with many more supporters than we have

I can’t see how we’ll get anywhere without some rich benefactors who underwrite a professionally managed media campaign

97589 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to Julian, #515 of 1374 🔗

There must be some very p***ed off business owners wanting to do something.

97599 ▶▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to Richard O, #516 of 1374 🔗

Yes it really is staggering how many people can’t think for themselves. People are stunned when I tell them how many people die of cancer every day. Can you imagine if the govt put as much effort into eliminating cancer as they do for this imaginary pandemic ? That would really make a difference to everyone.

98103 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to nat, #517 of 1374 🔗

Put that on a banner.

97612 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to nat, #518 of 1374 🔗

Conspiratorially minded my arse. Sybil Fawlty’s specialist subject, innit.

97989 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to nat, 2, #519 of 1374 🔗

My personal view is towards a broad church, who cares if it is a concspiracy or a cockup as long as we are doing things so it can’t keep happening. Also I’m never sure whether to blame conspiracy or cockup, the other of the two becomes more convincing with each new headline.

97440 MaxPower, replying to MaxPower, 29, #520 of 1374 🔗

Took the kids onto the Mersey Ferry today. Got asked three times about wearing a mask: first when boarding, then when I went up a level a PCSO came right up to me and demanded to know where my face covering was. 5 minutes later another PCSO demanded to know where it was. Two PCSOs in the ferry going back and forth all day….I’m sure there is real crime out there that they could be assisting with….

97593 ▶▶ Paul, replying to MaxPower, 4, #521 of 1374 🔗

PCSOs,tin-pot pretend coppers,civvies with a uniform and a radio and usually egos well above their station.

97610 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Paul, 4, #522 of 1374 🔗

Colloquially known as CHIMPS – Completely Hopeless In Most Policing Situations.

97708 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to MaxPower, 3, #523 of 1374 🔗

Just wondered were you wearing any sort of exemption badge? And were the PCSOs OK with your reasonable excuse?

97464 Telpin, replying to Telpin, 24, #524 of 1374 🔗

My student daughter has just been notified that the college bar and common room will be closed ’ due to Co Vid’. So the ‘ bubble’ of 30 students can all meet and socialise – just outside. They Can also of course all congregate down the pub – but they’ll just have to pay non subsidised prices. What idiot seriously thinks this will make a hot of difference to how much young healthy people, who are at virtually no risk whatsoever, will mix together. I despair. How will anyone ever meet anyone and procreate? Or is this the hidden agenda? Is no one allowed to have fun or behave like a normal human being any more?

97470 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Telpin, 10, #525 of 1374 🔗

Is no one allowed to have fun or behave like a normal human being any more?”

You jest – but may be closer to the truth than you think in this experiment of control psychology devised by the Mengeles of the Mind who infest SPI-B.

97473 ▶▶ PWL, replying to Telpin, 4, #526 of 1374 🔗

“How will anyone ever meet anyone and procreate?” Well, they just do what (the &*%$) they like wholly without any reference to Government diktat. It’s easy.

97479 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Telpin, 11, #527 of 1374 🔗

My bf is in a similar situation to your daughter – being forced to live in a ‘bubble’ of 15 people in his accommodation with all activities severely restricted. He reckons that students will comply for the first week but once they start seeing their friends and drinking again, it will all go out of the window. A lot of his friends live in private rented accommodation so I imagine a lot of young people will be meeting in those kinds of places.

97489 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Poppy, 3, #528 of 1374 🔗

just have house parties like in my student days – blimey that was a long time ago now but fond memories!!

97492 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Sue, 5, #529 of 1374 🔗

watch out for the policy helicopters (making sensible use of expensive resources) filming you from on high

97501 ▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, 4, #530 of 1374 🔗

meant to say “police” helicopters.. But there again they are not investigating crimes, they are implementing government policy …. so not necessarily incorrect

97497 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Sue, 3, #531 of 1374 🔗

Doing anything much like fun is going to have to happen in private for the forseeable future. Like Christians in China.

97560 ▶▶▶ Biggles, replying to Poppy, 9, #532 of 1374 🔗

When I was at college in the 70s I thought it couldn’t get any worse than the three day week and power cuts. Well I was certainly wrong there. My advice is fuck ’em, just do what you want to do.

97605 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Poppy, #533 of 1374 🔗

Surprised if it lasts a week …

97656 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Poppy, 4, #534 of 1374 🔗

At Girton in the early days, cocoa parties with a couple of friends were the height of social dissipation. You make the best of what you’ve got…

97910 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to annie, 1, #535 of 1374 🔗

Was still true in the 60s, I had 30/- a week for everything outside of college meals, including books. Didn’t stop us having fun, though…

97493 ▶▶ Eddie, replying to Telpin, 6, #536 of 1374 🔗

Yep we are being told to stop living in order to stay alive

97662 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Eddie, 1, #537 of 1374 🔗

Zombies exist.
Human beings live.
We choose.
They choose.
Who wins?

97511 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Telpin, 2, #538 of 1374 🔗

I think it’s just to avoid legal liability if someone catches “it” on campus. As long as they catch it off university campus down the pub or wherever else, no one cares.

97987 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #539 of 1374 🔗

What the manglement idiots don’t have the sene to realise is that any bed-wetetr who wished to sue for catching it would be unable to prove that they’d caught it on campus, just as likely they caught it in a pub, on the bus, while shopping… No-one has ever been able to sue for catching flu, they can’t prove beyond reasonable doubt that they caught it from the person/organisation they are accusing, covid is no different (and not much worse a disease that actual influenza either)

98253 ▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to seventeen, #540 of 1374 🔗


97466 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 15, #541 of 1374 🔗

We were out chain sawing fallen trees this morning, now there is an activity where you really do need full PPE. Someone mention that an acquaintance had been caught speeding and offered a speed awareness course rather than points on their licence. However, because of Covid the Speed Awareness Course had to be done by a ‘zoom’ meeting …….. you just could not make it up!

97477 ▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Steve Martindale, 14, #542 of 1374 🔗

This is indeed true. The better half is doing his zoom speed awareness course tomorrow. He has a cardboard cut out of himself all ready to place in front of his computer whilst he goes out and does something less boring instead ….

97485 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #543 of 1374 🔗

that’s a shame – i did one of these quite a few years ago now and was at a Hilton hotel and they had coffee and rather yummy biscuits if i recall!!!
Actually the 2/3 hour course was quite interesting though can’t remember much of it now!

97510 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Sue, #544 of 1374 🔗

I’ve had two of them (I think they must have got their records messed up). Can’t remember much of either tbh.

98023 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark, 2, #545 of 1374 🔗

I learned how to fit a ciggie, going to the gents, and making a cup of tea in the ridiculous five minute breaks.

98042 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to JohnB, 1, #546 of 1374 🔗

Potentially useful life skill.

97946 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Sue, 1, #547 of 1374 🔗

Yes, on most courses you learn something even if it’s not what you were supposed to learn. I was once on a Customer Awareness course but all I remember is that there were some leftover chocolate éclairs at lunchtime but they had been cleared away before the afternoon tea break. So I learned the lesson to grab things while they’re there, because they may not be there later.

97651 ▶▶ annie, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #548 of 1374 🔗

Great. Take a leaf out of the school pupils’ book: log on to Zoom, then minimise that screen and get on with what you really want to do.

97664 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #549 of 1374 🔗

Well that’s better than a regular one, when they make you turn your phone off altogether (I’ve done 2….I am the annoying one who knows all the facts and stats on deaths and injuries)

97469 PWL, replying to PWL, #550 of 1374 🔗

All throughout this episode, ICNARC has kept records of patients with Covid-19 in ICUs in Northern Ireland, England and Wales. To date (to the last report at the end of last month) there have been 13,379 admissions. On 10th April ICNARC reported 4690 accumulative admissions. If 20,000 were being admitted to hospital at this time, the ICNARC data suggests the vast majority didn’t have Covid-19 (because at the point people need to be hospitalised, they also need escalated treatment to stop a quick deterioration).

The scandal is that this data has been kept quiet. We would expect corporate-media to overlook the material, but alternative media failed miserably. Why? Hitchens even told his twitter followers that the data didn’t exist.


97753 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to PWL, #551 of 1374 🔗

Your link is dated March 29th?

97475 Emma, replying to Emma, 14, #552 of 1374 🔗


Beyond furious at the interfering f***wits on this SAGE group. Can they really contrive to make life any more miserable for young people than this? Why are they not looking at the data and concluding that this ‘advice’ is completely unwarranted? Why are students not protesting about this right now?

97525 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Emma, 7, #553 of 1374 🔗

I only have very limited anecdotal evidence but from what I have heard lots of students are either quite fearful or quite accepting of the narrative.

97526 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Julian, 3, #554 of 1374 🔗

The NUS seems to be going along with it.

97597 ▶▶▶▶ Emma, replying to Julian, 4, #555 of 1374 🔗

Yes. So depressing.

97648 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Julian, 6, #556 of 1374 🔗

And they always used to defy authority on principle.

97866 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to annie, 2, #557 of 1374 🔗

But they never defy the woke narrative.

98013 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to matt, #558 of 1374 🔗

They’re finding it increasingly difficult now that someone has dug up articles from the dim & distant past indicating Kamala Harris’ descendants owned enough slaves to start a Football league…!

98008 ▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Julian, #559 of 1374 🔗

Students aren’t protesting because they’re not told to. It’s that simple… they protest Boris, or Trump because someone tells them to.. they protest statues because someone tells them “they’re all racist”; witness the recent statue slayings: multiple young people on camera, asked if they supported attacking or removing the statue of [Churchill / Bristol slave trader / whoever else] – several had literally no idea what they were doing despite the fact they were in the middle of a protest.

Breakfast TV (either This Morning or GMB) had a student representative talking about potentially getting rid of the Churchill statue. She was asked the reason for her position – and said she wasn’t totally sure about him because she hadn’t met Churchill in person.

97650 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Emma, 3, #560 of 1374 🔗

This is “Independent” SAGE, nothing to do with SAGE apart from impersonating and trying to outdo them in egregiousness at every opportunity.

98029 ▶▶▶ Carlo, replying to guy153, 1, #561 of 1374 🔗

“Independent” SAGE are also hardcore lefties so fully on the woke narrative.

97476 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 19, #562 of 1374 🔗

Just had a professional salon haircut for the first time since February – it’s only taken me so long because I quite liked not paying for a short back and sides, but my sister’s/boyfriend’s cutting skills are just not salon quality and I want to support my local businesses.

Really refreshing – didn’t have to wear a mask and I wasn’t bombarded with pre-appointment emails full of ridiculous and unnecessary restrictions. It is a very small hair salon with only one member of staff present but it was still nice as I was worried I would have to comply with ludicrous measures which would make it a chore. Had a chat with the hairdresser about everything – she said she hated wearing the masks (especially with the heat from the hairdryers) and that the UK didn’t seem to have a plan for anything (she is from Turkey). Had a good old bitch about Johnson though…!

97673 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Poppy, 8, #563 of 1374 🔗

Me too! I said no to masks (“I’m exempt”….”no problem!”) and so it seems did most other customers. Poor staff were wearing them though.

My lovely colourist said that at the beginning of all this her impression from the BBC was that we were all going to die and she was terrified. Those fuckers have a lot to answer for.

Now she is fine as nobody she knows has even got sick, let alone died.

Also, nobody questioned me about lack of mask on the tube.

97478 richard riewer, #564 of 1374 🔗

A must listen, Sherri Tenpenny on Richie Allen, April 21, 2020. The interview begins at minute 17.


97487 tallandbald, replying to tallandbald, 40, #566 of 1374 🔗

I am now no longer a mask virgin. I have been purposely avoiding shops and establishments that mandate masks because there is no way i will wear one and i really don’t want the confrontation.
I have patiently been reading other contributors experiences and knew one day i would do it, and so today, half way round my 60mile cycle route i stopped for a coffee at a motorway service station (it’s one where you come off the motorway to use it). There is no way i am wearing a mask while still sweaty from riding.
Every one was wearing a mask, including my cycling mate, except me and it was pretty packed.
I wondered how i would feel and i was happy to report no-one said anything, everyone looked away and i felt great, happy to breathe air not snot and dribble like they must do.
I actually felt anger, confident anger towards these people meekly following the “rules”.
That’s it for me now! No mask ever!

97491 ▶▶ Eddie, replying to tallandbald, 8, #567 of 1374 🔗

Well in!! Takes guts to be the only one

97514 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to tallandbald, 6, #568 of 1374 🔗

Welcome! No surrender.

97516 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to tallandbald, 6, #569 of 1374 🔗

Welcome. I live in Wales where such things are not required (except on public transport), so never carry one with me. That’s the reason, honest! A few funny looks in the cafe at Dunham Massey, but I did note that those sitting down put their used face nappies on the tables…. triple yuk.

Oh, and for some reason they wanted you to wear a face nappy in the toilets, despite a “one in, one out~” policy. Yeah, whatever. Didn’t have one, didn’t wear one.

97540 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #570 of 1374 🔗

You don’t have to wear masks in cafes yet unless you’re buying a take-away (not always followed from what I’ve seen). I think they must make their own rules in Dunham Massey! MW

97646 ▶▶ annie, replying to tallandbald, 1, #571 of 1374 🔗


97678 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to tallandbald, 2, #572 of 1374 🔗

Yay! Join the gang

97844 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to tallandbald, 1, #573 of 1374 🔗

Well done. Once you’ve done it the first time, it becomes easier.

97488 Eddie, replying to Eddie, 19, #574 of 1374 🔗

Just reading the blog post for today and the pic of the kids at their desks all shielded up sends a shot of revulsion through my gut. I’m at a loss for words. I feel for any of you with young children to care for.

97508 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Eddie, 13, #575 of 1374 🔗

I was already home-educating my 6-year-old before all this (not keen on schools in general) and I have never been more glad!

97633 ▶▶▶ smurfs, replying to A. Contrarian, #576 of 1374 🔗

Just interested… how does home schooling work insofar as central/local government involvement is concerned? For example do social service busybodies come around and “assess” your teaching standards, curriculum etc.? Or do have a freehand to do as you please?

97698 ▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to smurfs, 2, #577 of 1374 🔗

I home educated my lot years ago but I dont think things have changed much since. We had an ofsted inspection once a year because my kids were in school and removed from it – to travel round Europe in an old school bus. Best education ever.
I had a friend who never sent her kids in the first place and they were never inspected.
We had a free hand in deciding what constituted an education – we just had to offer some justification to local ed authority. Ofsted inspector said coming into people’s homes and talking to EO kids was the highlight of his job. My kids loved showing their stuff to him.
Higher education establishments usually welcome EO kids with open arms. My daughter was given an unconditional offer at a quality establishment with no exams at all.

97759 ▶▶▶▶▶ smurfs, replying to gina, 2, #578 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for the insight.
I can see this will become an appealing option to some parents if the current bs continues.

97810 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to smurfs, 2, #579 of 1374 🔗

Maybe we should set up a sceptics’ education network to offer tuition to kids whose parents won’t let them be treated in such an appalling way.
Lots of expertise around on this site! Some sane science, for a start! And people who can interpret graphs and know what ‘per cent’ means!

97914 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to annie, 2, #580 of 1374 🔗

I’d be well up for supporting any parent who wanted to educate their kids otherwise.

97495 swedenborg, 9, #581 of 1374 🔗

Earlier published the article by Robert Redfield CDC from July in JAMA advocating facemasks. Publishing now this as antidote, which was produced at the same time. Just shows that this thing is not at all settled as MSM tries to persuade us. In fact, as influenza clearly has RCT (randomised control trials) evidence against use of face masks for the public, you would assume to have rather strong evidence for C-19 .But there is no RCT and indeed their evidence is not of any standard at all for face masks in C-19 pandemic.

Iaacs Published June 2020 below Redfield CDC JAMA published July 2020


Do facemasks protect against COVID‐19?
“An infectious diseases expert, Isaacs has been a member of every national immunisation committee for the past 25 years. He is a professor in the Sydney University medical faculty and a consultant at the Westmead campus of the Children’s Hospital. Last year, he published a history of vaccines and pandemics, Defeating the Ministers of Death”

Quotes from article

“There is no good evidence that facemasks protect the public against infection with respiratory viruses, including COVID‐19.

“Indeed, experiments have shown that surgical and cotton masks do not trap the SARS‐CoV‐2 (COVID‐19) virus, which can be detected on the outer surface of the masks for up to 7 days Thus, a pre‐symptomatic or mildly infected person wearing a facemask for hours without changing it and without washing hands every time they touched the mask could paradoxically increase the risk of infecting others

“Because the USA is in a desperate situation, their Centers for Disease Control has recommended the public wear homemade cloth masks. This was essentially done in an effort to try and reduce community transmission, especially from people who may not perceive themselves to be symptomatic, rather than to protect the wearer, although the evidence for this is scant.

Looked up in the dictionary US scant provide grudgingly or in insufficient amounts.I think Isaacs is a bit diplomatic about Robert Redfield CDC


This is a rather popular journalism and an interview with Isaacs. Important, the interview is in April at the height of the pandemic in Australia and has the flavour of it. Isaacs (his father was one of the discoverers of interferon) is a big name in the world of infectious diseases. His article about face masks carry heavy weight as the CEBM discussion of facemasks finding no evidence


97496 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 9, #582 of 1374 🔗

They really must:

  1. be taking the piss
  2. seeing how far people can be pushed before they snap and fight back
  3. really do think “we” are animals


97566 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #583 of 1374 🔗

It has to be against some human rights law.

97504 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 19, #584 of 1374 🔗

Few extra unmuzzled in Tesco today but what was astonishing was how many people now wear their muzzles wrong or half-hearted so that they are useless and more comfortable.

They are almost ready for the next step of going out and not wearing one.

97506 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Awkward Git, 11, #585 of 1374 🔗

The half hearted compliance with which school ties are worn? Removed and shoved in a pocket or bag as soon as possible…

97531 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Strange Days, 7, #586 of 1374 🔗

Just like that with shirt top button undone.

97564 ▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Strange Days, 4, #587 of 1374 🔗

Oh crumbs, the things I did to my school hat.

97541 ▶▶ Andy Riley, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #588 of 1374 🔗

My observation too – Tescos Osterley, West London. Still over 90% masked but this week a noticeable increase in no mask or half hearted.

97645 ▶▶ annie, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #589 of 1374 🔗

Think you may well be right.

97684 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #590 of 1374 🔗

I noticed on the tube today that lots of people wear them on their chins only. Weirdness.

97828 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #591 of 1374 🔗

That’s the only positive thing I could take from my recent travels, ie a fair few people wearing them half-mast.

97515 Basics, replying to Basics, 6, #592 of 1374 🔗

Zero in 2020 what does the word actually mean? It’s just so subjective. Top of the page zero may be kind of a space filling character to be updated later. A temporary zero, nothing too hairy about that.

Whereas the concept of Covid Zero completely might not mean what you thought it did, or does it? Fresh from the twitter pages of the esteemed devi sridhar is this –

[Commenting about a tweet from a ‘Lib Dem’] It’s about orienting around a Zero COVID strategy. It doesn’t mean 0 cases. It means no acceptable number of cases. Constant push to 0 & to get rid of virus. Stopping community transmission. Hard to re-open schools without taking this ‘elimination’ approach

Here Zero means zero, until we tell you zero means not zero but ‘elimination’, or ‘some cases, but not that many’. Don’t forget to play along in their little make pretend game.

97520 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Basics, 4, #593 of 1374 🔗

Well, I suppose she’s admitting they won’t achieve zero, but that’s of no consolation because she thinks they should try. In fact it’s worse because they will be trying forever. And tying reopening schools to this is especially evil because if you’re against it then you don’t want children to have an education. Despicable.

97523 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Julian, 7, #594 of 1374 🔗

It’s not just that they’ll be trying forever, but they’re looking to set a precedent of doing it forever with everything that is judged as or more deadly.

97537 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #595 of 1374 🔗

By selling it as zero but suggesting it’s not leaves them as much room as they like to insist any figure.
Movable goals posts is what my friday afternoon brain is trying to say. Who is setting the tolerance from zero – arbitrary as it is. The number directly affects our lives.
Who consented to this k8nd or rulership?

97639 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Basics, 4, #596 of 1374 🔗

What an absolute gobshite. There is no strategy more harmful than failing to achieve Covid Zero.

98036 ▶▶▶ Carlo, replying to guy153, 2, #597 of 1374 🔗

Look how well it worked in New Zealand.

97517 WhyNow, replying to WhyNow, 18, #598 of 1374 🔗

This is now utterly ridiculous. The BBC is continuing with its campaign to reinforce the use of masks, to embed the idea of a dangerous risk of infection, and we have ZERO deaths with/from Covid, while we continue to have the routine 1650 deaths per day from all causes, including all the usual terminal illnesses, and INCLUDING flu and pneumonia, which seem to be miraculously impervious to masks.

If there was any intelligent life in the News department of the BBC, it would surely be in a tailspin of “does not compute”.

97519 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to WhyNow, 8, #599 of 1374 🔗

Don’t give ’em ideas regarding flu and pneumonia.

97529 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #600 of 1374 🔗

I know! It’s a risky strategy. Tell them that more people are dying of flu and pneumonia and they might try even more extreme measures to prevent it.

Seriously, I think this comes from a lack of rigour or absence of clarity in reporting cause of death. The elderly and terminally ill usually die of an infection. What is the “cause”?

What we can see now is the displacement of the usual causes. Unless Covid actually cures cancer, then the people who died with cancer must have had terminal cancer (for example).

97521 ▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 6, #601 of 1374 🔗

Oh, there’s intelligent life there. Their intelligence is being employed in the service of evil agendas.

97580 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 4, #602 of 1374 🔗

The thing is that they’re not evil in themselves – just unthinkingly banal (remember the phrase?)

97644 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to RickH, 1, #603 of 1374 🔗

It’s a distinction without a difference.

97545 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to WhyNow, 7, #604 of 1374 🔗

They’re going to get in knots soon trying to convince people that dancing is OK as their flagship “Strictly” is looming on the horizon.

97553 ▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Achilles, 4, #605 of 1374 🔗

Glittery glamorous masks being designed at this minute.

97846 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to bluemoon, #606 of 1374 🔗

They’ll be in trouble when a pro or celeb ends up having a hypoxic or hypercapnia attack.

97773 ▶▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to Achilles, 1, #607 of 1374 🔗

That is going to be amusing. Short skirts, boobs akimbo and a flipping mask.

98281 ▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Achilles, #608 of 1374 🔗

I thought they might cancel it but saw it was going ahead. It’s going to be really interesting to see how they do it as there are just so many aspects (crowded dressing rooms, crowding on the viewing platform, singing in a studio etc etc) of the show that could cause trouble for them.

97623 ▶▶ guy153, replying to WhyNow, 3, #609 of 1374 🔗

Shows how well the masks are working is what they would say.

97681 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to guy153, 5, #610 of 1374 🔗

But not against flu and pneumonia. Curious, that.

97766 ▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to WhyNow, 1, #611 of 1374 🔗

“If there was any intelligent life in the News department of the BBC” We can only dream.

97532 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 15, #612 of 1374 🔗

I now live in a country where the local authority bin man, or parking attendant can imprison me for the rest of my natural life.

No charge, no trial, no lawyer, no jury, no appeal

The Dictator and what are described as MP’s think this is OK

Is it time we taught them a lesson?

97555 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Cecil B, 3, #613 of 1374 🔗

Yes,Cecil,I think it is.

97536 Polemon2, replying to Polemon2, 15, #614 of 1374 🔗

More local lockdown – Oldham now and Birmingham threatened. Obviously if deaths are at zero and hospitals with negligible numbers of patients then we must extend lockdowns whenever the slightest excuse can be found.

97576 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Polemon2, 4, #615 of 1374 🔗

… and thereby hangs the rationale.

97538 MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 16, #616 of 1374 🔗

https://youtu.be/iHi6qccp0aY (Jason Liosatos Outside The Box)

This is a nursing assistant in a Devon hospital speaking anonymously. The main points she makes are:

  • The 3 largest Devon hospitals have been C19 free for weeks
  • Many medical staff will not speak out as they, too, are brainwashed by the media propaganda
  • Some pretty horrible things went on on the C19 wards e.g.one was closed off and the 6 elderly patients denied toilets and showers for 2 weeks
  • One old lady who recovered from C19 was not allowed to go home because the hospital wouldn’t re-test her
  • As the C19 cases disappeared, masks were mandated at all times and now medics are getting sick. One of her colleagues is getting heart problems and she herself has breathing difficulties. Lots are complaining of headaches.
  • People are not being admitted or treated for serious conditions

She also talked about ‘an app’ but I’m not clear which one she meant. She seemed to think that it would produce multiple positives and therefore ‘cases’. MW

97568 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 5, #617 of 1374 🔗

Oh and I forgot, even she thinks the fine for not wearing a mask is £3,200. MW

97574 ▶▶ RickH, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 15, #618 of 1374 🔗

This (apart from direct experience of Covid wards) fits in with my observations as a frequent flier. by

I think the worst aspect of all this has been coming close up to the same sort of brainwashing that led to Auschwitz being given permission to exist by a compliant population not seeing the reality.

From my teens onwards, I became aware of what the previous generation had fought against; I spoke to survivors when taking part in a reading of Peter Weiss’s ‘The Investigation’ (transcripts of the trials) whilst at university.

Always I thought ‘It can’t happen here.’

No – there are none of the horrors of the gas chambers. But that plank of belief – that understanding of what the previous generations fought against, and the foundations of a fundamental democratic basis for society, despite all political disagreement – has been blown away in the last year.

It can happen here.

Thank you SPI-B, the other Mengele freaks and the government spivs and snake-oil salesmen. You have created a distinctive legacy.

Just don’t let me see you bastards wearing a poppy in November.

97620 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to RickH, 5, #619 of 1374 🔗

Yes it can always happen here. There is nothing fundamentally different about Germany or any other country.

Of course this isn’t as bad as national socialism but it’s very dangerous for any country ever to assume they’re exceptional or immune or the good guys.

The only consolation we have in the UK now is that our government is also highly incompetent. Imagine how much worse it would be if it were all enforced.

97655 ▶▶▶▶ DespairSquid, replying to guy153, 12, #620 of 1374 🔗

Late 1920’s Berlin must have been amazing. Exciting, sophisticated, free, decadent.

Late 1930’s Berlin must have been – actually quite similar to how I feel most days.

97669 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 6, #621 of 1374 🔗

This very good. Listen, if you can. Just voices of common sense and experience.
“All the people who died with Covid already had a pre-existing condition, like heart disease, and it was just the final straw. They did not die of Covid. They died of whatever was the pre-existing condition.” A nurse, on a Covid ward.

97701 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to WhyNow, 2, #622 of 1374 🔗

Yes, she kept saying died ‘with’ Covid not ‘of’ Covid. MW

97539 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 5, #623 of 1374 🔗

Re Over counted Hospital admissions

What else do we expect? This government and the NHS are soon the laughing stock of the world!
Does that mean they can finally get us back to normal?! I work in a cafe with very tight rules by my employer, and see more and more people ignore them and cause us aggro.

97548 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Silke David, 3, #624 of 1374 🔗

Does that mean they can finally get us back to normal” I think this is highly unlikely. As it stands, I can’t see where the push to get back to normal would come from.

97609 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Julian, 2, #625 of 1374 🔗

Us – vive la resistance!

97837 ▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #626 of 1374 🔗

Here are some personal messages for our friends in Occupied Europe; “The moon shines brightly by night. The moon shines brightly by night”.

97542 Riffman, replying to Riffman, 17, #627 of 1374 🔗

OMG…those poor children in that classroom!? Truly horrified and disgusted by such an image. ‘We’ really have hit rock bottom. How can everyone be so ignorant, arrogant and selfish in their behaviour and actions. I will be escaping this world of fools, probably to a canal boat next spring, I can take no more.

97556 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Riffman, 16, #628 of 1374 🔗

I’ve just done an afternoon’s spud-washing (our own crop) and come in, logged in to see this photo….immediately felt dire. How on earth can children perform well at school like this? gagged and boxed like biological specimens? They must feel utterly bloody stupid.

97740 ▶▶ fran, replying to Riffman, 2, #629 of 1374 🔗

I looked at that photo several times thinking that it MUST BE FAKE. Is it just a one-off experiment in one dumb school just to see if it will work or is this the new normal in all schools. Have the parents of those children seen this?? I am utterly stunned in disbelief.

97834 ▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to fran, #630 of 1374 🔗

But you are correct; it was a “trial” floated to see if there was any pushback. If there wasn’t an outcry, it would have been soon mandated by the local LEA and then by them all.

97565 PaulC, replying to PaulC, 31, #631 of 1374 🔗

Thank you Toby et al for the sanity this site provides.

It’s only when I leave the house that I sadly see no change. This week I have been into Waitrose, Tesco, M&S, Aldi and Lidl (twice) and was the only person not wearing a face mask. It feels very lonely! I was challenged once by a lady (polite description) and pointed silently to the lanyard. One elderly gentleman asked where he could get a lanyard – his wife finds difficulty breathing and has not been shopping since masks became compulsory. He was struggling too.

How much longer can this go on for? There is no logic or reason yet I feel rational thought has disappeared.

97641 ▶▶ annie, replying to PaulC, 13, #632 of 1374 🔗

Pride often goes with loneliness.
Be proud.

97734 ▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to annie, 3, #633 of 1374 🔗

Annie. You’re a legend. 🙂

97569 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 6, #634 of 1374 🔗

I hope a few of you will find time to have a look at these videos:

Plandemic the videos on this website explain the various interests in cv19, and how we are being hoodwinked.

What is The WHO a James Corbett look into The World Health Organization.

97700 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #635 of 1374 🔗

Corbett’s Who is Bill Gates is also well worth a watch.

98018 ▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #636 of 1374 🔗

Some of RFK Jr’s stuff is interesting, particularly about Gates. He has started the Children’s Health Defense and writes eloquently (and tirelessly) about potential vaccine safety.

97732 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Dave #KBF, #637 of 1374 🔗

If only 10% of the content in either is true then we’re in trouble.

One man’s conspiracy theory is another man’s hypothesis waiting to be proved.

97738 ▶▶ FiFiTrixabelle, replying to Dave #KBF, #638 of 1374 🔗

Watched Plandemic today – well worth it!

97570 WhyNow, replying to WhyNow, 9, #639 of 1374 🔗

It is clear to me from the numbers that the NHS does not have much of a clue about what it does. It should be really simple:

  • How many people were admitted to hospital with a respiratory illness?
  • How many contracted a respiratory illness in hospital?
  • Of those who contracted the illness and died, how many already had a diagnosis of terminal illness/disease?

It is becoming clear that the NHS just does not know the answer to these rudimentary questions.

97587 ▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 9, #640 of 1374 🔗

And why are the media and the NHS’s political masters not asking these questions?

97785 ▶▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to Julian, 2, #641 of 1374 🔗

That is a question I would like to know the answer to.

97572 Cruella, replying to Cruella, 17, #642 of 1374 🔗

So my daughters inner city secondary school has released it’s plan for the children’s return in September. The children will be isolated into year groups in different buildings and single classrooms for the forseable future. There will be one way walking and year group based eating zones and outside space. All face masks will be removed on arrival, and put away in a plastic bag, which is great. The HT goes as far as to say that their usage may increase risk of infection and have a negative impact in communication and learning. Although it is all very unnecessary it doesn’t sound too bad. My only concern is how the school will manage illness. As the coming season is one of colds and viruses how will the teaching staff discern a covid19 type virus from any other and am I supposed to keep her home if she gets any type of cold, cough etc? This will be where the problems arise. I only know that my girl can’t afford any more time out before her GCSEs next year. I guess we’ll find out. The teacher in today’s post should be fired. Not only is he a very ignorant and ill informed person but he is using the children as a political tool which is unforgivable. When I wrote to my Labour MP about the detriment of lockdown on my own child and my wish for him to support the young in this crisis I received much the same response. Namely one that acknowledged the harm being done to the vulnerable but remained committed to using the situation to pillory the Tories. It served only to harden my resolve to do whatever I can to keep them out of power. A resolution I made way back at the age of 19 protesting the illegal invasion of Iraq.

97579 ▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to Cruella, 9, #643 of 1374 🔗

All face masks will be removed on arrival, and put away in a plastic bag, which is great.

Not really. In those humid conditions the bacteria will multiply. There are likely to be quite a few sick children as a result.

97582 ▶▶▶ Cruella, replying to Simon Dutton, 9, #644 of 1374 🔗

You’re missing the point. The HT is saying that if kids turn up with them on they aren’t allowed to wear them at school. It is a statement of intent.

97585 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Cruella, 4, #645 of 1374 🔗

Well done that HT

97603 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cruella, 4, #646 of 1374 🔗

Yes, there’s no obvious reason why the kids should wear them on the way to school – though some corner shops might miss out on some custom.

97849 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sara, replying to Cheezilla, #647 of 1374 🔗

Many children travel to school by tube, train or bus. They will, unfortunately, have to have masks with them.

98129 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Cruella, #648 of 1374 🔗

I agree with you, but he has a point. My children’s school has said the same (bag to put mask in). I don’t want my daughter putting a matured Petri dish of bacteria on her face.

And she will follow the rules as she doesn’t take after her more independent minded mother unfortunately ….so what kind of receptacle is best? They have been told to bring named cloth masks…not disposable.

97676 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Simon Dutton, 3, #649 of 1374 🔗

Maybe they will ‘lose’ the bag?

97668 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Cruella, #650 of 1374 🔗

Hobson’s Choice – Tory wankers or Labour tossers. But getting the psychopath Tories in worked well over the last 40 years didn’t it?

Alternatives are verboten in the Fourth Reich.

97672 ▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to RickH, 2, #651 of 1374 🔗

What about Blair?

97755 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Winston Smith, #652 of 1374 🔗

What about Blair? Made a bridge between two other right of centre govenments. No change Party. Thus his current role.

97730 ▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to RickH, 2, #653 of 1374 🔗

Check out Hitchens book ‘The Cameron Delusion’. They’re all the same. I spoilt my ballot paper in December last for the first time and will be continuing to do until someone who deserves my vote sets up shop (aka a unicorn!).

97803 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, -1, #654 of 1374 🔗

Just to put this in context. Like him or loathe him, Corbyn was different (and no, I was never convinced of his leadership skills).

But – as with this current propaganda campaign – the massed bands of the establishment blew their socks off to make sure that he was painted as someone he wasn’t.

When you see two ex-heads of MI6 singing in harmony – you know that smell of rats.

97820 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to Cruella, #655 of 1374 🔗

Just commented above about a lad in our area (rural Scotland), who was sent home from school for coughing. Whole family having to isolate, whilst being tested. This is how it is going to go.

97573 Hubes, replying to Hubes, 25, #656 of 1374 🔗

If only the government tested people for cancer as much as Covid, then maybe we wouldn’t be looking at thousands of unnecessary deaths from people of all ages.

Save lives. Bullshit. They couldn’t give a toss about any lives. Wankers.

97577 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Hubes, 7, #657 of 1374 🔗

£300 billion. That is a lot of preventative medicine.

97852 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to WhyNow, 2, #658 of 1374 🔗

Thata a lot of a lot of things that could really improve the heath and welfare of everybody in the UK by a very significant amount. Where has it gone?

97588 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Hubes, 15, #659 of 1374 🔗

And cancer isn’t the only issue. Just heard From my consultant’s secretary that due to huge backlog caused by more or less halting all diagnostic brain scans for the last 5/6 months, my wait for a follow up brain scan is now around 2 months. Even emergency scans are having to wait 3/4 weeks. This is after already waiting 5 months after the original scan. These Scans are for potentially very serious conditions risking brain bleeds / death

97640 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Telpin, 14, #660 of 1374 🔗

The NHS should be branded a criminal organisation.

97657 ▶▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Telpin, 5, #661 of 1374 🔗

That is terrible, but some hospitals have been doing brain scans. My wife had one in mid May, but because of NHS incompetence it’s taken over 3 months to get the results and a few weeks of chasing. Thankfully she’s now been told it’s nothing to worry about, but has to wait for a phone appointment on Monday to get the details.

97578 Fiat, 2, #662 of 1374 🔗

A song for the people from Pendragon:

“Fear of falling down again
Believe in who you are again
Maybe one day we’ll ride wild horses
Maybe one day we’ll dive 10,000 feet
So don’t be afraid of everything you meet”

“Afraid of Everything” from the album Love Over Fear

97581 Edna, replying to Edna, 24, #663 of 1374 🔗

Posted this on yesterday’s comments by mistake!

Very good piece in the DT by Sarah Knapton (behind a paywall I think)


Coronavirus death rate continues to fall – despite more positive tests

Research shows that, if there had been a correlation between rise in cases and deaths, fatalities should have risen to around 35 per day

Instead, deaths are hovering at around five with the numbers declining all the time, suggesting Britain may soon experience its first day with no deaths at all.

Carl Heneghan is quoted:

“”Admissions data should be driving our response now, not case data. You could have 1,000 people and if there are no admissions then you’re building up a population that is resistant to create breaks in the transmission chain when you get to February and March.

“However, what has happened is the rapid increase spooked everyone and now they are in this mode where it is the precautionary principle and people are trying to negate a risk which isn’t out there right now.

“It’s time we had a chief epidemiologist who is responsible for the production and oversight of the data.”

97584 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Edna, 28, #664 of 1374 🔗

Heneghan seems to be getting more militant. He’s been a star. Hope he keeps his job. His bosses and the people who fund them deserve credit too for sticking to it.

97590 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Julian, 4, #665 of 1374 🔗

What is odd of course is that other Oxford Prof’s are telling a different story.

No wonder the masses are confused.

97594 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to hotrod, 8, #666 of 1374 🔗

Not Sunetra Gupta.

97606 ▶▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to RickH, 1, #667 of 1374 🔗

Obviously she doesn’t count because she is brown, a woman and not a friend of Cummings!?!?

97595 ▶▶▶ Telpin, replying to Julian, 15, #668 of 1374 🔗

He’s certainly my hero- one of the very few doctors ( also a practising GP) who is prepared to speak out and advocate for non Co Vid patients, who don’t seem to exist as far as our blessed NHS is concerned.

97745 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Julian, 1, #669 of 1374 🔗

Ivor Cummins has also been very outspoken lately: https://twitter.com/FatEmperor/status/1296776276536102915

97898 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Julian, 2, #670 of 1374 🔗

It’s his tone I like. He’s always measured, always factual, he never gets heated. He’s doing a very good job.

97600 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Edna, 5, #671 of 1374 🔗

Glad to see it’s about 5. With ~3000 infections per day (ONS) we should expect about 3 deaths per day if IFR is 0.1%. I was a little concerned when it was about 30 but that was before the new 28 day rule.

97591 RickH, replying to RickH, 15, #672 of 1374 🔗

Perhaps we should start an August Landmesser Memorial Fund – to assist legal action against the denial of civic rights.

He was the guy who stood out in the crowd for not saluting Hitler.

97611 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to RickH, #673 of 1374 🔗

Better be quick it’s almost September…

97632 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to RickH, 5, #674 of 1374 🔗

Shouldn’t we just support the Dolan JR, which has serious lawyers already engaged. I’ve contributed multiple times.

97602 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 12, #675 of 1374 🔗

Scottish Schools have been back two weeks now.

That seems to have been quietly forgotten.

Glasgow & Clyde with 5/100,000

Fife 3/100,000

97604 ▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, 4, #676 of 1374 🔗

Good point!

97621 ▶▶ Jack, replying to hotrod, 8, #677 of 1374 🔗

Good analysis of Scottish numbers:


Not only has it been shown that the number of cases has been wildly misreported and the prevalence of the SC2 virus has almost disappeared, the outbreak almost certainly burned itself out in mid May.

Using Bayes analysis and conditional probability shows that the likelihood of being infected with SC2, even if you test positive is around 10%. (Probabilities are not static numbers. They will have a range given the observed data)

Despite media reports of SC2 infections being underestimated, the opposite is true. They are grossly overestimated.

One further point which I think is vital is that people, whether asymptomatic or symptomatic, are not being tested for anything other that SC2.

There is a large amount of time, money and effort being spent trying to find something which has such a low probability of actually being measured.

97637 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Jack, 3, #678 of 1374 🔗

Somebody sneaked the needle out of the haystack and the black cat out of the unlighted cellar.

97819 ▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to hotrod, #679 of 1374 🔗

In our community, a lad has been sent home from school for coughing; his family have had to isolate until they are all tested. This sort of thing will only increase as the autumn / winter gets going, as normal coughs and colds increase.

97608 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 7, #680 of 1374 🔗

Overheard a discussion about mandatory Covid Apps. Easy. Do not have a smartphone.

Are people who oppose the app willing to give up their smart phone?

97624 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Silke David, 4, #681 of 1374 🔗

Well, I don’t know the answer to your question, but I imagine there are a few of us older folk who feel no need for a smartphone – I personally have a very old Nokia PAYG that I keep purely to have a mobile number and to use in case of car break-downs.

97721 ▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to IanE, 1, #682 of 1374 🔗

Snap. I’m 50 and swapped my iPhone for a Nokia 2 years ago. Its jeffing brilliant. Wish I’d done it years ago.

97726 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 2, #683 of 1374 🔗

Me too. I actually lump-hammered my iphone as it was taking over my life. Soooo satisfying.

97626 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Silke David, 3, #684 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I will

97635 ▶▶ annie, replying to Silke David, 4, #685 of 1374 🔗

Haven’t got a smartphone, won’t get a smartphone, they can eff off.

97649 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to annie, #686 of 1374 🔗

Wait until you have grandchildren and find out about WhatsApp.

97802 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #687 of 1374 🔗

Have no children, have no grandchildren, my iPad won’t do WhatsApp, I’m immune!

97723 ▶▶ fran, replying to Silke David, 3, #688 of 1374 🔗

I don’t have a smart phone… don’t want one … don’t need one. If, as we suspect, TPTB insist that all sorts of ‘certificates of conformity’ are installed on everyones smart phone (Have you pased your ‘woke’ BLM test’? Have you been vaccinated this week? Are you correctly masked today?) more and more of US will abandon them.

97736 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Silke David, #689 of 1374 🔗

Have a smartphone, but it can always stay at home. Also have a 2G phone, no frills. (Best reception and coverage when out in the hills)

97792 ▶▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to Nick Rose, #690 of 1374 🔗

No smartphone for me. I had a suspicion that it was a tracking device and did not like the implications of it. Well, they laughed, but due to T&T I have been proved right.

98035 ▶▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Laura Suckling, #691 of 1374 🔗

There’s an app called Blokada which I use & has good reviews. I can’t definitively prove it works to block tracking, though it claims to, but it does a very good job of blocking ads & lots of other rubbish 🙂

97825 ▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Silke David, 2, #692 of 1374 🔗

Just ensure that you turn off your Bluetooth as soon as you park the car; this stops the App from communicating with other peoples’ phones. You can also “Force Stop” the App itself. You need to check your phone every week or so to ensure that any new iteration of the App has not turned itself on. It’s actually quite easy and only takes a minute or so, and a couple of seconds when you stop the car. If you don’t use Bluetooth for hands-free, it’s even easier; just turn off Bluetooth and leave it off. The emotional impact of doing this is highly satisfying.

98033 ▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Silke David, #693 of 1374 🔗

Judging by what is at least speculatively happening in other countries, it won’t be as simple as giving up your phone – the health app will restrict you from potentially entering another building, certainly international travel, unless you have the green light. No phone, no play. Basically. Comply or Die (& I’m not talking about a Racehorse…)

97629 ▶▶ DespairSquid, replying to swedenborg, 3, #695 of 1374 🔗

Possibly. Loss of the unnatural “gain of function” capability for the “made in a lab” possibility…

Also possible – lower percentages of people infected whose time was up and fewer people killed by medical intervention (antivirals and mechanical ventilation).

I really don’t want to see anyone let off the hook for the early “treatments” through a “it’s a weaker mutation now” excuse…

97735 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to DespairSquid, 5, #696 of 1374 🔗

I’m wondering though (if this is true and the apparent lower lethality isn’t just for the reasons you state above) that the “the virus is less lethal now” might give some people, maybe even politicians/governments, a way that they can start to dial down the fear narrative without having to admit they were wrong/made mistakes previously .
Of course this means they might get off the hook at least in the short term, and it assumes that things aren’t so corrupt that they’re commited to keeping the fear going until a vaccine is available, and doing their best to discredit or just plain ignore any research like this.

97800 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Drawde927, #697 of 1374 🔗

Can they get their tiny wee brains up to that point?

97793 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, 2, #698 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for the link! This is the actual study from Singapore:


The mutation they’re talking about is quite an old one, discovered in January in Singapore. The new study is showing that that variant is associated with less severe disease.

This is where they first discovered it:


And in particular look at this diagram:

comment image

This is a family tree of variants of SARS2 up to about April. The grey box on the top is blown up over on the right. The variants highlighted in red on the right are this strain they’re talking about– the one with 382 nucleotides missing out of ORF7 and ORF8, which looks like it has a common ancestor with a 382 nt deleted strain also found in Taiwan. But as you can see it’s a relatively small part of the whole tree.

I think the apparent drop in CFR/IFR may be explained by more testing and better treatments rather than by evolution. Or it may be other mutations, but probably not this particular one, since it happened some time ago apparently somewhere in south China.

Although we know a lot about all the genetic differences in all the strains from lots of sequencing, we don’t know all that much about any phenotypical differences (i.e. which are worse, better, how they might behave differently). The study just done in Singapore is one of the first. But these guys:


found that the differences were mostly very small and evenly distributed all across the genome, which implies to me that they’re still just noise with no evidence of natural selection.

Note also that coronaviruses are much more stable than other viruses because they have “error correction” in their “RNA-dependent RNA polymerase” (the enzyme they use to copy themselves).

Edit: yikes didn’t realize it was going to inline the diagram. You will probably need to zoom in a good deal unless you have very sharp eyes.

97835 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to guy153, 2, #699 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for link,didn’t see it before I inadvertently also put it up.Thanks for the explanation.Perhaps you are interested in Francois Balloux twitter comment,he seems to have interrupted his holiday to give a comment as it is an area interesting him.I think he has the same interpreation as you are giving


97887 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, #700 of 1374 🔗

Yes I think this is actually Balloux’s area of research. Interesting that he says that “everything is everywhere”. I didn’t appreciate that. I’m also quite jealous that he appears to be mountain biking in the alps.

98195 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, #701 of 1374 🔗

So actually the virus could be attenuating due to evolution via this mutation or ones like it. This particular deletion makes the virus replicate quicker, but be less severe, and it gets hit by fewer antibodies. These are all “good” traits for natural selection. If all strains are everywhere then this one might start to dominate.

I don’t know if we have enough data to see if that is actually the case. They should add a couple of primers for the missing bit of ORF8 to the PCR test. Then you could tell which variant people were testing positive for.

98231 ▶▶▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to guy153, 1, #702 of 1374 🔗

I suppose yu have seen this article which Sylvie linked.If not, it is here very interesting also for a non specialist


98316 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, #703 of 1374 🔗

No, missed that one, thanks! That definitely looks like natural selection and I had heard of that mutation. I think that is the only known major mutation that affects the Spike which is the one that you would expect to have the most effect as the Spike is how the virus gets into cells.

The ORF8 deletion the Singapore guys were talking about has a more subtle proposed mechanism. SARS2 has a way of evading CD8+ killer T-cells by downregulating MHCI, which is a molecule on the surface of regular cells (all cells except red blood) used to present antigens for the killer Ts to find. If you lose that bit of ORF8 you can’t do that so can’t hide from the killer Ts. A robust killer T response may be important for avoiding severe C19.

But on the other hand if you lose that bit of ORF8, you lose an antibody target. So the virus is losing one weapon in return for another. And why does it replicate better? I don’t think they know, just that it does in vitro.

Balloux reckons no evidence this strain is more widespread however. But perhaps if we check again 1000 years from now there will be some effect.

97816 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 1, #704 of 1374 🔗

Here is the Lancet paper ref in the Reuters report


97615 crimsonpirate, replying to crimsonpirate, 8, #705 of 1374 🔗

Carl Heneghan, Sunetra Gupta, Karol Sikora, Michael Levitt, David Spiegelhalter. Have I missed anyone?

97653 ▶▶ Klein, replying to crimsonpirate, 7, #706 of 1374 🔗

Jay Battacharya, John Ioniddis

97654 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to crimsonpirate, 6, #707 of 1374 🔗

Dr. John Ionnidis, Dr. Scott Atlas

97674 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 6, #708 of 1374 🔗

Anders Tegnell, Rashid Buttar

97689 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to crimsonpirate, 6, #709 of 1374 🔗

Two Germans from the early days, Dr Wolfgang Wodarg who talked about this being the story of the Emperor’s new clothes and Dr Sucharit Bhakdi. The latter wrote an open letter to a Angela Merkel questioning the whole Covid scenario.

97690 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Margaret, 1, #710 of 1374 🔗

Where is Merkel, by the way, haven’t heard anything about her lately?

97709 ▶▶▶▶ fran, replying to Margaret, 4, #711 of 1374 🔗

Merkel has been very busy …. yesterday she was granted a 90 minute audience with climate worrier St Greta of Sweden to outline how Germany is going to stop climate change immediately … which is still far too slow and too late for St Greta.

97731 ▶▶▶▶▶ hat man, replying to fran, #712 of 1374 🔗

climate worrier – I love it!

97758 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to fran, 3, #713 of 1374 🔗

She’s got a lot of work to do bearing in mind a new build lignite power station has just come on stream:


Merkel has also signed up for further gas imports from Russia (Nord Stream 2).

Doesn’t look like a green future any time soon!

97791 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ smileymiley, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #714 of 1374 🔗

Lignite.. the dirtiest of all the fossil fuels. 25 years in deep mines in Britain. I know about these things.

97751 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Margaret, 2, #715 of 1374 🔗

She was visiting Mr Macron and his mum – sorry wife – in their south of France luxury pad yesterday. Not sure if she also went jet skiing though!

97795 ▶▶▶▶▶ smileymiley, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #716 of 1374 🔗

His mum… Ha, ha , ha . I like that!

97713 ▶▶ Julian, replying to crimsonpirate, 4, #717 of 1374 🔗

Johan Giesecke

97729 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #718 of 1374 🔗

Robert Dingwall has said some sensible things too.

97967 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to crimsonpirate, 1, #720 of 1374 🔗

In what context, can’t see if you’re replying to some earleir post. I assume this is a list of who should replace the cabinet? Add Lord Sumption to it.

98034 ▶▶ DJ Dod, replying to crimsonpirate, #721 of 1374 🔗

Professor Klaus Pueschel of the University Medical Centre in Hamburg, who told the German press in April that there was no need for panic.

On the basis of post-mortem examinations of patients who had tested positive for Covid-19 he concluded that:

  • all of the victims had co-morbidities (some previously undiagnosed)
  • Government actions were out of all proportion to the threat posed by the virus
  • Covid deaths would be unlikely to affect the annual mortality rate in Germany

It would appear that politicians find solid medical evidence less persuasive than computer models.

98261 ▶▶ Julian, replying to crimsonpirate, #722 of 1374 🔗

Didier Raoult

97619 PWL, replying to PWL, 22, #723 of 1374 🔗

This is not rhetoric, because things are serious enough to justify the idea: certain people need to go to jail.
The crime is the over exaggeration of a relatively harmless disease for the purpose of introducing intolerable infringements of civil liberties (for an agenda that has nothing to do with the protection of public health), and indeed the act of introducing the same. Moreover, the crime extends to numerous cases of the runination of health – to the extent that people have died (been man slaughtered) – and the ruination of business and means to a livelihood.


97642 ▶▶ hat man, replying to PWL, -1, #724 of 1374 🔗

Yes, here are mugshots of some of the criminals:

97622 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #725 of 1374 🔗

So, yesterday I emailed my MP and asked how many people with covid were in my town’s hospital.
He wrote back and said that in Kirklees and Calderdale, there were 5 (that’s out of a total population of 650,000).

Have we been released from local mockdown? From his facebook page:

No change to the Kirklees wide local restrictions for another week.
Having spoken to Health Ministers last night and this morning I am pleased they have listened and announced a new framework today for a way forward to use local data to focus on outbreaks but ease restrictions where there are zero or few cases.

“To ensure further targeting of the intervention, in future, the government is updating its Contain Framework to ensure that each week local authorities in an area of National Intervention bring a combined proposal on the geography which should be included that has been developed in conjunction with the local cross-party council leadership and MPs. The JBC will provide the relevant data, including on the minimum local areas which must be included due to the prevalence of the virus.
Local leadership will then be expected to seek consensus between Councils and local MPs and recommend the appropriate geography which fits local travel patterns, work and social behaviours for restrictions to be active in. Areas within the local authority where COVID-19 is less prevalent are expected to be exempt from any restrictions.
The Joint Biosecurity Centre Gold Meeting, chaired by the Secretary of State with the Chief Medical Officer, will then make the final decision based on the local recommendation, or recommendations if consensus cannot be reached. In the Northern area of intervention, we will expect Councils to engage with MPs immediately, and seek a consensus recommendation to the JBC Silver meeting chaired by the CMO on Wednesday, for a decision at the JBC Gold meeting on Thursday.
Secretary of State for Health Matt Hancock said: ”Our approach is to make the action we take as targeted as possible, with the maximum possible local consensus. To do that we are introducing a new process to increase engagement between local leaders, both councils and MPs, with the aim of taking as targeted action as possible. This will allow local councils to focus resources onto the wards which need more targeted intervention in order to drive infection rates down, and gives local people a stronger voice at the table.”

Sounds potentially very messy to me!

97652 ▶▶ tonys, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #726 of 1374 🔗

This is my area as well and so from trying to wade through that word soup it seems our local politicians and council officials will be heavily involved in the decision process, what a thoroughly depressing prospect.

97813 ▶▶▶ Ruth Sharpe, replying to tonys, #727 of 1374 🔗

Having worked for Calderdale Council in a previous life, my heart sinks for everyone.

97786 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to Cheezilla, #728 of 1374 🔗

Perhaps with so much consultation and involvement, nothing will actually get done.

97798 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #729 of 1374 🔗

We have a targeted policy that targets targets in order to reach our targets.

97630 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 10, #730 of 1374 🔗

Trip to McDonald’s today for a kiddie meal to get Scoob toy (yes I know…..). Horrible experience. NEVER again!!

Masked door guard wanted to know if I had a mask, said ‘exempt’, then asked me for proof. Told her that I do not have to prove, and if she wants me to leave. No please come in. Huhh?

lots of tables out of commission, all staff masked, even the ones standing behind the perspex counter. All orders must be done on self service screens. One grandmother (sunflower lanyard) struggled for 15 minutes to ‘place the order’ on the screen, then got a slip and then was able to pay with cash at the counter – is that what you call counter productive?

97862 ▶▶ Skam, replying to Victoria, 2, #731 of 1374 🔗

I had a similar experience last week but after being asked to “prove it” and politely explaining that we didn’t have to, we were told it was company policy not to allow us in, despite people already in there eating without masks on. I emailed to complain and got the worst customer service reply ever. The good news is I will never be going back there!

I am actually exempt but wouldn’t wear one even if I wasn’t.

97963 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to Victoria, 3, #732 of 1374 🔗

Screens, because all customers smearing their hands on a surface is completely unable to cause viral transmission (if the virus spreading amongst the non-vulnerable was a bad thing, which it isn’t)? While speaking to a person a shrot distance away to place an order is a threat to the very survival of mankind? All these stupid rules are there not to actually do anything to stop viruses, just to crush people into mindless obedient sheep.

97634 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 15, #733 of 1374 🔗


What the immune response to the coronavirus says about the prospects for a vaccine Viral immunologists say that results so far have been predictable — here’s why that’s good news.
A well written general article in Nature

 “In the late 1980s, 15 healthy people moved into new apartments in Salisbury, UK. On their third day, each was asked to snort a nostrilful of solution containing a coronavirus — one of several viruses that causes the common cold. Then the volunteers spent three weeks quarantined at the Common Cold Unit, part of the Medical Research Council, where researchers monitored a range of symptoms. Some study participants likened stays at the Common Cold Unit to a vacation — if so, it was a holiday complete with blood draws and nasal washes.
About a year later, 14 of the volunteers came back to do it again. This time, researchers were keen to know if the participants’ exposure to the virus had made them immune. The answer: sort of. Although they showed no symptoms, analyses revealed that nearly all of them became infected before their immune systems could launch an effective defence

97697 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, 1, #734 of 1374 🔗

That’s a very good balanced article that I wish Guardian contributors would read.

97797 ▶▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to guy153, 1, #735 of 1374 🔗

Don’t hold your breath.

97959 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to swedenborg, 1, #736 of 1374 🔗

Ah, the MRC Common Cold Unit at Salisbury! I’ve been wondering desultorily during lockdown what research they published and what happened to it.
this archive article is reticent about the former although I see it closed as late as 1989. Was interferon its thing?

97636 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 12, #737 of 1374 🔗

Missing in action: Prof Whitty

Perhaps his “limit” narrative was finally a step too far for 1922 and friends.

Jenny Harries also.

Quietly moved aside I wonder?

97660 ▶▶ tonys, replying to hotrod, 3, #738 of 1374 🔗

The penny May finally have dropped that he is a raving crackpot.

97691 ▶▶▶ DespairSquid, replying to tonys, 2, #739 of 1374 🔗

Though his “Covid isn’t really that dangerous to the majority” presentation was quite measured…

97952 ▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to DespairSquid, #740 of 1374 🔗

That, if I remember correctly, was in sane days when herd immunity was still recognised as the way forward, before the 23rd when idiocy took hold.

97695 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to hotrod, 1, #741 of 1374 🔗

He is busy as a member of the Board of the WHO.

97722 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to hotrod, 6, #742 of 1374 🔗

Harries was always too sensible. I don’t think she would stand for what’s going on now. And of course there’s that embarrassing chat with Boris where she told us what a bad idea masks are.

97647 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #743 of 1374 🔗

Wow, things move fast on this message board! a few hours ago I read a post from someone who had been asked about facemasks by a PCSO, I was going to ask a question in reply but I had to go out on a river survey and by the time I got back I could not find the post!
Anyway, my question is have people been challenged when going unmasked and have their ‘reasonable excuses’ been accepted OK?
I have a bright yellow lanyard from a retirement group and on this I hang a holder bearing a print-out of the Government’s ‘I am exempt’ badge and have never had any challenges but I guess it may happen one day?

97659 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Steve Martindale, 5, #744 of 1374 🔗

there is search functionality. do control f and type in PCSO.. to find the post .
And generally from comments i have seen on here, if challenged people are just saying they are exempt – which usually is all that is necessary.

97683 ▶▶ Kelly deacons, replying to Steve Martindale, 6, #745 of 1374 🔗

Have never worn mask in shops,no lanyard either,never challenged to date.

97699 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #746 of 1374 🔗

Challenged last night (M&S collecting a parcel) for the first time out of around 20 shop visits. Stated “I’m exempt” and that was that but you could tell the fella asking was seething.

97787 ▶▶ smileymiley, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #747 of 1374 🔗

Not worn a mask yet. No card either, not been asked other than the dentist last week . Posted earlier here. Was told had to wear one. Told her I’m exempt. ” You mean you have Asthma ?” Replied that’s not for you to ask & I could take you to court under the Discrimination act. Soon stopped her in her tracks!

97884 ▶▶ MaxPower, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #748 of 1374 🔗

Hi Steve, it was my post. PCSO was right up in my face and invaded my personal space. Told him I was exempt and he walked off. Everyone, bar him, that has challenged me today have been lovely when told of exemption.

97663 swedenborg, 11, #749 of 1374 🔗


The geriatric pandemic in Sweden

C-19 death average 82 median age 84  1,2% of all deaths below 50 (total deaths 5789)
Anybody comparing this to Spanish flu is insane. Even the later flu pandemics had more deaths in this age group. See 1918 Spanish flu Sweden.


97666 NappyFace, replying to NappyFace, 15, #750 of 1374 🔗

This whole situation with COVID-19 reminds me of the Tommyknockers for some reason.

Somehow, a mass hypnosis programme has failed to work on a portion of the population (rational people who question the logic of lethal lockdowns and associated policies).

Seeing as I don’t have a metal plate in my head, I do wonder what it was that saved me from the hypnosis / mind control / brain washing.

Smoking fags? Not watching much telly?

Any ideas?

97686 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to NappyFace, 14, #751 of 1374 🔗

I wish I knew. It is very interesting. It is a kind of “knowing”, in the heart, that something is just wrong. Sounds a bit touchy-feely and not very scientific, but that’s just my thought. However, I’ve been deeply suspicious of governments for many years, so that probably helped a bit.

97694 ▶▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to thedarkhorse, 11, #752 of 1374 🔗

I think it’s just a simple gut feeling that nothing adds up. What we’re being told is not joined up at all. Also I think it’s paying attention and the feeling in your heart that if EVERY organisation is pushing the same way it smells!

97871 ▶▶▶ Azoumi, replying to thedarkhorse, 5, #753 of 1374 🔗

it’s called intuition and we are born with it…it’s there for self preservation and very clever

97702 ▶▶ DJ Dod, replying to NappyFace, 5, #754 of 1374 🔗

Maybe it’s just common sense?

Personally, I had some help from my own modest ‘superpowers’ – the ability to read, and a memory. Reading showed me that there was ample scientific opinion which contradicted the media hysteria, and memory told me that Professor Ferguson had a lamentable track record in prediction…

97717 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to NappyFace, #755 of 1374 🔗

Not using social media?

97733 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to NappyFace, 4, #756 of 1374 🔗

It’s difficult to say. I just had a gut feeling from the start that something wasn’t right. I initially went along with the extra handwashing, until my hands started to become sore and the sheer lunacy started to become more and more obvious from there!

I do smoke fags and only really have kids’ programmes and cricket on the telly, so maybe that’s what it is…

97749 ▶▶ Lili, replying to NappyFace, #757 of 1374 🔗

I think you have to have been a questioning sort of soul all your life – a bit of an outsider, I suppose. I’ve always gone against the mainstream and tuned out of the media years ago, only checking in to see what the majority were being fed (know your enemy).

97750 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to NappyFace, 2, #758 of 1374 🔗

Probably smoking weed and drinking Stella for me 😉 and the gut feeling.

Great quote today on a Anna Brees video.

‘Viruses are invisible, pandemics are not.’

As the contributor said if it was that bad we would all know multiple people who have died or been ill with it whether it be family, friends or neighbours.

97950 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to stefarm, 1, #759 of 1374 🔗

We all do know multiple people who’ve had, they just don’t know they have, and we don’t know which of them. Thankfully this virus has spread a lot more widely than is typically beleived, that is what is bringing it tp a halt, and most cases are mild or asymptomatic. I spoke to an acquantance yesterday (can’t say “friend” any more given his response to my attempts to lecture him on the reality of covid), utterly convinced he can’t possily have had it “I followed all the rules”, utterly convinced it is a terrible disease “there are no mild or asymptomatic cases*”, utterly brainwashed.

*never mind how he then tries to justify all those ludicrous rules he’s been surrendering to

97796 ▶▶ annie, replying to NappyFace, 2, #760 of 1374 🔗

A visceral revulsion from the madness of crowds.
And nauseated recoil from the zombies.

97801 ▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to NappyFace, #761 of 1374 🔗

Certainly not watching telly. possibly smoking and probably just a little common sense.

97815 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to NappyFace, 1, #762 of 1374 🔗

I never believed a thing I heard on the news since about 1980. The Dead Kennedys shaped my world views as did punk.

97824 ▶▶ Sue, replying to NappyFace, #763 of 1374 🔗

Not had the chip implanted yet!! Don’t worry it’s coming!!

97885 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to NappyFace, 2, #764 of 1374 🔗

For me it was watching the overwhelming misery of my son – he was lucky enough to have an excellent online school programme but he still struggled to cope emotionally and was terribly unhappy. I would obviously question anything which made my son so desperate! But, more than that, he has always been one to find comfort and reassurance in rational explanations and in things making sense and I wanted to be able to explain things to him. So I read into it more. And the facts spoke for themselves.

97918 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to NappyFace, 1, #765 of 1374 🔗

Avoiding mainstream media and TV news seems to do the trick. Age too – ever been taken in before, never again.

98005 ▶▶ ianric, replying to NappyFace, #766 of 1374 🔗

What made me a skeptic was that lockdown was such an extreme measure eg people being placed under house arrest, businesses being forced to close,basic things becoming illegal, questions had to be asked was the lockdown justified on the basis of the characteristics of the disease. How was the disease spread, how infectious the disease was, the severity of symptoms and the fatality rate and whether asymptomatic spread was true. A major issue I had with lockdown was that we are living in the 21st century where we have made major advances in science and understanding of viruses and I felt lockdown is a blunt, primitive and unimaginative method of dealing with diseases and is like something out of the dark ages.

98134 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to NappyFace, 1, #767 of 1374 🔗

I don’t watch any TV. But for me it was gut feeling that the numbers didn’t add up. The data coming out of Wuhan suggested this was primarily dangerous for the very elderly, which is therefore not going to have any major economic impact and should not be a cause for mass panic. Anybody else getting it is unlucky, but there will always be the unlucky in life (and death).

i did buy into the narrative that everyone was susceptible until I saw the data from the Diamond Princess when only a minority of passengers and crew caught it …despite the above average age and as we know, immune systems weaken with age. So at that point I thought surely everyone should stand down and stop stressing…..this was mid March.

Obviously that has not happened.

97675 mhcp, replying to mhcp, 4, #768 of 1374 🔗

Just watched a news report (missus has BBC on) about a “new” type of rugby with sanitation breaks every 15 minutes. In the next second there’s some scenes from a cricket match where the bowler gets a man out and his teammates high five and hug him!

97715 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to mhcp, #769 of 1374 🔗

Does covid only become active after 15 minutes play? Presumably you’re safe up until 14 minutes 59?

97821 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to A. Contrarian, #770 of 1374 🔗

Bit like the quarantine where you are not infectious at 03.59:59am, but a second later at 4:00am you are a potential killer and locked up for 14 days!!

97763 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to mhcp, 1, #771 of 1374 🔗

I was talking with a guy who does thingsin local football, he said that matches are just about to start where spectators are allowed in. He said they need to stop play every 15 mins to wipe down the corner flags, ball and goal posts. ffs. The teams need to be tested every two weeks in order to play

97778 ▶▶▶ Polemon2, replying to Two-Six, #772 of 1374 🔗

You have to admire their creative thinking though. Sorry did I say thinking, my mistake.

97843 ▶▶ Phoneutria, replying to mhcp, #773 of 1374 🔗

Sale v Exeter seemed to go OK tonight. No spectators though. Stupidly.

97976 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to mhcp, #774 of 1374 🔗

I play cricket and we have to hand sanitise every 6 overs (36 balls). Utter madness but we have to defeat the crafty coroni.

Happy to say that most fake it.

97679 Basics, 5, #775 of 1374 🔗

The mask slips
40 mins

Have shared with friends and now posting here, a good watch. Fitting the vaccine plan to the lockdown and the aims of where we are being led.

97685 mjr, replying to mjr, 2, #776 of 1374 🔗

BBC – I have just been listening to this weeks edition of Feedback on R4. WIth the new controller Mohit Bakaya. (27 year career BBC person) .
At the start of the programme he explains what his pitch was for the job….. “interested in new thinking .. positive thinking and prioritise solutions and not arguments. ”
and a “rethink” project.
God forbid. ! Well we know BBC has given up arguments – if they are against their doctrine, but this is ridiculous…. …..

97707 ▶▶ Julian, replying to mjr, 2, #777 of 1374 🔗

Solutions arrived at without argument are usually not worth much

His kind of solutions would probably consist of agreeing with BBC groupthink

If you argue you get sent to re-education camp

97696 PastImperfect, 1, #778 of 1374 🔗

Heart damage from C19?

Even more reason to have HCQ for early intervention or as a prophylactic.

97703 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 18, #779 of 1374 🔗


From US
“Amazon: profit up 100% Walmart: profit up 80% Target: profit up 80% Lowe’s: profit up 74% Microsoft, Facebook, Apple, Google: stock at record high Small businesses: 21% closed; revenue for rest down 30% We’re seeing a monumental wealth transfer from mom & pops to conglomerates.

 Left wing lock downers. Labour party. Happy with the result?

97870 ▶▶ Biker, replying to swedenborg, 5, #780 of 1374 🔗

the Labour Party have no clue how to make money so i doubt they’d understand your point

97704 richard riewer, 3, #781 of 1374 🔗

We are free to be idiots, but we are not free to be skeptics.

97705 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 14, #782 of 1374 🔗

If you want to know what we’re up against you just have to read the highest rated comments on the BBC Oldham lockdown story. It’s the same every local lockdown story though. The comments are always along the lines of “if people followed the rules properly this wouldn’t happen”.

T-cells, false positives, PCRs, testing bias, statistical significance. I’m afraid it’s a different language (and mode of thinking) to most people. It’s not even on the radar.

97718 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Achilles, 7, #783 of 1374 🔗

I can’t wait ’til these individuals are stuck at home bemoaning the multitudes outside baring face. It’s coming.

97756 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Tom Blackburn, #784 of 1374 🔗

I really hope so.

97780 ▶▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Two-Six, #785 of 1374 🔗

They probably already are hence why social media is full of clots.

97864 ▶▶ FatBastardMcKenzie, replying to Achilles, 1, #786 of 1374 🔗

If people followed the rules properly then socialism would have worked!

97913 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to FatBastardMcKenzie, #787 of 1374 🔗

People do seem to get in the way of dictatorial ideologies. If they’d stuck with social democracy they might have achieved a lot more.

97911 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Achilles, #788 of 1374 🔗

If it’s BBC comments, then probably all coming from the 77th.

97706 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 8, #789 of 1374 🔗

56 child deaths C-19 in US 61 million children
188 child deaths flu in US this 2019-2020 season.


97743 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to swedenborg, 4, #790 of 1374 🔗

Thanks swedenborg for all your fact finding! Much appreciated!

97710 Aremen, replying to Aremen, 24, #791 of 1374 🔗

I would love to name and whatever the opposite of shame is, by precisely naming the town and supermarket filling station, but I might get the staff member into trouble. Suffice to say it was in Devon. A very close relative of mine – call him R – went to get petrol. He won’t wear a mask so nowadays pays at the pump. He pressed the wrong button, so had to go in to pay. The young lady serving, without prompting, told R that it was great to see a customer without a mask. R paid, then he heard a “hippy type” behind him say “tosser”. R said “What did you say? I can’t hear you because of your face nappy”. Hippy mumbled. R walked away. Here’s the best bit. Lady serving said to hippy “If you continue to be abusive to a customer I will ask you to leave”. R gave her a big smile and left.

97799 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Aremen, 3, #792 of 1374 🔗


97790 ▶▶ annie, replying to richard riewer, #794 of 1374 🔗


98002 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to richard riewer, #795 of 1374 🔗

I spare you 30 blows …

97714 Montag Smith, replying to Montag Smith, 8, #796 of 1374 🔗

The Beeb are stoking fear again:


They claim the local restrictions will stop infections from “spiraling out of control”. That’s an emotive statement when they should have said the restrictions might reduce further transmission. It also presupposes that we actually have any control beyond pushing inevitable cases into the future.

97939 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to Montag Smith, 2, #797 of 1374 🔗

We have not at any point had control over this virus, it is entirely in control, the only reason it is now rarer and that the only rises we see are local is because it has infected enough people to, if not at the herd immunity threshold yet (which could be quite low what with cross-immunity to other coronaviruses and the fact that the threshold is lower for any given R0 when immunity is provided by infections where they spread rather than vaccines at random), definitely have levels of immunity it more difficult to come across a non-immune next person to infect. What we have had control over is our reactions to the virus, and those have been disgraceful, Sweden is one of very few places which has seen sense in this.

97727 RDawg, replying to RDawg, 34, #798 of 1374 🔗

I was waiting to see if Toby would publish this or not. It seems not! 😢

So instead I will share in the comments section, my account of recent trips to a big brand gym. It rhymes with Buffield, but I expect all the big brands are at it.

First Visit: I am told off by a member of staff for bringing a sweat towel onto the gym floor. Apparently this is against their new policy. Even though it is freshly laundered from home, it seems they’d rather I sweat all over the equipment instead, because that obviously makes sense.

Second Visit: One of the machines is taped off. I removed the tape and started using the machine. Within 10 minutes, one of the Covid police was instantly onto me asking where the tape had gone, in a blind panic. She immediately ran back into her office, emerging with a fresh roll of tape to wrap all around the machine. I wonder how many actual lives this will measure save?

Third Visit: I am approached by an instructor and told, “You’re not supposed to wear weights gloves, they’re really bad for spreading bacteria.” I point out to him that SARS CoV2 is actually a virus, not bacteria. He looks dumbfounded, confused and replies, “Erm yeah, and that too.” I took them off, then when he walked away put them back on again.

Mid workout my water bottle was empty but I couldn’t refill it because all the water fountains are taped off. I asked reception for a refill but they told me it wasn’t allowed. She then quietly hinted I refill it from the taps in the changing room toilets, which I did. Who would have thought it, water is now illegal in the gym!

Some other new rules include:
– Temperature guns pointed on my forehead on entry (even though it’s never calibrated and totally unreliable).
– I must arrive ready and changed to workout. You can only use the changing rooms and shower if you are swimming. Oh and you want to swim, you must book a a lot in advance.
– Wiping down of equipment with antibacterial (but not antiviral) wipes before and after use.
– Pieces of equipment taped off for anti-social distancing. They seem to pick machines at random for this, rather than it being based on any sort of logic.
– Sauna, steam room and hot tubs all closed.

The saddest part of all of this, is that the gym is at around 25% capacity of what it used to be. Everyone, and I mean everyone, is neurotically and obsessively wiping down equipment. Everyone except me that is! I’m ignoring all of it and feel like a naughty schoolboy, hiding my towel in my gym bag and sneakily refilling my water bottle on the sly.

Oh and one more thing. One of the instructors said to me, “I’ve been watching people like a hawk, making sure they all stick to the rules. People are just carrying on as normal. Don’t they realise we’re in the middle of a pandemic?!”
Err no love, we’re not. We’re at the END of a “pandemic” and none of this is in any way necessary.

97737 ▶▶ Klein, replying to RDawg, 14, #799 of 1374 🔗

Thats exactly why I left my gym – they sent me a massive list of rules and restrictions – including having to book a slot via some shitty app.

I cancelled my direct debit, and joined a new gym. The owner offered to show me round, and shook my hand as he introduced himself. The only measures are a bit of hand gel here and there. Everything else is completely normal – its fantastic.

I would get yourself out of that gym and find somewhere that doesn’t go in for all the bollocks. Money talks!

97833 ▶▶▶ RDawg, replying to Klein, 2, #800 of 1374 🔗

Interesting. I’m guessing this was an independent gym? Not a big chain?

97741 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to RDawg, 6, #801 of 1374 🔗

Just got an email from our gym as our glorious leader has decreed gyms can open on 31st August (not that I give a flying fuck). Both of us are going to cancel, £120 saved each month.

97757 ▶▶▶ Klein, replying to stefarm, #802 of 1374 🔗

are they not even open yet in Scotland?!

97765 ▶▶▶▶ AnotherSceptic, replying to Klein, 5, #803 of 1374 🔗

No, they are not. Apparently they can open on the 31st of August. As can swimming pools.
We are miles behind England & Wales.
Still no word on when driving tests can start up here again either, I am waiting to do my HGV practical driving lessons & test, but el presidente sturgeon has not even mentioned driving tests resuming.

Daft bint that she is.

97777 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Klein, 2, #804 of 1374 🔗

Nah, perish the thought of us being allowed out into the wild. From reading the pages of rules it won’t be much fun anyway so it is their loss.

97876 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Klein, 1, #805 of 1374 🔗

You get gyms in Scotland? That can’t be right. Up here we toss our cabers to stay in tip top shape.

97854 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to stefarm, 1, #806 of 1374 🔗

Even if you were to keep a membership there’s every chance they’d close down again as soon as one person tested positive after walking past a window.

97872 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Nobody2020, #807 of 1374 🔗

don’t tell us windows can read the virus now?

97754 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to RDawg, 3, #808 of 1374 🔗

Save your money, has my instructors instructor was told by Roy ‘Pretty Boy’ Shaw, press-ups and sit-ups are all you need (particularly when you are locked up in solitary……)

I feel blessed that I’ve able to train almost all the way through this clown show, full contact, none of this social distancing bollocks.

97776 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to RDawg, 5, #809 of 1374 🔗

Out of all the unfathomable rules and orders that must be followed, it is the little one-way systems that befuddle me the most.

97936 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #810 of 1374 🔗

And, if there still was a virus worth worrying about in a spreading phase of an epidemic then those one-way systems would be counterproductive. Increasing the time people spend in places. And with one way systems you are quite close to people ahead and behind (peple who would have ben off and gone in different directions under civilised ways of moving around) for prolonged periods, whereas passing people going the other way is a brief event where the chance of anything being transferred is minimal. I think the morons who drew up one way systems were fantasising over huddled masses of obedient sheep trudging along at the pace of the slowest victim (videos from one of the south american countries which have recently seen cases rise because they locked down hard and early were shwoing this). I think we can all send them a sensible message: no way to one way!

97971 ▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to seventeen, 1, #811 of 1374 🔗

One way trudging, like the workers in Metropolis (1927 film).

97812 ▶▶ RichardJames, replying to RDawg, 7, #812 of 1374 🔗

The madness of keeping the sauna closed is truly staggering. A sauna turned up high, and heating yourself through-and-through for two hours at a temperature in excess of 104 degrees F will kill ALL coronaviruses. The effect, when I last did it, was absolutely magical.

97964 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to RDawg, 1, #813 of 1374 🔗

We’re actually at the end of a panicdemic.

97728 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #814 of 1374 🔗

For an insight into the mindset that is winning, check out this woman’s twitter feed. She, I believe is one of the leading lights that we have to thank for mask wearing.


Not quite sure why it is OK for an Oxford ‘Professor’ to publicly take such an extreme, obvious, partisan political position, but it obviously doesn’t impede her progress.

97747 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Barney McGrew, 9, #815 of 1374 🔗

Just a quick glance, this woman is clearly evil.

97960 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, #816 of 1374 🔗

Yes. The yellow star and that sinister masked profile pic were enough for me!

97995 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cheezilla, #817 of 1374 🔗

The profile pic is indeed nasty. But the star, a pentagram, is the right way up – the bad guys usually invert it.

97770 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #818 of 1374 🔗

If I comment, I might say something offensive and she will then block me. Oh, I’m not on Twitter so. I can say whatever like. TG – get a life, get a proper job.

97775 ▶▶ Klein, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #819 of 1374 🔗

And what the fuck is a professor of primary care?

97961 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Klein, #820 of 1374 🔗

Does she advise GPs how to work from home while in Spain?

97811 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #821 of 1374 🔗

One of the Mengele brigade.

97744 Klein, replying to Klein, 12, #822 of 1374 🔗

I’m getting more and more used to going bareback, its water off a duck’s back to me now. B&Q and B&M bargains – most people wearing masks but there are always a few going bareback.
One thing I’ve noticed is that it is mainly men not wearing the masks, and I see a lot of couples where the woman is wearing a mask and the man is going bareback.
I’ve also still yet to be challenged, looking forward to my first do-gooder encounter!

97760 ▶▶ smileymiley, replying to Klein, 9, #823 of 1374 🔗

Don’t forget to smile…. they hate us smilers!

97788 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to smileymiley, 5, #824 of 1374 🔗

I smile at everyone a lot. But honestly, I think most people are refreshed to see someone smiling at them. As I’ve long said … as soon as they are no longer mandated , masks will virtually disappear within a week.

Obviously, I hope this happens very soon. But here is one possibility, at least in the US. Election in November. Some republican governors take over (fingers crossed in my state of Washington). There are many states that no longer require masks. Covid numbers remain the same everywhere.

Lots of people in mask-required places start asking “wait, why the fuck are we still wearing masks?? Those people over there aren’t wearing masks and they are totally fine.”

97847 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to RyanM, 1, #825 of 1374 🔗

Walking around all masked people must be like being in a foreign country not knowing anyone for a lot of people.

97761 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Klein, 9, #826 of 1374 🔗

And walk with head held high and a royal posture. They don’t like confident people who aren’t muzzled.

97769 ▶▶▶ Klein, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #827 of 1374 🔗

I’m pretty tall too, which helps. Also I’ve been growing the beard a bit

97858 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Klein, 2, #828 of 1374 🔗

Exactly. I also found that it helps to be dressed smartly – not necessarily corporate but even smart casual and it does exude confidence.

97894 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #829 of 1374 🔗

Exactly. I think that is why I don’t get challenged very often because I stride round wearing a big smile and making lots of eye contact, most people respond positively, I also chat to everyone and am extra polite. But for those rash enough to think they can bully me, well they tend to wish they hadn’t!”

97905 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #830 of 1374 🔗

Yep. I notice that shop staff respond to me positively despite the fact that I’m not muzzled. It helps that I smile, make eye contact and try to make things easy for them which I think they appreciate.

97829 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Klein, 1, #831 of 1374 🔗

In Wales, I’m seeing very few voluntary mask-wearing in Sainsburies and Aldis where I shop, and the exception is usually men – often young men.

Someone needs to do a proper anthropological study of all this.

97893 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Klein, 11, #832 of 1374 🔗

Several people maskless in Sainsbury’s today, male and female, a masked man said pointedly to his wife “I bet they could wear a mask if they had to”, to which I spat back “And I bet you could grow a pair, if you had to”.

97924 ▶▶▶ Klein, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #833 of 1374 🔗

The self righteous bastard, fair play to you

98094 ▶▶▶ rational actor, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #834 of 1374 🔗

I dunno, you’re an optimist there.

97746 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #835 of 1374 🔗

You’ll love this:

Helene-Mari van der Westhuizen and colleagues argue that face coverings should be considered not as medical equipment but as a social practice informed by norms and expectations

97764 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Barney McGrew, #836 of 1374 🔗

She’s blocked everyone on twitter who has disagreed with her.

97772 ▶▶ Montag Smith, replying to Barney McGrew, 19, #837 of 1374 🔗

Here’s my social norm: if there isn’t compelling evidence for the efficacy of masks then you can stick solidarity up your arse if it means imposing a muzzle on me.

97781 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Barney McGrew, 9, #838 of 1374 🔗

Unforgiveable. I cannot bring myself to read the whole piece until I have had enough beers. That this is coming out of the BMJ is an astonishing admission that masks are a social and political tool, not medical.

My feeling is they will be made mandatory everywhere no later than October this year, and that this regulation will then remain in place for decades. 2050 and beyond. I’ll be long gone thank fuck.

97784 ▶▶ RyanM, replying to Barney McGrew, 14, #839 of 1374 🔗

I just read that… it was a very long and drawn-out way of saying:

“all the evidence suggests that face masks don’t work, but we need to do it anyway to curb the devastating effects of the coronavirus. Furthermore, this will be difficult in places where it is not already a social norm, so it is very important that we create lots of pressure and make people believe that nonconformance is anti-social and morally wrong.”

I could have written a better, and much shorter, article:

“all of the evidence suggests that face masks don’t work. So don’t wear them.”

97805 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to RyanM, 5, #840 of 1374 🔗

I think we’re going to need a longer wall.

97807 ▶▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Nick Rose, #841 of 1374 🔗


97841 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #842 of 1374 🔗

Sounds just like religious fanaticism to me.

97845 ▶▶ FatBastardMcKenzie, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #843 of 1374 🔗

“Yet, a balance must be struck between encouraging customisation for comfort and acceptability and ensuring that the covering is sufficiently effective to block most viral transmission”

That statement right there shows the madness we’re up against.

97768 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #844 of 1374 🔗
97771 ▶▶ Klein, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #845 of 1374 🔗

geeet your teeeest

97782 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 10, #846 of 1374 🔗

In that little video she behaves like a teenager, doing a stupid little smile as she describes how she is going to deprive people of their liberty using non-democratic, emergency (i.e. arbitrary, unlimited) powers. What a b*tch.

97794 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Barney McGrew, 9, #847 of 1374 🔗

What a nasty tyrant she is

97779 Bella, replying to Bella, 6, #848 of 1374 🔗

Apologies to my northern compatriots who are on here but my local ‘pub’ is an 85 room hotel with a lot of northerners staying at the moment, every one of them compliantly wearing masks when doing any activity which involves not putting something in your mouth (??!!!!). I’m getting odd looks for not doing so and so are all the other ‘regulars’. We were fine and mask free a couple of weeks ago except some of the staff. Is there another culture up there?.

97806 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Bella, 3, #849 of 1374 🔗

We were in Cumbria earlier this week. Mask compliance was depressingly high. A fair few people wearing them out and about.

97840 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, #850 of 1374 🔗

A lot of yummy mummy types holidaying up there, as I undertand.

97998 ▶▶▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to Cheezilla, #851 of 1374 🔗

No, it’s the locals as much as the visitors, I found.

97903 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 2, #852 of 1374 🔗

I was in Keswick on Day One of Mask Fascism and came away depressed. Looked like 100% compliance. I won’t be returning until the bullshit is over.

97997 ▶▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #853 of 1374 🔗

Returned today from a week in West Cumbria – depressing to go out in the evening – it was mask central.
Even found a discarded Boden mask half way up Yewbarrow (clearly fallen out of the rucksack of the group ahead of us). Thanks god (or, pace Annie, God) for the fells themselves, which were their usual joy 🙂

97814 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Bella, #854 of 1374 🔗

Flippin heck! are we going soft!

97838 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bella, #855 of 1374 🔗

Masks are rarely seen in my Yorkshire neck of the woods!

97856 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bella, #856 of 1374 🔗

It depends where you are Bella. In general, if they are from the North East, they will be overly ‘polite’ and likely feel this will be the right way to behave. On home turf, they will be much more confident to do as they please. Reports from my mother in Newcastle suggest much less mask compliance, especially among men.

97863 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #857 of 1374 🔗

I’m on south coast

97860 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Bella, #858 of 1374 🔗

Might be down to something said to them when checking in?

97881 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Bella, 2, #859 of 1374 🔗

Where’s our farinances when we need her? Come to think of it she’s been quiet for a week or so now hasn’t she?

97883 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Bella, #860 of 1374 🔗


Always a mark of being a simple-minded “southerner”. 🙂

97896 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to RickH, 2, #861 of 1374 🔗

Huh? It’s syntax. And I was being very mindful of not being ‘regionalist’ by divorcing LS people on here from the conformists wherever they hail from.

97927 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Bella, -1, #862 of 1374 🔗

No, Bella – it’s a generalisation. That’s what I was pointing out. There is no ‘The North’ or ‘northerners’. It’s an illusion – just as much as the terms ‘South’ and ‘southerners’.

(For elaboration – I come from a family deeply and historically rooted in a specific part of the south west (the land of the Hwicce). But I have migrated through the Midlands to Yorkshire over time – and, as Gloucestershire isn’t ‘the South’, so Yorkshire isn’t ‘the North’.

Sorry to be picky. But it matters.

98006 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 1, #863 of 1374 🔗

No, it isn’t an illusion it is, as you pointed out, a generalisation.

The point about generalisations, as I’ve pointed out to you previously in relation to the similar term stereotype, is that they are generally true, when the term is used in this kind of human context rather than in mathematical logic. They are not universally true, obviously, and so you can always find a counterexample and declare: “see, the generalisation is false”, and many do that, but this is simply a common logical error.

It’s perfectly plausible, and generally accepted, that there are cultural differences between north and south, though the boundaries are blurred and they are, as noted above, only generally applicable. Most people accept this, though there are often debates about what are true differences and what are merely perceived differences.

You can also of course highlight distinct sub-groups with their own cultural aspects and discuss how they fit in, or don’t fit in, to this overall scheme. None of that renders the basic generalisation untrue.

97789 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 11, #864 of 1374 🔗

Our man Toby doing a cracking job on Any Questions now


97851 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 6, #865 of 1374 🔗

Toby was great when he was allowed to speak but the questions didn’t really allow sufficient scope for discussion and provided a platform for more fear.

If I had been Toby I would have walked out.

97853 ▶▶ davews, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #866 of 1374 🔗

Yes, good under the circumstances. He got some points over but as expected got interrupted if he got too much on the sceptic side. Of the 45 minutes it seemed to spend far too much on the exam results, the first two questions, occupying nearly half an hour, covered more or less the same subject matter. His attempts to publicise this site didn’t really come off.

97949 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to davews, #867 of 1374 🔗

The exams have been a perfect smokescreen this week.

97873 ▶▶ Mark, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 6, #868 of 1374 🔗

I thought he did a very good job and scored some hits. However, his situation exemplified the problem of making controversial minority opinions heard when there is clear bias against it on the part of the rest of the speakers and the moderator.

A key problem was that there was no question raised about the fundamental legitimacy and efficacy of the whole panic and lockdown, because this was taken as uncontroversial. This left Toby in the position of trying to answer questions most of which could most honestly be answered by saying “I wouldn’t have started from here”, which he made a decent fist of generally.

It was particularly annoying that one of the three establishment parrots on the panel got away with the Big Lie about Sweden early on, basically unchallenged.

97886 ▶▶ Mark, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 3, #869 of 1374 🔗

Was a bit disturbed by the tone of the conformists on the panel supporting enforcement of the literally stupid quarantine nonsense. The last thing we need is the government deciding there’s a political need to waste more resources doing yet more damage by pushing that idiocy even harder.

To be expected from Charles “your papers, please” Clarke, I suppose.

97804 Bella, replying to Bella, 10, #870 of 1374 🔗

Just joined Save Our Rights UK Facebook group. Like here, another haven of sanity (and I don’t usually use Facebook) and I need all the sanity I can get at the moment. 18.7K like- minded people

97926 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to Bella, 5, #871 of 1374 🔗

The other big bastion for liberty is Simon Dolan’s Keep Britian Free website, quite a few of the members subscribe to more conspiratorial interpetations about the abuse of our rights than the “cockup” reasons Toby tends to give, but the people there are nonetheless all lockdown sceptics like us and worthy allies in the fight for freedom.

97822 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 3, #872 of 1374 🔗

My god. WTAF is this about?


97831 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to hotrod, 12, #873 of 1374 🔗

These will be the parents of kids that grow up with mental health issues, needing constant therapy and no idea how to look after themselves once they leave home. They also end up resenting their parents when they realise what’s happened to them.

97836 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to hotrod, 5, #874 of 1374 🔗

Fight the second wave??
They should have called themselves the Don Quixote Club!

97842 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to hotrod, 5, #875 of 1374 🔗

The government have made a rod for their own back.Without the schools going back there is no chance of ever getting back to normal.
Read the replies,Collection of Lib Dem’s and Greens wanting a zero Covid policy.
Where’s King Canute when you need him?

97850 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #876 of 1374 🔗

Surely this is the Greens and Liberals wanting you bring down the government by destroying life as we know it.

You can’t get Covid Zero so why on earth are they expecting to?

Moreover the Government are pandering a little to this agenda too and should not be.

97880 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to hotrod, #877 of 1374 🔗

I don’t think the LibDems and Greens – however pusillanimous – are responsible for the Tory debacle.

Let’s keep real.

97882 ▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to RickH, 3, #878 of 1374 🔗

They are just ticks on a dead dog.

98228 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #879 of 1374 🔗

Great analogy!

97899 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to RickH, 7, #880 of 1374 🔗

No? Well their opposition has been remarkably silent. Labour too. Silence is complicity. The whole bloody lot are in it up to their necks. We need a longer wall.

97922 ▶▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to hotrod, 10, #881 of 1374 🔗

How the f*ck can they call themselevs “liberal” if they are pushing for a barbaric zero-covid policy? Liberalism requires respecting liberty, what “the left” have become is goose stepping illiberals.

97994 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to seventeen, #882 of 1374 🔗

There’s always been the authoritarian left and the liberal left, and the former invariably dominate once any real power is involved.

98067 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to hotrod, 3, #883 of 1374 🔗

The government are not far off the greens and Lib Dem’s just with a blue rosette.All our politicians could switch parties without too much policy change.They are all Blairite scum

97855 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 9, #884 of 1374 🔗

Nor can life ever be safe by these people’s standards and the government don’t have the spine to say so. I am now experiencing overwhelming rage every time I hear or see the word ‘safe’

97861 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 6, #885 of 1374 🔗

I work in a school and I know we glorified childcare.

Without schools many parents would not be able to afford to work.

97869 ▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #886 of 1374 🔗

So what is driving the agenda being pushed that schools, colleges and universities cannot open until we are Covid Zero.

Surely these are educated people who have benefited from all the above but seems to want to prevent others to have an education and a LIFE


97868 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to hotrod, 6, #887 of 1374 🔗

Jesus wept.

I feel sorry for their children and I won’t be surprised if these kids rebel and never forgive their parents a few years down the line.

97901 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bart Simpson, 7, #888 of 1374 🔗

Never upset your children. They get to choose the care home you end up in. And we now know there are some right dogs’ homes out there…

98131 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Nick Rose, #889 of 1374 🔗

Exactly. We should remind these parents just that-once they grow old, senile and feeble they’re reliant on their kids and they can extract their revenge for what has been done to them.

Thank God I don’t have kids. It would be criminal to bring them into this insane world that we live in.

97956 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to hotrod, 1, #890 of 1374 🔗

What a terrifyingly stupid bunch they are.

97832 Cheezilla, 4, #891 of 1374 🔗

A COVID-19 update from Council Leader…. We’re now testing more people than ever in Kirklees, but infection rates have increased over the last seven days….

No shit Sherlock!

Health Secretary, Matt Hancock, has announced today that the current restrictions will remain in place to allow more time for the impact of this ban on indoor gatherings to be felt , and make sure local residents and their loved ones are protected.

Knowing Wankock’s school prefect tendencies, I’m not sure how to take that statement!

[The] Leader of Kirklees Council, says he is calling for the Government to lift the restrictions in Kirklees.

97839 Kevin Comer, replying to Kevin Comer, 6, #892 of 1374 🔗

I live in Northern California. The spate of fires ignited by lighting earlier this week has led to extremely poor air quality in the much of the Bay Area. A pulmonary specialist was asked about masks during an interview on a Bay Area news channel. The doctor noted that while it was important to wear a mask to “slow the spread,” the sort of masks most people are wearing for this purpose are not at all effective at blocking particulates…

97907 ▶▶ RyanM, replying to Kevin Comer, 4, #893 of 1374 🔗

hahahaha – that’s awesome. Not good enough to stop smoke, but good enough to stop a virus that is hundreds of times smaller. Love that the doctor “noted the importance,” though.

97848 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 21, #894 of 1374 🔗

Retail Report

Morrisons, reasonably busy, 8PM on a Friday evening.


My first visit to a supermarket and other people not wearing masks!

One lady had a lanyard with several cards, so I assume exempt.

Two young blokes by the sandwich area, no lanyards no masks

One younger Eastern European lady, no lanyard no mask.

All good stuff, apart from the person on the till coughed into her palm and continued putting our stuff down the conveyor belt. So much for germ control.

97857 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #895 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for the report!

97859 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 9, #896 of 1374 🔗

Someone round here said it was worrying that testing seemed to be being concentrated in food factories, and that the fake/spurious “cases” were going to end up with the food supply being closed down. Others pooh-poohed this, saying it was fear-mongering.

I’m not so sure…

UK’s cheap food could fuel Covid-19 spread, says WHO envoy
Britain’s demand for cheap food could be fuelling the spread of the coronavirus in factories, a leading health expert has warned…

…What is absolutely clear, however, is that the safety of workers in food processing plants must be our No 1 priority.


It looks to me as though they are preparing to throw a spanner into a system that has stood up remarkably well to the measures so far.

97888 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Barney McGrew, 8, #897 of 1374 🔗

Well if they do, they can have a reminder of what food riots are like. People are living close to the knuckle as it is. I’ve seen how it goes with starvation. The haves never dare leave their homes. Blood in the streets, because hungry people are desperate people and they have nothing to lose. Nothing at all.

We must defund the WHO and do to the UN what Japan did to the League of Nations.

97944 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #898 of 1374 🔗

I can’t help wondering about the supermarket workers, nearly all where I am are wearing masks, surely it can’t be healthy doing a long shift leading to them taking sick leave, shops could be understaffed, shops could then be reducing opening hours etc

98054 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to stefarm, 3, #899 of 1374 🔗

regrettably with all the people looking for work now that there probably wouldn’t be too much trouble back-filling staff in the supermarkets. Unfortunately it’s an employers market now with many people looking for work.

98221 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #900 of 1374 🔗

Anything the WHO has to say should be ignored. Once they have been tarnished with corruption it would be stupid to believe anything they say.

97865 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 21, #901 of 1374 🔗

Observations from work following mandatory muzzling in museums, art galleries and heritage sites:

So its nearly a fortnight since muzzles were required in museums, art galleries and heritage sites and while one site I work has had more families because of the summer holidays, the numbers are still not enough – its “busy” during the first hour after opening but it tails off by lunch time and by afternoon its almost totally dead.

The main thing I’ve noticed however is that people are not staying long. In the past even if an exhibition isn’t exactly blockbuster, we almost always have to throw visitors out because of closing time and even visitors who stay for hours. Not at the moment – even those who we think are likely to stay long spend at most 20 minutes then they’re out. As one visitor told me, she didn’t want to stay any longer because of having to wear a muzzle which gives her severe discomfort. I told her about exemptions and she said she wasn’t aware of them. So I told her about where to find them and where to get lanyards.

It’s not only my workplace this is happening. A colleague went to another museum to see an exhibition and she told me that she didn’t stay very long as the muzzle was making it unbearable and she didn’t want to linger any longer than necessary.

97875 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Bart Simpson, 13, #902 of 1374 🔗

A really interesting insight.

Extend that sort of reaction across a range of situations, and you have a register of the damage that is being done.

97891 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to RickH, 12, #903 of 1374 🔗

Thanks. And I forgot to mention that many of our visitors don’t even bother to go into the gift shop as well.

I think its no different to shops – I’ve spoken to a lot of people who admit that they spend little time in supermarkets now – just grab the stuff that’s in your list, pay then go. I’m the same as well even though I’m exempt.

And of course “non-essential” shops are simply being avoided. When I went to Hatchard’s last week to collect the books I ordered, that’s what I simply did – no browsing. I was in and out in 5 minutes.

97935 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #904 of 1374 🔗


98146 ▶▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #905 of 1374 🔗

Thank you for this. I know I am now avoiding or spending as little time as possible in shops even going un- muzzled, and I haven’t been to a museum or cinema since lockdown. These observations should now be headline news in MSM. My recreational sanity was singing and we can’t practice or perform live yet.

98180 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Nicky, #906 of 1374 🔗

You’re welcome. Unfortunately I seem to be a lone voice in my workplace. A lot of my colleagues don’t really seem to be aware of what’s really going on. In their minds, we’re not getting a lot of visitors because they don’t “feel safe” and not because they don’t like having to wear muzzles and are in financial difficulties because of job losses and/or bankruptcy.

And its a shame that you can’t even practise your singing even at the bare minimum.

97920 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #907 of 1374 🔗

There needs to be a realisation of this at the very top levels of organisations and businesses, where they can speak directly to the people making the decisions.

97933 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Mark, 10, #908 of 1374 🔗

And yet there seems to be nothing. You would have thought that the likes of CEOs and museum directors would be shouting from the rooftops that this is destroying their businesses and organisations.They’re making redundancies and blaming it on the virus but don’t seem to realise that the virus is the least of our problems now. Its the panic that led to this lockdown and the harebrained schemes to supposedly to keep us “safe” that is leading our economy into collapse.

97992 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #909 of 1374 🔗

The silence of the CEOs is definitely a big part of the problem.

98052 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Mark, 6, #910 of 1374 🔗

i agree – if i owned a business i’d be shouting at the rooftops to TPTB – i’d also make it very clear of a relaxed/optional mask policy.
I think businesses should have a section of the day where no masks are required and compare the footfall. Make it clear so those who are all for masks can avoid. For example in supermarkets after 7pm no masks required – i bet that would see more people going in the evenings!

98133 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Sue, 1, #911 of 1374 🔗

That would be a good idea – they could test it and even museums can join in then compare and contrast the figures.

98449 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Sue, #912 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I think that would be an excellent idea. Of course, one of the problems with using the law to push these things is that such flexibility is removed.

98132 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Mark, 2, #913 of 1374 🔗

Agree. Simon Dolan has said as much when he revealed that his biggest supporters were actually SME owners. He was pretty much ignored by big businesses.

97934 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #914 of 1374 🔗

Well at least you’re educating some people and greatly helping them.
More smiley faces to influence the rest – and no doubt they’ll pass on the good news!
Drip, drip, drip …..

97951 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #915 of 1374 🔗

As Mr Bart has said it seems to be deliberate to keep people ignorant about exemptions and their right to claim one.

97874 TheBluePill, replying to TheBluePill, 22, #916 of 1374 🔗

On the way back home from the south of France. The stark contrast has just got to me. Friday 9PM Birmingham New Street station is dead. Everywhere is closed at the new grand Central shopping centre. Not even a place to buy beer for the train. Failed restaurants have left units gutted. Train back home is empty. The South of France was heaving with French patrons enjoying themselves. Restaurants and bars were all full. Here it is becoming a derolict ghost town. The French didn’t need the dreaded “eat out to help out”, they just carried on with life. On the Eurostar home some old guy was literally scrubbing the windows and chairs with alcohols gel. What the fuck have we allowed to happed. Right now I feel that we need to bring back the gallows for these traitors in government.

97879 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to TheBluePill, 4, #917 of 1374 🔗

And yet, at the same time:


The Daily Fail says they even have to wear them while riding a bike! MW

97889 ▶▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 8, #918 of 1374 🔗

Yes, maybe. But their independent businesses are coping fine. Ours have been crushed, even small chains have perished. Their towns and cities are thriving, outs are dying. Because our populous are genuinely convinced they will die, the French not at all.

97895 ▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to TheBluePill, 1, #919 of 1374 🔗

Are you saying the French like wearing masks?

97941 ▶▶▶▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to Steeve, #920 of 1374 🔗

No, not at all. I’m just saying that they are still spending in their restaurants, bars and shops while our zombies are letting entire city centres die. It is disgusting that the French are complying with muzzles but the collateral damage there seems much more limited.

97970 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to TheBluePill, #921 of 1374 🔗

OK – Thanks for the reply!

98115 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to TheBluePill, 4, #922 of 1374 🔗

Our city centres have destroyed themselves by making the experience of visiting them so loathsomely unpleasant – not for zombies, who wouldn’t go there anywhere because Outside Home Is Death, but for human beings. If the businesses in any town or city centre had the collective guts to chuck the zCovid filth and restore normality, revival would be instantaneous.

97931 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to TheBluePill, 4, #923 of 1374 🔗

Very interesting. Have we been hit harder economically than most other Western nations because cultural trends that were more established here than elsewhere have been massively accelerated by the regulations? Increased o nline shopping and the terminal decline of pubs and restaurants were already well under way before 2020.

98025 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, 3, #924 of 1374 🔗

The death of the high street has just been accelerated

97877 MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 13, #925 of 1374 🔗

James Corbett’s latest video: ‘What is the WHO’ is worth a watch.


Apart from outlining some of their dodgy recent history, big pharma links and quite worrying amount of power over every state in the world, we should all be asking why nobody seems to see the danger of one organisation (BMGF) being the 2nd biggest, maybe soon the biggest, funder of a World health organisation. He also talks about the previous ‘Scandemic’ H1N1 which has relevance to what’s going on now.

Conspiracy data at its best. I realise some people want to hold on to the cock-up theory, that it’s just our government panicking, but the more you look what’s going on at global level, the harder it is to hide from what is fully documented and there for us all to see if we can take the trouble. MW

97953 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #926 of 1374 🔗

I will watch it for sure. I just made a donation to the Corbett Report. When someone like him and the Plandemic film maker tell a coherent story and put all the pieces together, it’s very difficult to think this is just one huge cockup and there isn’t something more nefarious going on.

97969 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #927 of 1374 🔗

Corbett is simply a very good independent investigative journalist. Everything he produces is meticulously researched and sourced. He mentioned a while back that he has only ever visited the USA once in his life, which surprised me.

Another great alternative Canadian who has really stepped up to the plate this year is Jeff Berwick (The Dollar Vigilante). His videos are actually entertaining, which is no mean feat considering the material being covered.

98216 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #928 of 1374 🔗

It has been planned, of that I am certain. Heads of governments should be facing treason charges. and that goes for Boris the Bluffer!

97878 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 7, #929 of 1374 🔗

Dr Ron Daniels, at last MSM seems to be printing the truth.

Daily Mail definitely turned track in last few weeks.

Comments too seem to be very clear on direction of readership.


97912 ▶▶ Nic, replying to hotrod, 3, #930 of 1374 🔗

Trouble is if there is a spike in deaths dm readers will.be screaming for lockdown,

97917 ▶▶ seventeen, replying to hotrod, 6, #931 of 1374 🔗

Still worrying that they refr to it as a “life-threatening disease” rather than a “pesky cough” or “irritating infection” or “virus induced week of mild misery”.

97930 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to seventeen, 1, #932 of 1374 🔗

There were some very mixed messages in the article. Most of the comments are brilliant though.

97940 ▶▶▶▶ Eddie, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #933 of 1374 🔗

Yes I really enjoyed the comments section. Was thinking some of you good folks were responsible for a few of them

97962 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Eddie, #934 of 1374 🔗

Surely you don’t mean me…

98695 ▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Eddie, #935 of 1374 🔗

I do my best. Same handle there as here.

98022 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to hotrod, 1, #936 of 1374 🔗

If I had a pound for every time someone has said “the tide is turning” on here, I would now be able to buy a Premier League football club!

97890 AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #937 of 1374 🔗

He’s an rather impressive fella that Mr Tedros 😉


97892 seventeen, replying to seventeen, 27, #938 of 1374 🔗

Here’s a fact worth noting about our disgraceful government’s actions, thanks to their fooolish decision to illegally lock down the British people our country now has a national debt of almost 17 times the yearly budget of the NHS. They could have funded 17 f*cking health services for the cost that lockdown has caused*, SEVENTEEN. And they try to claim they were “saving” the NHS? If they’d wanted to “save” it (from a disease which never had the ability to really threaten it anyway) perhaps they could have built up the same obscene level of national debt by spending 17 times its yearly budget on expanding it, rather than on stripping the liberty, dignity and economic hope from 67M of us. At least that way there would have still been a functioning economy to one day pay off this debt we never asked to be burdened with.

*cost to them, cost to the country as a whole is much higher still

97902 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to seventeen, 3, #939 of 1374 🔗

At least we will be carbon neutral by 2030.

97908 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Two-Six, 2, #940 of 1374 🔗

In what way? the only way to keep a proper civilisation running without emitting significant net CO2 quantities is to replace all powerplants with nuclear and renewables, and all petrol/diesel transportation with hydrogen fuel cells. Doing that will COST. and It’ll cost money we could have had but instead wasted on a tortuous lockdown.

97923 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to seventeen, 5, #941 of 1374 🔗

Well, how about, the commercial centres of towns and cities, no longer being the commercial centres. No more commuting, no more shopping trips to supermarkets or shopping centres, all goods and services ordered online and electric deliveries for the last 5 miles cutting “carbon” by a lot, no more school runs, 60% of the working population working from home, people living in confverted office blocks and shops pooling heating and energy use, no more travel for most people, air travel a luxury for the rich. No more internal combustion engines only EV;s….no more meat. food rationing.

97925 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, 1, #942 of 1374 🔗

Oh yes The Corona Project will enable all of this.

97945 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Two-Six, 4, #943 of 1374 🔗

And yet they still wheeled out Saint Greta Funberg this week to complain that 2 years has been wasted in the effort to achieve net zero carbon omissions. No mention of the PPE waste avalanche that is about to swamp the oceans of course.

I remember laughing at an Extinction Rebellion spokeswoman interviewed by Andrew Neil in October 2019 (around the time of their big protests in London) demanding that all civilian air travel needed to be terminated by 2025. I’m not laughing now.

97980 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Richard O, 2, #944 of 1374 🔗

I didn’t laugh then either. I could see clearly what was coming. I didn’t think they WOULD do the pandemic thing. I did wonder just how we were going to be carbon neutral by 2030.

Well this is how they are going to do it. A “pandemic” a “virus” as a vector for massive societal change. A catalyst, I am still amazed they did this to us. It’s just so cruel. SO evil.

98004 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Two-Six, 2, #945 of 1374 🔗

I note with interest that one of the prominent figures in the ghastly Masks4All is a member of Extinction Rebellion (and a doctor).

I need to revisit footage of the weird ceremonies and processions that those freaks put on during their protests. There may be some clues in there that indicate a level of foreknowledge.

98040 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to Two-Six, 1, #946 of 1374 🔗

Good points. Not sure about the reduced carbon thing – now I see people advocating for the importation of thousands & thousands & thousands of migrants because apparently we all know they will contribute billions to the economy. Import thousands of people from the middle east & sub-Saharan Africa – carbon emissions, much?

98019 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Two-Six, 2, #947 of 1374 🔗

Don’t forget offload all those carbon emissions to other countries by destroying industry here! Carbon zero is about shifting the problem elsewhere.

97955 ▶▶▶▶ Tangelo, replying to seventeen, 1, #948 of 1374 🔗

I think he was being sarcastic seventeen

98208 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Two-Six, 1, #949 of 1374 🔗

And that is what it is really about! I sussed this from the beginning.

97904 TheBluePill, replying to TheBluePill, 26, #950 of 1374 🔗

I’d like to share the reality of the professionalism of our government’s quarantine process…
So travelling from Paris to London on Eurostar today. I initially filled in the mandatory web form to provide information on where I was staying. Terribly designed and confusingly worded. At the end it sends you an A4 PDF with a massively complex QR code that must be an absolute arse to scan on a phone. On arrival at the British border at Gare Du Nord, I had to show the PDF to an officer at the front of the queue. The PDF was zoomed out and unreadable. It was not scanned. He glanced at it and then gave me a photocopy of a little ticket with two duplicated QR codes on it, cut out by scissors (FFS) to show at the passport check. Everyone had the same poorly cutout photocopy. At the passport check they didn’t do anything at all with the ticket.
At St Pancras on arrival I was singled out and sent to a seperate queue. This may have been due to the fact that I was the only unmuzzled person and was wearing a sceptic t-shirt from Carl Vernon. Was met with two officers and when I gave them my photocopied ticket they ushered me through. The rest of my group went through the “sheep” queue and did not have to hand in their tickets. My suspicion is that this was an attempt to find people who looked likely to have circumvented the quarantine rubbish and hand them a £100 fine, with the ultimate aim of producing some respectable numbers for the meeja to show they are really fining people.
This operation is ammature beyond belief. To think that they are printing out multiple duplicate QR codes on A4 and some poor sod is employed to cut them out with scissors. Not even sophisticated enough to buy a guillotine. Just pretending that they have a complex system in place.

97916 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to TheBluePill, 4, #951 of 1374 🔗

Interesting insight!

98234 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Tom Blackburn, #953 of 1374 🔗

Officers attended a property in #Swinton where 3 families were celebrating a child’s birthday in a private garden. The homeowner has been issued with a fixed penalty notice.”

Happily, most of the comments call this some version of tyrannical and overreach by the police.

97909 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 2, #954 of 1374 🔗


Attacking the defence: SARS-CoV-2 can infect immune cells From Oxford group
“Lymphopenia and systemic viral dissemination are commonly found in severe COVID-19. This preprint study reports that immune cells (monocytes, CD4 + T cells, CD8+ T cells and B cells) are susceptible to SARS-CoV-2 infection.”

 Perhaps not surprising that it happens in severe cases but how is the virus infecting the T cells?

97942 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to swedenborg, 6, #955 of 1374 🔗

Speculating here, but I suspect the clue is in the word “severe”. I suspect these cases will occur in people with other severe underlying conditions. It might not be Covid affecting the T cells, but whatever else the patients are suffering from. Else Covid would affect the T cells in everybody it infects, which is clearly not the case.

Occam’s Razor is your friend.

97988 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #956 of 1374 🔗

Probably correct.There are some harmless virus like HPV which can extremely rarely be fulminant where an undisclosed immune disorder just manifest itself in a fulminant infection.

97929 p02099003, replying to p02099003, #957 of 1374 🔗

John Campbell on YouTube has reported on this article https://www.jpeds.com/article/S0022-3476(20)31023-4/fulltext

97943 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to p02099003, 4, #958 of 1374 🔗

One critic
The fact that anti-schoolers resorted to hyping the Mass General “study” of “kids” up to age 22… only *three* of whom were asymptomatic positive… that didn’t even look at transmissibility… to claim “silent spreaders”… might be the strongest *pro-school* evidence yet!

97938 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, #959 of 1374 🔗

Anybody come across Earth United?

Do you wish to be free?….. If desire for freedom from a tyrannical power structure exists while restoring peace, then Earth United is a light for our world to go. It doesn’t matter who or what your background or beliefs are, these are FACTS that require action as this truth affects us all once known… and the time to correct and reclaim our FREEDOM , Sovereignty & power is now!

97966 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #960 of 1374 🔗

The idea of no government certainly sounds appealing! unfortunately I suspect we are going to get more of it than ever shortly unless people wake up. And now they have the technology to monitor and control us more than ever.

97981 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #961 of 1374 🔗

Anarchy has a very bad name, mainly because the word is incorrectly associated with civil disobedience. Nothing could be further from the truth. Real anarchy is probably the most idealistic political philosophy out there. There are different shades (libertarianism, minarchism, anarcho-capitalism etc.) but overall the message is the same. Government (especially big government) fucks everything up, and needs to be reduced or eliminated wherever possible.

97983 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Richard O, #962 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I agree. Anarchy is a good political philosophy and doesn’t mean chaos either. However it would rely on a well informed enlightened population. The levels of brainwashing and mendacious interference from power hungry actors will mean it can’t happen.

97991 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Two-Six, 2, #963 of 1374 🔗

I went to an anarchist/freedom conference in Philadelphia last year. Although the speakers were excellent, the whole event was plagued by all manner of factional in-fighting and back-stabbing. This regardless of the fact that t he attendees were generally very intelligent and informed. Proof right there and then that without coherent leadership we very quickly degenerate into chaotic disorder.

98020 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 3, #964 of 1374 🔗

Look at the Chaz experiment.Within days borders established and a strong man emerged .Anarchy is another Utopian pipe dream.Freedom under the rule of law is the best we can hope for

98031 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 5, #965 of 1374 🔗

Agreed. Look at the prison experiment at Stanford University in the early 70s. Within days the guards were torturing the inmates.

In the British context, we should aim for the rule of common law. It’s the greatest thing we have. A thousand years of gradually and organically evolving agreements on how to live together. It really pisses me off that we are not taught this as part of the basic school curriculum.

98503 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Richard O, #966 of 1374 🔗

Bliar probably wouldn’t allow it.

98502 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #967 of 1374 🔗

When I saw what happened in CHAZ I immediately thought of Jordan Peterson and his lobsters!

97947 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 16, #968 of 1374 🔗

I’ve had a glimpse of the future, finally we eradicated the virus:

98139 ▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #969 of 1374 🔗

If you look closely, you can just about make out where the high street used to be

98394 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Nobody2020, #970 of 1374 🔗

They make a desert and call it health.

97954 Tommo, replying to Tommo, 49, #971 of 1374 🔗

Only found this website two weeks ago. Such a great source of information. I have been a sceptic since the beginning, but thought I was on my own. So happy to find so many like-minded people. Anyway, you have given me the confidence to go mask-free for the first time this week. On Wednesday, I went to a soft-play centre with the kids. Rules a bit odd. Needed a mask to enter, was taken to a table and told no mask needed at the table. But mask needed if you leave the table. I refused to wear a mask throughout and not challenged. After an hour, many of the parents also took off masks. And tonight I went to local shop maskless for the first time. Determined to do my bit to stop the panic and fear.

97973 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Tommo, 5, #972 of 1374 🔗

Good job soldier!

97986 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tommo, 11, #973 of 1374 🔗

Every sane unmasked face helps resist normalisation of this abomination.

98021 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Tommo, 10, #974 of 1374 🔗

To quote Dr Vernon Coleman: “Although it may seem like it at times, please remember: you are not alone. More and more people are waking up all the time. I firmly believe that together we will win this war.”

98112 ▶▶ annie, replying to Tommo, 1, #975 of 1374 🔗

Welcome to the realm of sanity! Great to have you with us.

98135 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tommo, 1, #976 of 1374 🔗

Welcome and well done!!!!

98156 ▶▶ wat tyler, replying to Tommo, 1, #977 of 1374 🔗

Well done.keep fighting .

97958 Darryl, replying to Darryl, 8, #978 of 1374 🔗

It’s interesting that even if the ‘virus’ disappeared from the world tomorrow the worlds leaders seem to have decided this ‘new normal’ must continue until every one in the world has been vaccinated with a rushed largely untested vaccine. I find it staggering that billions of people around the world seem to be so submissive and unquestioning of the ruling elite. This is an interest if disheartening video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49rAlzU7WlY&t=5s

An academic said the other day that the drinking water should be drugged to alter peoples behaviour to make them more compliant, I wonder if they have started already and perhaps we are the immune few?

98048 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Darryl, 6, #979 of 1374 🔗

Astonishing as the level of compliance with all the bizarre and irrational regulations is, I think it was baked into the cake with the general deterioration in mental capacity that has been going on for a very long time. In the 80s I remember taking mock exams using papers given to pupils of the same age in the 60s, and they were indecipherable. Even back then the decline was already steep.

I gladly accept being in the ostracised minority who are immune. It does not even qualify as persecution. Unless and until we are directly threatened with the kind of bestial physical punishments meted out to ancestors who did not tow the majority line, I will not fear any mandates.

98224 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Darryl, #980 of 1374 🔗

I saw that video, too. Really worth a listen, just for all the leaders talking about how a vaccine must be mandatory and how they intend to enforce it by not making it mandatory – unless you want to live any kind of normal life.

I agree. I think some of us are immune to that drug in the water.

97975 Steeve, replying to Steeve, #981 of 1374 🔗

Good Night Boris! Good Night Matt! How often do you visit the site? Suggested bedtime reading – Johnson’s Life of London https://www.waterstones.com/book/johnsons-life-of-london/boris-johnson/9780007418930

98050 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Steeve, 3, #982 of 1374 🔗

The sequel ‘the man who destroyed London’

98352 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #983 of 1374 🔗

and the rest of the country.

97977 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 1, #984 of 1374 🔗

Coronavirus latest news: Pandemic can be over in under two years, says WHO chief
Oh good! Less than two years and we’ll be back to the old normal. No problem then.

From The Telegraph coronavirus live feed:
The world should be able to rein in the coronavirus pandemic in less than two years, the World Health Organization said today, as European nations battle rising numbers of new cases.
Western Europe has been enduring infection levels not seen in many months, particularly in Germany, France, Spain and Italy – sparking fears of a second wave.
In Madrid, officials recommended people in the most affected areas stay at home to help curb the spread as the country registered more than 8,000 new cases in 24 hours.
France also reported a second consecutive day of more than 4,000 new cases – numbers not seen since May – with metropolitan areas accounting for most of the infections.
But WHO chief Dr Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus sought to draw favourable comparisons with the flu pandemic of 1918.
“We have a disadvantage of globalisation, closeness, connectedness, but an advantage of better technology, so we hope to finish this pandemic before less than two years,” he told reporters.
By “utilising the available tools to the maximum and hoping that we can have additional tools like vaccines, I think we can finish it in a shorter time than the 1918 flu”, he said.

97984 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Tenchy, 16, #985 of 1374 🔗

The WHO chief must be the most incompetent and corrupt ever.To have the idea to compare to Spanish flu which was 100 times severe just shows that he is employed by Big Pharma

97990 ▶▶▶ Not Tiger Woods, replying to swedenborg, 5, #986 of 1374 🔗

There is/was a petition that reached over 1 million signatures to remove him. It appeared shortly after the Japanese Government (think it was the Deputy PM?) publicly attacked him as China’s puppet, I believe they actually used the phrase ‘Chinese Health Organisation’ in relation to the WHO. I’m pretty sure he (WHO Chief) was the former head of Ethiopia Communist Party, and has precious little in the way of medical qualifications, certainly he is not a trained Dr.

97996 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Not Tiger Woods, 1, #987 of 1374 🔗

He was an executioner.

98000 ▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Not Tiger Woods, #988 of 1374 🔗

Not a trained medical doctor, but to be fair he does have several relevant qualifications:


98190 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Not Tiger Woods, 3, #989 of 1374 🔗

Our problem is we expect the best person to be in the job when it’s the most corrupt that generally rise to the top.

98016 ▶▶▶ BJJ, replying to swedenborg, 1, #990 of 1374 🔗

Isn´t he a geologist?

98065 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to swedenborg, 3, #991 of 1374 🔗

Dead right Swedenborg! The Spanish flu is the benchmark for a really serious modern pandemic and we are nowhere near that mark.

97985 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Tenchy, 5, #992 of 1374 🔗

“battle rising numbers”, “enduring infections” – hospitals are empty and hardly any deaths. Who believes all this crap?
Do you think they are increasing the fear mongering because people are protesting and big protest are planned for the end of August?
Lebanon is now in partial lockdown. They have just had protests. No more.

98198 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to JulieR, 1, #993 of 1374 🔗

Yes I expect the Covid hysteria to rise exponentially with the publics awareness of the scamdemic.

98014 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tenchy, 1, #994 of 1374 🔗

Well if by that he means getting enough young (under 65s) fit people infected and recovered to achieve herd immunity? Possible if strains of SC2 are positively selected for infectivity without effect on disease severity:
cell.com/cell/full text/S0092-8674(20)30820-5

98220 ▶▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Bruno, 1, #996 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for the link. Although a technical complicated article to follow for us non specialists there are some striking findings. G614more infectious although a certain caution as higher viral load might not necessary mean automatically more infectious but the rapid spread seems to mean that it is more infectious and replacing the old one. The good news, no increase in hospitalization. Striking in the Sheffield data was that the most severe cases seemed to have low viral load if I read it correctly. A problem for a potential vaccine is that the vaccine needs to elicit much more antibodies to be protective if this clade of virus will be dominant for the future

98047 ▶▶▶ seventeen, replying to Bruno, 1, #997 of 1374 🔗

If we reach a position where we can get a very mild strain spreading to give immunity to the other kinds then the coronanists will start trying to deny the principle of natural selection as well as the principle of herd immunity. Viruses naturally mutuate over time to be less dangerous and more contagious, that is the pressure of evolution, I’d hope we could hurry that pressure along (not that doing so is so vital what with herd immunity approaching or here already).

98138 ▶▶ smurfs, replying to Tenchy, 3, #998 of 1374 🔗

The latest shortish video from The Corbett Report covers the role of the WHO in all of this if you want to get up to speed on this shower of shit. In a nutshell they are political appointments who have been bought by their biggest donors and used as a conduit to enforce medical tyranny on the whole world.

They achieve this as every country in the world (with a few exceptions) has signed up the the WHO charter and when the WHO say jump every country has to, in the greater public interest of course. It would be interesting to know what the consequences would be if a country were to say f*ck you.

So when that corrupt Ryan knob head at the WHO says we need to seek out members of families who are positive and lock them in secure isolation, and then New Zealand passes laws to do just that, you know we are are not far off being locked away in internment camps in the not too distant future when we resist testing/vaccinations.

This is why this is such an important fight we cannot afford to lose.

98202 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to smurfs, 2, #999 of 1374 🔗

Which is why anything the WHO says should be taken with a large pinch of salt. The same applies to this government and their advisors with links to Bill Gates and his impressive deep pockets.

97978 richard riewer, 2, #1000 of 1374 🔗

A must listen: At minute 47, or thereabouts, Dr. Tenpenny describes all the poisons that are essential ingredients in any and all vaccines.
Freak out.

98001 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 5, #1001 of 1374 🔗

I implore all of you to listen to both interviews that Richie Allen conducted last April 21, 2020. The two highly qualified women that were interviewed will fill your head with many interesting analyses.

98212 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to richard riewer, #1002 of 1374 🔗

No thanks. Try instead David Gorski, John Ioannidis. USAis full of snake oil proponents. DG advocates for openness of the results of clinical trials and the use of only evidence-based medicine to treat disease.

98009 Liam, replying to Liam, 22, #1004 of 1374 🔗

My response to a text from an ex earlier. Pardon the sweariness.

“You’re worried about a “no deal Brexit” when all of our social and economic life has been halted by arbitrary decree? When millions of people wait on rulings about whether they can hug their friends? When a virus that’s (maybe) added about half of one fucking percent to one month’s global deaths has dominated our fucking lives for nearly a year? Is everyone fucking mad?“

98012 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Liam, 4, #1005 of 1374 🔗

Not everyone. Just too many.

98015 ▶▶ BJJ, replying to Liam, 3, #1006 of 1374 🔗

Some of us are ok

98056 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Liam, 10, #1007 of 1374 🔗

Brexit, how quaint!

I voted Remain against all of my principles for one reason alone. Boris Johnson was the de facto leader of the Leave campaign. My reasoning was that if he is involved, it must be toxic. I utterly loathed him back in 2016. There are no words in the English language sufficient to convey my feelings towards him now.

It would not surprise me in the least if he ditches the whole thing at the last minute and extends the transition period indefinitely (owing to the crisis that his government has created). He never gave a fuck about it anyway, it was always his vehicle to become PM, nothing more.

98071 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 6, #1008 of 1374 🔗

He wrote 2 newspaper articles.One for remain,one for Brexit.He plumped for Brexit as he rightly thought it would give him the biggest opportunity for advancement.
Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel was written for him.

98077 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 2, #1009 of 1374 🔗

I have heard rumours that he tossed a coin such was the level of his disinterest. He is that shallow.

Such is our plight that the very worst among us always flourish. We’ve been here before a million times.

98136 ▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Richard O, 1, #1010 of 1374 🔗

Have to say that worries me at the moment. Leave should still mean leave whatever you voted, and please let us not go there again. This debacle is already feeling more and more like the brexit debate in the MSM i.e. majority one sided commentary, choice of who to interview to support that view, lack of true understanding of alternative picture. Who can forget the dire economic picture painted then at several stages – none of which came true. Now it’s the ever awaited ‘2nd wave’. Give me strength…..

98189 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Nicky, 1, #1011 of 1374 🔗

“None of which came true”. Give ME strength. It hasn’t happened yet, baby.

98219 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, #1012 of 1374 🔗

Brexit, I mean. NOT ‘second wave’, which I agree is not possible in UK .

98390 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Bruno, 1, #1013 of 1374 🔗

In truth, any potential effects from Brexit either way have likely been dwarfed by the economic catastrophe we are in the process of voluntarily inflicting upon ourselves.

98177 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Richard O, #1014 of 1374 🔗

I agree 100%.

98010 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 2, #1015 of 1374 🔗

Fauci funded studies at the Wuhan Lab with American taxpayer dollars. He’s a monster too. Listen to the April 21, 2020 Richie Allen Show for all the facts.

98026 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to richard riewer, 3, #1016 of 1374 🔗

It really is criminal that he has stayed in his position for 4 decades, he should have left years ago. I can only imagine it is friends in big pharma and Bill Gates keeping him in place. I suspect that if Americans were less medicated and had healthier lifestyles the country would be much better off. Big business and the media have completely corrupted the country.

98053 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Darryl, #1017 of 1374 🔗

Often the way with corruption. Silos (common purpose term) occur where its impossible to delegate without compromising the activities.

98063 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Darryl, #1018 of 1374 🔗

Didn’t he set out during (!) the crisis to write a book about himself and how wonderful he is…?

98242 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to richard riewer, #1019 of 1374 🔗

He had to do that a step research that was going on was banned in the US.

98028 richard riewer, 2, #1020 of 1374 🔗

Henrik Ibsen wrote a play about Cancelling way back at the end of the 19th Century:
An Enemy of the People

98038 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1021 of 1374 🔗

People have been brainwashed., and I have probably drunk too much Brewdog Punk IPA.

Sometimes we all need a release.

98043 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Dave #KBF, #1022 of 1374 🔗

Great beer! I was introduced to it a couple of weeks ago!

98044 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Dave #KBF, #1023 of 1374 🔗

I had some of that last night…errrrppp

98059 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Dave #KBF, #1024 of 1374 🔗

I recommend Fourpure Hemisphere Session IPA. Brewed in Bermondsey. It has seen me through many bleak evenings and the hangovers are mild.

98039 Dominic12, replying to Dominic12, 14, #1025 of 1374 🔗

My intended first post from about 10 days ago probably didn’t get through but I’ve registered now and hopefully it will appear. Of course I apologise if it did eventually get through and it has already been read without me being aware. That would result in a big deserved D’oh.

I haven’t seen much from the shopkeepers (manager not owner) perspective of mask wearing so that is the subject of my first post here.

After the law was published I read it online and printed out the most relevant parts. All members of staff were spoken to and advised that anyone could come in the shop without a mask and that they must not challenge them or question them. Some of the exact wording of the legislation was quoted to reinforce the point. If any mask wearer started kicking off it would be they who would have to leave and two staff members suggested that before I told them. There are also no posters in the shop referring to masks.

The printed relevant parts were put on the shop floor for reference in case of difficulty and at least one staff member read them of their own volition. Visors were purchased when the shop reopened but have not been touched and all staff were told they are welcome to wear their own masks if they wish to. No one on the shop floor has ever worn a mask there.

Almost everyone coming in the shop now wears a mask and there has never been an issue between them and the staff or the few customers who don’t. I haven’t usually gone out of my way to suggest people stop wearing masks but of course nothing is said to those who don’t wear them properly or at all. The times I’ve said that masks can be removed the wearer has frequently done so and been happy about it. On two occasions I’ve told parents of mask wearing children clearly under the age of 11 they are exempt – the kids were removing the mask after leaving the shop before I spoke. In the first instance the mother said she knew they were exempt but they had asthma and ‘better safe than sorry’. As it is not my business (in both senses) I thought it better to keep quiet. The second time the father seemed unsure of the exemption even though he said his wife had told him. He also said they’d been moaning about wearing them. So hopefully my comment reinforced the position of the wife and the children no longer have to wear the masks.

My perception is that most people are wearing them since it became compulsory because they believe the shop staff expect or require them to do so. Also that despite simply being some bloke who works in a shop I have some authority over them and what should be & was previously an important matter of their personal health.

I would go rather further if it was my own business but, especially as I don’t know who is listening, don’t feel able to take that risk Careless talks cost live and all; and the owner, whilst not expecting things to get betterany time soon, doesn’t yet fully appreciate that they will never be allowed to as a matter of policy.

98104 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Dominic12, 5, #1026 of 1374 🔗

Good for you! Any time you can set someone straight as to their rights and get them to ditch the mask is a big win. I wish there were more like you.

98111 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 5, #1027 of 1374 🔗

Indeed, If more shops and businesses adopted the same attitude, sanity would quickly orevail.

98049 Basics, replying to Basics, 3, #1028 of 1374 🔗

More on the Scottish nationalist activists making anti English demonstrations under the guise of keeping Scotland safe from Covid19.


My reason for posting is that there is a clear issue in Scottish politics that considers other nations to be a different race. This is because to say these thugs are nationalist would harm the er nationalists, so its called racism by MSPs. Discrimination finds a foot hold in any nook of human society. Even in times of supposed black death – the activists may even percieve they are risking lives by protesting such it the mind melting situation.

98246 ▶▶ kf99, replying to Basics, #1029 of 1374 🔗

Makes you wonder if these groups could be “outlawed” under all the various legislation we’ve had over the last 20 years. Who would enforce that is another matter since the Scottish Police is a nationalised industry.

98051 Basics, replying to Basics, 1, #1030 of 1374 🔗

2nd wave preparations to be 3x as big as first and its going to be in winter – amazing Scottish Government forecasting. They truly are as one with the virus.

“Scots health boards asked to prep for a huge coronavirus winter wave three times worse than first
A report from NHS Borders has revealed the Scottish Government has warned health boards to prepare for three ‘worst case’ scenarios, including a gigantic winter second wave three times the size of the first outbreak.”


98066 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 6, #1031 of 1374 🔗

Bill Gates: “The next one….will get attention”. Take heed comrades.

98069 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 4, #1032 of 1374 🔗

I saw that interview,he smirked as he spoke those words.Truly evil

98074 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 6, #1033 of 1374 🔗

Melinda Gates had a telling little giggle simultaneously as well. Both come across as completely abnormal and barely human. Bill looks like an old woman actually. Maybe he is, and Mel is his chick with a dick.

98076 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 4, #1034 of 1374 🔗

Wouldn’t put it past him.Smirking at the thought of people dying and of all the money he can make off it.
Why is there no questioning of his role in all this in the MSM.You don’t have to be a tin foil hat wearer to join all the dots.The man has so many links to all the key players in this.Boris even mentioned him in one of the press conferences.

98102 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 6, #1035 of 1374 🔗

I said here earlier that I’d rather wear a tin foil hat than a mask. Bill Gates is an evil psychopath who somehow predicted this pandemic last October. I’m starting to not believe in coincidences.

98057 David, 1, #1036 of 1374 🔗

When you don’t know the difference between “ever” and “never” it doesn’t give me much confidence in these rather unsupported claims of over counting when undercounting, because we lacked tests, was the reality.

98058 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 13, #1037 of 1374 🔗

I think we are now in the war-weariness stage. Everyone is fed up to the back teeth with the whole thing.

In a long war the enemy is still there. Let us hope in this case people may begin to realise the enemy is simply not there!

I noticed on tonight’s ITV News they were having to adopt more awkward positions than you get in Twister – so determined were they to somehow connect young people cavorting in summer to an Autumn spike in deaths.

The reporter obviously knew she couldn’t possibly connect normal summer behaviour of young people to current deaths – as there are hardly any at all, so that would make her look ridiculous. Instead by way of a completely unjustified reference to what was happening in Spain
she somehow made a link between young people’s behaviour now and a forthcoming death spike in Autumn.

Thus is utter nonsense. Young people haven’t been observing strict social distancing since at least late May. If this was going to cause a death spike it would have happened by now. N Basically the virus is everywhere. When we get to late atumun we will see a spike in deaths as it picks off those elderly and vulnerable people who escaped the cull earlier this year.

98062 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to OKUK, 20, #1038 of 1374 🔗

We are only just getting started! Many major battles lie ahead, especially in the critical Dark Winter of 20/21 coming up. The next 6 months could decide the trajectory of human history for 100+ years. We owe it to our ancestors who fought for years on end in utterly miserable conditions far worse than anything we have yet faced to keep our chins up.

98130 ▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Richard O, 4, #1039 of 1374 🔗

Agree. We must stand firm and united against this tyranny and our loss of freedoms, however long and however difficult. My OH and I are watching the Churchill film Darkest Hour a lot at the moment. Some of his family were in Russian camps in the war and survived more than a b****y nasty flu virus

98314 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to OKUK, 2, #1040 of 1374 🔗

The enemy is still there what people need to begin to realise is that the virus never was the enemy.

98060 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 2, #1041 of 1374 🔗

Does anyone know what happened to the comments section at Spiked?

98070 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to richard riewer, 6, #1042 of 1374 🔗

I heard an interview with Brendan O’Neill on Talk Radio this week where he mentioned he was following the mask mandates in shops and on public transport with seemingly little fuss. He sounded completely different from his much more belligerent stance in March/April. I wonder if Spiked has been compromised.

98072 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 2, #1043 of 1374 🔗

I read that he was a communist in his youth.,in the same group as Claire Fox who has just been ennobled.

98078 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #1044 of 1374 🔗

Peter Hitchens was a communist in his youth. He turned out alright.

I much preferred his brother when they were both alive. It seems to me that Peter has embraced something of Christopher’s aggressively contrarian charisma since the latter’s death.

98096 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, 2, #1045 of 1374 🔗

I loved Christopher Hitchens too. I didn’t even know of Peter until I found this site, Spiked, etc. He’s been amazing thorough all of this. Where’s the Canadian Peter Hitchens??? I despair.

98381 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Richard O, #1046 of 1374 🔗

I always disliked Christopher Hitchens strongly, because he almost always seemed to be pushing us further in the directions we were already going wrong in, and felt thoroughly vindicated when, on arguably the most consequential single issue of his life – the catastrophic and inexcusable invasion of Iraq – he went enthusiastically over to the dark side, and played a significant part in winning doubters over to the side of the neocons.

That said, very few people are all bad or always wrong. Credit where it is due, he was courageous and right on waterboarding.

98450 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, #1047 of 1374 🔗

Maybe they have something on him because he was very skeptical at the start.Any sane person cannot agree with the mask mandate.
On Peter Hitchens,he is very open about his past and I’ll take him over his brother.He turned into a neo-con and supported the Iraq war.Peter shows immense courage in swimming against the tide on a number of issues and he called the Tories out under Cameron.We can’t say we were n’t warned.

98305 ▶▶▶ peter, replying to Richard O, 2, #1048 of 1374 🔗

Brendan was trolling those people making videos on Anna Brees youtube channel, being quite snide. So people went to his instagram and let the turd have it. He soon made his account private.

98118 ▶▶ James Lawrence, replying to richard riewer, #1049 of 1374 🔗

Just looking at their main page, no talk of Covid even existing. Gone off their radar, and that after a whole March batch of podcasts and articles totally against L/D. All very strange…

98127 ▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to James Lawrence, #1050 of 1374 🔗

I agree. I receive Spiked updates via email and have noticed a dearth of anti LD and Covid articles. A lot on woke culture and BAME. Also emails asking for more funding.

98140 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to richard riewer, 2, #1051 of 1374 🔗

Someone posted here a few days’ ago where they got in touch with Spiked and s/he was told that because of the excessive trolling, they had to shut down the comments section.

98171 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to richard riewer, #1052 of 1374 🔗

They were getting a lot of trolls and it was taking up too much time to monitor the comments. It’s getting a real problem which the government seems to be OK with.

98306 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #1053 of 1374 🔗

Beyond not paying people to troll themselves eg the 77th brigade I think the last thing we need is government trying to solve the problem of online trolls.

98383 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Saved To Death, #1054 of 1374 🔗

Talk about putting the fox in charge of the henhouse!

98194 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to richard riewer, 1, #1055 of 1374 🔗

There is a cyclical process through which these media upstarts sometimes progress, though I don’t know if it explains Spiked.

They start as a platform for political comment, with a niche of reflecting common-sense positions not otherwise represented. They may also have political contacts that give them a few scoops. But as time passes, all the general comments that can be made have been, and in the usual churn of political organisations personal contacts move on. At this point, the platform needs information, scoops, to drive clicks, and can get it only in exchange for cooperation with the political organisations themselves. Once hooked and thoroughly dependent (hello, Guido), they just become compliant mouthpieces for a party, and readers who despise the party move on. As the readership falls, and the platform loses value as a means for reaching the unpersuaded, the political organisation gives lower value information. The higher value, exciting stuff is shared with rivals that are at an earlier point in the cycle. Soon, the old upstart is identified as a boring and predictable read, and atrophies into obscurity.

98197 ▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Ovis, #1056 of 1374 🔗

Edit: this should have been a reply to Richard O

98068 Dominic12, replying to Dominic12, 20, #1057 of 1374 🔗

My second post is the reason I registered as it seems a small portend of the immediate future we face.

I have to go to the local medical practice for an INR test performed by a Nurse. That is not something to be done over the phone and if not checked could result in a blood clot and death. I have a pretty good idea when my blood is too thick or too thin so until the prescriptons aren’t available I’m not worried about that aspect. Plus I’ve got a fair stash in anticipation and have no wish to survive the apocalypse anyhow.

I’ve had tests before during this process but for the first time they took an ear temperature. I was told it was a bit high and it was retaken. Then I was required to stand outside for about 30 minutes and despite having no idea what panic was going on inside the young guys who came out a couple of times seemed rather on edge . A close eye was kept in case of any Ambulance or Police attendance, in which case I’d’ve made a run for it, but none came and I was told to come inside and directed to an isolation room. Feeling fairly apprehensive I did so and sat for a couple of minutes before the expected nurse came in with nothing extra than disposable mask,apron and gloves. She was friendly and performed the test which requires close contact and was fine. She retook my temperature which was fine in one ear and high in the other. Shortly after a Doctor (yes, a real Doctor!) came to see me. He was also friendly and asked the regular Covid questions wearing his disposal mask and apron only as additions.. Prior to attending I was a little under the weather but, rightly or wrongly, kept quiet about that; not wanting to give them any excuse. I had a minor unknown stomach ‘thing’ which in the old world and this one did not prevent me from going to work but presumably had led to an increased temperature which I was barely aware of and, unless checked, would never have been considered.

The Doctor advised that it was “incredibly” unlikely I had Covid-19 but that just in case I should go straight home and isolate until a test was done via 119 which should be sorted in a couple of days. I acknowledged what he was saying and perhaps nodded but was never required to confirm I would have the test or was it suggested there would be any follow up. I didn’t wish to argue the matter as I was on their territory and thankfully they let me leave. I’ve read enough to know never to have a Covid test and I certainly wasn’t going let them get a false positive or other pro-Covid result out of me. But tens of millions aren’t in my position and would, I guess, be bricking themselves to have been found to have one of the key symptoms of Covid-19.

With autumn approaching and resulting in a great many raised temperatures; and with the impending physical damage of mask wearing becoming realised & in some cases mimicing Covid symptoms we have some very dark times ahead of us very shortly even if the economic dark times can be delayed with more of the magic money.

98082 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Dominic12, 14, #1058 of 1374 🔗

The test has been weaponised. There should be no need to insert a swab that deep into the nasal cavity to collect a viable viral sample. Nobody is shoving that shit deep into my head, ever.

More tests = more cases = more local lockdowns. It’s that simple.

98095 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, 5, #1059 of 1374 🔗

My daughter just returned to eastern Canada and not only must quarantine for 2 weeks, but is being subjected to 3 Covid tests within the 2 week period starting tomorrow. I nearly had a bird when I found out yesterday and another freak out when she got there and told me the testing centre is a 30 minute ride away. She doesn’t drive and there’s no way I’m pay for it. Never fear, the government is picking up the tab for anything relating to unnecessary testing. Will she get out of quarantine early? Nope. And somehow they think it’s OK for her to break quarantine three times to get the test. Had she left one day earlier she wouldn’t be subjected to this insanity (still would have had to quarantine) but they change the rules every day and it was not the case when we booked the ticket. Every day a new humiliation.

98106 ▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to Richard O, 4, #1060 of 1374 🔗

The Premier of Victoria wants more people to get tested. He’s disappointed that they’re not finding more cases.

98081 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 5, #1061 of 1374 🔗

The first photo on the left shows the back of my head and the back of my middle brother’s head, examining two Ginger Baker drumsticks that got lost in space. The youngest brother was further to the right and out of the photo, although it was he that picked up Ginger Baker’s flying drumsticks when they fell at his feet in front of the stage. He still has them somewhere in his Paris apartment.

98105 ▶▶ Caramel, replying to richard riewer, 1, #1062 of 1374 🔗

Wow, what a cool experience!

98084 Caramel, replying to Caramel, 7, #1063 of 1374 🔗

God, things in the UK are much better because living in Victoria, Australia is dreadful now.

98088 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Caramel, 10, #1064 of 1374 🔗

To think that New Zealand is now the global epicentre of the medical martial law model that is planned for all of us is insane. From what I have seen Victoria is worse, but that’s only one state in Australia. South Africa looks really bad as well.

Shame on all of us in the Anglosphere for capitulating to this. Basically if at any time in your history you were part of the British Empire, you are fucked.

98093 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, 5, #1065 of 1374 🔗

As a Canadian, I couldn’t agree with you more! At least we’re not as bad as Australia and New Zealand…yet. The words, “It could never happen here,” are no longer in my vocabulary.

98109 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 3, #1066 of 1374 🔗

It has happened here, for all of us. Maybe we deserved it. Too many lazy assumptions. Too much taking things for granted.

This is our lesson and our conflict. We brought this upon ourselves, and the only remedy is us. Let’s own it.

98461 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, #1067 of 1374 🔗

When you say ‘It has happened here.” Richard, you’re right. Crazy legislation (by diktat) by bad people has happened.

Whether we, and the population as a whole, go along with it, is the nub.

98097 ▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to Richard O, 11, #1068 of 1374 🔗

Victoria is worse but the borders between states have closed as well. I’m in two minds about England, loved the country but I’m furious about what Neil Ferguson, Boris, and Dominic Cummings have done to the world. Aus copied the UK but didn’t even have the excuse of having a high death toll.

98108 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Caramel, 14, #1069 of 1374 🔗

Did they change the law about death certification in Australia? It has been done in the UK. Since our Enabling Act in March, Covid-19 deaths can now be officially registered based solely on the opinion of a single doctor with no direct interaction with the patient, no tests and no post mortem.

The UK death figure of 50-60,000 you keep seeing in the media is a crock of shit. Nearly all of these were regular deaths reclassified as Covid-19 for political purposes.

98110 ▶▶▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to Richard O, 8, #1070 of 1374 🔗

Prof. Carl Heneghan explained the UK overcounting well. In Aus, they count anybody who tested positive and presumed to have died from it. The deaths are mostly from care homes and a few cancer patients.

The UK’s higher death toll is also because of Boris’ blindingly idiotic choice of sending convalescing hospital patients into care homes.

98182 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Richard O, 1, #1071 of 1374 🔗

Not so. CV19 is a notifiable disease. It has to be noted on the death cert if present, along with all the other causes of death, which in the overwhelmingly elderly and frail cohort who died, may be many, the average number of causes cited is 2.6. It is important and useful for public health surveillance to know that any particular cause is becoming prevalent, or in the case of CV19, ubiquitous. This is NOT “reclassifying deaths as CV19 for political purposes”. If you are familiar with very old people you should know that respiratory illness is one of the most common causes of finally carrying them off, the common cold can do it.
In the UK there is no financial incentive for hospital admissions, deaths etc to be certified as having CV19, unlike in the USA, where many of these stories emanate from.

98187 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cbird, replying to Bruno, 3, #1072 of 1374 🔗

My understanding is the same as Richard’s, i.e. that they rescinded the Shipman regulations via the Act and that UK death certification no longer has those very important safeguards

98239 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Cbird, #1073 of 1374 🔗

You may find this helpful, from a GP of 31 years experience, on the situation on the ground re death certs: https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/coronavirus-nhs-doctors-death-certificates-conspiracy-theories-a9513981.html

98237 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Bruno, #1074 of 1374 🔗

No financial incentive, but the revision of the death registration framework that has rendered any attribution useless as data. There is no ‘public health surveillance’ possible from this heap of speculative garbage.

98240 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to RickH, 1, #1075 of 1374 🔗

Well I find it useful, nay encouraging, to know that CV19 is ubiquitous. Roll on herd immunity.

98114 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Caramel, 14, #1076 of 1374 🔗

Nowhere has had a ‘high’ death toll.
Everywhere has had a high tyranny and hysteria toll.

98119 ▶▶▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to annie, 5, #1077 of 1374 🔗

It was higher in the UK but that was more because of the f’ing absurd policy of putting hospital patients into care homes. And care homes were poorly managed just about everywhere. Or at least, it highlighted how shit they were to begin with.

98464 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Caramel, 1, #1078 of 1374 🔗

We ain’t had no plod smashing car windows yet. That’s all yours.

98099 Lisa from Toronto, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 6, #1079 of 1374 🔗

Oh heavens, first report of an under-20 dying of Covid in Canada today. Apparently he had no underlying health conditions. Obviously a tragedy and horrific for his family, but I can see his death being weaponized already with dire warnings to young people. I feel another lockdown coming this fall/winter…

98113 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 10, #1080 of 1374 🔗

So one young, healthy person died from a disease that has not yet been proven to be caused by the virus, and which the test cannot identify.

This clearly justifies permanent mandatory masks, social distancing and lockdown. The reasoning is clear and unimpeachable. Who needs to go outside or come within 6 feet of another person for any reason anyway? All unnecessary risks.

The sole purpose of being alive is not to die.

98121 ▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 7, #1081 of 1374 🔗

The family came over from Congo Kinshasa 2015 so would not have had the same immunities as a youngster who had lived in Canada all his life.

He was athletic:

the Réseau du sport étudiant du Québec from last year states Kabangu Nsapu won the distinction of “male high school student-athlete who demonstrated academic and athletic perseverance.”


‘…. there are cohorts of athletes and para-athletes with heightened susceptibility to viral respiratory tract infection and cohorts with known chronic medical conditions, such as airways disease (seen in approximately 20% of all endurance athletes).’

‘Very high intensity training workloads, with or without sudden increases in training load, have been associated with transient immune perturbations, inflammation, oxidative stress, and muscle damage. A potential increased risk of illness in periods of high-intensity training is a concern, but mainly in non-competitive recreational athletes.’

‘…there is long-standing concern of the potential risk of athletes with respiratory tract infection developing other complications from return to vigorous exercise. Of these risks, the most important is the risk of myocarditis or myocardial damage


Note: those threats from viruses to the health of athletes are by no means specific to the SARS CoV 2 coronavirus

98123 ▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Tim Bidie, 2, #1082 of 1374 🔗

Surely all those risks could classify as co-morbidities then?

98148 ▶▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Nicky, #1083 of 1374 🔗

Only the hospital could answer that definitively.

In another 10-year observational study of 162 subjects under 40 years of age who experienced SCD (sudden cardiac death), myocarditis was discovered on autopsy in 22% of cases. 15 Of the total number of SCD, 23% were associated with exercise. 15 Despite these studies being small and observational, it appears that myocarditis serves as a risk factor for SCD, especially in younger subjects. Exercise also seems to be associated with an increased incidence of SCD in patients with myocarditis. Clearly this is of particular concern to athletes where exercise and competitive sport is a major component of their lifestyle.’


Many viruses are commonly associated with myocarditis, including the viruses that cause the common cold (adenovirus); COVID-19; hepatitis B and C; parvovirus….’

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/myocarditis/symptoms-causes/syc-20352539#:~:text=Potential%20causes%20include%3A ,)%3B%20and%20herpes%20simplex%20virus.

98152 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Tim Bidie, 1, #1084 of 1374 🔗

So where do we find the ‘actual’ cause of death outcomes from autopsy reports following sudden or unexpected deaths? We already suspect the true cause of death from so-called Covid related deaths among older people is not being fully acknowledged. Any readers out there from forensic science settings who are able to comment on mortuary findings?

98170 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Nicky, #1085 of 1374 🔗

John Radcliffe hospital, Oxford, report of 62 coronial autopsies during lockdown. Note the Appendix graph for the comparison with causes of death, 2018 ,same period.

98250 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Bruno, 1, #1086 of 1374 🔗

This is horrific, Sylvie.
Out of 67 autopsies only 2 had undiagnosed Covid-19. Some had suffered heart attacks or complications from diabetes. Their families had contacted the hospitals but had been told not to bring them in but to self isolate instead. Three out of ten suicides were put down to Covid restrictions.
The authors are clearly blaming the shut down for a lot of these deaths.

98408 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Bruno, #1087 of 1374 🔗

Thanks Sylvie, just seen your reply. Will have a read. From Margaret’s response below this does sound horrific and should be reported more widely.

98163 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Tim Bidie, 3, #1088 of 1374 🔗

So he was Congolese ergo lack of Vitamin D in dark skinned people makes them prone to the virus.

98153 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 7, #1089 of 1374 🔗

Sounds a lot like the a Chloe Middleton death over here. Turned out to be for a heart attack, never tested positive for COVID-19, but get what death is registered as? Yes, you’ve got it, COVID-19!

98160 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 5, #1090 of 1374 🔗

So no underlying health problem until its revealed he did in fact have one that no one knew about.

98184 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #1091 of 1374 🔗

Needs to be rebutted instantly with the number of young people who died of flu, meningitis, measles and other nasty infectious diseases.

98116 Caramel, replying to Caramel, 2, #1093 of 1374 🔗

There’s an excellent livestream with Dr. Simon Thornley, Prof. Gigi Foster and Liberal MP in Victoria. https://www.facebook.com/davidlimbrickldp/videos/317119122907262/?__tn__=HH-R

98120 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Caramel, 1, #1094 of 1374 🔗

Thanks! caught the last 15 minutes. Well worth listening to.

98117 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 5, #1095 of 1374 🔗

There is a condition known as ‘generalised anxiety disorder’.

‘The disorder is especially common and impairing in high-income countries…’

Worst affected first world countries?

‘Australia and New Zealand, both identified as high-income countries, had the highest lifetime prevalence rates — 8 percent and 7.9 percent, respectively.’

Lowest rates?

‘Nigeria (0.1 percent) and Shenzhen, China (0.2 percent), had the lowest rates reported’


98158 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to Tim Bidie, #1096 of 1374 🔗


Remember this from a few weeks ago?

98193 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Margaret, #1098 of 1374 🔗

Sorry 404 error on that link.

98199 ▶▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to ConstantBees, #1099 of 1374 🔗

I edited it and it should be working now CB. It is on my computer anyway. Apologies.

98682 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Margaret, #1100 of 1374 🔗

Yes, it works!

98207 ▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Margaret, 5, #1101 of 1374 🔗

Some local coronavirus outbreaks could be ‘mass hysteria’, Joint Biosecurity Centre warns

Sounds like the replacement for SAGE has got to the route of our covid problem – Bout fcukin time!!

98336 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Major Panic, 2, #1102 of 1374 🔗

Everything to do with Covid is mass hysteria… lol

98452 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Nick Rose, #1103 of 1374 🔗

And a joint would probably help …

98232 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Tim Bidie, 2, #1104 of 1374 🔗

Sounds like Tom Lehrer’s ‘diseases of the rich’.

98125 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 24, #1105 of 1374 🔗

We are going away for a few days to look after the grandchildren, at least we are still allowed to do that at the moment, but for how much longer? Doubtless my views on the Covid hoo-haa will come under some scrutiny from others and so I would be grateful if you could view my analysis of the current situation and let me know if you think there are any errors or omissions;

  • There is a coronavirus caled Sars-Cov-2, it can cause a disease known as Covid 19
  • The virus is a bit of a drama queen, it burst on to the world with a huge dramatic flourish and in its initial stages certainly had a big impact and in some cases a horrifying effect. Its major effect is on older people and people with other health conditions but in few cases it has caused horrifying symptoms in fit and well young people, although small in number, these cases have given the virus 5 star billing as a horror movie.
  • It is particular effective at being a nosocomial infection and thus caused havoc in Hospitals and care homes and also in other institutions like prisons where people live in close proximity. The powers that be have learnt their lesson on this aspect and are operating policies to counter its nosocomial effects.
  • Initially the aim of the Governments lock down efforts were to Flatten the curve, protect the NHS and save lives. Well the curve is now flat as a pancake, hospital are under utilised and the ONS figures show that registered deaths have been below average for the last 8 weeks. To simple minds like mine and indeed if this had been conventional flu we would by now have declared job done, packed up the circus and got on with normal life.
  • So why is this sorry circus continuing? …. Testing … someone invented testing and because most people are baffled by science and in awe of the ‘experts’ we are all now running about terrified of test results, even though ‘Test Results’ is not an accepted cause of deaths on a death certificate.
  • It is Covid 19 that is the accepted cause of death, to have Covid 19 you have to have been infected with SARS-Cov-2 virus and that virus has to have given rise to Covid 19 disease. So that whilst tests are finding SARS-Cov-2 virus there is little indication that the virus is currently giving a significant rise in Covid 19 disease.
  • Whilst the powers that be are very keen on testing it is not actually mandatory and anyone can refuse to be tested unless it is a condition of their employment or if you need hospital treatment. If everyone refused to take a test the authorities would have an increasingly threadbare case to continue this sorry circus.
  • It could be argued that the whilst SARS-Cov-2 virus seems to be causing little Covid 19 disease, the more it is spread about in the summer the better we will be protected from a winter time resurgence and that therefore these current local lock-downs might actually be damaging to health?
  • In the midst of this the Government threw in the ‘red herring’ of face masks, whatever your view on their effectiveness? it was clearly far too late in the day for such a measure and is simply an actual and metaphorical face saving measure for a hapless Government.
  • Whilst the Government originally had the 3 point objectives for this hoo-haa, these have all now been achieved and it is not clear where this sorry circus is going or what it is trying to achieve? The disease is now endemic and cannot be eradicated, but seems to be causing very little Covid 19 disease and so what are we trying to do, what is the objective? Or are we just shambling along until the magic vaccine pops up and the Government can declare a great victory and that they have now saved the country.

Sorry this is a bit long but I foresee some long conversations where I am the lone sceptic voice. thankyou.

98128 ▶▶ Mark II, replying to Steve Martindale, 9, #1106 of 1374 🔗

Sounds about right, except it didn’t really get much traction in prisons at all – probably because the age profile of population of prisons didn’t suit it.

98143 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Mark II, 1, #1107 of 1374 🔗

Thank you, I have duly noted your point about prisons, thanks

98149 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #1108 of 1374 🔗

Reads very level headed to me. I particularly like the last two sentences in your final ‘bullet point’ (dread term). Enjoy your days away – and I hope you’re going somewhere near Martindale.

98151 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #1109 of 1374 🔗

Thank,you, just grandparent duties in London as our son has injured himself, hopefully sometime soon we’ll get to take the grandchildren to Martindale.thanks

98161 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #1110 of 1374 🔗

You cover a lot of points Steve but since you mention prisons, they had some problems at first but they were quickly stamped out because Prison Governors are some of the few people able to do as they see fit in an emergency (perhaps facing the consequences later).

So no visitors, no Association, just staff and suppliers to worry about. A Lockdown prison being a perfect isolation unit.

Association and Dining resumed once each prison was clear.
Visits resumed three weeks ago , tables spread out a bit more, no plastic screens.
One couple chanced a kiss; she’s banned from the prison, he’s in 14 day quarantine with his unhappy cell-mate.

All of this on the Authority of The Guv’nor.

98179 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #1111 of 1374 🔗

The only thing I take issue with is “on older people and people with other health conditions”. This phrasing is used (I think deliberately) to imply that there is a risk rising simply with age i.e. you are more at risk at 70 than at 60 all else being equal, and “other conditions” might include general health problems like arthritis, diabetes, hip problems.

I think the data show this is highly misleading. 25% of all Covid deaths from March to June has dementia or alzheimer’s as a related cause. Coincidentally, around 25-30% of all people aged 85+ die of dementia and alzheimer’s normally. It is not “other causes”. It is the usual causes of death for the very elderly and the terminally ill.

98222 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to WhyNow, 2, #1112 of 1374 🔗

There is a notable gradient of mortality with age. But it is also associated with the presence of other conditions.

The problem is to work out how much more age is a factor with this particular virus, since age makes you more vulnerable to disease in general. Then there is the problem that we will never know the precise contribution of Covid to mortality – because the data was totally screwed from the start.

A final essential fact – not much reported at all – is that 2020 had a much highr vulnerable population, because the previous low infection year had spared a proportion of the population who would probably have died even in an average year for infection.

98293 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to RickH, #1113 of 1374 🔗

Indeed, older people die more , who knew ?

98345 ▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to RickH, 2, #1114 of 1374 🔗

Regarding age, I said “all else being equal”. You can be a healthy 80 year old, or an 80 year old with advanced dementia. It is not the 80 that puts you at risk, except in the sense of being more likely to have the dementia.

98262 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to WhyNow, 1, #1115 of 1374 🔗

You do NOT “die of dementia and Alzheimer’s”. On their own they will not kill you!
You die “WITH” dementia. Most often, people ‘with ‘dementia die ‘of’ pneumonia, or some other respiratory infection – such as CV19, when ‘there’s a lot of it about’.

98350 ▶▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Bruno, #1116 of 1374 🔗

I simply report that they are listed as the primary cause of death by the ONS. Flu and pneumonia are recorded separately. When you say that “Most often, people with dementia die of pneumonia etc” this contradicts the statistics recorded by the ONS.

98271 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Steve Martindale, #1117 of 1374 🔗

One “criticism”, “even though ‘Test Results’ is not an accepted cause of deaths on a death certificate”. A positive test result on a death certificate does mean the person died of it…Even if they died of a heart attack or something else.

98279 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #1118 of 1374 🔗

So why is this sorry circus continuing? …. Testing

I have also seen the argument: the internet. The internet made it possible for an economy of sorts to continue while in lockdown. Without that, they could never have imposed the lockdown. Once accepted and imposed, there is no logical way to exit a lockdown short of an effective vaccine.

98137 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 11, #1119 of 1374 🔗

The Daily Telegraph – WTAF?

Who runs this newspaper now?

Today’s headline story is fear, scare and inaccurate.

At the same time they print sceptical stories including those from Toby.

So is the DT a mouthpiece for the the government to scare people or is it’s editorial principle to just print whatever it’s contributors send in rather than stick to any editorial direction?

The Mail at last seems pretty much in the most sceptical camp.

98145 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to hotrod, 2, #1120 of 1374 🔗

I no longer buy the Telegraph but some of the opinion pieces and commentaries that come on my Google feed are verging on the sceptical and are generally critical of the government.
Perhaps it toes the line on the front page to keep the Covid ad revenue flowing?

98157 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to hotrod, 5, #1121 of 1374 🔗

Its a real shame the DT is becoming more like an upmarket Daily Express. We’re seriously considering cancelling the subscription. Columnists Pearson and Jacobs are worth reading but it can no longer be considered a serious news media.

98159 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Bella Donna, 3, #1122 of 1374 🔗

But has this got worse in the last six months?

Has something changed to alter the DT narrative?

98291 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to hotrod, #1123 of 1374 🔗

Covid advertising revenue, they farmed out sub-edititing to South Africa years ago hence
“The alleged assailant is in custody, he is said to be in a stale condition”. (not my typo).

98339 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to hotrod, #1124 of 1374 🔗

I’ve heard MSM have agreed to support the governments decisions for 3 months but don’t know if it is true. If it is true that means our news is no longer independent, its government owned.

98437 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Bella Donna, #1125 of 1374 🔗

The government have been the biggest spender on advertising,in the press for the last 5 months.

98206 ▶▶ Fiat, replying to hotrod, 2, #1126 of 1374 🔗

The other day the DT ran a story about Covid in India. Scary picture of a body in a shroud being carried by three fully hazard-suited people. The article was headed, “Relentless”. The number of dead was quoted as more than 50,000. A tragedy, of course, but no context whatsoever. India has a population well in excess of 1 billion so a conservative estimate puts the number of victims at 0.0036%. Furthermore, on average, over 10 million people die in India every year…..

98297 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Fiat, #1127 of 1374 🔗

Wong thread

98213 ▶▶ RickH, replying to hotrod, 5, #1128 of 1374 🔗

Face it : There is now no MSM source that can be trusted in terms of proper investigative journalism.

98268 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to RickH, 3, #1129 of 1374 🔗

Yes NO MSM media outlet can be trusted. They are all lying bastards.

98371 ▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to hotrod, 1, #1130 of 1374 🔗

1145 people work at the DT. Do you expect them all to have the same opinion? Personally I wouldn’t want to work anywhere where the editor presided over everyone and tells them what they have to think and write or else.
What we need is more debate not less. Otherwise we are just adding to the Cancel Culture.

98142 Youth_Unheard, replying to Youth_Unheard, 11, #1131 of 1374 🔗

So it has been over 6 months, and I am yet to see a single confirmed case of someone catching COVID-19 twice. Surely this would be across all the main news channels, breaking news, we must never ever leave homes again because you will never be immune until a vaccine. Has anyone seen one? There have been multiple rumoured come out from time to time, and it is always thrown in to the commentary occasionally that “oh maybe you’re not even immune for that long” but as far as I know, it seems you are immune!

98154 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Youth_Unheard, 6, #1132 of 1374 🔗

Currently In the UK and Western Europe there now seems to be few cases of Covid 19 for the first time let alone the second time Testing is finding much SARS-Cov-2 virus but it does not seem that these findings are resulting in many cases of Covid19 disease? Sars-Cov-2 now seems to be endemic, like chicken pox but the figures on deaths and hospital cases indicate that it is not having the drama merchant/horror movie effect of its original dramatic burst on to the scene. In pop music terms it is starting to look a bit like a ‘one hit wonder’,we live in hope.

98185 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #1133 of 1374 🔗

As I’ve been I’ve been on the west coast of Ireland looking out on the Atlantic for the past six months my attention has been much fixed on Covid statistics in the Republic.

Hospital admission figures have to be extrapolated. These are the weekly figures I’ve extrapolated since the last week of June – I can’t vouch that they are 100 accurate.

13, 12, 3, 2, 9, 12, 19, 13.


18, 11, 9, 7, 11, 1, 5, 3.

I’ve no idea if the Irish authorities are applying a four week rule regarding Covid death. There were 25,473 people in Ireland who were classified as Covid cases by the end of June 99.9% of whom must still have been alive at the end of July. A handful of these classified cases from between March and June could be reaching the end of their life each week and not from Covid. I wonder if they are being counted as such?

98299 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Youth_Unheard, 1, #1134 of 1374 🔗

Be a funny old virus if most survivors didn’t get lasting immunity.

98329 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Youth_Unheard, 1, #1135 of 1374 🔗

I don’t know of anyone catching it once in my circle.

98144 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 17, #1136 of 1374 🔗


I was hoping that the tide of public opinion was slowly starting to turn but the state of some of the comments on this article. It’s like taking a time machine back to April – moderately sceptical comments getting overwhelmingly downvoted, people moaning that ‘selfish’ young people aren’t complying and lockdown should be more rigorously enforced, the usual sanctimonious rubbish about people ‘sacrificing’ holidays (read: soon to be their livelihoods and entire way of life) this year in order to ‘save’ the elderly. I used to think that BBC comments were a good litmus test of the nation but the BBC is now a parody of its former self and these comments do not match with conversations I have with various people in the real world.

98150 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Poppy, 4, #1137 of 1374 🔗

There are plenty of alarmist studies still being pushed


Some of the assumptions in this are wild. Still with the “Everyone can get it at any time” type of approach. Any interaction leads to infection.

98162 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 6, #1138 of 1374 🔗

It really is a “let’s hide behind our sofas forever” article. Just incredible that three University lecturers can think this.

98168 ▶▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to arfurmo, 5, #1139 of 1374 🔗

I agree, incredible. There must be a political motive and now is the time for other Tory MPs and ensure the government stop pandering to this rubbish.

98389 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to arfurmo, #1140 of 1374 🔗

They can think any way they are paid to think.

98166 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 4, #1141 of 1374 🔗

It’s almost like the narrative is to destroy the nations future, opportunity for fun, social interaction, hope and mental well being.

Written by people who have had these opportunities but have sold out to something hither too unknown.

OR the plan is just to destroy the government by ensuring the fear is maintained and knowing that Boris is too stupid to realise and maintain his populism plan by pleasing the thick electorate.

Does he dare risk a different route….

98319 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to hotrod, 1, #1142 of 1374 🔗

I wish Boris was made of sterner stuff but he’s fake.

98321 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bella Donna, #1143 of 1374 🔗

Worse than fake. Useless.

98356 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Bella Donna, 3, #1144 of 1374 🔗

he’s a spineless, arrogant, cowardly cretin who has exhibited no moral judgement or leadership! Not up to the job in any sense.
I wonder whether when Brexit is done, the economy in tatters, unemployment rife, social unrest whether there will be a move to topple him from his perch…

98391 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sue, #1145 of 1374 🔗

It will be a bit late then!

98442 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bella Donna, #1146 of 1374 🔗

He’s not our mate. He’s Johnson .

98395 ▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to hotrod, 1, #1147 of 1374 🔗

There are so many pointers to the fact that this a fraud being manipulated from the corrupt WHO. (Remember who funds the WHO.)

98266 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 8, #1148 of 1374 🔗

I was talking to a guy in the pub the other night. He really is a proper idiot. Certified. So after I do the whole it’s not ver dangerous thing, that you need to rub shoulders with about 12-13000 people in order to meet ONE person who MIGHT hve IT and even then catching IT of them is incredible unlikely…he said well there is still that ONE chance…..


98322 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Two-Six, #1149 of 1374 🔗

As you say he’s a proper idiot. I think they have been putting something in the water supply, as a nation we never were this stupid, were we?

98357 ▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to Two-Six, 1, #1150 of 1374 🔗

and if there was that ONE chance it’s 80% likelyhood they wouldn’t even know they had the virus – maybe feel a little unwell!!

98393 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Two-Six, #1151 of 1374 🔗

Does he wear a hard hat in case of falling tortoises?

98317 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 2, #1152 of 1374 🔗

Remember when it was claimed Brexit would cause an outbreak of super gonorrhea? Its a similar tactic.

We must never forget they are our enemy.

98165 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Poppy, 5, #1153 of 1374 🔗

Thanks for the heads-up. I’d forgotten that I had an account on the BBC news site. If people go in and counter some of the misinformation being spread by coronaphobics, it may be possible to turn the tide there. The Daily Mail comment section is now dominated by anti-lockdown folks, so having another site to focus on is great. Thanks again!

98183 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to ConstantBees, 1, #1154 of 1374 🔗

Oh, but their commenting system is horrible. Still, we must persevere.

98323 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to ConstantBees, 1, #1155 of 1374 🔗

It’s heartening to see the majority of comments in the DT are now anti mask and lockdown.

98210 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Poppy, 4, #1156 of 1374 🔗

It’s the BBC. The comments are what may be called a ‘lagging indicator’.

I don’t spend much time looking at such comments. But when I do I’m struck at how there isn’t an iota of original, informed or independent thought among them, or anything hat isn’t derived from the herd. For anyone looking forwards they are no matter. Those people will turn when they’re told to.

98326 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to TJN, 1, #1157 of 1374 🔗

I think it’s called ‘hive mentality’ I don’t know if there is a cure.

98358 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to TJN, 2, #1158 of 1374 🔗

the only good thing is that maybe these will be first in the queue for this vaccine!! Let them be the guinea pigs!

98282 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Poppy, 3, #1159 of 1374 🔗

Getting downvoted by idiots who still think the BBC is a good place to get news.

98310 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to karenovirus, 4, #1160 of 1374 🔗

There is an army of internet trolls praising the government and abusing anti vaxxers and anti mask wearers. Its similar to the Brexit referendum war. I think we are all aware of how poisonous the BBC are.

98320 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Poppy, 3, #1161 of 1374 🔗

Don’t forget that with the BBC, we don’t know how many are genuine comments, or how many come from the various “nudge” units.

98680 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Nick Rose, #1162 of 1374 🔗

I’ve wondered the same thing about the Daily Mail.

98348 ▶▶ Sue, replying to Poppy, #1163 of 1374 🔗

Lesson #1 … never, never, never, never read the BBC website if you value your sanity!!!

98388 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Poppy, 1, #1164 of 1374 🔗

I suspect that most of the sentient amongst the population have given up the BBC in its entirety.

98147 Fed up, replying to Fed up, 22, #1165 of 1374 🔗

My observation from 2 trips to 2 major university cities. People want the old normal. The pubs and restaurants are doing good business. All attractions fully booked up. I did not wear a mask once and was positively gushed over when I said that I and my 16 year old off spring were exempt. Increasing numbers simply can’t be bothered to wear them especially in places like Tesco Express etc. If we keep this up and tell all our friends about the exemptions eventually the unmasked will prevail. Optimistic this morning.

98172 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Fed up, 7, #1166 of 1374 🔗

We need optimism!

98174 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Steeve, 3, #1167 of 1374 🔗

As above. I don’t think that’s allowed any more.

98155 BeBopRockSteady, 14, #1168 of 1374 🔗

Protests in Belfast and Dublin today. Hopefully a good turnout. Expect a good turnout.

98167 Steeve, replying to Steeve, 23, #1169 of 1374 🔗

The whack a mole policy of government does not help the well being of the elderly and their carers.
Life for the all of us but especially the elderly is full of nuances.
I made the decision very early on to spend time with my parents in their home. I decided not to wear a mask as I wanted things to be as normal as possible. At the time it was not an easy decision!
A few days before lockdown I took my dad to the dentist – that was not easy , but looking back, wow what a good decision that was – He had a filling done straight away! Imagine had we cancelled that appointment through fear!
We have not always been close but I have listened to some interesting stories especially from my Dad. Learning to swim in the local river, climbing trees and how an elephant camped in the local field next to his house, presumably on the way to the next town hosting the circus. The Austin 8, North Korea and a visit to Japan and loads more!
I did the shopping early on but after a while they started going back to the local shop -sometimes without telling me.
They have had a lecture from a nurse because they did not see the queue for the shop. My Dad found it quite funny, well he laughed about it for a few days!
Another time they went to a local bakery shop(have done for years) They have a 2 in a shop policy. They must have gone in together whilst someone else in. They got told off! no common sense – no nuance of how the rule was applied. This one did upset them! They have not being back since!
He wears the mask in the shop even though it nearly kills him (his words) because you can’t be too careful! Yes he does know about exemptions!
When all this started they had already slowed down a lot and so from that point of view it as not been too bad.
The only contact from the GP practice has been a text to see if they would take part in a medication trial if they got the virus! Another was a survey about how lockdown was for you!
Oh and then there was Specsavers, raining, got there too early. Went in the precinct for shelter, all the seating had been removed, no where to sit! except in an out of order photo booth.
The government are trying to control everything in relation to Covid19 but it puts a cruel emotional pressure on carers.
There needs to be a more informed and caring way of dealing with this. I know someone else who is over 90, she loves shopping for clothes and a trip out! It comes with risk and that’s why mature informed conversations need to be had. Lets have real facts, real conversations, real evaluations of risk and real life! Sorry whack a mole is cruel!

98175 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Steeve, 12, #1170 of 1374 🔗

Totally agree. Far from being beneficiaries, older people are among the victims of the measures taken.

98300 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Julian, 6, #1171 of 1374 🔗

I agree up to a point living in your twilight years under these horrendous rules are enough to make you just give up, but I also think the children will be the ones to suffer longer term. These sociopathic b’stards just don’t care. They should all be hanged for what they have done.

98275 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Steeve, 3, #1172 of 1374 🔗

If my mum was still alive I’d still be doing her big shop each week and driving it to the seaside town she retired to.
Despite me asking “you sure there’s nothing else you need” I knew that every day she would go up the town to buy something she had ‘forgotten’ but actually to bump into people for a natter.
Not much in the great scheme of things but she would have greatly missed that small pleasure during lockdown, and going to Church on Sunday.

98173 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 8, #1173 of 1374 🔗

Does Cummings also control the weather?

Has one of his ‘odd’ bunch invented a weather machine that controls the weather in the UK?

Three weeks ago we had wonderful sun, blue skies and warm temperatures.

Since then it’s been very wet, cooler and extremely windy.

Thus generally spoiling summer when it had finally become nice BUT at the same time “controlling us” by preventing trips to the beach and generally enjoying outside life.

It’s almost as if someone is trying to control every part of our life and take away any hope and enjoyment.

I probably have become paranoid now but it’s how I feel.

98181 ▶▶ mjr, replying to hotrod, 3, #1174 of 1374 🔗

Labour tried it back in 1976 with Dennis Howells made minister for drought and then it chucked it down and he became minister for floods

98290 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to mjr, 3, #1175 of 1374 🔗

😂 😂

I have a surefire method of making it rain, I water my garden.

98369 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bella Donna, #1176 of 1374 🔗

Works every time!

98448 ▶▶▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Bella Donna, #1177 of 1374 🔗

I start washing the car.

98368 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to mjr, 2, #1178 of 1374 🔗

I remember the 1976 drought. That was quite some summer – and before we’d invented global warming too!

98431 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1179 of 1374 🔗

yes – in those days is was “weather”

98435 ▶▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Cheezilla, #1180 of 1374 🔗

Remember it snowed in June that year as well.

98188 ▶▶ Basics, replying to hotrod, 3, #1181 of 1374 🔗

In 1977 US and USSR (and 45 odd others inc UK) signed a UN treaty agreeing not to use weather modification as a weapon. There were allegations at the time that it rained a lot in Vietnam.


For an enlightening/fun wander through weather modification perceptions look at the reviews for the Alaskan HAARP Research Facility – five stars and one stars. Maybe put in an order!

There is a problem with UK wheat crops this year. The weather pattern has happened to be bad for wheat.

98200 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Basics, 3, #1182 of 1374 🔗

Yes I spotted that, worst harvest since 1980?

All part of the grand scheme?

98260 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Basics, 2, #1183 of 1374 🔗

That’s because the spring was very dry. However I think that many farmers were saved by some very timely rain in early July. I don’t think the harvest is going to be as bad as many thought it would be.

98201 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to hotrod, 3, #1184 of 1374 🔗

Posted yesterday about holidaymakers heading home from here a day early, pissing down with rain in August having spent a glorious spring/early Summer lockdown indoors.

98178 mjr, replying to mjr, 16, #1186 of 1374 🔗

two observations this morning

  • Toby’s appearance on Any Questions last night. repeated today – and followed by Any Answers. The whole programme was like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Discussing exams etc whllst refusing to discuss the elephant – unnecessary lockdown – despite Toby’s attempts to steer it that way. Also was any discussion of masks off the table. As soon as Toby mentioned the word the presenter (a poor substitute) virtually shut him up.
  • BBC breakfast .. I know i shouldnt watch it. discussions about local lockdowns. Then the worst bit of covid fear porn. a long interview with some old guy who has just come out of hospital after 100+ days with admittedly serious problems with a covid link. But using this to get them to reinforce how important it is to follow the guidelines .. “what would you say to those people …….” Message.. “This person nearly died .. You are all in danger and will die if you dont wear a mask “
98257 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to mjr, 3, #1187 of 1374 🔗

I listened to that. Yes it was very obvious how Anita Anand trying to shut Toby up, over and over again. I hate the BBC. Charles Clarke…what a bastard.

He is a lockdown hard-liner. He wants more measures, more enforcement…thank fuck Labour aren’t in charge.

98288 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Two-Six, 8, #1188 of 1374 🔗

You say thank fxxk Labour aren’t in charge. I doubt we would notice any difference they’ll all the same. They are all corrupt charlatans!

98304 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Bella Donna, #1189 of 1374 🔗

But they would not pretend that the temporary nationalisions were temporary.

98429 ▶▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #1190 of 1374 🔗

All of the wankers need to be lynched

98286 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to mjr, 3, #1191 of 1374 🔗

Two things I do know, I will die eventually whether I wear a mask or not.

98401 ▶▶▶ Nicky, replying to Bella Donna, #1192 of 1374 🔗

I fully expect to be buried in one – whether I like it or not.

98186 mjr, replying to mjr, 17, #1193 of 1374 🔗

Just seen on tv that next month the Blackpool Illuminations are not being switched on by a celeb as is usual. This year they will be switched on by “seven covid heroes” ..
And the displays will include illuminated representations of 50 “heroes”
All arranged by Laurence LLewellyn f*cking Bowen.
Pass me the sick bag.

98191 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to mjr, 9, #1194 of 1374 🔗

Are the heroes supermarket workers and dustbin men ?

98192 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to KBuchanan, 4, #1195 of 1374 🔗

Killer Ferguson?

98204 ▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to annie, 2, #1196 of 1374 🔗

His monument is all around us.

98196 ▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, 10, #1197 of 1374 🔗

ps . BBC also interviewed one of the “heroes”, Via zoom. She was in her living room. Why was she wearing her blue nursing scrubs? or does she wear these as her pyjamas. Not so much operating theatre ,, More theatre of the absurd … i thang you!!

98214 ▶▶▶ Hammer Onats, replying to mjr, 8, #1198 of 1374 🔗

The sad thing is a lot of them actually believe they are “heroes” for doing the job they are paid to do.

98592 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Hammer Onats, 1, #1199 of 1374 🔗

Or not doing the job they get paid to do?

98278 ▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to mjr, #1200 of 1374 🔗


98203 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to mjr, 10, #1201 of 1374 🔗

Why not just have s giant blue mask slung across the street?

98287 ▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to mjr, #1202 of 1374 🔗

You won’t recognise any of them in their hamzat suits though

98315 ▶▶ Hoppy Uniatz, replying to mjr, 3, #1203 of 1374 🔗

Michael Levitt, John Ioannides, Knut Wittkowski, Anders Tegnell, Sunetra Gupta, Carl Heneghan and Toby!

98364 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to mjr, #1204 of 1374 🔗

Me first!

98205 Biggles, replying to Biggles, 10, #1205 of 1374 🔗

Mrs Biggles had a lucky escape yesterday as she nearly came face to face with Rishi Sunak in Richmond (North Yorks). He’s the local MP. It looked like he wasn’t too keen on talking to anyone who might have voted for him as he was moving pretty fast and was surrounded by security. Probably too embarrassed. He wasn’t wearing a mask, but then there were no TV cameras there.

98211 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Biggles, 7, #1206 of 1374 🔗

She should have taken a photo of Mr Sunak showing him maskless and so showing both his faces

98248 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to mjr, 5, #1207 of 1374 🔗

I notice that Sunak is almost an anagram A Skunk

98280 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to RickH, #1208 of 1374 🔗

🤣 🤣 🤣

98277 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Biggles, 4, #1209 of 1374 🔗

Masks are only for us plebs, and holidays abroad will only be for the ‘elite’.

98406 ▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Biggles, #1210 of 1374 🔗

Banker wanker

98209 Hammer Onats, replying to Hammer Onats, 11, #1211 of 1374 🔗

Good to see our Covid “heroes” in action. “
Greater Manchester Police


#UPDATE | Officers attended a property in #Swinton where 3 families were celebrating a child’s birthday in a private garden. The homeowner has been issued with a fixed penalty notice.

98215 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Hammer Onats, 6, #1212 of 1374 🔗

These people have clearly forgotten that a LIFETIME passes between birthdays when you’re a child.

98292 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #1213 of 1374 🔗

No, they’ve forgotten what it is to be human.

98217 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Hammer Onats, 4, #1214 of 1374 🔗

Don’t hide their talents under a bushel .. You missed the following – also yesterday

  • Officers dispersed 30+ people attending a wedding party at a private address in #Rochdale . A fixed penalty notice has been issued.


  • Officers attended a house in #Droylsden and dispersed 7 adults all from different households. Homeowner has been issued with a fixed penalty notice


  • Officers attended a house party in #Oldham and dispersed 30 teenagers. An adult has been sanctioned and parents issued a fixed penalty notice

I could go on here………. https://twitter.com/gmpolice

98227 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to mjr, 4, #1215 of 1374 🔗

Caught a snippet of a trailer for a police programme while flicking through the channels. It was about GMP, one of the bodycam programmes I think.
Trailer (WPC voiceover): “It’s all about reaching out to the community and showing them that we are on their side and we can be approached.”
Me: “Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha…”

98405 ▶▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #1216 of 1374 🔗

Fuck the Stasi bastards

98230 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, 3, #1217 of 1374 🔗

in fact if you follow that twitter account there are dozens of such entries. Dont they have proper police (or should that be policy) work to do ?

98223 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Hammer Onats, 5, #1218 of 1374 🔗

The totalitarian screws are turning.

98226 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to stewart, 7, #1219 of 1374 🔗

And they wonder why people throw bottles at them

98229 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Cecil B, 7, #1220 of 1374 🔗

The way things are going, it’ll be petrol bombs soon.

98235 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Hammer Onats, 2, #1221 of 1374 🔗

Wonder who grassed them?

98274 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Victoria, 4, #1222 of 1374 🔗

Neighbours with a grudge. You have to be some sort of scumbag to do that!

98244 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Hammer Onats, 5, #1223 of 1374 🔗

That’s it, next time the filth come into the transport cafe at the takeaway counter unmasked I’m dobbing the bastards in

98245 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Hammer Onats, 5, #1224 of 1374 🔗

Sieg Heil!

98362 ▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to Hammer Onats, 1, #1225 of 1374 🔗

I don’t get why people open the door to them???? It’s private property! If they broke it down and forced entry (or went to get a warrant) that would make for some fantastic footage.

98218 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 28, #1226 of 1374 🔗

You sceptics are wrong.

This virus is more deadly than anything the human race has previously encountered

The Welsh and English ‘governments” received exactly the same scientific advice, and have the same highly qualified scientific advisors

These ‘governments’ introduced different measures in each of their countries in order to counter the behavior of the virus

No face masks in Welsh shops. The pubs in Wales opened three weeks after their English counterparts

This proves

1 The virus can read

2 The virus can also read Welsh (As only twenty per cent of the Welsh population speak Welsh, this is a fantastic achievement since they only started learning in March)*

3 The virus knows the exact location of Offas Dyke. This suggests it has access to google maps or something similar and is likely to be computer literate

4 The vira (don’t know, can’t be) can communicate with each other; hence their decision to leave English pubs en masse and cross the border into Wales on a given date. Presumably they all became tee total three weeks later. This coincided with the dictators instruction to live more healthy lifestyles. Are the vira watching the BBC and MSM?

5 The ability of the vira to organise themselves suggests some sort of leadership structure

As Samual L Jackson might say “That’s one motherfucking dangerous virus”

I’m told it’s gone quiet at the moment as the vira are building an Air Force and Navy ready for the second wave (God help us if they acquire a nuclear capability)

See you on the other side

  • The Welsh government has spent billions on trying to get the Welsh population to learn the Welsh language. To date the population have point blank refused. All they needed to have done was deploy a cheap but effective virus
98233 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cecil B, 4, #1227 of 1374 🔗


98241 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Cecil B, 7, #1228 of 1374 🔗

I believe correct equipment for walking a South to North journey along Offa’s Dyke is a single right wellington boot. If returning it makes it sense to purchase a pair – the left boot will keep out the covids on a North to South journey.

98258 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Cecil B, 8, #1229 of 1374 🔗

This is absolutely correct. I live near the border between Wales and England, and often take my dog for a walk along the remains of Offa’s Dyke. I can see the pestilential miasma seething on the English side, bouncing off the invisible energy barrier that the Dyke generates – this is why, according to the Welsh government, “ Wales is now the only part of the UK where the daily rate of new coronavirus infections is falling” .

History records that Offa had a prophetic vision of Saint Anthony the Great, who as you know is the patron of Lockdown Sceptics, who bade him construct the Dyke not to keep out the wild Welsh, but as a sacred barrier to protect Wales from a ‘phantasmagoric ague that will strike the land of Brittania with madness in the nine hundred and eighty seventh year since the ascension of our Lord”.

98265 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Mr Dee, 3, #1230 of 1374 🔗

Got a Welsh drains crew down the road, they brought their Welsh traffic light signs with them, will they scare the Covid away?

98267 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to karenovirus, 3, #1231 of 1374 🔗

Yes they certainly will.

98270 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mr Dee, 8, #1232 of 1374 🔗

Wales only place where daily infection rate falling.
Wales only place that doesn’t mandate face nappies.

98295 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to annie, 5, #1233 of 1374 🔗

Obvious conclusion – Wales needs to mandate face-nappies to make the infection rate fall EVEN FASTER!!!!! And then when it’s at zero, we need to wear them to bring the Covid victims back to life.

98296 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to annie, 2, #1234 of 1374 🔗

Drakeford should have lifted the lockdown faster, earlier. Maybe we’d be Covid free now?

No pleasing some people, especially me 😃

98311 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to annie, 1, #1235 of 1374 🔗

That 100% quotable ?

98283 ▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1236 of 1374 🔗

Haha I expect to see this headlining the Guardian in the next few days

98363 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Cecil B, #1237 of 1374 🔗

Love it!

98225 Basics, replying to Basics, 8, #1238 of 1374 🔗

What is WHO?

Corbett Report. A newly published summary of WHO and it’s recent history including the 2009 H1N1 dealings which BMJ called into question at the time.

One incredible point is WHO changed it’s definition of Pandemic just one month prior to H1N1. No longer were high numbers of deaths required to meet the WHO definition, just an increase in, yup, cases/infections.

The BMJ noted after H1N1 that WHO declaring a pandemic triggers automatic paydays for pharmaceutical companies. They also noted issues with the closed door WHO inquiry into the dealings.

WHOs global internet activity tax also gets an airing. Can you afford not to watch or listen!?

Well researched with clear references and show notes it’s another important contribution by James Corbett. A journalist/research who was publishing at the time of H1N1.


98243 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Basics, 3, #1239 of 1374 🔗

The BMJ noted after H1N1 that WHO declaring a pandemic triggers automatic paydays for pharmaceutical companies.”

Yes indeedy!

98302 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Basics, 1, #1240 of 1374 🔗

Listened to this last night. Very compelling. I have been in the cockup not conspiracy camp throughout, but it’s hard to reason away the actions of the WHO as benign and ignore how they have shaped the current and future dystopia. Bone chilling.

98347 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1241 of 1374 🔗

The WHO have already admitted they changed their guidance on face masks due to political pressure.Asymptomatic transmission was another u turn as well.Control WHO and you control the response.I was torn between cock up and conspiracy until the Leicester lockdown and quarantine.There was no reason for those 2 policies unless your aims are nefarious.

98410 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #1242 of 1374 🔗

I think it’s more helpful to look at it in terms of dynamics rather than conspiracies.

Dynamic 1: The media, especially TV, are competing more than ever for eyeballs and are as sensationalist as ever.

Dynamic 2: Drug companies having infiltrated every national and super national health organisation in order to maximise their influence and profit jump on every opportunity to push a health emergency.

Dynamic 3: Government and politicians are spectacularly insecure and terrified of the media and being accused of being responsible for something. The worst accusation possible is being responsible for death.

Dynamic 4: A population that is continually becoming more flaccid, conformist and risk averse

Dynamic 5: Ambitious, self serving experts and scientists who will produce whatever research and provide whichever advice will get them funds and status.

Dynamic 6: Megalomaniacs with means constantly looking to exercise and expand their power and ambitions.

It’s the combination of those dynamics (and perhaps others), in my view, have led to this perfect sh*tstorm.

98341 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Basics, 3, #1243 of 1374 🔗

The above and Plandemics explain how screwed up the system is, the simple fact that patents have been taken out on cv19 says a lot.

I think if more people could watch the above videos they would realise they are being played & if we let this happen we are going to be living in a very different world going forward.

Take action for future generations.

98346 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Basics, 3, #1244 of 1374 🔗

Yes, I would agree – it’s worth making time to watch this, and whatever you can of his other videos, for a good analysis of the WHO’s influence and many other relevant issues.

Right now, people are posting on here about Tedros telling the world’s governments that the virus ‘could last another 2 years’ (?!) and, at the same time, the UK government apparently plans to extend the Coronavirus Act – aka tyranny – for another 2 years. Fancy that!

If there was a hint of good faith, a 6-month extension would be the maximum allowed and even that would not be justified. Cock-up or conspiracy?

I now notice that at least 3 of us have linked to this video on this thread. The more the merrier 🙂 MW

98236 davews, replying to davews, 4, #1245 of 1374 🔗

On my trip to London last week as I said the pub in Erith wasn’t serving food. In fact there were just a couple of customers in the pub drinking. Erith itself was busy. Back at Waterloo where I had lunch at the Wellington outside when I entered I was immediately struck that nobody was eating, just drinking. ‘Are you serving food’ I asked, ‘Yes. sure we are’. Lunch fine and speedily served, but during the hour I was there I don’t recall anybody else ordering food. OK, at 3.30pm it is well past the lunchtime peak but this is central London with most of the other eating places still not reopened after lockdown. Large Fullers chain pub and always busy with food when I have been there before. Plenty of people in but all just drinking. Maybe it was busier on the Monday to Wednesday EOTHO offers

98263 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to davews, #1246 of 1374 🔗

Perhaps its pubs, I’m in the cafe today, Saturday, almost full, working blokes, family groups going shopping later.

98330 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to davews, 5, #1247 of 1374 🔗

I’ve heard lots of stories that sit in food place are doing really well Monday to Wednesday then nothing. Even to the point of arguments as people cannot get tables due to capacity.

Maybe the powers that be could make the other four days unmasked shopping days, I bet that would give high street trade, and even eating out at full price a boost.

98238 stewart, replying to stewart, 11, #1248 of 1374 🔗

WHO announces pandemic will hopefully be over in 2 years .
Boris Johnson’s government looking to extend COVID laws by 2 years.
I guess the pharmaceutical companies have asked for 2 more years to get their vaccine.
(Whatever Bill G and his GSK, Pfizer friends say goes…)

98247 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to stewart, 25, #1249 of 1374 🔗

Absolutely horrendous – saw the DM (and Telegraph) this morning punting all these scare stories using the useless R number again. We all know the virus is no longer life threatening for the majority / more people are killed by flu at this stage.

What to do:

  • Do not get tested
  • Do not wear a mask
  • Do not participate in the vaccine trials as Long term side effects are unknown
  • Educate shop workers / colleagues at work / HR departments
  • Challenge, challenge, challenge
  • Optimise your immune system – start with vitamin D levels
  • Stay positive and happy
  • Visit your family and give them a hug
  • Support protests
  • Get the LS story out
98259 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Victoria, 3, #1250 of 1374 🔗

Spoke to a long term music events manager yesterday, “we are in talks with government, they say vaccine is on it’s way, better be, our industry is dead”.

98256 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to stewart, 8, #1251 of 1374 🔗

The plague ain’t over after 700 years, get fucking real WHO.

98249 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 3, #1252 of 1374 🔗

MEDICAL GENOCIDE: UK government pushing for more blacks and minorities to participate in coronavirus vaccine trials

Had the government of the UK looked closer at the actual data, it would have come to the realization that Wuhan coronavirus (COVID-19) risk is more a factor of socioeconomic status and employment type than it is about skin color. But in the age of social justice warrior-ism, the bandwagon approach to “science” has become the norm.

Consequently, UK officials are now engaged in a desperate search for more non-whites to get jabbed with experimental chemicals that are being rushed to market as part of President Donald Trump’s “Operation Warp Speed” program to create fast-tracked vaccines for the entire world.

According to the Times of India , the British government is actually now putting out ads in Gujarati, Punjabi, and Bengali to try to attract more people of Indian descent to participate in Wuhan coronavirus (COVID-19) vaccine trials.


98255 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Victoria, #1253 of 1374 🔗

Pity we were posting at the same time I would have done mine below as a reply to this, subject being a minority.

98269 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Victoria, 3, #1254 of 1374 🔗

There is an excellent alternative for people with dark skins it’s called Vitamin D.

98654 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Bella Donna, #1255 of 1374 🔗

Also good for people with light skins! My understanding is that it’s hard for people who live north of 37N (everyone in the UK) to get enough sun to stimulate vitamin D production from the autumnal equinox to the vernal equinox (Sept to March). So supplementation is the way to go during the winter. Getting ready to start my usual winter supplements next month even though I spend 2-3 hours a day out on my allotment.

98251 karenovirus, 7, #1256 of 1374 🔗

Got picked up by my favourite taxi driver last night. He told me he had been instructed to take part in a clinical trial for Covid but had noticed with suspicion the name Imperial College.
His English is not good so I read it for him
‘No look, it says “invited”, so not compulsory’.
They were not to know of his Covid sceptic Facebook site with 34k following, sadly all in Turkish and Russian.

98252 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 5, #1257 of 1374 🔗

Podcast: Big Pharma had to destroy HCQ to receive emergency approval for Covid vaccine


98349 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Victoria, 2, #1258 of 1374 🔗

In The US they can use emergency powers to push through the vaccine if no other medication is available, so they had to stop the use of HCQ & say the vaccine is our only hope.

98354 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Dave #KBF, #1259 of 1374 🔗


98360 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Victoria, #1260 of 1374 🔗

I can’t get the link to work.

98264 kf99, replying to kf99, 8, #1262 of 1374 🔗

Nice response to the Telegraph’s “are the youth rebelling” article today

”Is this the moment when Britain’s youth effects real change?” Not when they’re doing exactly what the system/establishment/deep state has manipulated them to do what they want them to do. The face nappies for starters. If you have a protest, blm, extinction rebellion and it’s not stopped or criticised, you are fulfilling the agenda. If you go against the system, protest against lockdowns,…you are attacked and treated completely differently and labelled as ‘far right’. The young aren’t rebelling against the system they are useful idiots. If you protest and are attacked by the common purpose police, political class and corporate media, you’re on the right path.

98276 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kf99, 3, #1263 of 1374 🔗

Sent Steve Baker (not my MP) a mailie this morning:

Dear Mr Baker

Although not a constituent of yours, I am writing as you are the only MP who questioned the theft of our liberty in March under the above Act, and furthermore was instrumental in restricting the term of the said Act to six months, recurring.

I am concerned by what I hear, that the Government are seeking a TWO YEAR extension to this Act come September.

Oughtn’t this, if needed at all, be restricted to six months also?

I am deeply concerned about what I see as an on-going power grab and coup against our democracy.

Yours sincerely

He responded quickly. Well, not really:

Thank you for contacting the office of Steve Baker MP. This is an automatic reply to confirm receipt of your email.

If you are a constituent and would like a response I require your name and full postal address; if these details were not included in your correspondence, please send them to me using this email address. Due to the volume and complexity of email being sent due to the Covid-19 crisis, and the pressures of Parliamentary business, it may take some time for us to get back to you.

Please be patient as we prioritise urgent casework. I regret my small team and I are not able to respond to template email campaigns at this time.

I should also let you know that there is a strict parliamentary convention that MPs do not take up matters on behalf of those who live in the constituencies of other MPs. If you are not sure whether or not you are my constituent, you can find out here: findyourmp.parliament.uk

So I feel there’s little alternative:


Looks like it’s violence then.

Knock on the door maybe?

98309 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to kf99, 1, #1264 of 1374 🔗

I agree. The youth are brainwashed by social media. They cannot organise a protest themselves.
They don’t believe it will go on for a long time unless we protest.

98335 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JulieR, 5, #1265 of 1374 🔗

I thought the youth were being blamed for local lockdowns by getting pissed up and shagging around in same old way; just as good as protesting and building herd immunity as a bonus to us oldies, shag away says I.

98272 tonyspurs, replying to tonyspurs, 8, #1266 of 1374 🔗


98284 ▶▶ guy153, replying to tonyspurs, 4, #1267 of 1374 🔗

Most importantly this proves herd immunity for Covid. If we can catch other viruses why not SARS2? It can’t be because of the masks and sticky tape.

98289 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to tonyspurs, 2, #1268 of 1374 🔗

But according to Fullfact.org they say this
There isn’t evidence for this. Although we don’t have detailed data on recent deaths, there are almost certainly fewer deaths where flu is identified as the underlying cause compared to Covid-19″

Sorry? no detailed data? Hardly conclusive

98327 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #1269 of 1374 🔗

‘Fact’ checkers = propaganda. Ignore! MW

98303 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to tonyspurs, 9, #1270 of 1374 🔗

My friend went to Greece a few days ago and messaged me yesterday that she has got flu (diagnosed by local doctor, she did Covid test, which was negative). She thinks she pick it on the plane or airport.
I said to her “Doesn’t it prove masks don’t protect from viruses?”.

98285 crimsonpirate, replying to crimsonpirate, 1, #1271 of 1374 🔗

Anybody familiar with this website-they make, to me, a dismissive response to the ONS figures regarding more people dying of flu than Covid. Can’t see much supporting evidence

98298 ▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #1272 of 1374 🔗

Here’s an article about them from UK column it’s an old article but still relevant I imagine

98308 ▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to tonyspurs, 1, #1273 of 1374 🔗

thanks for that!

98301 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #1274 of 1374 🔗


“ We don’t know exactly how many people are dying of flu at the moment—meaning that “flu” is the underlying cause—but it is almost certainly far fewer than these reports suggest.

With pneumonia included, the total number of people dying of pneumonia or flu is probably higher than the number dying of Covid-19 at the moment, but not by the margin that these headlines suggest. “

Probably, we don’t know, almost certainly!!?? Yep, must be Fullfacts.

They also have basically argued our point that Covid on the death certificate does not mean the person died of it:

“ These figures show the number of deaths where influenza, pneumonia or Covid-19 are mentioned on the death certificate, not those where they were listed as the underlying cause of death. This makes it misleading to say that these are cases where people necessarily died “of” the disease, or were “killed by” it, because in many cases influenza and pneumonia are only mentioned as factors in a death where the underlying cause was something else.”

98331 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1275 of 1374 🔗

How funny! So, in seeking to undermine the argument for the relative risk of flu, they end up demolishing the argument for the risk of Covid-19.

These are not Full Facts. These are distortions of data in order to reach a predetermined conclusion i.e. lying.

98334 ▶▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to WhyNow, 1, #1276 of 1374 🔗

sounds like they should be renamed foolfuct.org

98343 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Sarigan, 1, #1277 of 1374 🔗

Yes, it struck me that if they could use that argument for flu they were demolishing the argument for covid.

98366 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1278 of 1374 🔗

Er, yes, just like the died “with” and “of” covid debate, surely?!

98312 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to crimsonpirate, 1, #1279 of 1374 🔗

Factchecking orgs are to be avoided.


98342 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #1280 of 1374 🔗

Anything that calls itself Fullfact should be treated as a government disinformation tool.

98355 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #1281 of 1374 🔗

They are I believe a govt sponsored ngo type organisation. There was some stuff on them a while back. About as reliable as Snopes….

98494 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to crimsonpirate, #1282 of 1374 🔗

Fullfact? Fullo’faeces!

98294 annie, replying to annie, 33, #1283 of 1374 🔗

Dear Mr McCretin


I am writing on behalf of the LockdownSceptics Crass Covid Stupidity Awards Committee, to confirm that you have been awarded this week’s Covid Stupid Award for your sterling work in forcing the children in your care to eat their school dinner outside in pouring rain, in order to preserve ‘social distancing’.

The Committee always faces a difficult task, as acts of crass Covid stupidity and hysteria are reported to the Committee literally on an hourly basis. So great is the competition, in fact, that we have been forced to apply an additional criterion, namely that the act of crass stupidity must also involve an element of gratuitous and callous cruelty, preferably inflicted on a vulnerable element in society, such as the aged, the sick, or, of course, children.

Even so, the competition was keen. I am pleased to tell you, however, that your act was considered to be outstanding.

The award, which will be posted to you in a sterilised vacuum capsule, consists of a statuette of a primitive anthropoid wearing a face mask. Unfortunately, due to the mask we were unable to form the statuette into a close likeness of yourself, but we are confident that your friends (if any), and particularly the children in your charge, will instantly detect a resemblance.

It is possible for multiple awards to be made to the same individual. It would greatly facilitate our task in future if you were to forward details of all your acts of crass Covid stupidity and cruelty to us as they happen. You are fortunate in that your profession puts you in an ideal position to perform such acts. You may rest assured that these reports will be carefully stored, and even if you do not always receive the weekly award, all your acts will eventually meet with the reward they deserve.

Yours sincerely
Secretary to the Committee

98318 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to annie, 4, #1284 of 1374 🔗

Some members of this government won’t have enough room on their mantelpieces to display all their Crass Stupidity awards, Annie. Thanks for cheering us up.

98422 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to annie, 2, #1285 of 1374 🔗

Brilliant. I do hope you send it. Satire is one way of killing this thing.

98307 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #1286 of 1374 🔗

Has anybody else seen this?

…. The pictures also showed a bell tent pitched in a field next to the holiday home, but the tent was hastily packed away after the landowner arrived and accused Mr Johnson of camping without permission.
Kenny Cameron, a sheep farmer, told reporters that Mr Johnson and Ms Symonds, 32, also lit a campfire without asking and appeared to have used two wooden kitchen chairs to clamber over a 3ft fence. “Usually if people want to go inside a fenced area they ask for permission first, but I was not asked at all,” he said. “It is only polite to ask.”
Metropolitan Police officers apologised to Mr Cameron at the scene, explaining that the Prime Minister had believed the field to be part of the cottage.
According to one eyewitness, Mr Johnson and Ms Symonds spent their evenings drinking together in the tent before staying in the holiday home overnight.

Does this sound like a red herring to you? Fatty Johnson climbing over fences while camping with a six month-old baby? Really??!!

The picture of our revered premier is priceless though:
comment image ?imwidth=960

98313 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #1287 of 1374 🔗

That picture sums it up – the village idiot is ruining running the country

98324 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Major Panic, 1, #1288 of 1374 🔗

He had to wear “a special face covering” because of the midges.
I could have prescribed him some alternative designs!

98328 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1289 of 1374 🔗

Non that is Gerard depardeau or where’s wally

98333 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1290 of 1374 🔗

Both me and the wife saw the picture at different times and both thought the same.

We don’t think it is him, the nose doesn’t look right and something about the bottom of the face.

Too much effort gone into hiding his distinctive hair.

98379 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #1291 of 1374 🔗

Have a look at the film, “I was Montys double”, maybe in years to come we will get “I was Johnsons double”

Nice bobble hat in that picture and it has cv19 bobble.

In plain sight?

98427 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #1292 of 1374 🔗

I was suspicious of the MSM banging out “a special face covering” because of the midges.” Or to make it hard to make sure it was him?

98613 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Awkward Git, #1293 of 1374 🔗

I agree. I don’t think that photo looks like him.

98338 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1294 of 1374 🔗

Supports the theory that he went mad some months ago

98344 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Cheezilla, 3, #1295 of 1374 🔗

This is all staged – he was in Greece!

98488 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1296 of 1374 🔗

That’s what I thought!

98351 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #1297 of 1374 🔗

Something very wrong about that story. There is a perfectly good cottage – looks very nice from the pics I’ve seen but we are told that the PM of the UK decided to spend his time camped in some tent stuck with a six month old baby at the end of the garden. I mean wtf?? I think this is distraction. Like others I also think he has been abroad, probably Greece. This is trolling on grand level.

98380 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to Cheezilla, 2, #1298 of 1374 🔗

When I first skimmed your post Cheerios, I thought it read: “The pictures also showed a bell-end pitched in a field”. Then I reread it. Yep, right first time!

98490 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Margaret, #1299 of 1374 🔗


98534 ▶▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Cheezilla, #1300 of 1374 🔗

Sorry, predictive text again, Cheezilla.

98409 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1301 of 1374 🔗

The story that he erected a tent on Mr Cameron’s land, without permission, sort of gives the game away.

98416 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1302 of 1374 🔗

Can we petition the Royal Mint to put that image on the next 50p coin?

98325 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 29, #1303 of 1374 🔗

Fantastic comment from a London ITU nurse on Daily Mail comments.

What a star.

“This is ridiculous. I am an ITU nurse in London. We are Covid FREE and have been now for >2months. The reason for lockdown in the first place was not to stop people from getting the virus full stop.. it was to avoid the NHS becoming overwhelmed. There is clearly no sign of that happening now as people are no longer becoming sick from this virus in the way they were in March and April. Its time we stop this nonsense and let people get on with their lives. People arent losing their lives from covid but so many are losing their livelihoods at this stage. please people , can we wake up now !”

98337 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to hotrod, 1, #1304 of 1374 🔗

Unfortunately he/she is going to have to wait until he end of the summer rioting season before any truth is allowed to circulate

98340 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to hotrod, 2, #1305 of 1374 🔗

Sadly the London ICU nurse I know is all over this b*llocks, constantly praising the NHS (i.e. herself), posting photos of her two kids competitively social distancing and wearing masks, and berating anyone who dares to visit a pub or suchlike as a selfish granny killer…

98370 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to hotrod, 1, #1306 of 1374 🔗

My future daughter in law is also an ITU nurse in London, during the height of the infection her unit was given over to CoViD19 patients, that was changed back to a normal ITU a couple of months ago.

98332 Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, replying to Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, 6, #1307 of 1374 🔗

I’ve started a Lockdown Sceptics podcast! Let me know what you think…hopefully apple will index it in a week or two so you’ll be able to subscribe. Please tell Tobes and Mr Delingpole! https://www.buzzsprout.com/1268768/5100115

98387 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, 1, #1308 of 1374 🔗

Brilliant – I really enjoyed that. Very professional, informative, and at the same time funny and anarchic.

Looking forward to the next one!

Factual fun. Well done!
Will definitely share it. Thanks.

98353 Sir Patrick Vaccine, 1, #1310 of 1374 🔗

Swedish Covid-19 chief Anders Tegnell: judge me in a year https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xh9wso6bEAc&list=WL&index=2&t=9s

98359 Sprinter, 4, #1311 of 1374 🔗

A government response to the petition to repeal the compulsory mask legislation is here:

Quote from the response: “The British Retail Consortium has said that together with other social distancing measures, face coverings can make shoppers feel even more confident about returning to the high street.”

Quote from DM 18th August:
“Two million fewer supermarket visits were made than expected after face coverings became compulsory in shops, analysis has revealed.
Footfall in stores and grocers has been steadily climbing since the peak of the pandemic, with each household currently averaging 14 trips per month.
But the mandating of masks disrupted this upward trend in the last week of July and stopped hundreds of thousands from going to the shops.

98361 zacaway, replying to zacaway, 1, #1312 of 1374 🔗

The nightmare will never end if they implement this proposal:

98374 ▶▶ jim j, replying to zacaway, 2, #1313 of 1374 🔗

Don’t worry – if the LibDems have a lead in it then it’s bound not to work. They are excellent reverse indicators.

98386 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to jim j, #1314 of 1374 🔗

Good point. Even if the govt goes ahead with it, there is some comfort in the fact they can’t seem to bungle their way out of a paper bag, let along organise an effective tyranny.

On the other hand, I’m reminded of the film The Death of Stalin where it appears the Soviet Union was being (also?) run by a bunch of incompetent nincompoops.

98403 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to zacaway, 3, #1315 of 1374 🔗

It will literally never end because the test always has some number of false positives.

98415 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #1316 of 1374 🔗

Exactly. Which begs the question do they understand this (but want to do it anyway for some purpose) or are they just incredibly stupid.

I flip-flop between these two possibilities, on the whole I think it’s simply massive incompetence, but I don’t completely discount other motivations. For BoJo, possibly keeping this brewing is a distraction from the looming Brexit deal (or lack thereof).

98404 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to zacaway, 1, #1317 of 1374 🔗

It’s Layla Moran – that explains a lot. She will have revenge for Brexit – and being bullied at school.

98428 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Barney McGrew, #1318 of 1374 🔗

Her teeth remind me of St Jacinda – separated at birth ?

98434 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to zacaway, 3, #1319 of 1374 🔗

… screening should be introduced at transport hubs, shopping centres and supermarkets , in order to meet the goal.

Who the hell is this “group”?

The Prime Minister must get a grip and introduce a comprehensive plan to control this deadly pandemic before this winter.

I wish they’d pull their heads out of their anal orifices and look at what’s actually happening before promulgating such rubbish.

98438 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to zacaway, 1, #1320 of 1374 🔗

I note the lack of comments on the article. Last time I tried to comment on a Standard article, my comments, together with all other sceptic comments, were quickly deleted. To read the article sends a chill down one’s spine.

98365 Seansaighdeoir, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 9, #1321 of 1374 🔗

Been to Tesco twice now in the afternoon recently and again been the only one not muzzled. The other evening I was only one of 4. This has been disheartening although the only cashier not wearing one greeted me like an old friend when I went to her till.

Young girls got out of a car this morning opposite and both wearing masks. There is very high compliance where I live but I see this has a chance for the wearer to virtue signal.

A lot of wearers feel this need to adjust them and I have decided that this is a sub-conscious way of their drawing attention to them. This highlights their virtue in the wearing of them. I am becoming quite frustrated by this especially when seeing people wear them in the street.

I am also very angry that the govt is allowing this nonsense to not only continue but is encouraging it.

98377 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 6, #1322 of 1374 🔗

Fuck the government cretins, the people are encouraging it and revelling in it. As you say virtue signalling or scared to death of being scared to death.

98382 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 9, #1323 of 1374 🔗

The government is getting desperate, this is why they keep moving the goalposts. Backbenchers are growing restless, they can all see the writing is on the wall.

98392 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #1324 of 1374 🔗

Crunch time will be when the schools don’t all go back in a couple of weeks and it becomes painfully obvious they have no plan to ever gets us out of this.

98407 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to zacaway, 2, #1325 of 1374 🔗

And the end of furlough.

98413 ▶▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1326 of 1374 🔗

I bet they extend furlough, putting millions of people on the dole is not going to be popular.

98425 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to zacaway, #1327 of 1374 🔗

Didn’t bother Thatcher.

98433 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1328 of 1374 🔗

Love her or hate her – she had more balls than BoJo!

98483 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to zacaway, #1329 of 1374 🔗

She had a capable Cabinet too.

98423 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to zacaway, 1, #1330 of 1374 🔗

Less than two week. Playing with fire now.

98421 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1331 of 1374 🔗

Well the backbenchers had jollywell better do their duty to their constituents next month!

98420 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 1, #1332 of 1374 🔗

It’s the new equivalent of hair-flicking.

98367 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 6, #1333 of 1374 🔗

Is it starting?

Note the journo thought better than attach their name to it, but it’s a start


98372 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Cecil B, 2, #1334 of 1374 🔗

Good to see, but based on recent experience the current of information is still relentlessly flowing in the opposite direction.

98376 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stewart, 3, #1335 of 1374 🔗

It is, but so many articles now smack of desperation, rather than authority.

98375 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Cecil B, 3, #1336 of 1374 🔗

It has been starting for a while. I know many still doubt that, but the green shoots of freedom’s renaissance are there.

98378 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to Cecil B, #1337 of 1374 🔗

It’s a start, but I suspect the Ministry of Public Enlightenment will have it taken down once they get wind of it.

98417 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1338 of 1374 🔗

Nice to see them focusing on deaths (or lack of!!) rather than “cases”.

98373 Jane in France, replying to Jane in France, 9, #1339 of 1374 🔗

The Puy de Dôme has just made masks obligatoire in outdoor markets. Total number of apparent covid deaths in this department – 45. Currently seventeen people in hospital and one in intensive care. On the 11th of may when we were first allowed out hardly anybody was wearing a mask. I was optimistic at that time. We’ll soon be back to normal, I thought. The government over-reacted and now they want to get the economy going again. How wrong could one person be? We’ve been associating freely (more or less) for three months without any problem and suddenly they take it into their heads to mask us in markets. The police were there to enforce the rules. Will it ever end? Masks are already compulsory in shops. My husband met a friend in a supermarket the other day. Two grown men both wearing nappies on their faces. They thought about it for a bit and then shook hands.

98396 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Jane in France, 8, #1340 of 1374 🔗

As soon as people accept the argument “if it saves one life it’s worth it” they have no argument for any measures imposed upon them on that basis alone.

98384 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 9, #1341 of 1374 🔗


CDC now reports 4,794 deaths in its COVID count with “Intentional and unintentional injury, poisoning and other adverse events” on the death certificate.
Almost 5000 C-19 deaths in the official statistics of 175000 C-19 deaths in the US are not C-19 deaths. And this is just the beginning as there are some 25000 more dodgy C-19 deaths in their statistics.

98398 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to swedenborg, 4, #1342 of 1374 🔗

Not sure how you keep finding these facts – I guess its ‘track and trace!” Thanks again!

98385 Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, replying to Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, 7, #1343 of 1374 🔗

For those interested in my Lockdown Piss Take Podcast ‘Bedwetters’ you can now find it on SPOTIFY! https://open.spotify.com/show/4TvMounXNnJPuycMbn3kj7?si=xNh3mNDeQ3yMk8SXCPlvQQ

98399 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, 1, #1344 of 1374 🔗

Listening now, if the first two minutes is anything to go by this will be a mood lifter.

98419 ▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #1345 of 1374 🔗

You could be onto something!!! but Bedwetters might not be the best name to gain a wider audience which is what we need! Great that people could listen on the way to work etc

99490 ▶▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, replying to Dave #KBF, #1346 of 1374 🔗

Haha! Yes we named it ‘Bedwetters’ to keep it going after this madness is all over.

Just listened. Brilliant! Looking forward to the next one!

98432 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th, 1, #1348 of 1374 🔗

Great work! I also think the title is a shame, but I will be listening to more episodes. That chinese study about asymptomatic transmission sounds hopeful!

98397 Alan Billingsley, replying to Alan Billingsley, 9, #1349 of 1374 🔗

If you look at most European countries including, Belgium, France, Spain, Germany and the UK, the number of cases has increased recently. However the number of cases in Sweden has dropped. Could the difference be that Sweden has not imposed a mask regime, whereas the other countries have. Maybe I’m reading too much into the stats and then again. 🙂

98400 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Alan Billingsley, 4, #1350 of 1374 🔗

Or herd immunity has kicked in.

98411 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1351 of 1374 🔗

Both herd immunity and masks (reduces oxygen that impacts immune system negatively). Also testing leads to lots of false positives

98418 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Alan Billingsley, 3, #1352 of 1374 🔗

The number of cases has increased because of increased testing (hugely) number of deaths has not, still numbing away at a dozen or less daily.

98546 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to karenovirus, #1353 of 1374 🔗

Yes. When the virus decided to f.off, the Mangele and Jackboot brigade needed another excuse. So we have ‘cases’ gleaned from speculative tests.

These days when somebody says ‘You couldn’t make it up’, the appropriate response is :

‘Oh yes you can.’

98414 Cheezilla, 3, #1354 of 1374 🔗

Those were the days – March 27th:

Brilliant article with the whole lowdown on mask-wearing. How times have changed!

98426 Arnie, replying to Arnie, 8, #1355 of 1374 🔗

I refuse to wear a mask. I live on the South Coast which is as busy as hell with holidaymakers at the moment. There’s barely a mask in sight. Go to the local Waitrose or Morrisons and the nappies are everywhere. Everybody is as miserable as sin in the shops, not a smile in sight, go to the beach and it’s great! Lots of people having fun. I realise that this will alarm the lunatics so the fun certainly won’t last for much longer. Fuck ’em.

98440 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Arnie, 2, #1356 of 1374 🔗

Lets hope we have a sunny September!

98447 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Arnie, 2, #1357 of 1374 🔗

Sneaky bastards the government, we have almost a choice to go out and enjoy ourselves. Do something essential like buying food and water and dress as an extra from the hurt locker.

98430 Bella Donna, replying to Bella Donna, 3, #1358 of 1374 🔗

We have just returned from the local market in town. The majority were maskless. It angered me to see younger people wearing them as if it was a badge of honour. Talk about brainwashed! However it was good to see the town busier than our last visit.

98446 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Bella Donna, 1, #1359 of 1374 🔗

My anecdotal observation from this morning is that the door monitors at the shopping centre are fewer in number (maybe due to holidays) and more careless with their task, wandering off to chat with their colleagues.

98606 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Bella Donna, #1360 of 1374 🔗

I’ve noticed something similar – most outdoor mask wearers are either young, or very elderly and probably vulnerable.

98439 RichardJames, replying to RichardJames, 2, #1361 of 1374 🔗

I’ve just been to collect my prescription. Four people in front of me, three without masks, no comment from the pharmacist. Me with my exemption lanyard. Only one problem; one was a twenty-something woman in her pyjamas, dressing-gown and slippers, but I forgive her because she had a pretty (maskless) face.

98477 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to RichardJames, 2, #1362 of 1374 🔗

I wonder what she wears to bed.

98441 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 3, #1363 of 1374 🔗

I think I’m correct in thinking that flu deaths are now greater than CV19 deaths.

Personally the argument that infections increasing meaning face masks are as useful as a chocolate tea pot doesn’t really do much for me. I have no trust in mass testing, false positives and the unreliable PCR test as it is a clear tool to brainwash the masses.

However the greatest argument is people are still contracting flu and dying from flu so face masks are useless as they are infecting the wearer.

Hope that makes sense.

98603 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to stefarm, #1364 of 1374 🔗

I’ve wondered the same about masks. I see all sorts of unsanitary behaviour from people using masks. I doubt most of them wash their masks or replace them frequently (we’d see even more medical waste discarded on the street). I shudder to think what you would get wearing one of those things for days on end.

98445 Arnie, 3, #1365 of 1374 🔗

Covid is the new religion. I used to concern about the Islamification of the UK but look at the zealots who are involved with the Covid scam! Talk about the inquisition! I am a heretic. There I’ve said it. But in all seriousness how long before people are being being maimed or killed in plain sight? I accept that for now those who are guiding this prefer to hide in the shadows like the cowards they are but for how much longer?..

98467 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1366 of 1374 🔗

Just had a call from the hospital to offer an appointment (impressed they are working on a Saturday). I was referred by my GP after a physical examination that was only allowed after a telephone consultation with the nurse, then with her. Symptoms have persisted for several months, so GP was certain I would be seen in clinic for cancer screening within 2 weeks. Well, we missed that target, which I expected, but I have now only been offered a telephone consultation. No real beef with the GP surgery,but if this is the NHS ‘open for business’ then I am not impressed. Oh well, at least we are all safe.

98469 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Charlie Blue, 4, #1367 of 1374 🔗

Do “The NHS” have any targets other than ZERO covid?

I hope you are able to get a proper person to person consultation soon, and that you are correctly diagnosed and treated.

98474 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #1368 of 1374 🔗

New Update available —–>>>

98478 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Cheezilla, #1369 of 1374 🔗

Is that some kind of secret code?

98521 JulieR, 2, #1370 of 1374 🔗

I am sitting on a plane in Luton. I went through security and boarding without a mask, nobody said anything.
Everyone in the airport was wearing a mask, except in cafes. Virus is avoiding cafes.
I was only asked to put it on on the plane, but I still have it on my chin. Nobody cares.
Some children have visors, so weard.

98611 ConstantBees, replying to ConstantBees, 1, #1371 of 1374 🔗

Can I get information from anyone who has used the trains outside of London recently? I’m considering a short break in September from down on the south coast via Southampton up to Bradford-on-Avon. I think some time spent walking along canals will do my soul some good.

I’ve got my trusty mask exemption card, so I should be okay on the trains. But are there toilets available? Are passengers being harassed for being maskfree? Does it feel especially dystopian?

And if there’s anyone local to BoA, perhaps I could also get a reading for what it’s like to visit there.

Thanks in advance.

98762 ▶▶ Edward, replying to ConstantBees, #1372 of 1374 🔗

I’ve been on a few trains in the Midlands, mostly short local journeys. Usually I start with a scarf loosely around my face, find a nice quiet seat (the trains are usually not busy), and somehow the scarf tends to slip downwards. On-train ticket inspections now seem to be quite rare. Toilets should be available, but not on-train catering – bring your own food & drink. Quite common for passengers to pull their mask down to eat or drink, a process which may occupy much of the journey. Not too dystopian overall. It may be different elsewhere but probably not.

109565 Sir Patrick Vaccine, #1373 of 1374 🔗

Covid vaccine rush could make pandemic worse, say scientists


(The rest of the paper is …. RISE IN CASES .let’s not mention the fall in deaths )

191286 Sir Patrick Vaccine, #1374 of 1374 🔗

Mark Dolan: “We are killing Britain”

Mark Dolan: “We are killing Britain. We can’t do this forever. This virus isn’t going anywhere. Don’t be fooled by talk of a quick fix vaccine. That’s nothing more than snake oil.


223 users made 1,346 comments today.

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131swedenborg9, 1114, 7, 0, 4, 2, 0, 6, 2, 1, 1, 15, 18, 8, 2, 1, 4, 16, 1, 9
126mjr2, 6, 4, 6, 3, 0, 1, 14, 0, 13, 5, 4, 5, 2, 3, 1, 16, 17, 10, 7, 4, 3
122karenovirus4, 9, 6, 711, 3, 6, 15, 9, 9, 3, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1, 3, 3, 3, 0, 5, 3, 1, 0, 3, 8, 0, 5, 3
119hotrod14, 12, 12, 6, 3, 3, 5, 7, 11, 3, 5, 4, 3, 8, 3, 29
106Nick Rose8, 6, 8, 0, 1, 0, 0, 5, 2, 7, 7, 8, 0, 6, 2, 0, 3, 6, 4, 7, 2, 3, 9, 2, 3, 3, 4
101Cheezilla4, 38, 2, 7, 5, 5, 1, 3, 1, 5, 16, 0, 2, 4, 4, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 5, 1, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1, 2, 0, 6, 1, 0, 0, 0, 3, 0, 0, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1
98Lisa from Toronto15, 5, 9, 8, 16, 2, 1, 6, 6, 1, 5, 6, 2, 5, 5, 6
95MaxPower65, 29, 1
94Two-Six5, 2, 4, 5, 4, 7, 5, 3, 2, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, 1, 0, 9, 3, 5, 1, 2, 0, 5, 0, 0, 3, 8, 2, 3
89Mark II54, 15, 5, 6, 9
82Victoria4, 27, 10, 2, 4, 25, 3, 5, 0, 2
81Bart Simpson4, 1, 1, 3, 0, 0, 2, 0, 1, 0, 9, 2, 2, 6, 0, 21, 12, 0, 10, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2
74Liam13, 4, 35, 0, 22
74MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG19, 1, 1, 6, 0, 0, 2, 16, 5, 2, 4, 13, 3, 2
72seventeen0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 3, 2, 1, 1, 3, 0, 1, 2, 4, 5, 10, 6, 27, 2, 1
71Montag Smith5, 15, 0, 10, 9, 0, 5, 8, 19
71richard riewer0, 3, 2, 24, 6, 1, 4, 1, 4, 0, 15, 2, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 2, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 5, 4, 2, 2, 5
69Cecil B4, 5, 2, 15, 7, 28, 1, 1, 6
69Tyneside Tigress22, 9, 16, 10, 2, 2, 3, 2, 0, 3
67Klein25, 7, 14, 0, 3, 12, 1, 3, 2
67Tom Blackburn16, 19, 4, 3, 0, 7, 4, 0, 2, 7, 0, 5, 0, 0
64Will38, 5, 11, 2, 7, 1
64Jonathan Palmer12, 8, 11, 1, 5, 3, 3, 3, 6, 4, 4, 2, 0, 0, 2
62WhyNow2, 5, 1, 18, 3, 5, 6, 9, 7, 0, 2, 2, 0, 2
59Telpin24, 15, 15, 5
57Sarigan36, 11, 7, 0, 2, 1
57Tenchy39, 1, 13, 2, 1, 0, 1
56TheBluePill22, 8, 0, 26
55Charlie Blue33, 4, 2, 3, 9, 1, 1, 2
54Steve Martindale3, 15, 3, 24, 1, 2, 6
52stewart11, 1, 3, 11, 5, 5, 3, 11, 2
52Dave #KBF6, 6, 21, 3, 3, 5, 2, 1, 1, 4
52Steeve4, 0, 4, 1, 0, 4, 0, 1, 7, 23, 4, 2, 2, 0
51Awkward Git1, 4, 4, 3, 0, 9, 19, 7, 0, 4
50Nobody20203, 7, 0, 1, 1, 2, 12, 16, 8
49Steve Hayes7, 11, 31
49Drawde92723, 6, 14, 1, 5
47Poppy11, 19, 17
47Sam Vimes9, 10, 8, 2, 11, 1, 0, 6
43Lorenzo Basso35, 8
42Barney McGrew8, 3, 1, 4, 1, 10, 9, 1, 1, 3, 1
41Eddie2, 2, 1, 1, 6, 8, 19, 2
40Rowan4, 3, 11, 19, 0, 1, 2, 0
40Winston Smith2, 3, 8, 0, 13, 0, 0, 3, 2, 3, 3, 3, 0
39Cristi.Neagu12, 16, 11
39NappyFace11, 6, 7, 0, 15
38Caramel4, 1, 7, 11, 8, 5, 2
38T. Prince2, 10, 9, 0, 2, 5, 4, 5, 1
37Basics56, 4, 0, 3, 1, 3, 7, 8
37watashi65, 0, 1, 11, 7, 3, 2, 1, 1
37Alec in France2, 5, 3, 5, 3, 5, 3, 3, 6, 1, 1
37Thinkaboutit1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 9, 5, 2, 1, 4, 1, 4, 0, 0, 0, 2
36RDawg34, 2
35DespairSquid18, 12, 3, 2
35guy1534, 0, 0, 0, 2, 1, 1, 3, 4, 3, 5, 5, 2, 0, 0, 0, 1, 4
34Dominic1214, 20
33Achilles12, 7, 14
33AN other lockdown sceptic12, 3, 0, 2, 1, 9, 3, 11, 0, 1
32Sophie12315, 0, 2, 2, 8, 2, 2, 0, 1
31OKUK3, 3, 0, 13, 2, 10
30thedarkhorse16, 14
30KBuchanan6, 11, 9, 4
30Sue9, 3, 3, 0, 0, 3, 6, 3, 1, 2, 0
28Old Bill16, 12
28A. Contrarian2, 2, 13, 2, 6, 0, 0, 1, 2
27Bill Hickling27
27Ed Phillips20, 0, 1, 6
26Cruella17, 9
26The Spingler12, 14
24matt3, 4, 3, 8, 2, 2, 2
23RyanM5, 14, 4
23PWL0, 12, -6, 4, 0, 22
22Fed up0, 22
22Riffman5, 17
22BeBopRockSteady142, 0, 2, 4
21Hoppy Uniatz18, 3
21Silke David9, 0, 5, 7
20Simon Dutton8, 3, 9
20Polemon22, 15, 0, 0, 3
19Biggles9, 10
19Hammer Onats8, 11
19David Grimbleby14, 5, 0
18Emma14, 4
18AngloWelshDragon4, 11, 3
18Bella6, 0, 2, 10
18Seansaighdeoir22, 5, 9
17Sane and furious17
17JulieR25, 0, 1, 9
17ConstantBees4, 2, 4, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 5, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1
16Lucan Grey16
15bluemoon11, 4
15Youth_Unheard4, 11
15SweetBabyCheeses4, 2, 7, 1, 1
14nat2, 4, 3, 1, 0, 4, 0, 0
13NonCompliant13, 0
13Darryl2, 8, 3
13Fiat29, 2
13Lord Rickmansworth WillyWanks the 4th6, 7, 0
13crimsonpirate8, 2, 1, 1, 1
13Bella4, 7, 0, 0, 2, 0
13zacaway1, 0, 2, 4, 2, 4, 0
12Tim Bidie7, 0, 5
12smileymiley0, 0, 3, 9
12RichardJames0, 1, 0, 2, 7, 2
12Bruno4, 1, 1, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1
11A Heretic11
11Strange Days11
11AnotherSceptic6, 5
11Major Panic5, 6
11Lockdown_Lunacy7, 0, 4
11tonyspurs0, 1, 8, 2
11Jaguarpig2, 7, 0, 1, 0, 1
10Gerry Mandarin10
10arfurmo2, 1, 1, 6
10Nicky2, 1, 4, 0, 2, 1, 0, 0
9Alan Billingsley9
9James Bertram9
9Jane in France9
9EssieSW7, 2
9fran2, 3, 4
9gina5, 2, 2
9Not Tiger Woods2, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 5
8davews4, 4
8Jack0, 8
8kf990, 8
8tonys5, 3
8Biker2, 5, 1, 0
8Sylvie1, 1, 2, 4
8Alison96, 1, 1, 0, 0
8Margaret1, 0, 1, 0, 4, 2
7Paul4, 3
6Andy Riley6
6Kelly deacons6
6Kevin Comer6
5Julian S5
5DJ Dod0, 5
5FatBastardMcKenzie1, 4
5mhcp1, 4
5Ned of the Hills2, 3
5TJN4, 1
5hat man6, 0, -1
5smurfs0, 2, 3
5Laura Suckling1, 1, 2, 0, 1, 0
5Edward1, 1, 0, 1, 1, 1, 0
4BJJ1, 3
4James Lawrence4, 0
4PastImperfect11, 1, 1, 0
3Jenny2, 1
3Carlo0, 1, 2
3Saved To Death0, 2, 1
2Dan Clarke2
2jim j2
2Jonathan Castro2
2Mr Bee2
2Jay Berger0, 2
2Nigel Sherratt0, 2
2peter0, 2
1John Stone1
1Marie R1
1wat tyler1
1Ovis1, 0
1p020990030, 1
1BTLnewbie0, 0, 1
1Ruth Sharpe1, 0, 0, 0
1Sir Patrick Vaccine1, 0, 00
02 pence0
0Jim D0
0rational actor0
0Lili0, 0
0JohnB0, 0, 0