Last updated2020-09-14T09:52:56



129510 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 43, #1 of 1675 🔗

Need to look out for this in the morning. Will be interesting to see how people respond to the story:

Revealed: Lockdown Blow to UK Health
Hospital admissions for seven major non-Covid illnesses down by 173,000

129537 ▶▶▶ Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Lockdown Truth, 18, #3 of 1675 🔗

Virologist who fled China says Beijing is lying about COVID — and she has the evidence to prove it
‘It comes from the lab— the lab in Wuhan and the lab is controlled by China’s government’


A Chinese virologist who escaped to the United States earlier this year claims the coronavirus is man-made — and she says she has the evidence to prove it.

Dr. Li-Meng Yan, who was formerly based in Hong Kong, explained on British talk show “Loose Women” last Friday that she was one of the first Chinese scientists to conduct research on the novel virus. She claimed the Chinese government, which is controlled by the Chinese Communist Party, is lying to the world about the origins of COVID-19.

Officially, the Chinese government claims the virus originated from a wet market in Wuhan. But Yan called the claim a “smokescreen” — and said the virus actually came from the infamous Wuhan bio lab.

“It comes from the lab— the lab in Wuhan and the lab is controlled by China’s government,” Yan said.

Yan, who holds both an MD and a PhD, said she obtained her intelligence about the virus from the Chinese CDC and local doctors on the ground in China.

129552 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 6, #4 of 1675 🔗

The Chinese Centre for Disease Control needs to review their security protocol. Level Four not good enough.

129668 ▶▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to richard riewer, 31, #5 of 1675 🔗

All they need to do is wrap the lab building in some left over textile material – maybe with a pretty pattern print

130009 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian S, replying to Major Panic, 2, #6 of 1675 🔗

3 layers is enough

130309 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Major Panic, -2, #7 of 1675 🔗

Take a photo and send it to VistaPrint.

129877 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 3, #8 of 1675 🔗

Nothing new here.

129988 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 3, #9 of 1675 🔗

My main concern about this is why such big news would find it’s way to Loose Women instead of mainstream media.

130663 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, #10 of 1675 🔗

Of course. Obviously this person would have no axe to grind whatsoever.

129602 ▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to Lockdown Truth, 4, #11 of 1675 🔗

I emailed Covid19Assembly a couple of weeks ago and have heard nothing more except for a brief acknowledgement. Has anyone been able to become involved?

129654 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Basileus, 4, #12 of 1675 🔗

I did too, funnily enough, and got no response at all. I assumed it was because I asked them, before proceeding further, to clarify who their leaders, trustees and advisers are, what their corporate status is, and what their source of funding is. Their website still reveals none of these things, which you might think it would be important to set out before asking people to donate their time and money. I assume it’s a bright idea which someone dashed off a few web pages for and then lost interest.

Perhaps someone reading these comments is able to provide that information?

129535 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Nobody2020, 42, #13 of 1675 🔗

Approximately 450 people will have died of cancer yesterday, this time next year it’s likely to be 500+ because lockdown.
Nice one boris.

129553 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to karenovirus, 22, #14 of 1675 🔗

Charge him with premeditated murder to the nth degree.

130930 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to karenovirus, #15 of 1675 🔗

Only 500+? I’d suspect more like a doubling at the very least.

129559 ▶▶ annie, replying to Nobody2020, 17, #16 of 1675 🔗
129576 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to annie, 6, #17 of 1675 🔗

Thanks, I’ll buy the print version to read over breakfast. First paper I’ll have bought since March as a little reward for the Mail telling some of the truth at last.

129679 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 2, #18 of 1675 🔗

70p bargain ! Less than half the price of the Telegraph.

129582 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to annie, 31, #19 of 1675 🔗

The comments give hope as well. Is the tide now turning? The DM is read by thousands of people,even up here in Sturgeon land.

I found young father Sherwin Hall’s story particularly upsetting: 16 doctors later and he’s now been told to be prepared for the delayed treatment to fail.

Why did no one listen to his reports of such troubling symptoms? In such a young patient, they should have been investigated immediately.

And young mother Kelly Smith who died aged just 31,angry,frightened and frustrated.

Dr John Lee is becoming one of our most effective leaders in the fight to restore normality and stop this inexcusable madness.

129739 ▶▶▶▶ Marie R, replying to wendyk, 7, #20 of 1675 🔗

I’m also going to buy the daily mail (never thought I’d say that!). Its incredibly powerful.

129608 ▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to annie, 42, #21 of 1675 🔗

There is a great CS Leis quote at the end of this article. Here is the full version:

“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be “cured” against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.”

129633 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Basileus, 3, #22 of 1675 🔗

Excellent – though I’d like to have been able to ask him why he thought they were “more likely to go to Heaven.”.

129639 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 3, #23 of 1675 🔗

Is it to do with confessing their sins? Like with Jimmy Saville, most people say he’ll be rotting in hell now, but actually if there is heaven and hell he won’t be if he confessed his sins before he died which he most likely would have.

129673 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basileus, 5, #24 of 1675 🔗

Puts me in mind of Solzhenitsyns observations about the behaviour of fully committed Communists who fell foul of the Soviet Regime.
Instead of turning against their tormentors many concluded that since Party ruled for the benefit of The People he himself must somehow be at fault though not knowing what that fault may be. Being imprisoned must therefore be the correct position.

129649 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to annie, 21, #25 of 1675 🔗

protect the NHS… Dont bother us .. just die at home

130339 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to annie, 8, #26 of 1675 🔗

“But all practices will today receive a letter warning them that many patients ‘are experiencing difficulty in accessing their GP’.

The letter instructs family doctors to remind all patients that they can come in for appointments if they need to – and warns them not to send people to A&E instead.”


130351 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to nocheesegromit, 4, #27 of 1675 🔗

My own GP practice has been fine, car park always full.
I am an infrequent user despite COPD and Asthma for which I did not receive shielding instructions (which I would have ignored, rightly as it turned out).

130375 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to annie, 7, #28 of 1675 🔗

“The UK’s epidemic had forced many GPs to move most of their services to phone calls or Skype to avoid coming into contact with patients unnecessarily.

But all practices will today receive a letter warning them that many patients ‘are experiencing difficulty in accessing their GP’.

The letter instructs family doctors to remind all patients that they can come in for appointments if they need to – and warns them not to send people to A&E instead.”

What utter hypocrisy. Hancock had given a speech not that long ago saying that GPs should continue with telephone and online consultations , even after the CV19 “pandemic” was over.
Now they’re lecturing GPs to say they must offer appointments at their surgeries. And don’t send anyone to hospital and A/E…

130536 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to annie, 5, #29 of 1675 🔗

Dr John Lee has a conscience and an abundance of positive empathy. PM Johnson, on the other hand, appears to have misplaced his consicience and natural empathy towards others on the day when he left the emergency ward.

130695 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to richard riewer, 2, #30 of 1675 🔗

He certainly left his brain behind.

129562 ▶▶ Moomin, replying to Nobody2020, 9, #31 of 1675 🔗

At least it is front page news.

129782 ▶▶ nat, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #32 of 1675 🔗

Hmm, I am not yet convinced this is a positive sign. There was a near identical headline re Australia in Daily Mail a day or two ago. (Australian edition) I noticed another surprising headline – this one condemning the stereotyping of protesters as conspiracy theorists. This from the chief culprit ! A complete 180 degree turn from it’s coverage of the protests a week ago. The last week has seen a sudden and unified change in the MSM narrative about the Victorian premier Dan Andrews, he has been condemned by everyone – PM, the security services, all major media outlets and business leaders. I sense some sort of agenda or propaganda strategy in such seamless unanimity. Mainstream newspapers have very little to do with news.

129803 ▶▶▶ anon, replying to nat, 1, #33 of 1675 🔗

Indeed. What are they up to?

129905 ▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to anon, #34 of 1675 🔗

I’d like to know !

129938 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to anon, 2, #35 of 1675 🔗

Paying heed to the overwhelmingly sceptic/anti-Johnson views of their commenters.

129906 ▶▶▶ GuyRich, replying to nat, 5, #36 of 1675 🔗

I’m thinking this may be the start of an attack on the current world leaders in order to facilitate wholesale, NWO changes. Hope I am wrong.

130007 ▶▶▶▶ nat, replying to GuyRich, #37 of 1675 🔗

I do too !

130371 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to nat, 6, #38 of 1675 🔗

This is the article: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8729387/Anti-lockdown-protests-brought-coalition-freedom-advocates-Melbourne.html

However, the article is listed under the “Killer Coronavirus” category on the front page! – kind of mixed messaging…

I agree that a sudden 180′ change amongst all the media and authorities is a bit suspicious. But the situation in Victoria seems to be getting more nightmarish by the day (am I correct that people have been arrested for liking Facebook posts by protest organisers? ) so I’d say anything that gets “Kim-Jong Dan” out has to be a good thing.

130602 ▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to nat, 4, #39 of 1675 🔗

The godawful modelling has been called out and it might be twigging for people and the media. There was a radio interview that exposed him. People want a straight answer why there was a curfew after the CHO and police came out and said that they didn’t request it.
This is a satisfying read.

129968 ▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #40 of 1675 🔗

Whoda thunk it eh ?

I could cry, these absolute morons all need to get thrown in the tower.

130199 ▶▶▶ nat, replying to NonCompliant, 1, #41 of 1675 🔗

Yep, immoral spineless morons.

130318 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to NonCompliant, 2, #42 of 1675 🔗

When they get there, I hope that the Ghost of Anne Boleyn will give them all a visit. In the midnight hour.

129512 Lockdown Truth, #43 of 1675 🔗
129514 Braveheart, replying to Braveheart, 56, #44 of 1675 🔗

I’m just back from a trip ‘home’ to Glasgow (from London) and it’s seriously depressing how compliant the sheep are up in Scotland.

Once I arrived back in London, other than a cabbie that didn’t understand mask exemptions, I was genuinely back HOME! I went to the pub and didn’t even think about going to the bar and ordering a pint!

I was born and bred in Scotland (first 25 years of my life!) but it’s now a land of cowards and I weep for the country of my birth…

129536 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Braveheart, 16, #45 of 1675 🔗

That cabbie will have had Disability Awareness Training, tell him he needs a refresher. Refusal to accept your “ì’m exempt, thank you” is the same as refusing to allow am assistance dog on board.

129554 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Braveheart, 3, #46 of 1675 🔗

Do like Braveheart.

129575 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Braveheart, 10, #47 of 1675 🔗

Sad isn’t it, the amount of docile compliance is staggering. I have had moments of regret and sometimes wish I hadn’t moved from London.

129638 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to stefarm, 10, #48 of 1675 🔗

Same here. Sturgeon has hypnotised the masses. Awful.

129655 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to wendyk, 6, #49 of 1675 🔗

Yes, when are they going to wake up!!!

129667 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to stefarm, 4, #50 of 1675 🔗

I wish I knew! No signs as yet.

129600 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Braveheart, 14, #51 of 1675 🔗

As one of London’s finest Id say mask wearing is about 50/50 among the drivers who are still working.
We have have an edict from TFL to say drivers must wear a mask at all times,passsengers the same.No mention of any exemptions for driver or passenger.
A friend has been reported to TFL for not wearing a mask while being alone in his cab.They must be worn at all times while plying for hire.
You probably were not going far enough for the driver which is why he made a fuss.

129659 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #52 of 1675 🔗

Maybe he was going south of the river.

Sorry, bit of light relief. My dad was a taxi driver for over 40 years so I can just about get away with it. I’m glad he retired a couple of years ago.

129996 ▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 4, #53 of 1675 🔗

Do TFL take written responsibility for Hypoxia?
What if you gave a lung condition and your Dr recommends not wearing a mask?

130725 ▶▶▶ ajb97b, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 2, #54 of 1675 🔗

To the “one of London’s finest” – thanks for identifying yourself on this thread, and for all you do to tread the impossible line between what you are required to do and what you feel it is right to do. Posting here helps people remember that some of you are not at all the enemy

130837 ▶▶ GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to Braveheart, 1, #55 of 1675 🔗

Definitely agree. I live in Glasgow but I’m having a short break in London just now and I’m happy to say I wasn’t the only one unmasked on the tube but overall I’d say about 80% are masked.

129515 Barney McGrew, 10, #56 of 1675 🔗

Excellent news and round-up, Will!

129516 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 43, #57 of 1675 🔗

Edinburgh University has renamed this building. It was David Hume Tower, named after the great Scottish empiricist. It’s now 40 George Square, named after George Floyd.

All it took was an online petition with 1700 “signatures”. So let’s start a petition to change the name back.

129519 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Cristi.Neagu, -2, #58 of 1675 🔗

If I’d known who David Hume was when I was a student there I’d probably care as much about the name as I do now, which is not at all.

129555 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #59 of 1675 🔗

Skeptic was David Hume’s middle name and his claim to fame.

130673 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #60 of 1675 🔗

Bragging about your ignorance is not as clever as you seem to think it is.

130707 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to John P, -2, #61 of 1675 🔗

Can’t imagine how I’ve survived this long being so ignorant. Bet you check yourself in the mirror regularly and wink at yourself for being so clever.

130932 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to Nobody2020, #62 of 1675 🔗

Must agree with that sort of thing, named buildings seem grand, but nobody who uses the building ever pays attention to the namesake. I hate to think how much moey will be wasted changing over the signage though.

129522 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 33, #63 of 1675 🔗

My first undergraduate degree is in philosophy. It’s offensive to me that the university caved to 1700 “woke” idiots.

129564 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 7, #64 of 1675 🔗

So, it’s probably being run by woke idiots. Disgrace to the international reputation of that university. I hope enrolment plunges.

129594 ▶▶▶▶ Jane in France, replying to richard riewer, 13, #65 of 1675 🔗

The whole of Scotland is pretty much being run by woke idiots.

129538 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 7, #66 of 1675 🔗

They didn’t use the full name so in the fullness of time it will become just another George Square named after dead Kings.

129634 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to karenovirus, 3, #67 of 1675 🔗

Laid out in 1766 so named after George III. Who was of course white privileged gammon who reigned over a nation of colonial institutional racists enslaving africa. As most of the square is occupied by the University i am sure they can get the name changed by a compliant council. Sturgeon Square anybody?
Mad king George ?? He would be bloody livid!!!

129636 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to mjr, 1, #68 of 1675 🔗

Snap. 🙂

130675 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to mjr, 1, #69 of 1675 🔗

Salmond Square.

129635 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to karenovirus, -2, #70 of 1675 🔗

Kings who ruled during the time of organised slavery ?! Bloody hell !

129572 ▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 15, #71 of 1675 🔗

I don’t know, I think the new name is quite fitting. The David Hume Tower is a monstrously ugly building which would be greatly improved by non-existence. Floyd was a monstrously ugly character who has been greatly improved by non-existence. I’d only want it named after Hume if it was to be demolished and rebuilt in a more handsome style.

129595 ▶▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Ben Shirley, 2, #72 of 1675 🔗

I agree to a certain extent about the building, but they might have the idea of pulling down the statue on the High Street next.

129637 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ben Shirley, #73 of 1675 🔗

First chuckle of the day – thanks Ben.

130977 ▶▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to Ben Shirley, 1, #74 of 1675 🔗

No one deserves to be murdered like George Floyd was whatever sort of person he was and no country wants police that kneel on people’s necks to arrest them. It could be protestors against lockdown next.

129580 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 5, #75 of 1675 🔗

One consolation: it’s a hideous building.

129617 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 9, #76 of 1675 🔗

The named changed from an Empiricist to a drug fueled career criminal who holds pregnant women at gunpoint and never contributed anything to society!

130320 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to JohnB, 2, #77 of 1675 🔗

Yep! That’s the logic of Black Lives Matter for you. Cuckoo!

129623 ▶▶ Stuart Barker, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 10, #78 of 1675 🔗

They have changed the name for silly spurious reasons, but 40 George Square is just its address. It has been George Square for decades.

A bit of fact checking on this website’s part wouldn’t go amiss sometimes…

129631 ▶▶▶ Stuart Barker, replying to Stuart Barker, 4, #79 of 1675 🔗

Actually correct that, it has been George Square for literally hundreds of years…

129628 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 1, #80 of 1675 🔗

there is a modern day equation
1 woke person = 100 normal people

129676 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 2, #81 of 1675 🔗

Edinburgh Councik held a petition that got one signature to start flying the European Flag a top city chambers. An actual searchable fact.

129729 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 6, #82 of 1675 🔗


Scotsman recording academic disapproval of the change. Back in June when BLM was causing damafe to the streets it was being said Hume’s racism was found in one footnote in one single instance of wording that is taken to be a racist comment. The rest of his work irrelevant because of the footnote.

Said it yesterday, overseas students stay away from Edinburgh University your education will be blighted by griup think baises and woke authorities. Go somewhere better and live an unblighted life.

130322 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Basics, #83 of 1675 🔗

Live an unblighted life in Blighty.

130933 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to richard riewer, #84 of 1675 🔗

For anyone lucky enough to have the choice of where to go and not be tied to this shitty nation by various commitments and having been in the culture too long to imagine going elsewhere, live unblighted outside blighty, pick Sweden.

129518 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 26, #85 of 1675 🔗

However, I can never support this Government who appear intent on complete destruction of the fabric of our society.

So who can you support? Labour isn’t much better. The British public needs to understand that the two party false dichotomy must end.

130934 ▶▶ patric, replying to Cristi.Neagu, #86 of 1675 🔗

You can’t support any of the other major or minor parties either: Lib Dems, Greens, SNP, all full of lockdownists.

129520 Philip F, replying to Philip F, 14, #87 of 1675 🔗

I was in Hampstead on Sunday. In the window of GAP there was a sign saying FACE COVERINGS ARE COMPULSORY with no reference to exemptions. Is this legal? If not, can anybody give me the right things to say legally (Equality Act etc) and I will complain to them. Might do it anyway just to waste some of their time – they won’t like being accused of discrimination.

129523 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Philip F, 6, #88 of 1675 🔗

It’s probably legal, but you’re well within your rights to complain. The sign Toronto businesses have to post uses the term “required” but does make reference to exceptions for people who can’t comply in the small print. You should look up whatever businesses in your area are required to post and see if the GAP has conformed or gone rogue. I find it hard to believe there’d be no requirement to reference exemptions.

129539 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Philip F, 7, #89 of 1675 🔗

Regardless of their sign, one
word,”exempt” is all you need to say, “thank you” makes it more polite but is optional.

129541 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Philip F, 8, #90 of 1675 🔗

My local McColls newsagent/convenience store gives equal prominence on signs asking customers to wear a mask and saying that there are exemptions for people with disabilities, including hidden ones.

130083 ▶▶▶ Old Mum, replying to karenovirus, 3, #91 of 1675 🔗

Think all shops should be doing this

129574 ▶▶ court, replying to Philip F, 9, #92 of 1675 🔗

From what I’ve seen the major American brand retailers in the U.K. are the worst for their demands. Disney, Apple, GAP etc

129579 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to court, 12, #93 of 1675 🔗

I’ve noticed that as well. Spanish ones such as Zara and Mango are bad as well, Bimba y Lola went one step further by decreeing “no mask, no sale”. Surprise, surprise they’ve been devoid of customers.

129709 ▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Bart Simpson, 13, #94 of 1675 🔗

I’ve been quite shocked at the lack of sensitivity towards customers from a few local businesses displaying that “no mask, no service” that in person give pretty good service. It’s as if Covid gives makes them forget all about customer relations. Businesses need to wake up and fast.

129725 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Alison9, 10, #95 of 1675 🔗

Agree with you on that. Certainly good customer service has gone out of the window since this madness started. I recently wrote to the National Trust to complain about the lack of good customer service in the cafe of one of their properites and in the end all I got was a non-apology parroting the usual line about prioritising the safety of their staff.

Memo to all businesse and institutions: “Caring” for the safety of your staff is not an excuse to treat your customers and visitors abysmally. If that’s your logic then don’t be surprised if customers and visitors desert you in droves and you go bust!

130935 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Bart Simpson, #96 of 1675 🔗

We need to be establishing a netwrok of businesses that respect the welfare of customers instead of the diktats of government. A lockdown sceptics economy.

130677 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Alison9, 3, #97 of 1675 🔗

Vote with your feet. I minimise my visits to shops, but those I do visit have not given me any trouble so far for not wearing a face covering.

130693 ▶▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Alison9, 3, #98 of 1675 🔗

Had my first argument with a cafe today. Went to go in and was met with a raised hand “Not more than one inside at a time!” I wandered out and saw a table outside, completely empty. Shrugged and wandered back towards my car. Owner (muzzled, of course) rushed out and said in a panicky voice “There’s a table there, just wait a minute!” I shook my head.

“I perfectly understand, you’ve made your decision and you are perfectly entitled to do so, I’ll find somewhere else.” Then in a much louder voice “That’s perfectly OK, you’ve made your decision”. Then walked off.

A few more of those and we’ll see who cracks first; me with my money still in my pocket, or them wanting my business.

129894 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #99 of 1675 🔗

THey may say that, but when I went in Bimba y Lola and demanded to buy a handbag without wearing a mask (told them I was exempt), they backed down. It was probably their only sale of the day, given it was dead quiet on South Molton St.

129895 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Sophie123, 6, #100 of 1675 🔗

I am also a bossy looking middle aged woman, and it was staffed by early 20s people. So there is that.

130129 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Sophie123, 3, #101 of 1675 🔗

Well done you. You must have scared them and they probably know that deep down they haven’t got a leg to stand on not to mention the “no mask no sale” diktat would mean no sale and the end of their jobs.

130696 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #102 of 1675 🔗

I love to reply “Well, [pause] you do understand that in the end, you have to make enough sales to cover your wages, don’t you?”

129678 ▶▶ Steve, replying to Philip F, 5, #103 of 1675 🔗

The only place I’ve seen that mentions exemptions on the main signage is Iceland, it’s in small print right at the bottom, but it is there.

129747 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to Steve, 6, #104 of 1675 🔗

There are plenty of others. Both on the tube and at our local train station the announcements say ‘must wear a mask unless you are exempt’ and plenty of the TFL posters do as well. We need to get the message out.

129904 ▶▶ Sir Sceptic, replying to Philip F, 8, #105 of 1675 🔗

(Engage big smile) “Exempt” (Walk on in).

129521 Philip F, replying to Philip F, 24, #106 of 1675 🔗

Nick Abbot on LBC has been absolutely excellent regarding Covid recently (i.e. sceptical) – unlike almost all other presenters on that station. Tonight he quoted Peter Hitchens at length and with approval.
He is on Friday, Saturday and Sunday 10pm to 1am. Listen again and podcasts available.

129546 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Philip F, 15, #107 of 1675 🔗

Jeremy Vine is also going that way publicly, not that anyone believes me 😪 .

129583 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to karenovirus, 24, #108 of 1675 🔗

I feel the same. Not one of my ‘friends’ can even be bothered to look at the Ivor Cummins presentation. They don’t even want to look at anything that is contrary to what they have been brainwashed into believing. I am beyond hope now and seemingly have no friends left. Except patronising ones who think I have gone mad.

129641 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to CGL, 9, #109 of 1675 🔗

We’re all mates on here, CGL.

129700 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to CGL, 9, #110 of 1675 🔗

Indeed. It’s the sunk cost fallacy in operation I am afraid – we’ve invested so much, if we stop now it will all have been for nothing.

Also some measure of psychological self-preservation. They probably know there might well be an awful truth waiting for them, which they would rather not face.

129730 ▶▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to CGL, 35, #111 of 1675 🔗

Same here…apparently one of my so called close friends (best man at my fucking wedding) has messaged my wife on the down low, to tell her I have been posting anti-mask stuff on my social media and that my friends are worried that I have had ” a mental breakdown” and maybe need help…My wife was so shocked that even she lost her temper and I guess now I have no friends anymore…I hate this shit and the brainwashing that has torn communities and families apart..There will be a day of reckoning for all these scumbags or I and the people here will be in rounded up in camp somewhere

129797 ▶▶▶▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Thomas_E, 19, #112 of 1675 🔗

What?!!! Even the goons advising the government have said that at best masks make a marginal difference. I think it’s your friends whose mental stability has been badly affected by the fear porn.

130243 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Thomas_E, 3, #113 of 1675 🔗

”Friend’ will mean something different.
Like ‘safe’.
May be for the better.

130681 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Thomas_E, 2, #114 of 1675 🔗

That is awful. Still, if this hadn’t happened you would never have known what a scumbag your “best” man really was …

129736 ▶▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to CGL, 10, #115 of 1675 🔗

Ditto CGL. I watched Ivor’s video with with my kids. They can see what is going on.
P’s. I’ll be your friend… 🙂

129801 ▶▶▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Arnie, 1, #116 of 1675 🔗

Aah thank you.

129809 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to CGL, 6, #117 of 1675 🔗

On the bright side, more and more in the MSM and politics are waking up to the fact that, as a country, we called this one wrong. Eventually, the zealots will have no choice, the tide has turned and is running our way.

129812 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to CGL, 9, #118 of 1675 🔗

We can’t get our kids or their partners to watch either Ivor Cummins or Dave Cullen. It seems a clear explanation of what is going on is a step too far for them. They only believe what Facebook tells them and they prefer to think it’s all just ‘stupid’ or ‘idiotic’ when the latest tyranny hits and it puts their plans out. We will keep trying though…. MW

129885 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, #119 of 1675 🔗

Hi Miriam-sometimes-AlanAG.
Thanks for your length and interesting reply to a post of mine yesterday. I was subsequently offline for 18 hours so was unable to respond which might have appeared impolite.
btw, I grew being able to see Thorp Cloud from my bedroom window, not quite High Peak but close enough.

130567 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to karenovirus, 2, #120 of 1675 🔗

Hi, Karenovirus, I didn’t think you were impolite at all – life goes on (somehow) so I thought you’d got better things to do! 🙂 Sorry my reply was a ramble as usual and I’m glad you got your connection back. I thought your point was important i.e. that people are getting accustomed to the restrictions – masks and all – and it’s very worrying.

As AG said to me as we walked home from a depressingly mask-ridden trip to our local Morrisons today – the worst so far, ‘This really is the New Normal – we’re in it, aren’t we? What will ever convince people that it’s safe to go without masks? The insane idea of ‘Zero Covid’? the questionable vaccine? getting tested every single day?’ The conversation turned to how we would dodge the tests and the vaccine when the time comes.

It’s hard to see a way out of this when people seem almost to welcome their oppression, something I believe is called Stockholm Syndrome. It was a lovely day anyway and, although sadly, we can’t see Thorp Cloud, we have fine views of Kinder and some other landmarks and, when the local bus passed us before we headed for the fields, the lone elderly woman on it wasn’t wearing a mask, bless her. Oh and a couple of school kids walked past us, one coughing his head off – Dive, dive, dive!!! MW

129849 ▶▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to CGL, 3, #121 of 1675 🔗

So called intelligent friends of mine are the same, they want bite sized chunks of easily digestible info, yet still follow the party line

130241 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to CGL, 4, #122 of 1675 🔗

We are your friends.

129588 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to karenovirus, 6, #123 of 1675 🔗

Hopefully but he is still an odious prick

129694 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to karenovirus, 9, #124 of 1675 🔗

I believe you, it’s just that Vine is untrustworthy given his background of opinion guiding programming. Woukd not surprise me if he’s on a mission to capture free thinkers by lasso and then start on about having a vaccine just a little one just for your own good, etc. Nothing to trust in certain bbc employees.

Other than that good luck to him if his message is geniune and remains so.

129704 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basics, 2, #125 of 1675 🔗

At the beginning of lockdown there was Outrage in the press about 9,000 Londoners Invading ( I think) Brockwell Park.
JV crunched the numbers on air and came up with 1 person per Acre per daylight hour.
“Hardly an invasion” he concluded.

130326 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Basics, 1, #126 of 1675 🔗

He can have the first jab.

129524 Allen, replying to Allen, 16, #127 of 1675 🔗

Sweden/Switzerland/Germany/France Mortality Deaths Per Months 1980-2020: No Pandemic
Graphs here:


The United States is in free fall. This was occurring long before Covid Mania was engineered but now it is moving with great velocity.

The collapse started in 2008 and attempts to salvage this Leviathan have been failures only delaying the inevitable. Here in 2019 the crisis began to unravel again. There was a dramatic decrease in industrial production and then showed up in the banking crisis of August of 2019- the so-called Repo crisis when suddenly banks started to refuse US sovereign debt instruments as collateral of overnight loans forcing the Federal Reserve to step in and basically print money to cover this massive shortage.

So by the time the “Corona virus” magically appeared in 2020 the economy of the United States and many other Western countries were in full blown collapse.

The “Corona virus” has proven to be very useful by political leaders to mask what was going on- that’s why it was invented. The economic destruction that it is being blamed for it is absolutely extraordinary.

129526 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Allen, 3, #128 of 1675 🔗

This is fascinating do you have any more references?

129669 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Allen, 1, #129 of 1675 🔗

Great charts, but I already know what the reply will be if I try to argue with them: “tHaT’s BeCaUsE wE lOcKeD dOwN tHiS tImE”.

129771 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Allen, 6, #130 of 1675 🔗

I heard the same thing. Which was that the coronavirus is a cover for financial collapse, that the banks will be recapitalised as far as possible on all the bankruptcies that will follow lockdown.
It is bound to be about money – what else could it be.

Our government is also completing the process by extracting any remaining assets from the country under the guise of Moonshot testing and sending it to their cronies. We will have nothing left once this is over and the elite will have taken everything.

129912 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Kate, 1, #131 of 1675 🔗
130488 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Allen, replying to Kate, #134 of 1675 🔗

Good stuff in there.

129542 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to wendyk, 6, #136 of 1675 🔗

Read that earlier, similar piece in the Speccy. Doesn’t say much that we don’t already know but the more columns like that the better.

129556 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to karenovirus, 9, #137 of 1675 🔗

Agreed: ‘from little acorns oak trees grow’,so let’s hope that a veritable forest of dissent will shoot up before free thinking, rationality , mature personal responsibility and acceptance of risk are chucked into the lost and found, never to be seen again.

129701 ▶▶ Basics, replying to wendyk, 4, #138 of 1675 🔗

Zero covid makes zero sense but that’s precise what appeals to DELVING devi. Masked hamsters makeno sense to but DELVING devi swears by them. There’s something consistent about DELVING devi.

129529 BobT, replying to BobT, 99, #139 of 1675 🔗

I am now scared for my young children’s future. The scenes from Melbourne, Australia are too raw.
A defining moment in my life was when, as a young boy, my father took me to one of the concentration camp museums in Germany. The gas chambers were still in place along with the fences and the whole infrastructure of the holocaust including piles of harvested gold teeth and photographs. The place still smelled of death 15 years after it was closed. My father said to me “you see this, its horrifying, but I warn you it can happen again”. I did not believe him at the time but throghout my life I have seen genocides happen again and again. He was right.

Genocides are carried out by ordinary people whose minds have been twisted by hate. They see no logic or reason, they do not question why they are carrying out these atrocities against people who just a little while ago were friends and neighbours, they just act on their instilled hatred. The majority in conservative Melbourne who have drunk the coronavirus cool aid clearly now hate the protesters on the streets and have deployed the whole apparatus of the state to subdue them. These protestors are seen as filth who are endangering the rest and as such they deserve no rights as humans.

In the UK, divisions are already appearing. Divisions between Scotland and England, divisions between mask wearers and those who choose not to, the government encouaged snitchers, the deployment of covid wardens, the targeted arrests of protesting dissenters all serves to create hatred between two groups.

I have often wriiten light hearted bits and pieces when I have had a bit too much sauce but my main thrust has always been try and show the madness of all this by discussing here and with friends how, from the very beginning, the statistics did not back up any of the reasons for the draconian lockdowns and other actions taken by government. I thought that the works of spectaculary intelligent minds like Prof. Heneghan, Ivor Cummins, the gentleman who wrote the piece on PCR testing above the line here yesterday would convince people that all of these actions were a mistake and we should all just accept this little glitch in our lives and return to normal.

As far as I can see none of this solid reasearch and data has been taken up by the media (because presumably they have drunk the cool aid too). Even Ivor Cummins brilliant explainer has only been viewed half a million times, likely by the 1% or so of the population (us) who already see the reality.

I now think that I was (am) naive. Most people are convinced, and it is almost impossible to deconvince them. Society has been divided between the believers who are by far the majority and who now hate the non believers. The ingredients are in place for a catastrophe.

In my region of the world, people who are political opponents or other undesirables in Central America are being rounded up and imprisoned in inhuman conditions in the name of being ‘quarantined’ because of the virus. Totalitarian governments worldwide are taking advantage of the WHO driven situation. Smaller governments like mine are being coerced by the World Bank and the IMF to take loans with conditions applied that we should do even more draconian lockdowns, curfews. and further removal of our citizens rights.

This is looking like Naziism but on a global scale. I hope that I am wrong and, when my hangover has cleared in the morning, common sense has prevailed on Planet Earth.

129533 ▶▶ john, replying to BobT, 56, #140 of 1675 🔗

I couldn’t agree more. The shift to totalitarianism, and the desire for it by the majority, is the scariest thing about this. On another note, the BBC did have a couple of pieces about the environmental damage the enforced mask wearing is doing – another catastrophic unintended consequence – and again those normally piously concerned about the environment seem not to give a toss…it’s the most bizarre collective insanity in the history of mankind, and it’s unlikely to end well….

129534 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to BobT, 47, #141 of 1675 🔗

You write beautifully for someone who has been drinking! I wish I could disagree with your analysis, but being of Jewish descent I know fascism when I see it. I was never naive and saw this for the debacle it has turned out to be right from the beginning. I was hoping to be wrong and that people would wake up, but no amount of data or rational appeal is getting through to the hysterical masses. World governments, who stoked the fear in the first place now can’t put the genie back into the bottle and so double down on stupidity and destruction. It’s going to be a long winter.

129543 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to BobT, 33, #142 of 1675 🔗

I grew up sort of fearing intolerance coming from the Left, internally or externally, now I see it coming from the Middle which is bizarre.

There are no divisions between Scots and English, just Sturgeon creating political divides in her pursuit of Scottish independence, which to be fair, is central to her manifesto.

The targeted arrest of 70 year old dissenters and the rash of videos showing police roughly treating ordinary members of the public will backfire on our governments, far from cowering the response will be to increase our outrage.

Journalists have drunk from the trough of government advertising and it is not in their interests to downplay the Covid and blame all the bad stuff on it rather than lockdown.

I talk to lots of people every day and it’s clear that more and more if them understand that at least some of lockdown is absurd, yet still they comply. Sheepwalking (word !) towards tyranny perhaps.

129760 ▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to karenovirus, 6, #143 of 1675 🔗

Towards the proverbial gas chambers in truth Karen. Wake up people!!

129915 ▶▶▶ nat, replying to karenovirus, 4, #144 of 1675 🔗


129592 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to BobT, 39, #145 of 1675 🔗

Being of Asian ancestry where the culture is essentially authoritarian and born and grew up in a country that was in thrall of a dictatorship for 20 years, I had a feeling that this was going to happen from the word go and looks like I wasn’t wrong.

You wonderful post sums up the tragedy we are facing now and while it despairs me to see young people especially millenials cave in without so much of a whimper what really saddens and angers me is how many of the boomers those who were born not long after WW2 ended are some of the biggest cheerleaders of these draconian policies all in the name of “health” and “safety.” Which begs the question – Why? What’s in it for them?

Rather than admit that they were wrong, governments around the world double down their stupidity by even more insane and draconian means. I can say that this won’t end well as more and more people realise that they will have nothing to lose by protests, riots and unrest.

The governments will reap what they sow.

129706 ▶▶ Basics, replying to BobT, 9, #146 of 1675 🔗

Quarantine tags are being used in Western Australia. Exactly tge same as criminal tags but quaratine. Search if you want to read about them.

130937 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to Basics, #147 of 1675 🔗

They’ve also been installing CCTV cameras watching the homes of people who are being held hostage by the government psychosis surrounding positive tests.

129745 ▶▶ Arnie, replying to BobT, 5, #148 of 1675 🔗

I wish I could say that you are wrong Bob. But I cannot. All I can say with any certainty is that you have underestimated the problems that we now face.

129931 ▶▶ nat, replying to BobT, 7, #149 of 1675 🔗

I agree with you. The only possible positive outcome is that as it becomes increasingly evident what it happening, people will wake up in unprecedented numbers. It is starting to happen, whether it will happen quickly enough I don’t know.

129937 ▶▶ Paul, replying to BobT, 27, #150 of 1675 🔗

Last week my wife told me that the only place she feels safe now is at home,not because of any virus or so-called pandemic but because of the growing sense of menace she feels in every public place.
She is the only unmasked person in 90% of the shops she goes into and the snide comments and dirty looks she receives have increased hugely in the past couple of weeks.
She said it feels like we’re almost at the point when masked zealots are going turn violent and no-one will do anything to stop them.
You are right,this is looking like Nazism,with the state using a fully brainwashed,compliant and frightened population to do their bidding.

130733 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Paul, 6, #151 of 1675 🔗

I feel it everyday while riding the bus. My allotment feels safe, but only because I avoid conversations with the other allotment holders. I’ve overheard things that make my blood run cold. I feel like I have to hide my scepticism there for fear of losing the only thing that makes my life worth living.

130321 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to BobT, 5, #152 of 1675 🔗

Have the lunatics taken over the asylum?

129530 RyanM, replying to RyanM, 15, #153 of 1675 🔗

Well, that is a depressing start to the week. Meanwhile, in the US, things (minus the idiotic masks) are starting to feel a bit more normal. I think people are tiring of this. Maybe they will finally revolt…

129540 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to RyanM, 19, #154 of 1675 🔗

I’m counting on freedom loving Americans to get us out of this! The Canadian sheeple just keep begging for more “safety” in exchange for civil liberties. Please lock me down nanny state and pay me to stay home and watch Netflix, and please force all those covidiots to wear a mask so that I’ll feel better when I come out from under my bed to venture outside. I used to feel so lucky to have been born here. Now I wish I were Swedish.

129547 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 3, #155 of 1675 🔗

Sit down and watch a few episodes of
‘The Forest Rangers’ Lisa to remind you how proper Canadians should behave.

129585 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 2, #156 of 1675 🔗

Not from the people I know there unfortunately. A whole flock of sheep.

130337 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to CGL, 2, #157 of 1675 🔗

We need thousands of sheep dogs. They can herd all the muzzled muttons to another part of the world far away from the rest of us.

130736 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 1, #158 of 1675 🔗

I sometimes wonder if the reason I insist on using my mask exemption is because I’m American (I’ve lived in the UK for decades). I look around me at all the mask zombies and wonder if they’re wearing their masks because they’re English – and I’m not. We do have a rebellious spirit, although I still fear the potential civil war coming in the US.

129713 ▶▶ Basics, replying to RyanM, 4, #159 of 1675 🔗

Looks from a far that Manhattan is wrecked. Best resistence in that city is dancing in Union(?) Square, you done know who you’re going to meeter there, you gotta run run run run run take a drag or two.

So much business empty and boarded up. U-haul vans fully booked with people leaving the city. Night time street saftey gone. Looks on the very bleak side of things from a far.

130196 ▶▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to Basics, 1, #160 of 1675 🔗

Yes saw a report recently that suggested 2/3 of all eating establishments could be permanently shut, in the near future…crime of course is soaring thanks to Hollywood luvvies like Mark Ruffalo demanding $1 billion cuts to NYPD budget – well they got it alright. Interview recently with a couple of Sopranos actors; Michael Imperioli & Steve Schirripa, where they tore into the Mayor and pointed out the devastation… On the flip side, I saw on TV that Governor Cuomo did a press junket where he promised to cook a dinner for New Yorkers who had left town, if they came back. So yes, unfortunately, the city is spiralling out of control, but a few people might get a steak meal. That’ll turn it around.

130344 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Stringfellow Hawke, 1, #161 of 1675 🔗

But no after dinner cigars.

130364 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Stringfellow Hawke, 1, #162 of 1675 🔗

Seattle and Portland going the same way. See how antifa/blm* fare once the ‘middle classes’ flee with their taxable incomes.

* Lower case thank you auto correct.

129544 annie, replying to annie, 20, #163 of 1675 🔗

A comment on Dr Kendrick’s excellent blog introduced me to a new word: nosophobia.

“Nosophobia is the extreme or irrational fear of developing a disease. This specific phobia is sometimes simply known as disease phobia.
You might also hear it referred to as medical students’ disease. This name stems from previous assumptions that nosophobia tends to mostly affect medical students surrounded by information about different diseases. But some 2014 evidence lends less support to this idea.
It’s common to feel some anxiety when serious health conditions spread through your community. But for people with nosophobia, this anxiety can be overwhelming, affecting their everyday life.”


There’s our pandemic.

129548 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to annie, 3, #164 of 1675 🔗

Does that cover borisphobia ?

129558 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 16, #165 of 1675 🔗

Don’t think so, that fear is not irrational.

129573 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to annie, 4, #166 of 1675 🔗

It’s not so much fear, more like anxiety about what nonsense he’ll come up with next.
Cows spread the Covid so countryside out of bounds ?

129898 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to karenovirus, 4, #167 of 1675 🔗

I am waiting for the announcement on the “necessary” cull of domestic cats. THAT will be the tipping point, when it looks like Tibbles is going to get it.

(I love cats, we have a cat, I don’t want a cull…but all the articles on cats with corona have got me thinking)

129955 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Sophie123, #168 of 1675 🔗

There was some talk about that early into lockdown when it was reported that a tiger at Wuhan zoo had got the Covid from its keepers.

130699 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to karenovirus, #169 of 1675 🔗

Anxiety and fear are the same thing.

130738 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to John P, 2, #170 of 1675 🔗

I think anxiety focuses on something that could happen in the future.
Fear is of something right in front of you, like a lion.

129561 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to annie, 24, #171 of 1675 🔗

I think also that this obsession with the screening of the worried-well doesn’t help either. Over medicalisation of every life event and the associated view that a pill is always the solution is a major failing in modern medicine.

129565 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to kh1485, 3, #172 of 1675 🔗

Watch CNN, their news programs are laced with adverts for the latest miracle drugs. Pfizer spends billions on advertising every year.

129568 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to richard riewer, 6, #173 of 1675 🔗

Oh, I know, believe me. BigPharma has had the most devastating impact on my life. Yes, they spend more on advertising than they do on R&D.

130348 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to kh1485, 3, #174 of 1675 🔗

There was a pharmaceutical company in Quebec, Valeant. Really crooked. Bought out companies and raised the prices 200 to 300 percent. Didn’t need R&D.

129597 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to kh1485, 8, #175 of 1675 🔗

Spot on! Having suffered truly dire side effects from a number of widely prescribed drugs, and having subsequently had the comparative good fortune to sort myself out with the aid of dietary changes and extensive research, I would caution folk to think carefully before asking for prescriptions: witness the widespread overuse of antibiotics and the inevitable consequences.

129611 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to wendyk, 9, #176 of 1675 🔗

Hi wendyk, totally agree. I read a very good book years ago (mentioned it here before) called ‘Trick and Treat’ by Barry Groves, it totally changed my outlook regarding my health (after being misdiagnosed several times and trying to persuade my late mum that the pills her doctors foisted on her weren’t the answer). Also books by James Davies, Dr James Le Fanu, Ben Goldacre and, of course, Dr Malcolm Kendrick are all very instructive. I think people should always, always look up the side-effects of any drug they are taking. Trouble is, because they are in small print, many believe them to be negligible and thus ignore them.

129545 Nsklent, replying to Nsklent, 18, #178 of 1675 🔗

Note the article on the EU and living with the virus. No surprise in the statement that even if a successful vaccine is found, we will still need to be careful. So that’s it … according to that statement, we can assume no return to normal human and social interaction is the long term intention, businesses and economy to remain in ruins. So what’s the point of the rush for a vaccine, if by this logic it does not impact on the virus spread, and secondly can we rethink the idea that government’s actions are completely down to fear, incompetence and hole digging, there is too much emerging evidence to challenge this imho. The comment by BobT about monetary bribes by the IMF for lockdowns to be maintained similarly that Belarus was offered 750 million to impose a lockdown, but refused – these examples alone should prompt questions besides the many examples highlighted in comments and links on this sight.
I am still astounded by the limited scale of negative press coverage on Melbourne. Remember Hong Kong demos and the umbrellas, about 4 years ago, wall to wall media coverage for weeks, and now this, in a supposed established democracy, and it is almost background noise in msm. Not sure about the BBC, as it is banned in our household, by majority consent of course.

129682 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Nsklent, 5, #179 of 1675 🔗

I’m going to start learning Swedish.

130938 ▶▶ patric, replying to Nsklent, #180 of 1675 🔗

Why aren’t Amnesty International and the Red Cross going against Kim Jong Dan? I’m starting to fear that all these organisations have decided that human rights only matter when the person abusing them is someone that The Guardian doesn’t like.

129550 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 17, #181 of 1675 🔗

As previously posted, the teenagers at The College have decided that both face nappies and social distancing are uncool so I’d like to know what the Police are going to do about it as 2k of them arrive to go into any of a dozen nearby buildings.

They arrive by bus, from two train stations or on foot from all directions so, unlike going into a Nite Spot or football ground, they cannot but avoid crossing paths en mass.

Most will be more interested in chatting with their friends than worrying about more stupid lockdown rules.

Same will occur as they move between buildings when they change classes, lunchtime when they swarm s local park* and local takeaways/sandwich bars and once against Hometime (not a word I’ve used in some decades).

See some soppy Covid Marshal shouting
“Come on boys and girls, groups no longer than six . . .:

*said park was a burial ground for a proper epidemic of Cholera 19C but not alit of people know that.

129557 ▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 19, #182 of 1675 🔗

Three loud cheers for the college kids.
From someone plenty old enough to be their grannie.

129604 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to karenovirus, 10, #183 of 1675 🔗

Drove past a load of teenagers crammed together waiting for the bus this morning. Out of a huge group only a couple of oddballs wearing masks. Very nice to see!

Then popped into Tesco Express to find I was the only unmuzzled shopper… brought back down to Earth with a crash!

129746 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 5, #184 of 1675 🔗

I made a point of being near The College 08.45.
It was as though the Rule of 6 ‘law’ had not come into force this morning. The students behaved exactly the same as last week. Perhaps 1 in a hundred wore a mask, not cold shouldered by their peers but comfortable within groups, perhaps they are now the brave ones. More likely they have a condition that makes wearing advisable and their friends accept that.

I avoid the convenience store near The Collegel as it’s always full of bloody students but I pulled up over the road to observe.
As each of 8 or 9 went into the shop they put on their mask as they waited in the queue then whipped it off before reaching the exit threshold and slipping it into their back pocket.

They do not want to be seen on the streets in a mask and, of course, they were pushing and shoving each other as they passed through the door, as teenagers do.

129647 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to karenovirus, 2, #185 of 1675 🔗

Great. Which college, Karen ? Would like to congratulate them somehow, if poss.

129758 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JohnB, #186 of 1675 🔗

Probably the same at one near you

130741 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to karenovirus, 1, #187 of 1675 🔗

The university near me is the opposite. Masks everywhere. I have yet to see an unmasked student near it and I go to their bus station every day.

130978 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to ConstantBees, #188 of 1675 🔗

I have explained this in an earlier post. College students arrive in life-long friendship groups so they can rely on backup in the event of confrontation.

Uni students will arrive as singletons having spent 6 months cooped up far away at home. Conformity may appear the sensible option.

129551 richard riewer, replying to richard riewer, 11, #189 of 1675 🔗

Public Health Zealots are a menace to the health of human society.

130006 ▶▶ Basics, replying to richard riewer, 1, #190 of 1675 🔗

You are getting it! Public Health is the new force of our times being used to shape our future. Matters and extinction are mere pups compated to the intended social change intended to be brought down upon us via Public Health. Years in the seeding of the profession.

129563 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 1, #191 of 1675 🔗

Does anyone have a copy of the welsh government’s previous advice on mask wearing that stated that the scientific evidence for their use is weak? I foolishly did not save a copy and low and behold today when they mandate them this paragraph seems to have been removed from their guidelines.

129566 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 19, #193 of 1675 🔗

Matt Hancock seems particularly impressed with anything that destroys our freedom.

The peculiar Covid logic where the Virus carries a clock and a tape measure and will not infect anyone in a pub before 10pm, but will swoop once the clock strikes 10.

The virus has also mutated into something that only strike people if they are in groups of 7 or more, but only if they know each other. In England it counts children in these groups, in Scotland and Wales is spares the child.

129598 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 8, #194 of 1675 🔗

It also spares people at work in groups of 7 or more, coroni respects work ethic and understands that people have bills to pay. It really doesn’t like shoppers but is a big Sunday league football fan.

130350 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 2, #195 of 1675 🔗

Hancock is a Dolt.

129629 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 3, #196 of 1675 🔗

Is it because the virus appears to be smarter than dear old Matt?

Must be humiliating for him.

129651 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to mhcp, 9, #197 of 1675 🔗

One is a piece of half-alive organic detritus, with no known thinking apparatus. The other is (allegedly) a virus.

129788 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to mhcp, 3, #198 of 1675 🔗

You’re average brick wall is smarter than Hancock. Talking of brick walls…

129712 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 4, #199 of 1675 🔗

The group of six rule seems a bit like an attempt at a neutron bomb – make it look like you are doing something without affecting the economy. Of course we know it will affect the economy as far as hospitality goes (less people will go to the pub), but prohibiting private socialising is economy-neutral and all it does is push us further towards a situation where people’s interactions are all in regulated, organised contexts where there is the opportunity for more state intervention and control – a bit like how the Nazis forced civil organisations to sign up to their agenda.

130676 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Julian, 2, #200 of 1675 🔗

Back in the day politicians told us that the Neutron bomb was more humane because it only killed people.

130939 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to richard riewer, #201 of 1675 🔗

Wasn’t that one of those huge cold war projects that absorbed masses of tax money but never achieved a result? Like lockdown I suppose, only less destructive to private enterprise.

129768 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 3, #202 of 1675 🔗

Had that conversation with three people this morning, how the Covid sneaks out at 10pm to get us, caused a few giggles.
Authoritarian regimes that make themselves the butt of jokes never do well.

130679 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to karenovirus, 1, #203 of 1675 🔗

Like Dracula.

129567 John Ballard, 3, #204 of 1675 🔗

Fantastic article. My daily dose of sanity, thank you.

129569 SweetBabyCheeses, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, 4, #205 of 1675 🔗

The Omnibus Party… really like that, and all of Hugh’s reasoning.

129645 ▶▶ Tone, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, 1, #206 of 1675 🔗

Absolutely, pragmatism and a reversal from the current ‘clusterfuck’, I’m in…….

129918 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, #207 of 1675 🔗

Just don’t put £300k to the NHS on the side of it.

129570 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 19, #208 of 1675 🔗


“Health chiefs have warned GPs that failure to offer appointments in person is a “breach of contract” and may heap pressure on Accident and Emergency departments.”

Is the tide beginning to turn?

129620 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Charlie Blue, 20, #209 of 1675 🔗

I was surprised at the widespread cowardice of GP’s

I once regarded them as the best people in our society

Life is full of disappointments

129632 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cecil B, 19, #210 of 1675 🔗

Look at that survey of 8,000 Doctors today, 63% do not think the backlog of care is a priority. This to me is very concerning that two thirds of them basically are just happy for people to die.

130018 ▶▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to JohnB, 4, #211 of 1675 🔗

I think that is the Core problem with an NHS.
The GPs see themselves as dispensers of care to supplicants who beg for treatment, the GP may or may not give treatment if they feel like it.
This attitude problem does not exist in more effective health care systems such as Germany,Austria, Sweden, Switzerland, Japan etc etc.

Its observed behaviour, if you watch what they do, not say, but actually do, that tells you what most Drs think of the taxpaying public.

130367 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cecil B, 1, #212 of 1675 🔗

Gormless Prats.

130940 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to Cecil B, #213 of 1675 🔗

As they are on the “frontline”, and seeing firsthand that the virus is barely a threat to the young or healthy, this cowardice is even more shameful.

129571 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 14, #214 of 1675 🔗

Sir Desmond Swayne on talkRADIO right now. Unless I am missing others, he seems to be the only one right now holding the Health Sec’s feet to the fire.

129578 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to kh1485, 7, #215 of 1675 🔗

Roy Lilly is the guest is right now, and he’s just stated that “the absence of evidence doesn’t mean there isn’t any evidence”. I think I’ll just go back to bed and hope to wake up again to find I not living in an alternative, manufactured reality.

129586 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Charlie Blue, 12, #216 of 1675 🔗

Imagine that statement being made by a judge in a court of law.

129596 ▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to annie, 1, #217 of 1675 🔗

Quite, Annie. Though we don’t just have to imagine. We have endless examples of that card being played in repressive regimes around the world now and in history.

130177 ▶▶▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to annie, 2, #218 of 1675 🔗

… or even by Trump at a rally, debate, or something, against a Democrat!

130941 ▶▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Stringfellow Hawke, #219 of 1675 🔗

Both sides should be very careful what they wish for.

129612 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #220 of 1675 🔗

Yes, I heard him – switched the radio off.

129614 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Charlie Blue, 11, #221 of 1675 🔗

The saying is, “Absence of proof is not proof of absence”. Which is a truism.

“the absence of evidence doesn’t mean there isn’t any evidence”.

Yes it does you bloody fool

129621 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Cecil B, #222 of 1675 🔗

i dont have evidence that you are a tosser, but all the same you are a tosser

129689 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to mjr, #223 of 1675 🔗


129851 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Cecil B, 1, #224 of 1675 🔗

no…. not at all ,,, just expanding on your saying … and applicable to this Lilly guy referred to earlier ..

129644 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #225 of 1675 🔗

WTF??!! The absence of a large zit on your nose doesn’t mean you don’t actually have a large zit on your nose…

129662 ▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #226 of 1675 🔗

It’s a corruption of an old maxim – the absence of evidence isn’t evidence of absence. Although, of course, the correct quote wouldn’t really help in this instance.

130942 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Andrew Fish, #227 of 1675 🔗

“absence of evidence isn’t evidence of absence”, although if you’ve been looking PROPERLY for the evidence and not found it then it certainly hints at absence.

129901 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Charlie Blue, #228 of 1675 🔗

Who?! pea brain

129917 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #229 of 1675 🔗

Wonder how that would hold up in court if the police started arresting people on that basis.

130943 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Nobody2020, #230 of 1675 🔗

Taken as true by the same kind of so-called “independent” member of the judiciary who threw out Dolan’s first attempt at a case.

129969 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Charlie Blue, #231 of 1675 🔗

Tariq Ali (?) Said just that in Tom Hollands* excellent documentary exploring the lack of historical evidence surrounding the birth of Islam.

* the historian not the singer.

129577 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 9, #232 of 1675 🔗

BBC 07.30 R2 News

BMA survey of X,000 doctors”, 87% of them expect Second Wave sometime in the next 6 months.:
I try to avoid saying “you couldn’t make it up.”

129581 ▶▶ matt, replying to karenovirus, 9, #233 of 1675 🔗

“6 months” is depressing. Realistically, if there were going to be a second wave, it would be in the autumn, that being the seasonality of coronaviruses. 6 months implies that if it doesn’t happen in the autumn, we’ll just have to remain oppressed through the early spring, just in case.

129591 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to matt, 5, #234 of 1675 🔗

They’ve been expecting it for the last six months as well.
The Second Coming us postponed.

130944 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to annie, #235 of 1675 🔗

I hadn’t thought of that analogy, Neil Ferguson as the head of an apocalyptic cult. The zealots have been so obsessed with a second wave, even before the first began, every time their predictions are ludicrously wrong they say “oh it’ll be here soon”.

129714 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to matt, 3, #236 of 1675 🔗

And then another 6 months after that. Once you’ve started lying and no-one is noticing, you just carry on.

129977 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to matt, 1, #237 of 1675 🔗

It means that 6 months is the minimum they think they can keep this charade going.

130793 ▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to karenovirus, 1, #238 of 1675 🔗

They are looking to extend it by two years. Tell your MP to stop them.

129584 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to karenovirus, 4, #239 of 1675 🔗

It depends what they mean by a second wave. Waves come in all sizes. Ask a surfer!

130377 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Steeve, 1, #240 of 1675 🔗
129589 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to karenovirus, 6, #241 of 1675 🔗

In areas like North Devon where I live there has been so little Covid19 that we have not really had a first wave which is why much of the local population believe we will get our first wave this autumn.

129942 ▶▶▶ Mayo, replying to Steve Martindale, -8, #242 of 1675 🔗

Precsiely. There’s a load of mush being spouted by the likes of Professor Sunetra Gupta who claim we have achieved or are near to achieving Herd Immunity. We aren’t. There are still large swathes of the country that have had little exposure.

130029 ▶▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Mayo, 4, #243 of 1675 🔗

Either that or most of the country had T cell immunity to start with, 30% got an asymptomatic infection and the remainder got a wee sniffle they barely noticed.

130048 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mayo, replying to Nessimmersion, -8, #244 of 1675 🔗

Oh I see. By a remarkable coincidence everyone in Devon had T Cell immunity.

Err … No I don’t think so. In any case actual SYMPTOMATIC cases are increasing rapidly according to the Covid Symptom study. Numbers are up from 18k on Aug 25th to 45k on Sep 12th. (+150%)

130948 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Mayo, #245 of 1675 🔗

Are you sure those are symptomatic COVID cases, or just symptom reports of ordinary winter cold and flu starting to emerge in autumn?

130197 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Mayo, 2, #246 of 1675 🔗

The virus has spread from John o Groats to lands end i think it’s safe to say it’s been thru the entire country

130392 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Biker, #247 of 1675 🔗

And every whisky distillery as well.

130946 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Mayo, #248 of 1675 🔗

We’re pretty sure that 15%, perhaps a LOT more, have had covid. Depends which model of herd immunity you think is most plasuible, but some say it can take hold between 10 and 20%, by recognising that unlike vaccine induced herd immunity (scattered at random in the population) naturally induced immunity fills up the kinds of interpersonal paths in the social web that the virus would try to follow. Or if some of the “epidemiological dark matter” hypotheses hold, which rely on a fair proportion of the population being non-infectable (we know that previous exposure to some coronaviruses can induce this for some people for a reasonable length of time), the herd immunity threshold is also well below the very high 60 or so % which crude models assume. I couldn’t say with certainty either way whether we’re at herd immunity yet, but the fact that, with all the mingling over summer, deaths and hospital admissions haven’t risen certainly implies we are heading in that direction (rising cases can be largely discounted as testing capacity keeps shoooting up and as deaths occur as a proportion of infected cases the fact we’re seeing so few means that the number being infected now must be much lower than in spring, we just weren’t testing much back then).

129606 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to karenovirus, 1, #249 of 1675 🔗

The survey was for 8000 doctors (no indication of grade of doctor, could be FY1 or FY2 newly qualified) AND medical students.

129984 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to p02099003, #250 of 1675 🔗

Yes, posted in haste on the move, they did say it included medical students who are bedwetters in normal times due to the nature of their studies.

129775 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to karenovirus, 12, #251 of 1675 🔗

Shocking!!! Sadly most doctors are clueless about health.

  • They should know that your immune system protect you but they don’t
  • They should know that improving your immune system is super important but they don’t
  • They should know that exposure to to other people help us build our immune systems but they don’t
  • They should know that nutrient levels are important to improve your immune system but they don’t
  • They should know that optimal vitamin D levels is super important to keep people healthy and to protect people from suffering the cytokine storm but they don’t
  • etc
130380 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Victoria, 1, #252 of 1675 🔗

Why don’t they know that? Isn’t it part of their medical education?

130752 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Victoria, 1, #253 of 1675 🔗

These are the same people who learned that a low fat diet was healthy. It’s not.

130808 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Victoria, 2, #254 of 1675 🔗

Two or three years ago, when my local GP surgery was working as it should, I was advised my vitamin D level was low, was prescribed a strong booster and then recommended to take daily over-the counter supplement. I wasn’t very diligent, just taking supplements sporadically in winter. Figured I got quite a bit from sunshine most of the year.

130950 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to Victoria, #255 of 1675 🔗

One once tried to give me antibiotics for a viral infection.

129587 Jane Chapman, 3, #256 of 1675 🔗

Just to let you know that funerals are exempt from the six business. I know as I’m going to attend one this week and there are more than six.

129590 Moomin, replying to Moomin, #257 of 1675 🔗

Just posting this again:
Does anyone have a copy of the welsh government’s previous advice on mask wearing that stated that the scientific evidence for their use is weak? I foolishly did not save a copy and low and behold today when they mandate them this paragraph seems to have been removed from their guidelines.

129613 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to JohnB, #259 of 1675 🔗

Thanks skipper! I can’t seem to open the page though!

129616 ▶▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to Moomin, #260 of 1675 🔗

Odd, it opened for me.

129624 ▶▶▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to Basileus, #261 of 1675 🔗

Yeah, it’s odd. It won’t open on my phone or my computer!

129627 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Moomin, 1, #262 of 1675 🔗

Works on eveything I’m using. Maybe Drakeford is blocking you!

129619 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Moomin, 1, #263 of 1675 🔗

At the present time, the widespread use of masks by healthy people in the community is not supported by high quality scientific evidence. Social distancing and hygiene measures remain the most effective measures for reducing transmission of COVID-19.

Pretty much sums it up then again if you convince everybody that they are a walking infection they will only be too pleased to comply.

129625 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to stefarm, 1, #264 of 1675 🔗

Thanks Stefarm. This is the bit that I needed. They’ve removed this now!

129663 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Moomin, #265 of 1675 🔗

Have they really? wow.

129718 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to stefarm, 3, #266 of 1675 🔗

Distancing is pretty much out of the window most places I go. Masks make people complacent.

129702 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Moomin, 2, #267 of 1675 🔗

What is the science behind this advice?

At the present time, the widespread use of masks by healthy people in the community is not supported by high quality scientific evidence. Social distancing and hygiene measures remain the most effective measures for reducing transmission of COVID-19.

The WHO is recommending, though, that as part of the wider range of measures to prevent transmission, three-layer face coverings should be encouraged in situations where social distancing and hygiene measures are difficult to maintain.

There is evidence to suggest that the wearing of face coverings gives people a false sense of security which makes them less careful about social distancing and handwashing. We know that these measures are the most effective way to reduce transmission of the virus, and don’t want to do anything that might lead to a reduction of those measures being observed.

129593 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 8, #268 of 1675 🔗

Daily Mail: Dr JOHN LEE says coronavirus lockdown could cause more long-term harm than the illness itself.

130393 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Tom Blackburn, 3, #269 of 1675 🔗

I think he said much the same in April 2020. On Delingpole, Richie Allen. Maybe both. Prescient. Ahead of his time. Shunned and ignored by most other media outlets.

129599 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 21, #270 of 1675 🔗

The BMA survey predicting a a second wave also has a quite damning statistics which is when polled only 37% of Doctors believe that the “Prioritisation of patients waiting for care and clearing the backlog” is the top priority over the next year.

So 63% of Doctors don’t really give a toss about treating those with cancer, operations and other treatment.

129815 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnB, 3, #271 of 1675 🔗

It it bred into them at doctor training factory or do all humans have those same feelings of who-gives-a-****-not-me-guv-as-long-as-I-live-in-luxury-95%-of-the-world’s-population-can-only-dream-about-I’m-all-right-jack?

130003 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Basics, 2, #272 of 1675 🔗

All the polls that involved them being safer and better protected were all 60% in their favour, so look after themselves rather than those who they should be caring for.

130789 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Basics, 2, #273 of 1675 🔗

Rockefeller bought the medical departments of universities, banished natural medicine and replaced it with expensive oil-based treatments that never cure anything. Doctors just work to mental check lists – symptom S use drug D.

129993 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JohnB, #274 of 1675 🔗

It’s my view that waiting lists have been cancelled because newly diagnosed patients are getting hospital appointments almost immediately.

129601 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 3, #275 of 1675 🔗

The lead “Round-up” link above is:-

>>>“ Millions at greatest risk from coronavirus may be told to stay at home again ” – Government prepares to advise the vulnerable to stay at home for the entire winter and not see anyone.<<<

But ’tis behind a paywall.

What I’d like to know is:- Is this going to be an extra restriction? – or is the plan to impose this restriction and lift all others? (masks, social distancing and “rule of six” etc.)

I’ve used the words “impose” and “restriction”. Above the words “told” and “advise” have been used which aren’t compatible. Which is it to be? Does anyone know? Indeed do they know? (whoever be they).

129605 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Ned of the Hills, 5, #276 of 1675 🔗

I’m sure ‘they’ haven’t a clue. The article states that there will not be blanket advice for an age group, but those most seriously at risk (whatever that means) due to multiple vulnerabilities, amongst which age might be one, will be written to with advice about protecting themselves. At the moment the language is not suggesting imposition or enforcement.

I imagine that it will be in addition to other measures. After all more is always better isn’t it? We can’t have people feeling hopeful or expecting proportionality and fairness-where would that end?

129650 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Charlie Blue, 8, #277 of 1675 🔗

Much thanks for that reply.

I’m in my seventies. I haven’t made any sacrifices in the ‘battle’ against the virus. Many would see me as supporting the enemy. I enter shops and ride on busses without a mask, insist on walking down the high street the way I want, and when in Ireland I didn’t “caccoon” at all, at all, as they called it over there.

But, as an oldie as a ‘vulnerable’ I’d accept the government insisting on such as myself becoming hermits for three months (save for getting out on my push bike and going for a plod) so herd immunity can develop – and not seeing anyone – making sure we never got within 20 yards of anyone – and never entering another building but where we lived – and putting up with getting the wrong supply of vittles – IF, as a quid pro quo, the government scrapped all other restrictions!

But the government’s not going to do that is it?

129693 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 8, #278 of 1675 🔗

No. I’m a mere 54. And no matter what, I’m not accepting any more restrictions, ever.

129762 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #279 of 1675 🔗

Hello Nick and Julian,

Thank you for your responses

I suppose I just feel guilty that I’ve not in any way made any sacrifices – though I’ve had plenty imposed on me.

The essential words in what I’ve written above are “ quid pro quo”.

But this is not an offer that the government is going to make or seek. We’re just going to keep buggering on until the government decides to tell everyone to look to their own defences – much as the Romans told the Britons in 410 was it? Oh, for such a government now!

130778 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Ned of the Hills, #280 of 1675 🔗

Only after the vaccine has been injected into everyone (but themselves).

129722 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Ned of the Hills, 5, #281 of 1675 🔗

It’s very noble of you, but I don’t see why you should accept any restrictions. It should be up to the individual. Otherwise why not make smoking, drinking, overeating, etc, illegal?

Last time it was just guidance, though often framed as if it was law by government and media, quite deliberately I am sure.

130754 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #282 of 1675 🔗

I believe Lord Sumption said that under the law they are basing their authority upon they do not have the power to force healthy people to quarantine. Or perhaps I misunderstood.

129603 Norma Kershner, replying to Norma Kershner, 2, #283 of 1675 🔗

This is going to be a never ending story for sure 😷

129802 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Norma Kershner, 3, #284 of 1675 🔗

Until we win yes.

129609 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 18, #285 of 1675 🔗

Hitler could not deal with bad news from his generals, so they stopped telling him

That was fine in 39,40,41 and most of 42

Even as the Soviets were at the gates of Berlin his generals were showing him on maps that they could move this division or that division here or there

In reality the troops had left the battlefield

The ‘generals’ and their underling will be monitoring this site and sites like it. They will know the game is up and it’s only a matter of time. They are still at the ‘just following orders stage’

I’m reminded of the downfall of Ceausescu . There he was on the balcony, the crowd were clapping and cheering. In a moment they started booing. It was the moment Ceausescu’s delusions came face to face with reality


This dictators introduction to reality will come soon enough

129630 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Cecil B, #286 of 1675 🔗

I was told once that Adolf shot a high proportion of his generals. I don’t know if that is true.

129685 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #287 of 1675 🔗

Some of them, especially after the July Plot of 1944, when Adolf lost the plot.

130104 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Nick Rose, #288 of 1675 🔗

Except for Rommel who was too popular, he got given the suicide option and his family got to keep their estate, better option than the meat hook that most got.
Can’t see a Rommel in johnsons mob.

129653 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cecil B, #289 of 1675 🔗

What happened next to Ceausescu, Cecil ?

129672 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to JohnB, 4, #290 of 1675 🔗

Not sure, think he was given a life peerage, and a couple of directorships

129707 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Cecil B, 3, #291 of 1675 🔗

Meh. You were meant to describe his sticky end, and I would have replied “Yes I know, I just like hearing it repeated”. 🙂

129687 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Cecil B, #292 of 1675 🔗

Bags first go with the AK-47.

129822 ▶▶ Marie R, replying to Cecil B, 1, #293 of 1675 🔗

I’ve been fantasising about turning up at a “photo opportunity ” (fat chance!) of bozo or whoever and starting the booing

130070 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Marie R, #294 of 1675 🔗

You need to get out more……Ooooops sorry your not allowed out

130730 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Cecil B, 1, #295 of 1675 🔗

How will we get back all the wealth that has been stolen since this fraud began?

129615 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 12, #296 of 1675 🔗

BBC R4 News 08.00.
Chair of National Police (?) Council Martin Hewitt twice avoided the question ” should members of the public phone the police if they see people breaking the new rules”.
He did suggest that mops talk to rule breakers and that all people should “take responsibility “. Not quite as bad as Dicks call to shame the maskless.

Followed by a good interview with Lord Sumption who again advocated people taking responsibility but in terms of making their own decisions about self isolating.
Q. “Would you advocate people breaking the new laws ?”
LS ” I would advise them to regard the new laws as being of seconddary importance. “.

129618 ▶▶ TJN, replying to karenovirus, 12, #297 of 1675 🔗

Excellent interview (Lord Sumption that is). A shining light of common sense in the darkness. I was going to post this but you beat me to it.

130115 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to TJN, #298 of 1675 🔗

sorry TJN, you could have expanded on my post, he said a great deal more but I was in a hurry and

130187 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to karenovirus, #299 of 1675 🔗

Probably not so much a hurry as I was!

129683 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to karenovirus, 14, #300 of 1675 🔗

Sumption has long said that when a law is folly, it’s the citizens’ moral duty to ignore it.

130952 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to Nick Rose, #301 of 1675 🔗

He should be given back his old job, then preside over Dolan’s case, and after that preside over Johnson and Hancock’s trial for crimes against humanity.

129705 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to karenovirus, 6, #302 of 1675 🔗

I’m not going to be told how to behave by some fucking mop ! 🙂

129800 ▶▶ Basics, replying to karenovirus, 1, #303 of 1675 🔗

The National Police Chiefs Council

130162 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basics, #304 of 1675 🔗

Soz, was posting ‘live’ at the time.

129622 Phil Carsley, 11, #305 of 1675 🔗

I have been taking part in a discussion on LinkedIn for a month now and have vigorously stated my belief that masks are useless and the whole Covid response is a gross overreaction. I’ve face crude personal insults, accusations and threats from other subscribers. I’ve not faced any sanctions from LinkedIn (yet) but it had crossed my mind that I could, if it happened I would not be surprised.

129626 Simon Henderson, 20, #306 of 1675 🔗

I had to deal with a self appointed Gauleiter and the jobsworth steward, getting a flight to Croatia Recently. While queuing for the bag drop, one of the types that seem to think mountaineering attire is perfect for an airport, accosted me and my wife, for the heinous crime of being sans muzzle. Shouting across, she demanded we put masks on.
I asked her when was she voted in as my governor? I told her I must have missed that vote, but as an asthmatic, I don’t have to wear one. With a flourish I waved my inhaler in her direction. She saw my wife was wearing an exemption badge, so moved on to others in the line.
Then, on boarding the plane, jobsworth was primed and ready to go as soon as I walked on. I waved my inhaler at him as he demanded I wear a mask. He then insisted I show him a letter from my doctor. I now know this to be rubbish, but didn’t then. After a heated debate, Mr Pilot got involved, so I could see my holiday disappearing.
I conformed until in the air, then pulled it beneath my chin.
on the flight home I took the precautions of taking two tubes of Pringles and a bottle of water.
They’ll be the first thing in my travel bag from now on.

129640 Nick Rose, 1, #307 of 1675 🔗

The Government consultation on the vaccine is to be found here:


129642 crimsonpirate, replying to crimsonpirate, 9, #308 of 1675 🔗

SAGE scientist Professor Sir Mark Walport warns that the UK is “on the edge of losing control”…..of the narrative.

129795 ▶▶ Basics, replying to crimsonpirate, #309 of 1675 🔗

Any link please?

130204 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to crimsonpirate, #310 of 1675 🔗

Tha nice Mr Gove denied that only yesterday, cuh!

130385 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to crimsonpirate, #311 of 1675 🔗

Sir Stir the Pot Mark Walport.

129643 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 38, #312 of 1675 🔗

It’s started. Apparently, there is a Facebook page debate about my shop (just been told by a customer). People complaining about our mask/hand gel stance and calling for us to be reported to the police. Though the mother of one of my Saturday staff defending us.

I effing hate this world.

129646 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 12, #313 of 1675 🔗

Sorry to hear. Speaking for myself, I’m very close to considering alternative methods of protest. I’ve had enough too.
Edit: Conducting sorry, not considering. Done the considering part.

129652 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #314 of 1675 🔗

Thanks. Something really needs to happen and soon.

129656 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 11, #315 of 1675 🔗

Rallies at 12 noon, Trafalgar Square Sat 19th and Sat 26th September. I’ll be thinking of small businesses strangled by this nonsense at both. The first is disaffected medical people, but the second will hopefully build on the last rally on the 29th August

129661 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Nick Rose, 9, #316 of 1675 🔗

Wish I could go but am at work (that’s if I still have a business left by then). These keyboard warriors are real brave- they don’t have the guts to say what they are saying online to my face.

129671 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 11, #317 of 1675 🔗

It’s always the way I’m afraid. They’re like the lesser-status dogs, standing behind the alphas and growling, ready to turn tail and flee if it all goes wrong.

Don’t worry about having to work, that’s the reason I go, lol. I don’t work Saturdays! So I’ll be standing there for you, and others who cannot attend.

129684 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #318 of 1675 🔗

Thank you.

129777 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to kh1485, 5, #319 of 1675 🔗

Only a suggestion but can you invite people not to patronise your café? Point out to them it’s their choice and it’s your choice – if those are not compatible then there’s no sense in being a customer.

I know the reality is the bored human specimens want to cause trouble regardless, you won’t change them but you can achieve moral high ground.

Such businesses around here are quick to get in the local paper – perhaps you can take your business public to draw their venom.

130282 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Basics, 2, #320 of 1675 🔗

Essentially, with our notices, that’s what we were trying to do: if you value being treated as a human being, come in. Or, if you are terrified, best go where they are togged up to the gunwales in PPE.

130568 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Nick Rose, #321 of 1675 🔗

In our family, they’re called the Number 2s and NR, you’re so right they’ll absolutely switch sides without a second glance.

130953 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Alison9, #322 of 1675 🔗

What was being said about eastasia? Who put up those traitorous posters?

129657 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 22, #323 of 1675 🔗

How strange this world has become. You are being castigated because of your compassionate view to those who don’t wear face masks, yet a shop who are meant to be ethical close to me kick out disabled children and their parents for not wearing masks and are lauded on Facebook for their actions!

Society has gone completely crazy!

129660 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to JohnB, 9, #324 of 1675 🔗

Just evil. We need a clearout.

129696 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 1, #325 of 1675 🔗

Which shop, skipper ?

129711 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 6, #326 of 1675 🔗

The business is called Sankara Imports. I’ll try and find the Facebook post and post it. They kicked out a young autistic boy about 7 years old and his mum because the boy wouldn’t wear a facemask.

129716 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, 3, #327 of 1675 🔗

Ta. Hope they go bust. Though they are quite possibly a front for opiate smuggling anyhow. 🙂

129728 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to JohnB, 2, #328 of 1675 🔗

Ha! Just looked them up. Get this for hypocrisy! “Sankara Imports: Ethical and Fair Trade Imports with a Heart.”

You really cannot make this shit up.


129765 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #329 of 1675 🔗

Yep – hypocrisy oozing out of their website.

Another one to boycott

129820 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #330 of 1675 🔗

what a load of woke tossers.. And what about the cultural appropriation .. ripping off people in India and Nepal to flog tat at inflated prices to gullible people..
I bet they are anti brexit, pro immigration, support XR and take the knee at any opportunity
Quote from the site “ we are happy to be doing our part to slow the impact of this pandemic”

129997 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to mjr, 1, #331 of 1675 🔗

I’d like to think they won’t last that long but then again they seem to have majority support on Facebook.

130386 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Nick Rose, #332 of 1675 🔗

Thrust a dagger in their heart.

129887 ▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to JohnB, #333 of 1675 🔗

conversation is on 4th August so scroll down the comments

129982 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to mjr, 4, #334 of 1675 🔗

What lovely people they must be to want to mask anyone over 5 years old!

129658 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to kh1485, 11, #335 of 1675 🔗

How will these people feel when when the science reveals they been taken for fools and you were right all along? I think there a strong chance of that happening.

A lot of people bought in to Blair’s WMD threat not that long ago. Those that did probably forgot they did. With this Covid scare a lot of people are going to find it very hard to forget they bought in to it.

P.s. – there is no obligation on you to enforce the law on face masks (if it is the law). If you are reported to the police they’ll doubtless not want to know.

129664 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Ned of the Hills, 5, #336 of 1675 🔗

You know what, I don’t think they will even care.

129703 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 8, #337 of 1675 🔗

I’ll be reminding some people every day of their lives – selfies in masks, clapping outside our house, asking for my name in the pub. Wankers.

129733 ▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to kh1485, 6, #338 of 1675 🔗

Janet Daley nailed it in the Sunday Telegraph, as per usual, everyone knows this whole business is a load of bollocks but are still, sort of, going along with it for a quiet life although they aren’t actually obeying any of the stupid, unenforceable rules.

129665 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 13, #339 of 1675 🔗

I was one who bought into the WMD threat. Who bought into the Iraq War. I’m not proud of it. Events almost immediately after the invasion, the “missing” (ie non existent) WMD, proved I was wrong.

The important life lesson I learned is to NEVER believe what the government says without corroborating evidence or, even better, conclusive proof.

129674 ▶▶▶▶ Fed up, replying to Nick Rose, 9, #340 of 1675 🔗

I learnt that lesson as well, only bloody well forgot it hence meekly locked myself and my family into my home and allowed my 80 year old mother to be isolated for 6 weeks. The time it took for the bloody penny to drop. Kicking myself.

129677 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Fed up, 7, #341 of 1675 🔗

But the penny did drop :o)) Welcome aboard!

129680 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Fed up, replying to Nick Rose, 8, #342 of 1675 🔗

Yes but I want those weeks and my claps for our NHS heroes back.

129732 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Fed up, 1, #343 of 1675 🔗

“If Time is a dimension, for us it is only one way,” he replied philosophically.

129790 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Fed up, 4, #344 of 1675 🔗

It’s a rich tapestry. This is one thread. Thanks for sharing your regret. It was a multi-£million/billion propaganda machine that kicked in without a starting pistol being fired. Give yourself a break. Perhaps the process of realisation proves you rightly question everything in due time.

129670 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Ned of the Hills, 5, #345 of 1675 🔗

There was never any good scientific evidence to support the government. The science has always been saying we have been taken for fools yet here we are. No amount of reason is going to change their minds – what they need is an end to the brainwashing and therapy to recover some sanity.

129688 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to kh1485, 12, #346 of 1675 🔗

Just found a review mentioning my mask and gel sign (which clearly explains my allergy) and he has said “Avoid like the plague” What a twat (s’cuse language but very, very, very angry right now).

129818 ▶▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to kh1485, 6, #347 of 1675 🔗

Just produce your risk assessment that shows that masks put on and taken off leave all manner of unknown germs all over the place. Your risk assessment will also, of course, include links to studies that have shown masks to be ineffective (there are no studies which prove them to be effective, so no need to link to any of those), and it will also include the fact that the WHO considers masks to be pointless, and that their ‘official’ advice was changed only after political lobbying. No idea where you are, but I’d happily come every day for coffee and a bun.

129947 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to kh1485, 3, #348 of 1675 🔗

As usual, Laworfiction has good stuff. Further to Suey’s good comment about risk assessments:

It is essential to appreciate that the health and safety assessment required is not of the risk of transmission of the Covid-19 virus. The assessment required is of the risk of significant danger. Those are fundamentally different issues.
For illustration, risk of transmission of a common cold or flu virus may be high, but the risk of significant danger to the staff is extremely small.

129691 ▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 9, #349 of 1675 🔗

I expect you’ll be getting more custom now. As long as you are just on the right side of the law, with all its exemptions, you’ll do just fine.

129723 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to TJN, 2, #350 of 1675 🔗

Most of our customers are middle-aged to elderly – the types who don’t really do social media. But what concerns me is that I am now going to be labelled some sort of ‘granny killer’.

129731 ▶▶▶▶ David, replying to kh1485, #351 of 1675 🔗

Have any grannies actually died?

129738 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to David, 5, #352 of 1675 🔗

Er …. not that I know of. But truth and facts don’t come into it.

129750 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 2, #353 of 1675 🔗

They will eventually.


129749 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 8, #354 of 1675 🔗

I feel for you, but hang on in there. Guts and perseverance mean that you’ll eventually gain the respect of your local area, especially when this fraud is exposed for what it is.

And remember, it wasn’t any of us who pushed covid patients into care homes, or forced DNR certificated on them, or abandoned those with non-covid diseases to their fate – including pain, suffering and death. Or God knows how many people, especially children, in the Third World to starving. One day the hypocrisy of these people will out.

129861 ▶▶▶▶▶ James Bertram, replying to TJN, 3, #355 of 1675 🔗

Well said, TJN. Sums it up for me. And it takes courage to go against the crowd – but it is our moral responsibility to do so. This is why I love this site – so many courageous people making a contribution where they can.

130230 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to TJN, 12, #356 of 1675 🔗

A nearby garden centre refused to close during lockdown despite the Council threatening to prosecute them and the police threatening to prosecute customers (neither of which happened since not proper laws). Also got a lot of negative social and national media attention.

They did a roaring trade throughout lockdown and continue to do so now

130466 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to karenovirus, 4, #357 of 1675 🔗

I love stories like that!

130388 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to TJN, #358 of 1675 🔗

They are punishing us for their mistakes. Weird.

130468 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to richard riewer, #359 of 1675 🔗

If that’s true, we’ve got a very hard time coming …

129743 ▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to TJN, 6, #360 of 1675 🔗

‘An unjust law is no law at all.’ St Augustine.

129698 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kh1485, 4, #361 of 1675 🔗

Sorry to hear this and like you I can see why Linus said that while he loved mankind its people he couldn’t stand.

129699 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to kh1485, 8, #362 of 1675 🔗

Thankyou for the stand you have been taking in your shop, as one who would be very grateful for shops near me managed with your sense.

Since it seems you have been breaking no law, you are unlikely to face real difficulties. But I wonder if it’s time to consider a Sceptics’ Union, by analogy with the Free Speech Union, capable of providing more material solidarity should any of us be singled out.

129721 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to kh1485, 8, #363 of 1675 🔗

Suggest you post something that would come from a government propaganda wonk

“I would like this opportunely to clear up a misunderstanding that appears to be circulating on social media.

Here at (insert name of business) the safety of our customers is our number one priority.

Our policy has always been ‘people before profits’.

I would like to reassure customers that at all times we comply with the the letter and spirit of the corona virus regulations

We apologise for any distress that the information circulating has caused to our customers”

Then just carry on and do as you want

(Do what the government does, only ever apologise for something you are not responsible for)

129776 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to kh1485, 18, #364 of 1675 🔗

Thanks everyone for your support. A lot of the posters are breaking the group’s t&cs and we have fired a warning shot across the bow to one poster. To add insult to injury the BID chairwoman has just stuck her oar in to say that people are “concerned” about our signs and that they had a right to express that concern. I told her exactly what I thought in forthright and no uncertain terms.

Again, thanks. Without this website, I would have gone under.

129834 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 4, #365 of 1675 🔗

Sceptic of the week! Well done.

Piers Corbyn and that man on the Liverpool train watch out. Someone’s after your mantle!

I admire you, I really do. It takes guts and character to do what you are doing.

And you could always let Peter H. know again.

130010 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to kh1485, 4, #366 of 1675 🔗

Ah,the BID bitch,I knew she would have to get involved !,I hope you gave her both barrels and some !,god forbid that the chairwoman of business improvement might actually stand up for a business !.
Stick with it Kh,you are an absolute hero for keeping your business going with compassion and sanity whilst all around you are evil people trying to bring you down,I am certain that the overwhelming majority of your customers really appreciate all of your hard work and whilst most of us on here are too far away to be with you physically,we are all with you in spirit.

130024 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Paul, 11, #367 of 1675 🔗

Thanks Paul and for your comment further up/down. She has now started waltzing past my door (her office is upstairs from my shop), ostentatiously wearing her mask (doesn’t usually – what a child). Didn’t lose my temper with her but told her what a load of effing cowards these keyboard warriors are. Latest is that the moderator has stepped in and said that the comments should be removed because they could damage our business. Perhaps the little guy might prevail.

130031 ▶▶▶▶▶ Paul, replying to kh1485, 2, #368 of 1675 🔗

She really is a clown !.Glad to hear some common sense from a moderator for once.

130313 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 4, #369 of 1675 🔗

Have you reported the Facebook group to Facebook? If you haven’t then I definitely would, and I wouldn’t go easy on them either. I’d mention that the posts contain bullying, harrassment, threats, slander or defamation, and that Facebook by hosting the group is liable and that if the posts are not removed within 24 hours you will be taking legal action. I’d also make clear that you’ve had harassment in person as well due the posts in this group.

130480 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to JohnB, 2, #370 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for this skipper. The moderator removed the comments but if they reappear I will certainly do as you suggest.

129784 ▶▶ hat man, replying to kh1485, 2, #371 of 1675 🔗

Why are you bothering with Facebook? The trolls just want to get you ensnared in it, and break you.

129787 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to hat man, 6, #372 of 1675 🔗

I’m not, I hate the thing. It’s a grouping of the town and surrounding villages and one of my sceptic customers alerted me to what was going on.

129791 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to kh1485, 6, #373 of 1675 🔗

And the other thing is that when someone is appearing to libel you, you have to look into it.

129789 ▶▶ tonys, replying to kh1485, 3, #374 of 1675 🔗

How horrible, a friend has faced the same thing at the shop where she works, if it helps I reckon someone has a gripe about practically everywhere, certainly my experience of Facebook bears that out, the moaners are a tiny minority.

129908 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to kh1485, 7, #375 of 1675 🔗

These people should be reminded about what happened to collaborators in France after WW2. When sanity returns….

129936 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to kh1485, #376 of 1675 🔗

Are you breaking the law at all, KH? From memory, I don’t think you are – guidance maybe – but not law. In which case you are ok with the police, if they turn up. Snitchers are still twats, though.

130080 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #377 of 1675 🔗

Nope, it’s all guidance. We gave our staff the choice of wearing masks – they declined.

129967 ▶▶ Paul, replying to kh1485, 2, #378 of 1675 🔗

Bastards.Similar attacks on businesses and individuals regularly appear on a FB page in my town.The spite,vitriol and sometimes calls for violence or intense nazi style police action are unbelievable,a lot of these people are dangerously deranged.The moderator of the page must agree with the comments because even if I report them they are never removed.

130511 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Paul, 2, #379 of 1675 🔗

A guy in Sainsbury’s complained to a staff member about me not having a mask. The guy clearly had mental health issues. The Sainsbury’s guy defended me. He didn’t know there were exemptions. So, as directed by Cressida Dick, people with mental health issues and people ignorant of the law are essentially enforcing draconian laws on their neighbours.

130208 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to kh1485, 1, #380 of 1675 🔗

Stunning and brave, calling for somebody else to call the police.
Good luck kh1485

130374 ▶▶ annie, replying to kh1485, 1, #381 of 1675 🔗

This has to be illegal harassment, surely?

129648 SmokeandMirrors, replying to SmokeandMirrors, #382 of 1675 🔗

Does anyone have access to the number of tests carried out per day from March/April until now in France and Spain?
This info, for the UK at least, has a dramatic effect on the shape of the much-touted graphs and should demolish most of the current panic. It’s the ‘artefact of testing’ that has never been fully explained to the public.

129686 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to SmokeandMirrors, #383 of 1675 🔗

It’s the ‘artefact of testing’ that has never been fully explained to the public.”

yes – a point that has been made many many times already in here over the last months – so, in here, we are pretty much all on the same page on this one

129751 ▶▶ Jane in France, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 1, #384 of 1675 🔗

I don’t know about Spain, but in France they were doing several thousand tests a week in March-April, mainly on people who were already seriously ill in hospital whereas now in September they are doing over a million tests a week in the general population. Even santé publique, a bedwetting organisation if ever there was one, points out that in March-April the number of what would now be defined as “cases” was probably far higher than they realised because tests were not being systematically carried out. https://www.linternaute.com/actualite/guide-vie-quotidienne/2489651-carte-coronavirus-en-chiffres-cas-deces-bilan-du-dimanche-13-septembre-2020/ If you go down the page there are lots of graphs.

129666 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 9, #385 of 1675 🔗

In seven months not one successful prosecution in the courts for a breach of the corona virus regulations.

I’ll repeat it, not one

So why have the law if you are too scared to take anyone to court?

129675 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Cecil B, 12, #386 of 1675 🔗

The economy – our liberty, our livelihoods and everything worth living for is being systematically destroyed without taking anybody to court. The law is clearly serving its purpose regardless.

129742 ▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Cecil B, 9, #387 of 1675 🔗

Lord Sumption was useful on this. The edicts that the Government have been issuing have allegedly been done under the aegis of the Coronavirus Act. However, the act doesn’t actually give them that power, so it’s a massive bluff. There’s a Public Health Act (2004?) which does give them the power, but it requires each measure to be presented to Parliament within a week of being enacted. This is a reason why the Government keeps using the words “guidance” and “advice” because they know they are acting outside their authority and think that pretending they never mandated the restrictions will defend them in court. Simon Dolan experienced this over schools when they claimed the closures had merely been “advice” and were not mandatory.

129753 ▶▶▶ Cbird, replying to Andrew Fish, 3, #388 of 1675 🔗

I believe it’s the Civil Contingencies Act 2004

129759 ▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Cbird, 1, #389 of 1675 🔗

Happy to be corrected on the details, but I believe the basic point stands.

130266 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Andrew Fish, 1, #390 of 1675 🔗

They used the Public Health Act 1984 unlawfully because that was intended to allow local authorities to contain infected persons against their will* not take measures against the entire population or parts thereof.

The Civil Contingencies Act would have required weekly Parliamentary scrutiny which is why they didn’t want to use it.

*goggle ‘ typhoid mary ‘

129769 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Cbird, #391 of 1675 🔗

Correct but Andrew is correct to mention it, everything is a massive bluff hence why MSM is in on it.

A thought, under what legislation have other countries brought in their Corona virus act. Is there a similar pattern i.e. using inappropriate acts or law to avoid scrutiny.

Anybody know or have the time to investigate?

129772 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to stefarm, 1, #392 of 1675 🔗

I think in Irish Republic they actually brought in a special law to make mask wearing compulsory. Much to everyone’s amazement because they thought it had been for three weeks already!

129857 ▶▶▶▶ Alice, replying to Cbird, 1, #393 of 1675 🔗

Lord Sumption also mentioned amendments to the 1984 Public Health Act – that’s what the government is using to introduce new rules, as far as I understand it. It seems to me that this is more important than the Coronavirus Act (Simon Dolan mentioned it Twitter some time ago).

129757 ▶▶ matt, replying to Cecil B, 3, #394 of 1675 🔗

I was thinking about this the other day and it occurred to me that things have been organised so that it’s as unlikely as possible that any case will ever get to court. Most penalties are issued at FPNs (the few that have been issued at all), which means that it’s very unlikely that anyone will challenge them at all – far easier and cheaper to pay them quickly and move on. The addition of much more substantial fines (£3,200 for repeated breaches of the mask mandate or the ‘rule of 6’; £10,000 for organising an illegal rave like the ones that notorious party addict, Piers Corbyn arranged in Trafalgar Square and Sheffield) make it more likely that they’ll be challenged, but it seems unlikely that the £3,200 fine will ever be issued and the courts are so backed up that the case will probably never make it before a judge anyway.

One wonders whether this is deliberate, to make sure that a judge never gets a chance to comment on the validity of the regulations.

129764 ▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to matt, 1, #395 of 1675 🔗

That’s the idea behind FPNs in general. Councils issue them for parking without legislative backup too. Even the whole half price if you shut up and pay is a nudge to make you comply rather than question the authority.

130251 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Cecil B, 1, #396 of 1675 🔗

Because, as I understand it, until today all the lockdown laws were not real laws but regulations dressed up as such.
Which is why all early lockdown prosecutions were abandoned supposedly because several different police forces had used ‘laws’ only applicable on Wales, pull the other one on that.

129681 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 3, #397 of 1675 🔗

I’ve just been listening to today’s ‘short straw’ minister saying that only people with symptoms are being tested.

yeah but -no but – yeah but

Nearly all the +’ve ‘cases’ are young asymptomatic people (yes and false +’ves)

129838 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Major Panic, 3, #398 of 1675 🔗

Perhaps now the second wave has “started” they will switch to testing symptomatic people only. Cases fall, their swift decisive action worked to prevent a catastrophic surge etc etc.

Or, they will suddenly develop an interest in the positivity rate rather than case numbers. If you only test symptomatic people, % positive will increase. After R and case numbers, that will become the latest thing to panic about. 100% positivity rate! All 10 people we tested were positive! Second wave!

130096 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to Major Panic, 1, #399 of 1675 🔗

Presumably the “free tests” for anybody who wants one in Bolton town centre reported here yesterday did not actually happen

129690 Ed Phillips, replying to Ed Phillips, 8, #400 of 1675 🔗

Yesterday I had another family at my house for lunch – 8 around the table.
Then, in the afternoon, 14 of us gathered for tea after church and belted out some hymns. (How i’ve missed belting hymns out!)

Today, such activities would make me an outlaw.

129692 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ed Phillips, 3, #401 of 1675 🔗

Many noble precedents, Ed.

129695 Lucan Grey, replying to Lucan Grey, 5, #402 of 1675 🔗

I wouldn’t appeal to the authority of anybody in economics.

They’ve predicted 30 of the last 3 recessions.

Different groupthink.

129710 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Lucan Grey, 4, #403 of 1675 🔗

And failed to predict the three we got!

129697 Biggles, replying to Biggles, 14, #404 of 1675 🔗

Last week I mentioned having a bit of fun with a swerver by moving towards them. I’ve had a think about this and have come up with some guidelines that might help should you also meet a swerver.

1) Only use your anti-swerver technique in residential streets where traffic is light.

2) When you see a pedestrian approaching, make an early assessment. If it looks like they play lock forward for the local rugby team it might be best to give it a miss.

3) Check for any cars, we don’t want the swerver to be injured or run over.

4) If swerving is observed, you then have a choice. You could go for the subtle drift to the edge of the pavement which will force the swerver further into the road. Alternatively you could try the more aggressive ‘cross the road’ technique which is liable to cause panic. If you decide to do this, always pass behind the swerver.

5) Avoid eye contact and do not speak to the swerver (see 7 below)

6) Maintain social distancing. This, together with 5 above, is very important as we don’t want the swerver to think that we are taking the piss out of them.

7) In the unlikely event that the swerver queries what you are doing, act as though you have no idea what they are talking about. A simple ‘What?’, together with a shrug of the shoulders and a puzzled look should suffice.

8) Under no circumstances should you burst out laughing. We don’t want to hurt the feelings of the swerver or make them look any more stupid than they already are.

If you stick to these guidelines much fun can be had and the swerver will continue, completely oblivious to the fact that they’ve just been had.

Happy hunting.

129726 ▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Biggles, 1, #405 of 1675 🔗

I’m sure you’re aware that you’re setting out a programme for deliberately causing distress to other people for your own amusement. This is cruel, and it is bullying.

Perhaps other readers may like to draw an analogy with phobias. One member of my family has a phobia about spiders. What would we think of a poster who outlined a programme for amusing themselves at her expense by deliberately showing her a large spider? I think we might consider them somewhat deficient in the humanity department.

129737 ▶▶▶ Biggles, replying to Richard Pinch, 6, #406 of 1675 🔗

Sorry Richard, maybe I should have pointed out that the whole thing was meant as a joke.

129755 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Biggles, 3, #407 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for that.

The reason I posted, apart from a general sensitivity on the subject of phobias, is that this is precisely the point that has been made by many posters here. Some people have been pushed into irrational behaviour about masks and social contact, and I can only presume that what we’re seeing is people being tipped into various forms of phobia (I’m by no means an expert) but I believe that a significant number of people are suffering from agoraphobia. Here’s the NHS definition

Agoraphobia is a fear of being in situations where escape might be difficult or that help wouldn’t be available if things go wrong.

Many people assume agoraphobia is simply a fear of open spaces, but it’s actually a more complex condition. Someone with agoraphobia may be scared of:

* travelling on public transport

* visiting a shopping centre

* leaving home

They’ll avoid situations that cause anxiety and may only leave the house with a friend or partner. They’ll order groceries online rather than going to the supermarket. This change in behaviour is known as avoidance.

In short, from being a treatable disorder, this is now government policy.

129744 ▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #408 of 1675 🔗

Most people with phobias know their fears are irrational though.

129756 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Alison9, #409 of 1675 🔗

Yes, and it doesn’t help .

130492 ▶▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Richard Pinch, #410 of 1675 🔗

It does because they quite often seek help where as swervers think they are rationally protecting themselves from the Covid so consider their behaviour quite rational.

129752 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Biggles, 4, #411 of 1675 🔗

I enjoyed that. Shall hone my skills of Swerver-Mania later.

Happy memories of a summer Mask Touch Pub Cricket. Yes even you can get that arm to touch that mask by simply issuing the right sort of glance.

129708 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 14, #412 of 1675 🔗

Has anybody twigged that all of these fuckwits presenting the news, useless morning TV shows, radio shows, sports shows have not had a day off sick since March or died (although it could be argued they are zombies).

129717 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to stefarm, 3, #413 of 1675 🔗

Don’t forget the politicians especially the ladies!

And they still manage to look good and immaculately presented whilst I’m looking more and more like a zombie apocalypse survivor.

129715 Catherine, replying to Catherine, 9, #414 of 1675 🔗

Shoot me now. One of the kids has a temperature so we are all meant to isolate & get a test for child. Middle child actually has a snotty cough. I’d already sent eldest to High School before primary school broke the good news.
Fucks sake.

129720 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Catherine, 9, #415 of 1675 🔗

all the kids round here including mine have snotty noses and coughs. its just the back to school bug. they are all in school – no testing required

129727 ▶▶▶ Catherine, replying to steve_w, 1, #416 of 1675 🔗

It’s the fact he had a temperature that has blown it out the water. On Friday we had a poster up saying snot & temperature was fine but the guidance has changed. Any temperature you have to get a test. Ironically I work part time in the school office and do the attendance reporting!

129724 ▶▶ Will, replying to Catherine, 2, #417 of 1675 🔗

My eldest had a “temperature” at drop off. 5 normal retests later and we concluded it might be the gun. Youngest at home with a minor sniffle but because she is having chemotherapy we are having to be very careful about colds etc; not remotely worried about covid though. My daughter was part of a study of 1800 immuno suppressed kids, not one has been hospitalised by covid…

129734 ▶▶▶ Catherine, replying to Will, 2, #418 of 1675 🔗

At least they aren’t checking temperatures at drop off. Good luck with your daughter’s chemo x

129763 ▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to Catherine, #419 of 1675 🔗

I kicked myself for not testing with a proper thermometer before we went in but I knew he didn’t have a temperature and fortunately the schools protocol allow a second test with different equipment and a further test half an hour later.

Covid or no covid, with an immuno suppressed daughter I don’t actually think children should be at school with a temperature.

That said I don’t think there is ever a need for temperatures to be checked as a condition of entry to school.

129933 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Will, #420 of 1675 🔗

Taking a temperature with an infrared thermometer from a distance is no real indication of core temperature. I’ve used one that is in contact with the forehead and it came back as normal, the child looked poorly so I took another temperature in the ear and it was over 38.5.

129935 ▶▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to p02099003, 1, #421 of 1675 🔗

I forgot to add, once on the ward I was working on the HCAs did the observations. The first patient had a temperature of 38.5, which was trigger for possible sepsis. The second patient also had a temperature of 38.5. When the third patient had a similar temperature, I think I tried the thermometer on my self, Lo and behold I had a temperature of around 38.5. The thermometer was faulty.

129735 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Catherine, #422 of 1675 🔗

So ridiculous.

what do they regard as a high temperature?

129741 ▶▶▶ Catherine, replying to Victoria, #423 of 1675 🔗

Anything over 37.8, he managed 38.7 yesterday.

129948 ▶▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Catherine, #424 of 1675 🔗

This is where there are serious issues. Using the Paediatric Observations Priority Score (POPS) developed and verified by the university of Leicester, there is a sliding scale as to when temperature has a non zero score.
For infants 0-1 > 37.5 scores 1, > 39 it scores 2
for 1-2 years >38.0 scores 1 >=40 scores 2
for 2-4 >38 scores 1 >40 scores 2
for 5-12 same as 2-4 year olds
for 13-16 same as 2-4 year olds.
A POPS score of 1 or even 2 would be treated in primary care. The child could be looked after at home and I wouldn’t see the point of a test as it wouldn’t change the management.

129794 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Catherine, 2, #425 of 1675 🔗

Mate works in a school, said all Year 7s already isolating after one positive test.
If a teacher or another year group pupil tests positive in the next 2 weeks, it will be considered an “outbreak” and the entire school plus staff must isolate. Insane.

129872 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to DRW, 2, #426 of 1675 🔗

Is this what amounts to a plan to control the virus? It’s absolutely bonkers

129882 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 5, #427 of 1675 🔗

The plan is to control people – therefore quite sane.

129928 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Catherine, #428 of 1675 🔗

Temperature has a specificity of almost 0% for CoViD19 as pretty much any infection in a child will spike a temperature, from sore throat to urinary tract infections to ear infections to appendicitis to meningitis.
Cough is also very non specific.

129719 Emma Williams, replying to Emma Williams, 3, #429 of 1675 🔗

Important to stress that your statement “ Denmark – the country once lauded for its coronavirus response – has been placed on England’s quarantine watch list“ is most definitely incorrect at the current time. I flew in from Denmark last night after a lovely weeks holiday & am very pleased to confirm that Denmark remains on the exempt list for now …

129805 ▶▶ Jules, replying to Emma Williams, 3, #430 of 1675 🔗

We are off to Denmark for Christmas. The only way we are not going is if we are banned from going by either government. Quite happy to “quarantine” if necessary. Saw a chap out and about today who thinks it is our duty to continue travelling as a form of defiance. He also has a problem wearing mask as he had an operation on his nose a couple of years ago. He clearly did not understand that he did not have to wear one.I was pleased to be able to give him an exemption badge, one of a supply that my wife has printed off for us to hand out when we see people struggling. Each badge has the the government;s rules and regs printed the back to give the wearer comfort that they are within their rights to refuse to wear one.

129740 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 6, #431 of 1675 🔗

I’m sure the testing companies in order to minimise false negatives (because that would be so awful) are using high cycle rates which leads to false positives (I’m sure they have convinced themselves false negatives are worse than false positives). So we get lots of false positives, a casedemic and the government promised £100 bn to the testing companies. So a bit of an incentive to ‘minimise false negatives’.

129754 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to steve_w, 4, #432 of 1675 🔗

This text could serve as a basis for letters to MPs to stop the extension to the Coronavirus Act.

From Standupx

Hold your local Mp accountable. Copy paste and email
Wwg1 wga
To all Members of the UK Government IN THE NATIONAL INTEREST
We have serious concerns that the elected government is not acting for the people. As an MP it is your duty to serve the public and protect their interests and the UK. It is clear that this has not been happening since the passing of the Coronavirus Act in March 2020 and we need your help.
We DO NOT consent to the renewal of the Coronavirus Act at its 6 month review in September because that would clearly not be in the public interest. It is not needed, as there is now a mass of information proving that this virus is in no way as severe as the government is making it out to be.
1. Why did the UK government itself state on the 19th of March, that the Covid19 virus was NOT a “High consequence Infectious Disease”, then, on the very same day start the process of the Coronavirus Act 2020 with all its draconian rules and regulations, and going against all medical advice?
2. Why was this not called the Covid19 Act? as that was the name of the virus which we were supposed to be fighting. Instead, it was named after a group of viruses which include the common cold and Influenza, as well as other viruses for which we have not taken such draconian actions for, or destroyed our economy for?
3. The Covid19 virus has never been isolated and proven to exist! So why therefore, did the government use the words Covid19 to strike fear into the nation and bringing it to a standstill.
4. Why did the government give instruction to hospital medical doctors to place Covid19 on death certificates as the cause of death? Even when tests had not been carried out to confirm the actual cause of death? Instead, they advised doctors to include “Died with” and “suspected of having” as actual deaths from Covid19 (a virus that has never even been proven to exist).
5. Why did the government give instructions to medical staff in hospitals and care homes, to apply “Do Not Resuscitate” (DNR)notices on patients over 45, who were suspected of having Covid19? Also it issued the same instructions on disabled people suspected of having the disease, regardless of age? And why did the government give advice for elderly people in care homes with the disease, not to be admitted to hospitals? THIS IS TANTAMOUNT TO MANSLAUGHTER!
6. Why is the government using a testing method that cannot detect Covid19 and secondly, was never designed to carry out this function, as stated by its designer and originator? These tests are at best 50% accurate and repeatedly give “false positives”.
You are actually not testing for covid19, but testing for Coronavirus which could show positive even when a person has had a common cold or influenza. So why is the Government using this method to perpetuate the fear mongering statistics, and spending billions on future similar testing, wasting tax payer’s money just to support its argument. (As stated in Sunday express 06/09/2020)
7. Why did the government place a gagging order on hospital staff, instructing them not to communicate with the media, under penalty of disciplinary action?
8. Why has the Government instructed hospitals not to carry out treatments in hospitals during this period, causing the deaths of people with ongoing serious conditions, and causing around an estimated 20,000 avoidable deaths? In addition, the lack of diagnostic tests being carried out by hospitals during the last 6 months is estimated to result in future premature deaths of up to 30,000 people. Together these amount to more deaths than caused by the virus.
9. Why has the government rolled out laws around the wearing of masks in enclosed spaces, when it has never carried out any risk assessments around the dangers of wearing masks. Evidence around the wearing of masks is scientifically divided, with many saying it can actually be dangerous and cause additional diseases.
Prof Neil Ferguson has been involved with generating projected figures of COVID19 infection and mortality. Ferguson is on the management team of the “Vaccine Impact Modelling Consortium”. This group is overseen and funded by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.
In the normal course of things, where experts are advising government on matters, conflicts of interest are meant to be disclosed. Bill Gates (who has no medical qualifications or training) implied in a BBC interview that he treats mass vaccination, and possibly tracking to whom these vaccinations have been administered, as a “business interest.” It appears Professor Ferguson is also involved in this “interest.” and therefore should have never been an advisor to the government.


129761 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to PastImperfect, 7, #433 of 1675 🔗


Prof. Chris Whittey is the UK’s Chief medical officer, and involved also in advising the government with regards to the Corona virus. In 2008 he was awarded £38 million by the Bill and Melinda Gates foundation for Malaria research in Africa. A year later he was appointed Chief Scientific advisor to the Department for International Development.
Prof. Whitty was also part of the government’s SAGE committee, which has made recommendations about the duration of the UK’s Covid19 lockdown. Concerns are being raised about the intention to keep some of the SAGE activities secret, and the connections and conflict of interest of Prof. Whitty to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.
There are also concerns about Mr Hancock having ties to a company called “Babylon healthcare services which promotes an App called “GP at Hand”. It has not escaped peoples attention that as part of Covid measures that GP’s have vastly increased their use of telephones or remote appointments.
In a government document entitled “Options for increasing adherence to social distancing measures” (22nd March 2020) we come across the following:
a) Perceived threat. “A substantial number of people still do not feel sufficiently personally threatened.” Action to be taken, “The perceived level of personal threat needs to be increased amongst those who are complacent, using hard hitting emotional messaging.”
b) Also stated in this document it says “Use media to increase sense of personal threat”, “Consider enacting legislation to compel required behaviours” Consider use of social disapproval for failure to comply.”
This document strongly suggests that Government ministers, and/or their advisors, have committed an offense under the UK Terrorism Act .
There are many other instances of inappropriate behaviour and law breaking by this Government which we hold in reserve.
That “WE the PEOPLE of the UNITED KINGDOM, disagree and disapprove, of all the actions taken by the Government with regards to the alleged Covid19 Pandemic.
We request that ALL CURRENT LEGISLATION surrounding the Covid19 pandemic be removed, and life in the UK be returned to normal.
Also, that a full and detailed Public Enquiry be held as soon as possible.
We hold this Government in its entirety, responsible for all avoidable deaths caused by their draconian measures including suicides, for their lies and deceit to the people of this country, and will seek retribution in the courts for their actions.
Signed on behalf of the People of the United Kingdom.

129767 ▶▶▶▶ D B, replying to PastImperfect, 2, #434 of 1675 🔗

I was inclined to disbelieve your points following your claim that Covid19 hasn’t been isolated or proven to exist. I thought that it had infact been isolated and gene coded by scientists?

129785 ▶▶▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to D B, 4, #435 of 1675 🔗

Not done in the UK. Not isolated by any known UK government system. You can search for it, I’ve lost the link(!), and they will truthfully tell you that it doesn’t exist anywhere within the system.

129855 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to D B, 1, #436 of 1675 🔗

It would be great to get an answer to the question has it been isolated? It is unclear what has been done with countering accounts in many publications.

130035 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to PastImperfect, 2, #437 of 1675 🔗

I don’t think the PCR test will report flu as a positive. Why would it, unless flu contains the same bits of genetic code as those that you’re looking for with SARS-COV2?

129774 ▶▶▶ tonys, replying to PastImperfect, #438 of 1675 🔗

I believe (shoot me down if you know otherwise) that the reason Covid was not termed a high consequence disease was the case fatality ratio did not meet the threshold, the definition being intended more for the likes of Ebola for example. If this is the case then it is just setting up an easy aunt sally to be knocked down and might risk undermining the credibility of the correspondent.

130556 ▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to tonys, 1, #439 of 1675 🔗

Malcom McKendrick was of the opinion that they downgraded it as they were faced with a lack of PPE before lockdown. For a high consequence disease theyay have a contractual commitment to place workers in such an environment if they are adequately protected. Naturally so.

130818 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #440 of 1675 🔗

This is the reason. It was presumably thought that the number of cases would overwhelm the designated specialist hospitals: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/high-consequence-infectious-diseases-hcid#definition-of-hcid Hospital management of confirmed HCID cases
Once an HCID has been confirmed by appropriate laboratory testing, cases in England should be transferred rapidly to a designated HCID Treatment Centre. Occasionally, highly probable cases may be moved to an HCID Treatment Centre before laboratory results are available.
Contact HCIDs There are 2 principal Contact HCID Treatment Centres in England:

  • the Royal Free London High Level Isolation Unit (HLIU)
  • the Newcastle Royal Victoria Infirmary HLIU.

Further support for managing confirmed contact HCID cases is provided by the Royal Liverpool Hospital and the Royal Hallamshire Hospital, Sheffield.
Airborne HCIDs There are 5 interim Airborne HCID Treatment Centres in England. Adult and paediatric services are provided by 7 NHS Trusts:

  • Guy’s and St Thomas’ NHS Foundation Trust (adult and paediatric services)
  • Royal Free London NHS Foundation Trust, with a paediatric service provided by Imperial College Healthcare NHS Foundation Trust
  • Royal Liverpool and Broadgreen University Hospitals NHS Trust, with a paediatric service provided by Alder Hey Children’s NHS Foundation Trust
  • Newcastle upon Tyne Hospitals NHS Foundation Trust (adult and paediatric services)
  • Sheffield Teaching Hospitals NHS Foundation Trust (adult service only)

Case transfer arrangements Hospital clinicians seeking to transfer confirmed HCID cases, or discuss the transfer of highly probable HCID cases, should contact the NHS England EPRR Duty Officer. It is expected that each case will have been discussed with the Imported Fever Service before discussing transfer.

Unfortunately most of the leaflet consists of the sort of language and ideas that are all too easy to defuse &/or characterise as cranky. E.g. the ‘Koch’s postulates” irrelevancy at 3, the assertion at 4 that CV19 has never been proven to exist, the ‘ tests are at best 50% accurate’ figure is wrong, ‘You are actually not testing for covid19, but testing for Coronavirus which could show positive even when a person has had a common cold or influenza.’ is nonsense since the genetic code is specific to Sars Cov 2,, etc. etc. Add in the liberal use of capital letters and no-one you seek to influence is going to take any notice.

130845 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Bruno, #441 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for the info.

What exactly are you referring to when you say ‘at 3…..at 4’ etc?

Are you speaking in response to McKendricks views?

129779 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to steve_w, 2, #442 of 1675 🔗

Yes, a friend of mine who is, theoretically, scientifically literate, is obsessed by false negatives. He is sure that there are loads of cases going unreported because of them. And that the government is deliberately under -reporting cases!

Until you actually come across it, you can’t quite believe that such people exist. We believe the government is exaggerating cases (with the small matter of also trying to persuade people to maintain the economy and our way of life); he believes the exact opposite and is prepared to support policies that will obviously trash his own kids’ futures in order to make life harder for Boris. The government is probably trying to triangulate a course between both troublesome sets of people.

129858 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #443 of 1675 🔗

He’s a fool.

To try and devise public policy based on false negatives is pissing in the wind. You have nothing concrete to guide you.

With false positives you can be sure that a certain level of cases will always be returned, and theoretically, you should then have a threshold over which you can be sure cases are genuinely rising.

129860 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #444 of 1675 🔗

So where are they hiding all the dead bodies? Of all the conspiracy theories, this has to be one of the most ludicrous. But I guess your friend wouldn’t like to be considered a conspiracy theorist?

129748 BTLnewbie, #445 of 1675 🔗

Ferguson (the Good) quoted data on +ve tests by Pillar (X% for Pillar 1 and Y% for Pillar 2). Any idea where these can be found.
I’m looking at https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/cases and can get an analysis of the number of tests under each Pillar, but only an overall total for ‘cases’.

129766 Alison9, 6, #446 of 1675 🔗

I’m still chuckling to myself about the Magnificent Seven joke (end of yesterday’s update) … Yul Brynner would make a nice subversive track and trace name!

129770 T. Prince, #447 of 1675 🔗

Posted this late last night on yesterdays update, hope you don’t mind if you’ve already seen it.

“Anyone in need of a giggle?

Over on Conservative Woman there’s an article “Face-mask follies grow ever loonier”
Some budding Einstein posted this 2 minute video as evidence of how face masks work (!!). Somehow I don’t think it would pass even a modicum of academic rigour do you? If this is the best that the ‘other side’ can do…….(I commented on this and someone replied ‘why are you afraid of a mask, it won’t hurt you”!!!!


129773 Rachel.C, 7, #448 of 1675 🔗

James Fergusons’s paper yesterday shows that about 99% of so-called cases are false positives. Almost no one in the UK has Covid any more.

This should be the number one issue for discussion. Why are governments across the world not declaring the FPR? It’s a big cover up, more important than all the other craziness going on.

129778 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 2, #449 of 1675 🔗

neil ferguson hasn’t tweeted since april

and his team hasn’t produced a report since july

I thought maybe he’d gone quiet as his predictions (ie sweden) have proved so awful but then he popped up on radio 4 spouting some shite

129850 ▶▶ Basics, replying to steve_w, 7, #450 of 1675 🔗

He looks like a sickly mentally broken wretch in his tv appearances at select committees. He was being dug out of holes by his colleagues when his synapses failed him and he found himself unable to answer question. Twitter might be a stretch for him. Deserves every bit on unpleasantness coming to him. Decades of unforgivable grot.

129780 John Stone, 3, #451 of 1675 🔗

Fauci contradicts himself

Here, 4 days ago, he tells Jennifer Garner (12.55) “about 50% of all transmission occurs from an asymptomatic person”


Here he says “…asymptomatic patients (sic) are never the drivers of epidemics. The drivers of epidemics are always symptomatic patients”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKwHFXw-UaM&feature=youtu.be )

This is evidently old footage that someone has found, and I can’t identify the occasion from other video clips – perhaps private footage bearing in mind the quality.

I wonder what are the grounds for changing his mind? The asymptomatic claim is obviously hugely incredible. He does say in there somewhere the risk from touching surfaces is negligible. He also shows how he pulls his mask up and down according to the situation, although we are told we should avoid touching our masks in the UK.

Fauci saying you should consider taking Vitamin D & C (but obviously no big deal!) is at 32 mins in the Garner interview.

129781 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 1, #452 of 1675 🔗

Just on Victoria Derbyshire “8 out of 10 doctors think we’re heading for a second wave”!!!!!!!

129783 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 8, #453 of 1675 🔗

It is absolutely clear that the BBC has no intention whatsoever of reporting the facts..we’re f*cked

129876 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to T. Prince, 2, #454 of 1675 🔗

It never has. (No, we’re not.).

130051 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to JohnB, #455 of 1675 🔗


130092 ▶▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to T. Prince, #456 of 1675 🔗

I think the point is that if our response to an issue relied on the BBC reporting facts we’d never have had Brexit or a Conservative government. As it happens, the latter has turned out to be a complete disaster, but the point is that the BBC doesn’t infect the brains of enough people to set the agenda as much as it likes to think.

130764 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to T. Prince, #457 of 1675 🔗

Assuming you mean why we’re not fucked ? 🙂

Because we vastly outnumber the bad guys. And because we are more highly and more qualitatively motivated.

129792 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to T. Prince, 6, #458 of 1675 🔗

In the same survey though 6 out of 10 doctors believe that the backlog of care is not a priority, which is more concerning as the backlog is real rather than the hypothetical “second wave”.

So they’re happy to prepare for a potential “second wave” but in the mean time those that required treatment are not a priority and can be left to die.

129798 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to JohnB, 5, #459 of 1675 🔗

people believe what is in their best interests to believe. if we’d had no furlough and shitty weather in the spring, lockdown would have ended as soon as the peak was passed in early april

129806 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to steve_w, 1, #460 of 1675 🔗

Agree. I’ve said that from the start. Too many people were treating it as ‘party time’. I’m looking forward to seeing their faces when the party’s over!

130089 ▶▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to T. Prince, #461 of 1675 🔗

You won’t be able to see their faces – that’s probably why they have to wear masks.

130979 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Andrew Fish, #462 of 1675 🔗

To hide their shame.

129808 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to T. Prince, #463 of 1675 🔗

They only asked 10 doctors

129871 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to stefarm, #464 of 1675 🔗

But that’s enough for the gullible that have the BBC on constantly as ‘background noise’. Subliminal conditioning!

129826 ▶▶ Jo, replying to T. Prince, 2, #465 of 1675 🔗

I’m not surprised. I haven’t seen a decent GP for decades. In fact I haven’t seen a GP at all for over a decade.
It is scary though because they are (for some reason) so respected. I just see them as drug-pushers, on the whole. A bit like vets, you have to go to the top to meet a decent medic

129873 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Jo, #466 of 1675 🔗

just see them as drug-pushers

so true, they do not understand

  • immunity
  • how to improve immunity
  • how to identify and then address underlying causes of illness instead of treating symptoms with drugs
130081 ▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Victoria, 1, #467 of 1675 🔗

My wife has a chronic condition which means GPs are somewhat unavoidable for us. She’s also been through a couple of major problems in the last decade where the GP has been involved at least part of the way. In our experience they know very little about medicine – certainly we’ve invariably seemed to know more about the problems than they have. This is what you get when someone is supposed to be a generalist – anything beyond diagnosis and prescription is totally outside their field.

129854 ▶▶ RickH, replying to T. Prince, 2, #468 of 1675 🔗

Well – what do doctors know? – they’ve still got their heads down ever since the first wave turned out to be nothing special and have largely complied with the NHS ‘omerta’, I’m sad to say.

129869 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to T. Prince, 1, #469 of 1675 🔗

What do they mean by “wave” – are we talking about a tsunami? – or a gentle lapping on the shore? It would be useful if they were asked to put a figure on it.

129786 SmokeandMirrors, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 20, #470 of 1675 🔗

I suspect the ‘second’ wave is the politicians’ and experts’ escape pod.

It has to happen –or it has to appear to have happened. It has to be cured – or has to appear to have been cured.

In fact, it won’t happen and it won’t need to be cured, but all efforts are now on manning the escape pod.

A second wave that didn’t happen is a second wave that has been cured and so all the toil has been worthwhile.

Or, a second wave that does happen (which it won’t) is a vindication of the management of the problem.

Thus all reputations will survive unscathed. The government can resume governing, basking in glory.

Without the ‘second wave’ how can anyone wind down all the current restrictions when it’s been painfully obvious that this should have been done weeks ago and were probably unnecessary anyway?

This has now sod all to do with public health. This is to do with the survival of egos.

Cui bono?

129793 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 11, #471 of 1675 🔗

I don’t believe lockdown 1 was sensible but I can understand those that did. I do not accept lockdown 2 at all, when covid deaths are 10% of flu deaths. you can’t take away our freedoms ‘just in case’.

130560 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to steve_w, #472 of 1675 🔗

See Lord Sumption’s remarks, LS Sept 12.

129813 ▶▶ DRW, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 4, #473 of 1675 🔗

Someone here suggested they want an excuse to impose a second lockdown/national mockdown in October. Either way, Xmas is cancelled unless a ‘compliance target’ for their next move is met.

129831 ▶▶▶ SmokeandMirrors, replying to DRW, 5, #474 of 1675 🔗

A Christmas lockdown would be political suicide, hence the need for a second wave to be conquered – just in time……..

129846 ▶▶▶▶ Alice, replying to SmokeandMirrors, #475 of 1675 🔗

Let’s hope it’s “conquered in time”!

129874 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 9, #476 of 1675 🔗

It would be political suicide normally. But we’re 4 years from an election, and increasingly moving towards a police state.

If they can criminalize peaceful assembly, I don’t think Yule will give them any problem whatsoever.

130980 ▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to JohnB, #477 of 1675 🔗

Don’t be so pessimistic. Keep your chin up. Organize.

131212 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to richard riewer, #478 of 1675 🔗

Not being negative, Richard. Merely trying to get people to understand the character of the opposition.

We are organising – want to deliver some leaflets for us ? 🙂

129835 ▶▶ Julian, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 5, #479 of 1675 🔗

“Resume governing”. They think they are governing now. The threat of a second wave will be with us forever, or until there’s a big change in public opinion. Pretending there is a permanent public health emergency makes “governing” a lot easier – people do as they’re told, you’re not criticised for wrecking the economy, the opposition and the media do not scrutinize you, you’re the centre of attention, you can pretend to be saving lives. Why would any politician not want that to continue? Only a politician who lived by a moral code would want to stop.

129853 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 1, #480 of 1675 🔗

Not so much cui bono, more like ne peccati reus ero – to dodge the blame – when the “inquiry” occurs.

129863 ▶▶ Will, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 6, #481 of 1675 🔗

This has been the case since the middle of April. The other factor that has to be remembered when analysing the decision making is the need to perpetuate the myth of asymptomatic transmission to cover up the criminal decision to chuck (knowingly) sick people into care homes.

130086 ▶▶▶ SmokeandMirrors, replying to Will, 1, #482 of 1675 🔗

Ah! the concept of asymptomatic transmission.

So useful.


a) Miraculously, in the year of our Lord 2020 – which also coincided with an explosion of social media connectivity – a ‘new’ disease emerged that (uniquely?) is able to replicate itself enough so as to allow sufficient viruses to be released from an individual to be infectious without that individual’s own defence system ever being aware.


b) whilst their eyes were off the ball, the world health authorities were taken by surprise by a disease that appeared to spread out of control. To cover their inefficiencies, the concept of asymptomatic transmission appeared to be extremely attractive as it exonerated their lack of vigilance. The concept was freely used to justify a wide range of knee-jerk restrictions and was accepted willingly as truth – even though it is, perhaps, implausible.

I favour (b)

129875 ▶▶ Hampshire Sceptic, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 4, #483 of 1675 🔗

I agree the second wave nonsense is the government’s escape route. I reckon their perverse logic is something like this.

Gosh, we probably have grossly over-reacted but if we are not careful we will get blamed for trashing the economy and for all the excess deaths from non-Covid diseases. So how do we dodge that bullet? Yes, we had better pretend there is a real danger of a second wave and have a bit more of project fear for another couple of months. Deaths from Covid are unlikely to go up over that time so when we get to late November we can declare the rule of 6 has worked. It can then be announced that rule of 6 can be relaxed or even cancelled just in time for Christmas. Johnson and Handycock can then say “thanks to our wise policy we have saved your family Christmas” thinking they can be the heroes of a grateful nation. Probably they will still want muzzles until the spring by which time there will be hardly any Covid deaths as herd immunity will have been reached and at that time they will attempt to proclaim they have been totally vindicated.

All total bollocks of course but we need to remember that the overriding concern of all politicians is not “what is the best policy for the country?” but rather “how are we going to win the next election?”

130680 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Hampshire Sceptic, #484 of 1675 🔗

They might not make it to the next election. I hope.

129884 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 1, #485 of 1675 🔗

No it has to do with the mass vaccination that they are planning. Unfortunately for them 1) the virus is no longer ‘deadly’ and disappearing fast 2) the vaccine trial hit an obstacle (severe adverse incident) and had to be paused.

So they are desperate to keep us terrified and cooperative therefore the continuous scaremongering about the second wave, keep people apart, make them wear masks etc.

See Open Consultation: Distributing vaccines and treatment for Covid-19 and flu

Consultation document: changes to Human Medicine Regulations to support the rollout of COVID-19 vaccines

Draft statutory instrument: the Human Medicines (Coronavirus) (Amendment) Regulations 2020

UK law changes for COVID-19 mass vaccinationSUMMARY DRAFT CONSULTATION RESPONSE

129892 ▶▶ Roadrash, replying to SmokeandMirrors, 3, #486 of 1675 🔗

It will be manufactured. Like every other seasonal virus we are likely to see a rise in cases. Nothing out of the ordinary of course but this will be used to continue to justify the lockdown. When the number of actual cases isn’t that high they will use that as evidence that the lockdown worked and managed to keep a lid on the tsunami of illnesses we would otherwise have faced. Every sniffle, cough and cold will be viewed through suspicious eyes. They will ramp up the testing more, finding more false positives and carry on with the crap.

The MSM which appears to be slightly wavering now will watch these slight rise in numbers and in all likelihood revert back to their old positions of lockdowns good, individual freedoms bad.

I suspect at Christmas Boris will throw us a bone and say something like ‘for two days only I am suspending the rule of 6 to allow families to meet if they wish’ etc etc. The covidiots will lap this up. As long as I can have Chrimbo dinner then everything is o.k.

129932 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Roadrash, 3, #487 of 1675 🔗

Yep, the R number, which is an infallible measure that everybody understands* will magically dip on Christmas Eve, yet somehow rise again about 11.38 pm on Boxing Night. Possibly because of tinsel. Or something.

*This is the joke part.

130402 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Sam Vimes, #488 of 1675 🔗

Mistletoe in the hallway, near the front door.

129796 Leemc23, replying to Leemc23, 12, #489 of 1675 🔗

Starmer on LBC. Supports the Rule of Six. And clearly said that’s what Scientists have recommended and that’s what they have followed. What scientists ? Let’s wait 6 months for the vague SAGE crap to be published.

Absolutely losing the will to do anything with this ongoing load of shit.

129816 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Leemc23, 18, #490 of 1675 🔗

What actually is the point of Starmer? Why doesn’t he just join the Conservative party and be done with it?

129823 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to A. Contrarian, 5, #491 of 1675 🔗

its a strange democracy when on the most important topic since WW2 they all believe the same nonsense. need a new party

129830 ▶▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to steve_w, 9, #492 of 1675 🔗

Our lives, all our lives, are being governed by SAGE. Not either political party. That’s the reality of this. Our fury – and that’s what I have is fury – is to be directed at SAGE and politicians in equal measure.

129836 ▶▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Leemc23, 2, #493 of 1675 🔗

Absolutely. A number of posters on here have got stock responses from their MPs which simply state that they are following the advice and that is the right thing to do.

They are worse than useless, but dangerous.

129840 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 2, #494 of 1675 🔗

Those in positions of responsibility who don’t act with responsiblity are dangerous. Always are and always will be.

130588 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Basics, 1, #495 of 1675 🔗

They should be schooled, day by day. I told my MP that I was very disappointed and (essentially) told him to get better advisors who don’t just feed him junk. The reply was much less flippant.
They should be schooled, day by day. I told my MP that I was very disappointed and (essentially) told him to get better advisors who will feed him truth instead of junk. The reply was much less flippant.

129880 ▶▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Leemc23, -2, #496 of 1675 🔗

Make as many ‘fronts’ as you want and give them all ‘framing’ names.
But they are no more than interfaces to the managing of perception – and response.
Your fury will consume you. You cant ‘reach’ your targets nor would it make any difference if you could – in fact it would strengthen them as front line victims of ‘far-right terrorists’.

Too much inflammation burns in hatred.
That you are feeling betrayal, I understand.
But nothing good comes of making your self in its image.

The trap is more deeply laid and over generations.
But the more we struggle blind, the more entangled in lies.

There is a view that there is truth, by which lies are dispelled or undone.
And there is a view that vengeance takes priority over truth.
What we give priority to we give power to.
This puts YOU in the place of responsibility or indeed governance.
That you see a madness operating destructively is maddening.
Some have been seeing this throughout their lives, but your ‘world’ is just breaking – which reveals that it ran on false presumptions and invested identity.

Perhaps the force of rage can transmute to clear the Augean Stables? O r indeed sweep the Temple of interlopers?

129852 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to steve_w, #497 of 1675 🔗

They believe obeying orders will save their skin?
Perhaps in a framing of no conceivable escape?

129865 ▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to steve_w, 5, #498 of 1675 🔗

A general rule of thumb is that if all politicians support something, it is wrong.

129829 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #499 of 1675 🔗

You could say the same about Johnson.

129841 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #500 of 1675 🔗


129844 ▶▶▶▶ Alice, replying to Tom Blackburn, #501 of 1675 🔗

Worse than useless! He’s my MP, alas…

130981 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Tom Blackburn, #502 of 1675 🔗

Keir Starmer.

129867 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #503 of 1675 🔗

Agree. Labour just capitulated. There is NO opposition

129921 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to A. Contrarian, 5, #504 of 1675 🔗

The point of Starmer has been obvious for a long time : he is the establishment shill maneuvered into place as leader of the opposition to provide a ‘safe’ alternative in the eventuality of a change of government.

Anyone who has been awake during the last year (and able to see beyond simple political preference) will have noticed absolute continuity between the propaganda campaign around Covid and the techniques of lies and distortion focused on Corbyn, which was unprecedented in my lifetime.

The phenomenon was noted by good journalists (a rare beast) from across the political spectrum – such as Peter Oborne – as going way beyond normal partisan political debate.

130830 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to RickH, #505 of 1675 🔗

Substitute Brexit for Corbyn and you’d be just as close to the mark.

130311 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #506 of 1675 🔗

There’s no difference between the two, there’s just one Totalitarian Party.

130403 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to A. Contrarian, #507 of 1675 🔗

Or go back to being a Human Rights lawyer. Yeah, sure.

130578 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to A. Contrarian, #508 of 1675 🔗

Starmer: Trilateral Commission: David Rockefeller.

130893 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to A. Contrarian, #509 of 1675 🔗

Any reason to suppose he doesn’t have the vast majority of the Labour Party solidly behind him on this? None that I’ve seen.

But yes, they might as well all be in one party if they won’t do their jobs and Oppose.

129799 tonys, replying to tonys, 4, #510 of 1675 🔗

Carl Heneghan on ITV now

129807 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to tonys, #511 of 1675 🔗

I don’t have a tv. is he calm and measured or fuming?

129811 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to steve_w, #512 of 1675 🔗

Banging his head against a big brick wall?

129814 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to steve_w, #513 of 1675 🔗

Patience of a saint, I think! He’s just raised cycle thresholds but been swiftly redirected

129819 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Charlie Blue, #514 of 1675 🔗

I think the cycle threshholds and private testing companies will all come out in the final trials (like the cars and their emissions fix). doesn’t help us now though.

129824 ▶▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to steve_w, #515 of 1675 🔗

You might be right. Though I think that issue has been getting more coverage in the print media of late, thanks to Heneghan and co.

129832 ▶▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to steve_w, 2, #516 of 1675 🔗

I disagree. I think it is the key issue right now when we are testing so much. The rate of false positives is causing a lot of noise and we are locking down for case numbers at the level we are, it is something that needs sorted now.

The mantra ‘test, test, test’ seems so utterly sinister right now. They want to have massive testing to ensure cases, but bury the fact that much of those are just noise.

129839 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #517 of 1675 🔗

dont misundertand me 🙂 I think the FPR and testing is a massive issue and will likely give give a false lockdown. I think it will all come out in the wash but we will have double-fucked ourselves first. Pressure needs to be applied on this specific point. I write to my MP demanding to know the Ct applied in the testing companies etc

129847 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to steve_w, #518 of 1675 🔗

I agree, Steve. traction on this point would bring the whole house of cards crashing down. Which is why the govt will do what they can to avoid the question. I believe MH has stated that the cycle issue is being looked into but I have little doubt that even if that is true he will ignore the findings of any such investigation.

130576 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to steve_w, #519 of 1675 🔗

I wrote to my MP also on that specific point 3 weeks ago. No response

129891 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #520 of 1675 🔗

It’s a big issue, for sure, and if it can be communicated well it strengthens our case.

But I think they key issue is that same as it has always been – the virus does not represent an unprecedentted threat to public health by any reasonable measure, given the evidence we have, and unpredecented, untried measures that are obviously hugely damaging are in no way justified – such interventions are extremely hazardous and unorthodox, and the case for them continuing is almost impossible to make on the basis of the evidence from round the world.

129827 ▶▶▶▶ Rabbit, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #521 of 1675 🔗

He was able to speak with no interruptions, at least for as much as I saw (I only switched to on when I saw tonys post). Could have been worse, if he was on GMB would they just interrupt and talk over him.

129837 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Rabbit, #522 of 1675 🔗

Eamon Holmes?

129888 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rabbit, replying to Basics, 1, #523 of 1675 🔗

Phil and Holly.

129804 Paul Mendelsohn, 1, #524 of 1675 🔗

As universities open their doors again with the new restrictions in place, will the more experienced students be holding a “furlough a fresher week”?

129810 PaulH, replying to PaulH, 24, #525 of 1675 🔗

“We can’t keep wrecking economies…”

The trouble is they can and they are doing . Not only here but worldwide.

As each day goes by and any good news is systematically buried by the politicians, this is looking more and more like a sinister plan for a New World Order based around climate change and biosecurity pseudo-science.

Australia seems to be the test bed for each new sinister policy. Extremely worrying.

129817 ▶▶ Jo, replying to PaulH, 10, #526 of 1675 🔗

And Israel now locked down again. Just caught the last sentence of the report on the World Service – nearly all the epidemiologists in Israel have told the Govt that they should not lock down. And the reporter sounded surprised!

129825 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Jo, 1, #527 of 1675 🔗

You’d think you could rely on Israel to be hard-headed and pragmatic

129845 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Julian, 1, #528 of 1675 🔗

Why is using covid as the pretext to suppress and control dissent not hard-headed and pragmatic?

129886 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Binra, #529 of 1675 🔗

I suppose that’s one way of looking at it. I don’t know much about Israeli politics, but it has always seemed to me that, if nothing else, their leaders were pro-Israeli so were less likely to engage in policies that were so obviously not in the national interest. But I may be wrong.

130982 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Julian, #530 of 1675 🔗


129954 ▶▶ Mark, replying to PaulH, #531 of 1675 🔗

Again, not the Mark who has been posting here for months. It’s definitely a drawback that the system should allow identical handles.

Then again, if you’re the same new Mark who has been posting for the past few days, your views seem pretty similar to my own and you express them well. You seem slightly closer to the conspiracy end of the conspiracy/cock up spectrum.

But I’ll give you fair warning that I have been accused of being racist and told that my opinions on BLM should be silenced here, so if you continue to use that handle you will run the risk of being tarred with that brush.

130605 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to PaulH, #532 of 1675 🔗

NWO will be a worldwide and digital control version on the style of the southern slave economy. Welcome to he plantation (when the vaccine has done its stuff).

129821 Sir Sceptic, 1, #533 of 1675 🔗

Just planning a get away to Stockholm next week and found this – what the Swedes advise their people:

129828 Basics, 4, #534 of 1675 🔗

Here’s Ivor Cummins’ video from the 8th Sept again. For anyone who missed it or is lurking and happens to see the page today.
40 minutes of brilliant official data analysis.
Heading on towards 600k views now.

129833 steve_w, 1, #535 of 1675 🔗

current testing is 300,000 a day and 3,000 (false) positives
that’s 1% FPR

if we test all people who are dying and 1500 die every day then we will get 15 per day deaths from covid but all false positive

129842 Binra, 1, #536 of 1675 🔗

Do we really ‘save ourself’ by running from feared truth to hide in more complex lies of subjection? To ‘give the knee’ by denying and abandoning those who refuse to join in hate?

Is our truth, the capacity to abide through confusion of chaos, to a love and recognition of truth – free of deceit? Is our willingness for releasing invested self-illusions that mask over the heart to lock down in fear, an aligning in self-honesty instead of temptation to react?

Do we abandon our freedom in uncovering truth in life, to be ‘saved’ by such permissions or privileges as crumbs let fall from the table of control set by fear?

We may recognize coercion as locking down and framing in defencelessness against a deceit running in and as our own perceptions and responses. The lie is never true, but has all the support given it by engaging in its framing.
This is where we give power away by assigning priority to false thinking and accepting it as ‘normal’ currency.

While choking life support of the global economy, this iteration is not yet actively engaged in poisoning the novel ‘infected’ or the mass population with novel means to ‘protect’ against ‘novel infection’. As is the ‘normal’ for the (also novel HIV) – whose ‘designated antibodies’ are declared proof of infection instead of immunity.

This corona is not so novel, but a tried and tested formula of a revolving doors between regulatory bodies, institutional authorities, and financial cartels of hugely disproportionate leverage.

Where our treasure is, there is our heart invested – and given protection.
When we give our heart in wishing truth to be different than it is, we open to fear of losing what we never really had, and set defences that are blind to truth, running in our name.

129859 ▶▶ Edna, replying to swedenborg, 1, #538 of 1675 🔗

Dear Lord, what is this world becoming?

129864 ▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to swedenborg, 8, #539 of 1675 🔗

This is assault, pure and simple.
As someone once said – the problem with Australia is not that so many are descended from convicts, but that so many are descended from prison guards.

130408 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to BTLnewbie, #540 of 1675 🔗

How did they survive the boat trip?

129868 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to swedenborg, 3, #541 of 1675 🔗

The head-kicking motherfucker should be on charges.

129900 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to JohnB, 1, #542 of 1675 🔗

Agree, imprisoned in general population to see how big and brave he is. How anyone on this earth can think that is human is beyond me. No doubt some arsehole will say it’s his fault for being out after curfew and if they do they deserve the same.

129903 ▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to JohnB, 4, #543 of 1675 🔗

David Icke uses the term for these goons ” EmpathyDeleted”

129910 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to David Grimbleby, 2, #544 of 1675 🔗

The fail safe human quaility that prevents us doing evil – empathy.
Chew on that, it is good.

130090 ▶▶▶ anon, replying to JohnB, 1, #545 of 1675 🔗

And the pig who dove into him with bull bars

Disgusting behaviour

130027 ▶▶ D B, replying to swedenborg, 2, #546 of 1675 🔗

Alas as he’s not black and Trump isn’t the head of their government this will not be reported by the MSM

129848 BTLnewbie, replying to BTLnewbie, 2, #547 of 1675 🔗

I know this has been mentioned elsewhere as a likely target for Prof Heneghan’s CEBM team. As the numbers of new admissions to hospital with Covid decline, the Welsh stats are starting to have a significant distorting effect on the UK total.

The Gov’t website – at https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/healthcare , glibly says:
“The figures are not comparable as Wales include suspected COVID-19 patients while the other nations include only confirmed cases.”

I struggle to put tables on this site but have below (with the date in the final column):
Wales daily hospitalisations and UK daily total.
Wales as a % of the UK total and Wales as a % of the UK population (4.71%).
The ‘overcount’ if Wales simply had its ‘fair share’ of hospitalisations, and the revised UK total.

Looking at the 3 Sept as an example, the numbers hospitalised with Covid in the UK are reduced from 140 to only 77 if the Welsh figures were aligned.

56 192 29.17% 4.71% -47 145 09/09/2020
65 168 38.69% 4.71% -57 111 08/09/2020
46 130 35.38% 4.71% -40 90 07/09/2020
42 130 32.31% 4.71% -36 94 06/09/2020
27 122 22.13% 4.71% -21 101 05/09/2020
69 137 50.36% 4.71% -63 74 04/09/2020
70 140 50.00% 4.71% -63 77 03/09/2020
59 141 41.84% 4.71% -52 89 02/09/2020
69 131 52.67% 4.71% -63 68 01/09/2020

129897 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to BTLnewbie, #548 of 1675 🔗

The figures for yesterday on
Were that 884 people were in hospital in UK either with Covid or waiting for a Covid test result
The NHS spreadsheet is hard to follow
But on 3rd Sept it says there were 468 people with Covid in English Hospitals
I find hospital data hard to find and follow, but I feel it is going to be important to use to see if there is a second wave.

129902 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Steve Martindale, #549 of 1675 🔗

Even if we thought that a positive test legitimately translated to a case (and we don’t), surely the numbers are nonsense if they include those waiting for a test result? Guilty until proven innocent?

130053 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Charlie Blue, #550 of 1675 🔗

Hospital cases are all Pillar 1 tests i.e. a proper medical diagnosis backed up by a test. The NHS England figures are, as I understand it, all confirmed pillar 1 tested cases of Covid 19. It is the UK figures that are confused by including the Welsh pending figures.
I think the point is that the media are suggesting that hospital cases are going up and so we need to check the movement in these figures to see whether they are rising or falling.

129856 Cbird, replying to Cbird, 12, #551 of 1675 🔗

Go Lord Sumption! Here he is again on TalkRadio this morning. Amongst other things, he describes Wancock as “a gimlet eyed fanatic” https://youtu.be/ipaeGea5OZE

129889 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Cbird, #552 of 1675 🔗

What’s the timestamp for that comment? I just need something to cheer me up right now.

130305 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to mattghg, #553 of 1675 🔗

About 9:30 or just after

129890 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Cbird, 11, #554 of 1675 🔗

He is excellent in his focus on the key issue of civil liberties. I almost threw up yesterday as the media banged on about the Battle of Britain whilst news bulletins preached the doctrine of totalitarianism. What an insult to the two generations that came before mine to compliment Hitler, Goebbels and Mengele with the flattery of imitation!

Bluntly – Mr Toad and the rest of the Slime have achieved more moral and social damage in 6 months than the Third Reich did in the blitz. But – hey ho – the bricks and mortar are intact – it’s just the people that are collateral damage.

Some here have written about the possibility of legal action. Sumption’s clear thinking is interesting on this : see at about 6:30 into this interview.

129972 ▶▶ Nsklent, replying to Cbird, 1, #555 of 1675 🔗

Thank you for that laugh – perfect description.

129983 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Cbird, 4, #556 of 1675 🔗

Good grief, Hartley-Brewer talks far too much! If she’s interviewing someone as intelligent as Sumption, she really doesn’t need to explain what answer she wants at such length, before letting him respond….

130415 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cbird, #557 of 1675 🔗

New name for a cocktail.

129862 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 3, #558 of 1675 🔗

Re Vaccines that shed and then infect others that had not been vaccinated

Received the annual NHS letter re Annual Childhood Flu Immunisation Programme for schools

4.4 Special warnings and precautions for use

Vaccine recipients should be informed that Fluenz Tetra is an attenuated live virus vaccine and has the potential for transmission to immunocompromised contacts. Vaccine recipients should attempt to avoid, whenever possible, close association with severely immunocompromised individuals (e.g. bone marrow transplant recipients requiring isolation) for 1-2 weeks following vaccination. Peak incidence of vaccine virus recovery occurred 2-3 days post-vaccination in Fluenz clinical studies. In circumstances where contact with severely immunocompromised individuals is unavoidable, the potential risk of transmission of the influenza vaccine virus should be weighed against the risk of acquiring and transmitting wild-type influenza virus.

129878 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Victoria, 3, #559 of 1675 🔗

But “the potential risk of transmission of the influenza vaccine virus should be weighed against the risk of acquiring and transmitting wild-type influenza virus.”

If there is a low risk of seeing a wild influenza then there’s no point having our Flutetra because that is likely to pose more risk than going without.

Do I understand that correctly?

130302 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Basics, 1, #560 of 1675 🔗

I should say so

129866 JohnMac, replying to JohnMac, 24, #561 of 1675 🔗

Mr Malthouse added: “What we’re hoping is that we will see for the rule of six what we saw for the initial lockdown, which was extremely high compliance from the British people.”

That is because in March we believed you were operating on proper scientific advice. Now we know you’re just thrashing about with no idea what to do next.

The more rules these people invent the more the public’s contempt for them will increase. You’d think they’d realise that, wouldn’t you?

129870 ▶▶ Adam, replying to JohnMac, 3, #562 of 1675 🔗

He is my MP, and I wrote to him a few days ago. Wish I had left it until today, so I could have told him what I think about his latest comments.

129879 ▶▶ NickR, replying to JohnMac, 16, #563 of 1675 🔗

On the Today programme this morning, when pushed by Mishal Hussein he agreed that you should dob in your neighbours if they had a 7th person in their garden.
So, the kids can play with their friends in the playground at school but not in the park on the other side of the fence!
Who are these cretins?

129883 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to NickR, 4, #564 of 1675 🔗

Wankers that’s who

129881 ▶▶ CGL, replying to JohnMac, 2, #565 of 1675 🔗

Plus the restrictions then didn’t make any difference to the outcome. And they won’t this time either.

129907 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnMac, 5, #566 of 1675 🔗

Malthouse is an embarrasment to himself and his ‘profession’ talking without understanding what is happening. Mr Malthouse ought to be on the radio describing the progress being made into the viscious government policies that have isolated millions and caused the deaths of thousands. Is Mr Malthouse a puny man or does he just come across that way.

130202 ▶▶ Steve, replying to JohnMac, 1, #567 of 1675 🔗

High compliance? Not what I observed whilst delivering. Plenty of people about visiting friends and family in the back estates. Especially after the 2nd or 3rd week. Traffic on the roads started to increase at about the same time.

129893 Caroline Watson, replying to Caroline Watson, 39, #568 of 1675 🔗

I am a member of a church choir which has not been allowed to sing since March. I did a solo spot at one service which was incredibly good for both my morale and others who attended. I am a classically trained mezzo soprano with diplomas in singing performance and my teacher was a member of the company at the Royal Opera House, so we know how the voice works.

Last week I attended a Zoom call to do a risk assessment for a return to singing. I was there to try to dilute the nonsense coming from, mainly, teachers’ union reps. I also wanted to ensure that ‘safety’ measures didn’t interfere with the musicality of what we were trying to do and, therefore make it pointless.

There was a view that masks should be worn at all times when not actually singing. A trained singer breathes low down, holds the air, and controls the outward flow with the abdominal muscles. The shoulders and neck must be relaxed and the throat open. Covering the face will send the body into fight or flight mode, causing high breathing, tension, an unsupported voice and poor intonation. Performance anxiety can also have that effect and it is incredibly difficult to restore control. I argued that, once in the suitably spaced choir seating, masks should not be necessary at all, but I was overruled. The organist is also expected to wear one, on his own, facing away from anyone else. Playing the organ requires great concentration and physical agility.

There was then an hysterical discussion about how to send music to people without computers when it would be ‘contaminated’. There are people who literally quarantine their post!

The greatest absurdity was the view that singing could only happen in the west end with the door open. In winter! My comment that we would be protecting people from Covid to freeze them to death was ignored!

I am not prepared to compromise my integrity as a singer to participate in this choir. Fortunately I am also in a more rural one which is taking a more pragmatic and musical approach.

The Church of England is completely hysterical over this.

129911 ▶▶ Alison9, replying to Caroline Watson, 14, #569 of 1675 🔗

Not just The Church of England. My daughter did some exams last week (Summer exams postponed until now) – I asked her how she had got on. “Mum, they have to quarantine the papers for three days before they’re marked and then have to be quarantined again for three days before we get them back so we won’t know for a week”. I think some of the teachers think it is all nonsense but too many, for my liking, think this is rational and proportionate.

129916 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to Alison9, 7, #570 of 1675 🔗

I am a member of our church council. I suggested I pinned up the summary minutes of our last (Zoom) meeting on our noticeboard as we have always done in the past. I was told that doing so encouraged people gathering round to read them and passing them on to each other ‘spreading the virus’. Similarly we are not allowed to print out copies of our weekly notice sheets, email distribution only. I thought this idea of spread from paper/post etc had been well dismissed ages ago but seems some still panic at the very thought.

129922 ▶▶▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to davews, 3, #571 of 1675 🔗

Would you be arrested if you did it as normal?

130327 ▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to davews, 2, #572 of 1675 🔗

Yes, I vaguely remember something about it being a minuscule risk via paper. It’s all basically bonkers!

129919 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Caroline Watson, 5, #573 of 1675 🔗

Completely over taken by NWO fanatics, Welby was a plant

130572 ▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Dan Clarke, 5, #574 of 1675 🔗

The moment I was told that we had been instructed not to sing in Church, I said “Well, you won’t see me until I can”. I then waited for the remonstration from the others (which of course happened) “But we’ve been ordered…” and as they fell straight into my trap, I replied “Then it’s not only satanic, but you have just described the first stage of Hitler’s Germany. Have you learned nothing?”


129923 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Caroline Watson, 9, #575 of 1675 🔗

A trained singer breathes low down, holds the air, and controls the outward flow with the abdominal muscles. The shoulders and neck must be relaxed and the throat open. Covering the face will send the body into fight or flight mode, causing high breathing, tension, an unsupported voice and poor intonation.

No wonder singing (if done as you explained) is great for health. It also improved oxygenation of cells

130062 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Caroline Watson, 1, #576 of 1675 🔗

I would say they are ‘complicit’. The hysteria is fake.

130300 ▶▶ annie, replying to Caroline Watson, 6, #577 of 1675 🔗

One if Their wickedest crimes is the silencing of the singing voice.

129896 NickR, replying to NickR, 5, #578 of 1675 🔗

Jonathon Sumption 8:15 interview on BBC R4 Today Programme. Listen to it. Brilliant! Compare & contrast with the policeman on before or the cretinous Kit Malthouse.

129945 ▶▶▶ Cbird, replying to Cbird, 1, #580 of 1675 🔗

Also on TalkRadio. Link above. What a hero

129899 Basics, 2, #581 of 1675 🔗

The number 27 to High Town or the 15.09 from Paddington would appear to make fine law abiding locations for weddings and funerals. Seating for all, out of the rain. A little bit drafty perhaps but nothing more than some churches. Return tickets for increased use of the buffet.

129909 p02099003, replying to p02099003, 2, #582 of 1675 🔗

I’ve just unfriended a former colleague on Facebook after she posted a link to this https://www.facebook.com/gammonmag/photos/a.324985478075280/772129983360825

129914 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to p02099003, #583 of 1675 🔗

NHS approval?

129924 ▶▶ CGL, replying to p02099003, 5, #584 of 1675 🔗

Our wonderful NHS that is letting thousands of people suffer and die while they all cower in their homes on full pay. Bastards.
I’m back of fb again for good now after 2 friends have already posted a chain thing that says something like “I’ve been wearing a mask in shops since . . . To those who would mock me for this I am educated enough to know that of I am asymptomatic I could pass it to you, I am caring enough . . . Blah blah”. So taking the moral and intellectual high ground. Classic virtue signalling tactics.

130011 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to CGL, 12, #585 of 1675 🔗

What is more disappointing is that I’m a nurse practitioner and have been working throughout in an urgent care centre. I am male over 50, with diabetes and so I’m in the high risk category; but I am trusting my immune system to respond appropriately.

130298 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to p02099003, 1, #586 of 1675 🔗

Great attitude.

130781 ▶▶▶ janis pennance, replying to CGL, #587 of 1675 🔗

I had the same posted by 3 friends ..it pissed me off , so I copied it , changed the wording and posted
It began … I havnt been wearing a mask in shopes because I’m intelligent enough to know they don’t work I went through and changed it all …it was fun LOL

129956 ▶▶ Oldschool, replying to p02099003, 11, #588 of 1675 🔗

I have recently unfriended 2 people who posted this crap, the worst thing is that I know the 2 people who posted actually work in administrative positions in the NHS and have been sitting on their well padded asses at home on full pay since March, courtesy of the British tax payer
Before I unfriended them I pointed this out to both of the sanctimonious ass wipes

129960 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to p02099003, 3, #589 of 1675 🔗

They got the first bit right “we have not placed our lives on the line for months”. Should’ve left it at that.

129913 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 14, #590 of 1675 🔗

Masks are the new plastic bags, they are clogging up the oceans and the sewers. More fish are dying from the pollution than people dying of covid

130451 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Dan Clarke, 1, #591 of 1675 🔗

And they’re more of a nuisance than single use plastic bags!

129920 NickR, replying to NickR, 3, #592 of 1675 🔗

Wales which is has a population 18 x smaller than England’s (3.1m v 56m) has over 50% of all Covid hospitalisations!!!!!!
Could this perhaps be something to do with the Welsh recording ‘suspected’ cases rather than those with a test.
I’ve only just spotted this!

129925 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to NickR, 1, #593 of 1675 🔗

As in many communist countries, you stay as far away as possible from any government authorities

129929 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Dan Clarke, #594 of 1675 🔗

Must be handy to be able to blame any deaths through NHS Wales incompetence on suspected/imaginary covid19

129926 ▶▶ RickH, replying to NickR, 1, #595 of 1675 🔗

An interesting observation, Nick.

I think that the most likely explanation lies within the inaccuracies of classification that have been present in this data shambles from the start.

Remember – there’s never been a satisfactory accounting for ‘Covid’ and the numbers actually infected.

129940 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to NickR, #596 of 1675 🔗

Worth asking the Welsh government that question? It looks bonkers, can’t be right.

Via https://mobile.twitter.com/welshgovernment?lang=en

129943 ▶▶ NickR, replying to NickR, 6, #597 of 1675 🔗

I think this is political, Drakeford & the Labour Party are effectively shafting Boris (as if he needs any help on that front!).
But this is an absolute scandal, the Welsh doctors are inflating the numbers of hospitalisations astronomically.

129952 ▶▶ Will, replying to NickR, #598 of 1675 🔗

There is another post about it up the thread.

130015 ▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to NickR, #599 of 1675 🔗

Hi Nick,
I posted some adjusted figures for Wales earlier today, giving them their “fair share” of hospitalisations pro rata to their population – the effect on the figures is dramatic.

130040 ▶▶▶ NickR, replying to BTLnewbie, 2, #600 of 1675 🔗

I think the key missing data is just how many of these poor sods being hospitalised are admitted due to covid & how many are admitted for something else and fail a PCR test on it’s 34th cycle. Also, how many are nosocomial infections, how many have come from a care home & how many from being cared for at home.
I suspect just about 0 are people who one day were kicking about the town, got infected, got ill & finished up in hospital. That’s the implied picture but I think it’s vanishingly rare.

130137 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to NickR, #601 of 1675 🔗

Separate NHS England figures can be found here but they are not published daily
All of these concerns about hospital data seem like they need the attention of CEBM.

130307 ▶▶ RickH, replying to NickR, #602 of 1675 🔗

Nick – I forgot (I hadn’t read their article) – but the CEBM has done a paper on this :


129927 mjr, 1, #603 of 1675 🔗

Keep Britain Free: Life Post Covid Report
I took this survey in Mid August (linked from this site( .
Had email to tell me results are out
Click here for full results and more info

129930 Recusant, replying to Recusant, 8, #604 of 1675 🔗

How do we dob people in to the Covid marshalls? Can we do it anonymously through crimestoppers? I should think that a few hundred false alarms would divert enough police resources for the whole thing to become unworkable.

129941 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Recusant, 9, #605 of 1675 🔗

I was thinking of emailing my MP saying I was having a gathering of 10 adults this afternoon at 3pm, giving him my address and inviting him for a chat about false positives. See if he reports me to the police

129944 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Recusant, 3, #606 of 1675 🔗

has anyone seen a Covid Womble? Are they active from today? Do they have a uniform ? Have any been beaten up yet?

129950 ▶▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to mjr, 3, #607 of 1675 🔗

Do you mean a Johnson Jackass?

129992 ▶▶ Arnie, replying to Recusant, 1, #608 of 1675 🔗

I love it! I’m definitely on this.

129934 Bella, replying to Bella, 28, #609 of 1675 🔗

This was copied from Save Our Rights Facebook page and sums up what a load of bulshit this is.

“I live in the plague infested town of Bolton and have a close family friend of mine who is a nurse at Royal Bolton Hospital.
She told me by PM this 2 days
ago (on the understanding that I didn’t screenshot it) “the hospital is
like a ghost town now, we have dozens and dozens of empty beds, (which is
unheard of at this normally very busy hospital). We had 5 dedicated CV wards, 4
are empty and the 1 remaining has 3 patients in it.”
She is petrified of losing her
job, as all nurses and doctors at the hospital were sent an email, stating in
no uncertain terms that they must not say anything on social media or speak to
the press about what’s been happening at the hospital in recent months.
The worst thing of all is that
the Royal Bolton hospital (like all others) has cancelled ALL operations and
treatments for the foreseeable future. 1000s of ppl are going to die because of
this. This is disgraceful and an unreported national scandal.”

So I have a question for Toby whose efforts on this site are laudable and for which I am grateful:  Now that TPTB (across the whole of Europe it seems) are bending over backwards to CREATE a second wave and another lockdown despite all the clinical evidence against an escalation of illness (not ‘cases’) do you really think that this is no more than a catalogue of incompetence and not a global agenda of some sort? Johnson, Hancock et al have all seen the figures we have seen,  they know a second lockdown will be economic suicide (in whatever guise) and yet they insist on pursuing it, as do other countries.  Are they all just incompetent? I work in the storytelling industry and no editor would buy that implausible explanation for a minute now given the narrative that has unfolded.

129953 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bella, 9, #610 of 1675 🔗

A global agenda by which who gains? And if there are global forces powerful enough to prevent democratic governments to function as democratic governments, then why go to all this trouble? There are easier ways than concocting something that is difficult to set off, even more difficult to control once set off, and yet so many “special people” seem able to see through it so clearly. The economic devastation alone, never mind the numbers of highly dangerous hungry people with absolutely nothing to lose, would give any wannabe world-leader-megalomaniac a total nightmare to control. Does that sound like good planning to you? It sure as hell doesn’t to me, the very opposite in fact.

A better understanding of politics may be required, certainly in the larger countries. The government now admits that it got it wrong, that it shut down the economy for no real reason, all by accident, then that government will fall. It will fall because it will get every penny it has sued out of it by those who have suffered because of lockdown. At the very least, that party will face annihilation at the next election. In most countries, expect criminal proceedings.

They fear a lack of a second wave not because of “global forces” or whatever nonsense the conspiracy loons have dreamed up today, but because they fear their electorates. And with good reason. Because they will be slung from power, and all those concerned will face inquiries, commissions and, in many countries, criminal trials.

This last bit is the bit I’m looking forward to.

But no conspiracy is required.

129981 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Nick Rose, 7, #611 of 1675 🔗

World Economic Forum members gain.

it’s even on their website in the open as “the Great Reset”.

130701 ▶▶▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to Awkward Git, #612 of 1675 🔗

The Great Reset. God how I hate that. Also the phrase Building Back Better is becoming more and more common … where’s that come from?

130146 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Nick Rose, 7, #613 of 1675 🔗

I’d love to think the end of your third para carried weight but I doubt it. But when you talk about ‘conspiracy loons’ you are pretty much doing the establishment’s job for them. The WEF exists, Davos exists, Face Masks For All exists. (Face masks for everyone on the planet, all the time. No agenda there? A massive symbol of compliance?) I was called a conspiracy nut when I suggested really early on that WMD was a hoax, how’d that play out? People who were fighting against the tobacco industry in the 1960s, claiming it was harmful to health and the public should be made aware, were called conspiracy nuts. At a time when many doctors recommended smoking. What happened there?

130193 ▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Bella, 1, #614 of 1675 🔗

That the organisations exist doesn’t necessarily mean they are controlling things.

There’s a plot in the second radio series of Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy about a planet where the economy was driven past the point where it became impossible to build anything other than shoe shops (called the shoe event horizon). The people evolved into birds and refused ever to set foot on the ground again. Part of the story involves an evil shoe corporation which has what they call a “shoe shop intensifier ray” ostensibly designed to force the creation of shoe shops, but the truth is that the ray does nothing, the shoe event horizon is a sad, but natural feature of economics and the corporation has simply convinced themselves that they are responsible because it seems exciting.

Now, we know that some political movements do get the ear of some government ministers at some times – witness Michael Gove fawning over Saint Greta – but it’s a much bigger ask to believe that the entire political establishments of most countries have been taken over by these groups. Indeed, if they had, we’d expect their policies to be much more closely aligned instead of randomy authoritarian with some cross-influence (such as the way Johnson has followed nearly everything that Sturgeon has enacted). There’ll be some influence, certainly – I’ve no doubt that SAGE will have used faked research from face mask pressure groups to claim they are useful – but that’s not the same as saying that our government is actively pursuing an agenda set down by those organisations.

130229 ▶▶▶ Samhurt, replying to Nick Rose, #615 of 1675 🔗

I thought I’d respond to you directly Nick but my comment turned out a bit too broad, might fare better upthread.

130507 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Nick Rose, #616 of 1675 🔗


We are in the middle of a financial crisis and coronavirus has been used to cover up the reality.

129958 ▶▶ Rabbit, replying to Bella, 7, #617 of 1675 🔗

The annoying thing is that even if a percentage of those doctors and nurses spoke up, you couldn’t sack them all and even if they did try to do that, surely it would trigger others in the profession speaking out in disgust as it potentially has meant a close friend, mentor etc being unfairly treated.

….this is an ideal world scenario, which as well know doesn’t exist anymore.

129963 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Rabbit, 4, #618 of 1675 🔗

I’d quite happily crowdfund a protection fund for them.

130295 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to DRW, 1, #619 of 1675 🔗

And if the fund grew big enough, we could start an alternative health service dedicated to helping these who are ill. Novel idea, what?

130055 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Bella, 4, #620 of 1675 🔗

What is the end game of all these empty hospitals? A conspiracy theorist would say this is a means of killing people by negligence as part of Agenda 2030 and the green agenda’s population control. Threatening NHS staff with unemployment for speaking out is sinister and the actions of a despotic government.

130224 ▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Lili, 1, #621 of 1675 🔗

But when have you ever come across an extermination programme where they didn’t care who the victims were or even if they might end up amongst them themselves? Genodicial maniacs usually target particular groups, sometimes ethnic or religious, sometimes based on a perceived threat to the regime. Closing hospitals to regular patients doesn’t do that – it means that the victims are more-or-less random other than there being a bias toward the elderly – and could easily include themselves if the shutdown prevented them being diagnosed with a cancer that is treatable in its early stages.

130239 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Bella, 4, #622 of 1675 🔗

I mentioned yesterday that a girl i know 22 years old died because she didn’t get the transplant she needed, a transplant of an organ from her sister i might add. One of the shills pretending to be on our side called me out on it like i was lying. It’s horrendous. I don’t what it’s gonna take to sort this out. And watch out for the “friendly” posters whom i believe are at work for the state to so division.

129946 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 7, #623 of 1675 🔗

exemption to the rule of 6

  • support groups – formally organised groups to provide mutual aid, therapy or any other form of support. This includes support to victims of crime, recovering addicts, new parents, people with long-term illnesses, those facing issues relating to their sexuality or gender, and those who have suffered bereavement.

so, lockdown sceptic support groups would be legal if ‘formally organised’

129970 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to steve_w, 5, #624 of 1675 🔗

It could also be applicable to people who need support from the stress brought on from what the government are doing, there are a lot of people like that now.

129999 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Dan Clarke, #625 of 1675 🔗

this is a better idea. if lockdown is causing you stress then join a lockdown support group. could hold your meetings in ‘spoons

130022 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to steve_w, #626 of 1675 🔗

or any other form of support.

That’s the good bit!

130107 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to steve_w, #627 of 1675 🔗

Love these exemptions. Where did you find?

I equally love the mask exemptions about not wearing if they cause you distress. So that’s basically everyone exempt… you only need to wear it if you’re an advocate of “safetyism”

130505 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to steve_w, #628 of 1675 🔗

Very good to know. I am trying to get an anti corona support group going in my town. With hopefully the extra agenda of planning political pressure.

129949 Nsklent, 4, #629 of 1675 🔗

Results of a survey FYI

A massive 5,416 people took part in the survey including:

1,375 members of Keep Britain Free2,621 people who followed KBF on social media or used the website1,420 people who do not follow KBF who will have seen retweets of the survey request.

The survey was designed to represent the views of people who are unhappy with decisions the UK government has taken in the past six months.  We think it is the most comprehensive survey of its kind at this time.  Response so far has been very positive.

My top findings are:

9/10 people who took part in the survey are extremely concerned about the ways in which the government has taken decisions in the past 6 months. 9/10 think decisions have been taken by the UK government in the past 6 month in an illogical way, 8/10 inconsistently.When asked who they think had the most significant influence on decisions taken by the government, scientific advisers outranked MPs by more than four to one (selected by 8/10 and 2/10 respectively).A third of those working are unsure of their future.Three quarters would like a specific/named GP who they are able to see when they need to do so; three quarters would like in person consultations.Amongst those with school age children more than 9/10 (94%) thought it was safe for children to return to school.  Only 1 out of 1,652 parents felt school was unsafe due to Covid.98% agree we need to restore joy to life.97% agree the government willneed to work hard to restore trust.

129957 Andrew, replying to Andrew, 14, #631 of 1675 🔗

Ian Brown is tweeting again. Good lad.

So im a Conspiracy Theorist HA! a term invented by the lame stream media to discredit those who can smell and see through the government/media lies and propaganda #researchanddestroy

129985 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Andrew, 1, #632 of 1675 🔗

Do you know, Ian makes it look effortless. Partly because it is. Good for him.

130008 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Andrew, #633 of 1675 🔗

Top man as always.

129959 hotrod, 1, #634 of 1675 🔗

Can anyone with a DT account explain what this story says please?

Curious as to why the French are carrying on regardless but at the same time France are being held up as an example to us to justify draconian rules.


129961 zacaway, 6, #635 of 1675 🔗

Keep Britain Free: Life Post Covid Report

Results of the Keep Britain Free survey on Life Post Covid, that will be submitted to the House of Lords Life Post Covid committee.

A massive 5,416 people took part in the survey including:

  • 1,375 members of Keep Britain Free
  • 2,621 people who followed KBF on social media or used the website
  • 1,420 people who do not follow KBF who will have seen retweets of the survey request.

The survey was designed to represent the views of people who are unhappy with decisions the UK government has taken in the past six months. We think it is the most comprehensive survey of its kind at this time. Response so far has been very positive. Top findings are:

  • 9/10 people who took part in the survey are extremely concerned about the ways in which the government has taken decisions in the past 6 months.
  • 9/10 think decisions have been taken by the UK government in the past 6 month in an illogical way, 8/10 inconsistently.
  • When asked who they think had the most significant influence on decisions taken by the government, scientific advisers outranked MPs by more than four to one (selected by 8/10 and 2/10 respectively).
  • A third of those working are unsure of their future.
  • Three quarters would like a specific/named GP who they are able to see when they need to do so; three quarters would like in person consultations.
  • Amongst those with school age children more than 9/10 (94%) thought it was safe for children to return to school.
  • Only 1 out of 1,652 parents felt school was unsafe due to Covid.
  • 98% agree we need to restore joy to life.
  • 97% agree the government will need to work hard to restore trust.


129962 Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 8, #636 of 1675 🔗

Why has this excellent article not been given the right of user comments? Is it becasue the DT know that everyone on there will batter the Government? https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/09/14/boris-johnson-must-bin-rule-six-stop-panicking/

129966 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 7, #637 of 1675 🔗

The fact that the DT are now publishing this shows some change over last week or so.

129971 ▶▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to hotrod, 4, #638 of 1675 🔗

Take the DT with a pinch of salt. They’ll post a new article shortly after this one blowing smoke up his arse. All they do is gaslight their readers which is why I cancelled my subscription.

129974 ▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to NonCompliant, 5, #639 of 1675 🔗

At least they are giving both sides of the argument, unlike the BBC and the Guardian which never publishes any sceptical commentary.

129975 ▶▶▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth, replying to NonCompliant, 1, #640 of 1675 🔗

Yeah it’s annoying how they chop and change. I understand how columnists work but the main news side of the DT is crackers!

129976 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to NonCompliant, 1, #641 of 1675 🔗

The Torygiraffe excels in blowing both ways.

129980 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 2, #642 of 1675 🔗

Is Boris panicking though, or is he being ordered to do what he’s doing

129991 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Dan Clarke, #643 of 1675 🔗

Ordered by whom?

129998 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #644 of 1675 🔗

Powerful interests, which I suspect got at him with their orders when he was “ill in hospital”. We know the IMF tried to bribe Belarus into maskist-lockdownism.

130000 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DRW, #645 of 1675 🔗

So the IMF is trying to take over the world then?

130016 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #646 of 1675 🔗

Not the IMF specifically but this does seem to have been exploited by the big global orgs and their backers to push their agendas. Not saying that’s definitely true as not every country is in line. But I have been very suspicious.

130021 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DRW, 1, #647 of 1675 🔗

Oh there are people pushing their agendas all right, but that’s not the same as giving the orders.

130050 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #648 of 1675 🔗

True, they might not be issuing blunt orders but they can still have vast influence to get their way. Of course the main event could still be a giant global groupthinky cock-up followed by cover-up. It just all feels really cynical though.

130014 ▶▶▶▶▶ BJJ, replying to DRW, 4, #649 of 1675 🔗

British government is ordering vaccines for billions of pounds. So it seems that ministers are on the take. It explains everything.

130036 ▶▶▶▶▶ Andrew, replying to DRW, 2, #650 of 1675 🔗

100% they would not ccomply with lockdown so the usual suspects were sent in to stir the trouble up. Noticed how the msm are whipping it up over here also..

130069 ▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to DRW, 5, #651 of 1675 🔗

WHO, IMF and World Bank all pushing this pandemic narrative and how they expect countries to handle it.

130005 ▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 1, #652 of 1675 🔗

The general thesis is here from PM Castex
“We are, he said, going to have to learn to live with Covid, which will be with us “for several months”. It is up to the citizens to be responsible and behave themselves in line with preventive guidelines – and for local authorities to impose such restrictions as they feel necessary in their own districts.”
The theme is – there will be no 2nd lockdown; life goes on uninterrupted by Government; sport with crowds is resuming
So the French know how to Keep Calm and Carry On – if only they had a word for insouciance!

129964 jhfreedom, 2, #653 of 1675 🔗

Here is the Sumption interview on Today this morning:


Starts at 2H17m.

129965 godowneasy, 1, #654 of 1675 🔗

Theme tune suggestion:

You can’t argue with a sick mind – Joe Walsh (album)

129973 leggy, replying to leggy, 9, #655 of 1675 🔗

A comment from a forum that I frequent:

“The death rate is still several times higher than it was when we first decided to STAY AT HOME. We haven’t been out since early March and don’t intend to go out any time soon. There are plenty like us (which is thought to be why the death rate isn’t, yet, accelerating as fast as the infection rate at the moment).”

This person is a pilot, so obviously not a thicko. I can’t tell you how angry I am that people are being made to feel this way.

129989 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to leggy, 8, #656 of 1675 🔗

Its sad that the propaganda is working this way, but if they feel that way, they should stay at home, while the rest who don’t feel that way should live normally. The government has lost the plot and it’s no accident.

130004 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Dan Clarke, 5, #657 of 1675 🔗

Someone who hasn’t looked after their mental health thinks people should listen to them….

129990 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to leggy, 17, #658 of 1675 🔗

CORRECTION: This person WAS a pilot, because civil aviation will not exist after the sick, twisted mentality that they are exhibiting has run its course and completely destroyed our society and economy. Fucking prick deserves everything they get.

130532 ▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Richard O, #659 of 1675 🔗

You beat me to it – I was going to make this exact point!

130019 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to leggy, 9, #660 of 1675 🔗

Not the pilot of any plane I’m ever on I pray. “Don’t worry about the turbulence, I’m dealing with it by crashing the plane.”

130065 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to leggy, 1, #661 of 1675 🔗

Obviously sucking information from thin air

130136 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to leggy, 4, #662 of 1675 🔗

I expect he has a nice abode with garden, which makes the self-isolating lark a bit easier.
One wonders how his immune system will function if he ever emerges..

130235 ▶▶ davews, replying to leggy, #663 of 1675 🔗

Yes, I recognise which forum you are talking about. There seems to be a large number of contributors on there who have taken to the official line 100% which seems to be strange when most are highly technically qualified. However a few sceptics seem to stick their neck out from time to time.

130287 ▶▶ annie, replying to leggy, #664 of 1675 🔗

Gee. What a miserable git.

130531 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to leggy, #665 of 1675 🔗

What is their long term plan? To stay at home forever?

129978 Don't say much, replying to Don't say much, 13, #666 of 1675 🔗

Hi everyone, this is my first comment after lurking for while here. I have just read Lord Sumptions article and I noticed a distinct pattern in the likes, in the comments section.

I had a look at the first 20 comments 7 were negative, 2 neutral and 11 positive. The negs had a total of 6 thumbs up I.e less than 1 per comment by contrast the 11 positives had 217 likes or nigh on 20 each.

I know it’s just a straw in the wind, but hopefully it’s a sign that things are starting to go our way.

130867 ▶▶ wat tyler, replying to Don't say much, #667 of 1675 🔗

Welcome and say much more .

129979 Basics, replying to Basics, 3, #668 of 1675 🔗

Leafletting. Leaflets. Leaflets. & Pamphlets for those who don’t know what a leaflet is.

Vernon Coleman website has leaflet texts ready and prepared.


Look under the Health button on the left hand menu if you don’t land on the correct page from the link above.

129994 ▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to Basics, 7, #669 of 1675 🔗

I think the way to go here is with facts and data mate. Calling it a hoax from the off isn’t going to persuade Joe Public to read it, even the more scepticle ones.
I do agree on the leafletting campaign though, we gotta get out and in peoples faces before it’s too late.

130026 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to NonCompliant, 4, #670 of 1675 🔗

At the risk of thinking for you I’ve taken the liberty of not copying the word hoax. See how it turned out?

Dr Vernon Coleman MB ChB DSc FRSA

I can demolish the whole coronavirus nonsense in less than three minutes. Everything in this list can be verified.

1. Many doctors, including Dr Fauci, the American coronavirus supremo, have admitted that the risk of dying of the coronavirus may be similar to the risk with the flu.
2. The flu can kill 650,000 people a year around the world. Even though governments everywhere have admitted fiddling their totals, the covid-19 death total is only now approaching the global flu total.
3. Here’s how they fiddled the figures. In the UK, for example, anyone who tested positive for the coronavirus and subsequently died, was officially a covid-19 death – whatever else they had wrong with them.
4. The vast majority of those dying of the coronavirus were over 80 and had many other health problems. The risk for fit, young individuals is very small. The risk for children is smaller than the risk of being hit by lightning.
5. Research has shown that masks are dangerous, don’t prevent the spread of infection and almost certainly do more harm than good. The virus can go straight through the material of a mask. And mask wearing affects blood oxygen levels. At least two people have died through wearing masks. I’ve quoted figures and papers on my website http://www.vernoncoleman.com and in other videos on YouTube.
6. Many of those promoting the coronavirus horror story are linked in some way to the vaccine industry or the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation – which itself has strong financial links to the vaccine industry. For example, the Chief Scientific Advisor in the UK was formerly a senior executive at GSK – one of the big vaccine makers.
7. The British Government has admitted that at least four times as many people have died as a result of the lockdowns and other control measures as will have died from the coronavirus. The remedy has been much deadlier than the disease. Millions are waiting for cancer tests and treatment because hospitals were closed. And some hospital departments in the UK are still closed.
8. Neil Ferguson, the man whose predictions led to the lockdowns had produced a number of inaccurate predictions before he made wildly pessimistic predictions about the coronavirus. His track record is appalling. The college where he works has financial links to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and vaccines.
9. Exactly the same mistakes have been made in almost every country in the world. For example, sick old people were taken out of hospital and dumped in care homes – resulting in tens of thousands of deaths in each country. That couldn’t be a coincidence – so it had to be a plan. If you remove the care home deaths from the UK total you end up with a maximum of around 20,000 deaths (though that is a massive exaggeration because they included flu and anyone who tested positive) which is much smaller than the annual flu death total.
10. The number of people who have caught the coronavirus worldwide is now said to be around 10 million. But the flu can affect 1 billion in a single year.

These are facts which cannot be disputed, though they are being suppressed. Print out the list and give copies to doubters. I find it difficult to believe that anyone would still want to wear a mask once they are aware of these simple facts.

Copyright Vernon Coleman August 2020

130413 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Basics, #671 of 1675 🔗

A few comments.

(3) is incorrect. This is not how deaths in the UK were reported.

(4) is incorrect. The ONS figures for deaths in England and Wales involving COVID-19 registered up to 28 August 2020, by age group and sex
Men under 85: 18650; 85 or over: 10118
Women under 85: 11557; 85 or over: 11957
Total under 85: 30107; 85 or over: 22075

(7) is an illogical comparison. Comparing deaths from different causes under lockdown tells you nothing about whether death tolls would have been greater or less under some other scenario.

130023 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Basics, 2, #672 of 1675 🔗

Loads of leaflets, what is going to stop any of this, can we? Can’t believe even the most fanatical covid believer wouldnt want to at least question what is happening

129986 Jimmy, replying to Jimmy, 12, #673 of 1675 🔗

It is a scientific fact that there is no Covid-19‭ ‬test.‭ ‬The RT-PCR test being used by governments can only ever report the presence of genetic material in a sample.‭ ‬It cannot report anything about the nature of that genetic material present and there is a myriad of sources of generic material in the fluids sampled from the human body.‭ ‬It is a scientific fact that no Covid-19‭ ‬novel virus has ever been identified because no such virus has ever been purified,‭ ‬electron-micrographed,‭ ‬and genetically sequenced.‭ ‬So there is nothing to compare the RT-PCR generated positive sample to in order to claim a Covid-19‭ ‬positive test return.‭ ‬Thus,‭ ‬ALL reports of positive Covid-19‭ ‬patients are false‭; ‬every single one of them.‭ ‬But everything is being reported by government and the media as Covid-19‭ ‬positive.‭ ‬Moreover,‭ ‬99%‭ ‬of alleged Covid-19‭ ‬cases are mild,‭ ‬and‭ ‬99.85%‭ ‬of all cases fully recover.‭ ‬Of the‭ ‬0.15%‭ ‬that do not fully recover,‭ ‬those that have died mostly in their‭ ‬80s,‭ ‬90s,‭ ‬and over‭ ‬100‭ ‬years of age and most with other illnesses that have weakened them‭; ‬precisely those who die all the time from influenza.‭ ‬It is impossible to prevent all these people from dying from influenza.‭ ‬In even finer perspective,‭ ‬1.6‭ ‬million people die every year around the world from tuberculosis,‭ ‬1.4‭ ‬million children under‭ ‬5‭ ‬die of pneumonia every year,‭ ‬every year up to‭ ‬1‭ ‬billion people contract influenza and up to‭ ‬650,000‭ ‬die from it.‭ ‬Tobacco kills at least‭ ‬3‭ ‬million people every year and similarly for alcohol abuse.‭ ‬In Australia,‭ ‬about‭ ‬430‭ ‬people are admitted to hospitals across the country every single day for acute alcohol poisoning and if not for medical intervention most,‭ ‬if not all of them,‭ ‬would die.‭ ‬But there have been no gaol lockdowns for influenza,‭ ‬tuberculosis,‭ ‬tobacco,‭ ‬or alcohol,‭ ‬and no frantic efforts to produce miraculous‭ ‘‬vaccines‭’ ‬in a few months for any,‭ ‬when actual vaccines take at least‭ ‬10‭ ‬years to develop and must undergo extensive testing.‭

129995 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Jimmy, 5, #674 of 1675 🔗

Agree. We are on a very short timeline now to stop this getting worse and turning it around.

130013 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jimmy, 10, #675 of 1675 🔗

All of which adds up the to the greatest crime against humanity in history.

130020 ▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Jimmy, 1, #676 of 1675 🔗

It is a scientific fact that no Covid-19‭ ‬novel virus has ever been identified because no such virus has ever been purified,‭ ‬electron-micrographed,‭ ‬and genetically sequenced

Just to point out that either you’re using most of the words in that sentence in a rather idiosyncratic way, or an awful lot of people (some of whom I actually know) are lying their heads off.

130043 ▶▶▶ Cruella, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #677 of 1675 🔗

Can you expand on this?

130077 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Cruella, 1, #678 of 1675 🔗

My understanding is that numerous scientists, and as I say I know a few, have claimed to have done all of those things. Perhaps it’s some verbal quibble, or perhaps all those claims are false. Or perhaps the post is simply incorrect.

130041 ▶▶ Cruella, replying to Jimmy, -1, #679 of 1675 🔗

Nicely put.

130057 ▶▶ John P, replying to Jimmy, 2, #680 of 1675 🔗

You’re the sort of prat that give people like Toby a bad name.

Covid19 is the disease caused by the SARS-Cov-2 virus.


The test is too sensitive and is producing lots of false positives. However, the virus (SARS-Cov-2) is clearly real.

130143 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to John P, 1, #681 of 1675 🔗

PS: Jimmy, I apologise for the first line of my comment.

We’re all frustrated and the situation is very confusing.

130061 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Jimmy, #682 of 1675 🔗

Great post

129987 NonCompliant, replying to NonCompliant, 21, #683 of 1675 🔗

This new party I keep hearing about needs to up and running, making noise and going for the jugular before the end of the week. It needs to get a groundswell of members/supporters officially signed up and also encourage those members, who are members of the useless big 3, to cancel their memberships and explain to their lords and master why.
The window he is very short. If that sunset clause doesn’t get invoked then we’re well and truly screwed. This isn’t going to stop at the “rule of six”, they’ll be coming at us on the internet.
Come on Toby, us plebs are itching to get going !

130064 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to NonCompliant, 2, #684 of 1675 🔗

Agree. We need this up and running and in the news challenging the narrative

130001 kf99, replying to kf99, 9, #685 of 1675 🔗

Surprised to get a reply to my letter about Sturgeon using Covid to unilaterally extend her powers from Alister Jack – Secretary of State. He addressed the question and it’s not a stock reply. He seems pretty switched on to the issues.

130281 ▶▶ annie, replying to kf99, #686 of 1675 🔗

Can you quote?

130325 ▶▶▶ kf99, replying to annie, #687 of 1675 🔗

Roughly that Westminster is sovereign, and can legislate on any issue, it is only by convention that it doesn’t intervene in devolved matters. (Meaning to me that they would if need be…)

130002 Mark, replying to Mark, 25, #688 of 1675 🔗

Pretty depressing experience this morning going for a chest x-ray (cancer). The receptionist waved a mask at me but I said I can’t wear one so she very politely said “that’s fine, we just have to ask”.

Waiting room with nearly 40 seats and about 7 or 8 masked victims sitting spaced around it, big red crosses on all the other seats. During my half hour or so wait, three people (all of them not particularly healthy looking, one in particular elderly and shuffling, with a walking stick, and clearly not breathing well through the mask though probably due to underlying issues rather than the mask itself but presumably that doesn’t help) were told they’d turned up too early and asked to return in 15-20 minutes as the waiting room was “a little crowded”(!)

Rules over humanity, basically, and stupid pointless rules, at that.

130044 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Mark, 7, #689 of 1675 🔗

I agree with your observations. As a frequent flier in health environments, I have the utmost respect in general for the individuals I deal with.

But the top-down inversion of normal medical ethics that you outline and I too see is quite incomprehensible. The normal harm/benefit equation has been thrown out the window, let alone any realistic assessment of risk from a fairly ordinary virus that has clearly virtually disappeared into the statistical noise.

130130 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 6, #690 of 1675 🔗

Clearly in the NHS it’s mostly institutionally imposed and very difficult to fight, for any individual. But a fair few of the staff are true believers as well, including even among the senior clinical staff. As you rightly say, it’s the reverse of what medical ethics should dictate.

Some big questions to ask of the medical profession if and when all this is over, I think.

130277 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Mark, 4, #691 of 1675 🔗

After WW2 there was a doctors’ trial, calling some of them at least to account for their monstrous betrayal of the ethical standards of their profession.

130658 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to annie, 1, #692 of 1675 🔗

Unfortunately, so far the lawyers haven’t exactly covered themselves in glory….

130012 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 21, #693 of 1675 🔗

We were promised it would all be over in three weeks.

Seven months later we find ourselves living under a dictatorship

The safest option might to be to leave the country and see how this things develops

I know people who have left for these reasons

This may get a lot, lot worse

To escape with your life may be the best you can hope for

130025 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Cecil B, 6, #694 of 1675 🔗

If/when we go all the way into the dystopian hell of permanent totalitarian technocracy, to escape this place with my soul intact is the best I am hoping for.

130079 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Cecil B, 4, #695 of 1675 🔗

Where did they go?

130280 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #696 of 1675 🔗


130306 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to Cecil B, 3, #697 of 1675 🔗

Yes, but where to go? If this is part of a worldwide conspiracy even Sweden may not be safe forever. The future looks increasingly like it’s going to be health passports to do virtually anything, together with massive surveillance and control of populations. I’m not sure there’s anywhere to go.

130017 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 13, #698 of 1675 🔗

There is one thing about this utter madness that you can’t deny, and that it’s not amusing and entertaining.
We went to visit our elder son and his partner last Saturday and of course the usual ” wash your hands and social distance” bit ( I always pretend to wash my hands/sanitize) in these situations
My wife had purchased a car a few days before and of course our son and his partner went to look at it.
Now comes the amusing bit, she “social distanced” from the car.
I rest my case!

130032 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Fingerache Philip., 3, #699 of 1675 🔗

I’m banned, apparently I mentioned that there are always ‘anomalies’ in health, ie young who are affected by something or other.

130037 ▶▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 1, #700 of 1675 🔗

ie when given an example of one ‘younger’ person

130068 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Fingerache Philip., 3, #701 of 1675 🔗

For the young to act like this…do they not read around the subject (no offence intended and no reflection on your efforts to educate them).

130028 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #702 of 1675 🔗

Has anybody suggested the COMMON SENSE PARTY?

130033 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Fingerache Philip., 1, #703 of 1675 🔗

Don’t think that would fly because common sense is now banned.

How about The Party’s Over Party ?

130038 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Fingerache Philip., #704 of 1675 🔗

Ye – it’s a rubbish title – since all the mask wearers would claim ‘common sense’ as a justification.

… and indeed ‘blind prejudice’ is another term for ‘common sense’.

Statistical insight and concepts of real risk and probability have never been a feature of ‘common sense’.

130046 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to RickH, #705 of 1675 🔗

AGREED, I see your point.
Back to the drawing board.

130042 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Fingerache Philip., #706 of 1675 🔗

Open Britain Party?

130045 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Fingerache Philip., 1, #707 of 1675 🔗

the Herding Cats Party?

130047 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, #708 of 1675 🔗

the Safe Party

130067 ▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, #709 of 1675 🔗

the confidence party

130172 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Fingerache Philip., #710 of 1675 🔗

I did on here, yes.

130030 nat, replying to nat, 5, #711 of 1675 🔗

I have just read what Will picked out from the govt consultation paper about the unlicensed vaccine. A number of us have posted about this in recent weeks, but there are no end to the horrors which continue to reveal themselves:

If manufacturers are asked to supply an unlicensed medicine… it is unfair also to ask them to take responsibility for the consequences of the use of that medicine in the way that they normally would

Crikey !

130108 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to nat, 3, #712 of 1675 🔗

As I told them (across several replies) in the consultation, if it’s unlicenced, hasn’t been rigorously tested, is administered by an unqualified person, those responsible cannot be held to account if it goes wrong, and the law must be amended for it to be administered, then I don’t want it.

130188 ▶▶▶ nat, replying to Nick Rose, #713 of 1675 🔗

Good for you ! I have noticed that, in spite of the rise in pro vaccine propaganda, the number of people unwilling to have it is rising.

130442 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to nat, 1, #714 of 1675 🔗

Who are these morons and why are they running your country?

130034 John P, replying to John P, 14, #715 of 1675 🔗

Police brutality in Melbourne. A man is run down by the police and then they stamp on his head:


According to this the man is now in a coma.

130039 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to John P, 8, #716 of 1675 🔗

We are many. They are few

130211 ▶▶▶ nat, replying to Cecil B, 4, #717 of 1675 🔗

So they say, but it doesn’t feel like that in Melbourne at the moment. I am only allowed out for 1 hour a day, but when I when I do go out, there are police everywhere, menacing and looking for trouble. Police helicopters overhead day and night.

130049 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to John P, 7, #718 of 1675 🔗

Disgusting – how long before they start shooting people?

130054 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to godowneasy, 6, #719 of 1675 🔗

Not long

130060 ▶▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to godowneasy, 5, #720 of 1675 🔗

It’s for their own good though, to prevent them catching the common cold.

130075 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to godowneasy, 3, #721 of 1675 🔗

Don’t encourage them.

130056 ▶▶ nat, replying to John P, 6, #722 of 1675 🔗

Shocking. It is has now become necessary to start recording on your phone whenever you see police interacting with the public

130103 ▶▶ Bella, replying to John P, 4, #723 of 1675 🔗

I heard an interview with Melbourne’s Chief of Police explaining why they don’t challenge BLM protests. Apparently it’s because they have a history of violence (as in USA) and Police Chief doesn’t want to exacerbate the situation. So just knock the shit out of peaceful protesters. And so the message is: Er, you don’t get what you want unless you are violent. Good thinking Batman. Can we see where this is going?

130443 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Bella, 2, #724 of 1675 🔗

Another moron.

130052 Hubes, replying to Hubes, 14, #725 of 1675 🔗

I just went for a walk. There is a new sign in the park that says “Nitrous oxide is no laughing matter”.

I demand a full hard lockdown and strict curfew until all nitrous oxide deaths globally are eradicated. I want the NHS to deal with nitrous oxide cases only. All other treatment must stop immediately. All functioning society as we know it must cease until nitrous oxide is a thing of the past.

Stay safe folks and ffs wear a damn mask if you’re around anybody inhaling nitrous oxide.

130058 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Hubes, 10, #726 of 1675 🔗

a lot of people die ‘with’ athletes foot. I don’t think it gets enough attention. 600,000 people die a year in the UK after a positive athletes foot diagnosis

130078 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Hubes, 4, #727 of 1675 🔗

you can tell who is taking NO2 as they are the only members of the public you will see these days laughing

130198 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to mjr, 1, #728 of 1675 🔗

It’s N2O. NO2 is nitrogen dioxide and is a nasty brown vapour which wouldn’t have you laughing at all!

130446 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Edward, #729 of 1675 🔗

Diesel exhaust?

130615 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Edward, #730 of 1675 🔗

sorry … so used to writing CO2 on climate sceptic sites 🙂

130063 James Marker, replying to James Marker, 20, #731 of 1675 🔗

Some SAGE members steadfastly refuse to admit that they have been wrong all along, despite all the evidence now staring them in the face (most notably, the data from Sweden).  Sadly, no one in the government seems to have the scientific literacy either to challenge these people or to seek a second opinion from experts such as Anders Tegnell, Carl Heneghan and Sunetra Gupta.   To listen to the temerity of some SAGE members (Peter Openshaw, for example) you would think the cabinet is simply there to do as SAGE commands.  Why does the government put up with these people? The sheer incompetence of Boris et al. is compounded by the fact that several SAGE members barely disguise the fact that they hate conservatism and would happily destroy it.

130074 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to James Marker, 5, #732 of 1675 🔗

SAGE is not ‘Scientific’ if it argues against the evidence

130095 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Major Panic, 1, #733 of 1675 🔗

Sadly, “non-scientific” covers many scientists these days.

130155 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #734 of 1675 🔗

Well, I have a degree in a science, but I wouldn’t call myself a scientist.

I think the label is highly questionable when it comes to committee types, like those who sit on SAGE.

And individuals such as Neil Ferguson, I would not classify as “scientists” anyway. He’s a computer modeller with a physics degree.

Usually in science, the more that people study, the more specialised they become.

So it would not be reasonable to suggest that a physicist would know anything about chemistry and vice versa although they are both scientists.

And it would not be reasonable to suggest that an organic chemist would know a huge amount about crystallography, and vice versa, although they are both chemists.

130163 ▶▶▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to John P, 1, #735 of 1675 🔗

Does Neil Ferguson validate his models on Minecraft?

130201 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to p02099003, #736 of 1675 🔗

lol, they might be more accurate if he did …

130464 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to p02099003, #737 of 1675 🔗

Snakes & Ladders.

130076 ▶▶ mjr, replying to James Marker, 2, #738 of 1675 🔗

instead of having the “alternative SAGE” who are just a bunch of left leaning agitators, we need a “Real Alternative SAGE” . with scientists who are not satisfied with what is happening
Basically to act as a Red Team
This should be mandatory for any government decision making.
Wasn’t it fatso dePfeffle who finally decided to come out for Brexit after writing separate essays pro and anti Brexit and seeing which looked best.

130093 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to James Marker, 3, #739 of 1675 🔗

They’ve probably succeeded in destroying the “Conservative Party”, but that will only leave a gap for a new party to fill.

130109 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Nick Rose, #740 of 1675 🔗

I think that Oswald Mosley’s party before he formed the National union of fascists was called the New party.

130147 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Nick Rose, #741 of 1675 🔗

Every cloud has a silver lining.

(I’m not a Labour supporter either).

130117 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to James Marker, 1, #742 of 1675 🔗

The Twitter replies to Peter Openshaw’s greatest about everyone getting tested every day are a joy to behold. Uniformly anti mass testing.

130071 p02099003, replying to p02099003, 1, #743 of 1675 🔗

Snooping and reporting rule of 6 breakers is advised https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54142699

130073 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to p02099003, 5, #744 of 1675 🔗

talk about making a rod for his own back. Malthouse will now be under surveillance

130072 crimsonpirate, replying to crimsonpirate, 3, #745 of 1675 🔗

Magnificent Seven? Secret Seven? Nope we need Blakes Seven

130097 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #746 of 1675 🔗

Every Christmas we opened a Party Seven, guess that’s out the window now

Six out of seven dwarfs are not Happy

130123 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Cecil B, #747 of 1675 🔗

There is also to be a remake of Seven Brides for Seven Brothers.

130203 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to John P, 1, #748 of 1675 🔗

bit too much gender stereotyping there !!!!!

130271 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to John P, 1, #749 of 1675 🔗

And the week needs redesigning. Seven days so close together … scary.

130087 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #751 of 1675 🔗

Proving beyond a reasonable doubt that celebrities are entirely synthetic, and are completely in the service of the system. The sub-humans posting supportive comments deserve maximum pain and suffering, and they will get it too.

130098 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Tom Blackburn, #752 of 1675 🔗

Ian Brown – Kiss Ya Lips (No I.D)


130106 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Tom Blackburn, #753 of 1675 🔗

Oh, dear….

130085 Jack, replying to Jack, 1, #754 of 1675 🔗

The latest from James Corbett:
https://www.corbettreport.com/covid911/ – ‘From Homeland Security to Biosecurity’

Most of us have probably heard of Event 201 but I for one had not heard about ‘Crimson Contaigon’ before:

‘In his role as ASPR, Kadlec oversaw a joint exercise in 2019 named “ Crimson Contagion .” The drill included the National Security Council, the Pentagon, the Department of Homeland Security and a raft of other government agencies and simulated the US government’s response to a viral pandemic originating in China and spreading around the globe. Like Dark Winter, the “Crimson Contagion” exercise took place just months before the events it was simulating began to play out in real life. And, like Dark Winter, it gave participants like Kadlec the chance to argue that biosecurity was a pressing national security challenge that the country was ill-prepared to meet—an argument that he made to Congress with Dr. Anthony Fauci by his side just one week before the first reports of the novel coronavirus spreading in China.’ ( https://archive.org/details/crimson-contagion-2019/page/29/mode/2up )

130118 ▶▶ John P, replying to Jack, -7, #755 of 1675 🔗

Fine, but what is your point?

Assuming this to be true, then okay, you would probably expect the authorities to model what might happen in a pandemic originating from China and how they would deal with it.

Especially. given that about a quarter of the world’s population live in China and this is where other recent pandemics (SARS, bird flu) came from.

That doesn’t mean that it’s all part of some devious plot for world domination.

130289 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to John P, 4, #756 of 1675 🔗

so you keep saying but the uniform tyranny all over the world possibly might say otherwise

130088 Bella, replying to Bella, 32, #757 of 1675 🔗

Unless my ears deceive me Lord Sumption called Matt Hancock a gimlet-eyed fanatic on Talk Radio this morning. 🙂 Pass it on

130100 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Bella, 4, #758 of 1675 🔗

Not quite, but close enough to it for there to be no doubt as to what he meant. He very politely said that the government didn’t have a fe**ing clue.

130101 ▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, 7, #759 of 1675 🔗

Well, Sumption is a gentleman. Far too polite!

130132 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to John P, 5, #760 of 1675 🔗

Would you believe; Myself and Jonathan Sumption were born on the same day (9th December 1948) but that’s where the similarity ends, well apart from our attitude to the lockdown.

130210 ▶▶▶▶ Biggles, replying to Fingerache Philip., #761 of 1675 🔗

It’s alright for you, I share a birthday with Prince Andrew.

130236 ▶▶▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Biggles, 1, #762 of 1675 🔗

I truly pity you on that.

130317 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Bella, 1, #763 of 1675 🔗

You are correct, that’s exactly what he said. He’s pretty cross. https://youtu.be/ipaeGea5OZE?t=527

130359 ▶▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to Julian, #764 of 1675 🔗

At 9.35 into the clip- most unjudge-like language 😊

130094 thedarkhorse, replying to thedarkhorse, #765 of 1675 🔗

The government’s vaccination consultation documents are heavyweight and I admit I haven’t much of a head for that. What do people feel are the most important things to comment on? I already can see the issues re non-responsibility if someone dies from the vaccine….what else should we focus on?

130099 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to thedarkhorse, 7, #766 of 1675 🔗

I said that a vaccine should be voluntary, and should not be mandated. There should be no waiver for responsibility for a new vaccine where the long-term effects will not be known for possibly years.

130110 ▶▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Lms23, #767 of 1675 🔗

OK, it needs for me to be stuff I can easily relate to. The science angle is ok for me, I used to be in lab work. But the legal side really bugs me.

130124 ▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to thedarkhorse, #768 of 1675 🔗

The non-responsibility if someone has severe side effects (or as you say, dies) is obviously huge, and this applies basically across the board – companies, marketeers, everyone involved in it. Very concerning. Also there is mention of recruiting large numbers of people to administer the vaccine, presumably only a small % of them might be previously medically trained. They too will be exempt from all liability. Big, big red flag.

130102 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 37, #770 of 1675 🔗

No thanks to the bonkers, inhuman and draconian antisocial distancing and mandatory muzzling; our abysmal visitor figures has meant that my workplace has announced restructuring measures which will mean that more jobs will go. My colleagues and I are at risk at these proposals. I saw this coming months ago even before any redundancies were even announced.

Voluntary redundancy has been reopened in order to avoid or minimise the risk of compulsory ones. As I’ve said more than once this should never have happened and I lay the blame on Johnson. Wancock, Ferguson, Whitty and Vallance.

Also included in the blame are the lockdownistas who have swallowed the propaganda whole and seem to have little sympathy for those who are suffering from the effects of lockdown, social distancing and mandatory masking.I can only surmise that their fear has led them to lose perspective or because they’re financially cushioned that they have lost sight of the big picture.

What will it take for the government and people to wake up to the damage being caused by what was supposed to be a temporary measure?

130141 ▶▶ coalencanth12, replying to Bart Simpson, 9, #771 of 1675 🔗

Sorry to hear this. I went to visit a museum in the London area yesterday. On the way back into my flat in commuter land, I bumped into my somewhat dull next door neighbour*. He was not impressed to learn that I had visited an attraction and had fun (little does he know I’ve been doing this since June). ‘Why would you do such a thing…’ and so on. The interesting thing is he believes businesses, and leisure attractions are receiving high levels of government support and are in no danger at all. This might explain a lot of the mentality in this country. People are in for a rude awakening.

*I should explain a bit. My neighbour is a local, and in my commuter town, there is a big, big split between the locals and ‘incomers’, i.e. commuters and professionals. We lead largely separate lives and there is very little interaction across the barrier. Lockdown has made this problem worse as the chavvy locals seem to love causing social distancing and mask related upsets.

130161 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to coalencanth12, 8, #772 of 1675 🔗

Where I work receives no government funding and every penny made from ticket and retail sales is plowed straight back to pay for our salaries and operations such as conservation work.

Even those that receive state funding are in deep trouble from what I’ve heard and like us are suffering from dire visitor numbers.

This is not going to end well.

130166 ▶▶▶▶ coalencanth12, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #773 of 1675 🔗

When I’ve been in conversation with staff at London area galleries and museums, they have the problem of no high spending foreign visitors…! Very sorry to hear of your travails..!

130458 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to coalencanth12, 1, #774 of 1675 🔗

Yep. We are all in the same boat and we also missed out on the summer holidays as well when we usually get families and coach parties from all across the UK.

130105 Cecil B, 8, #775 of 1675 🔗


The wonderboy Henegan ripping the dictatorship a new one in the Spectator

130111 JohnMac, replying to JohnMac, 2, #776 of 1675 🔗

Legal question. Suppose your family comes over for Christmas and then your neighbour tips off the cops that you may have more than six people in your home.
So the cops come to your home to check.
Do you have to let them in?

130114 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to JohnMac, 3, #777 of 1675 🔗

I think there needs to be an established breach of the peace to force entry. Plus it would take a particularly miserable neighbour and police officer to do this at Christmas.

130131 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to jhfreedom, 2, #778 of 1675 🔗

I’m sure such people exist in a country of this many people.

130116 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to JohnMac, 2, #779 of 1675 🔗

Would they need a warrant of some kind to enter? At which point your extra guest hides under the stairs or whips out through the back door for a temporary period.

130120 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to thedarkhorse, 1, #780 of 1675 🔗

They wouldn’t be able to get a warrant at such short notice but would have to rely on existing powers.

130126 ▶▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to jhfreedom, 2, #781 of 1675 🔗

Keep an eye on the Liberty and National College of Policing websites. They are still updating to these new (idiotic) laws.

130128 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to jhfreedom, #782 of 1675 🔗

lol, well these days they don’t need much notice to pass a new law to suit them!

130133 ▶▶▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to John P, 2, #783 of 1675 🔗


Bottom of page 5 – says the laws don’t give power of entry. This for the Leicester lockdown.

Now, this may have changed for the new national ‘six’ rules. Watch this space.

Any criminal solicitors / barristers / police officers out there who know the answers already?

130139 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to jhfreedom, 1, #784 of 1675 🔗

Yes, but Christmas is still a few months off. If they want to then I’m sure they will change the law with the usual zero parliamentary scrutiny.

(Not that the Labour party would oppose them!)

130121 ▶▶ mjr, replying to JohnMac, 4, #785 of 1675 🔗

cant let them in .. cannot have two turkeys in the house at once

130127 ▶▶ John P, replying to JohnMac, -2, #786 of 1675 🔗

You have some nice neighbours. Don’t you get along with them?

130145 ▶▶▶ JohnMac, replying to John P, 4, #787 of 1675 🔗

That’s a really stupid reply because it’s actually quite an important point.
If you know that you don’t have to let the police in then you can go ahead and invite whoever you like, and not have your family Christmas spoiled.

130184 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to JohnMac, #788 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for the abuse. My point stands.

You may have noticed that this government is quite prepared to change legislation on a whim.

What the law says just now is utterly irrelevant.

If they want to make it legal for the police to enter your home at Christmas without a warrant then I am sure they will do so.

Do you think that the Labour Party will oppose them?

Happy now?

130404 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnMac, replying to John P, #789 of 1675 🔗

Actually it was you that was rude to me, and now you want to whine about it. Grow up.

My point about finding out the legal situation was perfectly correct.
You say the law might change before Christmas. So what? It will still be good to know what the law is when the time comes.

130149 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to JohnMac, #790 of 1675 🔗

I would be very surprised if the police turned up for that. Maybe if there was a big party going on with loud music and people hanging out of windows.

130303 ▶▶▶ kf99, replying to Nobody2020, #791 of 1675 🔗

Agreed but existing laws should cover that. So even less need for covid-specific rules.

130159 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to JohnMac, #792 of 1675 🔗


130160 ▶▶ RickH, replying to JohnMac, 1, #793 of 1675 🔗

Actually – that’s part of a really important question.

A brief run-down of actual police powers under the law would be useful.

130165 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to JohnMac, 1, #794 of 1675 🔗

A more likely scenario is someone with a grievance tipping off the police. For example, I can imagine my spiteful ex reporting me & my family having a normal Christmas with extended family. What can one do?

130214 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnMac, #795 of 1675 🔗

This was covered by a police Chief on radio interview on the day after the announcement. Police cannot enter without warrant etc. He said.

As others here pointed out they have excuses of in the interests of public safety. It would be a large step for police to enter a home on a tip from a neighbour over a family gathering. Not proportionate given the meetings and socialising happening in workplaces, pubs and transport, etc.

130112 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 8, #796 of 1675 🔗

Why is Whitty always sweating like a rapist?

130122 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Cecil B, 6, #797 of 1675 🔗

Because he’s a very guilty man?

130125 ▶▶ John P, replying to Cecil B, -9, #798 of 1675 🔗

Is that the best you can come up with? Personal abuse does not help our case.

130192 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to John P, -5, #799 of 1675 🔗

Still doesn’t.

130135 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to Cecil B, 1, #800 of 1675 🔗

Perhaps he has a temperature an it is really COVID but he just has to carry on regardless, or he refuses to admit to himself that he might have a health problem.

130153 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Cecil B, 1, #801 of 1675 🔗

Because he’s raped the truth.

130158 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Cecil B, 1, #802 of 1675 🔗

I’ve always thought he looks ‘compromised’.

130185 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Cecil B, 1, #803 of 1675 🔗

He realises what is going to happen when the (!) hits the fan on the other hand Hancock who keeps grinning, doesnt realise.

130965 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Cecil B, #804 of 1675 🔗

Eco anxiety?

130113 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 1, #805 of 1675 🔗
130294 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to hotrod, #806 of 1675 🔗

Probably suffering from long covid

130299 ▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, #807 of 1675 🔗

Unis won’t hold their nerve. From what I have been told they are safety-mad. Long after this bollocks has more or less gone, unis will be enforcing bullshit rules – who will stop them? They are independent.

130119 coalencanth12, replying to coalencanth12, 5, #808 of 1675 🔗

That was a blast from the past, Mark Walport. This individual used to be our chief exec, I don’t think he’s been an active coal face scientist/clinician for many a year, so I’m not sure why he is mouthing off. We all thought it was a bit odd he was put on SAGE actually – the way it was pitched to me was he was there to listen and connect up any UKRI research (say supercomputers or crystallography) with university groups who needed help on their covid projects.

On that note, I’ve noticed an odd pattern in my field of scientists with some kind of ‘connection’ to the Oxford vaccine project, or have some peripheral technology they are trying to flog as coronavirus ‘tests’ being very keen on keeping the panic levels high. A few buildings on my site, some of these characters have managed to get face masks made compulsory. This is causing some resentment as ‘clerical’ and theory/computing people are quite comfortably sitting at home for the foreseeable, whereas experimentalists and technicians are having to sit there with face nappies on all day (needless to say this is ignored whenever Professor Big-Shot has absented himself, which is frequent)

My place is slowly getting back to work, no masks but strictly enforced 2m spacing. We’re being encouraged to go back, I suspect the civil service department above us is getting pressure to send us back.

130154 ▶▶ Grebs, replying to coalencanth12, 1, #809 of 1675 🔗

Yes, i thought it was strange that Walport was piping up. John Bell too.

But thinking about it they are probably the most likely scientists in the country to toe the government line.

Also a warning shot to anyone trying to get money out of UKRI (aka everyone) what the party line is.

130373 ▶▶▶ coalencanth12, replying to Grebs, #810 of 1675 🔗

Good point, one of my colleagues just remarked the same!!

130134 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 33, #811 of 1675 🔗

If by some miracle we manage to turn this around, can we honestly say with hand on heart that the vast majority of our species deserves to live in any kind of freedom and prosperity? The answer for me is a resounding no.

This has been a massive teaching for me. We live on a planet of cretins.

130138 ▶▶ watashi, replying to Richard O, 13, #812 of 1675 🔗

so true. sadly so. It saddens me greatly that friends, acquaintances & family I used to respect can now be counted in that number.

130150 ▶▶▶ William Hand, replying to watashi, 4, #813 of 1675 🔗

My family are still together. Despite some differences. Don’t have any bedwetter friends so that is OK. Got a campaign going on Faceache using humour. One “friend” just posted the recent Ivor Cummings video, quite unexpected and a real boost.

130463 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to watashi, 1, #814 of 1675 🔗

Same here!

130216 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Richard O, 1, #815 of 1675 🔗


It’s about incentives and long term thinking so I wouldn’t be too hard on people.

Disappointing and frustrating yes but we are dealing with a cult.

130264 ▶▶ annie, replying to Richard O, 6, #816 of 1675 🔗

Or conformists hiding under the counter and waiting for it to just go away. Lots and lots of those.
When this ends, AS IT WILL, we’ll have to get on with the conformists somehow.The true cretins and zombies are another matter.

130297 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Richard O, 2, #817 of 1675 🔗

So it would seem. Selfishly, I want the majority to live in freedom and prosperity so that I can. Unless someone gives us some countries to inhabit, we’re stuck with the rest of them

130336 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to Richard O, 7, #818 of 1675 🔗

This has been one of the most depressing things about this. Most of the population have no concept of freedom and believe absolutely everything the government and msm tell them, regardless of how little it makes sense.

130966 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Richard O, #819 of 1675 🔗

Planet of the Cretins. A new, blockbuster film. Starring … The list is too long for this blog.

130140 William Hand, 22, #820 of 1675 🔗

A lovely sunny day up here on Dartmoor. No masks in these parts of course but the shite continues. Even though we have had zero COVID deaths and only a handful of symptomatic cases the same rules of six apply. But none of us are snitches in our little hamlet, so if anyone wants to have a bit of a get together that will be fair go. Getting angry though now at what is happening elsewhere, especially in the towns and cities. Pictures of masked zombies roaming the streets is not what we want to see. So lucky to live where I am in deepest rural Devon.

130142 Polemon2, replying to Polemon2, 2, #821 of 1675 🔗

BBC World at One getting very excited about the difficulty of getting people tested. Presumably this will be reflected in the statistics in due course.
OK, I guess the numbers still increase remorselessly. How else could current policies be justified.

130168 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to Polemon2, #822 of 1675 🔗

Who was getting exited?

130308 ▶▶▶ Polemon2, replying to hotrod, #823 of 1675 🔗

News presenter, Sarah Montague, and anybody that they spoke to. Plenty of vox pop, desperate for test, panicers
8:20 onwards

130144 PWL, replying to PWL, 1, #824 of 1675 🔗

More of the same unpoliceable legislation that’s easily ignored. But more of the same tension racheting alarmism from “alternative” media. That’s how you can tell it’s controlled.

Keeping it simple:
Covid-19 in a nutshell

130152 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to PWL, #825 of 1675 🔗

“Covid-19” – please note the use of quotation marks – is a disease that doesn’t exist. It is an umbrella term for death from other causes that have been designated to give the impression of the existence of a virulent plague. The vast majority of “Covid-19” dead were hospital population, with a big proportion having already been resident in hospital at the beginning of the episode in March. Twenty five thousand (and this is believed to be a figure for the entire UK) were sent into care homes where, as it has been reported, 20,000 people died of “Covid-19”. This figure could be smaller because the reportage from which it was obtained originated before a review and downscaling of the official death toll in August.


130174 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Victoria, 4, #826 of 1675 🔗

This is more misleading gunk. Unless this person is going to quote from reliable sources then this is just a conspiracy theory.

“covid-19” is the disease produced by the SARS-Cov-2 virus. That is fact.

It has been massively blown up out of all proportion, mostly by the mainstream media.

130176 ▶▶ John P, replying to PWL, #827 of 1675 🔗

I can tell no such thing.

130292 ▶▶ Julian, replying to PWL, #828 of 1675 🔗

What is this “alternative” media of which you speak? If you are trying to convince me of something, you’ll need to be blunter as I am a bit dense.

130148 NickR, replying to NickR, 10, #829 of 1675 🔗

Normally there are 360,000 cancer diagnoses per year, about 1,000/day. Currently there are 500/day.
Normally there are 160,000 cancer deaths per years. Let’s see how many this year.

130169 ▶▶ John P, replying to NickR, 1, #830 of 1675 🔗

I take it that the figures you are quoting are for the UK?

130194 ▶▶▶ NickR, replying to John P, 2, #831 of 1675 🔗

Karel Sikora, UK’s top oncologist, and data from the CDC. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFRR58D1oW0

130207 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to NickR, 1, #832 of 1675 🔗

Mmany thanks. I’ve always liked Sikora, such a nice man, but I suspect that he has a lot of splinters in his bum from all the fence sitting he has been doing.

130291 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to John P, #833 of 1675 🔗

Indeed it would be good to see him come out a bit more strongly, but he’s pushing in the right direction and less vulnerable to attack from lockdowners

130170 ▶▶ CGL, replying to NickR, #834 of 1675 🔗

They’ll never publish the truth

130151 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 2, #835 of 1675 🔗

a bit of logic on twitter 99.972% of people in the UK did not die with Covid. Other countries around the same numbers.

130178 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Dan Clarke, #836 of 1675 🔗

Bit of a coincidence but 99.972% of accounts on Twitter aren’t real either!

130156 Gtec, replying to Gtec, 1, #837 of 1675 🔗

If anyone would like to see a video about how ineffective/effective masks are, have a look at this one by a US doctor:


130200 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Gtec, #838 of 1675 🔗

This, from the ‘other side’. Isn’t there something a bit odd about this one?


130217 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Gtec, #839 of 1675 🔗

That looks good.

130491 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Gtec, #840 of 1675 🔗

That Dr. John what’s his name (who j really get annoyed by) did a pro mask video a few weeks ago on YouTube. He is a mask lover of the highest order following his own confirmation of his own self bias.

I actually tried to replicate his conclusions and could not. I could easily blow out a candle with and without a mask.

I concluded that if I wanted to do a video that shows a mask to be effective it would be easy to pretend that your blowing a candle when your not.

It’s absolute horse shit it really is.

130164 Biker, replying to Biker, 13, #841 of 1675 🔗

Bastards the lot of ’em

130191 ▶▶ Hubes, replying to Biker, 4, #842 of 1675 🔗

Sums it up perfectly

130212 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Hubes, #843 of 1675 🔗

No it doesn’t. Too simplistic, and solves nothing.

130293 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to RickH, #844 of 1675 🔗

sing us a song Bono. You, John Perry and others are shills, sitting doing the nasty work of a traitor

130539 ▶▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to RickH, #845 of 1675 🔗

Didn’t say it solved anything. It’s sums it up perfectly though.

130167 JulieR, replying to JulieR, 9, #846 of 1675 🔗

Just walked on London Bridge. A few people were wearing masks despite being outside in such nice weather. All of them were young. I don’t get what they watch or read to be so brainwashed wearing masks outside.

2 people amused me: a young Chinese looking man had 2 masks on (cannot take any chances with this killer virus), another young Chinese looking man was wearing ladies tights under his shorts. Is he worried that he can catch the virus through his legs?!

130173 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to JulieR, 9, #847 of 1675 🔗

Fucking morons. For me the presence of the zombies in the streets is effectively a permanent stay-at-home order.

130221 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, 5, #848 of 1675 🔗

But then they win, Richard.

Plus then there is the ‘lack of anyone sensible’ as examples for the masked, and the lack of like-minded people for the rest of us.

130195 ▶▶ Lili, replying to JulieR, 5, #849 of 1675 🔗

Was The Handmaids Tale a priming exercise for mask wearing?

130228 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Lili, 3, #850 of 1675 🔗

Extinction Rebellion did a bizarre Handmaids Tale style protest in Downing Street last week. Very strange. I was also told by someone on a protest if you don’t wear a mask you can’t march with the main protest you have to follow them! Unbelievable level of virtue signalling.

130206 ▶▶ DRW, replying to JulieR, 8, #851 of 1675 🔗

It’s when you see muzzloids driving alone that gets me!

130223 ▶▶▶ Kev, replying to DRW, 1, #852 of 1675 🔗

We should put stupid awards on their windscreens if we know where they live, let them figure it out!

130215 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to JulieR, 6, #853 of 1675 🔗

Had a couple of young Chinese men approach us at a central London anti-lockdown protest yesterday, they were both lockdown sceptics and wanted to attend the next protest. Gave me so hope that they don’t buy into the fear propaganda!

130219 ▶▶▶ JYC, replying to Darryl, #854 of 1675 🔗

Are any of the protests getting much coverage in the MSM yet?

130242 ▶▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to JYC, 4, #855 of 1675 🔗

The only time they are covered is to demonise them. UK media even defend and support the Melbourne police! (but criticise the Belarus police acting similarly).

Trafalgar Square protests are scheduled for Saturday 19th and 26th. I have a feeling the media will extensively cover these (the articles have probably been written already – evil anti-vaxxers, conspiracy theorists, far right / far left ….) we need a really high attendance of everyday people from all backgrounds, races and ages to counter the MSM / Establishment propaganda.

130273 ▶▶▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to Darryl, 2, #856 of 1675 🔗

I am going to this Saturday protest. I hope to see many people.

130315 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to JulieR, 2, #857 of 1675 🔗

I can’t make 19th September, but I’ll be there on the 26th.

130285 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Darryl, 3, #858 of 1675 🔗

The BBC “covered” the last Trafalgar Square protest, if you call a piece without direct quotations of what was actually said, full of opinions about the far-right/conspiracy theorist nature of the attendees, covering.

I emailed Michael Wendling, of the BBC Disinformation unit, and his answer was that they are under no obligation to give a platform to erroneous opinions and some views do not merit airing and debate, and proceeded to make an indirect analogy with giving a platform to a mass murderer. He fully believes it’s his job to make sure the public believe the “right” things as defined by himself and the BBC. That unit should be disbanded, it’s a disgrace it even exists.

130382 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Julian, 2, #859 of 1675 🔗

The BBC and mass media clearly see themselves as the thought police. I guess they have the George Orwell statue at Broadcasting House to remind them of the great work they are carrying out to achieve a 1984 dystopian style society.

130387 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Darryl, #860 of 1675 🔗

The Ministry of Truth in 1984 was based off Orwell’s BBC experience.

130418 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Darryl, #861 of 1675 🔗

Sort of. The Thought Police I think knew they were evil (certainly the Inner Party knew they were evil). The BBC really do think they know better. I suppose that kind of arrogance borders on evil.

130955 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Julian, #862 of 1675 🔗

And you got a response to your email? Wonder what he’d make of a flood of similar emails.

130967 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Julian, #863 of 1675 🔗

Propaganda Ministry.

130954 ▶▶▶ patric, replying to Darryl, #864 of 1675 🔗

They’ve likely realised our government over here is up to the same tricks as the government over there that they’re so glad to have gotten away from.

130233 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to JulieR, 2, #865 of 1675 🔗

I think it depends on how tall you are, whether you are standing or sitting and possibly whether you have washed your legs for twenty seconds. Different rules apply if you have done all the above but are in a house or garden, except when working.

130171 zacaway, replying to zacaway, 11, #866 of 1675 🔗

What about the turkeys? Seriously, what impact does the “rule of six” have on turkey producers, since a turkey is generally going to feed more than six (unless it is family of BoJo’s, perhaps). Should producers cut production now? Should people be cancelling / not ordering turkeys, in anticipation of cancelled Christmas? Are we going to end up with pyres of turkeys being incinerated, like what Ferguson caused to the cattle during foot & mouth? Will people be questioned for buying a turkey (planning an illegal party there, eh)?

130175 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to zacaway, 3, #867 of 1675 🔗

Just mean you’ll be eating a lot of Turkey meals through the entirety of January!

130180 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to JohnB, #868 of 1675 🔗

I guess so, maybe a lot of turkey twizzlers on sale this winter!

130190 ▶▶ Lili, replying to zacaway, 4, #869 of 1675 🔗

It seems like a frivolous concern and yet it will have a HUGE impact on turkey producers. There is no forward thinking or strategic planning.

130234 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Lili, 3, #870 of 1675 🔗

Exactly, they don’t think about all the knock-on effects of all these hastily and arbitrarily made rules. Of course, it’s not just about turkeys, just another example of boneheaded leadership.

130244 ▶▶▶▶ JYC, replying to zacaway, 5, #871 of 1675 🔗

What about the poor turkeys who’ve been masquerading as a government for the last six months?

130246 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to zacaway, 4, #872 of 1675 🔗

They don’t think because they’ve never had any real life experience of running a business.

130968 ▶▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to zacaway, #873 of 1675 🔗

It’s not boneheaded leadership, it’s deliberate.

130226 ▶▶ matt, replying to zacaway, #874 of 1675 🔗

Dear God, won’t somebody think of the turkeys!

130179 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 37, #875 of 1675 🔗

Just got back from business meeting about an upcoming contract.

What fun.

Since my last visit a month ago they’ve introduced temperature taking at door and masks for all visitors, but strangely not for staff and some other stuff added.

Said I had an exemption (which I do) which kicked off a rumpus especially when I explained about exemptions (they were ignorant of them), who can question me (they were ignorant of this), what I have to tell them (they were ignorant of this as well), the legislation and fines (they were ignorant of them as well) and so on.

They aid they need to protect themselves from the 2nd wave and spike that is happening. I went through PCR tests and it’s medical uses and meanings, the number of cycles, death certificates and so on and then asked how did they justify their measures as mitigations as there is no science available that proves they work blah blah blah.

Also told them that as I’m half deaf then they had better be prepared to shout at me if they were wearing a mask so I can hear them properly.

Told them that if they wanted to leave then no problem, I’ll leave and that is that.

Suddenly it’s kicked upstairs and they all troop off, message becomes back meeting is going ahead and they were all sweetness and light – I think they actually looked at some of the websites I told them to see if I was lying or not.

After the meeting chatted to a couple of the people and found out they had done no independent research themselves but only watched the TV news and so on.

Had good chat and as I reeled off facts, numbers etc then they loosened up and did not turn into out and out sceptics but were definitely reassured that the virus is not killing half the population and they were not going to drop dead by me not wearing a mask.

then went to a smaller company – no bollocks, no bullshit just in, chat and out.

Seems like the bigger the company, the more management then the more bullshit.

130209 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Awkward Git, 20, #876 of 1675 🔗

chatted to a couple of the people and found out they had done no independent research themselves but only watched the TV news and so on.”

I think that this is a crucial insight. In general, the majority of people (a) Don’t have the time or impulse and (b) Don’t have the skills for independent research.

That is why the capture of media for propaganda is so powerful.

130218 ▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to RickH, 7, #877 of 1675 🔗

I agree, which is why this is encouraging:
Headline Britons told to become a nation of narks
First line : Ministers today urged people to snitch on their neighbours


The top comment is excellent
“I am not snitching on my neighbours unless dozens of people turn up for a rave otherwise forget it”

130213 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Awkward Git, 4, #878 of 1675 🔗

It continues to astonish, the way people who (think they) have a reason to apply the rules don’t bother to look them up. Worse than that, they make them up! There’s half a dozen key issues in your story that they didn’t have a clue about, yet you (and we) have.

130222 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to Awkward Git, 12, #879 of 1675 🔗

“After the meeting chatted to a couple of the people and found out they had done no independent research themselves but only watched the tv news and so on”

Or as a friend of my son’s said to him “ The problem with this whole virus thing is that we are all intellectually lazy.” (Sceptics apart that is). “We can’t be bothered to ask the right questions”

Even a simple question seems beyond most people such as, “Why aren’t supermarket workers in masks when shoppers have to wear them?”

130381 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Margaret, 12, #880 of 1675 🔗

Or why haven’t all of the supermarket workers died

131224 ▶▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to stefarm, #881 of 1675 🔗

I asked a checkout lady in our local Morrisons if any of her colleagues had had the “covid ” since March, a resounding… no!

130256 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #882 of 1675 🔗

Our small company put sanitisers around, everything else is as before. And we worked all the time through the lockdown and nobody got ill. It might be the reason everyone is a sceptic.

130257 ▶▶ annie, replying to Awkward Git, #883 of 1675 🔗

They caught a Q ship when they caught you!

130272 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Awkward Git, 7, #884 of 1675 🔗

” found out they had done no independent research themselves but only watched the TV news and so on.”

Indeed – this is what I don’t get. I get political apathy generally, but not when your country has been turned upside down indefinitely. Bizarre.

“Seems like the bigger the company, the more management then the more bullshit.”

Indeed. I’m staying somewhere other than home at present, in an area with lots of ethnic minorities and small corner shops. I don’t think a single shop here has a sign in the window about covid. They just want the business.

130304 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Awkward Git, #885 of 1675 🔗

Good work!

130181 Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 7, #886 of 1675 🔗

Want to join 3 other likeminded sceptics whilst they drink a beer in the local pub’s beer garden and chat about how mental CV19 is?

Well episode 5 of ‘The Real Normal Podcast’ (formerly Bedwetters) is here!

This episode we chat about Context.

How dangerous is CV19 compared to other things…plus we sample some lovely Timmy Taylors…enjoy! 👇


130205 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 2, #888 of 1675 🔗

Good name.

130250 ▶▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Basics, 4, #889 of 1675 🔗

Thanks! Moved away from Bedwetters as we wanted to encourage more listeners over.

130563 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, #890 of 1675 🔗

It’s a savvy move.

130471 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, #891 of 1675 🔗

Real Normal – I like it!!!!

130182 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 5, #892 of 1675 🔗

“The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I’m from the government and I’m here to help.”


130186 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 3, #893 of 1675 🔗

I thought it was when you go to the Doctors for a repeat prescriptions and the Doctor says “You’re due a Prostate examination, I can do it now for you!”

130232 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to JohnB, #894 of 1675 🔗

No ,it’s when someone says “I’ll get back to you on that “

130405 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to JohnB, 1, #895 of 1675 🔗

Or this:

130237 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, -3, #896 of 1675 🔗

Let’s not let cheap Americanisms creep into British life. We have enough already.

Government in the UK comes out of Parliament, and Parliament is formed from people we elect using a pretty decent democratic system.

Therefore government is the rest of us. And unfortunately the polls back the action.

We need to respectfully persuade, (bearing in mind that many people have lost loved ones) not sneer.

130267 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Lucan Grey, 4, #897 of 1675 🔗

I don’t believe the polls though concede the majority are still broadly accepting of the narrative. HOWEVER, the people have been subjected to a deliberate, relentless, unprecedented, mendacious onslaught of propaganda from the government aided and abetted by the media, and the opposition have not opposed or scrutinised in any meaningful way, and neither has parliament. They were elected to make rational choices on our behalf, not to scare people into going along with arbitrary bullshit.

I try to “respectfully persuade” those of my fellow citizens who I feel are the victims of deceit. Those who are clearly pursuing agendas of their own and using this crisis for nefarious purposes, especially the government and the media, are not so much to be sneered at as condemned for possibly criminal acts.

130343 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Lucan Grey, 3, #898 of 1675 🔗

Government in the UK comes out of Parliament, and Parliament is formed from people we elect using a pretty decent democratic system.

You are on doubly shaky ground here. First, what something “comes out of” doesn’t determine its worth. Second, the most you could plausibly say about the UK democratic system is perhaps that it is “pretty decent” compared to others, and that would be a mere matter of personal opinion.

When we are in the midst of what might well prove to be the worst peacetime disaster caused by government in recorded history is hardly the time to start trying to pontificate about silly theoretical democracy fantasies. Government is a thing in itself, not some kind of mystical representation of the will of the people, and not only is it pretty much unanswerable that a government can do harm, it’s arguable at the moment that we are seeing that government can do more harm than almost any other kind of actor in existence, given the consequences of the disastrous panic policies adopted this year by most governments around the world.

130384 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark, 2, #899 of 1675 🔗

Indeed. Even if you leave aside the argument that the government has deliberately created, manipulated and perpetuated the “will of the people”, your defence of them amounts to “they are only following orders”.

130369 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Lucan Grey, 2, #900 of 1675 🔗

Where was Parliament when the Government curtailed our liberty?

130441 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Lucan Grey, #901 of 1675 🔗

For me the key requirement of a democratic system is not so much that we elect people to govern, it’s that we can get rid of them (in due course) if they do a bad job. Unfortunately we won’t get the chance for another four years, if then, and Starmer’s lot are no better.

130498 ▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #902 of 1675 🔗

Some people aren’t intelligent enough to be be persuadable – especially those in Westminster and the 77th Brigade.

130189 Jared, replying to Jared, 34, #903 of 1675 🔗

Just sent this email to my MP in Redditch

Dear Rachel

I am emailing you as a Redditch born and bred citizen regarding a very spiteful and unpleasant experience my wife had in our local supermarket. We had run out of the basics at home (milk, bread etc.) with the kids being back at school and lunches being made. Upon arriving at the supermarket, my wife and 16 year old son went in to grab some essentials. My wife does not wear a face covering of any sort due to skin reactions on the face which then lead to chronic body dysmorphia. While in the bread section, what I can only describe as, a very nasty and insidious elderly lady approached my wife and confronted her. My oldest son pointed out to this ghastly woman that the ‘scraggy bit of material’ covering her mouth, now centimetres from my wife’s face, was achieving nothing as she completely disregarded polite distancing from others. This woman went on to accuse my wife of being a ‘law flouter’ and followed her around the remainder of the shop. It was only when my son had had enough and challenged her, (he admits) firmly and with consequence if she persisted, that she ceased following them.

My anxiety about this mask nonsense and encouraging social ‘shaming and snitching’ is that neighbours are going to create rifts that will last a generation. My wife is a quiet lady and had I been there, this situation would have deteriorated very fast; I will NOT tolerate anyone, for any reason, bullying my wife!

I hope you speak out against both the policy and the attitudes that are leading to this dangerous and divisive future in our town; if you want to wear a mask, wear one but you do not have the right to challenge or insist others do the same.

Kindest regards

130253 ▶▶ annie, replying to Jared, 5, #904 of 1675 🔗

I doubt if your MP will listen, but well done for taking action. The treatment of your wife was disgusting.
Send a copy of the letter to your local paper.

130484 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Jared, 2, #905 of 1675 🔗

Well done to your son and very sorry to read of your wife’s experience.

130826 ▶▶ wat tyler, replying to Jared, #906 of 1675 🔗

Well done Jared and well done to your son.I would also have a word with the supermarket telling them there is a nutcase trouble maker on the loose in their store and to make sure if they are not already to keep informing people over the tanoy about hidden disabilities .

130857 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Jared, 1, #907 of 1675 🔗

What happened to your wife is appalling. Shame on that woman, I was bullied by one on the underground and I shouted at her to mind her own business which caused her to back off. Had you wife been built like a rugby player or a member of the BAME community I bet that Karen would have never dared approach her for fear of being beaten up or accused of racism.

Well done to your son!

130220 DRW, replying to DRW, 2, #908 of 1675 🔗

Anyone else expecting a Clown Show christmas special? They might even have a fairy-lit tree in the background and tinsel on the podiums for extra irony.

130238 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to DRW, 2, #909 of 1675 🔗

Yeah, Boris dressed as Santa with his two effing elves …

130286 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to DRW, 2, #910 of 1675 🔗

Before that wonder how many Hancock’s and Johnson’s will be on bonfire’s this year

130969 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Dan Clarke, #911 of 1675 🔗

When is Guy Fawkes Day?

130452 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DRW, 1, #912 of 1675 🔗

Was rather hoping for a re-run of the Two Ronnies. Or even Morecambe and Wise.

130225 cloud6, replying to cloud6, 3, #913 of 1675 🔗

Making a comment in the local rag and they censored it….

130260 ▶▶ Julian, replying to cloud6, 2, #914 of 1675 🔗

Evil bastards

130227 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #915 of 1675 🔗

This is the department (independent now, but part owned by government) who helps the government with behavioural insights about Covid-19. I just wanted to laugh to be honest. What a pile of shit. The graph that talks of generally how we are in the ‘disillusionment’ phase, then building something new. https://www.bi.team/blogs/britains-emotional-journey-through-covid-impact-on-wellbeing/

130261 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #917 of 1675 🔗

I don’t buy those stats. It runs contrary to what I see out and about. I think it’s more even than that.

130449 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #918 of 1675 🔗

It’s a little bit like people who say they don’t mind taxes going up an extra penny in the pound to help pay the NHS/Education/Social care/Insert your own single issue fanaticism here… Up until the moment when the government obliges and everybody starts whinging about tax increases.

130259 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Country Mumkin, #919 of 1675 🔗

that is my tax money that is being wasted

130240 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 2, #920 of 1675 🔗

How many coronavirus tests need to be administered, on average, in order to get one positive result?

The government tell us that they have testing capacity of three hundred thousand. The government also tells us that there are roughly three thousand positive tests. According to my arithmetic, that means they are having to test one hundred people to find one positive result.

Given the fact that the test produces false positives, one would have thought this would have given the clever people in charge some cause to re-think their response to this virus. Yet, they apparently think the results are cause for even more fear-mongering and panic and restrictions.

If this is not a case of collective madness, it is a criminal campaign against the population.

130249 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to Steve Hayes, 2, #921 of 1675 🔗

The ratio of positive tests to tests remains constant around 1.4%. I believe that is also the false positive rate.

130258 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to MizakeTheMizan, 1, #922 of 1675 🔗

It has climbed a bit in recent weeks according to my calculation – it was flat at around 0.5-0.6% for a long time in July and August.

130279 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Julian, 3, #923 of 1675 🔗

They can dial up the sensitivity and create more or fewer false positives as it suits them.

130328 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #924 of 1675 🔗

I assume this is what the private testing companies are doing. As cases fall they dial up the cycles. I expect they have convinced themselves this is morally right to ‘reduce false negatives’ – the fact that this is in their financial benefit will be wholly coincidental.

130435 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Lockdown Truth, 3, #925 of 1675 🔗

That’s exactly right. A lab using a maximum of 25 cycles will get far fewer positives than a lab using up to 45 cycles. A molecular biologist I was on a call with the other night has been trying to find out how many cycles our PCR tests in Ontario are subject to and she can’t get a straight answer. She heard 45 and, if true, it means we are getting a lot of false positive “cases” and we’ll be in this mess for a good long time. Nobody here seems to care that nobody is dying of Covid — in fact, a columnist in one of our national newspapers wrote last week that we shouldn’t get lulled into a false sense of security just because the numbers of deaths are so low! At least there was a lot of scepticism in the comments section, but it’s still rare here to find much scepticism.

130247 ▶▶ annie, replying to Strange Days, 9, #927 of 1675 🔗

Do zombies make good targets?

130248 ▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to annie, 2, #928 of 1675 🔗

It depends, do you want an easy shot or more of a challenge?

130268 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to annie, #929 of 1675 🔗

Have to make sure it’s a head shot

130252 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Strange Days, -1, #930 of 1675 🔗

Shoot the breeze or shoot the messenger

130255 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Strange Days, 5, #931 of 1675 🔗

The rich and powerful are not affected by the bullshit rules they make up for others

130263 ▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Julian, #932 of 1675 🔗

True, and in rural areas you tend to find a lot of members of the constabulary in clay shooting clubs

130276 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 3, #933 of 1675 🔗

Look on the bright side : it all piles up the evidence of the nonsense that is this pile of government shite.

130254 Basics, replying to Basics, 16, #934 of 1675 🔗

This article alows me to try out a phrase I have wanted to for a a few days now. Forgive me.

Daily mail “GPs are ordered to see patients face-to-face amid fears vulnerable people are ‘having difficulty accessing doctors’ during the pandemic”


The snivelling little shit-weasels.

130274 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Basics, 2, #935 of 1675 🔗

Well put!

130265 Basics, 6, #936 of 1675 🔗

The victoria police are now head-stamping. Here’s the video. So far removed from right and decent that these actiins must be causing people to realise nazi facists are among us, not just in jack boots on the streets but in the briefing rooms and management structures.


130269 Coronamoana, replying to Coronamoana, #937 of 1675 🔗

Could somebody in the know please clarify whether the COVID-19 test specifically tests for COVID-19 or for coronavirus in general?

130296 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Coronamoana, #938 of 1675 🔗

No it does not. It only picks up viral fragments after they have been duplicated a number of times.

Hopefully you will get more clarification

130335 ▶▶ Eyquem, replying to Coronamoana, 3, #939 of 1675 🔗

The test is predicated on finding the RNA signature that is believed to be unique to SARS-CoV-2, the strain of coronavirus believed to cause Covid-19. This RNA signature is isolated then mixed with enzymes to convert to a complementary strand of DNA (reverse transcriptase). Using heat and enzymes, the synthethised DNA goes through a process of amplification, creating an exponential accumulation of detectable genetic content.

130383 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Coronamoana, #940 of 1675 🔗

What counts as a ‘case’ of the virus?

By Carl Heneghan and Tom Jefferson

In the Spectaor

130559 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Coronamoana, 1, #941 of 1675 🔗

It tests for a few genes that are unique to SARS-COV-2 (the virus that causes Covid-19). You may get a false positive but not because of other coronaviruses.

Antibody tests on the other hand may give false positives because of other coronaviruses.

130270 Basics, replying to Basics, 11, #942 of 1675 🔗

Montreal – huge demonstration against masks has happened. See the numbers


130361 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 4, #943 of 1675 🔗

Wonderful. These kind of demonstrations coming soon, everywhere.

130970 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Basics, #944 of 1675 🔗

I live in Montreal. I filmed some of it. Hoping for even more protests in the weeks to come.

130275 Basics, replying to Basics, 15, #945 of 1675 🔗

“A number of doctors have called for an end to the daily Covid-19 figures, describing them as a “self-perpetuating cycle of misery”.”


130477 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Basics, 4, #946 of 1675 🔗

Quite right. If they did a daily report on all the other horrible things that are much more likely to carry you off we would all end up locked up in our own homes and potentially banned from social contact and maybe even unable to visit our family at Christmas……oh no wait a sec….

130972 ▶▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Leemc23, #947 of 1675 🔗

They have all become hypochondriacs and they’re projecting their fears on us.

130659 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to Basics, 1, #948 of 1675 🔗

Nope. We need to see the stats daily. Information is power. Without the stats, we’d know nothing.

130678 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Miss Owl, 1, #949 of 1675 🔗

Note the way tgey are being delievered to an unknowing public. Remember the days of the rolling news singling out deaths and reporting Bob Johnson, 52, bus driver survived by 3 children and a moggy.. it is a death toll that is all. Add in the fudge of numbers it is control.

The numbers are information yes. We need them reporting and accessible. We don’t need the propaganda associated with them.

A good idea would be to communicate the data in a meanginful way to the public. Ivor Cummins could do the job.

130971 ▶▶ richard riewer, replying to Basics, #950 of 1675 🔗

One protest sign in Madrid said Nefasta. Here’s the King’s English version:


English: nefastTrends
Definition of ’nefast’Word Frequency

nefast in British English (nɪˈfɑːst)
literary nefarious , wicked
Collins English Dictionary. Copyright © HarperCollins Publishers

130278 Samhurt, replying to Samhurt, 15, #951 of 1675 🔗

Re: the “incompetence” line I keep encountering amongst the spectical set:

[As far an “agenda” is concerned] I think destabilization is the goal. Harsher restrictions will lead to escalating troubles in the streets, which will lead to more incentives to keep existing emergency powers in place for longer as safety concerns lead to fewer reasons for the submissive majority to organize against tyranny-creep. Classic problem-reaction-solution strategy, eh? Everywhere this Hegellian farce is being demoed we see the same thing: the expectation is that a portion of the population will reject the new regime, and that portion is being made an example of (the “loons” as some like to refer to them) at the same time as the ruling-class makes it all but impossible to challenge the madness peacefully, through legal means. The streets will explode soon, perhaps in Africa, perhaps in Peru, perhaps in the Gulf, and when they do the lockdowns will only get tighter, and when the dust clears (it won’t take long) no one in power will lose any elections or face any criminal charges, and when the unrest spreads in middle-class Europe it’ll be much like 1980’s Iran, when the secular bourgeoisie awoke to find themselves completely trapped, victims of their faith in ‘the system’ which promised them an eventual say but which never seemed to have the time to get around to it, resulting in the snuffing-out overnight of a hundred years of hard-fought liberal gains and the disappearance and murder of millions of innocents. Some of our faith I think is comparable to theirs. They lost their country for it. Maybe we should stop coddling ourselves with bromides about ‘incompetence,’ people are more serious perhaps than we give them credit for. Henry Kissinger is not a one-off. We should try respecting our civilization’s adversaries rather than pretending they don’t exist, as though if given the chance we’d sort the matter out ourselves, believing as we seem to that the functioning of nuclear-power democracy doesn’t rely on infernal murderous machinery to operate at scale. It may be comforting to believe we’re being dunked on by overeducated fools without a clue and that there are no conspiratorial agendas at play but regrettably the “loons” have been pretty much spot on for the better part of a century, unless I’m totally schizophrenic myself – operation Northwoods, paperclip, mkultra, bluebook, Dutroux, Tuskegee, UFOs (recently confirmed by the US Dept. of the Navy), the Finders, Boystown, the Franklin affair, Epstein, Saville (implicating vast swathes of Downing-connected elites), WMDs, pesticide and food additive harms, autism, tobacco science, the sugar lobby, the Steele Dossier, the School of the Americas, underage DC prostitution rings (see Barney Frank), the killing of Nancy Schaefer, the killing of Dorothy Killgallen, the ‘Guinea Kids’ experiments in NYCs foster care system (pharma-connected, just nightmarish), and on and on and on – are any of these disputable phenomena? Have they not shaped the Western world in important and enduring ways? Do those responsible for them just vanish into the ether? Or do they and their acolytes carry on through the institutions, and are there things happening right now beneath the surface of our everyday lives equally as sinister and equally as far-reaching? You cannot explain what is happening righ now in terms of mass professional incompetence. That can’t account for the patterns of governance we’re seeing emerge; the uniformity is too lockstep, the policies are too similar, the wilfull blindness is too total. At some point we have to ditch our prejudices and wake up to the fact that we are being managed by forces who are smarter and more cunning than we are. Scapegoating goofballs and dolts like Wancock and Booris may make us feel like we have more control than we do but the events of this year I believe put the lie to that. The coincidences are just too astonishing to be accidental, in my view. Just because certain politicians may not have a clear idea of what it is they’re contributing to doesn’t mean that chaos reigns. Compliance takes planning.

130349 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Samhurt, 4, #952 of 1675 🔗

Maybe, but as I keep saying I am not sure it’s top priority right now to agree on or determine the whys and wherefores. Focus on the message that the cure is worse than the disease, whatever the reasons. No other argument needed. Don’t muddy the waters.

130646 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Julian, #953 of 1675 🔗

I couldn’t agree more. Get rid of the bollox, and only then debate the causes.

130354 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Samhurt, 7, #954 of 1675 🔗

Helps if you use paragraphs here.

Once you get civil unrest, you’ve lost control of the situation. If people are ignoring the laws of lockdown now, you’ve got no chance if you tighten the laws further. You just alienate even more people and increase the civil unrest.

This is why incompetence, arse-covering, just not looking outside the bubble, groupthink are all far more likely than conspiracy. Conspiracy requires everything to go exactly as planned. Nothing goes exactly as planned. The world’s best battle plan is only good until the first shot is fired, then it’s out of your control.

The uniformity to which you refer is indeed a lockstep. In case you didn’t realise, governments copy each other’s policies all the time. And on the face of it, lockdowns appeared to work in China, Italy and so on. It’s only when you drill into the data that the opposite becomes clear.

Look out the window – if you think the situation is under control, or planned, then you’re not looking out the same window I am. If this is conspiracy, prove it. Don’t point to gaps in knowledge and stuff bullshit in there, because it’s still bullshit.

130283 Mark, replying to Mark, 7, #955 of 1675 🔗

Mike Graham and Peter Hitchens’ weekly chat on Talkradio. Good stuff as usual.

Peter Hitchens: The Rule of Six has ‘made Christmas an arrestable offence.’

130284 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Mark, 3, #956 of 1675 🔗

At least that’s something to look forward to – an oasis of common sense.

130288 swedenborg, 6, #957 of 1675 🔗


War on restaurants from CDC

“Findings from a case-control investigation of symptomatic outpatients from 11 U.S. health care facilities found that close contact with persons with known COVID-19 or going to locations that offer on-site eating and drinking options were associated with COVID-19 positivity. Adults with positive SARS-CoV-2 test results were approximately twice as likely to have reported dining at a restaurant than were those with negative SARS-CoV-2 test results.”
But you need to read this also

“No significant differences were observed in the bivariate analysis between case-patients and control-participants in shopping; gatherings with ≤10 persons in a home; going to an office setting; going to a salon; gatherings with >10 persons in a home; going to a gym; using public transportation; going to a bar/coffee shop; or attending church/religious gathering. However, case-patients were more likely to have reported dining at a restaurant”

So no problems more than 6 at home,going to office,using public transport,going to bar/coffee shop, attending church, hair salon

130290 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 3, #958 of 1675 🔗

Another Has-Been urging the public to snitch on each other

‘I think we should call the authorities, yes, all of us have a responsibility to act’

@Ed_Miliband tells @shehabkhan he would call the police on his neighbours if they were having a party and encourages the public to do so too https:// itv.com/news/2020-09-1 3/rule-of-six-law-comes-into-force-to-tackle-growing-number-of-covid-cases

130301 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Victoria, 20, #959 of 1675 🔗

The couple next door have 3 children, this would mean I should report them each time their grandparents visit. Surely eveyone can see just how vile the suggestion is?

130323 ▶▶▶ Kev, replying to Strange Days, 7, #960 of 1675 🔗

You would think so, but no they don’t!

They will see themselves as the good ones, and the lockdown rule-breakers as the bad people.

They need to remember one thing, people will not forget what they did if they find out!

130347 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Kev, 6, #961 of 1675 🔗

Let me see what happened in 1944-45 as countries got liberated.. Oh yes, feathers, tar, shaving, and that was the lucky ones.

130644 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Kev, #962 of 1675 🔗

Head shaving would be a good start.
And use a blunt razor.

130314 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Victoria, 8, #963 of 1675 🔗

Yesp…just like back in the old days in his favorite countries of USSR and East Germany…Stasi and KGB and their army of informers. A close friend of mine grew up in E Germany and his father was in a ”re education camp” because his neighbors told the authorities he told a joke about the government. Let’s get back to it…#make London East Berlin 1974 again!!

130775 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Thomas_E, #964 of 1675 🔗

Now Russia and the UK have swapped places.

130333 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Victoria, 4, #965 of 1675 🔗

Just proves he’s the arsehole I always thought he was.

130340 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Victoria, 3, #966 of 1675 🔗

He probably doesn’t get invited to his neighbours’ parties.

130346 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Thinkaboutit, 3, #967 of 1675 🔗

Not even to his own.

130379 ▶▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #968 of 1675 🔗

Not even for a bacon buttie?

130437 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to T. Prince, 3, #969 of 1675 🔗

Lol. Especially not for a bacon buttie!

130472 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Victoria, 2, #970 of 1675 🔗

Clearly history has taught him no lessons.

130474 ▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Leemc23, #971 of 1675 🔗

At one point one of these ding bats in parliament will do a Dominic Cummings and screw up. I personally can not wait. As for Pretty Useless Patel. She can do one too.

130310 Stef, replying to Stef, 11, #972 of 1675 🔗

I wonder how many people want to go to Sweden in the next months as it appears to be the last beacon of hope and democracy. And finally we are going to a mask-free area without hysteria and terrified population! Definitely many of us will visit the country I guess.

Tourism will skyrocket there

130425 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Stef, 1, #973 of 1675 🔗

flights from Heathrow for November around £80. That’s a good start.

130529 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Stef, #974 of 1675 🔗

I checked out airbnb in several Swedish cities. Sadly too expensive for myself. anyone for a flat/houseshare? Lived in Stockholm for 3 months some years ago, wanted to go back for a while now.

130774 ▶▶ John P, replying to Stef, #975 of 1675 🔗

Russia is okay. It doesn’t get a good press as it’s still the West’s “official enemy”, but get beyond the anti-Russian propaganda and you find a good place to be. Few masks anywhere except on flights.

130312 Fingerache Philip., 5, #976 of 1675 🔗

Re: Authorities/Experts/Establishment telling collaborators to “snitch” on neighbours (more than 6,etc)
There’s a Black country saying:”Lower than a snake’s bally(belly)
We think and know that there’s something lower than that, don’t we?

130316 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 13, #977 of 1675 🔗

Hands, Face, Space, Rule of Six.

Listening to government ministers on the news programmes defending the new line, I could not but wonder if they are now taking their “advice” from some primary school teacher. They made no attempt to offer a justification based on scientific evidence, but rather simply asserted that the rules had to be simple so the public could comply.

130467 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Steve Hayes, #978 of 1675 🔗

I used to like watching Balamory with my daughter. The modern remake staring BJ, Matt etc is most disappointing. Although positively Patrick Vallance does make a fine job of Archie the Inventor.

130641 ▶▶ annie, replying to Steve Hayes, #979 of 1675 🔗

Shows what they think of the people.
Just as when they doubled the WHO distancing space because we Brits were too stupid to understand the original.
Our bedwetting town council has made a fetish of the six-foot rule, but most people hereabouts don’t give a toss.

130772 ▶▶ John P, replying to Steve Hayes, #980 of 1675 🔗

They are an incredibly arrogant bunch.

130355 ▶▶ leggy, replying to arfurmo, 2, #982 of 1675 🔗

All comments on there tend to be sceptical, even the articles where comments are moderated.

130459 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to arfurmo, 1, #983 of 1675 🔗

Pathetic of the reporter on there to average out the figures so they look much closer to 3,300 rather than reflect they are 800 odd less than Friday’s ( from memory ) key words “on average” tossers.

“Government statistics show some 2,998 infections are now being recorded each day, on average. For comparison, more than 3,300 cases were confirmed on Friday, Saturday and Sunday”

From 300,000 + tests 99% of people don’t have any sign of Covid, even dead bits. Great news. Nope let’s ignore that and focus on the 1% who might have something, although most likely have nothing.

130324 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 90, #984 of 1675 🔗

I have some good news. The moderator on the FB page containing the keyboard warriors’ insistence that the rozzers be called on me because I have a sign saying “No Masks Here” and another asking people not to use their hand sanitiser gel near me, has removed the comments and added a warning.

Further, the ‘brave’ person who informed any potential customers to avoid my shop like “the plague”(what a wit!) after being told that we would instigate legal action against him has also removed it.

And, I have had one of my busiest Mondays ever!

Thanks once again everyone for your comments, they’ve helped me get through what started as a pretty miserable day.

130329 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 12, #985 of 1675 🔗

Yay! So happy to hear this!

130332 ▶▶ DavidC, replying to kh1485, 5, #986 of 1675 🔗

Good for you! Well done.


130394 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to BTLnewbie, 6, #988 of 1675 🔗

Thanks. What I hate about that headline is that he is called a “Coronavirus denier” How abhorent.

130611 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to kh1485, 2, #989 of 1675 🔗

‘Denier’ has form which is why it’s used.

130342 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to kh1485, 10, #990 of 1675 🔗

I think you have provided concrete evidence for hope.

130345 ▶▶ Julian, replying to kh1485, 7, #991 of 1675 🔗

Glad to hear it. Either the moderator sensed trouble, or he/she has a spine and some moral code

130352 ▶▶ bluemoon, replying to kh1485, 3, #992 of 1675 🔗

Any publicity is good publicity they say!

130357 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to kh1485, 5, #993 of 1675 🔗

Well done for not backing down. Don’t let a PR crisis go to waste 👍

130362 ▶▶ JYC, replying to kh1485, 4, #994 of 1675 🔗

Well done!

130411 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to kh1485, 6, #995 of 1675 🔗

You’re a hero! That’s awesome news.

130412 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to kh1485, 4, #996 of 1675 🔗

Keep on keeping on, KH.

130439 ▶▶ Biggles, replying to kh1485, 4, #997 of 1675 🔗

Excellent news!

130457 ▶▶ Basileus, replying to kh1485, 4, #998 of 1675 🔗

Three cheers!

130510 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Basileus, 2, #999 of 1675 🔗

Hip hip, hurrah, hip hip, hurrah, hip hip hurrah.

Always good to hear something positive after some many months.

Next time I drive down the M11 I know where I will be stopping for a cup of tea, and a bite to eat.

130481 ▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 8, #1000 of 1675 🔗

‘I have had one of my busiest Mondays ever!’

I told you this morning it would be good for custom!

Well done. Sceptic of the Day, at least.

Thing is, the sort of ‘brave person’ you refer to are in my view generally the worst kind of coward. That’s why, eventually, they’ll lose. They are devoid of any form of original thought, merely follow the herd, and can’t do anything outside of the herd. Not the sort of people you want on your side in a struggle, as when the going gets tough they won’t be there.

130497 ▶▶ John Ballard, replying to kh1485, 5, #1001 of 1675 🔗

Big story on the mail site about a shop that says no masks, all the most rated comments are right behind the owner

130637 ▶▶ annie, replying to kh1485, 4, #1002 of 1675 🔗

So glad! There are some truly wicked,nhorrid people about and totalitarianism will always get them crawling out of their holes, but there is decency out there too.
More power to your elbow.
Maybe we should start designing a LS medal for our most outstanding resisters!!

130721 ▶▶ janis pennance, replying to kh1485, 1, #1003 of 1675 🔗

Brilliant !

130862 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kh1485, 1, #1004 of 1675 🔗

Woohooo!!! Well done you for sticking to your guns!

130330 DavidC, replying to DavidC, 30, #1005 of 1675 🔗

I get so bloody angry. They’re NOT CASES! They are positive test results! Cases are symptomatic individuals who may, but not necessarily, have to be admitted to hospitals!


130358 ▶▶ DRW, replying to DavidC, 3, #1006 of 1675 🔗

Hence the recent media arse-covering by calling them “infections”

130410 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to DRW, 8, #1007 of 1675 🔗

Infection is even worse as it implies the person who tests positive is actually infectious. A positive at 45 PCR cycles is a false positive and this individual is neither a case nor an infection. Language matters, and the misuse of language is one of the more insidious aspects of this insanity.

130331 CGL, replying to CGL, 16, #1008 of 1675 🔗

Just a thought – after hearing that the bbc is reporting that the government is encouraging snitching, I wondered if I might put a sign in my window to the effect that our household would not be taking part in this particular scheme. Anyone see any pitfalls with that idea?

130370 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to CGL, 2, #1009 of 1675 🔗

Someone will snitch on you?

130409 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to T. Prince, #1010 of 1675 🔗

I won’t have committed a crime though (until they make it one!) just stating that we want nothing to do with it.

130396 ▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to CGL, 13, #1011 of 1675 🔗

I fucking hate my neighbours but I would never rat on them, fuck the Stasi

130501 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Jaguarpig, 5, #1012 of 1675 🔗

We all need to take that stance, otherwise WHOever is running the farce will win.

130338 BeBopRockSteady, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 10, #1013 of 1675 🔗

Cases in France and Spain falling. Doubling rate lengthened by 25% roughly.

These figures are always so misleading. But they broadly reinforce the message that any rises we are seeing are just the flickering of the embers. Dry tinder exhausted.

130365 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #1014 of 1675 🔗

Can you explain some more detail on what this is saying about France and Spain.

The doubling rate means?

130424 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to hotrod, 3, #1015 of 1675 🔗

Not to comment on this, hotrod, but you were asking the other day about rising hospital admissions in the UK. Have you seen the couple of excellent posts today highlighting that the Welsh hospital admission figures are based on “suspected” covid. In the past two weeks Welsh “admissions” have made up a hugely disproportionate number of UK cases.

130541 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to hotrod, #1016 of 1675 🔗

How many days it will take for the current infections level to double. It gives you an idea of how steep the increase or lack of has been.

So before the weekend it was all about France and Spain as the warning signs for a second wave. However it seems to have peaked somewhat and the idea of na exponential second wave underway seems absurd and was obviously alarmist.

130341 DavidC, 3, #1017 of 1675 🔗

‘Rule of six’. Another NLP term. Funny how it reminds of ‘Seven of nine’ from Star Trek – assimilation into the borg?!


130353 The Dark Lord, replying to The Dark Lord, 1, #1018 of 1675 🔗

As it relates to the false positive rate … In the US in Sept daily tests have a range of 523k to 1,131K and the positive rate has been steady between 4% and 5.6% … it appears that no matter how many or few tests you do you will get about a 5% positive rate … seems like we’ll never get below 5% …

130363 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to The Dark Lord, #1019 of 1675 🔗

How does that explain Northern Ireland where it bounces along at 1 to 2% of 8000 or so daily tests?

130406 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 4, #1020 of 1675 🔗

It all depends on the number of amplification cycles used for the PCR tests. Many countries are going beyond the 35 cycles recommended at the top end, hence there will be more “positive” tests. Even 35 cycles is likely too many and 25-30 should be the upper limit. It is actually a quantitative test, so a positive at 5 cycles indicates much more virus than a positive at 40 cycles (which is likely a false positive).

130420 ▶▶▶ NickR, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #1021 of 1675 🔗

Read the piece by James Fergusson (no relation…… I suppose he could be like Mycroft, Sherlock’s smarter elder brother) in yesterday’s LS, he explains all about false positives & why everyone keeps reporting the same percentage of positives.

130356 nocheesegromit, replying to nocheesegromit, 8, #1022 of 1675 🔗

Absolutely brilliant newsletter today RE: the ‘sEcOnD wAvE’. That should be read out to Hancock, BoJo, Whitty the Witless et al. whilst they squirm and try to justify their measures.

In other news I’ve found some petitions on the UK Parliament website related to our cause. They’ll probably do sweet FA as per the pathetic response to the call to reverse the mandatory masks decision, but you never know.

Prevent any restrictions on those who refuse a Covid-19 vaccination (well over 100k now so it has to be debated in Parliament – excellent) : https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/323442

Don’t make the wearing of face masks compulsory in public places in England – https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/331174

Support Dance schools and venues that provide dance activities amidst COVID-19 – https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/328373

Do not make masks mandatory for children in primary or secondary schools in UK. – https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/332497

Repeal the Coronavirus Act 2020 – https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/313310

130430 ▶▶ CGL, replying to nocheesegromit, #1023 of 1675 🔗

All signed

130360 DocRC, replying to DocRC, 24, #1024 of 1675 🔗

My latest email to my MP, a junior Minister so no chance of a sensible reply….

Dear ………..,

I’m afraid the Government have gone too far with this latest infringement of our liberties. There is no science behind the arbitrary “rule of 6”. Asymptomatic “cases” are increasing due to massively ramped up testing and the false positive results of the flawed PCR test but hospital and ICU admissions and deaths are virtually zero.

I suspect there will be widespread flouting of this new law which again has been introduced with no Parliamentary debate.

I am unable to discern any Government strategy which for the record should be to shelter the elderly and those with co-morbidities and let the rest of us get on with our lives. Population immunity is the only way out of this mess and the Government needs to start trusting the British People rather than treating them like naughty children.

Kind regards,

130378 ▶▶ Julian, replying to DocRC, 6, #1025 of 1675 🔗

I still believe it’s good to remind them someone is watching them

130366 jim j, replying to jim j, 3, #1026 of 1675 🔗

What a shame the DT has not allowed comments under Carl Hennigans piece! It would be brilliant to see what the Chicken George’s make of the irrefutable logic!

130372 ▶▶ jim j, replying to jim j, #1027 of 1675 🔗

Heneghan, my apologies.

130417 ▶▶ Will, replying to jim j, #1028 of 1675 🔗

Which article was that Jim j

130368 PoshPanic, replying to PoshPanic, 12, #1030 of 1675 🔗

Took a break and a lunch time dip to cool off. Seems half the country are self isolating at the beach. Some in groups. I don’t that many are bothered about the dictators broadcasts anymore.

130376 ▶▶ jim j, replying to PoshPanic, 6, #1031 of 1675 🔗

I don’t think I have more than 5 friend anyway…!

130400 ▶▶ DRW, replying to PoshPanic, 2, #1032 of 1675 🔗

Imagine if they deploy the marshalls on the beaches. That could be quite funny having them counting numbers and asking “are you in the same household?”

130431 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to DRW, 5, #1033 of 1675 🔗

By all means they can ask. but I will be telling them to GFT

130470 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to DRW, #1034 of 1675 🔗

There were beach marshals on D-Day, weren’t there ?

130390 richard riewer, 7, #1035 of 1675 🔗

The OMG Party: Overthrow Malicious Governments

130391 mattghg, replying to mattghg, 6, #1036 of 1675 🔗

I knew that that remark about “live with the virus” meaning “self-isolate forever” was coming. In the first week of the Tour de France coverage the French Prime Minister was interviewed and asked why they were allowing the race to go ahead. His answer, that France has to “live with the virus”, was spoken from behind a mask.

130398 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to mattghg, 3, #1037 of 1675 🔗

And he spent the day with the Race Director, Christian Prudhomme, who was also wearing a face mask and tested positive the next day for the virus and had to self isolate.

130444 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Steve Hayes, #1038 of 1675 🔗

Yes, I remember that, too. Interesting that Prudhomme only has to isolate for seven days. Isn’t it 14 days here?

130520 ▶▶ guy153, replying to mattghg, 1, #1039 of 1675 🔗

In many ways I found him more encouraging than our PM though. They do at least seem to be clear that they aren’t going to have another lockdown so basically people just have to wait until they get bored of the masks. I had assumed that was the track we were on.

They have also just bent their own rules. It was two positive tests in a week for Covid meant the whole team got sent home. But after a few positives on the rest day after the first week, they announced they were going to “reset the clock”. So those teams won’t be kicked out if they test positive again.

It’s another rest and presumably test day today. I don’t know the results as I avoid the news but I’m hoping they won’t actually ruin the race by sending anyone home.

130534 ▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to guy153, 1, #1040 of 1675 🔗

I don’t think they will. They know how big the race is to the sponsors and to the country. They don’t want to send any team home. They’ll just change the rules again if 2 or more test positive from a team or send them off for another test for confirmation and then that will come back negative.
Who’s your money on Roglic or Pogacar?

130537 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to guy153, #1041 of 1675 🔗

I agree with you about the race, but I’m a bit more worried about the situation in France. In several metropolitan areas they’ve made it mandatory to wear a face covering at all times in public, including outdoors. I hope that’s not what we have in store.

130395 Pembroke, replying to Pembroke, 8, #1042 of 1675 🔗


I’m not going to comment specifically on the article as I haven’t read it yet. I would just like to record my congratulations to the staff of my local Co-Op here in Wales this morning (who as you know are now also required to wear a face nappy) for defying the socio-communist Welsh Assembly by wearing face Shields not masks.

As you could get a large banana round the side of the shield I don’t know who thought it would stop a Nano metre sized virus but hats off to them. Perhaps we should all see it as an example and stick to the law while finding ways to defy the law.

130629 ▶▶ annie, replying to Pembroke, 1, #1043 of 1675 🔗

Staff in Tesco are also wearing shields, unlike the nappied sheeple who shop there. Instant compliance, what a surprise.
It was very quiet in Tesco hell for 4 pm. I only peered in, I do Click and Collect, haven’t been inside a supermarket for months.

130769 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to annie, 1, #1044 of 1675 🔗

I’m disappointed. It took a lot for me to go into a supermarket naked without a face covering, but it gets easier.

BTW: has the face nappy law now spread to Wales?

130800 ▶▶▶▶ Pembroke, replying to John P, 1, #1045 of 1675 🔗

Yes John, I’m afraid it has but as the rural community is fairly well spread out, and the incidences of positive tests (no info on false positives of course) is approx. 1 in 5000 the chances of my even meeting someone who has tested positive let alone actually having the virus is statistically remote.

130401 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 4, #1046 of 1675 🔗

cant see the gov coronavirus update page because of ‘ongoing problems with microsoft azure’ whatever that is. they’d be better off using linux – probably get less false positives too

130407 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to steve_w, 2, #1047 of 1675 🔗

Just seen that, and on the day the ‘rule of 6’ comes into effect, how convenient!

130416 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1048 of 1675 🔗

Down to 2600 today.

But of course all those with it couldn’t get a test…..so these numbers are no longer valid…..


There are people genuinely disappointed that the number has dropped!!!!

130423 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to hotrod, #1049 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for that – yes, I can imagine some will be disappointed!

130432 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 9, #1050 of 1675 🔗

Dear Deidre,
I haven’t had a test.
I haven’t had any symptoms.
I live in an ‘outbreak’ area, with local restrictions.
I’m going to the pub, socialising, shopping like billy-o, not wearing a mask, shaking hands…
Am I doing something wrong?
I feel so left out.
Will my neighbours snitch on me because I haven’t got it?
Should I get a Pangolin?

130440 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #1051 of 1675 🔗

“Oh my, can’t get a test” was the mantra on Talkradio earlier – that and the Spector of lockdown part 2.

Had to laugh when some lady was talking about her husband (not funny as he was ill in hospital) and that she too had Covid currently but only knew that as he friend at the hospital did her a favour and swabbed her on the quiet. She then went on to say that if she had not known she would have been spreading it everywhere……surely the fact her husband had the thing and was confirmed meant she should have been at home, so what relevance is the test in her case anyway ?

130460 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #1052 of 1675 🔗

Pangolin, class lol

130454 ▶▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to hotrod, 1, #1053 of 1675 🔗

Figures must be wrong because experts say that the rise is exponential .

130419 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1054 of 1675 🔗

I had a set of emails with them last week. they were very happy to take constructive criticism of the way the data is presented – part of their public outreach I suppose. The only part they just wouldn’t engage in was my suggestion they should have ‘+ve results’ rather than ‘cases’. Just didn’t even acknowledge I’d said this.

130461 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to steve_w, 3, #1055 of 1675 🔗

It’ll be a computer virus …

130465 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to JohnB, 2, #1056 of 1675 🔗

Bill will have a vaccine for it in a jiffy.

130499 ▶▶ matt, replying to steve_w, #1057 of 1675 🔗

Azure is Microsoft’s cloud platform.

130414 Lord Rickmansworth, 7, #1058 of 1675 🔗

What’s that?

The best podcast about how bloomin’ crazy everything is?

Bedwetters is back but under the new name (which we think should be the party political name) of THE REAL NORMAL!

Check it out here

This episode we chat about Context. 👇


130421 nocheesegromit, replying to nocheesegromit, 14, #1059 of 1675 🔗

DM website’s top story at the moment is a load of photos of people socialising in groups of more than 6 with a headline blaming the young for daring to live their lives. Thankfully most of the comments are supportive of them.

130426 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to nocheesegromit, 8, #1060 of 1675 🔗

Bodies in the streets, 14 days from now, then?

130697 ▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Sam Vimes, #1061 of 1675 🔗

assuming they watch the TV news or read a newspaper

130427 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #1062 of 1675 🔗

they may have been lots of small support groups – hence exempt

130434 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to nocheesegromit, 22, #1063 of 1675 🔗

I like this one

What a load of hysterical, ill-informed,small minded nonsense.Around 1600 people die each and everyday in the UK and, sorry to break it to you but not all die peacefully in their sleep. Some die of horrendous diseases and cancers but some how the few that are dying of covid now, take precedence over those suffering from delayed and missed treatments. You really need to use a bit of common sense and put things into perspective. You can start by looking at the actual data and educating yourself on what a ‘case’ really is.

130422 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 7, #1064 of 1675 🔗

Just thinking about how the plebs make it all up for themselves, has anybody been told yet that Test and Trace details are mandatory from today?

Cos it ain’t til Friday.

130428 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Sam Vimes, 7, #1065 of 1675 🔗

I’ve never left details anywhere including today

130479 ▶▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to steve_w, 5, #1066 of 1675 🔗

I would happily give not quite correct details.

130503 ▶▶ matt, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #1067 of 1675 🔗

I was told it was mandatory on the day it was announced. I educated them.

The actual rule is that they’re obliged to ask and obliged to refuse entry if the customer declines. There’s no requirement in the customer to provide accurate details. Also, it’s perfectly possible in many places (especially places with QR code set-ups not to decline, but not to do it anyway.

130429 tallandbald, 8, #1068 of 1675 🔗

Coming soon to a white middle class neighbourhood like yours. Helmeted goons in blue uniforms with clubs and tasers to help you understand the “rules”.

It’s happening in Australia and will be here sooner than you think if we let it.

I wonder if a new culture will evolve for us built around “ all colour ” oppression by the Po-leece like it did in 80’s black America spawning the Hip Hop revolution.

I wonder if i could come up with lyrics to my song like NWA did?

Lights start flashin’ behind me
But they’re scared of a nigga so they mace me to blind me
But that shit don’t work, I just laugh
Because it gives ’em a hint, not to step in my path
For police, I’m sayin, “Fuck you, punk!”
Readin’ my rights and shit, it’s all junk
Pullin’ out a silly club, so you stand
With a fake-ass badge and a gun in your hand
But take off the gun so you can see what’s up
And we’ll go at it, punk, and I’ma fuck you up!

Their way of life, hassled by the boys in blue every day could be ours very shortly!

130433 Chicot, replying to Chicot, 8, #1069 of 1675 🔗

Typical misleading bs from the BBC. Under the headline “Antibody treatment to be given to Covid patients”, the excerpt states “Laboratory-made antibodies are to be trialled on 2,000 people with Coronavirus in UK hospitals”. I’ve just checked Worldometer and the number of “Serious, Critical” cases is 79. Given that I very much doubt that there are even 2000 Covid cases in hospital (anyone know the numbers for this?). Still, it’s a good way to keep the hysteria ramped up.


130438 ▶▶ NickR, replying to Chicot, 4, #1070 of 1675 🔗
130450 ▶▶▶ Chicot, replying to NickR, 6, #1071 of 1675 🔗

Thanks. No doubt anyone glancing at the excerpt will assume there are thousands which no doubt is the intention.

130436 thedarkhorse, replying to thedarkhorse, 27, #1072 of 1675 🔗

I have just received an “order” from within the family. I must, if we do actually have any Christmas holiday-time to speak of, not talk about cv19, or politics, or any other “extreme view” topic when relatives call….basically will amount to just one person anyway. Said person has said that because they work for government they feel that I am attacking their employer. Well buggar me, they forget that I actually also used to work for the state, in my youth, I now receive a small government pension but it won’t stop me speaking what I think. What is it with folk, they seem to only want a life full of “nice things” to talk about.
It always seem to be my fault. Do these people have some sort of “avoidance” syndrome?

130447 ▶▶ RickH, replying to thedarkhorse, 3, #1073 of 1675 🔗

It’s tough when you’re put in a position like this.

But know that it’s not you. There comes a point where trying to avoid conflict tips over into dishonesty if key issues are just ducked. It becomes emotional bullying.

Fortunately, we don’t have anything like this to deal with, but, given that different members of the family have to cope with practical situations that those of us without such constraints can ignore, there is always some negotiation, even given that we are all on the broadly sceptic side.

But it’s a two-way street.

130448 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to thedarkhorse, 9, #1074 of 1675 🔗

I’ve had that from ‘the wife’. Apparently when I try to educate people with ‘facts’, I sound like a ‘Sun reader’!! (even though I never read it)

130476 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to thedarkhorse, 5, #1075 of 1675 🔗

If they don’t talk about it then it’s not really happening – weird I know, I also have family members who are a bit like this. They are however getting a little less sure that it’s all about controlling the virus and nothing else. For me well it all falls in rather nicely with the Green agenda (that Teresa May signed us up to achieve by 2025), the 25% reduction in the World population so beloved by Gates plus removing Trump. A “happy” coincidence for for some high rolling Global cabal members?

130486 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to thedarkhorse, 10, #1076 of 1675 🔗

“Said person has said that because they work for government they feel that I am attacking their employer.”

Such person doesn’t understand that it is the civic duty of all citizens to criticise the Government.

BTW, I am a former public servant.

130500 ▶▶ Julian, replying to thedarkhorse, 2, #1077 of 1675 🔗

Oh yes indeed, some feel the instinctive need to avoid the awful truth as they know it will hurt them. I have some sympathy.

Others are just lazy and apathetic and find it “boring” to talk about such matters – I struggle to maintain respect for people like that – I don’t care if they want to allow their lives to be ruined, but they are allowing mine to be ruined too.

130508 ▶▶ NickR, replying to thedarkhorse, 4, #1078 of 1675 🔗

Governments and by extension government employees only have one paymaster, the taxpayer, and all tax only comes from the profits of private companies.

130547 ▶▶ Arkansas, replying to thedarkhorse, 1, #1079 of 1675 🔗

Said person has said that because they work for government they feel that I am attacking their employer.

But ultimately… you are their employer, surely!

In any case, being so identified with one’s employer, such that you take it personally and your feelings are hurt if someone has criticisms, is an unhealthy situation surely borne of having an “extreme view” of the employer-employee relationship.

130549 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to thedarkhorse, 2, #1080 of 1675 🔗

Their employer is supposed to be working for us.

I worked for the NHS for decades, and had no objections to anyone criticising it.

130691 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to thedarkhorse, 1, #1081 of 1675 🔗

there’s a lot of people who will be avoiding this subject at Christmas if they are on the wrong side of the argument.

130445 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 15, #1082 of 1675 🔗

Had a nice talk with a customer today about the silly ongoings. He sadly recently lost a friend who was too afraid to seek medical help for ongoing chest pain and died suddenly collapsing in the street.
How much longer are we going to accept that?
The letter to the MP, listing all the wrongs they experience amongst friends and family is just so sad, but powerful.

130485 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Silke David, 8, #1083 of 1675 🔗

At the start of this scam, there was a video of a person in China ‘dropping dead in the street’ which, we were told, was evidence of how dangerous this virus is. Because people don’t suddenly collapse in the street and die.

130618 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Ewan Duffy, #1084 of 1675 🔗

Not in civilised countries they don’t.

130453 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 11, #1085 of 1675 🔗

I watched a depressing news story about the Querdenken Demonstration in Munich on Saturday 12th September. Police try every little trick to stop people from demonstrating.
Luckily their lawyer seems to have never ending energy, but in the end they stopped the march and “just” had speeches on a large square where on can keep distance.
Funnily enough other demonstrations (BLM/Pride) can go ahead with out much police presence and restrictions imposed.
Querdenken are fighting the police in the courts and Querdenken will have their victory.

130607 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Silke David, #1086 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for this, it was hard to make sense from the streams of the event. There was a good turn out.

130616 ▶▶ annie, replying to Silke David, 2, #1087 of 1675 🔗

Let’s cheer them on to victory.
Sane people of the world, unite!

130455 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 7, #1088 of 1675 🔗

Jon Rappoport on a very positive development in Ohio – https://blog.nomorefakenews.com/2020/09/14/covid-major-case-filed-against-ohio-for-restricting-freedom/

This is the phrase that stuck in my mind – Since no quantified virus isolates of the 2019-nCoV are currently available , …

130487 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to JohnB, 2, #1089 of 1675 🔗


“In plain English this means that there are no available pure 2019-nCOVvirus isolates to test against so instead an educated best guess is being used. The question this leads us to is how accurate can a test be for a virus that has not been defined…? If our freedoms are to be abridged under an emergency declaration related to a disease, should it not be a requirement that the disease at least be defined?”

130653 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnB, #1090 of 1675 🔗

Thank you. Really good to get this point.

130456 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 1, #1091 of 1675 🔗

Pub Med article from 2016:


It is most certain that the high viscosity of hydrogel-based nanosystems can efficiently offer this mucoadhesive property. This update review discusses the possible benefits of using hydrogel polymer-based nanoparticles and hydrogel nanocomposites for drug/vaccine delivery through the intranasal administration.

Worried about the vaccine? If you’ve had a test, you may already have been administered with it.

130473 ▶▶ Cruella, replying to Richard O, 1, #1092 of 1675 🔗

Wow, I get vaccinated every week! Also, we’ve been using any swabs we can get, even vaginal brush type ones so don’t know if the NHS is coordinated enough for such subterfuge.

130478 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Cruella, -1, #1093 of 1675 🔗

In your experience how often are nasal swabs used which penetrate as deep into the head as the Covid-19 test kits?

130518 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Richard O, #1094 of 1675 🔗

Cruella is a paid shill bro, no doubt

130515 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Richard O, #1095 of 1675 🔗

if you’ve had a test they’ve certainly given you something

130682 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Biker, #1096 of 1675 🔗

No one has, or ever will, shove that bloody thing into my head.

130685 ▶▶ John P, replying to Richard O, #1097 of 1675 🔗

No, you wouldn’t have been. There is no vaccine at the moment.

130462 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 18, #1098 of 1675 🔗

10,214 corona virus fines not paid. Not one yet taken to court in 7months. Why not?

That should clog up the courts quite nicely thank you

130502 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 9, #1099 of 1675 🔗

As these are presumably contested cases it is likely that it will take an average of a day to hear each case (by the time prosecution and defence witnesses are called etc)

It would take one court sitting continuously for 42.5 years to hear them all. This in on the basis that the court also sits on Bank Holidays including Christmas Day and Boxing Day (which they don’t )

Our Christmas may be buggered up but so will the Magistrate’s(God bless them)

As the courts currently have a backlog of of five months, the dictator could create 42 new courts and deal with them in a year

This fails to take into account delays caused by adjournments etc

Rearrange the words

anyone, through, did, think, this

into a meaningful statement

130509 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 6, #1100 of 1675 🔗

So what does the dictator do?

He creates a new raft of additional offences and encourages narks to grass up Joe Public creating even more cases


130519 ▶▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 3, #1101 of 1675 🔗


The thousands of new magistrates that need to be trained.
42 new court buildings
Thousands of new solicitors.
Hundreds of new Court staff

Never mind, the dictator will have loads of money in the autumn/new year which he can use to fund this

130726 ▶▶▶▶▶ Felice, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1102 of 1675 🔗

Interestingly, I had a yougov survey a couple of days ago which was about magistrates. It asked had I considered becoming one, and if not, why not.

130527 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1103 of 1675 🔗

Good to hear. Source?

130847 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to mattghg, #1104 of 1675 🔗

Written response to parliament justice committee, reported on the BBC

130540 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Cecil B, #1105 of 1675 🔗

Because if you go to court you can say your piece, and no doubt the local rag would have a journo in attendance to report whatever is said.

130469 JohnMac, replying to JohnMac, 3, #1106 of 1675 🔗

57% of Daily Telegraph readers say they will abide by Johnson’s latest rules.
And 11% say will snitch on those who don’t.

130495 ▶▶ Julian, replying to JohnMac, 6, #1107 of 1675 🔗

57 – well, would have been nice had it been under 50, but a much lower figure than you’d have got back in March. And 11% isn’t bad either. Progress.

130517 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnMac, 2, #1108 of 1675 🔗

57% of Daily Telegraph readers, 77th brigade, and bots …

130765 ▶▶ John P, replying to JohnMac, 1, #1109 of 1675 🔗

8 out of 10 cats who expressed a preference …

130846 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to JohnMac, 1, #1110 of 1675 🔗

Strange given the comments on most articles are probably 80-90% sceptical. Not convinced the polls aren’t fixed like the YouGov surveys.

130882 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Darryl, 2, #1111 of 1675 🔗

Polls are a tool for influencing public opinion not measuring it

130482 RyanM, replying to RyanM, 19, #1112 of 1675 🔗

Here’s my “update” from the US. I have been horribly wrong about individual behavior this whole time, and I have been absolutely shocked by the widespread adoption of masks, but I’m still struck by a few things.

First, when I go to some of my morning-routine websites this morning, I don’t really see CV19 featured at all. It seems to be falling out of the news. You’ll see articles that are kind of buried, and the substance of those articles essentially says “nothing much going on.” I think people are losing interest, and as they lose interest, they will lose patience for any restrictions.

One example is my hometown. I live in WA state, and our governor “indefinitely suspended” (i.e. until after the election in November) his “safe start WA” plan, which enables us to “phase up.” My county is stuck in “phase 1.” But honestly, I don’t see that much of anything is still closed. Restaurants are at 25% capacity, and pretty much every business has a “masks required” sign on the door… this weekend, I did a lot of shopping, as I had some projects going at home, and I wore a bandanna around my neck the whole time. Didn’t even bother putting anything on the kids (6 and 8) and nobody said a thing.

I don’t even know what the restrictions of “phase 1” are, but it appears they are largely being ignored.

I would be shocked if any politician – democrat or republican – imposed new lockdowns prior to the election. But I’ve been shocked, before.

The simple fact of the matter is this: CV ain’t no black death. People aren’t dying in the streets. There is no immediately observable justification for mass hysteria. With a highly contested presidential election, and many local elections coming up, people simply aren’t concerned with CV19 right now. And once we lose interest, we lose patience.

That doesn’t mean they can’t attempt to ramp the hysteria back to 11, and I imagine that if Trump wins that is exactly what they will do. But I think it is going to be much, much harder the second go around.

130493 ▶▶ Julian, replying to RyanM, 10, #1113 of 1675 🔗

It has to an extent dropped out of the news here in the UK, except when there is a new development, but I am not so sure that is a good sign. My fear is that the nonsense being imposed upon on us, which is considerable and amounts to a continuation of lockdown, has just become normal for people now and they have accepted it. There can’t really be a “new” lockdown here because the “old” one never finished. We are in a constant state of public health emergency and panic, forever. The insidious “new normal” strategy is working.

130513 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Julian, 3, #1114 of 1675 🔗

Hence we need to keep reminding people that it isn’t normal, and telling those businesses and other organisations most affected that they are unlikely to survive if they don’t return to real normality.

130542 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Julian, 5, #1115 of 1675 🔗

I agree that that would be a bad thing. I worry about it with masks, but I also think that as soon as the restrictions are lifted, masks will all but disappear. The encouraging aspect of what I have observed here is that rather than considering it a new normal, a lot of people seem to be just ignoring it.

I may be way too optimistic about it, though. This weekend, as I walked through various stores with my bandanna pulled down below my chin, I didn’t really see anyone else not wearing a mask. I saw several with them under the nose or even under the mouth. People have largely accepted it and they just wear the masks. What really stuck out at me, though, was the fact that nobody said a word to me about not wearing mine. As I said, I think if the legal mandate is lifted, the immediate effect will be, in the very least, a 50% reduction in mask usage, and they will probably disappear altogether within a matter of weeks.

130728 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RyanM, #1116 of 1675 🔗

I think masks would certainly reduce enormously if they were not mandatory, but I can’t see any motivation for our govt to remove that, and lots of reasons why they wouldn’t (how would they explain it was no longer needed?).

130753 ▶▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Julian, #1117 of 1675 🔗

In my state, the mask requirement is an executive order justified only by our governor’s declared “state of emergency.” At some point, that emergency declaration expires and all of the mandates along with it. But beyond that, I think it is a simple matter of enforcement. As I mentioned, I went out shopping this weekend, and kept the bandanna around my neck. As more people do that, enforcement becomes impossible. I think what happens is that people begin to simply ignore the governor’s edicts and they lose all of their power.

130558 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Julian, 1, #1118 of 1675 🔗

My fear is that the nonsense being imposed upon on us, which is considerable and amounts to a continuation of lockdown, has just become normal for people now and they have accepted it.

This has also worried me. But maybe for the average member of the public – genuinely fearful and convinced by the media propaganda – seeing less and less Covid news reported would start to sow the seeds of doubt and scepticism.
I suspect a lot of people are now less than convinced by the constant focus on “rising cases” combined with a distinct lack of footage of packed hospitals and mass graves, month after month.

130727 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Drawde927, #1119 of 1675 🔗

I don’t think many are totally convinced, just wandering into the new normal. Right now we need more people with fire in their bellies, who like a drink and a laugh and a shag and a boogie with mates. We’ve been drifting away from that kind of life for a while now, which has partly enabled what has happened, IMO

130617 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 6, #1120 of 1675 🔗

One thing – a brief six months has blown out of the water the myth of UK exceptionalism.

All the television programmes about the Battle of Britain etc. stacked end to end won’t counteract the fact that the UK is just as susceptible to the totalitarian impulse and susceptibilty of the population as any country.

130722 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RickH, #1121 of 1675 🔗

Sadly seems to be true, though I still think we’d done OK up to now, overall. Human weakness is everywhere, and societies that function well have always seemed to me miraculous rather than the norm to be expected

130880 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to RickH, #1122 of 1675 🔗

Years ago you could argue it was true but we have been under the heel of the USA and Europe for so long now our exceptionalism has been driven out of our society

130483 Basics, 6, #1123 of 1675 🔗

Notes from a university city.

On the street you are the odd one out wearing a mask in in the areas of the city away from campus. 95% no masks, graffiti -some really creative on point about the fraud. Several elderly people in masks dotted about looking dejected and not making eye contact. Really sorrowful to see. Thought about interjecting but considered it wiser to not cause alarm.

On the street near to the university the mask to no mask ration is maybe 60% no mask.

Wearing mask as elbow pad is cool.

Also good form is to pick up ‘lost’ mask and dress near by railing to advertise to owner, same drill as winter mitten lossages.

In other news Patrick UK Column Henningsen has been twit blocked by DELVING devi for daring to start a discussion. This cannot be allowed in Freshers week -a professor being shown up in discussion. Block, block, block.

130489 Lili, 1, #1124 of 1675 🔗

In the forum – Exeter/Devon/Cornwall meet up. I’m in. Anyone else? I mention it here as the forum still doesn’t seem to be used as much as it should be for further ranting/group start ups.

130514 ▶▶ matt, replying to hotrod, 3, #1126 of 1675 🔗

Actually, I think that’s a remarkably fair piece.

130516 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to matt, #1127 of 1675 🔗

Agree. At last.

130528 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to matt, 1, #1128 of 1675 🔗

Yes – am I seeing things? – a pro-Sweden piece in the Evening Standard, or as I call it the house journal of the sneering metropolitan elite. They don’t get much more MSM than the Standard. Maybe it’s one of their occasional token articles going against their usual line – they did the same with Brexit.

130538 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to matt, 3, #1129 of 1675 🔗

Yeah, I’m not sure what there is to complain about with that article. Seems pretty spot-on to me. To quote:

But the politically explosive possibility, which the Swedish health authorities certainly believe to be true, is that they are reaching a degree of so-called “herd immunity”; in other words that enough people have had the virus and are now immune that it is hard for the virus to spread.

If this is true, the political ramifications are hard to overestimate.

130594 ▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to RyanM, 2, #1130 of 1675 🔗

It is going to destroy governments around the world. The Johnson might actually escape unscathed if he is ruthless enough to chuck Cummings under the bus…

130544 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to matt, 1, #1131 of 1675 🔗

Definitely, it seems very even-handed, it mentions the huge amount of media criticism Sweden received earlier in the year but does so (to my eye) in an objective, unbiased way, and acknowledges the huge implications if Sweden’s strategy turns out to be successful.

130592 ▶▶ Will, replying to hotrod, 1, #1132 of 1675 🔗

The suggestion it was some sort of outrageous punt to not follow the advice of the Chinese communist party, their WHO stooges and the jottings of a man, Ferguson, who has never been right about anything is the most wryly amusing aspect of this article. The worm is very much on the turn.

130494 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 3, #1133 of 1675 🔗

Retail footfall down https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/sep/14/uk-retailers-fall-in-shoppers-covid-lockdown but of course it is due to the holidays being over and schools going back. No mention of muzzles.

130647 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to arfurmo, 3, #1134 of 1675 🔗

And because of the government’s new campaign of terror no doubt.

130496 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 6, #1135 of 1675 🔗

DM Headline

China will not carry out mass vaccinations on its population because Covid-19 has largely been wiped out in the country, Beijing’s health chief says

130504 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Victoria, 3, #1136 of 1675 🔗

I love the euphemism. “Largely been wiped out”. There is only one way to wipe out a virus and only one way to “largely” wipe it out. These are eradication and herd immunity respectively. The strategies are polar opposites. It seems China has a “zero covid” policy very similar to Devi Sridhar’s definition of the term (it means herd immunity).

130512 ▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to guy153, 7, #1137 of 1675 🔗

No they just don’t test
No tests no problem

130533 ▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to 6097 Smith W, 6, #1138 of 1675 🔗

I think that is likely the case. The cynic in me wants to think that the extreme measures in Wuhan were widely publicized in an attempt to get the rest of the world to lock down, but it is likely that the rest of the country took a much more Sweden-like approach and simply kept it all under wraps.

130548 ▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RyanM, 2, #1139 of 1675 🔗

They are either lying or just not testing much, if at all. I would be curious to see if all-cause mortality has spiked.

Whichever way you look at it, they’ve come out of it much better off than most.

130551 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Julian, 3, #1140 of 1675 🔗

I imagine it is a combination of both. A lot of reason to believe that they were lying early on. But interestingly, the predictions made by Michael Levitt were based, in large part, on China’s numbers, and those have actually ended up being accurate, so it’s hard to say.

If the rest of us had stopped testing back in June, it is likely that the rest of this would have passed unnoticed. It is very possible that this is what China did.

130604 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 4, #1141 of 1675 🔗

Whatever. In the end, the Chinese showed that they can tie the rest of the world in gibbering knots.

Not a good advertisement for western democracy

130564 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Victoria, #1142 of 1675 🔗

i thought the Chinese were concentrating on trying to wipe out an ethnic people and their culture so have no time for a virus

130581 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to mjr, #1143 of 1675 🔗

Just the one ethnic people? Or have they finished with Tibet now so we only count the Uighur?

130610 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Will, 1, #1144 of 1675 🔗

sorry . that should have read … wipe out any ethnic people………

130626 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, 1, #1145 of 1675 🔗

So if they have no plans to vaccinate, why should we? is Gates in cahoots with the Chinese now?

130643 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to Carrie, 1, #1146 of 1675 🔗

Nice to see the positive articles about your homeland starting to trickle out in the MSM. We are in the process of selling our house at the moment but, if it all goes through, I think we will treat ourselves to a long weekend in Sweden. Maybe we won’t even have to wear the face nappies on the plane to get their…

130651 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Will, #1147 of 1675 🔗

I’ve heard masks are optional at Arlanda (Stockholm) airport! I shall have to investigate further..

130908 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Carrie, #1148 of 1675 🔗

The vaccine is the getaway to massive state control.Immunity passports etc.The Chinese already have this

130506 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 2, #1149 of 1675 🔗

This from the DT update!!!

“The race towards producing viable vaccines against Covid-19 continues, but, as Miranda Levy discovers, the noise and resistance from “anti-vax” conspiracy theorists is growing stronger in parallel. Miranda finds out why and what can be done to combat it .”

130565 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to T. Prince, 3, #1150 of 1675 🔗

Every couple of days they run a pro-vaccine type article. I think they get cash they get from the Gates Foundation which requires they do this. The readers generally don’t take kindly to it, judging by the comments.

130521 CGL, replying to CGL, 12, #1151 of 1675 🔗

Latest email to mp – slightly losing the plot now (nicked the fat controller thing from someone – sorry!)

“If this doesn’t stop soon you will be presiding over anarchy.

Covid Marshals, the rule of 6 and now a snitching charter – have the fat controller and his snivelling sidekick found a book entitled “The Idiots guide to Nazi’s”?

I honestly can’t even believe I am typing this email. They are insane.”

130654 ▶▶ DRW, replying to CGL, 1, #1152 of 1675 🔗

Reply: “We are following The Science”

130662 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to DRW, #1153 of 1675 🔗

I haven’t had a response to this or my previous one yet, but that was the response i got a couple of weeks ago to my first try, yes. What a crock!

130763 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to CGL, 1, #1154 of 1675 🔗

Thank you. ‘The Idiots guide to Nazis’ has just made the wife and I chuckle. Spot on.

130522 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 10, #1155 of 1675 🔗

From the Evening Standard article this evening and as per Lord Sumption this morning re: Sweden.

“If this is true, the political ramifications are hard to overestimate.”

130546 ▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, #1156 of 1675 🔗

If what is true?

130552 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Julian, 5, #1157 of 1675 🔗

That Sweden has reached herd immunity (which was the first strategy announced in the UK).

130585 ▶▶▶▶ Cruella, replying to RyanM, #1158 of 1675 🔗


130621 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to RyanM, #1159 of 1675 🔗

Latest hospital stats from here in Sweden will be released tomorrow so that will be interesting. But in the last random testing they did there were very few positive results!

130714 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RyanM, 1, #1160 of 1675 🔗

Thanks. I appear neurologically unable to believe in God, but am thankful that He provided Sweden as a beacon of hope in this present evil and madness

130583 ▶▶ Cruella, replying to hotrod, #1161 of 1675 🔗

If what?

130523 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 11, #1162 of 1675 🔗

I am watching BBC news and I cannot believe what I am seeing.
Overbearing police in a park telling people old enough to be their grandparents to choose a number of friends they are allowed to see.
I DESPAIR!!!!!@!

130557 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Fingerache Philip., 9, #1163 of 1675 🔗

With the “rule of six” we’re back to March/April and banning of sunbathing. The police are making idiots of themselves.

130595 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Edward, 2, #1164 of 1675 🔗

‘Battle of Britain’? The current one is about telling the government and any of their satraps to ‘f. off’.

130524 jhfreedom, replying to jhfreedom, 12, #1165 of 1675 🔗

Great story here in the Daily Mail:


If you live near his shop please patronise it – frequently! Also, maybe a solicitor can please check whether he is entitled to stipulate whatever conditions of entry he pleases?

More broadly, I sense the DM is at an editorial crossroads. The comments in the articles are overwhelmingly sceptical and they are running Peter Hitchens pieces with cheerful regularity.

Time for them to ‘turn’ and campaign all-out against The Madness!!

130609 ▶▶ annie, replying to jhfreedom, 2, #1166 of 1675 🔗

Mr Voke joins my parade of heroes!

130614 ▶▶ Suzyv, replying to jhfreedom, 2, #1167 of 1675 🔗

I live near I will give them my custom.

130666 ▶▶ Simon, replying to jhfreedom, #1168 of 1675 🔗

I’m moving to Chichester :>)

Where is it?

130668 ▶▶ John P, replying to jhfreedom, #1169 of 1675 🔗

Peter Hitchens doesn’t write for the Daily Mail.

130525 Basics, replying to Basics, 2, #1170 of 1675 🔗

Todays excellent UK Column looks at the lawfulness or otherwise of the Uk lockdown measures, the coup and much more.

There is an absolutely hilarious picture of Devi the global health advisor to Scotland – UK and the world. If that is her smile ever likely we are all to wear masks! Tears rolling down my face – brilliant!


130530 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Basics, #1171 of 1675 🔗

Really fascinating comment about the future of civil service and gives a bit of thought about who has caused the coup.

130526 hotrod, #1172 of 1675 🔗
130535 matt, replying to matt, 16, #1173 of 1675 🔗

Regarding the second wave.

Putting PR reasons aside, the concept of a second wave seems to come from the 1918 Spanish ‘flu pandemic. From what I’ve read (I’m willing to be corrected), there was a genuine “second” wave of infections and deaths. There is a school of thought that says that this was in fact either an entirely different infection – possibly even bacterial rather than viral – or a mutated strain brought home by the troops in the trenches. This seems to be an uncontroversial view, but not decided.

Either way, this is one epidemic in the last century, out of many. The others have not had a second wave, but instead the viruses have become endemic and have continued to pick off a few in the years that followed, as is the way of viruses.

So, if there is a second wave of SARS-CoV-2, you would have to ask yourself “what is different this time?” The answer must surely be lockdown. It’s only lockdown that is different from our approaches to other epidemics, as it had never been tried before.

So, if there is in fact (as opposed to in media fiction) a second wave, then lockdown must be to blame.

130543 ▶▶ Julian, replying to matt, 8, #1174 of 1675 🔗

Indeed, a second wave, if lockdown was even partially effective, is just the first wave delayed. However you play it, lockdowns (by which I mean ones that are at least partially effective) only really make sense in the following cases:
1) Very short term to flatten the curve in time to prepare healthcare
2) In the case of a very very deadly virus that might kill huge numbers, for a longer time IF you thought it was possible to cook up some better treatments or a vaccine quickly enough for the lockdown not to do more harm than good
I think in practice (2) is unlikely to be a viable option, and certainly wasn’t warranted for covid. (1) was how our lockdown was sold to us, but it has changed into permanent lockdown for zero covid. (1) was done in Sweden, on virtually voluntary basis, and worked.

130554 ▶▶▶ tonys, replying to Julian, 7, #1175 of 1675 🔗

The public mutation of the lockdown strategy from flattening the curve to seemingly eliminating the virus is, among very many lunatic outcomes over the last few months, one of the most sinister and insane, so much so that it’s original intention is now never mentioned in public.

130703 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to tonys, 2, #1176 of 1675 🔗

It’s a good one to remind people of

130562 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Julian, 5, #1177 of 1675 🔗

Agreed. One of the things I said very early on against both masks and lockdowns was that the best-case-scenario is that they don’t work at all . The worst case scenario is that they do work, and that all we’re doing is delaying the inevitable at an extremely high cost. We’ve seen, though, that it will pretty much arrive everywhere, eventually, and you’re going to see a curve… maybe that curve is lower for places thus-far spared, due to mutation, but it will happen. So I think the evidence supports the idea that masks and lockdowns, thankfully, don’t work.

130590 ▶▶ RickH, replying to matt, 3, #1178 of 1675 🔗

Your analysis is right – except that Covid never reached the prevalence required to be labelled an ‘epidemic’

As to ‘second waves’ in general – the CEBM has a paper on the myth of this as a common feature of infections :


130625 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to matt, 9, #1179 of 1675 🔗

Suneptra Gupta took the view that the very high mortality of the Spanish Flu second wave was largely caused by a period of prior mass self-isolation by a susceptible population. Kind of like today’s Australia / NZ approach…
My view is that Sars-CoV-2 is effectively over in Western Europe, and that collective immunity plus a virus mutating to a lower level of virulence, mean it cannot resurge in a clinically symptomatic manner (but that won’t stop the PCR positives..). But many old folk who have perhaps overdone the self-isolation, will simply be more vulnerable to the inevitable seasonal flu this winter due to a suppressed or untuned immune system.

130749 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Kevin 2, 2, #1180 of 1675 🔗

I think that is right. (and to repeat myself ad nauseum : the worst case scenario with respect to lockdowns/masks is that they work.)

130759 ▶▶ John P, replying to matt, 1, #1181 of 1675 🔗

From what I’ve read (I’m willing to be corrected), there was a genuine “second” wave of infections and deaths.

I don’t think they could be sure as it was 100 years ago. I had certainly never heard of it until this year. I have my doubts.

I don’t know why you even entertain this notion TBH. If is happens it happens, but I very much doubt that it will.

130783 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to matt, 1, #1182 of 1675 🔗

Waves do not have to be big. Just a little bit more than a ripple. We are not talking pacific storms here. People have to think about the worst.
Like I hate it when people say” it’s freezing out” just as the temperature dropped from 25C to 18C in September. 18C is not freezing!

130545 Ian, replying to Ian, 29, #1183 of 1675 🔗

I see the UK government is encouraging people to call the police if they spot their neighbours having 1 too many friends visit, even if they’re in the garden! Priti Patel.. “This disease is deadly and that is why it is right that the police enforce where people break the rules.”

If this disease is so bloody deadly, shouldn’t everyone here in Minsk be dead by now?? No masks, what little social distancing is long since over. Even international chains like McDonalds, Burger King etc. have reopened the tables they had blocked off. Every day packed public transport with only about 5% of people wearing a mask (through their own choice), and since the election on 9th August HUGE mass gatherings (100k+ people every weekend in Minsk).

No doubt people will say that the data from Belarus can’t be trusted. But forget the data, if the virus was so deadly everyone here would know someone who’s either died or been very unwell, this would then create it’s own fear in the population, who would quite rightly, take it upon themselves to wear masks, stay home where possible etc. etc.

130555 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Ian, 8, #1184 of 1675 🔗

Kit Malthouse – is there some way this scumbag can be nominated for the accolade of most loathsome politician of all time?

130561 ▶▶▶ Matt The Cat, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1185 of 1675 🔗

Kit Mauthausen, more like!

130569 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Matt The Cat, #1186 of 1675 🔗

I thought Ugly Patel was the candidate.

130577 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to RickH, #1187 of 1675 🔗

Both of them. Joint award.

130608 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tenchy, 4, #1188 of 1675 🔗

I’m sorry the competition is too strong this year

130777 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tenchy, 1, #1189 of 1675 🔗

Trouble is, he has plenty of competition!

130566 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Ian, 6, #1190 of 1675 🔗

Of course the disease isn’t ‘deadly’.

Only someone who is too thick to have a job in government – or too lying – would say such a thing.

130601 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to RickH, 4, #1191 of 1675 🔗

You couldn’t possibly be too lying to have a job in this government.

130630 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to annie, 2, #1192 of 1675 🔗

Good point.

130573 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to Ian, 6, #1193 of 1675 🔗

I am going to write something controversial: do the people of Minsk know how lucky they are?

130600 ▶▶▶ Ian, replying to Ovis, 5, #1194 of 1675 🔗

Sadly Ovis, in this regard, no they don’t. But to be fair, I don’t think extremely basic freedoms are something anyone appreciates until they’re taken away. As Belarus has not had any sort of lockdown whatsoever, it’s not something they appreciate. For all Lukashenko’s failings (and he has many), on this one issue he has got it bang on. But that’s not something most Belarusians will give him credit for.

130623 ▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Ian, 1, #1195 of 1675 🔗


130770 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Ovis, 1, #1196 of 1675 🔗

Comrade Ovis, they are watching BBC Newsnight and laughing at us.

130620 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ian, 3, #1197 of 1675 🔗

If this were true, Sweden would be a giant graveyard by now!

130642 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Carrie, 3, #1198 of 1675 🔗

“Nah nah, Swedish culture is different!” if I had a quid (or krona) for everytime I read that one…

130766 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Ian, 4, #1199 of 1675 🔗

You’d think it was the bubonic plague from the way the politicians/media talk, not a virus with a mortality rate of under 1%. I do not want to live in the GDR thank you Priti.

130550 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 3, #1200 of 1675 🔗

Daily Mail: Coronavirus denier is investigated by police after BANNING customers wearing face masks.

130553 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Tom Blackburn, 10, #1201 of 1675 🔗

As I remarked earlier, the word “denier” in that piece is disgusting.

130575 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tom Blackburn, 6, #1202 of 1675 🔗

The goose-stepping march of fascism.

130652 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #1203 of 1675 🔗

If I lived within 50 miles of Chichester I’d make a point of visiting that place as often as possible, just as I’d visit kh’s if I were within the same of Saffron Walden. These businesses that make a stand are likely to face oppression, and need our support.

The Open for Business section should highlight businesses that self report as taking such a stand. I would definitely change my spending patterns to support any such business in my area.

130710 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Mark, 4, #1204 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for this Mark. Further to my post that the moderator had removed the comments, one contributor couldn’t help themselves and had to suggest that our “No Masks Here” sign was “clunky” (I think that was the word) and suggested that the “owner may be autistic” and that might be the reason for our no masks policy! We were simply making the point that we do not wear masks and that it is not a requirement to enter our shop.

I should add that, although I hate masks, I have never refused entry to anyone wearing one. The only time I have suggested to someone that they remove their mask is when I have seen them in visible distress, especially the elderly. And they, without exception, are thankful.

130735 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to kh1485, 2, #1205 of 1675 🔗

Petrol stations used to refuse entry to people in bike helments for obvious reasons. Your acceptance of hidden identities could be seen as brave in light of this fact.

130742 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to kh1485, 4, #1206 of 1675 🔗

The most important thing you wrote, for the long run (imo) was: “ I have had one of my busiest Mondays ever!”

As long as you can avoid direct repression, if your business thrives you can surely ride out the storm. After all, someone in your position invests everything in a business. That’s why the potential destruction of small businesses (same with Offlands) is among the worst crimes of this “Conservative” government. Conservatives, of all parties, should be absolutely behind the kind of people who have the gumption and energy to stand on their own feet in the way that is necessary to build and sustain a small to medium sized business.

And we here should all directly support any kind of public stand where we can “vote with our feet” and support dissenting voices.

130570 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 3, #1207 of 1675 🔗

Any ideas who is behind this Twitter Account?

Comments are incredible.


Anna Brees on the case.

130591 ▶▶ Panda, replying to hotrod, 1, #1208 of 1675 🔗

That just looks like pure left wing propaganda. The type that are actually willing the virus to kill people.

130599 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to hotrod, 3, #1209 of 1675 🔗

Some of the comments are sceptic as it gets. Any personal claims by nurses about seeing a second wave are just dismissed as nonsense.

130819 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to JohnB, #1211 of 1675 🔗

Does Anna Brees know that?

130571 Hubes, replying to Hubes, 15, #1212 of 1675 🔗

Never rat on your friends and always keep your mouth shut.

130624 ▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Hubes, 1, #1213 of 1675 🔗


130757 ▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Jaguarpig, 1, #1214 of 1675 🔗

Ever since I can remember, I wanted to be a gangster

130849 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Hubes, #1215 of 1675 🔗

They’re called touts where I’m from. And you don’t want to be a tout. Your kneecaps will thank you

130947 ▶▶ DomW, replying to Hubes, #1216 of 1675 🔗

One I read on here

“Snitches get stitches”

Earlier today I was fantasising about posting a card with just that printed on it through every front door in the neighbourhood…

130574 A. Contrarian, replying to A. Contrarian, 17, #1217 of 1675 🔗

Most disappointing case count today, only 2621, it’s going exponential downwards! Panic!

130582 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to A. Contrarian, 4, #1218 of 1675 🔗

Haven’t heard or seen anything in the MSM yet describing this as a large reduction in positives.

130596 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Tenchy, 7, #1219 of 1675 🔗

whist they never say that the increase in positive tests is due to increased testing , dont be surprised if they tell us the reduction is down to fewer tests being carried out

130632 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to A. Contrarian, 4, #1220 of 1675 🔗

The Wail can’t bring itself to say that . Instead it says number of daily infections has doubled in a fortnight-no mention of the number of tests increasing. I suppose we were never going to get “Postive tests only double despite 10 (or whatever) fold increase in tests”

130636 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to arfurmo, 1, #1221 of 1675 🔗

Better than what they were saying a couple of days ago when it was apparently doubling every 7 or 8 days…

130779 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #1222 of 1675 🔗

1.15% of tests carried out. So 98.85% are negative.
Threshold for false positive is about 1.5% of tests. So should all be false positives.

130579 Caramel, replying to Caramel, 6, #1223 of 1675 🔗

Well, one positive about Denmark’s rise in cases is that they won’t be having a ‘travel bubble’ with New Zealand anytime soon. Suck it, Ms Jacinda.

130622 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Caramel, 4, #1224 of 1675 🔗

I don’t think anyone will, given their particular self-painted corner.

130580 mjr, replying to mjr, 2, #1225 of 1675 🔗

See this for a good laugh – maybe even a dance – and then consider whether you want to take anything fatso dePfeffel says seriously ever again

130715 ▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to mjr, #1226 of 1675 🔗

That is pure class!

130743 ▶▶ Lucky, replying to mjr, 1, #1227 of 1675 🔗

I never have.

130584 Lisa from Toronto, 4, #1228 of 1675 🔗

The latest mask music video –Surgical Mask on her Face — from Media Bear. Great, as usual.


130586 DJ Dod, 12, #1229 of 1675 🔗

Apparently the ban on household visits in the west of Scotland is to be extended by another week. This announcement comes on the same day that the acting Chief Medical Officer of Scotland, Dr. Gregor Smith, stated ‘I don’t believe we are in a second wave. The virus has never gone away. It is a rise in cases from a low baseline .’

Needless to say it is debatable whether these ‘cases’ are anything other than positive test results, but if we’re not in a second wave why are these ludicrous rules still in place?

No, don’t tell me. Is it because the Government have destroyed the economy and caused the deaths of thousands of people with their disastrous ‘lockdown’ and are hoping we won’t notice if they keep everyone scared of the ‘killer virus’?

130587 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #1230 of 1675 🔗

A thought occured about the reset – it’s not great so I’ll call it reset. Not certain if this is a LS matter or not.

What is their problem with the status quo? They are insanely rich and getting richer by the hour. What is the sense in resetting when they are winning? I don’t buy the climate reasoning one bit – and yes I have a lot of time for reuse frugality and liking lichen.

130603 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Basics, 3, #1231 of 1675 🔗

Who knows what their reasoning is or their motivation.Just because we don’t know doesn’t mean it’s not happening.
Power,’money greed normally cover most evil intent;maybe it’s to hold onto their positions and wealth.
America is falling from its position as world Hegemon.The whole western world is mired in debt.A wave of populist movements are starting to grow.All speculation but it most definitely is not about a virus.

130895 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Jonathan Palmer, -1, #1232 of 1675 🔗

It definitely is about a virus.

130627 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Basics, 4, #1233 of 1675 🔗

It’s the law of unlimited wants. The richer you get the more you sorround yourself with rich people. There are some exceptions, but for most they then want to prove themselves to this new group. It’s the only thing they’ve ever known. So they adopt the dreams and desires of the in group.

So more money is needed, more ‘success’. You also seek to be part of their causes to demonstrate your aligence to the group. Foundation work, trips to the big conferences. You need their respect.

It eventually becoem less about money, though it remains an important yard stick. Instead, it is about grand ideas and you shaping the world.

130655 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #1234 of 1675 🔗

We have has a banking collapse – just before coronavirus turned up to distract us from the real news

130700 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Kate, 1, #1235 of 1675 🔗

Interesting stuff. Of course the reset is planned, I din’t think its controversial to say that. It is a lengthy business creating the plan, not emergency planning. Bad luck the collapse took place just before the virus, neither in the control of men. Hmm.

130748 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 2, #1236 of 1675 🔗

On second thoughts, perhaps not…

130784 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #1237 of 1675 🔗

There was a quote from Rumsfeld. I am sure they did all the forward planning. Banks employ futurologists to help them predict the future.

Whose “new realities” will Rumsfeld talk about? The realities of a White House in which a key aide told a reporter that this Administration has scorn for the “reality-based community”? (“We’re an empire,” the aide told the reporter, “and when we act, we create our own reality.”)

130648 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Basics, 5, #1238 of 1675 🔗

The problem is that central bank policy is rendering our money worthless. This is their chance to buy up assets of real value before the currency collapses.

By making us all focus on masks, they help ensure that we turn a blind eye to – for example – the £200bn the BoE have printed this year.

130711 ▶▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Tee Ell, 2, #1239 of 1675 🔗

Sooo many distractions… hard to keep up.

130731 ▶▶▶ anon, replying to Tee Ell, #1240 of 1675 🔗

I thought deutsche were going to fail last year and initiate a domino style run / collapse

What happened? Have they re-opened their equities division ? Cause i nearly fell off my chair when they said they were closing it

130907 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to anon, #1241 of 1675 🔗

They seem to be hiring in equity research. I know someone who has just moved there. Weird.

130747 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, #1242 of 1675 🔗

I’m glad you’ve found your strategic reasoning 👍

130758 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nick Rose, #1243 of 1675 🔗

Does it come across like that? I’m stuggling with indigestion tonight.

130875 ▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to Basics, #1244 of 1675 🔗

The climate thing is BS, agree. Watch the news tonight trying to blame ‘all’ the fires on the west coast of the US on climate change – notice they steadfastly refuse to go near Yosemite, which has survived large numbers of fires in the last decade due to efficient fire management practices and long range planning – so if you hear the phrase “climate change refugees” tell them to go to Yosemite, climate change doesn’t work there.

On the reset thing: there is an issue of declining world resources. Technically peak oil production has passed, (see: Chris Martensen, The Crash Course, website & newsletter peakprosperity) so I believe that is a factor.

130900 ▶▶ John P, replying to Basics, -1, #1245 of 1675 🔗

It’s not “great” or even a “reset”. It’s a b/s conspiracy theory. Personally I am sick of reading this horseshit.

Climate science is b/s too.

130589 Lord Rickmansworth, 2, #1246 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for the overwhelming feedback on ‘The Real Normal’

A few of you have asked for the iTunes link to this week’s podcast.

It’s all about ‘Context’ this week. Some stats in there you’ll not want to miss!

We have a beer and a chat at our local boozer. Enjoy!


130593 Laura Gallagher, replying to Laura Gallagher, 5, #1247 of 1675 🔗

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/549793 Petition rejecting all the proposed changes to the Human Medicines Act t o support the roll out of unlicensed COVID-19

130606 ▶▶ Ian, replying to Laura Gallagher, 1, #1248 of 1675 🔗

Thanks, signed.

130639 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Laura Gallagher, 1, #1249 of 1675 🔗


130660 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Laura Gallagher, 1, #1250 of 1675 🔗


130744 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Laura Gallagher, #1251 of 1675 🔗


130597 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 9, #1252 of 1675 🔗

Daily Mail: What rule of six? Young Britons are already ignoring Boris Johnson’s new Covid restrictions.

130619 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Tom Blackburn, 10, #1253 of 1675 🔗

The local youngsters have never stopped hanging out together!

130631 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Tom Blackburn, 10, #1254 of 1675 🔗

Ignoring supposes they give a beep about what boris says in the firat place. I see no evidence that young people tune themselves in to boris. Why would they? Boris leads us towards death. It is natural for young to revel in life. Oil and water. Good for them.

130780 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tom Blackburn, 6, #1255 of 1675 🔗

I’m worried now they will use the excuse of young people mixing and ignoring the rule of six to institute a curfew.

130785 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #1256 of 1675 🔗

Same- that and a national mockdown.

130817 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to DRW, #1257 of 1675 🔗

I don’t think they can afford that.With no furlough and help for those stopped from working there will be too much opposition

130598 Fed up, replying to Fed up, 2, #1258 of 1675 🔗

Latest Regs : The Health Protection (coronavirus, restrictions) (no.2) (England) (Amendment) (No.4) Regulations 2020.

points to note:

  1. laid before Parliament at 10.30 am 14th September, came into force 12.01 am 14th September.
  2. restrictions on participation in gatherings of 6+ people (unless household or linked household)
  3. Reg 5(3)(i) does not apply to gatherings for the purpose of protest and the event has been organised by a business, charitable, benevolent or philanthropic institution, a public body, or a political body and the event organiser has carried our risk assessment and taken all reasonable measures to limit risk of transmission.
130612 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Fed up, 2, #1259 of 1675 🔗

There is a very good thread on Twitter (Francis Hoar linked to it; see end of this post for link) with whole load of info regarding these regs, including illogicalities and ways round certain rules. Francis reckons the regulations would not hold up in court, for a number of reasons, one being that no impact assessment has been done.

130635 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to Carrie, 1, #1260 of 1675 🔗

Downloaded and quick read, total gibberish to me. Unless you have the act to which the amendment applies and can be bothered to go through every clause it tells me absolutely nothing. Can’t be bothered.

130661 ▶▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to davews, 4, #1261 of 1675 🔗

They rely on people not reading the legislation and then produce guidance off the back of it, that the media report as law. If you do read the legislation you quickly realise how unenforceable everything is.

130716 ▶▶ NickR, replying to Fed up, 1, #1262 of 1675 🔗

Fabulous debate in the commons, the mother of parliaments at it’s best. MP’s from every party fully debating the intricacies of this finally balanced question. The finest minds, forensically examining the why’s and wherefores.
Makes you proud to be British!

130613 DRW, replying to DRW, 5, #1263 of 1675 🔗

If we start winning this fight, which of the media will be the first to turn full sceptic?

130633 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to DRW, 12, #1264 of 1675 🔗

We are winning this fight.

130645 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tom Blackburn, 10, #1265 of 1675 🔗

I agree. They are very concerned by us. You can see that by their actions against genuine discussion.

130776 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Basics, 1, #1266 of 1675 🔗

I want to believe that. But it could go the other away again.

130825 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to DRW, #1267 of 1675 🔗

It could.

130650 ▶▶ Will, replying to DRW, 10, #1268 of 1675 🔗

Telegraph is very nearly there. The daily mail site could bring on a migraine so I tend to avoid it but they seem to be moving in the right direction. A bit left field but I would have a sneaky punt on Channel 4 news surprising everyone and admitting they got it all wrong.

130656 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Will, 1, #1269 of 1675 🔗

Maybe we should make sure the DT also hear about this data breach in Wales, before people start getting too keen on testing: https://twitter.com/PublicHealthW/status/1305535693909831680

130672 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Carrie, 8, #1270 of 1675 🔗

And they want to test 10m people a day, more chance of finding rocking horse shit.

Some days I am genuinely scared about the future and sometimes I’m reminded of the ineptitude of our leaders and don’t feel too bad as they couldn’t organise a piss up in a proverbial.

130894 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to stefarm, #1271 of 1675 🔗

Unfortunately, as the article regarding false positives yesterday suggests, they will find positives even if in reality there are none.


130664 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to DRW, 2, #1272 of 1675 🔗

Maybe they’ll use the ’emerging facts’ is to discredit Johnson and destabilise the government to undermine Brexit? After all, previously they were only doing what the Government told them to in order to ‘keep us safe’ against ‘conspiracy theories’….?

130737 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to T. Prince, #1273 of 1675 🔗

A bit late for that now. That particular ship has sailed.

130719 ▶▶ Marie R, replying to DRW, #1274 of 1675 🔗

Telegraph or Mail

130729 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DRW, 2, #1275 of 1675 🔗

All of them, because I’m sure the editors all talk to each other, even if they officially “hate” each other.

130812 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Nick Rose, #1276 of 1675 🔗

The problem is the tribal feeling they have for the Tories.The government spend in advertising must have helped too.

130822 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1277 of 1675 🔗

They all turned on John Major fast enough. They do have form :o))

130806 ▶▶ annie, replying to DRW, #1278 of 1675 🔗


130628 NonCompliant, replying to NonCompliant, 5, #1279 of 1675 🔗

Got a response from the local MP. Not what I was hoping for but here it is. At least he bothered to read my email and didn’t just send a stock reply which is what happened to my mate with his.

Thank you for your email and for taking the time to get in touch and share your concerns with me. I have checked our records and my office did not receive your letter of 7 August. I can only apologise and set out my position on the issues that you raise here.

I know that a number of schools in Barnsley have taken the decision to introduce compulsory face covering for pupils in communal areas where social distancing is difficult to maintain. If you are concerned about this new rule, I would strongly recommend that you discuss the policy on face coverings with Horizon. Under the current guidance, the wearing of face coverings in communal areas is at the discretion of individual schools or academy trusts.

Over the past couple of weeks we have seen the rate of infection increase across the country, with the rate roughly doubling here in South Yorkshire. A rapid increase in the rate of infection risks creating a second wave later this year which could put significant numbers of people at risk of serious illness, hospitalisation and death. It is vitally important, therefore, that everyone follows the latest guidance from Public Health England: wearing face coverings in shops and on public transport; keeping at least two metres apart from those not in their household or support bubble; only socialising in groups of six or fewer; and washing hands on a regular basis. We have all got a responsibility to follow the guidance and play our part in containing the spread of this disease – which has already claimed the lives of over 40,000 people across the country. Although, as you rightly point out, the figures on hospitalisations and deaths are currently much lower than they were at the peak of the pandemic, there is a real risk that a rapid increase in infection rate will in turn lead to more deaths over the coming months, especially as we approach winter.

On testing, I’m afraid that I do not agree that the increase in positive results is solely due to increased community testing, as confirmed by the Chief Medical Officer. The current increase in infection rate is very concerning, and it is right that measures are put in place to reduce transmission and help save lives.

In terms of my vote in Parliament, I will very carefully consider the specifics on any proposals that are brought forward and vote in the best interests of my constituents – as I always have throughout my time in Parliament.

Once again, thank you for taking the time to get in touch. If you would like to discuss this in further detail, please do not hesitate to get back in touch.

With my very best wishes,

130634 ▶▶ RickH, replying to NonCompliant, 11, #1280 of 1675 🔗

The total bollocks in this says all that needs to be said about the quality of MPs.

130640 ▶▶ Basics, replying to NonCompliant, 5, #1281 of 1675 🔗

Rate of infection increase across the country. Wrong.
Your MP has fallen for the covid switch, infections are not cases are not positive tests.

I would be asking after the responsibilty the MP says we all have. Have them define that respinsibility and state where it comes from. Clearly that same responsibilty must be fairly distributed across society and other forms of ill health. The MPs focus is not adressing their stated responsibility outside the fantasy realm of covid.

130740 ▶▶▶ Nottingham69, replying to Basics, #1282 of 1675 🔗

A Hitch perfectly describes our mp’s dim, slumbering and gullible.

130805 ▶▶ annie, replying to NonCompliant, #1283 of 1675 🔗

Cut and paste.

130828 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to NonCompliant, #1284 of 1675 🔗

Absolutely moronic response

130638 Kevin 2, replying to Kevin 2, 5, #1285 of 1675 🔗

Apologies if it’s been posted before, but here is an Edinburgh Professor, who speaks passionately but undemonstratively, about his views on the wrongs currently being perpetrated. Why don’t more academics and medical professionals hold or voice these views?
Perhaps many do, but just feel unable to speak.

130809 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Kevin 2, 1, #1286 of 1675 🔗

He is great isn’t he Richard Ennos. Doing what he thinks is right. Why can’t others do the same? I know five at the university with tutoring/lecturing duties. 4 are unpleasant woke arrogants, one of whom is so closed of mind their own family struggle to relate to them. One of the Edinburgh staff I know is a brillant rounded person, not in a specialism that matters to SARS CoV.

130649 hotrod, 3, #1287 of 1675 🔗

This is a fun thread….

If you scroll down you can see what is happening in schools.

BBC ramping this fear is unforgivable.


130657 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 12, #1288 of 1675 🔗

Sod it I’m moving to Venus. Who’s with me?

130667 ▶▶ John P, replying to Achilles, 4, #1289 of 1675 🔗

It’s a bit warm, Achilles.

130688 ▶▶ Snake Oil Pussy, replying to Achilles, 7, #1290 of 1675 🔗

Stockholm is more comfortable. Greta says they no longer have a proper winter.

130692 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Snake Oil Pussy, 2, #1291 of 1675 🔗

Good point. I don’t know any Swedish though. My Russian’s improving and they are quite relaxed these days – except on flights. Is appealing.

130698 ▶▶▶▶ Snake Oil Pussy, replying to John P, 2, #1292 of 1675 🔗

I think they all speak perfect English. And you can get there by sailing boat. I can recommend a 72ft ketch in Newcastle whose charity owners can no longer afford to keep it.

130709 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Snake Oil Pussy, 1, #1293 of 1675 🔗

Sweden or Russia?

I recently watched some youtube travelogue videos of a woman on a week’s holiday in Sochi with a girl-friend. She usually goes with her husband/partner. She never shuts up. Anyway, Sochi has been crowded with holidaymaking Russians and hardly a mask in sight.

Link provided on request. I listen in Russian, but you might be able to get subtitles in English.

I could probably doggie paddle up the Med and through the Bosphorus up to the Black Sea and on to Sochi. Wonder if they take refugees? Might have to dodge the Royal Navy though, I have heard they are operating in the area.

130732 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to John P, #1294 of 1675 🔗

Okay, you twisted my arm. Link here:


(Warning: may make you want to emigrate to Russia).

130904 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Snake Oil Pussy, 1, #1295 of 1675 🔗

They really do. I spent all my summers in Sweden as a child and barely learned a thing as everyone insisted on speaking English to me.

130705 ▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Achilles, 2, #1296 of 1675 🔗

I’ll start packing!

130665 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 9, #1297 of 1675 🔗

Lord Sumption criticises ‘Rule of Six’ on BBC R4

130827 ▶▶ Templeton, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #1298 of 1675 🔗

He really is a total fucking dude.
Robbed that horrid interviewer of ammo, everytime.

130689 ▶▶ John P, replying to Kate, 4, #1300 of 1675 🔗

He’s been in Berlin recently too. Pity we can’t get him to come here.

130670 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 4, #1301 of 1675 🔗

Notwithstanding the concerns expressed in today’s discussion on hospital Covid 19 data, the Governments web-site indicates no change in the total number of UK Covid 19 cases in hospital, it was at 884 Sat, Sun and today Monday. To my mind this indicates that no change = no second wave, so far so good.

130868 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to Steve Martindale, #1302 of 1675 🔗

I think there has been a hold up in Scotland’s figures As they aim to remove those who no longer have covid

130671 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 34, #1303 of 1675 🔗

Bit long from Tom Woods but…

“Well, the skeptics are finding their voices at last.

In Ireland, Dr. Martin Feeley — clinical director of the Midland Fields Hospital Group and a senior executive of the Health Service Executive, Ireland’s government-funded health care system — just made his dissenting views known to the Irish Times .

He said the lockdowns that we were told were essential can no longer be justified in light of what we now know about COVID-19.

The lockdowns, he added, disproportionately harm the youth — and “you can’t postpone youth.”

“The financial cost,” he said, “can be seen in any walk or drive through cities, towns and villages. Mortgage repayments and other financial setbacks are virtually all suffered by the young worker or business person and not by the over-65, who are guaranteed their pension, as indeed are the salaries of the individuals who decide to inflict these draconian measures….”

Dr. Feeley condemned the obsession with “cases,” a contextless number that only panics people, when we should instead be focusing on hospital strain:

“The number of deaths among recent cases is less than one in a thousand. This data reflects a disease much less severe than the average annual flu. The media reaction to these cases, ie, with the gravity appropriate to reporting deaths from a major catastrophe, borders on hysteria. Opening a newscast with the number of people testing positive for a condition less dangerous than the flu, which many don’t even know they have, is scaremongering.”

The Irish Times also reports on Dr. Alan Farrell, who has made his unhappiness with the government’s extreme measures known to the Minister for Health.

He says:

“From a medical perspective I am not seeing an impact from COVID on the ground. What I am seeing is delayed diagnoses for other conditions – breast cancer, skin cancer in young people, an onslaught of anxiety and depression, an increase in loneliness in the elderly, recently a fractured humerus in an elderly lady that has been like that for months as she was afraid to go outside.”

Now here’s a question no mainstream reporter will ask a epidemiologist, even though it’s an obvious one:

Are you modeling the non-COVID human costs of lockdowns and restrictions and if so, what have you concluded?

Of course no epidemiologist will answer you, because none of them are doing this. They believe that the subject of their monomania must be as all-consuming for everyone else as it is for them. The very notion of tradeoffs simply does not enter the picture.

There are very real tradeoffs that are measured in human lives — including but far from limited to the 1.4 million excess TB deaths, the 500,000 excess HIV deaths, and the 385,000 excess malaria deaths that even the New York Times acknowledged the lockdowns will cause.

Now if you mention the cost to people’s livelihoods, you’ll be accused of callousness, and you care about things rather than people, etc. — all the sorts of things a midwit would say.”

130683 ▶▶ Julian, replying to T. Prince, 12, #1304 of 1675 🔗

Very encouraging, thanks.

To be fair it is ultimately up to politicians to consider the tradeoffs, but the public health officials certainly should look at the wider picture of health, not just the “new” challenge – that is Tegnell’s position

I mentioned cost benefit analysis to an acquaintance of mine and she compared me to Hitler

130802 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Julian, #1305 of 1675 🔗

A former acquaintance of yours.

130815 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Julian, 1, #1306 of 1675 🔗

Yes, in Tegnell’s interviews recently he has talked a lot about public health and what constitutes health from a long-term and bigger perspective, that for example denying people an education will have a long-term negative health effect..

130706 ▶▶ Chris Hume, replying to T. Prince, 15, #1307 of 1675 🔗

I’ve said this before, I think Ireland are ahead of the curve on this. There are a lot of leading sceptics from Ireland like Dolores Cahill and Ivor Cummins, and a healthy dose of scepticism amongst the public (the rally in Dublin had more attendees than London, from a far smaller population) but can you imagine a senior figure from PHE or the NHS saying something like this? No, nor can I.

130820 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Chris Hume, 2, #1308 of 1675 🔗

Nope. The marches are encouraging but remain small. They are doing a good job in demonising anti lockdown groups as right wing or conspiracy theorists. Ireland is the Silicon Valley of Europe and big pharma has been milking the low tax regime decades.

Polticial opposition is minimal, the odd individual here and there. Even anti establishment parties like PBP and SF seem to be more than happy to go along with the narrative.

Mask wearing is extensive. Even in Donegal which I frequent often and where the virus hardly took hold, masks are everywhere.

There are many individuals that are of great standing but this opposition still needs to get angry.

130839 ▶▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #1309 of 1675 🔗

Donegal with some of the cleanest air in the world as well.

130708 ▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to T. Prince, 2, #1310 of 1675 🔗

Are you modeling the non-COVID human costs of lockdowns and restrictions and if so, what have you concluded?

Of course no epidemiologist will answer you, because none of them are doing this.

And quite right too. Epidemiological and economic models are a different kettle of fish, and since there are some 90 people listed as participating in SAGE meetings, one would reasonably expect that expertise to be available.

The very notion of tradeoffs simply does not enter the picture.

If you ask an epidemiologist to model an epidemic, you get an epidemiological model. That’s why advisers advise and ministers decide.

130799 ▶▶ annie, replying to T. Prince, #1311 of 1675 🔗

Inly criticism: idea that the reaction is verging on hysteria.

130674 Will, replying to Will, 6, #1312 of 1675 🔗

BBC wetting the bed about a “surge” of cases in Marseilles but not asking why there isn’t a commensurate surge in Paris. The reason there isn’t, which we all know is that Paris has reached the very low herd immunity threshold.

130687 ▶▶ John P, replying to Will, #1313 of 1675 🔗

Please provide a link to the Paris research.

I thought that the reason for the “surges” was that they were testing more people.

130859 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to Will, -1, #1314 of 1675 🔗

France locked down before the virus could get there.

130686 Polemon2, replying to Polemon2, 16, #1315 of 1675 🔗

On 4th Sept I received an eMail from my local council asking all residents to help avoid a local lockdown as “cases” were rising locally. (I wonder where they got my eMail address?)
I then sent an eMail to my three ward councillors suggesting that any increase in “cases” was mainly down to recent visitation of three mobile testing units which just revealed what already existed and in reality there was no true increase in the level of local infection.
10 days later I have has no response of any kind from any of them.
This reinforces by long held belief that local politicians are there just for the status which they think their role confers.
I shall abstain from all future local elections.
They are all conservative party members – although I doubt this is actually relevant.

130694 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Polemon2, 1, #1316 of 1675 🔗

At this stage in the reengineering of our democracy local councillors are enablers and not representatives of local views and interests.

130704 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Polemon2, 14, #1317 of 1675 🔗

I shall be voting for Independents from now. No Party and v few MPs have asked any relevant questions during the last six months. Quite simply, they haven’t done their job.

130811 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Polemon2, #1318 of 1675 🔗

I’d be asking them where they got your email address from – GDPR?

130886 ▶▶ John P, replying to Polemon2, #1319 of 1675 🔗

I wonder where they got my eMail address?

You must have e-mailed them at some point or supplied it on a form and then forgot about it. There’s no other way, though some conspiracy nutjobs may tell you otherwise.

130891 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to John P, #1320 of 1675 🔗

PS, you could always ask them.

130913 ▶▶▶ Steve, replying to John P, 1, #1321 of 1675 🔗

In which case they should have asked if you still want to receive correspondence from them and to confirm that you do. If you don’t confirm or don’t reply at all the data is supposed to be deleted.

130690 Basics, replying to Basics, 7, #1322 of 1675 🔗

Local news headline.
Cops break up 405 lockdown house parties in Scotland with six arrested since Friday
Six people were arrested and one Fixed Penalty Notice issued as a result of the gatherings

130702 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Basics, 9, #1323 of 1675 🔗

Another headline
“Edinburgh Police called to the Meadows to break up gathering of 150 people
A group of ‘150 people’ were pictured having a ‘huge party’ the night before gatherings of more than six people were banned”

These are people enjoying themselves not protests.

130712 ▶▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Basics, 11, #1324 of 1675 🔗

I see the Greens in Scotland are objecting to a loophole that allows hunting parties to get around the rule of six law. There’s a good idea. Off to the hills with your shotgun for a party – the police wouldn’t dare to mess with you.

130810 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Jane in France, 3, #1325 of 1675 🔗

A thread on Francis Hoar’s Twitter refers to that little exception for hunting parties – clearly some lobbying went on to get that activity exempted from the rule of 6…

130884 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Carrie, #1326 of 1675 🔗

Apparently that’s why it was only published at 11.45pm, becoming law at 12 midnight.

130877 ▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Jane in France, #1327 of 1675 🔗

The greens are snivelling soy boy wankers

130713 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Basics, 21, #1328 of 1675 🔗

Enjoying ourselves in Scotland, perish the thought, chatting with my neighbour today he told me that the 19 year old son of our other neighbour was asked to leave a pub as him and his mates were making too much noise, by that I mean chatting and having a laugh, you know, the thing that people do in pubs.

130718 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 11, #1329 of 1675 🔗

Fun is out. That is noticable.

130720 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 10, #1330 of 1675 🔗

All very Presbyterian – if you’re from the seventeenth century.

130723 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1331 of 1675 🔗

! True enough

130724 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ DJ Dod, replying to Nick Rose, 17, #1332 of 1675 🔗

The SNP aren’t known as the ‘Tartan Taliban’ for nothing!

130792 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DJ Dod, #1333 of 1675 🔗

I can remember when they were called the “Tartan Tories.” Going back a bit…

130771 ▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Basics, 5, #1334 of 1675 🔗

Yep, the young lad said what is the point of going out anymore if it’s no fun

130791 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, #1335 of 1675 🔗

He makes a good point, perhaps it’s now considered the pub is there to be paid and nothing more.

130834 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Basics, 1, #1336 of 1675 🔗

My estimate is nearly all pubs either shut or bust before xmas

130876 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 1, #1337 of 1675 🔗

cannot see them surviving once the frosts begin.

130912 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lucky, replying to Basics, #1338 of 1675 🔗

I’ll do my best to keep them going – especially when the frosts begin

130717 Basics, replying to Basics, 14, #1339 of 1675 🔗

“‘It’s the final nail in the coffin’- Bourbon nightclub warns Edinburgh’s nightlife is on its knees
The popular late night venue has been closed since March and has issued urgent concerns over their future
“An Edinburgh nightclub has described the Scottish Government’s music ban as the “last nail in the coffin” after spending months with no income.

“Edward Fox ,the manager of Bourbon nightclub, told Edinburgh Live that many venues across the city will not reopen unless help is provided to the late night industry.

“After months of closure, the club is growing increasingly concerned for its future as the furlough scheme winds down – despite no potential date for venues to reopen.

“He told Edinburgh Live: “We really haven’t had any information from the government about how we might be able to reopen in the future or what restrictions we would need to follow, at least then we could prepare.”

“In recent weeks, some late night venues have made the decision to reopen as a bar and lounge, however as there is a ban on background music, Edward explained that there would be no attraction for them to do this.

“He added: “The music ban has been the final nail in the coffin for us.

“We had thought of going down the route of a late night bar but the music ban has ruined that idea so we’re having to wait again”

Edinburghlive to read more.

The lack of communication is quite striking. I propose that tge Scottish Government have not had instructions from their masters as to how the night club sector is to be handled. Or, perhaps the Scotyish Government is deliberately acting in an inhumane manner towards the sector by keeping silent to destroy it.
No communication at this stage is not an oversight.

130840 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Basics, 3, #1340 of 1675 🔗

The likes of Ian Brown shouldn’t be standing alone. They need some support.

130889 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to PoshPanic, 1, #1341 of 1675 🔗

Shaun Rider maybe unless he’s gonna “call the cops”

130914 ▶▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Biker, 1, #1342 of 1675 🔗

Musicians, like everybody else, have to got to eat. There has to come a time where more get out of zoom world and start playing in front of real people.

130917 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to PoshPanic, #1343 of 1675 🔗

Liam seems to be murmuring

130739 JohnB, 3, #1344 of 1675 🔗

Lord Sumption telling JHB about the pointlessness of the rule of six.


130746 JohnB, replying to JohnB, #1345 of 1675 🔗

Your brother will be happy with you publishing his mobile number on here!

130863 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to JohnB, #1346 of 1675 🔗

Just on your new post, the number can still be found by downloading and removing the layers from your picture using an editor such as GIMP or Photoshop.

130751 Basics, replying to Basics, 1, #1347 of 1675 🔗

The day began with the troubled footnote (singular) of Hume that caused the tower to be classed as 40 until suitable non-white name can be found. Ghandi Platz is my bet.

More troubled footnotes as the moon rises. This time the broken Scottish Governments. Internal strife, heated, oh so heated discussions manifest themselves in asterisk and double asterisk form. Things are so woeful we nearly need to be looking up the keying sequence for the dagger! A joy in footnotes.

* may not reflect the total number of new cases or new tests due to late provision of test data on 14 September 2020. Any additional cases will be reported in the coming days.

** This figure includes people who are no longer being treated for COVID-19. Tomorrow, this will be replaced with a measure that focuses on hospital in-patients with a more recent positive COVID-19 test. [They’ve been promising this for what seems like a month or more].


The number of total deaths under 45 in Scotland with only Covid19 as the cause – 2. One plus one equals two. Source for this is UK Column today.

130760 ▶▶ dpj, replying to Basics, 8, #1348 of 1675 🔗

She actually seemed quite upset that today’s ‘cases’ figure was so low so had to add disclaimer that it really is much higher it’s those people at Westminster that are holding up test results.

130782 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to dpj, #1349 of 1675 🔗

A chuckle thanks. Explains a conversation I stuck my head into earlier.. “it’s all political” well I had a little say at that myself, but soon realised we were snp and therefore don’t think.

130755 Kate, replying to Kate, 13, #1350 of 1675 🔗

From Kennedy’s childrens health defence

  • No federally-recommended vaccine has ever been tested against a real placebo. Vaccines are tested against other vaccines or vaccine ingredients, masking harm. And the government has never tested the entire childhood schedule in vaccinated vs. unvaccinated children.
  • Vaccines are typically tested for days or weeks, not years, like drugs.
  • Government agencies charged with vaccine safety are, in essence, vaccine companies, owning patents and earning royalties. They are sock puppets of industry.
  • Mainstream media heavily censors information critical of vaccines. The vaccine companies spend billions every year in advertising revenue to the big media companies in our country, and they’re not only buying ad space, they are dictating content.
  • It’s important to know you can’t sue a vaccine manufacturer for a vaccine injury or death. Instead, you have to go through a government claims program where most people lose. Vaccine makers get all the profits, but the injured get all the losses — physical, mental, emotional and financial.
  • COVID-19 vaccines have received billions in government subsidy and private money. These vaccines have become “too big to fail,” even though the clinical trials have been disasters.

So, please:

130927 ▶▶ James, replying to Kate, 1, #1351 of 1675 🔗

Thanks for this succinct summary. It helps.

130756 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #1352 of 1675 🔗

Ah the comfort of data leaks, at least that feels like normal.

Public Health Wales
We regret to announce that there has been a data breach involving the personally identifiable data of Welsh residents who have tested positive for COVID-19. Anyone concerned and wanting advice should read the FAQs: https://phw.nhs.wales/news/public-health-wales-statement-on-data-breach/
4:55 pm · 14 Sep 2020

130790 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 1, #1353 of 1675 🔗

Just another reason not to get tested!

130803 ▶▶ Lucky, replying to Basics, 1, #1354 of 1675 🔗

Interesting. I wonder if PHE would announce and apologise for a breach of data.

130835 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Basics, #1355 of 1675 🔗

Funny this because I’m currently developing a web app for one of my own company projects and it uses Amazon Web Services (AWS). Most of the web runs on AWS in some shape or form by the way.

One of the standard setups for apps (both web and mobile) is that a user can upload, delete, change objects in their own account. However it is possible without the proper security policies in place in the AWS bit to gain entry into everyone else’s data and even make yourself an admin.

It’s often because of how the initial development app is set up. I was aware of database script attacks such as through input forms, comment forms and search, and a lot of these techniques can be prevented with plugins. But the infiltration of a non-database stack is interesting.

I wonder if this has happened to the public health Wales thing. Temporary credentials were obtained that allowed deeper access to be gained using a few simple commands.

130851 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to mhcp, #1356 of 1675 🔗

Can’t say I follow all, but interesting none the less. Unprofessional product development with a flaw that feasibly shoukd have been known. It’s a possibility I assume.

130856 ▶▶ jim j, replying to Basics, 3, #1357 of 1675 🔗

I’ve never before looked forward to a class action so much!
Would Slater & Gordon care to start one on behalf of we who have been denied constitutional freedoms without incontrovertible proofs for the Emergency Powers??

130761 Klein, replying to Klein, 24, #1358 of 1675 🔗

Went to a local garage there, everyone in it not wearing a mask; the staff and about 4 or 5 customers.
It felt great, totally normal.
On my way out one woman was walking up with one of those stupid flowery ones….will be her turn to feel like she’s a dick, only for wearing one rather than not..!

130788 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Klein, 5, #1359 of 1675 🔗

Our local petrol station is in partnership with Morrisons. Since the beginning less than 50% masks and get less by the week. As you say, those without beginning to feel stupid in small pockets of sanity.

130762 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 8, #1360 of 1675 🔗

Sweden’s chief epidemiologist: ‘We are happy with our strategy’ on Covid-19

130823 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #1361 of 1675 🔗

Good stuff. French media is starting to pull ahead of the UK, though remaining cautiously optimistic.

130767 DRW, replying to DRW, 16, #1362 of 1675 🔗

One of the worst parts about all this is the chronic instability- you plan for anything at the mercy of the Clown Show’s next 9pm twitter diktat. I got a monthly discount coupon from the pub this weekend but I can’t look forward to using it when they can still shut the pubs again because sPiKiNg CaSeS1!1!

Also I really want to see a friend in Belfast next year but I just don’t know if I’ll even be able to get there, let alone what it will be like on the ground. I hope someday this madness will end.

130928 ▶▶ matt, replying to DRW, 2, #1363 of 1675 🔗

My boys haven’t seen their cousin (my sister’s boy) since last August. They’re very close (or were) and he’s an only child. We were looking forward to Christmas, but now impossible (my sister is a covinazi)

130768 Kevin 2, replying to Kevin 2, 14, #1364 of 1675 🔗

The Anna Brees channel on YT features many everyday folk, who have reached a point of enlightenment regarding the ‘pandemic’ and individually put themselves forward in a video blog.
Here is a 46 yr old mum:-

Many more on the channel.

I find it so curious that the maybe 10% who hold a sceptical position (or stronger), seem to have a completely different thinking mechanism to the unquestioning majority.

130787 ▶▶ annie, replying to Kevin 2, 8, #1365 of 1675 🔗

I think we’re a different species.

130795 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to annie, 5, #1366 of 1675 🔗

Yes I think so. And that’s before the Moderna RNA vaccine creates another species…!

130850 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to annie, 9, #1367 of 1675 🔗

I got asked on another site by a pro mask ‘person’ why was I scared of masks (!?). It was clearly just another cheap, lazy jibe to avoid any confrontation with facts. I really can’t understand why anyone would even try to question someone’s motives for not wanting to do something so obviously stupid and devoid of common sense. What weird people there are out there…..

130801 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Kevin 2, 9, #1368 of 1675 🔗

Diehard right-wing, Brexiteer, extremists apparently. Not that everybody here is a Brexiteer, and not everybody here is right-wing. I’m astonished that people who just want to see normality resume are branded as extreme…

I do hope we die hard, however.

130813 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #1369 of 1675 🔗

And dangerous, denialist QAnon conspiracy theorists according to the Ministry of Truth.

130841 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DRW, 3, #1370 of 1675 🔗

Always brings a wry smile to my face when I get accused of being a conspiracy theorist. It’s still better than being a sheeple.

130814 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Nick Rose, 22, #1371 of 1675 🔗

Yes – centre-left remain-voter here (though I was 50/50 about it and have supported Brexit since the vote happened). Not an anti-vaxxer, just concerned at this vaccine being rushed out and it being made compulsory. Not a covid-denier, just someone who’s baffled at the response to a virus with a mortality rate under 1%.

130836 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to nocheesegromit, 13, #1372 of 1675 🔗

The theft of our freedom is more important than any other issue, they don’t seem to get this on the other side of the Covid fence.

130861 ▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1373 of 1675 🔗

Indeed, this transcends demographics and politics.

130870 ▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Nick Rose, 13, #1374 of 1675 🔗

The loss of our liberty is my number one concern through this whole thing. The sick feeling has not left me from the day Boris announced the Crackdown on liberty. It gnaws away like a nuclear reactor. It’s made me slightly unhinged. I worry for my son. What future can he look forward to now? I feel the destruction of our lives is the plan and the sickness comes from knowing there isn’t a damn thing we can do about it.

130883 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Biker, 1, #1375 of 1675 🔗

the destruction of our lives is the plan

There is no plan. These people are incurably incompetent and stupid.

130887 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to John P, 9, #1376 of 1675 🔗

I hope you’re right but i don’t have much sympathy with that view. I think they know exactly what they are doing.

130902 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Biker, 2, #1377 of 1675 🔗

Well, we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one biker.

You credit these idiots with brains?

Quite how anyone can think that so much death and destruction can be desired by anyone is beyond me.

James Bond villains are just a fantasy, those sorts of people do not exist in reality.

130910 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lucky, replying to John P, 5, #1378 of 1675 🔗

Puppets don’t need brains.

131031 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to John P, 1, #1379 of 1675 🔗

See Blair Iraq or even more modern times Libya Syriah, Yemen. Our Parliament deals in death.

131186 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to John P, #1380 of 1675 🔗

Very naive to think powerful men don’t meet in secret and plot.
They have been extremely competent in dismantling our freedoms.

130992 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Biker, 2, #1381 of 1675 🔗

If anybody id unhinged, it most certainly isn’t you.
There is something you can do. Keep your courage up and don’t give in.

130958 ▶▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Nick Rose, #1382 of 1675 🔗

Those idiots are treating freedom as “last years fashion”. I’m stunned how they can be so stupid as to see it as something which can be sacrificed.

130957 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to nocheesegromit, #1383 of 1675 🔗

Under 0.26% actually.

130911 ▶▶▶ Steve, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1384 of 1675 🔗

It’s the standard tactic. Label anyone who disagrees with the liberal agenda as a right wing fascist. Doesn’t matter if it’s true or not, doesn’t matter if the topic on question crosses the traditional left/right divide (whatever that is) or not. The still use the label as it’s the best way to discredit whoever’s is objecting.

130960 ▶▶▶▶ patric, replying to Steve, 1, #1385 of 1675 🔗

I was described as a “fake news reading troll of a right wing extremist” for telling a “friend” (not one any longer since he responded like that) that Saint Jacinda was using military troops to guard quarantine centres.

130773 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 6, #1386 of 1675 🔗

If you speak German Bodo Schiffmann on top form again.
He has moved off YT to Bitchute.

Review of Numbers in Germany, another good study saying masks are useless, etc.

130873 ▶▶ DJ Dod, replying to Silke David, 4, #1387 of 1675 🔗

This is very good. The evidence is now so overwhelming that it’s difficult to comprehend that the mainstream media haven’t woken up to the fact that the ‘lockdowns’ across Europe are causing more damage than the virus.

130786 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 41, #1388 of 1675 🔗

First day of the Six ‘Act’ and the news on Radio 4 reports on the police cautioning mothers holding a toddlers picnic in a park. Clearly the police have decided to take on the toughest miscreants first!

130794 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Ned of the Hills, 11, #1389 of 1675 🔗

Give that officer the Queen’s Medal for Gallantry!

130796 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ned of the Hills, 10, #1390 of 1675 🔗

Fair dos to the police, they really know how to cover themselves in glory. Not.

130797 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Ned of the Hills, 26, #1391 of 1675 🔗

Will they put people on a sixual offenders register?

130804 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #1392 of 1675 🔗

Tish boom.

130844 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #1393 of 1675 🔗


130798 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Ned of the Hills, 23, #1394 of 1675 🔗

Our brave policemen and women always go for the easy targets.I have completely lost respect for the police.The images of them kneeling and running down Whitehall sums them up.

130807 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Ned of the Hills, 13, #1395 of 1675 🔗

One step away from the Melbourne police telling off a pregnant woman for sitting on a bench during the 1 hour a day she’s allowed outside…

130990 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to nocheesegromit, #1396 of 1675 🔗

Telling off?
Not shoving her to the ground and stamping on her head while Dan the Damned cheers them on?

130838 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Ned of the Hills, 4, #1397 of 1675 🔗

The story will be strategic. Many mothers listen to R4? No. But perhaps caring, concerned grand parents do. What better way to disseminate fear of police than by word of mouth from your own family.

In a land where a disinformation unit and the army is functioning against the best interests of the people it is perhaps useful not to downplay these previously insignificant occurances.

Is it possible the story was even called for by SAGE SPI-B? Yes, I am afraid that is a well founded possibility.

130843 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Ned of the Hills, 3, #1398 of 1675 🔗

Cowards, bet they didn’t even ‘take a knee’

130864 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #1399 of 1675 🔗

I think that there be an exemption that covers that anyway. Certain support groups are exempted. There are quite a few – which potentially makes the rules 1) unenforceable and 2) utterly irrational and ineffective – why would the virus respect the long list of exemptions?!!

130903 ▶▶ Steve, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #1400 of 1675 🔗

Wait until they start handcuffing the mothers or grabbing them by their throat up against a wall. Won’t be long now, as soon as curfews are imposed the police will feel they have carted blanche to behave in any way they want.

130916 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to Ned of the Hills, #1401 of 1675 🔗

So much of this seems to be about multiplying complicity.

We now have whole groupings of police, from the most senior down, who know that any serious return of democracy means that they lose their jobs and their pensions.

130816 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1402 of 1675 🔗

Looks like the FDA is taking a closer look at the Oxford Vaccine:


Unclear whether this is another participant, or a closer look at one of the two who have already been notified, and which prompted the pausing of the trials.

130824 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #1403 of 1675 🔗

I think it must be the same one. The first one they thought was unrelated to the vaccine but maybe given the second it’s worth taking a closer look. If they get another case of transverse myelitis now you’d think that would be the end of the road for this vaccine candidate.

They’re using a big dose because it doesn’t work all that well, which increases the risk of these adverse reactions (but may lower the risk of the other potential issue which is enhancement).

The Russian “Gamelaya” vaccine is very similar, and they’re using twice as big a dose again. Not for the faint of heart.

130833 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to guy153, 2, #1404 of 1675 🔗

Thanks Guy. The first one was supposedly a case of undiagnosed MS, and therefore unrelated (really?). In the second participant (Transverse Myelitis), was it after a second dose, or due to a big first dose?

130869 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1405 of 1675 🔗

I’d have to check but the MS case was probably in the earlier phase trial, when all the participants had to be super fit with no existing conditions. How can you miss undiagnosed MS in the the pre-trial physical examinations??
What we do know from the pre-clinical animal study was that all six of the macaques got infected after challenge with the virus and were viral shredding. A week later they were euthanised…

130878 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Kevin 2, #1406 of 1675 🔗

I think Pascal Soriot (CEO of AstraZeneca) said on an investor call last week it was in July. From the Lancet article, the first part of the Phase I/II was April-May, but I am not sure whether there was the intention of a booster dose in July, or whether it just went straight to Phase III with more participants in July. The US part of Phase III was due to start last week, but is now paused. I read the Indian trail continued notwithstanding the inquiry here. Not sure about South Africa.

130906 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1407 of 1675 🔗

Yes i saw that. Must keep the investors informed! Just shows how the world is turned upside down. There is also Brazil I believe in the trial.
The animal study certainly didn’t impress some commenters.

130881 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1408 of 1675 🔗

AZ shareholders are speculating it was post 2nd dose as it was a woman in the U.K. who developed TM, and the U.K. arm of the study fully enrolled a while back.

131005 ▶▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #1409 of 1675 🔗

It is possible that the MS was not diagnosed in the July participant because they may not have been showing any signs or symptoms of the condition. However, A-Z cannot ignore the possibility that their vaccine triggered it sufficiently for a diagnosis to be made. Depending on the type of MS, progressive or regressive/remitting, will have a serious impact on the person. If the latter then they will have periods with few symptoms alternating with periods of severe symptoms. If the former then that is going to completely disable the person over a period of time and they will inevitably die prematurely.
MS is also thought to an autoimmune disease, although it could be the failure of the cells that produce the myelin sheath around nerve cells.

Transverse myelitis May be an autoimmune disease but may also result from lack of myelin .

131135 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1410 of 1675 🔗

Yes they thought undiagnosed MS at the time, but it’s surely worth taking a closer look, as it’s a similar sort of problem (immune system going crazy and destroying your own myelin). I don’t know what the circumstances were of the transverse myelitis case. It should all get written up when the trial is over.

130842 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1411 of 1675 🔗

I noticed that when the the MHRA lifted the clinical hold, the other countries hosting the trial did not . This confirms it. And this is the second clinical hold. AZN did not acknowledge the first hold at the time, when a trial subject somehow contracted multiple sclerosis. This was because they concluded that the MS was not related to the vaccine….
It appears that the UK authorities are intent on giving this emergency use authorisation, before it is approved. Robert Kennedy Jr. recently stated that there had been two cases of transverse myolitis plus one of MS. Don’t know if he got that right though.
Transverse myolitis is one of the rare auto-immune diseases, that has been previously associated with other vaccines. TM and MS are both debilitating conditions for which there is no effective cure.

Sars-CoV-2 on the other hand is now an endemic virus, which is usually not clinically symptomatic.

130848 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Kevin 2, 2, #1412 of 1675 🔗

Agree Kevin. Have they not learned anything from Pandemrix?

130872 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #1413 of 1675 🔗

People have very short memories. There was the 1976 Swine Flu vaccine debacle as well as Pandemrix for H1N1. I actually read an editorial in the Wall Street Journal last week written by a doctor who was going to advise his 96-year-old father to get the Covid vaccine even though his dad had been injured by the Swine Flu vaccine in 1976. I was absolutely shocked that doctor could be so blind to the issue of vaccine injury even after his own father experienced it.

130989 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Kevin 2, 7, #1414 of 1675 🔗

The govt have always been terrified of being accused of letting Covid kill people. I’m puzzled that they seem to have no fear of letting a vaccine kill people.

130821 Basics, #1415 of 1675 🔗

Did a reply come back?

130829 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 22, #1416 of 1675 🔗

Sweden shows lockdowns were unnecessary. No wonder public health officials hate it

Imagine a world where Stockholm [think they meant Sweden] had caved to international pressure and fallen into line with everyone else. In such a world, politicians and public health officials could get away with claiming that but for their closures and crackdowns, things would have been unimaginably worse. The disease, they would tell us, would have spread exponentially. Millions, perhaps hundreds of millions, would have died.

130832 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Nobody2020, 15, #1417 of 1675 🔗

Sweden is one of the few beacons in a world where the lights have mostly been extinguished.

130852 ▶▶ Marie R, replying to Nobody2020, 21, #1418 of 1675 🔗

Reality v Ferguson’s model

130855 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Nobody2020, 6, #1419 of 1675 🔗

Well we’d still have Belarus, Brazil, Japan and parts of the USA as counterarguments, just less powerful ones.

130926 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to DRW, #1420 of 1675 🔗

Eh? Japan is hugely powerful! Belarus might be but we can’t trust their figures – as with China and Russia.

131132 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to OKUK, #1421 of 1675 🔗

I thought that lockdowners could argue they had a voluntary lockdown based on mobility data, as well as “Japanese culture is different” because they’re big on their personal space.

131003 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #1422 of 1675 🔗

Thank you Sweden…

130853 Marie R, replying to Marie R, 10, #1423 of 1675 🔗

Just watching mums and toddlers in a group of 7 being questioned by the police in Bristol on news at 10

130858 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Marie R, 1, #1424 of 1675 🔗

Will the Covid marshalls be fining the toddlers too?

130879 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Marie R, 1, #1425 of 1675 🔗

Seems like a story the want to promote. Nudge.

130915 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Marie R, #1426 of 1675 🔗

Definitely sound like terrorists.

130854 mjr, replying to mjr, 2, #1427 of 1675 🔗

tonight itv4 22.00 Family Guy.. Not to everyones taste (a bit surreal with adult humour and often in bad taste) but this episode is based around vaccinations and is quite funny .

130925 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to mjr, #1428 of 1675 🔗

Good – there must be more funny things than just Trump’s haircut (Radio 4 please note).

130871 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 6, #1429 of 1675 🔗

Feel a bit disappointed today.

Lots of decent articles, some airtime but still not breaking enough ranks in MSM.

Can’t help wonder why Ivor hasn’t been asked to appear on TV or Radio thus far?

130885 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to hotrod, 2, #1430 of 1675 🔗

The Brexit (Internal Market) Bill might explain much of this – nice distraction for the MSM?

130890 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1431 of 1675 🔗

I have always said that post Brexit the MSM would have nothing left to do.

Covid has of course come along and replaced Brexit quite nicely.

130945 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to hotrod, 2, #1432 of 1675 🔗

Only temporarily. CV19 will effectively end before Christmas in UK. There won’t be a safe vaccine for ages, if ever, it’ll be like SARs 1 – virulence dies out before vaccine passes trials. Brexit however is a whole other story. That one will run and run. A goldmine for every lawyer and accountant and politician, with endless re- negotiation of trade deals, legal interpretation and challenge clogging up the courts – the new CV Regs have nothing on what’s to come there – it’ll be never ending.

130898 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to hotrod, 8, #1433 of 1675 🔗

Hang on in there. I have days like that too but I really do feel that the message is getting out. It is just hard for those of us who have seen the obvious for ages and it is really hard to see that many people are still buying into the “we’re all doomed” nonsense and, worse yet, signal their virtue by donning masks everywhere, reminding everyone of “the rules” and accusing those who truly care about others – and want to see them have access to the work, education, healthcare, human contact etc. they need – of being heartless granny murderers.

130899 ▶▶ Tony Prince, replying to hotrod, #1434 of 1675 🔗

He has been on talk radio 6 weeks or so ago.

130923 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to hotrod, 1, #1435 of 1675 🔗

I think we all know why Ivor hasn’t been invited on: cogent, coherent and coolly factual.

131012 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to hotrod, 4, #1436 of 1675 🔗

Know how you feel. Compared with just two months ago, we’re doing well. Cracks are not just appearing in the dam wall, but the concrete looks like it’s crumbling too. Scepticism is gaining traction even in the MSM: editors know readers’ comments are turning against the narrative.

Hold fast.

130888 Liam, replying to Liam, 65, #1437 of 1675 🔗

I told a chap to f*ck off in the pub earlier when he approached my table where I was with friends and held up six fingers. I wasn’t very gentle, I’m a fairly big lad, a good bit over six feet and he took fright. Zero sympathy for him from onlookers and he left. I’m tired of being nice with snitches and idiots.

130892 ▶▶ Lucky, replying to Liam, 6, #1438 of 1675 🔗

Amazing he could count!

130896 ▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Lucky, 11, #1439 of 1675 🔗

I joked with a couple of the lads that Yul Brynner and Steve McQueen would be out of luck in this situation. In all seriousness, I’m a reasonable fellow, if he tried that with some of the big lads, the scaffolders and brickies that drink in the bar etc, he could have got into real trouble.

130901 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Liam, 10, #1440 of 1675 🔗

Amazing how stupid some people are.A punch on the nose is a much greater threat to this moron than 7 people sitting together in a pub

130988 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Lucky, 2, #1441 of 1675 🔗

I’m surprised they didn’t put the number at three. You know: ‘one, two, three, a lot’.

131008 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to annie, 5, #1442 of 1675 🔗

Blackadder: If I have two beans, and add two more beans, how many beans do I have?

Baldrick: Some beans, maybe a small casserole.

130897 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Liam, 4, #1443 of 1675 🔗

Best way to combat the Stasi!

130905 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Liam, 5, #1444 of 1675 🔗

Next time just hold up an open hand as if you’re showing 5 and then slowly make a fist.

130909 ▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #1445 of 1675 🔗

He got the message, in a noisy and public fashion.

130921 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #1446 of 1675 🔗

Surely two fingers or even one will suffice…five seems over the top.

130924 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to Liam, 3, #1447 of 1675 🔗

Can’t up-rate this enough!

130918 patric, #1448 of 1675 🔗


They know they’ve got to end the bullshit to save Christmas (remember the true spirit of Christmas is profit and that is vital after a spring and summer of ruin). they suggest “two weeks”. Might as well just drop all pretence of controlling the virus right now, and keep it dropped. Let it spread, we don’t mind, Copy Sweden, Bring back normality.

130919 assoc, replying to assoc, 3, #1449 of 1675 🔗

If, God forbid, one were to be ordered to self-isolate then what, if any, legal grounds would one have to challenge such an order?

130922 ▶▶ John P, replying to assoc, 3, #1450 of 1675 🔗

None as far as I am aware. Avoid being tested.

131059 ▶▶▶ OpenYourEyes, replying to John P, 1, #1451 of 1675 🔗

As far as I know, the self-isolation based on a positive test or symptoms of yourself or a family member is medical advice and as such can be ignored. Quarantining from abroad is a different kettle of fish.

130929 ▶▶ patric, replying to assoc, #1452 of 1675 🔗

We are beyond the point where law applies. Laws passed by this government lost their validity on March 23rd 2020. This is a government which rules by decree, announcing legislation on twitter and enforcing it 15 minutes later. Legal grounds are not what matters now, look instead to how you can practically and feasibly oppose the theft of your rights. Our liberties cannot be returned by lawyers, but by having the public make the police realsie that enfrocement is impossible (and give up), and shortly later the politicians realise it id futile to draft laws that cops won’t enforce. (and give up too).

130936 ▶▶ matt, replying to assoc, 4, #1453 of 1675 🔗

Ignore, ignore, ignore and rely on the fact that nobody has the faintest idea what you’re doing.

131178 ▶▶ Lili, replying to assoc, #1454 of 1675 🔗

Firstly, don’t tell anyone you’ve been told to self-isolate. Consider getting one of these doorbells that alert your phone and you can speak to whoever is at the door without actually being at home. https://en-uk.ring.com/?gclsrc=aw.ds&amp ;?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIieHYuN_q6wIVjN_tCh3KvgTyEAAYASAAEgIq7_D_BwE

If you’re out and you have a back entrance use that rather than the front during your isolation. Look very closely at who is around when you approach your house from the front. If you have any doubt, don’t enter.

They key thing is not to tell anyone that you’re going overseas, say it’s a week in Cornwall/Wales, and not to tell anyone, if it happens, that you have been told to isolate.

130920 John P, replying to John P, 5, #1455 of 1675 🔗

A Tory MP is unhappy:


It’s encouraging, though he makes a pukeworthy comment about the Tory Party at the end. There needs to be more of this. Nobody from Labour has criticised the government as strongly as this as far as I am aware.

130963 ▶▶ patric, replying to John P, #1456 of 1675 🔗

There are some very satisfying phrases in his piece, well done to him. And I say that as someone who has always voted for anything but tory, and anything but brexit.

130987 ▶▶ annie, replying to John P, #1457 of 1675 🔗

Pay wall, could you summarise?

130995 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to annie, 4, #1458 of 1675 🔗

They quote Charles Walker. This is his statement:

I hope I’m not going to foul-tempered tonight. It’s not a disposition I warm to. But Mr Deputy Speaker, there is a worrying trend – a worrying narrative emerging – and this is a good opportunity to get a lot of things on the record as I build an argument over the next two minutes, 45 seconds.

First of all, I am extremely concerned that we are placing severe restrictions on people’s liberties without any recourse to parliament. I would actually vote in certain circumstances to take people’s liberties away if I thought it was in the national interest. But I would like to have the chance to debate it on the floor of the House, to represent the concerns of my constituents.

I’m also concerned that we go around arresting old men in Trafalgar Square for having a peaceful protest and fining them £10,000. I never thought I would ever be defending Mr Corbyn in the chamber of the House of Commons. But I am – I am defending a Corbyn. We’ve got to be allowed to protest without fear of arrest or being fined.

And now today we hear that we’re going to have the public being urged to inform on their friends and neighbours because granny’s followed granddad into a family home of five. This is a profoundly unconservative thing. All of these things are unconservative.

I do think being asked to put this country, this House, members of this House, our constituents, on the wrong side of the law, before we’ve exhausted all other options – and I’m no fan of the EU, I was in every single division lobby for Brexit, I think they’re a pain in the neck – but surely we have to exhaust all other options before we press the nuclear button?

I’m not going to be voting for this Bill at second reading because if you keep whacking a dog, don’t be surprised when it bites you back. We are all members of parliament and we deserve to be taken seriously.

I accept there’s a pandemic – a national crisis – but surely that is the time when our voices should be heard on behalf of our constituents?

So I do hope the government goes away tonight, I do hope that the Prime Minister reflects on what is going on and listens to the concerns of this House, and comes back with a solution that allows me to skip through the division lobby at third reading and support him in this important Bill. Because I do believe, colleagues, that the Conservative party is the greatest party – the greatest political party ever – and we have to have the courage to live up to that greatness.

131013 ▶▶▶ Hugh_Manity, replying to annie, #1459 of 1675 🔗

Here you go Annie…

“So I do hope the government goes away tonight, I do hope that the Prime Minister reflects on what is going on and listens to the concerns of this House, and comes back with a solution that allows me to skip through the division lobby at third reading and support him in this important Bill. Because I do believe, colleagues, that the Conservative party is the greatest party – the greatest political party ever – and we have to have the courage to live up to that greatness .”

130931 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #1460 of 1675 🔗

Daniel Andrews was asked about man having head stamped on by Police mid violent attack and the lady pulled from her car by violent police. Andrews replied all can be avoided if people do not protest.

Watch and see what a man with the wrong thing inside him speaks.


130976 ▶▶ john, replying to Basics, 4, #1461 of 1675 🔗

He is one seriously sick individual…..

130986 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to john, 3, #1462 of 1675 🔗

If so, it’s the sort of sickness that is caused by diabolic possession.

131007 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to annie, 1, #1463 of 1675 🔗

Power-gone-to-head disease.

131002 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to john, 2, #1464 of 1675 🔗

If he said that, I agree, there is something seriously wrong with him.

131027 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #1465 of 1675 🔗

He said it. In press conference. The link has a clip of question and response.

131040 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Basics, 3, #1466 of 1675 🔗

it was the victims own stupid fault to have his head on the floor whilst the police tap dancing team were having their practice

130975 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to RyanM, 1, #1468 of 1675 🔗

The plaintiffs didn’t challenge the mask order. That’s unfortunate. But good news nonetheless!

130985 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #1469 of 1675 🔗

Every little helps.

130991 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #1470 of 1675 🔗

I think the suit came before the mask order.

131270 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to RyanM, #1471 of 1675 🔗

That is great

130951 Kate, replying to Kate, 2, #1472 of 1675 🔗


The participant who triggered a global shutdown of AstraZeneca’s Phase 3 Covid-19 vaccine trials was a woman in the United Kingdom who experienced neurological symptoms consistent with a rare but serious spinal inflammatory disorder called transverse myelitis, the drug maker’s chief executive, Pascal Soriot, said during a private conference call with investors on Wednesday morning.
The woman’s diagnosis has not been confirmed yet, but she is improving and will likely be discharged from the hospital as early as Wednesday, Soriot said.
The board tasked with overseeing the data and safety components of the AstraZeneca clinical trials confirmed that the participant was injected with the company’s Covid-19 vaccine and not a placebo, Soriot said on the conference call, which was set up by the investment bank J.P. Morgan.
Soriot also confirmed that the clinical trial was halted once previously in July after a participant experienced neurological symptoms. Upon further examination, that participant was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis, deemed to be unrelated to the Covid-19 vaccine treatment, he said.

131000 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Kate, #1473 of 1675 🔗

The first participant was diagnosed with MS, before or after the vaccination?
If it was before then A-Z would have known about it, which clearly didn’t.
If after then the patient couldn’t have been aware of it, although the patient may have started to show signs of the disease but no firm diagnosis, but did the vaccine exacerbate or provoke the mild symptoms?
A-Z cannot just write off the July event as being unrelated. This has potentially life changing effects.

131001 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Kate, #1474 of 1675 🔗

Hi Kate

Where did you get the medical detail above re the neurological inflammatory problem? I couldn’t find it in that article.

If you have a source I’d like to read it.


131271 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Kate, #1475 of 1675 🔗

Upon further examination, that participant was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis, deemed to be unrelated to the Covid-19 vaccine treatment, he said.

The vaccine could have triggered the MS

130956 richard riewer, 6, #1476 of 1675 🔗

Dr Vernon Coleman is on Richie Allen today and will be for many more Mondays in the weeks to come.

130959 Gillian, replying to Gillian, 2, #1477 of 1675 🔗


Love this woman! But why is her friend masked-up in the street?

130964 ▶▶ patric, replying to Gillian, #1478 of 1675 🔗

Some mask wearers just don’t realise they’ve got it on. So habituated to being muzzled that they don’t realise that its there, and quite a few don’t even realise the dangerous message that the mask’s presence is supporting.

130984 ▶▶ annie, replying to Gillian, 2, #1479 of 1675 🔗

Another comment says it’s to satisfy her children.

130961 richard riewer, 15, #1480 of 1675 🔗

Dr Vernon Coleman just said that no one could be as stupid as Hancock, Johnson and company. They are not our friends and we should take away all their authority over us before it’s too late.

130983 ▶▶ annie, replying to wendyk, 24, #1482 of 1675 🔗

Author says we all thought the bollox was necessary when we were first incarcerated.
I didn’t. I thought it was stark raving lunacy.

130994 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to annie, 4, #1483 of 1675 🔗

Me too

131015 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to annie, 1, #1484 of 1675 🔗

Slight twinge at beginning not wanting to infect anyone but a bit of research (Sucharit Bhakdi, Wolfgang Wodarg, Knut Wittkowski) dealt with that.

130974 richard riewer, 5, #1485 of 1675 🔗

Bill Gates should be charged with influence peddling and The Guardian and The BBC should be charged with taking bribes.

131138 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to annie, #1487 of 1675 🔗

Some of the comments are troubling.
A lot of do your bit and put up with the restrictions or you will all be on ventilators in the winter

130996 annie, replying to annie, 4, #1488 of 1675 🔗

The marvellous Andrew on the Edinburgh University scandal.


131025 ▶▶ Basics, replying to annie, #1489 of 1675 🔗

Spot on.
Chicago Uninversity make Black Studies mandatory for all in English Department.

130997 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 3, #1490 of 1675 🔗

Apologies if this has already been posted. This is the response from the government regarding possible restrictions being imposed on those not wanting the vaccine. Not so convinced by the response. And how can they state that vaccines are “thoroughly tested” if this one is being rushed through to the degree it is.

There are currently no plans to place restrictions on those who refuse to have any potential Covid-19 vaccine.

After clean water, vaccination is the most effective and crucial public health intervention, and a cornerstone of public health that we must not take for granted. It is vital that a significant proportion of people who are offered take up a Covid-19 vaccine in order to protect themselves as well as other vulnerable individuals. Averting a second wave is a key priority for the government and high take up of a vaccine when available will greatly contribute to that.

Immunisations save thousands of lives every year by preventing outbreaks of serious infectious diseases and, in cases such as smallpox and polio, eliminating diseases in the UK altogether. Since the introduction of the measles vaccine in 1968, it is estimated that 20 million cases and 4,500 deaths have been averted in the UK. From 1970 to 2017, it is estimated that rubella vaccination has averted 1,300 babies being born with congenital rubella syndrome and 25,000 terminations. With further innovation and the development of new vaccines, even more lives could be saved.

We believe it is everyone’s responsibility to do the right thing for their own health, and for the benefit of the wider community. There are currently no plans to introduce a Covid-19 vaccine in a way that penalises those who do not take up the vaccine. However, the Government will carefully consider all options to improve vaccination rates, should that be necessary.

The UK has a world class national immunisation programme which is constantly reviewed and updated to reflect the changing nature of infectious diseases and provide the best protection for the public. All vaccines used in the UK are thoroughly tested, meet strict safety criteria and are carefully monitored after they are introduced into the national programme. Our evidence-based immunisation programmes are informed by the advice of our work leading expert committee – the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI), which reviews a wide range of scientific and other evidence, keeping the vaccine schedule safe and relevant.

Immunisation offers everyone a chance at a healthy life from the earliest beginnings and into old age. It saves millions of lives every year and is widely recognised as one of the world’s most successful and cost-effective health interventions. High uptake of a Covid-19 vaccine is the best way we have, to protect our health, our jobs, and our economy at large.

131004 ▶▶ dpj, replying to kh1485, 5, #1491 of 1675 🔗

Looks like the usual non response going on about how great and useful tried and tested vaccines are but not actually addressing the main point that it will be rushed in to production and hinting that they might ‘consider all options to improve vaccination rates’ which could mean anything. They also include the compulsory mention of the ‘second wave’ which has been coming imminently since June.

131006 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to dpj, 6, #1492 of 1675 🔗

Indeed. And those weasel words “there are currently no plans …” We all know what that is code for!

131010 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to kh1485, 7, #1493 of 1675 🔗

‘We believe it is everyone’s responsibility to do the right thing for their own health’ – yeah, the right thing for me is that I’d rather not take the risk of ruining my own health with an experimental and rushed vaccine…!

But no doubt the disingenuous ‘wider community’ argument will be wheeled out to invalidate and override the concept of personal choice and risk, so that anyone who refuses isn’t just ‘risking’ their own health, but the ‘health’ of the vulnerable as well.

131033 ▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 3, #1494 of 1675 🔗

You could have a sign for your cafe saying non-vaccinated people welcome.

No doubt someone would moan on TwatFace about it, which would be great advertising for you.

The operative sentence in the response is:

However, the Government will carefully consider all options to improve vaccination rates, should that be necessary.

Translation: we couldn’t care less about this petition.

131077 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to TJN, 1, #1495 of 1675 🔗

Exactly. That response chilled me to the bone.

The last time I had injections for something (allergies) it messed me up for many years. A rushed out vaccine, that is already causing one of the guinea pigs problems, no thanks. My other response would be: OK, PM and all other MPs advocating this, vaccinate yourselves and your entire families, let’s leave it a few years and see what the health implications are.

131151 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, 1, #1496 of 1675 🔗

If there is any compulsion towards vaccination I’m sure capitalism will step in and we’ll all be able to buy forged certificates on ebay or Amazon.

131091 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to TJN, 2, #1497 of 1675 🔗

Just occurred to me, perhaps I can have a sign like the one on the Statue of Liberty: Give me your unvaccinated, your unmasked and your dispossessed!

131152 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to kh1485, #1498 of 1675 🔗

I reckon you and your business will do all right out of this.

130998 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 13, #1499 of 1675 🔗

How about a badge saying “I won’t snitch if you break the ‘rule of six’” or poster for your window

130999 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #1500 of 1675 🔗

Good idea, but the cynical might think it’s a double-bluff.

131009 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #1501 of 1675 🔗

I suggested a window poster yesterday too. Great minds!

131034 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #1502 of 1675 🔗


131011 HelzBelz, replying to HelzBelz, 15, #1503 of 1675 🔗

Talking to a friend who organises events. They’ve been told to forget about running a large, open air event in May, though it ‘could’ be feasible in September. I cannot bear the idea that we will be living like this until Christmas let alone another 8 months…. or more.

131019 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to HelzBelz, 2, #1504 of 1675 🔗

Who were they told by?

131021 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to kh1485, 3, #1505 of 1675 🔗

Not sure but I assume they sought government advice.

131026 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to HelzBelz, 10, #1506 of 1675 🔗

Only civil disobedience can end this.

131036 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Ovis, 7, #1507 of 1675 🔗

I dream of this. But how? We are in a minority – most people support all of this or at least are happy to go along with it. Organisations won’t push back even though the restrictions will bankrupt many of them – too scared of being shut down. The police and the army are fully behind all of this. Sure we can refuse to wear masks and see who we like but this has minimal impact. What else can we do?

131070 ▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to HelzBelz, 1, #1508 of 1675 🔗

Oh Helz, let me think about it.

While I do so, note: May. No local elections next year.

So we will need to think of something. Posters?

131014 Nsklent, replying to Nsklent, 16, #1509 of 1675 🔗

My comments in brackets.

The Government response to the petition – “Prevent any restrictions on those who refuse a Covid-19 vaccination”.

Government responded:

There are currently no plans to place restrictions on those who refuse to have any potential Covid-19 vaccine.

(Note the word ‘currently’ not ‘under no circumstances’ , therefore they are not ruling it out.)

After clean water, vaccination is the most effective and crucial public health intervention, and a cornerstone of public health that we must not take for granted. It is vital that a significant proportion of people who are offered take up a Covid-19 vaccine in order to protect themselves as well as other vulnerable individuals.
(Once again we have the manipulation of language as throughout this farce where words appear to suggest freedom of decision, but compliance will be enforced through implying harm to others).

Averting a second wave is a key priority for the government and high take up of a vaccine when available will greatly contribute to that.
(So, we are told a second wave is imminent, the vaccine isn’t- thank goodness- so how long is this supposed second wave threat going to be dragged out for. Note we are expected to expose ourselves to a rushed out, dodgy vaccine to support a ‘key priority of the government’, nice to know how valued our well being is).

Immunisations save thousands of lives every year by preventing outbreaks of serious infectious diseases and, in cases such as smallpox and polio, eliminating diseases in the UK altogether. Since the introduction of the measles vaccine in 1968, it is estimated that 20 million cases and 4,500 deaths have been averted in the UK. From 1970 to 2017, it is estimated that rubella vaccination has averted 1,300 babies being born with congenital rubella syndrome and 25,000 terminations. With further innovation and the development of new vaccines, even more lives could be saved.
(They miss the point entirely, as the concern is not about established vaccines, but vaccines that are not meeting the usual safety criteria, standards and research into long term side effects. Vaccines usually take many years before deemed approved).

We believe it is everyone’s responsibility to do the right thing for their own health, ( no, that responsibilty belongs to the individual, not the government) and for the benefit of the wider community (once again the old trick of implying your non compliance will harm others, you selfish person ).

There are currently no plans to introduce a Covid-19 vaccine in a way that penalises those who do not take up the vaccine. However, the Government will carefully consider all options to improve vaccination rates, should that be necessary. ( Well, here we have it, ‘consider all options’, thats a good subjective, broad category, so yes, we will force compliance if our targets are not met. We may not be wrestling you to the ground to whack a needle in, but we will make life’s routines and access to public spaces bloody difficult if you refuse vaccination).

The UK has a world class ( I, so hate this term, rolled out at every opportunity) national immunisation programme which is constantly reviewed and updated to reflect the changing nature of infectious diseases and provide the best protection for the public. All vaccines used in the UK are thoroughly tested, meet strict safety criteria and are carefully monitored after they are introduced into the national programme.
( Yes, to date this has been the case, but the issue with the aversion to any potential Covid vaccine that appears in the next 12 months is that it doesn’t meet this criteria, thus the current consultation on removing licensing).

Our evidence-based immunisation programmes are informed by the advice of our work leading expert committee – the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI), which reviews a wide range of scientific and other evidence, keeping the vaccine schedule safe and relevant.

Immunisation offers everyone a chance at a healthy life from the earliest beginnings and into old age. It saves millions of lives every year and is widely recognised as one of the world’s most successful and cost-effective health interventions. High uptake of a Covid-19 vaccine is the best way we have, to protect our health, our jobs, and our economy at large ( The grand finally, those that don’t accept the vaccination programme are selfish people who don’t care about saving lives or their country – you can only imagine the propaganda that will ensue if a vaccine emerges. Pity they hadn’t considered a functioning health service as a contributory factor to public health)

The End

Department of Health and Social Care

131017 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Nsklent, 7, #1510 of 1675 🔗

Just read the email. Predictable nonsense and p atronising shite written by a jumped up government functionary. Agree with your summary entirely.

The very first sentence made my blood boil –

After clean water, vaccination is the most effective and crucial public health intervention

The point is vaccines need to be necessary, demonstrably effective and above all safe.

131022 ▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #1511 of 1675 🔗

Absolutely. So considering the mortality rate and the current status of potential vaccines for CV19 , that would be no on all three points.

131050 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #1512 of 1675 🔗

I just read that… cam straight down here to comment my anger before proceeding to the rest. Unfuckingbelieveable – it’s also a line that has an origin not with the one whole wrote this reply. Is it straight from pharma marketing?

I read on..

131054 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Basics, 2, #1513 of 1675 🔗

I’m back. Polio has been put into circulation through vaccines. That’s nit a great thing. See WHO April 2020 admitting this to be the case. I read on .

131086 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #1514 of 1675 🔗

Interesting priorities: 1. clean water 2. vaccinations
Ummmm, what about good, natural FOOD?

131018 ▶▶ davews, replying to Nsklent, 3, #1515 of 1675 🔗

As expected. I see they are saying they want to introduce the vaccine to prevent a second wave. No doubt we will be on the third wave by the time it appears.

131020 ▶▶ Nsklent, replying to Nsklent, #1516 of 1675 🔗

Sorry, that should be ‘finale’ not ‘finally’

131030 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Nsklent, 5, #1517 of 1675 🔗

Yes, in a wasteland of waffle, the sentence that stood out for me:

However , the Government will carefully consider all options to improve vaccination rates, should that be necessary.

131047 ▶▶ anon, replying to Nsklent, 2, #1518 of 1675 🔗

I thought these traitors were supposed to debate this in parliament?

131058 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Nsklent, 1, #1519 of 1675 🔗

That is almost word for word what the chair of the British Medical Council said at times on LBC With Andrew Castle. Listen to yesterday’s Richie Allen show and you’ll see. The whole analogy with the water, the speel about how they have been the best invention ever.

This whole thing is mad. They are reading right off a script. Empty suits.

131065 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #1520 of 1675 🔗

I wonder where fluoride fits in with clean water.

Vaccines, untried and rush tested RNA vaccines, are as natural as the air we breath. Oh, I’m so happy says Basil Faulty.

131166 ▶▶▶ Lili, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #1521 of 1675 🔗

It will straight out of the Behavioural Science/Nudge Unit – which is now a private company, by the way.

131061 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Nsklent, 1, #1522 of 1675 🔗

Great post and good brackets too. Thank you.

131016 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 9, #1523 of 1675 🔗

Weird thing twitter! I have been trying to put a few sceptic thoughts around and have ended up with 20 people following me including people from USA and Australia! Oh well if it helps to move things forward. Yesterday I got involved in some threads regarding Australia/Victoria and got a huge number of likes and replies; Suffice it to say that plenty of people are not happy with what is going on in Victoria. But there is probably still a majority who go along with it out of whipped up fear over a ‘deadly virus’

Victoria seems to be bought in to some world wide grouping which I do not understand and so I am not sure if this is relevant?

But what is clear is that the authorities there as in the UK do not understand the science of SARS-Cov2PCR testing, Politicians everywhere are regarding PCR testing like a speed camera, either OK or speeding – healthy or diseased but it is not like that, and worse still in Victoria the authorities think they can blast it out of existence like the shoot out at the OK corral! Unlike the UK they do have a plan;
But the criteria are terrifying, like trying to sweep the beach free of sand, has nobody learnt the lesson of King Canute? With those sort of criteria totally based on PCR testing results they will be locked down for ever. And while one authority is doing this others (with the exception of Sweden) are unwilling to admit reality.

131023 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #1524 of 1675 🔗

Strong Cities came up on yesterdays uk column

131029 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Basics, 6, #1525 of 1675 🔗

Missed that one, too much information and I’m also painting the house!
But the frightening thing to me is the criteria they are working to, it is clearly a zero covid strategy;
No new cases for 28 days, state-wide.
And by cases they mean PCR test results.
It is akin to burning your house down because you have a mouse in the kitchen!

131024 Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 4, #1526 of 1675 🔗

Morning all!

I don’t want to bombard the comments section with pleas to listen to our wonderful podcast about how mad everything is right now…

But please do!

In the latest episode we go to our local pub to chat about ‘Context’ and where CV19 sits.
👇 👇


131045 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, #1527 of 1675 🔗

Great Stuff!

131028 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 15, #1528 of 1675 🔗

Personal test experience of past few days.

Nephew back to school last Wednesday.

His best friend calls in sick and is off on Friday.

Nephew comes down with high temp on Saturday, has some calpol and goes to bed.

My sister in law can’t get a test anywhere but finally gets one on Sunday.

In the meantime his friend is feeling much better but his mother is now unwell and in bed too.

Come Monday all are feeling better but can’t go to school without test results.

This morning nephew has just been told he has tested negative.

I am sure this situation is happening but and down the country.

It’s usual back to school seasonal colds.

131042 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to hotrod, 11, #1529 of 1675 🔗

My daughter had a cough for about a week, it’s cleared up now. School didn’t mention it, we didn’t mention it, and we certainly did not get her a COVID test!

131049 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 3, #1530 of 1675 🔗

What!!!! An outbreak of common sense.
The government/advisers/experts will soon put a stop to that.

131052 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #1531 of 1675 🔗

According to YouGov poll 107% of respondents would support that.

131032 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 8, #1532 of 1675 🔗

(paywall) but he has asthma so says he was a prisoner in his home. However he looked out of his window and to see guests arriving at neighbours’ houses; at weekends, my local parks were full of large crowds, with no attempt to socially distance; and on buses and trains, many of my fellow passengers refused to wear masks”.He was disapointed that the police had better things to do. Why should everyone out their lives on hold and wear face nappies when he is staying inside only? Loic is that I can’t afford a Porsche therefore noone should have one.

131037 ▶▶ Basics, replying to arfurmo, 4, #1533 of 1675 🔗

Reads like a SPI-B list of wants. They are telling us we need to refresh our commitment to their bollocks, they’seen our commitment wane and relax. This whole new wave of bollocks is being used to propagandise the fear back into the vulnerables.

Each story containes an identifed demograph, the young mum, now the underlying healthista.

SPI-B wants SPI-B gets.

131121 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Basics, 1, #1534 of 1675 🔗

They need to be brought to justice for the psychological attack on the public

131141 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1535 of 1675 🔗

Yes I feel it is criminal. We all have a right to live in peace.

131165 ▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1536 of 1675 🔗

From CPS website, I’d say our leaders are ticking enough boxes:

Terrorism is the use or threat of action, both in and outside of the UK, designed to influence any international government organisation or to intimidate the public . It must also be for the purpose of advancing a political , religious, racial or ideological cause .

Examples include:

  • serious violence against a person or damage to property,
  • endangering a person’s life (other than that of the person committing the action),
  • creating a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public ,
  • action designed to seriously interfere with or seriously to disrupt an electronic system.

It is important to note that in order to be convicted of a terrorism offence a person doesn’t actually have to commit what could be considered a terrorist attack. Planning, assisting and even collecting information on how to commit terrorist acts are all crimes under British terrorism legislation.

131038 ▶▶ Nsklent, replying to arfurmo, 11, #1537 of 1675 🔗

He claims he was a prisoner in his own home, but witnessed people misbehaving in parks, trains and buses. He has certainly been out and about more than me.

131043 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Nsklent, 3, #1538 of 1675 🔗

probably has a telescope

131057 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to mjr, 5, #1539 of 1675 🔗

Silly old fool, I’ve had assmar all my life and COPD, hasn’t stopped me being out & about every single day since March 23rd

131060 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to karenovirus, 3, #1540 of 1675 🔗

Yeah pretty embarrassing. My wife has asthma and she couldn’t be less bothered about catching COVID. Why do these people want everyone to share their fear?

131097 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, #1541 of 1675 🔗

Why do people (news orgs) interview and share his fear. Propaganda.

131053 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to arfurmo, 2, #1542 of 1675 🔗

Dog in the manger. In any case if he is young he is still pretty much at zero risk.

131035 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #1543 of 1675 🔗

I am wondering what the next move will be in response to the latest testing snafu. My first thought was that running out of tests could only be a good thing. Less dodgy data to fuel hysteria with. But since the Government have hitched their horse to universal testing to ‘control the virus’ will this mean a new lock down?

131041 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Charlie Blue, 4, #1544 of 1675 🔗

There will be more lock down, restrictions and demands until we hold those responsible to account.