2020-09-17

Sourcehttps://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/09/17/latest-news-137/
Published2020-09-17T08:24:39
Last updated2020-09-26T09:54:37
Scraped2020-12-20T20:18:06
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134062 tonyspurs, replying to tonyspurs, 4, #1 of 1435 🔗

Oi oi numero uno 😀

134064 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to tonyspurs, -1, #2 of 1435 🔗

Saveloy!

134069 ▶▶ Philip F, replying to tonyspurs, -1, #3 of 1435 🔗

Curse you, tonyspurs!

134104 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to tonyspurs, 8, #4 of 1435 🔗

Uno , you know it’s only for a mo, since surely time will flow.

Spare a thought for those who laboured hard over a post on the old thread not realising this new one had begun…casting their seed on barren ground.

134127 ▶▶▶ Philip F, replying to OKUK, 9, #5 of 1435 🔗

But verily they mayst cuteth and pasteth their wasted seed upon this fertile ground.

134660 ▶▶ PWL, replying to tonyspurs, 3, #6 of 1435 🔗

New restrictions in the North East. How is your dedicated lockdown sceptical media doing leading you out of what is plainly an elaborate racket?

Covid-19 as a modern day variant of an antique technocratic control device

134065 ChrisW, replying to ChrisW, 137, #7 of 1435 🔗

I was in a dark and angry mood last week after the announcements about the Rule Of Six, the Moonshot mass testing, possible curfews and more lockdowns.

Then I realised I don’t care what the Government say anymore because I’m just going to ignore it all. I’m not wearing a mask, I’ll meet up with who I like, whenever I want and there’s nothing they can do to stop me enjoying Christmas as normal.

Yes the situation is still bad but at least I can smile and laugh at it all.

134093 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to ChrisW, 45, #8 of 1435 🔗

The government does not have anything like the near 100% support and consent from the public that made the initial lockdown so successful ( in keeping people indoors, not in terms of fighting the Covid).

That is why they are creeping the curfew in a area by area, initially emphasising pub closing times to divide and control

Creating lots of “so going to the pub is more important than stopping the killer Covid is you selfish bastard “

134417 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to karenovirus, 15, #9 of 1435 🔗

But they can still go to the pub, but clearly CV19 attacks people between 10pm and 11pm so pubs have to close earlier….

134538 ▶▶▶▶ alw, replying to Lms23, 13, #10 of 1435 🔗

Staying at a hotel or eating in a restaurant you are asked to wear masks as you walk along corridors or go to your table. You can go to a restaurant with 6 people all from different households but families can’t have more than six people in their home. Never knew a virus could be so intelligent.

135190 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to alw, 3, #11 of 1435 🔗

Indeed. They know where to go and not to go.

134722 ▶▶▶ Sceptic Hank, replying to karenovirus, 14, #12 of 1435 🔗

I wonder about those Yougov polls that claim support. I have a strong feeling they have been doctored. Surely people can’t be that blind to what’s going on.

134954 ▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Sceptic Hank, 7, #13 of 1435 🔗

The trouble with YouGov is that they skew those asked to contribute to the surveys along the “trendy lefty” arc. I have never seen a daily three question survey, the answers to which have been along the lines of right-of-centre or the commonsense options. The “answers” of the majority have always been in the bed-wetter direction.

135186 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Sceptic Hank, 5, #14 of 1435 🔗

Naw, they’re fake. Yougov for me has always been suspect.

134794 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to karenovirus, 8, #15 of 1435 🔗

I’m not a pub-goer but all this nonsense makes me think I should become one.

135439 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to ConstantBees, 1, #16 of 1435 🔗

Me neither but in my younger days I was 3 pints an evening and rather more at the weekend. Alcohol Concern should be pleasantly surprised that I’m still alive.

134166 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to ChrisW, 46, #17 of 1435 🔗

After my initial anger had subsided over the recent FB aggro against our mask and gel stance, I was amused to look over the happy smiling and relaxed faces of my predominantly middle-aged to elderly customers – the ones I had been accused of trying to harm.

134179 ▶▶▶ ChrisW, replying to kh1485, 7, #18 of 1435 🔗

I must visit your cafe sometime!

134597 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to kh1485, 8, #19 of 1435 🔗

They’re the ones that matter. You make them matter and that’s because you matter.

135188 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kh1485, 3, #20 of 1435 🔗

Well done you for providing an oasis of sanity and normality. I like to think that your customers appreciate the fact that they’re welcome and not treated like lepers in your cafe.

Long may it continue and hope to visit you soon.

134207 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to ChrisW, 50, #21 of 1435 🔗

Best way to be. I gave up caring months ago. I’ve certainly never, ever feared coroni despite being in a vulnerable group. I even told my consultant this (at a very rare, telephone appointment) and he said “good for you, good attitude to have!” Don’t connect to interwebs or tv and coroni disappears! Think about it though. This is, after all just one massive psyops, Operation Fear being rolled out by government and its lapdog, MSM. Let’s face it if the threat to our lives was that great, they’d be playing it down to avoid panic! After all we wouldnt need telling, the evidence would be before our eyes! Local government would have had a far more active role in restricting and protecting people within its governance but have any our council’s been shown to be actively involved? No, this exercise, using a virus which at any other time in history would be treated like any virus in history, is a huge applied psychology exercise to get people to permanently change their social behaviours without them noticing by keeping them in a permanent state of fear. I see straight through the lies and I’m out!

134224 ▶▶▶ petgor, replying to HelenaHancart, 26, #22 of 1435 🔗

“Let’s face it if the threat to our lives was that great, they’d be playing it down to avoid panic! ”

Very good point!

134799 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to petgor, 4, #23 of 1435 🔗

Adding that one to my selection of comment snippets to post on the DM. Ta.

134218 ▶▶ petgor, replying to ChrisW, 4, #24 of 1435 🔗

It may have been Moonshot, but it seems like moonshine.

134239 ▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to ChrisW, 25, #25 of 1435 🔗

Just remember if you get nicked to not accept and sign a caution from the Police. Insist on your day in Court and don’t pay the fine 😉

134274 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to ChrisW, 6, #26 of 1435 🔗

George Carlin said it best.

Detach yourself emotionally

https://youtu.be/eVZMifGcW64

The human race is just an experiment

134807 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 6, #27 of 1435 🔗

Another American, Kurt Vonnegut, had a good perspective in his novel Galapagos . Basically, in the novel, he said that humans had evolved a brain that was too large to be truly useful. Eventually our species evolves a smaller brain and goes back to living happily in the sea. Vonnegut was always good at the long view.

134595 ▶▶ annie, replying to ChrisW, 2, #28 of 1435 🔗

Three hearty cheers for you!

135226 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to ChrisW, 4, #29 of 1435 🔗

ChrisW you are they type of person we need to look up to and say I am going to take a lead from Chris and do exactly the same.

More people who do this stronger we will become as a group.

135678 ▶▶▶ ChrisW, replying to Dave #KBF, #30 of 1435 🔗

Thanks Dave, never saw myself as a leader!

134068 Paul M, replying to Paul M, 60, #31 of 1435 🔗

Gutted that the Simon Dolans appeal has been delayed by a month due to one member of the government team being on holiday.

On holiday for Christs sake – it’s not like they didn’t know the appeal was set over a month ago.

The buggers can run and try to hide, but the reckoning must surely come

134123 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Paul M, 9, #32 of 1435 🔗

are you sure that’s real and not a script for Yes Minister ?

134228 ▶▶▶ microdave, replying to Biker, 17, #33 of 1435 🔗

Yes it’s true – here’s the content of an email from Simon’s team this morning:

Update on Join the Legal Challenge to the UK Govt Lockdown

Our legal challenge against the Government delayed by a further month – due to a Government lawyer being on holiday.

We had been scheduled to go ahead on September 23, with the court having moved the hearing forward from the original date of September 28.

But one of the Government’s 11-strong team is holiday on that date, meaning it has now been moved back to October 29. The availability of suitably senior judges to hear the case on alternative dates was also a factor.

As you know, the appeal was ordered to be heard by Lord Justice Hickinbottom who said that the legal challenge “potentially raises fundamental issues concerning the proper spheres for democratically-accountable Ministers of the Government and judges.”

We are all naturally incredibly frustrated that the hearing will be delayed, especially give Lord Justice Hickinbottom’s direction that the case needed to be heard quickly. The case is of the utmost importance to the entire nation and we believe that further delays only highlights the Government’s inability to face up to its decisions.

The better news is that the delay will mean that the appeal will be held in person, rather than virtually as all previous stages have been.

We have seen in recent weeks that the Government, by its own admission, is willing to break the law. It cannot be allowed that these actions go unchecked and I urge everyone to consider the ramifications which the lockdown has had on our freedoms and liberties.

In the meantime, we will continue to fight to expose the dangerous and damaging impacts the Government’s lockdown strategy has had on the entire nation and I would urge you to join our fight by signing up to https://www.keepbritainfree.com

134422 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to microdave, 8, #34 of 1435 🔗

It’s not government inability, it’s clearly their blatant unwillingness to face up to their responsibilities. Does the government have only one lawyer?? They don’t have anyone else to step in?

134603 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Lms23, 10, #35 of 1435 🔗

They’re scared of Simon. Yay.

134672 ▶▶▶▶ alw, replying to microdave, 10, #36 of 1435 🔗

Very clearly government interference. There is no other explanation. The government is clearly frit and delaying the inevitable. Hancock and Johnson need to be sent to the Tower.

135387 ▶▶▶▶▶ Paul M, replying to alw, 1, #37 of 1435 🔗

Nearest lamp post will do, with a socially distanced 2m rope

135338 ▶▶▶ MRG, replying to Biker, 1, #38 of 1435 🔗

Listened to a R4 Extra Episode of Yes Minister a few hours ago. Empty Hospital populated by administrators.
It seems we are there!

134136 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Paul M, 15, #39 of 1435 🔗

“Holiday”? What’s that?

134593 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to kh1485, 6, #40 of 1435 🔗

A Madonna song

134149 ▶▶ Hampshire Sceptic, replying to Paul M, 45, #41 of 1435 🔗

I seem to recall that last year when Gina Thingummybob was taking the government to court over the prorogation of Parliament the courts bent over backwards to get her before the Supreme Court in a matter of days. Why is Simon Dolan’s case treated so differently? Is it because she was part of the cosy Liberal world inhabited by so many in positions of power while Simon is posing a challenge to them?

134183 ▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to Hampshire Sceptic, 7, #42 of 1435 🔗

in words of Churchill “Oh Yes!”

134191 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Paul M, 16, #43 of 1435 🔗

The govt have ELEVEN lawyers on the case, but the others are incapable of filling in for the one on holiday. They can’t be much cop then.

134235 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Julian, 23, #44 of 1435 🔗

… this holiday must have been planned in advance – why was it allowed to happen if he/she had to be in court? If decided on short notice – again why was it allowed to happen?

This is clearly a delaying tactic and should not be allowed in our legal system

134291 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Victoria, 10, #45 of 1435 🔗

Contempt of Court it had been a witness.

134473 ▶▶▶▶▶ JASA, replying to karenovirus, 9, #46 of 1435 🔗

Exactly. When I was a forensic scientist, court citations over rode everything. If you were on holiday, you had to come back.

135210 ▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Victoria, 5, #47 of 1435 🔗

We have a legal system? I thought it had been cancelled along with everything else which goes together to make a civilised society.

134245 ▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to Paul M, 9, #48 of 1435 🔗

My main fear is what state will we be in by the time it makes it to court? Will we even have a functioning legal system by then?

134304 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to NonCompliant, 3, #49 of 1435 🔗

It is part of the delay the court process strategy. It should not be allowed

134400 ▶▶▶▶ Suzyv, replying to Victoria, 17, #50 of 1435 🔗

Definitely. Case dates are set well in advance and everyone’s diaries are checked first. You don’t then go and book a holiday when you know that it clashes.I used to work in the legal profession. This is all very convenient and most likely dishonest.

134344 ▶▶ sam, replying to Paul M, 4, #51 of 1435 🔗

delay is their main tactic

134420 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Paul M, 2, #52 of 1435 🔗

Haven’t the government advisors heard of Zoom?

134491 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to Paul M, 9, #53 of 1435 🔗

This really pisses me off! In June, Simon’s case was initially thrown out/not given the go-ahead because the judge decided the issues he was contesting were too far in the past, and many of the points regarding closures, lockdowns, etc … had been addressed or were about to be shortly. Adding an extra month only allows that line of warped logic to creep back in. I’m hoping Simon and his team are wise to that now, and will focus on the absurd, non-sensible current (as possible) diktats!

135384 ▶▶ Paul M, replying to Paul M, 1, #54 of 1435 🔗

What a day. I’ve a sense the chickens are thinking of setting off to roost. 11 strong team but if one is on holiday then the hearing can be delayed. 2 weeks holiday, followed by 2 weeks quarantine – for each. They could easily drag this out for ever.

But… Carl Henegan is getting some good coverage so might save us from the Grinch

134073 Londo Mollari, replying to Londo Mollari, 38, #55 of 1435 🔗

Why would anyone pay out a huge sum of money to go to Cambridge Maximum Security Prison? The superstitious bs has infected all of our major institutions, the universities being the craziest of all.

134079 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Londo Mollari, 18, #56 of 1435 🔗

They still will though. If anything has been proven from the BLM protests there, it’s that the staff and students are woke and conformist.

134157 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to JohnB, 11, #57 of 1435 🔗

You are correct. I suspect the students and staff will fully support the tough measures and many will want to go much further.

I would be surprised if the they make it to winter before the University term is suspended and everyone is sent home.

134300 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JohnB, 3, #58 of 1435 🔗

Not necessarily ‘woke’ themselves but few would wish to put their head above the parapet in the currently atmosphere.
Academia is conquered by the Frankfurt School and won’t change anytime soon.

134146 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Londo Mollari, 8, #59 of 1435 🔗

Bit tricky if you’ve worked really hard to get a Cambridge place and Trinity to boot. If you don’t take it (deferment won’t be on the cards) what do you do?

134201 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to arfurmo, 1, #60 of 1435 🔗

Such a dilemma!

134222 ▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to arfurmo, 3, #61 of 1435 🔗

Live in digs outside the college environment.

134200 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Londo Mollari, 2, #62 of 1435 🔗

It’s the same amout (£9,250/year for tuition) to go somewhere less exalted too. Merit is what determines UK admissions unlike USA. It’s the top (or close to, depending on where you look) university in the world.

134247 ▶▶ NonCompliant, replying to Londo Mollari, 1, #63 of 1435 🔗

I’d have told my kids to bail and come on home, i’ll help pay this years fees, fuck em.

134296 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Londo Mollari, 1, #64 of 1435 🔗

My local university has apparently sourced enough kit to test every student weekly for the foreseeable future.

134350 ▶▶ sam, replying to Londo Mollari, 5, #65 of 1435 🔗

don’t go to university. Its an indoctrination camp to turn out good little commies

134611 ▶▶ annie, replying to Londo Mollari, 4, #66 of 1435 🔗

I’m thinking of sending back my degree certificates. Being a Cambridge graduate is nothing to be proud of any more.

134074 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 29, #67 of 1435 🔗

My GP Surgery texted me about my annual COPD assmar review.
This is to take place over the telephone.
The main parts of the review are blood pressure and lung capacity tests.
Not sure how that’s going to work on the phone.

134086 ▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to karenovirus, 12, #68 of 1435 🔗

That will bring a whole new meaning for heavy breathing down the telephone!

134110 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to karenovirus, 34, #69 of 1435 🔗

“Inhale as much air as you can, hold your breath and then we’ll count how long it is before it is before we hear the receiver drop to the floor.”

134141 ▶▶▶ Braveheart, replying to OKUK, 8, #70 of 1435 🔗

That’s genuinely the first proper laugh I’ve had in days! 🤣 🤣

134227 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to OKUK, 6, #71 of 1435 🔗

“blow up a balloon whilst looking in a mirror and tell me if your eyes bulge or your veins start to stand out… and if you faint can you let out a squeal or fall on something noisy so i can tell”.

134125 ▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to karenovirus, 4, #72 of 1435 🔗

Telepathy maybe?

134309 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 2, #73 of 1435 🔗

I thought perhaps they had a special app to turn my phone into a stethoscope.

134311 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to karenovirus, 2, #74 of 1435 🔗

If it is anything lie my last checkup, suddenly some routine things become unimportant. However they were happy to accept that my bathroom scales were good enough for the weight record!

134352 ▶▶ sam, replying to karenovirus, 3, #75 of 1435 🔗

hopefully he is also testing your vit D levels?? Vit D is essential for lung health

134392 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to sam, #76 of 1435 🔗

I rely on lots of sunshine, always have

Doc no longer gives me lectures on smoking since I gave him a very robust response some years ago.

134418 ▶▶ Suzyv, replying to karenovirus, 3, #77 of 1435 🔗

If it were me I’d get back to them and tell that you insist on a face to face. It’s even been in the media hasn’t it that they required legally under contract law to see face to face. Just mention that to the telephone triage who seem to be fending off as many people as they can. Half an hour ago I just spotted my GP out jogging locally when I know that ordinarily she works at this time..

134427 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Suzyv, 4, #78 of 1435 🔗

Except it was Matt Hancock himself who said that telephone or remote consultations would continue for GPs even after CV19 was gone.

134496 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Lms23, #79 of 1435 🔗

Yes that was about 2 weeks ago got himself specially interviewed and everything.

134500 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Suzyv, #80 of 1435 🔗

To be fair Susyv I don’t take the live ones too seriously, just go along to look willing

134554 ▶▶ FenTyger, replying to karenovirus, 1, #81 of 1435 🔗

I had Asthma review by phone two weeks ago. Had a “Peak flow meter” to do my own lung capacity test (sent when I had bad breathing problems in late Feb……). Blood pressure I don’t know (I have my own monitor).

134617 ▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 4, #82 of 1435 🔗

Will it help them if you clap loudly?

135155 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to karenovirus, 1, #83 of 1435 🔗

Yes, it is now normal for our doctors to ask you to take your own blood pressure readings and send them by text; after all as they will tell you, the monitors only cost about £30.

135197 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to karenovirus, 1, #84 of 1435 🔗

ESP????

135214 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to karenovirus, 2, #85 of 1435 🔗

What a pathetic situation we are in.

I want to be a doctor because I want to help people be healthy after the legal profession, it is the best paid profession.

134075 Londo Mollari, 32, #86 of 1435 🔗

Thanks to Toby for all his hard work. I feared he had given up in despair at recent developments.

134076 ViralSputum, replying to ViralSputum, 10, #87 of 1435 🔗

The reason for the big increase in demand is that the case definition is so broad and flimsy that it captures huge numbers of people. All you need is either a fever, a cough, or loss of smell/taste, and you are supposed to get a test. With the schools going back and enforcing this rule strictly (I think that’s the key point) the demand shot up as any child with a cough now has to be off school and tested. The case definition needs to be tightened up so you need a cough AND a fever, for example.

134100 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to ViralSputum, 4, #88 of 1435 🔗

The specificity of temperature for CoViD19 is around 10% (maybe too generous)
The specificity of cough for CoViD19 is around 20% (ditto) depends on the nature of the cough. One or two coughs every 15 minutes does not a persistent cough make.
The specificity of temperature plus cough is still probably less than 50%
These are rough figures based on differential diagnoses for each of the parameters.

134102 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to ViralSputum, 4, #89 of 1435 🔗

Agree

Copied from yesterday

No clear guidance from the health department to the schools. Only mentions high temperature, coughing, loss of taste and smell.

Questions to determine whether a child must be tested:

  1. what is the official definition of a high temperature? Has this exact number been distributed to schools?
  2. what is meant by coughing? cough every now and then, coughing without stop, hacking cough?
  3. if you have a blocked nose and you can’t smell well; does this count as loss of smell?
  4. do you have to display only the 1 symptom, display 2 symptoms or 3 symptoms?
  5. how do you make the distinction between a cold and the covid-19 virus?
  6. how do you make the distinction between flu and the covid-19 virus?
134113 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Victoria, 3, #90 of 1435 🔗

How long do they have to have the high temperature for? In my experience a child’s temperature can go up and down like a yo-yo.

134155 ▶▶▶▶ Hampshire Sceptic, replying to OKUK, 4, #91 of 1435 🔗

My 6 year old granddaughter was sent home from school with a high temperature. 24 hours later after a good night’s sleep and plenty of Calpol she was as right as rain. Even so the school would not allow her back until she had a negative Covid test (which of course it was).

134436 ▶▶▶▶▶ Catherine, replying to Hampshire Sceptic, 2, #92 of 1435 🔗

Ditto with my child. It’s a farce!

134168 ▶▶▶ ViralSputum, replying to Victoria, 2, #93 of 1435 🔗

exactly. even the word “cough” can have several different definitions.

134316 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Victoria, 3, #94 of 1435 🔗

Don’t forget kids, it’s expulsion for ‘Malicious Coughing’.

134452 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to karenovirus, 3, #95 of 1435 🔗

Or for telling any covid jokes.

(I could tell one, but you almost certainly wouldn’t get it …).

134843 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to JohnB, 2, #96 of 1435 🔗

And even if you did get it, you almost certainly wouldn’t realise it

134622 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 1, #97 of 1435 🔗

Ill-timed, like Kitty Bennet’s.

134322 ▶▶ Polemon2, replying to ViralSputum, 4, #98 of 1435 🔗

Interesting that that none of the worried test seekers I have seen on the TV vox-pops appear to have no signs of a cough. I suppose they might have a temperature but not too bad that they can’t get themselves on the TV.

134419 ▶▶ Richard, replying to ViralSputum, 2, #99 of 1435 🔗

Unfortunately it seems that the government have given the teaching unions and their activists in schools an open goal here to disrupt the re-opening schools drive. We will never see that data but suspect that this is almost entirely a state school issue not private – at my daughters private school no concerns at all about the back to school sniffles !!

134810 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Richard, 1, #100 of 1435 🔗

My older son went back to school (state primary) last Monday with a runny nose and a cough (caused by said runny nose). Nobody has said anything.

134083 Basileus, replying to Basileus, 13, #101 of 1435 🔗

This looks like being a dark day for the North East as new lockdown measures are announced. My activism has just moved up a gear.

134216 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Basileus, 6, #102 of 1435 🔗

Has there been much in the way of resistance to the lockdown measures in the North East? I remember seeing some coverage of a small anti-lockdown protest in Newcastle a few weeks ago but given the devastating poverty and unemployment heading to the region if this continues I would hope for more.

134440 ▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to Darryl, 5, #103 of 1435 🔗

Nothing organised as far as I am aware, but almost everyone I speak with has had enough. The problem is they are reluctant to take any action. My position is to push against the rules as hard as possible and to try to spread the word.

134630 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Basileus, 1, #104 of 1435 🔗

Go it, rex et basileus!!

134085 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 9, #105 of 1435 🔗

“I’ve been told by another insider I respect that Chris Whitty does not support a 2 week lockdown, so I’m pleased to correct the record.”

Disgraceful fearmongering and gossip.

134359 ▶▶ Carlo, replying to hotrod, 3, #106 of 1435 🔗

It is the Imperial College Gates-funded twats who are pushing it.

134094 Philip F, replying to Philip F, 7, #107 of 1435 🔗

Morning, lockdown friends – it feels like that, doesn’t it?

Sorry to be uninformed, but could somebody please explain what is meant by “cycle thresholds” when it comes to the testing used to detect CV19? I understand that the test is regarded as being over-sensitive with “too many cycles” employed, but I’ve never seen it explained what that means exactly. And it feels like the over-sensitivity of the test is absolutely crucial and should be fully understood.
Thanks

134107 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Philip F, 3, #108 of 1435 🔗

every cycle (actually a temperature cycle) doubles the amount of dna of your target (ie a section of the virus). if you do too many cycles you get a positive result for the tiniest amount of dna which could have come from anywhere (ie contaminant). getting a positive result from low number of cycles means there is a lot of the virus. testing companies will use as high number of cycles as they can get away with

134109 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Philip F, 5, #109 of 1435 🔗

The RT-PCR Test converts viral RNA into DNA. The DNA is then split into two strands and duplicated. After the initial step there are 2 strands. After the next step there are 4 and so on. After 10 steps there are 1024 strands. After 20 there are over a million. After 30 steps there are over a billion. And after 40 there are a trillion. This is for every single strand of RNA in the original sample.

134233 ▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to p02099003, 2, #110 of 1435 🔗

Is it also that the recommended number of cycles is around 35, above that, for the reasons you have stated, false positives are more likely. I read the other day the UK is using 45 cycles, not sure of the validity of that statement. There is also the issue that different countries are using different number of cycles, so no uniformity, as was similar in the criteria for recording CV19 deaths.

134332 ▶▶▶▶ NickR, replying to Nsklent, 2, #111 of 1435 🔗

Here’s the relevant section from the NHS guidance on Covid testing protocol.
Essentially, tests below a Ct value of 40 are accepted as valid. 40Ct or above needs validation, whether a second positive test with a Ct of 40 constitutes validation I don’t know. My understanding is the acceptable Ct value in many countries is lower & naturally the higher the Ct value the greater the proportion of false positives. There is no published recommended Ct number so I guess consistency is a problem as is repeatability.

Where Ct values are below an agreed value (based on analysis of proficiency testing performance and other local testing data) with satisfactory quality control parameters, including internal control performance, the result is considered valid and should be telephoned and a report issued as a final result. Any such positive result will be recorded as ‘confirmed’ for public health reporting purposes and will be notifiable under recent legislation. Results where:
• the Ct value is ≥ 40 and/or
• there is an abnormal assay curve and/or
• the clinical context makes the positive result highly unexpected should be considered interim or held until reviewed by a laboratory clinician.
https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/wp-content/uploads/sites/52/2020/03/guidance-and-sop-covid-19-virus-testing-in-nhs-laboratories-v1.pdf

134276 ▶▶ Jill, replying to Philip F, 1, #112 of 1435 🔗

The best description of this is from Mike Yeadon – former CEO of Pfizer and well worth following on Twitter. He did an interview on Talk Radio explaining this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WapjYL1Wnfw

134095 JustMe, replying to JustMe, 7, #113 of 1435 🔗

Is there another (better) word that could be used instead of ‘cases’?
To me the word ‘cases’ signifies people needing treatment. It is clear that nearly all of these reported numbers are people who DO NOT nead treating for anything.

134103 ▶▶ Basileus, replying to JustMe, 6, #114 of 1435 🔗

Yes, fairly meaningless positive test results.

Positive test results for the presence of the virus cannot be described as ‘cases’. In medicine a case requires the presence of symptoms and the vast majority of those who test positive are asymptomatic and will remain so.

134112 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Basileus, 7, #115 of 1435 🔗

DHSC admitted in reply to Awkward Git’s FOI, that the test does not indicate the presence of disease and must be taken in context of symptoms!

134106 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to JustMe, 4, #116 of 1435 🔗

They are simply positive test results

134134 ▶▶▶ David, replying to Charlie Blue, 4, #117 of 1435 🔗

Positive or False Positive test results..

134412 ▶▶▶▶ anon, replying to David, 2, #118 of 1435 🔗

So… Test results then

134116 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to JustMe, 3, #119 of 1435 🔗

Carl Heneghan (who else?) has done a paper about what constitutes a case, it seems to vary with each country.
In this country we have pillar 1 testing which is medically assessed ill people with a confirmatory test result, a fairly traditional case.
And pillar 2 testing which is the drive in test centre results which are not really cases more like a vacuous shopping bag.

134177 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to JustMe, 12, #120 of 1435 🔗

“To me the word ‘cases’ signifies people needing treatment.”

That is why the Establishment is using that term. It makes the situation look worse than it is, justifying further restrictions.

134223 ▶▶ mjr, replying to JustMe, 3, #121 of 1435 🔗

unfortunately we have been having this conversation for weeks now since the media attention focused on cases. we even had to chide Toby/Will who write the daily summary about referring to cases.
As we all know, these are “tests where a positive is indicated” . As you say, “case” has implications. Most people will infer from this term that it refers to people who are ill with covid. Which they are not but it continues the scare tactics.

134345 ▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to mjr, 1, #122 of 1435 🔗

they’ve switched again-just listened to BBC London announcing there have been 18k positive tests- that’s a big increase- turns out this relates to a week not a day

134817 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to mjr, 1, #123 of 1435 🔗

I like “tests where a positive is indicated.” Does away with the suggestion that a positive test actually means an infection.

134320 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JustMe, 1, #124 of 1435 🔗

The BBCs preferred alternative is ‘infected’.

134096 Gman, replying to Gman, 82, #125 of 1435 🔗

I just wanted to say a huge thank you to Toby for setting up this site and for the many people who help to collate the information and post in the comments. Without it I am not sure that I would have been able to survive through the last 6 months.

At the beginning I felt like I was watching a school bus driving full throttle towards the edge of a cliff and the driver couldn’t hear my screams. After I found this site I realised I wasn’t going crazy living in some kind of parallel universe – there were lots of people screaming at the bus.

Whilst I initially feel down when I see news of second lock downs, curfews etc We have to remember that the tide is turning and the more restrictions that come in the more angry people become (out of 100 friends, family & acquaintances I now know of only 1 now who is pro lock down and he is in a cushy government job loving “working” from home.)

So bring it on, eventually the bus driver wont be able to drive off the cliff as there will be millions of people standing in his way.

134114 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Gman, 35, #126 of 1435 🔗

And this is why this site is great. On a day when you feel like there is just no hope, you’ll read a post like this and your spirits are lifted a bit.

134192 ▶▶ Ian, replying to Gman, 26, #127 of 1435 🔗

I agree. I have been in very dark places in the last 7 months, but, and I don’t know why, I do think we are nearing the end now. More and more people are seeing through this and the more the government impose pointless restrictions on every day life, the more people question. It will take one big event – perhaps a high level principled resignation (Sunak?) or a mainstream paper to do a thorough piece of investigative journalism – for the pack of cards to collapse. I naturally tend to pessimism, I don’t really know what is driving my more positive outlook, I just sense a change.

134303 ▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Gman, 5, #129 of 1435 🔗

Out of curiosity, how many of the hundred were sceptical to start with? The size of the shift is, after all, the significant variable.

134395 ▶▶▶ Gman, replying to Andrew Fish, 11, #130 of 1435 🔗

I would say none to start with – 50% were sceptical by July and all are now (apart from the government worker.) However most still toe the line for an easy life with regards masks etc. The anger is growing though and i don’t think it will be long before people decide that they have had enough and stuff the rules.

134437 ▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Gman, 4, #131 of 1435 🔗

That’s a positive sign, then. If that’s replicated across the country we may be reaching some kind of tipping point.

135235 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lili, replying to Andrew Fish, 2, #132 of 1435 🔗

I think we are, too. My one concern is that, far from giving up whatever it is they’re doing, the government will go full throttle Stasi, but by then I think people will put up a fight – I know I will.

135511 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Lili, #133 of 1435 🔗

Yes indeed, the government’s real agenda has little to with the ephemeral coronavirus. Like some others, the UK government has been thoroughly corrupted by a mega rich vaccine centric philanthro-capitalist and it is now waging a genocidal war which is designed to bring about a cull most of its own people.

134616 ▶▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to Andrew Fish, 13, #134 of 1435 🔗

I was scared at first as I’m vulnerable but I was outraged from day one at the ban on seeing friends or being outside as much as you wished. I had still been seeing my friends and my helpers came round in March and I continued to go to church. Come lockdown, church closed and my helpers abandoned me. I tore up “Stay at home” posters and never joined the clapping as it seemed like a display in a totalitarian state.

135236 ▶▶▶▶ Lili, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 1, #135 of 1435 🔗

Good for you. I hope your health is better. Anger can sometimes be a good medicine.

135390 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Andrew Fish, 1, #136 of 1435 🔗

I was from the word go. I couldn’t believe the Govt ordered the lockdown. But that was because in the lead-up I read all the stuff about every other pandemic and about vaccine efficiency (it’s just one of the tools in the box) and also planning for pandemics which said lockdown should not be an option.

134494 ▶▶ GLT, replying to Gman, 4, #138 of 1435 🔗

I’m sure that’s part of the problem…the government are surrounded entirely by people in ‘cushy’ government jobs.

134635 ▶▶ annie, replying to Gman, 3, #139 of 1435 🔗

That’s the spirit.
Come in, folks, no more moaning ‘I despair’!

135175 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to Gman, 4, #140 of 1435 🔗

This site has kept me sane! All the information we need to break down the fear-mongering reporting and crunch the numbers is there, together with a round up of all sorts sceptics stories, combined with the most important thing, humour! Thanks, Toby, for all your hard work.

135203 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Gman, 1, #141 of 1435 🔗

Hear, hear!! I discovered this site by accident and since then its been my go to for sanity and rationality. I’ve also been heartened by the support I’ve received here as well as the advice, laughter and general chit-chat that has helped me keep going.

Thanks to Toby and to everyone here!!!

135233 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Gman, 1, #142 of 1435 🔗

That’s good to hear. Finding fellow sceptics – or level headed normal people, as I call them – has also saved my sanity.

134098 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 43, #143 of 1435 🔗

Six months of lockdown now and still I don’t know anyone who has had COVID-19. I am still asking friends and people at all the businesses I carry out work for and none of them know of any cases either.

Seems truly bizarre when compared to the Swine Flu in 2009. I knew loads back then with a lot of people ill for a few weeks and having to take Tamiflu. I remember we couldn’t field one of the teams for about a month at the cricket club I played for because players either had it or were still recovering, and this time we’ve had no players catch COVID which it meant to be this highly contagious virus which makes people really ill.

It just does not add up at all!

134122 ▶▶ Arnie, replying to JohnB, 27, #144 of 1435 🔗

And all the testing stations are empty too… Hmm. And now lots of the testing stations are banning photography too… Even more hmm! Are we being lied to maybe?… Hmm!

134131 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Arnie, 8, #145 of 1435 🔗

They’ve always banned photography. There has been “No Filming” at the sites since the first ones were established. Some good videos on YouTube of people auditing the sites where there is no people testing or the sites which are meant to be active aren’t even built, the auditors are normally accosted by Army personnel telling them they can’t film even though they’re stood on private land.

134139 ▶▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to JohnB, 1, #146 of 1435 🔗

Hi Skipper, thanks for the heads up. I stand corrected. Regards, Arnie.

134132 ▶▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to Arnie, 3, #147 of 1435 🔗

With respect to the Rhondda Cynon Taf martial law, I mean local lockdown, it appears that in recent days some 300 people turned up from England for testing.

134144 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Londo Mollari, 14, #148 of 1435 🔗

Doncaster Racecourse have now confirmed that the story about the rugby club attending the racecourse last week was all lies. It’s an absolute joke, except it isn’t funny.

134363 ▶▶▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to JohnB, 2, #149 of 1435 🔗

we’ll see more of this-like Putin’s daughter dying after taking the Russian vaccine

134401 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JohnB, 4, #150 of 1435 🔗

Frazer Nelson told Jeremy Vine that the story of them stopping off at every pub on the way back was total rubbish.

134148 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Londo Mollari, 8, #151 of 1435 🔗

I’ve read yesterday that MP’s had brought up that people are giving false postcodes so that they can get a test, and thus if tested positive it inflates that postcodes figures. So, how true are the actual figures for these areas that are being locked down?

134173 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to JohnB, 5, #152 of 1435 🔗

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/15/uk-families-having-to-hack-system-to-get-coronavirus-test
Who knows, but looks as if giving a Scottish postcode gets you a test, so Scots results for Pillar 2 tests will be even more rubbish than previously realised.
You have to wonder what possesses some of the people interviewed. Traipse a sick child on a 104 mile round trip to get them tested for a cold?? Please.

134837 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to JohnB, 2, #153 of 1435 🔗

I don’t understand the point of that, given the results take a while to process. “Yes please! I would like a cotton bud shoved so far up my nose that it tickles my thalamus, but I have no interest in knowing the results of the test”

134853 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Hannahbanana, replying to matt, 2, #154 of 1435 🔗

I believe the results are sent electronically, so the validity of the persons address/postcode will be irrelevant. Horrific for people within the region of a test centre though, if people are fraudulently claiming to be from somewhere to snag a test, if it predisposes the area to lockdown.

134217 ▶▶▶ philburton, replying to Arnie, 3, #155 of 1435 🔗

Anecdotal I know, but the 2 testing stations I’ve been past have always been empty, or maybe 1 car.

134280 ▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to philburton, 7, #156 of 1435 🔗

The testing station at Bidston Moss in the Wirral (twinned with Eyam since the first quarantinees were brought here) was empty. Bed-wetting friends took their daughter to have a test as (wait for it) she had a cold at five years old and were invited straight in because they had nothing to do.

134405 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to philburton, 5, #157 of 1435 🔗

But we have heard the same from many posters including me, yesterday a testing station nurse called into Jeremy Vines show and said the same.

It’s one huge pack of lies intended to justify the creeping second lockdown that we are in the beginning of.

134184 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to JohnB, 10, #158 of 1435 🔗

I have a guy in doing some work for me at the moment whose mother sadly passed from Covid back in June. He couldn’t go anywhere near her throughout the several weeks she was isolated in hospital on oxygen. He’s a really nice guy, but grief stricken.

Unsurprisingly he’s a fan of masks and hoping for a vaccine.

We have to remember there are a lot of people who have suddenly lost people they weren’t expecting, and in the most horrendous circumstances. The grief is real.

134195 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Lucan Grey, 13, #159 of 1435 🔗

The horrendous circumstances were partly of the government’s making

134203 ▶▶▶ MDH, replying to Lucan Grey, 19, #160 of 1435 🔗

Indeed. But grief – or any other emotion – cannot be used to shut down debate. We are being governed not by logic or reason, but by whatever is trending on social media.

134283 ▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to MDH, 8, #161 of 1435 🔗

…and the hand-wringing. You must never forget the hand-wringing. It’s the most important part of their game, only surpassed by the phrase “If it saves the life of one person…”

134278 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Lucan Grey, 4, #162 of 1435 🔗

Of or With though? And did she have any other underlying illness. People seem to have very ill family members who have died but seem to want the crutch of “it was COVID that did it guv” so they can play the victim/sympathy card.

134410 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JohnB, 4, #163 of 1435 🔗

Did you see.my post yesterday about R2 doctor Sarah Jarvis explaing how important the difference was between With and Of, in that case pancreatic cancer?

134476 ▶▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to karenovirus, 6, #164 of 1435 🔗

Most men who make it through to old age tend to have prostate cancer. However, it isn’t usually the cause of the death. If we handled prostate cancer (phrasing that carefully) in the same way as Covid, then it would be considered to be a national crisis – assuming, that is, that the current political environment didn’t dismiss any problem which affected men.

134408 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Lucan Grey, 5, #165 of 1435 🔗

Loss of your mum can indeed be devastating even if not actually a surprise, personal experience.

134101 mattghg, replying to mattghg, 10, #166 of 1435 🔗

If they don’t make this supposedly voluntary “commitment”, they lose their place at Cambridge.

Wait wait wait. They lose their place at Cambridge? The passage you quoted suggests they lose their place *in college accommodation*. There’s a BIG difference!

134281 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to mattghg, 1, #167 of 1435 🔗

I think getting non college accommodation in Cambridge at short notice is going to be really hard and more expensive.

134336 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to arfurmo, #168 of 1435 🔗

No doubt, but that’s not the same as “los[ing] their place at Cambridge”!

134645 ▶▶ annie, replying to mattghg, 2, #169 of 1435 🔗

Most, if not all, colleges insist on your living in College in your first year.
Even if you didn’t, they’d still have removed everything that used to make a Cambridge education such a wonderful experience.

134105 stewart, replying to stewart, 25, #170 of 1435 🔗

Lockdowns and masks are like being asked to drink bleach to cure a bad tummy.

Bleach kills germs, a bad tummy is caused by bad germs, so drink bleach.

If the result is an even worse tummy, the solution is to drink even more bleach.

134653 ▶▶ annie, replying to stewart, 3, #171 of 1435 🔗

Or like the old bleed-and-purge medicine. If it doesn’t work the first time, carry on until you’ve killed the patient.
Anybody else familiar with Molière’s Le Malade imaginaire ?

134852 ▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to stewart, 2, #172 of 1435 🔗

Ah you forgot the last step – must repeatedly dilute the bleach in water until it’s undetectable and then it’ll be so potent it cures you.

135098 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to SweetBabyCheeses, 1, #173 of 1435 🔗

A homeopathic remedy is not simply diluted. If you don’t know anything about it, please don’t criticise!

I have several homeopathics in my first aid kit and find them extremely effective.

134108 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 16, #174 of 1435 🔗

Shameless re-post of mine and Arnie’s conversation just now on yesterday’s page, as I think it’s worth it:

Arnie :

Terrorism is illegal in the UK. Unless of course it’s done by the government.
Boris & his chum ‘Cock have killed more people in ONE DAY than the islamic terrorists have managed altogether. Let that sink in.
How long before the deaths are more than World War Two?
At what stage will the public realise that being ‘saved to death’ is not the answer?
Rage Against the Machine? You bet! The Government machine is literally butchering our people in plain sight while calmly, reasonably, and totally psychotically telling us that they are ‘saving’ us from covid.
When will our people wake up? Will they ever? Perhaps they deserve this?..

Sam Vimes :

Absolutely, Arnie. Posted this from CPS website before:

Terrorism is the use or threat of action, both in and outside of the UK, designed to influence any international government organisation or to intimidate the public . It must also be for the purpose of advancing a political, religious, racial or ideological cause.
Examples include:

  • serious violence against a person or damage to property,
  • endangering a person’s life (other than that of the person committing the action) ,
  • creating a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public
134120 ▶▶ Arnie, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #175 of 1435 🔗

Thanks for the thumbs up Sam! Keep fighting the good fight. Cheers, Arnie.

134137 ▶▶ anon, replying to Sam Vimes, 4, #176 of 1435 🔗

Can we charge alexander and hancock under the terrorism act then?

134460 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Sam Vimes, #177 of 1435 🔗

Bloke on Radio 2 NEWS Monday
“people who break lockdown rules are like terrorists, like walking about with a machine gun, they need treating like terrorists “

134656 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, #178 of 1435 🔗

So where’s my machine gun?

134632 ▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #179 of 1435 🔗

And don’t forget the Tories have already have had over 100,000 excess deaths due to their austerity policies. Add in the lockdown deaths and the figures are even more horrendous. The Government does not value human life. They should be in the dock, charged with corporate manslaughter.

134117 DomW, replying to DomW, 50, #180 of 1435 🔗

One more face freed, at least for this morning.

On my walk in the park, I saw a gentleman sporting full muzzle with no-one around him. I called over and nicely asked him why he was earing a mask. “Because everyone says we’re supposed to”. I smiled and did my best to engage with him and before long heard “I’ll take it off then”, which he did.

He wasn’t a “bedwetter” just someone who seemed genuinely confused about what was the right thing to do, so I gave him a small slip of paper on which I’ve printed out links to this website, Keep Britain Free and the nomasks.info website.

He may revert back but he at least now has access to more balanced information.

Keep fighting friends, but wherever possible do it with a smile 🙂

134370 ▶▶ sam, replying to DomW, 4, #181 of 1435 🔗

well done

134118 BTLnewbie, replying to BTLnewbie, 12, #182 of 1435 🔗

We shouldn’t ignore inconvenient statistics, or we will be branded “Covid deniers”.
Daily hospitalisations in England have risen from a 50-70 band at the start of September to a 130-160 band now, and the trend is rising steeply.
The % of P1 and P2 tests that are +ve has risen from around 0.8% to around 1.5% in the same period.
These are inconvenient truths, backed up by David Paton’s stats at:
https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern/status/1305889630353416192 (linked yesterday) but they can’t be ignored.
Anecdotally, I hear that the ICU in one of the main Birmingham hospitals has recently seen a very steep increase in Covid-19 patients. The latest stats I can find on this date back to 3 September here:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/statistical-work-areas/covid-19-hospital-activity/
which indicates no increase at all. Those who have access to more current data may be able to bear out the rumour.
I don’t dispute that:
– the overall numbers are vanishingly small compared to when we had a problem
– the reaction – lockdown – is hugely disproportionate
– Government are prepared to lie to us when it suits their purpose
But we need to be aware that there is an increase in hospitalisations, which has always been a key metric for me.

134126 ▶▶ Liam, replying to BTLnewbie, #183 of 1435 🔗

“Page doesn’t exist”? (The first link).

134129 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to BTLnewbie, 5, #185 of 1435 🔗

Fair comment. I’m not expecting a second wave but … uh … a ripple? In a way it would be surprising if there *wasn’t* a slight increase in hospitalisations for *all* respiratory diseases at this time of year. Carl Henegan made that point in his recent Spectator article .

134515 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to mattghg, 1, #186 of 1435 🔗

Bronchial tract infections caused by mask/petri dishes.

134154 ▶▶ Motke, replying to BTLnewbie, 1, #187 of 1435 🔗

One of my best friends is a consultant in a major London hospital. He says covid-19 admissions are increasing and we could be heading for another full lockdown soon. I hope he’s wrong and just being hysterical.

134163 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to BTLnewbie, 5, #188 of 1435 🔗

The UK NHS data reported on this site;
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/healthcare
Shows 901 people currently in hospital with Covid 19
and 115 on ventilators.
Figures on admissions needs to be offset against discharges and so really it is the figure of current hospital cases that is relevant, this has gone up a bit, down a bit, considering we have a population of 66.65 million the numbers in hospital are small. And despite media hysteria do not seem to be going up very dramatically.

134187 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Steve Martindale, 5, #189 of 1435 🔗

Dear NHS why are 115 Covid patients on ventilators? Ventilators kill Covid patients, or is it that they are on ventilators for other illnesses?

134249 ▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to Steve Martindale, 5, #190 of 1435 🔗

But are people in hospital or ventilated because of and only due to Covid, or they have another condition that required hospitalization and happen to test positive. There needs to be a distinction.

134518 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Nsklent, 2, #191 of 1435 🔗

Ventilators screw Covid patients kidneys so they got sent to dialysis wards to kill the regulars in there.

134279 ▶▶▶ BTLnewbie, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #192 of 1435 🔗

Looking at those stats, it’s 472 in hospital with Covid in England on 1 Sept rising steadily to 894 on 16 Sept.
Cause for concern and ties in with Motke’s comment from his London doctor friend.

134376 ▶▶▶ sam, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #193 of 1435 🔗

so the 115 on ventilators will probably not see the light of day

134164 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to BTLnewbie, 30, #194 of 1435 🔗

I think you are correct that we are seeing an increase in hospitalisations/ICU and deaths. Although some may still be not true CLI(Covid like illness) most are. It is correct that there are many false positive, asymptomatic etc but this is the repressed first wave of the disastrous lockdown, which comes back every time you open up. This is happening in almost every country in Europe. The more severe lockdown the higher current peak.

Look at Spain with almost a military lockdown and mask fanatics and the enormous spike.Many asymptomatic but still genuine cases dripping in to hospitals and ICU. France, severe lockdown and mask fanatics and now a huge rise. Belgium and Greece the same pattern.
Personally, I think masks facilitate spread and looking at all countries with mask show the same pattern. But it is not only a problem with the lockdown which is obviously not working but also SD has been discussed as a problem. This disease with almost 100 times more severe in the elderly compared to those below 65, might be the worst example of trying to use social distancing of younger people to protect the elderly. There are already some speculating that this SD might be a disaster for a disease which affect so distinctly the elderly. The alternative is shielding the elderly and stop SD in the younger. But to take that step you must philosophically accept that we are past suppression of the virus. The medical establishment, BMA ,Lancet etc are still not on board.

134270 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to swedenborg, 1, #195 of 1435 🔗

Great post.

134346 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to swedenborg, 10, #196 of 1435 🔗

Distancing measures, if indeed they do limit transmissions, simultaneously maintain a greater degree of population susceptibility.

It was probably wise for those in the well-defined vulnerable groups to exercise a degree of voluntary self-isolation in the early weeks of the outbreak. (And it was also when care homes and nursing homes needed and did not get, a guaranteed supply of PPE…)

But at the same time, the low-risk majority of the population should have been allowed or even encouraged to circulate normally in society, thus facilitating low-risk viral transmission, allowing for a gradual mutational shift to a low virulence virus phenotype. This process has happened in the countries that maintained social openness, most efficiently in Sweden, because it has been allowed to happen, whether or not that outcome was intentionally sought.

‘Suppression’ or ‘elimination’ strategies are doomed to failure, because they simply maintain susceptibility and a high level of collective vulnerability, to a virus that will has had less opportunity to evolve to a reduced virulence phenotype.

And it is why New Zealand and the state of Victoria in Australia remain in the most vulnerable and parlous situation, as the authorities double down on counter-productive measures (destroying fundamental civil liberties and decimating their economies into the bargain), which indefinitely spin out the potential for highly symptomatic viral spread.

But Dan and Jacinda will never see this, until they start taking advice from virologists and epidemiologists, who actually understand this.

134501 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Kevin 2, 2, #197 of 1435 🔗

It has crossed my mind that they may be hyper sensitive about the potential for CV19 to run riot through their Maori and aboriginal populations, hence the draconian measures?

134539 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Bruno, 2, #198 of 1435 🔗

In what sense are those populations any different? If they have a greater incidence of obesity, diabetes, heart disease, etc. then yes those individuals with those pre-disposing prognostic factors will be at greater risk. But so are the elderly! The answer is to get your population of people who are at minimal risk of symptomatic illness out and about, allowing for greater transmission!
That, in time, will help the vunerable subgroups.

It’s counter-intuitive to some, and the very thought of it is not to be entertained by public health officials, who will always stick to the; ‘until we have a vaccine’ mantra.

But it is what works. As the real world evidence shows us.

Given enough time and physical isolation, the NZ population will eventually come to have an element of the characteristic vulnerabilities of an isolated Amazonian jungle tribe.

Just my opinion!

134371 ▶▶▶ snippet, replying to swedenborg, 1, #199 of 1435 🔗

There is increasing support in the literature for this approach:

https://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/09/17/latest-news-137/#comment-134158

134171 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to BTLnewbie, 8, #200 of 1435 🔗

We absolutely shouldn’t ignore any relevant information. I think the context is everything. At what point did those patients in ICU test positive and where did they contract the virus – in hospital, in the community or a care setting? What was the reason for their initial admission to hospital? Age and underlying conditions remain important if we are to understand what a proportionate and likely effective response to the data is. Is there an increase in hospitalisations for patients suffering as a result of other respiratory conditions?

134334 ▶▶ snippet, replying to BTLnewbie, #201 of 1435 🔗

Are there age-category numbers for hospitalisations?

https://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/09/17/latest-news-137/#comment-134158

134361 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to BTLnewbie, #202 of 1435 🔗

Anecdotally, I hear that the ICU in one of the main Birmingham hospitals has recently seen a very steep increase in Covid-19 patients.”

Did they present early in the infection?
https://www.facebook.com/CraigKellyMP/videos/313190119942539/

134373 ▶▶ sam, replying to BTLnewbie, 5, #203 of 1435 🔗

a friend went to London hospital very ill from food poisoning and was given an MRI scan and a neck xray and they tried to forcible admit her. They didn’t treat her for the food poisoning. She managed to escape, very fearful!

134406 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to sam, 4, #204 of 1435 🔗

Good for her.

Activated charcoal will assist with food poisoning

134374 ▶▶ MDH, replying to BTLnewbie, 6, #205 of 1435 🔗

Surely these are only inconvenient in the context of a “zero Covid” policy? Otherwise, they’re pretty much par for the course as the seasons change and we move into winter. As I’ve said to friends recently, until the park outside my house is dug up for a mass grave, I will consider the current “policies” ludicrously disproportionate.

134513 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to BTLnewbie, 2, #206 of 1435 🔗

Do recall when hospital mortality fell from 6% to 0.25(?)% some months back ?

Was Covid less serious? Miracle Cure?
No, they were hospitalising people unnecessarily to bump up the numbers until they got caught out on that lie, of that among many.

134119 James Marker, 15, #207 of 1435 🔗

Has anyone been watching ITN’s News at Ten these last few nights? Tom Bradby and crew surely take the biscuit for bedwetters of the week.  The selective reporting and deliberate scaremongering destroys any claim these people may make to objective and impartial journalism. A claim which is further undermined by Robert Peston’s strange tics and vocal mannerisms, which have always marked him out as a clown. But it’s not funny: the politicking of these people is potentially destroying the lives of tens of thousands of others (through delayed cancer treatment) as well as the well-being and livelihoods of hundreds of thousands more.

134121 Liam, replying to Liam, 18, #208 of 1435 🔗

Thinking back to when my children were young, I can barely remember a week going by before the age of about six when at least one of them didn’t have a runny nose, a cough, a sore throat or a temperature.

134208 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Liam, 2, #209 of 1435 🔗

Exactly our experience with grandchildren.

134213 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Liam, 6, #210 of 1435 🔗

That is because the defence mechanism in children is based on the innate system including the mucosa. A sore throat indicates that T cells are being manufactured to fight the virus. This is the real anomaly with SARS-CoV-2, young children appear to be immune from any signs of infection.

134128 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 20, #211 of 1435 🔗

What kind of idiot refers to a virus as “devilish”? The kind of idiot appointed by the Lancet to head up an investigative commission. It sometimes feels like we have stepped back several centuries in time.

134133 ▶▶ DRW, replying to OKUK, 5, #212 of 1435 🔗

The enlightenment seems to be over anyway.

134156 ▶▶ David, replying to OKUK, 3, #213 of 1435 🔗

This virus has been ascribed malevolent qualities throughout the fiasco.

134411 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to OKUK, 1, #214 of 1435 🔗

NLP ?

134130 tallandbald, replying to tallandbald, 13, #215 of 1435 🔗

Surely this is helping the tide turn.

134142 ▶▶ Philip F, replying to tallandbald, 5, #216 of 1435 🔗

I don’t know. I think the perception of a shambolic testing regime will be used an excuse by this risk adverse/cowardly administration to impose further lockdown measures.

134153 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to tallandbald, 11, #217 of 1435 🔗

These articles don’t support freedom and individual choice they merely support more draconian rules and regulations but want them carried out efficiently and brutally like in Melbourne.

I worry when I see these articles it means more punishment ahead shortly (if people keeping complying and being submissive).

134135 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 2, #218 of 1435 🔗

Think most of you will enjoy the ‘cover my arse’ article by Neil Ferguson as a response to this one “ Professor’s model for coronavirus predictions should not have been used” by Oonagh McDonald

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/professors-model-for-coronavirus-predictions-should-not-have-been-used-z7dqrkzzd

Neil Ferguson’s article on 16/9/20:
‘Lockdown sceptics are distorting the science’

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/df5b790a-f78f-11ea-ab7f-2d901a77c934?shareToken=050672496623579eaae6e56196320ba5 (some might be able to open it, share token)

I should clarify that I never predicted bird flu would kill 200 million people. Rather, I was part of a US research network that examined what might happen if bird flu mutated to become transmissible between people. “If” being the key word: no one can yet predict whether a specific animal virus will cause a pandemic.

Covid-19 models had to be developed in a matter of days with limited resources, either by developing code from scratch, or adapting pre-existing code.

The process of peer review – or exhaustive software verification – is impossible when models are being developed and applied on such timescales. Therefore, the UK government has a policy of never relying on a single analysis.

Many uncertainties remain, but there is overwhelming scientific consensus about the threat Covid-19 poses. Of course, a small minority of scientists hold dissenting views .

Infection levels in the UK are now back up to the levels of late February. ….. Rises in deaths will unfortunately follow in the coming weeks. But this is not a rerun of March.

Dramatically enhanced testing means we have much more data to track the epidemic and understand transmission patterns.

It is too early to assess whether introduction of the ‘rule of six” will be enough to prevent a second wave. If additional measures are needed, effectiveness at reducing transmission will need to be balanced against social and economic impacts.

134172 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Victoria, 4, #219 of 1435 🔗

Melinda Gates has said there needs to be a reckoning of social media companies for not doing enough to censor during this whole outrage.

[Gates said] “It may be time for a reckoning” with social media’s role in spreading disinformation, Melinda Gates told “Axios on HBO” Monday — but she doesn’t see that happening until after the pandemic ends.

https://www.axios.com/melinda-gates-coronavirus-social-media-aab1ded6-a7b1-4b2c-98dc-b8ee9728998c.html

134379 ▶▶▶ sam, replying to Basics, 3, #220 of 1435 🔗

its time for the reckoning with them!

134206 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Victoria, 1, #221 of 1435 🔗

I think that, with the verifiable nonsense of the last three paragraphs, Ferguson pigeon-holes himself. A computer nerd pretending to epidemiology.

It is interesting to compare his self-advertising utterances with real science :

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/pcr-positives-what-do-they-mean/

134243 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Victoria, 3, #222 of 1435 🔗

He is probably reading our website, and worrying about his reputation.

Ten years ago Judy Mikovits thought she had found a virus XMRV in CFS/ME patients. I was part of a very active online forum discussing these findings and other virology papers.

All the virologists used to read our website and posts! They found they had suddenly become famous (an unusual situation for a virologist) and used to enter into online discussions with us.

Don’t underestimate Prof Ferguson’s vanity. The internet has elided the distinction between these grades in society, and “scientists” want to know what the public think of them.

134544 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Victoria, 1, #223 of 1435 🔗

That article got punted at me in my goggle feed this morning, I thought bloody cheek taking our name in vain.

135474 ▶▶ ChrisDinBristol, replying to Victoria, #224 of 1435 🔗

Sounds like a climate scientist

134138 Jane in France, 7, #225 of 1435 🔗

I read an article this morning about a Japanese businessman who works in Shanghai and recently returned there from Japan. PCR test at the airport. Bundled into a bus and taken to a nearby hotel where he must stay till he gets the results. The Japanese journalist interviewing him was shocked – in Japan apparently you’re merely advised to quarantine and they leave the rest up to your good sense and public spirit. There was a picture of his miserable little room. The hotel brings him three meals a day though he has to make do with one towel. He doesn’t have a key so if he went out he wouldn’t be able to get back in. There is one window that looks out on a wall. He has to take his temperature twice a day and report to some anonymous centre via smartphone. The man tells himself that if this is what it takes he has to put up with it. It wasn’t clear whether he meant what it takes to beat the virus or what it takes to get into Shanghai. Either way it would be a lot harder for him psychologically if he started to question the wisdom of the authorities. Which is a bit like saying it’s easier to put up with solitary confinement in a tiny cell if you’ve learned to love Big Brother.

134140 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 9, #226 of 1435 🔗

Update from Doncaster racecourse on the Rugby club from Rhondda Cynon Taf:

Along with our colleagues at the British Horseracing Authority, we were pleased to receive confirmation this evening from Public Health Wales that this group did not, indeed, attend the pilot event at Doncaster Racecourse last week.

So, it is all lies but I see that the MSM is still pushing this story as being the reason for the lockdown in this area.

134571 ▶▶ leggy, replying to JohnB, 1, #227 of 1435 🔗
134143 RickH, replying to RickH, 14, #228 of 1435 🔗

I thought that my anger had peaked – or rather, was at maximum level and couldn’t go any higher.

But … this bunch of Cupid Stunts are way ahead in their ability to screw up intelligent life in this country. We had planned a weekend away in Northumberland, taking a chance to meet up with our daughter.

Then we have the jackboots marching on the North-East. Do we fancy a ‘break’ in no man’s land under curfew?

134165 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to RickH, 3, #229 of 1435 🔗

Fantastic place, Rick. We too, are holding off holiday plans, because you just don’t know what the bastards will do next, although “Figure out what makes sense, then do the opposite” is a pretty good predictor.

134196 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Sam Vimes, 2, #230 of 1435 🔗

That’s about right, Sam. But I reckon the CS’s manage to outpace even our worst imaginings in this f.ing dystopia.

We’re still debating what to do – and yes, I love Northumberland. But f.ing about with extra restrictions on pubs and restaurants isn’t an added attraction.

With this gullibility, it’s no wonder that fake Nigerians with money problems have managed to make a good living out of the Great British Public.

134559 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to RickH, 1, #231 of 1435 🔗

So having had their fun playing wakamole with European holidays they are now doing it to our own tourist industry.

134145 Philip F, 5, #232 of 1435 🔗

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGBEaYEtiys&feature=youtu.be

I know this has been posted a lot but it can’t be watched or disseminated enough. The truth getting out…in Australia at least.

134150 kh1485, 9, #233 of 1435 🔗

I hope some in the government are listening to talkRADIO right now. William Clouston of the SDP talking a lot of sense.

134151 Peter Thompson, replying to Peter Thompson, 36, #234 of 1435 🔗

Interesting few days on the front line. I havent seen many kids for months in the surgery as most were enjoying their 6 month holiday but since Monday that has changed. I am seeing lots .

All have been sent home from school and told to get ” checked out ” . I can offer no Covid tests so all I do is after seeing them , examining them and if I m in a good mood giving mum a script for calpol ( We are discouraged from this but honestly in terms of the government corona bill of £ 500 billion it is peanuts ) is tell mum to go on line and book a test. I would say that all the children I have seen this week have been healthy and well apart from a sniffly cold ; I think this insanity will last over the winter.

Saddest sight for me this week was a breathless elderly patient very unwell with a chronic respiratory problem who was masked up . I told her to please remove it but she felt she couldn’t because it was somehow protecting her . I suppose we have the media, Whitty , Hancock and Piers Morgan to blame for that.

Weirdest sight was a middle aged man wearing the cultish black mask with a frilly lacy edge . Just odd.

134159 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Peter Thompson, 15, #235 of 1435 🔗

Yes, Peter, the sheeple clearly think that their face covering is a gas mask, that protects *them*, even though the government advice says exactly the opposite. Witness people wearing them on empty streets or alone in their car. Of course, the government knew this would happen, but can always say “No, no, we didn’t say that”. Bastards.

134175 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Peter Thompson, 16, #236 of 1435 🔗

Interesting frontline report. Confirm the same information from all over Europe that school openings has as usual increased the spread of rhinoviruses enormously. Germany reporting a big spike in rhinoviruses and masks will of course not stop that but most likely increase the spread by contaminating fingers. The only evidence-based measure to stop spread of viruses and bacteria a bit is handwashing and we have known that for 150 years.

134328 ▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to swedenborg, 8, #237 of 1435 🔗

Absolutely! 100 percent! See the evidence from Singapore.

134570 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to swedenborg, 5, #238 of 1435 🔗

But people can’t see if you are a hand washer or not so that does not achieve the objective.

134202 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Peter Thompson, 8, #239 of 1435 🔗

I concur, children with sore throat and temperature, treat according to signs and symptoms. Advising not to get tested, but maybe worth staying off school for a few days to stop the school from throwing a strop and sending a load of kids home for a fortnight for no real reason.

134250 ▶▶▶ Peter Thompson, replying to p02099003, 6, #240 of 1435 🔗

Here is the NHS guidance . I direct mum s to this.

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/symptoms/coronavirus-in-children/

I advise taking the child away from school until better. I am not going to risk being denounced on social media in the local ” spotted ” group for not following the ” rules ” and ” endangering the lives of the children ” .

Working in the insane asylum I know the limits . If you don’t know the limits you end up without a job.

https://gript.ie/hse-sacks-doctor-for-saying-coronavirus-less-severe-than-the-flu/

134260 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Peter Thompson, 13, #241 of 1435 🔗

My 4-year-old started school a week ago last Monday. By the Wednesday she had a streaming cold. She was very keen to go to school so I told the assistant on the gate, expecting to be sent home and told to stay there for two weeks.

To my very pleasant surprise they said, nah, doesn’t matter, they’ve all got runny noses this time of year and we just get on with it. Sanity!

Now I’ve got the same cold, at the same time as having one of those random covid tests thingies come through the post. I wonder if they are worth anything on ebay.

134292 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Peter Thompson, 1, #242 of 1435 🔗

Thanks Peter. What would you regard as a high temperature?

134338 ▶▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Victoria, 3, #243 of 1435 🔗

Anything over 103 degrees F in an adult. 102 degrees for a child, 100 degrees for a baby.

134347 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to RichardJames, #244 of 1435 🔗

Great. Now to get this information to the schools

134510 ▶▶ GLT, replying to Peter Thompson, 3, #245 of 1435 🔗

I am lucky that school my 12 year old attends is sensible. He attended with a sniffy cold and sore throat…although he had to endure some teasing when he occasionally coughed!

134566 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Peter Thompson, 6, #246 of 1435 🔗

Re your elderly lady, I spoke to similar outside Tesco.

“I got wear it I got breathing difficulties”
‘That’s why you don’t have to wear it’
“I do I had the double pneumonia”.

Sadly I gave up at that point.

134662 ▶▶ annie, replying to Peter Thompson, 4, #247 of 1435 🔗

A middle-aged man in a mask that is frilly
Is first in the line for a medal for silly.

134152 PastImperfect, replying to PastImperfect, 1, #248 of 1435 🔗
134181 ▶▶ mjr, replying to PastImperfect, 1, #249 of 1435 🔗

this was commented on yesterday …. unfortunately the search function on here is not good. there was a link to a youtube commentator also raising this as an issue.
I did pose the question of whether this might be HPV vaccinations which are routinely done annually on 12/13 year olds in school by the NHS .

134327 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to mjr, 2, #250 of 1435 🔗

Not necessarily the vaccine itself … but the parent apparently not having the opportunity to withhold consent – again if that is the case.

134447 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to PastImperfect, #251 of 1435 🔗

i cannot remember what happened with mine.. was a long time ago.. I think we had a note through in advance. It wouldnt surprise me if that had happened here and was overlooked or it just didnt get issued to the parent because of the confusion

134158 snippet, replying to snippet, 9, #252 of 1435 🔗

Interesting stuff retweeted by Prof. Francois Balloux of UCL yesterday:

(1) Model showing that social distancing can INCREASE the final size of an outbreak.

https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1306268841421541379

Note the positive response from Wes Pegden, who wrote a paper on this in July:

“Basically, the epidemic will be over when it is over for 20-35 year olds. Whether this happens before or after a large number of 60-100 year olds have been infected depends on our policy decisions.”

https://twitter.com/WesPegden/status/1306282575556743170

(2) How universal mitigations (e.g. lockdowns) kill more people over time than the Swedish approach.

https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1306284719349391366

Both support Professor Sunetra Gupta’s long-held view:

“Maybe the way to counter it now is to say, actually, not only is it a good thing for young people to go out there and become immune, but that is almost their duty. It’s a way of living with this virus. It’s how we live with other viruses. Flu is clearly a very dangerous virus, but the reason we don’t see more deaths from flu every year is because, through herd immunity, the levels of infection are kept to as low a level as we can get.”

https://reaction.life/we-may-already-have-herd-immunity-an-interview-with-professor-sunetra-gupta/

134188 ▶▶ RickH, replying to snippet, 1, #253 of 1435 🔗

Statements of the pretty bleedin’ obvious have no traction in this.

134199 ▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to RickH, 9, #254 of 1435 🔗

I must admit I was sceptical of the level of pre-existing immunity postulated by Prof. Gupta, and still am about her postulated three forms of the disease. However, pre-existing immunity is one explanation, and a perfectly plausible one, of the levels of herd immunity seen in places like Manaus and Guayaquil, which seem to be around 20-30%. That calls for some explanation. However, transposed to the UK setting, sending a million or so 20-year olds off to university to mingle, get infected and develop immunity would be a good step in the herd immunity direction.

Incidentally, if that seems a bit blasé about the mortality, it’s about 2 in a million for that age group. The risk from meningitis in the same age group is about three times that, but universities never bothered with these extreme measures for that. (And, very sadly, the risk from suicide is something like 100 in a million.)

134160 Lockdown_Lunacy, 14, #255 of 1435 🔗

Getting lots of support for sceptical comments I have made on the Spectator’s FB page today. I know a lot of sceptics probably gravitate towards the Spectator anyway, but it’s still positive!

134161 Nigel Sherratt, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 2, #256 of 1435 🔗

No longer true about Trinity’s Nobels v France and Belgium but still a very impressive total. More than all countries except (in order); USA, UK, Germany and France. There were 5 in residence when I went to a potential alumni donors stocktaking lunch in 2012. The previous master was a Nobel prizewinner and he succeeded Lord Rees the Astronomer Royal. The ex-Chief Medical Officer is, I’m afraid, not in that zone academically.

134174 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 1, #257 of 1435 🔗

Wonder what Prof Sir Greg thinks about Dame Sally, someone with an ‘interesting’ CV!

134189 ▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #258 of 1435 🔗

As another alumni (although sadly not like Nigel — I think we overlapped? — on the Rich List ) I was a little surprised to get an email yesterday from the Master inviting me, at less than two hours notice, to a webinar on “The Trinity Challenge”

A global coalition to foster innovative insights, solutions and collaborations to create global public goods and improve global public health. We believe humanity has the means to ensure that a pandemic like COVID-19, disrupting and destroying lives and livelihoods everywhere, will never happen again.

The partners include Tencent, the Chinese tech conglomerate, and a Chinese university, so I look forward to seeing what projects get approved. But this seems to reflect the Master’s particular interests.

134221 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #259 of 1435 🔗

I think you meant alumnus 🙂

134231 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Bruno, 1, #260 of 1435 🔗

Oops, thank you. We are an alumnus.

134254 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Richard Pinch, #261 of 1435 🔗

Haha, from an alumna of that place up the road, I in my turn have no idea how to enumerate words with forbidden factors. So you win hands down anyway. 🙂

134234 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Richard Pinch, #262 of 1435 🔗

Had to disabuse them about the rich list aspect, they took it well (as one would hope). Overlappingwise (’71-’74)

134241 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #263 of 1435 🔗

Yes, Maths ’72-’76. Wherever you go, you always find another Trinity person …

134668 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #264 of 1435 🔗

I was Modern and Medieval Languages 1972-75.
I simply cannot imagine the dons of that time acting like gibbering zombies.
O tempora…

134315 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #265 of 1435 🔗

I’m from the ‘other place’, and stopped all funding when ‘wokeness’ started (around 2000)!

134365 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #266 of 1435 🔗

I did my D.Phil at Christ Church. They’re still asking me for money after having spent around a million or so of the charitable funds on two failed attempts to get rid of the dean and issuing legal threats to one of the canons, while one of the Professors is now in prison on child pron charges and another has been arrested for stealing ancient manuscripts and selling them. Clearly an institution deserving of my support. I don’t know whether they’ve got the time to be woke about it.

134577 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Richard Pinch, #267 of 1435 🔗

Sounds like the plot from a Simon Raven novel.

134162 Biker, replying to Biker, 12, #268 of 1435 🔗

A Spitfire just went over my house. It’s a sign from the Universe that’ll everything thing gonna be alright. We’ll be making love in the park before lights out. I’ve got my Grandfathers suit he wore on the last day of the war i think i’ll go an put it on.

134169 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Biker, 12, #269 of 1435 🔗

It was painted with THANK U NHS … not joking. It is visiting hosptials on a thank you propaganda lap of our nation. Again not joking. Actually true.

134182 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Basics, 9, #270 of 1435 🔗

You know they made Spitfires from old pots and pans collected for the purpose. 🙂

It’s at that level of nonsense.

134212 ▶▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to RickH, 3, #271 of 1435 🔗

There is a view that much of the collected metal ended up dumped at sea, how true that is I don’t know. On a lighter note there is a very funny Just William story on the theme of ‘scrapion’

134586 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Strange Days, #272 of 1435 🔗

Oh I dunno, the made my Zenit fully manual SLR camera from melted down Soviet T34 tanks (reverse engineering).

134265 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to RickH, 9, #273 of 1435 🔗

They are taking the piss out of everyone! Sitting in their meeting room going…”nah, they’ll never fall for that!, “yes they will, wait and see, they’ve swallowed all the other crap we’ve told them for the last 6 months hahahaha”

We are being dictated to by Psychopaths, Paedophile protectors and Morons! And people still think that the government has their best interests at heart! Awww bless!!

134341 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kate, replying to B Boru, 6, #274 of 1435 🔗

I have noticed this.
When they get away with one outrageous piece of “news” they seem to be compelled to follow it up with something even more outrageous.

It is as if they cannot believe the nonsense people will swallow and have lost control of the lies they tell.

Is this typical sociopathic behaviour?

134625 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Kate, 1, #275 of 1435 🔗

It’s let’s take the piss behaviour, see what the twats will put up with next.

134620 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to B Boru, 1, #276 of 1435 🔗

I just posted above “having had a laugh playing wakamole with our European holidays they are now doing the same with our own tourist industry” Barf, hick chuckle chuckle wot !
( And me a bit of a Boris fan formerly).

134185 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to Basics, 3, #277 of 1435 🔗

As someone who build a 90% scale replica Spit, that one makes me want to puke.

134198 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to leggy, 2, #278 of 1435 🔗

As just being me it makes me want to puke. It’s covered in Edinburgh press if anyone wants confirmation – I realise it is hard to believe.

134294 ▶▶▶▶▶ leggy, replying to Basics, 1, #279 of 1435 🔗

Oh, don’t worry, I know all about it. It’s PL983 operated by the Aircraft Restoration Company.

134230 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to leggy, 3, #280 of 1435 🔗

Why 90%? To confuse the plane spotters?

134289 ▶▶▶▶▶ leggy, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 1, #281 of 1435 🔗

90% size, 10% cost.

135500 ▶▶▶▶ ChrisDinBristol, replying to leggy, #282 of 1435 🔗

As someone whos father flew them in the B of B I feel exactly the same. Were he still with us I’m sure he’d be wondering why he bothered.

134248 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Basics, 1, #283 of 1435 🔗

That’s ruined the story for me. Depressed again now.

134308 ▶▶▶ Girl down Under, replying to Basics, #284 of 1435 🔗

The money that must be costing. And who’s paying for it?

134242 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Biker, 4, #285 of 1435 🔗

A Spitfire flew low right over my house a few days ago down here in Devon. Deep growling engine.

Recognised it straight away, and saw it as a good omen – meant to post on here but didn’t get around to it.

In these dark days I try to remember that there are still Britons out there who know that the Spitfire was the most beautiful aeroplane ever built, and that the Pistols were the best band. And they don’t wear masks.

134634 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to TJN, 1, #286 of 1435 🔗

And they had ‘bollocks’ legalised in the Courts, not an obscenity.

134933 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to karenovirus, 1, #287 of 1435 🔗

Yes, that’s a very good point! A good old Anglo-Saxon word, as I recall he Judge finding.

134275 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Biker, 5, #288 of 1435 🔗

These are the details of the route it is taking

I trust you will all grab your rainbow flags and go outside and wave them patriotically as you become overwhelmed with pride for the NHS, the BBC, the other MSM and of course Fat Boris and his government who are looking after us so well

134434 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to mjr, 2, #289 of 1435 🔗

Thanks. Yes I will trip over my cat getting through the door in time with my rainbow flag. Yes.

134167 Basics, replying to Basics, 21, #290 of 1435 🔗

A moment to remember the STV thank you nicola advert that was pulled from airtime with a supposed investigation into what had happened.

For those who need thier memory jogging or never saw the advert it was a TV advert shown on ITV-STV within weeks of the lockdown starting.

The advert showed many children from toddlers up to prepubescent ages often in their bedroom sitting on their bed talking to camera thanking Nicola Sturgeon for doing such a good job and keeping us safe. It appeared the children had been given a short script to say, the editing cut a phrase from one child into another child so the viewers heard a complete sentence said by several children. All the children were alone not with others.

It was shocking to see, absolutely creepy. The children were so young they could not have know what they were saying – what the meaning and political connotations were.

Thank you nicola for keeping us safe. Many complaints and press columns written. The advert was pulled.

I just wanted to recall that sorry episode it shouldn’t be forgotten.

134288 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Basics, 4, #291 of 1435 🔗

I never saw that thankfully. Sounds both sinister and vomit inducing.

134431 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to leggy, 2, #292 of 1435 🔗

I’ve just been looking into what became of the investigation. The Spectator covered this at the time… https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/stv-s-snp-propaganda/amp

Also discovered there’s been an attempt to repiste the cracking Wee Witch viral video by STV. STV seem to have attempted to get a little girl, 5-6?, singing somewhere over the rainbow to thankNsturgeon . The STV site video is down -copy right strike or have people complained again.

134640 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to leggy, 1, #293 of 1435 🔗

I did, nearly forgot, almost puked.

134170 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 5, #294 of 1435 🔗

Oddly, out of all global commentators, why is it that only Alex Jones and David Icke are talking any sense ?

134178 ▶▶ RickH, replying to nickbowes, 5, #295 of 1435 🔗

Not so – there are a lot of others. They just don’t get much airtime.

134186 ▶▶▶ nickbowes, replying to RickH, 6, #296 of 1435 🔗

Sky News Australia.

134258 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to nickbowes, 1, #297 of 1435 🔗

There are a few more…..Max Igan in Oz for example. James Corbett, Jeff Rense, Jon Rappaport to name but a few

134176 Derrick Byford, 7, #298 of 1435 🔗

Just watched the BBC video about how to tell if you have Covid, Flu or just a cold. Actually quite helpful until the claim at the end “wear a mask and protect yourself” Has the BBC uncovered new evidence that even the most ardent (scientifically competent) advocates and government are not aware of?

134180 mwhite, replying to mwhite, 4, #299 of 1435 🔗
134287 ▶▶ leggy, replying to mwhite, #300 of 1435 🔗

Thanks – direct link – https://youtu.be/eKKIr425b40

134190 Chicot, replying to Chicot, 22, #301 of 1435 🔗

Utter insanity. While students are away at college is absolutely the best time to build herd immunity in them. They are largely isolated from the wider community and therefore won’t kill granny. Let them mingle amongst themselves, get it and recover (if they even have any symptoms at all).

134197 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Chicot, 4, #302 of 1435 🔗

There has been a veritable pox of local press stories about halls having ‘out breaks’ ‘clusters’ or any other virus riddled verb.

134209 ▶▶▶ Chris79, replying to Basics, 15, #303 of 1435 🔗

We used to call it “fresher’s flu” in the olden days.

134225 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Chris79, 10, #304 of 1435 🔗

Most symptoms coincide with those of a hangover anyway as TY has pointed out. Oh for the good old days when arranging overnight female companionship was the greatest challenge.

134215 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to Chicot, 8, #305 of 1435 🔗

They are largely isolated from the wider community and therefore won’t kill granny”
Really good point!

134237 ▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to JohnMac, 2, #306 of 1435 🔗

… so end of November is when we’ll need a million or so extra tests for them, before they start going home for the vac.

134193 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 11, #307 of 1435 🔗

“David Icke has been warning for nearly 30 years of a coming global Orwellian state in which a tiny few would enslave humanity through control of finance, government, media and a military-police Gestapo overseeing 24/7 surveillance of a micro chipped population”

I`m only asking because i recently picked up a 700 page David Icke book from 2017 for 20 pence (bargain !) from a car boot and the above quote is the blurb on the back !

134256 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to nickbowes, 8, #308 of 1435 🔗

One day the world will realise, David Icke was right!

More power to the man. Taken unimaginable shit over the years and kept on going. I challenge anyone to read his books, put aside your media programmed predjudice and then tell me that this isn’t what is going on.

Connect the dots. There is no such thing as a random event!

134479 ▶▶▶ Eldred Godson, replying to B Boru, 1, #309 of 1435 🔗

David Icke is right. Does he need to give his life to prove that he is right?
Do you understand what it’s like to be a laughing stock in life?
Do you understand what it’s like or who you are?
Eccentric billionaire, he doesn’t care, he’ll give it all away
Then there’s the mother, like the woman in
Butterflies, who ties herself up and dies
We won’t wait or hesitate to criticise
And never in a million billion years
Will we understand their minds
Do you understand what it’s like to give away your life?
And do you understand what it’s like to be a lost cause?
Like a butterfly, we’ve a very short life
Lighted cigarettes will burn out in time
Like a rainforest, but not metaphoric
In fact, like a piss in the Atlantic
Like a bowl of flies, we’ve a very short life
https://youtu.be/auvBXJv3qLA

134481 ▶▶▶▶ Eldred Godson, replying to Eldred Godson, #310 of 1435 🔗
134282 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to nickbowes, #311 of 1435 🔗

asking what. nick ?

134194 Basics, replying to Basics, 4, #312 of 1435 🔗

Carbon accounting being covered on Sky News with Triodos bank. How are we going to unify carbins across all industry and sectors. Carbon disclosure becoming mandatory. All under the cloak of covid recovery.
Triodos started work in carbon accounting in 2015,

Carbon impact of portfolios carbin accounting. Assess risks in portfolio based on carbon zero.

Insignificant little point but so insidious – implications for societal change are huge.

134429 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Basics, 2, #313 of 1435 🔗

They’re just opening up a route by which governments can print money and hand it straight to their rich friends under the guise of “green development”. Pure corruption.

134204 Charlie Blue, 3, #314 of 1435 🔗

Potentially interesting lineup for business in the House of Commons today. Business statement at the moment, but then:

  • Ministerial statement by MH Covid 19 update
  • Select Committee statement on the Fifth Report of the Public Administration and Constitutional Affairs Committee: A Public Inquiry into the Government’s response to the Covid 19 Pandemic, HC 541 – Mr William Wragg
  • Debate on a Motion on the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme – Patricia Gibson

Let’s hope we see some dissent in the ranks and awkward questions being asked

134205 Under The Bridge, 9, #315 of 1435 🔗

All in the name of protecting people from this “deadly” virus. Yet a recent analysis by Professor David Spiegelhalter in the BMJ has shown that the risk to people under 35 is almost zero.”

I absolutely agree that young people have been groomed to be unreasonably afraid of the risk of death from this virus, but the idea that the virus is not deadly for them creates a false dichotomy that says that since it isn’t deadly, it’s without risk. Young people in college have very good reason to be very afraid of becoming an asymptomatic “case”. Schools are requiring coronavirus testing and students who test positive are required to quarantine for two weeks, as if the past six months of asocial existence hasn’t been bad enough; as if the education-hampering “new normal” rules are not bad enough. These young people have been placed in an awful state of terror by authorities and “experts” who tell exagerrated tales about global warming, social injustice, and viral plagues.

134210 philburton, replying to philburton, 5, #316 of 1435 🔗

The one positive I see from the current “second wave” hysteria is that they (“They” being the media, the government and the lockdown fanatics) may have peaked too soon (forgive the pun). They may have over-egged the hysteria way too soon in to the Autumn, and when the “second wave” arrives, it’ll be a damp squib – mainly made up of misdiagnosed/misappropriated flu deaths, but “excess deaths” (which is the ultimate measure of this whole thing) will remain at or below the 5 year average.

Come end of October, they’ll have shot their load, the public will tire and Boris will have to change course.

134244 ▶▶ Philip F, replying to philburton, 1, #317 of 1435 🔗

But they will still be hyping the so-called “cases” regardless of the “dampness of the squib” when it comes to the statistics that matter (hospitalisations etc). And whose to say that flu deaths will be conflated with Covid by our ignorant scare-mongering media?

134284 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to philburton, 4, #318 of 1435 🔗

Agree with that. As I have said before, this ‘spike’ has happened 6 weeks earlier than they were hoping for. Second Lockdown was planned for late October – after the Brexit deadline, once the weather had started to falter, and, crucially, once the full impact of the economic disaster is staring everyone in the face, riots are on the cards.

134211 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #319 of 1435 🔗

Just heard on radio that Help for Heroes have had to cut 143 jobs because donations have fallen so much due to this ongoing mess.

134253 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Charlie Blue, 4, #320 of 1435 🔗

unfortunately army veterans are no longer heroes.. Since March the term “hero” is only allowed to be applied to those people who work for the NHS .
After all, working as an administrator in a hospital treating the occasional covid patient is far more dangerous than being based in Camp Bastion
which is the hero? this

134255 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, 2, #321 of 1435 🔗

or this

134277 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to mjr, 7, #322 of 1435 🔗

I know which one I would want around in a genuine crisis. As a former MP said many years ago, the problem with Parliament is that so few, if any, of our representatives have served their country in one of the services. That, fundamentally, is the difference between Boris and Churchill.

134286 ▶▶▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #323 of 1435 🔗

You see, “For conspicuous dancing in empty wards while video recording oneself” doesn’t fit on. But “For Valour” does. Much respect to Johnson Beharry.

134380 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #324 of 1435 🔗

Former colleague was MiD from Falklands – and injured in conflict. He was one of the most respectful, and impressive people I have met in business. Also met several ex-forces of a later generation while studying on a masters course. Similarly impressive. You would put your life in their hands. With our crop of politicians and ministers, as my mother would say, ‘I’ll join the other side’!

134457 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ kf99, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #325 of 1435 🔗

My favourite teacher (1980s) was ex-RAF. Is that even allowed nowadays?

134824 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kf99, 1, #326 of 1435 🔗

Our school had a central core of staff who’d all served in the SOE during ww2.

Quite impressive to see 500+ teenage lads fall instantly silent when one medium sized bloke walked into assembly. 🙂

134435 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Sam Vimes, #327 of 1435 🔗

one type of hero lives by the tic-toc of a video stream . . the other lives by the tick-tock of an IED

134430 ▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #328 of 1435 🔗

so few, if any, of our representatives have ever had a proper job!!!

134448 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to mjr, 1, #329 of 1435 🔗

Many are former journos, who have peddled the trade of ‘don’t let the facts get in the way of the story’.

134478 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #330 of 1435 🔗

Johnny ‘Johnny’ Mercer isn’t a very good advertisement for that theory.

Steve Baker was RAF though, and IDS was army.

Churchill was capable of immense concentration and hard work, and clarity of thought, combined with great moral courage. Johnson …………

134489 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to TJN, #331 of 1435 🔗

Missed something – Churchill was a talented writer.

134514 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to mjr, 2, #332 of 1435 🔗

Christ man! You utter cynic. Do you know how hard it is to plan those tictoc routines? You’ve got no idea!

134548 ▶▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to mjr, 4, #333 of 1435 🔗

I made a similar point to a friend, now former friend it seems, who works in the NHS where I made the point with reference to the military that sometimes your job is hard, sometimes your job is shit, sometimes it’s both at the same time but nobody claps for our armed forces each time they go into battle with arguably less effective PPE and potentially far greater danger. You can infer that I didn’t clap for the NHS.

134214 karenovirus, #334 of 1435 🔗

Just drove past the H.Q. of a local Housing Association, some of staff are outside standing a meter or so apart; about 8 or 9 of them possibly on their private property but it’s certainly a Public Right of Way.

They are having a ‘meet the happy team’ photo session.
Bang to rights I’d say.

134219 Nigel Sherratt, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 1, #335 of 1435 🔗

A bit harsh to single out Trinity for what seems universal behaviour (nice picture). It would be interesting to run the many similar documents through TY’s proposed plagiarism test to find the ‘fons et origo’. I suspect it’s the curse of woke Canadians (the Vice Chancellor in this case) infecting our public life yet again. China with its Uighur prison camps is OK, non-woke Canadian Prof. Peterson is not. Prof. Gopal is promoted, Prof. Gupta of Oxford is ignored.

134972 ▶▶ matt, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #336 of 1435 🔗

TY did his postgraduate degree at Trinity, so presumably feels particularly prickled (although I know Will wrote today’s page)

134220 Basics, 1, #337 of 1435 🔗

The naked scientist quote above. I have a disliking for him based on the little I have seen of him leering out of a screen towards me.

It is really encouraging talk he is quoted saying above. I believe what he is saying makes a shift from where we are now possible. His ideas give possiblity of a stepping stone away from where we are now.

It takes more skill than I have to offer stepping stones, my inclination is to entrench in an us trench across no mans land from them in their trench.

Quoting him here I have added in brackets what I would have respected him more for saying:

“It’s clear there is not going to be a vaccine any time soon. We’re talking perhaps six months away still at the earliest before we’re properly in a position to move on this, and we don’t even know if we do get a vaccine that it will work [or if it will be safe in the long term], so we do need a Plan B. ”

He remains talking about vaccines in six months time being acceptable. I disagree. Especially with the experimental nature of some of the RNA systems, and the ID system required which is overlooked when thinking about these proposed vaccine programs.

134226 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 12, #338 of 1435 🔗

Direct action is needed.

Send your used, soiled, revolting face-nappy to :-
Chris Twitty c/o Imperial College, London
Boris Johnson – 10 Downing St
Dodo Harding, PHE England
Robert Peston, c/o ITV London

for the price of a stamp you will get a helluva lot of satisfaction

Sorry, today, annoyed. NE about to be in lockdown -but hopefully that does not mean South Durham, more private sector jobs going, public sector still enjoying WFH on full pay with all the “life/health/balance” in flow. Nice work if you can get it !
Sunak will have to do something about ongoing support for parents who will on the whim of a child`s cough have to take two weeks off.

134236 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to nickbowes, 7, #339 of 1435 🔗

Definite North/South divide to these local lockdowns (to add to the other divisions in the country).

134252 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Tom Blackburn, #340 of 1435 🔗

That’s exactly what i concluded

134626 ▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to nickbowes, #341 of 1435 🔗

Oh brilliant idea. We could even smear the used masks in dog poo! Such fun!!

135740 ▶▶ gmwhite, replying to nickbowes, #342 of 1435 🔗

Superb idea! I’ve started a thread in the forum on this topic.

134229 PowerCorrupts, replying to PowerCorrupts, 3, #343 of 1435 🔗

The Communist Chinese dissident virologist who was instructed by her institute in Hong to investigate the origin of the Wuhan virus has provided her scientific analysis that concludes the virus was engineered at the Wuhan Virology lab in Wuhan. Her conclusions are mirrored by numerous very high level specialists in Italy, India and elsewhere. Youtube has removed her video and Twitter have suspended her account:
https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/coronavirus-dissident-cancelled-by-youtube/

134464 ▶▶ leggy, replying to PowerCorrupts, #344 of 1435 🔗

Two different stories here aren’t there? One a think tank, one the lady from Hong Kong?

134475 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to PowerCorrupts, 1, #345 of 1435 🔗

I disagree.I think she is a plant from CCP and part of the Project fear.She has persuaded Bannon and his likes about this.See below link

https://twitter.com/JordanSchachtel/status/1306259059390242821

CCP has a two sided approach.One the above for the right wing, the other side is bombarded by twitter etc to influence mainstream gov like UK

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/china-covid-lockdown-propaganda

This is to maximise the damage on the Western world and they have already come out of the C-19 recession.

134232 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 5, #346 of 1435 🔗

“Heavy exposure of children aged 9 to 12 years with SARS-CoV-2 did not lead to infection”

German couple(Drs) contracted C-19 and failed to transmit to their children despite efforts

“Our observation of the absent transmission of SARS-CoV-2 to four children aged 9 to 12 despite heavy viral exposure may have implications for preventive measures such as school closures and social distancing during the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic and encourages further studies on viral cell entry and transmission in child”
 https://academic.oup.com/jpids/advance-article/doi/10.1093/jpids/piaa116/5904972

134264 ▶▶ RichardJames, replying to swedenborg, 3, #347 of 1435 🔗

I know it’s not quite meant like that, and I knew German dactors of a certain era had form for it, but when I read that the German doctors “failed to transmit to their children despite efforts ” a certain image came to mind…

134238 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 2, #348 of 1435 🔗

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2026913

Facial Masking for Covid-19 — Potential for “Variolation” as We Await a Vaccine

 This is the hypothesis for universal mask wearing now promoted by CDC

134259 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 2, #349 of 1435 🔗

Michael Osterholms reply .He is one of the main person in Project fear.He is furious that a similar paper was published. Interesting the civil war in the lockdown fanatics.

 https://twitter.com/ibrake4ants/status/1303423557599363072

134263 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to swedenborg, 2, #350 of 1435 🔗

They clearly want to move to “ population-wide facial masking”, as they describe it in the article. Sinister? Dystopian? Ominous? How else can this phrase be described?

134321 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Tenchy, 3, #351 of 1435 🔗

“Recent data from Boston demonstrate that SARS-CoV-2 infections decreased among health care workers after universal masking was implemented in municipal hospitals in late March.”

Let’s introduce masks on everyone all the time globally because a study a few months ago in Boston found it might help.

Seriously. This is insane.

134459 ▶▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 6, #352 of 1435 🔗

The whole article is full of faults. Stating that face masks countries have lower death rate and we know about Peru and the Latin American countries. Stating that Asian countries have not had epidemics pandemics since SARS 1 and then an enormous flu outbreak the other year in Japan. And the obvious(as in the Boston article) the false idea that you can compare masks for HCW with general public. These are just some faults found quickly.

134399 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to swedenborg, 2, #353 of 1435 🔗

Insanity on steroids.

134850 ▶▶ guy153, replying to swedenborg, 1, #354 of 1435 🔗

Pretty much completely evidence-free.

It’s just as likely that mask wearing results in a greater chance of inhaling virus back into your own lungs and giving you a more severe infection.

But I expect if repeated often enough this myth will become part of the religion.

134246 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 15, #355 of 1435 🔗

In my opinion the moment has gone

When Hitler came to power in 1933 the fate of the Jews was sealed. On the whole they did not realise what was to become of them

In the years that followed, if they protested, they died, if they didn’t protest they died

The only ones that survived were the ones who got out early

The propaganda machine is in full flow, the ‘responsibility’ for what is to come will be laid at the door of ‘the young’ ‘the old’ ‘sceptics’ and other groups who at the moment do not know their fate is sealed

134272 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Cecil B, 2, #356 of 1435 🔗

Bleak but true. This time though, where can anyone escape to?

134325 ▶▶▶ snippet, replying to godowneasy, #357 of 1435 🔗

Sweden.

134621 ▶▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to snippet, #358 of 1435 🔗

Or Tanzania.

134804 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to HelzBelz, #359 of 1435 🔗

Or Belarus.

134458 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to godowneasy, #360 of 1435 🔗

I’m beginning to think we all might need to chip in and buy an island somewhere…

134251 grammarschoolman, replying to grammarschoolman, 6, #361 of 1435 🔗

Just been told that I’ve been banned from commenting on Unherd, the site supposedly for a broad spectrum of opinion, and supportive of freedom of speech. Ironic badge of honour!

134268 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to grammarschoolman, 2, #362 of 1435 🔗

What did you say? 🙂

134520 ▶▶ Mark, replying to grammarschoolman, 1, #363 of 1435 🔗

That’s quite impressive, though they do seem kind of soft left and intolerance of dissent is pretty much characteristic of the left these days.

134257 NonCompliant, replying to NonCompliant, 8, #364 of 1435 🔗

Just thought i’d plug Hector Drummonds site and this excellent page on there as it’s a goldmine of data and context!

Share this far and wide:

https://hectordrummond.com/2020/09/14/week-35-graphs-from-christopher-bowyer/

134267 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to NonCompliant, 2, #365 of 1435 🔗

Essential reading for any sceptics

134269 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to NonCompliant, 3, #366 of 1435 🔗

It was Chris Bowyers graphs that first brought to my attention that fewer people were dying in London than the 5 year average, back in week twenty.
At that point it was obvious that the Covid had shot its load.

134261 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 18, #367 of 1435 🔗

11.30 Jeremy Vine intro to midday show.
“98% of people going to test stations are coming up negative!
Don’t go if you haven’t got it !”

134266 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to karenovirus, 9, #368 of 1435 🔗

And we are paying for it.

Monumental level of waste.

134271 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #369 of 1435 🔗

Waste of money, or virus waste pollution
as someone posted yesterday?

134313 ▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to karenovirus, 3, #370 of 1435 🔗

So, logically, if we’re all supposed to already know if we’ve got it or not then none of us should be getting tested.

134335 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Andrew Fish, 8, #371 of 1435 🔗

no . people have got to stop going for a test because of a runny nose. Unfortunately the government have made the public so scared that they have lost the ability to assess their own health and still think a runny nose means they will die of covid or kill grandma.
They now need to convince people that the the disease is not everywhere and not everyone has it .. But that then reveals the Elephant in the room . Covid is not dangerous. What a dilemma!!!

134651 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Andrew Fish, 2, #372 of 1435 🔗

My point exactly.

134384 ▶▶ CGL, replying to karenovirus, 3, #373 of 1435 🔗

And the rest are false positives!

134455 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to karenovirus, 3, #374 of 1435 🔗

Shame he didn’t add that of the 2% positives, 98% were false positives…

135007 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to karenovirus, 2, #375 of 1435 🔗

I guess a lot of people who go to testing centres have to prove they are negative so they can work (care workers) or go to school. Employers or insurance companies are to blame for this.

134262 BeBopRockSteady, replying to BeBopRockSteady, -3, #376 of 1435 🔗

I actually think the Pitts Museum statement makes a lot of sense. While I think tearing down artefacts of the past is next to pointless, it seems to me as if they are trying to reconcile the fact that British history is mired in colonialism with the fact they as a business would technically not exist without it.

I don’t feel offended by such things as such, for, I think, we invite offense as much as it is imposed on us (self accountability is primary), but I think they are trying to address some of the darker sides to their artefacts. I see absolutely no harm in that kind of conversation

This is just my response to the article above, I haven’t read anything else into the whole thing with Pitts.

134273 ▶▶ grammarschoolman, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 2, #377 of 1435 🔗

Mired? We should be proud of colonialism and all of its achievements, of which the PRM is one.

The shrunken heads are a particularly ironic example, as they show the cruelty and viciousness of primitive peoples, from which the civilised West strove to rescue them. I presume that the museum has now removed them – despite being their most popular exhibits – because they have always showed the non-whites as they really are.

134285 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to grammarschoolman, 3, #378 of 1435 🔗

What do you mean by saying you should be ‘Proud’ of colonialism exactly?

Such statements I find somewhat bizzare. I did not have anything to do with what happened then, so what is that I should be proud of? Should I also feel guilty for certain aspects too?

134389 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #379 of 1435 🔗

Well, I am also perplexed by “proud”. I suppose one can be proud of one’s own hard work or resolve, from your own will. I guess one can be proud of one’s fellow citizens. But I think if we’re talking about a country or a culture it’s better to say that you value its good aspects, or feel overall it is a force for good, and you personally are glad or feel fortunate to be a part of it.

I am not ashamed of being English, nor am I “proud”. I am English, good and bad, and happy (or was) to live in what used to be a pretty good country, as countries go.

134407 ▶▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Julian, 1, #380 of 1435 🔗

You form those perceptions yourself. So you can call it pride or guilt or whatever. You can also choose to ignore it completely and forge as much of a non identity as you can. Whatever suits.

Like I said above, it’s the same with all outrage that surrounds the woke agenda. As an individual you don’t actually need to ‘do’ anything about it.

134290 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 4, #381 of 1435 🔗

Major incident in North Yorkshire. No not a rampaging herd of bulls or a comet crashing into the ground https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-5418115 of course the preferred response is to wear muzzles outdoors .

134293 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to arfurmo, 1, #382 of 1435 🔗

“Measures to be introduced include people being encouraged to wear face masks whenever they leave home, and dedicated police patrols targeting those breaking social distancing rules.”

134302 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Tenchy, 10, #384 of 1435 🔗

Red line crossed.

134298 ▶▶ DRW, replying to arfurmo, 6, #385 of 1435 🔗

Outdoor muzzling, I knew this was coming.

134305 ▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to DRW, 11, #386 of 1435 🔗

I’m not wearing it …Next stupidity please!

134421 ▶▶▶ William Hand, replying to DRW, 6, #387 of 1435 🔗

I’d love to see outdoor muzzles enforced up here on Dartmoor. I don’t even wear a muzzle in shops and I am certainly not going to wear a fucking rag outside! we have a hotel up here and I saw a customer putting on his filthy face nappy after getting into his car FFS!!! I scowled at him and shook my head in a disgusted fashion. He was quite old and didn’t appreciate it, but I don’t care, that is stupid.

134310 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to arfurmo, 2, #388 of 1435 🔗

Gtr Manchester, West Yorks, North East, NorthYorks… Joining the dots.

135484 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Sam Vimes, #389 of 1435 🔗

Wot about Brum and Leicester?
Creeping Curfew coming your way.

134331 ▶▶ mjr, replying to arfurmo, 2, #390 of 1435 🔗

Corrected Link (you lost a number off the end).
20 cases a day.. that word cases!!!!!

134424 ▶▶▶ William Hand, replying to mjr, 2, #391 of 1435 🔗

20!!!!!!! Sheesh, why aren’t they all dead?

134295 DRW, replying to DRW, 25, #392 of 1435 🔗

Just some a rant over how badly my last job did my head in over this.

Everyone on here rightfully hates the Clown Shows and $AGE. But I have seen first hand the despicable scum infesting the upper ranks of the civil service appease, lickspittle, cock-suck, cheerlead and celebrate this brutal assault on our liberties, human spirits, and even some actual lives just so these shits can keep floating in their cushy cesspit. They live the delusion of being independent technocrats but are actually wet obedient lapdogs completely useless at anything other than pandering, self-advancement, and repeating the approved bullshit and woke platitudes such as “leading a force for good”, that probably being the fairy story they tell themselves at night to rest about guzzling vast undeserved sums from the taxpayer for being essentially useful idiots. I bet they all soak themselves thinking about the promised jobs in the planned extra survelliance bureaucracy for having been good little boys and girls. They are very guilty individuals and equally deserve as much punishment as the front row clowns for their unashamedly supporting acts.

Working for them after March was soul destroying. Whilst the rich working experience I Ioved was reduced to a laptop and disembodied voices, these cunts were waltzing around Whitehall induldging in the otherwise forbidden pleasure of in-person meetings (revealing the true threat). And after a few months they celebrated further with an in-person awayday whilst telling us how great the crappy fake “virtual events” are, not that I bothered with any them. And the worst part is that the actually good natured, hard working people at the bottom questioned none of these absolute hypocrites because ~95% of them were complete spoonfed automatons. Utter sheeple, so brainwashed they actually enjoyed all the government/management shite and actively promoted elsewhere! And to think some of them were very intelligent in their field. The final straw was the late July northern mockdowns which went completely unchallenged and accepted by all. I was due to leave anyway but that was enough and made my notice that afternoon, followed by a couple of rants on here.

I used to believe that this organisation was better than the BBC and Guardian. I put so much into it because I believed that. I don’t regret going there last year, I learnt some new skills, earned some money and met my friend I’ve posted about before, but evidently I was very, very wrong on principle. And it emotionally hurt me so much. The job I had after March was very different to the one I had before. Before then I was genuinely excited to return to that organisation after I finished uni. Now I could burn it all to the ground. A few days ago I found myself furiously stomping a discarded muzzle into the ground imaging it was the head of the director screaming for his puppetmasters. That’s how badly they did my head in over this.

134318 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to DRW, 7, #393 of 1435 🔗

Completely agree regarding the senior civil service – they are amongst the big winners from global technocracy and more centralised control. Sold their souls to the devil.

134324 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Darryl, 4, #394 of 1435 🔗

you just need to re-watch Yes MInister to understand this has not changed for 50 years

134377 ▶▶ TJN, replying to DRW, 1, #395 of 1435 🔗

Sounds about right to me, having had some experience of the scientific Civil Service.

134299 BeBopRockSteady, 13, #396 of 1435 🔗

Have to share a story about attending a family wedding here yesterday

https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_Review-g212531-d237958-Reviews-Inishowen_Gateway_Hotel-Buncrana_County_Donegal.html

As Ireland slips through the cracks into some dystopian nightmare, scared to venture out of our homes for fear of being labelled a conspiracy theorist, this was an oasis of sanity.

While numbers were limited and the staff restricted us to table service, they split the 100+ guests into two rooms and as the day went on any rules on mixing was largely ignored.

No masks, bar stayed open till late.

Just off to their pool now for a dip.

134301 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 14, #397 of 1435 🔗

The smug git speaks:

Health Secretary announces new restrictions for north east England

From tomorrow in residents in Northumberland, north Tyneside, south Tyneside, Newcastle-upon-Tyne, Gateshead, Sunderland and country Durham will not be allowed to socialise with other people outside of their household or support bubble, Matt Hancock has announced.

Hospitality for food and drink will be restricted to table service only and late night restrictions of operating hours will have a 10pm curfew.

“I know that these decisions have a real impact on families, on businesses and local communities,” says Mr Hancock. “And I can tell everyone effected that we do not take these decisions lightly.”

“We agree with the local councils that we must follow the data and act. And the data says we must act now so we can control the virus and keep people safe.”

“I know that the people of the North East will come together to defeat this virus, as defeat it we must,” he adds.

(I live near Middlesbrough, so I’m being attacked by a pincer movement coming in from North Yorkshire and the North East).

134307 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 6, #398 of 1435 🔗

Just noticed a subtle change of emphasis from Lt. Gruber: “ we must follow the data”. Previously it was, of course, “follow the science”. I’m not sure if there’s anything in this, but it’s an interesting adjustment.

134319 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Tenchy, 4, #399 of 1435 🔗

they probably think that people are becoming sceptical about the science now but they are still just gullible enough to still believe that a case is an illness and so the data still shows there is a problem

134588 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tenchy, 1, #400 of 1435 🔗

Bound to be something in this. Admission to ICU if you have an itch.

134317 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Tenchy, 4, #401 of 1435 🔗

He also does not know the difference between affected and effected unless diliberate:

Effected means executed, produced, or brought about . To effect is to bring about or cause something to happen. For example, The dictatorial regime quickly effected changes to the constitution that restricted the freedom of the people.

On the other hand, affected means made an impact on . It is the past tense of the verb form of affect , which means to impact . For example, Carbon di-oxide emissions affected the environment.

So we can say that “The dictatorial regime quickly effected changes to the constitution that affected the freedom of the people.”

134323 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Sarigan, 2, #402 of 1435 🔗

I cut and pasted it from The Telegraph. It could be their transcription. My money would be on that, rather than Wankcock being semi-literate.

134326 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 2, #403 of 1435 🔗

Good luck enforcing it in the Meadow Well. Think Handsy Hancock should be sent to direct the troops!

134358 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #404 of 1435 🔗

Quite! And Northumberland FFS! It’s a largely rural county, as is much of Durham, come to that. Why the hell would you need any sort of restrictions there?

134367 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 4, #405 of 1435 🔗

They don’t. Wonder what the Blyth Tory MP has to say for himself. A Red Wall seat that has been truly shafted.

134353 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Tenchy, 6, #406 of 1435 🔗

Can’t someone kick him in the bollocks

134383 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to stefarm, 2, #407 of 1435 🔗

Me, me!!!

134787 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to stefarm, #408 of 1435 🔗

Repeatedly.

135487 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Tenchy, #409 of 1435 🔗

If wancock thinks anyone gives a toss about his bubbles he is simply deluded.

134306 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 32, #410 of 1435 🔗

Have I died and gone to heaven?
The mid-day news just came on BBC radio 4, there was an item on the lock down in the N/East all a bit dismal and then …………
A statement on the situation from Prof Carl Heneghan!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He talked about how the virus was now endemic, the need for a strategy and a clear objective and how without this lockdowns like this will just delay the inevitable.

Wow, all on the BBC main news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

134312 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Steve Martindale, 8, #411 of 1435 🔗

Somebody will get fired for this!

134381 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #412 of 1435 🔗

Well, main Radio, not TV. When he’s on the 9 o clock news on the BBC we will know the tide may turn

134414 ▶▶▶ William Hand, replying to Julian, 3, #413 of 1435 🔗

You’ll be lucky. the main telecast propaganda is at 10 not 9.

134607 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to William Hand, 5, #414 of 1435 🔗

Shows you the last time I watched TV news..

134413 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Steve Martindale, 5, #415 of 1435 🔗

Toby why can we only thumb up once? I want to press a few million thumbs up for Steve’s news.

134314 Catherine, replying to Catherine, 34, #416 of 1435 🔗

Quite invigorating shopping mask free, a bit like buying booze or fags underage. I’ll have an adrenaline buzz with my sausages, please!

135254 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Catherine, 1, #417 of 1435 🔗

That made me laugh!

134329 Kev, replying to Kev, 16, #418 of 1435 🔗

“I know that the people of the North East will come together to defeat this virus, as defeat it we must,” he adds.

Replace the word virus, with the word govenment. And replace the words North East with Country.

134333 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Kev, 20, #419 of 1435 🔗

you don’t defeat a virus – the fucking idiot…

You deal with it through community immunity while protecting the vulnerable – and the virus does its bit by mutating to be less dangerous – and then we all live together happily ever after…..

134357 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Kev, 17, #420 of 1435 🔗

That does seem to be one of the problems, many politicians seem to be tackling this like it was a fist fight or the shoot out at the OK Corral.
Carl Heneghan has just been on the news talking about how the virus is now endemic and we need a strategy to live with it. Should not be too tricky now it does not seem to be causing much death or disease.

134330 CGL, replying to CGL, 2, #421 of 1435 🔗

Does anyone know what science lockdown sceptics are distorting according to Neil Ferguson in the Times a couple of days ago? – behind a paywall.

135494 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to CGL, #422 of 1435 🔗

“Lockdown Sceptics are distorting the science”
Read it, can’t remember it, usual alarmist nonsense

134337 Chana, replying to Chana, 31, #423 of 1435 🔗

I am from Belgium. We have to wear masks in all stores, in the city centre (even in villages where no one is on the market), in public transport, and in every other professional meeting. It is so depressing. I cannot take it much longer.
We also can only meet up within a bubble of 5 people. In the beginning of corona we could not even sit on banks in the park. We have to keep moving when outside. The police would go get people from banks, even very old people and pregnant people (like me) They also would ask people how they know each other.I was about to give birth and I could not meet up with my best friend said the police. It is really creepy. In the beginning mouth mask were not mandatory, but now they are and they are becoming increasingly mandatory. In more and more places. Why does one have to wear a mask when you are all alone on a market in a small village?
There is also an evening clock. You also need to leave your contact information every time you go to a bar or a restaurant.
They are also thinking of going in lockdown again. Pff I am getting so depressed. Feels so alienating all those masks. I will be in a good mood and then I go out to the supermarket and just feel so depressed. Our virologist says it will take 2 years before we go back to normal :-S I mean wtf!!!! I think I will immigrate from Belgium. I cannot live like this for two more years, I really can’t.

134432 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Chana, 4, #424 of 1435 🔗

What is the situation in relation to exemptions?

134445 ▶▶▶ Tommy T., replying to Alethea, 7, #425 of 1435 🔗

They think everybody should just wear the crappy things as it’s a “small sacrifice to protect others”… NOBODY has spoken out about this ridiculous promotion of the regular flu to a “worldwide pandemic disaster” in Belgium, one ridiculously docile and compliant bunch of scared mussles whose only concern is whether they are “wearing their mask correctly” and droning on about “how bad the situation is” (while deaths have been at an all-time low since June, about 5 per day, and not even a quarter of IC beds are currently occupied…). I could kill them all.

134456 ▶▶ Girl down Under, replying to Chana, 12, #426 of 1435 🔗

Having a baby is daunting enough without having to through what you have described. This should be such a joyful time for you. What is happening is cruel, inhuman, demoralising and unfortunately taking place in so many countries. You have certainly come to the right place here to offload and be supported. I find reading the daily updates and comments really makes a difference, Try and stay strong Elmo, finding something good in every day. Look forward to your beautiful baby. I just pray that common sense prevails and all these lockdown measures can become a thing of the past very soon.

134355 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #428 of 1435 🔗

Bedwetter of the week candidate right there.

134551 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Sarigan, #429 of 1435 🔗

He’s one of the BBC’s top earners of course

134340 sam, 8, #430 of 1435 🔗

no point paying to go to Cambridge to be indoctrinated any longer as its now not even fun!

134342 sam, replying to sam, 9, #431 of 1435 🔗

Australian government minister resigns over covid hype and draconian lockdown
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/disease/covid-19-the-great-hoax-in-history-as-evidence-surfaces/
Governments have misled the public
https://www.sabhlokcity.com/

134372 ▶▶ Sally, replying to sam, 3, #432 of 1435 🔗

The person who resigned was not a minister; he was an economist employed by the Victorian government.

134378 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Sally, 4, #433 of 1435 🔗

It’s what all ministers and civil servants should be doing – refuse to go along with it and resign or make them sack you if they try to force you to

134382 ▶▶▶▶ Kev, replying to Julian, 4, #434 of 1435 🔗

That would require integrity, and integrity doesn’t pay very well.

134343 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 11, #435 of 1435 🔗

So it’s all our own fault according to the W.H.O. We should have tried harder rather than trying to enjoy the summer. Ireland regularly gets a “talking to” by those helpful W.H.O. envoys (I expect this happens everywhere else?). Today on RTE:

A spokesperson for the World Health Organization has said it is “quite typical” to see a rise in cases again in countries like Ireland after rules are relaxed.

Speaking on RTÉ’s Morning Ireland, Dr Margaret Harris said unfortunately we have seen across Europe that people did not get the message that you need to continue with the change in habits to suppress the virus.

She said private gatherings are one of the worst scenarios where people go back to close physical contacts and being in crowded settings.

She said they are asking everyone to understand that stopping the transmission of Covid-19 is in their hands, and warned that if too many people get ill then hospitals become overwhelmed very quickly.

ARRRRRGGGGHHH! – So at what point over the summer did we “people” not get the 24/7 deluge of messages telling us to change our (dirty little) habits?

134348 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to godowneasy, 9, #436 of 1435 🔗

Gets on my tits, nothing is typical as we’ve never locked the fucking country up for the flu so to say it is is complete bollocks.

134351 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to godowneasy, 8, #437 of 1435 🔗

If you have ever seen her being interviewed, she is truly loathsome.

134360 ▶▶ Kev, replying to godowneasy, 5, #438 of 1435 🔗

Their unconstitutional draconian measures were ineffective, as they would be, so now they try and divert the blame back on the victims – us!

Its just victim shaming.

134391 ▶▶ Basics, replying to godowneasy, 5, #439 of 1435 🔗

The all our fault line blaming holidays and poor adherence to BS over the summer has been a narrative devi the nondelight has been putting out on twitter.

My point is there are team messages being ‘scripted or briefed’ into these public health mouth-pieces. Was ever thus, but it is more obvious than ever.

Two days ago they were all over vaccines second only to clean water.

What we won’t be hearing is War is the biggest threat to public health.

134349 polistra, 3, #440 of 1435 🔗

Commission under Jeffrey Sachs: Remember, Sachs is the same man who broke Russia’s economy to enrich Soros. We know which side he’s on. No mysteries or secrets.

134354 nickbowes, 7, #441 of 1435 🔗

The so called “Blue Wall” in Durham did not last long. Still, there will be a day of reckoning for these criminal morons.

134356 Bella Donna, 4, #442 of 1435 🔗

I spoke with my niece who lives in the Algarve. She said the children had only been to school for one day now they are home again because someone complained of feeling unwell. Now everyone is to be tested. She said she thinks the virus is more widespread than they let on. Isolation hospitals are spreading the suspected Covid patients around so as not to seem too concentrated in certain areas.

134362 MDH, replying to MDH, 18, #443 of 1435 🔗

More high-end retail news. Liberty is offering a £20 bri… discount if you set foot in their shop. Sorry, luv, but while the facemask BS continues, I shall be staying well clear. I wonder when the British Retail Consortium will get the message?

134369 ▶▶ Sally, replying to MDH, 8, #444 of 1435 🔗

Liberty is another one of those purveyors of “high end” masks, made from their famous lawn fabric. If they stop selling pretty face nappies I’ll consider purchasing from them, but then again probably not.

135247 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to MDH, 1, #445 of 1435 🔗

Nope. Still not going and they’re profiteering from selling overpriced muzzles in their signature print.

The BRC are asleep. Someone should really wake them up before there will be nothing left to represent.

134368 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 5, #446 of 1435 🔗

COVID vaccine patent warned of “deliberate coronavirus release”
WATCH: Startling investigation reveal top COVID vaccine manufacturer hinted at deliberate release of SARS coronavirus MONTHS before pandemic began
https://www.naturalhealth365.com/covid-vaccine-patent-3555.html

134484 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Victoria, 3, #447 of 1435 🔗

This is so important if people want to fully appreciate the ‘plan element’ of the ‘demic.
Dr David Martin is a sharp cookie (and a self-made rich guy who doesn’t have a career in jeopardy..)

134375 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 13, #448 of 1435 🔗

3 out of 10 now saying the Gov has handled COVID-19 well now in latest Yougov poll. It was 6 out of 10 last week, and 8 out 10 the week before. A fall of 51% in two weeks. Are people finally waking up?

134386 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JohnB, 3, #449 of 1435 🔗

Sounds like they are going to sleep, 7 out of 10 saying they are now doing ok ?

134388 ▶▶ Liam, replying to JohnB, 1, #450 of 1435 🔗

But they want stricter rules as a result.

134390 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Liam, 5, #451 of 1435 🔗

Yeah, that’s my worry too that they think we’ve not lockdown hard enough and that more testing is required. Based on their previous thinking then I doubt they want to end the lockdown.

134403 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to JohnB, #452 of 1435 🔗

Kairotic moment 😉

134404 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to JohnB, 2, #453 of 1435 🔗

They certainly need to wake up! So far they’ve been acting like Covid Zombies, brain dead!

134409 ▶▶ wayno, replying to JohnB, 4, #454 of 1435 🔗

Just been on the yougov poll site, as i feel it clearly isn’t targeting the likes of us, did 2 chats, they are completely loaded questions. Anyhoo i had an opportunity to feedback, so both barrels were unloaded. Will fall on deaf ears but its off my chest for a few mins.

134423 ▶▶ JYC, replying to JohnB, 6, #455 of 1435 🔗

There’s no one waking up in Scotland. What will it take? I was playing tennis last night and there is a bowling club with it. Pretty much all the bowlers were fully masked before going in for a drink. If there is then a curfew imposed, will that just be accepted? Is there any dehumanising, tyrannical imposition that this country will finally not accept? I never thought I would see such an absence of thinking for ourselves and no indication of any courage to challenge something so blatantly disproportionate and damaging.

134439 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to JYC, 4, #456 of 1435 🔗

It has beome so entwined into identity politics (another carefully constructed and executed PSYOP against the population) up here that The Cult initiates have associated any sort of dissent with being a supporter of Westminster/Trump etc.

Why would SNP and Sturgeon do damage to the country and people they love and want the best for? is the sort of level they are at. Virtue signalling also comes into the equation!

Scotland is already divided with political views, religious bigotry, parochialism anyway so their task up here was much easier than the rest of UK. Added to the footie, drink and bookies, Glamour media, trash tv like love island etc and you have a perfect way to control the ignorant masses. Twas ever thus!

Read this for a true flavour of the Sturgeon administration….

https://johnjamessite.com/2020/09/13/a-50m-meltdown/

There are people waking up and there are many of us already awake…..beware the wrath!

134508 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to JohnB, #457 of 1435 🔗

Yougov lol.

134385 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 9, #458 of 1435 🔗

12.30 R2 Jeremy Vine
Bigging up Swedens response and results covering all the positive points we are familiar with.
The closest Martin McKeest, Soas (?) got to criticising was to say Swedish people put themselves into voluntary lockdown.

Later Fraser Nelson from the Speccy, Swedish Parliament have moved onto other things, schools not shut down, most deaths were in nursing home, economy bouncing back, never worried about Second Wave.

LV ‘one of Swedens advantages was not being advised by Ferguson and his very unreliable forecasts’.

McKee conclusion, “Sweden is happy compromise between hard UK lockdown and free for all in USA.”

134387 ▶▶ Liam, replying to karenovirus, 7, #459 of 1435 🔗

There hasn’t been a “free for all in the USA”. Do these people ever, ever get anything right?

134393 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Liam, 5, #460 of 1435 🔗

I don’t think any US states have taken a “free for all” approach. A lot of them were as bad or worse as the UK and slower to lift restrictions. I think South Dakota were/are the least restrictive, but even they (I think) have taken a Sweden-like approach, with some initial restrictions which have mostly now been relaxed.

135554 ▶▶▶▶ Emily Tock, replying to Drawde927, #461 of 1435 🔗

Speaking as a US citizen who doesn’t buy into either the Republican OR Democratic hype, my take is that it was New York state which was the free-for-all, with Cuomo gutting the hospitals and health system before the virus arrived, then indemnifying nursing homes from responsibility and sending Covid-19 positive patiens to them. NY state has terrible death statistics in the US, partly because people live on top of each other in NYC, HCQ was denied patients, ventilators were killing people, and Cuomo is bought off by multiple sectors of the health-care industry.

134396 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Liam, 5, #462 of 1435 🔗

They get away with it every time too.

134415 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to karenovirus, 4, #463 of 1435 🔗

USA had a mix of hard lockdowns and freeish depending on State. They have lower deaths per million than us, so hardly the ‘catastrophe’ Jeremy Vine was implying. I think its just his way of having a go a Trump

134468 ▶▶▶ kf99, replying to steve_w, 5, #464 of 1435 🔗

The final caller got away with something like “we couldn’t have voluntary rules like Sweden as we’re too rebellious” – and gave facemasks as an example. No time for comeback regarding Swedes not actually wearing any…

135498 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to steve_w, #465 of 1435 🔗

It wasn’t Jeremy Vine said that, it was his pro lockdown guest.

134394 Eldred Godson, replying to Eldred Godson, 1, #466 of 1435 🔗

To be fair #Boris is playing #GetBrexitDone with a pretty straight bat, and as for Cov19 he and Cummings are consummate political Hos…and are just giving the electorate what they want (which ‘coincidentally’ chimes with Cummings silicone valley vision). Just a shame it turns out the electorate are into S&M in such a big way. I guess we shouldn’t be surprised, we knew the Brits always had a bit of a thing for Ms Whiplash… https://youtu.be/kwaahcz0VxY

134398 ▶▶ Eldred Godson, replying to Eldred Godson, 4, #467 of 1435 🔗

And who would you replace him with? The Serpent Gove? The Lizard ‘unt? The only two I’d see in post are Steven Baker or Michael Fabricant, and I don’t think either of them want the gig….

134425 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Eldred Godson, 20, #468 of 1435 🔗

Brexit is irrelevant now

The PM, Cabinet and MPs have colluded in the biggest blunder in UK government history, a blunder that has cost many lives

They deliberately increased levels of fear and panic, and continue to do so, using taxpayers money to bribe the media

“Only following orders” is not a credible defence

Ideally he would be replaced by someone outside parliament, but failing that, someone is has played less of a leading role in the lies and stupidity, who can apologise, admit it was a mistake and move us on

In any case, he has to go and cannot be forgiven

134442 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Julian, 10, #469 of 1435 🔗

Agree Julian. The whole Cabinet needs to go.

134443 ▶▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #470 of 1435 🔗

The whole system more like!

134480 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Julian, #471 of 1435 🔗

Brexit allows for belt and braces societal meltdown.

134505 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Julian, 1, #472 of 1435 🔗

Agree, they all need to go. I find it pretty difficult to be enthusiastic about Brexit or anything to do with this country right now. I would not have said that before March.

134416 ▶▶ anon, replying to Eldred Godson, 12, #473 of 1435 🔗

The fat controller aka Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson is a fucking traitor mate

Straight bat ffs

134477 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Eldred Godson, 2, #474 of 1435 🔗

The reality is that they are rapidly constructing 29 lorry parks across the country (after giving themselves the planning permission to do so..).
You may ask yourself why they are doing this on the quiet.
Not what I’d call a straight bat.

This is likely to follow:-
https://www.businessinsider.com/no-deal-brexit-percentage-british-food-imported-shortages-2019-1?r=US&IR=T

134397 godowneasy, 7, #475 of 1435 🔗

Theme tune suggestion:

The WHO – Won’t get fooled again.

Watch the amazing video for an uplift:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDfAdHBtK_Q

134402 Basics, replying to Basics, 14, #476 of 1435 🔗

908k views in a week.
Ivor Cummins
Most excellent State of the Stats 8/9 video. It can’t harm reposting it, I’ll give up at 1 million. It is simply excellent so many have watched it and taken in clear official information.

https://youtu.be/8UvFhIFzaac

134572 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Basics, 2, #477 of 1435 🔗

Comprehensive take down of someone trying to debunk him too.

https://youtu.be/eKKIr425b40

134426 Charlie Blue, 8, #478 of 1435 🔗

William Wragg in commons saying the enquiry into the government’s response to covid-19 should not be delayed (Committee Statement) and encouraging devolved administrations to launch their own enquiries. “The committee expects the government to take a comply or explain approach “

134428 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 29, #479 of 1435 🔗

Went to a big Tesco today to do a shop, wife was getting that frustrated and belligerent at the idiocy on display that we decided to do a very big shop so that for the next couple of months we only need to buy fresh fruit and veg if we get bored eating frozen or tinned stuff. Also might not have the money or there might not be any food in the shops next month or be in a re-education camp.

It is certainly getting easier to to all this free-faced.

There were a few high points though:

  • saw about 6 free faced in the shop, that is a first. Normally just us.
  • shop and about 20% of the usual numbers for a Thursday in it
  • about 75% of those with masks and them below the nose including those in nursing uniforms
  • a few people in a group pushing older physically/mentally handicapped in wheelchairs, not a mask in sight
  • no-one would look us in the eye show as masked but they looked sheepish and cowed more than scared though.
  • did say in a lot voice a few times “wonder if the mask wearers are falling the government’s 17 lines of guidance?” and “why bother half wearing a mask below they nose? May as well take it off as it’s useless like that” and similar comments with the wife enjoying the stir we caused rather than telling me to shut up and getting pissed off with me like she did which and eat more fun.
  • very few staff in masks and/or visors
  • had enough watching people pulled down the mask, rub their nose, pull up the mask then start touching the food again so a few times in a very loud voice I said “that’s bloody disgusting, playing with bacteria a laden face cloth then wiping your hand over your bacteria covered face then playing with food without washing your hands. Disgusting. No wonder rates infection rates won’t drop if people are this disgusting.” making sure a lot of people heard me. Repeated about 6 times going round the shop. Wife told me that when I said this there were many people giving a guilty start/jump/look at me then turning way and slinking off. One of the worst offenders was in a nursing uniform so should have known better.
  • ha ha ha fuck ’em if they can’t take a joke.
  • bumped into an acquaintance who does a bit of specialist food delivery from importers. He said that he’s noticed over the last 6 weeks or so there is more and more stuff not coming into the supply chain from overseas and he thinks it’s going to get worse as he’s contacted the people he normally delivers for and they’ve told him they cannot get the foodstuffs they want as it’s not being harvested or exported from where it’s grown.
  • best bit was at the checkout checking to the bloke my age on the till. I mentioned about how disgusting people were with the masks and he said “yep, that’s why I don’t wear one. Notice how many of them have a new cough? I won’t wear one and they can’t make me” – I did as me and the wife discussed it while doing doing the shop. Total sceptic. He also mentioned that staff are getting coughs and staring to report sick even though since March they have had very few people off ill and these were for things that had no relation to flu/colds/coughs etc.
134446 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Awkward Git, 19, #480 of 1435 🔗

Interesting that comment of the person on the check-out.

I’ve just had a conversation with a nurse about the enforced wearing of a mask, confirming the clear harm that they do after a day’s continual wear.

135501 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to RickH, 1, #481 of 1435 🔗

Wave of Bronchial tract infections coming the way of the NHS, my nurse mum thought we’d seen the last of those in the 60’s.

134449 ▶▶ PD, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #482 of 1435 🔗

“Fuck ‘em if they can’t take a joke.”

Love to see a fellow follower of JR Bob Dobbs.

134904 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to PD, 3, #483 of 1435 🔗

I like this – it’s howdy wife and I are starting to act.

134472 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #484 of 1435 🔗

https://www.stroudnewsandjournal.co.uk/news/national/18726947.operation-stack-finishes-huge-queues-lorries-stretch-dover/
Glad to hear you are well stocked, food supply chain is fragile, not helped when there’s also a terrorism alert, like yesterday.

134503 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #485 of 1435 🔗

Your penultimate bullet point concerns me.

134575 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to jhfreedom, 5, #486 of 1435 🔗

It’s been concerning me for a while, I’ve been slowly stockpiling. Becoming a bit worried about how much the teenagers in the house eat too!

134908 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to jhfreedom, 3, #487 of 1435 🔗

Polycarbonate for roofing/conservatories is also hard to get – made from oil like most fertiliser.

134585 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #488 of 1435 🔗

There’s no appreciation of risk. A mask increases your risk of infection if used in the current environment just by the most probable use case compared to the theoretical transmission rate (again which appears to be zero compared to the flu)

The net harm to yourself if worse with mask wearing yet people are wearing masks.

134433 Leemc23, replying to Leemc23, 22, #489 of 1435 🔗

So following Furlough and a return to work on 70% salary, my Mrs company have now compelled the entire work force to accepting a clause where the company can reduce wages to £30 a day for 4 weeks, every 3 months “due to the economic crisis”

Take it or leave it.

Although redundancy has been avoided it’s this kind of shit that won’t be reported on and really affects families. Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson – your fault. End of.

134438 ▶▶ Braveheart, replying to Leemc23, 7, #490 of 1435 🔗

But surely that’s WELL under minimum wage limits? Really sorry to hear about that happening.

You’re also correct that this shit will not be part of the formal stats. This pack of buffoons have a lot to answer for.

134695 ▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Braveheart, 2, #491 of 1435 🔗

That is a very good point and torpedos the whole proposal I would imagine. Thank you.

134463 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Leemc23, 1, #492 of 1435 🔗

Unenforceable do to minimum wage regulations.

134696 ▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Lucan Grey, #493 of 1435 🔗

I think you are right. Thank you.

134698 ▶▶ Stuart Barker, replying to Leemc23, 3, #494 of 1435 🔗

The circumstances in which they can ‘force’ anybody to accept a change to their employment contract are tightly restricted. It is remarkable the number of companies who seem to think otherwise, somewhat missing the point of it being a contract in the first place.

They can make life miserable if you refuse – but that’s constructive dismissal.

Take a look at https://www.landaulaw.co.uk/coronavirus-and-cutting-pay/ for example

134441 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 25, #495 of 1435 🔗

A few short months ago, the only notable sceptics were Toby and Peter Hitchens. Now I’m finding I can follow a selection of people on Twitter without blowing my top. I can even add BBC’s Dr Chris Smith to the growing list now.

The tide is turning.

134465 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #496 of 1435 🔗

Except people have been saying that here for the last 5 months, unfortunately.

134516 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tom Blackburn, 7, #497 of 1435 🔗

Mass civil disobedience is the only way the tide will turn.The government have adopted a scorched earth policy on the economy to save us from a threat that is less than seasonal flu

134444 PD, 12, #498 of 1435 🔗

Mingle for Freedom

134450 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 10, #499 of 1435 🔗

Dr Mike Yeadon: ‘Government are using a Covid-19 test with undeclared false positive rates.’
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch7wze46md0&nbsp ;

The former scientific advisor at Pfizer, Dr Mike Yeadon, has reissued his challenge to the Health Secretary Matt Hancock regarding the coronavirus testing.

You must view this interview on Talk Radio with Julia Hartley Brewer and pass it on. The Government a killing this country for nothing

134466 ▶▶ DocRC, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 4, #500 of 1435 🔗

Mike Yeadon talking a lot of sense but we know from my piece yesterday on Lockdown Sceptics that NHS England produced 2 papers estimating the false positive rate is 2.3% (estimated range 0.8-4%)

134488 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to DocRC, #501 of 1435 🔗

Too many “upticks” from Hartley-Brewer but, an excellent interview. So question to you Mr Hancock – “What is the false positive rate on PCR tests?” Has no one asked him, or if they have, does he just bat the question away, or what?

134579 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Tenchy, 1, #502 of 1435 🔗

He was asked the other day in parliament but he evaded the question with lots of obfuscation and dissembling.

134451 DocRC, replying to DocRC, 17, #503 of 1435 🔗

So here is the reply of my MP to an email I wrote asking her what had happened to Parliamentary scrutiny when Hancock is ruling by statutory instrument.

“Thank you for your e-mail regarding the use of statutory instruments.

Statutory Instruments (SIs) are generally used to add information or make changes to existing legislation. Some SIs receive more scrutiny than others, but all receive scrutiny in Parliament and require a form of consent from Parliamentarians. They draw their power from Acts of Parliament, and cannot be enacted without overarching legislation.

SIs which are subject to the negative procedure are first scrutinised by the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments. This Committee examines the SI to ensure that it is legal and limited to the powers provided for in existing legislation. The House of Commons and the House of Lords then have 40 days in which to annul the SI if they so choose.

A small number of SIs are subject to the affirmative procedure and receive a greater level of scrutiny. After scrutiny from the Joint Committee, a Delegated Legislation Committee will debate the SI before it is approved by Parliament. Only once these stages are successful can a Minister make an SI.

I can assure you that major legislation will always be delivered by Acts of Parliament but I believe it is right that secondary legislation is used when more minor changes are required.”

So that’s alright then. Secondary legislation is used where “more minor changes are required” such as locking us in our homes, closing down the economy, denying our children an education, telling us how many friends and family we can mingle with and making us wear muzzles!

134453 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to DocRC, 7, #504 of 1435 🔗

And introducing an unlicensed vaccine for mass roll-out.

134590 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #505 of 1435 🔗

And creating a DNA and fingerprint database for reasons of “National Security” – linked to a virus?

134467 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to DocRC, 8, #506 of 1435 🔗

Is she taking the piss? or she stupid?

Currently 391 pieces of legislation enacted with the word “coronavirus” in the title and no parliamentary debate?

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/primary+secondary?title=coronavirus

And the committee she mentions doesn’t seem to do much scrutiny:

https://committees.parliament.uk/committee/148/statutory-instruments-joint-committee/events/

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt5801/jtselect/jtstatin/64/6402.htm

134469 ▶▶▶ DocRC, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #507 of 1435 🔗

I agree but she is a junior Government minister so following the party line. She reminds me of The Vicar of Bray as she was a minister under Mrs May and kept her job under Johnson. When May was trying to sell Brexit down the river with her “deal” this MP defended it as the best deal available!

134949 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #508 of 1435 🔗

I wish the speaker could intervene in this – 391 SIs is a joke and clearly a sign that we are living in a dictatorship.. It is abuse of Parliament, so surely there must be some rule they are breaking that would allow the speaker to intervene?

134487 ▶▶ RickH, replying to DocRC, 3, #509 of 1435 🔗

You are absolutely spot on. If anyone thinks that this is about ‘minor changes’, they want there bumps felt or to be locked up safely because of their delusions.

Such is the quality of democracy in this country : shite!

134493 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RickH, 1, #510 of 1435 🔗

Unfit to be a minister

134573 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to DocRC, 1, #511 of 1435 🔗

Makes one wonder what major changes would be? Napalming areas of high positive test cases? How about a hydrogen bomb on Manchester? Do virons survive temperatures around a couple of hundred million degrees C?

134681 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Cicatriz, 2, #512 of 1435 🔗

hydrogen bomb on Manchester? would anyone notice?

134846 ▶▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to mjr, 1, #513 of 1435 🔗

Make sure north London is inside the blast radii. And a minimum of three MOABs please

135013 ▶▶▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Chris John, #514 of 1435 🔗

Yes, certainly, but please wait until I can put a seat on the top of the Chilterns so I can enjoy the spectacle.

134454 B Boru, 2, #515 of 1435 🔗

https://covileaks.co.uk

Another good site for information folks

134461 Caramel, replying to Caramel, 12, #516 of 1435 🔗

It’s okay to want to marry someone for their citizenship so that you can escape the Melbourne gulag, yeah?

134608 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Caramel, #517 of 1435 🔗

I might put myself on ebay – Australia has ebay ?

134462 Lucan Grey, replying to Lucan Grey, 5, #518 of 1435 🔗

Oh the joy of living in Northern England.

From Friday 18th September, regulations will lawfully ban the following:

Residents must not socialise with other people outside of their own households in private homes and gardens

All hospitality for food and drink will be restricted to table service only

Late night restriction of operating hours will be introduced, with venues required to close between 10pm to 5am.

134470 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to Lucan Grey, 9, #519 of 1435 🔗

I live in the SW but born in Manchester. Breaks my heart to see good northern folk treated like that. We are rooting for you all down here in Devon.

134485 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to William Hand, 3, #520 of 1435 🔗

The geographical spread of these shut-ups is fascinating.

134492 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to RickH, 3, #521 of 1435 🔗

They seem in general to be avoiding Tory heartlands. Maybe coincidence.

134502 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Julian, 1, #522 of 1435 🔗

Blyth Valley MP is Tory, and ex-NHS – they need to be a bit careful because he will have contacts in the local trusts.

134521 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #523 of 1435 🔗

It’s the top management of the NHS that is one of the problems – deeply embedded in rubbish ‘science’.

134498 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to William Hand, 2, #524 of 1435 🔗

No-nonsense Northerners deserve better than this.

135024 ▶▶▶▶ Enjoyeverysandwich, replying to jhfreedom, #525 of 1435 🔗

Indeedy…no one should. As we are about to return back to Whitley bay having spent an almost normal week over in the lakes. It will be interesting how the new guidance is interpreted by the stasi to increase the levels of nonsense to the shit show that this turning out to be.

134536 ▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to William Hand, #526 of 1435 🔗

Don’t worry, the S of England is up next..Then you can live this beautiful existence in person

134497 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Lucan Grey, 3, #527 of 1435 🔗

Defy it

134511 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to jhfreedom, 4, #528 of 1435 🔗

The only way to go. The government has no business legislating who citizens can and cannot meet. Even less so on private property.

134944 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lucan Grey, 2, #529 of 1435 🔗

So with each new lockdown in a different area, they make stricter rules – there was no night curfew in Leicester, was there?

134471 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 7, #530 of 1435 🔗

https://twitter.com/AlistairHaimes/status/1306547492193005569?s=20 .

I have to agree with Alastair Haines about the wheels coming off the bus this week. We’ve already seen Wee Kranky being forced to admit hospital numbers were over egged in Scotland. A few weeks ago it was 5,377 taken off the death count in England and Wales and 1.3 million tests removed because of double counting.

The government have also sent new advice to laboratories about changes to the testing procedures, updated on September 9th.

https ://www.gov.uk/government/publications/sars-cov-2-rna-testing-assurance-of-positive-results-during-periods-of-low-prevalence/assurance-of-sars-cov-2-rna-positive-results-during-periods-of-low-prevalence

”As disease prevalence falls, the positive predictive value of diagnostic tests reduces.”
“Currently, problems of interpretation are seen particularly in relation to positive results at the limits of detection”
”The clinical significance of these positive results, at the limit of detection of the assay, are difficult to interpret in the absence of a clinical history and context”

Labs must now carry out two tests if the positive result comes from the extremes of testing ie if a low number of cycles or a very high number of cycles are required to get a positive result. In pillar one tests, they can use the same sample to retest but in pillar 2 they have to ask for a new sample.

I don’t buy into this “shortage of testing capacity”. I see this and the local lockdowns as a smokescreen. The number of hospitalisations and deaths is not going up to any great degree so they have to pretend that it is their actions which are having an effect on the numbers.

134483 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Margaret, 3, #532 of 1435 🔗

The problem is, with the wheels coming off, they’ve decided to set fire to the bus.

134558 ▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to RickH, #533 of 1435 🔗

That’s a precautionary-principle way to kill the virus. I didn’t need transport anywhere, did you?

134486 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 1, #534 of 1435 🔗

Purely anecdotal so don’t shoot the messenger, Edinburgh Napier university reporting a spike in positive cases and big cheese from Edinburgh university summoned to holyrood to answer questions.

Get ready for either university closure or total lockdown

134519 ▶▶ RickH, replying to stefarm, 3, #535 of 1435 🔗

As always, we have two semantic problems :

  1. ‘Spike’ = ????
  2. ‘Case’ = ????

The two terms are absolutely meaningless unless defined in proper scientific terms. Thus the whole f.ing problem we have in dealing with the knuckle-draggers.

134602 ▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, #536 of 1435 🔗

Napier canal side halls at fountainbridge apparently had a designated cluster or some such. That was news last night, Holyrood invitation sounds like theatre is getting dramatic.

134490 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 6, #537 of 1435 🔗

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-covid-hysteria-is-getting-worse

Lionel Shriver at her incisive best.

Secondly, an amusing scene spotted this morning: while walking along the seafront, I stopped as usual, to observe the many birds on the shoreline and the rocky outcrops: waders, black headed gulls and, unusually, the cheerful ‘chacking’ of jackdaws.

These birds,while versatile and adaptable,usually congregate inland; however, my search for the source of the chatter revealed a lone jackdaw, busily foraging on the exposed sand flats and talking away to itself.

No others in sight; I watched for 5 minutes as it chortled away,finally deciding that the covid derangement has afflicted the bird world as well,since this lone bird was apparently deep in conversation with itself.

Perhaps an urgent message to Chief Inquisitor Hancock might be in order: an avian lockdown is now on the cards!

134495 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to wendyk, 2, #538 of 1435 🔗

She is brilliant. I am reading her new book on exercise and laughing like a lunatic.

Maybe the jackdaw read it too…

134504 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to jhfreedom, #539 of 1435 🔗

There’s a thought: birds, spread the words of Lionel, our beacon of good sense and rationality.

134522 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to wendyk, 3, #540 of 1435 🔗

Excellent. Interesting how she is beginning to edge towards conspiracy rather than stupidity as a source of this madness.

134560 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to wendyk, 5, #541 of 1435 🔗

Corvid 19…

134609 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #542 of 1435 🔗

I’ve been shouting ‘Go away Covids’ at our jackdaws as they demolish the fatballs on our bird feeders. They ignore me, as usual. . . . MW

134685 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Sam Vimes, #543 of 1435 🔗

Brilliant!

134499 guy153, replying to guy153, 6, #544 of 1435 🔗

Been meaning to plot this for a while… This should hopefully show just how misleading that graph in the FT is.

The first graph is the number of “cases” in the UK, which were mostly real cases during the epidemic and are just positive tests now.

The second graph is a plausible SIR model of the number of new infections per day. This is something like what actually happened (obviously we had no idea of the true number of infections as were weren’t testing anyone until it was all over, and we certainly weren’t testing everyone).

The third graph is the two super-imposed and drawn to the same scale. In other words these are the UK “cases” viewed in the perspective of reality. You need quite sharp eyes to even see the test results.

134506 ▶▶ wayno, replying to guy153, 1, #545 of 1435 🔗

I did the same earlier on in the week, as most of the overlays are on a log scale which misrepresents the data for general consumption. Not sure how to embed them here.

134537 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to wayno, 2, #546 of 1435 🔗

If you log on, you get an icon in the bottom right of the input box that allows images to be attached.

The graphs are brilliant.

134540 ▶▶▶▶ wayno, replying to Julian, 2, #547 of 1435 🔗

Ah, i wasnt logged in

134770 ▶▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to wayno, #548 of 1435 🔗

Very good illustration!

134541 ▶▶▶▶ wayno, replying to Julian, 1, #549 of 1435 🔗

another

134509 Toby Lewis, 2, #550 of 1435 🔗

The deaths registered weekly from the ONS mentioned in lockdownskeptics on the 16th https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending4september2020

has a downloadable set of data. If you sum the columns, the “Influenza and pneumonia mentions – 2020” total is 56k and the COVID mentions is 52k, so the area under the curves is already greater for flu than for COVID. This is an even stronger assertion than the headline claim which amends “Since June”. The total for flu is going to increase far more than the total for COVID over the coming weeks.

134512 Jonathan Palmer, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 11, #551 of 1435 🔗

Just read in the times they are considering curfew for London.The City is already dying due to lack of tourists and commuters.This will finish it off and me.This is a nightmare from which there is no end

134523 ▶▶ Alison9, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 7, #552 of 1435 🔗

It’s like they’re just working their way through the totalitarian playbook.

134564 ▶▶ Richard, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 7, #553 of 1435 🔗

It’s done. Worked there for 24 years – the people I know that have gone in are not staying in. Any bars or restaurants not open or open in the hope of a good Q4 must be on verge of defaulting on Q4 rents. The conditions for people going back are getting worse not better – seen bans for people returning to office for days if they have an external meeting. As have commented before the size of the service eco system set up for workers was enormous and not always immediately visable from the street – eg private dental clinic in basements etc. The impact on the London economy is vast

134587 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #554 of 1435 🔗

Am going into the City next Tuesday and will report back my findings. Suspect last visit of the year.

134517 HelzBelz, replying to HelzBelz, 3, #555 of 1435 🔗

Wancock this morning whilst delivering his latest rules for the little people – namely the reintroduction of lockdowns in the North East – stated that in addition to the usual bollox about more cases, that there are more people now on ventilators. Is this true, or is this just another piece of misinformation from the same department that told us that Sweden did actually, really and truly lock down? Because I thought the medical profession had decided that ventilators weren’t the best idea for Covid patients as they have a tendency to kill them. Or is that actually the point?

134547 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to HelzBelz, 2, #556 of 1435 🔗

I thought the medical profession had decided that ventilators weren’t the best idea for Covid patients as they have a tendency to kill them.

Yes ventilators are contraindicated for Covid patients, if it does not kill them (majority) then it seriously damages their lungs

134553 ▶▶▶ Achilles, replying to Victoria, 5, #557 of 1435 🔗

Well perhaps the people are on ventilators for the co-morbidity that is really killing them but just happen to have also tested positive for Covid?

134524 Bruno, 3, #558 of 1435 🔗

https://parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/52ee1eec-a2bf-403d-a27d-7bba077ebfcc
Watch live Commons Sceince & Tech Committee right now . Heneghan on:
break out the popcorn/ironing board in my case.

134525 Smelly Melly, replying to Smelly Melly, 13, #559 of 1435 🔗

The wife and I had a couple of days away in Surrey (intended to do some National Trusting but very few places open now) so we went into London for the day. Went to the Tate Modern, everybody except us were wearing nappies. One room attendant came up to us and said something but couldn’t understand her due to muzzle and visor, so ignored her. Later in another room see said loader “I see that your exempt, so why not wear a visor”, I just said no and carried on looking at the rubbish on display.

However, we then walked into the City, so many shops are closed and I’ve never seen the roads so clear (you can just walk across, almost without looking). The shops that are closed are the high end retailers, like tailors, jewellers etc, the stuff city traders buy.

When we went into restaurant’s they requested we register using the QR code track and trace system. We just said they are on charge in the hotel, so we had to fill in short form with name and phone number, both false. On the way back to the hotel we thought we’d have a drink in a pub and they said it was law to register using the QR track and trace, so we didn’t bother. Couldn’t be bothered to say it’s a guideline not the law.

Anyway, as the government want your personnel details so they can snoop on your movements, I’m in the fortunate position of knowing where Baroness Harding lives, just in case anybody would like her personal details.

134529 ▶▶ alw, replying to Smelly Melly, 2, #560 of 1435 🔗

Yes please. Staying at a hotel in Mudeford. As of tomorrow they will be taking temperatures of guests. Suggest we call out these jobsworths.

134746 ▶▶▶ anon, replying to alw, #561 of 1435 🔗

What a shame, lovely terrace in that hotel. Beautiful views

Stroppy staff when i was there though

From memory there is a decent pub with a thai restaurant in mudeford – lobster was delish

134584 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Smelly Melly, 4, #562 of 1435 🔗

Almost not worth going out. National Trust about to go bankrupt apparently. Shut all their cafes, goodbye revenue…

134911 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to jhfreedom, 1, #563 of 1435 🔗

I’ve just had a begging email from the Royal Albert Hall, which I’ve been expecting. When I’ve composed my reply I’ll post it here, though I have to find their email address for feedback as the begging email is from an unmonitored account.

134526 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #564 of 1435 🔗

Very interesting observation here:

https://twitter.com/Dierenbach/status/1306474718854217730

Karl Dierenbach@Dierenbach
Here are more thoughts regarding the possibility of a Covid floor in Colorado. First, as a reminder, both positivity and hospitalizations seem to have found a steady-state floor and have been at the same levels for weeks. STEADY-STATE LEVELS ARE NOT NATURAL!

134549 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Nobody2020, #565 of 1435 🔗

A very good point.Stable figures are unnatural for an epidemic and are due to other factors not related to the acute infection of the virus.

134527 Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 12, #566 of 1435 🔗

Boris Johnson on grassing up your neighbours,  “But I think what is reasonable for anyone to do is if they think there is a serious threat to public health as a result of their neighbour’s activities — if there is some huge kind of Animal House party taking place, as I am sure, hot tubs and so forth, and there is a serious threat to public health then it’s reasonable for the authorities to know.”

‘Animal House Party” “hot tubs and so forth”

This guy is the PM FFS.

134528 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 3, #567 of 1435 🔗

Though at least it hints that normal gatherings will be overlooked. Some common sense in there, even if you believe big parties don’t make any difference (I certainly don’t think they do).

134533 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to jhfreedom, 4, #568 of 1435 🔗

True. Like everything so far, compulsory and voluntary at the same time. Let’s see if the public realise.

134922 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to jhfreedom, 2, #569 of 1435 🔗

Yes, basically he’s just given us carte blanche to do anything but have an “Animal House Party” with hot tubs…

134927 ▶▶▶▶ Paul, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #570 of 1435 🔗

So if I send the hot tubs back and tell Kevin Bacon he’s not invited anymore,I should be okay ?.

135333 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to A. Contrarian, #571 of 1435 🔗

It gives the police an excuse not to turn up for trivial tale-telling. They just need to ask if there’s a hot tub involved …..

134530 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 4, #572 of 1435 🔗

So why make it a law?

134532 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 5, #573 of 1435 🔗

He is the biggest threat to public health.

134534 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 7, #574 of 1435 🔗

His use of language, for someone who is supposedly articulate and well educated, becomes more infantile all the time

134546 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Julian, 1, #575 of 1435 🔗

Well, it probably disproves my earlier theory that he’s had his brain replaced with some kind of super advanced alien AI as that would probably be a lot more intelligible.

134556 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Julian, 2, #576 of 1435 🔗

It’s quite bizarre.

134555 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 4, #577 of 1435 🔗

Doesn’t it make him ‘down with the kids’ – at least kids in the seventies? I am trying not to picture Bozo in a toga…

134581 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 2, #578 of 1435 🔗

The thought of an Animal House Party (what is that? Is it as fun as it sounds?) with hot tubs has never seemed so appealing.

Yesterday I suggested Zoom events for us as a more social complement to the forum. But maybe we could try out the Animal House Parties with hot tubs as well? Who’s game?

134531 Will, 3, #579 of 1435 🔗

Brilliant piece in the Telegraph co authored by Levitt which succinctly and trenchantly nails the seroprevalence discrepancies seen around the world. I can’t seem to link to it for some reason but well worth a search.

134535 NappyFace, replying to NappyFace, 4, #580 of 1435 🔗

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lockdown-sceptics-are-distorting-the-science-xvzcm2sr5

This is interesting- unfortunately there is a paywall. He touches on a number of points but doesn’t fully confront the scientific counter arguments, nor does he fully face up to the damage eg 130 million pushed to starvation, 500 million pushed into poverty, all the cancer and heart disease deaths, however overall it’s exactly what’s needed ie to recognise other scientists are saying something different and addressing the counter argument.

134543 ▶▶ CGL, replying to NappyFace, 1, #581 of 1435 🔗

Thanks – was asking if anyone had seen that.

134642 ▶▶ A Heretic, replying to NappyFace, 1, #582 of 1435 🔗

His opening sentence is total bullshit so I’m not expecting it to get any better.

134542 alw, replying to alw, 4, #583 of 1435 🔗

Christmas is not within Boris or any other politicians gift. A totally pathetic fool. People will do as they please.

134552 ▶▶ Julian, replying to alw, 2, #584 of 1435 🔗

Except that sadly many won’t, and many others will have their options limited if they want to eat or celebrate outside of their own homes

134567 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to alw, 4, #585 of 1435 🔗

I’d be more than happy to stick two fingers up at Boris and carry on with Christmas as normal… but my OH is worried that if we break the rules, and if (unlikely as it is) she gets caught, she could be deported because although she has indefinite leave to remain in the UK, any criminal conviction could result in termination of her leave to remain. High stakes.

134545 MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 3, #586 of 1435 🔗
134550 alw, replying to alw, 23, #587 of 1435 🔗

As seen on Avon Beach Mudeford. Clearly not everyone supports the NHS. Bravo

134574 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to alw, 8, #588 of 1435 🔗

Oh god, the pebble shrine. There was one here outside the Church Hall. I did similar (something along the lines of “Rise up and reclaim your liberty”) – it got ‘moderated’ This was then replaced with, and I am not joking, ‘Colin the Covid Cobra’ It is situated alongside the graveyard which I find particularly distasteful. I ripped down the sign that asked that the pebbles not be removed and I give ‘Colin’ a good kick on the way to my mum’s grave. Asinine shite …. but good on the person not ‘on message’.

134920 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to kh1485, 2, #589 of 1435 🔗

I kicked a load of pebbles off the path the other day,oh,no!,what if it was an NHS shrine ?,what have I done ?,oh the humanity……

134557 alw, replying to alw, 3, #590 of 1435 🔗

As seen on pathway to seashore at Steamer Point Nature Reserve near Mudeford. Obviously a warning for bedwetters.

134561 ▶▶ alw, replying to alw, #591 of 1435 🔗

Correction

134563 ▶▶▶ alw, replying to alw, #592 of 1435 🔗

For some reason the image appears upside down. Can’t correct.

134582 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to alw, 2, #593 of 1435 🔗

Don’t worry about that I can turn my monitor around.

135344 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to alw, #594 of 1435 🔗

Actually it’s very appropriate that way up!

134562 Mr Jim McGregor, 10, #595 of 1435 🔗

Front page on BBC website today (at 3pm) headlines:

  • Hancock announces north-east restrictions
  • Czech cases surpass 2000 in a day
  • Quarantine should remain 14 days – WHO
  • Stricter coronavirus for seven areas
  • People waiting longer for virus test results
  • ‘Frustration’ as county’s lockdown set to begin
  • Next says pandemic ‘expensive and miserable
  • What’s going wrong with coronavirus testing?

So the usual well-balanced and considered coverage that drives us onto sites like this.

134569 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Sam Vimes, #597 of 1435 🔗

speechless but laughing

134578 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Sam Vimes, 1, #598 of 1435 🔗

You can’t even get them for false advertising either, as brass / copper is anti bacteria, hence Victorian era brassware making a comeback.
Note they state bacteria and not viruses!

134601 ▶▶ tonys, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #599 of 1435 🔗

High Zinc content, you would be better off swallowing it.

134924 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to tonys, 2, #600 of 1435 🔗

Can give it a lick now and then for extra protection.

134568 Steve, replying to Steve, 10, #601 of 1435 🔗

I managed to see my dentist this morning, as I’d needed two fillings for a couple of months and I was getting worried I might have to have a tooth removed if they got worse.

Luckily they’re now offering more appointments, though I had to triage on the phone with the dentist first.

When I knocked on the front door (which was locked to stop people walking in randomly) I had to talk through the letter box to the receptionist as I couldn’t make out what she was saying through the door and her mask!

They’re only allowing one patient in at a time, so thankfully I didn’t have to wear a mask to wait. I had my temperature taken with a remote thermometer and had to sanitise my hands, which was fair enough.

Everyone was masked up with gloves, aprons and other PPE. I got the impression they were really glad to be seeing patients as they were friendly and chatty.

The appointment went well, temporary fillings without any drilling.

On the way out I had a good chat with the staff, who really seemed happy to spend time to talk. They told me that if the dentist had to use the drill they have to book an hours appointment and then wait an hour afterwards to let the ‘aerosols’ settle before cleaning! As you can imagine that doesn’t leave a lot of time to see many patients.

They were fed up with the masks (one girl said she found it hard to breathe), and seemed pretty covid sceptical and fed up of the precautions they had to take, but of course they had no choice. I mentioned I hated masks and avoided going anywhere wearing one and one of them mentioned her boyfriend was like me and never wore a mask, saying he’s exempt. She also said that unmasked staff in the shop DFS (which was empty of other customers) had told them to leave because they weren’t wearing masks!

So at once a depressing experience due to the over-the-top precautions taken, but a welcome one due to the excellent staff who have to put up with this nonsence.

134753 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Steve, 1, #602 of 1435 🔗

By contrast to your infirmatuve account here is how politicians talk dentists. Credit edinburghlive

“Rachel Hamilton has asked why private dentists can give fillings but NHS ones can’t. [Gasp! – the dirty rotter!]
The Scottish Conservative MSP for Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire asked why one of her constituents couldn’t get a filling as an NHS patient, but could if she went private. Nicola Sturgeon answered: “The Chief Dental Officer has spent a lot of time making sure this guidance is right…that now allows a limited aerosol generating set of procedures but there are still restrictions.” She says they expect private dentists to abide by the same rules and regulations – but they have a different relationship with these dentists though so they don’t have the same ability to insist on that as with the NHS.

134580 Ian, replying to Ian, 5, #603 of 1435 🔗

Heneghan nailing it!

134583 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Ian, 5, #604 of 1435 🔗

Yes, he is superb. Waite is a government shill. Richardson doesn’t know her arse from her elbow!

134594 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #605 of 1435 🔗

Absolutely brilliant. Surely this must start to penetrate.

134589 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Ian, 6, #606 of 1435 🔗

he’s done the lot. Cycle rates, false positives, seasonally endemic, population being terrorised, not an epidemic by any measure

134596 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Ian, 4, #607 of 1435 🔗

Chair seemed to be a sceptic too

134600 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 4, #608 of 1435 🔗

Well I have been writing to him.

134604 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Bruno, #609 of 1435 🔗

nice! who is it?

134613 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 1, #610 of 1435 🔗

Greg Clark MP

134618 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Bruno, 3, #611 of 1435 🔗

thanks – I’m watching him skewer Dido Harding now

134606 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to steve_w, 5, #612 of 1435 🔗

He is very smart, and a decent guy – I know from an associate. He will buy into what Carl said.

134610 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #613 of 1435 🔗

He seemed to be leading it from a sceptic POV. Almost leading Carl to say what he wanted Carl to say. Top stuff!

134623 ▶▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to steve_w, 1, #614 of 1435 🔗

Makes for a pleasant change!

134598 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Ian, 7, #615 of 1435 🔗

The degree of ignorance being displayed by the committee members is staggering. Here we are in the middle of the worst economic, health and educational crisis this country has seen in my lifetime and some woman MP is wittering on about tests using electron microscope detection of the virus. As if that were the problem. KNOWING about this stuff is their JOB!!!

134591 2 pence, 2, #616 of 1435 🔗

Bundesliga: German states give green light to nationwide return of spectatorsGermany’s 16 federal states have reached an agreement that will allow a limited number of fans return to football stadiums across the country. The states are to review the pilot project in six weeks’ time.

https://www.dw.com/en/bundesliga-german-states-give-green-light-to-nationwide-return-of-spectators/a-54944681

134592 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 3, #617 of 1435 🔗

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3563.full?ijkey=fb7IwiBWN21zMIF&keytype=ref# Covid-19: Do many people have pre-existing immunity? Important article published BMJ
 “T cell studies may also help shed light on other mysteries of covid-19, such as why children have been surprisingly spared the brunt of the pandemic, why it affects people differently, and the high rate of asymptomatic infections in children and young adults.
The immunologists I spoke to agreed that T cells could be a key factor that explains why places like New York, London, and Stockholm seem to have experienced a wave of infections and no subsequent resurgence. This would be because protective levels of immunity, not measurable through serology alone but instead the result of a combination of pre-existing and newly formed immune responses, could now exist in the population, preventing an epidemic rise in new infections.”

134619 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to swedenborg, 2, #618 of 1435 🔗

It’s amazing how fools like Ferguson can speak with such certainty of numbers when it’s clear even immunologists have little idea about how it spreads and how our wonderful bodies deal with the virus.

134670 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to OKUK, #619 of 1435 🔗

Might have something to do with the dollars he is paid to say it. Gates’ bitch!

134599 Kate, replying to Kate, 6, #620 of 1435 🔗

Professor Henegan was excellent, but this Committee is a fine example of technological ideas and (at times) fantasies multiplying to the detriment of common sense and medical experience

134652 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to Kate, 1, #621 of 1435 🔗

Yes not fit for purpose.

134605 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 7, #622 of 1435 🔗

You win some, you lose some!
Went to my doctor’s surgery just to have “bloods” and blood pressure taken.
The receptionist met me with “Have you sanitized?,are you feeling well? have you got a temperature? etc,etc.,etc,etc
I thought of “coming out” as a sceptic to the nurse but when I was confronted with “We are still alive not like thousands of others so we must be thankful” and so on, I thought better of it, then she told me that when I went out to use my elbows to push the pads to open the doors.
Not one of this sceptic’s better days.

134628 ▶▶ Alison9, replying to Fingerache Philip., 6, #623 of 1435 🔗

I thought we were told to sneeze into our elbows!

134713 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Alison9, #624 of 1435 🔗

Yes, but you have to do that at the same time (well,they started it)

134906 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Fingerache Philip., 3, #625 of 1435 🔗

The thing is though I would imagine the nurse only has sympathy for those that have died from/of/with Covid,I bet she has never once given a thought for the far,far larger number of poor souls that have died from every other possible cause on the planet everyday.

134612 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #626 of 1435 🔗

The Baroness Harding is being taken apart by Greg Clark and she’s only been on for 5 mins.

134615 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #627 of 1435 🔗

he nicely bollocked her for testing people without symptoms. now she keeps referring to Carl positively

134629 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #628 of 1435 🔗

Yup, got her on the back foot. And she’s digging. But why isn’t he questioning whether all this testing is pointless, by following up Carl H’s point about indiscriminate testing???

134631 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Bruno, 2, #629 of 1435 🔗

hopefully he’s just warming up….

134648 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Bruno, 3, #630 of 1435 🔗

Yes I do not understand why we need tests at all.

Surely if you have symptoms you stay home and isolate. Why do you need a test? You know you are ill.

If you do not have symptoms why test?

There would only be a small window of a few days or so between picking up corona and developing symptoms and you would not be very infectious (if at all) in that period. Unless you test everyone all day long how can this testing lead to anything productive?

The only useful area to test in would be NHS staff and hospitals to prevent hospitals acting as hubs for transmission to vulnerable patients..

134697 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Kate, 1, #631 of 1435 🔗

Tests allow for the possibility of positive results, which allows for contact tracing, which allows for ‘hotspots’, which allows for local lockdowns, which allows for regional lockdowns..

I’ll stop there.

134728 ▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Kate, 2, #632 of 1435 🔗

Unless you test everyone all day long how can this testing lead to anything productive?

Don’t give them ideas!

Makes far more sense simply to advise people to stay home if they feel sick – doesn’t really matter much whether actually is covid-19, flu or just a cold. Isn’t that what we used to do before people lost their heads this year?

(And obviously, if it gets worse or you are particularly vulnerable, then maybe see a doctor. Though I think we also abolished that idea this year too.)

134638 ▶▶ SmokeandMirrors, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #633 of 1435 🔗

This guy is a BREATH of FRESH AIR!!

134649 ▶▶ NappyFace, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #634 of 1435 🔗

What are you watching?

134658 ▶▶▶▶ NappyFace, replying to SmokeandMirrors, #636 of 1435 🔗

Thanks

134661 ▶▶ alw, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #638 of 1435 🔗

All you need to know about this jobsworth.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dido_Harding

134665 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to alw, #639 of 1435 🔗

PPE – says it all

134666 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #640 of 1435 🔗

Kept the Cheltenham Festival rubbing and then slammed everything shut. Look up who is running the Cheltenham Festival…..

134614 PWL, 2, #641 of 1435 🔗

The so-called Naked Scientist: “If you’ve got an illness or some kind of problem that means you’re at high risk” – which is not correct, but I’m not surprised that another technician doesn’t know anything. He’s talking about the other illnesses which the NHS can call “Covid-19” when the patient dies.

Covid-19, an uncommon respiratory illness, at its root is probably a matter of imbalance of the microbiome.
Covid-19 as a modern day variant of an antique technocratic control device

134624 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 2, #642 of 1435 🔗

ask the woman what the false positive rate is

134627 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, 1, #643 of 1435 🔗

do it!

134633 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to steve_w, #644 of 1435 🔗

I will show my arse in Fenwick’s Window if they do!

134637 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Tenchy, 1, #645 of 1435 🔗

I shall avoid Fenwicks now Greg Clarke has outed himself as a sceptic!

134643 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to steve_w, #646 of 1435 🔗

Oh, oh!

134636 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 1, #647 of 1435 🔗

And what the point of ramping up testing to 500K per day could possibly be!

134641 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, #648 of 1435 🔗

When will someone tell her there’s no point in taking any notice of youngsters testing positive, other than telling them to go home with some Lemsip?

134646 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Bruno, 1, #649 of 1435 🔗

80% won’t need lemsip!

134657 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 2, #650 of 1435 🔗

True, but she keeps banging on about only wanting symptomatic people to get tested. Which will include all these kids with sniffles. She has completely got the wrong end of the stick. I don’t care how many kids test positive or not in schools, thats NEVER a good reason to shut it down. So annoyed with the ridiculous assumptions on show, not you Steve!

134663 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Bruno, #651 of 1435 🔗

At the risk of sounding like I’m defending her (no chance), a snotty nose or a sore throat is not a covid symptom

134822 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Charlie Blue, #652 of 1435 🔗

Those are both Covid symptoms.

https://doi.org/10.1101/2020.08.09.20171249

55% of cases had snotty noses (“rhinorrhea”) and 45% a sore throat.

134664 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Bruno, #653 of 1435 🔗

I think we are on the same page 🙂

134701 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Bruno, #654 of 1435 🔗

I feel sorry for her. She has got a Sisyphean task and one that is meaningless as far as I can see.

Why are all these professionals dedicating themselves so hopelessly to an inane goal? They are trapped by their political masters, and willingly comply to evade blame and the avoid appearance of incompetence. She has just said she did not volunteer, does not have relevant skills, but was asked by ministers to serve in this job (unpaid). She is now being grilled on her competence!

This is unfair, she is being set up as a fall guy.

She seems to have lost the capacity to criticise the necessity and ultimate end of the testing regime.

134703 ▶▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Kate, 1, #655 of 1435 🔗

That is Baroness Harding.

134720 ▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Kate, 3, #656 of 1435 🔗

It’s unfair in one sense, but she accepted the poisoned chalice and would have known that she would be squarely in the frame.

134825 ▶▶▶▶ guy153, replying to Kate, 2, #657 of 1435 🔗

I’m sure they’re making it worth her while.

134644 ▶▶ SmokeandMirrors, replying to steve_w, 1, #658 of 1435 🔗

Body language in panic mode.

134639 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 4, #659 of 1435 🔗

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-curfew-coronavirus-a4548646.html

The PHE chief stressed that the aim was to avoid lockdowns in London given their economic, health and well-being impact.

Great idea Mr. Health Expert. Let’s avoid lockdowns by….imposing a curfew.

Covid Cult members predictably leaping to the defence of this drivel in the comments:

So not a curfew then. Stopping the sale of alcohol between certain hours does not constitute a curfew. Asking people to stay indoors between certain hours does which is not happening.

134819 ▶▶ annie, replying to Richard O, #660 of 1435 🔗

Presumably the economic, health and wellbeing impact of lockdowns eksewhere is of no concern,

134647 Sir Patrick Vaccine, 7, #661 of 1435 🔗

Dr Mike Yeadon: ‘Government are using a Covid-19 test with undeclared false positive rates.’

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch7wze46md0&nbsp ;

The former scientific advisor at Pfizer, Dr Mike Yeadon, has reissued his challenge to the Health Secretary Matt Hancock regarding the coronavirus testing.

You must view this interview on Talk Radio with Julia Hartley Brewer and pass it on. The Goverment a killing this country for nothing

134650 steve_w, 5, #662 of 1435 🔗

MP for Bolton appears to be a retard

134659 PWL, replying to PWL, #663 of 1435 🔗

New restrictions in the North East. How is your dedicated lockdown sceptical media doing leading you out of what is plainly an elaborate racket?
Covid-19 as a modern day variant of an antique technocratic control device

134782 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to PWL, 1, #664 of 1435 🔗

TL;DR. Something about eclipses and priests. I wish your site was more succinct and readable since I get the sense that you might have some useful contributions tucked away somewhere.

134667 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 1, #665 of 1435 🔗

these questions are trite. let Greg have another go

134669 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to steve_w, 1, #666 of 1435 🔗

It is Butler, completely out of her depth.

134674 ▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to nottingham69, #667 of 1435 🔗

Just saw her passive questioning, added nothing to the event. Shame really, would have liked to see some fire similar to when the plod (unfairly accused of) targeted her.

134682 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to nottingham69, 1, #668 of 1435 🔗

I reckon she’s the worst politician this country has ever seen; 100% incompetent.

134689 ▶▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Tenchy, #669 of 1435 🔗

I see your Butler and raise you an Abbott

134690 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Chris John, 1, #670 of 1435 🔗

Hmm, it’s a close contest indeed!

134700 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Tenchy, 1, #671 of 1435 🔗

i’ll double your Butler and Abbott and raise you a Burgon

My game i think!!!

134714 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to mjr, 1, #672 of 1435 🔗

Game set and match with Burgon

134675 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, #673 of 1435 🔗

He knows they’ve had to send loads of tests to Germany for processing, as no capacity here . Hasn’t followed it up. Not that it matters in the wider scheme of things

134673 annie, replying to annie, 15, #674 of 1435 🔗

Just a huge ‘thank you’, from a Welshie negotiating the first week of face nappy hell, to all those brave Scottish and English souls who enlightened me about exemptions, lanyards, the best attitude to adopt in shops etc.
All working so far. Honestly, I don’t know what I’d have done without you.
Dreading napoy church on Sunday, but still determined to go, un-nappied. Has anybody some advice on this?

134680 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to annie, 6, #675 of 1435 🔗

Say: ‘I’m exempt.’

No problem.

134774 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Ovis, 5, #676 of 1435 🔗

Wish more people would do that in general. I don’t know why so many people wear masks if they truly hate them.

134921 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to ConstantBees, #677 of 1435 🔗

I think they are scared of being accused of being selfish..

134935 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Carrie, 4, #678 of 1435 🔗

To start with I found it difficult, and I feel a bit nervy again about the start of term. Part of what gave me the gumption to do it was the sense that I was doing it for others. Showing our faces is a gesture of common humanity that we make, at some cost to ourselves, for others as well as our own self-respect.

134979 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Ovis, 3, #679 of 1435 🔗

That’s exactly what got me started. I was reluctant not to wear one out of fear of harassment, even though I do have an exemption. But after I read about rape victims being afraid to go maskfree, I felt like I didn’t have any excuse to wear one again. I do carry an exemption card but it’s as much to spread the idea as to avoid harassment.

135212 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to ConstantBees, 1, #680 of 1435 🔗

I was determined no crazy Government decree was going to make my health issues worse by forcing me to wear a mask! It is bad enough not being able to see my GP or dentist when I wish.

134683 ▶▶ TJN, replying to annie, 1, #681 of 1435 🔗

It wasn’t really that brave of us – pretty straightforward really.

134691 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to annie, 5, #682 of 1435 🔗

Smile, be polite, if anyone asks say v simply‘I’m exempt’. They should not ask any further questions, particularly in a church setting where presumably folks are sympathetic to those with conditions. You need no proof or to give reasons to anyone other than an authorised person, eg police officer. If anyone does ask say, ‘you’ll appreciate that, like you, I’d rather not discuss my private confidential matters in public (and as per Government guidance I shouldn’t have to – not least as asking such questions and demanding proof could be discriminatory and unlawful ( max 9k fine) under the Equality Act)’ But would be VERY surprised if it got to that.

134706 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to annie, 4, #683 of 1435 🔗

I contacted my local church who informed me it was face-masks and track and trace. We got into a bit of dialogue where eventually she accepted that face mask exemptions won’t be challenged and the track and trace is voluntary. So just turn up as normal and if asked say exempt and decline to leave your details. They were literally singing from the govt hymn sheet though (pun in there somewhere) which is why we ended up having a bit of a two and fro (but online). Hopefully that won’t happen but always best to brush up on your brief.

134740 ▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 1, #684 of 1435 🔗

Be aware of other people’s reactions. Many in my church are exempt but others are criticising the leadership for letting them claim the exemptions.

134745 ▶▶ Ajb, replying to annie, 1, #685 of 1435 🔗

As it’s a new thing for everyone, it might be helpful if you have a lanyard for the first week, simply to help those on the door recognise one if other people show up. Though ‘I’m exempt’ should be enough, often welcomers are volunteers and church authorities higher than a congregation level have not always been clear – their interactions with government have often left them understanding the restrictions, not the exemptions (they do not seem to be spelled out on our denomination’s briefing documents and risk assessment, for example). Congregations are trying to jump through as many hoops as they can to allow worship to restart/continue, and the guidelines change on a weekly basis, so any extra information from you might be very welcome! Also, your preacher might be very glad to look out and see a smiling face – if you usually rely on a little feedback from the expression on people’s faces, a sea of masks is most disconcerting.

134814 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Ajb, 4, #686 of 1435 🔗

Thank you all.
My rector already has me down as a bolshie … but I’ll smile sweetly.

134790 ▶▶ RonniC, replying to annie, 1, #687 of 1435 🔗

My first time shopping at Tesco and Lidl today since face nappies became obligatory here in Wales. And what a joke! While it was just me and one other woman who went bare faced (absolutely no problem in both stores), the masked shoppers wore theirs in interesting ways — mostly under their noses, or completely skew which meant they were constantly adjusting them. Oh, and I saw one person who had a nappy on her face with another hung round her neck! Outside people were taking them off and either shoving them into handbags (women) or stuffing them into trouser pockets, or hanging them round their necks. All to be re-used I would guess.
Nice response from Ajb re your church question.

134813 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to RonniC, 4, #688 of 1435 🔗

I don’t think many people here think the nappies are the slightest use. They wear them to avoid possible aggro.

134883 ▶▶ Drummerman, replying to annie, 3, #689 of 1435 🔗

I’ve been going to church for the past 6 weeks, without a mask. I told the guy on the door, taking names and checking for masks, that I had an exemption and he said “Good for you!”. He now greets me each week with a cheery smile and a thumbs up. Why the fuck he hasn’t dispensed with his, I don’t know, but he’s polite and so am I. Inside there are 1 or 2 others (including a nun, so she probably doesn’t really count for these purposes) not wearing masks but I take communion and smile at everyone and no one says boo! Is it a good experience? No. But I go and I keep going.

135025 ▶▶ Nsklent, replying to annie, 3, #690 of 1435 🔗

Regarding church. Unfortunately our Catholic church is semi zealous in abiding by the rules as still not open for prayer and the last time I attended mass 3 weeks ago, there were 14 people instead of 100 plus. The priest wasn’t masked thank goodness, otherwise I would had to have left. I was the only unmasked, with my lanyard. No-one said anything or seemed to care, but I spent the whole mass being annoyed at the shadow the mass is now with so many can’ts – half the mass use to follow the Latin liturgy so plenty of singing/ chants, but now just a shortened version of the spoken mass. Being so angry at the debasement of the service and the church’s weakcapitulation to government rules defeated the purpose of being there, as prayer was pretty difficult. Communion was also a bit weird, outstretched hands, plus details also taken, and no point in giving false ones as the priest already has on record your address etc. I need to go away on a course in 3 weeks, so not keen to risk that.To think the sacrifices priests made in communist regimes in the past, torture, death, but still performed mass, and now they hide away from this, and no doubt will readily shut the doors again at a whiff of a lockdown order.

On the other hand, the local rural Anglican churches, as they switch churches each week, are quite relaxed according to MOH. The vicar announced that he would probably forget his mask, so could understand if others forgot as well. So about half and half and some sceptics on board, so, I think I will be changing sides for the next few weeks.

135191 ▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to annie, 2, #691 of 1435 🔗

I simply told them at church, “My health conditions mean I can’t wear a mask.” No problems at all. There is another lady there who doesn’t either. No one bothers us and we enjoy the services as usual.

134676 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 4, #692 of 1435 🔗

500,000 tests by end of october – so we can expect 5050 false positives daily

134679 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 3, #693 of 1435 🔗

Jeez, what is the matter with these people?!

134716 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Bruno, 2, #694 of 1435 🔗

They are brainwashed

134769 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to B Boru, 2, #695 of 1435 🔗

Mass psychosis.

134811 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to B Boru, 3, #696 of 1435 🔗

No brain to wash.

135063 ▶▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to annie, #697 of 1435 🔗

Touche! 😉

134694 ▶▶ DRW, replying to steve_w, 4, #698 of 1435 🔗

We’re losing this fight if the majority actually believe this exploding casedemic is a Spanish flu “second wave”.

134916 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to DRW, #699 of 1435 🔗

We need to share Ivor Cummins’ 2 minute ‘casedemic’ video – people might not watch the 37 minute film, but 2 minutes is not too long for anyone, surely?

134725 ▶▶ tonys, replying to steve_w, 2, #700 of 1435 🔗

But (and I may be displaying an optimism here I don’t necessarily feel) the wider and more glaring the discrepancy between positive tests and actual sick people, the harder it will be to ignore.

134677 D B, replying to D B, 19, #701 of 1435 🔗

Today is a dark day for us sceptics. I feel my hope wearing thin, curfews, mandated tests, excessive masking now even rumours of glasses/goggles. I’m not sure how long I can keep going with this. I think we’ve lost, despite real world control groups (Sweden, Tanzania), so much medical information discounting what we’re subjected too, rights and liberty being eroded. Lobbyists and shadow funding ruling the UK and world agenda. I think I’m about done with it. I’m not suicidal I just don’t think I want to wake up anymore.

To bastardise a Churchill phrase – never has so much been screwed up by so few.

134686 ▶▶ DRW, replying to D B, 4, #702 of 1435 🔗

I get that feeling too, I wish we could be optimistic.

134688 ▶▶ leggy, replying to D B, 1, #703 of 1435 🔗

It’s hard not to feel like this from time to time, ignorance is indeed bliss. It’s really important to keep one’s eyes on the road though as far as I’m concerned.

134702 ▶▶ Liam, replying to D B, 5, #704 of 1435 🔗

I feel like that sometimes, but sticking to an unpopular view is lonely, but essential and morally right.

134704 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Liam, 4, #705 of 1435 🔗

and you’ll be proved right in the end – which won’t be long 🙂

134749 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to steve_w, 3, #706 of 1435 🔗

How long though? Three weeks to delay has morphed into forever to eradicate and they get away with anything to chase the end of that rainbow. Complete runaway train to tyranny.

134711 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to D B, 6, #707 of 1435 🔗

We ain’t lost nothing my friend!!!

More and more are coming to the realisation, it’s like a dam has had a crack in it. Starts off with a drip, turns into a steady flow then becomes a deluge.

This is all Psychological mind games to keep you in fear and servitude. DO NOT COMPLY. Thats all we need to do.

Take everything they have got and laugh at them and say NO. You are more powerful than they are and that is what they are afraid of.

Cheers
B

134723 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to B Boru, 2, #708 of 1435 🔗

To borrow another WW2 reference. Apres moi la deluge (617 squadron motto)

134730 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to p02099003, #709 of 1435 🔗

Brilliant! love it 🙂

134808 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to B Boru, 2, #710 of 1435 🔗

LE déluge.

134726 ▶▶▶ D B, replying to B Boru, 3, #711 of 1435 🔗

Thanks B,

I will refuse to wear my mask till the day I die.

134729 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to D B, 1, #712 of 1435 🔗

That’s the spirit 🙂

134809 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to D B, 2, #713 of 1435 🔗

Likewise.I haven’t got one anyway.

134766 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to B Boru, 4, #714 of 1435 🔗

Not complying. But tired of overhearing bedwetter conversations that I can’t reply to. Tired of being the only maskfree person on the bus. Just tired. So happy for the encouragement from others feeling positive today. Actually debating with myself about returning to the US (dual US/UK citizen) but I fear things are just as crazy there as here.

134994 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to ConstantBees, 1, #715 of 1435 🔗

I know how you feel. I have to endure it also, but I have done for a long time and have got quite good at ignoring it and not letting it get to me as much as it used to.

At least you can get a firearm in the US. It may come to that. I have family there and they tell me it is bonkers bad where they are but that people are beginning to resist and rebel. Armed to the teeth and marching on washinton hopefully!

‘All enemies….foreign and domestic’

Good luck

cheers
B

134859 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to B Boru, 3, #716 of 1435 🔗

The “rule of six” has definitely opened up some serious cracks in the dam, but it still feels like it’s a long way from breaking. I think the next month or so will be critical, with the end of furlough and the so-called “second wave” (more like a series of ripples if Spain and France are anything to go by, but how the government and media treat it is another matter)
I really hope Simon Dolan’s legal challenge makes some progress, the argument last time was that, as lockdown was being lifted, his case was no longer relevant! Definitely not true now.

134984 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Drawde927, 1, #717 of 1435 🔗

It will just keep on growing, water will bring down mountains over time.

I agree about the immediate future however.

They have done the dirty on SD and his legal challenge, the old kicking the can down the road tactic!! Doesnt matter….to me their laws are irrelevant illegitimate anyway. I answer to a higher power.

134900 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to B Boru, 4, #718 of 1435 🔗

I am somewhat encouraged today by Julia Hartley-Brewer who seems to be a full-on sceptic now.
On her Twitter there is part of an interview she did with the health minister this morning where she ‘skewered’ him by quoting the number of deaths in under 60s, a statistic which he tried to claim no one had calculated! Watch here:
https://twitter.com/Trophy4toon/status/1306543937746857985

Then she later posted this: ‘ Meanwhile, routine testing of NHS patients for Covid-19 will mean many with other respiratory illnesses are identified as having coronavirus even if it is not their primary problem. Add to that all the false positives, and it doesn’t suggest anything approaching a second wave .’

134912 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Carrie, 1, #719 of 1435 🔗

Another fun extract from the interview mentioned above: https://twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1306510217920819200
Julia asks Health Minister Edward Argar if he can explain “why six people sitting at a table together in a pub at 9:59pm is perfectly safe, but seven people sitting in a pub at a table at 10:01pm means we’re all going to die?”

Somehow I think he might turn down future interviews with her!

134974 ▶▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Carrie, 5, #720 of 1435 🔗

Indeed. It might take a bit more time but the dam will break….it’s inevitable. The more a high public profile person like her asks questions, the more others will jump on board as well. Jeez…look how far things have come in the last week or 10 days alone!!

6 months ago I was in the depths of despair. As soon as all this started I knew what it was and where it was headed. Yes…I am and always have been what would be classed as a ‘conspiracy theorist’. I prefer truth seeker but it’s all semantics to me. However, my point is, since then, I have heard people talking about things I was reading about 10 years ago now and seeing with new eyes things I have known for ages. It is truly remarkable to me how far thealong we have come in the last couple weeks. I remember feeling like the loneliest person on the planet sometimes wondering if I wa truly MAD, but no, I trusted my inner voice and instincts that I was right to keep on going as the truth is always the truth, even if you are the only person saying it.

SO to all the ones who feel down or doubt or despair…..Please….DO NOT GIVE IN….and know that we/you are making a difference.

“I have found that it is the small everyday deed of ordinary folks that keep the darkness at bay. Small acts of kindness and love.” ~ Gandalf the Grey

134712 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to D B, 9, #721 of 1435 🔗

I have to believe, like all misguided “movements,” that they will take it too far and people will just stop complying, even if it’s on a small scale at first, like ignoring the rule of six. I read a piece by an historian early on in the “pandemic” and it basically said that pandemics can end in two ways — public health will declare the pandemic over (not likely in this case) or the public will declare it essentially over by not paying attention anymore and carry on with life. I try to find hope in the latter and look for signs that this is happening. I think we are all coming to grips with the fact the insanity is going to go on a lot longer than we’d anticipated and we just have to find ways to cope. While I wouldn’t call myself happy at this time, I do try to find moments of happiness and maybe that’s the best we can do right now.

134778 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 1, #722 of 1435 🔗

The problem is that it’s probably the most politicised pandemic in history and there are huge propaganda machines to keep the majority sucked in.

134789 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to DRW, 1, #723 of 1435 🔗

I totally agree. It’ll take far longer than it would have without social media and 24/7 fear porn, plus the US election doesn’t help either. I think we sceptics underestimated the timeline but I have to retain hope that the truth will win out eventually.

134838 ▶▶▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #724 of 1435 🔗

Even with the US election, I now have my doubts that a Democrat win will see an end to the politicised madness. It wouldn’t at all surprise me if some states decided to go down a “zero covid” wild goose chase, and where the US leads the rest of the English-speaking world (the media class at least) tend to follow.

134943 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Drawde927, 3, #725 of 1435 🔗

With respect to virus response, a Democrat win is a much more frightening prospect.

134833 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 2, #726 of 1435 🔗

the public will declare it essentially over by not paying attention anymore and carry on with life.

Pretty much everything that’s happened in the UK over the last 2-3 months seems to have been designed precisely to prevent this happening!

134721 ▶▶ Will, replying to D B, 2, #727 of 1435 🔗

Keep your pecker up Daniel, the worm is turning!!!

134870 ▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to D B, 1, #728 of 1435 🔗

“Glasses and goggles”? FFS. Do you have a reference to this please? They could just get fucking done with it and issue a GSR (General Service Respirator), noddy suit and decontamination kit. The worm would soon turn if the public had to wear that for any length of time.

134879 ▶▶▶ D B, replying to The Filthy Engineer, 1, #729 of 1435 🔗

It was in my spectator today, came from a study in China, its only a single study but at this point all rationality has gone out the window.

134874 ▶▶ Drummerman, replying to D B, 1, #730 of 1435 🔗

You’ve got to keep going, Daniel. Keep emulating the great Liam Gallagher and tell them all – the politicians, ‘experts’ and sheeple – to ‘get to fuck!’.

134905 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to D B, 1, #731 of 1435 🔗

Exactly how I feel today too. It’s awful.

134962 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to D B, #732 of 1435 🔗

Hey Daniel.
Kind Regards.

Maybe Kenneth Branagh’s Henry V might gird the loins for at least a short while!:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvFHRNGYfuo&ab_channel=Movieclips

134678 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 5, #733 of 1435 🔗

Just in: positive tests down 15% on yesterday. I bet the MSM will be chomping at the bit to report that one.

134707 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Tenchy, 3, #734 of 1435 🔗

BBC will soon be telling us “How do the new rules reduce covid cases?”

134710 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to Tenchy, 3, #735 of 1435 🔗

This is useful as I think the government has moved too soon so once that number stays low then there is no validation for restrictions to remain.

134903 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to hotrod, 1, #736 of 1435 🔗

They will somehow put it down to the Rule of Six, it’s inevitable.

134715 ▶▶ muzzle, replying to Tenchy, #737 of 1435 🔗

Coincides with recent testing capacity issues I would guess.

134976 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to Tenchy, #738 of 1435 🔗

More tests processed than yesterday, ramping up to nearly 250 k. Data by date test taken shows a distinct peak on the 7th, though the 14 th may push it close at least in time. Positive tests still very low in Scotland and NI.

134684 Chris John, replying to Chris John, 2, #739 of 1435 🔗

Baroness of horse Dido Harding waffling hard

134692 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Chris John, #740 of 1435 🔗

are they really going to let her off without any mention of the issues raised in the previous panel?

134693 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Chris John, 1, #741 of 1435 🔗

just been asked how she got the job

134877 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to steve_w, #742 of 1435 🔗

What did she reply?

134699 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Chris John, 1, #743 of 1435 🔗

So she’s running ‘An enormous consumer facing logistics service’ – hugely overblown and largely unnecessary, ill targeted and currently dysfunctional. Great. Go waste some more of our money.

134709 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, 1, #744 of 1435 🔗

Oh come on. Asked what’s an appropriate output measure, KPI, waffles on about increased cooperation between the 3 entities she’s now running. It’s a reduction in cases and deaths.

134717 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bruno, #745 of 1435 🔗

I thought she is an alumna of McKinsey – didn’t they invent KPI?

134757 ▶▶▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #746 of 1435 🔗

Killed Possibly Injured?

134687 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 3, #747 of 1435 🔗

Heneghan reckoned ONS seroprevalence survey shows infections to be 4x the level shown by the normal testing. Wider testing makes the normal testing approach the ONS level and this is the rise that we have seen. ie not increased prevalence

134708 ▶▶ Julian, replying to steve_w, 1, #748 of 1435 🔗

That makes sense

Hopefully the ONS survey makes some attempt to be representative – who gets tested is random, so the test results alone are not a good way to determine trends

And testing of the kind we’re doing is pointless…

134705 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #749 of 1435 🔗

Graham ‘I am not familiar with this’ Stringer is nailing the lovely Dido now!

134718 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #750 of 1435 🔗

Stringer – problem is response is too centralised. Not. Problem is using commercial firms who aren’t delivering and are secretive about their processes and capabilities. She can’t answer a lot of questions because – commercial sensitivity. This is no way to run a public health system .

134724 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bruno, 1, #751 of 1435 🔗

He rather cleverly alluded to ‘links’!

134719 p02099003, 1, #752 of 1435 🔗

It strikes me that there is a lot of information and dissent to the strategy employed by the governments in the UK, and that has varied between the four nations.
All of this information and dat analysis is disseminated across different web sites and individuals. There is no central repository of the data. There are multiple individuals that have analysed what is happening, from Ivor Cummins through Carl Heneghan to Malcolm Kendrick. This has led to a disparate approach, where individuals are classed as covid deniers/conspiracy theorists, not disssimilar to the climate change issue.
There are fundamental questions that need answering, like why are children, particularly in primary school, being tested, as they are unlikely to be infectious? Why are groups of children being sent home because of one positive test? Why are children apparently immune to the effects of the virus?
There was talk on the part of the parliamentary committee broadcast which suggested a controlled experiment which examined the effects of transmission, test results and infection rates. I though that this had been done with the Diamond Princess data.

134727 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 9, #753 of 1435 🔗

Dido Harding -“we have extended testing to scared people” – presumably being scared is a covid symptom now

134731 ▶▶ wayno, replying to steve_w, 1, #754 of 1435 🔗

built on Sage modelling….

134734 ▶▶ mjr, replying to steve_w, 3, #755 of 1435 🔗

sh*t does that mean i’ve got it .. because listening to this I am very scared by the incompetence.. See Wikipedia for her history.. Privileged,,,, all the contacts,,,,, PPE degree.. .. management consultancy …. marries an MP….. frequent job changes.. incompetence at Talk Talk … Quango to Quango.

134735 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to mjr, 4, #756 of 1435 🔗

scum always rises to the top

134892 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to steve_w, #757 of 1435 🔗

Not just the cream that floats to the top -shit as well.

134751 ▶▶▶ Recusant, replying to mjr, 5, #758 of 1435 🔗

In 1995 she was appointed marketing director of Thomas Cook before moving to Manpower and Kingfisher in 1998 and Woolworths in 1999″

Hmmmm, half the companies she worked for don’t exist any more. Co-incidence?

134760 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Recusant, #759 of 1435 🔗

sounds like industrial espionage

134786 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Recusant, 1, #760 of 1435 🔗

When people move around that often it is usually for a very good reason, and it is not connected to their ability!

134803 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #761 of 1435 🔗

When you try to get rid of a horrid but influential git within the same firm, they call it ‘kicking upstairs’. Leads to rapid promotion of the least competent.

134752 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 2, #762 of 1435 🔗

It sounds like Harding has absolutely no idea how or why you might want to get to a more normal way if life via herd immunity – she thinks the answer is self isolation after testing positive. Nor why random testing is so stupid, despite what Heneghan said earlier. With no scientific background, as she’s just admitted, theta to be expected. With maybe only 30K people currently infectious in the entire population, (1 in 2000), all this I discriminate testing is such a waste of resources. Now Bethell fixing with misplaced enthusiasm for ‘the app’ . Boys’ toys.

134764 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, #763 of 1435 🔗

Fixing =fizzing

134802 ▶▶ Julian, replying to steve_w, 1, #764 of 1435 🔗

It’s certainly a symptom of coronapanic, which has probably been much more destructive to public health than what was originally forecast for coronavirus

134829 ▶▶ Drawde927, replying to steve_w, 4, #765 of 1435 🔗

That quote would be more honest with a single letter “d” removed!

134732 RyanM, replying to RyanM, 1, #766 of 1435 🔗

Does LS have a requests email? I want to say:

“Toby! Please tell me you know people over at National Review, or that you’re even personal friends with Jim. Someone needs to step in and shake some sense into people!”

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/does-the-president-ever-talk-to-his-cdc-director/

134733 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 7, #768 of 1435 🔗

Latest update on UK hospitals
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/healthcare
Yes there has been an increase in Covid 19 patients up from 901 to 988 for the whole of the UK. As they say there are over 1200 hospitals in the UK that equates to less than 1 Covid 19 patient per hospital. I cannot say whether or not this is the start of a major rise in hospital cases but I would say that so far it just looks like the normal ebb and flow of hospital data. No need to panic and no need for any lock-downs.

134925 ▶▶ Will, replying to Steve Martindale, #769 of 1435 🔗

How many of them are “suspected covid” in Wales? How many of them are in hospital for an in growing toe nail and have picked up covid on the dirty wards?

134967 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to Steve Martindale, #770 of 1435 🔗

Hospital data flat outside England where there is a small rise, incremental not exponential. Deaths up a bit, many without positive test, very elderly demographics. Did something sneak into a couple of care homes?

134736 muzzle, replying to muzzle, 6, #771 of 1435 🔗

Motorsport UK has redone their rules for motorsports. Facemask mandatory, 1 warning then next time you get kicked out of the event. Only exception is if you are a competitor in your car with you helmet on. If you are mask exempt then you are not welcome. If I want to carry on being involved in this sport, I need to wear a mask all weekend unfortunately.

134738 ▶▶ Lorenzo Basso, replying to muzzle, 10, #772 of 1435 🔗

That’s discrimination – plain and simple.

134747 ▶▶▶ muzzle, replying to Lorenzo Basso, 3, #773 of 1435 🔗

It is. Not sure what can be done about it. Under 11s (i.e. in karting) are expected to wear a mask too and they would normally be exempt.

134875 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lorenzo Basso, 2, #774 of 1435 🔗

Get Simon Dolan to take them to court..

134878 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Carrie, 1, #775 of 1435 🔗

Take them to court yourself. You could ring Mr Tilbrook of this parish.

134755 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to muzzle, 5, #776 of 1435 🔗

The people running the sport are a complete disgrace coming up with such rules. If people still attend and fully comply they will see them as a success.

People really need to stand up now and force these organisations to back down from the draconian measures. If everyone wants to live in a world where we are 100% safe and protected by the the state, motor sport is finished anyway. It doesn’t really tie in with the environmental agenda being pursued.

134914 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to muzzle, #777 of 1435 🔗

So they’ll pay for your time off if you fall sick wearing a mask then?

134737 Basics, replying to Basics, 4, #778 of 1435 🔗

Edinburgh University have followed Cambridge setting their statement as
“As a University of Edinburgh student you are also bound by the University’s Code of Conduct.

“Behaving in a way that impairs safety is an offence under the code. The university will take the strongest possible action under the code if there continues to be illegal gatherings of our students.

“Please take this as a warning. If you take part in further illegal gatherings – gatherings of more than six people from two households, whether on or off campus – then you risk immediate suspension from the university and exclusion from your university accommodation.

“Neither the university nor the police can accept this sort of reckless and immature behaviour, which puts the health and safety of others at risk and wastes police time.”

134796 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 7, #779 of 1435 🔗

Whoever composed this obviously enjoyed it. I bet they even got aroused. Torturing young people is the done thing these days.

134805 ▶▶ SmokeandMirrors, replying to Basics, 6, #780 of 1435 🔗

Anyone who has shelled out £9+K might feel a bit aggreaved – and might, with a large group of others, show their disapproval………..

134889 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Basics, 3, #781 of 1435 🔗

Open University it is plus an apprenticeship if you want to make a positive career.

134991 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #782 of 1435 🔗

OU or Edinburgh. Devi is at Edinburgh so OU it is no brainer.

But seriously, you would be mad or woke to go to Edinburgh University in current conditions. You are brainwashed not educated.

That OU real life experience is such value to whatever subject you study.

134739 mjr, replying to mjr, 3, #783 of 1435 🔗

so if you isolate they dont want to test you in case you are negative … because you might not be negative…. and so come out of isolation
lost me there

134743 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to mjr, 1, #784 of 1435 🔗

maybe they care about false negatives but havent heard of false positives?

134744 ▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, #785 of 1435 🔗

yes she confirms … if you test negative doesnt mean that you havent got it .

134899 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to mjr, 1, #786 of 1435 🔗

Doesn’t this blow BJ’s moonsh*t bollox out of the water?

134741 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 45, #787 of 1435 🔗

I feel very lucky to have my family, job, dogs and horse and also this site which reminds me daily that I am not a lone voice crying in the wilderness. As I read the news of further lockdowns and the incomprehensible failure of the government to explain the data around cases, positive tests, false positives, hospitalisations and deaths to a terrified populace I can’t help wondering what I’d do if I didn’t have my support network and a family which thankfully ranges from mildly to hardline sceptical.

I know many people on here are on their own and can feel very isolated. I sometimes read despairing posts which quickly disappear down the page and get lost in the chatter. We all come here infuriated with what’s going on around us perhaps just to vent our spleen but it gladdens my heart to also see so much kindness and humour in the comments so I just wanted to say: thank you for being such good people.

You are all genuine. Sometimes genuinely angry, often genuinely funny and compassionate. Perhaps we are genuine because we are unmasked? We are the people who say what we think and wear our hearts on our sleeves. We are not dissembling, virtue signalling sheep: we are the best of humanity.

134777 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 14, #788 of 1435 🔗

You brought tears to my eyes. Beautifully written and spot on — we are the best of humanity because we are working each day to retain our humanity while others seem hellbent on suppressing it and trading it away for some false sense of security. It’s very lonely here in Canada as there’s so little scepticism it’s hard to see an end to the insanity, but I feel connected to my new UK community and am thankful each day for this site. Both my grandfathers were born in the UK and I still have relatives in England and Wales, so there is more than a fleeting connection!

134800 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 6, #789 of 1435 🔗

I think just now we are humanity.

134868 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 8, #790 of 1435 🔗

Very well said. There is a great deal of wisdom on here as well, something that our culture has completely lacked for at least two generations.

Despite our very low numbers – there must be no more than a couple of hundred active contributors – some days on here it feels like I am with a number a thousand times greater. No wonder, since each of you is worth at least thousand of those fucking morons who are trying to destroy everything.

135010 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 13, #791 of 1435 🔗

I’ve said this before, many times actually. Everyone here is my lifeline, as I stand at the abyss and contemplate the depths I might plunge, I read the comments on LS and force myself to turn my sorry, moaning, self-pitying arse around and FIGHT. FIGHT. FIGHT.

I am not alone, and I don’t know what I’d actually do with LS.

I can’t thank Tony and his team enough for the time, effort, dedication and courage they show everyday, probably every hour, given the torrent of abuse they must deal with through their daily course.

I love hearing stories of defiance – everytime I sit in my car in front of the Co-op and psyche myself to go in maskless, I think of the tales from all over, the victories, the strength, the conviction, the non-sensibleness … and I enter with my head held high and most times, even look for a fight (it never happens, I’ve never been challenged)! But that strength comes from LS, not me!

I don’t know if the tide is turning, or if things are spiralling downwards even quicker – a lot of that sentiment depends on my mood and context.

But I do know how much I look forward to the information, humor, outrage, experience, statistics, expertise, insight and analytical nuance presented articulately on a daily basis.

Thank you everyone!

135057 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to HaylingDave, #792 of 1435 🔗

Brilliant my man…brilliant stuff! 😉

I think you speak for many on here when you say that.

Cheers
B

135251 ▶▶▶ Lili, replying to HaylingDave, 1, #793 of 1435 🔗

The strength DOES come from you. Courage doesn’t mean you’re not afraid; courage means you don’t let the fear stop you and THAT is what real bravery is – being scared but forging ahead.

135242 ▶▶ Lili, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #794 of 1435 🔗

What a lovely, thoughtful comment.

134742 steve_w, 1, #795 of 1435 🔗

ooh – questioner asks ‘as we are trying to manage covid rather than eradicate it…..’

needs to have a chat with Devi Sridhar

134748 steve_w, 3, #796 of 1435 🔗

arse now up with his stupid phone app. apparently its ‘impressive’ – they’ve probably linked it with angry birds

134750 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, #797 of 1435 🔗

Sorry to post this rather large article from the Spectator but will report back in 21 days!

The North East rolls back into lockdown

One in seven Britons is now under increased lockdown restrictions, after a return of measures in the north-east added an additional two million people to the list. Those in areas including Northumberland, Newcastle, Sunderland, North and South Tyneside, Gateshead and County Durham will not be able to mix with other households (outside of support bubbles) from midnight, while restaurants, bars and pubs will be subject to a 10 p.m. curfew. Health Secretary Matt Hancock announced the latest lockdown measures in the House of Commons this morning, citing a rise of Covid-19 cases in the area.

Despite more than ten million people in the UK now being subject to some level of increased restrictions, the official metrics for deciding whether an area will be put into lockdown still haven’t been published. Yet today’s announcement suggests again that the government is basing its decisions on case numbers, rather than hospitalisations or deaths.
comment image &t=1600356324&ymreqid=3164bff7-e6bf-d914-1c43-7100f001b300&sig=m8vvAAdQ9K_pyzUxTLvkFA–~D In the North East and Yorkshire the number of patients in hospital with Covid-19 has stayed relatively low. An increase of 83 in the past week can be seen as cases have also risen. Deaths have yet to increase in the regions.
Of course, both hospitalisations and deaths are bound to lag behind infections, with the average time between infection and death at the peak of the virus estimated to be 20 days. Based on this logic, one would expect to see an uptick in the coming weeks. But there are several reasons to think Covid-19 deaths may not follow the same trajectory this time, including a possible increased immunity and better knowledge of how to treat the virus using anti-inflammatories rather than ventilators. All eyes will be on this graph in the coming weeks.

134756 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to T. Prince, #798 of 1435 🔗

Can you please post the graph. Can’t see in link above.

134958 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to hotrod, #799 of 1435 🔗

comment image &t=1600356324&ymreqid=3164bff7-e6bf-d914-1c43-7100f001b300&sig=m8vvAAdQ9K_pyzUxTLvkFA–~D

134964 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to hotrod, #800 of 1435 🔗

Sorry, won’t let me copy link, it’s here though

Covid-19 update: The north-east rolls back into lockdown

comment image &t=1600353641&ymreqid=3164bff7-e6bf-d914-1c43-7100a301b300&sig=eWJ.DEAnBvZuCnrfLeuvmw–~D

134754 steve_w, replying to steve_w, #801 of 1435 🔗

app functionality

tells you how many people are infected in our postcode
qr code reader for pubs
symptoms checker (questionnaire)
test booker
‘isolation companion’ – tells you how long you have left in isolation – very handy for those that cant count!
contact tracing – senses how close and how long you are to other people running the app

134758 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #802 of 1435 🔗

its voluntary
not obliged to self-isolate if it tells you that you went near someone with covid
2m for 15 minutes is the threshhold for alerts
cant tell if you were separated by a screen or wall – you need to turn it off if i) you have ppe ii) you are behind a screen iii) you leave your phone somewhere

134762 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #803 of 1435 🔗

decentralised – ie data doesn’t get sent anywhere (apparently)
only works on a Nokia-570

134767 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #804 of 1435 🔗

tested in Newham and Isle of Wight
launching next week – put it in your diary !

134771 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #805 of 1435 🔗

My estimate is 50% download, 5% use

134781 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #806 of 1435 🔗

not telling us the uptake in the trials until after the launch, but ‘optimistic’ and ‘the more the better’

134783 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #807 of 1435 🔗

apparently the scottish app has already given 100 alerts! its a game-changer!

134866 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to steve_w, #808 of 1435 🔗

So they say – do you trust them that the data doesn’t get sent anywhere? I don’t!

134768 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to steve_w, #809 of 1435 🔗

Didn’t I read that the threshold of 2m for 15mins would only be work half the time – in the sense that the other 50% you would get an alert without being that close for that long?

134776 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, #810 of 1435 🔗

guy defending the app looks like he still uses a fax machine

134759 ▶▶ mjr, replying to steve_w, #811 of 1435 🔗

sounds like the app has to be running all the time … which was the problems we had with the original app …. . doesnt work in the background ,

134761 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, #812 of 1435 🔗

now being asked about the centralised app and the problems inherent … apparently de-centralised
i ll wait for the technical analysis on here

134763 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, 1, #813 of 1435 🔗

but as it is voluntary … i just dont think my phone has any space left

134765 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to mjr, 1, #814 of 1435 🔗

my phone has a shitty battery but I’m happy to use it in the car or at home as I have a charger

134785 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to steve_w, 4, #815 of 1435 🔗

I wonder if there is a breach of digital and/or disability discrimination here.

All health services should be available to all. This app is apparently there to save so called lives. My tech isn’t able to run it.

There are hundreds of thousands that are discriminated against by not being users of the required hardware.

134791 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Basics, 1, #816 of 1435 🔗

they have an alternative which is you write down the name and contact details of anyone you spend 15 mins with within 2 metres and post it to the track and trace team

134864 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 2, #817 of 1435 🔗

Discriminates against anyone without a smartphone – a lot of elderly don’t have one.. And anyway, since when was there a legal obligation to own one? If it become a legal requirement then the government should be paying for our phones…

134847 ▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to mjr, #818 of 1435 🔗

My phone never has any space – I’ve just deleted a lot of photos (backed up elsewhere) and the usage has only gone down from 99% to 98% – which still doesn’t allow me to download any apps. Every organisation and his dog wants you to download their app nowadays.

134775 ▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to mjr, #819 of 1435 🔗

My iPhone battery is already shit. Not having an app ruining it even further. First world problems, but a good excuse to avoid this farce.

134798 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 12, #820 of 1435 🔗

Maybe I might ‘share my learnings’ (arrrgh) about an app: most of the at risk, very elderly people you’d like to identify and treat, don’t have a smart phone and aren’t in pubs and restaurants. Ergo it’s a waste of space. The youngsters out and about, delightfully mingling, except when they’re banged up self isolating of course, do. But then they’re not at risk, nor are their grannies, if they stay away, wash hands etc. Think we can conclude that every £ spent on this is wasted.

134828 ▶▶ RickH, replying to steve_w, 1, #821 of 1435 🔗

tells you how many people are infected in [y]our postcode”

Not if the term ‘infection’ still means anything – i.e. related to actual illness.

134887 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to RickH, #822 of 1435 🔗

This is so mad. When you look at the regional reports my local authority pumps out, week after week it’s a monotonous tale of isolated clusters in care homes, the occasional food processing plant, and people’s own relatives. Why you need millions spent on an app and with Serco, Deloittes et al to find these contacts, is beyond me. Why prat about finding the worried well, when the potentially sick are right under your nose?

134917 ▶▶ Will, replying to steve_w, 2, #823 of 1435 🔗

It won’t be functioning on my phone…

134772 Basics, replying to Basics, 3, #824 of 1435 🔗

Local rag bias. Rag writes:

“The First Minister also reported a small rise in hospital admissions, with 52 patients currently being treated for the virus.

“Out of that number, five are in intensive care units around the country.”

The actual situation is hospital admissions were 48 (approx*) are now 52.
Up by 4 in a population of 5,500,000.

ICU 5 in intensive care down from 7 (approx*) without death reducing that number.

* approx because it is not my job and the data cannot be trusted.

Baised reporting courtesy of edinburghlive.

Oh, and fishlips is talking about a full nation lockdown.

134848 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Basics, 5, #825 of 1435 🔗

as reported on here before .. political reporting in local rags is done by BBC embedded reporters. See this on BBC web and details of where they are
4 of them at Edinburgh Evening News (JPI Media Ltd) who i assume run Edinburgh Live
and we know the BBC standpoint

134978 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to mjr, #826 of 1435 🔗

… i reported it! Cheers though, it’s right!

134988 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Basics, 2, #827 of 1435 🔗

does no harm to keep mentioning it here.. i dont think many people know how much influence the BBC has on local news

135105 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to mjr, #828 of 1435 🔗

No harm at all. Good as you say..and visible to those not on here but look in.

134773 GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 4, #829 of 1435 🔗

There’s a story about the test balls up on the BBC news website and the 2nd highest rated comment states It’s all well and good saying don’t turn up for testing if you haven’t got symptoms but if you need any medical or dental procedures you need to show proof of a negative test before you can proceed with treatment.”
Is this true? If so it looks like the ‘health passport’ has been snuck in through the back door.

134788 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 5, #830 of 1435 🔗

Only if you are being admitted to hospital for elective surgery. I have never heard of this being the case for dental treatment, though that’s still hard to come by in some areas.

134856 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #831 of 1435 🔗

My mum had to submit to testing the day before an outpatient procedure recently.. so not just if it involves being admitted.

134871 ▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Carrie, 2, #832 of 1435 🔗

yes, sorry. Use of the word admitted was inaccurate. Should have just said before a surgical procedure.

134894 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Carrie, 2, #833 of 1435 🔗

My dad too, just for a day case procedure.

134821 ▶▶ RickH, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 3, #834 of 1435 🔗

It’s one area to watch very carefully.

134851 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 1, #835 of 1435 🔗

Is that with reference to a particular region or is it now nationwide?
I do know that my mum (in Surrey) has had to be covid-tested prior to (ie the day before) other medical procedures at outpatients ..

134779 Caroline Watson, replying to Caroline Watson, 29, #836 of 1435 🔗

Northumberland is in solitary confinement from tonight. We have no ‘cases’ (even based on the dodgy tests!) for 50 miles from Newcastle west to the Cumbrian border or 50 miles north to the Scottish border. We have hardly any people. A sheep disease would be far more damaging.
Our local businesses are desperate and our Tory MPs and councillors are nowhere to be seen. Northumberland has just been dragged into the virtue signalling by the Newcastle middle class left and its county unitary authority has presumably been promised some government money to sacrifice us.
It’s isolated enough up here in the winter, when the nights are dark and the roads impassable. There aren’t enough of us to make a big noise but more people will die from despair than of the virus. Please help us!

134795 ▶▶ annie, replying to Caroline Watson, 6, #837 of 1435 🔗

Love your area, the wonderful scenery, the peace, the calm, friendly people… is there anything positive we can do?

134820 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Caroline Watson, 7, #838 of 1435 🔗

dragged into the virtue signalling by the Newcastle middle class left “

Pity about that nonsense, because this idiocy isn’t helped by narrow sectarian politics and misdiagnosis. It’s too important, and not amenable to mickey-mouse political analysis. The outrage stretches across the board, as the failure of contemporary politics stretches from the right-wing extremists of Johnson’s cabinet, through the centre-right of Starmer’s post-Blair ineffectual self-seeking, to some of the Toytown Left. On the way, it includes the dimwits who seem to have been local government accomplices etc.

It’s about the only democratic feature of this debacle. The main constituency absent from the table is that of intelligence.

We had intended to be in Northumberland next weekend. All now with a question mark. Do we fancy a further descent into evidence-free idiocy? Or is the two-fingered salute probably the best answer to the knicker-wetters? At the moment, I’m not sure, given the need to retain shreds of sanity in the madhouse that is the UK.

But I do know that this situation needs an abandonment of that simple-minded sectarianism, and a focus on what it’s really about.

134885 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Caroline Watson, 7, #839 of 1435 🔗

Remember we are being governed by a new “conservative” government with an 80 seat majority, I honestly do not think you should be putting the blame for your current situation on the “Newcastle middle class left”

We all need to stand together on this, whatever our political leaning, all our futures depend on us being as one.

134937 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Dave #KBF, 9, #840 of 1435 🔗

Hear Hear……..forget the identity politics and remember you are a human being first n foremost!

This is a war against humanity itself. THIS IS WW3, make no mistake, and we humanity are who is under attack.

This cult despises us, despises life, worships death……. but is afraid of love.

It is afraid of us remembering who we are.
That we have compassion.
That we have empathy.
That we are eternal and everlasting love.

You cannot seek to fix a problem with the same level of consciousness that created it in the first place. So said Einstein – or words to that effect – This is the challenge for us all….can we individually and collectively change our minds from one of negativity, greed, aggression, violence, war etc etc to one of love, compassion, empathy, understanding, tolerance etc etc etc??

It may seem futile to some but I BELIEVE and have FAITH in myself to withstand the barrage and come out fighting if needs be and resist to my dying breath any attempt to enslave me into a system of AI controlled evil. I have done the internal auditing and walked the paths of despair BUT I AM STILL HERE!! Recharged, reborn, re-engaged with life and raring to go.

You cannot change the world but you can change yourself. From that, all else will come.Open your heart (not your biological heart but the heart of your being) to love and we can achieve anything. Be a decent human.

This battle will be won…..IT MUST!

Cheers
B

135055 ▶▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to B Boru, #841 of 1435 🔗

A million thumbs up B Boru! Comment of the day for me, and words to live by. Thank you. Arnie.

135258 ▶▶▶▶ Lili, replying to B Boru, #842 of 1435 🔗

Count me in. I’m prepared to fight to the death too. I will not live as a slave.

134780 mjr, #843 of 1435 🔗

All this talk about apps ..
I am surprised they dont just go straight to implanted chips and barcoding

134784 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 17, #844 of 1435 🔗

Just listening to the Dan Wootton show on TalkRadio. Bad news for KH1485, there was a Doctor from Reading University on there in favour of the unnecessary upcoming 2 week lockdown that said “if coffee and sandwich shops go under then it’s tough” as we need to think of saving people lives.

The poll on there has only 25% support for another lockdown.

134792 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnB, 8, #845 of 1435 🔗

Thats right . Clark at Reading Uni. Not a nice man despite his smile. He wasn’t questioned in a follow up to answer how joblessness wrecks health.

134801 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Basics, 27, #846 of 1435 🔗

The nurse from Brighton who works on an acute care ward who came on next was damning about the excess deaths. She said they’ve not had a COVID case in the hospital she works at since April, but they are getting overdoses daily which is abnormal as people are that stressed or lonely because of the lockdown that they are trying to take their lives. the other one she said was they’re getting a lot of Sepsis cases because GP’s will only doing Video appointments and are missing the obvious symptoms.

134869 ▶▶▶▶ leggy, replying to JohnB, 4, #847 of 1435 🔗

She’ll be off to the dungeon.

134909 ▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to JohnB, 4, #848 of 1435 🔗

I heard that nurse caller, we need more to tell it like it is.

134947 ▶▶▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to JohnB, 2, #849 of 1435 🔗

She’s right, I live locally and the lockdown has been disastrous for so many at the bottom of the heap

134836 ▶▶▶ hat man, replying to Basics, 4, #850 of 1435 🔗

If it’s the same Clark as here, he was telling us back in the spring why masks are no use against Covid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtuNSmUZcyY
Bought-and-paid for academic who spouts whatever he’s told to.

134845 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to hat man, #851 of 1435 🔗

That is the clark I was referring to. Sky News occasional dr hilary essentially.

134793 ▶▶ annie, replying to JohnB, 12, #852 of 1435 🔗

I hope the Rrading berk swallows a rock cake and dies. Bastard. Heartless unfeeling bastard.

134806 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to annie, 7, #853 of 1435 🔗

He seemed a complete “I’m alright Jack and sod the rest of them” type of person. These experts are so aloof, right up their own arses.

134812 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to JohnB, 5, #854 of 1435 🔗

Of course, he is a public sector employee, able to WFH, on 100% pay!

134834 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to JohnB, 2, #855 of 1435 🔗

Is it this idiot?:

https://www.reading.ac.uk/biologicalsciences/about/staff/s-r-clarke.aspx

Royal Society links so Bill gates tainted.

134893 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to JohnB, 2, #856 of 1435 🔗

Just talked with a friend. A large aerospace company we know is reducing perm staff by 25%. Partly market forces before Covid but also due to it. That’s over 1000 I believe across the country.

134961 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to JohnB, 5, #857 of 1435 🔗

Yes, all these people who advocate “saving lives” safe in the knowledge their incomes are guaranteed. I wish these bastards had felt so strongly about saving lives before they pumped my poor mum full of their effing drugs. Sorry, really, really angry and just come back from the grave she shouldn’t be in.

135134 ▶▶▶ janis pennance, replying to kh1485, #858 of 1435 🔗

So sorry to read about your Mum , we are in dark times for sure

134815 Bruno, replying to Bruno, #859 of 1435 🔗

Blimey, Harding wants to rely in SPI -M to tell her team how many tests need doing. That’ll be back to Ferguson and co, then.

134818 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Bruno, 3, #860 of 1435 🔗

100 grillion a day.

134826 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, #861 of 1435 🔗

Ha ha! And Bethell totally captured and captivated by the industry, what with his Excel spreadsheet of amazing new developments coming up in testing, saliva etc. Another Moonshot groupie.

134830 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Bruno, 2, #862 of 1435 🔗

I laughed out loud at him saying ‘Ive got a spreadsheet’ – like he’d discovered the holy grail in his shed

134855 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to steve_w, 2, #863 of 1435 🔗

Just looking him up, Harrow, self confessedly ‘fluffed his A Levels’, MA Edinburgh (so no science), journalist, ran the Ministry of Sound (!), Westbourne Comms (PR firm), hereditary peer .
Just the guy I want in charge of ‘Covid 19 medicines, testing, test and trace, life sciences, medicine, research, anti microbial resistance, global health security, rare diseases, NHS security management including cyber security, blood and transplants and organ donation’, which is the list of his responsibilities on the official Gov.uk website.
Words fail me.

134873 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bruno, 1, #864 of 1435 🔗

Makes Dido and Handsy Hancock look like Einsteins!

134832 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Bruno, 5, #865 of 1435 🔗

Dildo Harding has been a complete fuck-up with everything she has been involved with.

This will be no different.

134860 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #866 of 1435 🔗

Ditto Bethell. In spades.

134898 ▶▶▶ Cody, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #867 of 1435 🔗

She’ll fit in just fine with Boris & co. then.

134816 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 16, #868 of 1435 🔗

[Mental health warning: Do not read if you want to stay positive]

Sorry guys. The tides not turning, the water’s only getting deeper. People think the rule of 6 is a breaking point. What, over having your childrens’ education ruined, seeing your loved ones die alone and watching your business be destroyed? 90% of the population see it very simply:- Covid is terrible, it was getting worse so we locked down and it got better, and since we relaxed lockdown it’s getting worse again. Every graph, figure and news report they see just reinforces that belief.

As for the people in charge. Well the data’s all there now, the arguments are clear, the fallacies are exposed, the threat is quantified, the modelling has been tested against reality, Sweden is fine…and it makes no difference. If they were going to change their approach they would have done it by now. There’s nothing more to add. Just like we are living in a post-truth world we now have post-rational politics. We are living in a cult, a religion. Reasoned arguments no longer make any difference. Context and proportionality are dismissed. We will lock down again, we will have a curfew, Christmas will be cancelled. It’s inevitable in this post-rational world. So I’m afraid we’re going to have to ride it out. We are “long-Covid”. I’m hoping we may see some light start to return to our lives in March next year but I fear life may never return to exactly how it was before.   I mean, how could it?

134827 ▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to Achilles, 4, #869 of 1435 🔗

So, what happens when ‘key workers’ decide to strike? Obviously, this will never happen but if food supplies, transport and all medical services were suspended perhaps a rethink would be appropriate.

134831 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Achilles, 8, #870 of 1435 🔗

Just grit your teeth and keep fighting back anyway you can no matter how small or insignificant.

Help out by donating to the crown justice, send e-mails and letters to MPs and mInisters and just be awkward.

And a way that you are happy with that mean you are fighting back and that things will turn in the end.

And if all else fails, get violent and hang them with a hemp rope.

134839 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Achilles, 4, #871 of 1435 🔗

I agree things are just getting worse and the majority are too brainwashed to challenge it. The longer it goes on the less hope I have, I’m not sure even furlough ending will make a difference.

134841 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Achilles, 1, #872 of 1435 🔗

It’s only negative if one agrees with your take on things, Achilles.

134890 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to JohnB, 3, #873 of 1435 🔗

I don’t agree or disagree, necessarily… the points are all valid with respect to a certain possibility. But … so much can change so quickly. And it probably will. We don’t really have any idea. I’m staying positive, because I just don’t think the downward spiral usually ends up happening in quite the way we envision it happening. A big part of the reason for that is the fact that people fear the downward spiral. So … the best you can do is continually talk to people about it.

134861 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Achilles, 3, #874 of 1435 🔗

Well, I wish I could offer some hope here, but it’s only going to get worse. Waiting each day for some sign that the cult is about to be exposed, but it never happens. It’s become so extreme that even if our “leaders” came out tomorrow and said “Surprise – haha – relax now folks – it was all a big joke – we never meant it – get back to normal” – would most people actually believe them?

134863 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Achilles, 4, #875 of 1435 🔗

It’s why I’ll be going to my first ever protest shortly, it’s all I have left in the armoury really. Which I know sounds a bit pathetic. Otherwise I can only hope the longer it goes on, the more people (we can convince) to see it for what it is.

135229 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to leggy, 1, #876 of 1435 🔗

I am not sure what you have already tried. It is a trifle frustrating when there is no response, but you may have planted a seed. I have (home made) stickers on my car (e.g. END CORONAVIUS ACT – WRITE MPs NOW), some fliers/leaflets e.g. on HCQ with links to data – latest Alan Jones to accidentally drop into supermarket trolleys and baskets and would slip them through letter-boxes if I didn’t have so many ties.

134918 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Achilles, 1, #877 of 1435 🔗

I should have heeded your warning and not read on. That said, if nothing else, I do genuinely think Boris doesn’t want to cancel Christmas. That’s why things might well get (much) worse before then: he wants to be able to say “ta da, we saved Christmas with our measures” and then be lauded(?).

134928 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to mattghg, 2, #878 of 1435 🔗

I think he knows that if he did that, there really would be no coming back for him – he would never be forgiven for that..

135027 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to mattghg, #879 of 1435 🔗

Not a chance, I’m afraid.

Just sayin’…..

134926 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Achilles, 3, #880 of 1435 🔗

The rule of six was the first significant step backwards, at national level

134934 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Achilles, 6, #881 of 1435 🔗

Excellent analysis. It seems to me that people simply do not care about their freedom or prosperity, and are so cowardly and ignorant that they are willing to sacrifice everything for nothing, and destroy the entire fabric of civilisation in the process.

I have known for some time that we were in trouble, but not as much as this. All the people who are going along with this are no different than they were before 2020, it’s just that now we can see them for what they really are. Worthless, sub-human scum.

If the majority of people are worthless, then so is the society. I have turned my back on everyone and everything, and will have none of it.

134948 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Richard O, 5, #882 of 1435 🔗

Not everything and everyone…you ‘re on here so you must still retain some sense of hope….even if it is only a tiny wee bit 😉

134960 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to B Boru, 5, #883 of 1435 🔗

My main coping mechanism has been complete withdrawal from civil society, on the grounds that it is unbearable to be in and effectively no longer exists. So in terms of physical interaction with people I have turned my back altogether.

I do have hope, lots of it in fact, but it will not be realised in this fallen place.

134987 ▶▶▶▶▶ Suzyv, replying to Richard O, 1, #884 of 1435 🔗

Can you give us a hint of somewhere better? Might need to make some plans!

134998 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Suzyv, 1, #885 of 1435 🔗

Spoiler alert: it’s not a physical place!

135022 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Richard O, 3, #886 of 1435 🔗

Fair do’s, I hear you there brother!

I used to be like that but now I have decided it is time to get my sleeves rolled up and ‘get it right inty them’ as we say up here.

I am going to die, that is a fact and I will return to the infinite cosmos but the way I do that will be of my choosing and if tha means going down fighting then I accept that.Nothing to lose really!

135034 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to B Boru, 3, #887 of 1435 🔗

I’m with you all the way. My battles are all in the digital arena at the moment but there will be physical confrontations to come.

Standing in the truth and never giving in are the only way I can preserve my ticket out of here. More importantly, they are the only way I that can live with myself in the here and now.

135048 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Richard O, #888 of 1435 🔗

Of the we can be sure. A taster in Victoria, Oz to programme into the sheeple and those still on the fence of what will happen to them if they don’t comply!

Not staying in the shadows and under the radar is the only way I can live with myself now. i have hidden for too long and now I feel it is my time 😉 I’m sure you know what I mean by that.

Cheers
B

135033 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Suzyv, #889 of 1435 🔗

Offgridistan?

134995 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, 3, #890 of 1435 🔗

Yes, I’ve done the same. The only people I see face-to-face are fellow sceptics, or at least agnostics who won’t drone on about safety and the efficacy of face masks. I don’t go into shops unless it’s for 5 minutes or less. So my circle is small but it’s the only way I can cope. I’ve donated quite a bit of money to people and organizations who are fighting the good fight, so trying to do my part that way vs. protesting (which I can’t do from my place in the country, and part of staying sane is limiting my time in the city where the protests happen). Hope is fleeting, with some days better than others.

134942 ▶▶ Hopeful, replying to Achilles, 10, #891 of 1435 🔗

Don’t wish to preach. Take it or leave it as you see fit. Tendered in the spirit of helpfulness and based on what I’ve been doing to protect my mental and physical health. Secure your mental health by embarking on your own process for accepting the fact that life before covid 19 is gone. This acceptance should clear the way for you to see what actions you could take to help get rid of these puppet politicians, and tackle the real drivers of all this nonsense. Keep up to date with developments by checking information from all sources: not msm and bastard bbc of course. Mental energy is a powerful asset. Keep feeding your mind with truths not propaganda and garbage. Keep you body nourished with decent foodstuffs. Can’t be much help to the anti-lockdown cause nor to disrupting the globalists’ agenda 21 plans if we don’t maintain a positive outlook. Responsibility for one’s health and well being is a wonderfully grown-up thing. Bog off Hancock et al!

135003 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Hopeful, 3, #892 of 1435 🔗

Your name says it all! Excellent advice. I’ve tried to at least take control of my physical health with all of this going on. I have figured out what I need to protect my mental health (not associate with bedwetters and severely limit my time in the city), and I stay sane by coming here and listening to and reading truth; I’ve ratcheted down my MSM consumption considerably and mostly check in to see if I can discern a shift in the comments.

134823 steve_w, replying to steve_w, #893 of 1435 🔗

app guy slagging off heneghan

134865 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to steve_w, #894 of 1435 🔗

Steve, I stopped watching a while ago – do you mean Bethall or the other one (I don’t know his name)?

134835 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 20, #895 of 1435 🔗

Unfortunately the people who make the decisions do not suffer the negative consequences. Well not in the immediate short term.

They retain their pay, pensions, lease/company cars, their homes, and their health. Most haven’t been to work in recent times, ‘working’ from home.

The advantages to them are no commuting, etc, just switch on the computer whilst still in bed

So from their point of view it’s “Fukc the sandwich shops, who cares”

They are not bright enough to realise that this sh*t storm will also be coming their way

If there are no taxes being paid the public sector will soon collapse

The 2008 ‘crash’ was a cake walk compared with what’s coming

134840 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Cecil B, 4, #896 of 1435 🔗

I think you are right. I also think the government will try to borrow and print its way out of it. Probably get real austerity in a years time rather than the fake austerity we had for 10 years

134876 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to steve_w, 4, #897 of 1435 🔗

They had a trillion of debt after they bailed out the banks in 2008. The debt is now 2 trillion

Mass unemployment and plummeting tax revenues will severely limit the governments ability to borrow, or raise taxes

The government is already reneging on its commitment to the banks to guarantee the Business Bounce Back Loans (60bn)

They are spending cash like a drunken sailor on shore leave

Never say never. Banks and governments have gone bust in the past

134939 ▶▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Cecil B, 3, #898 of 1435 🔗

Every £ of debt has a £ of assets balancing it – by accounting identity.

Government doesn’t borrow in any sense you would understand it (it is actually simply an accounting balancing item of the non-government sector deciding to save more than it borrows).

There is no limit in the UK’s currency. It goes to whatever level people want to save and pay back private debt to make themselves feel comfortable.

Essentially it all goes around in a circle at the Bank of England – moving from the Consolidated Fund to commercial bank reserve accounts and back again. It never goes anywhere else.

All of which is very clear once you draw up a set of balance sheets. The notion of bankruptcy in Sterling makes no sense at all. There literally is no mechanism.

134977 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Lucan Grey, 2, #899 of 1435 🔗

It’s when you have a worthless currency and so can’t get anyone to lend to you any more that you’re in trouble. Luckily in this instance practically the whole suite of countries has gone down the same ghastly road. Oh, wait, not quite all, China’s still looking OK….

134862 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Cecil B, 2, #900 of 1435 🔗

Agree, and have been anticipating a ‘credit event’ in mid-October, or thereabouts, since March. It could trigger a 1973/4 style sell-off. I am very concerned, and I know I am not the only one.

134888 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #901 of 1435 🔗

It has happened already. Massive amounts of liquidity were injected into the markets in October. What we have got now is smoke and mirrors.

https://www.cadtm.org/Another-look-at-the-Federal-Reserve-s-panic-in-September-2019-and-solutions-to

134867 ▶▶ Drummerman, replying to Cecil B, 3, #902 of 1435 🔗

So long as the Central Banks keep printing money (‘injecting liquidity’ they call it) and setting interests low the middle classes will be ok. Stock markets keep rising and investments keep accruing. When that ends, fuck me, you’re going to hear some a’wailin’ and gnashing of teeth …

134955 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Cecil B, 2, #903 of 1435 🔗

If there are no taxes being paid the public sector will soon collapse”

That’s just as much of a myth as wearing a face nappy protects you from disease.

It’s the other way around. Government always spends ex nihilo using standard banking tricks at the Bank of England and that new money causes increased taxation and saving that precisely matches the initial spend (and thereby takes the same amount out of circulation).

And we can do that until doomsday.

134965 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #904 of 1435 🔗

So you keep saying. Why does anyone bother working – we can spend money that we print for ourselves.

134975 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Lucan Grey, #905 of 1435 🔗

Pity no-one has told the Bulgarians, Romanians and Albanians. All they need to do is to print money and they will be rich.

134842 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 11, #906 of 1435 🔗

Feeling down today, listening to Morrissey and the Smiths to cheer myself up.

134849 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Fingerache Philip., 8, #907 of 1435 🔗

You’re not alone, I just feel I’m staring into a bottomless dystopian abyss now.

134854 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #908 of 1435 🔗

The Smiths always wanted me to kill myself, the Manchester scene was so depressing.

Don’t mention Morrisey, he was worse.

134963 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #909 of 1435 🔗

once went to see him in concert .. cameras were ok but we were frisked for pork pies

134857 ▶▶ Drummerman, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #910 of 1435 🔗

Sorry to hear that, chum. I know how that goes.

Try listening to this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4IouDT4GTM

Champion anti-masker Noel Gallagher playing ‘There is a light …’.

A great performance of (IMO) the greatest Smiths’ song …

134872 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Fingerache Philip., 3, #911 of 1435 🔗

I’m on the verge of reaching for out a Radiohead CD – my wife hates it but I might have to risk it.

134884 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to godowneasy, 1, #912 of 1435 🔗

No..!!

134891 ▶▶▶ Drummerman, replying to godowneasy, 3, #913 of 1435 🔗

Try some Van Der Graaf Generator … You’ll really be set up for a fantastically miserable time 🙂

134970 ▶▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Drummerman, 2, #914 of 1435 🔗

Songs of Love and Hate -Leonard Cohen followed by Marble Index -Nico

134882 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Fingerache Philip., 1, #915 of 1435 🔗

I’ve been listening to a bit of Uprising by Muse to try and steel myself.

134897 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to leggy, 2, #916 of 1435 🔗

Brilliant…..latest album Simulation Theory worth a listen if haven’t and look of film they made for tour…..Matt Bellamy knows 😉

That entire album was written for now….have a listen and see what you think….and the film they made of same. Live intertwined with an interesting narrative

Cheers
B

135028 ▶▶ Arnie, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #918 of 1435 🔗

It’s Green Day for me! Hang in there my friend. The tide is definitely turning, if we get a big enough swing of the pendulum we could push all these murderous b*stards into the sea. In the the meantime KBO! Arnie.

135230 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Arnie, #919 of 1435 🔗

Who else but Commander Cody and his Lost Planet Airmen ?

(Some of the above selections explain a lot about the occasional outbreak of depression on here … 🙂 ).

134844 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 11, #920 of 1435 🔗

This is the link to Carl Heneghan giving evidence to the Science and Technology Committee this afternoon. Well worth a watch if you’re in need of a boost
https://parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/52ee1eec-a2bf-403d-a27d-7bba077ebfcc

134858 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #921 of 1435 🔗

Yep it was really interesting. Apart from Heneghan, no-one seemed able to assess this problem from the perspective of medical science. The reliance on a technical fix and fulfilling what was required of them seemed to override their critical faculties.

134910 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Kate, 3, #922 of 1435 🔗

Fascinating. So little grasp of the real issues on the part of the committee members, so much overweening and totally blinkered confidence on the part of Harding and Bethell, who wouldn’t recognise an endemic pathogen if it hit them between the eyeballs and shouted Boo. And who would probably turn green with self righteous indignation if you mentioned herd immunity.

134915 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, 6, #923 of 1435 🔗

Strengthened me in my resolve to take no notice whatsoever of any of the guidance, restrictions, rules or any of the other nonsense they seek to impose. Neither Bethell, Waite or Harding have as much grasp of the whole picture as most people commenting here.

134945 ▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to Kate, 3, #924 of 1435 🔗

Agreed, the others were all at sea. Certainly explains why we have a problem.

135088 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Charlie Blue, #925 of 1435 🔗

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1306587037244428291.html
 A good summary what Heneghan said today.

134923 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Basics, 10, #927 of 1435 🔗

Rail and public transport in general are utterly screwed – wll require massive bailouts until sanity prevails
i

134950 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Julian, 1, #928 of 1435 🔗

Reuters
Qantas Airways said a seven-hour scenic flight over Australia’s Outback and Great Barrier Reef had sold out in 10 minutes, as it joined a growing trend in Asia offering ‘flights to nowhere’ that take off and land at the same airport

134971 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Julian, 3, #929 of 1435 🔗

Anyone thinking electric cars are the solution might want to think again – read the attached:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/bills/article-8706033/Smart-meters-used-switch-electricity-without-warning-compensation.html

135030 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Julian, 2, #930 of 1435 🔗

Yes, I think you are right, Only largesse from the magic money tree is propping up most public transport. But not to worry, the RMT union is on the case for asking for more:

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-to-step-up-fight-over-jobs-pay-and-conditions/

I wrote to RMT several times in April-May, asking them why they were cheer-leading for the destruction of their industry with their Covi-hysteria but for some reason they were not willing/able to explain. . . . MW

135064 ▶▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 2, #931 of 1435 🔗

Also, we’ve just received the TravelWatch North West newsletter, here’s a quote from it:

Well here we are, still with almost empty trains and buses after the worst 5/6 months for public transport that anyone can remember.

There is a great fear now about the future of public transport and the extent to which the government in the shape of the Treasury will be prepared to prop up what is now a heavily loss making sector. There is a lot to be done to encourage people to come back and the move to working from home is a singularly potent threat to the traditional commuter flows.

To say nothing of the unease that many have of sitting in trains and buses in proximity to others. Face masks are no doubt a turnoff as well – in contrast the private car offers a comfortable, private and safe haven for those who have access to it. MW

135112 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, 1, #932 of 1435 🔗

I cannot for the life of me fathom why the government are pressing ahead with HS2 when everything else they are doing seems to imply no more travel for the proles and that everyone should work from home.

My only explanation is that there are elites who are friends of the government who will make a lot of money from the building of it, even if/when it never gets used…

134982 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 5, #933 of 1435 🔗

I have no sympathy. Public transport organisations from the ground up have been amongst the most zealous and rabid enforcers of the Covid Cult insanity. Let the whole network collapse, and all those jobs be destroyed.

135100 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Richard O, 3, #934 of 1435 🔗

Part of our rebuild ought to be a meangingful bus network that allows villages to be meangingfully connected not isolating villages from life except on wednesdays when escape is possible for a few hours.

134881 Pete Bell, 8, #935 of 1435 🔗

Just had a haircut; lady hairdresser in visor and mask insisted I mask and sanitise hands – yes, of course I’m going to touch a lot of things in a barber’s shop. But she refused to believe me when I said that currently more people in the UK have influenza on their death certificates than CV19. Thought I’d made it up!

134886 Jack, replying to Jack, 4, #936 of 1435 🔗

Young American doctor talking a huge amount of sense about mandatory vaccinations, conflicts of interest in the pharmaceutical industry and looking after yourself rather than relying on drugs. Worth 8 minutes of your time.
https://youtu.be/T540vEvq4IQ

135067 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Jack, #937 of 1435 🔗

Wow, what an articulate young man!

This is really worth listening to.

135109 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Jack, #938 of 1435 🔗

Great to hear from someone coming into the workplace with that mindset!

134895 Banjones, replying to Banjones, 14, #939 of 1435 🔗

This has all gone barking mad. If I even go any way at to obey these ridiculous diktats, I feel like a peasant, being told what I must to by the overlord.
It’s definitely Prole Control – and it’s working. Why are people so enthusiastic about obedience to this coercion?

134907 ▶▶ thedarkhorse, replying to Banjones, 8, #940 of 1435 🔗

Puzzles me too. I’ve always been a rebellious blighter though, re authoritarian things and people.

134919 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Banjones, 3, #941 of 1435 🔗

Populations have shown themselves to be susceptible to Big Lies before, and I think we’re more fearful and safety-mad than ever, as life has got safer. And the level of propaganda has been unprecedented. And now it’s sunk cost fallacy and/or unwillingness to face awful truth

134901 Smelly Melly, replying to Smelly Melly, 12, #942 of 1435 🔗

Just a point of interest. I’m not a psychiatrist (or any other health professional), but I’ve noticed mothers with very young babies wearing masks. I guess the mothers are hysterical about their babies getting this “killer” disease. But I have to ask, as my understanding is that young babies identify with their mothers and bond with them in the early months. Will the masking and unmasking of mothers cause potential psychological damage to the children? Just a thought.

134913 ▶▶ Basileus, replying to Smelly Melly, 7, #943 of 1435 🔗

I am not a specialist, but I would expect this to be extremely damaging.

134929 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Smelly Melly, 5, #944 of 1435 🔗

Yes, is the short answer to your question.

134930 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Smelly Melly, 14, #945 of 1435 🔗

I young mother I work with was saying her young child, I think about one year old, cries constantly when mum wears a face covering, so I told her that is a perfect reason no to wear a face covering.

She was amazed that she was exempt for that reason! People just do not think.

134932 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Smelly Melly, 6, #946 of 1435 🔗

Not an expert either, but speaking as a mother, I would have thought absolutely yes. Surely, babies need to learn a parent’s ‘normal’ range of facial expressions so they can read other people’s when they are exposed to the rest of society?

134941 ▶▶ JME, replying to Smelly Melly, 13, #947 of 1435 🔗

I would totally agree. I am a GP & we have to wear a mask in our consultations at the behest of our esteemed BMA as do our patients ( though I certainly still see them if they don’t have one or want to take it off during the consultation- I have to encourage the latter if they seem to be struggling). I really feel for the babies & toddlers who look for facial expressions all the time. It’s a terrible barrier both between the parents & their child & the doctor & the child (to be fair the barrier exists between the doctor & all patients with the mask situation). It’s a very depressing situation.

134946 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Smelly Melly, 8, #948 of 1435 🔗

Although I don’t like kids – my own or yours – I make a point of smiling or waving to young kids in buggies or prams or being dragged around by their idiot parents who are obviously scared and being affected by all the masked adults around.

Amazing how the kids react to even a miserable old git like me taking notice of them.

135004 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #949 of 1435 🔗

Yes, we M.O.G.s make a point of smiling and waving at little ones too. They usually look happy to see a real face for a change! I agree with those above who say the mask-wearing is damaging children. Chilling. MW

134993 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #950 of 1435 🔗

We need to show parents this picture and inject (sorry) some sanity into the situation:
https://twitter.com/Patriot6112/status/1306578074339868672/photo/1

135086 ▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to Smelly Melly, 2, #951 of 1435 🔗

I happened to be in the congregation for a christening and the infant was trying to pull her father’s mask off. That proves babies hate them.

135149 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #952 of 1435 🔗

I was watching passers by last weekend while my gallant OH put his face rag on to go into a shop. The saddest thing I saw was a couple and their children – one toddler in a pushchair and the mum with a baby carrier – both muzzled. I really felt like going up to her and saying ‘you do realise your baby needs to see your face? Why dont they use that as an excuse not to wear the damn thing. Surely the baby’s welfare takes precedent over virtue signalling. I’m pretty sure no one would challenge her for not wearing one

134931 Basics, 2, #953 of 1435 🔗

The anatomy of a Scottish lie.

https://blogs.gov.scot/statistics/2020/09/15/counting-people-in-hospital-with-covid-19/

If I could post the graph I would.. it’s what a lie looks like.

134936 DRW, replying to DRW, 22, #954 of 1435 🔗

I’ve spent much of the afternoon trying to sort out registration issues for uni. I’ve recieved an email promising campus will be “as safe as possible”. So that’s probably all the hygiene theatric bollocks I’ve been dreading, I’m staying away as much as possible thanks. Now I’m dreading full lockdown and mask zealotry in all material now. And yet the majority of my fellow students are probably complaining it’s not going far enough! It’s just getting worse all the time, I just want to cry.

134940 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to DRW, 19, #955 of 1435 🔗

Go get a job and do open university or fully online degrees.

Make some money and have fun.

Dump the idiots you think of as “friends” as they are not anywhere close to being friends. they re a waste of time.

134953 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, 8, #956 of 1435 🔗

Good idea – what is the point of uni if there is no opportunity to socialise?

134957 ▶▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Carrie, 2, #957 of 1435 🔗

To get a ticket to a job that doesn’t exist, but most importantly to get you deeply in debt so you can be controlled.

134990 ▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Lucan Grey, 6, #958 of 1435 🔗

Absolutely. I’m a retired (American) college teacher. The whole thing has turned into a racket – it wasn’t that in the 70s when I went to university myself, but it changed from the late 80s on. I would never advise anyone to go to university in the US or more recently in the UK, especially since it started following the American model. There are lots of other things a young person can do with their life.

135093 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ FenTyger, replying to ConstantBees, #959 of 1435 🔗

John Grisham “The Rooster Bar” summed it up for me.

135011 ▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Carrie, 6, #960 of 1435 🔗

I worked with someone last year who had completed his uni studies and was lumbered with £50k off debt. That is no way to start life, as Awkward Git say look at the Open Uni.

135348 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Awkward Git, #961 of 1435 🔗

I’m in my final year and only did uni because I could not find local work and now just want to be out of the system as soon as possible. If it was my first I would just do the OU.

134956 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to DRW, 4, #962 of 1435 🔗

My elder son is about to return (second year) and his girlfriend is starting first year at a different university. Hang on in there, they are not worried about safety etc. Two of my son’s friends are on their way round here for dinner too – also at different universities, and knowing them, I very much doubt they are worried about safety (a group of them went cliff diving in Wales a couple of weeks ago)!

135377 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #963 of 1435 🔗

Nice to hear about that. Unfortunately so many of the young have been brainwashed.

134959 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to DRW, 6, #964 of 1435 🔗

Do you want me to put you in touch with my daughter ( 2nd year). I can safely say that ALL her friends are sceptics- they don’t believe any of this nonsense. They too are dreading return to uni ( but at the same time are desperate to get back to some form of normality). What enrages me is that on the surface they’re more compliant- mask wearing) but they break every rule behind the scenes and you can forget social distancing. It’s for the birds. I’m in a dispute at the moment regarding how her college is unilaterally withdrawing all the communal facilities ( thereby consigning them to their bedrooms like convicts). Does anyone know how you contact Toby about this??

135040 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Telpin, #965 of 1435 🔗

There’s usually an email link above the line, but it’s lockdownsceptics@gmail.com

135215 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Telpin, #966 of 1435 🔗

Fewer facilities, lower rent ?

135345 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Telpin, #967 of 1435 🔗

It would be great if we could get a “young sceptics” group going as our generation is ironically the most brainwashed.

134980 ▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to DRW, 22, #968 of 1435 🔗

I feel I should share my experience here fwiw. I spent a total of about 10 minutes at Exeter University before driving straight back home. I had gone there with the mindset that I would lead the resistance from within, not distance or wear masks, party and be free. However when I got there and from the get go students outside in masks guiding us, signs and sanitiser everywhere you looked it was not pleasant. The fact you would have set places to eat in the dining room, and prospects of online teaching were enough to make me reconsider on the spot. I did make it to my room, but that was the final turn off seeing massive no entry signs on all the corridors saying except if you are resident in these flats. Granted students will ignore these, but I feared given the story of Cambridge above and Edinburgh and others it was only a matter of time before they started clamping down on student fun. I pity those sceptics who have gone to university this year. Because I know too many of my friends now matter how hard I have tried have just said they will put up with it because it’s “not difficult to wear a mask” and “it’s not for that long, we will be able to socialise properly soon”. No, the fact the vast majority of students will comply is sealing their fate and giving the universities a free pass to continue with the oppression, which is odd given normally uni students love to be out protesting at the slightest hint of oppression. So good luck to you if you decide you can cope, maybe you can deal with leading the resistance from within! But I am gladly withholding my £9250 from them until next year(unless this nonsense is still going on by then, in which case university might not be for me after all!).

135018 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Youth_Unheard, 4, #969 of 1435 🔗

Awky Gits has some good advice.

Don’t let the turnaround depress your path. Keep at it. Good luck.

135021 ▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Youth_Unheard, 8, #970 of 1435 🔗

I am so sorry to read about this, DRW and Fear Not. Campus is miserable at my place too. As a lecturer, all I can say is ‘Not in my name.’ Some of us did campaign for full normality. We lost, obviously. There are LS academics.

135356 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Ovis, 1, #971 of 1435 🔗

I have no doubt there are sceptical academics, not just the actual experts leading the charge either. There was one on Reddit saying they and some others were all for going back to normal but were outnumbered by the zealots.
It’s so sad it has to be like this.

135023 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Youth_Unheard, 2, #972 of 1435 🔗

Your name says it all. You have followed your instincts, and have just made an absolutely superb decision. Let the order followers who think “this is all going to go away soon” hang themselves. You now have a shot at some kind of future. They are all as good as dead.

135350 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Youth_Unheard, 1, #973 of 1435 🔗

Good on you for sticking up for your principles. They cannot be allowed to turn campuses into prisons.

135071 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to DRW, 10, #974 of 1435 🔗

Uni is not the only way. I went to a top grammar school and chose to do an apprenticeship, which was highly frowned upon at the school. By age 22, I had bought my first home, and now at age 28 I have a very nice home in a very middle class (albeit, bedwetting!) town.

The only problem is I went into the aviation industry, which seems to be defunct in the new normal! But my training and qualifications give me transferable skills, so it should be alright. Choose a good industry and an apprenticeship could be a better way forward. It’s worth thinking about, even though the pressure is there to go to Uni.

134938 Seansaighdeoir, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 17, #975 of 1435 🔗

There is some indication of cases increasing in Europe – Spain and France come to mind and it is interesting to wonder why that is. But as was indicated earlier a virus is never a steady state and it ebbs and flows in terms of infection rates.

It is worrying to see the loss of context in all this though. Yes cases may be increasing but the numbers are still very low.

It is even more important that to remember that as the noise levels grow particularly with the new lockdowns and ‘case increases’ and the panic that will induce it means relatively little to people that in 2018 alone we had 50,000 excess deaths due to flu. In 2015 there again approx 50K deaths and 50K in 2001. And close to that figure in other recent years.

Considering that most people have no idea of these numbers or the numbers of people that die daily and yearly when you consider we are still some way short of this figure in terms of covid deaths this year despite the exaggerated and falsely identified numbers it really makes one question why this is such an issue?

If it wasn’t for the govt and media driving this agenda most people would have little to no idea that there was even such as a thing as a SARS-COV-2 virus let alone the illness covid19 stalking the land. Even less so if the govt had taken the responsible approach and locked down the vulnerable and protected the elderly encouraging everyone else especially the young and healthy to live their lives as normal.

I really struggle to see this as purely incompetence but that is the alternative to what a lot of people here complain of as ‘conspiracy theories’. It beggars belief that western govt’s would behave this way without some sort of coercion. Most of the ongoing damage is purely self inflicted.

134966 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 12, #976 of 1435 🔗

Hancock said again today that the objective is to protect the NHS. This is a barking mad national objective. How about if we protect schools by not using them? Should we not drive our cars, to protect the roads? How about if we stop using public transport so as not to wear it out?

134981 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to WhyNow, 8, #977 of 1435 🔗

Reminds me of Molière’s Miser talking to his servant: ‘And don’t rub the furniture too hard when you polish it, for fear it might wear out.’

135026 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to annie, #978 of 1435 🔗

Hon, chienne! Je suis touché au vif!

135192 ▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to annie, #979 of 1435 🔗

I once knew someone who left the polythene wrapping on his kitchen surfaces.

135078 ▶▶▶ FenTyger, replying to WhyNow, #980 of 1435 🔗

I’ve protected my car by not using it for most of this year. Still have to pay Tax, MOT insurance and servicing though (just like the oNHS).

135001 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 5, #981 of 1435 🔗

I’m sure there are some pockets of remaining susceptibility in countries that locked down hard, and I think the result of this is the small upticks being seen in the countries you mention.
In my opinion, you can only make sense of this, if you do at least hypothesise about high level conspiracy.

135121 ▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Kevin 2, #982 of 1435 🔗

Totally agree. It is difficult to reconcile the two though. On the one had the complete cluster that govt continues to visit upon the same people but at the same time a cognitive dissonance that this really is down to incompetence. Personally there has been to much invested in too many high level parties such as the UN and the Banking world to accept there is not a larger game afoot. This has all the hallmarks of Agenda 21 and 30. The banking world is already looking at debt leverage and Nesara / Gesara. That is serious enough to warrant investigation.

134951 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #983 of 1435 🔗

Toby about to be on TalkRADIO with Dan Wootton.

https://youtu.be/7TyuVjgvTrs

Free Speech Union stuff I think, but lockdown may be mentioned.

134969 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #984 of 1435 🔗

No he is going to talk about why he was wrong to back Boris Johnson at the last election.

Should be interesting, he will be on before 19:00

135324 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Dave #KBF, #985 of 1435 🔗

Toby’s interview has now been uploaded to youtube, although I expect he will refer to it with a link when he nexts publishes on this site..

134952 WhyNow, replying to WhyNow, 13, #986 of 1435 🔗

I still think we are not quite hitting the target with our criticism of health policies. We talk about disproportionate, ineffective, false positive, mental health etc. All of these are unconvincing if you think that Covid is the new Ebola.

The problem is that we are a bit squeamish. Death is still a taboo subject. When they tell us that n people are in ICU, or n people will die, we don’t ask and they don’t say whether those people are terminally ill. It seems callous. But the statistics say they must be.

The ONS say that 52,000 more people died in the year to date than the five year moving average. That’s a lot of people, although it is also only 8-9% more than normal, and it may be less by the end of the year, and it may not be that far out of line with other bad flu years.

But the key point is: who is dying? If it is those who are terminally ill with dementia or alzheimer’s, or suffering the effects of a stroke, or with chronic heart disease, or all the normal causes of death, then those people are not available to die again. The wave must peter out as it rolls up the beach.

Currently they are telling us that the reduced death rate is only thanks to lockdown, and people will start dying again when it is eased. But this is a self fulfilling prophecy. If you took all those in hospital and put them in isolation for a few weeks, then fewer people would die of flu or bacterial infection during that time. But as soon as you take them out of isolation they would catch infections and die.

As it is, this is a very expensive way to prolong the life of the terminally ill by a few months at best.

134968 ▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 10, #987 of 1435 🔗

Yes, that’s the point. People seem to be/try to be disconnected from death most of the time, and once they were reminded of it incessantly they got panicked, and squeamish and are unable to think about it rationally. Death was hidden from the public discourse, especially considerations of cost benefit analysis in relation to death. But only an idiot can deny they have always happened, unavoidably.

135052 ▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to Julian, 2, #988 of 1435 🔗

Yes, I profoundly agree. Many people have preferred to deny that death is real; since March, that’s become much harder to do. Now, there are panic and terror in people who have not had any practice in facing up to this absolute fact about life.

134986 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to WhyNow, 3, #989 of 1435 🔗

But what about these stats regarding the 5 year average?
https://twitter.com/timbofive/status/1306618765656887298
A simple fact for everyone! From the 12 weeks 11/06/20-04/09/20 the UK death toll is the lowest for 5 years. Yet more stringent lockdowns are happening because of +tests from a spurious test operating at over twice the recommended magnification. All figures from ONS’

Maybe someone could retweet this thread to Julia Hartley-Brewer, who seems to be doing a good job now at presenting her interviewees with ‘uncomfortable’ stats, and putting them on the spot 😉

135092 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to WhyNow, 1, #990 of 1435 🔗

It is difficult when the MSM are hyping death stats all the time – remember when Toby was interviewed the other week, he said that surveys had shown that the public think that 7% of the population has died from Covid, which would of course mean millions…?

Either they cannot do maths or are all stupid, or are believing the MSM and not thinking logically. Someone needs to point out that if millions had indeed died, we would be seeing bodies piled on the streets and everyone would know a lot of ‘victims’, and be having to (sadly) delete phone numbers of friends from their mobiles…

135217 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Carrie, 1, #991 of 1435 🔗

The media do not have a sense of scale. If ten people died in a knife attack one day, it would be huge news. They used to bring us the daily death toll from Iraq. The very fact of a report makes it seem important. “Another five people died today” sounds significant, when in fact we know that about 1700 die every day.

134973 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 38, #992 of 1435 🔗

Just seen the BBC news and wonder of wonders, one woman in the North East said on camera “It’s yes sir,no sir,3 bags full sir; this country is finished” unbelievable a sceptic on national news.
GREAT RESPECT TO THAT BRAVE WOMAN.

134997 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Fingerache Philip., 18, #993 of 1435 🔗

There were two women interviewed on Sky in Sunderland of the same view. I would guess one was a student, the other a working class local woman around late 30s. They did not mince their words. Of course, we had to have two bedwetters for balance!

134983 HaylingDave, replying to HaylingDave, 5, #994 of 1435 🔗

What a nob.

I don’t think he even read my letter properly, or he did and picked the wrong template to reply. Every paragraph of his reply contains lies, errors or half-truths in multitude.

What a nob.

So I wrote my third (and probably final) note to my MP on Monday, urging him to not support any extensions to the Coronavirus Act 2020 … I won’t post the entire letter here, but this was the last paragraph – as opposed to bombarding him with facts/figures/logic/evidence-based-arguments, in the end, I tried to talk to him as a human, a citizen, and an honest guy:

….

Alan, although I write this from a current perspective, I do not primarily fear for myself in these times, but I fear for my children’s future. Right now, it appears dystopian – a land where the simple gestures of hugs and handshakes are discouraged, where smiles go unseen, where holidays pass unceremoniously, where special life-markers are celebrated in solitude, and friends and loved ones grow old and die alone. You have a chance to stand up and make a difference and be remembered in history as an MP who stood for and by his constituents. Alan, something is not right – the figures do not add up: you must know this, or at least feel it. Do the research, do the maths, do the evidentiary based trail-following, but most importantly, do the right thing. Do not support extensions to the Coronavirus Act 2020. Please!

Dear Mr Webster,

Thank you for contacting me about the new measures to restrict the further spread of coronavirus.

The Government has been clear throughout that, should the number of cases escalate, they would not hesitate to take whatever measures are necessary to stop the spread and save lives. While relaxations of restrictions over recent months have been welcome, sadly, rates are now rising.

That is why the Government, on the advice of scientific and medical experts, has acted. The new measures are simple: you may socialise in groups no larger than six, indoors or outdoors, unless everyone is from the same household or support bubble. Groups of six allow people to socialise with friends and family without encouraging large groups of multiple households, where there is a risk that somebody suffering with coronavirus asymptomatically could pass the virus on to several different households, who could then pass the virus further.

While these measures impact our way of life, they are necessary to keep control of the virus.

COVID Secure venues like places of worship, gyms, restaurants and hospitality venues can still hold more than 6 people in total. Within those venues however, there must not be individual groups larger than 6, and groups must not mix socially or form larger groups.

It is vitally important that people remember to wash their hands, to cover their faces in enclosed spaces, and to keep plenty of space between themselves and others.

Education and work settings are unaffected, COVID Secure weddings and funerals can go ahead, up to a limit of 30 people, and organised sport will still be able to proceed. More information on exemptions can be found at: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing

Children will not be exempted from the rule of six in England. This ensures that the rules are simple to remember, helping people to stay safe and protect one another from the virus. Unless a group is all from the same household, only six people should gather in social situations.

I strongly urge everyone to comply with the law and to restrict social contact as far as possible. We must do all we can to protect vulnerable people from coronavirus.

I appreciate that you have some reservations and disagree with this measure. I understand the frustrations you have expressed and I thank you for sharing your thoughts with me on this. I have subsequently passed these onto my Ministerial colleagues.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact me.

Kind regards,

Alan

134996 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to HaylingDave, 6, #995 of 1435 🔗

Utterly contemptable!

They must have circulated a generic response letter for all the acolytes who are fully on board and sold their souls!

134999 ▶▶ Drummerman, replying to HaylingDave, 4, #996 of 1435 🔗

The warmth of his reply will keep you toasty during the long winter months of lockdown stage X ….

135008 ▶▶ matt, replying to HaylingDave, 16, #997 of 1435 🔗

Congratulations. In a crowded field, you are the proud owner of the most useless and patronizing letter received by anyone on this site from an MP.

135015 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to HaylingDave, 5, #998 of 1435 🔗

I can’t even bring myself to read these replies from MPs anymore. I caught a bit of that just scrolling past and it made me angry.

135031 ▶▶ Nottingham69, replying to HaylingDave, 1, #999 of 1435 🔗

Asymptomatic spread again. Interesting and hard to believe.

135045 ▶▶ Hampshire Sceptic, replying to HaylingDave, 2, #1000 of 1435 🔗

That must be Alan Mak – a toady of the first order.

135232 ▶▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to Hampshire Sceptic, #1001 of 1435 🔗

Yes indeed …. sigh.

135069 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to HaylingDave, 1, #1002 of 1435 🔗

I’m not liking this ‘Covid secure’ language at all – reeks of state control…

135070 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to HaylingDave, 1, #1003 of 1435 🔗

“COVID Secure” has got to be one of the most empty and patronising slogans in the Covid Cult lexicon.

Works a treat though when the majority of the population are delinquent children masquerading as adults.

135082 ▶▶ CGL, replying to HaylingDave, #1004 of 1435 🔗

Don’t stop – I’m going to email mine every day!

135194 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to HaylingDave, 2, #1005 of 1435 🔗

Alan has been busy with ctrl+c and ctrl+v it appears.

134985 Bruno, replying to Bruno, 8, #1006 of 1435 🔗

Blow me, Rees Mogg today raised himself from the dead to extol this country’s ‘phenomenal success’ in dealing with this unprecedented disease. It is indeed a phenomenon.

134989 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Bruno, 5, #1007 of 1435 🔗

Who the bloody hell votes for these creeps?

135017 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #1008 of 1435 🔗

Who the bloody hell votes for these creeps and g utless parasites….?

135081 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bruno, 3, #1009 of 1435 🔗

Apparently he also had a go at people for complaining that it was taking too long to get a test… Whilst as one of the elite, he of course, had no problem getting a test when his kid got ill…

134992 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 4, #1010 of 1435 🔗

Disempowerment is surprisingly popular in this country, has been, arguably, forever

Peak Corbyn was 40% of the electorate, about 13 million voters, the same number that Blair got in 1997 (of course the population had risen, net, by 400,000/year in the intervening period…..)

14 million use twitter.

A very large number of people in this country like this kind of government, have always liked this kind of government: ‘big state’; and this is what it looks like, wherever it is to be found: illiberal, incompetent, inefficient, inimical to enterprise, small businesses, and heroically expensive.

This is Blair’s Britain, Corbyn’s Britain, and large parts of the population really believe, have always believed, that this is the way to go; representative social democracy apparently but, in reality, socialist party democracy and the socialist party bit trumps the representative democratic bit.

And this is what impotent disempowerment under socialism feels like…….

On the other hand, it does give those too young to remember Harold Wilson’s Britain of the 1970s (or the USSR) a feel for what it was like.

What, I wonder, will Starmer’s Britain look like, because that is what is hurtling down the tracks?

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/trackers/boris-johnson-approval-rating

Are there no states espousing enterprise, championing the individual, to which the disenchanted can emigrate?

In fact there is one, bigger than France, with great hats……..

https://realestate.usnews.com/places/texas/austin

135012 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Tim Bidie, 2, #1011 of 1435 🔗

Nonsense. This country has always been governed by an elite for an elite, since before the Norman Conquest. E.g., today , Deloittes fined £15M for accounting failures 10 years ago, in the sale of Autonomy to HP, one partner barred for 5 years. The Financial Reporting Council (FRC).said that Deloitte and Richard Knights failed to “act with integrity and objectivity”.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/sep/17/deloitte-fined-record-15m-for-failings-in-autonomy-audits , and we’re awarding their consultancy arm massive state contracts, without going out to tender, to run part of Track and Trace.
Multiple other examples of greed,incompetence and exploitation of the people down the ages, by those who should know better, claiming every excuse from the divine right of kings to the supreme competence of the free market.

135029 ▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Bruno, #1012 of 1435 🔗

My point exactly, and a socialist elite (encompassing parastatal big companies like Deloitte) since 1945…..state broadcaster fat salaries, state health service fat stipends, state quango heads knighted, ennobled, state bureaucrats on fat stipends/pensions/gongs…….

Even under Thatcher state spending rose in real terms during every year (except two) of her government.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/04/how-public-spending-rose-under-thatcher

Big state….and we are now living through, have arrived at, the natural destination….

135038 ▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to Bruno, 3, #1013 of 1435 🔗

“since before the Normal Conquest”

Actually the Norman Conquest was a huge change for the worse: Anglo-Saxon England was very advanced by the standards of the time. I’ve read that it was the most literate country in Europe: did any other country have a “civil service” capable of anything like the Domesday Book?

135054 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Ossettian, 1, #1014 of 1435 🔗

Agree we might have done better without the Conquest, it was a very well organised society under their predecessors. I often think that when contemplating the putative grave goods of King Redwald.

135043 ▶▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Bruno, 2, #1015 of 1435 🔗

The real problem for us here is that the lockdown is actually what most people want. The BBC and the other broadcasters want it too.

135058 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to WhyNow, 6, #1016 of 1435 🔗

lockdown is actually what most people want.”

True, because they have been lied to on an unprecedented scale by the government and the media, bribed by the government. Only following orders is no defence

135084 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Julian, #1017 of 1435 🔗

Yes, too many have no incentive to challenge what is happening. If, for example, it was a choice between locking down and obeying, or going out to work to put food on the table, attitudes and behaviour would change pretty quickly.

135117 ▶▶▶▶ wat tyler, replying to WhyNow, 7, #1018 of 1435 🔗

There’s no evidence most people wan’t another lockdown or even that they wanted the first or to wear masks or any nonsense about how many people can meet .Please can people on here stop believing these online polls ,they are completely meaningless . The truth is most people are fed up with it all and just want to get back to normal. Stop taking the ravings of the mental cases on twitter and the BBC as in anyway representative of the people of the country as a whole .

135252 ▶▶▶▶▶ OpenYourEyes, replying to wat tyler, 2, #1019 of 1435 🔗

“Opinion polls are a device for influencing public opinion, not for measuring it. Crack that, and it all makes sense” Peter Hitchens.

135263 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to OpenYourEyes, #1020 of 1435 🔗

I think he got it from Sir Humphrey Appleby.Very true

135050 ▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to Tim Bidie, 1, #1021 of 1435 🔗

What, I wonder, will Starmer’s Britain look like, because that is what is hurtling down the tracks?

Sir ‘Trilateral Commission’ Starmer will ensure that the programme stays on track. (AG thinks we’ll probably have a ‘Government of National Unity’ or similar with Starmer at the head by this time next year.) MW

135205 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Tim Bidie, #1022 of 1435 🔗

Haven’t Austin just voted to defund their police ?

135562 ▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to JohnB, #1023 of 1435 🔗

30% cut

‘… immediate cuts would include eliminating funding from three planned police cadet classes and reallocating funds to areas like violence prevention, food access and abortion access programs.’

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/08/13/austin-city-council-cut-police-budget-defund/

135000 Mrs issedoff, replying to Mrs issedoff, 19, #1024 of 1435 🔗

I do know that muzzles have been discussed on here many a time but wanted to ask a question of my fellow sceptics. I have never worn a mask and don’t intend to, I love walking around with a big smile on my face as I breath easily and feel superior. My question is, seeing as I am a grannie myself can I still be a grannie killer?!.

135065 ▶▶ annie, replying to Mrs issedoff, 1, #1025 of 1435 🔗

Only your own grannie, surely?,

135074 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Mrs issedoff, 3, #1026 of 1435 🔗

If the virus takes you out then I’m sure the sheepies will say that you killed yourself by not wearing the face nappy. So as as grannie you will have killed yourself as a grannie. I’m sure that Hancock could use his philosophy part of PPE to correct me if wrong.

135201 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Mrs issedoff, #1027 of 1435 🔗

Way to go grannie! I suppose you could take out grannie friends.

135002 Bruno, replying to Bruno, 3, #1028 of 1435 🔗

Deloittes today fined £15M for accounting failures 10 years ago, in the sale of Autonomy to HP, one partner barred for 5 years. The Financial Reporting Council (FRC).said that Deloitte and Richard Knights failed to “act with integrity and objectivity”.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/sep/17/deloitte-fined-record-15m-for-failings-in-autonomy-audits
And we’re awarding their consultancy arm massive state contracts, without going out to tender, to run part of Track and Trace. Great.

135005 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Bruno, 1, #1029 of 1435 🔗

Well you’d hate for integrity and objectivity to get in the way of phony state boondoggles.

135073 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Bruno, 2, #1030 of 1435 🔗

Well we have followed the lockdown strategy, to the letter, based on the expert modelling of a man who has an enviable track record of systematically getting it wrong by a factor of more than 10!

135006 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 9, #1031 of 1435 🔗

Hilarious – from BBC:

German football team loses 37-0 in socially distanced match A German football team lost 37-0 to their local rivals after fielding only seven players who socially distanced throughout the match.
Ripdorf fielded the minimum number of players possible in the game on Sunday because their opponents, SV Holdenstedt II, had come into contact with someone who tested positive for coronavirus in a recent match.
Their team tested negative but Ripdorf said the conditions were not safe.
Ripdorf asked for the match to be postponed but the local association refused, and the team would have faced a €200 (£182) fine if they had not played.

135035 ▶▶ Andy C, replying to godowneasy, 13, #1032 of 1435 🔗

So, you’re saying if they didn’t play, they would’ve been Ripdorf? I’ll get my coat.

135042 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Andy C, 2, #1033 of 1435 🔗

a tumbleweed just blew across my living room! 😉

135118 ▶▶ Matt The Cat, replying to godowneasy, #1034 of 1435 🔗

Saw the headline on the Beeb website and prayed it was an ironic/satirical act but alas, I was disappointed.

135177 ▶▶ Edward, replying to godowneasy, #1035 of 1435 🔗

That beats the famous “highest ever score in a football match”, Arbroath 36 Bon Accord 0 in 1885! But Bon Accord had a full team.

135016 tonys, replying to tonys, 10, #1036 of 1435 🔗

Death porn on the bbc ‘distressing images’ from France of a patient with Covid, the result so we are told by the reporter Lady Whiteadder of the populace frolicking on the beach in summer. It feels like no progress has been made in six months, I just don’t know what is wrong with these people, what they are doing is just evil and this was after Fergus Walsh had actually referred to Sweden in a positive light.

135056 ▶▶ Julian, replying to tonys, 6, #1037 of 1435 🔗

What’s wrong with them is that the kind of society you get with medico fascism is quite compliant, where people do that they are told and can be accused of antisocial behaviour if they question is, and that suits people who think they are right about everything and know better than everyone else – the kind of people who run and work at the BBC, like the man from their Misinformation Unit who told me that people like Piers Corbyn had erroneous views that must be not shared on the BBC and did not benefit from being given an airing.

135328 ▶▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to Julian, 1, #1038 of 1435 🔗

The modern day Pharisees, for those of us who know the gospels

135019 matt, replying to matt, 10, #1039 of 1435 🔗

I’ve just had a very interesting paper emailed to me by a friend, whose friend contributed to it, but doesn’t have his name on the paper. I have no obvious way to share the paper here, I’m afraid.

But just to share the commentary from said friend-of-a -friend:
“I’ve attached a paper that has been written by my colleagues and myself to officially challenge Neil’s model. Officially outside the NHS I do not have a view and you’ll see my name isn’t listed as an author on this version. I am working within the “Rules” of the NHS to try and progress challenge and change from within whilst my co-authors who are outside the NHS are going more along the media/govt route”

135060 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to matt, 2, #1040 of 1435 🔗

Can you scan it and send to Simon Dolan? He wants viewpoints from the NHS..

135091 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to matt, 1, #1041 of 1435 🔗

Email to Toby once you’re cleared to share this, please

135020 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 13, #1042 of 1435 🔗

In Debenhams today. No customers. Goods discounted by 70%

They won’t be around in 6 weeks

(I take no pleasure in saying it)

135061 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Cecil B, 5, #1043 of 1435 🔗

Agree. Quarter day is 29 September, so anticipate mass closures of retail businesses thereafter. Question is whether it precipitates a cascade of bankruptcies.

135062 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cecil B, 5, #1044 of 1435 🔗

How Covid hysterical have they been? I’ve no sympathy for stores that treat their customers like s..t.

135085 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Cecil B, 3, #1045 of 1435 🔗

Thoroughly deserved. More of the same please.

135209 ▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Cecil B, #1046 of 1435 🔗

Variation on
Get Woke, Go Broke.

Get Mask Cult, Go Broke.

Open to more lyrical suggestions?

135243 ▶▶ Thinkaboutit, replying to Cecil B, #1047 of 1435 🔗

Retail sales figures for August out tomorrow. Should be interesting. Comparing online re in- person.

135032 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 4, #1048 of 1435 🔗

https://rexdouglass.github.io/DataScienceAndCovid19/DataScienceAndCOVID19.nb.html

A good short article from California about science problems incl.testing in the C-19 pandemic and the chaotic registering of cases.

This quote describes well the UK situation

 “The necessity of directly including testing in models of disease spread can’t be understated. Per capita cases are so temporarily correlated with per capita testing rates they are more of a proxy of testing availability than infections (Kaashoek and Santillana 2020). Spatially, per capita testing rates correlate with urbanity and a wide range of co-morbids (Souch and Cossman 2020). How many tests are given and to who varies systematically in response to conditions on the ground with both periods of rationing and blitzes.”

135037 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to swedenborg, 2, #1049 of 1435 🔗

It is quite bizarre. It seems they can’t decide whether you should get tested if you are unwell, or get tested even though you are well. If they don’t know the population they are testing, then the percentage of cases is meaningless.

135161 ▶▶ Edward, replying to swedenborg, #1050 of 1435 🔗

Good explanation. Could be summarised as “Seek and ye shall find”.

135036 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1051 of 1435 🔗

Alert – Carl being interviewed on Sky

135059 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1052 of 1435 🔗

Link?

135097 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Carrie, #1053 of 1435 🔗

Sorry Carrie, there doesn’t seem to be anything up on Sky website.

135103 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1054 of 1435 🔗

No worries – I guess he might put it on his Twitter later?

135039 Tyneside Tigress, 10, #1055 of 1435 🔗

Carl is saying you need to connect testing with clinical pathway. Complete change of government strategy needed. He is speaking from experience in his GP clinic

135041 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 17, #1056 of 1435 🔗

Carl saying we need to follow Sweden and build herd immunity now among young and middle aged before January/February, and stop panicking.

Why is this man not the CMO?

135051 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Dan Clarke, 5, #1058 of 1435 🔗

It would have taken more courage at the time to follow the herd immunity approach than the PM had, since then it’s just been filthy self-preservation and love of power

135079 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, 4, #1059 of 1435 🔗

The press had a lot to do with rubbishing the population immunity approach, despite some late hypocritical recantation.

135083 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1060 of 1435 🔗

Because the best people probably don’t want to be CMO as it’s poorly paid in comparison to normal work ? Just a theory

135095 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Leemc23, #1061 of 1435 🔗

Likely better paid than a university professor – Dame Sally doesn’t seem to have done too badly out of it!

135101 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1062 of 1435 🔗

Is this uploaded anywhere?

135049 Kevin 2, replying to Kevin 2, 4, #1063 of 1435 🔗

2019 Flu jab / Covid link??

From the always excellent James Corbett:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHoxsSK_DXo&ab_channel=corbettreport

135066 ▶▶ Quernus, replying to Kevin 2, 11, #1064 of 1435 🔗

This is an excellent piece, and confirms what I’ve long suspected about the flu vaccine. My own experience is that my long-standing asthma cleared up only once I stopped going for the annual flu jab. I’ve heard this story time and and time again. And so I have been wondering how many of those who have died of/with Covid-19 had had the flu vaccine. Puts the government’s push for as many people to have the flu vaccine this winter in a rather dimmer light than before.

135077 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Quernus, 7, #1065 of 1435 🔗

Apparently a lot in Northern Italy had had it…..

Makes the plan to give it to all kids here seem like a secret plan to create a new scare – ‘kids get virus too’ – and to create their desired second wave..

135068 Basics, replying to Basics, 2, #1066 of 1435 🔗

Bill Gates Father has died. 94. I believe he was a Trustee of the Gates Foundation.

135076 ▶▶ annie, replying to Basics, 5, #1067 of 1435 🔗

Died with Covid?

135115 ▶▶ Matt The Cat, replying to Basics, 3, #1069 of 1435 🔗

Yet again, a Nation mourns 😉

135481 ▶▶▶ DomW, replying to Matt The Cat, 1, #1070 of 1435 🔗

I mourn only that he ever existed to create his ungodly spawn

135075 annie, replying to annie, 11, #1071 of 1435 🔗

A tiny spark: Channel 4 have dropped the horrible, patronising ‘stay safe’ (originally ‘stay at home’) message from the top left of the TV screen. Used to make me nauseous. Now I can go back Can p to watching ‘Secret Life of the Zoo’, which is all a about sensible, intelligent animal life, the total antithesis of the BBC News.

135080 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to annie, 3, #1072 of 1435 🔗

Bit off topic, but why don’t Sky drop the BLM advertising & messages that are on 24/7. Who’s paying for that

135089 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Leemc23, 2, #1073 of 1435 🔗

Probably Soros or one of his minions

135132 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Leemc23, 2, #1074 of 1435 🔗

no one … sky is more woke than the BBC…

135090 RickH, replying to RickH, 12, #1076 of 1435 🔗

Had an intelligent and thoughtful conversation with an oncologist today – about risk, benefit, harm and death in a real situation of assessing options.

Puts into context and perspective the pointless absolute blathering nonsense that Covid has induced.

135185 ▶▶ CGL, replying to RickH, 2, #1077 of 1435 🔗

Check out Karol Sikora on Triggernometry. It is a really good interview. Why are people like him not running this s**tshow?

135096 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 15, #1078 of 1435 🔗

Just have a look at this stuff from the BBC, especially the graphs at the bottom:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-52934822

Can someone now tell me why these ridiculous and draconian restrictions have been imposed on the people of Northumberland, one of England’s largest, and least populated counties? What is the sense or reason here?

135104 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1080 of 1435 🔗

Northumberland is badly served by public transport (relative to Newcastle). The buses, however, nearly all come into Newcastle at The Haymarket, which is right next to the University and Civic Centre. Assume this might be in their thinking, but who knows, given that they are incapable of rational thinking!

135110 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tenchy, 4, #1081 of 1435 🔗

What is the sense or reason here?”

Pass.

135225 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to RickH, #1082 of 1435 🔗

Where I’m from they called and still call the slower kids in school the Bleeps. From Mastermind when you say Pass.

135102 p02099003, 4, #1083 of 1435 🔗

Here is the response to my FOIA request to the University Hospitals of Leicester NHS Trust, apologies for the lack of formatting.

Please could you provide the following information relating to the pandemic.

For the period 1st March to 21st August 2020

a)    The number of patients admitted who tested positive for SARS-COV-2

Period 1

Covid Positive patients 2



From
To

Hospital Admissions

ITU admissions

Total ED Attendances

01/03/2020
01/03/2020

0

0

636

02/03/2020
08/03/2020

8

0

4,547

09/03/2020
15/03/2020

20

4

4,004

16/03/2020
22/03/2020

81

6

3,026

23/03/2020
29/03/2020

177

20

2,117

30/03/2020
05/04/2020

237

27

1,876

06/04/2020
12/04/2020

214

19

1,860

13/04/2020
19/04/2020

147

23

1,868

20/04/2020
26/04/2020

116

24

2,051

27/04/2020
03/05/2020

109

15

2,191

04/05/2020
10/05/2020

110

9

2,421

11/05/2020
17/05/2020

114

10

2,427

18/05/2020
24/05/2020

63

8

2,754

25/05/2020
31/05/2020

63

5

2,916

01/06/2020
07/06/2020

49

4

2,774

08/06/2020
14/06/2020

71

6

2,836

15/06/2020
21/06/2020

54

10

3,029

22/06/2020
28/06/2020

47

4

3,207

29/06/2020
05/07/2020

34

5

2,802

06/07/2020
12/07/2020

30

2

2,833

13/07/2020
19/07/2020

20

2

3,084

20/07/2020
26/07/2020

17

0

3,233

27/07/2020
02/08/2020

12

3

3,291

03/08/2020
09/08/2020

6

1

3,300

10/08/2020
16/08/2020

8

0

3,505

17/08/2020
23/08/2020

9

1

2,514

TOTAL for period 1st Mar – 23rd Aug 2020

1816

208

71,102

Notes
1 For a) Hospital Admissions and b) ITU Admissions this is the admission date into hospital and admission date into ICU, not the date of covid diagnosis. For ED attendances this is arrival date
2 Tested during stay in hospital and reported as covid-19 positive

b)    The number of patients admitted who tested positive for SARS AND who showed signs and symptoms of CoViD19

Response outlined in the answer for Question (a).

c)    The number of patients admitted into ITU with serious signs and symptoms of CoViD19, e.g. ARDS, abnormal clotting, other inflammatory symptoms including gastrointestinal and cardiac.

260.

d)    a breakdown of a – c on a week by week basis as well as total numbers

Part response is outline in the answer for Question (a)

A breakdown of the response to Question (c) is below:

DATE

ITU PATIENTS

March 16th – 22nd

4

March 23rd -29th

23

March 30th – April 5th

30

April 6th – 12th

30

April 13th – 19th

28

April 20th – 26th

17

April 27th – May 3rd

22

May 4th – 10th

11

May 11th – 17th

12

May 18th – 24th

11

May 25th – 31st

13

June 1st – 7th

6

June 8th – 14th

9

June 15th – 21st

10

June 22nd – 28th

11

June 29th – July 5th

5

July 6th – 12th

5

July 13th – 19th

6

July 20th – 26th

2

July 27th – August 2nd

3

August 3rd – 9th

1

August 10th – 16th

1

August 17th – 23rd

0

August 24th – 30th

0

260

e)    The number of patients attending the emergency department (both adults and children) for whatever reason for each week since 1st March 2020.

Response outlined in the answer for Question (a).

135106 Telpin, replying to Telpin, 18, #1084 of 1435 🔗

Delingpole excellent on Talk Radio just now – convinced that BJ would be gone in 6 months. Wancock too. God I hope so – though fear that there’ll be nothing worth saving. Will need a complete change of cabinet – to allow for a volte face in policy. Cannot tolerate more of the same

135111 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Telpin, 6, #1085 of 1435 🔗

Sam Coates report on Sky would confirm there is something of a behind-the-scenes ‘organised’ rebellion brewing ahead of the 30 September renewal of the legislation. Clip with earlier interview with Desmond Swaine, and clips from HoC with pretty aggressive points made by some Red Wall Tories. Bloody hope so – about time!

135123 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Telpin, #1086 of 1435 🔗

Yes, he was very good 🙂
Didn’t know he knew BJ personally..

135127 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Telpin, 2, #1087 of 1435 🔗

We could end up with a worse PM than Boris, but I can’t imagine a worse health sec than handjob.

135256 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to mattghg, 2, #1088 of 1435 🔗

Worse than Johnson is not possible

135259 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #1089 of 1435 🔗

Blair was worse. He’s probably still done more harm overall, though admittedly Johnson has done it much more quickly. Then again, Blair wasn’t gifted with a global pandemic of panic to work with – he had to base the national self-harm he inflicted entirely on his own efforts.

135329 ▶▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to mattghg, 1, #1090 of 1435 🔗

Thinking slightly outside of the box a minute, I agree, can potentially see problems here too. For a couple of reasons: a) there’s no guarantee a new leader will have any ideas outside of Boris’ station, and perhaps would be inclined to take us, or be *cough, ‘guided’ to take us on a similarly disastrous path, maybe Sunak would be the exception, from what I’ve seen of him thus far is that he seems like a decent guy, who probably cannot be bought (at the mo, imo); IF he wants the top job…he may not. b) the presence of a new Tory leader coupled with an impending [possible, maybe probable ] no-deal Brexit might wake the Labour front benches up a bit, and cause enough stir to demand a 2021 GE; a GE in which, while 80-odd majority is a handy place to be, I’m still not sure a lot of people would touch the Tories with a rented barge-pole…so you could end up with Sir Keir coming significantly to the fore… but which Keir Starmer will it be? the multi-millionaire knight of the realm going to go ‘oop north, all the supposed Labour heartlands, and to the midlands, walk through the potteries and tell them that he’s their man? or the Trilateral Commission member – globalist to the core??

But you’re right with Hangcock. Pick a random person on the street, blindfold them, & get them to chuck a brick out of a window to pick the next Health Sec.. guarantee they will hit someone better than him! 🙂

135138 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Telpin, 10, #1091 of 1435 🔗

I would enjoy Johnson’s demise immensely, purely out of spite, but whoever replaces him will be even worse. Starmer as head of a Government of National Unity is the nightmare scenario. Full-on Woke Totalitarianism with all the bells and whistles.

Nobody in the political arena is going to save us. We have to get out of this ourselves.

135249 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Richard O, 3, #1092 of 1435 🔗

No need for a “government of national unity”. The “Conservatives” have all the majority they need and Labour rendered themselves irrelevant by proving even worse on the coronapanic than the government. So all that is needed is for a deposition of the regime by “Conservative” Party MPs willing to admit the error and do the necessary.

The problem is that so far there haven’t been any in sight.

135283 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Telpin, 1, #1093 of 1435 🔗

I hope’s right but it’s not looking good.

135107 Sarigan, 3, #1094 of 1435 🔗

12 steps to create your own pandemic

Imagine that you had the resources and influence sufficient to create a global pandemic, what would you need to do? How would you get started? And how best to turn it to your advantage and boost your profits?We have the answers right here. A simple 12 step plan.

135108 RickH, replying to RickH, 2, #1095 of 1435 🔗

Where did I see that vegetable matter tested ‘positive for Covid?’

… and was that vegetable matter Johnson or Whitty?

135114 ▶▶ Julian, replying to RickH, 1, #1096 of 1435 🔗

Wasn’t that a yam or something in Tanzania? I think you’re being insulting to noble vegetables TBH.

135116 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Julian, 7, #1097 of 1435 🔗

A pawpaw, a goat and engine oil all tested positive I think.

135122 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to A. Contrarian, #1098 of 1435 🔗
135167 ▶▶ CGL, replying to RickH, #1099 of 1435 🔗

A papaya in Tanzania

135113 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1100 of 1435 🔗
135216 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to 2 pence, #1102 of 1435 🔗

The Sept Repo was the first sign. Then the New Year one where quietly 700 billion was printed to cover that.

It did Tesla the world of good though as so many big investors piled into it

135295 ▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to Sarigan, #1103 of 1435 🔗

Jim Rickards (among others) has some useful insights on this subject…seen it coming for some time.

135119 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1104 of 1435 🔗

Is Suneptra Gupta on Question Time tonight?

135141 ▶▶ Will, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1105 of 1435 🔗

It looks like it although I won’t believe it until I see it. If she is it will be like supporting my rugby team…. Gwan Sunetra!!!!!

135165 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Will, #1106 of 1435 🔗

Jonathan Ashworth is a chippy little get. Hope he gets skewered.

135120 B Boru, replying to B Boru, 22, #1107 of 1435 🔗

Just a thought……..I’m a biker……To all you kindred spirits and road warriors out there

5000 bikes rolling into Whitehall with engines revving would shake the Earth below them. I have a Fireblade and cannot imagine what 5000 of them would sound and feel like but it would put the shits up me!

Anyhoo, while we were there, we could all stand about, armoured and helmeted – For Covid of course – and maybe I dunno, keep a big heavy 32mm spanner in your hand in case that bolt needed tightened or perhaps the wee army shovel you use for taking care of your business when camping would be strapped to your panniers…just in case you’re caught short!

Some might say that would look like a cavalry….Just sayin! 😉

Cheers
B

135174 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to B Boru, 4, #1108 of 1435 🔗

I don’t bike, but I’d be right beyond you on foot. Had enough now.

135417 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Tee Ell, #1109 of 1435 🔗

More and more will soon 😉

135213 ▶▶ RyanM, replying to B Boru, 2, #1110 of 1435 🔗

Remember all the articles about how Sturgis caused thousands of covid deaths? Something about motorcycles, I guess. I’ve taken to “try rubbing it with a black lives matter t-shirt” as a panacea. But I think it has been scientifically shown (i.e. modeled) that motorcycles spread covid and that righteous protests and looting do not.

135420 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to RyanM, #1111 of 1435 🔗

Nothing a good burn out can’t fix 😉

135410 ▶▶ Andy C, replying to B Boru, 2, #1112 of 1435 🔗

Could I roll in on a pushbike? I would even ring the little bell to add to the cacophony.

135414 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Andy C, 1, #1113 of 1435 🔗

As long as you have a shovel! 😉

135124 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #1114 of 1435 🔗

This doesn’t look good:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8744401/Report-claims-Covid-19-jab-trial-paused-transverse-myelitis-left-woman-struggling-walk.html

It was after the second dose of the vaccine. Looks like AstraZeneca is being a little bit liberal with the truth!

135162 ▶▶ theanalyst, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1115 of 1435 🔗

My otherwise very healthy elder brother had transverse myelitis – it suddenly came from nowhere and within 8 hours he was partially paralyzed on the floor- he still is partially paralyzed 5 years later, though is a hardy soul and walks an hour a day to ensure mobility. It is a very cruel, unusual, rare and sudden illness – doctors said he had an inflammation in the spinal cord…but could never find the exact cause despite all the tests.

135276 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to theanalyst, 2, #1116 of 1435 🔗

I am sorry to hear that, and I wish him well. My husband contracted viral meningitis around 18 years ago. He picked up an infection while in hospital and that led to severe colitis. He has never been the same since, with a crippling auto-immune condition. TM is rare – 300 cases per year in the UK – but triggered by a virus or vaccine from what I have read. I doubt the trial participant, who has been discharged from hospital, apparently, will ever be the same again. Poor lady.

135317 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1117 of 1435 🔗

One hopes that her reaction means that none of her friends and acquaintances will take a rushed vaccine, nor anyone they know either!

135196 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #1118 of 1435 🔗

A link from that Mail article takes you to the trial participant information sheet.

From which (note the use of the plural):-

In the current trial we have undertaken safety reviews when volunteers in the trials of ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 developed unexplained neurological symptoms including changed sensation or limb weakness, and have paused the study while a safety review took place. After independent review, these illnesses were either considered unlikely to be associated with the vaccine or there was insufficient evidence to say for certain that the illnesses were or were not related to the vaccine. In each of these cases, after considering the information,theindependentreviewers recommended that vaccinations should continue.Close monitoring of the affected individuals and other participants will be continued.

135287 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Kevin 2, #1119 of 1435 🔗

The first pause in July was a participant who had ‘undiagnosed MS’, who would therefore have been withdrawn from the trial, but assume must also be monitored. However, the last sentence does not exclude the possibility there has been more than the adverse reaction (Transverse Myelitis) that led to the second pause?

135349 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1120 of 1435 🔗

Possibly the MS case and two others? Personally, I’m not satisfied that ‘undiagnosed MS’ necessarily means that it was unrelated to the vaccine. All adverse conditions that were diagnosed after vaccination were previously undiagnosed. Which to me simply means those conditions may or may not be vaccine-related. The info sheet states that the ‘illnesses’ (plural) were deemed ‘unlikely’ to be vaccine-related or there was insufficient evidence to say yes or no. It does not say that that a case had been ruled out for relatedness.
We are certainly not getting full transparency. And full transparency is essential for public trust.

135378 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Kevin 2, #1121 of 1435 🔗

Agree. I pointed this out in my submission to the consultation. They are not being transparent at all and the government’s proposal is endorsing that.

135125 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 2, #1122 of 1435 🔗

This is what we are up against.

I simply can’t grasp why her and Carl are so opposite. Both educated experienced medically qualified professors.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/17/health-minister-rejects-claims-two-week-national-lockdown

135129 ▶▶ Bella, replying to hotrod, 5, #1123 of 1435 🔗

Because she’s a communist with an agenda that supersedes clinical care. So if the government caves to her I see big trouble…maybe we need that to bring it on

135130 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, -18, #1124 of 1435 🔗

Don’t be stupid.

135136 ▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to John P, 10, #1125 of 1435 🔗

Bit of qualification rather than abuse don’t you think? Though I have noticed you are one of the most abusive people on this site

135137 ▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, -13, #1126 of 1435 🔗

I’m just tired of it.

135139 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to John P, 6, #1127 of 1435 🔗

Many of us are. Doesn’t justify abuse. We should be respecting each other’s pov otherwise it’s divide and rule as per usual

135140 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, -12, #1128 of 1435 🔗

I’m just tired of it. And I am entitled to my opinion.

You are clearly paranoid.

I am not “abusive”.

In what way did I abuse you with this? I think that your theory is stupid.

135144 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to John P, -11, #1129 of 1435 🔗

Your accusation is bullying.

135187 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to John P, 2, #1130 of 1435 🔗

Then that is what you should have said, John. There’s a big difference between calling someone stupid, and calling their theory stupid.

135148 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, -5, #1131 of 1435 🔗

I am tired not only of this virus. I am also tired of paranoid conpiracy theories .

135152 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to John P, 6, #1132 of 1435 🔗

Well, if one removed “communist” from what Bella wrote, and put “person” instead, I think it would still be true to Bella’s intention but be less controversial. People are flawed, and have agendas. Some more than others. Heneghan seems to have more of a passion for the truth, others less so.

135154 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to Julian, 1, #1133 of 1435 🔗

Why is her political position irrelevant?

135183 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Ossettian, 4, #1134 of 1435 🔗

Well, it may or may not be relevant. I suppose it depends what you mean by “communist”. I think people can hold quite different political positions and still have integrity and a respect for truth.

135158 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Julian, -1, #1135 of 1435 🔗

Thank you, Julian, but I just simply think that suggesting that the person “has an agenda” without elaborating properly on this is absurd.

Rather tired, I just said “don’t be stupid”. I am then accused of being an abusive person.

That comment by “bella” I find deeply offensive!

I am shaking now.

I AM ENTITLED TO MY OPINION.

135178 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to John P, 1, #1136 of 1435 🔗

Well, yes, people who are intellectually and morally laughable are entitled to spout nonsense

135156 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to John P, 1, #1137 of 1435 🔗

I’m tired of moronic gimps who support the utterly absurd serial incompetence argument.

135163 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Ossettian, 2, #1138 of 1435 🔗

People like myself and Toby Young. Okay.

Now “moronic gimp” that is personal abuse.

135157 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to John P, 6, #1139 of 1435 🔗

Very emotional but your usual bitter drivel, It’s neither paranoia nor conspiracy. Michie is a communist. (I don;t care either way by the way). The communist agenda is to destroy capitalism (I don’t care much about that either). The point is she wants more lockdowns to destroy the economy. Not paranoid, not conspiracy. But I now have lost patience with rudeness and stupidity, so fuck off

135166 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, #1140 of 1435 🔗

I’m not interested.

135170 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to Bella, 1, #1141 of 1435 🔗

He’s a shill.

135312 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to John P, 1, #1142 of 1435 🔗

John. That is a rude remark.

135153 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Bella, -6, #1143 of 1435 🔗

I cannot edit my original comment, so I will add this. In my opinion this is a ridiculous conspiracy theory.

That is my opinion of your comment regarding Ms Michie and not a personal remark directed against you, whoever you are!

I feel very offended by your “abuse” remark, which I regard as bullying.

135171 ▶▶▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to John P, 2, #1144 of 1435 🔗

There was no theory presented. But as an aside, genuinely sorry to hear you are feeling this way. Appreciate that when you are feeling that way, it’s easy to lash out. Just hope that the people who feel the brunt of it can see that it’s a result of your own personal frustrations, rather than to do with anything they’ve said.

135182 ▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to John P, 3, #1145 of 1435 🔗

“which I regard as bullying.”

FFS

135206 ▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to John P, 8, #1146 of 1435 🔗

well… keeping in mind that really nobody knows who anyone else is … saying “don’t be stupid” and saying “don’t be abusive” should probably be taken in roughly the same vein, don’t you think?

We could very likely generally assume that personal abuse (as with bullying) is largely impossible, as the only thing any of us are doing is responding to comments by faceless (and often nameless) other individuals.

Probably best to take a step back, cool off, and come back less offended.

True, conspiracy theories are tiresome. But then, the past 6 months have shown us that not all conspiracy theories are nutty. Our politicians are behaving in a manner that sure feels to be conspiratorial, even if all it really is is groupthink and fear.

135321 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to John P, 1, #1147 of 1435 🔗

John. If you thought it was ridiculous conspiracy theory then that is what you should have said, rather than what you did say!
What is wrong with conspiracy theory anyway?
Conspiracies exist and hypothesising about them is perfectly rational and acceptable.

135135 ▶▶ John P, replying to hotrod, 3, #1148 of 1435 🔗

Well, I don’t share the view of the conspiracy theorists here. In my view power goes to some people’s heads. Michie has an audience and has influence with the government. She’s enjoying her moments in the limelight.

She clearly doesn’t know what she is talking about. Unfortunately she has the ear of the government and Heneghan does not.

135208 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to John P, 3, #1149 of 1435 🔗

This is likely accurate. I see a lot of governors/mayors/health-authorities behaving like petty tyrants. We are in a collective state of madness that is almost global in scale.

135143 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to hotrod, 9, #1150 of 1435 🔗

Susan Michie is a psychologist, not a medical doctor.

135145 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #1151 of 1435 🔗

A reasonable explanation.

135164 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to hotrod, 5, #1152 of 1435 🔗

One specialises in virology, epidemiology etc. The other specialises in “behavioural change”. I know who I’m listening to.

135240 ▶▶ Leemc23, replying to hotrod, #1153 of 1435 🔗

Communism is not for me. It is for her. She can do one. Suits her politics fo wreck a capitalist society.

135309 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to hotrod, 3, #1154 of 1435 🔗

She is from the Centre for Behavioural Change.
He is from the the Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine.
I rest my case.

135126 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 24, #1155 of 1435 🔗

I was thinking today that it doesn’t matter how legitimate Neil Ferguson’s model may or may not be. It doesn’t matter if he tries to defend it.

The fact of the matter is that he broke lockdown back in April to meet his mistress when the rest of us were locked up and not allowed to be with our loved ones. His own modelling and predictions materially contributed to this lockdown. The government sought advice from him and trusted that the advice was legitimate and could be acted upon. Ferguson is meant to know better than any layman of the public about how dangerous this disease supposedly is and how important the restrictions supposedly are – and he ignored them himself.

Forget how inaccurate his models may be – I think this is reason enough not to trust anything he comes out with now.

135131 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Poppy, 10, #1156 of 1435 🔗

Correct, him blatantly contradicting the (useless) rules for a bunk up should of been the light bulb moment, the deadly killer was not that deadly.

If there was a deadly virus on the loose we wouldn’t need 24 hour brainwashing it would be every man and woman battening down the hatches.

135147 ▶▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to stefarm, 2, #1157 of 1435 🔗

One has to question how old rodent face managed to snag a rather attractive lover.

135151 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Laura Suckling, 2, #1158 of 1435 🔗

You need to look at the later photos!

135221 ▶▶▶ Shep, replying to stefarm, 2, #1159 of 1435 🔗

wake up moment for me was ‘The Diamond Princess’ 🚩 😍

135146 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Poppy, 6, #1160 of 1435 🔗

The rich and powerful often have trouble following the rules they make up for the rest of us

135150 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Poppy, 4, #1161 of 1435 🔗

Quite right, and this also applied to Dominic Cummings. The excuses made, particularly by Cummings, were incredulous and designed to insult the public, in my view. The support for both men from Boris and the Cabinet has had the effect of dragging this out.

135458 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1162 of 1435 🔗

Calderwood seemed to have been deliberate to wriggle out of the insanity. Or she had incredible levels of public facing naivety.

135159 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Poppy, 3, #1163 of 1435 🔗

You could say he fucked the Staats.

135168 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Poppy, 6, #1164 of 1435 🔗

We needn’t go over the top. It’s simple : he obviously simply didn’t believe that the virus was particularly virulent or that the lockdown nonsense was credible.

‘Nuff said. The actions belie the rhetoric. The man has 0 credibility. Ignore him.

135199 ▶▶▶ Poppy, replying to RickH, 3, #1165 of 1435 🔗

Exactly – and yet it’s all been swept under the carpet. This should have been the moment where lockdown lost all credibility for those who still believed it was beneficial.

135353 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Poppy, 2, #1166 of 1435 🔗

When you are older you will realise that many capable and useful people are immoral and duplicitous in their private lives. One has to take what is socially useful from them and not allow their other faults to cloud your judgment. That’s chucking the baby out with the bathwater. Anyway, fascinating to note that all assume he visited her; what’s to say she didn’t force herself on him?

135160 Ewan Duffy, replying to Ewan Duffy, 1, #1167 of 1435 🔗

https://www.rte.ie/news/uk/2020/0917/1165881-uk-covid-testing/

NHS asks Ireland to help carry out testing of samples 🙁

135169 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Ewan Duffy, #1168 of 1435 🔗

Harding said this afternoon that the UK was using some labs abroad to help with testing demands. Didn’t specify where though.

135231 ▶▶ annie, replying to Ewan Duffy, 1, #1170 of 1435 🔗

Send them Guiness.

135172 Tenchy, 3, #1171 of 1435 🔗
135173 Lisa from Toronto, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 5, #1172 of 1435 🔗

Just announced today, rule of 10…our version of your rule of 6. I’m spending most of my time outside of Toronto now, and I don’t think I know 9 other sceptics to socialize with anyway!

“Ontario is lowering the number of people permitted at social gatherings in three regions that have recently seen a spike in COVID-19 cases. The change will only affect Toronto, Peel Region, and Ottawa, and will not apply to businesses like restaurants, movie theatres, or banquet halls. Premier Doug Ford says starting Friday only 10 people will be allowed to gather indoors, down from the current limit of 25, while the number for outdoor gatherings will drop from the 100 to 25.”

135180 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 4, #1173 of 1435 🔗

They’ve maybe seen how the UK population have reacted to the limit of 6, so decided to go for a slightly higher limit? I somehow doubt any ‘science’ was involved!

135195 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Carrie, 2, #1174 of 1435 🔗

Just wait…school only just started back in Toronto the other day. Every sniffle will require a Covid test so “cases” will rise and 10 could very well be lockdown 2.0. Stupid Yahoo poll shows 60% are in favour of another lockdown. Give me strength…

135261 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 3, #1175 of 1435 🔗

My heartfelt apologies that we led the way on this. The contagion of bad policy decisions is the real pandemic. With a few notable exceptions, whoever comes up with the worst solution, everybody else follows. A much more decentralised approach to deciding the specifics is evolving in many countries. Local authorities now have free reign to do whatever they want, and there are plenty of busybodies at local government level champing at the bit to exercise their new powers. It will be interesting to observe how much divergence there is as things evolve.

What we in the West (Anglosphere) are finding out for the first time is that once the initial takeover has been accomplished, the power and will to sustain a totalitarian system actually comes from the ground up, not the top down.

135176 John P, replying to John P, 3, #1176 of 1435 🔗

Okay, enough of this. I am being bullied on here now, so I will leave. Probably permanently. Those of you who have taken a dislike to me can all celebrate.

I did say earlier this week that I suffered from depression. Generally I cope, but I have my moments. I was also bullied at school, which makes socialisation for me difficult. I’ve never been a gregarious person.

I have a good deal of self respect these days, though I still live alone.

I extend thanks to those who were kind enough to offer support to me earlier this week. I’ll be fine, don’t worry.

But I want no more of this.

135179 ▶▶ Julian, replying to John P, 5, #1177 of 1435 🔗

Please don’t leave. Ignore those posts that bother you.

135193 ▶▶ Ossettian, replying to John P, 3, #1178 of 1435 🔗

You’ll never make it to Lance Corporal with this level of commitment.

You know, if you dish it out you really need to be able to take it.

135204 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to John P, 8, #1179 of 1435 🔗

Sorry I don’t buy it. You’re rude to people and then claim bullying when called out on it. Now your trying the sympathy card for attention. If you genuinely can’t handle the comments on this site then God knows how you handle the rest of social media.

135219 ▶▶ Mark, replying to John P, 14, #1180 of 1435 🔗

I once described you (a couple of months back) as “an argumentative bugger”, which I regard as a reasonable description and which I clarified by pointing out that the same description applies to me.

But you really must develop the thick skin that is necessary to accompany that characteristic. If you dish it out you absolutely must train yourself to take it, in turn. Nothing anybody says on an anonymous internet platform should bother you personally. It’s fine to point out personal abuse in order to highlight it and discredit the person engaging in it, but it absolutely should not upset you personally.

This is imo a matter of personal training and it’s my belief that it is possible for anyone to train himself to dismiss such comments. If you can’t or won’t (and I accept that personal history might well make lot more difficult for some), then you need to accept that you can’t cope with such personal hostility and make a change in your own behaviour so that you – as far as possible – don’t provoke it.

135228 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Mark, 3, #1181 of 1435 🔗

Wise words Mark.

135222 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to John P, 5, #1182 of 1435 🔗

All of us are completely exhausted by this, so bitter exchanges are inevitable from time to time. Frankly I’m astonished at how rare this has been on here to date.

I have no objections to being asked to justify or provide evidence for any alternative interpretation I might advance, regardless of how it is expressed. Free speech is exactly that.

135260 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, 9, #1183 of 1435 🔗

Was just saying the same thing to my husband — it’s remarkable how civilized this forum is, particularly given the stress everyone is under. We’ve gotta keep our eyes on the prize, which is getting our humanity and way of life back.

135234 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to John P, 5, #1184 of 1435 🔗

John, I have offered support in the past. I think Mark offers some very wise words. Please take that on board, and come back tomorrow having thought about it overnight. Pretty much everyone on here has problems in their life to a greater or lesser degree, but we are a platform for the exchange of thoughts and ideas. We are united in our opposition to policy measures that are destroying our country and many of our fellow citizens. We need all hands on deck!

135237 ▶▶ wat tyler, replying to John P, 5, #1185 of 1435 🔗

stay on .Just ignore people if you don’t get on with them .Every single person on this site needs to put all political views and personal dislikes of people to one side and just get on with fighting to end the lockdown and all the stupid rules that go with it . The only way to do this is to see it like a war effort and throw all are resources at obtaining final victory .Only by unity do people overcome their objectives and pull through .

135290 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to John P, 4, #1186 of 1435 🔗

John. If you don’t mind me suggesting; take a break for a day or two. I think we all need to do that from time to time to maintain personal equilibrium. Then come back on. If you feel that you receive a bullying response, then simply post that that is how you are receiving it. And I’m sure that 9 times out of 10, you will receive an apology. I think this Board is refreshingly respectful 99% of the time, but sometimes in the heat of discussion, ardour may come across in an unintentional way.

135296 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to John P, 2, #1187 of 1435 🔗

I’m no fan of the conspiracy theorists either. Internal logic but no strategic thinking behind them. I hope you reconsider.

135181 JohnMac, 33, #1188 of 1435 🔗

Ken Marsh, chair of the Metropolitan Police Federation, representing rank and file officers: “Say you get called by a householder to say there are 12 people in her neighbour’s garden. What is our power of entry? There isn’t one.”

Good.

135184 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 8, #1189 of 1435 🔗

Just returned home from work and many thanks again for an excellent update.

Some quick observations:

  1. Reading about the horror story that is Trinity College, Cambridge; I’m so glad I’m no longer at uni having to put up with this Nightmare on Elm Street scenario. If students do decide that enough is enough and fight back they will have my support. They’re not at uni having the time of their lives, this is pretty much tantamount to being in a Soviet prison camp.
  2. Hats off to Tanzania for their level headed approach to this madness. The fact that a papaya and a goat tested positive should have sent off alarm bells ringing instead here we are still with this idiotic government pushing for tests that have shown to be dodgy.
  3. I’m sorry but the Pitt-Rivers museum statement is simply full of nonsense and gobledygook. I think that even turning my laptop upside down, banging my head against the wall and smoking cannabis would still make that statement unreadable and still full of bollocks.
135207 ▶▶ Eddie, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #1190 of 1435 🔗

Haha well in on #3

135189 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1191 of 1435 🔗

You Are One Million Times More Likely to Catch Coronavirus Than Winning Lottery
There is more chance of winning the lottery than escaping a coronavirus infection, a World Health Organization (WHO) expert said on Wednesday.
Dr. Mike Ryan, executive director of the WHO’s Health Emergencies Program, made the comments during an online Q&A with the public on Wednesday.

He said: “If we don’t find a vaccine and we don’t continue suppressing this virus, and we assume this virus spreads to 60 or 70 percent of the population in the world, that is effectively one in 200 [who have caught the coronavirus] on this planet.

“From that perspective, think of your chances of winning the lottery. When you look at your chances of being involved in an accident, if you look at many of the life risks we face, this is a significant issue.”

As a point of comparison, the odds of winning the U.S. Mega Millions jackpot are 1 in 302 million, and 1 in 292 million for the Powerball.
Give me strength!!!!

135202 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to Sarigan, 10, #1192 of 1435 🔗

?? And what are the chances of not catching a cold? Nil.

135227 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1193 of 1435 🔗

This raises a question that i have been checking out, is this virus losing it’s virulence? As best I can see the answer is; maybe but nothing definite yet. This virus relies on a very specific mutation to obtain its virulence and it is not uncommon for such viruses to mutate again and then fade away. Has anyone picked up anything to indicate this virus might be changing?

135280 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #1194 of 1435 🔗

I don’t believe it relies on a specific mutation.
Rather a genomic deletion can reduce virulence.
I believe this is what has possibly happened.

135293 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #1195 of 1435 🔗

Maybe we’ll have to wait until spring before we find out. Looking to the southern hemisphere, where they do not seem to be suffering the same levels of deaths we did in spring, I’m hoping that the virus has indeed lost its virulence, or else we’ve developed stronger resistance to it.

135330 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #1196 of 1435 🔗

There was a single study I saw weeks ago (Malaysia? Philippines?) which, on the basis of a single case, floated the idea that that person might have been infected with a mutation making that strain more infectious but less deadly. If what you’re wondering is whether the decline in hospitalisations and deaths in Europe results from a less virulent strain, I doubt it at present, but would defer to the medics on this site.

135492 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Bruno, #1197 of 1435 🔗

The reationship between pathogenic transmissibility and pathogenic virulence has been studied quite a bit in prior respiratory viruses, but without conclusive findings. Though it does seem like a trade-off process often comes in to play. If the virus wishes to self-propagate beyond the original host, it doesn’t pay to kill that host. It’s almost as if a transaction or an accommodation occurs over generational cycles between the host immune system and the virus, which is promotive of a genetic deletion or mutation in the virus, that is selective for an attenuated or less virulent form, at the same time that transmissibility is maintained or even enhanced.
Something like that is happening here.
Though I also defer to virologists or molecular biologists!
(Unless they’re wrong, of course.)

135300 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Sarigan, #1198 of 1435 🔗

I’ve seen people bring up a comparison with winning the lottery before. The clear difference is that there are few winners in a lottery whereas with this virus the vast majority of people are “winners”.

His comparison is actually the number of people taking part in a lottery = getting infected and a winner is somebody who gets seriously ill or dies.

135198 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #1199 of 1435 🔗

‘Author and investigative journalist’ Brian Deer, just been on TalkRADIO to push his new book about Andrew Wakefield, and at the same time knocking anti-vaxers.

When asked a the end of the interview, which was sadly very one sided, if he had proof that vaccines are safe he gave a long answer which basically said he could not say if vaccines are safe or not.

Bit disappointed as TalkRADIO is my new radio listen of choice.

I am not anti vaccine, but I am concerned with the speed of development of this vaccine.

135244 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #1200 of 1435 🔗

Agree, it was very one-sided; no real acknowledgement that vaccine damage exists or that there is likely to be a problem with rushed vaccines that have not been trialled for sufficiently long time..

135270 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #1201 of 1435 🔗

I am very pro-vaccine, but I am not going to take any Covid vaccine for at least a year, just to see how the beta test in public works out.

135311 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Recusant, 1, #1202 of 1435 🔗

I’m going to try and hold out for more than a year! Don’t know if Sweden plans to make it mandatory yet…

135200 smileymiley, replying to smileymiley, 4, #1203 of 1435 🔗

What have I missed? Moved home Monday & only got interweb connected today. Been told by a friend in Amble, Northumberland that they’re in lockdown again. This is madness.
A good piece about our missing PM in The Spectator.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-missing-leader-boris-johnson-needs-to-find-his-purpose-again

135291 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to smileymiley, #1204 of 1435 🔗

Trust the new house is all you hoped for? OK, a bit early to tell yet…

135211 Mark, replying to Mark, 14, #1205 of 1435 🔗

Nice to see some appropriately hostile comments being highlighted here.

Birmingham police boast of patrolling streets in ‘Covid car’ to snare social-distance flouters… only to find ZERO and get told to catch REAL crooks in city ‘plagued with drug and gun crime’

Police bragged about cruising through Birmingham in a ‘Covid car’ today
Gleefully shared photos of their anti-Covid crusade while enforcing new rules
Tweets show police marching through town unable to find any rule-breakers
Angry social media users told West Midlands Police to catch real criminals

135248 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Mark, 3, #1206 of 1435 🔗

Despair, the easy target again.

135218 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 1, #1207 of 1435 🔗

Anyone with latest France and Spain figures.

Carl suggested today that they had levelled off but MSM scare stories continue.

135223 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to hotrod, #1208 of 1435 🔗

From France 24

135224 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, #1209 of 1435 🔗

After Véran’s announcements on Thursday, France reported a record 10,593 cases over the previous 24 hours, up from 9,784 on Wednesday. The figure represents the highest daily confirmed coronavirus case figure recorded in France since the epidemic began. The country also reported 50 new Covid-19 deaths on Thursday, bringing the national toll to 31,095.

135239 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #1210 of 1435 🔗

New deaths as a result of having locked down earlier in the year, and thereby artificially suppressing/lowering the peak?

We are due for release of latest hospital stats tomorrow morning here in Sweden – will be interesting to see..

135246 ▶▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Carrie, #1211 of 1435 🔗

Seems likely to be a factor, doesn’t it?

135277 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ theanalyst, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1212 of 1435 🔗

Yes. Not only that – they detect traces of residual RNA several months later and call it a ‘positive case’ in very fragile elderly people who heroically recovered from the disease but subsequently passed away naturally from another cause a few months later. That is part of the business model. Their death is counted as Covid19 in the ’28 days after a positive case’ death stats. It will never hit zero.

135307 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to theanalyst, #1213 of 1435 🔗

In Sweden you have to die within 28 days of a positive Covid test in order for it to count as a Covid death..

135245 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to hotrod, 1, #1214 of 1435 🔗

https://twitter.com/AlistairHaimes/status/1306512440461582336/photo/2

This is from ECDC hospitalisations France Spain increasing from a low level but not much compred with April.The grey in Spain’s chart will be updated

135253 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to hotrod, 6, #1215 of 1435 🔗

The DM is now carrying an article about what Carl said today to the Science and technology committee: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8744063/Septembers-normal-increase-coughs-colds-causing-utter-chaos-post-lockdown-Britain.html

135271 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Carrie, 2, #1216 of 1435 🔗

Who would have thought it?!

The Daily Mail is now the beacon of MSM sanity.

Long may it continue.

135305 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Kevin 2, #1217 of 1435 🔗

Julia H-B has tweeted a link to it too 🙂

Maybe someone could send her Ivor’s de-bunking video as well?

135357 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tenchy, #1219 of 1435 🔗

Yep. Point taken.
But they have had several pieces now that wouldn’t have seen the light of day elsewhere.

135408 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Kevin 2, 1, #1220 of 1435 🔗

Don’t tell Rick, or he’ll be having conniptions.

135220 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1221 of 1435 🔗

Have anyone received the text from the GP Practice inviting them to sign up for cv19 studies. Mrs Doubting and myself each received the text yesterday evening.

Speaking to a work colleague today, he is from anther county, he received it yesterday evening.

Must be desperate to stick the hypodermic in a few folks.

135269 ▶▶ The Spingler, replying to Dave #KBF, #1222 of 1435 🔗

I’m not currently registered with a GP – really glad about that now 🙂

135238 Achilles, 18, #1223 of 1435 🔗

What do George Best and Neil Ferguson have in common? They both love f***ing models!

135241 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 4, #1224 of 1435 🔗

Trinity College students, is there any feed back on their thoughts of student life under the marxists?

135303 ▶▶ annie, replying to Dan Clarke, 2, #1225 of 1435 🔗

Won’t go up – sorry, go to prison – until the beginning of October.
What feelings of pleasant anticipation they must have right now.

135250 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #1226 of 1435 🔗

The Ivor Cummins video published on 8th September has come under scrutiny from a doctor. Ivor defends his work..

Make you own minds up

Original video

Debunking the Detractors

135255 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1227 of 1435 🔗

I watched that the other day and thought Cummins made a decent fist of trashing the wannabe debunker.

One think I did take note of for future reference is that the latter part of his video, dealing with the comical recent attempts to claim Sweden “effectively locked down”, is excellent material for resolving discussions on that point. which are quite common atm.

135278 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1228 of 1435 🔗

Original video is at nearly 1 million views. Fantastic.

135362 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to nocheesegromit, 1, #1229 of 1435 🔗

I’m afraid I have lost any hope that there is a turning tide or anything like it.

Ivor Cummins’ might get a million views every week or two. The BBC, ITV get millions of views every single day, spewing corona terror into every home.

135403 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stewart, #1230 of 1435 🔗

Well, I wish you a very pleasant surprise then :o))

135447 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to stewart, #1231 of 1435 🔗

Yes. But what do people remember? That guy on the internet with those graphs, he just explained it so well. This tv news is snippety and hard to follow.

Quailty over quantity.

Its a good fight. We will win.

135257 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 30, #1232 of 1435 🔗

Welcome to the surreal UK of 2020
Letter to FT
 Britain’s rule of six doesn’t add up If I understand the UK gov. rule of six correct, it is illegal for seven children to feed ducks, but legal for 30 men to shoot ducks.

135267 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to swedenborg, 16, #1233 of 1435 🔗

It’s funny, I appreciate this line of reasoning is quite effective, and whenever I discuss it with other people, this is the sort of thing I have most success with.

However for me personally, I stay I away from this line of reasoning completely. To enter into this debate, there must be a starting assumption that “provided we identify the correct measures and implement them fairly, they are justified”.

For me though this is flawed – there should be no measures, and there is no justification.

It is not simply an implementation detail that is wrong, but the whole concept itself.

135289 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tee Ell, 5, #1234 of 1435 🔗

Oh there should be measures all right, mostly to do with personal hygiene – hand washing and care when sneezing or coughing, for example. So locking up public toilets and keeping them locked even after people could spend the day outside exercising, made perfect sense… not.

135294 ▶▶▶ swedenborg, replying to Tee Ell, 2, #1235 of 1435 🔗

Agree.SD is not a medicine you can force feed the population. The whole concept that you can stop the virus by Law is absurd. If you think some form of a SD is needed(and that is debatable more by each day) you need a voluntary co-operation for a long, long time period.

135354 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Tee Ell, #1236 of 1435 🔗

YES!

135262 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 3, #1237 of 1435 🔗

Leeds/West Yorks next then.

What I can’t grasp is how they relate this to what Carl is saying.

The more regions that get locked down the more the push back.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/17/leeds-poised-join-list-areas-under-local-coronavirus-lockdowns

135265 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to hotrod, 6, #1238 of 1435 🔗
135284 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to hotrod, 7, #1239 of 1435 🔗

I won’t be going back into lockdown.

135266 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to hotrod, 4, #1240 of 1435 🔗

Somehow the politicians have got the idea that people feel safer thinking that the government is keeping on top of everything and helping them, the gist of an email from my MP, they live in another land far away.

135285 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Dan Clarke, 5, #1241 of 1435 🔗

Totally cut off. Remember the expression on the Ceaucescus’ faces immediately before they were shot? Our lot will look like that too.

135298 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1242 of 1435 🔗

Good.

135365 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #1243 of 1435 🔗

Will they ever have an equivalent moment though?

135394 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to DRW, #1244 of 1435 🔗

One can but dream. But remember, I’ve got first go of the AK-47.

135268 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to hotrod, 4, #1245 of 1435 🔗

They don’t relate it, hotrod. Prof H is the lynchpin of sanity for many of us, but he is still on the fringes and dismissed as dangerous and plain wrong by those invested in the narrative that has become pure faith since March.

135367 ▶▶ DRW, replying to hotrod, 2, #1246 of 1435 🔗

It’s the second national, being gradually rolled out.

135373 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to DRW, 2, #1247 of 1435 🔗

Yes Boris thinks if they do it one region at a time we won’t notice he’s gone for the nuclear option after all.

135386 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1248 of 1435 🔗

Thinks we (or at least the majority) are stupid!

135264 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, #1249 of 1435 🔗

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-admission-and-care-of-people-in-care-homes/coronavirus-covid-19-admission-and-care-of-people-in-care-homes

 In Ch4 the discussion about care homes to accept C-19 patients.These are the guidelines published 2 nd Sept. Don’t think Local Authorities will like this

A small number of people may be discharged from hospital within the 14-day period from the onset of COVID-19 symptoms needing ongoing social care, but no longer needing in-patient care. They will have been COVID-19 tested and have confirmed COVID-positive status. Test results should be included in discharge documentation. They will also need to be isolated until they complete their 14-day recommended isolation period.
No care home will be forced to admit an existing or new resident to the care home if they are unable to cope with the impact of the person’s COVID-19 illness for the duration of the isolation period.
Some care providers will be able to accommodate these individuals through effective isolation strategies or cohorting policies. If appropriate isolation/cohorted care is not available with a local care provider, the individual’s local authority will be asked to secure alternative appropriate accommodation and care for the remainder of the required isolation period.

135382 ▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to swedenborg, #1250 of 1435 🔗

Got to get the death rate up somehow and deliberately infecting the most vulnerable worked last time

135272 Jo, replying to Jo, 14, #1251 of 1435 🔗

Deep Breath. I am going to get shouted at. I think there is going to be a second wave, albeit probably a wavette. Hospital cases and ventilator rates are rising, albeit slowly. But it goes against the curve cited in the article by the wise three a short while ago. This is going to make things difficult and no doubt a second lockdown will occur – even if they don’t stop people going to work, the social aspect and closing of hospitality sector (which is, after all, a significant part of our economic life blood) will stop a lot of people going to work. How many people will end up on Universal Credit? I have heard of several young graduates who have no work and have chosen to do a Masters or teaching degree because they don’t want to do nothing. My neighbours’ son, with a degree from Oxford, has had to return home because he has no work and now has chosen to study for a Masters.
My view remains that we should not close down to save a minority of people, when so many will suffer for years/decades to come. We now know a lot about collateral damage – people who will die through lack of NHS care from conditions other than Covid; mental illness and of course the economic catastrophe which will affect everyone, but especially the young who have so much of their lives to lead. We know now, or at least know some of it – and we should not proceed. Sweden got it right. We locked down and we are now paying the price – just shunt it down the line. As if we could ever “control the virus”. For god’s sake. In other EU countries they are seeing the same thing. Enable people who are vulnerable to protect themselves – I signed up to help with this 6 months ago – please, let those of us who don’t feel at threat from the virus to carry on. I’m 59 – and if I get it – and I might – and get ill and die – well, I’m 50% likely to get cancer, if I look at family history – ditto heart attack (this risk is rising fast!) then so be it. Rant over.

135302 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Jo, 8, #1252 of 1435 🔗

Deep Breath. I am going to get shouted at. I think there is going to be a second wave, albeit probably a wavette. Hospital cases and ventilator rates are rising, albeit slowly. But it goes against the curve cited in the article by the wise three a short while ago .”

No reason for anyone to shout at you – nobody knows for certain what the future course of this disease will be. The most we can say is that the evidence seems to support the theories that tend to go against a “second wave”, in the sense of a repeated significant epidemic.

I’m still hopeful that what we will see is a shallow hump over the winter season.

135304 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Mark, 1, #1253 of 1435 🔗

… and don’t mention the camels!

135316 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Jo, #1254 of 1435 🔗

Dromedaries…

135323 ▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Nick Rose, #1255 of 1435 🔗

A dromedary is a kind of camel.

135383 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to matt, #1256 of 1435 🔗

A single hump camel, the thoroughbred. Ordinary camels have two humps. We don’t one of those…

135332 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Mark, 6, #1257 of 1435 🔗

It was always inevitable that a now-endemic respiratory disease would return in the autumn and there will always be a fresh crop of the vulnerable to be harvested by it and by the other respiratory diseases that are also endemic. Those that are saying “see? second wave!” are ignoring the relative irrelevance of the ‘first wave’ and the likely complete irrelevance of the second.

135352 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to matt, 2, #1258 of 1435 🔗

The ‘vulnerable’ are usually the elderly. However due to all the people whose other conditions have not been diagnosed or treated for the last 6 months, there is likely to be a different (and possibly younger) group of ‘vulnerables’ this winter, susceptible to the virus (and who would not otherwise have been so)..

135366 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to matt, #1259 of 1435 🔗

Absolutely. The issue is not whether we see a rise, but whether we see it at epidemic levels and whether we see signs of very rapid spread.

135524 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nsklent, replying to Mark, 1, #1260 of 1435 🔗

The fact is, is what the supposed cv19 is or will do this winter is exactly what flu has done every year, and no-one battered an eye lid. What were the numbers in 2017/18, 50,000, all age groups, and not a whisper in the press. Cold winters thousands of elderly die of fuel poverty, not a whisper by politicians. Now, every death related to this virus will be documented, while every other death will be a ‘so what’. Already the past few weeks, the media and politicians have ignored there have been more deaths from flu, as that might put some perspective on the matter and challenge their idiot restrictions.

135385 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to matt, #1261 of 1435 🔗

Ah yes, but the second wave “they” want must be bigger and scarier than the first!

135306 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Jo, 6, #1262 of 1435 🔗

Depends what you mean by “wave”. Is the increase in flu cases during winter each year a “wave”?

135313 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Tee Ell, 10, #1263 of 1435 🔗

Good point. And by flattening the bloody sombrero for far too long into the summer we have not actually got through the first wave. Unlike Sweden. When your first wave is done, there is no second wave.

135315 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Tee Ell, 1, #1264 of 1435 🔗

Yes, it probably is, sometimes more like a tsunami (eg 2014-15) but we used to be more tolerant of waves. We certainly aren’t now

135339 ▶▶▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Jo, #1265 of 1435 🔗

So maybe the tide is a better analogy than a wave?

135364 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Tee Ell, #1266 of 1435 🔗

Quite possibly

135310 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Jo, 12, #1267 of 1435 🔗

We must all be good little worker bees and keep going to work. On no account must we have a family, social or cultural life however. I feel like I have woken up in a mild and wetter version of a soviet labour camp.

135314 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 4, #1268 of 1435 🔗

They did say winter was coming, perhaps this is the new way to pronounce “Siberia”.

135322 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jo, 6, #1269 of 1435 🔗

The virus will do what it does, regardless of us. None of the measures have made or will make any difference to this.

The sunk cost fallacy is a major player here in the repetition of the lockdown approach, most significantly in the minds of all those who supported the measures.

135273 Will, 3, #1270 of 1435 🔗

Good luck Sunetra. I suspect you will need it as you will be treated like a nazi.

135274 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 2, #1271 of 1435 🔗

https://twitter.com/SpectatorEvents/status/1306628383464448000

Spectator TV Anderew Neil interviewing Tegnell and more with Fraser Nelson and others

135282 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to swedenborg, #1272 of 1435 🔗

Drip drip

135342 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to swedenborg, #1273 of 1435 🔗

Unfortunately labelled a private video so not available for everyone to watch..

135424 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Carrie, #1274 of 1435 🔗

You can watch it here Carrie:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NynUwxOct_8

135275 Nick Rose, replying to Nick Rose, 17, #1275 of 1435 🔗

Carl Heneghan mentioned the unnecessary panic surrounding the coronavirus to the committee today. Given most of that panic was helped along thanks to our press stirring the pot, helped along by the government’s various nudge groups.

Well news editors across the media, well government ministers and prime minister, well SPI-B or whoever you are, you broke it, you own it. Start putting it right. The evidence is all there about how the nasty bug isn’t as dangerous as first feared, use it.

Ball is in your court.

135281 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1276 of 1435 🔗

Spot on.

Enough is enough now.

135288 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1277 of 1435 🔗

Agree. But I’m not sure I can imagine what would motivate them to put it right at this point. ‘they’ and we have a completely different understanding of what the problem is.

135297 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #1278 of 1435 🔗
135301 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #1279 of 1435 🔗

Here we go again. Nobody – no matter how old or sick – must die of covid but cancer, stroke, coronary and a myriad of other patients are casually thrown under the bus.

135308 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #1280 of 1435 🔗

That magic “two weeks” again. When it doesn’t happen… Fingers crossed.

135326 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #1281 of 1435 🔗

Timed to perfection for the 30 September renewal of the legislation!

135337 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1282 of 1435 🔗

Exactly – that is actually the *only* reason…

135347 ▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1283 of 1435 🔗

If it doesn’t happen they will claim the measures work.
If it does happen they will claim the measures weren’t enough and put more measures.
There is no escape.

135379 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stewart, #1284 of 1435 🔗

Oh there is :o))

135472 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #1285 of 1435 🔗

Goodness, I come to these pages after 11pm and all I read is negativity and fear. Maybe the alcohol has communally kicked in, I don’t know. We can fight back. If you’re going to lose your liberty anyway then fight back before you lose it, don’t just give in. History is littered with rebellion and though many failed many also won. Glorious Revolution Mk II anyone? Fucking fight.

135286 swedenborg, 3, #1286 of 1435 🔗

https://twitter.com/AlistairHaimes/status/1306613124112449536/photo/1

 Cases in England by specimen date. Higher than earlier but not exponential increase

135292 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 18, #1287 of 1435 🔗

This was on the news update I get from the Spectator and it makes me hopping mad:

Thousands of stroke patients have suffered avoidable disability because of disruptions to services caused by the pandemic, according to the Stroke Association. Some 29% of those who suffered a stroke did not seek emergency help, while half of survivors had therapy sessions cancelled and 56% did not feel safe to attend an appointment. Strokes affect 100,000 people a year in the UK.

Yet again the No Health Service strikes again. And we’re supposed to call them heroes?

Enough already!!!

135371 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #1288 of 1435 🔗

It always was a health rationing service, it’s single biggest failing. Now everybody can see exactly what it is.

135299 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 28, #1289 of 1435 🔗

When the government is telling us to stop confusing covid with the common cold you would think people would start to realise that we are not dealing with Ebola or the Black Death here. I despair at the total inability of most people to think critically.

135336 ▶▶ Jo, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #1290 of 1435 🔗

This is probably one of the most important points made! If only people could think.

135341 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #1291 of 1435 🔗

That is an excellent point. I might borrow that, if that’s ok?

135360 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1292 of 1435 🔗

Be my guest!

135318 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 2, #1293 of 1435 🔗

Two weeks then….and if it doesn’t spike….then what?

Spike over and we move on?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/09/17/exclusive-hospitals-told-clear-beds-coronavirus-spike-two-weeks/

135319 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to hotrod, 1, #1294 of 1435 🔗

They’re fast running out of places to hide!

135325 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to hotrod, 7, #1295 of 1435 🔗

“A template for the so-called “escalation framework”, seen by The Telegraph, includes provision for “mandatory masks” at the amber level, suggesting face coverings will be legally required in even more settings than they are now.”

There is no end to the insanity.

135331 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Tenchy, 4, #1296 of 1435 🔗

Oh fuck no!

135334 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tenchy, #1297 of 1435 🔗

This is so that when they eventually ‘allow’ Simon Dolan’s case, they can say their actions have been proportionate to the ‘threat’..

135335 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tenchy, #1298 of 1435 🔗

Who is leaking to the press and doing the government’s ‘advance warning’ signalling for them?

135346 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1299 of 1435 🔗

Once masks have been made mandatory everywhere at all times, this policy approach to maintaining fear levels can no longer be exploited. I suspect there will therefore be at least another 3-4 stages of incremental expansion of the mandate before we reach the inevitable end point.

135368 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, 1, #1300 of 1435 🔗

Was kind of hoping for 3-4 stages prior to where we’re at now if I’m honest…

135327 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to hotrod, 5, #1301 of 1435 🔗

If there is no spike they will simply say the measures taken worked but the virus is still out there. There is no definable end to this.

135370 ▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to Nobody2020, #1302 of 1435 🔗

True

135343 ▶▶ Biggles, replying to hotrod, #1303 of 1435 🔗

Been told that Army medics are arriving in number at Catterick Garrison due to a ‘surge’ in coronavirus cases in North Yorkshire. Apparently this also happened in March.

135380 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to hotrod, 5, #1304 of 1435 🔗

I am relived to know that these measures are being put in place to protect me if I get a runny noze, whilst my wife dies of cancer.

135340 Basics, replying to Basics, 2, #1305 of 1435 🔗

The hypnotic threes propaganda continues into the ‘recovery’ – code name for reset. We are all going to be soon sick of – Build Back Better – code name for go eco or go bust. As an example BBC R4 wanted to give meaning to the BBB tag. So bicycles, electric ones and scooters.

I don’t think its patronising to suggest if you are over, say 70, and have say a health condition then a scooter on an icy pavement in a gale isn’t really going to be ideal. Ditto if you a parent of say 2.4 children. Ditto if … you get the idea. Yes there are many over 70 fit as a fiddle fleas zipping about. But as a measure for infrastucture, really? We won’t be traveling.

Transport is only one area though, Build Back Better is coming to every nook of our lives.

135355 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Basics, 6, #1306 of 1435 🔗

Same here in Canada. We’ve already been told that any recovery has to be a “green” recovery. Interestingly, there was a piece in Spiked yesterday about the green energy debacle in my province of Ontario and it was a cautionary tale for the rest of the world. Our energy prices are the highest in North America, which I can vouch for personally. Be afraid, be very afraid.

135407 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lisa from Toronto, #1307 of 1435 🔗

In europe somewhere, I forget where, charging a car with ekectric was pence but that has changed to be comparable to the pounds paid for petrol. Just an arbtrary rise. Maybe somewhere in the low countries.

Clearly there’s a issue with zero tax vehicals and road repair. When the current co2 stream ends how do you repair roads? Tax zero catbon? Well optical fibres are being installed in uk motorways ready for pay per mile. To do with Smart motorways. Smart.

Feel like I’m off topic. But this is all part of tge prescribed recovery from the lockdown. I’ll focus more, I respect the focus everyone else has.

135461 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Lisa from Toronto, 1, #1308 of 1435 🔗

I’m not going to be bloody afraid. That is what they want and I will not live my life in fear. Lisa, please don’t peddle this bollocks. Give us freedom or give us death. Fuck ’em

135478 ▶▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Bella, 4, #1309 of 1435 🔗

I don’t know what bollocks you think I’m peddling. Our “green” energy policy in Ontario resulted in a bill for $5,000 to heat our country place for 3 months the first winter we owned it. My point is that these policies designed to provide cheaper energy did the exact opposite, and yet my federal government has flat out stated that any recovery must be a green recovery. So, given my personal experience with what green policy looks like, it will be more expensive and less efficient and that inspires fear. Maybe your government will do it better, but based on recent events I highly doubt it.

135359 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 7, #1310 of 1435 🔗

Another tripartite incantation. Remember Jimmy Savile: “Now then now then now then”.

All three words in the spell are false:

Build = accelerating destruction
Back = we are never recovering
Better = worse for the people

“Destroy Forever Worse” doesn’t quite have the same ring to it though.

135363 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, 1, #1311 of 1435 🔗

As i say, people won’t buy it. And it fails on another level too. It’s not governments who control recoveries, it’s the industrialists and entrepreneurs. And if there’s no market for it, there’s no market for it.

135372 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1312 of 1435 🔗

Hence the spell aspect, it’s very clever psychological conditioning. Repeat that enough times and it will gradually seep into the minds of people so they will genuinely believe that what is being proposed is in fact better.

135388 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, 2, #1313 of 1435 🔗

Not convinced. This isn’t fear driving them, but convenience. If it’s not as good or better, they won’t buy it.

135397 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Nick Rose, #1314 of 1435 🔗

Or enthusiasm. A lot of people are genuinely enjoying this.

135428 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, #1315 of 1435 🔗

There we can agree. Let’s just hope it’s not a majority.

135376 ▶▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1316 of 1435 🔗

True, all govts can do is hinder recovery.
The best a govt can do is Emulate Cowperthwaite and get out of the way as in Hong Kong.

135396 ▶▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1317 of 1435 🔗

Big multinational companies (Davos types) heavily support the green new deal and all the social engineering agenda. People won’t be given a choice – all political parties support the plan.

If most citizens are reliant on a universal basic income and this is subject to your social credit score, you will find people will quickly become model citizens (in the eyes of the establishment). China with it state controlled enterprises and citizens is the future for the West.

135440 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Darryl, #1318 of 1435 🔗

I’m afraid we’re drifting a little there. UBI – or Communism repackaged – simply will not work. Remove incentive and you get less, not more, which means economic stagnation, the precise affliction that destroyed Soviet Communism everywhere.

Multinational corporations don’t run countries, despite what conspiracy theorists claim, politicians do, and politicians are answerable. They also have among their number those with Machiavellian minds who will spot opportunities to exploit.

China is a totalitarian state which, for all its faults, replaced something even worse. Here, it will be a retrograde step and, for that reason alone, unlikely. There is no fear driving any craving for such a move.

Remember, what is offered MUST be better, or it won’t happen.

135495 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Nick Rose, #1319 of 1435 🔗

Machines don’t need an incentive to work.What is coming is the 4th industrial revolution.This crisis has been a prototype.Masses of people out of work and kept alive by the stateAlso our politicians don’t seem very accountable at the moment.What is coming is not communism.It is technocratic Facism.The merging of the state with corporations.The whole track and trace apparatus is being built to neutralise any opposition to this

135381 ▶▶▶ Eddie, replying to Richard O, #1320 of 1435 🔗

So true Richard, excellent point. After all, healthy is the new sick and is backed up by all these (meaningless) cases.

135430 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to Richard O, #1321 of 1435 🔗

To quote Les Grossman there’s always : Go Fuck Yourself, but that’d be like a Ron Burgundy moment

135361 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 1, #1322 of 1435 🔗

If this is the plan, then the government will learn the hard way that if you replace one thing with another, the new thing needs to be better than what it replaces, or people don’t accept it. Forgotten the fuel protests of 2000?

135405 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #1323 of 1435 🔗

The population is much different to 2000. I can’t imagine a fuel style protest again – people in general are much more passive (unless it is a well funded and elite backed movement like Black Lives Matter, or other far left cause). Younger generations have had the green agenda drilled into them for a couple of decades now.

The WHO and Fauci seem to have moved onto the green recovery agenda – the fact that many of their solutions aren’t particularly environmentally friendly seems to go unnoticed. I suspect they desire population control.

135415 ▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Darryl, 4, #1324 of 1435 🔗

Young people don’t appear to care about their rights and freedoms – and privacy – now. I have been amazed at their compliance. My friends and I would never have stopped meeting our girl/boyfriends… would have been an extra challenge, adding more excitement….

135496 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Jo, 1, #1325 of 1435 🔗

I know at 18 nothing would have stopped me going out.Especially something the government said

135449 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Darryl, #1326 of 1435 🔗

Suspect what you like. Because something is drilled into someone, doesn’t mean they believe it. Besides, revolutionary change is not, contrary to popular opinion, driven by the young. I recommend you read Lenin.

135466 ▶▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #1327 of 1435 🔗

That’s an interesting thought… I think Lenin was young in 1917. And today’s BLM/Antifa stuff seems to be driven by young (mostly very poorly educated) people. I have also been absolutely amazed by the numbers of young people I see not even questioning these regulations. Recently drove by a basketball court and saw about 10 high-school aged kids out playing ball – all wearing masks.

I have, however, said that I don’t think these sorts of people are really capable of pulling off any sort of actual revolution. That requires far more discontent than currently exists in much of the world (certainly the US). “I’d love to be a part of the revolution, but I have a tee time at 9:30.”

135473 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RyanM, 2, #1328 of 1435 🔗

Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov (22 April 1870 – 21 January 1924), so 47 in 1917.

today’s BLM/Antifa stuff seems to be driven by young (mostly very poorly educated) people

The point is that these movements (BLM, antifa, XR) are not rebellious, whatever the self-described motives of their ringleaders might be, they are better described as enforcement mobs for intimidating dissenters from establishment dogmas. that’s why they get so little pushback from authorities and elites.

The BLM/XR/antifa phenomenon is better compared to the Chinese Cultural Revolution than revolutionary movements.

135393 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Basics, 1, #1329 of 1435 🔗

Notes from a couple of hours going about life with bbc r4 on in the background. Admitedly hard to read so skip if you can’t understand.
Quite an interesting rate of propaganda/social engineering hits per minute. Nothing was off message, no breadth to their tone of voice – R4 equipes the listener to be informed to go about intelligently in our modern world.

The Briefing Brief?) on R4 today covered what scientists have kearned about covid19 in the past 6 months.

I drifted off. Cannot remember the point that had me swearing at the man on the radio – easily procen rubbish.

Herd immunity – coronaviruses don’t operate in the realm of herd immunity so its likely herd immunity isnt going to help us. Mutations mean they escape the herd immunity. We are not sure but yeah, herd immunity is no going to help. Apparently.

Vaccine – we are going to need many little vaccines to tackle individual circumstances not one big vaccine for all.

Scientists – had to ‘retool’ at the start of lockdown. Kay.

Masks – Presenter has there been “good research ” done into their efficacy? Scientist – well I have chsnged my opinion over the last 6 months. It was shown that where deaths are less there are 3 things happening. Less obesity. Public wearing of masks. And one forgotten thing. Therefore masks are good. But it is clear masks dont work for flu because we see same flu rates in Asia where ‘paper’ mask wearing is common. So in summary I think masks are a good thing to wear. (!!)

No mention of a good qualitive study based on most of the world forced into masks. – this is now a giant whole in their side – there ought to be masses of research coming out about there use.

Ethnic high death – um we don’t know. Um guessing folk in third world are used to “bugs” and have a better immune system as a result. Uk ethnic deaths are in poverty where high that third world hygiene exists so lower strength immune systems. Overall though um we dont know and this is just speculation.

Scientist academics gave massive obfuscation answeting questions which the reporter didn’t follow up on. Listen with the slightest attention and it’s clear you are listening to a scripted back and forth not a series of questions answered.

Melvyn Bragg the popped up with In our time. Of all the things In Our Time has and does cocer what are the chances – a 500 BC Greek who just so happened to live at a time of plsgue. All BBC subtle, not drawing parallels thats for the canny listener to do – BBC just set the bread crumbs. The Greek was a democrat, punished fir something or otger in a time of plague, legislation operated using the time of plague as reason for sucessful prosecution against him – law and pandemic it as natural as clean water..

135398 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 1, #1330 of 1435 🔗

Masks work for Covid-19 but not for flu? What the actual fuck?

135411 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Richard O, 2, #1331 of 1435 🔗

Genuinely, catch it on the brief today. I half listened hence vagueness. But yes, cambridge scientist or another university equivalent said what you understand. Flu doesnt care a jot for masks. Covid is scared of them – or something.

135404 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Basics, 1, #1332 of 1435 🔗

I know. I heard it too. Unlike a lot of people on this site I used to like the BBC – or should I say R4 and World Service, although I was selective in what I listened to. I heard a World Service prog back in March before the lockdown on the efficacy of face masks and its conclusions were that – apart from surgical grade masks – they were of no benefit. I haven’t forgotten that prog because since then it has become politicised. I go with not wearing masks.

135421 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Jo, 2, #1333 of 1435 🔗

I havent been able to listen to r 4 for years 20 years ago it was lovely within limits. Then it became something to play to tomatos in the green house. Now it would make the tomatos wilt, it is that toxic.

I used to enjoy the world service. It is now unhealthy to listen to it imo, deeply sinister foreign policy at work. With a bit of persistence the internet beats the world service to a pulp.

135488 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Basics, #1334 of 1435 🔗

Great reset corresponding with agenda 21/30

135351 ajb97b, replying to ajb97b, 6, #1335 of 1435 🔗

Casedemic. No other words needed…

135358 ▶▶ hotrod, replying to ajb97b, 1, #1336 of 1435 🔗

So why the suggestion of a surge in hospital cases?

If ‘we’ are right then this will be gone if the red line doesn’t move.

135369 ▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to hotrod, 8, #1337 of 1435 🔗

They could start stuffing care homes with infected people again that might help get the death rate moving

135374 ▶▶▶ ajb97b, replying to hotrod, 3, #1338 of 1435 🔗

The “Patients admitted to hospital” or “Patients in hospital” data are misleading, as the simply COUNT the number of people including those who were positive up to 14 days before entering hospital. Since the amount of testing and number of Pillar 2 positives has gone up these last few weeks, then of course the number known to be positives in hospital has gone up. I.e., it just tracks the number of Pillar 2 positives.

The only ‘unbiased’ and meaningful data is the number of deaths

135392 ▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to ajb97b, 3, #1339 of 1435 🔗

And even then it’s still ‘you’ve died from Covid if you had a positive test within the last 28 days’ isn’t it?

135402 ▶▶▶▶ BobT, replying to ajb97b, 1, #1340 of 1435 🔗

I have been playing spreadsheets on PHE data when bored too.
Hospital admissions show a bit of an upturn but they do not publish discharges so its meaningless.
Patients in hospital has flatlined for months, so have deaths and so has the positivity rate of all tests (ignoring unknown false positives). I see no upturn in these figures.
I wonder if there could be a clue in the residual level of these flat lines which can point us to the false pos rate?

135764 ▶▶▶▶▶ ajb97b, replying to BobT, #1341 of 1435 🔗
135400 ▶▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to hotrod, 2, #1342 of 1435 🔗

There are still roughly 3 hospitals per covid patient so I wouldn’t say we have a surge….absolutely insane to think this is something we are 2 weeks away from being swamped by. And 20 odd hospitals per ICU patient…

135375 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to ajb97b, 6, #1343 of 1435 🔗

How about Fraudemic?

135691 ▶▶ wayno, replying to ajb97b, #1344 of 1435 🔗

yeah someone else making graphs 🙂

135389 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1345 of 1435 🔗

Question Time – John Caudwell a testing sceptic – great explanation of why not to panic. Waiting for Gupta’s first comment.

135391 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1346 of 1435 🔗

yes, it’s almost painfully exciting – I so want her to do well

135401 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 9, #1347 of 1435 🔗

I was one of the original staff for Caudwell Communications. We never sold any phones, and John and his brother Brian decided it was a non starter and they would close the business that afternoon. Whilst we were locking up the phone rang, and we unlocked the door and one of the guys there answered the phone and sold all the phones. If we’d have left 5 minutes earlier or not answered that call there wouldn’t have been any Caudwell Communications or Phones4u, and he wouldn’t have walked away with £300 million.

135406 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to JohnB, #1348 of 1435 🔗

Of such chances are great fortunes made and lost…

(Nice anecdote, thanks).

135469 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark, #1349 of 1435 🔗

Yes, there’s a very fine line between success and failure.

135413 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to JohnB, 1, #1350 of 1435 🔗

Wow, what a great story. He is performing very well tonight – a sceptic through-and-through.

135422 ▶▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1351 of 1435 🔗

yes, clear, persuasive, fluent

135490 ▶▶▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Alethea, #1352 of 1435 🔗

in that case don’t knock the BBC where there is a chance like this to influence public opinion. I had to wade through treacle to get to Heneghan’s interview.

135418 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to JohnB, #1353 of 1435 🔗

Reminds me of JB Priestley’s play Dangerous Corner!

135412 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #1354 of 1435 🔗

I think she is nervous. Alarmed by her understanding of how alarmed many people will be by hearing what she has to say. Then she was interrupted; Caudwell took over and communicated more effectively.
What do others think?

135416 ▶▶▶ The Diplomat, replying to Alethea, #1355 of 1435 🔗

Agree….she is not a natural communicator in front of a TV camera….is careful with her words and needs patience to be listened to.

135423 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Alethea, 2, #1356 of 1435 🔗

Yes agree, I thought that too. She is getting better though with each answer. Caudwell is a star – and he is supporting her too. Ashworth has lost it. Zahawi is a slimeball and wittering anyway (has he got Borisitis?)

135425 ▶▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #1357 of 1435 🔗

both Ashworth and Zahawi are making themselves look like fools. All they are allowed to do, evidently, is parrot the prepared lines. Literally, robots could perform as they are doing

135431 ▶▶▶▶ Badgerman, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1358 of 1435 🔗

She is clearly not a confident speaker in this environment. Caudwell is excellent – speaking with common sense and logic. The two most are just arrogant sock puppets. No surprise there then.

135435 ▶▶▶▶▶ Badgerman, replying to Badgerman, #1359 of 1435 🔗

Edit – “the two mps”

135436 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Alethea, 1, #1360 of 1435 🔗

Agree she is a bit too timid but she is not a politician.Ashworth is infuriating.What a prick

135441 ▶▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Alethea, 2, #1361 of 1435 🔗

I think her arguments are often too nuanced and advanced and she’s realising she’s got to somehow come down to their level while still being convincing. Tough job! Good to see Caudwell supporting effectively though for sure.

135443 ▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Tee Ell, #1362 of 1435 🔗

Is this something that is available online? It would be good to see these sorts of issues actually being debated publicly.

135444 ▶▶▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to RyanM, 1, #1363 of 1435 🔗

it will be on the BBCiplayer

135446 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Alethea, 2, #1364 of 1435 🔗

I live in WA state. 🙂 LS (for obvious reasons) appears to be primarily British… I’m a bit surprised there aren’t more of us on here.

135450 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RyanM, 1, #1365 of 1435 🔗

Apparently you can watch iplayer in the US provided you have the right VPN

https://www.comparitech.com/tv-streaming/watch-bbc-in-usa-iplayer/

Hopefully the key clips will be on Youtube in due course.

135451 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Mark, 2, #1366 of 1435 🔗

I need to get a VPN, anyway, so that I can watch baseball games when my team (colorado Rockies) plays against Seattle! I mean… if they have a baseball season next year and it isn’t completely ruined by social justice and covid bullshit.

135460 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RyanM, 1, #1367 of 1435 🔗

Well, now you have an excuse to try one out now to watch Question Time, so you can iron out any kinks before the really important stuff returns next year… 🙂 Though I did once go to a baseball match in Los Angeles, and mostly what I remember is a long afternoon of endless eating – similar to our cricket test matches, but with food instead of beer.

The only concern would be the suggestion that iplayer blocks some VPNs, which would suggest you might need up to date info as to what still works.

135491 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Alethea, #1368 of 1435 🔗

thanks I will check out-I’m encouraged by responses here

135395 Cecil B, 7, #1369 of 1435 🔗

It’s Thursday, shouldn’t you all be out clapping?

135399 nocheesegromit, replying to nocheesegromit, 16, #1370 of 1435 🔗

Just wanted to say hi to the fellow university student that commented earlier – I can’t seem to find your comment now, but it’s nice to see other dissenters my age.

135513 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #1371 of 1435 🔗

Good for you, its early days yet but students strolling around the local campus are 75% freefaced and ignoring rule of 6.

136747 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to karenovirus, #1372 of 1435 🔗

Good for them!!!

135409 Cecil B, #1373 of 1435 🔗

More lies and propaganda from the Welsh ‘Government’

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-54189913

135419 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 4, #1374 of 1435 🔗

I am beginning to doubt that a second national lockdown will actually be necessary. If all the major urban areas are in local lockdowns, it amounts to exactly the same thing. Job done.

Any thoughts on why the Midlands and North have been the keenest to exercise their newly acquired powers?

135426 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Richard O, 3, #1375 of 1435 🔗

It’s the Ferguson Foot & Mouth disease approach. He might have resigned from SAGE, but his model lives on in this government’s mind!

135429 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 4, #1376 of 1435 🔗

Labour authoritiesA lot of grandstanding especially from Burnham in Manchester.Politicians love power and never miss a chance to exercise it

135442 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #1377 of 1435 🔗

I’ve heard that Burnham has been especially keen to lead the pack.

The authoritarian mindset is now so deeply entrenched that central government can more or less step back and let all the local authorities get on with it. They will be competing to outdo each other. Reminds me of the Gauleiters in the Third Reich, who ruled their areas completely independently with no interference from Berlin.

135445 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, 4, #1378 of 1435 🔗

It gives him a national profile as well,just as Sturgeon has used the pandemic to further the cause of Scottish independence

135456 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #1379 of 1435 🔗

Daniel Andrews. Andrew Cuomo. Gavin Newsom.

Names I should not know, but I do. This is their moment in history.

135470 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Richard O, 1, #1380 of 1435 🔗

If when one dies one goes to Hell to suffer just eternal torment, surely part of the torment will involve having to listen to Andrew Cuomo’s self-serving homilies delivered direct to the CNN camera. .

135485 ▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to Richard O, 1, #1381 of 1435 🔗

Socialists. Commie-lite.

135509 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Richard O, #1382 of 1435 🔗

Because the local government Officers enjoy the power they now wield.

A music venue owner told me today that a local pub was closed down for three days after the landlord was grassed up by his own customer for insufficient Covid safety.

Usually corruption is for personal gain which is understandable, this is just the ability to boss people around which is pathetic.

Creeping Curfew coming your way =
Second Lockdown by stealth, they really do think that we are stupid.

135512 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to karenovirus, #1383 of 1435 🔗

Plenty more of this come. One snitch can ruin an entire community with a handful of tip-offs. This is a power trip for them as much as it is for the official enforcers.

135427 4096, replying to 4096, 6, #1384 of 1435 🔗

If you are watching Question Time to see brilliant Sunetra Gupta prepare to want to throw bricks at your laptop/TV when that ignorant, smug, cretinous muppet Ashworth tries to argue.

135432 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to 4096, #1385 of 1435 🔗

‘argue’? What is this ‘argue’ of which you speak?

135433 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to 4096, 2, #1386 of 1435 🔗

Caldwell is good too. Ashworth is a disgrace

135438 ▶▶▶ 4096, replying to Yawnyaman, #1387 of 1435 🔗

Yes, I just started watching – he’s great. I really feel like sanity is finally, slowly coming back

135479 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to 4096, 1, #1388 of 1435 🔗

I took the opposite view.The audience and all the panel bar him and Suneta Gupta gave all bought into the Covid scam.Arguing over the handling of tests without questioning the need for it all.I wish she had argued her point that it is not a deadly virus when Fiona Bruce threw the 41,000 figure at her.She could have calmly explained the difference between dying with and of coronavirus; the fact is no one knows the true figure because they labelled everything Covid.

135434 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to 4096, 3, #1389 of 1435 🔗

Pompous windbag. “I hear what you’re saying as the expert… and I choose to completely ignore it.” Rubbish socks too.

135448 ▶▶ 4096, replying to 4096, 3, #1390 of 1435 🔗

Zahawi: “…what I’m seeing in the data…” yes, I wonder what that is you idiot with no epidemiological training – I love that they cut to Sunetra’s barely suppressed smirk.

135463 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to 4096, 1, #1391 of 1435 🔗

I stopped consuming any BBC media months ago.

Is there an audience? If so, are they all wearing masks and socially distanced?

135482 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Richard O, #1392 of 1435 🔗

Audience on Zoom.You are right it is not good for the blood pressure

135508 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Richard O, #1393 of 1435 🔗

Apparently 250,000 fewer licences bought this year.

135518 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to 4096, #1394 of 1435 🔗

Didn’t watch it – what’s the verdict?

135437 Mark, replying to Mark, 10, #1395 of 1435 🔗

A witness called Pierre said that the Briton had tried to explain that he struggled to breathe with the mask on.
But the officer pointed at his vest and replied, ‘What does that say? This is marked “Police”, not a damned “social worker”, I do not give a damn.’
It’s further alleged by another witness named Clemence that one of the officers yelled: ‘You’re in France here, you’re not in your country .'”

Why you should never, ever, give police these kinds of powers. Mask wearing and all similar policies should always be voluntary, ruat caelum.

French cop kicks and stamps on British man’s head as he is arrested for ‘not wearing a face mask and possessing a knife’ at train station

As for the convenient “resisting arrest” claim by the police that he took out a Swiss Army knife (of all things) and supposedly tried to stab one of them with it, that should be treated with the same automatic scepticism as should be applied to claims that victims of violence made “racial abuse” towards their attackers, as such claims are so commonly made falsely to try to justify violence.

135475 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Mark, 2, #1396 of 1435 🔗

Strip away the language, the uniform and the body and only the brain remains. Police around the world appear to have their brains filled with violence. Is this a result of counter terrorism training? Police are out of depth policing public health enforcement.

135497 ▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Basics, 3, #1397 of 1435 🔗

They kick you in the head to protect your health. Strange times.

135503 ▶▶ A Heretic, replying to Mark, 2, #1398 of 1435 🔗

Looks to me like the c*** doing the kicking isn’t wearing a mask. Hopefully someone will give him the good kicking that he needs.

135452 Youth_Unheard, replying to Youth_Unheard, 5, #1399 of 1435 🔗

Sunetra just needs to explain to John that the virus has always not been deadly, it’s simply the media frenzy and panic which made it seem like it was more, the initial panicked estimates from China and the WHO. And of course the initial stupidity of emptying hospitals into care homes and then ignoring them.

135453 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Youth_Unheard, 5, #1400 of 1435 🔗

I care about the truth and think she should try to communicate it – but wonder if his version might not prove more palatable to all the people who bought the death porn in the spring

135454 ▶▶▶ Youth_Unheard, replying to Alethea, 2, #1401 of 1435 🔗

I agree it is an easier way out, and if the gov and media committed to that false narrative as opposed to the current one, I could not care less as long as people go back to life!!!

135459 ▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Youth_Unheard, 2, #1402 of 1435 🔗

I fear that gives too much of a hostage to fortune. Rub their noses in the truth. Slay the vampiric narrative, or it will come back to bite us.

135455 ▶▶▶ RyanM, replying to Alethea, 2, #1403 of 1435 🔗

Exactly. It’s a sort of stockholm syndrome. It will be very difficult for all of these martyrs to accept that … maybe it wasn’t all really necessary.

135457 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Alethea, 2, #1404 of 1435 🔗

Yes, that’s the difference between a salesperson (him) and an analyst (her). They would be a dynamite Pharma research team in The City!

135462 NickR, 5, #1405 of 1435 🔗

Unbelievable, the staggeringly cretinous Ashworth supporting the loathsome Zahawi.
Who votes for these people? Such 3rd raters.

135464 Mark, replying to Mark, 3, #1406 of 1435 🔗

Doctors warn Madrid is walking ‘in slow motion’ towards a repeat of its ‘nuclear bomb’ Covid crisis in March

  • Spain has recorded average of 10,000 new cases per day over the last week
  • Madrid accounts for 31% of all those cases, striking fear into the capital’s medics
  • Spain has borne brunt of Europe’s outbreak – it has the highest per capita deaths
  • One doctor in Madrid said: ‘It’s like the situation in March but in slow motion’

Lots of emphasis on “cases” and some, but relatively little, talk about hospitalisations. Pretty vital how his develops though.

In a way, it’s like the situation in March but in slow motion,’ said Dr. Carlos Velayos, who works as an intensive care unit physician at the public hospital in suburban Fuenlabrada.

Well ok, but the key feature of March was precisely the rapidity….

135468 ▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to Mark, #1407 of 1435 🔗

euromomo.eu showing a moderate excess death in Belgium and in Spain. No excess deaths anywhere else in the 24 participating nations. No excess deaths in Week 37 (w/e 11/09/20) showing that the Bank Holiday excuse was just that – an excuse.

135476 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Londo Mollari, #1408 of 1435 🔗

Trouble with death numbers is that there is considerable lag. Hospitalisations are a much better number to watch atm.

135483 ▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to Mark, 5, #1409 of 1435 🔗

Madrid was locked down hard. Lockdowns don’t work, just kick the can. This is where it’s landed. At the beginning of the winter season, which is the worst time, instead of where the virus wanted to be – all done by now.

135465 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 12, #1410 of 1435 🔗

Vignettes from the time of the plague:

1. Happily, 99% of schoolkids on the train totally ignoring the mask rule. Overhearing their conversations they seem (rightly) far more concerned about the fraud calls they get on their mobiles than the non existent threat (for them at that age) of Covid. Why doesn’t our useless government do anything to combat phone and internet fraud?

2. Had my first challenge out shopping maskless today. Was in Waitrose so won’t be going back there in a hurry! Explained I was exempt…no further queries. But even so I resent the intrusion.

3. Got a taxi back from the station today. Driver told me he’d been waiting for over three hours for a fare. He said things had got far worse since the rule of 6 was introduced. We agreed this was nothing to do with the rule itself but reflected the government ramping up the fear factor. In other words the government is sabotaging the very economic recovery it claims it wants.

4. Neghbour told me his very fit mid 80s yr old father passed away recently in hospital. Tested negative for Covid three times but was being recorded as “possible” Covid-related pneumonia. Maybe…but also possibly any number of pathogens might have caused the pneumonia so why mention Covid after three negatives? Sounds like the figures are being inflated…

135471 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to OKUK, 5, #1411 of 1435 🔗

I really appreciate these reports, and admire your bloody mindedness to go about your daily business irrespective of the conditions. I have not ventured further than a quarter of a mile from my flat, or been within a metre of another person, since 18th March. My coping mechanism, nothing more. The boots on the ground intelligence I gather from these kind of contributions on here are an absolutely invaluable insight into where we are. No detail is too trivial. Please keep it up.

135477 ▶▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to Richard O, 4, #1412 of 1435 🔗

There is NOTHING out there. They are playing M. Night Shyamalan‘s film ‘The Village’ for real.

135489 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to James Leary #KBF, 3, #1413 of 1435 🔗

It’s as bad as I thought then. Simply too excruciating to see places I once knew desecrated like this.

135480 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Richard O, 1, #1414 of 1435 🔗

I remain entirely non-judgmental as to how individuals (meaning people not in the public sphere, ie people not telling the rest of us what to do) decide to respond. We all try and adapt to this weird new environment as best as can!

135493 ▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Richard O, 4, #1415 of 1435 🔗

Well, if it makes you feel better Richard here’s a trivial detail: I have been to my local watering hole every day/night since the 24th July (after they got the draught beer back on – yes I like beer as well as wine) and I’m still singing and dancing and being convivial. We even laugh (all those droplets!!!!) The only negative is that I realise how much money I saved during lockdown – but blow me, how effing boring.

135499 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Bella, 3, #1416 of 1435 🔗

Excellent work. Supporting your local and trying to preserve humanity is more important than ever. I am barred from my local, although with 6 months of beard growth I would probably no longer be recognised.

I have at least supported a local microbrewery (Fourpure Brewing) with fortnightly orders, but it does not compare to the pub.

135504 ▶▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Bella, 1, #1417 of 1435 🔗

me too! Drinking in several places in London-nothing after 10 except the suburbs. Salient point was how much I saved during lockdown too

135505 ▶▶▶ Liam, replying to Richard O, 4, #1418 of 1435 🔗

I’m not wearing masks, anywhere. I go to the pub every night, and on Friday and Saturday night when I’m a bit pissed I hug my mates. I walk the dog every day and smile at everyone I pass. Courage my friend.

135515 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Liam, 1, #1419 of 1435 🔗

I am not afraid, just incapable of subjecting myself to the horrors that have been inflicted upon our public spaces. I won’t ever use hand sanitiser, let alone a mask.

Used to drink copious amounts of Courage in my youth. Directors was always acceptable, but Best was worse than soapy dish water. An insipid pint.

135507 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Richard O, 5, #1420 of 1435 🔗

Richard, each to his own; I’m in my 60’s, have COPD, assmar and a dodgy back but decided early on not to hide indoors and if the Covid got me sign a DNR, put me in corner and fill me full of morphine and goodbye.

None of this came to pass I work, shop and live normally, apart from care staff I’ve yet to meet anyone who knows anybody who has had the Covid far less died from it despite being up close and personal with about 5k individuals since March 23rd.

It’s all bullshit.

135467 Laurence, 6, #1421 of 1435 🔗

There’s a very important point you’re missing in the Spain article. In rough numbers, around 420,000 people die each year in Spain, around 1,150 a day.

Now in the latest figures 13% of tests gave a positive result, so you’d expect 149 per day of the deaths to be people who have tested covid positive, even assuming that has no health effect (in the same way as 58 would be left-handed assuming 5% of people are left handed).

The actual daily figure (deaths of people who have tested positive) is around 60 so well below this, implying either that COVID is good for you (very unlikely) or that the results are completely meaningless (most likely).

so there is no evidence of an uptick at all in Spain.

135502 Basics, 11, #1423 of 1435 🔗

Beautifully put by the Israeli Gilad Atzmon –

“If I have to choose between getting my T cells from Covid 19 or from Bill Gates, Oxford Chimpanzees or an Israeli WMD factory.. I certainly go for Covid, it guaranties 99.98% survival rate ..”

Twitter.

135506 Basics, replying to Basics, 2, #1424 of 1435 🔗

The World Health Organization, which is the medical epicenter of the depopulation lobby, now considers your child’s presence in school informed consent to vaccinate that child.

The WHO has labeled it ‘implied consent’

Link to WHO pdf
https://www.who.int/immunization/programmes_systems/policies_strategies/consent_note_en.pdf

135516 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Basics, #1425 of 1435 🔗

Getting jabbed against infections was just a routine part of infant/junior school life in the 60’s. Administered by the School Nurse who was regarded as a Fierce Saint, not to be messed with.

135714 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to karenovirus, #1426 of 1435 🔗

Vaccines have come a long way in 2020. Inclusive of tagging infra red tattoo.

135510 covid_skeptic, replying to covid_skeptic, 4, #1427 of 1435 🔗

SANJEEV SABHLOK : MY NOMINATION FOR AUSTRALIAN OF THE YEAR

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/politics/coronavirus-public-servant-sanjeev-sabhlok-quits-slams-police-state/news-story/e95a481a6b08aa461eeb34113d930b1b

An economist with the Victorian Department of Finance and Treasury has resigned so he can call out Labor Premier Dan Andrews’ handling of the pandemic and the “police state” imposed on Melbourne residents.

135517 ▶▶ Nsklent, replying to covid_skeptic, 3, #1428 of 1435 🔗

I have sent the video clip to my MP. We can only hope.

135514 covid_skeptic, replying to covid_skeptic, 6, #1429 of 1435 🔗

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6191658847001

Former Victorian public servant claims he was ‘stifled from the very beginning’
17/09/2020|12min

Former economist at the Victorian Treasury Department Sanjeev Sabhlok, who resigned after being stifled by superiors, has told Sky News top public servants chose not to “rock the boat” as it was not welcome by their “political masters”.

Mr Sabhlok recently resigned from his post at the Victorian Department of Finance and Treasury after being asked to remove online posts criticising the state’s management of the pandemic.

In an exclusive television interview with Sky News host Peta Credlin, Mr Sabhlok said that he raised objections in February claiming data was sufficient to look at actions to “isolate the elderly to protect them” whilst letting the rest of society to “continue with precautions”.

Mr Sabhlok said he was told this was “not the department’s job”, but in fact the purview of the Department of Health and Human Services.

“I’ve been stifled from the very beginning,” he said

“Normally treasury provides holistic advice. That’s the whole point of economics.

He said the Victorian government quickly imposed approaches emblematic of “extreme overreach”.

“We started reaching from one heavy handed approach to the more heavy handed approaches,” according to Mr Sabhlok.

“The public service has not served its role in terms of being an independent and free and fearless source of analysis which provides the government with a wide range of impacts”.

He said the “contractual arrangements” of senior public servants may have made them “bias towards supporting the status quo”.

“I think this whole thing has been policy on the run, and the worst example of policy making in my entire life,” he said.

“We’re focussing on one item, but society has a wide range of issues involved, a wide range of health impacts, economic impacts, psychological, and wellbeing (impacts).

“The entire decision making of every single activity is in fact … communism in practice.

“When the justification is not provided (for restrictions) and proportionality is not there, then the legitimacy of the government itself fails.”

135519 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to covid_skeptic, 5, #1430 of 1435 🔗

Full credit to this guy for having the guts to go public. In that imprisoned state he is risking everything to do so. Sky News Australia also deserves praise for broadcasting it. If this was a military conflict, their studios would have been bombed long ago (remember Al Jazeera in the 2003 Iraq War).

135520 karenovirus, 1, #1431 of 1435 🔗

Talk Radio, 5 hours ago, Toby regrets backing Boris.
Currently item #5. Sorry, can’t post links from Android.

135521 p02099003, replying to p02099003, #1432 of 1435 🔗

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54199642 reports another partial lockdown across the whole of England.

135522 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to p02099003, 1, #1433 of 1435 🔗

First BBC article I’ve read for months. It’s another reality. No wonder the UK is in such trouble.

However Prime Minister Boris Johnson is understood to be deeply reluctant to order another national lockdown, where everyone would be asked to stay at home and businesses to close.

He doesn’t have to do anything. The power to impose stringent local lockdowns has been delegated to local authorities, so the government has washed its hands of the responsibility. One by one, all the major urban centres are taking it upon themselves to finish the job.

135546 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Richard O, 1, #1434 of 1435 🔗

All part of the plan
Government wants local authorities to take over so they get the blame when the public finally wakes up to what is going on.

135599 mjr, 1, #1435 of 1435 🔗

FRIDAY PAGE IS HERE. MOVE ALONG
And watch out for the Gendarmes
https://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/09/18/latest-news-138/#comments

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21Seansaighdeoir4, 17, 0
21Suzyv17, 3, 1
20Major Panic20
20William Hand6, 2, 3, 9
20Cheshirecatslave13, 2, 1, 2, 2
20jhfreedom3, 2, 3, 2, 3, 4, 3
19Mrs issedoff19
19Thomas_E11, 8, 0
19mattghg10, 0, 5, 1, 1, 2
18B Boru9, 1, 8
18Andrew Fish5, 4, 6, 3
18anon2, 4, 12, 0
18arfurmo8, 1, 4, 2, 3
18Nigel Sherratt2, 2, 0, 3, 10, 1
18Richard Pinch9, 3, 1, 0, 3, 2
17microdave17
17Sir Patrick Vaccine710
17Nsklent3, 2, 5, 3, 1, 3
16tonyspurs4, 12
16Drummerman3, 1, 3, 2, 3, 4
15Chris7915
15James Marker15
15Andy C13, 2
15Braveheart8, 7
15tonys3, 2, 10
156097 Smith W7, 0, 0, 8
14Banjones14
14Sceptic Hank14
14BTLnewbie12, 2
14PD122
14Drawde9275, 3, 0, 2, 4
14A. Contrarian2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 7
14MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG33, 2, 2, 3, 1
13JME13
13tallandbald13
13Alison97, 6
13Ewan Duffy12, 1
13Dan Clarke2, 3, 4, 4
13SmokeandMirrors5, 1, 1, 6
13Ossettian3, 1, 1, 1, 1, 3, 3
12Caramel12
12Girl down Under0, 12
12ViralSputum10, 2
12wat tyler7, 5
12Nobody20203, 4, 0, 0, 5
12Sarigan30, 4, 1, 2, 2
11Quernus11
11Sally3, 8
11Will3, 32, 0, 2, 1
11CGL0, 3, 2, 2, 1, 1, 0, 2, 0
10Hopeful10
10Lorenzo Basso10
10Mr Jim McGregor10
10Steve10
10covid_skeptic4, 6
10James Leary #KBF1, 5, 4
10snippet1, 0, 9, 0
10guy1531, 6, 0, 0, 2, 1
9JASA9
9Under The Bridge9
9JohnB9, 0
9Liam5, 4
9Richard2, 7
940966, 0, 3
9ajb97b6, 3, 0
9Bella4, 1, 4
9muzzle0, 6, 3
9wayno4, 1, 2, 1, 1, 0
8Pete Bell8
8thedarkhorse8
8grammarschoolman6, 2
8Margaret7, 1
8philburton3, 5
8theanalyst6, 2
7Derrick Byford7
7Jane in France7
7JustMe7
7Tommy T.7
7David4, 3
7GLT4, 3
7NickR52
7Recusant5, 2
7Lili2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 0
6JYC6
6Laurence6
6Tee Ell6
6Bella Donna42
6kf991, 5
6Laura Suckling4, 2
6Polemon22, 4
6zacaway4, 2
6Paul1, 2, 3
6wendyk6, 0, 0
6Eldred Godson1, 0, 1, 4
6crimsonpirate1, 2, 2, 0, 0, 1
5MizakeTheMizan5
5The Filthy Engineer4, 1
5PWL23, 0
5Tee Ell0, 2, 3
5Cicatriz2, 1, 1, 1
5Tim Bidie4, 0, 0, 1
5Yawnyaman0, 0, 2, 1, 2
5mhcp3, 0, 2, 0, 0, 0
4GiftWrappedKittyCat4
4hat man4
4Jack4
4mwhite4
4smileymiley4
4NappyFace4, 0, 0
4PastImperfect0, 1, 2, 1
3Carlo3
3polistra3
3PowerCorrupts3
3Strange Days3
3Stuart Barker3
32 pence21
3A Heretic1, 2
3Matt The Cat0, 3
3HelzBelz0, 0, 3
3Nessimmersion1, 0, 2
3Chris John1, 0, 2, 0
3JohnB1, 0, 0, 0, 2
2Cody2
2Hannahbanana2
2OpenYourEyes2
2Saved To Death2
2Shep2
2Silke David2
2SweetBabyCheeses2
2Toby Lewis2
2Badgerman2, 0
2nottingham690, 1, 1
2T. Prince0, 0, 0, 2
1Ajb1
1BobT1
1Ed Phillips1
1Jill1
1Motke1
1MRG1
1Nottingham691
1RonniC1
1Eddie1, 0
1Rowan1, 0
1Stringfellow Hawke1, 0
1Cheezilla1, 0, 0
1FenTyger1, 0, 0
1Edward1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0
0Biggles0
0Emily Tock0
0Enjoyeverysandwich0
0gmwhite0
0janis pennance0
0The Diplomat0
0The Spingler0
0Thinkaboutit0
0ChrisDinBristol0, 0
-55John P-18, -13, -12, -11, -5, -1, 2, 0, -6, 3, 3, 3

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