2020-09-21

Sourcehttps://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/09/21/latest-news-141/
Published2020-09-21T00:30:39
Last updated2020-09-22T00:00:05
Scraped2020-12-20T20:18:06
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140179 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 4, #1 of 1915 🔗

I have a thirst to be first.

140181 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to OKUK, 51, #2 of 1915 🔗

Thirst satisfied, let me say that Carl Henegan has done a superb job in demolishing the government’s absurdist claims.

140458 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to OKUK, 13, #3 of 1915 🔗

Sadly, however, totally ignored by our ‘leaders’.

141494 ▶▶▶ Adam Hiley, replying to OKUK, 3, #4 of 1915 🔗

He should replace Witty as Chief Medical Officer or proffesor Sikora

141570 ▶▶▶▶ Derek Toyne, replying to Adam Hiley, 4, #5 of 1915 🔗

Hello,
I agree unfortunately the government have dug themselves into a hole which they haven’t a clue how to get out of. The pandemic is similar to the situation out generals found themselves during world war one.
Whatever they tried would lose thousands of lives so rather than accept that fact they ploughed on wasting thousands and thousands of lives. This is what where doing we’ve followed the wrong strategy but instead of admitting this we carry on and hope some miracle or new discovery, literally anything turns up.

141602 ▶▶▶▶▶ Colin Smith, replying to Derek Toyne, 3, #6 of 1915 🔗

And as in WW1, an entire generation is being sacrificed to keep the fat old generals in safety and comfort.

140203 ▶▶ Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to OKUK, 43, #7 of 1915 🔗

From the Telegraph

SIR – A major rethink on how we battle coronavirus is urgently needed. Now, we’re far better informed, so locking us all down and destroying more lives and livelihoods are not the answer.

Even when a vaccine is found, it may not grant total immunity. In the meantime, as with every other disease, we must learn to live with it.

The most vulnerable are more than capable of deciding how to protect themselves, while the young need to get on with their lives and enjoy their youth, which passes all too quickly.

Enough of this hourly analysis, which creates an atmosphere of fear out of all proportion to the threat. Our best weapon against the virus, for now, is common sense, not over-reaction, which is devastating our country.

Richard Drax MP (Con)
London SW1

********************************************************
Criminals being let off by the police to ease pressure on the courts, Telegraph investigation finds

********************************************************

I see the Telegraph has its own “Global Health Security Team”

Straight out of George Orwell

***********************************************

140206 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 11, #8 of 1915 🔗

Needs to be sent to every other MP.

140283 ▶▶▶▶ EllGee, replying to karenovirus, 6, #9 of 1915 🔗

Forwarded to my MP

140399 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bill Jamieson, replying to EllGee, 1, #10 of 1915 🔗

ditto

140461 ▶▶▶▶▶ IanE, replying to EllGee, 1, #11 of 1915 🔗

Good idea – mine too, now!

140329 ▶▶▶▶ James Bertram, replying to karenovirus, 7, #12 of 1915 🔗

Have sent this letter, combined with Nigel Farage’s video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdkaq3S7nH0 (which he has circulated to all Brexit Party members), to my Guildford MP – with the comment: What is your position on extending the Governments powers again on the 26th September Coronavirus Act 2020? I hear or read NOTHING from you on the most important matter of our lifetime!

140419 ▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to James Bertram, 4, #13 of 1915 🔗

Interesting lots of the comments to Farage’s video ask him to start a new political party so that they can vote for him as an alternative to Conserrvative and Labour

140449 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Victoria, 4, #14 of 1915 🔗

As a remainer, I can’t envisage voting for Faridge. But on the other hand……

140542 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Chris Hume, replying to Jo, 5, #15 of 1915 🔗

I am a Brexiteer, but not from the Farage wing. I don’t think he is the right person to lead the counter movement for all sorts of reasons, including alienation of Remain voters. Most important though is that he was in favour of lockdown and the MSM/Government narrative, and has only recently converted. Nothing wrong with converting (Mike Graham and Julia Hartley-Brewer are now quite sceptical after being supportive for example), but I think it would compromise their ability to attack the Government and establishment effectively if they are only now coming out on our side. It does smack of opportunism to me. Far prefer that leadership came from consistent sceptics like Hitchens, Hannan etc.. I do think Farage coming out for us will help convince a large group of people who have probably followed the Government and MSM line up to now, but are stirring. In taht way he will be useful. He will also scare the Government as well.

140959 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Chris Hume, 1, #16 of 1915 🔗

Agree. Farage supported the lockdown. Glad he appeared and would be helping the anti-lockdown message now, but NOT forgiven.

140580 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Jo, 6, #17 of 1915 🔗

That ship’s sailed, a new battle may require new alliances.

140596 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Jo, 1, #18 of 1915 🔗

The SDP are making the right kind of noises – perhaps they are the change we need.

141516 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Adam Hiley, replying to Andrew Fish, #19 of 1915 🔗

I joined them in April out of protest at the LibLabConSNP parties

141506 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Adam Hiley, replying to Jo, 2, #20 of 1915 🔗

it’s no longer about Leave or Remain it’s vital We defend ourselves from a wayward regime that needs removing

141719 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Adam Hiley, #21 of 1915 🔗

Well said.
I’m finding the leave/remain rhetoric acts as one big red herring. It tends to derail sensible and urgently needed anti-lockdown discussion in the MSM comments.

141608 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Colin Smith, replying to Jo, #22 of 1915 🔗

I know, suddenly I find myself willing to back anyone who adopts a basic common sense response to this « crisis ». Other political considerations can be sorted out later.

140456 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Victoria, 6, #23 of 1915 🔗

We could do with a genuine clear sweep of politics. A new party free from any of the old faces or financial backers – can’t see any party featuring Nigel Farage getting enough votes to get any MPs elected – too divisive figure.

141546 ▶▶▶▶▶ Olaf Felts, replying to James Bertram, 1, #24 of 1915 🔗

Snap.

141627 ▶▶▶▶▶ Derek Toyne, replying to James Bertram, 1, #25 of 1915 🔗

Hello,
I think with the warnings about mid October seeing 50,000 cases a day it will be very hard to not renew the Corona virus Act 2020. The mps are as much use as a wet flannel, I watched QT the other night and was disappointed how the mps dismissed the scientist views. So it’s a given it will be renewed all we can do is keep reminding people that lockdown as failed. While the UK and Europe are seeing increases in infections others like Sweden are seeing a decrease. We must let the facts speak for themselves and hopefully this will bring the lockdown nightmare to an end.

140214 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 41, #26 of 1915 🔗

‘The most vulnerable are more than capable of deciding how to protect themselves, while the young need to get on with their lives and enjoy their youth, which passes all too quickly.’

I honour him infinitely for those sane and simple words.

140221 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to annie, 11, #27 of 1915 🔗

PS. I’ve written to congratulate him. Great man.

140452 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to annie, 3, #28 of 1915 🔗

Me too. Think he will be inundated….

140487 ▶▶▶▶▶ Norma McNormalface, replying to annie, 2, #29 of 1915 🔗

Yes, I did too. I asked him to try and rally some more support.

141139 ▶▶▶▶▶ Gillian Swanson, replying to annie, 1, #30 of 1915 🔗

Me too, and sent a copy to my MP.

140229 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, 6, #31 of 1915 🔗

Well said. Should be circulated far and wide

140299 ▶▶▶ Nic, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #32 of 1915 🔗

Yes its funded by gates check it out

140429 ▶▶▶▶ RichT, replying to Nic, 2, #33 of 1915 🔗

B&MG Foundation funded Daily Telegraph £2.7 million pounds in 2017. They have funded almost every major media organisation in the world, so this is hardly surprising.

141785 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nic, #34 of 1915 🔗

Uncle Bill is a many-tentacled abomination!

140413 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #35 of 1915 🔗

The Telegraph’s global health security team is funded by Gates. Take a look at the donations page on the Gates website.

140432 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 5, #36 of 1915 🔗

Well one queries why he didn’t say this earlier but yes, yes, yes – particularly the bit about not depriving the young of their youth.

Anti-lockdown MPs now need to a cross party campaign group to get traction.

140503 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to OKUK, 3, #37 of 1915 🔗

“There is more joy in heaven, over one sinner that repents”

Why on earth are you carping at someone doing the right thing.

140448 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, #38 of 1915 🔗

I’ve copied RD’s letter to Theresa May

141165 ▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, #39 of 1915 🔗

Sent to mine

141207 ▶▶▶ Hester, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #40 of 1915 🔗

The bloke who heads up the Telegraphs Global health team, is the head of a company that specialises in something akin to stairlift production, when you next see a report on Covid look up the journalists biographies, one of them today who was putting out a terror piece as to whether children should go back to school, is actually a lifestyle editor who focuses on celbrity interviews and interior design. In other words the Telegraph adopts a call centre styleof Journalism, basically they have people with laptops scouring the internet for news putting stuff together and then senstionalisig. If it bleeds it leads. Just next time you see an explosive piece look up the journalists credentials.On the criteria they use, any 14 year old with a laptop could write

142082 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to OKUK, #41 of 1915 🔗

Are you on the 10pm – 6am shift 77? Is that why you were first today and still giving it large this evening?

140180 BJJ, replying to BJJ, 1, #42 of 1915 🔗

Again?

140182 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to BJJ, 5, #43 of 1915 🔗

Sometimes the late bird catches the worm.

140215 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to OKUK, 1, #44 of 1915 🔗

Only if it’s a late worm.

140512 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to annie, 1, #45 of 1915 🔗

He’s a lot earlier than most of the other worms. Don’t be too harsh.

140183 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 20, #46 of 1915 🔗

Great page today.

Suspect it’s going to be a BIG week.

Whitty v Carl Heneghan

140186 ▶▶ OKUK, replying to hotrod, 4, #47 of 1915 🔗

I thought you agreed with Whitty…

140187 ▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to OKUK, 5, #48 of 1915 🔗

And answer came there none, because they are working from a script…

140195 ▶▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to OKUK, 10, #49 of 1915 🔗

I’d really love to write a limerick about Chris Whitty, but for the life of me I can’t think of any rhymes.

140222 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 55, #50 of 1915 🔗

It. isn’t hard writing of Whitty
You just need to say it’s a pity
That this Whitless cretin
Has managed to get in
To power, with results that are s…..y.

141143 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Gillian Swanson, replying to annie, 1, #51 of 1915 🔗

Great, Annie – perfect scansion, too!

140244 ▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 11, #52 of 1915 🔗

no one in their right mind would get down to the nitty gritty
with a man so ugly called Chris Whitty

140259 ▶▶▶▶▶ adele, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 27, #53 of 1915 🔗

There once was a man named Chris Whitty,
Whose advice was terribly shitty,
With a shake of his head,
Lock ’em all down he said,
We ignored him, oh well, what a pity.

140286 ▶▶▶▶▶ Strange Days, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 18, #54 of 1915 🔗

Will you accept a clerihew?

Chris Whitty
Forbids proximity
Don’t ask
Wear a mask

141970 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to Strange Days, #55 of 1915 🔗

Excellent!

142086 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to OKUK, #56 of 1915 🔗

140364 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 6, #57 of 1915 🔗

A ditty about Whitty

There was a young lad called Whitty
All his friends thought he was a titty
they put poo on his chair, gum in his hair
so he burned the school down one night in a jiffy

140501 ▶▶▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #58 of 1915 🔗

That’s a shitty pity

140521 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 9, #59 of 1915 🔗

Whitty doesn’t rhyme with bastard, more’s the pity.

141035 ▶▶▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 2, #60 of 1915 🔗

The twat Chris Whitty
And the rest of the of the SAGE committee
Are supremely incompetent
Yet they won’t repent
For ruining sociality.

141065 ▶▶▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #61 of 1915 🔗

Chris Whitty
Is known for mendacity
And by being shortsighted
Lives have been blighted
And he has ruined the city

141789 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #62 of 1915 🔗

Shitty …..
Not Pretty

142084 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #63 of 1915 🔗

Lol
Pity

142083 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to OKUK, #64 of 1915 🔗

You’d know…

140519 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to OKUK, 2, #65 of 1915 🔗

I thought only Johnson and Hancock agreed fully with Whitty, apart from Bill Gates, of course.

140312 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to hotrod, 9, #66 of 1915 🔗

Whenever anyone interviews Whitty they need to ask what he meant by this comment on the 21st July 2020 in the DHSC Committee hearing:

“If you look at the R, and the behaviours, quite a lot of the change that led to the R going below one occurred well before, or to some extent before, the 23rd, when the full lockdown started.”

When he can explain that coherently he can then explain why the big change in his stance in the last 6 weeks. To me he looks lies he’s runnings acred of being found out.

Apart from being mentioned by Toby once on here and then on a Hector Drummond twitter feed it has not been in the MSM once, anywhere.

My letters to HanJobs, nugget DePeffle, waste of space Hunt “social distancing is law” committee chair et al have been ignored.

140185 OKUK, replying to OKUK, 78, #67 of 1915 🔗

I was very cheered by Henegan going on the offensive. I was going to say I have never been so ashamed of or saddened for my country before now. But there is still that small flame of hope when we have people like him around.

But I come back to my oft-stated position. The political elite have totally failed us. We need a new dispensation: a political party that we can vote for that will dismantle the Lockdown Lunacy and the Mask Madness, that will stand for free speech rights because it knows why they are so important and which will pursue the interests of UK citizens, not Russian oligarchs (Osborne), Saudi dictators (Hammond), globalist billionaires (Blair and many others) – a party that will defund the BBC, take on the Marxist mafia that is holding captive academia, and beat back the Calibans at our door.

140235 ▶▶ William Purle, replying to OKUK, 18, #68 of 1915 🔗

How about ‘The Restoration Party’?

‘For the restoration of liberty, sanity and normality’

140271 ▶▶▶ Rabbit, replying to William Purle, 6, #69 of 1915 🔗

I am not a member so it’s not a shameless plug as I have only had a brief read of their policies, but the SDP appear to be against lockdowns. Someone posted this the other week as well.

140482 ▶▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Rabbit, #70 of 1915 🔗
141975 ▶▶▶▶▶ OKUK, replying to mattghg, #71 of 1915 🔗

Libertarianism has little to do with liberty.

141982 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to OKUK, #72 of 1915 🔗

It’s cute that you think that.

140274 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to OKUK, 6, #73 of 1915 🔗

opposition is also noted the Lady Hale essay and Sir Graham Brady’s intervention.

140443 ▶▶ Jeremy Enns, replying to OKUK, 7, #74 of 1915 🔗

I agree with you, but one thing should be added to your list: prosecution of the decision-makers. Even if this is nothing more than a royal cockup, with those in power now guided by self-delusion, it is no excuse! Decision-makers must be held to a higher standard and their gross incompetence and negligence has already caused great, irreparable harm. It should not go unanswered.

140742 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Jeremy Enns, 4, #75 of 1915 🔗

This pandemic is clearly a long time planned event and it is heavily imbued with criminal intention. It has already cost the UK many thousands of lives and prosecution is absolutely vital.

140816 ▶▶▶ jakehadlee, replying to Jeremy Enns, 5, #76 of 1915 🔗

Absolutely – the failures are now so stark, and the consequences so serious, that there has to be legal accountability for it. Both those who created the failed models, and those who ignored the science, need to be prosecuted. I would include the press in this, but there’s not much we can do there other than punish the BBC, who unfortunately for them are the only ones we have the power to take it out on. Which we should.

With the growing evidence of the impact on the world’s poor, I don’t think it’s hyperbole to start looking at what has happened in the same way we would a war crime. It might have been by incompetence rather than design but the lives lost due to lockdown will be greater than anything we did in our equally bungled and ill-informed interferences in the Middle East.

140598 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to OKUK, 5, #77 of 1915 🔗

We need a party in favour of liberal democracy, unfortunately, despite their name, the LibDems doesn’t seem in favour of either. An new Liberal party perhaps?

140188 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 84, #78 of 1915 🔗

“I Had Been in Active Labour for Eight Hours on My Own.”

Guys… look, i know you are VERY protective of the NHS, but fuck me… time to wake up. The NHS is a shitshow. Has been for years. “But it’s free” no longer cuts it. There’s many other better health systems on the planet. Do something about it.

140194 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 29, #79 of 1915 🔗

Unfortunately telling the British that is like telling the Aztecs that human sacrifice doesn’t prevent the gods of night from destroying the day.

140232 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 33, #80 of 1915 🔗

Agree. The National Health Service has been exposed as the No Health Service, No Hope Service and the No Help Service. The likes of France, Sweden, Switzerland have far superior health services, why can’t we learn from them?

Unfortunately, the British for some reason are unable to wake up with regards to this New State Religion. Time for another Martin Luther to step out of the wings and tell a few home truths.

140290 ▶▶▶ Simon Dutton, replying to Bart Simpson, 13, #81 of 1915 🔗

Mind you, the other state religion used to be the BBC, and look what’s happening to them.

141714 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Simon Dutton, #82 of 1915 🔗

Indeed. People are heeding the call to Defund the BBC in droves that even the Beeb are running scared.

141811 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, #83 of 1915 🔗

Don’t forget one of de Piffle’s election campaign slogans was that the NHS is not for sale – even though it was blatantly being systematically dismantled, just like the Post Office.

140336 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 27, #84 of 1915 🔗

Have to agree with this..My best friend works for the NHS (one of the BIG hospitals in London) and he has been telling me that the whole system is rotten to the Doctors at the moment are lounging around, lunches on expenses, a little renovation work (curtain replacement in the pool)that would cost 200 Pounds is 4000 Pounds because hey, money is not an object in the NHS, nurses crying because their cancer patients have stopped checking in ?( probaly dead) , COVID put on every dead certificate as a rule, because why not? He is a true believer but in his words people are losing the will to live in there. So why are we surprised by the stories like the one above? It needs to die and something else needs to be put in place.

140389 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 5, #85 of 1915 🔗

Previous to lockdown, we have had 3 drains on resources (sorry children) all in NHS midwife lead, birthing suites etc.. and had nothing but praise for the service we received. Some trust are without doubt better than others and post code lottery also plays a part. But i agree there needs to be some radical changes to s disjointed system at best.

One area our trusts don’t seem to be good at is mental health, where as my friend who is bi polar and lives down south has had a much better response to his mental health before lockdown.

140422 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to wayno, 11, #86 of 1915 🔗

A mental health worker told me that lockdown had a serious negative effect on many of his existing patients and that he has no hope of dealing with a new caseload of people who have developed problems because of lockdown.

140444 ▶▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to wayno, 8, #87 of 1915 🔗

The question is, though: What are you comparing your NHS experience to? Have you been through the same things in a different country whilst being a resident and registered with the health system?
I know it’s all anecdotal, but my girlfriend’s mother works as a neonatal nurse in Romania. When she was told about how the NHS handles an expectant mother, through to birth, and to postnatal care, she was shocked. Some of the things considered standard by the nurses here would be grounds for malpraxis in Romania. Unfortunately, as with most things medical, it’s never obvious to us commoners, so i can’t even begin to tell you what the issues were, other than to say that it consists of a general lack of care towards the patient.
Either way, i invite you all to ask immigrants about their opinion of the NHS if the topic ever comes up in conversation. You’ll be surprised.

140469 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 8, #88 of 1915 🔗

You are so right. The care that pregnant women receive from the NHS is shocking. Lots of babies born with brain damage (oxygen deprivation) or die. Very 3rd world. Don’t accept these low standards just because you were told it is free, It is no free as we are all paying for it in taxes

140407 ▶▶ redbirdpete, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 6, #89 of 1915 🔗

To be fair, the paramedics and A+E (providing you are brought in from an RTA or similar) are bloody amazing. My GP is pretty good too. But overall, it’s a shambles.

140467 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to redbirdpete, -4, #90 of 1915 🔗

Well you should all be happy soon. Because I think there will be no NHS for anyone very soon. Try complaining when we are left with nothing.

Incidentally, I have had excellent care on the NHS. The last thing we want is an American style healthcare system.

140673 ▶▶▶▶ Judith Day, replying to Kate, 8, #91 of 1915 🔗

Many of us ‘ are left with nothing’ at the moment and have been since March.
A telephone consultation with a GP who then passes you on to a telephone consultation with a consultant is not ‘excellent care’!

I am now going into debt in order to pay for the private medical help that I should be receiving from the NHS.

140700 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Judith Day, 5, #92 of 1915 🔗

Yes. For the first time ever, I had to go private last year for a very painful and potentially dangerous hernia. I had been advised, that there would be a 35 week wait for it to be repaired on the NHS. No doubt today, the waiting period would be indefinite.

140680 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Kate, 5, #93 of 1915 🔗

Why people are marking you down seems very strange. The NHS is actually being dismantled as you suggest.

140879 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Rowan, 5, #94 of 1915 🔗

Well, this is a “right wing” site, whatever that means nowadays.
My sympathies are on the traditional left. Still I value diversity of views.

140965 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Kate, 1, #95 of 1915 🔗

I’m mystified by it as well as I said above. Perhaps someone will explain.

140962 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Kate, 4, #96 of 1915 🔗

Kate, I don’t understand the downvotes on your comment. I can agree with three things you’ve said:

  1. I agree there’ll be no NHS for anyone soon. There may not be an NHS now, except in very limited situations.
  2. I, too, have had excellent care on the NHS, although it was from 5 to 13 years ago, so things probably have changed since then.
  3. The last thing we want is an American-style healthcare system. I am American and I can assure you that is the last thing anyone should want. I had multiple experiences verging on malpractice and had the “pleasure” of paying for them. Employers avoid hiring full-time employees because they have to provide them with health cover. It is a great system for insurance companies.

So I’m not sure why you were downvoted so heavily. Perhaps anyone who decides to downvote me can explain.

141374 ▶▶▶▶ Bumble, replying to Kate, 3, #97 of 1915 🔗

Why, when discussing the future of the NHS, do people always refer to the American healthcare system ? I would bin the NHS tomorrow in favour of an insurance based system as found in france, germany, italy all of which have better outcomes than us for things like cancer.

141728 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Kate, 2, #98 of 1915 🔗

Why is it that America is always used as a stick to beat those who point out the problems with the NHS?

Is America the only other country in the world?

There are other countries who have better health systems than the UK, why can’t we learn from them?

140189 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 28, #99 of 1915 🔗

Wore a face nappy for the first time on Saturday.

I really enjoyed the experience. Didn’t even try the exempt stuff

It was on the flight out

In my mind I likened myself to the people who produced their identity documents to the Gestapo on the railway platforms of 1930’s Germany

The goons thought we were complying, in reality we were escaping

The OH and I have escaped the brutal pig dictator

140197 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Cecil B, 5, #100 of 1915 🔗

Where to?

140190 Allen, replying to Allen, 40, #101 of 1915 🔗

Hopefully more people are waking up to the fact that Covid ™ is not an epidemiological event it is a business model. Quite similar in many ways to The War on Terror™. Both manufactured events that are meant to increase the portfoli’s of the super- wealthy.

It is vitally important to understand that public health policy has been harnessed to global markets. Instead of serving those at risk of sickness and death, these policies of financialization are constructed to benefit investors.

Manufactured pandemics create new investment products that increase the holdings of billionaires and further concentrate their wealth.

The WHO, CDC, NHS etc are merely conduits for these investors who channel their investments through the likes of the Gates Foundations e.g. The return on these investments is staggering.

This is not going away unless and until we make it go away. All of the politicians that are “deciding” these things are spokespeople for these investors.

Global public health (and education) has become a plaything of financiers.

140201 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Allen, 2, #102 of 1915 🔗

Know anything about WHO issuing Pandemic Bonds in 2017, due for repayment
(?) this year ?

140350 ▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to karenovirus, 6, #103 of 1915 🔗

It was the World Bank

Washington, DC, June 28, 2017 – The World Bank (International Bank for Reconstruction and Development) today launched specialized bonds aimed at providing financial support to the Pandemic Emergency Financing Facility (PEF), a facility created by the World Bank to channel surge funding to developing countries facing the risk of a pandemic.

140356 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #104 of 1915 🔗

Thank you, I saw it mentioned elsewhere, so is that where the money came from to pay the third world to go into lockdown?

140710 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to karenovirus, #105 of 1915 🔗

I know only what I read in the linked-to press release.

140211 ▶▶ Jon G, replying to Allen, 15, #106 of 1915 🔗

Viral pandemics are as old as the hills. As are abuses of power, exploitation and lying to the masses.
I may lament the response but this is a completely normal natural event. It would be notable if we didn’t have the odd viral pandemic.

140474 ▶▶ nightspore, replying to Allen, 1, #107 of 1915 🔗

Let me suggest another kind of ‘conspiracy theory’. (For one thing, I think people tend to put too much stock in the financial angle. I also think that Seedhouse’s “cognitive bias” explanation (presented in a 19 Sept post) is probably naive; for one thing these people aren’t <i>that</i> stupid, and they must have <i>some</i> knowledgeable advisors.) The nonsense we’re seeing may have to do with the November elections in the U.S.

Why? Well, for one thing, the political elite and portions of the intellectual elite are quite aware of the growing populist revolt in the West and in other parts of the world (e.g. Brazil). They’re repelled by it, and at the same time they’re deathly afraid of it. In the words of (I think) a Facebook manager, they want to make sure it really is an historical blip. And since the keystone right now is the presidency of Donald Trump, that’s the stone they have to dislodge.

If the pandemic fantasy can be maintained for a few weeks longer that supports things like mail-in balloting as well as keeping people fearful (and away from the polls?). But it won’t be as easy to maintain this in the US if the rest of the world is going back to normal. So the idea may be to keep it up – maintain the facade – elsewhere as well. Incidentally, there’s no need for a conscious conspiracy – these people are all on the same page, they’re all up to date on what everyone else is doing, and that should be enough for collective action.

141014 ▶▶▶ nightspore, replying to nightspore, #108 of 1915 🔗

I want to add some glosses to my original remarks.

1) Not only does there not have to be a consciously coordinated conspiracy, these people don’t even have to be fully conscious of what they’re doing. (That’s problem with ordinary conspiracy theories – they always assume conscious intent.)

Ultimately, I suspect that what we’re seeing is an instance of tribal defense. The problem stems from the fact that the political and intellectual elite have become a separate tribe within the nation state (for the UK cf. Peter Oborne’s The Triumph of the Political Class). This would account for their “political lying” (H/T again to Oborn); they’re willing to lie to people outside the tribe. It would also account for the brazenness and recklessness with which they’re pushing the theme of a covid crisis (as well as sister events like the “climate crisis”, the Trump-Russia collusion, etc.).

2) How does Boris fit into all of this? I think the best explanation is that at present he’s thoroughly bamboozled. He’s surrounded by all these types, plus he has a lot in common with them, plus he had a very bad experience with the virus that undoubtedly still has him spooked . So at present he’s inside their bubble. But can he be awakened from this enchantment? (That might make for an interesting situation.)

141041 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to nightspore, 2, #109 of 1915 🔗

Boris is the main problem and he will not be part of the solution.

141822 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to nightspore, 2, #110 of 1915 🔗

I can’t agree. They’ve forecast what they were going to do throughout. For example, we’ve known for weeks that they intended a lockdown for October.
This has all been meticulously planned and is being driven by the Behavioural Insights Team.

140481 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Allen, 3, #111 of 1915 🔗

Absolutely correct. People do not understand just what the developments in control, communication, finance and technology over the last thirty years have allowed the elite to do. The nation state is irrelevant, so write to your MP all you like, they can do nothing.

They are constructing a world that is inconceivable to most people. This is why we may respond too late – they have powers we have never even heard of.

141178 ▶▶▶ Basileus, replying to Kate, #112 of 1915 🔗

So what will you do?

140717 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to Allen, 2, #113 of 1915 🔗

The plandemic is a nice little earner and is also a lead in to the Great Reset. The brave new green world of the Great Reset will have nothing to do with the massively populated planet that we have today. We are moving into very strange times.

140191 ColoradoGirl, replying to ColoradoGirl, 104, #114 of 1915 🔗

I have been a violinist in the Colorado Springs Philharmonic for thirty years. Today we received the horrible news that management cannot honor the musicians’ contracts. I suspect bankruptcy is not far behind. This is an orchestra that has been thriving and playing to sold out audiences for the last five years. For Beethoven’s birthday we were going to perform all of the symphonies in the course of two weeks. All gone. It’s just loss upon loss. We thought losing statues was bad. Losing the ability to perform and hear symphonic music is incalculable.

140199 ▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to ColoradoGirl, 35, #115 of 1915 🔗

I am so sorry. Live music feeds the soul, but these regimes seem to want to destroy everything that gives life meaning. It’s criminal.

140207 ▶▶ annie, replying to ColoradoGirl, 9, #116 of 1915 🔗

The.V pandals have landed.
Too sorry for words.
God protect you and your colleagues.

140233 ▶▶ Emily Tock, replying to ColoradoGirl, 28, #117 of 1915 🔗

I so feel for you and the other Colorado Springs Phil musicians. I am an amateur flutist and have been playing with the university orchestra while working on my PhD; it looks like our orchestra society will become another victim. Some fellow musicians and I have formed a small chamber group in protest. We are currently rehearsing in my home, which might well become a crime in the near future.

140236 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Emily Tock, 12, #118 of 1915 🔗

Go for it. Preserving our common musical heritage will be down to the likes of your lot.

All the best!

140243 ▶▶▶ Shep, replying to Emily Tock, 9, #119 of 1915 🔗

Please can you record the rehearsals;- might be a great you tube channel.

142111 ▶▶▶ ColoradoGirl, replying to Emily Tock, #120 of 1915 🔗

That’s wonderful that you’re playing with friends! As for me, I only know one musician who’s not deathly afraid. Skeptical musicians are a very rare breed!

140234 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to ColoradoGirl, 12, #121 of 1915 🔗

Very sorry to hear this.

The barbarians have breached the gates and what they’re doing to our way of life and what gives our life meaning is criminal.

Stay strong.

141053 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Bart Simpson, -10, #122 of 1915 🔗

Margaret Thatcher would be proud of what’s going on.

140284 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to ColoradoGirl, 5, #123 of 1915 🔗

Terrible news. I love live orchestral music. I am so sorry.

140292 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to ColoradoGirl, 9, #124 of 1915 🔗

So sorry to hear this, my musical tastes are quite different but the loss of live music of any style leaves us all poorer.

140403 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Strange Days, 15, #125 of 1915 🔗

Live music is what I miss the most right now. Incredible IT’S GONE. Everywhere.
Absolute evil.

140298 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to ColoradoGirl, 7, #126 of 1915 🔗

Very sorry to hear this. My local orchestra, BSO, has gone to huge lengths to put on an autumn season, starting next week with Beethoven’s 7th. I fear that another lockdown will put paid to the rest of the concerts. I hope there is some way that your orchestra can be reformed in the future and that you will be ok financially.

140305 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to ColoradoGirl, 14, #127 of 1915 🔗

Devastating news.Did anyone stop all performances during Asiatic flu or Hong Kong flu? They might be sometimes cancelled if many of the orchestra was sick with flu but 6mths after the peak having closed all performances of art? This is the death sentence for performing arts and the Media Dictators want us all just to watch in media streaming to the homes.

140330 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to swedenborg, 9, #128 of 1915 🔗

The Woodstock Festival was held in the middle of the Hong Kong flu.

141024 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to karenovirus, 3, #129 of 1915 🔗

And contact tracing was a bitch!

141058 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to ConstantBees, 3, #130 of 1915 🔗

There was an awful lot of contact and very little tracing.

141056 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to swedenborg, #131 of 1915 🔗

It’s a death sentence all round and it won’t be death by coronavirus.

140360 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to ColoradoGirl, 2, #132 of 1915 🔗

We have a music school affiliated to a university that has yet to reopen.

140511 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to karenovirus, 15, #133 of 1915 🔗

I offered to help a local arts group which puts on wonderful classical and jazz concerts very cheaply.
Since the first lockdown they are trying to restart.

I was horrified to receive e-mails from them explaining the new system to keep the audience “safe” All fully masked, one way systems through the church, door wardens to direct people to their seats safely, and social distancing and masks worn in the audience. You must book ahead online whereas before you could just walk in..

They are lamenting that only fifteen bookings have been received. How can they wonder at this?

I do not want to be part of this “safety” regime. How can I treat other people as if they are contaminated and in imminent danger?
The whole thing is dystopian.

141066 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Kate, 4, #134 of 1915 🔗

Yes its dystopian and intentionally so. The old life is in the process of being totally dismantled and it won’t be coming back without one hell of a fight.

142112 ▶▶▶▶ ColoradoGirl, replying to Kate, #135 of 1915 🔗

Agreed! The dystopian atmosphere takes away all the joy.

140406 ▶▶ Monty Greene, replying to ColoradoGirl, 3, #136 of 1915 🔗

I’m so sorry to hear that.

In Britain, some identitarian race-baiters expressed their desire to remove a bust of Beethoven from the British Library as it was a symbol of colonialism.

141047 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to ColoradoGirl, 1, #137 of 1915 🔗

Where Colorado Springs goes many more will follow.

141826 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to ColoradoGirl, 1, #138 of 1915 🔗

Systematic dehumanisation!

141983 ▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to ColoradoGirl, #139 of 1915 🔗

It gives me no pleasure to give the 100th tick. I’ve gone all Mahler.

140193 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 30, #140 of 1915 🔗

I went to the big Weatherspoons for breakfast yesterday, to gain access I was obliged to go behind waist high metal barriers zigzaging their way through the carpark to the front door. This made me feel uncomfortable until I realised what it reminded me of.

I grew up in a small north midlands market town. The centre of the town was dominated by a huge cattle market (plus sheep, pigs goats etc). We walked through this to get to school, all the animals were penned in with what were then head height metal barriers, need I say more ?

140208 ▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 15, #141 of 1915 🔗

Only ‘baa’.

140358 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to karenovirus, 8, #142 of 1915 🔗

We are seen now as nothing more than livestock, herded, registered, tagged, rounded up, and muzzled. Notice when they take your temperature from your forehead (not that I’ve allowed anyone to do that to me) it’s like having a stun gun pointed at you. Now they want to spray us with Christ knows what. Won’t be long until we’re branded. Did you see the pens people were put in to see a live OUTDOOR music show? But hey, as long as I’m SAFE!

140369 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to HelenaHancart, 3, #143 of 1915 🔗

There was a printed notice in each of the zig and zag pens
“Only six persons in this area”.

The door monitor was not satisfied with the offer of my (redundant) email, wanted me to use the QR (?) thingey with my android, told him no and left.

140435 ▶▶▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to karenovirus, 5, #144 of 1915 🔗

Good for you! If they treat potential customers like shite in the name of Covid, and are not prepared to fight for their own survival, they don’t deserve their business. Anywhere that demands you give your details gets wide berth from me. I’m not complying with new bloody abnormal to have a “normal” life. I had a good life before but that’s over so now I’m seeking out new ways to enjoy life and be as free, mentally and physically, as I can.

140690 ▶▶▶▶▶ Judith Day, replying to HelenaHancart, 3, #145 of 1915 🔗

I’m the same HH. I am not giving my details in order to dump rubbish at the local tip, or go to a restaurant.

141028 ▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to HelenaHancart, 3, #146 of 1915 🔗

Exactly. They’re driving us to do different things, or to concentrate on things we already love that have not been swept away in the madness. I go to my allotment every single day since working with plants means I am around sensible creatures for a couple of hours.

140781 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to HelenaHancart, 1, #147 of 1915 🔗

And then there’s the fast tracked and liability free vaccine hurtling towards us.

140200 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Tom Blackburn, #149 of 1915 🔗

I don’t do Twitter so can’t access, what are the results thus far ?

140204 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to karenovirus, 5, #150 of 1915 🔗

28 – yes
72 – no

140216 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #151 of 1915 🔗

That’s quit impressive for the Twittersewer.

140683 ▶▶▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to annie, #152 of 1915 🔗

There are many anti lockdown and anti new normal people on Twitter.

140454 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to karenovirus, #153 of 1915 🔗

I don’t have Twitter but I can open the specific links and read (but not comment)

140761 ▶▶ GLT, replying to Tom Blackburn, #154 of 1915 🔗

Like many others, I joined Twitter in April and I hope that it can be made more representative. Whether we like it or not, it plays a huge part in news gathering and politics.

140198 mattghg, replying to mattghg, 4, #155 of 1915 🔗

How much would you pay to get Ferguson and Henegan in the same room?

140209 ▶▶ annie, replying to mattghg, 13, #156 of 1915 🔗

And Heneghan with a gun,

140240 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to annie, 3, #157 of 1915 🔗

Nah – he’s nicer than us.
Annie get your gun!

140202 Sir Patrick Vaccine, 17, #158 of 1915 🔗

SIR – A major rethink on how we battle coronavirus is urgently needed. Now, we’re far better informed, so locking us all down and destroying more lives and livelihoods are not the answer.

Even when a vaccine is found, it may not grant total immunity. In the meantime, as with every other disease, we must learn to live with it.

The most vulnerable are more than capable of deciding how to protect themselves, while the young need to get on with their lives and enjoy their youth, which passes all too quickly.

Enough of this hourly analysis, which creates an atmosphere of fear out of all proportion to the threat. Our best weapon against the virus, for now, is common sense, not over-reaction, which is devastating our country.

Richard Drax MP (Con)
London SW1

140205 2 pence, replying to 2 pence, 3, #159 of 1915 🔗

Global Covid Report
Proton Science Group in association with
Extra-Parliamentary Corona Investigation Committee (ACU)

https://online.anyflip.com/inblw/ufbs/mobile/index.html

140373 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to 2 pence, #160 of 1915 🔗

Thank you, took several screenshots of easy to use bullet points to show waverers.

140210 Geoffrey Kolbe, replying to Geoffrey Kolbe, 22, #161 of 1915 🔗

Carl Heneghan seems to be having a real media blitz – but will it have any effect at all? I fear not.
Matt Hancock, our Minister for Health, clearly does not even understand what a false positive is for a PCR test – but the TV presenters interviewing him don’t understand these basics either, so he is not revealed for the numpty he is, or his policies for being as inane as they are.

140218 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Geoffrey Kolbe, 14, #162 of 1915 🔗

The current position with uncorroborated test results being used as the sole driver for major costly public health policies and for the imposition of £10000 fines on citizens is unprecedented. The doubts over the credibility of these tests may give grounds for a legal challenge. With one questioning letter from an MP in the Telegraph it may be time to press our MPs to call for an urgent multi-disciplinary (statistics, biology, medicine, management) review of the testing system.

141099 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to Geoffrey Kolbe, 3, #163 of 1915 🔗

It’s more that Hancock is simply playing his part in the global Great Reset agenda, as of course is Boris Johnson.

Despite what’s been said above, it is clear that the government is knowingly and willingly playing an important part in a major conspiracy. Yes it’s a conspiracy alright and it’s plain for all to see, once they get over their cognitive dissonance.

None of this pandemic event is remotely happenstance or even much to do with the ephemeral Sars-cov-2 coronavirus which is little more than a convenient scapegoat.

140212 Jon G, replying to Jon G, 23, #164 of 1915 🔗

I think Triggle needs a shout out. He’s written quite a few balanced pieces over the last few months that seem to go against the general bbc line.

140238 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Jon G, 5, #165 of 1915 🔗

I agree – he has shown some guts.

140247 ▶▶ Norma McNormalface, replying to Jon G, 2, #166 of 1915 🔗

Yep. Showed his colours as a sceptic pretty early on. Or latent sceptic, anyway.

140213 annie, replying to annie, 60, #167 of 1915 🔗

Attended face-nappy church (Wales) for the first time yesterday. Mine the only visible face. Sermon delivered through a thick black rag, mumble mumble mumble.
A lady, aged about 50, approached me afterwards and asked, quite politely, if I was ‘exempt’. I said I was, She said her husband had ‘forbidden’ her to go to church unless everybody was nappied. ‘it’s so uncomfortable wearing one’, she added. I could not resist saying, in the mildest tone I could manage, that if people wanted to behave like mumbling sheep they were free to do so.
Last week’s ‘cases’ in Pembrokeshire: 1. Deaths: 0, as for many weeks past.
Population of Pembrokeshire: about 123,000 – plus visitors, whose comings and goings have had no effect in the figures.
I wonder how many will refuse to come next week if I’m there.
I shall be there.
I believe that through Jesus Christ we can overcome the fear of death and rise to the life eternal.
Evidently, nobody else in my church does.

140239 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, 25, #168 of 1915 🔗

Makes you sad when it seems like the church is simply acting as the mouthpiece of the state and not God.

The early Christians must despair at the supine and cowardly nature of the churches of today.

140241 ▶▶ Shep, replying to annie, #169 of 1915 🔗

Hypocrisy

140248 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to annie, 7, #170 of 1915 🔗

Aren’t preachers exempt from the mask edict? Ours doesn’t wear one while preaching and, I think, implied that they’re only going through the rigmarole because they’re being forced to.

140343 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to mattghg, 2, #171 of 1915 🔗

Those leading worship do not have to wear masks, it is in the legislation. Some seem to do anyway ‘you can never be too careful’…
I wore a mask in Tesco this morning, I suspect with the nonsense non-compliers will be demonised even more soon. Glasses steamed up, couldn’t read labels. Decidedly breathless, and of course when taken off outside totally tangled with hearing aids. I hate to think what Whitty and crowd are going to say this morning but it doesn’t look good.

140384 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to davews, #172 of 1915 🔗

I saw a full C of E wedding taking place in the grounds of our 14th century church, the Vicar wore a black mask.

141087 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to davews, #173 of 1915 🔗

I’m sorry you didn’t feel up to your convictions today. I rode the bus maskless today, as usual, and will continue to do so. If they change the “law” to force masks on the bus, I will go back to riding my bike to my allotment.

But perhaps your circumstances don’t allow you to be as firm as I have been. And, of course, I’m trapped, as is everyone, if they force us all to wear masks outside. But then there’s no reason to go to my allotment anymore at that point.

140268 ▶▶ Ajb, replying to annie, 5, #174 of 1915 🔗

So glad you went, and so glad in the church here at least the preacher doesn’t need a mask during the service. I suspect there is a fair amount of mask scepticism in the congregation, but it may be a price they’re willing to pay for gathering to worship – the compulsory risk assessments to allow you to open the building are pretty fierce! And who knows, maybe your presence without a mask will encourage other exempt people to feel welcome.

140353 ▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to annie, 8, #175 of 1915 🔗

Pray for your ministers.
They have the full spectrum of opinion thrown their way from:
This is the Mark of the Beast and you’re a heretic for telling people to wear masks.

to

The Bible tells us to submit to authorities so you should tell the people that are claiming “exemptions” that they are going against God.

Our church is taking a light touch with all of this but our minister had to remind people that the law allowed for exemptions and there are things going on in people’s lives that you might not know about.

Many ministers are at breaking point – as are other people in every walk of life.
Our minister got pretty close to a nervous breakdown, I think.

140414 ▶▶▶ Athanasius, replying to Ed Phillips, 2, #176 of 1915 🔗

All very true! Our church is maybe 95% sceptic, including the priests, but the pressure from various external forces is unreal at times, which not all the sceptical congregation fully appreciates.

140380 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to annie, 1, #177 of 1915 🔗

My sympathy even though a lapsed CofE.
Presumably all the associated community activities, Sunday School, Scouts, Choir Practise and the like are suspended indefinitely ?

141068 ▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to annie, 2, #178 of 1915 🔗

They are fine about me (and another lady)being exempt from masks at my church and the vicar takes hers off to preach as do those reading or singing. Church is still enjoyable but it was obvious yesterday they are all terrified with little faith.

141080 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to annie, #179 of 1915 🔗

I walk through a churchyard every day on the way to my allotment. Yesterday, the masked were queuing to attend a service. As an atheist, I did have to wonder what good the Christian God is if he cannot provide any kind of protection, physical or mental, against the virus.

140217 Biker, replying to Biker, 8, #180 of 1915 🔗

What’s this nonsense from the Scottish university? Firstly Sturgeon isn’t popular like they claim and then they slag of people who don’t buy the idea that there isn’t some kind of sinister plot to destroy our society. Is the whole of Academia utter braindead? I think so.

140291 ▶▶ kf99, replying to Biker, 4, #181 of 1915 🔗

At long last people making the point (a very obvious one) that a theoretical yes vote leads not to a nice cosy country of Scotland, but to partition.

The people’s republic of Caledonia might be just be an enclave. A McGaza. No part of Scotland can be taken out of the UK against its will. They might not even get to call their new paradise Scotland, if they have less than half the territory.

140219 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #182 of 1915 🔗

One of the scare tactics being used is that Covid 19 hospital cases and deaths are rising. Tricky one this as it seems many illnesses and deaths are being rebranded as Covid! But anyway,for what it’s worth, we do now seem to be getting data on hospital covid cases/deaths but meanwhile we hear reports of under used hospitals, do we know of any data on total hospital capacity and current usage?

140342 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Steve Martindale, #183 of 1915 🔗

Locally the main hospital is doing some backlog work and newly diagnosed patients.
The Nightingale is supposed to be helping to clear the backlog but is only 25% utilized.

140220 sceptickat, replying to sceptickat, 10, #184 of 1915 🔗

More common sense from the BBC today which is heartening: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54228649

140223 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to sceptickat, 6, #185 of 1915 🔗

Great link, thank you, much as we deride the BBC, when they put out something like this it is a link I feel I can share round family and friends, whereas links to other media articles tend to get dismissed as extremist.

140226 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Steve Martindale, 12, #186 of 1915 🔗

The Beeb, wow..
Wonder if they scent that the all-going-to-die approach is played out and it’s time to start shifting their stance if they want to end up on the winning side?
One can but hope.

140228 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to annie, 8, #187 of 1915 🔗

I think as well the Defund the BBC campaign has picked up more steam and has rattled their cage. Ditto the Last Night of the Proms fiasco which exposed to all and sundry how the Beeb holds the nation in contempt.

140250 ▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #188 of 1915 🔗

and the thought of getting Charles Moore in charge.. they are sh*tting their pants

140258 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to mjr, 5, #189 of 1915 🔗

As well as the furore over the grotesque salaries of the likes of Zoe Ball and Gary Lineker. At a time when many people don’t know if they have jobs to return to and are tightening their belts, the BBC’s pay of their presenters and newsreaders are a slap to the face of Joe & Jane Public.

140231 ▶▶▶▶ Albie, replying to annie, 11, #190 of 1915 🔗

The BBC have relegated Covid from being the main news item on its site for almost 24 hours now. Very odd.

140246 ▶▶▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Albie, 1, #191 of 1915 🔗

I noticed that too. I’ve no idea when the last time that was.

140396 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Albie, #192 of 1915 🔗

Local Live (mirror group news) is also devoid of Covid today except for the lead item telling us the county is among those with the fewest ‘cases’.

140267 ▶▶▶▶ Mark H, replying to annie, 2, #193 of 1915 🔗

The BBC has periodically run pieces like this over the last 5 months, including a few from Triggle (that I’ve got saved, including full screen shots of the entire articles). The front page of the Scottish BBC news website barely has a mention of CV19 nor of Sturgeon’s proclamations of doom from last week. Instead the lead article is on the deaths of some asylum seekers in Glasgow.

140264 ▶▶▶ Marie R, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #194 of 1915 🔗

I totally agree, my best link has been the 50,000 deaths winter 2017-18
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-46399090
which is permanently up on my phone. We should all send this Nick Triggle article to our MP’S? I’m going to send to the Today programme, world at one, PM etc

140224 JME, replying to JME, 26, #195 of 1915 🔗

Just read in The Telegraph that the spread of the virus is all our fault, we’re at the last chance saloon & unless we comply totally with the governments crazy, non-evidence based measures we are going to pay the price.
Unfortunately viruses spread & no-one in history has ever prevented this from happening.
It’s insane & unbelievably depressing!

140227 ▶▶ annie, replying to JME, 8, #196 of 1915 🔗

Ignore it. Go read the letter from Richard Drax.

140230 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to annie, 38, #197 of 1915 🔗

PS.It’s a crude psy-op. If the figures get worse, it’s our fault for not complying. If the figures get better, it’s to their credit for bullying us. They win either way.
They think.
I don’t. Their chickens will come home to roost. Just you wait.

140242 ▶▶▶▶ Geoffrey Kolbe, replying to annie, 7, #198 of 1915 🔗

It is also a method of maintaining a good career trajectory for epidemiologists and committee-men like Whitty and Valance. Look at Professor Neil Ferguson whose career has done – and no doubt will continue to do – wonderfully well on the basis of predicting the worst possible outcome for now five (I think) pandemics. That these pandemics did not meet his full expectations was no doubt a matter of some disappointment to Neil Ferguson, but he could console his critics that this was due to the Government following his advice in a timely manner.
Consider, on the other hand, the effect on a career due to predictions that fall short of what actually happens. How people needlessly died because your model was wrong. No prognosticator could recover from even one bad result of that sort.
Boris really needs to see the advice from Whitty and Vallance in that light…

140249 ▶▶▶▶ JME, replying to annie, 3, #199 of 1915 🔗

Thanks Annie ~ I admire your optimism and sincerely hope you are right!
I agree about the psy-ops but it’s been going on throughout this & seems to have succeeded with the vast majority of people.
I had seen the Drax letter (& there do seem to be an increasing number of Tory MPs speaking out now) but I’m not sure, in the absence of any true opposition from Labour, there are enough sceptics in Parliament to halt this madness.

140237 Kevin 2, 11, #200 of 1915 🔗

It’s official. DIY is now causing more deaths than Sars-Cov-2.
The Society for the Elimination of Risk needs to swing into action immediately.

Here’s Reg:-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MU2BO5Obg2k&ab_channel=JayFee

140245 Nessimmersion, replying to Nessimmersion, 46, #201 of 1915 🔗

Spike

140257 ▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Nessimmersion, 2, #202 of 1915 🔗

Ha!

140260 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Nessimmersion, 1, #203 of 1915 🔗

🤣 🤣 🤣

140251 Mark H, replying to Mark H, 9, #204 of 1915 🔗

I hope Heneghan has a good security team.

140269 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Mark H, 3, #205 of 1915 🔗

I was thinking the same. He needs close protection.

140426 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Mark H, 1, #206 of 1915 🔗

He needs to make sure he doesn’t have any sports bags lying around at home.

141235 ▶▶ Ed Turnbull, replying to Mark H, #207 of 1915 🔗

He should avoid going for a walk in the woods.

140253 Bart Simpson, 8, #208 of 1915 🔗

With Wancock’s latest threats, one hopes that the hospitality, retail, museums & heritage and culture sectors will now make a stand and say NO!

Am still waiting…….

Do they secretly want to go bust?

If Wancock gets his way and they indeed go bust taking down their workers with them they will have no one but themselves to blame.

140254 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #209 of 1915 🔗

Graham Brady on Talk Radio in next 15 minutes. Hope this will be an encouraging interview….

140256 ▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #210 of 1915 🔗

Cor I’m looking forward to that!

In the meantime you could listen to old gits moaning about the lockdown here too:

https://therealnormalpodcast.buzzsprout.com/

140262 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 2, #211 of 1915 🔗

Loving these podcasts, Lord R. Thanks for the work you put in!

140266 ▶▶▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #212 of 1915 🔗

No worries Charlie! Glad you enjoy them mate. Recorded another one at the pub yesterday…but the sound was shit and Don was on the p*ss with some mates so re-recording tonight.

140273 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Lord Rickmansworth, 2, #213 of 1915 🔗

Have been enjoying your podcasts and well done for the shoutout Toby gave it!

140293 ▶▶▶▶ THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #214 of 1915 🔗

Yeah I literally spit my cornflakes out all over some old lady in the Covid testing queue when I saw that! 😂

140255 PepperAngus, 1, #215 of 1915 🔗

With respect to Mike Yeardon’s false positive rate piece, I’ve been telling everyone who’ll listen since May not to put much faith in “Pillar 2”.

Pillar 2 was, and probably still is, staffed hastily by postgraduates and various university kids without a day’s experience of clinical diagnostic work between them, running borrowed equipment in borrowed premises. No, or little, professional registration, unlike the Pillar 1 experienced scientists, although I suspect with a few decent industry people thrown in to supervise. It always was a shambles.

I’m not really convinced by Dr Yeardon’s false positive rate numbers, and as far as I’m aware the Pillar 2 protocol is essentially the same as Pillar 1. I completely agree in principle that false positives are a significant portion of cases now.

Although another thing worth understanding is that the PCR protocols in Pillar 1 were never standardised throughout the country.

140261 Mark H, replying to Mark H, 5, #216 of 1915 🔗

For reasons I won’t go into here, I was in the position recently of having to wear a face mask and comply with all of the little rules and regulations around keeping other people safe.

I had to force a switch to flick in my mind and conditioned myself to act and perform as a true believer.

I put the mask on and stood on the little markers on the ground.

I wore the mask at all times as soon as I was in an indoor public area. For example, I wore the mask as soon as I stepped foot inside the Whetherspoons, right before I dutifully sanitised my hands. I wore it as I walked to my table. I wore it seated at the table when I was waiting for my food to be delivered (per the rules: it can only be removed when eating and drinking). I wore it walking along the street as I had to nip in and out of various shops, I didn’t want to continually handle it.

I felt virtuous. I felt morally superior. I felt I was doing my part.

The mask I wore wasn’t one of those cheap paper disposable ones, but rather a decent 4-ply mask that’s washable.

No, I couldn’t breathe properly. Yes, I got out of breath.

But that was a small price to pay for the feeling of moral superiority, and the gentle pat on the back my subconscious gave me was all the reassurance I needed that I was helping to keep others safe. My pre-frontal cortex didn’t need to believe that my mask made any difference whatsoever in my spreading a virus I don’t have. The smug bubble of satisfaction from the dopamine from my amygdala did all the work.

140265 ▶▶ Lord Rickmansworth, replying to Mark H, 1, #217 of 1915 🔗

Pleased for you mark!

140404 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to Mark H, 2, #218 of 1915 🔗

It’s the dopamine
That gets me high
The dopamine connects me
It’s the dopamine
I can rely
The dopamine reflects me

Iommi/Hughes/Marlette

140447 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Mark H, #219 of 1915 🔗

mmm

140288 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Sarigan, 10, #221 of 1915 🔗

Good find. That’s an excellent report from Sweden. This doctor on the ground in Sweden confirms everything that most of us have thought for a long while now. It gives the lie to the pathetic false argument now being advanced, that Sweden only got where it is by voluntarily locking themselves.

I’ll take the liberty of quoting a chunk:-

“At the point in August when I wrote that article, I hadn’t seen a single covid patient in over a month. I speculated that Sweden had developed herd immunity, since the huge and continuous drop was happening in spite of the fact that Sweden wasn’t really taking any serious measures to prevent spread of the infection.
So, how have things developed in the six weeks since that first article?
Well, as things stand now, I haven’t seen a single covid patient in the Emergency Room in over two and a half months. People have continued to become ever more relaxed in their behaviour, which is noticeable in increasing volumes in the Emergency Room. At the peak of the pandemic in April, I was seeing about half as many patients per shift as usual, probably because lots of people were afraid to go the ER for fear of catching covid. Now volumes are back to normal.
When I sit in the tube on the way to and from work, it is packed with people. Maybe one in a hundred people is choosing to wear a face mask in public. In Stockholm, life is largely back to normal. If you look at the front pages of the tabloids, on many days there isn’t a single mention of covid anywhere. As I write this (19th September 2020) the front pages of the two main tabloids have big spreads about arthritis and pensions. Apparently arthritis and pensions are currently more exciting than covid-19 in Sweden.
In spite of this relaxed attitude, the death rate has continued to drop. When I wrote the first article, I wrote that covid had killed under 6,000 people. How many people have died now, six weeks later? Actually, we’re still at under 6,000 deaths. On average, one to two people per day are dying of covid in Sweden at present, and that number continues to drop.
In the hospital where I work, there isn’t a single person currently being treated for covid. In fact, in the whole of Stockholm, a county with 2,4 million inhabitants, there are currently only 28 people being treated for covid in all the hospitals combined. At the peak, in April, that number was over 1,000. If 28 people are currently in hospital, out of 2,4 million who live in Stockholm, that means the odds of having a case of covid so severe that it requires in-hospital treatment are at the moment about one in 86,000.
Since March, the Emergency Room where I work has been divided in to a “covid” section and a “non-covid” section. Anyone with a fever, cough, or sore throat has ended up in the covid section, and we’ve been required to wear full personal protective equipment when interacting with patients in that section. Last Wednesday the hospital shut down the covid section. So few true cases of covid are coming through the Emergency Room that it no longer makes sense to have a separate section for covid.
What about the few formal restrictions that were imposed early in the pandemic? The restriction on visits to nursing homes is going to be lifted from October 1st. The older children, ages 16-19, who were engaging in distance learning during part of the spring, are now back in school, seeing each other and their teachers face to face. The Swedish public health authority has recommended that the government lift the restriction on gatherings from 50 people to 500 people.”

140674 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Kevin 2, 2, #222 of 1915 🔗

Need to send that article to Julia H-B, Peter Hitchens, Simon Dolan – the usual people 😉

By the way, the photo at the top of the article was taken on Saturday – I recognise the headlines, because I was in a supermarket then and read them myself (one is about women saying their pensions are not high enough, which as a middle-aged woman caught my eye!)

140722 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Carrie, 1, #223 of 1915 🔗

Thanks Carrie. It’s bang up to date then!
If anyone has the email address for the people you mention or indeed any others, perhaps they could forward the link.

Here it is again:-

https://sebastianrushworth.com/2020/09/19/covid-19-does-sweden-have-herd-immunity/

141005 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Sarigan, #224 of 1915 🔗

Looks like that was extended at Dr Malcolm Kendrick’s request. Great stuff:

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2020/09/21/more-covid19-news-from-sweden/

“A few weeks ago, an emergency physician working in Sweden, Dr. Sebastian Rushworth, asked me if I would be willing to replicate an article from his blog on mine. I was more than happy; it was a great article. The only problem being that his writing puts mine to shame – in a second language. Although he did later tell me he had been to boarding school in England for several years. So, I feel a bit better. If not much.
He has now done an update, outlining how things are getting along in Sweden. I thought it would be of great interest for people to get news from the front line, so to speak.
As many of us know Sweden, alone in Western Europe, decided not to impose a tough lockdown. In fact, the only forcible restriction that was imposed was to ban people meeting in groups of more than fifty. Slightly later, a further restriction was placed on nursing home visits.
Apart from this, all other Government recommendations were purely voluntary [Imagine that, a Government treating its citizens as responsible human beings].
When Sebastian wrote to me recently, I sent him back this e-mail.
“Great article. Could you send it in Word format? I will obviously link back to your blog.
Also, would it be possible to put in an additional section – to go at the front of the piece – as to what measures were taken in Sweden, and what the average person in Sweden actually did. The narrative we now have (from the pro-Lockdown lobby) is that the people of Sweden, being so law-abiding and community aware, essentially locked themselves down.
Which meant that the Swedish partial lockdown was more effective than, for example, the UK ‘harsh’ lockdown. Because the Swedes self-policed themselves, and the Brits did not. This is usually stated with great confidence from people who provide no evidence to back this assertion up. People who have probably never been to Sweden, nor ever talked to anyone from Sweden, and probably couldn’t point to Sweden on a map.
I understand schools stayed open, bars and restaurants stayed open. Gatherings of more than five hundred people were prohibited etc. What did Swedes do with masks, and going to work, for example? I think that information directly from the front line in Sweden, on these things, would be useful for people to know.”
So, Sebastian added a bit onto the front as follows:”

140270 Mark, replying to Mark, 2, #225 of 1915 🔗

That’s an excellent collection of info and analysis – a worthy upgrade to the Swiss centre.

Only thing I’d quibble with is where in the intro it says “ In most countries, Covid deaths were 40-100% higher than a bad flu year “. reading further it seems to be basing this on the last five years’ flu data, which is reasonable but means the worst is not necessarily particularly bad.

I’d reword slightly to make that clearer. It’s “relative to the worst flu year in the past five years”.

More generally this is a comparison I think it is useful to make.

140345 ▶▶ jrsm, replying to Mark, 4, #226 of 1915 🔗

And even that is not universally true. For instance, in Portugal current Covid-19 attributed deaths (1900) are about 40% lower than a good flu year (about 3300) . And I believe there are many other countries like that.

140272 THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, 3, #227 of 1915 🔗

We’ve finally set up our own commenting account!

If you want to listen to our latest podcast ‘Coronavirus and Context part 2’ then click the link below.

Thanks for all your support! Please subscribe and leave an itunes rating… it’s a big deal!

https://therealnormalpodcast.buzzsprout.com/

140275 Richard, replying to Richard, 20, #228 of 1915 🔗

Quick update on trip to the City – on train from Norwich – caught same time one in late July – there are a few more people around but carriages still really empty. Car parks at stations are empty. No issues walking through station without mask – was asked said exemption and got “fair enough”. They were counting something though – he had a clicker in his hand. Taxi driver this morning was a joy – complete sceptic – worked all the way through – ferrying key workers / medics / picking people up from hospitals – as he said if was that bad I should be dead by now !

140317 ▶▶ kf99, replying to Richard, 5, #229 of 1915 🔗

Emergency rail measures now extended by 18 months…cost: 3.5Bn so far and counting. Plus a pre-covid normal 4Bn annual cost.

British Rail total annual subsidy in today’s money was about 1.7Bn I think.

140324 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to kf99, 4, #230 of 1915 🔗

So we are now indirectly funding European rail services.

140337 ▶▶▶ Richard, replying to kf99, 4, #231 of 1915 🔗

Am now going through heart of commuter Essex – still the same story of empty car parks. They can’t admit it but only solution now is full nationalisation – even with “support” the economic model is bust. And that’s before the latest round of madness

140488 ▶▶ Lyra Silvertongue, replying to Richard, 2, #232 of 1915 🔗

I wouldn’t regard the clicker as anything sinister – they just want to record passenger numbers, probably some arcane mechanism related to claiming subsidies.

Whilst I’ve had occasional cause to vent at some cab owners’ sloppy driving, it seems they are a demographic that have their heads screwed on the right way in the current times. Being self-employed myself I guess generally having to be responsible for your own business and make your own judgements will engender the right life philosophy in someone. A friend of mine drives one and he’s constantly been probably the most rational individual I know with regards to the whole situation. At least one local cab firm has been helping us out delivering food parcels and shopping here too.

140276 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 11, #233 of 1915 🔗

Well done Carl and co. I hope it works.

What does everyone think of how govt will react to this? Being told their advisors are complete tosh? Does it make Carl vulnerable?

I think he’s right but I think it’s dangerous as opening the narcissistic wound of those in power, could cause nasty damage. I mean, Boris and co aren’t going to just say “ok then, sack the lot of you crap advisers”.

He was more balanced the other day when he said that govt needs to incorporate front line clinicians as advisors too. At least the govt could add them in and not lose face.

I’m a little worried by that article as it may exclude him from being a serious influencer.

140277 ▶▶ Mark H, replying to Country Mumkin, 8, #234 of 1915 🔗

As I said in another comment, I hope he has good security. David Kelly, anyone?

140320 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Mark H, 1, #235 of 1915 🔗

if They resort to that then we know we are stuffed.

140327 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Mark H, #236 of 1915 🔗

Just to be sure he has never said ‘I’m feeling suicidal’

140371 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Mark H, 1, #237 of 1915 🔗

Good question .. Who is this governments Alastair Campbell ?

140386 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to mjr, 5, #238 of 1915 🔗

Just happened to notice the panic and terror our little ideas of liberty against tyranny are causing the political classes –

ALASTAIR CAMPBELL
@campbellclaret
·
1h
.
@grantshapps
normally the government’s most fluent turd polisher. But you can tell in his voice he knows this turd is beyond polishing, that the Covid record is beyond repair, the mistakes and lies beyond counting, the team too weak, the uselessness beyond anything defensible

140388 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 2, #239 of 1915 🔗

Game is nearly over.

140390 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #240 of 1915 🔗

Stay prepared for the hit back from the oppressors today. Still a long way to go. But yeah in terms of time through the ages nearly done is correct.

Was trying to add this under the campbell tweet-

NB that’s Campbell using tone of voice to unleash fury. These body language traits of communication reveal so much. Don’t dismiss tgem. Listen to your gut instinct. Look them in the eye.

140392 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 6, #241 of 1915 🔗

Today or tomorrow. But it’s getting old now, and people are sick of it. I’m expecting a bigger and better reaction than to the “Law of Six”. The government is losing control, losing its cool, and lost its justification.

They’ll also blame Saturday’s protest, wait and see.

142088 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to mjr, 1, #242 of 1915 🔗

Dom cumms obvs

140434 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Mark H, #243 of 1915 🔗

He killed HIMSELF???

140439 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Two-Six, #244 of 1915 🔗

My largely non-political mum had the same reaction, thought it an absolute disgrace.

140468 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Mark H, 1, #245 of 1915 🔗

Another agent of evil! We know who you are….tick tock

142089 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Mark H, #246 of 1915 🔗

Go hang out with OKUK and talk about how the job went today…

140282 ▶▶ Mike May, replying to Country Mumkin, 4, #247 of 1915 🔗

>> What does everyone think of how govt will react to this?

By doubling down on their commitment to eradicating the virus in order to show us all how caring and compassionate they are. By ramping up their language from talking about this terrible, devastating virus to this hell-sent demonic force that is lethal to all who even think about it. By panicking like crippled deer in the headlights.

Facts wash of this bunch like water off wax.

140303 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Mike May, 4, #248 of 1915 🔗

Yes Mike, they have become so predictable. We can read them like a book.

140307 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Mike May, 1, #249 of 1915 🔗

True!

140287 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #250 of 1915 🔗

Have had the same thoughts. I really hope his understandable frustration hasn’t pushed him into a misstep.

140289 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #251 of 1915 🔗

Not sure. I get where you are coming from, but as he has been in the MSM and on camera, plus the work he has done on Primodos, I think he will garner more support when he is next on TV. Will he just say he is getting ’emotional’ because he is so worried that this is wrong for the country and fellow citizens with delayed cancer referrals, heart attacks and strokes, not to mention mental health and poverty-related illnesses?

By the way, wonder whether he will be interviewed on Sky later today to rebut whatever tosh the CMO and CSA have to say this morning – they appear to me to have been put out to deflect as fall guys?

140306 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #252 of 1915 🔗

Ok I see what you mean. Thanks for bringing my attention to Primodos which I didn’t know about. I will continue to observe.

As an aside, I hear from my scientist brother in law it is a bit of a case of Oxford vs Imperial. But I don’t necessarily trust his judgment as he sits in his mother’s lounge with a face mask on!

140332 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #253 of 1915 🔗

There’s obviously form between the two camps (Gupta was Anderson’s post doc just before Neil Ferguson). Although Carl Heneghan is in his own funded institute (CEBM), they all know each other through the university association – and their kids are all at one or more of three/four schools.

140555 ▶▶▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #254 of 1915 🔗

Ah, ok. Thanks for that explanation and further detail.

140278 Mike May, replying to Mike May, 5, #255 of 1915 🔗

Just heard a woman in the queue at ASDA telling how a friend of hers has had to take all six of her children out of three different schools because one of them had a sore throat (not actually a CoVID-19 symptom) last week and they aren’t allowed back until they’ve ALL had a negative test.

140280 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to Mike May, 8, #256 of 1915 🔗

And at least one is likely to get a false negative. This is just a Covid Ponzi Scheme.

140285 ▶▶▶ Mike May, replying to MizakeTheMizan, 4, #257 of 1915 🔗

That’s OK – another may well get a false positive to make up for it! Be optimistic!

140300 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Mike May, 5, #258 of 1915 🔗

Last week I saw an 8 year old with a sore throat, no temperature slight productive cough, no runny nose. I put it down as a viral infection and told mum the child did not need to be tested neither did the family.

140315 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to p02099003, 2, #259 of 1915 🔗

I hope the child’s school are of the same mind, the child has seen a medical doctor, and is fit for school. No nonsense about isolating etc.

140367 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #260 of 1915 🔗

dont be silly .. schools reaction will be the standard “the child has covid”.. and they will ring plague bells and send the whole year home until a negative test. . The test is all !!!… What has a GPs untested opinion to do with anything

140462 ▶▶▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to mjr, 5, #261 of 1915 🔗

Actually I’m not a GP, but a nurse practitioner. The mum also appeared to be anti mask. As the consultation was at the end of the week then there shouldn’t be a problem with the school. As the government has said only test with symptoms then the little girl had not got symptoms and hence did not meet the criteria for a test. Secondly, as it was probably a rhinovirus picked up at school it demonstrates that the precautions do not work, unless SARS-CoV-2 is more intelligent than its rhinovirus cousins and knows it’s ow limitations.

140472 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to p02099003, 1, #262 of 1915 🔗

Hi p02099003

Sorry I got your profession wrong, I was going to say medical professional, then changed it.

Doh!

141148 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to p02099003, #263 of 1915 🔗

yes – i recall you have mentioned it before… You are still a health professional though … (and a sensible one!!)
the main point though is if this had been initiated by the school it would have resulted in sending the class home and required a negative test. As it was , they are not aware .. so all that was needed was calpol, ice cream and early night ( i think that is what i need!) and by monday no one would notice!!

140466 ▶▶▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to mjr, 1, #264 of 1915 🔗

The most ridiculous thing is that the appointment was booked by the child’s own GP surgery (we are an out of hours clinic) after the receptionist had asked the CoViD19 screening questions and decided that we could see her, because the GP was doing telephone consultations only.

140664 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Mike May, 2, #265 of 1915 🔗

It would be slightly amusing if some tested positive and some negative – as they all live in the same house, you’d surely expect all to get the same result..

140310 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #267 of 1915 🔗

Is this the camping trip being found out?

140323 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Basics, 3, #268 of 1915 🔗

No, another, more recent trip. The ‘camping trip’ was likely a photo op after the annual visit a PM and his partner normally has to Balmoral when HM is on her summer vacation. From there he most likely went by private jet to his old man’s 80th in Greece.

140313 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #269 of 1915 🔗

Weekend party with his Russian paymaster

140319 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #270 of 1915 🔗

Once again just shows how serious this whole thing is. If there was a national crisis politicians and the PM in particular would not be holidaying all the time.

140322 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to JohnB, 2, #271 of 1915 🔗

They would be in a secure bunker trying to actually save the country not shaft it.

140321 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #272 of 1915 🔗

What bollocks, the mask clearly photoshopped on the fat slob

140455 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #273 of 1915 🔗

Why does he need a mask? He had COVID and therefore cannot get it again.

140281 THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, replying to THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, 8, #274 of 1915 🔗

Sorry to say we had to wear masks at our local boozer yesterday…mainly so we don’t get dragged off by the police for ‘Wrong Thnking’

Plus we’re getting a lot of listens in Australia…so I’m expecting the Victoria police to get a plane over here to extradite us and charge us with being REAL NORMAL!

140440 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, #275 of 1915 🔗

Cheers

140294 alw, replying to alw, 23, #276 of 1915 🔗

No one is listening to Whitty, Vallance, Boris or Hancock anymore as the cat is out of the bag. An on the JHB show this morning she had Graham Whettome a police analyst saying the £10,000 fines can’t be enforced because of problems with the tests. Let’s just get on with life.

140318 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to alw, 5, #277 of 1915 🔗

He is often on Sky . I think is a former senior detective in the Met. Has excellent contacts!

140363 ▶▶ Basics, replying to alw, 9, #278 of 1915 🔗

We can’t just get on with life. We need an equivalent of the Nazi catching squads to go after these people and prosecute. A message needs to be sent through history so we never experience this again.

Then we can get on with life.

140295 Olive, 19, #279 of 1915 🔗

Go Julia Harley-Brewer on Talk Radio. Completely got Grant Schapps on the ropes about PCR testing. He genuinely didn’t understand the false positive errors thrown up when testing. There clearly has been NO cabinet scrutiny or understanding at all!!!!

140297 nottingham69, replying to nottingham69, 19, #280 of 1915 🔗

Anybody heard the interview between Julia Brewer and the Secretary of State for transport on Talk Radio. It is gold. Shapps has no clue on the false positives, thick as pudding.

140377 ▶▶ MRG, replying to nottingham69, #281 of 1915 🔗

Yes, just like Hancock last week. Here’s a graph for them:
http://fracturetraining.com/mrg/pcr_false_positives_effect.pdf

140405 ▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to nottingham69, 1, #282 of 1915 🔗

Ah, yes, but according to him, that’s not the problem… the big problem, the reason the economy is in free-fall, companies on their knees – it’s all because people can’t travel into work because of all that nasty graffiti they see!

140463 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Stringfellow Hawke, 1, #283 of 1915 🔗

Best commuter graffito ever, each word on three pillars came into view to reveal one word at a time

Good
Morning
Lemmings

On off ramp M4-North Circular, 1980’s, stayed there for months

140302 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 25, #284 of 1915 🔗

JHB having a sceptic morning on TalkRADIO, Grant Shatts just had a good ear beating.

interview ended with Shatts saying he will question government advisers about false positive pillar 2 tests. We shall see.

She is saying what has been said on here for months and LS was mentioned by a Dr Mike Yeadon during the show earlier.

if you read this Julia, well done and keep up the pressure.

140311 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #285 of 1915 🔗

Nice!

140304 William Hand, replying to William Hand, 18, #286 of 1915 🔗

I don’t like Carl Heneghan.




..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
.
.

I LOVE Carl Heneghan!

140334 ▶▶ Marie R, replying to William Hand, 5, #287 of 1915 🔗

He should be given a knighthood

140335 ▶▶ THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, replying to William Hand, 1, #288 of 1915 🔗

So do we!

140308 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 8, #289 of 1915 🔗

Apologies if these points have already been mad

I’ve just looked at the statistics for France and Spain as they, are constantly held up as being a warning to us.

France – cases are now double what they were back in the Spring but the mortality figures are less than 6% what they were back then. (using 7 day average).

Spain – over the last months they’ve had a ‘wave’ probably bigger than that which occurred in March and April, but deaths are less than an eighth of what they were back then.

In a brief discussion on radio 4 this morn it was noticeable how swiftly the interviewer scotched one chap’s attempt to make a comparison with Sweden. “That’s not what we want to know, thank you very much!” (Well, she didn’t say that, but I thought she might just well have done. “We haven’t got time” is what she said, or something similar.)

140326 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to Ned of the Hills, 5, #290 of 1915 🔗

I’m going to say that actual Covid deaths in France and Spain haven’t gone up at all, reported deaths were always going to edge up slightly as a direct result of increased testing and ‘cases’.

It’s a Ponzi scheme.

140354 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Ned of the Hills, #291 of 1915 🔗

Quoted you above Ned. I think you write this so well.

140453 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Basics, 1, #292 of 1915 🔗

Thank you.

It beats me if it takes me but two minutes to discover journalists questioning government ministers haven’t discovered it.

140309 PWL, replying to PWL, 1, #293 of 1915 🔗

Interesting that the Oxford University Scientists talk in terms of UK Government policy being ruled by astrology.

Covid-19 as a modern day variant of an antique technocratic control device

140416 ▶▶ Alison9, replying to PWL, -2, #294 of 1915 🔗

It’s interesting, the suggested link with prescription drugs has played on my mind.

However, I find it funny that people disrespect astrology – a extremely tense and difficult year followed by a recession has been widely predicted by the vast majority of astrologers.

For those with a curious mind and open mind (no offence taken Carl, those of us interested in astrology have long since got used to be seen as crackpots!) here is a link to two interesting posts about this year.

https://astro-awakenings.co.uk/astrology-in-the-age-of-covid-19
https://astro-awakenings.co.uk/the-astrology-of-2020-part-4-the-role-of-saturn

140445 ▶▶ Malcolm Ramsay, replying to PWL, #295 of 1915 🔗

As it happens, astrologers have been talking about 2020 as a year of political transformation (one way or another) for many years – referring to it as The Great Reset!

140601 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Malcolm Ramsay, 1, #296 of 1915 🔗

Yep, I can do astrology. There is a serious and unusual conjunction at the moment which has been active for about a year – looks like a power grab. Plus another aspect which means enforced control.

Next year is much more rebellious though!

141181 ▶▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Kate, #297 of 1915 🔗

Roll on 2021!

141179 ▶▶▶ Alison9, replying to Malcolm Ramsay, 1, #298 of 1915 🔗

I’ve up voted you Malcolm for not totally dismissing my post! The Great Reset – it’s unfortunate given the link with the WEF.

141468 ▶▶▶▶ Malcolm Ramsay, replying to Alison9, #299 of 1915 🔗

I upvoted yours too, Alison, because it looks like an interesting read (yours wasn’t showing when I posted mine, though).

I believe it was the financial astrologer, Ray Merriman, who first described 2020 with that phrase, maybe as much as ten years ago. He quite likely has followers in WEF circles, so it might not be random coincidence – though I daresay many in the WEF would think the link with astrology is unfortunate!

140314 James Leary #KBF, 19, #300 of 1915 🔗

Torygraph:

‘ Thousands of thugs, thieves and drug offenders have been let off prosecutions by the police during the coronavirus pandemic to ease the pressure on the court system, an investigation by The Telegraph has found.
Police have dropped prosecutions in at least 6,000 cases and instead applied out-of-court measures such as community resolutions which do not result in a criminal record.’

I was sitting outside a cafe on the beach near the i360 in Brighton on Saturday. All the other establishments around were fairly busy. No less than THREE police were above on the promenade filming the people sitting outside the cafes. In case there were more than six at any one table, no doubt.

A murder might have stirred them to proper policing. Perhaps not. They’re going to have to live in barracks after this is over. Not amongst us.

140316 alw, replying to alw, 20, #301 of 1915 🔗

Could someone please tell us why the riot police charged the peaceful anti lockdown protest on Saturday, why and on whose orders? And why was nothing of the same seen at the BLM protest yesterday?

140346 ▶▶ Basics, replying to alw, 3, #302 of 1915 🔗

Write to the Met. Talk to the ablut policing consent and how you would like to understand the different approaches. How tactical assult glives were used by one group and not by another etc. Do it politely, do it clearly. If you are very lucky you may get a reply in two weeks time giving a communication serial number to say your thoughtful, polite correspondence has been swallowed by the system.

You could try asking your MP or the MP for policing – reminding them that the police act under the Nolan Principles and are therefore bound to behave in an open and transparent manner – as far as operationally possible.

A local councillor for that area of london might fear loss of their career if enough voters urge them to seek explanation.

Good luck to you. Without a police command radio intercept of the day you’ll never know why.

140428 ▶▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to Basics, 4, #303 of 1915 🔗

Good idea. Could also try the Sadiq Khan approach: every 2nd or 3rd sentence chuck in the words ‘tolerance, diversity, equality’ in there.
New blue plaque gone up in London: “It’s wonderful. Londoners always celebrate tolerance, diversity, and pride themselves on equality…”
Major terrorist attack: “It’s obvious they target us because of our tolerance, diversity, and equality…”
Protests in London – well well, where is the Met commitment to tolerance, diversity, and equality??!

140651 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 2, #304 of 1915 🔗

And provide a link to the hands-off approach to BLM and XR protests over the weekend for comparison. Get them to explain the difference…

140395 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to alw, 5, #305 of 1915 🔗

I’ve seen more of the videos now, so have a better understanding of the police tactics on the day. What I saw can only come from where I was, stood on the Pall Mall corner of Trafalgar Square, between the ice cream cone and the National Gallery.

We suspect the orders came from upstairs to disrupt the protest and provoke a response. The police made an early move on the stage and were repulsed – myself included, many believe it to have been a feint. There was a little bit of argy-bargy, with an officer claiming he had been pushed over, the man he accused said he pushed back after being shoved himself. I think this is the excuse the police are using for their later charge.

The move at about 3-30pm was classic kettling, and they only moved once the crowd had thinned somewhat. I suspect this was what they were really waiting for, to expose those remaining as the veterans protecting the stage. Orders from above (I believe, I don’t KNOW for certain), tactics decided by the man in charge on the ground.

I never knew until last night the police had brought dogs as well as horses. I suspect they expected more trouble.

One of the officers ran full tilt into one of the concrete blocks (anti-terrorist device, I think), so that was doing its job, at least!

The BLM protest is a “good” protest, so the police are given orders to be nice at those.

140398 ▶▶▶ Hoppy Uniatz, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #306 of 1915 🔗

Dude, next Saturday just stand your ground and when you see the whites of their eyes, call out “Black Lives Matter”

140489 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Hoppy Uniatz, #307 of 1915 🔗

Good idea :o))

141170 ▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Hoppy Uniatz, #308 of 1915 🔗

Might be a good idea for a chant if the police start to look threatening.

141418 ▶▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Hoppy Uniatz, #309 of 1915 🔗

That’s cultural appropriation!

140437 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to alw, 2, #310 of 1915 🔗

Sadiq is the boss

140325 WillemKoppenhol, 8, #311 of 1915 🔗

Uplifting story from the Netherlands: Dutch students ignore coronavirus hysteria and decide to have a life, showing police officers what they think of the stupid new rules which came into force in the last few days, even pelting waste at them. Interesting detail is that the Dutch police, even after having been pelted with waste(!), still had to ask for official legal permission to enter the house!

Quick translation:

Rotterdam students pelt agents who act against illegal house party
The police in Rotterdam-Kralingen took dozens of young people out of a student house during an illegal party. The agents were pelted with waste from the student house during the police action.

The party in the building on the Oostzeedijk Beneden, corner of Avenue Concordia, was on Saturday evening. While meetings at home are limited to six people because of the corona crisis, at least 55 young people were partying in the student house.

When officers went to take a look, they received a load of household waste from above. They then decided to apply for a so-called ‘authorization to enter’ based on their suspicion an illegal party was ongoing.

According to the police when several police units entered, at least twenty young people took off through the back door. Dozens of other boys and girls tried to hide in rooms, beds, toilets and bathrooms. They were reportedly almost without exception dead drunk.

In the living room it was “one big mess with open bottles and cans of alcohol”, says spokesman Lilian van Duijvenbode. The young people still present behaved in a recalcitrant manner and refused to cooperate and obey the order to leave the building. “They were forced out with appropriate force. And some force was also used outside,” the police spokesman continues.

Outside, the data of 36 young people was registered. They were all fined for violating the corona rules. Van Duijvenbode: “Local residents who saw it all happen, were just about to applaud the police.”

(original link: https://www.rijnmond.nl/nieuws/199280/Rotterdamse-studenten-bekogelen-agenten-die-optreden-tegen-illegaal-huisfeest )

Notice that last sentence: “were just about to applaud the police”. If that were to be true, then only because such student houses have been known to create a lot of noise complaints over the years. But now finally there is something that doesn’t make you a “small-minded snitch” or something like that, it actually makes you a “hero” and a “soldier” in the “war against corona”.

140328 MRG, replying to MRG, 4, #312 of 1915 🔗

Grant Shapps showing a Hancockesque understanding of PCR test false positives on JHB Talk Radio programme this morning

140375 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to MRG, #313 of 1915 🔗

any link for that?

140648 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to steve_w, #314 of 1915 🔗

Likely to be a snippet on Julia Hartley-Brewer’s Twitter, and she often provides a link to the complete versions of her interviews on youtube..

140331 Sir Patrick Vaccine, 8, #315 of 1915 🔗

Former chief scientific advisor at Pfizer Dr Mike Yeadon has called on Matt Hancock to provide evidence that the UK is heading towards a second coronavirus wave.

Coronavirus: ‘At most we’re in a second ripple’, says scientist

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bwebLohmN4

140339 Basics, 4, #316 of 1915 🔗

In mind of today’s announcements I saw these two snippets of pertinent information on yesterdays comments. They may be good to bear in mind when the witching hour is upon us with the pulpit speeches of Witty -Sturgeon – Drakeford – not sure who will speak in NI.

Quote from yesterday:

“France – cases are now double what they were back in the Spring but the mortality figures are less than 6% what they were back then. (using 7 day average).

“Spain – over the last months they’ve had a ‘wave’ probably bigger than that which occurred in March and April, but deaths less than an eighth of what they were back then.”

“In March, infection to hospitalisation was ~2 weeks, admission to death 1-2 weeks (on average).”

There has been a small increase in admissions, if things go like they did in March we should be seeing deaths increasing between middle of next week and the middle of the week after.

Thank you to the commenters I’ve quoted, I see tham as a useful rough guide.

140340 Fingerache Philip., 15, #317 of 1915 🔗

Never ever thought I would say this: Brilliant article in the MOS yesterday by David Mellor.
Mellor was born a few months after me (late 1940’s) and the description of the genuine health scares of Polio,TB,Diphtheria and Measles pre 1950′ and later make for essential reading, it describes how people in the past dealt with life and death in all its forms.
Why are some people running around in ever decreasing circles shouting “Don’t you dare come near me because if you do; WE’RE ALL GOING TO DIE”?
This is a mild illness in the majority of cases so I urge people to read ( even if you have to retrieve the MOS from a bin) this article.
Take the government mandated blickers off and open your eyes.

140341 Marie R, replying to Marie R, 10, #318 of 1915 🔗

Toby and Will….absolutely brilliant LS today. I’m detecting, among friends who were full on enthusiasts, the sense that we are right!
If we can afford it, we should remember the ‘shameless begging bit ‘ below to help keep this amazing site running…..think how much cheaper it is compared to what counselling would have been!!

140374 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Marie R, 7, #319 of 1915 🔗

A lock down zealot friend of mine has turned recently into a sceptic – asked today for some bullet points and links she can share with family

140344 bucky99, replying to bucky99, 6, #320 of 1915 🔗

Well, back to school lasted a whole 2 weeks. One +ive test, and the whole of year 6 now has 10 days of homeschooling. Best bit – school will be getting their online material ready for tomorrow… they’ve had months to get this prepared!!

Hoping that what tomorrow brings is somewhat better than they managed before the summer, which was about 45 mins worth of content each day.

140347 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to bucky99, 1, #321 of 1915 🔗

Does this conveniently fit in with half term?

140348 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to stefarm, 2, #322 of 1915 🔗

Dovetails very nicely I imagine. I wonder if a second test was done?

140355 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Will, 3, #323 of 1915 🔗

and given the number of false positives, whether the child just has a cold and does not have covid (which is likely scenario)

140349 ▶▶▶ bucky99, replying to stefarm, #324 of 1915 🔗

Should make it back for a couple of weeks before that…

140352 ▶▶ bucky99, replying to bucky99, 3, #325 of 1915 🔗

There’s no logic to it either – my youngest is still able to go back in, apparently the cunning virus won’t get passed between siblings…

141310 ▶▶ matt, replying to bucky99, #326 of 1915 🔗

My 8 year old on the way to school this morning:
“Daddy, I think I’ve got a cold.”
“No you haven’t”
“Yes, I keep sneezing.”
“No you don’t. Stop sniffing.”

140351 jhfreedom, replying to jhfreedom, 32, #327 of 1915 🔗

The Daily Mail has come out against Whitty and Vallance. This is significant.

They have sensed the turn. This is the beginning of the end.

Finally, there is hope!

ps we should have a Nuremberg-style trial for all of these lockdown advocates when this is over

140359 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to jhfreedom, 10, #328 of 1915 🔗

Make sure to include the school staff who are subjecting children to abuse and bullying.

140412 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Saved To Death, 5, #329 of 1915 🔗

Yes them too. I want them all behind barbed wire looking dejected like the sorry-looking Wermacht being rounded up in 1945.

141628 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Saved To Death, 2, #330 of 1915 🔗

Yes! They have a legal obligation to safeguard children which they are shamefully neglecting.

141767 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Saved To Death, #331 of 1915 🔗

And don’t forget those Hitlers and Stalins in the retail, hospitality and transport sectors who treated their customers like crap in the name of “safety”

140370 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to jhfreedom, 10, #332 of 1915 🔗

I sense a turn. The Nick Triggle piece on BBC was excellent today. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54228649

BBC looking for a way out of being blamed for the worldwide lockdown induced apocalypse?

140394 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to steve_w, 15, #333 of 1915 🔗

The BBC must not survive this. Shut it down and sell all the assets.

140411 ▶▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Saved To Death, 10, #334 of 1915 🔗

Yes, they have failed abysmally. And they have no excuse like the Daily Mail, they don’t need the click bait since they are semi-publicly funded.

Have told the wife and kids they have until renewal time next summer to wean themselves off it, I won’t be renewing it!

140436 ▶▶▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Saved To Death, 3, #335 of 1915 🔗

A rousing hear hear!!!

140410 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to jhfreedom, 12, #336 of 1915 🔗

“We should have a Nuremberg-style trial for all of these lockdown advocates when this is over.”

A full plenary Royal Commission into who said what and when, who decided what and when, the consequences, the actual real world results in data, comparisons with countries who acted differently (we all know which one in particular).

Investigation and recommendations with regard to rule by diktat/Statutory Instrument, investigation into police and armed forces’ involvement. Investigation into why Parliament ran away instead of doing their duty to their constituents.

Because so many people have been adversely affected, mentally and physically, and because so many have died unnecessarily, both in the care home scandal and through denying access to the NHS, the sentences for the guilty MUST be severe.

Politicians and their advisers need reminding that they are the servants and not the masters of the people.

140438 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #337 of 1915 🔗

Yes, proper criminal tariffs for those found culpable. A full cleansing of ‘the system’ that has failed us all so abysmally.

140640 ▶▶▶ James, replying to Nick Rose, 5, #338 of 1915 🔗

I understand where you are coming from on this I really do. But where do you stop? The doctors and nurses who deliberately ignored their own medical ethics and effectively withdrew care from the people they are sworn to help. The dentists who shut down dental treatment completely for 6 months. The school heads who denied children education. The list goes on and on . Obedience to authority is not a valid defence in international law. That was established in the Eichmann trial. No one can argue: “I was just doing what I was told. I was just following orders.” But it goes deeper than that. We have all given our authority and dignity away in return for being looked after by our government and all it’s agencies. Government is supposed to serve the people. But if the people are asleep something insidiously evil starts to happen. We are all complicit in this. We reap what we sow.

141023 ▶▶▶▶ Arkansas, replying to James, 4, #339 of 1915 🔗

Fair enough?

Everyone who wore a mask whilst shopping was a contributor, for example, and is therefore partly responsible for this “tyranny of stupid ideas” and the subsequent effects on society, liberty, the economy, the future.

That doesn’t mean they should all go to jail, of course. But they are still “guilty”.

141633 ▶▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to Arkansas, 1, #340 of 1915 🔗

Could not agree more. Stupidity and ignorance should not absolve anyone of responsibility.

141775 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Arkansas, #341 of 1915 🔗

Plus don’t forget the lockdownistas and those who to this very day still berate us for being “selfish”

Agree they should not go to jail and they will be so embarrassed by their posts and selfies wearing muzzles that they will try to delete them. But we should never let them forget that they were collaborators and complicit in all this.

141321 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Nick Rose, #342 of 1915 🔗

I say this as someone who has always instinctively, like Burke, believed in “the genius of the constitution” and that, if the constitution is changed, it should be done gradually and carefully:

Our entire constitution has failed and is irrevocably broken. I don’t think we can limp ahead with what’s left, because now we know how it can be easily abused.

We need a new constitution. Root and branch. The system is rotten to the core.

140505 ▶▶ Edward, replying to jhfreedom, 3, #343 of 1915 🔗

The latest threats from the government are like Hitler’s V1 and V2 weapons – dangerous, damaging, but the last throw of desperate people.

140568 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Edward, 2, #344 of 1915 🔗

The V2 cost more lives that it ended too…

140357 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 26, #345 of 1915 🔗

Anyone else playing Covid bingo at the next briefing? This is my card:-

Prevent a second wave
Exponential growth
Hospitalisations
R rate
Spain
Concerning/worrying/alarming
Winter
Spike
Tipping point
Control
NHS
Unfortunate
New measures
Unprecedented
Together
Social responsibility
Quarantine
Disobedient scum

They might not say that last one but pretty sure they’ll be thinking it.

140361 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Achilles, 7, #346 of 1915 🔗

uptick
surge
ramp up

140366 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Achilles, 6, #347 of 1915 🔗

won’t mention sweden

140368 ▶▶▶ Achilles, replying to steve_w, 6, #348 of 1915 🔗

or vaccine as they know that’s way to dodgy to get in to yet.

140546 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Achilles, #349 of 1915 🔗

Sorree, Vallance the Vaccine did the hopeful end note (like you have to, so as not to scare everybody to death) talking about the 6 or so in Phase 3 trials.

140642 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bruno, 1, #350 of 1915 🔗

This is a really interesting article regarding the progress of the covid vaccines – interesting (to say the least) that main shareholders in Moderna have offloaded their shares..: https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2020/09/21/coronavirus-vaccine-patent.aspx?cid_source=dnl&cid_medium=email&cid_content=art1HL&cid=20200921Z1&mid=DM660562&rid=969575901

140372 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Achilles, 4, #351 of 1915 🔗

New measures! That’s good as cheating putting that on your list. Every second word between breaths will be new measures!

140376 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Achilles, 5, #352 of 1915 🔗

“Deadly disease”
“Exponential”
“Until we have a vaccine”

140379 ▶▶ Kelly deacons, replying to Achilles, 3, #353 of 1915 🔗

Safe

140387 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Achilles, 1, #354 of 1915 🔗

‘the harder we lock down, the quicker it will be over’

probably won’t use ‘3 weeks to flatten the curve’

140423 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to steve_w, 3, #355 of 1915 🔗

three to six years, to be certain

141323 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #356 of 1915 🔗

“3 to 6 years to flatten our civilisation” sounds about right.

140393 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Achilles, 3, #357 of 1915 🔗

Hands
Face
Space

140420 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Sarigan, 4, #358 of 1915 🔗

Bish, bash, bosh.

Wibble.

140397 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Achilles, 4, #359 of 1915 🔗

“Disobedient scum” – brilliant! That’ll be me then!

140451 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Achilles, 7, #360 of 1915 🔗

Eyes down, look in.

Bingo!

140460 ▶▶▶ Achilles, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #361 of 1915 🔗

Nice one! We’ll have to work on the calls too. Two fat ladies – increased mortality risk.

140825 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Achilles, 1, #362 of 1915 🔗

following The Science

141326 ▶▶ matt, replying to Achilles, #363 of 1915 🔗

Round the clock
At pace
Whatever it takes
The good work we’ve all done
British people
Every death a tragedy

140362 Muzz Off, replying to Muzz Off, 14, #364 of 1915 🔗

I urge everyone to take Peter Hitchens’ advice and email their MPs. I have just done so, despite him being Labour with an unassailable majority. To my shame it’s the first time I have done so. I felt powerless against the overwhelming strength of the media narrative and total acquiescence of all MPs, and I didn’t believe I could make a case that would make a difference.

But Mr Hitchens is right – we needn’t convince them with powerful missives that persuade them of our case. We simply need to show them that we are angry, and that for them, the bell tolls.

140391 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Muzz Off, 1, #365 of 1915 🔗

Mine has had 6 emails over the last week

141328 ▶▶ matt, replying to Muzz Off, #366 of 1915 🔗

I’m drafting a new one to my MP – also Lab, also in the safest of seats – I’m going for the constitutional and emotional approach. I’ll post it here as a draft when done.

140365 Will, replying to Will, 9, #367 of 1915 🔗

Two things putting a spring in my step as I do some training with the Spaniels. One is the traction that scepticism around the PCR test is beginning to gather the other is the intervention of Farage, a shameless populist rabble rouser he might be but where he leads Johnson generally follows.

140378 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Will, 2, #368 of 1915 🔗

When you said about Johnson following Farage, I got a picture of the two Davids from Spitting Image in my head. Johnson of course was David Steele, the smaller of the two Davids.

140382 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Will, 7, #369 of 1915 🔗

‘youth’ today being interviewed on R4 asked whether she or her friends would obey a new lockdown. Answer – ‘No’. ‘Thanks for being so honest!’

140433 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to steve_w, 2, #370 of 1915 🔗

Heard it; hope my granddaughter says the same after deferring her university place till next year .
I mean:How the hell can you study Dance and Choreography while social distancing and wearing a face nappy?

140417 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Will, 10, #371 of 1915 🔗

I told my Dad with a straight face that Nigel Farage would be getting my vote. He was dismayed but I said that the lockdown restrictions are a far bigger issue than Brexit or immigration and I had a moral duty to support ANY politician that wanted to see an end to The Madness.

140995 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to jhfreedom, #372 of 1915 🔗

That’s a reasonable position, though I suspect that covid will be long forgotten (apart from the consequences of lockdown etc) long before any meaningful elections come up.

140430 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Will, 3, #373 of 1915 🔗

I think a key sign things are turning will be when we go to the supermarket and 80%+ are no longer masked. It will be a sign both that people are no longer being brainwashed and that they are able to pluck up the courage to engage in a small but symbolic act of rebellion.

140476 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Saved To Death, 1, #374 of 1915 🔗

50% unmasked in my local Sainsbury this morning. And masking has only been in a week here in Wales.

140381 Jon G, replying to Jon G, 15, #375 of 1915 🔗

Anyone read Triggle, just published – ‘is it time we learnt to live with the virus?’
It’s brilliant.
Sorry, no link – google it. Also he just tweeted it.
No fucking bill gates or 5g, just common bloody sense and a well presented argument against all the measures the government are planning.

140385 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, 3, #377 of 1915 🔗

Nick Triggle has been good all the way through. The BBC has ‘allowed’ him to say this. I suspect they are as bored of the lockdown as we are and worried about ‘collateral’

141381 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to steve_w, #378 of 1915 🔗

Top comments almost all anti-lockdown.

140421 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Jon G, 2, #379 of 1915 🔗

unfortunately for you.. Gates, Prince Charles, The IMF, The WEF.. Goldman Sachs.. are all part of the covid ruse, the covid trojan horse… some want to sell vaccines, others want some kind of greenish new deal.. the great reset is not a conspiracy.

141632 ▶▶▶ ChrisDinBristol, replying to chaos, #380 of 1915 🔗

At least, not a conspiracy “theory”. Is it conspiracy if it’s in plain sight (and has a very large and impressive website)? The “piracy” part is probably true, I suspect.

140400 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 5, #381 of 1915 🔗

Boris Johnson – the voice of tyranny – leaves this woman in tears

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnUErvMrJA4
Alex Belfield – THE VOICE OF REASON
121K subscribers

Can you imagine being so confused and upset that you’re too scared to let your carers and son in bringing you food. This caller tonight blew my mind!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnUErvMrJA4

141581 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 1, #382 of 1915 🔗

Despicable terrorising people like this. How dare the government frighten elderly people.

140401 redbirdpete, replying to redbirdpete, 12, #383 of 1915 🔗

Would just like to draw attention to the fact that the Telegraph is actively removing ‘likes’ from anti-lockdown posts, even when it hasn’t deleted the posts themselves. Clearly the editorial comment team and the comment censorship team are not seeing eye-to-eye.

140418 ▶▶ Marie R, replying to redbirdpete, 3, #384 of 1915 🔗

There is no opportunity to comment after the heneghan article in the Telegraph

140431 ▶▶▶ redbirdpete, replying to Marie R, 3, #385 of 1915 🔗

I was posting comments against the Telegraph editorial mentioned in today’s lockdownsceptics late last night. Saw likes on one of my posts go to 13. Checked ten minutes later – 2. Checked again 10 minutes later – 0. This morning the post (and lots of the other sceptical posts on the same article) had disappeared.

140633 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Marie R, 3, #386 of 1915 🔗

Heneghan needs to publish his articles on Twitter, not behind a paywall. Look how many retweets Julia H-B can get when she posts sceptic articles, graphs etc!
A person can read Twitter without needing to sign up to it or pay anything..

140577 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to redbirdpete, 1, #387 of 1915 🔗

Think it works the same way as it does here, where you might uptick a comment only to find that that triggers 2 down ticks! It’s just a lag in updating in the system, they’re all valid ticks but not instantly reflected. Not censorship.

140402 Olive, replying to Olive, 26, #388 of 1915 🔗

Just spoken to my sister – the article by Carl Heneghan in Mail over weekend has completely turned her into questioning the entire thing and she was really sceptical today. How many other Mail readers were turned over the weekend…..?

140408 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Olive, 15, #389 of 1915 🔗

Lord Heneghan

140479 ▶▶▶ Bumble, replying to steve_w, 5, #390 of 1915 🔗

I would prefer Carl Heneghan, CMO

141072 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Bumble, #391 of 1915 🔗

Lord Heneghan, CMO?

140415 kf99, replying to kf99, 6, #392 of 1915 🔗

https://www.effiedeans.com/2020/09/was-lockdown-needed.html
“We are overly sentimental about death because we treat it as something not normal and indeed an outrageous imposition.
We are no longer the people who read the casualty pages in July 1916 with stoicism, lack of fuss and determination to carry on.”

140483 ▶▶ Liam, replying to kf99, #393 of 1915 🔗

Good piece.

140484 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to kf99, #394 of 1915 🔗

This is exactly right. “Death, where is thy sting, where is thy victory?” was an attitude much better suited to human beings.

140424 Nsklent, replying to Nsklent, 11, #395 of 1915 🔗

Did my car boot yesterday, a large site, so a good opportunity for people watching. Besides having a one way system around the site, which did not prohibit walking past people, stopping to browse etc., so no real infringement, everything else was gloriously normal. No swervers, not one, people standing and talking at normal distances, cash and casusl chat exchanged in a natural fashion, about 5% wore masks.I was there for 5 hours with a constant stream of people passing my stall, so you do the maths on numbers. Considering there was a good cross section of society there, I think it is safe to say what a lot of people there thought of the risk of this ‘deadly virus’. The only thing that spoilt the day was the arrival of a single plod towards the end, who had a wander about.

141131 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Nsklent, #396 of 1915 🔗

As car boots are a good place to find damaged items, did you notice if anyone was trying to sell the UK economy (“hardly used guv. was in decent nick but got broke this year with some fat blonde kid trying to play with it. Its nice an clean though .. wiped it down with bleach”)

140425 MDH, replying to MDH, 6, #397 of 1915 🔗

Another sleepless night. After a wonderful day walking in the Kent countryside, the OH noticed as we were returning home that signs had appeared nearby for a “Low traffic zone”. A Google search produced a twitter feed from Councillor Claire Holland, who seems to have employed a child to produce a delightful map of the proposals .

I live on a small park with four roads giving access. This would knock it down to one in and one out and mean a detour onto main roads each time I want to use my car. Deliveries? Forget it.

No consultation. No warning (to be introduced 28 September). Just a Twitter feed. I was so angry and upset I’ve laid awake all night. There is no longer democracy in England. Why not just ban cars outright to “enable social distancing”? If you flick through Ms Holland’s twitter feed you can see the draft letter that residents have still not received, but which she saw fit to share with her twitter followers. If someone can translate this garbage for me, I’d be most grateful.

140485 ▶▶ Basics, replying to MDH, 2, #398 of 1915 🔗

Lesley Mcinnes a senior empolyee of the council here has been causing large outrage by her comments in the press about road infrastructure alterations which all amount to choking the roads of our city – covid measures. Latest comment from mcinnes was it was the fault of 2000 attendees at an open air public meeting that they misunderstood what measures were temporary and what were permanent.

Battle axe type with no place in public service life. One mode antagonistic.

Frankly the outrage seems a deliberate way of diverting from the dirty work of shifting our city into a bleak low mobility city. The will be putting up zones with crossing checkpoints any day.

140427 chaos, 2, #399 of 1915 🔗

Boris Johnson in Perugia last week. How curious. He’s been there before. It’s where his russian friend lives who he made a Lord. Apparently he was there with Tony Blair.

140441 TyRade, replying to TyRade, 8, #400 of 1915 🔗

In fact, the Spanish and French examples make the case against any future lockdowns/circuit-breakers/imprisonment much more strongly the the excerpt from the Oxford team’s article suggested. Have a look at worldometers.info. Spain’s ‘second wave’ reached the same peak In cases as the first, around 10,000 a day, but the ‘second wave’ lasted ostensibly many more weeks. Yet Spain’s COVID deaths were around 900/day in wave 1 and less than 100 in wave 2. In France, the second wave is ostensibly affecting 10,000 or so a day, double the peak of wave 1. Yet COVID deaths in France are running around 50/day now, compared with 975/day in wave 1. Don’t mention: the testing boom, the false positives and never, under any circumstances…Sweden.

140499 ▶▶ Will, replying to TyRade, 3, #401 of 1915 🔗

And, I believe neither Spain or France have felt the need to lock the country down to bring the blip under control.

140627 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Will, 1, #402 of 1915 🔗

A good point!

140593 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to TyRade, 2, #403 of 1915 🔗

In other words, ‘Show us the Shrouds’.

140442 Sarigan, 6, #404 of 1915 🔗

Peter Hitchens will be watching Whitty etc. live with Talk Radio at 11:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jesxGwo4bTg

140446 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 6, #405 of 1915 🔗

does James O’Brien have any callers on or does he just rant shit for hours?

140457 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to steve_w, 3, #406 of 1915 🔗

Callers don’t stop him from ranting shit either.

140459 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to steve_w, 6, #407 of 1915 🔗

Only listened once since late March and he was full on belittling people as conspiracy theorists, I have taken my listening across to TalkRADIO where they seem, for the most part, far more sensible.

140450 Smelly Melly, replying to Smelly Melly, 18, #408 of 1915 🔗

This 2nd wave hysteria wouldn’t have anything to do with the Coronavirus Act with its sweeping “temporary” powers coming up for review on 25th September have anything to do with another lockdown, would it.

Or am I a tin foil hat conspiracy theorist?

140625 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #409 of 1915 🔗

You are correct!

140464 Basics, replying to Basics, 1, #410 of 1915 🔗

Common Purpose.
Training resources are available on cpexposed website. They are a little old but tyey are tgere. In one of them you can read how common purpose operatives must act to overcome opposition to the projects common purpose graduate are pushing through.

The manual uses really emotive blunt force language and uses the following annaology. From memory:

– Momentum. A stationary object can easily be crushed with your own momentum. If two cars are hurtling towards each other and crash it will kill you. You must act to stop opposition gaining momentum before it starts. – from a cp trsining doc around 2007 iirc.

Point being we currently have momentum. Today witty will comeback with a harsh hit, but how we respond may already be determined by our momentum. Keep working and speaking.

Things are incredibly good when you consider how much strategic calculating is being done by the oppresive regime.

140517 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to Basics, #411 of 1915 🔗

Common Purpose??

I do hope you are suggesting using their own tactics against them by this post?

Common Purpose and Common Core are just one of the many tools the cabal has used to get ‘the right sort of leadership and stanfards’ into prominant positions throughout society, institutions, government, media, education etc etc

But then again….there are no conspiracies!!!!

140967 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to B Boru, #412 of 1915 🔗

I am saying today’s/this week’s operation by government is to hit our momentum. They need to crush us because we are growing.

140465 2 pence, replying to 2 pence, 18, #413 of 1915 🔗

A group of us across medicine, academia and other areas have come together and sent this letter to the PM and his team.

https://twitter.com/ProfKarolSikora/status/1307972101463212032

140473 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to 2 pence, 2, #414 of 1915 🔗

Love it. Hancock is NOT one of the addressees.

140515 ▶▶ RickH, replying to 2 pence, #415 of 1915 🔗

A weighty and well-considered letter.

140662 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to 2 pence, #416 of 1915 🔗

This should be todays headline.

141202 ▶▶ Emily Tock, replying to 2 pence, #417 of 1915 🔗

Just saw it, liked it, and retweeted it!

140470 davews, replying to davews, 6, #418 of 1915 🔗

Some thoughts on false positives. Looking at the statistics at https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/testing it seems since the beginning of this month the test process seems to be have running at nearly 100% capacity – yesterday 233k tests, capacity 253k. Earlier in the summer it was more like 50% of capacity. I suspect this leads to many corners being cut to keep the pace up and cross contamination, with many tests being done in car parks through car windows, must be a huge factor. Any reputable test station surely does quality processes to establish the reliability of their process. If they do do such why is that information not made public?
Don’t expect Hancock, or even Witty, to know this…

140475 ▶▶ IanE, replying to davews, 1, #419 of 1915 🔗

Hmm, I suspect that they do indeed know!

140492 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to davews, 1, #420 of 1915 🔗

Are all the binned tests being classed as positive or negative?

140471 janeinthemindfield, replying to janeinthemindfield, 12, #421 of 1915 🔗

I am having a very disturbing time commenting on a guardian article this morning: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/21/local-lockdowns-begin-no-normal-advice-live-with-covid

I made several comments saying e.g. that the loss of our civil liberties is a disproportionate response to something that kills 10 x less than flu at the moment and also that we should not be made to feel guilty for normal behaviour and that the anti lockdown protest speakers dont necessarily speak for me in regards to 5G etc.

All these comments were deleted and my comments are now being pre moderated. I am being silenced.

I have emailed the moderators, but no response so far. I have been commenting on the Guardian articles for 10 years. Never has this ever happened to me.

Lately I have moved from the Guardian to the Telegraph as I could no longer bear to read it, but then I thought i would comment on stuff so that a proper debate could be had with people of differing opinions.

I am very disturbed.

140990 ▶▶ Mark, replying to janeinthemindfield, 3, #422 of 1915 🔗

The Guardian shut down proper debate decades ago on their website. They do not tolerate, and never have tolerated, dissent. Only opinion within the bounds of what their moderators regard as reasonable are allowed. Censorship and banning have been used to enforce that rigidly. I was banned from there before the Iraq War, iirc, possibly before the Yugoslav war. The Off-Guardian site was set up precisely because even lefties found their permitted range of opinion too restrictive.

If you haven’t noticed that already, it is most likely because you share their views of what is a reasonable range of opinion and haven’t stepped outside it until now.

141686 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to janeinthemindfield, 2, #423 of 1915 🔗

I was a Guardian reader until a few months ago when I got fed up with being called names for expressing doubts about the lockdown. That’s when I found this site. My old comments are still there and I occasionally try to get through to people but it feels like a fool’s errand. Sorry that you got kicked off the Guardian, but if I posted the same sorts of things I do here, I’d be modded as well.

It’s hard, but you probably need to do what I did – move on. The Guardian doesn’t want people like us. They won’t be getting any more financial support from me in future either.

Strangely enough, I now post on the Daily Mail. While I disagree with peoples’ opinions on almost every other subject, I find plenty of like-minded people when it comes to the government’s actions on the virus.

140477 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 25, #424 of 1915 🔗

One of my customers just asked what she should write on our T&T post-it notes. I suggested a message to the government. She asked” why, what have they done now?”. I asked if what they had done already wasn’t enough and provided a list (you know, economic devastation, removal of liberty etc. etc.). Cue deathly silence all round and another customer furiously tapping away on his phone. I think I may be in trouble again!

Just thought of a way of dealing with the bloody irritating cold calls I am bombarded with on a daily basis. Am going to answer with “Pandemic Hotline” in the style of the brilliant JP Sears.

140491 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to kh1485, 10, #425 of 1915 🔗

She’s only gone and put her dog’s name on there!

140493 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 2, #426 of 1915 🔗

I’m assuming the dog was there?

140504 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #427 of 1915 🔗

Yes he/she was (don’t want to break GDPR rules by divulging which it is!).

140513 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 6, #428 of 1915 🔗

Then in full compliance with the law. Nowhere does it say that the T&T form must name a human.

140578 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #429 of 1915 🔗

Could result in some interesting calls from the T&T bods though …

140630 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to kh1485, 1, #430 of 1915 🔗

lol

140478 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #431 of 1915 🔗

Together with false positive tests from pillar 2, we also hear of people who book a test, do not take the test and get a positive result.

The way they are doing this testing is failing us.

Who is actually doing the testing, is it PHE, NHS, military, private companies or a mix and match of the above?

140486 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Dave #KBF, 6, #432 of 1915 🔗

McDonalds

140495 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #433 of 1915 🔗

Pillar 2 are the Serco-type operations.

140869 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #434 of 1915 🔗

Increasingly, the people doing the tests are those who stand to profit from us doing more of them. Rates reducing? Simply increase the cycle threshold and… PROFIT! £££

140480 Roadrash, replying to Roadrash, 4, #435 of 1915 🔗

There’s a HYS on bbc under the Triggle article. Dash in uptick all the sensible comments before the 77th brigade lot get in!

140641 ▶▶ Marie R, replying to Roadrash, #436 of 1915 🔗

It won’t let me post

141690 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Roadrash, #437 of 1915 🔗

Did it.

140490 RickH, replying to RickH, 7, #438 of 1915 🔗

A couple of thoughts on the items in today’s edition.

First – it’s interesting to see how Heneghan and the CEBM have stopped pulling punches. Up to recently, articles have been remarkably restrained in avoiding going beyond the strict bounds of scientific discourse. Clearly something has changed as the government-supporting pseudo-scientists have become more egregious in their myth creation.

Re. France – given the difference in levels between the peak of infections and the current situation, I am bemused at the idea that hospitals are under any strain.

Re. Scotland and the union :

“very few people value liberal democracy, having no problem when democratic governments took away their freedom”

…. is a common problem that is patently true.

But it is interesting how this cuts across both the issue of the national union and the EU.

The fascinating issue about the UK is that, in this case, the Wee Krankie has held onto her image by actually doing the same as Johnson – not by any difference in approach.

In the larger context of the EU – Brexit has clearly become an irrelevance as the UK, governed by a distinctly pro-Brexit caucus has behaved exactly in line with the wider governmental consensus at the global level. How many of us would have foreseen the slavish adoption of the framework of a common framework of the police state as the successor to the Brexit argument?

141368 ▶▶ matt, replying to RickH, #439 of 1915 🔗

“The fascinating issue about the UK is that, in this case, the Wee Krankie has held onto her image by actually doing the same as Johnson – not by any difference in approach.”

I hate to admit it, because I loathe the woman, but she-who-must-not-be-named is a far better communicator than Johnson. You’re right, she’s done the same things, but she’s managed to maintain her demeanor of only trying to do what’s best. Assuming he ever had it (and I used to think he did), Johnson has now lost his knack of getting the message across. Possibly he’s good at getting exuberance across, but all he thinks he has to give now is doom. Either way, at this point, I wouldn’t give him 50p if he were in a sleeping bag next to a cash machine.

140494 Dave #KBF, 3, #440 of 1915 🔗

Blood pressure tablets anyone, we may need them after this.

increased number of “cases” is not due to increase testing.

140496 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 2, #441 of 1915 🔗

buttering us up for a lockdown

140497 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to steve_w, 1, #442 of 1915 🔗

We will need monthly vaccinations the way he is talking.

140782 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Dave #KBF, #443 of 1915 🔗

Massive cash for his sponsors.

140498 NickR, 10, #444 of 1915 🔗

Is London really on the brink. I’ve plotted the latest test data for 3 London areas, Westminster, Sutton & Haringey, I could have picked any, they all show a similar trend.

I’ve also included the rate of testing increase. You can see that testing is going up faster than positive results & as we know that the relationship between more tests and more positives is so crucial (I’ll repost my graphic from yesterday showing that 1,000 positive tests may represent as few as 13 symptomatic people).

Before Mayor Khan, Boris or Hancock go destroying businesses and lives they need to be able to tell us why this stuff is wrong. This is their own data just shown in a digestible form.

140500 steve_w, 3, #445 of 1915 🔗

‘vast majority of population susceptible based on the numbers with antibodies’

This is Neil Ferguson’s opinion all the way through

140502 EssieSW, replying to EssieSW, 4, #446 of 1915 🔗

“This isn’t a prediction” but look at this graph of how we are pretidcting cases will rise.

Expletive.

140507 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to EssieSW, 1, #447 of 1915 🔗

‘Estimated hospitisations’

140506 NickR, 6, #448 of 1915 🔗

Here’s a chart that shows how 1,000 positive cases may convert to 13 real ones.

140508 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 8, #449 of 1915 🔗

Project fear is being ramped up again as we go into flu season.

140569 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #450 of 1915 🔗

The great fearing is all they have to control. Slow patient exposure of the lies is working.

Look at Witty and Vallance walking up downing street. Two more self conciously aware unhappy wretches you are unlikely to see. These are people not at the peak of their game.

140509 Seansaighdeoir, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 18, #451 of 1915 🔗

This virus has never been exponential outside of the initial rise and there is no reason to believe it now after nearly 6 months ffs. Who is letting Whitty propagate these absolute falsehoods?? That guy should be locked up.

140556 ▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Seansaighdeoir, -2, #452 of 1915 🔗

Being exponential is not a property of the virus but of the sequence of numbers describing its spread. There is some reason to believe that certain numbers are increasing exponentially at the moment, such as hospital admissions with Covid in the North-West region.

140590 ▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Richard Pinch, 2, #453 of 1915 🔗

‘not a property of the virus but of the sequence of numbers describing its spread’.

Er thanks I thought that was obvious.

The numbers appear exponential as cases rise. This was true for the initial rise also. But as numbers spread as more data is known then it was obvious that the virus had a normal distribution.

The same will be true now. The reason for any ‘exponential’ rise can be many but as we head into the autumn it is normal to expect that colds and flu will increase. However these are also not ‘exponential’ as they too will have a normal distribution.

140613 ▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Richard Pinch, 4, #454 of 1915 🔗

I’m glad you told us about the numbers thing – I think we would all have been confused about that. Not.

And other sequences of numbers that might be increasing exponentially:

  • number of tests carried out
  • number of false positives
  • number of hospital admissions for reasons other than Covid
  • number of people queuing up for tests
  • number of people getting flu-like symptoms as Autumn approaches
  • directives being issued to local authorities to find more cases
  • testing company revenues
  • Neil Ferguson’s fantasy model outputs
  • SAGE’s verbal flatulence index
  • ‘Professor’ Trish Greenhalgh’s excitement
140647 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #455 of 1915 🔗

If you’re not confused about it, that’s good. The phrase “This virus has never been exponential” was, if not confused, at least confusing, in suggesting that being exponential was a property of the virus.

140860 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Seansaighdeoir, #456 of 1915 🔗

The “exponential” bit is that it reduces exponentially, rather than increases exponentially (as immunity builds). Gompertz.

140510 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 2, #457 of 1915 🔗

“Sir Patrick says about three million people – or 8% – in the UK have antibodies, meaning the vast majority of us are not protected and are susceptible to the disease.
If someone has antibodies present it suggests they have already had the virus.
The number of people with antibodies is a little higher in the cities – perhaps as high as 17% in London, he adds.”

140543 ▶▶ RickH, replying to steve_w, 10, #458 of 1915 🔗

Jeez! How can a ‘scientific advisor’ get away with such garbage about the sources of immunity? Even amateurs like myself know at least the fact that it is a far more multi-factor issue.

140595 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to steve_w, 1, #459 of 1915 🔗

Are they doing any random antibody testing? Otherwise how can they know?

140645 ▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Carrie, 1, #460 of 1915 🔗

Yes, ONS are doing both PCR testing (current infection) and antibody testing (past infection). See Coronavirus (COVID-19) Infection Survey pilot: England and Wales, 18 September 2020 . Currently 6% for England and 11% for London.
Whitty’s 8% and 17% figures are from tests on blood donors, who of course are not a random sample, being more likely to be healthy young adults.

140974 ▶▶▶ djaustin, replying to Carrie, #461 of 1915 🔗

Four independent random studies were presented. Only the blood donor study is non-random selection. They all give broadly the same conclusion – less than 1/10 people have antibodies against the pathogen. We can debate the role of other routes of immunity (e.g., cross-reactive T cell), but there have been no epidemiological studies that have shown a role for this route in SARS-COV2 infection.

141147 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to djaustin, #462 of 1915 🔗

According to the excellent Simon Rushworth MD, there have been no epidemiological studies that show that antibodies necessarily confer immunity either.
“As yet, no proper studies have been performed, to my knowledge, showing that antibodies give immunity to covid, and no studies have been done showing that T-cells give immunity to covid either for that matter. However, we know from experience of infectious diseases in general that an antibody response and/or a T-cell response usually means that you are protected from future infection, at least for a time, and often for a lifetime.”

And the recent Karolinska Institutet study found:-

“Let’s start with the blood donors who donated blood in 2019. They weren’t tested for antibodies (strange, I would have tested them just to have a baseline, to see what the rate of false positives was, but maybe there was some technical reason as to why this wasn’t possible) but they were tested for covid-specific T-cells. Not surprisingly, no-one in that group had T-cells (0/37).
Next, we can look at the people who were convalescing from severe disease. Among these individuals, 100% had antibodies, and 100% had T-cells (23/23). This makes sense. When you have a severe illness, you get a strong immune response.
Next up, let’s look at the people who were convalescing from mild disease. In this group 87% had antibodies (27/31), while 97% had T-cells (30/31). Again, this makes sense – if you have symptomatic disease, then that is a sign your immune system has realized there is an infection going on, so there should eventually be signs of that in the form of measurable antibodies and/or T-cells.
Now we can look at the exposed family members. Remember, this was a group of people that had not shown signs of symptomatic disease. In this group, 60% had antibodies (17/28), while 93% had T-cells! (26/28). This is pretty astonishing, and it shows two things. Firstly, if you lived with someone who had covid then you were most likely also infected. This is true even if you didn’t have symptoms, and even though you didn’t have symptoms, you most likely developed an adaptive immune response. Secondly, that immune response involved T-cells more often than antibodies.
Finally, we can look at the people who donated blood in May 2020. This was a random sample, so we don’t know how many had had symptomatic disease and how many had been completely asymptomatic up to the time point when their blood was drawn. In this group, 13% had antibodies to covid (4/31) and 29% had T-cells (9/31). That is pretty astounding. Now, again, this was a small trial and the cohort was small so the confidence intervals are wide. But it is still remarkable that twice as many people had T-cells as had antibodies in the random sample.
Additionally, this was in May, two months in to the pandemic. If 29% of Stockholm’s population had T-cells in May, then it’s reasonable to expect that by now, three months later, that number has at least doubled, which makes for a very reasonable explanation as to why the covid death rate has fallen so precipitously in Sweden – we’ve now reached the point where we have herd immunity. This is a speculative conclusion considering the small sample size, but it makes sense.”

https://sebastianrushworth.com/2020/08/08/what-is-the-best-way-to-measure-rates-of-covid-immunity/

140856 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to steve_w, #463 of 1915 🔗

That’s the blood serum percentage for specific antibodies. If you expand it to e.g. nasal tract, tear ducts etc. and include less specific antibodies, the number will be higher. See Hendrick Streeck interview on YouTube with “Unherd TV” for a fuller explanation.

140514 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 11, #464 of 1915 🔗

Wonder what they would be saying if they weren’t both so naturally optimistic.

140518 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to arfurmo, 4, #465 of 1915 🔗

larf!

140516 JohnB, replying to JohnB, 9, #466 of 1915 🔗

Watch Whitty’s right hand shaking. He’s clenching it to try and control it.

140541 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to JohnB, 5, #467 of 1915 🔗

Hitler syndrome?

140579 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 3, #468 of 1915 🔗

Notice how his left hand was well hidden and never seen throughout the briefing. I bet it was shaking like f*ck!

140584 ▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 1, #469 of 1915 🔗

Doctor Strangelove?

140638 ▶▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Barney McGrew, 1, #470 of 1915 🔗

Mein Fuhrer!!

140765 ▶▶▶ redbirdpete, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 3, #471 of 1915 🔗

Well i certainly think that he’s under terrible strain. And KNOWS he’s lying – he can’t be as innumerate as Hancock. Reminds me of the poor chap that blew the whistle on the false WMD report.

140574 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JohnB, 4, #472 of 1915 🔗

These are the signs to look for.

140520 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 11, #473 of 1915 🔗

flattening the curve to protect the NHS – god help us

140523 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, 8, #474 of 1915 🔗

now mentioning the economy and mental health. probably wants to steer away from the cancer murders

140522 Seansaighdeoir, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 8, #475 of 1915 🔗

It is NOT a pandemic!!!!!

140666 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 5, #476 of 1915 🔗

According to Ivor Cummins it’s not even an epidemic – that finished around early June.

140524 David Mc, 1, #477 of 1915 🔗
140525 Seansaighdeoir, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 23, #478 of 1915 🔗

Fuck off Whitty. If masks worked why are we even having this conversation?? Quite clearly you are admitting that they don’t otherwise how you maintain the lie that ‘cases’ are rising?

140632 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 3, #479 of 1915 🔗

No doubt they’ll say it’s because we aren’t wearing masks everywhere including outdoors and in our homes, etc. So the full implementation of masks will no doubt happen in the next few months.

140636 ▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to JohnB, 3, #480 of 1915 🔗

You’re a little ray of sunshine Skipper but I think you’re probably right.

140526 Emily, replying to Emily, #481 of 1915 🔗

How do I get in touch with Will Jones please?

140527 Dave #KBF, 6, #483 of 1915 🔗

Kill the elderly & infirm, *uck those with cancer, say hello to the new world order.

140963 ▶▶ Basics, replying to RS @ home, #485 of 1915 🔗

It’s just incompetence don’t give it another thought.

Good to see it starkly shown by your comment.

140529 mhcp, 8, #486 of 1915 🔗

So the increase in positives is happening a) within the natural rise of respiratory illnesses and b) you haven’t changed the symptoms so you have the same attribution errors. But now because you are in the habit of it it’s easier to make the mistake.

Sweden is laughing at these idiots

140530 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 2, #487 of 1915 🔗

4 things we can do

1 – masks, space and washing hands
2 – self-isolation and contact tracing
3 – stop households mixing
4 – vaccines

140535 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to steve_w, 1, #488 of 1915 🔗

Is he aware there isn’t a vaccine?

140538 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Achilles, 3, #489 of 1915 🔗

he had a slide with a list of his sponsors

140545 ▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to steve_w, 3, #490 of 1915 🔗

He should not have sponsors he is a civil servant.

140591 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to steve_w, #491 of 1915 🔗

And yet Sweden is only doing 1 and 2 (and the first part of 2 is limited to the actually sick, and vulnerable)…

140624 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Carrie, 3, #492 of 1915 🔗

No muzzles in Sweden

140701 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to arfurmo, #493 of 1915 🔗

I know – I live there 😉

140693 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to steve_w, #494 of 1915 🔗

All these indirectly exacerbate the health harm from the virus, by keeping susceptible the minority who are still susceptible, by reducing the efficacy of the human immunity through isolation, and by increasing anxiety and depression.
We don’t have a vaccine, other than mother nature’s vaccine.
What we need is a live attenuated vaccine.
Ah yes. The virus itself is serving that function now, since it appears to have lost most of its virulence.

140531 Jenny, replying to Jenny, 13, #495 of 1915 🔗

OK so far:

1.increased testing has not resulted in increased positives – surely we can debunk this
2.wider immunity not addressed – neatly dodged with no focus on antibodies
3.no mention of false positives
4.banging on about virus still being dangerous but a mild illness for most – wtf
5.talks about indirect deaths and implications of virus getting out of control but fluffs it on increased deaths and implications happening now
6.dodges actual hospitalisations

Political nuggets – keen to mention no rise in children (i.e. they want to keep schools open)

140845 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Jenny, #496 of 1915 🔗

There probably has been a slight uptick in real positives. I have expected this since April/May when I came to the view that this would be endemic and that they would increase in autumn/winter with an actual spike very slightly after the flu season (as is normal for coronaviruses). Strongly agree with your sentiments generally though!

140532 EssieSW, replying to EssieSW, 15, #497 of 1915 🔗

Breaking news: “Sir Patrick Vallance warns Britain could be facing 50,000 new cases a day by mid-October leading to 200 deaths a day if current rate of infection is not halted”

But it’s not a prediction apparently.

All ready for the extention of the Coronavirus Act at the end of the month.

140547 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to EssieSW, 5, #498 of 1915 🔗

So even if his worst case scenario takes hold Covid will still only account for about 12% of daily deaths? No biggy then.

140560 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to EssieSW, 2, #499 of 1915 🔗

Is 200 deaths a day that much worse than a bad flu season?

140562 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to A. Contrarian, #500 of 1915 🔗

about the same I’d have thought

140566 ▶▶▶ EssieSW, replying to A. Contrarian, #501 of 1915 🔗

Well Whitty quoted a figure of 20,000 deaths during the last bad flu season

140585 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to EssieSW, #502 of 1915 🔗

Yes, that is the REAL aim of all this!

140735 ▶▶ Locked down and out, replying to EssieSW, 1, #503 of 1915 🔗

Exactly. You are spot on and it’s why the fear porn is being ramped up this week to get the extension nodded through the HoC.

140533 DomW, replying to DomW, 41, #504 of 1915 🔗

Thanks to all of you brave enough to watch and report this hideous outpouring of lies and fear. It’s too much for me to take directly and I really appreciate the filter you’re providing.

140536 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to DomW, 4, #505 of 1915 🔗

Ditto

140563 ▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to DomW, 1, #506 of 1915 🔗

Same here. I can’t watch any of them, if I did something would end up through the tv and I can’t afford a new one!.

140582 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to DomW, 1, #507 of 1915 🔗

Yes, I feel sick just at the sight of their faces..

140660 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to DomW, 1, #508 of 1915 🔗

It wasn’t that bad really. I only leapt off the sofa and threw myself around the room spitting with rage once!

140534 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 7, #509 of 1915 🔗

now its all about vaccines and stopping us meeting until we have one

140540 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to steve_w, 5, #510 of 1915 🔗

What about your health passport, you will need one of those, like a dog travelling across international borders.

140550 ▶▶▶ 2 pence, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #511 of 1915 🔗

The plan then states that there would be “full rollout” in early 2021 to 10 million tests a day, to “enable people to return to and maintain normal life.” At this stage, weekly testing would be made available progressively to the whole population to allow people to go to high risk events by using a “digital passport” to show they have tested negative for the virus.

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3558?fbclid=IwAR2dJkmPMYF8hzfaqwtv2xaM4JS_xdIGBVEpPW4XoWhxyknxs3bnHTf1Liw

140581 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to 2 pence, #512 of 1915 🔗

Did Whitty and Vallance mention that?

140537 mhcp, 14, #513 of 1915 🔗

That is the best example of cognitive dissonance I’ve seen since Comical Ali and the CNN guy reporting on the “mostly peaceful protests” with the house on fire behind him

140539 Jenny, 6, #514 of 1915 🔗

Are you there Carl, it’s me, Jenny?

140544 steve_w, 5, #515 of 1915 🔗

so that’s over.

it was preparation for a lockdown or short circuit or whatever. but they want schools and business opened.

140548 B Boru, 5, #516 of 1915 🔗

If this so called ‘briefing’ doesn’t finally convince all the non believers and ‘conspiracy theory’ sceptics that all of this is a pre-meditated conspiracy to enslave the human race into a ‘new normal’ of totalitarian authoritarianism where the Ministry of Information controls the public narrative and everything goes down the memory hole that doesn’t suit the party at that particular time then I don’t know what will.

Reading a centrally dictated script. The same messages, almost word for word being used all around the world!

When telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act (Orwell) then the baw’s bust!

140549 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 6, #517 of 1915 🔗

Whitty – ‘this is not a prediction’

BBC – “ UK faces 50,000 cases a day by October without action”

140559 ▶▶ Mike, replying to steve_w, 1, #518 of 1915 🔗

They just can’t help themselves…

140588 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to steve_w, #519 of 1915 🔗

True, because it is a lie

140589 ▶▶ Basics, replying to steve_w, 2, #520 of 1915 🔗

Marianna Spring will be out and about dousing outbreaks of misinformation – the bbc will soo correct their error. No wait. Marianna spring is their to assist misinformation. Incompetent journalist that she is.

140756 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to steve_w, 1, #521 of 1915 🔗

Still using the word “cases” and not infections.

140551 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 8, #522 of 1915 🔗

Interesting that Johnson is not on the podium until tomorrow.

Maybe to see what the media response is to todays shenanigans.

140570 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Dave #KBF, #523 of 1915 🔗

Totally agree.

140592 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Jenny, 1, #524 of 1915 🔗

Yes, to gauge opinion first.

140552 Ewan Duffy, 5, #525 of 1915 🔗
140553 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 10, #526 of 1915 🔗

Just got back in and missed the Twatty & Imbalance show – did they come clean and admitted to their colossal fuck ups?

140571 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Major Panic, 6, #527 of 1915 🔗

I’ll let you take a guess at that…

140575 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Major Panic, 6, #528 of 1915 🔗

I would love to say yes, but here, we tend to try and share accurate information.

140649 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Major Panic, 1, #529 of 1915 🔗

Thanks MP – that made me laugh!!

140554 dpj, replying to dpj, 21, #530 of 1915 🔗

OK, we need Carl Heneghan, Anders Tegnell or someone similar to come out with a quick statement to rubbish what those two have just said.
As I said on here on Friday and others have repeated this is project fear turned up to 11 to make sure emergency powers vote goes the way the government wants it.

140564 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to dpj, 4, #531 of 1915 🔗

I agree. This needs a step by step debunking.

140573 ▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to Jenny, 1, #532 of 1915 🔗

Ivor Cummins is just the man for the job!

140608 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Arnie, #533 of 1915 🔗

1.1 million views 8/9 excellent video. Btw.

140669 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to dpj, 2, #534 of 1915 🔗
140557 NickR, 5, #535 of 1915 🔗

I’d be more impressed if the increase in positive tests was reflected in an increase in the proportion of positive tests as a percentage of all tests administered. I don’t see that.

140558 Roadrash, replying to Roadrash, 15, #536 of 1915 🔗

So according the Vallance we haven’t reached herd immunity but need to stop people mixing who aren’t vulnerable and could help develop it? Whitty saying “ if I increase my risk then I increase the risk to everyone”. WTF, how when he also admitted that for most people it is a mild illness and and if they do get it they will developing the bloody anti bodies he says we haven’t got. I effing give up.

this is just a cue no doubt to tomorrow’s announcement to more restrictions

140646 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Roadrash, 2, #537 of 1915 🔗

Spot on.

Two things:

(1) the X axis on the Spanish graph – did I see it showing 0.2 of a death per 100,000, i.e ONE death per 500,000?
(2) Whitty saying we must bear in mind NHS treatment being withdrawn will be a consequence of further restrictions. No shit, Sherlock. Tell us something we don’t know. No acknowledgment of deaths caused by the first lockdown. Are these men psycopaths?

Another psy-op leading – they hope – to compulsory vaccinations.

140771 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to charleyfarley, 1, #538 of 1915 🔗

On point 2 – it is worse than that as they are now pointing the finger of blame on people not following the rules causing other conditions to not be treated on the NHS. i.e. it is those bad sceptics causing people to die from cancer, because their irresponsible behaviour is creating more Covid “cases” and clogging up the NHS. Definitely nothing to do with government policy.

140561 theanalyst, 4, #539 of 1915 🔗

“Buy, Buy, Buy”
“Sell, Sell, Sell”
“Test, Test, Test”
“Fear, Fear, Fear”
“Money, Money, Money”

Just a random thought.

140565 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 4, #540 of 1915 🔗

2 week lockdown being suggested by some ‘Sir’ from SAGE on BBC

140586 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to steve_w, 16, #541 of 1915 🔗

SAGE are a menace to society, incentivised only to urge caution. They should be locked up.

140600 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to jhfreedom, 1, #542 of 1915 🔗

I agree with you.

140634 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to jhfreedom, 2, #543 of 1915 🔗

The problem is, anyone who gives expert advice in these situations is strongly incentivised to present worst cases and urge caution, because they suffer little from being over cautious but massively from being under cautious, and they don’t bear the costs of over–reaction. That is born by the people and, ultimately by the government who (should) make the decisions taking a lot of wider factors beyond the medical advice into account.

A wise government takes that into account when considering their advice. A stupid government – well we’ve just seen what they do played out over the past six months.

140689 ▶▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Mark, 3, #544 of 1915 🔗

Yes, there is no punishment for saying “I tried to protect people”. Well, there should be because they’re going to kill 100s of thousands in their efforts to ‘be kind’.

140695 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Mark, 1, #545 of 1915 🔗

Indeed, an important tool in government planning is the Reasonable Worst Case. It is explicitly not a prediction, but an assessment of the worst thing you reasonably need to plan for being able to cope with.

For example, the RWC is that your house might burn down and one of your guests might be killed. Could you cope with that? Perhaps you might decide to install smoke alarms and take out insurance. You’re not saying that you predict that your house will burn down, simply that it. might — and you’re now satisfied you can cope with the worst thing that’s reasonably likely to happen.

It would be a mistake to refuse to invite people round because you had heard a prediction that your house will burn down.

140794 ▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #546 of 1915 🔗

Reasonable Worst Case”

Notice that crucial first word. It makes all the difference.

What probability is ‘reasonable’? Given that ‘reasonableness’ is an imp0rtant legal criterion.

140800 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to RickH, #547 of 1915 🔗

PS You notice that the opposite pole of ‘reasonable’ (i.e the equal probability of vanishingly mild effects) is not emphasized.

141110 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to RickH, #548 of 1915 🔗

I’m not aware of a formal definition in that sense. However, let me quote from evidence given by the then Chief Science Adviser to the Commons Science and Technology Select Committee:

Reasonable worst case scenario

75. The second stage of the NRA process is assessing risks and their impacts. Risks are assessed using available historical, statistical and scientific data. Where possible, the assessment should take account of probable developments over the next five years. Impacts are assessed against five main criteria:

the numbers of fatalities that are likely to be directly attributable to the emergency;

the extent of human illnesses or injury over a period following the onset of an emergency;

social disruption;

economic damage; and

the potential for significant outrage and anxiety to be caused to communities.

76. The assessment leads to the development of a “reasonable worst case scenario” for every risk. The reasonable worst case scenario is “designed to exclude theoretically possible scenarios which have so little probability of occurring that planning for them would be likely to lead to disproportionate use of resources.”

The Government stated that:

They are not predictions of what will happen but of the worst that might realistically happen, and therefore we would expect most pandemics to be less severe and less widespread than the reasonable worst case. By planning for the reasonable worst case planners are assured that they have a high probability of meeting the demands posed by the hazard should it occur.

140726 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Mark, 3, #549 of 1915 🔗

Whitty and Vallance have been ‘detached’ from the government to make their predictions (not Boris not there), so that when they are proved wrong, the government cannot be blamed – those 2 will be the fall guys..

141420 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Carrie, #550 of 1915 🔗

Good point.

140587 ▶▶ Norma McNormalface, replying to steve_w, 5, #551 of 1915 🔗

From his comfortable home in South West London. The guy after him had a bow-tie and waistcoat on, and some nice antique-looking art in the background. I’m sure the second lockdown will be a lovely chance for the pair of them to catch up on some gardening.

140594 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to steve_w, 3, #552 of 1915 🔗

Just two weeks to break the circuit. I seem to recall hearing something similar once before.

We all know that the next lockdown will not be lifted until everyone has been vaccinated.

140605 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Richard O, 5, #553 of 1915 🔗

Ignore, defy it

140609 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to jhfreedom, 4, #554 of 1915 🔗

I have no choice but to do so. Sadly the vast majority will be rolling up their sleeves without a second thought that they are condemning themselves to a technocratic dystopian hell for the rest of their lives. Shame on all of them.

140629 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to steve_w, 1, #555 of 1915 🔗

Déjà entendu anyone?

140567 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 13, #556 of 1915 🔗

50,000 cases a day – wow – they’ll need to do 5 million test a day to get that many false positives…

140572 ▶▶ Kev, replying to Major Panic, 3, #557 of 1915 🔗

Actually they’d need to do 500 million a day. Equates to everyone in the countryt almost 10 times.

140606 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Kev, #558 of 1915 🔗

crikey – that’s interesting maths

140619 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Kev, 1, #559 of 1915 🔗

False Positives “under 1%” {Handycockup) 50k x 100 = 5million.

140622 ▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #560 of 1915 🔗

And in fact the UK government found it to be 2.3% in June, so even the 1% is doubtful.

140576 Dave #KBF, 10, #561 of 1915 🔗

Peter Hitchins is on form in response to Chris & Patricks predictions.

Hitchins talking about various people not liking the views of others, but needing to get along… “In a matter like this where the future of the country is involved.”

The event this morning shows that reality is playing no part in current events.

140583 janeinthemindfield, replying to janeinthemindfield, 3, #562 of 1915 🔗

Sorry, I linked to the wrong article, its : https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/21/local-lockdowns-begin-no-normal-advice-live-with-covid . I was saying that the response to covid is disproportionate etc. (more detail inthe other post). The removed all my posts and are now pre-moderating everything I say which means nothing I post is going up now and I have been silenced. I have phined and emailed and got no response. Ive been commenting on there for 10 years. Shocked and disturbed. Not sure where my posts are stored so I can find them again?

140679 ▶▶ Countrygirl, replying to janeinthemindfield, 1, #563 of 1915 🔗

I couldn’t read much of that. It’s just the usual doom and gloom that the Guardian has been churning out for the last 7mts, never the faintest glimmer of optimism or hope on their pages. The OH still reads it, I went back to the Telegraph a couple of months ago and I think he’ll be joining me soon. Btw, I think I’ve upvoted one of your comments on there!

140597 Mrs issedoff, replying to Mrs issedoff, 31, #564 of 1915 🔗

I had a stroke two years ago and worked hard on my health and fitness, before lockdown I was in a good place. Now I can’t sleep, have constant tension headaches, have a foul temper,drink too much, have no motivation, the list goes on but you get the picture. This isn’t me feeling sorry for myself, on the contrary, all this crap has impacted me far less than millions of others. I feel angry for all the sick not getting treatment, all the elderly in care homes and those who are isolated, all those who have lost their jobs who will shortly, again the list goes on. I just want to sleep and wake up when the madness is over but know I need to keep fighting in my own way.

Thank you to everyone on here who has kept me sane on days when I really feel that I could lose the plot. Most of my family are in a coma and look at me with pity in their eyes, look at our sister the conspiracy theorist, never mind, she may recover one day!.

140777 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Mrs issedoff, 2, #565 of 1915 🔗

Hang in there. There are lots of us here who agree with you.

140833 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Mrs issedoff, #566 of 1915 🔗

They don’t know it, but your understanding of reality (it’s not scepticism, it’s simply an appreciation of truth) might save them… I try and take solace in that when things are tough.

140599 Bob, replying to Bob, 2, #567 of 1915 🔗

It’d be nice if they could explain what they aim to achieve with another “lockdown”, of course it’s quite tricky to explain that when one hasn’t a clue.

140604 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bob, 5, #568 of 1915 🔗

The aim was clear from what they said, it’s to get everyone vaccinated.

140654 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to JohnB, 3, #569 of 1915 🔗

If that’s the case, we’ll be locked down till this time next year. Dr Scott Gottlieb, former head of the FDA, said last night likely no vaccine until Q2/Q3 2021 – he should know as he is on the board of Pfizer.

140720 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #570 of 1915 🔗

Maybe not even then… read this:

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2020/09/21/coronavirus-vaccine-patent.aspx?cid_source=dnl&cid_medium=email&cid_content=art1HL&cid=20200921Z1&mid=DM660562&rid=969575901

If top executives at vaccine manufacturers are offloading their shares, then that could be a sign they know they are in trouble..

140602 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 58, #571 of 1915 🔗

Found this in Vallance’s bin:

140616 ▶▶ Poppy, replying to Sarigan, 7, #572 of 1915 🔗

Gave me a good laugh! Humour is one of our best defences against this utter lunacy.

140618 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Poppy, 3, #573 of 1915 🔗

yes, I’ve already sent it to multiple email addresses. very good 🙂

140678 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Sarigan, 4, #574 of 1915 🔗

Lovely. Orange is my favorite pen too!

140836 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Sarigan, 2, #575 of 1915 🔗

Thank you so much. Not a lot to laugh at these days but that did the job.

140603 Kev, 8, #576 of 1915 🔗

Farage is opposing 2nd lockdown, we need someone to get behind!

The biggest problem all the counter experts face is lack of platform, BBC have one narrative and only one narrative.

140607 mhcp, replying to mhcp, 11, #577 of 1915 🔗

Hello everyone, I’m Dr Sunken and this is Dr Cost. Together we are Fallacy!!!

140772 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to mhcp, 1, #578 of 1915 🔗

the jokes on this site are just getting better

140611 Kev, replying to Kev, 13, #579 of 1915 🔗

So 50,000 cases in mid October based on what? Lets guess, computer modelling by Neil Ferguson at Imperial College maybe?

In 2005 he predicted, based on his computer modelling that up to 200 million would die worldwide from Avian Flu H5N1, total eventual deaths was actually just 440.

That neil Ferguson.

140615 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Kev, 4, #580 of 1915 🔗

They aren’t even modelling now, just looking at the trend and extrapolating.

That’s why we are all dead of flu by Spring every year

140652 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to steve_w, 4, #581 of 1915 🔗

It was another Hockey Stick

140659 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to steve_w, 4, #582 of 1915 🔗

Yes. They’ve gone from computer-assisted guesswork to pure guesswork.

140681 ▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Kev, -4, #583 of 1915 🔗

In 2005 he predicted, based on his computer modelling that up to 200 million would die worldwide from Avian Flu H5N1

That’s not correct. In 2005 he was interviewed by The Guardian about what might happen if Avian flu was transmitted between humans rather than only from birds to humans, and that was his off-the-cuff (not modelled) answer. As if happened, Avian flu did not become transmissible between humans, which is good.

140770 ▶▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Richard Pinch, 5, #584 of 1915 🔗

He is still a cunt

141689 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Richard Pinch, #585 of 1915 🔗

I’m sure RP’s reply is technically correct here (and don’t understand the down-votes), and that we have to be careful in how we criticise the Great Professor.

He appears to like making apocalyptic projections, but to caveat at them such that, strictly speaking, he was still correct.

I’m don’t know if his work has ever given any benefit to mankind, yet it is clear that in some instances it has caused great harm. I am gobsmacked that he is regarded by anyone in government as a credible source of advice.

141797 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to TJN, #586 of 1915 🔗

Let me be clear, that I hold no brief for Prof. Ferguson, nor have I analysed his complex models. I do however believe, firstly, that models in general, when correctly used, are capable of being valuable, and secondly, that Prof. Ferguson, like everyone else, is entitled to be criticised for what he actually said and did, rather than some fictitious version thereof — and the analogous belief for his or anyone else’s modelling.

142172 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Richard Pinch, 1, #587 of 1915 🔗

I think that’s a very fair comment – especially ‘ Prof. Ferguson, like everyone else, is entitled to be criticised for what he actually said and did, rather than some fictitious version thereof’

Much as I dislike the bloke, we’re not witch-hunting here, and we should try to deal in actual credible evidence.

In my opinion, if we get through to the actual evidence, as opposed to exaggerated reporting hereof, the case against him will likely get even more damning.

No idea if you’ll read this by now.

140612 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #588 of 1915 🔗

Does someone know where I could watch the Vallance and Whitty show ‘on demand’ please? I can’t find a link. Thanks 🙂

140614 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Country Mumkin, #589 of 1915 🔗

You can rewind on Talk Radio:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jesxGwo4bTg

140617 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 6, #590 of 1915 🔗

Have a glass of something strong in hand.

140737 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Sarigan, 3, #591 of 1915 🔗

Thank you. Goodness me. I have watched it.

“This graph is not a prediction” Absolutely terrible!

There’s so much fear fodder for the press to print in the next 24 hours isn’t there….

140620 court, replying to court, 11, #592 of 1915 🔗

I think they’ve overplayed their hand. In the last 6 months even the most conformist have become armchair experts and can see straight through the fear porn graphs shown.

140655 ▶▶ Basics, replying to court, 1, #593 of 1915 🔗

Very astute comment imo.

140621 Harry hopkins, 20, #594 of 1915 🔗

I enclose a copy of the letter sent to my local Labour MP, Alex Sobel this morning.
I would encourage other sceptics to do the same to their respective MPs.

Dear Alex,

As a seventy year old resident of Otley I voted enthusiastically for you at the last election. I now find myself in a position where I disagree entirely with the Labour party on its whole approach to Covid-19. The damage that has been done to the country in the last six months is incalculable. The absence of any decent NHS service would turn Nye Bevan in his grave. The loss of life and ill health brought about by ‘lock downs’ has dwarfed those lost to Covid. Covid, as all the evidence is now showing, is something we have to learn to live with just as we do with colds and flu of other strains. You cannot get rid of a virus by government decree.

This country now needs politicians who have courage and leadership to make a stand against the creeping dictatorship that is now only too apparent. Parliament MUST take back control of this renegade government before it damages this country and its people even further.

I look to you, as a responsible member of parliament, to look to your conscience and to do the right thing in the coming days. My vote and hundreds of thousands like me will not be given to a party or an individual that lets this country down in its hour of need.

The people of Britain have had enough of lock downs, masks, ridiculous and pointless restrictions on our liberties, not to mention the divisions between neighbours, friends and families brought about by the nasty machinations of government policy.

‘Cometh the hour cometh the men’—–will you be one of the men that we so desperately need?  I  sincerely hope so.

Yours sincerely,

Harry Hopkins

140623 DomW, replying to DomW, 19, #595 of 1915 🔗

Trying really hard not to hate these monsters for what they are doing (because it’s not healthy for me) but it’s very difficult.

Yesterday my partner was in tears (again) faced with the prospect of not being able to visit his mother during another lockdown

Just reading on here about this morning’s ‘presentation’ brought me briefly to depair yet again.

The next few days (at least) are going to be very difficut I fear.

140653 ▶▶ Basics, replying to DomW, 8, #596 of 1915 🔗

Accept they are monsters. It might help to lessen the unhealthy seething. Also having 2 minutes hate as Orwell said might be a good way to avoid over bearing continuous hate.

Don’t let the monsters have what they want which is a blacking of mood and spirits. A good way to overcome it is by taking action to fight back, getting busy passing the skeptic message for example. Another way to fight is to step away and focus on the important good things in life. We must never forget the good things through actions of these monsters.

Listen to the birds singing. They are more valuable to health than words.

140697 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to DomW, 12, #597 of 1915 🔗

It’s just horrible. I me and Mrs 2-6 are super depressed at the moment since we got back from our escape to the country. Miserable, as there seems no way out of this shit-show. The people that are running it are just beyond evil.

However, I have resigned myself to this fact. I am fighting anger and despair and hopelessness on a daily basis. Swinging from one extreme to another. This does get better sometimes and I can go for a day or 4 without getting too wound up. I do need to other things to distract myself from the insanity.

However I am getting used to being in this state. Actually I have given up, it’s too late, the damage has been done. The sheeple are totally mental. Only the sheeple can get themselves out of this mess. They might be able to. Unlikely.

So society is totally destroyed. I am perversely taking some comfort in the discomfort of people. Perhaps this will “wake people up” . It’s like being strangely satisfied at watching the edifice of life as we know it being burned to the ground. It’s like they made their bed of shit, now they have to lie in it.

People are fools, powerless and totally brainwashed. Perhaps they might realise this now. About time.

There is hope.

140626 Sim18, replying to Sim18, 1, #598 of 1915 🔗

Press conference says 50,000 cases a day with 200 deaths a day. Does this mean they now think IFR is 0.4% rather than UCL report 9 IFR of 0.9% ?

140637 ▶▶ Andy C, replying to Sim18, 7, #599 of 1915 🔗

So, even in this Armageddon scenario, the virus would kill fewer people on an average day than cancer, for instance, would?

140711 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Andy C, #600 of 1915 🔗

Good point to repeat to lockdown fanatics..

140725 ▶▶▶▶ Andy C, replying to Carrie, 3, #601 of 1915 🔗

The problem with doing that is that these people aren’t interested in facts.

140671 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Sim18, 1, #602 of 1915 🔗

200 deaths with covid?? and average age >75?

140628 Basics, replying to Basics, 6, #603 of 1915 🔗

Didn’t watch todays puppet show. As such I missed the wood but see the trees. Point of todays exercise was to reinvigorate alarm by issuing the figure 50,000 cases. That is it.

Get a number out to the public. Throw the media some bones to whip up alarm (fear isn’t happening) ahead of a announcement later in the week.

What happens with public reaction over the next few days will decide the tone of communication in final annoucement made by boris in a few days.

The devolved leaders won’t do anything more than lend an indication of what kind of oppression they are attempting to add.

All the rest is chaff. – until I watch the press conference and realise I am completely wrong.

140682 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Basics, 1, #604 of 1915 🔗

Surely this is make or break week? What kind of people are they that will ensure a sick society by constantly instilling fear in people?

140631 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 1, #605 of 1915 🔗

Downing Street denies reports that Boris Johnson flew to Italy for weekend break earlier this month
An article in La Repubblica titled: The mystery of Boris Johnson’s “trip to Perugia” said that Mr Johnson visited Perugia this month
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/09/21/downing-street-denies-reports-boris-johnson-flew-italy-weekend/

The mystery of Boris Johnson’s “trip to Perugia”The mystery of Boris Johnson’s “trip to Perugia”

Boris Johnson and his partner Carrie Symonds with their son Wilfred

Exclusive: according to an official statement of the Italian airport dated September 17th, the British prime minister “travelled to Perugia over the past few days”. Sources: “Johnson landed in Perugia on Friday 11 September at 2 pm and left on Monday morning”. Downing Street: “This claim is wrong”

di ANTONELLO GUERRERA E IVANO PORFIRI

https://www.repubblica.it/esteri/2020/09/20/news/the_mystery_of_boris_johnson_s_trip_to_perugia_-267989244/

140643 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 5, #606 of 1915 🔗

Wilfred? I hope the poor bastard makes his parents’ lives a misery for that!

141074 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Nick Rose, #607 of 1915 🔗

did BlowJob have a bash street kids fetish? If so is he Fatty or Plug?

140635 Sarigan, 2, #608 of 1915 🔗

I learnt a new word today – seems apt.

Blatherskite

There were two on the telly today.

140639 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #609 of 1915 🔗

I’ve just read:- the Deadly Danger of False Positives -by Dr Michael Yeadon
https://lockdownsceptics.org/lies-damned-lies-and-health-statistics-the-deadly-danger-of-false-positives/

It makes a lot of sense. It perhaps explains the complete disjunction I’m seeing twixt “cases” and deaths in many places.

I’ve been particularly tracking the figures for the Republic of Ireland, as I was located there until the end of August.

After dipping in August mortality figures in the Republic are now beginning to creep up.

They were 40 in July – down to 11 in August – and are 19 so far this September.

But “cases” have been going up and up since the beginning of July – they’ve rocketed.

From 65 a week at the beginning of July they have now almost reached 2,000 a week.

How to explain this disjunction?

I’m now guessing it could be the result of a lot more testing and perhaps using the same testing kits as are being used in Blighty?

Has anyone in the Irish media said owt similar?

140667 ▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #610 of 1915 🔗

The definition of “case” is likely to be nothing other than positive test result (I can’t say for sure) and tests have been going up in Ireland, like in most countries, from 3353 on 05 August to 11,913 on 11 September. The rise in the number of tests accounts for almost all of the rise in the number of cases.

The proportion of tests returned positive was 1.5% at the start of June, fell to 0.3% at the start of July, and has been between 1% and 2% since the start of August.

140677 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Richard Pinch, #611 of 1915 🔗

I might be wrong as I only scanned the dataset yesterday, but I think the positivity rate by specimen data is around 1.3-1.5% now, and slightly down from about 1.6% last week?

140702 ▶▶▶▶ Richard Pinch, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #612 of 1915 🔗

I took that from OWID. They only give a 7-day rolling average. Latest is 19 September: 2.0%

140684 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to Richard Pinch, #613 of 1915 🔗

There’s also the issue that this is the first occasion in recent history where mass testing is being done. So there will be variations within variations as procedures are essentially being qualified for use. The issue is that there is no set standard in many things, even down to the level of the lab. A friend was telling me about how they want to test in a level 2 lab rather than level 3 and even that needs to be calibrated and characterised.

140847 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Richard Pinch, #614 of 1915 🔗

Thanks for those stats.

140687 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Ned of the Hills, #615 of 1915 🔗

The Irish media is a disgrace so, no.
Anyone know whether the Irish Gov publishes data about the number of tests carried out? – I haven’t been able to find it.

140644 Achilles, 6, #616 of 1915 🔗

To re-quote my own comment that I put on a BBC fear article about China all the way back in February…”Still not scared”.

140650 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 5, #617 of 1915 🔗

Will they be sending out the empty ambulances with the sirens again ?

140656 ▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to nickbowes, 1, #618 of 1915 🔗

Oh Yes all the time

140712 ▶▶ Locked down and out, replying to nickbowes, -1, #619 of 1915 🔗

I think that was fake news and Toby quickly apologised for running the running the story and then deleted.

140764 ▶▶▶ David, replying to Locked down and out, 3, #620 of 1915 🔗

I can assure you that actually happened. I noticed it myself long before I was a reader here or heard it suggested by anybody else.

140769 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Locked down and out, 1, #621 of 1915 🔗

Not convinced it was fake – it has been repeated by NHS employees. It was just unapproved news according to the government censors. I am sure it will be confirmed in due course sometime in the future.

140895 ▶▶▶▶ kf99, replying to Darryl, #622 of 1915 🔗

To be fair blue-light driving must require training with empty vehicles. Although I’d rather still have dedicated ambulance drivers (think carry-on films era)

140657 NickR, replying to NickR, 7, #623 of 1915 🔗

200 deaths a day would be about 12% of all deaths, virtually all of people at the age at which they usually die anyway. Over 700 residents of care homes die everyday with or without Covid!
If the aim was to flatten the curve & save the NHS 12% of normal deaths sounds like job done. Well done Whitty & Vallance, job done let’s get on with life, isn’t this exactly what the strategy was all along?

140661 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to NickR, 3, #624 of 1915 🔗

Absolutely, but will Joe Public and our politicians understand that basic data and stats?

140707 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to NickR, 2, #625 of 1915 🔗

That fact about the number who USUALLY die in care homes per day needs to be pointed out as often as possible, for context…

140658 Major Panic, 9, #626 of 1915 🔗

i think someone needs to take a couple of policemen off kicking the crap out of peaceful protestors duty and go and check if Valance and Whitty’s families have not been kidnapped and the unscientific bollocks they are spewing is under duress

140663 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 14, #627 of 1915 🔗

Bit of advice for you, if my trip to Morrisons this morning is anything to go by I would advise you to do your shopping or try to arrange delivery or click and collect ASAP. I decided to pick up some essentials (beer mostly) and I could smell the fear in the shop.

I got barked at by the security guard – mumble mumble ‘mask’,

I knew he was speaking to me but feigned deafness – mumble mumble ‘where is your mask’

‘No!’

‘WHERE IS YOUR MASK’-

‘EXEMPT!’ little old lady parking her trolley nearly shit herself as she stared at me gasping for air like a fish.

Security guard big and brave standing 50 feet away, come and ask me face to face – or mask to face – bully!!

Morrisons now reverted back to the trolley queue. Lady directing trolley traffic maskless.

I thought right, I’ve had enough of this.

Me – ‘kin ell, this is like going back in time to March. Unbelievable, I’m speechless, all these people wearing their masks are sleep walking into a dystopian nightmare’

‘agree – I’m exempt as wearing a mask gives me anxiety’

Me – ‘good for you, these people have not got a clue what they are signing up for’

‘yes, we’ve been told full 2 week lockdown coming, I had a bad virus lurgy in December, doctor told me very contagious but I’m still here and not dead. We have to get on with things the only way like normal. There you go – till number 7’.

The behavioural scientists have pulled a blinder.

140676 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to stefarm, 7, #628 of 1915 🔗

Great observations. To hell with all of them, and this society.

140686 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to stefarm, 5, #629 of 1915 🔗

Good account.

I hope the stockpiling doesn’t begin. I was in Tesco at 6am this morning (!) and all was well but let’s see.

Please everyone, DON’T stockpile. Just buy what you need.

140714 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to jhfreedom, #630 of 1915 🔗

I think the latest 11am bollocks and the iminent bile from wee jimmie might ramp up the fear and cause panic

140716 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to jhfreedom, #631 of 1915 🔗

Yeah, these kind of images are worse than everything else. They really drive the fear to awful levels.

140743 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to jhfreedom, #632 of 1915 🔗

Bollocks to that! Last time I had to go a whole week drinking straight tea because they ran out of Earl Grey. I’m out for a couple of 200 bag Twinings boxes later this morning.

140751 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Mark, 1, #633 of 1915 🔗

If they run out Mark, these guys are good (and, please, no lemon!):

https://www.tea-and-coffee.com/

140767 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to kh1485, 1, #634 of 1915 🔗

Thanks kh, it might come to that…

please, no lemon !

Wouldn’t dream of it. Would be almost as bad as adulterating it with milk or sugar…

140755 ▶▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to Mark, 1, #635 of 1915 🔗

Bettys have an excellent Earl Grey: you can get it online. If things are looking bleak, let’s at least have the right groceries.

140774 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Alethea, 1, #636 of 1915 🔗

Cheers alethea, online will hopefully be the last to dry up.

If things are looking bleak, let’s at least have the right groceries .

Absolutely. Priorities…

140815 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to jhfreedom, 3, #637 of 1915 🔗

I think people should stockpile – tough times are ahead and having some food in reserve is a very good idea. What people should not do is panic buy. Stockpile is something you do long term with a plan and continue to do consistently and so should not strain supply lines. It is panic buying that causes shortages.

140665 Seansaighdeoir, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 2, #638 of 1915 🔗

Hilarious Boris articles on the mail – all with photoshopped masks.

Can’t get a comment on there for love nor money calling out this bs. Obviously this week is a major one for the re-imposition of project fear.

140675 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 2, #639 of 1915 🔗

Our weekend was a big one. They need to stamp out dissent. Momentum is with skeptics, they are fighting for all they are worth to stop our call for return of good reason.

140719 ▶▶▶ Jenny, replying to Basics, 5, #640 of 1915 🔗

I agree with this. There was much more questioning coverage on MSM this weekend. You could see W&V trying to give the appearance of dismissing things which have been covered like the virus being weaker, increased testing leading to increased positives, more people being immune etc. They even tried to stray into implications for the economy etc. Obviously there was no proper reasoning and nobody got to scrutinise them but you could see that pattern. Some things they didn’t touch e.g. false positives, presumably because even they couldn’t bring themselves to try that. It will be really important we grab that momentum back by Heneghan et.al. going through this and taking it down!

140730 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Jenny, 4, #641 of 1915 🔗

“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”
Moving to stage 3 now?

140739 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jenny, replying to DRW, 2, #642 of 1915 🔗

I hope so. Also interesting that Boris sent these two out to test the water. Another reason for a quick response taking them down.

140810 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Roadrash, replying to Jenny, 1, #643 of 1915 🔗

They were sent out to set the scene for what he has in store for us tomorrow methinks. All roads point to the two weekly circuit breaker nonsense on top of the local lockdowns to coincide with school holiday. So two weeks In October, two weeks at Christmas (barring Christmas Day of course – he will throw us a bone for that), two weeks February etc etc etc .

140880 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Jenny, 2, #644 of 1915 🔗

They were sent out without him in order for Boris to be able to blame them when their predictions do not come true. If he had stood with them today, he would been seen on camera to be complicit.

This way he can ditch them later and claim he never agreed with them…

140668 Basics, replying to Basics, 3, #645 of 1915 🔗

Live at 1 pm UK Column are sure to have some excellent comment and analysis of the claims made by witty/vallance earlier.

140672 ▶▶ sectornitad, replying to Basics, 1, #646 of 1915 🔗

what is UK Column?

140692 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to sectornitad, 4, #647 of 1915 🔗

Proper news

140694 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to sectornitad, #648 of 1915 🔗

Tune in at 1 pm. Please.

140741 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to sectornitad, 1, #650 of 1915 🔗

https://www.ukcolumn.org/

Highly recommend them and worth watching back over previous editions.

140817 ▶▶▶ watashi, replying to sectornitad, 2, #651 of 1915 🔗

real unbiased news not government propaganda

140670 sectornitad, 3, #652 of 1915 🔗

Does anyone have any reliable data which shows average/median duration of stay in hospital for those who go in suffering Covid but come out the front door, rather than the morgue?

I would assume that as doctors now have better/quicker ways of treating it the average stay will have decreased now against April. In which case, this will also mitigate further against hospitals being overrun. Not that I expect them to be.

Any data out there? Thanks

140685 Basics, replying to Basics, #653 of 1915 🔗

Sturgeon is going full these are pre lockdown days. Shes already soending UK Gov money to “mitigate” against financial impacts.

48 hours.

140691 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Basics, #654 of 1915 🔗

Scottish numbers: 20 September 2020

245 new cases of COVID-19 reported; this is 5.4% of newly tested individuals

0 new reported death(s) of people who have tested positive (noting that Register Offices are now generally closed at weekends)

9 people were in intensive care yesterday with recently confirmed COVID-19

63 people were in hospital with recently confirmed COVID-19
14,893 new tests for COVID-19 that reported results

https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-daily-data-for-scotland/

140696 ▶▶▶ dpj, replying to Basics, #655 of 1915 🔗

She’s on live now about to announce something bad https://www.bbc.com/news/live/uk-scotland-54232737

140723 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to dpj, 2, #656 of 1915 🔗

Lockdown or similar to come to scotland within 48 hours is what I underdtood her inhuman inhumane evil babble to mean. She is to wait for a Cobra meeting. But will not wait long. Scotland is a true globalist experiment of a nation.

140731 ▶▶▶▶▶ dpj, replying to Basics, 1, #657 of 1915 🔗

She going in for the usual ‘Us good Westminster bad, please vote Yes to Independence’ big time today.

140768 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to dpj, #658 of 1915 🔗

There all kinds of deep dark scandal, rot and smearing going in throughout her government – this covid is manner from heaven for her. As March began Salmond was set to dismember the government cabal who had put him in court. Covid is the camoflage to massive breaches of public trust and confidence. There’s plenty of online discussion and investigation into the depths of corruption present at westminster.
Who is Mr Murrell? being one much asked question by independence supporters.
BbC Scotland withdrawing a kirsty walk Salmond Trial documentary amid rumours of explicit wholesale bias.. interesting too in view of the bbc mis information unit being so hot on covid yet distracted from in house tosh being produced.

140688 Achilles, replying to Achilles, #659 of 1915 🔗

So did we get a feel from the speech whether the new lockdown would include schools? I can (just about) handle what they’re forcing on me but when they come for your kids…

140698 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Achilles, -3, #660 of 1915 🔗

Who knows. Rest assured we will be back in the same place we were in late March one way or the other, with no respite until the vaccine is deployed.

140705 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Richard O, 2, #661 of 1915 🔗

From people in the know (ie those who actually make vaccines rather than try and flog them to people), it’s likely to be four years before we’ll have an effective vaccine.

140715 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lucan Grey, -1, #662 of 1915 🔗

Then we’ll be in lockdown for 4 years.

140728 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Achilles, 1, #663 of 1915 🔗

I think not. They were keen to get in that there were not increased cases in children. They want to keep schools open I think.

140699 Suburbian, 9, #664 of 1915 🔗

This article was shared on Twitter today by Adam Wagner a human rights barrister.

The Government’s response to COVID-19: human rights implications

https://committees.parliament.uk/publications/2649/documents/26337/default/

Seems lockdown sceptics aren’t the only ones worried about these new rules. The document 90 odd pages long however the conclusions starting on page 70 are worth a read

140703 Lucan Grey, replying to Lucan Grey, 15, #665 of 1915 🔗

Sir Patrick Vallance warns Britain could be facing 50,000 new cases a day by mid-October”

It’s not a prediction. That is correct.

What it is is a psychological anchor. The classic marketing trick straight out of the Behavioural Insight Team playbook.

140709 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Lucan Grey, 3, #666 of 1915 🔗

So they can claim success from anything less than that?

140721 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to DRW, 4, #667 of 1915 🔗

It’s non-falsifiable premature extrapolation.

Unless the congregation prays to God He will send the plague to kill us all.

Big enough to be scary but not unreasonable.

140881 ▶▶ guy153, replying to Lucan Grey, #668 of 1915 🔗

Note that if that comes true (which it might) that’s about 50 deaths per day and a few hundred hospitalizations. And this will overwhelm the NHS?

140706 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 30, #669 of 1915 🔗

To be fair, if cases double every week for the next 19 weeks, Britain will have 393 million cases of Covid and I think the hospitals will probably struggle to cope

140718 ▶▶ DRW, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 8, #670 of 1915 🔗

Well they’ve already lined up the “reinfection” scaremongering so they’ll soon claim we’re headed for BILLIONS of cases!

140746 ▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to DRW, 8, #671 of 1915 🔗

Soon The Science will declare reincarnation possible, so we will each be able to contract covid an infinite number of times and kill an infinite number of elderly relatives.

141849 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Alethea, #672 of 1915 🔗

Those resurrected by the fake death count can be killed again to satisfy the numbers of “cases”

140753 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 6, #673 of 1915 🔗

To clarify, I was being deadpan. Whitty and Vallance calculated four weeks very carefully because it produces a sort of plausible and yet scary figure. Three weeks would be too little and five weeks too much

140913 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 2, #674 of 1915 🔗

Exactly. “IF” cases doubled every day, then after a month about 2 billion people in the UK would be infected. Not a prediction, just a maths lesson. Possibly the one Grant Shapps missed.

They can say any old bollocks by sticking an if in front and claiming they are not saying anything.

141227 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 2, #675 of 1915 🔗

Someone should ask those two treasonous bustards how much of Gates’s money they are pocketing!

140708 DRW, replying to DRW, 20, #676 of 1915 🔗

I went out my local woods this morning, a small haven of sanity in a sea of hysteria. Sitting there in an unmutilated natural environment helps my worsening mental health issues which have been costing me sleep now too. Reminder of how we’re supposed to live for the now and our surroundings, not in constant fear of the next Clown Show diktat. If there really was a new Spanish flu on the loose we wouldn’t need a propaganda campaign. I left in the sadness of knowing that this pleasure would probably soon be snatched away.

140729 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to DRW, 13, #677 of 1915 🔗

Fully with you on that. Strangely today I’m feeling a little hopeful. Our enemies are getting desperate and showing their hand. Their house of cards is wobbling. This is a crucial week.

141221 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to godowneasy, #678 of 1915 🔗

It’s a great pity we gave up our guns.

140733 ▶▶ Bob Webb, replying to DRW, 4, #679 of 1915 🔗

I share your dismay and condition. We are fortunate enough to be in Cyprus at the moment. Reading the news from home, I need to periodically look up and take in the sight of the calm blue sea lest I feel the urge to throw something heavy.

140749 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to DRW, 4, #680 of 1915 🔗

100%

Anyone with kids, get them outside at every opportunity too. It’s the ultimate cure from the fear

140889 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #681 of 1915 🔗

Good point.

140952 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to DRW, 1, #682 of 1915 🔗

I can relate to that. BUT they can’t hide the truth for ever. Stay strong!

140713 Basics, replying to Basics, 1, #683 of 1915 🔗

Leitch now reading a scriot given ti him by Devi. “Globaly the WHO declared a pandemic… ” and he’s off inti a refearing of the nation.

Between his lines you can hear the deperation they have reissuing this tired worn broken fallacy of a message.

This is all guns blazing by the oppressives. People have naturally tended away from the regimes rules – hence today’s big guns.

140921 ▶▶ Mark H, replying to Basics, 1, #684 of 1915 🔗

Doesn’t he have a root canal to do?

140724 mattghg, replying to mattghg, 13, #685 of 1915 🔗

My wife and newborn baby daughter are in a hospital maternity ward right now. I’m not allowed to visit them because my oldest son had a high temperature on Saturday. Which went away within three hours without any intervention from us.

140747 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to mattghg, 12, #686 of 1915 🔗

Why did you tell the hospital? Best to keep quiet about anything now. Do not get a test, just say NO etc

140727 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #687 of 1915 🔗

Welsh health minister presentation on Sky – Merthyr Tydfil, Gwent, Newport and Bridgend all locked down from tomorrow, so you can’t go in and out. Newport – the home of ONS!

140744 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #688 of 1915 🔗

Shutdown Merthyr? Good luck with that one

There are only three statues in the town and they are all of people who punched other people for a living

You and who’s army?

140732 Keen Cook, replying to Keen Cook, 9, #689 of 1915 🔗

No-one needs reminding of the appalling toll these lockdown rules are having on other normal everyday life. They are also quietly ruining our own institutions set up to regulate and allow us to carry on as law abiding citizens with a legal system that once was recognised as a world leader.
I’ve been battling to do a ‘first registration’ on the family home all year as it not been on the market since 1974 and bless him – left to me by my late husband who died last year of a real illness.
According to my solicitor, the Land Registry closed completely for 6 weeks earlier in the year ‘as they had no IT plans laid on for home use’ and to facilitate working from home. For the application, there was a way until recently to submit all the signed, stamped and verified title documents online (now boundaries had been established and agreed and topographical survey completed which has taken forever).
Until this morning, when my solicitor rings in desperation to say that online is no longer available and we have to print off copies and send them in the post to their office in Gloucester – where on doubt they will be thrown on top of the enormous mountain of paper that will get lost and disappear for ever. He spent half an hour on the phone trying to get through and the person at the end of the phone had no idea why it had been changed.
It appears we have travelled back in time – mindful of the historical discussion around terminology yesterday, to the Antiquities. It is one more example of the attach on ‘middle England’ that is reaching out in malign and malevolent ways.
I obviously won’t get a response till end 2021 if then.
Ah well. By then as a non-mask wearer I will obviously be dead and if not will have killed half a dozen grannies and be locked up at HMG pleasure due to non fine paying so won’t need a house to live in.

140961 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Keen Cook, 1, #690 of 1915 🔗

Shocking!! Unacceptable!!

140734 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 11, #691 of 1915 🔗

I predict 430 million deaths in the UK by Thursday

Well, they started it

140760 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to Cecil B, 3, #692 of 1915 🔗

You are Joe Biden and I claim my £5.

140762 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to Cecil B, 1, #693 of 1915 🔗

Fearmonger! It’s not going to be more than 200 million.

140736 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #694 of 1915 🔗

What is going off with the railways in this country?

Shapps says they are getting rid of rail franchises and simplifying the contracts, but still want “the capital, ingenuity & competition” that private companies have brought to rail operation.

So how are these companies going to make profits? Or are you just going to be paid for running trains, whether they carry passengers or not?

140752 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Dave #KBF, 5, #695 of 1915 🔗

Once a government has realised it can get away with talking complete and utter bollocks I guess they just carry on.

140766 ▶▶ Kev, replying to Dave #KBF, #696 of 1915 🔗

Government have paid £3.5 billion from taxpayers of course to plug the shortfall in rail ticket revenues dut to you know, it!

Article on BBC

141212 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Dave #KBF, #697 of 1915 🔗

Shapps is a fkucwit. How do these people get these kind of jobs ? Seriously I would not give any of them a job! It’s depressing to think these lunatics are in government.

140738 Leonard, 1, #698 of 1915 🔗

‘Now, this isn’t a prediction, but here’s our prediction of what will happen if you don’t all get back in your holes until the R0 is at zero. Cheers.’

140870 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to p02099003, #700 of 1915 🔗

Great article, it is also on Sebastian Rushworth’s own site: https://sebastianrushworth.com/2020/09/19/covid-19-does-sweden-have-herd-immunity/ Needs to be tweeted widely (those who have Twitter!)

140745 BeBopRockSteady, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 7, #701 of 1915 🔗

The Philosopher’s note on yesterday’s LS update has been resonating with me a lot since. Especially the point made about any theory being open to falsification for it to actually have any scientific basis.

Now with new updates from all administrations today I am seeing a common theme. Thanking areas such as Caerphilly for following the rules as cases plateau, criticising the rest for not adhering as cases rise.

But there is no way to prove that measures are having an impact really. Unless they have a scientific measure for the actual number of interactions that were reduced due to the rules and can show it to correlate significantly to lower cases.

There were no restrictions in many places as cases dropped recently and we get the answer that it was due to the weather. But let’s not use that point to argue the contrary. No. Its all about the rule breakers.

They must know they’ve lost the crowd now. Convincing arguments there are none. I will expect Auz style enforcement this time around.

140787 ▶▶ chaos, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #702 of 1915 🔗

up rock uprocking!

140801 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #703 of 1915 🔗

It was also codified into science by Karl Popper. A hypothesis must be falsifiable otherwise it is not a hypothesis, it is supposition. I think a lot of people here are realising just how hard it is to measure stuff properly as well as set out a hypothesis to test.

In other words welcome to being a practising scientist – the farther you go, the less you know (hat tip to Lao Tzu)

140748 John Galt, replying to John Galt, 4, #704 of 1915 🔗

Would you get the vaccine?
If not, is there any restriction they could put in place that would make you want to get the vaccine?
If they told you that you couldn’t travel without one?
If they told you that you couldn’t work without one?
More severe measures than that?
Or would you refuse to get it at any stage?

140750 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to John Galt, 4, #705 of 1915 🔗

No way will that shite be going into my body. I will forge a certificate if necessary. Luckily I am retired with a campervan. Holidays sorted. Only reason to fly would be to go to Canada to see my daughter, that is when the forgery might come in handy.

140862 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to William Hand, 1, #706 of 1915 🔗

Especially when Bill Gates tells you it will change your DNA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksEVaO806Oo&feature=youtu.be (only 2 mins long!)

140874 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to William Hand, 2, #707 of 1915 🔗

Unfortunately it will be very hard to forge, they are planning to use digital vaccine certificates and identity management:

https://id2020.org/

… new forms of digital ID allow us to travel, conduct business, access financial and health records

Our best hope is the government’s appalling track record of delivering IT projects.

140758 ▶▶ D B, replying to John Galt, 2, #708 of 1915 🔗

I would worry I’d never be able to go to a live event again, despite the fact I’ve had covid-19 and recovered (if you can recover from an illness you had no symptoms of)

The annoying thing is that under the current system any who had the vaccine would show as a positive case on the PCR tests so kind of defeats the objective really.

140759 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to John Galt, 9, #709 of 1915 🔗

It wont just be one vaccine. There will be an ever growing set of demands to conform to including multiple vaccines which will grow into your social credit score.

141197 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Saved To Death, #710 of 1915 🔗

Then it’s up to the people to rise up and if that means a bloody revolution then so be it.

140763 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to John Galt, 12, #711 of 1915 🔗

Refuse at any stage, and I am prepared to relinquish my life to avoid it. The punishments for refusing will be a death sentence, but the life awaiting those who take the vaccine will be a fate worse than death.

140776 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to John Galt, 7, #712 of 1915 🔗

“I don’t have the vaccine to protect me, I have the vaccine to protect you”.

That will be the brainwashing message.

140778 ▶▶ leggy, replying to John Galt, 12, #713 of 1915 🔗

I’m never having one, regardless of any restrictions or impositions. Final answer.

140780 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to John Galt, 3, #714 of 1915 🔗

Surely the sanity of choosing a relatively untested vaccine over the possibility of catching a disease which for the vast majority is mild or asymptomatic Speaks for itself?

140826 ▶▶▶ Achilles, replying to Telpin, 4, #715 of 1915 🔗

Sanity left the building a long time ago

140806 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to John Galt, 25, #716 of 1915 🔗

I am a pharmacist. I have had lots of vaccines for travel, including yellow fever because the risk of disease warranted it, in my view. I would not have this vaccine for at least 5 years, until its side effect profile was well established. So many drugs have looked amazing, even with the normal trials process, only later to be found to cause significant harm in the wider population.

140855 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Bumble, 6, #717 of 1915 🔗

There must be thousands in the medical profession who share your level-headed and common sense view. So why have voices like yours been totally excluded from the national debate in mainstream media? And why the rabid propaganda about this particular vaccine?

If waiting 5 years means losing your right to work, travel (anywhere outside your property) and have access to money, will you still be choosing this path?

141195 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to John Galt, #718 of 1915 🔗

I’m not having it under any circumstances.

140754 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 7, #719 of 1915 🔗

If this madness carries on,I can see mass suicides like in the People’s Temple in Jonestown,Guyana in the late 70’s.
I am not joking.

140775 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Fingerache Philip., 8, #720 of 1915 🔗

Sadly I think you are on the money, the way this government is performing, I would not be surprise to hear that our beloved leader will push assisted dying through parliament in the near future.

140783 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #721 of 1915 🔗

They don’t need it pushed through parliament. All they have to do is severely dehydrate the most vulnerable people in hospitals and care homes whilst their families can’t visit them. Also helps ramp up ‘Covid’ death figures.

141190 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Darryl, #722 of 1915 🔗

Frighteningly possible! That’s what I feel this second spike is about. They did not succeed in killing off as many elderly as they hoped the first time so are trying again.

140757 Gillian, 1, #723 of 1915 🔗

All churches should be steaming this

https://youtu.be/WyEogjYrXkY

140773 James Marker, replying to James Marker, 19, #724 of 1915 🔗

Following the news conference this morning, I would say that SAGE has now staked its entire reputation on a vaccine being available by spring next year. If this fails to materialize, or if vaccines prove ineffective (and bearing in mind that flu vaccines are significantly less than 100% effective), then Whitty and Vallance are going to face a lot of hostile questioning from people whose lives have been blighted by the lockdown. I would be worried if I were them. Another point: I’ve never been drawn to conspiracy theories; but given that SAGE are implacably opposed to herd immunity being established by natural means  (as seems to have happened in Sweden) and their insistence that vaccines are the only hope of salvation, I have to say that I’m beginning to smell a rat.

140799 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to James Marker, #725 of 1915 🔗

Interested to know what you imagine is a conspiracy theory?

And how you would describe what has happened if not world wide certainly in most of it – coincidence, incompetence, perhaps both?

140803 ▶▶ chaos, replying to James Marker, 8, #726 of 1915 🔗

Some of us have been smelling that Great Reset rat for months. There are many actors and agendas. WEF, UN, Goldman Sachs, IMF.. Prince Charles.. various billionaires.. banks.. Gates.. at night Boris’ little Boris is tugged by a posho tree hugger 24 years his junior.

140805 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to chaos, 3, #727 of 1915 🔗

And she has his ear. Save the planet Boris.. for our Wilf… bicycles bicycles for everyone.. bicycles and vaccines.

140828 ▶▶ James Marker, replying to James Marker, 1, #728 of 1915 🔗

& @Seansaighdeoir I would certainly agree that many statists have seized on this so-called “pandemic” to advance their own agenda

140865 ▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to James Marker, 1, #729 of 1915 🔗

But would you also agree that that ‘agenda’ seems to be remarkably similar in tone and effect? I.e. why are we all wearing masks?

140842 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to James Marker, 2, #730 of 1915 🔗

It’s better to think of it in terms of serendipity, a wide network of interests and some disturbing levels of group think and cognitive dissonance. Policy making is opaque but there is no need for this to be a preplanned event (although that is not impossible).

Incompetence is insufficeint but conspiracy is not necessary. There is plenty of land between these two points.

140852 ▶▶▶ James Marker, replying to Cicatriz, 2, #731 of 1915 🔗

Yes, this is exactly how see it – totally agree

140898 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to James Marker, #732 of 1915 🔗

If all we have to look forward too is some hostile questions by next spring then we are well and truly finished and many should prepare to starve to death.

140914 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to James Marker, 1, #733 of 1915 🔗

The vaccines will be ineffective. They will provide “protection” for 6 months to a year, when you will need a top-up. Without your vaccine status being up to date you will not be allowed to use public transport, go to gigs, sporting events or work. Most of this is already out there in the public domain, in various forms.

141183 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to James Marker, 1, #734 of 1915 🔗

I read yesterday that flu vaccines are around 50% effective and that if they do discover a vaccine for coronavirus it would only be similar.

I was never an anti vaxxer but I am now.

140779 Klein, replying to Klein, 11, #735 of 1915 🔗

Just about to email my MP – if anyone wants to cast an eye over and suggest anything? I tried to add a little sting at the end regarding the salary:

I’m contacting you to urge you to vote against the renewal of the Coronavirus Act which currently gives the government their emergency powers

The UK is a democratic country, and for the last 6 months we have been living under rule by ministerial decree – in which decisions that affect millions of people are taken without any sort of Parliamentary scrutiny whatsoever.

I understood why this Act was introduced back in March 2020, despite having grave reservations about the de-facto suspension of Parliamentary democracy. However we now know that the virus is likely to become seasonal and endemic, we know who is at risk from it and we can make provisions for those vulnerable to protect themselves if they so wish.

We also know that the Sars-Cov-2 virus is not as dangerous as originally thought. Professor Carl Heneghan of Oxford University estimates the infection fatality rate as so:

We could make a simple estimation of the IFR as 0.28%, based on halving the lowest boundary of the CFR prediction interval. However, the considerable uncertainty over how many people have the disease, the proportion asymptomatic (and the demographics of those affected) means this IFR is likely an overestimate.

This IFR is in line with a severe flu season. The above information is available here:

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/global-covid-19-case-fatality-rates/

Trying to suppress a virus that spreads in the same manner as other respiratory viruses will have a heavy toll on the health of the citizens; physical health due to a one eyed focus on Covid-19 above other illnesses and conditions, and on mental health due to the draconian restrictions on what is essentially normal human interaction and behaviour.

I must point out that I am not saying that we should do nothing; improvements on hygiene, advice for the vulnerable to avoid crowded areas and support for these vulnerable people to isolate themselves if they wish. These are tried and tested methods for dealing with viral epidemics.

I cannot begin to tell you the anxiety and stress caused by waking up each morning, dreading finding out what the latest restrictions on normal human interaction will be, seemingly at the whim of government ministers who can issue these directives without any sort of debate in parliament.
One argument is that these restrictions need to be made in haste due to the fast moving situation; however what usually follows these directives is an announcement such as “these restrictions will come in to effect from next week”.

I could include a lot more in this email, however I’ll just reiterate that I urge you to take a stand and vote against the renewal of these emergency powers. It is time that we as a country got back to making decisions that affect people’s lives in such a huge way being returned to the hands of Parliament and as such the people who elected the members of Parliament.

If not, then I have to question what exactly a member of Parliament is for. If they are going to vote for themselves to be bypassed and therefore unable to represent the constituents who elected them, then surely they are declaring themselves surplus to requirements. In that case, perhaps they should give up their £81,932 salary and various expenses that such a position entitles them to claim.

Thank you for your time

140786 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Klein, #736 of 1915 🔗

false positive rate for pillar 2 is likely as high as 90%.. or higher.. you should mention that..

140793 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Klein, 1, #737 of 1915 🔗

That’s a good letter. I’d add to the bit about effects on mental health due to the restrictions: “and due to the fear that is being spread and encouraged.”

From a proof-reading perspective, I’d just suggest a minor change:

Professor Carl Heneghan of Oxford University estimates the infection fatality rate as so :”
I’d reword “as so”

140859 ▶▶▶ Klein, replying to Mark, #738 of 1915 🔗

Thanks Mark, changed it 🙂

140936 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Klein, #739 of 1915 🔗

Good stuff! Let us know if you get anything substantive back. I think the climate is different now and MPs are going to be more willing to listen to dissenting views on this, than they were a few months, even a few weeks, back.

140795 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to Klein, 1, #740 of 1915 🔗

Copied minus the last para to my MP. Hoping that as Chope loves to vote against the government, especially on matters of procedure, he may be one to lead a rebellion.

140784 court, replying to court, 12, #741 of 1915 🔗

Dipped into DM comments to see what the feelings are like. The green arrows on the sceptical comments are through the roof. The tide is turning, I feel great!

140792 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to court, 4, #742 of 1915 🔗

They will soon manipulate the comments and votes – they always do. I bet they close the comments. I think the government are busy censoring all the coverage of the Met police brutality at the weekend so have taken an eye of the newspaper comments.

140798 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Darryl, 2, #743 of 1915 🔗

Telegraph is manipulating up/down votes and has occassionally deleted all comments.

140796 ▶▶ chaos, replying to court, 5, #744 of 1915 🔗

Whilst it is good that is happening.. most of the people I talk to on my road are still blind, believing everything the government and the the mainstream media tells them. Supposedly intelligent people some of them.. educated.. just incredible. Now we see why atrocities happen in nations.. the sheep sweep everyone up in their wake.

140837 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to court, 1, #745 of 1915 🔗

They’ve not let me post anything all week, maybe I’m unofficially banned.

140882 ▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to court, #746 of 1915 🔗

I hate the DM with a vengeance, come to think of it there a lot of people that I hate with a vengeance at the moment too. I used to go on and would often try make a comment against all the vile nastiness that was spewed out on that site. I don’t mind any vile comments made on here about the government,but on there, it was and is usually against people who have done nothing to deserve it. These comments were rarely printed which made me see that they had an agenda, join the braying crowd or you don’t belong.

140785 Basics, #747 of 1915 🔗
140788 chaos, replying to chaos, 3, #748 of 1915 🔗

Prince Charles in the papers again today talking about the need to use corona for The Great Reset.

140797 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to chaos, 5, #749 of 1915 🔗

We have had both Fauci and Tedros pushing all the environmental and Great Reset narrative and still the masses don’t see what is happening. They will soon be moaning when the plans are put in place and they can’t be reversed.

140902 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Darryl, 5, #750 of 1915 🔗

And Toby still doesn’t think there’s an underlying plan that’s being pushed.

140829 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to chaos, 1, #751 of 1915 🔗

Yes oops he’s rather spoiled their surprise now.

140841 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to chaos, #752 of 1915 🔗

Says it all…

140843 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to chaos, 2, #753 of 1915 🔗

I’m hoping he will never make King!

140849 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to chaos, #754 of 1915 🔗

Do you have a link to the article?

140789 tonyspurs, replying to tonyspurs, 25, #755 of 1915 🔗

They are insane, intent on destroying the economy our way of life and the British people all so they can line their pockets with vaccine profit ..utter c**ts ,every single MP who does not oppose this should swing for treason

140811 ▶▶ chaos, replying to tonyspurs, 6, #756 of 1915 🔗

Not just about vaccines.. just a part of it.. also an attempt to push green energy by UN/WEF/Prince Charles et al… towns and cities where only bicycle travel and walking and buses are possible.Air travel for the rich only…

140790 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 1, #757 of 1915 🔗

Can someone help me.

If the whole country has North East type rules what does that mean for me seeing my family (adult age kids) who don’t live in my household?

140814 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to hotrod, #758 of 1915 🔗

Hi hotrod. This was the Govt press release from a few days back about NE https://www.gov.uk/government/news/stronger-measures-introduced-in-parts-of-the-north-east-to-tackle-rising-infection-rates

It does say no mixing between households unless there is a support bubble justification. Please try not to fret until they actually spew something out tomorrow. It’s not as if we expect them to be consistent or logical in the measures they apply!

140824 ▶▶▶ hotrod, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #759 of 1915 🔗

How can’t I fret. I have followed all the rules but I can’t see my children for 6 months?

140838 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to hotrod, #760 of 1915 🔗

Similar situation for me – my mum, brother and I are all separate ‘households’, then there is my sister and her family (a household of 4 people). Under the current rules, we cannot all meet together…

140853 ▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to hotrod, 1, #761 of 1915 🔗

I do understand. Wasn’t being dismissive. I live alone and haven’t touched another human being since March – completely dehumanising. I’m just telling myself not to give them the satisfaction of spending a single minute being terrorised even more until I absolutely have to.

140900 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to hotrod, #762 of 1915 🔗

Do you need care and support from your children??? (hint, hint)

140957 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to hotrod, 2, #763 of 1915 🔗

How can’t I fret. I have followed all the rules

Fretting’s understandable, I suppose. but why on earth would anyone follow all the rules!?

They are irrational and counterproductive rules, made without proper due process, and obeying them is harmful both in the harm they inflict and in the fear they spread.

Obey only when They are watching, and then only with resentment and to the absolute minimum.

140818 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to hotrod, #764 of 1915 🔗

It means you would not be able to see them, in theory. I spoke to my mother (in NE) last night. She is in sheltered accommodation. Although she is allowed to come and go as she pleases nobody is allowed in or out of the building other than residents. Me and my brother are over 200 miles away, but 100 miles from each other, and I cannot drive. No way of getting to her for either of us now. She is noticeably ‘down’ from the last two phone calls. I am now very concerned about her. If she was nearer, though, I would ignore the advice – publish and be damned!

140888 ▶▶ Hubes, replying to hotrod, 17, #765 of 1915 🔗

Ignore everything they say and see whoever you want whenever you want.

140896 ▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Hubes, 1, #766 of 1915 🔗

Amen, sibling

140891 ▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to hotrod, #767 of 1915 🔗

Illegal under the NE law in private homes.

Advice is not to meet at pubs or outdoors but the law is the “rule of 6” that the rest of the country has.

140899 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to hotrod, #768 of 1915 🔗

I thought the rules generally have the same caveat – ie can be broken to avoid harm. As harm is not defined (could be MH), then see who you want and do what you want

140917 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to hotrod, #769 of 1915 🔗

If your children are happy then just ignore the rule. Find somewhere outside to meet (to avoid snitchers). You live with your kids right? Of course you do! Just say NO. Peaceful non-compliance.

140791 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 31, #770 of 1915 🔗

I think it’s now clear that the political and economic system will not survive this, and society will be altered beyond recognition. When the hypnosis wears off and the general public realise what has been done, there will be an uprising. Certainly I am angry enough to join one, and I’m tediously middle of the road. Perhaps Covid has simply magnified what was already there – an elite that is utterly incompetent and utterly arrogant; an economy predicated on infinite growth in a finite world; 650 rotten boroughs returning empty suits to parliament to represent nobody but their own self interest. But the underlying flaw that will bring everything crashing down is an inability as a society to deal with death. And statistics.

140802 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 7, #771 of 1915 🔗

…there will be an uprising. Certainly I am angry enough to join one, and I’m tediously middle of the road.

Well said, I feel exactly the same!

140807 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 8, #772 of 1915 🔗

When the hypnosis wears off and the general public realise what has been done, there will be an uprising.

I wish I could agree, but sadly the general public you speak of has already willingly relinquished all of its rights, and has no interest in getting them back. We are on our own here.

140809 ▶▶ Kate, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 2, #773 of 1915 🔗

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200331-covid-19-how-will-the-coronavirus-change-the-world

I think this BBC article explains what changes are being implemented.

We are being fitted for a sort of Green totalitarianism.

As a Green sympathiser, I can see the need to scale back on consumerism, I’m just not keen on the totalitarian element. After all, the people who are introducing this future accumulated huge wealth themselves exploiting turbo charged capitalism and massive despoliation of resources.

And where does the useless expenditure on an unnecessary vaccine come in to this benign future world if it will only be for our best interests?

140821 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Kate, 4, #774 of 1915 🔗

Totally unnecessary for this specific virus though it may be, the vaccine is the key to the totalitarian control. The state will completely own your body. Hence the narrative that the entire global population has to take it before we can “return to normal”.

140839 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Richard O, 4, #775 of 1915 🔗

There will be no return to the normal we knew and loved, that’s over.

140878 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Bella Donna, 2, #776 of 1915 🔗

I accepted that on 23rd March.

140840 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Kate, 1, #777 of 1915 🔗

The fact that the BBC are even writing an article about this tells you it is the plan!

141040 ▶▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Carrie, 1, #778 of 1915 🔗

too right…. BBC = Government propaganda department .. It is to the uk government what Pravda was to USSR

140890 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Kate, 4, #779 of 1915 🔗

“We can see from Wuhan that social distancing and lockdown measures like this are effective.”

Well, that undermines the article. Lockdowns don’t work. But it’s the BBC, so the propaganda can’t be undermined by reality.
And it’s funny how anyone saying that this is what certain people want for our future, are called conspiracy theorists.
It’s not a conspiracy theory when they tell you what they’re doing.

140858 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #780 of 1915 🔗

Well said!

140971 ▶▶ leggy, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #781 of 1915 🔗

I’ve probably spent an unhealthy amount of time listening to Muse lyrics the last few days. Prophetic though!

The paranoia is in bloom

The P.R. transmissions will resume

They’ll try to push drugs, keep us all dumbed down

And hope that we will never see the truth around, so come on

Another promise, another scene, another

Packaged lie to keep us trapped in greed with all the

Green belts wrapped around our minds and endless

Red tape to keep the truth confined, so come on

They will not force us

And they will stop degrading us

And they will not control us

We will be victorious, so come on

Interchanging mind control

Come let the revolution take its toll

If you could flick a switch and open your third eye

You’d see that we should never be afraid to die

So come on

Rise up and take the power back

It’s time the fat cats had a heart attack

You know that their time is coming to an end

We have to unify and watch our flag ascend

So come on

They will not force us

They will stop degrading us

They will not control us

We will be victorious, so come on

140999 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #782 of 1915 🔗

https://liberty.e-activist.com/page/63721/petition/1?ea.url.id=4913654&forwarded=true
Suggest you sign this Liberty (formerly NCCL) petition to end the lockdown, scandalously it has so far only attracted under 35K signatures.

140804 Chris John, replying to Chris John, 11, #783 of 1915 🔗

I wanna punch Twitty and mentally Unbalanced hard in the face 👊🏻 👃🏻

140835 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Chris John, 7, #784 of 1915 🔗

Why injure your fist when an iron bar would be better!

140943 ▶▶ Nic, replying to Chris John, 2, #785 of 1915 🔗

Il be right behind you ,also think Hancock needs a slap as well!

140808 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, #786 of 1915 🔗

Received this survey by e-mail:

https://www.surveygizmo.eu/s3/90273590/covid

From these guys.

Will give it a go and see what I can put in to cause trouble.

140867 ▶▶ davews, replying to Awkward Git, #787 of 1915 🔗

Completed. Intrigued why it asked whether I was born on Feb 30th, probably to get rid of the spam bots.

140871 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to davews, #788 of 1915 🔗

I thought that or get rid of the idiots.

Looked at who is behind it, it’s Toby.

140928 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #789 of 1915 🔗

Great website, still new and unfinished but please complete the survey
https://www.covid19assembly.org/covid19-survey

We are Covid 19 Assembly, a research organisation based in London, conducting this survey for a research project. The survey will ask you about your attitudes and behaviours regarding COVID-19 and government measures to control it. There is no financial incentive for taking part. All responses are used for research purposes in line with UK and EU law, as well as the Market Research Society’s code of conduct. Your participation in this research is entirely voluntary, and you are free to withdraw at any time. The data will be kept on a password-protected laptop, deleted within three months, and will not be shared with any other parties, nor published publicly. If you would like to contact the researcher, please email mail@covid19assembly.org . Note that you have the right to lodge a complaint with the Information Commissioner’s Office (ICO). This survey is anonymous and will not collect any personally identifiable information without your explicit consent; these anonymised responses will be aggregated with those of other respondents. This survey will take about 5-10 minutes to complete.

141034 ▶▶ mjr, replying to Awkward Git, #790 of 1915 🔗

just done it . Shame there wasnt an “all of the above” box on most of the questions

140812 JustMe, replying to JustMe, 43, #791 of 1915 🔗

Well, good bye friends.
Mrs Me and I are off.
I’ve done 87 days straight, without a day off, working on the ONS swabbing project, visiting people at their homes and doing my best to be ‘normal’ (no mask or gloves) and cheer people up. I’ve seen victims come to the doors of their own homes wearing PPE and many of my new friends see very few people in the days between my visits. Some days I feel more like a social worker.
I’ve pointed many people towards this site (I explain that I come on here every morning to get the latest real news before I start my rounds) and have pointed some towards Ivor Cummins video from Sept 8th.
But I’m knackered. So this afternoon we’re catching a flight to Corfu (at £33 from Manchester it was rude to say ‘no’).
Keep up the good work. I’ll look for a postcard to send.

140820 ▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to JustMe, 8, #792 of 1915 🔗

Have a wonderful and well earned break!

140834 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to JustMe, #793 of 1915 🔗

Bargain air fare!

140947 ▶▶ Basics, replying to JustMe, 1, #794 of 1915 🔗

Have a wonderful hol of it! Long may the good weather last. We will have this polished off by the time you get back…!

140813 zacaway, 3, #795 of 1915 🔗

Peter Hitchens robust commentary on the latest Vallance & Whitty horror show:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF6B7Fzo2zA

140819 Basics, replying to Basics, #796 of 1915 🔗

Cynical thought about the timing of the new oppressiins this week.

Freshers week last week. This uncertainty before freshers week woukd not have had a good outcome (exans scandal etc). Did they wait to get the students away from home?

140832 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 6, #797 of 1915 🔗

They wanted the students to have handed over their money to the universities before announcing it..

140850 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Carrie, 2, #798 of 1915 🔗

Students should mount a class action lawsuit against the universities to get their money back.

140929 ▶▶▶▶ D B, replying to Lms23, #799 of 1915 🔗

Its only money they’ve borrowed anyway

140946 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to D B, 2, #800 of 1915 🔗

Its only debt they’ve bought

140851 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Carrie, #801 of 1915 🔗

Exactly right – the VCs are in on the scam.

140892 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 2, #802 of 1915 🔗

Provides a perfect test population to conduct further social engineering experiments on the next generation of young adults. I think we are going to see very high suicide/drop out rates in this year’s university intake.

140822 Ed Turnbull, replying to Ed Turnbull, 15, #803 of 1915 🔗

Here’s something to bear in mind when you’re next confronted by some robot in a restaurant / pub / cafe / etc insisting that you hand over your personal details for ‘track and trace’ (or whatever it’s called this week). Is the establishment demanding your data GDPR compliant? Here’s a link to the GDPR compliance checklist – the business collecting the data must’ve conducted an information audit, data protection impact assessment etc. Demand to see proof (ideally the actual documents) of compliance before handing over any data. If the business can’t provide this then they’re non-complaint and in breach of the law . At which point you should inform them that you’re reporting them to the Information Commissioner’s Office. I believe the fines for non-compliance with GDPR can be pretty steep. This is the line I’ll be taking should some drone demand my details.

Always nice to see the bastards (by which I mean our government and those who go along with their tyranny without demur) hoist by their own petard.

140830 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ed Turnbull, 2, #804 of 1915 🔗

Good point and very helpful – thanks!

140866 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Ed Turnbull, 4, #805 of 1915 🔗

I think they would just throw you out.

Just submit fake details and say you don’t have a smartphone.

141288 ▶▶▶ Ed Turnbull, replying to jhfreedom, 1, #806 of 1915 🔗

Fine, they can refuse me admittance, but it means they won’t get any of my hard-earned. And if sufficiently large numbers of punters do this our government of incompetent clowns may (it’s a long shot I know, but without that small hope I’m lost) start to realise that their oppressive overreaction has a price. They started this horseshit because they feared the electoral consequences if the media accused them of allowing grannies to die. They must be made to realise that there are electoral consequences if they don’t end the whole ridiculous charade forthwith.

Foregoing a few restaurant meals, or beers in the pub, are small sacrifices to get a bunch of tyrants off our backs.

140897 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Ed Turnbull, #807 of 1915 🔗

I believe provision is made for this, it was either 14 or 21 days if memory serves, then they must destroy it. So because the retention period and purpose are defined, it’s arguably GDPR compliant, and I believe they can get away without having an Information Security person for smaller companies.

I just smile and nod and tell them I’m “Neil Ferguson”, because I’m fascinated to know whether any of them recognise the name. Rather concerningly, they never have.

140906 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to Tee Ell, #808 of 1915 🔗

I wonder what the restaurant I was in last week does, they write your details in a page per day diary. No doubt they tear the pages out three weeks later and shred them, or maybe not…

140937 ▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to davews, 1, #809 of 1915 🔗

Hardly secure and encrypted! What would stop someone grabbing the book and running?

141280 ▶▶▶ Ed Turnbull, replying to Tee Ell, 1, #810 of 1915 🔗

Whilst smaller businesses (< 250 employees) may be able to duck an information audit (though GDPR still recommends they conduct one) they’re not exempt from carrying out a DPIA. Particularly as they’re planning to use people’s data in such a way that it’s “likely to result in a high risk to [their] rights and freedoms.”‘. After all, being phoned by T&T and told to self-isolate for 14 days (in effect house arrest) certainly impacts upon one’s rights and freedoms. In short, make it as hard as possible for these unconscionable collaborators to operate as a business.

141385 ▶▶▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Ed Turnbull, #811 of 1915 🔗

Ah thanks for the correction – yeah I fully agree, let’s not make it easy for them!

141559 ▶▶▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to Ed Turnbull, #812 of 1915 🔗

So is it illegal to supply ‘wrong’ information for t&t?

140823 Kate, 1, #813 of 1915 🔗

no comment – problem with the comments box

140827 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #814 of 1915 🔗

Woohoo! We are famous! UK Column mention Lockdown Sceptics today!

140848 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Basics, 7, #815 of 1915 🔗

Toby and his website were mentioned on TalkRadio this morning by Peter Hitchens. Mike Graham is opposed to Simon Dolan’s court case, mainly because be doesn’t believe in wasting public money on taking the government to court on policy matters, and it was better to allow the likes of Graham Brady to deal with it. PH said that without all the opposition from Heneghan, Guptra, Toby Young, etc, Graham Brady wouldn’t have serious backup in his actions.

140942 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Lms23, 4, #816 of 1915 🔗

Hitchens is right.

140831 NickR, replying to NickR, 9, #817 of 1915 🔗

David Attenborough should front a new 1 hour special.

His dulcet tones telling us all that we have to learn to live with the virus.

Cut to him interviewing some care home residents who say they survived the war, they don’t want to blight their children’s & grandchildren’s future, they’d rather face the risk of the virus than be put back in solitary confinement.

Cut to cancer patients dying on wards, Attenborough says these are the people we’ve abandoned.

It would change the narrative over night.

140863 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to NickR, 2, #818 of 1915 🔗

The Queen needs to do it.

Yes, yes I know she’s not supposed to intervene.

But she made that comment ahead of the 2014 Scottish referendum…

140876 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to jhfreedom, 4, #819 of 1915 🔗

Where the hell is the Queen? Nothing since her TV speech many months ago. Is she still alive?

140883 ▶▶▶▶ tonyspurs, replying to Richard O, 2, #820 of 1915 🔗

Hopefully she’s kicking Charlie’s arse from breakfast to tea time

140885 ▶▶▶▶ Gillian, replying to Richard O, 8, #821 of 1915 🔗

According to BBC news today, Charlie boy says that the pandemic is an ideal opportunity to deal with climate change. Hope he dies before his mama. Fucking cunt that he is.

140935 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Gillian, #822 of 1915 🔗

Ouch!

140945 ▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Gillian, -1, #823 of 1915 🔗

Not sure if William would be much better.

140938 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Richard O, #824 of 1915 🔗

I get to some that is a disrepectful comment. But it is a fair question. Cinsider her corronation oath. She has a constitutional role despite appearing nit to. ‘Her’ Primeministers government she gave approval to have are causing this breakdown of Great Britain. Where is she? It is a fair question. Too old? Well perhaps she ought not to have an active role in our nation.

141204 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, #825 of 1915 🔗

I did read somewhere that the Withdrawal agreement effectively deposed her, because it specifically referred to Parliament as sovereign, whereas that is not technically correct.. I think it somehow removed the royal prerogative issue – but I am not an expert on these things…!

141199 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Richard O, #826 of 1915 🔗

I did see something about her planning to move back to Buckingham Palace recently…

140944 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to jhfreedom, #827 of 1915 🔗

The Queen??!!!

Lord save me……..That the same Queen who sits at the top of the pyramid and is one of the leading enablers for the whole fucking system? That Queen??

They do not give a fuck about you or anyone else. They look upon you with utter contempt and it is offensive to me that anyone would think any of the ‘royal’ family have anything but their own selfish interest at heart.

Prince Andrew was friends with Epstein FFS! Christ…even Jimmy Saville was on the inside with the royals!!

They are a cesspit!

You haven’t been paying attention.

140894 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to NickR, 1, #828 of 1915 🔗

That might interfere with his job as chief propogandist for the brainwashing corporation on all things ‘climate change’!

I’ve lost all respect for the man.

140923 ▶▶ Snake Oil Pussy, replying to NickR, 1, #829 of 1915 🔗

Greta Thunberg should also help by calling on children whose schools are closed to gather at the gates and demand to be let back in.

140932 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Snake Oil Pussy, 1, #830 of 1915 🔗

I hate to break it to you but that little automaton is nothing but a sock puppet who knows nothing other than what her handlers tell her.

140933 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to NickR, 7, #831 of 1915 🔗

Attenborough thinks humans are a plague on earth. He is fully signed up to this fearmongering. He wants to use it for the Great Reset. He is part of the problem.

141059 ▶▶ ChrisDinBristol, replying to NickR, 2, #832 of 1915 🔗

Nah, I’m afraid Attenbollox is a fully paid-up member of the Global Liars & Propaganda Club (see recent documentaries on climate change). Cuddly, wise national treasure or misanthropic, anti-scientific lying b*stard? Sadly, it is the latter.

141097 ▶▶▶ NickR, replying to ChrisDinBristol, #833 of 1915 🔗

He might do it for a peerage!

140844 Olive, replying to Olive, 25, #834 of 1915 🔗

Starting to feel horribly helpless: have seen in the last hour or so (ie since the Witty show) that kids camps being cancelled for this weekend and now the one thing I had to look forward to – a Tom Kerridge socially distanced music event this weekend (where already in strictly enforced groups of 6) now cancelled ‘due to the national picture changing drastically’. Have started kicking trees and throwing mugs around the sink. Utterly nothing to look forward to at all. Sat here home working all hours – for what? To afford yet another takeaway meal in my own bloody house? You know that Halloween, fireworks, Xmas is all now for the chop. And all everyone is talking about is ‘better to be safe’ still. I thought earlier today the tide may be turning. I think I was very wrong.

140854 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Olive, 6, #835 of 1915 🔗

Don’t despair, Olive.
Watch Peter Hitchens and Mike Graham on Talk radio today (YouTube)

140857 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Olive, 7, #836 of 1915 🔗

Mass non-compliance can change policies.

Have faith and hang in there…

140875 ▶▶▶ Olive, replying to jhfreedom, 6, #837 of 1915 🔗

Trying – genuinely cannot believe what I am still hearing from people though. When went to post office it seemed everyone was willing this ridiculous ‘circuit break’ to come in. More masks than ever seen before as I walked into town….

141596 ▶▶▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to Olive, 1, #838 of 1915 🔗

Chin up Olive. Today, my other half and I have just travelled back right across the country after a long weekend away: four trains and a tube across London. We wore cheerful smiles the whole way, coupled with some made-up important-looking badges on lanyards that an enterprising person on Etsy produced for us. Not a dickie bird from anyone, despite all the threatening signage and announcements. On the contrary, people started conversations with us, probably because we looked open and approachable.

140872 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Olive, 5, #839 of 1915 🔗

You are not alone, all of us on here have been going through these agonies every day throughout this.

I have not been within one metre of another human being for 188 days and counting. All I have to look forward to is takeaway meals and beers.

140877 ▶▶▶ Olive, replying to Richard O, 2, #840 of 1915 🔗

I would say come to ours, but with my kids you would tip us over that magic 6……

140886 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Olive, 6, #841 of 1915 🔗

Appreciate the thought, but it’s a non-starter as I don’t drive and have boycotted public transport on principle since the mask mandate on 15th June. Lived on my own for 20 years though so it’s not as bad as it sounds.

140893 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Olive, 4, #842 of 1915 🔗

Stay strong Oliver, WE are here for each other.

140903 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to Olive, 4, #843 of 1915 🔗

I’m afraid until the tide turns you have to learn to do something else. I have gone back to learning guitar, researching my family tree, I run my own weather station so have loads of data to analyze, I am going to play online Bridge; in essence you have to keep yourself occupied and leave stuff. Nobody can take your mind, but also don’t give it to them. Anger if channelled can be good but when it leads to stress and worry it can be destructive. Just trying to help.

140968 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Olive, 1, #844 of 1915 🔗

Don’t worry Olive, things will get better – there are very distant chinks of light at the end of the tunnel….
Go for a good long walk and get those endorphins bouncing up and down – you’ll feel a lot better.
(If not a bottle or two of plonk should sort the job out)

140983 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Olive, 1, #845 of 1915 🔗

Olive – we all have those days. Hang on in there! There is a lot of support here – just knowing you are not alone helps!

140846 AN other lockdown sceptic, 2, #846 of 1915 🔗
140861 Mark, replying to Mark, 23, #847 of 1915 🔗

For those thinking the tide is turning, this excellent letter tweeted by Karol Sikora today is great material (already posted by Poshpanic and 2 Pence below, but well worth repeating – look at the list of signatories).

They set up a bit of a false opposition between the government alarmists and people who supposedly want to “do nothing”, in order to present themselves as in the middle, but in reality almost nobody wants to do nothing. Most sceptics want pretty much what they call for – an end to the active generation of fear, and a reasonable approach based on protecting the vulnerable whilst otherwise keeping normal life going as much as possible.

https://twitter.com/ProfKarolSikora/status/1307972101463212032

Authors
Prof Sunetra Gupta
Prof Carl Heneghan
Prof Karol Sikora
Sam Williams, Director and co-Founder of Economic Insight

Signatories
Prof Louise Allan
Prof Francois Balloux
Prof Sucharit Bhakdi
Dr Julii Brainard
Prof Anthony Brookes
Prof Nick Colegrave
Dr Ron Daniels
Prof Robert Dingwall
Prof Fionn Dunne
Prof Kim Fox
Prof Anthony Glass
Dr Andy Gaya
Dr Peter Grove
Prof Matt Hickman
Prof Elizabeth Hughes
Dr Tom Jefferson
Prof Syma Khalid
Prof David Miiles
Prof Paul Ormerod
Prof Andrew Oswald
Prof David Paton
Prof Hugh Pennington
Prof Barbara Pierscionek
Prof Eve Roman
Prof Justin Stebbing
Prof Ellen Townsend
Steve Westaby, Consultant Cardiac Surgeon (retired)
Prof Simon Wood

141044 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to Mark, 1, #848 of 1915 🔗

Wow, great letter and articulately and intelligently outlined an opposing point of view regarding the government’s Covid-19 “strategy”, supported by facts and data.

Therefore destined to be ignored by the plonkers, no doubt!

But all kudos for the authors and signatories … please may that be a small whiff of a tide turning.

141610 ▶▶ wat tyler, replying to Mark, #849 of 1915 🔗

That’s great news.

140864 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 11, #850 of 1915 🔗

Got an answer back from Sir Graham Brady’s office this morning, they confirm they have passed on my e-mail to him and he will read it.

One line though which is worrying, it says “ he does keep a close eye on current opinion” which means to me he will go whichever way the wind is blowing.

If enough of us contact me with our views it might convince him which way the wind is blowing.

140868 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Awkward Git, 7, #851 of 1915 🔗

Well I think the wind is changing.

140887 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Mark, 8, #852 of 1915 🔗

I am hoping for autumn gales.

141196 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, #853 of 1915 🔗

His interview with Julia Hartley-Brewer indicated he has some awareness of people’s discontent..

140873 jb12, replying to jb12, 63, #854 of 1915 🔗

My first post here, I have been reading for a few months. I live in Scotland, and I am a graduate student at the University of Edinburgh with some tutoring responsibilities. I have been back at the university since last week, for as minimal an amount of time as was possible. I mention it because the levels of ridiculousness I encountered, and will have to navigate this semester, were almost unbearable. After all this nonsense this morning, I am absolutely scunnered. I just do not see how things will improve. The genreal public, academics included, are beyond any talking to, do not question anything they read in the newspapers, and are as complicit in this as Nicola Stalin and her coven are. I am beginning to harbour a deep hatred and resentment of most people I meet, which is not a great state of mind to be in.

Anyway, not much of an introduction, and I hope this malaise passes. I guess I just wanted to get it off of my chest, and mention that I appreciate this website and the community that has formed around it.

140905 ▶▶ leggy, replying to jb12, 4, #855 of 1915 🔗

You’re not alone jb, it’s incredibly frustrating isn’t it. But welcome to the comments anyway!

140916 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to jb12, #856 of 1915 🔗

Hello 🙂

140919 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to jb12, 1, #857 of 1915 🔗

Stay strong, not everyone in Edinburgh are zombies.

140920 ▶▶ Mark, replying to jb12, 4, #858 of 1915 🔗

You are absolutely far from alone, and one of the many useful purposes this site serves has been to allow the justifiably infuriated sceptics out there to blow off steam!

140927 ▶▶ Basics, replying to jb12, 4, #859 of 1915 🔗

I would say academics are worse than general public. Get down easter road or Leith and you can find any number of open minds of all ages shapes and colours. The closer ylu get to Bristo Square the worse life becomes. With Prof Ennos it’s not all bad at the university. He is epic in his work for reason.

140956 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Basics, #860 of 1915 🔗

academics are worse than general public.”

Generalised prejudice like this doesn’t help calls for rationality that should be the basis of this site.

Academics are no less susceptible to the Fear narrative than the public in general – but the divisions in the scientific community over Covid show the true picture of what is happening : divide and rule.

You have to remember that universities as institutions are enforcing stupid regulations – as is happening elsewhere, and that the academics on the ground are having to comply in order to get anything done.

It’s shit for everybody.

141022 ▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to RickH, 10, #861 of 1915 🔗

Hello Rick,

I would say that academics are worse than the general public, solely because, even if they should not know ‘better’, they are trained (whether in the humanities or the sciences) to question everything. The peer review system means that they, more than most, should be cognisant of the lack of epistemological uniformity that surrounds almost every contention in every field in the Academy. I do not want to specify which college I work in, but thus far I have seen nothing but unquestioning acceptance of every statistic and rhetorical strategy put out and adopted by both the UK and Scottish parliaments. If any of these people adopted this strategy in their own field, they would not have graduated past first year at undergraduate level, never mind achieved their PhD! I am aware that there will be some who silently disagree (and indeed, I am one and have encountered others in the context of the promotion of the overwhelming number of ‘equality and diversity’ programs), but the policy makers and senior academics are signed up and pushing whatever comes to them from the government and media. It isn’t a case of having to comply with mask regulations or social distancing, but absolute silence when it comes to public discussions of the diktats or repetition of absolutely untenable positions such as ‘the vaccine will mean a return to normal’ in less formal, and more social contexts.

141262 ▶▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to jb12, #862 of 1915 🔗

Thank you jb12 for writing more clearly and fully than myself. You clearly put my frustration across with all these graduated professionals – they should know better. In defence to Rick H I am short and difficult to read.

Generalisations are bad and never a catch all. They are practical in discussing behaviours etc.

141025 ▶▶▶▶ Basics, replying to RickH, 4, #863 of 1915 🔗

It is my experience. Outside of academia people are more inclinded to be reasonable, open and suspicious of nincompoop academics forcing measure onto society. Academics have actively shut down my own thoughtful discussions with them, edin uni staff. Equally families I know of other edin uni staff are struggling because of academic arrogance. It is widely recognised that education does not correlate to good sense. Finally I’ll add the op had no problems speaking in general terms nor do I. I pointed out one other very positive exception Prof Ennos, good company the op has. I could have picked devi should i have wished to tar all academics negatively.

140939 ▶▶ Andy, replying to jb12, 5, #864 of 1915 🔗

I work at the same institution myself. I wish I could pass on some optimism or light at the end of the tunnel comfort, but I can’t think of any. The UCU is doing all it can to make sure as little as possible gets done for as long as possible.Groupthink and monoculture is everywhere. The straw I clutch at is “If you’re still questioning your sanity, you’re doing just fine”. And like Basics says, we’re less mad north-side 😉

140981 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to jb12, 1, #865 of 1915 🔗

Welcome to sanity central; stay with us!

140988 ▶▶▶ Nessimmersion, replying to wendyk, #866 of 1915 🔗

OTOH, Prof Heneghan, Gupta and the others at CEBM are academics as well

140984 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to jb12, 1, #867 of 1915 🔗

So Edinburgh university is doing some face to face tuition?
Many English universities are online completely.
What is the absurd that you encounter at the university?

141026 ▶▶▶ jb12, replying to JulieR, 2, #868 of 1915 🔗

Yes, at least in my school. The lectures are all online. Again I don’t want to give out too much information publicly, but one absurdity: tutorials are typically 10-12 students in size, this year we have to sit in marked-off seats in 150+ capacity lecture halls, everyone distanced out, and if there is to be smaller group work outside of the main discussion, the students are to use the chat function in pre-selected video calling app to converse while they sit 2m apart.

141315 ▶▶▶▶ Emily Tock, replying to jb12, #869 of 1915 🔗

I too am a postgrad student; the tutorials and seminars I’m teaching this year are all online, in a county with, at last check, less than 20 deaths and less than 600 total cases since March. My son is an undergrad, last year, at the same uni where classes start 28 September. He still doesn’t know how his modules will be delivered.

140985 ▶▶ ikaraki, replying to jb12, #870 of 1915 🔗

You ain’t alone, few folk from the area on here, myself included.

Been through the university thing, even started a PhD… They can be insufferable, but if you need what they provide then just push through! Now find myself fortunate enough to have the knowledge to start my own venture, will say don’t forget the applied and practical.

141030 ▶▶▶ jb12, replying to ikaraki, 2, #871 of 1915 🔗

Haha, it is probably too late for the practical, but I enjoy what I do when I am doing the research and, as a relative late-comer to the university system, I appreciate wanting to get out of bed in the morning to start work rather than the drudgery I used to feel when I was a 9-5.

141155 ▶▶▶▶ ikaraki, replying to jb12, #872 of 1915 🔗

Oh the ad-hoc hours, how I miss them!

140992 ▶▶ jb12, replying to jb12, 2, #873 of 1915 🔗

Thanks to everyone for the welcome. I understand I am not alone, but I see like-minded people as being a tiny minority, hence the situation we are facing now.

141150 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to jb12, #874 of 1915 🔗

We may be a minority, but not as small a minority as you think, and our point of view is gaining traction in the media and elsewhere.
Most people are not very brave, unfortunately, and will keep their heads down without challenging authority.
Try quietly sounding out people’s views. Sometimes people are just waiting for someone else to stand up.

141116 ▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to jb12, 6, #875 of 1915 🔗

I am the same with that deep hatred and resentment towards a lot of people, you are not alone. I have reached nearly 60 years of age without really experiencing too much anger in my life, may seem odd but it is true!. Now however I spend my time swearing like a trooper and wishing harm upon certain people, I am at a loss as to how to get rid of my rage.

141140 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to jb12, #876 of 1915 🔗

JB12: welcome!!
I feared this would happen with the universities. It started over in the U.S., and unfortunately whatever lunacy happens there ends up here too.
I sympathise, and can only suggest that if you really can’t hack it, demand your money back and leave. Hopefully there’ll be others who will do the same. The universities need to be hit in their pockets as its the only thing they’ll care about.

Just so you can confirm its them and not you, look up “Tucker Carlson campus craziness” on YouTube, and enjoy.

141191 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to jb12, #877 of 1915 🔗

Welcome 🙂

140884 Dave #KBF, 8, #878 of 1915 🔗

If you are new here, having found the blog via being mentioned in other media.

Welcome, do not stay in the background get involved.

There is also a forum available, access from the top of the front page.

140901 tallandbald, replying to tallandbald, 6, #879 of 1915 🔗

Just had a nosey at Dolan’s twitter feed and this pic is on it.
Had to post due to the absurdity of Handcock looks like a kid on work experience shitting himself at the adults having a go at each other. Hugging himself with that nervous expression – Bless. (Wanker!)
Doris doesn’t look much in charge either!

comment image

140909 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to tallandbald, 11, #880 of 1915 🔗

so where are their effing masks??

140911 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to tallandbald, 10, #881 of 1915 🔗

No social distancing there is there….

140925 ▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Country Mumkin, 10, #882 of 1915 🔗

There only 6 people in the photograph – oh oops, the photographer makes 7!

141011 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to bluemoon, 1, #883 of 1915 🔗

All exempting themselves as key workers

141189 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Country Mumkin, #884 of 1915 🔗

Think we should be tweeting this photo out…

140915 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to tallandbald, 3, #885 of 1915 🔗

gaping Arseholes

141082 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stefarm, #886 of 1915 🔗

Thanks. I’ve just eaten…

141187 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to tallandbald, #887 of 1915 🔗

To me it looks like Boris is receiving orders from Whitty – who we know has links to vaccine companies and the WHO, also to Gates…

141404 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to tallandbald, #888 of 1915 🔗

Is there a date for this snap? Who’s the bruiser on the extreme left?

140904 4096, replying to 4096, 16, #889 of 1915 🔗

I think I’m starting to lose it. I’ve only worn a mask once or twice since March always just saying that I’m exempt when challenged but today in Tesco I felt like I could simply punch some cretin if he said something.

140907 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to 4096, 20, #890 of 1915 🔗

Both my wife and I are feeling like that more and more often so you’re not alone.

This is why we’re stopping going anywhere – not because we’re scared of the virus or don’t want the hassle of being challenged when free-faced but because of what we may do to anyone who even looks at us the wrong way let alone says anything.

140910 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #891 of 1915 🔗

Agree, definitely felt it in Morrisons this morning, security guard strategically placed on the door being more nosey than usual, definite message was to question maskless i.e. ordinary people.

140960 ▶▶▶▶ Annabel Andrew, replying to stefarm, 1, #892 of 1915 🔗

They’re not allowed to ask you- they can be fined £9k. Look at the links at the end of the newsletter!

141002 ▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Annabel Andrew, 2, #893 of 1915 🔗

Don’t worry, I’m always prepared and will never back down

141078 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stefarm, #894 of 1915 🔗

I might be making a point in my local supermarket after Johnson announces second lockdown. But I’ll have to start by wearing a mask…

141076 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #895 of 1915 🔗

My wife went shopping on her own over the past week,I am ready to take my frustration and anger out on the first covid wanker that says something out of line to me so it’s best not to go with her !.The trouble is my wife is getting to the same stage aswell !.

140941 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to 4096, 1, #896 of 1915 🔗

Probably to be made mandatory everywhere this week. Watch all the zombies comply without question, and expect hassle every single time you leave the house, for any reason.

140908 Steve Martindale, 16, #897 of 1915 🔗

Just been listening to the 2 Goddesses of Gloom on the radio, predicting 50,000 new cases a day, as these are all just dodgy test results who cares? But they were also giving dire warnings that deaths could rise to 200 a day, I do not want to appear callous or uncaring but as around 1500 people die every day and as we often get excess winter deaths from flu or cold, if we do get 200 deaths a day is that not part of the ordinary ebb and flow of deaths stats in the winter time?
They also did not make it clear whether slowing it down would just delay the inevitable or whether it was going to disappear..
On the plus side the news did feature the counter argument and had an interview with prof karol sikora, who was good.

140912 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 4, #898 of 1915 🔗

Is the David Icke/Piers Corbyn Trafalgar Sq gig still on this saturday or is this now likely to be outlawed as an “illegal gathering” ? Expect the police to do their best Melbourne impressions anyway.

140924 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to nickbowes, 8, #899 of 1915 🔗

Damn tooting it is. I am travelling 450 miles to be there! Fuck this bollocks, I need to be among human beings again!

140931 ▶▶ leggy, replying to nickbowes, 9, #900 of 1915 🔗

I don’t care. I’m still attending. As the Manic’s said, if we tolerate this, then our children will be next.

140950 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to nickbowes, 7, #901 of 1915 🔗

If you wear BLM T-shirts but carry Anti lockdown placards then gormless plod will kneel for you rather than attack you

141617 ▶▶▶ Colin Smith, replying to Major Panic, #902 of 1915 🔗

I think you meant “kneel for you rather than kneel on your neck”…

140972 ▶▶ Chris Hume, replying to nickbowes, 4, #903 of 1915 🔗

I thought it was a serious demonstration with serious speakers? That is very disappointing. . Corbyn is actually not too bad but Icke? Seriously, we have to move away from these conspiracy theorists and carry the people with us against this nonsense. That is really hard when they can point to Icke and his lizards and just paint us as a bunch of cranks and loons. I was planning on going, but won’t if it is headlined by those two I’m afraid.

141017 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Chris Hume, #904 of 1915 🔗

They will say the crowd is cranks or loons anyway. I would love to see a mainstream line up with people like Peter Hitchens and Toby Young – but it clearly isn’t going to happen. This will probably be our last chance to protest for 6 months – I am sure Icke (if he makes it) will be on last so people who dislike him can just leave early.

141018 ▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Chris Hume, 2, #905 of 1915 🔗

Keeping an open mind then?!

You clearly don’t understand anything that is going on to make such glib black and white statements.

You are now a ‘conspiracy theorist’ for posting on this site.

140918 Gerry Mandarin, replying to Gerry Mandarin, 2, #906 of 1915 🔗

At Morrison’s Kettering, 1 in 10 maskless a week ago.
This weekend at Morrison’s Belper, I was the only maskless person.

140934 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Gerry Mandarin, 6, #907 of 1915 🔗

Because masks are a highly visible thing to the public, they play an important part in the psy-ops. People hear headlines about increasing “cases” and their reaction is to be more assiduous in adopting this visible (though largely useless) symbol. On this site we’re also seeing anecdotal evidence of increasing verbal (or worse) abuse of non-wearers, despite exemptions.

150540 ▶▶▶ Muzz Off, replying to Edward, #908 of 1915 🔗

People have been talking about this apparently increase in abuse of non-mask wearers for weeks, but I’m still commuting daily on the tube, not one confrontation yet. Done it since early August. Don’t be afraid people!

140970 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Gerry Mandarin, 5, #909 of 1915 🔗

I was in South London Morrison yesterday. It was the other way around. More people without masks than a week ago. And the shop was busier. No empty shelves yet.

140922 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 7, #910 of 1915 🔗

I have just watched Julie Hartley Brewer’s interview with the Transport Secretary, Grant Shapps. It was painful to see how innumerate he (and by extension the rest of the government) is. She was asking him about the false positive rate. He clearly did not understand that it, even after she had tried to explain it to him.

140948 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Steve Hayes, #911 of 1915 🔗

Is it possible to send as a link

140926 ambwozere, replying to ambwozere, 10, #913 of 1915 🔗

Just had this survey sent to me via email which I’ve completed and sent back. From the Covid-19 Assembly asking for views on lockdown. Might be worth a few more people doing it, not sure if it will help but anything feels like it might help now.

https://www.surveygizmo.eu/s3/90273590/covid

140930 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to ambwozere, 3, #914 of 1915 🔗

Done

140940 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to ambwozere, 7, #915 of 1915 🔗

Toby is behind it so I think it’s worth us all filling it in to give hime more ammo for the fights.

140949 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to ambwozere, 2, #916 of 1915 🔗

Is it legitimate?

140954 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Telpin, 1, #917 of 1915 🔗

That’s what I was thinking. Something about it didn’t ring true. Happy to be proved wrong …

140975 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to kh1485, 2, #918 of 1915 🔗

It’s totally legitimate. It’s our new project. Please take part.

140997 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #919 of 1915 🔗

Thanks. Sorry, sceptic to the end!

141032 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to kh1485, #920 of 1915 🔗

No probs. Please get a few non-Sceptics you know to complete it. Could you put up a sign in your premises? 🙂

141006 ▶▶▶▶▶ ambwozere, replying to Lockdown Truth, #921 of 1915 🔗

Brilliant I shall get sharing.

141033 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to ambwozere, #922 of 1915 🔗

Thanks!

141020 ▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Lockdown Truth, 1, #923 of 1915 🔗

Completed just now. Relieved to be able to let off steam.
I’m usually a quiet solitary type, but now I’m becoming ever more angry and frustrated.
So many must feel as I do .

141036 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to wendyk, #924 of 1915 🔗

Thanks! Could you convince some no -Sceptics to complete it? They’re the ones we need to find out more about.

141055 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Lockdown Truth, #925 of 1915 🔗

I’ll do my best

141218 ▶▶▶▶▶ EllGee, replying to Lockdown Truth, #926 of 1915 🔗

filled in and shared

140978 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Telpin, 1, #927 of 1915 🔗

Yes. It’s our project! Please ask any non-sceptics you know to complete it. Thanks

140953 ▶▶ Snake Oil Pussy, replying to ambwozere, 1, #928 of 1915 🔗

Done it

140980 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Snake Oil Pussy, 1, #929 of 1915 🔗

Thanks

140966 ▶▶ Heather mutch, replying to ambwozere, 1, #930 of 1915 🔗

Done!! It’s nice to feel like I have a voice rather than shouting into the abyss every time I’m faced with a lockdown fanatic!

140991 ▶▶ Drawde927, replying to ambwozere, 1, #931 of 1915 🔗

Done!

141001 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to ambwozere, 1, #932 of 1915 🔗

Done also – thanks.

141004 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to ambwozere, 1, #933 of 1915 🔗

Done.

140951 nowhereman, replying to nowhereman, 4, #934 of 1915 🔗

Here we go..

HSBC’s shares dive to lowest level since 1995

Next phase of the reset?

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54230733

140955 ▶▶ CGL, replying to nowhereman, 1, #935 of 1915 🔗

What has occurred for that to happen?

141021 ▶▶▶ 2 pence, replying to CGL, 3, #936 of 1915 🔗

A huge trove of secret government documents reveals for the first time how the giants of Western banking move trillions of dollars in suspicious transactions, enriching themselves and their shareholders while facilitating the work of terrorists, kleptocrats, and drug kingpins.

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/jasonleopold/fincen-files-financial-scandal-criminal-networks

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/european-banks-see-biggest-drop-months-after-massive-fincen-leak

141073 ▶▶▶▶ CGL, replying to 2 pence, #937 of 1915 🔗

Thanks – will look at those

141173 ▶▶▶▶▶ anti_corruption_tsar, replying to CGL, #938 of 1915 🔗

Centred on 788 790 Finchley Road, and well documented by the great and late (sadly) Gordon Bowden: http://www.gordonbowden.co.uk/

141029 ▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to CGL, 1, #939 of 1915 🔗

Even BBC has it, doing a Panorama programme tonight. On something everyone has known about forever, that London is the centre of giant money laundering schemes through banks like HSBC and shadier outfits with branches in the City, often using British Crown dependency tax havens like the Turks and Caicos, Bermuda, British Virgin Islands etc etc.
The only novelty is the leak of some 2,000 Suspect Activity Reports (SARs, nice, isn’t it?) which banks have to complete if they suspect money laundering, but rarely act on and certainly not for their biggest customers.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54225572

141069 ▶▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Bruno, #940 of 1915 🔗

Thank you – as you say as if we didnt know they are crooks!

141079 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Bruno, #941 of 1915 🔗

I watched some Netflix documentary on this recently. It’s not a new thing? That was HSBC too

140958 Nic, replying to Nic, 9, #942 of 1915 🔗

So whitty says a vaccine next spring a few weeks ago he said it was at least a year away and that er might never have one.he is a liar and not to be trusted.
Now I know we dont need a vaccine ,but many sheep wont go back to normal until they have a jab
But this could go on for years we get to spring and they will say it will be ready in summer then autumn then next year see where I’m going!

140969 ▶▶ Kev, replying to Nic, 14, #943 of 1915 🔗

Anyone who wants the jab should get one, whether they appreciate the risks or not! It’s totally on them!

For myself I would have to be held down and subdued and done by force, against my will, I would never give my consent!

140979 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Nic, 4, #944 of 1915 🔗

These people are really enjoying inflicting pain and suffering. It must be immensely satisfying and highly amusing for them to see such high levels of compliance with what are obviously absurdities.

140987 ▶▶ Will, replying to Nic, 1, #945 of 1915 🔗

If they want a jab I am sure Putin would be delighted to supply a few million…

141015 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Will, 1, #946 of 1915 🔗

Putin isn’t bad at the other sort of jab either. Witless and Vaillant deserve a few of those each!

141008 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Nic, 3, #947 of 1915 🔗

That’s why they’re keeping the Fear going and having to hide the fact that there’s no need for a vaccine : there is no viable vaccine in sight – apart from the fact that it isn’t needed. Egg on face time if truth were told.

Remember Tom Jefferson’s prescient comments in 2017 about links of this tribe to the pharmaceutical industry? :

https://blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2017/12/06/tom-jefferson-the-uk-turns-to-witty-vallance-and-van-tam-for-leadership-revolving-doors/

141154 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Nic, #948 of 1915 🔗

See this very revealing thread on Simon Dolan’s Twitter feed – just the photo tells you that Whitty is the puppeteer here: https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1308016241781682177

Boris looks like he is receiving orders..

There are another couple of threads on Simon’s Twitter showing that Whitty is compromised (to say the least..)

Would be great if anyone with Twitter could share these with Peter Hitchens, Julia Hartley-Brewer, Denise Welch and anyone else you can think of!

140973 wendyk, 3, #949 of 1915 🔗

https://www.change.org/p/petition-vote-of-no-confidence-in-nicola-sturgeon-and-the-scottish-government-resignsturgeon

Trending on change.org

Please sign if languishing up here.

Here we go again: lockdown 2.0: the list of closures will finish off the likelihood of any small businesses surviving this madness.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/health/coronavirus/leaked-circuit-breaker-lockdown-plans-list-measures-which-could-be-placed-scotland-2978395

140976 kf99, replying to kf99, 1, #950 of 1915 🔗

Wow. Semi-sceptical piece in the Guardian .

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/21/coronavirus-government-liberties-tories-police-powers-laws

Although he doesn’t criticise non-Tory measures in Wales/Scotland, but it’s a start.

140998 ▶▶ RickH, replying to kf99, 4, #951 of 1915 🔗

John Harris is one of the few regular Groan journalists who does paddle his own canoe.

Sometimes I agree with him, sometimes I don’t : but at least I know I’m getting an honest view. The omission of particular comment on Wales and Scotland isn’t really anything : it’s an article written by an English journalist about England.

Where I would part company with him is in his acceptance of the basic narrative about a ‘crisis’ – to which the answer is, as always :

“Crisis? What crisis”

But at least he is picking up on the disjunction between the alleged disease and the remedies. It’s a start.

140977 DomW, #952 of 1915 🔗

Ignore – failed image upload

140982 Drawde927, replying to Drawde927, 4, #953 of 1915 🔗

I posted this yesterday, probably too late to receive a reply:

I would really like to know how much the overall level of hospitalisations and deaths (for all causes, or at least for all infectious disease) has been increasing lately, and if it is more or less the same as (a) the apparent increase in the same for Covid and (b) the rate from previous years.

I suspect that most of the apparent increase is just the normal seasonal trend in illness and death, likely aggravated by the false-positive issue (though I think the NHS Pillar 1 tests are more reliable, with a lower FPR) but would really like to know for sure.

141007 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Drawde927, #954 of 1915 🔗

Finding and sorting hospital data is tricky, I would be interested in answer to your question but do not know where to find that sort of information

141084 ▶▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Steve Martindale, #955 of 1915 🔗

I was hoping these sorts of statistics might already be available somewhere (didn’t manage to find it myself), Ivor Cummins’ recent video presentation shows Covid deaths plotted against normal yearly death rates at one point.

141096 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Steve Martindale, #956 of 1915 🔗

Make a FOI request, I did to the acute trust in Leicester and they answered all of my questions.

141106 ▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Drawde927, #957 of 1915 🔗

The semi-sceptical BBC article https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54228649 actually refers to this issue “ rising admissions for respiratory illness and, sadly, deaths are what you would expect to happen at this time of year as you head into autumn and winter when these viruses always spread more ” and does contain a chart, though it isn’t really detailed enough to read easily (no month subdivisions)
comment image

141160 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Drawde927, #958 of 1915 🔗

I have seen it today, think someone put it on Guido Fawkes (?), will try and find a link and post here..

141161 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Carrie, 1, #959 of 1915 🔗

Found it! http://probabilityandlaw.blogspot.com/2020/09/uk-plotting-new-covid-cases-per-1000.html

Scroll down the page and you will find hospitalisations..

140986 godowneasy, 1, #960 of 1915 🔗

Theme Tune Suggestion:

Demolition Man by The Police

140989 Hieronimusb, replying to Hieronimusb, 10, #961 of 1915 🔗

A late and shit free limerick in response to @DamRitter’s earlier thread – my WordPress skills don’t allow me to insert it in the right place it seems:

A science denier called Whitty
Who thought he could top Walter Mitty
Said ‘I’m doing my best
With this PCR test’
To get down to the fake nitty gritty.

141130 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Hieronimusb, 1, #962 of 1915 🔗

To make your life totally shitty.

141185 ▶▶▶ Hieronimusb, replying to Lockdown Truth, #963 of 1915 🔗

(Best Ian Richardson voice) You might say that..

140993 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 8, #964 of 1915 🔗

Re the constant harping on about this ridiculous mobile app – I have a nice ten year old Nokia that does very little apart from calls and texts.
No apps no vacs either, won`t get tested as I cannot afford to take two weeks off for a seasonal sniffle.

141054 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to nickbowes, 3, #965 of 1915 🔗

Nys ritn i had 2 yus txt spk wiv my nok

141057 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to nickbowes, #966 of 1915 🔗

Me too. Has been the subject of mockery in the past: not now, it isn’t!

141075 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to nickbowes, 3, #967 of 1915 🔗

I will be digging mine out too.

140994 Cheshirecatslave, replying to Cheshirecatslave, #968 of 1915 🔗

Actually a sensible article from the BBC!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54228649

141012 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 3, #969 of 1915 🔗

probably just wind, won’t happen again.

141050 ▶▶ jb12, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 2, #970 of 1915 🔗

They do this on all issues to make it look like they are balanced: one article for the position they stand against, surrounded by a mountain of articles pushing their own position.

141112 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 1, #971 of 1915 🔗

The same can’t be said for many of the comments btl

140996 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 6, #972 of 1915 🔗

We’ve reached yet another peak of insanity. How high can we go, I wonder? (my emphasis)

Geraint Davies
(@GeraintDaviesMP)
To prevent 50,000 cases a day UK must reduce movement & assembly, the engines of infection by maximising remote working from home; schools open 6 days but each child for 4 days so schools only 2/3rds full; wear masks & use straws in pubs .

(from Twitter)

141003 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tenchy, 6, #973 of 1915 🔗

Well you do get pissed quicker, apparently

141009 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Tenchy, 4, #974 of 1915 🔗

To ensure compliance for eating food, all meals will have to be liquefied.

Masks will be mandatory everywhere, including in your own home, and billions all over the world will happily comply.

141038 ▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Richard O, #975 of 1915 🔗

There will have to be random surprise raids on peoples homes to ensure compliance. All worth it of course to save 50,000 lives.

141048 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Saved To Death, #976 of 1915 🔗

Even if it only saves one life.

141052 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Saved To Death, 1, #977 of 1915 🔗

We will each have our own personal Covid marshal to check in on us once every hour to make sure we are complying with HANDS-FACE-SPACE-STRAWS.

141071 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Richard O, 3, #978 of 1915 🔗

To be fair, lots of studies have shown most transmission is in the home. To people you live with. So that is where if masks did work (which they don’t), they should be worn. Not while browsing cushions at Peter Jones.

141396 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Sophie123, 1, #979 of 1915 🔗

Odd because a 73 year old male friend of mine here in Sweden has tested positive for antibodies (after a seemingly mild case of Covid), but his wife apparently does not have antibodies. They live in a small flat…
You’d expect her to have tested positive as well..

141000 Jane, replying to Jane, 14, #980 of 1915 🔗

So, the UK govt is now basically governing by emergency decree.
Goebbels would be proud.

141016 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Jane, 1, #981 of 1915 🔗

https://liberty.e-activist.com/page/63721/petition/1?ea.tracking.id=Website
If you disagree with this, suggest you access the Liberty website, and possibly sign the anti CV Act petition.
There’s other help there, legal ,what your rights are etc.

141039 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Jane, 4, #982 of 1915 🔗

I wonder when Johnson & co will appear on the podium dressed in military style uniforms, lots of gold braid & medals for the campaigns they have not fought.

141042 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Dave #KBF, 4, #983 of 1915 🔗

Even Adolf’s Iron Cross was genuinely won.

141164 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Jane, #984 of 1915 🔗

Hopefully not for much longer – see this thread which ‘outs’ Whitty: https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1308034035252371457

141010 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 2, #985 of 1915 🔗

Is Mayo in the house, could do with some alternative thinking – if you are;

A couple of days ago you asked what the evidence was for there not being a ‘second wave’ – I asked what the evidence was for a second wave and were they normal after nasty coronavirus outbreaks (or any other nasty virus outbreaks) – my question was late so you probably didn’t see it – but I would very much like to know your thoughts.

I understand some people believe there was some sort of ‘second wave’ after the Spanish flu about 100 years ago, although there are plenty of other theories, including a second, and different virus rocking up.

But obviously nobody would base a ‘second wave’ theory purely on this subjective history, so there must be more recent evidence of second waves, but what is this evidence, please enlighten us.

Many thanks.

141019 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Major Panic, 4, #986 of 1915 🔗

Well no Mayo on the salad – but, did you clock that the CEBM had examined this question?

Second waves as a common feature are not a fact at all :

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/covid-19-epidemic-waves/

141049 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to RickH, 1, #987 of 1915 🔗

Yes, that and Dr Y and his 2 colleagues paper in LS a couple of weeks ago are why I don’t believe there is credible evidence for a second wave. I think that’s was why I asked the Q to Mayo after he/she asked for evidence for no second wave – the emphasis should be on evidence FOR a second wave.

There must be some reason for the ‘second wave’ thinking scientists to be so confident, and they seem to be keeping these reasons as a secret…

141250 ▶▶▶▶ Mayo, replying to Major Panic, 5, #988 of 1915 🔗

I think that’s was why I asked the Q to Mayo after he/she asked for evidence for no second wave – the emphasis should be on evidence FOR a second wave.

I disagree. We should assume that the default situation is that the virus is still active and that we still have a large susceptible population until evidence suggests otherwise.

However, I think the government & advisers have jumped the gun to-day. Continued close monitoring would have sufficed got another 7 to 10 days. Extrapolating from what was effectively little more than a single week’s data to get 50k cases is wildly speculative.

I’m inclined to agree with Carl Heneghan’s take on things which is that we are seeing a general seasonal uptick in all respiratory illnesses.

141313 ▶▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Mayo, #989 of 1915 🔗

thank you

141031 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Major Panic, 2, #990 of 1915 🔗

I do wonder if it was cooked up at certain point as a perfect story to tell after lockdown restrictions eased. The starting point was possibly Spanish Flu, but they probably knew that was not really relevant – it’s just a good cover. In reality, any “second wave” is simply the result of restrictions being eased, in the case where lockdown has done something to slow the spread (but nothing much to save lives) or is the result of normal seasonal fluctuations.

141064 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Julian, 2, #991 of 1915 🔗

I think the latter. There is no evidence to show that lockdowns do anything than cause misery (social, economic, and all other health reasons that are non COVID)

Coronaviruses however, we know we more prevalent in the winter. Typically peaking Jan to March.

141232 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Julian, #992 of 1915 🔗

Well – it was pretty obvious to me that when the ‘plague horror’ story ran out of steam in May as the curve declined in line with the common pattern, we then had all sorts of shit about a ‘second wave’ as a replacement panic generator.

141051 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Major Panic, 1, #993 of 1915 🔗

It is postulated that there were three separate viruses. The first in 1917, the big one in 1918 and a third in 1919 or 1920. Ivor Cummins has a video on this.

141083 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Major Panic, 1, #994 of 1915 🔗

I believe that the Spanish flu is the precedent be used for the warnings of a second wave. It’s the only example ever given when challenged.
As you say, there could be a specific reason for there to have been a second wave of infection and death, which might be different populations being affected in the first and second waves.

141166 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Major Panic, #995 of 1915 🔗

http://probabilityandlaw.blogspot.com/2020/09/uk-plotting-new-covid-cases-per-1000.html

The graphs here debunk the second wave theory… note there is a graph lower down showing hospitalisations..

141561 ▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to Major Panic, #996 of 1915 🔗

The “Russian flu” of the 1890’s now thought to be a corona virus by many scientists had 3 “waves” then is believed to have mutated into a common cold. The Victorians kept calm and carried on.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/31/did-a-coronavirus-cause-the-pandemic-that-killed-queen-victorias-heir

141013 A. Contrarian, replying to A. Contrarian, 5, #997 of 1915 🔗

Aaargh my brother posting smug comments on BookFace about how all the climate deniers (of which I am not one) are denying TWhitty and Bedspread’s latest pronouncements, which we must take seriously… Followed by posting the following Guardian article about how all our liberties have been taken away – which he agrees with – what?!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/21/coronavirus-government-liberties-tories-police-powers-laws?fbclid=IwAR2NhCy6u9V7CQl6mq6eXby2zDcg-fDfOne224eJ7VFe6qofVuSh8T-dLqs

141027 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to A. Contrarian, 5, #998 of 1915 🔗

You can choose your friends, you cannot choose your family.

141045 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #999 of 1915 🔗

ABSOLUTELY.

141062 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #1000 of 1915 🔗

Cognitive Dissonance is common currency these days…..Paranoid Schizophrenia also!

141512 ▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to A. Contrarian, #1001 of 1915 🔗

I heard the phrase ‘climate deniers’ recently, from an acquaintance online – knew it might start an argument but had to ask, if said group by definition includes the UK High Court, which ruled (late 2000s) that Al Gore’s movie ‘An Inconvenient Truth’ contained at least 9 major factual errors, and ought to only be seen under some kind of disclaimer and/or with presence of scientific rebuttal. No answer as yet.. 🙂

141037 RickH, replying to RickH, 23, #1002 of 1915 🔗

I thought that the following from ‘OffGuardian’ was very succinct in clearly exposing (and disposing of) the myths of the government pseudo-scientists :

============================================================

In today’s “Covid briefing” Chris Whitty – the UK’s Chief Medical Officer – outlined that the Sars-Cov-2 virus poses four types of risk. But is he right? Let’s take them one at a time.

RISK 1: THE VIRUS CAN KILL PEOPLE. Misleading. Chris Whitty himself has been more than clear that the odds of dying from Covid19 are very very small. All of the serological studies done to date found an infection-fatality ratio of around 0.2% Meaning an infected person has 99.8% chance of surviving.

RISK 2: THE VIRUS CAN LEAD TO THE NHS BEING OVERRUN. Bogus. The hypothetical “covid surge” was first predicted back in March, and never materialised. Whitty admits as much in his statement. Even at the peak of the “pandemic” ICUs were operating at less than 60% capacity . To this day surgeons are working at 50% capacity .

RISK 3: THE VIRUS CAN IMPACT PUBLIC HEALTH INDIRECTLY VIA POSTPONED OPERATIONS, CANCELLED TESTS ETC .False. It’s not the “virus” which cancelled operations, it was the lockdown policies which were put in place to avoid the hospitals being overrun. Which, as Whitty admitted, never happened. It was not the virus which caused people to avoid healthcare out fear, but the press coverage deliberately designed to frighten people .

RISK 4: THE VIRUS CAN ADVERSELY AFFECT PUBLIC HEALTH THROUGH ECONOMIC IMPACT. False. The virus has no economic impact of itself, lockdown does. Lockdown closed businesses and lost jobs and started a recession. A lockdown which was only put in place to #ProtectheNHS, which did not need protecting .

*

So, of Chris Whitty’s “four risks”, one of them has a 99.8% survival rate, one of them never actually happened and the other two are consequences of lockdown policy and not related to the virus at all .

141089 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to RickH, 10, #1003 of 1915 🔗

probably why the prick was shaking so much – are we sure his family hasn’t been kidnapped…

141172 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Major Panic, 1, #1004 of 1915 🔗

You mean the kidnappers have got the wrong Whittys? Must have been Boris wot done it. Only an idiot could get the wrong Whitty not once, but repeatedly.

141092 ▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 2, #1005 of 1915 🔗

Yes, that’s a pretty good response. I’m interested in this one, though, which I think could bear some close examination:

The hypothetical “covid surge” was first predicted back in March, and never materialised. Whitty admits as much in his statement. Even at the peak of the “pandemic” ICUs were operating at less than 60% capacity . To this day surgeons are working at 50% capacity .

I’d love to see an in depth analysis of the numbers of acute and critical beds occupied through the “crisis” period, to try to assess to what extent the crash program of freeing up space could have been justified even back at the peak demand. Percentages are problematic because they presumably are percentages of a progressively increasing number for bed capacity, ultimately including the almost unused Nightingales.

141228 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Mark, #1006 of 1915 🔗

Good point. The CEBM data shows critical care bed occupancy peaking at c.3,300 in April – but I can’r find what the total capacity was.

141119 ▶▶ stewart, replying to RickH, 4, #1007 of 1915 🔗

Whitty explained that lockdowns so that a “second wave” does not disrupt other NHS services
But NHS services have already been disrupted…. to prepare for the “second wave”!

It’s the mad f***ing hatters party.

141217 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to stewart, #1008 of 1915 🔗

Yes – It’s really ‘Alice Through the Looking Glass’ territory, when we know that the NHS is struggling with the last lockdown backlog, and has shed beds because of ‘distancing’.

FFS!

141169 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to RickH, 1, #1009 of 1915 🔗

And Whitty has known links to vaccine companies: https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1308034035252371457

141043 p02099003, replying to p02099003, 3, #1010 of 1915 🔗

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statler_and_Waldorf aka Vallance and Whitty. If there was a more ironic name than Professor Whitty I cant think of one.

141061 ▶▶ Strange Days, replying to p02099003, 1, #1011 of 1915 🔗

I wonder if he was known as witless at school, it might explain a lot

141091 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to p02099003, 5, #1012 of 1915 🔗

The self-righteous brothers

141102 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to steve_w, 3, #1013 of 1915 🔗

Well we’ve certainly lost that loving feeling, and it’s now chained melody.

141117 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to steve_w, 2, #1014 of 1915 🔗

Dumb and Dumber?

141093 ▶▶ Klein, replying to p02099003, 2, #1015 of 1915 🔗

Half-witty ?

141094 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to p02099003, 1, #1016 of 1915 🔗

That’s an insult to Statler and Waldorf – they were actually consistent and funny

141046 Julian, replying to Julian, 15, #1017 of 1915 🔗

Assuming as seems almost certain that today’s bollocks from Whitty & co was stage setting for more bollocks from the PM & co tomorrow, it should be clear to all now that they are going to keep doubling down until the bitter end.

It’s all out war now.

Anyone who knows any staunch Tories or Brexiteers or Boris fans who still harbour some kind of regard for the PM and the others, should be sternly told off and told to stop being silly.

I still think what we need is a well funded single-issue political party, or central movement as a point of focus, a la Vote Leave, professionally assisted and managed, that designs and runs a massive information campaign designed to counteract the govt. propaganda and get the kind of change in public opinion that will frighten enough backbenchers to get this to turn round

141063 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Julian, 9, #1018 of 1915 🔗

Best thing members of any political party can do at the moment is resign their membership and tell their member of parliament and local party why they are doing this.

141077 ▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #1019 of 1915 🔗

I wondered if there might be a leak of MPs, they could stand down to force a local election and then stand as an independent (if they’ve still got any guts for the job). Meanwhile a new nation wide party could form which they could ally themselves to.

141214 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #1020 of 1915 🔗

I disagree, having though about it for a long time.

Without contrarians, the establishment shills just walk away with control.

141098 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Julian, 1, #1021 of 1915 🔗

For the first time I actually agree with this. The only reason I didn’t before is because I thought all this would be over well before the May elections

141060 Laurence, replying to Laurence, 8, #1022 of 1915 🔗

Can we please get the Spanish situation in perspective.

Around 10% of tests in Spain are positive.

Around 6% of deaths are of people who have tested positive.

A smaller percentage of people are dieing with a positive test than in the population as a whole.

SO THERE IS NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER OF A SECOND WAVE IN SPAIN FROM THE ‘CASES’ FIGURES.

141070 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Laurence, 1, #1023 of 1915 🔗

did you cc the vallance & whitty show in on your conclusion – I think we’re all convinced

141088 ▶▶▶ Laurence, replying to Major Panic, 1, #1024 of 1915 🔗

No, but even this website and CEBM haven’t picked up on this point.

141103 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Major Panic, 2, #1025 of 1915 🔗

You mean “Vacuous” and “Witless”

141067 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 3, #1026 of 1915 🔗

Why do I keep thinking about the film:Invasion of the body snatchers,the 50’s original not the pathetic remake.

141201 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Fingerache Philip., #1027 of 1915 🔗

Because it’s a bloody good representation of what’s happening.

141298 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Fingerache Philip., #1028 of 1915 🔗

Great film. I think the bit at the end where the authorities at last start to believe him was tacked on as the film was felt to be too downbeat without it. But the remake finished with no hint of optimism. Which version are we in?

141350 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Edward, #1029 of 1915 🔗

I like to think the former

141081 PowerCorrupts, replying to PowerCorrupts, 4, #1030 of 1915 🔗

Please sign petition: To prevent any restrictions on those who refuse cov19 vaccination’, it is up to 142,071 and growing, we need millions…if everyone got 3- 5 other people to sign it would be astronomic….
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/323442

141085 ▶▶ CGL, replying to PowerCorrupts, 1, #1031 of 1915 🔗

Exponential even!!!!

141090 Drawde927, replying to Drawde927, 1, #1033 of 1915 🔗

Just discovered Steve Brown’s Twitter feed https://twitter.com/stevebrown2856
For anyone not sick of charts and graphs there’s a lot of good information there, especially shedding light on/debunking the latest “50,000 cases per day” scare.

141100 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Drawde927, 1, #1034 of 1915 🔗

This is a goldmine! Thanks.

141133 ▶▶ Drawde927, replying to Drawde927, #1035 of 1915 🔗

And on the subject of charts, it seems like this is where Whitty and Vallance got their “not a prediction” from: https://twitter.com/Manquality2018/status/1307995185226428417/photo/1

141095 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 2, #1036 of 1915 🔗

Matt Hancock apparently answering an urgent question shortly (next 20 or so mins)

141101 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Sarigan, 11, #1037 of 1915 🔗

Hopefully the question is ‘will you resign and give way to Carl Henegan’ and the answer is ‘yes’

141108 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to nocheesegromit, 8, #1038 of 1915 🔗

I am doing a ‘resign dance’ as we speak.

141171 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Sarigan, #1039 of 1915 🔗

Is that at the request of the Speaker?

141104 Locked down and out, replying to Locked down and out, 12, #1040 of 1915 🔗

I can’t believe what I am a reading, Labour coming around (well, sort of) to a sceptical viewpoint and not prepared to play fast and loose with the nation’s finances! It’s what I would have expected from Boris, but not anymore. Maybe the tide is turning after all:

Labour shadow health secretary Jonathan Ashworth has urged the government to avoid imposing a second national lockdown following today’s briefing from Prof Chris Whitty and Sir Patrick Vallance.
He said Downing Street would be to blame for a second wave of the virus, saying the government had failed to fix the testing regime and had not supported people to self-isolate.
“The government must do what it takes to prevent another lockdown, which would cause unimaginable damage to our economy and people’s wellbeing,” he said.
“We need an effective testing and tracing system with support for people to isolate. When testing breaks down we can’t track this virus and it quickly gets out of control.”
Shadow chancellor Annelise Dodds has also taken aim at the government, accusing it of a “cavalier” approach to spending during the pandemic.
Speaking at the Labour Party’s online conference , she said: “You’re only as cavalier with public money as our current chancellor if you don’t know the value of it.
“As chancellor, I would ensure that public money was always spent wisely. Targeted where it’s needed most. Not splurged where it isn’t.”

141107 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Locked down and out, 5, #1041 of 1915 🔗

Is this a turning point? First time I’ve agreed with Labour in a long time!

141111 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to nocheesegromit, 13, #1042 of 1915 🔗

Really? Agree with a mass testing and tracing programme?

Look like Labour support the China – Asia – Australia approach of total suppression through total surveillance.

Not for me thanks.

Plough resources to support the more vulnerable and let everyone take responsibility for themselves. That’s what I support.

141114 ▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to stewart, 4, #1043 of 1915 🔗

Not that bit, just the stuff about a second lockdown. I’ll take what I can get these days.

141182 ▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to nocheesegromit, 2, #1044 of 1915 🔗

Yes – at least it’s a small advance to get the lockdown idea identified as rubbish. A thin wedge – but a wedge.

Politically, the issue is to make MPs feel that there may be votes in standing out from the crowd and getting ahead of the game with a tide shifting against the current shambles.

141291 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to RickH, #1045 of 1915 🔗

Agreed – it’s long overdue and welcome to see a breakdown in the near-unanimity we’ve had so far among the governing classes.

141158 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to stewart, #1046 of 1915 🔗

Me too

141113 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to nocheesegromit, 6, #1047 of 1915 🔗

Well on the face of it, it may be helpful to our cause up to a point, though possibly not for the “right” reasons. Test and trace is largely nonsense, and encouraging people to needlessly self isolate at public expense isn’t exactly a good use of funds either. But opposing a new national lockdown is a step in the right direction, though I fear it won’t go further than that – local lockdowns and the continuing lockdown of distancing, masks, rule of six, rule by SI etc would continue under Labour

141115 ▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Julian, 1, #1048 of 1915 🔗

Yes this is what I fear too

141174 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Locked down and out, 2, #1049 of 1915 🔗

Ashworth isn’t the brightest bulb in the chandelier.

But it’s a bit of a move in the right direction, even tho’ he’s hanging onto the rags of ‘Taest and Trace’ as a policy which, as we know is beside the point :

  1. It doesn’t work as a blanket solution, and has never been recommended except in very specific circumstances in prior policy documents.
  2. It isn’t needed, any more than it is for other moderate seasonal diseases
  3. As we know – the tests are too inaccurate at low levels of incidence to identify actual infection.
  4. It’s throwing more money at a non-problem.
141184 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Locked down and out, 2, #1050 of 1915 🔗

Don’t agree on T&T but small steps I guess. If we can avoid Lockdown II, then hopefully we can push back on the bigger picture from there.

141194 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Locked down and out, #1051 of 1915 🔗

Rank hypocrisy from Labour, trying to have their cake and eat it as well – panic-monger about a dangerous disease with pie in the sky nonsense about supposed track and trace and self-isolation cures..

141293 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Mark, #1052 of 1915 🔗

When has hypocrisy ever been absent from politics?

141105 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 6, #1053 of 1915 🔗

Hancock making a statement in the house.

Project fear is running 100%

141157 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Dave #KBF, 9, #1054 of 1915 🔗

It’s Mega Monday before final fear friday. But they are too late. Too many are already aware something is up. Now those disparate groups and individuals are connecting. We will have our country back.

141109 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 6, #1055 of 1915 🔗

Why are the government so frit of locking down any part of London? Nearest I believe is/was Luton if it ever went into lockdown, or Leicester.

I am sure if they sent in the mobile testing people they could get a goodly number of cases in London.

Frightened of the backlash?

141159 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #1056 of 1915 🔗

Indeed. They are screwed every way in their arguments.

If immunity in the population is low – then, clearly the badly afflicted London is in for another massive second wave to match the first – so needs locking down. 🙂

Or the first wave created a level of immunity that, coupled with other immune factors means that such measures are pointless.

Make up yer mind time.

141176 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Dave #KBF, 2, #1057 of 1915 🔗

Locking down London makes the forthcoming protest on Saturday much more difficult..

141283 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1058 of 1915 🔗

London being the seat of government, they may be afraid of inducing too much resistance there, such as rioting in Brixton, Croydon etc. Too close to home for them, whereas it’s OK to screw the peasants in the North.

141118 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 3, #1059 of 1915 🔗
141126 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to wendyk, 5, #1060 of 1915 🔗

Just the fact he doesn’t understand what false positives mean shows he is unfit for this office. Peoples lives and livelihoods are being ruined based on these statistics, it’s not a game.

141132 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to Achilles, 4, #1061 of 1915 🔗

Quite correct. This lot are a kamikaze cabal, and they’re taking us all down.

141120 NickR, replying to NickR, 3, #1062 of 1915 🔗

This chart shows positive tests as a % of all tests for the UK as a whole.
I’ve also shown a false positive rate at 0.8% and shown notional numbers for the asymptomatic and people who are tested after the virus has become inactive, generally about 2 or 3 weeks after infection.
So, I’ve assumed 70% are asymptomatic and 60% are tested after the infectious phase.
Of the positive tests very few are likely to be genuinely infectious. In the chart only the little gap between the top blue and grey line represent infectious people.
This may be why so many people who test positive still didn’t infect even the people in their own home.

141142 ▶▶ RickH, replying to NickR, #1063 of 1915 🔗

A good shot at making sense of the reality

141121 Mark, replying to Mark, 7, #1064 of 1915 🔗

It is a ‘pyrrhic victory’ if a state is destroyed to curb infections
Sky News Australia continuing their sterling work in this panic.

141151 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Mark, 2, #1065 of 1915 🔗

The have been making excellent comentary. Important ti know it is not tge same organisation as the poor UK Sky News, I learned on LS.

141122 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 11, #1066 of 1915 🔗

Good piece from a panic-resistant virologist
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2020/09/21/can-beat-covid-without-lockdowns-says-top-german-virologist/

“It is time to stop all this alarmism. We can outsmart the virus using all our knowledge,”
“We have to realise that Covid-19 is going to be with us for a long time and we must learn to live with it.

He goes on to say that we can’t keep shutting everything down and argues against assumptions that lasting immunity is low

141138 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Charlie Blue, 3, #1067 of 1915 🔗

We have to realise that Covid-19 is going to be with us for a long time and we must learn to live with it.”

But will it be ‘with us’ in any important sense ‘for a long time’? Why should it differ from Swine ‘Flu?

141123 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 4, #1068 of 1915 🔗

How about “RESISTANCE” for a name for any future sceptic political party?

141124 Graham, replying to Graham, 49, #1070 of 1915 🔗

I have just written to my MP. I prefer to keep it short. I don’t think MPs (or anybody, unless very keen indeed) will read a long essay-type letter. Here’s what I said:

I write to you as a constituent and a lifelong Conservative voter at general elections since 1979. I write to express my opposition to the coronavirus measures and to urge you to vote against the renewal of the Coronavirus Act. I will not give my reasons at length, because I am sure you have encountered them before, but in summary, I believe the coronavirus measures are

  • immoral and contrary to fundamental human rights
  • disproportionate
  • ultra vires – that is, the measures are not allowed under the powers inherent in the laws and legal principles used
  • ineffective, given the lack of any significant correlation between the degree of lockdown in various countries and the number of deaths per capita
  • an outrage against public health, considering the number of unnecessary deaths from cancer, heart disease and suicide
  • chaotic and confusing, and symptomatic of a lack of both leadership and considered policy-making

I’m not asking for a rebuttal or counter-arguments. I have seen them and continue to see them everywhere, and I believe I have taken them into account. I am simply stating that I will have to find another party to vote for at the next election unless matters improve. I expect that a single-issue party will emerge and, like the Brexit Party, create an incentive for change.

141125 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Graham, 7, #1071 of 1915 🔗

Good letter.

141254 ▶▶▶ Kate, replying to stewart, 1, #1072 of 1915 🔗

Used a lot of it as a template for my MP’s letter. Added a bit about the vaccine.

141135 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Graham, 7, #1073 of 1915 🔗

Well done. I think that you’re absolutely right about not writing essays. I’ve done much the same, condensing things into three sets of bullet-points dealing with, an overview of policy flaws, the facts and the evidence and a request for specific actions by the MP, including opposition to government proposals on vaccines..

I’ve also included, indications that I wasn’t born yesterday and won’t be satisfied with bland repetition of the myths as a response.

I am not particularly hopeful of seeing any action – but one can but try – and not trying is inaction.

I’m from the other end of the political spectrum, but the problems are just the same : the culture born of inexperience, pole-climbing and subservience that has grown in parliament.

141146 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Graham, 3, #1074 of 1915 🔗

BRILLIANT letter.

141153 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Graham, 1, #1075 of 1915 🔗

100: 1 to change the bulb and 99 to write dissertations; ie : light bulbs and Zen Buddhism in a post Covid world.

141127 Darryl, 5, #1076 of 1915 🔗

There is some very good analysis and proper investigative journalism on the UK Covid statistics on this YouTube figures it destroys the case for lockdown using government data. As many on this site already know we are being completely misled by the media reporting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDZjxnMEBE0

141128 Telpin, replying to Telpin, 16, #1077 of 1915 🔗

My daughter has just told me that Oxford University has sent everyone an email address for reporting rule transgressions to the university. And this the University that Chris Patten is VC of. I never ever thought I would see universities doing this. Shameful.

141129 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Telpin, 2, #1078 of 1915 🔗

If we see this crap gone in my lifetime, the unis will be the last to go

141163 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Telpin, 3, #1079 of 1915 🔗

Can you publish that email address here?

141180 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Tenchy, 4, #1080 of 1915 🔗

Yes please – I need to tell them that I have spotted the Teletubbies gathering with 3 of their friends

141338 ▶▶▶▶ Sue, replying to nocheesegromit, 1, #1081 of 1915 🔗

snow white also needs to kill one of her 7 dwarfs! better snick on her too!!

141796 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to Telpin, #1082 of 1915 🔗

Perhaps you could let us know what that email address is. I sense a bit of fun in the future!

141134 Mark, replying to Mark, 2, #1083 of 1915 🔗

Gosh, look how the mainstream media reacted after the government science poodles made their “non-prediction” this morning:

“Without urgent action, the UK’s Covid-19 cases could hit 50,000 a day
Advisers have said that deaths could hit 200 a day if the current rate of infections continue”

https://twitter.com/i/events/1308006172746711040

I’m sure the government scaremongers never expected or intended that response…..

141141 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Mark, 5, #1084 of 1915 🔗

just read the comments section, nice to see most people are calling out the BS

141149 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Mark, 2, #1085 of 1915 🔗

“could” being the key word. Nice to see people are getting fed up with this though.

141244 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Mark, 1, #1086 of 1915 🔗

200 deaths a day is just a normal winter flu season. not even covid can kill you twice!

141136 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 7, #1087 of 1915 🔗

Can someone please stop this madness now?!

141192 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Moomin, #1088 of 1915 🔗

yes, put your fingers in your ears, shut your eyes, and say nanananananananan…..

and it will indeed all go away – just crack on mate….

141215 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, #1089 of 1915 🔗

get a fuckin grip!

141137 Tony Rattray, replying to Tony Rattray, 9, #1090 of 1915 🔗

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!

Letter has been sent today by a load of leading uk scientists, etc. questioning the whole government strategy, including oxford university:

https://twitter.com/ProfKarolSikora

6 months we’ve had to wait for this collective response!

PS. How many professors does it take to change a light bulb!

141144 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tony Rattray, 4, #1091 of 1915 🔗

No idea, but I have several theories.

141162 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Tony Rattray, 5, #1092 of 1915 🔗

100.
1 to change the bulb and 99 to write dissertations; ie: Light bulbs and Zen Buddhism in a post Covid world.

141168 ▶▶ Kev, replying to Tony Rattray, 8, #1093 of 1915 🔗

It would take millions of epidemiologists, and most of those would die in the process, according to predictions from Imperial College.

141203 ▶▶▶ Klein, replying to Kev, #1094 of 1915 🔗

haha

141175 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Tony Rattray, 4, #1095 of 1915 🔗

There is certainly a tipping point approaching when we see something like this. A lot of academics just needed leadership to get behind and this is it I feel. Massive hope feels from this letter.

141287 ▶▶ NickR, replying to Tony Rattray, 3, #1096 of 1915 🔗

These are the good guys, Heneghan, Jackson, Sikora & Gupta have been pretty heroic. Huge amounts of work, brillian analysis, months banging their heads against a brick wall that is the BBC. They all deserve knighthoods.

141145 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 9, #1097 of 1915 🔗

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/boris-needs-to-rethink-his-covid-strategy

For those who might not have seen this: Professors Gupta, Heneghan and Sikora issue a carefully planned and cogent challenge to Boris and co.

141167 ▶▶ dpj, replying to wendyk, 3, #1098 of 1915 🔗

I agree with pretty much everything they say especially last paragraph. We need to share this as widely as possible.

141152 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 10, #1099 of 1915 🔗

Re: Labour making sense. Great question from Rupa Huque – ‘can we have Vitamin D prescribed as there is evidence from Norway that high levels are beneficial’

141208 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #1100 of 1915 🔗

yes, very rare, and then handycock said – there is no such evidence – just wait for your fcukin injection and stop being so impatient…
(i may have made some of that up)

141216 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 6, #1101 of 1915 🔗

Easy for people to buy vitamin D themselves – it isn’t that expensive…

Actually a large number of Swedes take it during the winter, because it is so dark here, even in the south.. Where I live, we only have daylight from about 9 am till 2.30 pm, and as Swedes start work at 8 am, they both go to and come home from work in the dark for a number of months!

This may have an effect on our Covid cases over the coming winter…

141305 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1102 of 1915 🔗

Rather the NHS to provide vitamin D test for all, then Vitamin D3 supplementing dosages can be recommended according how low your levels are. The prescribed Vitamin D2 is synthetic and not well absorbed, also massive dose once a week is not very effective. In addition Vitamin D3 is relatively affordable. If you are older it is better to take Vitamin D3 with Vitamin K2 (helps the body to absorb calcium into the bones and not stay in the blood) and Magnesium.

If pregnant it is critical that you get a test and supplement vitamin D3.

Exposure to sunshine will also assist in increasing vitamin D levels, however a big part of the body must be exposed to makes enough vitamin D3. From October to March the sun in the UK is too low in the sky to make vitamin D.

141156 hotrod, replying to hotrod, 7, #1103 of 1915 🔗

Is Johnson hedging his bets?

The plan.

1. Allow doom and gloom to give their view.
2. Threaten a FULL lockdown if the public don’t heed the final warning.
3. Wait…..

If those pesky stats don’t start rising Profs Doom and Gloom will look rather silly and Johnson will have shown good leadership for once by following the numbers and NOT just the science.

11 deaths today.

141177 ▶▶ Margaret, replying to hotrod, 6, #1104 of 1915 🔗

I emailed similar views to yours, to my MP a couple of hours ago, hotrod and told him that the British public don’t like being taken for fools (at least those of us on here don’t) and that we would remember the way in which we had been treated by inept politicians.

141200 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to hotrod, 1, #1105 of 1915 🔗

do you mean is Dom hedging his bets?

141209 ▶▶ Julian, replying to hotrod, 2, #1106 of 1915 🔗

“Is Johnson hedging his bets” I doubt it. I expect it was all stage managed. The government can make the stats fit whatever message they want to give. The PM is not some hapless victim here – he is the perpetrator.

11 deaths – when we were in the peak of the deaths, deaths above the 5-year average vaguely matched covid deaths in terms of numbers, so even though the whole business of with or from covid was very grey, the numbers were vaguely plausible and meaningful, but is that still the case? Are we seeing deaths above any kind of recent average now? If so, attributing them to covid without some more evidence is dodgy IMO.

141213 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Julian, 2, #1107 of 1915 🔗

But did those deaths OCCUR today, or merely reach the stats today..???

141224 ▶▶ stewart, replying to hotrod, 1, #1108 of 1915 🔗

Not a chance. He is going to pretend to be strong and decisive and keep ploughing forward in the same direction. Like the generals in WWI ordering assault after assault each with the same catastrophic result. All well spoken, very arrogant and very stupid.

141493 ▶▶ Will, replying to hotrod, #1109 of 1915 🔗

FFS, how many more candidates does Johnson need to chuck under the bus?

141186 Basics, 1, #1110 of 1915 🔗

Scottish Government leaked document. Every trick in the book to cause public focus on today’s Operation Fear Mark 2: The Reheat. A document seen on Twitter by the Daily Record apparently lists measures being considered by Krankie and others. Lockdowns in school holidays one measure or telling the nation to look out is another apparently. What was leaked seems less important that there was a ‘sensational’ headline grabbing leak.

141188 Hester, replying to Hester, 12, #1111 of 1915 🔗

It seems from what I have read of the presentation by our new leaders Whitty and Valance that we are soon to be put under house arrest again, in Wales I see a number of draconian measures including Police checkpoints have already been introduced. We are powerless aren’t we? locked up, masked up, told how to behave, who to speak with and no recourse through Parliament. Might as well give up and die

141198 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Hester, 4, #1112 of 1915 🔗

yes, Wales and Scotland are to be our Victorias, once the toss pots fcuking up those countries have finished the people will be begging to stay in the UK

141265 ▶▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Major Panic, 5, #1113 of 1915 🔗

I see Nicola Sturgeon was “immersed” with her advisors all weekend. Couldn’t they all have drowned?

141229 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Hester, 3, #1114 of 1915 🔗

https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1308034035252371457

Whitty has such clear links to vaccine development – how can he possibly be impartial in his advice?

141636 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Carrie, 1, #1115 of 1915 🔗

There is no requirement for him or any member of SAGE to be impartial. Nor is there any requirement for them to declare any conflicts of interest.

This will give you a flavour of the massive conflicts of interests (you might want to turn the sound down..)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-d66V0-rlk8&ab_channel=They%27reDistortingYOURRhthym

141275 ▶▶ Cruella, replying to Hester, 4, #1116 of 1915 🔗

Don’t give up. Endure and it will eventually end. We’re just unruly citizens being put back in line. Slip below the wire and get on with your life quietly. What else can we do? I don’t wish to diminish the absurdity and seriousness of this situation but be encouraging. I long for the past, it’s all very sad.

141193 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 3, #1117 of 1915 🔗

does any body know when our lockdown announcment is to be? I want to watch on the telly in spoons

141241 ▶▶ DRW, replying to steve_w, 2, #1118 of 1915 🔗

Why do some pubs have news channels on anyway? You go there to get away from all the shit in the world not wallow in it!

141242 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to DRW, 3, #1119 of 1915 🔗

I go to spoons specifically to wallow in shit!

141245 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to steve_w, #1120 of 1915 🔗

Oh OK then.

141806 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to steve_w, #1121 of 1915 🔗

After tomorrow morning’s COBRA?

141205 Basics, 2, #1122 of 1915 🔗

Another small bit of information about the Trafalger Square demonstrstion this week. Please take it for a possibility – I don’t know if accurate.

The police were charging at the crowd almost from the get go on Saturday.

There were many veterans there holding them back so the speakers could proceed.

The police were there in their hundreds.

As some LSs were there it seems like possibly useful information to help understanding.

141206 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 9, #1123 of 1915 🔗

And yet another email to Sir Graham Brady – if he’s such a sceptic why doesn’t he speak up more loudly?:

Dear Sir,

Once again I find myself emailing you, yet still without a response.

The delusional scientific advisers advising this government are now saying that there will be 50,000 cases per day in October unless we do something.

Please can I once again URGE you, in fact I am begging you, to get the Prime Minister to get a grip and stop this unnecessary heavy handed fear mongering and authoritarian control of the nation.

As we know from all the other wild predictions of these so called experts, there will not be 50,000 cases per day in October, this is utter nonsense.

Is there any way of calling for a vote of no confidence or just something to stop this complete madness from further escalating?

Kind regards,

141210 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Moomin, 4, #1124 of 1915 🔗

I think he has to be more measured than just measured….
There is an ocean going tanker to turn, and it has many moving parts

141219 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Moomin, 4, #1125 of 1915 🔗

He did ask a relevant question in the HoC this afternoon but only caught a bit of it, followed by MH batting him off and going on about the need to save lives.

141220 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to Moomin, 5, #1126 of 1915 🔗

I think he got the message:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8754081/Former-head-Supreme-Court-Baroness-Hale-says-Parliament-surrendered-powers.html

I expect he needs to choose he approach carefully to bring along enough other MPs to actually achieve anything. Looks like step 1 is to get an amendment in the Corona Act to take back power to Parliament. If he can’t even get MPs to agree that they should have the power to debate and vote on these measures, then there’s no hope.

141231 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to zacaway, 3, #1127 of 1915 🔗

I like to think he’s doing an incremental approach like Heneghan.

141240 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to DRW, 4, #1128 of 1915 🔗

It needs to be faster – the vote to extend the coronavirus act is on 30th Sept..

Although it’s actually the Public health act they are adding the SIs to, I believe..

141222 ▶▶ wayno, replying to p02099003, 3, #1130 of 1915 🔗

what a load of tosh….its our fault for going out apparently.

141246 ▶▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to wayno, 1, #1131 of 1915 🔗

It’s our fault for living.

141258 ▶▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to Laura Suckling, 3, #1132 of 1915 🔗

The Crime is Life the sentence is death
As Judge Death likes to say

141629 ▶▶▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to 6097 Smith W, #1133 of 1915 🔗

Comment of the day 6097!

141401 ▶▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Laura Suckling, #1134 of 1915 🔗

Careful – the govt might have an answer for that.

141223 HoMojo, replying to HoMojo, 16, #1135 of 1915 🔗

I see that the print MSM (via Anna Brees) all called the demo on 19th as being comprised of conspiracy theorists which of course immediately invalidates their cause since by definition they’re all mad, so is it a surprise people don’t want to be labelled as such?  And yet…and yet…here we are with Johnson, Hancock, Witty et all pushing so desperately for that second wave by, if not telling outright lies then being somewhat economical with the truth, despite all the data so far suggesting there is no second wave. Nevertheless it is heaped upon us like desperate farmers shovelling shit before the rains come. But that’s ineptness, not a conspiracy. And yet…and yet…a London calling podcast in May/June had Dellingpole mention that some Tory MP (?) had told him that there would be a second lockdown in October, or it was a likelihood. So doesn’t that mean they’ve prepared for it, they knew it was on the cards? But that’s just ineptness? And now today they continue their psy-ops by suggesting that the virus spreads most efficiently in enclosed spaces with lots of people, i.e. places where people socialise. And those that think this is just ineptness don’t suppose they are preparing again to close pubs and restaurants, and further suck dry the joy out of everyone’s lives. But this is just ineptness… and Brutus was an honourable man. More businesses going to the wall to prevent the spread of a virus now less virulent than the common cold. Yet, this is just ineptness. When the BBC reversed the footage of the Battle of Orgreave in 1984 thereby insinuating the miners attacked the police and not the other way round (a fact – well a ‘mistake’ – the BBC admitted and apologised for in 1991) witnesses who were there were called conspiracy theorists. And the BBC said it was a ‘mistake’ so just ineptness then. And Brutus was an honourable man. By their actions in destroying lives (by decree, not law) this government and their advisors are criminals and murderers and no-one is calling them to account, not least parliament. They need to pay for this. MPs are supposed to work for us. They need reminding, as Peter Hitchens has said recently, what they are being paid for. From MPs replies I’ve read on this site you’d think they were all in on it. And yet it is only ineptness for ‘none dare call it a conspiracy.’

141237 ▶▶ Basics, replying to HoMojo, 3, #1136 of 1915 🔗

It is all ineptness… nod nod nod.

141295 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to HoMojo, 1, #1137 of 1915 🔗

From freedictionary.com
con·spir·a·cy (kən-spîr′ə-sē)
n. pl. con·spir·a·cies1. An agreement to perform together an illegal, wrongful, or subversive act.
2. A group of conspirators.
3. Law An agreement between two or more persons to commit a crime or accomplish a legal purpose through illegal action.
4. A joining or acting together, as if by sinister design: a conspiracy of wind and tide that devastated coastal areas.

the·o·ry (thē′ə-rē, thîr′ē)
n. pl. the·o·ries1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.
2. The branch of a science or art consisting of its explanatory statements, accepted principles, and methods of analysis, as opposed to practice: a fine musician who had never studied theory.
3. A set of theorems that constitute a systematic view of a branch of mathematics.
4. Abstract reasoning; speculation: a decision based on experience rather than theory.
5. A belief or principle that guides action or assists comprehension or judgment: staked out the house on the theory that criminals usually return to the scene of the crime.
6. An assumption based on limited information or knowledge; a conjecture.

I’ll leave that for you to decide what it is.

Put it through the Orwellian newspeak translator and you get…….tah-dah…

Critical thinker

141400 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to HoMojo, 4, #1138 of 1915 🔗

The SAGE minutes released by Simon Dolan confirm that the govt were actively seeking ways of scaring the public and finding ways to ramp up the fear. This is / was tyranny. People will deny that this is a plandemic though. Too much critical thinking and you will be called a conspiracy theorist by people who don’t want to face reality.

141225 Kev, replying to Kev, 20, #1139 of 1915 🔗

According to Vallance’s graph, by the end of the first week of February approximately 12.5 billion people will have the disease.

Note: This is not a prediction

141230 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Kev, 6, #1140 of 1915 🔗

32million per day by xmas using his maths ‘if it keeps doubling every 7 days’

141236 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Kev, 8, #1141 of 1915 🔗

According to Simon Dolan, ‘ The number of cases in London fell from 2,335 in the seven days from September 4 to 10, to 1,699 in the period from September 11 to 17′

So why a new lockdown?

141253 ▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to Carrie, 3, #1142 of 1915 🔗

Ober Gruppen Fuhrer Kahn was feeling left out

141238 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Kev, 3, #1143 of 1915 🔗

we need more people…

141267 ▶▶ Cruella, replying to Kev, 1, #1144 of 1915 🔗

Hospitals aren’t empty anymore, they’re functioning normally on the whole. Where did you hear this? See this? Obviously the waiting lists etc are now huge and almost insurmountable etc and many consultations are staggered etc or online. I’m just not sure that hospitals are empty like mid lockdown.

141308 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Cruella, 2, #1145 of 1915 🔗

Hi Cruella, I am going to delete my post as I cannot find written proof to backup my claim.

What I do see with my mark one eyeball is if I drive through my local hospital, ordinarily I would not be able to find anywhere to park, I could spend 30 minutes driving round trying to find a parking space. Hospital staff frequently park on local side streets.

Since March parking is not an issue, I can park close to whichever department I wish to visit.

141226 Basics, replying to Basics, 13, #1146 of 1915 🔗

A good person tweets

Dr Waqar Rashid
@DrWaqarRashid1
·
2h
Still fuming – extrapolated graphs which double in rate and end up as skyscrapers come late Oct. They say it is not a prediction but present no other (better and plausible) scenarios and offer no evidence that measures advocated will make any difference. Mickey-mouse science

__
It is the image that is being used. Skyscraper graph like the silly little joke graph someone posted on today’s comments page. A toddler graph. But, is it incompetence? Surely this isn’t how you hid incompetence by looking incompetent!

Keep cool because we are winning. Bill and Ben have lost any shred of credibility left in the eye of other scientists … surely?

141243 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Basics, 1, #1147 of 1915 🔗

Dr. Rashid is great!

141263 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Basics, 6, #1148 of 1915 🔗

Bill and Ben made me laugh

141234 Basics, replying to Basics, 10, #1149 of 1915 🔗

Chris Whitty is on the interim board of CEPI https://imi.europa.eu/sites/default/files/uploads/documents/news-events/events/2016/biopreparedness_roettingen_CEPI_new_vaccines_for_safer_world.pdf

“Novavax is receiving $384 million in new funding for its work on a coronavirus vaccine from the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness — the biggest investment from CEPI to date.” https://pharmamanufacturing.com/industrynews/2020/cepi-makes-its-biggest-coronavirus-vaccine-investment-to-date/

From
https://twitter.com/lisakeb007/status/1308026317154267136?s=20

Another Whitty ‘interest’ is listed on the thread.

141251 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Basics, 4, #1150 of 1915 🔗

This is outrageous.

141257 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to stewart, 4, #1151 of 1915 🔗

Agreed – anyone with Twitter need to spread this information far and wide!

141239 Basileus, replying to Basileus, 14, #1152 of 1915 🔗

Spent some time in a school today: interesting.

  • Most staff wore masks, some visors. Most did not wear masks to teach.
  • Pupils wore masks in corridors, but a few didn’t and it wasn’t enforced.
  • One way traffic in corridors.
  • Tape across corridor every two metres. Some students just travelled in huddles anyway.

The worst aspect of this craziness (ie most potentially harmful) was the constant putting on and taking off of marks – encouraging the spread of bacteria. Plus at lunchtime, students sat down to eat packed lunches, but I saw no evidence of hand washing or sanitising. So has basic hygiene been replaced by Covid nonsense?

141264 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Basileus, 5, #1153 of 1915 🔗

All the kids have new sore throats anyway, which demonstrates the virus transmission mechanisms are still fully functional.

Mention that to anybody though and you can watch the brain Segfault and reboot.

141247 tallandbald, replying to tallandbald, 2, #1154 of 1915 🔗

How do we know that to confirm their “second wave” narrative and to ensure their “planned for” Lockdown 2 happens they just release whatever figures for deaths, hospitalisations and infections they damn well please?
There is a control for this isn’t there?

141249 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to tallandbald, 2, #1155 of 1915 🔗

Other than a handful of individual scientists and journalists with a backbone, none whatsoever.

141255 ▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to tallandbald, 1, #1156 of 1915 🔗

none the figures are largely made up and cannot be verified or falsified

141248 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 8, #1157 of 1915 🔗

12:30 tomorrow apparently is Boris locking us all down again from the House of Commons

141252 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to steve_w, 1, #1158 of 1915 🔗

Never in any doubt. Why is he even bothering to go to the House of Commons?

141256 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to steve_w, 1, #1159 of 1915 🔗

Source?

141259 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Carrie, 1, #1160 of 1915 🔗

he is speaking to us from HoC at 12:30 – what he is going to say I have no idea

141261 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to steve_w, 2, #1161 of 1915 🔗

National mockdown with curfews I guess.

141268 ▶▶▶▶ Hubes, replying to steve_w, 3, #1162 of 1915 🔗

Neither does he

141284 ▶▶ Basics, replying to steve_w, 2, #1163 of 1915 🔗

Travel restrictions 5 miles from home and hospitality curfew closures. More masks in public spaces. national lockdown for school holidays perhaps.

All guesses. Travel is the main one I think likely.

141292 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to steve_w, 2, #1164 of 1915 🔗

Is it so you cannot debate?

141294 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to JulieR, 3, #1165 of 1915 🔗

Probably to stop Saturday’s march..

141349 ▶▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Carrie, 4, #1166 of 1915 🔗

The Establishment and media (especially the BBC) certainly hate all criticism and questioning of the lockdown strategy. The only debate allowed is how draconian the measures should be. Actions have been decided already.

If there was another George Floyd type incident in America (unless the victim was while, hispanic or asian) – I think there would be full political, police and media support for a million man style march and protest.

141260 zacaway, replying to zacaway, 16, #1167 of 1915 🔗

Mask Mould :

German children’s charity test child’s mask after being worn in school for 8 hours. 82 bacterial colonies and 4 mould (fungal) colonies.

https://twitter.com/mattlarby/status/1307441238799462406

141266 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to zacaway, 4, #1168 of 1915 🔗

Great post. If I forward this to anyone, I know the response I will get:

Yes but masks work, because science.

141274 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Richard O, 2, #1169 of 1915 🔗

But won’t somebody think of the children!

141281 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Richard O, 10, #1170 of 1915 🔗

My son came home from school on Friday and said he’d been wearing his mask for three hours straight. His breath stank, it cannot be healthy to wear these things.

141286 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to zacaway, 9, #1171 of 1915 🔗

It won’t be long before he starts developing serious oral infections as a result of this. Not to mention the psychological damage being inflicted.

It sickens me that none of this is reported in MSM, but then they are bought and paid for by pure evil so it is no surprise.

141269 Edward, replying to Edward, 14, #1172 of 1915 🔗

Retail report. I decided to do some non-essential shopping before the regime barks out its latest orders. I wore my magic exemption badge to ward off the zombies and demons.

Recently somebody here mentioned Debenhams being on the skids, lots of items at 70% off and few customers. My observations agree, though Monday afternoon is probably not a busy time anyway. Likewise in HMV. Actually both of these shops haven’t been busy for years. Card payment only in HMV.

In Poundland I was interested to see that they did have toilet rolls, though gaps were visible on the shelves. I expect panic buying will really take off in the next couple of days as the threat of a new lockdown sinks in.

Coffee & cake in a chain café, not one of the big three. I won’t name them in case the Stasi visit them, as they weren’t too fussed about track & trace – just a QR code on display. Assistant with mask below her mouth, nice smile, I’m always susceptible to a pretty girl.

Still a high level of mask wearing (it’s an indoor shopping centre) but a few non-wearers, mostly young men and women.

141324 ▶▶ Fiat, replying to Edward, #1173 of 1915 🔗

HMV?!!! Where?

141270 Laura Suckling, replying to Laura Suckling, 5, #1174 of 1915 🔗

The MSM are wetting their knickers with glee due to Witless and Vallance’s “non prediction”.

Even the FT are reporting the above as if it were gospel.

Is Ferguson doing his best again?

I’m beginning to despair.

141282 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Laura Suckling, 3, #1175 of 1915 🔗

the higher they climb, the further they fall…

141304 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Laura Suckling, 3, #1176 of 1915 🔗

It would be an interesting project to track down pronouncements (from March) by government shills, and set them against the facts that emerged.

141317 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to RickH, 2, #1177 of 1915 🔗

Yes, and to make a little film..

141271 Poppy, replying to Poppy, 49, #1178 of 1915 🔗

I definitely sense a change in public opinion – if not outright scepticism and anger, then at least weariness and an impression of people being worn down and utterly fed up of this misery. That is cause for optimism, and if further restrictions are brought in tomorrow, I predict they will be much less popular than the first lockdown, especially if they are social restrictions (bans on households meeting) and curfews, because the public generally tends to pick up on the contradictory and illogical nature of these types of restrictions. ‘So I can be in a train/pub/classroom/shop with dozens of people but I can’t meet my mum’/’Does the virus only strike after 10pm?’

We must keep pressing on. I wasn’t sure whether to laugh or cry at the alarmist rubbish the scientific advisors brought out today but there are many more dissenting scientists and sceptics now than there were in March. It feels like a long haul for me because I have been sceptical since February (following the Covid story in general since January as well) and I’m sure the same can be said for many on here! It isn’t over yet but it will be soon. They can’t hold back the tide forever.

141296 ▶▶ Hubes, replying to Poppy, 13, #1179 of 1915 🔗

I agree. There are more and more speaking out against it each day. They can’t keep these lies up much longer hopefully.

141299 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Poppy, 7, #1180 of 1915 🔗

I really hope that your qualified optimism is borne out.

I think that your observations are right – there’s a sort of weary resignation, which hasn’t defeated the Fear factor when push comes to shove, but suggests some cracks in the wall.

I was heartened to-day, driving around at school chuck-out time to at least see no increase in ludicrous fresh-air mask wearing after the latest attempts to throw a scare into people.

There is way to go, but a few straws in the wind – such as Heneghan and Jefferson coming out strongly, Levitt and others’ letter, Ashworth shifting slightly – suggest that this may be a pivotal time.

We need to turn the tables and scare the f. out of Johnson and Co. about the dire consequences of all this false narrative going tits up, with them taking the blame for the real excess deaths, the privations of the ‘vulnerable’ about whom they weep crocodile tears etc.

What we need is some real journalism to pose the questions that we know need to be asked – but, as with the decline in the occupancy of the HoC, that’s a big ask after a long process of decline in skill and moral fibre.

141364 ▶▶▶ Poppy, replying to RickH, 6, #1181 of 1915 🔗

We must stay optimistic because this is a war of attrition. They want to see us worn down and in despair. We won’t give them that satisfaction.

141490 ▶▶▶▶ wat tyler, replying to Poppy, 4, #1182 of 1915 🔗

You’re right Poppy we need to keep the morale up .Their defences are breaking and now is the time to advance .Steady under fire .

141708 ▶▶▶▶ Lili, replying to Poppy, #1183 of 1915 🔗

I’m not worn down with despair, I’m burning with anger.

141312 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Poppy, 3, #1184 of 1915 🔗

If Johnson had the balls to stand up and say the following, he would get my respect:

You will never get any of your freedoms back. Your body and mind now belongs to the state. If you try and fight us, you will have our respect (unlike the fools that comply with everything we say who are beneath contempt), but you will be defeated.

141329 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Poppy, 2, #1185 of 1915 🔗

I want to believe your last statements are right Poppy. Our side is growing.

141366 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Poppy, 7, #1186 of 1915 🔗

I think I agree. Today has, bizarrely, been a good day. It’s almost as though Whitty and Vallance and the ramp up to level 4 on a day of 11 deaths has helped throw into focus how ludicrous it all is. If they had been more muted and reasonable it might have been harder but they have played into the sceptical hands today. Plus, as time goes on there will be more anger as more people are impacted by the lockdown strategy and the Covid-only NHS.

141377 ▶▶▶ Poppy, replying to Jenny, 6, #1187 of 1915 🔗

Indeed. I am against further restrictions obviously but they are, sadly, probably going to happen so perhaps a round of second restrictions are a necessary evil to get people to really wake up and end this nonsense once and for all.

141402 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Poppy, 4, #1188 of 1915 🔗

Don’t like the idea of at least another 6 months of this.. gives them far too long impose yet more restrictions, covipasses etc..

141449 ▶▶▶▶▶ Poppy, replying to Carrie, 2, #1189 of 1915 🔗

Neither do I, but I have faith that there’s only so much that the public can take. A lot of them are complying on the basis that they’re not expecting this to last much longer.

141272 Basics, replying to Basics, 5, #1190 of 1915 🔗

UK Biosecurity Centre has just announced it recommends moving from 3 to 4 on the covid threat level meter doohicky.

Sky News just reported.
Also Sky setting up UK as being 6 weeks behind Spain. Regional areas lockdowns around Madrid with police checks between zones.

141277 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Basics, #1191 of 1915 🔗

as far as I know there are only lockdowns in Mardrid

141342 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to steve_w, #1192 of 1915 🔗

Was a roving reporter standing on a Madrid street talking about the local areas only with permission supposed to be granted for work or other good reason to enter other zones.

141279 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 8, #1193 of 1915 🔗

Clearly designed to ramp up the pressure on MPs to extend the coronavirus act powers..

141344 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Carrie, #1194 of 1915 🔗

That is exactly right.

141290 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 3, #1195 of 1915 🔗

Regarding restrictions, next time anyone tells you that Sweden should have acted like Denmark and Norway, refer them to this:

https://twitter.com/jhnhellstrom/status/1308036940042731520

‘First Denmark now Norway! They introduce now more measures as a result of new red level alerts & introduces a ban on gathering more than ten people in private homes, people travelling by public transport need to use a mask at all times. Restaurants & cafes must keep visitor lists’.

They seem to have been taking advice from the UK 🙁

Note: Not sure that Denmark has done any more than introduce masks in certain places thus far..?

141320 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Carrie, #1196 of 1915 🔗

Anyone know what Finland is doing?

141322 ▶▶▶▶ Fiat, replying to Julian, 3, #1197 of 1915 🔗

Pony trekking or camping. Or maybe watching TV

141337 ▶▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Fiat, 2, #1198 of 1915 🔗

and getting bitten by mosquitoes

141340 ▶▶▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Fiat, 2, #1199 of 1915 🔗

Finland, Finland, Finland. It’s the country for me.

141367 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Winston Smith, 1, #1200 of 1915 🔗

Had the most mental stag do ever in Finland. Absolute nutters.

141335 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Basics, 2, #1202 of 1915 🔗

6 weeks behind Spain, the new 2 weeks behind Italy.

141653 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Basics, #1203 of 1915 🔗

Ah, the Biosecurity Centre headed up by a terrorism expert… who has no idea about medicine but certainly knows how to promote terror.

141273 Henry, replying to Henry, 1, #1204 of 1915 🔗

Anyone care to comment on this blog post? I guess this is the view from the other side. Disingenuous at best.

https://liorpachter.wordpress.com/2020/09/21/the-lethal-nonsense-of-michael-levitt/#respond

141302 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to Henry, 1, #1205 of 1915 🔗

Yes….Bollocks!

141332 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Henry, #1206 of 1915 🔗

you fight the battles you’ve got a chance of winning – no point pissing against the wind

141341 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Henry, 1, #1207 of 1915 🔗

These academic squabbles can get very catty!

For anyone who wants to check out Michael Levitt’s thoughts, here is the interview with Freddie Sayers.

https://unherd.com/thepost/prof-michael-levitt-heres-what-i-got-wrong/

141276 JohnMac, replying to JohnMac, 15, #1208 of 1915 🔗

Apparently the BBC is saying that climate change activists are not very diverse. Well, of course they’re not. Non-white people tend to be Christians, Hindus or Moslems.

In other words, they’ve already got a religion.

141405 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to JohnMac, 2, #1209 of 1915 🔗

So are they saying that ethnic minorites don’t care about the environment? So the BBC is being RACIST?!

141278 john, replying to john, 23, #1210 of 1915 🔗

Q. When is a prediction not a prediction?
A. When it is made by the Chief Medical Officer of the land, who tells us that 200 people may die every day, but that this is not a prediction, meaning in fact that 200 people a day may not die. Having learned that no one believes the modeling anymore, they now come out with this meaningless tripe. As a physician, he should know about things like false positives and the risk of extrapolating from weak data points, so the only plausible explanation is that he is deceiving the public….

141301 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to john, 2, #1211 of 1915 🔗

Look into my eyes, look into my eyes…Not around the eyes but into my eyes!!!

141285 Hubes, replying to Hubes, 19, #1212 of 1915 🔗

Boris’s speech from tomorrow has been leaked

Mumble mumble mumble, 2nd wave, mumble, nhs, mumble mumble, 500k deaths, mumble mumble, Christmas, mumble mumble, Spain, mumble mumble, curfew, mumble mumble support bubble only mumble. Leaves.

Nobody knows what the fuck he has said. Some legislation comes out some point between now and October that is completely unenforceable. Every sane person ignores it like they have the other ones that have come out.

141289 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Hubes, 5, #1213 of 1915 🔗

Contract tasting.

141297 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Hubes, 9, #1214 of 1915 🔗

i was with him till he mumbled

141352 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Hubes, 2, #1215 of 1915 🔗

talking tough by shutting the pubs at 10pm? A lot of places I frequent like Earls Court have no places open after 10PM. Also most craft beer/micropubs shut at 10 anyway.

141300 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 1, #1216 of 1915 🔗

To be fair to Statler and Waldorf, I think they said something along the lines of whilst it [the graph] was not a prediction, it was a hypothesis. It seems reasonable usage to me, even if it was a bullshit hypothesis.

141311 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Tenchy, 2, #1217 of 1915 🔗

extrapolating trends into the future is a mugs game

141382 ▶▶▶ 4096, replying to steve_w, 2, #1218 of 1915 🔗

Even worse when they are not extrapolating any trends but making up their own. There is no evidence of cases doubling every week, least of all on their own graph – it all has really lost any semblence of sanity.

141316 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Tenchy, 9, #1219 of 1915 🔗

Let’s be generous and say it was a worst case scenario. It MAY be justified to introduce that into a meeting with politicians when thinking about future plans, but it has to be taken into account in conjunction with the cost side, and how likely the scenario is vs other possible scenarios. Lots of nuance there.

But no, go on national TV as the scientific voice of the nation, and of truth, and say this could happen, they KNEW VERY WELL what the headlines would be. It was deliberate. They deserve no credit, and much opprobrium.

141333 ▶▶ jb12, replying to Tenchy, #1220 of 1915 🔗

That is semantics at this point

141371 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Tenchy, 1, #1221 of 1915 🔗

In my view the graph (to-the-moon) was realeased purposefully. It is the medias take home message. They could of wafted a limb about to describe the vague terms the graph illustrated. The psychology of any graph scares large numbers of people..red bars too, did you see? Carefully delivered for behavioural response. Just like the stupid grey wall with coat of arms behind them.

Planned imo.

Upticked you though because your opinion is valid as mine.

141406 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Basics, 1, #1222 of 1915 🔗

This is the graph they *should* have shown: https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1308071748072550400

141843 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Basics, #1223 of 1915 🔗

Johnson’s warm up act to justify whatever fresh idiocy he comes out with tomorrow.Curfew,circuit breaker lockdowns.You can meet 6 others but not on a Tuesday after 12 and all day Sunday.

141303 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #1224 of 1915 🔗

Even Dr Hilary Jones is against another lockdown and he’s a wrong un that is on ‘the list’

https://twitter.com/ClarkeMicah/status/1308061404864352257?s=20

141336 ▶▶ MaxPower, replying to Tom Blackburn, 5, #1225 of 1915 🔗

Great that he said that. Just need to pick Hilary up on one point, he says the infections rose when we came out of lockdown and that’s incorrect.

141306 B Boru, 5, #1226 of 1915 🔗

I wrote this for a song with my band at the time approx 5 years ago…….The more i read it again, the more I can’t help that i might have been onto something 😉

Dead Culture

Roll back your shoulders, stand up straight,
The only way to beat it; is to let go of your hate.
Pull yourself together; fix your stare ahead,
Don’t be afraid, it’s all in your head.

Success or failure, are much the same here.
So few people living while most keep on dying.
Some people dance and some people pray.
Is it just black and white or is it all shades of grey?

I go back to a time I can hardly remember now.
Back to a time when my people stood tall and proud.
The power that we had is forgotten in memory.
They’re killing off our culture by perverting its history.

The spectre of defeat lurks boldly in your eyes.
I see the same fear that would break the back of me.
Giving off the air of positive uncertainty.
I see the same fear that would take the heart of me.

So far beyond, your glazed over eyes,
There’s a storm that rages, from another time.
Reset the crosshairs; start aiming for the bullseye,
Turn your back on that life, because you cannot comply.

What’s the matter with the picture we see today?
What’s the matter with the stories we hear today?
Standing by and watching a dying creature.
My life was racing by waiting for the future.

Fanatics all around are trying for destruction.
Will there be a resurrection of this dead culture?

Lines get drawn and so, condemning voices grow;
To cut the ties that bind, that stood up to the test of time.
Sold on blatant lies, to please the ones that hide;
The master of the game, the men that have no name.

What’s the matter with the picture you see today?
Are we the only ones that are holding it all at bay?

141307 Sir Patrick Vaccine, 5, #1227 of 1915 🔗

what makes you protest… Jeff Wyatt – 21st Sept 2020

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drrmvwgZsRo
Anna Brees
44.8K subscribers

141334 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Tom Blackburn, 9, #1229 of 1915 🔗

The anti Ian Brown people are some of the most pathetic ill informed weasels i’ve read in a long fucking time. They all post like he’s very dumb and they’re super smart and virtuous . I despair at how easily manipulated these wank-stains are.

141345 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Biker, 1, #1230 of 1915 🔗

Well said. It is the oh so much cleverer that you Blue Peter classes that continue to run the show. Absolute weapons of the highest order.

141549 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Biker, 3, #1231 of 1915 🔗

Thankfully if you can rely on anyone to not apologise or back down, it’s Ian Brown.

141314 Awkward Git, 5, #1232 of 1915 🔗

More protests, this time in Israel, not being reported in the MSM here:

https://www.activistpost.com/2020/09/trying-to-break-us-down-mass-protests-hit-israel-as-2nd-nationwide-lockdown-takes-effect.html

Almost like except for “Trump bad” or “Spain/France doomed, mass deaths” there is nowhere else in the world that exists.

141318 Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1233 of 1915 🔗

Gupta interview live on Sky now

141319 Tim Bidie, 7, #1234 of 1915 🔗

The chief whip has obviously run the numbers and there’s a bit of a flap on!

Every six months, a minister must, ‘as far as practicable’ make arrangements for MPs to vote to keep the provisions of the Act in force. If MPs are able to vote and vote to stop against keeping the provisions of the Act in force, the government must make regulations to prevent provisions having effect within 21 days.’

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/coronavirus-act

The precise deadline for the vote on the provisions of the Coronavirus Act depends on whether the House of Commons is in recess for the party conferences. The vote must be held within seven sitting days of six months after the Act received Royal Assent. This will fall in either September or October 2020.’

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/legislation-manage-coronavirus-pandemic

What a way to run a country……..

An immediate independent public inquiry is required forthwith…….but, of course, that is another reason for a confected ‘crisis’.

141327 GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 10, #1235 of 1915 🔗

That’s them raised the threat level from 3 to 4. Not sure how much more of this bollocks I can take.

141672 ▶▶ TJS123, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, #1236 of 1915 🔗

Looking at the original charts, we’d seem to be at level 2 – “present in the UK, but numbers and levels of transmission are low”. Even if we were at 4, the “treatment” is “social distancing continues”. Not threats of a lockdown.

141330 Basics, 10, #1237 of 1915 🔗

George Galloway has started a campaign for a vote of no confidence in the SNP Scottish Government. Extraordinary at a time when Sturgeon has had months of daily corona pulpit airtime.

From https://www.change.org/p/petition-vote-of-no-confidence-in-nicola-sturgeon-and-the-scottish-government-resignsturgeon?recruiter=1025734178&recruited_by_id=17120e90-19f6-11ea-b32f-711b7634a14c

“Be it literally ruining the futures of our children in the SQA results scandal, slandering Douglas Ross and claiming he is a ‘racist’, lying over secret meetings with Alex Salmond, the Coronavirus care homes scandal, the cover-up over the Coronavirus outbreak at Nike, the drug death scandal, the Hate Crime bill, the Derek MacKay scandal or the complete silence on racist nationalists at the border calling for England to ‘get out of Scotland’.”

141331 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 7, #1238 of 1915 🔗

Two interesting headlines in DM

Tory MPs rebel over threatened new lock-down after rumours emerge Boris will shut pubs at 10pm – as serious questions are raised over Whitty and Vallance’s doomsday claim that deaths could hit 200 a day by November

Do Whitty and Vallance’s numbers add up? Advisers claimed Britain is on course to follow French and Spanish trajectories but NEITHER country is showing cases doubling each week like they warned for the UK.

*******

Question from listener to Hitchins on his radio interview why the graphs showed by Whitty and Valance today only start in the summer (low death rates) and not during the lockdown (High death rates)

141339 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Victoria, 7, #1239 of 1915 🔗

Good observation. Of course – the answer is obvious, and plain to see by anyone who understands data and its portrayal … Whitty is a dishonest con-artist.

141348 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to RickH, 7, #1240 of 1915 🔗

That photo on Simon Dolan’s Twitter today shows that Whitty is running the government – the body language is very clear. Boris looks like he is receiving orders from him..

141354 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Victoria, 4, #1241 of 1915 🔗

Do Whitty and Vallance’s numbers add up ?”

Our host and others are slaughtering That Graph (the non-prediction that was immediately reported, of course, as a prediction of what WILL happen if we don’t all panic at once) on Twitter.

Toby:
If Whitty and Vallance had taken questions, I hope someone would have asked them what the projected number of cases would be on 13th Oct if you discount the 91% of “cases” that are false positives. I make it 4,410.
https://twitter.com/toadmeister/status/1307993055140761601

Huw Osmond
If there was a crime based on grievous abuse of mathematics, then this graph would result in life imprisonment at least. No sign whatsoever of exponential growth in the blue bars.
https://twitter.com/hughosmond/status/1307991558273236997

141542 ▶▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Mark, 2, #1242 of 1915 🔗

I wish people would start asking incisive questions like “what is the operational specificity / sensitivity of the PCR tests?”. Then when Hancock says he doesn’t know, we know conclusively that he has no idea how many false positives there are.

And then go harder “So what you’re saying is that they could all be false positives… and you’d have no idea?”.

I think journalism has become far too generous, as if they’re trying to be sympathetic and gentle because it’s a crisis. It doesn’t help anyone.

(I don’t think they are all false positives of course, but I think it should at least be presented as a possible worst case)

141373 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to wendyk, 2, #1244 of 1915 🔗

well that makes 60 odd million of us….

141346 chris, replying to chris, 12, #1245 of 1915 🔗

Closing pubs 1 hour early is just window dressing. What possible purpose does that serve.

141351 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to chris, 6, #1246 of 1915 🔗

great excuse to go to the pub an hour or two earlier

141357 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to chris, 6, #1247 of 1915 🔗

Instead of some people leaving the pub at 10 and others at 11, everyone gets to leave at the same time and fight over taxis 👍🏻

141815 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1248 of 1915 🔗

As a taxi diver I can assure you no one will be fighting over taxis.This crisis has destroyed the trade and you can have your pick

141358 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to chris, #1249 of 1915 🔗

last orders 9.45PM

141378 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to chris, 28, #1250 of 1915 🔗

Obviously, it protects the vulnerable. My parents, in their eighties, regularly stumble out of the pub at closing time. Before lockdown, they’d obviously simply have moved on to a nightclub, but those have been closed since March. That’s probably the reason they are still alive now – saved by lockdown!

141408 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Jenny, 3, #1251 of 1915 🔗

😂

141413 ▶▶ RickH, replying to chris, 4, #1252 of 1915 🔗

No purpose at all; it just shows that all this has no basis but exercising control.

These bastards should never be forgiven, whether politicians or pseudo-scientists.

141451 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to chris, 9, #1253 of 1915 🔗

It’s because the people who run this shit show have never been to a pub in their lives because they are too scared of who they might meet.

They have probably never been properly drunk or hammered on anything other than houmus.

They think we are all just yobbish idiots who can’t be trusted and we need to be told what to do and punished with stupid punative bullshit just to be seen to be doing the right thing.

I absolutely hate these people. My list of people to hate with a fucking passion.

The young woman I saw in the chip shop tonight with her fuckin flowery face-nappy or the young dude of about 20 with his cammo one walking down the road, or the fuckers I saw walking down the canal tow path out in the countryside “doing IT” or the young Japanese?/Asian couple I saw outside a pub with their blue face gags, or the female employee in Llloyds bank with hers on, telling me AGAIN that I can pay cheques in via the fucking machine.

Especially for her, enjoy the food bank experience you muppet, I am sure they do face napies in there too, you absolute twat.

I fucking hate these people.

Seriously, fuck them.

I have had 3 bottles of Spitfire tonight before tea time, I am fucking seething.

141539 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Two-Six, 5, #1254 of 1915 🔗

Yes, part of the problem is that the cunts calling the shots are weirdos who don’t know what it is to be alive. My plumber is sounding more on the money every day – reptiles, not humans.

141556 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Two-Six, 2, #1255 of 1915 🔗

It’s making me mad to see how the UK government are treating their citizens like children, whilst Anders Tegnell is treating his fellow Swedes with resect..

141824 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to Two-Six, 1, #1256 of 1915 🔗

I feel exactly the same two-six.I am so angry I am in a strange calmness,I know that sounds weird but that’s how it feels,I have reached the end of my tether now,I need to do something,I just don’t know what.
I also hate every last twat that has happily aided and abetted the destruction of our lives,from the smug bastards in their personalised masks to the jumped up morons in shops barking orders at customers who have no realisation who actually pays for their wages and everyone else prolonging the madness simply by ‘going along with it for a quiet life’.
Also,the next person who makes a vile comment to my wife in a shop because she has the sense,sanity and brain of her own and doesn’t wear a face nappy,is probably going to need the use of an ambulance if I hear them.The abuse she received today makes it about twenty times some arsehole has said something.
To those that are brave enough to abuse a 5ft 6 middle aged woman how about you discuss it with me instead,a 6ft 1 well-built bloke ?,no ?,I thought not,you vile,vile cowards.

141994 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Paul, #1257 of 1915 🔗

Going anywhere near covid saftey hell makes me tremble with RAGE every time. If somebody says something to me or mrs 2-6 I will probably rip their head off.

141996 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Paul, #1258 of 1915 🔗

Going anywhere near covid safety hell makes me tremble with RAGE every time. If somebody says something to me or Mrs 2-6 I will probably rip their head off.

141477 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to chris, 6, #1259 of 1915 🔗

I have a cunning plan to counter this: I will just get to the pub an hour earlier. In fact I can move my whole day an hour earlier.
Problem solved.

141347 Kate, replying to Kate, 17, #1260 of 1915 🔗

Well, we are at LEVEL 4 now!
(I made the mistake of listening to the BBC radio news, – wall to wall coronavirus crisis.)

For anyone who is having trouble coping, you may think I am mad but- the astrology throughout this year has been astonishingly accurate.
The next month will be unpleasant – lockdown – but things will change just before Christmas – there will be a fresh start.
So, it will not go on for ever, hold on and keep going.

141360 ▶▶▶ Cruella, replying to Kate, 1, #1262 of 1915 🔗

That has cheered me up too!

141355 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to Kate, 3, #1263 of 1915 🔗

Interesting! 😉 thanks for that.

I keep saying it…..there are other forces at work in this world other than dark ones.

141743 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to B Boru, #1264 of 1915 🔗

Always.

141356 ▶▶ Cruella, replying to Kate, 1, #1265 of 1915 🔗

I do hope so.

141379 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Kate, #1266 of 1915 🔗

Another contributor provided some links to articles in this area earlier today which I enjoyed reading.

141417 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Kate, 7, #1267 of 1915 🔗

Well astrology is at least as accurate as the shit predictions of Whitty & Co.

141745 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to RickH, #1268 of 1915 🔗

And with respect to Kate, probably more scientific too.

141359 Tommo, replying to Tommo, 30, #1269 of 1915 🔗

I’m back. Couldn’t stay away for long! And I am fecking pissed off. How can they keep claiming that the epidemic is doubling every 7 days, when all it takes is a calculator and 5 mins to work out this is a lie? Why are journalists just repeating this bull shit? There is certainly a wave coming. Not of the virus, but of dissent. It started as a trickle, but more and more are putting their heads above the parapet. It may not seem like it, but we are winning. Everyone keep taking your small actions – speaking to friends and families, posting comments, sharing links. The masses are stirring. Let’s keep going.

141372 ▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to Tommo, 9, #1270 of 1915 🔗

Journalists today were brought up on modern edukayshun which regards maths as an imperialist construct.

141431 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Londo Mollari, 5, #1271 of 1915 🔗

That’s not the problem. It’s the privilege in the system that allows idiots like Boris and mates in the journo profession,, bred through the public school system and Oxbridge to secure places far above their ability.

I’m not enamoured of simplistic ideas of meritocracy – but a system derived to achieve the opposite is just as bad in providing silver spoons to the dimwits.

141802 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to RickH, #1272 of 1915 🔗

The lefts destruction of the grammar school system has a lot of blame in this

141386 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tommo, 10, #1273 of 1915 🔗

MPs are starting to buckle under the weight of their post bags. Heneghan and Gupta are getting air time on MSM. Dissenting views are becoming more obvious. The CMO and CSA have cooked their turkey.

141391 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1274 of 1915 🔗

I hope you’re right TT. I feel it and hear it around me. Friends who were borderline or even committed believers are becoming sceptical. I now know nobody (except my sister – I don’t talk to her more than I have to) who buys in, but I wonder if I’m living in a bubble.

141397 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to matt, 4, #1275 of 1915 🔗

That’s my experience. People who were uninterested a few days ago are now receptive.

Unless a miraculous surge in covid19 appears or can be manufactured, it won’t be long before it will be impossible to find anyone who really supported the nonsense.

141409 ▶▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Mark, 4, #1276 of 1915 🔗

Sadly those who are full on fear believers I think will be even more frightened now.

Whilst those who are slightly sceptic may be pushed to become full on Tarzan sceptics.

141436 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #1277 of 1915 🔗

But the wind is now in the sceptics’ sails, until and unless there is a real surge in real covid effects.

141705 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Mark, #1278 of 1915 🔗

There will be, but not to the level claimed today. Or even anywhere near.

141702 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Dave #KBF, #1279 of 1915 🔗

I’m afraid so. And in case you believe I’m being flippant, sadly this includes my own parents.

141419 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Mark, 3, #1280 of 1915 🔗

But it does no good to be a sceptic/rebel if you are locked into your home and forced to submit to all sorts of craziness, rules and tracking just to buy food or even meet another human outside your family..

141434 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Carrie, 2, #1281 of 1915 🔗

What it means I think is that the free ride is over for the coronapanickers. They can continue to push their agendas but now they will face real pushback at the highest levels.

141551 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Mark, 2, #1282 of 1915 🔗

Hence why Tobias Ellwood wants the army involved 🙁

141707 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Carrie, 1, #1283 of 1915 🔗

I don’t think it will be like that this time around. They want to keep workplaces and schools open. A sort of Sweden-lite method.

141441 ▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to matt, 7, #1284 of 1915 🔗

No you are not, they are! My boys spotted the mood change on social media last week. Me and Mr TT were in local supermarket on Saturday and struck up a conversation with a lady in the queue who apologised for standing too close to us. We ended up having a great conversation about all things science, and the issues around the vaccine. I made a point of talking loudly about false positives when I walked through town with son 1 this morning.

It will reach a crescendo in the next few weeks. The end is in sight, in my view, after a ‘credit event’, which I think is baked in for mid October. In the end, the economy will force the government’s hand.

141455 ▶▶▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 4, #1285 of 1915 🔗

Yes my kids said the same – no one is happy

141529 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to CGL, 3, #1286 of 1915 🔗

They know they have been blamed for the ‘spike’ and bearing in mind they are going to be paying for the response in taxes, lost opportunities and worse, they want to get on with their lives.

141730 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1287 of 1915 🔗

Yes! I think this was an own goal by Hancock when he said that. My parents mentioned that, and I just asked if they wanted to stop seeing their grandchildren if they were so concerned?

141722 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1288 of 1915 🔗

The tide started to turn a bit ago, though it was slow. Sceptical comments to articles in the Press (except those from me and a few others of course, which have been sceptical since March) began appearing about the time masks were mandated in Scotland. And the tide has been turning ever since. It’s now flooding our way.

141393 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 7, #1289 of 1915 🔗

The tide is turning, and the wind is changing, and…lots of other metaphors for things looking up.

141736 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Mark, #1290 of 1915 🔗

I must down to the seas again, for the call of the running tide
Is a wild call and a clear call that may not be denied;
All I ask is a windy day with the white clouds flying,
And the flung spray and the blown spume, and the seagulls crying.

Masefield

141738 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Nick Rose, #1291 of 1915 🔗

And before some wag jumps in:

I must go down to the sea again,
To the lonely sea and sky;
I left my shoes and socks there –
I wonder if they’re dry?

Spike Milligan

141361 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #1292 of 1915 🔗

For those science type readers out there found this video from the Government Chemist about quantitive PCR test assay validation:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/an-introduction-to-quantitative-pcr-assay-validation

141370 ▶▶ Kate, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1293 of 1915 🔗

I get the ridiculous impression that this is how the private test companies carrying out the tests on the population are learning their job!!

141362 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 10, #1294 of 1915 🔗

Now the government say that parents and grandparents who provide childcare will be exempt from any future lockdown measures.
Talk about “Pick and Mix”.

141365 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Fingerache Philip., 16, #1295 of 1915 🔗

The Virus is getting more intelligent daily – now it knows that you are meeting to do childcare and not just visiting granny for tea and biscuits.

141375 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Awkward Git, 9, #1296 of 1915 🔗

Well, it’s certainly more intelligent than our government, their advisers and the “experts”

141650 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Fingerache Philip., #1297 of 1915 🔗

That’s no recommendation.

141395 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Awkward Git, 7, #1298 of 1915 🔗

It may be we can employ a pied piper to lure the virus over a cliff by appealing to it’s intellect through classical melodies. Suggest The Flight of a Bumble Bee or perhaps more effective would be somekind of jig.

141399 ▶▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Basics, 2, #1299 of 1915 🔗

Not classical music but “The road to nowhere” perhaps?

141411 ▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Basics, 6, #1300 of 1915 🔗

Problem is its not the virus that is a threat to us. If we could lure politicians and their advisers over a cliff that might help.

141416 ▶▶▶▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Saved To Death, 2, #1301 of 1915 🔗

You wont be able to appeal to their intellect though.

141466 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Saved To Death, #1302 of 1915 🔗

Haha.,,.that did make me laugh 😆

141414 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #1303 of 1915 🔗

That would be funny if the whole situation were not so serious..

It is nonetheless worth posting widely on Twitter to once again point out the ridiculousness of all the regulations..

141369 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Fingerache Philip., 5, #1304 of 1915 🔗

Kill Granny Smith as she looks after you while mummy is at work, granny jones who is safely locked away and will be fine.

141392 ▶▶▶ Jenny, replying to Dave #KBF, 14, #1305 of 1915 🔗

Obviously the main thing is that neither granny should, under any circumstances, be allowed to decide for herself.

141429 ▶▶ Suzyv, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #1306 of 1915 🔗

And people are still falling for this rubbish!? They are most definitely putting something in the tap water..

141433 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Suzyv, 2, #1307 of 1915 🔗

Some people are petrified that they will die, if they have to into hospital.

blame the psyop, not the water.

142036 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Suzyv, #1308 of 1915 🔗

Possibly worth a bit of reading on fluoride …

141363 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 3, #1309 of 1915 🔗

The flap is extremely localised. At first sight, it appears that, once again, the most vulnerable have not been protected. But the result would most likely have been the same no matter which common cold virus……?

‘A third of those who died with diagnosed or suspected COVID-19 in English hospitals did so at Tameside and Glossop Integrated Care Foundation Trust in the seven days to 10 September.

The Greater Manchester Trust has seen a significant rise in COVID-19 deaths, from a weekly total of five on 4 September to 18 six days later. The total number of COVID-19 hospital deaths in the seven days to 10 September across England was 54.

COVID-19 deaths at Tameside and Glossop had fallen to a weekly total of zero on 23 July, before beginning to climb steadily from 20 August. The last time the trust recorded 18 deaths in a seven-day period was in late April when the pandemic was still close to its first peak.

The highest seven day figure recorded by the trust was 28, meaning the 10 September figure is equivalent to 64% of its peak covid-19 mortality. Nationally, hospital deaths with the virus are running at less than 1 per cent of the early-April peak.
No other trust recorded more than three covid-19 deaths during the seven days to 10 September.’

https://www.pslhub.org/blogs/entry/1318-single-trust-accounts-for-one-in-three-covid-hospital-deaths/

‘Nationally, Tameside is 34th out of 326 most deprived local authority. It has the highest premature death rate for heart disease in England. In adults, the recorded diabetes prevalence, excess weight and drug and alcohol misuse are significantly worse than the England average. Rates of smoking related deaths and hospital admissions for alcohol harm are significantly higher than the England average. Healthy life expectancy for males is 57.7 years compared with the national average of 63.4 years; for women the healthy life expectancy is 58.3 years against a national average of 64 years. The population is predominantly white British (91%).’

https://www.cqc.org.uk/sites/default/files/new_reports/AAAJ4091.pdf

141398 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to Tim Bidie, 2, #1310 of 1915 🔗

As was the case back in March, hospitals and care homes. A nosocomial disease.

141884 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to Tim Bidie, #1311 of 1915 🔗

But life expectancy for uk men is c79 years; women c82 years. So why believe any of the figures?

142184 ▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Miss Owl, #1312 of 1915 🔗

‘Healthy Life Expectancy’

The latest data on healthy life expectancy (the number of years lived in self-assessed good health) (2013 to 2015) show that it is now 63.4 for males and 64.1 for females.’

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/health-profile-for-england/chapter-1-life-expectancy-and-healthy-life-expectancy

141376 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, 6, #1313 of 1915 🔗

Labour MP on TalkRADIO, “we are trying to save lives here”. Ask him home many people are dying directly of cv19.

141383 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Dave #KBF, 3, #1314 of 1915 🔗

EXACTLY.

141389 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Dave #KBF, 8, #1315 of 1915 🔗

Labour MP on TalkRADIO, “we are trying to save lives here”.

Not the ones dying because of resources diverted to chasing covid19 phantoms back and forth, nor the ones committing suicide because their businesses, jobs or lives have been wrecked by lockdowns, obviously.

141427 ▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Mark, 2, #1316 of 1915 🔗

That was his response when the presenter asked about failing business and the economy, which of course leads to deaths.

141573 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Mark, #1317 of 1915 🔗

no – we are trying to save lives here.

141380 NickR, replying to NickR, 11, #1318 of 1915 🔗

Let me understand this…… is Whitty saying that an additional 200 people a day might die over and above the 1,700 that die each day normally?

Or is he saying: of the 1,700 that die daily 200 will die of/with Covid?

At the moment fewer people than usual are dying which apparently makes us very worried that it might go back up to the normal rate!

If it’s the latter does it matter? Shouldn’t we only be moved by additional deaths not by the same number? Is he saying, we’ll destroy livelihoods, let people die of cancer/heart attacks whatever, get depressed, do all sorts of harm so that a different set of people die rather than the ones who might die of covid?

Am I being a bit dim here?

141387 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to NickR, 12, #1319 of 1915 🔗

You are spot on and I was wondering the same. If you a very old, frail person and unfortunately your lungs cannot cope with another winter, what’s the difference between dying of flu, pneumonia or covid ? NONE.

141530 ▶▶ Julian, replying to NickR, 1, #1320 of 1915 🔗

Not being dim other than, without wishing to offend, assuming there’s any logic. It’s all utter propaganda – as no-one is questioning them, they are not presenting logically thought-through, coherent, defensible positions. Just plucking figures out of the air that support their agenda.

141384 Barney McGrew, replying to Barney McGrew, 4, #1321 of 1915 🔗

I didn’t watch the Whitty/Vallance show, but on the headline of 50,000 ‘cases’, are these the ‘cases’ that scale with the number of tests done? Are they extrapolating from a trend that is controlled by number of tests done, and then predicting a trend that will be influenced by number of tests done?

141388 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Barney McGrew, 3, #1322 of 1915 🔗

Great question!

141500 ▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #1323 of 1915 🔗

they didn’t take questions which make them look very dodgy

141587 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to crimsonpirate, #1324 of 1915 🔗

No effort required on their part to look dodgy!

141655 ▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to crimsonpirate, #1325 of 1915 🔗

Very dodgy. The definition of ruling by diktat.

141390 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Barney McGrew, 9, #1326 of 1915 🔗

Today has just been out-and-out lying. There is no other way to describe it.

141410 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tom Blackburn, 6, #1327 of 1915 🔗
141415 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #1328 of 1915 🔗

Agree.

141394 crimsonpirate, replying to crimsonpirate, 4, #1329 of 1915 🔗
141467 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to crimsonpirate, 1, #1330 of 1915 🔗

King Crimson? Apparently very influential with Tim Smith (RIP) of The Cardiacs.

141482 ▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to Two-Six, #1331 of 1915 🔗

I hadn’t known that he’d died until I read your comment

“Is this the life” from Salisbury Arts Centre is one of my favourite music videos on youtube.

141495 ▶▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Two-Six, #1332 of 1915 🔗

that doesn’t surprise me-I was lucky enough to see the Cardiacs live twice

141726 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to crimsonpirate, #1333 of 1915 🔗

I saw them many times, every gig, the most amazing spectacle, the loudest and best band live EVER. Just awesome.

Yes he died about a month ago.

About 10 years ago he had a terrible heart attack and then multiple strokes that left him very disabled.
Apparently he was at a My Bloody Valentine gig, the loudest band ever and he blew a fuze.

Poor guy, a great loss, he was a genius.

141403 Basics, 1, #1334 of 1915 🔗

Good conversation from Ireland.
John Waters in interesting conversation with Computing Forever. A discussion about where we are at this point in the lockdowns and how we got here etc

https://youtu.be/RbTTkQz6qQI

141407 Norma McNormalface, replying to Norma McNormalface, #1335 of 1915 🔗

Depressing to see the comments on
Guardian sceptic(ish) Simon Jenkins’s latest effort. Diametrical opposite of comments on any Daily Mail or Telegraph equivalent.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/21/coronavirus-britain-vallance-whitty-fear-data-alarm

141422 ▶▶ JHuntz, replying to Norma McNormalface, 3, #1336 of 1915 🔗

Just the usual from the Guardian luvvies they are more worried about track and trace than the devastation of this virus on so many levels. Why can’t lefties think critically?

141522 ▶▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to JHuntz, 4, #1337 of 1915 🔗

I’m a leftie, that’s why I stopped reading the Guardian years ago.

141423 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Norma McNormalface, 4, #1338 of 1915 🔗

If you are a hardened Guardianista you will have been fed a diet of pure panic propaganda, between that and the BBC. At least the DM and DT have had a mix of some propaganda and (quite a lot, actually) of sceptical stuff, and a lot of it very good.

In any free speech situation where both sides are reasonably freely presented, the sceptical view on this wins hands down. Which is of course precisely why the coronapanic has had to be protected by so much censorship.

141428 ▶▶ Jenny, replying to Norma McNormalface, 3, #1339 of 1915 🔗

To be honest I was amazed to see such an article in the Guardian and there are a significant minority of sceptical comments. It’s not too bad overall!

141540 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Norma McNormalface, #1340 of 1915 🔗

I would imagine that large numbers of people who do read that are probably public sector workers. So the ramifications of what they push are largely lost on them.

141412 Dave #KBF, replying to Dave #KBF, #1341 of 1915 🔗

LBC have someone on pushing masks.

i could swear

141426 ▶▶ Lili, replying to Dave #KBF, 12, #1342 of 1915 🔗

Julia Hartley-Brewer on Talk Radio pushed hard for masks in the two week lead up to 24th July when they became mandatory. Now she’s whining about more of our freedoms disappearing when she’s partly responsible for them being stolen.

141445 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Lili, 7, #1343 of 1915 🔗

Yes her views on masks are still unfortunate. But she has made more effort to hold ministers to account of late than anyone else I can think of in the media and she skewered Shapps over FPR this morning. I’m certainly glad to have her in our corner right now.

141462 ▶▶▶▶ Bumble, replying to Charlie Blue, 7, #1344 of 1915 🔗

I agree. She’s on board now after an unfortunate bed wetting phase early on.

141478 ▶▶▶▶ Stringfellow Hawke, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1345 of 1915 🔗

OK to change your mind if there’s logical reasoning gone into it – for example, even Dr. Yeadon admits he was quite strongly in favour of lots of things done lockdown #1;… don’t always agree with JHB 101% on everything but overall think she’s a good egg.

141464 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Lili, -2, #1346 of 1915 🔗

Julia HB has always been a twat of monumental proportions. Fuck her too.

141580 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Two-Six, 1, #1347 of 1915 🔗

Strange, she always speaks highly of you… 😉

141623 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, #1348 of 1915 🔗

OOh that hit a never or two..

141624 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, #1349 of 1915 🔗

With her stupid blue hair highlights

141472 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Lili, 1, #1350 of 1915 🔗

changing your thinking is how science works

141578 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Lili, 1, #1351 of 1915 🔗

“When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?” J M Keynes.

Better she changes her mind and changes side than realise she’s wrong and double-down. Like the government does.

141659 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lili, #1352 of 1915 🔗

She says she still wears one and is far too supportive of this measure for my linking!

141421 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 10, #1353 of 1915 🔗

Regardless of the agonies yet to come, can anyone doubt that the social, political and economic damage inflicted during the last 6 months is already irreparable? Is there any coming back from any of this?

141424 ▶▶ Olive, replying to Richard O, 5, #1354 of 1915 🔗

today I feel very doomed!

142025 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Olive, #1355 of 1915 🔗

Popeye’ll be along anytime now …

141432 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Richard O, 3, #1356 of 1915 🔗

I agree. Certainly no chance of recovery within a generation in my view. Just seems to be a question of how much deeper they will dig the hole.

141457 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1357 of 1915 🔗

Me feelings exactly. In all probability we will not see an end to this in our lifetimes. It could take 100 years to restore a reasonable level of humanity.

141437 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Richard O, 8, #1358 of 1915 🔗

The education lost to the young will never be recovered. Remember two weeks off on holiday was apparently devastating to kids prior to this.

We’ll be paying for this for decades due to hysteresis and path dependency. We need the young back in education, training and back at work improving their skills.

141450 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Lucan Grey, 2, #1359 of 1915 🔗

Remember two weeks off on holiday was apparently devastating to kids prior to this.”

Exactly. Pure hysteria and hypocrisy at work in aid of command and control – in both cases.

Makes me want to puke.

141646 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Lucan Grey, #1360 of 1915 🔗

Just one unauthorised day off school was enough to get parents a telling off.

142027 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to A. Contrarian, #1361 of 1915 🔗

Only daft parents – “Our Johnny was absent due to an upset tummy and diarrhea”.

141469 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to Richard O, 5, #1362 of 1915 🔗

Until we excise the extreme corruption in our government and institutions there is only poverty and dystopia ahead.

We do live in a time of extraordinary potential and if we could just get that jack boot off our necks we might be looking forward to a new golden age.

141473 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Saved To Death, 2, #1363 of 1915 🔗

You might be right. I do hope so.

141560 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Saved To Death, 1, #1364 of 1915 🔗

Yes. I look at post-war Germany and Japan, which gives me some hope. But that jackboot must go; the country needs a vision (missing for many years) and proper leadership (also missing for many years) from the political class.

We will do the rest.

141523 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Richard O, #1365 of 1915 🔗

Eventually. Best case a few years, worst case many decades.

141534 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Richard O, 1, #1366 of 1915 🔗

They have spent 6 months telling us that it won’t. Welcome to the new normal was the refrain. Unfortunately I have to believe them.

141537 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, 2, #1367 of 1915 🔗

Yes, it will come back. But at huge cost to those who set up their own businesses and tried to live their own way. I noticed a sign in a shop window recently in Hoole, Chester: “Buy local and fund somebody’s dream, not somebody’s new yacht.” It left an impression of the humanity behind the statistics.

141425 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1368 of 1915 🔗

What’s the general view on flu jabs this year?

Last year I was under quite a bit of pressure (due to work) to have one and was carefully considering it however didn’t bother in the end. This year I expect that pressure to be tenfold. However if it means I don’t get flu and get put down as a Covid statistic, I don’t mind it. I’ve never had a flu and am a relatively young 38 btw.

Just wondering what the prevailing view (if any) amongst the sensible heads on here was?

141435 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #1369 of 1915 🔗

Nothing wrong with the flu jab. I have one every year because I don’t want the flu, even though I have to pay for it.

If somebody else is paying then it’s a no brainer. Get it done.

We’re far too nonchalant about flu. It’s a nasty disease that can leave you in a bad way. My mother spent three night in intensive care and three weeks in hospital due to it last time it did the rounds and now is on permanent anti-seizure tablets.

141447 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Lucan Grey, #1370 of 1915 🔗

Yes – flu’s vary – but I wouldn’t wish a bad dose on anyone.

The important thing about this is that it highlights what a total load of bollocks is the fuss over Covid – a much lower incidence, relatively moderate, virus

141438 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #1371 of 1915 🔗

On balance, ‘flu jabs may have some – but not massive – benefit. There doesn’t seem to be a high degree of risk associated. I’ve usually had one, and have never had side effects.

But the protection is often lower than thought – at 60% in some cases.

The other issue is any Covid vaccine that miraculously appears. Without at least two years of testing, I would avoid that like the plague.

141442 ▶▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to RickH, #1372 of 1915 🔗

RickH – absolutely, that goes without saying. The Covid vaccine will be avoided like…well… the plague.

Thanks for your responses.

141443 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to RickH, #1373 of 1915 🔗

Convo with people that actually make vaccines rather than flog them says we’ll be lucky to see one for Covid that is truly effective inside four years.

141459 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Lucan Grey, #1374 of 1915 🔗

truly effective and widespread availability? Even longer. The QC on a vaccine is very high & rigorous. Over 100 checks in the process. Try scaling that up at speed.

141460 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Sophie123, 3, #1375 of 1915 🔗

They won’t bother testing it, if they could get a deal with Barry Scott, they would inject us Cillit Bang.

The evil evil evil bastards.

142021 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Sophie123, #1376 of 1915 🔗

Not sure how this ties in with the flu jab being different every year ?

141648 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #1377 of 1915 🔗

Which is the reason for the moonshot project and immunity passport, whose real aim is mass surveillance and control.. They are playing the long game here…

141446 ▶▶▶ davews, replying to RickH, #1378 of 1915 🔗

Well last year’s didn’t help, I had the early version of CV over Christmas…
I am waiting to see if my surgery contact me, clearly their usual drop in clinics won’t be running this year and it may turn out to be more trouble than it is worth.

141503 ▶▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to RickH, 1, #1379 of 1915 🔗

This from the docs4opendebate open letter:
Survey studies on influenza vaccinations show that in 10 years we have only succeeded three times in developing a vaccine with an efficiency rate of more than 50%. Vaccinating our elderly appears to be inefficient. Over 75 years of age, the efficacy is almost non-existent
I doubt the British flu jab is any different.

141544 ▶▶▶ janis pennance, replying to RickH, 1, #1380 of 1915 🔗

Actually 50% is the highest efficacy if I recall and in 2017/18 15% .

141444 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #1381 of 1915 🔗

The Cochrane reviews on the effectiveness and safety of flu vaccinations are cited by many.

https://www.cochrane.org/news/featured-review-three-updated-cochrane-reviews-assessing-effectiveness-influenza-vaccines

Summary from the adult one below. Text in bold (by me) says it all.

Authors’ conclusions

Healthy adults who receive inactivated parenteral influenza vaccine rather than no vaccine probably experience less influenza, from just over 2% to just under 1% (moderate‐certainty evidence). They also probably experience less ILI following vaccination, but the degree of benefit when expressed in absolute terms varied across different settings. Variation in protection against ILI may be due in part to inconsistent symptom classification. Certainty of evidence for the small reductions in hospitalisations and time off work is low. Protection against influenza and ILI in mothers and newborns was smaller than the effects seen in other populations considered in this review.

Vaccines increase the risk of a number of adverse events, including a small increase in fever, but rates of nausea and vomiting are uncertain. The protective effect of vaccination in pregnant women and newborns is also very modest. We did not find any evidence of an association between influenza vaccination and serious adverse events in the comparative studies considered in this review. Fifteen included RCTs were industry funded (29%).

I’ve never had a flu jab and never will. Vaccines should only be used for the really deadly stuff.

141527 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #1382 of 1915 🔗

Hi AN other lockdown sceptic . I also just cited Cochrane. Great minds think alike!

141679 ▶▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Kevin 2, #1383 of 1915 🔗

I hadn’t delved in the vaccine swamp before all this. It stinks!

141768 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, #1384 of 1915 🔗

Absolutement.

141787 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, #1385 of 1915 🔗
141681 ▶▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Kevin 2, #1386 of 1915 🔗

Your summary is far better than mine.

141453 ▶▶ Bumble, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #1387 of 1915 🔗

Very low risk unless you’re allergic to eggs.it may give you mild symptoms for a couple of days (always gives me a headache then a mild cold). Effectiveness depends on whether they get the right strains in the vaccine and that is based on what is happening in the southern hemisphere right now. Flu is a serious illness in all ages. Interestingly the vaccination doesn’t seem to improve the hospitalisation and mortality stats for over 65s, even though they are the main target for the jab. An alternative or supplementary strategy would be to take daily vit D and zinc in the winter, as advised by PHE.

141643 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Bumble, #1388 of 1915 🔗

Yep, take vitamin D at the very least!

141474 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Tom Blackburn, 4, #1389 of 1915 🔗

Last year the effectiveness of the flu jab was 17%.

Does the Flu Shot Increase COVID-19 Risk ( YES! ) and Other Interesting Questions https://doctormurray.com/does-the-flu-shot-increase-covid-19-risk/

The best is to optimise you immune system. Optimise vitamin D levels, proper nutrition, good hydration, reduce stress, move/exercise, etc

141504 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Victoria, #1390 of 1915 🔗

Reduce stress????????

141642 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, #1391 of 1915 🔗

Yes, this ^^^^^^

141508 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1392 of 1915 🔗

The renowned Cochrane Independent Review Group did a huge meta analysis of influenza vaccine trials and concluded that:-

“We found 52 clinical trials of over 80,000 adults. We were unable to determine the impact of bias on about 70% of the included studies due to insufficient reporting of details. Around 15% of the included studies were well designed and conducted. We focused on reporting of results from 25 studies that looked at inactivated vaccines. Injected influenza vaccines probably have a small protective effect against influenza and ILI (moderate-certainty evidence), as 71 people would need to be vaccinated to avoid one influenza case, and 29 would need to be vaccinated to avoid one case of ILI. Vaccination may have little or no appreciable effect on hospitalisations (low-certainty evidence) or number of working days lost.”

https://www.cochrane.org/CD001269/ARI_vaccines-prevent-influenza-healthy-adults

I am not aware of any research undertaken to assess whether there may be vaccine interference or cross-reactivity between a seasonal influenza vaccine and a subsequently received Sars-CoV 2 vaccine. There certainly hasn’t been any clinical trials.

About Cochrane:-

“Cochrane is for anyone interested in using high-quality information to make health decisions. Whether you are a doctor or nurse, patient or carer, researcher or funder, Cochrane evidence provides a powerful tool to enhance your healthcare knowledge and decision making.
Cochrane’s members and supporters come from more than 130 countries, worldwide. Our volunteers and contributors are researchers, health professionals, patients, carers, and people passionate about improving health outcomes for everyone, everywhere. Our global independent network gathers and summarizes the best evidence from research to help you make informed choices about treatment and we have been doing this for 25 years.
We do not accept commercial or conflicted funding. This is vital for us to generate authoritative and reliable information, working freely, unconstrained by commercial and financial interests.
Our Strategy to 2020 aims to put Cochrane evidence at the heart of health decision-making all over the world.”

141521 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1393 of 1915 🔗

I had a fairly serious autoimmune episode more than a decade ago, since then have been in full remission and better health than before. Have shied away from flu vaccine on the basis that poking around my immune system without a compelling reason is tempting fate, given that I have really hardly been ill since the episode. No idea if I am doing the right thing or not.

141867 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Julian, #1394 of 1915 🔗

You are doing the right thing by not getting the flu vaccine. I have an overactive immune system and I won’t take any vaccine that could exacerbate it, and in your case there’s a chance a vaccine could re-activate your autoimmune issue.

141525 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tom Blackburn, #1395 of 1915 🔗

My company offers a free flu jab to all employees, but it is entirely voluntary. And is this year too.

141637 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #1396 of 1915 🔗

The cynic in me says they will ‘spike’ this year’s flu jab with something ‘nasty’, knowing that a lot of people won’t take the ‘real’ covid vaccine..

141430 daveh2, replying to daveh2, 18, #1397 of 1915 🔗

I emailed Layla Moran MP to ask her to vote against renewal of the Coronavirus Act. This is her response:

Dear XXXX,

Thank you for getting in touch with your concerns about the upcoming review of the Coronavirus Act 2020.

The Coronavirus Act 2020 was passed at a time of great uncertainty, when the need for controls to manage the spread of the virus was urgent. Due to the lack of time for Parliamentary scrutiny of the Bill, the Liberal Democrats and I argued that the powers should have to be renewed every three months rather than every two years, as was originally planned by the Government.

As a compromise, the Government agreed to give the Commons a vote every six months which is due at the end of this month.

The Liberal Democrats believe that Some of the provisions in the Coronavirus Act have proven necessary to help tackle the impact of the pandemic, such as enabling the emergency registration of nurses and other healthcare workers, and allowing people to receive Statutory Sick Pay from day one.

However, we agree that many of the powers in the Act have serious implications for people’s wellbeing, rights and freedoms – such as the relaxation of duties on local authorities to assess and meet people’s care needs, extra powers for police and immigration officers to detain people, and a new power to restrict or ban events and gatherings.

This combination of different emergency laws and government guidance has caused confusion among police and prosecutors, and 121 people have been wrongfully charged under the Act as a result.

For these reasons, the Liberal Democrats and I cannot support renewal of the Act in full after its first six months. We believe that new legislation is needed, both to preserve any parts of the Coronavirus Act that are still necessary, and to bring in new measures to tackle the next phase of this crisis.

Leader of the Liberal Democrats, Sir Ed Davey MP, has now written to the Prime Minister before this vote reaches the House of Commons to ask him to convene cross-party talks to agree new legislation that is better-suited to tackle the ongoing coronavirus crisis

Thank you again for writing in on such an important subject.

141439 ▶▶ Mark, replying to daveh2, 6, #1398 of 1915 🔗

“Leader of the Liberal Democrats, Sir Ed Davey MP, has now written to the Prime Minister before this vote reaches the House of Commons to ask him to convene cross-party talks to agree new legislation that is better-suited to tackle the ongoing coronavirus crisis”

FFS! We don’t need a bunch of bedwetters getting together to cobble up some nonsense to treat this as though it’s some real emergency, when it isn’t.

Just get rid of the coronapanic nonsense legislation and go back to normal arrangements for handling the business of government. That’s all that’s needed.

141440 ▶▶ RickH, replying to daveh2, 1, #1399 of 1915 🔗

Well – at least it’s a coherent reply. How long after sending your e-mail?

141863 ▶▶▶ daveh2, replying to RickH, #1400 of 1915 🔗

About a week.

141448 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to daveh2, 1, #1401 of 1915 🔗

From the party that gave up being neither liberal nor fans of democracy a long long time ago.

141470 ▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, #1402 of 1915 🔗

They have occasional and, in context, shocking flashes of real liberalism.

141654 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ovis, 1, #1403 of 1915 🔗

Yes, surprisingly good response – I’m quite shocked!

141652 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to daveh2, #1404 of 1915 🔗

Surprisingly good response – I’m quite shocked!

141864 ▶▶▶ daveh2, replying to Carrie, #1405 of 1915 🔗

Me too!

141859 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to daveh2, #1406 of 1915 🔗

My parents are fans of hers and as bored 80 somethings will probably like her position…

141452 Skippy, 11, #1407 of 1915 🔗

My scribble to the ginger wankpuffin

141454 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 3, #1408 of 1915 🔗

Tim Martin (Mr Wetherspoons) is a ‘fan of the Swedish approach’

https://youtu.be/9qhPN-ByuY8?t=76

141501 ▶▶ Julian, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #1409 of 1915 🔗

Wonder if he’d want to get together with Dolan, Hugh Osmond, Luke Johnson and maybe Rocco Forte to fund a resistance campaign.

141456 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 11, #1410 of 1915 🔗

Senior Tory warns Boris Johnson’s government: Acquiescence for lockdowns is draining away!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6bkQuHr0rk

141520 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 10, #1411 of 1915 🔗

I’ve managed to keep pro-lockdown friends, and even they are baulking at the thought of another lockdown. Acquiescence and support is indeed draining away. People have had enough.

141591 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #1412 of 1915 🔗

Same here. Even some of the biggest zealots now occasionally mumble something about freedoms and government by diktat. However they don’t seem to have quite realised that consenting to the first lockdown has paved the way for exactly that.

141872 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to A. Contrarian, #1413 of 1915 🔗

I’ll give most the benefit of the doubt. Three weeks often feels like six months.

141607 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #1414 of 1915 🔗

Couldn’t bear to listen to Hancock’s answer to that; as soon as he began ‘As a conservative..,’ I had to switch him off…

141873 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Carrie, #1415 of 1915 🔗

Could feel the bile rising myself…

141458 Recusant, replying to Recusant, 23, #1416 of 1915 🔗

The Covid second wave, with exponential rise in deaths are the WMDs of 2020. All the experts are convinced they exist, but nobody has actually seen them.

141461 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Recusant, 3, #1417 of 1915 🔗

100%

141463 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Recusant, 8, #1418 of 1915 🔗

Remember the levels of death and destruction that occurred in Iraq as a direct result of those lies (not to mention the years of brutal sanctions that preceded it). We are getting a taste of that very medicine now.

141479 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Richard O, 3, #1419 of 1915 🔗

Yes, It’s OUR turn now for the cabal to wage war on. Iraq, Syria, Libya, the Ukraine, now it’s turned on US, the Crown Estates and the the Americas. At least they haven’t started using real weapons on us…..yet.
It’s JUST A FACE NAPPY.

141486 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Two-Six, 2, #1420 of 1915 🔗

Yes, we let our governments get away with murder in our name time and again. Did we really think they would leave us alone?

I bet Johnson would enjoy ordering B52 strikes on areas with increasing cases. In economic terms, he already is.

141533 ▶▶▶▶▶ Kate, replying to Richard O, 1, #1421 of 1915 🔗

True, western governments are psychopathic. It is just that they have hitherto focused on other people

141513 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Two-Six, #1422 of 1915 🔗

hmmmm. I wouldn’t be so sure about that. Not using real weapons on us yet

Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars

https://lawfulpath.com/ref/sw4qw/index.shtml

This is another source document a lot of researchers turn to when referencing ‘the agenda’. It has been ‘debunked’ …….apparently!

Makes interesting reading in today’s context!

141741 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Recusant, 1, #1423 of 1915 🔗

https://www.corbettreport.com/covid911/

You jest but this is correct. National Security has become Bio Security. The same people (e.g. Rumsfeld) moved into the private sphere where they have been gearing up for this for years. Some of the clips used in this short podcast are truly frightening

141471 Jules, replying to Jules, 12, #1424 of 1915 🔗

I see that easements in family childcare arrangements are carefully presented to emphasise that there should be no opportunities for children to enjoy themselves in any way ie no parties or play dates. This Government really is the most vile imaginable.

141475 ▶▶ Olive, replying to Jules, 6, #1425 of 1915 🔗

kids sports clubs starting to cancel this weekend…… utterly gut wrenching. Not to mention the fun things that kids already planning for like halloween……

141483 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Olive, 9, #1426 of 1915 🔗

think positive Olive – in a few years time the kids will be wearing hancock or boris masks on Halloween….

141496 ▶▶▶▶ Suitejb, replying to Major Panic, 7, #1427 of 1915 🔗

And burning effigies of them on bonfire night.

141505 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Suitejb, 4, #1428 of 1915 🔗

Every night.

141510 ▶▶▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Major Panic, 6, #1429 of 1915 🔗

And burning a Boris on 5th November, or whatever date replaces it.

141517 ▶▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Dave #KBF, 1, #1430 of 1915 🔗

yes, 2020

141600 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Dave #KBF, 7, #1431 of 1915 🔗

I think we should start this year, burning effigies of Boris, Hancock, Whitty and Vallance..!!!

141750 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ sceptickat, replying to Carrie, 1, #1432 of 1915 🔗

Only effigies? With no country shows this year I’m missing a hog roast, I think there’d be plenty of crackling on Boris! Not so sure about the others, probably best for kindling.

141869 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to sceptickat, #1433 of 1915 🔗

Oh no, you’d be a walking coronary waiting to happen if you had a bit o’Boris.

McDonalds would be much healthier.

141492 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Olive, 12, #1434 of 1915 🔗

Last halloween I was honestly very disturbed by the way that all the staff in Tescos (and everywhere else) were dressed in the most horrific costumes, fake blood, surgical gowns, wounds, I found it to be very very disturbing.

Fuck Haloween.

We don’t need it, its all around us now every fucking day. Halloween and the glorification of it plays right into the plans of the Satanist cabal the runs our lives. Its an important RED letter day in their satanic calendar.

The glorification of evil, ghouls , death, withcraft, murder, injury, suffering, horror, all for the kiddies.

Evil.

141476 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 5, #1435 of 1915 🔗

At least Whitty and Vallance have nailed their colours to the mast (or do I mean mask?).

It is now possible to scrutinze their assumptions.

E.g. 50,000 cases by mid Oct. – 200 deaths a month later.

The highest number of daily cases so far was 7,860 on April 10th.

The highest number of deaths 1,166 followed elven days later – never mind a month later.

They appear to implicitly recognise that what are now termed ‘cases’ bain’t be the same as what were termed cases back in April – or 50,000 ‘cases’ would surely give rise to something like 7000 deaths going on what happened in April.

And 200 deaths a day? Is that what they are saying would occur each day for six month? 37,000 deaths? Somewhat less than the excess deaths that occurred in the winter of 2017/18 (correct me if I’m wrong in saying that) – which no one noticed!

141489 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #1436 of 1915 🔗

They can manipulate the testing to prove whatever case they want, deaths are harder but given that some people dying anyway will probably have covid they can claim those. If it doesn’t happen they will say it was because of the measures they took, if it does then it’s our fault and we need more.

141586 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ned of the Hills, 1, #1437 of 1915 🔗

Is that 200 MORE deaths than occur daily, or are all deaths, from all causes, going to be lumped together from now on to make sure they hit (or rather exceed) the target?

At the very least they will probably lump all flu deaths together with covid and call them ‘coronavirus’ deaths, hoping we are too stupid to rumble them..

141480 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 11, #1438 of 1915 🔗

Guess what peeps – reality is winning – that means we are winning – drive on!

141499 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Major Panic, 7, #1439 of 1915 🔗

It does feel now that the latest diktats are hitting on hard ground. Few people on various talk radio stations are saying we need more and harder restrictions, even from a few days ago I feel a shift.

I know some people have been mental distorted to such an extent that they are petrified and it is going to take a lot of care to help them get back to reality.

141515 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Major Panic, 4, #1440 of 1915 🔗

Unlike last time, there is more opposition to Lockdown II and now Parliament is waking up.

141481 Alan P, replying to Alan P, 3, #1441 of 1915 🔗

Tried to post this on the Spectator earlier.

Does anyone think that the government has put all the energy into getting Brexit done and overcoming the hurdles in parliament, the Supreme Court, and the civil service reluctance to leave the EU or make it as difficult as possible; and has been waging a war in clearing out the Augean stable.

As a result the Quango of SAGE has been able to use the Covid “crisis” to lever their position as the government isn’t able to use any other scientific source, I.e. they’re stuck with Whitty, Vallance, Ferguson, Michie, et al. All of which were appointed by previous governments.

Now would be the time to use the likes of Heneghan, Gupta, Sikora as an alternative SAGE (not that crazy Alternative SAGE that gets media coverage with their daft ideas!) and replace the failed, dis-proven groupthink addled bunch of halfwits currently appearing on TV usurping the role (and being allowed to!) by the elected government.

141485 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Alan P, 5, #1442 of 1915 🔗

Not entirely sure what you’re driving at, sorry, but the PM and others bear the major part of the responsbility for the decisions taken initially and at every stage since they have doubled down. They are guilty as hell.

141511 ▶▶▶ Alan P, replying to Julian, 3, #1443 of 1915 🔗

Yeah, sort of agree with the responsibility laying with them, but just thinking they got blinded and surprised and didn’t have any other body to go to for advice other that SAGE, whose members weren’t appointed by this government. Perhaps given time and not the pressure brought on by the media screaming death and destruction, they might have not followed the lockdown science paddled by the Ferguson’s of this world.

just sayin’…

141554 ▶▶▶▶ NickR, replying to Alan P, 1, #1444 of 1915 🔗

Alan, if they were 13 year old school girls I’d agree but they’re the sodding government, they’re supposed to be in control. Their voters trusted them with their livelihoods. They are able to make decisions & order things as they want, they don’t even have to square it with Parliament any more.
I take it you’re not a constitutional lawyer?

141663 ▶▶▶▶▶ Alan P, replying to NickR, #1445 of 1915 🔗

No I’m not (lol), but just trying to get an idea of what causes lie behind the madness and subsequent pile-on.

141584 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Alan P, 2, #1446 of 1915 🔗

Did you see the photo on Simon Dolan’s Twitter today? Looked like Boris is totally being controlled by Whitty, from the body language…

141588 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Carrie, 2, #1447 of 1915 🔗

Yes a very telling photo and no mistake. Very interesting indeed, Whitty laying it down to the PM who looks like he is gonna “take a knee” or bow or something….What a shower of bastards, it was like a scene out of Downfall.

142009 ▶▶ Bruno, replying to Alan P, #1448 of 1915 🔗

No, no-one thinks that. They are not ‘stuck’ with Vallance the Vaccine et al; they trust them or they could have got rid of them, just like all the remainer Cabinet ministers were got rid of in short order. Wish people would stop making excuses for the gang.

141484 A. Contrarian, replying to A. Contrarian, 4, #1449 of 1915 🔗

I know this is lazy but I really want a quick draft email to send to my MP (Lib Dem) today and I’m really pushed for time with kid and 12-week-old puppy… Could I steal something from someone please?! Am using Peter Hitchens’ very brief skeleton letter but want to add more.

Also as she is Lib Dem I would like to include Ed Davey’s recent statement against second lockdown but can’t find it anywhere…

Dear MP

I’ve noticed that you’ve not being doing your well-paid job. You haven’t held the government to account, you haven’t scrutinised its actions, in short you have not represented me. Why then do you expect to keep your seat at the next election?

141487 ▶▶ Julian, replying to A. Contrarian, 13, #1450 of 1915 🔗

Someone posted this further down, I thought it good:

I write to you as a constituent and a lifelong Conservative voter at general elections since 1979. I write to express my opposition to the coronavirus measures and to urge you to vote against the renewal of the Coronavirus Act. I will not give my reasons at length, because I am sure you have encountered them before, but in summary, I believe the coronavirus measures are

  • immoral and contrary to fundamental human rights
  • disproportionate
  • ultra vires – that is, the measures are not allowed under the powers inherent in the laws and legal principles used
  • ineffective, given the lack of any significant correlation between the degree of lockdown in various countries and the number of deaths per capita
  • an outrage against public health, considering the number of unnecessary deaths from cancer, heart disease and suicide
  • chaotic and confusing, and symptomatic of a lack of both leadership and considered policy-making

I’m not asking for a rebuttal or counter-arguments. I have seen them and continue to see them everywhere, and I believe I have taken them into account. I am simply stating that I will have to find another party to vote for at the next election unless matters improve. I expect that a single-issue party will emerge and, like the Brexit Party, create an incentive for change.

141550 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Julian, 1, #1451 of 1915 🔗

Thanks I will use this.

141545 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to dpj, #1453 of 1915 🔗

Thanks.

141498 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to A. Contrarian, 22, #1454 of 1915 🔗

a simple letter to MPs is;

Dear lazy cunt,

When there is low prevalence of Covid19 over 90% of the PCR tests are FALSE positives. Work it out you stupid fucker.

Kind regards,
A. Realist

141502 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Major Panic, 3, #1455 of 1915 🔗

Can I copy that for my MP?

141509 ▶▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Two-Six, #1456 of 1915 🔗

of course

141514 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Major Panic, 4, #1457 of 1915 🔗

Thanks. I think I am gonna have at least FOUR bottles of Spitfire tomorrow before lunchtime and write her a letter. The absolute bastard.

141661 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Two-Six, 1, #1458 of 1915 🔗

Make it pints. And Bishop’s Finger

141860 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Two-Six, #1459 of 1915 🔗

Spitfire Ale? Like the Luftwaffe, downed all over Kent… Remember the brewer getting into trouble over his advertising!

141532 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Major Panic, 3, #1460 of 1915 🔗

Short, to the point, and all completely true.

141547 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Major Panic, 1, #1461 of 1915 🔗

That one will be my PPS.

141857 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Major Panic, #1462 of 1915 🔗

Not convinced you’ll get much of a reply, if any.

141531 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to A. Contrarian, 14, #1463 of 1915 🔗

How about:

Dear Lid Dem MP twat,

If you idiots had not renegue on your promises to bring in proportional representation, lied about dropping tuition fees and legalising cannabis and had not gone into coalition with The Evil Tories (and all the other shit you lied about) we would not be in this position we are in now with the total collapse of society, financial melt-down and a suffocatiing medico-fascist police state

How can you justify your sorry life and your myopic world view now? You fool?

I hate you.

Fuck off and die.

Yours Sincerely

A voter.

141541 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Two-Six, 3, #1464 of 1915 🔗

I’ll add it as a postscript.

141491 Adam Hiley, replying to Adam Hiley, 15, #1465 of 1915 🔗

We must defend ourselves from an arrogant and out of control regime Johnson & Hancock must not be allowed to remain in Government a minute longer

141528 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Adam Hiley, 6, #1466 of 1915 🔗

I will any single issue party set up to dismantle this . Only Dolan winnning or the Tory party clearing out root and branch BJ and his supine cabinet will end this never ending hamster wheel. They’ll study this period in history for years to come. It’ll be known as a phenomenon- like the Inquisition/ Stalin’s purges, McCarthyism etc.

141576 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Telpin, 2, #1467 of 1915 🔗

Problem is, anyone they put in to replace them will carry on the charade.. don’t fancy Sunak who is ex Goldman Sachs..

Used to trust Steve Baker but he has hardly said anything for the last 6 months – Desmond Swayne has done more than Steve B..

141575 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Adam Hiley, 3, #1468 of 1915 🔗

Problem is, anyone they put in to replace them will carry on the charade.. don’t fancy Sunak who is ex Goldman Sachs..

Used to trust Steve Baker but he has hardly said anything for the last 6 months – Desmond Swayne has done more than Steve B..

141497 Jules, replying to Jules, 8, #1469 of 1915 🔗

Channel surfing last night, I came across an episode of “Enemy At The Door”. Life under the Nazi’s looked almost acceptable – dances, sweets, clear rules…

141507 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Jules, #1470 of 1915 🔗

I think they must of had free flags too back then.

141853 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Jules, #1471 of 1915 🔗

Rally each year. Book-burnings. Who needs a TV?

141518 Edward, replying to Edward, 1, #1472 of 1915 🔗

Can someone please explain the operation of QR codes for Track & Trace? I’ve been informed previously that iPhones have a QR reader as standard. On my Android phone I have a QR & bar code reader which I downloaded as free software about a year ago. On reading the code it translates it into text, usually a number from a bar code or a website name from a QR code. It then asks what I want to do with the result, such as writing it to a text file or looking at a website in my browser.

So, supposing I’m in a pub and read a QR code, how does the system ensure that I actually bother to go to the website? Does it assume that one’s phone is always online? Being old-fashioned I only have data or WiFi switched on when I need it, and not otherwise.

Or is it more sinister and the very act of reading the code registers your IP address somewhere?

141526 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to Edward, #1473 of 1915 🔗

Think you just answered your own question there my friend

141536 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to B Boru, #1474 of 1915 🔗

You mean the last sentence? I presume the phone itself has an ID tied to the phone number. I still don’t quite understand how the data gets sent to somewhere. Why would the QR reader know my phone number? – it presumably doesn’t need to for its own operation.

141619 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Edward, #1475 of 1915 🔗

Your smartphone can be accessed from a remote location and any data, information, files, etc can be looked at or accessed. Think of it as a computer rather than a phone. Hope that helps.

Might want to reconsider using one and revert to as some have suggested, an old Nokia. Either that or don’t use any of these apps and use encryption when communicating. Your data can be used against you and probably is already somewhere along the line with targeted advertising one example.

This is the whole sub-topic on it’s own.

Cheers
B

141548 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Edward, 3, #1476 of 1915 🔗

I think the QR codes will “talk” to the NHSX trac&Trace App. This app will log where you have been. Then some Muppet will give you a ring and demand that you stay in for 14 days or you will get fined £1000.

Fuck that for a game of soldiers.

Why would you????

141621 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Two-Six, #1477 of 1915 🔗

Supposing I’m a muppet who fully acquiesces in this system. Once I’ve read the QR code, is that “job done”? Or do I need to go on to the website to activate it?

141700 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Edward, #1478 of 1915 🔗

On my iphone 5 I needed to get an added qr reader app, it reads qr codes then can open up a thing in my browser, I have used it once. I think you will need to have the NHSX app installed with your details and give it suitable permissions to access you bluetooth wifi contacts and GPS data. If you “send it to” your browser or the NHS app, or the NHS app will find it then you will be tracked.

141740 ▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Two-Six, #1479 of 1915 🔗

Yes – I think I’ve cracked it now. The user needs to have the NHS Covid-19 app, available from http://www.covid19.nhs.uk (Don’t go there!)
So it’s possible to cheat the system by fiddling with your phone and pretending to scan the code, or actually scanning it using (say) my simple QR reader and doing nothing with the result. It’s a hi-tech equivalent of writing false information on paper.

141748 ▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Two-Six, #1480 of 1915 🔗

Yes, that’s essentially what the NHS website says (the one I’ve posted below).

141557 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Edward, 2, #1481 of 1915 🔗

For me the solution is just to write down my (false) name the “old school” way. They’ll try and encourage the scanning as it’s easier for them, but always been fine to let me go for the fallback option.

141562 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Edward, 5, #1482 of 1915 🔗

I’ve no idea, but I bought a very cheap dumb phone today which has solved all such issues for me.

At this point I’m seeing everything as sinister!

141601 ▶▶ AllieT, replying to Edward, 1, #1483 of 1915 🔗

And what pray do those of us do whose phones are neither smart or simply too old to download ludicrous apps? 🙄

141757 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to AllieT, #1484 of 1915 🔗

Don’t worry – be happy!

141691 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Edward, #1485 of 1915 🔗

Here is the government website explaining what venue owners are supposed to do. Each venue is assigned its own QR code. Visitors are supposed to scan the code “using the NHS COVID-19 app”. So I guess that app feeds the phone ID to the T&T database, and presumably my simple reader wouldn’t do the job. But I could pretend.
https://www.gov.uk/create-coronavirus-qr-poster

As an amusing aside, my QR reader was apparently written by someone with less than perfect command of English. When you choose the option to display a list of codes previously read, it does so and says “List readed”.

141716 ▶▶ matt, replying to Edward, 2, #1486 of 1915 🔗

Ignore. I always do. Point your phone at the QR code (don’t activate the camera first), fiddle around with your phone for a bit as if you’re filling a form in, say “done” and carry on as normal.

141720 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to matt, 1, #1487 of 1915 🔗

Good tactic – draws less attention to yourself as a potential ‘rebel’ (if the cameras are watching you..)..

141847 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to matt, 1, #1488 of 1915 🔗

I just fill in the paperwork. Lord Lucan and J Bond are out and about quite a bit atm.

141519 Telpin, replying to Telpin, 48, #1489 of 1915 🔗

It is so transparent what is happening- I feel so enraged by how cynically we are being manipulated and treated like infantilised idiots. First, Whitty and Vallance hype up the stats without any cross examination, the lobotomised MSM then hype up talk of a full second lockdown and the docile public buys it, enter BJ into the arena tomorrow, telling us how far we’ve come (!!- we’ve barely been allowed out) , how much ‘faith he has in the great British Public’ to ‘ do the right things’ and how much he values our ‘hard won freedoms’. He will then talk about he’s wrestled with his conscience and has not opted for full LD ( but will still keep it in his armoury- to keep us cowed) but will introduce more limited restrictions- like curfew / other. And all of us will actually be grateful and the poor excuse for Tory MPs will boast how common sense has prevailed. I feel physically sick just writing this. £10k fines for not obeying self imprisonment, non wartime curfews. How have we allowed ANY of this to pass under the radar? This is not a free democratic country. Forgive the hyperbole but I can barely function in this environment.

141535 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Telpin, 4, #1490 of 1915 🔗

I don’t think he will talk about how much faith he has in us any more. He will go full on dictator, tell us off and threaten us to behave or else.

141555 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Telpin, 11, #1491 of 1915 🔗

An extension of the mask mandate is top of the list for me. Because science.

Like you I reached the end of my tether some time ago. A breaking point is coming very soon where I will stop caring altogether and go full-on sociopath.

141583 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Richard O, 2, #1492 of 1915 🔗

Yes -muzzles in pubs & restaurants except when drinking/eating at table

141612 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to arfurmo, 3, #1493 of 1915 🔗

An MP (Brady I think) actually tweeted today that masks should be worn at all times in pubs, with customers drinking through straws. I shit you not, you’ll find it earlier today in the comments below.

141631 ▶▶▶▶▶ watashi, replying to Richard O, 1, #1494 of 1915 🔗

I thought Brady was one of the sane ones?

141638 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bella, replying to Richard O, 1, #1495 of 1915 🔗

Stupid twat. If you’re drinking through a straw then there’s a hole in your mask! Really, don’t we have any intelligent MPs?

141711 ▶▶▶▶▶ GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to Richard O, #1497 of 1915 🔗

According to the environmentalists, straws were deemed to be completely unacceptable a while back. I wonder if they’ll jump on that bandwagon again!

141840 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, #1498 of 1915 🔗

Wasn’t Brady. Geraint somebody-or-other.

141713 ▶▶▶▶ GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to arfurmo, #1499 of 1915 🔗

Already happening in Scotland. ☹️

141606 ▶▶▶ Telpin, replying to Richard O, #1500 of 1915 🔗

That actually made me laugh and ( ironically) gave me comfort that I’m not going completely insane. Everyone I know – usually fun loving rational people who could see the humour in everything) – is now suffering from low mood, if not full on depression.

141615 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Telpin, 4, #1501 of 1915 🔗

If you’re not depressed, there is something wrong with you.

141842 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Richard O, 1, #1502 of 1915 🔗

No, I’m just contrary.

142011 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, #1503 of 1915 🔗

No, got to disagree Richard.

Agree that hugely depressing things have happened, and keep on happening. But we are responsible for our reactions, and should not indulge in depression about these things.

It’s what SPI-B would want … 🙂

141569 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Telpin, 3, #1504 of 1915 🔗

As you say, totally transparent and it is obvious they think people are stupid and will be taken in by what they say… grrrr!

141590 ▶▶ AllieT, replying to Telpin, 1, #1505 of 1915 🔗

Well we won’t be watching ( Just as we didn’t watch the chuckle bros earlier) 🙄

141836 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Telpin, 1, #1506 of 1915 🔗

Hold fast. The end is coming – for them.

141524 Will, replying to Will, 18, #1507 of 1915 🔗

Meanwhile, a week on Thursday in Sweden, gatherings of 500 will be permitted and care homes will be open for visitors as long as they wash their hands and use common sense around colds etc. And this is in a country that never banned gatherings up to 50 people, never shut it’s schools up to 16 years of age, never shut it’s shops, any of it’s shops, it’s bars, cafes hairdressers, tattoo parlours etc etc.

141552 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Will, 11, #1508 of 1915 🔗

And to think that could have been us too if Bozo hadn’t lost his nerve.

141563 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Will, 6, #1509 of 1915 🔗

Yes, I am hoping Tegnell holds firm and does not put us under the rules now imposed in Norway and Denmark..

141566 ▶▶▶ Jenny, replying to Carrie, 4, #1510 of 1915 🔗

I think he’ll hold his nerve. He has done so far…

141568 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Carrie, 1, #1511 of 1915 🔗

Is he under pressure in Sweden to do that, Carrie?

141634 ▶▶▶▶ Faco, replying to Charlie Blue, 6, #1512 of 1915 🔗

Charlie Blue. Mr Tegnell could probably walk on water at the moment.
If our politicians tried to intervene theeir careers would be over very quick.

141668 ▶▶▶▶▶ Will, replying to Faco, 1, #1513 of 1915 🔗

Delighted to hear it!!!

141694 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1514 of 1915 🔗

Not that I have heard yet… I would think that in any case, he will (as ever) be watching the stats like a hawk – remember that in 2 weeks’ time some restrictions are due to be lifted..
Tegnell is not known for making hasty decisions, unlike British politicians!

Should be getting the latest hospital stats first thing tomorrow, if they don’t release them later tonight..

141833 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Will, 3, #1515 of 1915 🔗

But, but, people were lying dead in the streets with nobody to bury them. Surely you can’t have forgotten what a disaster befell Sweden for not locking down? Oh, wait…

141925 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Will, #1516 of 1915 🔗

Tegnell is like a boat captain. He knows not to oversteer and dick about.

141538 DRW, replying to DRW, 1, #1517 of 1915 🔗

Just thinking that if they bring back the NHS claps, nobody will want to do it at 8pm in the cold and wet. They’ll have to have them in the day over the weekend. Would be interesting to see how many do it again, I suspect much less.

141574 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to DRW, 4, #1518 of 1915 🔗

Nanny since the last time we clapped for the NHS with grandad Jonnie, now he is dead because of undiagnosed cancer can we clap for the NHS with with?

141597 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to DRW, 2, #1519 of 1915 🔗

I assume they would draw the line at trying that again. If they do there’ll be some arguments in the streets, that’s for sure.

141786 ▶▶ DomW, replying to DRW, 3, #1520 of 1915 🔗

I prefer Boo for Boris

Every day.

Saucepans welcome

141543 assoc, replying to assoc, 2, #1521 of 1915 🔗

Does anyone know if the tests carried out by the Germans are the same as ours, and if so do they produce the same quantities of false positives?

141577 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to assoc, 1, #1522 of 1915 🔗

All I know is that the Germans were some of the first to sell PCR tests, and our government have a contract to buy 10 million from Roche. I haven’t looked into it more recently though.

Worth noting that even if you buy the same tests, you could get different accuracy figures by (for example) changing the cycle threshold you consider a positive.

141553 Basics, replying to Basics, #1523 of 1915 🔗

Coronavirus outbreak identified amongst staff at NHS 24 call centre in Edinburgh

Local news reports.

141558 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 9, #1524 of 1915 🔗

Fuck me, so you can catch Covid-19 over the phone now.

141564 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Richard O, 3, #1525 of 1915 🔗

Never mind, just use the Power Of The Mask.

141571 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to DRW, 2, #1526 of 1915 🔗

With the articles circulating about how English speakers spread aerosols more than any other language, perhaps we will be required to wear masks whenever we talk.

141604 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Richard O, 7, #1527 of 1915 🔗

I feel sorry for influenzas viruses – they are simply getting ignored

141565 ▶▶ Dave #KBF, replying to Basics, 1, #1529 of 1915 🔗

Wasn’t there a T&T contact in Lanarkshire also responsible for an outbreak?

Clever cv19, it can travel over phone lines.

141598 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to Dave #KBF, #1530 of 1915 🔗

Yes. I forgot to add. You are right track trace and catch your own.

H&S always did go on about office workstations being grim reapers with a keyboard on top.

141567 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 6, #1531 of 1915 🔗

Latest update on hospital stats for England (I cannot fathom the Scots & Welsh stats)
Total number of Covid 19 patients in hospital 21st Sept 1261 14th Sept 783
i.e. an increase of 478 60% in 1 week
During this week there were around 200 people a day admitted to hospital for Covid 19 so around 1400 for the week. So by deduction that must mean around 900 were discharged from hospital.
These hospital stats do beg many more questions but I do not have the information to address them?
But I would say this all seems like the ordinary ebb & flow of hospital data for a disease that is just ticking along, certainly nothing here to justify lockdown actions.

141582 ▶▶ PFD, replying to Steve Martindale, 8, #1532 of 1915 🔗

It’s important to realise these are not admissions for COVID, but admissions of (i) people who tested positive in the 14 day period before admission, or (ii) who tested positive whilst in hospital. All conditions will be classified under a COVID admission. An interesting question is what fraction of the total admissions do they represent?

141589 ▶▶▶ Bumble, replying to PFD, 3, #1533 of 1915 🔗

Absolutely, so you might need a stent inserted and have had a positive test. In and out of hospital quickly. No treatment for covid. We need to know numbers being treated for covid in normal wards and icu.

141593 ▶▶▶ dpj, replying to PFD, 2, #1534 of 1915 🔗

It could also be a false postive or they were actually ill 3 months ago so like most covid stats can’t trust them 100%.

141599 ▶▶▶ PFD, replying to PFD, 2, #1535 of 1915 🔗

There are about 141,000 hospital beds in England. So 783 patients testing positive is a little over 2%. This is similar to the number of positive pillar 1 and 2 tests – mostly asymptomatic and a very large fraction of false positives. I suspect the number of patients is simply tracking the overall test results and doesn’t reflect a true rise in symptomatic COVID cases requiring treatment.

141605 ▶▶▶▶ PFD, replying to PFD, 2, #1536 of 1915 🔗

Oops….did my sums incorrectly! Should be 0.5% and not 2%.

141595 ▶▶ Telpin, replying to Steve Martindale, 5, #1537 of 1915 🔗

Relevant question is how many are seriously ill, how many in hospital for other reasons ( ie could be inpatients regardless of co Vid), how stats compare with admissions for other respiratory illnesses and crucially, what’s the capacity ( which will be regional)

141752 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Telpin, #1538 of 1915 🔗

I agree the basic stats beg many more questions but I do not know where to find the answers?

141626 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #1539 of 1915 🔗

Does it likely just reflect the restart of procedures since early September. Everyone needs to be tested on entry. If the test is positive, they will be discharged having not had the procedure, but the positive test will remain in the system tagged to an admission?

141647 ▶▶ NickR, replying to Steve Martindale, 8, #1540 of 1915 🔗
  • 65% of ‘Covid’ hospital patients only tested positive for covid when already an inpatient in hospital.
  • 50% of care home residents are in care homes that have had an outbreak of coronavirus so many of these people will fail a 40Ct PCR test.
  • 700 care home residents die each day with or without Covid.
  • 200 x 90 = 18,000, so, assuming the 200 deaths per day are additional to the 1,700 that normally die every day we can expect a pretty normal ‘excess winter deaths’ total for winter 20/21. There were over 50,000 in 2017/18 & we didn’t crash the economy for them.
  • The NHS won’t be releasing any new detailed hospital admission data for about 3 weeks so we can’t get much of a handle at a granular level on what’s going on until then….. & I don’t believe the bollox Whitty & co put out.
141683 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to NickR, 1, #1541 of 1915 🔗

Great stats! Where did you get the first one from, about the % that only tested positive when already inpatient? Not seen that before..

141976 ▶▶▶▶ NickR, replying to Carrie, #1542 of 1915 🔗

It’s from the monthly Hospital Admissions NHS data. In total since March 23rd 82% of covid patients were only diagnosed once already inpatients in hospital. Remembering that 40% of deaths occurred outside hospitals it seems likely that only about 10% of all covid fatalities came from outside the care system or people being cared for at home.
This has been posted several times.

141698 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to NickR, 4, #1543 of 1915 🔗

The first point is crucial. We have a normal influx of people into hospital into the winter, and many of these won’t have otherwise been tested. So now they are using our dodgy PCR tests, and are chalked up as admissions for Covid-19 even though they are flu patients for example.

141572 Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, 32, #1544 of 1915 🔗

AND ANOTHER THING
I have to mention the poor old lady we saw tonight walking into town, in her late 80’s pushing a shopping cart, miles away from any shops, out in the open, looking so frail, so scared, with her face nappy on, staggering along the road..

Mrs 2-6 burst out in tears when she saw her.

Lets not let THIS go down the memory hole.

The people who have done this to us are just EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

141592 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to Two-Six, 6, #1545 of 1915 🔗

And that lot won’t care one little bit.

141644 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Two-Six, 7, #1546 of 1915 🔗

Have seen this same scene many times. Your rehemency in revulsion is echoed in me.

Folk so frail to approach as a stranger to offer kindness would cause more harm than good.

Where there has been eye contact I make a point of doing what I can. Somehow ever are so far away in loneliness it is heartbreaking. Their spirit keeps them going.

Do not forget. Cannot forget the people I have seen.

141585 Basics, replying to Basics, 22, #1547 of 1915 🔗

Because this thought has merit now

Neil Clark
@NeilClark66
·
9h
We are on the brink of a genuinely populist rising in Britain. And it will take down not just Whitty & Vallance & pro-lockdown Tories like Hancock but Sturgeon, Labour & other authoritarian ‘New Normal‘ ‘progressives’ too. People have had enough. #NoNewNormal #NoMoreLockdowns

https://twitter.com/NeilClark66/status/1307975634187157504?s=20

141817 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Basics, 2, #1548 of 1915 🔗

This needs to be pushed too:

https://twitter.com/conscious2/status/1307987663924998144

Trafalgar Square – 26th September – Noon

We need to fill the area. The Square holds 35,000. The more the merrier. BUT PLEASE BE WARNED: we do NOT expect the Police to play nice.

141594 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 8, #1549 of 1915 🔗

If anyone gets overly stressed with all this bollocks please search and watch ”the joy of painting” by Bob Ross, it was on in the background and fcuk me I’m in a comma – marvellous…

141603 ▶▶ B Boru, replying to Major Panic, 5, #1550 of 1915 🔗

The old 2inch brush….purdy little cabins and big STRONG trees and mountains.

Lets have some fun….let’s go up here now

It’s your world! You’re gonna have to make some big decisions now!!

Love Bob….Legend 🙂

141611 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to B Boru, 5, #1551 of 1915 🔗

Don’t forget his happy little trees!

141645 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to DRW, 1, #1552 of 1915 🔗

my favourite is the water lines he puts in with the knife….scrape it right into that canvas..the canvas is strong, it can take it.

Also love how the mountains just appear when he drags the knife down with that little roll of paint on the end that you cut across to get 😉

Magical 🙂

Reminds me of Tony Hart as well….gentlemen in the truest sense of the word.

141616 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Major Panic, 5, #1553 of 1915 🔗

Big favourite in the TT household. Mr TT suffers from a number of health conditions meaning he often gets up at night and he watches ‘whispering’ Bob Ross and NHK Japanese tv – helps him get back to sleep!

141919 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Major Panic, #1554 of 1915 🔗

If you get ASMR he’s brilliant. I used to get it as a kid with Painting with Nancy and her spatula.

Funny how Bob was in the army and vowed never to raise his voice when he left. Hence the whisper

141609 tonys, replying to tonys, 23, #1555 of 1915 🔗

Walking along the riverside in Knaresborough today we noticed a woman of about seventy walking towards us and a family group in front, gesticulating wildly, it turned out she was ‘shooing’ us all out of the way so that no one in the fresh sunny air came within several yards of her. The expression on the poor woman’s face was utterly abject, she just looked really, really scared, it was a terrible sobering reminder of just how much of a job our government and media have done between them on on so many innocent and vulnerable people. I didn’t resent this poor woman or feel anger towards her I just felt so sorry that she had been terrorised in this way, the people responsible deserve to rot in jail as far as I am concerned.

141625 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to tonys, 24, #1556 of 1915 🔗

There’s one like this around my way, and she is extremely aggressive and unpleasant. I’ve been trying to manoeuvre myself so that she steps off the pavement and into the path of oncoming traffic. Unsuccessful so far.

141803 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, 2, #1557 of 1915 🔗

Richard, you and my dog are the only two souls who make me laugh at least once each day! Says a lot about who I’ve become now that the idea of you pushing someone into traffic is something I find funny.

141641 ▶▶ leggy, replying to tonys, 20, #1558 of 1915 🔗

So sad. My 18 year old daughter told me that one of her school friends has just killed himself. I will never forgive these humans for what they are putting people through.

141665 ▶▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to leggy, 5, #1559 of 1915 🔗

That is heart breaking. This government have so much blood on their hands and they try to tell us that all these measures are for our own good.

141697 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to leggy, 7, #1560 of 1915 🔗

Very sad to hear. They are doing far more damage to us youngsters than this hyped up cold.

141613 Leemc23, replying to Leemc23, 30, #1561 of 1915 🔗

Been to a socially distanced funeral this afternoon. The loss of humanity in that circumstance and environment is awful. Thanks to the Government for making something horrible even worse.

141614 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to Leemc23, 13, #1562 of 1915 🔗

Yes they are cruel bastards. They know what they are doing. Cruel, evil bastards.

141669 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Leemc23, 10, #1563 of 1915 🔗

The level of psychopathy to inflict this on funerals is off the charts. I guess we now know the true nature of our enemy though. We are dealing with nothing short of Satanic forces here. You may not believe in Satan, but they sure as shit do.

141756 ▶▶▶ Lili, replying to Richard O, 3, #1564 of 1915 🔗

It took me a long time to get this. It’s not about whether or not WE believe in it, if they do then it’s THAT what counts.

141777 ▶▶▶▶ B Boru, replying to Lili, #1565 of 1915 🔗

My Grampa used to say….

“The greatest trick the devil pulled was convincing the world he doesn’t exist”

My Grampa was an SOE operative during ww2, spent rest of his early career in intelligence circles following that and then civil service….he knew what he was talking about!

141639 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to arfurmo, 15, #1567 of 1915 🔗

I will not forgive or forget this fucker’s contribution. He was one of the first public figures to start lobbying for masks in shops. He will get his wish of course, Johnson already has it written in his speech tomorrow.

141688 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to arfurmo, 3, #1568 of 1915 🔗

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3676570

…wearing a facial mask outside work increased probability of COVID-19 infection

141701 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Tee Ell, 2, #1569 of 1915 🔗

So that is why they want people to wear them!

141781 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to arfurmo, 1, #1570 of 1915 🔗

He’s another evil b’stard!

141798 ▶▶ Yawnyaman, replying to arfurmo, 2, #1571 of 1915 🔗

He is the ultimate picture of hypocrisy, someone who feels he is making people’s lives better by making them worse.

141804 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to arfurmo, 3, #1572 of 1915 🔗

The Met Police wear them outdoors, especially when “interacting” with dirty, unwashed, plague-ridden, anti-lockdown protestors!

141620 Liam, replying to Liam, 36, #1573 of 1915 🔗

Apologies for this, but I just feel outright hatred for our wretched political and social establishment right now. They make me feel physically sick when I see their ugly, stupid faces.

141651 ▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to Liam, 9, #1574 of 1915 🔗

You do not need to apologise. I commented earlier that I can’t stand to look at them, and the contempt that I feel is something I haven’t felt before in my many years on this planet. I was talking to my son earlier who has never heard his dear old mum swear like a navvy.

141656 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Liam, 15, #1575 of 1915 🔗

Yes, these cunts never wear masks (of course) so we see their fucking faces every day.

141666 ▶▶▶ Jules, replying to Richard O, 9, #1576 of 1915 🔗

They are loathsome. They are revelling in the death, pain, loneliness, and misery that they are inflicting on the British people. No need to apologise, Liam.

141667 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Richard O, 5, #1577 of 1915 🔗

Yes, did you see the photo on Simon Dolan’s Twitter today? No social distancing and no masks…

141675 ▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Richard O, 6, #1578 of 1915 🔗

They don’t need to now.

The Daily Mail have been photoshopping masks on all the great and good all day. Risible if not a little sinister.

141835 ▶▶ DomW, replying to Liam, 3, #1579 of 1915 🔗

No need to apologise Liam, Today has been a rough day for a lot of us.

I had some pretty colourful thoughts just now regarding an imaginary interaction scenario with Sadist Khan when I read that he wants muzzles in all public spaces in London. The scenario was dark and didnt end well for him but I felt much better afterwards.

It’s natural to feel hatred at times like these, but for me it’s important to try and vent it in a non-destructive way to avoid it being misdirected, especially towards myself!

141622 JHuntz, replying to JHuntz, 7, #1580 of 1915 🔗

You know I find myself not caring one iota about those vulnerable to the virus, particularly those that use it to justify keeping these restrictions in place. Am I wrong, any help rationalising this thought process???

141630 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to JHuntz, 14, #1581 of 1915 🔗

You are not alone. I have nothing but disdain for anyone who is still taking this seriously. For the destruction of civilisation and humanity that they are helping to bring about, they are just as evil as the perpetrators at the top. Order followers have more moral culpability for wrongdoing than order givers.

141677 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to JHuntz, 5, #1582 of 1915 🔗

A large number of them are on board with that too. You look after you, I’ll do me.

They want their lives back.

141753 ▶▶ John, replying to JHuntz, 4, #1583 of 1915 🔗

Good. I am apparently vulnerable to the virus: I’m over 70. Tomorrow I’m going mountain biking over difficult terrain on volcanoes. I’ve got m