2020-10-12

Sourcehttps://lockdownsceptics.org/2020/10/12/latest-news-160/
Published2020-10-12T01:28:04
Last updated2020-10-12T09:09:38
Scraped2020-12-20T20:18:07
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180957 1stJamie, replying to 1stJamie, 25, #1 of 2192 🔗

first time I’ve posted

181017 ▶▶ Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to 1stJamie, 25, #2 of 2192 🔗

Tom Jefferson and Carl Heneghan
What does the Covid data really tell us?
11 October 2020, 8:00am
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/what-does-the-covid-data-really-tell-us-

Another week has passed with more restrictions piled on – but as lockdown measures become ever more restrictive, the demand for evidence grows. Sir Keir Starmer, for instance, has asked to see evidence for new lockdown measures. In mid-August, Andy Burnham called on the government not to put Oldham into lockdown as Sir Richard Leese, the lead for health in Greater Manchester, pointed out that there is ‘no evidence’ that additional lockdown measures would improve the chances of halting the virus.

Tomorrow, we’re told, there will be more restrictions still. But on what grounds?

The main evidence presented to us by the government is the new daily total for new Covid infections. But how severe are the cases? Severity can be assessed quantitatively starting from the clearest and unquestionable outcome – death. But even there, the evidence is not clear. Is a ‘Covid death’ someone killed by the virus, or someone who died from other reasons who also had the virus?

Our understanding of ‘Covid deaths’

Evidence from Italy casts new light on this. ISTAT, Italy’s national statistics institute, and Istituto Superiore di Sanità (ISS), an Italian health authority, published a report on the impact of Covid-19 deaths recorded up to the 16 July. They found 28 per cent of death certificates they studied have Covid-19 as the only cause of death. The remainder, over two thirds, are deaths with Covid: i.e. people with preexisting conditions such as hypertension, diabetes, heart disease and cancer. Often with more than one condition in the same person. So the figure for ‘Covid deaths’ in this instance will be almost four times as big as the number who died from Covid.

An ONS report of deaths involving Covid-19 in England and Wales in June paints a similar picture: ‘Of the deaths involving Covid-19 that occurred in England and Wales in March to June 2020, there was at least one pre-existing condition in 91 per cent of cases.’ Unlike Italy, dementia and Alzheimer’s disease was the most common pre-existing condition found among Covid deaths.

A recent update by the ISS shows that 59 per cent of Italy’s 36,000 deaths were amongst the over-80s. In August, the age of those who died with Covid shifted significantly towards the very elderly. In other words, cases are getting younger but deaths over the summer and early autumn are getting older. In traditional pandemic theory, deaths among the young should increase and several studies have demonstrated this age shift in deaths to younger populations. The major prevention strategies should therefore focus on older people – and not younger people – to minimize the loss to expected years of life.

Since the 1 August just over a thousand Covid deaths have been registered in England and Wales, most amongst the over 80s. (And one in five in the over 90s.) So Covid appears to have been – in the great majority of cases – a cofactor which tipped the frail and elderly. The current fixation on the daily diet of infection numbers is not helping anyone. Basing what happens next on comparisons with figures from the day before is leading to more anxiety, and ever-increasing restrictions. We’re told that hospital admissions are near capacity and can only get worse with hospitals in the north of England running out of Covid beds within a week. But, again we are left wondering: who is being admitted? And what for? The poor quality of data makes it very hard to gather a clear understanding.

Let’s look at people catching the virus in hospital. Using NHS England data, we estimated the probable number of those catching Covid-19 in hospital – known as Healthcare Associated Infections (HCAIs). We found for the most recent date of reporting, on 6 October, over 18 per cent of hospitalisations were being diagnosed after over seven days in hospital. Such patients are highly likely to have caught the virus in hospital, given that they were not diagnosed with it upon entry.

Hospital-acquired Covid infection appears to be particularly notable in the North West, where 17 per cent in the last week and 24 per cent on 6 October of the newly admitted patients who were subsequently tested, were positive with Covid-19. So they were probably HCAIs.

This is an obvious danger if you mix Covid patients together with non-Covid patients. Yet, little has been done to invest in ‘fever hospitals’ that could isolate Covid patients and help prevent the in-hospital spread of infection – keeping our hospitals open for the routine care that is so badly needed.

To talk about Covid ‘cases’ and draw international comparisons is also misleading as ‘cases’ has man

181131 ▶▶▶ Jane in France, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 37, #3 of 2192 🔗

The student son of a friend of mine went to stay with some people in Oxford a couple of weeks ago. Some of them felt unwell, were tested for covid and tested positive. The next day my friend’s son also felt shivery and headachy and he too turned out to be positive. My friend’s husband is in his seventies, though very fit and my friend had chemo for bowel cancer two years ago. She doesn’t seem worried about the boy, who is already feeling better, but since she and her husband could be considered “vulnerable” she doesn’t want him coming home till he tests negative. At one time that type of symptom would probably have been put down as freshers’ flu. Mum and Dad might well have told the boy to stay away since they didn’t want to catch it. It would never have occurred to them that they could die from it. Is freshers’ flu with covid likely to be more deadly to your relations? Am I going too far in continuing to believe that without the covid label and the test nobody would have noticed anything different about this year’s return to university?

182209 ▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Jane in France, 16, #4 of 2192 🔗

Nevermind this year’s return to university, I don’t think anyone would have noticed anything different about 2020 at all were it not for the MSM and government’s hysterical overreaction.

182222 ▶▶▶▶ MyHomeIsMyCastle, replying to Jane in France, 8, #5 of 2192 🔗

We now know that covid was circulating weeks before anybody was really aware of it, so it clearly didn’t cause any issues that made the medical profession really sit up and take notice.

182754 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to MyHomeIsMyCastle, 5, #6 of 2192 🔗

Covid-19, whatever it is, only became a problem only after the government decided to act against it. Government is the problem.

182748 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Jane in France, 3, #7 of 2192 🔗

You are not going too far and are almost certainly not going far enough.

181668 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 9, #8 of 2192 🔗

”More restrictions – but on what grounds?” On the grounds that ‘They’ need to keep everyone under control while promising them a vaccine will soon appear, so that the take-up will make it worthwhile. After all:
Hopeful people are more easily controlled, but the volume must be managed. Too much hope leaves a person emboldened and resistant. Too little leaves them disabled and useless. But just the right amount of hope subjugates them. They cradle it like a dying ember, and they’ll do anything to keep the wind from extinguishing it…..”

181033 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to 1stJamie, 16, #9 of 2192 🔗

Welcome jamie

181045 ▶▶ Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to 1stJamie, 64, #10 of 2192 🔗

Not all ‘cases’ of Covid are created equal
Ministers are starting from highly questionable assumptions
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/12/not-cases-covid-created-equal/
telegraphnews/2020/10/12/not-cases-covid-created-equal/
DR JOHN LEE
12 October 2020 • 7:00am
Dr John Lee
It is a commonplace of science, medicine and everyday life that in order to solve a problem you must first of all frame it correctly. If you ask the right questions, finding solutions can be straightforward. But if you ask the wrong ones you can grope in the dark forever. So having the right perspective really matters.

Unfortunately, the Government’s Covid approach has all the hallmarks of groping in the dark. In the name of “keeping everyone safe” we have endured local and national lockdowns, social distancing, masks, curfews, shutting cafés and pubs. Now we face further restrictions, based on naive modelling and virtually no evidence.

Our societal response doesn’t seem to have advanced much since 1665, the year of the Great Plague. Getting the framing wrong then cost many lives. If you believe (as people did) that plague is caused by corrupted air, not by a bacterium, you will take the wrong actions and make things worse. The authorities locked ill people in their homes with all who lived there, increasing overall mortality several-fold. Believing, paradoxically, that dogs and cats spread the plague, they arranged widespread culls, facilitating spread through a burgeoning rat population and their attendant fleas.

Funnily enough, Covid is actually carried on the air, so at least we have understood that bit correctly. But there has been a dangerous mission-creep since March. Then we were told a three-week lockdown was needed to stop the NHS being overwhelmed. But this has metamorphosed from the ugly caterpillar of protecting the NHS into the even uglier maggot of controlling case numbers. The wrong framing is that “case numbers” are being equated with “positive” tests.

What is a “case” of Covid? Let’s say you developed a viral cold last winter. Were you a “case” of a viral respiratory infection? On a theoretical level the answer must be yes. But on a practical, real-world level, the answer is no: you went to work and carried on with life. You were invisible to the authorities. Let’s say it got a bit worse and you saw your GP. Still no. You decided to take a couple of days off. Still no – you might show up in sick leave statistics, but not as a case of respiratory infection. If you got so far as being admitted to hospital with serious illness, you would show up as a “case” – a tiny proportion of those who actually had the illness.

The contrast with today is clear. Covid was made a notifiable disease in February, obliging all “cases” to be reported to the authorities. Since the only way to identify Covid is with a lab test, positive tests have been equated with positive “cases”. Back then, it was claimed there were no asymptomatic cases, but we now know that 90 per cent or more of people have Covid asymptomatically. A positive test is clearly not a positive “case”.

We also know that Covid affects different groups of people very differently: there is a thousand-fold difference in the severity of the disease between young and old. So the meaning of a positive test cannot be equated with its meaning in March, because the incidence of the disease at present has a completely different demographic.

Then there’s the issue of the tests themselves. Plausible false positive rates make up a substantial proportion of “positives” as unverified mass testing is rapidly rolled out. There is profound uncertainty around what low viral titres – found in a high proportion of young asymptomatic people – mean. Most probably very low infectivity. T-cell (as opposed to antibody) testing indicates that many people already have resistance to the virus. The more we know about this virus, the more it is like viruses we are already familiar with.

And yet, the Government is looking for an easy way out of the complex mass of restrictions they have devised; “control” the “cases” and wait for a vaccine to save the day. Unfortunately the former is a classic example of rubbish in, rubbish out, and the latter is unlikely to happen effectively, given previous attempts.

It’s time for the Government to start asking the right questions; framing things in the light of accumulating evidence, not unexamined preconceptions. On that basis, the course we should be taking is clear: asymptomatic spread is good. Advise and help the very elderly and those with serious illnesses to shield if they wish – but do not compel them, it’s their life, after all. And let everyone else get completely back to normal.

181397 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #11 of 2192 🔗

The Black Death was not bubonic plague. Why are people still pushing this falsehood?

181574 ▶▶▶▶ Iansn, replying to Steve Hayes, 2, #12 of 2192 🔗
181957 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Iansn, 1, #13 of 2192 🔗

Probably a viral infection, something similar to ebola. See W.H.McNeill’s Plagues and Peoples.

182211 ▶▶▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Iansn, 2, #14 of 2192 🔗

As I recall from A Level history, the black death was pneumonic plague.

182195 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Steve Hayes, #15 of 2192 🔗

Because most people don’t know. And isn’t it still under some debate??

181690 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 5, #16 of 2192 🔗

Thanks for reproducing that. The paragraphs about ”cases” needs to be disseminated far and wide.
This use of the word ”cases” is playing the government’s ”be afraid” game, in order to keep scared witless the Terminally Terrified.
We should just called them ”infections” and leave it at that – and point out they’re results (often dodgy) from healthy people.

182188 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 7, #17 of 2192 🔗

I’d say it’s even worse.
If you had a cold, and got over it after a few days, got tested a month later and the PCR test picked up some dead virus particles, under the current scenario, you’d be counted as a “case”.

182802 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Lms23, 3, #18 of 2192 🔗

And you’d be quarantined along with your contacts. What a fiasco!

181061 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to 1stJamie, 6, #19 of 2192 🔗

Welcome

181126 ▶▶ 1stJamie, replying to 1stJamie, 62, #20 of 2192 🔗

I’ve been reading LS comments for probably over a couple of months now. Thanks to all of you for helping me keep my sanity fully intact, in knowing I’m not alone with my anger, frustration and insomnia.
The information supplied by this website has been briiliant for proving what any sane, normal human being should be feeling and how they should be reacting to this manmedia made hysteria.
Sorry, I’m sounding like a bit of a snowflake, I can assure you I’m not. Just a very pissed off sheep farmer.
Just about to write another email to my MP, regarding PCR test and cycle thresholds.
I wonder when we’ll be allowed to know the amplification answer to this??
It was over 10 years before the 2001 Foot and Mouth Inquiry proved it was wrong to contiguous slaughter over 6,000,000 of the UK’s livestock.

181288 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to 1stJamie, 19, #21 of 2192 🔗

Excellent, we have a sheep expert on-board, this could be very useful indeed. Perhaps we can finally work out why they do what they do.

181320 ▶▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to 1stJamie, 7, #22 of 2192 🔗

There’s nothing snowflakey about a sheep farmer! Welcome, Jamie.

181356 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to 1stJamie, 8, #23 of 2192 🔗

Good luck with your MP!
I wrote this to mine last week:

In March 2020 NHS England set the covid 19 PCR positive test cycle threshold: https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/wp-content/uploads/sites/52/2020/03/guidance-and-sop-covid-19-virus-testing-in-nhs-laboratories-v1.pdf
This official guidance appears to state (on Page 21) that 45 cycles are undertaken.
It also says that a positive result at or above 40 cycles , requires the following:-
“Results where: •the Ct value is ≥40 and/or •there is an abnormal assay curve and/or •the clinical context makes the positive result highly unexpected should be considered interim or held until reviewed by a laboratory clinician. Laboratories will undertake the following actions: •defer telephoning the uncertain result to the clinician looking after the patient (or telephoning it with the clear caveat of uncertainty) •re-extract the original sample and repeat the PCR in the original and new extract in duplicate •perform testing on a further respiratory sample (or samples) from the same patient •confirmwith an alternative, equivalent sensitivity assay locally or,where none is available, forward the sample to Colindale •regularly review the performance of reagents, particularly control materials.The actions taken should be expedited to minimise the delay in obtaining a definitive result for the patient. Only confirmed results are expected to be notified to public health and other stakeholders.”
(My bolding.)
I take it that the clinical context makes the positive result highly unexpected means no clinical symptoms, ie asymptomatic.
So that means only a positive at 35 or below should be automatically considered a positive. Anything at 40 or above must be followed by the double checks (as detailed above) before public health is notified.
Given the government’s clear determination to lock down the entire North of England as soon as ppossible, despite overwhelming evidence that these measures don’t work, I’d be very grateful if you would answer these two questions please:
– In the madly expensive rush to test everyone and his dog, do you know if pillar 2 testing is complying with the NHS official guidance?
– Reliable evidence is fast appearing that students are currently being double-counted in both their uni and home towns. Is this being amended?
Below is a report of the problems with repeated positive tests (no doubt each counted as separate “cases”.) I’ve reproduced the abstract for your convenience.
https://ir.library.louisville.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1160&context=jri

He replied that, as a backbencher he wasn’t privy to that information.
Hopefully it made him think a bit though!

181502 ▶▶▶▶ 1stJamie, replying to Cheezilla, 9, #24 of 2192 🔗

Thanks Cheezilla

Very useful info

I’ve already seen the March NHS link and already sent it to my MP.
I’m not holding any hope I’ll get answers.
The PCR test is now the virus. Until the cycle threshold of each positive test is included and made publicly available. We will all be held hostage in our own country. Even after we are all put in a sheep race: vaccinated and ear tagged

181928 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to 1stJamie, 4, #25 of 2192 🔗

It’s a great site isn’t it. So pleased you’ve been reading and now you are commenting. Warmest welcome.

181963 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to 1stJamie, 6, #26 of 2192 🔗

It must be nice to spend time with intelligent animals like sheep, as opposed to zombies.

182212 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to 1stJamie, 2, #27 of 2192 🔗

HI Jamie. Welcome to the BTL! Sue/AngloWelshDragon (I post as either depending where I am logged on)

182829 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to 1stJamie, 1, #28 of 2192 🔗

You can be near certain that they are over amplifying the cycles, anything over 40 is dodgy and the rumour is they use 45, which renders the PCR test meaningless. However, the test is fatally flawed from the outset regardless of cycles, as it supposedly looking for RNA fragments from Sars-cov-2, a virus which has never been isolated and has yet to be proven to actually exist.

So what are they actually looking for and how do they know these particular fragments belong to the elusive Sars-cov-2. Of course, the answer is they don’t know, but that doesn’t matter one jot, as long as the positive “cases” keep piling up the agenda is being furthered.

181160 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to 1stJamie, 4, #29 of 2192 🔗

And very impressive you’re first today to post too! – but you must be up all night to secure such success.

181183 ▶▶▶ 1stJamie, replying to Ned of the Hills, 9, #30 of 2192 🔗

It’s tupping time

181249 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to 1stJamie, 1, #31 of 2192 🔗

The slow appearance of your first post was just because first posts are moderated

182866 ▶▶▶▶ GadgetGal, replying to 1stJamie, 1, #32 of 2192 🔗

Great excuse! Love your post. This is my first post ever, but this site has kept me sane. Every govt. scaremongering briefing eventually has be returning here for a dose of sanity. 🙂

181185 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #33 of 2192 🔗

Or in a different time zone.

181241 ▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to 1stJamie, 1, #34 of 2192 🔗

Excellent – welcome!

181968 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 6, #36 of 2192 🔗

And why is this colossal, murderous scandal not headlined in every newspaper, discussed on every news programme, a burning issue in Parliament… as it would be in a democracy?

182842 ▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to annie, 3, #37 of 2192 🔗

It’s called corruption.

182813 ▶▶ Biker, replying to 1stJamie, 3, #38 of 2192 🔗

Stop with the one post, get out while you still can.

183022 ▶▶▶ 1stJamie, replying to Biker, 1, #39 of 2192 🔗

get out to where?
Sweden?
Think I’ll stick around.
The fixed term parliament act kicks in again in 4 years.

180959 BJJ, replying to BJJ, 8, #40 of 2192 🔗

Hello all!

180981 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to BJJ, 2, #41 of 2192 🔗

And a very good morning to you

180990 ▶▶ Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to BJJ, 16, #42 of 2192 🔗

Sweden deaths (Worldometers) 7 day rolling average 1 a day

180960 BobT, replying to BobT, 43, #43 of 2192 🔗

There is a West Indian saying that goes “Well, if you do not know, you just don’t know”.

In the Y2K debacle, there were hundreds or thousands of people making dire predictions about what would happen at the turn of the clocks at the turn of the century but all of them just did not know, they were guessing, because nobody actually understood the computer code. Back then there was a simple way to find out. In the last days of 1999 I reset all the clocks on my computers along with some factory automation controllers to 1/1/2000 to test them and see what happened. Well, as we all know, nothing did.

Here we find ourselves, 20 years later, in the same situation where nobody knows what is going on with the PCR testing. Questions have been raised by Professors, FOI requests have been submitted to Government, questions have been made in Parliament but yet nobody can answer what the false positive rate is, whether a positive test result is for live or dead virus particles, whether a positive test result implies infectiousness or not. Nobody seems to know and if someone does it must be a closely guarded classified state secret.

I do not need to repeat the the damage being done to the human race by following PCR test data which nobody actually knows the details of, the algorithms which decide a positive or a negative or anything else. We just do not know.

Until we do know this, we are all lambs to the slaughter.

180988 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to BobT, 12, #44 of 2192 🔗

They are still getting it wrong, a couple of years ago I was told by a computer generated letter that I had to renew something because I had last renewed it in 1899. 🤦‍♂️

182863 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to karenovirus, 1, #45 of 2192 🔗

The library near me is a lot stricter that.

181164 ▶▶ RichT, replying to BobT, 4, #46 of 2192 🔗

I have been reminding people of the Y2K bullshit printed in all the tabloids. Stuff like “planes will drop from the sky”, Nuclear power stations would stop working” and even “your washing machine could stop working”.

I was a computer engineer at the time and saw that most of this was just hype, there were pretty easy workarounds for most problems. Washing machines had a realtime clock in them, but it was not used for anything except timing the wash (they did not know what the date was).

Reading the comments in this Have your say article, back then it seems that BBC readers were Y2K zealots.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/586938.stm

181193 ▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to RichT, 3, #47 of 2192 🔗

Rich, I beg to differ. Perhaps you didn’t have problems here in the UK, but I worked in the US, and we had many programs with a two-year date in them.

181203 ▶▶▶▶ RichT, replying to ConstantBees, 4, #48 of 2192 🔗

Sure there were things that needed fixing, but it was all over-hyped. As I said, for the most part the workarounds were pretty straightforward.
It may have kept you busy for a while, but it was not the end of the world.

Newspaper headlines should have been “computer programmers work tirelssly to fix date problems” not “planes will drop from the sky”

I had loads of people come into my computer shop, worried their computers would stop working. they would not stop working just display the wrong date. A simple dos program inserted into startup fixed this in minutes.

181469 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to RichT, -1, #49 of 2192 🔗

As I said, for the most part the workarounds were pretty straightforward.

This is a tabloid-esque degree of superficiality.

Business critical systems, national security systems, ‘risk-to-life’ systems, etc. could not be left running without analysis, amendment where needed, and testing. Most of the problems I remember (long time ago !) were in week/month/year-end routines, where date comparisons were more frequent.

Individual PCs were not a big deal, but multi-linked complex systems required work, if only to be as sure as possible they would carry on working.

182869 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to JohnB, #50 of 2192 🔗

But hardly that much more work, than systems people should be used to.

181997 ▶▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to RichT, 1, #51 of 2192 🔗

I worked for a large engineering company which started thinking about Y2K in 1990. Around 1997 they made available a software wraparound “trans-century date simulator” to test what needed to be done. In most cases the only issue was display of dates for information. More care was needed where calculations were done with dates, e.g. the time interval between events. Various date and time routines embedded within company software were identified as needing to be updated to cope with four-digit year numbers rather than two-digit, and once that was done everything worked fine.

181232 ▶▶▶ Mel, replying to RichT, 8, #52 of 2192 🔗

Me too.I work for a major UK bank. We had a dedicated test cell, where we moved system dates back and forth over the “scary date” and…..nothing went wrong at all. We found only one issue with our (ancient) payroll and HR system, that was patched by 1998. Total non-event. I earned a lot of overtime though, and it bought me my first house in 1997.

181481 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mel, #53 of 2192 🔗

Were your years already four digits ? By the mid/late 90s, new systems tended to be.

Now wishing I’d kept bug reports of the issues – I could write a book ! 🙂

(Best to declare an interest, the overtime was indeed very welcome.),

181312 ▶▶▶ Richard Brooks, replying to RichT, 2, #54 of 2192 🔗

It was even bigger than that.

Several articles I read said everything with a microchip would be affected! Funnily enough the guitar amp I bought in 1992 still works fine.

As a Mechanical Engineer I was involved in checking all the PCs we used where I worked. We simply set the date to Feb 2000 then ran everything to see what happened. However that got me into trouble with the MD who had been told by experts that simply setting the date forward was very dangerous and the software code should be reviewed instead!

181495 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard Brooks, #55 of 2192 🔗

We simply set the date to Feb 2000 then ran everything to see what happened.

On your live system ? This is usually not an option for financial, stock control, sales, personnel, etc. systems.

181599 ▶▶▶▶▶ Iansn, replying to JohnB, 1, #56 of 2192 🔗

thats what test systems are for, any bank or large would have a near complete replica of their systems to test upgrades and system patcthes which ALL need to be tested against a copy of a live system before the upgrade is actually performed. Patches are a fairly regular event, but can still go horribly wrong.

181925 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Iansn, #57 of 2192 🔗

I am all too aware of this, ian. Presumably you are informing others ? 🙂

181360 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to RichT, 4, #58 of 2192 🔗

We had a stock control system, ironically named “Millennium”, that was not Y2K compliant. The company was only concerned that its mainframe remained intact and that sales software would continue to work. We mere warehouse operatives had to make do with a temporary paper ledger system.

In the event, it wasn’t needed.

Two of us came in that Saturday morning especially to check the computer. The year was wrong. Badly wrong. It had gone from 31st December 1999 to 1st January 19100.

181499 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #59 of 2192 🔗

Heh. Separate century and year fields. 🙂

181443 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to RichT, 1, #60 of 2192 🔗

The Y2K agenda seems to have been –
beforehand, It Will Be the End of the World.
afterwards, Nothing Happened, Complete Waste of Time/Effort.

I’d suggest the truth is somewhere in between.

Easy workarounds for most problems maybe, but the remainder ?!?

181191 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to BobT, 5, #61 of 2192 🔗

As a former programmer, I can assure you that lots of my colleagues worked endless hours fixing programs so that they would work properly. The problem wasn’t that everything would cease working, it was that a large, but unknown, number of programs used a two-year date instead of a four-year date. My colleagues and I wrote program that way ourselves until the problem was recognised. Then it became necessary to review code and find where two-year dates were used.

Now the PCR test is another thing altogether.

181209 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to BobT, 3, #62 of 2192 🔗

I tried the argument about the PCR test picking up dead fragments of the virus with my lockdown zealot family and was told that this means that people have had the virus. To which I responded ‘great, that means they are no longer infectious’. I was then told that there is no other means of detecting whether the presence of the virus is live or dead and therefore the PCR test has to be used regardless of the consequences.

181393 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Ewan Duffy, #63 of 2192 🔗

I wonder what they’d have done without the PCR test!

181492 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #64 of 2192 🔗

“I wonder what they’d have done without the PCR test!”

They would have failed miserably to spin this out.
That’s why the PCR test was prepared well ahead of time!
In reality, it was essentially an 8 week mini-demic, already in rapid decline before any lockdown measures.
Which in itself, is rather a strange phenomenon, and lends considerable weight to my hypothesis that this virus self-attenuated rapidly (either by design or quirk of nature). Way too quick for collective immunity.
We shouldn’t be surprised by this, because it is exactly what happened with SARS 1, which also self-attenuated and just went away..
Except it didn’t really go away; it just stopped causing any uniquely characteristic symptomatic illness, and people simply stopped looking for it.
And it joined the ranks of thousands of other endemic or semi-endemic viruses, that are of virtually no individual or specific clinical significance.

If we stopped ‘looking’ for SARS-CoV-2, I’m sure the same would happen.
However , if a location was re-seeded with the original full-fitness wild-type virus (slight contradiction in terms because there is nothing ‘wild’ about it), then we would see a recurrence of high consequence infections.

When NZ and Victoria eventually stop their virus witchhunt (2022??), they will probably only see the attenuated form anyway.

Mainly educated opinion.

181546 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Kevin 2, -1, #65 of 2192 🔗

A theory as yet unsupported by evidence.

181881 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Bruno, 6, #66 of 2192 🔗

Well, yes not fully supported by genomic evidence, I’ll grant you!
But that sort of research looking to identify mutation or deletion leading to a low consequence pathogen, will be hard to fund and publish, because it would potentially represent a strong counterpoint to the prevailing narrative. That being that this remains a deadly virus that can strike anybody, anytime. And that is their continuing justification for the lockdowns and the masks.

But in my opinion, it is nearly as good as self-evident! I have yet to see an alternative hypothesis to explain the distinct disease kinetics seen in this virus all over Europe (rapid peaking of deaths after 6-8 weeks, followed by sustained decline.)
And if I’m not too wide of the mark, then, regardless of the distorted picture portrayed by the official figures, there will actually be virtually no Covid cases that progress to acute or critical second stage illness necessitating ICU treatment. I think we have already been in that situation for three months or so.
Yes, there has been some apparent continued use of mechanical ventilation. But then we discover that if a patient is occupying a ventilator-equipped bed, then it would seem they are recorded as being ‘on a ventilator’, when in actual fact they are not receiving mechanical ventilation!
And I also don’t think that the cytokine storm of systemic inflammation is happening.
Or if it is, there is no independent evidence for it!
We do know that median duration of hospital stay is much reduced.

And indeed, collective immunity is also now in play.
Take the two factors together and you no longer have a pathogen that it is any more life-threatening than flu or the rather nebulous IFI (influenza-like illness). In fact, if there were no more PCR tests, then Covid would just be an IFI.

And the deaths currently recorded as Covid deaths invariably have a different primary cause of death. Hence their need for the death certificate scam.

And there certainly is some evidence of loss of pathogenicity leading to SARS-1 disappearing.
So why shouldn’t we at least hypothesise that something similar is occurring here?

Out of interest, do you have a different hypothesis?

181432 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to BobT, 4, #67 of 2192 🔗

Please people, find an example/comparison that everyone agrees on.

In the Y2K debacle, there were hundreds or thousands of people making dire predictions about what would happen at the turn of the clocks at the turn of the century but all of them just did not know, they were guessing, because nobody actually understood the computer code.

It wasn’t a debacle. One could argue it was not needed, but not that it was a debacle. Of course people understood the code. The issue was data storage, where the year was commonly held as two digits i.e. 99 rather than the four digit 1999. And thousands of people, if not more, were engaged in changing databases to hold four digit years. And performing the necessary system amendments this change made necessary.

Back then there was a simple way to find out. In the last days of 1999 I reset all the clocks on my computers along with some factory automation controllers to 1/1/2000 to test them and see what happened.

Do you work on government IT projects, Bob ? 🙂

182899 ▶▶▶ BobT, replying to JohnB, #68 of 2192 🔗

No, but I hear there is good money in it. Give me a few billion and I will be happy to make you an app that does not work.

182852 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to BobT, #69 of 2192 🔗

It seems near certain that the PCR test has been very carefully set up to do exactly what it is now doing. In other words, we are being scammed on a colossal scale.

180961 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 20, #70 of 2192 🔗

“‘The free being is incarnate, and to see human life as a vehicle for freedom – to see a face where the scientist sees flesh and bone – is to recognise that this, at least, is sacred, that this small piece of earthly matter is not to be treated as a means to our purposes, but as an end in itself”

Roger Scruton

181013 ▶▶ annie, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 17, #71 of 2192 🔗

Seeing a face is the problem nowadays.The ‘scientists’ and the Pissenlits see a cloud of viruses loosely wrapped in flesh. The rest of us see nappies.

181136 ▶▶▶ LS99, replying to annie, 6, #72 of 2192 🔗

Pissenlit – sneaky but I like it!

181983 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to LS99, 2, #73 of 2192 🔗

Not The Naughty Word.

180962 Achilles, 3, #74 of 2192 🔗

Blimey! Is Toby suffering from insomnia?

180964 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 18, #75 of 2192 🔗

Just woken up. Is the pig dictator still in power?

181002 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cecil B, 12, #76 of 2192 🔗

One day nearer to the chopping blick.

180966 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 30, #77 of 2192 🔗

Who ordered the army to be deployed on the streets?

Who made the decision to disguise them council as employees?

Was it a government minister, or did the army act independently of the government?

Statement in the house please?

180976 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 6, #78 of 2192 🔗

Should read ‘them as council employees ‘

181196 ▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to Cecil B, 2, #79 of 2192 🔗

Not a very good disguise with their uniforms visible.

181330 ▶▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to ConstantBees, 3, #80 of 2192 🔗

Yep, wearing camos…with a nice high viz over the top!

181379 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to ConstantBees, 4, #81 of 2192 🔗

Camouflage with hi viz, so deadfully common.

181369 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Cecil B, 1, #82 of 2192 🔗

The army doesn’t act “independently of government”. The civil authorities have to request their assistance.

181442 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nick Rose, #83 of 2192 🔗

And they are doing!

181384 ▶▶ H K, replying to Cecil B, 4, #84 of 2192 🔗

My guess would be Tobias Elwood MP (77th Brigade) who is pushing Boris to use the army and introduce immunity/vaccination certificates

180967 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 23, #85 of 2192 🔗

Just seen Ferguson has released a new model. Apparently he was hit on the head by an acorn yesterday. He’s run the numbers and can confidently predict that if we don’t do anything the sky will fall down.

180995 ▶▶ annie, replying to Achilles, 31, #86 of 2192 🔗

There have been a lot of acorns about this year. I’ve noticed, The number being projected on to your head is set to double every seven days. If we don’t immediately chopdown every oak tree in the country we are heading for oakageddon.

181014 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to annie, 5, #87 of 2192 🔗

I’ve noticed this too! Masses of them

181555 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Sophie123, 1, #88 of 2192 🔗

Me too, what does this tell us about the fertility of the natural world when human activity is interrupted?

181030 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to annie, 7, #89 of 2192 🔗

What about conkers, they’re far more dangerous.

181035 ▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Fingerache Philip., 5, #90 of 2192 🔗

They were Banned years ago, just as well considering.

181050 ▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 9, #91 of 2192 🔗

But conkers come in cases.
Be afraid.

181378 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to annie, 5, #92 of 2192 🔗

Worse, they come in cases that look like the Rona..

181448 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nick Rose, 1, #93 of 2192 🔗

I love you guys!

181990 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #94 of 2192 🔗

Conkerona!

182860 ▶▶▶▶▶ Marie R, replying to karenovirus, 2, #95 of 2192 🔗

I saw a brilliant comment in DT a while ago “there is an absolute straight line between banning conkers in the playground (oh how we laughed) to the mess we are in now “

180970 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 95, #96 of 2192 🔗

The Prime Minister will chair a COBRA meeting on Monday morning to hammer out the final details before setting out the new nationwide three-tier system of restrictions in the Commons.

Seven months down the line and this incompetent bunch of useless morons that passes for the government goes from hysteria to complete madness. I’ve got to the stage now where I feel like a disconnected spectator at a dystopean horror film. To be honest, I gave up paying any attention to what these renegades were saying months ago and these ‘restrictions’ are just something else I shall ignore with impunity. By the day they dig their grave deeper and deeper. It will give millions of us great pleasure to see them buried forever.

180984 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Harry hopkins, 47, #97 of 2192 🔗

Someone crash the COBRA meeting with the new memo from WHO.
Boris, you know those nice people at WHO wot changed their mind about masks ?
They’ve gone and done it again about lockdown so you’ll just have to cancel todays announcement, bit of a bummer I know.

180996 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to karenovirus, 34, #98 of 2192 🔗

WHO changed its mind on face rags due to ‘political pressure’. What changed its mind on universal incarceration? Surely it isn’t bothered about millions starving to death, or dying of other diseases? I mean, it isn’t as if the World Hysteria Organisation has anything to do with health, or life, or sanity, is it?.

181085 ▶▶▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to annie, 13, #99 of 2192 🔗

It knows that if civilisation is destroyed due to lockdowns then it won’t be much fun trying to spend the cash they’re going to make. They’ve overshot, and they know it.

181169 ▶▶▶▶▶ RichT, replying to Barney McGrew, 7, #100 of 2192 🔗

They do not need money, just control of resources and power.

183185 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to RichT, 1, #101 of 2192 🔗

And they don’t need 95% of us. Now everybody roll up your sleeves, Uncle Bill has something for you.

181118 ▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to annie, 11, #102 of 2192 🔗

Because everyone has been softened up and is begging for a way out. Cue the health passports.

181245 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to jb12, 2, #103 of 2192 🔗

Exactly!

183186 ▶▶▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to jb12, #104 of 2192 🔗

Cue the genocidal vaccines.

181352 ▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to annie, 9, #105 of 2192 🔗

The WHO is largely representing the interests of pharmaceutical companies. (Pretty much every layer of health care is in some way representing the interests of pharmas). Lockdowns don’t particularly help pharmas. On the other hand immunity passports, track and trace systems… let’s see the WHO come out against those..

181516 ▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to annie, 2, #106 of 2192 🔗

I think it remains to be seen if the Nabarro statement is just an outlier opinion or the new official view.
An easing of community-wide lockdowns might be considered judicious at this point, because their broader aims can still be achieved by individual health persecution and health tyranny, by masks and track and trace with mandatory individual isolation, if it is done on the grandest possible scale.
Hence Project Lunar C.

182465 ▶▶▶▶ Carlo, replying to annie, 1, #107 of 2192 🔗

Political pressure from China who make the things.

180972 Londo Mollari, replying to Londo Mollari, 69, #108 of 2192 🔗

I think it is painfully obvious that no matter how much evidence is presented against lockdowns, Boris and his criminal friends running Her Majesty’s Government (where is the Queen, by the way?) are going to continue locking things down until a sizeable minority refuse to comply. There are grim implications for this view of things, not least for non compliers. What do others think?

thank you Toby et all for all your hard work both here and for free speech. Good night all.

180985 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Londo Mollari, 14, #109 of 2192 🔗

She’s been going around her gift shops removing all the Prince Andrew tat.

180993 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to karenovirus, 11, #110 of 2192 🔗

And the Ginger prince

181242 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Chris John, 1, #111 of 2192 🔗

Isn’t Ginge on his way over for a visit imminently?

181028 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to Londo Mollari, 13, #112 of 2192 🔗

Our wonderful Queen is fully supportive of everything that’s been inflicted on her subjects.

Obviously.

181089 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Londo Mollari, 2, #113 of 2192 🔗

Is it a North v South civil war?

181462 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Barney McGrew, 2, #114 of 2192 🔗

So far it’s a coup.
Given the stance of the Northern “Leaders”, I don’t fancy my chances with them on my side either!

180973 Londo Mollari, replying to Londo Mollari, 26, #115 of 2192 🔗

By the way, nobody who has been following the shameful biased extradition hearing of Julian Assange should be in the least bit surprised at the treatment of Darren Grimes.

180975 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to Londo Mollari, 17, #116 of 2192 🔗

Tommy Robinson has been constantly subjected to the same treatment for round about a decade now. It’s nothing new.

181175 ▶▶▶ RichT, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 3, #117 of 2192 🔗

I am not a fan of Tommy, but his treatment in prison was disgusting.

181414 ▶▶▶▶ H K, replying to RichT, 12, #118 of 2192 🔗

I followed TR for a good few years. His Oxford Union speech was an eye opener and so was his free speech/enemy of the state presentation.
The way the state uses it’s levers of power to character and financially assassinate it’s targets is frightening!

His working class status and some of his behaviour certainly didn’t help him (as one of his followers), but I didn’t see him as the far right racist as reported in the mainstream media.
As a ‘brown’ man(of Indian heritage), I know for a fact that he has a sizable following within the Sikh & Hindu community.

180974 Cristi.Neagu, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 37, #119 of 2192 🔗

Surely, locking people up without evidence has to be a violation of human rights. Not even the Prime Minister should have that power. Can’t the government be sued for human rights violations? Can’t we have a Nuremberg trial of our own?

180997 ▶▶ annie, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 33, #120 of 2192 🔗

The original lockdown violated seven key principles of the Human Rights Declaration. With total impunity. Clearly it is an umbrella that can only be used when it isn’t raining.

180998 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to annie, 10, #121 of 2192 🔗

That’s because we allowed them to.
This time they do not have the power since we did not renew it.

181129 ▶▶ James007, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 9, #122 of 2192 🔗

Keir Starmer was a lawyer with a special interest in human rights.. what an opportunity he has has to use that experience!

181269 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to James007, 3, #123 of 2192 🔗

No doubt he will use this experience to tell Johnson not to ‘lose his nerve’ just like he told the Swedish authorities not to drop the trumped-up rape charges against Julian Assange. MW

181235 ▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 18, #124 of 2192 🔗

Because my MP (one of the most useless human beings ever to enter parliament) Nadine Dorries no longer replies to my e-mails (hasn’t since 2007), I just sent her a copy of “The Nuremberg Trials” using Amazon. It’s arriving at parliament on the 5th of November.

181240 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to captainbeefheart, 1, #125 of 2192 🔗

Well done!

181313 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to captainbeefheart, 7, #126 of 2192 🔗

I don’t think Nadine Dorries can read.

181332 ▶▶▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Two-Six, 4, #127 of 2192 🔗

It’s one with pictures – it has several pictures of some of her heros standing in a dock looking very unhappy. If she looks at the pictures, she might get it.

181480 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to captainbeefheart, #128 of 2192 🔗

Does she have a facebook page? Might work well on there!

181473 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 1, #129 of 2192 🔗

The revised 1984 Health now Act allows “them” to lock anybody up without evidence, no problem.

180977 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 9, #130 of 2192 🔗

Where are the Conservative Party offices in Liverpool and Manchester?

180983 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Cecil B, 3, #131 of 2192 🔗

Gone I expect

181031 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Cecil B, 3, #132 of 2192 🔗

Why, do you want to burn them down ?

181034 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Fingerache Philip., 1, #133 of 2192 🔗

No, send a letter of protest

181107 ▶▶▶▶ Scouse Sceptic, replying to Cecil B, 2, #134 of 2192 🔗

Try the address in the footer of https://www.liverpoolconservatives.org/

181243 ▶▶▶ Mel, replying to Fingerache Philip., #135 of 2192 🔗

Yes

181182 ▶▶ Basileus, replying to Cecil B, 3, #136 of 2192 🔗

7 Dudley Court, 51 Carlton Road, Manchester, M16 8DA

10 Parkfield Road, Liverpool, L17 8UH

180978 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 39, #137 of 2192 🔗

Re Toby’s woke gobledgook piece. National Maritime Museum is going to review
‘the often barbaric history of race, colonialism and representation (wtf?) in British maritime history’.

Last week BBC R4 Womans Hour told of a privileged black woman who was a member of Queen Victoria’s Imperial Court.

The guest explained that she had been presented as a child slave to an RN Captain by the King of Dahomey, present day Benin, West Africa.
She further explained that Britain had already banned the slave trade throughout the Empire and was enforcing it more generally on the High Seas (no gasp of admiration from the host).

The King of Dahomey was still very active in slavery and the Navy Captain was negotiating with him him to stop selling his own people to the few Europeans still in that vile trade.

No “excuse me, did you just say that Africans were selling other Africans into slavery and Britain was trying to stop them?” from the host either.

The RN West Africa Squadron was actively fighting slavery when our country was in an existential war with France and continued to do so until the 1920s in the Red Sea.

Much of the diplomacy that took place at the Congress of Vienna at the conclusion of the Napoleonic Wars was to do with Britain strong arming other nations, including our Allies, to adopt anti-slavery or face the might of the ‘barbaric& colonialist’ Royal Navy should they choose not to.
In the way of diplomacy each country that agreed would have expected some concession from Britain in return.

Ps. The black woman in question would not have need of emancipation on arrival at Court because the condition of ‘slavery’ simply did not exist in Britain and had not done so since William the Bastard Conqueror.

180986 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to karenovirus, 12, #138 of 2192 🔗

Slave trading is alive and well almost everywhere except in the West. Even so, it is only the West that is accused of slavery. As anyone with more that two brain cells to rub together can perhaps figure out, this is because only people that despise slavery would be concerned about being accused of slavery. If the Western world was indeed built on slavery no one would even care about all these accusations. But we do, and that is the leash we’re being lead by.

180989 ▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 31, #139 of 2192 🔗

As I’ve said before, people struggling so nobly to be apologised and kowtowed to for things that happened three hundred years ago, were conspicuous by their absence when the Yazidi were being turned into rape slaves in Syria. Present-day slavery isn’t useful to the leftists, because it’s not being done by white people. Similarly, the West Africa Squadron is an inconvenient truth that needs to be airbrushed from history. Presumably statues of Wilberforce will soon have to go because he was merely exercising his white privilege and [insert rambling, meaningless justification to include the words “problematic” and “dialectic” here]
Defund the universities. Shut 90% of them down and found technical colleges instead. Defund the BBC.

181023 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 11, #140 of 2192 🔗

Much of the people traffic across the Channel leads the victims into slavery of various sorts.

181025 ▶▶▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 3, #141 of 2192 🔗

Question is, who are their enslavers ?

181501 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to karenovirus, 4, #142 of 2192 🔗

Cressida Dick seems to have some disguised as TSG.

181540 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to karenovirus, 1, #143 of 2192 🔗

End users include Middle-Eastern diplomats; fruit farmers; sewing sweatshops; factories. Enslavers are largely the criminal gangs.

181570 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to JohnB, 2, #144 of 2192 🔗

Especially cannabis farms and other food processing factories, coincidentally all with the sort of battery hen conditions where CV 19 thrives. I’ve stopped buying pre packed sandwiches.

181933 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Bruno, #145 of 2192 🔗

Still buying weed though Sylvie ?

181686 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to karenovirus, 2, #146 of 2192 🔗

Lauren Southern has a pretty good documentary on the topic called “Borderless”.

181490 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 1, #147 of 2192 🔗

It’s just called human trafficking in the West.

180987 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to karenovirus, 4, #148 of 2192 🔗

Very well put.

181054 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to karenovirus, 4, #149 of 2192 🔗

Some more information about Queen Victoria’s black goddaughter – Sarah Forbes Bonetta:

https://enoughofthistomfoolery.wordpress.com/2018/01/24/tv-review-victoria-christmas-special-itv-comfort-and-joy/

181221 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #150 of 2192 🔗

Thank you Bart, the guest did indicate that she had been educated discovering things about Queen Victoria that she did not expect.

182753 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to karenovirus, #151 of 2192 🔗

You’re welcome. ITV’s Victoria for all its faults did attempt to present a fairly rounded picture of Queen Victoria as a young woman.

181168 ▶▶ mjr, replying to karenovirus, 12, #152 of 2192 🔗

last night BBC2 put out two programmes about slavery with Samuel Jackson.. Some very angry black presenters. Some interesting information, a lot of nice diving scenes (especially for an elephant tusk!).

A lot of time spent about the wreck of the Douro as example of slave ships (but as this was wrecked many years after UK slavery ended some doubt about this). They also looked at another wreck which had been sunk after being chased by Royal Navy in their role of stopping slavery .

The worst of the whitewashing was about the Africans involvement in the trade. Particularly an interview with an Ashanti woman who admitted that in the past they had slaves. Except they were not referred to as slaves. They were referred to as “unfree”. And justified the selling of these Unfree people to “white slavers” because they needed the guns they received in trade to defend themselves from other tribes.

Otherwise very little about african tribes being heavily involved and selling captured tribes to european traders and the amount of slavery that already existed . (see Mansa Musa who once made a pilgrimage to Mecca with a procession that included 12000 slaves.

Apparently Mali today has 200,000 as slaves today.

So good old BBC… dont let the truth get in the way when you want to condemn UK and only UK as being responsible for the whole slave trade

181504 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to mjr, 1, #153 of 2192 🔗

Well said.
I wonder how many young BLM twerps eat chocolate ….

181669 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to mjr, 1, #154 of 2192 🔗

Was there any mention of the current booming slave trade in the previously-‘best-developed’-country in Africa? And how that state of affairs has come about?
(Clue: R2P) AG

181423 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to karenovirus, 3, #155 of 2192 🔗

Quite. In fact, she would have been manumitted the moment she stepped aboard a British warship, as such is considered British territory. Queen Elizabeth I had said no man who stepped on England’s land was a slave, and this was upheld in Law by Sir John Holt, then the Lord Chief Justice, in a case in 1701.

Often ignored, but apparently always honoured by the Royal Navy, who happily recruited runaway slaves in the Caribbean.

181523 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #156 of 2192 🔗

Patrick O’Brian, describing a slave boarding Jack Aubrey’s ship –

(Ignorant crew member (Killick)) YOU FREE MAN NOW !

(Ex-slave) Pardon me sir, but my name is Smith.

🙂

180979 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 12, #157 of 2192 🔗
180982 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to wendyk, 11, #158 of 2192 🔗

Tim Martin will be rubbing his hands in glee at all his independent rivals going bust. Actually he’s a very nice man, who I’ve met three times, but there is no doubt that it will be the big operators in many fields of activity that will be the long term winners out of all this.

181022 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to karenovirus, 6, #159 of 2192 🔗

Data on the fortunes of billionaires supports you.

181037 ▶▶▶ 6097 Smith W, replying to karenovirus, 6, #160 of 2192 🔗

Sort of the point of the whole thing really

181518 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to karenovirus, 1, #161 of 2192 🔗

Just as Big Ag swallowed up the small farms after the F&M scam.

182449 ▶▶▶ ianric, replying to karenovirus, #162 of 2192 🔗

If pubs and bars go bust Amazon and the supermarkets will get increased alcohol sales.

181517 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to wendyk, 2, #163 of 2192 🔗

Sad, especially considering what he’s already gone though, including all that ghastly covid signeage he’s had to deface the premises with.

180980 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 46, #164 of 2192 🔗

I didn’t see it posted yesterday but the Sunday Times reports that contact information being harvested by QR code in pubs and restaurants is being sold on marketing, credit card and insurance companies.

No surprises there then.

181057 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to karenovirus, 19, #165 of 2192 🔗

Test & trace even during its early days has been violating GDPR and there were reports that people who gave their details were later spammed with calls from various marketing companies.

This doesn’t surprise me.

182833 ▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Bart Simpson, #166 of 2192 🔗

Understood, but I wouldn’t know; I never give my true phone number anyway.

181236 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to karenovirus, 5, #167 of 2192 🔗

Toby seems to have missed that – maybe needs sending to him?

180991 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 11, #168 of 2192 🔗

North face, South face. Always two faces with the pig dictator

180994 ▶▶ Chris John, replying to Cecil B, 13, #169 of 2192 🔗

I don’t know which face to slap hardest, but I do know Wanksock is the most smackable

181004 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Chris John, 8, #170 of 2192 🔗

Wancock is so dim he probably doesn’t realise he is helping an Erdogan style coup.

181021 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Chris John, 8, #171 of 2192 🔗

‘Wanksock’ excellent, my suggested bedwetter alternative is coronanist .

181032 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Chris John, 2, #172 of 2192 🔗

Kickable!!

180992 Chris John, replying to Chris John, 29, #173 of 2192 🔗

I’ll keep bedwetters, not having a supposed free speech enthusiast telling me what words I’m allowed to use

180999 ▶▶ annie, replying to Chris John, 12, #174 of 2192 🔗

Likewise. Mort aux pissenlits .
Going to censor us, are you, Mr Dandelion?

181629 ▶▶▶ MiriamW-sometimes-AlanG, replying to annie, 2, #175 of 2192 🔗

I never used the term ‘bedwetter’ until I couldn’t resist putting it in a post yesterday. Being of an okkerd persuasion, this frankly infantile non-issue brought out the worst in me. If someone visits here and can’t cope with something so mild, they are not going to have anything to do with the things most of us are saying. And how will they cope with the language of, say, Biker ( 🙂 ) or people happily bandying around the ‘cunt’ and ‘twat’ and other profanities?

Anyway, Annie, I just love Dandelion/pissenlit. If you don’t object, I am going to borrow it for future use.

Maybe ‘Mr Dandelion’ will just encourage us to shame each other up if we transgress as advised by SPI-B and Dame Dick. (Seriously, I think those posters who say he has retired the term for UTL use may be correct although I did notice that he sneaked it into his links section underneath that letter yesterday!) MW

181070 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Chris John, 18, #176 of 2192 🔗

I prefer ‘murdering cunts’

181076 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Winston Smith, 5, #177 of 2192 🔗

That’s for everyone involved in making lockdown happen and sustain it.
Basically Westminster and media and SAGE. They should face summary execution and made to dig their own graves

181452 ▶▶▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to Chris John, 6, #178 of 2192 🔗

Everybody who wears a mask is sustaining it.

181532 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Chris John, 1, #179 of 2192 🔗

Too kind!
Solitary confinement with the refusal of healthcare would be much more apppropriate.
Even better if they’re given mouldy sarnies, like the students.

181170 ▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Winston Smith, 2, #180 of 2192 🔗

The CU iN Two weeks brigade?

181099 ▶▶ Steve, replying to Chris John, 2, #181 of 2192 🔗

Me too. Besides the whole concept of kids wetting the bed in fear of the imaginary monster fits the whole Corona panic too well.

181195 ▶▶ RichT, replying to Chris John, 6, #182 of 2192 🔗

Toby is not telling us what we can say, just retiring the word from his writings.

181234 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to RichT, 4, #183 of 2192 🔗

Exactly.

181233 ▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to Chris John, 3, #184 of 2192 🔗

Me too, but I will be open to alternatives also. Since the offenders formerly known as bedwetters are behaving like total idiots about Covid, we could use a snarky portmanteau based around that – something like ‘Covidiots’, perhaps.

181773 ▶▶ Jaguarpig, replying to Chris John, #185 of 2192 🔗

Well said

181000 annie, replying to annie, 5, #186 of 2192 🔗

I can now access the GB Declaration, but it no longer shows the numbers of signatories.

???

181005 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to annie, 2, #187 of 2192 🔗
181010 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #188 of 2192 🔗

Thanks!.
Thr number appears to have gone down substantially since yesterday.

???

181020 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to annie, 13, #189 of 2192 🔗

Probably weeding out the ‘Mickey Mouse’ ones attempting to discredit the declaration CCP bots probably.

181001 Ed Phillips, replying to Ed Phillips, 7, #190 of 2192 🔗

I’ve had some correspondence with someone who thinks that the April spike is proof that Covid-19 is a dangerous and lethal disease and that lockdown has worked in saving lives.

What are the facts concerning that spike and where can I find good sources on an explanation for it?

Was it actually a normal distribution but we’ve not had such a hard Spring for some time so it looks strange on the five year average?

Was it because we put lots of Covid patients into care homes?

Was it that the closing of hospitals in lockdown caused a spike due to other illnesses being untreated?

All of the above? Something else?

181006 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Ed Phillips, 1, #191 of 2192 🔗
181354 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #192 of 2192 🔗

That was exactly the thing I was gonna link to. An excellent review of THE DATA. Brilliant.

181008 ▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to Ed Phillips, 1, #193 of 2192 🔗

There’s some stuff here:

https://sluggerotoole.com/2020/05/31/what-is-the-evidence-for-and-cost-of-lockdown/

And a summary of some immunity research here:

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3563/rr-6

Google ivor cummins covid 19 april spike for more and maybe network from there.

181543 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Tim Bidie, #195 of 2192 🔗

Well they did say it was only to protect the NHS!

181009 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Ed Phillips, 6, #196 of 2192 🔗

The bell curve for the spring Covid exactly matches those of a normal bad winter flu, just arrived 3 months later than usual after a mild winter flu. Had last years winter flu been severe half this years Covid dead would have already gone.

181011 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Ed Phillips, 3, #197 of 2192 🔗

Don’t bother explaining, they will be dead from starvation this time next year

181015 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Ed Phillips, 5, #198 of 2192 🔗

CEBM did a chart a week or so back that showed deaths from flu & other respiratory conditions (Inc COVID) for 2020 was not especially abnormal vs prior 10 years. 2 other Aprils in the past decade have seen as many deaths.

Obviously we saw higher excess mortality in April this year, but they were not COVID deaths. Lockdown deaths.

181036 ▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Sophie123, 1, #199 of 2192 🔗

Thanks Sophie. I had a look on their website and couldn’t find that chart. Can you remember any more details?

181218 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Sophie123, 2, #201 of 2192 🔗

Thanks.

Can I check I’ve got this right?

The first table on that webpage shows that in the April spike there were 20000 (Twenty thousand) deaths recorded. But the graph posted above and the coronavirus data on the government’s website say that the highest number of deaths with respiratory disease was 2000.

So the huge spike in overall deaths in April was not connected with respiratory disease in any way? (18000 non-respiratory related deaths).

Am I reading that right?

181282 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to Ed Phillips, 3, #202 of 2192 🔗

I suspect there is a difference in definition at play.

You are correct in reading a spike of just under 2,000 deaths this year on the “comparison of respiratory disease” chart, but the ONS figures for “deaths-with-COVID-19” show a spike of just over 8,000. Given that COVID-19 is a respiratory disease, I don’t know how to reconcile this difference without access to the underlying data and definitions.

Here’s a chart that I prepared myself a few days ago from ONS data. It shows the peaks of both all-cause-deaths and deaths-with-COVID-19.

Of course, deaths-with-COVID-19 is a misnomer. It should be called deaths-within-28-days-of-having-a-positive-test-for-SARS-CoV-2-viral-fragments , but that’s another matter.

181344 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Mabel Cow, 5, #203 of 2192 🔗

Ok, I think I’m getting somewhere.
Data here https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/deaths has deaths with 28 days of a test peaking at 2000-ish.
Deaths with Covid-19 on the death certificate peaks at 8000 as your graph demonstrates. That’s 6000 deaths assumed to be Covid-19 without any verification. (Am I right in thinking that autopsies were seriously curtailed in this period?)

Can we say this based on Sweden’s experience and the UK’s (and drawing on Ivor Cummins):

There is a novel virus which was an contributory factor in the deaths of very old and very ill people in March and April. Previous low flu seasons meant that there was more “dry tinder” in the population. However, the response to that virus by discharging older people from hospitals into care homes increased the number of deaths and lockdown measures leading to restricted care added more.

If we had carried on as normal, adding capacity to our medical services we would have saved many more lives and the spike would have been less and much in line with previous bad years for deaths.

How is that for an interpretation of the facts?

181365 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Ed Phillips, 2, #204 of 2192 🔗

Spot on.

181600 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to Ed Phillips, 3, #205 of 2192 🔗

Seems fair.

I agree with Ivor (I think it was him that he said this) that in the absence of PCR testing, we would have just shrugged and said “bad flu this year, wasn’t it?”

181612 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mabel Cow, #206 of 2192 🔗

Yes. I keep pointing out that if the banned the pillalr 2 tests, apart from saving £billions, the “epidemic” would disappear overnight.

There was news last night that NL has realised this and abandoned testing. Any further info on that?

181655 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Mabel Cow, 3, #207 of 2192 🔗

I remember seeing a letter from a retired GP to the Telegraph, I think, at the beginning of this who said that in the days before the Internet the GPs would have said exactly that.

This is a crisis concocted by our dependence on the television, internet and globalism.

181713 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ djaustin, replying to Ed Phillips, #208 of 2192 🔗

COVID19 has a different ICD10 code of 100 so is not recorded in that dataset.The plot shows that for all other respiratory diseases of interest, this year is little different to the past five. However comparing all deaths to the same Week 39 time point, 66,000 extra people have died from something that they did not die of in the past five years.

182003 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to djaustin, #209 of 2192 🔗

Lockdown, maybe?

181042 ▶▶▶ helen, replying to chaos, #211 of 2192 🔗

Thanks

181102 ▶▶ Barney McGrew, replying to Ed Phillips, 12, #212 of 2192 🔗

There’s an irony in that the better a country is at routinely keeping old people alive, the bigger the spike you’d get if you just stopped their treatment. Which is what happened when the NHS became the National Covid Service. The numbers we’re talking about (40,000, say) are not so huge that they couldn’t just be a slight upset in the equilibrium. A problem for the government in wanting to keep the hysteria going, is that perhaps they killed off the driest tinder earlier in the year and are going to have to work very hard to create a convincing number of deaths now, even if it’s a strong flu season. Their only option is to lock down strongly and claim it’s this that is keeping the deaths down. They can play the ‘cases’ like a violin by just modulating the number of tests.

181003 chaos, replying to chaos, 22, #213 of 2192 🔗

Stanley worked for John D Rockefeller, Carrie Symonds works for Oceana, part funded by the Rockefeller Brothers Fund which has two Rockefellers on the board. Keir Starmer sits on the Trilateral Commission, founded by David Rockefeller. This is a coup. You all need to work out what you will do when they make the vaccine mandatory. What the hell will be in it? Nothing – it’s just a means to the digital ID ends? Or will it sterilise? Will it contain live virus? We are well beyond tin foil hats. We ARE in a coup.

181093 ▶▶ RichT, replying to chaos, 5, #214 of 2192 🔗

Scenarios for the Future of Technology and International Development – The Rockefeller Foundation

From the scenario lockstep – A world of tighter top-down government control and more authoritarian leadership, with limited innovation and growing citizen pushback

At first, the notion of a more controlled world gained wide acceptance and approval. Citizens willingly gave up some of their sovereignty — and their privacy — to more paternalistic states in exchange for greater safety and stability. Citizens were more tolerant, and even eager, for top-down direction and oversight, and national leaders had more latitude to impose order in the ways they saw fit.

http://www.nommeraadio.ee/meedia/pdf/RRS/Rockefeller%20Foundation.pdf

181230 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to chaos, 4, #215 of 2192 🔗

Seen Stanley Johnson’s books on population control and his (old) novel, called ‘The Virus’?

181016 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 3, #216 of 2192 🔗

Tom Jefferson and Carl Heneghan
What does the Covid data really tell us?
11 October 2020, 8:00am
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/what-does-the-covid-data-really-tell-us-

Another week has passed with more restrictions piled on – but as lockdown measures become ever more restrictive, the demand for evidence grows. Sir Keir Starmer, for instance, has asked to see evidence for new lockdown measures. In mid-August, Andy Burnham called on the government not to put Oldham into lockdown as Sir Richard Leese, the lead for health in Greater Manchester, pointed out that there is ‘no evidence’ that additional lockdown measures would improve the chances of halting the virus.

Tomorrow, we’re told, there will be more restrictions still. But on what grounds?

The main evidence presented to us by the government is the new daily total for new Covid infections. But how severe are the cases? Severity can be assessed quantitatively starting from the clearest and unquestionable outcome – death. But even there, the evidence is not clear. Is a ‘Covid death’ someone killed by the virus, or someone who died from other reasons who also had the virus?

Our understanding of ‘Covid deaths’

Evidence from Italy casts new light on this. ISTAT, Italy’s national statistics institute, and Istituto Superiore di Sanità (ISS), an Italian health authority, published a report on the impact of Covid-19 deaths recorded up to the 16 July. They found 28 per cent of death certificates they studied have Covid-19 as the only cause of death. The remainder, over two thirds, are deaths with Covid: i.e. people with preexisting conditions such as hypertension, diabetes, heart disease and cancer. Often with more than one condition in the same person. So the figure for ‘Covid deaths’ in this instance will be almost four times as big as the number who died from Covid.

An ONS report of deaths involving Covid-19 in England and Wales in June paints a similar picture: ‘Of the deaths involving Covid-19 that occurred in England and Wales in March to June 2020, there was at least one pre-existing condition in 91 per cent of cases.’ Unlike Italy, dementia and Alzheimer’s disease was the most common pre-existing condition found among Covid deaths.

A recent update by the ISS shows that 59 per cent of Italy’s 36,000 deaths were amongst the over-80s. In August, the age of those who died with Covid shifted significantly towards the very elderly. In other words, cases are getting younger but deaths over the summer and early autumn are getting older. In traditional pandemic theory, deaths among the young should increase and several studies have demonstrated this age shift in deaths to younger populations. The major prevention strategies should therefore focus on older people – and not younger people – to minimize the loss to expected years of life.

Since the 1 August just over a thousand Covid deaths have been registered in England and Wales, most amongst the over 80s. (And one in five in the over 90s.) So Covid appears to have been – in the great majority of cases – a cofactor which tipped the frail and elderly. The current fixation on the daily diet of infection numbers is not helping anyone. Basing what happens next on comparisons with figures from the day before is leading to more anxiety, and ever-increasing restrictions. We’re told that hospital admissions are near capacity and can only get worse with hospitals in the north of England running out of Covid beds within a week. But, again we are left wondering: who is being admitted? And what for? The poor quality of data makes it very hard to gather a clear understanding.

Let’s look at people catching the virus in hospital. Using NHS England data, we estimated the probable number of those catching Covid-19 in hospital – known as Healthcare Associated Infections (HCAIs). We found for the most recent date of reporting, on 6 October, over 18 per cent of hospitalisations were being diagnosed after over seven days in hospital. Such patients are highly likely to have caught the virus in hospital, given that they were not diagnosed with it upon entry.

Hospital-acquired Covid infection appears to be particularly notable in the North West, where 17 per cent in the last week and 24 per cent on 6 October of the newly admitted patients who were subsequently tested, were positive with Covid-19. So they were probably HCAIs.

This is an obvious danger if you mix Covid patients together with non-Covid patients. Yet, little has been done to invest in ‘fever hospitals’ that could isolate Covid patients and help prevent the in-hospital spread of infection – keeping our hospitals open for the routine care that is so badly needed.

To talk about Covid ‘cases’ and draw international comparisons is also misleading as ‘cases’ has man

181092 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 1, #217 of 2192 🔗

Thanks HawkAnalyst!

181115 ▶▶ helen, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 2, #218 of 2192 🔗

OOOOps I forgot the smokescreen measures!
oh yes now I see what the masks are for to protect us for ALL THE SMOKE

181018 Nigel Sherratt, 6, #219 of 2192 🔗

The portrait of Nelson shows the missing chelengk on his hat. A almost literally priceless gift from the Sultan of the Ottoman Empire to mark his victory at the Battle of the Nile stolen from (and lost by) NMM in 1951. Its loss a potent symbol of NMM’s current campaign.

181019 JudgeMental, replying to JudgeMental, 4, #220 of 2192 🔗

Sky news Australia big hit piece on the great reset https://youtu.be/GeykREAlYSg

UK talkRadio belittling it’s audience https://youtu.be/w1TrBMyEqLA

181038 ▶▶ chaos, replying to JudgeMental, 2, #221 of 2192 🔗

Good catch. Repost it every couple of hours or so…

181041 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to JudgeMental, 4, #222 of 2192 🔗

Sky well worth 10 minutes, that Schwarb guy looks really dangerous.
Old big ears said we had 36 (48?) Months to save the world how long ago ?

181063 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to karenovirus, 3, #223 of 2192 🔗

Boris has signed us up for all of this madness. Just what kind of cretin is Boris?

181225 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to chaos, 1, #224 of 2192 🔗

I believe it was John Major that signed us up originally, in 1992…

181688 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to chaos, #225 of 2192 🔗

A lying, dangerous one!

181229 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to karenovirus, 8, #226 of 2192 🔗

It was the bit about China’s role, at the end, that worried me… They have a traffic light system for access to society and BJ seems to be introducing that here now…

181665 ▶▶▶▶ helen, replying to Carrie, 1, #227 of 2192 🔗

Yes this is one of the very important questions..
Chinas part in this?

181692 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, 1, #228 of 2192 🔗

That’s the goal. The vaccine is a red herring on the way.

181024 chaos, replying to chaos, 27, #229 of 2192 🔗

James Delingpole has finally woken up to the Great Reset. Toby is a bit slow.. writes well.. but is unable or unwilling to see the big picture. I’ve always wondered about journalists that write for the mainstream. How do they support the government’s version of events i.e. lies? Is it like Les Dawson deliberately playing wrong notes on the piano? A knack that you cultivate to get the big money at the Telegraph? Or do editors just remove that which is contentious? Or do mainstream media just hire cluless twits? Or is this site just a vent.. a dishonest vent.. a baby pen to hold us?

We are in a WEF/Davos/Bilderberg coup. This is fact. It will become undeniable and obvious as the weeks progress. What will the Les Dawson’s play then? Plink plonk plank ooo what are they doing plink plink plinkity plonk why are they still locking down plink plinkity plonk plonk does the data support the measures plink plinkity plonkity plonk ignore the man behind the curtain plink clank cadonk ignore the man demanding to vaccinate you and your children Caaadonk plonkity cadink.

181026 ▶▶ John Smith, replying to chaos, 8, #230 of 2192 🔗

Toby has far too much to lose to speak the truth.

That’s the reality.

181027 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to John Smith, 5, #231 of 2192 🔗

So James Delingpole has more scruples than his mate Toby? That’s what I thought.

181029 ▶▶▶▶ John Smith, replying to chaos, 6, #232 of 2192 🔗

Or much less to lose. Which is more likely imo.

181056 ▶▶▶▶▶ helen, replying to John Smith, 3, #233 of 2192 🔗

You are both correct
Paradogma
Long but with watching

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrJR1Xz-WV4

181059 ▶▶▶▶▶ chaos, replying to John Smith, 3, #234 of 2192 🔗

He was put on the naughty step when he denied man-made Climate Change in the UK Spectator. Perhaps he would have fared better at the Australian Spectator?
https://www.spectator.com.au/2020/10/dangerous-elites-planning-the-great-reset/

181224 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to chaos, 2, #235 of 2192 🔗

James D did at least warn us months ago about the planned October lockdown. I’m waiting to see if he will tell us anything more about future plans…

181701 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to chaos, 2, #236 of 2192 🔗

We have free speech in this sandpit, which is a great place to share important information that we’re free to pass that on to others.
Be grateful and don’t bite the hand that feeds you.

181040 Nessimmersion, 12, #237 of 2192 🔗

.

181043 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 7, #238 of 2192 🔗

More lies from the BBC

They are not ‘due to appear in court’

They have been reported for summons, which means the CPS will decided if it goes to court or not

The third ‘covid is a hoax’ photograph is false. That is not the Bay in the background

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-54501281

181047 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 5, #239 of 2192 🔗

But hey, if fabrication saves just one life

181046 Sir Patrick Vaccine, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 9, #240 of 2192 🔗

Not all ‘cases’ of Covid are created equal
Ministers are starting from highly questionable assumptions
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/12/not-cases-covid-created-equal/
telegraphnews/2020/10/12/not-cases-covid-created-equal/
DR JOHN LEE
12 October 2020 • 7:00am
Dr John Lee
It is a commonplace of science, medicine and everyday life that in order to solve a problem you must first of all frame it correctly. If you ask the right questions, finding solutions can be straightforward. But if you ask the wrong ones you can grope in the dark forever. So having the right perspective really matters.

Unfortunately, the Government’s Covid approach has all the hallmarks of groping in the dark. In the name of “keeping everyone safe” we have endured local and national lockdowns, social distancing, masks, curfews, shutting cafés and pubs. Now we face further restrictions, based on naive modelling and virtually no evidence.

Our societal response doesn’t seem to have advanced much since 1665, the year of the Great Plague. Getting the framing wrong then cost many lives. If you believe (as people did) that plague is caused by corrupted air, not by a bacterium, you will take the wrong actions and make things worse. The authorities locked ill people in their homes with all who lived there, increasing overall mortality several-fold. Believing, paradoxically, that dogs and cats spread the plague, they arranged widespread culls, facilitating spread through a burgeoning rat population and their attendant fleas.

Funnily enough, Covid is actually carried on the air, so at least we have understood that bit correctly. But there has been a dangerous mission-creep since March. Then we were told a three-week lockdown was needed to stop the NHS being overwhelmed. But this has metamorphosed from the ugly caterpillar of protecting the NHS into the even uglier maggot of controlling case numbers. The wrong framing is that “case numbers” are being equated with “positive” tests.

What is a “case” of Covid? Let’s say you developed a viral cold last winter. Were you a “case” of a viral respiratory infection? On a theoretical level the answer must be yes. But on a practical, real-world level, the answer is no: you went to work and carried on with life. You were invisible to the authorities. Let’s say it got a bit worse and you saw your GP. Still no. You decided to take a couple of days off. Still no – you might show up in sick leave statistics, but not as a case of respiratory infection. If you got so far as being admitted to hospital with serious illness, you would show up as a “case” – a tiny proportion of those who actually had the illness.

The contrast with today is clear. Covid was made a notifiable disease in February, obliging all “cases” to be reported to the authorities. Since the only way to identify Covid is with a lab test, positive tests have been equated with positive “cases”. Back then, it was claimed there were no asymptomatic cases, but we now know that 90 per cent or more of people have Covid asymptomatically. A positive test is clearly not a positive “case”.

We also know that Covid affects different groups of people very differently: there is a thousand-fold difference in the severity of the disease between young and old. So the meaning of a positive test cannot be equated with its meaning in March, because the incidence of the disease at present has a completely different demographic.

Then there’s the issue of the tests themselves. Plausible false positive rates make up a substantial proportion of “positives” as unverified mass testing is rapidly rolled out. There is profound uncertainty around what low viral titres – found in a high proportion of young asymptomatic people – mean. Most probably very low infectivity. T-cell (as opposed to antibody) testing indicates that many people already have resistance to the virus. The more we know about this virus, the more it is like viruses we are already familiar with.

And yet, the Government is looking for an easy way out of the complex mass of restrictions they have devised; “control” the “cases” and wait for a vaccine to save the day. Unfortunately the former is a classic example of rubbish in, rubbish out, and the latter is unlikely to happen effectively, given previous attempts.

It’s time for the Government to start asking the right questions; framing things in the light of accumulating evidence, not unexamined preconceptions. On that basis, the course we should be taking is clear: asymptomatic spread is good. Advise and help the very elderly and those with serious illnesses to shield if they wish – but do not compel them, it’s their life, after all. And let everyone else get completely back to normal.

181049 ▶▶ Henry, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, 8, #241 of 2192 🔗

I think Toby has previously asked folk to refrain from posting entire articles from behind paywalls. Seems fair to heed that advice

181048 Mark, replying to Mark, 9, #243 of 2192 🔗

In Manchester, politicians launched a last-ditch appeal to ministers not to shut all pubs and restaurants and instead hand them the power to only close those which are not meeting coronavirus safety restrictions”

This would actually be a disastrous and divisive policy, basically forcing pubs and restaurants to enforce coronapanic theatre nonsense, empowering snitch scum, and giving local authority busybodies yet more power to bully dissenters.

181098 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Mark, 2, #245 of 2192 🔗

Just when you thought the pub experience couldn’t get any worse…

181711 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, 1, #246 of 2192 🔗

Agreed. The Northern “leaders” are making things as bad as possible. Politics before people yet again!

181055 mhcp, 7, #247 of 2192 🔗

So back in April and May it was Lives not Money.

Now it’s Money not Lives.

Funny that.

181058 Winston Smith, replying to Winston Smith, 4, #248 of 2192 🔗

OK, so we aren’t allowed to use ‘bed-wetters’ anymore.

I’m going to use ‘complicit murderers’ instead.

181064 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Winston Smith, 7, #249 of 2192 🔗

I’m going for “collaborators”

181074 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Bart Simpson, 3, #250 of 2192 🔗

How about we just keep discussing the alternatives? Then we can just ignore anything more important.

181150 ▶▶▶ DespairSquid, replying to Bart Simpson, #251 of 2192 🔗

“Quislings” perhaps?

181358 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #252 of 2192 🔗

‘Collaborators’ works well

181065 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Winston Smith, 9, #253 of 2192 🔗

I’m assuming that applies above the line. I don’t think he’s saying anything about what we in the peanut gallery can write.

I hope if he’s going to self-censor on “bedwetter”, he’s going to do the same for “pantywaist”, which imo is far worse. Apart from anything else, it’s an Americanism, and not a useful or sensible one.

181238 ▶▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to Mark, 1, #254 of 2192 🔗

What in God’s good name is a ‘pantywaist’?

181349 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Ben Shirley, #255 of 2192 🔗

An American term used for the time-honoured practice of insulting effeminate males, or implying male rivals are effeminate.

181726 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, 3, #256 of 2192 🔗

What kind of twat uses an expression like that?

182455 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Cheezilla, #257 of 2192 🔗

An American male, if you mean that particular one. If you are talking in general about insults implying effeminacy then it’s almost universal in some form or another. Inherent to humanity.

181723 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, #258 of 2192 🔗

I’ve never heard of pantywaist and can’t even begin to imagine what’s it’s supposed to denote. However, it does sound extremely puerile and that in itself would do the site no favours.

We have free speech BTL. It was pointed out that if we want to spread the word, it’s best not to alienate the waverers on their first visit above the line.

182461 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Cheezilla, #259 of 2192 🔗

Very common expression in the US a few generations back. Old fashioned now, I think, even in the US.

181073 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Winston Smith, -3, #260 of 2192 🔗

How about faggots?

181239 ▶▶▶ Ben Shirley, replying to chaos, #261 of 2192 🔗

See above re Americanisms.

181109 ▶▶ RichT, replying to Winston Smith, 1, #262 of 2192 🔗

We are allowed to call them whatever we want, however I do not think bedwetters is strong enough.

181271 ▶▶ Smelly Melly, replying to Winston Smith, #263 of 2192 🔗

How about “phobic lemmings”, driven to self destruction by an irrational fear of something that posses little danger.

181731 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Smelly Melly, #264 of 2192 🔗

The lemmings’ thing itself was a hoax.

181060 Mark, replying to Mark, 19, #265 of 2192 🔗

Stop Press: If you’re wondering why all the doctors and nurses that contribute to Lockdown Sceptics do so anonymously, it’s because they’ve been forced to sign NDAs as a condition of employment. Consequently, can I ask you to sign this petition calling on the NHS to nullify all such gagging orders when it comes to COVID-19 ?”

That’s fine and all, and the petition should be signed, and I have done so ( currently at 643 ).

But why should government bodies ever be allowed to impose NDAs on their staff? Shouldn’t we be entitled to know what they are getting up to? Shouldn’t confidentiality only apply to personal medical details?.

181244 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Mark, 4, #266 of 2192 🔗

And also, what happened to whistleblowers rights to be heard?

181255 ▶▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to PoshPanic, 7, #267 of 2192 🔗

Pournelle’s Iron Law of Bureaucracy states that in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people”:

First, there will be those who are devoted to the goals of the organization. Examples are dedicated classroom teachers in an educational bureaucracy, many of the engineers and launch technicians and scientists at NASA, even some agricultural scientists and advisors in the former Soviet Union collective farming administration.

Secondly, there will be those dedicated to the organization itself. Examples are many of the administrators in the education system, many professors of education, many teachers union officials, much of the NASA headquarters staff, etc.

The Iron Law states that in every case the second group will gain and keep control of the organization. It will write the rules, and control promotions within the organization.

181732 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to PoshPanic, #268 of 2192 🔗

That was before the coup.

181252 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Mark, 1, #269 of 2192 🔗

Because they have been lying to the public since…ohhh I don’t know? Forever?!!

181357 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Mark, 2, #270 of 2192 🔗

No wonder that in general whistleblowers take a massive risk.

181359 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Mark, 1, #271 of 2192 🔗

To keep us safe against terrorism or long covid or sweden or something. Stay safe.

181062 PastImperfect, replying to PastImperfect, 2, #272 of 2192 🔗

Does anyone have links to the latest Berlin protest rally?

181758 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to PastImperfect, #273 of 2192 🔗

Info about the weekend has been very hard to find.

This:
https://www.ruptly.tv/en/videos/20201009-069-Germany–Protesters-flood-Berlin-streets-for-rally-following-Liebig34-squat-eviction

And this: https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2020/10/01/prot-o01.html

but they’re not about lockdown!

I’ve been checking a couple of groups on fb since the weekend and there hasn’t been a squeak. I’ll let you know if there’s anything.

181066 optocarol, replying to optocarol, 28, #274 of 2192 🔗

I’m a New Zealander and want to make the point that not all of us think Jacinda Ardern is “saintly” as in Jeremy Warner’s article. Weekly protests in Auckland are growing in numbers. We also have covidplanb.co.nz to help keep us sane! In fact, I’m joining their weekly webinar right now.

181068 ▶▶ Mark, replying to optocarol, 14, #275 of 2192 🔗

For the sake of global sanity, please vote her out! It’s grossly inconsiderate of New Zealanders to inflict her on the world in the way you have done (no personal offence intended, I’m speaking collectively obviously).

And while I’m about it, as a Brit I apologise for Johnson’s existence.

183117 ▶▶▶ optocarol, replying to Mark, #276 of 2192 🔗

I’ve done my best!

181072 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to optocarol, 1, #277 of 2192 🔗

That’s good to hear! How do the authorities respond to the protests?

181272 ▶▶ Caroline Watson, replying to optocarol, 9, #278 of 2192 🔗

Have you seen the new Spitting Image, in which she is portrayed as Mary Poppins? In one scene, she decapitates someone who coughs, so that she can still say that NZ is clear of the virus!

183115 ▶▶▶ optocarol, replying to Caroline Watson, #279 of 2192 🔗

I did, yes – very funny. I think it was on thebfd.co.nz, a good website for NZers if there are any others here.

181069 Josephine K, replying to Josephine K, 7, #280 of 2192 🔗

We call the masked Sheeples here , but I guess that is a bit of an insult to sheep as I can’t imagine one of them allowing anyone to stop them bleating !

181165 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to Josephine K, 2, #281 of 2192 🔗

True a flock of sheep tend to run away from threats – the bulk of the UK population are embracing it.

181763 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to KBuchanan, #282 of 2192 🔗

Because they think they’re avoiding it.
You’ve got to hand it to the nudge unit!

182019 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to KBuchanan, 1, #283 of 2192 🔗

Correct me if I’m wrong, Jamie, but I reckon that sheep ‘know’ in their genes that they are dinner on legs, and so it makes sense to run away from a perceived threat. BUT as soon as the threat recedes, sheep immediately go back to normal and get on with their lives.

182057 ▶▶▶▶ Edward, replying to annie, 2, #284 of 2192 🔗

Sheep can learn. If they’re put into a field next to a railway line they’ll run away when a train passes, but once they realise that trains don’t come into the field they just ignore them and carry on eating grass. Government ministers are obviously less intelligent than sheep as it seems they can’t learn.

181071 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 35, #285 of 2192 🔗

Great update and if the article about the conditions at HMP Edinburgh doesn’t wake up more of the “I’m alright Jack” brigade then I don’t know what will.

Yesterday an older colleague branded young people who were going out or protesting about their conditions at university as “selfish” I had to literally walk away from him because I knew that I could have possibly verbally or physically decked him at work.

He has been ill over the past few months and I ackonwledge that he could be frightened but he had to stick it into his thick skull that no-one else is responsible for his health but himself.

The longer this goes on, the more I’m beginning to despair at many of my colleagues. Even the threat of compulsory redundancy hasn’t still sunk into them. Many still think that lockdowns and social distancing measures should be stricter and that we will be OK.

I have given up on them. Trying to inject reason and logic is like trying to get blood out of a stone.

181079 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Bart Simpson, 15, #286 of 2192 🔗

50% of the population have an IQ 100 or lower. Women are more concentrated at the mean, men are found more at the extremes (thicko and genius). Most of the sheep are in this 70-100 window but alas a significant portion of those with an IQ over 100 are also nappywetters.

181084 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to chaos, 21, #287 of 2192 🔗

And aggravated by bad education, lack of curiosity and peer pressure. Many of the lockdownistas at my work tend to be woke, voted/supported Remain and have a dislike of Trump that’s verging on the pathological. Funny how they pay so much attention to what’s going on the US while ignoring the real problems here.

181087 ▶▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #288 of 2192 🔗

I know just as many brexiteers and admirers of Trump as remainers who believe this covid madness. It should also be noted that the lib dems were the only party to vote against the Coronavirst Act. Why? I’m unsure. But Toby and James’ repeated observation that pantywetting remainers are the ones driving this is wrong IME.

181302 ▶▶▶▶▶ Caroline Watson, replying to chaos, 12, #289 of 2192 🔗

I voted Remain, for agricultural and trade reasons. However, in the North East, there is clearly a very clear divide between middle class public sector workers and pensioners, who tend to support lockdowns, and the working class, farmers and the self employed, who do not. Cracks are beginning to show between the middle class, green, BLM/identity politics-supporting Newcastle City Council and the more traditional Labour-controlled councils in places like Gateshead.
The unions are also divided; the public sector ones are whipping up a climate of fear and basically working to rule, because they see it as an opportunity to bring down the government, whilst what remains of the industrial and private sector unions, most of whose members have either worked throughout or face losing their jobs, are furious.
Many people in the North see this as an attack on the working class by the middle class woke. Rather than protecting Northern people, it seems that we are being punished. Northern social life, around pubs and football, is being destroyed, and the traditionally close Northern working class family is being disregarded.
It is ironic that Johnson’s government appears to be punishing the very people who delivered his Brexit vote. Presumably they have served their purpose and have become an embarrassment with their loathing of the Green/BLM/ identity politics crap.
And Labour, as ever, needs to decide which side it is on!

181342 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Caroline Watson, 5, #290 of 2192 🔗

Brexit was an unusual issue, and Johnson’s support for it was always just opportunist. The reality of our politics today was nicely summed up by Peter Hitchens a few days ago:

It used to happen, although the two political parties had many faults and no one’s saying they were perfect, the great thing was that they more or less represented the old divide in the country, which existed I suppose up until the mid-sixties, which was basically a class divide. But since then they don’t represent the divide in the country, which is now something completely different. I’d sum it up in shorthand as the difference between Polly Toynbee of the Guardian, and me. It’s all about social and moral issues, and education and marriage and sex and things of that kind, and not about nationalisation and trade unions any more. The two political parties are basically very much on the Polly Toynbee side. They don’t really have anything to fight each other against , so they have these phony wrestling matches every few years in which they pretend to be opposed to each other and in which huge amounts of money are spent on public relations tricks of various kinds and one party or the other wins….the Tory party nearly died, should have died, in 2010, but was madly saved by the electorate who decided to rescue it from its deserved doom, and also what’s more to endorse David Cameron’s Blairisation of it, so that the Tory party had become under David Cameron a Blairite party and Tory voters rushed to vote to approve this, and so they saved it. If that hadn’t happened the Tory party would in my view have collapsed, been unable to raise funds, or continue, and there would then have been a hole .”

https://youtu.be/HTCAM7t2ntM

The people you describe basically have no political representation at the moment, and the party that arises, or adjusts, to provide it will, over a decade or two, sweep aside one of the old duopoly and become a party of government, much as Labour replaced the Liberals in the early C20th..

181784 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mark, 1, #291 of 2192 🔗

I worry that Laurence Fox will ruin that possibility. At this point in time, his party is a red herring.

182452 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Cheezilla, #292 of 2192 🔗

Have to wait and see on that. It’s early days. If not him, then someone will do it.

181774 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Caroline Watson, 1, #293 of 2192 🔗

De Piffle made his contempt for the less affluent and privileged very clear in the past.

181117 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Bart Simpson, 14, #294 of 2192 🔗

I’ve often wondered that when I’ve heard colleagues wittering on about trump regurgitating what they’ve read on twitter.

I often think it’s got fuck all to do with you, you don’t live in America, you’ve got a good job and live in a nice 750k house in Twickenham. Keep your nose out and worry about things closer to home.

181130 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to stefarm, 6, #295 of 2192 🔗

Exactly. They have a lot to say about America but when you ask them about our problems here and the assault on our civil liberities, they fall silent.

I think this pretty much confirms what Tom Holland said in Triggernometry – the obsession with America by many people is main down to the view that somehow, its so much more exciting with what’s going on in America than here. I would add as well that these people want to be seen as being well informed when they talk about another country when in reality what they know is gleaned from what they read in the internet and media.

181189 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Bart Simpson, 7, #296 of 2192 🔗

Yes, American films and TV shows have been brainwashing us for decades – they all drive big cars and live in big houses blah blah. It’s all crap. Most Americans haven’t even been out of their township and have never travelled more than 50 miles from their house.

182767 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to stefarm, #297 of 2192 🔗

Agree. It’s not only that but they look at the politics and you have these larger than life characters and pantomime like performances so they find that a novelty and entertaining rather than our system which is pretty much tame compared to the US.

181769 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #298 of 2192 🔗

Do the read the grad and watch the beeb, by any chance?

182759 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Cheezilla, #299 of 2192 🔗

They do.

181086 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to chaos, 4, #300 of 2192 🔗

I think it probably has a lot more to do with temperament/personality traits than cognitive ability. High IQ doesn’t equate with pragmatism or protect from emotional reasoning.

181090 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Charlie Blue, 8, #301 of 2192 🔗

Exactly. Fear overrides reason and therefore intellect is of little or no benefit once panic has taken hold. Nor indeed is education or expertise, as we’ve seen from so many “experts” panicking along with the rest and leading us further astray.

181106 ▶▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Charlie Blue, 5, #302 of 2192 🔗

I know an Oxford grad with a 1st from PPE. She has worked for the UN. She believes the official narrative. I would imagine the same is true of the likes of Jenrick and maybe even Wanksock. Alok might have worked out what is going on, or even be part of it, but he’s a career politician and his party could be raping and shooting the plebs and he wouldn’t say a thing. Lord Sumption is still thinking we are in the midst of mistakes. Hitchens? The same despite experience of living in a totalitarian regime. The mainstream archives provide jigsaw pieces:
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/boris-johnson-prorogation-parliament-erdogan-democracy-turkey-a9086011.html

181820 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to chaos, 1, #303 of 2192 🔗

DePiffle showed his hand when he tried to prorogue Parliament – and they still voted for him!

181463 ▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to chaos, 2, #304 of 2192 🔗

I have to assume, that all the assorted politicians and advisors and scientists (SAGE and even the execrable Independent SAGE) and pro-lockdown journalists have above-average IQs. There’s more to this than IQ. A lot more.

I like that quadrant that someone came up with some months ago: people fall into 4 categories dependent on their passive-aggressive nature and their compliant-independent nature, with the bulk (70% IIRC) being compliant and passive. Which is probably right for a species which has evolved to live in cooperative social groups.

181257 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Bart Simpson, 20, #305 of 2192 🔗

Hold strong. We have a decree that we have to wear mask if we move around the office. I manage a team and have in uncertain terms told them that I do not want to see any mask around, They were all happy about this as one of them has a genuine medical condition. I also spoke to the local HSE representative about this who basically said. they are guidelines, if your team decided not to wear them that ok by me. It’s small steps but at least I have made my workplace as normal as possible. The fight continues.

181901 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Thomas_E, 1, #306 of 2192 🔗

Well done! Wear your faces with pride!

182032 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Thomas_E, 1, #307 of 2192 🔗

My riding instructor is ordered to nappy up when teaching in the indoor school ( several hundred square feet of space, draughts through the slats, one instructor, one horse and one rider present). I told her I was getting deaf in my old age and couldn’t hear her instructions through a nappy, besides being exempt from the foul things myself. So all was happy faces.

182790 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Thomas_E, 1, #308 of 2192 🔗

Well done. I don’t wear a mask at work as I’m exempt and the management in my workplace have been helpful and sympathetic.

I have decided to let my colleagues make the realisation themselves. Surely they can’t be blind to the destruction around them. Not to mention the threat of compulsory redundancy becoming more and more of a reality as the days roll by.

181077 Joseph Collins, replying to Joseph Collins, 23, #309 of 2192 🔗

I’m sick and tired of talking about cases like they mean anything. They don’t. It’s been clear for several months now that there never was a deadly virus in circulation unless you happened to be around 80 and with pre-existing comorbidities. I wish I could post an ONS chart up showing clearly that hardly anyone died of flu this year. Why? Flu deaths were re-branded CV19. Keep playing the Govt at their own game by all means but let’s call this for what it is which is a complete hoax and by now it should not need explaining for what purpose.

By the way I’ve not used the term bedwetters but they are sheeples. It’s not their fault but it is they who are keeping us in this dystopian nightmare.

181112 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Joseph Collins, 2, #310 of 2192 🔗

Sheople

181277 ▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to Joseph Collins, 4, #311 of 2192 🔗

Sheeple works for me

181905 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Keen Cook, 1, #312 of 2192 🔗

I like sheeple.

182037 ▶▶ annie, replying to Joseph Collins, 1, #313 of 2192 🔗

It IS their fault.If a human being deliberately renounces everything that makes him or her human, who else’s fault is it?

181078 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 8, #314 of 2192 🔗

The Mayor of Liverpool has just been on Talk Radio, he stated that there were 3000 cases in Liverpool. However, there are only 3451 hospital cases in the whole of English NHS and so I guess he was talking about test results. In my view we need to emphasise the point that an asymptomatic +ve test result = someone who is immune, that is what immunity is. If we have an outbreak of anything it is an outbreak of immunity – good news.
The Mayor also claimed that already 2/3ds of Liverpool’s covid hospital beds were occupied and were in danger of being overwhelmed.It did just occur to me that if there is any point in having a Mayor of Liverpool it should be to ensure that more covid beds were made available. The NHS is now dealing quite well with covid treatments so get some more covid beds to ensure all who get serious symptoms can be treated and discharged.

181083 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Steve Martindale, 7, #315 of 2192 🔗

Its nothing about a virus though, that is the rhetoric to bring in controls.

181095 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Dan Clarke, 2, #316 of 2192 🔗

Frustrating isn’t it? And exhausting. Thankfully some mainstream viepoints are helping to relieve our burden:
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/08/17/has-the-post-covid-future-already-been-decided/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeykREAlYSg
https://www.spectator.com.au/2020/10/dangerous-elites-planning-the-great-reset/

The sheeple only believe what they read or see in the mainstream.

181135 ▶▶ Roadrash, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #317 of 2192 🔗

Calling positive test cases is either wilfully misleading the public or a gross misunderstanding of the facts. Either way it should be a requirement of office that the mayor understands what he is talking about before spouting off.

181222 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Steve Martindale, 3, #318 of 2192 🔗

Thank god Liverpool is the only city in the country with a mad mayor. Oh wait..

181918 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Steve Martindale, #319 of 2192 🔗

So the interviewer clearly didn’t do his stuff, like asking “how many of tose are in hospital?” etc!

181080 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 29, #320 of 2192 🔗

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/pdfs/mm6936a5-H.pdf

From CDC.
Those who get sick from Covid:

3.9% never wear a cloth mask
3.9% rarely wear a cloth mask
70.6% always wear a cloth mask.

I rest my case M’lud.

181082 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Margaret, 5, #321 of 2192 🔗

Presumably the other 21% are in full hazmat gear.

181097 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Charlie Blue, 11, #322 of 2192 🔗

and wet the bed.

181101 ▶▶▶▶ anon, replying to chaos, 1, #323 of 2192 🔗

ha!

182044 ▶▶▶▶ annie, replying to chaos, 1, #324 of 2192 🔗

You are getting dangerously close to the Naughty Word. Go stand in the corner.

181104 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Charlie Blue, 1, #325 of 2192 🔗

there are two more categories:

Never 6 (3.9)
Rarely 6 (3.9)
Sometimes 11 (7.2)
Often 22 (14.4)
Always 108 (70.6)

181121 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Margaret, 1, #326 of 2192 🔗

I thought the columns showed there was no effect. The control has similar numbers (74% to 71%). So you are positive or not irrespective of wearing a mask

181226 ▶▶▶ matt, replying to mhcp, #327 of 2192 🔗

Sure, but you need to take into account mass compliance with mask wearing. If you told me that 7.8% of people never or rarely wear a mask when they’re “supposed” to and 70.6% always wear a mask, at least when they’re “supposed” to, I would say that sounds about right.

181351 ▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to matt, 1, #328 of 2192 🔗

Studies like this also suffer from self reporting bias. If a mask wearer got covid-19 PCR and had been zealous about it, would they reveal that they had actually broken the rules? I’d say that goes on a lot, people shouting ‘wear a mask’ while choosing when it suits them.

So much time and energy wasted on the mask debate. To no effect.

181999 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to mhcp, #329 of 2192 🔗

Yes, if they cycle the PCR test enough times.

181178 ▶▶ Pancho the Grey, replying to Margaret, #330 of 2192 🔗

What were the rest wearing?

181081 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 18, #331 of 2192 🔗

Will being sceptical save us from the controls the west is introducing, doubt it. Using the gullible to take our freedom and have control over our lives. The muzzle wearers, the nhs clappers have all brought us to a dangerous point and our own Parliament is complicit. This is not anything about a mild virus, never has been, all about the propaganda Fear factor.

181091 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Dan Clarke, 9, #332 of 2192 🔗

Parliament is sidelined. Boris has somehow (so far) managed a coup. Kier is complicit in that coup i.e. he knows where the goal is and is happily following the Eton oaf whilst pretending to joust him.

181138 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Dan Clarke, 8, #333 of 2192 🔗

As a retired person working on our large garden in north Devon and doing wildlife conservation work I find I have absolutely no idea about great resets or worldwide conspiracy theories, maybe there is? maybe not? I have no idea. In so far as this is about the virus then I feel I can make a useful comment, bizarrely i have 24 people following my comments on twitter and so in a very small way I am doing something.
But if this is about a great re-set and worldwide conspiracy then I am not sure what if anything we can do about it? The virus is the stated reason and so at least we can try to undermine this virus pantomime.

182005 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #334 of 2192 🔗

Surely everyone here is doing that?
However, we know this isn’t about a virus, so it’s good to be aware of the underlying agenda.

181088 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 11, #335 of 2192 🔗

Prof Sir Roger Lackland (?) on BBC R2 before 8am news,
Nick Robinson ” are pubs and restaurants really responsible for rising cases ?”

“Well Nick, I’m not in Sage so not privy to the data but when you look at pictures of people crowding outside venues it seems obvious that this will increase cases”

Following the science again.

Oh, and why is the data secret anyway, we paid for it ?

181094 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to karenovirus, 11, #336 of 2192 🔗

So whoever he is he has just made the case that booting everyone out at 10pm is the worst of all worlds.

181105 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to karenovirus, 13, #337 of 2192 🔗

Just the kind of prick I’d expect to be wheeled out by the BBC. Even though the hospitality industry only accounts for around 2% of the so called infections. But hey, why let the truth get in the way of another fearmongering bell end.

181113 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to karenovirus, 9, #338 of 2192 🔗

When I see people crowding outside venues it seems obvious that they are happy and not ill.

The only illness I can see is within those that want to stop that and spread misery.

181176 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to karenovirus, 8, #339 of 2192 🔗

Why can’t these divs put 2+2 together, nobody is fucking ill, if they were they wouldn’t be going out. An asymptomatic person cannot spread a deadly virus.

181273 ▶▶ Keen Cook, replying to karenovirus, 6, #340 of 2192 🔗

Yes I heard it too. He didn’t know, didn’t have access to any data, wasn’t a member of SAGE, was supposing the NHS might become overwhelmed – the whole slot was vague, fear inducing, uncertain and a slot filler. BBC doing what they’ve been doing since the start of this madness – making sure the message is one of terror and doom. Someone somewhere is influencing this media delivery. The presenter did try and point out that there were only 70 deaths compared to thousands in March but then he kind of lost the question. I wondered if he had received a message in his headpiece

181096 John Stone, 7, #341 of 2192 🔗

Rowan Dean on the Great Reset – reminds me of what journalism used to be like:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeykREAlYSg

181103 Mark, 7, #342 of 2192 🔗

Police WILL probe ‘race-hate’ interview: Scotland Yard sparks freedom of speech outcry over investigation into Darren Grimes’ interview with David Starkey
As noted previously in the case of coronapanic laws, if you make stupid laws, stupid people will apply them stupidly.

Though in this case it’s as much a problem of the kind of people (woke fools) being promoted within institutions such as the police for decades now, as it is the laws providing them with a pretext for their harassment of opinions they dislike.

181108 Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 10, #343 of 2192 🔗

Had to take a colleague to hospital last night due to an injury. I was expecting to witness a whole new level of social distancing madness, but no, I would say it was more normal than the average pub!

182010 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 1, #344 of 2192 🔗

Good to hear!

181111 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 13, #345 of 2192 🔗

Just seen a notice in our doctors’ surgery window:

Did you get great care today?

Rate and review this surgery at iwantgreatcare.org

I keep saying it, ffs and I despair …

181116 ▶▶ chaos, replying to kh1485, 10, #346 of 2192 🔗

Can’t get through on phone to my surgery. I will never trust another doctor again.

181147 ▶▶▶ James Leary #KBF, replying to chaos, #347 of 2192 🔗

Took a long time, but we got you there in the end.

182056 ▶▶ annie, replying to kh1485, 1, #348 of 2192 🔗

Go ahead and rate them. See how many minus signs you can fit in.

181119 Roadrash, replying to Roadrash, 4, #349 of 2192 🔗

Joe Anderson has been going around tv, radio and media outlets for weeks basically begging for more restrictions. Do not believe a word that comes out of this man’s mouth.

https://twitter.com/sw1a0aa/status/1315394820395937797?s=20

181380 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Roadrash, 3, #350 of 2192 🔗

Yeah I noticed that. Mind you, if I had his obesity problem, I’d probably be a mite worried about the virus as well.

181120 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 5, #351 of 2192 🔗

Immunity
Deniers
In
Oppositon
To us

IDIOT or IDIOTus

181346 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #352 of 2192 🔗

i like

181122 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 8, #353 of 2192 🔗

Carl Heneghan (@carlheneghan) Tweeted:
Tracking UK Covid-19 cases https://t.co/P46rAPaica https://t.co/TNvUmb3B6N
https://twitter.com/carlheneghan/status/1315325798463737857?s=20

Second wave (ripple) starting to roll over? We can now see the purpose of the Twitty and Unbalanced graph. It is to show us that the measures put in place have saved us all from certain death and protected so many lives.

Oliver Dowden, the Secretary for culture, media and sport, is quoted as saying that the aim of the government’s three tier system is to get the virus under control by the New Year and hopefully before Christmas.

Just following the script that was written months ago. So predictable!

181205 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Margaret, 2, #354 of 2192 🔗

It was always this. A sadly obvious attempt by the government, to make themselves look like a superhero squad. The problem is that there is now so much overwhelming evidence against them. I suspect Act 3 of their Infinity War, will involve quietly changing PCR test results and then proving that lockdown 2 etc has been a roaring success.

182033 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to PoshPanic, #355 of 2192 🔗

Well the sooner the better at least please!

181123 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 6, #356 of 2192 🔗

Alien is a good word instead of bedwetter.
Last time I went shopping, watching people around me in the queue to pay, I felt like I had landed on a different planet.

181134 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Silke David, 3, #357 of 2192 🔗

I agree, there is definitely a feeling of encountering a different species.

182061 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #358 of 2192 🔗

Well, they’re definitely not human.

181156 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to Silke David, 1, #359 of 2192 🔗

I still like the credulous or creduli if plural? Seriously it has to be brainwashing on a massive scale, or something put in the water ( which I’ve somehow missed?) total obedience in a Labrador is great in human beings it is NOT.

181124 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 7, #360 of 2192 🔗

(Please don’t take this post seriously at all, I’m just shrugging, really)

I’m genuinely surprised at the result of the “bedwetter” vote. From what I’d read here, I didn’t think there was a snowball’s chance in my grandmother’s cocktail glass that people would think it should be “retired”. If even this is possible, then all may not be lost for Trump!

181149 ▶▶ Jakehadlee, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 9, #361 of 2192 🔗

It’s just sometimes is more useful to be smart than angry. Don’t alienate the people you need to support you.

181151 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to Jakehadlee, 3, #362 of 2192 🔗

BUT, don’t spend all your time trying to be offended!

181217 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 4, #363 of 2192 🔗

I think the word can still be used in the comments – Toby is just going to avoid using it in the editorial, to avoid potentially putting new readers off from reading through the articles.

182038 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Carrie, #364 of 2192 🔗

That’s sensible!

181125 l835, replying to l835, 8, #365 of 2192 🔗

Bank of England investigating negative interest rates? Brace for the raid on savings…

181137 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to l835, #366 of 2192 🔗

Also means banks PAY businesses to have them take loans.

181139 ▶▶▶ l835, replying to mhcp, #367 of 2192 🔗

If only…

181142 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to mhcp, 4, #368 of 2192 🔗

It doesn’t.

Negative interest rates means that the Bank of England charges banks for leaving money on deposit with them.

Given QE there is a lot of banks with money on deposit with the Bank of England, which they can’t get rid of in aggregate – since only other banks can hold that type of money.

Therefore negative interest rates is a *tax* on banks, which they have to recover by putting *up* loan rates.

Because, of course, at the moment few people want to borrow more.

181148 ▶▶▶ IanE, replying to mhcp, #369 of 2192 🔗

It should do – but does not!

181140 ▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to l835, 1, #370 of 2192 🔗

QE and ever reducing interest rates are the only tools in the BOE toolbox. Once you hit zero interest the only option is to go negative.

181144 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #371 of 2192 🔗

Except it doesn’t work – because of the way banks operate.

That anybody is talking about it is deeply disturbing. It means those in charge don’t actually understand bank accounting.

181152 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2020, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #372 of 2192 🔗

It’s been tried in other countries and there have been rumblings of negative interest rates for months, maybe even longer as I’m sure it has been considered long before this crisis.

My suspicion is that it is inevitable in order to get people to spend rather than save.

181430 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #373 of 2192 🔗

Negative interest rates for large depositors could hit wealthy individuals. In the eurozone, they already apply to large corporate entities but also cash sitting in pension funds and credit union reserves.

I work for a company that provides treasury administration services to multinationals and credit unions – I’ve seen these negative interests rates in practice.

182045 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Nobody2020, 1, #374 of 2192 🔗

Well if they want people to spend, they’d better let us out of mockdown pronto!

181287 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Lucan Grey, #375 of 2192 🔗

If anyone didn’t learn that lesson following the global financial crash of 2008, they really weren’t paying attention.

182229 ▶▶▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Lucan Grey, #376 of 2192 🔗

Why should they? They don’t understand anything else?

181127 jo will tell the truth, replying to jo will tell the truth, 18, #377 of 2192 🔗

Let’s just ignore the damned lockdown. They can’t arrest us all.

181145 ▶▶ IanE, replying to jo will tell the truth, 6, #378 of 2192 🔗

No, but they can shut down and destroy businesses and this is what is most destructive and irreversible.

181204 ▶▶▶ jo will tell the truth, replying to IanE, 9, #379 of 2192 🔗

The pub landlords, business owners etc are to blame for this. If they showed some backbone and unified then they can’t shut them down. The government has divided and conquered.

181283 ▶▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to jo will tell the truth, 9, #380 of 2192 🔗

It needs the big players and organisations to do this, one pub landlord on his own can’t.
Looking at you, Wetherspoons, big breweries, FSB, chambers of commerce, Britis Retail Consortium. They are collaborators.

182828 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to thinkaboutit, #381 of 2192 🔗

And don’t forget the major cultural and heritage institutions – National Trust, English Heritage, Royal Opera House, London Symphony Orchestra, Royal Shakespeare Company, etc. They’ve been silent about this lockdown but are happy to take their begging bowl to the government rather than protest and lobby to open everything up.

They should all band together to urge the government to end this insanity.

United they stand, divided they fall.

181157 ▶▶ MizakeTheMizan, replying to jo will tell the truth, 5, #382 of 2192 🔗

Many of us were doing just that a couple of months ago, but then they started shutting down the pubs and businesses that didn’t comply.

181167 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to MizakeTheMizan, 3, #383 of 2192 🔗

Exactly.

181128 mhcp, replying to mhcp, 5, #384 of 2192 🔗

Apparently the number of cycles on your PCR test is not given to your GP and hence to you. Can any doctors here confirm that.

Something to do with being “proprietary”.

Surely that simple piece of information would be a major help? Considering that if used as indicative (PCR is qualitative) and that cycles above 30 will be noise, it would be easy to assess efficacy.

Shouldn’t the government mandate all tests to come with cycle rates?

181141 ▶▶ DeepBlueYonder, replying to mhcp, 12, #385 of 2192 🔗

I have just written to the Rt Hon Greg Clark, MP (Chair of the House of Commons Science and Technology Committee) to raise the following questions/issues, as part of the joint inquiry into Coronavirus: lessons learnt :

“In respect of all Pillar 1 and Pillar 2 PCR (polymerase chain reaction) testing for the coronavirus SARS-CoV2 between 1 March 2020 and 12 October, 2020, could you please advise:

(i) what definition has been used to determine that a test is ‘positive’
(ii) what the range, mean, median, and modal number of amplification cycles was used as the threshold in relation to ‘positive’ PCR tests.”

https://committees.parliament.uk/work/657/coronavirus-lessons-learnt/

181162 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to DeepBlueYonder, 2, #386 of 2192 🔗

I have also written to my MP Geoffrey Cox about testing but just got the usual ‘fobbed of’ reply, he has passed my concerns on to some black hole in the Health Dept.

181132 CGL, replying to CGL, 3, #387 of 2192 🔗

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/552013

To demand false positive PCR stats

181340 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to CGL, #388 of 2192 🔗

Done. Already 6.124 signatures

Publish false positive and negative Covid-19 test data for Pillar 2

The Government should publish the false positive and negative test results data for PCR tests on Pillar 2 since the outbreak began, and include these results alongside the graphs and other data the government already publishes on our response to the Covid pandemic.

181133 Nobody2020, replying to Nobody2020, 11, #389 of 2192 🔗

What exactly is all this for?

Are we saving people, regardless of whether they want to be saved or even if they need to be saved. After all, if we prevent them needing to be saved in the first place then how do we know they would have needed saving? Is nobody allowed to die from this virus but it’s ok to die in other ways?

Or is all this purely to protect the NHS? Nobody is allowed to get ill or die whilst using up vital NHS resource. However, it’s ok to get ill or die at home as long as the NHS is saved.

If it is purely about NHS capacity then what is/was the point of the Nightingale hospitals?

So what is the objective? Are people allowed to die from this virus or not?

181143 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Nobody2020, 4, #390 of 2192 🔗

They remain what they have always been: well-meaning idiots (mostly), charlatans (quite a lot) and (a very few) maniacs in pursuit of utopias (“Zerocovidia”, in this case) that they know, in their heart of hearts, are unachievable. So the more things go wrong, the more they will deny it and the angrier and more desperate they will get.

181155 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #391 of 2192 🔗

Nomad, I like this take on it. Especially the maniacs.

A few weeks ago I was at a stage when I was concerned about the utopias, but now I just realise they are in la la land. Especially Klaus Schwab.

181146 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Nobody2020, 12, #392 of 2192 🔗

It is no longer about a virus if it ever was.
The government are building a police state.A few months ago the government unveiled a scale,likened to the Nando’s one,but it did at least envisage a return to normality with a vaccine.
This new traffic light scale of repression doesn’t even give the hope of returning to normality.The lightest level is what we are experiencing now.
I feel despite the growing unease with all the restrictions that the public have become institutionalised and this is indeed the new normal and there is no going back.

181186 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Jonathan Palmer, #393 of 2192 🔗

Yep.

181212 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 2, #394 of 2192 🔗

What’s insidious about the traffic lights is the way it will cause great unease and destabilisation wondering whether you are deemed red, yellow or green and the switching in between. That in itself is a huge mental health issue.

Isn’t it the same traffic light system in China? If so, the Chinese of course cannot dissent. We can.

181214 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #395 of 2192 🔗

Yes, and if you watch the Rowan Dean interview on Sky, he points out towards the end that China have been welcomed in to the WEF to give insights/advice!!!!

181298 ▶▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #396 of 2192 🔗

The Chinese traffic light system is for people not places,but is similar to the track and trace app.I just read an article in the NYT to refresh myself about it;The article was from March and the interesting thing were the comments.They were all highly critical of China’s repressive state and the intrusion of privacy.It shows how far we have fallen in such a short space of time

181487 ▶▶▶ Marialta, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 3, #397 of 2192 🔗

You are spot on. It’s the end point of the ‘risk society’ – did you notice there is no low category of risk? Only medium and upwards, it reminds me of marketing condoms in large and extra large – who would buy small? 😏

181161 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Nobody2020, 16, #398 of 2192 🔗

There are two tiers of lockdown sceptics. Those that think this is a series of mistakes. Like the sheeple, these folks are also easily herded. It’s the opposing narrative the powers that be want you to believe i.e. it’s the least dangerous (to them) opposing narrative. And the second tier are those who realise that the virus is merely a trojan horse for digital ID and the great reset. The latter is the truth and we are growing more rapidly than is comfortable for the powers that be. My 75 year old mum has gone from a frightened sheeple to entertaining the Great Reset in less than 2 months.

We are undergoing a Great Greta Davos Bilderberg Klaus Charles faux green coup.

181188 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to chaos, 5, #399 of 2192 🔗

Yes, that video on Sky News Australia yesterday was great for explaining it all: In case anyone missed it, you can see it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeykREAlYSg&feature=youtu.be

Share widely!

181456 ▶▶▶ deldor, replying to chaos, 1, #400 of 2192 🔗

I’ve always been a bit cautious about big conspiracies but accept they do exist. The problem for me with current events is deciding who may or may not be actively supporting them.

My current feeling is we may have a bit of a mixture of motivations which are using and exploiting where we are now.

I suspect many are in the greed category and attempting to get people to wait for and have one of the several vaccines being developed, we have evidence of some in positions in SAGE who have financial interest in big pharma which does seem to be being ignored.

There has also to be some who are too stupid to see how ridiculous the claims about the risk are, and are compliant in what they are being advised.

Then there are a surprising number of those advising, who seem to have directly or indirectly received funding from certain dubious organisations that might be backed by rather wealthy and scary opinionated individuals.

I also find it very strange that at least one signed up member of the Communist party of the UK is allowed to sit on SAGE, given that they are committed to destroying capitalism in all forms.

I personally find the whole Track and Trace stuff sinister and a thin end of a wedge when looking at personal liberty violation, and a form of state surveillance we should be concerned about.

It seems clear that the environmental lobby, “rights” organisations et al are all jumping on the band wagon to further complicate things!

What the result will be? Who the hell knows?

181657 ▶▶▶▶ helen, replying to deldor, #401 of 2192 🔗

or perhaps covid was slipped onto the climate bandwagon ?

182119 ▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to helen, #402 of 2192 🔗

Possibly!

181172 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Nobody2020, 3, #403 of 2192 🔗

‘Our NHS’ is imediately recognisable and very emotive. It rings a bell with the sheep much more than any numbers or facts. They are just yanking our chain. When the sheep hear ‘save our NHS’, they don’t even stop to think “Hang on, we’ve managed so far, and we have more capacity now”, they just swallow it.

181159 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 50, #404 of 2192 🔗

I write from the North West of England. You might not have heard of this place, but it’s people are part of the 87% of the UK population that do not live in London. For those not too good with numbers, that means ‘nearly all’. We don’t have ‘Pret’ or ‘TfL’ or ‘Zones’ or whatever. What we do have is a simple desire to live a normal life.
Someone needs to kill this government now.

181166 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Sam Vimes, #405 of 2192 🔗

Ee, but you do have “Old Tom”. I bet the don’t have that down South. (Not forgetting Vimto either.)

181184 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Ned of the Hills, #406 of 2192 🔗

Steady on, Ned – only to be used in extreme circumstances. Hmmm…

181173 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to Sam Vimes, 5, #407 of 2192 🔗

Not in the north but totally agree with you – plus if Dodgy stats are being used to shut down the north ( trial run) what makes people think the thing won’t be rolled out over the whole UK?

181179 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to KBuchanan, 5, #408 of 2192 🔗

Of course it will. This cycle of stop start will run and run. If they are not physically stopped, this is forever.

181163 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 5, #409 of 2192 🔗

Since 1991, governments in this country have been more concerned with news management than government.

The wasted majorities of the Blair years well illustrate this.

This government has one policy: to get Brexit done. Everything else is subordinate to that aim.

So these hilariously dotty covid measures are simply to help manage the news cycle and distract from the Brexit negotiations.

That’s it…nothing to do with the virus itself, long since recognised as another seasonal common cold coronavirus.

181190 ▶▶ Chicot, replying to Tim Bidie, 4, #410 of 2192 🔗

What about the dotty covid measures in other countries? Seems unlikely they would have anything to do with Brexit.

181254 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Tim Bidie, 3, #411 of 2192 🔗

Brexit is irrelevant.I dare say that once the negotiations are over we won’t notice the difference.The establishment are wholly committed to the EU project and will never let us fully leave.
The real problem is our vassal status to the USA and it’s Globalist organisations.

181279 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Jonathan Palmer, 2, #412 of 2192 🔗

It’s also irrelavent when most countries think and behave the same anyway.

181171 FlynnQuill, replying to FlynnQuill, 78, #413 of 2192 🔗

My wife and I live in small seaside town in the North East of England. On Saturday night we decided we would go to one of our local restaurants before the fat bag of puss in No 10 tried to put them out of business once again. Before we got to the restaurant, we visited one of our local pubs, had a couple and wished him luck for the next round of government lunacy. Anyway, we just arrived at the restaurant and who was standing outside but two Covid Nazis from the local council. Dressed in vests, wearing council sweatshirts and clip boards as well as looking very stern and authoritative. Well, I was brought up to challenge bullies, especially ones from the state, I am a man of conviction if nothing else. So, my wife and I follow these two into the restaurant. The restaurant is half full, in normal times it would have been packed. So, the two Nazis move to one side and ask for the manager. I turn around, look them in the eye and tell them that they should be ashamed of themselves for doing what they are doing. At this point their jaws drop and they just stand there, and the restaurant goes quiet. We are then shown to our seats and one of them makes a complaint to the manager about what I said. The manager turns around and said, “it’s a free country, he can say what he likes”. Result!! We then sat down and had a very good night.

These people need to be stood up to, “I’m following orders” just isn’t a good enough excuse as far as I’m concerned. That is how the Nazi Holocaust machine managed to murder 6 million people in the death camps. All ran by vast swaths of jobsworths working behind desks in offices. Probably the greatest logistics operation of our time. If people think it could not happen here, have a good look around you. On Saturday night, there were more Covid Marshalls than punters.

181197 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to FlynnQuill, 16, #414 of 2192 🔗

Saw a documentary years ago, forget where or what, but I always remember a guy, talking about the Holocaust, and saying “It’s always only a couple of steps away”. That’s to say, someone gets power, some ‘minor’ rules become embedded, people fall in line etc. Sound familiar?

181256 ▶▶ alw, replying to FlynnQuill, 15, #415 of 2192 🔗

Camden Council posted leaflets through residents doors yesterday with erroneous information about the virus. Have written to councillors an extract..

“This morning we have received the attached leaflet from Camden Council.

To say that it is misleading is an understatement. It is downright dishonest and an attempt to scare people.

Firstly it is incorrect to say there is now law that everyone must now wear masks. The exemptions to mask wearing still apply but there is no mention of this. Furthermore there is no requirement for anyone to wear a mask when entering the restaurant to have a meal when walking to the table or using the facilities. There is only guidance and I point you to the information below…

I hope that you will be able to take this up with Camden Council and make it clear to them that they face possible legal action for putting out what is clearly factually incorrect information”.

Suggest others who receive such info do the same.

181265 ▶▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to alw, 5, #416 of 2192 🔗

Again! Busybodies deciding what is ‘law’ without even looking at the law. Takes five minutes.

183190 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to alw, 1, #417 of 2192 🔗

I received something along the same lines from Tesco and Morrisons. I have written to both of them and their replies are conspicuous only by their absence. Morrisons no longer answer the phone you just get a message that they cannot answer because they are too busy feeding the nation. What a load of shit.

181285 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to FlynnQuill, 4, #418 of 2192 🔗

Good for you.

181314 ▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to FlynnQuill, 8, #419 of 2192 🔗

Nice work, I look forward to meeting people round here. I’ll tell them that they are helping the government to commit economic genocide against it’s own people and ask them if they have any relatives that are having trouble getting hospital treatment.

I’ll then tell them to kindly eff off and that if I catch them on my property, I will be reporting them to the police for trespassing.

181336 ▶▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to captainbeefheart, 11, #420 of 2192 🔗

I’m with Delingpole, these people are collaborators against the public, enforcing the government rhetoric which is clearly very wrong. Just little authoritarians lying dormant, just waiting for the time when they can exert their sickness on the public. The worst of the worst, and I will continue to call these people out when ever I see them. My conscience compels me to.

182069 ▶▶ annie, replying to FlynnQuill, 1, #421 of 2192 🔗

Well done you. Stand up to the bullies and they usually crumble. If they don’t, it’s time for a fight.

182830 ▶▶▶ RichardJames, replying to annie, 1, #422 of 2192 🔗

I think that I’m going to try chanting “Quisling!” and see if anyone else joins in. Even if they don’t, they can’t complain about something which is not a direct insult, but is an exact description of what they are doing.

182870 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to FlynnQuill, 1, #423 of 2192 🔗

Hear, hear!!! Well done.

And agree, we need to stand up against bullies and call them out. Plus remind them that when the day of reckoning comes “I was only following orders” and “It was health and safety” won’t wash as an excuse.

183191 ▶▶ Rowan, replying to FlynnQuill, #424 of 2192 🔗

We either make our stand now or we will get marched off to the death camps a bit later. By death camps I really mean vaccination centres.

181174 Suzyv, #425 of 2192 🔗

This is 3 weeks old and may have already been posted-a really good listen from Sky News Australia. The message is clear and applies equally to here: https://youtu.be/kGBEaYEtiys

181177 Mike May, replying to Mike May, 5, #426 of 2192 🔗

I’m currently reading The Hunger Games – a trilogy based around the ruthless and cruel oppression of the regions by a totalitarian central government. Appropriate, somehow.

181366 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Mike May, 4, #427 of 2192 🔗

Not my cup of tea (too pc) but it’s amusing to observe that so many of the people who will happily express their approval of such warning literature about the dangers of authoritarianism etc have been quite happy to support covid dictats, snitching and exemplary or collective punishments of dissenters.

181180 Stuart, 10, #428 of 2192 🔗

The NHS lockdown is social atrocity.

181187 Nobody2020, 14, #429 of 2192 🔗

I know it’s a bit of a myth but the term Lemmings could be appropriate:

Lemming (Noun)

  • a person who unthinkingly joins a mass movement, especially a headlong rush to destruction
181192 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 19, #430 of 2192 🔗

What really “gets me” is when the North comes under more and more draconian measures; most of their local mayors,politicians and councillors don’t demand an end to the pointless stupidity; they seem to accept the situation “as long as we get a substantial financial package to help our businesses that are suffering and facing bankruptcy and those who are facing unemployment etc”
It seems to me that it’s not just the government who is “in denial”

181199 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Fingerache Philip., 9, #431 of 2192 🔗

Exactly, none of them said end it all and advised the people to ignore the lunacy and there is no danger.

It’s all about money just so they can sit at home on their fat arses.

Liverpool was city of culture in 2008!!

181207 ▶▶▶ Basics, replying to stefarm, 5, #432 of 2192 🔗

National lockdown by regional means that’s all that’s going on. There’s a clue in two key words being used in the ‘North’, ‘Andy’ and ‘Burnham’. Never trust, never.

181251 ▶▶▶▶ nottingham69, replying to Basics, 2, #433 of 2192 🔗

No Burnham is a very poisonous snake.

181213 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to stefarm, 2, #434 of 2192 🔗

I take it that there are plenty of pawnbrokers in this country because we shall certainly need em.
PS: I wonder what you would get for a second hand Prime minister,only 12 months old and only (I hope) used once.

181290 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Fingerache Philip., #435 of 2192 🔗

Ohhh, I think his been used more than once. A right old banger.

181202 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Fingerache Philip., 5, #436 of 2192 🔗

As long as they get some control and get paid, they will accept it.

181228 ▶▶ alw, replying to Fingerache Philip., 7, #437 of 2192 🔗

The Government are doing this because they know they contravened their powers under the 1984 Public Health Act in respect of emergencies. The Act does not give them powers to impose blanket bans. They are now trying to cover their tracks and hope the Judicial Review on October 29th will be in their favour. What the Government now needs to do is convince the Courts there is an emergency which we all know there isn’t.

181258 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to alw, 9, #438 of 2192 🔗

Correct! As Sumption has pointed out, they should have used the Civil Contingencies Act, but chose not to because that would have required more Parliamentary scrutiny and more often – they would not have been able to just issue SIs all the time.

I am sure the ‘lawyer on holiday’ reason for postponing Simon Dolan’s case was just to buy time and artificially inflate the number of cases, in order to make their actions appear proportionate, when they are not. Their latest tactic is to add flu cases to Covid to make things seem worse..

181719 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Carrie, #439 of 2192 🔗

Any judge worth his/her salt should not let the government talk about cases, when they mean positive tests from a dubious method.

181247 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to Fingerache Philip., #440 of 2192 🔗

They want as many of their population state dependent as they can, shutting business assists greatly. The financial package includes more testing and tracing surveillance, to augment their Universities mass testing. The aim then is to keep this going. Will the scousers see through this?.

181289 ▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to nottingham69, 3, #441 of 2192 🔗

Scouseland is getting it in the neck for being the only red enclave in N. W.Yes scousers have a fuck you attitude, lets hope it rallies now.

181275 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Fingerache Philip., 4, #442 of 2192 🔗

This is what a one party state looks like.They are all globalist pc blairite scum now.
What this crisis has revealed is the rotten state of our country.All our institutions and public services have been corrupted.

182114 ▶▶ Edward, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #443 of 2192 🔗

The arts and music sector is much the same, it’s nearly all “give us more money” when it should be “relax the restrictions”.

182677 ▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to Edward, #444 of 2192 🔗

Or actually really believe in what you do.

181194 djaustin, replying to djaustin, -7, #445 of 2192 🔗

So, cases doubling every two weeks not one week then.

181208 ▶▶ Steve, replying to djaustin, 3, #446 of 2192 🔗

The curve looks fairly flat to me at the moment.

181220 ▶▶ IanE, replying to djaustin, 1, #447 of 2192 🔗

What about the doubling time for number of tests though?

181311 ▶▶ Mark, replying to djaustin, 1, #448 of 2192 🔗

The numbers might have doubled in a particular two week period, but that’s a long, long way from “doubling every two weeks”, which implies sustained growth at that rate.

I fact it looks as though the growth is showing signs of plateauing, as was always predicted by rational, honest observers who had been watching what has happened elsewhere.

The Second Ripple is just a seasonal upturn combined with a bit of filling in the gaps.

182253 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to djaustin, #449 of 2192 🔗

We now know that pavements can harbour the virus.
Mandatory stilts?

181198 jo will tell the truth, 12, #450 of 2192 🔗

Noses are red
Covid’s a flu
We saw this coming
Why didn’t you?

181200 Basics, replying to Basics, 10, #451 of 2192 🔗

The Great Barrington Declaration page displays the following text after yesterdays outages:

“current signature count
239,470
Signatures will be made public after approval

With the current success of the campaign we have to ensure that the server remains available for signatures to be added.
We will update this page with a static list of signatures as time allows”

The site has had slight design changes, it appears as though running three real-time counters compounded with people checking back to watch the counters tick over as a fast rate was too much. The new design will update less frequently.

That is my non expert assessment of the situation.

181206 ▶▶ dickyboy, replying to Basics, 1, #452 of 2192 🔗

You’re exactly right.

181306 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Basics, #453 of 2192 🔗

That’s my impression as well.

Personally I hope they’ll try to leverage the expert signatures in particular into some real influence, but they have to be able to have confidence that most, at least, of them are genuine.

181201 Matt Mounsey, replying to Matt Mounsey, 4, #454 of 2192 🔗

So, the Head of the Free Speech Union is “retiring” certain phrases to be used among his disciples? Because it hwurt some pweaples fweelings? Doesn’t look like free speech to me.

Since when did any majority get to tell others what terms they can and can’t use? I also doubt there’s a majority consensus on this, since it’s the aggrieved that almost always complain the loudest because they feel the moral entitlement to do so.

Well I think the people walking around with masks on, getting paid by the government to engage in apocalypse theater at the public expense are “bedwetters”. They are infants that couldn’t wait to become a victim and revel in hysteria. They have no thought for the future and need to be guided on the right path by the adults in this country, which I was led to believe this site represented. They have no capacity to control their hysteria and must be guided by the reason of their more responsible fellow citizens.

And for those who whinge about my use of the term and want to police my use of it, who think they have some moral authority over me for my use of the term, I dub thee the less affectionate “bedshitters”. You’re shitting all over what was a perfectly good evidence based hazing of the idiots in our society that are sending it off a cliff. These people need to be mocked into questioning their own behavior and recoiling from themselves in horror.

And if Toby Young wants PC the language on this site, he’ll become the Bedshitter in Chief, such a mockery of the glorious mockery this site was founded on it is.

181210 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Matt Mounsey, 9, #455 of 2192 🔗

I actually don’t think the word is banned from the comments section; more that he is *personally* going to avoid using it in the editorial, in order to avoid unnecessarily cause new readers from potentially clicking away from the site.

181248 ▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Carrie, 1, #456 of 2192 🔗

When people curate their language to avoid offending others it undermines the honesty of their position. I believe he’ll lose more support than he’ll gain in the long run.

First instincts are usually the best and I was on board because of them. Honesty should be the goal, not modifying the message to suit the sensitivities of the very behavior you’re lampooning. That’s hack journalism.

181396 ▶▶▶▶ Muzz Off, replying to Matt Mounsey, 5, #457 of 2192 🔗

Ceasing to use a word that might be considered an ad-hominem insult is not necessarily being dishonest or changing the message though is it? I’m sure if our most trusted skeptical journalists didn’t filter their language at all they wouldn’t even get published. God knows what Hitchens’ internal monologue is like but it’s certainly much harsher than his admirably measured articles.

181211 ▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to Matt Mounsey, 5, #458 of 2192 🔗

He’s not forbidding you to sue the term. What terms Toby uses is up to him. let us know how much money you’ve donated since the start of this insanity and people might take you more seriously. But I suspect you are one of the 77th sent to demoralise.

181237 ▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Londo Mollari, #459 of 2192 🔗

“What terms Toby uses is up to him” – Then why is he buckling to pressure from his readers?

“How much money you’ve donated” – So you think you can tell people what words they can use because you’ve donated money to them? Don’t you see that this reinforces my arguments about free speech?

181259 ▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 5, #460 of 2192 🔗

I think you’ll find that telling people what words they should or shouldn’t use IS free speech – if you don’t like it then tough!

Toby isn’t telling you what terms you can or can’t use, so just grow up and stop being a tosser.

181489 ▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to deldor, -2, #461 of 2192 🔗

Does throwing around words like “tosser” on the internet make you feel like a big tough person? Good for you.

You can tell people what to do, it doesn’t mean they have to listen. My original point was that as head of the Free Speech Union I think Toby should have stuck to his guns and told you bed-shitters where to shove it.

181520 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Matt Mounsey, 1, #462 of 2192 🔗

Tosser

181526 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Two-Six, #463 of 2192 🔗

Clap clap clap. Who’s a big boy?

182097 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Matt Mounsey, #464 of 2192 🔗

lol

182183 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 1, #465 of 2192 🔗

Lol! You might be surprised if u you ever meet me in person!

Why Toby wouldn’t give a shit what you think is fairly obvious.

Get a life. Tosser.

182501 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to deldor, #466 of 2192 🔗

Why would I ever meet you in person? You do understand that people who speak on these forums don’t meet each other in person, right?

Still, I use my own name on these message boards. Not a pseudonym like you bedshitters. If you want to find me in person you’re welcome to do so. I’d really like to see if you have the balls to say anything you’ve said to me on here in person. I very much doubt it.

182756 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 1, #467 of 2192 🔗

Why would anyone want to meet a fool like you in person? I think most people would probably prefer to clean up dog shit.

181260 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Matt Mounsey, 7, #468 of 2192 🔗

No one applied pressure to Toby – he asked for peoples’ opinions and has listened to the ‘for’ and ‘against’, weighed them up and come to his own decision. It is his site after all…

181267 ▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Carrie, 4, #469 of 2192 🔗

Exactly.

181515 ▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Carrie, -1, #470 of 2192 🔗

As I said above, curating your speech to appease an offended majority is hack journalism and is not fitting for someone that wants to uphold honest free speech. Speak from the heart or not at all.

181534 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Matt Mounsey, 2, #471 of 2192 🔗

This is bollocks. Using the term betwetters or not isn’t about free speech for goodness sake. It a pejorative term and there is no need to use it. Pro lockdowners will use it as ammunition to discredit what he writes and also it will alienate potential new “recruit” to the anti-lockdown cause.Toby is a professional and he should be able to do better than use such language.

A Free speech issue. ffs

181539 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Two-Six, #472 of 2192 🔗

Yeah, I’ve covered this elsewhere so I’m not going to bother.

182196 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, #473 of 2192 🔗

So why reply then……..

182238 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Two-Six, #474 of 2192 🔗

It’s shorthand on the Comments section.
And therefore doesn’t alienate those who are “susceptible to the panic messaging”. Because they aren’t here reading it anyway. Probably not a productive strategy in other situations.
I do think it is wise for Toby’s daily commentary to restrict its use somewhat, because that will always be a newbie’s first port of call.

What about Karen? Is she irredeemable?

182187 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, #475 of 2192 🔗

In your opnion.

181216 ▶▶ Guirme, replying to Matt Mounsey, 11, #476 of 2192 🔗

This is a total misunderstanding of the position. I do not use the term bedwetter because my aim is to try to convert people by rational argument. Hurling childish abuse at people is counterproductive; it drives people apart and serves only to further entrench the views of those who we should be seeking to win over.

181231 ▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Guirme, 4, #477 of 2192 🔗

As I said above, these people are not engaging in their behavior because of rationality. They are hysterical. How is it rational to not wear masks for 3 months of the pandemic and all of a sudden start wearing them every day? They enjoy their hysteria and as long as the government is paying for them they will continue to be hysterical.

Some are not bedwetters, but are just sheep instead. Again, this is not a position arrived at through rational argument, these people just go with the flow. They are incapable of forming an unfashionable thought because that would make them a “conspiracy theorist”, an exile from good society.

I’ve been talking to people rationally since the beginning of this pandemic, they are mostly not interested. They need to be shamed into seeing their behavior as irrational first. Then you can use all the facts and figures you want.

181284 ▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 6, #478 of 2192 🔗

You don’t get it do you?

People on this site are here because they don’t agree with the measures of lockdown and masks which I totally support, but describing, for example, an elderly person who has been frightened shitless as a “bed wetter” for wearing a mask, doesn’t sit well with me, and others, when used in the main text of the blog.

You can carry on using the term if you want to.

Should be quite simple to understand for anyone with an ounce of intelligence…….

181333 ▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to deldor, 3, #479 of 2192 🔗

Agree. This is exactly what I was trying to say yesterday.

181479 ▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to deldor, #480 of 2192 🔗

What utter hypocrisy. You want to mandate politeness, but you’re quite willing to insult people yourself. Why should anyone take you seriously?

I actually think it’s you that insults “elderly people” by claiming they don’t have the capacity to think for themselves and shouldn’t be held to the standards of other rational people. They’ve “been frightened shitless” have they? Well why didn’t they look at the evidence and come to a rational conclusion? They’re elderly people, not children.

I respect those people enough to expect them to behave as rationally as I expect others to behave. You seem to want to infantilise them.

182203 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, #481 of 2192 🔗

Just speaking to you in language you appear to favour – you know, YOUR example.

182226 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, #482 of 2192 🔗

On your point about saying I don’t think the elderly can think for themselves, you clearly are a prize prick,

Some elderly are at the mercy of what they are led to believe by the likes of the sumbags at the BBC and much other MSM.

When SOME elderly get to a certain point they may not be able to think logically unlike “genius” types like you who are too stupid to understand that!

181291 ▶▶▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to Matt Mounsey, #483 of 2192 🔗

It’s called skin in the game. Talk is cheap (in your case).

181309 ▶▶▶▶ Guirme, replying to Matt Mounsey, 3, #484 of 2192 🔗

Have you considered the possibility that your inability to convert people could be due to your injudicious use of lsnguage?

181467 ▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Guirme, #485 of 2192 🔗

Yes, I’ve considered a number of things over the course of this pandemic. After a number of months of speaking to people about infection rates, R numbers and Great Resets I’ve come to realise that this isn’t a problem to be approached rationally. As I said above, I don’t believe these people are primarily interested in rational argument. They are enjoying being irrational.

181618 ▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Guirme, -1, #486 of 2192 🔗

I also think the real problem is that you want your argument to be popular. It’s never going to be popular. At least not until it’s far too late.

And by moderating your message to give it a broader appeal you will have undermined it by the time it will be most needed.

181262 ▶▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to Guirme, 5, #487 of 2192 🔗

In a discussion one to one I wouldn’t use the term but on here I don’t see the problem.I don’t see the point of arguing about this today,being the day the government rolls out its new regime of repression.Institutionalising the rules and restrictions with no hope of it changing

181264 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Guirme, 2, #488 of 2192 🔗

Well said.

181261 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Matt Mounsey, 4, #489 of 2192 🔗

The phrase climate change denier is anathema to the climate change sceptics due to its associations with holocaust deniers. Likewise anything with “truth” in it provokes thoughts of the 9/11 sceptics (<profession> for911truth.org). So some curating of terminology is necessary, otherwise you get ignored or seen as irrelevant.
Although “bedwetter” is understood within sceptic circles, it has other connotations in the wider world.

181611 ▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to p02099003, #490 of 2192 🔗

So it seems your saying that a website that’s clearly designed to mock the lockdowns and the irrational behavior associated with it, should change to be a website that has lots of nice facts and figures and simple arguments to convince people to come down from their hysteria. Is that right?

Firstly, it changes the original mission, which is a necessary mission to provide a base for sceptics. Secondly, for reasons I’ve outlined elsewhere, I don’t think it will work. Lockdown hysterics, bedwetters, are not interested in rational argument. Wetting the bed is not rational behavior.

181675 ▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Matt Mounsey, 2, #491 of 2192 🔗

It’s not the lockdown hysterics we are trying to change, just shift the centre of gravity of public opinion. Hurling insults is funny, for a bit, and might help us to feel better, but ultimately it doesn’t do anything to achieve the aim.

I’m not sure this site was designed to ‘mock’, as its sole objective at least – rather to be a beacon of resistance to the madness, and it does that mainly through scientifically based opinion and critical thinking.

Having said that, to be honest I do enjoy a bit of the mocking.

181335 ▶▶ Muzz Off, replying to Matt Mounsey, 2, #492 of 2192 🔗

I get that you’re angry and obviously that’s justified. But I think the purpose of retiring that jibe is so we don’t all come across like you do here – a bunch of unsound table thumpers.Don’t get me wrong, I agree with everything you said and rant in a similar tone to skeptical friends, but if LS is to continue to win over supporters it might help to adopt a more conciliatory tone.

181371 ▶▶▶ hat man, replying to Muzz Off, 1, #493 of 2192 🔗

Agree. It is a question of tactics, and IMO it comes down to this. Do we want any not-yet-sceptics viewing this site (and comments) to see us as normal, decent tolerant people they would like to join? Or just very hostile angry people? Justifiably angry, of course, but if we care about the image we’re presenting, TY’s appeal is probably right.

The alternative might be to have a members’ forum where we can all let off steam invisibly to the outside.

181628 ▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to hat man, -1, #494 of 2192 🔗

Tolerance of irrational, neurotic behavior that will have severe consequences for other people is not a virtue.

182288 ▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 1, #495 of 2192 🔗

A sentiment you should clearly take heed of, with regard to yourself!

181510 ▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to Muzz Off, -1, #496 of 2192 🔗

I see your point, but I don’t think you win over neurotic bedwetters by consoling them. They love that.

Imagine you’re dealing with a child that actually wets the bed. They want more attention to be drawn to their victim status. If you moderate your language to appease them you’ve vindicated their passive aggressive behavior. They’ll be wetting the bed for a long time thereafter.

No, I think shaming them into compliance is a far better strategy. Showing them that all their friends will laugh at them if they wear nappies to school will soon get them to see the error of their ways.

Also bear in mind that this situation is going to get a lot worse when the economy implodes. I want these bedwetters to see exactly what they’ve done and be told that they need to clear up the mess they’ve made. Starting with paying the money back that they’ve all been living on throughout this hysteria. If I compromise my position now I won’t be able to be so forceful when the time comes.

182306 ▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 1, #497 of 2192 🔗

You really are a sick puppy! You think a child wetting the bed is “passive aggressive” ?

You need help mate, I sincerely hope you aren’t allowed near any children.

Children, or indeed older people, who wet the bed may have physical (particularly in the case of older people) problems due to various reasons relating to age or illness, but a know nothing idiot with a personality disorder like you, comes along suggesting they do it deliberately!

You are a complete saddo and no mistake.
Do get some help – you definitely need it.

182460 ▶▶▶▶▶ Matt Mounsey, replying to deldor, -1, #498 of 2192 🔗

No, I think the adults engaging in this hysteria are passive aggressive. I think they need to be shamed into recognising the damage they’re causing.

Rather than engage with that point and discuss whether it would be effective, you only seem to want to insult and deliberately misconstrue what I’ve said. What a big tough person you are.

You talk about being surprised if I met you in person? I already know what kind of person you are. The kind of person that hurls insults over the internet. People like you live in a fantasy world of how tough they think they are.

People like you like to control what other people say. People like you think being right is a popularity contest. People like you are worthless on your own and find validation in groups of other bedshitters. People like you are utterly worthless and you know it.

182567 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Matt Mounsey, 1, #499 of 2192 🔗

Quote:

“Imagine you’re dealing with a child that actually wets the bed. They want more attention to be drawn to their victim status. If you moderate your language to appease them you’ve vindicated their passive aggressive
behavoir”

Misconstruing you?
Seems pretty clear to me.

I couldn’t give a flying shit what you think.
I’m actually responding to you using your own standards.

The rest of your rather sad rant shows you have a problem.

Oh dear! What a pity! Never mind!
Saddo troll.

182336 ▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Matt Mounsey, #500 of 2192 🔗

Troll.

181215 IanE, replying to IanE, 6, #501 of 2192 🔗

I see nothing wrong with ‘bedwetter’ as a description. However, for those who like to show their virtue by being offended, how about ‘covid science deniers’!?

181263 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to IanE, 4, #502 of 2192 🔗

I don’t really have a problem with hypochondriacs – but I do take issue with a) the Government’s relentless propaganda stoking fear and b) people supporting this message. I don’t think bedwetter is the right term for them – Covid Nazi seems more appropriate (both for the Government and people supporting it).

181268 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to zacaway, 1, #503 of 2192 🔗

More appropriate but I’m bloody sick of nazi/fascist/commie (or occasionally stasi, which is probably the most apt) being flung around everywhere.

181281 ▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Cicatriz, #504 of 2192 🔗

True, it is an overused insult, though seems appropriate when directed towards excessively authoritarian regimes. Bedwetter doesn’t seem to really cut it as an insult to an authoritarian.

181331 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to IanE, #505 of 2192 🔗

flat earther’s?

181343 ▶▶▶ PompeyJunglist, replying to Victoria, #506 of 2192 🔗

Useful idiots, unwitting collaborators

181381 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to Victoria, 2, #507 of 2192 🔗

Flat earthers are misguided but harmless. Those supporting this racket are anything but harmless.

181551 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to leggy, #508 of 2192 🔗

The flat earth thing was the first run of their global brainwashing system.

181219 stefarm, 6, #509 of 2192 🔗

Just received an email from prof Richard ennos

Dear Steven

Many thanks for the message of support. Much appreciated.

Best wishes and keep up the good work

181227 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 20, #510 of 2192 🔗

Just thought of a new slogan:-

#ProtectTheNHS,DieAtHome

181315 ▶▶ Llamasaurus Rex, replying to Achilles, 1, #511 of 2192 🔗

That’s a good one. Made me spray my morning cup of coffee.

182092 ▶▶ annie, replying to Achilles, 1, #512 of 2192 🔗

Go to an NHS hospital, die alone.

181246 zacaway, replying to zacaway, 10, #513 of 2192 🔗

Fightback beginning in Victoria, Australia:

‘Covering up’: Vic Government slammed in court for redacting key legal advice

The Andrews Government deliberately “covered up” legal advice that showed its curfew breached human rights, a court has heard.

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/health-problems/covering-up-vic-government-slammed-in-court-for-redacting-key-legal-advice/news-story/8e1c20a493a2f451b9598879da66993a#.53d22

181266 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to zacaway, 2, #514 of 2192 🔗

Hope that helps Simon’s case!

181253 Jules, replying to Jules, 11, #515 of 2192 🔗

The Conservatives always used to be the party of business and self-reliance. Now that they are not, t\hey are just a turd in a swimming pool.

181270 ▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Jules, 3, #516 of 2192 🔗

I don’t know, maybe they still are the party of (big) business and self-reliance, they now just expect us to each build our own hospital and perform life-saving operations on ourselves in the garage or something.

If everyone did this, we wouldn’t need an NHS.

We’ve not got one at the moment, so maybe I’d better dust off the black & decker and try and set up my own breast screening service.

181363 ▶▶▶ Alethea, replying to captainbeefheart, #517 of 2192 🔗

my favourite joke so far today

181274 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 5, #518 of 2192 🔗

Well Thursday is another day in court for Simon Dolan.

Good luck to him.

Shameless begging pit as Toby call it – I’ve just donated again to do my bit. Anyone else going to chip in a quid?

181276 ▶▶ D B, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #519 of 2192 🔗

Yeah I’ve recently thrown in my 10 cents, couldn’t do anything else so figured it might go a long way elsewhere

181295 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #520 of 2192 🔗

I’ve chipped in. It was always a long shot, but worth a go.

181278 Jules, replying to Jules, 3, #521 of 2192 🔗

Why is this site going along with the alleged majority re the “Bedwetter” jibes? If we went along with the majority ie the “bedwetters”, we would be knuckling down and wearing face muzzles, applauding the government and hiding behind our sofas. Come on Toby, get a life! Whatever happened to free speech?

181286 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Jules, 5, #522 of 2192 🔗

As far as I’m aware, it’s just a choice by Toby that applies to above the line stuff. Nothing to do with free speech down here.

181292 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jules, 1, #523 of 2192 🔗

I could think of a fair few nastier words to use to describe the order followers.

These people are destroying our civilisation, and enabling crimes against humanity. No term of abuse is off limits. “Murderers” perhaps?

181301 ▶▶▶ Arnie, replying to Richard O, 2, #524 of 2192 🔗

I prefer ‘murdering cunts’ myself.

181293 ▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Jules, 9, #525 of 2192 🔗

The term ‘bedwetters’ is divisive language. We need to unify people against the government, not fight against the targets of the government (the people) with needless insults.

Governments tactics throughout this have been to divide and conquer. Simple, effective tactics that are tearing our society apart. Turning mask wearers and non-mask wearers against each other is part of this tactic. If we alienate those of us who are compelled, either by threat or fear, to wear masks, the government wins.

In my view, abandoning the insulting language is a necessary act of diplomacy.

181299 ▶▶▶ Jules, replying to Mr Dee, #526 of 2192 🔗

That’s your view and I respect it. My view is that they are “bedwetters”. See how it works, this free speech stuff?

181310 ▶▶▶▶ Mr Dee, replying to Jules, 4, #527 of 2192 🔗

Yes, that’s fine, free speech. Huzzah! But insulting people won’t win them over.

This is a battle for freedom.

If we want to win this battle we need to think tactically.

If we lose this battle, there will be NO free speech.

Do you want to win or not?

181322 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jules, replying to Mr Dee, #528 of 2192 🔗

But insulting “bedwetters” might just be a safety valve for some people who are feeling down or perhaps desperate and powerless? I want to win, but would rather it did not come down to street fighting. By the way, how is the diplomacy coming along? Last I heard, most of the north is about to go into lockdown. Is that part of a cunning plan to lull the “bedwetters” into a false sense of security before we strike?

182425 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to Jules, 1, #529 of 2192 🔗

I think you’re right about insults being a safety valve, and most people on forums use them as such.

I think it was just that this particular one may have sent the wrong message to a certain demographic who have perhaps been the hardest to get through to, and might have an unfortunate affinity with it, due to age or infirmity reasons, and see it as a bit personal!

That was the impression I got from the guy who contacted Toby, which is why he asked readers opinions and came to the decision not to use it in the blog posts. Still useable in comments of course.

I will be honest, I hadn’t considered that it might be a problem, as thankfully, not suffering from that problem myself. But I see that it might stop some from coming on board, now it’s been brought to our attention.

Just my opinion of course. Lol.

181415 ▶▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to Mr Dee, #530 of 2192 🔗

You aren’t going to win them over. The only way they will go back to February 2020’s normal is if the TV tells them to.

181323 ▶▶▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Jules, 6, #531 of 2192 🔗

My view is that they ARE bedwetters, but it’s not helpful to call them that to their faces. But it’s fine to let off steam and call them whatever you want here.

181305 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Jules, #532 of 2192 🔗

I took it as all being a bit tongue in cheek

181324 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Mr Dee, 1, #534 of 2192 🔗

They were simply driving to get some food and vitamins. They apparently crossed some imaginary line on the map — that’s what police say — and so they each received a $5,000 fine.

181303 Mr Dee, 14, #535 of 2192 🔗

Anecdote from my step-daughter yesterday.

On Saturday, several members of her team from work had a house party, where they all got wrecked. They were all scheduled to work on Sunday. All of them called in ‘sick’. Guess what they claimed they had? Covid.

Work had to shut down for a few hours the following morning to deep clean, losing valuable revenue. The malingerers are off for two week’s self-isolation on full pay. Work is now understaffed for two weeks.

“We’re all in it together.”

181307 calchas, replying to calchas, 3, #537 of 2192 🔗

I was wondering if maks and social distancing had ever been enforced on a population before.

Sure enough – Guantanamo Bay in the early 2000s.

Do this search for some pics.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=guantanamo+masks&t=hk&iax=images&ia=images

181325 ▶▶ CGL, replying to calchas, 3, #538 of 2192 🔗

I have told my MP that this cannot be classed as anything other than experiment. Under that auspice the Nuremburg Declaration 1964 has a principle that the experimentee must volunteer their consent to be experimented on. I have told her that I do not volunteer my consent.

181568 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to CGL, #539 of 2192 🔗

I told my MP about that too, masks being an monstrous illegal experiment. She totally ignored what I said and ignored everything else also I wrote too. I worte a letter and she said “Thank you for your email”

She is living in La La land. A total muppet.

181326 ▶▶ calchas, replying to calchas, #540 of 2192 🔗

‘masks’ of course.

Inmates were punished for touching each other and communication between them was made as difficult as possible.

181327 ▶▶ Jonathan Palmer, replying to calchas, 1, #541 of 2192 🔗

Take off the jumpsuits and it looks like a picture of a school these days

181308 T. Prince, replying to T. Prince, 4, #542 of 2192 🔗

Now that PHE are combining covid and flu numbers in their weekly reports, we’d better brace ourselves for the ‘surge’ aka ‘the third wave’….

181318 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to T. Prince, 3, #543 of 2192 🔗

Can you tell us if they are combined or just reprinted side by side? It could be useful to track it that way

181821 ▶▶▶ jb12, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #545 of 2192 🔗

I am prepared to be completely incorrect, but it reads to me like they will be done side-by-side, as they are in the ONS Excel sheets.

181317 Arnie, replying to Arnie, 13, #546 of 2192 🔗

One thing that I think wins the argument for me is to mention that if the television (and radio) wasn’t reporting on this ‘pandemic’ that 99%+ of us would not know that anything was even going on. It’s not as if we are tripping over bodies in the streets is it?

I’ve spoken to loads of people this weekend, nearly a hundred by my count, and when you see the realisation, the light going, when people realise this, it’s great.

I still don’t know of a single person who has had covid. Although I do know of two people who had ‘positive’ test results. In seven months… Go figure.

181321 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Arnie, 10, #547 of 2192 🔗

Yes, this has been a “mediademic” from start to finish. They are as guilty of crimes against humanity every bit as much as the politicians.

181361 ▶▶▶ petgor, replying to Richard O, 3, #548 of 2192 🔗

I recall Margaret Thatcher talking about the “oxygen of publicity” when referring to the IRA. The media didn’t like when their role was disclosed and so they lambasted her. It’s funny how the media loves exposing cant and hypocrisy, except when they produce it.

181345 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to Arnie, 9, #549 of 2192 🔗

This how I deal with it. I don’t watch mainstream tv so I just withdraw for a hours or days from the interwebs….and it all goes away! Look outside – everything normal, apart from the odd face nap. No one ill or been ill, no one collapsing in the street, no one I know that has died….the virus is what is being allowed to be implanted into people’s minds.

181409 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Arnie, 2, #550 of 2192 🔗

When the Hong Kong flu pandemic hit in 1968 there was little in the media only three TV stations, four national BBC radio stations, local BBC radio had started. The Vietnam war was ongoing and escalating under LBJ.

181319 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 9, #551 of 2192 🔗

Dave Clements asks why mental health charities haven’t condemned the Government’s handling of the crisis, given the toll the restrictions are taking on mental health Lockdown has caused a mental-health crisis

Exactly my question: All types of charities protecting people’s rights have not questioned or condemned the draconian Government actions. Do not give your money to any of them. Time for new charities

181329 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Victoria, 3, #552 of 2192 🔗

Charities, especially the large ones, are as much a part of the power structure as the media. Once again, as has been the case so often in 2020, their true colours have been fatally exposed.

181347 ▶▶ petgor, replying to Victoria, 4, #553 of 2192 🔗

Sadly, mental health like so many of our ‘caring’s services has become an industry. That particular industry will have its day once, if it ever happens, this madness has ended.

182996 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Victoria, #554 of 2192 🔗

Well said. By their silence they’re complicit in this.

I for one will boycott them and never give them money. I won’t be sorry when they go bust.

181328 Basics, 7, #555 of 2192 🔗

Another highly interesting day above the line.

The tweet about the steam running out from northern cities as reason for holding off on lockdown measures is interesting.

It is precisely because of the wane the city leaders and politicians will rush in lockdowns – they must do so with urgency inorder to gain the false proof their measures work. They cannot afford unmolested wanings to happen. The inverse of good scientifically based public health.

181334 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 9, #556 of 2192 🔗

Wonder if my MP, lawyer, will answer this:

Sir,

No-one has yet to give a coherent answer to some questions about the introduction of legislation over the past 10 months so as you are a lawyer as stated on your Parliamentary profile I thought I would ask you your opinion as to me it makes no sense at all and can be construed as highly irregular or even suspicious.

The first piece of “coronavirus” legislation was introduced at 2.30 pm on the 10th February 2020 without Parliamentary oversight or debate and is now revoked. This was The Health Protection (Coronavirus) Regulations 2020 Statutory Instrument and it was subsequently amended on the 25th February 2020.

This piece of legislation required a statement of “serious and imminent threat” by the Chief Medical Officer to justify any measures to be taken.

Rather prophetically there was an unannounced and totally unpublicised release of a statement on the 30th January 2020 by the 4 Chief Medical Officers of England, Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland on this very subject. It stated:

“the 4 UK Chief Medical Officers consider it prudent for our governments to escalate planning and preparation in case of a more widespread outbreak.

For that reason, we are advising an increase of the UK risk level from low to moderate. This does not mean we think the risk to individuals in the UK has changed at this stage, but that government should plan for all eventualities.””

This statement was made 11 days before the piece of legislation it was required for was written and laid before Parliament and came into force the very same afternoon.

How did the 4 CMOs know 11 days in advance of a Statutory Instrument being written that “medical advice” would be required?

Why was this “advice” basically hidden on a webpage on a different department’s section and not on the DHSC webpages and why was it not linked to the Serious and Imminent Threat Declaration?

As this was part of a FOI request answer then either the above is the only advice given by the CMOs or the DHSC have withheld more detailed advice.

Then on the 19th March 2020 the coronavirus was downgraded and was no longer classified as a High Consequence Infectious Disease.

On the 23rd March 2020, the Prime Minister announced the start of the “lockdown” and the relevant legislation was written, laid before Parliament and commenced the 26th March 2020.

So what we have is:

– issue of medical (non)advice 30th January 2020 which was used as the declaration of “serious and imminent threat” for all future legislation

– legislation introduced 10th February 2020

– downgrade the disease 19th March 2020

– announced the population imprisonment 23rd March 2020

– introduce legislation 26th March 2020

– and so it continues 7 months after “3 weeks to save the NHS” with no end in sight

Isn’t something wrong with this scenario?

181339 ▶▶ petgor, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #557 of 2192 🔗

Very impressive.

Sadly, my MP is Tobias Ellwood, so no point in writing to him especially as in his last, one of his infrequent responses to my emails/letters was, to the effect of p**s off.

181337 calchas, replying to calchas, 2, #558 of 2192 🔗

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yk3xezML8Q

‘Amazing Polly’examines the global measures and asks if they constitute torture.

She compares the measures taken to the description of torture in an Amnesty International report from 1975.

Video is about 43 minutes.

I highly recommend.

181341 ▶▶ CGL, replying to calchas, 3, #559 of 2192 🔗

I have to say I definitely feel that the relentless pressure I feel every day and every week before the Fear Porn Show actually does feel like torture – it is inescapable hell.

181375 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to calchas, 2, #560 of 2192 🔗

An excellent report by Polly (as are all of her reports.) If everyone saw that I wonder if the lockdown lovers would still feel the same about the overbearing, and increasingly, the gaslighting measures constantly being foisted on the public to keep us “safe!”

181338 DRW, replying to DRW, 5, #561 of 2192 🔗

Hi all, this a reply to some of yesterday’s posts. I am pessimistic because the majority of the public have proven they only think through the MSM filters. The many no-clothes moments have been missed. Whether it be empty hospitals or absurd rules, the regime can just keep spinning the yarn. Even when the redundancies pile up it will be blamed on “Covid” or “the pandemic”.

We keep hoping on here (me too sometimes) that eventually there will be one move too many, a “poll tax moment”, or our own “tipping point”. But I wouldn’t hold my breath given the recent track record of high compliance, and I expect at least 70% will be gladly lining up for the vaccine/ID.

181350 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to DRW, 3, #562 of 2192 🔗

The more that volunteer for the vaccine the longer it will take for the army to track us down.

With the coercive “incentives” that will be accompanying the vaccine, I expect the uptake to be nearer 90%. If you think you are isolated now, just wait.

181355 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to DRW, 8, #563 of 2192 🔗

Have to agree. There is no resistance besides this sites and some other lonely voices in the desert. 99% of the Sheeple are completely under the spell of MSM and swallow everything wholesale. My wife now does not want to take me to see friends as she knows I would loose my shit. All the veneer of politeness has now been worn off and I’m constantly in full war path mode. I just can’t take the stupidity anymore and if people ask me for my opinion they get a full broadside..

181411 ▶▶▶ Mel, replying to Thomas_E, 2, #564 of 2192 🔗

Me too. I now see no other way out of this shit than Matt Hancock, Boris Johnson, one behind the other, one single bullet

181650 ▶▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to Thomas_E, 5, #565 of 2192 🔗

You are not alone. I have such intense outbreaks of anger that I sometimes surprise myself. I avoid most of my extended family now, as I can’t hold back when having to listen to the BBC propaganda being spewed from the zombie like creatures in front of me. I have gone from mild mannered middle aged woman to a raging, swearing pent up mass of rage.

181807 ▶▶▶▶ helen, replying to Mrs issedoff, #566 of 2192 🔗

Please can I make a suggestion..Even just reposting things from this site back onto the site helps…and the people here will all understand whats happening perhaps in a matter of days.. because they are all sceptics and therefore all open minded and questioning.

181786 ▶▶ helen, replying to DRW, #567 of 2192 🔗

seems like it

181353 Stuart, replying to Stuart, 4, #568 of 2192 🔗

Lockdown NHS is unfit for purpose and ought to be defunded.

181385 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Stuart, 3, #569 of 2192 🔗

Exactly. I’ve often wondered, if the NHS is so damned wonderful, why does no other country seek to have the same type of healthcare system?

181428 ▶▶ Mark H, replying to Stuart, 2, #570 of 2192 🔗

I’ve said since March that’s the longterm goal, demonstrate the NHS isn’t fit for purpose and privatise it.

181362 nocheesegromit, replying to nocheesegromit, 10, #571 of 2192 🔗

Just finished my first in-person session at university this year. I already take anti-depressants but I need more of them after this!

The rooms are laid out exam-style – one person to a small table and all facing the front. No opportunity to discuss in small groups or to talk to others – which I had presumed would be important because it’s a workshop . Module leader at the front in a face covering (which they fiddled with throughout and coughed into!) – it felt much more like a lecture than it should’ve done.

I was messaging my boyfriend (a fellow sceptic thank god) about how I hate what this government have done to us students. This is not worth £9250 a year and I am staggered at how the universities are not fighting this – all under the guise it’s to keep us ‘safe’. Safe from a virus which will be a mild illness for the vast majority of us!!!

Whilst I’m here, I’ll plug my website once again: https://covid19thelowdown.wordpress.com/

181373 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to nocheesegromit, 5, #572 of 2192 🔗

What a rip-off. I wonder if you have a legal case for reimbursement of all tuition fees?

If I were you I would get the hell out of there. Students will be sitting targets for the vaccination programme.

181387 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Richard O, 3, #573 of 2192 🔗

There are plenty of petitions to have tuition fees reimbursed – not sure of any legal challenges as I’m no expert on the law!

I wish I could but I’ve just started my third year. If I was in my first year I would’ve dropped out already and deferred to next year.

181398 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to nocheesegromit, #574 of 2192 🔗

Well if you stay there you will be vaccinated. Your choice.

181408 ▶▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Richard O, 7, #575 of 2192 🔗

And throw 2 years of hard work out the window, along with over £18k in tuition fees? No thanks. I will simply opt out of the vaccination – if anyone challenges this they will be sued.

181400 ▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to nocheesegromit, 2, #576 of 2192 🔗

Just furious on you behalf, NCG. I wonder whether it is a good thing that you at least got 2 years of a more normal experience in when you did – I can’t see things returning to that next year, if at all. Many universities were already trumpeting ‘blended learning’ and a lecturer friend of mine has been complaining for several years that she has had less and less contact with her students and expects to be replaced by video recordings.

181416 ▶▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Charlie Blue, 1, #577 of 2192 🔗

Yeah, though it was more like 1 and 2/3rds as the entirety of my second year summer term was online. This is already the case at our university RE: video recordings – all of our lectures have been uploaded online since first year. Very useful for lazy sods like me who hate 9ams (especially when they have nothing else on that day, as frequently was the case) but not worth £9250 a year. Aside from lectures I typically had 4 hours of contact time a week last year.

181739 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to nocheesegromit, 1, #578 of 2192 🔗

Which is about twice as much as used to be normal at Oxbridge 50 years ago, i e. one supervision a week. I knew loads of people who never went to lectures, preferred to read the lecturer’s books at their own pace. Different for those who needed to be in the labs, but doesn’t sound like that’s your field. Access to libraries was the important thing then, less so now I guess.

181752 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Bruno, 1, #579 of 2192 🔗

PS, good on you, keep up your activities!

182365 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ HoMojo, replying to Bruno, #580 of 2192 🔗

Yeah, but fifty years ago you didn’t pay tuition fees.

182067 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Richard O, #581 of 2192 🔗

‘sitting targets for the vaccination programme’.. yes… Will they be told that if they want to go home for Christmas they must agree to vaccination, I wonder?

181382 ▶▶ jb12, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #582 of 2192 🔗

At the upper management levels, the universities are only interested in getting their tuition fees and the rents for halls. At least from my experience, the staff who teach and work in the offices etc. are, unfortunately, part of the ‘lockdowns save us, need more lockdowns’ crew, so think they are doing their students a service by going along with the crazy diktats.

181394 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to jb12, 3, #583 of 2192 🔗

Agreed – which is why the unis are happy to provide piss poor food for students who are isolating (when they should just be getting on with it like we do for freshers’ ‘flu’ every year).

181404 ▶▶▶▶ Mel, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #584 of 2192 🔗

You are wonderful. I’m proud of you. Keep going.

181417 ▶▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Mel, 1, #585 of 2192 🔗

Thank you 🙂

181383 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to nocheesegromit, 1, #586 of 2192 🔗

Great website. The following article might fit well on your masks page: https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19-masks-crime-against-humanity-child-abuse/5726059

181434 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Victoria, 1, #587 of 2192 🔗

Thanks Victoria. I don’t doubt the claims of Dr Griesz-Brisson but I am reluctant to link to non-mainstream sources (however much I might agree with them) – I don’t think it’s a good way to persuade people to be sceptical.

181565 ▶▶▶▶ JohnMac, replying to nocheesegromit, #588 of 2192 🔗

She’s a Harley Street neurologist!!

181604 ▶▶▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to JohnMac, 1, #589 of 2192 🔗

I don’t have a problem with her – I just need to get my info from MSM if I’m going to persuade anyone not in the sceptic ‘bubble’. A website with a front page talking about John Lennon and the ‘deep state’ will just make it easy for my own website to be dismissed as quack conspiracy theory/MAGA/QAnon stuff.

181649 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnMac, replying to nocheesegromit, #590 of 2192 🔗

I get that, I really do.

But you can use a different link. She’s on https://www.bitchute.com/video/Blzj0nJFEnpZ/
herself, talking about this stuff.

You couldn’t get someone more qualified to talk about this subject.

181386 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #591 of 2192 🔗

I am disgusted with the way your generation has been betrayed by mine, and by the generation before mine as well. As for the seminar, or whatever that was, words fail me.

181395 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to JohnMac, 2, #592 of 2192 🔗

I would liken it more to a detention camp, or even isolation at secondary school (though I was always too much of a goody-two shoes to go there!)

181429 ▶▶ petgor, replying to nocheesegromit, 2, #593 of 2192 🔗

Sadly, the government has been ably assisted by those of us who have retired, with pensions, who own their own home and love the government for protecting us from death, sorry passing, by submitting your generation to lives or near penury. And oh, let’s not forget the featherbedded civil servants, BBC employees, MP’s and others all on full pay. Mind you let’s also not forget the teachers unions, whose members were also on full pay for many months and who had to be dragged kicking and screaming, back to work.

I apologise on behalf of my age group. Mind you there are a few of us who condemn the government and our weak minded MP’s for being so lily livered.

181468 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to petgor, #594 of 2192 🔗

You’ve fallen straight into Johnson’s Tory trap – divide and rule by inducing no-think knee-jerk generalisations. Actually – a mindset hardly distinguishable from the Covid victims.

181431 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #595 of 2192 🔗

I’ve seen your site before. It’s excellent.

And don’t forget Dr. Margarite Griesz-Brisson, on masks for children and adolescents. Presumably will apply to students as well. If knowing that your mask is causing you irreversible brain damage doesn’t create “severe distress” I don’t know what would.

“To deprive a child’s or an adolescent’s brain from oxygen, or to restrict it in any way, is not only dangerous to their health, it is absolutely criminal. Oxygen deficiency inhibits the development of the brain, and the damage that has taken place as a result CANNOT be reversed.”

She is an MD, PhD, Consultant Neurologist and Neurophysiologist with a PhD in Pharmacology, with special interest in neurotoxicology, environmental medicine, neuroregeneration and neuroplasticity.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/Blzj0nJFEnpZ/

Also, separately, we evolved to live in the palaeolithic era, not like this. A lot of mental illness is a natural reaction to unnatural ways of living. It may be a heightened reaction, it may be more than most people, but it’s a natural reaction.

181578 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to JohnMac, 3, #596 of 2192 🔗

Also, separately, we evolved to live in the palaeolithic era, not like this. A lot of mental illness is a natural reaction to unnatural ways of living. It may be a heightened reaction, it may be more than most people, but it’s a natural reaction.

Very interesting idea. Have our lives become so unnatural that the population has driven itself into a state of collective psychosis?

181785 ▶▶▶▶ JohnMac, replying to stewart, #597 of 2192 🔗

I bet that’s part of it.

181450 ▶▶ DRW, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #598 of 2192 🔗

This is why my campus can go fuck itself. But my last year of university saves me from real world interaction.

181571 ▶▶ stewart, replying to nocheesegromit, 1, #599 of 2192 🔗

There is a long and distinguished tradition of student protests. The rebels of May 1968 now run France, so it can even serve as a career move.

Thought about starting a protest movement at your uni?

181588 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to stewart, 2, #600 of 2192 🔗

I’m aiming to put up posters around campus in the next week or so, one of which is a list of facts featured on the website and another featuring the photo of normal Sweden Simon Dolan posted the other day stating ‘there is another way’. I’m not sure about an actual protest movement/’outing’ myself as I don’t want to be labelled a granny killer etc. However, I know UsforThem are creating a separate campaign group for students which I fully intend to get involved with and spread the word about.

181370 Jim Binks, replying to Jim Binks, 4, #601 of 2192 🔗

This is a great site. Lets all put flags of Sweden in our windows or in our cars, to show solidarity . Like the fact that the bed wetter’s comments have been voted down. People have been terrorised by the government its up to us to point out the facts and help them to get back to normal.

181376 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to Jim Binks, 2, #602 of 2192 🔗

Is Sweden back to normal yet?

“Sweden’s back to normal. Why not us?”

Assuming they are, of course.

181388 ▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to JohnMac, #603 of 2192 🔗

Are they back to normal? There was some talk a while ago about them maybe introducing masks, but haven’t heard anything from there for a while.

181557 ▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to zacaway, 2, #605 of 2192 🔗

That was yet another distortion of Tegnell’s words.
He was simply saying that all the measures are on the table in theory and would be assessed on their efficacy and need.

182060 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to zacaway, #606 of 2192 🔗

Very few people here wear masks and those that do are either foreign (asian-looking, for want of a better description) or elderly, or very obviously have some other co-morbidity..

181405 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to JohnMac, 3, #607 of 2192 🔗

Based on Julian’s comments here over the past week or so, from Sweden, as well as Carrie’s, I’d say they aren’t far off it. Certainly compared to most of the rest of Europe..

181453 ▶▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Mark, 2, #608 of 2192 🔗

They don’t have a rule of six, they have a rule of 50. I think there’s some imposition of distancing tables etc in bars and eating places. Not much else that I am aware of. They were going to make 50 into 500 but have gone back on that for now.

They have said they may introduce limited local guidance for specific areas if needed, but it sounded like this would not be law.

I think they said they would consider masks but it would be based on evidence.

Whatever way they go, it will still be better than here.

181522 ▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Julian, 3, #609 of 2192 🔗

“But the Swedes took it seriously! They had a voluntary lockdown!”
When I tried emphasising Sweden to my family in a past argument, they quoted some drivel about ‘social contracts’, probably regurgitated from the BBC or Independent.

182051 ▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Mark, 1, #611 of 2192 🔗

Hospital numbers here are a bit higher than a month ago, but we are talking a few extra people, between 1 and 4 per region (and a region might have several hospitals..). Important thing is that there are few people in intensive care, and people seem to only be in hospital for short periods, ie they are not extremely seriously ill…

181389 Beth, replying to Beth, 18, #613 of 2192 🔗

Sophie Ridge interviews Nicola Sturgeon Sunday 11th October 2020

https://news.sky.com/video/16-9-video-ridge-highlights-version-2-001-mp4-12101845

Just a few seconds from the start of the video ……

“Ridge – Why has it started to rise so sharply again, what’s driving it?

Sturgeon – In some ways its quite basic, and actually I think the phenomenon we’re seeing in many other countries, not least in the UK, but right across Europe right now. We suppressed the virus to a very low level because of lockdown, we then lifted lockdown a little bit more slowly than in other parts of the UK but as the lockdown measures are lifted and people start to interact with each other more then the virus gets more opportunities to spread.”

An explanation of why lockdowns don’t work from the mouth of a rabid lockdowner.

181401 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Beth, 4, #614 of 2192 🔗

Yeah, but, just lockdown forever then of course!

181458 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Beth, 5, #615 of 2192 🔗

We suppressed the virus to a very low level because of lockdown”

Apart from anything else, how can you trust the judgment of anyone who is so dishonest or stupid (there’s no other options) to spout this clear fiction.

181549 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Beth, 1, #616 of 2192 🔗

It’s vaccine or bust.

181391 petgor, replying to petgor, 17, #617 of 2192 🔗

I am beginning to wish that I believed the government. It would make life so much easier to bear. But, try as i might, i cannot.

181407 ▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to petgor, 3, #618 of 2192 🔗

I think you’ve hit on something there, petgor. There is a lot of truth in the saying that ‘ignorance is bliss’.

181410 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to petgor, 8, #619 of 2192 🔗

Your scepticism shows that you are still an authentic human being. Better to die in truth than live in a lie.

181548 ▶▶ stewart, replying to petgor, 3, #620 of 2192 🔗

I know exactly what you mean. Sometimes I wonder whether it wouldn’t be a relief for evidence to emerge that shows beyond doubt that this covid is a really nasty, very dangerous disease. It would mean that the world makes sense.

I would still be against lockdowns, masks and any forced measures. But at least it would all make more sense.

Unfortunately it’s the opposite. The more evidence emerges the clearer it is that the whole things is a giant psychotic episode.

182239 ▶▶ Borisbullshit, replying to petgor, #621 of 2192 🔗

I would say its impossible if you have a brain.

181399 Victoria, 2, #622 of 2192 🔗
181402 Victoria, 5, #623 of 2192 🔗

Follow the money
Questions over Government’s failure to account for £3bn spent on Covid contracts
A legal action has been launched over a failure to disclose details of spending on pandemic-related contracts.

https://www.shropshirestar.com/news/uk-news/2020/10/11/questions-over-governments-failure-to-account-for-3bn-spent-on-covid-contracts/

181403 Sam Vimes, replying to Sam Vimes, 10, #624 of 2192 🔗

“There will be no curiosity, no enjoyment of the process of life. All competing pleasures will be destroyed. But always— do not forget this, Winston— always there will be the intoxication of power, constantly increasing and constantly growing subtler. Always, at every moment, there will be the thrill of victory, the sensation of trampling on an enemy who is helpless. If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot Boris stamping on a human face— forever. ”
https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1315570352324587520

181422 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Sam Vimes, 3, #625 of 2192 🔗

So the state is now openly committed to completely destroying art. The anti-human agenda keeps rolling on.

181498 ▶▶▶ Recusant, replying to Richard O, 6, #626 of 2192 🔗

The state isn’t even the biggest problem. The big problem is that nobody in the country seems that arsed by it, it’s like they never really liked civilisation anyway. Who is demanding that concert venues re-open? That art is as important as life?

182722 ▶▶▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to Recusant, 1, #627 of 2192 🔗

So much contemporary art was .. is ? full of woke, identity politics sociolgy a smidgeon of anthropology and downright so called’ concepts’ all fucking clever dick and dickess and totally devoid of joy and wonder and celebrations of Life and nature…

181406 DownWithBedwetters, replying to DownWithBedwetters, 3, #628 of 2192 🔗

So the leader of the Free Speech Union has decided to retire a term in case it causes “offence”.

As James would say, Toby has re-earned his “cuck badge”.

181413 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to DownWithBedwetters, 6, #629 of 2192 🔗

You’re free to use the term, but who are you hoping to persuade by calling them a bedwetter? Have you found it an effective strategy? Because I’m not really interested in feeling superior to people who support lockdown, I’m interested in persuading them.

181425 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Recusant, 4, #630 of 2192 🔗

That’s the point – it is counterproductive, unless you just want to shout in an echoing room.

181507 ▶▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to RickH, #631 of 2192 🔗

Agree…I don’t call anyone a bedwetter..I call them sheeple, zombies or just cunts most of the time..

181426 ▶▶▶ DownWithBedwetters, replying to Recusant, 2, #632 of 2192 🔗

This is why we have been drifting to the left for the last sixty years.

Everyone wants to be the “adult in the room” and seems unaware that one-sided compromise is more accurately known as “surrender”.

181446 ▶▶▶▶ Recusant, replying to DownWithBedwetters, 1, #633 of 2192 🔗

Life without surrender is nasty, brutish and short.

181449 ▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Recusant, 2, #634 of 2192 🔗

Life with surrender is nasty, brutish and long.

181475 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Recusant, replying to calchas, #635 of 2192 🔗

Far from it. Without surrender nobody would collect the bins, contracts would never be honoured and married men would never have sex. Surrender makes the world go round.

181455 ▶▶▶▶▶ Achilles, replying to Recusant, 2, #636 of 2192 🔗

Sounds like a description of Matt Hancock.

182662 ▶▶ deldor, replying to DownWithBedwetters, 1, #637 of 2192 🔗

What a good idea! Insult the guy who runs the site!

He has a different view/opinion to you, is that ok with you?

So the guy has a brain and decides to engage in a bit of care in the text of HIS blog to try and not insult potential converts who may have had some personal offence due to an (unwanted) actual connection physically with the term, “bedwetters”.

I don’t personally, but can imagine those that do might dismiss the site as just a rant instead of the well written and researched one that it is.

That’s just smart marketing to not overtly perhaps offend potential “customers”!

Despite what you and others may believe, if the MSM and others decide the site is ripe for criticism because of some contentious terms used in the main blog (as opposed to the comments which aren’t restricted) then it may as well not exist.

What he has done is simple common sense – even if you don’t like it!

JMO of course.

181412 Free the North, replying to Free the North, 4, #638 of 2192 🔗

Snapshot from Manchester. We visited New Islington in Manchester on Saturday. There’s a Covid 19 testing station there which was clearly deserted, apart from the staff. We could see the entrance and exit clearly from where we were. Apart from two people (possibly staff arriving for a shift) no-one entered and no-one left. I wandered over to the exit and asked the staff member on duty if they’d been busy earlier in the day. They had not.

New Islington is full of young people and is awash with very popular bars, cafes and restaurants. Manchester allegedly is on the brink of a public health disaster which justifies trashing the city centre economy. So why was the testing station – conveniently located in the heart of the residential district – deserted?

181634 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to Free the North, 1, #639 of 2192 🔗

Isn’t it good that it is deserted? No testing, no “cases”.

181418 wildboar, replying to wildboar, 1, #640 of 2192 🔗

It is a shame that the bedwetters have yet again managed to close down free speech.

Upon the arrival of a complaint from ONE person that the term “bedwetter” is offensive or possibly could be offensive to some people, Toby Young has banned the word ‘bedwetter’ from his website. Was that one complainer a caring but easily-offended human being or was he part of a co-ordinated left wing group of activists, I wonder.

Why do I even bother to read the news at this site, if word-crime and thought-crime are the shape of things to come? I have never used the word myself until now, but when someone attacks free speech, it is for all of us to stand up to defend it.

Will my comment here now be banned by a human or software moderator because I have used a word that may offend someone, somewhere, at some time?

Whether that be the case or not, this will be the last comment I ever make on this site. I will just say, “Bedwetter!Bedwetter!Bedwetter!” and enough is enough now.

181439 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to wildboar, 7, #641 of 2192 🔗

It’s Toby’s site, he’s free to use whichever rules he like. If you want a bedwetter sceptics, feel free to set it up yourself. Free speech doesn’t mean that you get whatever you want published, it just means that you are free to find a platform that will let you say what you like. WordPress is open and waiting for you.

181440 ▶▶ Julian, replying to wildboar, 7, #642 of 2192 🔗

Doesn’t look like it has been banned, does it?

TY is free to decide what he posts above the line. It’s his site. Below the line, there is no censorship that I am aware of.

This issue has become a distraction and should not divide us. Some may wish to use it, some may not. We’ve all expressed our views on it.

181419 stewart, replying to stewart, -1, #643 of 2192 🔗

I am wondering whether the “retiring” of the bedwetter moniker is for real or a social experiment by TY, to show the insidious way free speech can be suppressed.

It reminds me a bit of the German movie The Wave – currently on Netflix – in which a high school teacher runs an experiment in authoritarian rule with his class, to prove how easily it can flourish.

Let’s hope this doesn’t get out of hand, like in the movie, and anyone who choses to continue using the term bedwetter doesn’t suffer censure from the rest of the crowd.

Either way, declaring the term bedwetters unhelpful whilst trying to find some other name for the same group of people is, well, the stuff of political correctness. Just like switching from crippled to handicapped to physically challenged to differently abled…and so on.

If this site is now into political correctness, then we are really entering twilight zone territory.

181436 ▶▶ Julian, replying to stewart, 9, #644 of 2192 🔗

I don’t think it is political correctness. It is partly to avoid using a term that is gratuitously offensive to those with medical issues (appreciate that is not the intention) but also a matter of tactics – are you going to get people onside by name-calling?

Someone yesterday suggested the term be avoided above the line, where newcomers and non-sceptics are likely to look. Below the line, anything goes. There’s never been any censorship that I have seen. Most people who post on here either ignore stuff they disagree with, or engage with. Freedom of speech is alive and well here.

181444 ▶▶▶ DownWithBedwetters, replying to Julian, -1, #645 of 2192 🔗

I don’t think that allowing certain language below the line while censoring it above the line is “free speech”.

It runs contrary to the principles of the Free Speech Union. Well, I thought so until now.

181695 ▶▶▶▶ Mrs issedoff, replying to DownWithBedwetters, #646 of 2192 🔗

I personally don’t think the word is strong enough, it is a school yard type of expression to me. I am too angry at people who refuse to see what is infront of their eyes, at this stage they are not bedwetters but traitors to a country under seige.

182819 ▶▶▶▶ deldor, replying to DownWithBedwetters, 1, #647 of 2192 🔗

How is it “censoring” it above the line ffs?

It’s Toby’s bloody blog!

What he chooses to use is HIS choice, he hasn’t stopped you or anyone using it in the comments so no “censoring” just free bloody choice on his part!

You telling him what he should say in HIS blog would be screwing with free speech for crying out loud!

You don’t get this?

181966 ▶▶▶ HoMojo, replying to Julian, #648 of 2192 🔗

It’s a delicate line. It’s PC if it’s mandated or we ‘cancel’ people for using it, it’s not if we agree that we don’t want to be offensive to people with a medical/emotional condition. On the other hand I’m not against offending people now and again, some people need to be offended , they need to get woken up. And I don’t agree – across the board – that ridiculing or insulting someone is self-defeating though concede that sometimes it is. Sometimes drastic times need drastic measures. I am in no way advocating violence (underlined for emphasis) because I consider it morally indefensible, on the other hand I am acutely aware that the only political demonstration in the last thirty years to get a result was the poll tax demo in 1990 which ended in riots and nearly 350 arrests, though granted that wasn’t the intention at the outset. And you could argue that the government’s policies are violent, as were the TSG in the last Trafalgar Square demonstration. So whether it’s insults or physical aggro where do you exactly draw the line?

182016 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Julian, #649 of 2192 🔗

Well said.

181420 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 3, #650 of 2192 🔗

Energetic message on reliability of PCR test. Not!
Proof that we’re being lied too… (important) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhwVRSZs8_8&feature=youtu.be

182174 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Victoria, #651 of 2192 🔗

That’s a good one to share to any first time doubters.

181421 RickH, replying to RickH, 11, #652 of 2192 🔗

Let’s hope there’s a full scale rebellion.”

Precious little sign of that so far.

On the ‘bedwetter’ debate : having had a ‘vigorous’ discussion yesterday (actually not over totally opposed positions, but simply about caution and justified response), I am convinced that throwing insults about isn’t of any use except to blow off steam.

I see believers now much more as victims than simple ignoramuses. The damaging effect of this blanket propaganda shouldn’t be underestimated.

181427 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to RickH, 2, #653 of 2192 🔗

Exactly my stance RE: the term bedwetter.

181521 ▶▶ stewart, replying to RickH, 1, #654 of 2192 🔗

I see believers now much more as victims than simple ignoramuses.

I don’t and I think it is a mistake to let them off the hook so easily. Having a population which is prepared to do the hard work of questioning and thinking is not a nice to have. It is an absolute necessity.

If you believe the population is incapable of questioning and thinking properly, then ultimately you don’t really believe in a workable democracy and are relying instead on benevolent, responsible authoritarianism.

The people aren’t the victims of this, they are the perpetrators who time and again support the crazy measures of the government despite all the contrary evidence. And the evidence is everywhere if one cares to look for just one second. Starting with most people’s personal experience.

182902 ▶▶▶ deldor, replying to stewart, #655 of 2192 🔗

I think most people here are aware of the facts which is why they are here, but being dismissive of those that aren’t as aware and denigrating them won’t fix the problem. I share the frustration and frequently have a rant amongst friends and family along those lines.

To publicly label those who might not be as aware or indeed, might not have the capacity to figure it out as “perpetrators” won’t further our cause, as frustrating as that is! As has been mentioned elsewhere today, we need to use good argument to convert those you mention, as bloody frustrating and difficult as that might be!

The phrase “softly softly catchy monkey” springs to mind.
Whether that works? Who knows? Lol!

181424 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 40, #656 of 2192 🔗

This morning I think I can safely assume that all my customers have been over 70. Not one of them has worn a mask. Only hint of one was one lady who pulled her scarf up to her mouth, and she was taking the piss!

These people aren’t scared, they just want their lives back.

181503 ▶▶ TheOriginalBlackPudding, replying to kh1485, 19, #657 of 2192 🔗

As a grandparent I feel I am being used by Hancock et al.
In my name they inspire fear and guilt in the young who should be living their lives to the full.
I’m happy to take my chance as, I’m sure from reading comments here, are many others of my age and above. My parents in their 90s feel they same – they would like to live what is left of their lives with an opportunity to see their children, grandchildren and great grandchildren – and take their chance. Family is the consolation of age and the government are denying us that whilst saying it’s for our own good. (The wife-beater analogy comes to mind again.)

Perhaps it’s time we had a Grandparents’ Declaration (“GPD”?) in which we can publicly state “Not in my name”.

181547 ▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to TheOriginalBlackPudding, 9, #658 of 2192 🔗

Excellent idea. I’m not a grandparent (wish they’d get on with it) but I’ll support that.

181621 ▶▶ William Hand, replying to kh1485, 3, #659 of 2192 🔗

You’re a star, a superstar, …..

181437 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to mattghg, 7, #661 of 2192 🔗

This has not happened in Florida, Spain, France or anywhere else where mandatory masks were more strictly enforced than here. Indeed there has been an increase in cases which correlate to the introduction of such mandates in these and other places.

The mask is a tool of oppression, and this is propaganda to facilitate the introduction of yet further extensions to the mandate in the UK.

181460 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Richard O, 5, #662 of 2192 🔗

If face masks work, why do people who wear them still get respiratory illnesses?

181477 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Steve Hayes, -2, #663 of 2192 🔗

EVERYONE needs to wear them!

181730 ▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to DRW, #664 of 2192 🔗

Sorry, that’s just what the zealots will say. Not sure what the latest mental gymnastics are on Spain though.

181438 ▶▶ T. Prince, replying to mattghg, 2, #665 of 2192 🔗

No, just the prelude to wearing them every fecking where

181441 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to mattghg, 5, #666 of 2192 🔗

Nope.They used modelling.

181447 ▶▶ Andy Riley, replying to mattghg, 8, #667 of 2192 🔗

“The authors use a modelling approach”
Need I add more?

Another study that looks at potential benefits. There could be a publication bias here – how many studies look for potential harms?

181459 ▶▶ calchas, replying to mattghg, 7, #668 of 2192 🔗

They were told what answer was required and devised a model in order to get there.

Peru has had compulsory masks in public places for seven months.

181465 ▶▶ kf99, replying to mattghg, 4, #669 of 2192 🔗

Even if they were 100% effective, they shouldn’t be mandatory. We don’t mandate crash helmets for when walking down the street. We don’t mandate everyone to eat healthy food every day.

181486 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to mattghg, 3, #670 of 2192 🔗

NO. There is no proof that face masks are effective. Actually face masks are very dangerous

COVID-19 Masks Are a Crime Against Humanity and Child Abuse Testimony of a virologist
https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19-masks-crime-against-humanity-child-abuse/5726059

181577 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to mattghg, 1, #671 of 2192 🔗

Here’s the paper (preprint):

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3698420

I reckon that we could follow this up by applying the authors’ exact methodology to some other geographical location: say for example the different cantons of Switzerland, which have had different mandates on face coverings. I’m pretty sure there would be no effect.

I could play a part in this but would need to collaborate with someone to share the workload of digging out the relevant data. It would be better still if it were a stats whizz with a relevant university position. I am actually a university researcher but not in a related area. Anyone interested?

181679 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to mattghg, 1, #672 of 2192 🔗

Suggest you ignore this study (pity it is reported in MSM but that is part of their propaganda). There are hundreds of studies pro and against face masks and we will be bombarded with the pro in the MSM. It is impossible to look at each and every study and it is very time consuming.

Just by reading the Study Extract the following:

Red Light:
This study you linked have been written by 4x people from the Department of Economics and 1x person from National Bureau of Economic Research.
This means that the health impact is of no concern

Red Light:
“We estimate the impact of mask mandates….”
What? That is meaningless

Big glaring gap
The impact of wearing a mask on health (physical & mental)

181671 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to mattghg, 1, #673 of 2192 🔗

I’m not sure if the Canadian findings are saying mask wearing reduces the number of infections or curtails the increase.

As far as I’m aware in these islands once made mandatory infections have started rise (perhaps elsewhere too?)

In Ireland mandatory mask wearing was introduced in mid-July when cases were running at 132 a week – they are now over 4,500 (but a lot more testing is going on testing)

Figures for Wales suggest in the period twixt mask wearing being mandatory in England but not in Wales that Wales did better per-rata – by my count anyway.

But even if they are curtailing infections – against that has to be the climate of fear they are generating which not only makes life more miserable also causes mortality figure to rise.

Footnote. Despite the massive rise in cases mortality figures in Ireland are only now becoming to equivalent to what they were before the mask wearing edict was introduced.

181687 ▶▶ HoMojo, replying to mattghg, 1, #674 of 2192 🔗

This is bulshit masquerading as a scientific study. Later on it says BMA demands face masks everywhere, even in the open. Actually it was one bloke at the BMA not speaking for its members.

181445 HelenaHancart, replying to HelenaHancart, 5, #675 of 2192 🔗

On the subject of facial attire, I find the word “mask” has very sinister overtones in the way it is being forced on the public at large. I agree “nappy” is somewhat infantile but isn’t that what the government is trying to do to us? When I see face masks everywhere I see people swaddled and silenced, like how babies used to be swaddled, to comfort, calm and get them to sleep! I like the term face “nap.” It is the stem of “napkin” which is where the word nappy comes from, and isn’t it really the correct term in that it absorbs the plague-ridden detritus from noses and mouths, like a napkin? BTW have handkerchiefs and tissues, the go-to solution for centuries to deal with face/nose emission, been outlawed now?

181494 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to HelenaHancart, 3, #676 of 2192 🔗

Good point re handkerchiefs & tissues. What is supposed to be the correct etiquette now for discharging one’s nose? Remove mask & blow/sneeze into a tissue? Keep mask on and explode your nose into it?

181451 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 17, #677 of 2192 🔗

Regarding the bedwetter discussion. Calling people names is not only impolite, it is counterproductive. If one wishes to persuade another to person to think or do something, name calling is the worst thing one could do. However, there is no debate on this coronavirus issue. What passes for the discussion is an official narrative that is nothing more than emotive rhetoric, baseless assertions and moralising: ie, it is propaganda; and very powerful propaganda. One effective response to propaganda is satire and ridicule. It works by deflating the presumed authority, allowing people to see it for what it is. Once that happens, people are more open to reason and evidence. So rather than calling the victims of propaganda names, I would suggest it would be more productive to satirise the official narrative (things like the virus knows what the time is) and provide reasoned, evidenced arguments, especially around the disproportionate response to the virus, including the fact that the measures kill people.

181485 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to Steve Hayes, 4, #678 of 2192 🔗

Excellent post.

181511 ▶▶▶ kf99, replying to JohnMac, 4, #679 of 2192 🔗

Agreed. we should satirise indirectly by coming up with good names for our side. I loved the suggestion yesterday for “person of face” for non-mask wearer

181461 Free the North, 8, #680 of 2192 🔗

I can’t prove this scientifically but I suspect many people are both frightened and confused. On scientific issues too, many people lack confidence and knowledge so are susceptible to messages allegedly based on ‘the science’. That said, I also meet many people from many backgrounds who are deeply sceptical about what they’re being told and growing numbers who are beginning to realise that we do need to learn to live with the virus and that it is not the apocalyptic threat it is made out to be. As for the polls, how many respondents are ‘shy sceptics’ or not sure enough to commit themselves to a sceptical response? On balance, I think not calling them ‘bedwetters’ is more likely to win such people over.

181464 Mark H, replying to Mark H, 24, #681 of 2192 🔗

Speaking as someone who was raised in a religious cult and woke himself up at the age of 36, I have some experience with trying to open eyes and minds to reality and truth in the face of brainwashing and indoctrination.

Re. the use of the term “bedwetters”, any perceived slight on the truth as seen by cultists automatically shuts their minds down.

Waking someone up from cult indoctrination is incredibly difficult. Believe me, I spent many years after waking up from my own indoctrination attempting to wake up others, the friends and family I’d “left behind” in the religion. 12 years later, none have followed me out.

Challenging head-on doesn’t work. Name calling doesn’t work, even if it makes the user of said names feel better.

One of the few proven ways is to go on with life in a way that directly contradicts what the brainwashed person has been told to believe; “Oh look, I didn’t die.” [shrug]

On a personal note, the trauma I experienced upon waking up to and exiting the cult I’d been brought up in, within which lay my entire family and social structure, which I lost upon leaving, was something I didn’t ever expect many people to understand or experience. Now my journey is being lived by thousands across the planet.

181482 ▶▶ JohnMac, replying to Mark H, 1, #682 of 2192 🔗

Are you able to tell us which religious cult?

181509 ▶▶ Basics, replying to Mark H, 2, #683 of 2192 🔗

https://twitter.com/SmithTarquin/status/1315395186562826246?s=20

A thoughtful tweet from someone who just got it.

181627 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Mark H, #684 of 2192 🔗

In this cult do you get to fuck all the ladies? I’m assuming you do because no one really believes in God. Sure there are people who claim they do but i know for a 100% fact that when the god believer faces their final days religion gives them no comfort whatsoever and in fact most of them regret the years they wasted believing in that load of old shit. I know christians will read this and just think i’m talking bollocks and that’s fine but i know when the time comes their nonsensical belief in god and an afterlife won’t help them in any way. To live is to fly not to hide behind some unprovable nonsense. Off course it goes without saying believe what you like it’s no skin off my nose.

181466 chaos, replying to chaos, 8, #685 of 2192 🔗

Just when I think my elderly mum is finally managing to grasp the great reset.. she again (like the sheeple talk radio masses) starts wondering why Boris doesn’t go for herd immunity. Great Groundhog day.

Our predicament has nothing to do with a virus and everything to do with digital ID and the great Bilderberg reset. A faux green reset with Chinese style control.

181476 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to chaos, 1, #686 of 2192 🔗

All with the agreement of our Parliament

181527 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Dan Clarke, #687 of 2192 🔗

Some of them like Jenrick are just too Tim nice but Dim to see the Great Greta plan. In other words, not everyone is in on the real goal.

181470 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 20, #688 of 2192 🔗

Kate Shemirani at Tesco challenged for not wearing a mask firstly by two abusive members of the public, then a Tesco employee (male and much bigger than herself) said to another member of staff that he was going to punch her in the face. She since reported this online to the police, to Tesco head office and will be pursuing this under the Equalities Act against Tesco and the individual involved.

https://twitter.com/KateShemirani/status/1315281580873613314

181474 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Victoria, 11, #689 of 2192 🔗

disgusting, and all because they haven’t got the courage to do the same as her

181561 ▶▶ HelenaHancart, replying to Victoria, 8, #690 of 2192 🔗

Good for her, I hope she wins hands down! Under the Equality Act 2010, businesses have an obligation to protect its staff and members of the public on its site, in this case, customers, who “may” have an unseen disability or condition to ensure they are NOT intimidated by other customers or staff!

182027 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, 3, #691 of 2192 🔗

Wonder if she was deliberately targeted due to someone recognising her?

181471 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 5, #692 of 2192 🔗

Blinding people with narrative has worked so far, but now we know that none of their ‘science’ has made a blind bit of difference. Just allowed them to plough on with their agenda unhindered with forced. masks showing compliance to all. Johnson was hiding his face today, hope he feels ashamed at what he’s allowed in a few short months.

181607 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Dan Clarke, 3, #693 of 2192 🔗

Ashamed? These people are shooting Adrenochrome into their eye balls they’re having so much fun. They are feeding off the misery of the people.

181635 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Biker, 1, #694 of 2192 🔗

‘A cheap holiday in other people’s misery’ (although he cribbed it).

181478 Miss Owl, replying to Miss Owl, 3, #695 of 2192 🔗

I’d have a little more respect for Toby Young if he simply used whatever language he chooses above the line, and not virtue-signalled about his actions.

181483 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Miss Owl, 1, #696 of 2192 🔗

Yep – virtue-signalling, the root of all evil!

181484 peter, replying to peter, 24, #697 of 2192 🔗

Lost my job to the covid hoax today, thanx Boris you CUNT

181488 ▶▶ AnotherSceptic, replying to peter, 7, #698 of 2192 🔗

I am sorry to hear that peter.

181589 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to AnotherSceptic, -6, #699 of 2192 🔗

He’s lying. He’s just trying to disrupt. That’s ok, maybes he’s just a fat socialist fucker thinking he’s funny or maybe he’s one of them paid for shills, though i doubt that, no i’d say he’s just a pathetic lefty liar.

181500 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to peter, 4, #700 of 2192 🔗

That’s everything that’s going on, in those 12 words. Sorry, mate.

181581 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to peter, 4, #701 of 2192 🔗

Sorry to hear that. I was in a similar situation not long ago, and took up a temp job with a large agency called ‘Staffline’ who hire nationally by the bucket load. The work hasn’t exactly been interesting, in fact the only enjoyable part of it has been going home, but it has kept my bills paid and the hours/pay have been as regular as clockwork.

If you need quick work to keep things going while you look for something else then it’s worth looking them up. All the best.

181491 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 7, #702 of 2192 🔗

I’ve found that the mask wearers are fearful, of everything. When you tell them they could become ill from breathing in recycled carbon dioxide they don’t know what to do and you can see the cogs going round, trying to figure out what would be worse, especially when you add that the average age of dying WITH covid is 82.

181563 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to Dan Clarke, #703 of 2192 🔗

Tell them that their body is full of dihydrogen monoxide and that they need to drink lots of water to get rid of it.

181585 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Recusant, 4, #704 of 2192 🔗

Someone stood outside the United Nations and asked people entering and leaving the building to sign a petition calling for the banning of that very substance. They collected many signatures, very quickly.

181602 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Steve Hayes, #705 of 2192 🔗

I now have a new theory. This all down to an episode of Brass Eye that has got out of control.

181608 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cicatriz, 1, #706 of 2192 🔗

Covid affects an area of the brain know as Shatners Bassoon…

181609 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cicatriz, #707 of 2192 🔗

Covid affect an area of the brain know as Shatner’s Bassoon.

181625 ▶▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Cicatriz, #708 of 2192 🔗

I had to look up Brass Eye. I can see from Wikipedia’s description why it was cancelled. Sounds rather too accurate.

181493 Biker, replying to Biker, 39, #709 of 2192 🔗

Johnston is a fat disgusting liberal tosser working for the NWO. This take down of our country is an act of war. Childless women like Sturgeon worship satan’s cock while they attend secret meetings with the kind of people who go to Epstiens island. They tell us we need to do better so allow savages from every fucking place here, then they tell us that we need to change and be more like these savages, then they tell us we need to get rid of our engines while the chinky dog eating savages burn coal quicker than a feminist can complain….. anything to chip away at Britain.
People are hiding in their homes for a flu that’s harmless to most people. When are the people gonna rise up? Oh that’s right most of us here have been fat fucking tubs of lard unable to do anything for themselves for years now, so never. Rule Britannia? Fuck off. We’ve allowed ourselves to be taken over by globalists. We are prisoners on our own island and the Guards are an occupying force hiding under the guise of the UN, WHO and god knows who else. The BBC is nothing but propaganda for faggots, foreigners and the destruction of everything we ever were. They constantly tell us how terrible we are and constantly lie about the virus. We’ve been led down the path to total destruction and no one gives a fuck. There is no place to turn. None of our MP’s will do anything, they’re all diversity trained so obviously as much use as tits on a Nun. Our governments are full of people who aren’t British. Our schools are full of pedophiles who teach children about sex and drugs when they’re at Primary, our NHS is a joke and the police are chosen for their ability to be follow their orders even when they are designed to destroy the country that pays these pea brained, unable to support themselves without a government job, tossers……
The game is up.
Your pensions will be worth fuck all, your savings the same. They keep printing and borrowing money to devalue it. Your children will never be able to own a house, they’ll never be able to have children of their own. We all know this “vaccine” will make people sterile, that’s what the evil Bill Gates wants, he openly says we need 5 billion less people, they’re not hiding their intentions. Who do they borrow this money from i wonder? Who accepts welfare handouts of any kind? Never a borrower or a lender be my old Grandmother would say, good advice that. What did Jesus say about the money lenders and look what they did to him. This is a biblical fight to the death and i’m afraid fat dullards like Johnston and intellectual pygmies like Sturgeon are equally as bad. I don’t know what i hate more, the fact the Johnstone is doing this because he’s paid to do it or Sturgeon is doing this because she’s dumb all over.
Land of Hope and Glory? In the words of the immortal John Lydon, “there’s no future and Englands Dreaming”.
I think i might have just had enough of this.

181497 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Biker, 4, #710 of 2192 🔗

Couldn’t agree more..

181506 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Biker, 3, #711 of 2192 🔗

What do you think about Parliament, who is standing by?

181513 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to Dan Clarke, 6, #712 of 2192 🔗

Parliament had declared itself Sovereign so we now live under a tyrannical non elected government stuffed full of foreigners.

181508 ▶▶ peter, replying to Biker, 5, #713 of 2192 🔗

Britain is at the heart of orchestrating this hoax.

181512 ▶▶▶ Biker, replying to peter, #714 of 2192 🔗

Oh fuck off

181519 ▶▶▶▶ peter, replying to Biker, -3, #715 of 2192 🔗

make me cuntface

181525 ▶▶▶▶▶ Biker, replying to peter, -1, #716 of 2192 🔗

you’re nothing son, just a speck of dust, irrelevant, someone who i already hate myself for for wasting the three seconds it took me to type this

181537 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ peter, replying to Biker, -6, #717 of 2192 🔗

do ride your bike into a brick wall and join yer mum

182135 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to peter, #718 of 2192 🔗

More likely a lead target, imo.

181610 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Biker, 3, #719 of 2192 🔗

You sound a bit like me at 1 am after about 6pints..But I agree with you 100%!

182734 ▶▶ David Grimbleby, replying to Biker, #720 of 2192 🔗

Lamely.. Johnson surely?

182855 ▶▶ RichardJames, replying to Biker, #721 of 2192 🔗

Thank you for my daily dose of “Biker”; I have read your post a few times, as it seems to work better than anti-depressants.

181524 Keen Cook, replying to Keen Cook, 6, #722 of 2192 🔗

I picked up a Tweet from an academic showcasing Anthony Costello’s slot on Sky news where he has a real go (and out of context) at Prof Gupta’s ‘let it rip’ comment. It suddenly hit me that I bet he wouldn’t have said that about a bloke (Prof G has said she has felt discrimination on all levels) & then it occurred to me that other than the bonkers Devi and Sturgeon there are very few women broadcasting honest news or truth.
It is the women who will bear the brunt of the fall-out from this disaster – not only in Europe but all over the world – it is the women who work in the fields, try to feed their children and don’t have a voice. I’m not a out and out feminist but there seem to be far too many male scientists ‘having their bit of fame’ moment and shouting down any female who dares to disagree.
I dislike being told ‘what to do’ especially if I don’t see the rationale behind it and I ESPECIALLY don’t like be told ‘what to do’ by men in power – and there are alot of them at the moment.

181533 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Keen Cook, -1, #723 of 2192 🔗

Can i just say take your feminist nonsense and stuff it up your fanny

181573 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Keen Cook, 5, #724 of 2192 🔗

Great post. Sadly the lockdown meant that mostly women (yes men too) had to do homeschooling and as a result their jobs had to take a back seat.

181751 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Keen Cook, #725 of 2192 🔗

Ooh – Michie ? Greenhalgh ?

181528 AnotherSceptic, replying to AnotherSceptic, 1, #726 of 2192 🔗

Comment deleted by me.

181552 ▶▶ Basics, replying to AnotherSceptic, 2, #727 of 2192 🔗

Snap the on the story, the hateful BBC embedded EdinLive and the condemnation of the stupidity of schools.

Safe-guarding?

181575 ▶▶▶ AnotherSceptic, replying to Basics, #728 of 2192 🔗

Snap indeed.
I agree with you though, we both think the same way Basics.

181530 chaos, replying to chaos, 6, #729 of 2192 🔗

I expect unemployment will be 4 million by Christmas. Am I right or wrong?
In other news Hitchens on talkradio wiffle waffle huffle puffle groundhog day wiffle waffle puffle huffle deja vu.

181538 ▶▶ FenTyger, replying to chaos, 1, #730 of 2192 🔗

It’s our Christmas present from Boris

181541 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to chaos, 3, #731 of 2192 🔗

Depends how many currently on furlough are made redundant. Could be much higher than 4 million.

181558 ▶▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Richard O, 3, #732 of 2192 🔗

I calculated that if everyone on furlough is made redundant then almost 10 million people will be unemployed, out of a workforce of approximately 32 million.

181569 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to nocheesegromit, 4, #733 of 2192 🔗

How many of these will become sick and die as a result of the inevitable crushing poverty I wonder? Dead is better than unemployed as far as the state is concerned.

181586 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Richard O, 3, #734 of 2192 🔗

Marriage breakups, child poverty, suicides, biggest deficit and debt to GDP since the war. It’s all worth it to stop the spread of covid.

181595 ▶▶ WhyNow, replying to chaos, 8, #735 of 2192 🔗

There is no unemployment! That’s a right wing extremist lie, intended to cause resentment and division. All workers are profitably employed by the State providing health care services. The service they are providing is to stay at home, avoid caring for anyone in case they infect them. What could be a more rewarding job than that! We will get back to the tractor factories when this is all over. Glory to the motherland and our wise leaders!

181606 ▶▶ Templeton, replying to chaos, #736 of 2192 🔗

Am I correct in thinking though, official unemployment figures are only people that are actively seeking work? It does not account for redundancies?

181536 Basics, replying to Basics, 10, #737 of 2192 🔗

From edinburghlive

“Edinburgh kids told to wrap up for school as classroom windows to stay open to tackle virus spread
Windows in school classrooms will be kept open even as temperatures drop”

I wonder what her royal -I don’t coment about party politics but vote Biden- Greta the Almighty might have to say.

Risk assessment say jumpers are okay – room temperature used to matter with optimum temperatures for desk work and physical work known to matter. Both for health and productivity. Shops of course have the optimum temperature for maximum spending in them. But wool hat and fingerless glives are now fine.

What comes when a human is exposed to low temperature? Ill health. Schools should be shut down because they are staffed by morons.

Ps I post local rag stories because they are likely to be typical across Britain.

181550 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to Basics, 7, #738 of 2192 🔗

Kids should contract pneumonia to avoid Covid. The psychos hate children. They hate everything, in fact.

181562 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Basics, 10, #739 of 2192 🔗

Parents need to withdraw their children from these government death camps now.

181576 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Basics, 13, #740 of 2192 🔗

The kids can sit there in minus temperatures while the “teachers” tell them all about drugs and blow jobs followed by some drag person reading a story about Billy’s two dads. It’ll be such fun. For them they won’t have to live under the brutal cane of Mr Brunton as he attempts to make you learn Calculus, no sir, not for these kids. Susan’s two mummies can come in and give a talk about the evil white men do and Lateeeeecha can come in and tell them all about the black experience of living under empirical science instead of witch doctors. A couple of extra jumpers and a hat should help keep them warm while some reformed junkie who’s found god tells them how Noah built an ark and took two of everything, no wait, sorry Noah is now considered racist and sexist and homophobic because he took a man and a lady, he wasn’t gender aware, which is handy because when the temperature gets into the minus the RE teacher will personally place his hands on all the young childrens bodies to help keep them warm. This will also serve as an important first step before the man boy love lesson in the afternoon. Something to look forward to after a fine lunch of GM soy sausages and a energy drink.

181591 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Biker, 5, #741 of 2192 🔗

All whilst wearing their government gimp mask all day long.

The people inflicting this on children should be serving lengthy custodial sentences.

181658 ▶▶▶ Chris John, replying to Biker, 1, #742 of 2192 🔗

You don’t normally sit on the fence about these matters… 😂

181580 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Basics, 1, #743 of 2192 🔗

It is so ridiculous. Kids will just get sick (demotivated, despair) because of long term exposure to the cold

181584 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Basics, 1, #744 of 2192 🔗

Nothing to do with covid, this is from the climate change warriors. Why do they keep blaming everything on covid, next they’ll be blaming the Financial Reset on covid. Covid a mild disease, that harms hardly anyone, is getting all the blame.

181587 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Basics, 1, #745 of 2192 🔗

They’re going to cause schoolchildren to freeze “for health reasons” SMH.

181617 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to mattghg, #746 of 2192 🔗

Well, if they can stop scanning for cancers for health reasons…

181592 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Basics, 1, #747 of 2192 🔗

Civil Service, years ago, if the temp dropped below 64c you could go home, during the 70’s strikes.

181623 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Dan Clarke, 2, #748 of 2192 🔗

I’m pretty sure you mean 64f!

181544 chaos, replying to chaos, 1, #749 of 2192 🔗

The new spitting image is very lame already. Started off ok in episode 1.. episode 2 is shite.

181593 ▶▶ Biker, replying to chaos, 1, #750 of 2192 🔗

It was always shit bro, lefty wankers have never been funny, ever.

181545 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 6, #751 of 2192 🔗

If you don`t want to ruin your evening meal tonight i recommend either “Abandoned Engineering”, “Hard Core Pawn” or “Secret Nazi Bases” as alternative 6 pm viewing to the three dimwits.

181559 ▶▶ DRW, replying to nickbowes, 2, #752 of 2192 🔗

Every Clown Show is worse than the last.

181553 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 5, #753 of 2192 🔗

Challenged the councils reply from Corporate about the FOI from last week on what evidence they have been given by central Government.

It’s been escalated:

“Thank you for your email below concerning our response to your freedom of information request.

Whilst the Access to Information Team are responsible for processing requests on behalf of the council as a whole, we do not have direct access to the service information. We are therefore reliant on the relevant service(s) to provide copies of information held and/or advice.

We will therefore conduct a review of how we have handled your request including confirming whether or not the council holds recorded information falling within scope of your request.”

182441 ▶▶ Felice, replying to Awkward Git, #754 of 2192 🔗

Don’t hold your breathe. My daughter works in FOI for a council. It’s nothing more than process. Complain and they have to do an internal review. Someone other than the original team member does the review, but more often than not, the original reply is upheld. If they don’t hold the info, there’s nothing they can give you.

181554 James Marker, replying to James Marker, 6, #755 of 2192 🔗

Sunak is being asked to pile up a debt mountain and wreck the economy. Beats me why he goes along with it. He is all set to be the most unpopular chancellor ever when payback time arrives next year. If I were him, I’d resign now.

181564 ▶▶ merlin, replying to James Marker, 1, #756 of 2192 🔗

He doesn’t care as he will either be the PM by then, or this government will not exist.

181582 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to James Marker, 1, #757 of 2192 🔗

Isn’t the rumour that he’s responsible (after a fashion) about the 10pm curfew because if pubs were forced to close he was prepared to walk out?

181556 kf99, replying to kf99, 1, #758 of 2192 🔗

On the subject of “Whatever happened to the likely lads” (theme tune suggestion) the glorious shots in the opening titles are so nostalgic. It looked like the city was crumbling but the point was that we were optimistic about the future in those days.

Fascinating revisit of the scenes used in the show.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Olo4MTWlws&ab_channel=neiljungtv

181683 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to kf99, #759 of 2192 🔗

The Football Match episode is an absolute classic

181560 Awkward Git, 9, #760 of 2192 🔗

Doing OK on scepticism on the Daily Wail’s comments – 2 comments now 55/5 thumbs up.

Good to see so many anti-narrative comments saying it’s all bullshit and the pro one being voters down.

181566 AnotherSceptic, replying to AnotherSceptic, #761 of 2192 🔗

From the Manchester Evening News site.

Regarding the stricter lockdown measures coming into force for the North East.

Prof Powis, the medical director of NHS England, said there were now more patients in hospital with coronavirus than there were when the government ordered the lockdown in March.

“As the infection rate has begun to grow across the country, hospital infections have started to rise.

“It is clear that hospital admissions are rising fastest in those areas of the country where infection rates are highest, particularly the North West.

“In the over-65s – particularly the over-85s – we are seeing steep rises in the numbers of people being admitted to hospital so the claim that the elderly can somehow be fenced off from risk is wishful thinking.”

181583 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to AnotherSceptic, 4, #762 of 2192 🔗

Given that every single hospital admission is now being tested, how many of these are false positives?

181603 ▶▶▶ Evoluon, replying to Richard O, 1, #763 of 2192 🔗

And of course weren’t being tested in March and whether the currently positive patients exhibit Covid symptoms

181678 ▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Evoluon, #764 of 2192 🔗

Indeed. That kind of contextual info is forever missing. So why should we listen? They don’t get it. You’ve lost the crowd with your incessant cries of wolf.

181642 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Richard O, 2, #765 of 2192 🔗

False positives isn’t really the issue here, rather it’s people who are in hospital for something else but test positive (correctly) for the covid virus (or fragments thereof), and are either asymptomatic or not suffering hospital level covid symptoms.

181728 ▶▶ RickH, replying to AnotherSceptic, 2, #766 of 2192 🔗

Prof Powis, the medical director of NHS England”

… so, after the Horlicks that’s been made of the NHS, we’re supposed to give credibility to one of the top management?

Scottie!!!!!

181742 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to AnotherSceptic, #767 of 2192 🔗

If a student breaks his wrist, back flipping off a wardrobe through boredom, then gets tested on admission, voila!

181567 Jules, replying to Jules, 1, #768 of 2192 🔗

There are just a few signs that fellow sceptics are turning on each other today. What we need is a bit of a team talk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Cc6eVHYhg

181572 ▶▶ matt, replying to Jules, 7, #769 of 2192 🔗

There are a few signs that certain individuals are deliberately trying to provoke a flame war. Fortunately, those individuals are so for being rightly ignored.

181598 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to matt, #770 of 2192 🔗

Come, come, let’s not descend into group think. I don’t see anyone deliberately trying to provoke anything. I see a few differences of opinion, which is not a bad thing. and expressed almost entirely in a very civil way,

181605 ▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to stewart, 2, #771 of 2192 🔗

Which is how it usually is here, but as I say, there are a few exceptions in the last few days. I’ll say no more – and should have said less – because I’ve been deliberately not engaging until now, which was probably the better policy.

181615 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to matt, 3, #772 of 2192 🔗

I’m expecting things to get worse on here as conditions deteriorate and we descend ever further into the abyss. I have been lashing out at colleagues regularly recently, some deserved it, some did not.

181626 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ matt, replying to Richard O, 6, #773 of 2192 🔗

I’m not in a position to be lashing out at work, whether or not somebody deserves it. I doubt many are in that position right now. That leaves at home, which would be immoral or in the pub, which would get me into different kinds of trouble. So good, old-fashioned self control is the only way forward. At some point, my head will explode.

181676 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to Richard O, 6, #774 of 2192 🔗

My family begged me yesterday to stop going on about the situation because I was causing them too much distress.

They’re both sceptics, but apparently there’s only so much of my bile that they can take.

It puts me in mind of the marriage counsellor’s dictum: “You can be right, or you can be married.”

181707 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Jules, 1, #775 of 2192 🔗

The reality is we are quite split as those of us who were pro-Brexit were more split than we realised at the time. As with Brexit we need to put our differences aside for the sake of the cause.

(P.s I draw the line at David Icke. I will never believe he is anything other than a damaging distraction. In fact I would suggest that if the NWO is as clever as some believe it would have created David Icke iteself with a mission to discredit every cause he attaches himself to!)

181579 John P, replying to John P, 3, #776 of 2192 🔗

On the bright side, Google UK has stopped shadow banning it, so the actual Declaration now shows up in the search results

Apologies if I’m not the first to say this, but it’s gone again!

I hope that this does open up more people’s eyes to the blatant manipulation of public opinion that does go on on in the media and on the internet and has been going on for years. Much of the propaganda being promoted by governments behind the scenes.

Jeremy Corbyn (who I did no vote for, but who I nevertheless did not fear) was subject to blatant smears, especially by the Guardian.

And, particularly here and in America Russia and particularly Putin has been subject to similar propaganda. (That doesn’t mean I like Putin.)

Regading Skripal. Corbyn’s approach was correct and we still don’t know what happened in Salisbury in March 2018 or who was really behind the poisoning.

And no, I still do not believe that Covid-19 is a clobal conspiracy planned by Gates! (This final sentence is not sarcasm).

181590 ▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to John P, 2, #777 of 2192 🔗

> And no, I still do not believe that Covid-19 is a global conspiracy planned by Gates!

Especially given that bing.com has so far not shown any obvious bias in its search results for the phrase “great barrington declaration”.

181594 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Mabel Cow, 1, #778 of 2192 🔗

I didn’t know that. You’re right. Good spot !

181620 ▶▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to John P, 6, #779 of 2192 🔗

In case you didn’t catch it, I posted on Saturday about the variation in bias I was seeing in search results. Pasted here for your convenience.

————8<—————————

As other people have reported, searching for “great barrington declaration” on Google is returning anti-GB propaganda.

But interestingly, of the big names it’s only Google who are up to tomfuckery. Bing and Yahoo returned legit results for me. DuckDuckGo is my default search engine, so I hadn’t spotted this manipulation until now.

But check this out.

When I do the same search from different parts of the world I see a difference in bias:

  • UK: Anti-GB.
  • USA: Anti-GB.
  • Luxembourg: Anti-GB.
  • Poland: Slightly anti-GB.
  • Lithuania: Slightly anti-GB.
  • Canada: No obvious bias
  • France: No obvious bias.
  • Netherlands: No obvious bias.
  • Germany: No obvious bias.

(I’m doing these searches using the various points-of-presence that my VPN service provides. Before each search I reset the browser cookies and history, and at no point am I logged in to Google.)

My anti-conspiracy stance is definitely taking a beating right now.

181927 ▶▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Mabel Cow, #780 of 2192 🔗

It is possible that Google bases its ranking on the popularity of links in each country. e.g. if more people in the UK go to Anti-GB, sites, then those sites will rank higher in searches from the UK.

I don’t use Google (prefer DDG) but I think it is possible this is not a conspiracy, just an artefact of how Google automatically ranks results.

If they wanted to suppress GB I would have thought they would just suppress it globally, not per country.

182347 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to zacaway, #781 of 2192 🔗

> If they wanted to suppress GB I would have thought they would just suppress it globally, not per country.

That was my initial thought as well.

But that’s predicated on the idea that Google is ideologically opposed to the GB Declaration.

What if it’s just a money thing? What if (hypothetically) Google offers a pay-to-play scheme where search results can be manipulated for a price?

They might offer to adjust the “view of the world” for certain classes of (logged-in) user, or as a blanket thing across territories. If the price of such a service depended on the number of users affected, it would probably not be cost effective for a customer to buy the entire world. Much cheaper to just hit those areas that needed suppressing.

Even if this barmy explanation turned out to be true, I still wouldn’t classify it as a conspiracy: it’s still just a money thing.

As to why Bing and Yahoo showed no bias, that might be because nobody uses those search engines, so why bother spending any money manipulating their results. 🙂

182380 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ zacaway, replying to Mabel Cow, #782 of 2192 🔗

Interesting possibility – they are in the business of making money after all!

181673 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to John P, 3, #783 of 2192 🔗

When I search “great barrington declaration” on Google, you have to go to page 4 of the result to actually find the link to the declaration website. By contrast, it’s the first result when you search on either Bing or DuckDuckGo.

181762 ▶▶▶ petgor, replying to mattghg, #784 of 2192 🔗

Thanks I will use duckduckgo

181596 Rowan, replying to Rowan, 4, #785 of 2192 🔗

Okay then, we need a new term for those being scared witless and shitless at the dreadful prospect of catching something akin to the common cold.

181667 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Rowan, #786 of 2192 🔗

Coronaphobes

181704 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 2, #787 of 2192 🔗

I think Coronaphile is more accurate. They’re seemingly enjoying it all.

181597 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 16, #788 of 2192 🔗

The press conference should be used as teaching material in behavioural science. Fearmongering par excellence. Very cleverly stating some facts, for example only showing charts of “infections rise” and talking about hospital admissions, but NOT showing any charts, which clearly would lesser the impact of the information dished out.
Most patients with covid in Liverpool are above 85, but if you put that into context that the average age in the UK for males is 79, and for females is 82.
At least the journalists have asked some fairly good questions.
In general, I think it has very well been aimed at the over 65s, the people most likely to sit at home and watch this, to put fear into them. The “heat wave charts”, again, have very cleverly been commentated, implying that the young people, who are the “hottest” group, infect the older.
For every argument they made, I had a counter argument.
I am fuming.

181614 ▶▶ matt, replying to Silke David, 5, #789 of 2192 🔗

It was very nearly as disgraceful as the Whitty/Vallance “press conference” of a few weeks ago. The single saving grace was that they didn’t publish a “not a prediction” graph this time round. Everything else around it was shameful, though.

181601 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 14, #790 of 2192 🔗

Surely a lot of this must come under the human rights act. Where are all the Human Rights Lawyers, Blair’s wife used to love it all.

181613 ▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Dan Clarke, 8, #791 of 2192 🔗

They’re busy defending illegal immigrant rights to stay in the UK.

181721 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to bluemoon, #792 of 2192 🔗

Another irrelevant hobby horse chews fodder.

Another notch down in the credibility of the site.

181619 ▶▶ Recusant, replying to Dan Clarke, 7, #793 of 2192 🔗

Human Rights and International Law are just opinions that high status people want to force on the rest of the world. And high status people currently say follow the science, lose your job and fuck off. So you’re out of luck.

181725 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Recusant, 1, #794 of 2192 🔗

Wish others would understand this. People still cling to the hope that a Human Rights Law or the Nuremberg Code will come to their rescue – they won’t, like you say they are tools of the rich and powerful and will be bypassed if need be through law of funds for a case or lack or representation.

181622 ▶▶ merlin, replying to Dan Clarke, #795 of 2192 🔗

Dangerous foreign born criminals have avoided deportation as the courts have ruled that their right to family life is more important than public safety.

181647 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to merlin, 2, #796 of 2192 🔗

the courts have ruled that their right to family life is more important than public safety

Are you suggesting that courts do the opposite? Because that’s the government’s excuse for lockdown.

181677 ▶▶▶▶ merlin, replying to John P, #797 of 2192 🔗

No. I am suggesting that foreign born dangerous criminals have more human rights than law abiding uk citizens

181993 ▶▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to John P, #798 of 2192 🔗

So why aren’t the courts objecting to lockdown?

181630 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Dan Clarke, 3, #799 of 2192 🔗

Cherie loved it until her husband disregarded the human rights of 100,000s of Iraqis and our own servicemen and women and Dr David Kelly and Robin Cook but let’s not get into that.

181644 ▶▶ John P, replying to Dan Clarke, 1, #800 of 2192 🔗

“Where are all the Human Rights Lawyers.”

I don’t know – cowering at home, afraid of a virus?

181616 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 9, #801 of 2192 🔗

Watch this psychology experiment.

An expressionless face causes the baby distress. What on earth does a face nappy do?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apzXGEbZht0&feature=share&fbclid=IwAR1ahQwrpAFaHLDaM4G8DcMqHGAp8VgtpL1jIHN8w81LECzAA12jc77b2A0

181648 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #802 of 2192 🔗

It is really shocking. This experiment is happening with lots of innocent babies on a daily basis.

181653 ▶▶▶ wayno, replying to Victoria, 7, #803 of 2192 🔗

its the main reason my wife refuses to wear one, as our 1 year old get freaked out by other people having them on. That and she as skeptical as me.

182081 ▶▶ Sophie123, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #804 of 2192 🔗

Ask babies in the middle east, in countries like Saudi. With its reputation for tolerance and kindness to fellow humans.

181654 ▶▶ leggy, replying to p02099003, 2, #806 of 2192 🔗

Curiouser and curiouser.

181631 Darryl, replying to Darryl, 6, #807 of 2192 🔗

It’s quite interesting to see how the MSM keep on reporting busy Covid 19 testing centres but in reality they seem to be pretty much empty apart from a lot of aggressive private security staff who don’t like the site being photographed from outside the centres on public footpaths. These places must cost a small fortune.

To me it suggests there is an another massive state coverup (fraud) and propaganda campaign (like the overflowing mortuaries, graveyards, crematoria etc). Why can’t people seem to seem to acknowledge the blatant lies the media tells them even with their own eyes –

Coventry – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQmjKYWiGco&t=373s
Milton Keynes – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szY0-dBQyik
Oxford – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_cForarMyY

181636 ▶▶ Biker, replying to Darryl, 4, #808 of 2192 🔗

No one is getting tested apart from those wanting to travel abroad, it’s all a giant lie

181691 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Biker, 1, #809 of 2192 🔗

Unfortunately, the UK government have endless funds (via the Bank of England) to continue the lie as long as they please. British public are so brainwashed they can’t see the obvious.

181637 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Darryl, 3, #810 of 2192 🔗

the ones at bet265 stadium Stoke and Ryecrodt car park Newcastle-under-Lyme both empty every time I drive past.

181685 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #811 of 2192 🔗

Interesting the security staff are so aggressive when people can obviously view sites just driving past. Also why do these sites seem to require a dozen security guards? and accuse people of photographing them of being a terrorist? can’t see anyone carrying out a terrorist attack they would find it hard to find anyone there!

181645 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Darryl, 2, #812 of 2192 🔗

If they’re empty, where are all the “infections” being found?

181656 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #813 of 2192 🔗

Universities and probably nosocomials.

181661 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to DRW, 2, #814 of 2192 🔗

Maybe some from council officers and the army knocking on doors. My sister and her husband were tested that way (both negative).

181681 ▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to DRW, #815 of 2192 🔗

Can people still request and return tests via post?

181812 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Darryl, 1, #816 of 2192 🔗

The one I drove past in Carmerthern a few weeks ago was totally empty apart from one or two cars. Those videos a sea of security facemasks. No filming, them saying yer its busy enough…what a nightmare.

181632 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 2, #817 of 2192 🔗

Dangerous elites planning ‘the Great Reset’
Davos 2021 will launch its own Green New Deal. Be afraid.

https://www.spectator.com.au/2020/10/dangerous-elites-planning-the-great-reset/

Note: I was able to read the whole article without having a subscription

181952 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Victoria, 3, #819 of 2192 🔗

From Sky News Australia:

“Published on 10 Oct 2020
Sky News host Rowan Dean says the next World Economic Forum in Davos has morphed from a “jet-setter climate gabfest” into a sinister “anti-democratic enterprise designed to destroy your job, steal your prosperity and rob your kids of a future”.

“It’s a hardcore leftist eco-horror show replete with quasi fascism,” he said.

Mr Dean highlighted what he described as a “disturbing trend among many of the world’s left-wing elites to increasingly conflate COVID-19 with climate change.

“Many are going so far as to suggest that all the measures applied to the coronavirus, the lockdowns, the destruction of businesses, the suppression of dissent, curfews, strong-arm police tactics, should become the ‘new normal’ for dealing with climate change.

Mr Dean said the next World Economic Forum is planning “to convince governments with the help of big businesses and big tech to bring about something deeply sinister called ‘The Great Reset’.”

“It is a program designed to strip us all of our fundamental democratic rights in favour of a new form of society as dictated by the elites”.

Mr Dean said the advertising for ‘The Great Reset’ was “just about as cliched and vomit-inducing as the most inane corporate ad can be”.

“This promo is saying that all the very worst things in the world, from the coronavirus to bushfires to riots to pollution to poverty are somehow linked.

“Then it is claiming they can magically disappear. Literally at the push of a button and just like that, everything in the world is made right and pure again.

“The Great Reset. What could be simpler?

Mr Dean said ultimately “lunatics including Prince Charles and the United Nations and the IMF want to replicate the global response to COVID and repurpose it for climate change, to enforce zero net emissions”.”

181638 nocheesegromit, 18, #820 of 2192 🔗

A nice meme for you all.

181639 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 1, #821 of 2192 🔗

Chaos posted this earlier but it’s essential info, so I’m bumping it. Pass it on:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeykREAlYSg&feature=youtu.be

181682 ▶▶ John P, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #822 of 2192 🔗

Is that one of the global conspiracy memes? Strange that this never gets banned.

The green con was in the Tory manifesto. Had you read it then you might not be hearing about these wretched electric windmills.

I’m not going to watch this cheezilla. I am tired of this.

If Bill Gates, George Soros, Richard Branson and – pick your demon – whoever else outside of government you want to point fingers at over this, stage a press conference and announce that they have taken over the world then I might start to believe it.

Until then, it is just a great way for governments to dodge the blame and get off the hook.

Imagine if, in two year time, Johnson and Hancock are on trial. Would you be happy if they said. “It was nothing to do with us m’lud! Bill Gates made us do it.”

181699 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to John P, #823 of 2192 🔗

Well said John P, these bonkers conspiracies make it so easy for the Zealots to characterise lockdown sceptics as a bunch of irrational conspiracy theorists. If I wanted someone to run a bath for me I wouldn’t trust Handcock or Harding to do it, they are both idiots.

181724 ▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Will, 1, #824 of 2192 🔗

Huge foreign loans are given to sovereign nations by the World Bank, IMF and the likes. But the conditions that come attached to these loans are seldom told by governments to their citizens.
A recent case in Belarus has exposed the conditions laid by these agencies for loans being provided for COVID-19. The President of Belarus has exposed that the World Bank coronavirus aid comes with conditions for imposing extreme lockdown measures, to model their coronavirus response on that of Italy and even changes in the economic policies which he refused as being “unacceptable”

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/world-bankimf-exposed-covid-aid-conditional-imposing-extreme-lockdowns-curfews

181949 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Will, #825 of 2192 🔗

Sky News Australia:

“Published on 10 Oct 2020

Sky News host Rowan Dean says the next World Economic Forum in Davos has morphed from a “jet-setter climate gabfest” into a sinister “anti-democratic enterprise designed to destroy your job, steal your prosperity and rob your kids of a future”.

“It’s a hardcore leftist eco-horror show replete with quasi fascism,” he said.

Mr Dean highlighted what he described as a “disturbing trend among many of the world’s left-wing elites to increasingly conflate COVID-19 with climate change.

“Many are going so far as to suggest that all the measures applied to the coronavirus, the lockdowns, the destruction of businesses, the suppression of dissent, curfews, strong-arm police tactics, should become the ‘new normal’ for dealing with climate change.

Mr Dean said the next World Economic Forum is planning “to convince governments with the help of big businesses and big tech to bring about something deeply sinister called ‘The Great Reset’.”

“It is a program designed to strip us all of our fundamental democratic rights in favour of a new form of society as dictated by the elites”.

Mr Dean said the advertising for ‘The Great Reset’ was “just about as cliched and vomit-inducing as the most inane corporate ad can be”.

“This promo is saying that all the very worst things in the world, from the coronavirus to bushfires to riots to pollution to poverty are somehow linked.

“Then it is claiming they can magically disappear. Literally at the push of a button and just like that, everything in the world is made right and pure again.

“The Great Reset. What could be simpler?

Mr Dean said ultimately “lunatics including Prince Charles and the United Nations and the IMF want to replicate the global response to COVID and repurpose it for climate change, to enforce zero net emissions”.”

181945 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to John P, #826 of 2192 🔗

It’s Sky News Australia. They tend not to go for the un-evidenced conspiracy theories.

181640 John Galt, 16, #827 of 2192 🔗

If this was a film it would be the funniest comedy in human history. Every time I read someone seriously debating the “rise in infections” and the “r number” and to “stay safe” for a mild flu I start laughing until I realise that this is actually reality.

181651 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 17, #828 of 2192 🔗

So my client has now got a flight to Australia to see her dying father but they will not grant any exemption on the quarantine so she has to stay in a state facility for 2 weeks before being permitted to see him.

Shame she is not Lord Sugar, Danni Minogue or Nicole Kidman, all allowed to quarantine in private properties:

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/health-safety/lord-alan-sugar-wife-in-independent-quarantine-after-flight-to-sydney/news-story/2a5c8685156495ba4e56298505345fa2

Absolutely disgusting and I just pray her father holds on long enough that she can spend some time with him.

181659 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Sarigan, 10, #829 of 2192 🔗

I bet all these “celebrities” are exempt from mask wearing on flights as well.

181712 ▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Richard O, 2, #830 of 2192 🔗

The few flights there are, are so empty that they can be social distanced at all times! They’ll feel like they normally do in first class.

181662 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Sarigan, 4, #831 of 2192 🔗

Sky News Australia on Youtube is the place to go for news of the terrible situation that’s been forced upon those poor people.
You’re right – if you’ve got money, the Australian world is your oyster, and there are plenty of spa hotels to choose from for your quarantine.

181696 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to Sarigan, 1, #832 of 2192 🔗

Calls for Andrews to go..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wd_d1TxVP4E

Hope your client gets to see her father before he passes

183219 ▶▶ GoogleAtItAgain, replying to Sarigan, #833 of 2192 🔗

Couldn’t the father be got out of Aus for his final days instead? Sneak him out via a boat in the torres straight?

181652 Banjones, replying to Banjones, 13, #834 of 2192 🔗

Can’t we all stop playing ‘their’ game and referring to these (dodgy) positive test results from healthy people as ”CASES” ?
This is what gets the Terminally Terrified panicky, thinking (as they probably do) of all those poor souls flooding into hospitals, dying in the corridors, and so on.
The word ”infections” might serve – though it’s still going to terrify the gullible.

181663 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Banjones, 5, #835 of 2192 🔗

I don’t think anyone here is playing that game are they? It’s clear that the traditional epidemiological terminology got rewritten at the start of this. A case is someone who presents with symptoms and we here all must know that.

181708 ▶▶ John P, replying to Banjones, #836 of 2192 🔗

I’ve been doing that for about a month.

It takes time for it to get through to people. Even here!

181709 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Banjones, 6, #837 of 2192 🔗

No. ‘Infections’ won’t serve. That also implies illness through an active virus. The point is that we do not know what a PCR ‘positive’ is. It can be anything form a stray bit of RNA to a full-blown illness – and everything in between.

What we do know is that genuine illness is a small minority of what is termed ‘cases’.

I don’t think at this juncture that I can come up with a single word suggestion. Therein lies the problem.

181722 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Banjones, 1, #838 of 2192 🔗

Just call them positive PCR tests in a PCRtestdemic.

181727 ▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to Banjones, #839 of 2192 🔗

Sandalwood posted a link to a great article this morning about the relationship (or otherwise) between PCR test results and SARS-CoV-2.

181660 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 14, #840 of 2192 🔗

Toby might be retiring “bedwetter” but I am not. They call us far worse and I don’t see any suggestions from their side that they should stop calling us murderers, granny killers, covidiots etc.

As for replacing it with chin wobbler / chicken little / pantywaist, how does replacing one childish insult with another change the tone of the debate anyway? I assumed the retirement of “bedwetter” was to avoid offending the incontinent community. Don’t our jowly, dwarf chicken and elasticated knicker communities deserve our protection too with equally non-exclusionary language.

If Toby isn’t careful he will have to report himself for “Woke Gobbledegook”

From AngloWelshDragon

181670 ▶▶ Saved To Death, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #841 of 2192 🔗

That woke gobbledegook section is in another dimension – it takes a lifetime of dedicated practice shunning knowledge, perspective and reason to get there.

181684 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Saved To Death, 4, #842 of 2192 🔗

I am a professional writer working in industry. You’d be amazed at how easy it is to write this kind of bollox when you get into the groove. Most of it is meaningless word salad but corporations increasingly like to display their wokeness.

181715 ▶▶ John P, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #843 of 2192 🔗

lol, I remain a big fan of Toby’s, but well said!

I’m fairly sure that “bedwetter” is one of James Delingpole’s jokes, anyway.

His brother Dick Delingpole is a graphic designer and has designed a “yellow mattress award” to present to offenders on twitter.

I suppose they figure it’s better than trying to engage the fear ridden loons in debate.

181733 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to John P, #844 of 2192 🔗

Yes I know. I love James and Dick! I think James was the first to coin the bedwetter epithet. I think they do engage with the opposition a lot through Parler and Twitter but I maintain the bedwetter label is apt for a section of the population who are literally living in abject fear.

181941 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #845 of 2192 🔗

The term “bedwetter” does not refer to those who suffer from incontinence, which can be caused by a number of things, so anyone who suffers from this should take no offense from the word.

It refers to those who are so terrified that they wet themselves, and it is an entirely apt term. As you say, they’re more than happy to insult us. We can rise above it and refuse to engage, but I prefer to fight back.

183218 ▶▶ GoogleAtItAgain, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #846 of 2192 🔗

I don’t think he’s retiring “bedwetter” becaue of those who might have conditions which cause such symptoms, despite what emails to him might have given as suggestions for why to retire it. I think he’s retiring it because he wants to start converting the coronapanickers to our side, getting them to be sceptics too is preferable to having some short lasting laughs from insulating them.

181664 Nic, replying to Nic, 34, #847 of 2192 🔗

My advice to anyone who ends up in a tier 2 or 3 lockdown area ignore the restrictions I am and will continue to do so.

181666 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Nic, 10, #848 of 2192 🔗

Me neither. I played the game for the three weeks to flatten the curve’ like we all did but I am not playing anymore.

181790 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 5, #849 of 2192 🔗

That’s it. They can shove their restrictions; if they don’t like it, they shouldn’t have lied to us in the first place.

181917 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Nick Rose, 4, #850 of 2192 🔗

Exactly. The only way out of this – wholesale civil disobedience.

181672 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Nic, 5, #851 of 2192 🔗

That’ll be everyone soon.

181689 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Nic, 6, #852 of 2192 🔗

There was near 100% compliance in March/April. If there is anything like that level of compliance this time around, we are finished.

182080 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, #853 of 2192 🔗

Must have been just me, and one or two others then. 🙂

181768 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to Nic, 2, #854 of 2192 🔗

I’m adamant the north west has taken it upon themselves to try and achieve herd immunity.

182047 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to Nic, 2, #855 of 2192 🔗

I am waiting to hear details of the new laws and guidelines so that I can set about breaking every single one. EVERY SINGLE ONE.

181674 steve_w, 13, #856 of 2192 🔗

so, after 8 months and all we know, we have decided to follow the Peru example (highest death rates in world) rather than Sweden example (pandemic done and dusted mortality not outside normal interannual variability)

181680 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 9, #857 of 2192 🔗

Apologies for the lack of punctuation but they only give 100 characters.

Sent to Tesco about my visit Saturday but wills end it to the other supermarkets just for fun I think:

“Saw staff struggling with masks, in distress. Spoke to them and found many HSE breaches by the company:

Tesco not shown them risks assessment on mask wearing

Tesco not made staff aware of hazards and illnesses physical and mental of prolonged mask wearing up to and including death

Tesco not briefed staff on initial signs of medical difficulties when mask wearing nor 1st aid

Tesco did not brief staff exemptions apply to them as well as customers

Tesco did not explain that masks only required when “in close contact” with customers, not all the time

Tesco did not explain there is no legal definition in the legislation and that “in close contact” has to be defined by their own risk assessment including supporting evidence to back-up their definition

Tesco did not show staff this risk assessment nor evidence

Tesco did not brief staff on correct procedures for mask wearing including do not touch it unless absolutely necessary, if you touch it wash hands if they do

All HSE breaches”

They reckon they will answer within 2 days.

181737 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #858 of 2192 🔗

Dear Mr Git,
Thank you for getting in touch with us, we value your input. Tesco’s is committed to protection our staff and customers from this terrible and unprecedented virus. We are constantly reviewing our policies with regards to COVID safety. We have noted your concerns.

On a more optemistic note, Tesco has reduced it’s carbon footprint by 14.3% over the last 6 months! So it’s not all bad, Every little helps.

Stay Safe!
Dave Davison
(Customer interface team).

181748 ▶▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Two-Six, 6, #859 of 2192 🔗

I knew you were moonlighting Two-Six.

181693 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 8, #860 of 2192 🔗

According to the Clown Show: England hospitals ‘fuller than during March peak’.

What contemptible hogwash is this?

181698 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Tenchy, 8, #861 of 2192 🔗

We desperately need NHS whistleblowers now. Without someone from within the system setting the record straight, the government will get away with murder yet again.

181770 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Tenchy, #862 of 2192 🔗

Any link to the actual numbers? I’ve been looking but not found them.

181694 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 5, #863 of 2192 🔗

BBC said this

  • More people are now in hospital with Covid-19 than before the first batch of lockdown restrictions were introduced in March

which is clearly a lie as the government data clearly shows. Unless by ‘before’ they mean back in 2010 or something

181703 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to steve_w, 4, #864 of 2192 🔗

That is just a complete bare faced lie. Another corporation that should be charged with crimes against humanity. Shameful bunch of scum bags.

181816 ▶▶▶ Mayo, replying to FlynnQuill, #865 of 2192 🔗

It’s not a lie – but it is very misleading. See my reply to Steve_W

181766 ▶▶ leggy, replying to steve_w, #866 of 2192 🔗

Can you point me to the data please?

181808 ▶▶▶ reason, replying to leggy, #867 of 2192 🔗

Go to the Covid Dashboard, click on Healthcare and then Data.

181803 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to steve_w, #868 of 2192 🔗

Is there a source for the figures to debunk this?

https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/statistical-work-areas/covid-19-hospital-activity/

Cannot find earlier data.

181894 ▶▶▶ jojo, replying to Sarigan, #869 of 2192 🔗

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/healthcare
shows numbers from 19th March

181809 ▶▶ Mayo, replying to steve_w, 3, #870 of 2192 🔗

Technically the BBC are correct. However, they are using the numbers out of context. Using ENGLAND hospital numbers for illustration

On March 23rd : 3097 March 25th : 4262 (+37.6%)
On October 9th : 3090 October 11th : 3451 (+11.7%)

So while numbers 2 days ago were similar to lockdown date the rate of increase is much slower now. The comparison, therefore, is misleading.

181829 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Mayo, #871 of 2192 🔗

they should have specified a date. ‘before’ could be anytime back to the birth of the universe

181893 ▶▶▶▶ Mayo, replying to steve_w, 1, #872 of 2192 🔗

We are ahead of the March 23rd figure but, as I made clear in the earlier reply, the rate of increase is much slower.

In March it took 3 days to double from ~1500 to 3k patients. In October(& September) it took around 2 weeks.

181697 Alan P, replying to Alan P, 8, #873 of 2192 🔗

So we’ll get the full on terror treatment from Boris et al today, followed by the usual MSM hysterical reporting of the rising cases (aka Positive test including false, non-infectious etc.); then the dissenting articles and voices start to debunk the (lack of) evidence presented.

A few days pass where the sceptical arguments seem to be winning through, followed by another Government (if they are really the ones in charge) pronouncement, followed by the MSM hysteria, then the fight back starts over again.

How can we break the Gordian knot ? Please fellow sceptics, what can we do other than keep (in the words of the real Winston Churchill) “buggering on!).

181700 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Alan P, 5, #874 of 2192 🔗

WHO now saying don’t lockdown because it kills the poor.

181702 ▶▶▶ Alan P, replying to steve_w, 3, #875 of 2192 🔗

But we are doing that, so even a flip flop by the WHO is ignored.

Won’t get fooled again….

181710 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Alan P, 1, #876 of 2192 🔗

They’ll soon weasel out of it as required, saying it wasn’t a universal suggestion, taken out of context or whatever.

181705 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Alan P, 1, #877 of 2192 🔗

This keeps happening and now coronabollocks has only worsened to the point of Lockdown II, yet apparently the tide is turning.

181750 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Alan P, 2, #878 of 2192 🔗

I suspect today is the last throw of the dice re Project Fear.

181791 ▶▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to crimsonpirate, 1, #879 of 2192 🔗

It’s really crumbling everywhere now. Though I’m betting the idiotics will continue, or get worse over the next week or 2

181796 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to crimsonpirate, #880 of 2192 🔗

Why will it be the last throw of the dice when it just keeps working?

181871 ▶▶▶ Stephanos, replying to crimsonpirate, 2, #881 of 2192 🔗

I would like to believe this but I am afraid I cannot. I decided to look through previous editions of Lockdown Sceptics articles, the ones like this that is, and some of the comments attached. A common theme (this was throughout May) was that scepticism was rising. I suppose it has been, but here we are, in a worse position than ever.
Unfortunately I see no end to this nonsense. It is almost as though we are at the beginning of a long haul.
I wrote to my rector about three months ago misquoting Lord Grey of Falloden speaking at the beginning of the first world war. ‘The song is being silenced throughout the churches. We shall not hear it again in our lifetime.’ Two weeks after that the Dean of Sheffield disbanded his choir and wanted to reconstitute it. I do hope I am wrong, but remember that from the Russian revolution in 1917 to the fall of the Berlin Wall was 72 years. Like the exile that was imposed on the Jews after Jerusalem was captured by Nebuchadnezzar.
Sorry to be bleak and pessimistic.
Thanks, Toby for this site, a welcome escape.

181706 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 19, #882 of 2192 🔗

Our correspondent [at the BBC] also asks whether there is scientific evidence behind closing pubs, bars and gyms.

Prof Van-Tam says that the virus thrives on human contact, particularly in closed spaces, crowded spaces and in close contact. He also says there is an emphasis on the duration people are likely to be in those spaces and the level of noise.
“All of those settings… are areas where the virus will thrive and spread if we allow it to,” he says.

So no scientific evidence then, just assumptions.

181714 ▶▶ Alan P, replying to Tenchy, 9, #883 of 2192 🔗

And the largest place where the virus spreads are…. Hospitals and Care environments.

Lets close those down as well shall we?

fupping idiots!

181729 ▶▶▶ petgor, replying to Alan P, 1, #884 of 2192 🔗

Sorry, I thought that the hospitals had effectively closed down to patients.

181716 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Tenchy, #885 of 2192 🔗

All the inconvenient decades and centuries old scientific evidence was binned months ago.

181717 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Tenchy, 2, #886 of 2192 🔗

Expect talking in public places to be banned before long.

181740 ▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Richard O, #887 of 2192 🔗

Yes, by talking you expel more air – often with more force.

Fortunately, technology allows us to communicate with each other ‘safely’.

181720 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tenchy, 4, #888 of 2192 🔗

He was being less than straight. Powis was similarly struggling with the truth – hence he was constantly fiddling with his wedding ring. The ICU doctor did not need to be there – she added nothing of value to the conversation.

181743 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Tenchy, 7, #889 of 2192 🔗

I could consider my place to be a sort of experiment: still know no-one who has had it … I have been surrounded by probably thousands of people since mid-May, handled loads of actual cash and I’m still here. And, according to the statistics, the hospitality industry accounts for between 2-3% of the transmissions. So yes, close us down, yeah, that makes loads of effing sense.

181878 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Tenchy, 2, #890 of 2192 🔗

Of course. Lives, livelihoods, businesses, careers etc are being destroyed based on guesswork.

182048 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Tenchy, 1, #891 of 2192 🔗

It’s one of the craziest Faucian rationalisations around:-

“….the virus thrives on human contact, particularly in closed spaces, crowded spaces and in close contact. He also says there is an emphasis on the duration people are likely to be in those spaces and the level of noise.”

Then lockdown people in their own households, where all of the above will apply.

181718 Sarigan, 6, #892 of 2192 🔗

Just stumbled across this from 2017 discussing the Great Reset:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnmauldin/2017/05/31/mauldin-brace-yourself-for-the-great-reset/#6284bce25d38

These are real problems we must face. It will mean forging a new social contract. It will also require changes to taxes and the economy. I believe that within the next 5–10 years, we have to end the debt and government promises.

What I mean by government promises are pensions and healthcare benefits. Governments assumed that taxes would cover their immediate costs. They thought future politicians would figure out the rest. Now the time is nearing when those “future politicians” are elected.

181734 John P, replying to John P, 12, #893 of 2192 🔗

This is appalling government propaganda. Appalling. Well done to Simon Dolan for spotting this:

https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1315570352324587520

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t like Gates, I do not approve of forced vaccination, but do not let Johnson and his cabal dodge their responsibility for this. The state really is out of control.

181747 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to John P, 2, #894 of 2192 🔗

Disgusting

181754 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to John P, 7, #895 of 2192 🔗

Mabel Cow needs to do a spoof poster of this e.g. “Matt’s next job could be in McDonalds”

181764 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #896 of 2192 🔗

Or as a bin man – not that I want to denigrate bin men. They do a good job in my area. Wanckock would like as not spill the contents all over the street, or refuse to pick the bin up if the lid wasn’t down properly.

181969 ▶▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Tenchy, 2, #897 of 2192 🔗

Our bin men have worked throughout lockdown and always have a cheery word for me and the dogs. Much better calibre of people than our pustulently malign politicians.

181822 ▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #898 of 2192 🔗

Hancock might just about cut it as a covid marshall.

181832 ▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #899 of 2192 🔗

I would struggle to edit the image. I can’t look at that prick’s face without wanting to puke.

181866 ▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #900 of 2192 🔗

As a nice inversion of Jakarta’s approach , perhaps the right honourable gentleman should be made to dig the graves of all the people he has condemned to death by his actions.

181958 ▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #901 of 2192 🔗

He is MP for Newmarket, Suffolk, the centre of horse racing.
Plenty of shit there for him to shovel!

181757 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to John P, 3, #902 of 2192 🔗

Obnoxious, disgusting filth!!

181759 ▶▶ Tom Blackburn, replying to John P, 1, #903 of 2192 🔗

Who needs culture?

181760 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to John P, 1, #904 of 2192 🔗

Apparently there are posters using the same wording for the other economic sectors that have been annihilated.

What on earth is “cyber” supposed to mean anyway? IT?

181787 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Richard O, 1, #905 of 2192 🔗

It is almost like they are suggesting they will programme us to be droids. By what means is anyone’s guess.

Pretty much a marketing fail. Which is just what we need! So thanks for scoring an own goal wancock and co!

181792 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #906 of 2192 🔗

We have been steadily merging with our technology over the last few decades, so this is the next logical step. All productive and interactive activity via a computer or device, nothing else.

181805 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to John P, 4, #907 of 2192 🔗

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/oct/12/ballet-dancer-could-reskill-with-job-in-cyber-security-suggests-uk-government-ad
“Minister distances himself from ballet dancer reskilling ad
Culture secretary admits widely mocked poster is ‘crass’ given job losses in arts industry”

Well, that didn’t last very long.

Some on Twitter thought the poster was a parody. It should have been but wasn’t.

181823 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lms23, #908 of 2192 🔗

I didn’t even know we had a culture secretary. 2020 has shown us that we don’t have a culture either, so he is doubly redundant.

181841 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to John P, 4, #909 of 2192 🔗

I honestly thought this had to be a parody. But it appears to be genuine, though this one they have already removed from the website.

Every single member of the cabinet should be sent to work in the sewers for the rest of their miserable lives.

181735 AnotherSceptic, 2, #910 of 2192 🔗

This was being said at the start of this shit in March, but people who said that they had had it in November/December 2019 were shut down & told that they couldn’t have had it then.

But now?….Hmmmm a bit late for discussion now me thinks.

https://uk.yahoo.com/style/heres-how-likely-it-is-you-had-covid-back-in-december-084036584.html

Yes, I am aware that Yahoo is as bad as the BBC for the fear mongering reporting.

181736 jhfreedom, replying to jhfreedom, 11, #911 of 2192 🔗

What does it take to get people onto the streets? In my living memory:

Poll tax
Gulf War 2
Brexit
Climate change

Hell, we even had a school strike over climate change!

Isn’t the virus response a bigger and costlier issue than all the above?

As the Economist this week stated, many policymakers in western European countries at the start of all this wished they could have followed China’s draconian lockdown example. But in the event they needn’t have worried since their own populations outright demanded to be locked down anyway!

The North was always the restive part of the country. I remember in Wolf Hall Cromwell lectured a wayward noble on his sole mission in life: “Your job is to secure the North”.

Won’t the North rise up and save the whole country now?

181741 ▶▶ John P, replying to jhfreedom, 1, #912 of 2192 🔗

I totally agree!

181782 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to jhfreedom, #913 of 2192 🔗

The mask doth silence. And if we go out we might kill someone’s granny. Or be thought of as uncaring.

181817 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to jhfreedom, #914 of 2192 🔗

I fear not.

181738 The Dominie, 1, #915 of 2192 🔗

WOKE GOBBLEDEGOOK

First time I have posted. By all means publish this if you consider it significant enough to merit a mention under Woke Gobbledegook. It’s in the public domain.
For some time I have been aware of the new V&A in Dundee, and I’ve read some good reviews. Looked it up this morning, to find this –

https://www.vam.ac.uk/dundee/articles/decolonising-our-galleries

Haven’t visited it yet, but probably still will.

181745 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 1, #916 of 2192 🔗

Daily Mail: DOMINIC LAWSON: Boris Johnson & Co have made Covid mistakes but when will scientists admit THEIRS?.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8829515/DOMINIC-LAWSON-Boris-Johnson-Covid-mistakes-scientists-admit-THEIRS.html

181781 ▶▶ John P, replying to Tom Blackburn, 2, #917 of 2192 🔗

In my opinion, any scientist worth their salt would be happy to admit to mistakes. People like Edmunds are a disgrace.

I don’t know what his bachelors degree was in. Does anybody know?

According to wikipedia he did a PhD in epidemiology at Imperial College. But I doubt that would be his bachelors degree.

The thing about PhDs is that they are theses, you don’t do exams for them.

Is “epidemiology” actually a biological discipline or is it mostly based on mathematical modelling? I suspect the latter.

The reason I say this, is because people with maths based degrees would not really be much exposed to the scientific method.

The scientific method being, as Richard Feynman is quoted as saying:

“If it (your theory) disagrees with experiment, it’s wrong. In that simple statement is the key to science”.

Mathematical (computer) models are not subject to verifiable experimentation. As a graduate of a pure science I regard it – to some extent – as quack science.

Maybe I do Edmunds and Ferguson a disservice, but it might explain a lot.

182161 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to John P, #918 of 2192 🔗

Your PhD is your first professional qualification as a scientist. You do an exam for it called a viva (viva voce) where you defend it. To get to this point the thesis is internally reviewed a lot and then you nominate an internal and external examiner. They basically ask you questions on the work itself and your processes.

The thesis it also published once corrections are made and available to the public. But in terms of applicability of your doctorate that all depends on the field.

Edit: PhD is your first professional qualification in whatever academic field

181753 RickH, replying to RickH, 9, #919 of 2192 🔗

Just pondering if the True Believers will ever cotton onto the fact that if the incidence of Covid is rising to the extent that society ios still put on hold, then the measures taken by Cabinet and associated brown-nosers have failed utterly and inexcusably.

So why take any more shit from this sad crew? Why not listen to those with a better record?

No – I realise I am imagining a degree of coherent reasoning that simply doesn’t exist.

181920 ▶▶ Will, replying to RickH, #920 of 2192 🔗

The government is starting to make Haig look proportionate and rational.

181755 DJ Dod, 12, #921 of 2192 🔗

The Scotsman today reports that bowel screening is to resume in Scotland after a seven month break.

According to the article: ‘Genevieve Edwards, chief executive at Bowel Cancer UK, said: “Bowel cancer is Scotland’s second biggest cancer killer but it’s treatable and curable, especially when diagnosed early.’

No doubt all those who have waited 7 months for a diagnosis will be thrilled to have done their bit to protect the NHS:

https://www.scotsman.com/health/coronavirus/scotland-resume-bowel-screenings-after-seven-month-suspension-2999963

181756 FlynnQuill, replying to FlynnQuill, 16, #922 of 2192 🔗

Listening to TalkRadio, the Preston council leader (Matthew Brown) is on and he is talking utter shite. He recons that hospitals in Lancashire are being overwhelmed. Mike Graham asks him for the evidence for that and retorts “that’s what I have heard” Christ who votes for these thick as shite windbags? The thing I’m noticing about the saber rattling of the councils being locked down is, they couldn’t give a shite about the constituents. They are moaning because they have no power to introduce the draconian laws themselves. That is the top and bottom of it. Don’t be fooled in to thinking these councillors care. They don’t, all they care about is losing power!

181767 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to FlynnQuill, 8, #923 of 2192 🔗

“That’s what I’ve heard” sums up the justification for every single policy that has been implemented in 2020.

181761 grammarschoolman, 1, #924 of 2192 🔗

I don’t know what the bedwetters should be called, but we sceptics should call ourselves ‘Enemies of the People’ – read the Ibsen play and you’ll see what I mean.

181765 matt, replying to matt, 11, #925 of 2192 🔗

I was thinking this through the other day and since several of these topics have come up in today’s comments, I thought I’d post it after all.

Firstly, there is no evidence that lockdowns have any effect at all on the control of the virus. There couldn’t have been on a March 23rd, because nobody had ever tried it before and there isn’t now. At least 6 studies have now demonstrated that there is no correlation at all between lockdown and mortality. The best there is is mechanistic theory – viruses are transmitted through human contact, therefore limiting human contact reduces the transmission of the virus. This theory boils down to “stands to reason, doesn’t it?”

There is no evidence that “hundreds of thousands” of lives have been saved. Any evidence that there is – for example, a comparison with Sweden – suggests that few lives, if any have been saved. The best you can say is that 99.99% of the population have not died with the virus

The is no evidence (despite Jonathan van Tam’s non-answer to the question today) that any controls on hospitality venues, beyond perhaps those put in place on 4th July, will make any difference. It’s almost impossible to imagine how there could be, since such a tiny percentage of the infections have been traced back to pubs or restaurants. Again, van Tam’s deceitful answer was based on mechanistic theory. “Stands to reason, doesn’t it?”

There is no scientific evidence that masks are of any use whatsoever. Various studies on both sides, but fundamentally, you’re back to mechanistic theory and “it stands to reason, doesn’t it?”

6 months in, with data available, it’s probably time to look at the actual data rather than continue with the assumptions that were made in March when we had none.

181947 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to matt, 2, #926 of 2192 🔗

Re the hundreds of lives saved, people, especially the elderly, should be able to decide either if they live at home or in a care home, how they conduct their lives.
I saw a touching report yesterday of a journalist in Germany who the last 2 weeks has been travelling around Germany spreading the anti lockdown message. He was met by a 96year old lady, pushed by her daughter in her wheelchair, who was in tears as she cannot enjoy life, and she thanked him for his work.
I am sure if you asked the Hundreds of lives who have been saved , a lot of them would put quality of live before quantity.

182186 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to matt, #927 of 2192 🔗

Mechanistic theory also says if you blow on a sheet of paper if moves away from you. Thankfully someone tested that and we ended up with aeroplanes

182280 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to matt, #928 of 2192 🔗

An interesting counter-factual to consider is that if Ferguson is correct – that without lockdown 500,000 lives would have been lost to Covid – that would imply that the UK alone would account for about a 1/3 of the global deaths, despite having only 1% of the global population. This does not seem to be in the slightest bit credible.

181771 Paul, replying to Paul, 11, #929 of 2192 🔗

I’ve just arranged a visit by a Sky TV engineer,this is what I have to agree to or else they won’t come,

You must be able to maintain a safe distance of 2 metres from the engineer at all times

Make sure that the engineer has a clear working space, that all household items are stored away and any areas that the engineer needs access have been cleaned

We’ll call you in advance to discuss the preparation activities in more detail. During the visit, the engineer will use PPE including a disposable face mask, disposable gloves, disposable shoe covers along with an optional face shield and will wipe down surfaces when they leave.

I don’t think we are ever going to reach peak lunacy let alone start to return to something near to normality at this rate.

181775 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Paul, 6, #930 of 2192 🔗

Cancel your subscription.

181776 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Paul, 12, #931 of 2192 🔗

Hopefully the engineer will arrive and agree it’s all a load of bollocks like the half dozen tradesmen I’ve had in this year have stated.

181819 ▶▶▶ Paul, replying to leggy, 3, #932 of 2192 🔗

Hopefully,we’ve had carpet fitters several times and they said it was all crap and were completely normal,they asked me to sign a form,which I did, to confirm they had used PPE even though they hadn’t !.
We had a plumber who turned up masked and I told him he didn’t need to wear it for our sakes and after a while he removed it,when he came back the next day he had changed his mind and wore it all the time,I couldn’t persuade him he didn’t need it.

181900 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to leggy, 2, #933 of 2192 🔗

Ditto -what the company says beforehand and why really happens when the workers arrive is completely different.

Offices just arse covering to say they “obeyed”.

181797 ▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to Paul, 1, #934 of 2192 🔗

At this point he might as well turn up in a full hazmat suit and set up a drench shower and UV tunnel at the entry/egress point to your property.

181936 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Paul, 1, #935 of 2192 🔗

A lot of companies wrote their risk assessments in April and have not updated them or bothered to research findings like, it does not live on surfaces, since then. Actually, neither ahs the government and many companies rely on them for information. I hope the engineer does not give a toss.

181772 Darryl, replying to Darryl, 10, #936 of 2192 🔗

The Met Police have clearly become a highly politicised authoritarian organisation over the past few months. Basically if you don’t like anything the government does for at least the next 6 months you have the option of writing to your MP and getting ignored / or going out on the street and speaking out like this young lady and getting arrested by 30 plus riot police. The media have the nerve to criticise Belarus – we are also a Dictatorship now. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rx4MPJZMe8o

181838 ▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Darryl, 2, #937 of 2192 🔗

Past few months??!

181887 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to captainbeefheart, #938 of 2192 🔗

True the militarisation of the police force has been slowly creeping up for years. They look very military like, all for a young lady speaking in a huge park!

181883 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Darryl, 2, #939 of 2192 🔗

The Met Police are definitely anti-free speech, going after Darren Grimes for what David Starkey said during a video interview.
Even the last and current Home Secretaries have criticised the Met.

181777 Country Mumkin, replying to Country Mumkin, 8, #940 of 2192 🔗

This is beyond words…

How the arts will take this… the most expressive, creative, flexible, dedicated, entrepreneurial of all. I look forward to their response.

181783 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Country Mumkin, 4, #941 of 2192 🔗

With complete silence just as long as the state bungs them enough compensation.

181801 ▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #942 of 2192 🔗

Or perhaps if Fatima doesn’t like computers, she will be offered a job collecting scent samples from flyers posted by lockdown sceptics.

181852 ▶▶▶ chaos, replying to Mabel Cow, 1, #943 of 2192 🔗

I hope Fatima’s Father Abdul doesn’t find out his daughter has been showing off her bare legs.

182026 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mabel Cow, #944 of 2192 🔗

Bloody hell ! Eau de Cologne prior to fly-posting it is !

181802 ▶▶ John P, replying to Country Mumkin, -1, #945 of 2192 🔗

I also just posted it here five minutes ago. Yes, it’s appalling.

181806 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Country Mumkin, 2, #946 of 2192 🔗

Those in the arts will be upset. The brainless sheeple will ignore it. Until the system comes for them. They came for the entertainers, but I was not an entertainer so I did not speak. Hands, face, space.. see no evil, speak no evil, hear no evil.

181827 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Country Mumkin, #947 of 2192 🔗

Didn’t they do this in Cambodia, that Mr Pot’s idea?

181835 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to Country Mumkin, 5, #948 of 2192 🔗

I thought this was a wind up. Absolutely disgusting, what has this country become. I feel it is truly beyond help.

181837 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #949 of 2192 🔗

lol I wonder how many ballet dancers are called Fatima or similar.

181839 ▶▶ Sam Vimes, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #950 of 2192 🔗

The poster writer’s next job might include full sentences (she just doesn’t know it yet).

181857 ▶▶ TJS123, replying to Country Mumkin, 4, #951 of 2192 🔗

Or she could just continue being a ballerina. This appears to be suggesting that the arts are NEVER going to restart. If this is really just a “temporary” situation to “manage” coronavirus why would anyone need to retrain?

181915 ▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to TJS123, #952 of 2192 🔗

Major leakage from the government here. Just shows that they are hugely incompetent and will be pretty impossible for them to pull off whatever industry destroying objectives they harbour.

They have put their business objective on a poster. It’s the marketing objective they need to apply, not the business objective.
Twonks!

182189 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to TJS123, #953 of 2192 🔗

Exactly! It will be interesting to see what other posters in the series are like – I very much doubt this is the only one…

181879 ▶▶ Will, replying to Country Mumkin, #954 of 2192 🔗

And not a single person who works in the arts would ever countenance voting Tory so Cummings couldn’t care less.

181929 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Country Mumkin, #955 of 2192 🔗

That is disgusting.

181937 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Country Mumkin, 4, #956 of 2192 🔗

This is apparently from a 2019 campaign and included other sectors (no less disgusting though). One response made me laugh though:

182184 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Country Mumkin, #957 of 2192 🔗

Need to put copies of this poster up on the notice boards and social media of all dance schools…

182214 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Country Mumkin, 1, #958 of 2192 🔗

It’s another case of Learn To Code.

The miners in the US didn’t take too kindly to it. Nor did the journalists and bloggers who were telling the miners this, then ended up losing their jobs. Twitter even banned the hashtag Learn To Code.

181778 Andrew, replying to Andrew, 1, #959 of 2192 🔗

I think lockdown sceptics should be looking for unconditional surrender. Dropping “bedwetter” may bring more to the cause but if the new converts are not anti mask, curfew or track and trace as well there is a danger that the Govt will try and compromise their way out of their mess.

181799 ▶▶ John P, replying to Andrew, -2, #960 of 2192 🔗

You “surrender” if you want to. I won’t be joining you.

181834 ▶▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to John P, 5, #961 of 2192 🔗

I read Andrew’s comment a couple of times. I initially made the same interpretation as you but on re-reading I think he means that the sceptics should be seeking the unconditional surrender of lockdown protagonists.

181779 chaos, replying to chaos, 11, #962 of 2192 🔗

Most politicians are so thick they have no clue this is a coup. You only have to listen to the likes of Jenrick to know this. Charles and William and Attenborough are so thick they likely believe the reset is about saving the world from the plebs and their carbon emissions. Flights for me and not for thee! Holier than thou. I sense Stanley is on the same page as Gates and other Bilderbergers… population reduction is their ultimate goal.

Discuss…

181810 ▶▶ John P, replying to chaos, -1, #963 of 2192 🔗

I don’t agree with you. Sorry.

181849 ▶▶▶ Hopeful, replying to John P, 3, #964 of 2192 🔗

..and the reasoning behind your disagreement? State your case rather than a mere sorry. I can respect reasoned opposition. Lack of serves no real purpose.

181867 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to chaos, #965 of 2192 🔗

I wouldn’t say they’re all thick. Badly informed, possibly, and politically compromised, definitely.

181950 ▶▶▶ helen, replying to Lms23, #966 of 2192 🔗

lazy and complacent which equates to stupid

181891 ▶▶ helen, replying to chaos, 1, #967 of 2192 🔗

Climate changers believe in tipping points.. I believe in tipping points too as well as in false flags and in Trojan horses
My theory: the climate change dogma has tipped into ideology piggybacked onto by mixture of dumb multimillionaire ideologues and multimillionaire facists … I blame it on Greta (this is what happens when one gets too big for their boots)
And I hope we never find out what their ultimate goal is..

182180 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to chaos, #968 of 2192 🔗

No need to ‘sense’ where Stanley is concerned – just look at the books he has written on population control and the novel he wrote years ago called ‘The Virus’….

182297 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to chaos, #969 of 2192 🔗

Do you think Johnson and Handcock are clever enough to stage the coup, or are they just following someone else’s directions (scientists / Cummins / ?)

181788 Lms23, replying to Lms23, 1, #970 of 2192 🔗

Instead of “bedwetters”, I’d be inclined to call them mask-wearing Stasi…..

181793 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Lms23, #971 of 2192 🔗

Mulled collaborators

181794 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #972 of 2192 🔗

Muzzled – bloody predictive text, real pain.

181863 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Awkward Git, #973 of 2192 🔗

Indeed. 😞

181914 ▶▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #974 of 2192 🔗

Mulled collaborators should be a new winter cocktail. Probably has arsenic, bile and henbane in it.

181907 ▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Awkward Git, #975 of 2192 🔗

I just call them collaborators. All of this ‘Oh I don’t mind’, or ‘I do it to make others feel safe’. They are colluding in killing people by keeping up the scare.

181789 Awkward Git, 1, #976 of 2192 🔗

While mooching came across this:

https://www.cqc.org.uk/contact-us/how-complain/complain-about-service-or-provider

All of you who are experiencing problems and issues with care homes and visiting etc use this to put in a formal complaint to the CQC.

Read this first:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/visiting-care-homes-during-coronavirus/update-on-policies-for-visiting-arrangements-in-care-homes

Get them under these :

“The factors relevant to decisions about particular individuals or groups of residents include the following, in addition to those factors above relating to a care home’s general visiting policy:

  • the benefits to a person’s wellbeing by having a particular visitor or visitors
  • the extent of the harm that will be experienced by the resident from a lack of visitation or whether the individual is at the end of their life
  • in making these decisions, the care provider should actively involve the resident, their relatives or friends, any advocates
181795 Tom Blackburn, #977 of 2192 🔗

Manchester Evening News: Some of the coronavirus rule breaches dealt with by police this weekend.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/100-strong-student-party-pub-19087035

181798 nocheesegromit, 2, #978 of 2192 🔗

My government petition RE: no 2nd lockdown and no extra rules has finally been published. It’s a bit late now considering the announcement today but it’s worth a shot.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/549862

181800 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 7, #979 of 2192 🔗

Just finished listening to a recorded show on our video recorder and of course the tv went back to normal time on BBC 1; I almost went to find a knife to cut my throat as I heard from a reporter “that,of course, some people want a stronger lockdown”
WHAT IN THE NAME OF ALL THINGS HOLY, IS THE MATTER WITH THESE PEOPLE?,?,?,?,?

181804 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Fingerache Philip., 6, #980 of 2192 🔗

It may be infuriating but it is a true statement. There are still millions of people who are loving every minute of this.

181811 ▶▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Richard O, 2, #981 of 2192 🔗

Not so sure the majority, but the majority of those asked in their selective polls

181814 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to Dan Clarke, #982 of 2192 🔗

Quite.

181813 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Richard O, 1, #983 of 2192 🔗

I’ve never met any of them.

181831 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Richard O, #984 of 2192 🔗

Masochists, or simply brain dead?

181854 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Richard O, 2, #985 of 2192 🔗

Only those being paid by the state.

181870 ▶▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Lms23, 1, #986 of 2192 🔗

Which is why the furlough scheme keeps limping on

181815 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Fingerache Philip., #987 of 2192 🔗

Of course we know how balanced Ministry of Truth repeating, sorry reporting, is.

181818 ▶▶ John P, replying to Fingerache Philip., 3, #988 of 2192 🔗

Philip, this is what you get watching the BBC these days. Government propaganda.

181868 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to John P, 1, #989 of 2192 🔗

As far as I know, the others are just the same; ITV,C4 &5 and Sky.
If you know of any that don’t follow the government line apart from Talk radio, please let me know.

181824 Allen, 11, #990 of 2192 🔗

Rising cases- lowering cases it all means nothing. We will be held hostage until people say- “Enough.”

This is all out warfare by your government against YOU- in case you haven’t noticed.

181826 RickH, #991 of 2192 🔗

.

181828 Andy C, replying to Andy C, 11, #992 of 2192 🔗

I know that every day, more and more people are rallying to our cause and slowly but surely, we’re gaining more and more traction, but I can’t help feeling a little low about things at the moment. Even during the Brexit saga I never felt like this. How is it that I and the rest of us here can see that the restrictions simply don’t work, but Boris et al can’t?

181833 ▶▶ calchas, replying to Andy C, 4, #993 of 2192 🔗

Perhaps they have diffeent goals than the stated ones.

One thing is for sure – there is something the public is not being told.

181842 ▶▶ IanE, replying to Andy C, #994 of 2192 🔗

There are none so blind as those who won’t see.

181844 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Andy C, 6, #995 of 2192 🔗

I’m feeling a bit more optimistic. The headlines in the Sunday Telegraph yesterday were highly critical, although have gone back to reporting the Government’s propaganda again today.
Talkradio is very critical and sceptical, and it may be that I’m in a sceptic bubble, but I’m seeing the narrative breaking down.

181934 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Lms23, 1, #996 of 2192 🔗

How is it breaking down? Yes, we can all see through it but the majority are still sucked in.

181942 ▶▶▶ Suzyv, replying to Lms23, #997 of 2192 🔗

I have just done a quick scan of newspaper comments (Mail, Telegrapgh etc) and also my FB groups, Twitter etc. Sceptism is most definitely gaining a lot of momentum. But complaining comments and taking action (even simple non compliance) are not the same thing and there is the problem. As mentioned by someone else below the rebellion may come from other nations as we can’t seem to do it.

181847 ▶▶ KBuchanan, replying to Andy C, 6, #998 of 2192 🔗

As I’ve said before, and say this with a very heavy heart as I am English. The falling of the scales from the eyes of the masses will come. I think though rebellion will come from the Spanish, Germans, Italians or French or anywhere but here. We have zero opposition to Doris Johnson from any quarter.

181848 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Andy C, 2, #999 of 2192 🔗

Because they’re not being presented with the facts (e.g. around testing and ‘cases’), which is why it’s imperative that we do this.

181855 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Andy C, #1000 of 2192 🔗

Fear for some Lies for the rest

181830 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 2, #1001 of 2192 🔗

Is Clown Show part 1 over yet? Were questions allowed? If so, what were the searching questions – and answers?

181909 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Tenchy, #1002 of 2192 🔗

There were 4 questions, and actually they did probe a little. They rolled out the chief medical something for intensive care in Manchester (when they mainly went on about Liverpool) to give some sound bites. Useless.
It was an exercise in fear mongering.
One question was evidence that hospitality spread is significant?
and how much does education play a part ? Answer only talked about schools, not Universities. Nice avoidance!

181836 RickH, 11, #1003 of 2192 🔗

One question any alert journalist (are there any such?) should ask of official functionaries is :

“You say that hospitals are in danger of becoming overwhelmed. Given that illness is at such a low level, and deaths even lower, how do you account for the incompetence that has led to this lack of capacity, which has obviously shrunk since March?

Do you take responsibility?”

181840 Allen, replying to Allen, 5, #1004 of 2192 🔗

Can you please stop calling this a “pandemic”- by doing so you are legitimizing that lie.

181882 ▶▶ calchas, replying to Allen, #1005 of 2192 🔗

My thoughts exactly!

—unless spat out in a contemptuous ironic tone.

182669 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Allen, #1006 of 2192 🔗

Didn’t the WHO downgraded the event berfore lockdown?

181843 Bruno, replying to Bruno, 1, #1007 of 2192 🔗

Jong Van-Tam on TV suggesting via maps that ‘infections ‘ are creeping southwards from northern plague spots. Where infection levels never reduced properly during the summer, (hint of criticism detectable?).
My question – how likely is that? If, as I think, London and its commuter belt ( which stretches out to Bristol) were burnt through in Dec – March, are there so many more susceptible people left for that to happen? What is his evidence on susceptibility, what are the serology studies results ( I realise they aren’t the whole story)?

181864 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Bruno, 6, #1008 of 2192 🔗

Jong Van-Tam – is that dude that was in kickboxer?

181880 ▶▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to stefarm, 3, #1009 of 2192 🔗

No, that’s the lying bastard the government employs to frighten the sheeple.

181932 ▶▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to FlynnQuill, 1, #1010 of 2192 🔗

AHH, sorry I was getting mixed up with Jean Claude Van damme although Jong van-tam is a better actor

182013 ▶▶▶ Sue, replying to stefarm, #1011 of 2192 🔗

ha i was an extra for a day in the kickboxer movie back in the 80s when i was young and carefree backpacker in hong kong!! Got a free meal out of it though! 🙂

181872 ▶▶ John P, replying to Bruno, #1012 of 2192 🔗

But again this is all based on the false premise that “infections” are high in the “north”. I don’t think they are.

The PCR test does not detect live virus.

So even if the test result is “correct” in that it is detecting pieces of the virus, it cannot tell you if the viral matter it has detected is living or if it is just dead pieces of virus from an old infection, which, given that viral matter can persist in the body for several months after infection, is quite likely in many instances.

181931 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to Bruno, 1, #1013 of 2192 🔗

Is it now official policy to substitute ‘case’ with ‘infection’ for additional scare value?

181845 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 7, #1014 of 2192 🔗

Those Media Studies at Uni have a lot to answer for. Making them think they were actually ‘journalists’.

183217 ▶▶ GoogleAtItAgain, replying to Dan Clarke, #1015 of 2192 🔗

True journalists live in fear of the government, because it is hunting them all the time for what they expose. True journalists don’t get comfy seats at press conferences, they have to arrange clandestine metings with sources in windswept places far from prying eyes. And true journalists keep on digging up the truth regardless.

181846 Sarigan, replying to Sarigan, 3, #1016 of 2192 🔗

Ok, the BBC stating that Covid hospital admissions may be correct and higher than pre-lock down (before 19 March) but it is fear-mongering twaddle:

The current graph is in no way following the trajectory in March.

181888 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Sarigan, 4, #1017 of 2192 🔗

Is that a positive test BEFORE admission or once admitted?

And in either case, are these people with covid symptoms?

And in either case, were covid-like symptoms the primary cause of admission?

181911 ▶▶ Mayo, replying to Sarigan, 1, #1018 of 2192 🔗

Correct.

It took 3 days for England’s patient numbers to double from ~1.5k (Mar 20th) to ~3k (Mar 23rd lockdown)

However, it took around 2 weeks for patient numbers to double from ~1.5k (Sept 24th/25th) to 3k (Oct 9th).

The rate of increase is significantly different.

182224 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to Sarigan, #1019 of 2192 🔗

It has to be quoted in context with flu season. It normally goes up now. It doesn’t tend to go up in April, it was going down and then for various reasons we had a registered spike.

181850 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 3, #1020 of 2192 🔗

All Lies, we all know it, the hardest thing is stopping the liars now.

181860 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Dan Clarke, 2, #1021 of 2192 🔗

Never trust a liar and you need to have a good memory to be a good liar.

We will never forget or forgive

181851 nocheesegromit, replying to nocheesegromit, 44, #1022 of 2192 🔗

Great comment found on the DM:
It’s just to flatten the curve. It’s just 6 feet. It’s just a mask. It’s just non-essential businesses. It’s just 3 weeks. It’s just to keep the hospitals from being overwhelmed. It’s just restaurants and pubs. It’s just until the numbers of cases are reduced. It’s just a few months. It’s just a little inflation. It’s just Easter. It’s just until we get a vaccine. It’s just to let others know you’re safe to be around. It’s just a blood test. It’s just a few job losses. It’s just a little microchip. It’s just an app for your phone. It’s just so you can leave your home. It’s just Christmas. It’s just so you can travel. It’s just so you can vote.”

181856 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to nocheesegromit, 14, #1023 of 2192 🔗

It’s just a load of bollocks

181858 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to nocheesegromit, 12, #1024 of 2192 🔗

It’s just the end of Western civilisation.

181884 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Richard O, 1, #1025 of 2192 🔗

Only if you allow it.

181921 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Richard O, 2, #1026 of 2192 🔗

Certainly seems like it.

181859 FlynnQuill, replying to FlynnQuill, 23, #1027 of 2192 🔗

So, Mike Graham on TalkRadio asks the Preston council leader (Matthew Brown) “how many people in Preston have died from covid in the last month Matthew?” Errr, one! Yes, one person and the government are closing it down and the plonker Brown doesn’t see the insanity of it. He is crying over one person because of course one person is one too many. However, he couldn’t give a shite about the people dying of cancer, heart disease, suicide etc. What an abhorrent human being he is.

181865 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to FlynnQuill, 2, #1028 of 2192 🔗

Follow the money

181903 ▶▶ D B, replying to FlynnQuill, 16, #1029 of 2192 🔗

My mum works on the ward that person died on – it is a neurosurgery ward, they were basically dead from what she tells me in all but name, they tested positive on the 12th day of their stay. Go figure.

181916 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to D B, 4, #1030 of 2192 🔗

So the patient merely tested positive as a coincidental finding? They were already effectively brain dead from presumably a brain injury of some kind?

182020 ▶▶ Nic, replying to FlynnQuill, #1031 of 2192 🔗

Heard it the man was clueless god help us if this is the sort of person in local government.

182630 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to FlynnQuill, #1032 of 2192 🔗

Common Purpose?

181861 GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 9, #1033 of 2192 🔗

The BBC news are in full on bedwetter (or whatever they’re called now) mode today with a story about the nightingale hospitals being prepared for an influx. I read some of the comments and was disappointed that not many were sceptical.

On another note, I had a chat with a colleague earlier whose son is a doctor in a hospice. He thinks the whole thing is a gross overreaction and those patients in the hospice were receiving end of life care for other conditions regardless of Covid but guess what was on the death certificates.

181875 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 4, #1034 of 2192 🔗

Hmm, is that why the Glasgow nightingale hospital is being de-commissioned

182171 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 1, #1035 of 2192 🔗

The BBC are ramping up the fear propaganda to help the government in the injunction hearing Simon Dolan has brought, which comes to court on Thursday..

181862 Steeve, replying to Steeve, 8, #1036 of 2192 🔗

In normal times hospitals are nearly always at 100% bed occupancy – especially so in the winter months. In normal times routine operations are cancelled – in normal times A&E can be congested (lots of reasons for that) In normal times patients can be fast tracked home to increase bed occupancy. In normal times medical staff have to complete reams of paper or digital records because if something goes wrong you need to have an account of the care you give. In normal times the NHS is a micromanaging organisation. In normal times those who shout loudest can get seen quicker. In normal times nursing care is variable. In normal times many staff at visiting times avoid eye contact(lots of reasons for that) In normal times some things are changed to exercise control over the system not because of any real clinical value. In normal times the NHS is a political football. In normal times there is a lot of inefficiency.& waste. I could go on! That said some jobs seem rather cushy and relatively stress free! I would add that collectively I am sure we have met lots of great practitioners despite everything!

181904 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Steeve, 5, #1037 of 2192 🔗

Social media is rampant in our area with people positing an official tweet from the hospital explaining that they are reaching capacity or A nd E times are very long.

A quick Google of similar tweets/announcements throws up Jan 2020, Sep 2019 and very alarmist announcement in 2017.

Context is sorely lost on people.

182168 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Steeve, 1, #1038 of 2192 🔗

Some elements of the NHS are extremely inefficient – my mum worked in specialist outpatient clinics (as a nurse) and she said that pretty much every day a quarter of patients just did not turn up. Those appointments are generally hard to get so it is extremely annoying for staff when people just don’t bother to turn up – that is a lot of wasted time.
Doesn’t happen as much here in Sweden, probably because you get charged for missed appointments, plus the charge of sending you a letter with the bill!

181869 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #1039 of 2192 🔗

I learned a lot reading this and watching the videos on PCR tests:

https://www.promega.co.uk/resources/guides/nucleic-acid-analysis/pcr-amplification/

There is a bit as you scroll down called “Cycling Parameters” and it states:

“PCR typically involves 25–35 cycles of amplification. The risk of undesirable PCR products appearing in the reaction increases as the cycle number increases, so we recommend performing only enough cycles to synthesize the desired amount of product.”

It gives a calculation of how to work out how many cycles are needed to get the test right,

I read it as the test needing an different number of cycles per tests depending on the sample, they should not use a set number of cycles regardless.

181896 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Awkward Git, #1040 of 2192 🔗

This was linked yesterday. Worth taking that knowledge and having a read through these assessments of the various PCR tests.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-phe-laboratory-assessments-of-molecular-tests

181924 ▶▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 1, #1041 of 2192 🔗

And as has been pointed out, it is exceedingly doubtful whether labs are actually following the official procedure that requires a confirmatory retest before reporting, if the ‘positive’ is only identified by testing at 40 cycles or above.

181948 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #1042 of 2192 🔗

Got on the manufacturers website for the first one on the list from the link.

Found then instructions for the tests – says run at 45 cycles:

https://www.apacor.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/IFU-MNC-EN-A_careGENET-N-CoV-RT-PCR-kit_2020.02.06.pdf

181940 ▶▶ John P, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #1043 of 2192 🔗

No. The PCR test (for the millionth time) does not detect live virus, it detects viral genetic material.

No matter how many cycles you do it will never tell you if what you have is living (viable) or dead.

I’ll try and explain. Genetic material – all genetic material – basically looks the same. Rather like a zipper on a cardigan or coat. It’s a long string with “teeth” on it, which is the code.

There are two types: DNA (which is akin a cellular bible, it is sacrosanct, it can be copied, but never altered) and RNA, which is less hardy and shorter than DNA.

Coronavirus genetic material is RNA. The PCR test will make a replica, a copy – using a polymerase – of a piece of whatever strand of genetic material you have in a sample. You keep repeating the process (cycles) until you have so much that it can be detected by other means.

The issue is that if (say) you did 24 cycles for all samples then in some samples you would have more material than in others. In that way you can guess – it still isn’t proof – that there is a genuine infection in amplified samples containing over a set amount of genetic material and in samples with less than that it is not a viable infection.

I keep having to say this again and again, even here, the PCR test does not tell you whether what you have in the sample is “living” or “dead”.

The standard way to do that is with a plaque assay. You put the sample on a cell culture (virus food) you then leave it and come back to it later. If the food has been eaten then the sample virus is “alive” if it isn’t then it is “dead” and not capable of giving you an infection.

The PCR test is probably being used in this way because it is cheaper and faster than using a plaque assay, but I don’t know the exact reason, or if it would be possible to subject positive PCR samples to plaque assays.

Really, in my opinion the PCR test should be used only as a means of confirming that already symptomatic persons are likely to have been infected by a particular viral agent. Using it on apparently symptom free people, I think, is very likely to lead to highly misleading results.

181953 ▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to John P, #1044 of 2192 🔗

I take it that could be any infection?

181970 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to John P, #1045 of 2192 🔗

I know all that, you’re preaching to the converted. I never said it picks up live virus etc.

No-one in MSM or Government, central or local, seems to though or are deliberately ignoring it.

I even have a FOI answer from the DHSC that states this openly:

One of my questions and the most important:

-supply the justification that a “positive” test means the person is suffering from the virus as is a danger to the public and must be isolated.

The answer:

SARS-CoV-2 RNA means the RNA is present in that sample at that point in time. It does not mean that the patient has the novel coronavirus (COVID-19). Patients can have SARS-CoV-2 RNA before onset of illness, during the illness and after resolution of symptoms (all variable periods). The result has to be taken into context of symptoms present.

My post is about the number of cycles that is being used to give the Government their required “positive” tests so they can claim more “cases” that aren’t as we all know.

Time and time again the results of running a search all say the same – somewhere between 30-35 cycles is the maximum number to get a reasonably accurate result.

Over this and the results are effectively meaningless as there are too many false positives.

https://principia-scientific.com/coronavirus-cases-plummet-when-pcr-tests-are-adjusted/

So my post is asking why are the government using 45 cycles?

182202 ▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to 2 pence, 3, #1047 of 2192 🔗

So independent specialists say 30-35 maximum for a sort of valid result.

Government and WHO say 45-50.

Deliberate increasing and maximising of positive results (false or otherwise) then to suit the agenda.

181873 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 4, #1048 of 2192 🔗

Was it Mr Pot of Cambodia who put a stop to the Arts, trying to remember who else did that.

181877 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Dan Clarke, 3, #1049 of 2192 🔗

The Taliban banned music.

182068 ▶▶▶ mjr, replying to Richard O, #1050 of 2192 🔗

the taliban destroyed any ancient monuments and artifacts … what the woke museum directors are doing anyway

181962 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Dan Clarke, 3, #1051 of 2192 🔗

Mao’s cultural revolution springs to mind. They banned the “wrong kind” of everything. Look how that all turned out. I still vividly remember my visit to Beijing a few years ago.

181874 mjr, replying to mjr, 13, #1052 of 2192 🔗

the new name to replace bedwetters ..
LEMMINGS.

small scared stupid little creatures that will periodically commit mass suicide by panicking and throwing themselves off a cliff into deep water

(i know the suicide thing is folklore but the bedwetting sheeple dont know that.)

181885 ▶▶ mjr, replying to mjr, 5, #1053 of 2192 🔗

another.. .. and this might not be an original idea…but i havent noticed it being mentioned

181899 ▶▶▶ calchas, replying to mjr, 5, #1054 of 2192 🔗

Those lemmings are ‘following the science’

181886 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to mjr, 2, #1055 of 2192 🔗

Is that the type of mask they sued in the study that used hamsters and guinea pigs to see if they work and DELVE used to convince our muppets in charge masks work?

181895 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to mjr, 3, #1056 of 2192 🔗

Yes, lemmings is a good one.

181876 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 16, #1057 of 2192 🔗

Interesting about David Nabarro from WHO begging governments not to lockdown. I bet they’ve looked at the effects of lockdown and wondered when the trials will start. Getting in their alibi early so to speak.

1 million geriatrics dead of Covid in 8 months. 1.5 million children dead of diarrhea in the same time. A disease of poverty. And lockdowns have thrown the poorest 400 million out of work.

I genuinely don’t know who can look at the data and think lockdowns are a good idea. Stupid? Evil? Just looking at covid and ignoring everything else?

181890 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to steve_w, 3, #1058 of 2192 🔗

Excellent questions. Sounds easy to see the reality but that just reflects how deep the psychological break has been. People genuinely think that just being a good person, in their own view, will be enough to rid us of this. They don’t see the manipulation that is going on.

181938 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 5, #1059 of 2192 🔗

The world food programme has been saying the reaction to covid has put another 50 million or so (I forget exactly) at risk of starving to death by xmas. Do people not care?

Covid is a problem for rich, old white people who due to our health services have dodged everything else.

The lockdown is a problem for poor black kids.

Why is the ‘progressive’ case to lockdown as hard as possible ‘to save granny’ but ignore everything else? I genuinely don’t get it. The only explanation I can see is that ‘the left/progressives’ want to destroy society so they can rebuild it how they want

181946 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to steve_w, 7, #1060 of 2192 🔗

The lockdown is a problem for poor black kids.

it’s not so hot for poor white kids either.

182036 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to John P, #1061 of 2192 🔗

No, it’s not, but then when’s the last time the progressives cared about them? Now we get to see their hypocrisy when it comes to poor black kids in different countries.

182551 ▶▶▶▶▶ ConstantBees, replying to John P, #1062 of 2192 🔗

Or the kids whose school closes and are reduced to sifting through rubbish tips for saleable scrap. I’m a leftie and that one drives me crazy.

182011 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to steve_w, 3, #1063 of 2192 🔗

It’s a rather strange pivot. Twelve months ago, they were putting out memes about old people who voted to leave the EU dying and ruining our childrens future.
Now, we’re ruining our children’s future by preventing old people from dying.
BLM…except those in poor countries baring the worst of the global recession.

I’d call hypocrisy, but I already have several thousand times when it comes to the identitarians.

182046 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Cicatriz, 4, #1064 of 2192 🔗

I can imagine a parallel universe where guardian readers are begging no lockdowns because of the effect on poor black kids abroad, and ‘gammons’ begging for lockdowns to save their grannies and being called racist for their efforts. It just makes no sense

183214 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ GoogleAtItAgain, replying to steve_w, #1065 of 2192 🔗

I wish to create the world where Guardian readers are out in the street protesting lockdown because it damages prospects for the poor in the thrid world, Times readers are out protesting because it damages their companies, Mail readers are out protesting because it damages their local pubs, Telegraph readers are out protesting because it damages pensions, FT readers are protesting because it damages their stocks and shares, socialist worker readers are out protesting because the poverty means they can’t start a communist revolution, and Sun readers are out protesting because it means the girl on page 3 is covered by PPE. I don’t think lockdownism would last long in the face of this kind of “opposition from everyone, even if on different or contradictory issues”.

181892 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to steve_w, 3, #1066 of 2192 🔗

Evil

181923 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to steve_w, 2, #1067 of 2192 🔗

How do they explain Sweden, where lives just go on, much as the UK has done in the past, HIV, Bird Flu, mass flu deaths 2017/18.

181951 ▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Dan Clarke, #1068 of 2192 🔗

Sweden , what’s that, is that a country somewhere. never heard of it myself.

182236 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Dan Clarke, #1069 of 2192 🔗

They trot out that Swedes are more compliant. compare with Norway/Denmark, less population density. Must be so dangerous to live there without masks

183215 ▶▶▶▶ GoogleAtItAgain, replying to arfurmo, #1070 of 2192 🔗

I’ve seen a fool who thinks Sweden got away with not locking down because everyone voluntarily never left home for the entire summer. And then there are the morons who say population density is the difference, the Swedish countrysie is empty, but most Swedes live in cities and large towns, those are very similar to our cities and large towns.

181959 ▶▶ calchas, replying to steve_w, 2, #1071 of 2192 🔗

1 million geriatrics dead of Covid in 8 months. “

Sorry Steve:

“1 million died after testing positive for Covis-19”

O course in many cases they weren’t even tested.

182058 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to calchas, #1072 of 2192 🔗

I get bored of writing of/with/presumed.

In reality I wouldn’t count it where covid is a complicating factor in a death of old age. I reckon covid deaths in the UK are in the low thousands by that measure.

182052 ▶▶ Caramel, replying to steve_w, #1073 of 2192 🔗

To be fair, he’s been trying to this for a couple of months. It’s Tedros the Terrible who is still pushing them.

182595 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Caramel, #1074 of 2192 🔗

Tedros is a Gates sidekick.

181889 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 7, #1075 of 2192 🔗

Sky News Presenter ‘What impact could the 3 tier lockdown have on bars and restaurants’ they are just so utterly embarrassingly ignorant.

181897 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Dan Clarke, 4, #1076 of 2192 🔗

They are thick.

182012 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Dan Clarke, 1, #1077 of 2192 🔗

What impact could a ten-mile-wide asteroid travelling at 40,000 mph have on life on earth?

182017 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to mattghg, 2, #1078 of 2192 🔗

A beneficial one if it didn’t wipe out all the animals as well.

182159 ▶▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to mattghg, #1079 of 2192 🔗

We can only hope :).

181898 Lms23, replying to Lms23, 7, #1080 of 2192 🔗

“At the peak of the coronavirus pandemic in April, Boris Johnson pledged “maximum possible transparency” over the evidence leading Britain into lockdown.

Six months later, with the country facing a second wave of Covid-19, senior MPs and scientists believe that promise may have been broken.

Concerns have been raised over the secrecy surrounding the Joint Biosecurity Centre, an “opaque” new government body handed responsibility in July for guiding the government’s response to coronavirus.

Led by a senior spy, the JBC does not publish details of its deliberations, the sources of its evidence, or its key personnel.

Nevertheless, its advice to ministers is understood to have guided recent decisions on where to enforce controversial local lockdowns affecting millions of people across the country.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/11/transparency-row-body-driving-uks-covid-lockdowns/

181954 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lms23, 4, #1081 of 2192 🔗

UK Column have been probing these new, secretive bodies that have sprung up under the Johnson regime. Parliament and Cabinet have been completely sidelined.

182151 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Richard O, #1082 of 2192 🔗

Are there more secret bodies than just the JBC then?

181988 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Lms23, #1083 of 2192 🔗

“senior MPs and scientists believe that promise may have been broken.”

Imagine my surprise…

182064 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Lms23, #1084 of 2192 🔗

Six months later, with the country facing a second wave of Covid-19″

What ‘second wave’ ? It’s pretty invisible – unless it refers to Brenda waving to adoring crowds.

181902 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 1, #1085 of 2192 🔗

Trouble is, Hancock, Johnson are still believing the Cartel.

181908 ▶▶ chaos, replying to Dan Clarke, #1086 of 2192 🔗

Hancock might. Boris doesn’t.

181986 ▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to chaos, #1087 of 2192 🔗

I was just discussing this at lunch – why do you think Boris doesn’t? I’d be interested in your views on this.

181943 ▶▶ John P, replying to Dan Clarke, -1, #1088 of 2192 🔗

They are “the cartel”.

181944 ▶▶▶ calchas, replying to John P, 1, #1089 of 2192 🔗

They are disposable errand boys.

181964 ▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to calchas, 1, #1090 of 2192 🔗

No they are not. They are 100% responsible for what is happening in the UK.

Would you be happy if, at their trial, they tried to get off by saying, “It’s not our fault, Bill Gates made us do it.”

I wouldn’t.

181973 ▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to John P, #1091 of 2192 🔗

That didn’t work for Keitel and Jodl at Nuremberg.

181977 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to calchas, #1092 of 2192 🔗

You didn’t answer my question. And Keitel and Jodl were not running Nazi Germany. Johnson is running the UK.

181980 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to John P, #1093 of 2192 🔗

Sorry, typo, I should have said:

Johnson is ruining the UK

181985 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to John P, #1094 of 2192 🔗

No, I would not be happy – and they wouldn’t get off.

181992 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to calchas, #1095 of 2192 🔗

With your point of view, how do you explain the censorship of Covid-scepticism by the big tech companies on a GLOBAL level.

181998 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to calchas, 1, #1096 of 2192 🔗

Sorry – this question to John P

182009 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ John P, replying to calchas, #1097 of 2192 🔗

Government backed propaganda.

There is some degree of co-ordination between some countries. NATO countries may be implementing similar “pandemic” responses and they probably discussed how they would handle a “pandemic”, should one occur.

I think they overreacted to this virus, but I don’t think it was deliberately planned as a pretext to implement all of these oppressive measures.

Governments are primarily to blame, not shadowy third parties such as Gates and Soros.

Big pharma, is like a vulture, it doesn’t kill anything itself, it is just taking advantage of the situation.

BTW, Microsoft Bing (Gates’ search engine) is not currently censoring the GB Declaration.

182042 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to John P, #1098 of 2192 🔗

I appreciate your point of view.

I am not a big believer in these shadowy figures either, but I do believe there is inter-governmental coordination.

As indicated, I consider that the particular personnel involved are not so important.

You rightly put the word ‘pandemic’ in quotes.

My speculation, and obviously that is all it can be, it that these lockdowns and so on, are measures intended to deal with a meldown of the financial system.

In such a situation, governments will/would be faced with the necessity of ensuring the flow of essentials such as food, fuel and medicine, as well as of maintaining public order.

The ‘pandemic’ affords them the opportnity to roll out and to test the infrastructure of social control that will be needed. citizens are becoming accustomed to emergency, abnormality and compliance.

182432 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to calchas, #1099 of 2192 🔗

It didn’t happen in the last financial meltdown, so why would anyone take an opportunistic chance to use an unforeseen viral pandemic to practice emergency measures which were neither used nor needed in 2008? Now using Brexit as an excuse to trial a pandemic response would have made a lot more sense – but since the rest of the world aren’t going up that blind alley, can’t see this as anything but post hoc rationalisation.

182190 ▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to John P, #1100 of 2192 🔗

Not an acceptable defence.

Nuremberg Principle IV applies.

181906 chaos, replying to chaos, 6, #1102 of 2192 🔗

Nearly every guest on talkradio is thick as dogshit. Discuss.

181913 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to chaos, 1, #1103 of 2192 🔗

Just put it off, have to agree

181926 ▶▶ Winston Smith, replying to chaos, 2, #1104 of 2192 🔗

Most people are.

181967 ▶▶▶ John P, replying to Winston Smith, #1105 of 2192 🔗

Not in my experience. I think many people go along with it because, for them, it’s too much hassle to oppose it.

182006 ▶▶ muzzle, replying to chaos, #1106 of 2192 🔗

You know how stupid the average person is? Well, half of the people are stupider than that.

182423 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Sir Patrick Vaccine, #1108 of 2192 🔗

Should be read by every MP.

Then the murder and crimes against humanity trials start.

181919 calchas, replying to calchas, 7, #1109 of 2192 🔗

I am slowly coming to the conclusion that all of these measures only make sense if it is policy to reduce direct human in-person social interaction to a minimum on a permanent basis.

This drives the digitalization of absolutely everything.

See the stuff about retraining those involved in the arts.

181939 ▶▶ calchas, replying to calchas, 5, #1110 of 2192 🔗

To be clear, it is mad and it will not succeed.

It will not succeed because those in power are not typical human beings and do not understand the rest of us.

In my opinion this digitalization agenda is being piggy-backed on an attempt to control the impending implosion of the financial system.

They won’t succeed there either.

181960 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to calchas, 3, #1111 of 2192 🔗

We have been happily doing this to ourselves with our increasing reliance on and addiction to technological devices over the last few decades.

182146 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Richard O, #1112 of 2192 🔗

The Michaela school in London has been actively discouraging its pupils from owning a smartphone, with quite a lot of success!

181922 Humanity First, replying to Humanity First, 1, #1113 of 2192 🔗

Negative interest rates on the way apparently…

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/bank-of-england-uk-banks-how-ready-for-negative-rates-2020-10-1029669508

No Benefits for Consumers
Contrary to what one might think, the advantage of negative interest rates will only be available to corporations and big banks. Individuals will not benefit from the negative rates. This is because only the base rate will be negative. Hence borrowers who can borrow at close to the base rate will benefit. On the other hand, individual borrowers are charged a couple of percentage points more than the market. Hence, a base rate of negative 1% would become an effective rate of 1% for the individual borrowers. Hence, for the individual consumers, it would be a double whammy. They would be expected to pay for taking loans from the bank. They would also be expected to keep their savings in the bank.”

https://www.managementstudyguide.com/consequences-of-negative-interest-rates.htm

181956 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Humanity First, #1114 of 2192 🔗

They will if they own stocks and shares. That’s the only way to democratise this extreme loose monetary policy. But most people haven’t a bean to run together for savings…

181971 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Humanity First, #1115 of 2192 🔗

Plus the government gets paid to borrow.

181982 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Humanity First, #1116 of 2192 🔗

This wheeze has been going on since 2008. QE was just a means to allow corporates to get close to 0% interest loans that rather than using for investment into growth just went and bought their own shares back and cashed in on the boom in the stock market.

182008 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Humanity First, 1, #1117 of 2192 🔗

Negative rates are a *tax* on banks. They have to pay to hold reserves the central bank is forcing them to hold.

They recover that tax via lower deposits rates and higher loan rates

182141 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Humanity First, #1118 of 2192 🔗

Time to withdraw any savings???

182213 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Humanity First, #1119 of 2192 🔗

Interesting. They say NIRP has been there in all but name anyway.

181930 leggy, replying to leggy, 4, #1120 of 2192 🔗

A reminder of the actual hospital situation according to the government:

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

I doubt we really had 16,000 people admitted with covid over the weekend, the media would be going nuts!

181955 ▶▶ PoshPanic, replying to leggy, 2, #1121 of 2192 🔗

If the discharged figures were included too, that would give some idea of what’s going on

181978 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to PoshPanic, 2, #1122 of 2192 🔗

I only have September data – average 124 discharged per day. Total 3,710.

181935 VickyA, replying to VickyA, 37, #1123 of 2192 🔗

Hi first post here. Been reading this for a few weeks.
But I had to tell someone about the sheer frustration I have for my Mum. She has been waiting for a painkilling injection for months. Was scheduled for 7am today, so in advance she had an unpleasant COVID test Friday and had been self isolating for a week and fasting too since yesterday afternoon.
Anyway this morning they had not received the test result, so she couldn’t go and has to wait another month to go through it all again.
I always thought the NHS was a sickness service and nothing to do with health, incompetent and failed most with chronic conditions, so why am I surprised? And I worked for them for a short time about 10 years ago and that only confirmed my suspicions.
Love this site, a pool of sanity in an ocean of crap.

181991 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to VickyA, 3, #1124 of 2192 🔗

I’m sorry to hear that. Very upsetting and stressful for you both.

182139 ▶▶ annie, replying to VickyA, 4, #1125 of 2192 🔗

The NHS isn’t a sickness service, it’s a sick service that we are all sick to death of.

182140 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to VickyA, 2, #1126 of 2192 🔗

Welcome!

181961 Edward, replying to Edward, 5, #1127 of 2192 🔗

Yesterday I sent a rude message to the British Medical Association (info.public@bma.org.uk) about their suggestion of wider use of face masks. Some of you may have seen the draft I posted in yesterday’s comments here. It was automatically bounced back from the BMA because of “inappropriate content”. I changed a few letters to asterisks or other symbols and I think it then got through. I used an old email address so that it doesn’t matter in the unlikely event that it’s suspended or cancelled.

181972 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Edward, 8, #1128 of 2192 🔗

“Rude” messages and rambling messages are simply water of a duck’s back. A waste of time.

Spend energy trying to force a significant reply.

182177 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to RickH, #1129 of 2192 🔗

Whatever I say is unlikely to carry weight with the BMA. When writing to my MP I generally keep it more reasonable as my vote may still count for something.

181995 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Edward, 1, #1130 of 2192 🔗

I di as well.

I sent it to all 3 of their contact e-mails:

mediaoffice@bma.org.uk
publicaffairs@bma.org.uk
info.public@bma.org.uk

Send ti to the 2 you didn’t use.

181996 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Edward, 6, #1131 of 2192 🔗

Understandable how strongly you feel about the horrible masks. However always keep calm and be constructive when you write a letter of complaint, otherwise it will just be binned and you make their case stronger.

182156 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Victoria, 1, #1132 of 2192 🔗

Actually my first sentence was very rational, intended as a warm-up for the rest of it. I don’t see anything wrong with displaying one’s genuine anger. I’m posting it again below in response to Caramel.

182065 ▶▶ Caramel, replying to Edward, #1133 of 2192 🔗

I haven’t. Can you please post it again?

182165 ▶▶▶ Edward, replying to Caramel, 1, #1134 of 2192 🔗

This is how it went (uncensored).
“Dear BMA
Sometimes a reasoned argument is the best approach, at other times a more direct statement is appropriate.
You can stuff your stinking mask up your shitty arse, then ram it down your throat till you choke.
Now fuck off.
Yours sincerely
Boris Handcock”

181965 Bruno, replying to Bruno, 2, #1135 of 2192 🔗

Another question for the sharp- eyed here who follow the charts and data – J Van Tam graph of hospitalisations by NHS Trust, showing Liverpool rising sharply, and other northern ones rising tho less steeply. The implication was that these were Covid 19 admissions, although Covid was not mentioned on the graph heading. I thought many of the positive tests didn’t precede admission. Are these genuinely admissions because of CV19 disease? If not, what are these figures reflecting?

181987 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Bruno, 1, #1136 of 2192 🔗

An interesting item from the CEBM on this issue. More essential reading :

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/probable-healthcare-associated-infections-in-england/

182002 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Bruno, 1, #1137 of 2192 🔗

“Are these genuinely admissions because of CV19 disease?”

Doubt it. The daily admissions figure include people who were already in hospital.

From their own admissions speadsheet definitions: “Shows the number of patients admitted in previous 24 hours where patient known to have COVID-19 plus patients diagnosed in hospital with COVID-19 in previous 24 hours”

Edit: Spreadsheet is here: https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/statistical-work-areas/covid-19-hospital-activity/ Look for the daily spreadsheet under this section ‘Publication of daily data on COVID-19 admissions’.

Definitions PDF is here: https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2020/09/Daily-admissions-publication-note-1.pdf

182059 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Ceriain, 3, #1138 of 2192 🔗

“Diagnosed” With what? “Known to have covid-19”. Do they mean tested positive for coronavirus with a PCR test?

182124 ▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Julian, 1, #1139 of 2192 🔗

Do they mean tested positive for coronavirus with a PCR test?

I assume that one, Julian. Disgusting, isn’t it?

Somebody posted on LS a while back (can’t find the link) that it’s a handy way for hospital managers to fiddle the bed numbers, too.

182015 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Bruno, 2, #1140 of 2192 🔗

You can download the monthly data from here. It ends 30th Sept.

It has:

The publication covers

  • the number of patients in hospital with COVID including those in mechanical ventilation
  • the number of patients admitted to hospital with COVID
  • the number of patients diagnosed in hospital with COVID
  • the number of patients discharged from hospital
  • staffing absences

https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/statistical-work-areas/covid-19-hospital-activity/

Once downloaded you can find the discharges tab.

It’s a bit of a mess but as it’s a government excel sheet what do you expect based on recent past performance.

181974 cloud6, #1141 of 2192 🔗

The manic obsessives are at it again, we now have C,C,C, D and V, all scientific you know….

181975 alw, replying to alw, 2, #1142 of 2192 🔗

The unacceptable politicised police forces continue instead of catching real criminals

181976 ▶▶ Miss Owl, replying to alw, 5, #1143 of 2192 🔗

What’s with the greengrocers’ apostrophes?

182000 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Miss Owl, 2, #1144 of 2192 🔗

Yeah, who the hell typed that up? I know appeals to grammar/spelling is a cheap argument, but an official letter that badly written.

182014 ▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Cicatriz, 7, #1145 of 2192 🔗

It was Fatima; she used to be a ballet dancer.

182022 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Ceriain, 4, #1146 of 2192 🔗

That is a truly shocking advert. If I didn’t know better, I’d have thought it was a meme ridiculing Handcock/Johnson.

182040 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to Cicatriz, 7, #1147 of 2192 🔗

Can you imagine this in the history books in 15 years time?

Book title: The silent nazi take-over.
Sub head: When everyone was arguing over the data, and trying to prove what was actually happening in hospitals, they crushed every industry and individual.

182055 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Country Mumkin, 4, #1148 of 2192 🔗

Probably no books by then, just approved internet material.

182077 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to DRW, 4, #1149 of 2192 🔗

I can here them now:

“Covid survives up to three months on the paper of books”

182393 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to calchas, #1150 of 2192 🔗

But only when kept in the dark!

182104 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to DRW, 1, #1151 of 2192 🔗

Just like schools.

182138 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Ceriain, 2, #1152 of 2192 🔗

There are likely a load of similar posters in the pipeline…
Anyone live near a ballet school? Maybe we should put some of these posters up there – might wake a few people up….

Or at least copy this poster onto the social media of all ballet schools in English-speaking countries…

182018 ▶▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Miss Owl, 1, #1153 of 2192 🔗

The algorithm that wrote it was probably designed to make it look human by making mistakes 🙂

182078 ▶▶▶ Tenchy, replying to Miss Owl, #1154 of 2192 🔗

They are only semi-literate.

181981 ▶▶ leggy, replying to alw, 3, #1155 of 2192 🔗

I’d hope most taxi drivers have more sense than that.

182108 ▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to leggy, 1, #1156 of 2192 🔗

Taxi driver’s , leggy; get it right. 😉

181994 ▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to alw, 3, #1157 of 2192 🔗

We can all be taxi drivers now (since we are losing our real jobs and the likes of Uber are taking over the world).

What’s to stop people just reporting gatherings that don’t exist to waste their time (obviously they wouldn’t be stupid enough to use a mobile phone or house phone registered to them)?

As this is illegal and I would never suggest anyone does it, I think they obviously need to:

a) Ban public telephone boxes + pay phones (they spread covid after all)
b) Stop people buying pre-paid sims and things you do not need to register (the government MUST be allowed to track ALL MOVEMENTS at ALL TIMES!)

I’ll write to my MP asking her to do the things above, she might enthusiastically reply then instead of just ignoring me for the last 14 years.

182024 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to captainbeefheart, 1, #1158 of 2192 🔗

Until self-driving uber cars.

However, if no one can work at the office, go to the pub/restaurant, visit family or go to the airport, what use will taxis be?

182075 ▶▶ Tenchy, replying to alw, 1, #1159 of 2192 🔗

Scum.

181979 l835, replying to l835, 11, #1160 of 2192 🔗

Presumably the press conference and news coverage this lunchtime is to “soften up” the public before Boris’ big announcement?

When you know the psychology it stops working…

182028 ▶▶ Country Mumkin, replying to l835, 2, #1161 of 2192 🔗

Exactly! We will all be experts in gaslighting soon.

181984 Silke David, 4, #1162 of 2192 🔗

Stephen Powis citing number of “cases” and “hospitalisation” in France and Spain totally pissed me off.
You cannot compare apples and pears!

181989 Steeve, replying to Steeve, 5, #1163 of 2192 🔗

Did anyone ask why there are more deaths in the home?

The numbers of deaths in hospitals and care homes were below the five-year average in Week 39 (416 and 71 fewer deaths respectively), while the number of deaths in private homes remained above the five-year average (749 more deaths).

182385 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Steeve, #1164 of 2192 🔗

It’s frequently asked but is promptly drowned out by frantic screaming about “cases” and “second waves”

182001 Lucan Grey, replying to Lucan Grey, 5, #1165 of 2192 🔗

Bzzzt. Stock/flow error.

It’s the rate of change that matters not the number of people in beds.

The propaganda tricks are no longer funny

182208 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #1166 of 2192 🔗

Indeed. Stats 101

182004 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 6, #1167 of 2192 🔗

How PATHETIC can our police get?
In the Metro newspaper: Police issued fixed £200 fines to 7(SEVEN) students congregating in a car park in Colchester.

182039 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Fingerache Philip., 2, #1168 of 2192 🔗

They’re just getting warmed up.

182053 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to leggy, #1169 of 2192 🔗

Sadly, I agree.

182210 ▶▶ Roadrash, replying to Fingerache Philip., 1, #1170 of 2192 🔗

It’s an easy win for them to show they have ‘solved’ a ‘crime’….in between browsing Twitter for offensive tweets.

182382 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Fingerache Philip., #1171 of 2192 🔗

I hope the students know to refuse and opt to go to court!

182007 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 3, #1172 of 2192 🔗

https://www.rt.com/uk/503246-covid-lockdown-cancer-uk/

Personal stories of treatments suspended and the consequences.

Wake up Shuttlecock!

182031 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to wendyk, 1, #1173 of 2192 🔗

lockdown obviously has health consequences which we know about. covid deaths are of people so old and frail they have missed barely any qalys. you cant do the maths to make lockdowns look better than non-lockdowns in terms of qalys. just cant be done.

all those that died ‘with/of’ covid in March would be dead by now anyway.

182062 ▶▶▶ wendyk, replying to steve_w, 1, #1174 of 2192 🔗

Absolutely. I’m still hoping, naively perhaps, that a day of reckoning will come and that those responsible for this diabolical state of affairs, will be penalised.

One can but hope.

182021 TheBluePill, replying to TheBluePill, 18, #1175 of 2192 🔗

We are missing something important about the Nightingale hospitals. They can NEVER be used for Covid-19 as they are totally unsuitable. This is because there is absolutely no one severely ill in hospital suffering exclusively from Covid.
The only people found in hospital with Covid are either asymptomatic routine day-patients or are already on their last-legs dying of something else. A specialist hospital that is only equipped with oxygen masks and ventilators, can never accommodate people dying of a variety of serious illness, or accommodate people who are asymptomatic and require routine surgery. Asymptomatics can just go home.
The Nightingales serve no purpose and are just another prop to show how scary the virus is.

182041 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to TheBluePill, 9, #1176 of 2192 🔗

https://www.desmondswaynemp.com/ds-blog/question-92665-a-shortage-of-loos/

Now, one of the reasons why the Nightingales were so underused is that they could only accommodate ‘intubated patients’ i.e. patients who are sufficiently unwell to have to have had a tube inserted down their airway and sedated. They would also, as a consequence, be catheterised.The hospitals couldn’t take patients that were not entirely bed-bound because they didn’t have enough lavatories.

182082 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Ceriain, 3, #1177 of 2192 🔗

And intubation is probably the worst intervention as it causes inflammation of the trachea.

182164 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Ceriain, 1, #1178 of 2192 🔗

Patients that are intubated are ITU patients which means there needs to be one nurse for each patient as a minimum.

182066 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to TheBluePill, 1, #1179 of 2192 🔗

So they commandeered private hospitals and built nightingales but the NHS is still stretched?

182087 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to TheBluePill, 2, #1180 of 2192 🔗

It was a giant PR exercise to reinforce the 3 weeks/flatten the curve/save the NHS diarrhea back in March. If the government didn’t do something, people would be asking why are they doing this with the government providing no contingency. I doubt there was ever any intention of them being seriously used.

182153 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to TheBluePill, 1, #1181 of 2192 🔗

They should be used for convalescence of those not sufficiently ill to remain in hospital, but not well enough to go home yet, to rest and recuperate.

182373 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lms23, #1182 of 2192 🔗

Not suitable – not enough toilets!

182178 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to TheBluePill, #1183 of 2192 🔗

great post

182356 ▶▶ Kevin 2, replying to TheBluePill, 1, #1184 of 2192 🔗

Hancock said several months ago that the Nightingales were designed to ‘deal with those who are ventilated and sedated’ and thus could not be used for other clinical purposes.

And that would explain why the London Nightingale has a morgue and incineration facilities, but no toilets.

I don’t think they were designed for patients who might recover….

182023 wendyk, 3, #1185 of 2192 🔗

https://www.effiedeans.com/2020/10/the-more-fronts-she-is-having-to.html

Nicola’s halo is starting to look tarnished. Resentment is growing.

182025 Smelly Melly, replying to Smelly Melly, 3, #1186 of 2192 🔗

Slightly off topic, but today my wife and I had our flu jabs (been having them for years so nothing new). We booked the appointments using the new NHS booking system and got different appointment time to each other, but not a problem.

The system sent us confirmation of our appointments and various reminders , like an hour before the allotted time and one at the allotted time (for some reason). However, the system didn’t inform the place where we went for the jabs of our appointments, so when my wife turned the nurse had to manually input the information and for me later on. Another failure of the NHS system I think.

182043 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Smelly Melly, 2, #1187 of 2192 🔗

Could that be a double count?? 1 app and 1 manual entry?

182204 ▶▶ davews, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #1188 of 2192 🔗

Having heard absolutely zilch from our surgery I just rang. Seems they have sent texts to those with mobiles but she has now put me on a waiting list and will phone me (landline) sometime – ‘next 2-3 weeks’. Not holding my breath.

182369 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Smelly Melly, #1189 of 2192 🔗

The words NHS and system do not work successfully together!

182030 Mabel Cow, replying to Mabel Cow, 16, #1190 of 2192 🔗

I’m a convert to the lemming insult.

182144 ▶▶ PatrickF, replying to Mabel Cow, #1191 of 2192 🔗

Lemming, or Sheeple, or Lemsheep?

182034 Caramel, 2, #1192 of 2192 🔗

This group from South Africa are worth following. https://www.pandata.org.za/

Recommend this excellent interview with them. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qXfyKcvj1c Petition to call covid ‘asymptomatic SARS’.

182035 ambwozere, replying to ambwozere, 1, #1193 of 2192 🔗

Hi fellow sceptics, would some of you be kind enough to sign this petition? It’s very specific to the world of dance and may make no difference given the agenda the government is following however would be good to get some more signatures on it. Thank you

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/551435

182050 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to ambwozere, 1, #1194 of 2192 🔗

Are you sure you want these places to reopen? Have you seen the video of the Covid-safe ballroom dancing with all the partners dancing back-to-back?

182099 ▶▶▶ ambwozere, replying to Richard O, 1, #1195 of 2192 🔗

Yes I said lots of rude words and thought what are these idiots like when I saw it.

182158 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to Richard O, #1196 of 2192 🔗

I saw a photo of that.

Good grief. WTF is wrong with these people?????

182109 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to ambwozere, 2, #1197 of 2192 🔗

2 signatures.
Our granddaughter should be at university studying Dance and Choreography, deferred to next year (hopefully)

182128 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Fingerache Philip., #1198 of 2192 🔗

Interesting they are accepting applications for that course, given this: https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1315615294388342786

182198 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to ambwozere, #1199 of 2192 🔗

Signed. In Hamburg, Germany, dance lessons are allowed, probably with restrictions, but hey are allowed, in enclosed spaces. Dancing outside is not. There was a protest dance event last weekend in the harbour area.

182049 Moomin, replying to Moomin, 3, #1200 of 2192 🔗

Question perhaps asked already, but I’ve just read that Covid hospital admissions are higher than they were in March? Where are they getting this nonsense from or is it before 23.03 when they started counting? Thanks.

182076 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Moomin, 2, #1201 of 2192 🔗

Not sure but I think this is only in certain parts of the North which I believe got off fairly lightly in the spring compared to other areas like London.

Also of course, now they are testing all hospital admissions whether admitted for covid or something else entirely like a broken leg, whereas in the spring they were only testing people actually being admitted for the treatment of covid symptoms. So of course this has inflated the current numbers.

182120 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #1202 of 2192 🔗

Thank you.

182142 ▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to Moomin, #1203 of 2192 🔗

Added to that, a large proportion are catching it after being admitted to hospital.

182085 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Moomin, 5, #1204 of 2192 🔗

On the 20th of March there were 1,591 people in hospital with Covid; yesterday it was 3,837, but if you look at it another way…

Given 1st March as day 1 of the ‘first wave’, and 10th August as day 1 of the ‘second wave’ (when ‘cases’ started to rise again), we are now on day 60 of the ‘second wave.

Covid-19 Hospital Patients

Day 60, first wave: 13,830
Day 60, second wave: 3,837

Powis is scaremongering!

182136 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Ceriain, #1205 of 2192 🔗

Great info. Thanks!

182105 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Moomin, 3, #1206 of 2192 🔗

The dashboard says admissions of 1271 on 23/3 and 1719 on 24/3. Total number in hospital on 27/3 was 7043. It is a long way from that at the moment. Perhaps he added in France and Spain to the UK numbers, because there seemed to be quite a lot of (superfluous) nonsense in the presentation about those countries!

182054 captainbeefheart, replying to captainbeefheart, 3, #1207 of 2192 🔗

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/ai-cameras-london-social-distancing-rules-a4566446.html

Wow! Quick work!

After just 7 months since the need to be able to do this, those techie boffins have managed to knock together a way of using CCTV to help keep us even safer.

I would have thought this sort of thing would have taken years of research, but they’ve got it all up and running so quickly.

I think they deserve a clap – Tuesday at 17:00 everyone?

182063 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to captainbeefheart, 5, #1208 of 2192 🔗

“Clap for Controllers” would be a perfect new national ritual.

182072 ▶▶▶ TheOriginalBlackPudding, replying to Richard O, 1, #1209 of 2192 🔗

Do you think that if they do get the clap “our” NHS will treat them??

182090 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to TheOriginalBlackPudding, 1, #1210 of 2192 🔗

No, there is only one disease.

182074 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to captainbeefheart, 3, #1211 of 2192 🔗

Hmm. It could be like those speeding cameras attached to smiley/frowny face depending on how faster you’re going.

This time, it could connect to Boris’ traffic light system. If it detects two people 99cm apart, it can turn red and all the pubs must immediately shut.

182131 ▶▶▶ TheOriginalBlackPudding, replying to Cicatriz, 2, #1212 of 2192 🔗

Shhh! You’ll be giving them ideas! 🙂

182071 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 8, #1214 of 2192 🔗

1 rule for Cabinet MPs constituencies, 1 rule for the rest https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1315586415690952704

182094 ▶▶ Carrie, replying to Victoria, 5, #1215 of 2192 🔗

Need to put that on Julia H-B’s Twitter feed. She was great with (against?) Andrew Brigden this morning and this will give her more ‘ammunition’ for future interviews!

182129 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to Carrie, 2, #1216 of 2192 🔗

Yes I agree Julia HB and talk radio are a beacon of light in the darkness

182100 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Victoria, #1217 of 2192 🔗

Not to excuse anyone in government in any way but in some ways this is slightly positive – I think those places on the left were all locked down in the summer when other places like London etc were at much lower rates than than they are now. Being optimistic it could mean that the govt have realised it’s not going to be practical to lock down over winter on the basis of such small case counts – since the England average currently I think is around 70 cases per 100,000.

Or am I being too optimistic?!

182110 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #1218 of 2192 🔗

I think you are, it’s not about a virus anymore, if it ever was.

182201 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to A. Contrarian, 1, #1219 of 2192 🔗

I think the issue for people in the north is fairness. When London was the epicentre we all got locked down, now the epicentre (such as it is) is in the north, the whole country gets locked down.

182273 ▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1220 of 2192 🔗

Epicentre? Of what? – Test positives.

182162 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Victoria, #1221 of 2192 🔗

Needs going billboards

182269 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Victoria, #1222 of 2192 🔗

‘Nuff said.

182073 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, #1223 of 2192 🔗

Interesting comment from Kendrick’s blog:

… the shrinking of the Thymus is key to why us oldies cannot shrug off infections as well as we did when we were younger, as well as why vaccines have little effect if the Thymus isn’t banging out T-cells like it used to.
There is now, however, research into therapeutics to stimulate regeneration of the Thymus e.g. https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2020.01745/full – interesting to note that zinc is involved in natural recovery of the Thymus after ‘insult’ by disease.

182149 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Cheezilla, #1224 of 2192 🔗
182197 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Cheezilla, #1225 of 2192 🔗

I’ve got hyperthyroid so my thymus loves banging out the T cells – unfortunately they like to attack various other things apart from viruses as well!

182233 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #1226 of 2192 🔗
182079 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 7, #1227 of 2192 🔗

nice ONS data

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/monthlymortalityanalysisenglandandwales/july2020

go to Figure 7

2009 was worse than 2020 for mortality! Covid-19 really is the shittest pandemic ever! What happened in 2009?

182084 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to steve_w, 1, #1228 of 2192 🔗

Sadly this can never be used as an argument because “but it would have been so much worse without lockdown!”.

182088 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to A. Contrarian, 4, #1229 of 2192 🔗

of course that argument is comprehensively annihilated by looking at Sweden

182106 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to steve_w, 1, #1230 of 2192 🔗

You’ll just get “But Sweden took it seriously and had a voluntary lockdown!”

182112 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to DRW, 4, #1231 of 2192 🔗

you can’t have a voluntary lockdown! you can wash your hands and distance a bit. lockdown is clearly something done to you by someone else

182122 ▶▶▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to DRW, 1, #1232 of 2192 🔗

Sigh…. we did NOT lock down here!

182127 ▶▶▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to DRW, #1233 of 2192 🔗

Yes, or population density, but they did much worse than Norway and Finland etc etc

182308 ▶▶▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to steve_w, 1, #1234 of 2192 🔗

Or Japan. 1,629 deaths across a population of 126,264,931 .

182111 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #1235 of 2192 🔗

My uptick was recorded as a downtick 🙁

182265 ▶▶ RickH, replying to steve_w, 2, #1236 of 2192 🔗

There’s one important fact missing : the five-year average, if used for comparison, covers a period of remarkably low mortality. Thus if current mortality is low in that context., it’s very low in a wider historical frame.

182083 Steeve, replying to Steeve, 9, #1237 of 2192 🔗

You could end lockdown today but there would still be masks, track and trace, Covid security. social distancing, no singing, no dancing etc

182086 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Steeve, 6, #1238 of 2192 🔗

It wasn’t hailed as the “new normal” for nothing.

182091 ▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Richard O, 3, #1239 of 2192 🔗

YEs – right from the beginning.

182118 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Richard O, 2, #1240 of 2192 🔗

‘New normal’….leading to this: https://twitter.com/simondolan/status/1315615294388342786

The latest 3 word slogan: Rethink, reskill, reboot

How long did it take them to find a ballerina of colour, I wonder?
Thought Rishi Sunak had backtracked from saying musicians should re-train?
Clearly dance is not part of the new normal…

182132 ▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Carrie, 2, #1241 of 2192 🔗

….and so all the joy, the love, the freedom is sucked out of life.

182167 ▶▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to Carrie, #1242 of 2192 🔗

also on this link see Boris should be in cyber. ha ha

182246 ▶▶▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Carrie, #1243 of 2192 🔗

Turn on, tune in and drop out.

182089 ▶▶ calchas, replying to Steeve, 4, #1244 of 2192 🔗

Exactly!

Lockdown is a bargaining chip to be conceded to make us feel we’ve won something.

Social control is the goal – with as little economic damage as possible.

182095 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to calchas, 4, #1245 of 2192 🔗

I think you meant social control with as much economic damage as possible.

182107 ▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to Richard O, #1246 of 2192 🔗

I think that economic damage in the short term undermines social control.

As soon as social control is firmly established, then the inevitable – due to unpayable debts – collapse of the economy can be allowed.

182126 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to calchas, 2, #1247 of 2192 🔗

The two are very closely related. Economic dependency on state handouts has already been and will continue to be used to bribe people into compliance. Further down the track, and when all alternative sources of income have vanished, this will evolve into coercion (e.g. no jab, no pay).

182103 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Steeve, 6, #1248 of 2192 🔗

Just think in ten years time, the sheep won’t remember why or when it all began.

182113 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to DRW, 2, #1249 of 2192 🔗

Yes, try to save as much information as you can as in 10 years young people won’t believe it ever happened or there was an old real normal.

182133 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to stefarm, 2, #1250 of 2192 🔗

At this rate it’ll just be like the post-9/11 airport security measures.

182137 ▶▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to DRW, 2, #1251 of 2192 🔗

Airports were outstanding slave training centres. I often wondered when we eventually see such measures expanded out into wider society.

182206 ▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to stefarm, #1252 of 2192 🔗

Message in a bottle?

182093 wendyk, replying to wendyk, 6, #1253 of 2192 🔗

https://unherd.com/2020/10/the-music-industry-has-been-left-to-die/

More covid related carnage.

How much more evidence do our well paid and financially secure politicians need, before they fess up and let the country start to function normally again?

182101 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to wendyk, 4, #1254 of 2192 🔗

Absent a popular rebellion, none and never.

182123 ▶▶ Jim, replying to wendyk, 7, #1255 of 2192 🔗

Good. People should’ve been piping up about this in MARCH!!!
Instead, they were placated and told what they wanted to hear – that Daddy Government would sort it all out.
The sooner the souffle caves in the sooner we’ve got to sort this mess out before there is no country to come back to.
Fatboy Slim has spoken up recently about all this – but he was bopping along livestreaming from his house in summer. . . couldn’t see anything coming.

182148 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Jim, 12, #1256 of 2192 🔗

I saw a quote on another forum that really sums this up well:

“The problem is that you’re asking government to solve a problem that government created.”

182256 ▶▶ RickH, replying to wendyk, 1, #1257 of 2192 🔗

This article only tackles a part of the music ‘industry’ as an example, and then, in focusing on music, is only tackling part of the wider arts and entertainment business – a massive area of employment and revenue that has been on hold since March.

Then – it’s not only the professional area. There has been a widespread collapse of amateur music-making and performing arts – a major element of social identity for many.

And all for – what??? The political exploitation of a fictional plague that turns out to be a cowering ‘wee beastie’ of no extraordinary significance except in the brainwashed mind.

The devastation by political wilfulness is the only thing that is exceptional.

182096 John Stone, replying to John Stone, 7, #1258 of 2192 🔗

Now that Lockdown Sceptics has got rid of “bedwetting” perhaps it can get rid of the coronavirus emblem. Another brilliant letter in BMJ on-line from retired GP Janet Menage entitled “Where is the virus?”

Re: Covid-19: Where is the virus? Re: A living WHO guideline on drugs for covid-19 Janet Diaz, Arnav Agarwal, John Adabie Appiah, Yaseen Arabi, et al. 370:doi 10.1136/bmj.m3379
Dear Editor
We are told that the virus is everywhere – in the air, in our breath, on fomites, trapped in masks – yet public health authorities seem not to be in possession of any cultivable clinical samples of the offending pathogen.
In March 2020, the World Health Organisation instructed authorities not to look for a virus but to rely instead on a genome test, the RT-PCR, which is not specific for SARS-CoV-2 (1) (2).
A Freedom of Information request to Public Health England about cultivable clinical samples or direct evidence of viral isolation has no information and refers to the proxy RT-PCR test, quoting Eurosurveillance (3).
Eurosurveillance states: “Virus detection by reverse transcription-PCR (RT-PCR) from respiratory samples is widely used to diagnose and monitor SARS-CoV-2 infection and, increasingly, to infer infectivity of an individual. However, RT-PCR does not distinguish between infectious and non-infectious virus. Propagating virus from clinical samples confirms the presence of infectious virus but is not widely available (and) requires biosafety level 3 facilities” (4).
The CDC admits that, “no quantified virus isolates of the 2019-nCoV are currently available”, and used a genetically modified human lung alveolar adenocarcinoma cell culture to, “mimic clinical specimen”(5).
It appears, therefore, that we have public health bodies without clinical samples, a test which is non-specific and does not distinguish between infectivity and non-infectivity, a requirement for biosafety level 3 facilities to even look for a virus, yet we are led to believe that it is up all our noses.
So, where is the virus?
(1) https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/10665-331501
(2) https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m2420/rr-5
(3) https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/679566/response/1625332/attach/ht
(4) https://www.eurosurveillance.org/content/10.2807/1560-7917.ES.2020.25.32
(5) https://www.fda.gov/media/134922/download

182169 ▶▶ calchas, replying to John Stone, 2, #1259 of 2192 🔗

In March 2020, the World Health Organisation instructed authorities not to look for a virus”

Well, well, well.

182219 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to John Stone, 1, #1260 of 2192 🔗

Great find. Has the virus even been isolated? Nothing would surprise me now.

182302 ▶▶▶ Lisa from Toronto, replying to Richard O, #1261 of 2192 🔗

My understanding is that it’s not been isolated or purified. Normally you’d culture a specimen, but in this case they’re using the PCR test. Nothing nefarious going on here (sarcasm).

182098 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 6, #1262 of 2192 🔗

My brother is a fanatic sceptic – refuses to wear a mask anywhere. Wouldn’t come to the restaurant yesterday incase he gets ‘track and traced’ so he cant work. I’m properly annoyed now

182220 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to steve_w, 10, #1263 of 2192 🔗

I won’t go to pubs/restaurants as I hate being surrounded by masked waiters and customers coming in/exiting/going to toilet in masks (no not peeing in masks).Dystopian experience.

182225 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to arfurmo, 7, #1264 of 2192 🔗

Same reason I haven’t been anywhere near a shop since 24th July.

182293 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Richard O, 1, #1265 of 2192 🔗

Same, been into a few cos I had to go into them. This mask thing is totally evil.

182243 ▶▶▶ Victoria, replying to arfurmo, 1, #1266 of 2192 🔗

same with me.

182276 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to steve_w, 2, #1267 of 2192 🔗

Do you think that some collaborators wear masks when they have sex?
No, on second thoughts, don’t answer that.

182320 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Fingerache Philip., 1, #1268 of 2192 🔗

Probably, Saturday I witnessed two love birds kissing each other both wearing a mask.

182102 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #1269 of 2192 🔗

39,566 people completed the poll.
42.4% (17,499) of people DO support a new national lockdown.
55.8% (22,067) of people DO NOT support a new national lockdown.

For goodness sake, vote now!

https://campaign.unredacted.co.uk/poll-6

182117 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Cheezilla, 4, #1270 of 2192 🔗

The default is a Yes vote I see…

182155 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cheezilla, #1271 of 2192 🔗

Thanks. Just voted

182200 ▶▶ Kath Andrews, replying to Cheezilla, #1272 of 2192 🔗

Done.

182205 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to Cheezilla, #1273 of 2192 🔗

Done.

182251 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Cheezilla, #1274 of 2192 🔗

What is truly frightening, Cheezilla, is that : ” Yes, I support a new national lockdown” is the default position.

182115 Sophie123, replying to Sophie123, 16, #1275 of 2192 🔗

I just replied to a poll sent to me by a big investment bank. It had ~2k respondants (presumably all clients of the bank, fund managers, corporates etc).

17% want full opening up of the economy
39% want targeted opening up (economy open, vulnerable protected)
26% want masks, no international travel, high risk parts of economy closed (presume they mean pubs & clubs etc)
10% want “broad” lockdowns (whatever that means)
7% want total lockdowns (complete social isolation!) until a vaccine (and presumably some kind of lobotomy given that they are bonkers/we would all go bonkers)

I trust these results more than any YouGov type nonsense. More than half want life to resume pretty much as normal. WHY are we pandering to the hysterical minority?

182152 ▶▶ captainbeefheart, replying to Sophie123, 11, #1276 of 2192 🔗

It would be interesting to ask the 99.9% (according to some numbers I just made up) of the general public who support lockdown why they do. I’d have the following categories:

1) I ****ing well hated having to get up every morning and commute in to that dirty, polluted city full of homeless scroungers using that crap transport system we have in this country. I don’t really care about the rest of the economy because it isn’t sustainable and the planet is dying. My job is safe, I can just work from home.

2) I am a bitter, nasty, angry person that doesn’t really like other people and I am loving the fact that so many people are suffering at the moment

3) I am terrified beyond belief and have been stuck in my house for the last 7 months watching BBC 24 News. I won’t go out until the government tell me to. If I see anyone, this might cause my relatives to die and theirs too.

I think these would be the main three categories

182240 ▶▶▶ Van Allen, replying to captainbeefheart, 4, #1277 of 2192 🔗

There is no doubt that the vast majority of lockdown zealots are in the selfish “I’m alright” and I don’t care about those suffering camp. One of the most frustrating points about this whole government propaganda programme is they’ve managed to twist it the other way round so you’re deemed selfish if you’re a LS even those most of us are worried more for future generations.

182464 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to captainbeefheart, #1278 of 2192 🔗

I think the largest category is people who are giving what they think is the “right” answer because that’s what they’ve been told.

182116 NappyFace, replying to NappyFace, 14, #1279 of 2192 🔗

You slave drones just haven’t suffered enough yet.

Kneel down with your ugly faces covered, so we can see what more random measures we can place on you with our lucky dice.

We don’t care if the rules make no sense – in fact that’s part of the fun, to confuse you and disorientate you.

Fuck you all – you deserve to suffer. But we’ll enjoy spending your pensions.

Now lock yourselves inside and cower like good little slave drones. You don’t want your neighbours informing on you, do you now?

182163 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to NappyFace, 3, #1280 of 2192 🔗

And roll up your sleeves when we tell you to. Once you have received Ambush and Triumph, your body and mind will belong to us.

182121 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #1281 of 2192 🔗

I have been listening to the one o’clock news on Radio 4. Another graph of doom presentation day it would seem – (although being steam radio I don’t see ’em of course).

Much was said about the steep rise in hospital admissions. Concentrating on the North West if I recall aright. Aye, they have been rising steeply in the North West. Comparisons were made with late March.

Will the rise in admissions emulate what happened last March? – they have not really done so even now. Figures from the 4th to the 9th suggest to me the rate could be slowing

We’ll know in a week’s time if that is the case – and should it be the case it can’t be put down to the restrictions being put in place today for hospital admissions in the next seven days will surely be of those people already infected – going by what happened to Mr Trump.

182134 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #1282 of 2192 🔗

cherrypicking nonsense. its cases until they level off and now its ‘hospitalisations in the north west’ because they are rising.

what about ‘deaths of people called nigel in the southwest in care homes’

182143 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 10, #1283 of 2192 🔗

Analysis: Covid patient rise needs proper context

Nick Triggle

Health Correspondent

The fact there are more Covid patients in English hospitals now than there was when lockdown was announced is alarming.

But the comparison needs a bit of context, too.

There has been a gradual and slow build-up to the 3,500 cases in English hospitals in recent weeks. Around 500 new coronavirus patients a day are being admitted at the moment – with a few hundred being discharged too.

The daily new admissions is on the upward trend – it’s doubling every fortnight at the moment.

But, compare that to the first peak of the virus in the UK, and the picture is somewhat different.

The numbers being admitted were exploding then – doubling every few days and threatening to overwhelm hospitals everywhere. Soon some 3,000 Covid patients were being admitted to hospital each day. That is three times worse than the NHS would normally see for all types of respiratory viruses in the middle of winter.

What we are seeing currently is not like that.

The danger with Covid, of course, is things can get worse rapidly. That has certainly happened in north-west England and could be repeated elsewhere. The coming weeks will be crucial.

Nick Triggle is the only decent journalist at the BBC I can think of

182147 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to steve_w, 4, #1284 of 2192 🔗

Give him his due for, at least, trying to put some honesty in his report.

182166 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to steve_w, 3, #1285 of 2192 🔗

The Mayor of Liverpool was on talk radio this morning saying that the Covid dedicated beds in Liverpool Hospitals were about to be overwhelmed. I rather felt that as Mayor it was his job to push hard for more Covid beds for Liverpool not lock up the city to save the NHS.

It does seem that the NHS are now much better at treating Covid cases and people are getting better and being discharged at at faster rate than a few months ago. So it should not be beyond our resources to treat all in Liverpool who need treatment.

182215 ▶▶▶ Leemc23, replying to Steve Martindale, 4, #1286 of 2192 🔗

If the hospital is overwhelmed then what the fuck have they been preparing for since last Spring. Idiotic left wing pricks.

182227 ▶▶ RickH, replying to steve_w, 1, #1287 of 2192 🔗

Nick Triggle is the only decent journalist at the BBC I can think of”

It’s an incredibly low bar.

… and there is still that utter confusion between Covid illness, other infections, and the large majority of instances being referred to – namely positive test results.

182150 Steeve, 3, #1288 of 2192 🔗

Just had delivery

Positive – No mask

illogical – puts parcel on step – I pick it up

182154 annie, replying to annie, 3, #1289 of 2192 🔗

Fledgling petition against further lockdowns:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/549862

182193 ▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to annie, 9, #1290 of 2192 🔗

Signed.

Damn, we have to win now. The number of petitions I’ve signed, I’m definitely on the enemy-of-the-state list. 🙂

182234 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Mabel Cow, 2, #1291 of 2192 🔗

I’m expecting a knock on the door anytime now.
A very dangerous enemy of the state for daring to think for myself

182292 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Mabel Cow, #1292 of 2192 🔗

Me too!

182232 ▶▶ wendyk, replying to annie, 2, #1293 of 2192 🔗

Signed

182277 ▶▶ DRW, replying to annie, 1, #1294 of 2192 🔗

Why do we even bother with these petitions?

182160 Will, replying to Will, 7, #1295 of 2192 🔗

Two more conversations with strangers, one a chimney sweep, another a fella walking his dog, both sceptics, and well informed at that. Who are all these lockdown enthusiasts?

182173 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Will, 6, #1296 of 2192 🔗

sitting in parliament, local councils, quangos and education.

182175 ▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Will, 5, #1297 of 2192 🔗

Sitting at home filling out opinion polls?

182176 ▶▶ Janice21, replying to Will, 11, #1298 of 2192 🔗

I’m a married mother and charity worker in my mid 30s from Northern Ireland. A lot of sceptics here and growing.

182182 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Janice21, 1, #1299 of 2192 🔗

If you run into Stephen Nolan please give him my regards.

182284 ▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Richard O, 1, #1300 of 2192 🔗

And a diet plan.

182230 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Will, 5, #1301 of 2192 🔗

Got two engineers in, servicing our espresso machine right now. Very grateful that we didn’t require them to wear masks.

182170 Ewan Duffy, 3, #1302 of 2192 🔗

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2020/1012/1170901-drinks-industry-group-of-ireland-research/

An article that looks at the costs being borne by pubs in Ireland that have been closed by dictatorial fiat.

182172 Locked down and out, replying to Locked down and out, 9, #1303 of 2192 🔗

Lies, damn lies and a Van Tam press conference.
Panic, panic, panic. Van Tam has today claimed that NHS hospitals are fuller now than back in March.
This may be 100% true, but only because hospitals were emptied in March and are not full today due to Covid-19-related patients.

182192 ▶▶ James Marker, replying to Locked down and out, 1, #1304 of 2192 🔗

Yes, absolutely. They painted a distorted picture by selective use of data. I would bet anyone a pound to a penny that Van-tam and Powys hate the Conservative Party. It is beyond belief that Boris has completely surrendered to these people.

182199 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to James Marker, #1305 of 2192 🔗

It’s not like it should be difficult for Boris to verify though. He must have the authority to get someone reliable to audit the hospitals.

182375 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Locked down and out, #1306 of 2192 🔗

Depends rather which day in March he’s talking about doesn’t it!

20-Mar-20 – 1,580
21-Mar-20 – 2,152
22-Mar-20 – 2,670
23-Mar-20 – 3,183
24-Mar-20 – 3,598
25-Mar-20 – 4,402
26-Mar-20 – 5,226
27-Mar-20 – 6,462
28-Mar-20 – 7,269
29-Mar-20 – 8,424
30-Mar-20 – 9,852
31-Mar-20 – 11,154

Anyway, the peak was 18,970 on 12th April (these are all England only numbers).

The pic below is as of last Thursday.

183099 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to leggy, #1307 of 2192 🔗

I think he was referring to the 23rd March when lockdown was annnouced.

The numbers in hospital today reflects not just how rampant the virus but the success of keeping patients alive.

Today admissions are going up in England by about 500 a day.

In the last week of March they stepped up close on 8000.

We’ll see if that is replicated in the week ahead – my guess is it will be closer to 4000 – but I’m no expert.

182179 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 11, #1308 of 2192 🔗

Is anyone else here as disgusted as I am to see the NHS spending advertising money with Ebay for its Test and Trap system?

182191 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to godowneasy, 1, #1309 of 2192 🔗

It’s every where Duolingo is another one!

182431 ▶▶ peter charles, replying to godowneasy, #1310 of 2192 🔗

we like your phrase “Test and Trap” as well

182181 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 15, #1311 of 2192 🔗

Just keeps getting better
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8830621/Lung-cancer-referrals-50-symptoms-similar-Covid-19-experts-claim.html

Lung cancer referrals are down 50% because patients believe a persistent cough and chest pains are signs of Covid-19 and self-isolate instead of seeing a specialist, experts warn

182261 ▶▶ Lockdown Truth, replying to Charlie Blue, 1, #1312 of 2192 🔗

FFS these morons have so much to answer for.
It’s like leaving a bunch of seven years olds in charge of the country.

182283 ▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #1313 of 2192 🔗

The difference is that upon explaining the damage they had caused by their actions, the 7 year olds would be more likely to experience guilt.

182307 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Lockdown Truth, 2, #1314 of 2192 🔗

It’s more like a bunch of youngsters like the candidates out of The Apprentice that are running the country under the direction of a totally malevolent cabal and they haven’t got a freekin clue.

182207 DRW, replying to DRW, 11, #1316 of 2192 🔗

Bingo card predictions:
“Level 1/2/3 restrictions”
“R rate”
“Worrying”
“Critical”
“Vital”
“Doubling”
“Tipping Point”
“Two/Six weeks”
“Hospital admissions”
“Until there’s a vaccine”

182217 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to DRW, 3, #1317 of 2192 🔗

Try this rather bizarre one from Belgium:
According to biostatistician Geert Molenberghs, Belgium is nearing a point of no return.
It is not five minutes to midnight, it is a quarter past midnight.

182237 ▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to godowneasy, 1, #1318 of 2192 🔗

What on earth does this mean? The piles of dead bodies lining the streets, half the population of Belgium wiped out? Sounds like complete nonsense!

182244 ▶▶▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Ozzie, 1, #1319 of 2192 🔗

I think it means that Belgium is suffering from coronabollox as much as the UK!

182258 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to godowneasy, 1, #1320 of 2192 🔗

I agree – just trying to put a perspective on what 1/4 past midnight might mean!

182218 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to DRW, 2, #1321 of 2192 🔗

“Spike”
“Uptick”

182223 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to DRW, 4, #1322 of 2192 🔗

“all in this together”
“OUR amazing NHS”
“hands, face, space”
“let it rip”

182454 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to DRW, 1, #1323 of 2192 🔗

“let rip”

182216 Robert Seddon, 3, #1324 of 2192 🔗

A wonderful piece of understatement from this new call for papers: ‘it is increasingly clear that the translation of scientific evidence into policy implementation rules is not a linear path’.

http://www.humanamente.eu/index.php/HM/announcement/view/7

182228 steph, replying to steph, 29, #1325 of 2192 🔗

Blood donation and mask wearing:
I had an appointment to give blood in a few weeks but have cancelled it due to the mandate that donors must wear masks throughout.
I received a phone call just now basically begging me to give blood. I have never received such a call before, having a common blood type, but it is clear to me that they are running short. Normally it’s a bit difficult to get a slot round here as the sessions are always booked up so far in advance.
I told the operator that I am ready and willing as soon as they’d allow me to do it without a mask. I also told her that I find masks suffocating and was not prepared to donate my oxygen carrying fluid whilst having my oxygen intake restricted. She will be registering my complaint which will be as much use as the emails I send to my MP but one has to try.
I’d be interested to know if this is really having an effect on stocks of blood.

182235 ▶▶ Ozzie, replying to steph, 6, #1326 of 2192 🔗

There could be an argument for registering to give blood and then do what you have done. The more that then lodge this complaint, the more the Blood Service has to take notice.

182252 ▶▶ IanE, replying to steph, 7, #1327 of 2192 🔗

Peter Hitchens wrote about this a while ago – and ended up going to Wales to donate, where, at the time at least, masks were actually forbidden because the nurses would not be able to see if someone was having a bad response to giving blood!

182254 ▶▶ Harry hopkins, replying to steph, 1, #1328 of 2192 🔗

Perhaps you might have told them that you had an exemption. In my experience—quite comprehensive now after 7 months of mask refusal—I would be gob smacked if they took the illegal route and tried to over ride this.

182294 ▶▶▶ steph, replying to Harry hopkins, 5, #1329 of 2192 🔗

I use an exemption in most every day circumstances where I need to. In this situation I don’t think I should have to go down that route. It’s too absurd for words to ask you to restrict your breathing in such a scenario.
Also, you have been lucky; I have had a couple of strange responses to my exemption but in the end they never push it but I’m fed up of the awkward situation it puts me in. I won’t wear a mask but I’m not going out of my way to be in situations where it is expected any longer.

182349 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to steph, 5, #1330 of 2192 🔗

My son has donated over 60 times and has an exemption to masks (panic attacks.)
He contacted the blood donor service to explain the situation, to be told: NO EXEMPTIONS, NO MATTER WHAT.

182358 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Fingerache Philip., 4, #1331 of 2192 🔗

Well he stops giving blood to the private company then who then sell it on to the NHS at big profits.

182881 ▶▶ HaylingDave, replying to steph, #1332 of 2192 🔗

Hi ya, interesting I’ve been wondering about this myself, as I cancelled a Blood donor session for mid September, for exactly the same reason.

I cannot wear a mask for a prolonged period of time due to severe distress and panic it causes me.

I contacted the Blood service as way of an explanation for my cancellation, stating my reasons, and also that I donated maskless mid March (height of transmissions) and mid June without issue.

On the contact form, I ticked “No, I do not need a response” but I got one anyway – a fairly well structured email which did not try to either a) make me feel guilty or b) try to persuade me to reconsider. The responder simply implied that the mask mandate was mainly for the comfort of the other donors, and also that if a positive Covid test for a donor or staff was to come to light, the staff would not have to self-isolate, due to the extra precautions being taken.

I took it that they had done some sort of cost/benefit type analysis given the number of donors who wouldn’t donate unless masks were mandated, vs. the number of donors who wouldn’t donated because of the mask mandate.

I didn’t begrudge the fellow who sent the message. It didn’t seem like a template (although it probably was) and he simply stated their position and wished me a good day.

Just today I was wondering about how blood reserves were doing – it’ll be interesting to see if I’m contacted as well. I have nothing against the Blood service (in fact in June when I last donated, and was the only person without a mask, they were lovely!), but I will make my position strongly known if asked.

Cheers
Dave

182231 Julian, 8, #1333 of 2192 🔗

“Samhurt
22 hours ago

Reply to Julian
Are we in the business of propaganda, then? I thought we cared about truth. We don’t need to evangelise if the evidence speaks for itself! I cannot believe what I am witnessing on this website today. It really looks like most people need a box to sit in. They need to be yoked to something, even if it’s just some piddling attempt at linguistic decorum. All to avoid offending the enemy!”

Missed this reply yesterday, another chapter in the bedwetter debate, but feel it’s an important point.

We do care about the truth, but there are effective ways of putting the truth across and other ways that work less well, and while remaining honest we should seek to choose ways that work in persuading people to our cause. I don’t think choosing to drop a pejorative epithet is dishonest. I don’t care about offending people, I care that if offended they stop listening. I am not saying we should never offend anyone – sometimes strong language is needed to reflect depth of feeling – just that we should try to be smart.

182241 Tyneside Tigress, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 8, #1334 of 2192 🔗

Narrative against lockdown building in the US:

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/after-who-flip-flop-former-fda-chief-says-no-reason-another-round-lockdowns-us

Trump is back on the campaign trail today. Now a big chasm between the candidates on the attitude to lockdowns and where to go from here. Gottlieb is a good person for Trump to have on board as he speaks to the wider business community which is starting to panic about the prospect of a Biden win for their capital gains.

182255 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1335 of 2192 🔗

great post

182260 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 1, #1336 of 2192 🔗

Three weeks to go until the vote and a lot is hanging on it. Interesting to see what happens after that.

182312 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 5, #1337 of 2192 🔗

Can’t believe I’m at the point where I’m now praying for another term for Trump!

182242 Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 6, #1338 of 2192 🔗

Krankie’s numbers are out:

961 new cases of COVID-19 reported; this is 17.1% of newly tested individuals

17.1%? Not a chance!

182248 ▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Ceriain, 3, #1339 of 2192 🔗

University of Edinburgh freshers, and all asymptomatic?

182309 ▶▶ nocheesegromit, replying to Ceriain, #1340 of 2192 🔗

‘Cases’ AKA ‘positive tests for dodgy PCR tests’

182245 stefarm, replying to stefarm, 17, #1341 of 2192 🔗

Just sent an email to my golf club. No big deal but people should be made aware and be made accountable. Ignorance isn’t a defence

I feel I must bring to your attention the Scottish Government face covering guidelines, this is in response to the sign on the clubhouse door stating that a face covering is required when using the clubhouse facilities.

https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-phase-3-staying-safe-and-protecting-others/pages/face-coverings/#exemptions

  • people who have a health condition or who are disabled, including hidden disabilities, for example, autism, dementia or a learning disability, or are providing care for someone with a health condition or disability, and a face covering would be inappropriate because it would cause difficulty, pain or severe distress or anxiety to the wearer or the person in the care of the wearer. This includes children with breathing difficulties and disabled children who would struggle to wear a face covering.

Those exempt under the guidance and regulations do not have to prove their exemption and should not be made to wear a face covering or denied access to public transport, shops or public places. We ask for people to be aware of the exemptions and to treat each other with kindness.

A person or establishment conducting a challenge, may find they have committed:

  • an offence for which they are liable on summary conviction to pay a fine of up to £5,000 – section 112 (Aiding contraventions) of the Equality Act 2010; and/or
  • an act of disability discrimination and be ordered to pay to any individual who suffers injury to feelings compensation between £900 and £9,000 – section 119 (Remedies) of the Equality Act 2010

I will be grateful if you would consider amending the sign to state that exemptions apply or notifying members of the guidelines.

182257 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to stefarm, 6, #1342 of 2192 🔗

Forgot to mention the sign fills an A4 sheet in big bold text. Pissed me off, fucking rules getting right on my tit ends.

182262 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to stefarm, 2, #1343 of 2192 🔗

Whatever next? Jackets and ties to be worn , no hats, no jeans and no trainers .

182249 Dan Clarke, 10, #1344 of 2192 🔗

It feels like banging your head against a brick wall, the ‘rules’ are so nonsensical as to be laughable, the proof against it being a ‘deadly’ disease so obvious. Johnson appears to be keeping to the Agenda, wonder why.

182250 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 7, #1345 of 2192 🔗

Illustrates breathing without a mask and with a mask

182290 ▶▶ Caramel, replying to Victoria, #1346 of 2192 🔗

Where is this from?

182259 MDH, replying to MDH, 7, #1347 of 2192 🔗

Charming email from Transport for London ramping up the pressure to wear a faceclaat at all times. I’ve just about got over the anxiety of getting on a train/tube, etc. Shan’t bother again now. I really cannot wait to leave this city for good. Using the Covid excuse, my little square is now all but cut off to road traffic by a Low Traffic Area – imposed without consultation, of course. I just feel isolated and depressed pretty much the whole time now.

182299 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to MDH, 3, #1348 of 2192 🔗

I’ve posted my copy above. I will never give my money to these bastards again. They have been amongst the most fanatical and zealous collaborators with the state.

182447 ▶▶▶ Jakehadlee, replying to Richard O, #1349 of 2192 🔗

Hasn’t it gone past the point of simply not using their services?

182263 EssieSW, replying to EssieSW, 17, #1350 of 2192 🔗

Medium, high and very high risk.

What happened to low risk? Or non bloody existent risk?

182266 ▶▶ CGL, replying to EssieSW, 3, #1351 of 2192 🔗

They don’t exist- those days are gone forever

182329 ▶▶ Mark H, replying to EssieSW, 3, #1352 of 2192 🔗

Even in the low risk category, masks are mandatory as is social distancing and the rule of 6. Seriously. Look it up.

182264 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 11, #1353 of 2192 🔗

Had my haircut this morning and the young girl said “I will have to ask you to wear a mask (she herself, was wearing one), but then had to undo my mask to cut my ( sparse) hair; touching my face.
No,I don’t get it,either.

182268 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Fingerache Philip., 9, #1354 of 2192 🔗

I’ve stopped going. Not only have the put the price up 25% but the experience isn’t worth the hassle.

I’ll stick with the “Covid Cut” from my clippers from now on.

182271 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #1355 of 2192 🔗

I’m going to have to go grey!

182305 ▶▶▶ Ed Phillips, replying to Lucan Grey, 5, #1356 of 2192 🔗

I’ve not had a haircut since this all started. I kept my beard after I came back from holiday in August.
I have now reached the George Best/Andrea Pirlo stage.

182275 ▶▶ Arkansas, replying to Fingerache Philip., 9, #1357 of 2192 🔗

“I will have to ask you to wear a mask.”

This is not the same as you having to wear a mask, of course.

You might have replied, “That’s absolutely fine, I don’t mind you asking [since it seems you are obligated to ask me]” followed by an optional “Me, I’m exempt [from asking and from wearing]”, and that would (or could) have been that.

182282 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to Arkansas, 2, #1358 of 2192 🔗

Yes, I take your point.

182342 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Fingerache Philip., #1359 of 2192 🔗

But you don’t have to as hairdressers are not on the list requiring a afce covering anymore.

“Also, referred to as a ‘must’ within guidance, but not listed as ‘relevant place’ and so where the face covering regulations don’t bite are:

  • premises providing personal care and beauty treatments (hair salons, barbers, nail salons, massage centres, tattoo and piercing parlours)
  • premises providing veterinary services
  • visitor attractions and entertainment venues (aquariums, adventure activity centres, indoor sports stadiums, funfairs, theme parks, skating rinks, bowling alleys, indoor play areas including soft-play areas)
  • storage and distribution facilities”
182267 DRW, replying to DRW, 22, #1360 of 2192 🔗

I can see myself in ten years reminiscing about when I used to take the train to actually go to work and university in person.

Everyone will be asking how scary it must have been back then without ID scans, masks and directional markings. Plus how quaint that we once worked in the real world. They won’t remember a world before all of that.

182445 ▶▶ Jakehadlee, replying to DRW, #1361 of 2192 🔗

I think if that does happen there will be a lot more things for them to be scared about. I can’t see any world in which any of this ends well.

182270 Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 7, #1362 of 2192 🔗

Johnson starts with a couple of lies.

182274 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Ceriain, 6, #1363 of 2192 🔗

No!!! Really??? That’s not like him, surely. 🙂

182278 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 25, #1364 of 2192 🔗

What pisses me off is when he, and Handjob, use the word ‘sacrifices’.
Most people didn’t volunteer to do this; they’ve been forced. That’s NOT a fucking sacrifice, Boris!

182442 ▶▶▶ Jakehadlee, replying to Ceriain, #1365 of 2192 🔗

What he means is they have been sacrificed – to the Corona God

182281 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Ceriain, 7, #1366 of 2192 🔗

He opened by telling the House that the Lockdown he introduced in March had shattered lives and the economy, which may be an understatement but I wouldn’t characterise it as a lie.

182478 ▶▶▶ Poppy, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #1367 of 2192 🔗

‘Lockdown shattered lives and the economy’.

So he’s doing all over again then. Makes sense!

182272 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 10, #1368 of 2192 🔗

Just received this vile propaganda from Transport for London. I have not used their services since early March. Clearly they must be struggling with levels of compliance.

182314 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Richard O, 7, #1369 of 2192 🔗

Poisonous bastards

182279 Caramel, replying to Caramel, 4, #1370 of 2192 🔗

Have you guys seen this sad picture yet?

I insisted we see dad over the wall today. It’s so upsetting. My mum was telling him we love him and all want to see him but can’t and she tried to tell him it’s almost their 52nd wedding anniversary. ‘

https://twitter.com/MirandaBakes/status/1315077371398098945

182318 ▶▶ Olive, replying to Caramel, 6, #1371 of 2192 🔗

Oh my god. I just saw this and burst into tears. How can people stand for this any more. I find it unbelievable. Is there utterly no compassion anywhere? I know what it must feel like to scream in a vacuum now – its soul destroying.

182348 ▶▶ NappyFace, replying to Caramel, 5, #1372 of 2192 🔗

Send it to Matt Hancock and Devi Sridhar. That’s the evil of these lunatics’ policies.

182285 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 20, #1373 of 2192 🔗

Boris is a Communist B’stard, More Funding for enforcement, can’t see family even in your OWN house

182287 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Dan Clarke, 11, #1374 of 2192 🔗

Revolt must happen now surely.

182291 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to CGL, 4, #1375 of 2192 🔗

I’m not counting on it.

182298 ▶▶▶ Moomin, replying to CGL, 9, #1376 of 2192 🔗

I doubt it, no one has revolted since March, that’s one of the things I simply can’t get my head around!

182303 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip., replying to CGL, 10, #1377 of 2192 🔗

Yes, even at almost 72, I’m willing to do what I can.

182427 ▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to CGL, #1378 of 2192 🔗

Looking at the history of the French Revolution, the only missing ingredient – and It’s an important one – is a cataclysmic volcanic eruption on Iceland that causes an ash cloud that devastates harvests for the next couple of years, to concentrate people’s minds.

Eyjafjallajökull, could we ask a favour? Please give it your best shot…

182289 ▶▶ Nic, replying to Dan Clarke, 9, #1379 of 2192 🔗

Just ignore disobey what can they do .

182295 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to Dan Clarke, 6, #1380 of 2192 🔗

Tried listening to him, had to turn it off for the good of my blood pressure.

182301 ▶▶▶ Nic, replying to FlynnQuill, 5, #1381 of 2192 🔗

I cant bear to listen to the bull shit

182344 ▶▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to FlynnQuill, #1382 of 2192 🔗

Yes should have done the same

182310 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Dan Clarke, 3, #1383 of 2192 🔗

He will not stop. Why should he? I bet he’s loving every minute of the power.

182359 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Dan Clarke, 7, #1384 of 2192 🔗

“Boris is a Communist B’stard”

You wish.

He’s a member of the Tory Party who was elected to leadership by that Party and elected to office wearing that label.

Everything was known about his narcissism and venality beforehand.

Similarly, Starmer is a member of the Labour Party. Not a ‘communist’. It’s pointless creating fictions when the actuality is so clear.

182286 The Filthy Engineer, 5, #1385 of 2192 🔗

Analysis of the ineffectiveness of masks. Not sure if this has been posted before but I found it well worth a watch:

https://themodelhealthshow.com/maskfacts/

182304 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 11, #1386 of 2192 🔗

Keir Starmer has told the House that measures have not worked and implies that the government should have taken more draconian measures. He simultaneously supports the measures and criticises them. Johnson accused him of equivocation.

182311 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Steve Hayes, 14, #1387 of 2192 🔗

Labour leadership cannot be relied on. Only hope is for the PM to be removed by his own party.

182315 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Julian, 7, #1388 of 2192 🔗

I wonder how many letters have been lodged with Graham Brady?

182605 ▶▶▶▶ James Bertram, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #1389 of 2192 🔗

I expect very few, sadly, Steve – all spineless careerists.

182317 ▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Julian, 26, #1390 of 2192 🔗

Agree. Boris has just completely dissed a very good question from IDS about rolling out antivirals for older people who catch the virus (instead of relying on lockdown). IDS also pointed out the average age of death of 82.4 and that the death rate is much lower than in March/April. Boris replied with a set of ‘alternative facts’. He is already on borrowed time with the party.

182357 ▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 2, #1391 of 2192 🔗

Oh I really do hope so!

182364 ▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Tyneside Tigress, 3, #1392 of 2192 🔗

Dear Tigress, that seems to be only half true. Undoubtedly, there are many who would like to step up when all this is over. But none willing to make it end. The Johnson regime can go on and on by prolonging the ‘crisis,’ and the party will do nothing but chunter politely.

182527 ▶▶▶▶▶ Tyneside Tigress, replying to Ovis, 2, #1393 of 2192 🔗

Not if the money men have their way. Lord Ashcroft calling for a ‘shuffling’ of the Cabinet. Various others over the last couple of weeks calling time on Boris’s strategy. Letters are sat in Sir Graham’s drawer. We need to see what happens after Thursday’s three events (Brexit deal deadline, Bower book published, Dolan case). I still think he will be gone by the end of the year.

182627 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Tyneside Tigress, #1394 of 2192 🔗

I do hope you are right.

182795 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ TJN, replying to Ovis, #1395 of 2192 🔗

To be replaced by what?????

182316 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Steve Hayes, 17, #1396 of 2192 🔗

Bellends

182323 ▶▶▶ jim j, replying to Two-Six, 5, #1397 of 2192 🔗

They’ll lick any ass that goes past

182353 ▶▶ Jo, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #1398 of 2192 🔗

The only time I am likely to agree with Al Johnson, I suspect

182390 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #1399 of 2192 🔗

Johnson is correct. The Labour Party is, has always been, and will ever be interested only in the best interests of the Labour Party. This gets it into all sorts of intricate knots, which are usually amusing to watch. Right now, it would be better to have an actual opposition

182319 Tenchy, replying to Tenchy, 14, #1400 of 2192 🔗

Bunter just said, “But if we were to follow that course, “and let the virus rip”, then the “bleak mathematics dictate that we would suffer not only an intolerable death toll” but would also put “huge strain” on the NHS and doctors and nurses would be unable to treat patients for cancer, heart disease and other conditions, he says.

“Let rip” well that one was expected. “Bleak mathematics dictate …” WTF!

And clearly Wuhan lab flu is given a higher priority than Cancer and heart disease. Bloody appalling!

182322 ▶▶ Mark H, replying to Tenchy, 20, #1401 of 2192 🔗

So we’re basically back where we were, in the gov’s mind, in March. High death toll. Overwhelmed NHS. They’ve learned nothing.

182341 ▶▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to Mark H, 13, #1402 of 2192 🔗

Is that the NHS that’s has over 150,000 beds, yet at the hight of the so called pandemic, only 41,000 were used. Lying scum, that’s what they are.

182351 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Mark H, 8, #1403 of 2192 🔗

That’s why they’ve decommissioned the covid hospital in Scotland. That I don’t understand. Sturgeon must know the truth and is lying through her teeth.

182324 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Tenchy, 5, #1404 of 2192 🔗

Let rip has to be used at least 3 times each statement.

182386 ▶▶▶ Tiberius, replying to Dan Clarke, 6, #1405 of 2192 🔗

I haven’t seen anyone suggest that we should let the virus (or anything else) rip.
Using that hyperbolic word only serves to demonstrate that the Government doesn’t have an articulate argument.

182330 ▶▶ FlynnQuill, replying to Tenchy, 21, #1406 of 2192 🔗

Is that the cancer and heart disease they haven’t given a shit about for the last seven months? Their lies know know no bounds!!

182340 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Tenchy, 3, #1407 of 2192 🔗

Wuhan lab flu is given a higher priority than Cancer and heart disease”

… and the rest.

And I bet none of the MPs (‘Muppets in Parliament’) raised that crucial issue of massive collateral damage and the management of the NHS.

182363 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Tenchy, 17, #1408 of 2192 🔗

His Eton debating society rhetoric was always an empty thing. He was grotesquely out of his depth as a guest presenter on Have I Got News For You? But now, parroting these ghastly phrases and flapping them in the faces of people making not only perfectly reasonable, but urgently essential objections to the government’s behaviour, he is revealed without question as the most pernicious, useless lump of nothing ever to take high office In Britain and I am ashamed I voted for him. Guy Fawkes, come back, all is forgiven, we need you.

182383 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 6, #1409 of 2192 🔗

For Johnson this has always been, and will continue to be, a great game.

The man deserves execution for what he has done. But we have to take a good portion of the blame for allowing such an inadequate individual anywhere near offices of political power.

182416 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Tenchy, 6, #1410 of 2192 🔗

They’re not letting the virus “rip”, and they’re still not treating cancer or other patients.

What e**ing bleak mathematics?? The ones that completely miscalculated and forecast other mass deaths that didn’t happen??
What about people????
What about our society and economy???
By the time they’ve finished, there’ll be nothing left.

He and his co-conspirators are a clear and present threat to this country. They’re deluded, or deliberately lying. Either way, they shouldn’t be in charge of anything more serious than deciding what socks they should wear.

182426 ▶▶ Nottingham69, replying to Tenchy, 2, #1411 of 2192 🔗

The cancer has certainly let rip in many people. Bunter I detest the man.

182321 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 19, #1412 of 2192 🔗

The despair that statement must have made to so many people is tragic, they sit there in Parliament laughing and chatting. I hope most ignore it, because they arent really bothered, the end game is the vaccine which all the countries are getting geared up for, the money to be made from rich countries is astronomical and they are all invested.

182400 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Dan Clarke, 5, #1413 of 2192 🔗

Does anyone else miss Guy Fawkes and co.?

182410 ▶▶▶ Evelyn, replying to Lms23, 2, #1414 of 2192 🔗

I do.

182325 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 39, #1415 of 2192 🔗

There has barely been a day since March without government announcements affecting the everyday lives of the population. They will not leave us alone.

This has been the most intense psychological warfare operation of all time. Not only is there no sign that this is going to change any time soon, but every sign that the attacks are going to intensify by many order of magnitude.

182326 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Richard O, 6, #1416 of 2192 🔗

Yep, it’s crushing.

182331 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Richard O, 5, #1417 of 2192 🔗

It is stifling and all pervasive. What did we do to warrant this punishment?

182335 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to CGL, 18, #1418 of 2192 🔗

Voted for this buffoon to be PM.

182338 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to RickH, 8, #1419 of 2192 🔗

Labour are no better though.

182370 ▶▶▶▶▶ RickH, replying to DRW, -1, #1420 of 2192 🔗

True. But beside the point.

182354 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to RickH, 3, #1421 of 2192 🔗

The problem is WE VOTED.

182396 ▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to CGL, 4, #1422 of 2192 🔗

Voted for Boris.
Won’t do that again. Ever.

182332 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Richard O, 6, #1423 of 2192 🔗

I suspect that’s the plan: to deliberately warm up the people to micro-managed lives.

182350 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to DRW, 12, #1424 of 2192 🔗

Mission accomplished in this regard. The tactic now is surely to crush all remaining life, hope and joy out of every last one of us so that we meekly submit to everything.

Nothing short of 100% compliance is going to be acceptable to these bastards.

#ComplyorDie

182327 nocheesegromit, replying to nocheesegromit, 4, #1425 of 2192 🔗

Does anyone have a news article to hand summarising the WHO’s flip flopping over face masks? This Standard article demonstrates our government’s uturns: https://www.standard.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-face-mask-rule-changes-timeline-a4533531.html

TIA

182337 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to nocheesegromit, 3, #1426 of 2192 🔗

Oddly enough it doesn’t seem to be receiving wide coverage. Almost as if people are completely ignoring it to make it go away.

182343 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to nocheesegromit, 17, #1427 of 2192 🔗

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8537489/PETER-HITCHENS-Face-masks-turn-voiceless-submissives.html

Here is a clue. On July 12, Deborah Cohen, the medical correspondent of BBC2’s Newsnight, revealed an astonishing thing. The World Health Organisation (WHO) had reversed its advice on face masks, from ‘don’t wear them’ to ‘do wear them’.
But the key fact was that it had not done so because of scientific information – the evidence had not backed the wearing of face coverings – but because of political lobbying.
She revealed on Twitter that: ‘We had been told by various sources [that the] WHO committee reviewing the evidence had not backed masks but they recommended them due to political lobbying.’ She said the BBC had then put this to the WHO, which did not deny it.
In March, the WHO had said: ‘There is currently no evidence that wearing a mask (whether medical or other types) by healthy persons in the wider community setting, including universal community masking, can protect them from infection with respiratory viruses, including Covid-19.’
The American TV news channel CNN reported on March 31 that Mike Ryan, executive director of the WHO health emergencies programme, had said at a briefing in Geneva: ‘There is no specific evidence to suggest that the wearing of masks by the mass population has any potential benefit.
‘In fact, there’s some evidence to suggest the opposite in the misuse of wearing a mask properly or fitting it properly.’
A few weeks ago, the WHO changed its advice to say it ‘advises that governments should encourage the general public to wear masks where there is widespread transmission and physical distancing is difficult, such as on public transport, in shops or in other confined or crowded environments.’
Earlier that same month, England’s chief medical officer, Chris Whitty, had said that wearing face masks would do little to combat the outbreak.
While noting that if someone was infected, they might reduce the danger of spreading the disease by covering their faces, Prof Whitty said wearing a face mask had almost no effect on reducing the risk of contracting the illness.
He stated: ‘In terms of wearing a mask, our advice is clear: that wearing a mask if you don’t have an infection reduces the risk almost not at all. So we do not advise that.’

182377 ▶▶▶ T. Prince, replying to Two-Six, 2, #1428 of 2192 🔗

I posted this link here weeks before the mask mandate. International mask lobby organization

masks4all.org.uk

182388 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to T. Prince, 6, #1429 of 2192 🔗

this organisation is evil

182530 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bruno, replying to Two-Six, 1, #1430 of 2192 🔗

I seem to recall masks4all.org was a Czech outfit. They locked down hard to start with, full masks etc. Look what happens when they ease off though:
https://www.theguardian.com//oct/11/czech-republic-goes-from-model-covid-19-response-to-brink-of-second-lockdown

182394 ▶▶▶▶ Lms23, replying to T. Prince, 2, #1431 of 2192 🔗

So what’s their particular motive to get everyone to wear masks, or for Susan Michie to suggest a cultural change to encourage mask-wearing?

182402 ▶▶▶▶ calchas, replying to T. Prince, 3, #1432 of 2192 🔗

Part of the DAVOS World Economic forum

182398 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to nocheesegromit, 1, #1433 of 2192 🔗

See Mr Dee above – not too far Tulsa Oklahoma Doctors Sue City Over Mask Mandates

182328 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 41, #1434 of 2192 🔗

Philip Davies just took the opportunity to remind Boris Johnson that Conservatives believe that individuals make better decisions for themselves and their families and communities than the state can make for them and therefore people should be advised of the risks and measures they can take and be able to make their own decisions. Boris Johnson responds by agreeing. This isn’t theatre, it is satire.

182355 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to Steve Hayes, 13, #1435 of 2192 🔗

Good – that means he has given us the all clear to make our own decisions!

182690 ▶▶▶ annie, replying to Steeve, 1, #1436 of 2192 🔗

Can we have the question and answer transcribed, verbatim, so we can take it with us to show the Covid Stasi?

182821 ▶▶▶▶ Steeve, replying to annie, #1437 of 2192 🔗

I am going to print that off!

182333 George Marchaux, 11, #1438 of 2192 🔗

urrghh, some genius decided to pop Johnson’s announcement on the TV, christ i’m depressed. I note the UK’s level of fear is not allowed to drop below ‘Medium….’

182334 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 30, #1439 of 2192 🔗

My new hate figure, Jonathan Van Tam, has declared that “shouting and screaming” are key factors in the spread of the virus, which is his rationale for closing down pubs in the north – because we all know what those northern pubs are like, don’t we, chaps, from those terribly amusing soap operas and true crime documentaries we all so enjoy in Epsom.

i can only say I find his assertion extremely unlikely, otherwise the virus would be spreading like wildfire everywhere I utter the words “Jonathan Van Tam”.

182345 ▶▶ wayno, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #1440 of 2192 🔗

we are all ruffians up here

182372 ▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 10, #1441 of 2192 🔗

They need to close down parliament, that lot shout and scream. They’re all useless, too.

182378 ▶▶ Mabel Cow, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 14, #1442 of 2192 🔗

Perhaps the government has realised that pubs are the last place that people can talk freely to one another and discuss the shit that we’re all in.

Shutting down pubs might be seen as a good way to shut down the spread of dissent. Just keep people apart, so that everyone assumes that everyone else is perfectly happy with the situation.

And of course there’s no problem leaving restaurants open because people on different tables very rarely talk to one another. Besides, if you can afford to eat out you’re probably not hurting financially and so you’re less likely to be in a grumbling mood.

182387 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #1443 of 2192 🔗

Looks like he has lots of adoring fans on Twitter…

182395 ▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Lms23, 4, #1444 of 2192 🔗

They’re mixing him up with Jean-Claude. Bad mistake

182392 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 6, #1445 of 2192 🔗

That means no more spectator sports, ever.

182405 ▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Richard O, 12, #1446 of 2192 🔗

indded. Stepping back from the immediate chaos for a moment, do we really see a possibility that 50,000 people will be allowed to crowd together in a stadium ever again? Or even , as a cricket fan, 35 people on a dank Tuesday morning in Chester-Le-Street? People don’t yet fully realize, but cultural and sporting life has been extinguished.

182409 ▶▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 4, #1447 of 2192 🔗

Sports, theatre, music, cinema, pubs, whatever your tastes. Never again.

182414 ▶▶▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Cicatriz, 4, #1448 of 2192 🔗

And they tell people who’ve trained for years, for love and very little money, in these fields, to retrain?

182411 ▶▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #1449 of 2192 🔗

Forget it…you will not see a football match live ever again…unless you take a new vaccine every 3 months ,then maybe, just maybe

182406 ▶▶ CGL, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 7, #1450 of 2192 🔗

I apparently can’t talk at a normal volume any more, I am so angry all of the time

182536 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #1451 of 2192 🔗

Van Tam comes across as someone who just couldn’t hack it in the real world so opted to be an empty worded bureaucrat instead. Just like the guy from the WHO come to think about it.

182339 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 11, #1452 of 2192 🔗

The lifetime security costs for the likes of witty, hancock and valance would probably pay for a new NHS hospital alone. Least i know there are millions ahead of me willing to take a pop given the opportunity !

182379 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to nickbowes, 3, #1453 of 2192 🔗

Can I watch??

182517 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to nickbowes, #1454 of 2192 🔗

They wouldn’t, in any normal times, get any official security after leaving office.

182346 garry a, 2, #1455 of 2192 🔗

Have some regions (eg Manchester) have rejected Tier three? Got it on in the background here at work

182352 Mr Dee, 10, #1456 of 2192 🔗

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbmvCKcUNuA&feature=emb_title

Tulsa Oklahoma Doctors Sue City Over Mask Mandates

182360 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 20, #1457 of 2192 🔗

Boris just stated we don’t have a SARS vaccine after 18 years and there are no guarantees now. How the hell can it be made any clearer that he’s going to keep this going forever.

182368 ▶▶ Nic, replying to Charlie Blue, 6, #1458 of 2192 🔗

Which is crazy as the whole government plan is for lockdowns to continue until a vaccine arrives 18 years for f s

182381 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Charlie Blue, 19, #1459 of 2192 🔗

SARS has disappeared because herd immunity was achieved. It was a lot easier with SARS because it was more difficult to catch, but it will be the same with SARS 2, IF THEY STOP THESE FACKING LOCKDOWNS, shield the vulnerable AND LET PEOPLE LIVE THEIR LIVES.

182721 ▶▶▶ guy153, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #1460 of 2192 🔗

I don’t think herd immunity was achieved with SARS1. If it was endemic there would still be a regular drip of cases. It looks like it actually was eradicated. It’s that much less infectious and more severe that this was possible.

182401 ▶▶ tonys, replying to Charlie Blue, 9, #1461 of 2192 🔗

That was a pretty clear sign no vaccine is on the horizon, at least not for those who are actually vulnerable to Covid 19, that is progress of sorts as it begs the obvious next question ‘how long do you think you can keep this lockdown going and how do you propose to get out of it’?

182407 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to tonys, 4, #1462 of 2192 🔗

They never had a plan on how they were going to get out of it

182417 ▶▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to tonys, 7, #1463 of 2192 🔗

The big clue this was a white elephant (forget IFR, CFR etc.) was no exit strategy was ever stated. We got a 2 year emergency bill that gave near unlimited power to the executive with six monthly reviews (some power remained in perpetuity). Next to no one in parliament could be bothered to review that legislation and passed it without scrutiny.

182421 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to tonys, 1, #1464 of 2192 🔗

Obvious only to us, I fear.

182412 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Charlie Blue, 7, #1465 of 2192 🔗

That’s a very interesting change of message. Last week stories were being briefed to the media that the NHS were gearing up for mass vaccination to start before Xmas. Now Johnson is saying there may never be a vaccine.

Probably the usual dropping of conflicting narratives to gauge social media reaction in order to inform the next wave of regulations to be announced.

182424 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Richard O, 3, #1466 of 2192 🔗

Maybe after at best mixed reception to those, they want to make the sheep want the “miracle vaccine” even more.

182361 Jo, replying to Jo, 9, #1467 of 2192 🔗

By the way, I read that book, Corona: False Alarm? You can read it in one sitting. I was impressed and it is now in a lending queue.

182516 ▶▶ James Bertram, replying to Jo, 1, #1468 of 2192 🔗

Passed my copy on to the local Doctor’s surgery – with a note to view The Great Barrington Declaration.

182362 Fingerache Philip., replying to Fingerache Philip., 5, #1469 of 2192 🔗

I am not making any political point but does anyone else think like me that if we had any other party in power other than the Conservatives, they would have been toppled ages ago.

182366 ▶▶ Jo, replying to Fingerache Philip., 6, #1470 of 2192 🔗

I’m not sure. Most people are still scared of the virus, most people favour lockdown and restrictions. Although hopefully the balance is shifting, slowly….

182389 ▶▶▶ jim j, replying to Jo, 2, #1471 of 2192 🔗

Well there certainly looks like there is plenty of time to have had a referendum… ah, but that’s gives them back answers they don’t like I guess!

182413 ▶▶▶▶ DRW, replying to jim j, 6, #1472 of 2192 🔗

Don’t expect to vote again. They don’t need even the pretence of democracy now.

182374 ▶▶ Lms23, replying to Fingerache Philip., 5, #1473 of 2192 🔗

Not if they had the same majority as the Tories.
It’s only a government with a small majority that would be under threat.

182451 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Fingerache Philip., 4, #1474 of 2192 🔗

As someone who has never voted for the Tories – no I don’t.

What is going on is partly about the capture of democratic politics by an establishment that now has unmediated totalitarian instincts.

Forget for a moment your personal views on Corbyn; they’re not relevant to this argument ( and he may well have had his arm up the back on the Covid issue had he gained power – such are the forces behind it).

Just consider, however, how the campaign against him reached depths of fabrication and propagandised shaping that we have never seen before. This has been recognised by the few good journalists across the board, and raises the question : Why? given that the actual policies espoused were simple social democratic ones, well within the post-war spectrum of political debate.

Why would two shills who once headed security services be recruited to issue desperately ludicrous warnings about his ‘extremism’? Then consider how those security services – and MI6 in particular are deeply involved in promulgating establishment propaganda through links with the Cabinet Office – and, in particular maintaining ex-colonial interests in the middle east, particularly with regard to Israel as a bastion of western (particularly US/UK) interests in the region.

Corbyn had to go, whatever a democratic process might determine. Starmer was the safe option for the future should Johnson and the Tories get blown away. Thus the frantic pushing of propaganda against him by the now captured ‘Guardian’ – a key organ aimed at the centre-left vote.

The fruits of this scenario can be seen in Starmer’s embrace of the Israel lobby and attempts to stifle support for Palestinian rights within the Labour Party. Domestically , we can see that he is a ‘safe pair of hands’ in turning away from any essential opposition to the official Covid narrative.

Quod est …

182367 Dan Clarke, replying to Dan Clarke, 11, #1475 of 2192 🔗

I really feel that they don’t care about the rules, but need to keep up the rhetoric about being vaccinated, they can’t let it slide because they are personally invested and the pharma companies are going to make a shed load of money from the rich countries.

182399 ▶▶ DRW, replying to Dan Clarke, 6, #1476 of 2192 🔗

I agree, the main goal is to roll out the vaccine and ID, mainly the latter. Getting tinfoil hat here but it wouldn’t surprise me if the former is just a placebo held for optimum timing. Once it can be sold as the cure to a year plus of lockdowns, masks and antisocial distancing, take-up will be huge.

182404 ▶▶ Julian, replying to Dan Clarke, 13, #1477 of 2192 🔗

It’s all just theatre to keep up the pretence that we face an unprecedented threat

182429 ▶▶▶ DRW, replying to Julian, 2, #1478 of 2192 🔗

Brilliant summary of coronabollocks generally.

182371 Liz F, replying to Liz F, 39, #1479 of 2192 🔗

I’m sick of hearing politicians say that they ‘understand’ how difficult the lockdown restrictions are for everyone. They have no idea.

182435 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Liz F, 2, #1480 of 2192 🔗

Especially when you can just ignore the restrictions with impunity.

182376 Victoria, 4, #1481 of 2192 🔗

Risking his profession and maybe his life, this doctor is a true hero speaking the truth that most of the others are too afraid to say

see video
https://twitter.com/jonkirbysthlm/status/1315648772828016643

182384 Harry hopkins, replying to Harry hopkins, 44, #1482 of 2192 🔗

I gather from all the excitement on here that our erstwhile excuse for a prime minister has been exercising his facial muscles by uttering the usual bollocks he is famed for.

I never listen to him. Never read the MSM. Never watch or listen to TV or radio news. So whilst I don’t know any detail of his latest mad pronouncements I haven’t a hope in hell of feeling any remorse when I go about my life as normally as possible. I live in the North of England, am I locked down? Could I give a fig?
I read somewhere the other day that the Amish community in America have no Covid cases. When asked why one of them apparently said ‘we don’t watch television’.

I wouldn’t give this inhuman criminal and his cohorts a single moment of my time. Which is why I’m negotiating this farce probably better than most.

182397 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Harry hopkins, 3, #1483 of 2192 🔗

spot on

182391 bucky99, replying to bucky99, 5, #1484 of 2192 🔗

Welcome to tier two… where anyone with kids can no longer go to the pub, unless they go on their own. Wonderful.

182403 ▶▶ Steeve, replying to bucky99, 2, #1485 of 2192 🔗

Is that the Kids?

182418 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to bucky99, 6, #1486 of 2192 🔗

Jesus…give it a couple of more weeks and V for vendetta will become a documentary! Alas without a masked vigilante taking the bastards down one by one..Remember remember, the 5ht of November. Before it was cancelled for your own good.

182408 Jo, replying to Jo, 6, #1487 of 2192 🔗

Oh look at this!
16 October 2017 (Transcript of the speech, exactly as it was delivered)
comment image
One of the roles of Parliament is to cast ahead, to look to the horizon, and tackle the great challenges of our time.
So I applaud the creation of the APPG on the fourth industrial revolution, which surely is one of the greatest challenges we face, as a nation, and as a world.
The nature of the technologies is materially different to what has come before. In the past, we’ve thought of consumption as a one-off, and capital investment as additive. Yet put resources into the networks that now connect half the world, or into AI, and the effects are exponential.
The reason is that the cost of storing and transmitting information has fallen, perhaps faster than at any time since the invention of the printing press. That time it transformed the world, democratised knowledge, and brought down the whole feudal system of Government. This time it’s just got started.
And the nature of the new technologies is that the changes we are experiencing today, are probably the slowest changes we will see over the rest of our lifetimes. If you don’t much like change, I’m afraid I don’t have so much good news.
Our task, in this building and around the world, is to make this technology, this change, work for humanity. And I’m profoundly confident we can. Because this technology is made by man, so it can be hewn to build a better future for mankind.
And I’m delighted to speak alongside so many impressive colleagues who really understand this, and alongside Professor Klaus Schwab who literally ‘wrote the book’ on the 4th Industrial Revolution. Your work, bringing together as you do all the best minds on the planet, has informed what we are doing, and I’m delighted to work with you.
For the 1st Industrial Revolution, the UK could claim to be the ‘workshop of the world’ – propelled by development of the steam engine, it reached its pinnacle in the mid-19th Century. But the UK has not had the monopoly on waves of industrialisation.
Now, in the fourth revolution, we are determined to use our strengths to play a leading part. By its nature the fourth industrial revolution is more collaborative than the first. And we will play our part.
The UK is already a world leader in key technologies – AI, nano and biotechnologies, and additive manufacturing to name a few. Our Industrial Strategy outlines what we’re doing to ensure the UK is a leader overall.
And our Digital Strategy, embedded within the wider Industrial Strategy, sets out the seven pillars on which we can build our success. And inside that fits our 5G strategy, like a set of Russian Dolls.
Our Strategy covers infrastructure, skills, rules and ethics of big data use, cyber security, supporting the tech sector, the digitisation of industry, and digitisation of government. All these are important.
You will, for example, have seen that just yesterday we launched our review into Artificial Intelligence by Jerome Pesenti and Wendy Hall. It’s an excellent report which sets out what we need to do to support the enormous potential of AI while mitigating its risks. We want Britain to be at the forefront of work in AI, and this report shows the way.
Today I want to focus on just two of those areas: skills and infrastructure.
The 4th Industrial Revolution will change the kinds of jobs needed in industry. Our strong view is that as a nation we must create the jobs of the future. Digital revolution brings with it disruption. And as the RSA so powerfully set out last month, the risk is not that we adopt new technologies that destroy jobs. The risk to jobs comes from not adopting new technologies. Our task is to support redeployment not unemployment.
Our goal must be to automate work, but humanise jobs. Allow machines to do the dangerous, boring, and repetitive, and ensure we humans have the capacity to do the creative, empathetic and interactive.
We need a full spectrum skills response, from school to retirement.
So we now have coding in the curriculum from age 8. For those already in work, the Digital Skills Entitlement provides free access to basic training and promotes lifelong learning.
We can’t do this on our own, so our Digital Skills Partnership de-conflicts the huge amount of work going on in the private sector.
It’s critical we have next-generation digital infrastructure in place. We’re taking steps to cement our position as a world leader in future technologies of full fibre and 5G through the £740m of funding from the National Productivity Investment Fund that the Chancellor announced last year.
TBC

182419 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Jo, 7, #1488 of 2192 🔗

Good find, It’s ALL coming out now isn’t it?

182420 ▶▶ calchas, replying to Jo, 6, #1489 of 2192 🔗

Nice find!

Social isolation for all through manufactured fear = Digitalization.

182422 ▶▶ Cicatriz, replying to Jo, 2, #1490 of 2192 🔗

Ah, that’s where he heard the word ‘exponential’ then.

182436 ▶▶ Dan Clarke, replying to Jo, 2, #1491 of 2192 🔗

So why the isolation and ruining of society, you would think keeping people occupied with ‘other things’ would make it easier for them.

182437 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jo, 4, #1492 of 2192 🔗

Our goal must be to automate work, but humanise jobs. Allow machines to do the dangerous, boring, and repetitive, and ensure we humans have the capacity to do the creative, empathetic and interactive.

Well the creative, empathetic and interactive have all been legislated out of existence, which leaves only the work to be done by machines. I think I get the message.

182443 ▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Richard O, 3, #1493 of 2192 🔗

We are superfluous. Doesn’t apply to Boris or the Billybot, of course.

182453 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to thinkaboutit, #1494 of 2192 🔗

It will apply to them also, once the transition is accomplished. They will be thrown under the bus along with everyone else.

182479 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Jo, 6, #1495 of 2192 🔗

Any chance you can delete that picture? Not really wanting to see that as I scroll the comments.

Suggestion: use this one.

182525 ▶▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to Ceriain, 1, #1496 of 2192 🔗

Totally agree. My monitor is in acute danger while that monster is so large on screen.

182663 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Ceriain, #1497 of 2192 🔗

I know…. I really should have got rid of it before posting, but worried about losing the text. Sorry folks!

182415 Jo, 2, #1498 of 2192 🔗

Now, in the fourth revolution, we are determined to use our strengths to play a leading part. By its nature the fourth industrial revolution is more collaborative than the first. And we will play our part.
The UK is already a world leader in key technologies – AI, nano and biotechnologies, and additive manufacturing to name a few. Our Industrial Strategy outlines what we’re doing to ensure the UK is a leader overall.
And our Digital Strategy, embedded within the wider Industrial Strategy, sets out the seven pillars on which we can build our success. And inside that fits our 5G strategy, like a set of Russian Dolls.
Our Strategy covers infrastructure, skills, rules and ethics of big data use, cyber security, supporting the tech sector, the digitisation of industry, and digitisation of government. All these are important.
You will, for example, have seen that just yesterday we launched our review into Artificial Intelligence by Jerome Pesenti and Wendy Hall. It’s an excellent report which sets out what we need to do to support the enormous potential of AI while mitigating its risks. We want Britain to be at the forefront of work in AI, and this report shows the way.
Today I want to focus on just two of those areas: skills and infrastructure.
The 4th Industrial Revolution will change the kinds of jobs needed in industry. Our strong view is that as a nation we must create the jobs of the future. Digital revolution brings with it disruption. And as the RSA so powerfully set out last month, the risk is not that we adopt new technologies that destroy jobs. The risk to jobs comes from not adopting new technologies. Our task is to support redeployment not unemployment.
Our goal must be to automate work, but humanise jobs. Allow machines to do the dangerous, boring, and repetitive, and ensure we humans have the capacity to do the creative, empathetic and interactive.
We need a full spectrum skills response, from school to retirement.
So we now have coding in the curriculum from age 8. For those already in work, the Digital Skills Entitlement provides free access to basic training and promotes lifelong learning.
We can’t do this on our own, so our Digital Skills Partnership de-conflicts the huge amount of work going on in the private sector.
It’s critical we have next-generation digital infrastructure in place. We’re taking steps to cement our position as a world leader in future technologies of full fibre and 5G through the £740m of funding from the National Productivity Investment Fund that the Chancellor announced last year.
Travelling around the world I see much excitement at 5G, and I’m confident the UK will be at the front of the queue. And I’m determined we will do our bit.
So today I am delighted to announce that we are launching the first £25m competition for 5G testbeds and trials projects. We already lead on the highly technical development of 5G standards through the international work of the University of Surrey and others.
Now we are looking for innovative projects to test the roll out of 5G to develop the UK’s growing 5G ecosystem. We want projects that explore the real-world potential for 5G for example:

  • to deliver benefits for businesses;
  • to develop new 5G applications and services;
  • to develop and exploring new business models around key 5G technologies; or
  • to reduce the commercial risks associated with investment in 5G.

It will also support projects which explore ways of using 5G technology to address challenges in particular sectors, such as those faced in health and social care.
It’s all about preparing Britain to take advantage of these extraordinary new technologies.
Earlier this year, the ‘fourth industrial revolution’ was not a very well-known term – at least before it became a central topic at the World Economic Forum. It recently made its way into an item on BBC Breakfast television – this shows we’ve probably started to reach critical mass.
It’s a pleasure now to introduce the man who made the fourth industrial revolution a household phrase: Professor Klaus Schwab.

182428 Eve, replying to Eve, 3, #1499 of 2192 🔗

If anyone uses South Western Railway…

They are conducting research in to expected travel habits now and post-Covid. May be helpful to have a few lockdown sceptics respond, if it’s a railway line you use. They are asking if British Transport Police enforcing fines for non mask wearing would make you feel safer… noooooo!

https://www.research.net/r/SWR2020-LB

182489 ▶▶ zacaway, replying to Eve, 2, #1500 of 2192 🔗

Thanks – filled it out. Interesting that they basically assume “the vaccine” is the only way to restore normal service. Does that mean we’ll need a jab just to take the train in future? (Rhetorical question… I know the answer: yes).

183466 ▶▶▶ Eve, replying to zacaway, #1501 of 2192 🔗

God forbid!

182808 ▶▶ davews, replying to Eve, 1, #1502 of 2192 🔗

Yes, completed. No boxes to put your feelings and some of the questions were a bit vague. I wanted to say that no way did I want mandatory seat reservation and I objected to masks but the only box was ‘make no difference’.

182430 Cheezilla, replying to Cheezilla, 11, #1503 of 2192 🔗

Where is the virus?

Read the GPs letter!

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3379/rr-2

182440 ▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Cheezilla, 6, #1504 of 2192 🔗

Good letter.
Would make a good satirical cartoon along the lines of ‘Where’s Wally’.

182485 ▶▶ Schrodinger, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #1505 of 2192 🔗

Written by a friend of my wife (also a retired GP) and she’s coming over on Wednesday for a walk with us. I shall pass on your compliments.

182433 THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, replying to THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, 3, #1506 of 2192 🔗

Recording our next podcast tonight. All about Vaccines. We hope you find the time to listen to it later this week!

182434 Basics, replying to Basics, 8, #1508 of 2192 🔗

The Great Reset. The Man Behind the Curtain.

https://youtu.be/tInLlsPdZO0

Perhaps posted already today. A new video out today from the excellent computing forever yt channel.

182438 ▶▶ Laura Suckling, replying to Basics, 2, #1509 of 2192 🔗

Listening to this now, excellent.

182480 ▶▶ JHuntz, replying to Basics, 2, #1510 of 2192 🔗

Also listening. Excellent and harrowing at the same time. These parasites are evil beyond measure.

182492 ▶▶▶ Darryl, replying to JHuntz, 3, #1511 of 2192 🔗

Their thinking is sadly at a completely different level to that of the general population. Hence, why I think they will get away with everything they plan.

182487 ▶▶ Darryl, replying to Basics, 6, #1512 of 2192 🔗

People should stop kidding themselves, these ideas and technology are clearly ready to be rolled out, they are changing the world. Millions will lose their jobs and many will never work again – social engineering on a global scale.

Many people seem to think they will be unaffected – they might have a nasty surprise. This encompasses every aspect of life.

182494 ▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to Darryl, 4, #1513 of 2192 🔗

The technology is already rolled out and has already changed the world. Now it is time for its full suppressive and human-replacing potential to be unleashed.

182629 ▶▶▶▶ Allan Gay, replying to Richard O, #1514 of 2192 🔗

I wonder if their technology depends on electricity.

If so, the collapse of our generating and supply system at the behest of the Prime Mountebank’s green zealotry may sabotage their plan.

Perhaps an icy freedom in civilisation’s ruins is to be our lot, rather than a glossy electric serfdom.

182444 Laura Suckling, 1, #1515 of 2192 🔗

Ivor Cummins interviews Swedish ER/ICU doctor:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6IeN6sgJ3g&t=0s

182446 Mel, 16, #1516 of 2192 🔗

So South Yorkshire are in tier 2 are we Boris. Go fuck yourself.

182448 Locked down and out, replying to Locked down and out, 6, #1517 of 2192 🔗

The government has released its daily coronavirus figures, announcing a further 13,972 confirmed cases on Monday.
So a massive undershoot of Vallance’s non-prediction prediction of 49,000 by today and a forecast which, of course, heralded the arrival of the “six”.

182463 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Locked down and out, 2, #1518 of 2192 🔗

Let’s hope they don’t find another lost Excel spreadsheet in the bottom drawer tomorrow…

182466 ▶▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to A. Contrarian, 2, #1519 of 2192 🔗

Anyway they’ve moved onto hospital admissions now since cases weren’t playing ball.

182535 ▶▶ Sarigan, replying to Locked down and out, 3, #1520 of 2192 🔗

I know it is due to the dodgy PCR testing but if you did not know that, would you not ask how the fuck so many people are catching it? Given the mass compliance, empty town centres etc. surely people must question what the hell the going on? Are there government funded teams of coughers, spitters and loud talkers running round superspreading?

Are there any rational people beyond this site that are not thinking:

Are masks really helping?
Is social distancing doing anything?
Lockdown’s are making no difference.

This has got to be last chance saloon for the Conservitwats. Win win. Numbers will inevitably drop and they will claim victory.

182550 ▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to Sarigan, 1, #1521 of 2192 🔗

Look at the breakdown, Scotland and NI had several days of over 800. They must have tested about everyone by now.
Compare data from date reported to date test taken, it is going down.
But yeah, where do they still find all these people?

182450 Margaret, replying to Margaret, 9, #1522 of 2192 🔗

We all knew another lockdown was coming, just not the exact details. Some on here predicted it a few months back.

I see it as more smoke screen and mirrors. Liverpool has been chosen as the scapegoat this time, whereas it was Leicester the first time around. Anyone who studies the graphs can see that the number of deaths now is a fraction of those in March/April and the number of “cases” is only a fraction of those tested.

The government and its advisors know this. By taking this action, they are hoping to divert attention from what is really going on i.e. nothing much out of the ordinary for back to school/university/autumn respiratory infections. They can’t just do nothing otherwise the game is up.

Oliver Dowden gave it away this morning when he talked about getting Covid under control by the New Year or even by Christmas. They are hoping to make a grand gesture then so they can be seen as heroes rather than the villains that they are now.

No doubt Liverpool has received a massive payout for its role in all of this. I feel sorry for the folks there. I have fond memories of the city from when I was at university there in the 1970s. It was a pretty depressing place then and much of the area where I shopped was destroyed in the riots of the 80s, but with the building of a Liverpool One and the regeneration of the dock lands, it has transformed itself. I would hate to see it go back to the Liverpool of my student days with places shut down, but I can see it happening.

182462 ▶▶ Nottingham69, replying to Margaret, 2, #1523 of 2192 🔗

Most of it is still depressing, it will be worse after Bunters destruction. As an antidote to Bunter, Dr Vernon is coming on the Richie Allen show 5.30.

182471 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Margaret, 4, #1524 of 2192 🔗

Small correction, Margaret; not intended as a dig at you, as I agree with all you say.

“No doubt Liverpool has received a massive payout for its role in all of this.”

This should read: “No doubt Liverpool politicians have received a massive payout for its role in all of this.” The Liverpool people won’t see a penny of it.

182486 ▶▶▶ Margaret, replying to Ceriain, 1, #1525 of 2192 🔗

You are right, Ceriain.

182579 ▶▶ R G, replying to Margaret, #1526 of 2192 🔗

I’m in Southport which is just about in the lockdown area. There’s going to be nothing left at this rate, especially if the bung money gets funnelled into Liverpool at our expense.

182797 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Margaret, #1527 of 2192 🔗

Didn’t Johnson get into trouble some years ago for something he said about Liverpool? Perhaps this is his revenge.

182456 Leemc23, replying to Leemc23, 26, #1528 of 2192 🔗

I looked out my window on a cold grey day in March. There was rain. There was doom and gloom in the media and there was incompetent government.

Today I look out my window on a cold grey day in October. There is rain. There is gloom and doom in the media and there is incompetent government.

In between time any last bit of faith I had has been flushed down the shitter.

Today’s highlight is walking through a school playground (fully outside) socially distanced and not wearing a mask (Heath reasons) and being called “dis