Last updated2021-01-25T16:28:53



377304 Judy Watson, replying to Judy Watson, 81, #1 of 1991 🔗

The headline is sickening. How to bankrupt a nation in one easy lesson

377305 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Judy Watson, 25, #2 of 1991 🔗

Hear, hear. I think I need to spend a day away from this.

377308 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Sceptic, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 54, #3 of 1991 🔗

T he Great Reopen UK businesses are asked to open – I am not saying anyone should break the law.

Aren’t all businesses essential – contact them

30th January there is a call for British pubs, restaurants, hospitality to reopen. Just like Italian restaurant and bars are doing
Who’s prepared to fight for their livelihood?
More importantly who’s going to get off their backsides & support them?
You want your pubs back, your social lives…take them!!!

#Reopen #Pubs #restaurants #

377316 ▶▶▶▶ Judy Watson, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 44, #4 of 1991 🔗

Believe me, if I was there I would be knocking on the pub doors to let me in – maskless and no anti-social distancing. If they wanted my phone number and home address I would put Thailand down.

I sincerely hope this happens and the great British public supports these premises.

377664 ▶▶▶▶▶ J4mes, replying to Judy Watson, 18, #5 of 1991 🔗

I had started to give the name and address of people I don’t particularly like when doing the track/trace thing.

378097 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Judy Watson, replying to J4mes, 3, #6 of 1991 🔗

Love it. Will thimk of that when I am next in the uk

377401 ▶▶▶▶ Stephanos, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 36, #7 of 1991 🔗

My wife and I have heard about this and we are planning our first meal out for 10 months on Saturday. Where? We don’t know.
No face-nappy, no anti-social distancing, no QR code.

377407 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 32, #8 of 1991 🔗

Mr Bart and I are trying to find if there are any pubs, restaurants and cafes that are open on 30 January. We would be happy to support them.

377492 ▶▶▶▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to Bart Simpson, 19, #9 of 1991 🔗

Me too I would go and support any cafe, pub or restaurant on Saturday even if even I did not like the food! The question is where will these businesses be. I will be in south shropshire on Saturday and free all day if anyone has any ideas of where to go?

377536 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Fiona Walker, replying to Boris Bullshit, 9, #10 of 1991 🔗

I would too but if they identify themselves to us they are also identifying themselves to the police and lockdown lovers and given the current propaganda blitzkrieg things could get messy. I propose Valentines Day as an alternative date, daily deaths and cases should be well down by then.

377580 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Fiona Walker, 33, #11 of 1991 🔗

I think that’s the whole point – its the Gandhi school of Civil Disobedience.

Open up and when the police come and issue fines, cry foul and demand your day in court.

If more than enough cafes, pubs, restaurants even shops, venues and museums do this the police and courts will be swamped especially as there is a backlog of more than 50,000 cases.

379251 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Elisabeth, replying to Fiona Walker, 2, #12 of 1991 🔗

Pub full of 80 people each carrying a pitchfork. What’s the car full of cops gonna do?

377575 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Boris Bullshit, 17, #13 of 1991 🔗

I live in London and it would be interesting to see what parts of the city where these cafes, pubs and restaurants will be open. We’re happy to go to any part of London where they’re open.

378491 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #14 of 1991 🔗

Surely the people we should look to are the more independent ‘communities’ – Asian and so forth. Surely they have more than enough supporters to face up to this. Everyone else of any persuasion, with anti-lockdown sympathy, would help.

378828 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Banjones, 2, #15 of 1991 🔗

Possibly Chinatown?

377812 ▶▶▶▶▶ ElizaP, replying to Bart Simpson, 2, #16 of 1991 🔗

Is this happening throughout the country? I’ve only heard England mentioned. What about Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland?

377923 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to ElizaP, 2, #17 of 1991 🔗

I have no idea sadly. We’ll presumably hear more closer to the time.

378692 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ GiftWrappedKittyCat, replying to ElizaP, 3, #18 of 1991 🔗

It’s been posted on a few anti lockdown Facebook groups in Scotland. Compliance here is high though so whether or not it takes off is debatable. I’ll be taking a walk along my local high St on Saturday though and will certainly go into anywhere that’s open.

378986 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to GiftWrappedKittyCat, 1, #19 of 1991 🔗

Me too will try Shrewsbury probably. Will go in anywhere open.

377518 ▶▶▶▶ Vir Cotto, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 12, #20 of 1991 🔗

Latest ICNARC Graphs: Amongst General Reattribution Of Other Illness To Covid-19, Pneumonia From Flu Is A Thing Of The Past

Should keep this one circulating – very damning evidence.

377553 ▶▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 5, #21 of 1991 🔗

This really is looking quite important now. To gauge the level of resistance and willingness to display it.

377312 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Sceptic, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 24, #22 of 1991 🔗

White Supremacy

Tony Heller – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKFelwmbRI8

Joe Biden says supporters of President Trump are “white supremacists” and “terrorists.” I live in Cheyenne, Wyoming – the most Republican state. Cheyenne is a military town with a very diverse population, and people get along great. I’ve never met a “white supremacist” – but if Joe Biden says so, it must be true.

377314 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Sceptic, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 11, #23 of 1991 🔗

The Truth About PCR Tests

Dr. Sam Bailey
168K subscribers
The truth about Covid 19 PCR Tests.


377510 ▶▶▶ Vir Cotto, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 22, #24 of 1991 🔗

It’s difficult to deal with this each day. It drags you down. Definitely keep up with hobbies and other interests. Take your mind off this junk, stay passionate about other things. Even if it’s just computer games or whatnot.

378989 ▶▶▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to Vir Cotto, 2, #25 of 1991 🔗

It is hard and with the freezing weather too. My partner is getting seriously depressed….there must be millions feeling the same.

377306 ▶▶ Lockdown Sceptic, replying to Judy Watson, 11, #26 of 1991 🔗

The Persecution of the Uyghurs in China – a window into our future?

Bjorn Andreas Bull-Hansen
380K subscribers

The Uyghurs in East Turkistan are being persecuted by the Chinese government. Mass surveillance, concentration camps, labour camps, forced sterilization. We need to speak up against this.

378183 ▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 4, #27 of 1991 🔗

The only reason the US is concerend about Uighers is that they were intended to be used as terrorist forces to destabilise China, after being trained and operating in ISIS/FSA/etc groups in Syria.

377313 ▶▶▶ Lockdown Sceptic, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 3, #29 of 1991 🔗

£60 Fine for Visiting Mum 96 In Care Home

378266 ▶▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 8, #30 of 1991 🔗

There is a special place in hell for this level of jobsworth.

377328 ▶▶ FrankiiB, replying to Judy Watson, 35, #31 of 1991 🔗

We will indeed be bankrupted. Perhaps we already are. The idol on the altar of lockdown, by which I mean the NHS, will not survive it.

377673 ▶▶▶ J4mes, replying to FrankiiB, 9, #32 of 1991 🔗

“You will own nothing and you will be happy” – the Great Reset.

377869 ▶▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to J4mes, 6, #33 of 1991 🔗

“You will be brainwashed and you will be happy.”

377884 ▶▶▶▶ kpaulsmith1463, replying to J4mes, 4, #34 of 1991 🔗

You will BE nothing, and you will be happy

377730 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to FrankiiB, 8, #35 of 1991 🔗

The NHS will survive just as long as we are able to provision the people who we ask to work within it. It’s never a matter of money. It’s only ever a matter of stuff.

And since the workers are still working while the Professional Middle Class hide, that will continue to happen.

The farmers are still in their fields and the lambs will still be born on schedule. Nothing that actually matters has stopped.

378140 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Lucan Grey, 7, #36 of 1991 🔗

Except the economy and social interaction?

378194 ▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to FrankiiB, 7, #37 of 1991 🔗

We already are. The (private) Bank of England has graciously allowed the UK to extend their borrowing from ~2% of GDP to 25% of GDP – about £250 billion. The interest alone is likely to be £250 million a year at current interest rates. That is essentially pure profit for the Bank of England. I imagine there are asset transfer conditions that would come into effect If the loans are defaulted on.

This explains why the government is handing out money to cronies as though there is no tomorow. The taxpayer is on the hook, not them.

Save the NHS – for private sector looting when loans cannot be met.

377576 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Judy Watson, 12, #38 of 1991 🔗

Another lesson from history. Germany was bankrupt with hyperinflation when a certain person from Austria came into power and the rest as they say is history.

377593 ▶▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to p02099003, 8, #39 of 1991 🔗

It’s a well known fact that fascism works in the short term to revive an economy, as you pointed out. But it does rely on having someone even modestly competent in charge. And in the long run it strangles the market and destroys any innovation.

378431 ▶▶▶▶ frankfrankly, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 3, #40 of 1991 🔗

The German economy was recovering before Hitler took power. His policies of autarky and war production were bankrupting the country. He had to invade Russia in 1941 or he would have run out of oil and the German food rations would have been cut.

377644 ▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to p02099003, 12, #41 of 1991 🔗

A better example and comparison is post WW2.
Civil servants and pensioners were in the poorhouse for a generation as the private sector boomed after the currency reform, but couldn’t be milked yet and as the government couldn’t borrow much and only at high rates.
That’s what keeps me going, the thought of former politicians, teachers, civil servants, GPS, final salary pensioners queuing up at the food banks.

377820 ▶▶▶▶ ElizaP, replying to JayBee, 5, #42 of 1991 🔗

NOT a helpful comment to make. There are some of us on here and also fighting back against the Government.

377853 ▶▶▶▶▶ TJS123, replying to ElizaP, 1, #43 of 1991 🔗

Absolutely. And the best way for us potential food bank queuers to fight back is from within.

377990 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to ElizaP, 2, #44 of 1991 🔗

As long as there’s enough for that last bottle of Laphroaig. Got my lovely enamel beaker from Arthur Beale ready and the little Hillyard 4 tonner will serve splendidly as the funeral barge.

378086 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Robin Birch, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 2, #45 of 1991 🔗

Damn. I knew I should have kept my Hillyard 6 Tonner. The magnificance of a Viking funeral -would beat the socially distanced crem any day

377672 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to p02099003, 7, #46 of 1991 🔗

Indeed. Everyone gets off on saying how bad the Nazis were, but almost no one understands where they came from.

378013 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to p02099003, 2, #47 of 1991 🔗

Actually it was the austerity of 1931 more than the hyperinflation of 1923 that helped put the Nazis into power. Many contemporary Germans forgot this, which goes some way to explain why the Eurozone became increasingly dysfunctional after 2008.

377725 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to Judy Watson, 6, #48 of 1991 🔗

You cannot bankrupt a nation with its own currency. Pretending otherwise is just as silly as thinking masks stop you getting infected. Both are systemic mistakes – caused by people treating their own feelings about their own individual situation and trying to apply that directly to the aggregate macro situation. Or as it is known ‘a fallacy of composition’.

The nation can maintain itself for as long as the working class continue to do the hard leg work, while the middle class hide away scared of their shadows.

377757 ▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to Lucan Grey, 7, #49 of 1991 🔗

Correct, there will be no bankruptcy. All debts will be paid in nominal terms.

Hyperinflation is the path of least resistance.

Yes, ‘stuff’ is what matters – not money. Right again.

However, ask yourself where that ‘stuff’ comes from.

It is imported – overwhelmingly.

So, ask yourself, if the UK keeps ‘printing’ pounds to import ‘stuff’, then at what point do the recipients of pounds ask themselves what they are going to do with them.

That massively increased budget decicit at HM Treasury leads to a wider trade deficit, as it is funnelled into maintaining the consumption of ‘stuff’ which is overwhelmingly imported.

As the currency falls, what are they going to do – increase interest rates.

378216 ▶▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to rockoman, 5, #50 of 1991 🔗

The UK doesn’t pay in pounds for everything it imports. It has to pay in USD for oil/gas. That means it has to buy USD which will become cripplingly expensive if the USD outlives the GBP. The Russians and Chinese are currently using currency swaos for about 25% (rising) of their mutual trade. They are becoming increasingly isolated form the vagaries and abuse enabled by the privileged position of the USD>

378654 ▶▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to rockoman, #51 of 1991 🔗

All countries are doing it, that’s the saviour, for a while.
I doubt that they can raise rates without causing a total catastrophe in financial markets and asset prices, which would annihilate all banks.
It’ll be a quick hyperinflation without any defending actions, IMO.
After the currency reforms, only a few old Western currencies will be left, like the NOK, SEK and may be the CHF.

378002 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Lucan Grey, 7, #52 of 1991 🔗

I liked Dr Gono’s comment in Zimbabwe that the problems with the money supply weren’t his fault because he was printing money as fast as he could.

378017 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #53 of 1991 🔗

Wouldn’t the equivalent of “bankruptcy” for a country with its own fiat currency be when it can no longer buy essential imports because the exporters are no longer willing to accept that currency (instead demanding US$ or gold)?

378209 ▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Lucan Grey, 3, #54 of 1991 🔗

If you look at the UK currency, it is copyright the Bank of England. The Bank of England is a private for-profit corporation, with the UK government as a minority shareholder. The other majority shareholders are unknown. If the BoE ceases to print money, or make loans to the UK govt, things will hit the fan remarkably quickly.

378409 ▶▶ redbirdpete, replying to Judy Watson, 10, #55 of 1991 🔗

Can anyone now doubt that we are living in a dictatorship? Parliament (with about 2 dozen exceptions among the MP’s) is a disgrace.

377309 awildgoose, replying to awildgoose, 38, #56 of 1991 🔗

Lockdowns, distancing, face nappies, and vaccines.


377338 ▶▶ Annie, replying to awildgoose, 38, #57 of 1991 🔗

Wankok, Boris, Psntsdown, Dungford and Turdgeon burning in hell.

377826 ▶▶▶ ElizaP, replying to Annie, #58 of 1991 🔗

Well I wouldn’t want to be them doing their Life Review just after they’ve died LOL.

377881 ▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to ElizaP, 1, #59 of 1991 🔗

Yup, Interview without coffee one hopes.

377359 ▶▶ WasSteph, replying to awildgoose, 45, #60 of 1991 🔗

This is all so depressing. They won’t let go now because when they do the reckoning starts. I really hope hospitality and “non-essential” businesses do open up on 30th and stick two fingers up to them. I doubt there is enough bravery in the land though.

377431 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to WasSteph, 23, #61 of 1991 🔗

If there is no fight back that will be the end for EVERYBODY!

People have to start realising this has bugger all to do with any virus!

377497 ▶▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to WasSteph, 11, #62 of 1991 🔗

I really hope they do and that they have maximum support. It was great to see the Italians reminding the filth who pays their wages and jeering at them and making them back off. I cant wait to see this happen in this country.

377556 ▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to WasSteph, 2, #63 of 1991 🔗

Is there a website we could check to see what pubs are actually going to open.

377565 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Thomas_E, 4, #64 of 1991 🔗

LOL yeah… the authorities would never find and use that list for anything authoritarian…

377745 ▶▶▶ J4mes, replying to WasSteph, 10, #65 of 1991 🔗

Christmas was the big milestone for them. The public let them shut down our biggest celebration without a whimper of dissent and gave the green flag to go ahead and lock down permanently (July is another carrot on a stick).

378158 ▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to J4mes, 4, #66 of 1991 🔗

But I also think Christmas was a big turning point for a lot of those hitherto compliant. The screeching hyperbole of the current propaganda suggests that many worms turned at the end of December.

378467 ▶▶▶▶▶ J4mes, replying to Cheezilla, #67 of 1991 🔗

I’d like to think you’re right. Unfortunately for me, everyone I know have since become totally obedient and openly scared of Corona.

377495 ▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to awildgoose, 17, #68 of 1991 🔗

It will be unless a sufficient number of people rise up and throw off the masks and ignore social distancing and go back to gatherings and meeting up. If even 5% of people did this the filth and the scumbag marshalls would be powerless to enforce it.

378573 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Boris Bullshit, 3, #69 of 1991 🔗

Sadly I know pretty much nobody apart from me who would do it! So nobody to meet or gather with.

377555 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to awildgoose, 5, #70 of 1991 🔗

I have been saying this since May..

377310 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 66, #71 of 1991 🔗

From the Telegraph’s attempted scaremongering about “wards full of people in their 30s, 40s and 50s”, the following unintentionally revealing information (which will probably be edited out soon):

“The demographic of the patients in ICU is notable. They are all overweight – I’m told one weighs 150kg – making the task of turning them onto their fronts for a procedure known as proning (which helps to improve breathing and oxygenation in the blood) far more difficult.

“It takes a team of five to prone one patient, and it’s a slow process, involving wrapping the unconscious patient in bedsheets and protecting them with a layer of pillows as they are gently rolled over, all while keeping their airways clear.”

377319 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 25, #72 of 1991 🔗

I cannot but read the quote without thinking the word prone (meaning to lie face down) was a part of the language they had never come across, and so they decided to construe it as medical jargon, rather than plain, everyday English.

377331 ▶▶▶ Annie, replying to Steve Hayes, 38, #73 of 1991 🔗

Presumably its opposite is ‘supining’: to assume an attitude of grovelling, cowardly passivity in the face of whatever terror tactics the Fascist bullies choose to adopt.

377697 ▶▶▶▶ Caramel, replying to Annie, 4, #74 of 1991 🔗

I like this comment. It’s going in my Word document that I made in August of LS comments.

378184 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Annie, 5, #75 of 1991 🔗

Not only are the British people supine, they’re supine and having their noses rubbed in the dirt. And that takes some doing!

379135 ▶▶▶▶▶ Annie, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 1, #76 of 1991 🔗

Even the heavenly choirs need some gymnastic ability, as in the infamous verse:

Let high-born Seraphs tune the lyre,
And, as they tune it, fall
Before his face who tunes their choir,
And crown Him Lord of All.

377408 ▶▶ GCarty80, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 17, #77 of 1991 🔗

So does that mean that the vast majority of Covid deaths are either obese, or over-80s who aren’t even sent to ICU and are instead just left to die?

377574 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to GCarty80, 8, #78 of 1991 🔗

There has been the plausible theory put forward that those who are vulnerable are also on medication designed to boost ACE2, especially when related to he lungs. The SARS-CoV-2 virus attaches to these receptors.

So over medication in the West has to be considered a possibility here rather than just have diabetes for example. It could be the meds used to address it too, though its poorly studied


377657 ▶▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to BeBopRockSteady, #79 of 1991 🔗

Which common drugs boost ACE2, and which conditions are they used to treat?

377727 ▶▶▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 5, #80 of 1991 🔗

It also gets back to the question of how many of these obese people of all ages are also targeted for annual flu vaccinations – supporting another theory that the flu vaccine and SARS CoV2 do not mix well.

377906 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to GCarty80, 1, #81 of 1991 🔗

Surprised NHS/Moloch has set the barrier as high as 85. Waiting (at 67) for my DNR certificate suitable for framing ready for paramedics. Should there be an upper weight limit too?

378165 ▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to GCarty80, 2, #82 of 1991 🔗

That’s a very strong hypothesis.
There are other relevant comorbidities but obesity seems to be a very prominent factor.

377423 ▶▶ Hoppy Uniatz, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 11, #83 of 1991 🔗

Would it not be easier simply to suspend them in tanks of water, leaving the blowhole head clear to breathe, of course.

377605 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 13, #84 of 1991 🔗

So we now need some new posters:

“Look him in the eyes and tell him that you really, really need that one last Mars bar…”

377910 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to A. Contrarian, 5, #85 of 1991 🔗

Mr Creosote!

379138 ▶▶▶ Annie, replying to A. Contrarian, #86 of 1991 🔗

Deep-fried, of course, if you’re in Turdgeon Land.
I knew there was something unhealthy about all those substantial Scotch eggs.

377737 ▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 4, #87 of 1991 🔗

I’m almost certain that I read a few months ago that there was evidence that laying patients with respiratory problems on their front is actually more detrimental to their breathing than keeping them on their back. Personally, I can’t see how laying someone on their front does anything more than detrimentally compress the lungs.

377834 ▶▶ ElizaP, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #88 of 1991 🔗

In other words – the rest of us suffer – because they’ve opened their mouths and stuffed them full of junk on a regular basis and probably been too lazy to walk an easy walking distance to get anywhere. Well I know who comes first for consideration then – and it’s not them.

377905 ▶▶ kpaulsmith1463, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #89 of 1991 🔗

I just got a mental image of slave building the pyramids from that description.

378228 ▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to kpaulsmith1463, #90 of 1991 🔗

The person chopping down the last tree on Easter Island is more evocative.


377315 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 18, #91 of 1991 🔗

O’Brien was a May lackey

He has been about his anti LS propaganda for about three weeks now

One Tuesday G4S will start converting hotels into prisons

Wonder what will happen next?

(There is no connection between O’Brien, May, and G4S and don’t let anyone tell you any different)

379071 ▶▶ caipirinha17, replying to Cecil B, 1, #92 of 1991 🔗

Declaring a personal interest! O’Brien is the MP for Harborough ward (Con) which covers the relatively tiny territory of Oadby & Wigston (Lib Dem), a grim overcrowded suburb tacked onto the edge of an otherwise sprawling (and in places very nice) green space. Anyone think his being so vocal about lockdowns is linked? Sold Oadby & Wigston down the river for his own purposes maybe? The extended lockdown didn’t actually work here, as is clear from the Gov.uk dashboard.

377317 Tom Blackburn, replying to Tom Blackburn, 24, #93 of 1991 🔗

Guardian News: Anti-lockdown rioters clash with Dutch police in the Netherlands.

377370 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Tom Blackburn, 23, #94 of 1991 🔗

Netherlands, Denmark, Austria, Tunisia… The revolt is spreading.

377577 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #95 of 1991 🔗

Israel. Students protesting about school closures too.

377415 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Tom Blackburn, 12, #96 of 1991 🔗

People have had enough. I think its spreading.

377437 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Bart Simpson, 38, #97 of 1991 🔗

I’m not expecting any real revolt from the UK we’ve become a nation of bedwetters.

377443 ▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Bella Donna, 13, #98 of 1991 🔗

Sadly I have to agree with you but one never knows. There is a point where enough people won’t take the crap anymore.

378196 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Bart Simpson, 3, #99 of 1991 🔗

We need a police strike, like in 1918.

377318 Steve Hayes, replying to Steve Hayes, 125, #100 of 1991 🔗

I am sceptical about these constant polls that apparently show the majority of the public are in favour of lockdowns, social distancing and face masks policies. The people I know who are in favour of these policies and condemn others for breaking the rules, have themselves routinely broken the rules from the outset. They are in favour of the rules for others.

Besides my personal experience of the hypocrisy of the lockdownistas, I am also aware that many people when asked a question will provide what they think it is the correct, socially approved answer, rather than assert their own opinion. The way polls are conducted is likely to exacerbate this tendency.

This tendency to elicit misleading responses is also reinforced by the way pollsters frame issues. Questions are often written in a manner that implies an obviously correct answer; or a range of possible answers is provided which exclude a particular, yet relevant, position.

My scepticism of the polling is reinforced by what I see of people’s behaviour. If the majority of the people are in favour of the draconian responses to the virus, why do they behave as if they are not? The government’s headline message is: Stay Home, but this is not what the majority are doing.

What I think the polls are showing is that many people, perhaps the majority, are not prepared to explicitly contradict (for no benefit to themselves) the propaganda: they are not prepared to tacitly admit to the pollsters: I am one of the granny killers; rather they wish to present themselves as one of the moral, caring people, who are making noble sacrifices for the good of others.

The polls offer an opportunity for mass virtue signalling. They might as well ask: Are you a good person? Yes/NO.

377321 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to Steve Hayes, 29, #101 of 1991 🔗

Trust the science, govern through polls! What can go wrong?

378343 ▶▶▶ james007, replying to TheClone, 7, #102 of 1991 🔗

Polls remind me of Boris Johnson’s entire approach to leadership. Work out which way a crowd is generally going, and nip out in front to lead.

379140 ▶▶▶▶ Annie, replying to james007, 2, #103 of 1991 🔗

Je suis leur chef, il faut que je les suive.

377335 ▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Steve Hayes, 33, #104 of 1991 🔗

I would agree that many people have programmed themselves with the ‘correct view’, much as they would under facist or communist totalitarian regimes.
This is why, once you hint at your own lockdown scepticism, they often quickly and sometimes forthrightly express sceptical views themselves.

377341 ▶▶▶ Annie, replying to karenovirus, 62, #105 of 1991 🔗

A friend of mine who once spent a term in communist Poland told me that was exactly what happened. Fellow students cagily expressed the correct opinions until they were sure he wan’t a snitch, then the mask (sorry) came off, and their real opinions were wholly sceptical.
Most people automatically adopt the safe option under a brutal dictatorship. But it follows automatically that when the dictatorship collapses, the safe people will not lift a finger in its defence.

377351 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Annie, 62, #106 of 1991 🔗

A frightened man went to the KGB. “My talking parrot has disappeared.”

“That’s not the kind of case we handle. Go to the criminal police.”

 “Excuse me, of course I know that I must go to them. I am here just to tell you officially that I disagree with the parrot.”

379176 ▶▶▶▶ Cranmer, replying to Annie, #107 of 1991 🔗

George Orwell wrote something similar about when he was a policeman in India in the 1920s. Any opposition to the Raj by whites was taboo and one had to be very careful when discussing such things with strangers.

377342 ▶▶ jonathan Palmer, replying to Steve Hayes, 53, #108 of 1991 🔗

Polls are a means to influence public opinion not measure it.

377419 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Steve Hayes, 34, #109 of 1991 🔗

As I’ve always said the polls are rigged and one should never trust them.

Well said about those lockdowinstas who break the rules themselves. I have asked those who whine about people not socially distancing or wearing masks, “so why are you not at home then?”

I never get an answer. It’s always tumbleweed.

Says a lot about these people.

377442 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Steve Hayes, 18, #110 of 1991 🔗

YouGov is owned by Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi & Stephan Shakespeare also founder of ConservativeHome .

377882 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Bella Donna, 16, #111 of 1991 🔗

And your government is owned by Bill Gates and Klaus Schwab.

377457 ▶▶ Dave Angel Eco Warrier, replying to Steve Hayes, 19, #112 of 1991 🔗

Covidiot = Someone who breaks the rules slightly more than you do.

377586 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Dave Angel Eco Warrier, 22, #113 of 1991 🔗

It’s the old speeding thing isn’t it…

Anyone going faster than me is a maniac, anyone going slower is a moron.

377548 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Steve Hayes, 18, #114 of 1991 🔗

I am sceptical about these constant polls that apparently show the majority of the public are in favour of lockdowns, social distancing and face masks policies.

Agreed. Plus sadly I do not trust The Spectator in the slightest these days. In my view, they became a department of The Ministry of Truth late last year when Allegra Stratton, the wife of their political editor James Forsyth, became Al Johnson’s press secretary after Cummins and mate left. Evidence? They had ‘exclusive’ front page interviews with Sunak and Hancock soon after. Plus, they editorial messaging has increasing been fully signed up to and pushing the government narrative ‘the only way out is the amazing vaccine’. Finally, their editor Fraser Nelson wrote some great thoughtful and sceptical pieces over last summer. Not recently to my knowledge. I’m sure these are all just coincidences ….

377594 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 12, #115 of 1991 🔗

Late last year? lol

The minute Fraser Nelson got his pale blue arse in the editors chair it was all over for the Spec.

When Isabel Hardmann (whiny feminazi, and mistress of disgraced former Labour MP ) was made asistant editor, it all went decidedly woke… Did you not notice paleolithic misandrist dumper-truck Julie Bindel getting repeated column inches in which to declare that all men are rapists and all domestic violence is committed by men?

377693 ▶▶▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AidanR, 5, #116 of 1991 🔗

Yep, the rot has been setting in for some time for sure. There have been the odd piece in there over recent years thats prompted me to subscribe (and then cancel!).

Didn’t know about the Hardmann link, makes sense now. I still think Fraser Nelson wrote some thoughtful lockdown sceptical pieces. Mind you, his and the magazines fully signed up position to ecoloonery has been nauseating for a long time.

377892 ▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #117 of 1991 🔗

Fraser Nelson writes as controlled opposition.

Never forget that he and Boris sip from the same cup.

378201 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to AidanR, 7, #118 of 1991 🔗

And James Forsyth of that parish……married to one Allegra Stratton… he knows Rishi from school (Winchester) and university….Sunak and his wife are godparents to their children…..what a happy series of coincidences.

378248 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ james007, replying to AidanR, 5, #119 of 1991 🔗

Agreed. I cancelled my spectator subscription last year. So many friendly links to the Johnson Government, no where near critical enough of the government. Mary Wakefield, Cumming’s wife was commisioning editor.
Interesting move dropping Delingpole last year.

378295 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to james007, 3, #120 of 1991 🔗

I had a month’s free subscription late last year. That was enough. No way would I pay for such drivel.

378417 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to james007, 1, #121 of 1991 🔗

I don’t know whether Delingpole got red-pilled about Boris before or after his defenestration from the Spectator, but I’m sure the two are connected.

Until far too recently, he was over the moon about Boris’ ascendancy, predicting all manner of unicorns and rainbows.

377663 ▶▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 15, #122 of 1991 🔗

Absolutely spot on! The Speccie has been a very serious disappointment for a mag with a supposedly “conservative” outlook. They should be raging at the loss of our freedoms and the damage done by lockdowns but there has hardly been a peep. I’ve cancelled my subscription.

377791 ▶▶▶▶ Alan P, replying to charleyfarley, 1, #123 of 1991 🔗

But the btl comments are generally scathing of any of these woke types. There are exceptions of course (usually nutters like Kolya and Nick Harman).

377827 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to Alan P, 2, #124 of 1991 🔗

Those two are a right pair. Harman blocked me, happily.

378208 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Jo Starlin, #125 of 1991 🔗

Strangely enough, I always got on okay with Nick Harman! I don’t particularly miss him, I hasten to add- I do miss Ianess, Lola, Steph, Peta J, but not enough to resubscribe to the appalling New Establishment rag.

378297 ▶▶▶▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Alan P, #126 of 1991 🔗

Kolya is indisputably a troll.

379007 ▶▶▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to charleyfarley, 1, #127 of 1991 🔗

I have never paid for it ……only ever read it in W H Smiths in the railway station. I would not bother even doing that now. Mind you of course that would be spreading a deadly disease lol.

377819 ▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 1, #128 of 1991 🔗

Forsyth is godfather to Sunak’s kids and vice versa.

377655 ▶▶ charleyfarley, replying to Steve Hayes, 6, #129 of 1991 🔗

Agreed. The polls are largely meaningless.

If you set out to terrorise the population, and then ask them if they are scared, they are probably going to say “Yes”.

377320 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 27, #130 of 1991 🔗

Be careful, internment is coming. Converting hotels into prisons. 100,000 capacity

They want you to stay at home because they want to know where to find you when it’s your turn

377919 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Cecil B, 1, #131 of 1991 🔗

Happening in Canada already if you refuse PCR test at airport on return home from abroad. (Rebel News)

377322 FrankiiB, replying to FrankiiB, 73, #132 of 1991 🔗

I can’t believe why so many Tory MPs are letting Boris get away with this madness. Are they truly insane? Boris is beyond reprieve and Steve Baker deserves more support in his bid ask MPs to pressure him. I have come to the conclusion that no amount of evidence or rational discussion will have any effect on Boris as he’s been fully swallowed up by a dangerous death cult of ever more extreme lockdown.

377323 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to FrankiiB, 49, #133 of 1991 🔗

And nothing than be done because the so called opposition is even more zealot. Parliament offers no way out of this. Johnson knows this. He doesn’t care what the CRG thinks.

377340 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 40, #134 of 1991 🔗

Conservative MPs have a route out of this by threatening to trigger a leadership contest. The Covid Recovery Group has more than enough MPs.

377356 ▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Steve Hayes, 19, #135 of 1991 🔗

yes, I think CRG is one hope. They were quite vocal in the summer but go very quiet when infections rise.

they had Heneghan and Sridhar give them presentations recently. I hope they took what Sridhar said with a mountain of salt considering she has no background in the subject

377382 ▶▶▶▶▶ TheClone, replying to steve_w, 4, #136 of 1991 🔗

What they are waiting for?

377448 ▶▶▶▶ Sceptical Steve, replying to Steve Hayes, 8, #137 of 1991 🔗

The mechanism to oust Boris and his lightweight chums might be offered to them by the recent intervention of Ms Sturgeon. If the Tory party senses that BoJo is becoming irredeemably toxic to political opinion north of the border (which he probably is already), then fear for the future of the Union would do the trick.

378213 ▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Sceptical Steve, 1, #138 of 1991 🔗

I agree. I think the Establishment will do whatever it thinks necessary to stop Scottish independence.

377456 ▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 2, #139 of 1991 🔗

I wonder if there is a tipping point with the opposition. Before there was a vaccine, it was easy for Starmer to claim that government inaction was costing lives and that stricter measures enacted earlier would have prevented deaths (untrue, but easy to claim). If the public as a whole believe that the vaccine is the way out of this (and I genuinely doubt that many people believe this should go on forever) then as the vaccine rolls out the opposition will make more political capital first by attacking the speed of the rollout and any mistakes made during it and then by turning the argument onto the economy and the inevitable austerity. Whether the public will respond to this by switching to Labour is debatable, but certainly the Conservative vote will fall and that might be enough to win Starmer the next election.

377661 ▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Andrew Fish, 4, #140 of 1991 🔗

God help us.

377890 ▶▶▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to Jo, 4, #141 of 1991 🔗

I’m not saying it’s a desirable outcome, but if we’re looking for a way out of this mess then understanding the politics being played by the opposition is part of the picture. Starmer doesn’t care about ordinary people, but he does care about how to manipulate them into voting for his party. This means he will disassociate himself from lockdown policy when he can gain more political capital by attacking it than turning it up to eleven.

Personally, I’m not voting for either party next time round – I just hope there’s an electorally credible alternative so we can get them out and launch criminal proceedings against them.

378286 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Jo, 5, #142 of 1991 🔗

Billionaires fund the Conservative Party.
Billionaires fund the Labour Party.

And that is why both parties care so deeply about the common man.

377754 ▶▶▶▶ Jez Hewitt, replying to Andrew Fish, 11, #143 of 1991 🔗

Left, right; bollocks or shite.

Looking at this predicament we’re currently treading water in, I’d say our only hope of advancement is to tear it up and start again. We’re at where we’re at because Parliament and Her Majesty have not only failed us, they’ve instigated, aided and abetted it.

Oh we’re gonna build back better alright – maybe just not the way they have in mind.

377346 ▶▶ TC, replying to FrankiiB, 28, #144 of 1991 🔗

I fear Mr Baker is not the man for the job.
You need a person of principle who can garner some significant support within the party.
Who could that be?
Most of the MP’s are lobby fodder and now presumably physically absent from Westminster so would find it difficult to gather in conspiratorial cabals even if they wanted to.
Boris knows he has a large majority and self interest in MP’s would probably mean perhaps at least 80 would need to ally themselves against him before he took it seriously.
The opposition parties are worse.
Thet’re all fiddling whist the UK burns.
With the school closures the Prime Muppet,his henchmen et al are complicit in institutionalised child abuse.
Not too troubled by a poll in the Spectator – who reads it – but the attitude of MP’s across the board is disgraceful.

377354 ▶▶▶ TJN, replying to TC, 24, #145 of 1991 🔗

Baker is all mouth and trousers. Brady is far more dangerous.

377619 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to TJN, 5, #146 of 1991 🔗


377447 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to FrankiiB, 10, #147 of 1991 🔗

Because they are all cowards and would prefer to be “inside the tent pi$$ing out than outside pi$$ing in!”

Don’t expect any rebellion from them you’ll be disappointed.

377608 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to FrankiiB, 14, #148 of 1991 🔗

Bozo is a hollowed-out shell, a puppet to be manipulated by sociopathic academics on a power trip.

377617 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to FrankiiB, 7, #149 of 1991 🔗

LOL… really? Most Tory (and mostly all the other) MPs are in it for their seat, their career and their money, They couldn’t give a shit about their constituents.

And many of them will get in again in 2024, because people have awfully short memories and would rather eat razor blades than vote for ‘the other lot’. Not to mention the fact that an awful lot of people think MPs are ‘doing their best’ and ‘we need to save our NHS’ and such like.

As for Baker.. he has a long and inglorious track record of not walking the walk that dates back all the way through Brexit.

378067 ▶▶▶ Andrew Fish, replying to AidanR, 9, #150 of 1991 🔗

Tribalism is a problem to an extent, but it manifests more as resistance for people shifting their vote directly between Labour and Conservative than shifting to some other party. That’s why the threat from UKIP and subsequently the Brexit Party worried them so much.

With regard to the next election, I don’t know to what extent people will forgive and forget. This isn’t the Iraq War – we’re not talking about people’s righteous indigation about a policy which has very little impact on them personally. People have lost businesses or jobs; many will have children whose career prospects have been damaged; some will know people who have died from missed treatments or even suicide. These are not things people readily forget, although Labour at least is counting on their part in this being overlooked.

The NHS issue is an interesting one. I have a theory – and it is only a theory – that much of the adoration of the institution comes from the manner in which most people deal with it. Young couples mostly experience it through childbirth and problems with their children – the positive feelings that new parents experience is, in part, reflected onto the NHS. And if the NHS saves a child’s life (even if it wasn’t really at risk) then it becomes beyond criticism. At the other end of the scale, a lot of people’s experience of the NHS is when a relative has palliative care before death. Again, a little bit of sympathy from a nurse and the illusion is created that they are dealing with a caring institution. One of the things that has happened over the last year is that these situations have changed: women are being told they can’t have their partners present during childbirth, old couples are being forced to stay apart as their partners die in hospital. These experiences and others have resulted in people becoming more critical of the NHS. I don’t know what proportion of the public this affects, but the longer it goes on the more people will either have experience of this seeming callousness or know others who have. Add to that the fact that the encroachments on our liberties are being done to “save” the NHS and it’s quite possible that attitudes will have shifted. The party which wins the next election may be the one which calls for root and branch reform, not simply preserving the institution in aspic.

378285 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Andrew Fish, 1, #151 of 1991 🔗

Your theory about how we got to where we are seems sound…. I wish I could be as optimistic as you about where it’ll lead.

377324 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 29, #152 of 1991 🔗

‘Clicking away the moments that make up a dull day
Fritter away the hours in an offhand way
Kicking around on a piece of ground in your hometown
Waiting for something or someone to show you the way.

Tired of lying in the sunshine, staying home to watch the rain
You are young and life is long and there is time to kill today
And then ten years have got behind you
No-one told you when yo run, you missed the starting gun.

And you run and you run to catch up with the sun, but it’s sinking
Racing behind to come up behind you again
The sun is the same in a relative way but you’re older
Shorter of breath and one day closer to death

Every year is getting shorter, never seem to find the time
Plans that seem to come to naught or half a page of scribbled lines

Hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way.

The time is gone, the song is over, thought I’d something more to say.’

Time, Pink Floyd; accompanied my teenage years.

377616 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to karenovirus, 1, #153 of 1991 🔗

Great song. One correction: verse two line three: “and then one day *you find* ten years have got behind you”.

377635 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to mattghg, #154 of 1991 🔗


377796 ▶▶ Binra, replying to karenovirus, 4, #155 of 1991 🔗

Clicking is an interesting slip on ticking.
Time is a parameter of the human condition or rather the human conditioning.
The timeless is denied awareness by a narrative continuity dictate.
A lead role in a cage? to quote ‘wish you were here’.
Welcome to the Machine. There’s a trove of good lines in their work because they have in our own milieu explored and reflected something of what it is to be human – as both consciousness and world.

377330 franktr, 6, #156 of 1991 🔗

I might have missed any comment regarding the changes by the WHO on PCR Tests> this on the day Biden was sworn into office:

when the German Fauci, Drosten was asked he replied that the WHO was giving out guidance for the 3rd world countries who had insufficient testing and needed help….

However this is an important change as numbers are now (with US back firmly a WHO paying member) drop fast (a lockdown and measures taken success)
Most PCR assays are indicated as an aid for diagnosis, therefore, health care providers must consider any result in combination with timing of sampling, specimen type, assay specifics, clinical observations, patient history, confirmed status of any contacts, and epidemiological information.

377332 J Cook, 10, #157 of 1991 🔗

Ive just uploaded a 4min highlights video of Professor Russell Viner’s evidence to the select committee about lockdown effects on children’s mental health (see Telegraph article above “More children admitted to hospital for mental health than medical reasons”) here – https://youtu.be/MwN8CUBL86I

377333 Cheshirecatslave, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 4, #158 of 1991 🔗

I hope this isn’t the shape of things to come for children’s education.

377345 ▶▶ Annie, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 22, #159 of 1991 🔗

Teachers – well, the apparent majority who hate children and work – would love it:

“Others too believe the shift will be permanent. “Covid has given an impetus to schools to adopt, roll out and use more of the functionality of edtech tools,” says Hannah Owen, of the Nesta innovation foundation. “It’s likely, and optimal, that we’ll move to blended models, where remote and digital platforms support in-person classroom teaching, and contribute to minimising teacher workload.”’

Minimising teacher workload.Yeah.The ultimate goal of all education.

It’s amusing to see the Grauniad trying to square the circle. Lockdown tyranny is good by definition, but electronic pseudo-education hits the poor harder than the rich, oh dear, we have to pretend to worry about that.

377475 ▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to Annie, 9, #160 of 1991 🔗

Will there be any children to teach?

Who wants to bring children into such a world?

377800 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to rockoman, 1, #161 of 1991 🔗

Genetic Control?

377638 ▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Annie, 8, #162 of 1991 🔗

I suppose these ‘teachers’ are too stupid to work out that nobody is going to pay them forever to sunbathe in their gardens. most of them will soon be on the scrapheap – where they belong

377815 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to JaneHarry, 1, #163 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps the stupid is a narrative identity that can interpret events as moving society in the right direction – as a result of the greenwashing and cancel agendas.
Narrative identities are nurtured, profiled and targeted as data inputs to an almost real time modelling system of control.
Systemic suppression of threat so as to save the system that interprets Life as threat, so as to make us safe.

378521 ▶▶▶ houdini, replying to Annie, #164 of 1991 🔗

Really no need for schools or teachers at all as it can all be run centrally online from wherever

377454 ▶▶ Just about sane, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 13, #165 of 1991 🔗

There are so many gaps in this online learning concept and the biggest one is, to learn something, someone or something has to teach it. Who is going to teach the child how to add, multiply or read? Without a teacher there is no learning. I speak from experience in the lack of education my 12 year grandson has at this moment. I’m not a teacher and I have no way in contacting his teachers, he has been sent work via emails once in three weeks and I don’t understand some of the maths, nor does my grandson, with no access to his maths teacher, who teaches him? Answer no one.

377844 ▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Just about sane, 4, #166 of 1991 🔗

If there is a survival need, the kids will develop their own ways of learning.
That a mass of skilled workers are largely no longer required is part of robotic developments. Workers can be imported or indeed workplaces re locate to anywhere. What to do with all of Kissinger’s ‘useless eaters’?

I am more concerned with the core learning of relational integrity.
If love is not modelled (taught) and learned (inducted), then an arrested development may be trained to perform tasks but will know not what they do because they know not who they are.

377334 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 15, #167 of 1991 🔗

Just a short translation today. No attempt to replicate rhyme or scansion. Just meaning and atmosphere.

Abschied von England
by Ingeborg Bachmann

Ich habe deinen Boden kaum betreten,
schweigsames Land, kaum einen Stein berührt,
ich war von deinem Himmel so hoch gehoben,
so in Wolken, Dunst und in noch Ferneres gestellt,
daß ich dich schon verließ,
als ich vor Anker ging.

Du hast meine Augen geschlossen
mit Meerhauch und Eichenblatt,
von meinen Tränen begossen,
hieltst du die Gräser satt;
aus meinen Träumen gelöst,
wagten sich Sonnen heran,
doch alles war wieder fort,
wenn dein Tag begann.
Alles blieb ungesagt.

Durch die Straßen flatterten die großen grauen Vögel
und wiesen mich aus.
War ich je hier?

Ich wollte nicht gesehen werden.

Meine Augen sind offen.
Meerhauch und Eichenblatt?
Unter den Schlangen des Meers
seh ich, an deiner Statt,
das Land meiner Seele erliegen.

Ich habe seinen Boden nie betreten.


Farewell to England

I scarcely trod your ground,
silent land, scarcely touched a stone,
so high was I upraised by your sky,
so transported into clouds, mist and still more distant things,
that I was already leaving you
as I dropped anchor.

You closed my eyes
with sea air and oak leaf,
watered by my tears,
you nourished the grass;
set free from my dreams,
suns ventured forth,
but everything was gone again,
when your day began.
Everything remained unsaid.

Through the streets flapped the great, grey birds
and sent me away.
Was I ever here?

I did not want to be seen.

My eyes are open.
Sea air and oak leaf?
Among the serpents of the sea
I see, in your place,
the land of my soul succumb.

I have never trodden its ground.

377529 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #168 of 1991 🔗

We have twice worked as structural/civil engineers with an architect who won the King of Prussia Gold medal awarded by the Ecclesiastical Architects and Surveyors Association for excellence in conservation of churches. He instituted the medal after enjoying visiting English country churches on trips to visit his aunt in his yacht.

Thanks for all these translations, get well!

378554 ▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, #169 of 1991 🔗

Or, in Colloquial Scottish: “Johnnie, I hardly knew ye”.

377336 Cheshirecatslave, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 33, #170 of 1991 🔗

The Government blaming everyone campaign (the eyes one) is truly evil. Most covid transmission takes place in hospitals, workplaces, supermarkets on public transport and between members of the same household who most likely caught it at work.

If people don’t go out mental illness soars as well as a decline in strength and mobility. A sure way to totally overwhelm the NHS and store up problems for years ahead.

377460 ▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 24, #171 of 1991 🔗

I highly doubt that anyone is catching it at the supermarket. Unless they’re having a secret orgy in the gluten free aisle.

377628 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 15, #172 of 1991 🔗

it’s not about a virus, public health, or even saving the bloody NHS. as soon as you get that, a lot of stuff which made no sense before just falls into place

377887 ▶▶ Binra, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 5, #173 of 1991 🔗

What do you really mean by covid transmission???

Whats with this idea of NHS as susceptibility to ‘overwhelm’?
It’s the same idea that was fed to us as lacking immunity to a novel ‘something’.
WHO told you you were naked? – said the Lord. (This is your invitation to actually ask your OWN question and receive an answer that meets You).

Instead of responding to the propaganda, why not choose NOT to run a virus on your own operating system?

From the VERY FIRST – guilt and fear has grabbed the minds of the many to set off an ant’s ness in chaos.
ANSWER: Do not let anything run in your mind (or as if your mind) from a guilt fear or hate reaction.

IF the process in play is of releasing all that truly has no belonging in your mind as recognised and accepted in your heart, then you are refining and compressing to an essence or seed from which a new period of growth in creative expansion can unfold.

The old invested identity shall not stand because it is inherently conflicted and no matter how close to 100% a collectivised fear can temporarily reach, it remains a control, a coercion, a denial set over wholeness.
The tower of babel collapsed not just as a ‘tower’ but as a coherent movement, purpose or consciousness. learning to live the conditions that truly support life is an alignment within Life – not set apart and over it – like a computer model of machine thinking.

379047 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Cheshirecatslave, #174 of 1991 🔗

As if they’d care. No doubt there is a good medical support network for the apparatchiks. Why would they worry about the great unwashed if they’re comfortable and cared for, with the promise of security and wealth in the future.
That’s how it seems, anyway.

377337 Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 166, #175 of 1991 🔗

So Matt Hancock surreptitiously signs the death warrants of thousands of small businesses, with no parliamentary scrutiny and barely a squeak from the opposition benches. This is the same man who just a week ago was pictured smiling in a public park, playing rugby with his son as if he didn’t have a care in the world.

Wake the f**k up, people. These are your oppressors, not your saviours. There is no cavalry coming in the form of vaccines or warmer weather. This is totalitarianism. Your continued conformity is ENDING LIVES, not saving them. You can wash your hands as many times as you want – the bloodstains will never come out.

I hope every hospitality venue from Carlisle to Canterbury opens up this weekend. We need to end this farce once and for all.

377384 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Scotty87, 54, #176 of 1991 🔗

The problem is that the more time people spent locked up, the more propaganda they hear – because what else is there to do? – the more fearful they become because they don’t experience the real physical world.

It’s a self-reinforcing loop. More lockdowns more fear more lockdowns more fear until the country ends up being North Korea with everyone thoroughly dehumanised, demoralised and brainwashed.

377406 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to stewart, -15, #177 of 1991 🔗

It wouldn’t surprise me if the lunatic QAnon right was able to build sufficient support to storm the Capitol earlier this month, precisely because lockdowns were causing people to spend almost all their free time online.

377486 ▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to GCarty80, 6, #178 of 1991 🔗

Jeez, that is one terrible take.

377610 ▶▶▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to jb12, 11, #179 of 1991 🔗

My point is that without lockdowns they’d probably have things like jobs, family and friends to keep them from getting overly radicalized.

377929 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to GCarty80, 8, #180 of 1991 🔗

You don’t see the gov-media as radicalising the population at large?
They call it ‘normalise’ its out of the kgb disinfo playbook.

Radical can mean from the root.
But often is used to mean fundamentally at variance, with social norms.
If society is normed to insane premise maybe sanity calls from the root, but this means walking out of a social ‘identity’.

377908 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to GCarty80, 4, #181 of 1991 🔗

While Q can be seen as a way to repackage all and any doubt in Trump as saviour, the antifa were let in to the Capital.
You are being played and while you enjoy the ride you will sign up for more.
Nothing personal – for this applies to everyone who wants to believe their own ‘narrative identity’.
That we are free to give attention to what we accept and choose to value is our inalienable right. That we can give this freedom to ‘idols’ or ‘ideals’ is the nature of mind-control or mind-capture.

377446 ▶▶ sunny66, replying to Scotty87, 24, #182 of 1991 🔗

Well said! The current situation is an utter shambles. I cannot believe that people refuse to acknowledge the damage being caused by this fiasco. It needs to end RIGHT NOW!

377523 ▶▶▶ CGL, replying to sunny66, 28, #183 of 1991 🔗

But they do refuse to acknowledge it. Came across a couple on a walk yesterday. Although they ‘know how hard it is’ for some people, this is a ‘great opportunity’ to change the way things are done, and good for opportunities for environmental change blah blah blah. Completely taken in by the greens. What a crock.

377632 ▶▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to CGL, 12, #184 of 1991 🔗

useful idiots

377339 jonathan Palmer, replying to jonathan Palmer, 59, #185 of 1991 🔗

The slow motion coup rumbles on.Lockdown to the middle of summer.Travellers quarantined for 2 weeks which amounts to closing the borders.
When will the majority wake up,this is never going to end unless enough of us say so.

377347 ▶▶ Stephen Williams, replying to jonathan Palmer, 27, #186 of 1991 🔗

I left the UK legally in December now I am threatened with being detained at my expense upon return. I shall need a negetative test before flight. Is this not imprisonment without trial?
No doubt the ‘hoteliers’ will be rubbing their sticky hands.

377348 ▶▶▶ jonathan Palmer, replying to Stephen Williams, 25, #187 of 1991 🔗

Hotels have been some of the worst hit sectors in all of this.The only ones still open and functioning are the ones housing asylum seekers.
This measure may have had some merit if you were trying to keep out a virus but it’s already endemic.
This measure is to finish off the aviation and tourism industry

377349 ▶▶▶▶ R G, replying to jonathan Palmer, 20, #188 of 1991 🔗

The ones housing asylum seekers and the homeless are not only functioning, but thriving; the hotel my father works at has never made more money than it has since March. Only the beneficiaries of council largesse are going to survive.

377398 ▶▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to jonathan Palmer, 10, #189 of 1991 🔗

This measure is to finish off the aviation and tourism industry

Why? Climate change?

Incidentally I have noticed that some who criticize the Government for not locking down or closing the borders earlier accuse them of being “in the pocket of the aviation industry”…

377418 ▶▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to GCarty80, 7, #190 of 1991 🔗

In the pocket of the aviation industry? Please.

Have these people seen any recent quarterly financial results from the industry?

377434 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to GCarty80, 21, #191 of 1991 🔗

I’ve long said this. If the greens have their way, there will be a return to the bad old days where travel was only the preserve of the super-rich, politicians, celebrities and royals. While the rest of us have to make do with Blackpool and Bognor Regis.

377943 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Bart Simpson, 3, #192 of 1991 🔗

The green captured don’t have a way of any real choice but are being had by corporate stakeholders. A love of life and nature has been subverted and weaponised as an anti life agenda.
I see some signs of this recognition growing but the core beliefs in AGW – and human guilt agenda remain the backdrop to ‘justice warrior’. Nothing like fear, hate and evil to bolster a shaky identity.

378221 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Bart Simpson, 1, #193 of 1991 🔗

Not the Greens. Those who pull their strings.

377645 ▶▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to jonathan Palmer, 2, #194 of 1991 🔗

Obeying Greta, Klaus, Owen Jones&co….

377775 ▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to Stephen Williams, 4, #195 of 1991 🔗

I have written to my MP and questioned quarantine hotels idea. It is insane and against human rights. I told my MP that if I am forced into one I would go on hunger strike and get Talkradio to report it. Awaiting his reply.

378060 ▶▶▶ Ken Gardner, replying to Stephen Williams, 4, #196 of 1991 🔗

A negative result is really only valid at the moment of testing. It’s like saying ” I’m driving on a car trip at the weekend, so I’ll take a breathalyser test on Friday to make sure I’m fit to drive.”

377390 ▶▶ stewart, replying to jonathan Palmer, 28, #197 of 1991 🔗

The manipulation of language is disgusting.

Hotel quarantine.

I know a few people who have experienced this going to Asia. It is incarceration in solitary confinement. They literally saw no one for the two weeks. Food would be left outside their door and only when they received a ring on the phone could they open their door to collect the food. Armed guards on every floor.

What are we becoming.

377402 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to stewart, -4, #198 of 1991 🔗

Notably even Australia and New Zealand didn’t introduce hotel quarantine for returning residents (no-one else was allowed in at all of course) until April, because they had to wait for the hotels to empty out before they could be repurposed.

(Fortunately for them, their isolated location and ban on non-resident arrivals had kept imported cases down up to that point.)

The need to empty out hotels before hotel quarantine can properly be implemented is probably why Taiwan and South Korea resorted to the smartphone surveillance app approach to quarantining incomers.

377467 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to stewart, 7, #199 of 1991 🔗

Didn’t see your post before. I have written another below. My daughter, and hundreds like her are students in the US on sports scholarships. I am terrified for her. She won’t cope with this. I can’t cope with it. It means she can’t come home for spring break or Christmas at all. I have written to my MP but he is a zealot. I don’t know who to turn to.

377604 ▶▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to ituex, 11, #200 of 1991 🔗

You turn to yourself. What should you do? What’s right, I would either go out and see them. Get a pay as you go mobile registered to a fake name and address and use this to go and when I get home I would just escape from the hotel and disobey the rules and they would be calling a phone I don’t own. Or I would let them come home and find a way to get them out the hotel. If this was my daughter NOTHING would stop me from seeing them. You KNOW the rules are wrong and fraudulent so don’t follow them.

377995 ▶▶▶▶▶ ituex, replying to Spikedee1, 2, #201 of 1991 🔗

They will have armed guards. I am a retired woman. I can’t break her out of prison.

377453 ▶▶ nootnoot, replying to jonathan Palmer, 2, #202 of 1991 🔗

The money needs to run out first giving way to mass job losses and poverty.

377954 ▶▶▶ Binra, replying to nootnoot, #203 of 1991 🔗

The ‘money’ is generated by fraud.
While lubrication is required it will be applied.
As the new system is in place it mutates.

377343 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 32, #204 of 1991 🔗

‘……the difference between a prediction of 2700 to the reality of 47 is embarrassing to say the least, and shows why the Government must not hand over total policy control to the scientists who are clearly not infallible with their predictions.” Esther McVey

The entire weird out in a nutshell

Just like:

‘Update on Kent lorry situation: 15,526 Coronavirus tests now carried out. Just 36 positive results’ Grant Shapps

I’ll have another look at the amazingly dull, lightweight ‘Antivirus’ website but my immediate reaction still stands:

Exactly how dumb are these people?

377412 ▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Tim Bidie, 4, #205 of 1991 🔗

Exactly how dumb are these people?

How dumb would most people be with £millions at stake?

377344 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 22, #206 of 1991 🔗

Another early start. 3 hours work before homeschooling. At least I have a job.

On the above

A senior Government source cautioned that although the data was starting to show signs of a slowing of infections, rates were not falling nearly as sharply as had been expected. The source said the picture had become “more pessimistic” over the past week about the Government’s ability to ease any measures in the short term.”

infections are dropping faster than they did after March/April spike. They are only looking at Imperial discredited REACT-1 study I expect

377350 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to steve_w, 21, #207 of 1991 🔗

I despaired when I heard this quote, it was as if King Canute’s people were still not convinced that he could not hold back the tide and so they all stood with him and glared at the tide until it swept over and drowned them all.
It seems to me that every year one or more coronaviruses roam about the damp chilly UK in the winter time and cause things like cold and flu. This year we have the SARS-Cov2 virus causing the covid cold. For years the UK had a Common Cold unit but we never controlled the common cold, we have been trying flu vaccines for a few years with limited success. Why do we now think that infection rates should go down because of our actions? They will go down when they are ready most likely with the weather, lockdowns, facemasks and hand wringing are not going to do it.

377353 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Steve Martindale, 13, #208 of 1991 🔗

Yes, I think Imperial has taken over – at least in philosophy. SAGE seem to not look at data that doesn’t agree with Imperials modelling.

All the evidence seems to show that R is unaffected by lockdown

377385 ▶▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to steve_w, 7, #209 of 1991 🔗

I wouldn’t say that, given that Sweden is above the other countries for much of that graph (and that Spain — the country with the harshest lockdown in Europe — got its R numbers very low by the summer), but it does show suggest that seasonality was the main thing bringing down cases in the spring.

Incidentally does anyone here think that Spain’s especially harsh lockdown may have been driven by an attempt to save at least some of the summer tourist season?

377416 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to GCarty80, 9, #210 of 1991 🔗

1 – The numbers are all coming down similarly. I would swap our graph on the above for Sweden’s. The removal of human rights and destruction of society gave us something that is indistinguishable from Sweden (given the error bars aren’t on the graph). Our lockdown should have given a step change on 23rd. It didn’t and lockdown had no noticeable effect

2 – I don’t believe it was driven by seasonality. The season does not change in that way across those countries. All countries R hitting 1.0 within days of each other, from Sweden to Italy. I think it was an effect of partial herd immunity

377522 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ PFD, replying to steve_w, 4, #211 of 1991 🔗

Agree with everything you say here. In particular the assertion that seasonality led to the fall off in April is wrong. The plot of R is classic Gompertz and the result of partial herd immunity.

377570 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to GCarty80, 11, #212 of 1991 🔗

The issues around Sweden are known and have been mentioned on this site already. Does the 77th not teach its members to research?

For your benefit:

  • Sweden has larger care homes and a higher proportion of elderly in such care homes
  • Sweden has taken in a significant number of Somali migrants and their death rates were higher – likely due to Vitamin D deficiency
  • Sweden had a lighter death rate in the 2018/19 flu season, leaving more eldery alive than its neighbours.

Taking these factors into account, Sweden is on a par with Norway/Denmark. Therefore the question is why is Finland better than Sweden/Norway/Denmark?

In 2003, the Finnish Government mandated the fortification of certain foods for human consumption with Vitamin D. They have had 17 years of this to build up protection.

377662 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to Ewan Duffy, 2, #213 of 1991 🔗

I already knew about those reasons why Sweden did worse than the rest of Scandinavia. I’d also suggest though that Scandinavian cultures are quite socially-distanced even in normal times, and that’s another reason why Somali immigrants (who didn’t share that culture) were disproportionately hit.

377404 ▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to steve_w, 3, #214 of 1991 🔗

Sadly sage = big pharma.

377365 ▶▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to Steve Martindale, 16, #215 of 1991 🔗

Yes, you’ve nailed it there. We are dealing with King Canute logic here.

The biggest failure by the decision makers (politicians and the science industry) is this ridiculous medieval belief (amplified and reinforced by conflicts of interest and hysteria and group think) that viral transmission can be stopped by these interventions you mention.

This is a seasonal virus and it goes away as the seasons change in exactly the same way that the tide goes out through natural forces.

Of course you need to look at the real science based on proper analysis using the scientific method (not to be confused with the conflicted science industry), but as soon as you do you realise that the interventions don’t work.

377571 ▶▶▶▶ Bungle, replying to Freecumbria, -1, #216 of 1991 🔗

Cnut, please get the spelling of the king’s name right! Imagine if someone wrote Ctun or Ctnu???

377674 ▶▶▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Bungle, 1, #217 of 1991 🔗

I guess people started spelling it “Canute” because they were trying to replicate how it’s pronounced.

377795 ▶▶▶▶▶ Jez Hewitt, replying to Bungle, #218 of 1991 🔗

I imagine Zippy’s version of those four letters would make George blush.

377591 ▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to steve_w, 10, #219 of 1991 🔗

So what your saying is; lockdowns don’t fucking work? Well who would have thunk? Despite terrifying the population, closing down schools, shutting all social meeting places and locking the healthy under house arrest the infections did not fall. So there can only be two reasons.

1. Lockdowns do nothing to prevent the spread.

2. The PCR test is giving out false positives and cannot be relied upon.

Which one do ya wanna choose? Oh you want to make up your own reason which is non compliance of your laws? Well I can show scientifically proven papers to back up my two reasons. What have you got? Oh Karen has seen people down the supermarket not wearing a mask and Sadiq has seen people over the park walking their dogs, the bastards!

377352 Tim Bidie, replying to Tim Bidie, 25, #220 of 1991 🔗

‘…. the failure of the lockdown sceptics’ movement to achieve any penetration with the wider public.’ (Reference above)

Personal observation divides the adult population broadly into two main categories:

Small business self employed: overwhelmingly sceptical….roughly 16 million…you don’t see them in supermarkets and they don’t engage in surveys because they are too busy making ends meet

Public sector employees and retired public sector employees: overwhelmingly lockdown zealots…..roughly 16.5 million……

I don’t see that as a failure.

The question for the government: which of the above voted you into power?

No wonder the May elections are going to be delayed…..again…….

377388 ▶▶ GCarty80, replying to Tim Bidie, 5, #221 of 1991 🔗

you don’t see them in supermarkets

Wouldn’t the real lockdown zealots not be found in supermarkets either, because they’d be getting all their shopping delivered to their homes?

378563 ▶▶▶ Tim Bidie, replying to GCarty80, 1, #222 of 1991 🔗

You haven’t got the hang of this at all.

The real lockdown zealot want others locked down but not themselves so they can get out and about correcting people on their mask wearing, social distancing, informing the Police of the activities of their neighbours and so on……

377355 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 35, #223 of 1991 🔗

I dedicate today’s board to those fearless warriors of truth and decency; those brave, indefatigable souls who strive for justice and are relentless in their pursuit of ultimate safety for all: THE SNITCHER.

Week 44 in the Big Brother society:

LIberty: yep, still denied;
Freedom: yep, still denied;
Education: not on your nelly.

Still think this is about a virus?


This is what I think has happened over the past few months, during which we have noticed several people taking photos of our blackboards:

Snitch: “Hello, is that the Environmental Health?”
EHO: “Yes, what have you got?”
Snitch: “Taken a photo, surely we’ve got them now?”
EHO: “Nah, can’t get ’em on that”

Next Day

Snitch: “How about this, surely this will do for them?”
EHO: “Nah, sarcasm hasn’t been criminalised yet, so no can do”

Following day

Snitch: “How about this?”
EHO [chokes on biscuit] “Now you’re talking, they’ve mentioned the word ‘bench'”

EHO: “Deploy all units, deploy all units. Mobilise the drudge squad; fire up the printer and the laminator, retrieve the cable ties from the stationery cupboard, GO, GO GO, we’ve got the bastards”

378312 ▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to kh1485, 3, #224 of 1991 🔗

EHO: “You mentioned bench!”
You: “Yes I did”
EHO: “So you admit it! We’ve got you bang to rights!”
You: “I actually said ‘bench press’. I was talking about an exercise regime”.
EHO: “pffffffft….” [sound of deflating balloon careering off into the distance]

377357 Caramel, replying to Caramel, 6, #225 of 1991 🔗

When Hancockupthecountry made his statements, I thought that it was likely that restrictions would be eased in around June/July. So my unfortunate bet will be that they will be eased in July and then more in September.

377378 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to Caramel, 11, #226 of 1991 🔗

Which year? 2021? The lockdowns are forever! Wake up!

377358 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 23, #227 of 1991 🔗

My MP is in the CRG. I’ve been asking him for the metrics of when restrictions will be lifted. He has been trying to get it out of the government – but the fact is they don’t have one. They are winging it.

Infections are falling rapidly – faster than April 2020

Pressure on NHS will be lifting over the next few weeks – admissions been dropping for a few days

CRG need to threaten Boris with a leadership election if we don’t at least have a plan

In Churchill’s war diaries he says that up to a point we had only had defeats and then after that point only victories. He was close to being removed at that point and if he had have been then the victories would have been someone else’s and he’d go down as a terrible prime minister. We need the same pressure applied to Johnson

377362 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to steve_w, 19, #228 of 1991 🔗

I am confident that a credible threat of triggering a leadership contest could force Boris Johnson into a U-turn. The Covid Recovery Group have far more MPs than necessary. If Harper or Baker or Brady were to inform Number Ten that the letters are pouring in and the threshold is about to be met, I sure Johnson would be prepared to bow to any demands. Boris might like to compare himself to Churchill, but that’s mere fantasy.

377380 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Steve Hayes, 10, #229 of 1991 🔗

Apart from public sentiment shifting away from lockdown – which I don’t really see happening (lets see what Spring brings), I think the 1922 committee is the main hope.

I think we should apply pressure to our MPs. Demand they demand a get out timetable with ‘actionable metrics’. If Johnson can’t supply it then someone else will. This is more important than his career.

This summer will be the time the govt needs to outline its cost benefit and come up with a pandemic plan (or just retrieve the last one from the bin). We can’t let them say they don’t have time or we’ll be in lockdown by autumn

377392 ▶▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to steve_w, 7, #230 of 1991 🔗

It’s a very rational comment, Steve. But you could have written it word for word last Spring. It’s rinse and repeat.

We know the regime can spin out hope and piss away a year easily.

377410 ▶▶▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Ovis, 4, #231 of 1991 🔗

yes, I think I did write it last spring! This is the problem. I expect I also wrote ‘with the coming of summer, the infection in retreat, people will demand an end to the restrictions and a promise it wont happen again’ etc. and yet here we are

but still, the same solutions apply then as now. have a proper, rational pandemic plan – the one they binned was fine

377381 ▶▶▶ Ovis, replying to Steve Hayes, 2, #232 of 1991 🔗

That depends on level of support for axing Bojo. If he’s feeling confident then he faces them down, and the eventual vote to remove him collapses below the number who sent letters. Bojo triumphant, and safe for a full year.

377470 ▶▶▶▶ Sceptical Steve, replying to Ovis, 1, #233 of 1991 🔗

I commented above that I see the most likely mechanism for BoJo’s downfall will be unrelated to Covid. The end will come once the Tory party acknowledges just how toxic he has become north of the border. (Now that the Brexit arguments are over, I expect Ruth Davidson to make a comeback into front line politics, but Johnson would have to go first.)

377824 ▶▶▶ Jez Hewitt, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #234 of 1991 🔗

I foresee Johnson’s reign being commemorated with novelty toilets in his deserving image. Nightclubs and bars may go one further and dedicate their urinals etc to the whole cabinet and SAGE.

I’ve yet to figure out where POTUS will put the one we send him/her/they.

377867 ▶▶▶▶ Jinks, replying to Jez Hewitt, 1, #235 of 1991 🔗

the very idea of shitting on that man’s face, is disturbing and satisfying in equal measure.

378011 ▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Steve Hayes, #236 of 1991 🔗

They are one set of clowns and muppets to love to hate.
The course will be held by hook and by crook, to bring the herd ‘safely’ under control. Churchill practiced his vanity for mirrors before working the crowd. Boris is no less groomed but to work todays crowd. The projection of image required for political manipulation in our times is profiled and targeted to the psychological manipulations of the times.

377987 ▶▶ Binra, replying to steve_w, 1, #237 of 1991 🔗

Amazing how wars can be made to serve so many world and mind shaping functions.

This is also a war but along lines that most cannot recognise – but then nor were the conventional wars what was mainstreamed to the fodder.

All wars are bankers wars.
You can also say that with financial backing no war can sustain itself.
This covid or climate or cancel war is backed by huge financial interests.
It doesn’t destroy their ‘economy’ but consolidates more to their possession and control.

378324 ▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Binra, 1, #238 of 1991 🔗

The advantage of war for the banksters is that it allows them some control over the timing of the destruction, sufficient for them to preserve theirs at the expense of everyone else. Then it is simply a matter of selling to both sides.

378609 ▶▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Ken Garoo, #239 of 1991 🔗

And to shape the post war world….
War bankrupts nations. Not Banks and their invested tentacles of influence.

378317 ▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to steve_w, #240 of 1991 🔗

“They are winging it”.

Of course they are. That is one of the reasons for the use of the 1984 Health Act. Providing the situation is assessed every 3-4 weeks, they can go on forever as long as the come up with some bs that satisfies ‘significant and imminent threat’ part of the legislation.

377360 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 22, #241 of 1991 🔗

With project management there is view that you need a range of personality types, operating in balance to develop and complete a project. One theory puts forward 9 key personality types that you need on a complex project, like UK coronavirus response. Management theory is both annoying and useful in equal measure but please bear with me!

I looked at the Remit for the SAGE group who are a major player in this hoo-haa;
The Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (SAGE) provides scientific and technical advice to support government decision makers during emergencies.

So SAGE might make up 1 or 2 of the personality types you need on this project but where are the rest? who are the Government Decision makers? who is the completer/finisher? who is the free thinker? who is the people oriented coordinator? To my mind this whole pantomime now looks like a classic case study in failed project management with no apparent ability or idea of how to bring the project to a satisfactory conclusion.

377366 ▶▶ WasSteph, replying to Steve Martindale, 18, #242 of 1991 🔗

And they missed what we all, in project management, know is an option that should always be considered – do nothing. Save your blood and treasure and consider would you be any worse off at the end? This government was severely infected by the must-be-seen-to-be-doing-something bug and has catastrophically failed. They won’t ever let go now though as their arses are truly on the line. Much worse than wasting a few billion on a failed IT project, they have actually killed people.

377368 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to WasSteph, 5, #243 of 1991 🔗

Their arses ARE on the line. And their necks.

377377 ▶▶▶▶ TheClone, replying to Nick Rose, 2, #244 of 1991 🔗

I don’t think so – they are untouchable!

377387 ▶▶▶▶▶ Annie, replying to TheClone, 3, #245 of 1991 🔗

Not for long.

377374 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to WasSteph, 6, #246 of 1991 🔗

yes. they should have done nothing until the cost/benefit had been made

I accept the case they didn’t have time in March because they panicked and needed to flatten the curve or whatever. But straight after that they should have put every effort into the cost benefit analysis. I suspect (eat out to help out) they thought it was done and dusted

377611 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to steve_w, 3, #247 of 1991 🔗

I accept the case they didn’t have time in March

They were informed about the virus at the beginning of January 2020 by the World Health Organisation. They decided not to secure the borders, ie, to import the virus.

377393 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to WasSteph, #248 of 1991 🔗

They are just good little puppets.

378619 ▶▶▶ Binra, replying to WasSteph, #249 of 1991 🔗

Seeing as the core ‘nudge’ is to ACT NOW OR ELSE! I don’t think they were ever managing any other other project. But there will be useful idiots who are used as fronts and puppets, who only need to know what their ‘profiled personality’ wants to know.

377372 ▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to Steve Martindale, 13, #250 of 1991 🔗

It’s interesting that you do see a mix of personality types on lockdown skeptics, and that is what makes the discussions useful.

There are the free thinkers, who don’t want to look at the data analyses at all but can see past the Government propaganda and official explanations, and engage readily with different ideas.

And they get helped out by those doing the data analyses who can show that alternate ideas are in fact the reality on proper analysis.

377581 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Steve Martindale, 12, #251 of 1991 🔗

who is this fucking sage anyway? I don’t remember anyone voting for them. they can all fuck off

377587 ▶▶ Bungle, replying to Steve Martindale, 1, #252 of 1991 🔗

You are probably referring to Belbin’s Team Role Theory which recognises 9 separate roles, 3 Cerebral, 3 Action and 3 People. These roles relate to behaviours, not personality.

378041 ▶▶▶ Binra, replying to Bungle, 1, #253 of 1991 🔗

Well the gist is that different people offer different perspectives that grow a consciousness greater than the sum of its parts.
I’m sure there are innumerable theories to invoke for anything. If it serves you well why not use it.

I see a reintegrative or healing process to a fragmentation and incoherence that has become ‘normalised’ as behavioural response to its own self-conditioning action and reaction. Willingness to see the same situation with new eyes, is the release of the persistence of what is recognised to not only not work, and never work, but actively undermine or prevent anything truly working – except as a persistence of the habit to its logical conclusion.

In the sense I am using workability, it is unarguable, that is to say one can choose not to accept or see destruction, but the fact operates regardless.
The capacity to see destruction as a means of creation as a private agenda set over reality, is the dissociating or fragmenting lure of power to a sense of self-lack running a hole in place of wholeness.

378327 ▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #254 of 1991 🔗

The prime requirement for getting to the top in Western governments is amenablitity to being bought and committment to staying bought. Epitomised by Tory Bliar.

379163 ▶▶ Cranmer, replying to Steve Martindale, #255 of 1991 🔗

Thanks for raising this – I have been thinking this myself because IIRC the British in WW2 had a sort of ‘devil’s advocate’ group which pointed out all the flaws in British planning and tactics. Germany by contrast did not have one because it was taboo for Germans to admit their plans might be wrong or flawed. I wonder if the British government has such a group for the Great War on Covid? I highly doubt it.

377361 PastImperfect, 9, #256 of 1991 🔗

Dolores Cahill on vaccines (15 mins)

Interview with Prof. Dolores Cahill – YouTube

377363 CivilianNotCovidian, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 63, #257 of 1991 🔗

Message for the reader with a mother in hospital…. GO to the hospital and INSIST on seeing your mother. Do not take no for an answer. No matter what they say, keep saying, “I want to see my mother!” Just keep saying it. Don’t argue with them. Just plead. I had to do this when a loved one was in hospital. Just do it. It is inhumane, a breach of human rights and unspeakably cruel not to let you see your mother. She has a right to have someone advocate for her. You may need to get her discharged and taken to a different hospital. I had to do that, too. It was very dramatic but – potentially – life saving. Don’t back down. My heart is breaking for you!

377397 ▶▶ Paulus, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 16, #258 of 1991 🔗

Having worked closely with elderly people in hospital I have seen more than enough poor care and the devaluing of our most vulnerable. The fact these issues have occurred when families were involved and visiting caused me to consider what it was like for people with no one to advocate for them. Fully concur with civilians post.

377409 ▶▶ stewart, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 38, #259 of 1991 🔗

OF COURSE they don’t want relatives in there poking around. If you’re not there, their work is far less scrutinised.

I hate the NHS and I hate the spineless self-serving people working in there.

The NHS workers coming out are minute in number. The majority are happy with the reduced workload (for most of them), the reduced scrutiny. The ones that aren’t and are quiet are just spineless. I don’t see too many of them coming out complaining about the horrific ads.

1.5 million employees. 200 billion pound budget. Can’t deal with a few thousand extra patients.

Screw them all.

377871 ▶▶▶ ElizaP, replying to stewart, 4, #260 of 1991 🔗

Well the thought has certainly crossed my mind that there would be advantages to the NHS going down the swanee – given there are so many Lockdown Zealots/wimps working for them. Then we have a much bigger private sector/cheaper private health care insurance – and they remember that “He/she that pays the piper calls the tune”. Of course we are all paying for the NHS anyway – but because it’s not coming directly from us personally – many NHS employees forget that “we pay – so we say”. But if we were paying directly – they would have to darn well remember that they are OUR employees and do as we require.

378352 ▶▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to ElizaP, 2, #261 of 1991 🔗

The intent is to convert to NHS to a (highly profitable) US-style system, which costs nearly 3 times the OECD average per person for a worse outcome (extremely wealthy excluded). It is a bureaucratic nightmare that makes the NHS seem quite rational.

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We already have the £54,000 a year diversity manager and the £41,000 a year doctor.

377597 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 14, #262 of 1991 🔗

My brother got taken in last night with a bleed on the brain and had surgery. No visitors allowed. He’s all alone.

377939 ▶▶▶ Hellonearth, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 5, #263 of 1991 🔗

This is simply heartless and cruel. I hope your brother recovers soon and can leave his prison and get home.

378484 ▶▶▶ fiery, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 3, #264 of 1991 🔗

Sorry to hear about your brother and hope he recovers soon.

377694 ▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 9, #265 of 1991 🔗

Disregard for the elderly and their families is nothing new. My mother was taken to hospital with sepsis six years ago when she was 89 and wasn’t expected to survive. The doctor who dealt with her told us to disregard visiting hours and visit whenever, and for as long as, we wanted. The visiting time bell went at the first visit and the nurses told my brother and me that we had to leave. We explained what the doctor had said and received tuts and frowns in response, completely uncaring about our mother’s precarious state of health. Thereafter they used to scowl at us at every visit … as we could well see how little they contributed to the wellbeing of their patients. In spite of the hospital’s very concerted efforts to finish her off, mother lived for another five years.

My 88 year old FIL was taken to hospital in central London about 15 months ago for a precautionary check up following a fall at home. His wife couldn’t accompany him to hospital as it was the middle of the night and she has her own mobility problems. The paramedics promised that the hospital would keep her informed of progress etc. After two days she had heard nothing and phoned the hospital switchboard. They put her through to the ward he was recorded to be on. The ward denied he was there and put her on to another number. Eventually she ended up talking to the original ward where they did ‘find’ him after all.

They were keeping him in because there were concerns about his blood pressure medication. After ten days of chasing up the hospital for daily updates, MIL managed to visit with one of her sons. The ward nurses looked extremely taken aback as they “didn’t realise he had a wife”. [They] “thought he lived on his own.” Presumably no one thought to ask him about family. I should add that he does not suffer from dementia. I think if they had bothered to find out, or have better ward communications, he would have been allowed home after 24 hours and simply advised to see his GP.

377364 Lockdown Sceptic, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 12, #266 of 1991 🔗

Winter of Discontent: Brits Face Power Rationing as Wind Power Output Collapses (again and again)
by stopthesethings

Brits expecting their thousands of wind turbines to deliver the goods this winter have been disappointed, yet again. While Boris Johnson peddles his delusional plan to run the UK entirely on breezes and bluster, the typical (and wholly expected) collapse in wind power output across Britain this winter provides a taste of things to come. […]

377367 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Lockdown Sceptic, 6, #267 of 1991 🔗

If you don’t have your own solar panels, buy a diesel generator. If everybody did this, the government would crap it.

377395 ▶▶▶ sophie123, replying to Nick Rose, 6, #268 of 1991 🔗

I already did, last April
I have no confidence in anything anymore

377369 PatrickF, replying to PatrickF, 29, #269 of 1991 🔗

Dear children,

(Those of you who managed to learn how to read and write)

Goodbye to the happiest days of your lives.

School’s out for summer. School’s out for ever. School’s been blown to pieces.

377376 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to PatrickF, 4, #270 of 1991 🔗

Dear children, granny screwed up your life for her’s!

377414 ▶▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to TheClone, 24, #271 of 1991 🔗

Dear children, those purporting to represent granny, screwed up your life and hers in the pretence it was protecting hers

377417 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Freecumbria, 11, #272 of 1991 🔗

And all the while, protected their own.

377561 ▶▶▶▶ CGL, replying to Freecumbria, 16, #273 of 1991 🔗

Quite – I don’t recall Granny being asked if she wanted this

377572 ▶▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Freecumbria, 3, #274 of 1991 🔗

more like it

377569 ▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to TheClone, 10, #275 of 1991 🔗

don’t scapegoat the grannies, they had nothing to do with this atrocity

377625 ▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to JaneHarry, #276 of 1991 🔗

Didn’t they though?

Are we sure there isn’t a strong correlation between the mean age of a population and lockdown savagery?

Young populations are just getting on with life because thats what those constituencies want.

The places with more late middle aged and older people want to be protected from the killer virus from Wuhan.

377640 ▶▶▶▶▶ bluemoon, replying to stewart, 8, #277 of 1991 🔗

Enough with these generalisations!
I’m so fed up with boomers this, all old people that – just STOP IT.
Stewart – this is not a dig at you personally, don’t be offended.
I’m just another thoroughly pissed off old person.

377920 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mutineer, replying to stewart, 4, #278 of 1991 🔗

In my area there are many young people and teens wearing muzzles. I am retired and refuse to wear one and abhor this tyranny. Many older people agree. The very old with dementia are being used as scapegoats. I certainly don’t want protecting from a flu no worse than many I’ve lived through. The elderly are being murdered.

377524 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to PatrickF, 1, #279 of 1991 🔗

Maybe you can incorporate the last sentence into a song?

377715 ▶▶▶ PatrickF, replying to arfurmo, #280 of 1991 🔗

It could be a hit! 😉

377371 Julian, replying to Julian, 4, #281 of 1991 🔗

A possibly picky point regarding the piece from the doctor:

– Starts out by not pulling any punches about how badly Britain has done mortality-wise.

It depends what one means by badly. I suppose it could support our case in so far as it shows that lockdowns don’t save lives. But I’m uneasy about starting with such a statement, as it seems overly defensive, and implies it would have been possible to “do better”.

377396 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Julian, 13, #282 of 1991 🔗

Should be rephrased as “Start out by not pulling any punches about how remarkably well Britain has done in misattributing deaths from all causes to covid.”

378358 ▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Julian, 1, #283 of 1991 🔗

If the NHS is to be piratised, getting rid of unprofitable chronic cases makes sense (if you are a psychopath).

377373 Laurence, replying to Laurence, 30, #284 of 1991 🔗

The ONS figures monthly figures point to a surprisingly high excess death rate for the month of December 2020 – they say there were 52,676 deaths in December 2020, this was 8,390 more deaths than in December 2019 and 10,594 deaths more than the five-year average (2015 to 2019). It appears they need further investigation.

Well, unless the weekly figures they have published are incorrect, it appears they have used the weekly figures for Christmas week to calculate the monthly figures. They have warned about the accuracy of these figures because of bank holiday reporting, as they include around 5 days’ deaths for the 2015-2019 average, but 6 days for 2020.  Not only that but they have extended these figures over a 9 day period, so the headline level of deaths for the average of 2015-2019 is not comparable to the 2020 figures by around 2,045 deaths. A further effect of this is that they have 4 days at the correct rate at the beginning of December in 2020, compared to one day for the previous years’ average. This makes a further difference of 957. Now adjusting for population size and age (their equivalent is to look at the Age Adjusted Mortality Rate AAMR) you have to increase the prior years’ average by 2502, so the excess deaths in December are 5090 for the whole month, or 1,150 per week.

Now, looking at the under 75s, they represent 15% of the deaths from COVID, or 172 people per week.

So the government on 4 January locked up about 54 million people under 75 in England and Wales, including stopping children going to school, to prevent 172 deaths which probably won’t be prevented anyway.

Is that proportional ? Is that just ? Is it democratic ? Is it even sane ?

Or is it stupid, ignorant, and a revolting way to treat its citizens in a supposedly democratic country ?

377383 ▶▶ Annie, replying to Laurence, 18, #285 of 1991 🔗

Why are all the people with brains and balls here, and not in government or advising government?

377394 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Annie, 18, #286 of 1991 🔗

Easy. We’re not ‘yes’ people. I didn’t last very long in the corporate world for that very reason. I told the truth and they didn’t like it.

377498 ▶▶▶▶ CivilianNotCovidian, replying to kh1485, 32, #287 of 1991 🔗

Exactly! Just back from a walk and bumped into an old friend who I have always thought of as highly intelligent, compassionate… and centre-left liberal. Started talking about the current situation and I expressed my views about appalling current situation and how lockdowns and masks are unethical and damaging. He says, “but what about all the people dying?” I say, “what about them? Most were very unwell or very old but we’re given a covid test so the government could say they died of covid… what about the fact that all other cause mortality has plummeted? Why are people no longer dying of cancer and pneumonia?” He seemed to think about it and we agreed that Whitty, Vallance, Hancock seem lost upstream without a paddle and making panic policies to save their skins. Then he said, “But the people I really hate are the likes of Laurence Fox and Toby Young. They’re dividing the country. It’s all about them.” I said, “I’ve never liked them in the past, but the most important life lesson I’ve had through this crisis is not to discount what someone is saying just because I don’t like them, or just because I’ve disagreed with most of what they’ve said in the past. I have loudly defended Laurence and Toby against the spiteful journalists trying to smear them, and I will do everything I can to help all the other voices trying to speak truth to power, and will continue to do so. If we don’t have the humility to agree with those we usually dislike and disagree with, and disagree with those we usually like and agree with, we have forfeited our autonomous human minds and we may as well be turned into cyborgs that do the bidding of our leader.”

I think he listened.

Keep talking to people when and where you can. This is all we can do. You change the world one person at a time.

Stay strong. Stay sane.

377405 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Annie, 17, #288 of 1991 🔗

Because we have a tendency to speak the unspeakable and think the unthinkable. Hence why I didn’t last as a teacher, I was perceived to be a malcontent.

378234 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Annie, #289 of 1991 🔗

“We all got balls an’ brains/ But some’s got balls an’ chains”…..Gouldman/Godley/Creme.

377389 ▶▶ steve_w, replying to Laurence, 2, #290 of 1991 🔗

This is the PHE daily all cause mortality. Nothing out of the ordinary until last week in December. But the dates of death come from a model from previous years. ie there might be some misattribution of the actual dates of death – so it might change over subsequent reports

377391 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to steve_w, 1, #291 of 1991 🔗


377399 ▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to Laurence, 5, #292 of 1991 🔗

This is the plot of monthly age standardised mortality (i.e adjusted for population size and age structure) for England for the past 20 years based on ONS data.

This monthly data goes up to December 2020, and I’m guessing that January will take us somewhere around the January 2018 figure (which was the peak for the 2017/2018 flu season). And that is before you adjust in 2021 for all the unnecessary indirect lockdown deaths.

So looks like typical winter seasonal mortality (although a relatively bad one).

Seeing all 20 years on there puts things in context for me

377559 ▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Freecumbria, 6, #293 of 1991 🔗

the plan is that as the ‘all-cause mortality’ numbers do actually start to go up, and the age of the dying comes down, on account of the lockdown deaths [untreated cancers, suicides, obesity related diseases, general immunosuppression, etc, etc,] and the vaccine deaths [don’t get me started] the well-primed population will have their hysteria whipped up to new and terrifying levels – this is the mutation of the Deadly Killer Lurgy, this is the work of all those evil ‘covid deniers’ who are refusing to get vaccinated….. so drearily predictable, why can so few see through it?

377734 ▶▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Freecumbria, 1, #294 of 1991 🔗

If my memory serves me correctly the highest number of weekly deaths from all causes in January 2018 was 15,050.

The highest weekly figure this year so far (England and Wales) was 17,750. The next weekly figure I’m sure will be higher. So I think this winter’s spike could be more in line with 2002.

Please keep us informed. It is a very useful graph.

377400 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Laurence, 20, #295 of 1991 🔗

Every time I hear the term excess deaths I want to scream.

This is just another manipulation of language and statistics.

Excess deaths, until this nightmare we are now living, was used to visualise the pattern of mortality to see when it was happening, when the seasonal diseases were coming, not as a measure of what an acceptable level of death is.

It is now used as “too many deaths” or “more deaths than we should have” which creates this completely. false notion that there is a correct amount of death.

It’s just more shit on the shit pile that we are standing in and it’s now just under the chin, about to choke us.

377426 ▶▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to stewart, 13, #296 of 1991 🔗

Absolutely, in my view the only time that deaths were such as to necessitate drastic Government action was back in April/May 2020 when deaths rates more than doubled in some weeks and nobody quite knew what was going on. However, as pointed out in today’s newsletter above, things are never as temporary as intended and here we are today still taking Government action on deaths as if the Government should be expected to micro-manage the death rate.

The Government’s role is to step in and avert a crisis, you could ague that last April/May there was a crisis and the Government stepped in (I will leave others to judge whether in fact they averted the crisis?). Since June 2020, by my analysis, there has not been a crisis and no need for dramatic Government intervention. Certainly no crisis with regards to deaths, maybe a crisis, of sorts’ with the NHS but if they had put some effort into developing HCQ and Ivermectin treatments that could probably have been averted.

Anyway, at present there is no crisis, no need for dramatic Government interventions and it is time for Big Government to get off our backs.
I never thought it would be a Conservative government that oversaw the biggest increase in BIG Government in my lifetime.

377441 ▶▶▶ mhcp, replying to stewart, 11, #297 of 1991 🔗

But that’s precisely how it is also powerful. If 73,000 UK deaths in Jan 2018 are acceptable how come thr 47,000 odd were not during the first installment of Covid Mania?

It’s because of the “belief” that if we didn’t do anything it would be MUCH WORSE.

It’s pure Tiger Horn Theory.

377649 ▶▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to stewart, 4, #298 of 1991 🔗

And any rise above a five or ten year ‘baseline’ in 2020/21 is usually greeted with a sharp intake of breath by lockdown advocates. They overlook the fact that the comparable ‘baselines’ are usually averages which by their nature are based on constituent statistics with peaks and troughs.

378375 ▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to Laurence, #299 of 1991 🔗

I’m sure I saw a recent UK all cause mortality data set, with a graph showing the data and long term average. I was totally surprised to find that the death figures reported were modelled figures, not actual deaths. I will have to check to see if can find the document again.

377375 TheClone, replying to TheClone, 8, #300 of 1991 🔗

The new normal – indefinite lockdowns imposed by spineless government!

377491 ▶▶ Sceptical Steve, replying to TheClone, 1, #301 of 1991 🔗

I sense it should read “indefinite lockdowns imposed by spineless government s !” One of the most obvious challenges in getting our leaders to change direction is that almost everywhere else is locked into the same delusions as our lot.

377379 stewart, 10, #302 of 1991 🔗

Of all the depressing items on this morning’s new. letter, the one about the hotel. quarantines is by far the most depressing.

It’s bedrock of the zero-covid strategy. It’s coming.

And I can’t help concluding 2 things.

  1. It’s partly. an economic decision. More Brits generally travel overseas than vice versa. Keeping them in Britain this year will help boost the economy – or so the logic goes these days of not really believing in an open commercial world except for goods.
  2. A bi-polar world is in the making, split into zero-covid and non-zero covid countries. I imagine the idea will be to create travel areas that include the zero-covids. They know this thing is never going away, the vaccines won’t do much and we’re going to have permanent suppression measures, rather than accept the risk

This is all crazy speculation on my part, but this is what I’m seeing.

377386 PastImperfect, #303 of 1991 🔗
377403 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 19, #304 of 1991 🔗

Well done to those psychologists speaking out although I think its a case of too little too late.

They allowed the likes of Susan Mitchie to dictate government policy of frightening the populace and perpetuating large scale Munchausen Syndrome by Proxy. There will be hell to pay when this is over as their profession will be swamped by people needing their help after developing psychological disorders as a result of their fearmongering.

I have long distrusted psychologists and Never Again will I support them or their work.

They need a clear out when this is over and a Code of Ethics by which all psychologists should subscribe too. And also to strip the likes of Mitchie their doctorates and right to practise.

377421 ▶▶ peter-, replying to Bart Simpson, 10, #305 of 1991 🔗

In the specific case of Susan Michie she is a card carrying member of the Communist Party. Whoever allowed someone with such warped and dangerous political views to advise a “Conservative” Government should be strung up next to her.

377445 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to peter-, 5, #306 of 1991 🔗

Exactly. Tower Hill should be revived especially for that purpose.

And reopen the Tower of London as a prison.

377489 ▶▶▶▶ peter-, replying to Bart Simpson, 15, #307 of 1991 🔗

I’d be more in favour of just dropping these people in random pubs on tough council estates at 10:45 on Friday nights. Hancock wouldn’t have to come up with any fake tears then. And can you imagine Ferguson trying to model his way out of a Moss Side flat roof. Warms the heart thinking of such things.

377584 ▶▶▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to peter-, 1, #308 of 1991 🔗

More like they will get beaten up by the locals in those areas.

377602 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ peter-, replying to Bart Simpson, 5, #309 of 1991 🔗

Would be thoroughly enjoyable to watch.

378063 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to peter-, 2, #310 of 1991 🔗

The Communist Party of Britain to be precise: far-left politics has been long been riven with factionalism, as brilliantly satirized in Monty Python’s Life of Brian .

377430 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #311 of 1991 🔗

There will be plenty of work for the prisons

377411 Ewan Duffy, replying to Ewan Duffy, 10, #312 of 1991 🔗


Headline: In this seemingly endless lockdown, will we finally run out of TV?
Good old Grauniad – focusing on the important issue relating to lockdown #facepalm

377449 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Ewan Duffy, 8, #313 of 1991 🔗

It’s the Graun’s version of “let them eat cake”

Nothing about soaring unemployment, bankruptcies, domestic violence, untreated illnesses, substance abuse, mental health issues. Instead it’s all about TV.

You couldn’t make this up.

377420 Lydia, replying to Lydia, 56, #314 of 1991 🔗

My son, 12 years old, said to me the other day “what’s the point” “we can’t do anything, nothing to look forward too”
He isn’t interested in anything other than gaming. He used to be so active with his sports and I fear that he won’t want to do anything again.

377427 ▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Lydia, 20, #315 of 1991 🔗

Yes, zoom classes are no good, but the lack of sport and recreation is another huge problem for youngsters. I wouldn’t be the person I am today if I hadn’t played school/club rugby and cricket.

The next generation is going to be really unbalanced if this continues.

377433 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 6, #316 of 1991 🔗

They will be so unbalanced they’ll end up like SAGE

377450 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to steve_w, 1, #317 of 1991 🔗

A terrifying thought!

377439 ▶▶▶ Lydia, replying to Lockdown_Lunacy, 8, #318 of 1991 🔗

They are no good. You can’t achieve any kind of decent learning via zoom. The teacher is always asking the children to make sure they’re on mute, kids don’t pay attention as well as they do in lesson.
Sports is good for children’s mental health as well as their physical health.

377458 ▶▶▶▶ Lockdown_Lunacy, replying to Lydia, 3, #319 of 1991 🔗

Yeah absolutely. I think sport is character building, helps build self confidence, discipline, team work and much more. For the non sporty kids other extra curricular things like debating clubs, drama clubs etc can help do the same thing.

The future is going to be grim if this zoom school idea takes hold.

377476 ▶▶▶▶ Just about sane, replying to Lydia, 7, #320 of 1991 🔗

Your son has zoom lessons? My 12 year old grandson has me and I’m feeling more incompetent every day I pick him up as he has the same thought as your son. My grandson has had one weeks worth of work sent by email to his dad. He had to push for that or he would be forgotten about.
I’m spending more time passing emails to my son for him to pass to the assistant head teacher asking for work.

Sport as well as being physically and mentally good for the body, I notice my grandson smiling and communicating more when kicking a ball about with his friends.

377455 ▶▶ Janette, replying to Lydia, 15, #321 of 1991 🔗

Oh that’s awful I feel like crying. I just can’t believe the government are doing this to our children.

377469 ▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Janette, 2, #322 of 1991 🔗

Believe it! Its happening! 😱

377471 ▶▶ Annie, replying to Lydia, 2, #323 of 1991 🔗

Get him to write to your MP.

377566 ▶▶▶ Lydia, replying to Annie, 3, #324 of 1991 🔗

My MP is useless and I do not want to engage with him anymore. He does not listen to people who are struggling, he only cares about getting free parking for his constituents.

377487 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Lydia, 24, #325 of 1991 🔗

the same with my nephew (13) – he used to be an outgoing boy, loads of friends, a footballer, very promising academically – now he has been sucked into a virtual world on a screen; he sleeps most of they day and spends the night gaming. I don’t think he’s untypical, and in fact I think there are probably many children in a far worse position than his- for example my sister’s neighbours: a young couple who spend the day stoned. they have 3 children under 10 who now with no school, no structure to their day, are left to their own devices, to fend for themselves as best they can. It is evil what they are doing. I don’t think they really envisage any future at all for this generation of young people – they are counting on them committing suicide at some point, or dying of obesity. I am so angry at what I see is going on, I want to stand those responsible up against a wall and just shoot them.

377621 ▶▶ Sodastream, replying to Lydia, 7, #326 of 1991 🔗

My nearly 12 yr old the same as is his 9 year old brother. No kickboxing no football no swimming etc etc. We do still see family and any friends that will meet which helps. He’s putting on weight it’s sickening what they’re doing to the children.

377660 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Lydia, 10, #327 of 1991 🔗

My 7 year old daughter yesterday said she wished she didnt exist, wtf! Made me so angry. She has lost all her interaction.

377845 ▶▶ JulieR, replying to Lydia, 5, #328 of 1991 🔗

I was also thinking about elite young sport people. My daughter’s friend is an elite swimmer. She has not been to a swimming pool for months. But in Russia sport clubs for young elite sportmen never closed. Now all sport and art clubs are opened in Russia.
So Russian children will be ahead of British children in sport.

377422 Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 71, #329 of 1991 🔗

Great picture on the front of today’s Times. A solitary police car in a sea of people sticking two fingers up to the “stay at home” message.

I wonder how many of them were questioned as to how far they’d travelled, or asked if they were locals? How many were told to maintain strict social distancing? I’d imagine next to none, because the authorities cannot cope with such numbers. This is an important lesson to take forward.

377428 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Scotty87, 30, #330 of 1991 🔗

Save for the rozzer truck, that looks like a Lowry.

377777 ▶▶▶ mj, replying to kh1485, 6, #331 of 1991 🔗

and with the rozzer truck it looks like an Hieronymus Bosch

378065 ▶▶▶▶ Jez Hewitt, replying to mj, 3, #332 of 1991 🔗

Or a Banksy.

377846 ▶▶ Ned of the Hills, replying to Scotty87, 1, #333 of 1991 🔗

The “Today” programme today concluded with the joyous sound of children playing in the snow! What were they thinking of!?

But the Today was a bit off piste today altogether (pardon the pun). Going on about how the lockdown was badly effecting children.

377926 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Scotty87, 1, #334 of 1991 🔗

WTF is that cop van doing there?

377424 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 42, #335 of 1991 🔗

95% of the people support the government

92% of the people support the restrictions

94% of the people would welcome further restrictions

East German Poll 1988

377466 ▶▶ Annie, replying to Cecil B, 6, #336 of 1991 🔗

Excellent comparison.

377928 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Cecil B, 2, #337 of 1991 🔗

9 out 10 people love their slavery. Fact

377425 Bella Donna, -1, #338 of 1991 🔗
377429 Amber1, replying to Amber1, 29, #339 of 1991 🔗

Should we start reminding people of all the occasions authorities tried to silence and denigrate people for having an opposing viewpoint? I’m thinking of wmd, Hillsborough, grooming gangs, NHS scandals, Jimmy Saville, I’m sure there are others. In all these cases those being silence were proven to be correct. Silencing opposing views to the authorities one is never in the public interest.

377493 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to Amber1, 6, #340 of 1991 🔗

The Hillsborough conclusions in the end were not justice, leading to a good man getting a conviction for doing his job on 1989 safety recommendations. I was there and saw with my own eyes what happened outside that ground. Yes the Police made some catastrophic decisions on the day that cost lives but don’t think they were not under enormous pressure to open the exit gates.

378168 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to nottingham69, #341 of 1991 🔗

As a scouser, I agree. The self-righteous thirst for vengeance of some parties will only- possibly- be sated when David Duckenfield is exhumed from his grave and his head displayed on a pole atop the Liver Building. The cover-up was disgraceful, and in my view partially continues, but the decades-long harrying of Duckenfield reflects no credit on anyone. I haven’t lived in Liverpool for 29 years and am in no hurry ever to go back.

377653 ▶▶ JayBee, replying to Amber1, 1, #342 of 1991 🔗

It’s only ever been the truth that was forbidden…

377432 ituex, replying to ituex, 42, #343 of 1991 🔗

The quarantine ‘hotels’ are terrifying me. My daughter is a student in the US, there are hundreds of British young people there, mostly on sports scholarships, as she is. The idea of her being locked up if she tries to come home is so dreadful, I can’t stop shaking. At university they are masked every waking hour, even during sport, athletes are tested every week, need to be tested before getting on plane. What on earth is the point of then locking them up? They have no option but to go back and forward.
I realise this will seem trivial to many people but I am genuinely desperate.
My MP is a zealot despite the fact that he is a practicing Psychiatrist which to me is unbelievable. I don’t know who to turn to, if anyone can think of who else I can write to I would at least feel I was doing something.

377463 ▶▶ Annie, replying to ituex, 11, #344 of 1991 🔗

The last thing this is, is trivial.
I can inly pray for you and for your daughter.

377474 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to Annie, 3, #345 of 1991 🔗

Thank you. I am beside myself.

377464 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to ituex, 6, #346 of 1991 🔗

It is unconstitutional. Is it time for a class action lawsuit in the UK?

377465 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to ituex, 13, #347 of 1991 🔗

what would worry me is the money – where are ordinary people supposed to find the means to pay for their 2 week imprisonment at an airport hotel? I wish I could reassure you, but unfortunately I think this is just a foretaste – sooner or later we will ALL end up in the gulag. Anyone who can get out should go – Tanzania. I would say Belarus, but that is likely to be targeted by the gangsters in the whitehouse for a regime change operation

377478 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to JaneHarry, 5, #348 of 1991 🔗

I know. At least with a holiday you have a choice whether to go or not. These young people are already abroad and stuck. Many take up these scholarships who couldn’t afford a US or UK university education otherwise.

377485 ▶▶▶ stewart, replying to JaneHarry, 5, #349 of 1991 🔗

They don’t. The whole premise of the thing is that people don’t leave Britain.

377578 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to JaneHarry, 4, #350 of 1991 🔗

I suspect Russia would not take kindly to a regime change operation by the US in Belarus.

377648 ▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to JaneHarry, 2, #351 of 1991 🔗

That’s exactly the point of that policy: that ordinary people stay put.

377852 ▶▶▶ JulieR, replying to JaneHarry, 2, #352 of 1991 🔗

I checked Belarus. The British have to arrive with negative test and quarantine for 10 days on arrival. Not good.

377468 ▶▶ swedenborg, replying to ituex, 8, #353 of 1991 🔗

But thousands of truckdriver will passing through every day.This is not an Australian solution. Can they really consider this? If they do it would be devastating.

377534 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to ituex, 15, #354 of 1991 🔗

I can understand that this is a frightening development for you. I’m very sorry you’re feeling so bad.
Realistically, even if the govt does try to enforce quarantine in this way, it surely could not last for long. It would destroy significant sectors of the economy. And as Swedenborg points out, truck drivers would have to be exempted: so right from the start, there would be gross inconsistencies that would be easy to see. A problem for us here with lockdown is that plenty of people are enjoying it, so the pressure to abandon it is too little. On the other hand, people in this country love travel; middle-class people, working-class people – most people. I just don’t see such a policy surviving for very long.

377650 ▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to Alethea, 2, #355 of 1991 🔗

30 years in the GDR…

377728 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to Alethea, 1, #356 of 1991 🔗

That’s what my husband says but the government is not made up of reasonable normal people unfortunately. It won’t apply to them.

378071 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to Alethea, 1, #357 of 1991 🔗

Why wasn’t hotel quarantine introduced during the first wave? Was it because of the whole truck driver thing, or was it down to a desire to appease the wealthy “jet set”?

378169 ▶▶▶ penelope pitstop, replying to Alethea, #358 of 1991 🔗

it wouldn’t be just truck drivers exempted but also other identified exemptions eg government, politicians, ‘important’ business people etc etc.
Look forward to the G7 cohort staying in the Travelodge in June before making their way to cornwall for their pow wow!!

377435 NickR, replying to NickR, 7, #359 of 1991 🔗

Can you spot a step change in positive tests reducing as a consequence of the lockdowns?
Can you see a step change from the ‘Kent variant’?

377440 ▶▶ PFD, replying to NickR, 4, #360 of 1991 🔗

In addition there is now the very interesting paper by Aukema et al. referred to by Swedenborg yesterday which applies a Bayesian statistics approach to published data and shows for example, that on January 11th of the 50,000 plus reported positive results it is likely that 68% of these are false positives!

377483 ▶▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to PFD, 1, #361 of 1991 🔗

Thanks. I only want to point out that it’s not like a “Bayesian statistics approach” is one option given to scientists that they may or may not want to use…it is literally THE science on this type of probabilities.

377436 LS99, 28, #362 of 1991 🔗

Great tweet on the Nick Cohen thread, linked to above.

“Everyone is a lockdown sceptic. It’s just a question of when.”

377438 steve_w, replying to steve_w, 24, #363 of 1991 🔗

“Gordon Brown: UK could become ‘failed state'”

We became a failed state on 23rd March 2020

377562 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to steve_w, 2, #364 of 1991 🔗

Not a failed state: a fascist state.

377726 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to steve_w, 2, #365 of 1991 🔗

He’s part of the reason if we do go in the way of a “failed” state.

The lack of self-awareness is staggering.

377444 Sarigan (Day 308 of lockdown), replying to Sarigan (Day 308 of lockdown), 19, #366 of 1991 🔗

Not one of these papers say lockdowns have any material effect. It’s a corona virus. Slippery as fuck. We are killing ourselves for nothing and I have had enough. Here is the entirety of the scientific literature.

























377639 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Sarigan (Day 308 of lockdown), 1, #367 of 1991 🔗

thanks for the links

377706 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Sarigan (Day 308 of lockdown), 1, #368 of 1991 🔗


377936 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Sarigan (Day 308 of lockdown), 1, #369 of 1991 🔗

Good job.

377451 Scotty87, replying to Scotty87, 46, #370 of 1991 🔗

According to the DT, the ever-shifting “return to normality” is being proposed for the end of summer, no doubt to allow 99.9% of bedwetters to get their jabs.

So naturally, we’ll get a few weeks of “freedom” until late autumn, when mass testing kicks in again, “cases” start to rise and lockdowns begin as the usual suspects start shrieking hysterically about the utterly hopeless NHS.

It’s already set in stone that this will happen even if everybody follows the rules, so what the hell’s the point?

377461 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Scotty87, 8, #371 of 1991 🔗

no point at all, Scotty. Resist!

377516 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Scotty87, 3, #372 of 1991 🔗

Entirely predictable isn’t it.

377763 ▶▶ Pebbles, replying to Scotty87, 1, #373 of 1991 🔗

There’s no point. They are psychopaths. Say NO. RESIST. Stand firm. Push back.

377452 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 33, #374 of 1991 🔗

By coincidence, I’m translating (professionally) some work about the reaction to the appearance of syphilis in Europe around 1500. A discussion of writings by the “experts” of the day – clergymen, physicians, humoralists, Humanists and especially astrologers and iatroastrologers. It’s easy (or it was easy) to scoff at the ignorance of such writings. But in important respects, nothing has changed. The avalanche of rubbish, moral and pseudomedical, talked about syphilis in those years now reads eerily like the avalanche of rubbish talked about Covid. Then as now, everything was driven by fear of death, moral panic and the instinct to scapegoat. Some of these writers were trying to make a quick fortune in the marketplace advertising quack remedies. Most were thoughtful, intelligent people who were just completely out of their depth and didn’t want to sound as though they didn’t know what they were talking about.

There’s even a woodcut of the Christ child, in the lap of the Virgin Mary, dispensing a miracle cure to two women with syphilitic rashes, one dressed respectably, the other a prostitute. All it needs is the caption “ANYONE CAN GET IT. ANYONE CAN SPREAD IT.”

I’m extremely tired and low today, so I’m not finding it a particularly pleasant day’s work. But it is interesting, how little we learn and how little we change.

377459 ▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 5, #375 of 1991 🔗

What a very interesting and different post. Thank you.

377462 ▶▶ Annie, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 5, #376 of 1991 🔗

So they all got the clap.
I’m sure that helped.

377480 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Annie, 12, #377 of 1991 🔗

We’ve made progress. The clap now only appears at 8pm each Thursday

377505 ▶▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Cecil B, 6, #378 of 1991 🔗

But the January clap has gone quiet.

377538 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to thinkaboutit, 6, #379 of 1991 🔗

Beware the Kentish Clap.

378082 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Jez Hewitt, replying to Nigel Sherratt, 2, #380 of 1991 🔗

Small mercies, at least the Brazilian Clap will be more astheticly pleasing.

377560 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 12, #381 of 1991 🔗

In 1347 a novel disease arrived in Europe. People died agonising deaths in massive numbers. In some populations the death rate was more than ninety percent. Over the whole of Europe, the death rate was between forty and sixty percent. There was no known treatment or method of prevention. Fear and panic were widespread.

The king of France called upon the continent’s finest experts to study the disease and come up with recommendations for the well being of the people. After much serious study the experts found that washing, especially bathing, made one susceptible to the disease. They, therefore, advised that no one wash. As a result, for centuries the people of Europe avoided washing like the plague.

It is easy with hindsight to see that this was counter-productive. But when people come to look at the current situation with hindsight, they will doubtless find it just as easy to see how obviously counter-productive is the advice of the contemporary experts.

378073 ▶▶▶ GCarty80, replying to Steve Hayes, #382 of 1991 🔗

And I was thinking the infamous filthiness of Renaissance-era Europeans was because we running out of trees to cut down to burn for hot water heating.

(Coal was banned in medieval England at least because of the pollution it caused!)

377472 Ewan Duffy, replying to Ewan Duffy, 13, #383 of 1991 🔗

“The risk of student suicides has quietly stirred many district leaders, leading some, like the State Superintendent in Arizona , to cite that fear in public pleas to help mitigate the virus’ spread.”

If only people did what they were told and stayed at home – students wouldn’t kill themselves. The cognitive dissonance is strong with this one.

377528 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Ewan Duffy, 8, #384 of 1991 🔗

Am I understanding this correctly? If there were more fear and isolation, there would be fewer suicides? Isn’t this the exact opposite of everything we know about risk of suicide?

377473 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 1, #385 of 1991 🔗

The Rapists Dad poses as Kin Jong-un whist meeting party functionaries

The groveling poses of the functionaries show how far that land is down the Marxist rabbit hole

(The villagers have been welded in their houses seeing as you ask)


377481 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to Cecil B, 2, #386 of 1991 🔗

Getting flooded and then the rapists dad turning up. Feel sorry for those Welsh people.

377739 ▶▶ FenTyger, replying to Cecil B, #387 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps riding a horse up Pen y Fan in the snow is next?

377477 james007, replying to james007, 9, #388 of 1991 🔗

Has asymptomatic transmission been proven, or is it another ‘we remain absolutely confident with 55% certainty’ situation?

377482 ▶▶ wendy, replying to james007, 7, #389 of 1991 🔗

Some research studies to say not proven and unlikely.

377502 ▶▶▶ james007, replying to wendy, 1, #390 of 1991 🔗

This is for my complaint to the ASA. Thanks for replies 🙂

377488 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to james007, 12, #391 of 1991 🔗

No it hasn’t been proven. Papers have been published like the “woman spreads it on a plane” when it turned out she was taking flu medication, or the Chinese study that has people scratching their heads.

The main problem is that the chances of it are vanishing small so it technically CAN happen but then a satellite can also fall on your head or your dog can drown you in the bath by accident.

377496 ▶▶ FerdIII, replying to james007, 15, #392 of 1991 🔗

No proof. Use common sense. If you don’t have symptoms how can you spread the flu? If you are not sick or do not have it, how can you spread it? If you have CV 19 do you really think you will be out running a half-marathon? Or would you be more likely to be flat on your back groaning? And when you recover is it sensible that you will be ‘spreading’ it given that your body fought it off and you are again healthy?

Or another view. What about TB, Malaria, Diarrhoea, Dengue, Pneumonic flu etc. Are you spreading those without having symptoms or an illness?

Is that what these morons are saying?

377500 ▶▶ Vir Cotto, replying to james007, 9, #393 of 1991 🔗

I seriously doubt asymptomatic transmission leads to increased chances of others being ill. People WITH symptoms are likely to spread a virus, not those without it. Mainly because the infection would be in their mucus, so not just in coughs and sneezes but in their breath too. These people always have symptoms of some sort – even if it’s just a dizzy light headed feeling as you might get with a cold. In my opinion, if asymptomatic transmission was a thing, then the human race would not be here today.

377521 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to james007, 10, #394 of 1991 🔗

This summer the World Health Organisation said that asymptomatic transmission was “very rare” and went on to say there were no confirmed cases.

377596 ▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to james007, 4, #396 of 1991 🔗
377606 ▶▶ Cheshirecatslave, replying to james007, 1, #397 of 1991 🔗

I believe most respiratory viruses can be transmitted about a day before symptoms appear, it has happened to me once as I caught a nasty virus despite not being with anyone with obvious symptoms. No one in the past cared much about that as most transmission occurs when you are coughing and sneezing and you remember someone who sat behind you in the bus blowing their nose or whatever if you catch a bug.

Also initial symptoms can be so mild you are unaware you caught something until more symptoms develop.

Given people are so judgemental about covid, it would not surprise me if people neglect to mention they had a slight cough or something if interviewed.

377634 ▶▶ gina, replying to james007, 6, #398 of 1991 🔗

Sucharit Bhakdi gives a very clear simple explanation of the improbability of ‘asymptomatic’ transmission in his interviews and where this particular bit of nonsense came from.



377723 ▶▶ FenTyger, replying to james007, #399 of 1991 🔗

See Fauci tell you it does not.

377479 wendy, replying to wendy, 8, #400 of 1991 🔗

I have been thinking about Devi Srivdah and how she presents herself rather than what she has to say. Does anyone else wonder why she does her interviews in skimpy tops, even in winter she is wearing tops which show a lot of her bare flesh. She is a very attractive woman and is very well groomed it is not my way of presenting myself and I don’t feel any jealousy of her. Anyone have any views or am I just looking for things where they don’t exist?

377484 ▶▶ nottingham69, replying to wendy, 5, #401 of 1991 🔗

Easy on the eye, not on the ears.

377503 ▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to wendy, 11, #402 of 1991 🔗

I’m sure Johnson will have noticed the skimpy tops…she is probably next on his list…maybe Ferguson too if she is married!

377515 ▶▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Boris Bullshit, 5, #403 of 1991 🔗

What? the pig dictator is going to shag Ferguson?

377542 ▶▶▶▶ mikewaite, replying to Cecil B, 6, #404 of 1991 🔗

Not improbable. You will recall no doubt that whilst at Oxford he and his mate Dave Cameron were members of a drinking club , where the highlight of their drunken night’s activities was carnal intercourse with a dead pig- or so it was alleged in the newsapers. Anfd this man now leads the country and is loved and admired by virtually every living soul in the nation. To whom is the greater shame – him or us.

377762 ▶▶▶▶ Bill H, replying to Cecil B, 3, #405 of 1991 🔗

Ferguson more likely to be the top there.

377531 ▶▶ Bellero, replying to wendy, 13, #406 of 1991 🔗

She is the most dangerous person in the UK with her 0 Covid policy

377568 ▶▶ Alethea, replying to wendy, 7, #407 of 1991 🔗

When I became an academic, female academics were often rather dowdy; it was a badge of intellectual honour, a sign of imperviousness to the sexualisation of women in mainstream culture. A style tradition that could be traced back to the bluestockings of the 18thC. By signalling that one didn’t care about one’s clothes, one made a claim to academic seriousness and substance.
My younger colleagues feel very differently. There are lots of women in academia now, so the risk of being overlooked or trivialised because of one’s feminine self-presentation is much reduced. Most of the younger women in my dept are rather glamorous.

378147 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Alethea, #408 of 1991 🔗

Difficult to imagine Dorothy Hodgkin or Jocelyn Bell glamming it up for likes, isn’t it?

378139 ▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to wendy, #409 of 1991 🔗

Of course she flirts to camera. Because- and I mean no innuendo- she’s a smart cookie with a pretty face and very sharp elbows, and she knows exactly how to sell herself.

378306 ▶▶ Mark, replying to wendy, #410 of 1991 🔗

I recall on one of the London Calling episodes a few weeks ago Toby Young and James Delingpole talked about “the trap” feminism has set for men of a certain age, iirc, by the combination of making it the norm for young women to wear clothes that manipulatively draw attention to their sexual assets, and simultaneously unacceptable to notice it, if you are an older male, particularly in any position of real or theoretical seniority.

Can’t remember the exact conversation, but it carried some truth I think.

377490 Cecil B, 10, #411 of 1991 🔗

Viva Eindhoven

377494 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 10, #412 of 1991 🔗

They’ve now put road barriers up around the bandstand. What these idiots don’t realise is that people will just sit on the steps!

377499 ▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to kh1485, 15, #413 of 1991 🔗

Take down the barriers! I removed lots of notices last night in my hat and sunglasses and mask….one of the few satisfying things to do at the moment!

377506 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Boris Bullshit, 17, #414 of 1991 🔗

Two problems: a) there are CCTV cameras (you know the ones – they can never detect a burglar, but there’ll be a crysal clear image if I were to do something) and b) I’d be top of the suspect list. Though, we did notice someone had been doing a bit of ‘Annie-ing’ before we got in this morning!

377512 ▶▶▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to kh1485, 6, #415 of 1991 🔗

Good for them….I dont think I am top of any suspect list…I prefer guerilla tactics lol.

377598 ▶▶▶▶ Fiona Walker, replying to kh1485, 3, #416 of 1991 🔗

The cameras are easy, simply do your duty and wear a mask!

377590 ▶▶▶ Sodastream, replying to Boris Bullshit, 12, #417 of 1991 🔗

The council have put large plastic signs round lampposts near all of the school where I live. The usual orders of keeping distance wearing masks etc. One had come loose and one of my children had great pleaseure in jumping up and down on it causing it to crack and smash up! Normally I would have been saying stop stop it’s vandalism. However I didn’t . It still makes me smile now. Small pleasures in life these days.

378000 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Boris Bullshit, 2, #418 of 1991 🔗

I’d say kh should stay a long way away from any such direct action, because she’s already a target and it will give them a pretext to take down a local centre of dissent.

If others in the area were to do so, unconnected to her, that would be different….

378032 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Mark, 2, #419 of 1991 🔗

…and of course any such acts would be highly-regrettable and would be condemned by all right-thinking people, would they not? And none of us would have seen or heard anything when the bizzies come round looking for witnesses- that would also be highly-regrettable. I suspect my regret would be visible from the I.S.S. in Earth-orbit, personally, and I’m sure yours would be too- your regret, that is.

378103 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 1, #420 of 1991 🔗

Indeed. In fact it’s quite likely that anyone accused of such acts might have been elsewhere with us on essential business, at the time of the alleged offences, anyway…

377501 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to kh1485, 15, #421 of 1991 🔗

They’re really angry, aren’t they …

377513 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to kh1485, 10, #422 of 1991 🔗

This is the kind of nonsense I thought they had left back with lockdown version one.

377784 ▶▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #423 of 1991 🔗

Where my parents live in Germany this week stricter measures – retrospectively of course, after cases hit 200/100k last week.

All adults have to wear a mouthnosecovering on playgrounds. At least it is not a medical one.

377526 ▶▶▶ mikewaite, replying to kh1485, 13, #424 of 1991 🔗

When your “journal of lockdown year (s?) “ finally comes out in Kindle it should be a best seller and compensate you for the stress you have been put through .
I look forward to seeing the names and photos of the council jobsworths and absurdly masked police officers fighting for control of a bench in a small country town park. Such a farce , and no doubt all charged up to council taxpayers.

377530 ▶▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to kh1485, 6, #425 of 1991 🔗

It has all the ingredients for a classic Ealing comedy. Except comedy.

377582 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #426 of 1991 🔗

Indeed. The air was pretty blue in the shop earlier,

377698 ▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to kh1485, 1, #427 of 1991 🔗

Stick a sign on the barrier saying “lockdown kills”. Or one of the alternative “look them in the eye” ones.

377702 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to kh1485, 2, #428 of 1991 🔗

That is hilarious – you’re hitting a nerve – well done

Its an excellent advert showing how absurd things are

377942 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to kh1485, #429 of 1991 🔗


377511 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to kh1485, 2, #430 of 1991 🔗

I think they all go home at 5pm

377504 FerdIII, replying to FerdIII, 22, #431 of 1991 🔗

in 10 million. Sweden – better off than the UK. South Dakota – the same. Snowdon, despite his sceptical foundations, is it seems clearly in the former camp. He states explicitly that lockdown “will prevent tens of thousands of people dying this winter”. Leaving aside the veracity of this claim, Snowdon in that one sentence accepts the central argument of the lockdown advocates.

So the Covidiots claim that LDs ‘save lives’. How do they test for that? Where is the ‘control group’ which has no LDs? Belarus? 1000 dead in 10 million. Sweden – better off than the UK. South Dakota – the same. How many dead from LDs in the UK – 40 K or more???

Real world control groups are stating the obvious. LDs kill, they delay all natural virus life cycles, they deny exercise, herd immunity, normal interactions which kill a virus…..it is the opposite of science and common bloody sense.

377509 ▶▶ Boris Bullshit, replying to FerdIII, 5, #432 of 1991 🔗

I always thought Snowden was weak even at the start…there was always something rather ‘fence sitting’ about him.

377507 Victoria, 9, #433 of 1991 🔗

Now why do they need to do another Ivermectin trial in the UK??? WHO already did one – we always follow the WHO slavishly

  • While preliminary evidence seems to suggest Ivermectin can be useful at all stages of SARS-CoV-2 infection, its real strength appears to be as a preventive approach
  • Of 58 health care workers who took ivermectin once a month for four months, only four (6.96%) came down with mild COVID-19 symptoms during the May through August 2020 trial period, compared to 44 of 60 health care workers (26.67%) who declined the medication
  • In August 2020, India’s largest state, Uttar Pradesh, added ivermectin to its recommendations and distributed the drug for home care free of charge. The state of Bihar also started recommending ivermectin, and by the end of 2020, Bihar and Uttar Pradesh had the lowest and second-lowest COVID-19 fatality rates in all of India
  • A WHO-sponsored review suggests ivermectin can reduce COVID-19 mortality by as much as 83%
  • In the U.S., the Frontline COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance is calling for widespread adoption of ivermectin, both as a prophylactic and for the treatment of all phases of COVID-19


377508 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 32, #434 of 1991 🔗

Of the 50,000 fixed penalty notices issued not one has progressed to a contested hearing in a Magistrates Court

Not one in close to 12months

Where have all these cases been disappeared to?

Why is the dictatorship so scared of having what they’ve done tested in the courts?

377545 ▶▶ Vir Cotto, replying to Cecil B, 11, #435 of 1991 🔗

It makes me wonder if they’re scared someone will try to mount a defence by bringing in evidence such as those studies that disprove the effectiveness of lockdowns, disprove the effective of masks/SD etc, and the mountains of evidence against the narrative that is bubbling under the surface of society like a super volcano waiting to explode. All of this could be used to question the very regulations that they’re guilty of violating, could it not? Unless they’re going to do away with due process entirely, naturally… and just turn it into a North Korea style system (or Cardassian from Star Trek) where everyone is guilty no matter what.

377552 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Cecil B, 11, #436 of 1991 🔗

used as scare tactics – too risky for them to take people to court – if judgement against these draconian measures then all will fall apart quickly

377589 ▶▶ gina, replying to Cecil B, 9, #437 of 1991 🔗

Could you say where you found this piece of info – I’m wanting to check it out in my personal battle to continue as normal a life as possible and encourage my kids and friends in theirs. Lots of people I know are not afraid of the virus but they can’t afford to pay an FPN and they’re scared of court action.
I’ve been thinking the ‘punishments’ must be a bluff. My understanding is the courts already have a backlog of 450,000 cases waiting to be heard but think I’ve read of people in court for breaches.
Any further info would be really helpful.Thanks

377682 ▶▶▶ Jinks, replying to gina, 3, #438 of 1991 🔗

if you don’t pay the FPN, a court summons must be sent out within 6 months or else the penalty is null and void.

378087 ▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to Jinks, #439 of 1991 🔗

thanks for the clarification – but was curious about where to find the info on the FPN’s being given but none being contested.

377994 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to gina, 1, #440 of 1991 🔗

I’ve heard exactly the same, Gina. You’d need to check it out yourself, obvs.

377667 ▶▶ TJN, replying to Cecil B, 4, #441 of 1991 🔗

Anyone know what happened about that maskless guy assaulted on the Liverpool train by a transport cop back in July? Had about 5 m youtube views and I recall that the case was due to come to court in January, i.e. now.

378003 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to TJN, 1, #442 of 1991 🔗

Mm, yes, I’d forgotten about that. You could check out the Liverpool Echo online, see if his case gets reported. Somehow I doubt it will. You’ll find there’s very little else in the Echo to detain you- a dreadful, semi-literate rag.

377680 ▶▶ Jinks, replying to Cecil B, 3, #443 of 1991 🔗

If you don’t pay, and a court summons isn’t received within 6 months, the penalty is null and void. I would much rather people wholesale refuse to give their details, to be issued with the fine, and be prepared to be arrested and taken to the magistrates, and take up civil proceedings against the police for assault, battery, illegal detention etc

377514 Fingerache Philip, replying to Fingerache Philip, 25, #444 of 1991 🔗

To every one of the 116 FS’s who upticked my comment about the damm Van Tam man’s statement concerning the vaccine yesterday, I would like to thank everyone of you.
The darkest hour is just before the dawn.
With apologies to the Mamas and the Papas.

377614 ▶▶ jb12, replying to Fingerache Philip, 2, #445 of 1991 🔗

What did he say? I missed it.

377695 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip, replying to jb12, 3, #446 of 1991 🔗

That even if you have been vaccinated, you can still spread the virus?????
If so, what’s the f×cking point???

377982 ▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Fingerache Philip, #447 of 1991 🔗

Bob Dylan, surely! “Meet Me In The Morning”, orf-of “Blood On The Tracks”!
No doubt the Ms and Ps too, I hasten to add, Philip- I only ever really liked “Creeque Alley”!

378096 ▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to Dermot McClatchey, #448 of 1991 🔗

While I’m far away from you my baby
I know it’s hard for you my baby
Because it’s hard for me my baby
And the darkest hour is just before dawn

Dedicated to the one I love, M+P

378128 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Spikedee1, #449 of 1991 🔗

Ah yes, I remember it now- you’ve got a very good singing voice, I must say!

378709 ▶▶▶ DomW, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 1, #450 of 1991 🔗

Ive always connected strongly with this Mama Cass song. It’s especially meaningful right now

Nobody can tell ya;
There’s only one song worth singin’,
They may try and sell ya,
‘Cause it hangs them up to see someone like you.

But you’ve gotta make your own kind of music
Sing your own special song,
Make your own kind of music
even if nobody else sings along.

You’re gonna be nowhere
The loneliest kind of lonely,
It may be rough goin’,
Just to do your thing’s the hardest thing to do.

But you’ve gotta make your own kind of music
Sing your own special song,
Make your own kind of music even if nobody else sings along.

So if you cannot take my hand,
And if you must be goin’, I will understand.

But you’ve gotta make your own kind of music
Sing your own special song,
Make your own kind of music
even if nobody else sings along.

377517 p02099003, 7, #451 of 1991 🔗

The observations made in the Nature article are not dissimilar to those made by Hope-Simpson when discussing the flu.
The rate of asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection is similar to that of influenza, and probably a lot of viruses. Again it’s the exposed, infected, infectious pathway, where you may be exposed but that doesn’t mean you’re infected and being infected doesn’t mean you show symptoms or that you’re infectious.

377519 FerdIII, replying to FerdIII, 9, #452 of 1991 🔗

Love the ‘look them in the eyes’ memes. Using them if you don’t mind.
Far closer to reality than the dystopian fascist propaganda from the SAGE Committee of Public Safety. As for the NHS, every single year you can read about the NHS being overwhelmed in the winter, and ‘studies’ saying that the flu vaxx failed with 10% effectiveness etc.

377546 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to FerdIII, 1, #453 of 1991 🔗

Agree. Now to get them out to the public

377520 Peter Thompson, replying to Peter Thompson, 22, #454 of 1991 🔗

When referring patients to hospital for an acute admission I often take the opportunity to speak to the admitting Registrar or SHO about the situation on the ground. Last weekend I learnt the blockage in A and E was not caused by large numbers of new Covid patients being admitted but rather as a result of the regular testing of patients on the wards leading to one ward after another being closed .

This would for instance block all the surgical wards from admissions for several days and leave surgical patients slowly piling up in A and E ..

I was told by the Medical Registrar that the number of Covid from the community was a regular trickle but quite manageable.

Reading today s column I would point out that the vast majority of those in ITU who are in the age 30-70 range fall into the extremely vulnerable or vulnerable categories ; the former are being offered the vaccine in many parts of the country this week.

377543 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Peter Thompson, 12, #455 of 1991 🔗

This information very rarely seems to make it into the regular news. Is it not possible for you and others to write to the BBC and the other outlets with this information on a regular basis?

They won’t publish it probably, but their not doing so will in time become a breach of their standards of fair and balanced reporting.

If they don’t receive the info though, there is zero chance they will report it and zero chance they can be accused of misinformation.

Please report your info to the media and ask your colleagues to do so too.

377988 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to stewart, 2, #456 of 1991 🔗

He would be risking dismissal by doing so, I believe.

377525 Achilles, replying to Achilles, 47, #457 of 1991 🔗

Every other week I see something on this site along the lines of “many Tory MPs are unhappy about the proposals and Boris could face a significant rebellion”, and every single time it amounts to zero, zilch. Every new edict flies through with barely a bump for Boris and Matt. I can only assume it comes from an out of date conviction that the Tories wouldn’t allow all this to happen. Time to wake up. If you’re waiting for a Tory revolt or the CRG to achieve anything you’re wasting your time.

377527 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Achilles, 13, #458 of 1991 🔗

Couldn’t agree more. Nothing will come of it and the government knows it.

377535 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Achilles, 16, #459 of 1991 🔗

100%. Same goes for nobly penning great long letters to MPs. Time would be better spent elsewhere. Parliament is a busted flush.

377544 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Achilles, 10, #460 of 1991 🔗

Protest boards and posters needed allover the place.

Kids should stand with protest boards outside schools demanding that schools reopen

377564 ▶▶ rockoman, replying to Achilles, 1, #461 of 1991 🔗


My eyes glaze over when I reach that stuff.

Totally irrelevant.

377532 NickR, 6, #462 of 1991 🔗

Go back a month or so, Havering & Redbridge in Nth East London were all over the news, positive testing in these areas drove the panic before the January lockdown.
Well let’s just look again at what was happening (and remember, testing increased by a 3rd over this period) in the key Nth East London area. Oh yes, cases falling before lockdown. No identifiable impact of lockdown.

377533 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 8, #463 of 1991 🔗

Have you up ticked a comment on here only for the up tick to disappear? It would appear the 77th are at work removing upticks

On occasions they over do it and send an obviously sceptic comment into the red

Smell rat

377719 ▶▶ CGL, replying to Cecil B, 4, #464 of 1991 🔗

If you downtick and then someone else upticks it is cancelled out. Don’t think there is any foul play.

377838 ▶▶ Jinks, replying to Cecil B, #465 of 1991 🔗

Easy way to resolve this 8s show both the up and down ticks, so both figures can be seen. I don’t see why one should cancel out the other. It would also sho how much traction the comments are getting

377537 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 2, #466 of 1991 🔗
  • Bill Gates owns more farmland in the U.S. than any other private farmer , having purchased a total of 242,000 acres — much of it considered some of the richest soil in the country — in the past few years
  • A subsidiary of Gates’ personal investment company is an inaugural member of Leading Harvest, a nonprofit that developed a “sustainability standard” without offering farmers guidance to achieve the result
  • Gates has been calling for sustainable energy and reduced carbon emissions for over a decade, but has also heavily invested in lab-grown foods and toxic chemicals that poison the food supply


377557 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Victoria, 5, #467 of 1991 🔗

Don’t forget he’s a big investor in the lab grown meat industry as well.

377540 p02099003, 6, #468 of 1991 🔗

Further to my post of yesterday about the dancing in Leicester, apparently the participants were Romanian and yesterday was a National day celebrating the reunification of Romania.

377541 DanClarke, 1, #469 of 1991 🔗

How did they manage to get so many useful idiots in councils etc, you would think none of the madness they are encouraging was going to by pass them and their families.

377547 suitejb, 25, #470 of 1991 🔗

I saw the ‘look them in the eyes’ advert last night and found it utterly reprehensible. How dare the government try and lay the blame and guilt on the population. If something isn’t working it’s because it’s the wrong thing to do and to try and force a population to obey is indeed a dictatorship.
I also saw the more powerful Women’s Aid advert. Look women who are trapped in their homes with an abusive partner in the eyes and tell then their life isn’t worth as much as anyone else’s.

377549 rose, replying to rose, 15, #471 of 1991 🔗

On. a brighter note, I am going skiing today with my children and grandchildren in Nottinghamshire!

377654 ▶▶ Achilles, replying to rose, 9, #472 of 1991 🔗

Thanks for letting me know. I’ve told my granny to avoid skiing today just in case you accidentally hit and kill her. Stay safe.

377550 alw, 20, #473 of 1991 🔗

A most depressing read of LS today. The comments always restore my sanity.

377551 Charlie Blue, 15, #474 of 1991 🔗

Morning all. Today the HART group are intending to launch their website fully https://hartgroup.org/ (not updated yet). This is making me feel a little hopeful. They state:
“HART is a group of highly qualified UK doctors, scientists, economists and psychologists who use a strong and broad multidisciplinary evidence base to help inform the Government’s policies on tackling COVID-19.
We aim to provide politicians and the wider public with the means to evaluate all the available evidence.
We represent a broad range of disciplines with a wide range of individual evidence-based expert views.”

I know we already have the GBD and that hasn’t got us far yet, but these guys seem to think the difference will be that they are a UK lobby group who can provide alternative approaches in a UK context. My hope is that it will be harder for detractors to pick off brave individuals speaking out if there is strength in numbers. It will be interesting to see just how many people have put their name to it and how they proceed. There has been very little info so far about what they actually intend to do.

377558 Cristi.Neagu, 5, #475 of 1991 🔗

Well, it’s clear what they’re doing. They’re tired of being made to look like fools for locking down when cases are dropping and releasing lockdown when cases are rising. They want to make sure they’ll release lockdown at the right time to make it look as though they know what they’re doing.

377563 CivilianNotCovidian, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 16, #476 of 1991 🔗

I think we urgently need to move the conversation away from “excess deaths” and “hospital beds”… these numbers are nuanced, open to manipulation AND will probably start to include people dying from lockdown harms such as missed cancer screenings, suicides and domestic abuse. As vaccinated people start to die (because the vaccine didn’t protect some from getting covid) these figures will ALSO be added and we will eventually get to the point where human life is disallowed altogether. We MUST move the conversation into the HARMS of lockdowns and masks. Psychological damage to children, cruelty to the elderly and single through enforced isolation, destruction of businesses, denying people dignity and basic human rights. There are a small number of selfish elites, sitting at home, furloughed or able to work on line, with their kids dutifully doing lessons via their iPads, ordering Deliveroo, who are piling up the cash to build a new extension. These people don’t want lockdown to end. They are turning into selfish, deluded, monsters… We must speak to them!

377588 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 6, #477 of 1991 🔗

Totally agree. The battle about the virus itself is over, the battle for hearts and minds over the consequences and collateral damage due to the government’s policies begins. It may not be the beginning of the end, but it is the end of the beginning.

377630 ▶▶ Steve Martindale, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 6, #478 of 1991 🔗

Agreed, we are now jumping about like scalded cats at every micro turn in the numbers and it is ridiculous. We had a crisis on AprilM/ay 2020 deaths were over double and we did not know what was going on and so we took crisis action with a lockdown. Since then there has not been a crisis and there is certainly not a crisis at the moment. For sure the public health people need to monitor numbers to advise on an appropriate public health policy but we do not have the numbers that amount to a crisis and no justification for crisis action like the lockdown. There is every reason to confidently move to an exit strategy now.

377704 ▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to CivilianNotCovidian, 7, #479 of 1991 🔗

We need to stop the argument about covid effects. Sick people, people who die with a positive test, asymptomatic spreaders, masks. We cannot hope to win this argument because people like the government have massive investment in this argument and we have no voice.

So let’s go after the lockdown as an entity. Why are people dying? Well they have not received proper care from the nhs for a year. Why have suicides risen? How many have died, why do you NOT PUBLISH THE FIGURES? domestic abuse on the rise. Cancer cases being untreated. The horror of changing sociable young children into scared introverted children who self harm and are living in isolation. Children contemplating suicide. Old people dying alone, afraid and in agony because they are being kept in care homes alone. Business owners who have spent a lifetime building up a business now broken. Small business being squeezed out by multinational companies like amazon. Peoples mental health. Killing granny. Lockdown policies have killed twice the numbers of granny’s than covid restrictions have saved. Lockdown supporters have murdered twice the number of people than lockdown sceptics. Which granny died? The one from covid or the one from Cancer, heart disease, lung and liver problems, obesity, suicide

I am sure we can all add to that list. This is undeniable and should be how we attack. Stop mask debates, stop death with or from covid, blood on my hands. So every covid supporter we call them mass murderers BECAUSE OF LOCKDOWN, there are 32 scientific studies showing lockdowns don’t
work. Sweden!! Florida. Let’s talk about their mistakes, the COST financially of lockdown 2 million lost jobs. I believe if we switch the narrative this is an argument we will win.

377567 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 15, #480 of 1991 🔗

Through the summer and up to US Election a common conversation i would hear would be something along the lines of “Trump is not perfect but he is the best option to obtain our freedoms back”.

Alas, he “lost”.. however, for those who think this was a cut and dry fair result should just look up the clips of the National Guard who were on the roadside when new President Biden s motorcade went past - many were showing their backs and some were spitting as the cars went by. The hugely "unpopular/divisive" Trump s inauguration event had many thousands of the public in attendance, Biden had 25,000 reluctant and mostly non supportive military in place to show who is now in power. This is unprecedented.

Here, we recently had (possibly still is) the United Nations flag flying above Downing Street.

We also have the likes of Princes Charles and William hobnobbing with the likes of global Bond villain Klaus Schwab and the mentally compromised youth Thunberg.

March 23rd 2020 was the day our country was taken over and we should all realize that the only way to defeat these evil men and women is to take the fight direct to their doorsteps and places of work.

A small step forward is to support the 30th January initiative.

377603 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to nickbowes, 12, #481 of 1991 🔗

The comments under Biden’s videos are all turned off. Trump never did that, no matter the constant vitriol he was receiving. And then there’s the very low number of views and the dislike ratio, which can’t be contained even with YouTube interfering.
And i find it kinda funny (but mostly infuriating) how the Guardian now place the same message under all their articles, saying that now that Biden is president, the press is finally free. Well, i don’t remember any press (or individuals, for that matter) being banned while Trump was president for saying bad things about him, even lying. But i certainly remember the New York Post being banned over exposing Biden’s deals with China. So we’re at the point where the press is covering up press censorship. Incredible.

377668 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 3, #482 of 1991 🔗

This screenshot shows it clearly the manipulation.

Plus if you watch the inaugranation video on youtube fishy things happen to the numbers as well.

377837 ▶▶▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #483 of 1991 🔗

Yep. As i was saying, even with YouTube interference, the videos still have more dislikes than likes.

377713 ▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 3, #484 of 1991 🔗

I don’t see any of them being banned from twitter. Free press? When they have spent the last four years pushing fake Russian collusion lies without any restrictions. From day one they pushed impeachment with zero restrictions. Joe signs an EO and 70,000 pipeline workers lose their jobs and they print…. fuck all. Oh yes the free press!

377573 Smelly Melly, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #485 of 1991 🔗

Burns night tonight or has the fish women banned it?

377966 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #486 of 1991 🔗

She will be havin a haggis supper fir hrrr teeeee the night

377579 Bella Donna, 3, #487 of 1991 🔗

If you haven’t signed the petition yet please can you consider doing so and share it around.


377583 stefarm, 6, #488 of 1991 🔗



Can’t really disagree with any of this. Worthy of sharing in the hope it might wipe the sleep from the eyes of the dozing masses

377585 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 34, #489 of 1991 🔗

Just going to shovel snow so to warm myself up before going outside I sent this to my MP copied to some notable other MPs who are fighting abck:

Sir (but copied to various other MPs)

You are my Member of Parliament.

My response to the latest fearporn masquerading as an advertisement on the TV from our Government I sent the Prime Minister amongst others a few days ago is below.

Will anyone who is complicit in the destruction of this country have the courage to look at me face-to-face and answer me with facts and figures and coherent reasons?

And no-“to save the NHS” or “if it saves just one life” are not valid factual arguments but an attempt at emotional blackmail.

And yet again Mr MP, Parliament has been treated with total contempt by the Government renewing and extending the legislation for another 6 months without a meaningful vote or discussion. Weren’t you promised this previously and nearly all of you buckled and accepted it a few months ago? Nothing changed then has it for all Matt Hancock’s blah blah blah to Parliament.


Begin forwarded message:

Subject: my take on the look them in the eye adverts

Date: 24 January 2021 at 13:51:48 GMT

Look ME in the eye and tell ME:

why your life was worth saving

why your granny’s life was worth saving

my business was worth sacrificing to save your miserable life

my retirement was worth sacrificing to save your miserable life

why my wife’s mental health was worth sacrificing to save your miserable life

why my wife’s physical health was worth sacrificing to save your miserable life

why my son’s career was worth sacrificing to save your miserable life

why the country was worth sacrificing to save your miserable political career

377595 ▶▶ Sodastream, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #490 of 1991 🔗

Well said

377592 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 8, #491 of 1991 🔗

Update on the barmy bench saga. This is the response from the council:


Thank you for your email and we note your concerns.

On Friday afternoon the Council had requests from the enforcing authorities to close off completely or remove the benches across the town however as a first resort the Council choose to place signs on the benches in Jubilee Gardens in the expectation people would read them and not sit on them , eating or drinking which is not allowed under the current legislation, the other alternative was and is to remove the benches completely which would involve costly expenditure. This may well be where the Council goes if people do not comply with current legislation.

This was done late Friday afternoon and we ran out of time to do the Square and The Common which are due to be done today(Monday).

The enforcement is a matter for the police and not the Town Council as all we can do is encourage and try and educate people not to stay or sit around.

It was interesting to see that on Sunday without the Market the Square was busier than Saturday so the constant criticism about the market encouraging people to hang around really does not hold water.

He is lying, the signs were put on the benches on Friday lunch time, so the lack of time excuse does not, in his words, hold water. In fact, the guy fixing the signs arrived about 10 minutes after the EHO woman had left. There was plenty of time to put signs on all the other benches.

377609 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to kh1485, 9, #492 of 1991 🔗

The argument against removing the benches altogether is that it would involve “costly expenditure”? (As opposed to non-costly expenditure?) So “if only we could afford it, we’d remove everything everywhere and abolish congregation in perpetuity”?

377620 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 6, #493 of 1991 🔗

Yeah, and we’d teach you nasty coffee drinkers a lesson …

377612 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to kh1485, 6, #494 of 1991 🔗

So nobody is allowed to sit on the council signs, all eating and drinking is banned, and the alternative alternative is costly cost? Well that clears that up.

377626 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to kh1485, 3, #495 of 1991 🔗

So you don’t need to wear a mask when eating or drinking, but you’re not allowed to eat or drink cause you must wear a mask… Also know as: “How to give away freedoms without actually giving away any freedoms”

377642 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to kh1485, 1, #496 of 1991 🔗

Which legislation is he referring to?

377646 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Steve Hayes, 7, #497 of 1991 🔗

Precisely. The customer who he sent this drivel to is following it up. If we complain, they will just ignore.

377686 ▶▶ J4mes, replying to kh1485, 2, #498 of 1991 🔗

He’s making up his own rules because this would prevent individuals from sitting down and, perhaps, eat something.

377764 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to kh1485, 2, #499 of 1991 🔗

Who are the “enforcing authorities”?
As usual, such bad grammar and punctuation. Has the council not paid their subscription to “grammarly”?

377771 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Silke David, 1, #500 of 1991 🔗

I presume he had his orders from the EHO. The signs, despite what he asserts, were fixed about ten minutes after her visit.

377806 ▶▶ TheOriginalBlackPudding, replying to kh1485, 2, #501 of 1991 🔗

Manual trades in local government very often do finish at lunchtime on Friday. That gives them more opportunity to earn overtime. The unions absolutely stiffed the employers years ago and the legacy remains, though is dwindling.

377965 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to kh1485, 1, #502 of 1991 🔗

AKA: Making things up as we go along.

Jesus wept.

377599 JayBee, replying to JayBee, 11, #503 of 1991 🔗

When the most gullible and apathic population meets the most destructive and zealous opposition, the most incompetent and most lustfully autocratic government, the most unfit health system and public health officials, this is what you get.

377641 ▶▶ FerdIII, replying to JayBee, 3, #504 of 1991 🔗

and when truth is destroyed by excessive fraud, data manipulation and fiction posing as science….when common sense is usurped by the cult of science….

377678 ▶▶ J4mes, replying to JayBee, 1, #505 of 1991 🔗

I agree with all you say, but when you say they’re ‘incompetent’ – what do you mean?

377957 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to J4mes, #506 of 1991 🔗

Indeed. Other adjectives might be more appropriate. Our masters don’t mind in the slightest if we call them incompetent.

377600 Smelly Melly, replying to Smelly Melly, 25, #507 of 1991 🔗

Nearly a year and I still don’t know anybody who’s died of this deadly disease.

377627 ▶▶ jb12, replying to Smelly Melly, 13, #508 of 1991 🔗

I don’t either, but I tend not to hang out with already-dying old people and 25st lumps of lard.

377656 ▶▶ J4mes, replying to Smelly Melly, 6, #509 of 1991 🔗

Nearly a year and only now are we seeing some sceptics questioning whether this tyranny is deliberate rather than a big mistake (as pushed by the likes of Peter Hitchens).

377692 ▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Smelly Melly, 9, #510 of 1991 🔗

I do. Friend of a friend found dead in her flat. She was self isolating due to a positive ‘covid’ test. I would imagine it was probably heart failure – it appears 999 not called – but because of that test she is a covid victim.

377746 ▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to bluemoon, 3, #511 of 1991 🔗

My god, what have we become! They cared enough to get a test but not enough to monitor if they were unwell. Brings tears to my eyes. My god what have we become.

377889 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Smelly Melly, 1, #512 of 1991 🔗

More significantly – the number of people who have died from the disease is a black hole of data.

377992 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Smelly Melly, #513 of 1991 🔗

I know of a bloke in Somerset who got it a Cheltenham races and sadlidied, he was 49. My Dad talked to a bloke who knows a bloke in Exeter who died of it and I talked to a woman about 4 months ago on the phone who’s hubby died of it, well he was in his 80’s very immobile, had a fall, got a serious head injury went into a steep decline then got covids and sadili died…but ummmm
Oh yer and I talked to a bloke in Toolstatiion who know who knows a bloke who died of it…he did have hear issues but otherwise 100% health for a 70 yr old.
AND a girl who works in Argos, her granny died of it.

377601 RickH, replying to RickH, 30, #514 of 1991 🔗

Mark Harper, … said: “The extension of councils’ Covid powers until July will be of great concern to those worried about their jobs and businesses.”

Yes, of course. But primarily it’s of concern to anyone interested in democracy and human rights.

377607 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to RickH, 7, #515 of 1991 🔗

Not aimed at you RichH, but jeez, understatement of the f***ing year.

377615 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to kh1485, 8, #516 of 1991 🔗

Precisely. Note this also :

The Express has reported on some of the fighting talk of those in Parliament opposed to the restrictions.”

Talk? About all it amounts to. Fighting? Hardly – in the main and in most cases.

‘Empty wind’ would be a better description.

377624 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to RickH, 5, #517 of 1991 🔗

Indeed. This lot couldn’t fight their way out of a paper bag.

377636 ▶▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to kh1485, 4, #518 of 1991 🔗

To be fair to them, if it was up to them we wouldn’t be in this position. The problem isn’t them. It’s the other 600 odd MPs who are Lockdown Mullahs.

377643 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to stewart, 3, #519 of 1991 🔗

OK, but surely there is something they could do. It’s time for the talking to stop.

377671 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ stewart, replying to kh1485, 3, #520 of 1991 🔗

I share you frustration. And I also wish they would be less polite.

377720 ▶▶▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to kh1485, 2, #521 of 1991 🔗

Oooh I could crush a grape. I am so angry I will slam down my papers. Stop, stop you are frightening me.

377613 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to RickH, 10, #522 of 1991 🔗

“Of great concern.” I’m tired to death of their woolly, “civil” parliamentary language.

377637 ▶▶▶ WasSteph, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #523 of 1991 🔗

Too true. Unseat the mad dictator now or they are guilty by association.

377647 ▶▶▶ vargas99, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 3, #524 of 1991 🔗

Me too, if I hear “my right honourable friend” one more time I will puke!

377670 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to RickH, 6, #525 of 1991 🔗

Time to break out this again:

“Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” – Benjamin Franklin

377738 ▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to RickH, 3, #526 of 1991 🔗

Yeah great. A bit late lads. Remember you have had two chances to debate and stop this. One to stop the 6 month extension of the covid bill and one to agree the tier schemes and you did…… absolutely fuck all, just laid down and took it. So the fat pig dictator does things you disagree with, who cares you are the ones that gave him the power. Didn’t Dante have a special ring for corrupt people? I hope it includes having hot pokers shoved up their arse!

377618 Bruce Reynolds, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 27, #527 of 1991 🔗

Skeptics..All of those wanting to make a difference you have the power to do so.. Remove all signage in your area, wear a banaclava if worried about CCTV, anything to do with the fake flue remove it.. encourage non social distancing,mix with households at every opportunity.. never wear a muzzle, claim exemption at all times…in this weather encourage kids to mix,snow ball fights, build a snowman etc.. just keep the pressure on never stop..

377623 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 6, #528 of 1991 🔗

Tweak the noses of authority at every opportunity.

377631 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 13, #529 of 1991 🔗

Every act of non-compliance is a victory.

Ignore the rules.

377833 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 4, #530 of 1991 🔗

Purchase a Sweden flag. Hang it from a window.

377622 PhantomOfLiberty, replying to PhantomOfLiberty, 13, #531 of 1991 🔗

Just to say that – and it should be obvious – Christopher Snowden’s article fails in its title branding anyone whom he disagrees with as a crank. He shifts the argument from matters of substance to the alleged bad people he disagrees with. This is intellectually and politically the least respectable line you could take.

377633 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to PhantomOfLiberty, 5, #532 of 1991 🔗

Also known as an ad hominem fallacy.

377658 ▶▶▶ PhantomOfLiberty, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 3, #533 of 1991 🔗


377758 ▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to PhantomOfLiberty, 3, #534 of 1991 🔗

Its just the SJW way. Don’t debate facts, you cannot win. So call me a racist, homophobe, sexist, a denier a granny killer, and all pile in. Attack where you work, discredit you and review everything you have ever posted. Find the errors and sling them back. Jump rhetoric, if you believe this… you must also believe this…. even though you have never mentioned this.

377829 ▶▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to Spikedee1, 4, #535 of 1991 🔗

Well, you can’t deny that calling people racists or nazis worked perfectly. These days all it takes is for enough people to call you a racist, and no one will listen to you, no one will invite you on talk shows or the news. We should turn the tables on them, i think.

378112 ▶▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to Cristi.Neagu, #536 of 1991 🔗

Oh its a fantastic way to shut people up. But how did we get to a place where debate is stopped because you have upset a blue check mark on twitter?

377629 JayBee, replying to JayBee, 20, #537 of 1991 🔗

As I stated yesterday, they have now adopted zero Covid and are intent upon imprisoning the population for good and on ruining and depressing the country ASAP, in particular the middle class.
The hotel chains are now in it too, as they realize that they won’t get any business this year, so they sell out if not demand occupation by the government.
Zero Covid will of course fail, those quarantines are happening far too late for that, and their and the policy’s success is more and more doubtful anyway in light of the constant relapses in cases in Asia Pacific countries.
I was due to buy another flat in London this month and will now probably cancel that.
Me and Mrs Bee will now also likely relocate back to Germany and take our tax payments with us for good, although it’s just as much of an inhumane hellhole, because otherwise, we cannot run our business there anymore and won’t be able to support family members when needed.
Actions have consequences, Messrs Johnson, Hancock, Whitty, Patel&co.

377828 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to JayBee, 2, #538 of 1991 🔗

Zero Covid is a race to the bottom and dependent on money printing

377651 pvenkman, 8, #539 of 1991 🔗

Hopefully this new group launching today can gather some support and make itself heard.

I feel that we here can’t sort this mess without organisation and direction we are all here because we feel on some level that the lockdown is wrong way to go and that the government is for some reason taking the wrong decisions. The government has got a lot of people scared and it’s worked and is still working.

I would like to see a group that works on our common problem that is we all want this to end start questioning the government on there policy’s on a grand scale perhaps why isn’t the government offering everyone vitamin supplements by make quick calculations they could do that for the whole country for a year for less than a week’s furlough cost.
ivermectin we know it’s safe for people so why not just start using it we will see very quickly weather it works or not.

How we would go about this is the problem perhaps we could reach out to the most vocal of lockdown zealots because I think we all want the same thing at the end of the day.

377659 Awkward Git, 6, #540 of 1991 🔗

Got a quick reply from the FOI team at the DHSC about any research being done into the ramp up of positive test rates being linked to the vaccination programmes:

Thank you for your email.

The Freedom of Information Act only applies to recorded information such as paper or electronic archive material. As your correspondence asked for general information rather than requesting specific recorded information or documentation, it did not fall under the provisions of the Act. It will be answered as general correspondence in due course.

Yours sincerely,

FOI Team

Department of Health and Social Care

At least they have said they will answer in due course and not just replied “it’s not under the FOI so get stuffed” which some departments do (Public Health Scotland being one) so will post any reply from them when it arrives.

377665 stewart, replying to stewart, 5, #541 of 1991 🔗

Watched The Matrix again recently.

20 years on, it seems as if the only thing they might have got wrong is that they were being overly optimistic that we would be kept around because the machines would need us as batteries.

The only use the machines have for us is in connecting all our brains together to generate enough data to train the machines. Google and the others are taking care of that already.

Once the AI takes over – Ray. Kurzweil who is now working on it at Google predicts in about 10-20 years (look it up) – they will have no use for us at all.

2020 was the year machines took a big step forward, captured large parts of our lives, and got humans to suppress much of their nature. We are all incarcerated now, siloed up in countries.

We may have paroles from time to time, they will be conditional and limited in time, but we will increasingly live isolated, confined existences, feeding the data into the machines, until they are ready to be done with us for good.

377700 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to stewart, 4, #542 of 1991 🔗

The Matrix claims to be based on Baudrillard’s ‘Simulacra and Simulation’ (the hollowed out book that Neo takes a minidisk out of during the ‘follow the white rabbit’ scene is actually this book), but it makes a bit of a dog’s breakfast of it and misses the point (and ends up being more like Plato’s allegory of the cave).

Simulacra and Simulation isn’t the easiest book to read, Baudrillard does disappear up his own arse in a way only a French Postmodernist philosopher can a lot of the time, but his ideas about simulations of reality are useful and accurate when thinking about why evangelists and sceptics seem seperated by such a wide gulf.

This is a decent short summary of his ideas:


377945 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to GrannySlayer, 2, #543 of 1991 🔗

Was it you who was recommending Baudrillard a few days ago? If not: agreed; JB has many interesting ideas if you’re prepared to get beyond his style of writing- the style is typically-French, not just typically-French Postmodernist, unfortunately.
If it was you, pls. disregard this missive!

378220 ▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 1, #544 of 1991 🔗

It was I, yes. 🙂

378538 ▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to GrannySlayer, #545 of 1991 🔗

Ca plane, kiddo!

377666 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 34, #546 of 1991 🔗

The fixed penalty notice process

1 An authorised person may issue a notice/fine

2 If the ‘fine’ is paid within 28days the fine is halved and that is the end of the matter

3 After 28 days and up to the time a summons is issued the fine can still be paid. This would also conclude the matter

4 Any any time the state can withdraw the notice/fine

5 At any time the state can ask you to agree to a caution in lieu of the notice/fine. You have to consent to a caution. The state cannot impose a caution without your consent

6 If the state still wishes to pursue the matter they must submit a full written file of evidence to the Crown Prosecution Service. Only the CPS can make a decision to prosecute you. If the CPS decide to prosecute you they must lay an ‘information’ in a Magistrates Court requesting that you are issued with a summons to appear in court

7 If summons is issued and the case proceeds to court then the state must prove it’s case. The state must produce it’s witnesses in court and they are required to give evidence on oath and submit themselves to cross examination. Evidence may be given to disprove the state’s claims

8 The Magistrates will decide if you are guilty or not

9 The ‘information’ must be laid within six months of the date of the alleged offence. If this six month limit is not complied with the notice/fine/summons are void

10 If you ignore the summons and do not turn up in court the case can be heard in your absence and you can be found guilty and fined in your absence

The state would like you to shut up and pay the fine at the earliest opportunity. The system is incentivised to achieve compliance. The system is rigged to avoid the state being challenged

Surprising then that there has not been one case where an individual has said ‘go on prove it’ and challenged the state in court. Not one case in nearly 12 months

In my own case the state deliberately let the six months expire


377676 ▶▶ gina, replying to Cecil B, 9, #547 of 1991 🔗

Thank you so much for posting this – very helpful.

377685 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to Cecil B, 4, #548 of 1991 🔗

It’s a tricky game of risk, isn’t it? If you pay up within 14 days or whatever it costs you £100 and you don’t get a criminal record. If you refuse and it does go to court and you lose, it costs an awful lot more and you get a criminal record. But what are the chances of that happening? Interesting to hear about your experience.

377830 ▶▶▶ gina, replying to mattghg, 2, #549 of 1991 🔗

What happens if you then push it to the end – go to court and lose – and still refuse to pay whatever fine is imposed?
These offences are non recordable offences, according to Liberty, so do not carry a prison sentence or criminal record. What would happen then?

377968 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to gina, 3, #550 of 1991 🔗

Non-payment of a court imposed fine is an imprisonable offence, I believe. That’s what you would go to prison for, not the original offence.

Though these days I believe they can steal your property instead of carting you off to prison.

378080 ▶▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to Mark, #551 of 1991 🔗

Thanks for the info.
The ‘optics’ of that would look interesting…

378172 ▶▶▶▶ Suey, replying to gina, #552 of 1991 🔗

But a record IS kept. For an enhanced DBS, the police can reveal any old information they hold that THEY consider might be useful.

378278 ▶▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to gina, #553 of 1991 🔗

“Non-recordable” doesn’t mean you don’t get a criminal record. According to this information from Liberty, if it goes to court and you lose then you do get a criminal record.

379169 ▶▶▶▶▶ gina, replying to mattghg, #554 of 1991 🔗


377788 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to Cecil B, 7, #555 of 1991 🔗

Precedent – if they can’t prove the case just once, they can’t prove any of them and the whole thing can no longer be enforced.

377863 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Cecil B, 4, #556 of 1991 🔗

Because in court you can ask them to justify their actions by supplying the evidence used to back-up the legislation and so on.

They can’t so don’t want to risk it.

377927 ▶▶ ElizaP, replying to Cecil B, 1, #557 of 1991 🔗

Is it possible to put up some sort of link somewhere so that this can be saved on Facebook please?

378267 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to ElizaP, #558 of 1991 🔗

Next to the red flag at the top of the comment there’s a sort of chain icon which you can click on to get a permanent link to the comment. The one for the comment you’re replying to is https://lockdownsceptics.org/2021/01/25/latest-news-265/#comment-377666 .

377669 Old Trout, replying to Old Trout, 37, #559 of 1991 🔗

Was out for a drive down to the sea front at the weekend with a friend and was absolutely blown away by how many people were out and about. Car parks full, traffic jams, thousands of people of all ages walking dogs, families, kids on bikes, etc. Little in the way of social distancing. Not a muzzle in sight. Have only ever seen the place like that on a red hot summers day and this was freezing. Gave me a few brief moments of joy and hope.

377679 ▶▶ alw, replying to Old Trout, 7, #560 of 1991 🔗

People have nowhere else to go.

377696 ▶▶ DanClarke, replying to Old Trout, 8, #561 of 1991 🔗

My regular haunt is the seafront, very occasional masked up person, busy, children in the playground, just as it always has been..

377675 Jo Starlin, 11, #562 of 1991 🔗

The intention to turn the future into a boot stamping on a masked face forever seems crystal clear now doesn’t it?

377677 Richard O, replying to Richard O, 33, #563 of 1991 🔗

As the inevitably catastrophic impacts of lockdown really begin to make themselves felt, so the attacks on lockdown sceptics intensify. All deaths and all damages to society are now our fault.

Friday’s announcement that any vaccine will be far less effective against new strains of SARS-CoV-2 was effectively an admission that it will fail, and that restrictions will continue indefinitely. This also is the fault of lockdown sceptics, presumably for not believing in the solution enough. Anyone who refuses to take it will no doubt be accused of being a murderer.

We are through the looking glass here, occupying a parallel universe where everything is completely inverted. Increasingly I am finding it very difficult to regard society with anything but the utmost contempt. The level of absurdity is so great that complete withdrawal from it is getting easier and easier.

377690 ▶▶ DanClarke, replying to Richard O, 13, #564 of 1991 🔗

You only need propaganda when necessary. They’ve never needed it for the flu vaccine. They do for this, because the majority know something is seriously amiss with the whole concept.

377709 ▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to DanClarke, 27, #565 of 1991 🔗

This is the first pandemic in history that needed a marketing campaign. They usually market themselves effectively. With, ya know, corpses everywhere and suchlike.

377783 ▶▶▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to GrannySlayer, 13, #566 of 1991 🔗

Its the first disease in history where you need a test to tell you if you are ill. And where you are financially rewarded if you manage to catch it!

377691 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Richard O, 25, #567 of 1991 🔗

I am finding it very difficult to regard society with anything but the utmost contempt.

My thoughts exactly.

377699 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Richard O, 15, #568 of 1991 🔗

Couldn’t agree more.

377703 ▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to Richard O, 22, #569 of 1991 🔗

Yes. The vast majority of people now actively disgust me.

377710 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Richard O, 15, #570 of 1991 🔗

I’m an enemy of the state, an enemy of the people and the only realistic future I see for myself is one of near-reclusion, having relinquished almost everything and learned to love simplicity. (I already love solitude, fortunately.)

377717 ▶▶ Jinks, replying to Bella Donna, 2, #573 of 1991 🔗

Links to nothing

377684 Cheshirecatslave, replying to Cheshirecatslave, #574 of 1991 🔗

Article on the vaccine deaths with comments by doctors.

377716 ▶▶ AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to Cheshirecatslave, 6, #575 of 1991 🔗

Thanks for the link, there’s a great quote on the comments that we could adopt:

“All truth goes through three stages, first it is ridiculed, then it is violently opposed and finally it is accepted as obvious.”

Arthur Schopenhauer

377802 ▶▶▶ WasSteph, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #576 of 1991 🔗

I like some of the other comments too. Obviously there are both sides of the argument there as there should be.
I like that 2 doctors said it’s always a Covid death if the victim has comorbidities, never the other conditions but for the vaccine it is always the other conditions not the vaccine.
I am also concerned by the doctor who finds the yellow card reporting fails when she tries to use it. I wonder how common that is.

377687 RickH, replying to RickH, 9, #577 of 1991 🔗

“… a group of psychologist have written to the their professional body objecting to the Government’s use of fear tactics…”

I think that’s vital for the reputation of the profession.

The SPI-B Goebbels & Mengele Memorial Group need to be prevented from membership of any professional body related to the discipline that they have sullied.

377733 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to RickH, 8, #578 of 1991 🔗

They should do like the GMC and strike down any psychologist who has colluded with this nonsense. Strip them of their doctorates & professional qualifications and render them unfit to practise.

And while we’re at it, the likes of the GMC, GDC and the Nursing & Midwifery Council should also strike off those who have been in dereliction of their duty and peddling misinformation. Yes, I’m looking at you Hillary Jones & Sarah Jarvis for a start.

377688 Llamasaurus Rex, replying to Llamasaurus Rex, 3, #579 of 1991 🔗

Good morning. Can anyone recommend…or even just point me in the direction of…a solicitor firm that can assist someone (retailer) with prohibition notice issues? I’d be most grateful.
UK based, ideally with presence in South East UK.

378273 ▶▶ Mark, replying to Llamasaurus Rex, #580 of 1991 🔗

Apparently Tilbrooks are your first port of call for sceptical-sympathetic solicitors:


Tilbrook’s Solicitors
Quires Green
Telephone : 01277 896 000
FAX: 01277 896 050

379171 ▶▶▶ Llamasaurus Rex, replying to Mark, #581 of 1991 🔗

Thank you Mark

377689 alw, 16, #582 of 1991 🔗

Protests in Denmark and Holland. Restaurants opening in the Czech Republic. Let’s hope Saturday’s Great opening up here take off.

377701 DanClarke, replying to DanClarke, 4, #583 of 1991 🔗

When the government have finished trashing the economy, and have no taxes coming in, where do they get the money from to exist?

377732 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to DanClarke, 5, #584 of 1991 🔗

Same way they get it now – make it appear on a computer screen at the push of a button.

377753 ▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to DanClarke, 2, #585 of 1991 🔗

The same place they normally do – the Bank of England.

Spending comes first. Taxation comes afterwards as a consequence of the spending and re-spending of the money as it passes from hand to hand. Not getting tax just means people are saving, not spending.

You can very quickly do the mathematics that shows government will get 100% of their spending back as tax for any positive tax rate you pick – as long as nobody saves any of their money when they get it.

Taxes for revenue has been an obsolete concept since the 1930s at least. The ability of the government to spend from the Bank is in an 1866 Act.

Masks don’t stop you getting viruses. Taxes are irrelevant to government supply.

378040 ▶▶▶ BJJ, replying to Lucan Grey, #586 of 1991 🔗

It all depends on whether a nation (read: currency) is a net importer or exporter. If the latter all is well and the government can spend all it wants. If the former, the currency will devalue.

377705 John P, replying to John P, 8, #587 of 1991 🔗

I noticed yesterday an exchange with a moderator on here. That’s new. I didn’t think there were any mods here other than those employed to remove the occasional spam links that may appear.

I’m disappointed in Toby, a prominent free speech campaigner, but hardly surprised. He always comes across as quite uptight in his London Calling podcasts with James Delingpole. I would have thought he were more naturally inclined to the oppression of free speech.

Perhaps my fears are unfounded in this regard.

The problem with speech moderators is that while they might smugly proclaim that they want to “protect” free speech (it needs protection?) they are in fact doing the opposite.

Making value judgments about the speech of another is an entirely subjective exercise – what moral right do you have to shut someone else up? What right have you to censor their words? Who are you to sit in judgment?

Offence? That’s a personal matter. As Brendan O’Neill points out (I paraphrase), “You have the right to be offended.”

You really don’t have to take another personally. I find that difficult, but I learn. Letting go of grudges is a good start. Again, who are you to judge another?

What one person might find offensive another may not. That is particularly true of “bad” language. Some are happy with effing and blinding. (I do that sometimes).

Who moderates the moderators?

377712 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to John P, 1, #588 of 1991 🔗

And I’ve noticed today the small red flag – top right of comments if the cursor hovvers there. Presume that’s new also ….

377731 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to kh1485, 5, #589 of 1991 🔗

It will be from the programme Toby is using to write/host the site.

His layout is very similar to other sites like this one on social media.

Company websites etc are the same – do you think comapnies like GoDaddy write an individual programme for “your” site? No they have a generic one and tweak it to suit.

377740 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #590 of 1991 🔗

All I was saying is that I hadn’t seen it before …

377799 ▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to kh1485, 4, #591 of 1991 🔗

They’re all at it – must be new “orders” to bring in more censorship.

377718 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to John P, 14, #592 of 1991 🔗

Christ, really? This argument has been going on in Internet forums for 20 years.

There’s always going to be someone who goes too far and posts something utterly beyond the pale. Would you put it past the lockdown zealots to come in here are start posting stuff that’ll have the police investigating LS and Toby?

The brand is valuable. It has to be protected from destruction through neglect or malice.

Post some evidence that something of value has been removed and I’ll think again about it, but I can’t see the founder of the Free Speech Society employing a censor ride roughshod over us.

377724 ▶▶▶ Londo Mollari, replying to AidanR, 4, #593 of 1991 🔗


377735 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to AidanR, 6, #594 of 1991 🔗

Not only LS and Toby might be at risk, but possibly also the individual poster. Entrapping someone by inciting them to post advocating illegal acts, and then prosecuting them for it, is standard fare for J-TRIG, a SIGINT organisation which doesn’t get noticed as much as the 77th Brigade does and is doubtless very happy to keep it that way.

377743 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to AidanR, 5, #595 of 1991 🔗

seems a good idea and will make the job easier for those good people who protect this site by using us to direct them to the possibly problematical posts, they have the good sense to work out which, if any, need moderation

377752 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to John P, 4, #596 of 1991 🔗

As ever JohnP, if you don’t like it here, setup your own site where you make the rules.

377865 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Ewan Duffy, 3, #597 of 1991 🔗

There is an inherent irony in that response to comments about censorship.

377879 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to RickH, #598 of 1991 🔗

Is there? ELI5 me.

377769 ▶▶ SweetBabyCheeses, replying to John P, 3, #599 of 1991 🔗

I doubt very much that limiting free speech is what the moderators are doing. Unless you’ve done the job yourself, you can’t appreciate just how much CRAP gets posted on forums, whether from real people or bots.
Clickbait, scams, viruses, stolen dogs, opportunists, quizzes just designed to mine your data… you have to keep a lid on that kind of stuff or people just won’t come here anymore.

377789 ▶▶ Mark, replying to John P, 2, #600 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps my fears are unfounded in this regard .”

Only time will tell. Your fears are well founded, but will not necessarily come to pass, or come to pass too unbearably or too quickly. There is hope that we will not follow the path set by pretty much all the mainstream media and social media outlets, because of Toby’s particular position as founder of the FSU and his personal experience with cancel culture.

The establishment of a moderating structure is inevitable as a forum grows, and as AidanR pointed out, this is something that has happened endlessly since the internet began. The same arguments are hashed out again and again. I’ve been involved both as commenter and as admin/moderator since almost the beginning, and I highly doubt any new points will be raised here. As someone on the long term losing political side, who has been censored and banned from more forums than some here have had hot dinners, I’m hypersensitive to such matters. One of the things I like about LS has been that so far it was a place where you really didn’t need to know the rules – just behave sensibly, and moderating has been very light touch.

What usually happens is that moderators and systems are set up with idealistic notions of “just keeping discussion reasonable”, and initially only address obvious genuine spam, but over time moderators interpret that in accordance with their own personal and political biases, and dissenting opinions are gradually forced out as “offensive”. I’ve seen the most supposedly adamantly libertarian idealists, over time, turn their forums into rigidly controlled restricted speech zones, under pressure from either commercial or identity lobby “offence-mongers” (indeed that’s pretty much the story of the US sphere internet and social media over the past three decades).

We shall see.

377877 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Mark, 2, #601 of 1991 🔗

There’s the voice of a man who’s speaking from experience.

I’ve also been a mod in a couple of fairly big forums, and I recognise every word you say.

377975 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to Mark, 1, #602 of 1991 🔗

Crikey, i started Off completely agreeing with John P with an uptick, then, after reading other comments, i changed to agreeing with the red flag, now after reading your comment I’m wobbling back to agreeing with John P again.

So now I am confused, and as you say, only time will tell

But do moderators really need the red flag system if their wish was to censor people who have apposing views to the moderators possible bias – I think/hope we can trust this site’s red flag management

Maybe they needed to add red flags it to counter criticism from others

377864 ▶▶ muzzle, replying to John P, 1, #603 of 1991 🔗

That’s interesting. Someone last week started a thread about the content of a BBC article which was critical of the PCR test. I asked them if they could provide a link which they did. Later on, the whole thread had vanished.

377707 chaos, 15, #604 of 1991 🔗

Then they came for the pubs, and I did not speak out — Because I was not a publican and I was getting 80% of my pay to stay home.

Then they came for the unvaccinated, and I did not speak out — Because I was vaccinated and I was getting 80% of my pay to stay home.

Then they started killing people, and I did not speak out — Because I was vaccinated and I was getting 80% of my pay to stay home.

377708 AidanR, replying to AidanR, 5, #605 of 1991 🔗

Has anyone started downloading & archiving all of the Downing St press conferences from YouTube?

They’ll probably all be disappeared soon.

When the reckoning comes, the record of all the promises they’ve made, going all the way back to “3 weeks to flatten the curve” will be important.

377722 ▶▶ Pebbles, replying to AidanR, #606 of 1991 🔗

That should be in public archive – BBC , Ch4 etc too … but downloading might be useful. Not that anyone can be ask surely.

377711 Basics, replying to Basics, 4, #607 of 1991 🔗


Doctors Around The World Issue Dire WARNING: DO NOT GET THE COVID VACCINE!!

Clear video giving the sound reasons to avoid the ‘vaccines’

Contrary to commenter BF Findlyson’s (77?) requirement my opinion is not important to add. The video speaks clearly for it’s self. It is for you to decide to watch and what to think and do. Unless, of course, BF findlayson passes by and issues a declaration that these are smug doctors jumping like rats from a ship. There is something strange about BF findlayson.

377714 Mark, replying to Mark, 12, #609 of 1991 🔗

Lots of meaty stuff on LS today, reinforcing its centrality to the central issue of the times. Particularly good for me is the piece by Angus McIntosh , He highlights my own main coronapanic-related concerns for the longer term:

It may then take a decade or more to recover from its terrible toll of death, depression and poverty and this is tragedy enough. But potentially even more damaging for our long-term future are the lasting shifts in attitudes which the virus may leave behind.
These will be many and complex, but there are three which are particularly likely:

  1. Permanently lowered public tolerance for life’s normal risks and challenges.
  2. Increased popular willingness to sacrifice freedoms in pursuit of safety.
  3. Greater tendency for authorities of all kinds to exploit the above.

The first two of these malign legacies represent acceleration of existing trends, rather than completely new phenomena. But the third is undergoing more of a revolution .”

The first two have indeed been accelerated by this self-inflicted cultural disaster, but they also represent key trends that both pre-dated and have enabled it. It was precisely increased “safetyism” combined with increased willingness to accept the protection of nanny state that allowed Ferguson and his ilk to get away with the totalitarian power grab described.

In a way, you could see this as a vindication of all the warnings through the C20th against those tendencies, which were denied and ridiculed as paranoid exaggerations because most simply lacked the imagination to foresee a time when people would have become so accepting of this fearful and submissive attitude that they would behave the way we have this last year.

It’s useful to track these insights back to past events, to help us understand past developments that we might not have so clearly understood at the time.

Related, is McIntosh’s observation that:

When governments take control of a new aspect of our lives, they assume permanent accountability for it in the public and media mind .

This is exactly what the establishment of the NHS did – it represented the government taking control of healthcare provision, and once that was established, so too was state accountability for health, in the public mind. From there, it was always inevitable that the authority of the state over behaviour that related to health would be strong and ever-increasing.

Arguments that individual liberty and responsibility should take precedence are crushed by the response that the costs fall on the public purse. Politicians, held responsible for public health, prioritise avoiding getting blamed for perceived bad outcomes.

This is exactly why, in so many ways, the NHS has been at the core of the UK’s particular collapse into fear-filled authoritarianism. In other countries, other issues and results pertained. The general – but by no means universal – rush to copy China’s practice represents in part a result of China’s generally raised status and influence globally by virtue of its economic advances, partly a collective panic effect, and partly just the herd instinct that says a politician can’t be effectively blamed for doing what “all the other” countries are doing, but can and will be blamed if he does something different from the global norm.

We might have hoped that the UK’s traditional famed resistance to the crushing of individual liberty would mean we would have been one of the few to resist last year’s rush to Chinese-style authoritarian collectivism. But we are not the nation we once perhaps were, and the particular form the crisis of liberty took attacked a weak spot in the UK’s defences against such authoritarianism. That weak spot had been created by state collective provision of healthcare.

377721 ▶▶ rockoman, replying to Mark, 13, #610 of 1991 🔗

Safetyism is the product of an affluent society which can afford it.

The bankruptcy and poverty to which it is currently leading us, will completely undermine it.

Isn’t it nice how these things self-rectify?

377741 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to rockoman, 4, #611 of 1991 🔗

It’s true that in a situation of societal collapse, people have to fend for themselves much more. But I don’t think Russia’s experience of exactly that has resulted in a stern political respect for individual liberty and responsibility in that culture, even if it resulted for a while in people more able, of necessity, to look after themselves.

377778 ▶▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to Mark, 4, #612 of 1991 🔗

Increasing povery does destroy safetyism however.

It alo increases responsibility, because if you (or your family and social network) don’t look after yourself, then nobody else will.

377748 ▶▶▶ Lucan Grey, replying to rockoman, 1, #613 of 1991 🔗

Except it won’t – because bankruptcy of the nation is just as impossible as the notion that wearing a mask magically stops you getting infected. Both are fallacies of composition – projecting your individual experiences onto the macro situation.

377759 ▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to Lucan Grey, 3, #614 of 1991 🔗

I’m pretty sure MMT doesn’t suggest that governments should deliberately restrict economic activity and then “print” money to replace the lost income.

377767 ▶▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to Lucan Grey, 1, #615 of 1991 🔗

Debts will all be paid in nominal terms, through the destruction of the currency.

I answered your point elsewhere.

I shpuld have said ‘hyperinflation’ not ‘bankruptcy’.

Prople will still feel ‘bankrupt’ though. 🙂

377893 ▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to Lucan Grey, 3, #616 of 1991 🔗

Explain why the UK needed to bring in the IMF in the 1970s and explain why Zimbabwe is not a model of economic success, having practiced money printing for many decades.

377747 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, 12, #617 of 1991 🔗

The notion that the 1948 establishment of the NHS leads inevitably and directly to the fascism that was introduced on 23 March 2020 is absurd. National health care in Belarus has a much longer history, yet it did not introduce draconian restrictions. New York, in contrast, has private health care and introduced draconian restrictions, whereas, other US states, also with private health care, didn’t. There isn’t even a correlation.

377808 ▶▶▶ Clancloch, replying to Steve Hayes, 3, #618 of 1991 🔗

Quite agree – in retrospect at its inception the NHS was a bizarre public /private hybrid in the wrong way with all the perverse and conflicting benefits and problems whereby some parts of it notably GP provision was under a private practice contractor arrangement
With an important although unwritten ‘rule’ of ensuring that the GPS filled the role of gatekeeper regarding onward specialist referral, a defacto rationing – encouraging to keeping waiting lists high which had the dual effect of showing that more resources from Gov are required due to demand and keeping the specialists lucrative private practices well stocked with patient referrals.
And to my eyes still too much of a reactive institution rather than preventative. The growth of type2 diabetes and obesity over the last 20 years is astonishing.
Having said that both Germany and France whose health provision and outcomes, which have been generally been held to be more successful than the NHS, haven’t had much effect on politics.
Although of course in the UK the NHS has been a wonderful emotional tool.
Would some of this have been so successful before the current financial state of the media and smart phones. I suspect not.

377811 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, 5, #619 of 1991 🔗

The notion that the 1947 establishment of the NHS leads inevitably and directly to the fascism that was introduced on 23 March 2020 is absurd . ”

I think there is a clear link, based on the cultural effects discussed.

You disagree, fine, but this is not an issue where straight national comparisons are really possible due to the complexities involved. In our culture, I think it’s pretty clear and obvious how, in our case, the NHS has promoted safetyism and the acceptance of state responsibility for health.

377836 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Steve Hayes, -1, #620 of 1991 🔗

Yes – there’s a lot of simplistic absurdity about that serves 77th Brigade without them having to lift a finger.

377854 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, #621 of 1991 🔗

Gosh, funny how it’s the people whose politics you dislike who “serve 77th Brigade”, eh? Remarkable coincidence.

377729 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 11, #622 of 1991 🔗

the 6 ”look him in him eyes” posters above the line are brilliant! and hit the spot perfectly.

A while back an article above in the blog argued that we have to direct the message to peoples emotions as many simple don’t understand graphs or data – these posters do just that and may click peoples critically thinking switches

get the printing presses printing…….

377915 ▶▶ TheOriginalBlackPudding, replying to Major Panic, 2, #623 of 1991 🔗

I suggested the other evening that some of the “look him/her in the eyes” memes should be projected onto hospitals as Recovery did some months ago. Anyone in contact with Recovery who can get them to crank up their projectors again? Or anyone else got the wherewithal to do it?

377736 keenrikki, 1, #624 of 1991 🔗

Where is your line in the sand for taking bolder protest?

We sceptics owe an immense amount of gratitude to Toby et al for these daily attempts to seek out Reason. However is it not increasingly futile to challenge insanity with sanity?

When do we put down our screens?

377761 ▶▶ isobar, replying to Caramel, 3, #626 of 1991 🔗

Definitely worth a read, explains a lot!

377744 kh1485, replying to kh1485, 20, #627 of 1991 🔗

Excellent quote:

377756 ▶▶ keenrikki, replying to kh1485, #628 of 1991 🔗

Trying to Reason in the Twittersphere is increasingly futile.

Where will protests be organised from and when?

377858 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to keenrikki, #629 of 1991 🔗

Agree. I got this from gab.

378603 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to kh1485, 1, #630 of 1991 🔗

Read one I liked recently, ancient Chinese wisdom probably.

Everyone has two lives.
The second begins when they realise that they have only one.

Trying hard to live by that for whatever is left.

377749 Ned of the Hills, replying to Ned of the Hills, 4, #631 of 1991 🔗

Neath the dubious ad featured above is the comment :-

Obviously the wording should read “Around 1 in 3 people who have the virus have no COVID-19 symptoms….(and are it without knowing it)

Even that would be highly contentious surely? Where is the “science” for it?

But yea, it is the corner stone which holds up the whole lockdown structure.

377776 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Ned of the Hills, 2, #632 of 1991 🔗

You can probably get there using a PCR test to 45 cycle…but then it’s nonsense on stilts of course

377825 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Ned of the Hills, #633 of 1991 🔗

Where is the “science” for it?”

There is none – as with so much of the government narrative.

377750 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 9, #634 of 1991 🔗

Great to have @SirGrahamBrady ‘s support!

Significant intervention by the Chairman of the influential 1922 Committee of Conservative MPs.

Join Sir Graham & tens of thousands of others across the UK by using the hashtag #REOPENSCHOOLS



377751 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Victoria, 8, #635 of 1991 🔗

Here is the image – right click and save to downloads

377941 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to Victoria, 3, #636 of 1991 🔗

On the one hand, I understand the tactic that he’s using – it’s a wedge issue and it’s also the first step in getting people back to work and things back to normal.

But on the other hand, I don’t give a f**k about schools. They are indoctrination camps of mediocrity, undermining all competetive advantage the west ever had over the 3rd world.

377755 leggy, replying to leggy, 2, #637 of 1991 🔗

Does anyone read this article a little differently to the way it is portrayed?


377768 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to leggy, 11, #638 of 1991 🔗

92 and with dementia?! Sounds like a merciful release to me. I for one do not wish to live like that and if I had a relative in that state I’d be praying every night for their misery to end. There was a reason we used to call bronchitis “the old mans friend”.

An old lady of 90 recently told off my 71 mother in law for saying she was lucky to reach such a venerable age. She said there was nothing lucky about it sitting around watching yourself and everything you valued in life diminish and decay.

377817 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 4, #639 of 1991 🔗

One thought I’ve had is about what sort of life a lot of people have had if they can view the current situation with equanimity and acceptance? It must have been pretty impoverished.

377850 ▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to leggy, 5, #640 of 1991 🔗

Sorry but why did they bother? Confused and in a care home, they’d have been better off taking her for an outing in her wheelchair in the fresh air, she might have had one last hour of enjoyment before dying.

377760 AngloWelshDragon, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 15, #641 of 1991 🔗

I see the push for compulsory N95 masks in shops is cranking up. Presumably the cloth face covering crowd and the fashion mask wearers (sequins anyone?) are the latest cohort with “blood on their hands”? Does anyone seriously imagine these masks are ever properly cleaned or disposed of as they are supposed to be?

How much has been spent so far on “face coverings” by the British public? Clearly they think we have nothing to spend our money these days but masks!

I do feel a strong sense of a schadenfreude that all those yummy mummy Cath Kidston floral cotton masks, SNP tartan masks and hideous black neoprene monstrosities may soon be off to the landfill!

377765 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 10, #642 of 1991 🔗

N95 masks are also useless and I don’t think they come in cheap either.

I will laugh like a drain if those who have been virtue signalling by making their own are forced to ditch them. I’ve lost count of how many cotton masks I’ve seen discarded during my walks.

377977 ▶▶▶ ElizaP, replying to Bart Simpson, 4, #643 of 1991 🔗

There’s a thread there right now on that huge website http://www.moneysavingexpert.com where the sheeple are getting their knickers in a twist wondering about wearing heavy-duty type masks. The links they have given (in all seriousness!!) show these type seem to cost around £4-£5 each.

377770 ▶▶ leggy, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 6, #644 of 1991 🔗

The N95 will become the new uniform of the covidian.

377780 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to leggy, 16, #645 of 1991 🔗

Even medical grade masks are useless in civilian settings or for purposes other than that for which they were intended. Does anyone seriously believe anyone washes or replaces masks as they are supposed to? If you glance into parked cars you see them on dashboards, seats, in foot wells and crammed into cup holders. You might as well strap a Petri dish, used nappy or panty pad to your face!

378423 ▶▶▶▶ Prof Feargoeson, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #646 of 1991 🔗

Don’t forget the ones that have replaced furry dice!

377781 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 4, #647 of 1991 🔗

How much do N95 masks cost? I mean, if you can’t afford such crap to visit your local shop or go into your office, what are they recommending? That you continue with an ineffective cloth mask for shits and giggles?

377794 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 5, #648 of 1991 🔗

No idea how much they cost and don’t intend to google it as I will then be dogged by adverts for them whenever I’m on line. Somebody (British importer spivs and Chinese manufacturers?) are clearly making a fortune. Can’t even shop at on line supermarkets like Ocado without a suggestion you add a box of masks or a pack of 5 cotton face coverings in your trolley when you try to checkout. They will be telling us we need to wear one to shop on line next!

377903 ▶▶▶▶ TheOriginalBlackPudding, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #649 of 1991 🔗

B&Q are already more or less there with the line “Whether you are shopping in store or online we urge you to socially distance”. Wanchors.

377810 ▶▶ RickH, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 1, #650 of 1991 🔗

C’mon – be fair. When most useful jobs have been sanctioned, there’s got to be pointless ways to fill your boots – especially if you’re a party donor.

377848 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 2, #651 of 1991 🔗

Are N95 masks the ones that require fitting to the individual?

377856 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to p02099003, 2, #652 of 1991 🔗

No idea. You can buy them on line but i would imagine in a hospital setting – as in Construction where I work – people get specific training on how to wear PPE properly. Whatever you believe about masks, if people don’t use them properly they are just more virtue signalling, performative flimflam! As we say in the equestrian world about a certain kind of horsewoman: all the gear and no idea!

378326 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #653 of 1991 🔗

I think the only solution is a mask made of rubber. This will kill the fucktard who is wearing it fast, the more of these bastards who die the better and the sooner we can get back to normal.

377766 Edumacated eejit, replying to Edumacated eejit, 13, #654 of 1991 🔗

“After My Mum Was Taken Away in an Ambulance, She Disappeared into the System.”
No surprises there. What one needs to realise is that this darling-of-the-people NHS is a bloated, nationalised, service industry straight out of ‘poor man of Europe’ union-ridden Britain of the 1970s. It is not a compassionate organisation. Many, many good people work in it on the front line but they have to shut their eyes to the inefficiency, the 70s union mentality, the appalling waste; many others are in the wrong job.

377818 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to Edumacated eejit, 8, #655 of 1991 🔗

I have had some terrible experienes with the NHS over the years, as I know many other have. I stopped thinking the doctors really know anything a long time ago. The best doctor, in my experience, is one who is willing to listen and look at information you provide from peer reviewed sources. Without that, your chances of a non standard diagnosis are very slight.

The NHS needs people to be ill – without that they’d be out of a job – they don’t do proper prevention.

377835 ▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to this is my username, 3, #656 of 1991 🔗

Behind heart disease and cancer, medical error is the largest cause of death in the US.

250 000 per year in the US.


378161 ▶▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to this is my username, 2, #657 of 1991 🔗

I was discussing GP services with a relative a few days ago. Neither of us is a regular visitor to the GP practice – in fact, being a dog owner, I have much more experience of vets and the same observation applies. These ‘experts’ scoff arrogantly at the patient who comes to them with a self-diagnosis gleaned from the internet but as soon as you tell them what your/your dog’s symptoms are they turn to their screens and search for guidance from the internet.

377772 RickH, 7, #658 of 1991 🔗

The recent Talk Radio Mike O’Brien/Neil Oliver slot is very good indeed :


377773 Suey, replying to Suey, 15, #659 of 1991 🔗

They have to keep lockdown going, so that they can keep furlough going. At a rough estimate, I imagine two-thirds of furloughed jobs are entirely non-viable. Taking away furlough payments will turn the UK into a bankrupt basket case.

377790 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Suey, 3, #660 of 1991 🔗

I’ve always thought the point of furlough was to at some point migrate those recipients into some form of UBI.

377814 ▶▶▶ leggy, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 5, #661 of 1991 🔗

That’s essentially what it is already. They just haven’t got the the “universal” bit yet.

378333 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to leggy, 1, #662 of 1991 🔗

yer forget getting 80% of your usual payoff, how about 20%, with strings attached….yes you have to go and pick turnips, don’t worry accommodation will be provided, don’t worry its off grid.

377885 ▶▶▶ TheClone, replying to Seansaighdeoir, #663 of 1991 🔗

You will owe nothing and you will be happy! You’ll get handouts from government!

377807 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to Suey, 3, #664 of 1991 🔗

But furlough is turning the UK into a bankrupt basket case. The choice is either to bankrupt the UK now or bankrupt it later whilst also burying it in debt.

377843 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to Cristi.Neagu, 13, #665 of 1991 🔗

All the politicians care about is keeping kicking the can down the road in the hope someone else will get blamed or everyone will forget exactly who and what caused the disaster.

My concern is not simply that those furloughed jobs no longer exist but people that have not worked for a year are losing skills and motivation. Their work ethic – perhaps built up over decades – has been deliberately demolished by the state.

In a few short weeks the furlough scheme will have been going for a whole year and is set to go on much longer. Let’s not forget that according to the government itself being unemployed for 12 months plus is long term unemployment. These people are recognised as being the hardest group to get back into work and in the older age group are very likely never to work again.

377774 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 14, #666 of 1991 🔗

I wonder if, one day, the use of propaganda scientists against the population will be deemed a crime against humanity

377785 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Major Panic, 11, #667 of 1991 🔗

It already is: see the trial of Julius Streicher by the Nuremberg Tribunal. He was charged with crimes against humanity. The prosecution claimed that he produced propaganda. He claimed that he had produced journalism. The Tribunal found him guilty and he was hanged.

377832 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, 4, #668 of 1991 🔗

But that was victor’s justice, and for victor’s justice you need a war and a victory.

You will not see that used against any of the current propagandists, short of a situation that will render all our current concerns trivial..

377857 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, 2, #669 of 1991 🔗

That is not what was said by the judges and prosecutors.

We must never forget that the record on which we judge these defendants today is the record on which history will judge us tomorrow. To pass these defendants a poisoned chalice is to put it to our own lips as well.

From the opening statement of Robert Jackson

377876 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, 4, #670 of 1991 🔗

Not the first or the last time that elites have claimed high-minded principles that would have been remarkably inconvenient for the powerful if honestly and consistently applied, and were subsequently never applied again, or never except against the enemies of the powerful.

Remind me, how many of the propagandists who enabled the aggression in Iraq were punished for their crimes?

Explain how it turned out that in this country, more than half a century after those trials, waging a war of aggression was not in fact a criminal offence. ( I don’t mean how Blair evaded prosecution in that particular case, I mean how it came to pass that the House of Lords formally ruled that it was not in fact illegal in the UK to wage a war of aggression).

378042 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, #671 of 1991 🔗

War of aggression is illegal in international law. I do not know of any domestic law that denies or contradicts this. Do you have a link/reference?

378084 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, #672 of 1991 🔗

“Former Iraqi general, Abdulwaheed al-Rabbat attempted to pursue Blair, former foreign secretary Jack Straw and former attorney general Lord Goldsmith for the crime of aggression. However, Lord Thomas, the Lord Chief Justice, and Mr Justice Ouseley held that the crime of aggression is unknown in English law , in Al-Rabbat v Blair [2017] EWHC 1969 (Admin).
It held it was bound by the unanimous House of Lords‘ decision in R v Jones (Margaret) [2007] 1 AC 136, in the context of the invasion of Iraq, that although there was a crime of aggression under customary international law, there was no such crime as the crime of aggression under the law of England and Wales .
Giving the lead judgment, Lord Thomas said it was ‘for Parliament and Parliament alone’ to make the crime part of domestic law.”

[Bold added]

378115 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, #673 of 1991 🔗


378124 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Mark, #674 of 1991 🔗

I have to say that I find the judgement on its face perverse, as there is universal jurisdiction for war crimes and crimes against humanity, therefore the court ought to hear such cases, rather than rule that there is not an English common law (although the trial of Charles I would suggest there is) or English statute. It sounds like the judges were politically motivated.

378176 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, #675 of 1991 🔗

No, it’s not perverse or politically motivated I don’t think, it’s a correct interpretation of the position in English law. International law does not determine the law in this country unless Parliament approves it doing so. And that’s correct, imo.

The same would probably have been true for German leaders tried after WW2 under the law in Germany pre-WW2. They would never have been convicted for the things they were tried for, because they were the government at the time and governments were allowed to do those things, pretty much (I’m talking about law, not morality – the separation is crucial). That’s why victor’s justice was required. We basically made up laws and created a court to provide the punishments we wanted to inflict. It’s one thing to say that they deserved to die for what they did (I would probably agree, in some cases at least), but pretending it was some kind of dawn of a new principled era is just fantasy. In some ways Stalin’s reportedly desired approach of just shooting them all out of hand would have been more honest.

Your criticism regarding the HoL decisions should be directed not at the lawyers, but at the generations of UK politicians who failed (conveniently) to get around to incorporating these principles after Nuremberg, and the media figures who either failed to understand this or chose not to raise it as an issue.

378090 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Steve Hayes, #676 of 1991 🔗

I do not know of any domestic law that denies or contradicts this .”

You don’t know about it for the very good reason that our media was remarkably lockstep, over decades, in not making a big deal out of what one might imagine was actually quite a significant finding.

My experience has been that you are far from alone in the false assumption you made there. Only those with a particular and active interest in the issue tend to have noticed it.

377899 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Mark, 1, #677 of 1991 🔗

Absolutely correct, Mark.

378021 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Mark, 2, #678 of 1991 🔗

Doesn’t matter, it’s precedent.

378036 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Nick Rose, #679 of 1991 🔗

Precedent in what court? (See my comment below about the (non-)crime of aggression in English law)

377792 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Major Panic, 1, #680 of 1991 🔗

It should be because it is.

377809 ▶▶ Cristi.Neagu, replying to Major Panic, 2, #681 of 1991 🔗

Probably not. They’ve been doing it for decades and getting away with it.

377782 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 11, #682 of 1991 🔗

Debenhams sold to Bohoo – all physical shops to close – 12,000 people to lose their jobs

377804 ▶▶ NorthumbrianNomad, replying to Victoria, 18, #683 of 1991 🔗

The tip of the iceberg. Full steam ahead to much bigger damage. Lockdown sceptics keelhauled for suggesting that the ship’s hull is going to get ripped apart. “Iron is much harder than ice! Everyone knows this! It’s the science!”

377831 ▶▶ WasSteph, replying to Victoria, 6, #684 of 1991 🔗

Bad news for the staff but Debenhams have been a basket case for years. Much more worrying is that previously totally viable businesses are being torn apart now.

377842 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to WasSteph, 4, #685 of 1991 🔗

So now the number of underpaid workers in Leicester is going to double.

377896 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to WasSteph, 3, #686 of 1991 🔗

John Lewis next? They’ve already gone woke, and we all know what the next step is…..

377840 ▶▶ Spikedee1, replying to Victoria, 10, #687 of 1991 🔗

My wife works in defence is WFH and zooms her ass off all day. The company are looking at their sites for their workers and saying, why do we need these expensive buildings in Essex and London? Not thought this through have you mr Handjob. What happens when you no longer earn any revenue from rent and rates and electricity? Oh dear!

377924 ▶▶▶ jb12, replying to Spikedee1, 4, #688 of 1991 🔗

All part of the plan. After everyone is set up to work from home, work that can will then become ‘gig’ work and be offered out to people in the third world at a fraction of the cost – ‘inclusive capitalism’ according to the Guardians of Inclusive Capitalism (that is really what they call themselves, headed by a Rothschild) that just put themselves in partnership with the Vatican.

377931 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to Victoria, #689 of 1991 🔗

Where am I going to go now for tartan slippers and nylon trousers??? 🙁

377786 stefarm, 2, #690 of 1991 🔗

Max Igan in the crowhouse.

A good one.


377787 alw, replying to alw, 7, #691 of 1991 🔗

A Belgian judgement on masks.

The judge recognised that the current health situation justifies a restriction of freedom of movement and the imposition of certain measures. However, he considered that these measures must have a legal basis – parliament had not legislated to authorise the restrictive measures taken by the various ministers since the beginning of the crisis – and that they must be compatible with the other rights in force.”


377798 ▶▶ RickH, replying to alw, 24, #692 of 1991 🔗

The UK is beginning to show the ‘Cradle of Democracy’/’Mother of Parliaments’ myth as the constitutional bollocks that it is.

When do we get a judgment that might give us some pride?

377797 p02099003, 4, #694 of 1991 🔗

The infection rate is still too high to consider opening schools, although R < 1 according to the incumbent of #10. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55791914

377801 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 17, #695 of 1991 🔗

Double standards in full flow. My take on this: Elderly person dies with COVID – “a tragic loss”. Elderly person dies after COVID vaccination: “Not unexpected – they were old and frail”. Take a look at this from Ireland’s Journal. A few amazing extracts with my emphasis:

No deaths in Europe directly linked to Covid vaccine, experts say https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-vaccine-not-linked-to-deaths-5334157-Jan2021/

  • DESPITE DOZENS OF deaths of people shortly after they were vaccinated against coronavirus, scientists say the evidence available so far does not incriminate the new anti-Covid vaccines .
  • Health agencies say the vast majority of post-vaccination fatalities were among people who were elderly, already vulnerable and often sick .
  • The European Medicines Agency said that despite the deaths, “to date no specific concerns have been identified with Comirnaty”, the commercial name for the Pfizer shot.
  • “It is not unexpected that some of these people may naturally fall ill due to their age or underlying conditions shortly after being vaccinated, without the vaccine playing any role in that,” the UK medicines regulator MHRA said .
  • The deaths are a highly sensitive issue , and approaches to informing the public vary.
  • France and some Nordic countries have reported post-vaccination deaths and detailed the potential side effects of the jabs even if no link has been established. But Britain’s MHRA said it would make a statement at a later date, possibly seeking to avoid spreading alarm .
  • “We will publish details of all suspected reactions reported in association with approved Covid-19 vaccines, along with our assessment of the data on a regular basis in the future ,” it said.
377816 ▶▶ WasSteph, replying to godowneasy, 4, #696 of 1991 🔗

Too true. Similar comments on the medscape article linked by an earlier commentator.

377870 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to godowneasy, 3, #697 of 1991 🔗

Thejournal.ie is a complete dandelion, online rag. I have stopped reading it as I won’t give them the pleasure of clicks on their bilge.

377883 ▶▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Ewan Duffy, 1, #698 of 1991 🔗

Someone described it as a digital arsewipe. I go there mostly to have a laugh at the comments!

377962 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Ewan Duffy, 1, #699 of 1991 🔗

Just look into who owns it.

377972 ▶▶ Pebbles, replying to godowneasy, 4, #700 of 1991 🔗

Great post. Just flagrant…yet to be expected. But the general public is so thick that I think lots more acute pain must come before they even begin to consider waking up their minds have been hijacked by the Covid cult. Remember… vaccines are the gravy train of Big Pharma. We have been indoctrinated for years that they are safe safe safe… best you can do is educate yourself and your surroundings about ADE and why coronavirus is potentially a ticking time bomb and what mRNA vaccines actually do.

377803 Victoria, 6, #701 of 1991 🔗

Businessman @simondolan , who challenged the Government’s lockdown in court, has launched a campaign urging the Treasury to write off ‘crippling’ Covid loans taken on by SMEs.


Are you a small business owner? Sign up to pledge your support, join the campaign and make your voice heard


377805 Jo Starlin, replying to Jo Starlin, 46, #702 of 1991 🔗

My daughter just came downstairs very happy and told me that her two best friends have both been accepted at Cambridge.

I felt like saying “so bloody what? What good is it to them now?” But I didn’t have the heart.

I’m very, very depressed today.

377841 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to Jo Starlin, 12, #703 of 1991 🔗

Bless her – that optimism is so fragile. I understand your feelings of depression today – nothing seems to be getting any better. I think things will only change when there is a political benefit to it (e.g. if Boris thinks he might lose the leadership of the Conservative Party).

377868 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to Jo Starlin, 7, #704 of 1991 🔗

I know someone waiting for news and planning to read engineering. On balance I’m sure it will do a lot of good.

Good for you biting your tongue, not easy at the moment!

377956 ▶▶ vargas99, replying to Jo Starlin, 7, #705 of 1991 🔗

Cambridge Tesco’s?

377973 ▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to vargas99, #706 of 1991 🔗

Lol.I needed that, thanks.

377959 ▶▶ vargas99, replying to Jo Starlin, 5, #707 of 1991 🔗

I hope to God they aren’t doing PPE – there’s enough of those twats in Parliament as it is

377971 ▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to vargas99, 2, #708 of 1991 🔗

No, biology and maths.

377813 Bart Simpson, replying to Bart Simpson, 26, #709 of 1991 🔗

Over the last few months, its been despairing to see many people who have been brainwashed and just far gone.

Last Saturday, Mr Bart and I were at a park in Brixton. We decided to get some coffees before continuing and saw a coffee shop across the park. To get to the cafe, there are two crossings you need to use.

I made my way to crossing number 1 and this bloke next to me looked terrified (he was muzzled) and moved away as if I was a leper.

We moved on to crossing number 2 and noticing that no-one had pressed the button so I moved closer to press the button and same bloke moved away again nearly tripping and falling onto the main road.

Makes me wish that he got run over by a car to teach him a lesson.

What is it about these people where they get scared by a virus with a 99.98% survival rate and end up in situations where they’re more likely to die or sustain an injury by getting run over by a car or having something fall over them.

377822 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Bart Simpson, 8, #710 of 1991 🔗

Inability to appreciate relative risk?

378009 ▶▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to Steve Hayes, 3, #711 of 1991 🔗

Agree. Plus losing all sense of proportion.

377821 TheBigman, replying to TheBigman, 19, #712 of 1991 🔗

Sooooooooooooo is everyone still thinking that the notion of anything untoward is a ‘conspiracy theory’?

Read about the extension of govt control without any word and then, as the latest NHS propaganda adverts say, look me in the eye and tell me this is about a virus response?

Its the devastation they need. Devastation makes the weak and uninformed easy prey to conspiring wolves.

There is now admission to what us sceptics have been saying for the longest time; the virus is going nowhere. It is endemic. It’s severity could be mitigated by having greater natural immunity. But they locked us down to stop that happening.

As compliant sheep we are now at their complete mercy as they move the final pieces of control into place.

Anytime someone steps out of line they are now a ‘denier’. Thus with the use of that word they will be added to the pyre of those that ‘deny’ (questions) such things as climate change or ‘hate speech’. Things to which the answers always seem to be the same; less freedoms, more laws/fines and more poverty.

I’d rather die on my feet than live on my knees.

377847 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to TheBigman, 8, #713 of 1991 🔗

The risk the peopple face is dependence on the state – that will be slavery. Don’t want the jab? No UBI for you. A very dangerous situation which most are completely unaware of.

377859 ▶▶ straightalkingyorkshireman, replying to TheBigman, 20, #714 of 1991 🔗

I didn’t think I was capable of such hatred that I now feel towards the perpetrators of all this. Pissing away people’s livelihoods and my childrens education, not to mention my sanity. They can all rot in hell. On a lighter note I really hope there’s a big showing of support this coming saturday. I’ll be out in the town visiting as many open establishments as I can.

377873 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to TheBigman, 3, #715 of 1991 🔗

They are either too stupid to pull it over or too spinless to be only puppets! While I am more inclined towards their stupidity their cowardice should also be taken into account.

377823 Silke David, replying to Silke David, 24, #716 of 1991 🔗

I posted yesterday that I had an allergic reaction to sanitizer on the shopping trolley.
I posted a short statement on Nextdoor.org asking people to be considerate and not overdue it with sanitizer.
I had 20 or so replies I should wear gloves then, order online etc.
The comments made me very upset.
I added another comment that surface transmission does not exist.

Now my account has been suspended as it went against community guidelines.

My local town is so brainwashed, it is horrendous!

377851 ▶▶ alw, replying to Silke David, 5, #717 of 1991 🔗

Don’t use Nextdoor ever. Full of scams at the moment and my neighbours nearly got caught out. There is no way you can verify if the person posting is genuine.

377894 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to alw, 2, #718 of 1991 🔗

While we’re on about scams, I’d suggest that nobody have anything to do with a company called Easylife- it’s a sort of lower-market Wilko’s, they sell the sort of stuff you see advertised in Radio Times. I ordered from them once and had to get a new debit card as a result, plus scam ‘phone calls which persisted for some time. Looking online, I found my experience was by no means unique.

378137 ▶▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to alw, 3, #719 of 1991 🔗

Nextdoor is soul destroying. All you get on there are people moaning about groups of youngsters not social distancing in the local park “Their parents must know who they are”… people not wearing masks in Asda…dog shit on the pavements (even with photos in case we don’t know what it looks like)…their car being bumped in the local supermarket car park “I’ve reported it to the police with the time and date. Did anyone see anything?” as if they were the first to have ever experienced this.

Full of self-righteous people but if you dare mention (as I have done) that the lockdown is all based on lies and destroying people’s lives and livelihoods, they jump down your throat and don’t want to look at the evidence – perhaps I should pin it to a pile of steaming dog poo!

377874 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Silke David, 8, #720 of 1991 🔗

Feel your pain. Every time I appealed to customers not to use it anywhere near me, they did an eye-roll and ignored me. Such kindness, such empathy …

377947 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Silke David, 5, #721 of 1991 🔗

Look on the bright side : every bit of this censorship is indirect confirmation of the rightness of your argument.

378351 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Silke David, 3, #722 of 1991 🔗

Nextdoor.org is at the forefront of driving this new communitarian governance structure.

It is literally an interface with the state and it is designed to reach into every household in every street in the country.

It is there to synthesize a new virtual community to replace one that has been shattered systematically over the last 20 years. The real community was deliberately destroyed as it could not be controlled. There was a void for this government social media service to be rolled out into. THE BIG SOCIETY. Remember?

I think this service is pure evil and well worth staying away from, furthermore I think it is necessary to stop people using it at every oppertunity and try to point out to them how it will be the electronic enabler of a literal STASI in every street in the country.

378465 ▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to Two-Six, #723 of 1991 🔗

I did quite find it useful for recommendations for tradespeople.

379021 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Silke David, #724 of 1991 🔗

yes perhaps but I find this nextdoor thing particularly sinister. That said I do like freecycle or freegle and that’s similar although its scope is pretty limited.

377839 p02099003, 5, #725 of 1991 🔗

The 1 in 3 poster should actually read: “1 in 3 people who have tested positive have no or probably more accurately “9 in 10 people who have tested positive have no symptoms”

377849 mattghg, replying to mattghg, 4, #726 of 1991 🔗

So … “the great reopening” on 30 Jan. Is it going to happen? And if so, how will I be able to find out in advance which businesses to patronise?

377888 ▶▶ Scouse Sceptic, replying to mattghg, 1, #727 of 1991 🔗

It’ll be announced/confirmed nearer the time.
The official group can be found via Telegram at https://t.me/THEGREATREOPENING

377855 Tyneside Tigress 2021, replying to Tyneside Tigress 2021, 7, #728 of 1991 🔗

Adam Boulton on Sky. Assume he is doing his show from home, as he has just returned from Washington DC. Thing is, he seems to have had a hair cut – did he do it himself?

377935 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Tyneside Tigress 2021, 11, #729 of 1991 🔗

Watching the lockdown propagandists exhorting everyone to follow the rules with their immaculate hair styling has been an ever present source of amusement for me during the lockdowns.

I particularly enjoyed it when Piers Morgan resorted to showing a picture of his wife stood behind him, holding a pair of scissors, and telling us that she styled his hair. He elaborated saying she had watched a tutorial on YouTube (who knew it only took minutes to become a hair stylist?).

Another example I particularly enjoyed was watching an epidemiologist on BBC Breakfast saying everyone should maintain at least two metres from everyone else. His hair was perfectly styled.

For me the humour lies in the fact that this behaviour reveals: (1) how stupid and gullible they think we are; and (2) how easily they deceive themselves and how superior they think they are.

377946 ▶▶▶ stefarm, replying to Steve Hayes, 17, #730 of 1991 🔗

I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again

Piers Morgan is a……..wanker

377969 ▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to Steve Hayes, 2, #731 of 1991 🔗

I remember Mark Steyn last summer asking who was doing Fauci’s hair and being ridiculed for it.

378012 ▶▶▶▶ Fiona Walker, replying to Jo Starlin, 6, #732 of 1991 🔗

I watched the football last night and thought the same thing, all the elaborate corn rows, dye jobs, man buns and razor shapes. Anyway, good on the players, they’re still doing the hugging and kissing bit when they score despite instructions.

378026 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to Fiona Walker, 5, #733 of 1991 🔗

Damn, one of those areas where a bit of increased social distancing would be an unalloyed improvement in the culture….

377860 p02099003, 4, #734 of 1991 🔗

The medical union, the BMA, are worried about the 12 week gap between injection 1 and injection 2. https://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/news/clinical-areas/immunology-and-vaccines/bma-calls-for-dialogue-with-cmo-about-cutting-12-week-vaccine-interval they’re probably concerned about their liability.

377861 The Covid Kid, replying to The Covid Kid, 21, #735 of 1991 🔗

I’d look him in the eyes and say this….. Sorry Tony but you’ve only got yourself to blame for not shielding properly. Besides, you’ve had your three score and ten (and many more by the look of things!) We can’t all live forever you know. Anyway, there’s a 14 year old cancer patient who really needs your bed. So, on yer bike!

377900 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to The Covid Kid, 9, #736 of 1991 🔗


378303 ▶▶ Prof Feargoeson, replying to The Covid Kid, 1, #737 of 1991 🔗

Look him in the eyes and tell him his Equity card isn’t real.

377862 kpaulsmith1463, replying to kpaulsmith1463, 21, #738 of 1991 🔗

BREAKING: Starmer self-isolates for THIRD time.
This is beyond absurd, now.
And just think of the impact all of these absent parliamentarians are having on the Whitehall cocaine economy.

378360 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to kpaulsmith1463, 1, #739 of 1991 🔗

I don’t think you can snort coke through a face nappy, some of it MIGHT get through…who knows…

377866 FooledAgain, replying to FooledAgain, 18, #740 of 1991 🔗

Talking of misleading Government/NHS ads (propaganda) when walking the other day I saw, on an electronic board, the one about “stay in, protect the NHS, save lives”. The next ad that came onto the very same board stated “abusers work from home”. The irony of all of this is clearly lost on Government, SAGE, NHS management.

377878 ▶▶ alw, replying to FooledAgain, 4, #741 of 1991 🔗

Staying in is bad for your health. More likely to have a stroke as a result.

378085 ▶▶ Bart Simpson, replying to FooledAgain, #742 of 1991 🔗

Noticed the same thing too. Funny that its us who have noticed the irony.

377872 mhcp, replying to mhcp, 9, #743 of 1991 🔗

Again, if 1 in 3 people have the virus then in 10 days 1 in 3 are immune from Covid. Which also means that 1 in 3 had it in the first “wave” so there’s your herd immunity.

If trite sayings are going to be expressed then they need to be pushed to their logical conclusion

377904 ▶▶ jb12, replying to mhcp, 2, #744 of 1991 🔗

And such logical conclusions are why terms like ‘herd immunity’ have been redefined – in that specific case, removing all indication that this can occur without pharmaceutical measures.

377875 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 5, #745 of 1991 🔗

Worrying news from Israel. I’m going out on a limb here – will vaccination be required before children go back to school? Will it also be used on children under 16 eventually? (It has not been trialled on children under 16).

Health officials: UK variant running wild, hitting children at a worrying rate https://www.timesofisrael.com/mutated-covid-19-strains-are-stymieing-efforts-to-curb-spread-virus-czar-says/

  • officials estimate some 40-50 percent of new daily cases are caused by the British variant.
  • the strain was causing concerning levels of infection in children and young people , as well as serious illness in a number of pregnant women.
  • She said that “40% of illness is in children, a higher percentage than their part in the population… We see a rise in infections in ages 6-9, which is exactly the age group that is supposed to go back to school ” when the tightened lockdown ends at the end of the month. “We’re monitoring it.”
  • She added that “the vaccine works against the British mutation but the virus infection rate is much faster than the vaccine rate.”
  • Ash said there was a very high probability that the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine that Israel is using for its mass immunization drive also works on the British variant, but it is still not clear how effective it is against other variants.
  • The government has set a goal of vaccinating the entire adult eligible population over the age of 16 by the end of March.
377895 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to godowneasy, 14, #746 of 1991 🔗

The Vaccine has not been tested on young people. There are worrying reports that the covid vaccine could impact fertility. Despite professionals demanding that this aspect should be investigated and trials done, nothing has ben done. However, there are numerous articles online stating that the covid vaccine will not impact fertility – how can they say that if it has not been investigated?

Children pick up infections all the time, but they recover quick – most of them have proper functioning immune systems.

Adults should improve their immune systems.

377907 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Victoria, 2, #747 of 1991 🔗

Is there any credibility to these reports of possible infertility?

I mean, if it’s a serious concern why have I never seen it mentioned above the line here?

Got any links?

377937 ▶▶▶▶ Pebbles, replying to AidanR, 5, #748 of 1991 🔗

There are tons of links and people who have spoken about it:
Dr Mike Yeadon… former VP of Pfizer
Dr Klaus Wodarg
Prof D Cahill

…here are two links that explain the problem with mRNA vaccines and Coronavirus vaccines the best IMHO:

(Never mind his religious affiliations… his scientific writing is easy, concise and spot on).

And of course the press isn’t going to pick up anything remotely critical about vaccines… that would open the floodgate to hell, considering that all pharmaceutical companies have been graciously made exempt from any liability by our dear government. The charade must be maintained. I bet 99% of British citizens who have had the vaccine by AstraZeneca would not know what ADE even is, let alone their doctor or nurse having explained it to them before administering them the vaccine.

377964 ▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Pebbles, #749 of 1991 🔗

Neither link seems to mention fertility at all. Am I missing something?

Honestly, this sounds like the sort of half-baked scaremongering cobblers that will be used to rubbish the entire anti-lockdown platform.

377989 ▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to AidanR, 2, #750 of 1991 🔗

Because this is a vaccine shill site.

378034 ▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to jb12, #751 of 1991 🔗

That’s a bit of a stretch…

378160 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to AidanR, 1, #752 of 1991 🔗

No, it isn’t…

378223 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to jb12, #753 of 1991 🔗

Then provide some evidence.

378254 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to AidanR, 1, #754 of 1991 🔗

Look up any of Jonathan Barr’s posts above the line about vaccines and how they are a way out of lockdowns, all without any critical analysis of their efficacy or, more importantly, danger.

377938 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Victoria, 14, #755 of 1991 🔗

The Vaccine has not been tested on young people.”

Lets cut through the government crap :

The vaccines have not been tested. Full stop. Not in any way that might be recognized as adequate.

377961 ▶▶▶▶ Mutineer, replying to RickH, 5, #756 of 1991 🔗

We are the guinea pigs. Or rather, the elderly and sick with damaged immunity (so the least likely to benefit from a vaccine and the most likely to have side effects) are the guinea pigs. It’s slaughter.

377922 ▶▶ Pebbles, replying to godowneasy, 7, #757 of 1991 🔗

As someone who worked in the Middle East for 5+ years directly in the heart of it all… (and who has extended family there and friends etc):

Israel is a totalitarian, religious, military state, under the disguise of a western democratic society. It combats the virus with the same contempt that it treats people in general (those who aren’t white, Ashkenazi Jewish to be exact).

King Bibi is a lying, deceiving, manipulating piece of work that some people have been trying to get rid of, to no avail, as too many still fall for his crap. The country is riddled with a narcissistic ego beyond imagination, traumatised from wars, emotionally handicapped, lacks empathy on all levels, fragmented to the extreme.

Their “war against Covid” was always going to be an all out war… shifting the country from what was left in democratic ways, to a totalitarian extension of The People’s Republic of China.

The majority of the populace is seeking the vaccine with open arms, believing it will be their salvation. Very few critical voices, dissent is wiped off the table. Since they have always been in love with their own science and technology, they don’t see anything wrong with a vaccine still in the clinical trial phase that may cause ADE (Antibody Dependent Enhancement) and a spectacular cytokine storm when the wild virus and a new variant hits, render the young generation infertile, or for that matter, potentially permanently alter your DNA.

Israel is a HIVE mind and well on its way to be absorbed by AI in a few years and inevitably, on the fast track to self-destruction. You are just watching the latter in slow-motion.

As for their bullcrap on the ‘British variant’: it’s just the pre-cursor for bringing in yet another vaccine with more mRNA technology in it. And they don’t give the remotest of f&^ about school children.

377932 ▶▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Pebbles, 1, #758 of 1991 🔗

Great comments thank you. Bibi has staked his re-election on the vaccine roll-out. If it goes wrong, then surely that’s him finished.

377951 ▶▶▶▶ Pebbles, replying to godowneasy, 3, #759 of 1991 🔗

He will only ever be finished if the Israeli public wakes up to the fact that they have entered a pact with the devil with these vaccines… and the vaccines themselves backfire… and people make the connection it is the vaccines backfiring (and not a super scary new variant).

For now the public has swallowed the vaccine salvation kool-aid hook, line and sinker, and the government can easily navigate around criticism by saying see we got all them vaccinated but that then this new variant came around… they might deliberately want to cause large swaths of the population to go infertile, given the infinite number of children produced by the religious groups… just saying.

377967 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to godowneasy, 1, #760 of 1991 🔗
377880 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 17, #761 of 1991 🔗

I understand the need to close the borders in March 2020 , but by almost February of 2021, not only has the horse bolted, it has galloped beyond the paddock, had its way with several mares, quenched its thirst at another farm’s set of troughs and arrived back home for rest.


377902 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to Victoria, 6, #762 of 1991 🔗

On the one hand I agree with him. On the other, shutting the borders is a superb way to bring all this to a head.

377998 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Victoria, 2, #763 of 1991 🔗

If they were going to secure the borders, it should have been done at the beginning of January 2020. The “experts’ advised the government that it would not work and would cause harm, so they decided not to do it, ie, to import the virus.

377886 Pebbles, replying to Pebbles, 6, #764 of 1991 🔗

Depressing update today from LS.

Nevertheless, we gotta keep going:

Great interview from Flu Fighters for Vit C as adjunctive therapy. Go to the website and sign the petition and do email your MP about it. Thanks.

377914 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Pebbles, 1, #765 of 1991 🔗

Yes Vitamin C is great in fighting viral infections – at the start of the lockdowns the WHO instructed media companies to censor any information about Vitamin C being helpful for covid infections. They sadly do not care about saving people’s lives.


Vitamin C Protects Against Coronavirus by Andrew W. Saul, Editor

377891 this is my username, replying to this is my username, 7, #766 of 1991 🔗

The headline on this:
“Makers of Sophia the robot plan to produce THOUSANDS of lifelike droids by the end of 2021 to provide company for people who are lonely and socially isolated during Covid-19 lockdowns”

When do they expect lockdown to end?

377897 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to this is my username, 7, #767 of 1991 🔗

If that doesn’t come with holes, expect them to be retrofitted within hours of release.

377918 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to AidanR, 5, #768 of 1991 🔗


377952 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #769 of 1991 🔗

Definitely don’t google ‘teledildonics’

378318 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to AidanR, 1, #770 of 1991 🔗

Definitely won’t ! 🙂


377984 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to AidanR, 1, #771 of 1991 🔗


377898 ▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to this is my username, 9, #772 of 1991 🔗

So not only will singletons like me be effectively locked up but we will have to pay thousands for a droid to keep us company? Of course, we will probably have to rent it because, after all, we will own nothing and be happy about it.

377985 ▶▶▶ jb12, replying to Ewan Duffy, 2, #773 of 1991 🔗

Hopefully you will wash it out afterwards.

377991 ▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ewan Duffy, #774 of 1991 🔗

Rent a sex droid? Sounds revolting!

377909 ▶▶ godowneasy, replying to this is my username, 7, #776 of 1991 🔗

Well they can fuck their robots.

377913 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to godowneasy, 4, #777 of 1991 🔗

As Aidan pointed out, they undoubtedly will…..

377955 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Mark, 3, #778 of 1991 🔗

I don’t know… I mean, who doesn’t have a perfectly serviceable Henry?

378022 ▶▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to AidanR, 1, #779 of 1991 🔗

Never understood the supposed appeal of vacuum suction in that regard, myself, but I’m a bit of a conservative and traditionalist on sexual activity generally…

377916 ▶▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to godowneasy, 4, #780 of 1991 🔗

I’m sure they will come with the appropriate adaptors to allow just that!

377921 ▶▶ AngloWelshDragon, replying to this is my username, 5, #781 of 1991 🔗

I wonder if they will need to set up rehoming centres for people that decide they can’t cope with a droid in the same way we see thousands of unwanted lockdown puppies?

377949 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to AngloWelshDragon, 3, #782 of 1991 🔗

Where are all the unwanted lockdown puppies? Every puppy I’ve seen has been north of 2K, usually more like 4!

My local dogs trust only has the usual mix of greyhounds, malamuts and mastiffs.

377953 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to AngloWelshDragon, #783 of 1991 🔗

See the movie AI.

377974 ▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to karenovirus, 1, #784 of 1991 🔗

Isn’t that the sequel to Kes?

377925 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to this is my username, 8, #785 of 1991 🔗

Really, could this get any more bloody dystopian.

378038 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to this is my username, 1, #786 of 1991 🔗

“All this has happened before. All this will happen again.”

377901 JamesM, replying to JamesM, 13, #787 of 1991 🔗

Many of the arguments on the Anti-virus Website are highly contentious and some are easily refuted. For example, the argument that … only with eradication can we be sure it [SARS-CoV-2] will not develop into a more dangerous form .  Well, many eminent scientists will tell O’Brien et al. that a zero-covid policy is not a practical proposition without the imposition of severe restrictions on people’s freedom for years to come. But what struck me most is that O’Brien fails to address a simple question, which is: at what point does the cure become worse than the problem? How much collateral damage is O’Brien prepared to tolerate?  Just to take one example: he may wish to sound compassionate for the elderly; but If the government intends to inflate away the debt (which a number of economists are now suggesting), then it will condemn many old people to poverty in their remaining years, which in turn will lead to increased mortality – the exception, of course, will be those people on gold-plated public-sector pensions, of which O’Brien will be one.

377979 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to JamesM, 1, #788 of 1991 🔗

It will affect them too. Inflation doesn’t discriminate.

377917 richlyon, 12, #790 of 1991 🔗

In the Duradiamond healthcare briefing, at 21:40, Dr Emslie notes the results of a recent German study showing that recovery from natural infection confers up to 95% immunity, with an effect that lasts for up to 8 months.

What a pity we have incurred one of the highest per-capita costs in the world and spent it on the goal of doing everything conceivable to prevent that process from occurring in the healthy population, through policies that the government estimated at the end of the first lockdown will lead to the deaths of 200,000 and Bristol University estimates is now closer to 540,000, and which have resulted in one of the highest per-capita death rates in the world due to the lack of resistance the virus now encounters in the healthy population in the winter acute respiratory infection season.

377930 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 39, #791 of 1991 🔗

If they are closing down the country and locking its doors because a new variant MIGHT emerge, they can never lift the restrictions.

Therefore the only options left for the public are

– acceptance of perpetual lockdown

– insurrection

I’m not CALLING for insurrection. But the other option isn’t an option for me. And I hope many others feel the same.

Time to get offline and into action.

377944 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 13, #792 of 1991 🔗

See what happened in Holland over the weekend. We may yet get there. I can’t wait personally.

378001 ▶▶ Tom in Scotland, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 10, #793 of 1991 🔗

The only way out of this is through a massive public ‘push’ for a change, either by large-scale peaceful protest or something else. I’ve thought this for months, and I fear that this push won’t happen until people’s daily lives get far worse through economic catastrophe or (I would hope) a combination of the normal springtime reduction of respiratory virus infections, lockdown fatigue, wondering why the ‘magic’ vaccine isn’t releasing us, and finally putting it all together and figuring out that we’ve been conned.

378118 ▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Tom in Scotland, 2, #794 of 1991 🔗

I agree this can’t go on, its clear parliament isn’t going stop this!

There is no effective political opposition & its clear the strategy is to destroy the opposition to a growing lockdown movement before it empowers the people by the usual methods of propaganda & discrediting individuals.

We have to be reminded however despite our strength in numbers v state thugs & complicit criminals, any form of violence is a gift to the state giving them permission for even greater brutality, there are conssequences when people loss the willingness to comply, i just hope the government understand everyone losses if our country resorts to violence in opposition to their malfeasance .

378236 ▶▶▶▶ Tom in Scotland, replying to Anti_socialist, 3, #795 of 1991 🔗

Yes, I hope it does not become violent, but I fear it might. My hope is that if there is sustained, non-violent protest across the UK, it will end up like the fuel protests in 2000. It really didn’t take that much before Tony Blair caved in.

I think many people here and abroad have had enough and once the weather improves across Europe, I hope compliance will fall apart. There are simply not enough police in this country to arrest everyone and the government’s credibility would collapse.

378281 ▶▶▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Tom in Scotland, 1, #796 of 1991 🔗

A very good idea & way to protest, gum up the works with a countrywide traffic jam, it would maintain gov cv19 diktat whilst effecting proactive protest.

Another benefit would be you could in theory do it outside your house with easy access to the loo when required ; – )

378033 ▶▶ ituex, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 10, #797 of 1991 🔗

I have emailed every sceptic mp, every cabinet minister, my useless mp, the Daily Telegraph letters, Planet Normal this morning. Hoping to find a business opening on 30th and will visit all I can find. If someone can think of something I can actually do I will do it.

377933 captainbeefheart, 19, #798 of 1991 🔗
377934 neilhartley, replying to neilhartley, 19, #799 of 1991 🔗

We’ve had 5 different trades people in the house working this morning. Fuck you Boris.

378175 ▶▶ mj, replying to neilhartley, 6, #800 of 1991 🔗

took my car to small garage for MOT check. owner was maskless, his mate was maskless, mate who gave me a lift back maskless, me maskless

was just like it was last January.

377940 karenovirus, replying to karenovirus, 32, #801 of 1991 🔗

Jeremy Vine featured Charles Walkers excellent speech about ‘smug’ people in big houses and gardens with secure salaries who enjoy lockdown while complaining about ‘covidiots’.

A Socialist journalist asked why Kier Starmer didn’t make that speech.

377970 ▶▶ Fiona Walker, replying to karenovirus, 9, #802 of 1991 🔗

They are usually partnered and have a couple of well behaved children and dog too so they get social interaction thrown in free. Not the same for a single person in a tower block.

378048 ▶▶▶ karenovirus, replying to Fiona Walker, 5, #803 of 1991 🔗

Or trying to work from home with two children who require home schooling

378064 ▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to Fiona Walker, 2, #804 of 1991 🔗

Caught a few minutes of News on BBC2 this morning. People writing in how they cope.
” a lot of people are grateful they have a dog”

378311 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Fiona Walker, 2, #805 of 1991 🔗

Now now. My children were all poorly behaved scallies. The dogs were good though, I’ll give ’em that.

377948 Anti_socialist, replying to Anti_socialist, 48, #806 of 1991 🔗

“Sceptics position” = focused protection.

Not this sceptic, I won’t be shamed & emotionally blackmailed by leftists. Let the fu*ker rip, i’m ready to defend your right to lock yourself in a broom cupboard sobbing into your n95 mask, whilst i assert my freedom to assess my own risk, if saving the NHS means perpetual slavery, then sod pull it down.

If I succumb to the covid lurgy, the righteous leftists can show us all how sympathetic & compassionate they are when they revel in delight!

I don’t trust anything the government say period……..

The tests don’t work
The masks don’t work
The social distancing don’t work
The lockdowns don’t work
The ventilators don’t work
The vaccines don’t work
The human rights (lawyers) don’t work
There’s anecdotal evidence NHS staff don’t do much work.

About the only thing that is working is state terrorism & police brutality. The very fact, that nearly 12 months on from initial awareness of covid19 deaths & infections are rising is evidence the governments response & interventions DON’T F*CK*NG WORK!

This is a political crisis it only gets resolved in freedom loving libertarians favour if we fight for that inalienable right to FREEDOM Its not their gift to take away, i’m more than willing to socially distance myself from socialism.

377960 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Anti_socialist, 2, #807 of 1991 🔗

“blackmailed by leftists”

I think – factually – oppression by the right of the Tory Party is more of a practical problem at the moment if you want to get into outmoded political shit.

377983 ▶▶▶ concrete68, replying to RickH, 3, #808 of 1991 🔗

It’s staring them in the face but they just won’t accept it…

378127 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to concrete68, 5, #809 of 1991 🔗

Seriously, do you have any explanation for why so many leftists so enthusiastically support it, and indeed criticise the government endlessly for not going far enough?

I know a lot on the left like to pretend Blairites “aren’t really left”, so let’s stick to Jeremy Corbyn for the moment – as we’ve see reported atl today, a “zero covid” moron, or at the least a sympathiser with that suicidal fanaticism.

Why? Is he “not really left” as well? Is he just too stupid to see through the manipulation by the supposed “right of the Tory party” supposedly behind this coronapanic?

He seems to have been clever enough to fool most of the non-Blairite left into supporting him, up until the election at any rate. Was it all a trick?

377986 ▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to RickH, 4, #810 of 1991 🔗

What’s “right” about the tory party?

You make to many assumptions, the neo-liberal political ‘ elite ‘ use decidedly leftists control methods!

The secound assumption you got wrong was I give a shit about political dogma, but your biggest mistake is the belief this isnt a political crisis.

378031 ▶▶▶▶ concrete68, replying to Anti_socialist, 1, #811 of 1991 🔗

Your entire frame of reference is standard political ideology. What alternative models are you offering? Indeed are you even aware of anything other than left/right.?

378053 ▶▶▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to concrete68, 6, #812 of 1991 🔗


At this time the dominant political movement is one of leftist liberal technocracy. Socialist ideologies are always authoritarian! I’ve got not love of national socialism either.

Civilisation & human societies are Political ignore it at your peril.

377996 ▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to RickH, 3, #813 of 1991 🔗

I think

It doesn’t appear that you do.

378015 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to RickH, 7, #814 of 1991 🔗

Sure it is, that’s why it’s so enthusiastically backed by hard rightists such as Jeremy “zero covid” Corbyn, ffs!

377950 THE REAL NORMAL PODCAST, 8, #815 of 1991 🔗

GETTING TOGETHER , with the lads to record the next episode of the Pod tonight. Has to be via Zoom as one of the boys is on a work trip up norf!

We’re going to be talking about Vaccines. Italy. How this will end.

Has anyone got any thoughts they’d like to share? I’ll try and get them in.

Many thanks,
Lord R.

377958 Jo Starlin, replying to Jo Starlin, 62, #816 of 1991 🔗

How many single people are quietly despairing every day of ever finding someone to love them? How many childless women are giving up the hope of Motherhood? Don’t these people count? Is loving and being loved nothing?

377963 ▶▶ Fiona Walker, replying to Jo Starlin, 24, #817 of 1991 🔗

Agree. That could make a powerful “look them in the eyes” poster, “tell them they are not entitled to love and be loved” or something.

378072 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Jo Starlin, 12, #818 of 1991 🔗

Is loving and being loved nothing?

In our new society, yes. All expressions of organic, authentic humanity are not only nothing, they are illegal.

377976 Richy_m_99, replying to Richy_m_99, 9, #819 of 1991 🔗

I’m really surprised that little has been said about the findings of Delores Cahill in this discussion


A few have mentioned the gene sequencing of positive test samples that found of 1500 samples, all were found to be either influenza A or B.

What I haven’t seen mentioned us the challenge to doctors and coroner’s to confirm causes of death, which they had originally stated as covid-19, having obtained medical history from relatives of the deceased. Reminded of the penalties for making false declarations, the reported 1700 Covid deaths was reduced to 92.

Discussion from 19 minutes in.

377993 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Richy_m_99, 4, #820 of 1991 🔗

I’d like to hear more on both of those topics.

378045 ▶▶ Jo, replying to Richy_m_99, 3, #821 of 1991 🔗

I am hoping that she is the one to watch at the moment. But that will probably sound the death knell so perhaps I should shut up.

378047 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to Richy_m_99, 2, #822 of 1991 🔗

I’d need links to the underlying studies / data before I can judge either way.

377978 Uncovered, replying to Uncovered, 7, #823 of 1991 🔗

According to The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Wearing of Face Coverings in a Relevant Place) (England) Regulations 2020
The Secretary of State must review the need for the requirements imposed by these Regulations before the end of the period of six months beginning with the day on which they come into force.

which would be before today.

Does anyone know if the need for the requirements has in fact been reviewed, and if so what the outcome of this review was?

378552 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Uncovered, #824 of 1991 🔗

I think frogmella, the work experience girl put a gold star and a smiley face on it.

377980 jhfreedom, replying to jhfreedom, 5, #825 of 1991 🔗

Awful article from the BBC about lockdown breakers. No one citing cost-benefit or individual liberties as a reason to do it.

Covid: ‘Why I’m breaking lockdown rules’ – BBC News

378010 ▶▶ Mark, replying to jhfreedom, 18, #826 of 1991 🔗

Defund the BBC.

Never forget. Never forgive. And that goes for the enablers, not just those nominally in charge.

377981 Joseph, replying to Joseph, 29, #827 of 1991 🔗

Another day, another carrot which will disappear at some point. Another glimmer of hope that will be snuffed out when the time is right for the dictatorship

Boris giving false hope at restrictions easing before mid-February. The day after the lockdown law is extended until July. And despite the fact they’re still hammering hard on the new variant storyline as well as the “too soon to know what effect vaccine has on transmission” bullshit.

Today is the angriest I’ve been since last year with this. The mind games are becoming more insidious now to break people down completely.

378006 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Joseph, 15, #828 of 1991 🔗

Today is the angriest I’ve been since last year with this. The mind games are becoming more insidious now to break people down completely.

Me too, the piss-taking belies the visceral fury I feel right now. But try explaining what is being done and people just don’t want to know. I spoke to one woman right now and the thing most exercising her was whether she should cancel her window cleaner.

378020 ▶▶▶ Joseph, replying to kh1485, 13, #829 of 1991 🔗

It’s because people have short memories and every time a new carrot is dangled, they forget all the carrots in 2020 that were dangled and consistently removed/delayed. The goalpost shifting is keeping the public subdued and thinking “it’s the last stretch”

We’re on the road to nowhere and so many people have fallen for the gaslighting and abuse – left right and centre, time and time again.

378114 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to kh1485, 5, #830 of 1991 🔗

Orwell was in Wigan when Hitler reoccupied the Rhineland Protectorate. He wrote that people’s sole topic of conversation was outrage- at the announcement of a 1d increase on the football-pools levy. Ploo sa shonge, Rodders.

378298 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to kh1485, 1, #831 of 1991 🔗

Has the window cleaner been a bit trans-phobic then ? 🙂

378058 ▶▶ Pet Lamb, replying to Joseph, 10, #832 of 1991 🔗

Johnson and Hancock et al have been gaslighting us for nearly a whole year now. I am beginning to question my sanity.

378258 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Pet Lamb, 3, #833 of 1991 🔗

That’s what gaslighting is designed to do. Don’t let them win!

378547 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Pet Lamb, #834 of 1991 🔗

pah, don’t worry sanity is over-rated.

378100 ▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to Joseph, 3, #835 of 1991 🔗

And weren’t we told a few months ago that it was ‘simply’ a case of getting the ‘R’ value below one and then restrictions could be lifted? According to this article, the R rate appears to have fallen below 1 twice since early December. But note that the government disingenuously states that it could be between 0.6 or 0.8 and 1, so presumably, by their argument, not technically proven to be below 1. And of course there is now the ‘new variant’ to justify continuation of lockdown.

Goalposts are being moved on a whim to suit their ambitions.


377997 kh1485, 12, #836 of 1991 🔗

Bench saga (part 354), Town Council guy has told our customer who questioned it, that she needs to question the ‘Enforcing Authority’. In other words, ‘stop bothering me, I was just following orders and I am now passing the buck’.

Good news, three benches now taken … Council functionary probably spluttering over his lunch as he watches the live-feed on his phone.

377999 JASA, replying to JASA, 21, #837 of 1991 🔗

Has extra strong moron dust been sprinkled over Derbyshire overnight?
As I was leaving my house for a walk round the local park, I saw my neighbour and stopped to say hello. Despite both of us being within our front garden areas, someone walking along the pavement saw us and glared at us and moved into the road to go past us, despite being at least 4 metres from us!
Then, in the park, there were more people wearing masks than not. What’s happening to people? I am about to explode in public.

378007 ▶▶ Paul, replying to JASA, 11, #838 of 1991 🔗

Don’t hold back,explode at them,I have been doing for a while now,every one of them gets both barrels.

378214 ▶▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Paul, 1, #839 of 1991 🔗

I am so tempted to start yelling at people who do this but then I do the same running route every other day and I might eventually be ‘identified’!!

378294 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to jhfreedom, 1, #840 of 1991 🔗

Just take care leaving and returning home. Otherwise, WANKER ! at the top of your voice would surely be aerobically beneficial. 🙂

378030 ▶▶ FerdIII, replying to JASA, 22, #841 of 1991 🔗

Same when I run. People cover their faces and turn their backs. Many have diapers on. More than a few glare at me ‘how dare you run and murder people’ their eyes scream. A few are normal, no diapers and don’t jump out of the way or run and hide as I waddle past. The lack of knowledge, common sense, is astounding. If the BBC said eat dog shit, it stops Covid, 60% will be out on their knees with slices of bread in both hands looking for it….

378062 ▶▶ ituex, replying to JASA, 15, #842 of 1991 🔗

Same around me, rural Suffolk. In the local large village almost everyone walks around outside with a mask on. People turn their faces to the hedge when my son goes out running. People cross the road or walk in the middle of it to avoid me. I am actually hoping one of them gets run over by a mask wearing motorist, it will make my day.

378076 ▶▶ Hellonearth, replying to JASA, 12, #843 of 1991 🔗

There are morons about than I ever thought possible. I have taken to muttering under my breath when they swerve past me. I was brought up to have good manners and be a genuine all round ‘nice’ person, a lot of this has vanished over the last 10 months. There is no way I am going to go off the path onto a muddy bank just so some cretin feels safer. My compassion only stretches as far as the very old, those whose only information comes from the BBC and other msm. Anyone else who has access to the internet can get stuffed, if they are too stupid to dig deeper and use some critical thinking then they are a lost cause.

378439 ▶▶▶ JASA, replying to Hellonearth, 1, #844 of 1991 🔗

Yes, I used to oblige by waiting if a path was quite narrow, as I would have done in normal times, but now I just can’t be bothered. I am muttering under my breath quite loudly now. As I posted a few weeks ago, my anger has over taken my severe anxiety and autism etc. and, although my heart is pounding with fear (of confrontation resulting), I push on through and don’t oblige and shake my head in disbelief at some people.

378542 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to JASA, 2, #845 of 1991 🔗

I went for a walk yesterday and I found that I just couldn’t look at people. I just didn’t feel any bon ami towards my fellow citizens. Then I tried a bit of being friendly. Perhaps I just wasn’t doing a good job of it. Not very convincing perhaps. Not that day. Anyhow mixed reactions, most people were fine but there was a significant majority trying not to be friendly, again perhaps I was giving off “vibes”…..

Umm also I can spot a swerver. I find myself making a judgement, covidian or just being courteous, its a hard one but I can usually tell by the levels of fear/nervousness etc and if I think they are covidians and I studiously ignor them and barrel on through.
fuck em.

378251 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to JASA, #846 of 1991 🔗

Round here (Oxfordshire) it’s definitely gotten worse since Friday and Bozo’s announcement of the “more lethal variant”.

378005 John Galt, replying to John Galt, 61, #847 of 1991 🔗

I don’t know why the main updates focus on demoralising news at the expense of anything positive, but it’s creating a gap between the website and the excellent comments section.

When thousands of restaurants opened in Italy in response to the draconian rules, not a word. When the Netherlands fight back and take a stand, it gets a small link in the round up and called “disturbing footage”. “The Great Reopening” on the 30th of January should be front and centre, but it’s hidden away in a paragraph that titles a hairdresser as “magna carta quoting”, which is the type of thing a tabloid would say to denigrate her.

The fact that the main updates keep referring to polls is another facet of demoralisation that keeps cropping up. The polls are complete nonsense. They’re pushed by people with an agenda and they’re not accurately representative. Give me an email database of 1000 people who have previously stated that they agree with lockdowns and I’ll give you a 96% approval rate of lockdowns. Let me poll everyone who comments on this site and I’ll give you a 100% disapproval rate of lockdowns. It’s complete rubbish and it blows my mind that the main updates use them as if they’re fact with a little sentence saying “ohh, but some bad news”. It’s not bad news because it’s complete and utter nonsense.

The main updates really need to work out what they want to be, because they could be very powerful but they’re literally just a page that allows us to comment at the moment.

378016 ▶▶ Joseph, replying to John Galt, 27, #848 of 1991 🔗

I hate to say it but I think the website and its staff are under some sort of pressure from elsewhere to not cover certain things.

378025 ▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Joseph, 11, #849 of 1991 🔗

There must also be a very fine line to tread to avoid accusations of inciting people to break the law.

378043 ▶▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Charlie Blue, 21, #850 of 1991 🔗

Since when has reporting news events elsewhere ‘incitement’? Reporting what is happening in Italy and elsewhere is absolutely what this website should imo be doing.

Similarly last week with the Swedish update. Very good to hear but why isn’t Belarus front and centre? This is the smoking gun. The WTC7 of the covid narrative.

Its why I come here less and less. Love the commenters but the headlines I can get in the mail and elsewhere. And I would never go to the guardian or any of the msm if I want and ‘informed’ opinion. Repeating that garbage is completely unhelpful and as John says is really demoralising.

378077 ▶▶▶▶▶ Charlie Blue, replying to Seansaighdeoir, 7, #851 of 1991 🔗

Since when has earning a living, or almost all other normal human behaviour been criminalised? Probably round about then.

378154 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to Charlie Blue, 1, #852 of 1991 🔗

Fair point but then if the plan is to really oppose all this it can’t be assumed that posting a few stats is going to be sufficient at countering and overcoming the narrative.

378088 ▶▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Charlie Blue, 6, #853 of 1991 🔗

I agree with you that there’s a fine line between letting off steam here & inciting law breaking BUT who is showing concern for human rights violations?

I see no articles on this, there comes a point where the absurdity of laws made by dictators can only be repressed by a willingness to stand up for what is right, ‘freedom’.

The only reason the government are getting away with this is the majorities unwillingness to break the law. If people were organised they can overcome the state thugs that the police have become. Of course there are LAWS against defending yourself from dictatorship , authoritarian rules based order.

The likes of Hitchens – et al Telling us our only recourse is writing to our MP’s, but it is the corrupt MP’s doing it us! See any of them advocating human rights? What hope do I have when my MP (ian blackford) ignores me?

Its at times of emergency when governments blur the line of acceptable state control & oppresion, when human rights really matter! These mitigation measures aren’t proportinate & the state is using physcological warfare against its people, who exactly are the law breakers here again?

378027 ▶▶▶ John Galt, replying to Joseph, 21, #854 of 1991 🔗

I agree completely and that’s been proven time and again by the pathetic little comments like “oh, oh, I’m not a conspiracy theorist” and sentiments along those lines. They’re either against this lunacy or they’re not, and everyone who isn’t against it is going to tar everyone who is against it with the same brush, so diplomacy is an irrelevance. They should hand it over to someone who isn’t so weak willed, because this isn’t the time to kowtow to the evil that’s trying to take over.

378138 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Joseph, 5, #855 of 1991 🔗

Hence the red flags that have suddenly appeared.
I do wonder if this site may either suddenly disappear, or the comments section disabled.
In which case – see you at your local Freedom Hub! (Or we may have to get things going by the passing of chupatties. There’s a precedent…)

378711 ▶▶▶▶ John Crichton, replying to Banjones, 2, #856 of 1991 🔗

Set up a group on Grab.com – we could call it lockdownopponents – and create accounts using our user names on here to carry on the good fight.

FYI, Grab is committed to free speech.

378039 ▶▶ Tee Ell, replying to John Galt, 20, #857 of 1991 🔗

I generally disagree with complaints about the site in the comments section, because generally these things are subjective and I err towards “it’s their site, they can do what they want”.

This struck a chord with me though – it would be great to have more positive coverage of protest movements. All our efforts should be focused on spreading the word about 30th Jan in my view, and the actions in the Netherlands are incredibly encouraging rather than concerning.

Everyone needs to be willing to define the line that cannot be crossed. If you’re being beaten in the head by a policeman with a baton for exercising your basic human rights, maybe the first time you might say “it was a one off” – and you don’t fight back because you believe in peaceful protest and don’t want to give our cause a bad image. But if it happens again, and then again… there must be a point at which you are willing to say “that crosses the line”. I think everyone needs to start grappling with where that line falls for them.

378052 ▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Tee Ell, 18, #858 of 1991 🔗

I’m inclined to agree. The current groupthink view is that we are tiny band of fringe weirdos without much support. If there was more exposure of our position being quite widely held beyond the confines of this benighted isle, it might make our ideas more compelling to the curious and open minded who happen to swing by.

I suspect the site is avoiding being too anti-establishment currently. If so, it is likely an attempt to prevent too wide a chasm forming betwix ‘them’ and ‘us’. I’m not sure how everyone would feel about this. As someone with a more minarchist general view, I’m probably at too extreme an end of the spectrum to comment on behalf of everyone here. (If it was up to me, there’d be articles on ’21 Things Robespierre Did Before Breakfast’, ‘The Correct Way To Tie A Noose’ and ‘Pitchfork Field Maintenance’).

378044 ▶▶ Seansaighdeoir, replying to John Galt, 10, #859 of 1991 🔗

Great comment John.

378149 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to John Galt, 5, #860 of 1991 🔗

I did wonder when listening to Toby on Sky News Australia, when he was banging on about the appalling UK death numbers (or however he put it) rather than simply quoting the reality of them. It must be difficult to withstand the pressure – but I suppose if you can’t take the heat you have to stay out of the kitchen.

378237 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to John Galt, 4, #861 of 1991 🔗

That is why it is important that we continue to publish it in the comments and distribute it as wide as we can

378008 EllGee, replying to EllGee, 14, #862 of 1991 🔗

Is something going on somewhere? There was the usual scare/fear thing at the end of last week but it was members of Nervtag etc. that queried the numbers and the BBC covered it. The doctors are pushing back on the 12 week second jab policy and the BBC covered it. The Children’s Minister is questioning about school reopenings and the BBC has covered it. Jezza Vine is doing the negative side of lockdown life.

378057 ▶▶ Luckyharry69, replying to EllGee, 15, #863 of 1991 🔗

the BBC even showed the rioting in Eindhoven?….perhaps they are getting scared?….I think there will be a turning point…it has to happen……

378014 Andrea Salford, replying to Andrea Salford, 14, #864 of 1991 🔗

‘ majority support for the current Government restrictions with 62% (of 2000 people) saying the restrictions are more helpful than harmful to society,’
What a shocking number of ‘I’m alright Jacks’
Perhaps the question should also include – ‘are you prepared – as you clearly expect of others affected – to lose your job/income in order to not overwhelm the NHS?’

378024 ▶▶ Joseph, replying to Andrea Salford, 30, #865 of 1991 🔗

These polls are pure propaganda. I fucking hate these political polls. They are designed to shape opinion, not reflect it.

378129 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Joseph, 7, #866 of 1991 🔗

And enough fall for it to make the coercion well worth the effort.

378049 ▶▶ DThom, replying to Andrea Salford, 10, #867 of 1991 🔗

From what I see around me I find 62% hard to believe – way overstated!

378126 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Andrea Salford, 6, #868 of 1991 🔗

And another question: ”Are you paid from the public purse?”

No doubt these polls, even the ones not carried out by Yougov, may have a bit of advice from that quarter. Looks who’s got his fingers in the Yougov pie – a certainly Mr Zahawi who’s also got an interest in rolling out the poison.

378018 Anti_socialist, replying to Anti_socialist, 9, #869 of 1991 🔗
378125 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Anti_socialist, 3, #870 of 1991 🔗

Thanks. Just watched it, and re-posted the link above.
I think if we knew the extent of the self-interest that goes into all this guff they pump out, then even we sceptics would be appalled.

378019 TyRade, 5, #871 of 1991 🔗

Quote from Samir al-Khalil, ‘Republic of Fear’, 1989, re Saddam’s consummate Project Fear. All Boris needs is the moustache and little children to stroke? All we need is Shock and Awe?
“Fear is the cement that holds together this strange body politic…The public is atomised and broken up, which is why it can be made to believe anything…Fear is the agency off that transformation; the kind of fear thatches not only from what the neighbours might say, but that makes people careful of what they say in front of their children. This fear has become a part of the psychological constitution of citizenship…The result was a true regime of terror whose deepest roots lay in the growing fear that people now had of each other.”

378023 Jinks, replying to Jinks, 7, #872 of 1991 🔗

Has anyone seen any support groups or helplines for anyone who has been impacted by covid deaths and “long-covid”? They seem very inconspicuously absent. Isn’t this usually the case Everytime there’s a disaster?

378094 ▶▶ bluemoon, replying to Jinks, 3, #873 of 1991 🔗

Every time there’s a disaster there’s a slew of TV ads from NGOs wanting more money!

378101 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to bluemoon, 3, #874 of 1991 🔗

Flies round shite.

378107 ▶▶▶ Jinks, replying to bluemoon, 4, #875 of 1991 🔗

Exactly! So where are they now? As well the monotonous ads for donations or helplines? it’s not even been done for the sake of propoganda. I was just curious to see if anyone else had noticed. Also, absent are those terrible surveys, asking how you’ve been impacted by something, etc

378274 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jinks, #876 of 1991 🔗

Set your own up.

‘Mental Health Support Groups’ are exempted from a lot of the bollox – premises, lockdowns, etc.

378028 Anti_socialist, replying to Anti_socialist, 15, #877 of 1991 🔗

LOL i’ve just noticed the red flag icon, when did that happen? The founder of free speech union & this website is now in the censorship business!

Oh the irony. Running scared from big brother huh?

378079 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Anti_socialist, 3, #878 of 1991 🔗

If you press the red flag it turns everything into cyrillic script.

378174 ▶▶▶ Prof Feargoeson, replying to GrannySlayer, 2, #879 of 1991 🔗

Mine plays a Die Rote Fahne jingle.

378110 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Anti_socialist, 3, #880 of 1991 🔗

dont see it on my machine

378564 ▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to wayno, #881 of 1991 🔗

You must be a marked man.

378029 Jo, replying to Jo, 46, #882 of 1991 🔗

Anyone else feeling extra crap today?
Just saw John Galt’s recent post about the headlines on this site and I agree, I’d been pondering them and wondering how much longer this site has to run. It seems that a lot of the interesting material comes from posters rather than the headlines.
I am feeling increasingly pessimistic despite the strides of business owners abroad – although I know a lot of sceptics around me, everyone is heads down, keep themselves to themselves and I can see myself doing that now. I have run out of drive. I can’t imagine local businesses here doing anything at all. It’s just like we’re on death row, the last appeal has failed and we’re waiting for the date of execution. I am not including a lot of you guys because your fight and spirit astounds me, sometimes. I used to write letters, have conversations with people and even put up posters and now I find it hard to get through each day.
And I am concerned about Toby and others diluting the message.

378037 ▶▶ Joseph, replying to Jo, 26, #883 of 1991 🔗

You’re not alone. I’m fuming today.

I feel like I want to band together with some of you guys to distil the core anti-lockdown message and then design some really shareable graphics/resources.

Things like:

  • Average death age from coronavirus is ~82
  • Why the PCR test is producing false positives and what that means
  • The fact the NHS has been routinely ‘overwhelmed’ for years
  • A list of effects of lockdown vs the effects of the virus – a form of risk assessment
  • etc
378054 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Joseph, 7, #884 of 1991 🔗

And – please – the comparison with the number of daily deaths from all causes this year, and the number on an ”average” year.

378059 ▶▶▶▶ Joseph, replying to Banjones, 12, #885 of 1991 🔗

Yes, this!

Also – “deaths within 28 days of a positive test” meaning if you test positive, then get shot dead, you’re a covid stat!!!

We need to make a list. I’m a graphic designer so I can create some engaging, shareable resources with facts and sources listed at the bottom of each!

378265 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Joseph, 4, #886 of 1991 🔗

You’re not alone. I’m fuming today.

I feel like I want to band together with some of you guys to …

… march on Westminster, kill all the inhabitants, and then burn it to the ground. But I guess more moderate solutions have their place too. 🙂

378055 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Jo, 23, #887 of 1991 🔗

If you’ve read more comments today, you probably know I had some nasty comments on Nextdoor.
I am down today, I am saddened, I am upset.
But I will not give up and deliver some leaflets from Back to Normal later.
I intend to print out the posters for 30th Jan and put it through letter boxes of independent hospitality businesses. With a note “I know you are unlikely to open as the climate in this town is not supportive of this action, but I wanted to inform you about the event!.

378056 ▶▶ rockoman, replying to Jo, 23, #888 of 1991 🔗

I read here mainly – 90% – because of other commenters.

Toby has to do what Toby has to do. His position is different. It is good to have different people woring different angles on this.

The present general position is socially and economically unsustainable.

A massive reaction is building.

What we are witnessing is the death-struggle of our debt-based ponzi system, which is throwing everything at the terminal illness in the attempt to survive.

It won’t

Ironically, I think that the very virulence of the reactions that come from some covidians, reflects the unconscious recognition that they are wong and have been wrong.

378075 ▶▶ John Galt, replying to Jo, 35, #889 of 1991 🔗

If I ever feel down I just remind myself that I’m completely right in what I believe. Never view yourself as an outsider who everybody is (seemingly) against. View yourself as someone who is right and honest and good, and realise that other people haven’t quite caught up to you yet. When you a watch a film or read a book, the hero is never the person who goes along with the evil establishment, they’re always the rebel.

And everything that’s happening today is against nature and against truth. The sheer lies involved to prop up this lunacy is just insane. But keep faith, because there’s only so much they can push before the fabric of life itself pushes back.

378092 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to John Galt, 13, #890 of 1991 🔗

I am quite reassured that my academic niece is coming around to scepticism. I haven’t pushed anything on her but she is waking up to the insanity.

378116 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to John Galt, 5, #891 of 1991 🔗

I’ve just watched the video (link posted earlier today – thanks)
about the spreading of false information deliberately designed to terrify, and why it’s done, and what self-interest goes into the formulating of it.

378170 ▶▶▶ BJJ, replying to John Galt, 6, #892 of 1991 🔗

Very well put. I thank God that I have the good fortune of not being afraid of this virus. Of course it is saddening to watch the herd running in fear and the cynical scientists looking for a quick buck. But I think as you do that the reservoir of dissent and disbelief is slowly but surely filling and the dam will break sooner than later.

378256 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Jo, 2, #893 of 1991 🔗

Do you take breaks from ‘the struggle’, Jo ?

No media, nature, food, sleep, people, exercise. Recharges the physical, emotional, mental, and spiritual batteries. 🙂

378322 ▶▶ Puddleglum, replying to Jo, #894 of 1991 🔗

Today is tough for some reason. Maybe it is the length of time this has been going on. As below says – we could probably do with a break. Regroup, refresh and continue anew.

378035 alw, replying to alw, 5, #895 of 1991 🔗

“Almost as soon as the pandemic struck, we developed a morbid fascination with the new coronavirus. Death became a part of daily life: as restrictions were introduced and the rules of society were rewritten, our only constant seemed to be the daily announcements detailing how many more lives had been taken by the new disease.”


378051 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to alw, 20, #896 of 1991 🔗

And the obsession goes on. Today I heard about two friends, one who’s died and the other who is at death’s door. Both of them have been ill for a long time, with many problems. Yet their relatives, telling us about the sad state of affairs, went on about ”covid related” stuff.

If their problem had been flu, or just a common cold, which also could have been fatal, nothing would have been added, except to tell us their sad news.

378173 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Banjones, 7, #897 of 1991 🔗

PS Been thinking about it. It must be because it somehow makes them feel important, somehow. ”Look at me. Be impressed. I’m part of this Tragedy.”
It’s beyond pathos.

378046 Banjones, replying to Banjones, 5, #898 of 1991 🔗

Can I be alone in my confusion (or maybe I just read the wrong things) about these ”death by covid” stats? Or death stats generally.
Sometimes we’re told there are very few ”excess deaths” compared with the average yearly count – and other times we’re told that the mortality rate is astronomical. Toby, speaking on Sky News Oz, was also saying that the UK deaths figure was huge. Then we’re told that the daily death figures for the UK are more or less what we’d expect at this time of the year anyway.
Please, someone – put me right.

378050 ▶▶ John Galt, replying to Banjones, 9, #899 of 1991 🔗
378104 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to John Galt, 3, #900 of 1991 🔗

Thank you.

378091 ▶▶ DeepBlueYonder, replying to Banjones, 11, #901 of 1991 🔗

Another perspective is given by looking at age-standardised mortality rates per 100,000 population. The dataset below shows these for the period from 1971 to 2020 for England. While the mortality rate in 2020 is higher than the previous 11 years, it is lower than every year between 1971 and 2008.

Age-standardised mortality rates, standardised using the 2013 European Standard Population, England from 1971 to 2020.

Year  Rate per 100,000
1971  1808.43
1972  1865.82
1973  1839.50
1974  1819.81
1975  1792.63
1976  1834.31
1977  1732.02
1978  1735.69
1979  1742.85
1980  1681.99
1981  1657.45
1982  1653.52
1983  1629.35
1984  1573.77
1985  1618.07
1986  1570.50
1987  1508.30
1988  1508.69
1989  1506.01
1990  1456.35
1991  1458.92
1992  1409.00
1993  1445.78
1994  1368.91
1995  1384.47
1996  1365.95
1997  1343.34
1998  1321.88
1999  1312.06
2000  1259.81
2001  1229.33
2002  1225.01
2003  1225.34
2004  1156.56
2005  1137.59
2006  1099.27
2007  1084.54
2008  1085.45
2009  1027.75
2010  1010.97
2011  972.91
2012  981.27
2013  979.08
2014  946.73
2015  986.57
2016  959.79
2017  959.00
2018  956.10
2019  918.60
2020  1037.30 (Provisional)

1. 1971 to 2016: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/adhocs/008520agestandardisedmortalityratesstandardisedusingtheboth2013and1976europeanstandardpopulationsbysexengland1971to2016 [accessed 19 January 2021].

2. 2017 to 2020: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/monthlymortalityanalysisenglandandwales/december2020 (Section 6) [accessed 19 January 2021].

378105 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to DeepBlueYonder, 4, #902 of 1991 🔗


378119 ▶▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to Banjones, 1, #903 of 1991 🔗

The ONS data for total 2020 mortality month by month is out tomorrow (England and Wales). You can compare to previous years.

Here’s the site to check then:


378132 ▶▶▶ Dorian_Hawkmoon, replying to DeepBlueYonder, 3, #904 of 1991 🔗

And noting the much lower 2019. There is the April bulge which was late winter 19/20 totted up with winter 2021. The April bulge, partly viral and partly panicked mishandling continues to be used to queer the current state. I doubt they will give up on exploiting it very soon despite its murky causes. Smoothing these numbers makes things clearer. Covid deaths and all cause excess deaths are munged by testophilia.

378404 ▶▶▶▶ DeepBlueYonder, replying to Dorian_Hawkmoon, 1, #905 of 1991 🔗

Yes, the mortality rate in 2019 was extraordinarily low. These data are by calendar year.

378504 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Dorian_Hawkmoon, 1, #906 of 1991 🔗

A testophiliac.

378507 ▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Two-Six, 3, #907 of 1991 🔗

Somebody who likes bollocks?

378061 Bruce Reynolds, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 50, #908 of 1991 🔗

All this Fucking rubbish on the MSM of fines for misbehaving, basically propaganda in reality few are issued in a population of 67 million..All I can see at the moment is people not giving a fuck, going about there daily business and this in the middle of winter, wait till spring then it will be showtime.. the main problem now is the hospitality industry this desperate bunch of wankers(government) hold the ace card regarding this issue,like a cornered rat these business need to fight for there survival,they will soon have know other option…

378068 ▶▶ iane, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 17, #909 of 1991 🔗

Yep, (well past) time to follow the Italian example!

378069 ▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 30, #910 of 1991 🔗

It would take one brave pub owner to open up and risk losing his licence, with court and possibly a show trial. But maybe someone feels they have nothing left to lose and will go for it. I would support them again tyranny.

378083 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to thinkaboutit, 10, #911 of 1991 🔗

Can’t see pubs opening because the brewers aren’t brewing, at the moment, for the pub trade and have moved operations to bottled product for the supermarkets.

378142 ▶▶▶▶ BJJ, replying to Will, 2, #912 of 1991 🔗

I´ll have a G&T then please

378098 ▶▶ Ganjan21, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 27, #913 of 1991 🔗

Yes I’m noticing this ‘lockdown’, even for being in the dead of winter, is nowhere near like the first one. More people just don’t seem as scared and doing their own thing. Come spring lets hope to see more mass disobedience. More aren’t trusting a thing that comes out of the twats’ mouths. Also in a way, the more people we know who have Covid and recover/say it was like a cold/no symptoms, e.t.c. , then all the better because it shows for the majority that it’s really not that bad or deadly.

378106 ▶▶▶ Bruce Reynolds, replying to Ganjan21, 24, #914 of 1991 🔗

Yes good comment, let’s face it if you’re so fucking scared to come out of the house for a virus with a 99%or more survival rate then you don’t deserve to live your a waste of time and breath..

378117 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Ganjan21, 10, #915 of 1991 🔗

Limit to what you can do -no pubs, cafes, restaurants, cinemas, clubs, theatres, hotels, “non essential” shops, golf, tennis etc . Best you can do is go round to someones house or meet up in a park.

378155 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to arfurmo, 7, #916 of 1991 🔗

Four takeaway cafes open on Seaford prom at the weekend. All reported doing good business. (Good coffee and walnut cake, 2nd/3rd cafe from the west !).

378066 Mark, replying to Mark, 7, #917 of 1991 🔗

Comment from Llamasaurus Rex below imo raises a useful point:

Good morning. Can anyone recommend…or even just point me in the direction of…a solicitor firm that can assist someone (retailer) with prohibition notice issues? I’d be most grateful.
UK based, ideally with presence in South East UK.

At the moment lawfare is a big part of both the assault on liberty and the resistance to it. Access locally to solicitors who are at least not ideologically aligned with the regime, and ideally who are actively opposed to it, would be extremely useful.

If anybody can identify such in their areas this would be great, and it would be useful to have this information somewhere accessible at need. If nothing else, a forum post.

And obviously if anyone knows of any solicitors in the SE who could help LLamasaurus, that would be good. I recall there was a firm who were early LS sponsors, but they seem to be no longer mentioned as far as I can see.

378078 ▶▶ JME, replying to Mark, 3, #918 of 1991 🔗


378111 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to JME, 1, #919 of 1991 🔗

Looks to be a campaigning website.

378151 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Mark, #920 of 1991 🔗

Tilbrooks were happy to discuss an issue on the phone. V friendly.

378189 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to JohnB, #921 of 1991 🔗

I think they were the early sponsors, now that you mention them.

378070 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 60, #922 of 1991 🔗

Bojo today “”Schools obviously will be a priority, but I don’t think anybody would want to see the restrictions lifted so quickly whilst the rate of infection is still very high, so as to lead to another spread of infection.”
I would want to see the restrictions lifted today -so he is wrong to say “ I don’t think anybody” .

378074 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to arfurmo, 24, #923 of 1991 🔗

He doesn’t know what anybody thinks, especially about him and his whore!

378099 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to TheClone, 16, #924 of 1991 🔗

Boris- governed by his johnson.

378153 ▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to TheClone, 19, #925 of 1991 🔗


378182 ▶▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to GrannySlayer, 2, #926 of 1991 🔗

I’ve mentioned it before -but she looks just like the gal who advertises Tena pads. (Only the wig is different.) Do you think she’s moonlighting?

378331 ▶▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Banjones, #927 of 1991 🔗

Moonbatting more like.

378113 ▶▶ isobar, replying to arfurmo, 7, #928 of 1991 🔗

First one thing (mid Feb):then another. It’s a pity that the Domestic Abuse Bill doesn’t apply given Psychological abuse Includes name-calling, threats and manipulation, blaming you for the abuse or ‘gas-lighting’ you.

378186 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to arfurmo, 5, #929 of 1991 🔗

Since when did this arrogant, ignorant, self-serving, scruffy oik know or care what ”anybody” wants or thinks?

378192 ▶▶▶ isobar, replying to Banjones, 2, #930 of 1991 🔗


378243 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to arfurmo, 3, #931 of 1991 🔗

Open the schools BoJo and stop scapegoating our children. They need to be in school for social contact and education.

378081 WasSteph, replying to WasSteph, 17, #932 of 1991 🔗

I’ve finally received a reply to my complaint to Lloyd’s bank about the text I received stating face coverings are “essential”. They have declined my complaint on the grounds that exemptions are accepted in branches.
If I’ve got the energy I might rebut the answer as the content of the text was very off putting if you’re not confident and many people are not. Of course the whole thing is designed to be proscriptive and to ensure people are cowed into obeying even if it causes physical or mental distress. Lots of weasel words in the letter about ensuring the safety of colleagues and customers that cut no ice with me.

378109 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to WasSteph, 8, #933 of 1991 🔗

Just heard a LLoyds ad on Talkradio saying “Please wear a face covering” No rider of “unless exempt”. Same with the Halifax .

378487 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to arfurmo, 4, #934 of 1991 🔗

These bank” stay safe” and “with you during these difficult times” messaging make me want to puke. So do those banking muppets who stand there and tell you that you can use the machine to pay your cheque in.
Yes i know and you will be out of a job really soon. Idiots.

378146 ▶▶ isobar, replying to WasSteph, 3, #935 of 1991 🔗

Here’s a link that I found to a handy aide memoire on why masks don’t work and might well do more harm than good.

378247 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to WasSteph, 2, #936 of 1991 🔗

Well done for doing that. Good to know that exemptions are accepted by them otherwise they would get claims for discrimination ito of Equality Act

378089 Hellonearth, replying to Hellonearth, 1, #937 of 1991 🔗

I tried replying to a comment that JASA made a bit earlier about Derbyshire and too many morons about. When I tried to send it a comment came up at the side saying a duplicate post being detected! and it wouldn’t go through. Has anyone else have this happen to them?.

378093 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Hellonearth, 1, #938 of 1991 🔗

Yes, happened to me a few days ago. I just refreshed the page a few times and went on to post my comment.

378095 ▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Hellonearth, 2, #939 of 1991 🔗

I’ve had that happen- I just attributed it to what seems to be the general wheeziness of the site. My post went through eventually.

378150 ▶▶ mj, replying to Hellonearth, 1, #940 of 1991 🔗

yes – it is a connection issue. i have had it where the comment has actually posted but on your screen it doesnt look like it has , and so you send and that is when the duplcate message appears .

378260 ▶▶ Hellonearth, replying to Hellonearth, #941 of 1991 🔗

Thank you all, I hope it doesn’t suddenly appear in triplicate.

378102 Andrea Salford, 25, #942 of 1991 🔗

I look in their eyes and, with a thoroughly clear conscience, say – ‘Nothing I have done has put you in here. The government lied. Lockdowns don’t work……by the way, did you catch Covid here?’

378108 Jo Starlin, 42, #943 of 1991 🔗

Hey lockdownista moralisers. How’s Zoom and smart learning tools working out for blind and disabled children? Look their parents in the eye you bastards.

378120 Ewan Duffy, replying to Ewan Duffy, 17, #944 of 1991 🔗

Finally, Irish medical staff calling for the population to take Vitamin D supplements.


378121 ▶▶ Ganjan21, replying to Ewan Duffy, 12, #945 of 1991 🔗

Only fecking almost 10 months later!

378252 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Ewan Duffy, 1, #946 of 1991 🔗

That is great news. Hopefully they recommend at least 4,000 IU, instead of the paltry RDA of 400IU that will only prevent rickets

378122 alw, replying to alw, 2, #947 of 1991 🔗

Biden’s first two days as President.

378187 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to alw, 1, #948 of 1991 🔗

Liars create truth seekers!

379141 ▶▶ Jez Hewitt, replying to alw, #949 of 1991 🔗

I want to freeze this young lady (hear me out) for 25 years then thaw her out to marry one of my boys (I don’t care which one).

Preferable to the Macron route but each to their own. Sunday lunch would be a blast.

378123 Fingerache Philip, 25, #950 of 1991 🔗

Wonders never cease: Anti lockdown “riots” in The Netherlands reported on BBC lunchtime news!!!
All of about 15/20 seconds, but it’s a start.

378130 Bella Donna, replying to Bella Donna, 29, #951 of 1991 🔗

I’ve just ordered a take away meal from our local gastro pub for Saturday. They also do a nice selection of wines too but unfortunately because the government is insane we cannot order any wine to take away with it! So I’ll have to drive to a supermarket and buy my wine from there! I know what you’re thinking, you’re thinking WTF? And you would be right !

378134 ▶▶ Ganjan21, replying to Bella Donna, 5, #952 of 1991 🔗

We still have a cap here on not being permitted to buy alcohol anywhere after 8pm.

378145 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Bella Donna, 22, #953 of 1991 🔗

Yeah cos it’s much safer to have to visit two public places in one night, isn’t it, rather than just one. And much better for the pub not to make money by selling you wine, Tesco and Sainsburys need it much more at the moment don’t they?

Like you say, insane.

378131 I Got A Letter, replying to I Got A Letter, 5, #954 of 1991 🔗

Nothing in LS today about the riots in Holland?

378141 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to I Got A Letter, 6, #955 of 1991 🔗

Mentioned in the ‘Roundup’.

378143 ▶▶ mj, replying to I Got A Letter, 3, #956 of 1991 🔗

yes – link in round-up above the line – but nothing seen in MSM

378163 ▶▶▶ Fingerache Philip, replying to mj, 4, #957 of 1991 🔗

It was on BBC lunchtime news for about 20 seconds.

378133 SilentP, replying to SilentP, 4, #958 of 1991 🔗

I have been talking to myself abut inhaled interferon treatment on the Medicine sub-forum.

First patient dosage in the worldwide Phase 3 trial was announced just over a week ago.

Today news was released that it has been included in Operation Warp Speed in the US as part of Activ-2.

With the various trials now running it is likely that a clear view of whether it can be rolled out successfully will emerge within the next two months. Emergency Use Authorisation may proceed that.

If successful it could be a game changer in both reducing hospitalisations and improving hospital and non-hospital patient outcomes – and as a result making a huge difference to reducing any case there may still be thought to be for lockdowns.

Why oh why have the UK Government not got behind this and remained fixated on vaccines?

https://www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk/co … 39335.html

378135 ▶▶ SilentP, replying to SilentP, #959 of 1991 🔗

precede not proceed!

378136 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to SilentP, 1, #960 of 1991 🔗

I thought Wancock announced this miracle cure, as if he himself had toiled night and day to discover it, quite some weeks ago now? Don’t tell me they’re not actually using it?

378162 ▶▶▶ SilentP, replying to A. Contrarian, #961 of 1991 🔗

Not mentioned by him – except maybe he said something in July after trial results then.

No government backing – but there is some UK medical involvement in the Phase 3 trial.

378203 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to SilentP, 4, #962 of 1991 🔗

No money in it, guv.
No money for them and their friends with fingers in the big pharma pockets. And they don’t want theraputics or prophylactics that actually work – people might get over-confident and see that they don’t need a vaccine.
As with Ivermectin and HCQ, this is something many of us heard about months ago. Now they’re saying ”need to do more tests”. Well, how about this: just give them to the population immediately, as and when needed, and see what happens. I believe that a precedent has been already been set……

378222 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to SilentP, #963 of 1991 🔗


379146 ▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to Cheezilla, #964 of 1991 🔗

Yes. (HCQ, Ivermectin are non-existent.)

378144 Ganjan21, replying to Ganjan21, 6, #965 of 1991 🔗

What is the back up plan if this site is forced to shut down?

378152 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Ganjan21, 5, #966 of 1991 🔗

The Save our rights UK social media page?
Paid member ship required, though.

Won’t happen, though.

378206 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Ganjan21, 3, #967 of 1991 🔗

The Freedom Hub – do they have a forum?

378242 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Banjones, 1, #968 of 1991 🔗

I get gazillions of emails daily, so I guess so.

378231 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Ganjan21, #969 of 1991 🔗

‘if’ – you mean WHEN

378257 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Ganjan21, 3, #970 of 1991 🔗

Cant see that it would happen – Toby and team sticks to reporting of news so totally above board

378390 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Victoria, 1, #971 of 1991 🔗

The cancelleers have already gone after the site, and after the guy who hosts the site, trying to get him sacked… from the hosting company he part owns 😀

378383 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to Ganjan21, #972 of 1991 🔗

It depends what part of the stack is forced offline. The DNS record is the most vulnerable bit IMO, but there is an amenable DNS provider in the USA called ‘Epik’ that could be used.

Nic and Andrew Elliot covered this in their podcast recently (Nic apparently part-owns the company that hosts this site) and I think this site is safer than most, having heard their thoughts.


Start listening at about 34mins if you want to dive straight in to this issue.

378148 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 11, #973 of 1991 🔗

Keir Starmer gets pinged and has to isolate for the third time – boy is he unlucky. He said on Twitter:

This morning I was notified that I must self isolate after coming into contact with someone who has tested positive for COVID-19.

I have no opposition and will be abstaining from home until next Monday.

378171 ▶▶ Ozzie, replying to godowneasy, 20, #974 of 1991 🔗

If he hadn’t posted his isolation on twitter nobody would be any the wiser – we live in a single party state now with Labour just agreeing with government.

378181 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to godowneasy, 4, #975 of 1991 🔗

I have no opposition…”

“Dictatorship, form of government in which one person or a small group possesses absolute power without effective constitutional limitations.

The term dictatorship comes from the Latin title dictator, which in the Roman Republic designated a temporary magistrate who was granted extraordinary powers in order to deal with state crises.

Modern dictators, however, resemble ancient tyrants rather than ancient dictators. Ancient philosophers’ descriptions of the tyrannies of Greece and Sicily go far toward characterizing modern dictatorships.

Dictators usually resort to force or fraud to gain despotic political power, which they maintain through the use of intimidation, terror, and the suppression of basic civil liberties. They may also employ techniques of mass propaganda in order to sustain their public support.”


378191 ▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to godowneasy, 8, #976 of 1991 🔗

I wish someone would ask the likes of Hancock and Starmer how they came into contact with a suspect ‘case’. It shouldn’t randomly happen. As we all know, the only situation in which such an occurrence is legitimate is if that person is in your own household or support bubble. In any other circumstances, it can only happen if the social distancing rules have been broken, mask or no mask.

378226 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to godowneasy, 1, #977 of 1991 🔗

How convenient for him!

378229 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to godowneasy, 5, #978 of 1991 🔗

‘I have no opposition’ – never a truer word….

378276 ▶▶ Annie, replying to godowneasy, 2, #979 of 1991 🔗

He has no opposition?
First true thing he’s said in years.
Abstaining from home? What on earth is that supposed to mean? Does he abstain on every single vote?

378325 ▶▶▶ godowneasy, replying to Annie, 2, #980 of 1991 🔗

I’m too subtle – those are my words – his were “I have no symptoms and will be working from home….”

378335 ▶▶▶▶ Jo Starlin, replying to godowneasy, #981 of 1991 🔗

I got it 🙂

378785 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to godowneasy, 1, #982 of 1991 🔗

Why doesn’t he delete the app?

378156 Mike, replying to Mike, 30, #983 of 1991 🔗

God damn, its so depressing listening to people talk about the lockdown madness. I’ve ventured into the office today, not that I’ve been avoiding it due to COVID, but why bother going in if I dont have to.
Anyway listening to a couple of the managers discussing how the economy is ‘doing really well all things considered, its only the hospitality industry which isn’t doing well!’. Apparently thats what the radio has told them. Apparently theres no point rushing to open the country up when its doing so well while closed down…the mind boggles.
Seems it’ll all bounce back when we finally open up as people rush to spend the money they’ve saved during lockdown. I’m thinking a lot of those savings may be needed to cover the loss of jobs!! But what do I know; all those closed shops in town, foreclosure notices in windows etc mean nothing.

378164 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Mike, 26, #984 of 1991 🔗

Hospitality has a huge supply chain.
And what about the arts, museums, galleries, beauticians, hairdressers. We all know how long this list is!

378638 ▶▶▶ Freddy Boy, replying to Silke David, 2, #985 of 1991 🔗

Don’t forget music , both my sons are musicians so you can imagine what their careers are like now 😭

378166 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Mike, 15, #986 of 1991 🔗

I keep hearing that the housing market is ‘booming’. Not here in leafy North West Essex it isn’t. I’m registered with Rightmove and every day there are notices about quite substantial price reductions and hardly any new listings. I think they’re living in a fools’ paradise if they believe the economy is ‘doing really well’. Nice that they’re happy that a major industry is being thrown under the bus. ‘We’re all in this together’ – yeah, right.

378190 ▶▶▶ ThomasT, replying to kh1485, 8, #987 of 1991 🔗

I live in Northamptonshire and houses in my town seem to be selling within 24hours of coming on the market. Its crazy in my town. One house down the road came up, vastly over priced compared to similar and even thats now sold!

378264 ▶▶▶▶ Richy_m_99, replying to ThomasT, 1, #988 of 1991 🔗

If you live in the London commuting catchment area that would not surprise me. I imagine that being able to work from home yet stay relatively close to london has encouraged a lot of people to sell up and move away from London. They can afford to take a hit on their London house price and still pay over the odds to get the property they want.

378316 ▶▶▶▶ jonathan Palmer, replying to ThomasT, 1, #989 of 1991 🔗

Rishi’s funny money will seek to find a home creating asset bubbles but once the crash happens they will all burst.
This is guaranteed,the only question is what will finally set it off and when.

378330 ▶▶▶▶ Ossettian, replying to ThomasT, #990 of 1991 🔗

Me too.

A house in the next street had the “For Sale” sign up before Rightmove told me it was on the market.

378204 ▶▶▶ WasSteph, replying to kh1485, 10, #991 of 1991 🔗

They are totally deluded. You are at the sharp end so you know. God knows what my hairdresser and beautician are paying their bills with. All those people they owe money to also have families and bills. I’m self employed and personally have not had a penny of income since this started but luckily we can manage.
There will be a big reckoning, paying (all the wrong) people to do nothing for months has surely had a cost.
We paid our Essex CCC membership last year and got not one single day of cricket. The club knows not to ask us to pay yet this year so god knows what they are subsisting on.
We got a voucher back for a cancelled Festival Hall concert last year which will expire soon. So they will have to give us cash instead – where is that coming from?
Just a couple of small examples and you can be sure the government’s answer to throwing our money away for the last 10 months will be punitive taxes.

378287 ▶▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to WasSteph, 3, #992 of 1991 🔗

I’ve just had a conversation with North Essex Parking Partnership about my soon to expire season ticket. Their website trumpets all these discounts for ‘key workers and NHS staff’. I just pointed out to the woman I spoke to, that it seems very unfair that I am expected to fork out full-whack for another season ticket when our business is being decimated through no fault of our own. She replied “ah, but you had a free four months”. Like I’m meant to be grateful. Apparently, she will forward my concerns to a manager.

378456 ▶▶▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to kh1485, 1, #993 of 1991 🔗

Saw an advert from a housebuilding company, discount for NHS staff.
I hope they at least check it is front line staff and not the office staff.

378471 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Silke David, 2, #994 of 1991 🔗

I talked to a bloke a few months ago, a home maintenance man. He said he had about NINE houses he rents out. Buy to let. He was very pleased with himself, I mentioned that there will probably be a huge financial crash coming and was he worried? He said no, in a financial crash house prices go up!

Well, I don’t think this guy is going to be in a good position soon if interest rates go up and his tennants loose their jobs.

378871 ▶▶▶▶▶ mj, replying to kh1485, #995 of 1991 🔗

virtue signalling bastards

378205 ▶▶▶ nottingham69, replying to kh1485, 4, #996 of 1991 🔗

When the asset bubble bursts, based on artificial low interest rates then the housing market won’t be booming.

378215 ▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to kh1485, 8, #997 of 1991 🔗

Sozhenitsyn came to the conclusion that the Russian and other people living under the yoke of the USSR deserved what was coming to them, and it’s hard sometimes not to avoid that same conclusion in our case – these people simply don’t deserve freedom or prosperity, they don’t deserve to be left alone to live their lives free from oppression; they are going to either have to learn the value of these things the hard way, or else pay the ultimate price of their stupidity

378233 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to JaneHarry, 2, #998 of 1991 🔗

He reckoned they didn’t deserve freedom partly because they didn’t jump the death squads when they visited the apartment blocks.

Everyone got their billhooks, axes, and cricket bats handy ?

378299 ▶▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to JohnB, 8, #999 of 1991 🔗

I’ll swing at them with all three hardback volumes of The Gulag Archipelago tied together in a bin bag. Murder weapon and motive in one.

378235 ▶▶ Cheezilla, replying to Mike, 8, #1000 of 1991 🔗

Ask them who’s going to pay for the dustmen and the streetlighting, now there’s no revenue for the council as all those dead shops and empty town centre offices will be paying no rent?

378503 ▶▶▶ Mike, replying to Cheezilla, 5, #1001 of 1991 🔗

I’m afraid I’ve given up asking pertinent questions to sheep. If all you get back is a blurt of government propaganda with not a jot of self reflection it really isn’t worth the hassle that follows.

You can certainly see the detrimental effect of the disconnect people have with the natural world and the wider environment in which they live. Most seem to have completely forgotten that cold wet weather and old age normally brings about illness. Anyone would think this is the first time any of them have seen or heard of people getting sick.

I’m starting to believe goldfish have more intellect than the majority of people.

378157 Steve Martindale, replying to Steve Martindale, 20, #1002 of 1991 🔗

I decided to post off a few replies on twitter today, mainly calling for Big Government to get off our backs and come up with a plan to bring us all out of this nonsense. I have so far had 38 likes and only a few anti’s, as you can imagine in twitter terms I am very much a nobody and so 38 likes is a record and maybe gives a small indication that people are looking for an end to all this, especially now that over 6 million have been vaccinated.

Now that Granny has been vaccinated nobody has today accused me of being a Granny killer! every cloud has a silver lining.

378268 ▶▶ Annie, replying to Steve Martindale, 2, #1003 of 1991 🔗

Granny can still pass the Deadly Lurg on to you, though, remember.

378460 ▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Annie, 3, #1004 of 1991 🔗

Especially if she licks her hankie and wipes chocolate of your face with it.
They all do that don’t they.

378272 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Steve Martindale, #1005 of 1991 🔗


Yes the Government must now publish an exit plan + the cost benefit analysis of lockdown v economy

378159 Thomas_E, replying to Thomas_E, 22, #1006 of 1991 🔗

Well I had a nice and relaxing weekend away from this little island of sanity but I need to report front the Forbidden Lands aka outside spaces in London.

Saturday I took the family for an afternoon walk down the Southbank, nice and sunny , lots of people, relaxed atmosphere, zero police and it felt almost normal bar the fact that almost everything was closed . Borough market is now feels like a prison, checkpoints to in in maned by burly security guards checking everybody has a mask on and very unpleasant if you don’t. They have also kettled everybody that wants hot food into a queue where people are standing cheek by jowl for at least 15 minutes.So that means all over each other in the queue, but makes re you wear a mask and distance inside the market( which is actually opened but with a roof, because science?!)

And yesterday my wife took my daughter sledging to a nearby hill where she met some of her friends and they were kids for a couple of hours. Send this to my BIL and he went ballistic again, granny killer, irresponsible scum etc..I now do it just to mess with his head.

I also so somebody asking about a veterans opinion of a military coup as being the only solution. Right , let me explain this. The forces are manly consisted of very decent , patriotic man and women who are prepared to give their life for their country. The officer class are mostly toffs from various military academy’s (Sandringham ETC) who are upper middle class or super rich toffs. While some are very decent ( I had a LT and a Cap that were like brothers to me) the moment you make full Coronel it’s nothing but politics. They all become backstabbing politicians and that is how all the promotions are handed out , political actions , loyalty and lobbying. This is juts my opinion , a veteran that did 2 tours of duty but would love to hear other opinions.

SO the people at the very top are in complete lock step with the government so this is a no,no scenario.

378198 ▶▶ jhfreedom, replying to Thomas_E, 5, #1007 of 1991 🔗

The closest the army got to a coup was in the 1970s during the three-day week when everything in the UK was going to hell. It is today too, but now the army is much smaller. I’m afraid I don’t see them doing anything about it.

378355 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to jhfreedom, #1008 of 1991 🔗

The idea of doubling down with an army-led coup as a way out of a police state and back back to democracy is ludicrous beyond belief.

378513 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to RickH, 1, #1009 of 1991 🔗


378368 ▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to jhfreedom, #1010 of 1991 🔗

Agreed, to many cuts trough the years, some units can’t even fill their ranks for fucks sake, not enough recruits. The Navy has become a paper tiger and is a shambles and the RAF ,well they have their own issues with founding .

378512 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to jhfreedom, #1011 of 1991 🔗

That’s correct, apparently- the clandestine meetings in 1968 between Hugh Cudlipp, Lord Mountbatten, George Kennedy Young, Walter Walker and God knows who else. However, the only enthusiasm for Coup d’Etat 2.0 from the usual sources would IMO be in favour of clamping down on us really, really hard if the politicos hadn’t the balls to see this agenda through. No prospect whatsoever of their acting as a people’s army of liberation.

378224 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Thomas_E, 8, #1012 of 1991 🔗

Keep sending shit to your BIL, Tommy. I’ve just ordered my paranoid brother a year’s subscription to ‘The Light’.

So you’re saying our coup would need to be led by Majors, Captains, and Lieutenants … ? 🙂

378262 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Thomas_E, 1, #1013 of 1991 🔗

The way you describe army officers of the ‘old school’ is nothing like the reality, in my own experience, with most, now retired, having very little in the way of political leanings, especially not becoming ”back-stabbing politicians”. That very description is laughable! The presently serving ones are certainly not mostly ”toffs from military academies”, upper class or rich. Yes, a very few are, of course, but no less effective for that.

The problem that I see with the forces today is that the attitudes of young people have been degraded, with snowflakery being encouraged. Yes indeed, though, they most certainly are to be admired for their commitment and loyalty, and no doubt they’re honourable and admirable people, robust and professional. But I doubt very much if they’re the material of which revolution is made, neither the present officers or those in the ranks.

378365 ▶▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Banjones, #1014 of 1991 🔗

Look, in my experience the unit I was in was led by officers who were all from military academies and one he was a son of a fucking Earl ( good officer and a very decent bloke)…so yes , these people are still very much in the forces. of course can’t wouch for RAF and or the Navy..You are right , mostly have no open political leanings but somebody I know (from the good old days) is now working at the MoD and he tells inside shannigans happen all the time. You are right that a lot of the old guard is on their way out and very enjoying your retirement but it will not change until there is who le generation shift. There were also a ot of very good officers that left the service after Afghanistan because they were disillusioned etc..

378555 ▶▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Thomas_E, #1015 of 1991 🔗

There aren’t many who are the sons (or daughters) of titled aristocracy.

You’re right, of course. But it surely must depend on the individual and their personal honour. And it’s good to speak to people who’ve served at the sharp end – from NI to Afghanistan – to get their take on it. But that’s why I think they are not the people who would countenance insurrection, both ex rankers and ex officers. They REALLY want to believe in the country (and its government as representative of this country) that they swore allegiance to, even though many now are not in the military. At the moment, I really feel that Johnson and his government are letting them down.

God only knows how the present youngsters (officers and ranks) feel about the situation.

378350 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Thomas_E, -3, #1016 of 1991 🔗

The forces are manly consisted of very decent , patriotic man and women”

No – they’re just a cross-section of ordinary individuals who went into the forces. Just like those in most occupations. Don’t get sentimental.

378561 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to RickH, #1017 of 1991 🔗

This is NOT sentimentality. If you really believe that then you know NOTHING about the military mindset, so it’s best you say nothing at all, lest you offend people with a very strong sense of military honour.
At least Thomas E knows that of which he speaks. You obviously do not.

378357 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Thomas_E, 2, #1018 of 1991 🔗

Way back in 1989 I was offered a cadetship at Sandhurst.

Looked at what they were paying, looked at what I was getting working 56/28 rotation in Syria on the rigs going to Amsterdam and Thailand every time off and said “no chance” to them.

Think it was a wise decision looking back.

378167 DThom, replying to DThom, 26, #1019 of 1991 🔗

Why not send all the people that wish to remain Locked down and safe, away to live their lives in China or North Korea, then the rest of us can get on with our lives!

378255 ▶▶ Annie, replying to DThom, 2, #1020 of 1991 🔗

Excellent idea. They would be very, very safe in North Korwa.

378177 Ken Garoo, replying to Ken Garoo, 15, #1021 of 1991 🔗

Regarding the totally BS No Health Service advert:

“I doubt I’m the first to send you this ad, which makes the ludicrous assertion that a THIRD of people are spreading COVID-19 asymptomatically.”

Arrrgh we have time-warped back to the Typhoid Mary era.

I have seen that figure menioned in an official goverrnment document. I couldn’t believe it, but didn’t have time to track down the origin. I got the distinct impression it was a modelled figure. The recent Chinese investigation of 10 million people found a possible 0.03% rate of asymptomatic transmission, as opposed to the claimed 33% transmission. Given the UK figure is out by 3 orders of magnitude, it is almost certainly the result of the Mad Modeller’s actions.

378197 ▶▶ Ozzie, replying to Ken Garoo, 2, #1022 of 1991 🔗

There is more about this in article above the line. Also has a link to report it to the Advertising Standards Agency

378363 ▶▶ p02099003, replying to Ken Garoo, 1, #1023 of 1991 🔗

But did Typhoid Mary really pass on typhoid fever? She was a cook. According to Wikipedia some of her “victims” developed diarrhoea, but according to the NHS website one of the initial symptoms is constipation. However, other food poisoning such as campylobacter also causes similar symptoms, and occurs if food is inadequately cooked or cross contamination.

378541 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to p02099003, #1024 of 1991 🔗

My Best Beloved is a version of Typhoid Mary. There is an ability to be so laid back that stress can be spread without the carrier being at all affected.

378537 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Ken Garoo, #1025 of 1991 🔗

This link was posted earlier, and it’s well worth a listen/watch:

378178 Spikedee1, 14, #1026 of 1991 🔗

Hey all you muso’s, I know it’s not covid related but I was on YouTube last night and found a series of interviews done over Zoom by David Hepworth and Mark Ellen.
They have been doing these since lockdown began. Theses guys worked on smash hits back in the day and also whistle test back in the day. Its a simple premise called a word in your ear. Or a word in your attic. So its either authors talking about their books about music, like album designers, music promoters. Or the Attic one they just get famous people like Mari Wilson or Danny Baker or Billy Bragg to go in their attics, find some interesting stuff and chat about the story attached to it. Things like first record purchased, first gig. Its addictive and very entertaining. Good way to burn an hour before bed to take your mind off this covid shit!

378180 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 11, #1027 of 1991 🔗

Germany Weighs Electricity Rationing Scheme To Stabilize Its Now Shaky Green Power Grid

Blackouts threaten

Cutting off e-vehicle battery chargers and industry


378193 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Victoria, 17, #1028 of 1991 🔗

Maybe instead of clapping, we can all stand at our doors and wave Bye Bye to western civilisation.

378200 ▶▶ stefarm, replying to Victoria, 5, #1029 of 1991 🔗


378624 ▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to Victoria, 2, #1030 of 1991 🔗

To deal with the power grid problems, Germany’s Economics Minister Peter Altmaier presented a draft law that would allow electric utilities “to temporarily cut off charging power for e-cars when there is once again too little electricity available”, an idea known as “peak smoothing”.

Imagine putting your electric vehicle on charge just before you go to bed expecting to have a full charge in the morning that would get you to your client site only to find that the fuckers had turned it off overnight and that you now only had a partial charge that wouldn’t get you anywhere near your destination.

That would ruin your day.

378185 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 21, #1031 of 1991 🔗

The big electric vehicle LIE: Electric cars are not “zero emissions,” and their ecological impact is actually dirtier than diesel trucks

Electric cars emit 11 – 28 percent more CO2 than diesel engines


378195 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Victoria, 9, #1032 of 1991 🔗

the well to wheel Co2 has been know in the automotive industry for years. But it doesn’t meet the narrative.

378279 ▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Victoria, 6, #1033 of 1991 🔗

Yes. But electric cars are very expensive- the masses can’t afford them. And you can’t drive very far in one.

378349 ▶▶▶ jonathan Palmer, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 7, #1034 of 1991 🔗

If you watch UK column today they did a great piece on electric vehicles.Basically there are not enough rare earth materials in the world to replace the UK car fleet and that is before you even begin to generate the electricity that is needed to run them.
We are not going to be allowed to drive in the future.Agenda 21/30 is taking shape before our eyes.

378442 ▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to jonathan Palmer, 1, #1035 of 1991 🔗

How else were they going to meet CO2 targets apart from dropping the covid bomb?
That will be 500 quid please.

378494 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to jonathan Palmer, #1036 of 1991 🔗

That is exactly the point I was making, Jonathan. Our masters have been fretting about the mobility of the common people since the advent of the railways. What an opportunity they have now to put us back in our box.

378188 Ozzie, replying to Ozzie, 15, #1037 of 1991 🔗

This may already have been posted:

January lockdown had 1/3 less national impact on movement than the March shutdown

The latest data from Oxford’s COVID-19 Impact Monitor shows the January lockdown has, so far, had one third less national impact on movement than the March shutdown. The figures demonstrate that some regions are still moving at more than 50% of pre-pandemic levels, despite the tough restrictions and calls for people to remain at home.

January lockdown impact on movement

378246 ▶▶ Annie, replying to Ozzie, 11, #1038 of 1991 🔗


378275 ▶▶▶ WasSteph, replying to Annie, 6, #1039 of 1991 🔗

Oh yes, but I’d like it to be even “GOODER”

378199 Nobody2021, replying to Nobody2021, 3, #1040 of 1991 🔗

Unless Nick Cohen is advocating absolutely zero risk then anything he says or thinks can be classed as “dealing in ignorance” and “promote ideas that can kill”.

His only defence would be that his stance is a “safer” stance.

378202 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Nobody2021, 2, #1041 of 1991 🔗

What do you think of his ability to appreciate relative risk?

378230 ▶▶▶ Nobody2021, replying to Steve Hayes, 7, #1042 of 1991 🔗

He like many others try to use individual cases to make an argument. One man said covid is a hoax and died of it as if to say if you don’t believe in it then it will get you.

Statistically it is almost certainly the case that the majority of people who die of covid believe in it and follow all the rules. It would be an easier argument using data to say you are more likely to die of covid if you follow the rules.

That would be an absurd argument to make but also a stronger one than Mr Cohen’s attempt.

378348 ▶▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Nobody2021, #1043 of 1991 🔗

In a nice irony Cohen asserts that RT is propaganda.

378453 ▶▶▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Nobody2021, #1044 of 1991 🔗

which shows it’s nothing more than superstition. Unless you pay obeisance to the gods of covid, they will smite you down. fuck off.

378341 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Nobody2021, 3, #1045 of 1991 🔗

Cohen is a known and notorious dimwit masquerading as a journalist, but mainly just parading private obsessions.

378446 ▶▶ JaneHarry, replying to Nobody2021, 2, #1046 of 1991 🔗

Nick Cohen is a dunderhead

378479 ▶▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to JaneHarry, 1, #1047 of 1991 🔗

Yes, just Speccie click bait, best ignored.

378207 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 17, #1048 of 1991 🔗

Been reading this document again:


and in it it states:

“A typical RT-PCR assay will have a maximum of 40 thermal cycles.”

But in an e-mail from a test kit manufacturer they told me when I asked where their 45 Ct cycles came from:

“This is a PHE requirement rather than what is laid out by the manufacturer.”

So does this mean that all tests been done for months now been out of spec and are null and void?

378232 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Awkward Git, 8, #1049 of 1991 🔗

Yes indeed. These Ct cycles were ramped up to get as many as possible ‘cases’ to shut down the country and eliminate our rights

378238 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Victoria, 10, #1050 of 1991 🔗

I’ve sent a FOI to PHE, the NHS and DHSC asking if this means all results over 40 cycels are null and void.

378289 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1051 of 1991 🔗

In this Government document it says something different again:


Recommended actions

All laboratories should determine the threshold for a positive result at the limit of detection based on the in-use assay.

It is necessary to strike a balance between the risk of false positive test results and an acceptable level of delay in test turnaround time (time taken to report results).

This puts the onus on the testing labs and gives the Government an out to say “not us wot done it, it was those naughty labs that did it”.

Pointed this out to the test kit manufacturer I had been in contact with saying that were being thrown under the bus by Governemnt and were now on the hook in the upcoming court cases etcand they said basically “Oh really? Give us more info about them” so I did.

378339 ▶▶ isobar, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1052 of 1991 🔗

Almost certainly does. You just have to add this to the change in signing off death certificates to see how engineered this whole thing is.

378859 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Awkward Git, #1053 of 1991 🔗

So does this mean that all tests been done for months now been out of spec and are null and void?

Were it anyone else, AG, I’d have to advise “keeping up !”. But from your good self even I can spot the irony. 🙂

378210 JohnB, 17, #1054 of 1991 🔗

Huzzah ! Have been invited to a KBF Mental Health Support Group poker session. What a good idea. 🙂

378211 Stephanos, replying to Stephanos, 26, #1055 of 1991 🔗

I have just been offered ‘the vaccine’. I turned 70 last year. I have refused, I don’t trust all this.
Has anyone else on here refused? Lots of people said they would.
By the way, I used to work at a sewage treatment works so I think I have an immunity already.

378217 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Stephanos, 9, #1056 of 1991 🔗

my dad is 81 and he refused, he has had the flu one though.

378241 ▶▶ Andrea Salford, replying to Stephanos, 12, #1057 of 1991 🔗

I’ve not been offered one yet but my mum 82.5 has refused hers. She’s had the ‘flu and pneumonia one, so not anti-vax but she just said ‘no for now, I’m not being a guinea pig’.

378244 ▶▶ Portnadler, replying to Stephanos, 8, #1058 of 1991 🔗

Not yet as I haven’t been offered it. I’ll be 68 when my offer comes in and it will be a polite but flat refusal. I have more respect for (and trust in) my body than to inject it with God-knows-what.

378249 ▶▶▶ Carrie, replying to Portnadler, 6, #1059 of 1991 🔗

Good on you for refusing – look at this: https://twitter.com/Mhd_AlObaidi/status/1353691534512840708/photo/1

The UK may not be reporting vaccine ‘effects’, but Gibraltar is…

378307 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Carrie, 1, #1060 of 1991 🔗

Maybe the government site for putting in the reports needs to be more widely advertised:


For active monitoring of the vaccine you need to register and then they will monitor you to see if you get side-effects and see how you get on:


378337 ▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Carrie, 1, #1061 of 1991 🔗

Interestingly, I posted on this quite late the other evening: https://lockdownsceptics.org/2021/01/22/latest-news-262/#comment-373553

I posted:

I do NOT like coincidences; this one is waaaaaay to coincidental for me.

Gibraltar: January 13th – total cumulative deaths was 20. January 21st – total cumulative deaths was 59. Increase of 195% .

Watch the numbers go up since January 14th. Guess what started on January 14th.

1st chart is deaths, 2nd chart is vaccinations.

I added 2 charts showing the sudden jump in deaths starting the day vaccination started.

I just revisited the post and notice our own Northumbrian Nomad says

The numbers are so tiny you have to look at the specifics. It’s got into care homes. Six people died “with Corona” in a single care home the other day and even the Gib government says two of them died of other causes, one of dementia and the other of brain damage (perhaps he’d been reading the collected speeches of Neil O’Brien, poor chap).

“So. Coincidence? Yes.”

Nomad, I love your posts, but when did we started believing anything any government says?

378338 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, #1062 of 1991 🔗

Apologies, I badly worded that last sentence.

I meant to say:

“Nomad, I love your posts, but if this is what the Gib Government are saying, when did we started believing anything any government says?”

Anyway, Vaccinations.

378426 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Two-Six, replying to Ceriain, 3, #1063 of 1991 🔗

Hummmm intersting, I think it might be something in the water. They get all their water from that mountain thing don’t they. I bet some covids landed the rock and got into the water.

The water in Gibralta

378271 ▶▶ Van Allen, replying to Stephanos, 11, #1064 of 1991 🔗

I know a number of people who say they won’t take it unless forced to, but it seems “forced to” includes needing it to go on holiday for some people. Me? I’ve accepted I won’t be going abroad for at least a couple of years because I’m pretty sure it’s going to be a condition of travel (OR You will have to go through the isolation hotels and testing hoops and the rest).

378304 ▶▶ alw, replying to Stephanos, 10, #1065 of 1991 🔗

I am 72 and have been offered the Pfizer vaccine twice which I refused, just had an invite for the Astrazeneca vaccine which I will be declining too. I will not be having any vaccine.

378336 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Stephanos, 6, #1066 of 1991 🔗

I haven’t been offered it, but I won’t be taking up the offer.

Snake Oil boiled for 6 months isn’t a vaccine established as safe – by definition.

378344 ▶▶ stevie, replying to Stephanos, 4, #1067 of 1991 🔗

I am 70 also. I had a phone call (on the land line) last week was offered it and politely refused. This was from my local doctors medical centre.

378371 ▶▶ mj, replying to Stephanos, 3, #1068 of 1991 🔗

i was reminded that i hadnt had flu vaccine .. letter ignored.
not old enough to be on the covid concoction so unable to have the satisfaction of telling them where to stick the needle

378520 ▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to Stephanos, 1, #1069 of 1991 🔗

Definitely trust your judgment on this. You are far from being alone. Whatever you do, do not give in to any peer pressure. In my view, those who do this without a second thought clearly have no sense of the value of their own life, or are incredibly naive, if they are prepared to take what is undoubtedly a risk.

378858 ▶▶ xplod, replying to Stephanos, 1, #1070 of 1991 🔗

Had a phone call earlier from my health centre inviting me for a jab. I refused, politely. No comment from the receptionist, merely a “well, if you change your mind, give us a call”. I’m 68 and classed as “extremely vulnerable”. Already taking a small cocktail of drugs including immunosuppressants, so not too keen on any of the jabs….in any case, as they only “mitigate” the symptoms, I might as well take Lemsip (other remedies are available) and hot lemonade!

378212 Paulus, replying to Paulus, 76, #1071 of 1991 🔗

92 year old mother who won’t act her age was at the GP surgery for a consultation, cutting a long story short was prescribed a medication she has an allergy to and went back the following day to flag their error and get a new script. Receptionist informed her that she could not just turn up, she had to make an appointment despite the whole reason for attending was their error.

So can I make an appointment? no you have to phone in, but I’m stood in front of you! Can I pay to use your phone to talk to you? no we don’t have a pay phone. Can you tell me where there is a payphone I can go to to have this conversation with you? No sorry I don’t know, I am just doing my job. At this point a member of the audience (she was enjoying herself) offered her the use of a mobile phone to enable her to stand in front of this person and call her, only then did the stupidity seem to hit home and she’d bend the rules and talk to the doctor who made the mistake.

God help anyone who is frail or vulnerable, remind me again why we are protecting the NHS!

378219 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to Paulus, 32, #1072 of 1991 🔗

That is brilliant – good on your Mum for not allowing the stupidity to continue!

378282 ▶▶ Paul, replying to Paulus, 25, #1073 of 1991 🔗

Good for your mum.I encountered similar insanity at my surgery a few weeks ago.They had messed up my repeat prescription for the seventh time in a row and I went to sort it out,as expected I couldn’t just walk in and had to phone them from the outside entrance,the receptionist said she would get the right one printed out so I could collect it,but under no circumstances must I enter the building,I said I couldn’t anyway because the bloody door was locked !.Eventually the receptionist came to the door,visored up,opened it slightly and stretched her arm out with my prescription.I said can we get this ongoing problem with my prescription sorted out please ?,her response was no,you will have to ring me,I said you can’t be serious ?,you’re stood here in front of me,please just sort it out,no,sorry,you need to phone me she replied and closed the door !.

378309 ▶▶▶ kh1485, replying to Paul, 20, #1074 of 1991 🔗

They just love it, don’t they, the power. I wonder if they go on a special course.

378340 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to kh1485, 7, #1075 of 1991 🔗

Yep, quite a few simillar commenst alstw eek about some of the doctor’s staff enjoying the power trip and it give sthem a thrill.

One was overheard by a GP who was trying to get in the building and he looked decidedly sheepish and scuttled in as quick as he could.

378374 ▶▶▶▶▶ Alan P, replying to Awkward Git, 10, #1076 of 1991 🔗

Similar theme. DiL having a scan in 12 weeks of pregnancy.
On NHS terms my son not allowed in to accompany her. Same thing done paying private medical insurance, on same premises with same sonography reviews; All fine.

Insanity or what? You choose!

378457 ▶▶▶▶ ituex, replying to kh1485, 8, #1077 of 1991 🔗

I worked as a doctors receptionist during the holidays when I was a medical student. It was really good fun and yes you do have a ridiculous amount of power. The difference was that I had some sense of why I was asking the patients questions rather than just doing it to be difficult. I actually made more per hour than I did as a newly qualified doctor.

378293 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Paulus, 15, #1078 of 1991 🔗

enable her to stand in front of this person and call her

I think you will will find many people this has happened to.

What you described above has happened to me, except in my case I just pulled out my own phone and called her. The circumstances, in my case, were also over a wrongly prescribed medication.

The doctor came out of his office to ask what was going on, and just stood there mouth wide open while I explained. It was quite surreal.

378308 ▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 21, #1079 of 1991 🔗

Also worth adding: same surgery, same receptionist once “handed” my wife my prescription through the surgery’s front door letter box with one of these…

378559 ▶▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Ceriain, 2, #1080 of 1991 🔗

I use one of them to pickup dried hard dog turds.

379144 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Anti_socialist, #1081 of 1991 🔗

Man needs a hobby, I suppose. 😉

378314 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Paulus, 20, #1082 of 1991 🔗

More and more this happens I’m finding that as I do the deliveries to GPs and dentists the absurdity is now angering people.

Big change in attitudes when I speak to people at their doors in recent weeks.

378323 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Awkward Git, 8, #1083 of 1991 🔗

There’s only one thing for it – BIGGER posters proclaiming ‘our staff’s right to work in an environment free from abuse, intimidation and violence’

Frankly, knighthoods should be on offer for turning doctors’ receptionists inside out with a meathook.

378376 ▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Awkward Git, 12, #1084 of 1991 🔗

AG, do you ever get a chance to discuss with the GPs/Nurses/Receptionists in these surgeries the stupidity of having their elderly patients being left queueing in the cold to get in to see them?

378617 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Ceriain, 3, #1085 of 1991 🔗

I do mention it now and again along with other stuff – they all look sheepish most of the time especially as I end up in the back room somewhere as they cannot carry the box, freefaced, with my lanyard hidden behind the big box I’m carrying.

Some are very sceptical but don’t want to say it out loud just in case and so on but from what they say to me on the QT I know as you do.

The few who questioned me as I’m delivering lateral flow tests soon realise I’m not as green as I’m cabbage looking and know a lot more than they seem to do and can hold my own in a debate so they soon shut up.

One question that really flummoxes them is this:

“did you know that this practice is specifically mentioned as exempt from the face covering legislation and the BMA cannot supply evidence face coverings work so why are you wearing a mask/face covering?”

Don’t believe me? It’s in here:


Here is the relevant phrase and it’s never been changed in all the amendments:


Exemptions from definition of shop – regulation 2(2)

7. Premises (other than registered pharmacies) providing wholly or mainly medical or dental services, audiology services, chiropody, chiropractic, osteopathic, optometry or other medical services including services relating to mental health.

379154 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Awkward Git, 3, #1086 of 1991 🔗

As always, thanks for a most informative reply. 🙂

I recognise the “Some are very sceptical but don’t want to say it out loud just in case
and so on but from what they say to me on the QT I know as you do.” line.

I went for my flu jab (have to, for… reasons) and the practice nurse said to me with a twinkle in her eye, “Where’s your mask?”
I gave her a cheeky look and a wink.
She gave back an even cheekier wink and said, “You don’t believe any of this, do you?”
“Me neither,” she replied.

Made my day!

378319 ▶▶ dorset dumpling, replying to Paulus, 8, #1087 of 1991 🔗

A friend of mine, 87, partially sighted and stone deaf, still gets phone calls from her surgery although on the top of her records it states quite clearly that she is deaf and only to send text messages which she is able to read with a special phone. Fortunately she is still bright eyed and bush tailed and just lets it flow over her.

378505 ▶▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to dorset dumpling, 13, #1088 of 1991 🔗

When my mother died at home eighteen months ago after 5 years bedbound and with dementia, the principal GP for the local practice rang to ask my brother (her sole carer) rhetorically if he had been satisfied with the local NHS care she had received – apparently he is obliged to do this before signing off a death certificate.

My brother told him that it didn’t reflect well on the practice that every year for five years a practice letter arrived telling our mother that she needed to visit the surgery to have her blood pressure checked, and on being told she was bedbound (and it must be on their records) they promised to send a district nurse to do the check, but said nurse never actually materialised in all of the five years.

After some hesitation, all that the GP could proffer was no apology but the excuse that “Managing a practice is a complicated affair and this sort of thing is bound to happen.” Really? How complicated can it be to flag up on someone’s records that they are bedbound…and every year for five years? A specialist incontinence nurse came routinely every year and a podiatrist every six weeks without fail. How could they manage to organise themselves but not the local GP practice?

378364 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip, replying to Paulus, 6, #1089 of 1991 🔗

Worthy of a Marx brothers film.

378527 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Paulus, 3, #1090 of 1991 🔗

I used to volunteer with a transport service and sat in plenty waiting areas in GPs, dentists, hospitals. Coming from Germany, I am always astonished how inefficient the system is.

378218 Victoria, replying to Victoria, 10, #1091 of 1991 🔗

Why is Bill Gates buying up farmland across America ?

 Bill Gates and the UN’s agricultural experiments .
Bill Gate’s investment vehicle, Cascade Investments, has gone to great lengths to conceal his large farmland purchases , and have tried to cover their tracks with each monstrous deal. One of the deals was a $171 million acquisition concealed by an LLC with two employees in a metal-sided building down a dirt road off the Bayou Teche.
In Scotland, Bill Gates teamed up with the United Kingdom to develop “super crops” and to breed high-yield cows. The two entities invested $174 million into experimental breeding programs that aim to make cows produce more milk, make chickens lay more eggs, and make genetically modified crops better withstand disease. The experiments are intended to “help” 100 million African farmers so they can produce higher yields from their small-scale farming operations.

Do these international land grabs and globalist’s experiments coincide with the FDA’s efforts to shutdown raw milk farmers and the Bureau of Land Management’s war against independent ranchers ?


378227 ▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Victoria, 15, #1092 of 1991 🔗

Because he’s a psychopath. Psychos seek power to control.

378263 ▶▶ Portnadler, replying to Victoria, 5, #1093 of 1991 🔗

There are far better things going on in Uganda as a result of an organic farming centre (supported by Riverford). No GM rubbish there:


378284 ▶▶ maggie may, replying to Victoria, 3, #1094 of 1991 🔗

God, is there no limit to the way the human race will abuse animals?

378332 ▶▶▶ jb12, replying to maggie may, 4, #1095 of 1991 🔗

No, and now imagine a group who see everyone else as cattle (you don’t have to imagine very hard) and think about what the former might do to the latter.

378622 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Victoria, #1096 of 1991 🔗

I’m fully expecting all that land to get “rewilded” at some point.

378225 bebophaircut, replying to bebophaircut, -2, #1097 of 1991 🔗

This is a link to the Richard Dawkins Foundation.He doesn’t appear to be on our side. He’s a scientist, so I guess that explains it.


378253 ▶▶ Van Allen, replying to bebophaircut, 1, #1098 of 1991 🔗

But most of the scientists not paid by the governments or the vaccine companies are on “our side”?

378329 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to Van Allen, 4, #1099 of 1991 🔗

Exactly. Sloppy generalisations don’t help the cause.

I would argue that those supporting lockdowns etc. are actually not ‘scientists’, since they are denying scientific method.

378530 ▶▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to RickH, #1100 of 1991 🔗

This was explained quite well in this video (link here earlier today)

In the rarified air of acedemia, it doesn’t actually matter about honesty so long as you produce something, anything, even if it’s mocked, so long as you get it out there. Lucrative and high profile jobs are few are far between.
(At least, that’s how I understood it.)

378270 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to bebophaircut, 3, #1101 of 1991 🔗

Not written by Richard Dawkins. The site is reporting a piece published in the New York Times written by:

Aaron E. Carroll and Nicholas Bagley.

Mr. Carroll is a professor of pediatrics . Mr. Bagley is a law professor .

Hardly vaccine experts.

378378 ▶▶ FerdIII, replying to bebophaircut, 4, #1102 of 1991 🔗

Dawkins is a scientist? Since when? Philosopher not a scientist. Kindly direct me to any scientific experiments he has done, or any system he has built (including software) which is related to the scientific method – you know – hypothesis, observations, experiments, test, factual data, assess against hypothesis etc. that anyone can replicate.

378506 ▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to FerdIII, #1103 of 1991 🔗

This is a site from the USA.

378836 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to FerdIII, #1104 of 1991 🔗

He was Professor of Zoology for a while, at Berkley and at Oxford.

379203 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to FerdIII, #1105 of 1991 🔗

He is a zoologist. You appear to have a rather narrow definition of science.

378239 Ken Garoo, replying to Ken Garoo, 15, #1106 of 1991 🔗

Lockdowners and maskers are supporters of mass child abuse. Discuss.

378245 ▶▶ jb12, replying to Ken Garoo, 2, #1107 of 1991 🔗

I hate that ‘discuss’ thing you have appended there.

378261 ▶▶▶ Ken Garoo, replying to jb12, 11, #1108 of 1991 🔗

Sorry. It was intended as a mockery of the Oxbridge-style exam paper questions.

Torture is sometimes justified. Discuss

378269 ▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Ken Garoo, 2, #1109 of 1991 🔗

Torture is sometimes justified. Discuss”

Tony Blair.

378425 ▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to GrannySlayer, 7, #1110 of 1991 🔗

Torture is justified on Tony Blair. Discuss.

378292 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to Ken Garoo, 1, #1111 of 1991 🔗

“What is a head? What is the evolutionary significance of heads?” I’m not making that one up.

378362 ▶▶▶▶▶ mj, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 5, #1112 of 1991 🔗

something that can be used to describe a health minister or a prime minister when prefixed by the word “dick”.
I await my PPE 2.1 in the post

378486 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to mj, 1, #1113 of 1991 🔗

Congratulatory First at the very least!

378522 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to mj, 1, #1114 of 1991 🔗

Well, THAT should put you in line for a job as ”Secretary of State for Health” anyway.
No medical or scientific experience required.
Can you quote Churchill too?

378812 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to mj, #1115 of 1991 🔗

2.2. You omitted the alternative correct answer ‘knob’.

378328 ▶▶▶▶ jb12, replying to Ken Garoo, 1, #1116 of 1991 🔗

No, I am sorry, I shouldn’t have been so rude. I do hate that ‘discuss’ stuff though.

378815 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to jb12, #1117 of 1991 🔗

You weren’t rude, jb12. 🙂 Chill.

378366 ▶▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Ken Garoo, #1118 of 1991 🔗

To be a true Oxford-style exam question the bit before “discuss” would have had to be about three lines long.

378321 ▶▶ RickH, replying to Ken Garoo, 1, #1119 of 1991 🔗

No. Many genuinely don’t recognise this problem.

378807 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to Ken Garoo, 1, #1120 of 1991 🔗

Lockdowners and maskers are supporters of mass child abuse. Discuss.


Right, that’s done, everyone down the pub …

378240 tony rattray, replying to tony rattray, 7, #1121 of 1991 🔗

The end of debenhams and its lesson for lockdown britain

The judge who finally wound up debenhams described it as a “rudderless ship” drifting in an “ocean of insolvency” which needed to be brought into port.

Lockdown britain…

378250 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to tony rattray, 17, #1122 of 1991 🔗

“A rudderless ship drifting in an ocean of insolvency”…. that describes the entire country.


378476 ▶▶ The Filthy Engineer, replying to tony rattray, 2, #1123 of 1991 🔗

Debenhams was in trouble long before the lockdown. I won’t deny that lockdown was probably the final nail in that coffin but they had had the Administrators in twice in the last few years.

378259 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 14, #1124 of 1991 🔗

So they are about to ease restrictions in California !
Now if i believed in conspiracy theories..

378472 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to nickbowes, #1125 of 1991 🔗

‘French Laundry’ Newsom trying to save his skin.

378277 maggie may, replying to maggie may, 27, #1126 of 1991 🔗

I got an email just now from the NHS about vaccination (I’m 70) The first two lines read

‘The NHS is performing selections for coronavirus vaccination on the basis of family genetics and medical history.

You have been selected to receive a coronavirus vaccination’.

Does anyone else find that really disturbing or am I neurotic? I am unaware of anything in my family genetics or medical history that makes me a suitable candidate for vaccination (both parents died in late 80s of natural causes, my grandmother ditto in her 90s) I have no medical problems. My age is nothing to do with my medical history, it’s just a fact!

It seems to me that they are putting the fear of God into people talking about family genetics etc so that they will all line up like good sheep for their vaccination. I have deleted the email without replying

378291 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to maggie may, 8, #1127 of 1991 🔗

Hi Maggie, I agree that is concerning. The NHS seems to be moving towards that kind of technology – perhaps they are just preparing us for that with such language.


378296 ▶▶ Portnadler, replying to maggie may, 2, #1128 of 1991 🔗

It’s quite likely to be a scam. Just as well you deleted it though it may have been worth reporting.

378300 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to maggie may, 4, #1129 of 1991 🔗

The letter will have been generated from a standard template.

378510 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Steve Hayes, 1, #1130 of 1991 🔗

And if so, that in itself is unforgivable.

378411 ▶▶ vargas99, replying to maggie may, 5, #1131 of 1991 🔗

Maybe ask them when exactly they took your DNA without consent?

378464 ▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to vargas99, 3, #1132 of 1991 🔗

Like it!


378441 ▶▶ ituex, replying to maggie may, 2, #1133 of 1991 🔗

That isn’t right. Actually I’m not sure who or how to report it but might be worth finding out almost certainly a scam.

378459 ▶▶▶ maggie may, replying to ituex, 1, #1134 of 1991 🔗

Didn’t occur to me it could be a scam as i was expecting to get a ‘summons’ now they’re talking about doing the over 70s. looking online, there have been fake texts sent to people but can’t find anything about email scams. This was only asking if i wanted to accept or decline a vaccine, would be interested if anyone else has had this, people seem to be just getting direct calls from their GP.

379078 ▶▶▶▶ PastImperfect, replying to maggie may, #1135 of 1991 🔗

I was in the first group and the call from GP was similar to yours.

378499 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to maggie may, #1136 of 1991 🔗

Maybe that is supposed to persuade more “BAME” to take the vaccine?
Although that wording would offend me.

378515 ▶▶▶ Banjones, replying to Silke David, #1137 of 1991 🔗

Yes, good thinking. And, as you say, that in itself is actually offensive. Treating everyone as if they are representative of a ”group” for something so important.

378800 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to maggie may, #1138 of 1991 🔗

I’d have emailed them back asking for details of the ‘family genetics’. Lying bastards.

378280 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 10, #1139 of 1991 🔗

Until his recent Damascene conversion, Dan Hodges used to tweet “don’t worry, it’s only Pret” whenever the lockdown caused some business to fold. His point was that spoiled lockdown zealots were snottily saying who cares if Pret A Manger goes bust and had underestimated the depth of the economic disaster. I wonder if he’s tweeting that about Debenhams.

378385 ▶▶ Jonny S., replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 1, #1140 of 1991 🔗

Careful with using Debenhams as an example, they were in big trouble way before covid arrived.

378301 Lockdown Sceptic, 6, #1141 of 1991 🔗

Cruel Summer

Tony Heller

Thanks to unprecedented man-made global warming, we had 90 days between snowstorms this summer in Cheyenne, Wyoming. From June 8 to September 8.

378305 Puddleglum59, replying to Puddleglum59, 22, #1142 of 1991 🔗

i have calculated that I probably know 3,000 to 4,000 people. After nearly a year I do not know anyone who has died and only a handful of people who have had COVID. I’m not denying that there are folk dying of COVID but surely I would have heard of one or two by now. what is more whenever I ask people if they have known anyone they say something similar.

I just don’t get it.

378315 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to Puddleglum59, 4, #1143 of 1991 🔗

Still very very unlikely to be ”of” it, rather than ”with” it. I’m sure there are people out and about, fit as fiddles, who think that at any moment they’re going to attacked by the BigV and die a horrible death, right there on the road.

378461 ▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to Banjones, #1144 of 1991 🔗

Sadly, try saying that to any of ‘The Believers’…


378334 ▶▶ Fingerache Philip, replying to Puddleglum59, 2, #1145 of 1991 🔗

Nor anybody (sceptics, that is) else!

378342 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Puddleglum59, 6, #1146 of 1991 🔗

It might have something to do with age profile. The average age of coronavirus related deaths is 82.4. Are many of the people you know in their eighties and nineties?

378429 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to Steve Hayes, 4, #1147 of 1991 🔗

My mother is 84. She has a lot of friends. The only one who has had it developed it in hospital ten days after admission having fallen on ice and broken hip, arm and ribs.

378402 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Puddleglum59, 2, #1148 of 1991 🔗

Ahh but if someone dies 28 days after testing positive then its a Covid death depot the fact that you were killed by lightning/bus/stabbed/fell of cliff

378434 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to Victoria, 4, #1149 of 1991 🔗

My mums friend is refusing to die for that very reason!

378496 ▶▶ Portnadler, replying to Puddleglum59, 1, #1150 of 1991 🔗

My own guess is that you need to know people in a particular line of work. Medics and care workers know lots of people who have had it (and not just because they are dealing with patients, I mean their own colleagues).

The question is, why do they get it and we don’t?

378526 ▶▶▶ Puddleglum59, replying to Portnadler, #1151 of 1991 🔗

That’s a fair point but as a 61 year old I know people in all age categories and a good many who are in the health profession. My mum is in her late eighties and has many friends of a similar age. The average age of people in my church is possibly early 70s with many in their eighties and nineties.

I accept the point you made though

378313 Banjones, replying to Banjones, 22, #1152 of 1991 🔗

A family member was just offered the ‘jab’ on the phone today by her local surgery. She politely delcined: ”Not just now, thank you.” She said she heard a sharp intake of breath….

378320 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Banjones, 13, #1153 of 1991 🔗

Shock, horror! Some people are not being persuaded by the relentless propaganda!

I think the government can easily get to 50% of the adult population vaccinated on the strength of their fear messaging alone. Thereafter they will need to apply much more pressure to get to the 100% required for the technocracy.

378367 ▶▶▶ FerdIII, replying to Richard O, 3, #1154 of 1991 🔗

Army going door to door…? Voluntary but mandatory poison ingestion…

378380 ▶▶▶▶ Richard O, replying to FerdIII, 5, #1155 of 1991 🔗

That kind of action will be the last resort reserved for the 10% of refuseniks who resisted all other measures. I anticipate a large number of employers to make it mandatory for people to continue to work, and for the unvaccinated to be denied access to public services (transport, health etc.) before we get to that stage.

378790 ▶▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Richard O, #1156 of 1991 🔗

If they have to make it mandatory, that alone would be a huge admission of defeat on several levels.

Coercion, pressure, bribes, restrictions will continue, but no mandation.

378710 ▶▶▶ Rowan, replying to Richard O, #1157 of 1991 🔗

They will never get the 100%, even if it was made mandatory.

378345 Mark, replying to Mark, 19, #1158 of 1991 🔗

Laurence Fox’s new party still looking like the best option for anyone wanting to cast a vote against lockdown on principle:


378399 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Mark, 5, #1159 of 1991 🔗

Agree! we will need to support one alternative party against conservatives and labour

378438 ▶▶ wayno, replying to Mark, 1, #1160 of 1991 🔗

the comments are interesting, 😉

378454 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to wayno, 2, #1161 of 1991 🔗

I don’t think the Twatterati are his primary target market : -)

It’s just the easiest way to get a message out atm.

378458 ▶▶▶▶ wayno, replying to Mark, 2, #1162 of 1991 🔗

Agree, but it did attract a lot of pond life. That is the reason im not on twatter.

378911 ▶▶ jayp, replying to Mark, #1163 of 1991 🔗

I like Laurence, talks common sense . He will get my vote

378948 ▶▶▶ Mark, replying to jayp, #1164 of 1991 🔗

Probably mine too, if they stand a candidate in my const (northern big city Labour donkey cons though, so it’s not as though I’m ever personally going to get an MP worth spit anyway).

378466 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to neuer Englander, 1, #1166 of 1991 🔗

Did the fraud remember to rub the correct arm this time?

378655 ▶▶ Janette, replying to neuer Englander, 1, #1167 of 1991 🔗

I think that might just be a stunt though to show that he had some symptoms but not really serious with a view to encouraging people to get them

378356 Anti_socialist, replying to Anti_socialist, 17, #1169 of 1991 🔗


378386 ▶▶ alw, replying to Anti_socialist, 1, #1170 of 1991 🔗

Can we not get more information. Have no desire to sign up to telegram.

378398 ▶▶▶ alw, replying to alw, #1171 of 1991 🔗

I looked at Twitter and Facebook and there is no information

378468 ▶▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to alw, 1, #1172 of 1991 🔗

Just do it. There are tonnes of local groups up now.

378395 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to Anti_socialist, #1173 of 1991 🔗


378413 ▶▶ Thomas_E, replying to Anti_socialist, 2, #1174 of 1991 🔗

Now if there was a way to check which business would open and where so you could support them..Not going on a wild duck chase just on the off chance that the pubs around me grew some balls overnight and deiced to open up.

378936 ▶▶▶ stevie119, replying to Thomas_E, #1175 of 1991 🔗

Wetherspoons should join in. That would make a difference

378470 ▶▶ EllGee, replying to Anti_socialist, 1, #1176 of 1991 🔗

How do we find out? We’d support (obviously) but there’s no way of discovering….well as far as I can see

378525 ▶▶ Ken Gardner, replying to Anti_socialist, #1177 of 1991 🔗

It seems you have to provide a phone number to register for Telegram. Is anyone else concerned about that?

378642 ▶▶▶ Silke David, replying to Ken Gardner, #1178 of 1991 🔗

As it is mainly an APP, so designed for phones.

378543 ▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Anti_socialist, #1179 of 1991 🔗

Message to all BTL. Its nothing to do with me i just saw it & copied it to post here, i’m not organising it (if anyone is) i think its just an idea! I have no more info than the poster says. Pass it on!

378668 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Anti_socialist, 1, #1180 of 1991 🔗


378665 ▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to Anti_socialist, #1182 of 1991 🔗

I really love that website!

378369 isobar, replying to isobar, 27, #1183 of 1991 🔗

There can be no doubt that the Government is waging a psychological war against its own people with its increasing threats and lurid messaging. In effect we are being treated less well than prisoners of war; this is what the Geneva convention says:

“POWs cannot be subjected to physical or mental torture, or any other form of coercion to secure from them information of any kind. If the POW refused to answer any question, the POW must not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment.”

Surely “Look into my eyes” is mental torture as is “we are going to have Christmas “ then “we are not going to have Christmas” “we will look at easing restrictions in mid Feb” “we are a long long way from lifting restrictions” It would also seem that POWs would have had more defence about not wearing a mask without having to be interrogated or suffer unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment.

And our parliament has let this happen. Where is our modem day Cromwell when you need him?

378408 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to isobar, 11, #1184 of 1991 🔗

They have spent a year destabilising people. No one knows where they stand, no one can plan – it’s deliberate.

378418 ▶▶▶ isobar, replying to this is my username, 9, #1185 of 1991 🔗

Absolutely, which is why it is mental torture. I see the terrible impact of this on a daily basis in my own family and, from what I can gather, it’s the same in the families of my friends. Simply reprehensible and unforgivable.

378462 ▶▶ Nigel Sherratt, replying to isobar, 3, #1186 of 1991 🔗

Cromwell was dug up, hanged, beheaded and his head put on a spike at Westminster Hall to show that things were back to normal.

378589 ▶▶▶ isobar, replying to Nigel Sherratt, #1187 of 1991 🔗

Ouch! But things have moved on since then. I guess the modern day equivalent would be breakfast with Professor Fearguson, lunch with Handyjob and dinner with the fat blob himself. Actually, thinking about it beheading might be preferable.

378370 Ozzie, replying to Ozzie, 2, #1188 of 1991 🔗

“I’ve had the vaccine badge and vaccine card”

Just found this on eBay. Forget the badge – it comes with “an exact replica of the card issued at the time of vaccination to last as a permanent keepsake.”


378384 ▶▶ alw, replying to Ozzie, 1, #1189 of 1991 🔗

They are pointless as they do not come stamped as the official card.

378391 ▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to alw, #1190 of 1991 🔗

From what I can find out, the official card just has space for a date of each vaccination – is there something else on it?

378432 ▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Ozzie, 3, #1191 of 1991 🔗

It should have the batch number. This allows them to trace back if there are any adverse effects from the vaccine.

That doesn’t happen in this country, of course. /s

378421 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to alw, #1192 of 1991 🔗

They are by no means all stamped

378389 ▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Ozzie, 9, #1193 of 1991 🔗

Actually it would be fun to wear one when entering a supermarket and explaining that you have no need of a muzzle and getting quite stroppy if they said that the jab neither stopped you getting it or transmitting it. You could then say that they must be wrong or what would the point be in having it.

378394 ▶▶▶ Ozzie, replying to arfurmo, 2, #1194 of 1991 🔗

Yes – that is a great idea. I had been thinking of a more serious use if an employer was insisting on a vaccination before return to the office (the card not the badge!)

378427 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Ozzie, 7, #1195 of 1991 🔗

10% of the sale of this item will benefit NHS Charities Together

Regardless of what they are selling, the above means I’m out!

378373 Basileus, replying to Basileus, 12, #1196 of 1991 🔗

I don’t think that this has been reported here:

53 Dead in Gibraltar in 10 Days After Experimental Pfizer mRNA COVID Injections Started

378403 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Basileus, 1, #1197 of 1991 🔗

The story has (see my posts below), but I haven’t seen that link before, so thanks. 🙂

378534 ▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to Basileus, 4, #1198 of 1991 🔗

Call me cynical, but you have to admire the beauty of a scheme, giving an experimental vaccine to the frail elderly! That you couldn’t prove it was the vaccine that killed them, when they had little time left & were vulnerable to any other unlimited number of disease & old age morbidities.

378593 ▶▶▶ jonathan Palmer, replying to Anti_socialist, 2, #1199 of 1991 🔗

You forgot the bit about them using the inflated death figures to scare people into having the jab.
Evil genius

378540 ▶▶ Janette, replying to Basileus, 1, #1200 of 1991 🔗

Mmm not great. I wonder when BBC are going to start reporting these deaths???

378377 charleyfarley, replying to charleyfarley, 57, #1201 of 1991 🔗

Have just returned from delivering Back to Normal leaflets in my town. Only two people came out of their houses to shout at me in the street, so that was a result!

Angry man: “You should be ashamed delivering leaflets like that”.

Angry woman: “What a load of rubbish! I don’t want to read stuff like that”.

In characteristic bedwetter fashion they both scurried back into their dwellings before I could ask for the leaflets back. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

I walked around town for a bit. The streets were largely deserted, shops closed, like the aftermath of some nuclear accident. The little family run Thai grocery at the end of the High Street is now permanently closed. A personal tragedy for those folk – nice people -their lives ruined, unnoticed in the general hysteria, scenes which are no doubt being repeated across the country countless times.

Describing this dystopian vision to my wife later I said it was as if the country was at war. She said a war usually unites the country against a common enemy. This time the country is divided, the enemy within.

I am more convinced than ever that the regime is working to a plan. How else to explain the casual extension of local authority powers without any prior announcement, still less a debate in what passes for parliament these days?

We have a long road ahead of us, a very long road.

378482 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to charleyfarley, 12, #1202 of 1991 🔗

I delivered some leaflets today as well, had no encounters.
Also printed out a few leaflets about The great reopening and put around.

Found a £10 note, that was nice!

378635 ▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to Silke David, 2, #1203 of 1991 🔗

I lost £10 – it’s mine, Silke !

378633 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to charleyfarley, #1204 of 1991 🔗

Grocery shops can open, no ?

378381 Bruce Reynolds, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 34, #1205 of 1991 🔗

There have been many crimes against humanity over the decades, Jews in Nazi Germany,Pol Pot year zero,to name but just a few… The Great Reset and Lockdown is most certainly the modern day equivalent of those mentioned..
The human suffering and economic damage has been breathtaking..It may have been easy to implement this crime using the virus as the excuse but it’s going to be extremely difficult to keep the narrative alive, time is fast running out for this shower of shit the lies and corruption can’t go on indefinitely,ass holes are twitching as the inevitable reckoning gets closer and closer..

378396 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 22, #1206 of 1991 🔗

The death toll from the “response” to Covid will far exceed that inflicted by all 20th century dictatorships combined. In short, we are living through the greatest genocide in human history.

378414 ▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to Richard O, 9, #1207 of 1991 🔗

Yes – some people think that s an exaggeration because the they don’t ‘see’ the economic casualties, particulaly in poor countries.

378447 ▶▶▶ isobar, replying to Richard O, 6, #1208 of 1991 🔗

Got it in one, but how do we stop this?

378455 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Richard O, 4, #1209 of 1991 🔗

yes – this is exactly how I feel

378387 swedenborg, replying to swedenborg, 5, #1210 of 1991 🔗

This is a country with the world’s most efficient vaccination campaign. It seems the moment you roll out the vaccine you have to isolate forever considering 1 billion people have been infected, millions carrying the virus and mutating all the time with thousands of variants with potential vaccine resistant. The moment someone whispered mutant variant,the so called threat of C-19 was multiples 12000 times considering the variants.They have painted themselves in a corner.
 https://time.com/5933085/israel-covid-19-airport/ Israel to Close Airport to Curb COVID-19 Outbreak Throughout the pandemic, Israel has restricted entry at its main international airport. But it has made exceptions for certain categories of people, including religious students and Israelis returning from abroad, while allowing Israeli tourists to fly to a handful of “green countries.” This limited air travel appears to allowed highly contagious coronavirus variants from the U.K. and other places to enter the country.

378401 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to swedenborg, 9, #1211 of 1991 🔗

Are they going to stop importing products from abroad too? That Spanish lettuce might have coronavirus on it, or those tomatoes, or that orange. This is about controlling people – nothing to do with a virus.

378388 peterthepainter, replying to peterthepainter, 28, #1212 of 1991 🔗

Been lurking for quite a while but thought I would post for the first time as today I got the call.

” This is the Doctors surgery. We have a space for you to have the vaccine at XYZ as they have started doing the over 70s.”
“OK. Which one will it be?”
“We don’t know”
“We would only consider the Astra Zeneca one.” I knew my wife was reluctant to have any other.
“We are never told which one it will be.”
“We will wait a while then to see how things go and maybe we will contact you or you can ring again. Goodbye for now.”

Why do they think we should just turn up somewhere and let them shove whatever they have handy into our bodies? We are definitely not anti-vax and have, until now, had all vaccines we have been offered.

I did also mention to them that another fairly local vaccine centre have cancelled 2 sessions as they have not finished all the over 80s and those 2 sessions were currently filled with, apart from 3 people, all under 70s. Looks like they have been told to slow down. Maybe some over 80s are unwilling to be vaccinated at the moment.

Mother, 98 and in a care home, had the AZ one about 10 days ago and so far is fine. My sister, also over 70, had seemed reluctant to have a jab yet but as she is getting desperate to give Mum a hug has said she will take whatever is available. Ex-senior nurse and has been very outspoken about the way things are being handled but seems to be leaning the wrong way.

Unfortunately I have fallen into the naming of the jab as a “vaccine” trap. This is just another example of the way our minds are being programmed as with “social” distancing when what is meant is “physical” distancing.

378407 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to peterthepainter, 5, #1213 of 1991 🔗

Welcome, peter. 🙂

378410 ▶▶ Suey, replying to peterthepainter, 2, #1214 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps you might like to re-think your preference for the Astra-Zeneca jab? Read Dr Sebastian Rushworth here: https://sebastianrushworth.com/2021/01/10/are-the-covid-vaccines-safe-and-effective/

378415 ▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Suey, 4, #1215 of 1991 🔗

I wouldn’t. I like Sebastian R but I think he has sold out in this article – it is completely out of character for him to back an mRNA vaccine, from other stuff I have read and I would bet a lot of money that he wouldn’t have the Moderna vaccine, as he says he would. Honest.

378416 ▶▶▶ ituex, replying to Suey, 5, #1216 of 1991 🔗

I have read this too but my preference for AZ is based on the fact that I trained with Andrew Pollard (one of the lead clinicians and often in media) I would trust him with my life. I also understand better how this works as is variant on traditional vaccines. Got to pick one so that’s my reason.

378436 ▶▶▶▶ peterthepainter, replying to ituex, 4, #1217 of 1991 🔗

Being a more traditional “vaccine” is why we have preferred it.

378608 ▶▶▶▶▶ sophie123, replying to peterthepainter, 1, #1218 of 1991 🔗

But it’s not. It’s similar to the mRNA ones and only differs in that it uses a chimp adenovirus as the vector to get the RNA into the cell rather than a Manufactured nano-protein shell.

If I HAD to get a vaccine (I don’t believe I need one), I’d be opting for an mRNA one for the same reasons as Dr Rushworth. Better Designed and conducted studies, No transverse myelitis

378433 ▶▶▶ peterthepainter, replying to Suey, 1, #1219 of 1991 🔗

Will do.

378420 ▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to peterthepainter, 1, #1220 of 1991 🔗

Interesting to hear how they are going about this. Thanks and welcome.

378424 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to peterthepainter, 5, #1221 of 1991 🔗

They are doing more for the anti vaxx movement than anyone has done before.

378451 ▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to peterthepainter, 4, #1222 of 1991 🔗

Welcome to the sanest corner of the web. Well, usually.

378392 Charlie Blue, replying to Charlie Blue, 15, #1223 of 1991 🔗

HART have now published more information on their website https://www.hartgroup.org/

I think there are 30 members – many names that we recognise, such as Dr John Lee, David Paton and Joel Smalley. Hats off to them, but I was hoping for a much bigger group. Perhpas more people will come forward and join now that they have moved on from the slightly cloak and dagger stuff.

It’s still not clear to me how they are planning to influence anything but I’m certainly pleased to know there is a group of this nature out there in the UK.

378406 ▶▶ PW, replying to Charlie Blue, 8, #1224 of 1991 🔗

Good to see Dr Malcolm Kendrick on board….he has an excellent website….

378412 ▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to PW, 7, #1225 of 1991 🔗

Agreed! Both Malcolm Kendrick and John Lee are excellent.

378445 ▶▶▶▶ Nick Rose, replying to Ceriain, 2, #1226 of 1991 🔗

Remember Malc Kendrick speaking at the September protest in Edinburgh

378463 ▶▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Nick Rose, 3, #1227 of 1991 🔗

I like both because they don’t go in for any of this fake emotional crap like Johnson and Handjob; neither is there any exaggeration in the science they present, unlike ‘the science’ of Whitty and Vallance.

It’s just good old cold hard facts; remember them?

378518 ▶▶▶▶ Janette, replying to Ceriain, 2, #1228 of 1991 🔗

Yes they are

378440 ▶▶ SimonCook, replying to Charlie Blue, 2, #1229 of 1991 🔗

This is indeed most welcome news Charlie.

Do you know if they are linked to PCR Claims?

It feels as if these 2 plus UsForThem need to come together – strength in numbers like a Transformer!

378481 ▶▶ Ken Gardner, replying to Charlie Blue, 1, #1230 of 1991 🔗

“.. hoping for a much bigger group.”

Well, perhaps not all the big hitters, but I’ve just checked out the list of members. Quite an impressive list of professionals, I would have thought…

378393 Freddy Boy, 5, #1231 of 1991 🔗

Standby for the new pregnant women alert ! More susceptible than others , 69 suffering in uk ! So approx 1 per million , better double the lockdown !!

378397 Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 17, #1232 of 1991 🔗

Beeb live feed:

Dido Harding has been addressing a Confederation of British Industry webinar. Interestingly, the Beeb says:

The Baroness says another reason people do not isolate is mental health, with people “ really struggling with the consequences of having to stay at home “.

Didn’t the Government (Mad Nad Dorries) say there was no mental health crisis?

378422 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Ceriain, 7, #1233 of 1991 🔗

Who would have thought that isolation with no end in sight just might have an impact on the mental health of some people?

Today is day 314 of my voluntary self-isolation from a non-existent society, and I am very glad to have made this choice. I’ll do another 1,000 days if I have to. And another 1,000 after that.

378428 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to Ceriain, 8, #1234 of 1991 🔗

Dido – stupid and corrupt!

378480 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to TheClone, 5, #1235 of 1991 🔗

I wouldn’t trust her to tell me the time.

378400 Luckyharry69, replying to Luckyharry69, 15, #1236 of 1991 🔗

Does anybody think the BBC newsreaders and presenters all look a bit haggard and stressed at the moment?

I think things are turning……..

378405 ▶▶ Jonny S., replying to Luckyharry69, 22, #1237 of 1991 🔗

Just had a letter from Auntie Beeb saying that as I cancelled my licence having paid upfront I am now due a refund of £66.00. Think I’ll be making donations here and to UK Column news.

378435 ▶▶▶ DavidC, replying to Jonny S., 4, #1238 of 1991 🔗

UK Column is only £30 for an anuual subscription.


378474 ▶▶▶▶ Jonny S., replying to DavidC, 1, #1239 of 1991 🔗

Oooh. Thanks for the info.

378497 ▶▶▶▶ Bella Donna, replying to DavidC, 2, #1240 of 1991 🔗

And its worth it! I stopped subs to Telegraph and Spectator and decided to put the money to better used. I subscribe to Spiked and ConWoman too.

378448 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to Jonny S., 5, #1241 of 1991 🔗

Next, submit a GDPR DSAR request to TVL, and have them wipe ALL your personal data.

Otherwise, they’re half way to screwing you over.

Life is an awful lot easier when TVL have no record of any of the names of any of the people at your address.

378473 ▶▶▶▶ Jonny S., replying to AidanR, #1242 of 1991 🔗

Cheers for the heads up.

378602 ▶▶▶▶ JohnB, replying to AidanR, #1243 of 1991 🔗

Life is an awful lot easier when TVL have no record of any of the names of any of the people at your address.

Mind you, I’ve been getting ‘enforcement’ letters for over 10 years addressed to ‘The Occupier’.

378673 ▶▶▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to JohnB, 2, #1244 of 1991 🔗

They must think you’re Israeli

378437 ▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to Luckyharry69, 5, #1245 of 1991 🔗

I caught the last ten minutes of Channel 4’s Countdown today, currently being presented (socially distanced of course) by (usually) sports presenter Colin Murray. He was wearing a plain navy blue jumper bearing a prominent smiley face emoji. I didn’t see if he commented on it at the beginning of the programme but I wonder…?

378495 ▶▶▶ Dave Angel Eco Warrier, replying to Dodderydude, 2, #1246 of 1991 🔗

That crossed my mind as well. I suspect it is just coincidental, though.

378450 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Luckyharry69, 7, #1247 of 1991 🔗

As Chomsky discovered when he spent time trying to understand the media, many journos are staunch believers in the establishment narrative because that often represents what is acceptable to be printed or published as news, so they believe because they are paid to.

Journos themselves don’t question what they churn out, nor have a great sense of creating propaganda, but rather are quite saturated by mainstream narrative, and feel they are doing a good job in getting this information out to the public. Their idea of solid journalism is defending the pre-supposed truth and attacking those that diverge from it, rather than old-school journalism that often did the exact opposite. Opinion is driven by those who decide what is and is not acceptable as news further up the ladder, not the flying monkeys.

This being the case, they are probably as scared as any ‘informed’ compulsive consumer of MSM nonsense, so I’m not all that surprised by their somewhat burned out appearance. They are a good yardstick for how the rest of the true believers are coping. Unfortunately, large numbers of mentally unbalanced citizens do not make for a stable society. Things are about to get very interesting.

378477 ▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to GrannySlayer, 6, #1248 of 1991 🔗

As he said to Andrew Marr, in a piece of intellectual evisceration which I’m sure you’ve seen and enjoyed as much as I did: “If you didn’t think the way you did, you wouldn’t be sitting in that chair.”

378517 ▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to Dermot McClatchey, 5, #1249 of 1991 🔗

Yeah, that was the one about propaganda wasn’t it? About the time Manufacturing Consent came out. Marr is truly the midwit’s midwit.

378777 ▶▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to GrannySlayer, #1250 of 1991 🔗


378612 ▶▶▶ RickH, replying to GrannySlayer, 3, #1251 of 1991 🔗

The problem with journalism has been developing for years. Nick Davies in Flat Earth News (which I wholeheartedly recommend) calls the transmutation ‘churnalism’.

The underpinnings are many – from narrowing control of the media to the deadly narrowing of the networked pool from which journalists are recruited – with a massive bias towards Oxbridge graduates. The result is an incestuous, self-reinforcing network that narrows perception and narrative.

The old apprenticeship routes to journalism that produced the good ones are now dead, and proper investigative journalism is a rare art. It parallels the connected decline in political talent.

378701 ▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to RickH, 2, #1252 of 1991 🔗

Interesting, I haven’t heard of that one, but it sounds pretty good. I used to know a couple of journos and they certainly described a fairly tight network. Real journalism is currently languishing in Belmarsh.

Of course, this sort of thing is also a problem:
comment image

378483 ▶▶ Janette, replying to Luckyharry69, 1, #1253 of 1991 🔗

God let’s hope so

378556 ▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to Luckyharry69, #1254 of 1991 🔗

As with all lies, they started out with little lies, but as soon as they became compromised, they couldn’t say no as the lies lies got bigger and more evil. They probably realise now that they may as well be working for Goebbels, but there is nothing they can do about it. It’s a choice of make the lies work or facing punishment from the state or justice after the revolution. Waiting for the first big news personality suicide – will probably go down as a covid death.

378419 rodmclaughlin, #1255 of 1991 🔗

When is Quillette going to publish the response to https://quillette.com/2021/01/16/rise-of-the-coronavirus-cranks/ ?

378430 DavidC, replying to DavidC, 21, #1256 of 1991 🔗

I’ve been wondering about what the government has been doing with the continual ‘It’s only for this long’, ‘No, it’s not’, ‘Yes it is’, We can have Chhristmas’, ‘No, we can’t’, ‘It’s only until the schools go back, ‘No, it’s not’ etc etc etc.

Does this not constitute mental torture or mental abuse? Would there be any legal case to be brought against Johnson or Hancock (individuals rather than the faceless government)?


378443 ▶▶ isobar, replying to DavidC, 10, #1257 of 1991 🔗

I think that it surely does; see my earlier post about the British Public being treated less well than prisoners of war.

378449 ▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to DavidC, 13, #1258 of 1991 🔗

If anyone still has any faith or trust in government left, they need to be sectioned. I hear its even easier now under corona act.

378452 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to DavidC, 6, #1259 of 1991 🔗

Ever watched a cat torture a mouse to death?

378485 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to DavidC, 4, #1260 of 1991 🔗

Oh yes, the lawyers are going to rip them a new one

378509 ▶▶▶ thinkaboutit, replying to Cecil B, 7, #1261 of 1991 🔗

Well I wish they’d get on with it.

378546 ▶▶ RickH, replying to DavidC, 1, #1262 of 1991 🔗

I think the German and Potuguese court judgments provide a better general rationale for legal action, although I fear that civil protection of fundamental rights in the UK are weaker, despite all the historical guff.

You can see now why the Tories have been keen to undermine Human Rights legislation.

378444 JaneHarry, replying to JaneHarry, 16, #1263 of 1991 🔗

a contributor on here the other day posted that in spite of knowing nobody yet who had died of covid, they had begun to hear of people within their social network who had died shortly after being vaccinated. well, today I heard of my first one, too – and still- after 10 months- no covid deaths! [although plenty of colds and flu’s ascribed to this ‘covid’]

378528 ▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to JaneHarry, 5, #1264 of 1991 🔗

As Bella Donna just posted:


Combine that with the deaths in other countries and the dots are beginning to join up. I know of one person who had a “mini-stroke” within a day of being jabbed. I know of no-one that has had a life-altering impact from Covid itself (or things re-badged as Covid), other than from known hypochondriacs claiming long-covid. That’s what you get when you release a vaccine that was not tested at all on the elderly target demographic.

378469 Nobody2021, 4, #1265 of 1991 🔗

This linked study is dated April 2020 but looks into how case definitions affect the epidemic curve which in turn determine the urgency and level of action required.


Robin Monotti

How the statistical hoax began: when WHO said that in China only a PCR test on asymptomatics is required for a case. Note the date. Later China wisely stopped listening to the WHO.

Effect of changing case definitions for COVID-19 on the epidemic curve and transmission parameters in mainland China: a modelling study


378475 ekd, replying to ekd, 4, #1266 of 1991 🔗

I just checked the Deaths Registered (deaths per 1000 population) statistics from Ireland’s Central Statistics Office.

So far they have stats up to Q2, 2020. I looked back to Q1, 2014.

I don’t think I need to comment.

378536 ▶▶ ituex, replying to ekd, 3, #1267 of 1991 🔗

I know, for the life of me I can’t think why they’re making such a big deal of this. 5km, road blocks etc etc it’s unhinged. The government could be boasting about how well they’ve done and reopening everything.

378478 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 19, #1268 of 1991 🔗

To misquote the late great Brian Clough

I don’t know if the Covidians are the thickest group of people on this earth but they are definatly in the top one

378492 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1269 of 1991 🔗

As you’ve mentioned BC, thought I would recommend I Believe in Miracles. One of the most enjoyable films about him – and I hate football. It’s an absolute hoot and with a great soundtrack to boot (forgive pun!).

378648 ▶▶ penelope pitstop, replying to Bella Donna, 4, #1271 of 1991 🔗

well spotted – that is shocking. Why are people not asking questions about the number of deaths emerging shortly after the vaccines – truly frightening!

378489 Basics, replying to Basics, 6, #1272 of 1991 🔗

When in Edinburgh 6 months ago Delores Cahill made a speech in which she offered to act as expert witness for covid19 medical interventions.

Here is a recent interview where Delores talks about civil legal actions she is now involved with and how others may seek similar action.

Prof Dolores Cahill Informed consent PCR tests and legal action

378523 ▶▶ vargas99, replying to Basics, 4, #1273 of 1991 🔗

I wish her well in this. If it gets traction then it could be the undoing of so many.

378490 godowneasy, replying to godowneasy, 23, #1274 of 1991 🔗

Saw this boiling frogs t-shirt on twitter – no idea where you get one though.

378501 ▶▶ Banjones, replying to godowneasy, 6, #1275 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps someone had it printed privately. If there’s no copyright, perhaps it’d be worth copying. And if there is a copyright, they deserve all the profit they can get!

378508 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to godowneasy, 3, #1276 of 1991 🔗

Ooooh I want one several of those…

378514 ▶▶ this is my username, replying to godowneasy, 5, #1277 of 1991 🔗

That is brilliant.

378493 Lisa (formerly) from Toronto, replying to Lisa (formerly) from Toronto, 11, #1278 of 1991 🔗

Moderna is working on a vaccine booster for a new variant (the South African one), per the New York Times. But what about the killer UK variant??? The “cure” will definitely be worse than the disease. I’m not sure why anyone, at this point, could still be of the belief that the magic “vaccine” is our route back to normal.

378511 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Lisa (formerly) from Toronto, 7, #1279 of 1991 🔗

The vaccine* is the cure….until the next one, and the one after that, and the one after that.

* does not prevent infection or transmission and potentially reduces symptoms for some strains only with completely unknown short, medium and long term side effects

378544 ▶▶ awildgoose, replying to Lisa (formerly) from Toronto, 5, #1280 of 1991 🔗

It should be clear that we livestock are in for an endless cycle of mutant strains and updated jabs.

Our future as two-legged pincushions is so bright we must wear shades!

378731 ▶▶ leggy, replying to Lisa (formerly) from Toronto, 1, #1281 of 1991 🔗

This was in the Spectator today:

Moderna says its vaccine ‘retains neutralising activity’ against Covid-19 strains identified in the UK and South Africa – but there is a ‘sixfold reduction’ in neutralising activity against the latter. The company is also developing a booster shot against that strain.

378498 Bruce Reynolds, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 48, #1282 of 1991 🔗

All this Fucking garbage about “Look into their eyes My eyes or whatever Fucking crap it is.. What these fuckers need to do is look into a woman’s eyes because her husband / son has committed suicide, the poor sod who has lost his home and business,and the poor fuck who is dying of cancer..look into there eyes fucking hypocrisy of it all..

378500 ▶▶ Cecil B, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 18, #1283 of 1991 🔗

Look into their eyes and tell them the fat fuck is still in charge

378533 ▶▶ Richard O, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 8, #1284 of 1991 🔗

I wonder if the BBC will roll out Matt Lucas to resurrect his Kenny Craig stage hypnotist character in support of the fear messaging?

Look into my eyes, look into my eyes, don’t look around the eyes, look into my eyes….if you leave your house you are killing people….3-2-1, you’re back in the room.

378549 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 44, #1285 of 1991 🔗

You know whose eye’s I’m happy to look into?

The eyes of the tosser who has spent his life smoking and is now asking children to stay at home to reduce his risk of death.

The eyes of people who have spent their lives over-eating and are now demanding that businesses close because they don’t want to be put at risk, and you know, we all have to do our part.

In fact, I’m more than happy to looking into anyones eyes. Because there isn’t a single person in Britain who hasn’t at some point decided to take on some additional level of risk in their lives for some pay off in the moment.

Drive over the speed limit? Cycle on the road? Have a night of binge drinking? Take a peak at the phone while driving?

We’ve all accepted risk for benefit. Anyone who now asks me to reduce my life to reduce their risk can go and fuck right off.

And that includes nurses and doctors. Never took any drugs? Never had any crazy nights out when at college? Screw the lot of them.

378568 ▶▶▶ Bruce Reynolds, replying to stewart, 6, #1286 of 1991 🔗

Stewart bang on the nail with that comment if I could double up vote it I would..

378768 ▶▶▶ ElizaP, replying to stewart, 4, #1287 of 1991 🔗

Very true and it’s just struck me again that I’m usually the only one I see at the supermarket checkout with loads of fresh fruit/veg there that I’ve just bought – and that’s for me as a single person. Very few other people have anything like as much fruit/veg and I bet they are shopping for a couple or family. So explain to me just why my life is supposed to be put on hold – so they can go on neglecting their health like that. Explain to me why I get out and walk for short walking distances – whereas many of them just leap in a car – and so the list goes on.

379186 ▶▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to stewart, #1288 of 1991 🔗

Cycling is less risky than not cycling.

378598 ▶▶ Tiberius, replying to Bruce Reynolds, 3, #1289 of 1991 🔗

They’ve nicked that strapline from the 1990’s Wonderbra advert.

No surprise as their whole response to covid has gone tits up.

378502 arfurmo, replying to arfurmo, 3, #1290 of 1991 🔗

Today’s scores 22195/592 “but it’s a Monday”. In the words of John Bercow UNLOCK

378524 ▶▶ Jonny S., replying to arfurmo, 1, #1291 of 1991 🔗

That looks like four curves flattened off. Roll on back to normal.
Oh hold on!

378516 HelzBelz, 10, #1292 of 1991 🔗

This video was put together in October, but it’s very frightening to see what has come true so far: https://www.facebook.com/ILMyLifeOfficial/videos/798809217377148

I watched the American Frontline Doctors video last night – everything that Dr Gold says resonates with me and I know it instinctively to be the truth. And then I look them up on Google – everywhere they are being slated as disseminators of lies and disinformation. It is truly shocking.

It is so clear to me that those on the other side have no argument against the truth which is why their only course of action is to suppress it and write us all off as dangerous cranks.

Here is another doctor’s view on vaccines – again it rings of nothing but the bona fide truth to me: https://www.bitchute.com/video/35w2LEpW6H6x/

378519 stewart, replying to stewart, 52, #1293 of 1991 🔗

What kind of banana republic has Britain become that the decision to force us into 14 day isolation in a designated facility when returning to our country can be taken by a bunch of guys sitting around a table, without any parliamentary debate or scrutiny of any kind.

And the stupid mob cheering it on. And anyone who protests is shouted down, accused of wanting people to die.

This is a full on dystopian nightmare.

378531 ▶▶ TheClone, replying to stewart, 12, #1294 of 1991 🔗

Expect more, this is just the beginning!

378779 ▶▶ leggy, replying to stewart, 1, #1295 of 1991 🔗

No doubt at some stage a vaccine passport will exempt people from the requirement of short term, self funded imprisonment. They’re so transparent.

378529 Lucan Grey, replying to Lucan Grey, -3, #1296 of 1991 🔗

“Noticeably absent from the line-up of people apparently seriously suggesting that a seasonal respiratory virus which is now endemic can be completely eradicated was anyone who did not have a safe public sector job.”

Everybody can have a safe public sector job for the duration of the pandemic – in the sense of receiving a wage that will keep us fed and watered. We can lock down hard and we can go full Victoria. And that would be one way out of this mess – along with complete lockdown of the borders like Australia.

The alternative is to take it on the chin and operate like Sweden.

It’s this half-baked compromise that is the problem. It doesn’t and can’t work.

Either do it, or don’t do it.

378539 ▶▶ stewart, replying to Lucan Grey, 17, #1297 of 1991 🔗


Australia still locking down occasionally. China locking down in places. Malaysia locked down.

Zero covid is just the latest mutation of the corona madness that has infected the world.

378545 ▶▶ rockoman, replying to Lucan Grey, 16, #1298 of 1991 🔗

Lockdowns are completely irrelevant to the spread of respiratory viruses.

These are a mid-latitude phenomenon n conditions of low humidity, which allow aerosols to remain stable in the air, particularly in built-in, indoors locations.

All you need to to realize this is to look at the situation in hospitals ad care homes in the affected countries, whee regardless of isolation, the wearing of PPE and similat measures, the residents continue to die of respiratory ailments.

There is now considerable evidence also that virus particles can also spread on air currents over long distances.

378580 ▶▶ Will, replying to Lucan Grey, 7, #1299 of 1991 🔗

I agree but how a country that needs 10000 lorries a day to sustain itself can achieve zero covid, and how long it would take, given the level of infection and population density, doesn’t even are thinking about especially as I only have to look out of my window to see how lockdown is being completely ignored.

378585 ▶▶ BeBopRockSteady, replying to Lucan Grey, 8, #1300 of 1991 🔗

False dichotomy and if you take either of those positions there are a number of outliers now which can be shown empirically to invalidate it. For every Australia, you have to explain a Peru or Argentina. For every North Dakota, there is a South Dakota. For every UK there is a Sweden. There are no easy answers here. It’s complex and challenges fundamental concepts of virology and public health.

378587 ▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Lucan Grey, 14, #1301 of 1991 🔗

Australia and NZ will undoubtedly start to see Covid cases / deaths as soon as they open their borders. Alternatively they can just remain closed to the rest of the world for ever!

378597 ▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to HelzBelz, #1302 of 1991 🔗

Well, ‘cases’ haven’t quite disappeared. Wait for lower humidity in the Southern Hemisphere winter and we will see them locking down again.

Contact with others is not necessary.

378632 ▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to HelzBelz, #1303 of 1991 🔗

They are also just entering their 2nd winter waves…

378532 nickbowes, replying to nickbowes, 21, #1304 of 1991 🔗

Well,on a positive note least the evenings are getting lighter !

378548 ▶▶ Jonny S., replying to nickbowes, 16, #1305 of 1991 🔗

Along with the lighter evenings, Cases in England appear to have peaked on 1st Jan. with hospitalisations on the 12th Jan and deaths looking to have peaked on 20th Jan. Lets hope so.

Will be a bit of a bumpy ride for the next few weeks but just shows that Boris’s full lockdown on the 4th was once again too late to make a difference.

378550 ▶▶▶ arfurmo, replying to Jonny S., 8, #1306 of 1991 🔗

I’m pretty sure that was what Steve_w predicted. If he’s around and I’m correct, take a bow sir.

378553 ▶▶▶▶ Jonny S., replying to arfurmo, 4, #1307 of 1991 🔗

Yes, I will second that.

378569 ▶▶▶ Will, replying to Jonny S., 3, #1308 of 1991 🔗

If the deaths peaked on the 20th then the infection peak could well have been on Christmas Day.

378645 ▶▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to Jonny S., 1, #1309 of 1991 🔗

I keep a note of English hospital deaths labelled as ‘covid’ by date of death (with an allowance added in for deaths that have occurred but not been reported).

The 7 day running total of these deaths does appear to have peaked for the 7 day period centred on about 19th January. Might just need a few more days to confirm that.

From the zoe data I was expecting the peak to have been around 1st February but it seems to be happening sooner than I thought.

378535 stewart, replying to stewart, 27, #1310 of 1991 🔗

Opinion polls are a pointless bad joke.

62% of the people believe lockdowns are doing more good than harm.

Well, what information have they been given?

Let’s see, on the one hand 24/7 death porn and state propaganda that if you leave your house you’re a murderer. Ok…

On the other side of the balance… fuck all. No impact assessment. Devastated business owners quietly brushed aside. A few lone voices here and there standing up for kids education, but pretty much anyone who raises their voice against lockdowns is called a murderer.

So.. let’s see what the British public think…

Mad, mad, mad.

378586 ▶▶ Victoria, replying to stewart, 2, #1311 of 1991 🔗

or asked questions with two sides neither of which you agree with

378629 ▶▶ Derek Toyne, replying to stewart, 3, #1312 of 1991 🔗

When will people see that lockdown isn’t working we are near 100,00 deaths and somehow that’s not enough for lockdown supporters. Perhaps when we reach a million deaths someone will have the balls to say lockdown doesn’t work. Mind you people think it’s alright to lockdown 100% of the population when only 20% are severely affected. My wife was recently struck down by covid and she says it was like a bad flu, so it’s not a killer flu. I didn’t like having to self isolate as I believe only infected people should be put into quarantine. This is what we humans have done with contagious diseases for hundreds of years so what as changed. In York where I live less than a thousand people are infected so we could easily put them in the empty hotels we have here. I’ve been reading factfullness by Hans Rosling who tells us about how he dealt with an outbreak of Ebola. Not roadblocks (lockdown) but by meticulously tracing people who had been in contact with infected people. I would recommend everyone read this book as it tells you the ten thinking mistakes we all make about the world.

378664 ▶▶ RickH, replying to stewart, #1313 of 1991 🔗

Opinion polls are a pointless bad joke.”

No. They indicate the size of the problem.

378703 ▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to RickH, #1314 of 1991 🔗

No they serve government policy, they’e just propaganda, telling you what they want you to think. Questions carefully crafted to give the answer they want.

378551 AN other lockdown sceptic, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 38, #1315 of 1991 🔗

Just had a walk out in the countryside with the dogs and something happened that hasn’t done so before.

On three separate occasions, individuals passing me from the opposite direction pulled on face masks before the passed me.

This is in the middle of the English countryside on a crisp sunny snowy day with hardly a breathe of wind.

This is the first time that this has happened since this all started. I suspect that things may get a lot worse before they get better if my experience today is anything to go by.

378560 ▶▶ C S, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 22, #1316 of 1991 🔗

bunch of idiots we are living with

378578 ▶▶ JohnB, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 7, #1317 of 1991 🔗

I suspect that things may get a lot worse before they get better if my experience today is anything to go by.

If by ‘a lot worse’, you mean three benighted sconeheads locking themselves in cupboards and swallowing the keys, you may well be right. 🙂

378653 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 2, #1318 of 1991 🔗

Don’t worry – fuck ’em.

378658 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, 4, #1319 of 1991 🔗

A a bloke coming towards me today, one could NOT see his face.
Large black mnc, glasses, hat, hood.
He is one of those who will wear that for the rest of his life, probably.

379270 ▶▶ DomW, replying to AN other lockdown sceptic, #1320 of 1991 🔗

You could do what I did today when a jogger did just that – turn back and shout “you should keep that on – I’ve been breathing out all the way along the path”

It’s just a pity she was wearing headphones….

378557 peyrole, replying to peyrole, 34, #1321 of 1991 🔗

An Honest Pharma Company!
Merck, based in New Jersey have pulled their covid vaccine, which they developed the conventional way, after they found that it provided less immunity than was the case of natural immunity of people recovered from the disease. They are now concentrating on producing medicines that will provide treatments for sufferers.

378623 ▶▶ JayBee, replying to peyrole, 1, #1322 of 1991 🔗

Conventional vaccines failing is no good, as they are much safer than the current experimental gene therapies, especially so if discrimination against the refusers is practised.
They would have provided an acceptable way out.
And the recombinant traditional ones should also work best and better against any mutations.
Fortunately, a few others of those are still in the pipeline.

378558 JamesM, replying to JamesM, 26, #1323 of 1991 🔗

The latest statistics compiled by the University of Oxford Research Platform show that the UK has the second worst Covid-19 death rate per capita, while Sweden doesn’t even make it into the top 10. That’s one on the eye for Neil O’Brien.

378566 ▶▶ Will, replying to JamesM, 10, #1324 of 1991 🔗

And Sweden is going to fall further and further down the list. I predict Holland will end up with a higher death rate than Sweden, possibly Germany as well.

378572 ▶▶▶ steve_w, replying to Will, 7, #1325 of 1991 🔗

lockdown kills!

378579 ▶▶▶ jrsm, replying to Will, 8, #1326 of 1991 🔗

Portugal is also about to overtake Sweden on “COVID-19” death count, after a year with moderate-to-extreme lockdowns and universal muzzling.

378613 ▶▶▶ JayBee, replying to Will, 1, #1327 of 1991 🔗

Germany has ways to go to catch up Sweden in total numbers, but the second waves, or Covid deaths/pMInhabitants from 1.7.
20 are pretty much identical as per their total in those 2 countries, with Sweden improving and Germany worsening indeed.

378600 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to JamesM, 7, #1328 of 1991 🔗

The latest statistics compiled by the University of Oxford Research Platform show that the UK has the second worst Covid-19 death rate per capita…

How is that possible when ‘our NHS is the best in the world’? /s

378628 ▶▶▶ houdini, replying to Ceriain, 1, #1329 of 1991 🔗

The envy of world but don’t worry it’s not for sale.

378677 ▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to houdini, #1330 of 1991 🔗

don’t worry it’s not for sale

Thanks, H; you’ve really put my mind at rest. 😉

378832 ▶▶▶▶ Mark, replying to houdini, 3, #1331 of 1991 🔗

Wish it was. Then we could stop twisting our entire society into knots to “save it”.

Same with the BBC. Sell it and stop pretending it’s somehow more honest than the other big corps because it’s the “national broadcaster”.

378704 ▶▶▶ JamesM, replying to Ceriain, 4, #1332 of 1991 🔗

That’s a very good point. It would be interesting to know how the death rate in NHS hospitals compares with death rates in hospitals abroad. I expect the mainstream media will suppress the statistics if they are not favourable to the NHS.

378562 p02099003, replying to p02099003, 3, #1333 of 1991 🔗

Matt Hancock leading the press conference this evening.

378567 ▶▶ Major Panic, replying to p02099003, 18, #1334 of 1991 🔗

I am no physiatrist but as a lay person, do your mental health a favour – don’t watch it – if there is a conspiracy going on then that fraudster is up to his eye balls

378570 ▶▶▶ p02099003, replying to Major Panic, 16, #1335 of 1991 🔗

I don’t watch them for my own sanity.

378604 ▶▶▶▶ penelope pitstop, replying to p02099003, 4, #1336 of 1991 🔗

nor me – i just cannot listen to any media any more as it’s like a broken record about covid. Nice to listen to my old cds though!

378708 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Major Panic, 4, #1337 of 1991 🔗

Agreed. I’m conspiracy-agnostic but one thing I’m confident about is that *if* any of our politicians are corrupt, he is.

378574 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to p02099003, #1338 of 1991 🔗

378601 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to GrannySlayer, 3, #1339 of 1991 🔗

Is that for cleaning my robot companion?

378611 ▶▶▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to AidanR, #1340 of 1991 🔗

Yes. Especially if the Health Secretary cries on it.

378582 ▶▶ kh1485, replying to p02099003, 1, #1341 of 1991 🔗

Radio on mute then.

378596 ▶▶ Freddy Boy, replying to p02099003, 1, #1342 of 1991 🔗

“Long, long, long” he said just in case we thought the lockdowns would finish soon ! Chunt !!

378661 ▶▶ RickH, replying to p02099003, #1343 of 1991 🔗

You mean ‘the propaganda event’ ?

378565 Cecil B, replying to Cecil B, 19, #1344 of 1991 🔗

The pig dictator and child abuser his doing his “I’m sorry I beat you up” charm offensive today

As soon as he can he will be getting the children back to school, the obvious implication being that if you were just a bit more compliant then the children would not have to suffer

He will be back to his old tricks in a few days time

An abuser from central casting

378715 ▶▶ alw, replying to Cecil B, 1, #1345 of 1991 🔗

Munchausens by Proxy is the illness

378571 NorthumbrianNomad, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 77, #1346 of 1991 🔗

I’d like to say this, last thought for the day. To government ministers and the geniuses behind the scare campaigns.

You’ve lost me. You’ve radicalised me (one of your favourite words). Forever. And I am a boringly middle of the road person. You think you’ve been so clever with your behavioural analysis and your nudge nudge manipulations. You haven’t. You’ve failed by your own lunatic yardstick. You’ve failed by any measure. To call your pathetic would insult pathos. You’re worthless and contemptible and you deserve retribution for what you’ve done. Whatever I – a former Tory voter – can do to ensure you get it, I will do.

Good job, scum.

378576 ▶▶ isobar, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 7, #1347 of 1991 🔗

I agree, but think that you are demeaning scum, they are worse than that!

378706 ▶▶ mattghg, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 15, #1348 of 1991 🔗

Same here. I used to be so conservative, and in the space of less than a year I’ve turned irrevocably against parliament, police, the courts, the security services and basically anything to do with state institutions.

378760 ▶▶▶ Bugle, replying to mattghg, 3, #1349 of 1991 🔗

Every institution has failed us, and, worst of all, Parliament.

378774 ▶▶▶ Nymeria, replying to mattghg, 1, #1350 of 1991 🔗


378734 ▶▶ iansn, replying to NorthumbrianNomad, 8, #1351 of 1991 🔗

I wrote directly to Shitty, JVT and Vaccine yesterday about their disgusting and insulting adverts look into my eyes. with the look into my eyes father suicide ad as a counterfoil. Ill leave the contents private for now and see what response I get back. I dont expect they will be in a hurry. Despicable fucking bastards.

378575 BeBopRockSteady, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 11, #1352 of 1991 🔗
378581 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 10, #1353 of 1991 🔗

“I’ve really picked up the sense among the extreme sceptics that they feel the walls are closing in,” said Bowman. “And I think they’re right.”


378599 ▶▶ JayBee, replying to BeBopRockSteady, 7, #1354 of 1991 🔗

Jordan Peterson: the woke and Left think that you no longer have a right to be regarded as an individual. Everyone just belongs to a group, and the groups obviously totally oppose another.

378627 ▶▶▶ AidanR, replying to JayBee, 3, #1355 of 1991 🔗

Indeed but – oh my – don’t they get bent out of shape when any of the groups I happen to belong to starts to organise and represent itself.

378577 this is my username, replying to this is my username, 2, #1356 of 1991 🔗

From the UK Column:

Comment from Mike that this might be related to lockdown and distance from home.


378584 ▶▶ ituex, replying to this is my username, 4, #1357 of 1991 🔗

Never ever answer anything as sinister as this. Yes of course it’s for checking up where you are.

378588 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to this is my username, 3, #1358 of 1991 🔗


378595 ▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to this is my username, #1359 of 1991 🔗

I find it unbelievable people give government depts their mobile number!

Frankly this seems nothing to worry about, government surveillance agencies already place face to number plate LOL.

378610 ▶▶ Two-Six, replying to this is my username, 3, #1360 of 1991 🔗

I thought this was about fuel rationing

378649 ▶▶ ituex, replying to this is my username, 2, #1361 of 1991 🔗

My reply to this has been removed. I think it’s either deeply sinister and related, as you say to checking your whereabouts or it’s a scam. Either way don’t answer it.

378696 ▶▶▶ Anti_socialist, replying to ituex, #1362 of 1991 🔗

You are of course right, be suspicious of phishing scams if someone emails or texts asking for personal data.

I would never reply but you can sometimes gauge authenticity by looking at email address of sender, do a whois check.

378947 ▶▶ Suey, replying to this is my username, #1363 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps they want to make sure that Gov employees aren’t letting hard up friends and rellies use their petrol cards?

378583 Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 9, #1364 of 1991 🔗

More propaganda from the Beeb:

Between 19 January and 25 January, there were 8,671 deaths within 28 days of a positive coronavirus test – an increase of 9.8% compared to the previous seven days.

That’s deaths reported; the actual number of people who died ‘by date of death’ is 3000 less than that.

378591 ▶▶ PeeDubbya, replying to Ceriain, 6, #1365 of 1991 🔗

That ‘died within 28 days’ stat that they roll out really gets on my fucking tits! It’s meaningless

378590 Basileus, 5, #1366 of 1991 🔗
378592 rockoman, 4, #1367 of 1991 🔗

Social isolation:

“Conclusions . —More diverse social networks were associated with greater resistance to upper respiratory illness.”


Psychological Stress:

“Conclusions.Psychological stress was associated in a dose-response manner with an increased risk of acute infectious respiratory illness,”


378594 Major Panic, replying to Major Panic, 21, #1368 of 1991 🔗

I’ve just watched the interview of Prof Dolores Cahill by Dr Fuellmich. I watched an interview of the Prof with an Irish interviewer the other day when the sequencing of 1500 positive PCR tests in October showed they were all Influenza. (why was this not screamed from the roof tops?)

Prof Cahill is an extremely educated and accomplished scientist and I have been using her interviews in a hope to dissuade close family members not to take the vaccine.

From what the Prof is saying, the vaccine distributors are committing mass murder, if not now then in a few months/years by the harm done to the victims immune systems.

This is a massive thing to assert – I feel she needs much more scientific support and evidence to confirm her understanding of the dangers of these new vaccines.

My fear is that, without other experts stepping up or credible evidence, she may be discounted as a fantasist.

378659 ▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to Major Panic, 7, #1369 of 1991 🔗

Perhaps this is why they seemingly didn’t start rolling out flu vaccines until January this year. They knew they needed the flu victim numbers to be high. I still haven’t had a letter for my flu jab – which I have decided never to have again.

378756 ▶▶▶ Nymeria, replying to TheBluePill, 4, #1370 of 1991 🔗

I had a letter (first one ever inviting me for a flu jab). It went in the bin.

378805 ▶▶▶▶ Jo, replying to Nymeria, #1371 of 1991 🔗

Me too.

378741 ▶▶ ElizaP, replying to Major Panic, 5, #1372 of 1991 🔗

By now I’m so fed-up with the Covidians and the way they are ruining things for the rest of us – that I hope they do all get the vax quickly, followed by getting ill or dying from it quickly. Then surely the evidence about this will be so clear that the vaccinations stop and no-one has any excuse to keep the rest of us in Lockdown any longer surely? Then those of us left (ie the ones sensible enough to not have the vax) can get back to normal and that’s that.

378863 ▶▶▶ Major Panic, replying to ElizaP, 1, #1373 of 1991 🔗

I’m comfortable with that, but some of the brainwashed covidians are quite close to me….

Giving up on them is not the answer

378605 p02099003, replying to p02099003, 29, #1374 of 1991 🔗

“The health secretary says people must maintain social distancing, even if they’ve had a jab. The body takes around three weeks to get to maximum protection levels and it’s not known if those who are vaccinated spread the virus, he adds.
On new variants, Matt Hancock says scientists are “learning more all the time”. The variant first found in Kent is spreading 30% to 70% faster than the original and “may” have a higher mortality rate, he tells the public.
The public’s response must remain “extra careful”, and the “end is in sight”.”
The end of what? Civilisation? The U.K.? England?

378634 ▶▶ RickH, replying to p02099003, 22, #1375 of 1991 🔗

Anyone taking notice of Handcock needs their bumps felt.

We’ve just been mixing with our neighbours – as normal. They’ve just left.

Anyone who doesn’t want to can stay away – that’s their right – but government diktats can f. right off. The twat brigade has done enough damage.

378663 ▶▶ Julian, replying to p02099003, 14, #1376 of 1991 🔗

scientists are “learning more all the time”

Lol. Yeah, they’ve done a great job. Top notch. Haven’t heard anyone from SAGE say anything remotely definitive, other than we definitely need to lock down, forever.

378674 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to p02099003, 6, #1377 of 1991 🔗

I find 30% to 70% is too wide a gap to mean anything.

378691 ▶▶ Freecumbria, replying to p02099003, 1, #1378 of 1991 🔗

The ONS Infection Survey for the week ending 16th January didn’t seem to be say anything about 30 to 70% faster


The percentage of people with new variant compatible positives has decreased in London, the South East and the East of England in the week ending 16 January 2021; in other regions, increases in new variant compatible positives have generally levelled off

378606 Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 21, #1379 of 1991 🔗

For the 10th month in a row Handjob says:

the “end is in sight”

FFS! Couldn’t make this shit up!

378616 ▶▶ Andrea Salford, replying to Ceriain, 8, #1380 of 1991 🔗

He is the (bell)end in sight.

378657 ▶▶ Jane G, replying to Ceriain, 12, #1381 of 1991 🔗

Is it possible to loathe anyone more?

378669 ▶▶ Silke David, replying to Ceriain, 8, #1382 of 1991 🔗

You know when you look across the sea and see a tiny point. But it does not come closer no matter how many hours you’ve been rowing.

378811 ▶▶ Bugle, replying to Ceriain, 4, #1383 of 1991 🔗

The restrictions are there to secure our complete compliance, and if they are ever lifted and freedoms restored, they will be in the government’s gift on condition of obedience. Cancelling Christmas was the psychological crossing of the Rubicon; holidays abroad will follow and possibly holidays in Britain too.

They don’t want you to have a family life; they don’t want you to travel; they don’t want you to own a car; they don’t want you to go out for a coffee or a beer. Many things we took for granted are never coming back. They offer a glimmer of hope, and we move towards it in the hope that that way freedom lies, but our compliance only invites more sacrifices.

It is human nature to seek stability, and as we are pushed backwards into narrower restrictions, we assure ourselves that this will be enough – they will leave us alone now. But we won’t be left alone: new demands will be made and the only way to avoid them will resistance and non-compliance.

378886 ▶▶ A. Contrarian, replying to Ceriain, 1, #1384 of 1991 🔗

Only yesterday wasn’t he saying that we’d be locked down for a long, long, long time yet?

378903 ▶▶ Prof Feargoeson, replying to Ceriain, 1, #1385 of 1991 🔗

If you have tunnel vision all you can see is the end, glimmering faintly a long way away. I think for him though to travel hopelessly is better than to arrive.

378607 Andrea Salford, replying to Andrea Salford, 9, #1386 of 1991 🔗

A rather promising article today from AIER re US States opening up (totally coincidental to the timing of Biden etc).


Lifted my spirits – what happens in USA we’re usually not far behind (here’s hoping).

378618 ▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Andrea Salford, 9, #1387 of 1991 🔗

I really hope this really happens in the US and the UK. I am in the depths of despair today.

378630 ▶▶▶ Andrea Salford, replying to HelzBelz, 7, #1388 of 1991 🔗

Always darkest before the dawn. Stay strong for, as I have to regularly remind myself, this too shall pass.

378827 ▶▶▶▶ Annie, replying to Andrea Salford, 2, #1389 of 1991 🔗

Me too.
It will pass.
There will be a reckoning.
I keep two pictures in my mind: the Nazi leaders strutting in their pride, and the Nazi leaders at Nuremberg.

378736 ▶▶▶ Nymeria, replying to HelzBelz, 2, #1390 of 1991 🔗

You’re not alone in that despair, HelzBelz x

378652 ▶▶ Nobody2021, replying to Andrea Salford, 10, #1391 of 1991 🔗

My main concern is that people will be so happy to get their freedoms back that they forget to question whether it was the right thing to do thus leaving the door open for it to keep happening in the future without proper cause.

378656 ▶▶▶ Andrea Salford, replying to Nobody2021, 9, #1392 of 1991 🔗

Far too many of us won’t let them wriggle off that hook. Let’s get them back then hold the inquest.

378697 ▶▶▶ mattghg, replying to Nobody2021, 8, #1393 of 1991 🔗

I’m worried about that. I’m also worried that we’ll get *almost* all of our freedoms back, and everyone will just accept that as good enough and we’ll then be stuck with masks or track ‘n trace or something in perpetuity.

378694 ▶▶ crimsonpirate, replying to Andrea Salford, 1, #1394 of 1991 🔗

Seeing this made me wonder if covid was endemic did it result in a low to non existent flu season?
“Even mild infections appear to elicit a persistent and functional immune response. One recent European study found that people who had mild or asymptomatic covid-19 mounted a “robust T-cell immunity” afterward”

378754 ▶▶ Elisabeth, replying to Andrea Salford, 7, #1395 of 1991 🔗

Everyone knows this whole scamdemic was perpetrated exactly to remove our non-globalist-filth president. Whether the release of the infectious agent was on purpose or accidental I don’t know but the RESPONSE to it was on purpose. The globalist filth has been planning their Great Reset for a while. If Hillary had gotten in in 2016 she would have wrecked the economy then. Now that the fraudulent election got Biden in he will do it instead. The scamdemic was only to wreck the world economy and get Trump out.

378614 HelzBelz, replying to HelzBelz, 56, #1396 of 1991 🔗

My hubby as I’ve written before, is a lockdownista and works as a project manager for the track and trace system. What – is that still a thing, I hear you say… but I digress.

It concerns me deeply that he, a non-medical person and therefore wholly unqualified to express any opinion on vaccines or PCR tests, does just that – in authoritarian, ‘I know best’ tones.

When he hears me telling my parents to not get a vaccine (which they stupidly did and now my mum is not feeling well), he goes nuts and starts yelling at me that they are 100% safe. How can he say this? What makes people so certain about things that are not in any way certain and to the logical mind, cannot even be true?

He tells me he frequently argues with colleagues about how the PCR test is ‘so much more accurate’ than the lateral flow one. Again – how the fuck does he get to believe that he is an expert – or indeed knows anything at all – in these things?

So this is what we are up against. Unqualified, stupid people in positions of supposed authority making pronouncements and assertions about things that they cannot possibly know are true.

I despair. For humanity, as well as for myself.

378620 ▶▶ AidanR, replying to HelzBelz, 14, #1397 of 1991 🔗

Time he packed his bags then, eh?

378631 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to HelzBelz, 15, #1398 of 1991 🔗

Time you got rid as Mrs Awkward would say.

378636 ▶▶ ituex, replying to HelzBelz, 26, #1399 of 1991 🔗

I’m a doctor, my husband, who is completely non medical also seems to think he knows more than me. Sometimes he sort of agrees with me,I don’t need agreeing with, it’s facts not opinion, today is not one of those days. So it isn’t just you.

378707 ▶▶▶ alw, replying to ituex, 1, #1400 of 1991 🔗

Husband’s can be contrary that is the nature of the beast.

378714 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to alw, 2, #1401 of 1991 🔗

A’s can wives’ as Im; sure youll’ agree.

378637 ▶▶ TheBluePill, replying to HelzBelz, 8, #1402 of 1991 🔗

And I bet that in his role, he sees evidence every day that we would love to have access to. But he just puts his blinkers on and refuses to see it.

378678 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to TheBluePill, 26, #1403 of 1991 🔗

Exactly. In fact he showed me a graph recently – one of the ones that has featured on here a few times. He said – and I shit you not – ‘You need a bloody maths degree to understand this graph’

I helpfully pointed out to him what the graph clearly showed – that the increase in Covid hospitalisations this winter was in entirely consistent with the number of flu hospitalisations over the previous 5 years.

Blinkers on, refusal to comment any further.

378639 ▶▶ Andrea Salford, replying to HelzBelz, 14, #1404 of 1991 🔗

Re the vaccine try if you can to get him to watch the excellent Netflix documentary on the thalidomide scandal. That should shock him to his senses – that too was rushed through and promoted by ‘those that knew best’.

378667 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Andrea Salford, 8, #1405 of 1991 🔗

Tried this using both Pandemrix and thalidomide as examples.

Pandemrix he deems to have insufficient numbers of adverse reactions (and hey, narolepsy isn’t that serious at all really is it) and thalidomide is completely different because it’s not a vaccine.

(His words obviously, not mine!)

378687 ▶▶▶▶ Andrea Salford, replying to HelzBelz, 8, #1406 of 1991 🔗

None so blind as those that refuse to see.

378724 ▶▶▶▶ Ewan Duffy, replying to HelzBelz, 9, #1407 of 1991 🔗

What they are currently offering isn’t a vaccine either so Thalidomide is a valid comparison. In fact, I made that very point to the Irish Minister for Health last week that the “vaccines” are, in fact, medical treatments undergoing trials and not vaccines in the conventional sense of that term.

378770 ▶▶▶▶ Elisabeth, replying to HelzBelz, 5, #1408 of 1991 🔗

Oh boy. I guess I’m lucky my husband is a lockdownsceptic as well. I do not wish to be in your shoes!

378808 ▶▶▶▶ Dodderydude, replying to HelzBelz, 4, #1409 of 1991 🔗

I wonder why he thinks that the fact that thalidomide was a tablet makes the principle of ‘thou shall do no harm’ any different. I would say to him that the issue is the same in principle and I would add that at least with thalidomide the effect of the tablets wears off…with the covid vaccines there is no going back once it’s injected in you; any potential damage is done.

With all due respect to him, I suppose he thinks that narcolepsy involves dozing off involuntarily in front of the TV. I saw a documentary about the impact of the problem and it condemned many of the victims to a lifetime where they could neither complete education nor hold down jobs and in many cases would never be able to hold a driving licence. A natural consequence of this was also severe depression.

378640 ▶▶ GrannySlayer, replying to HelzBelz, 5, #1410 of 1991 🔗

A difference of opinion is acceptable. That’s life. Screaming is not. That’s abuse.

378641 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to HelzBelz, 9, #1411 of 1991 🔗

Ask/show him this:

CMO Chris Whitty on the 21st July 2020:

“If you look at the R, and the behaviours, quite a lot of the change that led to the R going below one occurred well before, or to some extent before, the 23rd, when the full lockdown started.”

Here is a link to a video I had made for me by parliamentlivetv of the relevant section of the committee hearing:


It’s 23 MB so too big too e-mail.

So all under control prior to the initial lockdown starting.


Professor Dingwall, a SAGE member, about social distancing that is easily found in an internet search:

“it was conjured up out of nowhere”.

So how can something “conjured up out of nowhere” be used as scientific evidence?

Or the best:


Some quotes:

Cycle threshold (Ct) is a semi-quantitative value that can broadly categorise the concentration of viral genetic material in a patient sample following testing by RT PCR as low, medium or high – that is, it tells us approximately how much viral genetic material is in the sample.

A single Ct value in the absence of clinical context cannot be relied upon for decision making about a person’s infectivity.

The clinical significance of positive results with high Ct are difficult to interpret in the absence of clinical history and context.

And the absolute best and damning quote:

RT-PCR detects presence of viral genetic material in a sample but is not able to distinguish whether infectious virus is present.

Then this in a FOI request answer from the Department of Health and Social Care Reference FOI-1240596 and it stated that a positive PCR test means nothing medically.

The actual quote: “SARS-CoV-2 RNA means the RNA is present in that sample at that point in time. It does not mean that the patient has the novel coronavirus (COVID-19).”

Or from a RT-PCR test kit manufacturer that the Government uses and who I picked at random and contacted asking for information about what a test result means, in the various technical documents they sent me it stated at various points:

The final diagnosis should not be based solely on the results of this product. The final diagnosis should be based on a combination of different test methods and clinical results at the discretion of the physician”

The detection of viral RNA of SARS-CoV-2 is dependent upon proper specimen collection, handling, transportation, storage, and preparation, including extraction. Failure to observe proper procedures in any one of these steps can lead to incorrect results.

Results from the device should be correlated with the clinical history, epidemiological data and other data available to the clinician evaluating the patient.

This device is a qualitative test and does not provide information on the viral load present in the specimen

This test cannot rule out diseases caused by other bacterial or viral pathogens.

Cross-reactivity with respiratory tract organisms other than those listed in the Analytical Specificity Study may lead to erroneous results.

So they tests should not be used to “diagnose” anything and are certainly not a test that can then be used to state the person is a “case” medically and therefore can be used to justify restrictions and lockdowns.

378644 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 6, #1412 of 1991 🔗

The DHSC also kindly supplied this link in the same FOI answer to a document by Health Technology Wales which in answer to this question:

– the official policy/guidance from DHSC to the various bodies who are following the above policy. I can confirm that the Department holds information relevant to your request. As the information held by the Department is in the public domain, we will under Section 21 of the FOI Act (information accessible to the applicant by other means) refer you to the published source, a summary of evidence on the accuracy of the test,


It does include a few notable gems such as (the paper’s original comments in blue with their updates in umber and with my notes in red ):

We identified 39 individual studies and one pooled analysis reporting outcomes including diagnostic accuracy, detection rates and the time taken to obtain test results. We carried out quality assessment of the studies and judged the majority to be at risk of bias in one or more aspect of their design or conduct, which means their results may not be reliable. So not too accurate then these studies?

Some studies did not include methods of confirmatory/differential diagnosis to validate the test results obtained (e.g. the proportion of likely false positive and negative results). A pooled analysis estimated the sensitivity of an initial RT-PCR test result to be 89%, using results of repeated RT-PCR as the reference standard. So does this mean that there is an estimated 11% false result?

There are important gaps in the available evidence on the effectiveness of tests for the presence of SARS-CoV-2. Studies of virus testing in asymptomatic patients, or in specific populations such as healthcare workers are limited in number and there is no evidence on the validated diagnostic performance of the tests beyond their use in the hospital setting. So pretty useless then?
A true assessment of the accuracy of RT-PCR test results is very challenging, and using these RT-PCR for validation mean the same issues apply to the results of antibody tests studied in this way. so the test has lots of problems with accuracy and the antibody test cannot be used for doublechecking the results due to these inaccuracies?

So basically as admitted by the DHSC you are using tests that are “unreliable” to say the least, have no reference standard to double check the accuracy against and that have results that means nothing medically.

378700 ▶▶▶▶ iansn, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1413 of 1991 🔗

If thats the level of competence in DHSC, then we are fucked, as we already know.

378662 ▶▶▶ HelzBelz, replying to Awkward Git, 15, #1414 of 1991 🔗

Tried showing him all sorts of articles – basically won’t believe anything unless the BBC tells him it’s true. Or presumably his employer – the ‘hasn’t it been disbanded yet’ PHE…

378693 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to HelzBelz, 3, #1416 of 1991 🔗

Show him the links starting assets.publishing etc

All officially published government documents – his ultimate employer.

378726 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to HelzBelz, 5, #1417 of 1991 🔗

Mrs Awkward says again “Get rid”.

In the end it’ll be better.

She knows from experience, I’m her 2nd attempt and she’s doing better than the last one from 30 years ago.

378744 ▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to HelzBelz, 3, #1418 of 1991 🔗

Print it up and leave it laying around where he can pick it up and peruse it as his leisure.

Do’t ever mention it until he does.

Then when he does post on here asking for a link to my onedrive folder with the FOIs in and keep posting until I answer as I’ll be busy for the rest of the week and might not see your first post.

Or just find your local leather clad bike club, buy them a beer or ten and get them to have a “quiet word” with him.

379188 ▶▶▶▶▶ Nymeria, replying to Awkward Git, #1419 of 1991 🔗

I have a well-known, leather-clad bike club close by. They are my main friendship group, and have lifted and supported me over the past few difficult years. But, I seem to be the main, lone voice of scepticism among them which surprises me somewhat, given their reputation and whatnot.

378769 ▶▶▶▶ Dermot McClatchey, replying to HelzBelz, 12, #1420 of 1991 🔗

Neither will a single member of my extended family believe anything unless it carries the imprimatur of the State Broadcaster- including the daughter who’s a Cambridge graduate, and the other daughter who’s doing her Ph.D: and my brother, who is what we seem these days to have to call a “loya”, and who is very intelligent, but seems entirely to lack either the interest in, or the capacity for, thinking for its own sake. I simply cannot understand this mentality, no matter how hard I try. This shitshow has revealed things about many people which I really wish it hadn’t.

378647 ▶▶ chaos, replying to HelzBelz, 4, #1421 of 1991 🔗

aye aye divorce incoming…

378651 ▶▶ Ceriain, replying to HelzBelz, 4, #1422 of 1991 🔗

I despair. For humanity, as well as for myself .

The solution to your problem is very simple, IMHO.

378737 ▶▶ mhcp, replying to HelzBelz, 6, #1423 of 1991 🔗

Just ask him what the control group is? If he asks what that is, say it’s the group or situation in any experiment where you do nothing or considerably less than you are doing in your experiment. The default condition or trivial solution.

It is fundamental to any experiment by the way. If you don’t have a control you can’t do a real comparison. It also has to be comparable situation, so no models unless your experiment is purely model based.

It’s used to set up the baseline from which you compare.

The control groups are places like Sweden, South Dakota, Tanzania, Belarus. etc.

378752 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to HelzBelz, 4, #1424 of 1991 🔗

Does he not know that the vaccines are still in the trials stage and that they have not been licensed?

378789 ▶▶ Ovis, replying to HelzBelz, 3, #1425 of 1991 🔗

‘he goes nuts and starts yelling.’ That’s the tell. Not even an innocent dupe.

378860 ▶▶ tarfu, replying to HelzBelz, 11, #1426 of 1991 🔗

As I have written before, Mrs tarfu gets all her information from the Daily Mail. Yesterday the subject of holidaying in Spain cropped up (again). I mentioned that lockdown could well be extended until July, we would need a negative test to get into Spain and one to get out again, plus quite likely have to quarantine in an approved place for however many days at our own expense on our return. Assuming of course that Spain lifts the ban on UK holiday makers. Big argument ensues, I’m accused of lecturing and should stop looking at ‘obscure websites’.
Covid is dividing households like nothing else.
Like you HelzBelz, I am at an all time low and truly despair.

379054 ▶▶▶ LMS2, replying to tarfu, 2, #1427 of 1991 🔗

I’m sorry to hear of your problems.
What the government is doing is so wicked and harmful.

Does your wife not trust you normally? Has she not looked online for information for herself, from the mainstream media?
The proposal for quarantine is in the Telegraph, which is not an obscure website.

I’m lucky in that MOH agrees with me, but it’s still not easy being so trapped at home all the time. We had a blazing row over nothing, just because we’re feeling stressed.
We have a trip booked to Alaska in May, which I booked early last year, thinking this would be over by now, but i don’t think it will go ahead. There’s too many unknowns. Governments are making it too difficult to make plans.

All I can suggest is backing off, and not mentioning anything about CV19 and lockdown. Ask questions rather than telling her information. Let her find the answers.

Good luck. You’re not alone.

379181 ▶▶ Old mum, replying to HelzBelz, #1428 of 1991 🔗

Jeez – how are you still married?!!

378625 rockoman, replying to rockoman, 15, #1429 of 1991 🔗


7 day moving average of covid deaths falls to 11 in Sweden: 1.1 per million.


7 day moving average of covid deaths is at 1240 in the UK: 19 per million.

7 day average of ‘covid deaths ‘ in the UK now 17 times that of Sweden.

Hoist them on their own petard .

Probably the population density right – yeah right . 🙂

Or maybe they just have a milder ‘variant’?

Or something?

Anyway let’s not talk about it.

378643 ▶▶ RickH, replying to rockoman, 10, #1430 of 1991 🔗

Careful of falling into the trap of accepting the UK figures as real.

378650 ▶▶▶ rockoman, replying to RickH, 9, #1431 of 1991 🔗

Of course – hence the ‘petard’

Live by fabricated numbers, die by fabricated numbers.

They need the numbers to create fear, the same numbers which damn their policies.

378690 ▶▶ Nobody2021, replying to rockoman, 5, #1432 of 1991 🔗

For me getting a similar result without the additional collateral damage is a better outcome. We can see that countries and states that tried a more open approach did not end up in catastrophe.

However I apply the same argument here that I do to the zero covid argument. There was a small window of opportunity when zero covid might have actually made sense. I say might because we don’t actually know the true extent of the spread of the virus early on plus we don’t know if maintaining zero covid is a realistic prospect.

So likewise, the opportunity to follow the Swedish approach was effectively lost as soon as Boris announced the first lockdown. In so doing he sealed our fate and set in motion a chain of events that has led us to where we are today.

Some may argue that the NHS would have been overwhelmed but to me reducing the capacity within the NHS and creating a backlog of demand turned this into a self fulfilling prophecy.

378717 ▶▶▶ Julian, replying to Nobody2021, 1, #1433 of 1991 🔗

So likewise, the opportunity to follow the Swedish approach was effectively lost as soon as Boris announced the first lockdown”


378738 ▶▶▶▶ Nobody2021, replying to Julian, 3, #1434 of 1991 🔗

As soon as we switched we lost the benefit of any additional immunity that might have been gained had we not switched. Add to that the cummulative demand/workload we started building up by postponing medical procedures. Over time the effects of this would just keep building up.

If we switched today for example there would almost certainly be more deaths as a result. If we wait till the prevalance is lower then we will still suffer from the reduced build up of immunity. It would be very hard to turn to a policy that would increase the death toll, even if it might reduce the toll in the long run, if you’ve spent the last 12 months telling people that too many have died already.

378660 Ceriain, replying to Ceriain, 10, #1435 of 1991 🔗

More bullshit from the presser:

Julie from Walsall asks when the current lockdown ends will we revert back to tier system or a new one.

Dr Hopkins says we need to see our death rates fall “much lower” before any decisions can be made.

“We are at the highest number of individuals in ICU [intensive care] today and the numbers of hospitalisations are still twice the peak,” she says.

“We will look at and monitor these and use them to help inform government on how the tiering should look in the future,” she says.

So, not an end to Lockdown, just more tiers.

378670 ▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Ceriain, 8, #1436 of 1991 🔗

And the quote from the BMA:

We appreciate that this is an area in which there is little high-quality empirical evidence. There is, for example, a lack of randomised control trials showing that mask wearing is effective (either indoors or outdoors).

378675 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 5, #1437 of 1991 🔗

Stuck it on wrong comment, should be on mine above.

Too much beer with fried egg and chip butt, HP sauce and Lea and Perrin’s Sauce hedonistic tea.

378705 ▶▶▶▶ Ceriain, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1438 of 1991 🔗

Stuck it on wrong comment, should be on mine above.

You’re always welcome on my mini threads, AG. 🙂

378718 ▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Ceriain, 3, #1439 of 1991 🔗

All the blood has rushed from my brain to my stomach to digest the very enjoyable, unhealthy, high calorie dinner.

378719 ▶▶▶▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 1, #1440 of 1991 🔗

And worth every calorie.

378820 ▶▶▶▶▶▶▶ Annie, replying to Awkward Git, #1441 of 1991 🔗

And it will give your hard-working brain a well-deserved rest!

378679 ▶▶ Luckyharry69, replying to Ceriain, 2, #1442 of 1991 🔗

I say RAISE THE ‘R’ RATE!!!!!…….

378666 Awkward Git, replying to Awkward Git, 10, #1443 of 1991 🔗

One question that really flummoxes GPs and hospital staff is this:

“did you know that this practice is specifically mentioned as exempt from the face covering legislation and the BMA cannot supply evidence face coverings work so why are you wearing a mask/face covering?”

Don’t believe me? It’s in here:


Here is the relevant phrase and it’s never been changed in all the amendments:

Exemptions from definition of shop – regulation 2(2)

7. Premises (other than registered pharmacies) providing wholly or mainly medical or dental services, audiology services, chiropody, chiropractic, osteopathic, optometry or other medical services including services relating to mental health.

378735 ▶▶ Steve Hayes, replying to Awkward Git, 2, #1444 of 1991 🔗

In hospitals patients generally are not expected to wear face masks.

378759 ▶▶▶ Awkward Git, replying to Steve Hayes, #1445 of 1991 🔗

But outpatients are forced to unless they claim an exemption and have a lanyard on.

378765 ▶▶▶ Lisa (formerly) from Toronto, replying to Steve Hayes, 3, #1446 of 1991 🔗

Here they’ll let you die rather than let you inside a hospital without a mask. A journalist here has been fighting for his wife to be able to get her dialysis treatment without a mask and only one hospital, quite far away, will allow it. The local hospital she always went to refused her.